This is Version 2.9 of my unofficial guide to Samsung HLN series DLP sets. I have owned a Samsung 61 inch set since December 2002, and another 43" inch set since April 2003. This guide includes information that helped me decide for these sets and then to use them effectively. The information is gathered from myriad threads and posts in this forum, I have just tried to put it in one document.

I shall try to keep this guide up-to-date. If you have information that will benefit others in deciding or using these sets, please post it in the thread and I shall include it in the guide.

http://www.digiupdate.com/P001_Samsung_HLN_DLP_2003.html

Previous versions downloaded ~30,000 times
Version History
Version 2.0 - Major revision
Version 2.01 - corrections, additions to firmware
Version 2.1 - corrections, additions to firmware, connection resolution, Xbox
Version 2.9 - HTML hosted version

Note: For 2004 DLP Models, see http://www.digiupdate.com/105_DLP_RPTV.html

What a great idea.

I hope you don't get too much flack for a few of your enthusiastic impressions. I plan to spend some time with your guide as I am just now getting started on a HTPC.

My understanding is that some of the HLN characteristics may be different than those you show in your table.

It might help to show the both models for the 43" and 50" sets. I believe that the HLN437, HLN507, and HLN617 have the Charcoal bezel( about 2"). The HLN4365 and HLN5065 models have the silver bezel as you indicate.

From what I have read, the HLN467 and HLN567 will have a brushed aluminum thin silver bezel. I think someone posted the measurements for these two thin bezel models. I'll try to find them. They seem to be about to arrive in small numbers as early as the first week of June.

Is there a way for you to easily update your document at AVS Forums?

Thanks for providing us with a place, especially new members, to find this information.

Thanks, Les. I'll make the corrections.

I believe posts (and attached documents) can be updated by using the edit button at the top right of a post.

Arun

Here is the size information for the HLN567 form this thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=253509&highlight=567

Thanks to celeron450:

The dimensions listed in the Korean manual (page 41) for the HLN567W are:
1268 mm x 461 mm x 924 mm (WxDxH)
41.5 kg
In the English system this is approximately:
49.9" x 18.1" x 36.4" (WxDxH)
91.5 lbs

__________________
celeron450

Originally posted by arungupta
I believe posts (and attached documents) can be updated by using the edit button at the top right of a post.
Arun

I've never tried to use edit to update an attached document. Sounds good.

Here I am again.

Do you have the weights reversed? The HLN567 according to the Korean manual is 91.5 lbs.

Yes, I did have the weights reversed. Correcting right now, then I shall test if I can update the doc.

htwaits - thanks for all your input.

Document successfully updated.

I shall keep updating with other corrections and missing info on at least a daily basis until the document reaches a satisfactory level.

Those bezels are still causing trouble.

"I believe that the HLN437, HLN507, and HLN617 have the Charcoal bezel( about 2") not the 2/3" thin bezel.

From what I have read, the HLN467 and HLN567 will have a brushed aluminum "thin silver" bezel not charcoal."

Samsung has created "model" hell!

Good doc, arungupta. I have just some comments about htpc stuff - it might be more useful for people to have estimates on what they can get with particular levels of hardware, rather than making recommendations about very specific configurations (ie, exact speed, mobo, brand of memory, etc). HTPC's are huge subjects unto themselves, obviously.

Thanks! You may want to send it over here:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2184314#post2184314

"After 3-5 years, pay for a cleaning of the lenses on the light engine to clear any residue that may collect on the surface"

How much will this cost? An estimate of the labor involved (how many minutes) and cost should be included in your Guide, so people don't get a bad surprise.

Originally posted by Maurice2
"After 3-5 years, pay for a cleaning of the lenses on the light engine to clear any residue that may collect on the surface"

How much will this cost? An estimate of the labor involved (how many minutes) and cost should be included in your Guide, so people don't get a bad surprise.

Why not wait three to five years and check it out then?

why don't these things come with hepa filters or something to keep the screen, guns, etc free of debris?

Posted version 1.2

Thanks for all your inputs.

I am looking for input on specific recommendations on User mode and Service mode adjustments.

I'm still waiting on a pre-ordered HLN567w, so I could be wrong about this...

You mention in your FAQ that the HLM/HLNs are monitors, not TV's, because they don't have built in tuners. I'm not sure if it counts or not, but aren't there built in SDTV tuners (hence, the buttons on the TV to change channels)? You only need an external tuner if you wish to display HDTV signals, right?

I guess the FAQ is going to be a continous work in progress, but thanks for taking the time to put it together!

Originally posted by venm11
why don't these things come with hepa filters or something to keep the screen, guns, etc free of debris?

Guns? What guns?

Originally posted by htwaits
Why not wait three to five years and check it out then?
That's a ridiculous answer. You missed the point entirely.

Originally posted by htwaits
Guns? What guns?

Well, it sounded like the thread was tangenting into CRT pj's. But... my question wasn't rhetorical; do any of the pj sets have air filters to prevent stuff from getting in?

Originally posted by Maurice2
That's a ridiculous answer. You missed the point entirely.


Totally. I can see a joke now and then, but these irrelevant quips aren't adding anything to the discussion.

Originally posted by lmychajluk
You mention in your FAQ that the HLM/HLNs are monitors, not TV's, because they don't have built in tuners. I'm not sure if it counts or not, but aren't there built in SDTV tuners (hence, the buttons on the TV to change channels)? You only need an external tuner if you wish to display HDTV signals, right?


Lee - you are right - It does have built-in SD tuners. I forgot about them because I haven't used them. I shall upgrade the guide accordingly.

-- Arun

"My Unofficial Guide to Samsung HLN Series DLP Sets" by arungupta. See the first message for his attached document.

arungupta,

Here are the measurements for the HLN467. They were provided by Celeron450 in another thread.

The dimensions and weight as listed in the Korean manual (page 41) for the HLN467W are:

1047 mm x 399 mm x 779 mm (WxDxH)
33.5 kg

In the English system this is approximately:
41.2" x 15.7" x 30.7" (WxDxH)
73.9 lbs

Document updated -- version 1.3.

In this version I have added many links to threads in this forum and to other relevant sites.

Still looking for concrete info on service menu adjustments.

Originally posted by arungupta
Document updated -- version 1.3.
Still looking for concrete info on service menu adjustments.

We may have to wait awhile or buy someone like KenLand a HLN upgrade.

If Samsung comes through with an upgrade option for the early HLMs then one of the Houston gang may do a new calibration.

Thanks again for your efforts.

Originally posted by htwaits
In the English system this is approximately:
41.2" x 15.7" x 30.7" (WxDxH)
73.9 lbs
41.2 makes a lot more sense than 40.6" previously stated on another post. I would trust that. Likewise for the weight and the height. On the other hand, 15.7" for the depth (which I would be very happy with due to my space limitations) sounds suspicious because it is the same as for the HLM 43". I would expect it to be a little deeper. On that other post, it said 16.1".

Maurice2,

You are right. The source is from the Korean manual. It could be a typo there are in the original message form celeron450. I just ask him to double check.

arungupta,

I just looked at the table of dimensions again and I think the measurements for the HLN437 and HLN617 might be reversed in version 1.3.

Maurice2 and htwaits - I have fixed both problems and uploaded the document. (The version number was not changed.). Thanks.

Arun

Thanks Arun. I hope you still have time for your day job!!!

I just wanted to publicly thank Arungupta for his publication. It is FULL of useful information, the type that is generally only available on an internet site. IMHO, this is what the internet is and should be about, namely individuals helping the masses. If your interested in the possible purchase of a Samsung HLN you owe it to yourself to download this!

Once again, sir, thanks for and EXCELLENT publication. I just wanted you to personally know that I/we appreciate yours and the many others who contribute to this site. Enough said!

Originally posted by htwaits
I hope you still have time for your day job!!!

I am writing this as I wait for yet another meeting to start in my day job. BTW, this is a lot more fun!!!

Now, now kmil - you are making me gush. We really should all thank David Bott, Alan Gouger and others for making this forum happen where we can share such information.

I think you've missed the point. Samsung wouldn't even give a price on replacement bulbs before many of us ordered this set. And who is to say the price on the bulb assembly won't go up 500% by the time most of us need them anyway?

The answer to your original question is nobody knows.

Originally posted by Maurice2
That's a ridiculous answer. You missed the point entirely.

Turls, are you the one who lives too far away to get Samsung service calls to your house? If my memory is right, have you found any solution to that problem?

Well, if you call totally replacing the set at Samsung's expense 2 times a solution, right now I am ok. It took a while to get Samsung to work with me but once they did I can't say too much bad about them.

I'm only 40 miles away from the closest authorized repair center, so I would think a lot of people would have run into this problem, but I haven't heard about too many that had to get complete replacements.

Would anyone tell me the website or phone no. of PC Richards.

Originally posted by turls
I'm only 40 miles away from the closest authorized repair center, so I would think a lot of people would have run into this problem, but I haven't heard about too many that had to get complete replacements.

I was thinking that this guide might benefit from having something in it about the exclusions based on distance in the Samsung "in home" warranty.

I'm glad Samsung came through. But, forty miles doesn't seem that far. Is it left up to the authorized repair service as to how far they will go to make a call?

Originally posted by turls
I think you've missed the point. Samsung wouldn't even give a price on replacement bulbs before many of us ordered this set. And who is to say the price on the bulb assembly won't go up 500% by the time most of us need them anyway?The answer to your original question is nobody knows.
Turls, I'm sorry to say, but you too have missed the point I was making. I guess I was not clear enough. My fault.

Of course nobody can predict what the cost of cleaning the lenses will be 3 years from now. What I was suggesting was that we should try to find out how big a job cleaning the lenses will be. Will it take 30 minutes? an hour? two hours? A knowledgeable Samsung person ought to know (otherwise he is not knowledgeable enough). Knowing this, one should be able to determine approximately how much the cost would be today (depending where one lives, of course). To have this approximation -- or at least the time needed to do the job, approximately -- would, in my view, be helpful to many people (including me) for whom forking out over $3,000. for a TV is a big decision, and it should be included in the Guide.

An approximation (if we can manage to get one) is all that is needed.

Great document, very informative!

I’m considering getting one of these HLNs in the near future and your document has provided a lot of good info in one spot.

One thing I think would make a good addition is info about the PIP functionality of these sets. I’ve seen some threads on this but never a really clear answer. Can it do two pictures side by side? It would quite nice if my girlfriend could watch a animal planet on one side while I played a video game or surf the web on the other. Is this possible? I’ve never been able to get it to work that way in store, only a (relatively) small corner window (can you change the position of the window?). Also, are there limitations to what input combinations can be used?

Anyway, thanks a bunch, keep up the good work! :)

No, I don't think I did. My point is that getting information like this from Samsung would be like pulling teeth. The analogy I made about not being able to get pricing on bulbs before people ordered the set is very applicable here.

There are a lot of variables involved with what you are asking, and you are lucky to find a tech that has been trained on DLP anyway.

Another point, unlike bulbs that HAVE to be replaced by EVERYONE eventually, what percentage of owners do you think will actually pay someone to come do this anyway? I would guess very few. The interior is accessable and unless you are in a very dirty environment surface cleaning should get 99% of the people by, if they even do that much.

Originally posted by Maurice2
Turls, I'm sorry to say, but you too have missed the point I was making. I guess I was not clear enough. My fault.

Exactly. It would be nice to mention that little exclusion in this type of guide, and that it is also next to impossible to figure out who will do what without calling them ahead of time.

The guy in St. Louis really drove me crazy. If he drives from one side of St. Louis county to the other he is going to have probably 3/4ths or more of the drive time that he would have almost all interstate to my house. These guys don't think about traffic or stoplights I guess because he wouldn't have had either coming to my house.

Originally posted by htwaits
I'm glad Samsung came through. But, forty miles doesn't seem that far. Is it left up to the authorized repair service as to how far they will go to make a call?

Originally posted by Maurice2
A knowledgeable Samsung person ought to know (otherwise he is not knowledgeable enough).

Who is this knowledgeable Samsung person? The one who might not be knowledgeable enough?

I think we are all users here. Service departments probably haven't gotten around to doing this kind of job yet. Some of them haven't even heard that there are some internal differences between DLP and CRT RPTVs.

Some service contracts cover this kind of cleaning but only if there is a clear degradation of PQ.

I'm sure there is all kinds of dust and other unmentionables in these unfiltered sets, but we don't know if it will hurt PQ. If it does hurt PQ we don't know how long it will take to be noticeable.

An ISF calibrator who has had the screen off of an HLN set might give an estimate--if that's how you get in to polish the mirrors.

Maybe you could do the research and contribute it to the "guide".

Axl, I shall add the PIP information to the guide.

Regarding the recommendation on cleaning of the lenses, the statement in the guide came from 13 questions and answers posted by Duffin on 3/6/03. See question #11:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=227068&perpage=20&highlight=residue&pagenumber=3

His sources is someone at Samsung. Maybe we can ask Duffin to get more elaboration on this topic. It is quite likely that the answer is going to be - they don't have an answer yet and they won't have it for another couple of years.

Is this cleaning also required in any other type of rear projection TV? Is this unique to all DLP TVs? Or is it unique to Samsung DLP TVs only?

Posted version 1.4 of the guide. Added sections on black levels, PIP, viewing distance, and internal reflection. Updated other sections.

Originally posted by arungupta
Posted version 1.4 of the guide. Added sections on black levels, PIP, viewing distance, and internal reflection. Updated other sections.

When I compared the brochures from the Samsung website between the 507 and the 5065 HLN, the 507 indicates Faroujda Film Mode 3:2 pulldown enhancement, whereas the 5065 indicates just Film Mode 3:2 pulldown enchancement.

Is this the main difference (other than the bezel) that would account for the differences in prices that are seen?

Kevin

Samsung's web page is not clear as it might be. The same Faroujda chip is in all models. The only difference is that Samsung doesn't pay a license to advertise it in the cheaper models.

HTwaits:..................so, in view of that will Samsung make a "lower" model of the HLN467w........(lower cost)? I'd doubt it but what do you think?

Originally posted by kmil
HTwaits:..................so, in view of that will Samsung make a "lower" model of the HLN467w........(lower cost)? I'd doubt it but what do you think?

I don't know. They have duplicate models for 43" and 50" sets. Why not confuse things further and do the same at 46", 56" and 61"? I don't know why they removed the Tanus designation from the 43", 50" and 61" HLNxxx sets either. I'm hoping it's more than cosmetic.

From a manufacturing perspective, its actually cheaper for them to have the same electronics guts for all the models - and just put on a different size box around it. The artificial model differences appear to be their attempt at creating differentiation for their high and low end dealers. They've ended up confusing everyone - and maybe that was the intent.

In future, I shall post updates in the threads first, then consolidate them into the guide - making it easier for people who have already downloaded the guide.

Remote Keyboard and Mouse
-------------------------------------
One of the pleasures from this set is couch computing - sit back, browse, e-mail, post on AVSforum, instant message, .... Of course, you need a good remote mouse and keyboard for this purpose. I have the two best options, one on each set: Gyration Ultra Cordless Optical Suite (~$99) and Logitech Elite Duo (~$79). I have tried others, including Microsoft Bluetooth, before settling on these two.

Gyration, the preferred one, has a 25' range. It has a great smooth mouse which can be used with a mouse pad or in the air using its gyro device, and the mouse comes with a charger. Its keyboard is small and lite, but its narrow laptop style is not good for touch-typing or keyboard intensive games.

Logitech only has a 10' range, but it has a really great keyboard and the mouse is also very smooth.
-------------------------------------
Coming updates - OTA antennas, Service Menu tweaks, HD Programming

Thanks arungupta for taking the time to put all this info together in one place. Just one correction: The guide says the HLN sets don't do side-by-side PIP. My HLN507W does.

I also think your recommendation for a "mid range" HTPC is too stringent. I have an HTPC with "only" an AMD 2100+ processor and "only" an ATI AIW 7500 video card (I use the DVI output of course!) and I get the impression that the PC never even gets close to breaking a sweat doing all that I ask of it. I do agree completely that an HTPC is the way to go with this TV. I am amazed at (a) how good a PC monitor this set makes, and (b) how good most DVDs look through the HTPC.

Originally posted by Radiophile
The guide says the HLN sets don't do side-by-side PIP. My HLN507W does.

Thanks for the correction, Radiophile. I haven't been able to find side-by-side PIP on either of my sets. What do you do to turn it on?

I also think your recommendation for a "mid range" HTPC is too stringent. I have an HTPC with "only" an AMD 2100+ processor and "only" an ATI AIW 7500 video card (I use the DVI output of course!) and I get the impression that the PC never even gets close to breaking a sweat doing all that I ask of it.

My recommendation is only for people buying a new PC, I'll make it clear in the guide. If you already have one and you are happy with it, there is no reason to follow this advice. I recommend a mid-range PC for two reasons: 1) Its an old rule of thumb when buying any new PC so it won't become obsolete too quickly 2) You need a minimum 2.4 GHz P4 (or AMD equivalent) to play Windows Media 9 hi-def video. Terminator 2 is the first HiDef DVD coming out in June using this format. We hope there will be a lot more.

I do agree completely that an HTPC is the way to go with this TV. I am amazed at (a) how good a PC monitor this set makes, and (b) how good most DVDs look through the HTPC.
We are in full agreeement!! When I played my first DVD from my HTPC (Star Wars- Attack of the Clones) my jaw kind of dropped - I wasn't at all expecting the crystal clear picture.

Arun,

On my set(HLM 507 with new internals), i can cycle through the various PIP options by pressing the PIP button on the remote. I use the side-by-side option a lot especially with NBA games and sitcoms. One of the windows can display component inputs, but i think vga/dvi is not possible(that would've been the icing !).

-Srinivas

I figured out what I may have been doing wrong. My main windows is almost always DVI or VGA and I guess you can't do side by side with DVI or VGA as one of the windows. I shall try out all the options and revise the guide.

Corrected PIP section. Updated remote Keyboard and mouse section.

"If you must use a DVD player with component out, use a non-progressive player instead of a progressive one - this is because the TV has superior de-interlacing/scaling circuitry compared to the DVD player. Connect it to Component 1 Input -- It is the only component input that accepts 480i/480p signals."

I am in the market for a new DVD player to complement my HLN. I've read in other posts and this guide that the best quaility DVD is not to use a progressive scan DVD player. Why is this and if I do connect a progrssive scan DVD, will the quality be poorer than a non-P?

Thanks.

I REALLY recommend only these worthy companions to your High definition TV: 1) Bravo D1 player ($199), 2) Samsung 931 player (~$320 street), or 3) an HTPC. All can output DVI at 720p, and you cannot get a better PQ from any conventional DVD player. See these threads regarding these two players:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=257728&highlight=bravo
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=252173
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=252217&highlight=bravo

Conventional DVD players (Component output) are really for SD televisions. If are intent on a conventional player, then you should select a non-progressive player or disable the progressive feature in the player. Your TV has the Faroudja FLI 2300 chip, which does a superior job of de-interlacing. Connect into Component 1.

Hope this helps.

then you should select a non-progressive player or disable the progressive feature in the player. Your TV has the Faroudja FLI 2300 chip, which does a superior job of de-interlacing.

Yes this help and great job with the guide!

I have the 3 blinking lights problem on my HLN4365W. I didn't have this problem with my HLM617W in over 4 months of use. My new HLN4365W developed the problem in less than 3 weeks. The problem surfaced at the worst moment, when I was proudly showing the TV to my visiting brother, a Sony GWII owner.

When I turn the TV on, the picture comes on, but within a few minutes the picture goes dark and the front panel has 3 blinking lights. Its suppsed to be a problem with the lamp system - obviously not a fused bulb because I do get the picture for a few minutes. I am not the only one who has this problem with this set. See:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=256956

Luckily, PC Richards, the retailer, has been very good in providing support. A service person will come and check it out in the next day or so. They are also willing to exchange it for a new set if it can't be readily fixed. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

We need to make Samsung aware that the problem is still persisting with the HLN series. They have claimed that less than 5% of HLM series had this problem - a combination of fused bulbs and improperly seated lamp assemblies.

Oh well!!!

Originally posted by arungupta
We need to make Samsung aware that the problem is still persisting with the HLN series. They have claimed that less than 5% of HLM series had this problem - a combination of fused bulbs and improperly seated lamp assemblies.


I thought Samsung claimed less than 1% and a massive quality control effort. I'm sorry to see it popping up in the HLN sets too. The Panasonic DLP seems to have started doing something similar. I wonder ...

The HLN567 is now back to July and Toshiba may have a 57" LCoS ready by October. One of my original reasons for waiting for the HLN series was to get the "three red lights" behind us. Now it looks like "htwaits" again.

You're right. Les. Samsung has claimed 1% in exchanges with other forum members. I think that people in this forum believe the percentage is higher. Related threads:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2059960&highlight=blinking#post2059960

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2003674&highlight=blinking#post2003674

In order to have broad adaption of this product, Samsung HAS to put this problem behind.

I can understand why you may be reconsidering your options.

Originally posted by arungupta
You're right. Les. Samsung has claimed 1% in exchanges with other forum members. I think that people in this forum believe the percentage is higher.

I'm one of them but there is no reliable data. Certainly the forum members have a much higher failure rate.

I want to buy the HLN437W, but haven’t figured out how to get one in Germany yet. The failure rate bothers me, but I am psyched about using it with a HTPC. The only difference with HLN4365W is the color right? I think the 7 is black frame and 6 and a half is all gray?

When viewing 4:3 SD, can you get black bars on the side or are you stuck with gray?
I like black better and I read “burn in” is not a problem with this display.

Arungupta, Sorry to hear about your 3 blinking lights problem. I can’t thank you enough for your guide. It is most excellent. Until my dad red it, I could not convince him why he needed a PC in his living room.

Not to be overly critical, but you have:

“The first generation, HML series, was introduced last year”

in section A which should be changed to HLM.

Also, you may want to be a little more clear that the HTPC specks are your recommendation for buying/building a new PC for that purpose. Since the display does have VGA input, your existing video card will work for now. I have a Duron 650 with 512 meg 133 RAM (soon to be upgraded) running Win2K server for HTPC and it works fine even with all the other functions running in the background such as domain controller, game server, web server, and more. I would also recommend the keyboard/mouse be RF and not IR like most of them are.

If you can find a black RF keyboard with a built in mouse (preferably joystick rather than touch pad) I would appreciate the URL.

Todd, its interesting that you are in Germany. I am going to Munich tomorrow and will be there for a week.

The only difference with HLN4365W is the color right? I think the 7 is black frame and 6 and a half is all gray?

Yes, to the best of my knowledge, there is no other difference.

When viewing 4:3 SD, can you get black bars on the side or are you stuck with gray? I like black better and I read “burn in” is not a problem with this display.
The bars are actually black. I'm not aware of any way of changing them to another color.

Sorry to hear about your 3 blinking lights problem.
The retailer, PC Richards, took the set back yesterday. It'll either be fixed by next week or they'll give me a new one. I'm concerned about this problem too, and I hope that Samsung gets a handle on it soon.

I can’t thank you enough for your guide. It is most excellent. Until my dad red it, I could not convince him why he needed a PC in his living room.
You are very welcome.

Not to be overly critical, but you have:

“The first generation, HML series, was introduced last year”

in section A which should be changed to HLM.
Thanks for catching the Typo. I shall update the guide.

Also, you may want to be a little more clear that the HTPC specks are your recommendation for buying/building a new PC for that purpose. Since the display does have VGA input, your existing video card will work for now. I have a Duron 650 with 512 meg 133 RAM (soon to be upgraded) running Win2K server for HTPC and it works fine even with all the other functions running in the background such as domain controller, game server, web server, and more. Since my current display does not have VGA input, I recommend the Hollywood Plus DVD decoder card with remote control.
If you already have PC that serves your purpose, then the HTPC recommendations in the guide are not applicable. The recommendations are only meaningful if you are planning to buy a new HTPC. I recommend a mid-range PC to make sure that you buy something that has a decent life before it becomes obsolete. I shall update the guide to make it clear.
I would also recommend the keyboard/mouse be RF and not IR like most are.

If you can find a black RF keyboard with a built in mouse (preferably joystick rather than touch pad) I would appreciate the URL.

I believe that Logitech and Gyration are both RF and not IR. Both of them have an excellent mouse, though its not integrated into the keyboard. I have seen a number of integrated mouse/keyboard RF devices, although they all have trackballs not joysticks. I wonder if someone else can recommend a device here.

Hope the weather in Munich is warmer that here in Connecticut. Brrrrrrrr!

Arun Gupta

What a great thread! I wish I had stumbled across this earlier. I bought my HLN about a week ago. A couple of things I've noticed in general, don't know if it is worthy of guide material or not:

Monitor audio out only appears to work using Antenna and Video 1 composite sources for input?

I believe the Game Cube component outs ($30 option) does 420p. . .I have it hooked up with composites right now and was hoping to read about it in your guide before shelling out the cash. I haven't made it through the cited thread on HD gaming yet, answer maybe there.

In the HTPC section, I was wondering if you have information on VGA cable necessary to connect?

netzen7,

Thanks for pointing out the audio out limitation - monitor audio out is only available for RF/Antenna, Composiite Video 1-3, and S-Video 1-3 inputs. I shall add a section in the guide regarding the audio setup to use if you want to use a separate stereo/5.1 speaker system.

Game Cube is just about the only gaming system we don't have in our house - and I didn't come across any threads on connecting it to the Samsung. If you can post your findings and experience with the Game Cube, I can add it to the guide.

You can use an ordinary 15 pin VGA cable that you normally use to connect a PC to a monitor.

CNET has just posted a review of HLN617W:

http://electronics.cnet.com/electronics/0-6342372-1304-21210911.html?tag=dir

Summary:
The good: Slim and light design; excellent connectivity; bright, detailed image; robust, low-maintenance technology; wide viewing angle.

The bad: Expensive; some rainbow effects; black levels not as good as with CRTs

Arungupta - can you add the link to the file to your sig? I'm lazy and don't want to keep going back to page one to get the latest! :D

Thx!

I have been unable to find a store with component cables for the game cube. I'll have to order online. . . I did get it hooked up Svid, which is better than composite. Regarding audio, I finally figured out that Svid 2 uses the audio inputs for composite 2. *DUH*

Thanks for the VGA cable tip, I called the store I bought the set from and they gave me the cable at no charge. Was it supposed to be included? I hooked up a PC and surfed from the couch. The computer in the den has lost its wireless keyboard, probably permanently!

I also noted your mention of using a non-progressive scan DVD player. I have a progressive scan unit that I manually disabled. Picture quality improved substantially. It actually looked like I was getting distortion in picture with progressive scan on, and the film choice enabled. I wonder how many people are watching/demoing this unit and seeing what appears to be noise? Is there such a thing as a double decode attempt = artifacts and blur? Or is my phillips progressive player just that bad at 3:2?

Here’s a black RF Wireless keyboard.
The reviews aren’t very reassuring, but this might be the look and feel I am going for.

Versapoint interlink (http://pcmag.pricegrabber.com/rating_getprodrev.php/product_id=411313/id_type=M/ut=991ab02215ef11f8)

Could someone confirm the MSRP prices for the HLN sets? From what I've read on some of the other threads the MSRP's are higher -- the 4365 is $3999, and the 467 is $4499. This does matter when trying to negotiate down to a reasonable price (since not all of us are in the NY area :P).

Originally posted by netzen7
Regarding audio, I finally figured out that Svid 2 uses the audio inputs for composite 2. *DUH*

Don´t feel bad. It took me a little while to figure out the SVideo 1-3 are the same as Video 1-3 - just an alternate way of feeding video. I should add it to the guide.


Thanks for the VGA cable tip, I called the store I bought the set from and they gave me the cable at no charge. Was it supposed to be included? I hooked up a PC and surfed from the couch. The computer in the den has lost its wireless keyboard, probably permanently!

Happy surfing. People who don´t hook up a PC to their Samsung are missing one of the biggest benefits of the TV. I didn´t get a VGA cable with either of my sets - but I had plenty lying around.


I also noted your mention of using a non-progressive scan DVD player. I have a progressive scan unit that I manually disabled. Picture quality improved substantially. It actually looked like I was getting distortion in picture with progressive scan on, and the film choice enabled. I wonder how many people are watching/demoing this unit and seeing what appears to be noise? Is there such a thing as a double decode attempt = artifacts and blur? Or is my phillips progressive player just that bad at 3:2?

Its not double decode attempt - your TV simply does a better job. The DVD players today in general weren´t really designed for this new generation of high definition televisions. The Samsung DLP has top notch circuitry for de-interlacing and scaling - Faroudja 2300 - which few DVD players do.

Another critical feature in a DVD player is to be able to output DVI - creating a fully digital hi fidelity path from DVD to the monitor. Only 2 DVD players in the market do that today. I currently use only the HTPC for playing DVD´s -- our current DVD player has been retired. I´m going to now order the Bravo D1 player to make it easy to watch DVD´s.

Originally posted by Zathrus
Could someone confirm the MSRP prices for the HLN sets? From what I've read on some of the other threads the MSRP's are higher -- the 4365 is $3999, and the 467 is $4499.
List price is one of the mysteries on these products. Here are the LIST prices posted by 2 different on-line retailers 1-877amcorder and TV Authority:
HLN4365W $3695 (1-877) $3999 (TVA)
HLN437W $3799 (1-877) $4199 (TVA)
HLN5065W $3999 (1-877) $4499 (TVA)
HLN507W $4199 (1-877) $4699 (TVA)
HLN617W $5299 (1-877) $5499 (TVA)

In the end list prices may be meaningless - only the price that dealer pays are meaninful, but we don´t have access to that info.

Todd, if you try out the integrated keyboard/mouse, can you share your experience.

Arun Gupta

Below is the list prices for the January 2003 Samsung press release. I agree list prices are meaningless. An example is for furniture most furniture stores buy can buy furniture for 60% under list. Many department stores work on a 100% markup. What is a fair markup - it depends upon the availability and the overhead of the store.

The HLN467W (MSRP $4,499) and HLN567W (MSRP $4999) will both be available in April.

Samsung's current models include the 43" HLM437W (MSRP $4199), 50" HLM5065W (MSRP $4699), and the HLM617W (MSRP $5,499). National account distribution models include the 43" HLN4365W (MSRP $3,999) and the 50" HLN5065W (MSRP $4,499).

I can not open your guide. Can you help me?

Originally posted by joenash
I can not open your guide. Can you help me?

The guide is in a compressed (zip) file. When you click on the link you will get a download window. Click "save" and select the folder you want to save it into.

You need a program that can extract the contents from a zip file before you can read the guide document. A popular one is "winzip". You can get a copy at shareware sites like:

http://downloads-zdnet.com.com/2001-20-0.html?legacy=cnet

Thanks for all the great info Arun, and I haven't actually read the writeup yet, just read over this thread.

I am looking to get a new tv in the next couple months. I used to own the 36XBR400, but my sister also wanted to get a new set, so I made her an offer she couldn't refuse because I really wanted to get a widescreen.

I was happy with my XBR, so I was going to take the logical step and get the 34XBR800. Then, after reading on this forum, I learn that a new and seemingly superior model is coming out, the 34XBR910.

Then I read about these DLP sets but I have honestly never seen one. My mom has a 42" RP Samsung, and I'm not too happy with its quality.

With my new set, whatever I go with, I really want to set up an HTPC. I have read the XBRs have some overscan issues.

I was wondering if you have any experience comparing this set to any of the XBRs for use as a HTPC monitor. It sounds like this set it better prepared for the task (at least compared to the 34XBR800), but does anyone know if the 34XBR910 will have better support. The DLP is so much more expensive, do you think it is worth it?

rjcarr316, I can't really give you a fair comparison against 34XBR800 or 34XBR920, because I don't have any experience with them.

For use as an HTPC monitor, you may consider issues while comparing the two sets:
- Samsung sets are larger (43 to 61") vs Sony 34"
- Samsung is more expensive - although not much more so. I paid $2500 retail for my second Samsung 43" set. The best price for the Sony 34" seems to be about ~$1900.
- Samsung has a native resolution of 1280x720, and at this resolution, the computer text and the DVD picture are very clear. I don't know about the Sony.
- DLP has no burn-in problems. This morning I saw that my son was using our 61" Samsung for instant messaging last night and its been on all night - and thats OK. The picture will remain at the same brightness with no burn-in spots after years of intense usage like this. CRT TVs have burn-in problems, although not as severe as Plasma.
- Samsung has more inputs. For computer connections, you can choose between DVI and VGA. Sony only has the DVI.
- CRT TVs have better black levels
- When set up as a PC monitor, Samsung has 2 modes - TV-wide mode overscans, PC-wide mode underscans. I don't know about the Sony.

I wanted a large TV, so direct view CRT was not an option. For you the choice may not be as clear. You should test both TV's with a computer before making your decision.

Thanks for the reply Arun ... I agreed with everything, except:

"You should test both TV's with a computer before making your decision"

That is the problem really ... not too easy to bring your PC down to the local Best Buy, and the pain of lugging these monsters (well, at least the CRT ... my 36XBR400 weighed about 275lbs) doesn't make it practical. Luckily this forum has a lot of people that have done such a thing.

My only hesitation about getting the DLPs is the native resolution problem. While 1280 by 720 is nice, I *think* I read the new XBR910 will do 1440 lines horizontally, and maybe the full 1080i vertically (or it may have been only 540). However, most entry level plasmas only have 480 vertical scan lines, so this is certainly a step up from that.

The pricing is not significant enough to really make a difference. I just have to go into Best Buy and get a comparison.

Thanks again.

Don't get confused by "720" v/s "1080" - It is not as straight as it sounds. It is 720P for Progrerssive and 1080i for interlaced. There is enough information on the forum on this, to educate you further. 720P is "better" for moving objects where as "1080i" for steady pictures.

rjcarr316, I know that its hard to do a side by side comaparison of how the 2 sets look with a PC. A laptop perhaps? If you are able to do the comparison, please let us know here.

"There is enough information on the forum on this, to educate you further"

There really is no need to be condescending. I am fully aware of the difference between 1080i and 720p and all the other different formats.

I look at it like this ...

When you pick up a DVD from the store or rental place, I would assume you pick up the widescreen version, or at least the aspect ratio that was in the theater, right? This is because you want to see the movie as it was made, how the director intended you to see it.

I look at these HD sources in the same way. Any company that spends the money to get an HD camera, also most likely spent the money to do their research to determine which format was best for their situation.

Therefore, I would like to view the source as the originator intended. If you can find a set with actually 1080 scan lines, then you are guaranteed to get 1080i and all the other formats.

This is all I meant.

Originally posted by rjcarr316
"There is enough information on the forum on this, to educate you further"

There really is no need to be condescending. I am fully aware of the difference between 1080i and 720p and all the other different formats.



You got some good advice. The "difference" is more complicated than you seem to understand.

I am back from a trip and will be updating the guide in several areas. I shall post the changes in the threads first and then in the guide. The areas to be updated in the next few days: puchasing pros and cons, price and availability, HTPC recommendations, remote Keyboard/mouse, DVI DVD players, 3 blinking lights problem, stand height, internal reflections, OTA antennas, service menu tweaks.

Arun Gupta

Don't forget that link in the sig! ;D

Also, any chance of just saving the DOC into an HTML file, and foregoing the zip/download/unzip/view in Word process? Just a thought...

Thanks again for the effort!

Purchasing Pros and Cons
---------------------------------
Worthy alternatives to Samsung DLP TVs are: LCD projection, LCoS projection, and CRT rear projection.

LCD Projection - Sony KF-60XBR800
----------------------------------------------------
I spent the long weekend at a relative's house who has a Sony KF-60XBR800 60" LCD rear projection TV. My wife and I both agreed that 1) Samsung has a much brighter and much more vibrant picture. With Sony you had to close the shades to watch in daytime. 2) Sony has poor black levels - detail in dark scenes was mostly lost 3) Samsung has a much wider view angle compared to Sony - in fact the view angle for Sony was surprisingly narrow - you almost had to sit straight in front 4) Samsung is more PC friendly with VGA input and underscan/overscan option 5) Sony had a more attractive cabinet but takes up more space.

LCoS seems to be a more credible alternative - with new products coming from Toshiba and Phillips. CRT rear projection is a lower priced alternative.

Originally posted by lmychajluk
Don't forget that link in the sig! ;D

Also, any chance of just saving the DOC into an HTML file, and foregoing the zip/download/unzip/view in Word process? Just a thought...

Thanks again for the effort!

Imychajluk, what link/sig? How do I do it?

I shall try to convert it to HTML or PDF.

Arun

First, under the new LCD segment you misspelt LCD as LDC in the section header (at least in the copy/paste in this thread).

If you want to put it in your sig, then just go to the first page, copy the URL for the attachment, and then paste it into your signature under User CP->Edit Profile.

If you could convert it to HTML then that would be great -- I wanted to read it a couple days ago on my Linux system, but don't have OpenOffice.org or AbiWord installed on it, so couldn't.

arungupta,

Click on the little 'User CP' button on the top of the page, then Edit profile. There is a field for 'Siganture', and is added to every post. Copy the URL to your file in there as Zathrus said.

If you have a current version of Word, you should be able to 'Save As' and save the file to HTML format. If you want to go the PDF route, there are a couple of free programs that create PDFs, like this one: http://www.pdf995.com/download.html

Zathrus or Lee, If I add the URL to my profile signature, it shows on my posts as the URL text not as a link. What do I need to do to make it show as a link?

Try surrounding it with "" and "" (without the quotes).

Thanks Zathrus, that worked.

I shall change the format of the guide to HTML or PDF later today.

I tried to change the guide to html format, but the AVS forum doesn't accept attachments in this format (why??). Does anyone know how to post an html file?

You could use WinZip on it first than post it, or would that defeat the purpose?
Another idea, upload it to a web site. Maybe you know someone with a site, or you can look for a free one.

Excellent overview! In the "cons" section I would add lack of firewire, which is important to some.

Just curious I guess. If you already have a computer hooked up to the VGA or DVI input, why would you care if the display has FW?

Lasing, yes, zipping the guide would defeat the purpose of converting it to HTML. I guess I'll keep it as a word doc for now.

GadgetFreak, can you list some information on Firewire - what other comparable TV's have firewire, and what is the typical use of Firewire? I shall include it in the guide. Thanks.

There are some output devices (digital camcorders for instance) that have Firewire. I believe there are also some digital sat boxes that have it, as well as some D-VHS players (but I could easily be blowing smoke here since I haven't looked into either). Firewire also incorporates more than just picture data, since you can do command and control over it as well.

Can somebody provide me with a mac-readable document for the guide? I've tried a few different ways with no success. (pdf, .doc, html would be ok).

Thanks.

Originally posted by arungupta
Lasing, yes, zipping the guide would defeat the purpose of converting it to HTML. I guess I'll keep it as a word doc for now.

GadgetFreak, can you list some information on Firewire - what other comparable TV's have firewire, and what is the typical use of Firewire? I shall include it in the guide. Thanks.

I'm just starting to read up on the new series of HDTV's so please correct me if I am mistaken. Firewire is a two way port that allows data and instructions to be sent between the TV and other devices.

RCA recently announced a High Def PVR with an 80GB drive for $449 which is pretty cheap compared to other products. It is cheap because it does not include a tuner or MPEG decoder. You hook it up to a firewire compliant tuner or television set and it uses the televisions tuner to get the signal and the televisions decoder to play back the signal. The Mitsubishi folks really talk up the Netcommand features enabled by FW, but taht didn't resonate with my like the RCA PVR did in terms of wanting FW.

I know that the new RCA's and Mitsubishi sets have firewire. Heard that Hitachi had it but not sure if they still do.

Seems to be more important if the set has built in HD tuner. If/when Samsung adds an on-board QAM tuner and FW then I am a buyer!

fyi: a link to the RCA announcement:http://www.rca.com/content/viewdetail/1,2811,EI700497-CI258,00.html?

and a link to their HDTV announcement :
http://www.rca.com/content/viewdetail/1,2811,EI700489-CI258,00.html?

I have not seen the RCA set yet (due in Aug.) but I like the feature set. Unfortunately they don't offer a 40-something size set. 50+ inches is too big for our living room, which is why I am hoping Samsung adds the features. I think on-board QAM will be common next year.. not so sure about Firewire.

Great thread, thank you for posting.

I was terrified at the prospect of having wasted $700 investing in my progressive scan DVD player (a Denon DVD-2800II), since you claim that the television's internal conversion circuitry is likely better than the DVD player's. Since the player was a recent purchase, I decided to do my own comparison of the player with the progressive scan mode switched on and off. If I preferred the picture in interlaced mode, I could have taken the player back to the retailer and would have willingly paid the restocking fee (if any).

I actually preferred the DVD player in progressive mode... by a wide margin. While the picture in interlaced mode was still impressive, I noticed motion artifacts that I don't see when I play the DVD player in progressive mode.

My suggestion to readers: If you already have a progressive scan DVD player with your HLN-507W, I suggest you perform the same comparison before writing off your own player.

Good luck!!!

If all is true on the new RCA Scenium DLP61, how would you compare it to the yet to come Sammy HLN619 in terms of features, quality, and price? Thanks, Mikesan1.

Stupid question - given I've spent hundreds of hours with these DLPs and sold hundrends too, but I'll ask anyway:

Can you use the speaker inside the DLP as a center channel? If so, how does one go about doing it?

Originally posted by neiltvauthority
Can you use the speaker inside the DLP as a center channel? If so, how does one go about doing it?

I don't think there is a center channel audio input on the Samsung DLP. If I had stuck with the power-buy I could go into my living room and look. But, I'm still waiting for the HLN567.

Beyond that problem (if true), things just get worse. What ever you do, it wouldn't match the timber of the other speakers which degrades the whole sound system.

For it to work at all I think you would need a center mounted speaker that was independent of the other TV speakers. That way it could be controlled by a receiver. If the manufacture sold a matched surround sound package that optionally used a matched speaker in the TV it would work. It might not be the greatest sound, but it would work.

You could use the TV as a center channel, but I don't think you'd want to.

If you simply fed the TV audio from the center output (with a splitter to feed both L and R) the TV could act as a poor man's center speaker -- but you'd have no timbre matching, very poor spatial resolution, and frankly the speakers on these sets are mostly vestigal anyway.

I suppose the real question is, you're planning to spend $3000+ on a TV and can't afford a couple hundred or so on a real center?

I was simply asking for a customer. Customer claims he doesn't have room for a center channel, and asked if he could use the internal speaker as a center.

Thanks for the help!

Originally posted by neiltvauthority
I was simply asking for a customer. Customer claims he doesn't have room for a center channel, and asked if he could use the internal speaker as a center.
Neil, I don't know of any way to use the internal speakers as center channel.

In my current setup, I route all audio from my higher quality inputs (HTPC, DVD player, HDTV receiver) into a separate receiver/5.1 speaker system - and the audio for the lower quality signals (SDTV receiver, VCR) goes to the TV directly. I am out of town till tomorrow. When I get home, I shall feed the audio out from the TV to my receiver/5.1 speaker system and find out how it performs.

Originally posted by Gadgetfreak
Firewire is a two way port that allows data and instructions to be sent between the TV and other devices.
....
I have not seen the RCA set yet (due in Aug.) but I like the feature set. .
GadgetFreak, thanks for the info on RCA announcements - intriguing. Firewire was hot for a while, then DVI seemed to take over, and now RCA is introducing Firewire back again. Can anyone shed light on pros and cons of Firewire vs. DVI.

Originally posted by blackbr
My suggestion to readers: If you already have a progressive scan DVD player with your HLN-507W, I suggest you perform the same comparison before writing off your own player.
blackbr, I shall post this advice in the guide, along with your experience. Your Denon DVD player has the Silicon Image/DVDO PureProgressive (SiI504) Decoding Engine - which according to Denon is the highest quality progressive decoding engine available. I wonder if anyone has done a comparison with Faroudja FLI2300, the chip in Samsung. Also, I am wondering if you plan to try out the Bravo D1 (or Samsung 931) player. If you do, please share your experience.

Neil, one more comment. The TV does have the Dolby Virtual option. According the Samsung user guide "The center and surround sounds are mixed into the L/R speakers." I don't know if that's what your customer wants, or how well this feature actually works.

FW can be a two way port, but what info would the TV have to send back? It doesn’t have storage capability. I suspect some people might like the idea of connecting a digital camera or something direct to the display, but if you have a computer sitting right next to the display, you can do the same thing without that input on the TV.

I’m not trying to talk anyone out of buying a TV with FW input, but I would like to understand why you think you need it.

Originally posted by Lasing
FW can be a two way port, but what info would the TV have to send back?

Two reasons for 2 way Firewire:
1) Sending program data from a tuner to a PVR. In the case of the announced RCA HD PVR it does not have an on-board tuner or MPEG decoder (which is why it is less then half the price of other announced HD PVR's). If the television set has an HD tuner (which Samsung will probably have next year?) then the PVR can send an instruction TO the TV tuner about which program to tune in (1st leg of the trip). Then that program is sent BACK TO the PVR (return trip). Finally when you want to watch the program it is sent by the PVR TO the TV where it is decoded and displayed. (3rd leg of the trip)

If you do not have an on-board HD tuner then you don't need firewire in the TV for this but you should look for it in whatever external tuner you get if you want to have the widest selection of PVR's to choose from.

2) Firewire can also be used to control other devices. Mitsubishi TV's can send instructions to other products (DVD players? PVR's? HD VCR's?) all through a unified "NetCommand" interface.

I've never seen NetCommand so I cannot tell you whether it is something worthwhile. You can do a search on Netcommand to learn more (not sure if it is 1 word or 2). Persoanlly to me, the first reason is really important. Not so sure I care about reason #2.

I don't think it is a question of Firewire or DVI -- I think both are necessary. And one other benefit of having both -- it is another HD digital input. If your PVR hooks into a Firewire port it leaves the DVI port free for soemthing else.

If you want to obtain more opinions, maybe post a new thread to solicit opnions from Mits owners and others that might not be reading page 6 of a samsung thread?

If your computer is your DVD, PVR and your HD tuner, you still don’t need FW input on the display.

I stopped using the built in tuner and speakers on my TV back in 1986. Unless you count CH.3 only. I did use an RF modulator until I got a set with a video input. Speakers connect to stereo system of some kind are much better than the TV has. Channels are always changed on something outside the display such as VCR, cable box, satellite decoder, and now computer. Really, all I want is a big, flat, wide screen computer monitor. For the price, I think Samsung DLP is the best thing going.

Thank you, GadgetFreak. Now I understand why someone that doesn’t have a computer in their living room yet, might be interested in Fire Wire.

Firewire is nice if only for command and control -- even with discrete codes being able to tell the TV to turn on, change input to X over firewire is a good thing. And it's better than discrete codes in this case because not only can you tell the TV to do this, but the TV can respond with an OK message.

If the industry would standardize on a command and control protocol over firewire then it'd make all of our lives much, much simpler. And then pigs would fly and hell would freeze over.

arungupta, I am really happy with the current setup although I may tone down the color a bit, once there is some consensus on the agreed to adjustments. I was watching "A Time to Kill" Sunday night on CBS hi-def... and the scene that blew my mind was a courtroom shot where I could see the texture of the paper being drawn on by the sketch artist.

I don't currently intend to upgrade to a DVD player with a DVI or VGA interface... I didn't even know they existed until I ran across this forum a few days ago. In fact, I had always understood that component video inputs were the highest quality! I don't expect to buy a new DVD player until high definition players are released, if ever.

Thanks again for this service.

Originally posted by htwaits
I was thinking that this guide might benefit from having something in it about the exclusions based on distance in the Samsung "in home" warranty.

I'm glad Samsung came through. But, forty miles doesn't seem that far. Is it left up to the authorized repair service as to how far they will go to make a call?

I live in Central Illinois, zipcode: 61704. How can I find out and who can I call toll free to find out who, in my area, is authorized to repair DLP's and what, if any, travel limit there might be.

Thanks

Originally posted by kmil
I live in Central Illinois, zipcode: 61704. How can I find out and who can I call toll free to find out who, in my area, is authorized to repair DLP's and what, if any, travel limit there might be.

Thanks

I don't have a Samsung TV right now but there should be a toll free number that came with the set. I think that when you call with a problem they refer you to a "local" service provider. I also understand that those providers may decline to service your set. I'm not sure what happens next.

How can they "decline"? I suspect they are under some kind of a contract to provide a service. How can Sammy, in effect, potentially leave you hanging? Also, if I got a Sammy it would be the new 46" so obviously I don't have the set yet. If possible, please provide me with an 800 # to call for service info. We/I would appreciate it. Thank you for your time and attention!

arungupta,

I'm planning on purchasing the HLN617W and have found your guide
invaluable in answering some of my questions. I do have one additional
question. The shelves on the Samsung TRL612S stand are only 6.1" high
per the Samsung documentation and my 7" tall receiver and my 8" tall
center speaker will not fit into the stand. Due to the 56.5" length of the TV,
stands for it may be hard to find. Has anyone else found any other stands
adequate for this TV? Has anyone developed any plans for making a stand?

Neil,

As for using the Samsung for a center channel, I agree with Zathrus and strongly recommend against it. If your customer has decent main speakers, they are much better off leaving the center channel in *Phantom* mode. If he/she wants to try using the TV, it can be connected using a Y-connector and the center channel set to *Small*.

Originally posted by vblyth
arungupta,
The shelves on the Samsung TRL612S stand are only 6.1" high
per the Samsung documentation and my 7" tall receiver and my 8" tall
center speaker will not fit into the stand. Due to the 56.5" length of the TV,
stands for it may be hard to find. Has anyone else found any other stands
adequate for this TV? Has anyone developed any plans for making a stand?

vblyth, I don' know of any other special stands or plans or for this TV. Any stand of the right height (~20"), and enough width (>40") to hold the base will do. If other members have found any specially suitable stand, please share the info.

I am going to soon build a stand -- still waiting for spring to arrive here in CT. The stand will have enough space to house 6 A/V boxes, a mid-tower HTPC, and 2 game systems. I need to also make it look as part of an oak wall system. For now I have been using the stand from an older TV.

Originally posted by vblyth
Has anyone else found any other stands
adequate for this TV?

Here is information about the stand that I bought.

Ikea has a 59 inch stand in black for $78 that's pretty good for the money. They also have it in birch for $99. It's the OPPLI TV Bench and is 59"W x 19 5/8"D x 15 3/4"H with casters. When we got ours they only had black in stock. We intended it as a temporary solution but it's looks and works so well for us that I expect we will have it for some time.

There are three component bays. Each bay is 10 1/4" high and 17 5/8" wide. There are two adjustable shelves that can go in any bay.

It has casters that seem to work smoothly. You do the assembly.

There is a HLM507 in the picture along with five components.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?s=&postid=1872514&fullpage=1

Originally posted by Zathrus


If the industry would standardize on a command and control protocol over firewire then it'd make all of our lives much, much simpler. And then pigs would fly and hell would freeze over.

They are trying with HaVI. http://www.havi.org/

I didn't realize until I stumbled across that site that Firewire devices could be daisychained to your TV -- that would reduce the need for multiple inputs. I knew you could daisychain from a PC, but wasn't sure if consumer devices supported that, though I think each device would need 2 ports then.

Originally posted by kmil
I live in Central Illinois, zipcode: 61704. How can I find out and who can I call toll free to find out who, in my area, is authorized to repair DLP's and what, if any, travel limit there might be.

Thanks

Kmil,
Call this number and they can probably refer you to an authorized service center.

800-747-5618

FriscoJoe

Thanks for the picture of your tv stand, htwaits. I really like the look of that stand, especially since black is my preferred color and it has a good price tag. Since I don't have any Ikea stores near me (just Kansas wheat fields :(), I checked their web site and it appears they only have the birch in stock. My search will continue. I may have to build one as arungupta is planning on doing. Thanks again for the input.

Vern

You are welcome. Ikea works best if you are near one of their monster stores. On that stand I think they charge more for shipping than they do for the stand.

For DVD playback using DVI output players, please refer to this thread where pros and cons of Bravo D1 and Samsung 931 DVD players are discussed. I shall summarize this discussion and post it in the guide.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=268177

Some of us have been unsure about buying a product made by Samsung -- old perceptions persist. We are more comfortable buying the familiar Japanese brands. A year ago, I would have been in the same situation. It changed late last year when I happened to buy one of their yepp mp3 players and was pleasantly surprised. Since then, not only have I bought multiple Samsung DLP sets, but also many of their other products including LCD monitors, LCD TV's, cell phone, DVD drives and CD players. I have been impressed by each product in both performance and price. Samsung aims to become the leading consumer electronics brand in the world, and they are moving in the right direction. This business week article talks about Samsung and is very illuminating:

http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/03_24/b3837001_mz001.htm?c=bwinsiderjun6&n=link1&t=email

I am posting this because we need to be comfortable with the company that is going the stand behind our expensive purchase.

I want to make it clear that I have NO business relationship or interest with Samsung -- other than purely as a consumer.

That article mentions they are releasing 42 new TV's in the US this year. Any idea how many they have already announced? Is there more to come this year? I had been thinking the next announcements wou;dn't come until January CES.

I don't know if anyone is keeping count of their announcements?

Some excerpts of interest here:

"Samsung thinks the moment is fast arriving when it can unseat Sony Corp. as the most valuable electronics brand and the most important shaper of digital trends."

"A year ago, you'd have been hard pressed to find a Samsung high-definition TV in the U.S. Now, Samsung is the best-selling brand in TVs priced at $3,000 and above -- a mantle long held by Sony and Mitsubishi Corp. "

"No wonder Samsung exited the low-margin market for TV sets 27 inches and under."

DVI and VGA connections / TV-wide vs. PC-wide
------------------------------------------------------------
Prompted by a post from another member, I ran the checkerboard patterns on TV-wide (overscan) and PC-wide (underscan) modes and found that:

- If you set your input resolution to 1280/720 then,
- TV-wide mode maps it 1:1.
- PC-WIDE MODE DOWNSCALES IT TO SOME UNKNOWN RESOLUTION

Based on this, this is what I would recommend for use with an HTPC:

- For normal PC work, you have no choice but to use PC-wide mode and live with the signal degradation due to downscaling

- For DVD or any other video playback when the quality of the output is paramount, you must use the TV-wide mode for 1:1 mapping. If you don't like overscan, then use zoomplayer and adjust the zoom level.

I am going to find out if we can get 1:1 mapping in PC-wide mode using a custom resolution using Powerstrip. If anyone has already done it, please let us know.

Arun, Great Article. Great T.V.

Samsung -- old perceptions persist.
I think you can make that statement for most anything with Korean roots. I've got 3 sub $100 Samsung VCRs, bought at a time when other manufactures wanted almost twice the price for equivalent feature models. B4 my HLN, I had Samsung figured as cheap, low end products.

The next Sony? I don't know, or much care. Actually, I hope not. I'm not sure brand recognition means what it did. With proliferation of boards like AVS (and the Net in general) leveling the communication playing field, I think consumers are better educated, and voting with their dollars for quality products at reasonable prices. If Samsung keeps bringing products to market with speed and appeal, I look forward to additional products from them in my home and business.

BTW, the VCRs are still running, after years of abuse.

Originally posted by Lasing
FW can be a two way port, but what info would the TV have to send back?

DVI/HDCP and FW/5C require the TV to send an ID to the source. The source checks to see if the TV is licensed based on the ID.

FW doesn't support the data rate that DVI does, so a FW connection sends MPEG-encoded picture data, which would have to be decoded. To some extent that would make a TV with FireWire input more expensive (only a little really).

Originally posted by htwaits
You are welcome. Ikea works best if you are near one of their monster stores. On that stand I think they charge more for shipping than they do for the stand.

Please send me a picture of that black stand from Ikea....my wife likes black for a stand........soooo, guess what color we'll probably end up with.
BTW, I will either get an Sammy HLN467 OR a Phillips 44 inch LCoS. I'll also try to find it on the net assuming that www.ikea.com is the probable site? A picture from you though would be appreciate. Also, what do YOU think about the LCoS from Philips? I'm leaning in that direction, away from but not to far from the above Sammy.

All,

I found these and think they would be great stands for the DLPS.
The links I have to the stands in black, however they also come in a light oak...

For the 50 - 61 inch DLPs look at this thread:

http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/ref=br_1_11/602-3770337-4967846?asin=B00008PC40

For the 43-46 inch this one would work great:

http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/ref=br_1_4/602-3770337-4967846?asin=B00008PC3S


Jeff

Originally posted by kmil
Please send me a picture of that black stand from Ikea....my wife likes black for a stand........soooo, guess what color we'll probably end up with.


There is a link and dimensions in a message near the bottom of page 6. Here is a link to the picture.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?s=&postid=1872514&fullpage=1

QUESTION:

I'm looking at the dlp samsungs and was still unsure about the component connections after reading the guide.

If I have a motorola 5100 HD box (Comcast) which airs digital cable, standard cable and HD - can I just hook it up to one of the component 480p/720p/1080i connections and get signals for all sources out of the box, or do I need to hook up through S-Video and Component (that would be a pain)? I guess I'm not sure if the 480p/720p/1080i connector will read standard non-high def cable like it does in other sets (the samsung seems different in that they split out the sources), I don't think any of the signals coming from comcast would be 480i - but I could be wrong.

Thanks.

I don't have personal experience with the Motorola 5100 HD box - but the following recommendations is based on incomplete knowledge. I believe the Motorola box has the following output options: component, S-video, composite and RF.

I would recommend connecting the Component OUT from this box to Samsung Component 2 IN. I would additionally recommend connecting RF OUT to Samsung Antenna 1 IN. (You can use Antenna 2 IN for an Over-the-Air antenna.)

You should now see the cable channels on both Component 2 and Antenna 1.

SD channels: Compare the picture quality for SD channels. If Component 2 is superior, you don't need to use the Antenna 1 connection. If Antenna 1 is superior, then you should use Antenna 1 for SD channels.

HD channels: Use Component 2 input. Warning - HD signal over a component connection is not as good as the one you get from a DVI connection. You have to wait till your cable company gives you this option, or consider satellite service.

Hope this works out for you.

Thanks, I'm not sure if I'm going to get the sammy - I'm currently a 57xwx hitachi owner who's a bit frustrated with some bad luck! I've liked what I have seen so far on dlp - but I'm a bit hesitant to go with a relatively new tech (plus the 56 or 61 sammys are going to cost well north of $1,000 more than the hitachi - including a stand). Gotta keep researching!

Just ordered the HLN617W today. Being told I should have it by mid-July. Thanks to everyone in the AVSforum for the great discussions on the Sammy DLPs. Hopefully, the wait will be over soon.

Connecting more than one DVI sources has been one of the issues on Samsung DLP TV's. I have three sources: a Samung SIR-TS160 DirecTV and OTA receiver, an HTPC, and soon a Bravo D1 DVD player.

DVI switches available in the market today cost ~$500.

There may be some respite on the way. Belkin has announced DVI switches at a lower price. A 2 port switch is listed on their site at $245 and a 4 port switch is listed $325. Both are listed as "coming soon". Although these prices are still higher than I would like to pay, they are now in the range where I shall seriously consider getting one.

http://web.belkin.com/config/Search/SearchResults.asp?search=dvi&catID=1

Here is the description for the 4 port model.

"OmniView SOHO Series 4-Port KVM Switch with Audio

Part # F1DD104U

The new OmniView SOHO Series KVM Switch with Audio from Belkin allows you to control up to four DVI/USB computers from one USB keyboard and mouse, and one DVI monitor. It makes choosing your connected computers easy with convenient switching through either the press of a button or a simple keystroke. Its innovative design offers built-in cable management and creates a sculpted new look for your desktop-while saving you time, space, and money.

Advantages
• Works with up to four DVI/USB desktop computers
• Control through USB hot key switching and direct-access port selectors
• Offers audio and microphone switching support
• Support for video resolutions of up to 1600x1200
• 10-second AutoScan mode to monitor all computers
• Complete USB keyboard and mouse emulation for error-free booting
• Flash-upgradeable firmware
• PC99 color connectors for matching cables to appropriate ports quickly and easily
• Active port LEDs for easy status monitoring
• Built-in cable management

Color: MIDNIGHT GRAY
UPC: 722868452912"

Although this is designed as a switch for computers, I am hoping that thare will be no issues connecting non-computer DVI sources.

If anyone gets a hold of it, please share your experience as soon as possible.

There is a discussion thread on this new product announcement:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=271650

There is a lot of discussion on whether this will pass the HDCP requirement. In my view, a passive switch like this should be unaware of the signal content and therefore should have no issues with HDCP.

I am a lot more concerned about whether it degrades the signal in any way - introducing noise for example.

This site sells all types of KVM switches including Belkin. They also sell other DVI switches, including Geffen. They seem to discount Belkin switches about 30%. The new Belkin DVI switches are not yet listed.

http://www.kvms.com/belkin/belkin_omniview_soho_series.asp

Here is a review of the Belkin SOHO switch, the non-DVI version.

http://www.tech-report.com/reviews/2002q3/usb-kvms/index.x?pg=2

This is a compilation of many useful threads on Samsung DLP

Samsung Upgrade Program Announced FOR DLP UNITS!!!
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=267244

Power Buy for the Samsung DLP Lamp
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=217910

Concrete Information About The Samsung HLN Series (Update)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=227068

Samsung DLP -N- series tweaks thread
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=244193

Samsung 50'' DLP In Action
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=247169

Poll: Samsung HLM437, 507, 617W Upgrades...
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=228718

ExtremeTech HDTV Quest: Samsung Takes the Crown + Gary Merson Interview
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=267348

Poll: Interest Check: PowerBuy for Samsung HLNs?
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=237610

Samsung HLN617W DLP is awesome
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=262022

Why should a DLP have motion artifacts?
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=268854

Samsung HLN617W reviewed by Cnet
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=260353

Best Internet Store to Buy Samsung DLP
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=270025

Review of the DLP Samsung HLN5065W from a common “normal” consumer
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=270105

Samsung HLN617W Discrete power codes found!
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=269193

Question about DLP and HDTV Fast Pans
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=271954

Help With Samsung 61" DLP and Powerstrip
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=255014

Arun, thank you.

Your "Guide to Samsung DLP" is a Godsend. Now to find out how, where and when to get my 61" Sammy DLP.

Thanks for all your hard work!

Dom

Arun, we appreciate your work on giving us info on the Samsung DLPs. Please continue the great work.

You can also add the following to your list:

Dlp Internal Reflection Fix
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=266475&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

Originally posted by arungupta
Some of us have been unsure about buying a product made by Samsung -- old perceptions persist. We are more comfortable buying the familiar Japanese brands. A year ago, I would have been in the same situation. It changed late last year when I happened to buy one of their yepp mp3 players and was pleasantly surprised. ...


Interestingly enough, Samsung's line of Yepp MP3 players were designed by a Korean company called MPIO (does business in the US under the name of DigitalWay). It recently started selling its own line of MP3 players -- I reviewed the FL100, and excellent device overall, here: http://www.gearbits.com/archives/000017.html

OK, now back on-topic...sorry for the diversion...
- Craig

For those of you still on the fence about using DVI input for your DVD playback on Samsung DLP, here is a link to an article in USA Today where the author shares his experience of hooking up a Samsung HD 931 DVD player to a Samsung DLP TV:

Higher-definition DVD player: A resolutionary idea
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2003-06-24-samsung_x.htm

Here is the part where he compares DVD playback to a High definition broadcast of "Star Wars, attack of the clones":

"Make no mistake, the HD broadcast was superior. In Amidala's and Anakin's sappy frolic in the field, I could make out individual weed stalks in the foreground that were lost in the DVD video. But the DVD player held its own, and, to many eyes, would appear close enough to HDTV to make it worthwhile."

By this post, I don´t mean to imply that Samsung HD 931 is a better choice than Bravo D1, HTPC or even Momitsu. Simply, that DVI is a must for DVD playback. A $200+ investment in a DVI DVD player significantly enhances the much larger investment in the Samsung TV.

By the way, the article says that DVI cables cost $80-$100. Actually they are available for much less. For example, Pacific cable lists DVI-D male to male cables from $16 to $30 depending on the length.

http://www.pacificcable.com/DVI.htm

Hmmm . . . the USA Today writer waxes ecstatic about the quality he gets from DVDs upconverted to 720p and played via DVI to his DLP TV. This sounds like a description of the quality many of us who have HTPCs, software DVD players, and video cards with DVI output have already been enjoying for months! :D

It’s interesting that I used this same scene when I first got the 931 for my Sammy HLN. I hooked up both the component and DVI and switched between the two while watching the “sitting-in-the-field” scene of AOTC. With component, the individual stocks of grass tended to blur together, while with DVI, each stock stood out with greater clarity. Also, check out the grains of sand when Amidala gets up after falling from the transport.

Indeed, sometimes the DVI is a little too revealing because the special effects on older movies appear not so special as the matte paintings, wires, and other tricks become more obvious. Also, bad makeup, cheap sets, and cheesy costumes can be readily spotted.

Bottom line is that this is that DVI (at least when the Sammy 931 DVD player is coupled with a Sammy HLN set) will make a material improvement in your DVD viewing pleasure.

Does a DVI connection (compared to a component or S-video one) improve the PQ of HD programs? and the PQ of SD programs?

Originally posted by Maurice2
Does a DVI connection (compared to a component or S-video one) improve the PQ of HD programs?
For HD programs, DVI is a must. DVI does not actually improve the quality of your source, it passes it through without change. Other means of connection lose quality that is already in the source. The ranking of connections from best to worst are:

DVI
VGA
Component
S-Video
Composite

The higher the quality of your original source, the more it is imperative that your use a DVI connection. There is no point in investing in HD if you don´t use DVI.

Originally posted by Maurice2
and the PQ of SD programs?
Depends on the program. DVD´s - absolutely. A good quality movie broadcast - yes. For poor quality SD programs - DVI is not worth it.

arungupta,

2 questions.

1. If I have get the new DVI samsung DVD player and I've also got direcTV, do I understand correctly that I should use the sammy's DVI for the direcTV, and if so what connection should I use for the DVD player?

2. Is there any word about the direcTV/Tivo HD tuner/recorder- as to when it's coming out, how much it will cost and how much recording capacity?

Thanks very much for your informative thread!

Irwin

Originally posted by brick33308
1. If I have get the new DVI samsung DVD player and I've also got direcTV, do I understand correctly that I should use the sammy's DVI for the direcTV, and if so what connection should I use for the DVD player?
Irwin

My choice would be to connect the DVI DVD player to the DVI input and DirecTV to component. I enjoy DVDs more than TV.

If I was going to reverse that and already had a DVD player I wouldn't bother with getting one with a DVI output. The component 1 input on the TV works well with interlaced DVD players.

In other words, what you guys are saying is:

if you don't watch that much DVD, but much more TV, connect the DVI input of your DLP to the DVI output of your STB (assuming it has one), and connect your DVD player to the DLP via component. That makes sense for me, since I seldom watch DVD. For movies, I tend to rely on the four premium channels I subscribe to: they have dozens of free movies every day.

Of course, if you wait till next year, you won't have this decision to make: the new models will evidently have two DVI inputs.

What about using DVI for the DVD and the 15 pin VGA for the direct TV? I have not seen this mentioned - am I missing something?

I know VGA is between DVI and component but is it closer to DVI in quality? Forgive me if this is obvious but I have only been in this for a few months.

Connect the one you like to watch the most or that you are most particular about.

Originally posted by justman
What about using DVI for the DVD and the 15 pin VGA for the direct TV? I have not seen this mentioned - am I missing something?

I know VGA is between DVI and component but is it closer to DVI in quality? Forgive me if this is obvious but I have only been in this for a few months.
That should work reasonably well. Try it and tell us what you think.

There is no optimum or single answer until good DVI switches become affordable, It depends on your exact equipment and watching habits.

Couple of techniques people follow:

- The highest quality/most preferred source gets DVI, next highest VGA, then component ......

- Manually switch when you have to for now

Maybe relief is on the way. See posts on Belkin DVI switch announcements in this same thread.

After doing some comparisons between DVD and HDTV, I found that DVD benefited most from the DVI input. Therefore, I elected to run the Sammy 931 DVD player through the DVI and the Sammy 165 HD Tuner through the 15-pin VGA.

If a big HD event comes up (Superbowl, Grammys, etc.) I will take the time to hook the HD tuner up through DVI (maybe a 3 minute task).

Kevin,
How close is the VGA picture to DVI (for your 165 connection)? Is it almost as good as DVI or is it just above Component quality?

Are you using expensive DVI & VGA cables for your results?

I think this may be the answer for me since watching movies is when I care most about PQ

DVI cables are digital so spending more on them has no return in improved PQ.

Here is a Belkin DVI switch thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=271650&highlight=Belkin+and+DVI+and+switch

I perceived only a minimal improvement between DVI and 15-pin on the Sammy 165 HD tuner, but bear in mind the following. With a DVD, you can replay the same scene over and over to really observe the difference between cables. With HD, the picture is always changing so you are not able to compare the exact scene between DVI and 15-pin. Furthermore, the PQ of HD is also dependent on the program material, the transmitter, your antenna, etc., so you may see a difference where I don't. Finally, I've got the 43-in Sammy, so a larger screen may reveal an improvement that I don't see. In summary, your mileage may vary.

The bottom line is that I noticed very little difference between DVI and 15-pin on HD material. HD still looked darn good using 15-pin but DVD took an indisputable leap in PQ using DVI.

I have the $100 Monster DVI that the salesman threw in for $25 (probably the wholesale cost). However, initially I used a DVI cable that came with my computer monitor (probably a $20 cable), and I couldn't say there was a difference between the two. The Monster is gold plated, but if you used a good contact cleaner like Caig Pro-Gold, I would think you would see the same results with either cable.

I don't necessarily agree that all cables are created equal, but my experience is that Monster products are substantially over-hyped and overpriced. Other than on long runs, my opinion is that any good quality DVI cable will provide excellent results.

My VGA cable is a Belkin gold-plated purchased at CompUSA for around $30.

We mainly watch movies, so connecting the DVI to the DVD was an easy choice until a good switcher comes along.

I've got another Sammy HLN question unrelated to my original DVI question.

Most of my source material is recorded and viewed from Tivo which in turn gets it from digital cable. When the DirecTV/Tivo HD combo unit comes out, I plan to switch to DirecTV and get the HD unit. Until then, however, do you think I'll be unhappy with PQ on my existing Tivo recorded material? I almost never watch live TV anymore.

Originally posted by brick33308
... however, do you think I'll be unhappy with PQ on my existing Tivo recorded material? I almost never watch live TV anymore.

You may be. Does Tivo add an extra layer of compression?

I think Tivo does compress. Does anyone out there have acutal experience with PQ of Tivo recorded material on the Sammy HLN?

Originally posted by brick33308
I think Tivo does compress. Does anyone out there have acutal experience with PQ of Tivo recorded material on the Sammy HLN?

Maybe a new thread and a good subject line would bring out the Tivo people.

thanks, will do.

Arun, I think your zip file is busted. I can download it, but it's empty when I open it. Jsut FYI - keep up the great work!

I use my hacked SA Tivo to feed my hlm5065 (new internals) and am quite happy with the picture quality via digital cable (s-video). I started to try some config changes on the Sammy, but kept ending up at the settings that were OOTB.

Pay channels (HBO and such) look better than regular stations.

Originally posted by lmychajluk
Arun, I think your zip file is busted. I can download it, but it's empty when I open it. Jsut FYI - keep up the great work!
lmychajluk, thanks for letting me know. I don't know how it could have happened. It may be related to all the server changes in the forum. I am travelling right now and won't be home for another 10 days and I don't have access to my original file at home.:( I'm actually in the great city of Berlin as I am typing this. ;)

DOES ANYONE HAVE THE LATEST VERSION OF THIS GUIDE (1.5)? PLEASE POST HERE FIRST THAT YOU HAVE IT AND THEN E-MAIL IT TO ME AT arungupta_ct@yahoo.com. I SHALL THEN UPDATE THE FILE IN THIS THREAD. I'LL REALLY APPRECIATE IT.

Originally posted by lmychajluk
Arun, I think your zip file is busted. I can download it, but it's empty when I open it. Jsut FYI - keep up the great work!

Are you using WinZip? I think it's a bug with WinZip. If you click on the link, and it automatically opens the file in WinZip, this happens. Blank.

What I do is I download the file to the hard disk, by Right clicking on the link and then clicking Save Target As... Once you have downloaded the file, you can open it using WinZip and the contents will show up.

No prob, Arun. The last copy of the file that I have was a May 10th date on the Word file, but I don't think this is v. 1.5. I hope your enjoying Berlin!

Arun, thanks so much for the guide.
Since you have experience with this set, I would appreciate any comments user have with the conversion modes... you list, wide, normal, and panoramic. How does the conversion routines look when converting Direct TV or Dish 4:3 material to fill up the screen 16:9 modes? Anyone?

I am in the market and would appreciate any information!

Thanks,

Dan

Arun, I have version 1.5...emailing it to you now. Dave

Dan,
Be aware that only "wide" and "normal" modes are available when the TV thinks it's receiving a HD source - which is all the time when feeding a satellite box into the component inputs, whether the channel is truly HD or SD. That's why most sat receivers (including my Dish 6000) provide internal aspect switching - but unfortunately, the 6000 does not have a non-linear stretch ('panorama') mode, just 'stretch' and two 'zoom' settings. I've worked around this by also running s-video from the 6000, so by changing the TV input and also switching the 6000 into "SD" mode I can utilize the Samsung's more flexible aspect controls.

Personally, however, I find that I don't like any of the aspect conversions - why pay so much to watch a distorted image? I vastly prefer to watch 4:3 in its original aspect ratio. Being able to do this with no fear of burn-in is one of the big reasons I chose a DLP set in the first place. Also, I find that compression and other artifacts of poor SD signals are accentuated even more when they're stretched out to fill the screen.

Rob

Dropped a few grand at CC this AM and a shiny new HLN437W will be delivered sometime this week.

Funny story: ever since I told my wife that I found our next TV, she kept asking me "so when is it coming?" I thought, "wow, she's excited about this." She then informed me that, no, she's not excited, she just wants to know when this whole "new TV" obsession will be over.

I then had to inform her that, since this was an HD set, actually getting the TV was just the beginning. {cue evil laugh}
- Craig

So,, what kind of prices is everyone paying for the HLN617W?

Seems the $4999.99 price is everywhere. I ended up
ordering mine at The Great Indoors. I got $500 off by
opening up a credit card with them.

Originally posted by DiamondDave
Arun, I have version 1.5...emailing it to you now. Dave

Thanks, Dave. I got it. I´ll post it tomorrow as soon as I find an Internet access place that allows me to save downloaded files.

(In US, we are spoiled by Internet access everywhere, and most places now offer high speed access. Here in Berlin, probably the most Internet savvy place in Germany, you really have to look for good Internet access, and even the best hotels don´t have high speed access.)

Originally posted by dleithaus
Since you have experience with this set, I would appreciate any comments user have with the conversion modes... you list, wide, normal, and panoramic. How does the conversion routines look when converting Direct TV or Dish 4:3 material to fill up the screen 16:9 modes? Anyone?
...Dan
Initially when we got the TV, I watched a lot of 4:3 TV in Panoramic or Wide modes. These modes work as well as could be expected. After a month or so, however, I seem to often move back to Normal mode with black bars on the side. I find it more natural. My wife prefers the Wide mode. I think that Wide and Panoramic modes are cultivated tastes.

As Rob/rvonder says, there is a limit to when wide and panoramic modes are available. In my case, however, the Samsung SIR-TS160 set top box also happens to have a wide mode.

Originally posted by lmychajluk
Arun, I think your zip file is busted. I can download it, but it's empty when I open it. Jsut FYI - keep up the great work!
I have now replaced the guide in the first post of this thread. Please let me know if anyone has problem in downloading it.

On the recommendations of Arun Gupta and after seeing a working demo in a local store I decided to get a Samsung DLP set because I found the image quality to be stunning.

I have a question for Arun Gupta and/or other owners of this set that are using it for computer input.

DVI or VGA? And is it a noticeable difference?

I also have on order a DVD player (Samsung HD391) that uses a DVI output and since the TV only has one DVI input I'm leaning towards using the standard D-SUB VGA input for the computer but if the quality is going to be noticeable inferior I will see about getting a switch or splitter.

Anyone have comments about this?

Originally posted by Darkwind_Legion
On the recommendations of Arun Gupta and after seeing a working demo in a local store I decided to get a Samsung DLP set because I found the image quality to be stunning.

I have a question for Arun Gupta and/or other owners of this set that are using it for computer input.

DVI or VGA? And is it a noticeable difference?

I also have on order a DVD player (Samsung HD391) that uses a DVI output and since the TV only has one DVI input I'm leaning towards using the standard D-SUB VGA input for the computer but if the quality is going to be noticeable inferior I will see about getting a switch or splitter.

Anyone have comments about this?
Using DVI for a DVD player and VGA for computer input is a good compromise. Computer VGA is very good quality, though of course it is not as good as DVI. You should try it just to see what the difference is.

Of course, that leaves a question of what you will use for Set top box connection, assuming your STB also has a DVI output.

Lack of multiple DVI connections or a good and affordable DVI switch is one of the biggest pains of owning a high-def TV today.

Originally posted by dwk
So,, what kind of prices is everyone paying for the HLN617W?

Seems the $4999.99 price is everywhere. I ended up
ordering mine at The Great Indoors. I got $500 off by
opening up a credit card with them.

Not everyone ... I just bought one yesterday at TWEETER in Dallas for 4749.00.

I didn't even try hard. I perhaps could have gotten him lower. No money down. 15 equal payments, interest free.



-----------------------------------------------------------
Go George Bush! He's done his share for low interest rates. Now go out there and buy something!

Originally posted by brick33308
I think Tivo does compress. Does anyone out there have acutal experience with PQ of Tivo recorded material on the Sammy HLN? As an owner of a SA Tivo with dreams of the toys to come, I can say that DirecTivo units do not compress/convert the native digital signal. The SA units have to convert the analog signal and then compress according to user settings. I have no experience with digital cable with an SA unit but I have my suspicions that those signals are treated as if analog.
YMMV

Thanks!

If anyone buys the HLN617W at Great Indoors, they take the $500 off of the $4999 before adding tax , so with $49 delivery it's $4589 + tax
delivered.

I expect like anything new we will see the prices plummet in the months to come.. Oh well, the price of the edge..




PS I dont work at Great Inddoors, just thought others may want to take advantage of the offer.....

From CNET review of Bravo D1:

"We connected the D1 to our DLP-based, fixed-pixel Samsung HLN617W via DVI, and the player produced some of the best pictures we've ever seen from a DVD source. When we set the output to 720p, the pristine digital images from Star Wars: Attack of the Clones looked downright spectacular. "

See the "Performance" section in this review:

http://reviews.cnet.com/V_Inc_Bravo1/4505-6473_7-20848496.html?tag=cnetfd.sd

Hello All,

Can you please provide exact dimensions of the HLN617W. I'm looking for the Screen dimensions as well as the dimension from the bottom of the unit to the bottom of the bezel.

Dave

Question on HLN617... the new brochure points out discrete/non-discrete TVs and states the HLN617 is *not*.

I plan to purchase a new set in Sept/Oct time frame, but need to decide which one now (wall unit guy is building and needs measurements)...

IS or IS NOT the HLN617 going to have discrete?

Thanks in advance...

ps. Arun, you are the freakin MAN... THANK YOU for helping Samsung out with their impotent Marketing Department.

Originally posted by WTIDave
Hello All,

Can you please provide exact dimensions of the HLN617W. I'm looking for the Screen dimensions as well as the dimension from the bottom of the unit to the bottom of the bezel.

Dave


OK here you go (because I obviously have too much free time on my hands; ;) )...

OVERALL DIMENSIONS:

W = 56_1/2"
H = 40_1/8"
D = 19_1/2"

BREAKDOWN DIMENSIONS:

From bottom of base to bottom edge of lower Bezel (including speaker) = 7" high

Speaker cabinet = 6" high

Base footprint = 1" high x 37_3/4" wide

From bottom edge of lower Bezel (just above speaker) to top edge of upper Bezel = 33_1/8"

Left and Right side Bezel frame (each) = 1_5/8" wide

Bottom Bezel frame = 1_3/4" wide

Top Bezel frame = 1_1/2" wide

Screen Dimensions within the Bezel frame = 29_7/8"H x 53_1/4"W

I went to the local SoundTrack today to take a look at the larger DLP sets.
The Samsung HLN617W was great looking and was comparable to more expensive competitive sets. I did not detect any hints of "rainbows" on any of the sets, the DLP pictures were bright and color accurate. I found the expansion of 4:3 images to a widescreen format to be acceptable on the Samsung models. I also measured the base depth of the model was 17.5 inches, but the overall depth including the "back" of the set was more like 22". Depth of the set is something I am considering in my current purchase mode. In chatting with the salesperson, he told me that they were not going to be able to sell these 61" units for a "couple of months"! Stuck at the border or some such thing.... I was disappointed but am inquiring from a couple of my normal sources.

While not on the same subject, and I apologize, I also took a look at a number of 50" plasma screens. Yeah, they are more expensive, but they all were very bright and easy to look at from every angle ! One thing that I noticed, and I know it has been discussed here is that the Panasonics and Sharp models definitely BUZZED. In Denver, we are at 5200-5400 feet so this has been a concern. The Pioneer, Sony, and Samsung models did not have any detectable buzzing associated with their operation. The salesperson was knowledgable and indicated that this was a concern, and that some sets buzzed at this altitude, others did not.... they were trying to have manufacturers produce sets which would be altitude friendly.

I still think I am going to buy a Samsung....

Dan

The depth of the HLN617 should be 19.4" based on the spec sheet.

Russ,

Thanks for all you free time :)
This helps out alot.

Dave

[QUOTE]Originally posted by dleithaus
I found the expansion of 4:3 images to a widescreen format to be acceptable on the Samsung models.

With DLP there is no burn in possible, so there is no need to distort a 4:3 image, just window box it.

While not on the same subject, and I apologize, I also took a look at a number of 50" plasma screens. Yeah, they are more expensive, but they all were very bright and easy to look at from every angle ! One thing that I noticed, and I know it has been discussed here is that the Panasonics and Sharp models definitely BUZZED. In Denver, we are at 5200-5400 feet so this has been a concern. The Pioneer, Sony, and Samsung models did not have any detectable buzzing associated with their operation. The salesperson was knowledgable and indicated that this was a concern, and that some sets buzzed at this altitude, others did not.... they were trying to have manufacturers produce sets which would be altitude friendly.

This is only an issue with plasmas... dlp, lcd, lcos, etc. don't buzz

I still think I am going to buy a Samsung....

They make models in half a dozen different technologies, which one? The HLN617W?

Dan [/QUOTE

RS,

I purchase a big widescreen TV. I want the screen filled!
I do not see any distortion on many sources, but do see it at times. Sometimes I do go to a standard 4:3 format, but more often, I like the expansion modes.

Yeah, I was interested in the HLN617W--but SoundTrack told me there were major delays in obtaining this model. I have some inquiries out to my normal sources.

(my comments about plasma were only a sideline--that discussion belongs somewhere else.... DLP's do not buzz!)

dan

There was a backorder on the HLN617s for a while, probably while they slipped the new firmware into the production line, but it seems like a boatload have come in recently. My retailer here in NJ got 60 of them last week, of which they said only 42 or so were spoken for.

FWIW - I like the stretch on the HLN for TV and video games so far, but I'll still will watch DVD's in the native ratio.

I think I decided to go with HLN617W after a difficult struggle between Pio 50" 503 plasma and this set. I would appreciate suggestions where could I buy this set with immediate delivery, obviously except in the local stores. Thanks for your help in advance.

I just had my HLM617W replaced with HLN617W (N vs. M). A couple of small differences for your guide (I can't seem to download it today, so I apologize if these were already in there):

1. The Green Power LED has been removed - no lights are visible while the TV is on (yeah!). What used to be the Power LED was replaced by one that flashes during IR receiving - which was in the middle position on the M.

2. As soon as you turn the set on, you can hear the audio, while you wait the 20-30 seconds for the lamp to start up. The M didn't do this - it was silent until the picture appeared - also a good improvement.

Jeff

Thanks Jeff. I shall update the guide. I shall also check the download problem.

I agree - great improvements on the set. Overall, Samsung seems very responsive to customers and feedback.

Did you replace the set, or did you go for the upgrade? If you replaced the set, how did you manage to do that?

If you notice other changes, please post them here.

Switching between multiple DVI devices is becoming quite a hassle. So I am devising just an easier way of switching DVI cables (while we all wait for a DVI switch that works and is reasonably priced.)

Connect a 2 meter DVI extender cable (DVI-D, male to female, single link) to the back of the TV. Attach its free female connector to an easily accessible location on the side of the cabinet. For each input source, say a Bravo D1 DVD player, connect a DVI cable (DVI-D, male to male, single link) and attach its free male connector to the same side of the cabinet so that it can be easily connected and disconnected. Label each connector. Switch cables as neeeded.

I have ordered the cables. I shall post as to how this works.

What we have to do in this age of high technology.

:(

Arun - would you also give us a sense of what these cables would cost? I'm sure it's far less than the current switchers but how much?

arungupta,

I like you guide to the Samsung DLPs.

I do have a question for you, I have a HLN507W and would like to get a good D-VHS player and take advantage of the High Definition picture quality.

Do you know of a good D-VHS player to use with the DLPs?

Please inform,

Thank You,

Jeff

Originally posted by Jefftaz
Do you know of a good D-VHS player to use with the DLPs?
Jeffraz, I didn't go for D-VHS because I thought that it was too much of a stopgap technology, and I couldn't deal with tape again.

JVC HM-DH30000U seems to be most commonly adapted player in this forum, but it seems to have had problems.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=247334
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=233041
http://www.buydig.com/shop.php?prod_id=JVCMDH30000U&adv=bizrate

A new generation JVC HM-DH40000 (or 400U?) has been announced:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=272290
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=275941

Alas, no DVI output in any of these players.

Pre-recorded D-VHS tapes (D-Theater):

http://www.dvhsmovieguide.com/dvhsevents/default.lasso
http://www.uln.com/cgi-bin/vlink/dvhs_index.html
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=277846

Originally posted by Jbach
Arun - would you also give us a sense of what these cables would cost? I'm sure it's far less than the current switchers but how much?
The 2 meter cable connecting to the TV is $24. The 3 meter cable connecting to each input is $18. For three input devices, it comes to $80.

www.pacificcable.com/DVI.htm

You would need most of these cables even when you get the switch, unless the switch came pre-packaged with these cables. The Belkin switch to be released this month(?) that I am hopeful about doesn't come with any cables.

Originally posted by Jefftaz
arungupta,

I like you guide to the Samsung DLPs.

I do have a question for you, I have a HLN507W and would like to get a good D-VHS player and take advantage of the High Definition picture quality.

Do you know of a good D-VHS player to use with the DLPs?

Please inform,

Thank You,

Jeff

Jeff, if you don't plan to get D-Theater tapes, you can also check out the Mitsubishi HS-HD2000U. I have this deck for over six months now, and it has worked fine for me. the JVC 30000 deck seems to have many problems as Arun mentioned.

arungupta,

Thank you for the response, I will check out those treads.

I guess I am getting anxious to see what my DLP is capable of... I have Comcast cable and have no high def channels. Denver is still trying to get the over the air high def channels and currently I get no signal. Maybe I should just be patient and play the waiting game.

-----------------------------------

pspun,

Not sure if I need the "D-Theater tapes" or not. I know that if I got a D-VHS I would like to get a high definition picture quality, would the Mits do this? Also as the DLP has no Firewire is the connection made through component?

I have never seen the picture quality of the D-VHS but from the reviews I read it is the best that you can get these days until HD-DVDs hit the market.


Thanks,

Jeff

Arun,

"kmil" has pointed out that the new "all models" Samsung brochure has some measurements that are different than what is in the guide. I checked the brochure against the guide for the HLN467 and HLN567 and found several small differences. The biggest one is the width of the HLN467.

HLN467: 40.6" x 16.1" x 30.0" WxDxH
HLN567: 49.9" x 18.2" x 36.3" WxDxH

I think all of them except the HLN467 width are only off .1".

Thanks Les. I am upgrading the guide tomorrow -- will update the size information.

Originally posted by Jefftaz
pspun,

Not sure if I need the "D-Theater tapes" or not. I know that if I got a D-VHS I would like to get a high definition picture quality, would the Mits do this? Also as the DLP has no Firewire is the connection made through component?

I have never seen the picture quality of the D-VHS but from the reviews I read it is the best that you can get these days until HD-DVDs hit the market.


Thanks,

Jeff

You will need to have a STB (to receive HD) with Firewire output into the D-VHS recorder in order to record HD broadcasts. You will not be able to record HD using the component input into the D-VHS recorder.

Arun
A friend pointed me to this forum after I had already ordered an HLN617W. I'm still waiting for that (maybe 7/14?), but I have to thank you for your guide, and to all of the forum members who make this an informative and interesting read.
Question: Can someone define "discrete codes"? I see that the 617W does not come with them, but they can be obtained through the upgrade program. I looked through some other threads, but didn't find a good (simple) explanation. Since I'm not sure what they are, I may not be the right person to use them, but having the information won't hurt.
Also, I have the same issue that was referenced in some previous posts about putting a center channel on a stand. I've been looking at (but have not purchased, yet) some of the Sanus stands (nf203 and nf204), which have 8 - 8.5" between shelves. Go to www.sanus.com. They're not as inexpensive as some of the others posted here, but they may have more color/style options.
Finally, SoundTrack (Ultimate) is currently having a 10% off sale, which does include DLP's. My final price is very close to that mentioned above from Great Indoors, after the credit card rebate. I think the leftover will go for the Sammy HD931.
Thanks again.

The "upgrade" for older DLP sets offered by Samsung is supposed to have the following:

1) Discrete Codes for on/off functions
2) Discrete Codes for video input select functions
3) Last setting memory for Aspect Ration and Picture adjustments for each input

It is expected that Samsung made these same changes across all models but I don't think anyone knows for sure. When the HLN467 and HLN567 sets are available (soon we hope) they should include these changes. If you are in the process of buying another Samsung model it might be a good idea to get one with these changes already included.

The commands are discrete in the sense that there is a command for "ON" and a different command of "OFF". The remote for the current sets has one button/command that toggles back and forth between on and off.

The same is true for the input selection function. You must cycle through a list of all "connected" input devices until you get to the one you want. With discrete commands you can go directly to the desired input device with one command or button.

A programmable universal remote can be set up to control a HT system if each function has it's own discrete command. Otherwise, it's very hard to prevent a universal remote from losing it's way and issuing the wrong commands.

Quick question (Yes I tried searching....) What is the resolution you are getting if you hook up the SIRTS160 with VGA cables to the HLN437W? I figured the max res is 1024*768 in this input. Why would you want to use the VGA cable before the component inputs? Wouldn't you get a higher res out of the component cable (even though it is analog) than the VGA? BTW DVI being used by DVDHD931.

Thanks guys,

J

Originally posted by JCHanifan
Quick question (Yes I tried searching....) What is the resolution you are getting if you hook up the SIRTS160 with VGA cables to the HLN437W? I figured the max res is 1024*768 in this input. Why would you want to use the VGA cable before the component inputs? Wouldn't you get a higher res out of the component cable (even though it is analog) than the VGA? BTW DVI being used by DVDHD931.

I actually use DVI between my SIRTS160 and the Samsung. I've used VGA to connect my HTPC. My Bravo D1 player is used on the second Samsung DLP set.

Why would you think that VGA is limited to 1024x768? That's not true. VGA can be used for all the resolutions your set is capable of receiving.

So you can connect your SIRTS160 using VGA at 720p resolution. I don't really know how good the picture will be compared to component or DVI in this particular setup. Based on my experience, I'd say that it'll be better than component but not as good as DVI. Why don't you try all three and decide for yourself -- and share your observations here.

Arun,

How did your new cable setup work out?

Does the Sammy take a DVI-D connector SINGLE or DUAL link?

I will be hooking a 467 to the Sammy DVD-HD931 AND Sammy STB.

Thanks,
Bruce

Bruce, you need DVI-D Male to Male Single Link, and connect at 720p to get 1x1 pixel mapping.

I'm still waiting for one more cable to try my manual DVI switching setup.

Arun, thanks. We will be watching for the results of your "manual" DVI switcher!

Originally posted by arungupta
Bruce, you need DVI-D Male to Male Single Link, and connect at 720p to get 1x1 pixel mapping.


Arun-

I have a DVI-D male-to-male, dual link that I plan to use with a 567 and D1. Sorry to be such a ******, but am I correct in assuming that the dual link cable won't be a problem?

Spad

Single link is sufficient, but dual link is not a problem.

Just out of curiosity today I tried a comparison on my HLN507w
No DNIe, Film Mode, or DNR (I don't think they do anything anyway)
Cool1
Dynamic mode

PS2 on Component 1 (keep in mind the PS2 has interlaced 480i output)

Notebook hooked up the VGA input (mobility radeon and windvd)

2 copies of Episode 2 playing at the same time. So I was able to flip back and forth.

Holy cow! The difference is like night and day. It's not practical to keep the notebook hooked to the TV, but it will be very difficult to watch a DVD with the PS2 ever again.

It's hard to visualize everyones complaints until you actually have a good source to view.

The PS2 - Zero dark scene detail and some dark scenes are almost too dark to see anything. Sunburned faces. Banding and mosquito noise and clay faces.

VGA - 100% more dark detail. I was literally amazed at the difference. Flesh tones were much more natural. No sunburn. Way less banding and noise. It was almost an unbeleivable difference. Some smoke actually looked like smoke :)

After loking at the service menu, I realized that the TV is processing the 480i signal from the PS2 with the same processing it uses on RF and video inputs. Ouch...There definately has to be some black enhancement going on for those inputs for the difference to be so pronounced.

Using the VGA input or DVI defiantely seems to help as it seems to skip over a lot of garbage processing thats going on with my 480i signal.

VGA is not the be all to end all though. Tried my Army of Darkeness DVD. During the whole end battle scene you can barely see anything, and the improvement on the VGA input was small at best. As opposed to my 27" tube TV where you can see details quite clearly. Also tried my Young Frankenestein and it looked pretty similar on the PS2 and VGA. But I am sure some of this can be atributed to the quality of the source material and DVD transfer. Obviously Ep2 is at the top of the heap and the others are older movies.

Loonng story short...I am definately saving up for that DVI DVD player :)

andywhite1, thanks for sharing your experience. Let me add a few related points:

- My Compaq notebook graphics card provides a very poor PQ, especially in black level details. My IBM T30 (ATI Radeon 7500) provide a much better PQ. My desktop ATI card (ATI Radeon 9500 Pro) provides excellent PQ.

- Going from VGA to DVI is another quantum jump in PQ - from my desktop PC or from a Bravo D1.

Thanks Arun. We are going to try it and see!! I was just misinformed about the VGA resolution.

J

Thanks for the guide. It is very helpful.

Starving

I want to thank you, too, for the guide Arungupta! It's nice to have all this info compiled in one place. One thing I would like to see is a table of default SM values for various models and firmware revisions (if they differ). That would help those of us that might get a little enthusiastic in our tweaking.

Cheers,
RDaneel

Originally posted by RDaneel
One thing I would like to see is a table of default SM values for various models and firmware revisions (if they differ). That would help those of us that might get a little enthusiastic in our tweaking.
Great Idea!!!

Can you start by posting yours here. Include Model/Firmware version/Date of Manufacture. I shall also look up my sets and post them as well.

I shall put them in the guide in a table as people post them.

<sheepish> I didn't exactly write down my stock settings... that's one of the reasons that I would like to see them included in the guide!

Cheers,
RDaneel

Originally posted by RDaneel
<sheepish> I didn't exactly write down my stock settings... that's one of the reasons that I would like to see them included in the guide!
RDaneel
Aaah! The truth comes out. :D

OK how about just reporting the Model/Firmware/Date of manufacture then. That way we can request someone else with the same firmware to report theirs.

An important question here. I am assuming that the factory settings for all the sets of a given model/version are the same -- there is no per set tweaking in the factory. I wouldn't think there would be - but I thought its worth asking the question. Does anyone know the answer??????

Originally posted by arungupta
An important question here. I am assuming that the factory settings for all the sets of a given model/version are the same -- there is no per set tweaking in the factory. I wouldn't think there would be - but I thought its worth asking the question. Does anyone know the answer??????

How about a vague memory that in the early days people discovered there was "some" variation among sets with the same firmware. Others must have a better memory about this than I do.

Of course, if someone :rolleyes: is willing to tweak and then ask questions, just getting the same firmware settings should be a good starting point. :D

I recently heard a rumor that Samsung was going to bring out an 80 or 81" DLP set around the end of the year. Has anyone else heard this? So far I have been unable to substantiate the rumor, but I would definitely be interested in a set this size.

Ken

AG - My set is a HLN507 with Firmware 211 dated May 3rd.

Originally posted by K_Thompson
I recently heard a rumor that Samsung was going to bring out an 80 or 81" DLP set around the end of the year. Has anyone else heard this? So far I have been unable to substantiate the rumor, but I would definitely be interested in a set this size.
One of the advantages of DLP sets that it is easier to scale them to larger sizes. So I wouldn't be surprised.

There seems to be almost no hln43s for sale online or ebay. Is there a problem in production?

Originally posted by joenash
There seems to be almost no hln43s for sale online or ebay. Is there a problem in production?
Maybe it is too much demand. Since people ARE getting deliveries, at least its not a production hold up.

If you haven't already done so, try the Price Search feature at the top of this page and type "Samsung HLN" or "Samsung DLP". It gives a list of retailers.

Of course, I'm sure you have already tried your local retailers.

Good luck.

Well I finally purchased a HLN5065W yesterday from Atwater Village Best Buy. I appreciate the opportunity to read & learn from everyone’s experience here at AVS. I’ve been lurking for years – ever since I bought my 1st TiVo. I have confidence in the individual whom I made the purchase at Best Buy because of favorable outcomes with past purchases. But did I over do it purchasing a 50” TV for a 17x12 ft room? I’ll be viewing from 9 ft away. Anyway Adelphia, the local cable company has strung fiber down my street & said 9 HDTV channels will be available next month or so. Until then I am looking forward to watching DVDs from the PC connected via DVI to the DLP. Thanks again for making this an excellent resource.

:)

A lot of people like the 50" Samsung at 9'. You should too.

Originally posted by htwaits
A lot of people like the 50" Samsung at 9'. You should too.


With the proper source, the 61" is stunning at 11'. You will be happy with the 50" at 9'.

My 50" is at 9', and I love it....just right, I think.

arungupta:

taken from your guide:

"The TV has no component input that accepts signals that could range from 480i to 1080i. As an example, this causes a problem with the XBox hookup. Samsung has no current plans to address this issue"

Why would there be a problem if the Xbox is hooked up to the 480p/720p/1080i component input?? Are you refering only to the FEW games that are 480i?? I guess in this case there would be no signal for those games right? Since over 85% of Xbox games are at least 480p.....I'm confused about this...:confused: Please explain what you are reffering to.

Thank you!

Soycrema - Yes, you have that right. The issue is for 480i games, and the dashboard. For some of us with hacked boxes, the dashboard is our game launching screen, and we have to be able to see it! Thus, you have to split or somehow fudge the connections to make 480 visible...

For most users, though, this is not a huge problem, as you simply change the xbox setting to HD and leave it at that.

Cheers,
RDaneel

Originally posted by Soycrema
arungupta:

taken from your guide:

"The TV has no component input that accepts signals that could range from 480i to 1080i. As an example, this causes a problem with the XBox hookup. Samsung has no current plans to address this issue"

Why would there be a problem if the Xbox is hooked up to the 480p/720p/1080i component input?? Are you refering only to the FEW games that are 480i?? I guess in this case there would be no signal for those games right? Since over 85% of Xbox games are at least 480p.....I'm confused about this...:confused: Please explain what you are reffering to.

Thank you!
The problem with Xbox is that its control panel is 480i, and the games could be any resolution. It has created a minor inconvenience in hooking up XBox. There are many proposed solutions. Easiest one is to hook up through Component 1 for the control panel and then switch to component 2 or 3 for the actual game if the game is above 480p.

Thanks for your reply guys, I understand now.
I didn't know the dashboard is 480i.....
Oh well, I'm still looking forward to buying this TV, I might be getting a part time job at Circuit City just for the discount, hehe....
By the way arungupta, nice job on your guide!!
Thanks!

Jose

Does anyone know what the RS-232 port is used for?

Thanks

Jeff

For some reason i get a blank Zip download box when I attempt to download your ver 1.5 file. Is there any other method of obtaining the file? I have a broadband connection. thanks.

raymar99, try saving the zipped file first. Then open and unzip it. If that doesn't work, I'll e-mail you a copy - send me PM with your e-mail.

Originally posted by ride525
Does anyone know what the RS-232 port is used for?

At the present time, its used for nothing. There was an expectation that the port will be used for firmware upgrades, but apparently this feature is not enabled on this port.

There was a thread on this port a while ago, but I can't find it anymore.

I just bought the 43" Sammy today at Best Buy and of course they wanted to sell me the $299 extended 4 year warranty. They said it only comes with a 90 day in-home labor warranty standard and after that it would have to be shipped back to Chicago (from SoCal) for warranty. Eighty bucks for shipping each way. Sounds like BS to me since there are several authorized service agencies nearby. The sales guy also made it sound like this unit could need a lot of expensive repairs... for example, he maintained that the lamp needs replacement every 2 years at a cost of $400 plus. I know the lamps do need replacement but isn't that an easy DIY?
Is anyone picking up an extended warranty? Generally, I never buy the warranty, but with this new technology should I make an exception?

On new technology, it is sometimes prudent to buy extended warranty - and I did buy one myself.

However, the main problem reported on this set is the lamp failure and that is a DIY effort. So these sets in general are proving to be very reliable other than the lamp problem.

Samsung warranty service is available in most areas. I am in southernn CT and mine was just 30 minutes away. They came and picked up the set and returned it when I had a lamp failure.

My understanding is that Samsung's warrenty is for 1 year, parts and labor.
And Samsung will extend that to 15 months, if you send in the warrenty card within 10 days....

Also, from what I've read here, most extended warrenties don't usually cover the bulb replacement, since it's considered a "consumable". But I decided to go with one anyway.

The lamps are DIY, but are not cheap - $200-250 or so. But not $400.

If you get a warranty extension, see if you can find one that does cover an early lamp (2-3 yr) failure.

Arungupta,
Your Guide to the HLN DLPs is a great piece of work. I just printed it out and its looks like a very comprehensive, well thought out reference guide.

I really appreciate your work. Thanks.

P.S. You might add page numbers in a footer for those who choose to print out duplex copies. I did.

Just swapped out from a Mitsu 55511 to the 507W. I didn't like the lack of DVI input on the Mitsu. Also, I couldn't take my eyes of the DLP units whenever I was in the shops locally. The clarity over the other RPTV's was astounding.

Then they knocked another $400 off the price for me, and that made it an easy swap within my 30 days buy it/try it from Ultimate Electronics.

The set just came in yesterday...I currently do not have ANY HD viewing. I've got a DTV TIVO and a Go-Video player.

I'm not a overly discerning viewer, as I actually felt most of the SD coming from DTV yesterday was fine on this set. My living room is subject to a lot of natural light, and this set is hands down better than the Mitsu in bright light.

I was just about to plunk some cash down on a Progressive Scan DVD player, until I happened upon Arun's write-up which said stick w/ Interlaced DVD until you can get a DVI DVD unit. Thanks Arun, great write-up!

1. Rather than getting a HD DTV STB now, I wanted to wait until the HD DTV TIVO's come out at year's end. So that leaves me w/ OTA for some HD NFL viewing this Fall, I guess? But if I get an attic antennae for OTA...I still need a HD STB for that, correct? So, I'm screwed out of waiting for HD TIVO if I want HD NFL, right?

2. Do I need to enter the SM to get my version? Will that tell me if discretes are available or not yet? Or is it confirmed the 50" does not/will not have discretes available?

Only one day of standard def watching, but I'm happy so far...and I imagine it will only get better with a little cash expenditure.

I think my wife is fine w/ SD viewing for the most part. We both want great DVD viewing, and I'll want HD NFL when possible. As NFL is just around the corner, I think I'll have to look into HD STB for DTV and a good attic attennae. Then, I would think about upgrading the DVD to DVI, but the single DVI input will then be taken up by the STB. I swapped up for DVI input, but I already see that having just one DVI input is going to be very limiting in the next year!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ride525
[B]My understanding is that Samsung's warrenty is for 1 year, parts and labor.
And Samsung will extend that to 15 months, if you send in the warrenty card within 10 days....

RIDE525: Does the "15 month extension" refer to Samsung getting the card "within 10 days" OR having it postmarked within 10 days? Also, would the 10 days be from the day you PLACE the order, the day it is shipped, OR.......within 10 days after you have signed the shipping receipt. Its these "little things", as you know, that give manufacturers "wiggle room" to get out of their promises. As Ronald Regan once said about negotiating on the ABM treaty with the Russians: "Trust but verify". Translated, "cover your a**!"

kmil,
You can register online to alleviate those timing concerns. Do it while the delivery guys are still setting it up!

RIDE525: Does the "15 month extension" refer to Samsung getting the card "within 10 days" OR having it postmarked within 10 days? Also, would the 10 days be from the day you PLACE the order, the day it is shipped, OR.......within 10 days after you have signed the shipping receipt.

The card just says "fill out and return this survey within 10 days of purchase and we will extend the warranty by 3 months. That says to me you have to mail it within 10 days. I would guess they are not going to be sticklers about it....it could get held up in the mail, etc.

I also heard you could do this online...but haven't looked online yet....

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ride525
[B]The card just says "fill out and return this survey within 10 days of purchase and we will extend the warranty by 3 months.


Wouldn't we be even lucky to GET the set "within 10 days" of purchase, let alone return the card. It sounds like our chances of getting the warranty extended are, for all intents and purposes, practically nil. Your thoughts?