The NFL has rules to protect their interests and the interests of the networks and their affiliates, understandably so. The St Louis Rams secondary markets are Cape Girardeau, Columbia, and Jefferson City. These are the only other markets that must show Rams road games. The network (Fox) decides which game will be shown, but almost always grants the local stations request. In short, KSFX ranks the Chiefs, Rams, Cowboys in that order, and decides what they will air accordingly, ratings and practical, common sense thinking be damned.

And since the Chiefs are AFC, they are on CBS 90 percent of the time, so it really comes down to if you want to watch any NFC game that's on at the same time as the ewes, your screwed in Springfield.

I remember the good old days before the Rams came to Missouri, Dallas was on every week. The Broncos (my team) were on a lot also.

It just seems like common sense to me, show a possibly exciting close game instead of a crappy team. Seems to me a whole lot of people would watch the former, and a very few people will watch the Rams. I may be wrong.

And since the Chiefs are AFC, they are on CBS 90 percent of the time, so it really comes down to if you want to watch any NFC game that's on at the same time as the ewes, your screwed in Springfield.

I remember the good old days before the Rams came to Missouri, Dallas was on every week. The Broncos (my team) were on a lot also.

It just seems like common sense to me, show a possibly exciting close game instead of a crappy team. Seems to me a whole lot of people would watch the former, and a very few people will watch the Rams. I may be wrong.

Never one to clap for a hearse, but it will be nice when they leave St. Louis. They probably won't avoid having home games blacked out before the season is over.

Edit: They will leave St. Louis eventually, the credit meltdown may have given them a stay of execution, but it is only a matter of time.

No regard is at it again. I'm flipping through the channels...and what do I find on 3? KY Analog! (yes on 3-0)

3-1 is airing the exact same stuff in digital.

I knew he had no regard for the viewer, but FCC regulations? KY Analog is supposed to be gone for good as I recall.

It's true. Unless it's really strong skip.
http://i36.tinypic.com/kc0bbr.jpg

Report unauthorized broadcasts here:
http://esupport.fcc.gov/complaints.htm?sid=&id=d1e640

:mad:

So here it is, 4th quarter, Dallas 10, Broncos 7 and KSFX is still showing the ewes getting blown out 28-0 by the 49er's

Good Call KSFX. At least you could switch mid game.

No regard is at it again. I'm flipping through the channels...and what do I find on 3? KY Analog! (yes on 3-0)
KY3 analog should be off again as of ~8:30pm central. When was the earliest it was observed to be on?

KY3 analog should be off again as of ~8:30pm central. When was the earliest it was observed to be on?

I was getting a very weak (as in "just there") picture and audio over my "skip" setup earlier this evening. It was interesting even getting it considering the poor propagation today in Central-Southeast Arkansas.

Has anyone verified this, what makes you think the station was actually broadcasting on ch 3 and not just some yahoo retransmitting their signal out of an analog ch 3 modulator near by?

Because the same broadcast was being seen all over?

Unless this "yahoo" was on a 2,000 foot tower... :D

- Trip

Why would a station pull a stunt like this? Are they asking for a fine or to have their license pulled? This should be interesting to see how they get away with this.

KY3 analog should be off again as of ~8:30pm central. When was the earliest it was observed to be on?

10am

My photo was taken/tagged @ 11:42AM on 10/04/09.

I was helping my wife's grandmother troubleshoot her convertor box Sunday afternoon, about 4 o'clock, and analog 3 was there. Imagine trying to explain to an 86 year old, that's been told for months that she can't watch tv unlees the box is turned on, that 3 rerally isn't suppposed to be there.

Oh and to the braintrust at KFSX, at 4 I was visiting in laws, rather than watch the sorry excuse for a football game you aired.

...this "yahoo" was on a 2,000 foot tower... :DThis yahoo was on a 2,000' tower. :)

I was helping my wife's grandmother troubleshoot her convertor box Sunday afternoon, about 4 o'clock, and analog 3 was there. Imagine trying to explain to an 86 year old, that's been told for months that she can't watch tv unlees the box is turned on, that 3 rerally isn't suppposed to be there.

Oh and to the braintrust at KFSX, at 4 I was visiting in laws, rather than watch the sorry excuse for a football game you aired.


That's taking it to extremes don't ya think?:D

Not that any one cares - I'm still getting KY3 analog with mostly snow. But, it is still there.

Maybe I'm seeing things, but no regard 3 had Oprah in HD on 10/14/09, not that I care about Oprah, just surprised.

'Bout time. Ft Smith/Fayetteville, Ark. stations have had HD time shifting capability for syndicated programming like Wheel of Fortune, Jeopardy, Dr. Phil, etc. for quite some time.

yep, it was 16:9 ratio, I even made sure the cat hadn't stepped on the zoom button.

Watched the 1st minute of wheel at 6:30, not in HD, or at least 16:9. They may have switched it later, I don't know...sometimes ky3 forgets.

Anyone else have problems with KSFX on Sunday and Tonight? All the programs sunday (family guy, simpsons, american dad) the audio was glitching throughout. Now it was doing the same tonight during Glee. I am using Directv for my signal so I don't know if the problem is on KSFXs end or Directv. All I know is I am missing my New York HD DNS now more than ever.

That's why it's good to have an antenna for backup. And if it's screwed up on both OTA & D*, at least you know the problem is with the station.

yep, it was 16:9 ratio, I even made sure the cat hadn't stepped on the zoom button.

Watched the 1st minute of wheel at 6:30, not in HD, or at least 16:9. They may have switched it later, I don't know...sometimes ky3 forgets.Perhaps WOF was recorded at an earlier date than Oprah.

Perhaps WOF was recorded at an earlier date than Oprah.


WOF has been saying it's in HD for a couple of years. Came home for Lunch, and Ellen is not 16:9 either, and that show has been saying HD where available for a long time.

Yes, WOF has been shot in HD for a long time. But if the episode that KYTV ran wasn't recorded on HD equipment at the station, that would explain why it was shown in SD.

Thanks for the explanation, I've always wondered if the programs were streamed, sent from the big bird in the sky live, or what..

Many syndicated programs are sent to stations before the broadcast date, via satellite. They are recorded by the station for later broadcast.

Get ready for KSPR News in HD... Sunday night at 10pm!

kevin,
Thanks for the HD update!

Get ready for KSPR News in HD... Sunday night at 10pm!

Glad to hear that, I enjoy KSPR's news, but the sd picture quality is really bad, compared to the competition.

Glad to hear that, I enjoy KSPR's news, but the sd picture quality is really bad, compared to the competition.

Everyone else's news is SD as well, KSPR will be the only HD newscast in the area, until KY3 starts....

http://images.bimedia.net/images/ksprhd.jpg

Sneak peak into KSPR in HD

Glad to hear that, I enjoy KSPR's news, but the sd picture quality is really bad, compared to the competition.Yep, KSPR's SD picture quality has always been horrible. Going HD will be a huge improvement for the station.

The only other local news in HD I ever get is from Tulsa, and that's only when the wind's right.

yep, I know all the others are still SD, I was just saying that the picture quality of KSPR's news now is really bad compared to the others.

I am really fed up with so many forum posts saying they have trouble receiving KOLR 10 and the owner doesn't care. There is no station in this area that does as much to provide a high quality signal to its viewers. Their signal is not down graded with sub-channels as most others are. The station management and employees are available to listen and offer what help is possible in solving problems. They offered free FM traps to viewers requesting them. They have spent countless money with antenna changes and tower alterations. They have tried to make the best of a bad situation with VHS digital transmission. This problem was not anticipated by anyone with the FCC or anyone else before the digital transition took place. Testing had not indicated that these problems would exist. KOLR 10 seems to have made every effort possible to overcome the technical issue facing all broadcasters using VHS digital. Running a TV station is a business and this business is heavily regulated by the government as to what you can do and when. If you are a reader of this forum I cannot see how you can say that the owners of KOLR 10 do not care. Have you ever seen a response to concerns from any other station in the area? I for one would like to thank KOLR 10 and its management for being the only station in the area that does seem to care at all.

I am really fed up with so many forum posts saying they have trouble receiving KOLR 10 and the owner doesn't care. There is no station in this area that does as much to provide a high quality signal to its viewers. Their signal is not down graded with sub-channels as most others are. The station management and employees are available to listen and offer what help is possible in solving problems. They offered free FM traps to viewers requesting them. They have spent countless money with antenna changes and tower alterations. They have tried to make the best of a bad situation with VHS digital transmission. This problem was not anticipated by anyone with the FCC or anyone else before the digital transition took place. Testing had not indicated that these problems would exist. KOLR 10 seems to have made every effort possible to overcome the technical issue facing all broadcasters using VHS digital. Running a TV station is a business and this business is heavily regulated by the government as to what you can do and when. If you are a reader of this forum I cannot see how you can say that the owners of KOLR 10 do not care. Have you ever seen a response to concerns from any other station in the area? I for one would like to thank KOLR 10 and its management for being the only station in the area that does seem to care at all.

I don't know that it is so much KOLR owners and management don't care. Obviously it is in their best interests to reach as many as possible, because viewers directly translate to revenue. The fact of the matter is digital on VHF doesn't work as well as UHF for many reasons. Faced with that fact, it is now up to the owners/management to decide if it is worth it to move away from VHF. They will probably weigh the cost/benefit and decide it is too costly to go to UHF and will sacrifice the few people who complain about it. Most people will have no choice except to suck it up, and tolerate the audio and video dropouts associated with VHF digital. Coverage-wise, I don't think KOLR's digital VHF coverage is substantially smaller than it was with analog, except for extremely distant fringe areas that are probably not part of the Springfield market anyway.

For me, I have a choice to watch another CBS OTA station, but it is on VHF 12 and not much better than VHF 10. So if I want to watch CBS programming, I suffer through the picture break up and audio dropouts that cause my home theater system to go crazy. It is horribly annoying, so when it comes time to watch news and things like that, I choose another station now. I did end up quitting a couple CBS shows just because it is so annoying to watch. If people stop watching KOLR, things might change. Right now CBS is the #1 network and in a good position to not worry as much.

Scott

I am really fed up with so many forum posts saying they have trouble receiving KOLR 10 and the owner doesn't care. There is no station in this area that does as much to provide a high quality signal to its viewers. Their signal is not down graded with sub-channels as most others are. The station management and employees are available to listen and offer what help is possible in solving problems. They offered free FM traps to viewers requesting them. They have spent countless money with antenna changes and tower alterations. They have tried to make the best of a bad situation with VHS digital transmission. This problem was not anticipated by anyone with the FCC or anyone else before the digital transition took place. Testing had not indicated that these problems would exist. KOLR 10 seems to have made every effort possible to overcome the technical issue facing all broadcasters using VHS digital. Running a TV station is a business and this business is heavily regulated by the government as to what you can do and when. If you are a reader of this forum I cannot see how you can say that the owners of KOLR 10 do not care. Have you ever seen a response to concerns from any other station in the area? I for one would like to thank KOLR 10 and its management for being the only station in the area that does seem to care at all.

KOLR does NOT care about its viewers. They've had an 'engineer' in here ripping into the fact those of us who have bought HDTVs aren't significant to the viewership.

Also, KOLR demands and gets money from every pay service that carries them. They've got NO incentive to provide a decent signal when those viewers are getting their product for free. (Meaning they don't get my 50 cents a month)

I have an alternative to KOLR/KSFX and I refuse to pay for what I can get for free. And have YOU tried to get their half-baked signal OTA lately?? It can't be received in most of Springfield. The fact they went back to 10 in the first place when there were plenty of viable UHF channels is nothing more then CHEAPNESS on Nexstar's part.

So go take your Nexstar stock and shove it on Channel 52.

They have tried to make the best of a bad situation with VHS digital transmission. wtf is VHS digital transmission?


sneaky snooper,
Excellent last 2 posts.

VHF is a damned dog and should have never been allowed for DTV broadcasting. Europe abandoned it and the US should have, too. But the FCC smelled money and the money was in auctioning off the prime TV spectrum, the UHF band.

The only thing that might convince KOLR's owners to get a decent channel (UHF) is if mobile DTV becomes popular. It will not work well in the VHF band, and certainly not at current weakling ERPs.

I solved the VHF problem by not watching it any more.

Local newscasts this morning on KSPR were in HD. The picture looked great but the sound was noticebly boomy.

Gerontius

Local newscasts this morning on KSPR were in HD. The picture looked great but the sound was noticebly boomy.

Gerontius

Hi Gerontius. Welcome to AVS.

Very nice to see KSPR's news in HD. I was so excited, I even recorded it last night. Now are other local news channels looks sick.

Find out if a tower is coming to your back yard. It's a pretty clunky web site, takes forever to process. But it has some pretty detailed information.

Find proximity to Towers, Antennas - multiple & single

http://www.antennasearch.com/

Very nice to see KSPR's news in HD. I was so excited, I even recorded it last night. Now are other local news channels looks sick.

It was nice. Apparently KSPR has plenty of HD field cameras too. The sports highlights included a local soccer game that was in HD. Nice!

It was nice. Apparently KSPR has plenty of HD field cameras too.
The sports highlights included a local soccer game that was in HD. Nice!
The field cameras are indeed Panasonic P2 HD cameras. Not only are they HD, they record on a P2 memory card, so there are none of the problems that tape has.

Kudos to KSPR for being the first in the market. Note that Mike "No Regard" Scott had to approve this significant capital expenditure.

Congratulations, KSPR. Lookin' good!
http://i35.tinypic.com/2zq9bmd.jpg

(jealous, rhoops?)

Makes me want to watch KSPR's morning show in the morning.

Makes me want to watch KSPR's morning show in the morning.

Natalie Nunn in HD = well, I'm too nice to say it. But let's just say she looks good and leave it there. =)

Now, when do we get to see Maria in high def?

Natalie Nunn in HD = well, I'm too nice to say it. But let's just say she looks good and leave it there. =)

Oh yeah. :D

Jeez who is that clown in that picture? Oh well at least his weather graphics are in HD!

Congratulations, KSPR. Lookin' good!
(jealous, rhoops?)
Only partially. The manpower used in the KSPR newscast is pretty sparse. There is really only one crewmember involved, the producer/director.

No audio or tape operator, and no camera persons. No Character Generator operator or prompter or floor director. The audio sounds a bit strange because all mics are either on or off, and you hear a voice through 2 or 3 mics at the same time.

It has to be very carefully produced or it will fall like a house of cards. They have very little flexibility to add breaking news like a live remote for breaking news.

In some ways its "eye candy" at the expense of ability to cover the news in depth.

When KCTV went HD they also laid off 2/3 of their crew.

Since I've got more seniority than Methuselah, I'm not worried about my job, but it's a sea change in the way TV news is produced.

In a few years TV will be like radio at Clear Channel is now. 5 stations and only one person in the building.

We do at least have a floor director.

We do at least have a floor director.
Cushy! Does the talent work the prompter with a foot pedal or does the floor director do that?

Cushy! Does the talent work the prompter with a foot pedal or does the floor director do that?

Talent w/ pedal.

Where is all the switching done for kolr/KSFX? Still in Springfield?

KSPR,
Looks like you also now have HD time shift capability. Jeopardy looks great.

Where is all the switching done for kolr/KSFX? Still in Springfield?
For the time being. At the moment either KOLR or KSFX runs automated during much of the day. There is frequently one operator for both stations.

When new equipment arrives next year we will probably hub for Joplin or other stations. Quite possibly one operator running 4 or 5 stations.

Currently our traffic and business departments handle several other Nexstar stations.

Talent w/ pedal.

Is that for real or are you yanking the chains of the noobs like me?

To the average moron like me, it looks like loads of people behind the scenes are needed to make this happen! Wow.

...When new equipment arrives next year we will probably hub for Joplin or other stations. Quite possibly one operator running 4 or 5 stations.Like KFTA/KNWA are switched in LR, I guess. If they keep on, eventually, there'll probably be just one nexstar hub in Irving....

Like KFTA/KNWA are switched in LR, I guess. If they keep on, eventually, there'll probably be just one nexstar hub in Irving....
More likely a place with a lower cost of living than the DFW area. They need a good supply of workers for under $ 10 / hr.

Is that for real or are you yanking the chains of the noobs like me?

To the average moron like me, it looks like loads of people behind the scenes are needed to make this happen! Wow.
There are still assignment editors, producers, field photographers and video editors. And of course, reporters.

There is no videotape anymore. Field cameras record on memory cards and this is dumped into a computer at the station and edited on computer. The finished products is in the video server and the producer links it to the story in the computerized rundown. Any supers are entered by the editor or producer in the rundown.

With heavy computer assist they elimate the need for someone to run the still store, character generator, and videotape. Studio cameras are either robotic or fixed.

KSFX / KOLR currently takes a crew of 7 not including master control for a newscast. KSPR does it with 2,

KCTV's master control is in Atlanta, and KNWA's master control in in Little Rock.

With digital TV, the audio is embedded and audio / video levels are "fixed" as is the color. There is nothing to adjust so it's just a matter of getting show segments in the right place and in the right order. That's really no harder than stacking blocks or building something with tinkertoys.

Today's young people who have grown up with computers take to it very naturally. If you can build a facebook page, you can build a newscast.

...KCTV's master control is in Atlanta, and KNWA's master control in in Little Rock.

With digital TV, the audio is embedded and audio / video levels are "fixed"...I wish KNWA would "fix" their audio. Still screwy on local news. Out of phase, sound doesn't come from the center and they sound like they're in a well.

I wish KNWA would "fix" their audio. Still screwy on local news. Out of phase, sound doesn't come from the center and they sound like they're in a well.
I'll bet no one at the Studio actually listens to the off air audio. You'd think someone in management or engineering would have listened by now.

Obviously, they haven't, at least not on a surround system. It sounds fine on a 19" set with mono sound.

Talent w/ pedal.

I see. This explains why KSPR reporters are not in close-ups. The wide view shots keep them on the screen when they move around. Doesn't look a good as it should though. Not natural looking. The first rule of photography is to fill the screen.

I see. This explains why KSPR reporters are not in close-ups. The wide view shots keep them on the screen when they move around. Doesn't look a good as it should though. Not natural looking. The first rule of photography is to fill the screen.

HD news is much much trickier than SD is. HD is produced for a 16:9 ratio and SD is 4:3 (as a rule). In a sense, HD has to be shot with 4:3 still in mind which is a problem to say the least. (Mediacom, Directv and DISH center cut the HD feed for their SD customers...I don't agree with it, but I don't have to watch it either...since I have HD)

One other issue with KSPR are the inconsistent graphics. One minute I see the last names capitalized and the next they look normal, just in bold face like Michelle Sherwood which is consistent with the rest of their graphics. The putting the last names in all caps is ANNOYING to say the least and just isn't being too consistent.

The audio on the news seems too soft for my liking at least. I'm not sure where the problem is but I can tell a big difference if I flip to KY during the news.

...The audio on the news seems too soft for my liking at least. I'm not sure where the problem is but I can tell a big difference if I flip to KY during the news.Maybe it has something to do with the wider dynamic range of KSPR's all-digital studio(?)

I'm just curious if anyone else is having the same problem as me. Since yesterday afternoon my signal on all channels has gone way down. Before then the signals were very strong. I've tried several things with antenna, pre-amp, etc. By messing with those things and the connections The signals have seemed to increase some, but nowhere near where they were. I thought I would throw this out here in case I'm not the only one with the problem. I will wait to see if anyone else has noticed a drop in signals before I investigate further. Thanks !

No problems noticed here, 70+ miles from Fordland. Things to check:
Connector or coax may be loose or corroded.
Wind blew your antenna aim off.
Preamp going bad.
Tuner going bad (try a spare TV or converter box).

Thanks JT ! Maybe it was conditions. My signals seem to have come back up now. Hope it lasts. Thanks to you also arxaw ! I hope it's not my preamp going out, but time will tell.

Thanks JT ! Maybe it was conditions. My signals seem to have come back up now. Hope it lasts. Thanks to you also arxaw ! I hope it's not my preamp going out, but time will tell.

I am at Lake of the Ozarks and Channel 10 has been tough to get for the past 4 days or so. Not sure what is going on, but I used to get them 85-90% and now it is mid 70's at best with plenty of drop outs. It really isn't watchable anymore. The rest of the Springfield channels are great, even better than in the past with KY3 being the lowest at 86-88%.

Digital VHF sucks and I think I have some new source of interference. In analog days I could see it on the screen. Does anyone have suggestions on troubleshooting in the digital world? There must be something interfering with 10 but I have no idea what it would be.

...Digital VHF sucks and I think I have some new source of interference. Careful, some folks on here get all bent when you speak the truth.

Check the usual interference suspects around the house. New appliance or other electronic gadget? New FM station near your house? See FMfool.com to find out. If you have nearby FM station interference, get an FM trap and hope it helps. Neighbor have a new gadget?

There's probably nothing that will likely get you reliable distant VHF DTV reception, though. I've found nothing that will at my house. UHF works great.

The VHF stations don't give a damn about fixing the problem. They'd rather you just sign up for some subscription TV service, so they can get a cut from your bill every month.

Careful, some folks on here get all bent when you speak the truth.

Check the usual interference suspects around the house. New appliance or other electronic gadget? New FM station near your house? See FMfool.com to find out. If you have nearby FM station interference, get an FM trap and hope it helps. Neighbor have a new gadget?

There's probably nothing that will likely get you reliable distant VHF DTV reception, though. I've found nothing that will at my house. UHF works great.

The VHF stations don't give a damn about fixing the problem. They'd rather you just sign up for some subscription TV service, so they can get a cut from your bill every month.

Nothing new here. I wish it were that easy. I have had VHF 10 in for months with no problems until the past several days. I can't receive it well enough to watch. I have the Wineguard big preamp with FM trap already turned on. I was thinking about adding another FM trap but I would hate to attenuate any signal more than necessary. I suppose it could be anything. My next experiment will be to point my VHF 7-13 only antenna to Jeff City and see about getting KRCG for CBS but they are VHF 12 which also sucks. Can't be worse :mad: . I will put that through a combiner that separates/combines UHF and VHF so I don't hose myself with multipath.

The only big change around here are the leaves falling from the trees!

There has been an ongoing tropospheric ducting event that has included your area. It should abate in the next 24-48 hours.

If that was the source of your difficulties, then your reception should stabilize soon. If it doesn't, look for local sources of interference.

FWIW, I was near Cuba Friday and couldn't see even a sniff of KOMU and KRCG from the top of a 45' tower. Ironically, KPLR out of St Louis was also completely absent while the rest of the St Louis UHF locals came in fine on a 43XG. Screwy conditions!

Leaves dropping usually improves UHF reception for some people. Not sure about VHF, though.

My guess is you may have a new source of ch 10 interference in the area. I would shoot for ch 12 if you have half a chance of picking it up. Does TVFool show you have a shot at it (use their draggable mapping tool (http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=90) for a more precise plot)?

One problem with VHFs is that most of 'em are too anemically powered to cut through all the noise out in TVLand.

There has been an ongoing tropospheric ducting event that has included your area. It should abate in the next 24-48 hours.

If that was the source of your difficulties, then your reception should stabilize soon. If it doesn't, look for local sources of interference.

FWIW, I was near Cuba Friday and couldn't see even a sniff of KOMU and KRCG from the top of a 45' tower. Ironically, KPLR out of St Louis was also completely absent while the rest of the St Louis UHF locals came in fine on a 43XG. Screwy conditions!
I believe this is the cause of my problems with signal loss. I turned on my CB radio yesterday and "skip" was coming in like crazy. In the past with analog signals it was obvious when these conditions were out there, but this is my first experience with "tropospheric ducting" since the digital switch. I will know now that this is what happens during these conditions.
As for KOLR10 being difficult lately, I too have had problems with dropouts and pixelizing similar to lightning. This has been happening even though there hasn't been lightning anywhere within hundreds of miles. It has been doing it here for a couple of weeks. Since I'm nowhere close to the others having these problems I assume it is not just something near me. I, like arxaw, agree that VHF sucks for digital tv ! I hope KOLR10 switches to UHF soon or figures out a solution before we lose interest in their programming.

Leaves dropping usually improves UHF reception for some people. Not sure about VHF, though.

My guess is you may have a new source of ch 10 interference in the area. I would shoot for ch 12 if you have half a chance of picking it up. Does TVFool show you have a shot at it (use their draggable mapping tool (http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=90) for a more precise plot)?

One problem with VHFs is that most of 'em are too anemically powered to cut through all the noise out in TVLand.

KOZK and KY3 UHF have both been more stable lately. The football game on KY3 actually looked pretty decent last night. I wonder if they gave the main channel more bandwidth or something.

KRCG is running 15.1kw at 59 miles, and KOLR is running 26kw at 55 miles from where I am. When KOMU went from UHF 36 to VHF 8, I totally lost them with their 13kw of power using my Wineguard 1713 VHF only antenna and preamp. On UHF I had KOMU at 92% solid. If I put up that setup again and aimed it at KRCG I wouldn't be able to put it up as high as my main CM 4228 unfortunately. The only thing I can hope for is less interference on VHF 12 vs. VHF 10, and a little more gain on VHF 12 vs. the CM 4228 gain on channel 10. I may give it some time and hope the tropo ducting clears up with the upcoming change in the weather.

It's a lot of work getting free TV. It should't be this hard. I guess that is what I get for living where I do. Maybe I should just pay for it. NOT! ;)

I was able to tour KY3 and KSPR this evening, asked the guys that record the delayed shows why Jepordy was in HD and wheel of fortune was not.
They only have 2 machines that can record and play HD, and one may be used playing while the other is recording and that show does not get recorded in HD, They would try to get Wheel of Fortune recorded and played in HD tomorrow.
I would think it was a DVR and could record and play at the same time?
I should have asked?
Will watch and see.
KSPR studio was awsome.
Just like any studio, not the same as what you see on TV,

No Regard plans to take KY News HD within 60 days (I'm guessing right before Feb. Sweeps)

Also here's a juicy quote from No Regard II, aka Nexstar's GM:

"At the end of the day, viewers are going to watch the programming they like the most, and if it's HD programming, that's great," Gordon said, noting that recently added equipment shared by both stations is capable of running HD. "And if it's not, some people will still say, 'I sure wish it was,' but they're not going to stop watching because it's not in HD."

MULEMUFFINS.

Memo to Nexstar: If its not in HD, its not for me. I refuse to watch SD programming and I DO have alternate ways to see your half-baked programming. Nor will I subscribe to any pay service that carries your half-baked channels. I refuse to reward your lack of regard for me, your viewer, who gets you the advertisers. I've spent good money to get equipment that can support HD and if you don't choose to provide me with the content, I will find an outlet that will. And there's not much you can do to stop me.

Nexstar doesn't get the fact its us the VIEWER that gets their advertisers. If we don't watch, the advertisers do not buy. And Nexstar's advertisers can forget about my dollars.

No Regard plans to take KY News HD within 60 days (I'm guessing right before Feb. Sweeps)

Also here's a juicy quote from No Regard II, aka Nexstar's GM:

"At the end of the day, viewers are going to watch the programming they like the most, and if it's HD programming, that's great," Gordon said, noting that recently added equipment shared by both stations is capable of running HD. "And if it's not, some people will still say, 'I sure wish it was,' but they're not going to stop watching because it's not in HD."



Who is Gordon? What a rube. Is he too blind to see that every major TV show on any major network is in HD? Heck, even non-major programming is in HD! Was he just talking about the local news or something?

Gordon is Mark Gordon the GM of KSFX/KOLR (aka No Regard II).

He basically says 'if we have to spend money to get you HD, forget it...SD is good enough'

All moot if you can't reliably watch the channel.

All moot if you can't reliably watch the channel.

No kidding. My channel 10 problems persist. I don't know what the source of my new interference is but I am going to try climbing on the roof this weekend and inspect my antenna. KY3, KSFX, KXPR are all high 80's to low 90's pretty solid. KOLR gives me mid 80's, then mid 70's, then no signal, then back up again. It is all over the place. It used to be solid mid 80's with a couple drop outs every now and then. For a day it was OK but it is a mess now. I just can't watch it anymore.

Don't waste your time contacting the station. They will only try and blame you for something they'll say you're doing wrong.

What's wrong is the station clinging to an obsolete channel band plagued with modern day interference that didn't exist in the 1950s and is now unsuitable for OTA DTV broadcasting.

Don't waste your time contacting the station. They will only try and blame you for something they'll say you're doing wrong.

What's wrong is the station clinging to an obsolete channel band plagued with modern day interference that didn't exist in the 1950s and is now unsuitable for OTA DTV broadcasting.

And I think we can safely gather they did so to force people to cable/satellite so they can collect retrans dollars. Nice Try, Nexstar, but I, for one, will be watching the alternatives I have. =)

And I think we can safely gather they did so to force people to cable/satellite so they can collect retrans dollars. Nice Try, Nexstar, but I, for one, will be watching the alternatives I have. =)

JT, I don't know if you have high speed Internet where you live but if you do, there are plenty of alternate sources out there. Due to my horrible reception of KOLR, I had to use my alternate sources and was able to view what I needed. It takes a little work, but I would rather do that than pay for a subscription to something.

I climbed up on the roof today and messed with my antenna. Unfortunately there was no visible damage or anything wrong with it. That would be too easy. There was 1 leaf stuck in the bottom of it though! I adjusted it to max out my signal on KOLR and the best I can do is 78%. KSFX is 82%, KY3 is 90%, KSPR is 90%, KOZK is 80%. I suppose I'll have to see what happens. I am pretty solid at 78% for KOLR with few dropouts, but it's only been 12 hours and a big weather change, so here's to hope.

Did a channel scan this morning, and found RF 19.1 in the list. Turns out it's KSPR 33, but the channel mapping had gone awry. (33.1 wasn't in the list) But what was surprising is that for the first time ever, KOLR VHF 10 actually appeared! It's not a very stable signal, but it's the first time I've ever even had a hint of the VHF signal. I'm writing it off to atmospheric conditions.

Did a channel scan this morning, and found RF 19.1 in the list. Turns out it's KSPR 33, but the channel mapping had gone awry. (33.1 wasn't in the list) But what was surprising is that for the first time ever, KOLR VHF 10 actually appeared! It's not a very stable signal, but it's the first time I've ever even had a hint of the VHF signal. I'm writing it off to atmospheric conditions.Atmospheric conditions have been good for distant reception lately. This changed with the passage of a cool front through the Ozarks.

Atmospheric conditions have been good for distant reception lately. This changed with the passage of a cool front through the Ozarks.

Sure enough, KOLR VHF is gone now. At least I got a few minutes usage out of my VHF setup :-) Strangely, when KSPR showed up on 19.1 this morning, the Pioneer nor either Dish receiver could find 33.1 in a scan. Now, 33.1 has reappeared on them, but still shows up on the Polaroid on 19.1, but not 33.1. Going to have a house full of company later today, hope nobody wants to watch NASCAR while KSPR reads through the encoder's user manual and makes changes.

...33.1 has reappeared on them, but still shows up on the Polaroid on 19.1, but not 33.1. If the PSIP changed prevents one of your OTA tuners from seeing a station, a double rescan should fix it.

Disconnect the antenna.
Rescan the digital tuner (do a complete auto-scan, not "add new channels").
Unplug the TV/tuner from power for a minute or so.
Reconnect antenna, then power and do one more complete auto-scan for channels.

If that doesn't work, use the TV's master reset, if present in the setup menu. That will also wipe out any custom picture & audio settings you've programmed, plus favorite ch list(s).

I have DSL at 256k from Centurytel but I need to call and up the speed!

I also check my antenna all the time and there's nothing wrong with it either!!! Maybe some cobwebs on it thats about it!

Hope channel 8 don't mess up during the Nascar Race today!!! Would watch KSPR but can't get it over the air!

Did you say that you didn't have an amp? If not, you NEED IT. BAD. I don't care what anyone says, those radio shack Hi-gain amps work real good. We currently get all Kansas City locals with a 15 year old Radio shack UHF only and that same hi-gain amp. 65 miles away, and signal strength is over 80 percent 24/7. Also... don't underestimate the tuner. That Channelmaster box leaves most all others in the dust when it comes to pulling in stations. And when my channelmaster shows only 25-30 percent signal, it's a stable picture. It only drops out about 20 and below.

Did you say that you didn't have an amp? If not, you NEED IT. BAD. I don't care what anyone says, those radio shack Hi-gain amps work real good. We currently get all Kansas City locals with a 15 year old Radio shack UHF only and that same hi-gain amp. 65 miles away, and signal strength is over 80 percent 24/7. Also... don't underestimate the tuner. That Channelmaster box leaves most all others in the dust when it comes to pulling in stations. And when my channelmaster shows only 25-30 percent signal, it's a stable picture. It only drops out about 20 and below.

I use a Radio Shack 160 Inch VHF/ UHF Outdoor Antenna I bought this spring! "this is short as I can go" 62 FT RG 6 Quad shield Cable! My antenna is one a pole clamped to the side of my house. The antenna is 24 FT above the ground. I can't remember how far above the roof. I'll find out tommorow and edit this! The Coaxial Cable was also new!

I don't have a channel master box wish I did but I don't. I have a Dish DTV Pal Plus! Still have a Sanyo 19 Inch TV I bought from a TV Repair Man for $40 used back in the yearly 2000's. I say why waste a good tv?!!!! I'll get a new one when this one blows up!!!! When I get reception I watch all programs that allow it in widescreen. I don't like it scretched to full screen, the picture looks out of place now! Maybe its just me! I think stretching to full screen degrades the picture. If I had a HD set it wouldn't have the black bars at the top and bottom. And for SD black bars on the sides!

Example Crappy Models How I watch with Converter Box and Analog TV
http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd141/johnt_bobcat/HD.jpg http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd141/johnt_bobcat/SD.jpg

The reason I leave them like this is so none of the picture gets cut off!!!!!

I use tv fool and a compass to know where the point my antenna for each location, the transmitters at my location are not all in the same direction. When I turn the pole because I try to get by without a rotor.

Took the Radio Shack Amp Off because it drown out some weak signals I get without it! I've tested it with and without and at my location seems to do better without! The Amp was a few years old! There could be something wrong with it too!

Since Tropospheric Weather conditions have gone away KAIT 8 from Egypt AR abc has returned to a signal strength of 74-80% It works good as long as certain vehicles don't go up and down the street it screws up!!! Lightening also messes it up!

At night sometimes after its dark outside I can get KTEJ 20 Bono AR about 54-64% and KEMV 13 Fox AR about 54-64 both stations are PBS. KVTJ 48 Truman AR about 54-60. But These don't work all the time!

The cities listed are Transmitter locations!

I can't pick up Springfield MO locals from Fordland MO. Probably because their 89-92 miles away!'

The Jonesboro AR locals are 55, 64, and 85 miles away!

PBS from Mountain View AR is 64 miles!

K38HE is a religious low power analog station at West Plains MO, 24 miles away. It don't work without an AMP!

Here's a look at my TV FOOL (Very Sad Looking)
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3dbc273008413d5b

Take note KTEJ and KEMV's ERP is wrong on TV FOOL, AETN has not increased the power levels yet! KTEJ is at 50 kW and KEMV is at 4.05 kW. Which is terrible!!! I believe I might be able to get this one when they up the power KTEJ, 419 kW. KEMV 13, 12.1 kW. This one may start to work of a daytime but will probably pixilate! They plan to put a larger broadcast antenna and equipment to increase the power for KEMV this spring. I wish they would up the UHF KTEJ 20 to 419 kW. I believe it would be more stable than KEMV VHF 13!

Thank you guys for all your tips!!!! Please do share more it you would like to?????

You should try a Winegard AP 8275 preamp. I have read a lot of good things about it and mine works well. They are down to $38 at Solidsignal. I paid better than $80 when I got it. Unless this is a knock off junk version which I hope not, it would be much better than nothing for you.

You ARE in a real tough place... I've been to Thayer before, and it's a LONG ways away. But if I were you, I'd take the plunge and try that channelmaster box. Order it online, try it out.... and if it doens't do you any better, turn right around and sell it on Ebay. You'd get most of your money back out of it, I'm sure. when it comes to amps.... if it doesn't work better for you, then it don't. Your mileage my vary, as they say. I even KY3 and KSFX here 3 or 4 nights a week during the warm season here at my house. And I'm 128 miles from Fordland!

...We currently get all Kansas City locals with a 15 year old Radio shack UHF only and that same hi-gain amp. 65 miles away, and signal strength is over 80 percent 24/7. Must be nice to be able to receive everything on good ol' UHF. IIRC, Saint Louis is also an all UHF town. It sure simplifies antenna setup and gets rid of a lot of reception issues for the viewer.

You ARE in a real tough place... I've been to Thayer before, and it's a LONG ways away. But if I were you, I'd take the plunge and try that channelmaster box. Order it online, try it out.... and if it doens't do you any better, turn right around and sell it on Ebay. You'd get most of your money back out of it, I'm sure. when it comes to amps.... if it doesn't work better for you, then it don't. Your mileage my vary, as they say. I even KY3 and KSFX here 3 or 4 nights a week during the warm season here at my house. And I'm 128 miles from Fordland!

Yeah I live a long away from most transmitters! Thanks for all your help!!!!

Is this the right box? I want to make sure I know the right model to get!!!http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?mc=03&p=CM-7000&d=Channel-Master-CM7000-ATSC--Digital-Converter-Box-CM7000&c=Digital Converter Boxes&sku=020572070003

I'm also thinking about trying a new AMP!

What might also help me a little is take my antenna down add 2, 3 FT poles screwed together on my already 24 FT pole. And put antenna back on at the top. Which would put my antenna 30 FT above the ground! But the only problem with this is if a add any more FT to the pole I can't reach it!!!

The CM-7000 has a very sensitive tuner. Will you see any improvement with it, over the DTVPal Plus? Hard to say.

What amp are you currently using?

The CM-7000 has a very sensitive tuner. Will you see any improvement with it, over the DTVPal Plus? Hard to say.

What amp are you currently using?

Currently I'm Not Using an Amp. I was using an Old Radio Shack AMP. But I've tested my reception with and without it and it seems my reception is better without the Radio Shack one.

If a signal drops to or below 54% on the Dish DTV Pal Plus the channel is unwatchable!!!! It also says this in the manual. Its true.

Using the RCA, Magnavox, and Zenith. The Dish DTV Pal plus decodes weak channels the others can't. Test results based on my location!

During Tropospheric duction weather conditions I had got stations mostly UHF out of Memphis TN, Little Rock, Greenville Greenwood MS, St Louis, MO, Cape Girardeau MO, and Springfield MO my local market. Got these without AMP!!! But these station come in and out!

Please share any tips you have with me! If you would like!!! Thank You Very Much!!!!

JT,
Things to try (other than moving):

A higher antenna.
An antenna rotor.
Separate VHF and UHF antennas.
A new preamp.
A different converter box.

Amps sold at rat shack over the years vary considerably. I have several in the junk box that do not help reception at my location. If your old amp made matters worse, it might have been defective or was just adding too much noise to the signal to be of any use for DTV reception.

I, and others on this thread, have had very good results with a CM 7777 (http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?mc=03&p=ANC7777) high gain, low noise V/U preamp.

Hey:

I've got one for you all.

I got a complaint this morning from someone who was helping an 87-year old gentleman who lives in downtown Springfield. He's trying to use an indoor antenna, and only gets 3/21/33. He's not expecting to get 10 on an indoor antenna, but was confused that a box he'd already programmed on his roof antenna at home showed zero signal for KSFX as well. He couldn't get it to show any signal regardless of positioning.

I'm rather surprised by this too and have no ideas. Any thoughts?

- Trip

JT,
Things to try (other than moving):

A higher antenna.
An antenna rotor.
Separate VHF and UHF antennas.
A new preamp.
A different converter box.

Amps sold at rat shack over the years vary considerably. I have several in the junk box that do not help reception at my location. If your old amp made matters worse, it might have been defective or was just adding too much noise to the signal to be of any use for DTV reception.

I, and others on this thread, have had very good results with a CM 7777 (http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?mc=03&p=ANC7777) high gain, low noise V/U preamp.

Thanks arxaw!!! That looks like the best amp I've seen! Based on how low the noise figure is! I will have to get one!!!!

Hey:

I've got one for you all.

I got a complaint this morning from someone who was helping an 87-year old gentleman who lives in downtown Springfield. He's trying to use an indoor antenna, and only gets 3/21/33. He's not expecting to get 10 on an indoor antenna, but was confused that a box he'd already programmed on his roof antenna at home showed zero signal for KSFX as well. He couldn't get it to show any signal regardless of positioning.

I'm rather surprised by this too and have no ideas. Any thoughts?

- Trip

Sounds like to me if you can't get KOLR and KSFX on a rabbit ear about 30 miles from the transmitter something is seriously screwed up with KOLR and KSFX!!!!!!

Maybe with digital 30 miles is too far away to get channels over the air on a rabbit ears.

Try my antenna trick outside the house!!!! It should work good being only 30 miles away!

I get channel 8 on it on a share tv using a zenith box. I'm 55 miles from KAIT.

During tropo I have got WMC 5, KATV 22, WREG 28, WKNO, 29!

Example

http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd141/johnt_bobcat/AntennaTrick.jpg

Setup

Step 1 Get a VHF Dipole Antenna. From Radio Shack! $10 or online!
http://rsk.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pRS1C-2159925w345.jpg
Step 2 Get a pole, or antenna mount, or anything else you can think of to use to mount it.
Step 3 Duck tape antenna to pole with antenna dipoles horizontal pulled out about 14 inches for channel 10.
Step 4 Run a coaxial cable inside house to Digital TV or converter box.
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ______

Antenna Trick Facts / Tips

- Will pickup VHF up to 55 miles, no joke!!!!
- Will pickup UHF!
- Only works if you live inside a local TV stations coverage area under non Tropospheric Ducting Weather.
- No Amp Needed
- Depending on your location you may need to fully extend dipoles.
- Will pickup VHF & UHF outside normal coverage area during strong Tropospheric Ducting Weather.
- VHF will not work during lightning.
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ______

Tips For Viewers Best Reception

- Have a good VHF/UHF Outdoor Antenna
- Use RG 6 Coaxial Cable. Cable lenght as short as possible!!!!
- Use a HDTV, Digital TV or Dish DTV Pal Plus or Zenith Converter Box if you can live with lower quality TV! But not bad since analog signals are gone for full power TV.
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ______

Fringe Viewer Info

- Point Antenna in exact location facing transmitter. (Use Compass and TV Fool If No rotor)
- Fringe Viewers are pretty much screwed!!!
- Pray for Tropospheric Ducting Weather!!!
- If your reception is little to none try an AMP get one with high VHF/UHF gain, and a low noise figure.
- Install FM Trap in between Antenna and AMP. If AMP doesn't have FM Trap on it.
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ______

Recommended Tips / suggestions for TV broadcasters Not already doing so!!!

- Think about Over The Air Viewers!
- Do whats best for All Viewers!
- Avoid VHF!!!
- Pick a UHF channel in the range from 14-51. That is not used by a nearby station!
- 1000 kW power
- 2000 FT transmitter tower

These recommendations will increase their coverage areas to the fullest as possible!
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ______

Things That Screw Up VHF

- Lightning!
- Certain Vehicles going Up the Street, Hwy, or road! (Depending on your location.)
- Running a vacuum, drill, or mixer!
- Turning on and off a light switch!
- Pulling the chain on a ceiling fan!
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ______

Digital vs. Analog

- Digital has better picture and sound than Analog.
- Digital UHF signal is stronger than Analog UHF signal.
- Analog VHF signal was better than Digital VHF signal.

____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ______

AMP Facts

- Amps amplify not just the signal but other unwanted garbage.
- If your plan to use an AMP get one with high VHF/UHF gain, and a low noise figure.
- Install FM Trap in between Antenna and AMP. If AMP doesn't have FM Trap on it.
- Old Radio Shack Amps only works for Analog which is Low Power Analog now!
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ______

Useful Websites

FCC TV Database
http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?state=MO&call=&arn=&city=Springfield&chan=&cha2=69&serv=&type=0&facid=&list=1&dist=&dlat2=&mlat2=&slat2=&dlon2=&mlon2=&slon2=&size=9

FCC Engineering Maps
http://www.fcc.gov/mb/engineering/maps/

TV Fool
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29

REC Broadcast Query (Just Type In Callsign)
http://cdbs.recnet.com/fmq.php?facid=&call=KYTV&ccode=1&latd=&lond=&city=&state=&country=US&zip=&party=&party_type=LICEN&jaws=0

Rabbit Ears
http://rabbitears.info/market.php?mktid=94

Tropospheric Weather Conditions
http://www.dxinfocentre.com/tropo.html

UTC Time Converter
http://hurricanes.noaa.gov/zulu-utc.html

Meters to Feet
http://www.unitconversion.org/length/meters-to-foots-us-survey-conversion.html
KM to Miles
http://www.unitconversion.org/length/kilometers-to-miles-us-survey-conversion.html

KSPR Predicted Coverage Area (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT1248539.html
)
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ______

I have a 30 year old UHF/VHF antenna that no longer picks up PBS and drops other channels out of St Louis. If you could suggest an antenna make/model that would best suit my needs, it would be greatly appreciated. I have not paid for TV for over 25 years and don't plan to start now. In the last week I began receiving channels from towers to the East of my house--St Louis is to the West...but I read elsewhere a omni antenna is not worth the purchase. Still, I would like to receive as many stations as pratical.

Here is some info on where I live:
" http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3dbc27f38c0e061c"

Welcome to the forum!

If KETC is fine for PBS and you're not interested in WSIU PBS, all you need is a good UHF antenna suitable for your area. This one (http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?mc=03&p=4221-HD) should work well, aimed at approximately 258°, which is just slightly to the left of due West.

If you have more than one TV, or a long coax run, say over 75' or so, you may need a mast mounted preamp. But only if signal strength is low. This one (http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?mc=03&p=ANWHDP269&d=Winegard-HDP-269-SquareShooter-PreAmplifier-for-SquareShooter-SS1000-(HDP269)&c=Pre-Amplifiers&sku=615798396145) works well for mid range locations.

BTW, there is also a thread for St Louis area.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=793006&page=509
Lately, though, they seem to be discussing computers!

SteveR

If you want to ensure you get KETC, pick up a medium range Yagi such as a 42XG or a 4-bay bowtie.

Hey:

I've got one for you all.

I got a complaint this morning from someone who was helping an 87-year old gentleman who lives in downtown Springfield. He's trying to use an indoor antenna, and only gets 3/21/33. He's not expecting to get 10 on an indoor antenna, but was confused that a box he'd already programmed on his roof antenna at home showed zero signal for KSFX as well. He couldn't get it to show any signal regardless of positioning.

I'm rather surprised by this too and have no ideas. Any thoughts?

- TripTrip,
That's odd. KSFX is usually the strongest Springfield channel I get. I can get it 24/7, using a simple indoor loop antenna. And I'm 71.5 miles from the tower. He's not using an amp is he? If so, the amp may be overloaded.

He may want to try this popular RS indoor antenna (http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103077). It has a larger UHF loop than most set top antennas, and often works well (KOLR 10 not included). I have one just sitting in the corner of the room that's picking up KSFX as I type this.

http://i50.tinypic.com/1z583y8.jpg
http://i50.tinypic.com/zjb3vm.jpg


JT,
This simple antenna in the post below, might help your situation
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17580830#post17580830
:)

Trip, On the FCC site, I see a ton of channel 10s operating or applying to operate at many times more power than KOLR 10. Several as high as 80kW.

It's ridiculous that KOLR 10 is only an anemic 26kW. What are the reasons for this, other than interfering with KTUL in Tulsa?

That probably is the reason. KTUL's non-directional antenna currently receives 0.46% interference at 26 kW, according to Page 20 of the paperwork KOLR submitted. (Remember the rule is 0.5%.) Once KTUL builds out their directional pattern, that number drops to 0.15%, and amusingly then WGEM becomes the station to protect with 0.16%.

Perhaps at that time KOLR can increase power further.

- Trip

What is with the video quality of the Chiefs game on KOLR today? It was horribly blocky during the fast motion shots. It looked like a channel with a bunch of subchannels and bandwidth constrained. Was it the CBS feed that was horrible? The commercials looked good. :mad: The late game looked a lot better.