Hi Tom.

So guys,
Did any of you get the Timberwolves game in HD on FSN-HD tonight (Tuesday night)? When we went to it, it was just frozen. So we had to watch the game on TNT. I want to invite friends over to watch the next playoff game, but I'm afraid FSN-HD might not have it just like tonight. :(

Hi,
I'm having comcast upgrade my standard service to HDTV and was wondering:

- Do you have to pay installation for HDTV? They quoted me $30.
- Why is the second HDTV receiver $10 when the first is $5?
- What channels are available via HDTV? DiscoveryHD?
- Do you have to ask for specific HDTV tunner or does everyone get the same one?

Thank you.

On page 9 of this thread, MrBlonde wrote,

"I suppose I should post an update for you.

I was able to order the standard cable and the $5 hdtv package, WITHOUT having to order the digital cable package. At first the rep said I couldn't do it, but then they checked with "someone else" and they said it was possible. So I know have the DCT-6200 Moto box in order to get the HD channels.

The HD is phenomenal by the way."

You may wish to check out the surrounding messages for a little more info.

Also go to http://www.hdtvtwincities.com for a current listing of what is available.

Wingnut, Thanks for the information but comcast reps insist I need to upgrade to digital cable.

StoneyHome:

I hope you enjoy the channels in HD you are getting now. Evidently, Comcast doesn't see the necessity or value in adding HD channels. You will not get DiscoveryHD (even though, after ESPNHD it is the most-desired HD channel). It appears we won't get TNT-HD, and for sure we will never get BravoHD or HDNET. We do get a lot of sports, though. From what I've read, all other major cable systems far out-weigh Comcast for HD carriage.

Your other alternative is to use Comcast for local HD and INHD1&2 (which we watch a lot) and a satellite service for HD programming. I'm just not sure I can afford it.

Rich N.

If you don't get the digital package you will not get ESPN-HD, INHD 1 or 2... You will only get the 112-NBC, 113-CBS, 114-FOX

They consider all the reset part of the digital packages...even though their website doesn't say that. Website only says you get all of them for $5 a month.

From a personal point of view as a Comcast subscriber, my choice for HD right now would be to stay with analog cable service and receive HD over the air. As long as Comcast can't supply what I want and I have no need for digital cable for extra cost premium channels like HBO, Comcast can keep it.

If one can live without ESPN-HD and HDNET, you won't be missing out on anything and getting more locals than Comcast can provide. Over the air you will get, WCCO-4, KARE-11, and KMSP-9 enhanced wide screen like Comcast offers. Additionally you will get KTCA-2, KSTP-5, KSTC, and KMWB. Either way you will not receive Discovery-HD. Even if you go with satellite, as I understand the situation, you will still have to get many of the locals over the air.

When "they" start selling what I want (including the Twins) rather than what "they" want to provide, then I will make a final choice as to where to spend my money.

Sorry, I wrote "If one can live without ESPN-HD and HDNET. . ." I meant to say INHD 1/2 not HDNET. Lost my track of brain for a second.

I'm gonna have to agree with you Wingnut. When I change locations again, I won't be going back to comcast if I can help it. ESPNHD and INHDs are great but they really should be offering more. And now they are making me order a digital package on top of the regular cable and hdtv charge.

So in order to get the three extra HD channels that they offer (besides the local, you get the local HDs even if you don't have digital service, and besides the premium channels) you have to pay the $5 hdvtv charge and you have to have one of the digital packages. Really not worth it.

How much is OTA HTDV receiver? Without cable I don't get good reception for local channels so will the HTDV reception be better with HTDV receiver OTA?

Did all of you guys have to pay $30 installation per TV for comcast HDTV?

Also one of my TV is Sony KP61XBR300 and I was told it was HDTV ready when I bought it. My question is since this TV is 4:3 how is the HDTV programs displayed on this set? Does it have the black strips on top and bottom for these programs? Can you watch HDTV in full screen mode on this TV?

An OTA receiver will probably run several hundred dollars. You will have to shop around. Unlike analog where you get differing quality of reception from fuzzy to good, digital is either received or not. You get a great picture or you get nothing. My stepson lives nearly seventy miles from the towers and he gets a good signal with "rabbit ears."

I have heard that Comcast is slowly working their way around the neighborhoods and forcing folks to go digital. They offer no charge conversion and no increase in monthly rates when it suits them to get you converted. If you call them and request an "upgrade" from analog to digital, yes, they will ding you for an installation charge.

Your TV will display black bars on the top and bottom of 16:9 formatted HDTV. The capabilities of your tv will determine if you can "pan/scan", stretch, distort, or in some other manner screw up the original formatting to fit your screen. The exact same thing is true when displaying 4:3 material on a widescreen tv so don't feel bad.

We use Comcast HDTV in the bedroom where our TV is HD-ready (no outboard tuner) but on our main TV in the family room that has a built-in tuner we just use a Zenith Silver Sensor indoor antenna. This pulls in all of the local digital channels and the picture is great. Any TV that I buy in the future will have the HD tuner built in.

Originally posted by The Wingnut
An OTA receiver will probably run several hundred dollars...Sorry if this seems like I'm beating a dead horse, but the HD-DirecTiVo has two OTA HD tuners and can record two OTA shows at once. Why wouldn't anyone (who has $500 extra to toss at the problem) buy one of those instead?

I'm waiting impatiently for mine, so I can ditch Comcast.

BTW, in another thread a poster declared that D* is planning on offering a pay-as-you-go (rental) HD-DirecTiVo. Maybe $10 or $15 per month, with a loooong contract.

If one could buy a Tivo for a couple of hundred, that might be a good solution. However, a recent ad shows the dual HDTV receiver Tivo around a thousand bucks. The small print states that "subscription to DIRECTV High Definition packaged required. Monthly subscription to Tivo required for full functionality." I don't want DIRECTV or Tivo, just HDTV. Is that what you are doing to ditch Comcast?

Doesn't anyone else care about Timberwolves playoffs in HD?

Now that Victory Sports is history and the Twins are back on FSN (http://www.startribune.com/stories/509/4765575.html), do you think there's any chance we'll start seeing the Twins in HD?

Do they even use HD cameras for the games?

If so, will Comcast pick-up FSN-HD for the Twins like they did for the Wolves?

"Doesn't anyone else care about Timberwolves playoffs in HD?"

Timberwolves? Playoffs? Are they some new soccer team in town or maybe an arena football team? I miss the Kicks and the Minnesota Moose, but the Timberwolves is a new one on me.

Time Warner just added KSTP on May 7th.

TWC Picks Up KSTP (http://www.hdtvtwincities.com/mainframe.php/news)

Rumors are floating that Comcast is close (I know - they always are).

Originally posted by DaveMN
Now that Victory Sports is history and the Twins are back on FSN (http://www.startribune.com/stories/509/4765575.html), do you think there's any chance will start seeing the Twins in HD?

Do they even use HD cameras for the games?

If so, will Comcast pick-up FSN-HD for the Twins like they did for the Wolves?

With Victory gone this should make things much more clear to get full-time FOX-HD added to Comcast.

I was wondering why FSNHD (North) hadn't already been added to Comcast's lineup. Though I doubt that Fox has very many HD trucks available right now.

... But I'm soon going to be a DirecTV customer, anyway. What are the chances of FSNHD on D*?

Doesn't FOX own DirecTV? If so, chances might be very good.

Originally posted by Markito
Doesn't anyone else care about Timberwolves playoffs in HD?

I would if it actually came in. I got to see one game in HD in the Denver series, but for some reson it hasn't been working for the past few games. I had the Tech come out, he said something was wrong on their end (Comcast).

When I did get to watch the game it almost seemed if the camera was zoomed out to much. It was kinda like sitting in the upper deck instead of the lower deck.

Originally posted by jltrdavis
I would if it actually came in. I got to see one game in HD in the Denver series, but for some reson it hasn't been working for the past few games. I had the Tech come out, he said something was wrong on their end (Comcast).

When I did get to watch the game it almost seemed if the camera was zoomed out to much. It was kinda like sitting in the upper deck instead of the lower deck.
I don't believe they've carried any games in the second round. I'm trying to remember which games were in HD for the Denver series - it seems like all of them?

I have Comcast also, and was very pleased with the quality of all games that were broadcast in HD.

Yes, the quality was very good.

shelland said:
I don't believe they've carried any games in the second round. That's right. I've checked the HD channels (HSNHD, 438 and ESPNHD, 173) during each game with the Kings and "Yes, we have no HD." A Comcast salesperson said they get internal emails telling them when games will be in HD, but also said the only way for me to find out is to call 1-800-COMCAST. (Ironically, that number is automatically fed to a local switchboard, while the 651 numbers usually go out of state to Idaho, Illinois, etc. -- he said.)

Three of the Nuggets games were carried in HD on 438, and they looked very good.

Now channel 438 (FSNHD) has totally disappeared from my guide. Aparrently they didn't think the Timberwolves were going to make it past the first round.

Yes. Disappeared from my guide as well. Of course, pessimism about the Wolves isn't the most likely reason for its disappearance. ;)

THE HD-DVRs ARE AVAILABLE!

Just talked to Comast, and they are now offering the single-tuner Motorola DCT6208 boxes in the Twin Cities. The CSR I spoke with was suprisingly helpful and knowledgeable. He also said they're scheduled to have dual-tuner boxes available in late August/early September.

Had to schedule a service call, since they told me I couldn't just go to an office and swap boxes. I'll be up and running Thursday evening- Yahoo!!!

The user guide is here:
http://broadband.motorola.com/dvr/downloads/DCT6200-08_UserGuide.pdf

I called them on Sunday about a DVR box and they said they would have someone call me back. No return call yet. Guess I will call them again. Thanks for the heads-up, Dave!

Just got off the phone. After spending some time checking, the CSR determined that yes, they can switch my HD box for the HD-DVR box. Thursday it is!

On Sunday, the CSR told me there would be no fee for a tech to come to switch out the box, but the CSR told me today that there IS a charge. However, they're waiving the charge for me since they gave me incorrect information on Sunday.

The monthly cost for the HD-DVR box is $9.95, and that replaces the $5 for the HD box. So for only $4.95/month more, we will have DVR. The 2-tuner box will be great this Fall. Does anyone know which box it will be - the HD8000 maybe?

Thanks again, Dave!!

PS - No word from them yet on when ABC and PBS will be added to their HD lineup, but I requested it once again (just like every other time I have to call them).

cielo said:
...they're waiving the charge for me since they gave me incorrect information on SundayWell, I wish I knew what were the magic words you uttered (in addition to "they told me on Sunday that there wouldn't be any installation charge").

My CSR passed me to Billing, where they took a hard line on the $30 charge: a flat "No."

When I followed up with, "Considering that #30 charge, plus no ABC or PBS, I'm just going to switch to DirecTV and get a 2-tuner DVR," she simply said, "Do you want me to terminate you today?"

Of course, I wasn't ready to do that; I don't have any satellite equipment yet. ;)

Wow, Frank - that really stinks! The CSR I talked to today was much, much more accommodating than that. I don't think I've ever been treated as poorly by Comcast as you apparently were. The only thing I can think of is that she was maybe trying to make up for the fact that they had not returned my call from Sunday (in addition to the fact that on Sunday they told me there would be no charge).

I have been looking into satellite options too, but it doesn't seem like they're any better price-wise when HD is also taken into consideration. Am I wrong on that?

Why do they charge you to sent an inexperience tech out to unplug your old box and plug in the new box. When you could do this yourself. Time warner lets you just go to the office and swap the boxes. Is there any way that you can get around the charge.

Just talked to Comast, and they are now offering the single-tuner Motorola DCT6208 boxes in the Twin Cities. The CSR I spoke with was suprisingly helpful and knowledgeable. He also said they're scheduled to have dual-tuner boxes available in late August/early September.
Only a month until I move out of both Comcast and TWC coverage areas - yippee for me! :mad: (yes, I'm being very sarcastic!) I'm very tempted to get one for the month that I'll still be a customer, but I'd hate to do that to them.

Since I'm moving to Cologne, which only has analog cable available, and is an NRTC area that only has a $699 RCA HD box available, looks like I'm about to make the jump to Voom. If I don't like what Voom has to offer, I'll spend the cash to go to DirectTV later (since Voom doesn't have a contract).

Originally posted by DaveMN
THE HD-DVRs ARE AVAILABLE!

Just talked to Comast, and they are now offering the single-tuner Motorola DCT6208 boxes in the Twin Cities. The CSR I spoke with was suprisingly helpful and knowledgeable. He also said they're scheduled to have dual-tuner boxes available in late August/early September.

Had to schedule a service call, since they told me I couldn't just go to an office and swap boxes. I'll be up and running Thursday evening- Yahoo!!!

The user guide is here:
http://broadband.motorola.com/dvr/downloads/DCT6200-08_UserGuide.pdf

Do you know if the price for this still the extra $5 per month?

Do you know if the price for this still the extra $5 per month?
Yes, as cielo said, the monthly charge for the DVR box is $9.95. Since we're already paying $5/mo for the current 5100 HD box, moving to the new box will be a net increase of $4.95/mo. Of course if you're not a current HD subscriber, the net increase will be $9.95/mo.

BTW, here's a newly updated technical site for the Motorola boxes (stolen from another thread):

http://cjhengineering.com/DCTHDFAQ.htm

I made 3 calls to Comcast yesterday.

Call 1: You can schudule an install of the 6208 OR you can simply stop by the local office and exchange the box for no charge.

Call 2: After reading the threads here and on hdtvtwincites thought I should call the local number to be sure I could exchange the box (without a scheduled install). CSR stated that they did have the 6208 box at the Inver Grove location and that I could stop by and exchange. I asked her several times if she was sure - she said yes.

Call 3: Comcast rep posted on hdtvtwincites that you could not do a simple exchange for the 6208 but had to do an appointment. I called back, the CSR knew right away that I had to make an appointment. I asked for a supervisior. The supervisor was very sure that I needed an appointment and told me so in no uncertain terms. She stated that it was a soft roll-out because of a small number of 6208 currently available. I had to make an appointment for next Thursday to get the unit installed - and of course pay the install fee:mad:

I just wish they were all on the same page because I almost went to the trouble of disconnecting my 5100 and going over to Comcast to find out I had to pay extra and could not do a self install (which I am sure I will end up doing anyway).

Getting mine between 5-7 tonight. There are rumors flying that you can't record INHD. Anybody know anything about this? That would be a major bummer if true.

I'm getting mine between 1-3 this afternoon. I'll try to record INHD and then post. The unit claims to be able to record HD (including 5.1 audio) so I can't imagine why INHD would be a problem, but we'll see...

Just had my install. It went fine, and the tech was very nice. It was the first one he has ever installed, so he didn't know much at all about how to work it (and was very apologetic about that). He said they're not planning to formally roll them out until the dual-tuner units are available because they don't want to have to install a ton of boxes just to replace them so soon.

INHD appears to work just fine with the DVR. I haven't tried to formally record a program yet, but it pauses and then continues from the paused point perfectly well. Very cool!

Did he mention when the Dual tuners were coming out? or being released?

Eric,
He didn't really know. But DaveMN posted earlier this week that Comcast told him it would be late August/early September (so you can probably count on it being by the end of the year).

The first few things I recorded were INHD and they recorded great.

Rich N.

So within one year I will need three installs each being at least $30 - wow. Why can't they just exchange them?

That's an excellent question. All the tech did was remove the connections to the HD box and reconnect them to the new box, and then he called to have them activate the new box. Not complicated at all.

I am getting my 6208 installed next Thursday. I hear it can record 30 hours non-HD and 7 hours of HD programming? Can someone let me know if that is correct? We also were told a $30 install fee. Paid $30 less than a month ago for the 6200. Shew...

I think those numbers may be conservative, but I'm no expert. I recorded Harry Potter on ABC in HD for 4 hours. The 6208 said the disk was 31% full. Maybe their HD didn't need as much bandwidth as others? Otherwise it would be 12 hours for HD. Be sure you have the installer show you how to manipulate through the menus and operate the playback. I've found it to be tricky.

But it does record and play back HD and pause well. Hopefully when the 6412 comes along in late Summer/ early Fall these usability issues will be improved.

Rich N.

I have heard the 6412 has 2 tuners...why is that important? Is it because with 2 tuners I can watch a HD channel and be recording another HD channel? With the 6208 will I have to watch what I am recording and with a 6412 I can record and watch a different channel? Also, is there more disk space on the 6412? Thanks Rich :)

Got my 6208 last night and gave it a quick run-through. I recorded 30 mins of the Phillies' game on INHD no problem, and it looked great. Checked the usage, and the 30mins used 6% of the storage capacity. A few quick calculations, and I come up with about 8.3 total hours of HD storage capacity.

After being used to the TiVo interface, the 6208 interface is clunky and awkward, but at least I can finally record some HD without shelling out $999 for a Direct TV HD-TiVo.

I have not checked out the back of the unit yet. Is the FireWire port active so we can add an external drive for more capacity? This is something that I would readily welcome.

All the Comcast tech did was swap out the old box for the new one, and call the office to activate it. $30 for something I should have been able to do myself at the Comcast office.

Hopefully when the 6412 comes along in late Summer/ early Fall these usability issues will be improved.
What is your source for the 6412 info? Do we know for sure this will be the dual tuner box they make available?

The manual for the 6208 says that digital non-HD channels take up less bandwidth so that it can record more than 30 hours on those channels, but 30 hours is what they claim is the max for analog non-HD. And yes, the install fee is $30. Expect another $30 when they roll out the dual-tuner units.

Yes, it's important to have 2 tuners because otherwise you can't record one channel while watching another (unless you have a second cable input directly into your tv like I do). The other important advantage is that you can record 2 different programs at the same time.

I don't know much about the 6412. I've heard more talk about the 6408, which has the same small 80GB hard drive as the 6208. There is also an 8000 dual-tuner unit which comes in 80GB and 160GB versions. Gee, which one sounds better??

Yes, the 6412 has two tuners and, I understand, 120 GB hard drive, so you could watch one thing and record another with more storage space. I actually was watching one thing and a timed program switched the channel to start recording.

About the time, I heard the same timeframe as DaveMN from a Comcast person. Hope it comes through. Maybe they can improve the user interfaces on these boxes too. II'm not aware of a Motorola 8000 unit, that sounds more like a Scientific Atlanta box, they are the main sources for cable STBs.

It is fun having a new toy that only costs $5 a month over the regular HD box charge.

Rich N.

Oops - Rich, you're right - the 8000 is a Scientific Atlantic box. It's nice to hear that the 6412 has a little bigger hard drive. Does anyone know if it is more user-friendly for connecting a computer to transfer programs to DVDs?

And does anyone have any definitive information as to which dual-tuner box Comcast is planning to roll out here? The tech who installed my DVR didn't have a clue.

Thanks guys for all the info. I am so excited to get the 6208 next week! Is the interface really, really clunky? Or once you get used to the clunkyness, you can navigate quickly? I really lose interest quick in something electronic if it takes alot of energy each time I want to use it...I hope it isn't so.

Is the interface really, really clunky?Yes, it's clunky, but it's usable. My main problem was that I've been spoiled by TiVo for 5 years. I'll take the clunky interface over TiVo though if I can record HD!

I am installing a Sony HS20 to a Motorola HD set top in St. Paul. We wired for both component and DVI. The cable company had left the box in place before we had the projector ready to go. Our initial tests showed the DVI connection working fine. The box seemed to be in some "free" mode as we seemed to be accessing much more programming than the customer was subscribing to. We left the site with the box in this mode. Now that it has been authorized or whatever,it will not work until you unplug and replug in the DVI cable. Then a message displays indicating your DVI HDCP or something has been compromised. After the message goes away the box works fine until you restart the system. Anyone out there have any experience with the DVI on this box? Thanks for any insight

I have the same problem. If I do not reset the box by unpluging it before I
turn my system on I get the message " HD has been compromised etc."
My system is connected by DVI, IEEE, and Component and they all get
message. This started happening when the 7.10 firmware was installed.
I have had Comcast out to my house and all they do is replace the box,
which does not fi the problem. Comcast says Motorola is working on a fix.

Thanks AdrianG. So you have the same message and problem when you use the component output? That was going to be my temporary fix. Thanks

The only output I have NOT had this problem with is analog.

Wow, I leave the country for 10 days and this thread goes from being almost a ghost town to a vibrant popular thread again. Nice to see so many of you dropping by.

Great news about the HD DVR!!! Thanks so much for the heads up!

I too have had the "Compromised" error message for the past few weeks and it is driving me CRAZY! I am sure that it has to do with HDCP and DVI, but my Panasonic PT-L500U front projector is fully HDCP compatible/compliant, so I should not be getting that. What I get first is no picture at all (anymore) via DVI on my projector, then I go to the menu in my projector, change a certain setting, change it back and then exit the menu and then I get a picture, but with the big blue box and error blocking everything. Then I wait about one minute and then it disappears. But everytime I try to watch HD again via DVI, it appears again.

I was planning on calling them to replace my Moto 5100 box anyway due to that and the fact that lately when changing the channels (mostly with my ReplayTV unit), it doesn't go to the right channel and takes me to some awful local access channel instead. I've also been having no audio via the 5100 at times too.

But now that I know about the new HD DVR being available, I will see if they can replace the defective 5100 with the 6208 with no service call charge since it needs replacing with a new cablebox anyway. It's worth a try since I am having trouble and was going to call for a replacement anyway.

So people are still having this "Compromised" error even with the new box (6208)?

And how would you 6208 owners rate the picture quality of recorded HD shows? Any degradation in quality from live HD?

I'm calling now and can't wait to get the new box!

Let's keep this thread alive!

Update:

Well, they wouldn't waive the $30 (6208) installation fee, despite my need for a replacement HD cable box. The gal claimed that those are two completely separate departments.

But they are going to come to my house on Wednesday afternoon to bring it to me.

To me, it's worth the $30 to have someting new, cool and finally record my HD shows in High Definition, rather than not in HD on my ReplayTV units.

I can't wait!

I have the 6208, got it Saturday, and I'm quite pleased so far. Has anyone tried to connect a firewire drive to this bad boy yet? I'm guessing it won't work, but you never know. I've searched the other threads to no avail.
Also---what are the experiences out there with digital VCRs? I'm going to want to archive, and I guess the choice is Mits or JVC. Anyone using these with the 6208 yet, locally? Local vendors? I'm also intrigued by the whole D-Theater thang....is it really worth the extra $$ to get a VCR that will play these tapes?
Thanks in advance---

Here is a good explanation of the "HDCP Compromised" error. Apparently an automatically upgraded firmware glitch...

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,10302302~mode=flat

Yikes, here is some scathing AVS members' reviews of the 6208.
I must admit, I'm a bit depressed after reading those. I know it's no ReplayTV (like mine) or Tivo, but I hope it's at least worth having.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?threadid=391772&highlight=comcast

Here is a demo of the 6208...
http://broadband.motorola.com/dvr/multimedia_demo.asp

Well, I've been a dedicated Tivo guy for awhile, but once you get past the fact that it's not a Tivo, it's really not half-bad. I'm sure it'll improve over time, too, especially if the MS software is adopted. Basically, the easiest way to program it is to go the the guide and select each program manually. It doesn't have the `smarts' of the Tivo, but it works.

I subscribe to the standard (non-digital) Comcast cable package, and I was able to get HD channel for NBC, CBS, and FOX without hooking up the antenna. However, I couldn't find the ABC's HD channel, anyone know what is it, or do I have to hook-up antenna to get it?

Thanks for the help.

Originally posted by katetsai
I subscribe to the standard (non-digital) Comcast cable package, and I was able to get HD channel for NBC, CBS, and FOX without hooking up the antenna. However, I couldn't find the ABC's HD channel, anyone know what is it, or do I have to hook-up antenna to get it?

Thanks for the help.
Unfortunately, KSTP digital is not being carried yet by Comcast, so you'll need an OTA antenna until they decide to listen to their customers.

Here's a good listing of who carries what:
http://www.hdtvtwincities.com/mainframe.php/satellite

Edit.

Originally posted by DaveMN
Unfortunately, KSTP digital is not being carried yet by Comcast, so you'll need an OTA antenna until they decide to listen to their customers.


Comcast may not be at fault in this. They get their local analog signal free as part of "must carry" rules. These rules don't cover HD. Most stations give their HD signal to them as well (as you noted, you get all the local HD except ABC). but Comcast must have written permission to rebroadcast the HD signal.

If your station is owned by Sinclair, they will not give Comcast their HD feed for free, unlike the other stations. Comcast won't pay, since the HD signal, like the analog signal, is free OTA, plus they have free agreements with the other locals. I hate Sinclair, they are stopping Fox in Baltimore from having the soon-to-be Fox HD on Comcast so we won't see the Super Bowl or World Series in HD.

If KSTP is owned by Cox, they also won't give Comcast their HD signal. I don't know if it is because Cox wants money or just won't give permission out of spite to another cable company. Many markets are suffering because Cox and Sinclair are being *astard* about this. Obviously those companies don't care about HD cable users in their communities.

Rich N.

Boy, am I glad I'm getting the HD-DirecTiVo DVR in a couple of weeks (or so I'm told). Otherwise I would've been tempted to pay Comcast their stinking $30 ripoff so they could come out and "install" a 6208 (replacing my 5100), and then in less than 6 months they would've been asking me for another $30 to "install" a dual-tuner 6412 with halfway decent capacity.

And, since I want to use the DVI input on my Sammy DLP, I would've been disappointed to find that the 6208 doesn't do DVI output yet!

Like DaveMN, I've been spoiled by TiVo for 5 years; unlike DaveMN, I'm fed up with Comcast. So "there's a rumor" that we'll get ABC-HD soon? I won't believe it until it happens. It's quite possible that the "rumor" originated with a shill for Comcast. (Shill = plant = undercover salesman.)

I'd jump ship for a HD-Direct TiVo, but I just can't justify $1000 for the hardware. If they cut that in half, I'd definitely consider it. I look at the Comcast DVRs as a relatively cheap interim solution until something better is available. I'm not locking myself into any long-term commitments with the Comcast DVR, so I'm going to wait it out for an extra $9.95/mo until things settle a bit. I'm hoping in the next year or so, there will be more, better and cheaper options available.

Originally posted by raidbuck
If your station is owned by Sinclair, they will not give Comcast their HD feed for free, unlike the other stations. Comcast won't pay, since the HD signal, like the analog signal, is free OTA, plus they have free agreements with the other locals. I hate Sinclair, they are stopping Fox in Baltimore from having the soon-to-be Fox HD on Comcast so we won't see the Super Bowl or World Series in HD.

If KSTP is owned by Cox, they also won't give Comcast their HD signal. I don't know if it is because Cox wants money or just won't give permission out of spite to another cable company. Many markets are suffering because Cox and Sinclair are being *astard* about this. Obviously those companies don't care about HD cable users in their communities.

Rich N.

Luckily KSTP-TV isn't owned by either Sinclair or Cox... it's privately owned by the Twin Cities' Hubbard Family. I should know, I worked there for 6 years.

C'mon Comcast and KSTP, let's turn this rumor into reality. It's not fair that I can't watch Alias' Jennifer Garner in extremely clear high definition!!!:eek: :D :cool:

I'm with DaveMN, Comcast's limited DVR is a good short term temporary solution for now.

I repeat my point made several pages back that I am very grateful for all of you "early adopters" and even "medium adopters." You folks are the ones that keep the technological ball rolling. Thanks much!

I just hope that Comcast, KSTP, DirecTV, etc. understand that there are probably many thousands of us out here (in the Twin Cities area) that are still sitting on their wallets. Until I can get what I want, when I want it, at a price I want, I will not spend a single dime more for any of their dung. Phoney install charges, lame STBs lagging other technologies and soon needing to be replaced, thousand dollar Tivo BS, no thanks.

But in the meantime, I will just have to do without. Sounds like the chicken and the egg scenario. If there is a demand, the technology and services will be provided to meet said demand. But without a satisfactory product for sale at an acceptable price, how can "they" expect demand in sufficient numbers? Oh well. I suspect that Don Shelby and Emril LaGossie wouldn't look much better in hi-def anyway.

Those are fine sentiments, laddie! I, however, decided that 4 HD tuners and recording 2 HD shows at once -- plus TiVo functionality -- was worth my $900. Jumping into SD TiVo in 1999 was the best buying decision I ever made (except for buying a house in 1968).

And I have already thanked you for your leadership. And I will thank you again because it is you and others like you have have gotten us at least this far. It isn't far enough for me, but without folks like you, we would still be watching Ed Sullivan in black & white, etc.

My issue is with Comcast and DirecTV and . . . . They simply charge too much and deliver way too little. Time is the only determining factor of when I jump on the bandwagon, not if.

I am very happy that you are satisfied and enjoying the experience, Syzygy.

I made yet another call to Comcast today asking for more HD channels. Yes, I repeated my previous requests for ABC, PBS and Discovery, but I also inquired about TNT. I know people in Time Warner territory already watching the Wolves games on TNT-HD, but Comcast apparently has no plans to add it to their lineup . . . at least that's what the CSR says. Hopefully, they have negotiations in the works and just haven't told any of their CSRs.

I hate to stifle any optimism, but several "in the know" folks are saying that TNT-HD is a very long way from being included in Comcast's HD lineup. After DiscoveryHD there are no rumors I've heard about new HD channels. WGN and Hallmark SD channels are starting June 1st.

Rich N.

Originally posted by The Wingnut
Oh well. I suspect that Don Shelby and Emril LaGossie wouldn't look much better in hi-def anyway.

It is spelled Emeril Lagasse and I wouldn't mind seeing him in Hi-Def ;) But I digress...I agree with all of you posters on the HD-Tivo versus Comcast DVR discussion. I would love to stick it to Comcast and dump most or all of their services and buy an HD-Tivo or build a HT PC with a MyHD card but it is a financial decision of where to spend the HT dollars that will provide the biggest digital bang for the buck. We chose to spend our HT bucks on the monitor, receiver and speakers and lease the comcast STB/DVR. It is a crapshoot to guess correctly which HT components will be most vulnerable to technology obsolescence. Any of you guys know when Lifetime channel will be in HD? Just kidding ;)

LindaLuv said:
Any of you guys know when Lifetime channel will be in HD? Just kiddingMy better half would also like to know that! ;) I think maybe the guys making the decisions believe that women don't care so much about picture quality, but they do... All it takes is a little exposure to HD to hook anyone, is it not so?

Absolutely true, Frank! I have been far more assertive than my husband in obtaining new technology and pressing for more HD and DVR options with Comcast (and Comcast techs are frequently surprised by the fact that I know what I'm talking about, presumably because I'm a woman). I'm sure there are a ton of people out there, men and women alike, who appreciate the fine television viewing experience HD offers.

This brings up an interesting point, has anyone compiled a list of what we IDEALLY would be receiving from Comcast if it were to carry ALL the HD channels other cable providers are carrying? Off the top of my head TNT-HD (GO Wolves), PBS-HD, ABC-HD, Discover HD Theater. What's missing???

Originally posted by Syzygy
Boy, am I glad I'm getting the HD-DirecTiVo DVR in a couple of weeks (or so I'm told). Otherwise I would've been tempted to pay Comcast their stinking $30 ripoff so they could come out and "install" a 6208 (replacing my 5100), and then in less than 6 months they would've been asking me for another $30 to "install" a dual-tuner 6412 with halfway decent capacity.

And, since I want to use the DVI input on my Sammy DLP, I would've been disappointed to find that the 6208 doesn't do DVI output yet!

Like DaveMN, I've been spoiled by TiVo for 5 years; unlike DaveMN, I'm fed up with Comcast. So "there's a rumor" that we'll get ABC-HD soon? I won't believe it until it happens. It's quite possible that the "rumor" originated with a shill for Comcast. (Shill = plant = undercover salesman.)

Many folks are saying Tivo will dry up die, due to the increased competion that's beginning to become available.

I'm getting my DVR from Comcast tonight. The CSR told me there would be no $30.00 install fee when the two-tuner model becomes available in August/September. I didn't have to pay the $30 for the install tonight either after I told the CSR that I was told by another CSR that I would NOT be charged for the swap when I first recieved my HD box.

How about adding Bravo-HD, HDNet, HDNet Movies, and Fox SportsNet? And what about Comcast SportsNet HD? Why don't we get that? It can't be carriage agreement disputes.

Hey, LindaLuv! I just digested your assertion that "It is a crapshoot to guess correctly which HT components will be most vulnerable to technology obsolescence." I respectfully disagree. I bought my Sammy DLP (50") in 2002 through the AVS Power Buy, completely confident that DLP technology would quickly replace CRTs in projection TV. This year I bought Magnepan's direct-from-the-factory speakers (MMGs, MMG-Ws, MMG-C coming) and a Hsu STF-3 sub with the same degree of confidence. (Before that we were listening to the TV's speakers.) These decisions were supported by loads of online reading.

Without the benefit of such exhaustive research I bought a Marantz SR8000 AV receiver in 2001, and that was a mistake. Great remote (Olympian, even), but totally inadequate bass management. Waiting now for the DVI/HDMI switching receivers before upgrading. I hope Outlaw offers such a receiver.

As for HDTV tuners, I think they cost around $300. For $600 or $700 more you can get dual OTA tuners and a TiVo PVR -- not to mention the DirecTV tuners. And I figure to save around $20/month on DirecTV vs. cable. I could save as much as $44/month if I didn't want the HD package or HBO.

blitzen102 said:
Many folks are saying Tivo will dry up die, due to the increased competion that's beginning to become available.Sounds a lot like trolling to me. Who are these many folks?

Sure, the price of a HD-DirecTiVo has to drop in the long run (maybe in six months), but I'm willing to pay the early-adopter's price premium (again).

Wow, cielo's a chick! I didn't know that! Very cool! Good to have some smart and gadget cool women around here.

Well the Comcast guy came and installed the 6208 DVR today. He was knocked out by my theater in the basement. It's always fun to see those guys drool.

He didn't seem to know much about the box at all. Even confused the terms "component" and "composite" a true indicator. He told me that DVI wouldn't work on it and I said, well, it was enabled on my 5100, so let's try. Wouldn't you know, it did work, just as I had told him it would.

So far, I am glad that I have it, but yes, it is way more limited than my ReplayTV units (am I the only Replay user here?). But, all the same, it will be worth it to be able to watch HD without having to only see it live.

It will also be great for recording a really fantastic looking HD show to play when I want a guest to see how really good HD looks on my 12 foot diag. movie screen. Usually at that point, there is nothing stunning on live.

Now I am trying to figure out how to get at the 6208's hidden service menu. I tried the method for the 5100, but it didn't work for the 6208.
Have we discussed it here yet?

Lemme know.
Thanks,

I had the service menu up the other day. I think it was some combination of pressing Power and Select on the front of the box. I had to try a few times to get it right. Unfortunately I'm not at home right now to verify.

I'll check it out. Because as you probably remember, the 5100's service menu was turn the power off and then just press "menu", but that doesn't work with the 6208.
Thanks,

Originally posted by Syzygy
Hey, LindaLuv! I just digested your assertion that "It is a crapshoot to guess correctly which HT components will be most vulnerable to technology obsolescence." I respectfully disagree.

Wow Sygyzy...I didn't expect anyone to digest my assertions :) I do respect your point of view but for the casual consumer, it is a crapshoot. For folks like yourself who do the necessary research, you reduce the "technology obsolescence" risk. But in either case, there is risk. I don't feel as confident as you that DLP technology will be around long enough to justify the $3,000+ we paid for the Sammy...but I don't care all that much. I love being able to watch Hugh Grant in Hi-Def (no gagging please).

Originally posted by Markito
Wow, cielo's a chick! I didn't know that! Very cool! Good to have some smart and gadget cool women around here.
I am a chick also who loves this stuff. My hubby is lagging so far behind me in the gadgetization of our home...he is concerned he may become obsolete himself <evil grin>

Hi Markito,
To access the internal diagnostics menu, shut off the box and then quickly press "select." Here's a website with information regarding the Motorola STBs, including the 6208. Hope it's helpful.

Thanks m'am, but could you please add the link to the website?

Oops - sorry. Don't know how I didn't get that pasted into my last post. Here it is: http://cjhengineering.com/DCTHDFAQ.htm

I just had my DVR "installed" (nudge-nudge wink-wink) last night. The tech agreed it's pretty silly to require an install when all they do is swap out the box. He said they are given essentially no training on the DVR capabilities of the box. He was a nice guy though, and the install went smoothly.

He DID say that we (Comcast Twin Cities) will have 17 HD channels by the end of 2004 - 34 by the end of 2005.

The box itself works great. This is my first experience with a DVR.

It was nice to find in the setup menu the ability to change the amount of time the flip bar stays up when you change channels. The minimum is 3 seconds but I still think it's a second or two faster than my old HD box. You can also change the color of the guide.

It still boggles my mind why any company would make a single tuner DVR - but oh well, I'll take it for now.

Originally posted by blitzen102
The box itself works great. This is my first experience with a DVR.

Hey Blitz, did you have a 6200 prior to the DVR? If yes, how does the PQ compare to the 6200?

The DCT5100 (and earlier boxes) also allowed you to change the amount of time the flip bar stays up when you change channels. There too, you couldn't get the damned thing to go away quicker than 3 seconds.

Does anyone know if Comcast is putting 5C copy-once protection on any channels here locally? I'm looking to pick up a JVC 30K, and ideally I'd like to dump from the DVR...

Originally posted by LindaLuv
Hey Blitz, did you have a 6200 prior to the DVR? If yes, how does the PQ compare to the 6200?

It's pretty much the same. Things DO little slightly cleaner with the new guide and it's graphics (not that it's ALL THAT different) -- but the PQ of broadcasts hasn't changed much if any.

Originally posted by Syzygy
The DCT5100 (and earlier boxes) also allowed you to change the amount of time the flip bar stays up when you change channels. There too, you couldn't get the damned thing to go away quicker than 3 seconds.

Yeah, they want you to see the dumb ad for at least 3 seconds.

How many of you have ever purchased something after seeing and add for it on the guide/flip bar??

:rolleyes: :eek: :confused:

I agree with all the comments about the flip bar. I really wish they would eliminate the ads on the guide altogether to make room for more programming information. Wouldn't it be great if you could see two full hours of programming across the guide?!

I've had Comcast HDTV service for less than a month now and I was wondering when Comcast will add more channels to their service? I've been reading about Time Warner cable adding TNT-HD, KSTP-HD ect.. Why can't the Comcast do the same for their customers?

Is there an email address or phone # where we can call to request they add these channels?

I would also like to see them carry Discovery-HD.

The one thing you can do is call Customer Service (frequently!) to request more channels (651-222-3333), but don't hold your breath for Comcast to add any in the immediate future. It doesn't look good.

Originally posted by SonyHome
I've had Comcast HDTV service for less than a month now and I was wondering when Comcast will add more channels to their service? I've been reading about Time Warner cable adding TNT-HD, KSTP-HD ect.. Why can't the Comcast do the same for their customers?

Is there an email address or phone # where we can call to request they add these channels?

I would also like to see them carry Discovery-HD. Comcast will add Discovery HD in many systems (bandwidth and other technical issues permitting) within the next 4 to 6 weeks.

SonyHome said:
I was wondering when Comcast will add more channels to their service? I've been reading about Time Warner cable adding TNT-HD, KSTP-HD ect.. Why can't the Comcast do the same for their customers?To quote Lily Tomlin's switchboard operator for The Telephone Company [Laugh In, ca. 1969]: "We don't care. We don't have to. <snort>"

Originally posted by cielo
Hi Markito,
To access the internal diagnostics menu, shut off the box and then quickly press "select." Here's a website with information regarding the Motorola STBs, including the 6208. Hope it's helpful.

True, but that brings you to the "Diagnostics Menu", which you can scroll down and hit "select" to read TONS of info about your settings, but I couldn't find a way to actually change any of the settings. It kinda' felt like a "Read Only" type menu.

I guess the only thing I want to fiddle with is the 4:3 override. It was easy to do this with the 5100, but though I can read the info in that menu, I don't think I can change any of it.

Ideas?

To change the 4:3 override, you turn off the power and quickly press "menu." Use the down arrow to scroll down to 4:3 override and then the right arrow to change the selection.

Comcast just added WGN and Hallmark SD channels, sucking up more bandwidth. I will like the sports on WGN. As for HD, Comcast is very slow to add HD channels other than local HD and premium movie channels' HD. DiscoveryHD will be the first added since last September with INHDs. Since they aren't interested in BravoHD+ or HDNET, and TNT-HD has too little HD to warrant the bandwidth (correct me if that is incorrect, please), there really isn't much to add except maybe some Fox HD sports? ENCORE-HD? TMC-HD? Anyway, maybe DiscoveryHD will give us more new stuff to watch for a few months and make the waiting for more content less upsetting. Maybe they'll come up with VOD-HD?

Rich N.

For me, ABC and PBS are the biggest omissions--by far--in Comcast's HD offerings.

"ABC and PBS are the biggest omissions" -- Hear, hear!

Hi all, just bumping this up to see if there is any new news out there in Twin Cities Comcast HDTV land.

It may be that your ABC affiliate won't grant permission to carry the HD signal. Our Fox affiliate is owned by Sinclair, which wants money to carry the HD feed even though it is free OTA. So we won't get Fox on Comcast unless something unforeseen happens. Maybe your PBS station isn't able to broadcast the national PBSHD feed? It isn't the same as Comcast not wanting to give us HDNET or TNT-HD or BravoHD. If they have no-compensation carriage agreements with NBC, CBS and Fox in your area they can't really sign a separate agreement requiring payment for ABC.

Good luck,

Rich N.

I suspect it's still the case that Comcast can't work out a carriage agreement with our local ABC and PBS stations. Our local PBS station is definitely capable of broadcasting the HD feed; Time Warner already carries it.

The latest news flash I have heard is that Time Warner cable here in town will broadcast about a dozen Twins games in HiDef between now and the end of the season. A dozen isn't much, but it is head and shoulders above what Comcast is offering us. Thanks Comcast. They remind me of some TV commercial where a guy asks a subordinate following an ongoing series of screw ups, "Remind me again why I keep you around here?"

Hey all.

I live in West St. Paul an I am planning to get the HD tuner from comcast, and I am wondering what I am going to be getting channel wise. The folks at comcast have not been very clear about exactly what I will be getting. I just have standard cable, none of the digital packages. So what channels can I expect to get? Is Discovery-HD out there yet?

Thanks.

Oh, one more thing. What is the make and model of the HD DVR box one can get from comcast?

Thanks

Originally posted by LambMN
Hey all.

I live in West St. Paul an I am planning to get the HD tuner from comcast, and I am wondering what I am going to be getting channel wise. The folks at comcast have not been very clear about exactly what I will be getting. I just have standard cable, none of the digital packages. So what channels can I expect to get? Is Discovery-HD out there yet?

Thanks.

http://www.comcast.com/Support/viewCLU.asp?CLUID=82022


Channels Networks


112 NBC HD -- KARE
113 CBS HD -- WCCO
114 FOX HD -- KMSP
173 ESPN HD
174 INHD
175 INHD 2
534 STARZ! HD
551 HBO HDTV
563 CINEMAX HD
576 SHOWTIME HDTV

Originally posted by LambMN
Discovery-HD out there yet?



It is getting very close. See this thread....

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=401537&perpage=20&highlight=discovery&pagenumber=4

Originally posted by LambMN
I live in West St. Paul and I am planning to get the HD tuner from comcast, and I am wondering what I am going to be getting channel wise. The folks at comcast have not been very clear about exactly what I will be getting. I just have standard cable, none of the digital packages. So what channels can I expect to get? Is Discovery-HD out there yet?No Discovery-HD. I think there's no immediate likelihood of any more HD channels being added.

I believe you will be a digital subscriber once you get the Motorola DCT5100 from Comcast. You'll get ESPN-HD, NBC-HD (KARE), CBS-HD (WCCO), and INHD1 & 2. You'll also get FOX in ED, not HD -- although the phone monkeys have a list that says Fox is HD.

For more money you can subscribe to HBO, Showtime and/or Starz, and in each case get one or two more HD channels. Of these only HBO is worthwile, and now that The Sopranos is in its last week and Deadwood is ending in two weeks, I don't see sufficient value in HBO either. Sure, Six Feet Under is starting soon, but I could miss it.

But I could be wrong (in the last paragraph), so give the phone monkeys another try. You might get a better one next time.

Thanks for the info.

Originally posted by LambMN
Oh, one more thing. What is the make and model of the HD DVR box one can get from comcast?
Thanks

LambMN,
I don't think your question was answered.
While the "Motorola DCT5100" was mentioned, that is the HD cablebox that is NOT a DVR.

The DVR box is the "Motorola 6208".

Best of luck and you are going to LOVE how true HDTV looks!

Enjoy,

And just so I understand what the DVR does, it records all the cable chanels, not just the HD/Digital ones, correct?

Thanks. That seems like a pretty nice DVR box.

Yes, the 6208 can record standard channels, and it can even hold more that way because standard shows take up far less gigs on the 6208's harddrive than an HD show.

I wouldn't call it really nice, since ReplayTV DVRs (I have several) and Tivo DVRs are way better, but for the price, it is good enough and it sure is nice to be able to record HD.

One last quick question, with the ReplayTVs (at least the old ones) you could get recorded shows off the replay over the network, is there a way to do that with this thing?

Thanks

Nope. Besides, transferring shows took too long even over a fast connection.

Sorry Frank (Tivo guy), but many of us do it with our networked ReplayTVs every day. It works great. But true that the Moto 6208 cannot do that.

Oops, Markito, I was thinking about how slow it is to send movies & shows over the internet -- not thinking about ReplayTVs in a home network. That's only sorta slow. ;)

Thanks Frank, I just thought you were ReplayTV bashing. I'm glad that you weren't. Because I like and respect you. Glad we're cool. :)

Originally posted by DaveMN
Unfortunately, KSTP digital is not being carried yet by Comcast, so you'll need an OTA antenna until they decide to listen to their customers.


Does the 6208 act as a tuner for ota HD as well? Can I just hook an antena up to the cable box and get HD? I cant can I?

No, the 6208 does not have an OTA tuner, and I doubt the dual-tuner unit coming this fall will have one either. You would have to purchase a separate OTA tuner in order to receive ABC-HD.

Comcast has signed a deal for Discovery HD. Anyone seen anything about possible date(S) it will be added for us in the Twin Cities??

Great news, blitzen102! Of course the CSRs don't know anything yet about an agreement. I can't find anything on the web indicating an agreement has been reached. Where did you hear about it?

As far as DiscoveryHD Ken H (moderator) announced it last Friday. I received confirmation from another source. Of course, when DiscoveryHD starts will vary from a week to much longer based upon bandwidth considerations for each Comcast location. The big thing is that it is coming.

Rich N.

Originally posted by raidbuck
As far as DiscoveryHD Ken H (moderator) announced it last Friday. I received confirmation from another source. Of course, when DiscoveryHD starts will vary from a week to much longer based upon bandwidth considerations for each Comcast location. The big thing is that it is coming.

Rich N.

I don't think we should have a bandwidth limitation here in the Twin Cities to get Discovery added. Comcast DID add FSN-HD temporarily for the Wolves and HD "slots" are still probably reserved for ABC and PBS.

Yah, they'll probably add Discovery HD right after I discontinue my service (which will happen as soon as my HD-DirecTiVo arrives and is installed).

Originally posted by Syzygy
Yah, they'll probably add Discovery HD right after I discontinue my service (which will happen as soon as my HD-DirecTiVo arrives and is installed). Just curious how you went about getting your HD Tivo? I am disappointed by the amount of HD programming on Comcast and the limitations of the moto 6208 and really looking hard at D* and HD Tivo. I could care less about Comcast adding Discovery HD...spiders and snakes in HD....ewwwww!

I can't wait for Discovery HD!!!!! Thanks for the news! Please keep us posted when you hear something.

I was hoping we'd somehow get TNT-HD before tonight's airing of Part 1 of the new "Salem's Lot"! But NO. :(

Hi Guys,
I got my 6208 DVR for about 2 weeks now and I'm having to unplug the thing once a day because it freezes up or locks up. Only way to recover from this is to unplug it. I leave my cablebox on all the time and only power off my TV each night.

I have Sony Grand Wega III LCD Rear Projection TV connected with DVI.

Anyone else having this similar problem?

I haven't had any problems like that; my DVR has been working very well. Sounds like there's something wrong with your box. What does Comcast say about it? Maybe they will replace it to see if that solves the problem.

I have continual freezes, sound loss and then pixelation for a few seconds. This happens about once every half-hour. I also never unplug or turn of the 6208. I'm moving next week and I'll speak to the installer when my service gets moved.

Rich N.

I have experienced this too, to some degree. What's odd is that it doesn't seem to effect whatever is being recorded. In other words, I can rewind the DVR and I won't see the pixelization/sound drop off that just occured. Which leads me to believe it's a firewire issue to my TV.

I have had my 6208 for over a month now I have had no daily lock ups at all and I never turn mine off either.

The only time I get pixelation or freezes is if I overtask it like set a recording, etc. Then I get that for just a few seconds and then it is just fine again. And I too have rewound the recording and not had the freeze or pixelation on the actual recording.

So to sum up, I am VERY pleased with my 6208 (though my ReplayTV units' interfaces are better) and have had no problems. I am thrilled that I can record HDTV and that the recording looks and sounds as stunning as it was live.

SonyHome, I would highly recommend that you have them switch it out with a replacement 6208 with a free service visit. I have never had to unplug or reset my dependable 6208.

Come to think of it, I only have two issues:

1) I wish it had a bigger harddrive (not actually an issue, more like a wish). If I owned it instead of rented it, I could swap the current harddrive for a bigger one like I have done with my ReplayTV units.

2) It still has the DVI "HDCP Compromised" bug that I talked about earlier, mentioned in my two quotes below. I keep hoping that they will correct it with a firmware upgrade. It still works through my DVI connection, but I have to do some things in the menu and then wait about two minutes until the error screen goes away. A pain, but still worth it.

Originally posted by Markito
I too have had the "Compromised" error message for the past few weeks and it is driving me CRAZY! I am sure that it has to do with HDCP and DVI, but my Panasonic PT-L500U front projector is fully HDCP compatible/compliant, so I should not be getting that.

What I get first is no picture at all (anymore) via DVI on my projector, then I go to the menu in my projector, change a certain setting, change it back and then exit the menu and then I get a picture, but with the big blue box and error blocking everything. Then I wait about one minute and then it disappears. But everytime I try to watch HD again via DVI, it appears again.


Originally posted by Markito
Here is a good explanation of the "HDCP Compromised" error. Apparently an automatically upgraded firmware glitch...

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,10302302~mode=flat

Originally posted by SonyHome
Hi Guys,
I got my 6208 DVR for about 2 weeks now and I'm having to unplug the thing once a day because it freezes up or locks up. Only way to recover from this is to unplug it. I leave my cablebox on all the time and only power off my TV each night.

I have Sony Grand Wega III LCD Rear Projection TV connected with DVI.

Anyone else having this similar problem? It took me three 6200's and three 6208's before I got one that would not freeze up. Sorry, they probably gave you one of the ones I had swapped out ;-) So far so good with the 6th box. Sorry you are having to deal with this problem...it is a bug in the box.

OK. Thanks for the feedback. I'll see if they'll replace out my unit with different one.

Thank you.

^Bump^

I said, "Yah, they'll probably add Discovery HD right after I discontinue my service (which will happen as soon as my HD-DirecTiVo arrives and is installed)."
LindaLuv said:
Just curious how you went about getting your HD Tivo? I am disappointed by the amount of HD programming on Comcast and the limitations of the moto 6208 and really looking hard at D* and HD Tivo. I could care less about Comcast adding Discovery HD...spiders and snakes in HD....ewwwww!I deposited $100 with ********************* on 3/31/04. Who knows when they'll ship it? (A DTiVo ordered by someone else from VE on 1/22/04 was received 6/22/04.)

Frank, does that mean Discovery HD is now available?

Never been closer...

C'mon, Bart! Weeks, days, what?

Good to see a sign of life here again.

Yeah, when?!?

Oh Bart?

No new news?

Nope no new news :(

Hey guys...just hooked up HD in Brooklyn Park. I was wondering if anyone knows if Comcast is passing along 5.1 on any of the local channels? I tried both an optical and digital coax into my 5.1 receiver (from my Moto 6200), but I couldn't get Cold Case, Law and Order, or Las Vegas to come in as anything other than Dolby 2.0. It's definitely digital sound, but not 5.1.

I was also thinking maybe this could be because I'm an analog cable subscriber with the HD package added on.

Any help would be much appreciated.

I don't recall, as I usually just watch INHD, INHD2, HBO, Showtime-HD & ESPN-HD, but I think I recall NBC's Jay Leno show in 5.1

I just noticed Discovery HD on Ch. 205!!

...wish I were home to check it out---can anyone confirm?

Wow!!!!!!!!!! That's great news!
After a painful wait and me bumping the thread a ton of times, we finally have something to celebrate.

I work out of the home, so I will check right now and report back in a few minutes.

O.k., so here's the deal...

It is true, we have a new HD channel at 205.

It is "Discovery HD Theater".

Now I've never seen an HD Discovery channel before, so I'm a bit confused.
Why "Theater"?

Methinks this isn't just the normal Discovery channel that happens to be in HD.

Is it a patchwork quilt of any of their programming from their other channels that just happen to be the HD stuff?

Is this the exact channel everyone was hoping for?

Is the HD Disc channel on satelite and OTA also called "Discovery HD Theater"?

Is this the only HD channel Discovery has?

PQ-wise, it looked like it was in high-def, but not as stunning as INHD. But then it may vary from show/source to show/source. But it is in high-def.

But despite my confusion, I'm thrilled to have another HD channel!

Thanks so much for "discover"ing it for us kip43!

I'm pretty sure it's the same channel that SAT has, don't know if it's offered OTA anywhere. My brother has Dish, so I'll give him a call and verify. Take a look at the website

Sorry, I need more than 3 posts for a link, so......

This should work http://dhd.discovery.com/schedule/weekly.jsp?channel=DHD

Yeah, that must be it.
See this...
http://gethdtheater.cablesource.net/

So I'm psyched!
Congrats all!

Originally posted by Markito
Yeah, that must be it.
See this...
http://gethdtheater.cablesource.net/

So I'm psyched!
Congrats all! My wife is so upset with me, I called home at lunch to let my sons know Discovery HD was up and running on 205..they have been inside all day watching the sammy :D

Glad we could help... enjoy the couch tonight! :D

Originally posted by Markito
Glad we could help... enjoy the couch tonight! :D I do enjoy Discovery HD on Comcast (America's Best Beaches 2004 was eye popping in HD for more than one reason) but it is so painful to watch the British Open on TNT analog and then this weekend, we are treated to watching The Open on good ol' KSTP analog. It seems like every sporting event I am interested in, Twins, Major golf championships, T'Wolves playoffs have all been on TNT analog, ABC analog, blacked out on INHD (Twinkies vs. Red Sox), or just simply not broadcast in HD (US Open on CBS, MLB All Star Game on FOX, Twins on FSN analog). And now that the Vikings have returned to Monday Night Football on ABC after a 3 year absence, I will be watching the analog broadcast of that game too. Any hope that Hubbard will work out a deal with Comcast any time soon? How about FSN HD? TNT HD? Sorry about the rant...I want my HDTV :(

I hear ya' tall. :(

A very reliable poster on these forums is saying "possibilities of three national" HD channels added by the end of the 2004 or in very early 2005.

Any chance one of them is HDNet?

Originally posted by blitzen102
A very reliable poster on these forums is saying "possibilities of three national" HD channels added by the end of the 2004 or in very early 2005.

Of course there are possibilities, but then there is the issue of likelihood. There aren't that many national HD channels to choose: HDNET/Movies, BravoHD, TNTHD, ENCOREHD, TMCHD.

I'm sure that the vast majority of Comcast HD subscribers would vote for HDNET/Movies. I'm semi-sure that the most likely are ENCOREHD and TMCHD because they come with movie packages, and would be cheaper for Comcast. I would think that we won't see anything except veiled rumors and wishful thinking until HD-VOD is in place (many areas don't have DiscoveryHD operating yet) and the 6412 HD-DVR has been released nation-wide.

Then we may really see some action. Better an optimist than a pessimist.

Rich N.

Couldn't it also include ABC-HD or PBS-HD?

Those aren't national HD channels. They depend on your local PBS system broadcasting a digital stream and your local ABC affiliate having an agreement with Comcast. In my market Sinclair won't reach agreement with Comcast over the FoxHD digital stream so we won't get FoxHD. However, my PBS station does broadcast digital, so we get the PBS national feed. And we get the other networks.

You should pressure both your local ABC station and Comcast to agree to have the signal on cable and check if your local PBS station broadcasts the digital stream. I hope your ABC station isn't owned by Sinclair or Cox, as they consistently won't let Comcast show their HD throughout the country.

Rich N.

No, our ABC affiliate (KSTP-TV) is privately owned by Stanley Hubbard and the Hubbard family.

I just read about the Discovery-HD.

Why doesn't comcast let us know that they've added a new HD channel! Now I'm wondering what other HD channels I have that I don't know about.

Originally posted by SonyHome
I just read about the Discovery-HD.

Why doesn't comcast let us know that they've added a new HD channel! Now I'm wondering what other HD channels I have that I don't know about. Don't depend on comcast to let you know about any new services. I visit here and http://www.hdtvtwincities.com/ for the latest developments with comcast.

Has anyone had their Display professionally calibrated? Did you use a local person? Any recommendations?

I have a front projector in my HT and I used my AVIA DVD and calibrated it myself.

There is a Comcast ad in today's (7-27-2004) StarTribune "A" section saying On Demand is "Coming Soon".

No details on programming.

Comcast in the Bay Area adds FSN-HD.

http://www.oaklandtribune.com/Stories/0,1413,82~10835~2297378,00.html

Hopefully this means Comcast Twin Cities will be getting FSN-HD Minnesota Soon.

Originally posted by tall1
Has anyone had their Display professionally calibrated? Did you use a local person? Any recommendations?

I had an indication from a guy named Pat Bradley in Apple Valley. I have a 70" Sony rear projection (KDF70XBR950) and he indicated a price of $475. This seems pretty expensive for an LCD rear projection, IMO. At the very least I am going to wait until I get a new DVD player, probably in a couple of months. Then I may shop around a little more for something more reasonable.

Wow $475! You could buy a new smaller tv for that! :)

Looks like we got another new channel. 176 PPVHD, looks like they have the Tyson-Williams fight on tonight for $44.95. I wonder how much they'll actually have on this channel, or will it just go away like the Fox Sports HD after the first round of the playoffs was over.

Interesting!
I was wondering if the Tyson fight would be available to us in HD.
But at $44.00, it's too rich for my blood.

Where did you find out about the new channel?

I have heard rumors of Video On Demand (VOD) coming soon to the twin cities. Any heard anything official, or closer than a total rumor???

I heard a radio commercial saying that we will have it on Comcast in a "few weeks". And someone here saw an ad just like that in the paper.

Phooey on channel 176, PPVHD -- looks like it'll show only PPV. And, Markito, that's $45 for the Tyson-Williams fight.

Also, phooey on VOD.

Still no HD for PBS or ABC, of course. But in a week or so I'll be watching superior PQ through my new HD-DirecTV, finally being delivered by VE after a more than 4-month wait. Then I'll no longer be a prisoner of Comcast, and I'll no longer be poking feebly at them through posts like this. ;)

The ONLY way to find a new Comcast channel is to sit around and flip through the program guide. Somebody will then make a post here or at http://hdtvtwincities.com/forumbb/index.php

You're never gonna get any info from any Comcast employee, because they find out the same way.

Man I am loving Discovery HD Theater.
They have so many interesting and visually stunny programs on.

Bump ("The Sea Monkey has my money")

Originally posted by berg0449
I have heard rumors of Video On Demand (VOD) coming soon to the twin cities. Any heard anything official, or closer than a total rumor???

A message was on my Comcast bill this month - "VOD Coming Soon!!".

When will Comcast have ABC HD? It's going to suck watching Monday Night Football without it!

Great news! Comcast has begun upgrading their firmware on the Moto 6208 (also 5100 & 6200) boxes to the new version 7.15.

They began the automatic upgrade downloads on August 6th and soon we will all have them. For the record, I don't yet have the upgrade, but I just spoke with someone locally at Comcast who read his official memo to me.

This upgrade corrects many bugs, including my biggest aggrivation, the DVI HDCP error that covers the screen with a blue box and warning for at least 30 seconds everytime I switch to HDTV.

Do any of you out there have the 7.15 fw upgrade yet?
Everybody report in here listing their box's model number, etc.

I'll start:

Markito: 6208 no 7.15 yet

6200 and 6208, both still at 7.10

Anybody else?

Originally posted by SonyHome
When will Comcast have ABC HD? It's going to suck watching Monday Night Football without it! I just dropped Comcast in favor of DirecTV (with TiVo), so I'll be getting KSTP-DT in high def over-the-air. Join me, won'tcha?

Markito I have two 6200,s on one I use DVI and the other I use IEEE.
The IEEE was upgraded about a week ago to
Firmware 07.15, the software is 51.89. I no longer get the blue box.
Also before the upgrade when I truned on TV the 6200 would also turn on.
After the upgrade the 6200 does not turn on when the TV is turned on.

Hmm. Interesting. Thanks for the info.

Mine still hasn't been updated. :-(

Originally posted by Syzygy
I just dropped Comcast in favor of DirecTV (with TiVo), so I'll be getting KSTP-DT in high def over-the-air. Join me, won'tcha?

What are you paying for your DirectTv service? Does it come with TiVo and is it HD capable? I had DirecTv before and I lost signal during heavy rain and snow and it was pain in the butt to get any kind of service from them without shelling out money.

I was paying $92.19 per month for cable (with HD, HBO and Starz!).
I'm now paying $53.05 per month for DirecTV (with HD, HBO and TiVo);
this will rise to about $74 after 6 months.

The breakdown:
• $26.99 -- Total Choice ($36.99 after 6 months)
• $04.99 -- Additional receiver
• $04.99 -- TiVo Service (one charge for all TiVos)
• $00.00 -- HD Package ($10.99 after 6 months)
• $12.00 -- HBO HDTV plus HBO's 8 SD channels (which I don't watch)
--------
• $48.97 -- $69.96 after 6 months -- plus about $4 sales tax

Without HBO (which I may drop because its HD isn't very sharp):
• $36.97 -- $57.96 after 6 months

[i][The above portion was corrected on 17 Aug 2004]

The HD Package is ESPN HD, Discovery HD Theater, HDNet and HDNet Movies.

The up-front cost (from *********************):
• $899.99 -- HD-DTiVo (DirecTV HR10-250)
• $039.99 -- SD-DTiVo (RCA DVR40)
• $089.99 -- Winegard SquareShooter OTA antenna
• $044.65 -- shipping
• $050.00 -- OTA antenna installation
------------
• $1124.62

About DirecTV's support:

After I discovered that local channel 29, WFTC-DT, was not coming in -- while channel "21-1" was -- so that there was no TiVo guide data for the station and no possibility of using TiVo's searching or season-pass features on its programs, I called HD TiVo Support, (800) 695-9251.

A supervisor in Alabama did two things for me: (1) He "escalated" the issue so that someone would contact WFTC and get them to install the PSIP equipment that they have sitting around. (2) At my suggestion that DTV could give me free locals to fill the gap between now and when WFTC gets their act together, he offered free locals for one month. I asked, how about 6 months, just as the HD package is currently free for 6 months. He agreed, reminding me that it would start costing $3 per month after the first 6 months.

I've got Comcast's total package or whatever they call it that includes cable, phone and internet. The basic charge is $100 a month, plus I think $10 for one HD Motorola box. On my main TV there is a built in tuner so I just have standard cable plus an indoor antenna which pulls in all of the local digital stations. When I first connected it I was surprised to see all of the public TV variants - including the HD channel, weather and kids stations I think there are 6 of them.

Anyway I think the only reason that I would switch to Dish or DTV would be to improve the picture quality of SD programming. I have 5 TV's connected now so the equipment cost would be pretty high. I would end up paying more monthly charges too as I would have to buy the cable internet and phone separately again. Right now I'm going to hold pat, but I would be interested, Frank, in your comments about your SD picture via DTV vs. what you were getting from Comcast.

Originally posted by Markito
Mine still hasn't been updated. :-(

Try unplugging it for 20-30 seconds and then plug it back in.

Thanks. I'll try it.

Does anyone see the NFL Network Channel(s) yet?

Originally posted by JBaumgart
I've got Comcast's total package or whatever they call it that includes cable, phone and internet. The basic charge is $100 a month, plus I think $10 for one HD Motorola box. On my main TV there is a built in tuner so I just have standard cable plus an indoor antenna which pulls in all of the local digital stations. When I first connected it I was surprised to see all of the public TV variants - including the HD channel, weather and kids stations I think there are 6 of them.

Anyway I think the only reason that I would switch to Dish or DTV would be to improve the picture quality of SD programming. I have 5 TV's connected now so the equipment cost would be pretty high. I would end up paying more monthly charges too as I would have to buy the cable internet and phone separately again. Right now I'm going to hold pat, but I would be interested, Frank, in your comments about your SD picture via DTV vs. what you were getting from Comcast. I have the total package (take 3 is what I think they call it) from ComLast also but the Cable/Internet are $99/month and then I get a separate bill for digital phone service of approx. $30. Is your phone service included on the same $100 invoice? Comcast told me they could not consolidate those 2 invoices...are all 3 services on one invoice?

They told me the same thing. I was even quite overdue paying my phone bill, because I assumed it was covered in my other Comcast invoice.

Originally posted by blitzen102
Does anyone see the NFL Network Channel(s) yet?
Any word on whether this will be, as rumored, in the "digital extra" tier? If so, I'll be passing (no pun intended) :).

Originally posted by tall1
I have the total package (take 3 is what I think they call it) from ComLast also but the Cable/Internet are $99/month and then I get a separate bill for digital phone service of approx. $30. Is your phone service included on the same $100 invoice? Comcast told me they could not consolidate those 2 invoices...are all 3 services on one invoice?

Right, they cannot include the phone bill with the cable and internet invoice. Looking at my last bill the phone was $34.61 and the other two including digital (expanded) cable, one HD box, "Cable Guard Wiring Plan" and taxes came to $93.13 - total of $127.74 for all three. Of this amount, $16.80 is for various taxes and fees which leaves $110.94 that goes to Comcast. This is pretty close to the $99 "Take 3" package price plus the extra $10/month for digital cable w/HD box.

Question - any word as to how many of the Vikings games this season might be in HD? With my OTA antenna on our main TV I'd be able to pick up any HD broadcast feed to the local channel.

Yeah how many Vikings games will be on Comcast HDTV channels?

Originally posted by JBaumgart
Question - any word as to how many of the Vikings games this season might be in HD? With my OTA antenna on our main TV I'd be able to pick up any HD broadcast feed to the local channel.

The first 5 will be in HD.

Per this link

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=189249

Fox will do the Week 1, Week 3, and Week 5 Vikings games in HD.

ABC (MNF) does Week 2.

Week 4 is a "bye" for the purple.

Week 6 is on ESPN-HD.

Originally posted by Markito
Mine still hasn't been updated. :-(

My firmware hasn't been updated yet either.

Does anyone know the status of the roll-out plans for the dual-tuner DVR boxes (I assume it'll be the 6408s)? They had said they would be available this fall.

Also, is everyone having as much trouble with NBC-HD as I am? Every time I tune in, it takes about 15-20 seconds for the box to be able to decode the signal. It gets pixelized and freezes, jumping from one scene to the next.

PS - If I see that Sony Wega commercial one more time, I think I'm going to puke. What the heck is NBC doing?!

I unplugged my box, waited and plugged it back in and still no update. :(

cielo, I agree, I can't wait until the 6408s come out. I spoke to a Comcast HD guy the other day and he said that it is still in internal Beta testing phase.

Almost all my channels do the pixelization thing for a few long painful seconds when I change the channels. I've read that the firmware update helps this, but we wouldn't know, would we.

And yes, what is with that Sony ad?!?!?! You're right, it's on every single commercial break! I think it will work against them. Arggggg! Get rid of it!

Originally posted by cielo
My firmware hasn't been updated yet either.

Does anyone know the status of the roll-out plans for the dual-tuner DVR boxes (I assume it'll be the 6408s)? They had said they would be available this fall.

Also, is everyone having as much trouble with NBC-HD as I am? Every time I tune in, it takes about 15-20 seconds for the box to be able to decode the signal. It gets pixelized and freezes, jumping from one scene to the next.

PS - If I see that Sony Wega commercial one more time, I think I'm going to puke. What the heck is NBC doing?! Mine hasn't been updated either. I rented a 6200 in addition to the 6208 to appease my wife. I was recording stuff when she wanted to watch a Lifetime movie (plots are all the same, wife kills husband or is plotting to kill him..I sleep with one eye open since Lifetime movies).

When you get the pixelation stuff, quickly hit pause and then play and the channel tunes right in. I have had to learn so many freakin workarounds for these moto boxes. I am sure I am going to have to learn several new ones when the 6412 boxes are released.

I hit record on the NBC-HD oh-limp-ic loop and after about an hour I start to play it back and hit skip (another 6208 hack) on the remote when the wega commercial comes on. Notice that Dream Machine HTIB audio setup in the commercial? Amazing someone would drop the kinda ching on a grand wega and use a dream machine for audio.

Originally posted by JBaumgart
"Cable Guard Wiring Plan" What is this? An optional protection plan for your wiring if it gets damaged?

My bill is about the same as your's. You had me going when you said you got all 3 for $100. I did the same analysis as you did when comparing DirectTV to Comcast. I almost pulled the trigger and bought a HD-Tivo but the 6208 became available the same week I placed my order. I cancelled and have not looked back. I am sure the HD-Tivo is amazing and life altering but I would never have the time to watch all the crap it would record. Plus, I rarely watch anything in SD anymore....unless it is the vikes on good ol' analog channel 5.

Originally posted by Markito
They told me the same thing. I was even quite overdue paying my phone bill, because I assumed it was covered in my other Comcast invoice. I did the same thing...past due. I pay all my bills electronically, I open mail about once every 6 weeks.

Originally posted by tall1
I did the same thing...past due. I pay all my bills electronically, I open mail about once every 6 weeks.

The same thing happened to me when I first switched to Comcast for phone service. They seemed surprised that I didn't realize it wouldn't be auto-paid along with my tv/internet bill. I bet they're not surprised by this problem anymore, given how many others have apparently made the same mistake. Now I'm back with Qwest for phone service since they lowered their prices below Comcast.

Tall1, thanks for the tip on the pixelization problem. I'll try it out. It happens with lots of channels, but NBC-HD takes FOREVER to recover. If the new firmware reduces this problem, I will be very happy.

Originally posted by cielo
The same thing happened to me when I first switched to Comcast for phone service. They seemed surprised that I didn't realize it wouldn't be auto-paid along with my tv/internet bill. I bet they're not surprised by this problem anymore, given how many others have apparently made the same mistake. Now I'm back with Qwest for phone service since they lowered their prices below Comcast.

Tall1, thanks for the tip on the pixelization problem. I'll try it out. It happens with lots of channels, but NBC-HD takes FOREVER to recover. If the new firmware reduces this problem, I will be very happy. I ddin't know qwest lowered their pricing for local phone service. So do you pay ala carte now for internet and cable? Or do they have a Take 2 plan?

The pause/play thing works just fine but it still bugs me I have to do it. I get so irratated with this stuff. I have a JVC 40K that I use to archive movies but it has some goofy firewire problems (more workarounds) that are fixed in 7.15. I am considering using DVI once the upgrade is done...I didn't even attempt it after I read all the problems with the HDCP handshake. I am still at 7.10.

You still get the Comcast discount ($15/mo) off internet service if you have cable tv service, so there wasn't any drawback to switching our phone service back to Qwest. I think Qwest offers a $5/mo discount off their DSL service when you also have their local phone service, but we decided to stay with Comcast for now.

Yes, the pause/play trick works on my box too. It's annoying to have to do it, but at least it works. Thanks!

I had to call Comcast today about a technical problem, so I asked them about the new DVR boxes. The CSR knew that they are coming in the near future, but unsurprisingly, he had no idea of a launch date, or even whether it will be the 6408 or the 6412 (keep your fingers crossed for the 6412, which has a 120GB hard drive). He also had no idea about a launch date for the NFL channel and no new information on ABC-HD or PBS-HD. Always the same story.

Thanks for checking c.

Originally posted by tall1
What is this? An optional protection plan for your wiring if it gets damaged?

It's an in-home warranty-type plan that covers you if modifications are necessary or if any problems arise with your wiring. It would seem to be a waste of money but for me it's more than paid for itself. For example, when I first got my big screen, I was happy with the picture, and they came out 3 or 4 times trying to improve it, trying various things. They finally ran a separate line to it from the box outside and I think it's as good as it's going to get. I also had them out to run a very difficult connection to a small LCD that we have on the center island in the kitchen - it was really tough getting the wire up in there from the basement, through rafters and up through the floor within the center island, but between the two of us we finally succeeded. Before that we just had rabbit ears on an older small set and having full cable on a thin screen that takes up almost zero room is a big plus. Anyway depending on how picky you are and how often you reconfigure things, this plan can be well worth it.

Originally posted by JBaumgart
It's an in-home warranty-type plan that covers you if modifications are necessary or if any problems arise with your wiring. Interesting stuff...I have never had a Comcast CSR try and upsell me on this deal. They need sales training from the BB and CC folks. I just assumed the Comcast installers do this type of wiring. My wife gets these guys to practically stand on their heads when they have made service calls. Lot's of complimentary rewiring on existing stuff but maybe not on new installs like you described.

Originally posted by tall1
Interesting stuff...I have never had a Comcast CSR try and upsell me on this deal. They need sales training from the BB and CC folks. I just assumed the Comcast installers do this type of wiring. My wife gets these guys to practically stand on their heads when they have made service calls. Lot's of complimentary rewiring on existing stuff but maybe not on new installs like you described.

Yeah, on several occasions when one of their guys was finishing up they noted that I have the plan so there would be no charge...I honestly don't know how much ahead I am because of it, but my intuition tells me it's quite a bit. Now that I think I'm all set for quite a while I'm thinking I'll drop it and save the $4 a month.

JBaumgart said:
I would be interested, Frank, in your comments about your SD picture via DTV vs. what you were getting from Comcast.Bear in mind that DTV is connected to my Sammy DLP through the DVI port, while Comcast had to use the component connections. There's good news and not-so-good news:

First, DTV's SD channels are all much sharper (relatively speaking), with better colors and higher contrast than the same channels from Comcast. I'm sure they'd be superior even if I was using the component connections.

However, I'm so spoiled by the PQ of HDNet and Discovery HD Theater (as well as the local channels) that I don't watch SD if I can help it. For example, I was addicted to both Stargate series on SciFi, but after about a week of DTV's HD, I cancelled my Season Passes to both of them. I'll see those shows in all their glory if and when they're delivered in HD.

I do still watch timely SD shows such as The Daily Show. Like the other channels, The Comedy Channel is much more satisfying to watch now that I'm getting it from DTV (via DVI).

JBaumgart said, wrt "Cable Guard Wiring Plan":
...they came out 3 or 4 times trying to improve it, trying various things. They finally ran a separate line to it from the box outside and I think it's as good as it's going to get.I think they would've done that part of the wiring change for nothing, without the plan. They buried my cable for nothing when I put in a swimming pool, and ten years later they replaced that buried cable because some channels weren't coming in very well. (That did help a little, but KSTP channel 5 remained extremely fuzzy and low-contrast, and they never fixed that. In fact, some Comcast employees said it was because the feed from KSTP was using a low-grade line -- while others strongly denied that possibility. I'm guessing there was a standoff between the two companies about who would pay for an upgrade -- just as there is now WRT KSTP's digital feed. And in both cases, Comcast has issued an omerta edict to its employees.)

Yeah, I have never had them charge me for any additional wiring either. Although my wife is usually the one who is here to let them in and she can be pretty demanding. Although it helps when she wears her bikini, like she did last time they were out (she has a trophy wife bod). That may have helped :D

Originally posted by Syzygy
Bear in mind that DTV is connected to my Sammy DLP through the DVI port, while Comcast had to use the component connections. There's good news and not-so-good news:

First, DTV's SD channels are all much sharper (relatively speaking), with better colors and higher contrast than the same channels from Comcast. I'm sure they'd be superior even if I was using the component connections.

However, I'm so spoiled by the PQ of HDNet and Discovery HD Theater (as well as the local channels) that I don't watch SD if I can help it. For example, I was addicted to both Stargate series on SciFi, but after about a week of DTV's HD, I cancelled my Season Passes to both of them. I'll see those shows in all their glory if and when they're delivered in HD.

I do still watch timely SD shows such as The Daily Show. Like the other channels, The Comedy Channel is much more satisfying to watch now that I'm getting it from DTV (via DVI).

Interesting. Sometimes I get tempted to try DTV or Dish, but then I think of the cost and complexity...with 5 TV's including the one that goes to the center island in the kitchen, it would be expensive. And then there's all those tuners. I really wish Comcast would find a way to improve their SD signal though, as it's the one thing that draws me to satellite. Or quicken the pace of the conversion to HD - at the current rate it will take 50 years before most good programming is in HD. Shoot, I'd even settle for ED or DVD quality, but sometimes their SD programs look about as bad as a VHS tape. Like you, I try to watch OTA HD programming as often as possible, but I won't watch just anything just for the picture....well, not most of the time anyway. ;)

Originally posted by Syzygy
I think they would've done that part of the wiring change for nothing, without the plan. They buried my cable for nothing when I put in a swimming pool, and ten years later they replaced that buried cable because some channels weren't coming in very well. (That did help a little, but KSTP channel 5 remained extremely fuzzy and low-contrast, and they never fixed that. In fact, some Comcast employees said it was because the feed from KSTP was using a low-grade line -- while others strongly denied that possibility. I'm guessing there was a standoff between the two companies about who would pay for an upgrade -- just as there is now WRT KSTP's digital feed. And in both cases, Comcast has issued an omerta edict to its employees.)

The line is a little fuzzy as to what the plan covers, and I think it also depends on the individual tech that they send over. And without a trophy bod there's little chance I could talk my way out of a major repair bill...
:rolleyes:

I assure you, Mrs. Trophy Bod is more expensive than $4/month. You are miles ahead.

LOL!!! Great stuff!

JBaumgart said:
...but then I think of the cost and complexity...with 5 TV's including the one that goes to the center island in the kitchen, it would be expensive. And then there's all those tuners.Please consider the possibility of dispensing with a couple of those TVs. For instance, when my wife or I are working in the kitchen, we wouldn't have the opportunity to watch a TV. If kids demand TVs in their rooms, ignore them. (TiVo has made me realize that TVs are very poor sources of background noise.)

Forgive me if I seemed to be taking a superior tone just now. I'm a TV-holic, as is my wife, but each of us gravitates to one of two TVs; there's simply no need here for a third or a fourth.

I posted this question over at HDTV Twin Cities (a great website btw) but I think it may get lost in the subchannel and antenna discussion so I thought I will ask it here.

I was watching the NFL preseason game on FOX which did a nice job on the 480p. I am anxiously awaiting Sept. 12th when they debut the NFL in HD. But the thing that concerns me is the moving thin white line at the top of my screen. Does anyone else see this? Drives me nuts. I am hoping this will disappear once they broadcast in HD. I have noticed the local feed does not have this line anymore.

Anyone know anything at all about this annoying white line on FOX?

EDIT: A big thank you to Syzygy! He sent me a response on HDTV Twin Cities forum on how to change the POS-Y in the service menu on my HLP. Problem fixed!

Tall1 and I both use the same monikers in both forums (HDTV Twin Cities and this one). Here's what I posted over there...

Yeah, I see it (actually, them -- a bunch of shifting white horizontal lines) at the top right of the screen in Fox's The Simpsons. It bothered me a lot too. I'm getting Fox digital over the air.

I fixed it in my Samsung HLN507W by entering its Service Menu and changing POS-Y in the DDP1010 section from 16 to 23. This left Fox's letterboxing more or less centered vertically, but now HBO's letterboxing is higher than ever.

(To enter the Samsung HLM/HLN/HLP Service Menu, turn off the TV and press Mute-1-8-2-Power in quick succession; you should first turn Melody off in the user menu to allow entering the Service Menu from the power-on state without using a lamp cycle.)

P.S. --

Don't admit to Samsung that you tweaked the SM (even though this particular tweak should be perfectly harmless)... An AVS forum member reported they wouldn't do some work under warranty because he went into the SM.

Originally posted by Syzygy
Don't admit to Samsung that you tweaked the SM (even though this particular tweak should be perfectly harmless)... An AVS forum member reported they wouldn't do some work under warranty because he went into the SM. I will heed this warning. Thank you again. I think I did read a couple of posts that recommended not even disclosing the firmware version to a Samsung CSR. They get very suspicious that you have been messing with the SM.

Originally posted by Syzygy
Please consider the possibility of dispensing with a couple of those TVs. For instance, when my wife or I are working in the kitchen, we wouldn't have the opportunity to watch a TV. If kids demand TVs in their rooms, ignore them. (TiVo has made me realize that TVs are very poor sources of background noise.)

Forgive me if I seemed to be taking a superior tone just now. I'm a TV-holic, as is my wife, but each of us gravitates to one of two TVs; there's simply no need here for a third or a fourth.

Well, every family is different I guess - we have them spread out throughout the house for convenience, and with Comcast it hasn't cost us any more than it would for one set. If ever I did go with satellite all the way around, I'd have to consider the loss of convenience of not having two or three of these TV's, plus the additional cost of buying the equipment. Rigth now I'm going to stay with what we have.

Bump. ("Yes I'm a natural blue.")

Originally posted by JBaumgart
I really wish Comcast would find a way to improve their SD signal though, as it's the one thing that draws me to satellite. Or quicken the pace of the conversion to HD - at the current rate it will take 50 years before most good programming is in HD. Shoot, I'd even settle for ED or DVD quality, but sometimes their SD programs look about as bad as a VHS tape. Like you, I try to watch OTA HD programming as often as possible, but I won't watch just anything just for the picture....well, not most of the time anyway. ;)

Complain to Comcast. The picture of the analog channels should look good. If your Bravo channel's PQ is terrible (Channel 96 for me -- used to be the "snowiest") call Comcast. They will check your install -- they had to do a complete re-install of the cable going to my house because it was not "up to code" (Comcast's "code", I'm guessing). It didn't cost me one cent.

Yeah, complain to Comcast. Maybe they'll fix your problem. In my case, they made some channels clearer, but there was nothing they could do for KSTP's picture because the weak feed from the station would never be upgraded until (I suspect) KSTP paid for the upgrade.

Originally posted by blitzen102
Complain to Comcast. The picture of the analog channels should look good. If your Bravo channel's PQ is terrible (Channel 96 for me -- used to be the "snowiest") call Comcast. They will check your install -- they had to do a complete re-install of the cable going to my house because it was not "up to code" (Comcast's "code", I'm guessing). It didn't cost me one cent.

I've had them out more times than I can count, and some of the techs were able to improve things from where it once was. It's quite watchable now, and I think now it's about as good as it's going to get. Even so, I still often find myself watching mediocre HD programming rather than put up with mediocre SD picture quality.

This morning I was going to tape something I recorded previously to the 6208 and flipped to the component input of my JVC 40K. The picture was so clear with no breakups I thought I had the wrong input. I was totally confused until I saw the menu for the JVC display on screen. It was surreal and so I thought...hmmm, I wonder if the FW was upgraded to 7.15? Low and behold both boxes, 6208 and 6200 were upgraded to 7.15. Just played back a movie I taped with my 40K and it had maybe 2 audio dropouts. Going to try DVI next...this is great!

tall1,
That's great news. Guess what?!? They must finally be rolling it out, because I turned mine on today and mine has been updated to 7.15 too!

I know this because I no longer have the incredibly frustrating DVI HDCP handshake error blocking my view and best of all, I can flip through all the channels WITHOUT any of the pixelization holding me hostage!

I am sooooooo happy with these two changes!

Whoo hoo!

Thanks for the heads up.

Originally posted by Markito
tall1,
That's great news. Guess what?!? They must finally be rolling it out, because I turned mine on today and mine has been updated to 7.15 too!

I know this because I no longer have the incredibly frustrating DVI HDCP handshake error blocking my view and best of all, I can flip through all the channels WITHOUT any of the pixelization holding me hostage!

I am sooooooo happy with these two changes!

Whoo hoo!

Thanks for the heads up. Oh yeah, I forgot about the pixelation thing when switching channels...that is cool. Isn't it interesting we get so used to failure with HDTV that when something is fixed and actually works as intended we think it must be screwed up? There must be a name for it. Highdephobia?

NFL network on comcast twin cities today, channel 180

Is the NFL network pay channel? I have digital classic and I don't see anything on 180.

INHD - Tuesday, September 7, 2004
7:00PM ET / 4:00PM PT
MLB: 09/07 Twins @ Orioles
The Minnesota Twins take on the Baltimore Orioles. Subject to local blackout.

"Subject to local blackout." Vendors of substandard, fuzzy SD conspiring to try to force us to watch their @%$#!* commercials. Well, I'm not watching any of their fuzzy crap.