I fixed my antenna reception problems. I figured it out when I started flipping circuit breakers in the basement. The coax runs down the side of the house by the bedroom window. And guess what is in the window – an air conditioner. Air conditioner on = bad interference. Air conditioner off = happy TV. I guess a big metal fan spinning next to a transmission line would do that…

:)

Hello, all. I am moving to an apartment next to Boston Common in just a couple weeks. I know nothing of the Boston area broadcast stations. If I want to pull an HD signal out of the air, is that going to be possible from my location? What channels would I most likely be able to pull in? Anyone have a recommendation for a powered antenna to buy that would be adequate for this purpose. I have cable back here in Georgia, so I'm kind of new to all this.

Anyone having reception issues with WFXT-DT (25.1) during tonight's Colts-Rams preseason game? My reception goes in and out.

Anyone having reception issues with WFXT-DT (25.1) during tonight's Colts-Rams preseason game? My reception goes in and out.

I didnt check, I was watching the Sox LOOSE another game on NESN HD from D*

:(

Anyone having reception issues with WFXT-DT (25.1) during tonight's Colts-Rams preseason game? My reception goes in and out.
Didn't watch last night's game on FOX, but I had been having the same problems as you with 25.1 (see other posts in this thread; FOX is xmitting at very limited power)...bought a ChannelMaster pre-amp and that solved the low signal problem!

Hello, all. I am moving to an apartment next to Boston Common in just a couple weeks. I know nothing of the Boston area broadcast stations. If I want to pull an HD signal out of the air, is that going to be possible from my location? What channels would I most likely be able to pull in? Anyone have a recommendation for a powered antenna to buy that would be adequate for this purpose. I have cable back here in Georgia, so I'm kind of new to all this.

I dunno..if you live next to Boston Common you can afford cable I guess. :)

For over the air - you are 10-15 miles from broadcast source with many

high buildings which may or may not block/multipath the signal.

Many places have Cable etc. built in...maybe other services as well.

Hello, all. I am moving to an apartment next to Boston Common in just a couple weeks. I know nothing of the Boston area broadcast stations. If I want to pull an HD signal out of the air, is that going to be possible from my location? What channels would I most likely be able to pull in? Anyone have a recommendation for a powered antenna to buy that would be adequate for this purpose. I have cable back here in Georgia, so I'm kind of new to all this.

generally, you will probably not have a problem. although you are not especially close to the broadcast towers, i think most boston market stations would try to adjust their coverage to cover the city.

i live in cambridge, and i get all the major stations except fox, which i can get, but is so unreliable as to be useless. i suspect your results should be similar, but your location and elevation, and locations of nearby trees and buildings will have a big influence.

there are websites out there (such as antennaweb.org) which will tell you what type of antenna is recommended for receiving various stations from a given geographic location, but obviously they can't completely account for location details like trees and buildings.

Question for Bob Yankowitz

Given the cramped bandwidth situation at Comcast and the lack of HD programming on the "indie" 38 come September, what is your understanding of Comcast's plans regarding Ch 838? Will they keep it up or give the space to someone else?

Question for Bob Yankowitz

Given the cramped bandwidth situation at Comcast and the lack of HD programming on the "indie" 38 come September, what is your understanding of Comcast's plans regarding Ch 838? Will they keep it up or give the space to someone else?
Dang. Wouldn't you know my crystal ball just went into the shop last week? And Comcast last told me their future plans, oh... never!

If someone higher up than me in my organization (which is just about everyone) knows something I'll be sure to pass it along.

Anyone else notice the ~2" wide blue side bars on CBS' broadcasts tonight? What's up with that? By the time I noticed (I was in the other room while my wife was watching Big Brother) and switched the aspect ratio of my Pio-1130HD, there was a slight bit of IR on the screen...nothing permanent, just annoying. :mad:

I just posted this in the Providence section as well regarding TV38's plans for showing Jeopardy and Wheel of Fortune in HD:

For those of you who are Jeopardy or Wheel of Fortune fans, I just got the following information from WSBK, TV38.

Jeopardy and Wheel of Fortune are going to be recorded in HD when they both start their new season's production for airing beginning in September. WSBK is working on getting the necessary equipment to broadcast in HD. They do not expect to have anything ready at the start of the season, but they expect to be in HD in December. If I hear any more I will let you know.

SMK

Heads up:

For the next few days (up to a week or so) we will be performing maintenance on our HDTV antenna, which means we will be off the air from midnight to around 5am. Work will begin tonight. The stations affected will be:

WBZ-DT (4)
WSBK-DT (38)
WCVB-DT (5)
WGBH-DT (2)
WGBX-TV (44 - Analog)
WGBX-DT (44)

I'll let you know when the work is complete. Apologies for the inconvenience to the late-owls.

Appreciate the heads up Bob.


On another note, my gf and I are going OTA only starting next week since Deadwood and Entourage have their season finale's next Sunday night. It'll be interesting but I think it will work. Maybe we'll trade in Comcast for Netflix.

Yabbut a new season of The Wire starts up in a week or two.

I recently went through a couple months of unemployment. At the time, I was thinking of drastically scaling back on my cable offerings, but dang if HBO doesn't do a great job of keeping the interesting shows coming, one at a time. (Although I'm pretty well done with The Sopranos.)

Good luck on your cold turkey.

Think of that: Watching TV without a monthly bill. What a concept!

Just getting rid of NESN (and those shameful Sox) is reason enough to drop Comcast.

Just getting rid of NESN (and those shameful Sox) is reason enough to drop Comcast.

There almost as bad as the Hokies will be this year.

There almost as bad as the Hokies will be this year.
Steve, I hope you didn't waste your money on the new D* equipment to get NESNHD!

Steve, I hope you didn't waste your money on the new D* equipment to get NESNHD!

No I haven't made the plunge I am actually hoping that FIOS shows up in Walpole not to far down the road. I have had D* 11 years now and they just seem to getting worse instead of better. I can't belive they still haven't released their new DVR except in LA. Sunday Ticket use to be the 1 thing that kept me at D* but now with all the games on OTA and and NFL Network the Sunday ticket is not what it used to be and is just plain getting to expensive so this will be my last year of ST and the 1 reason D* had me. I refuse to get locked into a 2 year agreement with them.

Where have you been haven't seen you on here much?

Where have you been haven't seen you on here much?I just started getting e-mail notification on subscribed threads again recently. I stopped visiting AVS except occasionally browsing. It's almost as if someone didn't want me coming in?

I just started getting e-mail notification on subscribed threads again recently. I stopped visiting AVS except occasionally browsing. It's almost as if someone didn't want me coming in?


Well welcome back I can't imagine anybody trying to shut you out. I hear you though I go through times where I get tired of all the same stuff over and over again. This is a great site though and will never not visit.

Should be a great year for CFB HD this year with ABC doing games in primtime. I remember when CBS was the only HD game of the week when I got my 1st HD TV. I just got the new 58 inch HP DLP it is amazing football is fantastic on it.

Well welcome back I can't imagine anybody trying to shut you out. I hear you though I go through times where I get tired of all the same stuff over and over again. This is a great site though and will never not visit.

Should be a great year for CFB HD this year with ABC doing games in primtime. I remember when CBS was the only HD game of the week when I got my 1st HD TV. I just got the new 58 inch HP DLP it is amazing football is fantastic on it.
I never thought the color was very good on Ch.5's MNF. Glad to see it on ESPN and SNF on NBC7. I only wish someone at ch.7 would flip the DD 5.1 switch for football. I'm pretty certain NBC is sending a 5.1 signal for the games, and I know ch.7 has 5.1 capability since many of the primetime drama programs are passed along in 5.1. I think CBS4 still does the best HD job on the football games. And now I can see more HOKIEHD since Comcast picked up ESPN2HD. Don't want to jinx the Pats but I think we're looking at another SB championship even without #4.

Hi. I was hoping to hear from some people in the boston area about directv's H20 box the local channels in HD via MPEG-4? Directv is offering a good package:

H20 box
5 lnb dish
4 months free of HD

but I wanted to check to see if anyone has an h20 and is receiving their locals via it. How is the quality.. any issues.. etc.. Thank you.

Hi. I was hoping to hear from some people in the boston area about directv's H20 box the local channels in HD via MPEG-4? Directv is offering a good package:

H20 box
5 lnb dish
4 months free of HD

but I wanted to check to see if anyone has an h20 and is receiving their locals via it. How is the quality.. any issues.. etc.. Thank you.
tafkap......
I've had the H20/AT-9 combo for about 7 months now in central NH (just east of Concord).....There were some audio/sync issues early on, especially with WHDH-DT (Channel 7), but these all have cleared up; some of the problems were with the individual stations' encoders, NOT D* itself....
Overall, I have to say I'm quite satisfied with the HD-LILs from D*....I also have E* (VIP411 with a Dish 500 for 110/119 and a second 500 for 61.5) and the HD-LILs look fine here, also....IMHO, not a noticeable difference in PQ between the 2 services (OK....others will probably dispute this....YMMV.... ;) ). FWIW, I was able to "cash in" on 6 months of free HD when I came on board with my D* upgrade; it's all in the timing, I guess -- you have to "hit" the promotional "window" just right.... :D Sounds like a good deal with 4 months, though (I had to PAY for my AT-9!!). Good luck!

I've had the H20/AT-9 combo for about 3 weeks. I also get most Boston stations OTA so can do a direct comparison. I can't say I've watched a lot of the locals in those 3 weeks, and a casual switch back and forth between D* and OTA they look about the same for PQ. However with some programming, noticeably football and baseball, there is a distinct jitter on the D* MPEG-4 locals. This has been mentioned before in other threads - in fact I think the problem has its own thread. I've watched a fair amouth of Red Sox on D* NESN-HD and the problem is very noticeable there.

_Paul

Hi there,
I live in East Sandwich and have the HD D* package since January. I have the HD Tivo Recorder right now (which I love) but only have the following HD channels: HBO, TNT, Discovery, and UHD. I watch (tivo) a lot of primetime TV, especially Fox and it is so annoying that I'm paying all of this money for HD and not getting my favorite shows! :eek: I was going to get an OTA antenna but have heard that I may be too far away for it to help. Does anyone near me have one or do you think it will help me (antennaweb said I'm 57.3 miles away from most of the channels in Boston)? Which one do you recommend? I know they have a newer HD dish out that could get me the channels but I have very iffy things about it so if I don't want to get it.
Does anyone have any other advice or recommendations for me; I really appreciate your help!

Michelle

Hi there,
I live in East Sandwich... I was going to get an OTA antenna but have heard that I may be too far away for it to help. Does anyone near me have one or do you think it will help me (antennaweb said I'm 57.3 miles away from most of the channels in Boston)? Which one do you recommend? Does anyone have any other advice or recommendations for me; I really appreciate your help!

Michelle

Michelle,
I live 50+ miles away in Southern Rhode Island and receive all of the Boston channels via OTA for the past few years. I am not certain how the reception is in your area, but I am sure someone close by will speak up.

BTW, I use this indoor/outdoor amplified antenna inside a 4th floor condo:
http://www.starkelectronic.com/wgs2000.htm
[Winegard GS2200]

P.S. You didn't list the ESPN or HDNet HD channels---do you not watch/receive those?


Keith

Hi Keith,
Yes, I do watch those but the most annoying thing in the world is when the Red Sox are at home playing on HDESPN but that's the only time I can't watch the channel b/c of damn NESN. Not that I don't love Jerry Remy b/c I do, but that drives me crazy! And yes I do get HDNET too, which they're all good, but I watch a lot of local channels and it just stinks knowing I'm paying all of that money and not getting most of what I watch in high def.
Thanks for sharing what you use, and hopefully you are right and more people near me will be gracious enough to chime in. Take care!

Hi there,
I live in East Sandwich and have the HD D* package since January. I have the HD Tivo Recorder right now (which I love) but only have the following HD channels: HBO, TNT, Discovery, and UHD. I watch (tivo) a lot of primetime TV, especially Fox and it is so annoying that I'm paying all of this money for HD and not getting my favorite shows! :eek: I was going to get an OTA antenna but have heard that I may be too far away for it to help. Does anyone near me have one or do you think it will help me (antennaweb said I'm 57.3 miles away from most of the channels in Boston)? Which one do you recommend? I know they have a newer HD dish out that could get me the channels but I have very iffy things about it so if I don't want to get it.
Does anyone have any other advice or recommendations for me; I really appreciate your help!

Michelle

I'm 45 miles south of Boston in Plymouth. I have the H20/5LNB but use OTA for HD locals because they are better than MPEG4. I use a CM4228 in the attic and get all 4 networks perfectly plus some others. I am on a hill. I like the H20's but also have an HR10-250 they gave me for free for some recording. I can't wait for the HR20 (MPEG4 DVR) but hope the OTA is operable. My recommendation is get the H20 but also use OTA if possible. H20 is needed for HDNESN but as others mentioned it's a jittery picture. I much prefer D* over Adelphia but may reconcider if comcast ever comes into town.

I have a cottage in Wareham which is 48 miles from the Needham antenna farm. I recently put a Yagi antenna on the roof and bought my first digital TV. All the Boston stations are received just fine except 25 and 38. 25 (31) is OK 95+% of the time, but 38 (39) is only receivable about 40% of the time. Even though my TV says that the signal strength is 85%, it just won't display any picture most of the time. Is it a weak station? Even analog-38 isn't clear. Could it possibly be because there's a New Haven station broadcasting on channel 39 that's 117 miles away. Could they be interefering with each other?

I have a cottage in Wareham which is 48 miles from the Needham antenna farm. I recently put a Yagi antenna on the roof and bought my first digital TV. All the Boston stations are received just fine except 25 and 38. 25 (31) is OK 95+% of the time, but 38 (39) is only receivable about 40% of the time. Even though my TV says that the signal strength is 85%, it just won't display any picture most of the time. Is it a weak station? Even analog-38 isn't clear. Could it possibly be because there's a New Haven station broadcasting on channel 39 that's 117 miles away. Could they be interefering with each other?
WSBK's output power is a bit reduced compared to the other Boston stations (though it is higher than channel 25 and 56's DTV's). Normally it isn't reduced enough to make a difference for most viewers, but it may in your case because of your distance. I am located 43.1 miles to the tower (at my house in New Bedford), and I can receive all channels, including 25 and 56.
I wouldn't be concerned about the New Haven station. At that distance and direction it would not have an effect, and if it did it would affect me before it got you.

Heads up:

For the next few days (up to a week or so) we will be performing maintenance on our HDTV antenna, which means we will be off the air from midnight to around 5am. Work will begin tonight. The stations affected will be:

WBZ-DT (4)
WSBK-DT (38)
WCVB-DT (5)
WGBH-DT (2)
WGBX-TV (44 - Analog)
WGBX-DT (44)

I'll let you know when the work is complete. Apologies for the inconvenience to the late-owls.
Update
We are taking a break from the antenna maintenance for a few weeks, so there will be no further overnight interruptions for a while.

Has anyone else noticed a complete lack of closed captioning on WSBK-DT?

There's closed captioning for every other major -DT in the area, and I can switch to WSBK analog and see captioning, but on WSBK-DT I can't get captioning on any show I've tried.

What's going on here?

Has anyone else noticed a complete lack of closed captioning on WSBK-DT?

There's closed captioning for every other major -DT in the area, and I can switch to WSBK analog and see captioning, but on WSBK-DT I can't get captioning on any show I've tried.

What's going on here?
I've just checked it, and it seems to be fine.

I've just checked it, and it seems to be fine.
Yet I still can't get it. How is this possible? Is anyone else unable to get closed captioning on WSBK-DT? Is it possible that something about the captioning stream is incompatible with certain receivers? What are you using to test it, RYankowitz? I only have one LG HDTV with which to test, and though I can get closed captioning on WGBH-DT, WBZ-DT, WCVB-DT, WHDH-DT, WFXT-DT, WGBX-DT, WLVI-DT, and on various analog stations, including WSBK, I still can't get any on WSBK-DT. This is a mystery that needs solving.

Yet I still can't get it. How is this possible? Is anyone else unable to get closed captioning on WSBK-DT? Is it possible that something about the captioning stream is incompatible with certain receivers? What are you using to test it, RYankowitz? I only have one LG HDTV with which to test, and though I can get closed captioning on WGBH-DT, WBZ-DT, WCVB-DT, WHDH-DT, WFXT-DT, WGBX-DT, WLVI-DT, and on various analog stations, including WSBK, I still can't get any on WSBK-DT. This is a mystery that needs solving.


I'm able to get CC on WSBK-DT using an LG receiver (not TV).

I'm not sure what the options are on your TV and I have no idea what the settings are on my receiver (as I do not use the CC option), but with WSBK-DT I had to set the CC option to "Analog-Caption1". The 'Digital-Service1" does not appear to work on my receiver for WSBK-DT the same way it does for the other digital channels. You may want to mess around with the CC options on your TV and see what you can get. But to back up what RYankowitz said, CC is available on WSBK-DT.

I'm able to get CC on WSBK-DT using an LG receiver (not TV).

I'm not sure what the options are on your TV and I have no idea what the settings are on my receiver (as I do not use the CC option), but with WSBK-DT I had to set the CC option to "Analog-Caption1". The 'Digital-Service1" does not appear to work on my receiver for WSBK-DT the same way it does for the other digital channels. You may want to mess around with the CC options on your TV and see what you can get. But to back up what RYankowitz said, CC is available on WSBK-DT.
Thank you, sonofjay, I believe you have found the nature of the problem.

My LG TV has no option to choose between analog and digital captioning. It has one setting to turn captioning on and off, and another setting called "Caption/Text". This second setting is strange, because it sometimes offers English/Spanish/French as options, and other times it offers CC1/CC2/CC3/CC4/Text1/Text2/Text3/Text4 as options. I believe, based on what you said, that it uses the digital captioning signal if it is present, offering the English/Spanish/French option set, and uses the analog captioning signal if the digital one is not present, thus offering the CC1/CC2/CC3/CC4/Text1/Text2/Text3/Text4 option set.

I must conclude that WBGH-DT, WCVB-DT, and WLVI-DT are transmitting a digital captioning signal which contains captioning, and that WBZ-DT, WHDH-DT, WFXT-DT, and WGBX-DT are not transmitting a digital captioning signal at all, causing my TV to fall back to the analog signal, but that WSBK-DT is alone in sending both an analog captioning signal which actually contains captions, AND a digital captioning signal that contains nothing whatsoever, rendering it impossible to watch WSBK-DT with captioning on an LG 37LC2D television.

RYankowitz, can you confirm this hypothesis?

Thank you, sonofjay, I believe you have found the nature of the problem.

My LG TV has no option to choose between analog and digital captioning. It has one setting to turn captioning on and off, and another setting called "Caption/Text". This second setting is strange, because it sometimes offers English/Spanish/French as options, and other times it offers CC1/CC2/CC3/CC4/Text1/Text2/Text3/Text4 as options. I believe, based on what you said, that it uses the digital captioning signal if it is present, offering the English/Spanish/French option set, and uses the analog captioning signal if the digital one is not present, thus offering the CC1/CC2/CC3/CC4/Text1/Text2/Text3/Text4 option set.

I must conclude that WBGH-DT, WCVB-DT, and WLVI-DT are transmitting a digital captioning signal which contains captioning, and that WBZ-DT, WHDH-DT, WFXT-DT, and WGBX-DT are not transmitting a digital captioning signal at all, causing my TV to fall back to the analog signal, but that WSBK-DT is alone in sending both an analog captioning signal which actually contains captions, AND a digital captioning signal that contains nothing whatsoever, rendering it impossible to watch WSBK-DT with captioning on an LG 37LC2D television.

RYankowitz, can you confirm this hypothesis?
Your analysis is a good guess, and almost correct. WBZ-DT (and most of the other Boston DTV stations) transmits both analog and digital captions. WSBK-DT is only transmitting analog captions. There is no digital closed-caption signal transmitted for WSBK-DT.

Some sets, such as a JVC we have at the TV station, have a Closed Caption menu with a choice of caption types. On the JVC, the types are Basic, Advanced, and Auto, which correspond to analog, digital, and both. In the case of Auto, or both, the digital caption will be displayed if present, otherwise the analog, if present. It appears to me your set is locked on the digital captions. The menu where you can change this may be hidden in a different location than the one you have described, as it is in the JVC (it is under the "Initial Setup" menu).

One more point. I have a Sony HDTV set-top box which behaves strangely with some captions. When it detects digital captions it will display them, but turning the caption setting to off will display analog captions! The only way to turn captions off entirely is to set the box to display an unused caption format, such as "Service 2" (the digital equivalent of CC2). Your set may be equally quirky, so you may have to experiment.

Good hunting!

Hey there, I just wanted to thank the people that have responded to my question about over the air antennas out here in Cape Cod. If I must get one for 57 miles away, do I have to get one of those huge butt ugly antennas. Are there any of them that look small and quaint that would do the trick? How about the antennas that clip on to the satellite dish, are they any good? I know Channel Master and Winegard are good but are there any out there that aren't so monstrously ugly? THanks in advance for helping me out!!

The clip on antennas are usually worthless and only work if the satellite is pointing the same direction as the TV transmitters--not the case if you are on the Cape. You will likely need an ugly antenna. However, you might get away with putting that ugly antenna in your attic, so only you know about it. I am about 40 miles from the transmitting towers and have my antenna in the attic just lying on the joists pointing the right direction with no amplifier. You might be able to do the same, but you'd have to try it to see. If it doesn't work, it might with an amplifier.

SMK

My apologies if this was addressed before, but I couldn't find anything searching previous threads. Anyway, I'm in a 3rd floor apartment in Somerville and I need to purchase a small, indoor OTA antenna for my local HD broadcasts. From what I can tell, everything is being broadcast from Needham, which is about 15 miles from my apartment. I was considering the Zenith ZHDTV1 which I have read excellent reviews on. As far as I can tell, the Zenith antenna only supports UHF broadcasts. For the local Boston HDTV broadcasts, I assume that would only include Fox (25) UPN (38), etc and not any of the major networks (CBS, ABC, NBC) that are in channel range 4-7, is that correct?? If so, can anyone recommend an inexpensive, small indoor antenna that is capable of pulling in all of the local HDTV broadcasts (both UHF and VHF).

Thanks very much for the help.

I am quite sure all the HD stations in this market are in the UHF band, thus a VHF antenna is not needed to pull them in....Ch 2.1,2.2 ,4.1,5.1.5.2,7.1,25.1(weak power level) will come in on the UHF if positioned properly.....

My apologies if this was addressed before, but I couldn't find anything searching previous threads. Anyway, I'm in a 3rd floor apartment in Somerville and I need to purchase a small, indoor OTA antenna for my local HD broadcasts. From what I can tell, everything is being broadcast from Needham, which is about 15 miles from my apartment. I was considering the Zenith ZHDTV1 which I have read excellent reviews on. As far as I can tell, the Zenith antenna only supports UHF broadcasts. For the local Boston HDTV broadcasts, I assume that would only include Fox (25) UPN (38), etc and not any of the major networks (CBS, ABC, NBC) that are in channel range 4-7, is that correct?? If so, can anyone recommend an inexpensive, small indoor antenna that is capable of pulling in all of the local HDTV broadcasts (both UHF and VHF).

Thanks very much for the help.
As the previous poster stated all Boston digitals are transmitted on UHF. Any good VHF/UHF set-top antenna should work for you provided you have line of sight to Needham through a window in the room the TV is in. If you don't, no antenna will work.

My apologies if this was addressed before, but I couldn't find anything searching previous threads. Anyway, I'm in a 3rd floor apartment in Somerville and I need to purchase a small, indoor OTA antenna for my local HD broadcasts. From what I can tell, everything is being broadcast from Needham, which is about 15 miles from my apartment. I was considering the Zenith ZHDTV1 which I have read excellent reviews on. As far as I can tell, the Zenith antenna only supports UHF broadcasts. For the local Boston HDTV broadcasts, I assume that would only include Fox (25) UPN (38), etc and not any of the major networks (CBS, ABC, NBC) that are in channel range 4-7, is that correct?? If so, can anyone recommend an inexpensive, small indoor antenna that is capable of pulling in all of the local HDTV broadcasts (both UHF and VHF).

Thanks very much for the help.

I've just moved to Somerville - Davis Sq area this past week and using my Terk HDTVa indoor antenna (the one with the built in amplifier) I get all the stations and I'm on the first floor. I think I had to compromise and accept all the stations at around 80 to 85% signal strength since I couldn't quite get them all in otherwise. Getting 100% on a number of the stations meant getting an inadequate signal from Fox. Don't know why as they're in the same direction. My antenna is behind my tv pointed at a wall...then a closet...then some more walls.

This is the one I'm using:
http://www.audiovox.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=10001&productId=14370&langId=-1

Hi everyone, I'm a newbie looking for some information.

I just moved into my dorm room at Emerson College (located on Boylston Street on the Boston Common) with my HDTV, but Emerson's cable does not provide any HD channels. Therefore, I decided that I want an antenna in order to get the channels. Problem is, I have no idea where to begin. I went to that Antennaweb site, and it tells me that I need a "Medium directional with pre-amp." I don't know what to do with that information. Also, I cannot get a roof top antenna because I'm in the dorms.

I was considering getting a Terk HDTVa indoor antenna because that seems to be getting the best reviews here and at Amazon.

Since I am a poor college student, so I can't spend a bunch of money on different antennas... and I also don't really know how to position an antenna either (I was a young child when my family had one).

Sorry if something similar has been posted, I went through several search results.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

HighDefGirl

Very simple go to BB get a Zenith silver sensor it is around 20-25.00 screw it in to the ant port on the back of the tv run a scan for the local channels and you should be good to go. If you run a scan and only get a couple of channels move the anntena and try again.

Good Luck

Hi Guys -

Sorry for jumping into your thread from down here in MD, but we're having an issue with a Hearst station in Baltimore. They are claiming that they are stretching their 4:3 pictures to 16:9 (making everything short and fat) because it "is a corporate policy" to do so.

I was wondering if WCVB in Boston did the same thing, since it's a Hearst station.

Thanks for any info!

Mark

WCVB's HD 720p broadcast is NOT streched. I hate StetchOvision and hope locals do not start doing this like TNT does. If I wanted to fill the screen I would have bought a TV that could do so. Maybe TV mfr's will have to start making an "Unstretch mode" aspect ratio.

greg

I was informed by a Direct TV rep that if I upgraded to their HD service that I would not need an additional antenna and that I could receive the local HD channels on the normal local channels that they are broadcast on. Is this True?
I thought I would have to tune into some other channels to see the local channels.

And maybe off topic, but if I did get this HD service, and I did get the HD available channels what would all of the non-hd channels look like with the HD service? Would they look any better than say if I had the regular Direct TV service?

Thanks for the help,
CaptK

Hi Guys -

Sorry for jumping into your thread from down here in MD, but we're having an issue with a Hearst station in Baltimore. They are claiming that they are stretching their 4:3 pictures to 16:9 (making everything short and fat) because it "is a corporate policy" to do so.

I was wondering if WCVB in Boston did the same thing, since it's a Hearst station.

Thanks for any info!

Mark
I believe your local station is feeding you a line of krappola. WCVB does not nor has it ever stretched 4:3 SD programming.

I was informed by a Direct TV rep that if I upgraded to their HD service that I would not need an additional antenna and that I could receive the local HD channels on the normal local channels that they are broadcast on. Is this True?
I thought I would have to tune into some other channels to see the local channels.

And maybe off topic, but if I did get this HD service, and I did get the HD available channels what would all of the non-hd channels look like with the HD service? Would they look any better than say if I had the regular Direct TV service?

Thanks for the help,
CaptK
The big 4 network locals (CBS,NBC,ABC and Fox) are available in HD from DIRECTV. Not sure about UPN or WB. The non HD channels would look the same from an HD receiver as they do from an SD receiver. However most SD programming does not look as good on an HDTV as it does on an analog TV. You would need DIRECTV's newest equipment (MPEG-4 satellite and receiver). The older HD equipment cannot access the new satellites. Incidentally, this HD service is only available if you are in the primary Boston demographic area.

Yah, neither have I.

I mean, I set my TV to stretch it, just so I can feel skinny(-er), but I've never seen WCVB do it.

HighDefGirl

Very simple go to BB get a Zenith silver sensor it is around 20-25.00 screw it in to the ant port on the back of the tv run a scan for the local channels and you should be good to go. If you run a scan and only get a couple of channels move the anntena and try again.

Good Luck

Also, if you use the map feature on antennaweb you should be able to get a rough idea of which direction you should be pointing the antenna from your building. Find a good place for it and then just rotate it little by little and test the signal using your tv.

Hi Guys -

Sorry for jumping into your thread from down here in MD, but we're having an issue with a Hearst station in Baltimore. They are claiming that they are stretching their 4:3 pictures to 16:9 (making everything short and fat) because it "is a corporate policy" to do so.

I was wondering if WCVB in Boston did the same thing, since it's a Hearst station.

Thanks for any info!

Mark

WCVB, WMUR (New Hampshire), WMTW (Maine) are all Hearst owned and do not stretch their picture

WCVB, WMUR (New Hampshire), WMTW (Maine) are all Hearst owned and do not stretch their picture

Thanks for all of the replies. We figured that they were giving us a line of bull, but it's great to have ammo to back us up!

Thanks again -

Mark

Your analysis is a good guess, and almost correct. WBZ-DT (and most of the other Boston DTV stations) transmits both analog and digital captions. WSBK-DT is only transmitting analog captions. There is no digital closed-caption signal transmitted for WSBK-DT.

Some sets, such as a JVC we have at the TV station, have a Closed Caption menu with a choice of caption types. On the JVC, the types are Basic, Advanced, and Auto, which correspond to analog, digital, and both. In the case of Auto, or both, the digital caption will be displayed if present, otherwise the analog, if present. It appears to me your set is locked on the digital captions. The menu where you can change this may be hidden in a different location than the one you have described, as it is in the JVC (it is under the "Initial Setup" menu).

One more point. I have a Sony HDTV set-top box which behaves strangely with some captions. When it detects digital captions it will display them, but turning the caption setting to off will display analog captions! The only way to turn captions off entirely is to set the box to display an unused caption format, such as "Service 2" (the digital equivalent of CC2). Your set may be equally quirky, so you may have to experiment.

Good hunting!
Well, I've been hunting for it, as you say. I've been 'round and 'round the remote, the menus, and the manual, upside down and backwards, and I'm now feeling quite confident that, short of venturing into the factory service mode, which would most likely void the warranty, it is impossible to view closed captions on WSBK-DT using an LG 37LC2D HDTV.

So the question then is who dropped the ball? Did LG make a television which doesn't meet FCC specifications? Or does WSBK-DT's captioning signal not meet FCC specifications? Or did the FCC enact a set of regulations which is insufficient to prevent this sort of incompatibility?

This is quite the disappointment, as a member of my family is hard of hearing, and relies heavily on closed captioning, while others, myself included, have come to find it useful when people on-screen are mumbling.

Hey guys, anyone know anyone at WBZ? CBS has the rights to carry Star Trek:TOS (The Original Series) in HD starting Sept 16th, and we should urge them (nicely but strongly) to add it to their lineup.

I really don't care if they air it at 2am. That's what DVRs are for.;)

Hey guys, anyone know anyone at WBZ? CBS has the rights to carry Star Trek:TOS (The Original Series) in HD starting Sept 16th, and we should urge them (nicely but strongly) to add it to their lineup.

I really don't care if they air it at 2am. That's what DVRs are for.;)


WCVB Sept. 17 2:35-3:35 AM "Balance of Terror" Fire up the DVR's. HD may be a pipe dream since satellite delivery is through HD unfriendly Pathfire.

WCVB Sept. 17 2:35-3:35 AM "Balance of Terror" Fire up the DVR's. HD may be a pipe dream since satellite delivery is through HD unfriendly Pathfire.Oops. WCVB gets it because they carried Enterprise. Someone want to give them a call?

Didn't watch last night's game on FOX, but I had been having the same problems as you with 25.1 (see other posts in this thread; FOX is xmitting at very limited power)...bought a ChannelMaster pre-amp and that solved the low signal problem!

Anyone know the current status of 25.1 (WFXT)? I'm still getting issues with intermittent signal. How long will Fox be transmitting as very limited power? If it's for a long time, I may need to get a pre-amp.

What ChannelMaster pre-amp is recommended for an indoor antenna? I'm already using a ChannelMaster CM-3044 distribution amplifier with my Terk HDTVa to split my antenna 3 ways.

I appreciate your help.

Anyone know the current status of 25.1 (WFXT)? I'm still getting issues with intermittent signal. How long will Fox be transmitting as very limited power? If it's for a long time, I may need to get a pre-amp.

What ChannelMaster pre-amp is recommended for an indoor antenna? I'm already using a ChannelMaster CM-3044 distribution amplifier with my Terk HDTVa to split my antenna 3 ways.


i am in cambridge, also and i get strong signals on the other major networks plus 38 and 56, but i haven't ever been able to pick up fox25 reliably. i have a preamp. for brief periods, the signal will seem strong, but it always breaks up after a short time. perhaps cambridge is a "bad spot" for their antenna? i don't know.

I was in Belmont and reliably recieving Fox via only the Terk HDTVa. Since moving to Somerville I have trouble getting a reliable signal. However I have not played with position of the antenna much and I'll share if I get any improvement and how much.

Does anyone know if it is possible to transmit the antenna signal over the same wire as cable and have both signals stay seperate? Or are they using the same bandwidth range?

Does anyone know if it is possible to transmit the antenna signal over the same wire as cable and have both signals stay seperate? Or are they using the same bandwidth range?

It won't work because cable does use part of the over-the-air frequency range. You can see this by connecting cable to a TV without a converter box.

It won't work because cable does use part of the over-the-air frequency range. You can see this by connecting cable to a TV without a converter box.

Thanks I figured as much...I had just been hoping it'd be an easy way to get a wire upstairs in my apt by using the existing internal cable wiring.

Anyone know the current status of 25.1 (WFXT)? I'm still getting issues with intermittent signal. How long will Fox be transmitting as very limited power? If it's for a long time, I may need to get a pre-amp.

What ChannelMaster pre-amp is recommended for an indoor antenna? I'm already using a ChannelMaster CM-3044 distribution amplifier with my Terk HDTVa to split my antenna 3 ways.

I appreciate your help.
Using the CM7775, available at SolidSignal.com and elewhere....

Anyone know the current status of 25.1 (WFXT)? I'm still getting issues with intermittent signal. How long will Fox be transmitting as very limited power? If it's for a long time, I may need to get a pre-amp.

What ChannelMaster pre-amp is recommended for an indoor antenna? I'm already using a ChannelMaster CM-3044 distribution amplifier with my Terk HDTVa to split my antenna 3 ways.

I appreciate your help.

I use the CM4228 in the attic with no amp and get 25.1 perfectly down in Plymouth. I am on a hill.

From Lunenburg I had a UHF atenna installed and get beautiful pictures on 2-1, 2-2, 4-1, 4-2, 5-1, 5-2, 7-1, 7-2, 9-1, 12-1, 25-1, 38-1, 44-1, 44-2, 44-3, 44-4, 50-1, 56-1, 56-2, 68-1, 68-2, and 68-3. I also get some Spanish channels, but as I don't speak Spanish I have then delisted. My AT9 dish doesn't get them without occaisonal pixilation. D* can't seem to find a tech that can fix the pixilation problem.

From Lunenburg I had a UHF atenna installed and get beautiful pictures on 2-1, 2-2, 4-1, 4-2, 5-1, 5-2, 7-1, 7-2, 9-1, 12-1, 25-1, 38-1, 44-1, 44-2, 44-3, 44-4, 50-1, 56-1, 56-2, 68-1, 68-2, and 68-3. I also get some Spanish channels, but as I don't speak Spanish I have then delisted. My AT9 dish doesn't get them without occaisonal pixilation. D* can't seem to find a tech that can fix the pixilation problem.


Your AT9 Dish has nothing do do with getting these OTA channels and D* would/should have nothing do wo with troubleshooting them.

Are you saying the receiver is breaking up? If so how are you determining that the channels come in 'beautiful' in the first place?

D* is supposed to provide the locals in HD through the AT9 and H20 receiver and they do, but there is pixilation on 4, 5, 7, and 25. I therefore had a UHF antenna installed to get these channels. I now get those channels and some more beautifully with no pixilation. D* has sent two techs to the house in an attempt to solve the problem of pixilation and neither was successful.

D* is supposed to provide the locals in HD through the AT9 and H20 receiver and they do, but there is pixilation on 4, 5, 7, and 25. I therefore had a UHF antenna installed to get these channels. I now get those channels and some more beautifully with no pixilation. D* has sent two techs to the house in an attempt to solve the problem of pixilation and neither was successful.

Are you getting pixelization? Or are you seeing the D* MPEG4 motion jitter/shimmer? If its the latter, its not a problem at your end. I seems to be particularly bad with football games!

D* is supposed to provide the locals in HD through the AT9 and H20 receiver and they do, but there is pixilation on 4, 5, 7, and 25. I therefore had a UHF antenna installed to get these channels. I now get those channels and some more beautifully with no pixilation. D* has sent two techs to the house in an attempt to solve the problem of pixilation and neither was successful.

If the problem is bit-grooming (i.e. reducing bandwithd), then it is not surprising that they were unable to solve the problem at your house ;)

- Rich

I don't know what jitter is, but some of it could be shimmer. I do on occasion get single band rectangles. After the installation two weeks ago I got 4X5 rectangles of red or green and a 2X18 vertical bar of yellow, but they haven't reappeared lately. I also don't have a clue what bitgrooming is or how to fix it. I do have another appointment with a techie? on Monday who is supposed to be an expert on Ku/Ka. Any ideas on what I should tell him in regard to bitgrooming?

W/ regards to the OTA-HD WFXT Fox-25 discussion before, I found that moving my antenna around the room at my new apartment in Somerville (Davis/Tufts area, 1st floor, Terk HDTVa, indoors) I was able to get anywhere from 0% signal to 92% signal :)

I just put it on a long cable and moved it around the room, then focused on moving it around the wall about 7 to 8 ft in the air and eventually found a great position where the girlfriend had no issues with me installing a small shelf and using white RG-6 to setup the antenna.

Is WOF or Jeopardy in HD in the boston market? I wasn't home last night to check...

Is WOF or Jeopardy in HD in the boston market? I wasn't home last night to check...

Do we really need or want to see Vanna White and Alex Trebek (is he still hosting Jeopardy?) in HD at this point??? :confused: :D :eek:

FWIW, both are listed as HD for tonight in my program listings for 38.

All,

Did WGBH-DT make a change to their PSIP programming recently?

The reason I ask: A few months ago when I got my TV (a HLS-4666W DLP from Sansung), I could not tune in WGBX-DT (44.1) via OTA. When I did, my TV would endlessly reboot. At that time, I thought it was OK because I never watched that channel. Removing it from my channel manager solved the reboot problem at that time.

Just a couple of days ago, the exact same issue is now occurring for me on WGBH-DT (2.1). WGBH is a channel that I really want to watch, so removing it from my channel manager is not an option.

I called Samsung tech support today. The first level support guy said he'd never heard of such an issue and forwarded me to 2nd level support. The 2nd level support tech knew exactly what my problem was. He said that the station was using an old version of PSIP which was causing the TV to reboot. He said there was no way to fix this issue. He told me that I must take this issue up with the station.

What?!>!?!?! I spent over $1000 on this TV and I can't watch certain stations?

Also, WGBH worked great for months. Why would they suddenly 'downgrade' their PSIP?

My question to you all: does anyone know about this PSIP issue, and does anyone know of a technician I can contact at WGBH to inquire about their PSIP versioning?

If this issue can't be resolved, I'll be sending the TV back and not recommending Samsung to anyone.

Any help is greatly appreciated!

-BL

Interesting! My Vizio TV doesn't recognize channel 2.1 or 2.2, but the 44's come in fine. When I run the OTA signal through my HD20-100 receiver the 2's come in fine. I'd also be interested in why the TV's don't accept the signal.

I called Samsung tech support today. The first level support guy said he'd never heard of such an issue and forwarded me to 2nd level support. The 2nd level support tech knew exactly what my problem was. He said that the station was using an old version of PSIP which was causing the TV to reboot. He said there was no way to fix this issue. He told me that I must take this issue up with the station.

That's not really an acceptable response from Samsung. Even if the station is transmitting absolute junk, it's no excuse for the TV to constantly reboot - the software in the TV should be designed to handle bad data gracefully. If the station is sending valid PSIP data, even if it's "an old version" then it's not even remotely fair to put the blame on the station.

What?!>!?!?! I spent over $1000 on this TV and I can't watch certain stations?

Not to belittle your purchase, but should those of us who paid much more than $1000 be really irrate? What was paid for the TV is really irrelevant to the discussion. If you paid $300 for it, it's still perfectly reasonable to expect it to work properly.

My question to you all: does anyone know about this PSIP issue, and does anyone know of a technician I can contact at WGBH to inquire about their PSIP versioning?

If this issue can't be resolved, I'll be sending the TV back and not recommending Samsung to anyone.

Quote honestly while it wouldn't be a bad idea to contact WGBH and see if they might be aware of a problem I'd go with plan B and return the TV if you have the option. Samsung's response to your problem is completely unreasonable. Certainly for the time being stations aren't always going to have their signals operating 100% correctly at all times and the TV shouldn't go crazy and start rebooting on you just because it received some screwy (or valid but not to their liking) data. Also consider this - if WGBH changes their signal so it will work with your TV, who's to say it won't screw up my TV (or someone else's)?

FYI - I have a Samsung 42" DLP and I have no problems with 'GBH's HD stations.
I did have an audio problem a while back and talked to someone in the engineering dept (can't remember the name....lucky if I remember yesterday), and they were very cooperative and the problem was resolved.

Are other people still having issues with WFXT??? I am now getting signals consistently in the high 80's low 90's at about 28/29 db but occassionally the signal drops to 0%/0db and then comes back a couple seconds later. Any one else experiencing similar?

this is probably unrelated, but when I watch fox HD on RCN (using a QAM tuner no box) it occasionally skips and gets blocky, like it was losing signal (over cable mind you). espically when watching SD content, watching house the other night, the end of the simpsons and the first few minutes of the show, all messed up, after that it was fine

WLVI is sold today

http://business.bostonherald.com/businessNews/view.bg?articleid=157515

Are other people still having issues with WFXT??? I am now getting signals consistently in the high 80's low 90's at about 28/29 db but occassionally the signal drops to 0%/0db and then comes back a couple seconds later. Any one else experiencing similar?

I'm having the same issue. Signal is at 27 dB and then drops to 0 dB. I feel like it's happening less than before though. Anyone want to call WFXT to see if we can get this resolved?

EDIT: Nevermind. Just as I was writing this, the signal kept dropping out like crazy, so it's the same as before.

I'm having the same issue. Signal is at 27 dB and then drops to 0 dB. I feel like it's happening less than before though. Anyone want to call WFXT to see if we can get this resolved?

EDIT: Nevermind. Just as I was writing this, the signal kept dropping out like crazy, so it's the same as before.

What you guys are describing sounds like multipath interference. It's not the station's fault, but a reception issue on your end. Some tuners are better at handling multipath than others. Changing the antenna location can also help.

In Billerica with an antenna inside in a 3rd floor attic and using my accessDTV cards and HD Tivos as tuners, WFXT DT is coming in just fine right now and almost always does.

Cambridge can be a tough area for reception.

What you guys are describing sounds like multipath interference. It's not the station's fault, but a reception issue on your end. Some tuners are better at handling multipath than others. Changing the antenna location can also help.

In Billerica with an antenna inside in a 3rd floor attic and using my accessDTV cards and HD Tivos as tuners, WFXT DT is coming in just fine right now and almost always does.

Cambridge can be a tough area for reception.

I understand what you are saying, but before the summer, WFXT-DT was coming in perfectly. What change would cause multipath interference? Everything on my end is the same as before.

I have 3 tuners--a Sony KDF-E42A10 ATSC tuner, a FusionHDTV PCI tuner, and a FusionHDTV USB tuner--and I see the same issue with all of them.

I will do what you suggested and try moving the antenna around though. Hopefully it will work.

I understand what you are saying, but before the summer, WFXT-DT was coming in perfectly. What change would cause multipath interference? Everything on my end is the same as before.

Leaves on the trees can make a big difference.

For Bob Yankowitz:

What is up with the TV38 program guide and scheduling starting next week? I have Jeopardy set up as a Season Pass in my D* HD TiVo, and as of next week all the shows are showing up twice, at 7:30 and again at 9:30. Is Jeopardy going to be on twice? If so, can you change the flagging on the second one so it's not listed as a new show and confusing my TiVo which I've set for first run only? Otherwise, I will have to manually delete every second show from the "To Do List."

TIA

SMK

For Bob Yankowitz:

What is up with the TV38 program guide and scheduling starting next week? I have Jeopardy set up as a Season Pass in my D* HD TiVo, and as of next week all the shows are showing up twice, at 7:30 and again at 9:30. Is Jeopardy going to be on twice? If so, can you change the flagging on the second one so it's not listed as a new show and confusing my TiVo which I've set for first run only? Otherwise, I will have to manually delete every second show from the "To Do List."

TIA

SMK
Apparently Jeopardy is going to be on twice, as you say. I'll pass on your concern to the folks who do the scheduling to see if there's anything they can do.

Leaves on the trees can make a big difference.

I moved the antenna approximately 8 inches. 25.1 is coming in at about 30 dB now, and I have seen no signal drops or stutters. I'll keep on monitoring to be sure.

On an entirely separate note, did anyone have trouble with 7.1 during Studio 60? MCE only recorded about 10 minutes. The event viewer said there was a signal loss during the recording. Not sure what the problem is. Hopefully, it's not my computer. If so, I really hope it doesn't happen again. By the way, of the 10 minutes I did see, Studio 60 is damn good. I'm definitely going to have to Netflix the pilot to catch the rest.

On an entirely separate note, did anyone have trouble with 7.1 during Studio 60? MCE only recorded about 10 minutes. The event viewer said there was a signal loss during the recording. Not sure what the problem is. Hopefully, it's not my computer. If so, I really hope it doesn't happen again. By the way, of the 10 minutes I did see, Studio 60 is damn good. I'm definitely going to have to Netflix the pilot to catch the rest.
I was watching it as it aired, and I noticed that it started out airing as an SD show, in that it had the thick black border all the way around the image, then around 5 to 10 minutes in, there was a click/crackly noise and, in the middle of a scene, the image suddenly jumped to full screen HD. It was sort of surreal to see the "in HD where available" overlay airing in SD on such a major station. I can only assume someone at WHDH-DT was asleep on the job.

Apparently Jeopardy is going to be on twice, as you say. I'll pass on your concern to the folks who do the scheduling to see if there's anything they can do.

It's been reported that 38 will be starting a 9:30 newscast shortly, so I suspect the extra JEOPARDY is a stop-gap measure tl the newscast starts. The TiVO apparantly uses the guide descriptions to determine what it records, so if there is no description, it assumes it's a new episode. Happens to me a lot with non-network shows. I have a plethora of COLBERT REPORTS that want to record.

I was watching it as it aired, and I noticed that it started out airing as an SD show, in that it had the thick black border all the way around the image, then around 5 to 10 minutes in, there was a click/crackly noise and, in the middle of a scene, the image suddenly jumped to full screen HD. It was sort of surreal to see the "in HD where available" overlay airing in SD on such a major station. I can only assume someone at WHDH-DT was asleep on the job.

Yeah, I noticed that too. I was able to record through the point where it switched over to HD.

Yeah, I saw the glitch, too. I was watching on an SD set, but had tuned the HD feed, 'cause I'd rather have the letterboxed picture than the clipped version (or is it the other way around), but either way, it was pretty jarring when it happened.

Hi all. I'm new to posting at AVSF but read frequently and appreciate the helpful info.

I'm having an issue myself lately with the OTA HD (UHF) signal for the local CBS station. I'm using an HD Tivo with an attic antenna to capture the OTA signals. I get perfect reception for all stations but seem to get pixilization with CBS. Some nights, I have no problem at all, and other times, my signal strength will be bouncing from the low 90s down to the high 20s and when it drops low enough, poof, pixilization. I have a clear shot to the sky, no trees or other possible interference. Ironically, last night, in the pouring rain, no pixilization issues. Monday night, clear sky, and I have cut off recordings of anything I tried to record on CBS.

I had a similar problem with CBS from a prior house with the same equipment. I'm inclined to think its a broadcast issue (but don't see others talking about it). if it were the antena, would I have great reception on the other stations (or even get to 90+% signal strength sometimes)? If it were the DTV box, wouldn't it happen on all OTA stations (dropping signal strength)?

Any thoughts?

Hi all. I'm new to posting at AVSF but read frequently and appreciate the helpful info.

I'm having an issue myself lately with the OTA HD (UHF) signal for the local CBS station. I'm using an HD Tivo with an attic antenna to capture the OTA signals. I get perfect reception for all stations but seem to get pixilization with CBS. Some nights, I have no problem at all, and other times, my signal strength will be bouncing from the low 90s down to the high 20s and when it drops low enough, poof, pixilization. I have a clear shot to the sky, no trees or other possible interference. Ironically, last night, in the pouring rain, no pixilization issues. Monday night, clear sky, and I have cut off recordings of anything I tried to record on CBS.

I had a similar problem with CBS from a prior house with the same equipment. I'm inclined to think its a broadcast issue (but don't see others talking about it). if it were the antena, would I have great reception on the other stations (or even get to 90+% signal strength sometimes)? If it were the DTV box, wouldn't it happen on all OTA stations (dropping signal strength)?

Any thoughts?

The problem you're having sounds like it could be multipath distortion. That happens when you are close enough to the transmitter so that reflected signals (such as off of buildings or other objects) are strong enough to interfere with the direct signal from the transmitter. Multipath distortion is easy to see with an analog signal, appearing as outlines or ghosting. Unfortunately, with digital it's much harder (for an average person at least) to evaluate the signal quality. It makes sense that it would go away when it rains, because rain attenuates the UHF signal, so the reflections could get so weak as to have no effect. A possible solution is to get a more directional antenna, although you may find then that there is no single position for the antenna that works for all stations.

I agree it's likely multipath, but it is somewhat strange it only effects local CBS because local ABC and PBS are also using the same transmission antenna CBS is. It would help if you told us where you are and what antenna you're using.

SMK

I have had the same problem for years and believe it is multipath. What I have done is gotten myself a silver sensor indoor antena and that works great for the most part. I am about 6-7 miles from the antenna farm all other stations come in good except 5 which I hardly watch but the indoor antenna takes care of that. I think you said you have the HD Tivo which is known for bad tunners on OTA signals my TV tunner works great.

Good Luck I know what a pain it is to have this problem.

I agree it's likely multipath, but it is somewhat strange it only effects local CBS because local ABC and PBS are also using the same transmission antenna CBS is. It would help if you told us where you are and what antenna you're using.

SMK


I'm in Wellesley (2.2 miles from source for WBZ-DT, WCVB-DT) on a large lot with little for the signal to be bouncing off to create the multipath problem. I have no issues at all with ABC but admittadly don't watch/record much PBS. I'm using the Winegard Square Shooter. I have the signal amplified after a long run from the attic to basement head end where the box is located.

I'm in Wellesley (2.2 miles from source for WBZ-DT, WCVB-DT) on a large lot with little for the signal to be bouncing off to create the multipath problem. I have no issues at all with ABC but admittadly don't watch/record much PBS. I'm using the Winegard Square Shooter. I have the signal amplified after a long run from the attic to basement head end where the box is located.
Multipath is a tricky fella. It does not respect all stations equally, but is dependant on your location and the frequencies (more accurately, wavelengths) involved. So your reception of WCVB-DT on channel 20 (and WGBH-DT, channel 19) may be significantly different than on WBZ-DT, channel 30, which is 60 mHz higher. Move your antenna by just the right amount and you'll get WBZ fine, but lose WCVB!

I wouldn't look to your houselot for the bounces. It's the really big buildings (and in other parts of the country, mountains) that cause the problems. In your case it could be the Pru or Hancock.

When I was a kid in Brooklyn in the early 70's the biggest disaster for TV reception was the move of the TV transmitting antennas to the World Trade Center. The ghost caused by the bounce off the Empire State Building ruined television for millions of New Yorkers. I remember the dire predictions in the newspapers that turned out to be correct. On the other hand, had the stations not moved, there still would have been a bounce off the WTC, so they were in a bad position no matter what they did. It was good for the cable companies, though.

Bob, I looked at the "To Do List" in my HD TiVo last night, and the Jeopardy scheduling issue seems fixed. Only the 7:30 showings are set to record, so I guess TV38 fixed the info they are sending out regarding first run/repeats. Thanks for the help.

SMK

I wouldn't look to your houselot for the bounces. It's the really big buildings (and in other parts of the country, mountains) that cause the problems. In your case it could be the Pru or Hancock.



I guess my head says if its the Pru or Hancock (by the way, over 10 miles away at almost a 90 degree angle from me and the tower (2 + miles away)), then it would seem anyone in my area would be experiencing the same issues. Not sure whether they are or not. Would a more directional antenna solve the problem? How about relocating the antenna from inside the attic to outside on the roof?

By the way Bob, thanks for the info direct from the source!

I get some kind of interference on D* HD CBS Local Station. It is the worst of my locals with interference of some kind on average of once per minute. The last service call I was assured I didn't have a line of sight problem and that there wasn't anything that could be done to fix the problem by technicians here. He said it was an issue with the H20. Now my question if it is the H20 in my house why does the same channel CBS (Channel 4) go through the H20 receiver to my TV from my UHF antenna with preamp, that has nothing to do with D*, separate wiring etc. and give a perfect picture? Signal strength as measured by the H20 is in the 80's. I don't understand why they both wouldn't have the same interference problems if it was the H20 causing the problems. It would seem more logical to my muddled brain that it would be the transponder on the satellite.

I get some kind of interference on D* HD CBS Local Station. It is the worst of my locals with interference of some kind on average of once per minute. The last service call I was assured I didn't have a line of sight problem and that there wasn't anything that could be done to fix the problem by technicians here. He said it was an issue with the H20. Now my question if it is the H20 in my house why does the same channel CBS (Channel 4) go through the H20 receiver to my TV from my UHF antenna with preamp, that has nothing to do with D*, separate wiring etc. and give a perfect picture? Signal strength as measured by the H20 is in the 80's. I don't understand why they both wouldn't have the same interference problems if it was the H20 causing the problems. It would seem more logical to my muddled brain that it would be the transponder on the satellite.

My understanding is that this is a nationwide problem with D* and their MPEG4 HD channels in all markets. The H20 maybe part of the problem in how it decodes the KA MPEG4 stream. D* are aware of the problem have been saying the have been working on fix since this problem was first reported earlier this year. I have also heard that 1080i (CBS for example) are more prone to this problem.

The OTA channels do not go though the same process as the KA DBS channels.

Bottom line, the installers is mostly right. It is not anything he can fix and it is not an LOS issue. You may want to call and complain to D* and and ask for credits programming credits until they resolve the issue.

Bob, I looked at the "To Do List" in my HD TiVo last night, and the Jeopardy scheduling issue seems fixed. Only the 7:30 showings are set to record, so I guess TV38 fixed the info they are sending out regarding first run/repeats. Thanks for the help.

SMK
I'm afraid I can only take credit for trying. We haven't changed anything.

According to the person I bumped it to, two levels up, "I called the company that gives the listings to Tivo and they do not distinguish between the M-f 1st run, weekend run, or M-F second run. The person can modify his Tivo record for the M-F 7:30pm only."

I don't know if that last bit of advice is accurate or not, but there it is, I'm afraid.

Anyone noticing any signal drift on WCVB-DT? Looks like spurious emissions. I have not put a scope on it yet but I have a clean lock on WGBH so I'm not really thinking atmospheric or multimpath issues from my receive point. Plus I noticed they have some hanging green pixels at the top of their SD picture. Something breaking down there?

Also, Audio on WSBK-DT? Anyone?

Hey guys,

I seem to be getting pixelation across the board on my digital stations last night and this morning even though my signal strength is reading in the 90% to 100% at 29 to 31db for the stations. Could this be a multipath issue? Any thoughts? Ideas to try to reduce multipath that I can buy locally?

Currently I am using a Terk HDTVa...

The Audio on WSBK has been screwed up for days. It sounds like low quality/bitrate Mpeg Internet feed.

All,

Did WGBH-DT make a change to their PSIP programming recently?

The reason I ask: A few months ago when I got my TV (a HLS-4666W DLP from Sansung), I could not tune in WGBX-DT (44.1) via OTA. When I did, my TV would endlessly reboot. At that time, I thought it was OK because I never watched that channel. Removing it from my channel manager solved the reboot problem at that time.

Just a couple of days ago, the exact same issue is now occurring for me on WGBH-DT (2.1). WGBH is a channel that I really want to watch, so removing it from my channel manager is not an option.

I called Samsung tech support today. The first level support guy said he'd never heard of such an issue and forwarded me to 2nd level support. The 2nd level support tech knew exactly what my problem was. He said that the station was using an old version of PSIP which was causing the TV to reboot. He said there was no way to fix this issue. He told me that I must take this issue up with the station.

What?!>!?!?! I spent over $1000 on this TV and I can't watch certain stations?

Also, WGBH worked great for months. Why would they suddenly 'downgrade' their PSIP?

My question to you all: does anyone know about this PSIP issue, and does anyone know of a technician I can contact at WGBH to inquire about their PSIP versioning?

If this issue can't be resolved, I'll be sending the TV back and not recommending Samsung to anyone.

Any help is greatly appreciated!

-BL


All,

On a whim, I decided to tune in WGBH-DT (channel 2-2) last night and was relieved to see that I can now watch it again without my TV continually rebooting. Something at WGBH must have been fixed. I still can not tune WGBH-DX (44), as my TV still reboots on that station.

I have an email thread going with WGBH support (although I haven't really gotten anywhere with them yet. I'm still waiting to talk to a real engineer.) I'll tell their support folks about how WGBH-DT (2.2) is working again for me and ask that they make the same change to 44.x to see if that works for me.

I'll let you know how it all pans out.

Thanks,

-BL

Hey guys,

I seem to be getting pixelation across the board on my digital stations last night and this morning even though my signal strength is reading in the 90% to 100% at 29 to 31db for the stations. Could this be a multipath issue? Any thoughts? Ideas to try to reduce multipath that I can buy locally?

Currently I am using a Terk HDTVa...

Apparently I yanked the cable on my antenna and loosened the connector (guess I did a shoddy job crimping it :) ). Relized the inner core was barely making a connection. New crimp job and it's all set :)

The Audio on WSBK has been screwed up for days. It sounds like low quality/bitrate Mpeg Internet feed.
We've looked into the problem (even going so far as to listen to the audio!), and we cannot duplicate it. We have made no changes to the configuration of our equipment in quite a while. Do you notice it on any particular show or shows? Any other details you can offer? Let me know and I'll pursue it further.

While watching Gray's Anatomy last night the feed froze twice on the OTA signal and D* had a blank screen on Channel 5 ABC. Anybody else experience this?

Didn't watcch GRAY'S, but there were problems with UGLY BETTY (other than her being ugly, of course). The first 10 minutes or so were in SD before someone at ABC finally caught on, and it switched to HD. Are they stupid or what. There were a couple of audio dropouts, but brief, after that.

All,

On a whim, I decided to tune in WGBH-DT (channel 2-2) last night and was relieved to see that I can now watch it again without my TV continually rebooting. Something at WGBH must have been fixed. I still can not tune WGBH-DX (44), as my TV still reboots on that station.

I have an email thread going with WGBH support (although I haven't really gotten anywhere with them yet. I'm still waiting to talk to a real engineer.) I'll tell their support folks about how WGBH-DT (2.2) is working again for me and ask that they make the same change to 44.x to see if that works for me.

I'll let you know how it all pans out.

Thanks,

-BL


I received the following reply from WGBH support:

Dear Mr. Leveille,

We're very sorry for the wait, engineering has been busy working off-site at our transmission tower which has slowed our communications. We appreciate your patience.


Our engineers have carefully examined both our DT19 (2.1, 2.2) and DT43 (44.1,2,3,4) streams and determined that the PISP information we are broadcasting is correct and within specifications. Additionally, we have not made any changes to our DTV broadcasts in a long time. We continually monitor our off-air digital broadcasts using a variety of ATSC tuners and none of them are experiencing a reset problem. In fact, we use Samsung tuners at our transmitter. We have also not heard from other viewers using ATSC tuners who have experienced the reset problem you described.


Unfortunately, it is likely a case where a lack of standardization in the industry continues to cause problems. Because the design and implementation of features in DTV boxes and internal tuners varies from manufacturer to manufacturer, resets, channel recognition, tuner sensitivity, etc.., can still cause problems. We're afraid that we have to refer you back to Samsung as this may require a firmware fix.

Sincerely,
WGBH Member Development and Services



While I was hoping they would say the problem is on their end, I certainly accept their response.

I'll open another ticket with Samsung to see if I need (another) motherboard swap (the first motherboard swap fixed a popping/clicking audio issue).

Wish me luck.


Just had a thought: are there ANY other HL-S4666W owners within broadcast range of WGBH that can put up a pair of rabbit ears and test this? Perhaps if multiple poeple are experiencing the same thing, we can collectively plead with Samsung to fix the issue.


-BL

I received the following reply from WGBH support:

Dear Mr. Leveille,

We're very sorry for the wait, engineering has been busy working off-site at our transmission tower which has slowed our communications. We appreciate your patience.


Our engineers have carefully examined both our DT19 (2.1, 2.2) and DT43 (44.1,2,3,4) streams and determined that the PISP information we are broadcasting is correct and within specifications. Additionally, we have not made any changes to our DTV broadcasts in a long time. We continually monitor our off-air digital broadcasts using a variety of ATSC tuners and none of them are experiencing a reset problem. In fact, we use Samsung tuners at our transmitter. We have also not heard from other viewers using ATSC tuners who have experienced the reset problem you described.


Unfortunately, it is likely a case where a lack of standardization in the industry continues to cause problems. Because the design and implementation of features in DTV boxes and internal tuners varies from manufacturer to manufacturer, resets, channel recognition, tuner sensitivity, etc.., can still cause problems. We're afraid that we have to refer you back to Samsung as this may require a firmware fix.

Sincerely,
WGBH Member Development and Services



While I was hoping they would say the problem is on their end, I certainly accept their response.

I'll open another ticket with Samsung to see if I need (another) motherboard swap (the first motherboard swap fixed a popping/clicking audio issue).

Wish me luck.


Just had a thought: are there ANY other HL-S4666W owners within broadcast range of WGBH that can put up a pair of rabbit ears and test this? Perhaps if multiple poeple are experiencing the same thing, we can collectively plead with Samsung to fix the issue.


-BL

I am having the exact same problem with my HL-S4266. The channel 2.2 problem was back on Thursday night(9/28). but is OK now (Sat 9/30). I haven't been able to watch 44.1 OTA since I bought the set a few months ago. It locked uo the first time I scanned for channels.

Thanks Baldur.

Any other Samsung HL-S users experiencing problems with WGBH-DT OTA? On the flip side, any HL-S owners working perfectly?

p.s. I just went downstairs and tested WGBH-DT 2.2 and it's working perfectly for me today. Very strange how it works some days and not others!


-BL

WGBH-DT 2.2 is crashing my TV today (Sunday, 1oct2006). Worked fine yesterday, crashing today.

Ugh!

WGBH-DT 2.2 is crashing my TV today (Sunday, 1oct2006). Worked fine yesterday, crashing today.

Ugh!

Same here @ 10:37 AM. I checked it after I read your post.

11:30 I checked my 2-2 and it is perfect and still on at 11:57. I have a Vizio 37" HDTV and a UHF OTA antenna. I have never had a problem with 2-2 or 2-1.

We've looked into the problem (even going so far as to listen to the audio!), and we cannot duplicate it. We have made no changes to the configuration of our equipment in quite a while. Do you notice it on any particular show or shows? Any other details you can offer? Let me know and I'll pursue it further.

Cleared up a day after I posted. No problems since.

Anyone experience problems with 4.1 watching Pats yesterday, signal bouncing all over the place(multipath?). Don't know if rain yesterday had anything to do with it. Usually 4.1 is rock solid. Bob Y. care to weigh in on this. Luckily I had 80 on D* has backup.

Anyone experience problems with 4.1 watching Pats yesterday, signal bouncing all over the place(multipath?). Don't know if rain yesterday had anything to do with it. Usually 4.1 is rock solid. Bob Y. care to weigh in on this. Luckily I had 80 on D* has backup.


No issues in Salisbury for OTA. My backup is D*'s H20 Local channel via MPEG4.

Anyone experience problems with 4.1 watching Pats yesterday, signal bouncing all over the place(multipath?). Don't know if rain yesterday had anything to do with it. Usually 4.1 is rock solid. Bob Y. care to weigh in on this. Luckily I had 80 on D* has backup.


Watched the entire game in Manchester, NH. No problem here.

Watched the whole game in Lunenburg, MA no problem on 4.1.

Anyone experience problems with 4.1 watching Pats yesterday, signal bouncing all over the place(multipath?). Don't know if rain yesterday had anything to do with it. Usually 4.1 is rock solid. Bob Y. care to weigh in on this. Luckily I had 80 on D* has backup.
We had no transmitter or antenna issues yesterday. Must have been atmospherics (that great all-purpose excuse)...

I noticed audio problems during the Pats game - kept switching from 2.0 to 5.1 in the middle of the game (instead of/as well as of at commercial breaks). I also got the occasional video flash, but that may be my PVR (I just replaced the HDD).

I noticed audio problems during the Pats game - kept switching from 2.0 to 5.1 in the middle of the game (instead of/as well as of at commercial breaks). I also got the occasional video flash, but that may be my PVR (I just replaced the HDD).

I've noticed that too. It's happened with all the football games that I've watched on 4.1 over the past 2 weeks. Not sure if it's happened with primetime shows though.

Hi all,

I am in Boston in an apt near Fenway and am going to buy an HDTV and antenna but have a question. I looked up Antenna Web and from my location the towers are about 6.5miles away. If my antenna is indoor, will it "go through" buildings and give me a signal? Say, with a relatively inexpensive antenna (like 20-30 $)? Thanks !

I noticed audio problems during the Pats game - kept switching from 2.0 to 5.1 in the middle of the game (instead of/as well as of at commercial breaks). I also got the occasional video flash, but that may be my PVR (I just replaced the HDD).
Checking into it...

Hi all,

I am in Boston in an apt near Fenway and am going to buy an HDTV and antenna but have a question. I looked up Antenna Web and from my location the towers are about 6.5miles away. If my antenna is indoor, will it "go through" buildings and give me a signal? Say, with a relatively inexpensive antenna (like 20-30 $)? Thanks !
You're certainly close enough to pick up the main local channels with an inexpensive indoor antenna. However, the nearby buildings may cause some multi-path. But its worth a try. (I get good OTA HD reception 30 miles west of Boston with a small indoor antenna.)

Mickey

I live in the South End, and I can pick 'em all up with an indoor antenna...of course, I'm on the top floor, so that must make some difference. The only one that might give you a problem is WFXT (25-1) - their signal appears to be somewhat weaker than the others.

You're certainly close enough to pick up the main local channels with an inexpensive indoor antenna. However, the nearby buildings may cause some multi-path. But its worth a try. (I get good OTA HD reception 30 miles west of Boston with a small indoor antenna.)

Mickey

Okay, I will try it. The direction of the towers is directly through a couple walls, so I'm worriec abut that. Should I try picking up a small multidirectional antenna or maybe the Silver Sensor?

WGBH-DT 2.2 is crashing my TV today (Sunday, 1oct2006). Worked fine yesterday, crashing today.

Ugh!

Just wanted to drop a note regarding my WGBH-DT PSIP saga.

Just for kicks, I tuned in DT19 (WGBH 2.2) tonight (5oct2006 at 8pm) and it worked. Thinking it was another fluke, I hit 'info' on my remote and noticed something.

Previously when my TV was intermittently crashing the program info screen on my TV would say something to the effect of: "No program description available."

Today, the program description is "PBS HD Loop".

I wonder if WGBH put in a vanilla description where there was none before, and I wonder if it'll solve my crashing isssue?

-BL

Well, it's 11:25 on 5oct2006 and now when I tune in WGBH-DT my TV is crashing.

In the 3 seconds before it rebooted, I called up the PSIP info and see that it has changed back to 'No detail information'.

I noticed audio problems during the Pats game - kept switching from 2.0 to 5.1 in the middle of the game (instead of/as well as of at commercial breaks). I also got the occasional video flash, but that may be my PVR (I just replaced the HDD).

Ditto here. I had frequent audio dropouts and changes from 2.0 to 5.1 and flashes of green in a 4x3 area only in the middle of the screen. I thought for sure it was my reception, but I was puzzled as WBZ-DT is my most solid performer by far. Glad to see others are reporting it.

Here's to hoping Bob can locate the problem before this Sunday's game (if it wasn't a program source or network issue.)

Ditto here. I had frequent audio dropouts and changes from 2.0 to 5.1 and flashes of green in a 4x3 area only in the middle of the screen. I thought for sure it was my reception, but I was puzzled as WBZ-DT is my most solid performer by far. Glad to see others are reporting it.

Here's to hoping Bob can locate the problem before this Sunday's game (if it wasn't a program source or network issue.)
As of right now, it does appear to have been a network issue, so I cannot promise a resolution for this weekend.

Sorry.

Okay, I will try it. The direction of the towers is directly through a couple walls, so I'm worriec abut that. Should I try picking up a small multidirectional antenna or maybe the Silver Sensor?

I picked up a normal rabbit Ears enhanced antenna and I can't pick up very good service. I get fuzz in my picture with the enhancement all teh way up (up to 30dB i think). And it picks up no HD stations. guess I'll try the Silver Sensor but Best Buy didn't have it...hmm. Might have to get a TV with QAM...

As of right now, it does appear to have been a network issue, so I cannot promise a resolution for this weekend.

Sorry.

It started happening with the Patriots-Dolphins game. 5.1 switched to 2.1 intermittently just as before.

It started happening with the Patriots-Dolphins game. 5.1 switched to 2.1 intermittently just as before.

It's at the network, I switched between WPRI and WBZ and they are both switching at the same time from 2/1 to 5/1 and back.

It's at the network, I switched between WPRI and WBZ and they are both switching at the same time from 2/1 to 5/1 and back.

Yeah but at least the video broadcast was almost perfect. I think it went to SD for a few seconds then back to HD.

It started happening with the Patriots-Dolphins game. 5.1 switched to 2.1 intermittently just as before.

It's incredibly annoying. If my AV receiver is like most (and I think it is), there's a brief drop-out in sound as it switches between 5.1 and (I think more accurately) 2.0. I know exactly what causes it, but I've got a few people over watching the game and I'm trying to answer the question about why the sound keeps going away. For people who don't yet have HD, it doesn't paint a very positive story.

Even when they go back to the home studio for some between-play highlights of other games, it drops back to 2.0. We're how many years into HD broadcasting? It's amazing to me to that these technical issues haven't been worked out yet. Come on now... is there REALLY no way to keep the dolby digital stream in tact? It just don't seem like it would be a big deal to me.

-Steve

You will note that the drop off from 5.1 to 2.0 occurs when New York takes control of the feed in order to do an update of other games;I don't believe NY is broadcasting from that control room in HD/5.1, thus the revert to SD and 2.1; sometimes NY will take control and not do an update, but usually you will see other games' highlights; it is incredibly annoying to all of us watching in HD and listening in DD5.1;perhaps the networks will start taking HD more seriously soon.....it is a slow process as SD still drives the cash register...just my 2 cents....

I noticed that too.. A switch to 2.0 always seemed to occur in the middle of a play preceding a "lets go to New York for an update..".

Lots of gratuitous switching between 2.0 and 5.1 at other times too.

You will note that the drop off from 5.1 to 2.0 occurs when New York takes control of the feed in order to do an update of other games;I don't believe NY is broadcasting from that control room in HD/5.1, thus the revert to SD and 2.1; sometimes NY will take control and not do an update, but usually you will see other games' highlights; it is incredibly annoying to all of us watching in HD and listening in DD5.1;perhaps the networks will start taking HD more seriously soon.....it is a slow process as SD still drives the cash register...just my 2 cents....
Yea, I know why it happens. I'm just surprised that they've been unable (or unwilling) to find a technical solution to route the 2.0 audio into the 5.1 stream without inturruption. It's just highlights, so why not run their 2.0 audio through any "pro-logic" like processor and dump the output to the appropriate 5.1 channels. It can't possibly be that its not technicallay feasible... it can only be that they don't care to be bothered with making it right.

And as far as SD goes... I'm not so sure that's true any more. Most of the die-hard football fans I know have either made the jump to HD or they go somewhere that there's an HD broadcast (bars, a friend's house, etc.). Look at the vast numbers of ads during the games that are for HD equipment (DirecTV, DLP, Sony, etc.). The advertisers know that a large number of the fans are watching on HD, even if it's not HD equipment that they own.

-Steve

Did anyone else experience the in-and-out of HD that happened during "Heroes?" Because I was watching it through TiVO, I thought perhaps it was either a TiVO or network problem, but others from other parts of the country watching it did not experience the problem. You'd think that they'd have it all together at this point. No wonder friends say to me, "I'll wait until they get the kinks worked out before I invest in HDTV."

Did anyone else experience the in-and-out of HD that happened during "Heroes?" Because I was watching it through TiVO, I thought perhaps it was either a TiVO or network problem, but others from other parts of the country watching it did not experience the problem. You'd think that they'd have it all together at this point. No wonder friends say to me, "I'll wait until they get the kinks worked out before I invest in HDTV."

The HD was fine for me in the Boston market. However the audio was terrible. It sounded like it was reverberating. I could not understand most of what was being said. :(

Did anyone else experience the in-and-out of HD that happened during "Heroes?" Because I was watching it through TiVO, I thought perhaps it was either a TiVO or network problem, but others from other parts of the country watching it did not experience the problem. You'd think that they'd have it all together at this point. No wonder friends say to me, "I'll wait until they get the kinks worked out before I invest in HDTV."

Yes and this is not a TiVo problem. When you see that small picture in that means you are getting the SD feed from the local station. It was a broadcast issue.

- Rich

The HD was fine for me in the Boston market. However the audio was terrible. It sounded like it was reverberating. I could not understand most of what was being said. :(

Wow, I'm not the only one who had that issue! I kept on switching settings on my receiver because I thought I had it set on "Concert hall". Or, more accurate "tile bathroom."

Wow, I'm not the only one who had that issue! I kept on switching settings on my receiver because I thought I had it set on "Concert hall". Or, more accurate "tile bathroom."

Yes. I had that too. Good description. I kept checking my Pre-amp to see if I had engaged stadium or some such idiotic surround mode :p

- Rich

Yeah, it started out SD, and switched over to HD sometime in the first five minutes, followed by the echo-chamber effect.

Glad the audio problem wasn't just me.

I noticed that too.. A switch to 2.0 always seemed to occur in the middle of a play preceding a "lets go to New York for an update..".

Lots of gratuitous switching between 2.0 and 5.1 at other times too.

With the Logitech receiver I have, my unit powers off nearly every time they switch from 2.0 to 5.1.

For weeks I thought it was a problem with my receiver, until I pinpointed it to CBS programming and football in general...and now after reading this thread I totallly know it's their issue! :)

More specifically, the first 4 minutes of "Heroes" were broadcast in SD, and then there was a click as it switched over to HD with echoey sound. 13 minutes after that it went back to SD for a little less than a minute, and then back to HD for the rest of the program. However, as far as I could tell, the sound was messed up for all but those first 4 minutes of SD. It sounded to me like they were running the audio from both the HD and SD broadcasts overlapped, and slightly out of sync.

One could easily get the impression that HDTV broadcasting is less of a career, and more of a hobby for the good folks at WHDH.

With the Logitech receiver I have, my unit powers off nearly every time they switch from 2.0 to 5.1.

For weeks I thought it was a problem with my receiver, until I pinpointed it to CBS programming and football in general...and now after reading this thread I totallly know it's their issue! :)


oh man! Thats gotta be a PITA! :(

One could easily get the impression that HDTV broadcasting is less of a career, and more of a hobby for the good folks at WHDH.

That's long been my assumption.

I mean, c'mon. You're telling me these guys are new to broadcasting?

It's incredibly annoying. If my AV receiver is like most (and I think it is), there's a brief drop-out in sound as it switches between 5.1 and (I think more accurately) 2.0. I know exactly what causes it, but I've got a few people over watching the game and I'm trying to answer the question about why the sound keeps going away. For people who don't yet have HD, it doesn't paint a very positive story.

Even when they go back to the home studio for some between-play highlights of other games, it drops back to 2.0. We're how many years into HD broadcasting? It's amazing to me to that these technical issues haven't been worked out yet. Come on now... is there REALLY no way to keep the dolby digital stream in tact? It just don't seem like it would be a big deal to me.

-Steve

I hear you. I feel like an idiot with $5,000 worth of gear in my living room and the darn network or affiliate make it look defective to people over to see the game in stunning HD. It's a tuff sell that it's the stations defect.

On to this issue, the dolby audio for CBS is actually fed to the affiliates by a dolby E stream. The conversion and 5.1 encoding happens at the local affiliate. The NFL Sunday situation breaks down like this:

The production truck/facility at the the stadium mixes the audio program and sends it along with the metadata via Dolby E to CBS in NY. It's then converted back to a baseband audio signal where it can be mixed with alternate audio programs. It's then outputted once again with new metadata via Dolby E to the affiliates to be mixed again or encoded for terrestrial broadcast.

I don't think the technical producers at the network realize that some affiliates are just encoding as is without mixing and their directly controlling the viewers decoders.

Just a guess. :confused:

That's long been my assumption.

I mean, c'mon. You're telling me these guys are new to broadcasting?
First approx. 20 minutes of Tuesday's "Friday Night Lights" not transmitted in HD by Ch 7; magically popped in for rest of program after that; 7 (or NBC) has issues...

Yea, I know why it happens. I'm just surprised that they've been unable (or unwilling) to find a technical solution to route the 2.0 audio into the 5.1 stream without inturruption. It's just highlights, so why not run their 2.0 audio through any "pro-logic" like processor and dump the output to the appropriate 5.1 channels. It can't possibly be that its not technicallay feasible... it can only be that they don't care to be bothered with making it right.

And as far as SD goes... I'm not so sure that's true any more. Most of the die-hard football fans I know have either made the jump to HD or they go somewhere that there's an HD broadcast (bars, a friend's house, etc.). Look at the vast numbers of ads during the games that are for HD equipment (DirecTV, DLP, Sony, etc.). The advertisers know that a large number of the fans are watching on HD, even if it's not HD equipment that they own.

-Steve
Steve, I intended to say that HD is still an after-thought at a lot of stations; more attention is paid to the SD chain than the former; I am with you in that once a sports fan sees a game, any game, in HD it is very painful to revert to SD

oh man! Thats gotta be a PITA! :(

Indeed! I've had to go through the TV for CBS football broadcasts (the same thing happens ocasionally during college games too). Doesn't affect another channel or broadcast -- just during their football games!!

Add me to the list of annoyed HD football viewers on Sunday.

At least this time I didn't get any of the 4x3 green flashes but it was clear that the break-ins were responsible for the switching between 5.1 and 2.0. There were also lots of other random switches when breaks didn't occur. As someone else reported, my receiver "loses" appx 1-2s of audio everytime a digital format switch occurs and its amazing how many words apparently fit into this time span.

I ended up going on channel 88 to watch it was so annoying.

Come on FIOS I am ready.

Let's see...HEROES on Monday, FRIDAY NIGHT... on Tuesday....wonder what 7-1 will screw up tonight?
Actually, I had an audio issue with WHDH-TV back about a year ago, and got really good response from the chief engineer there (can't remember his name). Don't know if he's still around, but maybe he reads this forum..?

Well, it's 11:25 on 5oct2006 and now when I tune in WGBH-DT my TV is crashing.

In the 3 seconds before it rebooted, I called up the PSIP info and see that it has changed back to 'No detail information'.

Brian,

Please accept my apology for not following up with you and others sooner on the re-boot problem you are experiencing o 2-2. In the background engineering has been trying to narrow down the cause. It is especially difficult because the problem does not exhibit itself on the receivers we are using. We have checked the GBH DT transport stream on an analyzer and things look normal.
We were originally looking at the possibility that something in a datacast stream in the GBH DT transport might be disturbing some receivers, What did not make sense to us is that we have had the Data in the stream for almost a year. The problem you mention has been happening in the past couple of months. With your discovery of a link to missing guide info and a re-boot, has me looking at the import of program schedule info into the PSIP tables. We will pursue further investigation on this end. It is good that you also reported the issue to the manufacturer.
Please keep us posted, as I will this forum.

I owe you a call.

I'm glad to find this thread. I'll be trying to read it over the next few days. We recently added a TiVo Series 3, and while we can get local HD through cable, we also have a ($40) antenna connected. My main interest will be in advice/recommendations regarding that. While it works, I do occasionally have issues with it, brief gaps where I lose signal. Right now, the antenna is perched atop the TiVo box which is perched atop the subwoofer, with the ugly black wire snaking across the wall to the back of the TiVo. (We are, of course, permitted by law to put up an outside antenna, but will not be doing so, for a variety of reasons.)

If there is a better thread/forum for questions and answers about indoor antennas, please do let me know. Thanks!

Essential Information: We're in a condo unit, with a southwestern exposure through the living room windows, which is nice since that's the direction the broadcast antennas are, I believe, 205-209 degrees according to antennaweb, about 13.4-13.6 miles away.

--

UPDATED: Most specifically, I currently have this antenna:

Philips MANT510 (http://i.walmart.com/i/p/00/02/66/16/01/0002661601728_215X215.jpg)

And am considering this antenna:

Terk HDTVa (http://img.nextag.com/image/Terk_HDTVa_Indoor_High/1/000/000/787/453/78745381.jpg)

Would it be reasonable to expect a significant improvement?

I'd also like to ask a specific question about 25-1 (Fox). It is the weakest channel according to my tuner, and I don't maintain signal acquisition reliably. Is there something specific I can do to enhance or address problems with that one frequency?

Brian,

Please accept my apology for not following up with you and others sooner on the re-boot problem you are experiencing o 2-2. In the background engineering has been trying to narrow down the cause. It is especially difficult because the problem does not exhibit itself on the receivers we are using. We have checked the GBH DT transport stream on an analyzer and things look normal.
We were originally looking at the possibility that something in a datacast stream in the GBH DT transport might be disturbing some receivers, What did not make sense to us is that we have had the Data in the stream for almost a year. The problem you mention has been happening in the past couple of months. With your discovery of a link to missing guide info and a re-boot, has me looking at the import of program schedule info into the PSIP tables. We will pursue further investigation on this end. It is good that you also reported the issue to the manufacturer.
Please keep us posted, as I will this forum.

I owe you a call.



IBBP,

Thanks for the followup.

I'd be happy to work with you and do any sort of 'real-time' testing or data collection that you'd like. There is another user on this forum who is experiencing the same issue and I'm sure they would also be able to participate in any testing.

Again, thanks for the followup. I look forward to when I'll be able to watch WGBH-DT (and hopefully the same fix will work for WGBX-DT)!

-Brian

I'd also like to ask a specific question about 25-1 (Fox). It is the weakest channel according to my tuner, and I don't maintain signal acquisition reliably. Is there something specific I can do to enhance or address problems with that one frequency?

You are correct WFXT-DT is running at a very low power. Your receiver is probably having a hard time staying with any direct signal because the echos are so close in strength, hence the drops. Perhaps putting a variable attenuator in line (found at the local radio shack) will help with this.

There has been little movement on their app for full power on the current channel. Looks like they will be waiting to fall back to 25 to run at full power in 09.

Anyone else have issues with CW (56-1)....it's the only channel I haven't been able to lock down reliably even though it seems to be located the same distance and general direction as my other channels.

Anyone else have issues with CW (56-1)....it's the only channel I haven't been able to lock down reliably even though it seems to be located the same distance and general direction as my other channels.

No problems locking it down from RI. "The Tube" carried on the sub channel is really worth tweaking your gear to get.

No problems locking it down from RI. "The Tube" carried on the sub channel is really worth tweaking your gear to get.

Oddly enough I think that one is the strongest one I get...

I'm on the south shore so getting some RI channels is also good. All in all I'd say I might get about two dozen stations.

Granted I do have the problem with 2.2 of PBS but I can live with that given they have the most stations (4 of 44 and 1 of 2)

WFXT I have to give some credit for maybe it's atmospheric conditions but the baseball games have came incredible (granted I'm watching it of SD)

Spanish programming I think started up...now I get I think univison or telemundo..is there english closed captioning on that?

You guys may be interested in the following reviews of a couple of new set-top boxes that use the latest 5th generation 8VSB chipsets in their front ends. They get amazing reception results (by current standards) and seem to deliver on the promise of easy OTA reception.

http://www.hdtvexpert.com/pages_b/h260f.html
http://www.hdtvexpert.com/pages_b/onair.html

IBBP,

I'm still suffering from the reboot issues. I've been randomly testing 2.2 and 2.1 over the past week and have never been able to watch the channels. My TV constantly reboots. Any luck in determing the root cause of the issue?

-Brian

I'm still unable to get closed captioning on WSBK-DT, because the TV thinks there's a digital captioning signal (containing no text), and so it won't let me select the analog captioning signal, since it was programmed to use the digital signal when it sees that both are available. Interestingly, there was one time when I managed to get captioning on WSBK-DT. It was an infomercial for an all terrain vehicle of some kind that was running one day somewhere in the 4AM to 6AM region. For that one "show", it seemed that the fake/blank digital captioning signal was silent, and so my TV let me select the analog captions. It's very annoying.

The TV in question is an LG 37LC2D, which I have had for about two and a half months, but I don't blame the TV. It's doing what it was designed to do, and doesn't seem to demonstrate this problem with other stations.

1080i AND 720p I'm confused. I have a Vizio TV with choices wide or normal for the screen. Today during the President's speech I checked the major Boston channels direct from the OTA antenna (coaxial from roof to TV). The info said both 4 and 7 were 1080i, but 5 was 720p all were what I would call pillared. While he was still speaking I changed to the D* signal and got exactly the same results in fact 4, BN4, and 4-1 all had the same picture and difficult to see much difference. The same was true for the most part with 5, 5BN, 5-1, 7, 7BN, and 7-1. Does anyone know which any of them were really broadcasting? To make matters worse after the President spoke Channel 5 went to its regularly scheduled network show and still said it was broadcasting in 720p, but now filled the screen rather than being pillared. Anybody any clues.

PatO

1080i AND 720p I'm confused. I have a Vizio TV with choices wide or normal for the screen. Today during the President's speech I checked the major Boston channels direct from the OTA antenna (coaxial from roof to TV). The info said both 4 and 7 were 1080i, but 5 was 720p all were what I would call pillared. While he was still speaking I changed to the D* signal and got exactly the same results in fact 4, BN4, and 4-1 all had the same picture and difficult to see much difference. The same was true for the most part with 5, 5BN, 5-1, 7, 7BN, and 7-1. Does anyone know which any of them were really broadcasting? To make matters worse after the President spoke Channel 5 went to its regularly scheduled network show and still said it was broadcasting in 720p, but now filled the screen rather than being pillared. Anybody any clues.

PatO
Channels 5.1 and 25.1 broadcast in 720p. All other HD channels in the area seem to broadcast in 1080i.

If the source material is not shot with HD cameras, and is therefore in a 4:3 aspect ratio, an HD station broadcasts it in a pillarboxed format, which is to say that the pillarboxing is added at the station, such that they are sending you a 16:9 widescreen image that includes the black bars, which means that the TV must be set to a 16:9 mode to make what appears to the eye to be a 4:3 image look right.

For non-HD stations -- such as 2.1, 5.2, 7.2, 44.x, 56.2, and all of the analog stations, all of which broadcast in 480i -- the TV must be set to 4:3 because the image being sent is true 4:3, meaning that the pillars are not being added at the station, and must be added by the TV itself in order for the image to appear correct.

Does this answer your question?

720p is ABC's and Fox's selected HDTV format. 1080i is the HTDV format selected by most of the other networks.

Stations are presently exempt from closed-captioning programs between 2AM and 6AM. I work at two on the West Coast and we watch this closely. CBS "Up-to-the-Minute" overnight is not CC'd by the network. Many infomercials try to sneak by.

I am considering getting HDTV OTA instead of Comcast.

I live on Commonwealth Ave in Back Bay facing North on the first floor, and when I go to antennaweb.org, 90% of the stations are between 260 and 266 degrees. These are located approximately straight down Comm Ave, but it looks like my line of sight might be slightly cut off by the neighboring buildings (which is a very long line of buildings).

What is the liklihood that I would get decent OTA? Will the 100 or so buildings lined up next to mine totally destroy my line of sight to the broadcast tower, or is it okay that I am slightly off from a "direct" line of sight to the tower? I get decent Analog reception with my rabbit ear antennas; is that any predictor of the HDTV OTA reception? Does anyone have any OTA experience on Commonwealth Ave or elsewhere in the Back Bay area? Thanks for your help!
-Peter

Channels 5.1 and 25.1 broadcast in 720p. All other HD channels in the area seem to broadcast in 1080i.

If the source material is not shot with HD cameras, and is therefore in a 4:3 aspect ratio, an HD station broadcasts it in a pillarboxed format, which is to say that the pillarboxing is added at the station, such that they are sending you a 16:9 widescreen image that includes the black bars, which means that the TV must be set to a 16:9 mode to make what appears to the eye to be a 4:3 image look right.

For non-HD stations -- such as 2.1, 5.2, 7.2, 44.x, 56.2, and all of the analog stations, all of which broadcast in 480i -- the TV must be set to 4:3 because the image being sent is true 4:3, meaning that the pillars are not being added at the station, and must be added by the TV itself in order for the image to appear correct.

Does this answer your question?

I understand everything that you say. My major question still remains. How do I know when what I'm watching on channels 4-1, 5-1, 7-1, and 25-1 is high definition? Cronicle last night was amazing, but much of what I watch seems humdrum in comparison.

PatO

Ok, say your watching 7.1 at 5pm, for there newscast.

There newscast is shot in 4:3, which is shown on the SD feed (normal channel 7),

HOWEVER

For the Digital feed, they upscale the original 4:3 image (ie, make it look better), add sidebars, and transmit it 16x9 in 1080i.

The easiest 'tell' to see if its real HD or not is simply, if its full widescreen (ie, no black bars), thats a start. It can still be 480p widescreen, but usually only FOX does that.

The easiest 'tell' to see if its real HD or not is simply, if its full widescreen (ie, no black bars), thats a start. It can still be 480p widescreen, but usually only FOX does that.

Can I say then that if it is not 16X9 then it is not true high definition? If it is pillared it is not true high definition!

PatO

FYI, in case it hasn't been posted yet.
As of 10/25, WCVB, 7:30pm, Chronicle is broadcast in HD every day from now on. I believe it is 1080i with 5.1 audio. At least that's what they said on yesterdays show.

As of 10/25, WCVB, 7:30pm, Chronicle is broadcast in HD every day from now on. I believe it is 1080i with 5.1 audio. At least that's what they said on yesterdays show.

Last night was 720p and would expect that going forward

Can I say then that if it is not 16X9 then it is not true high definition? If it is pillared it is not true high definition!

PatO

Hense the "its a start", one could make the claim that it is still transmitted full 16x9 1080i, but using upscalers etc, so again, not true HD, but being transmitted LIKE true HD, hense the TV showing it as 1080i, as it technically would be, even though its not.

It just tends to be an easy tell, if the picture coming through the pipe is true 16x9 (ie, no pillars), theres a GOOD chance that it MAY be real HD, but its not always true (ie FOX, or locals who stretch anything on there DT channel)

I just didnt want to confuse anyone , no 'simple' way to tell!

Hense the "its a start", one could make the claim that it is still transmitted full 16x9 1080i, but using upscalers etc, so again, not true HD, but being transmitted LIKE true HD, hense the TV showing it as 1080i, as it technically would be, even though its not.

It just tends to be an easy tell, if the picture coming through the pipe is true 16x9 (ie, no pillars), theres a GOOD chance that it MAY be real HD, but its not always true (ie FOX, or locals who stretch anything on there DT channel)

I just didnt want to confuse anyone , no 'simple' way to tell!

CJPC is correct, but you want a simpler answer, if I read your post correctly. 99% of the time, If you have a 16x9 display of a digital channel on your TV it is HD. If the audio is DD5.1, then the odds go up to 99.9%.

CJPC is correct, but you want a simpler answer, if I read your post correctly. 99% of the time, If you have a 16x9 display of a digital channel on your TV it is HD. If the audio is DD5.1, then the odds go up to 99.9%.

Actually my post is the other way around. If it is not 16X9 then it is not HD true or false or maybe?

Can I say then that if it is not 16X9 then it is not true high definition? If it is pillared it is not true high definition!

PatO

Correct 99.99% of the time.

Stations are presently exempt from closed-captioning programs between 2AM and 6AM. I work at two on the West Coast and we watch this closely. CBS "Up-to-the-Minute" overnight is not CC'd by the network. Many infomercials try to sneak by.
So are you saying that the reason I once was able to receive closed captioning on an infomercial on WSBK-DT around 4AM-6AM was because this (theoretical) phantom digital captioning signal somehow gets turned off in that time slot, allowing the infomercial's native analog captioning to shine through? I do know that, for that one brief shining moment of captioning reception, my (LG 37LC2D) TV was giving me the analog/EIA-608 (Line 21) captioning options (Off/CC1/CC2/CC3/CC4/Text1/Text2/Text3/Text4), whereas the rest of the time on WSBK-DT it gives me the digital/EIA-708 captioning options (Off/English/Spanish/French), and displays no captions at all.

Though I lack the equipment to prove or disprove it, I have a theory that WSBK-DT, at least during most hours of the day (including during Southpark), is sending an EIA-608/Line21 captioning signal which contains the actual captions, just as they appear on WSBK analog, but also inadvertently sending a blank EIA-708 digital captioning signal, and that my TV sees both of these signals, and is programmed to display only this (theoretical) 708 signal when both are available, but that this leads to no captioning at all because the 708 signal contains no text. Meanwhile, people with TVs that allow them to manually choose to ignore the 708 signal, and display the 608 signal even when the 708 one is present, would be able to get captioning on WSBK-DT.

I don't know how to go about proving/disproving this theory, whom to contact, nor what tests to tell them to run. I don't know if anyone, is in violation of FCC rules regarding captioning. I suppose that it's possible that the FCC rules are so lax as to allow a TV station's captioning signal to be incompatible with a certain brand of TV, without either the station or the TV maker being in violation. There's a lot here I just can't know.

Tempus. Robert Yankowitz is the engineer for WSBK. His last post is one page up, #7169. He is the person to address.

Mallego

So are you saying that the reason I once was able to receive closed captioning on an infomercial on WSBK-DT around 4AM-6AM was because this (theoretical) phantom digital captioning signal somehow gets turned off in that time slot, allowing the infomercial's native analog captioning to shine through? I do know that, for that one brief shining moment of captioning reception, my (LG 37LC2D) TV was giving me the analog/EIA-608 (Line 21) captioning options (Off/CC1/CC2/CC3/CC4/Text1/Text2/Text3/Text4), whereas the rest of the time on WSBK-DT it gives me the digital/EIA-708 captioning options (Off/English/Spanish/French), and displays no captions at all.

Though I lack the equipment to prove or disprove it, I have a theory that WSBK-DT, at least during most hours of the day (including during Southpark), is sending an EIA-608/Line21 captioning signal which contains the actual captions, just as they appear on WSBK analog, but also inadvertently sending a blank EIA-708 digital captioning signal, and that my TV sees both of these signals, and is programmed to display only this (theoretical) 708 signal when both are available, but that this leads to no captioning at all because the 708 signal contains no text. Meanwhile, people with TVs that allow them to manually choose to ignore the 708 signal, and display the 608 signal even when the 708 one is present, would be able to get captioning on WSBK-DT.

I don't know how to go about proving/disproving this theory, whom to contact, nor what tests to tell them to run. I don't know if anyone, is in violation of FCC rules regarding captioning. I suppose that it's possible that the FCC rules are so lax as to allow a TV station's captioning signal to be incompatible with a certain brand of TV, without either the station or the TV maker being in violation. There's a lot here I just can't know.
Tempus,

We have been trying to track down the source of your difficulty, without success, I'm afraid. Several of our technicians spent some hours on it this week. We have been digging very deep into our signal path to try to find something that differs between WSBK's and WLWC's (our other station that does not have 708 encoding equipment) systems. So far we can find no difference, however we do have a Samsung receiver that behaves similar to your LG. In fact, we too have seen an occasional decoding of the 608 caption, only to see the receiver stubbornly turn back to 708 after a short time.

As for your questions regarding FCC rules, head here: http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/dro/ccrules.html for some enjoyable reading. These are the current closed caption rules.

We haven't given up yet. Don't give up on us, please.

We have been trying to track down the source of your difficulty, without success, I'm afraid. Several of our technicians spent some hours on it this week. We have been digging very deep into our signal path to try to find something that differs between WSBK's and WLWC's (our other station that does not have 708 encoding equipment) systems. So far we can find no difference, however we do have a Samsung receiver that behaves similar to your LG. In fact, we too have seen an occasional decoding of the 608 caption, only to see the receiver stubbornly turn back to 708 after a short time.I appreciate your efforts, and I hope they yield success. To that end, I would like to point out that WLWC-DT is just outside my reception range, so if WLWC-DT had the same problem as WSBK-DT, I wouldn't know. In order for me to receive WLWC-DT at all, I have to wait until the weather is such that there is an extremely rare state of high tropospheric ducting. As a result, in the entire time I have had the TV, I was only able to get WLWC-DT to come in once, and then only for a few minutes. I was so surprised at the time that it did not occur to me to do captioning tests on it.

Can I assume that the reason you are concentrating on finding a difference between WSBK-DT and WLWC-DT is that you have only seen the Samsung TV in question exhibit the problem with WSBK-DT, and not with WLWC-DT?

As for your questions regarding FCC rules, head here: http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/dro/ccrules.html for some enjoyable reading. These are the current closed caption rules.I will try to read through all of that later tonight. Since one good turn (or link) deserves another, here's a link for you:

http://www.dxinfocentre.com/tropo.html

It is a tropospheric ducting forecast, to help find the times when you are most likely to be able to pull in distant stations. Perhaps you already know about it, since it relates to your profession, but I'm sure others will find it interesting.

We haven't given up yet. Don't give up on us, please.Until now, I thought that you still believed that I had not configured my TV correctly. Now that I know that you have seen a similar problem for yourselves, and are working on finding a resolution, I will try to remain hopeful.

Can I assume that the reason you are concentrating on finding a difference between WSBK-DT and WLWC-DT is that you have only seen the Samsung TV in question exhibit the problem with WSBK-DT, and not with WLWC-DT?
You are correct. We are using identical encoding equipment for both stations, and we have no trouble receiving WLWC's captions on the Samsung receivers, but cannot receive WSBK's. We discovered that just about the same time you brought up the subject again on Monday.

IBBP,

I'm still suffering from the reboot issues. I've been randomly testing 2.2 and 2.1 over the past week and have never been able to watch the channels. My TV constantly reboots. Any luck in determing the root cause of the issue?

-Brian

Testing 2.2 and 2.1 this morning (Saturday, 28oct2006) I find that everything is working fine.

The program info for 2.2 reads:

Program name: PBS HD Program
Program detail: No detail information


The program info for 2.1 reads:

Program name: DTV Program
Program detail: DTV Program

-BL

Testing 2.2 and 2.1 this morning (Saturday, 28oct2006) I find that everything is working fine.

The program info for 2.2 reads:

Program name: PBS HD Program
Program detail: No detail information


The program info for 2.1 reads:

Program name: DTV Program
Program detail: DTV Program

-BL


Still working for me on Sunday morning. Woo hoo! Two days in a row. Must be some kind of record... ;-)

FOX HD has been down since noon here, anyone else ?
:mad:

FOX HD has been down since noon here, anyone else ?
:mad:


That and CBS HD down for me here in Stoughton. It sings even more that it's Sunday and both stations show NFL. :mad:

Well, I rarely get Fox HD reliably anyway, their signal is so weak to start with -- but I'm getting nothing at all today.

CBS and FOX are fine for me in Salisbury.

Fox 25 working great. All local DT reception excellent.

I am considering getting HDTV OTA instead of Comcast.

I live on Commonwealth Ave in Back Bay facing North on the first floor, and when I go to antennaweb.org, 90% of the stations are between 260 and 266 degrees. These are located approximately straight down Comm Ave, but it looks like my line of sight might be slightly cut off by the neighboring buildings (which is a very long line of buildings).

What is the liklihood that I would get decent OTA? Will the 100 or so buildings lined up next to mine totally destroy my line of sight to the broadcast tower, or is it okay that I am slightly off from a "direct" line of sight to the tower? I get decent Analog reception with my rabbit ear antennas; is that any predictor of the HDTV OTA reception? Does anyone have any OTA experience on Commonwealth Ave or elsewhere in the Back Bay area? Thanks for your help!
-PeterI can't say for sure, but you can probably figure something out without too much trouble. It's not as critical to have a perfect line of sight as with some technologies. And you're fairly close to the towers, and the nearby buildings aren't that tall. A decent HDTV antenna that can sort out multipath problems, maybe an amplified one, would probably work. Under $100 still.

I have a better line of sight and am up higher, and granted I'm only using a $20 non-amplified Silver Sensor - but I'm surprised at how uneven the signals are (strength on WGBH 2-2 varies from 10% to 60%); and how they aren't as directional as I would have expected.

Maybe someone with more nearly your situation can comment. But I'd say it's worth a try.

Fox HD was down on Comcast from around noon until around 3 PM yesterday. I had to watch the SD Giants game, but the HD channel was back when I checked at 4 PM. No problem with CBS.

Does anybody know if the cable system in Brattleboro, VT carries any of the Boston/Worcester stations in HD yet? Technically, Windham County, VT is still a portion of this market based on viewing habits. I first thought they'd be part of Burlington/Plattsburgh. Stranger yet, Brattleboro lies closer to Springfield, MA than Burlington, VT (and Massachusetts is only 10 miles to the south). :confused:

Still working for me on Sunday morning. Woo hoo! Two days in a row. Must be some kind of record... ;-)


IBBP,

If you made any changes to the PSIP data in WGBH-DT, please leave them in their current state. I've had perfect reception (i.e., no reboots) for about 5 days now.

Thanks!

-BL

Regardless of the aspect ratio, shouldn't you be able to tell when a program is in HD by the picture quality? If the picture looks grainy, the edges are "soft", it is
probably an SD source. If the edges are clean, it is likely an HD source.

If you can't tell the difference by this, then you probably don't have a very good
television.

TV station upconverting is the equivalent of ripping a song off an old phonograph and burning it onto a CD. When listening the the CD, the only for-sure giveaway of its source is the sound quality.

Well, I think you also need to consider your source. Some sources of "HD" signals heavily compress the signal, so you might indeed see tell-tale indicators typically associated with SD, even though the signal itself started out as HD.

For those living in/around the Taunton area, would you please recommend a decent antenna, preferably indoor. At the moment I'm considering the DB4 from antennasdirect, it's medium multi-directional and *should* do the trick. If anyone has any other recommendations, I'd love to hear it. I would ideally like to place it in the attic, near a window where it will point north and northwest to pick up Boston and Providence OTA.

Hi, I am EXTREMELY new to HDTV and to OTA.

I live in Revere.

Can anyone reccomend an antenna setup for me?

I am really only concerned with recieving 2 stations in HD.... NBC and FOX.

Do I need an outdoor antenna when I am only 13 miles away from the Broadcast tower?
Can I get away with an indoor?
Does it need to be amplfied?


Thanks for any help anyone can give me.

sev1512, go to antennaweb.org and read. plug in your address.

fox isn't strong, weakest one

I already did that. Thank you though.

Its showing blue at 13 miles away... I dont get it. Fox cant be that weak.
Every other channel is in red.



sev1512, go to antennaweb.org and read. plug in your address.

fox isn't strong, weakest one

I already did that. Thank you though.

Its showing blue at 13 miles away... I dont get it. Fox cant be that weak.
Every other channel is in red.

I'm in Everett, not far from you. I use a simple outdoor antenna and I get FOX just fine. If you look through the archives you will find that there is some issue with FOX not being allowed to use full power. (I think I recall that it was a conflict with another station.)

Since I'm familiar with the Revere/Everett area, your biggest concern is not distance. It is those very large hills that dot the landscape here. If Mountain Ave, Resevoir Ave, or Orient Heights hills are between you and the stations; you are going to have to use and outdoor antenna. I need my outdoor antenna because of the Whidden Hospital hill.
The potential good news is that if you are on top of one of those hills, you will get by with the simple 'Silver Sensor' type cheap indoor unit.

Good luck,
Mike C.

Hi, I am EXTREMELY new to HDTV and to OTA.

I live in Revere.

Can anyone reccomend an antenna setup for me?

I am really only concerned with recieving 2 stations in HD.... NBC and FOX.

Do I need an outdoor antenna when I am only 13 miles away from the Broadcast tower?
Can I get away with an indoor?
Does it need to be amplfied?

Thanks for any help anyone can give me.

We are both in the same boat! I am getting my first HDTV this weekend and I didn't even realize "over the air" HD programming is available. I logged onto antennaweb and there are several HD towers within a 5 miles radius of my house.

I found a great article at cnet about installing antennas. They recommend trying your old school antenna first. If it doesn't work, they like this one: Zenith ZHD-TV1 HDTV Indoor Antenna. Try the indoor option first. If it doesn't work out, install an outdoor antenna.

If all goes well this weekend, I will let you know how it works next week.

Its showing blue at 13 miles away... I dont get it. Fox cant be that weak. Every other channel is in red.If I remember correctly, Fox is currently low-power -- they're planning on moving their digital signal onto Channel 25, when the FCC reacquires OTA analog frequencies, and that has something to do with why they're such low power now.

I recently purchased an indoor antenna for getting OTA from Boston that my TV's QAM won't pick up (it picks up Providence and NewBedford). My TV has one RF input.

The manual for my TV says that an A/B switch can be used to switch between an antenna and cable connection. However, when I switch from antenna to cable, I have to search for digital channels again. This takes a while and it's a royal PITA. Is there any way around this or is this just the way it is? I read somewhere that a "combiner" might do the trick. If so, how exactly does this combiner work?

With regard to whether you can get your television to retain ASTC channel mappings when you switch sources, you would probably be better off asking that question in a thread associated with your specific television.

Forgive me if this has already been discussed....

If I read the latest news correctly, NBC is going to move its digital signal back to channel 7 after the 2009 deadline, rather than retain their new digital channel. I had thought that the only local channel considering doing that was Fox, but according to what I'm reading, they're actually going to stay on Channel 31.

Am I reading things correctly?

I would think it would be better for all the channels to be up in the UHF range, given that that means we would only need a UHF antenna.... :shrug:

Forgive me if this has already been discussed....

If I read the latest news correctly, NBC is going to move its digital signal back to channel 7 after the 2009 deadline, rather than retain their new digital channel. I had thought that the only local channel considering doing that was Fox, but according to what I'm reading, they're actually going to stay on Channel 31.

Am I reading things correctly?

I would think it would be better for all the channels to be up in the UHF range, given that that means we would only need a UHF antenna.... :shrug:

I believe the UHF transmitters use more electricity so if VHF works and you have already developed a brand, like CBS4, why not keep the VHF slot?

Forgive me if this has already been discussed....

If I read the latest news correctly, NBC is going to move its digital signal back to channel 7 after the 2009 deadline, rather than retain their new digital channel. I had thought that the only local channel considering doing that was Fox, but according to what I'm reading, they're actually going to stay on Channel 31.

Am I reading things correctly?

I would think it would be better for all the channels to be up in the UHF range, given that that means we would only need a UHF antenna.... :shrug:

This gets really strange. I was under the impression that as of the deadline, the VHF frequencies were going to go back to the government to reassign. This was to go along with the (911) initiative to get various emergency services on equipment that was compatible with each other. They still had issue during Katrina.

I guess if the digital signal really uses less spectrum they could co-exist? The antenna that I put up is VHF/UHF, but the installer wanted to put up a UHF only in the worst way (because it was lighter?). I'm glad I argued the VHF point with him. I agree that it would be nice if all HD was VHF.

Anyone have a lead on researching the spectrum plans?

Mike Cocorochio

The frequencies going back to the government to reassign are those in the UHF channel 52 and above range. (Previously it was just 56 and above, I believe.)

Here's a link to the info on the "spectrum plans" you referred to:

http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-06-150A1.pdf

The frequencies going back to the government to reassign are those in the UHF channel 52 and above range. (Previously it was just 56 and above, I believe.)

Here's a link to the info on the "spectrum plans" you referred to:

http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-06-150A1.pdf

Bicker,
Thanks a lot for the answer and the link.
Boy, was my installer wrong. I glad I won the day with the full service antenna.
Your link was quite detailed, it had each station/location.

I also used lunchtime for some research, I didn't know how much I didn't know.
For anyone who wants a much lighter overview I found this at lunchtime:
http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/oct05/1911

Another article mentioned that the bandwidth issue is a wash. More efficiency with digital, but we also want more info. That's why we use compression also.

So it looks like we get to rearrange our channel lists quite a bit in a few years. That transition should be interesting. I'm going to assume some duplication of signals while it gets settled in 2009ish

Thanks again for article, I'm amazed.
Mike Cocorochio

I believe the UHF transmitters use more electricity so if VHF works and you have already developed a brand, like CBS4, why not keep the VHF slot?
Because low-band VHF (channels 2-6) are rotten for HDTV. The low band is very susceptible to man-made interference (such as from power lines, vacuum cleaners, motors, etc.).

The HDTV receivers will display our signal as channel 4 anyway, so the branding issue is not a big one.

For your information, Mr. Yankowitz, the other night was one of those freakish tropospheric ducting days, and I was able to pull in WLWC-DT for a little while, so I took the opportunity to test whether my LG TV could handle the captioning, and it did. It had no problem whatsoever with WLWC-DT captioning, giving me the analog/608 captioning options, i.e. Off/CC1-4/Text1-4, whereas with WSBK-DT it still refuses to display captions, and gives me the digital/708 captioning options, i.e. Off/English/Spanish/French.

This would seem to confirm that my LG is acting in much the same manner as the Samsung you're using for testing, which implies that if you can fix the problem to the satisfaction of the Samsung, it should fix it for my LG, as well.

Because low-band VHF (channels 2-6) are rotten for HDTV. The low band is very susceptible to man-made interference (such as from power lines, vacuum cleaners, motors, etc.).

The HDTV receivers will display our signal as channel 4 anyway, so the branding issue is not a big one.

There was an 'if' in my statement and I realize for 2-6 there are real issues but wouldn't you keep your channel if there wasn't a problem?

I am surprised that the branding isn't an issue. Maybe you guys in engineering haven't even told the marketing guys what is really going on ;)

They wouldn't be "keeping" the channel in any tangible way. They've be moving their digital channel, where folks have been finding it for years -- where folks have programmed their ATSC tuners to find it -- to another frequency (which just happens to be the same frequency they used for their analog signal in the past). The folks who have been pulling in their analog channel are going to have to do something different anyway -- why force change on all your viewers instead of just some?

They wouldn't be "keeping" the channel in any tangible way. They've be moving their digital channel, where folks have been finding it for years -- where folks have programmed their ATSC tuners to find it -- to another frequency (which just happens to be the same frequency they used for their analog signal in the past). The folks who have been pulling in their analog channel are going to have to do something different anyway -- why force change on all your viewers instead of just some?
Because it's better in the long term. You're thinking only of the next few years, but it would be better in the decades that follow for the station's virtual channel number to match its broadcast channel. It would be more intuitive, and would probably cut down on future support calls from confused viewers.

I don't think it would be better. I think it would be worse. I think you're mistaken about the linkage between virtual channel and broadcast channel (for which there is no practical importance or significant, today, with regard to digital OTA).

So, if you're going to go the OTA route, you get a new TV, have it do the automatic channel scan, and something calling itself "Channel 7" comes up in the list of channels you receive.

You don't have to know, and probably don't even care, which "real" channel number that maps to. All you know is that there's something called "Channel 7" among your choices.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it's my understanding that in places like the UK, there's never been a hard linkage between channel "number" (in this case, "BBC 1" or "Channel 4") and the actual channel number. TVs just get set to whatever frequencies the local transmitter's on. And, I don't recall this causing any particular confusion.

So, if you're going to go the OTA route, you get a new TV, have it do the automatic channel scan, and something calling itself "Channel 7" comes up in the list of channels you receive. You don't have to know, and probably don't even care, which "real" channel number that maps to. All you know is that there's something called "Channel 7" among your choices.Absolutely. That's the whole point of having PSIP part of ATSC, and why there is no real need to mess around with a channel allocation once assigned.

my singal went from 90 to 20 on chan7 whdh,all others are fine, its #42 on my tivo, is it me or them, Im in attleboro
thanks
gene

my singal went from 90 to 20 on chan7 whdh,all others are fine, its #42 on my tivo, is it me or them, Im in attleboro
thanks
gene

I am getting 79 to 86% signal strength on 7.1 as I write this from Westport, MA.

Question Re: PBS DT Stations

I might be getting a tuner in my Black Friday bedroom set tomorrow (the living room set is a monitor hooked up to Comcast), so I thought I would ask this here.

I know 2.2 is PBS HD, but I'm curious as to whether programs shot in WS or HD show up as such on the simulcast digital channels (2.1 and 44.1), or are letterboxed as they are on the analog channels. This might actually influence my purchasing decision tomorrow. Anything else of interest that OTA viewers see that Comcast viewers don't? TIA!

Question Re: PBS DT Stations

I know 2.2 is PBS HD, but I'm curious as to whether programs shot in WS or HD show up as such on the simulcast digital channels (2.1 and 44.1), or are letterboxed as they are on the analog channels. don't? TIA!

They are letterboxed. If your display (or tuner) has the ability to zoom, this works out well. For some reason, I can only zoom my live TV watching. If I record (myHD tuner on PC) I cannot zoom the recorded content. That ends up being a pain, and it just may be my setup.

BTW, how does this effect the decision. I have never seen HD other than over the air.

Mike Cocorochio

They are letterboxed. If your display (or tuner) has the ability to zoom, this works out well. For some reason, I can only zoom my live TV watching. If I record (myHD tuner on PC) I cannot zoom the recorded content. That ends up being a pain, and it just may be my setup.

BTW, how does this effect the decision. I have never seen HD other than over the air.

Mike Cocorochio

Trying to get a fix on how it may expand my viewing options. If a set w/tuner doesn't significantly add to what I'm already getting from Comcast, and the best choice otherwise happens to be a monitor, then it would make more sense to go with that.

You guys may be interested in the following reviews of a couple of new set-top boxes that use the latest 5th generation 8VSB chipsets in their front ends. They get amazing reception results (by current standards) and seem to deliver on the promise of easy OTA reception.

http://www.hdtvexpert.com/pages_b/h260f.html
http://www.hdtvexpert.com/pages_b/onair.html
Bob - Thanks for the post! I had all but given up hope that any new HD STBs would ever be introduced at this point (since all new displays include them.) Even more so any that would provide excellent analog component PQ in this age of digital interconnects. Some of us early adopters are stuck with very capable displays (ISFd Elite 510 in my case) which simply don't have any DVI/HDMI capability. My Panny TU-HDS20 with 1st gen tuner absolutely stinks in all regards except for the fact that it provides reference quality analog component video. Having grown accustomed to it I've failed miserably at finding an adequate replacement where the PQ was acceptable enough to justify the increased reception capability.

Well, I finally found that in the DTB-H260F this weekend!! Guts by ATI means very strong analog component video performance. Still gives up a tad of high-freq response (so some very, very fine details are lost...practically negligible) but easily gives 90+% of PQ and 1000% better reception! I think I've found my holy grail of STBs!!

Even with my CM4228 (with Winegard AP4700 pre-amp) vectored to 206 deg from Andover the auto-scan picked up every channel out of NH! Simply amazing. Not a single dropout all weekend long. Biggest difference was TV56-DT which I could only receive if vectored perfectly +/- 2 degrees on the best DX ducting days. With the 260 it locks and holds for a full 35 degrees in either direction from 206!!

For this I thank you. But more importantly, my wife and kids thank you! If you only knew how may programs they sat through with dropouts every 30 seconds since I insisted on trying to watch in HD instead of admitting failure and reverting to SD. :)

For this I thank you. But more importantly, my wife and kids thank you! If you only knew how may programs they sat through with dropouts every 30 seconds since I insisted on trying to watch in HD instead of admitting failure and reverting to SD. :)
Just another service from the happy HD folks at WBZ-DT!

Got the DTB-H260F today! Hopefully it deals with multipath better than my old samsung unit. I am only 8 miles away from the towers, and on a hill, but the multipath some times caused dropouts.

Wow! Sounds like gen 5 tuners are amazing. My gen 4 tuner built into my D*TV HD10 is sensitive to +- 2 degrees of tuning, and gets buggy during high wind/falling leaves/storms/etc. for fringe low power stations like 25.1 where I live in Westport, MA about 50 miles away. Anyone know if the HD20 D*TV box has the latest tuner? My 1999 era HDTV doesn't have an ATSC tuner, so that's what I rely on.

Bob

Any update on when Jeopardy will be in HD on TV38? You had originally said you thought early to mid December. Is that still the time frame?

TIA

SMK

Hi folks, my brother lives in Boston and is looking to put a home theater in his house. Is there a dealer you folks would recommend that has a decent number of projectors in stock that he can view as he's relatively new to this.

Thanks and sorry for getting off topic.

For those who can receive WMUR-9-DT, do you hear a crackling or static in the audio? It seems to be more obvious when a woman is talking with no background music or other sound. I can heard it during the 6:00 news and on other programs.

thanks, Mallego

Does anyone know if WGBH Channel 44 HD is on the Boston Comcast system? I'm thinking of dropping DirecTV for Comcast, but their DVR does not have an input for OTA, and I can't find their channel listings on their site.

Does anyone know if WGBH Channel 44 HD is on the Boston Comcast system? I'm thinking of dropping DirecTV for Comcast, but their DVR does not have an input for OTA, and I can't find their channel listings on their site.
If you mean the PBSHD channel, then yes it is on 802. The channel 44 subchannels (all SD) are also in the channel list.

If you mean the PBSHD channel, then yes it is on 802. The channel 44 subchannels (all SD) are also in the channel list.

From what I can gather, Channel 802 is WGBH-HD Channel 2. I am inquiring about Channel 44 - are you saying it is only available as an SD channel? It DOES broadcast in HD OTA.

Channel 44 in HD? Not in my experience.

They transmit 4 SD channels on that carrier, at least 3 of which can be picked up on Comcast. Interestingly, you can also find the fourth in clear QAM, although I'm not sure what cable channel it shows up on.

802 is WGBH's 2-1, which is usually Rudy Maxa travel shows. 2 is 2-2, which is GBH's SD "regular" channel. 44-* can be found in the 200s as GBH-Kids, GBH-Create, etc.

Digital channel 44 simulcasts the PBSHD channel during the middle of the night. I believe it goes back to regular programming around 5AM. During this period Comcast shuts down the 44 subchannels.

Well, ok, that 'splains why my cable reception of the sub-channels always goes away in the middle of the night.

Channel 44 in HD? Not in my experience.

They transmit 4 SD channels on that carrier, at least 3 of which can be picked up on Comcast. Interestingly, you can also find the fourth in clear QAM, although I'm not sure what cable channel it shows up on.

802 is WGBH's 2-1, which is usually Rudy Maxa travel shows. 2 is 2-2, which is GBH's SD "regular" channel. 44-* can be found in the 200s as GBH-Kids, GBH-Create, etc.
I have an OTA antenna on I get Rudy Maxa on 2-2 and the regular programming on 2-1. According to HDTV magazine for today there are only 3 shows on 2-1 in HD and 21 HD shows on 2-2 (some are repeats of earlier shows). There was no HD programming on any of the 4 channel 44 subchannels.

Last time I checked, this was my line-up for PBS:

82-1: WGBH-TV (2) [2]
84-1: WGBH-HD ("2-2") [802]
82-9: WGBX-TV (44) [16]
85-1: GBH World (44-2) [209]
85-3: GBH Create (44-3) [237]
85-2: GBH Kids (44-4) [217]
83-3: WENH-TV (11) [11]

I've looked through a decent portion of this thread and couldn't find anything.
Does anyone have a compiled list of OTA HD stations that are available around the boston area?

Similar to the PBS one above, but for the remaining channels as well.

Gracias!

I've looked through a decent portion of this thread and couldn't find anything.
Does anyone have a compiled list of OTA HD stations that are available around the boston area?

Similar to the PBS one above, but for the remaining channels as well.

Gracias!

Here's a start on OTA channels in the Boston area (first # is the RF channel number, the # in parenthesis is the channel's well known #):

19-1 WGBHDT (2-1)
19-2 WGBHDT2 (2-2)
20-1 WCVBDT (5-1)
20-2 WCVBDT2 (5-2)
23-1 WUTFDT (66-1)
30-1 WBZDT (4-1)
31-1 WFXTDT (25-1)
32-3 WBPXDT3 (68-3)
32-5 WBPXDT5 (68-5)
39-1 WSBKDT (38-1)
41-1 WLVIDT (56-1)
41-2 WLVIDT2 (56-2)
42-1 WHDHDT (7-1)
42-2 WHDHDT2 (7-2)
43-1 WGBXDT (44-1)
43-2 WGBXDT2 (44-2)
43-3 WGBXDT3 (44-3)
43-4 WGBXDT4 (44-4)

This is the only OTA thread I could find for New England, so I hope I'm posting this in the right place. My sister and brother in law in Jaffrey, NH, 70 miles NW of Boston, 40 miles WSW of Manchester, are going to get an HDTV for Christmas. They're asking me what they need to do for HD reception.

They presently have an outdoor antenna on the roof and can pick up all of the NTSC Boston stations plus several outside Boston and up there in New Hampshire. Is there anyone on this list up in that area that can tell me if they'll get the digital stations OTA?

Thanks.

Larry
San Francisco

If they can pick up the NTSC signals with their antenna, they should have no problem picking up the digital version. I am not in that area, and I can't say for sure, though.

SMK

Is there anyone on this list up in that area that can tell me if they'll get the digital stations OTA?


Go to antennaweb.org and click on choose antenna button. You will need to put in their address to get the most accurate channel listing. It will tell you what antenna they would need and what stations they could potentially receive.

cjcote

If they can pick up the NTSC signals with their antenna, they should have no problem picking up the digital version. I'm not quite sure just how consistently that is true. For me, 90% of the digital channels come in very reliably if their analog channel comes in at all, to any reasonable level of watch-ability. However, that is not true of Fox. I've been told it is because, for now, Fox is operating their digital channel at low power. So while I can tune in a marginally-acceptable version of their analog channel, the digital channel is practically unwatchable, just 13 miles away, without any reason for there to be multi-path issues.