BTW, KTVD-DT has a 60 signal level for me (33 is my threshold) but I STILL can not get any audio - no how; no way. Not on my RCA DTC-100 (1st gen) nor on my Sony HD200 (2nd gen) receivers.
Yea, I do receive the 'Stereo' sound on my MITs, on my LG 3200, nada. So, I'm note sure what they're sending out for audio,
I did notice I am getting KRDO-DT now at a 45 signal level and it has audio issues also, coming in and out continuously. I didn't even move my antenna -- it's pointing nearly perpendicular to C/S. I noticed the PSIP marks the station as KRDO-SD. I wonder -- do they change it to KRDO-HD when they have HD? What's the next thing in HD on ABC?
Cool! The bad news is they apparently don't have any HD recording equipment. So, about the only thing that they can put out in HD is live events(think sports). There is a bit more in the C/S thread, and the current end of it is here. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6838136#post6838136)

Maybe they can broadcast the NFL wildcard games on Saturday in HD? Doesn't matter to me though! :(
....jc

Those that get KMGH-DT live within spitting distance of the station (and I use that term purposely ;)

Not necessarily :) I'm probaby 20-25 miles away and can still get KMGH-DT via a rooftop UHF antenna. I can, however, see downtown Denver from my rooftop which helps tremendously...

Watching the Orange Bowl on KRDO-SD right now (in HD). First time ever at my house to see anything in HD on ABC. :D

Watching the Orange Bowl on KRDO-SD right now (in HD). First time ever at my house to see anything in HD on ABC. :D
Cool, I was wondering if they'd carry tonite's game in HD. So, for now, if it's live they've got it, otherwise? :(

Me, it's KMGH or D*'s West Feed. Either way I'm covered! ;) But I was having some audio problems! :(
....jc

Those that get KMGH-DT live within spitting distance of the station (and I use that term purposely ;) ) I also get KMGH-DT with good signal and I am more than 25 miles from downtown, but I do have line of sight from my antenna location.
What's the next thing in HD on ABC?Good Morning America is in HD every morning on ABC.

Watching the Orange Bowl on KRDO-SD right now (in HD). First time ever at my house to see anything in HD on ABC. :D
Congratulations Ron. BTW, the next BIG thing on ABC is the Rose Bowl game tomorrow night. I suspect you have already thought about that one.......Congratulations on joining those of us who already ABC HD viewers (no thanks to KMGwhatever...)
:)

Latest update in the Post (http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_3369029).

OK, you guys have already given me peace of mind that my rooftop antenna will probably work, so I'm ready to take the plunge and get a new HDTV. I want to get a true HDTV with an integrated tuner as opposed to a separate tuner. Not sure why - just seems like a neater pakage and a better idea unless you tell me it's totally stupid. Anyway, I've tried to read up on tuners so as not to bother you with too many questions, but I'm getting a wee bit confused and I know you can resolve my confusion in a heartbeat.

If I am getting OTA signals, I assume I want to be able to get both digital and analog, both because some channels are not yet digital, and some that are digital, like Channel 7, are hit and miss.

So when looking at specs for TVs with integrated tuners, what exactly do I need to make sure it says? For example, the Sony XBR says it has ATSC and NTSC (as well as QAM and cable card) but the new Sharp D6 says it has NTSC and 8VSB, whatever that is. The Sharp does not mention ATSC.

From what I have been able to glean from context, the only two I need to worry about for OTA are NTSC and ATSC, but am confused whether I need both. I am also sure y'all are not confused at all, thus my question. As always, thanks.

OK, you guys have already given me peace of mind that my rooftop antenna will probably work, so I'm ready to take the plunge and get a new HDTV. I want to get a true HDTV with an integrated tuner as opposed to a separate tuner. Not sure why - just seems like a neater pakage and a better idea unless you tell me it's totally stupid. Anyway, I've tried to read up on tuners so as not to bother you with too many questions, but I'm getting a wee bit confused and I know you can resolve my confusion in a heartbeat.

If I am getting OTA signals, I assume I want to be able to get both digital and analog, both because some channels are not yet digital, and some that are digital, like Channel 7, are hit and miss.

So when looking at specs for TVs with integrated tuners, what exactly do I need to make sure it says? For example, the Sony XBR says it has ATSC and NTSC (as well as QAM and cable card) but the new Sharp D6 says it has NTSC and 8VSB, whatever that is. The Sharp does not mention ATSC.

From what I have been able to glean from context, the only two I need to worry about for OTA are NTSC and ATSC, but am confused whether I need both. I am also sure y'all are not confused at all, thus my question. As always, thanks.
NTSC is the old, analog TV, and ATSC is the digital format. ATSC uses an RF modulation format known as 8-VSB (8-level Vestigial SideBand), so at least from a marketing perspective, 8VSB is equivalent terminology to ATSC. To meet your needs for you would want both NTSC and ATSC. After the analog shutoff, there will be no more NTSC in US and so you would only need ATSC (though analog cable might still exist, and you might still have an old VCR that hooks up through channel 3 with NTSC).

QAM (Quadrature Amplitude Modulation) is the digital cable standard. You would need this if you want to connect your TV to a cable TV system without a box. Cable Card capability allows the built-in tuner to decode the scrambled channels. The card itself comes from the cable TV company, and fits into a slot in the TV. This is only one-way, however, unlike a cable box. There is a new cable card format in development that would allow two-way services such as PPV and video-on-demand services to work without a cable box. You would have to wait to get this capability, probably into 2007 or beyond.

Doug, I had these same questions as well.
I just got my 1st HDTV, the JVC HD-P61R1U, it as 2 coax inputs, 1 labeled as uhf/vhf the other ASTC / digital, I have Basic Comcast with no Set top Box.
From the wall I split the coax, so both TV inputs are connected.
The TV has a digital/Analog button on the remonte to switch between the 2 RF inputs. In Analog I get 2-99 channels, none of these are in HD.
When I select the digital button, I get the digital channels, like D18-1 is CBS, these channels come in HD, like 9 news, CSI, the Las Vegas show, etc... these look great, all for 10$ per month through Comcast.

If I wanted to use a OTA antenna I would do the same setup, antenna to a splitter to both TV inputs, I cannot combine my cable with my antenna connections. I would need a A/B type switch between cable and OTA, then run the auto channel scan with each A/B switch.

If I were to get a cable card installed in the TV, then I'd hook up the OTA antenna to the TV RF inputs. Then I think I could switch between cable and OTA with out an A/B switch.

Hope this helps

OK, you guys have already given me peace of mind that my rooftop antenna will probably work, so I'm ready to take the plunge and get a new HDTV. I want to get a true HDTV with an integrated tuner as opposed to a separate tuner. Not sure why - just seems like a neater pakage and a better idea unless you tell me it's totally stupid. Anyway, I've tried to read up on tuners so as not to bother you with too many questions, but I'm getting a wee bit confused and I know you can resolve my confusion in a heartbeat.

If I am getting OTA signals, I assume I want to be able to get both digital and analog, both because some channels are not yet digital, and some that are digital, like Channel 7, are hit and miss.

So when looking at specs for TVs with integrated tuners, what exactly do I need to make sure it says? For example, the Sony XBR says it has ATSC and NTSC (as well as QAM and cable card) but the new Sharp D6 says it has NTSC and 8VSB, whatever that is. The Sharp does not mention ATSC.

From what I have been able to glean from context, the only two I need to worry about for OTA are NTSC and ATSC, but am confused whether I need both. I am also sure y'all are not confused at all, thus my question. As always, thanks.

Simply,

NTSC = Analog OTA
ATSC = 8VSB (this is the actual format of an ATSC signal) = Digital OTA
QAM = Unencrypted cable
CableCard = Encrypted cable (need to get a physical card from Comcast - don't know if they are doing this locally)

You'll want both NTSC and ATSC if you are relying on OTA only. If you have cable or satellite, you probably don't need NTSC because you already get the local analog stations.

Edit: Wow, quite the response. I guess I was a little slow. :D

Simply,

NTSC = Analog OTA
ATSC = 8VSB (this is the actual format of an ATSC signal) = Digital OTA
QAM = Unencrypted cable
CableCard = Encrypted cable (need to get a physical card from Comcast - don't know if they are doing this locally)

You'll want both NTSC and ATSC if you are relying on OTA only. If you have cable or satellite, you probably don't need NTSC because you already get the local analog stations.

Edit: Wow, quite the response. I guess I was a little slow. :D

Thanks all. So I will make sure the TV says it has NTSC and either ATSC or 8VSB. I assume they all probably do. Confusion resolved. Do you know by chance, if anyone has compiled a list anywhere of 32" LCDs avialble that have built in tuners?

Latest update in the Post (http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_3369029).

After reading that article, it occurs to me that LCG and the rest of us should quit refering to the new tower as the 'SUPER Tower!' and refer to it as the 'New Low-Impact Tower!'

I don't know if I want a 'super' tower in my backyard, but a new, low impact tower? Now your talking!

Tim

I can tell you that I live 2.7 miles from the channel 7/7.1 signal and CANNOT get their 7.1 signal...in fact my reception from 7.0 is not perfect, it flickers a bit.

Good Luck! Any help from anyone else would be great. BTW, I purchased a medium directional antenna that was highly recommended from this site.

I can tell you that I live 2.7 miles from the channel 7/7.1 signal and CANNOT get their 7.1 signal...in fact my reception from 7.0 is not perfect, it flickers a bit.
7.1 is broadcast from a coat hanger on the roof of KMGH's building on Speer Blvd; 7.0 is broadcast from Lookout Mountain.

So does anyone know what 19-1 is transmitting incorrectly such that most of us don't receive any audio? Does anyone have the capability of checking the PSIP data? Would it do any good to contact KTVD at this point?

So does anyone know what 19-1 is transmitting incorrectly such that most of us don't receive any audio? Does anyone have the capability of checking the PSIP data? Would it do any good to contact KTVD at this point?
I still haven't gotten the promised phone call from KTVD's chief engineer, so I haven't had a chance to ask them about their audio issues yet. :(

Thanks all. So I will make sure the TV says it has NTSC and either ATSC or 8VSB. I assume they all probably do. Confusion resolved. Do you know by chance, if anyone has compiled a list anywhere of 32" LCDs avialble that have built in tuners?

In Denver because of the Lookout Moutain & KMGH issues I would make sure the TV has a QAM tuner. That way if you are unable to pickup KMGH OTA you can get it in HD through Comcast basic (no set top box required) for ~ $15/month provided Comcast has upgraded your area. (If you can get Comcast digital in your area it has probably been upgraded but you don't need to order any of their digital packages to get the local stations in HD).

Thanks all. So I will make sure the TV says it has NTSC and either ATSC or 8VSB. I assume they all probably do. Confusion resolved. Do you know by chance, if anyone has compiled a list anywhere of 32" LCDs avialble that have built in tuners?

When you get near your final selection on that HD-LCD TV (yes there are LCD TVs that aren't HD), if at all possible (maybe from the manufacturer's website), see if you can determine the source of the ATSC tuner inside. LG no longer produces standalone ATSC tuners, but is manufacturing them for the DTV industry in general. LG developed a reputation for producing the best ATSC tuners in terms of dealing w/ multi-path issues. This would be a small factor in your purchase decision, but, assuming you can determine it, it could be a tie-breaker.

As to a list of 32" HD-LCD TVs, I'd just Google it w/ qualifiers for "HD built-in" and/or "ATSC tuner". Most of the great deals on LCD TVs the past few weeks have been for those w/o ATSC tuners and/or non-HD LCD TVs. Buyer beware!

Have fun!

For those curious, as well as myself, I looked at KTVD PSIP info and found that they are mapping correctly to PID 48 for their PMT, PID 49 for video content and PID 52 for audio. However, I believe the discrepancy to be in the discriptor for their audio. According to my equipment, it lists the audio as an MPEG 2 stream when it should be an AC-3 stream. Not knowing their equipment, it is likely an issue with the encoder or PSIP generator.

Dave Martinez
WB2 Colorado
KWGN 2-1

For those curious, as well as myself, I looked at KTVD PSIP info and found that they are mapping correctly to PID 48 for their PMT, PID 49 for video content and PID 52 for audio. However, I believe the discrepancy to be in the discriptor for their audio. According to my equipment, it lists the audio as an MPEG 2 stream when it should be an AC-3 stream. Not knowing their equipment, it is likely an issue with the encoder or PSIP generator.

Dave Martinez
WB2 Colorado
KWGN 2-1

Thank you, Dave.
To offer this kind of useful information about a competing station is pretty cool.
My hat's off to you.

Hello all, great site.

I get KWGN (WB) but not KDVR (Fox.) This seems strange since they're both at the same bearing and range. Is KWGN more powerful?

I'm using a Terk directional aimed at RP and can get all the RP stations. Interestingly, I get PBS Broomfield with is way off the bearing I'm pointing at and much further away.

I live in Greenwood Village.

Maybe I should get a non-directional for KDVR?

Thanks.

Hello all, great site.

I get KWGN (WB) but not KDVR (Fox.) This seems strange since they're both at the same bearing and range. Is KWGN more powerful?
Yes, I don't remember the exact wattage but KWGN is more powerful. Like you, I have my main antenna oriented toward RP, which gives me frequent dropouts on KDVR but solid reception of KWGN.

Hello all, great site.

I get KWGN (WB) but not KDVR (Fox.) This seems strange since they're both at the same bearing and range. Is KWGN more powerful?.As far as I know.

Here in Louisville, KWGN is my strongest station and KDVR is my weakest with the RP stations fallling in between.

This of course doesn't count either KBDI-DT or KMGH-DT, with both show a signal strength of zero here…

DrrD,

KWGN is at 1/2 power, 500,000 watts and KDVR is at approx 1/3 their assigned power. You should be getting KDVR with ease. Almost everyone in the metro area can. First, Terk antennas aren't very well liked, second, it just sounds like you need to experiment with antenna locations a bit more. It's a game of inches. (Rule #4)

Thanks, I'll try moving the antenna a bit. Do KWGN and KDVR transmit from the same place (Lookout Mountain?) When I get home I'll test my signal strength, but it still seems weird I'd get KWGN so well and KDVR not at all if they're transmitting from the same spot.

Of course when I test my signal strength I may find that 1 is just over the threshold and 1 just below.

BTW, the reason I haven't tested strength yet, is before I had my antenna connected to the built-in tuner on my new sony SXRD, which does not show signal strength, but yesterday I got the D* HR10-250, which does, but I was too busy watching Discovery HD to do any technical stuff.

Interesting stuff all this. Oh yeah and you can watch TV too.

DrrD,

Are you doing a auto-scan for channels or manually adding them? Are you sure you have the correct Digital channel number for KDVR, it's DT32.

------------------

Letter in the Post regarding towers... http://www.denverpost.com/letters

When you get near your final selection on that HD-LCD TV (yes there are LCD TVs that aren't HD), if at all possible (maybe from the manufacturer's website), see if you can determine the source of the ATSC tuner inside. LG no longer produces standalone ATSC tuners, but is manufacturing them for the DTV industry in general. LG developed a reputation for producing the best ATSC tuners in terms of dealing w/ multi-path issues. This would be a small factor in your purchase decision, but, assuming you can determine it, it could be a tie-breaker.

As to a list of 32" HD-LCD TVs, I'd just Google it w/ qualifiers for "HD built-in" and/or "ATSC tuner". Most of the great deals on LCD TVs the past few weeks have been for those w/o ATSC tuners and/or non-HD LCD TVs. Buyer beware!

Have fun!

OK, based on the info you guys gave me yesterday on what ATSC, 8VSB and NTSC mean, I started searching. Let me give you a specific example of some specs so you can once again (perhaps finally) clairify my inability to understand.

I looked at the specs on Sharp's own web page for the Sharp LC-32D7U and LC-32D6U. Both have built in tuners, and one would assume they woudl be very similar TVs. The D7 says it has an 8VSB, QAM and Cable Card tuner, but also says the "Video System" is NTSC. The D6 says the tuner is 8VSB, NTSC, QAM and Cable Card, and the "Video System" is both NTSC and ATSC.

OK, there are several possibilities here. One is that these two TVs do have very different tuners, and the D7 has no NTSC and therefore I would not be able to get OTA analog signals with that TV, but could on the D6. A second possibility is just sloppy spec writing. A third very likely possibility is I don't know how to read specs.

So which is it? And what does the "video system" spec mean? Thanks again guys.

OK, based on the info you guys gave me yesterday on what ATSC, 8VSB and NTSC mean, I started searching. Let me give you a specific example of some specs so you can once again (perhaps finally) clairify my inability to understand.

I looked at the specs on Sharp's own web page for the Sharp LC-32D7U and LC-32D6U. Both have built in tuners, and one would assume they woudl be very similar TVs. The D7 says it has an 8VSB, QAM and Cable Card tuner, but also says the "Video System" is NTSC. The D6 says the tuner is 8VSB, NTSC, QAM and Cable Card, and the "Video System" is both NTSC and ATSC.

OK, there are several possibilities here. One is that these two TVs do have very different tuners, and the D7 has no NTSC and therefore I would not be able to get OTA analog signals with that TV, but could on the D6. A second possibility is just sloppy spec writing. A third very likely possibility is I don't know how to read specs.

So which is it? And what does the "video system" spec mean? Thanks again guys.
I have no idea what the "marketing specs" are referring to. Accodring to the manual for the D7 (on page 96, or page 97 of the pdf file), it supports NTSC VHF (2-13), NTSC UHF (4-69), NTSC CATV (1-125), Digital Terrestial Broadcast 8VSB (2-69), and and Digital Cable 64/256 QAM. So I think this unit would meet all of your needs. The tuner may be the same or different than the D6; the panel is supposedly better in the D7. One of my sets is the Sony XBR1 26" LCD set, and I like it very much (and its tuner has the same capabilities).

There is another area of avsforum that discuss LCD display devices and sets, and there are plenty of threads in there for the Sharp LCDs.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=&f=40

You might want to check this out, as there are no doubt people there with experience with those sets (though not necessarily with our great OTA situation in the Denver DMA :().

I have been lurking here for a while and now have decided to join in the fun. Has anybody else tried to pick up the Colorado Springs ABC station up North? I am in North Thornton and suffered through the last couple of nights watching the Bowl games in Low Def. After having all of the other games in Hi Def on ESPN it was tough to watch. Luckily the games were good enough to help me get through it. I just pretended that I was watching the games through a rainstorm.

I don't there's anyway you can receive COS stations in Thornton. Stranger things have happened, but I seriously doubt it. KMGH should be on-line from Republic pretty soon.

Has anybody got any inside information about the new dish and receivers from Directv for the Denver area? It is starting to get hard to stay away from Comcast when the Nuggets and Avs are on in HDTV on a regular basis. It looks like with the press releases that they will only add the major locals and not the regional sports networks right now. I am also caught up in that dilemma with an HDTIVO and not wanting to give up watching recorded HI-Def.

I have been lurking here for a while and now have decided to join in the fun. Has anybody else tried to pick up the Colorado Springs ABC station up North? I am in North Thornton and suffered through the last couple of nights watching the Bowl games in Low Def. After having all of the other games in Hi Def on ESPN it was tough to watch. Luckily the games were good enough to help me get through it. I just pretended that I was watching the games through a rainstorm.

I live in Thornton, and have great reception from all Denver (well, almost all but we do not talk about them). Not a single lick of signal from any Springs stations. Cheyenne I get on good weather days, with a slight breeze from the North. I think we are in the shadow, most likely the ridge that runs down 84th and or 104th.

Has anybody got any inside information about the new dish and receivers from Directv for the Denver area? It is starting to get hard to stay away from Comcast when the Nuggets and Avs are on in HDTV on a regular basis. It looks like with the press releases that they will only add the major locals and not the regional sports networks right now. I am also caught up in that dilemma with an HDTIVO and not wanting to give up watching recorded HI-Def.
No inside info, but as soon as Comcast rolls out a dual-tuner HD TiVo (or TiVo comes out with a dual-tuner CableCard TiVo) I'm switching.

D* has only stifled DVR innovation in the last couple of years, and I haven't heard anything positive coming out of CES with regard to D*'s future plans. Unless you really need to have an integrated dating service built into your DVR :rolleyes:

I have been lurking here for a while and now have decided to join in the fun. Has anybody else tried to pick up the Colorado Springs ABC station up North? I am in North Thornton and suffered through the last couple of nights watching the Bowl games in Low Def. After having all of the other games in Hi Def on ESPN it was tough to watch. Luckily the games were good enough to help me get through it. I just pretended that I was watching the games through a rainstorm.
I tried to pull in channel 13.1 abc colorado springs and got nothing. I'm using a medium directional antenna.

Doug

I don't there's anyway you can receive COS stations in Thornton. Stranger things have happened, but I seriously doubt it. KMGH should be on-line from Republic pretty soon.
Ernie:
Any insight on "how soon" this will be? I live in Central Denver, no cable, and am tired of waiting for KMGH. The last few days (bowl games) have been killing me with no HD and if they don't have things set up before the super bowl...well what can I say.

No inside info, but as soon as Comcast rolls out a dual-tuner HD TiVo (or TiVo comes out with a dual-tuner CableCard TiVo) I'm switching.

D* has only stifled DVR innovation in the last couple of years, and I haven't heard anything positive coming out of CES with regard to D*'s future plans. Unless you really need to have an integrated dating service built into your DVR :rolleyes:

Since I have 3 tivos in the house and everybody in the family is addicted to them I certainly am going to hear some complaints when they switch over. I have 3 hdtvs and want to have the ability to record and watch recorded materials in those 3 locations. When they were first talking about the media center I thought that might be the answer to keeping me with Directv. But it seems that early information coming out of CES doesn't even mention the media center. I will not switch to Comcast without Tivo and the big issue is going to be what am I going to have to put out dollar wise. I have already put 750 into the HDTIVO and the wife is going to have my head if it was just a 1 1/2 year investment. I have to be careful or that dating channel will actually be worth something.

Letter in the Post regarding towers... http://www.denverpost.com/lettersYeah, last time I was in New York City I noticed the beautiful mountains, unspoiled by any TV towers, that towered over the city. IIRC, the mountains around Chicago are also quite lovely. Especially on the east side. :D

DrrD,

Are you doing a auto-scan for channels or manually adding them? Are you sure you have the correct Digital channel number for KDVR, it's DT32

------------------

Letter in the Post regarding towers... snip.


I did auto-scan, I'll manually check 32 tonight and see what it looks like. Maybe I'll just have to nudge the antenna a bit. Thanks.

Since I have 3 tivos in the house and everybody in the family is addicted to them I certainly am going to hear some complaints when they switch over. I have 3 hdtvs and want to have the ability to record and watch recorded materials in those 3 locations. When they were first talking about the media center I thought that might be the answer to keeping me with Directv. But it seems that early information coming out of CES doesn't even mention the media center. I will not switch to Comcast without Tivo and the big issue is going to be what am I going to have to put out dollar wise. I have already put 750 into the HDTIVO and the wife is going to have my head if it was just a 1 1/2 year investment. I have to be careful or that dating channel will actually be worth something.

Yeah, the media center was noticably absent in the first press release. The Windows MCE integration announcement in the Gates keynote was interesting. At least it sounds like Directv is finally going to network their DVRs. And, i'm just a little curious if this Windows MCE integration had something do with the absense of the HMC. Because in the perfect Microsoft home, you should be able to achieve the same results as the HMC would provide. Maybe tonight's Directv press conference will give a little more insight.

After reading that article, it occurs to me that LCG and the rest of us should quit refering to the new tower as the 'SUPER Tower!' and refer to it as the 'New Low-Impact Tower!'

I don't know if I want a 'super' tower in my backyard, but a new, low impact tower? Now your talking!

Tim

You are a smart man, Tim. Finding the right language for selling this "improvement" in the community's television viewing experience is key. And it's not jsut about aesthetics. It is an issue of quality of life along the front range, and the pro group's language should reflect that.

Use of the word "tower" for the structure may even be too imposing. It almost sounds like what the aliens looked like in the recent remake of "War of the Worlds".

How about this: "Low-impact Television Transmitter Antenna"? The acronym is "LITTA"... as in the "lighter" antenna.

It needs to be sold as a remedy to potential economic catastrophe, and that is not a stretch if LITTA isn't built.

How so?

Without LITTA, our community's standard of living and quality of life will suffer greatly.

Without LITTA, 20% of area TV viewers will find it difficult to watch television.

Advertisers like King Soopers, Safeway, Albertsons, Jake Jabs, Dealing Doug, Brian "Bulldog" Moore and other area businesses and employers will find it harder to reach that 20%.

Sales will suffer and with them the whole area's economy.

If Jake can't reach 20% of his market via television, it could have a profound negative affect on his sales. The same is true for all TV advertisers.

This will make the front range a less desirable place to do business. People will lose jobs. It will drive down real estate values. It will damage the economy. The tax base will shrink and with it nice quality of life services like parks and recreation, street repair, snow removal, etc.

The front range will be a less desirable place to live.

With LITTA, however, we can sustain the Front Range's economy and way of life while enjoying crystal clear television without that jumble of towers on Lookout Mountain.

And yes, I was a politician in my past life and may be again one day. :D

1) List of broadcasters I'd like to see offer local OTA broadcasts: Altitude, ESPN, Fox Rocky Mountain Sports. I think they're missing the boat on years of higher revenues for a small capital expense, especially Altitude and FRMS. They'd be able to reach the front range without the usual song-and-dance they get from Comcast. To get Altitude on satellite, one must usually subscribe to the highest tier of service. Between the 20% who get their TV OTA and the other 25% who get it via satellite, that's a ton of viewers not benefitting from their advertisers' offerings (and that is how broadcasters look at it).

How much ad revenue do they miss out on by not going directly to the community?

2) Affordable HD-DVR/DVD recorder/player.

All press releases from the CES show talk about players so far, and none of them is cheap.

3) Affordable, smaller digital C-band (as in as small as a DirecTV or Dish antenna). Maybe not possible technologically... but if it could be done, the impact would be profound!

4) Qwest succeeds in giving Comcast all the competition it can handle with its new TV service. Has anybody heard how the tests are going down in Highlands Ranch?

Please add your own to the list. I can't wait to hear the ideas.

Since I have 3 tivos in the house and everybody in the family is addicted to them I certainly am going to hear some complaints when they switch over. I have 3 hdtvs and want to have the ability to record and watch recorded materials in those 3 locations. When they were first talking about the media center I thought that might be the answer to keeping me with Directv. But it seems that early information coming out of CES doesn't even mention the media center. I will not switch to Comcast without Tivo and the big issue is going to be what am I going to have to put out dollar wise. I have already put 750 into the HDTIVO and the wife is going to have my head if it was just a 1 1/2 year investment. I have to be careful or that dating channel will actually be worth something.

My friend. Comcast's Motorola dual tuner DVR is a mess, and each new generation gets worse and worse. If you think the grass is greener over at Comcast, I am here to tell you it is not.

The current problems with Comcast's Motorola 6412 Phase III DVR are too numerous to go through.

A few highlights, however:

> When you record a program in Dolby 5.1, playback is in PCM stereo

> Lots of pixelization and sound drop outs

> Digital channels are blurry, muddy and faded looking (not the HDTV, though they are less clear than OTA)

> The box freezes up in playback making a manual reboot necessary (pull the plug)

> It doesn't pass through the closed captioning (important for my 75 year old father who has tinnitus) so the television can control the function; instead, one must make a manual adjustment to the box when it is turned off. Once it's turned on through the box, it will stay on until turned off. This is a real problem when one is already recording a program and no longer wants to use the CC. The box can't be shut off the box when it's recording.

> There is a bug/virus in their system, though they'll deny it. When one suddenly uses the MyDVR feature to watch a recorded program, the menu will suddenly show a program as having been recorded with the date of 12/31/89. It will take up 3% of the hard drive. And multiple entries can show up. I had four of them once, and it gobbled up 12% of the hard drive. They cannot be deleted... ever.

> It has only a 120 gig Maxtor hard drive and can only record 10 hours (if you're lucky) of HD programming.

Needless to say a Comcast manager told me a few weeks back that they have, are you sitting down, 60,000 broken boxes in a warehouse in Denver ready to go back to Motorola. These boxes were returned by customers for the third time, after being repaired twice before. The rollout for the Phase III box only began in... September 2005. There will be no more until the end of January.

They are working on a new firmware upgrade (12.22), which supposedly will allow one to add an external hard drive and use the PIP function. We'll see.

He said the TIVO situation was still unclear, and that two options may be offered. One is for you to BUY a TIVO HD DVR for $900, that works specifically with Comcast. The other is to have the software in the existing Motorola DVR upgraded to a TIVO program. There would be a monthly charge for this service in addition to the one already paid for the TV Guide interface (Comcast is a majority owner of TV Guide, btw).


DirecTV sounds like it is coming out with a pretty spectacular DVR, based on a story I saw from CES, and includes an On Demand service function.

http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=127160&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=799955&highlight=

It would be really nice if Dish found a way to take its 942 Whole House DVR and add MPEG 4 capability to it.

Good News:

I finally received some audio on KTVD for the first time!

Bad News:

Now that I am getting audio, the video is all screwed up...

The worse news:

After a few minutes, the audio disappeared, and now the video is still a mess.

Oh well...I would assume this is being caused be their engineers trying to rectify the lack of audio for most of us...unfortunately it looks like currently they are headed the wrong way in their efforts. At least it appears they are addressing the problem.

Good News:

I finally received some audio on KTVD for the first time!

Bad News:

Now that I am getting audio, the video is all screwed up...

The worse news:

After a few minutes, the audio disappeared, and now the video is still a mess.

Oh well...I would assume this is being caused be their engineers trying to rectify the lack of audio for most of us...unfortunately it looks like currently they are headed the wrong way in their efforts. At least it appears they are addressing the problem.I noticed the garbled video also. To be fair, they haven't to my knowledge announced their service as yet. But they don't have the luxury of working out these problems without us looking on.

I noticed that KDVR-DT was off the air this afternoon. I'll check again later to see if they have returned. Gremlins in the machine no doubt.

As to the C/S ABC DT broadcast, I didn't actually try to point at them (not sure of the azimuth anyway), but I have seen sporatic signals from them on my Dish 811. No steady signal, but flashes of 49% ever few seconds. Probably a bounced signal.

Just checked and KDVR-DT is back on the air at normal strength. I actually receive them at a little stronger reading than I do KWGN, even w/ a dedicated additional antenna pointed directly on their LOM azimuth.

I also just checked KTVD on my Dish 811 and while the signal remains at a high number, it is really screwed up. Not watchable at this time.

I also just checked KTVD on my Dish 811 and while the signal remains at a high number, it is really screwed up. Not watchable at this time.
Based on your post, so did I. Yup, either they changed something, or it's an 'atmospheric' problem. Watchable, but there are lots-o-breakups. The audio: SOS. Mits has it, LG doesn't.
....jc

I don't there's anyway you can receive COS stations in Thornton. Stranger things have happened, but I seriously doubt it. KMGH should be on-line from Republic pretty soon.

We shall see. I personally expect the flange to arrive Feb. 6.

Don

As to the C/S ABC DT broadcast, I didn't actually try to point at them (not sure of the azimuth anyway), but I have seen sporatic signals from them on my Dish 811. No steady signal, but flashes of 49% ever few seconds. Probably a bounced signal.My CM4228 is pointed at RP, but there's only about 10 degrees difference in azimuth between RP and Colorado Springs from where I live. I too have noticed these occasional blips on channel 24 (13-1); not enough to get my hopes up at a distance of 92 miles.

BTW, what is our basis for believing they are at full power? The FCC record I found at 2150.com lists them at 1.58 kw.

We shall see. I personally expect the flange to arrive Feb. 6.
Flange, smange. It's basically worthless without the:

Kilbasee Kinetic RF Damping Super Hydraulic Mini Connecting Semi Super Titanium Anti Scare Golden Sucs Clamping Device.

And, you guessed it: It's only Made in China
....jc

Can anyone comment as to the picture quality of basic cable HD signal through the QAM tuner vs the OTA HD signal?

I have an old Samsung 150 tuner and was thinking about upgrading to a newer one with QAM if the picture quality was as good as the OTA signal.

BTW, what is our basis for believing they are at full power? The FCC record I found at 2150.com lists them at 1.58 kw.
It's based on the reports from people in the C/S forum. A while back, there were multiple reports of increased signal strength readings. So, I guess that you could say it was hearsay. But that's what they were reporting. Me? Not a hint of the signal here.
....jc

My friend. Comcast's Motorola dual tuner DVR is a mess, and each new generation gets worse and worse. If you think the grass is greener over at Comcast, I am here to tell you it is not.

The current problems with Comcast's Motorola 6412 Phase III DVR are too numerous to go through.

A few highlights, however:

> When you record a program in Dolby 5.1, playback is in PCM stereo

> Lots of pixelization and sound drop outs

> Digital channels are blurry, muddy and faded looking (not the HDTV, though they are less clear than OTA)

> The box freezes up in playback making a manual reboot necessary (pull the plug)

> It doesn't pass through the closed captioning (important for my 75 year old father who has tinnitus) so the television can control the function; instead, one must make a manual adjustment to the box when it is turned off. Once it's turned on through the box, it will stay on until turned off. This is a real problem when one is already recording a program and no longer wants to use the CC. The box can't be shut off the box when it's recording.

> There is a bug/virus in their system, though they'll deny it. When one suddenly uses the MyDVR feature to watch a recorded program, the menu will suddenly show a program as having been recorded with the date of 12/31/89. It will take up 3% of the hard drive. And multiple entries can show up. I had four of them once, and it gobbled up 12% of the hard drive. They cannot be deleted... ever.

> It has only a 120 gig Maxtor hard drive and can only record 10 hours (if you're lucky) of HD programming.

Needless to say a Comcast manager told me a few weeks back that they have, are you sitting down, 60,000 broken boxes in a warehouse in Denver ready to go back to Motorola. These boxes were returned by customers for the third time, after being repaired twice before. The rollout for the Phase III box only began in... September 2005. There will be no more until the end of January.

They are working on a new firmware upgrade (12.22), which supposedly will allow one to add an external hard drive and use the PIP function. We'll see.

He said the TIVO situation was still unclear, and that two options may be offered. One is for you to BUY a TIVO HD DVR for $900, that works specifically with Comcast. The other is to have the software in the existing Motorola DVR upgraded to a TIVO program. There would be a monthly charge for this service in addition to the one already paid for the TV Guide interface (Comcast is a majority owner of TV Guide, btw).


DirecTV sounds like it is coming out with a pretty spectacular DVR, based on a story I saw from CES, and includes an On Demand service function.

http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=127160&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=799955&highlight=

It would be really nice if Dish found a way to take its 942 Whole House DVR and add MPEG 4 capability to it.

You obviously have some problems with your box, but I have not experienced most of what you shared. One thing is for sure; the statement of 10 hrs. of HD is just not true. I currently have EXACTLY 15 hrs. of HD recorded at 83% full, which would give a capacity of a little over 18 hrs.

I have noticed that playback sometimes, not frequently, starts in PCM stereo. A quick off/on of the box restores the 5.1. Digital channel quality exceeds that of D*, with the analog being a bit muddy. YMMV, but the Comcast situation is not near as dire as you state.

LCG just called me and asked if any of us can go to an informal Wayne Allard townhall meeting today and ask him what he can do to fix our tower situation. Drop me an email and I will give you the info.

Damn! I'm home with a sick kid today, or else I would go. I hope at the very least, this means this issue is getting more attention.

Allard Town-hall Meeting Location Today (3:30-4:30)

Windsor Gardens Community Activities Center
595 S Clinton St.
Denver, CO 80247 - 1206
(303) 364-7485

http://www.dexonline.com/servlet/ActionServlet?pid=singlemappingresults&primaryLocationKey=&primaryBusinessRecordID=3ssct64ersi17bs9eba8305ok5&primaryStreetAddress1=595+S+Clinton&primaryCity=Denver&primaryState=CO&primaryZipCode=80247+-+1206&old.x=-1049800&old.y=397400&from=&primaryProductID=1030&primaryHeadingID=10000&mapZoomLevel=7

Can't go -- I don't have a car today (besides, that would mean I have to take a shower;))

Talked to Mike Dant just now at KTVD. They are still trying to get help on the audio issue with many receivers. I asked him about HD timeshifting for network HD and live HD feeds from FSRM for Rockies games. Nothing outside of the realm of possibility, but the pending Gannett purchase (May at the earliest) is going to mean lots of uncertainty in the short term.

Allard Town-hall Meeting Location Today (3:30-4:30)
Yea, I sent Allard and the rest of my 'representitives' http://www.panelcrafters.net/rotflmao.gifan email trying to get them involved in this situation. Both from the aspect of the low power/sCARE situation, and the fact that stations can deny waivers when they aren't supplying a suitable signal.

Please tell him that it's more than just Metro Denver that depends on the HD stations in Denver.
....jc

I have been lurking here for about the last 75 pages of this marathon thread. I too have experienced some of the same reception issues namely get most channels OTA but still can't even sniff the coat hanger at KMGH. I live near the 144th street ridge in Broomfield. From what I have seen so far the chance of the KMGH transmitter being up and running by the Super Bowl is about the same as Houston Texans making it to the big game. So personally I am already planning to go to a friends house to watch the game in HD through Comcast.

Has anyone heard what channel the Division playoff games will be on as well as the Conference championship games? Any news about HD?

Verc

Ernie:
Any insight on "how soon" this will be? I live in Central Denver, no cable, and am tired of waiting for KMGH. The last few days (bowl games) have been killing me with no HD and if they don't have things set up before the super bowl...well what can I say.

I just got this email today from KMGH's general manager:


Russ,
We are currently installing the equipment at Republic and will be ready
for the Super Bowl.
Happy New Year!
Darrell Brown

Has anyone heard what channel the Division playoff games will be on as well as the Conference championship games? Any news about HD?

This has been pretty much the same for years. Tomorrow's games(AFC & NFC) will be on ABC. After that(Sunday on) the AFC games will be on CBS and the NFC games will be on Fox. So, I guess that I'll only be watching the AFC games on the big screen! Thanks KXRM you waiver denying ^%@&#.

All games will be in sparkling HD!
....jc

Quote from santellavision
Allard Town-hall Meeting Location Today (3:30-4:30)

Windsor Gardens Community Activities Center
595 S Clinton St.
Denver, CO 80247 - 1206
(303) 364-7485

Thanks, Ernie.
Mapquest for the address might help, too (I was unable to find on dex).

Hi, all.
Long time member, first time poster (anytime, anywhere on the internet). :o
Sorry for any breach of ettiquette.
Unable to attend, but hope for best.

Is freeing up frequencies for use by Homeland Security a valid reason to push for the new tower? The frequencies won't be available until everyone switches to digital, will they? Would Allard be interested in such an argument?

I'm not too knowledgeable, so again I apologize if I'm off base.

---Greg

Is freeing up frequencies for use by Homeland Security a valid reason to push for the new tower? The frequencies won't be available until everyone switches to digital, will they? Would Allard be interested in such an argument?
Welcome!

The argument you propose is one of the arguments LCG is trying to push right now. I believe it's also part of the rationale congress used to set a firm analog shutoff date.

The problem with using that argument is that people will suggest that since LCG has another 3 years to figure out where to put their digital transmitters, it's not so critical (yet) that the government has to step in and squash Golden like the little bug of a town it is.

Would Homeland Security want to use Lookout Mountain for their communications? Or the CIA, if they do decide to move here during decentrallization?


---Greg

I keep popping over to channel 19 to see how they are progressing. Apparently they are working on the problem and are achieving mixed results. At noon today I checked and the video problems of last night were no longer present. However, the audio was still out on my LG, but now even my Dish 811 is silent on 19.

Checked again at 12:40 PM and there wasn't any signal at all for 19. I guessed they pulled the plug to work on the system.

I never watch the channel, but decided to try and tune it in last night to test. Weird thing is my Sony TV Internal tuner pixelates just as bad as my E* 921. I get all other stations from RP just fine with sometimes pixelation with KCNC on my 921. Just attributed that to being an older generation tuner than my Sony TV and them being such a high frequency and/or multi-path.

Both of my HD tuners have sound from them.

Are they running at an extremely low power right now because of testing?

And BTW, who ever believes KMGH will be ready by the Super Bowl, has not been through the last 3-4 years of their lies. I wouldn't plan any big HD Super Bowl parties if you don't receive their signal already (all 3 of you that do).

Allard Town-hall Meeting Location Today (3:30-4:30)

Windsor Gardens Community Activities Center
595 S Clinton St.
Denver, CO 80247 - 1206
(303) 364-7485

It's in Aurora, not Denver...

Here (http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?address=595%20S%20Clinton%20St&city=Aurora&state=CO&zipcode=80247%2d1206&country=US&title=%3cb%3e595%20S%20Clinton%20St%3c%2fb%3e%3cbr%20%2f%3e% 20Aurora%2c%20CO%2080247%2d1206%2c%20%20US&cid=lfmaplink2&name=)is the correct map.

Tim

KTVD-DT was trying different things for the past hour and rebooting their encoder. They installed a patch from the encoder vender and their audio issues should now be gone. I have audio for them on both of my receivers. They are done tweaking for the day. They are at approx. 6.7kw ERP.

Anyone still experiencing issues should call the station at (303) 792-2020.

KTVD-DT was trying different things for the past hour and rebooting their encoder. They installed a patch from the encoder vender and their audio issues should now be gone. I have audio for them on both of my receivers. They are done tweaking for the day. They are at approx. 6.7kw ERP.
Yup, much better than last night, and audio on both receivers! TaDa! :p

Now, if KCNC & KUSA could only go to 'Non-Directional' antennas! Naw, that would be too much to ask. So, I'm a little better than 50% from RP(KCNC about 33% of the time, KUSA forgetaboutit). I'm glad that I've got ABC from D*, 'cause when KMGH makes the 'big move' I'll prolly lose them too!
....jc

IS anyone having luck receiving any of the Colorado Springs HDTV stations here in Denver Metro. Living in Castle Rock at 6500 feet would think I could, but so far absolutely no luck... though I have been getting FOX from Ft Collins of late. Any advice or reports please. Posted on Colorado Springs forum but got no responses.

I get 4 HD channels out of the Springs - KTSC (PBS) 8.1, KKTV (CBS) 11.1, PKDO (ABC) 13.1, KXRM (FOX) 21.1. There is even a video channel on 21.2 that does not show up on listing that I have seen?? I think these are the only 5 in C/S that ar HD. I just recently was able to get ABC which was a surprise. I also get 2 Denver HDs - KWGN (WB) 2.1, KDVR (FOX) 31.1. I can't figure out why I don't get the other Denver stations that are on lookout mountain??

I have a CM4288 antenna with a CM7777 preamp. I pointed it at Denver and get the C/S stations from the back side. This antenna is amazing, I get C/S from the back side and Denver from the front and don't have to rotate it!!! I tried it the other way around but was not able to get any Denver stations from the back side.

I am about 2 miles south of Castle Rock and 2 miles west.

It's in Aurora, not Denver...

Here (http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?address=595%20S%20Clinton%20St&city=Aurora&state=CO&zipcode=80247%2d1206&country=US&title=%3cb%3e595%20S%20Clinton%20St%3c%2fb%3e%3cbr%20%2f%3e% 20Aurora%2c%20CO%2080247%2d1206%2c%20%20US&cid=lfmaplink2&name=)is the correct map.

Tim

TIMAY
It is Denver. My mom lives there and Dayton is the dividing line. East is Aurora and West of Dayton is Denver.

cheers
Willy

I also get 2 Denver HDs - KWGN (WB) 2.1, KDVR (FOX) 31.1. I can't figure out why I don't get the other Denver stations that are on lookout mountain??
There aren't any other Denver stations sending DTV from Lookout Mountain; you should be able to pickup the analog signals though.

I'm getting sound for 19-1 on my panny plasma. However, the signal has gotten worse from when they first went live(from 72% to 58%) There are also frequent dropouts now. It is now my weakest signal. I checked all of my other RP siganls and they are all normal:

4-1 72%
6-1 68-70%
9-1 76%
17-1 0.00% :D

You can't put to much emphasis on the receivers empirical signal meter value, especially with low-power signals. Just know that more is better. I get KRDO (C/S ABC) with a 60% (33% is my receivers threshold) but it has continuous A/V drop-outs, audio very frequently, as if the signal was borderline. A receiver can be locking on to a low-power signal good, but that signal is a reflection and subject to all kinds of fluctuations.

Just ran a quick check while passing through the house on the way back out and I now have audio on 19-1 too. Didn't check on quality or type though.

KTVD-DT was trying different things for the past hour and rebooting their encoder. They installed a patch from the encoder vender and their audio issues should now be gone. I have audio for them on both of my receivers. They are done tweaking for the day. They are at approx. 6.7kw ERP.

KTVD coming in both LOUD (finally) and CLEAR here...plus my signal strength for them is the highest its ever been, maxing out the meter on my E* 921...the only other station that does that at my location is KUSA.

Nice work KTVD! :)

It is Denver.Either way, it wasn't really worth much. The meeting actually ran from 3 - 4, so I missed a lot, and he was finished shortly after I arrived. A lot of retirees asking or complaining about the government's torture policy, energy policy, tax inequities, his position on Alito, etc. He stuck around at the end talking to individuals, and I probably could have caught him, but his aide started ushering him out.

A lot of retirees asking or complaining about the government's torture policy, energy policy, tax inequities, his position on Alito, etc. He stuck around at the end talking to individuals, and I probably could have caught him, but his aide started ushering him out.
I can answer some of those questions for him:


Torture Policy: Whatever GW says is correct. If we need to torture 'terrorists', so be it. We're trying to perfect the methods used, so that we don't waste a lot of time when we start using it on US citizens...
Energy Policy: Of course it was negotiated behind 'closed doors'. We don't want you all to know how badly you're getting #$%* in the a$$...
Tax Inequities: Why should corporate America pay taxes? We need them to keep contributing to us politicians...
Alito: If Big George wants him, he's my man...

...and I probably could have caught him, but his aide started ushering him out.
Yea, I can't spend too much time around the 'citizens', something might rub off. Besides, a big donor is buying me dinner tonight...

Our political system is so corrupt, do you really believe that he was there to listen to anybody?

Probably just another 'Photo Op' for us fools...
....jc

Please keep politics out of this forum. I really don't care to read that crap here.

I can answer some of those questions for him:
Torture Policy: Whatever GW says is correct. If we need to torture 'terrorists', so be it. We're trying to perfect the methods used, so that we don't waste a lot of time when we start using it on US citizens... Actually, he says he voted with McCain against torture. I don't think a lot of people know how torture is defined.
Energy Policy: Of course it was negotiated behind 'closed doors'. We don't want you all to know how badly you're getting #$%* in the a$$...He didn't go there, but used some vague words about how we're on the right track. He supports drilling in the ANWR.
Tax Inequities: Why should corporate America pay taxes? We need them to keep contributing to us politicians...Flat tax.
Alito: If Big George wants him, he's my man...Not exactly how he answered it, but he does support Alito.
Yea, I can't spend too much time around the 'citizens', something might rub off. Besides, a big donor is buying me dinner tonight...He was on his way to Loveland. I suppose there could be big donors there.
Our political system is so corrupt, do you really believe that he was there to listen to anybody? Probably just another 'Photo Op' for us fools...He certainly listened long enough to answer the question. But no photo op - I saw no press there at all - maybe because I got there so late. So my ugly mug won't be in the paper. End of the politics.

Please keep politics out of this forum. I really don't care to read that crap here.
Well, then Geof, what the ^&%$ is sCARE and The City of Golden? Non-Political entities?
...jc

That's one thing, talking about Washington politics is another, totally unrelated topic.

That's one thing, talking about Washington politics is another, totally unrelated topic.
I disagree! :p Washington is where congress resides. And, Congress is the entity that controls the FCC. And, it's the FCC that won't get involved with the ugly mess that we have here. So, one way or another, Washington and politics are involved. Remember, all stations were supposed to be broadcasting a full power digital signal on 07/01/05. The FCC gave out 6 month extensions like lollypops. Those extensions have expired. Now what? Does the FCC step in? Probably not. Congress(controlling the FCC) doesn't want to piss anybody off(it's an election year).

You can attempt to bury your head in the sand, but Politics is what rules this country. And, until you realize that we live in a country of massive corruption, you'll never understand why we are being denied what everyone in the top 20 DMA's already has.

But, for the sake of your political favor, you can close your eyes, and pretend that all is well.
....jc

Hey pal, keep your opinions of what I do and do not understand to yourself. This isn't the place for it. I will say you are so far off base about me that you just demonstrated what an idiot you are. Regardless I'm bowing out of this thread anyway since it's fast becoming irrelevant to me.

Good luck everyone - so long and thanks for all the fish!

Washington politics as it relates to the FCC and the digital cutoff are relevant.

Torture, ANWR, Salito - none of that has any bearing whatsoever.

Geof - do you have a timeline yet? I know you've been itching to head back east for what seems like a long time now. FWIW, I'll miss you around here.

I agree too. This is not the place for Political ranting. Party issues are a tinderbox.

I was on a shoot last week where one of my (liberal) grips made a poplitical comment during lunch and my (now known) far right Republican client went ballistic on him in front of everybody! I bet I don't get another job from that client again. One word and I'm now out thousands of dollars.

Washington politics as it relates to the FCC and the digital cutoff are relevant.

Torture, ANWR, Salito - none of that has any bearing whatsoever.Exactly right.

My new house is framed now but my brother and I are doing the rest of the work so I'll be spending time back there working on it before I'm ready to move. I have no specific timetable for moving at this point though. I'll be in Denver for awhile yet but (unfortunately) it's clear that the OTA status won't be changing in time for me to finally see our locals in HD. :mad:

Hey pal, keep your opinions of what I do and do not understand to yourself. This isn't the place for it. I will say you are so far off base about me that you just demonstrated what an idiot you are. Regardless I'm bowing out of this thread anyway since it's fast becoming irrelevant to me.
Too funny! http://www.panelcrafters.net/rotflmao.gif At least, I haven't stooped to name calling. I guess there's a lot of pent up frustration in this country! :p
....jc

Hey gang, I have 2 more newbie questions.

I have the standard Samsung D* HD receiver. First off, is there any way to manually add channels? Such as if I want to try to add a channel that does not pop up in the automatic scan.

Secondly, for most of the HD OTA channels in the channel guide it just says "Regular Schedule". Is there anything I can do to get the actual programs listed? I'm guessing I'm SOL but I always scroll past 12-1, 12-2, 12-3, etc because I never know what's on and really never think to stop on any of them.

Thanks!

I have been a long-time lurker on the board - and procrastinater about finally installing the equipment for OTA reception in the Denver area.

This weekend, taking advantage of the mild weather in Denver, I finally got around to successfully installing the equipment, and thought some others may find the experience useful.

First, my home is located in Centennial - near the corner of Dry Creek and Quebec - maybe 1/2 mile to the SouthEast.

Antennaweb.org says my orientation to the Republic Plaza stations is 330 degrees and are 12.3 miles away.

I have Dish Network with the HD Value Pak - so I have been enjoying HDTV for some time, but not the local channels in HD.

The Dish receiver I have was purchased with the notion of adding OTA, so I purchased the model 6000U with the OTA option. It is probably badly outdated by now, but it is what I have.

I called a couple of online vendors to get recommendations for an OTA antenna, as well as reading this site. Candidly, the site threads have become so long that it is a PITA to wade through them. As a result, I decided to call some vendors to get their recommendations.

They seemed to think a UHF only bow-tie type antenna would be best for my application - and they pointed me toward a multi-directional mid-range antenna.

I looked around locally for an OTA antenna, but the selection was pretty limited at Home Depot and Lowes. I ended up dropping into a nearby Radio Shack and found a UHF only they said is pretty popular and purchased that one. Model U-75 R for $25 - so it seemed a reasonable price for an experiment - even if it didn't work too well. I also purchased their chimney mount and a 5 ft. mast, along with a grounding block and a coupler.

I put everything together - and aimed the antenna generally toward downtown and according to the orientation depicted on the street level view of the antennaweb.org site.

To my GREAT surprise, I ran the scan feature of the 6000U and it found 12 stations - including one that was marginal from Longmont (I later deleted it). Like everyone else, I am unable to find KMGH (ABC), no matter what I try.

The cost of parts, including a grounding rod and some coax tools, ended up being about $150. It took maybe 2 or 3 hours of dedicated effort to get it all pieced together and operational.

I was pleasantly surprised at how simple it all was.

Fox (KDVR) has the weakest signal strenght at about 70%. It seems my threshold is right at 50% - as that was what the Longmont station (KDEN) was showing as it was dropping in and out. Most others are in the 85% + range.

Since I have the local program option from Dish, I am able to toggle back-and-forth between HD and non-HD displays, and it represents a nice demonstration for anyone who has never seen HD before.

I hope this helps someone who, like me, may be straddling the fence trying to decide what to do.

- Dan

Hey gang, I have 2 more newbie questions.

I have the standard Samsung D* HD receiver. First off, is there any way to manually add channels? Such as if I want to try to add a channel that does not pop up in the automatic scan.

Secondly, for most of the HD OTA channels in the channel guide it just says "Regular Schedule". Is there anything I can do to get the actual programs listed? I'm guessing I'm SOL but I always scroll past 12-1, 12-2, 12-3, etc because I never know what's on and really never think to stop on any of them.

Thanks!

I have the same problem with local channels on my Dish 6000U receiver - they do not display any programming at all. While it is not an elegant solution, one bit of help is the website (http://www.checkHD.com) where they use your zip code to provide the HD programming for that evening.

I hope this helps.

- Dan

I have been a long-time lurker on the board - and procrastinater about finally installing the equipment for OTA reception in the Denver area.

This weekend, taking advantage of the mild weather in Denver, I finally got around to successfully installing the equipment, and thought some others may find the experience useful.

First, my home is located in Centennial - near the corner of Dry Creek and Quebec - maybe 1/2 mile to the SouthEast.

Antennaweb.org says my orientation to the Republic Plaza stations is 330 degrees and are 12.3 miles away.

I have Dish Network with the HD Value Pak - so I have been enjoying HDTV for some time, but not the local channels in HD.

The Dish receiver I have was purchased with the notion of adding OTA, so I purchased the model 6000U with the OTA option. It is probably badly outdated by now, but it is what I have.

I called a couple of online vendors to get recommendations for an OTA antenna, as well as reading this site. Candidly, the site threads have become so long that it is a PITA to wade through them. As a result, I decided to call some vendors to get their recommendations.

They seemed to think a UHF only bow-tie type antenna would be best for my application - and they pointed me toward a multi-directional mid-range antenna.

I looked around locally for an OTA antenna, but the selection was pretty limited at Home Depot and Lowes. I ended up dropping into a nearby Radio Shack and found a UHF only they said is pretty popular and purchased that one. Model U-75 R for $25 - so it seemed a reasonable price for an experiment - even if it didn't work too well. I also purchased their chimney mount and a 5 ft. mast, along with a grounding block and a coupler.

I put everything together - and aimed the antenna generally toward downtown and according to the orientation depicted on the street level view of the antennaweb.org site.

To my GREAT surprise, I ran the scan feature of the 6000U and it found 12 stations - including one that was marginal from Longmont (I later deleted it). Like everyone else, I am unable to find KMGH (ABC), no matter what I try.

The cost of parts, including a grounding rod and some coax tools, ended up being about $150. It took maybe 2 or 3 hours of dedicated effort to get it all pieced together and operational.

I was pleasantly surprised at how simple it all was.

Fox (KDVR) has the weakest signal strenght at about 70%. It seems my threshold is right at 50% - as that was what the Longmont station (KDEN) was showing as it was dropping in and out. Most others are in the 85% + range.

Since I have the local program option from Dish, I am able to toggle back-and-forth between HD and non-HD displays, and it represents a nice demonstration for anyone who has never seen HD before.

I hope this helps someone who, like me, may be straddling the fence trying to decide what to do.

- Dan

Where did you mount the antenna? Inside or out? How high up?

Thanks.

Where did you mount the antenna? Inside or out? How high up?

Thanks.

It is mounted outside. I used Radio Shack's chimney mounts to attach the antenna to the chimney. I live in a multi-level home and simply got onto the roof and went over to the chimney to install the straps. I would guess the antenna is about 20' above the ground.

- Dan

First, my home is located in Centennial - near the corner of Dry Creek and Quebec - maybe 1/2 mile to the SouthEast.

I just set up an old DTC100 for my parents who live in Walnut Hills, or very close to you. I was able to get most of the digital stations, except for KMGH as well. I used their 35 year old rooftop antenna, but it works OK. I was going to try a dedicated, larger UFH antenna but I guess I'll just wait and see if they actually move to RP this century.

Strangely, I live at C470 and Bowles, and I can get KMGH. However, I can see downtown from my rooftop, but from my parents' house I cannot see downtown from their roof. Even though they are much closer as the crow flies, altitude seems to be the determining factor in my case :)

I just set up an old DTC100 for my parents who live in Walnut Hills, or very close to you. I was able to get most of the digital stations, except for KMGH as well. I used their 35 year old rooftop antenna, but it works OK. I was going to try a dedicated, larger UFH antenna but I guess I'll just wait and see if they actually move to RP this century.

Strangely, I live at C470 and Bowles, and I can get KMGH. However, I can see downtown from my rooftop, but from my parents' house I cannot see downtown from their roof. Even though they are much closer as the crow flies, altitude seems to be the determining factor in my case :)

I am going to try a couple of more things, as I have time. One will be to switch to the antenna the guys at the online store recommended. Here is a view of it -- http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?CAT=&PROD=TD-DB4. I may also try to elevate the antenna another 5 feet - with a 10 ft. mast, instead of the current 5 ft. one. Lastly, if I am *still* unsuccessful, I may add a small amplifier. The online guys told me a CM 13dB amplifier should be all I need.

Will report back if this helps at all.

As for distance - I did not think I could see downtown from my home, but once on the rooftop, I could see the buildings downtown through some neighbors tree limbs. The antenna is not quite high enough to have direct line of sight, but the extra 5 ft. on a 10 ft. mast should get it there.

- Dan

The online guys told me a CM 13dB amplifier should be all I need.Very often, if an amplifier helps at all, it will be only at very modest gain. I have a variable gain amp and it only helps when turned all the way down. 13dB sounds good. I have to filter VHF and FM also which gets me everything from RP, except KCNC which
is hit or miss (mostly miss). And I'm 46 miles from RP but at 6400'.

I am going to try a couple of more things, as I have time. One will be to switch to the antenna the guys at the online store recommended. Here is a view of it -- http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?CAT=&PROD=TD-DB4. Just one comment: If you are going to order that antenna, you may want to try this one instead. (http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?main_cat=03&CAT=&PROD=ANC4228) It is less money and most of those here who have used it (including me) rave about it.

dhcoop I have a DB4 if you would like it.

Just one comment: If you are going to order that antenna, you may want to try this one instead. (http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?main_cat=03&CAT=&PROD=ANC4228) It is less money and most of those here who have used it (including me) rave about it.

I asked about that one because I've seen it mentioned so often. The sales guy told me it was more directional than the DB4, and since I am trying to get Fox at 291 degrees - along with Republic Plaza at 330 degrees, I apparently need something that is not directional.

Does that make sense?

- Dan

Just one comment: If you are going to order that antenna, you may want to try this one instead. (http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?main_cat=03&CAT=&PROD=ANC4228) It is less money and most of those here who have used it (including me) rave about it.

Understand that a CM 4228 and an AntennasDirect DB-4 are not equivalent. The CM equivalent of a 4-bay DB-4 is a 4- bay 3021, also a good antenna. The 8-bay CM 4228 equivalent from Antennas Direct is a DB-8.

While there is some marginal gain advantage above channel 35 w/ CM 4228 versus almost all other UHF-only antennas, there are some disadvantages to also consider. They are size, weight (almost all steel construction; it's heavy and it will rust), and wind loading (one of the worst of commonly available consumer TV antennas). Be sure you can return any of antenna you order for experimentation and don't spend more money than you have to or buy more problems than you need to deal with.

Only stay w/ as much antenna as you need. The DB-4 should be more than enough for you w/ an outside mount. However, the CM 3021 is cheaper. The 3021 has a very broad beamwidth for antenna of its gain, so you should do better in pulling in KDVR while pointed at RP.

Good luck and let us know how things work out for you.

dhcoop I have a DB4 if you would like it.

Did you try it and are unhappy with it?

What are you using it its place?

I asked about that one because I've seen it mentioned so often. The sales guy told me it was more directional than the DB4, and since I am trying to get Fox at 291 degrees - along with Republic Plaza at 330 degrees, I apparently need something that is not directional.

Does that make sense?

- Dan

The sales guy told you the correct technical facts regarding the CM 4228.

Any news on if/when KMGH will be moving their broadcasting for HDTV to Republic plaza? I thought I heard they were planning on doing this before the superbowl.

While in their building -- I noticed that KMGH has received their new antenna... it is the same as UPN's...so those of you who receive them should soon receive KMGH. It is set to be installed in the next few weeks and yes... the GM has consistently said it will be up by the superbowl. I'm not sure what ERP they plan on having... but I will try to find out.

While in their building -- I noticed that KMGH has received their new antenna... it is the same as UPN's...so those of you who receive them should soon receive KMGH. It is set to be installed in the next few weeks and yes... the GM has consistently said it will be up by the superbowl. I'm not sure what ERP they plan on having... but I will try to find out.

Thanks a lot for this info! Hopefully they get it time for the Broncos in the Superbowl! ( :) Yes, I am an optimist!)

( Yes, I am an optimist!) Yes, you are! Especially after seeing the issues of bad software/PSIP on many of our receivers from KTVD. I hope they get it up an runnin' well before that Sunday!

Yes, you are! Especially after seeing the issues of bad software/PSIP on many of our receivers from KTVD. I hope they get it up an runnin' well before that Sunday!
Obviously this should be easy for KMGwhatever, they advertised that they were the first station in Denver broadcasting in HD, so they are obviously the most experienced......
:rolleyes:
not that anyone who wasn't three blocks from their transmitter would have known.....

Hey gang, I have 2 more newbie questions.

I have the standard Samsung D* HD receiver. First off, is there any way to manually add channels? Such as if I want to try to add a channel that does not pop up in the automatic scan.

Secondly, for most of the HD OTA channels in the channel guide it just says "Regular Schedule". Is there anything I can do to get the actual programs listed? I'm guessing I'm SOL but I always scroll past 12-1, 12-2, 12-3, etc because I never know what's on and really never think to stop on any of them.

Thanks!

On my my H10 receiver, you have to go into the setup menus and type in your zip code to retrieve the schedules for those OTA stations that D* has for your area. Go into menu/setting/setup/sat&Ant/antennia setup/local networks and then type in your zip code. After it retrieves the stations, it allows you to select those stations you want to see in your on-screen menus (use "edit off air channels").

I have accurate schedules for most all the stations exept for the new UPN one that just started broadcasting.

Hope that helps.

Yes, you are! Especially after seeing the issues of bad software/PSIP on many of our receivers from KTVD. I hope they get it up an runnin' well before that Sunday!

Boy, what a good point. If KMGH was really serious about this, they would have their transmitter already installed and sending out a signal from RP so that the time between now and the Super Bowl could be used for the troubleshooting that will inevitably be needed. I hope they don't think they're going to be able to just flip on the power button after they install it and all will be well. Realistically, it's already getting to be too late to have it up and properly operating in time for the Super Bowl.

Boy, what a good point. If KMGH was really serious about this, they would have their transmitter already installed and sending out a signal from RP so that the time between now and the Super Bowl could be used for the troubleshooting that will inevitably be needed. I hope they don't think they're going to be able to just flip on the power button after they install it and all will be well. Realistically, it's already getting to be too late to have it up and properly operating in time for the Super Bowl.
If I were to guess, they are probably just going to move their existing transmitter and whatever else they need to RP, and go from there. There will no doubt be some disruptions of service and it wont go perfectly smoothly, but they probably won't have the kinds of problems like a new stations coming on line either. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

Even if KMGH just moves their coat hanger and gerbil cage, with the added few hundred feet of elevation, at least 10 times more DMA residents will be able to lock their signal.

I am going to try a couple of more things, as I have time. One will be to switch to the antenna the guys at the online store recommended. Here is a view of it -- http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?CAT=&PROD=TD-DB4. I may also try to elevate the antenna another 5 feet - with a 10 ft. mast, instead of the current 5 ft. one. Lastly, if I am *still* unsuccessful, I may add a small amplifier. The online guys told me a CM 13dB amplifier should be all I need.

Will report back if this helps at all.

As for distance - I did not think I could see downtown from my home, but once on the rooftop, I could see the buildings downtown through some neighbors tree limbs. The antenna is not quite high enough to have direct line of sight, but the extra 5 ft. on a 10 ft. mast should get it there.

- Dan

I live just South of "The Big Toolbox" on Holly. I don't have a direct view of downtown but I am above most. I use a DB2, smaller than a DB4, mounted outside, no amp. I pick up KMGH and other local HD channels. The DB4 should work for you. The DB2 occasionally had some pixellization on KMGH when I installed it a year ago, but haven't had any issues for quite some time. Adjustment is tricky with any outside antenna. Remember small adjustments of the antenna can be the difference.

See especially the bold paragraph:

Article Launched: 01/09/2006 01:00:00 AM

denver & the west
Petition targets eminent domain
A group starts collecting signatures at the stock show in order to put a constitutional amendment before Colorado voters in the fall.
By Ann Schrader
Denver Post Staff Writer



A petition drive for a state constitutional amendment to limit governments from taking private property kicked off Sunday at a National Western Stock Show booth.

Colorado Citizens for Property Rights aims to collect 100,000 signatures by June 4 to get the issue on the November ballot. On the stock show's first day, 600 voters signed the petition.

"There will be more than 750,000 people coming through here during the stock show, and it's the best place to kick it off," said Marsha Looper, executive director of the property rights group. "There are a lot of people here who have been on their land for several generations and want to protect their land."

Looper said the proposal would block "land grabs" for private uses, such as "big box" retail developments or toll roads. The proposed amendment would allow acquisition of property by eminent domain if the property is occupied by a public entity or a public utility such as a highway or school.

The initiative would go against last year's U.S. Supreme Court decision that expanded eminent domain for economic development, Looper said. The court ruling said states could enact stricter property rights laws.

Greg Castiglione of Highlands Ranch signed the petition, saying he's concerned about a specific issue.
"The city of Golden is attempting to take the land for a tower that would broadcast high-definition TV (from Lookout Mountain), and if it (eminent domain) isn't done for the public good, it's stealing," he said.

Backers warned politicians to pay attention to the efforts of the grassroots organization. "People and property are the name of the game in 2006, not politics," said group member Kathy Farth.

The group plans to collect signatures throughout the state, saying there are more than 130 active or threatened eminent domain "takings" for private use statewide.

See especially the bold paragraph:

Article Launched: 01/09/2006 01:00:00 AM

denver & the west
Petition targets eminent domain
A group starts collecting signatures at the stock show in order to put a constitutional amendment before Colorado voters in the fall.
By Ann Schrader
Denver Post Staff Writer



A petition drive for a state constitutional amendment to limit governments from taking private property kicked off Sunday at a National Western Stock Show booth.

Colorado Citizens for Property Rights aims to collect 100,000 signatures by June 4 to get the issue on the November ballot. On the stock show's first day, 600 voters signed the petition.

"There will be more than 750,000 people coming through here during the stock show, and it's the best place to kick it off," said Marsha Looper, executive director of the property rights group. "There are a lot of people here who have been on their land for several generations and want to protect their land."

Looper said the proposal would block "land grabs" for private uses, such as "big box" retail developments or toll roads. The proposed amendment would allow acquisition of property by eminent domain if the property is occupied by a public entity or a public utility such as a highway or school.

The initiative would go against last year's U.S. Supreme Court decision that expanded eminent domain for economic development, Looper said. The court ruling said states could enact stricter property rights laws.

Greg Castiglione of Highlands Ranch signed the petition, saying he's concerned about a specific issue.
"The city of Golden is attempting to take the land for a tower that would broadcast high-definition TV (from Lookout Mountain), and if it (eminent domain) isn't done for the public good, it's stealing," he said.

Backers warned politicians to pay attention to the efforts of the grassroots organization. "People and property are the name of the game in 2006, not politics," said group member Kathy Farth.

The group plans to collect signatures throughout the state, saying there are more than 130 active or threatened eminent domain "takings" for private use statewide.
Eminent Domain has definitely been abused by local governments, but I worry about how well this initiative is drafted. Toll Roads are a legitimate use of Eminent Domain, IMHO. Open Space and Parks are also a legitimate use - how would this initiative ban Golden's land grab while permitting normal park acquisitions?

No matter how good it sounds, my default vote on any initiative is NO until I completely understand how it will work and who is behind it.

Eminent Domain is great until they try to take your property(or tower as it were).

Something really smells when a governmental entity can take the Jones's 10 acre horse farm, and turns the property over to a private developer, because that governmental entity can make more tax revenue from the property.

But, in the case of the tower property, it's a different scenario. The property already serves the public interest. So, who benefits more? The people who might enjoy that land(park or whatever), or the million or so people who will receive free OTA broadcasts(and radio)?
....jc

Something really smells when a governmental entity can take the Jones's 10 acre horse farm, and turns the property over to a private developer, because that governmental entity can make more tax revenue from the property. These are the cases that have folks riled up, and rightly so.

I still believe the most likely outcome is that stations will use their EXISTING towers and frequency assignments on Lookout Mountain indefinitely. If Golden were to try shutting down OTA altogether they would get smacked down by the legislature.

While in their building -- I noticed that KMGH has received their new antenna... it is the same as UPN's...so those of you who receive them should soon receive KMGH. It is set to be installed in the next few weeks and yes... the GM has consistently said it will be up by the superbowl. I'm not sure what ERP they plan on having... but I will try to find out.
UPN - channel 20 is broadcasting in HD?

Reggie

KTVD (UPN) is broadcasting DTV on 19.1 but not passing any HD yet.

UPN - channel 20 is broadcasting in HD?Digital yes, HD no.

I have never understood the arcane rules or circumstances under which D* will show local sports teams on the "special" channels in the 90's, but tonight we may get a chance. The Avs are playing St. Louis on the exclusive OLN game tonight at 7:00 MST and it shows up in the D* guide on channel 97. If you're a hockey fan, it's worth a surf-by!

Does anyone know if the current UPN digital output is as good as it's gonna get, or if there are plans to further 'boost' the signal after testing is complete? I am barely pulling it in now (not well enough to watch anyway), while I am getting 'adequate' reception for all the other RP stations...

Avs are on OLN-HD on D* channel 97!

This was the e-mail response I received from channel 7/abc..

"Channel 7 does not grant waivers to viewers within its
designated market area.
Our HD transmitter and antenna will be operational in time for
the Super Bowl.
We appreciate your patience with this process - and thank you
for writing."


The post above on this tread mentioned if you get the UPN signal, you should be able to get the abc, 7.1 signal.

I can get the UPN signal pretty good via my channel master antenna in the attic in Westminster, but the picture keeps cutting out (even at a good signal) - is this just them (UPN) getting it operational, or is my signal reading misleading and my signal is really not as good as my sony hd200 receiver is leading me to believe.

Any others getting a good signal on UPN 20, but the picture cuts out, etc w/ a good signal?

Promising about abc moving their antenna, and hopefully it will work before the super bowl.... Is the antenna going to republic plaza??

Does anyone know if the current UPN digital output is as good as it's gonna get, or if there are plans to further 'boost' the signal after testing is complete?

I hope that they are planning on boosting it. I was able to receive it for the first few hours that they were broadcasting (I was able to watch them changing their channel identification and playing with the video signal), but I can barely get any signal from them ever since. I am nowhere close to getting any kind of a lock on it now (it just barely registers on the signal meter). All of the other RP stations come in fine for me.

I am planning on buying a new telescoping mast to put my antenna on. I'm at 15 ft above the peak of my house now. I tried going to 20 ft using a regular mast extension pipe, but the mast just couldn't take it and it ended up bending the mast before I could hook up the guy wires. I am hoping that the additional height will help out my RP signals, as I seem to barely be in the signal path. The signal path seems to start about 10 feet above my peak.

Ahh, the things that Coloradoan's have to do to get High Def...just plain rediculous.

Avs are on OLN-HD on D* channel 97!

Thanks for the heads up. I wouldn't have watched this game if it weren't for this notice. I don't even know what OTN network is and I have been with D* for many years. I'll have to figure out why this is on in HD on 97. Go figure.

Does anyone know if the current UPN digital output is as good as it's gonna get, or if there are plans to further 'boost' the signal after testing is complete? My guess would be that they are already at their planned 6.5kw signal level. My Fusion5 card show the signal strength for KTVD as almost exactly 3db lower than KRMA and KUSA, who are broadcasting at 13 kw. 3db is exactly what I'd expect for a 2x difference.

6.5 kw is the power level KMGH is planning for their new transmitter as well.

FYI, tonight on the Dishnetwork Charlie Chat they announced Denver HD locals by mid March!.

I hope DirecTV follows soon.

Avs are on OLN-HD on D* channel 97!

Thanks for the heads-up! Good game for the Avs!

I read a few posts here talking about KMGH being ready with their new transmission by the Super Bowl. I read back a bit but couldn't see specifically what this was referring to. So the question - Is KMGH going to a new tower that will actually output a signal that can be reached by more than a few blocks of their current location?

One response indicated that if you could receive UPN you should receiver ABC - so I am just looking for some details on this as ABC is the only channel I can't get at the moment and would be great if they started outputting a receivable signal.

They're moving to the top of Republic Plaza - same place all the other low powers are at.

They're moving to the top of Republic Plaza - same place all the other low powers are at.

I suspected that with the reference to UPN but wasn't sure as I didn't see anything specific on it.

That's great news as I started watching a few programs on ABC so that would be great. Kinda makes the upcoming DirecTV rollout of Denver Locals a non-issue since I will finally be able to get everything. Of course we will have to wait and see what kind out output they really put out but sounds great!

Thanks for the heads up. I wouldn't have watched this game if it weren't for this notice. I don't even know what OTN network is and I have been with D* for many years. I'll have to figure out why this is on in HD on 97. Go figure.
[Off Topic]
OLN = Outdoor Life Network = D* 608 SD
Known for several years as the home for the live broadcast in the US of the Tour de France, they are contracted now to broadcast 1 or 2 NHL games each week usually with one on Monday. They are not a full time HD channel, but the games are telecast in HD. D* has been picking the HD version up on occasion in their special telecast HD packages with the channels usually in the 90-98 region. There are also some RSN NBA basketball and hockey HD telecasts in those channels, but you have to check each night for the schedule. The RSN games are open only to the Center Ice and Center Court (NBA?) subs only, but the OLN games are open for anyone with a package which includes the OLN SD channel.
[/off topic]

So KMGwhatever says they will be on the air by the Super Bowl, are those the same lawyers who told us and the FCC they would be on the air by Sept. of 2004 from Lookout Mt.? I would hold my breath, but my Doctor told me I need to breathe more than once every 10 years.
:rolleyes:

FYI, tonight on the Dishnetwork Charlie Chat they announced Denver HD locals by mid March!.

I hope DirecTV follows soon.Why, so you can actually pay more per month to see local stations you should be able to receive for free in lower resolution than you would get if you received them off the air?

Why, so you can actually pay more per month to see local stations you should be able to receive for free in lower resolution than you would get if you received them off the air?

Yes. And because, with no other options, people will pay.

Why, so you can actually pay more per month to see local stations you should be able to receive for free in lower resolution than you would get if you received them off the air?

And don't forget that eventually some of that payment to E* will go back to the LCG stations too. Sort of makes you stop and think.....if you are an LCG station, what's the rush for OTA?????

On my my H10 receiver, you have to go into the setup menus and type in your zip code to retrieve the schedules for those OTA stations that D* has for your area. Go into menu/setting/setup/sat&Ant/antennia setup/local networks and then type in your zip code. After it retrieves the stations, it allows you to select those stations you want to see in your on-screen menus (use "edit off air channels").

I have accurate schedules for most all the stations exept for the new UPN one that just started broadcasting.

Hope that helps.

Thanks boiler! I never realized you could do this!

I am getting UPN 19-1 better now, but I still have many break-ups. My 1st gen SIR-T150 gets everything else available pretty well, but is not doing that great on UPN. I am getting sound now, and can get a picture, but with my indoor RS Double Bow Tie, I get lots of breakups. It looked better when I had no audio, and my "signal strength" meter shows a level that is about the same as the other RP stations, and is rock solid (no jumping around like I usually see when signals are breaking up). So I assumed the problem was on their end. But last night I messed around a little and was able to move to a location where the picture was stable, then move to another location that caused the picture to break up. So it looks like my issue is something different than I've had before. My signal looks strong, but the actual s/n must be close to the limit for my receiver. if that rumored ABC station ever starts broadcasting, I will not be surprised if I have the same issue with them if they are doing the same ERP as UPN. Aarrgh, I guess I'll have to try to optimize my setup.

I hope that they are planning on boosting it. I was able to receive it for the first few hours that they were broadcasting (I was able to watch them changing their channel identification and playing with the video signal), but I can barely get any signal from them ever since. I am nowhere close to getting any kind of a lock on it now (it just barely registers on the signal meter). All of the other RP stations come in fine for me.

Try again now. DT-19 was doing a lot of work to resolve some audio issues. The video was often affected and several times they left the air altogether. I got a very high signal on DT-19 from day one, then encounter the issues you noted. I now receive DT-19 as well as ever w/o any audio issues on either receiver.

When I point my antenna for max signal from RP, DT-19 reads in the low 90s on my Dish 811. Equal to KUSA, my strongest signal of any DTV channel no matter which way I point any antenna. With my narrow beamwidth XG91 antenna pointed about 15 degrees west of RP (to lock KDVR) I get DT-19 and KUSA in the high 80s. I'm 10 miles from RP w/ a small ridgeline blocking my LOS. BTW, I get KRMA-DT in the mid-80s and KCNC-DT in the low 80s, consistent w/ their lower broadcast antenna elevation and KCNC's higher UHF frequency.

Why, so you can actually pay more per month to see local stations you should be able to receive for free in lower resolution than you would get if you received them off the air?

Yeah, dont those dummies at Dish and DirecTv realize that the millions of people who'll be upgrading to HD in the next few months and years would much rather dick around with OTA antennas for one reason or another to get their local HD channels than they would just have them available like all the other channels they're already getting (and paying for) from those systems?

Theres no reason to offer those.. especially in the other markets where the stations *have* done the right thing digitally. In fact, all cable co's should stop offering the HD locals too for the same reason. Just use OTA antennas you dumb SOB's!

Yeah right.

Yeah, dont those dummies at Dish and DirecTv realize that the millions of people who'll be upgrading to HD in the next few months and years would much rather dick around with OTA antennas for one reason or another to get their local HD channels than they would just have them available like all the other channels they're already getting (and paying for) from those systems?

Point taken. Ultimately, OTA DTV will be for the purists (for the superior PQ) and those w/o the means and/or desire to pay for cable or DBS. So screw those elitists who want the best PQ their $2K to $10K HDTVs can deliver and screw those economically disadvantaged who won't forego heating their homes so they can pay Comcast for DTV.

Point taken. Ultimately, OTA DTV will be for the purists (for the superior PQ) and those w/o the means and/or desire to pay for cable or DBS. So screw those elitists who want the best PQ their $2K to $10K HDTVs can deliver and screw those economically disadvantaged who won't forego heating their homes so they can pay Comcast for DTV.

No one's saying that full power OTA should not be available. It's just a reality of these times that people expect their TV to come from one source. Everyone in my neighborhood has asked why I'm fiddling with the roof top antenna. Most probably don't see it as worth the trouble.

The bottom line is that the only way for a subscription TV service to maintain/achieve high pentration numbers is to offer locals, and those do come with a price. Why should one be bothered by pay alternatives when there are no other options. It's not like a lack of subscription to HD locals via cable or sats would accelerate the LCG situation.

Since I'm known as the techie-HDTV-HT-computer geek amongst my friends and coworkers (hey everyone needs some sort of legacy), I've found one word that really grabs their attention when they ask me how I get my HDTV. That word is "free".

Yeah, there is still the cost of the antenna, and depending where you live maybe up to several hours spent setting it up and tweaking it, but when I tell them I get all HDTV locals via my rooftop antenna and that my monthly TV bill for this is $0, they generally become very focused listeners. Now I know this is not currently an option for everyone (location, location, location), but I've seen people stand outside in freezing rain for hours &/or trample their family and friends to get something for free.

I didn't say 'easy', I said 'free'. ;)

Point taken. Ultimately, OTA DTV will be for the purists (for the superior PQ) and those w/o the means and/or desire to pay for cable or DBS. So screw those elitists who want the best PQ their $2K to $10K HDTVs can deliver and screw those economically disadvantaged who won't forego heating their homes so they can pay Comcast for DTV.

Who's getting screwed? Not talking about abolishing OTA altogether. If a person his hellbent on receiving it that way(in principle or for monetary considerations), go ahead. Someday the OTA situation will be sorted out even here.

But to suggest that theres no reason for the other 90% of the people to be excited at the prospect that they'd be able to get HD locals over their DBS system is poppycock.

I'd wager that even the vast majority of posters in this thread over the years, had they waited til like '07 to get into HD, wouldnt even consider bothering with getting the local digital channels OTA if all of the multi-channel providers were offering the local digital channels on their systems at the time the person made the move to HD. They'd prolly have laughed at the notion of hooking up some sort of antenna.

Since I'm known as the techie-HDTV-HT-computer geek amongst my friends and coworkers (hey everyone needs some sort of legacy), I've found one word that really grabs their attention when they ask me how I get my HDTV. That word is "free".

One of the goals of the digital conversion is clearly to be able to receive OTA digital signals with little effort and with a PERFECT picture. Now, we all know that in Denver, we don't have any stations broadcasting yet at full power or from a logical location, ie Lookout. Nevertheless, at some point, when all parties come to their senses, most people in the Denver area (and all other major cities) should really be able to get their digital signals with a simple indoor antenna and do so with little effort.

I know this should work because I was able to receive ALL stations, except you-know-who, with a small RS double-bow tie antenna inside my house. The ONLY reason I have this mother big Yagi on top of my roof is to be able to get the signal from you-know-who. I am hopeful if those recalcitrant ba$tards finally send a reasonable signal from RP, I will be able to replace my outdoor unsightly antenna with a small indoor one... my RS double bow tie which is still stored in its box!

When TV stations start broadcasting OTA at full power, that ability should be the norm, not the exception as it is now. Now, if I wanted to try to receive Colorado Springs or Cheyennne digital signals, maybe I would keep the Yagi and buy a rotater!

Yeah, dont those dummies at Dish and DirecTv realize that the millions of people who'll be upgrading to HD in the next few months and years would much rather dick around with OTA antennas for one reason or another to get their local HD channels than they would just have them available like all the other channels they're already getting (and paying for) from those systems?

Theres no reason to offer those.. especially in the other markets where the stations *have* done the right thing digitally. In fact, all cable co's should stop offering the HD locals too for the same reason. Just use OTA antennas you dumb SOB's!

Yeah right.

Those dummies at Dish and DirecTv are smarter than I was when I ordered my 921 receiver, They advertise that it has a OTA tuner (8VSB), Great right, Well if you want to get the OTA guide information you have to subscribe to the locals otherwise all you see is "No Info Avail", Try to set some DVR timers a week ahead and take your chances, Then try to find a show you recorded and the entire DVR list of recordings is titled No info avail. So yeah, 95% of the TV I watch is OTA while I pay E* $6 a month for locals. I veiw it as $6 a month for guide info. Both of my HDTVs are monitors only so I am stuck right now with paying.

The OTA situation in Denver is driving me completely insane!!!! Now that I have seen HD (and ponied up the $$$ for an antenna & HD set-top receiver -- not to mention the HDTV set itself), I can't be content to watch analog broadcasts any longer.

However, it is completely ridiculous that we have to climb into our attics, up on our roofs or whatever for re-configuration -- or worse yet -- buy and install new equipment for each additional station that we want to receive OTA (or each time a station decides to change their configuration, or each time a new building goes up between us and RP, etc. etc.).

And, I absolutely refuse to pay a secondary provider for TV content since that content is initially paid for by advertising (which we still have to be subjected to even if we pay for that same content through a secondary provider).

Once the switchover happens, how many ordinary folks are going to go through what we (the few, the elite, the insane) go through just to watch TV? At that point, the stations will likely face enough pressure from consumers to get their (functional) tower built. But in the meantime, this just plain sucks!

If nothing happens soon, we are ALL going to have supertowers constructed in our back yards to receive OTA broadcasts from coathangers because SCARE/BOYCOTTGOLDEN won't let one tower go up in their general vicinity!

PATHETIC!!!

- the (pissed off) Great White Water Buffalo

Those dummies at Dish and DirecTv are smarter than I was when I ordered my 921 receiver, They advertise that it has a OTA tuner (8VSB), Great right, Well if you want to get the OTA guide information you have to subscribe to the locals otherwise all you see is "No Info Avail...My 1st gen D* receiver doesn't have the APG, so it gets the dynamic PSIP data OTA (there's actually a setting to get it or ignore it)
My 2nd gen D* receiver does have the APG and it can only get the dynamic PSIP data by cloning the data from the D* local station.

I think most satellite receivers with the Advanced Program Guide are like this. I thought I noticed, however, that once I subscribed to locals via satellite and then canceled them, I continued to get the guide data for those channels.

So I tuned in at 5 this afternoon to watch Rick Steves Europe in HD and instead I see America's Test Kitchens in SD. Although there is no mention of this on the KRMA website or TitanTV's program guide, it seems they are now passing the "APT Create Channel" in the afternoons instead of the PBS-HD feed? They switched back to the PBS-HD feed around 6:45 PM - I guess that was when the janitor got back from his break.

I did some googling and found this
http://www.aptonline.org/aptweb.nsf/vOtherDocs/Press+Release-Create+Announcement
which ominously includes Denver among the cities where this new channel is going to be carried "12 to 24 hours per day". Ugh. If we must have this, why can't it be on KBDI, which could easily absorb another SD subchannel.

Try again now. DT-19 was doing a lot of work to resolve some audio issues. The video was often affected and several times they left the air altogether. I got a very high signal on DT-19 from day one, then encounter the issues you noted. I now receive DT-19 as well as ever w/o any audio issues on either receiver.

Unfortunately, DT-19 is still a horrible signal for me. I'm getting around 25%, and I really need about 35 - 40% to get a good lock. I've always been kind of on the edge, as channels 4 and 6 only come in reliably at night, and 9 gives me a perfect signal at all times of the day.

Well, it seems that my idea to get a taller mast is running into a problem. The Rohn telescoping masts that I was looking at all require freight shipping, which would cost about double what the mast costs! (Mast is about $50, freight is about $100) Does anyone know of a place along the front range that might have 30 foot telescoping masts at a decent price (less than or near $100)?

B.J.

Well, it seems that my idea to get a taller mast is running into a problem. The Rohn telescoping masts that I was looking at all require freight shipping, which would cost about double what the mast costs! (Mast is about $50, freight is about $100) Does anyone know of a place along the front range that might have 30 foot telescoping masts at a decent price (less than or near $100)?
BJ,
My Rohn 45 tower was shipped from a supplier in Denver. So, there used to be a supplier in Denver. Sorry, I can't remember their name. :confused:
....jc

And, I absolutely refuse to pay a secondary provider for TV content since that content is initially paid for by advertising (which we still have to be subjected to even if we pay for that same content through a secondary provider).



What, no TIVO? I haven't seen a commercial in years. when I first set up my OTA I didn't have a high-def TIVO, the quality was great but the ads seemed sooooo looooooong!!!

So I ordered the D* HR10-250 the next day. I pony up my money, get a few more channels, some of which I even watch, and essentially no commercials. Believe me in the time it would take me to watch the commercials I can earn far more than the cost of the service!

What, no TIVO? I haven't seen a commercial in years. when I first set up my OTA I didn't have a high-def TIVO, the quality was great but the ads seemed sooooo looooooong!!!

So I ordered the D* HR10-250 the next day. I pony up my money, get a few more channels, some of which I even watch, and essentially no commercials. Believe me in the time it would take me to watch the commercials I can earn far more than the cost of the service!
DrrD:

With that HR10-250 can you record OTA HD transmissions? I only use OTA and have no other feed but am looking for a HD recorder and was curious if this one would work...I also do not want to pay for the 12.95/month for a tivo subscription.

DrrD:

With that HR10-250 can you record OTA HD transmissions? I only use OTA and have no other feed but am looking for a HD recorder and was curious if this one would work...I also do not want to pay for the 12.95/month for a tivo subscription.
It'll work with OTA, but you have to pay DirecTV (at least Total Choice, plus $5 DVR fee) for the thing to work.

TiVo's coming out with a dual tuner HD model later this year (or so they claim) that'll work with OTA and/or cable, but will be subject to the $12.95 (or $300 for product lifetime) service fee.

Back on topic - what was the deal with Gilmore Girls on WB tonight? First new episode in months and no HD? :(

So I tuned in at 5 this afternoon to watch Rick Steves Europe in HD and instead I see America's Test Kitchens in SD. Although there is no mention of this on the KRMA website or TitanTV's program guide, it seems they are now passing the "APT Create Channel" in the afternoons instead of the PBS-HD feed? They switched back to the PBS-HD feed around 6:45 PM - I guess that was when the janitor got back from his break.

I did some googling and found this
http://www.aptonline.org/aptweb.nsf/vOtherDocs/Press+Release-Create+Announcement
which ominously includes Denver among the cities where this new channel is going to be carried "12 to 24 hours per day". Ugh. If we must have this, why can't it be on KBDI, which could easily absorb another SD subchannel.

yep, i just noitced this afternoon. Let's take the best HD channel and put SD crap on. There's a great idea. I hope this isn't going to be a subchannel :mad:

Yeah, dont those dummies at Dish and DirecTv realize that the millions of people who'll be upgrading to HD in the next few months and years would much rather dick around with OTA antennas for one reason or another to get their local HD channels than they would just have them available like all the other channels they're already getting (and paying for) from those systems?In every market other than Denver, you can plug your antenna cable that you used to receive NTSC into your ATSC set and receive HD instantly, all for free. No need for tweaky antenna pointing, it just works.

The reason it doesn't work here is, IMHO at least in part because too many people are content to subscribe to Comcast, D* or E* instead.

Anyone know what was up with KWGN tonight? Brand new Gilmore Girls, complete with animated "Available in HD" logo, in 4:3 on KWGN-DT. :(

Not only that but "clicks" in the audio every minute or two. :( :(

Anyone know what was up with KWGN tonight? Brand new Gilmore Girls, complete with animated "Available in HD" logo, in 4:3 on KWGN-DT. :(

Not only that but "clicks" in the audio every minute or two. :( :(
No audio issues on my HR10-250.

Is it just me, or is KWGN having more and more HD failures recently? I don't remember them being this unstable say, a year ago. :confused:

I did some googling and found this
http://www.aptonline.org/aptweb.nsf/vOtherDocs/Press+Release-Create+Announcement
which ominously includes Denver among the cities where this new channel is going to be carried "12 to 24 hours per day". Ugh. If we must have this, why can't it be on KBDI, which could easily absorb another SD subchannel.You don't know about the histories of KRMA and KBDI, do you? :D

Seriously, it's only in the past few years people at the two stations have been willing to talk to each other…

DrrD:

With that HR10-250 can you record OTA HD transmissions? I only use OTA and have no other feed but am looking for a HD recorder and was curious if this one would work...I also do not want to pay for the 12.95/month for a tivo subscription.


Yes! The antenna feed goes into it, and the channels show up in the guide and can be recorded just like the satellite channels. In fact, you can't tell what's OTA and what's satellite. It has 2 OTA and 2 satellite tuners (so you cna record 2 OTA shows at the same time.)

All,

Regarding the problem with Gilmore Girls last evening, unfortunately someone still needs to press the RECORD button on our HD server and this did not happen until the start of Supernatural. If you noticed, Supernatural was switched to HD a few minutes into the show.

We try to eliminate all possible errors but some mistakes do happen. Sorry!

Dr_Mal,

You spoke of reliability issues with WB2 lately. Do you have more details as to specific problems that I have not addressed in the forum. I just want to make sure there is something I have not been made aware of.

Thanks!


Dave Martinez
WB2 Colorado
KWGN-TV
HD 2-1

It'll work with OTA, but you have to pay DirecTV (at least Total Choice, plus $5 DVR fee) for the thing to work.Actually the cheapest way you can get it to work for OTA is by subscribing to one of the DIRECTV PARA TODOS Packages: SELECCIÓN EXTRA™ for $29.99 a month plus the $5 DVR fee.

Dr_Mal,

You spoke of reliability issues with WB2 lately. Do you have more details as to specific problems that I have not addressed in the forum. I just want to make sure there is something I have not been made aware of.
Nothing you haven't addressed, Dave. It just feels like the occurrence of someone forgetting to hit record is up the last few months. Doing a quick search here shows issues with HD on KWGN-DT last night, December 4, November 22, and on October 18. Four issues over the course of 3 months isn't terrible, but IMHO higher than it should be.

I think part of my perception of HD unreliability is that the last 2 "fresh" Gilmore Girls (last night and November 22) had issues. So in terms of Gilmore Girls, we haven't seen a new episode in full HD since 11/15. Obviously most of that time was due to no new episodes airing but the last episode before their break and then the first new one again were both messed up. That's a little frustrating.

Crossing my fingers for HD Smallville on Thursday...

Thanks for hanging out here and letting us vent. Your presence is appreciated.

Four issues in the past four months is unacceptable and is being addressed at the present time and I will not make excuses for the lack of quality on our end.

In the future we will have redundant systems that should eliminate many of the errors that occur at present and this will help achieve the goal of 100% reliablity.

As always, the input provided on this forum is greatly appreciated.

Thanks!


Dave Martinez
WB2 Colorado
KWGN-TV
HD 2-1

Why on earth would someone need to press the RECORD button on your HD server? Sounds very primitive.

Cause the Chimpanzee they hired on a year ago to do it up and quit a while back without even giving any notice.

I think I can help though. I have one of those Rat Shack VCR programmer thingys that can send a record command to a VCR at appropriate times. It's for like when any would-be built in timers dont work for whatever reason.

It set me back $15.00 once upon a time but since I dont use it anymore I'll let them have it for $10.00 ;)

I guess I need to defend myself now and say I was not actually serious when I said someone did not press the "RECORD" button. The device we have does require someone to enter the correct record information and that did not happen. Perhaps I will just state only what is cause and result and leave it at that.

Dave Martinez
WB2 Colorado
KWGN-TV
2-1

Cause the Chimpanzee they hired on a year ago to do it up and quit a while back without even giving any notice... and he's now playing QB for the Broncos ;)

I guess I need to defend myself now and say I was not actually serious when I said someone did not press the "RECORD" button. The device we have does require someone to enter the correct record information and that did not happen. Perhaps I will just state only what is cause and result and leave it at that.

Dave Martinez
WB2 Colorado
KWGN-TV
2-1

Dave,

"MOST" of us here appreciate your always quick response and honesty. "SOME" of us even have a sense of humor. Thank you for taking the time out of your busy schedule to keep us involved and updated.

Jack

So if Dish will offer HD locals in March - and D* promising sometime soon in first half of 2006 and Comcast also doing HD locals

Does it really matter if the fing tower gets built?

Reggie

So if Dish will offer HD locals in March - and D* promising sometime soon in first half of 2006 and Comcast also doing HD locals

Does it really matter if the fing tower gets built?

Reggie
Yes.

Figure about 20% of the population relies on OTA TV reception exclusively. The analog is going away in 1133 days. They need the digital broadcasts at full power by then.

Even though I'm among those who choose to pay for additional TV channels, I intend to rely on my OTA antenna for local HD for the forseeable future - I don't trust any carrier to not (eventually) recompress and lower the quality. The beauty of digital OTA broadcasts is that, apart from multicasting, the quality is as good as it gets. We no longer "need" a cable company to get the local stations without snow, ghosting, etc.

I guess I need to defend myself now and say I was not actually serious when I said someone did not press the "RECORD" button. The device we have does require someone to enter the correct record information and that did not happen. Perhaps I will just state only what is cause and result and leave it at that.On a related note, any idea why there was a "pop" or "click" in the audio once a minute or so during last night's 4:3 Gilmore Girls?

Yes.

The beauty of digital OTA broadcasts is that, apart from multicasting, the quality is as good as it gets. We no longer "need" a cable company to get the local stations without snow, ghosting, etc.

But if you are like me OTA does not exist

And I think we have a better chance to get the Sat companies to increase resolution than we do to get a tower built.

Reggie

Our Off-Air HD record of Gilmore Girls did not indicate any "click" or "pop" during any segment.

Dave Martinez
WB2 Colorado
KWGN-TV
HD 2-1

.............And I think we have a better chance to get the Sat companies to increase resolution than we do to get a tower built.

Reggie
Boy if that isn't a comment on just how sorry the story of network HD is in the Denver area. Where else could it be so bad that you have a better chance of getting the Satco's providing 'decent' network HD (in actuality HDLite) than you would getting towers built for OTA HD. A special thanks must go out to (S)CARE and the LCG for that one. What a sorry situation........
:(

BTW, a special thanks to 'boilerup' for the suggestion on how to get the schedules up on a D* receiver to replace the "Regular Schedule" in the on screen guide. I remember when I first got my receiver I had the schedules for the OTA stuff and then when a new software upgrade downloaded it went back to the 'regular schedule'. Although it wasn't a big issue for me since the local schedules were on the D* channels and I don't use a DVR, it was definitely an annoyance. My second receiver on my downstairs set was OK, so I just lived with it. I had forgotten how it was setup on the upstairs receiver. Reading his comments brought it all back and things are good again with my receiver. Thanks boilerup, who says 'you can't teach an ol' horse new tricks'.

Dave,

"MOST" of us here appreciate your always quick response and honesty. "SOME" of us even have a sense of humor. Thank you for taking the time out of your busy schedule to keep us involved and updated.

Jack

I mostly lurk and get great tips and info in this forum, but I just wanted to echo the thanks to Dave for looking in here and always responding to questions.

Dave, I go out of my way to watch programs live in HD on channel 2-1 BECAUSE I see you in here answering questions. It also helps that you guys are actually broadcasting digitally and have HD programming that I enjoy.

I also go out of my way to avoid channel 7 specifically because I cannot receive their digital signal where I live. Of course there are certain shows on ABC that I like to watch, but I record those on an SD DVR so that I can skip the commercials--If they can't reach me digitally, then I am not going to support their sponsors.

I also go out of my way to avoid channel 7 specifically because I cannot receive their digital signal where I live. Of course there are certain shows on ABC that I like to watch, but I record those on an SD DVR so that I can skip the commercials--If they can't reach me digitally, then I am not going to support their sponsors.
7? We have a channel 7 here? :D

Sorry, couldn't resist. But for what it's worth, I stopped watching any new ABC shows when it became clear KMGH didn't want to expand their HD coverage area. Since Drew Carey ended in 2004, I haven't watched anything on ABC/KMGH. Of course, if their Republic transmitter ever goes live, I'll likely start picking up some new shows this fall. Can't resist the idea of more free HDTV.

I understand the requirement and timeframe for "broadcast" stations to switch to DTV. And, also that stations don't necessarily have to broadcast in "HDTV." Can somebody enlighten me on how this applies to what I would call "cable-only" stations like MTV, CNN, etc? I looked around on the FCC site, and the answer wasn't exactly jumping out at me.

7? We have a channel 7 here? :D

Sorry, couldn't resist. But for what it's worth, I stopped watching any new ABC shows when it became clear KMGH didn't want to expand their HD coverage area. Since Drew Carey ended in 2004, I haven't watched anything on ABC/KMGH. Of course, if their Republic transmitter ever goes live, I'll likely start picking up some new shows this fall. Can't resist the idea of more free HDTV.

Funny how that works. They're only bush league and worth boycotting altogether until a person can suddenly see their HD for themselves.. even though theres no shortage of other people in the region who still wouldnt be able to even from RP. ;)

Must be why I personally have never really bothered taken pot shots at em.. having been one of the Lucky 13 (or is it 20 by now..who knows) all along.

As far as Reggies comment..

So if Dish will offer HD locals in March - and D* promising sometime soon in first half of 2006 and Comcast also doing HD locals

Does it really matter if the fing tower gets built?


Oh like so many things in life.. it's an individual (or in this case perhaps, household) consideration as to how much it matters.

To *me* it doesnt really matter for 2 reasons. For one I have every intention of always using a multi-channel provider for channels like ESPN, Discovery, CNN and others and as such will be able to get the locals that way.. and for two, even if I had to resort back to OTA I happen to live where I can pick the channels up even with their low power deals.

Although I dont know that the latter makes much difference anyway since in the couple years now that I've gotten the locals over the cable, I havent watched much of anything via my OTA tuners (other than for some brief comparison) or recorded a single program from them. Not sayin I wont in the future.. but have had no cause to lately.

In other words, I care as much about a new digital tower at this point as I would have if the ol analog ones would've ever come crashing down and shut off the OTA analogs for an indefinite period of time. Not a lick.

Some might say that makes me selfish.. and thats fine. I'm sure some might say I'm selfish for not givin a chit about global warming, amazon forest destruction or homeless people (who by in large I think tend to like living under bridges) either. So be it.

With any luck, someday I'll find some cause to actually rant and rave about and lose sleep over.. make me feel like a normal human being. ;)

On a related note, any idea why there was a "pop" or "click" in the audio once a minute or so during last night's 4:3 Gilmore Girls?

FWIW, I had no problems with audio during the Gilmore Girls last night using a Dish 921 and Yamaha receiver.

Can somebody enlighten me on how this applies to what I would call "cable-only" stations like MTV, CNN, etc? I looked around on the FCC site, and the answer wasn't exactly jumping out at me.
I've never seen one, and I've read quite a few FCC 'rulings'. Remember, these are private entities. Other than the content that they carry, I doubt the the FCC really cares about the quality or type of signal that they provide. Eventually, they'll be forced to provide a digital signal, but market forces and competition are what are going move them toward HD broadcasts.
....jc

I've never seen one, and I've read quite a few FCC 'rulings'. Remember, these are private entities. Other than the content that they carry, I doubt the the FCC really cares about the quality or type of signal that they provide. Eventually, they'll be forced to provide a digital signal, but market forces and competition are what are going move them toward HD broadcasts.
....jc


In otherwords, the DTV requirement by the FCC doesn't apply to stations that don't broadcast OTA.

Funny how that works. They're only bush league and worth boycotting altogether until a person can suddenly see their HD for themselves.. even though theres no shortage of other people in the region who still wouldnt be able to even from RP. ;)
Yup - that's exactly how it works ;)

It's all about the HD for me - I can't think of anything I watch in SD anymore.

The reason it doesn't work here is, IMHO at least in part because too many people are content to subscribe to Comcast, D* or E* instead.

IMHO, the biggest reason is those NIMBY's up the hill! :mad:

I'd much rather get my HDTV OTA, as unmolested as possible. If I have to go to D* to get it, I suppose I will but I'd much rather get it for free.

As a DirecTV subscriber who intends to stay with the choice of locals OTA even when they become available on the satellite, some of my reasons are:
1) The PQ is better OTA, even when DirecTV goes to MPEG4, it will still be compressed.
2) The phase III dish used for DirecTV now is way less ugly and obtrusive than the Ka/Ku monstrosity that will be necessary to receive HD locals on the satellite.
3) I intend to use an HR10-250 to record HD so I can keep the Tivo service as long as possible to avoid going to what I understand is a kludged-up copy of a DVR made for DirecTV.
4) I am lucky enough to be able to get all the Denver digital signals being broadcast with my current CM4228 antenna.

Our Off-Air HD record of Gilmore Girls did not indicate any "click" or "pop" during any segment.Interesting... no idea why that was as my receiver (LG LST-3410a) hasn't had that issue with other channels or, for that matter, with Supernatural last night.

(Cue Supernatural theme music. ;))

Thanks for checking and of course, for being here on this forum! :D

Sorry if this is old news, but I'll post a message I just got recently from Denver 7 based on a gripe I made on their feedback website and my disappointment with their HD. I made the last line of the respose yellow... Hopefully we can watch the SB in HD! :D


***********************************************
From : Brown Darrell <darrell_brown@kmgh.com>
To : <rktcyntst>
Subject : RE: TheDenverChannel Feedback
Date : Wed, Jan 11, 2006 04:09 PM

Mike,
We currently installing a new HD transmitter and antenna at Republic
Plaza- the site where channels 4, 9, 20 and 6 are located. The
equipment is in place and the wiring is being done as we email. The
signal should be available the week of January 23rd.
Darrell Brown

-----Original Message-----
From: rktcyntst
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 8:55 PM
To: generalmanager@thedenverchannel.com
Subject: TheDenverChannel Feedback



EMAIL SUBJECT:
TheDenverChannel.com - Website Feedback

MESSAGE:
Could you guys give your super bowl coverage to a local station that
actually broadcasts HD? I'm kinda bummed that your network (actually I
should say your station, since other ABC affiliates in the country
actually broadcast in HD) has it. (All the other major Denver networks
broadcast stuff like this in HD).

I'm seeing these 'ABC HD' logos on the rose bowl and am bummed that I
can't watch it in HD as advertised.

I don't want to pay comcast to get your alleged over the air HD signal.

Thank goodness ABC won't be carrying NFL games next year!

Let me know if you can get it moved. Thanks.

- Mike

Mike, thanks for the info on the reply. I received similar info from them regarding the 23rd. Good to know they are providing consisent info, hopefully we will finally get a signal to watch 7.1.

Sorry if this is old news, but I'll post a message I just got recently from Denver 7 based on a gripe I made on their feedback website and my disappointment with their HD. I made the last line of the respose yellow... Hopefully we can watch the SB in HD! :D


***********************************************
From : Brown Darrell <darrell_brown@kmgh.com>
To : <rktcyntst>
Subject : RE: TheDenverChannel Feedback
Date : Wed, Jan 11, 2006 04:09 PM

Mike,
We currently installing a new HD transmitter and antenna at Republic
Plaza- the site where channels 4, 9, 20 and 6 are located. The
equipment is in place and the wiring is being done as we email. The
signal should be available the week of January 23rd.
Darrell Brown


Notice the lack of YEAR. I'd feel better if it said 2006.

So I am not sure if this is the thread to post this question... but here I go anyway.

I have the DirecTV with the Basic DVR service currently. I am looking to upgrade to HD Box. The people at DirecTV would like to charge me an arm and a leg to have a tech install the service. They did say that I could "DIY" and simply pay the monthly charges. So here is my question... Do I use my currect dish to receive OTA HD signal or do I have to buy a seperate antenna? While talking to 4 DirecTV people only 1 said that it wouldn't be necessary but said that I would need to pay for installation to take advantage of this (sounds like a bunch of BS to me). Can anyone help me out? I am looking to get the H20 from DirecTV.

Welcome DaBody1:

You do need a separate UHF antenna for OTA. This plugs into the back of the HD Tivo along with TWO satellite inputs. Depending on where you are located, the antenna would probably need to be on your roof and be a pretty good one. Channel Masters are excellent and you can buy them online.

Where do you live?

Go here: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=36 for lots more information on the HD Tivo.

I would wait until the HD Denver locals are available on DirecTV (hopefully within the next 3 months) since you will need a 5 satellite dish to get those HD locals via sat. If you buy now they will install a regular 3LNB dish and you will pay again to get the new 5 sat (aka AT9) dish.

If you are sure you will not want the locals via sat (OTA signal should look better than satellite version) then go ahead and get H20 now.

OTA HD signal needs to come from an antenna, not the dish. Most cities can use a Silver Sensor indoors, but here in Denver many need an external to pick up the low power signals from Republic Plaza.

On my my H10 receiver, you have to go into the setup menus and type in your zip code to retrieve the schedules for those OTA stations that D* has for your area. Go into menu/setting/setup/sat&Ant/antennia setup/local networks and then type in your zip code. After it retrieves the stations, it allows you to select those stations you want to see in your on-screen menus (use "edit off air channels").

I have accurate schedules for most all the stations exept for the new UPN one that just started broadcasting.

Hope that helps.

This looks to have worked for me as well, thanks for your help. I'll have to do a little cleaning because now I have several duplicates, but now I actually know what's on some of the HD OTA channels. Of course, it also got my hopes up with 7-1 appearing in my guide. What was I thinking? ;)

tivocommunity is trying to cut down on discussions of non-TiVo products. You might find more info about the AT9 dish, H20, and soon-to-be-released HR20 here http://www.dbstalk.com/forumdisplay.php?f=82

Welcome DaBody1:

You do need a separate UHF antenna for OTA. This plugs into the back of the HD Tivo along with TWO satellite inputs. Depending on where you are located, the antenna would probably need to be on your roof and be a pretty good one. Channel Masters are excellent and you can buy them online.

Where do you live?

Go here: ---] for lots more information on the HD Tivo.


I am keeping the DirecTV Tivo Unit connected in my family room. I am looking to add the plain HD BOX in the entertainment room. I am not sure if this makes a difference. How the above quote reads, I guess I will need to add an OTA Antenna in addition to the Satellite Dish. But isnt that silly? I mean, look at the size of the DISH. ITS HUGE in comparison to a UHF antenna... oh well...I guess this the price we pay for HIGH DEF!

-THANKS DENNIS-

ITS HUGE in comparison to a UHF antenna...Ahhhh... newbies. Wanna' see my 80" Yagi! Some guys have 100" ones... antenna's that is - haha!

Well it looks like DT-19 is still having problems. Despite a consistent 90% signal, I've seen periods of video breakup every day. I hope they get it fixed soon. I'd hate to go back to viewing UPN on my E* local feed, which looks like crap.

BTW, really wierd yesterday right at noon. All of my RP signals, except KCNC (signal strength down, but still locked), suddenly went bonkers. I couldn't hold a lock on KUSA, KRMA, or KTVD for about 5 minutes. At the time we were having some pretty substantial wind gusts. Since my antenna is in the attic, the wind wasn't affecting it, but could the PR tower have endured some sway or broadcast antenna movement due to the wind? I haven't seen or heard anything about this from the local news, but this is the first time in two years that I've encountered such a signal loss from RP.

Unfortunately, DT-19 is still a horrible signal for me. I'm getting around 25%, and I really need about 35 - 40% to get a good lock. I've always been kind of on the edge, as channels 4 and 6 only come in reliably at night, and 9 gives me a perfect signal at all times of the day.

Well, it seems that my idea to get a taller mast is running into a problem. The Rohn telescoping masts that I was looking at all require freight shipping, which would cost about double what the mast costs! (Mast is about $50, freight is about $100) Does anyone know of a place along the front range that might have 30 foot telescoping masts at a decent price (less than or near $100)?

B.J.

I special-ordered my mast at an ACE Hardware. They have a thick catalogue at the stores (not on their web site) with non-standard stuff. My 4-section pole was about $50, I think.

I read Iwanthd's post #13780 about the Avs being on Directv ch 97 about 3:10 PM today, (I had no idea!) so I went in and allowed all the channels in the 90's. Then I looked at the guide, and went to ch 98 and saw the NFL channel in HD! It was their Game of the Week (Patriots) and it looked great. But half-way through, at 3:30, the show was replaced by the white Directv logo screen. Anybody know what the deal is? The program guide says "Six days to Sunday" is on at 6:30, and more programming follows. Is this something new, or have I just missed it like I missed the Avs in HD?

Scott,

CONIFER!!!!!! You are a brave soul!

I am keeping the DirecTV Tivo Unit connected in my family room. I am looking to add the plain HD BOX in the entertainment room. I am not sure if this makes a difference. How the above quote reads, I guess I will need to add an OTA Antenna in addition to the Satellite Dish. But isnt that silly? I mean, look at the size of the DISH. ITS HUGE in comparison to a UHF antenna... oh well...I guess this the price we pay for HIGH DEF!

-THANKS DENNIS-

When I upgraded to D* HDTV about a year ago, I went to Ultimate Electronics (SoundTrack) and bought a new converter box (about $200) took it home and activated the new card and added the HDTV package. I already had the required (oval) dish installed so didn't need an installer.

If you have the oval (mult-sat) dish already, then all you'll need is the new STB. You may also need to do some inside coax wiring as you're adding an additional receiver. Purchasing a new converter locally (esp. if you can find one on sale) may cost less then a D* installation.

No matter what you decide to do at this time, you will need an antenna in order to receive local HDTV broadcasts (at least until D*'s new service is launched in Denver). The current D* HDTV package consists of about 1/2 dozen HD channels plus an option for a couple of movie channels.

You may want to start by setting up your existing equipment to receive OTA digital TV (if your TV has an ATSC tuner) then getting D*'s new offering when it's available. The new (HD-locals) service does require another dish so you'll probably want that installed professionally.

Good luck!

No problems with the HD feed for Smallville tonight.

Thanks Dave!

BTW, if you haven't been following it, the DTV cutover date may be moving out again.

Last year the House and Senate agreed on a date, but very late in the year the Senate made some changes to the budget bill to which the DTV legislation is attached.

This means the House needs to vote on it again, and both sides have said that if that happens they will likely move the date further out to accomodate "further research into the issue."

Since buying Directv equipment has been discussed recently, I thought this might be a useful piece of info. Several other sites, like Tivocommunity, are discussing a letter sent to Directv dealers by Directv indicating that as of March 1st., Directv will be switching to an equipment leasing model.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=281632

(The text of the letter is about halfway down the page)

Are you "married" to having Direct?

Maybe Dish would work better for you, especially with their new whole house HD DVR (VIP 622 model) just announced at CES as coming out soon? They also announced they would add local HD and an additional 10 - 15 Voom HD channels to those they already use.

I bet to get your business they'd make you a decent deal on converting from Direct when this new DVR is available, as long as you don't being married to a multi-year contract. The multi-year contract stops me from running to a satellite provider, though. Although if Comcast's "digital" channels have any more of a degraded, faded, muddy picture than I've seen recently, I may have no choice.



So I am not sure if this is the thread to post this question... but here I go anyway.

I have the DirecTV with the Basic DVR service currently. I am looking to upgrade to HD Box. The people at DirecTV would like to charge me an arm and a leg to have a tech install the service. They did say that I could "DIY" and simply pay the monthly charges. So here is my question... Do I use my currect dish to receive OTA HD signal or do I have to buy a seperate antenna? While talking to 4 DirecTV people only 1 said that it wouldn't be necessary but said that I would need to pay for installation to take advantage of this (sounds like a bunch of BS to me). Can anyone help me out? I am looking to get the H20 from DirecTV.

As of this moment, the date is Feb 17, 2009.

http://news.com.com/House+approves+new+digital-TV+deadline/2100-1025_3-6000804.html


BTW, if you haven't been following it, the DTV cutover date may be moving out again.

Last year the House and Senate agreed on a date, but very late in the year the Senate made some changes to the budget bill to which the DTV legislation is attached.

This means the House needs to vote on it again, and both sides have said that if that happens they will likely move the date further out to accomodate "further research into the issue."

I need to know how to pick up ota hdtv channel 4...I have a cheap indoor antenna and only pick up 31 and 9...Any help appreciated................ no signal in Littleton

I need to know how to pick up ota hdtv channel 4...I have a cheap indoor antenna and only pick up 31 and 9...Any help appreciated no signal in Littleton

I would get the winegard ss-2000 square shooter antenna and mount it on the side of your house. You should be able to pick up all the digital stations with that, from where you are from.

As you'll see in numerous posts above, you need to get a better antenna and put it outdoors. (HOAs cannot stop you.) I got mine online and it is a Channel Master Yagi 3023 (same as a 4248). The easiest thing for you would be to go to Rat Shack and buy one of their better UHF antennas and try to get it mounted or placed up on your roof and aim it directly at the Republic Plaza building. If it doesn't work, you can always return it. Use good quality RG-6 cable (not RG-59).

KCNC has a slightly lower signal strength than KUSA, but with a better antenna, you should be able to get 4 (actually UHF 35) from RP. 7 promises to be up on RP before the Super Bowl, but don't count on it. Good luck.

I am keeping the DirecTV Tivo Unit connected in my family room. I am looking to add the plain HD BOX in the entertainment room. I am not sure if this makes a difference. How the above quote reads, I guess I will need to add an OTA Antenna in addition to the Satellite Dish. But isnt that silly? I mean, look at the size of the DISH. ITS HUGE in comparison to a UHF antenna... oh well...I guess this the price we pay for HIGH DEF!

-THANKS DENNIS-
I'm a little confused, I too just got the HR10-250 and was told installation was included. I did not have the option to forgo installation in return for a price drop.

So I let the guy come over and asked him to do 1 thing only, run the cable from my new OTA through the wall and make it all nice and neat (it was going though a partially open window, wife loved that.) I already had the 3 LNB dish with the dual cable run to my old Tivo.

KCNC has a slightly lower signal strength than KUSA, but with a better antenna, you should be able to get 4 (actually UHF 35) from RP. 7 promises to be up on RP before the Super Bowl, but don't count on it. Good luck.

Oh man I hope so, but have learned to keep expectations low. Anyone know whether they are planning equivalent/better power than the other stations on RP? I get all of them "ok" now... in the 50-60% signal strength. Think Im pretty lucky considering Im at NW corner of Longmont, ABC will be the last/only one Im worried about.

jc

This looks to have worked for me as well, thanks for your help. I'll have to do a little cleaning because now I have several duplicates, but now I actually know what's on some of the HD OTA channels. Of course, it also got my hopes up with 7-1 appearing in my guide. What was I thinking? ;)

Glad to be of help.

I have actually "un-selected" 7-1 in the "Edit local channels" option so that it won't appear in my guide. Otherwise, I'd just get too mad everytime I saw it.

It sounds like the KMGH move to RP is for real. My 'source' at RP has informed me that KMGH has already erected their broadcast antenna on the roof of the building (it's gotta be getting crowded up there by now :rolleyes: )

How for they are beyond that, I have no idea. I must admit I very much doubted that Ch. 7 would EVER move to RP...but now that I have verification, I'm a believer.

For the few people like myself that can get them currently off of their roof on Speer, I still have this nightmare scenario in my head that once they do move, I'll be one of the few that has MORE trouble receiving them after the move.

Regardless, as has been stated on this thread before, I hope they are going full speed ahead at RP, so that they can get all the bugs worked out (See KTVD's continuing teething pains) well before the Super Bowl.

I wonder if they will do a press release... Our coat hanger has moved. :D

How will Ch 7 get their signal to RP? Microwave? Fiber? Romex? or.....hand signals, maybe!

I wonder if they will do a press release... Our coat hanger has moved. :D
Just in case they bought a 'newer' coat hanger antenna for the RP I would be happy to let them know what to do with the 'old' coat hanger......
:mad:

My personal view is that I will continue to use my alternative source for ABC unless for some reason I have no option. Otherwise, I do not plan to watch any KMGwhatever again for many years to come.

KCNC has a slightly lower signal strength than KUSA, but with a better antenna, you should be able to get 4 (actually UHF 35) from RP. 7 promises to be up on RP before the Super Bowl, but don't count on it. Good luck.[/QUOTE]

Funny, but with a Silver Sensor indoors I actually get a better signal from 4-1 than from 9-1. Though when I raised the antenna 6", 9-1 became watchable. In any case, receiving OTA HD in Denver is a task where experimentation can lead to good results.

How will Ch 7 get their signal to RP? Microwave? Fiber? Romex? or.....hand signals, maybe!

I work across the street from RP (in the 410 bldg). I just saw a guy carry a fax machine in. That must be how KMGH plans on getting their signal to RP. They will fax 1's and 0's.

I work across the street from RP (in the 410 bldg). I just saw a guy carry a fax machine in. That must be how KMGH plans on getting their signal to RP. They will fax 1's and 0's.
LOL!

I would wait until the HD Denver locals are available on DirecTV (hopefully within the next 3 months) since you will need a 5 satellite dish to get those HD locals via sat. If you buy now they will install a regular 3LNB dish and you will pay again to get the new 5 sat (aka AT9) dish.

If you are sure you will not want the locals via sat (OTA signal should look better than satellite version) then go ahead and get H20 now.

OTA HD signal needs to come from an antenna, not the dish. Most cities can use a Silver Sensor indoors, but here in Denver many need an external to pick up the low power signals from Republic Plaza.

I upgraded to the 3 sat dish with a new H10 receiver to get HD about two months ago and was 100% promised that when Denver locals went HD that they would upgrade/install the new dish and swap out the receiver for FREE. I even made them document it since it sounded too good to be true.

Even if you intent to continue to get your locals OTA, won't you want to get the 5 sat dish upgrade to get the other chanels (like TNT) that would be on the new sats?

I thought I read that KCNC and KUSA have the same signal strength but that KCNC does not travel as far or as well as KUSA because of being at a higher frequency and thats why its not quite as easy to receive. Is that not true?
It's true.
When/if KMGH-DT starts broadcasting from RP, what UHF channel # will it be on?

The same as it is now. UHF 17, remapping to 7.1 & 7.2.
....jc

I thought I read that KCNC and KUSA have the same signal strength but that KCNC does not travel as far or as well as KUSA because of being at a higher frequency and thats why its not quite as easy to receive. Is that not true?

When/if KMGH-DT starts broadcasting from RP, what UHF channel # will it be on?
They do have the same ERP, but with a slightly different radiation pattern, I think. Anyway, most people report KCNC lower than KUSA probably because of the difference in frequency between 16 and 35 and maybe a bit as to where their physical antennas are on the building.

Since the FCC assigned KMGH-DT to channel 17, I would assume they would keep it when they move. Good question, tho, since most people have never gotten anything on 17!

I upgraded to the 3 sat dish with a new H10 receiver to get HD about two months ago and was 100% promised that when Denver locals went HD that they would upgrade/install the new dish and swap out the receiver for FREE. I even made them document it since it sounded too good to be true.
I had heard that the new receiver was free, but that they were charging for the dish. But, everything is about to change. D* is moving to a model(like cable companies) where they own all of the equipment, and you rent it. I believe this to be true, and it's supposed to start soon!
Even if you intent to continue to get your locals OTA, won't you want to get the 5 sat dish upgrade to get the other chanels (like TNT) that would be on the new sats?
Absolutely.
....jc

I noticed the totally unwatchable video breakups on KTVD-DT for the past 2 days. They are totally off the air now. Their head engineer said it will be until at least the middle of next week until they are back on the air with some new and/or fixed uplink eqpt.

Don't we get the Avs @ Flyers game tomorrow on KUSA-DT? :)

Don't we get the Avs @ Flyers game tomorrow on KUSA-DT? :)

Yes, but the Flyers game is NOT in HD. The RangersRed Wings game on the east coast is the only HD telecast. It is only available on the east coast and in the Detroit area or to those with 'Canadian' contacts, not a big deal since of course everyone will be on their way to the Broncos game anyway.....
:D

Here is the region map for the telecasts...
NBC Sat Hoockey regions 1/14/06 (http://cdn.nhl.com/images/nbcmap011406.pdf)

I wonder what they'll do with that gerbil they been using as their power source for the coat-hanger antenna?

The old gerbil will be joining a second, younger gerbil for a tag team on RP.

As of this moment, the date is Feb 17, 2009.

http://news.com.com/House+approves+new+digital-TV+deadline/2100-1025_3-6000804.htmlRight... The version the House approved was the version that was sent to the Senate but that was modified before being passed by the Senate on December 21st.

That version now needs to be voted on again by the House to pass, and if the House doesn't pass it verbatim the DTV provision could be stripped from the budget bill (to which it's attached) before it gets sent back to the Senate. Reps in both houses of Congress say if that occurs, the DTV deadline will likely be pushed even further back, to late 2009.

The old gerbil will be joining a second, younger gerbil for a tag team on RP.

LOL!

BTW, for those hotly anticipating Denver HDTV locals in March, be advised that E* will only be carrying KCNC, KMGH, KUSA, and KDVR -DT channels. They won't provide the DT broadcasts for KWGN, KRMA, KBDI, or KTVD for the foreseeable future. Still need that OTA capability to view all available DTV broadcasts.

Yes, but the Flyers game is NOT in HD. The RangersRed Wings game on the east coast is the only HD telecast. It is only available on the east coast and in the Detroit area or to those with 'Canadian' contacts, not a big deal since of course everyone will be on their way to the Broncos game anyway.....
:D

Here is the region map for the telecasts...
NBC Sat Hoockey regions 1/14/06 (http://cdn.nhl.com/images/nbcmap011406.pdf)
Sooo....they don't want me to watch the NHL on NBC? :confused: Whatever.

I've been to about 4 games so far this year and will go to at least one more. Who knows, depending on when the ComcasTiVo comes out, I may even get to catch some games on Altitude-HD this year.

Life's too short for SD.

LOL!

BTW, for those hotly anticipating Denver HDTV locals in March, be advised that E* will only be carrying KCNC, KMGH, KUSA, and KDVR -DT channels. They won't provide the DT broadcasts for KWGN, KRMA, KBDI, or KTVD for the foreseeable future. Still need that OTA capability to view all available DTV broadcasts.Frankly aside from KWGN, there isn't that much HD on the others anyway! :D

(Seriously, KBDI and KTVD have no HD, and KRMA's HD content is dropping precipitously in favor of the new PBS "Create" subchannel.)

One of my recordings from KCNC cut out about half way this evening. Right now I am getting no signal on KCNC, KDVT and KRMA. The only RP station I am getting a signal on is KUSA.

I read a few posts back that KDVT is having equiptment issues and doesn't expect to have it fixed until sometime next week - but is anyone else having problems with KCNC and KRMA OTA?

Of course KDVR, KBDI and KWGN come in fine - but except for KUSA (at least for me) it's like RP just disappeared!

KRMA-DT is fine (showing "Create", ugh), but KCNC-DT and KTVD-DT are MIA.

I suspect transmitter/equipment work is going on at RP; perhaps KMGH is finally getting some install work done.

Can we expect KCNC to deliver the Bronco game in HD or are we going to need to march on the studio? :p

Wasn't there someplace to find the games that were gonna be carried in HD?

Tim

Can we expect KCNC to deliver the Bronco game in HD or are we going to need to march on the studio? :p

Wasn't there someplace to find the games that were gonna be carried in HD?

Tim

In my D* guide it says it's in HD.

Can we expect KCNC to deliver the Bronco game in HD or are we going to need to march on the studio? :p

Wasn't there someplace to find the games that were gonna be carried in HD?

Tim

http://www.hdsportsguide.com/

I suspect transmitter/equipment work is going on at RP; perhaps KMGH is finally getting some install work done.
I was wondering the same thing. Well, they have 9.5 hours to get it fixed or I'm gonna be p****d.

KCNC is back for me....noticed it was out earlier this morning, looks like it was some time last night even. Hopefully it is back to stay....don't need to be messing around on the day of a playoff game....

I read a few posts back that KDVT is having equiptment issues and doesn't expect to have it fixed until sometime next week - but is anyone else having problems with KCNC and KRMA OTA?

I cant say at 1:30 in the morning, but as of midnight, I had all but KDVD. I saw the KDVD problem about mid afternoon, and was puzzled what was going on (had 60% signal, but LOADS of pixelization, and the audio was trashed).

Here's to hoping the KMGH has better luck getting the gerbils fed, and the coathanger bent correctly before the super bowl. Somehow I still have my doubts.

j

2-1 had some more woes last night. Was surfing around and stopped on "Fran." It started in HD with no audio. Came back from ads and then it switched to SD with audio. Flipped over to 6-1 to watch some sharks swimming around in HD. Then I went back to 2-1 for the last 5 mins and they had fixed the problem, now it was HD with audio.

far80oj adn MileCJhgih,

it's KTVD.

John, Great map! Can you send me one like that every day there's an NHL game?!

According to KCNC's website, the game today will be in HDTV.

Looking forward to it!

Tim

Just saw a "pro-Lookout" ad on KUSA touting the www.hdtvcolorado.com website and mentioning the small group of people preventing free over-the-air digital tv in Denver. About time!

I mentioned that I would give a quick update after I reconfigured my OTA antenna and mast.

According to antennaweb.org I am 12.3 miles from Republic Plaza, with an orientation of 330 degrees to point to RP (for KUSA, KRMA, and KCNC).

I recently installed an OTA antenna - a Radio Shack UHF only, on a 5 ft. mast. I was able to receive *almost* all the stations - with the exception of KMGH.

I decided to install a more sensitive antenna (Antennas Direct DB4) and put it onto a 10 ft. mast - in the hopes I would be able to receive KMGH.

Well, it worked. I am now receiving KMGH - but just barely. On my Dish 6000U OTA receiver, I get a signal strength that bounces around from 50% (not a readable signal) to about 65% (stable signal). All the other stations come in at a bare minimum of 70% and KUSA is maxing out the signal strength meter.

I have not yet tried to watch a program of any length, so am unsure if KMGH will 'lock' for an extended period of time. I have my doubts - but with their imminent move to RP (fingers crossed) and the fact I may be able to boost that signal enough with a small amp or pre-amp, I think this is about as good as it will get until they make the move.

One important bit of information to pass along. I had installed the previous antenna/mast using a chimney mount purchased from Radio Shack. It had a neat ratcheting type mechanism that promised to make the installation just a bit simpler than without. Unfortunately, the quality of that ratcheting mechanism leaves something to be desired - and I became VERY concerned about the mount not being able to stand up to the snow and wind loads we sometimes get here in the Denver area. I decided to change over to a Channel Master chimney mount from Lowes, and it is MUCH more stable and secure. Since this represents a possible threat to property and even to people below, I wanted to bring this up as it is an important consideration.

So the final equipment goes like this:

Already had a Dish 6000U receiver with OTA option.
Antenna: Antennas Direct DB4
Mast: 10 ft. Channel Master
Cable: RG6 50' buriable with attached ground wire
1/2 " dia. grounding stake
20' Aluminum ground wire
Channel Master chimney mount
Grounding block
RG6 Compression fittings
Compression tool
RG6 cable stripper
RG6 cable staples

I *think* that is about it. Approximately $150 in 'stuff' to get HDTV OTA.

Watching the NFL playoff on Fox right now - and looking forward to the Broncos on CBS in a few minutes.

I hope this helps.

- Dan

KCNC and KRMA came back for me this morning.

Well, the game was in HD, and what a game! Life is sweet.

The News had an article about MTV's HD network in the paper today. I was going to write a letter in response. It's primarily about Comcast, but feel free to comment or correct.

Just saw a spot on KUSA...about the lookout tower...refered to a website and asked all to get involved... wish I would have been able to write down the web site... I am amazed that they are becoming a bit more active on this issue...

I think that I found it:
http://www.hdtvcolorado.com/
Glad that they are really promoting it...

Just saw a "pro-Lookout" ad on KUSA touting the www.hdtvcolorado.com website and mentioning the small group of people preventing free over-the-air digital tv in Denver. About time!

Just saw the same ad after the 10:30 news cast on KUSA. Finally LCG is getting the word out. Why couldn't they have done it sooner?
It basically talks about providing OTA signal from Lookout mountain for over 50 years and now a small group of people are trying to take away the right to receive free OTA. Doesn't mention who the small group or city really is. It says to go to the website for more information.
I had goosebumps.............

Let's just hope that they start doing this promotion during prime news hours...say,
4, 5 and 10 PM...as well as early morning. Maybe they were crafty in playing it after the Broncos game coverage at 10...

Please keep it up !!

Just saw a commercial (which I assume is from LCG) explaining how SCARE is preventing Colorado from receiving full power HDTV.

All I have to say is it's about friggin' time the stations start informing the people about what Golden is doing! Why it took them this long to make a simple commercial about it, I'll never know.

EDIT: Whoops, maybe I should refresh the page once in a while! I guess everybody saw it.

Just saw the commercial on KUSA during Saturday night live.

BTW, did anyone else get to go to the Bronco game? That stadium rocked today like I have never seen. It definitely rivaled the old 'Mile High' today. Did the TV convey any sense of the sound from the stands? What a great game and a great night.

Go Broncos!!!
:D :D :D