Question for anyone running a QAM card on Adelphia or Warner. First is the Cavs channel still unencrypted on Adelphia. Second, what is available unencrypted as far as HD content and regular digital content. I am thinking about getting a card to replace hdtv and digital cable/dvr boxes, I feel like 50 to 60 bucks a month for digital cable which i rarly watch and espn and espn2 hd which I do watch a lot but can't justify it for 60 bucks a month is a waste. Are channels like espnu encrypted? Does anyone know of a good card that can do qam, atsc, and ntsc?

Not the same issue I had. My recording light stays on. I'm learning from another thread that what happens is a freeze occures and even though the light for recording stays on the STB stops recording.

Also I recorded CSI:Miami and Medium last night with no problems.

However during my recording of 24 and The Apprentice at 9:50 my SA 8300 felt it was time to reboot so I did loose 5 minutes on both of those shows. :mad:

MY 8300 rebooted at least a half dozen times between 10-11:30 last night.

I took it in today and swapped it out. The CSR at the counter was skeptical that I was having an issue with the box. Throwing five or six questions at me as to how I had the box hooked up and if I know it was the box and not my TV.

Question for anyone running a QAM card on Adelphia or Warner. First is the Cavs channel still unencrypted on Adelphia.


Last time I looked, it is.

Adelphia's online lineup shows 798/HDBON is "Broadcast HD", so it's not encrypted and it isn't in the HD Plus tier:


798 HD BONUS FEATURES HD Bonus Features Broadcast HD (High Definition)


Discovery HD (776) is listed the same way, and is "in the clear" via QAM.

Here's what I'm getting in the clear:

* All local HD broadcast stations (WKYC, WEWS, WOIO, WJW, WVIZ)
* All local SD digital simulcasts of said stations (all of the above plus WUAB)
* 776/Discovery HD
* 798/HDBON
* 181/OHIO (WVIZ's "Ohio Channel" SD subchannel)
* 183/WTHR+ (WKYC's Weather Plus, also SD)

I think LOGO is in there as well (SD) as well as 300/BARK - no, not a dog channel, but the "BARKER" preview channel for PPV.

Each time Adelphia adds one of those SD digital channels, it has the proper cable box channel and name in the PSIP info.

I would assume BARK is there because it's just an in-house advertising channel, but I don't know why LOGO is on the list and other digital cable non-"plus" stations aren't.

just got my 8300Hd (living room) and 8300 (bedroom) installed, wife is happy, so am I, only one problem, tonight around 8:56 or so, I was watching (and recording) american idol, it was towards the end, when it paused and froze, I stopped the recording maybe thinking something was wrong, but all it did was back up 2 seconds and freeze at the same spot, change the channel up, then down once and it did the same thing, backed up 2 seconds and froze in the same spot as before, I changed to the analog channel, then came back to the HD channel, and it was now at the live t.v. point, wondering if I should expect hiccups like this or was there something in the signal that made it do this? or if someone had any ideas! thanks guys, other then this, I am in heaven! I mean cavs in HD? and the indians on the way!

just got my 8300Hd (living room) and 8300 (bedroom) installed, wife is happy, so am I, only one problem, tonight around 8:56 or so, I was watching (and recording) american idol, it was towards the end, when it paused and froze, I stopped the recording maybe thinking something was wrong, but all it did was back up 2 seconds and freeze at the same spot, change the channel up, then down once and it did the same thing, backed up 2 seconds and froze in the same spot as before, I changed to the analog channel, then came back to the HD channel, and it was now at the live t.v. point, wondering if I should expect hiccups like this or was there something in the signal that made it do this? or if someone had any ideas! thanks guys, other then this, I am in heaven! I mean cavs in HD? and the indians on the way!


This problem is being discussed in the SA 8300 and SATA forum. It happens more to people who have added an external HD (like me). Expect it to happen from time to time. Rebooting once a week may (or may not) help.

What you would have seen if you were not watching it at the time was a partial recording (up to the point where it froze). There is only speculation as to what causes this and don't expect any answer from your cable company or Scientific Atlanta any time soon.

Thank you Don.
I look forward to seeing HD back on PBS. I was able to see it pre October on CH50 and it looked spectacular! I am still getting programming on 50-1 to -4 but now it's duplicated on 49-1 to -4 on my HR10-250. The Guide data is correct on 49-2, but incorrect on 49-1 and 49-3. "Regular Programming" shows up on 49-4. Right now at 4:30pm the guide show "The Piano Guy"on 49-1, but Create is on. "Maya and Miguel" is listed on 49-3 but the educational stuff is on.

Other than that, it's good!

PBS 45 & 49 Digital (WNEO/WEAO) are now properly remapped to appear on 45.1 - 45.4 and 49.1 - 49.4. The change from 50.1 - 50.4 took place Friday March 3 just before noon.
Our HD signal is in deed returning, but I just can't put a firm date on it. For those of you who have called or emailed me since we discontinued our HD service in October, you know that I have repeatedly said "soon." Our delay is caused by an equipment problem interfacing the program automation system and the HD encoder. Now that we have that piece of equipment we are waiting for the automation equipment manufacturer to re-program the system to allow it to control the HD encoder. Will this fix be days or weeks, I truly don't know. When it is done our schedule will be 4-SD channels from midnight until 7 pm, then HD and 1-SD from 7 pm until midnight. The SDs will be Create on channel 1, our primary service on channel 2, the educational Annenberg/CPB Channel on 3 and The Ohio Channel on 4. HD will replace channel 1 when it is on-air and our primary service SD will be channel 2.
Thank you for your seemingly limitless patience. I really hope we'll soon get things working as we planned.

Don Freeman
Director of Programming and Operations

With WBNX getting the CW network speculation over WUAB getting the new FOX network "My TV Network" may be true.

http://www.mediabuyerplanner.com/2006/03/08/cw_my_network_tv_increase_total/index.php
My Network TV's new affiliates include outlets in Cleveland (market rank number 16)While the article does not list the affilliate by name, who else would get MTVN?

MTVN? No way are they going to get away with that acronym.

Still I'd have to say your probably right on your speculation. Besides their parent company owns a FOX station in Cincinnati.

It's not speculation - it's fact. WUAB will be running "My Network TV" in the fall:

http://www.broadcastingcable.com/article/CA6313928.html?display=Breaking+News


Fox’s new My Network TV inked deals with five affiliates Tuesday, bringing its distribution to 40% of the country. Raycom Media is committing three of its stations – WUAB Cleveland, KFVE Honolulu and WBXH Baton Rouge, La. – to the new mini-network, which is launching Sept. 5.


BTW, it's "My Network TV", not "My TV Network" (though both sound equally silly).

The Beacon Journal's website says R.D. Heldenfels will have more on the WUAB/My Network TV thing in tomorrow's paper.

So PBS HD is coming back soon, and we'll be getting a My Network TV station in our area as well. Pretty cool that come this Fall we'll have every broadcast market in the US in the Cleveland market.

Just curious about My Network TV. Will they be broadcasting 1080i, like the current WUAB is? Or is none of their content going to be HD?

Thank you Don.
I look forward to seeing HD back on PBS. I was able to see it pre October on CH50 and it looked spectacular! I am still getting programming on 50-1 to -4 but now it's duplicated on 49-1 to -4 on my HR10-250. The Guide data is correct on 49-2, but incorrect on 49-1 and 49-3. "Regular Programming" shows up on 49-4. Right now at 4:30pm the guide show "The Piano Guy"on 49-1, but Create is on. "Maya and Miguel" is listed on 49-3 but the educational stuff is on.

Other than that, it's good!

EricG, are you receiving WEAO-DT via cable or satellite? I am receiving OTA and I have never received guide information for WEAO-DT on either channel 49 or 50. All I get is "no information". In addition, the time of day when I tune to WEAO-DT is way off (several hours).

The other station in the market with this problem is WOIO-DT. No guide data and time of day way off. Funny thing is, their sister station WUAB-DT has guide data and correct time of day.

Anybody else have the missing guide data and incorrect time of day for OTA reception of WOIO-DT and WEAO-DT?

So PBS HD is coming back soon, and we'll be getting a My Network TV station in our area as well. Pretty cool that come this Fall we'll have every broadcast market in the US in the Cleveland market.

Just curious about My Network TV. Will they be broadcasting 1080i, like the current WUAB is? Or is none of their content going to be HD?

Pure speculation here but I will bet they will have HD content. Fox generally broadcast in 780p. I don't know if that would mean equipment changes but I don't think "Cheapcom" will shell out any money for new broadcast equipment.

Last time I looked, it is.

Adelphia's online lineup shows 798/HDBON is "Broadcast HD", so it's not encrypted and it isn't in the HD Plus tier:



It is now (in the HD Plus Tier). I just looked the other night when the Cavaliers game was in HD and that channel didn't appear in the guide or by scrolling or going directly to it. I just looked today and indeed that channel is there now. Do they remove it when the game starts or is this a new change today? It says something like "Tune to this channel for extra HD content & programming...only here on 798 in HDTV".

I'm currently a D*/HD Tivo user but am evaluating options of eventually changing to cable. Which company (TW or Comcast) is going to end up with the Cleveland suburbs after the Adelphia deal is implemented? When is that due to happen? Which STB do they use and is it a good one?

Thanks for the help.

Just curious about My Network TV. Will they be broadcasting 1080i, like the current WUAB is? Or is none of their content going to be HD?

Oddly enough, I haven't seen a single mention of HD content in the My Network TV stories.

I assume they will, though which standard they'll use, I don't know. As noted, FOX (MNTV parent) uses 720p.


It is now (in the HD Plus Tier). I just looked the other night when the Cavaliers game was in HD and that channel didn't appear in the guide or by scrolling or going directly to it. I just looked today and indeed that channel is there now. Do they remove it when the game starts or is this a new change today? It says something like "Tune to this channel for extra HD content & programming...only here on 798 in HDTV".


Yes, it's been like that the past few days. The channel doesn't have any guide data, though it did the first night the channel hit the boxes. There wasn't much in the data - just the pre-game/game/post-game - but it was there and is not now.

I meant that 798 was in the Broadcast HD tier (with the OTA network affiliates and Discovery HD), as opposed to being in the HD Plus tier (with the channels you pay extra for).

I'm currently a D*/HD Tivo user but am evaluating options of eventually changing to cable. Which company (TW or Comcast) is going to end up with the Cleveland suburbs after the Adelphia deal is implemented? When is that due to happen? Which STB do they use and is it a good one?

Thanks for the help.

My understanding is the majority of Adelphia customers in our area are going to TW. They use the SA 8300. How good it is compares to what your use to.

Since your a D*/HD TiVo user you will think it's a piece of crap. If your using OTA for your locals and your successful with it I'd stay where your at.

It's real difficult for those of us who've experienced dual tuner TiVo to adjust to the SA 8300. No wish list. 7 day guide that doesn't differentiate between new episodes and reruns. Terrible search function. No season passes, though you can set up regular recordings of your shows.

If you are one of the lucky ones who go to Comcast (and that's a matter of opinion too) eventually you will have a TiVo STB.

Oddly enough, I haven't seen a single mention of HD content in the My Network TV stories.

I assume they will, though which standard they'll use, I don't know. As noted, FOX (MNTV parent) uses 720p.



Yes, it's been like that the past few days. The channel doesn't have any guide data, though it did the first night the channel hit the boxes. There wasn't much in the data - just the pre-game/game/post-game - but it was there and is not now.

I meant that 798 was in the Broadcast HD tier (with the OTA network affiliates and Discovery HD), as opposed to being in the HD Plus tier (with the channels you pay extra for).

Ahhh...gotcha. I wish it had been there for the Cavs game on Monday, but I'll look forward to seeing the game on the 28th in HD. So you are saying they are going to show the CAVS in HD on that channel right?? I see the channel in the guide, but with no programming info. It just says 240 min. I'm guessing there's nothing there because nothing is on the schedule and when there is programming, that info might appear in the guide as you said "pre-game/game/post-game" etc...

My understanding is the majority of Adelphia customers in our area are going to TW. They use the SA 8300. How good it is compares to what your use to.

Since your a D*/HD TiVo user you will think it's a piece of crap. If your using OTA for your locals and your successful with it I'd stay where your at.

It's real difficult for those of us who've experienced dual tuner TiVo to adjust to the SA 8300. No wish list. 7 day guide that doesn't differentiate between new episodes and reruns. Terrible search function. No season passes, though you can set up regular recordings of your shows.

If you are one of the lucky ones who go to Comcast (and that's a matter of opinion too) eventually you will have a TiVo STB.

Yeah I think even the standard Comcast Motorola HD box seems nicer than the SA. I've played with it at a friends house for a few minutes and the menu system looks slicker. Not sure if it's more functional though.

Those of you Adelphia customers switching to TWC could get lucky and your firmware could get "upgraded" from SARA to Passport out of this deal. It won't happen immediately, but depending on how controlling TWC is, they may want everyone to have the same firmware. That could give you improved performance of the SA8300HD, but not improved functionality. Plus Hookbill will lose his SATA drive.

Those of you Adelphia customers switching to TWC could get lucky and your firmware could get "upgraded" from SARA to Passport out of this deal. It won't happen immediately, but depending on how controlling TWC is, they may want everyone to have the same firmware. That could give you improved performance of the SA8300HD, but not improved functionality. Plus Hookbill will lose his SATA drive.

I doubt that. Not all TW uses Passport, I think it would be a pia to switch.

And more importantly as you stated hookbill would lose his SATA. :eek:

A few things here...

My understanding is the majority of Adelphia customers in our area are going to TW.

Actually, ALL Northeast Ohio Adelphia customers - those on the Cleveland system - are going to TWC. (I believe this includes the separate cluster down in Dover/New Philadelphia, but I'm not positive about that part of it.)

In addition, Comcast's Cleveland operation will also go to TWC. Comcast will not operate any systems in Northeast Ohio after the merger. In some other cities outside of Ohio, it'll be the opposite...but here, Comcast goes away.

Ahhh...gotcha. I wish it had been there for the Cavs game on Monday, but I'll look forward to seeing the game on the 28th in HD. So you are saying they are going to show the CAVS in HD on that channel right?? I see the channel in the guide, but with no programming info. It just says 240 min. I'm guessing there's nothing there because nothing is on the schedule and when there is programming, that info might appear in the guide as you said "pre-game/game/post-game" etc...

Right, the game will be on 798 that night. The guide data for the game only appeared the first night that 798 showed up on the box, and I haven't seen it since that night. I wish they would put it in, if only so I could set up the 8000HD to record it! On my 8000HD, there is no data at all, not even in those 240 minute blocks. (Of course, I could set up a manual recording on my Fusion if I really wanted to do so. :D)

I doubt that. Not all TW uses Passport, I think it would be a pia to switch.

I would not bet the farm on this, but I don't believe TWC/NEO uses Passport. I could be wrong. I wish Tiffany was still around to answer that one...she didn't stick around long!

I have passport software on my sa8300HD from Twc, this is all I have seen from them....also for the simplicity of Customer Service, I am going to go out on a limb and say that is all they use in the Northeast Ohio region. Now if that is the case, who knows how long before they switch everyone out, Time Warner is not known for speed in these areas...Also one quick thought, is CAVSHD, just turning into Indians HD when the season opens or will there be a serperate STOHD channel?

you are right, there is no 5.1 in cleveland right now. if anyone is close, it is ABC, but they have been saying that they will upgrade soon, but they never do..

3-1 and 8-1 are 5.1. Sounds strange, but it's true.

I have passport software on my sa8300HD from Twc, this is all I have seen from them....also for the simplicity of Customer Service, I am going to go out on a limb and say that is all they use in the Northeast Ohio region.

OK, I think I know the problem. I believe I saw the standard SA software on my sister's cable box, but they don't have a DVR over there...just an HD cable box.


Now if that is the case, who knows how long before they switch everyone out, Time Warner is not known for speed in these areas...Also one quick thought, is CAVSHD, just turning into Indians HD when the season opens or will there be a serperate STOHD channel?

As far as I know, STO's HD channel will be separate from FSN Ohio/Cavs HD on Time Warner. I'm not sure about Adelphia, which is calling the channel "HD BONUS" and may well cherry pick, assuming it gets STO before the TWC merger.

3-1 and 8-1 are 5.1. Sounds strange, but it's true.

And 5-1 is 2.0!

:D

assuming it gets STO before the TWC merger.

This is very very true! also I thought I might be crazy but I have passport software (actually under the diagnostic channel its version is passport echo 1.8 something something something)

Wow, I wasn't aware of the Comcast deal. Sounds like there will be (from what I understand) 3 TWC regions in NEO. You'll have TWC-NEO, TWC-NEO-Former Comcast, and TWC-NEO-Former Adelphia. Since that's alot of variety in a very small area i'll bet they will probably want to merge the three giving you one channel lineup, one software platform, one set of standard hardware, and less maintenance/support headaches for TWC. This won't happen quickly, but TWC seems to have a fairly standard package of features that they will want to put in place as soon as possible.

Again, this brings up the very interesting question of "What's going to happen to my email address?" for Comcast and Adelphia subscribers.

I would not bet the farm on this, but I don't believe TWC/NEO uses Passport. I could be wrong. I wish Tiffany was still around to answer that one...she didn't stick around long!

Funny, I was thinking about her the other day. Lol. She lasted I think two posts. :D

TWC still has to use the existing system that Adelphia has in place. I'm not saying it isn't possible, but I do know that the system has to be compatible to the software, not vice versa.

Still if they do somehow switch to passport it doesn't mean the absolute end of external hard drive. Word has been out for sometime that there will be a version of Passport that will activate SATA.

Still if they do somehow switch to passport it doesn't mean the absolute end of external hard drive. Word has been out for sometime that there will be a version of Passport that will activate SATA.

Though it does appear that TWCNEO uses Passport for their SA DVRs, it *will* take some time for the integration described above. It won't be an automatic switch on May 31st or whatever the target date is.

I do agree with Terry that they'll likely eventually migrate all the pieces they bring in, to the same lineup, etc....give or take a few local differences, like now, where TWC's Akron system carries WAOH-LP/29, and TWC's Canton system carries WIVM/52.

While SARA vs. Passport is a pretty big deal, think about the Motorola vs. SA conversion that will most likely take place *some day* with the TWC-NEO-Formerly Comcast people :)

Good point Terry. Hopefully they'll have their hands full with that before they get to me. :)

On the other hand if they do switch to Passport I wonder what would happen to my recordings? Let's say I have 5 days of programming on the HD. I would think it would have to reformat to accept totally new software. Bye Bye recordings?

Suddenly I'm not looking forward to this so much.

Im getting locals OTA with my DirecTV HD DVR. The guide data for 50-1 to 4 has been "Not Available" since 8/05 when I first bought the rcvr.
Since last Friday when they re-mapped 50 to 49 has the guide been good for 49-1 and -2.


EricG, are you receiving WEAO-DT via cable or satellite? I am receiving OTA and I have never received guide information for WEAO-DT on either channel 49 or 50. All I get is "no information". In addition, the time of day when I tune to WEAO-DT is way off (several hours).

The other station in the market with this problem is WOIO-DT. No guide data and time of day way off. Funny thing is, their sister station WUAB-DT has guide data and correct time of day.

Anybody else have the missing guide data and incorrect time of day for OTA reception of WOIO-DT and WEAO-DT?

Im getting locals OTA with my DirecTV HD DVR. The guide data for 50-1 to 4 has been "Not Available" since 8/05 when I first bought the rcvr.
Since last Friday when they re-mapped 50 to 49 has the guide been good for 49-1 and -2.
You should delete and rescan WEAO because they have:
49.1, "Create"
49.2, mirror of WEAO analog
49.3, "The Annenberg CPB Channel" (telecourses)
49.4, "The Ohio Channel" (I call this one C-Span of Columbus) :D This one is also on WVIZ (if you are lucky enough to live within 2 miles of Brookpark & State Rds.) :p

When the HD channel comes on line most of the SD subchannels sign off for the part of the day that PBD HD is on. At that point you would have just 49.1 HD & 49.2 mirror of the analog channel.

On the other hand if they do switch to Passport I wonder what would happen to my recordings? Let's say I have 5 days of programming on the HD. I would think it would have to reformat to accept totally new software. Bye Bye recordings?

Suddenly I'm not looking forward to this so much.

I tend to think you're screwed, too...I don't see how they could transfer the existing recordings done by the SARA software. But I could be wrong.

49.4, "The Ohio Channel" (I call this one C-Span of Columbus) :D This one is also on WVIZ (if you are lucky enough to live within 2 miles of Brookpark & State Rds.) :p

Adelphia actually carries this on digital 181, off of the WVIZ-DT feed (which they carry HD on 710).

I'm still wondering how far along the North Royalton project is.

DirecTV, Tribe play hardball for now (http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindealer/roger_brown/index.ssf?/base/sports/1141983549139430.xml&coll=2)

Nope that doesn't look good. Once they announce the other companies that have signed it will be up to D* customers to put the pressure on them to sign on.

And to think I was mostly worried about not getting the HD games on D*! Hadn't really considered the option of NO games via D*...

How come it seems there are no "good" options for receiving TV anymore? It's more pick an evil. How long 'til FIOS hits Cleveland?

And to think I was mostly worried about not getting the HD games on D*! Hadn't really considered the option of NO games via D*...

How come it seems there are no "good" options for receiving TV anymore? It's more pick an evil. How long 'til FIOS hits Cleveland?

Well, they won't stop you from getting 20 HD games on WKYC.

I know, little conciliation. And you would have to do it OTA (as of now). Or watch on SD via DTV.

And 5-1 is 2.0!

:D

But 5-1 is attempting to be 5.1. Unfortunately, it appears 19-1 will be 2.0 forever!

Well, they won't stop you from getting 20 HD games on WKYC.

I know, little conciliation. And you would have to do it OTA (as of now). Or watch on SD via DTV.
Some concilation at least. Although ironically I picked up a 20 game package for this season which is primarily weekends, i.e. when WKYC will be carrying games, so there's a reasonable chance I'll be at ~ half the games they carry in person vs. enjoying the HD-OTA feed...

And at least 3.1 comes in fairly well for me OTA so I can at least get some HD Tribe games, if not all of 'em...

Michael-
I'm getting the channels, it's just that the guide data is wrong for -1,-3 and reads "regular schedule" on -4.

You should delete and rescan WEAO because they have:
49.1, "Create"
49.2, mirror of WEAO analog
49.3, "The Annenberg CPB Channel" (telecourses)
49.4, "The Ohio Channel" (I call this one C-Span of Columbus) :D This one is also on WVIZ (if you are lucky enough to live within 2 miles of Brookpark & State Rds.) :p

When the HD channel comes on line most of the SD subchannels sign off for the part of the day that PBD HD is on. At that point you would have just 49.1 HD & 49.2 mirror of the analog channel.

So what's the quality of PBS HD like? Since the time I've had my HD receiver, I haven't seen PBS HD yet.

RussTC3:
OTA it was outstanding when I got a signal. When the signal is weak it jumps in an out and just totally drives you nuts. A weak signal is totally unwatchable. It's not like analog whereas the sound never fades out so you don't loose continuity. I watched it on my buddies Samsung DLP in aurora (Adelphia) and it was not as good as my OTA. I might add that he was really upset when he found out that he couldn't view everything in widescreen mode with his new widescreen TV. When I left his house he was still watching short fat people. (stretched SD)

JJK

More on the Tribe and DirecTV, along with cable system negotiations:

http://ohiomedia.blogspot.com/2006/03/tribe-and-directv-standoff.html


UPDATE: SportsTime Ohio has now put up a pull-down list on its website of what appears to be every major and minor multichannel TV provider in its Ohio territory, and it's pretty easy to tell which agreements are likely to be announced soon.

We've gone through each system, and only the following systems show that they "fully expect an agreement soon": Adelphia, Comcast, Cox, Buckeye Cablesystem (Toledo) and Buckeye's Erie County Cablevision sister system. That phrase next to Cox is interesting, since Cox is the driving force behind the MakeThemPlayFair.com website, which is still up as of this writing.

For systems that are not in the "fully expect an agreement" category, including DirecTV, Dish Network and other providers not listed above, STO "helpfully" provides a phone number to call them.

More on the Tribe and DirecTV, along with cable system negotiations:

http://ohiomedia.blogspot.com/2006/03/tribe-and-directv-standoff.html

The "fully expect an agreement" comment was exactly what Adelphia said to me in that email I posted. But I am surprised that the list contains so many others who they do not have that statement for. It sounded earlier like only one or two providers that may be a problem.

I guess that "one or two" could be Dish and Direct, though WOW is also not on the list. I think everyone else is really kind of outside the immediate Cleveland area.

I guess that "one or two" could be Dish and Direct, though WOW is also not on the list. I think everyone else is really kind of outside the immediate Cleveland area.

Well, if (judging from STO's comments to the PD) "expect an agreement" means they're pretty close to signing, look at this lineup:

Time Warner (primary outlet)
Adelphia
Comcast
Cox
Buckeye Cablesystem (dominant Toledo provider)/Erie County Cablevision (co-owned Sandusky provider)
A few very small cable systems (TSC, Wadsworth City, Doylestown, etc.)

That pretty much gets you by far the largest chunk of the cable viewers in Cleveland/Akron/Canton/Youngstown and even up to Toledo, and much of Columbus and mid-Ohio via TWC.

Not included:

WOW Cable (Cleveland and Columbus alternative provider)
Insight (Columbus' second largest provider)
Armstrong (Medina, south suburban Youngstown)
Massillon Cable/Clear Picture Wooster (both same owner)
DirectTV
Dish Network
A bunch of tiny cable systems not signed up above

If they sign up nearly all the big name providers in Cleveland/Akron/Northeast Ohio, they can nudge the satellite guys.

Just after midnight Friday night, my Cox S.A. 8300HD rebooted itself! Strange to watch, first parts of the PiP disappeared, then parts of the main picture, then it went black, turned itself off, went through boot and finally it turned itself completely off.

DirecTV, Tribe play hardball for now (http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindealer/roger_brown/index.ssf?/base/sports/1141983549139430.xml&coll=2)
:eek: The last time there was an increase in the cost to carry the Tribe games (via FSN Ohio the 2nd year they had 150 games) "D*" had the games but "E*" did not.

In the past you could always count on D* to get every possible RSN signed on.
Of course that was before Rupert Murdoch owned the company. Looks like both DBS systems will be without the Indians. :mad: As was mentioned in the article this will affect MLB EI via satellite.

:eek: The last time there was an increase in the cost to carry the Tribe games (via FSN Ohio the 2nd year they had 150 games) "D*" had the games but "E*" did not.

In the past you could always count on D* to get every possible RSN signed on.
Of course that was before Rupert Murdoch owned the company. Looks like both DBS systems will be without the Indians. :mad: As was mentioned in the article this will affect MLB EI via satellite.

They will come around. Maybe not buy opening day but they will come around.

This reminds me of the time that D* decided not to show WWE PPV. So WWE was on every week explaining to people how they can get Dish with a special WWE offer. It didn't go on to long, D* caved in. They will this time too.

I wouldn't be sure of E*. They still don't carry the YES Network...

I wouldn't be sure of E*. They still don't carry the YES Network...

Well, who the heck wants YES around here? God, I see enough of the Yankees on Fox all summer long.

Oh...Maybe your saying that they don't have YES in NY. I guess I see your point.

Well, if you want to watch the Indians, if it's that important to you and you have E* I would probably be thinking about a change of some sort. Either cable where you have your best shot or you can hope for D* to come around.

Well, who the heck wants YES around here? God, I see enough of the Yankees on Fox all summer long.

Oh...Maybe your saying that they don't have YES in NY. I guess I see your point.

Well, if you want to watch the Indians, if it's that important to you and you have E* I would probably be thinking about a change of some sort. Either cable where you have your best shot or you can hope for D* to come around.

I decided the cable route, sorry indians are too important to me, and I know how E* plays, they really dont like price increases.

How come it seems there are no "good" options for receiving TV anymore? It's more pick an evil. How long 'til FIOS hits Cleveland?

For a FIOS-equivalent, you'll have to wait for SBC aka "The New AT&T" to get "Project Lightspeed" going in the Cleveland area. I'm not holding my breath. I've never been impressed with SBC's technology in the Cleveland area. It's kind of funny, for the past few years, I've seen SBC trucks all over the place pulling new fiber, but all I've got to show for it is a crappy DSL line at home and the best we can do at my office in Mayfield Village is a (very expensive) 1.5Mbps T1 line. And our office is a stone's throw from Progressive's world headquarters, you'd think they could do better around there for broadband internet.

From what I've read Project Lightspeed starts at about $60 a month, so I'll bet there will be little cost savings, if any over the existing satellite/cable options.

AFAIK, SBC doesn't plan on running fiber directly to the home like Verizon. They think they can make it work by running fiber to a local node, then going the last proverbial "mile" via copper to your house. It will be interesting to see how well that handles multiple HD channels and a fast internet connection.

The Lightspeed thread is here:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=638947&page=1
It's mostly worthless press releases, since nobody seems to actually have the service yet... AT&T is having legal troubles already - they don't think they should have to pay local cable franchise fees, and the communities AT&T wants to service aren't happy about that.

I decided the cable route, sorry indians are too important to me, and I know how E* plays, they really dont like price increases.What if your cable option also does not carry STO? Even though COX was listed on the Ohiomedia Blogspot as one of the systems who are about to sign-on, keep in mind that COX is the system behind the "Fair Play" site. That is my only choice other than E* which I have now and D* which I could switch to, however it's not looking too good for any DBS right now. The usually quick-to-sign D* is "playing hardball" with Fastball. That does not look too promising when D* is balking.

Why doesn't Fastball/STO just charge more for the commercials to make up the difference?

What if your cable option also does not carry STO? Even though COX was listed on the Ohiomedia Blogspot as one of the systems who are about to sign-on, keep in mind that COX is the system behind the "Fair Play" site.

And it's so noted in the article as well, that dichotomy. I, too, was surprised to see Cox without the phone number and with the "expect an agreement" notation. (It's in the STO menu pulldown for Cox, not original to the cited blog entry.)

Maybe STO backed off a little to allow the "ring of cable systems" carrying it, putting pressure on D*?

As far as Dish Network goes, they also do not carry the Washington Nationals' MASN RSN. They didn't all of last year, and it doesn't look like they'll carry it this year... if D* is balking at STO's numbers, Charlie Ergen must have shouted back obscenities!

So.... nobody checked out the inaugural Indians game on STO today?

So.... nobody checked out the inaugural Indians game on STO today?

I did I watched the first inning, then had work to do! not bad, I just will wait till time warner gets a full time 24 hour channel up and not use the local one, I will pass judgement there, but there were no hiccups as I was watching, and the tribe won, so...good channel so far

Oh, I forgot STO was up and running. Unless they threw it on without telling anyone, it's not yet on Adelphia. :D Their schedule says they're back tomorrow, Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday night.

I did I watched the first inning, then had work to do! not bad, I just will wait till time warner gets a full time 24 hour channel up and not use the local one, I will pass judgement there, but there were no hiccups as I was watching, and the tribe won, so...good channel so far

The STO ad in the Beacon Journal the other day did specify TWC's local programming channel (23). I wonder if they're gonna change that at some point, if only for the collision between the Indians' games and WKYC's own Akron/Canton News...

Yeah, I guess that could be. So would this apply to DD DVD content as well because for DVD's on my system, I'm usually around -36db's to -40db's, not -20dbs. They are definately lower volume than most TV shows, but still no where near as low as the Olympics have been. It does make some sense that feeds coming from Europe might not be using a standard that is used for most DVD and TV content in the USA. The only thing is, wouldn't all of that stuff be NBC's equipment and come from America?
Sorry to take so long to reply - I haven't been here in a month or so.

Yes, it definitely applies to DVDs as well. If they were recorded "louder", then they wouldn't be able to have the dynamic range that most movies demand. And where the equipment comes from isn't really the issue - it's more a question of where the engineers come from who are choosing the settings for the equipment.

Oh, I forgot STO was up and running. Unless they threw it on without telling anyone, it's not yet on Adelphia. :D

Your not expecting to see a screen saying "Adelphia now carrying Indians on STO on channel XX" are you? They only use that for important announcements like "New channel added; Come enjoy the excitement of watching grass grow on the Green Channel, now located for digital subscribers on channel XXX." :D

What's happening with 5.1 (ABC channel 15) ota today? It shows a good signal on the meter but no video or sound.

What's happening with 5.1 (ABC channel 15) ota today? It shows a good signal on the meter but no video or sound.I get WEWS at an average 117 signal strength and live just a little bit over a mile from the transmitter.

The last few days I have been getting sporadic dropouts. They come and go so fast that the signal strenght meter does not have time to dip (actually I see the dip after the picture and sound returns.

WEWS-DT has had problems with their transmitter recently. A few months ago they were running at reduced power (I believe they made the fix just in time for the Super Bowl).

The way the signal keeps cutting in and out leads me to believe they still have some issues with the transmitter. If I can see problems here at the 'tenna farm, I'm willing to bet it's worse just about everywhere else.

I'm hearing that Comcast may have added SportsTime Ohio on cable channel 73. Can anyone out here with Comcast confirm that?

[QUOTE=Michael P 2341]I get WEWS at an average 117 signal strength and live just a little bit over a mile from the transmitter.

The last few days I have been getting sporadic dropouts. They come and go so fast that the signal strenght meter does not have time to dip (actually I see the dip after the picture and sound returns.

QUOTE]

Thx Michael,
Channel 5 has been spotty lately but I thought it might be weather related. It's back on now.

I'm hearing that Comcast may have added SportsTime Ohio on cable channel 73. Can anyone out here with Comcast confirm that?

Not on Comcast Mentor.

They now have a HD channel for Time warner cable Northeast ohio on sportimes web page, it will be channel 523...just for those interested, so Cavs HD is 531 nad STO is 523...have a great night!

We were talking about the upcoming Adelphia/TWC merge. The feeling here seemed to be that TWC would make it a comprehesive "All In One" sytem for TWC/NEO. More importantly, they would switch from SARA to Passport. I would lose my External Hard Drive.

I really think that would be quite expensive and basically not possible. Talking about this on the thread "8300 and External SATA-It Works" one knowledgeable person feels this will not happen.

davehancock:I don't think that you will see any sort of SARA to Passport change. Both are used on various TW systems, and that happens because a system is built around one system or the other. It is virtually impossible to change a system.

So rest assured, your external drive is safe in Ohio.

BTW: I'm on TW Rochester - it's SARA.

I told him I hope he was right. He responded with this: (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=516559&goto=newpost)

I CHALLENGE anyone to report* where a major system has converted from SARA to Passport, or visa versa. I just don't believe that has ever happened. (But I am open).

*Report means: Person identifying this is identified (in a manner he/she can be contacted directly, not just some internet moniker), naming the system (TW Columbus, OH), the approximate date the change took place, the change (SARA to Passport) and how this person came to know the change took place.


I like his confidence! :)

i'm getting around 85-90 reception, yet channe l3.1 cuts in and out all the time. Does any one else have this problem?

I hope for your sake he's right. Something big will have to happen in that general area anyway since I highly doubt that TWC will keep the Comcast network and equipment.

I scheduled the recording at 9:00 pm, a one time only recording. Even if Cold Case started late it would have still done a one hour recording. It only recorded 40 minutes and as I stated I saw the recording light on all the way up until 10:00 pm.

Oddly enough someone else reported something strange happened to them on Sunday night as well, however this person was watching his recording "live" when the picture froze and his recording light stayed on as well. If your interested look here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7255635#post7255635). He does not have the same type of external hard drive I have, same brand but different model.

Hookbill, I thought you'd be interested to know that this phenomenon struck me this past Sunday while recording & watching The West Wing. The picture froze but the recording light stayed on and the list reported the show as being 1 hour so we just switched to something else to let it finish. However when we came back to it we saw only about 40 minutes were actually recorded, and it ended at the point that the picture froze initially.

I don't have an external harddrive.

Hookbill, I thought you'd be interested to know that this phenomenon struck me this past Sunday while recording & watching The West Wing. The picture froze but the recording light stayed on and the list reported the show as being 1 hour so we just switched to something else to let it finish. However when we came back to it we saw only about 40 minutes were actually recorded, and it ended at the point that the picture froze initially.

I don't have an external harddrive.

Although I don't know exactly why this happens I have concluded that it happens more frequently to those with external hard drives then those who don't.

I have been experimenting with daily reboots to see if this helps. This wasn't something I pulled out of the air, I got it from another forum where there is a beta tester who discussed this. He said that even without his external hard drive he can make this happen if he doesn't reboot at least once a week.

ClevelandJax I know your as frustrated as I am about this. Try the weekly reboot. For me I've been doing my daily reboots for 10 days now and I have had no partial recordings. It's a bit of a pia but hey, if it works it works.

You may also be interested to know that this beta tester says this only happens during prime time on network HD shows. That's exactly how it happens on my 8300 as well.

I really think that would be quite expensive and basically not possible. Talking about this on the thread "8300 and External SATA-It Works" one knowledgeable person feels this will not happen.


hookbill, I would tend to agree with you - I'm guessing the cableco would have to change/upgrade/swap out equipment at the headend to service all those customers, or run two different versions of software at the headend for a while as they transitioned the SARA users to Passport. Even if they could automagically change everyone's set top box operating system overnight, can you imagine the FLOOD of customer service calls that would come in the next day. They would be rolling trucks to people's houses from now until eternity, costing a fortune.

Just found out this player will play HD-WMV and m2t, ts files on standard DVD discs, Only restriction is you can only get 30 minutes on one disc. Don't know if it will play DL discs. This is great for me as I can render my HDV files to m2t and play them with standard discs. They are at B & H Photo for $379.00. JVC-SRDVD-100U.
It wiill also play mp-3, mp-4, DIVX, and can be hooked up with cat 5 or USB-2.0.
If it works, it rocks.

JJK

I like his confidence! :)

I think a lot of the "changeover" speculation comes from the fact that TWC locally, in its existing systems, runs Passport instead of SARA, and that the Adelphia/Comcast systems will be merged into TWC NEO and run out of the existing TWC cluster. I don't know if in the other cases, there was already an existing TWC system with Passport that was merged into.

That being said, I'd certainly agree that if it happens at all, any such switchover isn't going to happen overnight. If it does, it may be done LONG down the road, probably a year or longer, as part of a major system overhaul that'd have been done anyway. There'd certainly be a long time that the two types of systems would co-exist, no matter what happens in the future.

I don't know much about the hardware end of cable TV, but I'd assume TWC could do stuff like channel lineup standardization without swapping out the type of DVR boxes it offers.

I don't know much about the hardware end of cable TV, but I'd assume TWC could do stuff like channel lineup standardization without swapping out the type of DVR boxes it offers.

That might not even happen. Just like when Adelphia took over whatever cable companies it took over years ago some things haven't changed within the Adelphia system, i.e. Inundated and myself both have Adelphia but do not have the same cable line ups and more importantly, the same head end. We know this is true because of times of service interruptions, guide data problems, that one has experienced (mostly me) and the other hasn't.

Inundated,

Out here in North Ridgeville, Comcast is listing Sportstime Ohio on
Channel 73. I-Guide shows off-air till 7pm, then a exhibition game: Toronto vs Cleveland in Winterhaven, Fla.

Ben Music

STO has officially signed up Adelphia. Starting date is Thursday:

http://cleveland.indians.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20060314&content_id=1349376&vkey=pr_cle&fext=.jsp&c_id=cle

In addition to the channels listed, STO's site has now been updated with other Adelphia systems and channels that aren't in the press release below. The release and STO site do not list an HD channel, though it probably wouldn't be a surprise to see them use 798.


SportsTime Ohio and Adelphia finalize broadcast rights agreement
03/14/2006 5:02 PM ET
MLB.com

CLEVELAND -- SportsTime Ohio and Adelphia of Northern Ohio today announced that the new Indians television network will air on Adelphia beginning Thursday, March 16th with the telecast of the Spring Training Indians vs Minnesota Twins game at 8 p.m. The pre-game show will air at 7:30 pm.

"We are pleased to add Adelphia to our growing list of partners and are very appreciative to their commitment to the negotiating process. From the start, they understood the importance of the Cleveland Indians to their subscribers" Liberatore said. "Their presence throughout the region will bring Tribe baseball to thousands of Indians fans. We continue to work hard to finalize our outstanding partnerships to ensure that all the Indians games and the related programming are available to the widest possible audience."

"Adelphia is delighted to bring SportsTime Ohio and Indians baseball to our viewers" said Pamela Mackenzie, Area Vice President of Northern Ohio, herself an avid baseball fan. "2006 promises to be an exciting season for the Indians and these games are sure to delight local fans. This is another example of Adelphia's commitment to superior programming and customer satisfaction."

Adelphia subscribers in Northern Ohio will see five spring training games, 130 in-season games during the 2006 season and other original local programming centering on the interests and passions of Northern Ohio sports fans.

Adelphia customers will be able to view Cleveland Indians games on the following channels:
•Cleveland and suburbs: Channel 17
•Ashtabula Area: Channel 30
•Lorain Area: Channel 23
•Macedonia Area: Channel 97
•Port Clinton Area: Channel 17

SportsTime Ohio will broadcast all of the Indians home games in high definition - giving fans baseball action like never before. From the first broadcast, crisper action from 11 cameras (it was previously eight) and surround sound will help bring the baseball experience into the living rooms of fans.

This is good news. I recently re-signed with Adelphia for a Broadcast Basic package with local HD channels (Got it for less than 20 bucks!). Channel 17 is included in the available channels...

This will hold me over until E* adds Cleveland locals...

Re-reading the release above, it appears for whatever reason, the STO games will be on cable channel 97 on the Macedonia-based lineup (former "Western Reserve" system)...

That might not even happen. Just like when Adelphia took over whatever cable companies it took over years ago some things haven't changed within the Adelphia system, i.e. Inundated and myself both have Adelphia but do not have the same cable line ups and more importantly, the same head end. We know this is true because of times of service interruptions, guide data problems, that one has experienced (mostly me) and the other hasn't.

Good point.

Still, my guess is that TWC WILL standardize the lineup at some point, as they have throughout their entire existing system. They'll probably take the time to rejigger your lineup out there, too.

As evidenced in the STO announcement above, Adelphia hasn't really standardized lineups. I think TWC will.

Hope you enjoy the Indians games on 97 until then. :D

Speaking of Adelphia, Howard Stern On Demand is now officially available from them, although I haven't seen an announcement. (It's an extra monthly charge for unlimited access). The Sirius shows are supposed to start on March 16th and they've been recording in high definition for the new shows, but I don't know if any of the HD programs will be available from Adelphia.

I don't know whether any VOD services include HD programming. Anyone with HBO or Showtime On Demand know?

Good point.

Still, my guess is that TWC WILL standardize the lineup at some point, as they have throughout their entire existing system. They'll probably take the time to rejigger your lineup out there, too.

As evidenced in the STO announcement above, Adelphia hasn't really standardized lineups. I think TWC will.

Hope you enjoy the Indians games on 97 until then. :D

Adelphia Macedonia never added Channel 15 (the Adelphia programming channel). Of course, the only thing worth watching on it is Les Levine and I don't know whether he's moving over to TWC after the changeover.

Good point.

Still, my guess is that TWC WILL standardize the lineup at some point, as they have throughout their entire existing system. They'll probably take the time to rejigger your lineup out there, too.

As evidenced in the STO announcement above, Adelphia hasn't really standardized lineups. I think TWC will.

Hope you enjoy the Indians games on 97 until then. :D

Nope, I'm not in the Macedonia area. I'm in Cleveland Suburbs. That's the old Western Reserve not Macedonia.

Nope, I'm not in the Macedonia area. I'm in Cleveland Suburbs. That's the old Western Reserve not Macedonia.

Oh, I thought you had the Macedonia lineup (WVIZ on 2, etc.). Macedonia used to be Western Reserve Cablevision before Cablevision, then Adelphia, bought it. It was based there. Maybe they split off the lineup at some point.

Good news! STO is already up and running tonight on Adelphia 17 here.

Adelphia Macedonia never added Channel 15 (the Adelphia programming channel). Of course, the only thing worth watching on it is Les Levine and I don't know whether he's moving over to TWC after the changeover.

He may well move to FSN Ohio, where he'll be doing a TV/radio simulcast Indians post-game show also heard on WKNR/850. Neither of them, of course, have the game rights.

Oh, I thought you had the Macedonia lineup (WVIZ on 2, etc.). Macedonia used to be Western Reserve Cablevision before Cablevision, then Adelphia, bought it. It was based there. Maybe they split off the lineup at some point.

Good news! STO is already up and running tonight on Adelphia 17 here.

I do have WVIZ on 2. The difference is WOIO is on 4....and a few others. :)

NCIS got a whopping 6 minute recording tonight. :( First partial program in 10 days, once again HD, prime time.

So much for my daily reboot theory. I didn't really think it would hold up. That's the thing about the SA 8300 - just when you think you got it, it lets you down.

I noticed last night that WOIO-DT is now broadcasting program guide and the correct time of day. I think this is the first time since I got my DTV back in November. That leaves only WEAO-DT in this market not broadcasting program guide or correct time of day info. PBS4549 - any chance of getting this fixed?

According to the thread Inundated posted regarding the Tribe Adelphia has signed on for the full 130 games.

This would negate the theory that they were only signing on for a partial season. Just makes me curious as to why?

I still think TW is pulling the strings at this point. :)

I don't know whether any VOD services include HD programming. Anyone with HBO or Showtime On Demand know?

I've got HBO and unfortunately none of it that I've seen is in HD. It sure would be nice to have OnDemand content in HD, but I wouldn't hold your breath. Adelphia has had enough trouble keeping the SD OnDemand working properly and I imagine the additional bandwidth burden of HD content would cause a total system meltdown.

I've heard Cinemax OnDemand is coming soon, too..

NCIS got a whopping 6 minute recording tonight. :( First partial program in 10 days, once again HD, prime time.

So much for my daily reboot theory. I didn't really think it would hold up. That's the thing about the SA 8300 - just when you think you got it, it lets you down.

Just hang in there for a few more months, and then pick up one of these bad boys --

http://www.hdbeat.com/2006/03/14/hd-tivo-series-3-release-date/

6 tuners plus CableCard for HD content.

*EDIT* Plus it looks like you'll be able to use your external SATA drive with it, too.

*EDIT 2* Here's a better write up of all its features. http://www.tivolovers.com/252572.html CableCard 2.0 for multistream capabilities is supposedly supported, which is amazing I didn't even think the standard had been approved yet.

Well, since nobody knows for sure when the TWC takeover will take place, they had no choice but to sign a full contract. The broadcast last night was nice, with no major glitches. I assume that they will use 798 for the HD games.

Just hang in there for a few more months, and then pick up one of these bad boys --

http://www.hdbeat.com/2006/03/14/hd-tivo-series-3-release-date/

6 tuners plus CableCard for HD content.

*EDIT* Plus it looks like you'll be able to use your external SATA drive with it, too.

*EDIT 2* Here's a better write up of all its features. http://www.tivolovers.com/252572.html CableCard 2.0 for multistream capabilities is supposedly supported, which is amazing I didn't even think the standard had been approved yet.

Yeah, I've heard about the series 3 and it's dual tuner capability. Don't know that my External HD would work with this but you can bet your behind this will work better then the SA 8300. I've got my eye on it for sure.

I think I can even get the wife to go on board with this as she is a huge TiVo fan. Mostly depends upon cost. If they keep it under 500 I can probably do it. More then that, I don't know.

Anyone Else Having Problems With Channel 3.1 Using An Ota

Yeah, I've heard about the series 3 and it's dual tuner capability. Don't know that my External HD would work with this but you can bet your behind this will work better then the SA 8300.

Yeah, the 6 tuner cabability is kind of a misnomer. It only can record two shows at one time while you can view a third show that was recorded. It has enough tuners to record two shows from any of the following sources: NTSC, ATSC, QAM, or Cable Card decoded sources. If I remember right only the TiVo branded SATA drive will work with the Series 3. That doesn't say people won't figure out how to hack it.

Anyone Else Having Problems With Channel 3.1 Using An Ota

It's absolutely horrible in Middleburg Hts.

I wrote the station asking if they plan on upping the signal strength prior to the Indians coming to TV-3, but I don't expect it, especially if they're partnered with a cable company. What motivation would they have to provide better OTA for Indians.

Honestly, with them stretching most of their upconverted 4x3 to 16x9 I don't care to see it. They have by far the worst picture quality in town. Then throw in Weather Plus, and there's even less bandwidth for the full HD shows.

I did I watched the first inning, then had work to do! not bad, I just will wait till time warner gets a full time 24 hour channel up and not use the local one, I will pass judgement there, but there were no hiccups as I was watching, and the tribe won, so...good channel so far

Expect major hiccups when they come to their first home show.

The studio STO's using out of WKYC for Tribe games is in shambles, and they've cheaped out on all of the equipment.

As for the 20 KYC games, you have to remember this is coming from the only station in town that stretches their upconverted 4x3 analog programming to 16x9, so I don't think they really care about quality.

Then throw in Weather Plus, and there's even less bandwidth for the full HD shows. I would not sweat one subchannel going along for the ride. IIIRC one HD channel does not use the full bandwidth available. There is not enough for 2 HD feeds but there is plenty of bandwidth for one HD and one SD.

Yeah, the 6 tuner cabability is kind of a misnomer. It only can record two shows at one time while you can view a third show that was recorded. It has enough tuners to record two shows from any of the following sources: NTSC, ATSC, QAM, or Cable Card decoded sources. If I remember right only the TiVo branded SATA drive will work with the Series 3. That doesn't say people won't figure out how to hack it.

I don't know that I'd call it a misnomer.. I mean it does, in actuality, have 6 tuners. True you're limited to recording from 2 at any time, but the fact remains that there are 6 tuners which is an impressive engineering feat that speaks to the quality of the backplane bus, firmware and software.

I thought I read somewhere that they would be using standard Maxtor ESATA drives, but can't find the source again so maybe I just made it up in my overexcitement that this thing isn't just vaporware. That would be a real shame if they locked it to their own drives but I suppose understandable from a business perspective. Tivo's always been very hacker friendly though, so hopefully they'll remain so and as you say, it'll probably be cracked quickly.

*EDIT* Ah, found that source I was thinking of.. (http://community.livejournal.com/tivolovers/252572.html?thread=981148#t981148) This guy was talking to the people in the Tivo booth at CES'06 and asked them about the ESATA. They said they "hope" to allow users to use any SATA drive that meets some minimum requirements. Of course, as always, we never really know until it's here etc etc etc..

I hate to rain on the Dump on WKYC Parade, but...


I wrote the station asking if they plan on upping the signal strength prior to the Indians coming to TV-3, but I don't expect it, especially if they're partnered with a cable company. What motivation would they have to provide better OTA for Indians.

You're missing the point.

1) WKYC's signal strength has nothing to do with the Indians games. And WKYC certainly can't go "well, darn, the Indians are starting in a couple of weeks, we'd better up the power!" Any facilities changes have to be filed with the FCC, have a construction permit approved, and such, and that takes months to YEARS. Just ask WBNX!

2) The biggest problem with WKYC's digital signal is not strength. It's the fact that it sits on DT channel 2, which is even worse for electrical interference, noise and out-of-town skip than even their analog channel 3. WKYC will abandon DT 2 at the analog shutoff (4/2009) for DT 17, which will become available when WDLI/Canton abandons analog 17 for their current digital channel of 39.

There is really not much they can do about this before then. It's not like they're sitting there and saying "gee, we don't want to make our over-air digital signal any easier because we're together with Time Warner in the STO deal!".

There are so many issues here, and the fact that WKYC is now the over-air Indians home has NOTHING to do with them, and can't even remotely affect those issues.


Honestly, with them stretching most of their upconverted 4x3 to 16x9 I don't care to see it. They have by far the worst picture quality in town. Then throw in Weather Plus, and there's even less bandwidth for the full HD shows.

I am not a fan of stretch-o-vision, I'll have to agree with you there. But at least WKYC didn't do what WEWS did until recently - stretch to that insane almost-quasi 14x9! At least my tuners can squash WKYC's 16x9 stretch down to 4x3, and it looks reasonably well. And WKYC's digital SD certainly beats the living daylights out of WOIO "Contrast Set To 11 On Aging Analog Equipment" 19. The ONLY time WOIO-DT looks good is during CBS HD programming.

As far as Weather Plus and WKYC-DT - do you honestly think that is going to affect the Indians games? 90% of baseball is low action. I did notice some macroblocking during very fast Winter Olympic action with bright colors, but I don't know how much of that was the subchannel and how much of that was motion in the 1080i standard.

I'd like for somone to explain to me why WKYC Dolby 5.1 volume is so much lower then WJW.

Or is this my equipment? I'd list equipmen but trying to keep typing down. Bird bit finger yesterday. 4 stitches.

Anyone Else Having Problems With Channel 3.1 Using An Ota

Problems with WKYC-DT OTA? Never! :rolleyes:

Actually, Inundated does a good job of explaining WKYC-DTs predicament a couple of posts back.

Where are you located? What kind of antenna are you using?

Here in North Canton, I have an outdoor antenna on a 30-foot mast with a preamp on the signal line after it drops into the attic. I will get solid reception on WKYC-DT for a week or so at a time, and then it will disappear for a week or two. Reception chance is usually better at night. It is really hit or miss.

If you have the ability to point your antenna toward Youngstown and you are close enough, WFMJ-DT 20 puts out a very strong signal. I can pick it up with an indoor antenna sitting by a north-facing window. YMMV.

Anybody know what WOIO-DT is planning to do with the NCAA tourney broadcasts? Will they multicast more than one game or will they stick with the single HD stream? What did they do last year?

I have mixed feelings about this. In one way, I would like to be able to keep tabs on multiple games going at the same time. But on the other hand, sports just looks so great in HD!

Maybe as a compromise, they could do multicast for the first round and then go back to single HD stream for the remaining rounds. Anybody from WOIO listening?

Problems with WKYC-DT OTA? Never! :rolleyes:

Actually, Inundated does a good job of explaining WKYC-DTs predicament a couple of posts back.

Where are you located? What kind of antenna are you using?

Here in North Canton, I have an outdoor antenna on a 30-foot mast with a preamp on the signal line after it drops into the attic. I will get solid reception on WKYC-DT for a week or so at a time, and then it will disappear for a week or two. Reception chance is usually better at night. It is really hit or miss.

If you have the ability to point your antenna toward Youngstown and you are close enough, WFMJ-DT 20 puts out a very strong signal. I can pick it up with an indoor antenna sitting by a north-facing window. YMMV.
I live in Medina. I have my antenna on top of my roof. I live in a condo with a flat roof top with no trees in the way. I get on average about 88%, so it really makes me mad. Actually what makes me angrier is that we need an antenna, CMON D* HURRY UP!!!!!!1

Has anyone in Adelphia land seen the Tribe in the listings yet? All I see on channel 17 is "Adelphia Community Channel". The first game is supposed to be telecast tonight. In addition no announcement page.

I wonder if they are going to pull it off in time? Nothing 798 either.

None of the spring training games are in HD so 798 won't show anything until April.

They turned Tuesday's game on right after the announcement, so I know they're able to show it, but the guide listing didn't change.

Anybody know what WOIO-DT is planning to do with the NCAA tourney broadcasts? Will they multicast more than one game or will they stick with the single HD stream? What did they do last year?

I have mixed feelings about this. In one way, I would like to be able to keep tabs on multiple games going at the same time. But on the other hand, sports just looks so great in HD!

Maybe as a compromise, they could do multicast for the first round and then go back to single HD stream for the remaining rounds. Anybody from WOIO listening?

I emailed them about multicasting either last year or the year before. Their response was that they did not have the necessary equipment to allow them to multicast and they had no plans to acquire it.

I emailed them about multicasting either last year or the year before. Their response was that they did not have the necessary equipment to allow them to multicast and they had no plans to acquire it.

WOIO (Raycom) is something else. They should change the call letters to WCHP (W-CHEAP). :)

I don't know that I'd call it a misnomer.. I mean it does, in actuality, have 6 tuners. True you're limited to recording from 2 at any time, but the fact remains that there are 6 tuners which is an impressive engineering feat that speaks to the quality of the backplane bus, firmware and software.

The problem with telling people that it has 6 tuners (which I agree it does) is that they will assume that it can record 6 things at a time. Since people are very familar with "dual tuner" DVRs a 6 tuner DVR sounds even better, but they wouldn't be getting what they're expecting. That's why you can't simply say "it has 6 tuners" without saying "to record two shows at a time."

I cant believe that people actually want multicasting to degredate the picture quality. Thats crazy talk on this forum.

I noticed last night that WOIO-DT is now broadcasting program guide and the correct time of day. I think this is the first time since I got my DTV back in November. That leaves only WEAO-DT in this market not broadcasting program guide or correct time of day info. PBS4549 - any chance of getting this fixed?

We've had talks this morning about the time issue. Internally we have the correct time being inserted into the digital stream. We're unsure at which point it is being altered/stripped. There's about 4 different points we need to look at and we'll do that as quickly as we can.
As for the program information, we have static PSIP, which means we are properly identifying our stations. Dynamic PSIP, allowing us to insert program related information, will begin when the recently ordered equipment is delivered and installed. That could be up to 6 months.

I cant believe that people actually want multicasting to degredate the picture quality. Thats crazy talk on this forum.

It is not crazy talk in this situation. Typically what other CBS affiliates did in the past was to multicast 3 or 4 SD NCAA games when there was no HD game being broadcast. When there was an HD game, they would show it and no more than 1 multicast SD game. It was a good use of the technology to give the viewer the maximum number of viewing options. In essence, it was a special implementation put in place just for the NCAA tournament. You were no longer at the mercy of the local affiliate as to which one of several games they chose to broadcast. I would love to see it done. Our only possibility locally though will be WKBN in Youngstown for next year. They obviously have the capability since they are currently planning to multicast an SD Fox channel.

I recall last year Adelphia had a different game on CBS' feeds. Was it one game on Ch4 and an HD game on 704? Wonder if they can make use of 804?

I recall last year Adelphia had a different game on CBS' feeds. Was it one game on Ch4 and an HD game on 704? Wonder if they can make use of 804?

Don't think so. 804 is ch 4. If you hook up without a box what you see is 804. When you hook up with a box you see digital WOIO on 4.

I cant believe that people actually want multicasting to degredate the picture quality. Thats crazy talk on this forum.

I DID say I had mixed feelings about it! :D

Anyway, the point is moot here since WOIO does not have the capability to multicast.

I did find this on their website:

http://www.woio.com/Global/story.asp?S=1176429&nav=menu68_6

So, it appears that they are doing the next best thing - all HD games on their digital channel, and "games of regional importance" (my interpretation) on the analog channel. In some cases, the digital and the analog will be the same (e.g. for the Pitt - KSU game on Friday).

I am kind of bummed that the Buckeyes game will only be on the analog channel. :(

We've had talks this morning about the time issue. Internally we have the correct time being inserted into the digital stream. We're unsure at which point it is being altered/stripped. There's about 4 different points we need to look at and we'll do that as quickly as we can.

Thanks for the update. The time is no biggie, just kind of jarring when I see it.

As for the program information, we have static PSIP, which means we are properly identifying our stations. Dynamic PSIP, allowing us to insert program related information, will begin when the recently ordered equipment is delivered and installed. That could be up to 6 months.

Good to hear that you plan to add the program info! I hope that equipment is not the same equipment that will bring us the HD feed. As I recall, the HD problem was a software issue?

I am kind of bummed that the Buckeyes game will only be on the analog channel. :(

Yeah, we always get screwed because we are still the minority, not the masses.

There ought to be a law..... ;)

I did find this on their website:

http://www.woio.com/Global/story.asp?S=1176429&nav=menu68_6



Thanks for the link. Looks like they(WOIO) did good on Thursday and are showing all the HD games from Greensboro. On Friday though, the only HD game they have listed from the other HD site(Philly) is Kentucky/UAB. That means we don't get to see the UConn(one of the highest ranked teams in the country) game. This makes no sense showing the Kent State game on both channels. Hopefully they will get a clue before Friday.

Hey guys, this may not be the exact forum for this, but I'm looking for some local help/input.

Just had my HD DirecTV install last week. Everything is working great, but it was the free installation that came with the new service. Needless to say, they really butchered the wiring. I have exposed wires running everywhere. They say they can't fish the wires to where they need to be. I'm looking for an experienced installer. Can anyone provide a reference. Doesn't necessarily need to be a DirecTV installer, but an experienced AV installer. I don't mind paying for the job to be done to my satisfaction. I live on the west side (Avon Lake). TIA

Just a note regarding the Adelphia line-up in Macedonia. Although STO's web site lists channel 97, last nights Indians game was on channel 71. Rough way for a start to the new network for us 12-5, ouch.

Rough way for a start to the new network for us 12-5, ouch.

I'd rather they lose ALL of the spring training games and start winning on opening day! It seems when they have a winning ST season, they lose most of their games in April...

Hey guys, this may not be the exact forum for this, but I'm looking for some local help/input.

Just had my HD DirecTV install last week. Everything is working great, but it was the free installation that came with the new service. Needless to say, they really butchered the wiring. I have exposed wires running everywhere. They say they can't fish the wires to where they need to be. I'm looking for an experienced installer. Can anyone provide a reference. Doesn't necessarily need to be a DirecTV installer, but an experienced AV installer. I don't mind paying for the job to be done to my satisfaction. I live on the west side (Avon Lake). TIA

Here is the answer to your prayers:
Call Jim WEst at Cleveland Antenna 440-237-6888
Use my name. I have referred many people to him and all have been made happy.
He will send his son Joel to you
He will fix your problems!!!

Typical "free" install. My dad got his FREE install from TWC on his DVR. Those little morons actually took a cable from his center channel audio on his DVD player to "complete" the installation!!

Anyone else having trouble with WEWS (5-1) tonight? When I'm getting a picture OTA it's constant breakups. My HD-Tivo managed around 3 minutes of Desperate Housewives and about the same on Grey's Anatomy.

So is WEWS having another go round of problems? Or is it just me tonight?

Anyone else having trouble with WEWS (5-1) tonight? When I'm getting a picture OTA it's constant breakups. My HD-Tivo managed around 3 minutes of Desperate Housewives and about the same on Grey's Anatomy.

So is WEWS having another go round of problems? Or is it just me tonight?

Receiving through Adelphia on my SA 8300 both shows fully recorded. I noticed that DH was a repeat before I went to bed so I deleted it without watching, but there were no recording problems.

Likewise: in fact my OTA of 5-1 was unusally stable - very good last night.

Thanks for the feedback guys - not what I wanted to hear, but good to know.

After posting, I checked my signal meter and it was bouncing all over, but always very low. Oscillating from 0 to the 20s then 0 then 40s with a peak in the 40s. Basically the worst I've ever had on 5-1.

My current thought is I'm prone to some multipath interference on 5-1 w/certain weather/atmospheric conditions. Seem plausible to anyone? Guess I'll need to try adjusting my antenna to see if I can nip it in the bud. Joy...

Thanks for the quick feedback on 5-1 for last night...

Does anyone know when WKBN-Channel 27 (CBS) in Youngstown will start broadcasting HD programming ? I live in North Canton and cannot get Channel 19-WOIO in Cleveland OTA, but I can get Channel 21 out of Youngstown with an amplified rabbit ears for the NBC programming.

Does anyone know when WKBN-Channel 27 (CBS) in Youngstown will start broadcasting HD programming ? I live in North Canton and cannot get Channel 19-WOIO in Cleveland OTA, but I can get Channel 21 out of Youngstown with an amplified rabbit ears for the NBC programming.


Check out the Youngstown, Ohio thread:

Youngstown, Ohio OTA (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7200923&&#post7200923)

Thanks for the feedback guys - not what I wanted to hear, but good to know.

My current thought is I'm prone to some multipath interference on 5-1 w/certain weather/atmospheric conditions. Seem plausible to anyone? Guess I'll need to try adjusting my antenna to see if I can nip it in the bud. Joy...

I think that you're on the right track as I have a similar issue with 5-1 which requires two main positions/orientations for my indoor antenna. The first pulls in 3, 5, 8, 19, 43, and 61 the vast majority of the time. The second is for when 5-1 is acting up (about a week or so every month - including the past few days) although then 3, 19, and 43 are shaky. My problem started right around the first of the year, which I think was when they upped the power of their transmitter.

19-1 down on OTA?
Anyone else notice it?

Check out the Youngstown, Ohio thread:

Thanks. WKBN-27 reports that it is on-track to begin broadcasting in digital and HD on May 1, 2006. Good news for those of us in Stark County that have trouble picking up the CBS programming on WOIO-19 via OTA.

Thanks. WKBN-27 reports that it is on-track to begin broadcasting in digital and HD on May 1, 2006. Good news for those of us in Stark County that have trouble picking up the CBS programming on WOIO-19 via OTA.This is good news not only for Stark county, but to good portion of the southeasten side of the Cleveland DMA. The coverage map from the FCC shows WKBN-DT reaching as far west as Stronsville and Medina! It even covers the City of Cleveland proper out into Lake Erie and the other side of the signal reaches all the way to Pittsburgh! The other two Youngstown stations barely make it to Bainbridge (actually WYTV is not even that good, while WFMJ touches parts of Solon).

WKBN: http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT603946.html

WFMJ: http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT421700.html

WYTV: http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT422166.html

The WKBN-DT antenna is 406 meters (1332 feet) above ground level; hence, the signal will travel farther than most stations.

19-1 down on OTA?
Anyone else notice it?

...noticed it here too. It came back on later in SD but looks like it's fixed now.

cheers.

I can't wait to get mine

Does anyone know when WKBN-Channel 27 (CBS) in Youngstown will start broadcasting HD programming ? I live in North Canton and cannot get Channel 19-WOIO in Cleveland OTA, but I can get Channel 21 out of Youngstown with an amplified rabbit ears for the NBC programming.

Are you using the rabbit ears to try and get WOIO-DT? Make sure you have them fully extended. You are probably asking for a lot from mere rabbit ears, though. WOIO-DT has a fairly weak signal - I think 3.5 kW according to the FCC website. Even WKYC-DT puts out 8 kW.

I normally do not have any problem receiving WOIO-DT with my outdoor 30' antenna. I did notice that their signal seemed weaker than usual this weekend (ocassional macroblocking and dropouts during the NCAA tourney games), which may explain the problems that others were seeing. Earlier this evening, their signal seems to have returned to normal.

Back in town...

WOIO-DT is usually my hardest-to-receive signal after the infamous WKYC-DT. But I can usually find a place to get it even on my indoor antenna, which is usually impossible for WKYC.

Of course, most of my HD watching is Adelphia QAM (with my Fusion tuner downstairs), so I haven't really done the loop of the OTA stations.

Are you using the rabbit ears to try and get WOIO-DT? Make sure you have them fully extended.

Wrong. For physical channel 10 (which is what 19.1 is actually broadcasting on), the rabbit ears should be only about 1/3 extended. Full extension would be for channel 2/3. They should also be horizontal, not "V" shaped for the best pickup.

Several people have told me that a solid OTA signal results in the best hi-def picture beacuse it comes direct from the station tower while the cable and satellite signal is diluted. On the other hand, setting up a rooftop antenna is a hassle. Any thoughts on this out there ?

Several people have told me that a solid OTA signal results in the best hi-def picture beacuse it comes direct from the station tower while the cable and satellite signal is diluted. On the other hand, setting up a rooftop antenna is a hassle. Any thoughts on this out there ?

I kind of think several things enter into play on this. It would make sense that a solid OTA signal would be best, but I don't know how much difference you would actually be able to see unless you had a trained eye. Also from what I've read aquiring a "solid" OTA signal depends on so many things, location from tower, trees, weather conditions, elevation. Also it would depend on the type of HD set you have. Certainly with my CRT Sony Wega I wouldn't see much difference from OTA and cable.

I'm pretty sure that cable offers the best of both worlds because generally cable seems to be "locked" into that solid signal better then an OTA antenna at home could be. In addition with OTA only you get only what's available. No premium channels. There has been many people pleading for PBS on OTA but that's not a problem for cable subscribers.

On the other hand we do not get UPS, or WB. Since I watch two shows on those networks they are not that important to me. Anyway they will be replaced soon and WB isn't available in HD in our area.

Just my thoughts. My opinions.

Please remember however, that I'm always right. :D

Wrong. For physical channel 10 (which is what 19.1 is actually broadcasting on), the rabbit ears should be only about 1/3 extended. Full extension would be for channel 2/3. They should also be horizontal, not "V" shaped for the best pickup.
It's the OTA paradox. How to pick up WKYC and WOIO at the same time. I actually had it working where I got all the stations. But now WOIO isn't coming in usually and the ABC affiliate is on and off. I actually can get WKYC unlike my Akron bretheren. And a rather solid lock as well.

This is a pain. I don't want to venture into the attic and lose WKYC to gain WOIO, but football will start back up and no CBS. Oh the humanity! My main solution would be to get an antenna for the outdoors. Which is probably how I'll fix this problem. I just wish these main channels were all UHF like some areas.

[What's the best picture]
Cable (Adelphia) provides a clear Hd picture from Cleveland broadcast stations.
I would be surprised to see as consistent quality from an antenna.
I have not seen picture degradation due to weather either.

[What's the best picture]
Cable (Adelphia) provides a clear Hd picture from Cleveland broadcast stations.
I would be surprised to see as consistent quality from an antenna.
I have not seen picture degradation due to weather either.

I have both and I do see a slight difference between the two but I have a pretty well trained eye & have had HD for over 5 years. I'm positive that the vast majority of people wouldn't see any difference. Keep in mind, there isn't really picture degradation in the normal sense...the picture either comes in or it doesn't, although sometimes it can freeze up and/or get blocks. The actually PQ remains the same. I can see the most difference when watching OTA outdoor sports. I see just a tad more shadow detail and light reflections and what I can only describe as 'life' in the picture via OTA. If I wasn't able to compare on the same set going back & forth it would be hard to tell. Now, if I throw in the fact that I often can't get NBC or CBS & have to run outside in the cold and move my antenna an inch to the left in order to fix the problem, OTA becomes far more of a pain in the rear end. Then mix in the occasional drop-out even with good signal strength (which my wife HATES) and now cable is sounding quite a bit better. So, in the end, if I have the worlds best OTA antenna & could put it on my roof with a rotor and that eliminated all drop-outs, I think it's a tad better as far as pure picture quality. But, a tad better unfortunately is way to problematic at this point and cable is basically hassle free comparativly. But if you are talking pure PQ, I think OTA does win just by the tinyest of margins.

Since I built my home theater this December, I had moved my HD STB from Adelphia into the basement & into the theater. Since then, I've been doing only OTA upstairs on my Sony HDTV. After 2 months, I gotta tell ya, I'm gonna spend the extra $10 a month & get another Adelphia box. It's becoming a pain & nothing is worse than having the channel drop out right at a critical moment during a show. (not to mention not having the option to DVR HD upstairs). I had forgotten what a pain it was for me pre-Adelphia HD. I'll still watch OTA locals, but if they aren't coming in, I'll have the Adelphia box to flip to instead of venturing outside in the cold at 10:00 PM to move the antenna!

On the other hand we do not get UPS, or WB.


Maybe WUAB would be better off hooking up with UPS - they'd sure deliver!

(Umm, where's my rimshot? :D)

It does seem likely that we'll have The CW in HD in some form from WBNX before the network starts. If they don't get their DT channel up by the July deadline, they'll probably feed HD to cable.

It's the OTA paradox. How to pick up WKYC and WOIO at the same time. I actually had it working where I got all the stations. But now WOIO isn't coming in usually and the ABC affiliate is on and off. I actually can get WKYC unlike my Akron bretheren. And a rather solid lock as well.

This is a pain. I don't want to venture into the attic and lose WKYC to gain WOIO, but football will start back up and no CBS. Oh the humanity! My main solution would be to get an antenna for the outdoors. Which is probably how I'll fix this problem. I just wish these main channels were all UHF like some areas. I find it odd that you can't get both VHF DT's at the same time. The WKYC and WOIO towers are next to each other. What you need is a good VHF-only antenna aimed squarely at the northeast corner of the Parma antennafarm (roughly the intersection of Ridgewood Dr. and Broadview Rd.) and a seperate UHF only antenna aimed squarely at WEWS (State Rd. north of Pleasant Valley Rd.). If the beam width of your UHF antenna is wide enough you will have no problems with any of the UHF DT signals currently on the air (with the exception of WVIZ). WEWS is between WJW and WUAB along State Rd.

Maybe WUAB would be better off hooking up with UPS - they'd sure deliver!

(Umm, where's my rimshot? :D)

It does seem likely that we'll have The CW in HD in some form from WBNX before the network starts. If they don't get their DT channel up by the July deadline, they'll probably feed HD to cable.

Hey, easy there pal. I'm typing with 4 stitches in my middle finger.

See it? :D :D

SportsTime Ohio has signed up Cox and Comcast. No word on any deal with DirecTV, WOW or Armstrong Cable yet.

Of the two newest systems, only Cox has already listed an HD channel for STO.

FYI, Dish Network is currently testing SportsTime Ohio, although it isn't available for public, nor has an agreement been announced. However, since they're testing, maybe things are close:

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=55164

[What's the best picture]
Cable (Adelphia) provides a clear Hd picture from Cleveland broadcast stations.
I would be surprised to see as consistent quality from an antenna.
I have not seen picture degradation due to weather either.

Real issue that can make OTA better is compression. Full broadcast spectrum is something like 19.4 mb/sec. DirecTV typically reduces that to around 14-16 mb/sec. Many have measured and found that some cable companies also compress. That is the reason (more bits equals more information equals more detail/better picture) that in many cases the same program looks better OTA than via satellite or cable.

FYI, Dish Network is currently testing SportsTime Ohio, although it isn't available for public, nor has an agreement been announced. However, since they're testing, maybe things are close:

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=55164
A cautious Woo Hoo! for the Wahoos from this E* sub :D

Thanks for the heads up JT!

Here's the Cox/Comcast SportsTime Ohio News Release:

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20060322&content_id=1359641&vkey=pr_cle&fext=.jsp&c_id=cle

I finished my surround equipment install today. I waited until I was sure it worked before I posted. :D

I finished my surround equipment install today. I waited until I was sure it worked before I posted. :D

Excellent news! Keep up the good work.

BTW, I switched on WFMJ-DT at about 10:40 last night and noticed whatever was on (don't remember the name) was being shown with black borders all the way around the screen (picture was not filling the entire screen). Any idea what was going on?

I've got a choice. Either I can disconnect my external hard drive so I can watch HD television and only miss an occasional show, or I can keep it and stop watching HD.

Last night my 8300 failed to record 4 shows. Law & Order, Criminal Minds (well it got 2 minutes of that, but that's a failure as far as I'm concerned) Heist and CSI:NY.

When I look at the "to be recorded" screen it shows all these shows scheduled on
3/29. That means it had to have made an attempt at recording these shows, otherwise it would still have the 3/22 date next to them.

I tuned in the last few minutes of "Criminal Minds" before I shut the equipment off. The SA 8300 said "recording". :confused:

I'm mostly ranting at this point. Not much I can do about it. I know it's going to happen once and a while even if I disconnect the external hard drive. What a pos.

That Series 3 TiVo can't get here soon enough. :mad:

I found the OTA v.s. Cable PQ discussion interesting and agree with what was said. I am on Adelphia HD and get good OTA but less (hardly any) dropouts on cable, not to mention the DVR issues addressed by Dweezilz (And by the way I always agree with the Proud Flock Owner since he IS always right and when he's not he gets bit pretty darn quick around here.) My question is, has anyone done a side by side comparison of PQ between available Satellite HD and Adelphia (soon to be TimeWarner) cable? I was told cable generally provides less of the compression mentioned by rlb, but I have no clue about the veracity of this and especially lately with the advent of MPEG 4 and perhaps other compression schemes in the satellite world. Bottom line is I want the best PQ I can get

Excellent news! Keep up the good work.

BTW, I switched on WFMJ-DT at about 10:40 last night and noticed whatever was on (don't remember the name) was being shown with black borders all the way around the screen (picture was not filling the entire screen). Any idea what was going on?

At this point I believe it was an NBC issue. They came back from a commercial break to full screen black with the NBC bug. After about 30 seconds it went to SD, but we didn't throw the switch. Check out this link in the programming thread. Heist Link (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7358298&&#post7358298). They're running an encore presentation Friday night. Maybe they'll have it fixed by then.

My question is, has anyone done a side by side comparison of PQ between available Satellite HD and Adelphia (soon to be TimeWarner) cable? Bottom line is I want the best PQ I can get

You're going to be hard pressed to find someone that has HD cable and HD satellite running on the same display to do a real comparison. The bottom line is satellite has to compress their video more than cable currently does. Satellite hasn't yet moved all of their channels to MPEG4 (locals are MP4 while everything else isn't) which means the major channels will still be compressed more than cable. I have heard several times that if you must choose satellite then E* is the way to go.

My understanding of the rankings:
OTA
Cable
E*
D*

At this point I believe it was an NBC issue. They came back from a commercial break to full screen black with the NBC bug. After about 30 seconds it went to SD, but we didn't throw the switch. Check out this link in the programming thread. Heist Link (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7358298&&#post7358298). They're running an encore presentation Friday night. Maybe they'll have it fixed by then.


Well, that probably explains why I had a recording failure on both Law & Order and Heist on my 8300. Doesn't explain why I had a failure with CBS of course.

Further rant: I screwed up on my DVD recordings of Lost and whatever new show followed that. I didn't allow enough disk space, not the equipments fault.

Not a good night for recording for me.

Well, that probably explains why I had a recording failure on both Law & Order and Heist on my 8300. Doesn't explain why I had a failure with CBS of course.

Further rant: I screwed up on my DVD recordings of Lost and whatever new show followed that. I didn't allow enough disk space, not the equipments fault.

Not a good night for recording for me.


NBC's problem wouldn't have affected your recordings. Law & Order was perfect technically and the switch to SD on Heist didn't make the bitstream breakup.

NBC's problem wouldn't have affected your recordings. Law & Order was perfect technically and the switch to SD on Heist didn't make the bitstream breakup.

I realized that after I actually clicked on the link you posted. Well, I'm moving everything off my external hard drive to DVD now and I'm going to disconnect it. Hopefully when TiVo Series 3 rolls around I'll be able to use it somehow.

I found the OTA v.s. Cable PQ discussion interesting and agree with what was said. I am on Adelphia HD and get good OTA but less (hardly any) dropouts on cable, not to mention the DVR issues addressed by Dweezilz (And by the way I always agree with the Proud Flock Owner since he IS always right and when he's not he gets bit pretty darn quick around here.) My question is, has anyone done a side by side comparison of PQ between available Satellite HD and Adelphia (soon to be TimeWarner) cable? I was told cable generally provides less of the compression mentioned by rlb, but I have no clue about the veracity of this and especially lately with the advent of MPEG 4 and perhaps other compression schemes in the satellite world. Bottom line is I want the best PQ I can get


I certainly agree that cable has a good picture and is far more convenient than putting up an antenna. On the other hand, for those of us who can get by with just major network programming, $0 per month beats $80 per month all the time. :)

You're going to be hard pressed to find someone that has HD cable and HD satellite running on the same display to do a real comparison. The bottom line is satellite has to compress their video more than cable currently does. Satellite hasn't yet moved all of their channels to MPEG4 (locals are MP4 while everything else isn't) which means the major channels will still be compressed more than cable. I have heard several times that if you must choose satellite then E* is the way to go.

My understanding of the rankings:
OTA
Cable
E*
D*

Actually not as hard pressed as you'd think; I do have this exact scenario. :p

I have had Dish Network's HD package for 5 years or so (since they first started HD). I was grandfathered in at only $8 a month without any other programming. They don't allow this anymore without full programming so I haven't cancelled. For about $15 total (including tax & fees), it's worth hanging on to for now (if only for the Voom channels and TNT-HD). Mostly because of the hassle of OTA, DVR for HD and also to get PBS and INHD1, INHD2, I also got the Adelphia HD package for $5.

From what I've heard many times, Dish does indeed compress more than cable, but how it relates to real world PQ differences is another story. I do direct comparisons all the time between HDnet, ESPN-HD, Discovery-HD & the locals ota. For the actual HD networks, I'd have to say on my Sony 51" HDTV, while I might be able to see some slight difference at times, I'd be hard pressed to say that Adelphia's cable was the clear winner in PQ. It's just too close to call & most people wouldn't notice at all. To me they look almost identical going back & forth, however if there's any difference, I'd say that Adelphia's colors seems to be just a tad more saturated overall. Nobody would be able to tell the difference without being able to flip back & forth like I can do however, so at this point, I'd have to say advatage goes to...neither, as far as a noticable PQ difference with the HD networks.

Does anyone know locally if you can pick up the HD stations from Adelphia simply by plugging in the cable to an HD tuner (not needing a box to get the 700-series channels then component out to the monitor). Basically, the cable line acts as if it's a big antenna.

Insight cable in Columbus, if you plug the cable into your HDTV tuner you get the OTA signal, bypassing the cable box and compression. I don't know if they remodulate the signals down the line or what, but it's great.
Any thoughts?

Recently I upgraded my 25 yr. old RS 160" vhf/uhf antenna on a 30' tower/w rotor. I live about 45 miles south of the Parma Farm (Massillon). With the old set-up I was getting frequent drop-offs and pixelation. With the following upgrade, I get all the HD stations with no drop-offs or pixelation.
CM 4228 UHF
Wade VIP-306 VHF
CM titan 7777 pre-amp
CM 9421A Rotor/controller
All new RG-6 coax/rotor wiring

The only oddity is Channel 8.1 HD which comes in at 31.3 ??

Attached are some pics

No doubt with that sucker, anything will come in! ha! I think the development we live in would lock me up & throw away the key if I put that up. It's very cool though! That's strange that Fox would come in on 31.3! It should be 31.1.

Actually not as hard pressed as you'd think; I do have this exact scenario. :p

I have had Dish Network's HD package for 5 years or so (since they first started HD). I was grandfathered in at only $8 a month without any other programming. They don't allow this anymore without full programming so I haven't cancelled. For about $15 total (including tax & fees), it's worth hanging on to for now (if only for the Voom channels and TNT-HD). Mostly because of the hassle of OTA, DVR for HD and also to get PBS and INHD1, INHD2, I also got the Adelphia HD package for $5.

From what I've heard many times, Dish does indeed compress more than cable, but how it relates to real world PQ differences is another story. I do direct comparisons all the time between HDnet, ESPN-HD, Discovery-HD & the locals ota. For the actual HD networks, I'd have to say on my Sony 51" HDTV, while I might be able to see some slight difference at times, I'd be hard pressed to say that Adelphia's cable was the clear winner in PQ. It's just too close to call & most people wouldn't notice at all. To me they look almost identical going back & forth, however if there's any difference, I'd say that Adelphia's colors seems to be just a tad more saturated overall. Nobody would be able to tell the difference without being able to flip back & forth like I can do however, so at this point, I'd have to say advatage goes to...neither, as far as a noticable PQ difference with the HD networks.

Winner would definitely be cable if all I cared about was HD (other than the fact that I have an antenna for HD locals); however if you watch any SD (e.g., Fox News, or CNN) digital SD from D* beats the hell out of analog SD from most cable companies. That difference is significantly more than the difference between HD sources. That's why I use both D* and OTA. Not to mention that the HD Tivo works with only those two sources.

No doubt with that sucker, anything will come in! ha! I think the development we live in would lock me up & throw away the key if I put that up. It's very cool though! That's strange that Fox would come in on 31.3! It should be 31.1.

I don't know why my Sony 42"A10 HD TV tuner locks the signal at 31.3 but whatever direction I rotate my antenna at, channel 8 HD only comes in at that channel setting. I also have tried numerous times to try to lock at 8.1 HD but no luck. Channel 8 HD comes in at the best resolution over any other station. Go figure??

I read that Seinfeld is going Syndicated HD on March 27, 2006, and called WJW to see if they'll be able to broadcast Seinfeld re-runs in HD. I spoke with a nice guy in Operations Engineering that said as of now the station has no way of downlinking it in HD whether it's satellite, fiber or a file. Then if they could get it they have no way recording it to their server in HD. Right now their server is SD only, but he does expect to have the ability in the next six months to a year.

I've wrote the station several times on it, and encourage any support.

My bet is you'll see it on HDnet or INHD.

Thanks for the information on PQ everyone! It all makes sense to me (except for Hookbill's ext. drive problem, I have one as well and it works just fine and I don't want to jinx it by saying so). I so agree Adelphia SD is terrible, made all the worse I think by my Sony 955XS. I tried to do a setting for SD on one of the other video inputs but I did not really get very far with that experiment because I could not figure out how to output more than one video source from the SD 8300 besides the VCR record which we all know looks terrible. The HD looks so good I am loathe to watch the SD stuff anyway. Has anyone had good luck running one monitor setup for HD and another for SD? Thanks again (esp to Dweezilz) for the good info, I'm not surprized the satellite and cable looked pretty much the same.

I don't know why my Sony 42"A10 HD TV tuner locks the signal at 31.3 but whatever direction I rotate my antenna at, channel 8 HD only comes in at that channel setting. I also have tried numerous times to try to lock at 8.1 HD but no luck. Channel 8 HD comes in at the best resolution over any other station. Go figure??Aiming your antenna differently will do nothing to change the PSIP data on WJW. The problem is on WJW's end. Oddly, it affects some ASTC receivers and not others. My E* 921 reads 008-01 for WJW all the time. I did have problems last year with WUAB, which went blank on 043-01. A rescan put it on 028-01, this lasted for a short time and then 043-01 returned "on channel".

I read that Seinfeld is going Syndicated HD on March 27, 2006, and called WJW to see if they'll be able to broadcast Seinfeld re-runs in HD. I spoke with a nice guy in Operations Engineering that said as of now the station has no way of downlinking it in HD whether it's satellite, fiber or a file. Then if they could get it they have no way recording it to their server in HD. Right now their server is SD only, but he does expect to have the ability in the next six months to a year.

It'll eventually happen.

Someone on here quoted an article from a broadcast engineering trade magazine, which interviewed WJW's engineering folks about their future HD plans. It sounded like they were pretty aggressive about it, right down to outfitting SkyFox in HD!

Aiming your antenna differently will do nothing to change the PSIP data on WJW. The problem is on WJW's end. Oddly, it affects some ASTC receivers and not others. My E* 921 reads 008-01 for WJW all the time. I did have problems last year with WUAB, which went blank on 043-01. A rescan put it on 028-01, this lasted for a short time and then 043-01 returned "on channel".

My OTA receiver was picking up WJW-DT's sole channel at 31-2 for about a week or two. I think it's OK now.

Thanks for the information on PQ everyone! It all makes sense to me (except for Hookbill's ext. drive problem, I have one as well and it works just fine and I don't want to jinx it by saying so). I so agree Adelphia SD is terrible, made all the worse I think by my Sony 955XS. .
My SD off Adelphia is outstanding (Panny 44" LCD). What made the biggest difference for me was locking the output of the 8300 to 720p. Of course some channels and some program material is better/worse than others, but overall for what I watch (SCI-FI, BBC America, USA) it looks decent, even when stretched.

Does anyone know locally if you can pick up the HD stations from Adelphia simply by plugging in the cable to an HD tuner (not needing a box to get the 700-series channels then component out to the monitor). Basically, the cable line acts as if it's a big antenna.

Insight cable in Columbus, if you plug the cable into your HDTV tuner you get the OTA signal, bypassing the cable box and compression. I don't know if they remodulate the signals down the line or what, but it's great.
Any thoughts?

I am on Adelphia.
My HDTV has a tuner. It has 2 inputs from cable.
One is direct cable feed.
The other is from the HDTV converter(cable company) box.
The input from strictly cable feed does not see the HDTV channels .
I need to use the HDTV cable box to access HDTV .

I am on Adelphia.
My HDTV has a tuner. It has 2 inputs from cable.
One is direct cable feed.
The other is from the HDTV converter(cable company) box.
The input from strictly cable feed does not see the HDTV channels .
I need to use the HDTV cable box to access HDTV .


Thanks, I won't waste time trying.

Thanks, I won't waste time trying.

HD (and any digital channels on cable for that matter) are transmitted in QAM - Quadrature Amplitute Modulation. Broadcast HD is transmitted in a completely different format - 8VSB (8 bit Vestigial Sideband Modulation). A TV set has to have a QAM tuner in order to receive HD directly off of cable.

The reason for the different formats is stability - 8VSB has a lower throughput rate but is more robust than QAM in the presence of multipath interference. QAM has better throughput and survives well in a cable environment where there's no multipath interference present.

As has been stated here numerous times, the local HDTV channels are "in the clear" on Adelphia, but you need a tuner that handles QAM. If the tuner doesn't do QAM, it won't work.

Somewhere up here, I posted a list of all the "clear" channels on Adelphia's greater Cleveland system. It includes not only all the network affiliates Adelphia carries in HD (everyone but UPN 43), but the Discovery HD channel and the new HD Bonus channel (Cavs, and maybe Indians down the road).

If Adelphia does not carry the station (like WUAB-DT), you won't get it via QAM, and you won't get the OTA signals via the Adelphia cable line...only the HD stations they do carry. The cable line won't "act like a big antenna", as asked above...

Some folks aren't getting the extra channels, so I don't know if that's an issue with their QAM tuner or not. I'm using a Fusion HDTV5USB tuner on my computer.

As has been stated here numerous times, the local HDTV channels are "in the clear" on Adelphia, but you need a tuner that handles QAM. If the tuner doesn't do QAM, it won't work.

Somewhere up here, I posted a list of all the "clear" channels on Adelphia's greater Cleveland system. It includes not only all the network affiliates Adelphia carries in HD (everyone but UPN 43), but the Discovery HD channel and the new HD Bonus channel (Cavs, and maybe Indians down the road).

If Adelphia does not carry the station (like WUAB-DT), you won't get it via QAM, and you won't get the OTA signals via the Adelphia cable line...only the HD stations they do carry. The cable line won't "act like a big antenna", as asked above...

Some folks aren't getting the extra channels, so I don't know if that's an issue with their QAM tuner or not. I'm using a Fusion HDTV5USB tuner on my computer.

Thanks...does that mean the DirecTV box's HD Tuner is a QAM? That's where I first saw it.

I have Aldelphia basic service;all I need is a QAM tuner and I can obtain HD from them?
If so, where can I gt QAM tuner and what is cost?
I have HD from DTV ,but have 1 HD ready tv on cable
thanks for help

Official AVS HDTV STB Synopsis
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=179095

I have Aldelphia basic service;all I need is a QAM tuner and I can obtain HD from them?
If so, where can I gt QAM tuner and what is cost?
I have HD from DTV ,but have 1 HD ready tv on cable
thanks for help

Yes. Look for the DCR logo (Digital Cable ready) on TV sets and external tuners. The DCR logo means that the device has been certified as being compatible with the cable industry's QAM channels. You can use this device to pick up any in-the-clear HD channels such as the broadcast-basic HD channels.

Thanks...does that mean the DirecTV box's HD Tuner is a QAM? That's where I first saw it.
Direc TV and Dish Netwotk HD STB's are ASTC tuners only - no QAM. So you would need an off-air antenna to use these to get the local stations in HD.

I believe there are some stand alond STB's that may include QAM, however I don't know of any brands or models. Radio Shack had a close out on one STB that they said was "cable ready" however it did not have QAM (hence the close-out). In the analog world all "cable ready" meant was the ability to tune to the "mid-band" channels ("super-band" cable channels are the same frequencies as UHF, just numbered differently). Radio Shack tried to pass off this STB as cable ready probably because it could tune to the mid-band, however it was ASTC only, so in realilty it was only good for OTA.

Thanks for the link ajstan99, I will check it out and should have known about that link, I appreciate you posting it!

I believe there are some stand alond STB's that may include QAM, however I don't know of any brands or models.


I think the LG 4200 and 3410 do QAM and ATSC both.

http://us.lge.com/

SportsTime Ohio's HD Cleveland Indians games will indeed be shown on Adelphia's "HD Bonus" channel 798. It's now listed on the pull-down menu, under Adelphia, on the STO site.

There also appears to be a digital cable (non-HD) simulcast of STO on 179.

I think the LG 4200 and 3410 do QAM and ATSC both.

http://us.lge.com/

The 3510, an HD tuner / upscaling DVD player, also does QAM. However, it only has 1 antenna input, so you must swap the cable and rescan in the setup to switch between QAM and ATSC.

SportsTime Ohio's HD Cleveland Indians games will indeed be shown on Adelphia's "HD Bonus" channel 798. It's now listed on the pull-down menu, under Adelphia, on the STO site.

There also appears to be a digital cable (non-HD) simulcast of STO on 179.

Thanks for that info. I hope Adelphia starts listing the games on their IPG. If they do it like they are doing the Cavs then you will have to do a manual record if you want a recording.

Thanks for that info. I hope Adelphia starts listing the games on their IPG. If they do it like they are doing the Cavs then you will have to do a manual record if you want a recording.

Well, they're getting the data somewhere for the IPG - the 179 STO digital cable channel does have the program guide information. I suspect 798 will eventually have the info, as well.

Winner would definitely be cable if all I cared about was HD (other than the fact that I have an antenna for HD locals); however if you watch any SD (e.g., Fox News, or CNN) digital SD from D* beats the hell out of analog SD from most cable companies. That difference is significantly more than the difference between HD sources. That's why I use both D* and OTA. Not to mention that the HD Tivo works with only those two sources.

I'd agree with this - I have D* and Wide Open West, and WOW cable HD PQ is superior to D* HD. WOW cable HD PQ is identical to OTA HD PQ on the locals. On the other hand, all of WOW's low end channels (approx 1 - 83) are analog and the PQ on those SD channels are inferior to D*. So like rlb says, it depends if you're more of an HD lover or an SD lover. Always a compromise, it seems.

Thanks for the link ajstan99, I will check it out and should have known about that link, I appreciate you posting it!

You're most welcome. I didn't know about it either until I stumbled upon a reference to it in some other thread I was scanning.

Inundated's posts have me thinking about getting a QAM tuner and switching back to Adelphia (can't believe I'm saying that). Free Indians, Cavs, PBS, and Discovery in HD may be too good to pass up. I currently have WOW basic (good people and good service) but they don't provide anything via QAM that I can't get OTA.

Inundated's posts have me thinking about getting a QAM tuner and switching back to Adelphia (can't believe I'm saying that). Free Indians, Cavs, PBS, and Discovery in HD may be too good to pass up. I currently have WOW basic (good people and good service) but they don't provide anything via QAM that I can't get OTA.

The only thing I wonder - will TWC keep things the same way when they take over? I think it'd probably be a while before they change lineups, but I wonder if they have the STO and FSN HD feeds in the clear on QAM. (They have to, by law, have the OTA network affiliates' HD feeds in clear QAM.)

I don't know anyone with a QAM tuner on TWC NEO, so I don't know what they have in the clear right now. I'm surprised that Discovery HD is considered Broadcast Basic for Adelphia, and thus in the clear.

The only thing I wonder - will TWC keep things the same way when they take over? I think it'd probably be a while before they change lineups, but I wonder if they have the STO and FSN HD feeds in the clear on QAM. (They have to, by law, have the OTA network affiliates' HD feeds in clear QAM.)

I don't know anyone with a QAM tuner on TWC NEO, so I don't know what they have in the clear right now. I'm surprised that Discovery HD is considered Broadcast Basic for Adelphia, and thus in the clear.

If I recall Adelphia just recently made Discovery available to basic HD subscribers.

I just can't see any changes. It's not feasible. I think TW is going to run with what they pick up, not do an overhaul.

When they buy Adelphia they absorb their assets as well as debts. Why take on a bankrupt company's debt and then tear down their assets? It doesn't make sense.

Sportstime Ohio on Adelphia question -
I was at a friends house with Adelphia (Shaker Heights) and checking his channel lineup, looking for the Sportstime Ohio channel. IIRC there was a channel "SPTOH" or similar on channel 179(?). According to the Sportstime Ohio website, they say it will be on Channel 17. Just want to make sure my friend won't require a digital cable box on every TV in the house in order to watch the Indians on Adelphia.

I haven't looked at Adelphia in a long time, but boy, Adelphia has really stepped up to the plate on the HD lineup. I'm not seeing much of a reason to stay with WOW. Adelphia has HDNet and INHD (WOW doesn't have INHD). Adelphia also has ESPN2HD ...and they have the SA8300HD which reportedly provides better resolution than the SA8000HD that WOW provides. I think if April comes and no Indians on WOW, it's an easy choice for me to switch. Hmmmm.....

When they buy Adelphia they absorb their assets as well as debts. Why take on a bankrupt company's debt and then tear down their assets? It doesn't make sense.

It's not a matter of assets in this case, it's lineups.

I do agree that TWC will, assuming it's possible, hold onto channels that Adelphia has rights for that they don't (ESPN2?) in former Adelphia areas. I also agree that they're probably not going to wipe out the former Adelphia lineups on day one.

I just wonder about TWC's general policy regarding what channels get placed where, and what gets fed via QAM in the clear, that's all...

Sportstime Ohio on Adelphia question -
I was at a friends house with Adelphia (Shaker Heights) and checking his channel lineup, looking for the Sportstime Ohio channel. IIRC there was a channel "SPTOH" or similar on channel 179(?). According to the Sportstime Ohio website, they say it will be on Channel 17. Just want to make sure my friend won't require a digital cable box on every TV in the house in order to watch the Indians on Adelphia.

I noticed that as well.

I believe the general intent for STO is to distribute the product as widely as possible. On pretty much every system so far, STO is in at very least the Expanded Basic lineup, and on Adelphia and TWC, it's even in the "lifeline" basic lineup (17 and 23).

I would not expect the games to only be on 179...it would appear to be a digital simulcast channel from here. And the games that Adelphia has already run were on 17.

I just wonder about TWC's general policy regarding what channels get placed where, and what gets fed via QAM in the clear, that's all...

Generally TWC will only transmit the locals in the clear, but there are some reports of outliers in several TWC divisions (HBO-SD, Starz-SD, UniversalHD (when we had it), etc).

I noticed that as well.

I believe the general intent for STO is to distribute the product as widely as possible. On pretty much every system so far, STO is in at very least the Expanded Basic lineup, and on Adelphia and TWC, it's even in the "lifeline" basic lineup (17 and 23).

I would not expect the games to only be on 179...it would appear to be a digital simulcast channel from here. And the games that Adelphia has already run were on 17.

Maybe. I don't trust Adelphia. They nickle and dime you any way they can.

Think about it. They get you in as a feebie and then say "Oh, now that you've enjoyed our free "trial" see more of the Tribe on STO on digital channel 179." And then they drop the analog feed.

STO probably has it in their contract for it to be widely available so it probably won't go down that way. Still, this is Adelphia we are talking about. :rolleyes:

Actually I've been getting both the HD bonus channel and channel 17 with my cheapo Adelphia broadcast basic package, which actually makes it more economical than when the Indians were on Fox Sports Net.

It will be interesting to see if Dish signs this week, although I doubt that they'll pick up the HD broadcasts (I don't know that they do any regional HD networks).

No Dish or DirecTV for STO yet, but you WOW folks are now onboard:

http://cleveland.indians.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20060327&content_id=1364164&vkey=pr_cle&fext=.jsp&c_id=cle

Also, Clear Picture/Massillon Cable, and tiny GLW Broadband out in Grafton...

Praise the Lord! They've moved EWTN and the nun lady so I can watch baseball.

I see my threats to cancel WOW and go with Adelphia worked :D

Praise the Lord! They've moved EWTN and the nun lady so I can watch baseball.

You can make up for it by praying for Indians wins. :D

Looks like you get it in HD too. I wonder if the systems that don't have an HD channel listed will do so...

If I recall Adelphia just recently made Discovery available to basic HD subscribers.

I have a Toshiba 62HM195 which has a QAM tuner. The weird thing is, I can get (without a cable box) only two HD channels: 776 (Discovery HD) and 798 (the "bonus" channel that the Cavs are on). I can't get the locals which is what I'd want the most (especially when considering a possible second HD set in my household.)

The cable tech was at my house this weekend for another issue and was totally confused when I asked about these channels. He sounded like "it works for some people, not for others" (regarding the local HD channels), which sounds to me like he didn't know the first thing about my question.

(He actually suggested I try, for example 3-2 or 3-5 for the HD channel for NBC--that doesn't work.)

I have a Toshiba 62HM195 which has a QAM tuner. The weird thing is, I can get (without a cable box) only two HD channels: 776 (Discovery HD) and 798 (the "bonus" channel that the Cavs are on). I can't get the locals which is what I'd want the most (especially when considering a possible second HD set in my household.)


HAve you tried re-scanning for available channels? Maybe the set didn't pick up those QAMs on the first try.

Pucky,
You might have a weak signal coming in - try running the cable direct from the cable feed into the house right to the set without any taps in between, then re-scan. You could also try adding an amplifier in the line.

I had flaky problems with some QAM channels coming in and others not coming in until I added an amplifier to the line and cleaned up some extra taps (splitters) on the cable.

Sportstime Ohio on Adelphia question -
I haven't looked at Adelphia in a long time, but boy, Adelphia has really stepped up to the plate on the HD lineup. I'm not seeing much of a reason to stay with WOW. Adelphia has HDNet and INHD (WOW doesn't have INHD). Adelphia also has ESPN2HD ...and they have the SA8300HD which reportedly provides better resolution than the SA8000HD that WOW provides. I think if April comes and no Indians on WOW, it's an easy choice for me to switch. Hmmmm.....

WOW has recently added TNT-HD, FSNOH-HD, and now SportsTime Ohio-HD all within a few months so it looks like WOW is starting to remember they provide HD service. The SA8300HD is available from WOW, I know a few people that have the box. They pretty much install what they have in stock, so we as customers are limited to what they give us. But you might be able to go to the local office and see if you can do a swap, some people have gotten the 8300 without a problem.

I am using Adelphia with a PC-card tuner (pchdtv) and getting many QAM channels, but not all. I am in the Copley area (north/west of Akron) if that matters.

Here is what I am currently receiving (which doesn't exactly match what others have reported in the past...):

Channel C84: (SD version of local networks) [frequency 585000000]
WKYC
WOIO
WEWS
WUAB
WJW
Channel C86: [frequency 597000000]
DSCHD (or DHD) -- Discovery HD
Channel C88: [frequency 609000000]
HDBON
Channel C103: [frequency 669000000]
WTHR+ (weather channel associated with WKYC)
Channel C104: [frequency 675000000]
WKYCDT
Channel C113: [frequency 729000000]
WOIODT
WVIZDT


I have tried several different ways to find WEWSDT and WJWDT but can't locate them. Does anyone know what QAM Channel they should be on? It does appear that Adelphia has done some re-orging of the QAM channels since the last time I tried this. At that point (maybe 3 months or so ago at least), I think the weather and WKYCDT were on the same channel, for instance. Anyhow, can anyone confirm that they are currently receiving WEWSDT and WJWDT from Adelphia via QAM and report back on the QAM channel? Also, please confirm that the rest of the lineup above matches what you get?

Thanks.

WOW has recently added TNT-HD, FSNOH-HD, and now SportsTime Ohio-HD all within a few months so it looks like WOW is starting to remember they provide HD service. The SA8300HD is available from WOW, I know a few people that have the box. They pretty much install what they have in stock, so we as customers are limited to what they give us. But you might be able to go to the local office and see if you can do a swap, some people have gotten the 8300 without a problem.

I keep forgetting that they have a local office. They don't make that public knowledge the way Adelphia does...

IIRC, Adelphia has, but WOW is still missing:
PBSHD
ESPN2HD
InHD
ShoHD

I keep forgetting that they have a local office. They don't make that public knowledge the way Adelphia does...

IIRC, Adelphia has, but WOW is still missing:
PBSHD
ESPN2HD
InHD
ShoHD

Also INHD2 :)

Does WOW also give the NFL Network in HD? Not that it matters much, nothing is ever in HD on that station anyway.

Yeah, WOW has NFL Network. Here's the list:

High Definition Television
200 ABCHD
201 CBSHD
202 FOXHD
203 NBCHD
204 WUAB DT
410 HBO HD*
471 MAX HD*
493 STARZ HD*
*Must subscribe to premium
service to receive

HD Pak
(available a la carte)
209 TNT HD
210 Discovery HD Theater
211 ESPN HD
212 HDNet
213 HDNet Movies
214 Wealth TV HD
215 NFL Network HD

My edits - add:
220 FSNOH HD - "Cavaliers" channel
221 SPTOH HD - "Indians" channel

(edit: added channel numbers for the last two)

SPTOH HD on WOW will be channel 221.

Davidshay:

Try 105-1 wews

105-2 wjw

I'm on the same branch of the Adelphia system as davidshay is, and I'll confirm that WEWS and WJW are on QAM channel 105. I get them with no problem on my Fusion HDTV5USB tuner.

One oddity - the Fusion tuner returns channel "1051-2" for WJW-DT, where it properly returns 05-1 for WEWS-DT. Maybe there's problem with Adelphia's PSIP use on 105? Anyway, the Fusion doesn't seem to care...and displays both channels just fine.

Davidshay:

My lineup is slightly different. I am getting WVIZ, for a total of 6 SD channels, on 84.

Discovery HD is nowhere to be found, but I am getting something called LOGO on 90-13.

As others have posted, 105-5 and 105-8 are the HD feeds for WEWS and WJW respectively.

I am also getting the music only channels on 80 and 93.

For those who asked - SportsTime Ohio is indeed still on Adelphia 17 for today's game, and is simulcasting on digital (SD) cable 179. They're not on HD 798 today, but STO isn't doing any spring training games in HD.

What channel is that in the Macedonia (Twinsburg) area? 17 is MTV here.

BTW, don't forget that the Cavs game is on STO 798 tonight!

What channel is that in the Macedonia (Twinsburg) area? 17 is MTV here.

They said channel 97 in the launch PR, but I think someone here said it may be on 71. Try both. :D

BTW, don't forget that the Cavs game is on STO 798 tonight!

:up:

And BTW, when STO starts doing HD Indians games, those will be on 798 as well, even up there...

Yep, it's 97! thanks! Can't wait to see how the Cavs broadcast looks tonight. Will scheduled recording work on that channel? As it turns out I have a meeting from 7 - 8.

Yep, it's 97! thanks! Can't wait to see how the Cavs broadcast looks tonight. Will scheduled recording work on that channel? As it turns out I have a meeting from 7 - 8.

I don't think it's in the program guide, which is odd, because it was the first night. It just says "HD Bonus".

They block it into 4 hour blocks, so you can pretty much just record "HD Bonus" from 6-10 PM and likely get the whole game...(unless it runs over :D)

Of course, you will have to fast forward past a half-hour or so, and then pregame...

I've been trying to see if the digital version (SD) of SportsTime Ohio is in the clear QAM wise, like WeatherPlus, etc... and it apparently is not. Or, at least, they aren't attaching PSIP data to it...

Anyone get this to work? QAM TV tuner or PC QAM tuner, please...I know the digital cable box version works on 179. :D

I'm watching on 179, picture is much cleaner then on 17.

Hey guys. Those of you with the SA 8300 may want to keep an eye on your recordings for next week. I spotted some discrepencies in the guide and when they are set to record. Just take a look over your "to be recorded" list for next week.

If I recall correctly I had the samed problem last year during the time switch. Make your recording adjustments as needed. Better safe then sorry.

I'm watching on 179, picture is much cleaner then on 17.

Sound was clearer, too. I was getting an S-lisp on 17, but not on 179.

I wish I could get 179 on my QAM USB tuner...the analog 17 on the tuner looks awful, and even snowier on a regular TV...

Well guys, I noticed SBC installed this big new box in my neighborhood a couple weeks ago, I posted pictures of it on the DSLReports.com SBC forum, and word has it that it's a box to facilitate AT&T's new "Project Lightspeed" IPTV service. You can see my pix and feedback here:

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15784021

So who knows, by the end of the year, AT&T will throw another wrench in the Adelphia vs. WOW vs. Satellite debate!

I'll have to start looking to see if there are any of those in the neighborhood...

I doubt I'll see any of that. I live in Alltel land. They are stuck in the 80's. :rolleyes:

It would be great if cable and phone companies truly competed. Then everyone would get much better services. I'd love being in that area where you can have either WOW or Adelphia. I'd be playing them off each other weekly. :)

From www.dishchannelchart.com

"3/29/06

Channel 431 Sports Time Ohio moved from tp 24 at 110° to tp 18 at 119°. It is still not available to subscribers. (ANON)"


At this point, I just want it on. I'll get my HD fix off of the OTA broadcasts.

Interesting that they are uplinking and moving it around. If there was no interest by Dish, would they even bother?

From www.dishchannelchart.com

"3/29/06

Channel 431 Sports Time Ohio moved from tp 24 at 110° to tp 18 at 119°. It is still not available to subscribers. (ANON)"


At this point, I just want it on. I'll get my HD fix off of the OTA broadcasts.

Interesting that they are uplinking and moving it around. If there was no interest by Dish, would they even bother?Thanks for the heads-up. I hope E* is close to an agreement on STO.

It makes sense to have STO on 119 since FSN Ohio is on 119. There may still be some Top-120 subs with a Dish 300 aimed at 119 only.

From www.dishchannelchart.com

Interesting that they are uplinking and moving it around. If there was no interest by Dish, would they even bother?

Because they want to mess with your MIND!!!! :D :D

I sympathize, really. That would bug the heck out of me. ;)

i heard this update on the radio today:

all major cable subscribers should have access to STO. only 20-30,000 cable subscribers in the Cleveland market will be able to watch STO.

Dish Network is 70% of the way to signing an agreement.

DirecTV does not look as good, but that doesnt mean it looks bad.

i heard this update on the radio today:

all major cable subscribers should have access to STO. only 20-30,000 cable subscribers in the Cleveland market will be able to watch STO.

Um, you mean "not" be able to watch. :D


Dish Network is 70% of the way to signing an agreement.

DirecTV does not look as good, but that doesnt mean it looks bad.

Where did you hear this, by the way? And what does "70% of the way" mean? ;)

I do expect DirecTV to sign up. Aside from the ongoing behind the scenes satellite activity, I'm surprised that Dish seems to be headed towards signing up.

STO has locked up all of the big cable providers in Northern Ohio, with Armstrong now agreeing to carry the network.

http://ohiomedia.blogspot.com/2006/03/and-final-major-system-for-sportstime.html

But maybe the most interesting item here - a copy of an advertisement by Time Warner Cable in the Beacon Journal today, with big letters stating: "INDIANS IN HD NOT AVAILABLE ON SATELLITE".

Does this mean that STO's 63 HD games won't be available to DirecTV and/or Dish Network whenever they manage to agree to carry the network? Hmm.

That is correct, unless they choose to show selected games on their HD events channels. At this point, the satellite companies don't show ANY HD programming from regional sports networks, except some games from the Extra Innings package.

Dish at least has stated in the past that they want to offer the HD RSN programming, but they're working on getting HD locals up, so it's unlikely that any other HD programming will appear for awhile.

That is correct, unless they choose to show selected games on their HD events channels. At this point, the satellite companies don't show ANY HD programming from regional sports networks, except some games from the Extra Innings package.

Doesn't DirecTV have a couple of HD RSNs? I seem to recall seeing something in the HDTV Programming section about YES in HD (the Yankees' RSN)...

I know there aren't a lot of 'em, though.

You may be right. I don't know much about DireccTV since I'm a Dish subscriber.

At this point, I'll be keeping my cheap Adelphia package even if Dish signs with STO so that I can get the HD games on STO, since the package is less than $20 per month, including the 8300 DVR, and includes the HD locals. Dish will be offering HD locals for Cleveland later this year (probably), but HD Indians broadcasts are important to me.

A forum on scout.com was reporting that yesterday's Indians/Tigers replay was showing up on ESPN alt channel 145 and some reporting the same on 431. A Canadian Dish viewer with a "hacked" card (the only way cunucks can get satellite) verified this.

Of course, this is coming second/third hand and not directly from my eyes viewing a game but it is more info leaning towards Dish carrying the Tribe.

Bastages are probably teasing us only to pull the rug out before Tuesday.

I guess a good test will be to see if today's 7:00pm rebroadcast shows up on either.

Here's your final SportsTime Ohio release on the cable situation:

http://cleveland.indians.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20060331&content_id=1376258&vkey=pr_cle&fext=.jsp&c_id=cle

It has a list of channels at the bottom, including new HD channel listings for some services that were not listing them before. Comcast is listed as an HD carrier, for example, though they don't have a channel yet.

And it lists Adelphia 179, which we spotted here. It will be an SD digital simulcast of STO, and 17 will still carry games in analog (and 798 in HD).

No mention of DirecTV or Dish Network, though they're kind of hinting at it in noting that there's a "strong possibility" of other agreements before Opening Day...

And then there was one - SportsTime Ohio and Dish Network have signed a deal:

http://www.wkyc.com/sports/sports_article.aspx?storyid=50230

Nothing on DirecTV - yet...

It sounds like DirecTV is populating the guide on channel 657 with SportsTime Ohio programming. Keep your fingers crossed if you're hoping to see STO on D*!

And then there was one - SportsTime Ohio and Dish Network have signed a deal:

http://www.wkyc.com/sports/sports_article.aspx?storyid=50230

Nothing on DirecTV - yet...
This was announced last night on WEWS 11:00 PM sports report.

This was announced last night on WEWS 11:00 PM sports report.

"This" being Dish or DirecTV?

"This" being Dish or DirecTV?

WKYC had it on the morning news. I rushed to the computer to announce it but Innundated was already on top of it. :)

It being Dish.

WKYC had it on the morning news. I rushed to the computer to announce it but Inundated was already on top of it. :)

It being Dish.

I've corrected your typo :D

As noted, DirecTV has been putting STO in the programming guide on channel 657, so maybe there'll be a deal announced there on Monday.

A forum on scout.com was reporting that yesterday's Indians/Tigers replay was showing up on ESPN alt channel 145 and some reporting the same on 431. A Canadian Dish viewer with a "hacked" card (the only way cunucks can get satellite) verified this.

Of course, this is coming second/third hand and not directly from my eyes viewing a game but it is more info leaning towards Dish carrying the Tribe.

Bastages are probably teasing us only to pull the rug out before Tuesday.

I guess a good test will be to see if today's 7:00pm rebroadcast shows up on either.
Please don't say that "A Canadian Dish viewer with a "hacked" card (the only way cunucks sic can get satellite)". Canadians have Bell ExpressVue and Star Choice available to them on sattelite. If they had to get U.S. satellite there is the "Grey Market" where an address broker uses a valid U.S. address to activate an account for Canadians (there is also a "Gray Market" for U.S. residents to get Bell Express Vue and Star Choice). The difference between the Grey/Gray market and hacking is with the grey/gray market the satellite providers get paid while hacking is stealing an encrypted signal.

Hacking is a criminal offense, no matter which side of the border your are on. The RCMP has been cracking down hard on the hackers.

Hacking is frowned upon on all the legit discussion boards. There is absolutely no justification for hacking. With the Grey market a payment is made to E* and/or D*, the DBS providers get a sub, they just don't know the true location of the receiver. Hacking otoh is stealing. The only one getting money are the pirates who hack boxes for stealing signals.

Please don't say that "A Canadian Dish viewer with a "hacked" card (the only way cunucks can get satellite)". Canadians have Bell ExpressVue and Star Choice available to them on sattelite. If they had to get U.S. satellite there is the "Grey Market" where an address broker uses a valid U.S. address to activate an account for Canadians (there is also a "Gray Market" for U.S. residents to get Bell Express Vue and Star Choice). The difference between the Grey/Gray market and hacking is with the grey/gray market the satellite providers get paid while hacking is stealing an encrypted signal.

Hacking is a criminal offense, no matter which side of the border your are on. The RCMP has been cracking down hard on the hackers.

Hacking is frowned upon on all the legit discussion boards. There is absolutely no justification for hacking. With the Grey market a payment is made to E* and/or D*, the DBS providers get a sub, they just don't know the true location of the receiver. Hacking otoh is stealing. The only one getting money are the pirates who hack boxes for stealing signals.

Not that I want to get politically correct, I've heard this term all my life because I'm French Canadian but is "Canuck" an appropriate word?

Being that Vancouver's hockey is call The Canucks, I'm guessing it's not deemed offensive generally speaking, especially if used by a Canadian. If it was insulting, then they are being rude to themselves. ;)

It's actually deemed a patriotic term in Canada according to the Wikipedia listing, however, it says that it can be misunderstood & deemed an insult to the heritage if an outsider says it. I'm guessing it would be if used sarcastically.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canuck

I'm on the same branch of the Adelphia system as davidshay is, and I'll confirm that WEWS and WJW are on QAM channel 105. I get them with no problem on my Fusion HDTV5USB tuner.

One oddity - the Fusion tuner returns channel "1051-2" for WJW-DT, where it properly returns 05-1 for WEWS-DT. Maybe there's problem with Adelphia's PSIP use on 105? Anyway, the Fusion doesn't seem to care...and displays both channels just fine.

Argh. I tested some more and I don't even get a lock on 105, much less PSIP data. I also just got the same tuner you have and it ALSO doesn't get a lock or see anything on 105.

Any chance of getting any support from Adelphia on this? Any hints on how to phrase the question?