It was probably the ice. My D* signal went flaky then out completely about the same time last night. I went outside with my 10 foot stick and tapped the dish to knock the ice off and the signal came right back.

I've seen some spray sold on the internet that coats the dish (with silicone I guess) supposedly keeps the ice from sticking. I also vaguely remember seeing dish heaters somewhere. I think I've also seen a fabric cover type deal to keep the dish clean.

LOL. My D* signal went out last night too! My first thought was to run outside with my extension deck broom and knock the ice off, but then I started thinking about how I might whack it out of alignment, so I came back inside. My neighbors probably thought I was nuts, standing on my deck railing and reaching towards the roof with a broom in the freezing rain! :D This type of signal fade is very unusual for me, but then again, so has been the weather the last few weeks....

By the looks of it last night, 2 of my LNB's had a massive frozen glob of ice covering them! Hopefully they thawed out today. My wife was pissed that she couldn't see the Westminster on USA-HD last night.....

By Ted Hearn -- Multichannel News, 2/12/2008 9:34:00 AM


Washington – Federal Communications Commission chairman Kevin Martin might be retreating from his plan dealing with the carriage of local TV signals by satellite carriers DirecTV and Dish Network in early 2009 after the digital TV transition.
Martin’s new approach was contained in prepared House testimony he is planning to deliver Wednesday before the Telecommunications and the Internet Subcommittee. A copy of Martin’s testimony was obtained by Multichannel News on Tuesday.
Last Friday, Martin described his plan as a strict non-discrimination rule, which would ban DirecTV and EchoStar from carrying some local TV stations in high-definition but not others in HD.
The two satellite giants could depart from this standard, he said, but only with an FCC waiver based upon a showing of limited channel capacity. Martin's rule would take effect after the national shut off of analog TV signals on Feb. 17, 2009.
In his House testimony, Martin made no mention of his HD-parity proposal. Instead, he simply referred to a straightforward carry one, can all regime for digital signals, just like the one that exists for analog signals today.
The FCC is expected to vote on Martin’s DBS carriage rule on Feb. 26.
“Currently, the law requires that when a satellite operator chooses to carry any local broadcast signals, it must carry all full power local broadcast signals in that market. The pending item clarifies that, in such a `local-into local’ market, where a full power television station is broadcasting only in digital, it is the digital signal that the satellite operator carries. This clarification is critical to ensuring that satellite customers, like cable customers, will continue to receive the same broadcast stations they saw the day before the transition on the day after
the transition,” Martin’s prepared remarks said.
Martin's testimony suggested that DBS didn’t have to deliver any local signal in HD and he appeared to leave the door wide open for downconversion of some HD signals to standard definition.
Last week, Martin described his proposal differently.
“What we said is that you have to carry them in a nondiscriminatory way, but if you are under capacity constraints, then you can come back to the commission and explain why you can’t carry them all in high definition, for example, or you can carry them in standard definition but only some in high definition because you still don’t have enough capacity,” Martin told reporters.
An FCC rule mandating satellite HD parity for local TV stations would result in duplicative carriage burdens. DirecTV, for example, would not be able to carry a local TV signal only in HD because the signal wouldn’t be viewable in homes that didn’t have HD set-top boxes. DirecTV would need to carry the signal both in HD and standard definition.
Unlike cable operators, DirecTV and Dish Network have the option of not carrying local TV signals at all. DirecTV is developing a set-top box that can terrestrially receive DTV signals

It was probably the ice. My D* signal went flaky then out completely about the same time last night. I went outside with my 10 foot stick and tapped the dish to knock the ice off and the signal came right back.

I've seen some spray sold on the internet that coats the dish (with silicone I guess) supposedly keeps the ice from sticking. I also vaguely remember seeing dish heaters somewhere. I think I've also seen a fabric cover type deal to keep the dish clean.

We used to use PAM cooking spray on our 5 meter dishes... works pretty well.

By Ted Hearn -- Multichannel News, 2/12/2008 9:34:00 AM


Washington – Federal Communications Commission chairman Kevin Martin might be retreating from his plan dealing with the carriage of local TV signals by satellite carriers DirecTV and Dish Network in early 2009 after the digital TV transition.
Martin’s new approach was contained in prepared House testimony he is planning to deliver Wednesday before the Telecommunications and the Internet Subcommittee. A copy of Martin’s testimony was obtained by Multichannel News on Tuesday.
Last Friday, Martin described his plan as a strict non-discrimination rule, which would ban DirecTV and EchoStar from carrying some local TV stations in high-definition but not others in HD.
The two satellite giants could depart from this standard, he said, but only with an FCC waiver based upon a showing of limited channel capacity. Martin's rule would take effect after the national shut off of analog TV signals on Feb. 17, 2009.
In his House testimony, Martin made no mention of his HD-parity proposal. Instead, he simply referred to a straightforward carry one, can all regime for digital signals, just like the one that exists for analog signals today.
The FCC is expected to vote on Martin’s DBS carriage rule on Feb. 26.
“Currently, the law requires that when a satellite operator chooses to carry any local broadcast signals, it must carry all full power local broadcast signals in that market. The pending item clarifies that, in such a `local-into local’ market, where a full power television station is broadcasting only in digital, it is the digital signal that the satellite operator carries. This clarification is critical to ensuring that satellite customers, like cable customers, will continue to receive the same broadcast stations they saw the day before the transition on the day after
the transition,” Martin’s prepared remarks said.
Martin's testimony suggested that DBS didn’t have to deliver any local signal in HD and he appeared to leave the door wide open for downconversion of some HD signals to standard definition.
Last week, Martin described his proposal differently.
“What we said is that you have to carry them in a nondiscriminatory way, but if you are under capacity constraints, then you can come back to the commission and explain why you can’t carry them all in high definition, for example, or you can carry them in standard definition but only some in high definition because you still don’t have enough capacity,” Martin told reporters.
An FCC rule mandating satellite HD parity for local TV stations would result in duplicative carriage burdens. DirecTV, for example, would not be able to carry a local TV signal only in HD because the signal wouldn’t be viewable in homes that didn’t have HD set-top boxes. DirecTV would need to carry the signal both in HD and standard definition.
Unlike cable operators, DirecTV and Dish Network have the option of not carrying local TV signals at all. DirecTV is developing a set-top box that can terrestrially receive DTV signals

Ummm....

D* DOES carry both the SD locals where the HD locals are also available. The same applies to E*. (In Cleveland, E* currently just offers SD locals. They do not have HD locals yet).

Ummm....

D* DOES carry both the SD locals where the HD locals are also available. The same applies to E*. (In Cleveland, E* currently just offers SD locals. They do not have HD locals yet).

Yeah, and anyway there is an unwritten rule around here. When you post something, provide a link.

By Ted Hearn -- Multichannel News, 2/12/2008 9:34:00 AM

I have no idea who they are.

I tried to post the link but it's not working.

I tried to post the link but it's not working.

So your saying you know these people and his statement is correct?

Your word is as good as a link for me and no offense was meant to clevemkt but like HD MM says D* is already carrying both and E* is carrying the local channels.

So what's all the fuss?

So your saying you know these people and his statement is correct?

Your word is as good as a link for me and no offense was meant to clevemkt but like HD MM says D* is already carrying both and E* is carrying the local channels.

So what's all the fuss?

I'm still trying to understand what the fuss is about???? The practice of carrying both the SD and HD (where available) has always been in place by DBS providers. This sounds to me that people are getting confused by the difference between HD and digital again. Both the HD and SD local feeds through satellite are already digital. So once the analog shutoff comes around, from my understanding this has no impact on satellite.

I don't know if this has been posted but D* users can now schedule recordings on their DVRs from the D* website. For example, if you are at work and realize you forgot to set your DVR to record a show you can signon to your account on the D* website, pull up the online channel guide, select a show and tell it to program your DVR to schedule the recording. I tried it and it works great.

Unfortunately, my dish is high on top of the garage, so there's no way for me to get up there. The signal went flaky around 7:00 and was back at 8:45. It didn't wipe out all channels, so I was able to watch the SD locals as well as some OTA.

It was probably the ice. My D* signal went flaky then out completely about the same time last night. I went outside with my 10 foot stick and tapped the dish to knock the ice off and the signal came right back.

I've seen some spray sold on the internet that coats the dish (with silicone I guess) supposedly keeps the ice from sticking. I also vaguely remember seeing dish heaters somewhere. I think I've also seen a fabric cover type deal to keep the dish clean.

I don't know if this has been posted but D* users can now schedule recordings on their DVRs from the D* website. For example, if you are at work and realize you forgot to set your DVR to record a show you can signon to your account on the D* website, pull up the online channel guide, select a show and tell it to program your DVR to schedule the recording. I tried it and it works great.

Yup. It was posted: here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12871185&postcount=11241) and here. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12875969&postcount=11248)

I've taken advantage of this feature at least 6-7 times already. Typically when I learn of an upcoming program that interests me, I'm usually on the computer, so this is super convenient for me. If I waited till I was at home or in front of the TV to set the recording, chances are I would forget about it and miss out. This is truly a great feature.

And as Hook has also mentioned in the past, TiVo has had this feature for quite some time through their site or the Zap2it.com site.

One of the tricky things about amplifiers is that they can be driven into nonlinear operation on strong channels, causing distortion that can wipe out a digital channel. Those distortions can easily splatter across other frequencies, taking out more than the strong channels that caused the clipping in the first place.

Be especially wary of amps with crummy, intermittent gain pots. I've struggled with many amps from RS that would go absolutely banannas from just touching the gain pot. Getting the pot adjusted to the correct gain was an exercise in futility, and I usually wound up having to settle for a setting that was almost good enough. :rolleyes:

TY all for your input! :) Thing is that where I am there is no such thing as a "strong" channel in my area, so there is really no overloading or gain problems, more or less I've had the gain turned completely up on these type of amps that yielded the best results. I did have a similar problem upon moving back here from out west I had to remove the FM amp from the car because of distortion/images on FM especially on the 271 corridor.

Nevertheless, I'll likely be upgrading 2 sets with these new converter boxes, as I'll also be inheriting a 5 year old 32" Sony Trinitron..... yeah, much rather have new, but if it's not broke why fix it? I have no intentions of ever going to Cable, D* or E*. Likely I'll be doing some side by side tests with the converter boxes as they become available, I don't know just how much they can change within the upcoming year &/or if newer features will be available on them.

Waht's going on with "American Idol" right now?? Color bars for three minutes followed by freezing/pixelation.

I don't watch this but had the first 5 minutes on & was doing the same in analog OTA.. Fox 8 Logo for about 3 minutes followed by freezing & pixilization.

Yeah, and anyway there is an unwritten rule around here. When you post something, provide a link.

By Ted Hearn -- Multichannel News, 2/12/2008 9:34:00 AM

I have no idea who they are.

Fair enough. I am having the same issue Bob is having. (From NAB Daily Briefing... that's the National Association of Broadcasters)... but here's Multichannel News' site: http://www.multichannel.com/ Good source.

FWIW, I have worked in local television since 1967. NAB Member and member of Chapter 70, SBE (Society of Broadcast Engineers), NATAS, have been a General Manager of a local TV station, taught at the U of A, etc.

TY all for your input! :) Thing is that where I am there is no such thing as a "strong" channel in my area, so there is really no overloading or gain problems, more or less I've had the gain turned completely up on these type of amps that yielded the best results. I did have a similar problem upon moving back here from out west I had to remove the FM amp from the car because of distortion/images on FM especially on the 271 corridor.

Nevertheless, I'll likely be upgrading 2 sets with these new converter boxes, as I'll also be inheriting a 5 year old 32" Sony Trinitron..... yeah, much rather have new, but if it's not broke why fix it? I have no intentions of ever going to Cable, D* or E*. Likely I'll be doing some side by side tests with the converter boxes as they become available, I don't know just how much they can change within the upcoming year &/or if newer features will be available on them.
Does this mean you don't currently have an ATSC tuner on any of your TV's?
Your success with an amplifier on analog channels may or may not continue on the digital - especially WOIO which is the weakest of them all, and will continue to be after the transition.

I'm still trying to understand what the fuss is about????

From what I'm reading in that article(link) (http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6531605.html), the FCC is basically telling D* and E* that they must carry HD versions of PBS and other stations (CW, MyNetwork) that are willing to make an agreement for carriage if they're going to carry "the big 4." It is my understanding that D* (and probably E*) is not too interested in channels that are not "the big 4" (ABC,CBS,NBC,Fox) which the FCC is finding discriminatory.

That article also says that if the DBS providers can provide a claim for limited channel capacity they can get out of this requirement (which they likely will, but they have to admit the capacity issue which is a PR issue for DBS).

From what I'm reading it seems that DBS providers have an all or nothing deal with the FCC to carry analog, full power locals. If they carry analog, full power locals they must carry all analog, full power local channels. I believe the FCC is now asking that the same is applied to digital and HD broadcasts.

One big issue I think this article doesn't cover is if all subchannels must be carried or if just the primary subchannel is required.

Also, this article doesn't cover retransmission consent issues which would prevent D* from being able to carry all of the locals in a market regardless of the resolution or transmission method.

From what I'm reading in that article(link) (http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6531605.html), the FCC is basically telling D* and E* that they must carry HD versions of PBS and other stations (CW, MyNetwork) that are willing to make an agreement for carriage if they're going to carry "the big 4." It is my understanding that D* (and probably E*) is not too interested in channels that are not "the big 4" (ABC,CBS,NBC,Fox) which the FCC is finding discriminatory.


I just took a look and sure enough D* does not carry CW or MyTV in HD. MYTV however as we have discussed before doesn't offer much in the way of HD and CW, according to TW only offers 12 hours per week of HD.

Still TW carries MYTV in both digital (actually upgraded analog) and HD. CW only comes in analog. So if the dishes have to follow this rule, TW will as well which means eventually they will have to add the CW.

From what I'm reading in that article(link) (http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6531605.html), the FCC is basically telling D* and E* that they must carry HD versions of PBS and other stations (CW, MyNetwork) that are willing to make an agreement for carriage if they're going to carry "the big 4." It is my understanding that D* (and probably E*) is not too interested in channels that are not "the big 4" (ABC,CBS,NBC,Fox) which the FCC is finding discriminatory.

How can the FCC mandate which HD channels a private TV company provides it's customer's?? And it's not like D* or E* doesn't provide their SD counterparts. What's next, is the FCC going to force TW to pickup BTN-HD, NFLN-HD and other HD channels that satellite gets? This is ludicrous!

That article also says that if the DBS providers can provide a claim for limited channel capacity they can get out of this requirement (which they likely will, but they have to admit the capacity issue which is a PR issue for DBS).

From what I'm reading it seems that DBS providers have an all or nothing deal with the FCC to carry analog, full power locals. If they carry analog, full power locals they must carry all analog, full power local channels. I believe the FCC is now asking that the same is applied to digital and HD broadcasts.

But aren't all of the channels provided through DBS already digital, locals and all? SD and HD are technically both digital transmissions through DBS, so they're fine by the FCC's request for all digital or nothing. SD CW/PBS are still digital. Each DBS satellite and set top box already ensures this!

One big issue I think this article doesn't cover is if all subchannels must be carried or if just the primary subchannel is required.

Also, this article doesn't cover retransmission consent issues which would prevent D* from being able to carry all of the locals in a market regardless of the resolution or transmission method.

Frankly, this article leaves a lot of unanswered questions.....

How can the FCC mandate which HD channels a private TV company provides it's customer's?? And it's not like D* or E* doesn't provide their SD counterparts.
The FCC can very easily regulate DBS since it falls under their jurisdiction (see Wiki:FCC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FCC)). The SD counterparts aren't the issue. DBS is discriminating against certain HD affiliates that want to be carried and DBS refuses to carry them.

Here's the other half that I'm just now figuring out from this article. The current regulations from the FCC regarding DBS and locals only covers analog broadcasts. Once Feb 2009 rolls around those signals go away and so does the regulation. The FCC is trying to make sure that you still get all of your local channels (if offered in your market) once the analog transmissions go away.

But aren't all of the channels provided through DBS already digital, locals and all? SD and HD are technically both digital transmissions through DBS, so they're fine by the FCC's request for all digital or nothing. SD CW/PBS are still digital. Each DBS satellite and set top box already ensures this!
Don't confuse the digital broadcast mandate to include cable or DBS in their distribution. The digital conversion only covers the termination of analog broadcasts OTA on UHF and VHF bands.

Don't confuse the digital broadcast mandate to include cable or DBS in their distribution. The digital conversion only covers the termination of analog broadcasts OTA on UHF and VHF bands.

Terry is dead on here. The FCC is concerned with reclaiming that portion of the over-the-air spectrum for use by 2-way communications and other advanced services. Since cable and DBS don't send any signals into the open airwaves on those frequencies, they're unaffected by the 2009 analog shutdown.

Since cable and DBS don't send any signals into the open airwaves on those frequencies, they're unaffected by the 2009 analog shutdown.
Well, that's not entirely true. DBS and cable are affected indirectly with the loss of the analog signal they use as a source for their SD retransmission (with a few exceptions).

I don't know if anybody has asked this question before...

I am on the TW system near Kent (Akron channels). I was wondering if there was any difference between the digital channels in the expanded basic lineup, and the very same channels that are in the 600s. There are quite a few that are replicated there.
Thanks.

A little bit OT ... we are moving our office to a new location that happens to be wired for Time Warner Cable. I am thinking of Time Warner Cable Business Internet access for general surfing the net and possibly an email/web server at the new office. Any opinions on the reliability of business service from TWC ?

Right now at our current location we have a very expensive T1 (1.5Mbps), but when there is a problem (VERY rarely), I call and get right through to a knowledgeable tech, and they jump on it right away. (This is a T1 from Verizon Business formerly WorldCom formerly MCI formerly UUNet, the best network in the land, LOL) Curious if "business" class service from TWC can compare.

Right now at our current location we have a very expensive T1 (1.5Mbps), but when there is a problem (VERY rarely), I call and get right through to a knowledgeable tech, and they jump on it right away. (This is a T1 from Verizon Business formerly WorldCom formerly MCI formerly UUNet, the best network in the land, LOL) Curious if "business" class service from TWC can compare.

Hehe - I have quotes from TWC sitting on my desk right now - considering something similar. You can get their business class service in two forms: cable (same technology as home RoadRunner service, but they add static IP addresses and (I believe) a SLA) and fiber. The cable version has the same issues as home RR - fairly reliable, shared bandwidth with your neighbors, etc. Their fiber offering is an entirely different beast, but it's SERIOUS cash. (Makes your T1 look cheap.)

My biggest concern with their cable offering regards their repair techs. Do they send out the same low-level idio....err...techs that have come to my house, or do business customers automatically get better people? (Waiting on that answer from my sales rep.)

I'll check my quotes tomorrow and get the details about SLA, etc.

Of course, there is a pretty good reason T1's cost what they do... I have several of them, and probably wouldn't switch them out without a very good reason to do so.

My biggest concern with their cable offering regards their repair techs. Do they send out the same low-level idio....err...techs that have come to my house, or do business customers automatically get better people? (Waiting on that answer from my sales rep.)



I can only speak as a home owner but my experience with the techs that come out for internet vs. the techs that do your cable TV is like night and day.

Internet techs are very knowledgeable, IMHO and they are very thorough. I had an outage and called to let them know. While I was talking to the rep it came back up. She said good, but she noticed some problems that I can't see on her end and sent a truck roll.

Something apparently was not coming in or going out right, I don't remember but the tech that came out knew what he was there for had me show him where the cable stuff was and fixed it. He also ran a test from my computer to make sure everything was up to spec. I was impressed.

One word of caution: This experience happened when it was still Adelphia H.S. internet, not RR yet. I imagine however they have the same people.

Has anyone else other then me got a letter saying they need to change out the modem for Turbo RR?

I would imagine Business Class has their own techs for how responsive they are to any trouble calls. We have Business Class service at my office and we have customers with offices around Cinci and the state of Ohio for whom we recommend TWC Business Class service.

I've noticed in my area, TWC seems to be moving the HD locals. In the last couple days WKYC HD moved to 3.1 with WKYC weather on 3.2. The same for ch 5 (5.1), ch 8 (8.1), ch 19 (19.1), ch 19 weather (19.2),ch 43 (43.1), and ch 49 (49.1). Before they were much harder to locate, for example ch 3 hd was on 101.1.

Seems like Cox is doing rather well here in Parma. I'm able to get more stations that way than OTA, at this point. Hopefully that'll change closer to that magic date a year from now. Right now, the most stable signals that I'm getting are WKYC, WEWS, WJW, WUAB, WQHS, and sometimes WOIO, if I'm using the right antenna when it comes to OTA HD. Otherwise, the only way I can get WBNX and WVIZ seem to be over QAM lines at this point... Sometimes I will get WBNX OTA, but it's usually hit, and most times miss. WVIZ seems to have DRM when it comes to OTA, so QAM seems to be the only way I can get that at this point... Whether or not that'll change eventually, I can't really tell you off hand...

EDIT: Ooh, I hate that number of posts that I made thus far. Someone exorcise me! :D

Seems like Cox is doing rather well here in Parma. I'm able to get more stations that way than OTA, at this point. Hopefully that'll change closer to that magic date a year from now. Right now, the most stable signals that I'm getting are WKYC, WEWS, WJW, WUAB, WQHS, and sometimes WOIO, if I'm using the right antenna when it comes to OTA HD. Otherwise, the only way I can get WBNX and WVIZ seem to be over QAM lines at this point... Sometimes I will get WBNX OTA, but it's usually hit, and most times miss. WVIZ seems to have DRM when it comes to OTA, so QAM seems to be the only way I can get that at this point... Whether or not that'll change eventually, I can't really tell you off hand...

EDIT: Ooh, I hate that number of posts that I made thus far. Someone exorcise me! :D

You little devil you.:) Anyway hardly anyone gets WVIZ OTA and probably won't for a long time to come.

Now you can respond to this and take care of your, um, problem.:D

Yeah... Thanks a lot. However, I'd have to say that QAM may be the only way WVIZ will come in. However, as for the others for OTA, I'd say that there's only a handful of ones that are actually stable. I have a Philips 50dB that I got from Walmart about a year ago for my bedroom TV, and an RCA Terrestrial that I recently bought for my HTPC. However, it seems like even tho my RCA may be less dB than the Philips, it's picking up more stations than my Philips, for some odd reason. Sounds weird, but seems like my PC's picking up more stations (at least I can record HDTV on my PC, and use my X360 to extend those for playback).

Yeah... Thanks a lot. However, I'd have to say that QAM may be the only way WVIZ will come in. However, as for the others for OTA, I'd say that there's only a handful of ones that are actually stable. I have a Philips 50dB that I got from Walmart about a year ago for my bedroom TV, and an RCA Terrestrial that I recently bought for my HTPC. However, it seems like even tho my RCA may be less dB than the Philips, it's picking up more stations than my Philips, for some odd reason. Sounds weird, but seems like my PC's picking up more stations (at least I can record HDTV on my PC, and use my X360 to extend those for playback).

My OTA digital/HD is pretty rock solid. Rarely an issue. And far fewer issues than I see in this forum regarding HD locals via cable.

Of course, no WVIZ HD OTA. :( But I have noticed a HUGE improvement on my WOW cable SD local WVIZ. Is it digital now? Just a better analog signal?

Yeah... Thanks a lot. However, I'd have to say that QAM may be the only way WVIZ will come in. However, as for the others for OTA, I'd say that there's only a handful of ones that are actually stable. I have a Philips 50dB that I got from Walmart about a year ago for my bedroom TV, and an RCA Terrestrial that I recently bought for my HTPC. However, it seems like even tho my RCA may be less dB than the Philips, it's picking up more stations than my Philips, for some odd reason. Sounds weird, but seems like my PC's picking up more stations (at least I can record HDTV on my PC, and use my X360 to extend those for playback).
I can get WVIZ-DT in Parma using a Silver Sensor and a lot of patience. I have to aim it out my patio door just a little bit west of due north. Forget trying to get it through a wall, only an unscreened window or door will do. I'm a little bit over 3 miles from the Brookpark Rd. transmitter (southeast corner of Parma not far from where 3 cities meet).

Well, I usually find doing makeshift pedestals for my OTA HD antennae myself. I just stack a few old books to form a small tower, and place the antenna on top, telescope the rods, and point my "satellite" thingy in the direction that the majority of the trasmition antennae are located (being here around the Snow/Ridge Rd. area, that would be facing southeast), and that's usually optimal for a lot of things.

Well, I usually find doing makeshift pedestals for my OTA HD antennae myself. I just stack a few old books to form a small tower, and place the antenna on top, telescope the rods, and point my "satellite" thingy in the direction that the majority of the trasmition antennae are located (being here around the Snow/Ridge Rd. area, that would be facing southeast), and that's usually optimal for a lot of things.

OIC, you are talking set top antenna. Mine is chimney mounted. That may explain our diferences in OTA PQ and reliability.

But also satellite looking. :)

OIC, you are talking set top antenna. Mine is chimney mounted. That may explain our diferences in OTA PQ and reliability.

But also satellite looking. :)

I wanted to put one of those things on my entertainment center to use with my S3. Wife vetoed it.

She doesn't like antennas.:rolleyes:

I wanted to put one of those things on my entertainment center to use with my S3. Wife vetoed it.

She doesn't like antennas.:rolleyes:

I'm no fan of antennas myself. I can't think of anything *less* attractive on/near a home than an antenna. But then it's worth a little loss in aesthetics for the content.

Luckily I'm close enough to the Parma Farm to be able to use a very low key version. My neighbors didn't even know I had put it up till I pointed it out to them. It's just a 23" x 2" disc on my chimney.

Technically, I'm not even supposed to have an antenna in my development. But it's so low key noone even notices it.

Well, I usually find doing makeshift pedestals for my OTA HD antennae myself. I just stack a few old books to form a small tower, and place the antenna on top, telescope the rods, and point my "satellite" thingy in the direction that the majority of the trasmition antennae are located (being here around the Snow/Ridge Rd. area, that would be facing southeast), and that's usually optimal for a lot of things. From Snow/Ridge you would have to aim your antenna towards Brookpark & State (just a little bit east of due north. The rest of the towers are in the opposite direction (as you say southeast). You are a lot closer to WVIZ-DT than I am so only ground clutter would hamper your reception of their mini-signal.

While the majority of Greater Cleveland OTA viewers only have to aim their antennas in one direction to hit all the towers, here in "ground zero" we are surrounded by 'em.

BTW: I taped together several cardboard boxes to raise my Silver Sensor. The extra height was necessary to pull in WEAO-DT and WDLI-DT. I don't have a window facing south for those two, however the south facing wall does not have aluminum siding on the other side (it's looking through the attached garage). I think I'm going to try moving my (local) antennas to the attic this spring (I have one on the chimney looking east for WKBN-DT). I use 2 A/B switches in tandem to switch between the Cleveland, Akron, and Youngstown antennas.

Hi. Long time lurker, but first time poster. First, you guys have been a great help in getting my system set up so thanks for that.

I have done some searches, but couldnt find a clear answer so I hope this is not a repeat.

I currently have a Mits WD 65734 and am using the built in QAM to get NBC/ABC/FOX HD. I never watch any other channels and mostly use the TV for movies. My questions is can I cancel the basic cable service and still pick up these channels over QAM? I am in Cleveland, OH and have Time Warner Basic cable package. Thanks.

I currently have a Mits WD 65734 and am using the built in QAM to get NBC/ABC/FOX HD. I never watch any other channels and mostly use the TV for movies. My questions is can I cancel the basic cable service and still pick up these channels over QAM? I am in Cleveland, OH and have Time Warner Basic cable package. Thanks.

How can you cancel your service and expect to get channels over QAM? Unless you left out that you have Road Runner and that's how you get your internet.

I believe it is possible if you have internet through TW that you can still get these channels over QAM from what I've read. But I'm not an expert in QAM so if I'm wrong someone will come by and set me straight shortly.

However if you cancel your basic service and your not using internet from TW then I don't think that's going to happen.

Edited to add: Others may disagree but IMHO that's stealing. I love a little controversy.:)

Stealing? I had no idea! If that is the case its not worth it for $16/month. I was under the impression that QAM channels are something like getting OTA HD channels which are "free" (i think).

If it is stealing forget it, but if not I do use TW for internet.

Stealing? I had no idea! If that is the case its not worth it for $16/month. I was under the impression that QAM channels are something like getting OTA HD channels which are "free" (i think).

If it is stealing forget it, but if not I do use TW for internet.


Well, if you hook up to cable and you get a signal without paying anything for it then you are stealing. It's just that simple. But probably if you canceled your service you would not get the signal anyway.

How can you cancel your service and expect to get channels over QAM? Unless you left out that you have Road Runner and that's how you get your internet.

I believe it is possible if you have internet through TW that you can still get these channels over QAM from what I've read. But I'm not an expert in QAM so if I'm wrong someone will come by and set me straight shortly.

However if you cancel your basic service and your not using internet from TW then I don't think that's going to happen.

Edited to add: Others may disagree but IMHO that's stealing. I love a little controversy.

Stealing? I had no idea! If that is the case its not worth it for $16/month. I was under the impression that QAM channels are something like getting OTA HD channels which are "free" (i think).

If it is stealing forget it, but if not I do use TW for internet.

For as much as RR from TW costs, I would consider getting "free tv" for free as a bonus for giving them all that money every month.
If I watch local tv channels along with RR that TW is pipeing into MY HOME, and that's considered stealing?... I think that is stretching it a little.

How bout those ketchup packets, napkins, and straws at fast food restaurants?... ever take a few of those with you?
Ever take anything out of someone else's trash or out of a dumpster?... it's not really yours, right?
How about at the doctor's office... that bowl of candy/mints... ever take two?
Have you ever told a lie?... I know I haven't. :D ;) :p

For as much as RR from TW costs, I would consider getting "free tv" for free as a bonus for giving them all that money every month.
If I watch local tv channels along with RR that TW is pipeing into MY HOME, and that's considered stealing?... I think that is stretching it a little.

How bout those ketchup packets, napkins, and straws at fast food restaurants?... ever take a few of those with you?
Ever take anything out of someone else's trash or out of a dumpster?... it's not really yours, right?
How about at the doctor's office... that bowl of candy/mints... ever take two?
Have you ever told a lie?... I know I haven't. :D ;) :p


Call TW and ask them if they think it's stealing.:p

Actually, over the last couple months my cable periodically loses the HD signals. I can't tell if it's normal, or if they're working on the lines, or if there's something wrong with my line/drop. Anyway, I think I may call them to come out and look at it. When they're here I'll ask about the RR/free basic cable scenario ans see what the tech has to say about it. :)

Internet techs are very knowledgeable, IMHO and they are very thorough. I had an outage and called to let them know. While I was talking to the rep it came back up. She said good, but she noticed some problems that I can't see on her end and sent a truck roll.


On that point, I'll generally agree.... On the few occasions I've had a TWC tech out to check on a RR problem, I don't remember ever being "disgusted".

However, there is one visit that will stick in my mind for a long time. RR had been dead for a few days, and a tech showed up to fix the problem. The (very old) cable modem was dead. The guy stared at my rather large rack of computers, routers, modems, and other gizmos for a minute, then said: (this is kinda funny)

him: "OK, where is it?"
me: "The cable modem? Here." (I pointed to it.)
him: "That's OUR'S?!?! I've never seen one of those..."
me: "Yep - I've been a RR subscriber for a LONG time...."

He replaced the box, got the service running, and spent the next hour (without me asking) checking and tuning the signal levels to my cable boxes and non-boxed TVs until they were right where they should be.

Very knowledgable and pleasant guy to work with. If only TWC had all of their techs trained this well...

Stealing? I had no idea! If that is the case its not worth it for $16/month. I was under the impression that QAM channels are something like getting OTA HD channels which are "free" (i think). If it is stealing forget it, but if not I do use TW for internet.
If you're not paying for at least basic "lifeline" cable service, then you are not entitled to connect their cable to your TV. If you connect it, you are stealing service.

And internet service doesn't change that. If you have internet service, you are entitled to connect their cable to your cable modem, but not to your TV.

If you're not paying for at least basic "lifeline" cable service, then you are not entitled to connect their cable to your TV. If you connect it, you are stealing service.

And internet service doesn't change that. If you have internet service, you are entitled to connect their cable to your cable modem, but not to your TV.

I would like to believe I am entitled to do anything I want with the coax cable within my house. They can simply remove the frequiences that carry the signals and thus when plugging it in, nothing would transmit. I would say that this does seem to fall on some moral fence on whether it is right or wrong to watch it. Seeing that those broadcasts (Local HD) are sent over the air I wouldnt feel bad getting them free through the cable (assuming i have some service with TW).

........I think I'm going to try moving my (local) antennas to the attic this spring (I have one on the chimney looking east for WKBN-DT). I use 2 A/B switches in tandem to switch between the Cleveland, Akron, and Youngstown antennas.

With you being so close to the antenna farm putting your antennas in the attic may just work. I tried a directional outdoor antenna in the attic (as recommended by antennaweb.org) but ch 3 & ch 19 were very weak and lost their signals frequently. All of the other local ch's were very solid with signals at 75%. The attic walls & roof can diminish the signals by 50%. :eek:

Once I went to the bidirectional disc on the chimney it solved the 3 & 19 issues to where 3 & 19 are now a 75% consistent signal and the rest are 100%.

Anyone need a directional antenna with a 2 output distribution amp? :)
1 year old, used indoor only?
http://antennasdirect.com/V15_vhf_antenna.html

I would like to believe I am entitled to do anything I want with the coax cable within my house. They can simply remove the frequiences that carry the signals and thus when plugging it in, nothing would transmit. I would say that this does seem to fall on some moral fence on whether it is right or wrong to watch it. Seeing that those broadcasts (Local HD) are sent over the air I wouldnt feel bad getting them free through the cable (assuming i have some service with TW).

So if the neighbors newspaper starts landing in your driveway and you know it's the neighbors newspaper it's yours? I mean it's on your driveway right?;)

Actually I feel that if you get internet service and you're able to get a basic signal that's TW's problem. I really wouldn't consider that stealing although I understand Jim's point. Yes, you are using something that you're not paying for but then again you didn't force that part of the signal to get into you're house. But the bottom line is you are still getting something that you're not paying for.

Geeze, my head is spinning on a moral circle on this one.:D I say if it doesn't bother your conscience, even a bit then maybe it's ok.

But some people kill people and that doesn't bother them either.

Crap, I'm going to stop. I'm driving myself nuts now.:D

Actually, over the last couple months my cable periodically loses the HD signals. I can't tell if it's normal, or if they're working on the lines, or if there's something wrong with my line/drop. Anyway, I think I may call them to come out and look at it. When they're here I'll ask about the RR/free basic cable scenario ans see what the tech has to say about it. :)

No, that's not normal and it's been going on for a couple of MONTHS?

Dude, you just dropped on the hookbill respectometer. I'll be that breaks your day doesn't it.:D

And as far as asking the tech about the rr/free cable he's going to answer according to his personal moral compass. If he's a company guy, or a completely honest guy he would say you shouldn't do it.

If you're just asking if it can be done he may not tell you the truth. I know I've read where people can get basic cable from just having internet cable from TW so I know it works. Maybe it doesn't work in all areas but it must in some parts of town.

We were talking a few pages back about contacting this dude via email. Someone said they never got a response back and I said when I tried he didn't contact me but someone else did.

It happened again.

I tried to find out when my new modem was going to arrive from customer service. Rep said she wanted to ask her supervisor if she could find out and asked if she could call me back.

Of course I never got a call back. So I call the next day and ask the rep if she sees the notes about yesterdays conversation. She says she doesn't see anything in there from me for a couple of months, and my modem will get there when it gets there with the "and don't be questioning me about this" tone.

So I sent the following email to steve.fry@twcable.com:

Dear Mr. Fry,

On Saturday, February 9, 2008 I received a letter from you stating that it had come to your attention that my current modem is not capable of delivering Road Runner Turbo Service. The letter stated that a refund would be made for service that I had not received and that and I quote "In the next few days you will receive a replacement modem via UPS."

The problem I have is that I would like to know what exactly "the next few days" means. To me that would mean maybe a week from the date of the letter at the most. However on this letter there is no date.

So I called customer service who had no idea I had the wrong modem but said she would check with her supervisor to see when it would be sent. She said she would call back and let me know what she found out. For some reason I thought that meant the same day! Anyway, I called this morning to see if anything had been found out and the representative said she didn't see any notes about my call and that the modems would be sent out sometime but she had no idea when that would happen. I asked why they didn't do a truck roll and she said that it was for the customers convenience. She said that way when UPS delivered I could sign for the modem and that would save a truck roll and me the inconvenience of going to my local office and picking up the proper modem.

Is there anyway you could tell me a better time frame of when I can expect my modem to arrive? I would really rather have the turbo service for a variety of reasons, and yes, I did notice the difference in speed. I've noticed it for a while.

My home phone is 330.555.5555. If you could have someone call me I would appreciate it. I should be home after 3:00 this afternoon.

Sincerely

hookbill

I got a call from a TW representative at 3:15 pm from TW who said my modem is being shipped tomorrow (today) and I should receive it by Monday.

So he may not contact you directly, but he will get your question to the right person.

I got a call from a TW representative at 3:15 pm from TW who said my modem is being shipped tomorrow (today) and I should receive it by Monday.

So he may not contact you directly, but he will get your question to the right person.

It will be interesting to see if it has been pre-provisioned in the system and ready-to-go or if you have to call and have CS do it after you receive and install it! I've read horror stories on getting new modems up and running post-Adelphia....

It will be interesting to see if it has been pre-provisioned in the system and ready-to-go or if you have to call and have CS do it after you receive and install it! I've read horror stories on getting new modems up and running post-Adelphia....

I don't think that's a worry. They did refund my account as they promised. I'll bet the modem will be here by next week.

No, that's not normal and it's been going on for a couple of MONTHS?

Dude, you just dropped on the hookbill respectometer. I'll be that breaks your day doesn't it.:D

And as far as asking the tech about the rr/free cable he's going to answer according to his personal moral compass. If he's a company guy, or a completely honest guy he would say you shouldn't do it.

If you're just asking if it can be done he may not tell you the truth. I know I've read where people can get basic cable from just having internet cable from TW so I know it works. Maybe it doesn't work in all areas but it must in some parts of town.

Well, like I said, it only happens periodically, not all the time. The signal will break start to break up here and there, and then eventually pixelate and deminish, forcing me to them watch the analog feed (no probs with analog).
The problem will last anywhere form a few hours to a few days. It's so random that I can't tell if it is connected to weater changes or not. I think that maybe there is some water in the line or in the filters. They've been doing some channel realignments here recently too so I thought maybe it was from them working on the system.
They've finally moved some channels to their proper placement. Like WKYC to 3.1 and same goes for 5.1, 8.1, 19.1, 43.1, ect...
It hasn't screwed up since they moved the channels, so I'll wait for now and see. If it does it one more time, then I will call for sure.

As far as asking the tech about the RR/free cable situation... basically, I would just ask him if TW is aware of the situation, and if they really care. I can't imagine they'd make a real fuss. Most who can afford to pay for RR have more than just basic cable anyway IMO. So the lost revenue by TW isn't even a blip on the map.

When I changed over to Comcast (now TWC) a few years ago I remember that if I were to only get the cable modem only it would have cost me as much as getting both cable modem and basic digital cable. In other words it was as economical to just order both cable modem and basic digital cable even if you had no intention of using the cable TV service. I believe they need to deliver the digital cable service to you house to cover the bandwidth of cable modem. It was a non issue to me at the time since I took the entire package with HD service DVR and a second cable box. I am close to making the jump back to satellite and dropping the TW so I will be interested to see what cable modem only service costs.

Ray

That was me who did not receive a call back from Steve Fry.
I guess I'll try again when I get a chance.

When you have RR, do you lease a box from TW? I'm thinking if I am going to get RR, then I will buy a used one off of eBay or buy my own box so I don't have to lease.

"The format war has turned into a format death watch.

Toshiba is widely expected to pull the plug on its HD DVD format sometime in the coming weeks, reliable industry sources say, after a rash of retail defections that followed Warner Home Video's announcement in early January that it would support only the rival Blu-ray Disc format after May."

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/news/e3ib77125d96b22e86027d0bfb0c25aa58d

"The format war has turned into a format death watch.

Toshiba is widely expected to pull the plug on its HD DVD format sometime in the coming weeks, reliable industry sources say, after a rash of retail defections that followed Warner Home Video's announcement in early January that it would support only the rival Blu-ray Disc format after May."

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/news/e3ib77125d96b22e86027d0bfb0c25aa58d

Wal-Mart just announced (this morning) that they are going BR exclusive.
I absolutely love my "HD_DVD", but I guess this is all the beginning of the end for HD. It's a shame that all the Blu players are complete shite. So...
blah blah blah... this type of talk is getting old for me...
Hopefully soon I can amass myself 100+ HD_DVDs for pennies on the dollar. :)

That was me who did not receive a call back from Steve Fry.
I guess I'll try again when I get a chance.

When you have RR, do you lease a box from TW? I'm thinking if I am going to get RR, then I will buy a used one off of eBay or buy my own box so I don't have to lease.

I suppose I can't comment on your exact TWC division, but most include it in their HSI fees and don't offer a discount for providing your own.

Wal-Mart just announced (this morning) that they are going BR exclusive.
I absolutely love my "HD_DVD", but I guess this is all the beginning of the end for HD. It's a shame that all the Blu players are complete shite. So...
blah blah blah... this type of talk is getting old for me...
Hopefully soon I can amass myself 100+ HD_DVDs for pennies on the dollar. :)

Oh I'm sure the HD-DVD prices will be just that in the coming weeks, especially once this become an "official" announcement and the mainstream media picks up on it. Watch those ebay prices PLUMMET!

Best Buy & NetFlix announced the same thing two weeks ago, going Blu-ray exclusive, shortly after the Warner studio announcement that they are dumping HD-DVD in favor of Blu-ray.

Toshiba (HD-DVD) cancelled their entire presentation at CES 08, they knew they were done.

Well, I don't know about "all that" Toby. They cancelled that CES presentation because Warner had just stabbed them in the back minutes beforehand.
Also, to correct you regarding WorstBuy, they are NOT going Blu exclusive, they are still selling HD. It's just that they are going to "push" Blu more because of... well, who knows exactly what Sony offered them. I know they already make a larger profit margin on BR than they do on HD. I'm sure that had something to do with it.

That's all I'll say about the "format war" here. Sorry for the off topic talk guys.

Well, I don't know about "all that" Toby. They cancelled that CES presentation because Warner had just stabbed them in the back minutes beforehand.
Also, to correct you regarding WorstBuy, they are NOT going Blu exclusive, they are still selling HD. It's just that they are going to "push" Blu more because of... well, who knows exactly what Sony offered them. I know they already make a larger profit margin on BR than they do on HD. I'm sure that had something to do with it.

It's Best Buy being PC so as to not ruffle Toshiba's feathers and publicly "kick them when they are down". Pushing one format over the other may not be *exclusive* but it means they are putting Toshiba on the back shelf and steering customers to Blu-ray. Ask a Best Buy salesman "I'm thinking of going HD for DVD's, what should I be looking for?" and I'd bet that salesman would not even MENTION HD-DVD, once that policy was to go into effect. :)

It's all moot anyway with the (very soon) Toshiba announcement forthcoming. :)

Does this mean you don't currently have an ATSC tuner on any of your TV's?
Your success with an amplifier on analog channels may or may not continue on the digital - especially WOIO which is the weakest of them all, and will continue to be after the transition.

Right now no, but I had done some tests with a borrowed HD set, from the roof no problem I will likely lose 32, 53 & 65 (which are weak analog, no big deal), from my attic setup is what my concern is, I will likely lose 19 (or 10) from my attic antenna as a regular station, & may lose a few others in adverse conditions. From my roof I'm up in the 80-90% on the locals except for 3 & 19... 3 should fix itself after the move to 17. Likely will also lose 23 from my roof, always a watchable signal (sometimes perfect) but never consistant, doubtfully will recieve a digital from them way up here... biggest loss.

I was in luck to purchase unit that still has the anntenna hooked up to it, when cable came in they cut off a lot of the units antenna wiring to make the unit owners dependent on them for any TV.

Also experimenting with the amps from my parents setup a few miles from me... the amp does make a big difference there, & eliminating the attic antenna & splitting the roof antenna also helped too.

Dear (CUSTOMER),

Have you ever thought of changing the way you view digital cable? With over 200 channels to choose from, making viewing decisions can sometimes be a challenge.

Luckily at Time Warner Cable, we think like you think and have listened to your feedback. That is why we have decided to arrange your Digital Cable channel lineup to make finding what you want to watch easier than ever. Look for these changes in the coming weeks.

We are arranging the channels above position 100 so that channels with similar programming will be grouped together by categories such as News, Sports and Kids. This setup not only gives you a single destination for your most desired shows, but also helps keep you aware of other similar programming that you might have missed.

You may notice that some fo the digital channels may be offeredon tiers which have different names than ou remember. You also may notice some great new channels in your area.

We are excited about these changes and invite you to learn more about them online or on your television. Details are available at http://www.twcguide.com or on channel position 399 once your lineup has changed.

Prior to the lineup changes, you'll receive another quick reminder letter that will include a printed copy of your new Digital Cable channel lineup. You should also find a copy of the new channel information in your billing statement, and your digital on-screen guide will reflect the changes as soon as your area is realigned.

At the time of these changes, you may need to reprogram all of your settings. These settings include Parental Control, Blocked Channel, Favorite Channel, Reminder Timer and most scheduled DVR recordings. You might also lose stored content on your DVR.

If you need more information on programming your settings, there are options for help:
*Consult the booklets that came with your digital cable box.

OR

*Visit http://www.twcguide.com for printable copies of guides for the various types of cable boxes we carry.

OR

*Go online to http://www.twcneo.com and look for Answers On Demand under Quick Links.

We apologize if this may cause soem confusion, but we are confident you will appreciate the benefits of this new lineup layout in the future.

Knowing you have options when it comes to purchasing the products that Time Warner Cable provies, we most sincerely appreciate your busines and look forward to serving you for many years to come.

Sincerely,
Steohen R Fry
President, Time Warner Cable
NE Ohio and Western PA Division
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I understand having to change channel settings amd recordings, since the channel numbers are changing. I want to know why THEIR cahnging fo the channel lineup might cause me to lose stored programming on MY DVR?? :confused::confused: Channels have been added/deleted in the past and my saved shows were OK. Plus, it's on MY hard drive.

With you being so close to the antenna farm putting your antennas in the attic may just work. I tried a directional outdoor antenna in the attic (as recommended by antennaweb.org) but ch 3 & ch 19 were very weak and lost their signals frequently. All of the other local ch's were very solid with signals at 75%. The attic walls & roof can diminish the signals by 50%. :eek:
http://antennasdirect.com/V15_vhf_antenna.html

Weather seems to have a greater affect on the attic antenna too, I'm in an aluminum sided structure but the antenna is well above that.

I got the letter, too. It left out this crucial piece of information.

I got the letter, too. It left out this crucial piece of information.

According to the programming notices, HGTV-HD, FOOD-HD, A&E-HD, HISTORY-HD are being added on or around March 4th. I'd assume the lineup might be changing then too. The letter was very vague. I still want to know why I might lose DVR shows.

http://www.twcguide.com/media/inst-DVR.pdf

http://www.twcguide.com/media/inst-settings.pdf

http://www.twcguide.com/media/inst-pcontrol.pdf

These are the three instruction manual PDFs at twcguide.com. Notice that they show the PASSPORT menu system. I thought TW was moving away from PASSPORT? :confused::confused::confused:

They are adding channels to the Expanded Basic positions as well. I wonder what is going on there...

Right now no, but I had done some tests with a borrowed HD set, from the roof no problem I will likely lose 32, 53 & 65 (which are weak analog, no big deal), from my attic setup is what my concern is, I will likely lose 19 (or 10) from my attic antenna as a regular station, & may lose a few others in adverse conditions. From my roof I'm up in the 80-90% on the locals except for 3 & 19... 3 should fix itself after the move to 17. Likely will also lose 23 from my roof, always a watchable signal (sometimes perfect) but never consistent, doubtfully will receive a digital from them way up here... biggest loss.

I was in luck to purchase unit that still has the antenna hooked up to it, when cable came in they cut off a lot of the units antenna wiring to make the unit owners dependent on them for any TV.

Also experimenting with the amps from my parents setup a few miles from me... the amp does make a big difference there, & eliminating the attic antenna & splitting the roof antenna also helped too.:eek:
You could get the "little 3" from Lake County! Wow! That's actually a good sign. It means the "ridge" is not blocking your view of at least one of the Parma towers (the "little 3" all reside on WBNX's stick). WOIO is right next door to WBNX on Ridgewood Dr. If you can get the LP's you may have better luck with WOIO-DT. Just be sure you have an extremely directional antenna since the interference form Canada will cause havoc wit WOIO in the warmer months ahead.

EDIT: I just reread your post. You mentioned 32 (I mistook it for 35). 35, 53, and 65 are on the WBNX tower. 32 OTOH is transmitted from the top of a building in Downtown Cleveland (somewhere around E 9th & Lakeside judging from the map on the FCC site). They had a C.P. to move to the WBNX stick however I see no sign that it ever happened (due to my poor reception of 32 in comparison to the other 3 LP's that I know are on WBNX's tower.

I got the letter, too. It left out this crucial piece of information.

It says on the web site around March 4.

Take a look here (http://www.timewarnercable.com/NortheastOhio/programming/Legal_notices2.html).

Dear (CUSTOMER),

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I understand having to change channel settings amd recordings, since the channel numbers are changing. I want to know why THEIR cahnging fo the channel lineup might cause me to lose stored programming on MY DVR?? :confused::confused: Channels have been added/deleted in the past and my saved shows were OK. Plus, it's on MY hard drive.

You think you will have problems? I can't imagine the havoc this will bring upon my S3.

I've already sent TiVo a "heads up" notice with the link in my previous post.

According to the programming notices, HGTV-HD, FOOD-HD, A&E-HD, HISTORY-HD are being added on or around March 4th. I'd assume the lineup might be changing then too. The letter was very vague. I still want to know why I might lose DVR shows.

The letter is vague because the line up changes will still be different for some areas. For example in my area we have our HD in the 700's. Now there is a large area of Adelphia people who have their HD there. So they want to move the digital channels first.

BTW I got the letter too. IMHO all that letter will do is cause people who don't keep up with things like we do to call customer service and increase their call volume needlessly.

The letter is vague because the line up changes will still be different for some areas. For example in my area we have our HD in the 700's. Now there is a large area of Adelphia people who have their HD there. So they want to move the digital channels first.

BTW I got the letter too. IMHO all that letter will do is cause people who don't keep up with things like we do to call customer service and increase their call volume needlessly.

I don't know how this is going to work and TW is keeping us in the dark as usual. Some of us have HD in the 500s others in the 700s. It looks like everyone will have HD in the 400s when this is done. But how are they adding the HD channels? Will they be showing up in my current lineup and then move or will they show up when the lineup is changed? I want to see Racheal and Giada on FOOD HD:D:D:D:D

And I still want to know why they have passport manuals online when TW has talked about getting rid of Passport.

nick, we know you are a passport supporter but Time warner is not going back to it, they have their in house stuff, and that is that, its a simple slip, not a sign.

You think you will have problems? I can't imagine the havoc this will bring upon my S3.

I've already sent TiVo a "heads up" notice with the link in my previous post.

Maybe not... If TiVo puts a little thought into how they remap the channels, it might go smoothly.

From what I've read about the TWC box internals, especially those running Navigator, I'd guess that the warning is being issued due to design goofs that can't be easily worked around. I've read a few articles that indicate when a significantly different version of the software is installed on the box (Passport to Navigator conversion, anyone?) , the hard drive is automatically formatted, losing all saved shows and schedules.

Interesting thought. It's been discussed that this Navigator conversion is supposed to be coming, yet nothing has been said about it. Are they going to change overnight without telling us? I can't wait to see the outrage over that one.

They have Passport PDFs on the new lineup site and also on demand. Tune to channel 1111, scroll to "For Customers" and press select. Scroll right to "Answers on Demand". All of the videos are for Passport and say they are available till 1/1 12:00AM(sounds like a generic date). There is more to this than they are telling us. Maybe they finally got are saving Passport??

ANd BTW, I am a PASSPORT fanboy!! But you already knew that :D:D

Noticed the "Between the Lines with Tom Beres" political discussion segment was in HD on the WKYC Sunday morning show today. Does this mean WKYC has upgraded another studio? Will we see HD at the "sports desk" on Sunday nights after the 11pm newscast ?

Back by popular demand, 27.3 WYFX-HD is up and running for the Daytona 500. It will be up until sometime after the race is over. At 9:00PM the HD programming starts on WKBN and it will definitely be returned to the normal state by then.

nickdawg,

I had Passport when my wife and I lived in San Diego circa 2005. When we came back to Adelphia/Time Warner land, I began to really hate TWC due to Navigator software. If TWC were to change to Passport, I would give them credit for caring about DVR customers. However, since TWC is a soul-sucking anti-consumer company, I have no faith in them to ditch their horrible DVR software. IMHO, Tivo has the best software and the rest will always best second rate. The only thing that could save TWC, in my mind, is SDV and a new DVR interface (or using Tivo). Anything less than that is unacceptable and will guarantee me switching to satellite ASAP.

nickdawg,

I had Passport when my wife and I lived in San Diego circa 2005. When we came back to Adelphia/Time Warner land, I began to really hate TWC due to Navigator software. If TWC were to change to Passport, I would give them credit for caring about DVR customers. However, since TWC is a soul-sucking anti-consumer company, I have no faith in them to ditch their horrible DVR software. IMHO, Tivo has the best software and the rest will always best second rate. The only thing that could save TWC, in my mind, is SDV and a new DVR interface (or using Tivo). Anything less than that is unacceptable and will guarantee me switching to satellite ASAP.

You're not stuck with what they give you. Get a TiVo HD or TiVo S3. It will actually save you money in the long run. For more info on that go to the TiVo forum because I don't know the formula and never really cared about the cost. I had the SA 8300 with SARA and I was lucky if it even recorded what I wanted, let alone dealing with it's crummy interface and lackluster features, like it's almost non existant search.

I understand passport is a better software but since you can't have it do something about it.

I understand passport is a better software but since you can't have it do something about it.

Was I complaining I couldn't do anything about it? If TWC doesn't do anything soon, I'll be going to satellite. I was simply stating that Navigator is inferior to most and Tivo is the best. FWIW, I just don't have $300 to plunk down on a Tivo anytime soon. Savings over the long term or whatever.

Was I complaining I couldn't do anything about it? If TWC doesn't do anything soon, I'll be going to satellite. I was simply stating that Navigator is inferior to most and Tivo is the best. FWIW, I just don't have $300 to plunk down on a Tivo anytime soon. Savings over the long term or whatever.

To the best of my knowledge you still have to pay for a satellite HD DVR. It's only their regular DVR that's free.

To the best of my knowledge you still have to pay for a satellite HD DVR. It's only their regular DVR that's free.

Free? Well, that's interesting to me, because I have an SA8300HD from TWC (formerly Adelphia, here in the Cleveland east suburbs). This is the box I got when I ordered HD service. TWC told me it costs an additional monthly fee ($7) to turn on the DVR feature, and that's what their online rate card shows for my area.

Yes, it's $99 (or if you find a willing CSR, it's $0). So $99 (or $0) is cheaper than $299.

its not free for the dvr feature, I think Hookbill was saying you have upfront costs for a dvr, then a monthly fee, whereas with cable, its just a monthly fee.

Noticed the "Between the Lines with Tom Beres" political discussion segment was in HD on the WKYC Sunday morning show today. Does this mean WKYC has upgraded another studio? Will we see HD at the "sports desk" on Sunday nights after the 11pm newscast ?

To answer my own question, WKYC's Sunday night sports show is indeed in HD tonight with a new set (at least new to me since I don't watch the 11pm news all that much) Nice upgrade!

Yes, it's $99 (or if you find a willing CSR, it's $0). So $99 (or $0) is cheaper than $299.

Really. Well, first that's cheaper then it was two years ago when it was 389.00 and you had to get your HD locals OTA. And if you can get it for free that's even better.

That sounds like something Yogi Berra would say.:D

Hey, if I had a choice and could get D* that would be what I would go for. No doubt. I hear good things about their DVR and they are kicking tail on the HD front.

Hook, I have a chainsaw you can borrow. I'll even help you, but I don't climb trees. :D

its not free for the dvr feature, I think Hookbill was saying you have upfront costs for a dvr, then a monthly fee, whereas with cable, its just a monthly fee.

As I understood it you had to pay a one time "lease" fee for the dvr. When I was looking at it it was around 389.00, or maybe 289.00.

Anyway maybe they have dropped the price on it.

And as far as cable dvr there is a service fee and a monthly fee for the dvr itself. I think. At least that's the way it was on the day I dragged my SA 8300 back to their office tied to the back of my bumper.

Alright I know you're tired of that line. That will be the last time I use it.;)

Hook, I have a chainsaw you can borrow. I'll even help you, but I don't climb trees. :D

Smarty-pants you don't climb the tree. All you do is cut it.

Then you turn around and deal with my wife. Hope your insurance is paid up.;)

I got a call from Time Warner today. It was a guy from their Akron office who told me his superiors had informed him that he was to come out to my house, install my upgraded modem and take the old one with him. I gave him directions, he said he'd be out between 2 and 4 today.

So once again, it's steve.fry@twcable.com.:cool:

As I understood it you had to pay a one time "lease" fee for the dvr. When I was looking at it it was around 389.00, or maybe 289.00.

Anyway maybe they have dropped the price on it.

And as far as cable dvr there is a service fee and a monthly fee for the dvr itself. I think. At least that's the way it was on the day I dragged my SA 8300 back to their office tied to the back of my bumper.

Alright I know you're tired of that line. That will be the last time I use it.;)

about the dvr's you are right on the money....also I never tire of the line, I think its funny, but remember I am this [-] close to pulling the trigger on a tivo HD, I told my friends about selling my 360 to pay for it, they thought I was crazy as i already have a dvr they said, but I have had it freeze twice (once lost every other chanel then my on demands, then my hbos, then I only had two HD channels) so every time it does that plus we lost 7 minutes of lost because it thought it was time for a reboot, 2 minutes before the show!!! but its pushing me to get a tivo before the Dongle comes out and just saying screw On demand for a couple months.

This seems to have completely gone past the radar:

http://www.sportstimeohio.com/blogDetail.php?blgId=60

Bruce Drennan in HD! Oh, Joy!

This seems to have completely gone past the radar:

http://www.sportstimeohio.com/blogDetail.php?blgId=60

Bruce Drennan in HD! Oh, Joy!

We are pleased to announce that Armstrong, Buckeye CableSystem, Cox Communications, GLW Broadband, Insight Communications and most Time Warner Cable systems have agreed to carry STO HD full-time.

It seems like TW never likes to make anything perfectly clear. OK, they didn't make the announcement but what the heck does that really mean? As it stands right now it's on a "shared" HD channel.

I think I'll email STO for a clarification. If that doesn't work I guess I can send an email to my good buddy Steve Fry.:D

This seems to have completely gone past the radar:

http://www.sportstimeohio.com/blogDetail.php?blgId=60

Bruce Drennan in HD! Oh, Joy!

Great news! The upcoming baseball season can't come soon enough and this is definitely welcoming news to the Tribe nation! STO has grown exponentially in it's 2 years of existence. Kudos!

about the dvr's you are right on the money....also I never tire of the line, I think its funny, but remember I am this [-] close to pulling the trigger on a tivo HD, I told my friends about selling my 360 to pay for it, they thought I was crazy as i already have a dvr they said, but I have had it freeze twice (once lost every other chanel then my on demands, then my hbos, then I only had two HD channels) so every time it does that plus we lost 7 minutes of lost because it thought it was time for a reboot, 2 minutes before the show!!! but its pushing me to get a tivo before the Dongle comes out and just saying screw On demand for a couple months.

Your friends have probably never seen a TiVo so they don't know the difference. But the reasons you state were all the reasons I shelled out the full 900 bucks to get an S3 as soon as it came out.

It's just frustrating when a DVR won't do the basic thing you want it to do and that's record a show. I could put up with crappy interface and lackluster programming features but not doing the basic job of recording a scheduled show is what frustrated me the most.

As far as On Demand goes, I think the jury is still out as to whether or not the USB will be able to do that. I would think it should but I'm not certain. If On Demand really is important to you then tell TW that you want a HD only box. I don't think they have those anymore but I do believe that they won't charge you for the DVR service if you just keep it for HD receiving only.

Hopefully D* will commit to carrying the full time station. Supposedly there's a placeholder for the channel as a game only channel (657-1), so I'm sure we'll get the games, but it would be better to get the whole thing.

Great news! The upcoming baseball season can't come soon enough and this is definitely welcoming news to the Tribe nation! STO has grown exponentially in it's 2 years of existence. Kudos!

I don't know how this is going to work and TW is keeping us in the dark as usual. Some of us have HD in the 500s others in the 700s. It looks like everyone will have HD in the 400s when this is done. But how are they adding the HD channels? Will they be showing up in my current lineup and then move or will they show up when the lineup is changed? I want to see Racheal and Giada on FOOD HD:D:D:D:D

And I still want to know why they have passport manuals online when TW has talked about getting rid of Passport.

Sorry to disappoint Nickdawg, but Food HD is has an entirely different programming/scheduling lineup than Food SD. And as of now, Rachael Ray does not have any HD exclusive shows (personally I'm not a big fan, so I am quite happy with this).

Now as for Giada, she can be seen in anyone of her various HD shows such as "Giada's Weekend Getaways" and "Everyday Italian".

As for a substitution for Rachael Ray, I do suggest you try "Semi-Homemade Cooking with Sandra Lee". Sandra translates pretty decently to High Def....;)

Actually they've begun to show 30 Minute Meals in HD (it started right after the first of the year). Here's this week's schedule as a sample:

http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/hdtv/0,2857,FOOD_26756,00.html

Sorry to disappoint Nickdawg, but Food HD is has an entirely different programming/scheduling lineup than Food SD. And as of now, Rachael Ray does not have any HD exclusive shows (personally I'm not a big fan, so I am quite happy with this).

Now as for Giada, she can be seen in anyone of her various HD shows such as "Giada's Weekend Getaways" and "Everyday Italian".

As for a substitution for Rachael Ray, I do suggest you try "Semi-Homemade Cooking with Sandra Lee". Sandra translates pretty decently to High Def....;)

Hopefully D* will commit to carrying the full time station. Supposedly there's a placeholder for the channel as a game only channel (657-1), so I'm sure we'll get the games, but it would be better to get the whole thing.

Completely agree. I'd imagine STO going "full-time" HD would give D* all the more incentive to dedicate their own full time channel for them as well.

Actually they've begun to show 30 Minute Meals in HD (it started right after the first of the year). Here's this week's schedule as a sample:

http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/hdtv/0,2857,FOOD_26756,00.html

Woops. I stand corrected. I had no idea Rachael Ray (30 Minute Meals) went HD. All the merrier I guess.....

More Northeastern Ohio Customers Gain Video Choice, Innovative Features with AT&T U-verse TV

U-verse TV and Suite of New Interactive Features Now Available to More Than 135,000 Living Units

Cleveland, Ohio, Sunnyvale, California, February 19, 2008

More northeastern Ohio residents and their televisions can break free from cable. AT&T Inc. (NYSE:T) today announced that AT&T U-verseSM TV and Internet services are now available to more than 135,000 living units in and around the Cleveland and Akron areas.

Since introducing U-verse TV services in the Cleveland area in June 2007, AT&T has made the service available to more northeastern Ohio customers on an ongoing basis. U-verse TV is offered today in parts of more than 65 communities, including Akron, Canton, Cleveland and Mentor. There are plans to continue reaching even more customers.

In addition, northeastern Ohio customers can now enjoy a suite of new U-verse TV features — currently available for all local U-verse TV customers at no extra charge — that further differentiate the service from cable, including:

* AT&T U-bar, which brings customizable weather, stock, sports and traffic information to the U-verse TV screen, without interrupting the current program. Customers who also subscribe to AT&T Yahoo! High Speed Internet can personalize the U-bar from their AT&T Yahoo! home page to display weather at specific locations, their personal stock portfolio and scores for their favorite sports teams.
* YELLOWPAGES.COM TV, which lets U-verse TV customers easily search for local businesses and other information via their TV screen.
* AT&T Yahoo! Games, so U-verse TV customers can now play their favorite online games — including Sudoku, Solitaire, JT's Blocks, Mah-jongg Tiles and Chess — on the TV screen.

"Now more northeastern Ohio consumers can see why U-verse TV is such a compelling video choice," said Steve Mitchell, AT&T vice president and general manager for Ohio. "We're offering unmatched features, more HD channels than the local cable providers and all the Big Ten Network sports action that Ohio fans could want."

AT&T is the only national provider to offer a 100 percent Internet Protocol-based television (IPTV) service, making AT&T U-verse TV one of the most advanced television offerings available anywhere. AT&T is deploying next-generation video services, including AT&T U-verse TV, to connect people with their world, everywhere they live and work, and do it better than anyone else.

Customers who want additional information on AT&T U-verse TV — or to find out if it's available in their area — can visit http://uverse.att.com. They can also stop by the nearest AT&T retail location to learn more. To find the closest store, visit http://www.wireless.att.com/find-a-store/.

http://www.att.com/gen/press-room?pid=4800&cdvn=news&newsarticleid=25196

1. Not available in my area and I had to put my whole address in. Junk mail will be arriving shortly.:mad:
2. Still only 1 HD channel at a time?

They have a thing to fill out if you're interested in availability to contact you but I'll know when it's available. I'll just look for the weird box at the end of my street.

And that's still if it will become available. I don't see any reason why it shouldn't other then the fact that I'm in "Windstream" area. I would think the law they pushed through the state would still make them able to come in this area, but if they are using phone lines to tansmit this stuff I doubt Windstream will let them do that.

I don't know, it's all complicated.

I thought it was funny they were boasting about availability to 135,000 living units. Sorry, but that doesn't seem like a whole hell of a lot for a metro area with what, 3 million people ?

BTW, I see that they now offer a new higher speed internet tier of 10Mbps down/1.5 up. I wonder how they found more bandwidth for that but still can't do any more HD streams.

I see crews constructing boxes next to the current telco boxes in my neighborhood this week. I wonder how long it will be before they "turn it on".

I wonder if all phone lines will eventually go through the "lightspeed" boxes, or only the newer services (TV/Internet)

I see crews constructing boxes next to the current telco boxes in my neighborhood this week. I wonder how long it will be before they "turn it on".



I'll bet you do, that's all AT&T country where you live. I'm in Bainbridge.

I've never understood this "territory" stuff. Years ago they deregulated phone companies. At that time I lived in California so I thought that meant you would have a choice on how you could get your phone service. Remember, we're talking land line.

But that never happened. I couldn't get AT&T phone service here, I had to use Alltel (now Windstream). Matter of fact the only other service for land line phone that I see offered is that 1.800.4 a phone. Basically for people who didn't pay their bill and have no credit. And I'm not sure if they could give me a phone.

Same thing with cable. When cable was deregulated it was suppose to encourage competition. Didn't like TW, try WOW. But then our local communities made deals so we were still stuck with only one choice in most areas.

Now this other law allowing "competition" has been passed but so far the only competition is AT&T, who helped push the bill through. Why can't WOW come in my area. Or Comcast? Or Armstrong?

I don't get it.

I wonder whether the Uverse work is helping the regular DSL users too. Up until recently, I consistently was unable to get the highest speed DSL at my house (called Elite by ATT). Today I went to the website and was given the option for the faster speed! I'll do some testing to make sure I actually get it!

Hook, they can come and service you anytime they want to. The hang-up is, they have to install from scratch in your area. That costs loads of money. No one is willing to pay more than what they are now, so to recoup all those costs that "said company" had to fork out will take years. Apparantly, they're just not willing to make that investment.

Well, I went to the Kent TW office today with much better luck. The reps were MUCH friendlier and I got everything I needed. The rep also threw in Showtime and Cinemax for the same price I was paying for just HBO (now I get all 3). She also bumped me up to RR Turbo. I would recommend anyone going to that store if you are in the Kent area (its right off of SR 59).

Well, I went to the Kent TW office today with much better luck. The reps were MUCH friendlier and I got everything I needed. The rep also threw in Showtime and Cinemax for the same price I was paying for just HBO (now I get all 3). She also bumped me up to RR Turbo. I would recommend anyone going to that store if you are in the Kent area (its right off of SR 59).

Is the Showtime and Cinemax temporary or permanent?

Well, I went to the Kent TW office today with much better luck. The reps were MUCH friendlier and I got everything I needed. The rep also threw in Showtime and Cinemax for the same price I was paying for just HBO (now I get all 3). She also bumped me up to RR Turbo. I would recommend anyone going to that store if you are in the Kent area (its right off of SR 59).

I had to click on your prior threads to see what the heck you were talking about. You wanted like 3 boxes, right and they wanted to charge you for each one?

How could you get Showtime and Cinemax free? Has to be temporary or part of a package or the girl really liked you.

Was she good looking?;):D

Hook, they can come and service you anytime they want to. The hang-up is, they have to install from scratch in your area. That costs loads of money. No one is willing to pay more than what they are now, so to recoup all those costs that "said company" had to fork out will take years. Apparantly, they're just not willing to make that investment.

Now who are you talking about? AT&T or other cable companies or both?

I'm in a confused mode right now. I think I need a reboot.:eek:

Now who are you talking about? AT&T or other cable companies or both?

I'm in a confused mode right now. I think I need a reboot.:eek:

Anyone. They can route whatever they want to your house.
Where is the closest place that has XY-cable... 25 miles away. That means they have to install 25 miles of lines, equipment, wires to get XY-cable to you. That costs tons of money and they are not willing to spend it unless they are pretty sure that they are going to gain enough customers along the way to pay for all that "install".

Hook, they can come and service you anytime they want to. The hang-up is, they have to install from scratch in your area. That costs loads of money. No one is willing to pay more than what they are now, so to recoup all those costs that "said company" had to fork out will take years. Apparantly, they're just not willing to make that investment.

Are you referring to the fiber lines they have to install? I've seen phone company trucks around in Summit County installing new cables on the poles, probably for Uverse.

I had to click on your prior threads to see what the heck you were talking about. You wanted like 3 boxes, right and they wanted to charge you for each one?

How could you get Showtime and Cinemax free? Has to be temporary or part of a package or the girl really liked you.

Was she good looking?;):D

She was pretty good looking :rolleyes:. Anyway, the premiums are for one year, as is the entire package. I already have 2 boxes, one HD. I inquired about a third but they are dead out of the non DVR HD boxes. Although she said again that an additional HD DVR box would be 15 dollars a month (which still baffles me, thats alot) I wasn't going to get into that though because she was cool to me.

I left with:

RR Turbo, and new modem (I had DSL and am switching)
The premiums (HBO, Cinemax, Showtime, and the according HD channels, respectively)

I had (and still have):

2 boxes, one HD, one not
HDTV tier
HBO

I was spending close to 70 bucks a month for what I had, so in my opinion getting what I got for only about 30 bucks more (its going to be about a hundy a month for everything) is a pretty good deal in my opinion.

:eek:Wait till that year is over, you'll be in for a BIG shock!!:eek:

I won't even give Time Warner the time of day for their internet service unless they can beat SBC's $19.95.

:eek:Wait till that year is over, you'll be in for a BIG shock!!:eek:

I won't even give Time Warner the time of day for their internet service unless they can beat SBC's $19.95.

I know. I asked her what would happen after the year. She told me to call back and ask for another rebundle of services. I assume I can get the same sort of deal if not better in a year. Plus I am starting to like this RR turbo, 13 Megs down!

And...http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-sat_attfeb02,0,2670897.story

I know. I asked her what would happen after the year. She told me to call back and ask for another rebundle of services. I assume I can get the same sort of deal if not better in a year. Plus I am starting to like this RR turbo, 13 Megs down!

And...http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-sat_attfeb02,0,2670897.story


Heh Heh Heh. Of course she told you that. And there are packages available but not anywhere near what your getting now.

Heh Heh Heh. Of course she told you that. And there are packages available but not anywhere near what your getting now.

Then I'll drop the premiums I got (i didn't really want them to begin with, besides HBO) or the "Turbo" part of RR. Eh, I'll deal with it in a year. :p

Then I'll drop the premiums I got (i didn't really want them to begin with, besides HBO) or the "Turbo" part of RR. Eh, I'll deal with it in a year. :p

Yep, that's what I did and as far as the Turbo goes this (http://www.aroundcinci.com/speedtest/) is what they use to check the speed. It only shows download speed, not upload. Also notice that it goes to Cincinnati, not really around here. Really the only reason I have turbo is because I've got computers networked, TiVo, and I have VOIP.

When I didn't have the "turbo" I did notice that things slowed down a bit but everything worked just fine.

To my fellow D* subs and/or golf enthusiasts, DirecTV will be offering a unique experience and coverage for this year's Masters Tournament. D* will feature an exclusive dedicated channel that will be an interactive multi-screen coverage of this year's Tourney!

http://www.businesswire.com/portal/site/google/index.jsp?ndmViewId=news_view&newsId=20080220006180&newsLang=en

From above link......

The Masters Mix Channel will be available on DIRECTV channels 701 (standard-definition) and 706 (high-definition) and will offer the following views within a single screen, including:

* View One – CBS and ESPN’s live coverage of the Tournament.
* View Two – “Today’s Highlights” offers a continuously updating loop of the best shots from the day’s play with voice-over providing context and commentary.
* View Three – “Amen Corner” provides complete coverage of the most famous stretch – holes 11, 12 and 13 – of Augusta National Golf Club. The channel will provide a continuous view of play as the field challenges this most treacherous part of the course.
* View Four – Holes 15 (the par 5 Firethorn) and 16 (the par 3 Redbud) spotlights this especially difficult part of the course, which can make or break a golfer’s round.

Here's an example of a screen shot...

http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.engadgethd.com/media/2008/02/2-20-08-masters-mix-channel.jpg

Personally, I may not be moving from the HT the entire weekend of April 10-13th...:eek:

HD MM

There are alot of sports I don't watch and only really a few I do. I love baseball and football. I can watch basketball, but usually I'll fall asleep unless I'm at the game. I can watch beach volleyball. I can look at nascar though I don't understand anything it's kind of fun to watch in HD.

But golf? I don't get it. I just don't see what is so exciting about hitting a ball that isn't moving. Now I'm not talking about playing. I'm talking about watching.

I certainly wish I had D* for all the great HD channels they are offering, but you couldn't pay me to sit through that.

Now I say this because I want to know what the appeal is. I've often wondered who watches golf and I'd like to know why. And with the excitement you have of this upcoming event perhaps you can explain it to me.

HD MM

There are alot of sports I don't watch and only really a few I do. I love baseball and football. I can watch basketball, but usually I'll fall asleep unless I'm at the game. I can watch beach volleyball. I can look at nascar though I don't understand anything it's kind of fun to watch in HD.

But golf? I don't get it. I just don't see what is so exciting about hitting a ball that isn't moving. Now I'm not talking about playing. I'm talking about watching.

I certainly wish I had D* for all the great HD channels they are offering, but you couldn't pay me to sit through that.

Now I say this because I want to know what the appeal is. I've often wondered who watches golf and I'd like to know why. And with the excitement you have of this upcoming event perhaps you can explain it to me.

Hookster,

Please let me explain the appeal of Golf and it being available in HD.........

-The outdoor rolling landscapes of the various golf courses throughout the PGA Tour are quite enjoyable to look at in HD. The types of courses that the professionals play are like works of art. Having the ability to watch in HD allows me to see famous courses that I normally wouldn't see or play as an armature in stunning clarity and as if I was actually there in person. Quite simply, watching The Masters in HD is the next best thing to being at Augusta, Georgia and smelling the azalea's in person!

-As I mentioned before, I am a fan of the game and players. For an individual sport, I appreciate the competitiveness and history books that a certain player is chasing (Mr. Woods).

-The sport of golf is a cerebral experience of man vs. nature. The winner of a tournament is based on the grueling mental and physical challenge that is posed over 4 days. To me, the winner of this simplistic outdoor sport with great history is quite unique to any other sport out there.

And that my friend, is a few reasons why I enjoy the game of golf and am looking forward to the first major of the year; The Master's!

Hookster,

Please let me explain the appeal of Golf and it being available in HD.........

-The outdoor rolling landscapes of the various golf courses throughout the PGA Tour are quite enjoyable to look at in HD. The types of courses that the professionals play are like works of art. Having the ability to watch in HD allows me to see famous courses that I normally wouldn't see or play as an armature in stunning clarity and as if I was actually there in person. Quite simply, watching The Masters in HD is the next best thing to being at Augusta, Georgia and smelling the azalea's in person!

-As I mentioned before, I am a fan of the game and players. For an individual sport, I appreciate the competitiveness and history books that a certain player is chasing (Mr. Woods).

-The sport of golf is a cerebral experience of man vs. nature. The winner of a tournament is based on the grueling mental and physical challenge that is posed over 4 days. To me, the winner of this simplistic outdoor sport with great history is quite unique to any other sport out there.

And that my friend, is a few reasons why I enjoy the game of golf and am looking forward to the first major of the year; The Master's!

Now I could bet you would mention the landscape and such in HD. Even I can understand that.

And I don't think it's a simplistic sport. I understand the skill it takes to play the game. But I don't play and maybe that's why I don't get it.

Then again I don't play football or baseball anymore either, but I did as a kid. I've only golfed once in my life, when I was 16 and I just didn't find it very fun.

So I'll bet you play. I would think that people who play, and I know there are millions who do are probably the one's that appreciate it on TV.

I'll bet you do, that's all AT&T country where you live. I'm in Bainbridge.

I've never understood this "territory" stuff. Years ago they deregulated phone companies. At that time I lived in California so I thought that meant you would have a choice on how you could get your phone service. Remember, we're talking land line.

But that never happened. I couldn't get AT&T phone service here, I had to use Alltel (now Windstream). Matter of fact the only other service for land line phone that I see offered is that 1.800.4 a phone. Basically for people who didn't pay their bill and have no credit. And I'm not sure if they could give me a phone.

Same thing with cable. When cable was deregulated it was suppose to encourage competition. Didn't like TW, try WOW. But then our local communities made deals so we were still stuck with only one choice in most areas.

Now this other law allowing "competition" has been passed but so far the only competition is AT&T, who helped push the bill through. Why can't WOW come in my area. Or Comcast? Or Armstrong?

I don't get it.Get this, because I'm in AT&T territory I can chose another local phone company and AT&T still has to maintain the lines! It's similar to getting your gas or electric from another company, only better in that with gas & electric you still get a bill from Columbia or Dominion or First Energy, while with the local land line company I never see a bill from AT&T, only a smaller bill for equivalent service from a competing company.

This service is available in Summit county, but only for those with AT&T. Summit has some strange divisions in their telco lines (Verizon has the west suburbs of Akron, Windstream has the northern suburbs etc.). AT&T is usually found in the older neighborhoods, Those other (smaller) telcos reside in formerly rural areas. Now that these areas have built-up, perhaps AT&T will get the incentive to expand, and compete with, Windstream and Verizion. How long that will take is pure speculation. It's not impossible, and the fact that the smaller companies are surrounded by AT&T lines may actually make it practicable some day.

Geauga also has some limited AT&T presence in Chesterland and Burton (many years ago the government made Ohio Bell service those rural areas in an attempt to improve rural telephone service). So even in Bainbridge there is hope!

This service is available in Summit county, but only for those with AT&T. Summit has some strange divisions in their telco lines (Verizon has the west suburbs of Akron, Windstream has the northern suburbs etc.).

Of course, today's Verizon subscribers out west of Akron were once GTE subscribers. And as hookbill has already pointed out, Windstream is the former Alltel landline division.

I lived out in "GenTel" territory in eastern Medina County a number of years back. It was awful. Long after Ohio Bell had implemented touch tone dialing, GTE was actually using equipment that converted touch tones to pulse dialing!

And the line quality? Well, I'm guessing those noises I heard on the line were probably the squirrels eating the lines.

I've never understood this "territory" stuff. Years ago they deregulated phone companies. At that time I lived in California so I thought that meant you would have a choice on how you could get your phone service. Remember, we're talking land line.

But that never happened. I couldn't get AT&T phone service here, I had to use Alltel (now Windstream).
...
Same thing with cable. When cable was deregulated it was suppose to encourage competition. Didn't like TW, try WOW.
...
Now this other law allowing "competition" has been passed but so far the only competition is AT&T, who helped push the bill through. Why can't WOW come in my area. Or Comcast? Or Armstrong?

I don't get it.

Get this, because I'm in AT&T territory I can chose another local phone company and AT&T still has to maintain the lines! It's similar to getting your gas or electric from another company, only better in that with gas & electric you still get a bill from Columbia or Dominion or First Energy, while with the local land line company I never see a bill from AT&T, only a smaller bill for equivalent service from a competing company.

I've been dealing with this for many years, a boatload of phone companies, and a ton of phone lines spread out all over Ohio and West Virginia. This is what I've learned.

The deregulation basically allows any phone company to provide services wherever they want. When a CLEC (new telco to the area) decides to provide service to an area, they have two choices:

1. Build out an entire infrastructure covering the area - apply for the necessary permits, install boxes all over the place, and run hundreds of miles of cable. Very expensive.

2. Lease existing lines from the ILEC (phone company already established in the area). This is much more affordable, but the CLEC needs to rely on the ILEC to maintain the lines. The deregulation rules require the ILEC to allow the CLEC to lease their copper, provided the CLEC has the equipment in place to provide the service.

Option 1 almost never happens - it's way too expensive for most telcos, since they have no guarantee they'll be able to recover the cost.

Option 2 requires the CLEC to install switching equipment close enough to the ILEC central office to provide the service reliably. The ILEC provides the copper, but the CLEC needs to provide the actual service. Given that DSL doesn't travel more than around 18,000 feet of cable and POTS lines are limited by a logarithmic formula based on quality of the copper, this limits the CLEC in the area that can be serviced based on where their switching equipment is installed. (More simply, a CLEC can't install equipment in Cleveland and expect to service Canton just by leasing lines - just doesn't work that way.)

I could go on, but this is getting pretty wordy...

The same rules basically apply to cable companies. The problem for them is that option 2 really doesn't exist - the coax can't be easily shared between two cable providers, which pretty much requires a new cable company to run their own lines everywhere.

FYI:

CLEC - Competitive Local Exchange Carrier
ILEC - Incumbent Local Exchange Carrier
POTS - Plain Old Telephone Service (your average phone line)

Mike

"I'll bet you do, that's all AT&T country where you live. I'm in Bainbridge.

I've never understood this "territory" stuff. Years ago they deregulated phone companies. At that time I lived in California so I thought that meant you would have a choice on how you could get your phone service. Remember, we're talking land line.

But that never happened. I couldn't get AT&T phone service here, I had to use Alltel (now Windstream). Matter of fact the only other service for land line phone that I see offered is that 1.800.4 a phone. Basically for people who didn't pay their bill and have no credit. And I'm not sure if they could give me a phone.

Same thing with cable. When cable was deregulated it was suppose to encourage competition. Didn't like TW, try WOW. But then our local communities made deals so we were still stuck with only one choice in most areas.

Now this other law allowing "competition" has been passed but so far the only competition is AT&T, who helped push the bill through. Why can't WOW come in my area. Or Comcast? Or Armstrong?

I don't get it."

It's simple, Decisions disguised as Democracy do NOT empower the people, but rather continue the privilige of a few........The preservation of privilige requires the excercise of power......The power to inform or dis-inform.....continuing the perpetually rejuvenated illusion of choice.

Ohoooo-kay...

I lived out in "GenTel" territory in eastern Medina County a number of years back. It was awful. Long after Ohio Bell had implemented touch tone dialing, GTE was actually using equipment that converted touch tones to pulse dialing!

And the line quality? Well, I'm guessing those noises I heard on the line were probably the squirrels eating the lines.

In 1975 I was in college and living at home, my family moved from west Akron to Granger Township in Medina county. I was stunned to learn that they were still on party lines. It's a strange feeling when you pick up the phone to make a call and you hear one of your neighbors talking. As I remember, it actually took a few years before we got a private line. I always thought that GTE seemed to be stuck in the stone age.

TWC updated Road Runner overnight with a new appearance to the Web Mail page. Unfortunatly all E-mail in my inbox was lost. My wive called me at work and just got off the phone trying to get some explaination. Apparentlly everyone lost there mail. I told her calm down. Hopefully they figure out how to recover the lost e-mail in a few days. My wife worked in IS for years and said she would have been fired if she put in a new system with this kind of result. Perhaps she should apply at TWC/RR

Ray

TWC updated Road Runner overnight with a new appearance to the Web Mail page.

Ray


Apparently they haven't moved all of their subscribers to this new webmail page yet. I was on adelphia's email servers, and my web mail page (which is a roadrunner.com page) is unchanged.

Apparently they haven't moved all of their subscribers to this new webmail page yet. I was on adelphia's email servers, and my web mail page (which is a roadrunner.com page) is unchanged.

I'm in Mentor. I spoke with someone I work with from the Akron area and he is OK too. I cant wait to see how the first week of March goes with the channel lineup changes due.

Ray

TWC updated Road Runner overnight with a new appearance to the Web Mail page. Unfortunatly all E-mail in my inbox was lost. My wive called me at work and just got off the phone trying to get some explaination. Apparentlly everyone lost there mail. I told her calm down. Hopefully they figure out how to recover the lost e-mail in a few days. My wife worked in IS for years and said she would have been fired if she put in a new system with this kind of result. Perhaps she should apply at TWC/RR

Ray

Why use Road Runner? I use G Mail. I also use it as my client.

Yeah there are one or two things you can't do maybe but for them most part it's reliable.

Same thing with cable. When cable was deregulated it was suppose to encourage competition. Didn't like TW, try WOW. But then our local communities made deals so we were still stuck with only one choice in most areas.

The true story of why there is no WOW in Parma today:
Before WOW was WOW it was Amreicast, as in Ameritech's attempt to get into the cable TV business as an overbuilder. This was around the same time as the 216 area code split. Parma which is served by 3 different central offices was going to be split between 216 and 440. The mayor would not give Americast a franchise to operate cable in Parma unless all of Parma stayed in 216. Ameritech countered that they had no say in the determination of where the area code split was to happen (it was a "committee" of citizens that determined the a/c split, I bet all of the exchanges where the committee lived stayed in 216 - how else could you explain places like Hunting Valley staying in 216, so far away from the central city).

Why use Road Runner? I use G Mail. I also use it as my client.

Yeah there are one or two things you can't do maybe but for them most part it's reliable.

The other upside to using a non-provider based email system is not being tied to your HSI provider.

The other upside to using a non-provider based email system is not being tied to your HSI provider.

Yep, we are in the process of changing ISPs and it will be a hassle moving everything from the email they gave us to new ones. I am moving everyone in our house to GMail, like myself. Not being tied to an ISP for email is pretty important. I think Gmail is better anyway...

Attn: local D* subs.....

I was just flipping through DirecTV's guide data on my HR20 and noticed on FSN-OH HD (channel 637-1) there was a message for "Upcoming: The Assasination of Jesse James" movie! Well, I arrowed forward until Saturday February 23nd and sure enough, it lists the HD showing of Jesse James at 12am! This is significant since this movie just came out Feb. 5th and I've never seen FSN show movies. Is this some kind of error? I'm having enough trouble trying to rent this Blu-Ray from Blockbuster Online and to be able to have a new release available through D*'s local RSN programming is quite exciting. Anyone have any ideas if this is for real?

It's either a data error or a PPV offering being sent on the FSN-OH part time HD stream. I wouldn't get too excited.

If I had money to burn, I'd bet it on the fact that the guide data is a mistake.

If you look through the guide, you'll see PPV movies in a number of the -1 HD RSN channels. I have also seen them during off periods in the NHL & NBA channels.


It's either a data error or a PPV offering being sent on the FSN-OH part time HD stream. I wouldn't get too excited.

I got my hands on the Zenith coupon eligible converter box. So far it has been very impressive. I have one TV in my kitchen with the rod type rabbit ears that they used to ship with the TV. They are on a plastic post that slips into a hole on the back of the set.

Last night I took the Zenith stb home and attached it to the kitchen TV. I didn't touch the alignment of the antenna and used the RF out of the stb on ch 3 into the TV.

I live about 6 miles from WFMJ, WYTV, WKBN and about 15 miles from WNEO. I am able to get slightly ghosty pictures from the Youngstown stations and a very snowy picture from WNEO in Salem. I have to adjust the antenna for each station otherwise the picture fades, ghosts, and the audio gets noisey when I move around the kitchen.

After the Zenith did it's auto scan I was able to get all the above stations perfectly with no breakups without moving the antenna. The Zenith has a signal meter that showed almost full scale in the "GOOD" zone on all channels. I adjusted the rabbit ears to optimize the digital signal level and got pretty much unwatchable pictures on analog.

In other words the Zenith box impressed me. It has RF out and video/stereo audio outputs. The EPG is simple and shows "now" and "next". It has all the closed captioning. It does NOT have an analog tuner and does NOT have a QAM tuner. It's also pretty small - about 9" wide and 6" deep. It does come with a remote which I think can be programmed to your TV set, but I haven't done that, mainly because I didn't read the manual.

Your reception description is confusing. Were you using the Zenith box when you had the snowy, ghosty, and fade or were you describing how your analog tuner performed in the kitchen tv and how the PQ improved with the Zenith box?

Your reception description is confusing. Were you using the Zenith box when you had the snowy, ghosty, and fade or were you describing how your analog tuner performed in the kitchen tv and how the PQ improved with the Zenith box?

I was describing how the PQ improved. Since it's only a digital tuner, you don't get snow or ghosts.

I was describing how the PQ improved. Since it's only a digital tuner, you don't get snow or ghosts.

Yes, I understand, which is why I was confused why you may have been describing those issues with a digital tuner.

If you look closely to that Sat night discription of Jesse James on STO, you will see a small $ sign. My guess is that it is a PPV, but they don't show a price.

Ben Music

If you're looking for answers for what's going to happen in your particular area a call to customer service won't be necessary. That's because I just tried and the very nice person I talked to said there is going to be a change, when it happens they don't know, it will affect all areas.

So, based on that statement I would think that we will soon all be on the same channels. I'm betting it doesn't happen to former Adelphia customers. At least not by March 4.

He said he may know a bit more around March 4. I will try some of my contacts as we get a bit closer and see what I can find out.

As a TiVo owner the good news is if they do a massive channel change and they use the lineup that they have posted here (http://www.twcguide.com/media/change-flyer.pdf) it shouldn't be too difficult to get TiVo to do the changes.

If you're looking for answers for what's going to happen in your particular area a call to customer service won't be necessary. That's because I just tried and the very nice person I talked to said there is going to be a change, when it happens they don't know, it will affect all areas.

So, based on that statement I would think that we will soon all be on the same channels. I'm betting it doesn't happen to former Adelphia customers. At least not by March 4.

He said he may know a bit more around March 4. I will try some of my contacts as we get a bit closer and see what I can find out.

As a TiVo owner the good news is if they do a massive channel change and they use the lineup that they have posted here (http://www.twcguide.com/media/change-flyer.pdf) it shouldn't be too difficult to get TiVo to do the changes.

The rep at the Kent TW office told me "Mid-March", but the website said the 4th, so we will have to wait and see...

In other words the Zenith box impressed me. It has RF out and video/stereo audio outputs. The EPG is simple and shows "now" and "next". It has all the closed captioning. It does NOT have an analog tuner and does NOT have a QAM tuner. It's also pretty small - about 9" wide and 6" deep. It does come with a remote which I think can be programmed to your TV set, but I haven't done that, mainly because I didn't read the manual.

Interesting review... thanks. They must be using a Gen5 (or better) tuner in there to get such good results.

I recall that Zenith has always jumped into new broadcast technologies with both feet. IIRC, they were one of the creators of MTS stereo, and they had a lot of input into the ATSC standards. I'm sure that today's Zenith is nothing like the old company (the quality goes in before the name goes on), but it's nice to know that they're still out there in some form.

Interesting review... thanks. They must be using a Gen5 (or better) tuner in there to get such good results.

I recall that Zenith has always jumped into new broadcast technologies with both feet. IIRC, they were one of the creators of MTS stereo, and they had a lot of input into the ATSC standards. I'm sure that today's Zenith is nothing like the old company (the quality goes in before the name goes on), but it's nice to know that they're still out there in some form.

My cockatoo will be happy. He's been worrying bout this for some time. And I'm sure he will appreciate the better signal.:)

I gotta get that coupon for him.

I'm sure that today's Zenith is nothing like the old company (the quality goes in before the name goes on), but it's nice to know that they're still out there in some form.

Zenith is now an arm of LG, which makes 5th generation ATSC chips. Makes sense. :D

Oh, if I am reading right from another thread, the Insignia (store brand) coupon-eligible tuner from Best Buy is identical to the Zenith box.

Zenith is now an arm of LG, which makes 5th generation ATSC chips. Makes sense. :D

That's right, I forgot that they're a part of Lucky-Goldstar now. Yep, makes sense. This bodes well for the DTV transition.

I have a Dvico external USB tuner that's based on a 5th gen tuner and it works extraordinarily well, even with the simple rod antenna that it comes with.

My cockatoo will be happy. He's been worrying bout this for some time. And I'm sure he will appreciate the better signal.:)

I gotta get that coupon for him.

He'll have to give us a full squa... er, report. ;)

He'll have to give us a full squa... er, report. ;)

Well, I put in for the coupon. I see the LG (Zenith) box at around 60 bucks. TVChief21, did you purchase one or did it fall into your hands because of what you do?

Then there's the Wal-Mart special Magnavox for 49.95. That would cost me 9 bucks.

If I can even pull in one digital signal in that room I'll be happy. The analog looks like crap all the time. And I can't afford an HDTV for the bird right now.:)

And I can't afford an HDTV for the bird right now.:)

That's one lucky bird! :D:D:D:D

Like one of Oprah's dogs! LOL :):):)

That's one lucky bird! :D:D:D:D

Like one of Oprah's dogs! LOL :):):)

It's kind of like this. Tyler (the cockatoo) is a very intelligent bird. Actually he is smart enough to pick the lock on his cage and break out which is why I have to use a padlock on his cage. His intelligence level is around a 2-4 year old child. Since he can pick locks he may be smarter then that.

Unfortunately Tyler acts like a 2-4 year old child. He screams if he doesn't get attention, throws tantrums, will destroy a room if he gets out of the cage unsupervised so he has to be kept in his own room. He hs two other smaller birds as companions and I don't think he gives a hoot for either of them.

So we give him a TV so he has something to either hear or look at during the day. Does he watch? Who knows. I've heard him get pretty upset however during basebal games when the Cardinals or Orioles are playing and they are losing.:D

If the Browns are on he screams the entire time. So I keep it on FOX 8.

OK most of this I'm joking about but I do use FOX 8 because that and channel 19 are the best analog channels to come in and come on, would you want your kids to watch Action 19 news?:eek:

Since the picture is always full of ghost and stuff I figure I'll give the analog converter box a shot because birds can see more pixels then we can. Theory being, clearer picture, quieter bird.

And for those who wonder he isn't kept like a prisoner. He is brought out daily and watches TV in the afternoons when I'm home. He's a big fan of Cops, loves the theme song, and he also likes rock concerts on DVD.

My wife named him after Stephen Tyler of Aerosmith because he moves his beak like Stephen does his lips.

I did a quick QAM scan on the plasma we have for the heck of it. I was surprised to find all of the local OTA's mapped to the correct places (3-1, 5-1, etc...). But what surprised me even more is that a few premiums worked their way through, 2-3 of them to be exact. It was in the 80's range. It was neither HBO or Cinemax. Other than that nothing real big, couple of PPV preview channels, Lifetime, and GSN of all channels...

I've been toying around getting one of those new converter boxes just to play around with it, but I decided to just get one of the rebate cards first. :D

I don't really even "need" it on this little TV downstairs, as it's hooked to cable, but that'll be the likely place it goes.

And hookbill? Agreed. I wouldn't wish "19 Action News" on my worst enemy. Let alone a poor bird. :D

There's a new video at TWC guige.com(http://twcguide.com/video.phtml). In this video describing the lineup I saw the following on a different channel lineup card in the video:

403 WKYC/NBC CH3 HD
404 WOIO/CBS CH HD
405 WEWS/ABC CH5 HD
406 WUAB/MNTV CH43 HD
407 WBNX/CW CH55 HD

Pause about 42 seconds into the video to see it.

Looks like Time Warner may be adding WBNX HD as well. Also they're going with a better numbering system
(3 on 403, 5 on 405).

Later in the video there are screencaps of cable channels and the program guide with the new lineup in it. Again, the program guide shown in the new video is Passport. Hmmm...

I got my hands on the Zenith coupon eligible converter box. So far it has been very impressive. I have one TV in my kitchen with the rod type rabbit ears that they used to ship with the TV. They are on a plastic post that slips into a hole on the back of the set.

Last night I took the Zenith stb home and attached it to the kitchen TV. I didn't touch the alignment of the antenna and used the RF out of the stb on ch 3 into the TV.

I live about 6 miles from WFMJ, WYTV, WKBN and about 15 miles from WNEO. I am able to get slightly ghosty pictures from the Youngstown stations and a very snowy picture from WNEO in Salem. I have to adjust the antenna for each station otherwise the picture fades, ghosts, and the audio gets noisey when I move around the kitchen.

After the Zenith did it's auto scan I was able to get all the above stations perfectly with no breakups without moving the antenna. The Zenith has a signal meter that showed almost full scale in the "GOOD" zone on all channels. I adjusted the rabbit ears to optimize the digital signal level and got pretty much unwatchable pictures on analog.

In other words the Zenith box impressed me. It has RF out and video/stereo audio outputs. The EPG is simple and shows "now" and "next". It has all the closed captioning. It does NOT have an analog tuner and does NOT have a QAM tuner. It's also pretty small - about 9" wide and 6" deep. It does come with a remote which I think can be programmed to your TV set, but I haven't done that, mainly because I didn't read the manual.


TY for the review, I'm taking it that the Digital signal is then more reliable in your area then the analog? I looked at the box a CC but don't have the coupon as of yet, is there a channel guide on this & how is the RF out on 3 or 4 set?? via a internal setup I take it.

I recieved 2 pieces of mail from AT&T today & expected them to be the pitch on U Verse, much to my surprise it was something on Agreements with PUCO.

Looks like AT&T is getting ready to screw me again, just how I don't know yet, bad enough I only have a 5-10 mile calling radius.

There's a new video at TWC guige.com(http://twcguide.com/video.phtml). In this video describing the lineup I saw the following on a different channel lineup card in the video:

403 WKYC/NBC CH3 HD
404 WOIO/CBS CH HD
405 WEWS/ABC CH5 HD
406 WUAB/MNTV CH43 HD
407 WBNX/CW CH55 HD

Pause about 42 seconds into the video to see it.

Looks like Time Warner may be adding WBNX HD as well. Also they're going with a better numbering system
(3 on 403, 5 on 405).

Later in the video there are screencaps of cable channels and the program guide with the new lineup in it. Again, the program guide show is passport. Hmmm...

I don't understand what you mean by the program show guide is passport.

The numbering system in my area has been like that for some time. 703, 704, 708 and 705.

That little blip of WBNX is good news. Now that is not what I would call an easter egg but still a nice find. Still, don't get to excited. I really think that at least for a bit they are going to have several problems as the transfers occure, and that has to be expected.

And again I have to remind you that they have to use cable cards except on their existing DVD's. Eventually there will have to be a recall. Hopefully they will work out a good deal of the bugs on that new machine, just like they did on the SA 8300 SARA.:D

Dude....get a TiVo. :) Or go satellite if you can.

One other thing. It irritates the crap out of me with all that talk about the new line up when you go to your area there is no new information, just the same channel line up. What's the point of doing that?

Sorry, it was a typo. Fixed now:D I find that interesting because I follow the Navigator forum and someone in Florida(I believe) said he got a card in the mail about a Navigator transition. With the letter mailed in NE Ohio as well as the new website, Navigator has not been shown or mentione even once. Just by the way this channel realignment is being announced, you'd think a change in UI would also be announced and material about it would be sent out. As a FORMER Navigator user, it truly is a NIGHT and DAY difference. I could see lots of complaints over it. Many features you know and love now will be gone.

Akron started on the right track with WJW on 508. Then they screwed up and put channels in odd places all the way up to WEW on 551. I like the way that works b/c all the locals are in a straight shot between 403 and 408.

Still wish they'd tell us when this is going to happen. They have been doing something at night. I've noticed several channels not working at night and that pesky black stripe btw the left sidebar and the picture is showing up on more channels over 100.(I'll have photo to show later).

I thought it was an easter egg. It's like they are trying to keep this a secret(maybe finalizing contracts??). Hookbill has asked several times and they gave a generic answer. I hope it's coming in time for new "SuperNatural" later this season. I'm ready to get my DTV converter coupon and try OTA.

I'm not really sure they will recall boxes because of OCAP(that would be alot of boxes). There is a loop hole, any boxes activated BEFORE 7/1/07 are "grandfathered" in. I got a non-OCAP box back in August. If they do a Navigator conversion or box recall I'm saying F---it and going with OTA. I'll miss alot of cable channels and recording, but at least it's NOT Navigator!!

I don't understand what you mean by the program show guide is passport.

The numbering system in my area has been like that for some time. 703, 704, 708 and 705.

That little blip of WBNX is good news. Now that is not what I would call an easter egg but still a nice find. Still, don't get to excited. I really think that at least for a bit they are going to have several problems as the transfers occure, and that has to be expected.

And again I have to remind you that they have to use cable cards except on their existing DVD's. Eventually there will have to be a recall. Hopefully they will work out a good deal of the bugs on that new machine, just like they did on the SA 8300 SARA.:D

Dude....get a TiVo. :) Or go satellite if you can.

One other thing. It irritates the crap out of me with all that talk about the new line up when you go to your area there is no new information, just the same channel line up. What's the point of doing that?

Not for the legacy TW foks,
NBC for us is 521
FOX is 508 (maybe the only one that is lined up correctly)
I think ABC is 551.

I'm not really sure they will recall boxes because of OCAP(that would be alot of boxes). There is a loop hole, any boxes activated BEFORE 7/1/07 are "grandfathered" in. I got a non-OCAP box back in August. If they do a Navigator conversion or box recall I'm saying F---it and going with OTA. I'll miss alot of cable channels and recording, but at least it's NOT Navigator!!

I don't think they will recall either actually but I know just the thought of it makes the hair on the back of your neck stand up so I like to mention it from time to time.;)

I'll stop doing that. I'm going to review that menu again and try to see what you mean by "passport."

Edit: OK, I see what you're saying but I don't know if what you see is "passport" really.

I assume you've seen a different menu for Navigator software which is why you say this guide menu is "passport." First, with the channel line up you currently have are you able to program for first run only, no repeats? If the answer to that question is yes then the guide you are looking at is not a "passport" menu, it's simply the menu guide is used by TW in your area. But even if you're answer is no that still does not mean it is passport software. It is just the guide they picked to use the demonstration.

I know you can't do this but if you were able to look at a Non DVR HD box, one of the older ones in your area you would see the same guide.

In my area the guide on my HD STB looks exactly like the one on my SA 8300 SARA. Probably TW in your area uses a different service provider for guide service. So what you are seeing is just the guide, not the software.

The SA 8300 SARA is also capable of running first run only but the guide provider Adelphia used didn't give us that info so we were not able to do that.

With so many different STB's and DVR's probably TW will continue to provide the same guides for those boxes. That's good news for you because it means so long as your DVR doesn't break you will continue to be able to use passport.

One difference in the current local HD lineups, the difference which is being transported to the new merged digital lineup: If TWC/legacy NEO had done the same as Adelphia, mirroring their HD locals as 70x (where x=where the station is in the analog lineup), they'd have had 502 (WKYC), etc...since the Akron/Canton system has the locals in analog on odd numbers due to signal ingress issues.

I noted from the PDF lineup card that it does appear STO HD gets its own channel, so I assume they'll run the 24/7 STO HD feed starting in April. Unlike the "Cavaliers HD" channel, it's specifically marked as "Sportstime Ohio HD", not "Indians HD".

The lineup card doesn't specify the locals' HD numbers, so no WBNX-HD is listed there. Presumably they do that since some areas will have different local HD channels - i.e. Youngstown vs. Cleveland/Akron/Canton.

:eek:
You could get the "little 3" from Lake County! Wow! That's actually a good sign. It means the "ridge" is not blocking your view of at least one of the Parma towers (the "little 3" all reside on WBNX's stick). WOIO is right next door to WBNX on Ridgewood Dr. If you can get the LP's you may have better luck with WOIO-DT. Just be sure you have an extremely directional antenna since the interference form Canada will cause havoc wit WOIO in the warmer months ahead.

EDIT: I just reread your post. You mentioned 32 (I mistook it for 35). 35, 53, and 65 are on the WBNX tower. 32 OTOH is transmitted from the top of a building in Downtown Cleveland (somewhere around E 9th & Lakeside judging from the map on the FCC site). They had a C.P. to move to the WBNX stick however I see no sign that it ever happened (due to my poor reception of 32 in comparison to the other 3 LP's that I know are on WBNX's tower.

Little 3, meaning WKYC-2-DT? strange thing in my tests on 3-DT, I get about a 70-80% signal in the daytime to no signal to 40 at night.... they reducing power, or atmospheric conditions?

Unfortunately no heartbeat at all from 35 which would be the choice of the LP's, 32 is an all Infomertial station.... no loss.

I know about polarization I found out antenna in my my attic setup is not completely level & actually points slightly "up" toward the towers, seemed to work a bit better at least with the analog, I had corrected it to level with slightly less results.

Someone a while back posted sample maps of ground elevation contour maps (likely to street level) with color that seemed to corespond with the colors in Antennaweb, what site were those from?

To answer a couple questions about the box, I got it through the National Association of Broadcasters as part of the education program. It just showed up here.

The RF output is menu selectable to 3 or 4.

The guide is simple, it shows "now" and "next".

Probably the best feature is the EZ scan. It's great for those that have to move antennas. You can do a scan in one direction, repostion or rotate the antenna then do an EZ scan and it will only add new channels and not delete the ones already scanned.

It does seem to be more reliable than all the ATSC tuners I've got here. Most of which are 2nd generation.

Anyone else havign WOIO DT problems? I turned on The Price Is Right and nothing is there. Just a grey screen. Channel 540(WOIO DT2) jus thas a plain blue screen instead of WeatherNow. Of course WUAB works fine :rolleyes:

WOIO's main channel is now working.

EDIT:

There's still mad macroblocking on WOIO. Every few seconds it blocks up and there's even audio drop out.

Anyone else havign WOIO DT problems? I turned on The Price Is Right and nothing is there. Just a grey screen. Channel 540(WOIO DT2) jus thas a plain blue screen instead of WeatherNow. Of course WUAB works fine :rolleyes:

EDIT:

There's still mad macroblocking on WOIO. Every few seconds it blocks up and there's even audio drop out

WOIO's main channel is now working..


When you get a gray screen that usually means their HD transmitter is down. Everytime I've come here to ask when these things happen OTA people also say it's down.

I'm not seeing macroblocking at all. Probably that SA 8300 that you're using.

Little 3, meaning WKYC-2-DT? strange thing in my tests on 3-DT, I get about a 70-80% signal in the daytime to no signal to 40 at night.... they reducing power, or atmospheric conditions?

Unfortunately no heartbeat at all from 35 which would be the choice of the LP's, 32 is an all Infomertial station.... no loss.

I know about polarization I found out antenna in my my attic setup is not completely level & actually points slightly "up" toward the towers, seemed to work a bit better at least with the analog, I had corrected it to level with slightly less results.No, this has nothing to do with WKYC. I saw that you listed 3 LPTV stations: 32, 53, & 65. I get a snowy signal on those and I can see the tower out my window! 2 of the 3 signals come off the WBNX tower, so if you get any picture at all on 53 & 65 (as well as 35 which ironically you don't get) you should have no problems getting WBNX-DT, and hopefully WOIO-DT which is right next door, with that same antenna.

When I read Nidkdawgs post about WOIO off the air I took a look and saw it was on. I noticed however that dobly 5.1 is not working and they have it on all the time.

I just checked again and still no Dolby 5.1. Have they changed the way the are handling that? Are they just turning it on at nights now?

When I read Nidkdawgs post about WOIO off the air I took a look and saw it was on. I noticed however that dobly 5.1 is not working and they have it on all the time.

I just checked again and still no Dolby 5.1. Have they changed the way the are handling that? Are they just turning it on at nights now?

God I hope so!! I've found that non-network proramming sounds better forced into 2 Channel Stereo. I call it "WOIO Viewing Mode". I :mad:HATE:mad: that faux surround WEWS, WUAB and WOIO do.

Probably that SA 8300 that you're using.

Funny. :D:D:D

The macroblocking happened during TPIR. I watched the noon news and there was just freezing and audio dropout. I came back around 4:30 and it works fine, except it's in 2.0. I actually like it in 2.0.

To answer a couple questions about the box, I got it through the National Association of Broadcasters as part of the education program. It just showed up here.

The RF output is menu selectable to 3 or 4.

The guide is simple, it shows "now" and "next".

Probably the best feature is the EZ scan. It's great for those that have to move antennas. You can do a scan in one direction, repostion or rotate the antenna then do an EZ scan and it will only add new channels and not delete the ones already scanned.

It does seem to be more reliable than all the ATSC tuners I've got here. Most of which are 2nd generation.

TY 21Chief, as some said the "Guide" is included, I briefly tested a Panasonic analog DVR that included a guide. I was kind of lead to believe the guide was similar to that. Just wondeerd if the Zenith/LG included this or would the RCA or Phillips have this, in the long run I'm not looking for features but sensitivity, as I had posted before I think the Manufactures have been skimping on the Tuners since "everyone" has Cable now.

That EZ Scan sounds nice, I think most tuners delete, & sometimes impossible to add manually.

No, this has nothing to do with WKYC. I saw that you listed 3 LPTV stations: 32, 53, & 65. I get a snowy signal on those and I can see the tower out my window! 2 of the 3 signals come off the WBNX tower, so if you get any picture at all on 53 & 65 (as well as 35 which ironically you don't get) you should have no problems getting WBNX-DT, and hopefully WOIO-DT which is right next door, with that same antenna.

WBNX DT doesnt seem to be a problem, its WKYC at nights, & of course WOIO especialy during band openings.

53, 65, & 32 are snowy, but watchable, & actually 23 provides a very watchable picture with a light grain most of the time. I take it 59 DT is not operational either, nor do I expect to recieve that DT.

Ah, I get ya with the little 3 :), the FCC databsae lists 65 as 44 analog (???) with an application of 44 Digital, along with an application for another LP on 7 on the farm.

WBNX DT doesnt seem to be a problem, its WKYC at nights, & of course WOIO especialy during band openings.

53, 65, & 32 are snowy, but watchable, & actually 23 provides a very watchable picture with a light grain most of the time. I take it 59 DT is not operational either, nor do I expect to recieve that DT.

Ah, I get ya with the little 3 :), the FCC database lists 65 as 44 analog (???) with an application of 44 Digital, along with an application for another LP on 7 on the farm.
If you check out the FCC site a lot you will see that the same people and/or organizations keep requesting LPTV permits all over the place. I guess there is nothing to lose to request 10 different applications hoping one sticks.

BTW 32 had an app. some time ago to move to the same coordinates as WBNX (i.e. joining the "little 3").

God I hope so!! I've found that non-network proramming sounds better forced into 2 Channel Stereo. I call it "WOIO Viewing Mode". I :mad:HATE:mad: that faux surround WEWS, WUAB and WOIO do.

WUAB is still in Dolby 5.1 so I'll bet what you saw with the macorblocking and stuff may be the reason why they pulled Dolby 5.1.

Don't be surprised if it's not on tonight. I don't think I'm recording anything on WOIO tonight, since the writers strike the only thing I think I'm recording from CBS is Big Brother and that's the wife's show. She wouldn't be able to tell if it's in Dolby 5.1 or not anyway.

Oh and Survivor. Do they use the "faux" Dolby 5.1 on those shows, because if they do that really doesn't sound to bad. I do need to crank the back speakers up a bit but all and all better then Pro Logic II.

Someone a while back posted sample maps of ground elevation contour maps (likely to street level) with color that seemed to corespond with the colors in Antennaweb, what site were those from?

There's a sticky at the top of the HDTV Reception Hardware forum with Google Earth mapping info:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=821480

To answer a couple questions about the box, I got it through the National Association of Broadcasters as part of the education program. It just showed up here.

The RF output is menu selectable to 3 or 4.

The guide is simple, it shows "now" and "next".

Probably the best feature is the EZ scan. It's great for those that have to move antennas. You can do a scan in one direction, repostion or rotate the antenna then do an EZ scan and it will only add new channels and not delete the ones already scanned.

It does seem to be more reliable than all the ATSC tuners I've got here. Most of which are 2nd generation.

What's really cool is that new "Smart Antenna (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=909018)" feature where the tuner talks to the smart antenna and adjusts for the best reception from any direction. Unfortunately it seems most of the coupon-eligible tuners don't implement this.

I checked and it was on by primetime. I also checked just now to see if that's the way it's going to stay, off in the day on at night.

Sorry nickdawg, back to all doby 5.1 all the time. They probably had something break and were able to repair it by evening.

TV21CHIEF the box you got is very reasonable priced, Radio Shack has it for around 70 bucks. But the Magnavox box at Wal-Mart is only 49.95.

Now I don't want to buy something that doesn't work and you mentioned the EZ scan feature on the Zenith box. Since I get poor analog reception anyway I'm thinking the Zenith box may not have that.

I don't have my coupon yet and I wonder if I tried the Magnavox box if I would get either a full credit or my coupon back at Wal-Mart. I'll have to investigate further.

TW sent out an offer for a free HD DVR today! All I need to do is bring in my HD STB and they would be happy to give it to me for free (for a limited time).

It will probably be the SA 8300 with Navigator software....um, no thanks. You'll take that HD STB from me either when I get a TiVo HD DVR or you pry it from my cold dead hands.:D

TV21CHIEF the box you got is very reasonable priced, Radio Shack has it for around 70 bucks. But the Magnavox box at Wal-Mart is only 49.95.

Now I don't want to buy something that doesn't work and you mentioned the EZ scan feature on the Zenith box. Since I get poor analog reception anyway I'm thinking the Zenith box may not have that.

I don't have my coupon yet and I wonder if I tried the Magnavox box if I would get either a full credit or my coupon back at Wal-Mart. I'll have to investigate further.

I was thinking of just buying the box without the coupon first, then rebuying it with the coupon if I'm satisfied with the results. CC has the Zenith box, but no price was on it & was in a bit of a hurry to find someone & ask. Now is LG coming out with this box too, along with Insignia Best Buy version which I was told would be 59.99?

One other question on this box, it only covers ch 2-69 on the broadcast band & not the upper band cable channels, right?

& something for 21Chief, I understand this whole digital switchover was so our goverment could sell of the airwaves.. thus from something I read within the past few years, broadcast channels 59-69 were going bye bye... true or false?

Selling air?? :) ... who would fall for such a scheme? I'll give it 75-100 years & you will be paying for air itself! ;)

There's a sticky at the top of the HDTV Reception Hardware forum with Google Earth mapping info:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=821480

TY, Ouch, big downloads :D, but thats what I was looking for. :)

One other question on this [Zenith] box, it only covers ch 2-69 on the broadcast band & not the upper band cable channels, right?

Right as this is a ATSC/8VSB only tuner (no NTSC, no ATSC/QAM).

& something for 21Chief, I understand this whole digital switchover was so our goverment could sell of the airwaves.. thus from something I read within the past few years, broadcast channels 59-69 were going bye bye... true or false?

Selling air?? :) ... who would fall for such a scheme? I'll give it 75-100 years & you will be paying for air itself! ;)

As we celebrate mediocrity all the boys upstairs want to see
How much you'll pay for what you used to get for free. - Tom Petty/The Last DJ

Actually that line was a direct shot at American Idol. But so true in just about everything today.

thus from something I read within the past few years, broadcast channels 59-69 were going bye bye... true or false?It more than that, it's 52-69 that's going by-by. That's the reason why WVPX never turned on it's DTV assigned signal on ch 59. Why invest in equipment to broadcast on a frequency that will have to be vacated?

This may also explain why some of the LPTV stations have analog requests on new channels.
the FCC database lists 65 as 44 analog (???) with an application of 44 Digital, along with an application for another LP on 7 on the farm.

I checked and it was on by primetime. I also checked just now to see if that's the way it's going to stay, off in the day on at night.

Sorry nickdawg, back to all doby 5.1 all the time. They probably had something break and were able to repair it by evening.

I saw that during 2 1/2 Men an Old Christine. Both sounded good. Then the 11pm news came on and sounded like crap(pun intended). Back to using my "WOIO Viewing Mode". :D:D

Tune to channel 399. There is information about the new line up. I haven't seen any dates, but they do run through the line up and WBNX-DT is again listed as # 407.

Tune to channel 399. There is information about the new line up. I haven't seen any dates, but they do run through the line up and WBNX-DT is again listed as # 407.

Again, not in our area. If there is any info I'll go see if I can find it on my upstairs HDSTB just in case TiVo isn't picking it up, but the channel had no info when I looked.

Again, not in our area. If there is any info I'll go see if I can find it on my upstairs HDSTB just in case TiVo isn't picking it up, but the channel had no info when I looked.

I went through every channel on the HD STB analog, digital, HD and not one word on the cable line up change.

Again I think this will happen primarily to old Comcast and TW customers first. In the old Adelphia area it may be a little bit more difficult to pull off. I'm not saying it won't happen in March, but if I were a betting man my money is saying it may be down the road awhile for us.

Channel 399 is available in the Dover/New Phila area. We were Adelphia customers.

Channel 399 is available in the Dover/New Phila area. We were Adelphia customers.

I kind of had the feeling that someone from respond from the old Adelphia people. I thought I should have posted "maybe some Adelphia people" but I decided that sticking my foot in my mouth was a better idea.:o

Ok, checking my google map first you are farther South then Akron and second in distance to my house you're about the same as Pittsburgh PA.

So let me modify my statement now by saying the people in the old Adelphia who have HD channels in the 700's are going to be the problem child. Probably Northeast Cleveland and others who have those tiers for HD channels.

I kind of had the feeling that someone from respond from the old Adelphia people. I thought I should have posted "maybe some Adelphia people" but I decided that sticking my foot in my mouth was a better idea.:o

Ok, checking my google map first you are farther South then Akron and second in distance to my house you're about the same as Pittsburgh PA.

So let me modify my statement now by saying the people in the old Adelphia who have HD channels in the 700's are going to be the problem child. Probably Northeast Cleveland and others who have those tiers for HD channels.

HeHeHeee :D. You back pedal almost as good as Senator Clinton. :D;)

It looks like DirecTV is trying to sign up CW HD locals around the country. They added four today in different large markets. Hopefully Cleveland isn't too far down the list. They also are adding the MyNetwork stations at the same time.

I just read this from Ohio Media Watch (http://ohiomedia.blogspot.com/):

WVIZ - Believe it or not, after years of headaches, there's some possible "good news" for Cleveland's PBS affiliate in the land of digital TV.

WVIZ will be staying on its pre-transition digital channel 26, abandoning 25. But the Ideastream-owned PBS affiliate has had a long-running legal dispute with CBS Radio, which owns its tower site (CBS' WNCX/98.5 is there).

Is there an end, soon? Read the report...

IDEASTREAM FINALLY DEVELOPED A LEASE MODIFICATION THAT IS BELIEVED TO MEET CBS'S NEEDS AND A COMPLETE PROPOSAL WITH EXHIBITS WAS SUBMITTED TO CBS FOR APPROVAL. FURTHER INFORMATION WAS REQUESTED BY CBS AND IT HAS BEEN PROVIDED, BUT IDEASTREAM DOES NOT YET HAVE AN EXECUTED LEASE MODIFICATION SO THAT WORK CAN BEGIN.

Once that agreement takes effect, the application says a side-mounted temporary facility at the North Royalton site would take about six months, and they'll request an STA for it. They say the final, top-mounted, post-transition facility "WOULD NOT BE IN PLACE UNTIL SOME TIME BETWEEN FEBRUARY 17, 2009 AND AUGUST 17, 2009". WVIZ's application says the station would apply for an extension to cover that, if this plan is what is decided upon.

But whatever power level the side-mounted STA facility would specify, either way, WVIZ-DT would finally be on an actual tower, and not on a small tower that barely clears the roof of the station's former studio building on Brookpark Road in Parma...

So let me modify my statement now by saying the people in the old Adelphia who have HD channels in the 700's are going to be the problem child. Probably Northeast Cleveland and others who have those tiers for HD channels.

Actually, we do have the HD's in the 700's, but I get your point.

:)

Actually, we do have the HD's in the 700's, but I get your point.

:)


That point is I should keep my mouth shut because obviously I'm wrong about everything today.:o

Well, we shall see. I really wish if they are going to do something around here they would give us some heads up.

Once that agreement takes effect, the application says a side-mounted temporary facility at the North Royalton site would take about six months, and they'll request an STA for it. They say the final, top-mounted, post-transition facility "WOULD NOT BE IN PLACE UNTIL SOME TIME BETWEEN FEBRUARY 17, 2009 AND AUGUST 17, 2009". WVIZ's application says the station would apply for an extension to cover that, if this plan is what is decided upon.


What a joke. ANOTHER 18 months for them, and as I suspected they will blow past the analog cutoff date. Pathetic.

What a joke. ANOTHER 18 months for them, and as I suspected they will blow past the analog cutoff date. Pathetic.

Hey, don't shoot the messenger.:D

I was just giving you OTA folks a little info, I know you guys talk about WVIZ frequently.

Hey, don't shoot the messenger.:D

I was just giving you OTA folks a little info, I know you guys talk about WVIZ frequently.


Great, but how so is this "Good News"? ... I hadn't heard too much about this lately, 6 months without PBS, & speaking of which are they upgrading the repeaters to DT or will they go dark...

Meaning...
63 in Montville & 64 in Conneaut.

They had a few more one in Twinsburg & 22 in Gates Mills, years back

It more than that, it's 52-69 that's going by-by. That's the reason why WVPX never turned on it's DTV assigned signal on ch 59. Why invest in equipment to broadcast on a frequency that will have to be vacated?

This may also explain why some of the LPTV stations have analog requests on new channels.

Don't hear all too much on 23,, so 59 never went on? I'm assuming 23 will go DT at the switchover on 23 since they have an app in for 23DT

I guess then 55 will keep it's ID as Virtual channel 55 & #'s will basically be meaningless then?

Great, but how so is this "Good News"? ... I hadn't heard too much about this lately, 6 months without PBS, & speaking of which are they upgrading the repeaters to DT or will they go dark...

Meaning...
63 in Montville & 64 in Conneaut.

They had a few more one in Twinsburg & 22 in Gates Mills, years back

It is good news in that WVIZ finally has a plan and (tentative) completion date. Prior info was "yeah, someday, when 20 other things take place, we might get around to puting up a more permanent transmitter". :)

I cant get WVIZ-HD on TW!

I cant get WVIZ-HD on TW!

Do you get any PBS HD Channel? If not, you should be able to get WVIZ.

Do you get any PBS HD Channel? If not, you should be able to get WVIZ.

I can get 45/49 so it isn't too big of a deal. It's listed, TW has it, but it was pixelated for some time and now just shows a Grey screen when I try to access it. It used to work, so I don't know what is up. All of the other HD channels work fine.

I can get 45/49 so it isn't too big of a deal. It's listed, TW has it, but it was pixelated for some time and now just shows a Grey screen when I try to access it. It used to work, so I don't know what is up. All of the other HD channels work fine.

What are you using to tune in with?

Grey screen usually means a broadcast problem but I just checked and I'm getting it fine. I'm not too far away from you, I'm in Bainbridge.

What are you using to tune in with?

Grey screen usually means a broadcast problem but I just checked and I'm getting it fine. I'm not too far away from you, I'm in Bainbridge.

I'm using SA8300HD *hookbill enters anti-8300 pun here*.

I just checked the channel again, and now it comes in, and is very pixelated and unwatchable. I find this odd- it's the only HD channel I really have trouble with...

Perhaps weak cable signal? I thought we had pretty good strength but I could be wrong. WNEO HD looks fine.

:D:D

Proud Owner of the SA 8300HD
TiVo HD? TiVo S3? Don't make me laugh!!!!
$900 Unit. Hundreds of dollars on additional service fees. Extra $$$ to make it SDV compliant. NOT FOR ME!! :D:D

Do you get any PBS HD Channel? If not, you should be able to get WVIZ.

I plug right into my TV without a box and get WVIZ in HD on 25-1. Sometimes it jumps to 103-1. Time Warner Cable (University Heights, OH)

I'm using SA8300HD *hookbill enters anti-8300 pun here*.

I just checked the channel again, and now it comes in, and is very pixelated and unwatchable. I find this odd- it's the only HD channel I really have trouble with...

Perhaps weak cable signal? I thought we had pretty good strength but I could be wrong. WNEO HD looks fine.

:D:D

Have them check your signal. Either that or you may need a new DVR. Caution: If you've got passport software you'll probably get the SA 8300 with Navigator and those are big time problems.

I plug right into my TV without a box and get WVIZ in HD on 25-1. Sometimes it jumps to 103-1. Time Warner Cable (University Heights, OH)

Same for me in Mayfield Heights.

Proud Owner of the SA 8300HD
TiVo HD? TiVo S3? Don't make me laugh!!!!
$900 Unit. Hundreds of dollars on additional service fees. Extra $$$ to make it SDV compliant. NOT FOR ME!! :D:D

nickdawg, I can't believe you want to go toe to toe with me on this but ok, if you insist.

First, you can get an S3 or a TiVo HD much cheaper then what I originally paid for it now. I'm not sure what you can get an S3 for but I've seen prices as low as 500.00 and even cheaper. A TiVo HD at Best Buy is 250.00.

For your money you get a better quality HD picture at least with the S3. You also get the ability features like TiVo to Go, TiVo to Come Back, you can play your music on your computer through your TiVo. I have 8 days worth of music and play it wireless though my TiVo. You get a larger hard drive and eSATA or you can install a larger hard drive sine you own it. Search features are so much better then the SA 8300, there is the wish list (I'm still waiting for Forest Gump in HD) so even if something isn't on and you want it you can find it. True, no on demand but I don't use on demand and since I have 750 gb if I want to watch something on HBO I'll simply record it. If I start to run out of space I can simply move my shows to my computers hard drive.

And then there's Amazon Unbox which downloads directly to your TiVo, you can play Avi. files from your computer on your TiVo. They offer Rhapsody if you want that. HD photo and slide show from your computer. If your into podcast that's available along with weather and traffic info.

The guide go further out then the one that TW offers so you can see what's coming up. I believe passport allows priority in setting up your progamming, SARA did not. Can you set your programming to record "first run only"? I know the SA 8300 is capable of that but it wasn't able to do it in my area. Maybe you can in your area.

I won't go after passport software because I've never used it but you and I both know what SARA is like.

From time to time lifetime service is offered, though I admit that's rare. I paid 299.00 for 3 years service.

Many people at the TiVo forum actually have figured out that when you take off the DVR charge and DVR fee, remember they charge for both of that, it's actually cheaper to buy the TiVo in the long run

There are all kinds of other features like swivel search. That's kind of like surfing on the internet maybe looking at something and then you see something else and you move in that direction. For example you search for a certain movie and you see who directed it. Then you can have TiVo search for other movies by that director, or actor. All kinds of things you can do with that.

Also the S3 and TiVo HD record OTA. I don't use that but if I wanted to get an antennae and drop cable all together, I could.

Hows that SA 8300 doing on that OTA reception?

Can you watch something recorded on your SA 8300 in another room without running a wire?

Can you transfer programs to your computer?

Can you play avi. files?

The bottom line is this: If you are happy with the DVR you have then I say stay with what you've got. I'm not going to go through all thre reasons I wasn't happy with the SA 8300 SARA but it certainly doesn't sound like Navigator is any improvement.

Anyway, I just love TiVo. I like the interface, the 30 second skip and tick, the ability to stop two recordings and watch live tv and go back to those recordings. My first DVR was a TiVo and after I got the SA 8300 the interface and lack of features was so bad I could never get use to it.

The extra dollars for the USB is to be determined but for superior quality and more important its reliability it's worth it.

I just took a look at the on line letter that was sent out to all of us about the line up change. In the letter it says the following:

We are excited about these changes and invite you to learn about them online or on your television. Details are available at www.twcguide.com
or on channel position 399 once your lineup has changed.

So I suppose that even I'm going to get affected by this probably within a week or so. And just like everyone else I'll have to reprogram my season passes.

I guess if there is any good news about this most of my season passes that are not in HD are on the analog channels. So long as they are running repeats of my network shows I can set up season passes for those, otherwise I will have to create wish lists.

It is good news in that WVIZ finally has a plan and (tentative) completion date. Prior info was "yeah, someday, when 20 other things take place, we might get around to puting up a more permanent transmitter". :)

Oh, I'm so disappointed now since what little TV I watch is usually on PBS, I guess I can do without it for 6 months. No 49 & no 54 (WQLN), I guess I'll get over it.

I thought the plan was "next spring"? :D

As we celebrate mediocrity all the boys upstairs want to see
How much you'll pay for what you used to get for free. - Tom Petty/The Last DJ

Actually that line was a direct shot at American Idol. But so true in just about everything today.

How true, I guess thats just why I don't buy into a lot of fads myself.

I'll bet the FCC will start charging for Amateur renewals soon.

Oh, I'm so disappointed now since what little TV I watch is usually on PBS, I guess I can do without it for 6 months. No 49 & no 54 (WQLN), I guess I'll get over it.

I thought the plan was "next spring"? :D

The biggest disappointment about WVIZ IMHO is no Dolby 5.1 and sometimes they have some real good concerts.

Then again they usually show up sooner or later on HDnet. In 5.1.

The biggest disappointment about WVIZ IMHO is no Dolby 5.1 and sometimes they have some real good concerts.

Then again they usually show up sooner or later on HDnet. In 5.1.

They're also on WNEO-HD at the same time(PBS-HD). WNEO has Dolby 5.1.

IMHO, WVIZ is absolutely WORTHLESS. I was pissed when it was added to my cable last year. Probably b/c Adelphia had WVIZ and TW had WNEO. When they combined, everyone gets everything.

Also, WNEO has a better multicast channel. I like the true digital feed of WNEO-SD. WVIZ can keep their stupid "Ohio Channel".

Did anyone else recall the letter they received in the mail from Time Warner about the lineup change indicate that the change would happen March 1st? I tossed the letter so maybe I'm remembering wrong but I really thought that's what it said.

Well, it's March 1st and no new lineup, no new HD channels in the 400 range.

Did anyone else recall the letter they received in the mail from Time Warner about the lineup change indicate that the change would happen March 1st? I tossed the letter so maybe I'm remembering wrong but I really thought that's what it said.

Well, it's March 1st and no new lineup, no new HD channels in the 400 range.

With all respect my friend, we've been talking about it for about a week now.;)

The letter said around March 4th. Some people say customer service, who knows less then we do said around mid March.

If you can get channel 399 then you're probably due for the change soon. Check it out. If you can't receive channel 399 (like myself) then it will probably happen a bit later.

No one really knows, and that includes TW. I've tried all my contacts and they are closed mouth on the subject.

If you looked 4 post above you will see I made a comment. Since your mouse may not be working or your arrow key I will put it here for you:

We are excited about these changes and invite you to learn about them online or on your television. Details are available at www.twcguide.com
or on channel position 399 once your lineup has changed.

They're also on WNEO-HD at the same time(PBS-HD). WNEO has Dolby 5.1.

IMHO, WVIZ is absolutely WORTHLESS. I was pissed when it was added to my cable last year. Probably b/c Adelphia had WVIZ and TW had WNEO. When they combined, everyone gets everything.

Also, WNEO has a better multicast channel. I like the true digital feed of WNEO-SD. WVIZ can keep their stupid "Ohio Channel".WVIZ-SD was finally added as a subchannel to WVIZ-DT awhile ago. The Ohio Channel has been on both WNEO & WVIZ since the beginning of digital OTA.

They say we get WNEO in our area, it's on the guide (http://www.timewarnercable.com/CustomerService/CLU/TWCCLUs.ashx?menu=Programming) but we don't get it. I wish we did get it.

Oh and I asked customer service about this and got the "no you don't get it" then had them look at the web site and they said "gee, golly, I don't understand, we will look into it."

That was about a year ago.:D

They say we get WNEO in our area, it's on the guide (http://www.timewarnercable.com/CustomerService/CLU/TWCCLUs.ashx?menu=Programming) but we don't get it. I wish we did get it.

Oh and I asked customer service about this and got the "no you don't get it" then had them look at the web site and they said "gee, golly, I don't understand, we will look into it."

That was about a year ago.:D

That's the kind of BS that just floors me. At the very least, correct the website to reflect the correct information.:mad::(:rolleyes:

With all respect my friend, we've been talking about it for about a week now.;)

The letter said around March 4th. Some people say customer service, who knows less then we do said around mid March.

If you can get channel 399 then you're probably due for the change soon. Check it out. If you can't receive channel 399 (like myself) then it will probably happen a bit later.

No one really knows, and that includes TW. I've tried all my contacts and they are closed mouth on the subject.

If you looked 4 post above you will see I made a comment. Since your mouse may not be working or your arrow key I will put it here for you:

We are excited about these changes and invite you to learn about them online or on your television. Details are available at www.twcguide.com
or on channel position 399 once your lineup has changed.


oops...sorry about that hook. Got a new job, been in San Francisco almost 3 out of 4 weeks each month since November and have been out of the loop. Thought I recalled March 1st, came back to this thread for the 1st time in many months, did a quick scan, saw the comments about channel 399 but didn't compute that it related to my question about what date (I didn't see a date even though I'm sure it's here in a post you made ;) ). Been to the TWCguide.com many times in the last few days, didn't see a reference to a date. I thought my letter that I got a month back said March 1st, my mother-in-law said March 1st so thus, I thought it was march 1st. Thus, I asked if it was March 1st. My bad. Guess it makes me realize all the fun I've been missing in this thread... Mouse is working just fine thanks. :rolleyes:

oops...sorry about that hook. Got a new job, been in San Francisco almost 3 out of 4 weeks each month since November and have been out of the loop. Thought I recalled March 1st, came back to this thread for the 1st time in many months, did a quick scan, saw the comments about channel 399 but didn't compute that it related to my question about what date (I didn't see a date even though I'm sure it's here in a post you made ;) ). Been to the TWCguide.com many times in the last few days, didn't see a reference to a date. I thought my letter that I got a month back said March 1st, my mother-in-law said March 1st so thus, I thought it was march 1st. Thus, I asked if it was March 1st. My bad. Guess it makes me realize all the fun I've been missing in this thread... Mouse is working just fine thanks. :rolleyes:

Well, you know me. You can't ask a simple question when you're a regular around here without getting a little heat.;)

That's the kind of BS that just floors me. At the very least, correct the website to reflect the correct information.:mad::(:rolleyes:

Oh, I've asked that very same question and the answer I got was it wasn't that "easy" to correct something on their web site channel guide.

If you want to see something really funny take a look at this (http://www.timewarnercable.com/MediaLibrary/4/1/Content%20Management/Customer%20Service/documents/ADCCChannels8106/TWCCWK-5013%20NEO%20IP%20LU-ClevSub_072006c.pdf). Notice the HD channels have INHD 1 and INHD 2, and The Tube. That's on page 3 so you will need to scroll down. And I believe several of their digital channels have changed as well.

Why even keep this page on the web?

Why even keep this page on the web?

EXACTLY:rolleyes:

The NEW lineup is here!!!

http://www.twclineup.com/lineups0208/TWNEO5935SuburbanCleveland3MigrationLU022008.pdf

The NEW lineup is here!!!

Didn't work for me. This link did, though:
http://www.twcguide.com/media/change-flyer.pdf

It shows all of the channel starting at 101 for TWC NEO.

The link above should be working now. It was an HTML code error. I threw an extra "http://" in there.

http://www.twclineup.com/lineups0208/TWNEO5935SuburbanCleveland3MigrationLU022008.pdf

OK. That's the line up. Now when is it going to happen?

I hope it's this week, if I need to contact TiVo I'll have more time. But that link alone should be enough to get them working on it.

I'm apologizing for this in advance, but I can't resist!

TiVo's gonna crash and burn when the lineup changes. But not my 8300HD!! :D

I couldn't resist!

What do you think will happen on March 4 with the new channels? Will they show up somewhere even if the lineup didn't change yet? The Programming notices page also said some SD digital channels were being added/removed. Will that be happening on March 4? I'm hoping, lineup change or not, the new channels show up on Tuesday. Maybe somewhere in the 600s.

TiVo's gonna crash and burn when the lineup changes. But not my 8300HD!! :D

I couldn't resist!



dude, your SA 8300 is going to have the same problems I'm going to have. We will have to reschedule our season passes, but I won't have as many to do as you since I have many shows on wish list which is not channel sensative.

Now as far as the line up change goes, I think TiVo will have a crystal clear idea about it. I sent my good friend Steve Fry an email reminding him to make sure that TiVo is aware of the changes.

But let's say that doesn't happen and I'm stuck with the old line up. All it will take to get it change is that nice little link that you provided and an email to TiVo. It will be done in 24 hours.

But I think Mr. Fry will make sure they are aware of exactly when it will happen.

And your SA 8300 sucks, passport or not.:p

http://www.twclineup.com/lineups0208/

I think it's pathetic that the stuff under 100 is not standardized. I know most of it will not be around much longer but they should have taken what they will be required to carry after 2/17/09 (LOCAL BROADCAST CHANNELS) and put them on the actual channel they are(ie 3 on 3, 5 on 5, 8 on 8, 19 on 19 and so on). That would end alot of confusion, especially if cable picks up any SD customers after the transition.

Also, any thoughts on what will happen to the channels under 100 after the switch? On digital boxes will there be virtual channels mapped to TWO places: the existing nimber and the new number or will the existing numbers "go away"? I hope the second happens because it will make it worse flipping channels and using the guide to have channels in multiple places(as some are now).

are you guys happy that wbnx is listed at channel 407? :)

It's about time. WBNX has been on air for almost a year. It better be going live ON March 4th!!!

I think it's pathetic that the stuff under 100 is not standardized. I know most of it will not be around much longer but they should have taken what they will be required to carry after 2/17/09 (LOCAL BROADCAST CHANNELS) and put them on the actual channel they are(ie 3 on 3, 5 on 5, 8 on 8, 19 on 19 and so on). That would end alot of confusion, especially if cable picks up any SD customers after the transition.

I think that depends upon how you look at it and what you are use to. For me, the local line up for the channels you mention make perfect sense. They all are on the correct channel except channel 19 and that's been on channel 4 in my area for years. You left out "My 43" (with good reason:)) but it has always been on my lineup on channel 6. I automatically go to 4 or 6 if I want those channels. And I do the same with the HD channels as well, except I'll have to het use to a "4" to start instead of a "7".

Also, any thoughts on what will happen to the channels under 100 after the switch? On digital boxes will there be virtual channels mapped to TWO places: the existing nimber and the new number or will the existing numbers "go away"? I hope the second happens because it will make it worse flipping channels and using the guide to have channels in multiple places(as some are now).

I have some thoughts on that. The answer to your question is it will be mapped to different places. They've been doing that with analog locals for a couple of years. My first thought is "why?" We already know that the way this will be done is by upgrading the analog signal from the hub to a digital signal, but personally I'd prefer to let my DVR do it (even if I had one of those cheapo SA 8300's;)) My next thought was I noticed they eliminated the analog channels of the local stations which in my area were in the 800's. Same reason, I'd rather record their analog and let my S3 upconvert. I would think the local analog channels may be "hidden", but where? Unless they can get into the 1000's then there is no place to hide them.

So either we will get analog versions of the locals, which is fine with me or the local channel analog versions will be hidden. It will be easy for DVR users to tell because if they have their DVR's hooked up to digital sound they will see PCM 48 for analog or Dolby 2.0 for digital. TiVo people will know because we will hear the sound that TiVo makes when you change channels even if you arn't hooked up to a digital receiver.

But I'll bet you a snow free winter that those digital versions of the channels like FX and USA will be nothing more then upgraded analog from the hub. The good news is that if you don't like it you can still use the analog channel and let your DVR upgrade for you.

But why do that? Why put them in two spots? Well, if you think like a cable company wouldn't the logical thing be to give them about a year maybe two and then send out a letter saying "these channels will only be available on digital cable. If you would like to continue to see these channels then you will need a digital converter."

That would be fine with me and you to nickdawg becaue we would at least get real digital signals of these channels. All speculation but in the evil mind of a cable company it makes perfect sense to me.

im a Cox subscriber now, but moving to Avon so it will either be TW or DirecTV.

Is CavaliersHD supposed to be FSN HD? Or do they only turn it on when the Cavs are playing?

The thing about that channel is its a game time only channel for the cavs....but dont expect consistency like STO had for the indians....the games are random (meaning not every home game) but there are a I guess fair amount of HD games...but it is a game time only channel no matter what the provider. Now as far as the reason why they do this I dont know, and maybe someone else can explain this



Edit: did you know we have the #2 most posts in our thread behind NEW YORK, way to go cleveland the #14 tv market..

Well, you know me. You can't ask a simple question when you're a regular around here without getting a little heat.;)

True enough! No issues. Just a bit grumpy yesterday I guess. :)

Now let's hope they get this going in the next week!! I have my doubts!

I have a feeling that the new digital packages that TW is making is going to cost more to get the same channels that I do now.

I think it's pathetic that the stuff under 100 is not standardized. I know most of it will not be around much longer but they should have taken what they will be required to carry after 2/17/09 (LOCAL BROADCAST CHANNELS) and put them on the actual channel they are(ie 3 on 3, 5 on 5, 8 on 8, 19 on 19 and so on). That would end alot of confusion, especially if cable picks up any SD customers after the transition.

I often thought of this while being somewhere with Cable (I've never had cable at least where I was paying a seperate bill for it & you pay for this confusion & aggravation?)

I never understood the logic in this except to "Cluster" the channels putting the locals into a straight block,which never was done anyway. Around here it really should have been all channels on their coresponding channel numbers, WTBS on 17 (which is it's regular broadcast channel in Atlanta) WWOR on 9, WGN on 6 ... ect.

Now with the new digital positions the channel numbers are really meaningless for us OTA people too. :(

TV21CHIEF the box you got is very reasonable priced, Radio Shack has it for around 70 bucks. But the Magnavox box at Wal-Mart is only 49.95.

Now I don't want to buy something that doesn't work and you mentioned the EZ scan feature on the Zenith box. Since I get poor analog reception anyway I'm thinking the Zenith box may not have that.

I don't have my coupon yet and I wonder if I tried the Magnavox box if I would get either a full credit or my coupon back at Wal-Mart. I'll have to investigate further.

I'm test driving a Magnavox, its actually made by Funi (as I thought) rather than Philips as reported somewhere.

The Zenith box is 59.99 @ Circuit City.

http://www.twclineup.com/lineups0208/



When does all this take effect?