I've got a new antenna that had been sitting around for years. It looks like a Radio Shack VU-90 XR, I believe this is a large directional antenna. I've ordered a Spartan 3 amp from Channel Master but haven't got it yet.

The only reason I can think of why I can't get WCAX when they have the tallest antenna and are broadcasting at higher power than WFFF is the Dish Network 622 DVR. It looks like any signal in the low 50% is cut off. While turning the antenna to get the strongest signal I noticed that when I turned it to a point where WFFF got in the low 50s the grean "locked" signal bar disapeared and just said signal lost, not locked in red.

I've got a new antenna that had been sitting around for years. It looks like a Radio Shack VU-90 XR, I believe this is a large directional antenna. I've ordered a Spartan 3 amp from Channel Master but haven't got it yet.

The only reason I can think of why I can't get WCAX when they have the tallest antenna and are broadcasting at higher power than WFFF is the Dish Network 622 DVR. It looks like any signal in the low 50% is cut off. While turning the antenna to get the strongest signal I noticed that when I turned it to a point where WFFF got in the low 50s the grean "locked" signal bar disapeared and just said signal lost, not locked in red.
WCAX is my weakest signal (65-75%) and I have direct line of sight on the towers. It could have more to do with channel 53 than anything else. The gain on many antennas starts falling off in the upper channels.

It's ironic that I get WCAX at 98% while you just get it around 70, and you can get WVNY while I can't as it constantly goes under 50.

It's ironic that I get WCAX at 98% while you just get it around 70, and you can get WVNY while I can't as it constantly goes under 50.
Foxfan,
I think it's weird too, but I do have a high-band VHF antenna for WVNY. I tried without the VHF and only get 32% on WVNY with my DB4. If I had it to do all over again knowing about WVNY going with channel 13, I would have gotten a 4221 or, even better, a 4228, but had erroneous info that they would all be UHF.
I wonder if a homemade antenna cut for 13 taped to the DB4 and connected to the 300 ohm screws on the DB4 would be effective. Or, I could just leave the high-band VHF on the mast.

Foxfan,
I think it's weird too, but I do have a high-band VHF antenna for WVNY. I tried without the VHF and only get 32% on WVNY with my DB4. If I had it to do all over again knowing about WVNY going with channel 13, I would have gotten a 4221 or, even better, a 4228, but had erroneous info that they would all be UHF.
I wonder if a homemade antenna cut for 13 taped to the DB4 and connected to the 300 ohm screws on the DB4 would be effective. Or, I could just leave the high-band VHF on the mast.

I tried that and it did work, I had a steady lock without drop out.

I've seen a good tutorial on making antennas from twin lead, but can't seem to find it now. Would an antenna for channel 13 be a 26" length of twin lead?
Okay, I found it by Googling "cheap tv antenna" and it is a 26" folded dipole. I guess that I'll tape it to a dowell and attach it to the mast somehow. Or just leave the VHF antenna on the mast.

I am wondering if anyone has any info on the southerly range of CBMT-DT. I am using a Channel Master Antenna and live in White River Jct, VT? Just set up the TV/antenna and get 3.1, 3.2, 5.1, 5.2, 20.1, 20.2, 22.1, 22.2, 31.1, 33.1, 33.2, 41.1, 41.2, 44.1, 44.2. But no CBC, and no CTV in digital. Any suggestions?

I understand it is broadcast on Channel 20 and re-maps to 6.1.

Thanks (first-time poster)

hckyfan, I don't know why you aren't getting CBC-DT. Perhaps its power level is too low.

CTV doesn't broadcast digitally at this time.

I am wondering if anyone has any info on the southerly range of CBMT-DT. I am using a Channel Master Antenna and live in White River Jct, VT? Just set up the TV/antenna and get 3.1, 3.2, 5.1, 5.2, 20.1, 20.2, 22.1, 22.2, 31.1, 33.1, 33.2, 41.1, 41.2, 44.1, 44.2. But no CBC, and no CTV in digital. Any suggestions?

I understand it is broadcast on Channel 20 and re-maps to 6.1.

Thanks (first-time poster)

hey hckyfan, I'm across the river from you in Lebanon, from where I am in leb its only 66 miles to Mansfield, but its 143 to Mont Royal. Also, CBC from Montreal is broadcasting at 107 kW, both of these probably factor in to why you're not receiving it in White River. Your best chance would be to pick up SRC, channel 19 which remaps to 2.1 from Montreal. It's broadcasting at 1000 kW but watching it wouldn't be very entertaining to someone who doesn't speak French.

Even if you can receive CBC Montreal's analogue programs on channel 6, you might have trouble getting CBC-HD. The analogue transmitter is atop Mount Royal but the digital transmitter is at a significantly lower elevation atop the CBC/RC building in downtown Montreal. Because of its lower elevation there might be obstructions that block the digital signal from your location but present no problem for the analogue signal. As an example, Mount Royal itself blocks the digital signal from reaching any location on Montreal's West Island. Where I live in Pointe Claire I would need a 1000+ foot tower to receive it (same with Radio Canada's HD on channel 19).

There is no indication from CBC as to when this "temporary" situation will be resolved. Too much politics involved. Maybe 2008, maybe not. I was told that the brass at CBC rejected a proposed ,low cost, temporary solution to tide them over until they can move their antenna to Mount Royal. That would have involved putting a low power "translator" atop the dome on the Oratory on Mount Royal so that their HD signal would reach the West Island.

As for CTV? If they have any plans for CFCF digital, they are unwilling to divulge them. Their attitude seems to be that they consider Montreal to be too small an english speaking market to bother with in the foreseeable future. Their lack of progress anywhere outside of Toronto and Vancouver seems to confim that. Since the Mount Mansfield stations have come on-line I hardly watch CFCF any more. To hell with BCE and their evil empire. (ExpressVu, CTV, CHUM Ltd.) Better yet it's high time the CRTC squashed them like bugs on a windshield, but they don't have the guts.

Global? They have the weakest analogue signal in town. They don't give a damn about OTA in Montreal, analogue or digital. To hell with them too.

Cableguy,

In a previous post you mentioned that Williston was gearing up to deliver HD locals. By any chance would you have any info on the Montpelier area? So far I have been unable to get much info out of Comcast's CSR's.

Thanx, MrJ

Since all stations are broadcasting digital from the top of Mansfield, you don't need a rotor. Use to find the compass direction, then use a compass to point your antenna. The site will also suggest what type of antenna you need. BTW, their info on WPTZ is wrong, so use the WFFF azimuth for pointing your antenna.

And 57 is not a station?

And 57 is not a station?

Maybe SkiSmuggs isn't a Daniel O'Donnell fan. :)

Seriously though, a lot of new members probably aren't even aware that WCFE-HD (57.1) and WCFE-SD (57.2) have been on the air for well over 2 years, broadcasting on channel 38 from Lyon Mountain, NY.

Anyone else loose WPTZ? A few days ago I lost the signal leaving me only with WFFF. I installed a Channel master Spartan 3 amp and now get WCAX too but still no WPTZ.

Maybe SkiSmuggs isn't a Daniel O'Donnell fan. :)

Seriously though, a lot of new members probably aren't even aware that WCFE-HD (57.1) and WCFE-SD (57.2) have been on the air for well over 2 years, broadcasting on channel 38 from Lyon Mountain, NY.
Being east of Mt Mansfield, I can't get WCFE, so although 57 is a live channel, it is of no consequence to me. So when I speak of all stations, I speak only of the 5 Burlington area locals. No offense to 57 but I am also leaving out the thousands of other stations around the country that I can't get. :)
And who is Daniel O'Donnell?
A solution some folks use when desired channels are in different directions is to use two antennas and combine the output.

And who is Daniel O'Donnell?


An Irish country/pop singer who has done a few specials for PBS, including a 4-hour live show from Branson Missouri. He is a long-time favourite on many PBS stations, including WCFE.

A question for techno57. Will WCFE be showing the new "Doctor Who" at any time in the near future? So far 2 13-week seasons and 2 Christmas specials have aired. CBC shows it in Canada. Season 3 will be making its debut soon on BBC.

An Irish country/pop singer who has done a few specials for PBS, including a 4-hour live show from Branson Missouri. He is a long-time favourite on many PBS stations, including WCFE.

A question for techno57. Will WCFE be showing the new "Doctor Who" at any time in the near future? So far 2 13-week seasons and 2 Christmas specials have aired. CBC shows it in Canada. Season 3 will be making its debut soon on BBC.
Presently, only two PBS Stations in the US have announced the resurrection of Doctor Who. San Jose and Cincinnati. The Sci Fi channel purchased season three from the BBC to air this summer and CBC will be airing repeats of 1 and 2 starting the 19th. As far as WCFE goes, no plans.....yet.

Presently, only two PBS Stations in the US have announced the resurrection of Doctor Who. San Jose and Cincinnati. The Sci Fi channel purchased season three from the BBC to air this summer and CBC will be airing repeats of 1 and 2 starting the 19th. As far as WCFE goes, no plans.....yet.

Thanks for the info about WCFE's plans. Too bad. The commercials on CBC ruin it. I just hope that if WCFE eventually gets around to showing it, theywill do so in 16:9 widescreen and not that phony 14:9 that is used for BBC World News.

CBC has shown Season 1 three times now (twice in 2005 and once last summer) and has shown the first 8 episodes of season 2 on Mondays at 8 pm. It has been preempted the last few weeks. It will resume where it left off January 15. Unfortunately it's part 2 of a story started on Dec 4. It is Season 1 that will be rerun yet again at midnight starting Jan 19/20.

CBC showed last year's Christmas Special one day after BBC did. They have not shown this year's yet because it would give away what happens to Rose and her mother at the end of Season 2.

In a about 60 days, all new TV sets in all size ranges, as well any other TV receiver, will have to include an ATSC DTV tuner. Many of the new tuners inside these sets, and ATSC demodulators used with them, have specifications that meet or exceed the ATSC A/74 receiver performance guidelines. I hope most of these sets will include 5th generation chipsets.

Hello,

I live in Plattsburgh and utilize a very old basic indoor antenna for HDTV and am capable of receiving VPT, WCAX, and WPTZ without too much difficulty. The signal strength is not very good (usually 30-40 of 100). However, if I raise the antenna and balance it on top of my plasma display and search for channels, strengths increase to 60-70 and it can pick up WFFF. Incidentally, I have not been able to receive WVNY.

Since this is an unacceptable position for the antenna, I was wondering if an inexpensive amplified indoor antenna might allow all the signals to be received with the antenna in a more natural position.

I had toyed with the ideal of an outside antenna, but if I can get the 5 big channels in the area with an indoor one, why go through the hassel?

Thanks for any help.

Hello,

I live in Plattsburgh and utilize a very old basic indoor antenna for HDTV and am capable of receiving VPT, WCAX, and WPTZ without too much difficulty. The signal strength is not very good (usually 30-40 of 100). However, if I raise the antenna and balance it on top of my plasma display and search for channels, strengths increase to 60-70 and it can pick up WFFF. Incidentally, I have not been able to receive WVNY.

Since this is an unacceptable position for the antenna, I was wondering if an inexpensive amplified indoor antenna might allow all the signals to be received with the antenna in a more natural position.

I had toyed with the ideal of an outside antenna, but if I can get the 5 big channels in the area with an indoor one, why go through the hassel?

Thanks for any help.
I live in Williston and am using a Terk amplified antenna from Radio Shack. Cost $30. I get all the locals BUT there is a great deal of change in the signal value throughout the day. Weather changes affect the performance greatly. 90% of the time I really have no problems. With digital signals 50% is as good as 100% strength in my experience. The good news is that if it doesn't work for you , you can return it. I've seen the same antenna at Best Buy for more money. The bad news is that neither of the guys at Best Buy or Radio Shack knew what they were talking about. Buyer beware...

Hello,

I live in Plattsburgh and utilize a very old basic indoor antenna for HDTV and am capable of receiving VPT, WCAX, and WPTZ without too much difficulty. The signal strength is not very good (usually 30-40 of 100). However, if I raise the antenna and balance it on top of my plasma display and search for channels, strengths increase to 60-70 and it can pick up WFFF. Incidentally, I have not been able to receive WVNY.

Since this is an unacceptable position for the antenna, I was wondering if an inexpensive amplified indoor antenna might allow all the signals to be received with the antenna in a more natural position.

I had toyed with the ideal of an outside antenna, but if I can get the 5 big channels in the area with an indoor one, why go through the hassel?

Thanks for any help.
Although an indoor amplified antenna may improve your signal, you will still have issues with reception during bad weather. I suspect your antenna is UHF and will therefore have trouble receiving WVNY as it is broadcast VHF channel 13. A properly placed outdoor antenna will give you a good solid signal that will be impervious to most weather. A combo VHF/UHF outside antenna should also give you WVNY. A Channel Master 4228, although designed for UHF only, has a design quirk that makes it a decent upper (10-13) VHF antenna too, and is one of the very few UHF type that will do this. And is much more attractive than the combo antennas.

Hey,

I am in milton. I have a siver sensor and am picking up channel 3 and one of the PBS channels OTA. I am looking to get a roof mount anntenna and was looking at the db4. But it seems some are recommending the Channel master. I am not adverse to a vhf only antenna and UHf but just want to pick up as much as I can.

What are your suggestions on antenna and is there any where local that has them?

thanks

theskuh:

I certainly suggest that you get a Channel Master 4228 over any other UHF-only antenna. Another good choice would be the Channel Master 3016, which may improve WVNY reception somewhat, but isn't as compact in certain dimentions as the 4228.

You can perhaps get the 4228 (and other Channel Master antennas?) at Lowe's, and certainly online.

I suggest pointing that Silver Sensor toward Lyon Mountain, NY to get WCFE-HD on remapped channel 57-1 (channel 38). Perhaps you can place the antenna in the attic with a window directly inbetween the antenna and the transmitter. Use a coax cable combiner (available at RadioShack, and perhaps Lowe's) to assure that you can get all the Mt. Mansfield stations in addition to WCFE.

mmb,

Cool will look into the 4228, and 3016

I can get 57 if I point out the bathroom window. I can get WPTZ in that location too. to get wcax I have to bring it towards the front of my house. I am going to have to draw a map with all the channels on it until I get something else sorted.

Hey, theskuh, AntennaWeb hasn't updated the WPTZ digital azimuth yet. All Burlington digital locals, with the exception of WCFE, broadcast from Mt. Mansfield, so you'll be fine no matter how directional the antenna is (with the exception of WCFE-DT, of course). Mt. Mansfield even has its own PBS station, even though its HD picture quality apparently isn't as good as WCFE.

I'm thinking: Have the 4228 pointed toward Mansfield (remember, the side with the X-shaped things is pointed toward Mt. Mansfield), and your Silver Sensor pointed toward the WCFE transmitter in NY. Combine the two feeds with that SolidSignal combiner thing or a similar device from either Lowe's or RadioShack. Don't bother with any omni-directional antenna (long story as to why), and WCFE is no huge loss in the scheme of things, if you don't want to bother with a combiner.

Edited to add: Are you looking to pick up analog or digital TV signals? If you want to get ANALOG signals, I strongly suggest either doing what you suggested in the ending of your most previous post, or what SkiSmuggs said. If you want to pick up DIGITAL/HD signals, then the original part of this post applies.

mmb,

Cool will look into the 4228, Will it be too directional? I am 180 degress from wptz,wcfe and the mansfield stations.

I can get 57 if I point out the bathroom window. I can get WPTZ in that location too. to get wcax I have to bring it towards the front of my house. I am going to have to draw a map with all the channels on it until I get something else sorted.

edit -
Here is a thought. What if I run a 3016 pointed towards Mansfield. then put another 3016 towards new york and combine with one of these

http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=CC7870
The WPTZ you are getting with WCFE should be the analog channel (5) as the digital channel (14) is broadcasting off Mt Mansfield with WCAX(53), WFFF(42), WVNY(13) and WETK(32). Two 3016s on your roof would be ugly. Point a 4228 at Mansfield and a 4221 or Winegard PR-4400 or even a DB2 at WCFE(38) and combine them.

Cool thanks guys,

Yeah just looking for digital hd signals. It was the digital HD WPTZ I am not sure how it came in pointed towards New York, not a clue. Walking the antenna around the house makes no sense to me where it picks up stuff.

I will hit mansfield with something and then worry about the ny stations later.

WCFE is/was amazing quality as I have moved the antenna for wcax reception.

Two 3016s on your roof would be ugly. LOL it is milton. wait the new milton.

EDIT- Fished some cable through the wall and ran the silver sensor to the second floor. I found a window pointing to mansfield and I get everything 50-80% but wvny. So I am good to go. I don't think I am going to need an external.

Did an install for a customer in Holland, Vt. yesterday. Antennaweb shows they are 50.0 miles from Mt Mansfield. Their house is in a field on the Valley rd, but they have Mead hill between them and the transmitters. Using a C/M 4221, no amp, diplexed on the satellite coax, into a 622, the reading for cax, ptz, fff, & etk were all 95-100. Vny was 85. As I said this was with a 4221 not a 4228. I get similiar readings at my house in Newport Ctr. @ 41 miles from in the woods with NLOS, though I do use a 0068 pre-amp.

So if appearance is an issue, I'd give the 4221 a shot before doubling up the size and getting the 4228, especially if you're already pulling in some of the channels with a $30 coathanger.

Just 53, oops 54 years today, of real world experience.

First antenna installed 1/1/1953.

WVNY (22.1) has reverted to their SD feed for the second half of the Rose Bowl. Anyone have an idea how to contact them and get the nice HD picture back?

Hey guys,

Here's a weird antenna question I hoped some of you could help with. I rent a townhouse in Colchester and currently receive WCAX, WPTZ, WVPT, and WFFF digital broadcasts perfectly with an indoor silver sensor antenna on the 2nd floor of the house (where the only current HDTV exists). I'm planning on upgrading my living room (1st floor) TV over the next month and need some advice on antennas.

Basically, I have two options (both suck):

1 - Use an indoor antenna on the 1st floor, looking East which will only need to pass through one wall

2 - Mount an outdoor antenna (such as the CM 4221) outside, on the west side of the building, underneath the back patio (it would have to be hidden from sight and protected from neighbohood kids.. lol)

I have a feeling #2 might be a slightly better solution, but it would have to receive through the entire building. Would this likely work? I'd love to be able to pick up WVNY as well, but don't really hold much hope for those VHF signals ;)

Any opinions would be greatly appreciated!!!

Hey guys,

Here's a weird antenna question I hoped some of you could help with. I rent a townhouse in Colchester and currently receive WCAX, WPTZ, WVPT, and WFFF digital broadcasts perfectly with an indoor silver sensor antenna on the 2nd floor of the house (where the only current HDTV exists). I'm planning on upgrading my living room (1st floor) TV over the next month and need some advice on antennas.

Basically, I have two options (both suck):

1 - Use an indoor antenna on the 1st floor, looking East which will only need to pass through one wall

2 - Mount an outdoor antenna (such as the CM 4221) outside, on the west side of the building, underneath the back patio (it would have to be hidden from sight and protected from neighbohood kids.. lol)

I have a feeling #2 might be a slightly better solution, but it would have to receive through the entire building. Would this likely work? I'd love to be able to pick up WVNY as well, but don't really hold much hope for those VHF signals ;)

Any opinions would be greatly appreciated!!!

By law, the townhouse association cannot prevent you from installng an antenna.
A 4221 on a J-mount would not be unsightly from my point of view, but it is a directional antenna and would need to be on the east side facing Mansfield. The CM4221 does have somewhat better Channel 13 abilities over most other UHF antennas, and mounted on the east side, will probably receive WVNY.

Last Friday I went to Radio Shack in Essex and bought an unpowered $20 indoor antenna.

I plopped it down next to our TV on the first floor, faced it in the general direction of Mansfield, and had the TV search for channels. There are two walls between it and "outside."

To my amazement, I got all the networks in HD right from the get-go, including the two weather channels and both Mountain Lake and VPT PBS. I'm out near Porter's Point in Colchester, with a fairly direct line to Mansfield (albeit through trees). Depending on how I played with the antenna, I was getting between 50 and 80 for signal strengths amongst the various channels. (Down to zero if I adjusted badly, of course.)

Amusingly, the analog versions were barely received.

Not sure if I can post a URL, but this is the unit I got... The selection was limited.
"UHF/VHF/FM Indoor Antenna with 12-Position Fine-Tuning "

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062081&cp=&origkw=antenna&kw=antenna&kwCatId=2032057&parentPage=search

I am sick of all the local stations showing their local logos and station identification. Every damn time it happens my nice HD picture goes to crappy SD and then a great deal of the time the signal gets left in SD since whatever or whoever is suppposed to throw the switch back to HD doesn't. This seems to happen ESPECIALLY ON ABC ch22.1 like right NOW during the middle of the Rose Bowl of all times to do it! They switched to show their logo, the signal went to SD and then stayed that way for most of the 3rd quarter until someone figured it out and it just went back to HD.

So local stations, if you must show your logos, please find a way to do it AND STAY IN HD!!!!!!!!!!
I can only applaud your sentiments. As I tried to watch the morning news shows, I was convinced that my projector was faulty for I could only get SD broadcasts. I finally switched to HDNet to find that it and all of the Voom channels were in pristine HD. OK locals, it's been almost three months since the inception of the broadcasts and you still can't seen to get the switching right. There aren't many jobs that most of us could keep if we screwed up constantly for three months. It would seem that it is time to adjust attitudes (and competency) at these locals. Perhaps some of their engineers should do a field trip to Mark Cuban's broadcast facillity. He protects his signal's quality at all costs--even taking on the money merchants at Dish Network and Direct TV adhere to his quality standards. The license to serve the "public good" should be taken more seriously. Let's bring some pride back to local broadcasting. Those of us who are offended by this lack of professionalism should call and email the stations.

just picked up a panasonic 42" plasma and am having trouble picking up HD channels, or at least I can't find them. I was able to pick up VPT and CBS on my toshiba DLP - they were channels 21-4 and 21-5 or something along those lines - but I can't seem to locate them when I do a channels search on my panasonic. Anyone have any ideas what channels VPT and CBS should be or how I should locate them on my panasonic? FYI, I don't have and hd box just yet; I am merely plugging my cable wire right into the set. thanks in advance.

terryb28, the first thing you should think about is your antenna setup. With all Burl. locals operating from Mt. Mansfield, with the exception of WCFE, it should be easy to pick them up with a decent VHF/UHF antenna, or just a UHF antenna if you don't want WVNY. How far away are you from the towers, and are there mountains in your way? What's your current antenna and is it pointed correctly enough*? Are you using a splitter to feed one antenna's signal reception into two TVs?

That said, the #1 post in this thread details the physical channel nos. that all locals broadcast on. The Panasonic should check all those channels and remap the ones that work. I doubt that manually tuning the channels would help, but...

It might be that the tuner in the Panasonic isn't the greatest in the world and needs a more powerful antenna to lock locals.

* I ask this because some analog locals (WPTZ and WCAX) broadcast from NY instead of Mt. Mansfield, and you might have aligned the antenna to account for this. A simple realigning toward Mansfield should cure this, with the possible cost of losing WCFE.

I am in Shelburne and able to pick up all locals with the exception of Fox. Any thoughts?

As a expatriated Vermonter I have been watching the build up and power up of HD atop of Mt. Mansfield. I am in the Charlotte, NC market and can tell you that even with three years of HD on all local stations, sometimes getting the switching right is elusive. It is not as seamless as you would think and I would bet that there is a high degree of a leaning curve for the equipment. Just wait until the stations decide to do some tweaking of the signal, especially after the mountain thaws out later this year.
It would be nice if one of the station engineers would respond to questions like the Fox station engineer does here in Charlotte. Information can be the best way to ease the frustrations.

terryb28, the first thing you should think about is your antenna setup. With all Burl. locals operating from Mt. Mansfield, with the exception of WCFE, it should be easy to pick them up with a decent VHF/UHF antenna, or just a UHF antenna if you don't want WVNY. How far away are you from the towers, and are there mountains in your way? What's your current antenna and is it pointed correctly enough*? Are you using a splitter to feed one antenna's signal reception into two TVs?

That said, the #1 post in this thread details the physical channel nos. that all locals broadcast on. The Panasonic should check all those channels and remap the ones that work. I doubt that manually tuning the channels would help, but...

It might be that the tuner in the Panasonic isn't the greatest in the world and needs a more powerful antenna to lock locals.

* I ask this because some analog locals (WPTZ and WCAX) broadcast from NY instead of Mt. Mansfield, and you might have aligned the antenna to account for this. A simple realigning toward Mansfield should cure this, with the possible cost of losing WCFE.

I have cable through Comcast. I'm just plugging my cable wire directly into the tv; not using an antenna. worked for the tosh but not the panny. I noticed the channel listing in the first post, but they don't correspond to the ch. #s my tosh picked up. VPT and CBS were on channels 21-4 and 21-5 or something along those lines.

Are you sure the Panasonic has a QAM tuner?

Are you sure the Panasonic has a QAM tuner?

pretty sure. says so on the panasonic site at least.

Interesting. Our HDTV, when Comcast (cable) is selected, gets CBS on 113-4 and PBS on 113-2. (We don't have a cable box.)

Do different TVs receive HD over cable on different channels? That doesn't seem right. Maybe it varies by service area.

Interesting. Our HDTV, when Comcast (cable) is selected, gets CBS on 113-4 and PBS on 113-2. (We don't have a cable box.)

Do different TVs receive HD over cable on different channels? That doesn't seem right. Maybe it varies by service area.

hmm, I'll try manually entering those channels when I get home. not sure what would account for the difference.

Anyone in Montreal have any luck with an indoor antenna and able to catch local Mtl channels, but most importantly the Burlington (And Plattsburgh) locals in HD? If yes, which indoor antenna.

cheers

Can anyone tell me how much to expect if I change antennas? My current antenna has an average gain of about 8. It looks like the 4228 has an average gain of 12. HDTVPrimer has pretty good charts showing the differences (my current antenna is slightly smaller than the CM3018).

Right now I'm getting WFFF around 70, WPTZ around 63 to 65, and WCAX is 55 to 59. I was getting WPTZ higher than WFFF but I think the snow on the ground cut the signal down. I would be very happy if I could get WCAX more consistantly.

For those of you in who live in the Upper Valley and can't get WVNY there may be some hope,

"At this time, we have not finalized our plans for either of our two
translator sites - Lebanon or Colebrook, NH. Before conversion
of the sites can take place, many issues must be resolved - cost
of conversion equipment, viewership, rental site costs for the
translator equipment, licensing issues, and so on. We will be
working on these issues and many more in the following months!"

I got this e-mail from the engineering manager at WMTW which operates a translator on channel 27 in Lebanon.

* I ask this because some analog locals (WPTZ and WCAX) broadcast from NY instead of Mt. Mansfield,

WCAX broadcasts its analogue from Mount Mansfield. WPTZ and WFFF broadcast their analogue from Terry Mountain, NY.

i have been getting the local hd channels since they first started airing. just one problem, for some reason i get fox hd at a signal rating of 88 on my sony tv yet when i try to get it on my d* hr10-250 the signal is not strong enough it is only 19. all other channels are fine. anyone know why the signal would be ok on the tv but not on my receiver? thanks

[QUOTE=mikemikeb]Hey, theskuh, AntennaWeb hasn't updated the WPTZ digital azimuth yet. QUOTE]

Well, it's taken a couple of months, but I've managed to get WPTZ and DecisionMark to update the correct WPTZ-DT coordinates in AntennaWeb's back end database. Unfortunately, you won't see it live on AntennaWeb until January 15.

When you follow up, DecisionMark can be quite helpful. The problem is sometimes getting the local station to update the database correctly. (For example, I think the WFFF-DT data was updated very soon after I first sent my feedback to AntennaWeb/DecisionMark. WPTZ took a bit longer.)

TVlurker
Ottawa, ON

WCAX broadcasts its analogue from Mount Mansfield. WPTZ and WFFF broadcast their analogue from Terry Mountain, NY.
According to the FCC (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?list=0&facid=10132), WFFF broadcasts its analog signal from the Mt. Mansfield area. But you are correct that WCAX analog does NOT broadcast from NY.

By the way, does anybody know the CTRC website address?

Edited to add: Never mind, I found it / mistaken moniker (note to self: its CRTC)

According to the FCC (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?list=0&facid=10132), WFFF broadcasts its analog signal from the Mt. Mansfield area. But you are correct that WCAX analog does NOT broadcast from NY.

By the way, does anybody know the CTRC website address?

Edited to add: Never mind, I found it / mistaken moniker (note to self: its CRTC)

The FCC information concerning WFFF's analogue transmitters is incorrect. It incorrectly gives the same geographic coordinates for both analogue and digital transmitters. To find the true coordinates for WFFF analogue, look up WPTZ's analogue coordinates. They are at the same location.

The Terry Mountain location (near Peru, NY) is explicitly identified every night (around 3 am) when WFFF gives its mandatory daily station summary (ownership, transmitter location, erp, etc.). Since you probably cannot receive WFFF in DC, look at the write-ups on VPT's web site, where it indicates the move from New York state to Mount Mansfield for both WPTZ and WFFF. The fact is that before they started broadcasting their digital signals in October, WFFF had never transmitted from Vermont.

Anyone in Montreal have any luck with an indoor antenna and able to catch local Mtl channels, but most importantly the Burlington (And Plattsburgh) locals in HD? If yes, which indoor antenna.

cheers

Hello,

I've had good results with UHF stations using the TA-4 antenna from Addison Electronique (http://www.addison-electronique.com/).

From Chomedey Laval, I'm currently able to get most digital channels with it, but WFFF-DT and WVNY-DT.

Good Luck!

For those of you in who live in the Upper Valley and can't get WVNY there may be some hope,

"At this time, we have not finalized our plans for either of our two
translator sites - Lebanon or Colebrook, NH. Before conversion
of the sites can take place, many issues must be resolved - cost
of conversion equipment, viewership, rental site costs for the
translator equipment, licensing issues, and so on. We will be
working on these issues and many more in the following months!"

I got this e-mail from the engineering manager at WMTW which operates a translator on channel 27 in Lebanon.

I thought that translator was currently analog only? Are they talking about going digital with it?

I am in Shelburne and able to pick up all locals with the exception of Fox. Any thoughts?
I live in Shelburne, and I do receive FOX (and all others DT) with an indoor/non-amplified antenna. Where about are you?

Hello,

I've had good results with UHF stations using the TA-4 antenna from Addison Electronique (http://www.addison-electronique.com/).

From Chomedey Laval, I'm currently able to get most digital channels with it, but WFFF-DT and WVNY-DT.

Good Luck!

great to hear, as I am in Ste-Dorothée! whe you sat most digital channels, I assume you mean HD channels?

Anyone else know why we in montreal would not receive wfff & wvny?

I am in Shelburne and able to pick up all locals with the exception of Fox. Any thoughts?I live in Shelburne, and I do receive FOX (and all others DT) with an indoor/non-amplified antenna. Where about are you?I wonder if hdtv05482mktguid is having the same problem as dt33b:

i have been getting the local hd channels since they first started airing. just one problem, for some reason i get fox hd at a signal rating of 88 on my sony tv yet when i try to get it on my d* hr10-250 the signal is not strong enough it is only 19. all other channels are fine. anyone know why the signal would be ok on the tv but not on my receiver? thanks

great to hear, as I am in Ste-Dorothée! whe you sat most digital channels, I assume you mean HD channels?

Anyone else know why we in montreal would not receive wfff & wvny?

WVNY-DT is broadcasting a relatively weak signal on channel 13, which is VHF.

As for WFFF-DT, I have no problem receiving it in Pointe-Claire with a 36 year-old roof-mounted UHF antenna. However, depending where you live there might be obstuctions blocking WFFF-DT's signals because of the fact that their broadcast antenna is temporarily mounted fairly low on WCAX's tower. It probably won't be until spring that they can make repairs to their ice-damaged transmission line and move the antenna to its permanent location on the intended tower.

Does anybody know what channel the TV Guide info is being broadcast on? I've lost all the programming info on my TV and I'm afraid I probably disabled that station from my listing.

I thought that translator was currently analog only? Are they talking about going digital with it?

Yeah, WMTW is thinking of upgrading it to a digital translator

Yeah, WMTW is thinking of upgrading it to a digital translator
That would be great if they did. Right now many VT & NH residents located on the wrong side of the hills are SOL for any of the new digital stations from Mt Mansfield.

We're talking many thousand viewers (hundreds of thousands when digital really catches on) that, if they want to watch network HD, only have NBC (WNNE-DT) as an option.

Hearst Argyle apparently has a lot more foresight than these other youkles if they move on their White River translator, because that will give them both NBC & ABC in digital for a big chunk of northern New England - not to mention that WMTW is twice the station WVNY is.

They put up WNNE-DT over a year before any of you people had digital from Mansfield and they've had very few problems, great picture quality and none of this switching BS. I just wish they owned a Fox in this area too - 10 more days until "24" starts.

as of 3:00 PM- I've got no signal here in St A for WFFF and WVNY. Anyone else or just antenna issues.

That would be great if they did. Right now many VT & NH residents located on the wrong side of the hills are SOL for any of the new digital stations from Mt Mansfield.

We're talking many thousand viewers (hundreds of thousands when digital really catches on) that, if they want to watch network HD, only have NBC (WNNE-DT) as an option.

Hearst Argyle apparently has a lot more foresight than these other youkles if they move on their White River translator, because that will give them both NBC & ABC in digital for a big chunk of northern New England - not to mention that WMTW is twice the station WVNY is.

They put up WNNE-DT over a year before any of you people had digital from Mansfield and they've had very few problems, great picture quality and none of this switching BS. I just wish they owned a Fox in this area too - 10 more days until "24" starts.

Definatly, I don't understand how not one DMA is centered in a state of 1.25 million. People in NH have it rough trying to pick up stations from surrounding DMA's, whether it be Portland, Boston, or Burlington. It's nice that WMUR is around, but it's too far south for a lot of the state. The Burlington DMA is way to huge for these stations to cover, since it stretches from Franklin County, NY to Sullivan, NH. NH should split away from the other DMA's and have some stations in the center of the state which would not only fill in the gaps in the state, but also help out border towns with limited coverage in VT and ME. I would absolutely love a Fox, or CBS station in the Upper Valley, like what WPTZ does with WNNE.

I live in Shelburne, and I do receive FOX (and all others DT) with an indoor/non-amplified antenna. Where about are you?

I am just off of Webster Road on Farmstead Drive. I must admit I am using a pretty cheap antenna from Radio Shack that I intend to return and replace with the silver sensor.

But I find it odd that I have yet to even get a trace of FOX.

Where are you located? And what brand/type of antenna are you using?

I am just off of Webster Road on Farmstead Drive. I must admit I am using a pretty cheap antenna from Radio Shack that I intend to return and replace with the silver sensor.

But I find it odd that I have yet to even get a trace of FOX.

Where are you located? And what brand/type of antenna are you using?

I'm on Martindale (behind the S. Saloon) and I use the Terk HD-TVi, but I'm sure the Silver sensor is as good if not better. You need Fox for all the college bowl games and the coming NFL playoffs. Good Luck!

I have been using a DB4 coupled with a high-band VHF antenna (WVNY), but hoping for a single antenna solution, ordered a Winegard PR4400 because it outperforms the CM4221 below channel 28. It came, I removed the VHF antenna and measured signal strength with the DB4 alone at:
WCAX 80, WPTZ 88, WVNY 54 WEKT 98 and WFFF 98. I was surprised because I remember WVNY being at 32% before.
So I installed the PR4400 pointed at roughly 260 degrees (Mt Mansfield) and only had 14% on WVNY. Played with it for an hour climbing the ladder, tweaking, then running to the TV to check strength. Finally got WVNY at 65-70 by pointing a roughly 283 (Mt Terry). WCAX at 74, WPTZ 88, WETK 88 and WFFF 88. So one antenna, nice digital pictures by pointing antenna almost 15 degrees away from Mansfield. Huh?
I should be happy, but when I went analog (22) to tape Gray's Anatomy for my wife, the formerly clear picture was very grainy.
The PR4400 is very directional (for VHF) as even 2-3 degree changes can greatly change signal strength. I may just go back to my old setup with the VHF antenna where I got 80% on WVNY and great analog and digital reception. I guess VHF reception with a UHF antenna is like trying to make a silk purse out of a pig's ear.
I may have a partial blocking of one or more towers by Madonna as I barely see the towers just left of Madonna and I may be getting a bounced signal.

Anyone else have reception problems with WFFF-DT last night? I normally receive the channel great, but last night it was pixelating so badly that I had to switch over to the Comcast analog feed.

Does anybody know what channel the TV Guide info is being broadcast on? I've lost all the programming info on my TV and I'm afraid I probably disabled that station from my listing.

If you use a US ZIP it will be PBS (33), and montreal is CTV 12. I'm using the US Zip.

Anyone else have reception problems with WFFF-DT last night? I normally receive the channel great, but last night it was pixelating so badly that I had to switch over to the Comcast analog feed.


I live in S burlington and had no problems with WFFF last night through 9pm. At 9 I switched to WCAX and didn't flip back to fox.

Over the past 6 weeks or so, I continue to get audio dropouts on ch 22.1. I am at 80-84% strength so I am guessing this is due to more interference on the lower VHF channel that they broadcast on vs. the other UHF channels. Do others also get these dropouts? I have a CM7778 pre-amp coming that I was hoping might make the signal a little more stable and reduce the dropouts. What are other people seeing in terms of audio drops on ABC? Thanks for any comments.
Same here. I am sure it is their problem and not at our end.

Hi, now that things have seemed to have settled down for the winter I thought I'd let you know how things look down here in Hanover Center, NH (Near Hanover/Lebanon).


Hardware Setup

VHF:
Winegard Prostar PR-5030
Channel Master Titan 2 7776 mast-mounted pre-amp

UHF:
Blake JBX21WB
Channel Master Titan 2 7775 mast-mounted pre-amp

The antennas are mounted on a Rohn 25 tower with the VHF antenna at about 25 feet and the UHF antenna at 30 feet. There are separate RG6 runs from the pre-amps to the TV. The VHF link goes through a splitter to feed my FM tuner and then to a combiner. The UHF also goes to the combiner which then goes through the VCR and finally to the TV.

Analog Performance

The VHF setup works very nicely. I get channel 3 (WCAX) fine - channels 5 (WPTZ) and 9 (WMUR) are ok. I can also get snowy signals from the CBC stations in Montreal on channels 6 and 2 (channel 2 is noticeably snow-ier). I love watching "Hockey Night in Canada" on Saturday evenings - how could your week be complete without seeing Don Cherry rant on during the break after the first period? I do lament the fact that the Toronto Maple Leafs seem to have replaced the Canadiens as the Montreal "home team" as far as the CBC is concerned. I can also see weak signals from other Canadian stations on channels 7 (CKRT), 10 (CFTM), and 12 (CFCF). There are lots of other weak stations are out there like 10 (WTEN) in Albany, etc.

Not as much to see here on analog UHF - channel 22 (WVNY) is fair but with some consistent multi-path, 31 (WNNE) is ok. The low-power NH PBS that is just a few miles away on channel 15 (W15BK) is strong but un-watchable due to the extreme multi-path no matter where I point the antenna.

HD Performance

Mt. Ascutney (26 miles): WNNE 100, WVTA 100

Mt. Mansfield (67miles): WCAX 100, WFFF 75, WPTZ 80, WETK 100

I'm getting WVNY at about 75-80 after a bit of diddling here. The initial signal strength was in the low 40's, not enough to get anything useful. I thought I'd try running the VHF line directly to the TV, bypassing the splitter, combiner, and VCR that are normally in line. I had found in the past that this is good for another 5 points or so of signal strength. I was surprised to see that the signal went from the 40's to the 70's and the picture was fine. I tried adding each item back into the signal path and found that the splitter and combiner didn't have much effect but that the VCR was doing all the damage. I did some further testing and I don't see this effect on any other channel. For the analog channels I don't have the signal strength indicator but I checked the quality of the display to see if it was degraded. Very strange, I guess I'll have to re-think my cabling.

the 40's to the 70's and the picture was fine. I tried adding each item back into the signal path and found that the splitter and combiner didn't have much effect but that the VCR was doing all the damage. I did some further testing and I don't see this effect on any other channel. For the analog channels I don't have the signal strength indicator but I checked the quality of the display to see if it was degraded. Very strange, I guess I'll have to re-think my cabling.
Since your splitters don't have much effect, what about splitting the signal before the VCR/TV instead of using the VCR as a passthru? Then connect the VCR to the TV with composite cables.

just purchased a 42" panasonic plasma. I did a channel search and am only able to pick up CBS and VPT HD channels. The first post in this thread says that:

* WVNY-DT 13 (ABC) on-air (hard to get)
* WPTZ-DT 14 (NBC) on-air
* WETK-DT 32 VPT (PBS) on-air
* WFFF-DT 43 (Fox, the CW) on-air
* WCAX-DT 53 (CBS) on-air
* WCFE-DT 38 - Mountain Lake (PBS) on-air

are all on the air in HD at this point. So my question is, why aren't I able to pick up those channels over the air? Should I be able to pick up the other channels listed? Right now, my cable wire is bypassing the cable box and is plugged directly in the tv if that makes any difference. thanks in advance.

j
are all on the air in HD at this point. So my question is, why aren't I able to pick up those channels over the air? Should I be able to pick up the other channels listed? Right now, my cable wire is bypassing the cable box and is plugged directly in the tv if that makes any difference. thanks in advance.
You haven't said anything about an antenna. To get over the air broadcasts, you need an antenna. Go to www.antennaweb.org, input your address and see what it says about the type of antenna you will need. Come back here with your questions after that.

Perhaps I'm using the wrong terminology, but I am most definitely receiving CBS HD and PBS HD and I certainly don't have an antenna. I simply plugged my coax cable wire into the aux in on my tv. From what I've read, this is a perfectly common, basic way of getting HD channels. You don't need an antenna, smuggs. My question is, other than CBS(WCAX) and PBS(VPT) HD stations, are there any other HD stations that I should be able to pick up by doing a channel scan? For the sake of clarity, I repeat: I am not using an antenna; I have Comcast cable and am just plugging the cable wire into the tv.

Hi, now that things have seemed to have settled down for the winter I thought I'd let you know how things look down here in Hanover Center, NH (Near Hanover/Lebanon).


Hardware Setup

VHF:
Winegard Prostar PR-5030
Channel Master Titan 2 7776 mast-mounted pre-amp

UHF:
Blake JBX21WB
Channel Master Titan 2 7775 mast-mounted pre-amp

The antennas are mounted on a Rohn 25 tower with the VHF antenna at about 25 feet and the UHF antenna at 30 feet. There are separate RG6 runs from the pre-amps to the TV. The VHF link goes through a splitter to feed my FM tuner and then to a combiner. The UHF also goes to the combiner which then goes through the VCR and finally to the TV.

Analog Performance

The VHF setup works very nicely. I get channel 3 (WCAX) fine - channels 5 (WPTZ) and 9 (WMUR) are ok. I can also get snowy signals from the CBC stations in Montreal on channels 6 and 2 (channel 2 is noticeably snow-ier). I love watching "Hockey Night in Canada" on Saturday evenings - how could your week be complete without seeing Don Cherry rant on during the break after the first period? I do lament the fact that the Toronto Maple Leafs seem to have replaced the Canadiens as the Montreal "home team" as far as the CBC is concerned. I can also see weak signals from other Canadian stations on channels 7 (CKRT), 10 (CFTM), and 12 (CFCF). There are lots of other weak stations are out there like 10 (WTEN) in Albany, etc.

Not as much to see here on analog UHF - channel 22 (WVNY) is fair but with some consistent multi-path, 31 (WNNE) is ok. The low-power NH PBS that is just a few miles away on channel 15 (W15BK) is strong but un-watchable due to the extreme multi-path no matter where I point the antenna.

HD Performance

Mt. Ascutney (26 miles): WNNE 100, WVTA 100

Mt. Mansfield (67miles): WCAX 100, WFFF 75, WPTZ 80, WETK 100

I'm getting WVNY at about 75-80 after a bit of diddling here. The initial signal strength was in the low 40's, not enough to get anything useful. I thought I'd try running the VHF line directly to the TV, bypassing the splitter, combiner, and VCR that are normally in line. I had found in the past that this is good for another 5 points or so of signal strength. I was surprised to see that the signal went from the 40's to the 70's and the picture was fine. I tried adding each item back into the signal path and found that the splitter and combiner didn't have much effect but that the VCR was doing all the damage. I did some further testing and I don't see this effect on any other channel. For the analog channels I don't have the signal strength indicator but I checked the quality of the display to see if it was degraded. Very strange, I guess I'll have to re-think my cabling.

Hey, I'm a few miles south of you, have you been able to pick up WMUR, WTEN, any of the Montreal stations, or any others digitally? Also, do you have any line of sight or elevation that would help you out getting these signals? I'm close to the top of a hill near the Lebanon/Hanover border with the elevation around 1200 feet. I have a decent shot towards Burlington and I am able to get a few Montreal radio stations crystal clear. And by the way, CKRT is roughly 300 miles to the Upper Valley, that's impressive you can pick that up!

Perhaps I'm using the wrong terminology, but I am most definitely receiving CBS HD and PBS HD and I certainly don't have an antenna. I simply plugged my coax cable wire into the aux in on my tv. From what I've read, this is a perfectly common, basic way of getting HD channels. You don't need an antenna, smuggs. My question is, other than CBS(WCAX) and PBS(VPT) HD stations, are there any other HD stations that I should be able to pick up by doing a channel scan? For the sake of clarity, I repeat: I am not using an antenna; I have Comcast cable and am just plugging the cable wire into the tv.
Well, WCAX, WVNY, WPTZ, WETK and WFFF are all broadcasting in digital from Mt Mansfield. Whether you get them in a channel scan with your Comcast cable depends on what Comcast is broadcasting over that cable. Maybe a Comcast user can shed some light on it.

Perhaps I'm using the wrong terminology, but I am most definitely receiving CBS HD and PBS HD and I certainly don't have an antenna. I simply plugged my coax cable wire into the aux in on my tv. From what I've read, this is a perfectly common, basic way of getting HD channels. You don't need an antenna, smuggs. My question is, other than CBS(WCAX) and PBS(VPT) HD stations, are there any other HD stations that I should be able to pick up by doing a channel scan? For the sake of clarity, I repeat: I am not using an antenna; I have Comcast cable and am just plugging the cable wire into the tv.What you're seeing are the 2 HD locals which are carried by your cable company. Right now you'll need and antenna to get all 5 of the Hi-Def locals. Nobody knows for sure when Comcast will pick up the remaining 3.

skismuggs, vttom, thanks for the info. so if I understand, I can't get the other 3 HD locals unless I have an antenna? Comcast doesn't even carry them? That stinks. So even if I get an HD cable box from comcast, I won't be able to get Fox HD? Can any comcast subscribers confirm this? thanks.

terryb28:

Under law, all cable customers have the right to pick up HD signals of local affiliates without a cable box (if they are being offered at all). Therefore, subscribing to a higher tier than you have now shouldn't add any local afffiliates, just stuff like HDNet and Discovery HD Theater. At least for now, a good antenna will provide WFFF, WVNY, and WPTZ in HD.

Since this may be a temporary situation for you, I suggest seeing what antennas and coax cable are lying around that you could use, before purchasing any new ones. For instance, at my house, I have an old, somewhat rusted, Realistic indoor antenna with two twin lead cables (one for UHF and one for VHF) that picks up locals pretty well, as well as a newer RadioShack with a coax cable output, a crud amplifier, and decent UHF digital performance with it off.

skismuggs, vttom, thanks for the info. so if I understand, I can't get the other 3 HD locals unless I have an antenna? Comcast doesn't even carry them? That stinks. So even if I get an HD cable box from comcast, I won't be able to get Fox HD? Can any comcast subscribers confirm this? thanks.

Correct. The only HD locals you can get through Comcast right now are WCAX (CBS) and WVPT (PBS). It's assumed that Comcast will add the rest of the local HD broadcasts to their lineup soon, but nobody knows when.

Just pick up some rabitt ears for now and see if you can get the other locals over the air. That's what I'm doing until Comcast adds them.

I know that they have had issues lately, but is any one else having signal strength issues with WPTZ tonight? Usually, my signal strength is around 85-87. Tonight it keeps jumping all over the place. It hovers near the mid 80s, then drops to the low 70s, then down to as low as 49 and I get major pixelation. It's made for a fun time watching the football game tonight.

I know that they have had issues lately, but is any one else having signal strength issues with WPTZ tonight? Usually, my signal strength is around 85-87. Tonight it keeps jumping all over the place. It hovers near the mid 80s, then drops to the low 70s, then down to as low as 49 and I get major pixelation. It's made for a fun time watching the football game tonight.
The wind may have had something to do with it. My antenna was whipping in the wind, but WCAX was the only one it affected for me with signal ranging from 45 to 70%

I'm in Burlington's New North End and am a longtime Comcast subscriber. Since I was sick of waiting for them to pick up the remaining locals, I went to Radio Shack and picked up some cheap $30 rabbit ears (#15-1878). I just wanted to report that I can reliably pick up all of the locals in HD and was quite surprised how well everything came in. Residents of the NNE know that it can be frustrating out here since Fort Ethan Allen blocks the line of sight to Mt. Mansfield and reception for TV, cell phones, etc can be spotty.

I'm especially psyched about WFFF-HD since Comcast's SD feed is horrendous to watch.

I've heard that Comcast is going to add the remaining HD locals in Feb but since they don't seam to be much better than Adelphia I wouldn't count on it until it happens.

does anyway know if any of the CW shows Fox 44 plays are in high definition?

Yes they are - however they haven't been providing them in widescreen yet. We should be getting Smallville, for example, in full widescreen.

does anyway know if any of the CW shows Fox 44 plays are in high definition?
I've seen many of them like "House", "Bones" and even "Superman." However, much like the other locals, they do drop out of HD to SD often for whatever technical reason. I've also seen the network upconvert some shows (like pre game shows) to "fake" HD.

Has anyone been able to obtain distant network waivers for D* HD channels? I had someone come to day from an antenna installation place and he said that it would be over 700 dollars to hook it up and after that it only might get me Burlington channels, and I already have the antenna, masts and rotator.

Has anyone been able to obtain distant network waivers for D* HD channels? I had someone come to day from an antenna installation place and he said that it would be over 700 dollars to hook it up and after that it only might get me Burlington channels, and I already have the antenna, masts and rotator.Where do you live? What does http://www.antennaweb.org have to say about your distance from the towers?

Has anyone been able to obtain distant network waivers for D* HD channels? I had someone come to day from an antenna installation place and he said that it would be over 700 dollars to hook it up and after that it only might get me Burlington channels, and I already have the antenna, masts and rotator.
Depending on where you are located, the Burlington channels would be WCAX, WPTZ, WVNY, WEKT(PBS) and WFFF(FOX). They are all broadcasting digitally from Mt Mansfield. What other channels were you looking for?
And $700 sounds awfully high.

Not knowing the setup, I'll not speculate whether $700 is high or maybe even a deal. I will say though, if the "antenna installation company" can't tell you before they begin work, if they'll be able to get you reception, it's time to call someone else.

Using antennaweb will only give you a very general idea, especially in the hinterlands, if you'll be able to pull in the channels you want. We have 2 Blonder Tongue BTPDA-2s and a Sadelco MinMax-M we use to determine, before we begin an installation, if we'll be able to get reception. We carry both 30' & 50' telescopic masts, so we can usually test most locations on a customers property, without leaving the ground.

Paying $700 and having the guy say it might not work, doesn't sound like good deal. Tell the guy to get the right tools for the job, then you'll talk.

Not knowing the setup, I'll not speculate whether $700 is high or maybe even a deal. I will say though, if the "antenna installation company" can't tell you before they begin work, if they'll be able to get you reception, it's time to call someone else.

Using antennaweb will only give you a very general idea, especially in the hinterlands, if you'll be able to pull in the channels you want. We have 2 Blonder Tongue BTPDA-2s and a Sadelco MinMax-M we use to determine, before we begin an installation, if we'll be able to get reception. We carry both 30' & 50' telescopic masts, so we can usually test most locations on a customers property, without leaving the ground.

Paying $700 and having the guy say it might not work, doesn't sound like good deal. Tell the guy to get the right tools for the job, then you'll talk.
You sound like a true professional. It is good to have you here!

Not knowing the setup, I'll not speculate whether $700 is high or maybe even a deal. I will say though, if the "antenna installation company" can't tell you before they begin work, if they'll be able to get you reception, it's time to call someone else.

Using antennaweb will only give you a very general idea, especially in the hinterlands, if you'll be able to pull in the channels you want. We have 2 Blonder Tongue BTPDA-2s and a Sadelco MinMax-M we use to determine, before we begin an installation, if we'll be able to get reception. We carry both 30' & 50' telescopic masts, so we can usually test most locations on a customers property, without leaving the ground.

Paying $700 and having the guy say it might not work, doesn't sound like good deal. Tell the guy to get the right tools for the job, then you'll talk.

Hey everyone, thanks for the advice, I'm in Lebanon and today I took the antenna, put it on the side of the house on the masts and hooked it up and magically I get WNNE, WVTA, and WVNY. I'm almost positive if I fiddle around with it I'll get WMUR and WCAX.

oops, double post

Habscolts, is that the digital WVNY you're getting or the analog? If you're getting the digital WVNY doing good. If the others can't be gotten then you just might need a different antenna. For me even though I live less than 10 miles to Mansfield I'm obstructed from direct line of sight. I get WFFF and WPTZ unless there's snow on the ground then I loose WPTZ but get WCAX. I'm thinking of upgrading to a CM4228 and maybe moving the antenna from the side of the house (32' off the gound) to a pole (50' or so). If you haven't done so you can find the most unobstructed place with in cable reach and prop it up using a compase to point it in the direction of any antenna you want to get and see what comes in.

Habscolts, is that the digital WVNY you're getting or the analog? If you're getting the digital WVNY doing good. If the others can't be gotten then you just might need a different antenna. For me even though I live less than 10 miles to Mansfield I'm obstructed from direct line of sight. I get WFFF and WPTZ unless there's snow on the ground then I loose WPTZ but get WCAX. I'm thinking of upgrading to a CM4228 and maybe moving the antenna from the side of the house (32' off the gound) to a pole (50' or so). If you haven't done so you can find the most unobstructed place with in cable reach and prop it up using a compase to point it in the direction of any antenna you want to get and see what comes in.

I'm getting WVNY digitally, I have a lock on it but I can't get more than a whisper on WPTZ and WCAX. WFFF doesn't register at all. I have a Channel Master 4228, it seems to be doing better picking up VHF then UHF. I was hoping to pick up WCAX digitally and hopefully get lucky by getting WVNY or WMUR, I'm pumped I have 3 of 5 though, hopefully I can change things around and get WCAX

Regarding antennas I wish to add my 2 cents. 2 years ago I got the biggest Radio Shack combination UHF / VHF that they made. It's about 12 feet long and the literature says that it has 57 elements. I thought I was prime for getting something digital from Mansfield sooner or later, (even though I later found that antennaweb says I will not receive any digital anything period.) I put it up and suprise! I found that I get great reception of VTPTV and NH PT from Burke / Littleton and even occasionally channel 6 44DT from Portland ME. The Mansfield stations got up and running this past fall, but I couldn't get a lock on anything, even though all the new DTV stations registered at about 3 - 4 bars out of 8 on the TV reception meter. I then went out and bought a CM 4228 because every thing I read said it was the best but it also got only about 3 - 4 bars of reception, the same as the RS. I was bummed by all this, but I tried combining the 2 leads together and surprise surprise I now occasionally get CH 14 WPTZ but none of the others from Mansfield. Has anybody tried combining 2 CM 4228's to improve reception? I'd like to be able to get more than just public televison and NBC once in a while. I can't think of any other ideas.

I ended up giving the antenna some more elevation, the final result was that I get a lock on WVNY-DT, (my tv has a bar graph thing instead of percentages, it has one bar), WNNE-DT, WVTA-DT. On analogue, I receive a snowy, black and white picture on 9 WMUR, 10 CFTM, 11 WENH, 12 CFCF, and a color, but not spectacular picture on WVTB, WVNY and WETK. When I tune to 14, 32 or 53, my tv stutters on the digital, before giving up and flipping to analogue. My D* receiver shows 5% on all those stations, but if I get a color picture anologue I cannot be too far off I assume from getting a digital one. I am 65 miles from Mansfield, and I only have a 50 foot run of cable from the Channel Master 4228 straight to the TV. How much of a difference would a preamp make? A would absolutely love to have CBS or Fox digitally, and I wouldn't mind WPTZ because of the weather station. If I go with a preamp I think I'll include VHF because I have to have my Canadian Idol this summer ;-). It seems odd with the difficulties I've read that everyone is having picking up WVNY when it is the only channel I receive, even when there is another ABC closer to me that I do not digitally receive.

On a separate note, WVNY is broadcasting a test signal on 22-2. Does anyone know what, if anything they plan on putting on it? I hope just not the SD version and something worthwhile.

Hey, I'm a few miles south of you, have you been able to pick up WMUR, WTEN, any of the Montreal stations, or any others digitally? Also, do you have any line of sight or elevation that would help you out getting these signals? I'm close to the top of a hill near the Lebanon/Hanover border with the elevation around 1200 feet. I have a decent shot towards Burlington and I am able to get a few Montreal radio stations crystal clear. And by the way, CKRT is roughly 300 miles to the Upper Valley, that's impressive you can pick that up!


The only other digital station I can get here is the VT PBS station from St. Johnsbury which comes in at about a 90. I don't know if there's a whisper from any of the other stations since my tv's signal strength meter only displays when it has a lock. It would be nice to borrow some kind of UHF receiver to see if there's anything out there coming in below my event horizon.

On the analog side WMUR/9 is watchable with lots of snow and WTEN/10 is on the edge - about the same as channel 6 from Montreal.

I gave the antenna about 5 more feet of elevation, I now receive WPTZ digitally, WETK will come in but be choppy, still no signal on WCAX. That's really disappointing because I really want to watch the Superbowl and NFL Playoffs in high definition.

Has anybody tried combining 2 CM 4228's to improve reception? I'd like to be able to get more than just public televison and NBC once in a while. I can't think of any other ideas.
Honestly, the best you could do is to get a Channel Master 7777 preamp, hook it up to the one 4228, and take your RS antenna down. That could be the key.

Remember: With the 4228, point the side with the X-shaped thingeys toward Mansfield. Since you're getting WPTZ, you might already have, but it shouldn't hurt to check. At your distance, minor adjustments in both height (or lack thereof) and pointing direction can affect digital reception.

habscolts, keep raising your 4228. It might help.

habscolts, keep raising your 4228. It might help.

Right now its on an upside down flower vase, on top of an apple crate, on top of 4 plastic lawn chairs stacked together, and a tractor cart flipped upside down. I'm going to buy a roof mount tomorrow and move it up some more. I also ordered a Channel Master 7777 preamp, hopefully all works out well :)

Has anyone heard anything more about the Comcast re-provisioning that was supposed to happen today? I'd heard rumors that getting the rest of the local HD stations was one reason it was pushed back to today, but I haven't seen anything yet.

Right now its on an upside down flower vase, on top of an apple crate, on top of 4 plastic lawn chairs stacked together, and a tractor cart flipped upside down. I'm going to buy a roof mount tomorrow and move it up some more. I also ordered a Channel Master 7777 preamp, hopefully all works out well :)
Also use the www.antennaweb.org as a starting point for direction, but then try turning it in either direction off the starting direction and check signal strength.

For those of you who are struggling with poor signal strength, I have experimented with different antennas and amps.

I prefer the CM 0064 amp to the 7777 because of the 300 ohm inputs. I have compared them one after the other and the 0064 gives me about 10% more signal strength despite the higher rated gain of the 7777, the 0064 beats it because I do not have to use a matching transformer (balun).

My antennas:
- CM 4221
- Winegard 8800
- DB2

Has anyone heard anything more about the Comcast re-provisioning that was supposed to happen today? I'd heard rumors that getting the rest of the local HD stations was one reason it was pushed back to today, but I haven't seen anything yet.

I'd also like to know what's happening. My non-HD cable box was scrolling through codes on the LED readout this morning and I immediately thought it was because of the re-provisioning. After 10+ minutes of letting it do its thing, I chacked it out and there were zero changes. Also checked my HD box several times and no changes there either.

AntennaMan1, reading your last post leads me to believe that you install antennas, either part time or full time. Do you offer or have you thought about offering the service of just evaluating sites and making recomondations as to what someone could get? Seams to me that there's a lot of people who are handy enough to install an antenna but really have no clue until they do as to what they would get.

AntennaMan1, reading your last post leads me to believe that you install antennas, either part time or full time. Do you offer or have you thought about offering the service of just evaluating sites and making recomondations as to what someone could get? Seams to me that there's a lot of people who are handy enough to install an antenna but really have no clue until they do as to what they would get.

I'll second that request. If I knew for sure what I would receive, I wouldn't mind buying the antenna. I just don't want to spend a bunch of money and not get anything. Also another question for AntennaMan1, How much does a professional typical install cost. I'm talking about a two story house, roof tripod or J mount, 4228 antenna, all cabling including professionally grounding everything so as not to burn down your house and blow up your equipment with a lightning strike, no rotor or amplifier.

Right now its on an upside down flower vase, on top of an apple crate, on top of 4 plastic lawn chairs stacked together, and a tractor cart flipped upside down. I'm going to buy a roof mount tomorrow and move it up some more. I also ordered a Channel Master 7777 preamp, hopefully all works out well :)
Now if you could just get a dead SkiDoo under the tractor cart and take a picture, you could probably sell the prints as art in NYC. Get a Holstein or two in the background and you could be looking at a Pulitizer:)

Only in Vermont :D

Hmmm - has anyone else seen an actual HD showing of a CW show on Fox 44? I only watch Smallville, but have not yet seen it in HD - it looks like a 16:9 presentation jammed into the 4:3 SD box... I assumed that Fox44 just wasn't recording or broadcasting CW programs in HD at all. (prime-time Fox programming and football however look fantastic in HD).

I've heard that Comcast is going to add the remaining HD locals in Feb but since they don't seam to be much better than Adelphia I wouldn't count on it until it happens.

Crazyal, where did you hear this? I have been unable to get a straight answer out of Comcast. Every csr has a different answer. The one positive thing I was told was that they are currently in negotiation with the remaining channels.

Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

MrJ

Crazyal, where did you hear this? I have been unable to get a straight answer out of Comcast. Every csr has a different answer. The one positive thing I was told was that they are currently in negotiation with the remaining channels.

Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

MrJ

At lunch today I went to the comcrap building to pay my bill and asked the CSR at the counter when they would be adding the remaining locals to the HD content. Her first response was "Legally, we don't have to add them until 2009." Upon further pressing, she did state that the current hold up is the line is not fully connected to the other channels coming from Mansfield and comcast. I have no clue if what she said is true or not, but it just continues the mis-information (or total lack of info) coming from Comcast. It is really frustrating to deal with them on any issue. I'm at the point where I'm ready to cancel entirely and try to figure out how to get Dish @ my condo. But that is a whole other PITA that I don't really want to deal with right now.

Where would we be traveling to? We're in Newport. The business has been doing antennas part-time since 1953, full-time since 1976. I've been in the business since 1980. Antenna Man LLP. When I registered for this site, it said AntennaMan was already taken, hence the 1.

Jeff

Where would we be traveling to? We're in Newport. The business has been doing antennas part-time since 1953, full-time since 1976. I've been in the business since 1980. Antenna Man LLP. When I registered for this site, it said AntennaMan was already taken, hence the 1.

Jeff

Well, I live in Waterville so I realize that I am probably out of your range, but I was more interested in what does a typical professional installation cost taking out the travel portion of the bill.

At lunch today I went to the comcrap building to pay my bill and asked the CSR at the counter when they would be adding the remaining locals to the HD content. Her first response was "Legally, we don't have to add them until 2009." Upon further pressing, she did state that the current hold up is the line is not fully connected to the other channels coming from Mansfield and comcast. I have no clue if what she said is true or not, but it just continues the mis-information (or total lack of info) coming from Comcast. It is really frustrating to deal with them on any issue. I'm at the point where I'm ready to cancel entirely and try to figure out how to get Dish @ my condo. But that is a whole other PITA that I don't really want to deal with right now.
I was so angered by my latest dealings with Comcast that I dumped the service (after 30 years) and wrote the Vermont Public Service Board about the issue of increased prices. I was dismayed that they continue to do exactly what they want even though they had promised to hold the line when they were courting the PSB. Screw the big MSOs and all the politicans who helped them grow into such gigantic porportions. Kudos to folks like the Burlington Cable crew who are instituting new (and local) control of cable systems. I hope they give Comcast a real run for subscribers. Now that really would be "Comcastic"

I have a friend who works for Comcast, or as i like to call the Imcompcast. I had so many problems with Adelphia when i lived in Essex but they were my only source for high speed internet so I delt wih them. Just as I finished building my new house out in the hills of Cambridge and cable is not an option Comcast bought out Adelphia's assets. At first I was pissed because just as I was leaving I got my wish, after talking to my friend it sounds like only the name has changed. What's really funny about all of this is that Comcast is having to provide cable to rual areas that Adelphia said they would do but didn't. Most of these areas people gave up long ago and got DTV or Dish so they are really just waisting money (assuming they actually use the extra money they get by raising the rates on extending the cable network. My guess is that it will just go into someone's pocket).

Tarzan24 Watervile isn't far away from Newport, 30 to 45 minutes maybe. Since I aready got an antenna up there's not much point for me to have my signal checked otherwise since I'm right up the road I would have looked into having my signal check at the same time as you to cut down on driving time and maybe cost. I still wouldn't mind knowing how much of a difference there is between 30' and 50' though.

At lunch today I went to the comcrap building to pay my bill and asked the CSR at the counter when they would be adding the remaining locals to the HD content. Her first response was "Legally, we don't have to add them until 2009." Upon further pressing, she did state that the current hold up is the line is not fully connected to the other channels coming from Mansfield and comcast. I have no clue if what she said is true or not, but it just continues the mis-information (or total lack of info) coming from Comcast. It is really frustrating to deal with them on any issue. I'm at the point where I'm ready to cancel entirely and try to figure out how to get Dish @ my condo. But that is a whole other PITA that I don't really want to deal with right now.

Yup, same line I got at the crudcast office in S. Burlington. Their csr's are so ignorant it's laughable. I tried to explain that I did not believe that crudcast would need a direct line anymore (as in the WCAX feed) now that all the stations were broadcasting in HD over the air. That did not register at all. Trouble with the satellites is they do not offer our locals in HD either. BTW what is this re-positioning crudcast is doing.

MrJ

I have comcast high def and called them to discuss savings with my bill. I pay more than $150 for internet / high def dvr / hbo & sho. My mom in Florida pays $100 (also Comcast) for a similar package with voip phone included. Why the big difference in price? After talking to the woman for 5 mimutes my head was spinning... I just told her to send me an explanation of the packages and pricing and she agreed to do that. These packages/prices are not posted on the internet..... apparently they are some sort of secret.

Anyway I am pissed that the other local channels are still not in HD. Luckily some of the NFL playoffs and superbowl are on CAX which is avail in HD. Fox (channel 9) on cable looks like is was broadcast over a videophone. What a poor picture.

Thinking about picking over the air broadcsts. I entered my location (essex center) into antennaweb and the results looked bleek. I am at 500ft above sea level and there is a hill (650 ft) about 1/2 mile from me in the direction of Mt Mansfield. This blocks my view and apparently kills my reception. The top of the hill gets great reception according to antennaweb. Is anrennaweb accurate?

I have comcast high def and called them to discuss savings with my bill. I pay more than $150 for internet / high def dvr / hbo & sho. My mom in Florida pays $100 (also Comcast) for a similar package with voip phone included. Why the big difference in price? After talking to the woman for 5 mimutes my head was spinning... I just told her to send me an explanation of the packages and pricing and she agreed to do that. These packages/prices are not posted on the internet..... apparently they are some sort of secret.

Anyway I am pissed that the other local channels are still not in HD. Luckily some of the NFL playoffs and superbowl are on CAX which is avail in HD. Fox (channel 9) on cable looks like is was broadcast over a videophone. What a poor picture.

Thinking about picking over the air broadcsts. I entered my location (essex center) into antennaweb and the results looked bleek. I am at 500ft above sea level and there is a hill (650 ft) about 1/2 mile from me in the direction of Mt Mansfield. This blocks my view and apparently kills my reception. The top of the hill gets great reception according to antennaweb. Is anrennaweb accurate?
I have no real technical expertise but I have a hill in my way to the mountain and from my Williston home I merely have to use an amplified Terk small antenna (hidden in a closet) to get all the locals. Forgive me, those of you who have elivated antenna reception into rocket science--to me, it seems like it's a crap shoot. Moving the damn thing a mere two feet changes reception significantly.
Why not pick up an antenna at Radio Shack--see if it works--and return it if it doesn't?

I wouldn't trust antennaweb too much. I think it has it's place but it's not as black and white as it makes it sound. If you don't have line of sight you will probably need a large outdoor antenna and maybe a preamp. If you're not planning on sticking with cable you may have it soon (or maybe not) and in a month or two you'll not need the antenna anymore. I'm not sure how you feel about mounting an antenna to your house only for a few months.

Does anyone around the Burlington area sell the Channel Master 4228?

About the only thing I find antennaweb useful for is it's a quick and easy way to find the direction Mt Mansfield is from a particular address. Of course you could also use a lot of other mapping sites/software for the same thing.

For me as well antennaweb gives me a bleak outlook. My location in East Montpelier has the Worchester range between me and MtMansfield with Mt. Hunger almost in line. I never could get the analogs very well. Channels 22 & 33 so ghostly there were unwatchable, CAX so snowy it was basically unwatchable as well. However I got some analog from Mt. Ascutney and Schenectady so maybe that is a shot. However for me an issue with OTA is how to record these channels. No way I want to deal with a TIVO. I do not need another monthly TV bill. As with the earlier poster, 150 / month is more than enough. As I see it Crudca$t needs to step up the plate and offer the locals along with a decent HD package. For me I wish for the money a lot of us pay we could at least be kept informed by knowledgable csr's. Well, that's my rant for today. :rolleyes:

MrJ

Why not pick up an antenna at Radio Shack--see if it works--and return it if it doesn't?

I would but my TV dosen't have a tuner. Its a panasonic 42" plasma monitor and I have it hooked up the the hd dvr cabe box via component cables. SOmeone on this forum suggested an hd tuner video card which would allow a PC to act as a tuner/dvr. That would be cool but it sound pretty complicated to me. I hate to say it but I kind of like the simple black box approach I have with comcrap. The HD/DVR is simple and and works well. I just want something that is simple and cheap. I really wish the Patriots still had Adam Vinitieri.

I really wish the Patriots still had Adam Vinitieri.

He is money as they were saying today. I need to get my antenna fixed up so I can get WCAX and watch the Colts and Viniteri play New England or San Diego next Sunday and then hopefully someone else in the Superbowl two weeks after that.

Did anyone notice during the Eagles Saints game when WFFF displayed their station identification it wasn't in HD?

Being near DC, I didn't see what happened BUT I think it was because WFFF didn't pay $$$ for an HD keyer. I don't know how much an HD keyer is, but it's certainly more than an SD one. I was watching WUSA-DT OTA and I saw the station ID without the picture going to SD -- looks like they spent the coin for an HD keyer. I didn't see any IDs on WTTG-DT (our FOX affil.) but I don't think I was watching hard enough for it.

Stations without an HD keyer should learn to ID during SD commercials or, as with most CBS primetime shows, during end credits.

Did anyone notice during the Eagles Saints game when WFFF displayed their station identification it wasn't in HD?
WNNE-DT does the same thing down here.

I think by law they have to put up the station ID at least once an hour and when they do they drop back to an SD overlay.

I would but my TV dosen't have a tuner. Its a panasonic 42" plasma monitor and I have it hooked up the the hd dvr cabe box via component cables. SOmeone on this forum suggested an hd tuner video card which would allow a PC to act as a tuner/dvr. That would be cool but it sound pretty complicated to me. I hate to say it but I kind of like the simple black box approach I have with comcrap. The HD/DVR is simple and and works well. I just want something that is simple and cheap. I really wish the Patriots still had Adam Vinitieri.
You might consider the Dish Network Vip 622. It will give you the locals in HD when they are carried later this year--plus a darm good HD DVR to boot. I'll let you know when the service starts to carry local HD content and then you could decide on a cost basis which of the two services (or three if Direct TV gets on-board) is a better financial deal for you.

WNNE-DT does the same thing down here.

I think by law they have to put up the station ID at least once an hour and when they do they drop back to an SD overlay.To their credit (WFFF-DT), at least the HD->SD->HD switcheroo is relatively seemless. Aside from the change in aspect ratio (16:9 to 4:3 and back) and soundtrack channels (5.1 to stereo and back), there are no audio or video dropouts.

You might consider the Dish Network Vip 622. It will give you the locals in HD when they are carried later this year--plus a darm good HD DVR to boot. I'll let you know when the service starts to carry local HD content and then you could decide on a cost basis which of the two services (or three if Direct TV gets on-board) is a better financial deal for you.You neglected to mention that the ViP622 has an ATO HD tuner built right in, so you can stick up and antenna and get locals in HD right now, integrated with your SD and HD satellite channels and PVR functions.

why on earth isn't the pats game being broadcast in HD??!! I can't believe this crap!

WCAX is still in SD and the game is up in HD! Flip the switch!!!!

will calling comacast help? wtf?!

will calling comacast help? wtf?!
no, call WCAX-

Terry, if you live in VT, can you call Primary Phone: 802-652-6300 or Engineering/SHVA Questions: 802-652-6410

http://www.wcax.com/Global/story.asp?S=460229&nav=menu183_13_1

I just called WCAX 658-6300 Choose option 8. I spoke with the tech and he said it could be one of 3 things, the game is not HD (which we know is not true), there is a problem with the feed from NY, or someone in the S burlington studio didn't flip a switch. My guess is it's option 3. He did try to call the studio, but couldn't reach the tech there. I think that the more people who call, they will get their act together and get it in HD. I also have comcrap and it's not in HD either.

wtf wcax?

edit -ahhh all better now!

I watching the pats game via OTA antennae, and it's in SD not HD.

WTF !!!

HD! YES! Thank you for calling guys!

Wonder if these geniuses will do this for the Super Bowl too? Ugh!

@#$% boneheads. they just fixed it. how they were not aware of such a huge error is beyond me.

cool much better now

As I was talking to the clueless gentlemen from comcast on the phone it suddenly switched to HD. Well I am sure he thought I was a nut. I was demanding the Patriots playoff game be broadcast in HD!!!! I was pissed!

I really wish the Patriots still had Adam Vinitieri.

I think Gostkowski did a great job yesterday! I would have been much less nervous if we had Viniteri though...

Next week will be interesting, they better not forget to flip the switch in the future.

I have comcast in killington. I do not have a box but I do have an HDTV. I run the search and I get WETKHD on 21-2 and WCAXHD on 21-4. The only digital channel I get is MTVJams on 101-2. It comes up as CSTV on 175 but says channel not available. Also all the MC channels are there in the 400's. Anyone know what it would take to get the rest of the digital channels and HD channels short of getting a box? Anyone else got more channels showing up on their tuner.

I have comcast in killington. I do not have a box but I do have an HDTV. I run the search and I get WETKHD on 21-2 and WCAXHD on 21-4. <snip> Anyone know what it would take to get the rest of the digital channels and HD channels short of getting a box? Anyone else got more channels showing up on their tuner.This very issue was discussed in this thread at some length just last week. Take a look at the half-dozen or so posts starting with this one:


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9370257&&#post9370257

Did anyone notice that the last two HD episodes of Boston Legal carried only the Music and Effects soundtrack--but NOT the dialogue? Within the show, all of the SD commercials are normal audio but the HD commercials also have no dialogue tracks. It is as though someone at ABC is playing the master tape and forgetting to include all the channels. I don't have trouble with any other show on WVNY.

Yup, I noticed it. I was going nuts last night trying to adjust my antenna to get the dialog back.

The loss of the center dialog channel is an (almost) weekly event on Boston Legal on Ch 22.1 Last night and last week the dialog came back after their local commercial inserts around 10:27PM so we could watch the second half of the show in HD. It is a problem with their DD 5.1 implementation. The show before it is fine, and the commercials which aren't in DD5.1 during the show are OK. Somehow when they go local at mid-show, it comes back fine. My receiver still shows DD 5.1 3/2 after the dialog comes back , but I don't hear anything from the surrounds, so I am suspicious that it has been forced to mono somehow during the break, but I don't have any way to prove it. I was going to call them last night, but can't figure out how to reach them. Very frustrating to have to watch the 1st half of the show each week on analog 22 in SD! Perhaps when Comcast is carrying them more folks will be watching and complaining.

The loss of the center dialog channel is an (almost) weekly event on Boston Legal on Ch 22.1 Last night and last week the dialog came back after their local commercial inserts around 10:27PM so we could watch the second half of the show in HD. It is a problem with their DD 5.1 implementation. The show before it is fine, and the commercials which aren't in DD5.1 during the show are OK. Somehow when they go local at mid-show, it comes back fine. My receiver still shows DD 5.1 3/2 after the dialog comes back , but I don't hear anything from the surrounds, so I am suspicious that it has been forced to mono somehow during the break, but I don't have any way to prove it. I was going to call them last night, but can't figure out how to reach them. Very frustrating to have to watch the 1st half of the show each week on analog 22 in SD! Perhaps when Comcast is carrying them more folks will be watching and complaining.
Boy, I hope so! My problem is that I record the program (old age rearing its ugly head) so I miss it. I wrote to the manager but have not had a reply. Unfortunately, they don't list a phone number on their web page.

The loss of the center dialog channel is an (almost) weekly event on Boston Legal on Ch 22.1 Last night and last week the dialog came back after their local commercial inserts around 10:27PM so we could watch the second half of the show in HD. It is a problem with their DD 5.1 implementation. The show before it is fine, and the commercials which aren't in DD5.1 during the show are OK. Somehow when they go local at mid-show, it comes back fine. My receiver still shows DD 5.1 3/2 after the dialog comes back , but I don't hear anything from the surrounds, so I am suspicious that it has been forced to mono somehow during the break, but I don't have any way to prove it. I was going to call them last night, but can't figure out how to reach them. Very frustrating to have to watch the 1st half of the show each week on analog 22 in SD! Perhaps when Comcast is carrying them more folks will be watching and complaining.


So are you watching off of cable or antenna? (And if cable, which system).

Thanks

P.S. As for the commericals, the local spots are in 2.0. The spots fed from Network are in 2.0 only because there are virtually no 5.1 spots. But when spots are available in 5.1, you would hear them that way.

We get the "local" HD channels here via Videotron in Montreal, and I've noticed that WPTZ's broadcasts alone seem to have three problems:

1) SD shows actually make the area "beyond overscan" on top visible. That is, we can see a pattern of short white and black lines dance around on top, presumably a data subcarrier. I do not see this on the other HD channels, and the TV used isn't adjusted to minimize the overscan (that is, to extend the picture well into the overscan area);
2) possibly related to this, this channel does not broadcast the Closed Caption content of any of the shows. When we got the Buffalo HD signal, it was there on the shows I watched, and now we get nothing;
3) red and orange areas of the picture show severe artifacting or noise. It literally looks like dark lines where there should be a gradual change in the brightness, and its more prominent in orange areas than red areas. This happens for both HD and SD content.

My question is, does anyone else here see this happen? I'm wondering where the problem lies, and right now it would seem to be the station itself: none of the other local HD stations, indeed, any of the other HD channels available on Videotron, show this problem. I've left a message via email to WPTZ about it, but I never received a reply and the picture never got any better...

Howard

We get the "local" HD channels here via Videotron in Montreal, and I've noticed that WPTZ's broadcasts alone seem to have three problems:

1) SD shows actually make the area "beyond overscan" on top visible. That is, we can see a pattern of short white and black lines dance around on top, presumably a data subcarrier. I do not see this on the other HD channels, and the TV used isn't adjusted to minimize the overscan (that is, to extend the picture well into the overscan area);
2) possibly related to this, this channel does not broadcast the Closed Caption content of any of the shows. When we got the Buffalo HD signal, it was there on the shows I watched, and now we get nothing;
3) red and orange areas of the picture show severe artifacting or noise. It literally looks like dark lines where there should be a gradual change in the brightness, and its more prominent in orange areas than red areas. This happens for both HD and SD content.

My question is, does anyone else here see this happen? I'm wondering where the problem lies, and right now it would seem to be the station itself: none of the other local HD stations, indeed, any of the other HD channels available on Videotron, show this problem. I've left a message via email to WPTZ about it, but I never received a reply and the picture never got any better...

Howard

My only problem with WPTZ ota HD is the closed caption. When I first tune to WPTZ my TV tries to retrieve data but I get no CC or show info. I don't have any picture or sound issues.

Thanks everyone who gave me advice, my final fooling around with the antenna until I have someone come put something more permanent up, which may be a while...

WCAX 39% lock
WVNY 100% lock
WNNE 72% lock
WVTA 66% lock
WPTZ 20% no lock

I was able to get a solid lock on WPTZ, WVTB, and WETK (in the 60%), but I gave that up to get a lock on CBS. Still only a whisper on WFFF, but the Colts are on WCAX so I don't care. I am utterly shocked however that I get a 100% signal on WVNY. Reading about all the complaints about there weak signal in this forum and then getting it perfectly 66 miles away with no line of sight astounds me. Maybe I'm just lucky though.

Thanks everyone who gave me advice, my final fooling around with the antenna until I have someone come put something more permanent up, which may be a while...

WCAX 39% lock
WVNY 100% lock
WNNE 72% lock
WVTA 66% lock
WPTZ 20% no lock

I was able to get a solid lock on WPTZ, WVTB, and WETK (in the 60%), but I gave that up to get a lock on CBS. Still only a whisper on WFFF, but the Colts are on WCAX so I don't care. I am utterly shocked however that I get a 100% signal on WVNY. Reading about all the complaints about there weak signal in this forum and then getting it perfectly 66 miles away with no line of sight astounds me. Maybe I'm just lucky though.
Go Colts!-

Thanks everyone who gave me advice, my final fooling around with the antenna until I have someone come put something more permanent up, which may be a while...

WCAX 39% lock
WVNY 100% lock
WNNE 72% lock
WVTA 66% lock
WPTZ 20% no lock

I was able to get a solid lock on WPTZ, WVTB, and WETK (in the 60%), but I gave that up to get a lock on CBS. Still only a whisper on WFFF, but the Colts are on WCAX so I don't care. I am utterly shocked however that I get a 100% signal on WVNY. Reading about all the complaints about there weak signal in this forum and then getting it perfectly 66 miles away with no line of sight astounds me. Maybe I'm just lucky though.
Great! Have you tried a pre-amp yet? Oddly, WCAX is not one of my strong signals and I am only 13.5 miles away. Could be the upper range of UHF doesn't travel well.
I want to try tilting my Winegard PR-4400 up a little so it points to the top of Mansfield instead of at the 1200' level. This will probably have to wait until spring.

Great! Have you tried a pre-amp yet? Oddly, WCAX is not one of my strong signals and I am only 13.5 miles away. Could be the upper range of UHF doesn't travel well.
I want to try tilting my Winegard PR-4400 up a little so it points to the top of Mansfield instead of at the 1200' level. This will probably have to wait until spring.

Yeah, I got the Channel Master 7777. It improved everything a lot. Oddly enough write after I wrote that last message, my antenna came crashing down onto the ice outside. All of the reflectors got bent and the screen got messed up. However, I put it back up and it brought back WVTB, WETK, and WPTZ. WCAX also was boosted a couple points.

Go Colts!!!

Videotech, off the air. Signal strength of 90+. Three different tuners, all the with same symptoms.

Videotech, off the air. Signal strength of 90+. Three different tuners, all the with same symptoms.
The whole second half of Men In Trees was without dialog last night. Had to switch to (shudder) analog.

Habscolts if your interested in reading up on antennas and how to place them you should try going to http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ . The section about erecting an antenna has lots of useful information. There's lots of information about how things blocking the signals effect your reception and how height is not always the answer. You might be able to use it to increase WCAX (usually it will mean making some of the other stations worse).

My question is, does anyone else here see this happen? I'm wondering where the problem lies, and right now it would seem to be the station itself: none of the other local HD stations, indeed, any of the other HD channels available on Videotron, show this problem. I've left a message via email to WPTZ about it, but I never received a reply and the picture never got any better...

Howard

I've seen both problems OTA as well.

When analog shows are converted to digital, they pick up more scan lines than needed, thus making the scan lines containing the closed captioning and program information visible, even if they shouldn't. I'm pretty sure I've seen this on other stations as well, probably from Fox WFFF-DT. It can only be seen when the display is set very close to 0% overscan. I've personally seen it on my computer, it doesn't show up on my tv at around 5% overscan.

I've also seen the bad red problems from WPTZ. I only remember seeing it on an HD broadcasts though, and am pretty sure that not all HD broadcasts are affected by it. I don't remember noticing this problem recently.

The whole second half of Men In Trees was without dialog last night. Had to switch to (shudder) analog.
I got this reply from WVNY about the audio problem:
Thanking you for taking the time to detail the problems you are encountering. I have passed along both of your emails to our engineering department to help them find a better way to monitor this issue.

I certainly did not discount your, nor any other viewer’s report; viewer feedback is important to us, especially since viewer comments are sometimes the only way we are made aware of certain problems.
Sara Carpenter
Director of Programming
WVNY-ABC22
298 Mountain View Drive
Colchester, VT 05446
p (802) 660-9333 ext. 162
f (802) 660-8673
She seems a bit peeved at me for wondering why she didn't answer my first email. There is a phone number attached so some may want to contact her directly during future problem periods.

Does anyone know when WCAX is planning on switching to 22 from 53? I know the deadline is Feb 09 but are they planning on changing sooner or will they drag their feet waiting until the last moment?

Well, they can't move to 22 until that channel gets vacated by WVNY, which is currently using it for analog.

Obviously, it would have been a lot better if WVNY would have chosen to stay on channel 22 and have WCAX move to channel 33 when WETK vacates it.

Well, they can't move to 22 until that channel gets vacated by WVNY, which is currently using it for analog.

Obviously, it would have been a lot better if WVNY would have chosen to stay on channel 22 and have WCAX move to channel 33 when WETK vacates it.
Wow, I didn't know there were any channel changes in the offing. Is there a place where I can get info about this?

Here's a link to a pdf that has all the current and future channels. Not sure if it's up to date though. http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-06-1082A2.pdf

Call Sign WCAX WETK WFFF WVNY WPTZ
Current DTV Channel 53 32 43 13 14
Current NTSC Channel 3 33 44 22 5
Tentative Channel 22 32 43 13 14

If the list is accurate then only WCAX is going to change, which will help with reception as the higher frequencies don't do well with things like ridges or obstuctions.

But it's still not over. We still have to convice WVNY to change channels again, as 90% of the people who receive that station's analog signal can't receive them on the channel 13 digital signal that seems to be powered by a 9V battery! :mad:

I would be happy if WVNY would just turn the power up. VHF is better for us who are in "challenged" locations.

They can't turn the power up. They chose a channel (13) that's already being used by stations nearby in Ottawa and Trois-Rivieres, all of which have out-of-core digital allocations and therefore will STAY on channel 13, even after the transition. Therefore, there is absolutely no possibility of WVNY increasing its power by staying on channel 13.

I thought I read that the FCC gave out channels with an expectation of realistic 60 mile range from the transmitter and stations could ask for a power increase (don't remember the maxium level though). I also thought that the FCC avoided having two stations in the same area using neighboring channels. Sounds like the FCC shouldn't have gave WVNY 13 if they couldn't broadcast a strong enough signal or WVNY doesn't really care much about OTA and didn't fight very hard. Really don't watch anything on ABC anyway.

i am seeing so many problems with abc from everyone how about fox? before on here i have said that my tv can pick up fox fine but for some reason my d* hr10-250 cant, does anyone have this problem? on the tv fox is at 80% but only registers 19% when connected thru the dish receiver. will this maybe corrected in the spring when fox abandons their temporary posistion?

Anybody else suddenly having problems with Fox, half an hour before the game? Every other channel is coming in fine, so I'm assuming it's not me... but I get ~40% signal from fox 44, and a picture rarely if at all.

Anybody else suddenly having problems with Fox, half an hour before the game? Every other channel is coming in fine, so I'm assuming it's not me... but I get ~40% signal from fox 44, and a picture rarely if at all.
My Fox signal is better than ever. I have had trouble with WCAX since the high winds and cold weather, however.

Anyone in Burlington area getting the game in HD OTA?

Fox has always been my best channel. WCAX is always my worst station. I replaced my radio Shack special with a CM 4228 and now I'm able to get WVPT (better than WCAX now) when before I wasn't able to get it at all. I have Dish with a 622 that doesn't show anything less than 56% (minimum amount needed for a lock).

Anyone in Burlington area getting the game in HD OTA?
I'm in Shelburne and getting the game. Lower signal (65-70%) than usual. PTZ is gone.

Anyone in Burlington area getting the game in HD OTA?
Oh, yes, an occasional revert to SD for a few minutes then back to HD.

i am seeing so many problems with abc from everyone how about fox? before on here i have said that my tv can pick up fox fine but for some reason my d* hr10-250 cant, does anyone have this problem? on the tv fox is at 80% but only registers 19% when connected thru the dish receiver. will this maybe corrected in the spring when fox abandons their temporary posistion?

Are you located in the Plattsburgh/North Pole/Peru area? Maybe you're so close to the strong channel 44 analog signal from Mt. Terry that it is overloading the weaker digital channel 43 signal from Mt. Mansfield on some receivers.

I'm still getting Fox at 96% on the south shore of Montreal.

I requested written info from comcast on channels and pricing and they sent me the info. Channel lineup says for HD Programming, Available Broadcasters: ABC, CBS, FOX, NBC, CW, PBS. I hope means these channels will be available real soon. They are not available to me now.... only CBS/PBS.

There also sent me Burlington area pricing details. Even in writing this is hard to figure out.

Here they are:
http://www.geocities.com/vt_road_cyclist/hdtv_cable/channel1.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/vt_road_cyclist/hdtv_cable/channel2.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/vt_road_cyclist/hdtv_cable/price1.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/vt_road_cyclist/hdtv_cable/price1.jpg

I requested written info from comcast on channels and pricing and they sent me the info. Channel lineup says for HD Programming, Available Broadcasters: ABC, CBS, FOX, NBC, CW, PBS. I hope means these channels will be available real soon. They are not available to me now.... only CBS/PBS.


You seem to have skipped this one:
http://www.geocities.com/vt_road_cyclist/hdtv_cable/price2.jpg

There were some Comcast reps a Circuit City last weekend signing people up for service during an HDTV sale. I asked them about the HD locals, and they told me that they were currently negotiating contracts with the remaining networks and expected to have them all added this quarter. They also told me that we would be seeing an expanded OnDemand catalog sometime in February, including HD PPV movies. I believe that this is the box re-provisioning that was referenced earlier in this thread.

Anyone else amused by the irony of those Sony HDTV ads that they run during the NFL playoff games? It's the one that touts Sony as the official HDTV provider for NFL.... but the spot is letterboxed SD. :rolleyes:

There were some Comcast reps a Circuit City last weekend signing people up for service during an HDTV sale. I asked them about the HD locals, and they told me that they were currently negotiating contracts with the remaining networks and expected to have them all added this quarter.
At least they'll be able to watch the big game in HD this year, barring any switch-related snafus.

Anyone else amused by the irony of those Sony HDTV ads that they run during the NFL playoff games?
Not amused, but intrigued.

Good afternoon,

For the first time, ever, I'm able to see WVNY-DT using a pair of collapsed rabbit ears. Notice how I said see - I cannot hear any sound whatsoever on this channel. Is anyone else having this issue, or is it something with my tuner card?

I'm able to hear sound on all of the UHF stations perfectly - UHF come in between 75-100% on the little loop antenna... and WVNY only comes in at a steady 75%....

Just curious...

Here's a link to a pdf that has all the current and future channels. Not sure if it's up to date though. http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-06-1082A2.pdf

Call Sign WCAX WETK WFFF WVNY WPTZ
Current DTV Channel 53 32 43 13 14
Current NTSC Channel 3 33 44 22 5
Tentative Channel 22 32 43 13 14

If the list is accurate then only WCAX is going to change, which will help with reception as the higher frequencies don't do well with things like ridges or obstuctions.
I thought that this reply from WCAX might be of interest on this subject:
In 2 years, Feb 09, we will go from ch53 to ch22. This has more to do with the fact that ch53 will no longer be available for broadcast TV. As for reception the change has nothing to do with that. Where do you live and how is the reception? Please let us know and enjoy our HD signal

Fred Lavenberg
Transmitter Engineer
WCAX TV Channel 3
802-652-6430

Anyone have any idea when any syndicated programs, (Jeopardy, Wheel, Seinfeld) will be broadcast in HD? I know that they've are distributed in HD but they are not carried.

The antennaweb.org info for WPTZ-DT is now finally correct. It took a few months, but we finally got all the affected parties to make the appropriate changes to the database.

TVl

Thanks Teacher1066. I really don't think that most (if any) local stations care much about OTA reception. I'm sure we who have HD TV's and have antenna's to get our HD local fix because our cable/ sat provider doesn't seam to be in any hurry to provide it to us are a minority in their eyes.

Maybe Fred forgot that each antenna has differnt gains for each channel as well as the higher the frequency the less it likes to fan out after being blocked (like having a ridge between your antenna and the tower).

Maybe Fred forgot that each antenna has differnt gains for each channel as well as the higher the frequency the less it likes to fan out after being blocked (like having a ridge between your antenna and the tower).

I don't think he forgot at all. He is simply stating that the primary reason they are moving to channel 22 is that they are required by law to vacate channel 53, on or before February 18, 2009. Effective that date, the only frequencies that can legally be used by TV broadcasters in the USA are those currently used for channels 2-36 and 38-51. (Channel 37 is not used by TV broadcasters anywhere in the USA. It is used by radio astronomers only.) Had it not been for the legal requirement to vacate channel 53, WCAX might very well have decided to remain on 53 rather than move. But since they have to move, it is a moot point.

Can anyone explain why WVNY-DT is currently being broadcast on channel 43 instead of WFFF-DT?

The switch happened somewhere between 16:30 and 16:45.

Is WFFF-DT now on channel 13?

They BETTER NOT put FOX on channel 13!!! :mad:

Well, maybe since WFFF has UHF DT transmitting equipment, and if they don't care if they lose some signal to the north, they're giving WVNY the use of them for now until WETK vacates 33....

So in 2009 it would be:
WFFF 33
WVNY 43
WCAX 22
WETK 32

For tonight, WFFF on 13 WOULD be a problem for AI fans, but for the SOTU, I think FOX will broadcast in upconverted 480p while ABC does full 720p. I know, I know, CBS and NBC will do 1080i, but for those who want to save TiVo hard disk space or have a 720p TV...

As for programming occurring tomorrow on, it's anybody's guess at how worthwhile this is. What's good on Fox other than the Sunday block, AI, and 24? (Then again, what's good on ABC other than Desperate Housewives and LOST?)

They BETTER NOT put FOX on channel 13!!! :mad:


I just had to reconfigure my tuner. Channel 44-1 is know blank, but I still get a strong signal (90). I am picking up Fox HD on 13-1, with a signal strength of 93, but the picture keeps freezing - no pixelation it just looks like I paused the show. Does any one know why this is happening?

I requested written info from comcast on channels and pricing and they sent me the info. Channel lineup says for HD Programming, Available Broadcasters: ABC, CBS, FOX, NBC, CW, PBS. I hope means these channels will be available real soon. They are not available to me now.... only CBS/PBS.

There also sent me Burlington area pricing details. Even in writing this is hard to figure out.

Here they are:
http://www.geocities.com/vt_road_cyclist/hdtv_cable/channel1.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/vt_road_cyclist/hdtv_cable/channel2.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/vt_road_cyclist/hdtv_cable/price1.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/vt_road_cyclist/hdtv_cable/price1.jpg


I just got off the phone with Comcrap, and something that is not clear at all on their pricing sheets is, if you want all the HD channels, you need to have both the expanded basic cable, and at least the digital tier, other wise, you'll just end up with the OTA HDs. They still have no idea when they will pick up the other Locals for HD. After talking with them for a little bit, they were able to lower my bill and I could keep all the HDs. I basically cut my bill in half for the next 6 months. That was much easier than trying to get Dish in my Condo.


I'm not sure what is going on, but after waiting about 15 minutes and reconfiguring my tuner, everything is back to the way it was. I have all channels and they are mapped back to where they have always been. I don't know it was weather related or if some of the stations were messing with thier equipment.

Fox and ABC switched??!!!! I still haven't been able to get Fox on 43 but 13 comes in crystal clear. I don't care much for any ABC shows, I've never like Lost, Desperate Housewives or any of that garbage but I am pumped for Fox being on 13, if that is the case. Will this change be permanent?

WFFF seems to be still on 43 (and WVNY on 13), but keeps cutting in and out (either black screen or color bars).

Now they're both "off the air", broadcasting a signal but no content.

Now they're both "off the air", broadcasting a signal but no content.

Yeah I was going to say, I'm getting about a 95 % signal strength on physical channel 13 but no content. Are they switching channels, or was this just a weird thing? And the most important question, does anyone know if I will be able to watch American Idol in HD in 59 minutes?

In a related note, WVNY's analogue signal on 22 has greatly decreased in Lebanon since this afternoon. It used to be almost as good as an analogue signal could be and now I can hardly tell it exists. I'm guessing that its caused some co-channel interference on the i channel from Concord, NH on 21 since that I know get that relatively clear and in color when before it was unwatchable. I'm really hoping for Fox on 13 even though I'm guessing it won't happen, even though its somewhat logical to give ABC the bigger northern audience.

Whoops. They were just on, now they're off. Oh wait, they're back.

WVNY is back on 13

habscolts, remember that WFFF was the first to use the "Burlington-Plattsburgh-MONTREAL" ID. I doubt they would be dumb enough to give up the audience they have been courting for the past 9-10 years.

habscolts, remember that WFFF was the first to use the "Burlington-Plattsburgh-MONTREAL" ID. I doubt they would be dumb enough to give up the audience they have been courting for the past 9-10 years.


Does WVNY not reach Montreal at all? I think where I am the main problem lies with upper UHF frequencies, as I get 32, analogue 33, and analogue 41from 20 miles away. The low UHF and high VHF reception is great, and I even am able to watch CTV from time to time. WVNY is the only station I think that doesn't mention Montreal, but I'm sure they all care about the Montreal audience.

WVNY off the air here in Lebanon, it came back, gone again, except when it goes now the signal strength goes to zero, instead of the empty screen and 95% it was before

Does WVNY not reach Montreal at all? I think where I am the main problem lies with upper UHF frequencies, as I get 32, analogue 33, and analogue 41from 20 miles away. The low UHF and high VHF reception is great, and I even am able to watch CTV from time to time. WVNY is the only station I think that doesn't mention Montreal, but I'm sure they all care about the Montreal audience.

WVNY does mention Montreal in its ID and has lots of Montreal ads like WFFF.

WCAX (Vermont's Own) is the only station that doesn't mention us (apart from the weather subchannel's listings).

As I mentioned previously, WVNY analog on 22 is the STRONGEST and easiest cross-border station to receive in Montreal. WVNY-DT on 13, however is almost impossible to pull in. A large outdoor VHF antenna on a tower only gives me a borderline signal that constantly drops out. Forget about picking it up with rabbit ears here! The UHF stations (14, 32, 43, 53), however, can be picked up even with indoor loop antennas.

Is it true that in 2009 virtually all stations that have been broadcasting digitally on UHF will go back to VHF because it will be easier for most people to receive a good signal with VHF? I read this on the HDTV Primer website. This would necessitate people having to install another antenna at this time for OTA reception.

This will most likely only be the case with stations which currently have full power high-VHF allocations (like CFTM-10 and CFCF-12 in Montreal). It will not apply to WCAX-3 and WPTZ-5 since they are considered low-VHF (2-6) and are much harder to receive.

This will most likely only be the case with stations which currently have full power high-VHF allocations (like CFTM-10 and CFCF-12 in Montreal). It will not apply to WCAX-3 and WPTZ-5 since they are considered low-VHF (2-6) and are much harder to receive.

Plus, most stations have already made their post-transition channel elections, meaning that we already know the channels most stations will be using after Feb 2009. In the Burlington-Plattsburg market, only WCAX will be changing (from 53 to 22) because 53 is 'out-of-core', and will not, in general, be available for TV broadcasting after 2009.

In the Watertown market, WWNY will revert to 7, but PBS and ABC will stay the same.

In Canada, it's hard to say what will happen, but I suspect the CBC stations on VHF-low will stay in UHF. Not sure if Ottawa's CBOFT 9 (25 DT) will revert or not. I suspect that most stations will flash cut.

Note that some stations have elected to stay on or revert to VHF-low channels. The problem with VHF low, as I understand it, is not propogation issues, but elevated error rates due to increased thermal and electrical noise in that band. Check out W9WI.com for lists of post transition channel numbers, etc.

And as we are now experiencing with WVNY, even VHF-high has its own problems, but stupid "consulting engineers" don't want to believe it because it doesn't correspond to their computer model predictions.

And as we are now experiencing with WVNY, even VHF-high has its own problems, but stupid "consulting engineers" don't want to believe it because it doesn't correspond to their computer model predictions.

I think the issue is that the Longley-Rice model does not necessarily reflect reality.
I think you'll see that the predicted contours for both WVNY-22 and WVNY-DT 13 have the same radius, and neither includes Montreal Isalnd or the South Shore. However, the contours for both ch 3 and ch 5 include most of the island of Montreal, and yet they are not as easily receivable as Ch. 22, even when 2 and 6 are not broadcasting.

I wouldn't call consulting engineers 'stupid'. They are constrained by the FCC to only use certain tools to predict coverage. In Canada, CRC-Predict can be used for coverage maps, except when the coverage has to be coordinated with the FCC, in which case Longley-Rice must be used.

TVl

Yeah. That's what I meant by saying they constantly overestimate VHF and underestimate UHF. Look at this map predicting the current contour of WFFF. According to the map, it shouldn't even reach Plattsburgh, while in reality, it easily reaches Montreal.

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DS1157077.html

I can't believe that after all these years no one has corrected this VHF vs UHF fallacy in the prediction models.

Yeah. That's what I meant by saying they constantly overestimate VHF and underestimate UHF. Look at this map predicting the current contour of WFFF. According to the map, it shouldn't even reach Plattsburgh, while in reality, it easily reaches Montreal.

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DS1157077.html

I can't believe that after all these years no one has corrected this VHF vs UHF fallacy in the prediction models.

The plot you showed is WFF-DT's STA for operating at 18kW instead of 47kW. Is that what they're using right now with their temporary setup? I don't always trust the FCC db, because it's hard to tell which of several entries a station is currently using. (In this case, you would think it would be the STA and not the CP, but who knows?)

TVl

tvlurker, WFFF was forced to operate in their STA mode over the winter because they couldn't get their main antenna setup working before the winter construction break.

I think I might be ordering a new Channel Master 4228. It hasn't survived a couple of falls very well, and the screen is horribly bent, one of the poles the reflectors is on is no longer straight and two of the reflectors broke. Nevertheless, I still get WPTZ, WVNY and WETK from Mansfield digitally, but the signal strength has gotten worse, and CFCF and CFTM still come in too. Are there any antennas comparable to the 4228 that would pull in 53 and 43? Losing 13 isn't that big of a deal, I get it 95% with my UHF antenna 65 miles away, and having it made me realize that there is nothing good on ABC.

I think I might be ordering a new Channel Master 4228. It hasn't survived a couple of falls very well, and the screen is horribly bent, one of the poles the reflectors is on is no longer straight and two of the reflectors broke. Nevertheless, I still get WPTZ, WVNY and WETK from Mansfield digitally, but the signal strength has gotten worse, and CFCF and CFTM still come in too. Are there any antennas comparable to the 4228 that would pull in 53 and 43? Losing 13 isn't that big of a deal, I get it 95% with my UHF antenna 65 miles away, and having it made me realize that there is nothing good on ABC.
I think the CM-4228 pretty well is the best of the bay type antennas as you seem to have proved. However, I've seen articles that describe how to make 16 or 32 bay antennas with two or four 8-bays.

I'm not sure when it happened but comcast has put CAX's weather channel (WCAX-2) on 21.3

...not big news, but for people like me in a mysterious OTA signal free zone it's exciting...

I've read a few "how tos" on ganging two or four CM 4228s together but it makes for a heavy antenna and may not always help. I have thought about making a copy of a 4228 but with a bigger alum screen and longer dipoles. I assume that the cm 4228 size is probably due to being UPSable.

Of course I'm also thinking of getting a second 4228 and getting out the welder and picking up some pipe and making a 50' tower next to the house. There's some ledge that would make for a great base and instead of a giant lightning rod on the side of my house now it would be 20 feet away, lol.

Plus, most stations have already made their post-transition channel elections, meaning that we already know the channels most stations will be using after Feb 2009. In the Burlington-Plattsburg market, only WCAX will be changing (from 53 to 22) because 53 is 'out-of-core', and will not, in general, be available for TV broadcasting after 2009.

In the Watertown market, WWNY will revert to 7, but PBS and ABC will stay the same.

In Canada, it's hard to say what will happen, but I suspect the CBC stations on VHF-low will stay in UHF. Not sure if Ottawa's CBOFT 9 (25 DT) will revert or not. I suspect that most stations will flash cut.

Note that some stations have elected to stay on or revert to VHF-low channels. The problem with VHF low, as I understand it, is not propogation issues, but elevated error rates due to increased thermal and electrical noise in that band. Check out W9WI.com for lists of post transition channel numbers, etc.


Channels 2 thru 6 have been found to be pretty bad for digital. (The lower the worse). But in the digital relm, you should not really see a dif. of a station on the vhf high band verse UHF. Propagation as you say, is another matter.

just wondering, is there anyone in the vt area that has the d* 5lnb dish installed yet? was wondering if there are any more hd channels available with the mpeg 4 technology? and does anyone have the new hd/dvr receiver from them? if so any thoughts on how it is working?

just wondering, is there anyone in the vt area that has the d* 5lnb dish installed yet? was wondering if there are any more hd channels available with the mpeg 4 technology? and does anyone have the new hd/dvr receiver from them? if so any thoughts on how it is working?I forget, does d* mean DishNetwork or DirecTV?

FWIW - I've got Dish with 2 dishes (a Dish 500 pointed at 110 and 119 ganged to another dish pointed at, I think, 65), and a ViP622 HD DVR receiver. Oh yeah, and a DIY square loop antenna in the garage for OTA reception.

Works great. Even though there are more HD stations from the satellite, I almost exclusively watch the 5 OTA HDTV locals.

D* stands for DirecTV. E* stands for Echostar, the parent company of Dish Network. As of now, I don't think either has local HD channels on either MPEG2 or MPEG4. And when it comes to D*'s national HD channels, I think that the 3 LNB dish is all that's needed for now, but when the new national channels go online later this year, the 5 LNB dish and an MPEG4 receiver WILL be required.

Well the temperatures are going down once again, and once again the WCAX signal, which is usually solid, is cutting in and out. All of the other locals remain at the same levels. Does anyone out there know of a book or web page where I can research the reason for this oddity and other reception "strangeness"? I always thought that signal propagation was better with cold temperatures.

Well the temperatures are going down once again, and once again the WCAX signal, which is usually solid, is cutting in and out. All of the other locals remain at the same levels. Does anyone out there know of a book or web page where I can research the reason for this oddity and other reception "strangeness"? I always thought that signal propagation was better with cold temperatures.
Interesting, because WCAX had been about 78% and is now 88%, with WPTZ at 92%, WVNY at 82% and both WEKT and WFFF at 98%. The antenna is a Winegard PR-4400 four-bay, plus a high-band VHF antenna for WVNY.

Well the temperatures are going down once again, and once again the WCAX signal, which is usually solid, is cutting in and out. All of the other locals remain at the same levels.
You could have overload, as WCAX is far and away the area's most powerful signal. Try getting an attenuator online or at a RadioShack store.

There's a slight chance that the cold weather is causing the center conductor of your coax to contract and start to pull out of the contacts on the transformer. Being as WCAX is on the highest frequency, it would be the most susceptible to such an occurrence. Though I wouldn't hold my breath that this is what's causing your signal drops.

I'm not sure when it happened but comcast has put CAX's weather channel (WCAX-2) on 21.3

...not big news, but for people like me in a mysterious OTA signal free zone it's exciting...

What do you mean 21.3? Where is that channel on my Comca$t lineup?

Thanx

What do you mean 21.3? Where is that channel on my Comca$t lineup?

Thanx

That is referring to those of us who are using the built in tuners in our TV's instead of a cable box.

So here is the digital "in the clear" line up so far:
21.2 WETK-HD (VPT)
21.3 WCAX-DT2 (Weather)
21.4 WCAX-HD (CBS)
300 Digital Info Channel
401-445 Music Choice Digital Music

Anyone seeing any other channels?

OK, now I understand. New to this HD stuff. Now would that preety much be any tuner that now comes with the HD sets? I believe that would be the ATSC?

Thanx

An ATSC tuner will allow you to receive over the air digital signals, but to pull digital signals from cable, you need a QAM tuner. Many TVs have QAM tuners, but there are also quite a few that do not.

That is referring to those of us who are using the built in tuners in our TV's instead of a cable box.

So here is the digital "in the clear" line up so far:
21.2 WETK-HD (VPT)
21.3 WCAX-DT2 (Weather)
21.4 WCAX-HD (CBS)
300 Digital Info Channel
401-445 Music Choice Digital Music

Anyone seeing any other channels?

OK, I 'm learning. Now, these channels I take it are not scrambled. As the rest of the OTA's are added will they also be unscrambled? Is there any rule that regulates OTA on cable differently than the regular cable channels?

Thanx

Greetings everyone,

I have spent a few hours searching the forums, prior to registering to post this message. I also spent a good deal of time reading the Burlington, VT - HDTV thread. However, I'm still a bit confused and I hope you can help me make some sense of some things.

First off, I am relocating to Burlington, VT from Minneapolis, MN in 3 weeks for a new job.

Here in Minneapolis, Time Warner Cable recently was purchased by Comcast. I currently have a InFocus 4805 projector as my primary TV, along with a SA8300HD tuner/DVR provided from Time Warner/Comcast. I have this hooked up to the 4805 with an HDMI cable/adapter. I've had this set up for a 18 months, and I love it. We get ESPN, ESPN2, HDNET, INHD, HDMovies, TNT, Discovery HD, PBS HD, CBS, NBC, ABC, and FOX in HD.

When I saw that Burlington had Comcast as well, I figured it would be an easy swap of services, and I could enjoy the same channels I have grown accustomed to here in Minneapolis. However, after many web searches, I've found that Comcast recently purchased Adelphelia cable in the area, and that HD service is spotty at best.

I will be moving into an apartment, so Dish Network is not an option. Here are my questions.

1.) Is it realistic to request & then receive an SA8300HD tuner from Comcast in Burlington?

2.) Is it true that Comcast in Burlington only REALLY offers 1-2 HD channels? (Their website was not conclusive, and when I called, the rep told me that they weren't sure as they're just in a sales office).

3.) If Comcast only offers 1-2 channels, and no SA8300HD tuner, what are my options for HD with a projector (4805) that has no built in tuner? Is building a HD PVR PC my only option? A satellite is not an option.

Thank you very much, in advance!

1.) Is it realistic to request & then receive an SA8300HD tuner from Comcast in Burlington?

2.) Is it true that Comcast in Burlington only REALLY offers 1-2 HD channels? (Their website was not conclusive, and when I called, the rep told me that they weren't sure as they're just in a sales office).

3.) If Comcast only offers 1-2 channels, and no SA8300HD tuner, what are my options for HD with a projector (4805) that has no built in tuner? Is building a HD PVR PC my only option? A satellite is not an option.

Thank you very much, in advance!

1. Yes, they have the SA8300HD

2. They only have 2 of the local channels so far. The rest will be added. Here are the channels available now:
703 WCAX HD
733 WETK VPT HD
750 HBO HD
752 Starz HDTV
753 Cinemax-HD
770 HD Net
771 HD Net Movies
772 ESPN HD
773 NESN (New England Sports Network) - HD
774 INHD
775? TNT HD
776 Discovery HDTV
777 NFL Network - HD
778 ESPN 2 HD
779 Fox Sports New England - HD

Thank you for your answers! That was just the info I was looking for!

1. Yes, they have the SA8300HD

Ahh, very good. I think the misses would choke me if I told her we were getting rid of the HD DVR. :)

2. They only have 2 of the local channels so far. The rest will be added. Here are the channels available now:

drat, no NBC, ABC or Fox HD. Is it worth begging and pleading with my landlord to get Dish service, or do they only offer CBS and PBS, as well?

Thank you, again!

drat, no NBC, ABC or Fox HD. Is it worth begging and pleading with my landlord to get Dish service, or do they only offer CBS and PBS, as well?Dish does not have any of the locals in HD over satellite. They're strictly SD right now. And fat chance of getting a waiver to allow them to provide you with distant locals in HD.

However, if you upgrade to the ViP622 HD PVR, then it has a terrestrial HDTV (aka ATSC) tuner built-in. The PVR happily records from both the ATSC and satellite tuners.

Of course, you'll have to put up an antenna, but once you do, theoretically all 5 locals will be available to you in HD in addition to the HD content from the satellite. Unfortunately, as you'll see if you read through this thread, people have had varying success getting all 5 locals with antennas.

Lastly, the law grants you certain rights when it comes to putting up a satellite dish (or small OTA antenna for that matter). If you happen to have a balcony with South-West exposure, then you should be able to put up a dish without much to-do. For the OTA locals, you'll want near line-of-sight to Mt. Mansfield where the transmitters are located.

drat, no NBC, ABC or Fox HD. Is it worth begging and pleading with my landlord to get Dish service, or do they only offer CBS and PBS, as well?

Thank you, again!

Yeah, It's painful not having these in HD. I spoke to Comcast about 2 weeks ago and they told me that the additional HD channels would be added sometime in 1st quarter of this year, so you wouldn't be without them for long.

Here's a link to the FCC fact sheet on the placement of antennas and dishes, even for apartments:

http://www.fcc.gov/mb/facts/otard.html

Xotis, why move to Vermont?? Just kidding of course. :rolleyes: The rumour mills have it that comca$t nationally will be upgrading their HD service later this year partly in response to D* recently announcing upwards of 100 new HD channel additions, although some of these may be time shifted duplicates.

http://www.engadget.com/2007/01/09/directv-to-carry-100-national-hd-channels-in-2007/

This will be a very interesting year for HD. I think finially HD will come into it's own so to speak. The other interesting thing will be to see how much Comca$t charges us for the expanded lineup.

http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6410009.html?display=Breaking+News

MrJ

edited to add content

Yeah, It's painful not having these in HD. I spoke to Comcast about 2 weeks ago and they told me that the additional HD channels would be added sometime in 1st quarter of this year, so you wouldn't be without them for long.

That's great news! I was fearing that I'd have to wait till 2009. :)

I think D* is talking more about adding local station coverage in smaller markets than adding new channels. The real problem is that there's not alot of HD providers to broadcast. I was hoping that after TNT started there would be other's that followed. Maybe with strong sales of HD tvs that will be the added push needed.

xotis, welcome to Vermont, soon. Depending on your appartment's location you could get all the locals with a rabbit ear antenna. The stations you listed are all being broadcasted ota in HD from Mt. Mansfield. You would just need a easternly view. Although I've heard the same thing (Comcast will be adding the missing locals next month) as an ex costumer I don't trust a word out of their mouth. Neither Dish or Dtv offer HD locals in Vermont yet.

first post
Cool forum
I called D* last week and they said they would be carrying Burlington/Plattsburg local channels in HD sometime starting in march 2007. We'll see if they live up to that promise.

I'm on DishNetwork currently and awful area for OTA in Warren. I can get WVNY reliably with roof Uhf/Vhf antenna, but all the others are spotty. Wcax the best of the rest, but with frequent dropouts.

Any advice from anyone in the mad river valley/warren area?
Thanks

xotis, welcome to Vermont, soon. Depending on your appartment's location you could get all the locals with a rabbit ear antenna. The stations you listed are all being broadcasted ota in HD from Mt. Mansfield. You would just need a easternly view. Although I've heard the same thing (Comcast will be adding the missing locals next month) as an ex costumer I don't trust a word out of their mouth. Neither Dish or Dtv offer HD locals in Vermont yet.


Thank you for your post. Since my HD "TV" is an InFocus 4805 projector with no built in tuner, what would I need to get, besides an antenna, to get the OTA signal to display on my projector?

Thanks!

I think D* is talking more about adding local station coverage in smaller markets than adding new channels. The real problem is that there's not alot of HD providers to broadcast. I was hoping that after TNT started there would be other's that followed. Maybe with strong sales of HD tvs that will be the added push needed.

Crazyal, If you check the link I provided you will see more than just the locals, assuming of course that you can believe the PR. Again I will say, if this is true and that is a big if, than this will be the breakout year for HD. Of course it could be argued that any year would be better than 06. It is certainly about time the
Scifi channel goes HD at any rate. I hate to single them out, but lets be real, they are the geeks channel (i include myself in this) and a lot of geeks buy HD.

MrJ

Thank you for your post. Since my HD "TV" is an InFocus 4805 projector with no built in tuner, what would I need to get, besides an antenna, to get the OTA signal to display on my projector?

Thanks!

Many say this one. http://www.tvantenna.com/products/dtv/stb/DTB-H260F.html

I personally have not tried it. I live in the devil's triangle of RF. Antennas do not seem to work in East Montpelier. :D

Mrj

first post
Cool forum
I called D* last week and they said they would be carrying Burlington/Plattsburg local channels in HD sometime starting in march 2007. We'll see if they live up to that promise.

I'm on DishNetwork currently and awful area for OTA in Warren. I can get WVNY reliably with roof Uhf/Vhf antenna, but all the others are spotty. Wcax the best of the rest, but with frequent dropouts.

Any advice from anyone in the mad river valley/warren area?
Thanks
When you use D* do you mean Dish Net or Direct TV?

When you use D* do you mean Dish Net or Direct TV?

D* = DirecTV
E* = EchoStar ( DishNetwork )

I think we all say it because it's a club thing, not easier :o

MrJ

I assumed since xotis would settle for cable. It's been some time and I can't remember if the 8300 HD had an antenna input on it or not. I have Dish with a 622 VIP now. It has an antenna input but my TV also has an input. Worse case you would have to get a OTA tuner for your projector, might be getting kind of pricey if in a month or two Comcast adds them. Of course until you try you'll have no idea what you'll get (unless you can clearly see Mt Mansfield) for stations. With the hills around here it's hit or miss.

Thank you for your post. Since my HD "TV" is an InFocus 4805 projector with no built in tuner, what would I need to get, besides an antenna, to get the OTA signal to display on my projector?

Thanks!

A TiVo Series3 would allow you to integrate OTA HD and all of your Comcast channels together seamlessly. Of course, it's far from the cheapest solution.

D* = DirecTV
E* = EchoStar ( DishNetwork )

I think we all say it because it's a club thing, not easier :o

MrJ
Boy, I hope this doesn't mean I'll have to buy a "decoder ring" to join the club! After shelling out for an HDTV, I haven't got but pennies left. Seriously, thanks...

A TiVo Series3 would allow you to integrate OTA HD and all of your Comcast channels together seamlessly. Of course, it's far from the cheapest solution.

Amen. I just set up my new S3 TiVo a few weeks back, integrating Comcast's HD offering with all of the OTA HD locals that I get from my rabbit ears. Works beautifully, but definitely a very pricey investment.

Also, when a Comcast technician came to install my CableCards a few weeks ago, I asked the inevitable question of whether he knew when the remaining HD locals would be added to their lineup. He said he thought they were still working on contactual issues and that he heard the channels wouldn't be added until April at the earliest. Not sure how accurate it is, but I figured I'd pass it along.

I don't think anyone at Comcast has a clue when the remaining locals will be available in HD. Ask five different people and you'll get five different answers.