While watching my Panny today, I heard a nasty whinning sound for about 5 seconds and then the Display powered off . It was a very high pitched sound followed by the power cutting off. I was unable to turn the power back on until I unplugged the display and waited a few minutes to power it back on. Since this occured this afternoon, it has happened three times since. ANy ideas what may be going on? Thank you.

bump

Note: This is also posted in another, similar thread:

Cabber,
As I mentioned in my PM, Panasonic is coming on Wednesday to repair the TV, replacing modules 5 and 7, which the tech said cost > $800 apiece. I spoke with a manager, who suggested they might replace the TV or refund me if the repair does not solve the problem, but that could only be authorized after at least one service attempt. Does anyone here know what modules 5 and/or 7 are on the 42PA20? Or have any other suggestions to press Panasonic for a satisfactory resolution? I certainly hope the repair solves the issue, as the PQ when the TV works is excellent, but I'm not too happy about having a 2-month-old TV that requires such a large repair.

any update on this, jba87?

Not yet, they postponed the service call until Friday. Will update then--if they don't postpone again.

Bump...

Same problem here, what's the deal with this???

Sorry for not posting sooner. My TV was repaired in home by an authorized tech, then had the exact same problem the day after repair. It was then sent to the factory for service (Panasonic would not replace it) and is expected back today, a few weeks later. (I've now been without a functional TV for 6 weeks). I will report back to let you know if they successfully addressed the issue this time.

I was under the impression that this diode problem was well documented within Panasonic and replaceable on a house call basis. Hopefully this is still the case.


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=310194&highlight=panny


"Technically speaking, this is part of a protection circuit that shuts down the PDP if any of the working voltages dip below 75% of their nominal value.
This particular problem is due to the shutdown circuit being too anxious to do its job. It had to be mellowed a bit, made less sensitive, given an electronic traquilizer if you will.

All units since Sept 1 production have had the improved parts. More than 99% of the original parts stock were well within specification and will last as long if not longer than the new ones.

All service parts and boards have been changed to the newer stock.

To answer your question, the consumer group will probably send an authorized servicer with a replacement module if needed to perform the update on site. Broadcast units may be serviced at any of the regional centers and also at authorized Broadcast service centers now in some major cities nationwide. Check with your nearest region for locations."

Originally posted by jba87
(I've now been without a functional TV for 6 weeks). I will report back to let you know if they successfully addressed the issue this time.

this is really a troubling report

Mark,
Yes, this issue has been troubling--and incredibly frustrating, given that I've been without a working TV for 6 weeks on a unit that was 7 weeks old when this issue first occured. I tried everything I could, but they would not replace or refund the TV, even after the first repair didn't work. In my case, they did replace the entire module, but it didn't take. After having the unit on for 2-3 hours, it shut off again repeatedly. They said that sending the unit to the factory was the most expeditious and best way to resolve the issue, rather than keep sending people to my house. I was told by the tech that the entire process from pickup to return would take 5 days. Well, it's 2 1/2 weeks since they picked the unit up (3 1/2 weeks since they said it would have to be sent to the factory)...and the TV is scheduled for delivery to the local service center today. Hopefully they'll deliver it tonight, but when I called to give the tech a heads up that the unit was on its way he responded by hanging up on me. I'm crossing my fingers this fix took, otherwise I'll have to prepare for more (and I've already had my fair share of) headaches dealing with Panasonic.

Sorry to hear about your Panny woes...

Does anyone know if the 37inch version of this model is also afflicted with this problem?? If so, maybe I should be worried (the set I have has a July manufacture date).

Originally posted by markrubin
this is really a troubling report

I agree. Seems to me that in this particular case at least, Panasonic is going so far out of its way to not replace the unit that they've probably spent about the same amount of money.

I think at this stage I'd be escalating this as far up the chain as I could.

Originally posted by jba87
Mark,
Yes, this issue has been troubling--and incredibly frustrating, given that I've been without a working TV for 6 weeks on a unit that was 7 weeks old when this issue first occured. I tried everything I could, but they would not replace or refund the TV, even after the first repair didn't work. In my case, they did replace the entire module, but it didn't take. After having the unit on for 2-3 hours, it shut off again repeatedly. They said that sending the unit to the factory was the most expeditious and best way to resolve the issue, rather than keep sending people to my house. I was told by the tech that the entire process from pickup to return would take 5 days. Well, it's 2 1/2 weeks since they picked the unit up (3 1/2 weeks since they said it would have to be sent to the factory)...and the TV is scheduled for delivery to the local service center today. Hopefully they'll deliver it tonight, but when I called to give the tech a heads up that the unit was on its way he responded by hanging up on me. I'm crossing my fingers this fix took, otherwise I'll have to prepare for more (and I've already had my fair share of) headaches dealing with Panasonic.

could you tell us the location of the service center that hung up on you?

Wow,

I hope I don't have to go through the same trouble as you. I would be extremely peeved if that was the rediculous service Panasonic gave me. I've had my TV for about 7 weeks, just like you (july/03 prod date) and just recently it started acting up. Called the local service today, and they said they're not even sure they can service plasmas because they haven't done it before. Uhh ohh, things aren't looking too great from the start

Originally posted by Amir
[B
I've had my TV for about 7 weeks, just like you (july/03 prod date) [/B]

Can you say how to determine the production date of a Panasonic plasma display? I've poked around the back to the display a bit looking for the production date, and have not found it, but I might not have looked hard enough, or in any of the right places.

Maybe we should start tracking serial numbers of the units...

Originally posted by SilverWolf
Maybe we should start tracking serial numbers of the units...

good idea:

someone might want to start a new thread for this purpose

I think we need to get the attention of the higher ups to get this issue resolved

Originally posted by shadowspawn
Can you say how to determine the production date of a Panasonic plasma display? I've poked around the back to the display a bit looking for the production date, and have not found it, but I might not have looked hard enough, or in any of the right places.
It's on the little plate on the back that has the serial number.

I've had mine for almost 8 weeks, no problems.
production date is June 2003. I swear if this
jinxes me, I'm gonna be so pissed!

Originally posted by JimSD
It's on the little plate on the back that has the serial number.

... which is just barely completely covered by my mounting plate...

DOH!

This diode problem will effect anyone with a 2003 model Panny that was manufacturer early.

The TH-42PA20U ED Plasma came out in early July. The diode problem was discovered soon after. But there were already hundreds of plasmas in the sales pipeline.

I have a feeling that any large vendor like Electrograph, CC, or BB may have dozen's of these defective plasma's in their warehouses. I doubt that Panasonic is recalling these early production plasma's and replacing them with fixed models.

Therefore, Panasonic is trying to "fix" them once they get to consumers with a service call. I doubt they are fixing them in the warehouses of CC and BB before they get to consumers. That would make too much sense.

I smell a Microsoft-like contempt for consumers. Not to go off on a tangent.
That new Tarantino move "Kill Bill" is really about Uma Thurmon chasing down Bill Gates....

A Warning to all TH-42PA20U/TH-37PA20U/TH-42PX20U owners to possibly include commercial 6UY owners.

- If the manufacturing date is before July 2003 get your unit replaced after a stress test.
- A manufacturing date of August 2003 may still be a problem. Perform a stress test.
- September 2003 and later seems to be OK.

We got burned by being early adaptors of these new Panny Plasma's.
Plus I am sure you paid MSRP. $1500 over the current price.

Stress test: Leave the plasma On for 1-2 days and see if there is a shutdown. Be careful, with burn in. Make sure the source material is widescreen or stretched. (HD PBS or Discovery).

Alternately, go to where you purchased your plasma at night and ask the salesman if the unit has been shutting down. Then check the manufacturing date on the label in back with the serial number.

If your Plasma is less than 1 years old and has shutdown even once, then get it replaced. Speak to a supervisor, if you don't get any satisfaction.
If they don't replace it, return it to your vendor. Make a big stink. This is no different than getting a defective new car at a dealership. Lemon Law may appply. I had a defective Nikon digicam I paid $1000 for. Got it swapped for a new model after a stink. If you have a problem it may get worst as your 1 year Panasonic warranty counts down.

Think about this. They could take your returned defective plasma, fix it, and give it to stores as their display models. You should get a NEW model. It is pennies to Panasonic/Matushita.

One thing to add

Someone on the forum had a Panny SD plasma replaced and they sent him a HD plasma as a replacement.

We should be so lucky.

Everyone,
Here's the update on my shutdown issue. Well, so far so good. My set was returned Thursday from factory servicing and it appears to be working properly. It has not shut down, nor does it display any warning signs (a high-pitched whining sound at startup). They even resolved the DVI image shift issue I had. A couple of things: I asked for an extension of my warranty for the time I was without my TV, and will let you know what Panny says. Stealth, your points are well-taken, but I can assure you that I escalated my situation as far up as possible and Panasonic would NOT replace or refund the TV, even after it was repaired once unsuccessfully. It got to the point where I couldn't fight it anymore. And, insofar as the member who had his set replaced with the HD model, I'm certain he arranged that through his store, not Panasonic, and most likely because he agreed to pay the difference.

any chance a unit manufactured in July '03 would NOT have a problem? or do you think they are all affected? mine says July '03. it's about 6 weeks old, but i was on vacation for 2 of those weeks so it's only been used for 4. conducting a stress test right now. so far, so good. this sounds like a real hassle. i certainly didn't pay over 3 dimes for a tv for this nonsense. many thanks to the above posters for sharing their experiences in this matter and for giving a heads up to the rest of us.

boist

Boist,

Mine is a July '03 manufacture, and it has the shut down issue.

Can anybody get the official word on the date of manufacture after which the diode was factory corrected? Maybe Lisa can slap her rep with a trout 'till he tells her?

thanks,

elvis

mine has been on for 2 days as a test suggested by stealth. no shut down yet. think i'm out of the woods??? i hope so. purchased at CC in NYC first week of september. crossing my fingers

Boist

boist, as I noted in another thread, mine didn't fail until it had at least a good 150 or 200 hours on it. I don't know how many hours you have on your plasma total, but if your goal is stress testing it for the diode problem, I wouldn't personally call it quits until I had hit at least 250 hours or more. It's a shame to have to log hours on a TV to make sure that you won't have problems later, but I guess that's another subject entirely!

Yes, boist, I second SLCMike about total hours needed (I estimate mine started having problems at 150-250 hours), but I wouldn't recommend continuing the "stress test." The chances of your TV being affected are small, yet if it is affected it will begin to shut down sooner or later no matter what. The stress test will only speed up the process if it's affected, and only put extra life on the TV if it's not. Since you're already past the 30-day return of CC, there's really no reason to continue stress-testing to speed up the process. My advice is if you're happy with the TV otherwise, to continue to watch happily. If it fails in the not-too-distant-future, call Panasonic to get it repaired. If it looks like they won't be able to fix it quickly in-home (as they didn't in my case), buy another one from CC in the meantime and return it 29 days later or whenever your TV is fixed. Although I didn't pursue that strategy, in hindsight I wish I had.

That's one stratagy. The other is to contact your credit card company and dispute the charge. The go down to CC, ask for the Store manager and ask him to do the right thing and replace your unit. If he refuses tell him he's forced you into asking the credit card company to dispute payment. Then buy another one with plans to return it within the 30 day window. It's kind of playing hard ball but since they're doing the same to you....

Ray

I knew it was too good to be true! My TH-42PA20 just started shutting down. For the first few days it was every 6 hours, yesterday it was every 3 hours and today my wife said it is doing it about every 10 minutes. It is a July '03 model. I estimate just over 1000 hours of operation.

I have a local service shop but they told me to bring it in. I'll have to check the warranty to see if they are suppose to provide "in-house" repair.

Stitchman, you should call Panasonic's customer service at 1-800-973-4326. Maybe they'll learn this problem really does exist. As far as I know, it is most definitely supposed to have in-home service. That's one of the selling points of this versus the industrial model.

Has anyone else ever seen more than one PIP box displayed on the screen? I walked away from the TV for a while and when I came back there were 3 small PIP boxes and they were cycling through the channels. I don't know if a little one sat on the remote or pressed some weird combination of buttons or what. I haven't seen it since, but I haven't used it much either since then.

Stitch, sorry to hear about your troubles. I've been there. And, yes, the 42PA20 has in-home service. It is clearly stated in the warranty. You should definitely take Panasonic up on it, rather than bring the TV in. The service center may want to bring it in or send it to the factory, but they'll pick it up and put it in a special container to do so. You shouldn't have to bring it in. Jim, I think what you saw is the channel index feature. I haven't used it since I feed all TV through component rather than the internal tuner, but I think the set allows you to preview several other channels, which it cycles through, while watching another.

Originally posted by jba87
Jim, I think what you saw is the channel index feature. I haven't used it since I feed all TV through component rather than the internal tuner, but I think the set allows you to preview several other channels, which it cycles through, while watching another.
Thanks for the tip. I found out from looking at the manual online that it is the Search button on the remote. I suspected a certain 4 year old pushed something.


Is there anyone at AVS Forum that can get the attention of someone in Panasonic to acknowledge the shutdown problem and respond how they will deal with it down the line? Since it took Stitchman 1000 hours to hit the problem, I'd suspect some of us won't encounter it until after the warranty runs out.

Good point Jim. That's one reason why I just bought the 4 yr. extended Warrantech warranty.

Thanks guys, I plan on calling Panasonic tomorrow and will let you know what they say.

I'm also going to check on that warranty from Warrantech. The 4 year is under $200. Almost sounds too good to be true.

Stitch

Hi, I'm a new member here but have been a "lurker" since I got my 42" Panny Ed in September. I'ts a June 2003 build. This is ALMOST funny, I was reading the post on the "shut down" issue and heard the now infamous high pitched sound...followed by shut down... followed by blinking red power light. I'm now a member of "the club".

Mark

Originally posted by slocmah
Hi, I'm a new member here but have been a "lurker" since I got my 42" Panny Ed in September. I'ts a June 2003 build. This is ALMOST funny, I was reading the post on the "shut down" issue and heard the now infamous high pitched sound...followed by shut down... followed by blinking red power light. I'm now a member of "the club".

Mark


Wow Mark, sorry to hear about that. Approximately how many viewing hours would you guess you had on the display before it shut down?


Also, if you have a second, respond in this thread. It's been a helpful gauge of how prevelant this issue is:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=316601&perpage=20&highlight=th42pa20u&pagenumber=4

Well, I just purchased my 4 year extended warranty from PROCURA.com. I also called Panasonic who gave me the local service center. The woman I spoke to had no idea that this model had any problems....okay, sure. So I called the local service center and arranged for in-home service. I was told that they would still have to take the PDP back to the shop to work on it. Oh well, at least they will do all the transporting. I just hope it doesn't take weeks to get it back.

Stitch

Originally posted by Stitchman
Well, I just purchased my 4 year extended warranty from PROCURA.com. I also called Panasonic who gave me the local service center. The woman I spoke to had no idea that this model had any problems....okay, sure. So I called the local service center and arranged for in-home service. I was told that they would still have to take the PDP back to the shop to work on it. Oh well, at least they will do all the transporting. I just hope it doesn't take weeks to get it back.

Stitch
I'm planning on writing to Panasonic tonight to request a warranty extension that covers the specific problem people are experiencing. Obviously their customer support is unwilling to acknowledge the problem or uninformed. Honda extended a warranty for transmissions proactively when they discovered some had a premature failure rate in the single digits. I'd guess this failure rate is much higher than that. Unless someone knows a better address to send to, I'll just be sending it to the national headquarters that is listed in the owner's manual.

The TH-42PA20 is a fantastic set otherwise. They need to do the right thing and provide some assurance to the early buyers of this model who based their decision on Panasonics track record with their previous models.

Jim, that is a great idea. Please keep us posted with your progress.

I'm an owner of a 42pa20u with a June 2003 build date ( purch 8/5, est 700 hours). I have not experienced the shut down problem and I too will write Panasonic to request a warranty extension for this particular problem. I'm not expecting much, but it can't hurt. I wonder how the "shut down" poll would look if only those with pre Sept 2003 units responded. I would be interesting to know what percentage of pre Sept units have failed.

Here's an address I found on the Panasonic website:

Panasonic Consumer Affairs
Panazip 2F-3
One Panasonic Way
Secaucus, NJ 07094


This looks to have a little more specific routing info than the generic address in the owner's manual.

I just got a call from the service center. The tech was somewhat aware of the "shutdown" problem and said he would order the boards. He said it would take about a week to get them and then would come to my house and install them...at least that is the plan. So in the mean time I can still watch my PDP (getting up occasionally).

Cross Posted from another thread

Finally!!!

The tv repair place in my area finally received the necessary parts to repair my tv. Apparently the part was backordered for two months!! I've been in such agony not being able to watch MNF for the past 2+ months!!.

Anyway, they came to my place earlier today, removed the rear panel, removed a circuit board, and will return later to put everything back together. I did manage to get a few pics for you guys...

Originally posted by jfklennon
I've had mine for almost 8 weeks, no problems.
production date is June 2003. I swear if this
jinxes me, I'm gonna be so pissed!

lfklennon, have you gone into the service mode to see how hours you have on it? Next to the CHK, there is a hex number which appears to be the service hours for the unit.. I've had mine since July, but only have 91 hours on it.

Jason how do you get into the service mode?

Stich or Amir- If you or anyone else can get the part number or name of the "boards" that need to be replaced to fix it, it would be very helpful to the rest of us if we run into the same problems. Thanks.

Originally posted by Amir
Jason how do you get into the service mode?

OK


1) Put input into Cable Mode
2) Go to channel 124
3) Set sleep timer for 30 minutes
4) Turn volume all the way down using the REMOTE
5) Press DOWN Volume button on the TV

You will see a red "CHK" and then a group of 6 letter/numbers right after. That I believe is the Service Hour count

Oh, press POWER on your Remote to get into the service mode with "CHK" displayed, press POWER on the TV to get out of it.

** It has been reported that you can possibly lose your custom video settings, so write them down first (number values)

OK so mine says CHK001B5 48434843 08

Which combination of numbers shows how many hours I have?

Originally posted by jasonbanks

Oh, press POWER on your Remote to get into the service mode with "CHK" displayed, press POWER on the TV to get out of it.


So, when you see the CHK displayed you're not in service mode yet? You have to press POWER on the remote? If so, and you only want to check the hours and not go into service mode, do you then just press POWER on the TV?

Originally posted by NickChicago
Stich or Amir- If you or anyone else can get the part number or name of the "boards" that need to be replaced to fix it, it would be very helpful to the rest of us if we run into the same problems. Thanks.

Roger that, Nick. I'll do my best.

:D

Originally posted by Amir
OK so mine says CHK001B5 48434843 08

Which combination of numbers shows how many hours I have?

001B5. Shows you have 437 hours on your set.

Quick tip.. in Windows, open CALC (calculator). Click View, and set it to Scientific mode. Select Hex, and enter your number (e.g., 1B5), then click Dec. It will convert it to a number for you.

Originally posted by JimSD
So, when you see the CHK displayed you're not in service mode yet? You have to press POWER on the remote? If so, and you only want to check the hours and not go into service mode, do you then just press POWER on the TV?

Sorry, yes technically your in the "Service Mode". But you are not on a screen that you could toast things from. Pressing "Power" on your remote once "CHK...." is displayed with take you to the "Service Menu".

Regardless if you just look at the "CHK" screen, or go into the Service Menu, to get out, you need to press Power on the TV

Jason, thanks!!!

I should have known that heh :)

Thanks for the info on how to check the hours of use. I had 0x132 which is 306 hours. About 50% more than I would have guessed. Until Stitchman came along with the problem developing at 1000 hours, I would have felt more confident that the problem wouldn't show up. I wonder what the next set of 8 digits are after the use hours? Mine were all 0 so I'm thinking it could be some sort of error code - zeros being no errors since Amirs had a much different value.

Originally posted by JimSD
Thanks for the info on how to check the hours of use. I had 0x132 which is 306 hours. About 50% more than I would have guessed. Until Stitchman came along with the problem developing at 1000 hours, I would have felt more confident that the problem wouldn't show up. I wonder what the next set of 8 digits are after the use hours? Mine were all 0 so I'm thinking it could be some sort of error code - zeros being no errors since Amirs had a much different value.

Not sure about the extra digits.. mine were 48444844, and then reset after I left the Service Mode.

So, what are we to do now? Should we petition Panasonic for repair (in lieu of a recall) for all sets from a specific date? Or at least a written guarantee that if this issue EVER occurs, even out of warranty, it will be covered?

Sounds like an idea.. anyone here "know someone" at Panasonic?

Here's a question.. I have the understanding of what the problem is, but is it somewhat related to the actual voltage that is supplying the set? I mean, my voltage throughout the house is 120 +/- 1 at all times. Would I be likely to see this problem at all?

Or is this irrelivant of actual voltage, this is a component incorrectly sensing the incoming voltage?

BTW, I think it would be good for anyone here who has had their set replaced, please post WHO repaired it and their CONTACT INFO. We should be able to, if needed, reference certified Panasonic repair techs who KNOW about the problem.

Originally posted by JimSD
Thanks for the info on how to check the hours of use. I had 0x132 which is 306 hours. About 50% more than I would have guessed. Until Stitchman came along with the problem developing at 1000 hours, I would have felt more confident that the problem wouldn't show up. I wonder what the next set of 8 digits are after the use hours? Mine were all 0 so I'm thinking it could be some sort of error code - zeros being no errors since Amirs had a much different value.

Jim, I'll try to check mine tonight to get the actual hours. I am only guessing at the 1000 hrs based on the fact that my daughters family moved in with us just after we got the PDP. She only works one day a week and watches the set all day. Boy, now I'm really curious how close I was...:confused:

Originally posted by jasonbanks
BTW, I think it would be good for anyone here who has had their set replaced, please post WHO repaired it and their CONTACT INFO. We should be able to, if needed, reference certified Panasonic repair techs who KNOW about the problem.
I've thought that too. What would be great would be for some party that people feel comfortable giving their contact info to to compile a list of the owners that have had the set serviced for this problem. Then if Panasonic continues to tell us that there is no problem we could provide them a list of 17 people that have had their set serviced for the shutdown problem.

By the way, I did send out a letter to Panasonic Consumer Affairs earlier this week requesting a warranty extension that covers the specific board or power supply that is causing the shutdown problem. Frankly, I don't expect anything to come of it. The best hope would be to get a reply so that we have someone's name to start sending more specific inquiries to.

Originally posted by jasonbanks
BTW, I think it would be good for anyone here who has had their set replaced, please post WHO repaired it and their CONTACT INFO. We should be able to, if needed, reference certified Panasonic repair techs who KNOW about the problem.

That's a great call.

I love my set and the only real worry I have is that when/if the shutdown problem occurs, whether servicers will know the right way to fix it. To me, that "right way" would be them ordering the part and switching it out in home. That way the problem would be the inconvenience of having to unplug the set every so often, rather than having it sent out to some shop for weeks. It's not too much to ask of the repair people and would be much easier if there were experienced servicers who could describe the problem for you.

I completely agree. In home service should be exactly that... in HOME service. That is why I've decided to return my unit to the seller (Sears) in exchange for a new one. To their credit they agreed to exchange for a new one. Let them fight it out with Panasonic.

Mark

Has this problem happened with the TH-42PWD6UY?

OK, I know you are all curious about the "actual" hours on my set since I said it was about 1000 hours before failure occurred.

Well you won't get it yet because I can't get into service mode!!! My PDP is disconnected from my satellite because the shutdown is now occurring every 2-5 minutes (we are watching a 27" tube...gag).

So how can I get to service mode? Do I need to reconnect to the "dish"? Where do I find "cable mode" when I use a satellite? Sorry for sounding confused, but I am. Spending too much time in the woods lately...

Stitch

Stitchman,

Go to the Set Up menu. Then go to the Other Adjustments screen from that menu. Mode is the first item on the Other Adj menu. Set Mode to be Cable. See pages 26-28 in the Operating Instructions manual if you need more help.

Originally posted by Maurice2
Has this problem happened with the TH-42PWD6UY?

This post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=3024913#post3024913) just showed up today that seems to be the first reported incident. A little troubling for the hundreds of us now taking delivery on our 42PWD6UYs

Someone has now reported this problem with the 37" model on the Panasonic website. The post is kind of buried in a TH-42PA20 thread in the HDTV forum of the Club Panasonic section.

This isn't good news for those of you who haven't experienced the "shut-down" bug yet. I finally got into the service mode and retrieved the magic number of hours before I got hit...~1300hrs! I currently have 1435 on the PDP but the bug hit me about 1-1/2 weeks ago so I approximated what the hours were at the time of the first hit.

I'm now curious if the "shut-down" has something to do with the number of times the PDP is turned on and off and not the necessarily the hours of operation. In my case, the PDP is turned on in the morning and pretty much ran until bedtime thereby giving me more hours whereas others with less hours probably ran their PDP from the time they got home from work until bedtime. Just a thought.

I also thought there was somewhere in the depths of the menu that we could retrieve the on/off count. Any ideas?

Stitchman, I urge you to write a letter to Panasonic about the problem and the number of hours of use before it occurred. You may be one of the lucky ones having the problem occur while it's still under warranty. I imagine you'll be fine after the fix. Below is an address to write to:

Panasonic Consumer Affairs
Panazip 2F-3
One Panasonic Way
Secaucus, NJ 07094

These are great sets otherwise; let's hope Panasonic does the right thing by us all and provide us assurance that we'll be taken care of down the line if/when the failure occurs.

Jim, thats a good idea and I plan on doing just that. But Iwant to wait until the repair is completed so I can include some of the info I might get out of it. I also plan on asking for a retroactive 1yr warranty...but won't hold my breath. I did purchase the 4 year extended warranty which takes effect at the end of the manufacturers warranty. That makes me feel a whole lot better knowing I am covered 100% for the next 4yrs 8mos.

I'm going to wait a little while to see if Panasonic responds to my request for a warranty extension before I get the extended warranty. Like you, I'm not holding my breath though.

Folks,

There is a hotline for the BROADCAST Plasmas (and all Broadcast products in fact) 800-524-1448 option #2 is for Plasma.

Consumer units need to go to 800-211-PANA (7262)

FYI - The "shutdown" issue affected only a percentage of standard def units of both the 37" and 42" models. These use the same power supply. The 42" and 50" HD models are not affected as they use a different PS.

ONLY June July and August production units may have this problem. Sept production already has the "fix" from the factory.

If you have a Sept productin unit or later, you will not have this problem.
As these units have been on backorder since introduction (and many thanks to you all for making that so) your chances of getting an early production unit through legit channels are quite remote.

T. Wiz

P.S. Please don't bombard with PMs about theory questions or other trivialities. The above tech support #s are for that purpose.

Thanks for the numbers T. Wiz ... I'm hoping I won't actually need to use them for my TH37PA20U (July production date).

- Charlie

Please re-read my former post. It IS only 3 mos. and not all units are affected. The factory lines after Sept 1 were only using the higher rated part. Ballpark numbers on the industrial side are less than 25 units per each of 5 regions. Factor in a small amount of field repairs and the total numbers are really less than 150 units out of many thousands.

It is NOT an epidemic of thousands. I can't comment on the consumer numbers but their proportions and time table should be similar.

Outlong,

You are of course free to disagree.

FYI, I am the Senior Engineer in the NE Region for PBTSC and one of our QC responsibilities are the Plasma series. I receive and review all initial failure complaints and have been tracking this issue nationwide.

The 150 number is accurate for Broadcast. As stated previously, the consumer data may be different as that is handled by a different group. The units however are fabricated at the same factory with a similar design for the standard def units. As such, their defect ratio should be equivalent.

That a poll amongst the distinguished members here might be skewed toward a higher percentage, in reality it is not so.

Outlong, Techniwizard has been tracking this problem nationwide; he says it is part of his job. Why are you doubting what he says? Why are you so argumentative?

By Broadcast I am pretty sure that he means the Commercial/Industrial units (as oppsed to the Consumer models). But as he says, the failure rate is approximately the same. This means only a small percentage of the Plasma TVs overall had the problem. However the sets made during those 3 months had a higher percentage of failures. (Techniwizard agreed with that).

Outlong, you have been saying a lot of things without any basis in fact (other than it is your opinion). You have no data that can show a 30% or even a 10% failure rate. Where are you getting your facts from? I hope that it is not from the poll in this forum! That poll, while interesting, is statistically meaningless.

T Wiz. thanks for the insite here...

No further explanation is warranted.

thread reopened

if your post is not ON POINT for this issue, please do not post, and please do not respond to any inflammatory posts

many posts have been removed from this thread based on several reports/complaints we have received: they have been referred to Alan Gouger

very disappointed we have to take this action based on one members disregard of the Forum rules

THANK YOU!:)

There was a thread started today by Lateboy in which he reports that his commercial 42ED Panasonic manufactured in November, 2003 has developed the "shutdown' problem. He had been under the impression that the problem only effected the consumer model. I gather from Techniwizard (see above) that it has effected both the commercial and the consumer 37 and 42 inch EDs. But Techniwizard asserted that it only effected such models produced prior to September. It now seems as if that may not be accurate. I wonder if perhaps Panasonic has not fully diagnosed the primary cause of the "shutdown" problem? The faulty diode may not be the root cause.

Techniwizard- Forgive me if you've already mentioned it, but could you name or describe the part(s) that would need to be replaced on a display should the problem occur. I ask because it would seem that telling a tech "here's what I need, please order them and then come out in-home to fix it" would be much less of an inconvenience than having to have it shipped out. Thanks.

Hi All,

Thanks Mark and Bruce for the (undeserved I might add) high praise.
Hey, we take on all comers. You can lead a horse to water....

The November failure may be isolated, and probably another component and some unfortunate bad luck.

Nick,
The blood and guts technical info concerns an IC on the power supply PCB.
The part has been changed to one of the same type with a tighter spec. kind of like premium versus regular gas. Why wasn't premium used at first ?

Like most semiconductors, the specs fall into a bell curve during their production, some a little higher, some a little lower. Seems that some of the lower units were on the hairy edge leading to the shutdown thing.

Raising the bar clears the problem at the cost of a few Yen. Sometimes this happens when the beancounters outnumber the engineers.

The actual circuit involved is a protection loop voltage watchdog that is too sensitive and may shutdown when there really is no problem. The change of IC (replacing the original from the bottom of the bell curve) restores proper operation.

I'm not going to list part numbers because there has been "panic" buying of both the IC and the PCB snarling the parts channel. There have been orders for dozens of units by some servicers drying up the supply for the dealer who really may need only one or two. There has since been some kind of "rationing" put into place and the replacements are readily available.

If the servicer/dealer needs more specific information they may call the numbers posted earlier inthe thread.

Grrrrr.... I got a call last night from the service center...they just ordered the part because it took the "company" that long to respong to them. ??

So it looks like another week watching the 27" tube!!!

thanks Techni.

Techniwizard, thank you for your input. The numbers you gave out yesterday for the number of 6UY panels with the problem seems to be consistent with the infrequent mention of the shutdown problem here among 6UY owners. For whatever reason though, the shutdown problem seems to be mentioned much more at this forum among the PA20 owners.

Do you have a counterpart at Panasonic in the consumer division that could verify that the number of problems in the consumer model (PA20) is similar to what you've seen in the 6UY?

I realize the problem part is supposed to be the same between the 6UY and the PA20, but there are other differences between the 2 models (e.g., speakers) and possibly some interaction with those parts that are different is causing additional failures in the PA20?

Do you suspect the frequency of shutdown mentions in this forum is either due to a freak statistical cluster or possibly some tainted voting?

Finally, what is the usual policy when a production line change is made as in this case? Does the company just wait do something only when there is a failure or will there be some sort of service bulletin that will provide for repairs of this issue outside the warranty period?

Again, thank you for your input. It's comforting to have someone from Panasonic providing us with some info. You seem to be our only source of inside info. As you might have read, some of us have called about the issue only to be told it's the first time they've ever heard about it. That may be why it seems we're pestering you for information - we're not getting the straight scoop anywhere else.

I walked into a nearby CC here in LA where I had been keeping an eye on a June TH42PA20, and sure enough is was the only plasma not working. I was told by a sales person that "they were having trouble getting a signal on it." Uh huh. When I asked him if to turn it on, he said they had just tried a couple minutes ago and "nothing."

The unit must've shut down within the last week, because it was functioning when I was there a week ago. It's been on display in the store close to three months.

I have a June model, and I wouldn't be surprised if my display shuts down even though I have a little over 1000 hours on it. I'm sure the CC unit had over 1000 hours on it also, as well as an above poster whose unit shut down with about 1300 hours on it.

Jim SD.

Techniwizard, thank you for your input. The numbers you gave out yesterday for the number of 6UY panels with the problem seems to be consistent with the infrequent mention of the shutdown problem here among 6UY owners. For whatever reason though, the shutdown problem seems to be mentioned much more at this forum among the PA20 owners.

Do you have a counterpart at Panasonic in the consumer division that could verify that the number of problems in the consumer model (PA20) is similar to what you've seen in the 6UY?

>> They are under the same constraints as the rest of us not to release information. By the same token, I am here only as an individual without any official basis. I just get my wrist slapped more.

I realize the problem part is supposed to be the same between the 6UY and the PA20, but there are other differences between the 2 models (e.g., speakers) and possibly some interaction with those parts that are different is causing additional failures in the PA20?

>> This should not be the case but I do not know for sure

Do you suspect the frequency of shutdown mentions in this forum is either due to a freak statistical cluster or possibly some tainted voting?

>> I think it is the frustration of having spent big $$$ on a unit and then to have a failure so sudden. For the married folks, there is also that added stress of the WAF and having to explain away the failure. When all is well, there is not as much reason to post.

Finally, what is the usual policy when a production line change is made as in this case? Does the company just wait do something only when there is a failure or will there be some sort of service bulletin that will provide for repairs of this issue outside the warranty period?

>> In this case because all units are not affected, we wait for the failure and repair under warranty. I believe this problem would manifest well before the warranty expires. In the unlikely event it occurs later, we'll deal with each unit on a case by case basis. Our region is fairly liberal dealing with known problems post warranty. I cannot answer for others.

Again, thank you for your input. It's comforting to have someone from Panasonic providing us with some info. You seem to be our only source of inside info. As you might have read, some of us have called about the issue only to be told it's the first time they've ever heard about it. That may be why it seems we're pestering you for information - we're not getting the straight scoop anywhere else.


>> If you use the ###s posted earlier, you should get the right info.

T.Wiz

This number, 800-524-1448, posted above for commercial/broadcast plasmas seems to be disconnected. Is there a different number?

John

Thank you for your reply Techniwizard. The shutdown issue aside, Panasonic has provided an incredible set with the 42PA20 and the best bang for the buck available.

JShulte

Nope, 800-524-1448 is THE number. Nominally 9-5 M-F EST

Broadcast only.

Shutdown problem on a 6UY:
Mfg date: Jul 2003
Delivered Sept 4.
Problem occurs ~ Dec 7
Audible whine - shuts off repeatedly - 6 red blinks:mad:

Took it to the shop Dec 10

-Michael

i have a panasonic th42pa20. it was produced in July, 2003. It has approximately 500 hours of burn time on it. On Sunday, I had my first shut down problem after the tv was on for about seven hours. After the shut down, the power light would blink 5 times, then go steady, then repeat. I experienced the problem twice tonight. Once after the tv was on for 90 minutes and once after about 45 minutes of use. I called Panasonic and they told me to call one of the service shops. The rep on the phone did admit he has gotten other calls about this. I am very concerned since this was a large investment although the posts from techniwizard suggest the problem is easily remedied. However, I was wondering if anyone had the repair done and then had the problem again?

thanks.

Originally posted by Techniwizard
Please re-read my former post. It IS only 3 mos. and not all units are affected. The factory lines after Sept 1 were only using the higher rated part. Ballpark numbers on the industrial side are less than 25 units per each of 5 regions. Factor in a small amount of field repairs and the total numbers are really less than 150 units out of many thousands.

It is NOT an epidemic of thousands. I can't comment on the consumer numbers but their proportions and time table should be similar.

You are the man we wanted to hear from! I am really glad to hear from someone in the middle.

Quesiton for you though. My set is located in the basement with my pool table. That being the case, it does not get used much. I ony have about 80 hours on it, and I got it at the begining of July. So, my concern is that the problem, if it does occur, may not show up until after the warranty expires.

What is your feeling on Panasonic's support the this? Knowing that there was a minor issue that is somewhat dependant on the service usage of the set, do you believe Panasonic will correct the issue if it occurs after the 1 year mark? Even if your answer is "unofficial", you can speak better then anyone around here..

I love the set, it's just a mental wall.. I'm not rich, and want to make sure that $4k investment is safe..

Thanks much!

Jason,

You are in NJ and close enough to bring it in for service. As the NE is my region, you're in good shape unless I get struck by lightning. I cannot speak for the other regions, but I believe that there will be some unofficial leeway if the unit fails from this issue.

For those of you interested on how repairs due to the shut-down issue are going, I have some good news concerning my own unit. I have the 42Pa20 which was produced in July. I first had the shut-down issue last Sunday and then twice on Monday. I called Panasonic on Tuesday and they offered to have the repair man come to my home on Wednesday. However, I wasn't around until today. The repair man showed up at my house (on time i might add), quickly took the unit apart, and replaced the parts. He knew about the issue before coming to my home, asked me about the cycle of blinks on the power display, and said the ic has been a problem on these televisions. In total, it took thirty minutes from start to finish. The service was fantastic. The reapir-shop was called Electro-Craft in Brooklyn, New York. Thier number is 718-259-2578. So if you are in NY and have this problem, I highly suggest using this service center. All they wanted was a copy of my receipt for the television.

Happy Holidays,

Tom

Tom, you are fortunate. When I called for "in-home service" they sent a guy in a truck who had me help him carry the set to his truck. That was almost 3 weeks ago. On thursday, they said they finally had a chance to look at my set and discoved the problem (what a surprise, given how well known this issue). Now I am waiting for the part ot be sent to them and put into my TV. My experience is nothing like yours.
Bob

Yes, you are very fortunate. I notified the repair shop over two weeks ago. It took them a week just to get the info to order the part(s) and its now another week has past and no word. I'll be calling them today.

Based on what I was reading prior to get the repairs done, I was worried I would be without the set for a long time. (I'm starting a nice vacation in time for the college bowl season and nfl playoffs so I'm pretty happy they fixed the set so quickly). It's been three days now and I have had no more shutdowns. Hopefully, the problem has been resolved for good. I posted the number of the repair shop in case anybody is in the area or within a reasonable drive.They really seemed to have a handle on the plasmas. It seems like there is going to be a learning curve with the repair shops and the new technology. I hope you guys get your sets back real soon.

Good Luck,

Tom

I have the 6UY with a July manufacture date. I bought the 6UY in early September and had no shut down problems until December. I noticed the shut down problem for the first time on 11th. I confirmed I had the problem over the weekend of the 13th to 14th

With some initial assistance from techwizard, I had an excellent repair experience.

On the 15th I e-mailed Panasonic and mentioned that there was a Panasonic authorized servicer, (though not specifically for plasma) in Manchester, NH--only 14 miles away from where I live. I received a response promptly from Panasonic the same day and they had already contacted the servicer (Demers TV in Manchester, NH) I suggested and authorized them to make the repair. I was impressed that they had done this even before responding to me. I had to fax them my invoice and e-mail them with the serial number and manufacture date. I did this by Tuesday night. Panasonic sent the part by second day air on Wednesday and it arrived Saturday. I boxed up the plasma (original box and packing which I'm glad I kept) and took it in first thing Monday. By 2PM it was repaired and I picked it up the same day. It's worked fine since then--it might even look better.

Great job Panasonic!

John

Nice to hear a success story once in a while!

I have to apologize for my late response...I've been on vacation remodeling my daughters house....

My last response was on 12/22, well just that afternoon the repair guy showed up and fixed my unit! Unfortunately, I was not able to be there when he made the repairs. I did however talk to him and he said that Panasonic says it is a regulator IC (integrated chip) on the power supply board that is the problem. Panasonic also requested that he just change the regulator instead of replacing the card so they could verify it is in fact the IC. I guess it would be cheaper to replace a chip vs. the card. He told me he would replace the card just the same. He did, and so far so good. My wife said he was there for all of an hour.

I'm not sure why some of you guys have to take the unit to the service shop. I was told "in-house" repair or they will come and get it if they feel they can't fix it at the home. This was right out of Panasonics mouth.

It's great to have my display back in action!!!

I had to take mine to a shop because it is the 6UY not PA20. I just posted here because the problem is the same and there is a lot more information here than in a shorter thread specifically about the 6UY.

I knew what I was getting into regarding the lack of an in-home warranty when I bought mine. Actually, when I bought mine I wasn't sure that anyone other than Panasonic factory service centers could do repair work (there are only 3 across the country). I am very pleased that independent service centers have been authorized to do the reapair. Of course, in home is still he best.

John

JSchulte,

Can you please post the info on that Repair Center so I can update the FAQ. :)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=342696

it's nice to see everyone is starting to get their displays back in time for the new year.

I'm a long time lurker, first time poster. I must first say this forum has been extremely helpful thanks to all the wonderful people here. I personally want to say Thank You for all the informative posts and knowledgeable people in this online community.

I've been reading about this shut-down problem for some time now. I must admit, I am slightly worried this problem will affect me. I have a Panny TH-42PWD6UY with a July build date. Techniwizard, can you please explain why the IC diode problem won't affect all ED units manufactured pre September? If I remember correctly, you mentioned roughly 150 units (broadcast) out of thousands may have this problem. It's unclear to me as to why the thousands of units won't suffer this problem. Please put my mind at ease because this is something I constantly worry about. I apologize if this question has been addressed already. Thank You.

Kevin

Well, Tom, at least some members are getting their TV's back in time. Mine was carted away by Four Star Repair (Kenilworth, NJ) on Dec 3. They have been unresponsive to my request for a fix date. When I called last Friday, they told me they had good news: they got the part. I said the good news will be when they return my set. Of course, they couldn't tell me when it would be ready...but they are working on it. (this is the 20pau shut down issue).
Bob

I have now joined the shut-down club, received 42pa20 July 11. It has been helpful and comforting to read your posts. With the info that you guys have provided, I'll be able to check with the repair guys and make sure that they come prepared. My set is wall mounted so I don't want to be taking it down until all the parts are in place.

PlasmaGamer

The particular IC in question has only shown to be out of spec for a small percentage of the first couple months production. It will usually surface within the first couple hundred hours of use. It is not a component that will "fail" or wear out after more time. If this failure develops within the first year, it will be repaired under warranty. It is doubtful that this type of failure will occur after more than one year of use, but we are generally flexible with known issues and warranty status.

Originally posted by Techniwizard
PlasmaGamer

The particular IC in question has only shown to be out of spec for a small percentage of the first couple months production. It will usually surface within the first couple hundred hours of use. It is not a component that will "fail" or wear out after more time. If this failure develops within the first year, it will be repaired under warranty. It is doubtful that this type of failure will occur after more than one year of use, but we are generally flexible with known issues and warranty status.
Techniwizard, thank you for replying. You have been extremely helpful and now I can stop worrying so much and enjoy my Plasma!

bdav,

i can't believe they have had your display for a month. that is simply unacceptable particularly when they now have the part. i hope you get it back soon.

tom.

I am sad to report that I have also joined the "shut-down" club, adding my 42PA20U with June 2003 built date to the "small percentage" of failed units. I have enjoyed watching 1,705 trouble-free hours (according to the service menu) before my set turned off with the blinking power light. I called Panasonic and the customer rep who of course was unaware of any "shut down" issues gave me the information to contact my local service center. Service center dispatcher said they will come out sometimes after the new year holiday to check my unit.

FYI -- Just airing my frustration. I have/had the shutdown problem with the PA2OU. Four Star TV took 4 weeks to repair. Delivered it to me this am -- with a cracked display -- the delivery guys tried to tell me it was condensation at first, but then admitted that is was cracked in several places. Now it is back to the shop for "investigation." I have no idea what is next, but I believe that a new unit is certainly an appropriate solution.

By the way, the Panasonic tech support guy told me the average time for repair is now 4-6 weeks. And be warned, "in-home" repair usually means they come into your home to take the display away.

And to think that my previous TV (a Sony XBR) lasted for 18 years without a problem...

stef1...congrats....you now hold the record for most running hours before shutdown. I went ~1300 before mine quit. It still stinks though. I also can't believe that the customer reps STILL deny knowing about any problems.

bdav...sorry to hear about your display. That was one of my concerns when the repair shop said they might take my unit back to the shop to repair it. What I don't understand is why they need the whole display? The defective part is component on the power supply circuit board which they can take out at the home and fix at the shop. Or as in my case, just swap out the power supply circuit board! If I were the repair shop I would definitely take the faulty board vs. the huge, fragile display. Those of you who still need the fix might want to remind them of bdav's venture and insist on just taking the faulty board.

Bdav – sorry to hear about your plasma and the terrible repair experience. No one should ever have to go thru this, especially after spending so much money on your plasma. I do fear the same problems on getting my 42PA20 repaired. I was told by my service provider that they will need to take my plasma to the shop because they need "controlled environment" to diagnose and troubleshoot the problem. This is the only authorized service center in my town. My next closest Panasonic service is 120 miles away.
Why do we have to go thru this ordeal when all is needed is a simple communication from Panasonic via service bulletin acknowledging the shut-down problem with the pre September sets? This way the service techs, consumers and even the Panasonic customer support is informed of the part replacement. Instead of me having to wait for the arrival of TV "pick-up" crew to haul the TV to the service center, they, based on the official Panasonic service information could be ordering the power supply board and making simple on site replacement. As it appears now our "in-home" warranty guarantees that our TV is picked up for the troubleshooting and left in the shop for several weeks to diagnose the known issue before the part is replaced and TV is returned. There is always an option of taking and picking up your TV yourself, which after reading bdav's post on the cracked panel I am seriously considering. I am also glad that my unit failed while still in the warranty period. I just can't imagine the added hassle of having to go thru this after the warranty expires. Considering that mine has failed after 1,705 hours it is very likely that some may experience shut-down failure after their warranty has expired. I have seen previous post where someone was requesting warranty extension covering this problem. Has anyone had any success to get any commitment from Panasonic to extend the warranty?

Originally posted by Techniwizard
PlasmaGamer

It will usually surface within the first couple hundred hours of use. It is not a component that will "fail" or wear out after more time.

I own a Panasonic 42PA20u which has a July build date. I bought the set in August. I run the TV maybe 10 hours a week so I'm troubled when I start reading these posts from Panasonic owners who are developing the problem after a "long" period of usage. (And the major hassle that some owners are going through to fix what appears to be a simple solution.)

Techniwizard (or anyone else):

Despite everything that has been posted it just seems that the odds are increasing that a lot more of these pre-September 42PA20u Panasonic plasmas are developing this shut-down problem than was anticipated. I know this forum is just a random sampling of the number of units that are out in the public, but when I look at the poll which was keeping track of the owners who experienced the shut-down problem...well, as time goes on the number of units that are shutting down IS increasing.

I guess I'm having a problem understanding this quote or yours. It seems like the component IS failing as more time goes on. Any reason to think that you may have originally misdiagnosed the problem and that it is, in fact, more widespread?

Is there any way that once we experience this problem that we can let Panasonic know that we are aware of what the solution is and that the solution should be done in-home in a relatively quick amount of time? Is there any way that we could request a specific part/repair order number when we call into Panasonic so that they can begin dealing with this problem in an expedient manner (and less-costly than removing the set from people's homes)?

Thanks for any information that you can share on this matter.

Franchot, I am starting to feel the same way.. I have one of the first sets off the line, and only have 84 hours on it. It is a secondary screen, so it does not get constant use.

If it were true that the set would fail after the first couple hundred hours, I could live with that, but now seeing reports of a failure with over 1000 hours, I am really troubled.

We (20U owners) invested a LOT of money on these sets, and I for one would like to see Panasonic 1) STEP UP AND ACKNOWLEDGE THE ISSUE, and 2) bite the bullet and issue a replacement program for the part.

We need to get a list together of everyone who has had this problem, and get it to someone up the ranks. Stop talking to "customer service".

If, at a MINIMUM, Panasonic would officially state that if this particular problem ever occurs during the life of the set (since it is a KNOWN defect), that it will be repaired, no questions asked, then I think we all would rest a little better.. but not knowing that 6 months (or even more for that matter) after my warranty goes... kinda why I think we need to organize something to protect ourselves... there is power in numbers..

bdav, wow they had it 4 weeks and broke it in the process? Sounds like my carry in warranty worked better. I took mine to the shop in the morning and had it back in the same afternoon.

John

To my fellow "shut down" victims, thanks for the sympathy (empathy). I'll let you know what happens next. I agree that this known problem should have been proactively managed. That, combined with poor service from the "authorized" repair shop(s), can cause tremendous damage to a great brand's image and sales. Looks as though I'll be watching the New Year's games on a 20 year old 21 incher...(I gave the Sony away).

Also, I guess we have learned the new definition of "in home" warranty service...

Bob

Originally posted by bdav
To my fellow "shut down" victims, thanks for the sympathy (empathy). I'll let you know what happens next. I agree that this known problem should have been proactively managed. That, combined with poor service from the "authorized" repair shop(s), can cause tremendous damage to a great brand's image and sales..


You are absolutely right about that. I've got a TH37PA20U (July build date) which supposedly has the same power supply as the 42. The unit is in a bedroom and doesn't get all that much use (maybe 200 hours or so by now) and I haven't been bothered by the shutdown issue as yet. I'm now in the process of remodeling my den and I've got a 50" plasma planned for that room but given all of the "bad press" this issue has received here, I doubt very much that my next plasma will be a Panasonic (and yes, I do know that the 50" Panny doesn't appear to have any of these issues).

Originally posted by Techniwizard
PlasmaGamer

The particular IC in question has only shown to be out of spec for a small percentage of the first couple months production.
Techniwizard - I do appreciate all the feedback and contribution that you provided to this forum re: shut-down issue but I would like some clarification on the above statement. I am just trying to understand how it was determined that only a certain small percentage of IC components in pre September units were out of specifications. When on the production assembly line aren't the same batch of components (IC's) used and assembled in each set? Logically, if the electronic component is out of spec, won't it be out of spec in all the sets that now contain it regardless if they exhibit the "shut down" issue or not? With this said how can one feel knowing that their $$$$ plasma may contain "out of spec" component and Panasonic is not doing anything about it!

Originally posted by jasonbanks

Stop talking to "customer service".
jasonbanks - I agree. It was a waste of time. All they did is give me the nearest service center that you can find thru their website. Their support staff kept denying any knowledge of "shut-down" issue. They wanted to know were did I hear of this “shut-down” issue, asking me if I got this from online. They suggested that when I talk to my service center that I tell them to contact Panasonic regional service tech, but indicated not to mention anything about the "diode" problem as it may unnecessarily confuse them.

Originally posted by Franchot

I know this forum is just a random sampling of the number of units...
I have also seen number of posts in Panasonic's HDTV forum with the same "shut-down" issue. With each post of the failure it is starting to look more and more like a widespread problem. How widespread? IMO - June 2003 to August 2003 built units.

I'd like to share a story with you all....

I just came back from my local sears...and what do you know?...the only plasma not turned on is a Panny PA2OU! Surprise surprise. So...i ask the CS guy there if it turns on...and he says "no..it's broken, there was a power surge and now no power will go to it." hmmm...i notice the blinking light when i push on and off the power and ask if it's actually the "shut down issue." Suddenly he snaps back.."no, it WAS a power surge and we just need to get a circuit changed that burnt out" Then after I sit there playing with all the buttons...suddenly he tells me he can "unplug it and it'll work for a few minutes...then the TV will realize that there is no power and turn off." I ask you...What the hell kinda explanation is that?? He does so..it works...I smile at him and turn around...and walk away. I simply could not bare to argue with this man. What a freakin joke.

Panasonic needs to step up and address this issue. I'm sure this isn't the only store display with the problem...and it doesn't seem to be good business to be the only plasma in a store that "won't" turn on. Surely nobody will buy something they can not view. Good luck everyone...i'm still waiting for my 42WDUY and crossing my fingers.

OK, in determining how wide-spread this is, we are all overlooking the sets that are on display at the local Circuit City or Best Buy. EVERY set I have seen at these stores is OFF. I turned one on at the CC in Phillipsburg, and it lasted not even 3 minutes before it started blinking.

Seeing as EVERY floor model I have seen does not work, I am very, VERY worried now.

I think this problem is bigger then everyone thinks. If you include all the dead sets at the stores, that is a LOT of sets.

Here's a challenge for everyone.. when you go out shopping at your local electronics store, see if they have a PA20 on display. See if it's on.. if not, report it back here. Post the Store, City and your observations (only for non-functional sets).

For my contribution:

Circuit City - Phillipsburg (on floor now, personally saw last 3 minutes)
Best Buy - Allentown (a few months ago, removed the set, no longer on display)

For our protection, lets get the info together everyone.. even if you don't own this set, if you see a dead one in the stores, please post it here.

Sears - Ann Arbor, MI

CircuitCity - Phoenix, Camelback store
CircuitCity - Chandler

Guys,

You're really making yourselves crazy. Again, this was an issue with only 3 months of production, June, July, August.

Sept. production on were corrected at the factory. As these have been on perpetual back-order (thank you all for that) the chances of getting an early production unit through legit dealers now are nearly impossible.

Anyone contemplating purchases now can rest assured.

That the mass market B&Ms have DOA early models and are too lazy to get them fixed is not a fiendish plot by the manufacturer to "hide" anything.

This issue has been acknowleded throughout the dealer and support network. It is not a "diode" failure so don't expect an answer on that one.
"Shutdown" with an error LED code of 5 or 7 blinks (count the OFF times) IS the known issue. That some dealers and support folks don't read is again not any type of plot.

I would be more concerned not with how many, but if for whatever reason warranty repair was unsucessful or warranty coverage for this issue was refused. Any cases of that out there ?

If you call numbers other than those for Plasma, you may get incorrect info.
Search the back-threads for the proper contact info.

Techniwizard,

With all due respect (we certainly appreciate your input here), I think the ones asking how widespread the problem is are the owners of the June-August built sets. To us it is still an issue, not 'was an issue'.

Earlier you had said it would generally happen within the first few hundred hours, yet now we have had several reports with sets that have more than 1000 hours of use. So in some instances it does take a lot of time for this to develop - more than some of us will use the set during the warranty period. That is definitely a concern.

Also, how can we have confidence that it will get taken care of outside the warranty period when our inquiries to Panasonic result in being told that there is no problem?

All it would take from Panasonic is an acknowledgement to us that, yes, there has been an issue and you will be taken care of if that specific issue occurs within x years. Honda did this for transmissions on 2-3 years worth of Accords, Preludes, and Odysseys that had a higher than expected early failure rate. It made me think higher of them for being proactive. If Panasonic could do the same thing and put it in writing I would think most of us would be very satisfied and applaud Panasonic for stepping up to the plate.

Without jeopardizing your job, anything you could do to press the higher ups to do the right thing regarding this issue would surely be appreciated by many people.

Jim

Techniwizard,

Thanks once again for responding to this thread!

Please understand that we don't feel that there is a "fiendish plot" by Panasonic to cover something up. We owners of the plasmas which were produced during the months of June, July, and August are just trying to get a definite answer as to whether or not we will all eventually be hit by the "shut down" problem.

Originally, it was thought that a unit would fail early on within a few hundred hours of useage. As time has gone on, people who have gotten a thousand hours of useage from their sets are experiencing the shut-down problem.

The quote below mirrors my feelings about the issue:

Originally posted by stef1
I am just trying to understand how it was determined that only a certain small percentage of IC components in pre September units were out of specifications. When on the production assembly line aren't the same batch of components (IC's) used and assembled in each set? Logically, if the electronic component is out of spec, won't it be out of spec in all the sets that now contain it regardless if they exhibit the "shut down" issue or not?

Even your most recent post seems to indicate that the problem might exist in quite a few (if not all) units that were produced during June, July, and August.

Again, this was an issue with only 3 months of production, June, July, August.

Sept. production on were corrected at the factory.

We are trying to get a more definite answer because if we must go through this repair we would like it to go as smoothly and quickly as possible. Some owners have had the repair done in their home in a matter of minutes while others have had their sets taken to a repair shop for several weeks. (In at least one case more damage was done to the set during the repair at the shop.)

What it boils down to is that if we know as much information about causes and remedies of this shut-down problem as possible (and in cases where Panasonic can not get this information to repair shops and dealers who don't read service bulletins), we can hopefully "educate" our repair centers so that they can successfully do the repair "in-home."

So I guess the question still remains (at least for me), will all plasmas produced during the June, July, and August production cycle eventually experience the shut-down problem?

Again, thank you once again for posting here and any answers that you give are always appreciated.

(Whoops. I was writing my response while Jim SD was posting his...I agree with Jim and the excellent points that he made in his post.)

Originally posted by Techniwizard
Guys,

You're really making yourselves crazy. Again, this was an issue with only 3 months of production, June, July, August.

Sept. production on were corrected at the factory. As these have been on perpetual back-order (thank you all for that) the chances of getting an early production unit through legit dealers now are nearly impossible.


Techwizard, I do not question you at all that NEW sets off the line do not have this problem. Everyone here is referring to sets purchased during that initial time, not future purchases

If it were true that failure would occur at < 300 hours, we could all rest easy once we pass that point. But, what is being shown, is that the set can fail at any point as indicated by failures > 1000 hours. That to me says that at some point, any of the sets can fail, your mileage may vary.

As stated before, in my boat, I will probably have < 200 hours when my warranty expires. The fact that SO MANY sets are sitting on showroom floors with this problem (having run through usage much quicker then any consumer), says there is a fairly big problem with the initial run off the line.

The fact that the B&M stores are too lazy to get them fixed has nothing to do with the fact that the set has failed. Without those sets included in the failure statistics (because they can't be bothered to fix them) inhibits the ability to measure the true failure rate.

In my opinion, based on what I am reading, and seeing for myself in the stores, these sets had (past tense) a problem. Those of us who have a set should be taken care of, and not wait for the problem to surface.

The Best Buy in Bellevue, WA appears to have a failed TH-42PA20U as well. I visited the store approximately 2 weeks ago and it was the only plasma set not working on their showroom floor. The set had been working as recently as a month ago.

To All,

A just arrived home from BestBuy, CompUSA, and Circuit City and have story to tell. A friend of mine and myself went out to demo the TH-42PA20 at one of the above mentioned stores. At BestBuy, the Panny was the only plasma not "on", so I asked the salesman if I could get a demo of this set. He told me that over the last 3 days they set up 2 units and were unable to find a unit that functions for more that 2 hours. Both units started shutting down fairly quickly (with the same symptoms described on this board).

So, we journeyed over to CompUSA to get a demo, and guess what?, their unit fails (shuts down) also!. The problem started shortly after it was set and they have yet to determine the nature of the problem. (I played dumb)I suggested that he unplug the unit for a short time, and then try it again.
He did this and the unit powered up long enough for me to demo it with a few DVD's. Very Impressive ... After 1/2hr the unit shut down with red LED flashing.

We decided to go to circuit city to see if they had a unit on display.
They did, but it wasn't turned on!
I found a salesman and asked him for a demo of this model, and he told me that the unit was experiencing problems and they are going to replace it on Friday. I asked him what the problem was and he told me that the unit worked for a couple of days, then started shutting down. Now the unit won't power up and the red LED flashes on the front panel.

I was unable to find out the date of manufacture for any of these units, so
I know that I am posting nothing new here, but I was surprised at how wide spread this problem is. And how the decision to ship products to customers and repair later could really come back and bite Panasonic in the XXX.

Originally posted by Francesco1
To All,

A just arrived home from BestBuy, CompUSA, and Circuit City ...

Francesco1, could you please post the City/State for these stores?

As I mentioned in an earlier post, I have the commercial ED model. This shutdown issue seems to be more common with the consumer ED model and I'm curious as to why that is? Am I wrong to assume that the same power supplies and other essential components are used in both models? For peace of mind, I just purchased a WARRANTECH 4 year extended warranty, which has helped alleviate some of my concerns.

Smart move Plasma Gamer, I have a 3 year in home warranty.

JasonBanks,

The City/State that relates to my prior post is Norwalk/Milford, Connecticut.

I am visiting more stores in this area on Friday and will post another update soon.

Looks like that this "shut-down" issue also effected units that were sold in Europe. Here is the interesting link to European AV forum thread that mirrors the issues and concerns of this thread...

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=105132

Originally posted by PlasmaGamer
This shutdown issue seems to be more common with the consumer ED model and I'm curious as to why that is?
PlasmaGamer - I too have been wondering about the same and came up with the following explanation...

Please note that I am not an electronic engineer and my explanation is nothing more then my own theory based on the known specifications and a few known facts. It covers only the units manufactured between June and August 03.

I compared power consumption specifications for both commercial and consumer units.

TH-42PWD6 - 395 Watts max
TH-42PA20U - 425 Watts max

Higher power consumption of 42PA20U is due to the added tuner, speakers and several built in A/V inputs. We know from previous posts that "some" units may contain "out of spec" IC component on the power supply board. We also know that the same power supply is being used in both models. Obviously, there has to be a higher stress/load demand on the power supply in 42PA20U. Logically, with this added stress/demand on the power supply the "out of spec" IC would fail much quicker in PA20U then it would in PWD6 unit. We would also see a very few, if any reports of failed 37PA20 or 37PWD6 having lower power consumption load of 355 and 325 Watts respectively. This may be difficult to track considering the small ratio of existing pre Sept 37" vs. 42" models and the possibility of out of spec IC failing over the time.

Originally posted by Stitchman
Panasonic says it is a regulator IC (integrated chip) on the power supply board that is the problem
If out of spec component is indeed the (voltage?) regulator IC, then I would not be surprised to see this IC failing 'over the time' due to the thermal stress (overheating). Most common type of failure in these type of electronic components and the reason why heat sinks are commonly used to help dissipate the heat. Of course, in a case of out-of-spec component the heat sink will do little to prevent it from failing. It is just a matter of time...

The higher power consumption is due to the thicker shielding for FCC consumer regulations.

Now I am certainly not looking for an argument, but with all due respect I also went to check the set out at (PC Richard, CompUSA, and Circuit City) this week because I was thinking of purchasing it (I have a thread posted in this forum).

I must say that I was very disappointed because at CompUSA, the sales person told me the only way he could get the set to come on (it was sitting with the flashing power light) was to unplug and replug it, he did and it came on.

At Circuit City, the set was in the same condition (it was sitting with the flashing power light), the lady there didn’t bother to do anything, she told me the inputs were not connected and that is why it wouldn’t come on (I course, that was a bunch of horse ____)

PC Richard was the only place where the TV was working, and I must say the picture was great.

This makes me a little hesitant to buy this set, the last thing I need is a high tech TV that won’t even turn on.

These stores are all in the Long Island, NY area.

Just an FYi.

In one of the circuit city's in Milwaukee, WI the 42PA20U is the only plasma that does not work. I saw it on one time and every other time I go there I try turning the power on and get the blinking led. It's sad because it is the first widescreen set seen right as you walk in the front door. This has been like this since mid November.

There are no 42PA20U's in the Best buy across the street. Not sure if this is intentional or not.

Originally posted by crucial
There are no 42PA20U's in the Best buy across the street. Not sure if this is intentional or not.
I believe there was a 42PA2OU at BestBuy in Manhattan until recently, but it has now been removed.

OK, add Circuit City in Allentown, PA too.

I am now passed the point of worried, I'm pissed. I am seeing a 100% failure rate at B&M stores. Not 5%, not 10, 100%. Those sets that DO work, I would bet are recent productions.

At this point, I would bet that ALL July-August sets will eventually fail.

I am done waiting around.. I want this dealt with..

Originally posted by jasonbanks
I am now passed the point of worried, I'm pissed. I am seeing a 100% failure rate at B&M stores. Not 5%, not 10, 100%. Those sets that DO work, I would bet are recent productions.

At this point, I would bet that ALL July-August sets will eventually fail.

I am done waiting around.. I want this dealt with..

Agreed.

Maybe a first step might be sending this tread to the higher-ups at Panasonic and seeing if we can get any kind of response from them? Anybody out there have an e-mail address of who we should be getting in touch with?

TIA

Originally posted by jasonbanks
OK, add Circuit City in Allentown, PA too.

I am now passed the point of worried, I'm pissed. I am seeing a 100% failure rate at B&M stores. Not 5%, not 10, 100%. Those sets that DO work, I would bet are recent productions.

At this point, I would bet that ALL July-August sets will eventually fail.

I am done waiting around.. I want this dealt with..

My stores Panny 42PA20 was also out...for a MONTH. And of course they didn't even know what the probelm was....I guess Panasonic in their infinite store/customer relations wisdom didn't tell anyone. They just let the customers deal with the headache and find out on their own.

Yes I believe all those pre-September units with the faulty diode will eventually go out. This is due to an underpowerage that eventually happens to most if not all households at some point (because power fluxuates) which trigger the Panny to fail. When the Panny gets fed somewhere under 115 volts the oversensitive diode will make it shut down....and keep shutting down. Thats why people are having shutdowns at different time levels of usage.

How Panasonic failed to catch this widespread problem so late in the game is really unbelievable. Then compounding the problem is how they handled it...they didnt even notify their own stores because if they did then the NUMEROUS stores involved would have their units up and running instead of being out for weeks and weeks. Even this thread's Panny employee "Techniwizard" seems in the dark...giving misinformation about time parameters of shutdowns and false assurances over reliability. He seems to have gotten his information more from other avs board members than getting it straight from Panasonic. This is no time for a company spin guy to put a nice face on this....and guessing at that.

It sickens me that people have a large amount of money and emotional commitment involved in thier Panasonic plasmas only to be left fending for themselves trying to get answers off an internet board instead off from them directly. Panasonic needs to come out publicly and address ALL customers and stores questions on all aspects of this disaster. People shouldnt have to use their extended warantees now or years in the future over this. Panasonic needs to fix EVERY pre-September plasma regardless if it's shutdown or not. WHY ARE THEY WAITING FOR THEM TO FAIL? Because chances are they all will fail from this problem at some point. Customers shouldnt have to worry about this and have it on their minds. They spent good money on new plasmas so lets get with it Panasonic!

Originally posted by Becker
Even this thread's Panny employee "Techniwizard" seems in the dark...giving misinformation about time parameters of shutdowns and false assurances over reliability. He seems to have gotten his information more from other avs board members than getting it straight from Panasonic. This is no time for a company spin guy to put a nice face on this....and guessing at that.


Hey Becker,
I see you have a whopping 2 posts and you already crossed the line. Fortunately for us we haven't been treated to more....your last one is a great example of paranoia, innuendo, and personal attack... Techniwizard is highly regarded around here and didn't even have to give you the time of day but went out of his way to try to explain this little problem... and yes, no matter what you may work yourself up into believing, it is a small problem, effecting a relatively small percentage of the thousands of pre-Sept build PA2OU's. And it does appear that Panasonic has stepped up to the plate and fixed it for all involved, have read of no denials of service whatsoever, have you?

Your attack on Techniwizard was ill-advised and not justified and I, for one, appreciate the valuable input he gives here much more than the 2 whining posts you have served up so far....howzabout you try to stick to the facts instead of slamming members that actually contribute to this forum.

elvis

Originally posted by PlasmaGamer
For peace of mind, I just purchased a WARRANTECH 4 year extended warranty, which has helped alleviate some of my concerns.

If a person were worried about this shutdown issue after 1 year (and I am at least slightly worried, though I haven't yet decided quite how worried to be), where would one look for information about purchasing an extended warranty?

I looked at the WARRANTECH web site, and it seems focussed on signing up delivery channels, I couldn't find anything there for the consumer.

I too watn to point out that techwizard was very helpful in assisting me in getting my TH-42PWD6uy fixed promptly. At least in my case Panasonic stepped up to the plate.

John

Wow, go away for a dew days and all h*** breaks loose!

Seriously, I cannot answer why it seems that all the B&Ms have DOA units.
Again, not a cop out but consumer is handled by a different organization than the Broadcast/Industrial group so I cannot comment on their inner workings.

I do know that they are concerned diligent engineering folks trying as hard as they can to get everyone's unit modified ASAP.

This is the consumer contact #. Follow the prompts for Plasma support.

TV
800-211-PANA (7262)

Additionally, on the Panasonic website (www.Panasonic.com) may be found links to local servicers searchable by model and location.

ElvisDoc you are correct in quantities, a couple hundred failures out of thousands seems to be accurate. Of these hundreds, most have failed within the first 2-300 hrs. Several have had as much as 1100 hrs. which seems in line with some of the reports here.

Actually, it is not a true component "failure" as the particular regulator IC is part of a shutdown protection circuit and causes shutdown when in fact no adverse condition needing protection has occurred. Changing this part to one a little less sensitive stops the problem. Only a small portion of the original parts run have shown this low sensitivity resulting in the same proportion of failures.

Reality check is that I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for ALL ICs to be changed when only this small percentage shows a problem. Unlike the automotive anology, there is no life threatening brake part that may go bad so each case will be dealt with as it occurs. Again, this is just an unofficial observance and not company dictated so please don't quote as a manufacturers' statement.

JasonBanks bear in mind that we can only implement policy, it is generally made from across the Pacific and is about as easy to change as moving an iceberg with a broomstick. If in the extreme rare case that your unit fails after warranty for this issue and you cannot get it repaired easily, let me know and I can try to intervene on your behalf. Because you are within my region, it may be a little easier. Of course try the regular service channels first as you all should.

Again, I cannot speak officially for the consumer group but past practices have been quite forgiving if a known issue occurs on a low-hour unit within a reasonable time after the initial warranty has expired.

I just wanted to say that I had the shut-down issue on my 42pa20 and had it fixed with no problem. After I first had the issue, I came here and read this thread which ultimately gave me some peace of mind. I called the number listed by TechniWizard and the panasonic representative was quite helpful and acknowledged he had some other calls about this. The service center repaired my unit in my house in about 30 minutes. So I am Happy with the service I received from Panasonic and the information I got on this forum. Even from the posts on this forum, it does not seem like Panasonic is denying service to anyone.

Also, in my opinion, it makes sense that the B & M stores have units with the shut-down problem because they likely received these units when they were released (early production models.) It also makes sense that many people posting here have the shut-down prolem because, like myself, they came to this forum looking for answers on how to deal with it happened to them. Therefore, when you look at this thread alone, it seems like a high percentage of panny users have this problem but when you consider the total number of units sold, it's impossible for the actual percentage of units affected to come anywhere near the percentage of people that are affected AND posting on this forum.

I joined the shutdown club today :(
I purchased my TH-37pw5uz 2 weeks ago and it shut down today and so far it won't come back on. The red light blinks twice then stops and repeats. It's a July '03 build.
AHHHHH!!!! Right in the middle of the Titans/Ravens game!


I'll let everyone know how I make out.

Two blinks sounds like another problem.

Originally posted by shadowspawn
If a person were worried about this shutdown issue after 1 year (and I am at least slightly worried, though I haven't yet decided quite how worried to be), where would one look for information about purchasing an extended warranty?

I looked at the WARRANTECH web site, and it seems focussed on signing up delivery channels, I couldn't find anything there for the consumer.
There were a few posts about the WARRANTECH extended warranty not too long ago, you should be able to find it by running a search. Check out these sites: procura.com or efunctional.com (I can't post URL's because I don't have 5 posts yet, sorry). I purchased the "RMT45000 In-Home 4 Year Warranty Extension for Televisions Under $5,000" and I paid ~ $216 including shipping.

Originally posted by Techniwizard

JasonBanks bear in mind that we can only implement policy, it is generally made from across the Pacific and is about as easy to change as moving an iceberg with a broomstick. If in the extreme rare case that your unit fails after warranty for this issue and you cannot get it repaired easily, let me know and I can try to intervene on your behalf. Because you are within my region, it may be a little easier. Of course try the regular service channels first as you all should.

Again, I cannot speak officially for the consumer group but past practices have been quite forgiving if a known issue occurs on a low-hour unit within a reasonable time after the initial warranty has expired.

See what happens when you go away!

I think you fully understand my concerns.. when I walk in to every store in my area that has that set on display, and they are ALL dead, that is the only logical conclusion I can come to since they are 1) the same unit and 2) from the same production date range.

And I do know and understand that you guys can only do what your instructed to (joys of corporations). I also want to give Panasonic the benefit of the doubt in this case. Since the B&Ms are NOT reporting the failure of the sets, Panasonic does not know how widespread the problem is.

So, based on that, I will be calling that number and explaining the information that I have. I will do my best to inform them, and hope that they investigate this further.

It is simply my goal at this point to make sure, in any capacity that I have, that this problem is dealt with in a proper manner.

If "thousands" = 2000, then "a couple hundred" = failure rate of ~10%. If most of the sets ended up on showroom floors, and they have not reported the problem, that many hundreds more. That's is a shameful failure rate for what is referred to as one of the best plasmas.. imagine the consumer backlash if this was a Marantz!

Originally posted by PlasmaGamer
There were a few posts about the WARRANTECH extended warranty not too long ago, you should be able to find it by running a search. Check out these sites: procura.com or efunctional.com (I can't post URL's because I don't have 5 posts yet, sorry). I purchased the "RMT45000 In-Home 4 Year Warranty Extension for Televisions Under $5,000" and I paid ~ $216 including shipping.

For those getting a Warrantech plan online, make sure you pay attention to shipping costs when price shopping. Efunctional ended up adding like $25 to my order for shipping, and I didn't pay attention at the time of order. What makes it just plain silly, is that they are only shipping a single piece of paper and could just as easily have put it in a simple envelope.:mad:

FWIW "thousands" = tens of thousands. The calculated defect ratio at this point (which includes all failures, not just shutdown) is around 1% on the Broadcast side.

The "broadcast" plasma must not be the 42PA20 unit because no way does it have a 1% failure rate....I'd be more likely to believe the reverse of it having a 1% success rate at this point. When peoples own plasmas and their stores plasmas are failing what else are we to believe?

Really what specific model does broadcast cover and how does it relate to this 42PA20 thread? Do you know the failure rate of the 42PA20 and how many of those units were produced?

This whole thing is really distrubing because I was considering this plasma (and a couple others) for purchase but I dont think I'd go anywhere near it. I dont want to go through any hassles whether its covered by warantees or not.

Originally posted by Frisco30
The "broadcast" plasma must not be the 42PA20 unit because no way does it have a 1% failure rate....I'd be more likely to believe the reverse of it having a 1% success rate at this point. When peoples own plasmas and their stores plasmas are failing what else are we to believe?

Really what specific model does broadcast cover and how does it relate to this 42PA20 thread? Do you know the failure rate of the 42PA20 and how many of those units were produced?

This whole thing is really distrubing because I was considering this plasma (and a couple others) for purchase but I dont think I'd go anywhere near it. I dont want to go through any hassles whether its covered by warantees or not.


Frisco30
You gotta get those reading comprehension skills up a little, bud. OK, listen very carefully. Say it phonetically if it will help.

The shut-down issue affected a very limited number of PRE-SEPTEMBER PA2OU's.

This means that the PA2OU's built in September and later DO NOT have this issue or any others that anyone is aware of. Please read the above again a few times until you understand it. :rolleyes:


elvis

Originally posted by elvisdoc
Frisco30
You gotta get those reading comprehension skills up a little, bud. OK, listen very carefully. Say it phonetically if it will help.

The shut-down issue affected a very limited number of PRE-SEPTEMBER PA2OU's.

This means that the PA2OU's built in September and later DO NOT have this issue or any others that anyone is aware of. Please read the above again a few times until you understand it. :rolleyes:


elvis

With all due respect to Techniwizard, his numbers reflect the Commercial model defect rate, not the consumer PA20. His input on the resolution of the situation is very helpful to potential buyers (new ones are fine), however, is in opposition to what is being witnessed on the consumer side (e.g., 100% failure rate of showroom demo units).

Which technically similar, there are differences. Power Consumption being one of them, which is a possibility on why the set fails more on the Consumer model even though the sets use the same internal components.

So, while I would LOVE to believe that the Consumer and Commercial sets have the same defect rate (believe me, I really would), I absolutely cannot accept a 1% rate of failure simply based on the FACT that every display model at every store has the shutdown problem. EVERY set. I'm sorry, but there is no arguing with that.

Well, good news...I can report that I did see a working model of the 42PA20 at The Great Indoors store in Columbus, OH. PQ looks amazing for an ED set. I did not get to ask about any power loss issues since my kids were getting antsy to leave. I know this doesn't help with the failure survey, but I had add my input. This set is definitely on my plasma wish list.

Originally posted by elvisdoc
The shut-down issue affected a very limited number of PRE-SEPTEMBER PA2OU's.

This means that the PA2OU's built in September and later DO NOT have this issue or any others that anyone is aware of. Please read the above again a few times until you understand it. :rolleyes:


elvis

Exactly.

I don't quite understand why this hard for some people to grasp. If someone is looking at the PA20U, do not let this be a deciding factor in the slightest.

Leave the panicking and "what ifs" to us folks who have these units with a pre-Sept build and are hoping to avoid the problem.

The question to ask at any store that has a working model is: when was it built? And then report back here.

Originally posted by Maurice2
The question to ask at any store that has a working model is: when was it built? And then report back here.
Actually if it's working and is a June-August built set, then you'd want to ask if it has needed to be fixed. I've seen sets with a June manufacturing date both working and out of commission at various stores in San Diego. Just yesterday I saw a 42PA20 at the Sears in the UTC mall with the red light blinking 5 times. It was a June build.

We've all seen how the video feed in stores can be horrible as it is split among many sets. I wonder if the power level in those stores is equally as bad and because of the extra sensitivity this set has that is why so many are out of commission in those stores?

Techniwizard - I wish we could have someone like you from a 'consumer group' to address our PA20U shut-down concerns. Commercial unit owners are very lucky to have someone like you participating "un-officially" in this forum.

I have to agree with jasonbanks and others that the situation on the consumer side is quite different. I am owner of June 03 PA20U and have been very happy with my set. It is our primary TV and I have had no problems until Dec 28th, 2003 when my set shut down with 7 blinking LED's. The only reason I knew what happened was that I frequently read this forum and have been reading this thread since the very beginning of the first reports on shut down problem. Your posts of low initial failures and the low possibility of shut down problem made it seem very reassuring to me that I would not have this problem, knowing that I had close if not more then 1,000 viewing hours. I had 1,705 hrs when my TV first shut down. Will my TV get repaired? Yes, I am quite sure that 'eventually' it will be fixed under warranty. I am sure that Panasonic will come thru on the repair, but...

there is no life threatening brake part that may go bad
I would not compare this issue to a failed brake that requires emergency recall. It compares more to a failed fuel pump that leaves you stranded in the middle of nowhere even though the manufacturer is aware of the problem.

past practices have been quite forgiving if a known issue occurs on a low-hour unit within a reasonable time after the initial warranty has expired
If a know issue occurs it should be dealt with regardless of low or high hours and regardless of warranty. What is a definition of "low-hour" unit or a definition of a "reasonable" time? This is exactly what I am trying to point out. It is not about panicking nor whining nor going crazy... It is about manufacturer coming forward and assisting us the consumers with little more then just a referral to the service center. I know Panasonic can not control my service tech nor can it force its dealers and support channels to read technical bulletins, but we as a consumers could be armed with 'official' information. Information that right now is left to the speculations and the mercy of those that will be repairing our units. Is that too much to ask for?

Even though I haven't experienced the shut-down problem, if I did, it wouldn't bother me all that much UNLESS I had to go through a big hassle getting the unit repaired. That's my main worry. When I read about people who have had their set in the shop for weeks on end while other people had the problem taken care of in a matter of minutes IN HOME, then I ask WHY the discrepancy?

I'm very much a pro-Panasonic consumer. I own numerous products of theirs which I am very satisfied with. Although I've never had to seek repair service for any of them, I feel confident that they will take care of this issue. My concern is: I have an IN HOME warranty which is meaningless if my plasma is taken to a shop when it could have been repaired quite easily at my house. (I understand that if there is a major malfunction of my set then they would have to take it to a shop, but in this instance this isn't the case.)

My concern is: I have an IN HOME warranty which is meaningless if my plasma is taken to a shop when it could have been repaired quite easily at my house. (I understand that if there is a major malfunction of my set then they would have to take it to a shop, but in this instance this isn't the case.)

I strongly agree! As I said in an earlier post, let the repair shop know that you know what the problem is and there is NO NEED for them to take it back to their shop to fix it.

My repair shop said they would probably have to come get it, but when the part came in they came to my house and replaced it. Now here is what I think might be happening...the repair tech told me that Panny wanted him to change out the IC only. This would require soldering and a customers kitchen table would not be the best place to do that. My guy said he was going to change the whole circuit card instead, hence plug-n-play "in home" and no mess. If this is the case, insists he just take the card and leave the set in you home.

I have been reading all the Threads in the last couple of days.I am brand new to this site..I purchased my Panasonic Model TH42-PAOU on October1,2003.On December 15th I had the famous POWER SHUTDOWN..I did what everyone else did to resolve this problem with no results...AS a last resort I went back to Sears with pages of what we all have been reading..Sears is replacing the set as of tomorrow 01/08/04.....YOU can be sure when the carton is opened I will be checking the Mfg date.. If it's not from Sept on the set goes back.....Sears has been very helpful.. Panasonic on the other hand is another sad story...What surprise's me is that most service centers on unaware of this problem ..They all want to remove the set and bring it to the SHOP....If Sears did not resolve this I was going to start a Class Action Suit. I have an attorney who will take this on.So if my new set starts blinking guess what folks....

Winman,

What "Panasonic" number did you call ?

800-211-PANA (7262) is THE number and follow the prompts for Plasma support.

Off the top of my head, one of the key NJ servicers is Videologic/Eastern Stereo. These folks have had factory training. Their contact info is available on our website.

There are many consumer service centers in the NJ area. I can assure you that at least 3 that are also authorized for Broadcast know of this issue.

At this stage of the game, it is absurd to be told it is an unknown issue. But you do need to contact the correct people.

T. Wiz

Originally posted by vinman
...What surprise's me is that most service centers on unaware of this problem ......

Not to overly favor Panasonic, but to be fair they can't force a service center to read service bulletins (that is if they did send one out.) I'd imagine that most service centers deal with hundreds of different products from many different manufacturers. Most service centers are just Video "Fix It" Shops that are dealing with everything from unjamming VCR tapes from a VCR to trying to fix a crack on a RPTV. With bulletins, junk mail, sales literature, etc. coming into the shop, a lot of stuff probably gets tossed in the trash without being opened. And with employees that are backed up with work they probably don't have time to read through all the literature that comes through the door.

I'm not making excuses for Panasonic--just trying to look at the issue from another perspective. (Maybe if Pansonic had made a nation-wide recall of the product when they discovered the problem? I've never heard of a major recall of electronic items so I doubt a lot of people would take heed. And how to get the information to the consumers? You see recalls for cars and children's toys on TV from time to time because that's a safety issue, but a recall for a defective TV wouldn't be broadcast on the news. Perhaps, Panasonic could have been more proactive and sent out recall notices to consumers who have bought the plasmas and arranged for shipping to a central service center to fix the problem? Well, that would have been too cost prohibitive. Not much profit that way and most businesses are not in the charity business.)

Anyway, I was in my local Best Buy in Lakewood, CA and the 42PA20u with an August build date was going strong and looking good. Don't know if it had the shut down problem and had been repaired or not, but maybe that's a positive sign for those of us with early production sets who haven't experienced the shut-down issue.

Good luck on your new set! (And your class action suit if it comes to that.) (And it looks like I may be giving Sears some of my future business.)

Just the quick update on my "in-home" warranty repair of 42PA20U that shut down on 12/28/03 with 1,705 hrs.

I received a call from the service center this morning. I was told that they have researched the problem thru Panasonic and are now ready to order the part but are only willing to order it if I agree to have my set removed from my home and brought into their shop. I tried to explain to them that the repair can be easily done at home, even referring to some of the few AVS members success stories. I also tried to convince them to at least consider taking out the power supply without removing the whole TV but my request were met with responses that if I don't like it I can call Panasonic or another service center. As this is the only authorized service center we have in town and the next nearest one being 120 miles away I had no other choice but to agree with their demand on removing the TV from my home. Good news is that they will take my TV to the shop when the part is in and I am hopping that it will be a same day turn-around. We'll see...

Anyone considering Panasonic consumer model just because of Panasonic "in-home" warranty may want to think about it again...It is not the Panasonic, but your luck with the service center that determines if you get in-home warranty repair.

More to come later.

Well you can add my name to list the list of dead units
my th-42pwd6uy went belly up this morning, has been working
fine since i got in oct 4,2003,then this morning got a high pitch winning
and then shut down, ouch, i called panasonic this morning and i am waiting for a call back, so i will wait and see what happens.

ditto526

Where are you located ?

Broadcast Tech Support # 800-524-1448, follow the prompts for Plasma support.

I've been watching this post for a while, since documenting the shut-down issues I had with my 42PA20 (June 2003 build). Although I've felt I didn't have much new to add, after seeing this problem persist--and so many others have a similar customer service experience as myself--I feel I have to jump back in. I loved the TV, but with all fairness to Panasonic the customer service was among the worst I've ever seen from any company, let alone one that I had given several thousand dollars of my hard-earned money to. I can say this unequivocally, and fairly, given that my specialty as a marketing consultant is to help companies provide a better customer experience--before, during and after-sale.

After enjoying the TV for the month of July, I spent three months of hell trying to get the issue resolved. It took almost two months to get the unit repaired properly, the authorized servicer missed numerous scheduled appointments and showed up late to every single appointment (the other service center in my area couldn't even schedule a diagnosis visit for 4 weeks), the first repair (replaced the whole board) didn't take as the TV promptly shut down again the following day, they sent the TV in to Panasonic after coming by 6 more times to figure out what to do, it came back to me a month later only to have the entire screen go red a few weeks after that. Even at that point, Panasonic flatly refused to provide me with a new TV or even extend my warranty. Every contact there continued to pass the responsibility on to someone else, yet would never let me speak to the person whom they claimed made the ultimate decisions on the matter. They also insisted on sending a tech to watch TV with me to make sure I wasn't lying about the screen going red, even though I sent them time-coded pictures of before and after. Thankfully, after telling them the story, the B&M store where I bought it agreed to exchange the unit, even though it was 4 months after I bought it. (Now that was good customer service.) I ended up getting the 42PX20 (Sept 2003 build) since it was readily available and--knock on wood--I've had no problems since I got it in November. Although the PQ on this Panny is great and I have no regrets about it, I must admit, though, that I ended up buying the store's extended warranty (which I never do) just so I'd never have to speak to anyone at Panasonic Customer Service ever again. And I can promise you that this entire ordeal is well-documented, and will be a case study in a future book about how not to manage the customer experience.

jba87

Techniwizard
sorry it took so long(do have to do some work)
i live in chicago, and that is the number i called and they are going to have
someone call me back and discuss my problem?

First thank you to all. I learned a lot from this forum.

I am also about to buy a 37 in. panny plasma.

Can you help me to answer these:
1- I can buy from bj's last years model, 37pd5uz manufactured in July. Worried about the shut down problem. What are the chances the unit I buy will fail?

2- I can buy 37pwd6 on the net. How can I guarantee this one was one manafuctured after Sep 03.

3- If it is manafactured after sep 03, can we be sure it would not have the shut down problem.

5- If I buy a 37pa20 from a local store, I read somewhere pa20's does not have 720p, so Xbox would not work (for my kids;-). Is this true?

thanks for all your help.

Techniwizard
Just for the record,I called the number you posted at least once a day every day for the last several weeks.I have case numbers,spoke to supervisors,have the names,times,and dates for everyone I spoke to at the customer care number you posted.......Including asking for the plasma help desk.......Their response was always the same " I can give you the name of your nearest service center " It's like reading from a script!!!!!!!

Originally posted by DavePana
1- I can buy from bj's last years model, 37pd5uz manufactured in July. Worried about the shut down problem. What are the chances the unit I buy will fail?

I just bought the same model from BJ's a few weeks ago with a July '03 manufacture date, and it just shutdown last weekend.
FYI, BJ's has a no return policy on the plasma.

OK, and when you called the service centers that the "Help Desk" gave you what happened ?

If you are of a mind to forward that contact info to me at:

BOETTGER@US.PANASONIC.COM

I will try and get that to someone on the consumer side. I can't guarantee anything but who knows. Hopefully Sears will come through in this case. I can't imagine any more pre-Sept. stock being available so let's hope all goes well.

Please use the above e-mail for service problems only as I rarely check PMs.
Bear in mind I have little or no pull with other divisions and not too much within my own for that matter <GGG>

T. Wiz

Originally posted by DavePana
1- I can buy from bj's last years model, 37pd5uz manufactured in July. Worried about the shut down problem. What are the chances the unit I buy will fail?
PWD5 models do not have this shut down issue. Only PA20 and PWD6 models built between June and August 03 may exhibit shuts down with the power LED flashing 5 or 7 times.

HTnB - If I recall your plasma shut down with power LED blinking twice. This is not related to the shut down problem. I'm not sure in PW5 but on PW4 model LED flashing twice (count OFF cycles) indicates driver LSI (in SS, SC, C board) has trouble.

2- I can buy 37pwd6 on the net. How can I guarantee this one was one manafuctured after Sep 03.
Only way to guarantee is taking it out of the box and looking at the built date on the back of the plasma. Outside of the box does not provide information on when the plasma was built.
5- If I buy a 37pa20 from a local store, I read somewhere pa20's does not have 720p, so Xbox would not work (for my kids;-). Is this true?
No 720p support on PA20. You can still connect your XBox, but playing 720p games at 720p resolution will not be supported. This should not be a problem as those games will also play at 480p which is PA20 native resolution.

Stef: very good information. One follow-up -- When you say that 720p is not supported, what does that mean? Will the screen be blank? Or will it simply show in some other resolution. What would the lack of 720p support mean for watching ESPN HD, or other 720p material?

Originally posted by MiamiSteve
Stef: very good information. One follow-up -- When you say that 720p is not supported, what does that mean? Will the screen be blank? Or will it simply show in some other resolution. What would the lack of 720p support mean for watching ESPN HD, or other 720p material?
Screen goes blank on 720p signal. This has not been a problem with my 42PA20. I just set my D* satellite STB to output 1080i and it will upconvert 720p to 1080i.

I can second that lack of 720p has not been an issue for me. 720p HD material looked great on my 42PA20 and currently on my 42PX20 upconverted through the box to 1080i. And, for that matter, HD XBox games look amazing at either 1080i or 480p. Even non-HD games look great.

Thanks HTnb.

Stef - Thanks for answering my questions.
HTnb says bought the 37pd5 and it had the problem. Are we sure that these last years models do not have this problem?

I kind of remember another post in some from about a 37pd5 having this problem.

Does anyone know other cases?

thanks again.

DavePana,

No, the 37 never had a "shutdown problem" and the one in question is a "2 blinker" meaning trouble in the drive circuitry.

Most common suspect is called the SU PCB pn# TNPA2626.

A lot of folks mount this guy in entertainment center type enclosed areas. As this unit has no fans, it MUST have adequate air flow or this PCB (in the upper left corner as viewed from the rear) will overheat, fail, and cause a 2 blink shutdown.

After the repair, try to mount some type of fan to aid exhaust from the rear upper left vent area. Even with the recommended 3 inch spacing around the perimeter, if air flow is non-existant it is prone to failure.

T. Wiz

Techniwizard


Thanks for response to my post... When I contacted the first one out of South Plainfield NJ they told me it would take a week to get to me. The second from Kenilworth NJ said they would be out in a couple on days.. On the phone when I told (lets call him Jim) what was happening he said I know what the problem is we can repair in 20 to 30 minutes. When the repair guy showed at my home First words out of his mouth was "I have to take the set in" Did not even turn on the set. Plus said would take at least 10 days for the repair.....I showed him the Door.....That same night I was reading the threads and came across a guy from Milburn NJ who used the guy from Kenilworth.....If you get a chance read it.. Its a horror story...So I am writing you and waiting for Sears to show up any minute...Will keep you posted... Again thank you.......Vinman

Originally posted by Techniwizard

A lot of folks mount this guy in entertainment center type enclosed areas.
T. Wiz

Your right, that's exactly where I had it and it failed after just 2 weeks.
There's alot of open space in the back (18") top (8") sides (2"). It's also pushed out all the way to the front of the unit. I'm suprised that the're prone to fail like this.
It sounds like this could be an ongoing problem for me.

I had the service man from midwest audio come today to repair my th-42pwd6uy for the shut down problem, he saw that the red light was flashing 7 times and he knew what to do. it took all of 1 hr to do the repair and we are back in business, this was after panasonic refered me to midwest audio in chicago for the repair, so my problem was not as much a problem as some have had, as i was only down for 2 days, p and l was under warranty i just had to pay for the service call, because i did not want to haul it over to service center.

Techniwizard

Sears delivered the new set at noon yesterday,its up and working...Just Fine! Mfg date is December 2003.....I was at sears yesterday on another matter and I always walk thru the TV dept... Guess what set was not working The TH42PA20 Mfg date June 2003...Also last night at 5:30PM got a call from a panasonic supervisor....First time they have called me since this all started.....Told him everything that was going on including Sears stepping up to the plate.".He was happy that Sears resolved the issue"

Vin and Ditto,

Glad to hear of the good outcomes for you both. Let's hope everyone else gets resolved as well.

T

Originally posted by vinman
Techniwizard

Sears delivered the new set at noon yesterday,its up and working...Just Fine! Mfg date is December 2003.....I was at sears yesterday on another matter and I always walk thru the TV dept... Guess what set was not working The TH42PA20 Mfg date June 2003...Also last night at 5:30PM got a call from a panasonic supervisor....First time they have called me since this all started.....Told him everything that was going on including Sears stepping up to the plate.".He was happy that Sears resolved the issue"

Vinman, when you say "supervisor", was he in the consumer repairs division? Or in customer service?

Techniwizard, Stef,

thanks again for your answers. it was very helpful.

Now w/this new panny announcement, I feel like I need to do more homework;-)

I benefited a lot from this forum. Thank you to all.

I may be back sooner then I think!

ditto526 - Congrats on getting your plasma repaired. Do you know exactly what service man did? Did he just replace the power supply board? Looks like he came to your home prepared with the necessary part(s) to fix it.

vinman - Glad to see Sears coming thru and getting you the replacement. It's great you avoided more hassle and I doubt that the supervisor was going to be any help... most likely just referring you to another service center.

stef1- no he did not replace the board, he replaced two chips on the board
has now been working for a couple of hours and no problems

If they have it narrowed down to 2 chips, it sounds like it has gotten a lot less expensive to have repaired for someone that is out of warranty. Not that anybody is yet, but if it happens down the road.

Originally posted by ditto526
no he did not replace the board, he replaced two chips on the board
has now been working for a couple of hours and no problems
Thank you for the info.

It just confirms that the repairs can easily be done at the customer's home even if it requires soldering.

I would not be surprised if Panasonic was 'pushing' for component replacement when servicers are inquiring on the shut-down problem/repair covered under the warranty. It costs them lot less to replace individual components then the entire circuit board.

Originally posted by JimSD
sounds like it has gotten a lot less expensive to have repaired for someone that is out of warranty
Will the same apply when the warranty expires? I hope so... but it all depends on the service center. They could replace a $2 part and tell you that they had to replace the entire power supply. How are you going to dispute when they try to charge you hundreds more? Tell them that you know about this shut down issue and that it is easily fixable by replacing inexpensive component?...

What shut down problem? ...we know of no such issue with Panasonic plasma!:confused:

Well my August 2003 build TH-37PA20 just experienced the 'shut-down' issue this p.m. for the first time.
Let's hope the local Panasonic tech. knows what to replace.
Does anyone have the specific part numbers that have to be replaced on the circuit board?
Thanks in advance.

I'm a PWD6UY owner newly in the shut down club on my Aug 2003 build date unit, received in late Sept. Will check hours/count blinks, then post here and start calling the broadcast number, thanks to T. Wiz!

My problem surfaced in a way different than reported (AFAIK): when switching between HD and SD cable channels, on occasion. Most frequent occurence was when using the cable guide to switch; less frequent when keying in the channel direct. Never occured on initial power-up.

I have never heard any electronic whines. Never had to unplug. Just power down at the panel and it powers back up right away.

Wish me luck...

Originally posted by thebishman
Well my August 2003 build TH-37PA20 just experienced the 'shut-down' issue this p.m. for the first time.


How many times is your standby light flashing? Can you turn it back on?

I've had the TH-42PA20 since mid-August, so mine must be a June or July build date. I got into the service menu tonite, and found that we've put 977 hours on it since I first fired it up.

No problems with shutdown yet. Knock on wood.....

What's feeding power to my TH-42PA20 is a Monster Power HTS 5000 Home Theater Power Center, which itself is plugged into (and buffered from the raw AC line by) a PS Audio Ultimate Outlet (high current version).

I wonder whether all the buffering that I have between the TH-42PA20 and the power company is helping? (FWIW, my TH-42PA20 is also extremely well ventilated).

Originally posted by shadowspawn
I've had the TH-42PA20 since mid-August, so mine must be a June or July build date. I got into the service menu tonite, and found that we've put 977 hours on it since I first fired it up.

No problems with shutdown yet. Knock on wood.....

What's feeding power to my TH-42PA20 is a Monster Power HTS 5000 Home Theater Power Center, which itself is plugged into (and buffered from the raw AC line by) a PS Audio Ultimate Outlet (high current version).

I wonder whether all the buffering that I have between the TH-42PA20 and the power company is helping? (FWIW, my TH-42PA20 is also extremely well ventilated).

I am not using anything on my Plasma setup (have the 3600 upstairs though). While I don't know if it's accurate, the 3600 has always (I mean always) been between 119 and 122. Never strayed at all. Plus, I have pretty much a dedicated circuit on the plasma TV (which includes DVD player). I have not yet read whether this problem will occur at any time, or just when power conditions are not optimal.


Techniwizard, do you know if indeed I am getting supplied ~120 constantly, should I be in good shape? Or can this problem occur even with optimal power supply conditions?

shadowspawn, jasonbanks - Using power conditioning will not eliminate or prevent shut down problem. Panel has good tolerance on handling power fluctuations...This was previously posted by techniwizard in another thread:
Originally posted by techniwizard
No, it is not fluctuation. The panel can handle that with ease. This is the protection area of the power supply and the voltage must dip a LOT before the protection comes into play.

What he said....

Some folks are just luckier than others

Originally posted by Techniwizard
What he said....

Some folks are just luckier than others

That should be in the service bulletin! :D

"How many times is your standby light flashing? Can you turn it back on?"

The number of 'blinks' is 7.

Yes, it will turn back on if I unplug the unit, however it is starting to turn off much more frequently now, (which is the norm I understand).

Techniwizard/6UY owners - is there a way to get to the panel hours of my PDP? I failed to note the instructions given were for a PA20.

I know this thread is for the consumer version, but is quite active with good advice. Thanks in advance!

Actually, do a search for Service Menu, I think Glauco was the last to post.

In the service menu, scroll to the SD field, there are two 2 character fields below the command box area.

As I recall WT (center) is the number of power cycles and PT (right) is the number of hours.

Although it is well documented here, I am reluctant to post the actual service menu entry instructions. We had a customer who asked, obtained and then got himself into trouble with the service menu. He then demanded and got a "warranty" repair from the higher ups. I had my hand slapped for that one so bear with me, nothing personal.

T. Wiz

OK, a little update.. I started with the only email I could find, that if Jim Reilly, who is on-site PR at the CES show. Forwarded my emails to Patricia Moore, Executive Representative at Panasonic.

After speaking with Patricia for a few minutes, she informed me that she forwarded my emails to the chief engineer, and will be in touch with me.

Again, I am only out to make sure that a great product, and it's owners, are protected. So, I have no other reason but to believe she is sincere.

Let's see what happens..

Jason,

Thanks for following up on this matter. Let me know if I can assistance you in any way.

I talked to someone from Panasonic today who called me based on a letter I sent last month requesting a warranty extension. He said they wouldn't be doing that, but would handle it on a case-by-case basis if the failure occurs after the warranty period expires.

He acknowledged the shutdown issue and said that it affected only a certain run of serial numbers from June-August. At least that is how I interpreted what he said. I asked if not all serial numbers from that time period were affected and he said 'yes'. He was unable to give me give the serial number range and was unable or unwilling to tell me if my serial number was in the affected range.

Techniwizard, have you heard anything about it being just a certain range of serial numbers from that time period, or did I misinterpret his comments when he was just trying to say that only serial numbers from that time period had the potential of the problem and that not all of them would develop it? The way I interpreted what he said was that there was another range of serial numbers from June-August that don't have the potential of the shutdown problem.

I wonder.. is it possible that the boards themselves were made at different times? Not the sets, but a bad run of the boards containing the IC?

Originally posted by JimSD
I talked to someone from Panasonic today who called me based on a letter I sent last month requesting a warranty extension. He said they wouldn't be doing that, but would handle it on a case-by-case basis if the failure occurs after the warranty period expires.

>>This is usually the case.

He acknowledged the shutdown issue and said that it affected only a certain run of serial numbers from June-August. At least that is how I interpreted what he said. I asked if not all serial numbers from that time period were affected and he said 'yes'. He was unable to give me give the serial number range and was unable or unwilling to tell me if my serial number was in the affected range.

>>If your unit is stamped June-August production, there is potential for a problem no matter what serial number, ie: any unit produced within this time frame could fail. All units will NOT fail.

Techniwizard, have you heard anything about it being just a certain range of serial numbers from that time period, or did I misinterpret his comments when he was just trying to say that only serial numbers from that time period had the potential of the problem and that not all of them would develop it? The way I interpreted what he said was that there was another range of serial numbers from June-August that don't have the potential of the shutdown problem.

>>See above. It's like a slot machine, all units June-August have the same potential to be bad or good for that matter.

It's not an end-all but it seems that the THxxPWD6 units with # after YB355xxxx are OK but if it has an August sticker, it could still be a problem.
With some certainty, I can say that units with a YDxxxxxxx serial # are in the clear.

FWIW, the newer PCB carry an AE suffix on the part # vs an AC suffix. All of the stock AC suffix boards have been modified already so anything a servicer gets through the parts channel will be OK.

To further muddy the matter, the original IC had a suffix B. The replacement IC has a suffix M. The AE PCB have ICs with a suffix B BUT with a small white dot in the upper left signifying (I believe) hand selection and testing of tolerance before being installed on the PCB.

Note that the above is made intentionally cryptic to the layman but will be understood (and should already be known) to the authorized servicers.

Don't mean to offend anyone but this stuff is really not for the masses.

TW

Thanks for the clarification T Wiz. I had a feeling I may have misinterpreted his comments, but it seemed a reasonable interpretation based on the particular conversation.

T. Wiz, thanks. FWIW, I get 7 pauses between flashes, and my serial number (Aug 2003 model) is in range - YB344xxxx. Guess I'm in for the full experience.

I realize my few posts work against me, and respect your caution. I don't need to enter the SM if no value is added to the troubleshooters here.

Originally posted by Techniwizard
[BIt's not an end-all but it seems that the THxxPWD6 units with # after YB355xxxx are OK but if it has an August sticker, it could still be a problem.
With some certainty, I can say that units with a YDxxxxxxx serial # are in the clear.
[/B]
Does your statement about units with a YDxxxxxxx serial # hold true for the consumer model (TH-42PA20) too? Even if they have a June manufacturing date? I realize this would conflict with your statement that all June-Aug sets have an equal chance of being good or bad, but I had to ask.

Thanks,

Jim

JimSD - Perhaps T Wiz can further clarify, but I don't think it applies to the consumer units. My 42PA20U June 03 built unit with shut down issue has S/N YD335XXXX.

Originally posted by stef1
JimSD - Perhaps T Wiz can further clarify, but I don't think it applies to the consumer units. My 42PA20U June 03 built unit with shut down issue has S/N YD335XXXX.
Well, I guess that answers my question. Thanks.

You aare correct. The consumer units differ in that their SN #s all seem to start with YD. But the 33xxxxxxx seems accurate.

Y = The TV factory

B or D = The particular assembly line, I believe

3 now 4 = Year of manufacture, 3= 2003, 4 = 2004

Now they get confusing...

The year is divided into 8 six week periods. The odd weeks are the Factory "Golden Weeks", quarterly mass vacation weeks, factory is closed.

The 2nd numeral is which 6 wk period and the 3rd numeral is the week, 1-6.

The remaining numbers are the actual serial #.

So YB334xxxx is 2003 production, 4th week of the 3rd 6 week period.

Get it ? Clear as mud I'm sure.

Originally posted by Techniwizard

No, the 37 never had a "shutdown problem" and the one in question is a "2 blinker" meaning trouble in the drive circuitry.

Most common suspect is called the SU PCB pn# TNPA2626.
T. Wiz

You are a genuis! The tech guy came out last week to service my plasma and was well aware of the shutdown problem. (I did tell them mine was only blinking twice). He even brought the "shutdown" replacement part. I showed him your post and after realizing it was not the usual shutdown issue he called Panasonic tech support and within a few minutes came to the conclusion that we needed to replace pn# TNPA2626!
He ordered the part before he left my house and came back today and installed it. Thanks GOD I have my plasma back! I forgot how good it looked....

FYI, the tech told me he's been out to many of the local dep't stores (Circuit City etc..) to fix the broken Panny 42's with the shutdown problem! When he left my house last week he was on his way to fix another customer's Panny in the next town over.

Also, I would highly recommend Columbia TV in North Attleboro MA if anyone needs service.

Somedays, we get it right !

Actually, you get a lot of things right. It's just a matter of getting the right information to the right people so that they can do the right thing. Am I right or am I right?

Thanks, Techniwizard, for providing your expertise to this forum.

Thanks to all who post to this thread...it really helped me navigate through the shutdown issue.

I've got a 42' 6uy (August '03 production date) that died last Sunday night (5 blinks). While simultaneously searching AVS Forum and fruitlessly attempting to explain to the wife that I had not flushed several thousand $$ down the drain, I found this thread. Monday AM, I called the Panny Broadcast # given above by TWiz, and they they gave me the number of the local (Houston) service center. When I contacted the service center and explained the problem, the technician had not heard of the issue. I called the Broadcast # again and asked if they could have someone call the technician and explain the problem so he could be prepared before I brought the 6UY in. By Monday noon, Panasonic had spoken to my local technician, and then I took the monitor in that afternoon. Although I was hoping he could order the part Monday afternoon, he did not get to it until Tuesday morning. I approved for overnight shipping of the part, and the 6UY was repaired by Wednesday at noon.

Without you guys, I would have still been lost and possibly divorced. The shutdown nightmare was really only a slightly unpleasant dream.

THANKS TO ALL

Originally posted by dondavidson
and then I took the monitor in that afternoon.
I'll soon be getting the 42" PWD6UY, and won't have room for keeping the wrapping. In anticipation of a *problem,* I plan on wrapping a blanket around the set, putting it on the back seat of my car (vertically, though at an angle), and driving to the Panasonic Service Center in New Jersey, about 15 miles away.


Will this be good enough? Any special precautions I should take?
Thank you.

Many folks from the city bring their PDPs over by car exactly the same way.
No problems, just go easy on the bumps.

My TH-42PWD6 has just started getting this shutdown problem. I thought I was in the clear since I logged 1320 hours without one shutdown. MFG date Jun 2003 SN YB335xxxx.

What is the part number for the problem PCB? I saw TNPA2626 referenced earlier but I am not sure if this is the part number in question?

Hiker,

Check with the LA based broadcast service group for a service center in the Sf area.

323-436-3500

Techniwizard,

Do you know the actual part number for the TH-42PWD6UY that needs to be replaced?

I have to go with an independent servicer in this area and will pay extra for the in-home repair. I want to make sure they bring the correct part so I'm not overcharged for the double travel.

Thanks

hiker
there's an independent panny service center in mtn view.

http://www.pasc.panasonic.com/WhereTo/FindServicer.asp?Pass=5

IC 551 on the Power Supply PCB

Have them look it up.

I am purposely NOT posting the actual part number to avoid a mad rush on the parts folks with "panic" buying. Trying to keep the parts stock there for those who really have a failure.

T Wiz

Just got my repair done in Houston on a carry-in basis. For the record, my PWD6UY had over 1600 hours on it when the shut downs began.

Thanks to all for your help - from diagnosis to resolution in about a week!

Just got the shut down issue on my TH42PA20. Called Panasonic right away and the operator was about as useful as a houseplant. She couldn't find the model number in her system. I gave her my zip, a NJ zip, and she proceeded to only give me NY service centers. I told her that none would come to NJ. She said those are the only numbers I have. So worthless. I went to Panny website and found some NJ service centers. Have an appointment for 1/28. Will let u guys know.

Boist

Boist:
What is the manufacture date of your PA2OU and approximately how many hours did you have on it?

Malachy,

Mine is July, 03. I bought it on 9/5 and i'd say it had about 500-700 hours on it. The repair place said they were aware of the issue with these plasmas and will be bringing equipment to fix it in house. I can't believe it would be this easy to get it fixed, so I'm crossing my fingers. I have a feeling it will take 2 visits. We shall see.

Boist

BAM!!!

I've been hit with bug after 1100 hrs of use. Does anyone have a service center on Long Island (NY) who's experience with this issue?

I will have the tech also look into the "shadow" line in the middle of my screen too.

It just so happens the Superbowl right around the corner....... :Sigh:

PS - I will never buy or recommend a Panasonic plasma. Its amazing how they will not own up to the problem. This is just horrible customer service imo.

Originally posted by MC®
BAM!!!

I've been hit with bug after 1100 hrs of use. Does anyone have a service center on Long Island (NY) who's experience with this issue?

I will have the tech also look into the "shadow" line in the middle of my screen too.

It just so happens the Superbowl right around the corner....... :Sigh

PS - I will never buy or recommend a Panasonic plasma. Its amazing how they will not own up to the problem. This is just horrible customer service imo.

Absolutely. Them and their thousands and thousands of failed Pannys all over the place...and not a word from Panasonic about any of it. Even their own stores that carry Panasonic plasmas act clueless. I would never trust Panasonic with my hard earned money...especially with the plasma big bucks they want for thier unreliable "Pannys".

One independent servicer in the S.F. bay area and they are not returning my calls after I leave voice messages. One servicer for a large area with almost 7 million people? Shipping this thing to L.A. is going to be my worst nightmare.

Panasonic should do a recall of the affected TH-42PWD6UY units. By a recall I mean do what is right and at least provide on-site repair. And notify owners that the warranties covering this problem are being extended.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not whining. I was fully aware of the carry-in warranty requirement before I bought my TH-42PWD6UY. I knew the nearest independent servicer was 56 miles (one-way) from my home. But the probability that a Panasonic PDP would fail was very low according to what I was told by the sales person and what I surmised from reading this forum. This is different. Eventually, this problem will plague every one of the TH-42PWD6UY's manufactured during a 3 month period. Mine worked fine until over 1300 hours of use.

And to add insult to injury, my neighbor is pissed at me for recommending a Panasonic PDP. They bought a TH-42PA20U which had the same problem. At least they were able to get in-home repair.

Shame on you, Panasonic. Never will I purchase or recommend your products again unless you do the right thing.

Originally posted by MC®
BAM!!!

I've been hit with bug after 1100 hrs of use. Does anyone have a service center on Long Island (NY) who's experience with this issue?

I will have the tech also look into the "shadow" line in the middle of my screen too.

It just so happens the Superbowl right around the corner....... :Sigh:

PS - I will never buy or recommend a Panasonic plasma. Its amazing how they will not own up to the problem. This is just horrible customer service imo.

Followup:

Talk about a quick fix. I found an authorized serv ctr in Massapequa (R-State of Arts Electronics 516-797-0454). Spoke with Melvin this morning and he came to my house and pulled out the IC board. He promised to have it fixed and re-installed by this evening.

When I asked him if it was safer to replace the board he replied: Only few techs can fix the board, because most techs don't understand the problem to begin with. Anyone can replace a board he says, a select few understand the cause and can fix it. Plus, the boards are on back-order from the manuf (2-4 weeks).

Same day service / in-home. Can't ask for more....

Quote of the day: "I fixed plenty of these dead pannies - there all the same problem."

Glad to here about your quick fix. What did the tech say about your vertical shadow/line problem??? Send me a PM if you think I'm off topic. Thanks!

I have a 42WD6UY with a build date of November 2003. My question is if units produced in Nov. and on are still prone to the shutdown problem?

Was there a specific production date when Panasonic upgraded the power supply PCB or have they not done any upgrades?

Thanks in advance for any information, Bill

I went back in this thread and saw that the production dates with the shutdown issues were June 2003 thru August 2003. Please disregard my previous post.

Thanks, Bill

Bill Mac,

You should be fine. All the information we've heard says that only sets with June-August build dates are possibly affected. Techniwizard posted some serial number ranges of 6UYs that are/aren't affected on p. 11 of this thread (about half way down). I don't think you have any reason to worry.

When the shutdown issue is fixed, does the hours of use get reported back to Panasonic? We're seeing more people experiencing this after 1000 hours of use. I got a call last week from someone at Panasonic regarding a letter I sent to them about the issue and he said I would have had the problem by now if it was going to occur. That leads me to think that he was either uninformed of the most recent information, was putting on a public face, or that they aren't aware of the amount of hours it can take to occur.

JimSd,

Thanks for the heads up on the serial numbers on page 11, I missed that. I hope all those effected have their issues resolved quickly.

I also think that Techniwizards input has been very helpful to so many people with issues with their Panasonics. His presence on this forum is extremely valuable.

Thanks again, Bill

JimSD,

I think the highest number of hours was 1600 as reported by PIFFLE previously in this thread. That's a lot of hours (almost 4.5 hours/day) and more than most people will log during the warranty period.

I'm probably going to get criticized for this but, unless you have an extended warranty, I would report the problem and get the part replaced, even if you're not yet affected. Since Panasonic isn't stepping up and taking care of consumers you should be proactive and protect your investment.

Originally posted by mimler
What did the tech say about your vertical shadow/line problem???

I'd like to know the answer to this as well.

Despite the shutdown problem, I'd buy or recommend this Panny again....and recommend the user to become a forum member. T.Wiz gave us the unvarnished truth - a problem caught early in the production run - with key diagnostic tips so we could educate the local service center. Who knew the number of blinks was significant?

The 800 # folks admit they are there to give out contact info so you can ship it or contact your local servicer. When asked how I could get someone to ship my local guy the right part, they immediately said they'd have someone call me. That person was knowledgeable and volunteered to get the T.Wiz-level boss in the Southeast region involved.

If PA20 owners never get in-house service - that's a problem for sure. But I'm betting Panny will honorably fix this problem well after the warranty period if it crops up "late".

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by mimler
What did the tech say about your vertical shadow/line problem???
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by NickChicago
I'd like to know the answer to this as well.

Since the problem is limited to the cable box/component output only. His feeling is the HD signal from the cable box is being "scaled" down for ED causing some slight signal degradation. The shadow line is normal but designed to be transparent during viewing (including the HD model) but the high contrast ratio and component feed is causing this faint shadow to be visable. He proved that the line was transparent while switching between DVI (via DVD), cable-analog and cable-S-Video.

As for the shut-down issue, it was fixed. There was a high pitch whine during start-up (more noticeable as the shut-down issue started) but it's now gone.

Originally posted by PIFFLE
Despite the shutdown problem, I'd buy or recommend this Panny again....and recommend the user to become a forum member. T.Wiz gave us the unvarnished truth - a problem caught early in the production run - with key diagnostic tips so we could educate the local service center. Who knew the number of blinks was significant?

The 800 # folks admit they are there to give out contact info so you can ship it or contact your local servicer. When asked how I could get someone to ship my local guy the right part, they immediately said they'd have someone call me. That person was knowledgeable and volunteered to get the T.Wiz-level boss in the Southeast region involved.

If PA20 owners never get in-house service - that's a problem for sure. But I'm betting Panny will honorably fix this problem well after the warranty period if it crops up "late".

The problem is most ppl who do not know about this forum is most likely getting the run-around because NOTHING has been posted. You have to read this 13 page thread just to understand the problem.

Panasonic has done NOTHING to be proactive, simply put they want to keep this hush hush. WE had to learn about this flaw and fix from other owners and T. Wiz. There's NOTHING on Panny site, FAQ, and even their CS reps are playing dumb about this problem.

Depending on which srv ctr you contact, the story always changes. Now we're forced to deal with TV repair salesman who wants to bill for pickup, diagnostic charges, parts, shipping etc....

So basically Panasonic wants to treat customer who buy a $4K TV like sh1t and for us to walk around recommending their products???

PS> Good luck with the post-warranty repairs - I think you will be quite disappointed.

I believe that when a car model for a given year is found to have a flaw which may lead to "failure," a written notice is mailed to all those who bought that model -- telling them about the problem and advising them to bring their car in for repair ***before*** failure occurs, at no charge.

Well... I'm happy to report that my "in-home" warranty repair of 42PA20U that shut down on 12/28/03 with 1,705 hrs has now been completed.

It only took 26 days from the date I first called Panasonic support. First, I had to deal with uninformed and incompetent Panasonic 'consumer group' customer service reps that just left me to the mercy of my warranty service center in hope of them knowing or being informed about this "well known" issue. They refused to order the part and repair the set unless I agreed to have my TV hauled to their shop. I know that in-home warranty does not specifically mean that all repairs/diagnostics will be done at home, but in this case we are talking about a simple part replacement. There is no need for further diagnosis. Unit turned off with power LED flashing 5 or 7 times - replace defective part. End of story.

Why is there such a wide discrepancy between services provided? Using this board as an example - some repairs done in same day, some even at home, while others taking several weeks. And I agree with MC® 100% - what about all the ppl that do not visit this board to learn that the problem with their set is not an isolated defect?

If Panasonic cared about their reputation and their customer service they would long ago implement repair strategy that avoided the hassle some of us had to go thru. Instead they hide behind their manufacturer warranty pretending your set exhibited "normal" defect. I am not saying that they need to do a recall. That would not be practical for a consumer electronic item but how about this simple scenario:

First, they have customer service reps that are knowledgeable and well informed. Upon verifying that your set exhibits shut down issue they would immediately call your nearest service center, log repair and overnight them the part if necessary. Simple power supply exchange swap is all that's needed and easily done in home. Regardless if the set is still in warranty or not. Maybe even a short follow-up courtesy call from Panasonic would be nice...then again, maybe I am just dreaming, expecting too much. I know from working 18 years in computer service industry that I would not be in a business for very long have I provided this type of service to my customers.

So to conclude this long post let me just say that while I love my Panasonic plasma, this ordeal will not be forgotten when the time comes to shop for another TV in a few years...

Not to belittle the PITA experience some of you have had, but as 'early adopters' of a brand new plasma this is not totally unexpected. Your plasmas were fixed at no expense to yourselves and for most, in an expedited fashion...maybe some hassle to you but in dealing with a multinational corporation, that is to be unexpected. Nobody asked you to buy the set when it was first introduced, you know you HAD to have it and you knew the risks involved with a new version. Now you scream there's a problem with a small and yes it is SMALL number of early consumer and industrial Panny ED's and you'd think your very Constitutional rights had been violated. I think Panasonic has done you right, probably more than most companies would and the bashin' goin on is not justified. TWizard gave you the skinny on the problem, that is now fixed, and many of you bash him as well....I find that sad and petty.

How 'bout you buy a Tatung next time and then let me know how great it worked out.....


elvis

Originally posted by elvisdoc
..., but as 'early adopters' of a brand new plasma this is not totally unexpected. Your plasmas were fixed at no expense to yourselves and for most, in an expedited fashion...maybe some hassle to you but in dealing with a multinational corporation, that is to be unexpected

Hey elvis...

Let's clarify this.

First - we are not an early adopters... What generation are these Panny plasmas?

Second - waiting 4 or even 6 weeks to get it repaired? Is what you call an expedited repair for an item you paid $$$$? I hope that these are only isolated cases!

Third - you need to go back and re-read this thread and few others such as "Trouble in Panny Paradise". Maybe you learn on how all this started with the initial claim that only plasmas with few hundred hours exhibited this problem. And even at that it was a very low number. All the posts here reflect on the contrary to what was said. Fact is, Panny is letting their initial mishap work itself out using same approach then any other "unexpected" manufacturing defect.

Do you see any solid claims on how will Panasonic handle "shut-down" issue for out of warranty units? I don't! For now, I bet all of the repairs were done and covered within a warranty. What will happen to those that run out of warranty? Hopefully they find their way to this forum and scream real loud... Others, not so lucky will be left to their luck with the service centers. Or be the "lucky" ones who will never ever have a shut down issue.

<<<First - we are not an early adopters>>>

Wrong. This is a new version incorporating many features not seen prior in earlier models. You bought the first release of this new version and it had a bug...this happens in cars, software, and many other products...BTW, that makes you an 'early adopter'.

<<<Second - waiting 4 or even 6 weeks to get it repaired?>>>

Wrong again. Most posts state repairs performed in a timely fashion...many times in home. 4-6 weeks is the exception, definitely not the norm.

<<<Third - you need to go back and re-read this thread>>>

Strike three. Have followed this issue from the beginning. Main reason I waited to get a Sept build instead of 'early adopting' was the shut-down issue...another plus of reading this board.

<<<Do you see any solid claims on how will Panasonic handle "shut-down" issue for out of warranty units?>>>

Actually, free out of warranty repairs are not really expected in any consumer device but from what TWizard and others have posted, I do see solid evidence that Panny will handle it in a most satisfactory fashion for affected sets. They really have no reason not to, as they want repeat business and this is a known issue for early units.

So lets stick to facts and not hysterics, huh, stef?


elvis