* Offical Velodyne Support Thread * [Text View] - Page 6

curt c

05-27-05, 06:29 PM

Curt,

Are the new SPL's built in China like the current line?
(Always thought they were US built until I saw the "Made in China" on the outer carton).
I thought building offshore helped keep the price down ;)

Is it your factory or is the work subbed out to a third party manufacturer?

Thanks

Hi,
Every Velodyne SPL-R subwoofer is totally designed and engineered in our Silicon Valley facility in California with Velodyne’s cutting-edge technology in the use of DSP for digital control and tuning, driver design, and our patented ERS Class D amplifiers. None of the engineering or design is done in China.

Like the SPL-II products, the SPL-R Series is made in China in one of the world’s state-of-the-art speaker factories. We use the same facilities as other premier manufacturers from the US, Great Britain, Sweden, and Germany. In today’s international economy, this Chinese facility is considered one of the highest quality, most efficient and reliable manufacturing resources in the world. Nevertheless, to assure that every Velodyne meets our standards, we quality control every piece, and have production experts and engineers in the Chinese factory on a regular basis.

You are right with regard to building in China and value; consider what is built into and comes with all the SPL-R subwoofers: patented 1000 Watt RMS amplifiers, sophisticated long throw drivers with massive magnets, butyl rubber surrounds and proprietary voice coil designs, beautifully constructed and finished cabinetry, a DSP processor that precisely tunes the subwoofer for its best possible response and lowest distortion, a full feature remote control, Velodyne’s exclusive digital circuitry for limiting distortion, and a calibrated microphone for use with the self-contained digital 6-band room bass EQ system.

Then, look at the features and benefits: a built-in one-button, automatic, digital 6-band auto bass EQ system to deliver the ideal bass right at your listening position; four factory presets that with one touch automatically adjust the bass curves, volume and EQ for the source you select—Movies (similar to a THX curve), R&B/Rock (with a curve that emulates the house curve in a live performance), Jazz/Classical (flat with the deepest and most accurate bass), and Games (for those who want to maximize their gaming experience). Add to that the convenience of a small, easy to use remote control and you’ll never have to get out of your seat to adjust your subwoofer again.

Think for a moment about the differences between this generation and the original 600 Watt RMS SPL-800 (built in the US) in its plain, square little box wrapped in wood grain vinyl. None of the advance features or performance improvements were included in that product that sold at the very same price you now can buy an SPL-800R. If we were to build this product state-side it would add hundreds of dollars in cost to the consumer. This is why we utilize state-of-the-art Chinese manufacturing—to give the consumer the absolutely highest performance, most accurate and reliable product we can at the best possible price.

Hope this helps,
Curt

curt c

05-27-05, 06:39 PM

curt: i have a dd12 (and have been very happy with it!). i'm now adding an anthem avm30 pre-pro to my system, and it has a single notch filter. my question is whether i should use the anthem's notch filter to get rid of the worst peak in the room and then use the dd12 to get as flat a response as possible after that...or use the dd12 first and see if the anthem's notch filter is even needed? also, the anthem will also control the sub's phase and polarity -- would you suggest that this be handled with the anthem or with the dd?

thanks very much, curt -- you've got a fantastic sub!

Hi David,
I wish I had a definitive answer for you. Perhaps someone with the same equipment can lend a hand. I would initially just use the Velodyne's EQ and see if I could get a good response. I'm not too keen on multiple units doing the EQ unless necessary. I would also use the Velodyne's phase and polarity if needed. The Velodyne is working in the digital domain and more flexible in my opinion.
Certainly you can experiment with your different options.
Thanks,
Curt

Everyone have a Safe and Happy Holiday Weekend!!

The Rang

05-27-05, 08:35 PM

Hi,
Every Velodyne SPL-R subwoofer is totally designed and engineered in our Silicon Valley facility in California with Velodyne’s cutting-edge technology in the use of DSP for digital control and tuning, driver design, and our patented ERS Class D amplifiers. None of the engineering or design is done in China.

Like the SPL-II products, the SPL-R Series is made in China in one of the world’s state-of-the-art speaker factories. We use the same facilities as other premier manufacturers from the US, Great Britain, Sweden, and Germany. In today’s international economy, this Chinese facility is considered one of the highest quality, most efficient and reliable manufacturing resources in the world. Nevertheless, to assure that every Velodyne meets our standards, we quality control every piece, and have production experts and engineers in the Chinese factory on a regular basis.

You are right with regard to building in China and value; consider what is built into and comes with all the SPL-R subwoofers: patented 1000 Watt RMS amplifiers, sophisticated long throw drivers with massive magnets, butyl rubber surrounds and proprietary voice coil designs, beautifully constructed and finished cabinetry, a DSP processor that precisely tunes the subwoofer for its best possible response and lowest distortion, a full feature remote control, Velodyne’s exclusive digital circuitry for limiting distortion, and a calibrated microphone for use with the self-contained digital 6-band room bass EQ system.

Then, look at the features and benefits: a built-in one-button, automatic, digital 6-band auto bass EQ system to deliver the ideal bass right at your listening position; four factory presets that with one touch automatically adjust the bass curves, volume and EQ for the source you select—Movies (similar to a THX curve), R&B/Rock (with a curve that emulates the house curve in a live performance), Jazz/Classical (flat with the deepest and most accurate bass), and Games (for those who want to maximize their gaming experience). Add to that the convenience of a small, easy to use remote control and you’ll never have to get out of your seat to adjust your subwoofer again.

Think for a moment about the differences between this generation and the original 600 Watt RMS SPL-800 (built in the US) in its plain, square little box wrapped in wood grain vinyl. None of the advance features or performance improvements were included in that product that sold at the very same price you now can buy an SPL-800R. If we were to build this product state-side it would add hundreds of dollars in cost to the consumer. This is why we utilize state-of-the-art Chinese manufacturing—to give the consumer the absolutely highest performance, most accurate and reliable product we can at the best possible price.

Hope this helps,
Curt

Thanks Curt,

Yes that does help. Wasn't questioning the facility, just curious. Though I must confess, despite being excellent subs, I find the SPL series pretty expensive considering the lower labour costs in China.
Didn't stop me from buying mind you ;)

Now...I just have to decide if I keep my new 1200II or return in favour of the R

Nightmaster

05-28-05, 03:25 AM

Hi guys- a friend of mine picked up what seemed to be a great Velodyne CT-120 sub a few weeks ago. Gave him super sound but then when he went to power it on yesterday it was dead, no power. It had given him no indication of any problems before then. He checked the internal fuse and it was blown, changed the fuse to no avail. Any ideas why this would happen so suddenly, and is the CT-120 a very old model in the Velodyne sub line? I'm a bit worried about it because I have the same model myself! Thanks in advance :)

curt c

05-28-05, 04:58 PM

Nightmaster

05-28-05, 07:22 PM

Thanks for the reply Curt :). He was able to get his money back as he had only had it a few weeks, so finding out what the problem was isn't an option now. Like I said, I'm more concerned at this point with how long my own CT-120 is likely to last!

Nightmaster

05-30-05, 06:51 AM

Hi,
I'm sorry to hear of your friends problem. I would suggest he contact Velodyne Service at; service@velodyne.com or (408) 465-2851. The CHT's replaced the CT about 3-4 years ago as I recall. The manufactured date is on the amplifier plate.
Thanks,
Curt

Curt,

Looking at my CT-120 I see no manufactured date on the amplifier plate, only the model and serial number which is 58288573. Beneath that is the location, San Jose CA.

05-30-05, 01:21 PM

Hi Curt,
As of what date did Velodyne move all of their assembly to China. My SPL-1000 series II was still assembled in your California facility.

The Rang

05-30-05, 09:27 PM

Hi Curt,
As of what date did Velodyne move all of their assembly to China. My SPL-1000 series II was still assembled in your California facility.

So I was correct when I assumed the SPL's were built in the US once upon a time.

I can't help but wonder if manufacturing was moved offshore in advance of the SPL-R series to get the ball rolling.

I must admit, this has soured me somewhat on the pricing. Considering the lower labor costs it makes the SPL's that much more expensive.

My SPL1200II seems nice enough but the value factor isn't there for me. I'm leaning towards taking it back.

MrHifi

05-31-05, 06:25 AM

The Rang

05-31-05, 10:27 AM

Rang,

Your comment is truly pathetic. While the speaker's "value" in terms of cost benefit may not fulfill your expectations, it in no way detracts from the Velodyne Subwoofer's position as the finest implementation of servo controlled bass reproducers available for the last decade and a half. Simply put, for those seeking the finest reproduction of frequencies below 120 Hz, there is no other choice. When seeking low distortion and ultra low accurate response a Velodyne sub is the way to go.

Whether they are built in Illinois, Mexico, Malasia or China, has nothing to do with the speaker's unparallelled low end accuracy. When you buy the best, you have to pay a premium for the effort that went into the implementation of the technology. You should be thankful that Velodyne's managers have found a way to keep costs down so that the speakers can be purchased by folks like us who can appreciate the diference in performance but can not take a "Michael Jackson Approach" to buying where cost is not a factor, i.e. you buy it because you want it.regardless of the price.

You threaten to return the speaker because for you the "value factor isn't there". If that means that you feel you payed too much for the speaker, that is more a statement about your inability to shop around for the best price available. it has nothing to do with the speaker's performance. Perhaps you reflect an ethnic discrimminatory bias by believing that the Chinese workers can not build speakers as well as American workers. That would be sad and false.

i'm wondering how you will resolve your "value" dilemna. Perhaps you will return these speakers and purchase another subwoofer on the internet. If that is what you are considering, I did see altec Lansing subwoofers offered on EBAY for the cost of the shipping alone, $16.00. Unfortunately, these too were built in China but at zero cost, other than the S&H, they may meet your critria for good "value".

Art,

I'm entitled to my opinion as are you.

Velodyne is a respected company. I have had personal e-mails from Bruce Hall, he comes across as a great guy. Curt responded to one of my e-mails about this issue with a very clear and thoughtful statement, a statement which I understand and accept.

All I'm trying to say is this: though I believe the SPL is an excellent sub I have had heard other subs that, IMHO, are also excellent especially when price is factored in.

I can't comment on their servo products....haven't heard them, can't afford them.

As far as my inability to get a good price......I got a screaming deal. I know what the cost is. I got a huge discount and the store still put some money in their pockets, as it should be. I can get it for even less if I buy the demo, which I may do.

Re your "ethnic discriminitory bias" reference: I am truly offended.

Forget price or country of manufacture. Generally speaking I think the world of Velodyne. Their participation in this thread speaks volumes.

But the reverence with which they, and SVS, are afforded on this forum leaves me wondering about the objectivity of some of the comments I read here.

I joined this forum to participate in a helpful, enjoyable conversation on the subject I love . That's it. Didn't expect to be slapped for an honest opinion or observation.

Just my $.02.

If that's pathetic then so be it.

Blair

curt c

05-31-05, 11:14 AM

Curt,

Looking at my CT-120 I see no manufactured date on the amplifier plate, only the model and serial number which is 58288573. Beneath that is the location, San Jose CA.

Hi,
Your CT-120 was manufactured in October, 1998. It has apparently provided you with years of service and there's no reason to assume it won't continue doing so.
Thanks,
Curt

Nightmaster

05-31-05, 11:28 AM

Hi,
Your CT-120 was manufactured in October, 1998. It has apparently provided you with years of service and there's no reason to assume it won't continue doing so.
Thanks,
Curt

Thanks for the insight, Curt! My pal just bought a DPS-12 at Circuit City to replace his blown CT-120 this weekend.

duffmike

05-31-05, 04:55 PM

The enjoyment I have received from my brand new SPL 1200 II has not been spoiled due to the fact it was made in China. I was a little surprised, but it is a fine unit. No regrets whatsoever. Bring on the SMS-1!

curt c

05-31-05, 05:15 PM

Thanks very much for the feedback. I too am very excited about the SMS-1.
Stay tuned.
Curt

bradleycox

05-31-05, 07:34 PM

First let me say I am really impressed that the owner of a company like Velodyne would take time to answer our question!!! Bruce must be a true audiophile Enthusiasts. How does a hgs series compare to a spl R series II? I was reading in a review on the Velodyne web site that the SPL series would be louder than the HGS due to the Servo Feed back on the HGS using so much power. Which would be a better choice? I would probably get 2 spl series or 1 hgs 15x. I am replacing a Sunfire true sub mark II and I do not want to loose any SPL.
Thank you,
Bradley

curt c

05-31-05, 08:04 PM

Bradley,
The SPL-R's and the HGS-X's both sound superb. Two SPL-1200R's under ideal conditions would play a little louder than a single HGS-15X, but it would be in the same ballpark. Either will play considerably louder than what you now have. To me it would come down to placement ease, two small or one larger unit. Keep in mind when utilizing two subwoofers they must be placed where they support each other and that may require experimentation.
Thanks,
Curt

jedi29

05-31-05, 09:12 PM

bradleycox

05-31-05, 09:19 PM

bradleycox

05-31-05, 09:24 PM

Will the HGS-x subs get any improvements such as room EQ?

curt c

06-01-05, 11:03 AM

Hi,
There is no current plan to include EQ in the HGS-X series.
Curt

curt c

06-01-05, 11:23 AM

Hi Curt,
Another ?
Are the new SPL-xxxR servo subs ? or are they controled through DSP function.
Also are the "wood" colors veneer or vinyl covered?
One last ( well maybe LOL ) ? Any idea when they will be on Velodyne`s website ?
Many thanks for all your help,
Gary

Hi,
The SPL-R series are not servo subs. We used our long term experience with servo subwoofers to design a multi stage amplifier circuit that closely mimics what the servo would accomplish. That combined with the new DSP funtionality maintains tight control on performance. That's why they sound so accurate. The finishes on the SPL's are a high quality (expensive) vinyl finish available in black gloss, cherry and maple wood grain effect. The SPL-R info will be on the website very soon.
Curt

curt c

06-01-05, 11:29 AM

What do you think about the hgs not having equal output as a spl series with the same size driver? MY local dealer does not really push the HGS series, it is the only one he does not have in stock. My room is 16x20 with 10' ceilings and it is open on two sides to a kitchen and hall, what do you recommend? Which Velodyne would be equal to the output of my Sunfire true sub MKII?
Thank you,
Bradley

Bradley,
Including the kitchen and hall you probably have 4000-5000 cubic feet. That would call for a DD-18 or DD-15. The next best solution would be a HGS-15X or a pair of SPL-1200R's.
Curt

sprakash

06-02-05, 11:30 AM

Hi,
couple of quick questions.
I had a DD10 in a corner position which I could equalize it to a ruler-flat curve(?) between 25 and 95hz. Not much SPL below 20, about 60db, though it sounded great above that.
Replaced it with a DD12 v2.0 within two weeks so I could get some more low-end extension. In the same physical location, on auto-eq, I get around 80db from 17hz upwards. Obviously punchier than the 10.
But when I try to manually equalize, below 20hz I again have only about 60db.
- Does the auto-eq boost the lower-end which I also need to do manually?
- The curve is also not as flat as the DD10 - auto or manual calibration
- Does it matter if the driver faces towards the seating area, or back towards a wall or the corner?
I haven't had enough time to try these out - will try this weekend.
Thanks for any advise,
SP

curt c

06-02-05, 12:09 PM

Hi,
I wouldn't worry about trying to achieve a ruler flat curve. We suggest +/- 3db. With the DD-12 I wouldn't try to raise (eq) below 20 hz. You will use up amplifier power rapidly trying to do so. If you really want deeper than 20hz, I would suggest you get the DD-15 or 18. The ultra low frequencies are very room related. If you have fairly flat to 20hz with the DD-12, that's great. Realize human hearing stops around 30 hz. Low note on a string bass is about 40hz and seldom played.
You can certainly touch up the auto-eq by going in and manually eq'ing over the auto. As far as placement in the corner I would have the driver facing the listening position. In order to use the remote the front of the subwoofer would have to be somewhat facing the listening position.
The DD-12 has almost twice the output capability as the DD-10.
Thanks,
Curt

John Kotches

06-02-05, 01:32 PM

Curt:

I take it your shoulder is doing much better?

Low note on a string bass is about 40hz and seldom played.

True if it doesn't have a C extension added, which takes it down to ca. 32Hz. In addition, five string Electric basses generally tune to B below Low C which is ca. 30 Hz. All frequencies assume A4=440 for tuning standard ;)

5-string electrics are getting more and more common.

Best,

Super Rats

06-02-05, 02:00 PM

Hello, I have a VRP-1000 and to get the desired level of bass in my apartment, I have the volume set to the 2 o'clock position. I have it connected in both the L and R as suggested by the website. Is this a sign that I'm pushing it and I need a more powerful unit, since the manual seems to indicate 9 o'clock is probably where it should be?

The room is 17x12, but the listen area is basically a 12x12 area with the extra 5' on the left hand side (which leads to an 8x8 dining area). So really, the room is like 25x12 with the entertainment center on one side in a 12 x 12 area. Ceiling is 10 feet.

curt c

06-02-05, 02:19 PM

curt c

06-02-05, 02:50 PM

Curt:

True if it doesn't have a C extension added, which takes it down to ca. 32Hz. In addition, five string Electric basses generally tune to B below Low C which is ca. 30 Hz. All frequencies assume A4=440 for tuning standard ;)

5-string electrics are getting more and more common.

Best,

Hey John,
I sent you a PM.
Take Care,
Curt

John Kotches

06-02-05, 03:35 PM

Curt:

Got it ;)

Just putting it out there, because we're getting more and more 5-string bass material out there in popular music. I guess record producers are figuring out that we have subwoofers and we like them :D

Cheers,

tweeterex

06-03-05, 08:52 AM

In general, as soon as you lower distortion and eliminate some meaty bass hump by flattening room response, you have taken away what many of the "great unwashed masses" of consumers believe to be, bass. A couple of co-workers have picked up DD'S (AND WE , BEING IN THIS BUISNESS, HAVE A LOT WE CAN CHOOSE FROM) and they are VERY happy. I am very pleased with the DD series too and how well it helps with blending, music, and overall accuracy, in fact I believe that it will be replacing a Rel in my main set-up, and the new SPL-r might just be what the doctor ordered in my bedroom system. Congrats Velodyne for some great new gear.

curt c

06-03-05, 09:52 AM

Thank you very much from the Velodyne Team. Feedback like yours makes it all worthwhile.
Curt

Super Rats

06-03-05, 10:15 AM

Hi,
Try the following;
1) Place the phase switch where it is the loudest, usually "0".
2) Raise the internal volume (in receiver) for the subwoofer jack to three fourths of the way up. It's probably at half way up now.
3) Back off on the VRP volume to half way or below.
This should provide a little more reserve.
Curt

Thanks. I turned the volume on the subwoofer down to 11 o'clock and was able to get the desired volume at +9db to the sub from the receiver.

The Rang

06-03-05, 09:23 PM

In general, as soon as you lower distortion and eliminate some meaty bass hump by flattening room response, you have taken away what many of the "great unwashed masses" of consumers believe to be, bass.

I'm starting to agree with this point.
Have been running the SPL1200II and Seismic 12 side by side for a couple of weeks. You can definitely feel the Seismic more but I suspect that's the result of it being downward firing and having much higher distortion. Very impressive.....at first.

If you take the "rumble" factor away the Velo seems to be tighter and.....more enveloping? Does that make sense? You actually hear more bass. Things I didn't notice with the Seismic are clear as a bell (well, maybe a tympani). Blends better too and that's with zero experimentation with position. I guess that internal sub X-over bypass is a good idea.

Strangely enough the Velo, despite seeming to have less "boom" actually rattles things in the room more. Maybe I should stick it in a corner to re-inforce the bottom even more :)

Still haven't decided which is staying but I'm leaning towards the SPL.

tweeterex

06-03-05, 09:49 PM

I am also happy with the idea of room correction just in the sub .

The Rang

06-03-05, 10:27 PM

I am also happy with the idea of room correction just in the sub .

Well, that opens another can of worms.
Do I keep the SPLII, which I will get at a substantial discount, or wait for the SPL-R?
I seriously doubt the dealer will be prepared to give me the new model at the same price as the discontinued piece.

tweeterex

06-03-05, 10:43 PM

Do I keep the SPLII, which I will get at a substantial discount, or wait for the SPL-R?

I doubt that I will ever buy another sub that doesn't room correct.

Pierce

06-04-05, 02:41 AM

Well, that opens another can of worms.
Do I keep the SPLII, which I will get at a substantial discount, or wait for the SPL-R?
I seriously doubt the dealer will be prepared to give me the new model at the same price as the discontinued piece.

I am in the same dilemma. The SPL800II is perfect for my 12 X 12 X 10 bedroom, and they are significantly discounted at the local specialty electronic store. But the SPL-R's DSP modes and room EQ is incredibly enticing. If curt c hadn't mentioned its imminent arrival I might've already taken the plunge on the old school Velo... :p

I'm dying for someone to get one of the first ones and give us some news. But I can only imagine that it's as good as the current model at the very least.

duffmike

06-04-05, 12:11 PM

If anything I will add a SMS-1 to be used with my spl12 II. This sub definately needed a little break in time. Very clean and low. I won't get caught up in the spl r hype.

tweeterex

06-04-05, 12:52 PM

If anything I will add a SMS-1 to be used with my spl12 II. This sub definately needed a little break in time. Very clean and low. I won't get caught up in the spl r hype.

but it isn't hype, and if you are looking into the sms-1, isn't that an acknowledgement of interest in the idea?

MrHifi

06-04-05, 01:38 PM

Tweeterex,

The comment below your note implies that folks posting to these forums are disengenuous. I resent that. I feel your comment is inappropriate. We are all big boys and girls here and appreciate the effort put forth by manufacturer's representatives who give their time so generously to help owners and prospective buyers help with repairs, purchase considerations, and installation possibilities. If they hapen to sell a few units as a result of their many hours researching questions and providing truthfulll, usefull answers, I consider that an appropriate and above board benefit to the company who in many instances make these individual's time available. In many other cases, I am sure individual's love for their craft motivates their participation. I work for no AV company and receive no support from any company or individual to come here and answer questions. After 50+ years playing with this stuff and several years years of specialized education in the acoustics field, I often read comments to which I feel I can respond and offer some insight that might not be available to others.

I really believe you should consider dropping the statement that appears in every comment you make. It is in bad taste.

duffmike

06-04-05, 03:18 PM

You are right...I'm just speaking to the fact that I will not be selling my spl 12 II to get an SPL r because it is the new and maybe better sub. The idea of the EQ is very cool.

hifisponge

06-04-05, 07:13 PM

If anything I will add a SMS-1 to be used with my spl12 II. This sub definately needed a little break in time. Very clean and low. I won't get caught up in the spl r hype.

As a happy owner of a DD15, I can attest tot the benefits of room EQ. However, and with all due respect to Velodyne and their efforts to introduce a more cost effective sub that includes an EQ, I think using the SMS-1 is a better solution than the SPL-R. The reason being that the SMS-1 is a variable band, parametric EQ (just like the DD series), whereas the SPL-R is going to use a fixed-band EQ. Fixed band EQs in ineffective for correcting room response because a peak in the room response can (and often does) fall between the set frequency bands, and you also have no control over the width of the filter. Both are vitally important to getting results you'll be consistently happy with.

Enigma

06-04-05, 07:30 PM

Anyone know when the SMS-1 is going to be available? (Sorry if this has been answered already)

tweeterex

06-04-05, 09:30 PM

The comment below your note implies that folks posting to these forums are disengenuous

As I stated, there is nothing wrong with being marketed to or pitched to, just worth bearing in mind...I find people are under the false assumption that everyone here is just being neighborly, which, is I'm sure , generally the case, but a healthy amount of scepticism or thoughts towards possible motives, can't do any harm...many used to believe that all press reports were unbiased and many now believe that some may have an agenda. If you are a bit suspicious of Mike Wallace's motives , you should apply that to everyone here as well...I am a dealer and never post where I work or try to drum up buisness, but many will say I have biases and agendas. I'm comfortable with them pointing them out to people who may not know what e-marketing is , I don't know why people would mind a piece of cautionary advice.

yakuzaboss1975

06-06-05, 12:51 AM

hi bruce & curt,

i just recently i noticed a kind of popping/cracking noise coming from my sub. i'm running my Velodyne Deco 7.1 speakers system with an Onkyo TX-NR901 receiver. the crossover is set at 'deco setting' and the subwoofer level at a little less than half. when i watch movies, i have the master volume at around 60 - 70% of the maximum level. any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. please and thank you very much.

curt c

06-06-05, 11:49 AM

Hi,
Please contact our service dept., (408) 465-2851 or service@velodyne.com regarding your DECO subwoofer.
The DECO system was designed for small home theater installations. For maximum subwoofer performance, the room should be about 2000 cubic feet or less and no openings into other rooms. Always use a "Y" splitter into both inputs and try raising the volume control for the subwoofer jack in your receiver about 3/4 of the way up. Keep the Deco's volume at less than 1/2 way. Running the master volume at 60-70% seems awfully high, but I'm not familiar with the Onkyo. The DECO sub may not be large enough for your room.
Thanks,
Curt

yakuzaboss1975

06-06-05, 12:15 PM

hi curt,

thanks for replying. i appreciate it. the room itself is 18ft long by 13ft wide by 7ft high with no openings into other rooms. and i dont think that the volumes too loud because i can still hear the phone ring in the other room with the door closed. someone suggested that maybe it was blown. i hope not though.

yakuzaboss1975

06-06-05, 12:37 PM

on the back panel of the sub, there is a high-pass output (R & L). and the LFE input (R & L). i have the subwoofer cable plugged it to the LFE (L) input, as per the deco owners manual. do i just plug the cable into the y-splitter then the other side into both the R & L LFE input? and leave the high-pass out unused? i apologize for my ignorance with this matter. i've done everything according to the manuals.

curt c

06-06-05, 01:03 PM

Hi,
The DECO system should be perfect for that size room. Your assumption for hooking up the "Y" splitter is exactly right.
Curt

Kevin12586

06-07-05, 11:05 AM

I am new to this thread so I apologize if this has been discussed yet. I am looking into 3 subs, Outlaw LFM-1, SVS PB12 and the 5000R, my basement is over 6000 cubic feet with the theater in one portion of the basement. The space is open to all areas and I was wondering if the 5000R would be able to 'fill' this space with smooth and deep bass? I plan to place the sub in a corner behind one of my towers. I asked a similar question in a different thread but figured I would ask in the 'support' thread.

Thanks in advance.

curt c

06-07-05, 11:23 AM

Hi Kevin,
A DLS-5000R would be a good start. Two would be much better. In that price range I don't know of anything that would do as well. The recommendation for your cubic displacement would be two fifteen inch or even two eighteen inch subwoofers.
Thanks,
Curt (480) 595-7141

david mcdaniel

06-07-05, 06:09 PM

I am planning electronics and speakers for my new HT. While I realize room treatments may be important I was hoping to minimize their costs and complexity. Do any of you Velodyne DD series owners use a receiver with the Audessey Room EQ system along with your DD Sub? Would this be redundant?

Jake Sm

06-08-05, 08:45 AM

I am of the feeling that the Velodyne room correction is all I'd need to tame those elements of room troubles that I could not handle easily in a passive way. If I had another EQ system in the receiver, I would be inclined to do as much with the Velo first and then try the Audessey, etc after the DD was dialed in. A colleague of mine complained that one of his customers (who already had a good video processor/switch) returned a 5805 after setting up that and a DD12 , opting insted to go with a lower priced pre/pro to drive some seperate amps he already had. I told him to introduce him to the Lexicons.

John Kotches

06-08-05, 09:11 AM

JakeSm says:

I am of the feeling that the Velodyne room correction is all I'd need to tame those elements of room troubles that I could not handle easily in a passive way. If I had another EQ system in the receiver, I would be inclined to do as much with the Velo first and then try the Audessey, etc after the DD was dialed in. A colleague of mine complained that one of his customers (who already had a good video processor/switch) returned a 5805 after setting up that and a DD12 , opting insted to go with a lower priced pre/pro to drive some seperate amps he already had. I told him to introduce him to the Lexicons.

Your thoughts are actually pretty accurate.

1) Start with the room treatments.

2) Use the integrated DD to dial in the response as close as possible.

3) Use EQ in processor/receiver to get the last little bit.

It's quite effective, and that's exactly how I've got the setup running at my house :)

Cheers,

rss

06-08-05, 12:08 PM

A quick question for Curt:

I own a SPL-1200 series II, and recently had an in-warranty repair of the amplifier (bad volume potentiometer). Thanks for the very prompt and courteous service from Velodyne!

Perhaps it's my imagination, but it seems that I'm seeing much greater gain for a given volume setting than I did previously. I now have a calibrated sub output with the volume control turned almost to the minimum setting (about 7 o'clock), having dialed down the sub by about 7 dB at the receiver as well (Rotel 1056). I am using a Y-splitter for the input, as I did previously. I believe that I used a volume position of about 9 o'clock previously. Now this setting will result in too great a volume to calibrate at the receiver side. I assume this is all a result of the new volume pot. Does this sound right, or am I losing my mind? Should I change any settings? And BTW, did you have a bad run of pots? It seems odd that mine failed, as I basically set it once and never touched it again.

Thanks for endulging the silly questions and many thanks for the excellent support!

Scott

D. Saint

06-08-05, 03:09 PM

Dear RSS

In addition to the replacement of the volume pot on your amplifier I would guess that we also updated your amplifier as well, which may account for the increased
output level. Assuming you have more adjustment range left on your Rotel unit after going down 7dB, you may be able to lower it even further and raise the volume setting on the subwoofer to the 9 O'clock setting you desire.
Afterwards I suggest you get out your trusty SPL meter and calibrate your subwoofer output for 75dBc using the test tone generator in the Rotel.
You might find that your subwoofer was playing much louder than needed all along.
With regards to your question about the volume pots, some of the amp boards were apparently subjected to a chemical bath to cleanse them from the solvents used in manufacturing. We believe the chemical bath damages the pots over time, thus causing them to fail. It is a very limited issue that to date has only affected a very small number of units. Sorry that you were unfortunate enough to have received one, but hope we did our job in repairing the item to your satisfaction.

David Santos

rss

06-08-05, 03:34 PM

Thank you, David.

The settings I described above were indeed calibrated to 75 dB (measured 72 dB on my SPL meter) using test tones. At the 9 o'clock position on the Velo, I don't have enough adjustment on the Rotel to bring the volume down to 75 dB -- that is, with my mains set at 0 dB. I suppose I could boost the mains to acheive a larger gradient between the mains and the sub, but if it's okay to have the volume pot on the sub set to minimum, I won't bother.

I guess this is core of my question: Am I losing anything by having the volume on the Velo set almost to minimum?

Thanks for the info regarding the pots. Any chance of the solvent damaging other elements on the amp board? In any case, my sub does seem to be functioning well at the moment.

Cheers,

Scott

D. Saint

06-08-05, 07:25 PM

RSS,

In our experience the chemical bath has only been detrimenmtal to the volume pots.
They're not sealed pots so exposure to the bath causes internal deterioration over time.

D. Saint

rss

06-08-05, 08:01 PM

Thanks, David
I'll experiment a bit with the levels.
rss

Pierce

06-08-05, 09:04 PM

The Rang

06-08-05, 09:49 PM

The SPL-R (http://www.velodyne.com/velodyne/products/product.aspx?ID=13&sid=779g714k) series page is finally up at Velodyne's website!

click here (http://www.velodyne.com/velodyne/products/product.aspx?ID=13&sid=779g714k) or up there!!

They look great and if you look closely at the specs it would seem each of them goes down lower by a db or two.

I still have another week to decide on my SPL1200II.

Can't see a reason to keep it anymore. Even I have to pay more (sale price on the II's vs regular on the "R's") I can go "down" to the SPL1000R and probably sacrifice nothing while gaining the new features.

tweeterex

06-08-05, 10:45 PM

BUT IT'S NOT THE AUDESSEY EQ! :rolleyes:

jedi29

06-09-05, 10:14 PM

Are we sure the new SPL`s have the same MSRP`s?
I sure hope so, in other words I hope that there will be no inflated prices.
It realy does "sound" ( at least on paper ) like it`s a fine sub.
And no volume control to get scratcheee over time is a welcome change.
Also , do you have to use that mic thingy ?
I need to hear one , any idea when local ( or web ) stock will arrive?
And BTW "RANG" IMO if you can squeeze it get the 12"`r , you can always turn it down :)
Gary

curt c

06-09-05, 11:02 PM

Gary,
Same price!
BTW, you only need to use that mic "thingy" once.
Curt

vsrivera

06-11-05, 07:13 PM

Hi Curt,
I just purchased the spl 1000 II sub and the blue led light does not turn off even when the toggle switch is on auto-on.
Is this normal?

thanks.

jedi29

06-11-05, 07:19 PM

Hi Curt,
Thanks for the info !
Any idea when stock should start to show up ?
Also who are Velodyne supported web etailers ? ( other than Crutchfield , unless they are going to sell the 12" , so far they have only been selling the SPL`s in 8" and 10" and not in maple. If they sound "A-OK" I would prefer a 12" Maple )
Many thanks ,
Gary

iboon

06-11-05, 10:18 PM

An online support thread for a retail only manufacturer? Wow! I'm surprised - but very pleased.

Welcome Bruce - glad to see you here!!:D

Imagine that...Support for a product from a company that doesn't compromise on its integrity.

There are quite a few companies out there that have a similar POV. I'd like to see threads approved for these as well.

As it pertains to subwoofers yeah, enough with SVS being the only thing discussed here. Not everyone wants a water heater in their living room.

iboon

06-11-05, 10:20 PM

The Rang

06-11-05, 10:30 PM

Strangely enough the Velo, despite seeming to have less "boom" actually rattles things in the room more. Maybe I should stick it in a corner to re-inforce the bottom even more :)

I don't know if the smiley alludes to your realization if this but... Sticking it in a corner may re-create the hump you're learning to enjoy being without. :)

You are right.

Tried it in a corner.....didn't like it. Too much boom ;)

Will experiment some more but I suspect this puppy puts out enough bottom end that I can keep it "in the open" so to speak to maintain tightness.

Kevin12586

06-12-05, 04:02 AM

I just got my 5000R yesterday and absolutely LOVE it :D

Granted this is my first home theater sub (I have a 10" in my car), and I am by far no expert, but the 5000R put a smile on my face from the moment I turned it on till I turned it off. My God this thing is HUGE, I knew what the measurements were before I purchased it, but you never actually realize the size until you experience it.

I have it placed in a corner of my basement (over 6000 cubic feet) and am VERY happy with the effect that it gives off. I thought I was feeling a lot of vibration in my basement, UNTIL I went upstairs and stood in my kitchen directly above it, the floor was vibrating and the dish drainer was rattling :D I then went up to the top floor (3 level house including the basement) and I could still feel 'some' of the vibration up there (I was playing the rocket launch scene from The Incredibles at the time).

The only 'complaint' I have about the sub is the fact that I don't really know how high the volume is set since there is no volume knob.

What I do like is the different EQ settings (movie, game, music) and I also love the night mode, great for late nights or during the day when my wife is asleep, also the mute button.

All in all a great sub, the audio stayed clear at high volumes, I never felt anything was missing from the scene and if there are lower frequencies that I am not getting I have no complaints.

Keep up the good work guys and when I am looking to upgrade (years from now), Velodyne will be the FIRST on my list. :)

GaryZ06

06-12-05, 08:21 AM

I just got my 5000R yesterday and absolutely LOVE it :D
The only 'complaint' I have about the sub is the fact that I don't really know how high the volume is set since there is no volume knob.
Yes I agree an the performance of this sub........In my opinion this sub is without a doubt one of the best bang for the bucks out there period......just forget the cost of it ....it just plain kicks butt.....Yes I also hate not knowing exactly where the volume is but I just crank it all the way up and control it through the receiver....Good luck with it and yes it is HUGE.

Kevin12586

06-12-05, 10:45 AM

Gary, did you adjust with an SPL meter and then use your receiver or just turned it up and then use your receiver to adjust?

GaryZ06

06-12-05, 10:56 AM

Gary, did you adjust with an SPL meter and then use your receiver or just turned it up and then use your receiver to adjust?
Kevin I don't have a meter.I just turned it up and did it from the receiver.

AsahiToro

06-12-05, 11:12 AM

Guys,

Where's the best deal on a DLS-5000R? Can I get one from a reputable online dealer for under $600 shipped?

Thanks,

Scott

Kevin12586

06-12-05, 11:14 AM

When you did this did your receiver give you a setting of 'below' zero for the level? Right now, my receiver set my sub at -7

GaryZ06

06-12-05, 11:28 AM

When you did this did your receiver give you a setting of 'below' zero for the level? Right now, my receiver set my sub at -7I really don't remember but I will redo it again an check it.Right now I have the sub 2 hotter than the mains....if that makes sense.

Kevin12586

06-12-05, 12:27 PM

If you are referring to the level that your receiver sets each speaker than it makes perfect sense. If so, then I have some adjustments to make, I have my speakers about 5 hotter than my sub, maybe I should turn the sub up more and make my house REALLY rock :D

mailiang

06-12-05, 12:47 PM

The only 'complaint' I have about the sub is the fact that I don't really know how high the volume is set since there is no volume knob.

For Curt and Bruce: Are they ever going to address the the lack of volume control settings on the EQ subs? It seems to me to be a major issue. I remember Tom Nousaine bringing this up in his September S&V review of the DPS 12.

Regards,
Ian

GaryZ06

06-12-05, 12:54 PM

The Rang

06-12-05, 02:15 PM

For Curt and Bruce: Are they ever going to address the the lack of volume control settings on the EQ subs? It seems to me to be a major issue. I remember Tom Nousaine bringing this up in his September S&V review of the DPS 12.

Regards,
Ian

Does this mean the new SPL-R series won't have a volume control either?

Maybe there is a valid reason for this but it seems short sighted to me. Some people will want, need, that manual flexibility.

curt c

06-12-05, 07:54 PM

Hi,
There is a volume indication on the SPL-R's. After the volume blinking stops, the unit will blink out the actual number. Slower blinks represent tens, and faster blinks represent ones. Example; if the volume were set at "34", after the rapid blinking stopped you would observe three slow blinks followed by four faster blinks, indicating volume set at "34".
Hope this helps.
Curt

Anamorphic

06-12-05, 08:35 PM

Guys,

Where's the best deal on a DLS-5000R? Can I get one from a reputable online dealer for under $600 shipped?

Thanks,

Scott

Kevin just paid $565 + $58 shipping for his. I don't know where he bought it from though.

After doing a quick search on Froogle, it seems that Kevin found his for $4 less.

jedi29

06-12-05, 09:27 PM

Hi Curt,
Got It :D (pm, that is still, looking for the sub :) )
IMO have an electronic volume control is a great idea , should have been done sooner !! ;)
Gary

mailiang

06-12-05, 11:59 PM

curt c

06-13-05, 10:24 AM

Ian,
The DD's (2.0) and SPL-Rs have it now. We will continue to study future improvements in the other subwoofers.
Thanks,
Curt

nmo

06-13-05, 11:54 AM

I was calibrating a friend's HT setup that has a older Klipsch 15" sub. When I played a test tone from his Denon 5803 and again a audio tone, after calibration, from a THX disc (to test speaker blend) his sub sounded very smooth.

Now, I have a DLS-4000, and when I play a test tone the sub doesn't sound smooth. It doesn't sound like distortion, but more of a "thrumming" sound. Hard to describe in words. But not as smooth as hearing a test tone thru my speakers.

Is this "thrumming" sound normal? I noticed it again yesterday when I was watching Speed at -10 on my receiver (I have my speakers calibrated up at 70db when the volume shows 0). The bass doesn't seem uniform. Any ideas?

curt c

06-13-05, 12:28 PM

You're comparing two different rooms and two different size subwoofers. Placement of subwoofers is critical as is proper size. I suggest you give me a call at (480) 595-7141 or provide me a phone number to call you and maybe I can help.
Thanks,
Curt

MrHifi

06-13-05, 01:16 PM

curt c

06-13-05, 02:17 PM

Hey Art,
Great story! I have many "nailpops" too. Glad you're enjoying the sub.
Take Care,
Curt

hifisponge

06-13-05, 02:49 PM

Curt,

You will get a buzz out of this. I was showing of with the Telarc CD of the 1812. It has extremely low information (cannon shots) at +10dB above the program level. Between the 6 low end drivers on each of the VMPS STII Towers and the Velodyne Sub, the output was too much for 3 nails in my ceitling. 3 more nailpops. Did i mention that I blew out the right rear channel EV 15" woofer. At my age i should have known better. All that power just gets to you. Thanks again for repairing the sub. I enjoy it every night.

Good God man! How loud were you playing your music?! Seems like your ears would bleed at levels high enough to pop nails. Seriously, I know what THX reference level is, but how loud is "+10dB above program level'?

How big is your room BTW?

MrHifi

06-13-05, 04:14 PM

My AV system is in a room 60 ft x 17 ft. with a couple of doors and walkways coming in and out of the space. Nail pops are not that strange a phenomenon if you are getting below 25 Hz. Below that one excites room resonances. Every room has them regardless of the size. When you amplify a Canon shot, albeit a fake one, the concussion can be startling specially with 6 woofers ranging fom 15" to 10" and the 18" Velodyne sub's driver all are in phase. my ears are OK but my buddy felt his heart skipped and he had to have a shot to put himself back together. I'm not sure what the SPL level is for the THX level you refer to but I usually run my system so that the speech is running around 65-70dB. I live in the middle of nowhere so the ambient is very quiet. The night in question, I'm sure we hit 110dB easily. i drive my VMPS ST- III's with Adcom GFA 555 monoblocks for the low end and a 7800 for the mids and highs. there's well over a killowatt feeding those plus the 600 watts available from the subwoofer. it was loud. It was amazing.

cargen

06-13-05, 06:07 PM

Velodyne DD Subwoofer Series discrete commands are now available for owners of the URC MX-3000 remote control at:
<http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin/files/rcfiles.cgi?area=mx3000&db=devices&br=velodyne&dv=subwoofer&fc=>

Many thanks to Bruce Hall for shipping me a loaner master remote from which I learned the commands. Another example of Velodyne's constant efforts to provide outstanding service and support to its customers.

Chris Cargen

Kevin12586

06-13-05, 11:27 PM

One question about my 5000R, according to Velodyne's website, it has a frequency response of 23hz to 120hz +/- 3db, does this mean that my sub won't pick up anything below 23hz?

curt c

06-14-05, 12:06 AM

Kevin,
Anything below 23hz will be more than 3db down. Measurements are very room dependent. Keep in mind you don't hear any frequencies below about 30hz at normal volumes.
Curt

DAlba

06-14-05, 02:55 AM

Does this mean they fixed the problem with discrete codes on newer Pronto remotes (TSU7000) too? Bruce??

Velodyne DD Subwoofer Series discrete commands are now available for owners of the URC MX-3000 remote control at:
<http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin/files/rcfiles.cgi?area=mx3000&db=devices&br=velodyne&dv=subwoofer&fc=>

Many thanks to Bruce Hall for shipping me a loaner master remote from which I learned the commands. Another example of Velodyne's constant efforts to provide outstanding service and support to its customers.

Chris Cargen

Kevin12586

06-14-05, 08:29 AM

Kevin,
Anything below 23hz will be more than 3db down. Measurements are very room dependent. Keep in mind you don't hear any frequencies below about 30hz at normal volumes.
Curt

But you do FEEL them :D

No problem, just curious, thanks Curt

MrHifi

06-14-05, 08:52 AM

Kevin,

Actually, what happens is that your brain perceives something troubling. A sustained oscillation in the range of 10Hz-18Hz will cause nausea and vomitting. If you wish to test your sub's effective low frequency performance, this is a very good way to check. Just so I do not get in trouble----Do not try this unless you are prepared for the consequences. Also, wear some ear protection and make sure your amplifier will not melt down at these frequencies with sustained tones. This will cause structural damage. Lastly, do not try it using a speaker with less than an 18-30" driver that can handle enormous amounts of power. Actually, a better way to get the type of visceral response we are discussing is to use the large panel exciters that give you a feeling rather than a sound. A typical installation would require placement of a chair on top of a wooden platform to which is attached several of these shakers.

cargen

06-14-05, 10:19 AM

Does this mean they fixed the problem with discrete codes on newer Pronto remotes (TSU7000) too? Bruce??

I'll try to answer on Bruce's behalf:

I believe that Pronto users can cross utilize MX-3000 rcc component files to learn commands for Pronto remotes. I read this somewhere, but have never programmed a Pronto.

The only command that I was not able to learn on to the posted MX-3000 rcc file was Preset "3. Pop/Rock". [The "work around" remedy I use to access the Pop/Rock settings is via the "5. Custom" button, with the on screen Custom column values reset with the Pop/Rock settings.]

Chris Cargen

Omen

06-14-05, 11:13 AM

Hi,

I have a Velodyne HGS-15 that I bought in 1999. In the past day or so, the sub started making a thumping noise (about 2 beats per second). Even with the input to the sub disconnected, this thumping still occurs, and gets louder as I increase the sub's volume.

Unfortunately, the HGS-15's pretty much unuseable as it is. I'm thinking about taking it to an authorized repair center (Tweeter, in my area) to have a look at it, but if the problem is a serious one (and naturally costs a bundle to fix), I may be better of buying a new sub with new tech, etc.

Before I lug this ~100 lb beast to the service center, does anyone have an idea what might be wrong with it? Or is there anything else I could try to correct the problem myself?

Thanks for any input.

Addendum - I just called Tweeter, and they don't actually fix it there, they send it back to Velodyne. I'll need to pay $50 deposit and they'll take care of the transportation and the communication between me and Velodyne. The problem with this scenario is that I won't know the total cost to fix my HGS-15 until Velodyne get their hands on it. If it's $800 to fix (pulling that number out of a hat), then I think I would be better off buying a new sub. But I've spent all this time lugging the HGS-15 to Tweeter and waiting the 4-6 weeks for the final verdict. That's what I'm trying to avoid with my post here.

curt c

06-14-05, 01:32 PM

scottielee

06-14-05, 03:20 PM

hi, just curious, is the dd-12 entirely made in the usa? i didn't see it mentioned in the back of one.
thanks.
scottie

jrannison

06-14-05, 03:48 PM

Art...........

AT those low frequencies it is best to use a Vibration Shaker like we use to do for qualification testing of mechanical designs.
Our small shaker would go down to 5 Hz @ about 3Gs. It was driven with a 8Kw class D amp.
Now talk about pounding nails out of the walls :D

By the way I just ordered the 1812 that you mentioned above. I have always enjoyed the 1812 and not just for the Cannons!

MrHifi

06-14-05, 04:21 PM

JRannison,

those are what I was referring to. i've seen them in the wholesale parts catalogs for less than $50.00. Enjoy the 1812!!!!!!!!1

Omen

06-14-05, 04:27 PM

Hi,
Please call Velodyne Service at; (408) 465-2851. You will only need to send in the amplifier. It comes right out. The repair will be a (small) fraction of what you mention and it should be like new.
Sorry for your trouble.
Curt

Thanks for your quick reply Curt! I'll call Velodyne Service first thing tomorrow. I'd be great that I wouldn't have to send to whole sub back to Velodyne.

jdallen23

06-14-05, 05:07 PM

I have searched this thread regarding "crossovers" and "cascading" and have seen a few responses but I just wanted to go ahead and ask my question in hopes of possibly getting an answer. My HT reciever has speaker settings of Large and Small with cutoff frequencies of 100, 150, and 200hz.

So to see if I am understanding correctly, the best place to start with setting up my HT/Audio playback system would be to set the settings for all my speakers at small and then set the x-over freq at 100hz in the reciever?

Secondly, what would be the benefit of using both crossovers together? I read that to avoid a problem with 'cascading' I use one crossover at one frequency and the other a bit higher (ie: Receiver at 100hz and Sub set at 120hz). Can you give a brief explanation of what this will accomplish?

For reference if needed:

The Energy C-1's listed frequency response is +/-2db @ 53-23Khz
The Energy C-C1 listed frequency response is +/-2db @ 50-23Khz

~edit:

My DVD player also has a speaker setting size of large and small, should I just set these to large so that all of the signal is being sent to my receiver for decoding inside it? I am sending the signal via a digital coax.

Thanks in advance!!!

curt c

06-14-05, 05:27 PM

Hi,
With your equipment and choices I would call all speakers "small" and use the 100hz crossover. I would "bypass" the subwoofers crossover. Taking the subwoofer's crossover higher than 100hz would accomplish the same more or less. Usually there's no advantage to using cascade crossovers unless you want a steeper slope or in your case crossing over below 100hz. Generally unless you understand crossovers and their effects, it's best to use the receivers crossover and "bypass" or turn up the subwoofer's crossover. I would leave the DVD player at "large". If you'd like to get more in-depth information on crossovers, give me a call.
Curt (480) 595-7141

jdallen23

06-14-05, 08:13 PM

Thank you for the helpful and timely response. I will try these selections out and see how they do. Your company makes a great product that has give me quite a few years of enjoyment, as I am sure you can tell by the model #. I think it's best that I leave the subwoofer's crossover bypassed like you recommend. I understand "the basics" of crossovers and for me at this point in time, that is all I need to know. :p Thank you for the option to contacting you personally though.

I believe I'm going to put in and order for a Subdude this week as I live in an apt. complex with wooden floors and I have heard that this should help to clean things up a little, along with making my neighbors a bit happier.

FYI I have had no issues with this sub since day 1. I will be upgrading in the future once we step up to a house where I can have a "dedicated" A/V room. I'll definately consider Velodyne when purchasing again.

Again, thanks for the great product and thanks for the support!

The Rang

06-14-05, 09:18 PM

The local dealer is blowing out the SPLII series at truly stupid prices :)

My question is:

The 1200 is 19% more expensive than the 1000 (difference about $179CDN)
(Retail is $1999 vs. $1749, or about 13% diff.)

Have auditioned the 1200 and I like it but maybe the 10" will be sufficient in my 1700cf room, and tighter to boot. Maybe put that money towards cabling and or an inexpensive HDMI DVD player. Or is bigger truly better?

This pricing has ruled any thoughts I may have had about the Seismic.

curt c

06-14-05, 09:24 PM

IMHO, it's a "no brainer". Bigger is truly better! Money well spent.
Curt

The Rang

06-14-05, 09:46 PM

IMHO, it's a "no brainer". Bigger is truly better! Money well spent.
Curt

Not a surprising answer.

In retrospect probably a dumb question ;)

What's another $179, eh?

Hope the 12 is till there. Will have to take an early lunch and camp out at the dealer's door for opening.

Am curious though...

The 1000 has the same amp, same magnet structure. It would appear just a bigger face to the woofer, slighty bigger cabinet and 2hz according to the specs.
Does it make that big of a difference?

flyingvee

06-14-05, 10:02 PM

Just purchased an SPL1200, a couple weeks ago. Discovered this thread half an hour ago, have only gotten to page 6, so apologies if you have answered my question too many times.

Firstly, I have used Magnaplaners for over 20 years; while they are a superb speaker that begs for a sub, I have resisted because I have never found one at even a semi-affordable price that blended seemlessly with my beloved Tympanis. So before I go any further, HUGE kudos to you - your sub works and sounds amazing with my Magnapan 3.5rs. When things are right, I can't even tell there is a sub - I can just feel it.

My question/and problem are as follow:
1. Is there any good way to set the level of the sub? I am getting very tired of running back and forth, tweaking the volume level, only to go back two songs later and tweak it the other way.

2. and this may be related to above - I am using a Rotel 1065 as a pre/pro, feeding my Mesa Baron and the Maggies. I am currently running the Rotel with an 80 Hz crossover, and running the Velo full-range. I have also tried, as reccomended in the manual, running the amp with a 120 HZ crossover, and the Velo at 80. Have also considered, but not tried, just running the pre full range, running pre out to the Velo, and letting the sub's crossover do all the work. Could you PLEASE let me know what combination/setting is likely to give the most consistent results. Bearing in mind that my only concern is how it sounds for two channel stereo playback. I want to enhance my Maggies, not have some artificial thumping.

Thanks for all your time and help; should you ever need another testimonial as to the amazing sound of your subs, please feel free. :)

curt c

06-14-05, 10:46 PM

Jon,
I have often used Maggies, and always with a Velodyne.
1) No easy answer since different recording engineers record bass level differently. If I don't have remote control capability, I usually find a level that works fairly well for most material and then just change it occasionally.
2) Strickly a matter of opinion, or preference. I usually filter the Maggies to avoid "bass slap" but many prefer running the Maggies full range and augmenting with the Velodyne. In audio there are many times when there is no "right answer". I would experiment and see what sounds best to you, in your room.
My recent experience has been with the 1.6's. Maybe some other Maggie users will provide some opinions and input.
Curt

flyingvee

06-14-05, 11:59 PM

Thanks for quick response; that's pretty much what I've been doing, had just "hoped" that there indeed was a "right" answer. Or at least a good starting point :( Guess I'll have to bring down the rta, and see what that says. But gotta say, when they are dialed in to the recording, etc, they are stupendous. I just picked up a "new" cd - from the 70's, just released on cd, so no enhancements - I could clearly feel the kick drum in the small of my back, but there was absolutely no mud. Amazing. It is a rare performance, or even recording session, where things are that perfect.

Jake Sm

06-15-05, 10:18 AM

curt,
I've been thinking that, with the ability of the DD series to be VERY flat , low distortion, fast , tight , and, in short, musical across a wide frequency range, I might rethink my need for floorstanders over bookshelf/monitors.....Can you offer more personal opinions or observations in advance of my testing in this regard?

curt c

06-15-05, 11:06 AM

Hi Jake,
Unless the room is quite large, I would look for a really good two way speaker (monitor/bookshelf) with response to 60hz or below. It's usually easier to deal with one bass driver, the subwoofer in this case. In larger rooms you often need multiple subs or other large bass drivers supporting each other.
Curt

curt c

06-15-05, 11:10 AM

I just picked up a "new" cd - from the 70's, just released on cd, so no enhancements - I could clearly feel the kick drum in the small of my back, but there was absolutely no mud. Amazing. It is a rare performance, or even recording session, where things are that perfect.

Jon,
Don't keep me in suspense. What's the CD? Sounds like one I should own.
Curt

mailiang

06-15-05, 11:30 AM

hi, just curious, is the dd-12 entirely made in the usa? i didn't see it mentioned in the back of one.
thanks.
scottie

If you go on the Velodyne offical site and take their tour, you will see that they manufacture their subs from the ground up at their plant in California:

http://www.velodyne.com/velodyne/about/factory.aspx?sid=116u372q

Ian ;)

flyingvee

06-15-05, 12:02 PM

Jon,
Don't keep me in suspense. What's the CD? Sounds like one I should own.
Curt

One of my fav old bands, which I actually got to hang with some - Mason Proffit, finally managed to get their 3rd album onto cd - "Last Night I Had the Strangest Dream." Country rock, biased towards country, with nice pedal steel and banjo, no fiddle. If you get a chance, listen to "24-Hour Sweetheart." Best kick I've heard in years. They were a bunch of long-haired hippies, into protest songs, etc, (their only big hit was "Two Hangman,") but everything that wasn't a protest song was about being on the road.

curt c

06-15-05, 12:27 PM

Jon,
I'll definitely try to find it. Sounds like good stuff!
Curt

Jake Sm

06-15-05, 01:31 PM

Curt, what's a minivee?

curt c

06-15-05, 02:15 PM

Hi Jake,
The MiniVee is our new high technology offering in a compact subwoofer. It features a Kevlar reinforced 8" driver and our class D, 1000 watt amplifier. This subwoofer will provide superb performance for small home theater and music installations up to about 2000 cubic feet. We have just started shipping and the data will be on our website next week. At $799 (street price), it's entry level into the real high-tech compact subwoofer arena. The dimensions are; H/W/D, 10"X10.4"X12.75".
Thanks for asking and sorry for the delay on the website.
Curt

Jake Sm

06-15-05, 03:18 PM

how will it compete with carver's and def tec's units?

curt c

06-15-05, 04:19 PM

Hi Jake,
I sent you a PM. IMO the Velodyne compact high-tech subwoofers are the best available, period. I've been involved with subwoofers for many, many years. I am fortunate to work for Velodyne because (IMO) they are the best. In the end the consumer must choose. We hope they choose Velodyne or at least give us a test ride.
Thanks,
Curt

ontheinside

06-16-05, 01:50 AM

how will it compete with carver's and def tec's units?
Not even close. I upgraded from a True sub to a DD-12. Before I had the True sub I owned a Def 15".
:D

tweeterex

06-16-05, 07:27 AM

I think he was refering to a new sub that is coming out soon, not the DD's

mikety

06-16-05, 09:49 AM

curt c

06-16-05, 10:12 AM

jedi29

06-16-05, 06:39 PM

Hi Curt,
Would you please post the MSRP of the new SPL - 1200R subwoofer.
Thanks, as it would be a big help !!
Gary

curt c

06-16-05, 07:01 PM

Hi Gary,
List price is $1899. By shopping around you should be able to find it for "street price" of $1499. These are the same prices as the previous SPL-1200II. You now get all the new features; auto eq, presets, power on/off, volume up/down and more all controlled by a small hand held remote for the same price! Still available in black gloss, cherry and maple finishes.
Curt

jedi29

06-16-05, 09:23 PM

Hi Curt,
Thank you for clearing that up ;)
I was unsure as to the exact MSRP.
So far there have been none to be found , but I hope that will change soon.
I did download the manual , and it realy looks like it would suit my needs, as long as it`s not a boomy sub and being a sealed enclosure I`m sure that it sounds tight.
I thank you again for all your help , I`m sure that helped a lot of people and the info that you provide as well as taking the time to do it is, IMHO a great testament to both your integrity as well as Velodyne as a company that will stand by what it sells.
Thanks again for all your post and help !!
Gary

curt c

06-17-05, 12:03 AM

Gary,
Thanks for the kind words. Much appreciated.
I must say I'm totally impressed with the new SPL-R series. Bruce did a superb job with the software in a very short time. Our engineers worked long and hard to make it all come together.
Again thanks from the Velodyne team.
Curt

tonydeluce

06-17-05, 01:58 AM

I am trying to make a decision between the DD-15 and the HSX-15 and the price
difference is a consideration. With the Odyssey EQ on the Denon 4806 / 5805
serve a similiar function as the built in EQ on the DD-15?

I also noticed the specs of the DD-15 extending down to 15Hz and the HSX-15
only extends down to 18Hz - is this true? I thought that the HSX-15 was basically
the DD-15 with EQ.

I would appreciate any help offered...

tonydeluce

06-17-05, 01:59 AM

I meant I thought that the HSX-15 was basically
the DD-15 without EQ in the above post.

curt c

06-17-05, 11:27 AM

Hi Tony,
I have no experience with the Denon's auto eq. I know none of the receivers auto-eq are as elaborate or technically sophisticated in the bass section as the Velodyne. We provide eight bands of parametric eq just for the bass section. As for the discrepancy in the frequency response (15/18hz) between the DD-15 and HGS-15X, I suspect we didn't update the number for the HGS-15X when we went with the improved driver designed for the DD-15. The HGS-15X uses the same driver. I'll check with the engineers and update the spec for the HGS-15X. Another important advantage with the DD, is the ability to "tune" the digital servo circuit for more output or extreme accuracy. The HGS-15X has the analog servo circuit.
Thanks,
Curt

tonydeluce

06-17-05, 02:50 PM

Thanks Curt,

I guess I can live with the DD-15 EQ as long as the HGS-15X extends downs to 15 Hz like
the DD-15 and is of the same quality. The HGS-15X seems like a great sub for the price.

Thanks again,

Tony

tonydeluce

06-17-05, 03:02 PM

Curt, once you verify with engineers that the HGS-15X extends down
to 15 Hz, would you please let me know. Thanks, Tony

MrHifi

06-17-05, 04:27 PM

Tony,

You are splitting hairs. 13 Hz or 15 Hz ... My God man not even the instruments can resolve that. Your ears or body wouldn't know either. Curt, you're a Saint.

tonydeluce

06-17-05, 05:35 PM

Mr Hifi,

You are correct, most humans cannot hear below 20Hz but that is not
the point. My question is regarding 15 Hz vs. 18 Hz and I am interested
in it for various reasons. 1) The DD-15 is one hell of a sub and if the
HGX-15X is the same drive, etc, without the MultiEQ then it is one hell of
a sub at that price. Additionally, if the sub can perform at 15 Hz it is more
likely to have a flatter response at 20Hz on up.

I recommend before spouting off drool in the future, you consider the
person asking the question may have valid reasons for asking. Thanks!

curt c

06-17-05, 06:25 PM

Hi,
Let's be kind. Human hearing for all practical purposes stops around 30hz, not 20. If you think you're hearing 20hz from a speaker chances are it's (2nd harmonic) 40hz. Our engineers agree the bottom extension on both is about the same. I would hate to see you make a decision on the difference between 15hz vs. 18hz, even if it existed. I would look at the features and how valuable they would be for the additional expense.
Thanks,
Curt

slick316

06-17-05, 06:39 PM

I was wondering about the new Velodyne SPL-R subwoofers, and what the differences between the "R" and my SPL Series II are?
I know the the "R" has the auto EQ and setup mic with wireless remote, is that all the major stuff?

tonydeluce

06-17-05, 08:08 PM

Thanks Curt,

If I understand you correctly, both the DD-15 and the HGS-15X extend down
to 15 Hz? I am pretty sure I will be going with the HGS-15X unless there
is some other major feature besides the MultiEQ on the DD-15 that I
can take advantage of.

Thanks again,

Tony

shadow 8

06-17-05, 08:27 PM

slick316

06-17-05, 08:33 PM

I saw this question posted earlier on this thread,but saw no answer. Is it wiser to get the now discontinued SPL 1200 and buy a Velo parametric EQ later this summer or get the new 1200 R model with the 6 band EQ. It seems that the parametric would be better and more adaptable. Which route is better? BTW, when is the Velo parametric EQ coming out and how much will it be? Curt? :)

what is this Velo parametric EQ you speak of? a seperate EQ made for velodyne subs?

The Rang

06-17-05, 08:39 PM

I saw this question posted earlier on this thread,but saw no answer. Is it wiser to get the now discontinued SPL 1200 and buy a Velo parametric EQ later this summer or get the new 1200 R model with the 6 band EQ. It seems that the parametric would be better and more adaptable. Which route is better? BTW, when is the Velo parametric EQ coming out and how much will it be? Curt? :)

Good point.
I just bought a brand new SPL1200II on clearance (incredible price:))

A parametric would likely be more useful and versatile than the built in EQ.

I had an SAE parametric EQ in the 80's. The only audio component I wish I'd kept. Way more flexible than a graphic.

curt c

06-17-05, 11:05 PM

Hi All,
The SMS-1 (separate component) will be out sometime in the Aug/Sept time frame. We are projecting a price of $500. It will have the features of the DD series subs which among other things includes an eight band parametric equalization system. Yes it will offer more flexibility than the SPL-R subwoofers. It will be a great addition to any quality subwoofer.
Hope this answers your questions.
Curt

kalin02

06-17-05, 11:20 PM

now i'm more confused than i was yesterday! i'm thinking of waiting for the spl-r but if the sms-1 module is more flexible i may have to get a spl2 now and wait for the sms. two questions, when does the spl-r hit the street and does the sms-1 have an auto configuration mode?

tweeterex

06-18-05, 08:28 AM

spl-r's are out now, the sms-1's in sept....and I thought Bruce Hall said $600- $700 for the sms-1?

curt? how sure are you on that price?

shadow 8

06-18-05, 08:29 AM

curt c

06-18-05, 12:16 PM

spl-r's are out now, the sms-1's in sept....and I thought Bruce Hall said $600- $700 for the sms-1?

curt? how sure are you on that price?

Hi,
Okay, since projections don't always happen, I'll play it safe and say - "Price to be Determined"
Thanks,
Curt

shadow 8

06-18-05, 01:51 PM

spl-r's are out now, the sms-1's in sept....and I thought Bruce Hall said $600- $700 for the sms-1?

curt? how sure are you on that price?

To my knowledge, Bruce never said any such thing on this forum. Do you have a quote you can show us regarding the price?

tweeterex

06-18-05, 02:20 PM

It was during a personal conversation with him a couple of weeks ago.

mikety

06-19-05, 06:57 AM

Hi,
I guess you are referring to the CHT-12 (or CHT-12R) subwoofer. The crossover point is determined by the speakers you are using, not the subwoofer. If you are using our CHT satellites then 100hz would be better than 80hz. A general guide is if your speakers have a 6 1/2" woofer or larger then 80hz is fine. If the speakers woofer is smaller than 6 1/2" go with 100hz or even higher if available.
Thanks,
CurtHi Curt, i am using velo cht-12R and Mission 783 floor stands , 3-way reflex speakers(6 ohms) sensitivity 90db, frequency responce 38hz-20kHz, partnered with Onkyo txnr-900, my fronts are set to small as you suggested but am still confused as to what crossover best suits my hardware? my fronts cone measures about 5.25 inches, what is thumb rule for crossovers? ... :rolleyes: :) Thanks in advance !!!

curt c

06-19-05, 09:24 AM

Hi,
While there are no "real" rules, one recommendation that seems to make sense is double the bottom rating, 38hz in your case. So that comes out about 80hz. Most manufacturers are using small woofers now and rating them below what they may be capable of playing with any volume. Your speakers have small woofers and will perform best not having to play the lower bass, so call them "small", crossover at 80hz and let the sub take care of the bass.
Curt

kalin02

06-19-05, 03:16 PM

will the sms-1 be capable of auto calibration? if so does that include setting the phase along with the output level? i have no idea how to correctly use a parametric eq to get the flattest response so i need something that is user friendly.

curt c

06-19-05, 03:29 PM

Hi,
Yes the SMS-1 will have the same auto-eq capability as the DD's with 2.0 software. Any phase or level changes would be done manually via the remote. Even manual equalization is quite easy as you can see the corrections you're making on the video display.
Thanks,
Curt

AsahiToro

06-19-05, 03:37 PM

Curt,

Thanks for your input on the SMS-1. Do you know the dimensions of the unit (without any rack handles)? What color is it BTW?

Thanks,

Scott

curt c

06-19-05, 03:51 PM

Scott,
It's black. Don't have exact dimensions handy. I can get them next week.
Curt

tweeterex

06-19-05, 04:01 PM

Let's be kind. Human hearing for all practical purposes stops around 30hz, not 20. If you think you're hearing 20hz from a speaker chances are it's (2nd harmonic) 40hz. Our engineers agree the bottom extension on both is about the same. I would hate to see you make a decision on the difference between 15hz vs. 18hz, even if it existed. I would look at the features and how valuable they would be for the additional expense

No offense to anyone but these "mine goes to eleven" numbers game at this 15 vs 18 level is where the objectivist bs gets me laughing. :)

kalin02

06-19-05, 08:10 PM

i didn't think of this until now but i have another noob question; how does a parametric eq function and how does it differ from the one used in the spl-r? also, what are the pros and cons of each (parametric vs. six band graphic eq) ? i've already figured out that since the parametric eq has more options as far as possible settings its more likely that someone like myself will find it easier to screw up. sorry for the stupid questions but i'd hate to buy something that is overkill for my needs, past, present and future.

curt c

06-19-05, 08:50 PM

The SPL-R has 6 bands of auto-eq and they are fixed. A parametric eq can be adjusted to different frequencies and you can adjust the bell (curve) of the frequencies. That is you could affect just a few frequencies (narrow) or many frequencies (broad). For instance 40-45hz would be narrow, whereas 40-60hz would be broad. Parametric eq's are obviously more flexible than a fixed band eq. Keep in mind that the DD series subs and the SMS-1 will also have auto-eq as well as manual parametric. With the manual parametric, you can't really screw up, unless you want to. Anything you do can be undone and you see the changes and results in real time on the video. Not to worry!
Hope this helps.
Thanks,
Curt (480) 595-7141

curt c

06-20-05, 12:25 AM

Hi All,
I'm on a business trip until Thursday and may not have computer access until I return. So help each other out, there's a lot of knowledge and experience among you.
Thanks for you help and support.
Curt

vinodk

06-20-05, 10:14 AM

Hi Guys!
Please explain to me what exactly a Q value is. Does this effect the width of the band? Is the higher the number the greater the width effected?
Thanks.

John Kotches

06-20-05, 10:21 AM

Q is the Quality of the resonance. The larger the Q the narrower the band is, and the worse the resonance is.

Cheers,

vinodk

06-20-05, 11:01 AM

Thanks John! Does that mean that it is better to adjust EQ with smaller Q i.e. say value of 3 rather than fixed Q of 4.3 as used in DD's EQ? Seems like I have only scratched the surface on DD's EQ.

John Kotches

06-20-05, 12:22 PM

scottielee

06-20-05, 01:39 PM

i would greatly appreciate your knowledge of the average/normal wattage needed for a dd-12 for music playing at normal volume. i am trying not to get another power conditioner for the subwoofer. currently my amps, cd player, and plasma tv are sharing a running springs audio haley (1,800 watt output). i am hoping to squeeze in the dd-12 if it doesn't require too much power at normal volumes.
thanks!!!
scottie

BruceHall

06-20-05, 02:13 PM

I don't have any experience with v 1.0, but in 2.0, you can vary the Q. The answer as to what's better isn't always clear cut as every room is different.

You might be able to vary the Q in 1.0, I don't know about that at all.

Cheers,

Hi John,
Yes, you can vary the Q in earlier releases of the software. Just press the SELECT button while on the EQ you want to change the Q of, then use the SET +/- keys to change the Q.

Hope this helps,
Bruce

dtb300

06-20-05, 02:58 PM

I understand most of the features of the SMS-1 with its auto-EQ, parametric EQ, etc. but have a couple of other questions about it, if someone at Velodyne could answer for me.

I have a passive sub with an external power amp and and external xover unit - all three are seperate units.

Right now with my Xover sitting next to me in my rack, I am able to adjust the phase, Xover point and volume of my sub according to the needs of the current source I am playing. Usually I just have to boost/decrease the volume levels, and/or increase/decrease the Xover point to accomodate the low end quality/quantity of the source.

So question one is: After having the SMS-1 initially Auto-EQing my room, will I be able to manually adjust the volume and Xover point by using the remote to adjust for lacking or over-accentuated sources?

Question two is: My pre-amp has two line level outputs. I run one to my main amp/speakers to run them full range, and I run the other to my current Xover for the sub. I would hope that I can run the same setup, but using the SMS-1 in place of my current Xover. With the SMS-1 I would need RCA Left/Right input and RCA Summed/Mono Output. I would imagine this is possible, but wanted to ask to make sure.

Question three: Up to what frequency will the SMS-1 work to? I thought I remember reading 200Hz, but I could be wrong.

I hope I explained everything, if not please let me know. I am really looking forward to the release of the SMS-1 and the ability to do some room correction for low end frequecies.

Thanks...Dan

John Kotches

06-20-05, 03:03 PM

Bruce:

It doesn't help me much, but it does help those with version 1.x of DD who might not have known how to access the parametric EQ :)

Cheers,

metaldog99

06-20-05, 10:25 PM

shadow 8

06-21-05, 08:51 AM

Ths SPL IIs are being closed out at attractive prices at a number dealers. The SPL R is new and substantially more expensive.

jedi29

06-21-05, 10:21 PM

BruceHall

06-22-05, 11:19 AM

Hi Bruce,
On the new SPL-1200R , is there a big disadvantage to not using the EQ and the mike ?
Or is that something that needs to be done in order for the presets to function properly.
Many thanks,
Gary

Hi Gary,
The Auto-EQ function emits 12 sweep tones and sets a 6 band internal digital EQ based on room anomolies. Not using it is like having a sub without EQ, which for the most part would probably sound okay, but not as good as an EQ'd sub. However, if there were severe peaks or nulls in the room the differenece without the auto-EQ would be very noticable.

The presets work independantly of the auto-EQ. They each set volume, frequency countour, and subsonic filter according to the listening mode.

Hope this helps,
Bruce

scottielee

06-22-05, 01:25 PM

curt c

06-22-05, 02:31 PM

Hi Scottielee,
Under "normal" listening conditions in a "normal" size room, I would estimate the wattage draw to be 100-400 watts. Keep in mind for every 3db increase of volume you double the power required, so going from normal to loud can increase the draw dramatically.
Thanks,
Curt

curt c

06-22-05, 02:44 PM

My system is going to be installed in about a month and the current plan calls for 2 SPL-1200 II's (4000 cu ft room). Right now I'm thinking that SPL-1200R's is the better way to go, with more SPL and EQ. How would the EQ work with 2 subs, and are the 1200R's at the same price point as the 1200 II's? Earlier posts seem to indicate this, just wanted to confirm.

Or do I go with the 1200 IIs and add the SMS-1 when it becomes available later this year?

Thanks,

Phil

Hi Phil,
The SPL-R subs have the same price structure as the previous SPL-II's. The SPL-II's are now discounted as they are discontinued. If you were using two of the SPL-R's and they were not placed together, I would eq them one at a time and then perhaps do a final eq on one of them with both playing.
As to using two SPL-R's or two SPLII's and a SMS-1, that's a personal decision. Either way should provide great performance in your size room.
Thanks,
Curt

curt c

06-22-05, 02:53 PM

dtb300

06-22-05, 03:39 PM

1) Yes you can accomplish this by using the remote of the SMS-1.
2) Yes again, all that capability is included.
3) The crossover frequency goes to 199.

Curt...

Thanks for the reply and answers to my questions. Now I just have to wait until SMS-1 is released.....

Dan

metaldog99

06-22-05, 06:23 PM

Curt,

Thanks for the reply. I have yet to hear back from my installer regarding the SPL-R - if the subs are not going to be ordered for several more weeks, then perhaps he's going to go with the SPL-Rs anyway, if the II's have been discontinued.

Phil

scottielee

06-22-05, 06:45 PM

Thanks Curt!

jedi29

06-22-05, 11:01 PM

BruceHall

06-23-05, 01:07 AM

Thanks Bruce,
So using the auto "EQ" on the new spl`s , has nothing to do with responce as far as flatness. ? ?
I like to listen to everything at a flat setting , maybe it`s different for bass.
Thanks again,
Gary

Hi Gary,
Sorry, not what I meant - the auto-EQ certainly flattens the response. You asked about the presets and if they worked if the auto-EQ wasn't used, and they do (in that they will adjust settings for the music being played).

The "reference" or flat preset is 3 - Jazz/Classical.

Bruce

jedi29

06-23-05, 01:08 PM

Hi Bruce,
Thanks for the info , a great help :)
So by using the mic to set up the sub in it`s new home , it will give the best responce possible for either music or movies that go bang.
It will handle LFE a lot better than some of your older F series subs , right ?
Thanks again, you and Curt have been a great help :)
Gary

curt c

06-23-05, 01:34 PM

Gary,
Most will prefer flat response for music and some will want a little boost for movies, that's what the presets can do. As Bruce said preset 3 is flat response. Either way you're covered. The SPL's are much better suited for music and home theater than the F series, which did well on music as long as the correct size unit was used. Again with the SPL's it's very important to choose the correct size subwoofer. Our website (www.velodyne.com) offers information on selecting the proper size subwoofer.
Thanks for the feedback.
Curt

MrHifi

06-23-05, 03:57 PM

Curt,

Please explain how the SPL series is "better suited for music than the F series". Yes the SPL's are newer but my friend come on...you move the diaphram in the sealed box with an amplifier that is able to move the piston sufficiently within its linear range and you corrct it with feedback. Other than equalization of which you already have heard my opinion, how is my poor old F1800R II less suited to reproduce music and booms? I'm offended-- to say nothing of how the sub feels. I think I just heard a groan out of it or was that clipping? HaHa I think i digress. Seriously, how is it inferior?

curt c

06-23-05, 04:38 PM

Well Art you don't have a "real" F series. When I refer to the "F-series" I mean the older technology F's which were tens, twelves and fifteens. Your F-1800R (and later FSR-18) were the first new technology subs which were later renamed HGS's. So pat your sub on the head and explain it was exempted from my comments. The older technology F's did not have the robust long throw driver and powerful class "D" amp that you have. My mistake for not being clearer. Your sub can indeed do it all!
Curt

tonydeluce

06-23-05, 05:20 PM

Curt,

I just wanted to thank for your help. I just installed my Velodyne HGS-15X and
all I can say WOW!

I haven't heard the DD series but I can say this much - I have never heard a more
musically accurate subwoofer than can still provide the THUMP when needed!

Thanks again,

Tony

P.S. I don't know if I need the MultEQ since my HT room provides excellent
sound acoustics but does Velodyone offer an external MultEQ that can
be used with the HGS-15X? If not, is there another supplier that offers
one that will work?

curt c

06-23-05, 05:31 PM

Tony,
Great to hear the positive feedback. The SMS-1 should be available in the Sept/Oct time frame. It will provide the features of the DD series in a separate component. This is the one to wait for!
Curt

MrHifi

06-23-05, 07:15 PM

Wow, do I feel better Curt. When I told the Sub it got turned on and asked for a round with the 1812 recorded in Dolby Digital in some church with artificial canons added. It was so excited that my neighbor came to find out if I had felt the earthquake. Since my neighbor lives over 200 ft. from my house, I consider this a new achievement for the little woofer that could. Seriously though, I now remember that I waited to purchase this particular unit because of the higher wattage amp. Now that you guys got it working correctly, life is good. As I explained before, I bought this primarily to use as an LFE channel. That iss how I use it mostly. On rare occassions I will use it for low end reenforcement of bluegrass or 50's R&R or organ music from my Teac 6010 GSL R to R machine. Those old Command and Audio Fidelity tapes are amazing. Do you remember "Bongos, Bongos, Bongos" and "La Cumparsita" played on a Lowery Organ? It's hard to beat those 32Hz fundamentals. The F1800 loves them.

curt c

06-23-05, 07:30 PM

Art,
You've got me curious, I'm going to check my supply of reel tapes. That is if I can remember where I stored them.
You Take Care and Good Listening.
Curt

jedi29

06-23-05, 10:09 PM

Hi Curt,
Thanks ( again ) , I will be looking to get the SPL-1200R.
The "F" Series sub was the old F1200 , it was very good with music , but failed in a big way when it came to heavy duty LFE.
I always thought that it was because it had such a small ( 100 W ) amp.
Anyway back to my big ?
Will the new SPL-1200R fail me when it comes to movies like "Attack of the Clones" , like the part when Padme``s ship blows up at the beginning of the movie ?
From read all that I could about my old sub verses the new SPL`s , it seems like the old F sub`s were not realy made for ( dvd`s were not invented yet ! ) LEF and the punch that follows, am I correct in my research ?
Thanks,
Gary

curt c

06-24-05, 01:29 PM

Gary,
As I stated before, it's about the correct size subwoofer for the room and any openings into other rooms. We need to load the total cubic displacement. You may need a larger subwoofer than a SPL. The SPL series are compact subwoofers designed for small to medium rooms. Yes the older F's were primarily designed for music.
Provide me your room measurements (HXWXD) including any openings into other rooms and the size of those rooms. Or give me a call at 480-595-7141 and we can discuss the whole situation and perhaps other options.
Thanks,
Curt

jedi29

06-24-05, 02:31 PM

Thanks Curt , you have a "P.-M." reguarding room size ect.
Take care :cool:
Gary

tonydeluce

06-25-05, 04:45 PM

Just a note on the volume control / volume level for the HGS-15X.

I have about a 4000 cubic foot family room ( used primary as
a HT ) which opens to a 3000 cubic foot kitchen. I had the volume
control in the 12 0'clock position and found that peak bass moments
on some movies were so instense they rattled my windows.

I have turned the volume down to the 9 o'clock position
so that I don't end up with a broken window!

I have the subwoofer placed in the front corner furtherest
away from the opening to the kitchen.

dc00

06-25-05, 09:57 PM

I posted the following in earlier in the subwoofer forum and was suggested to post it here and ask Curt for help...

============
Just bought a Velodyne DPS-10. But no matter what I do, I can't get any sound out of it.

First I tried to connect the subwoofer output jack (one cable) of my receiver to the LFE input on the woofer. Then I tried to connect the speaker input/output terminals. Nothing worked. Now I'm not sure if this is a bad unit. Can someone tell if I did anything wrong? (I did turn up the woofer volume.)

My receiver is a Pioneer VSX-D811S.

===========

I've exhausted all combinations of settings in the receiver and wiring options. What else can I try? Is there an easy way to test if the woofer works?

Thanks,
Dennis

tweeterex

06-25-05, 10:08 PM

check the settings on the receiver?

MrHifi

06-26-05, 07:12 AM

Try putting your finger on the center lead of a wire plugged into the line in jack. Turn the volume to 12:00. You should get blown out of the room. If not, keep your finge on the wire and start flipping switches. No sound? Send the amp in for repair.

curt c

06-26-05, 07:34 PM

Dennis,
Often the receiver isn't programmed correctly. Some won't send info to the subwoofer jack when playing a CD unless you program your speakers as "small" in speaker setup. You could also try hooking up a CD player directly into the two input jacks of the subwoofer. Turn the sub off and volume down first. Start playing the CD and turn the subwoofer on and slowly raise the volume. You should hear bass coming from the subwoofer. If not, it's defective and you should return it to the dealer for an exchange.
Thanks,
Curt

dc00

06-26-05, 10:29 PM

Thanks for the suggestions. I finally figured out what's wrong after I opened up the front cover and saw a big round hole. Yes, a subwoofer with nothing inside. What an experience!

curt c

06-26-05, 11:40 PM

I assume you returned (or will) for a replacement. Did you purchase it new from a dealer? Was it a sealed box or not. I'm sorry you had this experience and am very concerned how it may have happened. If I can be of any assistance please let me know. Any information would be very helpful.
Thanks,
Curt

Kevin12586

06-27-05, 09:36 AM

BruceHall

06-27-05, 10:10 AM

I have a question about the 5000R (and I guess your other subs that don't have a volume knob). If the power goes out, does the sub 'remember' where the volume was set or does it return back to 'default'?

Hi Kevin,
There is a memory chip inside the sub that remembers the volume. Each time you change the volume, the value is stored in permanent memory and recalled at power up.

Hope this helps,
Bruce

Kevin12586

06-27-05, 11:19 AM

Thanks Bruce, I was afraid I would have to recalibrate whenever the power goes out. :)

By the way, the 5000R is a great sub. After having it for a few weeks in my over 6000 cubic foot basement I am more than happy with it. I may add another sub at a later date, but the 5000R gives me no reason to worry about it now.

tonydeluce

06-27-05, 03:32 PM

Is there a partcular subwoofer cable/s that you can recommend for use with the
HGS-15X. I am looking for a high-end cable 12 feet in length with a built-in
Y.

Thanks,

Tony

BruceHall

06-27-05, 03:49 PM

MrHifi

06-27-05, 04:44 PM

curt c

06-27-05, 05:25 PM

Is there a partcular subwoofer cable/s that you can recommend for use with the
HGS-15X. I am looking for a high-end cable 12 feet in length with a built-in
Y.

Thanks,

Tony

Hi Tony,
I sent you a PM.
Curt

mooney

06-27-05, 05:37 PM

Small VS Large for speaker setting

My 2600cuft HT has Energy C7 w/3 ea 5 1/2" drivers for L & R and 2ea 61/2" in C-C3 center.

I have a ST1000 II and the installer used "large" when setting up my marantz 8400 receiver. Also used 80HZ. The subs level control is set for about 3/4.

Are these the reccommended settings?

curt c

06-27-05, 05:53 PM

Bob,
There won't be universal agreement on this but I would start by calling all your speakers "small" and cross over at 80hz, assuming you have a proper size subwoofer. I don't like to see small drivers doing long excursions while also trying to play upper bass and midrange. They may also interfere with the subwoofer which is better equippted to play the bass. If you mean you have a SPL-1000II, I would make sure you're using a "Y" splitter into both inputs and raise the volume for the subwoofer jack in your receiver. You need to back off on the volume of the Velodyne. Try to keep it no higher than half way.
Probably the best advice would be try both methods (small vs large) and see what sounds best to you.
Thanks,
Curt

dc00

06-27-05, 10:03 PM

Curt, I have PM'ed you the serial number of the subwoofer. Thanks.

mooney

06-27-05, 10:22 PM

curt c

06-27-05, 10:28 PM

Bob,
A "Y" splitter is a device that connects to the end of your "rca" connector cable at the subwoofer end. It's called a "one female, two male Y splitter" You then connect the two (male) ends into both "rca" input jacks of the subwoofer. It will provide more input voltage to the sub so you can lower the volume some on the Velodyne. It runs about $4. at Radio Shack.
Curt

Kevin12586

06-28-05, 08:24 AM

scottielee

06-28-05, 10:01 AM

hi Curt,
just received my new dd-12 last night. i can't seem to get the sweep tone to be sent to my amps and have the sub respond to the tone simultaneously. under manual eq (12345), only my main speakers respond to the sweep (no response from sub even after adjusting volume). under auto eq (321), only the sub respond to the sweep. please help! (setup: sub eq line out -> tv line in + tv amp line out -> amps line in)

the main and sub do respond together beautifully when playing music (setup: cd player line out -> sub line input + sub thru out -> amps line in).

thanks in advance.
scottie

curt c

06-28-05, 10:56 AM

Scottie,
The DD setup will not work in your system. You will need to get at least a preamp with input capability. The sub eq outputs must be routed to an input device first. If you have 2.0 software you could do "self eq" for your system. You might want to give me a call.
Curt (480) 595-7141

curt c

06-28-05, 11:05 AM

Bob or Curt:

How do I know if I am at 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 or full on my sub volume? Does the blinking light let me know in some way?

Also, based on your previous comments, I will get better output by using a 'Y' splitter at my sub?

Hi,
The previous advice was for a different subwoofer than you have. I'm assuming you have a DPS or DLS subwoofer. Here's a guide that will help you know where your volume is. To reset, press 1-2-3-4 and then 4-3-2-1. That will take the sub to "reset" which is volume '30' of a possible '100'. Every quick touch up or down will change the volume number by 2. So one touch up would be number '32'. A "Y" is optional on your subwoofer.
Hope this helps.
Curt

BruceHall

06-28-05, 12:01 PM

Bruce,

Your mention of a "slot" to Kevin set me to wondering about Velodyne's design philosophy. My F-1800 II whose 600 watt amp's power supply you recently repair appears to be a sealed enclosure powered by a 600 watt Class D switching amp. Are the HGS series bass reflex units or are they also sealed. Is the 5000R Kevin owns a bass reflex unit?

Would you care to elaborate on how the company decides whether to use a ported or sealed enclosure?

I've designed a few speakers over the years and found that ported designs always seem to require "tuning" in order to eliminate that unwanted cabinet resonance that seems to re-enforce frequencies right around the drivers free air resonance, typically around 40-60Hz. Of course some folks like that but without your feedback producing servo loop it would sound boomy. The sealed cabinet allows you to bypass the critical cabinet tuning at the expense of max SPL. I'm just curious how you decide which design to use and if and how you "tune" the ported enclosures. I'm just curious and if it is explained somewhere already just refer me there. The last thing I want to do is create more work for you.

Hi Art,
Some call it "work" others call it "job security" ;)

I agree with you that we are a company who places accuracy over max SPL. However, products for different markets require different design philosophies.

A comedian once said, "If the black box survives the crash, why not make the whole plane of that material?" The answer of course is because the plane would be too expensive to produce and too heavy to fly. Likewise as we look at different market requirements we use designs to optimize the price performance ratio. If we could put 3,000 watts of power, a huge magnet, a sealed enclosure and a digital servo out for $200 we would, but it just ain't possible! :p

For the most part we use bass reflex designs for products under $1000 because we are looking for more output from a less expensive drive train. These all indeed have the peaks at 40 - 60 that you reference. However, since they are DSP controlled it makes it easy to put in cuts where needed to flatten out the response and get rid of the boom. Not to mention putting in boosts down low where needed to give added impact. In the case of DLS-R/DPS, there is a 2 dB cut at about 56 that smoothes out the response. This filter was arrived at after trying literally hundreds of combinations of boosts, cuts, and gain compression variables, which is incredibly easy to do with the DSP (unlike analog designs that make you wear out a soldering gun to try different combinations).

Of course, the most accurate designs are sealed servo units. They are also the priciest because they need the most amp power and magnet structure. We also strive for small boxes too in order to accommodate room decor needs. Tradeoffs, tradeoffs!!

Hope this helps,
Bruce

BTW: HGS: Sealed. DD: Sealed. SPL (all types): Sealed. F Series (all types): Sealed. DLS-R/DPS: Bass reflex (slot). VRP: Rear Port. VX: Rear Port.

theranman

06-28-05, 12:12 PM

and good tradeoffs they are!

I just LUUUV small subwoofers...genus: subwooferus minisculus :)

turls

06-28-05, 02:35 PM

I just got the DPS as well, very pleased so far. How good is the subwoofer at keeping volume settings during power outages? I'm obviously not going to hook the subwoofer to a UPS, but I should not normally have more than short outages.

The previous advice was for a different subwoofer than you have. I'm assuming you have a DPS or DLS subwoofer. Here's a guide that will help you know where your volume is. To reset, press 1-2-3-4 and then 4-3-2-1. That will take the sub to "reset" which is volume '30' of a possible '100'. Every quick touch up or down will change the volume number by 2. So one touch up would be number '32'.

curt c

06-28-05, 02:44 PM

Matt,
A memory chip will hold the volume setting during outages.
Curt

Exocer

06-28-05, 03:39 PM

Hi guys, I have a question about my Velodyne DPS-10's High pass crossover to my bookshelf speakers. Here is my setup:

Onkyo Tx 800 - 2 Channel stereo receiver
Velodyne DPS-10 hook up via speaker-level inputs
Infinity Primus 150 Bookshelf speakers hooked up to DPS-10's Amp (speaker-level out)

Now, to my understanding, the subwoofer is supposed to cross-over the bookshelf speakers at 80hz. In music, the Primus's drivers move violently at the very deep sections, reacting as if they're trying to play as deep as the subwoofer. Also, I have some test tones. From about 20hz-29hz and 30-39hz, the bookshelf speakers are actually playing along with the sub. Why are they trying to play these frequencies below their cutoff? Is my setup flawed somewhere or will i have to settle for this until I get an A/V receiver? Is the high pass crossover adjustable somehow?

mailiang

06-28-05, 06:22 PM

What is the low frequency extension of your infinitys? Normally the crossover point should be approximately one and a half times above that.

Ian

curt c

06-28-05, 06:38 PM

Exocer

06-28-05, 09:47 PM

mailiang, its 68hz - 3db, so an 80hz xover should be perfect.

curt c, you are awesome, thanks a lot. Will be in touch.

scottielee

06-28-05, 11:30 PM

Curt, you were very helpful over the phone. i ended up using a pair of y-adapters to send the sweep tone from the sub's eq line out to my tv (serving as preamp to my amps for calibration only) and back to the sub's line input. this way both my main speakers and sub receive the sweep simultaneously, which solves my problem.

you're da man!

best,
scottie

hi Curt,
just received my new dd-12 last night. i can't seem to get the sweep tone to be sent to my amps and have the sub respond to the tone simultaneously. under manual eq (12345), only my main speakers respond to the sweep (no response from sub even after adjusting volume). under auto eq (321), only the sub respond to the sweep. please help! (setup: sub eq line out -> tv line in + tv amp line out -> amps line in)

the main and sub do respond together beautifully when playing music (setup: cd player line out -> sub line input + sub thru out -> amps line in).

thanks in advance.
scottie

Brian27

06-29-05, 06:27 PM

Hey guy's, I purchased a CHT-10 a few years back and I use it with another sub, a Polk psw303 and have them hooked up to a Onkyo tx-sr800 through the single sub pre out with a Y-cable and avr crossover set at 80hz. The main speakers in my 7.1 setup are Polk bookshelf( Rti38). I have just a few questions:

1. The CHT-10's manual says that in some installations it may be beneficial to have a steeper ultimate crossover slope, should I be doing this?

2. I was also wondering if I should be using the Polk sub with the CHT-10( could it be hurting the CHT's performance)?

3. Is there a better way to be hooking up the CHT to get the best out of it?

ps...My HT is used for movie watching 99% of the time and my room size is 13ft/W by 22ft/L by 8ft/H.

Thanks,
Brian

curt c

06-29-05, 06:50 PM

Brian,
As long as you're using two subs, you have them hooked up correctly. I would designate your speakers as "small" in speaker set-up. If you're happy with the sound then leave it alone. If not try the Velodyne alone. When using two subs they can support or cancel each other, so location of each is important. I wouldn't worry about a steeper slope. Try for strong clean bass at listening position.
Curt

louthewiz

06-29-05, 11:56 PM

I just recently picked up a dps-10 since I wanted to replace my old radioshack sub,well I really like the velodyne alot I also have a klipsch ksw-10 and now instead of the subs competing with each other the subs get along really nice.

RugerFan

07-01-05, 03:16 AM

Well my F-1800XR made a few farting sounds tonight and now the green light no longer comes on. It looks like my amp took a dumb finally, any sugestions of what the problem might be?

curt c

07-01-05, 08:57 AM

Hi,
Your amp will need work. Please contact Velodyne service at; 408-465-2851 or service@velodyne.com.
Thanks,
Curt

Brian27

07-04-05, 05:46 PM

Hello, I was wondering if the CHT-10 is a sheilded sub for safe placement close to a tv? It would be right next to my 46in. Sony HD on the floor.

Thanks,
Brian

curt c

07-04-05, 05:55 PM

Hi Brian,
The CHT series are not video shielded. Normally a foot or two distance is adequate. If your picture becomes distorted it is too close. No permanent damage will occur.
Thanks,
Curt

tweeterex

07-04-05, 06:07 PM

curt there is another thread waiting for you!

hsu v Velodyne v svs

Brian27

07-04-05, 06:26 PM

Hi Brian,
The CHT series are not video shielded. Normally a foot or two distance is adequate. If your picture becomes distorted it is too close. No permanent damage will occur.
Thanks,
Curt
Thanks Curt! Sorry, one more question, I use a polk 303 and the cht-10 and was wondering if the cht would be better for the front of the room than the polk? The reason I ask is I have a long room with a open wall on 1 side that goes to kitchen and currently I'm trying to find the best places for each sub :eek: . I have the polk in the front now because its smaller and can be placed right beside the tv and the cht is in the back about 4ft. from couch. I could place the cht in the front also but it would be in front of a sliding glass door and dont know if thats good for the sound :confused: ? Where the cht is now, I can hear where the sound is coming from and the bass is too "boomy". Thanks again for any suggestions you might have.

Take care,
Brian

Exocer

07-04-05, 11:39 PM

curt, I repeat, thanks a lot for the help. The input terminal should be arriving tomorrow. Oh and thanks for getting me in touch with pete ;) Cant wait to turn up my volume without fear of blowing out my bookshelfs.

curt c

07-05-05, 02:15 PM

Thanks Curt! Sorry, one more question, I use a polk 303 and the cht-10 and was wondering if the cht would be better for the front of the room than the polk? The reason I ask is I have a long room with a open wall on 1 side that goes to kitchen and currently I'm trying to find the best places for each sub :eek: . I have the polk in the front now because its smaller and can be placed right beside the tv and the cht is in the back about 4ft. from couch. I could place the cht in the front also but it would be in front of a sliding glass door and dont know if thats good for the sound :confused: ? Where the cht is now, I can hear where the sound is coming from and the bass is too "boomy". Thanks again for any suggestions you might have.

Take care,
Brian

HI,
I would move the Velodyne to the front. The sliding glass doors are not an issue. Keep both subs away from the room opening. You'll have to experiment, that's what I would do. If you can hear the location of the sub then (probably) the volume or crossover, or both is set too high on the Velodyne.
Thanks,
Curt (480) 595-7141

Brian27

07-05-05, 03:08 PM

Thanks Curt, I did move the CHT up front where the polk was. It is a little closer to the tv than reccomended but no picture distortion. It sounds good there and is only a couple ft. from where I had it the very first time, which did not sound that good. The only thing that bothers me now is my damn neighbor upstairs who just now complained! :mad: :eek: There is no way to place the neighbor somewhere better is there??? :confused:

Thanks again,
Brian

Jake Sm

07-05-05, 04:13 PM

The most important component in a system is a room location that won't bother anyone!

Prozakk

07-05-05, 06:45 PM

is my damn neighbor upstairs who just now complained! :mad: :eek: There is no way to place the neighbor somewhere better is there??? :confused:

Thanks again,
Brian

6' under.

MrHifi

07-05-05, 07:24 PM

In 1970, i moved into an apartment. I feared for the reaction from my neighbors when I brought in 2 Altec Lansing A7-500 Voice of the Theater speakers fed by my Citation 12 amplifier. In order to control the sound, I moved into the 17th floor, the top floor. I selected an apartment next to the elevator shaft. My bedroom was between the speaker room and the neighbor. That left me with the floor and the front entrance as sources for propagated sound. I bought the thickest shag carpet i could find and applied acoustic tile to the front door making sure to overlap any seams in the door. When the door closed, the panels overlapped the frame closing the door cracks off as potential sources for sound. In the two years I lived there, i received 2 complaints. 1 from the folks below me and one from the folks at the end of the 70 ft. hallway. Apparently, the base propagated down the hall during a brief entrance or exit from my ubit while the music was on. I regularly ran my system with peaks of 100+ dB. On several occasions, I noticed open doors listening to my music. My point is that living in an apartment with a good system does not have to mean trouble with neighbors.