Current Stations (3-6-09):
WNDU-DT (42) 560 kW @ 282m HAAT - 800 kW @ 309.7m HAAT Requested
16.1 HD NBC
16.2 SD (simulcast)
Analog ceased programming February 16th at 11:59pm and ceased transmission March 3rd at 7:52pm (2009).

WSBT-DT (22) 266 kW @ 332.6m HAAT (was 280 kW @ 239m HAAT on channel 30)
22.1 HD CBS
22.2 SD "SBT2" (carried in Analog on most area cable systems and DISH Network)
22.3 SD Weather video
Analog ceased programming February 17th at 6:30pm and ceased transmission at midnight.
Digital transmission on channel 30 ended simultaneously and was moved to channel 22 by 12:02am February 18th.

WSJV-DT (58) 42 kW @ 315m HAAT Directional (pre-transition)
Channel 28 250 kW @ 335m HAAT post-transition granted (expected to be in use June 12th, 2009)
28.1 HD FOX
Analog ceased programming February 17th at 9:00am and is currently playing an educational "nightlight" loop.

WNIT-DT (35) 50 kW @ 332.9m HAAT - 85 kW @ 332.9m HAAT Directional Requested
34.1 HD PBS
34.2 SD (simulcast)
Analog ceased programming and transmission on March 12th, 2008 (transmitter failure).

WHME-DT (48) 300 kW @ 295m HAAT Directional - 640 kW @ 306m HAAT Requested
46.1 SD LeSea Broadcasting (religious)
Analog ceased programming and transmission on January 16th, 2009.
A digital channel change to 46 has been applied for.

Low Power
W18CF (18) 8 kW @ 85m AGL Directional Granted - CP for Flash Cut Expires 3/16/2009
Currently broadcasting TBN in analog

WCWW-LD (27) 15 kW @ 292m AGL
25.1 HD CW
This is a digital companion channel for WCWW-LP (25).

WBND-LD (49) 15 kW @ 304m AGL Directional
57.1 HD ABC
This is a digital companion channel for WBND-LP (57).

WMYS-LD (23) 15 kW @ 284m AGL Directional
69.1 SD MyNetwork
This is a digital companion channel for WMYS-LP (69).
An analog channel change to 34 has been applied for to clear up interference between 69 and emergency service radios.

(WYGN-LP 12 3ABN Berrien Springs, MI is also in the South Bend Market. Their CP for a digital companion channel expires 1/12/2010.)


Original 10-27-03 Post:
I havn't seen many South Bend Indiana posts here ... and I suppose that now I have my receiver, I might as well start.

Current Stations:
WNDU-DT (42) 310kW - future 1000kW
Digital 16.2 is simulcasting Channel 16
WSBT-DT (30) 280kW - future 400kW
Digital 22.1 simulcasts Channel 22 in 16.9 widescreen with side bars or HD when available
Digital 22.2 is UPN Michiana (and is carried in Analog on most area cable systems)
WSJV-DT (58) 10.5kW - future 671kW
I cannot receive this channel at all
WNIT-DT (35) 40kW - future 50kW
Digital 35.1 is PBS-HD "American Public Television" - With a slight audio delay behind picture ... - Program is unrelated to WNIT
Digital 35.2 simulcasts Channel 34
(Note that the Main Channel is 35 not 34.)
WHME-DT (48) 4.5kW - future 300kW
Digital 46.1 simulcasts Channel 46
This channel has plenty of glitches ... must be the low power :)

Nobody seems to be broadcasting their PSIP guide information properly --- not even WNDU which is Licensed (the others are operating STA). And as noted, WNIT is using the "wrong" Main Channel Number on DTV.

JL

WNDU 16.1 (DT42) was back on the air at 6:06pm tonight!
It's still isn't stable as I write this, but it looks like they will have:
16.1 WNDU-DT (in HD 16:9)
16.2 WNDU-DT (in SD)
16.3 WNDU-S2 (SD VERY LOW BANDWIDTH weather map)

Hopefully they will raise the 16.3 feed to enough that the sweep hand on the radar doesn't get stuck. It takes a few seconds to get the full picture up.

JL

As a former native South Bender who has moved down south, I must say that I am disappointed by the progress of DT in a market of that size, and do you no longer have an ABC stion in the market?

We have had an ABC Low Power station since just after WSJV went Fox.

Currently ABC is available to South Bend/Elkhart/Goshen (and not much else) on ABC57 WBND-LP.

As far as DT goes, they do have some lingering problems (no guides, no program names, and not all stations doing closed captioning) but at least all five DTs are on the air daily, and all except WNIT are broadcasting DT full time. (WNIT is doing HD from 2pm to Midnight, with the national HD feed and their local SD feed).

On all of the market's HD feeds when 4:3 is upconverted they letterbox - no zoom and crop nor forgetting to throw the HD switch as complained about in other threads. All except PBS are using their NTSC channel numbers as well, and have call letters broadcast. There are still stations that don't get that right (in other markets)!

BTW: WNDU is still down. Apparently some equipment that they needed was delayed by the fires in California. Right now they have a strong carrier but no mux but the brief glimpse I got showed the channels above.

Refreshing the full list:
16.1 WNDU NBC HD
16.2 WNDU NBC SD
16.3 WNDU Weather Radar (a cool feature)
22.1 WSBT CBS HD (no closed captioning)
22.2 WSBT UPN SD
28.1 WSJV ABC HD (works now I put my antenna outside)
35.1 WNIT PBS HD (test loop and some national programs)
35.2 WNIT PBS SD (local content)
46.1 WHME LeSea SD

Not on DT:
18 TBN Low Power
25 WMWB "WB25" Low Power
57 WBND "ABC57" Low Power
69 WRDY Low Power (No programming for at least 9 months, just colorbars)

Perhaps WMWB and WBND can pay to be on WSJV or WSBT's feed. It certainly would help.

JL

DT42's programs returned today. They are showing:
16.1 WNDU-DT HD with 4:3 stretched a little on width when upconverted
16.2 WNDU-DT SD with poor picture quality ... crank the bandwidth folks!

There is no 16.3 at this time.

JL

Yes, I was glad to see NBC back up. Does any one from our local market monitor these boards? I sent an email a few weeks ago about the RADAR #.3 channel and received no response. I wonder if they grabbed my suggestion or they had it planned. :) Lurker - Do you have an ABC feed from another market? I live on the North side of Elkhart.

BTW: I freaked when I first saw you first post on this board, I go by 'onewaylurker' on another satellite forum!

I can just barely pick up DT24 from Fort Wayne. I'm hoping that an amp will work. I have two UHFs on the roof, one pointing to South Bend and one for DT24 (and other Fort Wayne stations when they go full power). The antennas are tied together, which seems to be making DT24 too weak. I'm just outside of the city on the south side.

That 16.3 radar only lasted the first 20 minutes or so. Now they are up with 16.1 HD showing stretched upconversion and 16.2 SD jumpy due to low bandwidth. Have you seen 22.1 and 22.2? That's the way to do DTV!

(Maybe 22 will put up their Double Doppler?)

JL

JL,

Untie your antennas and use an A/B switch.Radio Shack makes a good remote controlled unit.

Been wanting to catch WSBT's new made-for-digitaltv-only UPN Michiana.Got a good pic tonite.I suspect we'll see much more of this in the future on other OTA broadcast stations.

http://community-2.webtv.net/GregBarker/DXPHOTOS/

Originally posted by MAX HD
Untie your antennas and use an A/B switch.Radio Shack makes a good remote controlled unit. Do you happen to have a part number? I was trying to avoid a switch because I have multiple TVs (analog) that I don't want to lose.Been wanting to catch WSBT's new made-for-digitaltv-only UPN Michiana.Got a good pic tonite.I suspect we'll see much more of this in the future on other OTA broadcast stations. I hope so. There are a few stations doing second networks. WOOD TV8 DT7 does a UPN feed in Michigan (along with a handful of broadcast LP stations).

I guess I'm wierd. I don't care about HD, I just want a stable picture at good quality. I'd rather have multiple SD feeds than HD, assuming the content is worth watching.

JL

I've been drawn to HD only. I have satellite from DISH but the OTA signals look so fine on my large screen HDTV! (Mits 65613)

I have never really seen that great of quality from the 22.2 station. It could be my set is too large for it to look that good. Isn't SD just a digital feed with 430i content? I know that Enterprise is 'filmed' HD but 22.2 does not broadcast it in HD only SD. (I checked this past weekend)

I keep watching for that 16.3 :)

L8R

One other thing probably wrong forum:

I have a JVC DVHS and noticed this weekend when I record off of firewire the HD feed I get the sub channels recorded with them. I hooked it up to my computer and dumped the program. When I decoded the signal to mpeg the decoder found both video and audio streams from 22. I watched both of them to check it out. WOW. Now I'm going to look into the transmission methods. Maybe that's part of the bandwidth issues.

I get pixelation now and then, is this common with hdtv? It's the same pixelation you get decodeing fast mpeg files but seems to be quite frequent on HDTV.

It appears that no South Bend Digital Channels are available in Kokomo at the current power transmission levels.

Originally posted by Jim_Hunt
It appears that no South Bend Digital Channels are available in Kokomo at the current power transmission levels. Unless you put up a really big antenna, I wouldn't expect South Bend.

Do you get the analog channels?

JL

Newbie here.

Just wanted to chime in and try to keep this thread going.

I expect my HD tuner to arrive next week so I don't really have anything to offer to the thread at this time.

Be back next week.

I heard that WBND (ABC) will be going digital any day now. Any truth to this? Do you know what channel it will be on?

Originally posted by Intimidator
I heard that WBND (ABC) will be going digital any day now. Any truth to this? Do you know what channel it will be on? Not likely, as WBND is a low power station. Perhaps they have bought a stream on one of the high power DT feeds.

I'll do some checking. But don't hold your breath.

JL

Anybody have a guess as to whether the South Bend HD signals would make it to Sturgis, MI - and if yes, what type of antenna it would take to receive them in a worthwhile way? Thanks.

Originally posted by mikerht
Anybody have a guess as to whether the South Bend HD signals would make it to Sturgis, MI - and if yes, what type of antenna it would take to receive them in a worthwhile way? Thanks.
Outdoor, roof mount - perhaps on a tower. The SB stations seem to be doing OK on power.

JL

Originally posted by mikerht
Anybody have a guess as to whether the South Bend HD signals would make it to Sturgis, MI - and if yes, what type of antenna it would take to receive them in a worthwhile way? Thanks.

Absolutely they make it. I am out by Klinger Lake and get 16, 22 and 35. On rare occasion I have picked up 58. I have a roof mounted 12' channel master combo antenna, with rotor to move between SB and Kalamazoo locals.

I doubt you need a tower, simple roof install should be plenty, as I am sitting down behind a tree covered hill, lower elevation than Sturgis. I am also preampped and amp'd.

Does anyone else have issue with WNIT not broadcasting the virtual channel number 34.1? It is causing my real havoc, picking up WNIT's 35.1 as well as WGVU's 11.1 that gets remapped to 35.1.

When I asked WNIT about it, they claimed that everyone in the SB market does this (i.e. not broadcast the virtual channel number) which is obviously false, because WSBT and WNDU both do. And all GR/Kalamazoo channels do as well, as do most digitals I think. Maybe we should try and start a campaign to get them to join the masses?

Originally posted by Kirby Baker
Does anyone else have issue with WNIT not broadcasting the virtual channel number 34.1? It is causing my real havoc, picking up WNIT's 35.1 as well as WGVU's 11.1 that gets remapped to 35.1.

When I asked WNIT about it, they claimed that everyone in the SB market does this (i.e. not broadcast the virtual channel number) which is obviously false, because WSBT and WNDU both do. And all GR/Kalamazoo channels do as well, as do most digitals I think. Maybe we should try and start a campaign to get them to join the masses?
My biggest issue with WNIT is lagging audio, which I get on "35.1" from time to time. Sometimes it gets choppy too.

WNIT is the *ONLY* broadcaster in the South Bend market *not* to use the proper virtual channel number. WNDU, WSBT, WSJV, and WHME are all doing it right, transmiting 16.1, 22.1, 28.1, and 46.1 respectively. The Fort Wayne stations were slow to add virtual numbers, but they are joining in now.

I don't believe that WNIT is up to speed on DT yet. I'm glad they are on the air, and they show that one can do HD and SD at the same time without major problems (such as WNDU's lousy signal). But the little things, like broadcasting an non-standard virtual channel number, are dropped.

I almost hate to ask when PSIP program information will be available. :)

JL

Just got my HD receiver last night, so I am glad to see this South Bend thread. I live in Granger. Everything looks great, except I really can't stand strectched TV, as 16.1 did last night with everything up until ER.
Who do we contact when we want to give these stations comments? Maybe we could compile a nice list so we could use our numbers to get stuff done?

Originally posted by JD-1027
Just got my HD receiver last night, so I am glad to see this South Bend thread. I live in Granger. Everything looks great, except I really can't stand strectched TV, as 16.1 did last night with everything up until ER.
Who do we contact when we want to give these stations comments? Maybe we could compile a nice list so we could use our numbers to get stuff done?
You may find a feedback form on the station website. I sent one to WNDU to complain about their picture quality (wait till you watch auto sports or fast action, waving on camera causes pixilization :( ). I also mentioned the stretch.

The reply said they had a repair planned next month ... and they would talk about the stretch.

JL

I started a thread to discuss the HD semi-stretch from 16.1 to a more general audience. Please see the thread below, I really want as much info from the South Bend group since it most directly affects us...

avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?threadid=355570

(sorry, I don't have enough posts to link directly yet)

WSBT 22 Superbowl Sunday

22.1 The Superbowl in HD
22.2 UPN Michiana (SD Only)
22.3 New Channel (WSBTSD2), no video but they seem to be broadcasting a radio station (probably one of WSBT's stations) ... It looks like a radar may be coming soon!

JL

Originally posted by justalurker
22.3 New Channel (WSBTSD2), no video but they seem to be broadcasting a radio station (probably one of WSBT's stations) ... It looks like a radar may be coming soon!JL Nope, just a way to steal more bits from their HD primary subchannel...:mad:

Just what America needs; how to turn $3,000 worth of ATSC/HDTV equipment into a $4.00 FM radio! WZOC is the current audio source for this channel. Eugene Hale hasn't responded to my inquires about why this subchannel was added.

Also, this just in: After being off the air for the past two weeks, WSJV-DT (ATSC 58) is back on the air. I'm seeing better error rates on my Dish 6000, but I don't know if they upped the power or made any other improvements.

hello all. Does anyone have updates on the current situation with the HD channles in the area? Been a lurker around these parts for a long time and I am getting ready to make the move. Just wanting to know what to expect on the reception end of things. I live in Nappanee.( let the slamming begin)

I'm getting jittery audio on WSBT's national feed. This occurrs during Swordfish in HD, Letterman commercials, prime time show ads etc.

However, local commercials sound fine. Examples: Steak n' Shake, local Mitsubishi auto dealers, etc.

Is anybody else experiencing this tonight (May 15, 2004) or am I the only one?

My Setup...
My stb is a D* compatible Sammy Sir-T160. WSBT gives me an off-air digital signal strength of 72-93%. I'm in Portage, MI with a Radio Shack UHF antenna in the attic pointed at South Bend for WSBT and a Radio Shack UHF/VHF in the attic pointed almost due north for WWMT (30-36%..generally lousy), WXMI (93%..excellent), WOOD (77%..good to excellent), WOTV (93%...fabulous), and WGVK (0-100%...lousy to excellent). The UHF antenna pointed at South Bend is about 25 feet away from the UHV/VHF model. It is connected to the UHF/VHF antenna lead by heavy shield 300 OHM wire. In turn, the UHF/VHF antenna is hooked up to a Channel Master 7777 pre-amp which finds its way to the stb via QS RG6.

I tend to think that the audio problem is on the WSBT end and less likely to do with my location, gear, antenna placement etc. Again, the cuts to local commercials all sound and look fine. Also, during the national programming this audio problem happens continuously, so it doesnt matter whether the signal strength is as low as 72 or as high as 93.

Thanks,
Jay

Jay,
I just saw your post. I'm just south of Benton Harbor/Saint Joseph and have been wondering what kind of HDTV reception I would get here from South Bend.
I'm about 30 to 35 miles from the towers. It looks like you're about 45 to 50 miles away.
What kind of Radio Shack antenna are you using? Is the attic in a one or two story house? My antenna would have to go in the attic also, a one story house.
How is reception from the other South Bend stations?
Thanks,
Jim

I've been goofing off and not having enough fun with HD! It's been a while since I checked out South Bend's HD landscape here or on my tuner. Not much has changed. PSIP still seems to be a lost art in South Bend.

What time is it? WNDU 16.1 (currently NBC Olympics) is running fast by a minute. WSBT 22.1 (CBS) and 22.2 (UPN-SD Only) are spot on the time. WHME 46.1 is 17hrs 44min fast. WSJV 28.1 (Fox) is sending February 4th as a date. WNIT 35.1 (PBS National HD) and 35.2 (NTSC 34 Simulcast) don't have a time code. My receiver just keeps playing whatever time I had on the last digital channel. WNIT PSIP doesn't have call letters or program names any more either. Currently, nobody in the South Bend market is sending titles.

24/7 HD? One good development is that WNIT-DT is now on the air 24/7 with the PBS-HD feed on 35.1. Even after NTSC 34 signs off and powers down. 35.2 carries tone and colorbars when WNIT-TV 34 is off the air.

NBC-HD is a refreshing change to WNDU's normal feed. They half stretched their SD and were proud of it! "If you want unstretched HD tune to 16.2 ." Bahh. 16.2 is off the air (no broadcast) for the olympics.

Nobody in South Bend has stepped forward and put up a weather radar. WNDU-DT had one very briefly on 16.3 but tossed it because they couldn't get 16.1 HD and 16.2 SD to work well with the extra bandwidth loss. Actually, 16.1 HD and 16.2 SD didn't look too good after dumping 16.3 . Perhaps WNDU should talk to WNIT. They manage to get a HD+SD looking good.

WSBT-DT has 22.1 HD and 22.2 SD UPNMichiana. They seem to work too. Double Dopler would look cool on 22.3 ...

WSJV-DT has only 28.1 HD, so they could pop up a radar ... if they wanted to.

WHME-DT? It would be interesting if they would lease some space to WMWB and WBND ... and perhaps put up a radar with "The Pulse" as muzak. It would get the WB and ABC SD feeds on DT, provide limited funding, and the Pulse w/radar would be a nice touch. But I'm just dreaming. :)

As I said ... nothing much has changed.

JL

Well I went round and round with the engineer at WNIT and got nowhere with them understanding why I wanted them to send the information that they were really channel 34. My Tivo guide is practically useless since all recording for the channel has to be done manually. The engineer wrote me the following:

Your equipment is working correctly. Our digital channel assignment for WNIT-DT is channel 35. Accordingly, our HD feed (PBS HD) is branded as 35-1 and our SD feed (simulcast of WNIT analog) is branded as 35-2. This assists viewers in telling whether they are seeing our channel 34 feed or our simulcasted chanel 35 feed.


IMHO this doesn't assist viewers in anything. How does labeling one channel 35-1 and 35-2 differ from 34-1 and 34-2????

Anybody have any word as to when WBND might get us ABC HD?

Originally posted by idttywlm IMHO this doesn't assist viewers in anything. How does labeling one channel 35-1 and 35-2 differ from 34-1 and 34-2????Excellent question! Does he know that the concept of subchannels with PSIP is that on many tuners 34-0 would cause them to tune the analog signal, and 34-1 would tune in the digital signal? Apparently having some viewers tune 34 while others tune 35-n is less confusing, in his mind, than everyone (analog or digital) using 34. Wow. So much for branding.

Well, at least he's not covering for not going through the work of adding PSIP information. I examined the WNIT-HD stream during the last DX opening and found a wealth of PAT/PMT/TVCT info:

Channel 35-1
Service Name: WNIT-HD
Channel number: 35.1
Extended Channel Name: WNIT High Definition
Video PIDs: 0x0011 (15 Mbps, 1080i, 29.97fps, 16:9)
Audio PIDs: 0x0014 (English, 384 kbps, 2.0 channels)

Channel 35-2
Service Name: WNIT-SD
Channel number: 35.2
Extended Channel Name: WNIT Std. Definition
Video PIDs: 0x0021 (4 Mbps, 480i, 29.97fps, 4:3)
Audio PIDs: 0x0024 (English, 192 kbps, 2.0 channels)

I just got an email from WNIT this morning and they said due to recent rule changes at the FCC they were changing the PSIP to 34.1 and 34.2 to match their analog channel numbers.

I haven't read the FCC release on low power digitals, but I look forward to having ABC57 and WB25 in ATSC.

BTW: Echostar (Dish Network) is carrying 22.2 on their service as a local "ESBT". DirecTV is not carrying the station.

JL

"Recent rule changes..." ha ha... That's funny.

Thanks for the info.

What strikes me funny is that it has always been an ATSC guideline to have the DTV channel number equal the original analog channel number. Now that the FCC basically just reiterated this in a Report and Order for the DTV transition, it's being viewed as a "rule change."

Perhaps the R&O will coerce WCIU-DT Chicago to stop using 1-1 and 1-2, and start using 26-1 and 23-1 for their subchannels. It would also be nice of a couple of the other stations devoid of PSIP info would begin sending it.

Perhaps the "rules changes" were all the complaints about the illogical reasoning for the channel 35-1 and 35-2 tags. Helps save face I guess. Anyway I'm glad it will change. Now if WSJV can get their Fox broadcast to work with HD on the football games. The engineer, Mr. Gooding said they are short one piece of gear from Fox and hope to receive and install it in the next couple days. He said they were trying to work around it but I didn't get the bears game in HD even though my datastream said it was 720p. For those with Tivo HD receivers pressing Select-Play-Select-InstantReplay_Select while watching a program shows the data stream info at the bottom of the screen ... Pressing the same sequence of buttons while at the Directv main screen (pressing tivo button) will have it disappear although I've had to do it several times to make it work.

Jeff

Is WSJV (FOX) in HD yet in South Bend?

Yes the Fox affiliate is now up and running. Took a little while but the baseball and football look nice.

Is anybody getting HD on Comcast in South Bend area? I'm wondering what channels are on, and if any are unscrambled.

Al

Any one else having trouble with WSBT 22-1, could not watch the colts game on sunday, kept breaking up and then even when the picture came on it didn't seem to be in HDTV
Bob

Any one else having trouble with WSBT 22-1, could not watch the colts game on sunday, kept breaking up and then even when the picture came on it didn't seem to be in HDTV

22.1 didnt show the game in HD. I think that they have only broadcast 1/2 of a game inHD this season. some one pulled the switch at halftime of the away Jags game

The last 2 home games were on 22.1 but the picture was boxed 4x3.

I would like to know why 22 wont broadcat the game in HD. Is CBS not filming all games in HD, or is does 22 not push the button just before kickoff.

My new Winegard HD 9095P antenna is up in South Haven ,MI and am receiving the analog feeds of 16,22,28 very strong.With 25,34,and 57 less so but still watchable.What are the odds of HD reception of the less strong channels
I hope to make my decision on a new HDTV very soon.I am planning on using the digital tuner in a sat. receiver,VOOM most likely.
Updates to the thread for the latest info would be appreciated.Thanks

Also this might sound like a very uh,simpleton question but,are the commercials in HD too?

bobbehr:
Both 25 and 57 are very low power analogs, only about 100k watts or so. If you get a watchable pic on these 2, I would say you should get a very good digital signal at least on 30 and 42, probably on all the digitals.

Al

22.3 is no longer a radio station ... as of Friday, December 1st it is WSBT's Weather Channel.

It isn't the standard radar only ... they flip through several forecast and conditions pictures, many animated.

The audio is NOAA South Bend/North Webster.

JL

Gee, I forgot all about this thread. This isn't exactly an OTA question, but does anyone else in the Michiana area have a Dish 811 that they're using for local reception? We're supposed to be able to get EPG information for the Local DTV stations from DishNetowrk, but I'm still getting "Local Digital" for all of mine.

justalurker, we're both on the South side of SB. One thing that would be nice to add to the WSBT-WX would be adding school closings on days like today.

I'm in Chicago (Hyde Park on the South Side), and am wondering what my chances of catching South Bend's WSBT with a roof mounted antenna are. I'm a huge Colts fan, and so far have subscribed to NFL Sunday Ticket on DirecTV, but I recently bought an HDTV and am seriously considering switching to Comcast because of the high cost of HD Tivo equipment from D*. According to AntennaWeb, I could use a "violet" class UHF antenna to catch WSBT, which is 72.4 miles away. What do you guys think, and which antenna/mount is recommended?

Hey Kamage,

For the first 21 years of my life, I lived in Calumet City. I had a corner
reflector UHF antenna pointed north-northwest to Chicago and could
still get a weak signal from WSBT from an outdoor roof antenna.

Once you get beyond 60 miles the curvature of the earth kills the signal.
You can try a ChannelMaster 4228 8-bay UHF and a preamp, but you
might have unwanted side effects from being so close to Sears tower.

That said, I live out here in DeKalb, IL, 70 miles west-northwest of you.
And last week, with tropospheric ducting, or "trop" going on (TV reception
from 300 miles away was possible), I got WSBT-DT for about an hour
out here, and I'm 20 miles away from a low power analog channel 30
which I can get! If you have a roof to put a good antenna on, you can try
it...but inside, in an attic or wherever, you just won't be able to get it except on "good" days.

Thanks for the reply. That's kind of what I was afraid of. But I'll give it a shot -- fortunately I do have roof access. Are there any other antennas in addition to the ChannelMaster 4228 8-bay UHF that I should be looking at?

Actually, I would go to antennasdirect.com and try out the XG91.
Lots of people have had great success with that antenna.
The problem is that it is BIG. 7 3/4' long. But, it is very directional,
and that will definitely help you at least reduce the interference from Sears
and the Hancock some. You will need to be careful in how you point it,
as even a 1 degree turn can literally mean the difference between
signal and none at all. The ChannelMaster has slightly less gain and
is less directional, but 62 miles from the Hancock, I can get all but
channels 2 and 26 digital with it in the *attic*, in a low area close
to a river!

My guess is that you won't get WSBT reliably. But, with continuous lake
breezes, as a meteorologist and a over-the-air TV fan, it should
grace your pixels frequently, especially spring-fall.

And I wish I had a list of all the South Bend and Indianapolis
subchannels and what they broadcast. Posting on the Indy board,
no one wants to write them down. Can anyone here?

Gilbert

Originally posted by sebenste
And I wish I had a list of all the South Bend and Indianapolis
subchannels and what they broadcast. Posting on the Indy board,
no one wants to write them down. Can anyone here? PSIP Channels for South Bend:

16.1 WNDU NBC HD w/SD slightly stretched, cropped and upconverted
16.2 WNDU NBC SD = NTSC Simulcast
22.1 WSBT CBS HD w/SD letterboxed and centered
22.2 UPN Michiana SD - DT Only Station (no HD)
22.3 24/7 Weather Slide Show - Low Bandwidth SD w/NWS Audio
28.1 WSJV FOX HD w/SD letterboxed and centered
34.1 PBS-HD National Feed (No local content)
34.2 WNIT PBS SD = NTSC Simulcast
46.1 WHME LeSea SD = NTSC Simulcast (no HD)

Occasionally 34 PSIP has shown the DT channel PSIP of 35.

JL

Occasionally 34 PSIP has shown the DT channel PSIP of 35.

JL [/B]


They screwed up again this week. It's on 35 so no online guides/tivo will work for recording. I have once again emailed them. None of the other local channels have this (problem). I hope it is in error and not the engineer's personal belief again.

I just checked the Prime Time line-up available on the Michiana DTV stations. WNDU-DT and WSJV-DT seem to have their act together and are transmitting proper PSIP information for the programs on the air. WSBT-DT has the correct 22.x channels, but with bogus PSIP program titles for 22.01 and 22.02 ("DTV Program". Duh.) Like idttywlm said, WNIT-DT shows up on my Mits as 35.01 and 35.02, no station ID, no Program titles. WHME-DT, usually 46.01, now says 48.03 (?) with no PSIP Channel ID or Program title.

So, three days after the FCC says "You will obey" and the score is 2 pass, 3 fail (40%). I guess the SBN DMA fails.

Roland,

The only channels that don't correspond to their analog channels for me are 34-1 and 34-2. 22 and 46 both come in fine at their digital slots of 22-1.. and 46-1. This is with a Tivo HD tuner and not any instrument.

Yesterday I emailed WNIT and got no response. Today I sent a complaint to the FCC.

Jeff

I think I'll need to re-scan the Digital channels to fix the Mitsubishi. I was hoping to wait until after WNIT fixed their tables.

This is what I got back from the FCC regarding my complaint. They say there is no violation so I F'n give up. I'm not giving another dime to either the radio or tv station:

You are receiving this email in response to your inquiry to the FCC.

Thanks for contacting the FCC Consumer Center in Gettysburg PA.

While we understand your frustration, we're not seeing a violation of FCC rules described in your message. However if you believe there is a violation, you may file a complaint with the FCC Enforcement Bureau in writing to:

Federal Communications Commission
Enforcement Bureau
445 12th Street, SW
Washington, DC 20554

Fax: 202-418-0232

Complaints should include:

- the call sign and community of the station allegedly in violation

- detailed facts regarding the nature of the violation

- any available supporting documentation, and

- the name and address of the person(s) sending the complainant.

WNIT's analog channel is 34; its DTV channel is 35. That is, the channels are adjacent - and we can't think why, if indeed they are, taking measures to help consumers more easily change from their analog to their digital channel.

***Does the above mean that since they are adjacent, they fulfill the FCC's wishes? When will the analog signal go away and make the digital stuff work correctly with all the guides out there? Probably not for many years I imagine. ****************************

That is, a TV station broadcasting on, say, channel 8 might have been issued non-adjacent channel 29 for its digital operation.

Consumers may see these channels denoted by hyphens, and they may appear as 8-1 and 8-2; or 8-0, 8-1 and 8-2; or variations.

8-0 is usually the station's standard, analog signal; 8-1 and 8-2 is the station's DTV transmitter actually operating on channel 29. Using what is called PSIP (Program System Information Protocol) the station is able to make a TV set display those channels as 8-1 and 8-2, but in reality your TV set tuned to channel 29. This prevents the viewer having to keep track of TV stations' DTV channels. Using PSIP, the broadcaster can associate the analog transmitter channel assignment to the DTV transmitter channel. Therefore 8-0 is analog channel 8, 8-1 is actually channel 29, as is 8-2. Without such association, the viewer would be required to tune to channel 8 or 29 to view analog or DTV programming. It is easier for a viewer to use the remote control channel up/down button to change between channels 8-0, 8-1, and 8-2.

JustaLurker,

Thanks for the info! Mucho appreciated.

BTW, WSBT-DT has applied to move back to channel 22
for their DT signal after the analog channel gets shut off.

Originally posted by sebenste
BTW, WSBT-DT has applied to move back to channel 22
for their DT signal after the analog channel gets shut off. Cool. Are you getting that from the FCC or a local source?
I know that existing stations are supposed to be making that election now, but I have not found the list -- yet.

Nevermind the link --- Found it!

WNDU 16 -> 42
WSBT 22 -> 22 (not 30)
WSJV 28 -> 28 (not 58)
WNIT 34 -> 35
WHME 46 -> 48

Interesting choices.

JL

Originally posted by justalurker
Nevermind the link --- Found it!

WNDU 16 -> 42
WSBT 22 -> 22 (not 30)
WSJV 28 -> 28 (not 58)
WNIT 34 -> 35
WHME 46 -> 48

Interesting choices.

JL

Indeed. S'funny, but 65 miles west of Chicago, WSBT-DT and TV
come in about once a week. WNDU has a trickle of a signal when this
hapens, and the other stations aren't there. I might never see WNIT-DT
on my dial, since Milwaukee has one of their PBS DT stations built out at a nice power on channel 35. That, and analog WWTO-DT 35 35 miles
south of me at 5 mw ERP will stop that from happening. It's also nearly
impossible to get WNIT analog since W34CK, low power translator of
channel 62 in Tinley Park (southwest of Chicago) upgraded their
transmitter and power on Sears Tower last month. Directional south
and west. Sigh. PBS beats 24 hours of infomercials hands down. :-(

It is interesting to see how many (or how few) stations are going to keep their historical frequencies. I've pulled the records for the 135 stations in Michigan, Indiana and Illinois that filed a DTV election and only 36 of them are choosing their old frequency over the new one.

Who wants to move their DTV to their analog channel after transition?
Chicago: WLS 7 (WBBM asking to be on DT 11 once vacated by WTTW analog)
Carbondale: WSIU wants channel 8 instead of 40.
Champaign/Springfield: WILL 9, WICD 15, WICS 20 and WCFN 49
Peoria: WHOI 19 and WEEK 25
Rockford: WREX 13 (the only VHF) and WIFR 23
Quincy: WGEM 10

Four of Indianapolis' 14 stations want their analog frequency: WTHR 13, WTTK 29, WCLJ 42 and WIPB 49. Powerhouses RTV and TTV are happy to move (or stay on their DTV assignments).
Evansville: WNIN 9 and WEHT 25
Fort Wayne: All keeping their DTV channel
South Bend: as noted two keeping the analog three keeping the DTV assignment.
Terre Haute: WTHI 10 and WVUT 22. Yes, WTWO is giving up 2 for 36!

Ann Arbor: WPXD wants CH 31
Flint: WJRT wants 12 instead of 36 - making them the only VHF there. WFUM wants 28.
Grand Rapids: WZZM wants CH 13 (and be one of the 5 of 9 to be VHF in that market).
Lansing: WILX 10 and WKAR 23
Far north stations not shown, although it is interesting to see that 9 out of 16 stations in the northern lower and upper peninsula that made a choice will go with their analog channels.

Two questions:
1) How tough was it for the stations to decide? Is it strictly based on how many people they could cover on each channel and go for the best or did stations take in to account years of channel branding? I know in this market WNDU IS channel 16. Will we grow to love them as CH 42?

2) What will happen to PSIP - and when? The thought crossed my mind when WNIT's PSIP broke a couple of weeks ago that since they will eventually be WNIT-DT 35 they might want to start calling themselves that now. I assume that WNDU cannot call itself CH 16 forever. What will happen when the next channel 16 comes along?

The interesting thing about the digital transition is that when it is over all of the abandoned channels will be up for grabs. So in South Bend we will have CH 16, 30, 58, 34 and 46 ready to assign --- there could very well be a new TV16.

JL

Originally posted by justalurker
I know in this market WNDU IS channel 16. Will we grow to love them as CH 42?I was thinking the same thing. NewsCenter Fourty-two doesn't roll off the tongue quite the same as "NewsCenter 16"...

When channels 16, 22 and 28 first went on the air back in the 50's, weren't they all at higher channels than they are now?
Seems to me, I can remember channel 28 originally being up in the 50's somewhere. I think they all moved to their present assignments at about the same time.
I just checked their web sites. Channel 22 doesn't say anything about it,
but Channel 16 went on the air on channel 46 and moved to 16 in 1957. Channel 28 went on the air on channel 52 and moved to 28 in 1958.

Originally posted by justalurker
It is interesting to see how many (or how few) stations are going to keep their historical frequencies. I've pulled the records for the 135 stations in Michigan, Indiana and Illinois that filed a DTV election and only 36 of them are choosing their old frequency over the new one..............

Two questions:
1) How tough was it for the stations to decide? Is it strictly based on how many people they could cover on each channel and go for the best or did stations take in to account years of channel branding? I know in this market WNDU IS channel 16. Will we grow to love them as CH 42?

2) What will happen to PSIP - and when? The thought crossed my mind when WNIT's PSIP broke a couple of weeks ago that since they will eventually be WNIT-DT 35 they might want to start calling themselves that now. I assume that WNDU cannot call itself CH 16 forever. What will happen when the next channel 16 comes along?

JL

Over the weekend, "George at WNDU" answered most of your questions with this post at the Indy thread......................


<It looks like all the stations in the FW area are going to stay at their <current digital channel assignment. Why would a station want to do that, <vs. changing back to their analog number?

Ryan


Ryan,

Basically, the FCC made it very difficult for stations to go back to their analog channel with digital.

FCC allowed/encouraged/bullied stations into maximizing coverage on their digital channel and have proclaimed that facility "protected."

But a station wanting to move digital to its analog channel is not allowed to increase interference to those "protected" facilities (by more than only a slight amount), meaning power reductions in certain directions (although some of these might disappear if relocated to their analog channel).

And two (or more) stations whose digital operation on their analog channels would mutually interfere have to protect each other (but the FCC won't approve large areas of interference between, even if such stations agree to accepting).

Stations were faced with deciding between the guaranteed coverage area of their current digital channel and any coverage reduction on their analog channel from having to protect nearby digital stations.

Many stations discovered their digital channel afforded better coverage because re-using the analog channel was impeded by protecting already established digital stations or digital stations reverting to former analog channels.

But stations whose analog channel allowed bigger/better coverage for digital than their present digital channel got lucky and elected to revert digital to their analog spectrum (and some stations had no choice in this round of channel elections if one or both of their channels is outside the core or both on low-VHF).

A lot of thought also went into branding by established channel number, but not considered as important because PSIP allows virtual channel numbers (and besides channel numbers are different on cable or satellite and viewers seem to have no problem finding their favorite station).

But in the end, it seems it was really a choice between a "bird in the hand" and a "role of the dice."

I'm sure many stations will regret their decision, either way, but many won't.


__________________
George at WNDU

Originally posted by jimisham
When channels 16, 22 and 28 first went on the air back in the 50's, weren't they all at higher channels than they are now?
Seems to me, I can remember channel 28 originally being up in the 50's somewhere. I think they all moved to their present assignments at about the same time.
I just checked their web sites. Channel 22 doesn't say anything about it,
but Channel 16 went on the air on channel 46 and moved to 16 in 1957. Channel 28 went on the air on channel 52 and moved to 28 in 1958. I can appreciate the history ... but in those early days of TV changes affected less people. In 1950, only 9% of households had TV. In 1955 that jumped to 64.5% and by 1960 it was at 87.1%. (That 87.1% was 45,750 of 52,500 households.) Now we are at 108,400 TV households in the US (98.2%).
source (http://www.tvb.org/rcentral/mediatrendstrack/tvbasics/02_TVHouseholds.asp)

I'm suprising myself with the percentage of early adopters ... I didn't realize that TV took off that quickly. But then the statisics are not for number of sets and hours watched. I consider early TV to be almost experimental ... with a lot more slack cut by the viewers for problems like weak pictures and lack of color. Those channel changes most likely represented vast improvements in their signals.

We are seeing some "experimental" forgiveness on digital TV. Audio and video problems are being excused to a certain extent while stations do what they did in the 1950's and 60's and work the bugs out of broadcasting. And PSIP helps keep the channels on their familiar numbers during the transition. But when DT goes mainstream and "the common folk" are forced to get a new tuner it will be different. And interesting to see how the stations handle their change.

I'll ask in the Indy thread about PSIP, since it came up there first. And be glad that the transition is still a couple of years off.

JL

From the answering my own question department ...

Poking around the DTV 2nd Report and Order it does appear branding is kept:
paragraph 30
As part of PSIP, a broadcaster’s “major channel number” is its NTSC channel number. This major channel number is the station’s channel identity during and after the transition. Therefore, a station’s channel election decision will have no effect on the assignment of its NTSC channel number as its “major channel number” in PSIP.

BTW: Under this order, PSIP is required as of February 1st, 2005 (120 days after the publication in the Federal Register). This is the paragraph that says WNIT should be using PSIP 34. (Paragraph 152 is where the FCC says the program guide should be accurate for the next 12hrs minimum - hello! "DTV Program" isn't accurate!)

JL

Justalurker,

Better than WYIN-DT 17 in Crown Point, IN (northwest IN). They have
NO PSIP data at all, and of their two subchannels, one is completely
dead. From what I can tell, outside of big PBS stations like WTTW
in Chicago, many of the smaller ones have major issues. I don't
consider yours to be major in comparison, and "DTV program" is
not detailed but is the truth. Probably just lets them off the hook
until they get everything in.

Gilbert

Originally posted by justalurker
From the answering my own question department ...

Poking around the DTV 2nd Report and Order it does appear branding is kept:


BTW: Under this order, PSIP is required as of February 1st, 2005 (120 days after the publication in the Federal Register). This is the paragraph that says WNIT should be using PSIP 34. (Paragraph 152 is where the FCC says the program guide should be accurate for the next 12hrs minimum - hello! "DTV Program" isn't accurate!)

JL

So where does that leave us? The FCC told me they saw no problem with the PSIP at 35 so I don't understand your post. This seems to contradict what they said. I just want the damn guide and channel in sync. They can be channel &^ as far as I'm concerned. I don't know who to complain to to get the tivo/directv guide changed.

Originally posted by sebenste
Justalurker,

Better than WYIN-DT 17 in Crown Point, IN (northwest IN). They have
NO PSIP data at all, and of their two subchannels, one is completely
dead.

Gilbert

They might be screwed up now,but they had it working last May.Check the screenshot on page 4.

http://community-2.webtv.net/GregBarker/DXPHOTOS/

All three of my ATSC decoders are now showing WNIT-DT's PSIP data is back on line. Lower-cased, but now showing 34-01 wnit-hd and 34-02 wnit-sd on my Dish 6000 and 811. The Mitsubishi WS-55613 still shows the program title as "DTV Program", though.

Originally posted by idttywlm
So where does that leave us? The FCC told me they saw no problem with the PSIP at 35 so I don't understand your post.I don't believe the FCC is up to speed with its own regulations yet. These are new rules. There are a lot of FCC rules that are not fully enforced.Originally posted by Foxbat
All three of my ATSC decoders are now showing WNIT-DT's PSIP data is back on line. Lower-cased, but now showing 34-01 wnit-hd and 34-02 wnit-sd on my Dish 6000 and 811. The Mitsubishi WS-55613 still shows the program title as "DTV Program", though. That's good news. It was probably just an equipment failure - something that could be explained to the FCC if they ever asked.

I'll be glad when DTV is less of an "experimental" technology. :D

JL

Hi, Has anyone noticed pixilation on 22.1 March Madness BB?

I wonder if the subchannels' operation has taken too much bandwidth?

Hi, Anyone have ComCast HD cable in South Bend? I am wondering if they have any carriage of ABC-HD. ( A Comcast Rep has so claimed, but I don't understand how they could!)

Also, I gather that they don't carry Fox-HD; can someone confirm?

Thanks,

Originally posted by aggie
Hi, Anyone have ComCast HD cable in South Bend? I am wondering if they have any carriage of ABC-HD. ( A Comcast Rep has so claimed, but I don't understand how they could!)

Also, I gather that they don't carry Fox-HD; can someone confirm?

Thanks,

No, there is no ABC HD, the CSR told me the same thing before I signed up. All the local HD they have (in Middlebury, I think it is all the same in South Bend) is WSBT CBS-HD and WNIT PBS-HD. There is no Fox-HD so far. A while back I got a message that WNDU-HD would be coming on on ch 188, but I have never started getting it. Has anyone in the South Bend/Elkhart area started getting WNDU-DT?

Al

FYI: WNDU announced their HDTV arrival on Comcast during their 5pm newscast tonight. Channel 188.

It was fun to watch Terry McFadden read the story and say HDTV so many times in a row. :D

JL

JL, Thanks, now all we need is an ABC HD channel, and of course, carriage of FOX.

I note that WNDU resolves to 16-1, 16-2 and 16-3 here.
Did they add a subchannel? What's currently on 16-1,
16-2, and 16-3?

Originally posted by sebenste
I note that WNDU resolves to 16-1, 16-2 and 16-3 here.
Did they add a subchannel? What's currently on 16-1,
16-2, and 16-3? 16-1 - WNDU programming, 16:9 format for HD, 14:9 for upconverted SD
16-2 - WNDU, 4:3 SD format
16-3 - Live SuperDoppler16, 24 hr radar with NOAA weather radio audio

WNDU added 16-3 about a month or so ago.

Originally posted by Foxbat
16-1 - WNDU programming, 16:9 format for HD, 14:9 for upconverted SD
16-2 - WNDU, 4:3 SD format
16-3 - Live SuperDoppler16, 24 hr radar with NOAA weather radio audio

WNDU added 16-3 about a month or so ago. Odd. I'm not getting 16-3. 16-2 is nasty at the moment (NewsCenter 16 at 10). I'm getting blockiness as well as audio loss. Perhaps 16-3 is off at the moment?

JL

Thanks, Fox and Lurker. Looks like they are having problems with it
tonight, but I suspect it's only temporary.

Gilbert

FOXBAT, The near full (widescreen) SD upconversion on Ch16-1 appears to be close to 16:9, although I may have some overscan on my display. Do you happen to know if they just stretch the picture horizontally, or are they maintaining correct "shape" by discarding some vertical resolution?

The up-converted material looks MUCH better than the 4:3 SD on Ch 22-1, for example.

Does anyone know if any HDTV (ota) channel sends any kind of test signals for color, tint, contrast, etc.?

How about the antenna direction? From the degree listing on antennaweb.org they're all between about 190 and 205. But I can't figure if 190 is clockwise from 0 or counter-clockwise. Know what I mean? I'm in Knollwood, and I just can't seem to get all the ota channels from one antenna placement.

Has anyone heard about when we might get a digital ABC?

Thanks

Janko, Clockwise from north. South is 180.

ABC digital is still just a hope. The digital "white-area" may solve our problem, via Direct or Dish. I believe that the "white-area" rules have not been published by the FCC yet.

I also live in Knollwood; using an antenna in my attic works quite well, except for ABC which is a LPTV.

Are you connected to a DBS service or Comcast?
I

I figured that I'd have to get my antenna up higher. It's actually in my basement and it's only a little RCA amplified so I'm doing pretty well with it.

I had Comcast HD for a short time. At that time they had only CBS and PBS and I wasn't in the mood for waiting since CBS looked really bad anyway. I think OTA looks much better.

Originally posted by aggie
FOXBAT, The near full (widescreen) SD upconversion on Ch16-1 appears to be close to 16:9, although I may have some overscan on my display. Do you happen to know if they just stretch the picture horizontally, or are they maintaining correct "shape" by discarding some vertical resolution?

The up-converted material looks MUCH better than the 4:3 SD on Ch 22-1, for example. Personally I don't like the stretch on 16-1, but it does appear to be mostly proportional.
{FX flipping on HD tuner and going to 16-1}
Then again, I haven't looked in a while. The old way left slight bars on the side (4:3 expanded to "14:10.5" cropped to "14:9" and side letterboxed to 16:9).

Flipping back and forth between broadcast and HD it appears they have zoomed it more to get rid of the side bars. They are trimming top and bottom, with a little more off the top than the bottom. It is appears to be proportional.

(4:3 expanded to "16:12" cropped to 16:9?)

JL

BTW: I did a rescan and 16-3 appeared on my box. All radar all the time. :D

(22-3 automatically appeared when added a few months ago, so I had not thought of doing a rescan. Come to think of it - 22-3 WX replaced 22-3 radio, so it would have been a valid channel at my last rescan just as different content.)

JL

Looks like TV 16 doesn't have a delay server.
Conan (delayed an hour) appears to be upconverted.

Both the SD and HD feed has black bars top and bottom. It does show the amount of cropping going on.

JL

Does anyone know whether WSJV-DT 58 will implement its CP for 671kW by the July 1st deadline for the top 100 markets? At least I'm assuming that this station is still utilizing its STA for much lower power. Earlier this morning some nice tropospheric enhancement allowed me to get a short lock on WNIT-DT 35 @ 116 miles (pic attached). During the past two years I've seen every South Bend DTV with the exception of WSJV-DT. Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks.

Steve

Does anyone know whether WSJV-DT 58 will implement its CP for 671kW by the July 1st deadline for the top 100 markets?Their most recent STA was filed May 1st and approved May 4th. (Their previous STA expired May 3rd.) This one expires July 1st - so they will need another STA in a couple of weeks or get their CP on the air!

JL

JL,
You seem to be on top of the Michiana DTV situation, have you seen any indication whether Weigel (sp?) Broadcasting will ever get WBND-DT and WMWB-DT on the air before the LP deadline?

When is the LP deadline? I must have completely missed the announcement!

I for one am very interested in having HD MNF, but little else. If I could receive the Fort Wayne ABC with a tower, I would consider it (I live in Granger).

I for one am very interested in having HD MNF, but little else. If I could receive the Fort Wayne ABC with a tower, I would consider it (I live in Granger).Isn't MNF going to be on ESPN-HD this year? Or, is that for 2006? Either way, I don't think viewers in Michiana will ever see MNF on ABC in HD without putting up a good tower/antenna combination.

A lot of information can be found on the FCC website ...
Start here > http://www.fcc.gov/mb/video/tvq.html

The details of what has been applied for are elsewhere in the FCC's "CDBS".

I haven't paid a lot of attention to the low power issue, but IIRC they have to choose a channel to move to or do a splash cutover on their existing channel. The CA level of low power has more options ... IIRC regular LPs just have the splash cut option.

Considering that they are apparently allowed EITHER NTSC *OR* ATSC I doubt if they will cut over until a lot of people have ATSC tuners.

BTW:
WMWB-LP just filed for it's license renewal on March 30th (along with the other Indiana TV stations). No other applications pending.
WBND-LP also filed for it's renewal (March 29th) and has nothing else pending.
The other Weigel LP, WAAT-LP 69, filed it's renewal on March 30th.

JL

I believe that the change in MNF to ESPN will not be until the "06" season. Of course, the ABC college games are badly missed as well.

Is there a published FCC mandate for LPTV to go digital?

I don't see a date in the FCC rules ...
Here they are if anyone wants to look
http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-04-220A1.pdf

Everything is going digital - so there is a mandate ... the deadline is less obvious.

JL

Just wanted to bump and suscribe to this....I'm a noob here and was hoping to get some direction. I'm still reading, though....

I'm going to be moving to the South Bend area soon; my fiancee is already in Mishawaka, and we've got a brand new Samsung HDTV that I really want to try out. DVDs look awesome, but I was hoping to test out some of the HDTV programming thats available. So that's basically my question - what's available and how do I get it? We've got Comcast digital cable with HBO, but it looks like comcast only provides like 2 local channels and then some movies? Most of our TV watching is on the major networks, plus things like TBS, TNT, MTV, etc. I'd like ESPN in HD, too. I can't get some of those extended stations over the air, can I? Speaking of, what do I need to get them over the air (that's my next research after posting this :-) )

I guess in summary, in the South Bend area, what is the best option to get the most HD programming available? Thanks for any info!

In Mishawaka you shouldn't have too much problem getting the networks over the air - NBC, CBS, FOX and PBS HD feeds are available ... Comcast carries a couple of those feeds.

ABC and WB are low power stations in the South Bend market and probably won't be HD for many years. UPN is a digital only station (a subchannel of the CBS station) and will not be HD. (There has been hints of time shifting the UPN primetime to show it in HD, but they don't do that.)

As far as other channels - besides Comcast (which you have found) there is DirecTV and Dish Network satellite services available. Both of them are developing their lineups and Dish is expecting to make major improvements in the fall/beginning of 2006. So my simple advice is don't make long term comittments to any company.

JL

Just wanted to bump and suscribe to this....I'm a noob here and was hoping to get some direction. I'm still reading, though....

I'm going to be moving to the South Bend area soon; my fiancee is already in Mishawaka, and we've got a brand new Samsung HDTV that I really want to try out. DVDs look awesome, but I was hoping to test out some of the HDTV programming thats available. So that's basically my question - what's available and how do I get it? We've got Comcast digital cable with HBO, but it looks like comcast only provides like 2 local channels and then some movies? Most of our TV watching is on the major networks, plus things like TBS, TNT, MTV, etc. I'd like ESPN in HD, too. I can't get some of those extended stations over the air, can I? Speaking of, what do I need to get them over the air (that's my next research after posting this :-) )

I guess in summary, in the South Bend area, what is the best option to get the most HD programming available? Thanks for any info!

Comcast is probably your best bet for the channels you mention. They have TNTHD, ESPNHD, Comcast SportsnetHD, InHD 1 & 2, CBS, NBC, PBS. Comcast is probably the most expensive option, but there is no long term obligation.

Alesh1, I would reccommend DISH, the 10 VOOM channels in HD are a blast. In addition, Comcast does not carry all of the local HD channels, so you need an ATSC receiver anyway.

With a simple antenna, you wil receive all of the locals easily. DISH also has SHOHD, HBOHD, TNTHD, HDnet, HDmovies, and Discovery HD.

Currently, there is no way tp receive ABC HD from any source.

Currently, there is no way tp receive ABC HD from any source.

doh, how do I get my NBA Finals in HD then? :-) Thanks for all the good info guys - I think I might start looking into an OTA antenna / receiver....where do I start for that?

edmicman, The DISH HD receiver has an ATSC receiver built-in. The Comcast stb's have no such feature. Direct HD satelite receivers also feature ATSC tuners.

We can receive ABC in STD via a LPTV station.

As for the antenna, it won't take much to pick up the stations in Mishawaka. I'm further away over in Elkhart and decided to get a cheap Radio Shack outdoor UHF that has served me well. Check out Antennaweb.org (http://antennaweb.org/) and you will see that the simplist "Yellow" antenna will get you all the digital locals. (SD versions of nearly all the channels are available on Comcast and DishNetwork ...)

I *have* been able to pull in the ABC from Fort Wayne, but I am in Elkhart. I don't see even the analog version of WPTA listed on antennaweb from Mishawaka.

JL

BTW: I decided to reconnect my Fort Wayne antenna. I am still able to pull in WPTA-DT 24 (21.1 and 21.2).
Signal strengths: (on my Samsung SIR-150)
Local channels are mostly "halfway" on the signal strength meter ... about 8 bars.
WPTA-DT is currently (middle of the night) coming in at 3 bars (25%?).

I'm using two of RS's cheapest UHF Only ("Red") antennas and no amp.

Analog channels are worthless from Fort Wayne.
WPTA-21 is too close to WSBT-22 and unless I install an antenna switch or give up on my own locals it won't improve. WANE-15 is also poor ... but that is expected with WNDU-16 booming in. WISE-33 is watchable but weak but will be worse when local WNIT-34 turns back on in the morning. WFWA-39 and WFFT-55 are poor quality (I'm actually getting better signal out of WOTV-41 Battle Creek ... and I don't have an antenna pointed that way.)

I'm actually getting a better signal on WPTA-DT than any of the non-local analogs. Which is promising. I'll have to check during the daytime and see if I lose it.

Update:
The sun came up and the signal went down. Guess I'll have to reserve my WPTA viewing for nighttime. :D (The Fort Wayne analogs all went away.)

JL

Currently, there is no way tp receive ABC HD from any source.

A friend of mine has Directv and gets ABCHD on the satellite because ABC57 in South Bend is a low power station, and he lives far enough away to be out of the b grade area. He lives in Goshen.

Unfortunately Mishawaka is too close to the transmitter to be outside of Grade B.
WBND "ABC57" Coverage - per FCC (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=TX614822.html)

Looks like D* needs to update their database as well. Goshen is inside Grade B.

JL

justalurker: Any ideas about any relief from the "Digital White Area" legislation? It seems we should al qualify for distant HD from ABC, with no local service in sight in any future projection.

Hey gang,

I just had to check in from Illinois tonight. I'm watching WNDU-DT 16.3's radar
spin "backwards" (they do that to wear the gears evenly, from other TV
station radar owners who tell me as much). Oh yeah, It's 11:30 PM CT,
and I am 60 miles due west of downtown Chicago, using a ChannelMaster 4228 with a CM 7777 preamp...in my attic! :eek: :D

Gotta love tropospheric ducting, aka "skip"! WNDU and WSBT are frequent
visitors to my antenna. However, a 1 mw FOX DT is due to sign on in
October, and that will probably, for the most part, spell the end of
my chances of getting WNDU. WSBT can trounce a local WSPY-TV 30 with
its eyes closed. :-)

justalurker: Any ideas about any relief from the "Digital White Area" legislation? It seems we should al qualify for distant HD from ABC, with no local service in sight in any future projection.IIRC Digital White Areas won't be in effect until 2007. It has been a while since I looked over SHVERA.

JL

I just got a message on my Comcast HD box that they will have WMWB-HD and WBND-HD starting on Sep. 7. Does anyone know if these channels are going to be broadcasting OTA?

Al

I just got a message on my Comcast HD box that they will have WMWB-HD and WBND-HD starting on Sep. 7. Does anyone know if these channels are going to be broadcasting OTA?

Al

Nope, cable only. Actually, I had been sitting on that news but I had to wait until
I had permission to break the good news. You beat me to the punch, nicely done! :-)

Nope, cable only. Actually, I had been sitting on that news but I had to wait until I had permission to break the good news. You beat me to the punch, nicely done! :-)It will be interesting to see where they end up OTA when the time comes, since both are out of core.

The TV stations have always seemed to have a friendly relationship in the SB market with whatever the cable company has been. Perhaps some of that is just the public face. Getting HD as a Cable Only offering is sweet.

JL

Hi, This announcement is very stimulating. Can anyone provide an estimate for minimum cable costs which include the HD locals?
Thanks, aggie

Any new word on the ABC HD situation? I have directv was wondering if the only way to get this station would be through cable.

Thanks - drew

Hi, This announcement is very stimulating. Can anyone provide an estimate for minimum cable costs which include the HD locals?
Thanks, aggie

I believe if you have a QAM tuner and get the basic cable for about $15 a month you will get the local HD channels. I haven't actually tried this.

Al

Thanks Al, I asked Comcast, and they said about $50/month, basic +HD +box. So now I need a switching unit to switch between component sources. My Sony receiver can't do it. The bandwidth is inadaquate.

aggie

Anyeone have Comcast service? The ABC HD was rumored to start today...did it?

thanks,

I live in Fort Wayneand trying to get the FOX station out of South Bend(WSJV).
I tried 28.1 last week but with no success. SOmeone told me today that they thought the correct station was 58.1.

Before I get back on my roof could someone tell me which one is correct.

Ben

I live in Fort Wayneand trying to get the FOX station out of South Bend(WSJV).
I tried 28.1 last week but with no success. SOmeone told me today that they thought the correct station was 58.1.

Before I get back on my roof could someone tell me which one is correct.

Ben
WSJV-DT is on 58; the PSIP data remaps it to 28-1.

I just got a message on my Comcast HD box that they will have WMWB-HD and WBND-HD starting on Sep. 7. Does anyone know if these channels are going to be broadcasting OTA?

AlIt's feldercarb like this that makes me think that the FCC should yank Weigel's two LP licenses. They "serve" the public interest of the South Bend/Elkhart DMA about as well as I serve a tennis ball (believe me, it ain't a pretty sight!) I live maybe three miles from their tower and have a small yagi pointed in their general direction, yet my channel 57 is usually snowy, especially if Notre Dame is playing on ABC. Yet this is considered to be an "A" contour and thus denies me ABC from Chicago via DBS.

It's one thing when WSBT broadcasts UPN digitally and Comcast picks it up as a service to those without ATSC receivers, but this is saying "I have a major and a minor affiliate in HD, but I'm too cheap-@ss to buy the digital transmitters, so I'll just cut a deal with the local cable outlet to carry the HD. Everyone has cable anyway..."

Well, as an ATSC household with the demographics that local retailers would love to target, I guess I won't be buying anything from anyone who advertises on WBND or WMWB, not until they go ATSC.

Anyeone have Comcast service? The ABC HD was rumored to start today...did it?

thanks,

I checked this morning, no new channels yet.

I live maybe three miles from their tower and have a small yagi pointed in their general direction, yet my channel 57 is usually snowy, especially if Notre Dame is playing on ABC. Yet this is considered to be an "A" contour and thus denies me ABC from Chicago via DBS.

"I have a major and a minor affiliate in HD, but I'm too cheap-@ss to buy the digital transmitters, so I'll just cut a deal with the local cable outlet to carry the HD. Everyone has cable anyway...".

I live in Middlebury, at least 35 miles from the transmitters, and get a snow-free pic on 25, 57, and 69 with an 8-bay. Maybe something is wrong with your setup?

The FCC has not allocated frequencies for LP stations to go digital. The only way they can put on a digital signal is to switch off their analog.

Al

Roland and all interested parties:
I have inquired on another forum if anyone has encountered a situation like this...no HD-OTA, but cable only HD. I received no positive responses, so this seems to be a unique business model. I can't help but wonder if ABC -57 would offer HD to Direct if/when they get sufficient bird-bandwidth to offer local HDservice in our neck of the woods. This mode will certainly save on the I&M power bill. I wonder if there is a minimum required power for LP-TV. If not, this could be a real neat way to get additional networks, if there were any!

I got another message on my Comcast box on Thursday. The new HD channels are delayed until 9-20.

Al

Al, Thanks for the update. Please keep us advised.

The new channels, WBND-HD and WMWB-HD came on on the 20th. So far ABC-HD has had messed up audio every time I check it.

Al

Did you get these channels from cable or from your antenna?

Did you get these channels from cable or from your antenna?Drew, Al has Comcast. As of this monring, a scan of the OTA Digitals doesn't show any new ATSC stations.

Al, is it really WBND, or is it just ABC-HD from a different source? In other words, did WBND pay for all the HD-capable equipment, just not the transmitter?

Al, is it really WBND, or is it just ABC-HD from a different source? In other words, did WBND pay for all the HD-capable equipment, just not the transmitter?

Yes, it is WBND. The shows are all the same. SD is stretched and cropped a little, not as much as WNDU.

Al

Al, Thanks for the update. The Comcast web page now shows both additions as well.

Roland, They (the ABC guys) don't have an additional channel assignment yet..do they? So it seems that this is the first of a new business model for LPTV stations. As far as I have been able to determine, there is no announced FCC date for conversion of the LPTV's to digital. Please correct me if I am in error.

I believe that with the new (digital) format with a different overlap to adjacent channels, it is technically possible for the FCC to assign adjacent channels in any given locale, As a result, the number of LPTV stations could bloom like dandelions in spring. In turn, with no present requirement for digital operation, would it be possible for analog stations to go to LP transmission, and distribute HD signals on cable and satellite (at least Direct in the near future)? This would lower the electrical bills dramatically, while retaining analog tranmission, and contact with the low-income viewers who depend on analog OTA.

Sorry, my prior remarks were mixed-moded. Adjacent digital LPTV's would not interfere with each other, but analog LPTV's would. It is not clear if they (digital and analog) could alternate in channel assignments without interference. I suppose somone has the information.

Well, if the LPTV stations don't have to play by the same rules as the full power stations, then WBND should have no right to block my reception of ABC HD programing via DBS when it becomes available.

I guess I should be happy, since the FCC cut-off for analog signals requires that a given percentage of households need to be able to receive the digital signal before the analog stations can be shut down. Once analog is shut down, WBND-LP and WMWB-LP can switch over to ATSC operations and I'll be able to get nice, clear, snow- and ghost-free ABC and WB programming without having to pay Comcast a thing.

Roland, Digital "white area" rules should solve our problem, when they are announced. The FCC has delayed in announcement of the "Rule-Making". When that happens, either Dish or Direct should be able to provide us wih a distant local for ABC (assuming that WBND hasn't converted).

d

Okay, here is the skinny, any help would be greatly, greatly appreciated. I have a Samsung T451 OTA Receiver. A little background, I live in Elkhart,Goshen border, actually it could be considered Dunlap by the Concord Mall area. According to Antennaweb.org I am roughly 15 miles from all the South Bend Towers.
I am having a terrible time with the antenna situation. I live in an apartment so outdoor antenna just isn't going to work. So I went and purchased the Zenith Silver Sensor since it got such good reviews. I hooked it all up, then nothing. I had it pointing in the right direction according to antennaweb, nothing, zilch, no signal on every channel. Thinking something wasn't right I used the antenna on my TV, worked out pretty good, some snow on channels but I got every one I cared about 16, 22, 28, 34. 28 Fox was probably the most messed up but it still got it in. So I thought maybe the signal wasn't strong enough so I went to radio shack to buy an amplified antenna. I bought their UHF VHF entry level amplieied, I think it was 15db and cost 30.00, hooked it up and as soon as I powered it up I received 22 and 34 with pretty good quality. I watched some on it and thought it was great, but I wanted 16 and 28, so I went back to get the 50.00 highly rated 15-1880 amplfied antenna (26db). I hooked it up and before turning it on I instantly got channel 22 with as good of reception as the antenna before being turned on. So I turned on the amplification to see what I would get and instantly I lost the signal. I don't know if I had too much signal or what but I lost it. With it powered on I could not get any signals. Later in the night with lots of cloud cover I couldn't get 22 either unpowered or powered. So now I am on my third antenna option, I went and bought a 10 signal amplifier for the Silver Sensor. Still nothing. I guess i just do not totally understand everything going on with antenna technology and HDTV. All the antennas will pull in the channels pretty good on my regular TV, but for some reason the ATSC tuner says I do not have a signal.
Question to all, what type of an antenna do I need to get to pull in the 4 channels I want from South bend? It seems like too much power is overpowering 22, but the others I can't even pull in. Has anyone in my general area had good experience with an indoor antenna? I live in the second floor, but facing the towers is directly into a wall with no windows that goes through about 4 other small apartments. There are lots of windows everywhere else except the wall due west where the towers are. Any help and I would be estatic or a point in the right direction to help me answer why this is happening to me. Thanks everyone

CW1981, It is usually claimed that ATSC signals have better reach than NTSC signals. As a consequence, I suggest that it may be a good idea to have your ATSC receiver checked. This especialy since you get watchable signals with a different receiver. Of course, the DTV signals are on higher frequency channels, which may have impact.

Can you receive ABC 57? It s a low power analog signal.

If you are north of Meijer you probably have trash mountain and part of the continental divide in your way. I ended up needing a rooftop antenna thanks to the big hill (I'm North of trash mountain).

JL

BTW: WNDU has dropped Spin City and is showing an infomercial before Conan O'Brien. With the time change coming up in about a month (national feeds returning to EST scheduling) perhaps the contract ended early? In any case, it looks like a month of infomercials is on the way! :D

JL

I will check on Channel 57. I live right behind Meijer (west). I can see it out my window, so I don't know if the trash mountain is in the way.

I took back the Radio Shack Amplified Reciever already. However I still have the unamplified Silver Sensor and I do pull in the following channels. 16, 22, 28, 34, 46 and 57

They all have quite a bit of snow in the picture but the audio is good (28 and 57 probably have the worse quality) 46 is really good and I can't pull it in on my ASTC tuner? Everything says no signal with the antenna I am currently using to pull all the channels in with my regular TV.

Okay, now I am getting frustrated. I tweaked the antenna and I am pulling in "near" perfect crisp reception with my antenna over analog on 16, 22, 28, 34,46, 57 is still snowy. So I leave the antenna in place and hook it up to my ASTC tuner (Samsung T451), and what do I still get? No Signal on every channel.

Sorry for so many updates. Latest. I have analog every channel pulling in crystal except 57 still snowy. Rescanned on my ASTC tuner and I am pulling 22.1, 22.2, 22.3, 34.1,34.2.

On analog 34 is not as good as 16. Any reason I am having such a hard time pulling in 16 and 28? Are these two channels not powered as well?

I am almost thinking it may be the tuner unless I hear otherwise, I am going to try to pick a different model up and see what happens, I suppose I can always return it.

I live in Leesburg, IN and I'm completely lost....what all do i need to get an HD signal...i want to spend as little as possible and would prefer not to go through putting up a big antenna...

Heres my tv (dont know if i need a tuner, i cant tell)
I cant link but its the $1088 RCA HDTV from Walmart

and heres my antennaweb info....

DTV Antenna
Type Call Sign Channel Network City State Live
Date Compass
Orientation Miles
From Frequency
Assignment
* lt green - uhf WSBT-DT 22.1 CBS SOUTH BEND IN 317 30.4 30
* lt green - uhf WNDU-DT 16.1 NBC SOUTH BEND IN 316°29.7 42
* red - uhf WNIT-DT 34.1 PBS SOUTH BEND IN 318° 29.7 35
* blue - uhf WFFT-DT 55.1 FOX FORT WAYNE IN 119° 33.8 36
* blue - uhf WANE-DT 15.1 CBS FORT WAYNE IN 120° 31
* violet - uhf WPTA-DT 21.1 ABC FORT WAYNE IN 120° 34.5 24
* violet - uhf WSJV-DT 28.1 FOX ELKHART IN 318° 29.5 58

I live in Leesburg, IN and I'm completely lost....what all do i need to get an HD signal...i want to spend as little as possible and would prefer not to go through putting up a big antenna...

Heres my tv (dont know if i need a tuner, i cant tell)
I cant link but its the $1088 RCA HDTV from Walmart

and heres my antennaweb info....

DTV Antenna
Type Call Sign Channel Network City State Live
Date Compass
Orientation Miles
From Frequency
Assignment
* lt green - uhf WSBT-DT 22.1 CBS SOUTH BEND IN 317 30.4 30
* lt green - uhf WNDU-DT 16.1 NBC SOUTH BEND IN 316°29.7 42
* red - uhf WNIT-DT 34.1 PBS SOUTH BEND IN 318° 29.7 35
* blue - uhf WFFT-DT 55.1 FOX FORT WAYNE IN 119° 33.8 36
* blue - uhf WANE-DT 15.1 CBS FORT WAYNE IN 120° 31
* violet - uhf WPTA-DT 21.1 ABC FORT WAYNE IN 120° 34.5 24
* violet - uhf WSJV-DT 28.1 FOX ELKHART IN 318° 29.5 58

You should be able to check your owners manual and see if your TV has a builtin ATSC tuner. If it doesn't have one builtin you can buy the one at Walmart for about $200. You also need an antenna. You are plenty close enough to South Bend to get all the stations here.

Al

If that's the RCA D52W19 that Walmart sells for $1800, here's what the description says - "HDTV ready; will require a set-top box (purchase separately) to decode high definition signals" .
It does have twin tuners, but that's for analog only.

I have it working now. I went out and purchased a cheap hinense USDTV ASTC tuner from Walmart. Instantly I locked onto every channel. I then had to play with antenna placement to receive all channels. The samsung I would not recommend because it has an needs an extremely strong signal before it will even attempt to lock in on the channel. After I had the antenna in the right placement the samsung worked fine. I still sent it back because actually the cheap hinense I liked better.

As of 10/4/05 at 8:51 AM, WSJV is at 220 kw, full power until analog shutdown,
when it will go higher.

I am attempting to get NBC WGEM (Quincy) from Macomb, IL. Antennaweb.org says its about 52miles away. WGEM broadcast digitally on channel 10.1. Would having a UHF only antenna (Like a Channel Master 4228) cause problems since that is such a low channel?

Thanks

Anyone seeing break-ups and drop outs on 16.1and 22.1 (OTA)? I have seen no problems lately on 28.1 or 34.1, but NBC and CBS both appear to have problems, unless I have a new tree problem...

thanks,

I am attempting to get NBC WGEM (Quincy) from Macomb, IL. Antennaweb.org says its about 52miles away. WGEM broadcast digitally on channel 10.1. Would having a UHF only antenna (Like a Channel Master 4228) cause problems since that is such a low channel?

Thanks
WGEM boadcasts its DT on channel 54 which would require a UHF antenna.At some point they will likely move back to CH 10,so you really need both,for now and in the future.

Anyone seeing break-ups and drop outs on 16.1and 22.1 (OTA)? I have seen no problems lately on 28.1 or 34.1, but NBC and CBS both appear to have problems, unless I have a new tree problem...

Up here in Michigan, DT 16 and 22 almost never come in as well as DT 28 and 34. Their analog signals are fine but I still get occasional drop-outs even though the indicated signal strength is around 80%. I just assume they have some problems with their data stream. DT 16 is usually worse than 22 BTW.

The other thing that annoys me about South Bend is that they have no ABC affiliate since 28 went to Fox. That means I have to swing my antennae around to Chicago for ABC. This will be resolved in the future when WLS moves to channel 11(?) for their digital assignment since I can go back to using my VHF antennae for them.

Blato, Thans for the response, I will attempt to contact each station, they may not know about the dropouts. The last time I checked with them, engineering management did not have HD at home! In addition, I am not convinced that they really care. A horrible audio problem with Ch 22 took months to resolve; I even sent them an audio tape of their distorted sound.

The ABC situation here has a curious solution. Comcast is carrying a digital feed from the LPTV which is not OTA with HD! You are lucky if you can get Chicago ABC HD, I would need something like a 50' tower.

WGEM boadcasts its DT on channel 54 which would require a UHF antenna.At some point they will likely move back to CH 10,so you really need both,for now and in the future.

Oh? Thats odd. Cause they say its channel 10.1 for digital
http://www.wgem.com/tv/wgem-hd.php

Will other stations be moving to VHF too?

Anyone seeing break-ups and drop outs on 16.1and 22.1 (OTA)? I have seen no problems lately on 28.1 or 34.1, but NBC and CBS both appear to have problems, unless I have a new tree problem...

thanks,Aggie, the only issues I have with WNDU/WSBT are related to the lack of available bits for their "HD" sub-channels. WSBT's sound has had some issues, but for most part, has been solid recently. I see more problems with WNIT's HD channel, but I think it may be an encoder issue and not a reception problem as the signal quality meter reads in the mid-to-high 90s.

Roland, Thanks for the reply. Tonight "Jay" was going black for several seconds at a time with audio drop-outs, and I believe that they switched to the SD feed and streched it.

Oh? Thats odd. Cause they say its channel 10.1 for digital
http://www.wgem.com/tv/wgem-hd.php

Will other stations be moving to VHF too?With certain restrictions, each station gets to make the choice of whether they will stay on their new digital channel or move their digital signal to their old analog channel when the analogs are turned off.

10.1 is just a display channel, the actual signal could be on any TV channel. Right now they are using channel 54 and apparently have decided to move their digital signal to 10 when analogs die. They would continue to use 10.1 as a display channel even if they stayed on a UHF channel. (IIRC: The FCC wants 54 and the othe high end UHF channels back for other uses. If WGEM decided not to go back to 10 they would have to find another channel to put their signal on.

JL

Anyone seeing break-ups and drop outs on 16.1and 22.1 (OTA)? I have seen no problems lately on 28.1 or 34.1, but NBC and CBS both appear to have problems, unless I have a new tree problem...

thanks,

WSBT 22.1 OTA has many problems....I have seen many "drop outs" and "break ups".

Especially recently, it seems to have gotten worse. I jut emailed them when all of the primetime on Oct 3 was in HD video and no audio at all. I did get a reply from the engineer saying they acknowledge the audio problem. Here is his response ..."Yes, I am aware of the audio problems. We have an intermittent HD satellite receiver that loses audio and then comes back. We are working to correct this problem." But gave no dates or promises.

I don't watch many other HD channels, so I can't say there.

joshMV4; Thanks for the confirmation! Unually the stations want to deny any and all problems, and claim that the viewer has faulty equipment, trees, etc.

It seems to me that the stations with tecnical problems should post that info on their web-sites, including when fixes were made

I currently have D* with HD service. I get all the OTA stations pretty clearly. But my problem is i need to bundle some services because i'm paying way too much for DSL + D* + phone. I was thinking i could lower my monthly bills by switching to comcast for HSI and HD...then i could get vonage for phone service (we have sprint phones but we barely get signal in our house)

I was wondering if there were any downsided to Comcast HD v D* ... i know the MPEG4 conversion is starting, but who knows when anything new is gonna come up.

Please help....


Thanks,

Figskate

I currently have D* with HD service. I get all the OTA stations pretty clearly. But my problem is i need to bundle some services because i'm paying way too much for DSL + D* + phone. I was thinking i could lower my monthly bills by switching to comcast for HSI and HD...then i could get vonage for phone service (we have sprint phones but we barely get signal in our house)

I was wondering if there were any downsided to Comcast HD v D* ... i know the MPEG4 conversion is starting, but who knows when anything new is gonna come up.

Please help....


Thanks,

Figskate

I highly recommend Comcast HD over D* as the HD is not compressed.

D* is actually not HD but somewhere in between 720p and 480p (See the many forums on this ). Comcast offers VOIP service but not in my zip yet so you may want to stick w/ DSL.

Downside: The technician may not know how to set up the STB correctly for HD (mine didn't). I used the Moto 6412 forum to get the answers.

If you wanted to do VOIP you can get it from vonage without the need for comcast to supply it, you just need Cable High speed internet. Comcast is offering a "dish buy back" program that would save me over $900 over the next year. Considerably less savings year over year, but who says i won't switch again in a year! You gotta play the game to save the dough!

Figskate

Did ayone else notice that complete lack of sound on 22.1 (WSBTV South Bend) on Sunday eve? They really do a good job of monitoring their broadcast!

In addition, there seems to be a lot of break-up, and occasional black screens!

If they have a tech problem, I would expect to see a crawling mesage!

Perhaps the device that creates the scroll was broken too. :D

JL

Hello,
I live in SB and just got an HDTV set, and I was hoping someone here could fill me in a bit. I'm getting my HD channels via a Comcast DVR box and everything's working great except for the WBND-HD channel, which has no audio. From reading this whole thread, that appears to be par for the course for a number of these channels, but I'm a little unclear in this particular case if it's a temporary tech problem that will be fixed or if that's just the way it is for WBND. Also, Comcast doesn't have an HD channel for WSJV/FOX, and I'm wondering if I could get that programming via an antenna. Thanks for any help!

Chris

Hello,
I live in SB and just got an HDTV set, and I was hoping someone here could fill me in a bit. I'm getting my HD channels via a Comcast DVR box and everything's working great except for the WBND-HD channel, which has no audio. From reading this whole thread, that appears to be par for the course for a number of these channels, but I'm a little unclear in this particular case if it's a temporary tech problem that will be fixed or if that's just the way it is for WBND. Also, Comcast doesn't have an HD channel for WSJV/FOX, and I'm wondering if I could get that programming via an antenna. Thanks for any help!

Chris

WBND has had audio every time I have watched it until I tried to watch "Desperate Housewives" that I had recorded on Sunday. That's irritating when you have recorded something and then can't watch it.

Yes, if you have an ATSC tuner in your TV, you should be able to watch WSJV HD.
Al

I turned on WBND HD during the day on Wed and the sound was OK. Then Wed evening I turned it on during the HD programming and got no sound.

Al

It's funny, I've gotten sound on WBND-HD a few times now, but the three times I tuned in to watch specific shows -- Desperate Housewives, MNF, and Lost -- no sound. You'd think they're strategically trying to ruin their best programming.

But everything else has been wonderful. I found myself watching a PBS puppet show for three-year-olds yesterday just because it was so pretty looking.

Chris

It's funny, I've gotten sound on WBND-HD a few times now, but the three times I tuned in to watch specific shows -- Desperate Housewives, MNF, and Lost -- no sound. You'd think they're strategically trying to ruin their best programming.

But everything else has been wonderful. I found myself watching a PBS puppet show for three-year-olds yesterday just because it was so pretty looking.

Chris
Yeah, I think maybe they lose the audio when they are showing the network HiDef feed. I have started recording on the SD channel also just to be sure to get my favorite shows.

Al

Hey folks,

WNDU-TV was just sold from Notre Dame U. to Gray broadcasting (pending FCC approval). Assuming it goes through, an era has ended.

Notre Dame has poured money into the station over the years, making it the power house that it has been and is today. Flooding money into it's news and weather operations, this station has had equipment that BIG market stations
would drool over. 2 news helicopters, producers of nationally syndicated programs like "Ag Day", legendary news and weathercasters like Dick Addis...

All coming to an end. Gray Television doesn't have deep pockets, and I fear
that the cost-cutting will start the moment they close on the sale. I pray
they don't. WNDU is a legend, a bastion of quality broadcasting, and is what one gets when everyone on board excels to be the best, from news to engineering to production, and is given the time and money to do so. I have never heard a bad thing said about WNDU, other than minor complaints. It was, and is, a station that other stations need to consider copying.

I hope Gray Broadcasting doesn't take that apart. I grew up with WNDU 80 miles away, thanks to tropo...and loved their programming. Some days, I watched it more than the stations in Chicago. This summer, a "YES!" echoed from my mouth when, during a mild tropo event, WNDU-DT came on my digital tuner 60 miles west of Chicago. As I expected, the picture on the main and two subchannels was sharp and colors were crisp. Exactly what I expected from WNDU.

Thanks, ND, for being such good stewards of this station. I only hope Gray Broadcasting can keep it going. In Rockford, they got rid of their longtime news anchors, and hired one anchor to replace them. Maybe they have got a second on the way, but it's been awhile, and I'm not holding my breath. Having said that, however, I hope the executives there realize what a gem they have and keep it the ratings and quality powerhouse it has been since 1955.

Is anyone having problems with WNDU tonight, its been down for me for awhile and i need confirmation that its not just me :(

Hey folks,

WNDU-TV was just sold from Notre Dame U. to Gray broadcasting (pending FCC approval). Assuming it goes through, an era has ended.

Notre Dame has poured money into the station over the years, making it the power house that it has been and is today. Flooding money into it's news and weather operations, this station has had equipment that BIG market stations
would drool over. 2 news helicopters, producers of nationally syndicated programs like "Ag Day", legendary news and weathercasters like Dick Addis...

All coming to an end. Gray Television doesn't have deep pockets, and I fear
that the cost-cutting will start the moment they close on the sale. I pray
they don't. WNDU is a legend, a bastion of quality broadcasting, and is what one gets when everyone on board excels to be the best, from news to engineering to production, and is given the time and money to do so. I have never heard a bad thing said about WNDU, other than minor complaints. It was, and is, a station that other stations need to consider copying.

I hope Gray Broadcasting doesn't take that apart. I grew up with WNDU 80 miles away, thanks to tropo...and loved their programming. Some days, I watched it more than the stations in Chicago. This summer, a "YES!" echoed from my mouth when, during a mild tropo event, WNDU-DT came on my digital tuner 60 miles west of Chicago. As I expected, the picture on the main and two subchannels was sharp and colors were crisp. Exactly what I expected from WNDU.

Thanks, ND, for being such good stewards of this station. I only hope Gray Broadcasting can keep it going. In Rockford, they got rid of their longtime news anchors, and hired one anchor to replace them. Maybe they have got a second on the way, but it's been awhile, and I'm not holding my breath. Having said that, however, I hope the executives there realize what a gem they have and keep it the ratings and quality powerhouse it has been since 1955.


I am a past owner of a station sold to Gray in 1996. Gray does not operate they way you have feared. They do have deep poskets and understand the legacy of # 1 stations in mid to small size markets. They will not dismantle WNDU but build upon it.

I am a past owner of a station sold to Gray in 1996. Gray does not operate they way you have feared. They do have deep poskets and understand the legacy of # 1 stations in mid to small size markets. They will not dismantle WNDU but build upon it.
Lcosby,

I am only going upon what I saw in Rockford, and that wasn't good. I really, really, REALLY do hope you are right. Time will tell.

Hi, I continue to see (and hear) dropouts on 22.1, even after the trees which could be a problem have dropped their leaves.

The picture pixilates frequently during fast action as well. In particular, in shots in which a person is shown against a fixed background, e.g. Letterman, the head/body breaks up.

Does anyone else notice this problem? I am using a DISH 6000 receiver.

aggie

Hi Everyone! New to the group. I am a master control operator in the South Bend market. If I can answer any questions, I'll be happy to. If I don't know the answer, I'll go to a reliable source that does. Enjoyed the comments.

Welcome to the AVS Forum, mc operator. This should be the place to find out how well your viewers are receiving your ATSC signal.

Thank you for welcoming me to the group! It's fantastic to be able to communicate with viewers and vice versa, :)

I guess I should mention whom I'm with...I'm with WNDU.

It's funny, I've gotten sound on WBND-HD a few times now, but the three times I tuned in to watch specific shows -- Desperate Housewives, MNF, and Lost -- no sound. You'd think they're strategically trying to ruin their best programming.

But everything else has been wonderful. I found myself watching a PBS puppet show for three-year-olds yesterday just because it was so pretty looking.

Chris

I'm having the same issues with WBND-HD (187) on Comcast. Sometimes audio doesn't work at all; sometimes it glitches; many times (during "Lost" and "Desperate Housewives" the video and/or audio drops out so many times you can't watch the show. Tonight the audio is only coming out of the left channel, not right. Sometimes HD stations are widescreen in HD, most times they are SD in 4:3.

I'm not sure what the problem is, but it is very frustrating. It's pretty worthless to try to record anything on that channel anymore. I've never had a good recording yet.

As far as I'm concerned, Comcast does not yet offer ABC in HD in South Bend.

Hi, I continue to see (and hear) dropouts on 22.1, even after the trees which could be a problem have dropped their leaves.

The picture pixilates frequently during fast action as well. In particular, in shots in which a person is shown against a fixed background, e.g. Letterman, the head/body breaks up.

Does anyone else notice this problem? I am using a DISH 6000 receiver.

aggie


Aggie,

In my opinion, CBS 22.1 is the worst of the 4 HD channels, and worst in quality. I live in Nappanee and pick up all S. Bend HD stations on a DTV Sony HD300 with strong signals on each, even 46.1.

The HD Colts games are pixelated on camera zooms and fast action, network programing is the same. This Sunday's game was no exception. I will switch back and forth to Bears Games on FOX 28.1 and the difference is amazing. It is like night and day.

Also, I have had to call the station and ask for them to pull the switch at least 2 times this year for games that were suspose to be brodcast in HD. The late game 2 weeks ago was one of those times. I sat down this earlier this fall to watch the prime time line up on 22.1, and it was not being sent out in HD.

This is disapointing. I feel they dont really care about the OTA HD brodcast quality or if they even turn it on at all. I would be interested to know what is going on over there on this subject.

Aggie,

In my opinion, CBS 22.1 is the worst of the 4 HD channels, and worst in quality. I live in Nappanee and pick up all S. Bend HD stations on a DTV Sony HD300 with strong signals on each, even 46.1.

The HD Colts games are pixelated on camera zooms and fast action, network programing is the same. This Sunday's game was no exception. I will switch back and forth to Bears Games on FOX 28.1 and the difference is amazing. It is like night and day.

Also, I have had to call the station and ask for them to pull the switch at least 2 times this year for games that were suspose to be brodcast in HD. The late game 2 weeks ago was one of those times. I sat down this earlier this fall to watch the prime time line up on 22.1, and it was not being sent out in HD.

This is disapointing. I feel they dont really care about the OTA HD brodcast quality or if they even turn it on at all. I would be interested to know what is going on over there on this subject.


I too have been very disappointed with WSBT 22.1. I have noticed the poor quality at times as well. Multiple times they have audio problems.

I have emailed an engineer there from an email I found on their web site, and he acknowledged the problem, but blamed it on a poor sattelite feed and/or a receiver problem at their station. I also noticed that they must have a manual switch that they throw at prime time to go from regular to HD programming. I don't think they have the technology to broadcast live in HD.

The HD often doesn't start when it should in HD. (The picture is still cropped to 4x3 and my receiver is only recieving 2 channel dolby instead of 5.1 surround). Then they throw the switch (often mid-program), and it jumps to widescreen HD and 5.1 surround sound. But they always switch it back to SD (usually during commercials), right before a news anchor comes on to give a 30 second blip, then try to switch back to HD again without us knowing. It is very unprofessional.

Here is my speculation for the theory on quality....I am no expert on this though...In comparing the local Fox to WSBT, Fox's channel is only braodcasting the Fox network, using all the bandwidth for that. But WSBT is broadcasting CBS on the majority of the bandwith, but also splitting it up to broadcast UPN and a local weather channel, so the primary CBS channel loses bandwidth as a result. I have heard that the cable companies have the same problem, trying to stuff multiple HD channels, regular cable & internet all in a given bandwidth.

It has been a while since I managed to get 22.3 to work on my receiver. I tune it but it never shows me a picture. (This is on a SIR-150 - I hope to get a new tuner soon to see if that can tune it.) I have no problems with 16.1/.2/.3 - they tune immediately and (except for the stretched upconvert) I have no issues with 16.1 . WSBT might as well drop 22.3 .

WNIT seems to be doing well and I consider it the benchmark for HD. I also appreciate that they leave the HD running overnight with "bonus" programs on 34.2 .

I wish WHME would rent their wasted space to WMWB, WBND, WAAT and W18CF (TBN). It would be better than letting it sit empty and would get those LPs on digital quicker.

JL

I wish WHME would rent their wasted space to WMWB, WBND, WAAT and W18CF (TBN). It would be better than letting it sit empty and would get those LPs on digital quicker.I've often wondered the same thing, WHME is sitting on a digital gold mine and could be doing a community service as well.

Then I think about the programs on ABC like "Desparate Housewives" and those on the WB like "Smallville" and think that programs like these would make Lester Summeral spin in his grave :eek:

JL, the Accurain units that RatShaq were closing out a few months ago don't seem to have any problem receiving the low bitrate of WSBT-WX. I got one for my Dad for Christmas (good thing he doesn't read AVS Forum!)

Can anyone tell me if it just my tuner (MyHD MDP-130) or is WNIT's PSIP channel ID sent in lower case "wnit-hd" as opposed to "WNIT-HD"? Just sorta annoying I guess, at least to me. I am glad however that they are doing 34.1 and no longer 35.1, as I also get WGVU, and they are 35.1.

Now if they just wouldnt multicast, and give their HD feed more than 13mbps I would be truly happy! :)

Kirby,
WNIT-DT sends it out lower case, it's not just you.

I just picked up a Comast HD box a few days ago. I only got the dumb thing because they claimed to offer ABC in HD. Well my first opportunity to watch what I thought would be HD was the MNF game and it was as square (4:3) as my 10 year old tube tv. It might have been digital, but it certainly wasn't HD. What's the deal? Was this a fluke? All the other HD channels were HD. I'll check it again tonight during prime time, but I'm hoping that they at least have the ability to broadcast HD for things like the ND game on Jan. 2!! I get all the OTA channels very well from Granger without a powered antenna. Of course I guess we're all still wondering when ABC is going to get in the game.

All:

We are currently rebuilding our technical facilities in Chicago that also control WMWB and WBND in South Bend. Currently, all programming is being upconverted 24/7 until Saturday, Jan. 28. We are now operating on an all digital SD plant and will not introduce HD into the mix until phase 2 is complete at the end of January.

FYI, ABC network NY went through a similar rebuild last fall and operated in a 24/7 upconvert mode nationwide for just over 3 weeks. We are simply doing the same on a local level. When complete, all processing for both stations (graphics too) will be in true HD and a 4:3 downconvert will feed the existing transmitters and direct analog feed (Ch 5 and 7) to Comcast.

Be patient, it will look great in the end.

-Kyle

When complete, all processing for both stations (graphics too) will be in true HD and a 4:3 downconvert will feed the existing transmitters and direct analog feed (Ch 5 and 7) to Comcast.Will you be providing a direct feed to Dish Network/DirecTV as well?

At some point I hope E* picks up the HD feeds for our market, including ABC and WB. I expect we're realistically talking 2007 or 2008 since they are just starting HD locals next year, but it would be nice to get HD before the digital change over.

Good to see the processing improved.

JL

Hard to say. Right now Dish and DirecTV have no plans on schedule for HD sat. Remember it hasn't been that long ago since they added locals!

Hard to say. Right now Dish and DirecTV have no plans on schedule for HD sat. Remember it hasn't been that long ago since they added locals!

Huh???? DirecTV has at least 12 HD LiL markets live right now. And dozens more will be added early next year (which isnt far away). New York and LA just went live today infact.

Hard to say. Right now Dish and DirecTV have no plans on schedule for HD sat. Remember it hasn't been that long ago since they added locals!In South Bend, yes. Both satellite companies added locals in 2003. But as noted, DirecTV has several HD markets up and Echostar is planning five markets in January and possibly 60 markets by the end of 2006. I believe both companies will be more proactive with HD locals than they were with regular locals.

JL

All:

We are currently rebuilding our technical facilities in Chicago that also control WMWB and WBND in South Bend. Currently, all programming is being upconverted 24/7 until Saturday, Jan. 28. We are now operating on an all digital SD plant and will not introduce HD into the mix until phase 2 is complete at the end of January.

FYI, ABC network NY went through a similar rebuild last fall and operated in a 24/7 upconvert mode nationwide for just over 3 weeks. We are simply doing the same on a local level. When complete, all processing for both stations (graphics too) will be in true HD and a 4:3 downconvert will feed the existing transmitters and direct analog feed (Ch 5 and 7) to Comcast.

Be patient, it will look great in the end.

-Kyle

Thanks for the info. I was beginning to think we would never get HD on these 2 channels, and I should start to look for some other way to get these networks.

Al

Does anyone know why Fox 28 HD is not on the Comcast lineup? When I called the Comcast 800 # they said it was channel 190. When I picked up the box at the local store they told me there was no FoxHD. Sure enough, I cannot tune to channel 190.

Anyone?

Nice to here WBND is working on it. The time table probably won't work out but wouldn't it be great if they were done in time for the Superbowl!

Thanks

This information is not very comforting for someone who is having guests over to watch a Fiesta Bowl in HD!!!!!!!!!!! Can you guys get it going for just a few days for the football games? What a shame that you are the big Bowl network and you choose to fix something during the time when most people want to watch!!!!! Unbelievable. Mon. Jan. 2, 5:00pm. C'mon give the rebuild guys the day off and give us ND in HD.

Maybe I'm the lone voice of dissent here, but I'm more interested in OTA HD than LiL HD via DBS. TVmicrowave2002's timeline is good news for me (even if it means I'll be missing ND v OSU in the Fiesta Bowl in HD:() as it seems his organization has been quiet about their ATSC plans. Thanks for feeding us an update.

TVµw2K2, will WBND & WMWB be on the same channels (basically, does analog go away when DTV operations start,) or do you have new frequencies that will be used?

Maybe I'm the lone voice of dissent here, but I'm more interested in OTA HD than LiL HD via DBS. TVmicrowave2002's timeline is good news for me (even if it means I'll be missing ND v OSU in the Fiesta Bowl in HD:() as it seems his organization has been quiet about their ATSC plans. Thanks for feeding us an update.

TVµw2K2, will WBND & WMWB be on the same channels (basically, does analog go away when DTV operations start,) or do you have new frequencies that will be used?

If I'm not mistaken, the HD will only be on cable, not OTA, at least for now.

Al

Al,
Does Middlebury have WBND in HD (or upconverted SD) on your cable currently or is it just Comast in South Bend/Mishawaka that provides this signal?

TVmicrowave2002, if you're just referring to the feed your company provides to Comcast, I'll be ever so cross...

In my previous post, I was referring to the South Bend market for HD. Obviously HD on sat is in the works but lets face it, we're talking about South Bend market 80-x. They were not in any hurry to launch Standard Def in SB, we can only hope they will do HD in SB in the next 18-36 mos.

As for 25 and 57, we'd do launch full power OTA tonight if we could but there is one problem...as of right now the FCC will not issue a LPTV an assigned DTV frequency. The current rules only permit you to "flash cut" your current analog to digital with a maximum power of 15 kW ERP. That's not much. Obviously flash cutting 25 and 57 now would be suicide.

We're currently working with the FCC to provide DTV service on a separate channel. Believe it or not it isn't easy. Most of you are aware that WMWB and WBND are low power stations. Not low power because Weigel is cheap and doesn't want to go full power, rather, we were assigned a low power license because the FCC's table of allotments does not allow another full power station in the South Bend area. In 2002, Weigel invested in a new tower, the tallest in the South Bend market, new antennas, new transmitters, new processing at the tower site, a new bi-directional digital link from Chicago to South Bend as well as means for the local sales office to broadcast commercial content within minutes from the local sales office in South Bend vs, overnight shipments as they did before. Before these improvements, we broadcast from a leased tower only 500' tall with older, unreliable transmitters and poor processing.

It's a process. We are playing with the cards we were handed. If it was 1960, we would have a full power station. The South Bend stations have some of the best range and facilities in the country for a low power class station. Obviously, there is still a leap in signal strength with 16,22 and 28. Fortunately, cable's penetration grows day by day as OTA viewership decreases. In this context, low power vs. full power doesn't matter. I believe within 10 years, a majority of the markets will be focused on delivery systems other than OTA. Let's face it, we're already at that point in many markets.

As for true HD on the special events coming up, we'll do our best...

Maybe I'm the lone voice of dissent here, but I'm more interested in OTA HD than LiL HD via DBS.I'd prefer OTA HD as well ... but as tvmicrowave2002 noted, it is going to be a while before we are going to see that for WMWB and WBND (thanks to the FCC). It would help if they were WMWB-CA and WBND-CA instead of -LP stations.

In any case, until the FCC relents "alternative means" will have to be used to reach viewers. I'm glad that Weigel is doing all they can to get HD to our market. If that means the final leg needs to be done via Comcast and/or DBS providers that's fine.

Weigel has WB and ABC viewers in Warsaw and southern Kosciosko county thanks to the DBS company's carriage (and the way markets are defined). Cable carriage helps too. Personally, I'm not going to subscribe to Comcast just for HD. The thought of our market being 18-36 months out via satellite is encouraging. (Even though in ~48 months everything OTA will be digital.) Having owners like Weigel involved presenting a good signal to DBS is helpful.

(That being said, something flaked out last night during the Smallville rerun via E*. In the rocket launch scene it looked like the digital stream was losing stability. I'll let E* take the heat for that one. :) )

Here's where WBND and WMWB should cover (give or take) -
WBND-LP Service Area (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=TX614831.html)
WMWB-LP Service Area (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=TX614822.html)

As far as the ND game goes, it would be real cool if Weigel could borrow WNDU's HD feed for a few hours to get the game to more viewers in HD OTA. But that's pie in the sky dreaming! :rolleyes:

TV46 is the real waste of DT space in our market. Not because of content, but because all they ever feed is their SD channel with only suggestions that they might do some HD eventually. Maybe they would take a 'donation' to rent the rest of their bandwidth! :D

Seriously: The improvements Weigel has done are laudable. I hope we all get to see their HD feeds sooner than later, but at least we know that the NTSC transmitters, cable companies and satellite companies are getting a good feed to pass on.

JL

All I can say is this: WBND and WMWB will not get any viewing time in my home until they go Digital. I don't know what else to say. Mine is just one viewing household in our Market area. WBND's and WMWB's advertisiers can obviously do without our money since we have no idea who they are.

Al,
Does Middlebury have WBND in HD (or upconverted SD) on your cable currently or is it just Comast in South Bend/Mishawaka that provides this signal?

Yes, we have WBND-HD and WMWB-HD on the cable here in Middlebury. As far as I know, the channel lineup is exactly the same here as South Bend. I even recently got VOD here.

Al

I don't understand all the technical stuff like you guys seem to, but if 46 is keeping 57 from getting FCC ok for "space" then that's a crime. 46 certainly doesn't need it and they prove it by not using it. Is there anyway for us to get a message to the FCC?

How about contacting Comcast and getting the ABC games on Monday switched to the ESPN channel (173) just for the day? Does anyone know how feasible this might be? Or who to contact to make it happen?

I don't understand all the technical stuff like you guys seem to, but if 46 is keeping 57 from getting FCC ok for "space" then that's a crime. 46 certainly doesn't need it and they prove it by not using it. Is there anyway for us to get a message to the FCC?46 is a fully licensed TV station with more rights than any LP station. Under the digital conversion rules WHME gets a full DT channel to use for conversion (48). They do NOT have to transmit a HD signal. Personally I think it's a waste to use a DT channel for a single SD feed - but it isn't illegal.

57 is a low power station - not only lower power than the full "TV" designated stations but a secondary service. They were bumped off of their original channel by WSJV 28's digital channel (58) a few years back. The digital conversion rules do not give LPs a second channel to use for conversion, but they may flash cut losing the NTSC audience for the potential ATSC audience. (There is another issue facing 57 as the FCC will eventually want them to move to a lower channel to leave the channels above 50 for other uses than TV.)

It would be cool if WHME rented out their unused space to Weigel or another broadcaster to allow HD feeds in the remainder of their space. They ARE permitted to do so, but not compelled. I doubt if their 'mission' would allow them to do that.

WHME would be less of a waste of DT spectrum if they would simply put SOMETHING there. Perhaps a 24hr old rerun of their main channel or alternate feed of LeSea. They could put up a music video channel or other extra content as well. At minimum they could put WHME Radio and PulseFM audio channels up with a black screen or screen saver video. There is so much one can do with the space than just leave it empty.

JL

I'm new to this discussion and the AVS Forum period, but seeing people from the area discussing the local situation specifically has been a welcome sight. I wasn't aware of all the specifics as to who is allowed to broadcast what before I found this thread.

We haven't gone HDTV yet, but will in the next couple of months or so and this has been very useful to access beforehand.

Moving along, do WBND and WMWB broadcast from the same antenna? Although we haven't bought an HD receiver yet, I have an old TV in my workshop with an antenna. I know from the maps and the FCC site that they must share the location, but thought it odd that I would receive WMWB so much more clearly than WBND.

[QUOTE=justalurker]46 is a fully licensed TV station with more rights than any LP station. Under the digital conversion rules WHME gets a full DT channel to use for conversion (48). They do NOT have to transmit a HD signal. Personally I think it's a waste to use a DT channel for a single SD feed - but it isn't illegal.


I didn't mean that it was a literal crime.

I am formerly from South Bend and am currently living in LaPorte.

In the city of LaPorte I am able to watch WMWB OTA fairly clear with only a antenna. WBND is another story. I have never been able to pull in WBND clearly. When WMWB was on Channel 69 I could never get it, but after the move to 25 it is not to snowy even if the FCC map does not show LaPorte in the B Grade coverage. The FCC coverage map shows WBNDs signal on 57 should come in better then 25 and that has never been the case.

Regardless, I can only get WMWB and WBND (57 is very snowy) OTA. Comcast in LaPorte/Michigan City, which now shares the same lineup, does not carry either the analog or HDs of WMWB-LP/WBND-LP on our cable system because we are considered to be more in Chicagoland then South Bend, and the fact that they are both LPs makes it even worse to get added. I am really happy that this thread is here because I have always wondered what would happen to the ABC and WB affiliates in South Bend after the analog conversion at the end of this year (although I am not sure if 85% of American households will be watching DTV by the end of the year). Realistically I think we may still be a couple years off. I am familiar with Weigels stations in Chicago and Wisconsin and they are not a cheap company. They was handed the short end with this because the FCC does not allow a new High Power to sign on OTA in South Bend. It is a bit dissappointing but I do hope that I will be able to watch ABC or WB from South Bend in HD sometime in the future. It is just a shame that our local comcast system does not carry any South Bend LPs. We still do get all high powers however.

Regarding DaveK913s question: I had a conversation with a engineer at station I used to work at in South Bend about this a few years back when they made the switch with the WBND and WMWB frequencies. The tower site for 25, 57 and 69 is the same location, just west of Highway 331 south of town. I am not sure if the location would really matter to you as nearly all of the South Bend channels that you watch all broadcast from roughly the same area around Ironwood south of the Bypass. When WMWB moved from 69 to 25 I instantly started to get it fairly decent out here in LaPorte. Granted, they did get a better tower, but WBND still comes in snowly while WMWB is usually pretty clear. Its not just you, I have found this to be the case with nearly everyone else finding it more difficult to pull in 57 then 25. I have personally always found WBNDs signal to be weaker then 25, but I am aware that many other conditions could effect it. I personally wondered why they would not move WBND between 22 and 28. I have always found 25 to have better reception so it is possible it is because its on a lower channel number.

Hopefully tvmicrowave2002 still reads this and can post a reply and correct me about a few things.

Your wish has been granted. Viewers of Comcast will see WBND-HD in true HD today. May look rough during breaks (you'll see what I mean when you watch it) but it's true HD from network for all the games today. Back to upconvert after this evening. Hopefully we can push for the true HD during all network HD by the end of the week. Thank you for your patience as we are rebuilding the Chicago plant into one of the area's first HD master controls.

I'll have to see for myself, but if it's true, you are the MAN! Way to go.

Your wish has been granted. Viewers of Comcast will see WBND-HD in true HD today. May look rough during breaks (you'll see what I mean when you watch it) but it's true HD from network for all the games today. Back to upconvert after this evening. Hopefully we can push for the true HD during all network HD by the end of the week. Thank you for your patience as we are rebuilding the Chicago plant into one of the area's first HD master controls.

That doesn't do anything for many people that get the local HD signals over the air or use DirecTV or Dish. I am disgusted by the absentee ownership just sucking money out of this market. A major network on a low power signal is rediculous.

That doesn't do anything for many people that get the local HD signals over the air or use DirecTV or Dish. I am disgusted by the absentee ownership just sucking money out of this market. A major network on a low power signal is rediculous.

As TVMicrowave mentioned, they (or anyone else) can't sign on any more digital over-the-air signals here until analog sign-off. You need to call Dish or DirecTV to get them to add WBND, but since WBND-HD is not over-the-air, I don't know if they can legally or logistically do it.

Absentee ownership sucking money? They are right here on this board (as well as their also out-of-town competition, FOX 28), and even though Weigel based in Chicago, getting an HD signal out to South Bend to Comcast wasn't cheap, I'm sure. They've done all they can to get you the best ABC signal possible given the severe limitations by the FCC they are under. South Bend was set up with only 4 full-power stations by the FCC, it's not their fault. Believe me, they only wish they could have a full power analog and digital station here. It isn't going to happen, the FCC says so, and that's final. And obviously, no in-town broadcasting company wanted to bring you full-powered ABC. Weigel got the crumbs and are doing a stellar job with what little they have to work with. New tower, equipment, HD via cable...it's the best they can do right now.

As TVMicrowave mentioned, they (or anyone else) can't sign on any more digital over-the-air signals here until analog sign-off. You need to call Dish or DirecTV to get them to add WBND, but since WBND-HD is not over-the-air, I don't know if they can legally or logistically do it.

Absentee ownership sucking money? They are right here on this board (as well as their also out-of-town competition, FOX 28), and even though Weigel based in Chicago, getting an HD signal out to South Bend to Comcast wasn't cheap, I'm sure. They've done all they can to get you the best ABC signal possible given the severe limitations by the FCC they are under. South Bend was set up with only 4 full-power stations by the FCC, it's not their fault. Believe me, they only wish they could have a full power analog and digital station here. It isn't going to happen, the FCC says so, and that's final. And obviously, no in-town broadcasting company wanted to bring you full-powered ABC. Weigel got the crumbs and are doing a stellar job with what little they have to work with. New tower, equipment, HD via cable...it's the best they can do right now.

HD via cable is useless to those who don't want to invest in yet another HD set of equipment. I get all the other local channels fine via OTA antenna. Why can't they broadcast a low powered HD signal? I really don't think WBND has any presence in this community. They don't even fund a website let alone a news department. I believe that WBND themselves would block me from getting a real ABC feed from Directv. Perhaps when Directv moves to getting the HD locals out I'll have better luck.

Why can't they broadcast a low powered HD signal?The only logical way that Weigel could do this would be to switch over operations at WMWB-LP (25) to digital operations, simulcasting WBND-DT and WMWB-DT on two sub-channels, while WBND-LP continued with NTSC ABC broadcasting. With ABC-HD broadcasting 720p and WB-HD using 1080i, I don't know how well this would work. Perhaps ABC at 720p and WB at 480p? They could also take Channel 69 (which was supposed to be shut down to return the spectrum to the FCC, but probably gets away with it being a low-power station) to broadcast WB analog programming, but I wouldn't think that would fly with Weigel.I really don't think WBND has any presence in this community. They don't even fund a website let alone a news department. I believe that WBND themselves would block me from getting a real ABC feed from Directv.Weigel revoked my ABC waiver when they went to the new tower, so I have no doubt that they would deny yours. Depends on how close you are to the south side of SBN.

It would be nice of Weigel if would they allow ABC-HD & WB-HD waivers until they can provide ATSC transmissions. I wouldn't count on it, though.

Kudos to Weigel, though, for providing the ABC-HD Bowl Games to those 25 people that can get ABC-HD via Comcast. Hopefully, Comcast pays well...

The HD picture was great for the games today. The sound wasn't 5.1, but I'm not complaining. I hope they continue for the next games or at least for Wed. finale. Thanks again to Comcast. I might have been one of 25 people with Comcast, but I had about 15 at my house.

On a different note, I have a Samsung SIR-T451 (ota). It claims to have the ability to "decode" digital cable signals. Of course when I ask Comcast about it, they say it isn't compatible. How can I know for sure? Should I just plug the cable into the Samsung? Has anyone tried this? It would be nice to not need the Motorola box.

Thank Comcast as well. They've had a problem over the past 3-4 months that was causing "tiling" to our HD signals. We monitor our HD signals via a loop-back circuit from South Bend back to Chicago and the signals have always been rock solid. I believe they found the problem over the past week or so.

46 is a fully licensed TV station with more rights than any LP station. Under the digital conversion rules WHME gets a full DT channel to use for conversion (48). They do NOT have to transmit a HD signal. Personally I think it's a waste to use a DT channel for a single SD feed - but it isn't illegal.I didn't mean that it was a literal crime.The point is that 46 isn't keeping WBND and WMWB from being digital/HD. The FCC rules are keeping WBND and WMWB from being digital/HD (without discarding their NTSC audience).The only logical way that Weigel could do this would be to switch over operations at WMWB-LP (25) to digital operations, simulcasting WBND-DT and WMWB-DT on two sub-channels, while WBND-LP continued with NTSC ABC broadcasting. With ABC-HD broadcasting 720p and WB-HD using 1080i, I don't know how well this would work. Perhaps ABC at 720p and WB at 480p? They could also take Channel 69 (which was supposed to be shut down to return the spectrum to the FCC, but probably gets away with it being a low-power station) to broadcast WB analog programming, but I wouldn't think that would fly with Weigel.They could convert WMWB-LP to DT and carry both signals ... again sacrificing NTSC viewers for ATSC viewers. Moving the WB NTSC back to 69 is possible, but the coverage area is not as good as on 25. WAAT-LP 69 Coverage (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=TX700572.html)

I have a hard time getting 69 on the south side of Elkhart. It is good that Weigel was able to keep the license. Perhaps something can be worked out there to use 69 as a temporary digital channel?

It's all up to the lawyers and the FCC. :D

JL

That doesn't do anything for many people that get the local HD signals over the air or use DirecTV or Dish. I am disgusted by the absentee ownership just sucking money out of this market. A major network on a low power signal is rediculous.

I believe Weigel has done a lot more than they have to in the South Bend market. I was very impressed that they were making the effort to get HD on the cable system, because I'm sure that cost a lot of money to provide a HD signal that only a few people receive. Read the Fort Wayne thread. They have a Fox affiliate with less than 1 kilowatt of power and never any HD.

If you want to get the channels, get basic cable for about $15 a month and buy a QAM receiver.

Al

Many, many thanks for making the bowl games available in HD yesterday, even if only on Comcast. I am sure there are more than 25 of us that enjoyed the game. The Superbowl is next (wink, wink)!!

As a DirecTV customer and an HD TV owner, I do not like the limited HD choices on DirecTV. Comcast has a much better selection. Nor do I want to setup an outside OTA antenna to catch local HD signal as I find it to be unreliable (at best).

When I first switched to DirecTV I used a large OTA antenna in my attic which everyone kept telling me it should be good enough. In reality, without the ability to rotate it for best signal reception I got varying degrees of reception quality.
I swear I live in an electronic interference zone. OTA has never been very good (even radio). All I know is when I listen to AM radio in my car, the signal gets significantly better once I pull out of my neighborhood.

After being fed up with the OTA antenna, I subscribed to the basic TV package from Comcast (then AT&T) and I was happy. Eventually, DirecTV made available locals and I subscribed (the wife liked the simplicity of all channels being available from one source). I kept my basic cable TV subscription because I saved about $3 a month on cable internet bill if I have some cable TV package (what a scam!)

When I got an HD TV I subscribed to DirecTV's HD package but I was back in the same boat when I first moved to DirecTV. No HD locals except via OTA. Back to square one! I would love to be able to Tivo my favorite HD programs on local channels but the signal just isn't reliabled enough (none of them: WNDU, WSBT, Fox28, even WNIT).

When I found out Comcast made local HDs available with the basic cable TV package for $5 more I jumped at the chance. Unfortunately, I cannot use Comcast's DVR because that requires a minimum cable TV service of Digital Cable (which is an additional $40a month). I am not going to carry a full subscription to both Comcast and DirecTV.

I would probably drop DirecTV completely if it weren't for Sunday NFL Ticket. DirecTV has an exclusive and recently extended their contract with the NFL (rats!!).

I don't like having split services (again) but, if I can enjoy my HD network shows on my HD TV with a reliable signal I am happy.

Someday (unknown) DirecTV will make local HDs available. When that happens I will drop the $5 a month cable box and get all my services from source, DirecTV. That is unless Sunday NFL Ticket is made available to other TV outlets. If that happens (please let that happen), my choices for TV service will increase and (hopefully) the price of Sunday NFL Ticket will go down (because everyone will have it).

In reality, there are far fewer folks with HD capability and some of those folks don't even know how or have HD set it up properly. I understand things take time.

I am very grateful for the services I do have. Even if all the services are not yet available via any/all service providers.

It will happen. I have to keep reminding myself of that and take advantage of the work arounds (when available).

Does anyone know why Comcast is not carrying the FOX28 HD signal?

Read the Fort Wayne thread. They have a Fox affiliate with less than 1 kilowatt of power and never any HD.
You ain't kiddin'. Thank God for FOX 28.

Hi all, new to the forum... Watching HDTV OTA from the South Bend locals on a Sony XBR960 in Buchanan, MI. Lack of an ABC OTA signal is disappointing since Comcast's system north of the border in Michigan does not carry any HDTV whatsoever! No ESPNHD or local affilate HD period. Does anyone know what Comcast's issues are in SW Michigan?

Moving on to second issue. Sent an e-mail to WNDU regarding the macroblocking artifacts on 16.1 OTA. ND games and fast camera pans were really poor picture quality. Gave them my opinion that squeezing HD, SD & weather radar into their digital bandwidth was sacrificing image quality on the HD broadcast and suggested scrapping the weather channel if it improved picture quality. Today, I read on their website that the weather channel is shut down until they resolve encoder issues that were affecting picture quality. So do I get to claim credit for this turn of events or have some of you also contacted them? Just curious...

Regarding DaveK913s question: I had a conversation with a engineer at station I used to work at in South Bend about this a few years back when they made the switch with the WBND and WMWB frequencies. The tower site for 25, 57 and 69 is the same location, just west of Highway 331 south of town. I am not sure if the location would really matter to you as nearly all of the South Bend channels that you watch all broadcast from roughly the same area around Ironwood south of the Bypass. When WMWB moved from 69 to 25 I instantly started to get it fairly decent out here in LaPorte. Granted, they did get a better tower, but WBND still comes in snowly while WMWB is usually pretty clear. Its not just you, I have found this to be the case with nearly everyone else finding it more difficult to pull in 57 then 25. I have personally always found WBNDs signal to be weaker then 25, but I am aware that many other conditions could effect it. I personally wondered why they would not move WBND between 22 and 28. I have always found 25 to have better reception so it is possible it is because its on a lower channel number.

They're all within 5 miles of us, but we have plenty of trees in our area so I'm sure that's a factor in our reception from what I've read. Aluminum siding I guess doesn't help. Thank you for the response!

I contacted Fox 28 regarding Fox28 HD on Comcast, below is their response:

"Thanks for your inquiry regarding why our HD signal is not on Comcast. Your timing is excellent!

WSJV and Comcast were in negotiations for the right for Comcast to carry our HD signal for a year or more. These talks were recently completed...and a contract for carriage was executed by both parties within the past two or three weeks.

So far, we have not heard an actual carriage date or channel position from Comcast. It should happen pretty quickly, however. Cable companies have some rules regarding giving viewers a 30 day notice of changes...but I don't know if that applies in this case?
In any event, Comcast should be able to answer that question."

So it should be soon.

Additional Info added 1/6/06
I contacted Comcast today and they expect to have WSJV-DT added as channel 190 by 1/10 or 1/11.

Your wish has been granted. Viewers of Comcast will see WBND-HD in true HD today. May look rough during breaks (you'll see what I mean when you watch it) but it's true HD from network for all the games today. Back to upconvert after this evening. Hopefully we can push for the true HD during all network HD by the end of the week. Thank you for your patience as we are rebuilding the Chicago plant into one of the area's first HD master controls.

Hey TVMicrowave2002,

How are things proceeding? Will they be in a position to push the true HD signal? NFL Playoffs are Saturday and both games are on ABC.

Thanks for keeping us informed.

Adam

Hey all,

Ever since i got my new hdtv about 6 months ago, i've been following the threads here to see the progress on getting WBND-HD OTA..... unfortunately i don't have the ability to get digital cable, so my only option has been OTA for the digital locals (which after much positioning i get all signals just fine), and dish-network for everything else, including espn-hd..... i'm not a huge abc viewer, so not having an HD feed was never a huge deal until this bowl and nfl season....I saw the train wreck that was the fiesta bowl live and in person so that wasn't an issue, but there's no way i'm letting my hdtv go to waste on super bowl sunday.... Is there any way at all that WBND could get some kind of HD feed OTA for the super bowl?? It's the most watched event of the year, and the biggest advertising moment of the year...there's no way some kind of deal could be worked out for one day? I'm desperate here!!! I have to agree with the above posters in saying how much of a disgrace it is for a major network to have to be stuck with a low power station when pbs and those other networks are able to have hd feeds... to hell with the FCC... that's why i'm going with Stern to Sirius on monday morning!

Hey TVMicrowave2002,

How are things proceeding? Will they be in a position to push the true HD signal? NFL Playoffs are Saturday and both games are on ABC.

Thanks for keeping us informed.

Adam
New to the forum. No HD signal on ABC today as far as I can tell. It seems to me that "your wish has been granted" applies to the Fiesta Bowl day. The FOX HD news is great!

Looks like channel 190 on Comcast (Fox28 DT) is on. That makes both Sunday playoff games in HD on Comcast. Great!!!!

We're making good progress on the digital facility rollout. True HD on WBND and WMWB should be back late next week. 1/13 is the goal. Sorry nothing today or tomorrow. We (I) took some beatings from advertisers during the Monday games since we did not insert the commercials on the HD feed...

I'll post as soon as it's up. As for low power channel 69 for use as an HD signal, we tried. We were denied by the FCC due to 800 MHz land mobile (2-way radio) concerns.

Thanks for the update TVMicrowave2002

I'll post as soon as it's up. As for low power channel 69 for use as an HD signal, we tried. We were denied by the FCC due to 800 MHz land mobile (2-way radio) concerns.

So what does this mean for those of us not willing to fund another HD source (comcast)? When will WBND broadcast HD?

Thanks.

As soon as the FCC will issue Low Power class TV stations a digital channel to broadcast on. Right now, they have no plans to. Seriously, please complain to them! We want it too for WMWB and WBND. See above posts. They won't even let us broadcast DTV on our extra LPTV channel 69.

Hey all,
New to the forum, watching HDTV via OTA in Goshen, IN. I have been following the progress of receiving WBND-HD via OTA and while very disappointed I understand that WBND/Weigel is doing everything necessary to accomodate everyone. That brings up my point, I am a D* customer that has been denied the waiver to receive ABC-HD via D*. If there are no immediate plans to accomodate those that are unwilling to fund another HD source(Comcast) why has my waiver request been denied when WBND does not even broadcast a digital signal due to the FCC regulation. D* has told me to contact the affiliate directly, does anyone have an idea on who to talk to? I am tired of watching Sportscenter highlights of ABC telecasts in HD, I want the real thing.

Have I got this all wrong? The FCC are the ones who have mandated a certain date for every channel going digital, however, the FCC are the ones who are not allowing ABC to have a digital broadcast because of some limitation of signal?

Have I got this all wrong? The FCC are the ones who have mandated a certain date for every channel going digital, however, the FCC are the ones who are not allowing ABC to have a digital broadcast because of some limitation of signal?

If you want to read it, it looks like this is it. http://www.fcc.gov/dtv/
It's dated 9/30/04, and titled 'FCC Establishes Rules for Digital Low Power Television and Television Translater Stations.'

I'm now getting a FOX HD signal on channel 190 (Comcast). It breaks up quite a bit. Should I expect this during the initial period or is this it? 189 (CBS) and 187 (ABC) look good and don't break up. 188 (NBC) is hit and miss. Anyone else experiencing this?
By the way, if not for the forum, how would I know that FOX is now available on HD? It seems they (Comcast) do a terrible marketing job. When the installer came out, he didn't even know what channels were available!!! Go figure.

Dan

Hi all, new to the forum... Watching HDTV OTA from the South Bend locals on a Sony XBR960 in Buchanan, MI.

Nails,

I'm in Niles and am looking carefully at the 34XBR960. I'd be very interested in any comments on the tv. I've looked at one in the Mishawaka WorstBuy store but the picture on their set is one of the worst of the HD tube tv's in the store - looks like its got a very bad SD signal feeding it. How's the picture quality when watching SD programming? I'd hate to shell out close to $2K and have worse SD picture quality than I do on my old 27" Sony. I'll only be using OTA - how much of the local programming is available in HD?

Thanks

Fred

I'll only be using OTA - how much of the local programming is available in HD?Fred, currently WNDU (NBC), WSBT (CBS), WSJV (FOX), and WNIT (PBS-HD) are the only sources of HD OTA. Depending on where you are in the Michiana area, you should have no problem receiving a good ATSC signal from these stations using an outdoor antenna. Indoors, YMMV.

As to when you can watch HD, WNDU, WSBT, and WSJV have Primetime programs from their networks in HD. Sporting events have been in HD recently (ND Football on NBC, for example, and NFL/NASCAR/NCAA Basketball/Masters PGA), but unfortunately, not the BCS bowl games. WNIT shows PBS-HD pretty much 24/7.

Thanks for the info. I just had a new antenna installed on my 50' tower so I expect that I should have good reception - at least I do for the SD programming. Now I just have to make up my mind on taking the plunge to purchase an HD set.

Fred

hi, I live in Niles and have my SB antenna at 100ft I get excellent HD on all channels. Buy a used HD tuner on ebay for $50.00 and use you existing TV to try HDTV!!

Here's something I've wondered: Would anybody be able to suggest a good TV tower installer in our area? My friend and I put in a 48' HAM tower at my dad's vacation place, but that was back in the 70s and I would want it done right.

I just had JoJo's install a new antenna and while the work appears to have done well, I was not happy about pricing. The price changed after the install was completed, not all charges were disclosed up front.

A Benton Harbor antenna and electronics wholesaler I talked to recommended Rick's in Dowagiac to me (269 782 7250). Rick's price (as is now apparent) was much better than JoJo's. For just a little more than JoJo's charged me for a new antenna and installation, Rick's would have installed a marginally higher quality antenna as well as install an amplifier and new coax. JoJo's did not replace the coax or install an amplifier and now wants over $300 for that.

Fred

tpctech,

How's the HD reception on Chicago channels? Any difference between UHF and VHF HD reception?

Fred

tpctech,

How's the HD reception on Chicago channels? Any difference between UHF and VHF HD reception?

Fred

I recieve the UHF Chicago HD fine..I have a Blake UHF antenna at 180ft on my tower. My analog Chicago VHF is not very good do to not enough antenna gain. I plan on changing my VHF is spring.

I am using a Blonder Tongue tower top preamp on both antennas

KEN

Nails,

I'm in Niles and am looking carefully at the 34XBR960. I'd be very interested in any comments on the tv. I've looked at one in the Mishawaka WorstBuy store but the picture on their set is one of the worst of the HD tube tv's in the store - looks like its got a very bad SD signal feeding it. How's the picture quality when watching SD programming? I'd hate to shell out close to $2K and have worse SD picture quality than I do on my old 27" Sony. I'll only be using OTA - how much of the local programming is available in HD?

Thanks

Fred

As already stated by other posters, you will get all local affliate's HD signal no problem in Niles. The XBR is adequate for displaying SD and has the same drawbacks as other HD displays when it comes to SD. On larger screens, SD resolution just looks worse the larger your screen gets. The XBR960 has what Sony calls Digital Reality Creation which uses electronics to improve SD PQ, but not dramatically so. The real benefits of the XBR960 compared to less expense Sony HD CRTs are the built in turners, twin view (split screen), a plethora of inputs/outputs including memory stick slot, 2 firewire ports, HDMI, digital optical audio out, and 3 HD component inputs all which can be custom labeled. HD and DVDs look awesome with the superfine pitch (true 1080 line resolution). If you don't need all the bells and whistles though, go with a good mid-range Sony model, and save the cash for PS3 or surround sound or whatever. It is a very nice HD set though...

I recieve the UHF Chicago HD fine..I have a Blake UHF antenna at 180ft on my tower. My analog Chicago VHF is not very good do to not enough antenna gain. I plan on changing my VHF is spring.

I am using a Blonder Tongue tower top preamp on both antennas

KEN

Wow. Receiving Chicago HD broadcasts (relatively low power versus analog)in Niles? You are an inspiration. Key questions are
1. How does ABC HD look
2. What time should we come over for the superbowl party in HD?
<grin>

Anyone have Comcast running through a QAM HD receiver?

What channels, if any, can you receive without subscribing to the comcast HD package?

Is there someone specific we can email or call? Maybe we can get some sort of petition started to get OTA ABC-HD going here. This is very frustrating, since I also do not want to start a cable subscription to compliment my DirecTV subscription, just to get one channel. Let us know. I'll be the first to sign!!

Mike

Any word on WBND in HD and if so, what digital channel # would it be on?

Currently the ABC-DT signal is only available via Comcast. As I understand it, the FCC is preventing WBND from transmitting an OTA digital signal because of the type of license they have (low power license). The FCC has rules in place about Low Power Stations and Digital OTA transmissions (restricted). The FCC is stating this area already has it's allotment of regular station licenses so WBND/WNWB can't upgrade either.

The last communication, on this discussion board, from a guy I believe works for or has knowledge of WBND/WNWB has hoped to get HD content ready (again, via Comcast cable only) by 1/13. That would be channel 187 on your Comcast digital tuner.

I don't know the current status of that.

Hope that helps.

Is there someone specific we can email or call? Maybe we can get some sort of petition started to get OTA ABC-HD going here. This is very frustrating, since I also do not want to start a cable subscription to compliment my DirecTV subscription, just to get one channel. Let us know. I'll be the first to sign!!

Mike

I agree, very frustrating. I am in the same situation, I just can't justify a cable subscription for one channel. I am a DirecTV customer who has applied for an HD Waiver(twice) for national broadcasts, but was denied by WBND. According to DirecTV, I should qualify for the national ABC feed due to the LP classification and no OTA source for ABC-HD. That was what I was told by the CSR @ DirecTV. They said contact the local affiliate.....but who do I talk to? Any input as to why or who to talk to would be appreciated.

All:

We should have true HD for network back again for WBND and WMWB in a day or so. It works and looks great, however something is causing the switcher to breakway audio during the standard def hours when the system is online causing no audio. In another words, give us another day or so and it should be back in service. Sorry for the delay. I want it solid before we flip the switch.

By the way, according to Avid, we're the first station group to purchase HD master control graphics! WBND-HD and WMWB-HD will have "coming up" graphics in true HD in a few weeks...

I am receiving WB on 80.1 and ABC on 80.2 on my QAM tuner but was not able to locate the other ones yet.

So, if anybody else can help out, I'd greatly appreciate the information.

Anyone have Comcast running through a QAM HD receiver?

What channels, if any, can you receive without subscribing to the comcast HD package?

All:

We should have true HD for network back again for WBND and WMWB in a day or so. It works and looks great, however something is causing the switcher to breakway audio during the standard def hours when the system is online causing no audio. In another words, give us another day or so and it should be back in service. Sorry for the delay. I want it solid before we flip the switch.

By the way, according to Avid, we're the first station group to purchase HD master control graphics! WBND-HD and WMWB-HD will have "coming up" graphics in true HD in a few weeks...


Once WBND/WMWB are pushing HD will the signal be available for Dish Network folks too or just Comcast?

I am receiving WB on 80.1 and ABC on 80.2 on my QAM tuner but was not able to locate the other ones yet.

So, if anybody else can help out, I'd greatly appreciate the information.

Are those the true HD pictures or what?

I have the Sony kdfe55a20 with QAM on the cable input. I have been getting WB on 80.3 with what my TV tells me is 1080i and WBND on 80.4 as 720p. The only thing I'm trying to figure out is why the audio on 80.4 is off by about 1/3 of a second and the picture isn't shown in 16:9. Besides football, the only thing I ever watch on ABC is Lost, and because of the sound issue with 80.4, I usually end up watching it on Cable 7.

As far as my OTA digitals, I get the whole kit and kiboodle just fine, and that's running some Coax with a few couplers outside and 3/4's of the way of the side of my apartment building to the antenna that came with my ATI HD card for my computer. Jerry-rigging at it's finest :D ;)