Originally posted by snatch
Alright, starting to get impatient here. Last time I asked about HD NFL on CBS I was told they only do certain game each week- understandable. Well this weel Ken H says the Oakland-Indy game is HD on CBS this week. I turned it on right at 10 and the initial opening CBS did was HD, and then suddenly someone flipped the switch and the broadcast went SD. I am now sitting here with my HDTV and HD receiver watching a game that from what our trusted mod said was HD, the feed started in HD, and now its gone!!

What gives? KGPE??

I'm disappointed in that also. I decided to watch the Houston/Minnesota after seeing the oak-indy game was not in HD. I turned on NFL primetime later that afternoon, lo and behold the highlights of the oakland-indy game are in HD. wtf KGPE?!?!

Any updates on KMPH? Was bummed out to see the Yankees game in SD. (although it wasn't too bad looking SD)

I want to see what HD baseball looks like once this year.

Pat

With Pappas, who knows. In my D* on screen guide it showed 26-1 as being in HD, further teasing me and at the same time killing me cuz Pappas just isn't quite there yet.

Please give us HD!!!

Is there a concensus as to which HD OTA antenna is preferable for us in Fresno? It seems that there are many different types on the roofs around town, yet I'm not sure which are SD vs. HD. Even this thread mentions everything from Yagis to Radio Shack to Silver Sensors; so any insght would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

I got my antenna from Sparky's it works great from NW Fresno just point East. It a directional roof top style. Its square wire mesh with 4-bowties.

Look at the outdoor section below

http://www.tvantenna.com/support/tutorials/uhf.html

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Sittin here watching Lost and NO HD!!! What is going on? This is gettin real old real fast. No HD football, no idea why, now no HD Lost, no idea why. Do our local affilitates think no one around here has an HDTV? If someone has the contact info for our local ABC I'd love to have it.

Lost was not in HD last night because of the time it was on. The network sent out the HD feed at 8pm last night. Because the affiliate showed Lost at 10pm, it was just a tape of the 8pm SD feed.

The affiliate cannot record HD for a later showing.

Interesting- why did it come through in DD 5.1 then? Also, was Lost on at 8 PST in other PST markets? Was ours just showing it at 10 so they put that other crap on first after the debate? I know from other forums that other markets had it on HD, and on the east coast that means 11pm for them. No excuses please, just get it done! (Preferably in HD)

Was also disappointed that KFSN chose to air "Lost" at 10 instead of 8pm (interesting that there was an ABC promo/commercial towards the end of the debate coverage that LOST was coming up "Next" at 8pm (on the West Coast as those on the East saw it 3 hours earlier), meaning it was the damn station's decision to not receive the HD feed and instead chose to air a news broadcast and "Millionaire" at 8 and 8:30 respectively.


You can contact KFSN at KFSNTVHD@abc.com or Ron.Neil@abc.com and voice your concern.

Originally posted by snatch
Interesting- why did it come through in DD 5.1 then? Also, was Lost on at 8 PST in other PST markets? Was ours just showing it at 10 so they put that other crap on first after the debate? I know from other forums that other markets had it on HD, and on the east coast that means 11pm for them. No excuses please, just get it done! (Preferably in HD)

30 has an in-house audio upconverter, all of the audio sent out on 30.1 is DD 5.1, either native from the network during true HD or upconverted by them for SD stuff.

I received an email from the chief engineer at KMPH yesterday and it said:

KMPH has ordered and will install the necessary equipment to pass through Fox network HD programming in the next couple of months.

Thank you for your patience.


Maybe there is hope for this seasons Super Bowl!

Originally posted by jshowers
I received an email from the chief engineer at KMPH yesterday and it said:

KMPH has ordered and will install the necessary equipment to pass through Fox network HD programming in the next couple of months.

Thank you for your patience.


Maybe there is hope for this seasons Super Bowl!

Progress!!!

Now I just have to get Comcast to carry their HD signal...

Just an FYI:

There is now a thread for Bakersfield, CA - HDTV (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=460701) for those of you actually closer to Bakersfield - or for any discussion related to the Bakersfield affiliates.

'In the next couple of months'...argh...but better than nothing.

Also, does anyone watch Boston Legal ota hd? I was watching last night (I love that show for some reason) and KFSN shuts the HD off waaay early. The first couple episodes it was right at the end, but last night it was a good 5 minutes early. Why are they doing this?

Originally posted by snatch
'In the next couple of months'...argh...but better than nothing.

Also, does anyone watch Boston Legal ota hd? I was watching last night (I love that show for some reason) and KFSN shuts the HD off waaay early. The first couple episodes it was right at the end, but last night it was a good 5 minutes early. Why are they doing this?


I noticed that too watching it through Comcast. Very Annoying.

'cause whoever's in charge of flipping the switch wanted to go home early.
There's no HD on after 11pm on KFSN, so the switchflipper doesn't have to hang around after all the HD stuff is over. This used to happen all the time on NYPD Blue. Solution would be for station management to discipline the switchflipper or install automatic switching.

They have also been flipping the switch too early the past two Saturdays during the repeat broadcasts of Desperate Housewives.
I'm glad the network shows I watch on KFSN regularly air before 10:00pm.

If anyone has good contact information for our local ABC I'd really like to send them an email about the early flipping of the switch. Last night- again.

Off the subject. I have been looking for some Kay-Halbert Tv made in Culver City in the 50's. If you have any info please Pm me. G.B.

FYI from the HD hardware forum, the rumor on the street is that comcast will be releasing their 2-tuner HD DVR on Nov. 15th. I realize that they have delayed it several times, but keep this date in mind for you comcast users.

It will be an extra $5 per month which is a bargain.

I'm a TiVo diehard but their total failure to produce a stand-alone HD DVR has me ready to switch when this new device is released here.

It's been over a month now since I have been able to get ABC HD. I am located in NW Fresno and am REAL tired of watching NYPD Blue, According to Jim and MNF in old style viewing.

I have sent an email to ABC but am yet to get a response. Does anybody know if KFSN's transmitter is down and when it will be back on-line? I don't believe this to be an antenna issue (have a Terk TV55) but these days, who knows.

Thanks in advance.

Still getting your other H D stations ok ?

Yep. No problems with CBS and NBC. Also getting Fox (26.01) but in SD still (thanks nothing Pappas) and UPN (53.01). PBS on 40.1 comes in sometimes but I attribute that to them and not the antenna.

I'll have to get up on the roof - in the rain - tonight to see if I can't nail down ABC since they tell me there is no problem with their transmitter.

Well, I got up on the roof and made some adjustments. YEEEEEHAWWWW!!!. Now I get ABC clear as a bell. The problem is that now CBS goes in and out. ARGGGHHHHH!!!!!

As I said earlier, I am in NW Fresno and have a Terk TV55 antenna. I have the anntenna installed on a mast attached to my chimney. Basically, the ends of the TV55 are pointing North and South.

I'll give CBS a couple of days as it may be attributed to the weather right now - doubt it but tired of climbing the latter.

If anybody has any ideas of how to postition the TV55 in NW Fresno I'd GREATLY appreciate the help.

HD RULES!!!!!!!!!!!!!! when it works.

You will probably need to get a rotor. I can get NBC and CBS, but to get ABC, I lose NBC and CBS. Until Desperate Housewives was airing, it was an easy choice, but now it isn't. I can't miss CSI, but I only got to see DH in NTSC last week, which was a MAJOR bummer if you know what I mean. My wife asked why I didn't delete it from the TiVo after we watched it.

I'm about half a mile due west of FAT, my antenna is pointed almost due East, and I get all the locals very nicely. I would think a North-South orientation in Northwest Fresno would be pretty bad as most of the transmitters are to the East of central Fresno. Maybe try pointing it a bit South of due East and see what happens, or if there are a significant number of other antennas in your area point it the same way most of them are pointing.

Terk are not the best antennas out there, and 30.1's actually on VHF channel 9 which while theoretically still receivable with a UHF-only antenna might come in better with a VHF-UHF antenna. That's what I switched to and it works much better for 30.1 than my previous UHF only antenna did.

DV9384 - See my previous post - I have no problems with getting the locals


Originally posted by DrewM
I got my antenna from Sparky's it works great from NW Fresno just point East. It a directional roof top style. Its square wire mesh with 4-bowties.

Look at the outdoor section below

http://www.tvantenna.com/support/tutorials/uhf.html

Is KFSN-DT down for anyone else? I was hoping to watch saving private ryan in HD, but I guess that's not going to happen.

I'm not getting anything (KFSN-DT) via OTA or Comcast. Oh well.

I too was planning on watching Saving Private Ryan on ABC tonight. Everything looked good - for the first couple of minutes. Then the plug must have been pulled. ABC-HD went black (blue actually on my Mitsubishi).

I wonder if this has anything to do with the controversy over showing this film on regular TV uncut. Maybe KFSN thought it was to graphic for it's HD broadcast. The old analog is still working however.

Thanks guys, I was afraid it was my antenna or something. 30.1 was back up this morning, don't know if this was a network issue or local.

Following suit of others in the forum I changed from my Terk TV55 to a plane old bow-tie (latest model from Sparkys) and whala - EVERYTHING is clear as a bell.

So much for trying to work with cool, up to date technology. In this case good ol' ugly works the best. I am now getting all HD channels - even the ones I never got with the TV55.

Thanks for all the help and reply's.

I read in the Bee today that KMPH, fox 26 is hoping to be broadcasting in HD by the end of the month!

Originally posted by Steve S
I read in the Bee today that KMPH, fox 26 is hoping to be broadcasting in HD by the end of the month!

Good news! Now to get Comcast to carry it ASAP...

Sweet mercy... please let it be true...

Where did you read it? (what section/page if you remember)

If you go the Fresno Bee website and do a search for "KMPH", you will see the article dated 11/18/04 by Rick Bentley. The reference to KMPH is down towards the bottom.

http://www.fresnobee.com/columnists/bentley/story/9445895p-10355457c.html

"Clear picture: KMPH, Channel 26, general manager Charlie Pfaff says that if everything goes as planned, the local Fox affiliate will broadcast in high definition by the end of the month.

Programming shown in high definition will be network shows only. Pfaff says that football fans have been particularly interested in seeing high-definition telecasts of NFL games."

so does anyone have a 6412 DVR from Comcast yet? :)

Originally posted by Klin
so does anyone have a 6412 DVR from Comcast yet? :)

I've been following this closely for the better part of a year and I do believe that all of Northern California will have the 6412 by the end of the year. You may know that we are virtually the last market to get a comcast HD DVR, we skipped completely the one-tuner model that much of the country has been using for months. Here in Fresno I'm expecting a mid Dec. release. Of course it has been delayed multiple times, but given the fact that it has been released all over the country I'm hopeful.

Can't wait!

Originally posted by rodneyremington
I've been following this closely for the better part of a year and I do believe that all of Northern California will have the 6412 by the end of the year. You may know that we are virtually the last market to get a comcast HD DVR, we skipped completely the one-tuner model that much of the country has been using for months. Here in Fresno I'm expecting a mid Dec. release. Of course it has been delayed multiple times, but given the fact that it has been released all over the country I'm hopeful.

Can't wait!

Neither can I. It's going to be great to finally record HD content and watch it when I want to.

A comcast rep told me today they are expecting it here in Feb. :(

Originally posted by snatch
A comcast rep told me today they are expecting it here in Feb. :(

Excellent. Since comcast customer service reps are generally the last to know about any Comcast product, that means it should be here in December as planned.

Seriously though, the telephone CSRs for Comcast know nothing. The people on avsforum.com know way more about release dates, I'm pretty confident about December. Probably 50% of comcast phone reps have never even heard of DVRs. When I first got HD through Comcast half the reps didn't know they offered it.

Well I just got off the phone with a Comcast CSR, and she said the 6418(she obviously meant the 6412) would be available in the Fresno area starting December 1st. can't wait :D

Hi,
I get channel 58 Fox which is basically a clone of KMPH 26 except for some local news, etc.

To date I have been unable to pull in the digital signal with on OTA antenna.

The local cable company, Bright House, does not carry the digital feed of Fox or CBS yet.

Does anyone know if 58 will be high-def and if there are any plans to boost its signal?

Thanks,
mgh

Any word on the status of KMPH doing HD? We are nearing the end of the month. Oh wait, I said KMPH didn't I...nevermind.

Originally posted by Klin
Well I just got off the phone with a Comcast CSR, and she said the 6418(she obviously meant the 6412) would be available in the Fresno area starting December 1st. can't wait :D

Dang I hope this is true. That's two days from now!

EDIT--
I just called a Comcast CSR and was told the 6412s were in the warehouse but would not be released until Jan because they are "waiting for the remotes to be delivered".

Believe what you want, I will believe it when I see it sitting by my TV.

Originally posted by rodneyremington
Dang I hope this is true. That's two days from now!

EDIT--
I just called a Comcast CSR and was told the 6412s were in the warehouse but would not be released until Jan because they are "waiting for the remotes to be delivered".

Believe what you want, I will believe it when I see it sitting by my TV.

Well you were right. I just called again, and they pushed the date back to January the 15th. :(

And still no Fox in HD...

Someone up here was told that Comcast launches HD DVR in Fresno today. Whether this is accurate or not, I cannot guarantee. If accurate, it would be a soft launch, so you might have to get to a supervisor or even higher level to confirm that you are eligible.

You will need a digital tier or package subscription to be eligible, I believe.

Good luck and don't take that CSR's initial "No" for an answer. :) (Some people up here have had success ordering DVR today through the website. Live chat no less.)

Originally posted by SonomaSearcher
Someone up here was told that Comcast launches HD DVR in Fresno today. Whether this is accurate or not, I cannot guarantee. If accurate, it would be a soft launch, so you might have to get to a supervisor or even higher level to confirm that you are eligible.

You will need a digital tier or package subscription to be eligible, I believe.

Good luck and don't take that CSR's initial "No" for an answer. :) (Some people up here have had success ordering DVR today through the website. Live chat no less.)

I read your post in the SF thread. Congrats on getting the 6412. I doubt I'd have the kind of luck that people in the bay area are having. I guess I can wait.

Originally posted by SonomaSearcher
Someone up here was told that Comcast launches HD DVR in Fresno today. Whether this is accurate or not, I cannot guarantee. If accurate, it would be a soft launch, so you might have to get to a supervisor or even higher level to confirm that you are eligible.

You will need a digital tier or package subscription to be eligible, I believe.

Good luck and don't take that CSR's initial "No" for an answer. :) (Some people up here have had success ordering DVR today through the website. Live chat no less.)

I hope you are right. I called comcast today and got the usual run-around.

"so, what kind of dee-vee-rr do you have for us to install for you?"
"no, it's YOUR HD-DVR I want you to come and install"
"oh I'm sorry sir, I can put you on the waiting list."
etc. etc.

Straight from the horses mouth. Response to an email asking when KMPH will bring up their HDTV. Response was on Monday 12/6.


Literally any day now. We are in the process of isolating a number of "bugs" with the system.

Jim Boston
Chief Engineer
KMPH/KFRE

Originally posted by dv9384
Straight from the horses mouth. Response to an email asking when KMPH will bring up their HDTV. Response was on Monday 12/6.


Literally any day now. We are in the process of isolating a number of "bugs" with the system.

Jim Boston
Chief Engineer
KMPH/KFRE

Thanks for the update Jim. We're looking forward to it.

Boy are we ever!! Get some Raid, whatever it takes to kill the bugs, start showing HD and I might even watch that OC show with the Wif.

I just got an appointment for a comcast HD-DVR installation here in Fresno for Dec. 30th! $9.99 per month, or $4.99 more than I am paying now for my HD cable box rental. That's a deal.

Originally posted by rodneyremington
I just got an appointment for a comcast HD-DVR installation here in Fresno for Dec. 30th! $9.99 per month, or $4.99 more than I am paying now for my HD cable box rental. That's a deal.

well I called and I was put on the "list" for "another dept" to call me back with an install appt. I decided to sign up through their website too. Let's see which one gets me an install appt. quicker. :)

Originally posted by Klin
well I called and I was put on the "list" for "another dept" to call me back with an install appt. I decided to sign up through their website too. Let's see which one gets me an install appt. quicker. :)

I just an email back. I've got my install date for Dec. 27th between 10am and 12pm :D. hopefully it won't take too long as I want to be able to watch the bulldog/cavalier game.

Originally posted by Klin
I just an email back. I've got my install date for Dec. 27th between 10am and 12pm :D. hopefully it won't take too long as I want to be able to watch the bulldog/cavalier game.

Hey man, you got one before me!!!:mad:

Good for you. Let me know how you like it.;)

Originally posted by Klin
I just an email back. I've got my install date for Dec. 27th between 10am and 12pm :D. hopefully it won't take too long as I want to be able to watch the bulldog/cavalier game.

Ordered online this morning, received appointment back by email this afternoon for 12/27 between 1-5PM.

Tom

Has anyone heard any updates about KMPH starting their HD broadcasting? I'm really hoping Comcast can pick them up before the super bowl broadcast. Otherwise, I'll have to hook up the old T151 and grab the broadcast OTA, that is if they're up and running before the SB.

Just want to confirm -- has KFSN/ABC broadcast "Desperate Housewives" and "Boston Legal" in HD the past 2 weeks? I hope it's not my Samsung T165 OTA tuner going bad or having trouble with the signal.

No they have not. I watched and neither show was in HD. The other day when they were re-running the pilot episode of Lost, it started out HD, then kept flickering from SD/HD for a minute or so, then just stopped and remained SD. I guess they figure no one wants to see the reruns in HD, or maybe they're just having tech problems.

I too am very interested in KMPH updates, thats almost all I seem to post about lately (probably because I don't have Comcast or need a DVR).

I think KFSN's been having tech problems since last Wednesday when Lost started out in HD with the top half of the screen black with green crosses, then went to SD then back to HD later. Monday morning their digital channels were all down when I got up at 6:40 am. Should be back up by now.

If we're lucky, KMPH will have HD going at least by the playoffs. That gives em three weeks. C'mon boys, you can do it!!

I just tuned in to the news and noticed KMPH started broacasting in HD. Did they just start today (12/23)? How did "The OC" look?

I'm definitely looking forward to watching widescreen/High Def broadcasts of House, Arrested Development, and my fave "24".

Lots of grain in the OC. Not a show I watch but wanted to see the HD for a few moments. (hey its bowl season)

Also the FOX logo was out of place (choped off) and it was a big blue bug.

Looking forward to the NFL this weekend.

Yes the 23rd was the first day.

Also if you have a QAM tuner and Comcast they are giving Showtime HD out for a free preview for two months its on channel # 112-1

nice fox in hd with 5.1 dolby digital now all we need is comcast to pick it up

Originally posted by $onof$pam
nice fox in hd with 5.1 dolby digital now all we need is comcast to pick it up

Amen to that. Listening, Comcast?

I just watched the Packers/ Vikings NFL game and was pleased with KMPH-DT HD . For there first game I thought the picture was very good along with the DD5.1. I did not have one drop out during the whole game. It took KMPH long enough to go HD but it looks like they did it right. Now when is KAIL, UPN and KFRE-the WB and KVPT -PBS going to do HD?

Originally posted by DiCecco
I just watched the Packers/ Vikings NFL game and was pleased with KMPH-DT HD . For there first game I thought the picture was very good along with the DD5.1. I did not have one drop out during the whole game. It took KMPH long enough to go HD but it looks like they did it right. Now when is KAIL, UPN and KFRE-the WB and KVPT -PBS going to do HD?


Who cares when they're up and running? ;)

On the 5th day of Christmas my local gave to me....Fooox in HD...!

Sweet. Hopefully you Comcasters get it soon, meanwhile I'll enjoy it OTA through my hd-tivo.

Ok now that KMPH is broadcasting in HD, Comcast needs to pick them up. Didn't Comcast pick up KGPE-DT a few weeks after they started broadcasting in HD?

Pardon my lack of knowledge, but do the Comcast HD boxes have OTA tuners in them? Just wondering if you guys can hook up an antenna to that receiver and get HD that way like I do through the Directv OTA tuner.

Originally posted by snatch
Pardon my lack of knowledge, but do the Comcast HD boxes have OTA tuners in them? Just wondering if you guys can hook up an antenna to that receiver and get HD that way like I do through the Directv OTA tuner.


Unfortunately they do not have an OTA tuner. That would be a nice feature if they did.

Originally posted by DiCecco
Now when is KAIL, UPN and KFRE-the WB and KVPT -PBS going to do HD?

For what it's worth dept.: KFRE/59 (WB) is co-owned with KMPH/26. I don't know if the Pappas folks have plans to light up the HD on KFRE, but at least you know they know how to get an HD signal up. :)

Welp I got my DVR installed and ready to go to record the Bulldog/Cavalier MPC Bowl game. :D I'm happy.

Originally posted by Klin
Welp I got my DVR installed and ready to go to record the Bulldog/Cavalier MPC Bowl game. :D I'm happy.

Nice, mine is coming in 3 days. I'd be interested in your impressions. I have TiVo now but the lack of HD recording bothers me as well as the somewhat cumbersome set-up between the TiVo and the cable box.

Well, the Bulldog/Cavalier game wasn't going to be in HD. Too bad, as it was an awesome game. Certainly a nail-biter.

Originally posted by rodneyremington
Nice, mine is coming in 3 days. I'd be interested in your impressions. I have TiVo now but the lack of HD recording bothers me as well as the somewhat cumbersome set-up between the TiVo and the cable box.

I'm impresed so far. I recorded the whole game and was able to watch some of the highlights. Make sure you get the 6412 remote from them, which allows you to use some of the functions on it. I've gotta figure out how to output from the DVR to my laptop, if it's even possible. There is a small problem using optical for the audio to my sony HT receiver. I had to power cycle the DVR to get the audio back online.

Originally posted by Klin
I'm impresed so far. I recorded the whole game and was able to watch some of the highlights. Make sure you get the 6412 remote from them, which allows you to use some of the functions on it.

Do you have to specifically request the 6412 remote when you get it installed? It seems like that should be a given. Would they give me some other remote instead?

Originally posted by rodneyremington
Do you have to specifically request the 6412 remote when you get it installed? It seems like that should be a given. Would they give me some other remote instead?

You shouldn't have to, but just in case. The installer didn't have any on him when he came and put my DVR in. He said he would come back with a 6412 remote, and he did a few hours later. hopefully they get some more of these remotes to their installers.

Question:

I've been playing with recording OTA HD content thru the firewire of my Samsung T165 STB using the methods described in the thread titled "HowTO record via 1394/Firewire to WindowsXP".

I attempted to record "Arrested Development" and tonite's repeats of "House" on KMPH, but when I play the TS files, the video becomes severely distorted or just plain garbage every 10-15 seconds. I thought it was my firewire card, but the same thing happens when I try to capture on another computer.

I don't have trouble recording HD shows on KFSN/ABC -- the TS files play perfectly. I also do not have any trouble playing the TS files when I record regular KMPH programming.

Is this some sort of encryption that FOX or KMPH is using when broadcasting network content?

I was watching House last night on KMPH and noticed that only the top left third or half of the Fox logo was onscreen in the right lower corner, is this the same for all you guys? None of my other HD channels have the logo cut off, so though I know I have a bit of overscan I don't think that's the problem with the Fox logo. PQ was quite good overall--some film grain evident but that's normal for lots of filmed tv shows--what little I've seen of live sports on KMPH looked very good indeed. Their upconvert of SD is also very nice, unlike KSEE which has lots of combing during fast movement like the red Dodge truck commercial.

KMPH also has the digital closed captionning working, some "older" hd channels haven't mastered this.

Anyone with Voom having a problem with Fox 26-1? It was on for a couple of days, but it's been "dark" for a day or two now. I had similar problems with 47-1 awhile back, but that was fixed.

Have your receiver do a rescan of the local OTA digital channels...or even just specifically for 26-1.

There are some changes that local TV engineers in markets around the country are rushing to put into place before the end of the year...something about program information in the digital stream being required by the FCC by January 1. A rescan of the offending channel may do the trick.

26-1 was down last night.


I checked it again before I left for work and it was still off the air.

Anybody in Fresno able to get the ABC HD feed off DirecTV?? KFSN is owned and operated by ABC and other markets where the local ABC affilliate is O&O are getting it on channel 87. I spent an hour on the phone trying to get a rather obtuse person to turn it on for me with no luck whatsoever, she did put in for a waiver but nobody else in an O&O market is having to get waivers for HD network feeds.

Steve, we've answered this question in the other two threads you've posted it in.

The basic problem is that Bakersfield's KERO/23 is claiming you as a Grade A contour viewer. You won't be able to get ABC HD even in an O&O market unless the overlapping stations grant you waivers.

Bakersfield?!?! You have to be kidding!

No, I'm not kidding.

If you put the STUDIO ADDRESS of KFSN/30 into DirecTV's distant network eligibility tool online, it'll say KERO/23 claims Grade A (not even Grade B!) at that address, which I believe is in downtown Fresno. I could almost accept Grade B, the lower-quality signal, but A? Oh, well, that's what it says in the official tool they use to determine such things, so who am I to question it?

Here's the message where I deliver the bad news to Steve:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4894675#post4894675

The map I copied on that message shows some strong signal coverage for KERO in the very southern end of the Fresno market...I'm assuming this FCC-generated map is their predicted grade A contour, but as mentioned, it appears KERO is claiming the entire Fresno market as A.

For those of you within Comcasts grasp:

I've had their new motorola HD-DVR/cable box, the 6412, for a few days now. It is simply great. The ability to have a dozen or so good HD channels including all the networks, and be able to timeshift them with a HD-DVR that I am paying $9.99/month for (actual cost of the unit to Comcast is likely several hundred dollars) is awesome. I watched a movie last night with my wife recorded in HD with surround sound 5.1, and it was simply awesome.

Before I used to say that I had a hard time watching SD TV. Now that I can record literally dozens of different top-tier movies in HD per week, I can honestly say that I don't really enjoy watching DVDs any more because of the poor PQ.

The new i-guide software rivals that of my (now-displaced to the children's play room) TiVo, which was not HD.

IMHO it's the best thing to happen locally to HD enthusiasts in the past year. At least for Comcast subscribers.

Anybody else have a problem with CBS dropping their HDTV coverage of the Broncos/Colts game after halftime to show us the second half of the Raiders/Jaguars game in NTSC when it was already available on their analog feed?

Does anybody know how to contact them without having to wait until the following Monday?

Originally posted by Mr.Poindexter
Anybody else have a problem with CBS dropping their HDTV coverage of the Broncos/Colts game after halftime to show us the second half of the Raiders/Jaguars game in NTSC when it was already available on their analog feed?

Does anybody know how to contact them without having to wait until the following Monday?

Earlier in the season KGPE was showing the raider game on the SD channel, but a different game in HD on KGPE-DT. I bet they could get into trouble if they hadn't switched to the raider game today and got caught.

Thanks for the help, inundated. I have e-mailed that map to KERO in Bakersfield along with a request that they allow a waiver, keeping my fingers crossed.

I received an initial response from KGPE on the HDTV football game they dropped:

Mike
At this point in time I do not know what happened on Sunday but
I am following up on it and will let you know what happened and what has
been done to try and prevent it in the future.

Thank you for tacking the time to drop me a Email on this.

Now that football season is basically over except for the playoffs, I don't see this happening again for another 8 months or so anyway but I hope they find out what happened and let us know.

Well I'm impressed with the 6412 so far. I bought a SIIG firewire and a 10" firewire cable. I installed everything, followed the directions from the thread on here, and was downloading to my laptop within 15 minutes.

I'm disappointed Comcast hasn't picked up KMPH-DT yet. I was looking forward to watching all of the playoffs in HD. They better have it up before the Super Bowl though.

No 26 yet huh. That sucks. Speaking of stuff that sucks, our friendly local ABC turned the HD off at 10:47 from Boston Legal tonight. 30 seconds I guess I can see, but holy crap, almost the last quarter of the show? Cmon.

Originally posted by rodneyremington
For those of you within Comcasts grasp:

I've had their new motorola HD-DVR/cable box, the 6412, for a few days now. It is simply great...IMHO it's the best thing to happen locally to HD enthusiasts in the past year. At least for Comcast subscribers. My contract w/E* is up this month, and I was deciding who to choose for my next programming provider, and I've gotta say the Comcast offer was hard to beat.

I initially signed on w/E* when they were giving new subs an 811 for free w/a one year contract - at the time the best I could find a D* HD receiver for was ~$300. As a die-hard Tivo enthusiast (two S1 tivos still pluggin along) I was dying to get back to DTivos, and waiting for the price of the HD-Tivo to drop into my stratosphere - hasn't happened.

With the 6412 out I called Comcast and, long story short, they'll be out Thursday to install with no installation fees, the $9.99/month for the 6412 and a $25/month programming credit for 16 months for switching from satellite. All in all, my monthly cost is lower, for a higher programming tier than I had on satellite and when/if Comcast switches HD equipment I'm out nothing.

I'd have to use an HD-Tivo for more than 8 years to get value over the $9.99/month lease fee. Since D* is dumping Tivo well before then, and has committed to moving to MPEG4 (which the current HD-Tivos can't do) it was a no-brainer.

Brian

I talked to the engineer at KERO - the Bakersfield ABC affiliate that has to give us waivers to receive ABC via DirecTV. He told me DirecTV uses some old report that lists Fresno as a Bakersfield market. He argued with them years ago to be removed from that and they wouldn't budge. He also stated that he has never denied anybody in Fresno a waiver, but it is a lot of work for him to keep having to approve waivers from the entire Fresno metro area.

Anyway, the waivers from Bakersfield should be an automatic thing as soon as they hit his desk. Just ask DirecTV for the ABC national feed and have them submit the waiver request.

Originally posted by Mr.Poindexter
I talked to the engineer at KERO - the Bakersfield ABC affiliate that has to give us waivers to receive ABC via DirecTV. He told me DirecTV uses some old report that lists Fresno as a Bakersfield market. He argued with them years ago to be removed from that and they wouldn't budge. He also stated that he has never denied anybody in Fresno a waiver, but it is a lot of work for him to keep having to approve waivers from the entire Fresno metro area.

Anyway, the waivers from Bakersfield should be an automatic thing as soon as they hit his desk. Just ask DirecTV for the ABC national feed and have them submit the waiver request.

It sounds like the engineer needs to have someone higher up the chain at ABC call DirecTV. Fresno SHOULD not be listed as a Bakersfield market. That really sucks. I'm really glad I have Comcast now.

It isn't about ABC. It is that DirecTV just goes by what the report says and they won't budge. That wastes the time of DirecTV's staff, their customers and also the Bakersfield ABC affiliate.

Originally posted by Steve S
I was watching House last night on KMPH and noticed that only the top left third or half of the Fox logo was onscreen in the right lower corner, is this the same for all you guys? None of my other HD channels have the logo cut off, so though I know I have a bit of overscan I don't think that's the problem with the Fox logo. PQ was quite good overall--some film grain evident but that's normal for lots of filmed tv shows--what little I've seen of live sports on KMPH looked very good indeed. Their upconvert of SD is also very nice, unlike KSEE which has lots of combing during fast movement like the red Dodge truck commercial.

KMPH also has the digital closed captionning working, some "older" hd channels haven't mastered this.

I noticed the same thing. I have been watching The O.C. and 24 on 26-1 and I also only see the top left. I can not see the "X" at all. I actually think that 24 looks real good in HD. One of my favorites. The best show in HD I think is Lost.

Hi, I just want to introduce myself as a new Fresno HD AVS Form user. I wish I had found this months ago. I have Direct TV HD with a JVC 48 inch TV. I have a decent antenna that gets 24,26,30,47. I also get both ABC HD channels (got lucky with a waiver years ago) . This will be a cool place to go to report issues and talk about stuff. Can anyone recommend a good set top antenna for Fresno? My signal is usually around 50%.

Thanks!

Originally posted by mdt178
Anyone with Voom having a problem with Fox 26-1? It was on for a couple of days, but it's been "dark" for a day or two now. I had similar problems with 47-1 awhile back, but that was fixed.

I had to the same thing with 30-1. It was out for a few days and the tech guy at 30 said to rescan worked perfectly. This may be old news, but im a newbie. Anyone notice on the D* HD receiver that it shows 53-1 and 59-1 on the guide with having shows in HD? That seems to be a big joke. There is no way those shows are HD.


So what is the leading tech here? Direct TV or Comcast? I could never leave Direct TV.

i too am new to this site i just happened to find it while doing a hdtv search. i use comcast. I get abc, cbs, nbc, inhd, inhd2, espn and discoveryhd. does anyone know what else might be coming to comcast in the near future. what about fox? would be nice for the superbowl. im sure this topic has been discussed so im sorry if im being repetitive but like i said im new...thanks and any info would be great.

Greg

Originally posted by firemedic679
i too am new to this site i just happened to find it while doing a hdtv search. i use comcast. I get abc, cbs, nbc, inhd, inhd2, espn and discoveryhd. does anyone know what else might be coming to comcast in the near future. what about fox? would be nice for the superbowl. im sure this topic has been discussed so im sorry if im being repetitive but like i said im new...thanks and any info would be great.

Greg


You cant get OTA channels with Comcast? With Direct TV you can get OTA plus whatever they carry. 26=1 comes in real good.

You get OTA with an antenna. Most people who get cable have an aversion to antennas for some reason.

If you have Comcast does the HD receiver have a set top antenna input? That is how my direct tv HD receiver works. It even puts all of the local OTA channels in the guide.

Does anyone have this unit? I do and there are problems.

SIR-TS360

I did have that receiver until I got my HD-Tivo. (It's under my bed now).

Comcast receivers do not have OTA tuners.

Originally posted by fresnohd
Can anyone recommend a good set top antenna for Fresno? My signal is usually around 50%.From Merced, using a Silver Sensor, I was able to pull in solid digital signals from NBC / CBS / FOX / WB (sorry I forget all the affiliate call signs atm) - all w/my trusty Silver Sensor. If you search the forums you'll find tons of threads on the SS.

[EDIT]

On an entirely different topic, now that my 6412 is in, I called up the engineering department at KMPH and asked if they had any idea when Comcast would carry the digital signal. The engineer I spoke with, a very amicable and helpful fellow (didn't get his name, had an English accent I think), said <brace yourself for the frustration of bureaucracy> the KMPH and Comcast engineers have already done all the testing and everything is a go - *PENDING* Comcast and Pappas coming to an agreement on the terms.

He said literally it would take about 1 second from the moment they're told the agreement is reached to when they can go live with the signal on Comcast's network - all the testing, config, and integration is done.

It certainly won't hurt, then, for everyone to start phoning & calling both Comcast and Pappas to get this done. Might not even hurt if anyone knows someone at the Bee - there were several areas where the Superbowl was "saved" last year (often just days before the event), due to local media pointing some light at the fact that thousands of folks were not going to be able to see the Superbowl in HD due to bureaucratic squabbling.

Brian

I am starting to think that this 6412 does not have antenna inputs. I must admit the 26 OTA picture is real nice. We just got it a week or two ago. It looks real good on the O.C and 24.

Originally posted by fresnohd
I am starting to think that this 6412 does not have antenna inputs...Huh?

This question was asked and answered only a few posts above where you first did. As Klin (and many others) have stated - it does not have an OTA tuner.

Brian

Does anyone know if there is anyone local that will come out to Clovis and check out my HD system? Check to see if all the settings are good and that I am getting the best picture?

Silver Sensor Digital HDTV UHF Indoor Antenna - ZHDTV1

Does anyone in Fresno/Clovis have this? I am searching online now with no luck. It seems everyone only carries Terk.

You could probably get anyone of a number of people out there if there was a financial incentive to do so. Also, if you are not getting the optimal picture, are you hoping they can fix it? That could take anything from pluging in your interconnects properly, adding interconnects you do not have to calibrating your display.

If you are getting HD, there should be no doubt as long as you have an HD display.

Shouldn't your user name be clovishd?

I have a silver sensor, but I don't know the model number. I do not use it, though. Being way out in Selma I opted for a roof mounted antenna.

True should be clovis. My picture for the most part is good. I just would like to make sure it is optimal. Maybe once i get a better antenna and get this stupid Samsung HD receiver to work properly it would be fine.

Originally posted by Mr.Poindexter
I have a silver sensor, but I don't know the model number. I do not use it, though. Being way out in Selma I opted for a roof mounted antenna.

Would you sell that antenna? I can not seem to find them in Fresno.

Originally posted by fresnohd
Does anyone know if there is anyone local that will come out to Clovis and check out my HD system? Check to see if all the settings are good and that I am getting the best picture? Ummm...you're at one of (if not the) premiere site on the net for good info on exactly these issues. Take some time and read through the forums, use the search feature.

Read, research, then tweak. Then learn some more. Then after all that, come back and ask more questions.

Alternatively, if you're not inclined to DIY, there's several qualified ISF professionals who will travel (on occasion) to your area. Here (http://www.imagingscience.com/isf-trained.cfm) is a list of them. One gentleman I know will (for standard price + travel fees) make the trip is Mr. Bob (http://www.imageperfection.com/), whom many folks have good things to say. Calibration of one input at one resolution starts around $400 and goes up from there.

Spend some time reading up and learning - it'll be time well spent.

Brian

Originally posted by fresnohd
Would you sell that antenna? I can not seem to find them in Fresno.

I once used a RadioShack UHF Dual HDTV Indoor Bow-Tie Antenna (http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&product%5Fid=930-0998) and worked great -- channels I received had 95% signal strength using both my Samsung T165 and Sylvania SRZ3000.

Switched to an RCA Amplified Indoor Antenna (Model: 1250) since the Bowtie antenna is only UHF and I couldn't get KFSN and KAIL (Ch. 9-1/30-1 and Ch. 7-1) from Kings Co. using the BowTie

I highly recommend the Radio Shack antenna -- but I don't live in Fresno/Clovis area, and I'm not sure if the antenna will get KFSN and KAIL if you reside in the area.

I'm sure all Sears stores carry the Silver Sensor.

Did anyone notice if The O.C was in HD on 26-1? To me it looked like it was not. The Direct TV guide also did not have HD. The picture still looked good, just not like HD.

If it didn't have black bars on the sides it was HD. A lot depends on how grainy the filmstock is etc, and some cinematographers and directors go for a softer or grainier look than others.

At this point, we're all (Comcast subs - OTA fellas are ok) probably going to miss the Rams/Falcons matchup on Saturday, because Comcast and KMPH are each trying to go down the wire and get the best terms out of each other, while holding the customers hostage.

I've already made (more than) my share of phone calls to Comcast / KMPH / and Pappas - so if you haven't already, start letting them know that you're unhappy that Fox HD (already tested and ready to go) is still not being carried on Comcast.

Brian

So I am the only Direct Tv with OTA here?

On the Zenith Silver Sensor, I found a few. Is the signal even better if I get an amplifier for it?

I'm DirecTV with ota, no cable. If at all possible a good outdoor antenna will give better results than the Silver Sensor, with or without an amplifier.

I live about a mile or so due west of the airport and get great reception on all the local ota digital channels that are up. Antenna is a big VHF-UHF jobbie from Radio Shack but it's only about 4 feet above my single story home's roofpeak. I just sorta aimed it in the same direction all the other antennas in the area are pointed and left it at that. My reciever is a Sony HD-200, a box mfd by LG and essentially similar to the current Hughes models.

My house has double layered stucco walls and a stone-coated steel roof, indoor antennas just don't work for me.

I also am D* OTA. Amplifier shouldn't make much of a difference for digital signals.

Originally posted by fresnohd
Is the signal even better if I get an amplifier for it? One thing you need to keep in mind is, that w/digital broadcasts, signal strength is less of an issue. I think, perhaps, you're looking at your digital signal strength from an analog perspective.

With analog reception, every (reasonable) incremental increase in signal strength improves the PQ. With a digital signal you either have the full digital signal or you don't. (I'm neglecting some of the problematic dropout issues on marginal signals as that's not an overall PQ issue)

i.e. on a digital set, you'll notice no "better" PQ by increasing your signal strength from say 70% to 90%. If your receiver locks on well at 70% (no dropouts) the PQ will not improve if you increase the signal strength.

So, bottom-line, if you're searching for the best PQ, signal strength (via OTA) is not on your to-do list (assuming you are getting a locked signal - which I believe you are)

Brian

Brian is absolutely correct. If your present antenna gives you a solid picture with minimal dropouts or pixellation that's as good as it gets. An analogy would be DirecTV signal strength. Some of my DirecTV channels only run at about 70 or so for signal strength but are solid with no dropouts except during hailstorms, overall pq is no worse than some of my other channels that run in the mid-90s.

You should also keep in mind that some local digital stations (53 for sure and sometimes 26) are picking up their analog signal at the transmitter site and converting it to digital for their digital feeds. Last weekend and sometimes during the week 26's analog signal was unusually weak and except when running HD from Fox, the digital signal had the same slightly snowy look. 53's digital feed always displays the exact same analog pq problems as their analog feed--some snowiness and color banding.

Originally posted by stickyfingers
I've already made (more than) my share of phone calls to Comcast / KMPH / and Pappas - so if you haven't already, start letting them know that you're unhappy that Fox HD (already tested and ready to go) is still not being carried on Comcast.

Bug Pappas and Bug Comcast, but don't waste your time calling the station (unless you call during business hours ??-5pm). This rings especially true during any time of the day we're actually showing something in HD. None of the higher ups and decision makers are there during prime time (7pm-10pm) or on Sunday so please leave the BoardOps alone. I honestly get a call or two a week (got one tonite as a matter of fact) that somehow made it back to me asking about the HD signal and Comcast. I try and have patience (I'm a fellow AV fan, elsewise I wouldn't be on this forum) when I get these calls but I honestly have no answers for you guys, I speak for all the board-ops when I say none of us are kept in the loop in these matters.

hey Adopted,

I get the impression you maybe work for KMPH? If so, let me compliment you on the quality of your HD signal. Your SD upconverts are also excellent!
I've been getting HD OTA for about 3 1/2 years now, have seen all but KFSN (30) inaugurate HD in that time, and 26 has been the most trouble free as far as early problems.


If I might ask a dumb question, why is the FOX logo sorta mostly off screen in the lower right hand corner during HD, and would it maybe be possible to make it just a bit more translucent as I'm a bit scared about burn in?

Also, any chance of getting HD on channel 59 in the forseeable future?

If these are questions for higher ups, please accept my apologies.

First up, no apologies needed, I'm on your guys thread so I have no right to get too defensive. I hope my first post wasn't to defensive, just kinda warning more for you guys. Not all the other ops might be as patient as me, we're not supposed to field calls from viewers EVER. Yet we somehow do and they're not always pleasant. Oh yeah the Upconverted stuff looks just as clean as the source material stuff does. Trust me there was problems in the beginning we just never launched it till we got a nice clean picture in-house. I'll pass on the compliment to one of the main engineers responsible... I was gonna tell him how funny it was I found out people cared enough to talk about it on a forum I've visited for quite some time.

Fox logo... that will probaly change, that logo is the default sent down by FOX until we send them the bug we'd like inserted in the stream. I've gotten a few calls about the logo problem, we checked our WS monitor and the Plasma in the theatre and saw no problem. But I'll pass on the word about that too, especially if more then a few of you are expericing the problem that might get them to investigate some more. But don't count on it anytime soon, especially cuz the Superbowl isn't far away.

WB-HD: No comment. Don't hold your breath or you'll end up bluer then the bug.

Adopted,
I have the same problem with the Fox Logo in the bottom right corner being half cut off and too Bright. FYI, I have a 53' wide Panasonic.

Thanks for listening.

The Fox logo if you do a split picture on my set most of it shows up. Whats happing is the overscan on our sets is cutting off the bottom and right most portions of the bug.

I had my set calibrated and set overscan to 3% but out of the box many sets can have a overscan much higher, and thats why with my split screen it shows up because no or less overscan with the split. Which is okay by me, because it would be huge bug if its not chopped off.

On this topic does anyone notice how far up or down on the screens sports tickers are? On my 57" set, there is over an 1" gap between the top edge of the screen and where the graphics start. I now this is because of different overscans on different sets and they(broadcasters) want to make sure its not chopped off on those sets with a high overscans. But it sure can be annoying at times, it seems like the graphics are in the middle of the picture.

And as with other posters pass the word on to "those" who would like to know that the FOX picture looks great in HD. I never watched '24' until this year but it looks great in HD so now I find myself hooked. I'm sure I'm not alone in letting HD programming determine what I watch. During football season I would only watch CBS when it went head to head with FOX because I couldn't stand to watch a SD Picture. Looking forward to a HD upersay owlbay.

Anyone else watching Lost tonight sans HD? Not to mention drops off and on?

Originally posted by snatch
Anyone else watching Lost tonight sans HD? Not to mention drops off and on?

No HD thru Comcast either. I find it ironic the "simulcast in HD" still flashes on by, yet it's not. What the hell KFSN? :rolleyes:

I watched it on the ABC Los Angeles feed in HD. Was KFSN not broadcasting in HD?

No HD on my OTA either. It was strange my receiver said it was 720. But it was not. My Samsung does not work on my Direct TV ABC HD Feed either so I was watching SD.

Well ABC is broadcasting the inauguration in HD, and it's working on KFSN. I'd say KFSN has redeemed themself for last night :D.

Lost...Inauguration....

Not redeemed!

Yeah, I knew how the inauguration was going to turn out.

As for priorities - Lost is the #1 season pass on my TiVo. I didn't even watch the inauguration.

Wish me luck guys, Direct tv is sending me a replacement for my Samsung HD receiver, this will hopefully fix the problem that i have with Direct tv ABC and ESPN programming.

Mr. Poindexter,

I'd be interested to know how you are getting the LA ABC HD feed. I've had a running fight with DirecTV ever since it came on and have not yet been able to convince them that KFSN is an O&O and therefore they should turn it on for me.

I got it in less than 24 hours. Have DirecTV apply for a waiver. Then call and talk to the engineer at KERO in Bakersfield. Tell him your name and that you are in Fresno trying to get a waiver. He will grant it. He will go online and sign off on it. Then call DirecTV back and let them know you have the waiver. They will check and you will have it.

I have the LA and NY HD feed on Direct TV, I got a waiver 2 years ago for the SD Channels so they just automatically turned them on.

Lucky suckers. My brothers grandpa and grandma-inlaws also have the LA and NY feeds. They just bought a new HD set and get glorious HD without an antenna. Lucky bastards live right in the middle of Northeast Clovis too. Talk about grandfathering...

well my new RCA sure works better them my samsung, those ABC HD feeds come in much better, I bet the ESPN stuff will work better also. I think I have had my ABC feeds even before we got the locals and I still have them. I was surprised to get the HD feeds, right here in Clovis.

Wierdness. I have been trying without success to get the ABC-W hd feed since the first day it was available on DirecTV.

First I was told I could not get it because SD locals were available in my area, then because KERO in Bakersfield claimed Fresno as in it's market, and that they would apply to KERO for a waiver. then the GM of KFSN e-mailed me in response to a query as to whether or not they were O&O that they still needed to give me a waiver and they were not gonna do it.

At that point I gave up.

Just now I called the DirecTV HD elegibility number and talked to a rep named Matt. I asked if there were any news on the waiver from KERO, and he said no. Then he asked again where I lived, and said "I can turn it on for you". Within a minute he'd turned on ABC-W for me!!

Now I have a backup if KFSN messes up!

I mostly use it as a backup, but i like the east coast hd feed to watch some shows early in the evening.

I could certainly use a backup for when KFSN either has a poor signal or just plain doesn't do HD (see last wednesday for Lost and Alias). Any suggestions Steve?

the only way that I have heard of is people saying that they are moving and using their new address for the eqiupment and their old address for billing. if you used a bay area address you would get nbc cbs and abc hd, if you use la i think you would get all 4.

More wierdness. Even though the rep said last night that the waiver hadn't come thru, I found a notification in the mail today that my waiver had been granted, said notification must have been mailed out prior to my inquiry to Matt last night. It could be that he first looked for a waiver from KFSN, which is not necessary since they are owned and operated by ABC, then discovered the waiver from KERO in Bakersfield.

Snatch,

I strongly suspect that between the time I gave up on this a few weeks ago and last night, something might have changed overall at DirecTV. I can only suggest you call DirecTV's HD Network eligibility number:

1-800-263-0028 and see if they will let you have ABC HD west.

The rep last night turned it on for me even though he said the waiver from KERO in Bakersfield hadn't come thru, even though it obviously had.

You should be able to get ABC HD west only, since KFSN is the only local affilliate owned and operated by the network.

As for the problem with Lost and Alias, I noticed the screen went black several times, and figured it did so because they were trying their damndest to get the HD up. I've been HD capable since Sept. of 01, when KFSN was the only local station with a digital signal at all, let alone HD. Things were a lot worse then. Audio was almost always badly out of synch and picture breakups occurred every 5 or 10 minutes on a good night.

Is there another ABC or CBS HD channel then 47-1 or 30-1? Also anyone here have a RCA Direct TV HD reciever? I just got one yesterday and the OTA scanner can not seem to find 47-1 or 30-1. Also it is wierd that in the guide there is no program information for OTA locals. My old reciver Samsung did have program info. I wanted to see what others see on their RCA.

Yeah I had the drops also and I too assumed they were trying to get it working. I suppose I shouldn't complain what with how things used to be as you mentioned.

Well I just got my T151 back from my sister(they never hooked it up for 5 months). I got it hooked up, and KMPH-DT is coming in very nicely. They're showing the NFL pre-show in HD and it looks pretty good.

Still can't seem to record/watch network programming from KMPH properly with my Samsung T165 OTA tuner -- via firewire to my PC using "CapDVHS" or "VideoLAN".

I get a scrambled picture and a transport stream that is unwatchable.

The problem comes when KMPH switches from network to station/local programming (ie local commercials) or from local programming to network programming.

This is the only problem I have with my T165.

Anybody else have this Samsung tuner?

Or has anybody else tried recording KMPH to their pc via firewire using the methods described here? (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=403695)

I have the most problems reception-wise with KMPH than any of the others. Twice I've tried Tivo-ing American Idol and both times there were stretches of "scramble" that left it unwatchable.

Snatch,

Can you tell me at what points did your recordings become unwatchable or "scrambled" (ex. KMPH switching to local commercials)?

Interestingly, the commercials actually came in for the most part Ok. The HD is where the problems occurred. If I turn on 26-1 at any time of the day before prime time, reception and 'quality' are fine, but when the HD comes on, it becomes a chore trying to keep it going consistently. Last week wasn't quite as bad as the first week, but it was still pretty problematic.

For me personally, 24-1 I have never had problems with, 47-1 very rarely, 30-1 every now and then a small part of the overall picture 'scrambles', but for the most part is consistent. 26-1, and only when they're doing HD, is the one I have problems with.

how are you guys getting kmph fox 26....i have comcast HD and no fox....are you using something different?

Well, the rep I just talked too told me that a wavier is required for both Kero (obviously) AND for KFSN. I asked how this is because they are owned and operated by ABC, and he said that local stations that already offer HD have the option of requiring you to watch their feed over the national one. I then asked him if everyone has to ask for this waiver, ie folks in SF or LA or any O&O, and told me that some areas have what they call 'blind waivers' that are granted automatically. Theoretically, shouldn't that be any O&O? Shouldn't only the non-O&O's be needing waivers?

He also told me they aren't even allowed to submit waivers in certain areas. Anyway, I guess I'm playing the waiting game now as he said it would take up to 45 days for them to respond.

Suck.

Originally posted by firemedic679
how are you guys getting kmph fox 26....i have comcast HD and no fox....are you using something different?

they are getting the Fox HD signal OTA (over the air). Comcast doesn't yet carry fox but hopefully soon.

We're getting the signal over the air from KMPH. Unfortunately Comcast's boxes don't have OTA tuners.

Originally posted by rodneyremington
...Comcast doesn't yet carry fox but hopefully soon. Since they've managed to shaft Comcast customers, by not reaching an agreement in time for 24 or *any* of the playoff games, I don't expect them to get anything done in the next week or so, because of the off week for the NFL...

Brian

Snatch,

Did you call the HD Eligibility number or just the regular reps? I swear sometimes it seems like you get a different answer on these things depending on the individual rep you're talking to.

The notification I got in the mail stating that my waiver had been granted didn't specify whether it was granted by KERO, KFSN, or both. Just says "Waiver granted by your local TV stations". I know KERO routinely grants them for people here in Fresno, and the General Manager of KFSN told me in an e-mail there was no way they'd grant it. So either somebody at KFSN granted it contrary to what the GM said or they didn't need to grant it since KFSN is O&O. I'm not about to try to call DirecTV to find out which for fear they'll turn it off again.

KABC in LA uses a different aspect ratio for their SD upconverts than KFSN.

KFSN puts a 1:33 picture in the center with black bars on the side. KABC appears to be doing a slight stretch of the 1:33 image, to maybe 1:50 or 1:60--black bars are definitely narrower, nothing is lost off top and bottom, faces look just a tiny bit wider than the same images on KFSN. Desperate Housewives started out in upconverted SD 4/3 on KFSN the other night, switched to KABC and it was HD. After the first commercial both were HD. I could see no difference in pq between KFSN OTA and KABC on DirecTV, the satellite picture was really excellent.

You said you were having trouble with 26.1 on your HD-Tivo, do you also have problems in the store? I haven't had any problems with it lately. Usually these days if there is a problem it's at the station's end rather than a problem with your equipment. When 47 first started there was severe picture breakup exactly every 3 minutes for days on end, turned out to be a problem with their encoder. 26's SD was iffy for a few weeks when they first started, seemed to get much more stable recently.

Originally posted by stickyfingers
Since they've managed to shaft Comcast customers, by not reaching an agreement in time for 24 or *any* of the playoff games, I don't expect them to get anything done in the next week or so, because of the off week for the NFL...

Brian

I'm disappointed that they haven't gotten it up and running with Comcast. I hope they get the feed up before the super bowl. I really want to get some of the commercials capped :D.

I called that eligibility number you gave me. I was expecting to start with an automated response system and was surprised a real person picked up right away. That's interesting that KABC uses a different AR, I would have thought they'd all be the same.

The only station I have trouble with on my HD-Tivo is 26.1. I posted a while ago that I have no problems with 47.1 or 24.1. I do occasionally have a quick blurb on 30.1, but 98% of the time things are fine when they've actually got it going. On Desperate Housewives last Sunday, the start of the show had half the screen cut off when they were trying for HD and they had to switch to SD, but as you mentioned got it going and it was fine the rest of the time.

I watched American Idol tonight instead of Tivo-ing it to see if that would make any difference, and initially I thought it had as the first 30 min were perfect. After that, the next 15 min started scrambling for a good 10 seconds, would regain consistency and then lose it again. The last 15 minutes were unwatchable and I had to change it to D*'s local feed. My wife actually gasped when she saw the disparity in PQ between the two, but I had no choice, 26.1 was dead for me.

I would love to blame my tuner, but since I get the other 3 local HD"s almost flawlessly, I have no other choice than to blame KMPH. Am I wrong?

I'm thinking its KMPH.

Using VideoLAN VLC media player, I tuned into "HOUSE" at 9pm with my Samsung T165. I ran into problems (flickering/scrambling, video just unwatchable) just when KMPH switched to local commericals.

I exited the program, changed the channel on the STB, switched back to 26-1, opened the VLC media player, and voila I could watch KMPH again. When KMPH returned to FOX network programming, the video stream again became unwatchable.

There is something going on there that will not allow my T165 (and possibly snatch's HD-Tivo) to work properly when KMPH switches between local and HD network feed?

I sent an email to Carlton Simmonds at KMPH asking him when Comcast may be carrying the Fox HD channel, and this was his response:
------------------------------------
CSimmonds@kmph.com to me


Our two companies are currently talking about a retransmit agreement
which both sides are hoping will be resolved before the Super Bowl.



------------------------------------
Those of you with a vested interest in this happening may feel free to email him and politely express your interest in the matter.

I have no problems with 26.1 on my integrated tuner. I do notice on my receiver whenever they go to local programming/commercials it switches form DD 5.1 to Pro Logic. I thinks its kind of interesting to see which commercials are national vs local. A few of what I thought were national truck commercials were actually local.

Originally posted by rodneyremington
I sent an email to Carlton Simmonds at KMPH asking him when Comcast may be carrying the Fox HD channel, and this was his response:

Our two companies are currently talking about a retransmit agreement
which both sides are hoping will be resolved before the Super Bowl.That's the exact same position they were in two weeks ago and, I imagine weeks, or months, before that. It's a big, dumb game of Chicken, with each side betting the other will blink first - and it's really very silly.

Maybe several years ago, when cablecos and local affiliates were first beginning to structure retransmit agreements for digital channels, it was problematic to decide what terms were fair for these transactions. At this point though, most affiliates in most markets now provide their digital feeds over the cable networks, so the value of this to each side is, I imagine, fairly well established.

If this was a non-Superbowl year for Fox, I imagine this agreement would have been reached much more quickly, but as it is, both sides hope to leverage the event to extract the best possible terms. I could be overflowing with naivete, but I still hoped customer service would figure into the equation somewhere.

I don't imagine they expect anyone to believe there's any good reason this didn't get wrapped up months ago. KMPH was almost certain to have their digital signal up before Superbowl, and Comcast was well aware of that as well - and there's simply no (good) reason Comcast and KMPH shouldn't have had an agreement in place when the station went live with the digital signal. As stated earlier, everything HAS been in place to carry the digital signal weeks ago, it's just a matter of taking it to the brink to get the best terms for each side.

Last Superbowl, this exact posturing kept several areas cable customers from watching the Superbowl in HD - here's to hoping they've learned something...

edit: After that wee diatribe, I decided to do something (hopefully) more productive and dropped an email to various editors and reporters at Central Valley newspapers. I've seen several other papers (nationally) that are, again (sigh), attempting to focus some heat on this issue in their area. Here's just one from todays Cincy Post (http://www.cincypost.com/2005/01/26/hdtv012605.html)

Brian

HI folks!
I live in Clovis, more specifically Quail Lake (between Academy & McCall and Shaw & Ashlan).

I am new to HDTV and still shopping for a TV and enjoying every minute of the hunt.
I presently have Dish...and am disappointed in the offerings for HD. The price package is not bad, but CBS Los Angeles is the only HD network channel offered.
I explored Comcast and DirecTV. Comcast can get me more locals, although I have never been thrilled with cable, even though I know it has improved over the years. Direct will buy me some locals too, but I already have a PVR receiver (non HD) and one additional receiver.
Just seems like too much hassle when I could mount a good UHF antenna on the dish and connect up to the existing Sat cable with a diplexer. All the channels of interest except KMPH are within 2 deg of each, so I am going with a large amplified multidirectional UHF antenna. Then I will drop my local Dish package and save 6 bucks also.

This one looks good too:
http://www.lashen.com/vendors/winegard/uhf_antennas.asp


http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/welcome.aspx

I will still get CBS/LA off Dish so I will have my CSI fix satisfied. :) in any case. I will try and handle Fox as a separate issue. Maybe a directional antenna in the attic for that purpose only, and have it switched by the set.
I don't plan to have my new set in place before SB anyway!

If anyone wants to persuade me to switch to a different program provider than Dish, plaease do. I am still learning. But I would think HD will poliferate the market quite well in the very near future.

So I feel sorta sheepish.... Even though I subscribed to Comcast "HD DVR Notification Email for Clovis" service, I never got an email letting me know it was available. Grrrr!!! That's what I get for not keeping up to date on this forum. So, I ordered the 6412 yesterday, and its scheduled to be installed on 2/7. Hooray!!!

Can any of the 6412 users out there tell me if it has OTA capabilities/input?

Also, I'm really interested in how I can transfer content from the 6412 via FireWire to a Windows Media Center 2005 server (or MythTV or whatever), and then stream HD content over IP (Ethernet or 802.11a/g) to another set top PC or Media Extender. Anybody done that yet?? Especially since Comcast only "allows" one DVR per household, I've got to figure out a way to centrally manage all my digital content. Anyway, enough rambling from me... I need to go outside and play with my daughter while there is a break in the clouds :-)

Adam

Hi Adam,
There is some dicussion as to using the firewire on the 6412 on other areas of avsforum. It is apparently functional. I haven't used it.

I do have 2 6412s, the rule about one per household doesn't seem that hard to get around as I ordered my first one on the phone and my second one on the internet. My friend here in Clovis also did this.

I also was supposed to get an email announcing the availability of the 6412 from comcast but still haven't and I've had mine for almost a month. Go figure.

There is no OTA functionality nor would I ever expect COmcast to provide OTA hardware, after all they are in the business of selling you TV.

Originally posted by rodneyremington
There is some dicussion as to using the firewire on the 6412 on other areas of avsforum. It is apparently functional. I haven't used it.The general info 6412 thread is here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=464986). The firewire out thread (which addresses issues w/the 6412 as well) is over here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=403695).

With both of these threads, be warned that they are very long, and even the helpful folks will get frustrated if you don't read the thread (and use the search function) before asking questions (as it's most likely been asked and answered several times already).

Cheers,

Brian (go send Comcast and Pappas and KMPH an email about FOX-HD)

Okay guys, a little help here maybe? I'm headed into Fresno for Superbowl weekend at my sister's house. I'm bringing with me an OTA HD receiver (Zenith HDV420) and a Silver Sensor in the hopes of pulling in KMPH OTA. She lives near Hwy 99 and McKinley Ave. Is there anyone out there that has had sucess with a similar setup and location? Antennaweb.org is kinda confusing in that they show the KMPH signal to be practically due east and 52.6 miles away while the studio in Visalia is really more like due south but maybe also that many miles away. Is 52.6 miles really how far it is to the broadcast antenna or to the studio? Is there any chance at all that we'll get to see the Superbowl in HD with the setup that I'm bringing into town or should I stay home where Comcast just came to an agreement this last week with our local Fox affiliate (KTVU, O&O by Cox Entertainment) to carry the Fox digital signal? Any input from y'all out there in the cold and gray Central Valley would be much appreciated.

Thanks,
Chris

I've been able to get a solid signal even further north (Merced) from KMPHs OTA broadcast, so I'd say you're in good shape (I use a Silver Sensor too). Currently my OTA rig is on the shelf as I wait with baited breath that Comcast and KMPH will reach an agreement that will preclude me having to pull out the trusty Sammy 151.

Someone who's viewing OTA can probably give you a "for sure" answer, but I don't think you'll have any problems.

Brian

Originally posted by videoaddikt
HI folks!
I live in Clovis, more specifically Quail Lake (between Academy & McCall and Shaw & Ashlan).

I am new to HDTV and still shopping for a TV and enjoying every minute of the hunt.
I presently have Dish...and am disappointed in the offerings for HD. The price package is not bad, but CBS Los Angeles is the only HD network channel offered.
I explored Comcast and DirecTV. Comcast can get me more locals, although I have never been thrilled with cable, even though I know it has improved over the years. Direct will buy me some locals too, but I already have a PVR receiver (non HD) and one additional receiver.
Just seems like too much hassle when I could mount a good UHF antenna on the dish and connect up to the existing Sat cable with a diplexer. All the channels of interest except KMPH are within 2 deg of each, so I am going with a large amplified multidirectional UHF antenna. Then I will drop my local Dish package and save 6 bucks also.

This one looks good too:
http://www.lashen.com/vendors/winegard/uhf_antennas.asp


http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/welcome.aspx

I will still get CBS/LA off Dish so I will have my CSI fix satisfied. :) in any case. I will try and handle Fox as a separate issue. Maybe a directional antenna in the attic for that purpose only, and have it switched by the set.
I don't plan to have my new set in place before SB anyway!

If anyone wants to persuade me to switch to a different program provider than Dish, plaease do. I am still learning. But I would think HD will poliferate the market quite well in the very near future.

Well, actually you won't get CBS-Hd from that LA station on Dish, as it's only available to those who are out of reception range of any local CBS station OR who live in a market whose local CBS affilliate is owned and operated by CBS. Channel 47 is not owned and operated by CBS.

That's the bad news.

The good news is that you should be able to pull in all of the local HD channels (24, 26, 30, and 47) just fine with a decent roof antenna. I'm over by the airport, my antenna's only 4 feet above my single story roofpeak, and I get all of 'em solid as a rock, no rotor, no problem due to 26 being a bit off center. Antenna aim is not like dish aim--doesn't have to be perfect. BTW, 30's Hi def is actually broadcast on VHF channel 9.

Dish mounted antennas, or antennas that don't look like antennas usually don't work worth a damn. Get a real UHF/VHF antenna and mount it on it's own pole above the roof, not in the attic. You won't need an amplifier, they actually can introduce noise to the signal and mess up digital reception. I tried one when I had my old antenna and it only made things worse. My present antenna is a Radio Shack VU-160XR, pulls in every local digital station just fine, as well as some analogs I didn't know were there. No rotor or amp.

I would not switch providers just yet, as Dish just bought Voom and may have lots of new HD coming up within the next year or so.

I'm with D and am not at all happy about the fact that they don't have most of the national HD networks like TNT, Starz, etc, but have too much invested to switch to anything else right now.

They do carry ABC-west HD from KABC in LA, and I was successful in getting them to turn it on for me.

Welcome to the forum and the wonderful world of HDTV, do let us know what you end up with as far as a set and service provider.

Originally posted by Steve S
Welcome to the forum and the wonderful world of HDTV, do let us know what you end up with as far as a set and service provider.

These are the antenna I had in mind Steve. I agree, and being half the distance to the transmitters than you are, amping should not be needed. They can add noise and I don't expect very long cable runs either.

http://www.lashen.com/vendors/winegard/uhf_antennas.asp

http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&product%5Fid=15-2160

I do live in a gated-community and while the law is on my side I don't want an antenna on a pole if I can avoid it.
The smaller antenna would be mounted on the side of the garage near the front peeking over the roof into empty space!

I am sure Dish will come up with better HD programming, it's inevitable. I have enjoyed the service and not ready to switch providers.

Thank for the clarifications, Steve...!!!

Originally posted by Steve S


Dish mounted antennas, or antennas that don't look like antennas usually don't work worth a damn. Get a real UHF/VHF antenna and mount it on it's own pole above the roof, not in the attic. You won't need an amplifier, they actually can introduce noise to the signal and mess up digital reception. I tried one when I had my old antenna and it only made things worse. My present antenna is a Radio Shack VU-160XR, pulls in every local digital station just fine, as well as some analogs I didn't know were there. No rotor or amp.

Hmmm...amps introduce noise in to the signal eh. I don't know why I didn't think of that. I have an amp on my antenna right now. I'm using that Terk HDTVi. I don't know how it compares to silver sensors etc, but it works great except for my 26 problems. Maybe I ought to the amp off?

Snatch,

Try it with the amp off, it might work better. If you have stucco outside walls or insulation bats in your walls chances are you have chicken wire and or foil in your walls which can seriously hamper the performance of indoor antennas. I have double layered stucco and a stone coated steel roof, indoor antennas just don't work at all in my home.

If at all feasible a decent outdoor UHF antenna of the kind that looks like a rectangular grille set on end with bow ties in front should work fine. VHF channels above channel 6 should come in with these (KFSN's actual HD broadcast is on VHF channel 9 and 2 of the Spanish channels SD digitals are on VHF channel 5).

I went with my relatively large RS VHF-UHF antenna (an Xmas gift from my dad, LOL!) mainly out of desperation trying to get good ota with a Hughes E-86, turned out the box's ota digital tuner was fried.

It may be that the problem with 26 involves some incompatibility of it's signal and your HD DirecTivo, especially if you get 26 well at the store with other receivers, or the problems may be at the station.

Don't hold your breath for a Fox Super Bowl in HD via Comcast. Last night KMPH ran a commercial advertising the game in HD via an antenna, and made the point that its not available via satellite or cable.

There line and incorrect as it was "just hook up an antenna to an HD ready TV".

FWIW

You very well might be right, but if so, that's absolutely inane on their parts. If they don't carry it by Sunday, I almost guarantee it will be carried by the end of February, or mid-March at the latest.

They both know it's going to get carried relatively soon, so all this dickering around is wasteful.

Brian

Sticky and Rodney,

Thanks for the replies re: the 6412. I'm quite motivated and inspired now to figure out to how to make the thing particpate in a centralized content distribution system. I'll keep everyone posted.

Adam

Hi All-

Newbie here. Just got hooked up with Comcast HD today. Everything looks good, but I have a couple questions. I noticed in earlier posts that Fox HD isn't on Comcast yet. That's a big bummer. We were expecting to watch the Super Bowl in HD. Also, does the WB have a HD channel yet? I noticed some of the progamming said it was in HD, but I didn't notice it in any of the 900 channels? Thanks for all the great info :)

Fox HD will be carried by comcast within a few weeks most likely, whether before or after the superbowl is unknown.

Don't know when WB HD will be on comcast--anyone?

Probably won't have WB HD until after they start sending out an HD signal. If they had an HD signal at all then we would be able to pick it up OTA.

Originally posted by Mr.Poindexter
Probably won't have WB HD until after they start sending out an HD signal.Ya' think? ;)

Brian (wonder which we'll see first - WB in HD or KVPT in HD...)

Considering Pappas also has the WB, don't count on it any time soon.

Spoke with a Comcast rep yesterday....no super bowl in HD.

Originally posted by snatch
Considering Pappas also has the WB, don't count on it any time soon.

Spoke with a Comcast rep yesterday....no super bowl in HD.

damn, I was looking forward to recording some HD commercials. Oh well, I guess I'll have to make sure my T151 is getting KMPH on SB sunday.

ok, need some help. getting ready for the big game.. i live over by shaw and brawley and have been trying my darndest to get my motorola receiver and two different antennas from good guys to pick up the signal for KMPH 26.1.

I've only attempted to get these channels the past three nights, and to no avail.. the signal is too weak. the second of the antennas I purchased has some sort of 10dB amplifier, that isn't helping me!!!

Can anyone assist.. i only have a chance to check on these tonight with the bernie mac show and that other one, before superbowl sunday.

Anyone have any suggestions on another antenna that may work best? and where I can purchase over the counter in the next day or so..

we have a huge party planned and would love to show the game in HD.

help!

i'm doing my best to read all of the posts, but having to actually work is limiting me.

I live not too far away, Polk & Sierra and get 26.1 just fine. Forget those indoor antennas and get a real one. For a quick fix go to Sparky's and get their square bow tie antenna and just use inside your home until you can get it outside. Thats what I did before I put mine on the roof and it worked just fine.

Indoor antennas don't like houses with tile or stone-coated steel roofs, nor do they work well if there's stucco with chicken wire under it and/or insulation bats with foil covering.

Drew has the best idea for indoor antenna, don't get an amp from Sparky though--the ones they sell introduce lots of noise in an analog signal which will translate to real nastiness on a digital one--been there, tried that. If that antenna doesn't work inside, put a long lead on it and take it outside and put it as high as you can and jigger it around. Best idea is to permanently mount it on a real antenna mast, chimney mount often quickest and easiest solution.

After watching commercials all weekend from Comcast explaining how they tried to get us the Super Bowl in HD but could not reach an agreement, I go to the listings for Fresno Comcast Digital on TitanTV.com and they have listings already for KMPH-DT on channel 906. Looks like we were the losers in the Pappas/Comcast game of chicken.

Well I enjoyed the Super Bowl very much. I went to friend's house in Hanford, and I took my OTA tuner with me. We were able to get a weak signal from KMPH and was able to watch the game in HD and 5.1 DD surround. It was showing about 3 bars worth of signal, but it was enough to get the broadcaset.

KMPH aside for a moment.
Given the choice between Comcast HD provided locals and OTA, is there THAT much difference in PQ?

I've read on other location threads, like the Bay Area, etc. that most folks are very happy with the PQ from Comcast on HD broadcasts.

This could be the deal breaker for me on dumping Dish, and going with cable when I get my HDTV and not messing around with OTA.



Cable already beat out SBC for high speed internet. They gave me 29.99/month for 1 year vs. SBC $36/mo the 1.5-3.0 mps DSL Pro service.
Of course they only did it because I planned to cancel the standard $56/mo service.
I spent only 5 min on the phone with Comcast, 20 min. with SBC just to cancel an order. That's another story....

I've been very happy with the HD picture quality from comcast for both the networks locally and the other HD channels. I wouldn't expect the PQ to be very different from OTA, actually. I don't think comcast has the compression degradation HD picture quality issue that some have complained about with satellite.

Thanks, Rodney. That's very interesting.

If you still watch any of the non-HD local channels there is something else to consider regarding OTA vs Comcast.

Comcast doesn't carry the digital feeds from any of the non-HD local digital channels, only the analog versions and those are not carried digitally on cable, it's an analog signal that looks pretty bad on most big tvs.

WB 59, UPN 53, and PBS on Comcast are virtually unwatchable on my Comcast service, but their digital feeds ota, though not HD, are actually quite watchable.

All of the local channels are now doing at least SD digital broadcasting and it looks very much better than the analog version on Comcast. So even though our UPN, WB, and PBS stations aren't doing HD, they are doing SD digital that will look much better than what you get on Comcast. In addition, Comcast doesn't carry any of the subchannels from any of the digital broadcasters, not hugely important but a factor nevertheless.

The valley locals I get on Dish don't look that great. I know they would be better OTA. A friend has cable, and his local channel reception appears to be about the same quality.
I have to believe everything will upgrade eventually. And if something is that important to watch one can always go the OTA route as needed.

Keep in mind that by law all cablecos are going to be switching to an all digital signal for all channels quite soon. That includes Comcast of course, which will significantly improve the appearance of the lower channels. Rumor has this happening for Comcast region by region later on this year, perhaps before summer.

Which law is that? The only law I know of for conversion to digital is for broadcast signals, not cable signals.

Originally posted by Mr.Poindexter
Which law is that? The only law I know of for conversion to digital is for broadcast signals, not cable signals.

I don't either but consider this. Broadcast by definition is not restricted to over-the-air.
Furthermore, it is cable and satellite companies that are demanding more innovations from broadcasters like movies on demand.
If the government regulates and legislates TV manufacturers to develop sets capable of receiving digital signals, and broadcasters to send out digital signals, I can't believe they would exclude satellite and cable companies from doing the same.

One of the main reasons I switched to D* is that every channel is digital. My wife watches a lot of TNT, USA and SciFi, and those channels looked terrible on Comcast due to the analog feed. They actually look really really good on D* through my HD box. I agree the locals that D* carries are quite compressed and leave something to be desired, but I get great reception now with my antenna and just watch all locals that way.

The other reason I went with D* is their claim to an ambitious 'adding' of future HD channels. Hopefully that comes to fruition.

Videoaddikt, start imagining it. The digital transition is about freeing up the analog spectrum so that it can be auctioned off for special services like police radios. HDTV is just a carrot to pull the cart and is not the end goal.

The public owns the airwaves and the government must protect that public good and regulate it. The satellite frequencies are also part of the public good and are regulated by the FCC, but the catch here is that they are already 100% digital - DBS means Digital Broadcast Satellite.

The FCC is not going to mandate digital cable since it is a closed system owned by a private entity. The market will determine a need for that.

Movies on demand are being demanded by service providers in an effort to generate more revenue. Interactive TV is in the same boat except that hardly any consumers want interactive TV.

I think that broadcasting does indeed mean over the air and is broken down between terrestrial and satallite broadcasting. Cable isn't a broadcast but a narrowcast as in not everyone can get it. You can exclude access to the signal by not running a cable there. You cannot restrict terrestrial broadcasts selectively like you can with cable. Sat is in the same boat except their signal is encrypted.

Cable will be forced into converting to digital by satellite providers and a self-preserving fear of being at a competitive disadvantage when marketing against those providers.

Cable Operators Prepare for Switch to All-Digital Systems
Comcast, Charter, Adelphia & Other MSOs Gear Up for Digital Simulcast Trials

JANUARY 01, 2005
By Alan Breznick, editor, Cable Digital News

As the new year opens, the cable industry finally seems poised to
start making its much-ballyhooed shift to an all-digital format for
its core video product.

Six months after Charter Communications launched the nation's first
all-digital cable system with a big splash in Long Beach, CA, many
large cable operators are quietly drawing up plans for similar digital
simulcast field trials and deployments in their territories. MSO
executives and tech vendors say they expect to see a flurry of such
trials and initial deployments in 2005 and 2006 as cable operators
seek to move more and more of their customers away from analog
broadcasts and set-top boxes.

"Now they're practically all gearing up for trials," said Seth Kenvin,
vice president of strategic marketing for BigBand Networks, a tech
vendor working with many cable operators on the digital transition.
"Some operators are laying out a time frame now and placing orders...
I think this is going to be a major wave for two to three years."

Indeed, several large MSOs have already tipped their hats. In
December, Comcast Corp. unveiled ambitious plans to launch digital
simulcasts of its analog channel lineups in most of its systems by the
end of 2005. Speaking at two separate financial analyst conferences in
New York last month, senior Comcast executives outlined their strategy
for carrying out the digital transition.

"Now, what we're doing is we are already beginning to put the
simulcast signals on to our systems," said David Fellows, chief
technology officer (CTO) of Comcast. "And over the course of 2005, we
will bring that up across our entire footprint."

In somewhat less bold fashion, Adelphia indicated last month that it's
also gearing up to introduce digital simulcasts in several of its
systems as early as the first quarter. The MSO disclosed its plans in
a Dec. 15 meeting with FCC officials in Washington.

"We're definitely looking at it," said Doug Ike, vice president of
advanced video engineering for Adelphia. "We're looking at candidate
markets."

Such other large cable operators as Cox Communications, Cablevision
Systems, Insight Communications and Bright House Networks are not
making their plans just yet, at least not publicly. But they're
closely monitoring the landscape.

"We know it's being tested in various places around the country," said
a spokeswoman for Bright House. "We're watching that. We're going to
keep track of what's happening."

The push towards all-digital systems comes as Charter continues to
report positive results with its Long Beach pilot. Charter, which
started digital simulcasts in the 75,000-subscriber system in early
July, has been delivering its 91-channel basic cable lineup in both
digital and analog formats with few technical or operational hitches.

"It's been a surprisingly easy transition after all," said Wendy
Rasmussen, vice president and general manager of Charter's Los Angeles
metro markets division. "It was not onerous at all to our customer
base."

With 70% of Charter's Long Beach subscribers now opting for digital,
Rasmussen said the all-digital move has produced better picture and
sound quality for the bulk of the MSO's subscribers, raising their
satisfaction levels, cutting churn rates and bolstering the system's
competitive position against satellite TV providers. She said the
switch has also improved the company's relationship with the city and
boosted employee morale.

"There have been some good, tangible benefits," she said. "We're very
pleased with the results so far. Internally, I'd definitely deem this
a success."

Satisfied with Long Beach's initial success, Charter executives are
now looking at ways to offer more digital offerings. Among other
things, they're weighing Hispanic and broader foreign-language tiers,
particularly aimed at the local Asian-American community.

Charter officials declined to say where they'll try digital simulcasts
next. But, without saying so explicitly, they made it clear that they
will expand the pilot and extend the simulcasts to more markets.

"That's the future," said a Charter spokesman. "Digital simultrans and
all-digital are in Charter's plans."

Taking their cue from Charter, other large cable operators are
plunging into the digital simulcast business too. As noted before,
Comcast, seeing simulcasts as the first step towards true all-digital
systems, is leading the pack.

In a move to spur its digital transition, Comcast notched a 20-year,
$100 million deal with Level 3 Communications for inner-city and metro
dark fiber early last month. The fiber backbone deal, encompassing the
lease of 19,000 route miles reaching 95% of Comcast's cable systems,
will give the MSO much greater capacity for the delivery of
all-digital services, including video-on-demand (VOD) and
high-definition TV (HDTV).

"We are in the process of connecting or lighting up that fiber,"
Fellows told financial analysts in New York last month. "We have
already lit up the Boston to Washington, D.C. corridor and are passing
packets over that section of the network."

Like Charter, Comcast will keep its 80-channel or so analog lineup
intact for its non-digital subscribers as it begins its transition to
all-digital systems. So the MSO, while taking care not to lose any of
its analog customers, will use up precious bandwidth transmitting the
80 channels in both analog and digital format.

Despite the loss of bandwidth from such duplication, Fellows argued,
the digital simulcasts will produce "some significant near-term
benefits" for Comcast. First of all, he said, the switch will provide
the MSO's digital subscribers with "higher quality pictures" because
they won't be getting any analog signals anymore. This is especially
important for customers with large-screen digital TVs, a group that
spends heavily on video services and is quick to notice analog
imperfections on their big-screen sets. MSOs are particularly
concerned that these high-value customers could be enticed to switch
to competing all-digital satellite TV services.

Second, Fellows said, the switch will enable Comcast to offer VOD more
widely, including its free, ad-supported on-demand product. In
addition, he said, moving at least some customers to all-digital
service will allow Comcast to cut the cost of its digital set-top
boxes because the new set-tops won't require expensive analog
circuitry. Finally, he contended that the shift will permit Comcast to
create more specialized and low-end tiers to attract cable
subscribers, just as Charter is aiming to do.

"We're not forcing our customers to go digital," Fellows said. "I'm
going to give [Comcast COO] Dave Watson the opportunity to incent
customers, to get them to realize they really do want digital and not
just analog HBO, but all of the on-demand that comes with being even a
basic digital subscriber."

Over the longer term, Fellows definitely sees the move opening up more
bandwidth for Comcast. He estimates that the MSO could "triple the
capacity of our hybrid fiber coax network" once it recaptures all the
bandwidth used by the 80 analog channels.

"Once we have the digital signals up there, we can begin to take back
the analog signals," he said. "I don't think we're going to take them
all back in the near-term. But every time we take one analog signal
back, we can offer 12 channels in its place in standard-definition,
three channels in its place in high-definition."

Fellows figures that it will take about $150 million for Comcast to
bring its infrastructure up to snuff for the digital simulcasts this
year. Calling it "a modest investment," he said most of that money
will be spent on digital ad insertion and encoding equipment.

As for the new, cheaper digital set-top boxes that Comcast and other
cable operators envision, Fellows believes the costs could come down
to $50 per set-top or lower in a few years. Currently, Comcast
executives said, low-end digital-only set-tops cost around $70 to $75
apiece. This is about $50 less than the cost of today's low-end hybrid
analog-digital boxes. In hybrid set-tops with digital video recorders
(DVR), going all-digital could drop the box cost by as much as $100.

"Actually taking the analog circuitry out of one of our digital
set-tops saves an awful lot of money," Fellows said. "It's another
step towards getting that sub-$100, maybe even $50 set-top box."

At Adelphia, executives are studying their fully upgraded 750-MHz
systems to see where they have enough capacity to carry the same
channels in both analog and digital format. They're also testing
digital encoders, splicers and multiplexers to see how to make the
digital simulcasts work. "Certainly, we need to look for a
cost-effective way to do digital programming insertions," Ike said.

Adelphia and other MSOs are keen on solving this challenge because
local cable advertising is a $5 billion and growing annual business in
the U.S. alone. Once a cable system moves to digital simulcasts, local
TV commercials must be inserted and delivered in both analog and
digital formats.

In addition, Adelphia officials are weighing the costs of low-end
digital set-tops. Like their counterparts at Comcast, they're seeking
boxes with price tags of $50 or lower.

"We're still looking for the mysterious $30 set-top box or at least
$50 on the low-end," Ike said. "There's a lot of discussion with the
set-top box folks about what we need that set-top box to do."

thanks again to those that let me know to go to sparky's to get an over the air antenna.. worked wonders in my backyard, propped up with a broom inside my garbage can full of grass clippings.. full signal throughout the whole game..

thanks again!

Glad it worked out.

Wonder how many in Fresno Area get to see 26.1 in HD? My guess is not even 1% of the population.

Originally posted by Mr.Poindexter
Videoaddikt, start imagining it. The digital transition is about freeing up the analog spectrum so that it can be auctioned off for special services like police radios. HDTV is just a carrot to pull the cart and is not the end goal.

The FCC is not going to mandate digital cable since it is a closed system owned by a private entity. The market will determine a need for that.

I think that broadcasting does indeed mean over the air and is broken down between terrestrial and satallite broadcasting. Cable will be forced into converting to digital by satellite providers and a self-preserving fear of being at a competitive disadvantage when marketing against those providers.

I agree, retransmission is probably a more appropriate term for cable, et al.

Here is an interesting article. It talks to exempting cable from simulcasting. Something that will provide cable with greater incentive to move forward in the digital domain. Considering the poliferation of the cable industry, they can hardly be ignored by the feds, even if their control over them is limited.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/media/2005-01-26-digital-usat_x.htm

Originally posted by DrewM
Glad it worked out.

Wonder how many in Fresno Area get to see 26.1 in HD? My guess is not even 1% of the population.

Count me on that small group getting to watch FOX hd on 26-1. Direct TV with OTA antenna. It looks real good.

I get FOX HD on 26.1 as well.

fresnohd, shouldn't your name be clovishd? I will be moving to Clovis in about 5 months.

you are right, i should see if i can change my nick. where in clovis you going to be? we are in clovis east.

Pardon this newbie inquiry....I plan to be HD ready with a new display in the April-May timeframe.

I am considering a set with a cable card capability. Now, if I drop Dish and take Comcast Digital will I only need OTA for Fox? (forget WB and UPN for now).
I should be able to get the major 3 plus maybe PBS over cable? And of course HDNet, ESPNHD, etc. through subscription?


loc: east Clovis....

I will be in the Buchannon area, I think. It is a Wathen-Castanos development off of Shepherd and DeWolf. It had the largest bonus room of any development I have seen - a 30'x22' room with a 9' 1" ceiling.

Originally posted by videoaddikt
Pardon this newbie inquiry....I plan to be HD ready with a new display in the April-May timeframe.

I am considering a set with a cable card capability. Now, if I drop Dish and take Comcast Digital will I only need OTA for Fox? (forget WB and UPN for now).
I should be able to get the major 3 plus maybe PBS over cable? And of course HDNet, ESPNHD, etc. through subscription?


loc: east Clovis....

By April or May KMPH's HD signal will probably be available on Comcast. If not the cable card sets also have ota ATSC tuners and you should have no problem getting 26.1 ota. WB and UPN are digital here but are not HD capable, nor will you get HD feeds of them from Comcast. Comcast doesn't carry HDNet as far as I know. Our local PBS channel does not do HD, though they do have an on-again off-again digital signal at 40.1, often inactive in the morning but usually up in the evening. The PBS, WB, and UPN channels on Comcast are all analog and are not in their digital tier, pq on the analog tier on Comcast stinks on an HD-capable set.

Thanks, Steve. Getting NBA/PGA on various channels will supersede any interest in HDNet... :)

I guess everything will be available in due time. I will likely be doing the OTA thing anyway for a couple of non-HD sets in the house.

Interesting in that my TiVo gave me a message saying that comcast had added channel 909 KVPT (PBS) to my lineup, although the channel is not actually there at the moment.

I think this is a precursor to PBS-HD going live on Comcast in the near future. New channels usually show up on the TiVo guide before the channel actually starts broadcasting.

Cool!

Originally posted by rodneyremington
Interesting in that my TiVo gave me a message saying that comcast had added channel 909 KVPT (PBS) to my lineup, although the channel is not actually there at the moment.

I think this is a precursor to PBS-HD going live on Comcast in the near future. New channels usually show up on the TiVo guide before the channel actually starts broadcasting.

Cool!


IF KVPT will have HD On Comcast, shouldn't they have it on OTA also?

Of course it should be ota as well as on cable, their SD ota digital signal's been up for a while now, though they only seem to turn it on at night.

Anyone know when the HD will be up? Also anyone also notice on their Direct TV guides that is shows 59 and 53 with shows in HD that are not in HD?

Looks like tv.yahoo.com has PBS on 909 too. Is anyone actually seeing the channel?

Update for Steve and others who want to try it-

I took your advice a while back, can't remember how long its been- but I applied for the waiver for ABC as you did, and a little post card came in the mail yesterday saying it had been granted! The card said I should already be receiving it, which I doubted, but I checked anyway and sure enough, not there. But, 5 minutes of holding with D* later, and I now have ABCHD through the dish for a backup! (Which is nice considering the periodic problems I have getting ABC through my antenna.)

Thanks again Steve.

Wow, it took that long?! Man, I must have been lucky to get in touch with the right people to have mine fixed in a day.

Hi Folks,

New DTV convert here currently viewing OTA content using a Samsung SIR-T451 and indoor Terk HDTVi. Had "fun" finding the sweet spot for the location of the Terk but I am now able to receive all the local stations without too many issues. The only exception is KAIL/UPN, which I think is suffering from multi-path distortion as signal strength is fine but get random blocking from time to time.

Just wondering if any of you are having problems with DD5.1 from KGPE/CBS? I was looking forward to watching my CSI fix in it's full HD/DD5.1 glory but found that all my HT receiver could decode was DD2.0. From what I understand we are at the mercy of the local broadcaster as to whether DD5.1 is piped through to the end user(?). I assume my equipment is good since KFSN/ABC 30.1 (VHF 9) provides me with DD5.1 sound using optical interconnects. I also noticed last night that I was getting DD5.1 from 26.1 (cannot remember the show). Any insight from local members would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Originally posted by SineWave
Just wondering if any of you are having problems with DD5.1 from KGPE/CBS? I was looking forward to watching my CSI fix in it's full HD/DD5.1 glory but found that all my HT receiver could decode was DD2.0. From what I understand we are at the mercy of the local broadcaster as to whether DD5.1 is piped through to the end user(?).

Neither KGPE nor KSEE pass the 5.1 audio on their digital broadcasts. Most of NBC's primetime scripted shows are in 5.1 now, and the CSI's and Numb3rs on CBS are as well. Live events from CBS are usually in 5.1.

Hopefully these two affiliates are working on providing DD5.1 audio in the near future. Of course, the cost to provide it is in the tens of thousands of dollars. So it may be awhile.

A station engineer, 47's I think, once said that getting 5.1 audio vs 2.0 to work brings up lots of audio synch issues and can even affect video, causing frequent blocking and video dropouts. So in addition to the extra expense, there are other issues involved.

I started getting HD back in October of 01, when 30.1 was our sole local HD station and was doing 5.1 all the time. It was actually very rare then to have the audio in synch with the video, and the picture would drop out fairly frequently, maybe 4 or 5 times every half hour or so.

One thing I've noticed since DirecTV turned on ABC-W HD for me is that even though KFSN and KABC (the LA feed on D*) both do 5.1 all the time, the 5.1 on KABC sounds much better during network feeds like Lost than KFSN--deeper bass and better channel separation.

Originally posted by Steve S
One thing I've noticed since DirecTV turned on ABC-W HD for me is that even though KFSN and KABC (the LA feed on D*) both do 5.1 all the time, the 5.1 on KABC sounds much better during network feeds like Lost than KFSN--deeper bass and better channel separation.

I haven't been back to this thread in a while, and I didn't know you'd been successful at this quest. Congrats!! It's good to see KERO wasn't making a stink about it...since Fresno really is not their market area.

Mr. Poindexter posted a while back that KERO routinely grants waivers for Fresno residents, so I was in luck in that regard. I've noticed no difference in pq between KFSN and KABC that could be attributed to compression by DirecTV, but KABC's upconversion of SD is different, has a slight horizontal stretch so the black bars on the sides are narrower than those on KFSN.

I presently have Dish...just purchased an HDTV and I told the salesman I plan to drop Dish for Comcast Digital. He told me to keep it and put up an OTA antenna until Dish does their satellite thing for locals.
It is his opinion SD is still looks better on Dish than digital cable. He is in the Bay Area, so it could be a regional difference. Any takers?

DirecTV will have locals in HD long before Dish, probably by late 06 or early 07.

Comcast does not carry all the local digital stations, only the HD ones and still not KMPH, which has been HD for months now. You will be better off with an antenna as far as local digital reception than with Comcast. Note that although only 4 of our locals are doing HD, all the rest except for 49, the Catholic Channel, are doing SD digital. SD digital ota beats the crap out of Dish's analog locals as well as the Comcast analog feeds.

Comcast does not carry local analog channels digitally, it's still a crappy analog signal all the way to your house.

Originally posted by Steve S
DirecTV will have locals in HD long before Dish, probably by late 06 or early 07.

Comcast does not carry all the local digital stations, only the HD ones and still not KMPH, which has been HD for months now. You will be better off with an antenna as far as local digital reception than with Comcast. Note that although only 4 of our locals are doing HD, all the rest except for 49, the Catholic Channel, are doing SD digital. SD digital ota beats the crap out of Dish's analog locals as well as the Comcast analog feeds.

Comcast does not carry local analog channels digitally, it's still a crappy analog signal all the way to your house.

Thanks, Steve. I think I will keep Dish for now. I was able to hook up a Terk TV50 I had sitting in the garage ready for dumping with the Spring cleanup. I can pull in all the big players, NBC/ABC/CBS/Fox plus PBS.
That with the Dish HD package should get me through for a while. :)
I may upgarde to the small Zenith wonder indoor ant.

I used to have Comcast until I bought my HD set last summer and I found out how crappy analog signals look. I switched to D* mainly because of channels like SciFi and USA that my wife loves that are not HD, but look soooo much better on D* than on Comcast.

I have no problems gettin all the locals OTA (mostly), and we also have D*'s HD pack. Universal HD was a great improvement.

Did anyone see the Utah/UTEP game? It was supposed to be in HD, but it wasn't on KGPE over Comcast. Come on KGPE, get with the PROGRAM!!

Is anyone else having problems with WB59 OTA. It seems to be coming in really bad, while all my other OTA channels come in fine. I love watching HD it is so crisp.

Is anybody else having problems getting CBS OTA HD at this time? I apparently lost it starting yesterday. Of course, just in time for March Madness.

Is this related to March Madness (some stupid blackout rule) or is there a problem with KGPE's HD transmitter?

This BYTES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think there's something wrong with their transmitter, or something else. Each game I've watched on KGPE 47.1 has been just the regular digital. No HD at all. At first I thought maybe CBS wasn't doing the first rounds in HD, till I watched Sportcenter and saw highlights in HD of the exact same game.

Very disappointing.

Real quick- meltedcheez, are you just saying you love HD or that you get HD on WB59? To my knowledge KFRE 59 doesn't have HD, just a digital feed.

AHHH, They just switched from the HD Utah/Oklahoma game to the SD Pacific/Washington Game. Come on KGPE!!!!

I'm getting concerned now. I am still not getting ANYTHING on 47.1 - not even digital. I checked with another HD user who lives across town and they said everything is fine for them.

I have not had any problems with 47.1 until Thursday. I'm not really sure where to start. I get all other channels in HD just fine so I don't think it's an antenna issue. I do get analog 47 so I know that I am picking up feeds.

Any suggestions on where to start troubleshooting?


Thanks for any help.

I too was disapointed with 47-1 not showing the hoops games in HD, especialy since Direct TV had channel 81 blacked out during the games.

If your 47-1 is down, I would try rescanning your OTA channels. I have a Direct Tv received and I have to do that once or twice a year. It always seems to fix it. I also have a problem with 59-1, I know it is not HD (Even though my receiver says some of the shows are in in HD) but the Bulldog games would probably look better then regular 59.

Originally posted by videoaddikt
Thanks, Steve. I think I will keep Dish for now. I was able to hook up a Terk TV50 I had sitting in the garage ready for dumping with the Spring cleanup. I can pull in all the big players, NBC/ABC/CBS/Fox plus PBS.
That with the Dish HD package should get me through for a while. :)
I may upgarde to the small Zenith wonder indoor ant.

Which PBS HD Channel do you get?

KVPT is not doing any HD yet. Their SD digital signal is actually broadcast on UHF channel 40, shows up as 40.1 and 40.2 on my guide. It's only turned on in the evening, not in the am. I'm getting guide data now but it still doesn't remap to 18.1.

Tried tuning 40.2 on my guide late last night and got true HD scanrate (my stb locks into full when it gets an incoming HD scanrate), so we are getting some kind of HD broadcast from KVPT, looked like a demo loop of some kind for the 10 minutes or so I was watching last night.

WOOHOO! (http://tinypic.com/2k0e53)

We have PBS in HD (http://tinypic.com/2k0f95) on 40-2!

Using my Samsung T165 when connected to my PC via firewire, I get the following for 40-2:

Size: 1920x1080
Aspect Ratio: 16:9
Frame Rate: 29.97
Bit Rate: 13.8 Mbps

Video PID : 0x41
Audio PID : 0x44

Different programming...is this just a test/demo broadcast?

Edit: Not a demo broadcast. Here is a link to PBS-HD feed schedule:
http://www.pbs.org/tvschedules/tvschedules_hd.html

This is the PBS HD channel that I am able to receive on my Unity Motion box. KVPT is broadcasting the PBS national feed. Now all we need is the WB and UPN to go HD.

Excellent! My Silver Sensor pulled that puppy in immediately!

Yup, it's a nice strong signal. Things are so much better now than only 3 years ago when ota HD was scarce and very unreliable.

I suppose I should now start sending in email requests to the Sesame Workshop asking when Elmo's World will be filmed in HDTV? LOL.

La la la la, la la la la, H D T V.
La la la la, la la la la, 5.1!
Elmo loves his widescreen
digital TV. That's Elmo's world!

Is it hard to know I have a 15 month old living in the house?

Anyone know if KFSN increased their power output? I just went from Comcast back to OTA due to financial constraints. A couple weeks ago, I couldn't get KFSN unless I set my antenna on my front porch. Now, I can get it with my antenna sitting on top of my TV. oh, PBS-HD rocks :D.