Since these units are now shipping I thought we should start a thread where we can share issues, tips and tricks for the new XBR950 series LCD rear projection monitor.


This thread is primarily for owners - others with questions are certainly welcome but lets not include long debates here about other technologies.

The iLink (IEEE 1394 / firewire) interface looks very promising. Has anyone thought about connecting Hi Def devices to this connector?

Could we connect to a PC?

Is there a High Def Tivo on the horizon?

Other thoughts?

also i just read that the we610 HAS a 10-Bit 3D Comb Filter and the XBR950 does not have one. can someone enlighten me please on that :) ?

isn't the comb filter a good thing to have and why does the xbr950 not have it ?

thanks

Originally posted by flmgrip
also i just read that the we610 HAS a 10-Bit 3D Comb Filter and the XBR950 does not have one. can someone enlighten me please on that :) ?

isn't the comb filter a good thing to have and why does the xbr950 not have it ?

thanks

This is from another Thread, posted by BobFilmore. If I knew how, I'd throw in the URL here ...

"CCP2
The CCP2 integrates a 3D comb filter and CCP's digital driven chrome decoder.
This 1-chip digital solution converts any NTSC source to a pure component
video signal and helps DRC-MultifunctionV1 work efficiently. CCP2's digital
processing is increased from 8 bit to 10 bit to improve contrast.

Advanced Panel Driver LSI
This new panel driver was developed to produce dynamic, smooth contrast
and improve sharpness. By increasing the performance of the panel driver
from 12 bit to 14 bit, sharper and deeper contrast is achieved."


As I understand it, the XBRs have a purely digital signal processing path and split the color information so that much of the filtering (like the comb) analog signal processing needs isn't required. Thus the distortion that analog processing leads to simply doesn't happen in the XBR.

Take with a grain of salt ... can't even prove that the XBR is pure digital ... this is gleaned from rhetoric produced by Sony's marketing and investor relations, which have distortions in their own right.

roblake:

wrt the 'purely digital signal path' that the XBR has,

..wouldn't that be even more of a reason to feed it a digital signal via the DVI connector or possibly the iLink connection?

... the resulting picture should be even sharper on XBR vs the non XBR chassis?

or does the DVI connector on the 610 chassis bypass the analog circuitry too?

Originally posted by Gruber
roblake:

wrt the 'purely digital signal path' that the XBR has,

..wouldn't that be even more of a reason to feed it a digital signal via the DVI connector or possibly the iLink connection?

==> In my opinon, certainly!

... the resulting picture should be even sharper on XBR vs the non XBR chassis?

==> I put my money on the line, sight unseen, based on this belief. XBR 60 is on order.

or does the DVI connector on the 610 chassis bypass the analog circuitry too?

==> Only the schematic diagram would tell for certain. If I had the information, I'd write an article for IEEE Sprectrum ... :=}}} Maybe a call to Sony USA Marketing is in order? Hmmm.

Received my 70" on Wednesday - so far it's a beautiful set just sitting in the room. The anti-reflective screen is better than that of the GW2, but can't say how it compares to the GW3 Non-XBR.
Hooked up the Denon 5900 DVD player with DVI activated. Still trying to figure out how to calibrate the picture settings on the 5900 (chroma delay). However, the DVI does look better than component.
Out of the box, the blacks aren't quite there. I need to get my DVE back from a friend before I comment on the PQ.. It's much better than the GW2 so far.
We watched "Wall Street" last night on DVD - not a reference disc by far, but it was much more "involving" on the 70". The floating screen with deep black matte around the edges of the screen really made the picture "step out" of it's cabinet - all we could see was the picture - This alone was worth the cost of the upgrade!
I'll post more comments as I get to calibrating it.
EL

Originally posted by Gruber
roblake:

or does the DVI connector on the 610 chassis bypass the analog circuitry too?

Supposedly yes, the DVI on the WE610 is pure digital but I have yet to see schematics that prove it. That was a big point for many deciding between the XBR800 and WE610. I dont see any reason the XBR950 wouldnt be all digital as well.

Well, I took the plunge and ordered a 60XBR950 from NOW Audio Video in NC. For me, the cabinet design and a few of the optical differences made the difference. I got a fair price, so I'm happy. They are having trouble getting large quantities of this set, so I was told to expect a December 15 delivery date. Patience is a virtue, but waiting over a month is going to be hard. I can't wait!!!

Can anyone post the differences and picture quality between the XBR 950's and the WE610's.

Saw it at Sony Store in OC. Makes the 610 and the 60" XBR look like toys next to it. Blew me away after 3 months of research and couldn't justify 20K for the 60" Plasma.

1st to purchase it at Magnolia in SM with standard promo discounts. Delivery on Sunday. 4 left in stock in the warehouse.

Wait until the wife finds out.

Saw what? mnc asked about the 60" WE610 and 60" XBR950. What made these sets look like toys? I'm assuming the 70"?

Actually, he didn't say 60" explicitly, but I guess that is implied by the WE610 reference. :)

I think that that 70XBR950s are almost the only ones out there, but much rarer sightings of the 60" XBRs (sounds like CJR saw one). I think a good rule of thumb when picking out a set is to NOT look at it next to a bigger one :D. It is amazing how small a larger set makes the smaller one look; however, by itself a 60" set is quite a good sized picture.

Myself, while I certainly have the room for the bigger set I don't know that I can justify another $1,500 for it. I have a 57" at home right now so 60" will see bigger by itself.

I have a 60" xbr coming in two weeks. I am really interested in how this will compare to my sony KP-65WV700. Anyone know how much the bulbs cost?

The 610 looks plastic (i.e. like a toy, a good picture but lifeless in a way) in comparison to the XBR950. The 120W lamp makes the 70" XBR brighter than the 60" 610 and the design and glass screen truly set it apart from the 610. The XBR design and and picture make it look closer to plasma than any other LCD TV I have seen at 60%-70% discount, you just can't hang it on the wall. It is not just the same TV with better optics.

The 70" looks exponentially bigger than the 60" XBR even though it is only an additional 10". Can't explain why but it just does. Very impressive.

I agree that the XBRs look must "richer" in just their basic appearance from the WEs -- something that should impress people even when the set is not on, if that is important :). I agree with the analogy to plasma, in many respects.

BTW, the XBRs *do not* have a "glass" screen. It is plexiglass (acrylic). What sets it apart from the WEs is that it is mounted on the front of the set so that the picture appears to "float" in space.

Originally posted by BTDT
I agree that the XBRs look must "richer" in just their basic appearance from the WEs -- something that should impress people even when the set is not on, if that is important :).

That only thing that matters to me is whether there is any difference in PQ between the 60" WE610 and XBR. I'm waiting to see someone do a comprehensive comparison between the two. I'm also curious, since the bulb is the same in both sets, whether there is anyway to increase the wattage of the bulb in the WE610 to 120.

Originally posted by magillagorilla
... I'm also curious, since the bulb is the same in both sets, whether there is anyway to increase the wattage of the bulb in the WE610 to 120.

As I understand it, the XBR series has an additional filter on the LCD panels. If you pump the wattage up in a WE, you may fry the panels ... or at least prematurely age them.

I don't know yet if the panels are unit-replaceable or whether an entire new optical block would be required ...$$$.

Does iLink on XBR go both ways?

I posted the following on the GWIII owners thread, did not see this XBR thread until after that. Anyway, the Sony specs don't call the DVI or iLink connections "outputs", instead they call them "interfaces." I am a non tech type and perhaps there is no distinction, but it got me curios. My post to the other forum is this:

>>A question for owners of XBR models. I see in the rather skimpy specs on Sony website that there are three iLink (firewire) connectors, one in front and two in back.
My question is this: Does that mean you can record OTA programs from the built in HD receiver onto a D-VHS box? For me that alone would make up for the price premium for the XBR.<<

There is an additional 4 square feet of screen area going from a 60" to a 70" screen. Not bad for an extra 10" of diagonal. The 70" XBR is just about double the size of a 50" plasma.

Does the 70" set come split into two parts that are then assembled, as is the case with the largest Toshiba LCOS and Hitachi CRT RPTs? Can someone provide the dimensions of the box(es) for those of us with narrow staircases and turns to traverse.

Originally posted by ericlhyman
Does the 70" set come split into two parts that are then assembled, as is the case with the largest Toshiba LCOS and Hitachi CRT RPTs?No, this is a tabletop TV.

>>I also posted this is the GWIII thread<<

The answer to my own question is no. It turns out XBR can not output OTA via firewire.
I went to East Palo Alto GG store where they have a 70" XBR on display. The picture is just stunning. Even the SD stuff looked pretty good, as close as ten feet. And the design of the set is really attractive, by far the best looking RPTV I have ever seen. The OTA tuner gets a perfect picture and DVD's look great as well. You have to see the size of the thing--it absolutely dwarfs 50" sets next to it. I could not believe how much bigger 10 inches diagonal makes. The base retracts to be flush with the screen and a built in cabinet could cover the front right up to the picture bezel. Built in properly it could be mistaken for a plazma, and the picture is as good as any plazma in that GG store--and it is the biggest most impressive GG I have been in. They said it is the GG Expo floorplan. Whatever, it is some nice store--located right between a giant Ikea and one of Home Depots new Expo centers.

But it is not the set for me, unfortunately. Because it is almost as reflective as the GWII from last year. The Plexiglas shield, which the salesman says is not removable...and it sure looks like it is not removable to me---makes a beautiful mirror. We have windows everywhere and a view of the entire SF Bay Area from San Jose to San Francisco so the little wife would never put up with bricking up the windows, or even air raid curtains. I may have to settle for the 60" GWIII with its ugly cabinet and inferior picture. If you have a light controlled room I would highly recommend this giant. It has the WOW factor in spades.

Originally posted by ericlhyman
Does the 70" set come split into two parts that are then assembled, as is the case with the largest Toshiba LCOS and Hitachi CRT RPTs? Can someone provide the dimensions of the box(es) for those of us with narrow staircases and turns to traverse.

My 70' was delivered in two boxes. The 'set' has a 'foot' that allows it to sit on a table and not tip over. If you purchase the Sony stand ($1K list) you will get a cool looking stand that matches the set perfectly. It has a locking mechanism that grabs the center of the 'foot'. The net result is that the 'foot' nestles into the stand making the gap between the stand and the set minimal. The front of the foot actually retracts when using the locking Sony stand - very cool.

Originally posted by Villageman
>>I also posted this is the GWIII thread<<

The answer to my own question is no. It turns out XBR can not output OTA via firewire.
I went to East Palo Alto GG store where they have a 70" XBR on display.

...

SF Bay Area from San Jose to San Francisco so the little wife would never put up with bricking up the windows, or even air raid curtains. I may have to settle for the 60" GWIII with its ugly cabinet and inferior picture. If you have a light controlled room I would highly recommend this giant. It has the WOW factor in spades.

Thanks Villageman. I'm also in the Bay Area. Do you know of any stores that have the 60" XBR950 on display and/or in stock for purchase?

I'm in the same boat as you. I have an awesome view with 10 windows in my living room. I purchased the Samsung HLN567 DLP, but alas, it's not bright enough for my room. I'm going to return it. I'm hoping that the XBR950 will be bright enough.

A few stores in the Bay Area have the 70" on display. I was just at Anderson TV this afternoon in Redwood city and it looked awesome, but would love to see the 60" XBR or WE in person before trading in my Sammy DLP.

Just FYI, I was at Anderson on Steven's Creek last Wed and they didn't have any XBR950 yet. I might just have to drive up to Palo or Redwood to see the 70".

Originally posted by Villageman
>>I also posted this is the GWIII thread<<
...
But it is not the set for me, unfortunately. Because it is almost as reflective as the GWII from last year. The Plexiglas shield, which the salesman says is not removable...and it sure looks like it is not removable to me---makes a beautiful mirror. We have windows everywhere and a view of the entire SF Bay Area from San Jose to San Francisco so the little wife would never put up with bricking up the windows, or even air raid curtains. I may have to settle for the 60" GWIII with its ugly cabinet and inferior picture. If you have a light controlled room I would highly recommend this giant. It has the WOW factor in spades.

so you are saying the the WE60 is much less reflective than the XBR950 ??

i have a window right behind my couch and that would be a deal breaker to deal with the "mirror"....

thanks

I have had my 70XBR950 and stand for two weeks. The OTB picture is ok for now. I probably will get ISF calibration in two months. It does take a
little time to get use to the size of the screen. I have had no trouble with
the set to date. Hockey in HD is great.

Originally posted by Villageman
>>I also posted this is the GWIII thread<<

The answer to my own question is no. It turns out XBR can not output OTA via firewire.


Villageman,
Why don't you think the XBR will output OTA via firewire? Did you get this direct from Sony?

I may be wrong, but my belief is that we will be able to record and playback HD over the firewire port. I haven't confirmed this yet, but I see no reason it shouldn't work.

Ixion

Re: 60" display. Sales guy at EPA GG says they will have the XBR 60" on display Friday PM or early Saturday. Hopefully right alongside the 70"

Htwaits

Re: EPA GG XBR display. Yep, they have the front door window lined up perfectly with the 70". I doubt there is a worse location anywhere in that humongous store. But I am glad it is there because that is how our house is everywhere. Darn it, I would buy that set in a second if there was some way to get rid of the glare. Maybe sandblast the Plexiglas? Ammonia?

Flmgrip

Re: the reflection of WE vs XBR, I would say it is like comparing flat paint to glossy. The WE reflection is there but is a subtle muted look, the XBR is just very mirror like.

Why don't you think the XBR will output OTA via firewire? Did you get this direct from Sony?


No, let me hasten to say it was not from Sony, just two salesmen at GG and one real geeky customer that was looking at it the same time I was. I don't put much faith in salesmen, but the other guy seemed really knowledgeable about stuff. (Here in Silicon Valley it seems just about everybody but me is a techie.)
I asked to see the users manual but they didn't seem to be able to find it. I think the geek sort of intimidated them.
Anyway, that is why I posted the question to XBR owners in this thread. I would hope someone would look in their manual or try to record or something. I guess they are all just enjoying their sets and not reading the thread anymore.

Still though, there is the problem of screen reflection--a deal killer for me.

From the Manual, it is clear that the XBR can accept signals on FireWire.

As far as sourcing a video signal, here is the best that they say:

"iLINK: Provides a secure digital interface to other digital home entertainment devices. iLINK allows for the secure transfer of copyright-protected high-definition content between these devices and your LCD projection TV. The iLINK is not compatible with personal computers."

The 60/70XBR950 user's manual does not explicitly say that i-Link cannot output, but all of the examples given are of input from a source device.

Note that earlier Sony displays with i-Link only accepted input, rather than supporting output from the built-in tuner. This would cause me to assume the same will be true for these sets.

Roblake

The iLINK is not compatible with personal computers.

Thanks for the info. This is even worse than I feared.
Lets see, as I understand it, you can't OUTPUT to record and can't even INPUT from firewire equipped computers? So you get THREE practically useless iLinks, ZERO VGA and ONE DVI connection. Good plan I must say.

I guess the were thinking of someone who owns three iLink equipped Sony video or digital cameras. What else works with them?

That makes sense that the i.Link interface is treated as an input port for the DTV. If you were to hook up a cable set top box (like those who live in NY and subscribe to Cablevision's iO service) with a 1394 port, you should be able to receive digital content. In a way, i.Link in the DTV's eyes, is another secure digital input port like DVI-HDCP. I'm not sure however if you can display video from a Digital Camcorder that has a 1394 port. That depends if the DTV can decode DV in addition to MPEG2.

The manual used an example of a digital camcorder with FireWire.

1. What other stands besides the Sony one are people considering for the 70" XBR?

2. Are other potential buyers concerned about not waiting for the SXRD RPTs that Sony is supposed to introduce in 2004?

We are waiting to get the 60XBR before deciding on the stand. Although we have the dimensions, it's not clear just how much the base could overlap the front/back and sides of whatever we set it on.

We are getting the 70" and are getting a stand custom made. Considering the Sony stand was $1000, it made sense to spend a bit more and get something that was both more functional and suited our decor more.

What DVD players are you guys buying for 70" XBR? We are thinking of buying one with DVI output as it is true digital all the way. How about Samsung/Bravo? Some of the members have recommended Samsung HD931 with Wega .....

My dealer says new products will be announced any day now. He's to call me with info later today.

I am using a Sony DVP-S7000 DVD player, one of Sony's earlier models. Although it has component output, I have not even tried using it yet for connecting it to my 70". I am using the S-video (I know it is the inferior interface). The thing is the quality of the video that I am getting from the DVD is absolutely breathtaking, this TV has exceptional circuity for converting the 480i to native resolution. I have the composite cable, and plan to crawl behind the set to hook it up to do a comparison, but I have no urgency to do it because of the quality I am currently getting. Try your current DVD and you might be surprised. I will keep my older DVD for now and wait the for HD DVD when Blu-ray (sp?) makes the scene.

That is exactly what I am going to do with mine (when I get it). Try my current player, but switch off progressive. Depending on how good the picture is, I will choose my upgrade path accordingly.

I saw a 60XBR950 side by side to a 50WE610 yesterday at Circuit City in Houston.

Without quoting prices, the WE was $1500.00 less than MSRP for the
XBR. ::D

The PQ on the XBR seemed slightly sharper than the WE. I say this and there was a Circuit City tech standing next to me and he did not see the same thing.
Both were tuned to HD TV, but I have no idea what the adjustments were.

Take that for what you will.

Once again into the breach

Hexdump,

So you saw a 60" 60XBR950 with a 50" 50WE610 side by side and you thought that the larger screen XBR was sharper.

That means the XBR must be quite a bit sharper because usually smaller screens tend to look better.

I want the new 70" XBR real bad. Any suggestions as to where I can find the best price on one of these? Feel free to PM me with info. I know this forum does not allow price postings.


"Tag" man

I was impressed at the better PQ of the 60XBR over the 50WE, but I can buy a lot of other "stuff" for the additional $1,500.00.

And most places didn't have the 70 as of yet.

I seem to recall that tweeters would be getting the 70" in about 2 weeks and they will call me. I seem to remember it was $7,000.00 but I wouldn't swear to it.

happy hunting

Hex

HI Hex,

I saw the 70" at Circuit City last Tuesday and it is HUGE!! It is truly impressive...

I want one real bad!

"Tag" man

I got a call from my dealer an hour ago. He said to expect my 60XBR950 soon, as the truck containing the 50XBRs had just arrived.

I didn't even know there WAS a 50" XBR, but he assures me. Will be able to see the 50XBR on the floor middle of next week.

"One Test is Worth a Thousand Expert Opinions"

Originally posted by madipac
What DVD players are you guys buying for 70" XBR? We are thinking of buying one with DVI output as it is true digital all the way. How about Samsung/Bravo? Some of the members have recommended Samsung HD931 with Wega .....

This afternoon dealer said Sony ES will be coming with a new DVD player. Lower end new Sonys expected middle of next week. He has no idea about DVI capability.

I checked one out at my local CC yesterday myself and was reasonably impressed. The picture looked very similar to the 42WE610 right around the corner from it, just far bigger of course (this thing made everything but the 65" CRT RPTV's look downright puny :eek: ). It had too many negatives for me to consider it though:

Not PC-friendly - most notably that for something this big it'll probably be even more important than it is for smaller TV's that when you hook a PC into it you can get 1:1 pixel mapping if you don't want it to look like $#!+ :p.
It's just too big! Even without the side speakers (which relative to how big the screen is actually don't add much to its width), it's too big for where I'd want to put it in my apartment, as it would be half-blocking my front door. OK that's not necessarily a horrible thing until I run out of food, but.... :p
Price of course.

Originally posted by Googer


Not PC-friendly - most notably that for something this big it'll probably be even more important than it is for smaller TV's that when you hook a PC into it you can get 1:1 pixel mapping if you don't want it to look like $#!+ :p.
It's just too big! Even without the side speakers (which relative to how big the screen is actually don't add much to its width), it's too big for where I'd want to put it in my apartment, as it would be half-blocking my front door. OK that's not necessarily a horrible thing until I run out of food, but.... :p
Price of course.

I hear that ATI has introduced a new video card that supports DVI/HDCP - all the timings and issues should be handled by the new card/driver. Supposed to be an easy hookup to the XBR70.

Also, have you considered moving to a larger apartment? Suggest getting the XBR70 and inviting everyone from the AVS Forum over to see it. Then your neighbors will even help you move! :p

best,
jg

The DVI/HDCP thing isn't my concern PC-wise; I'm comfortable enough with PowerStrip to make HDTV's that don't officially support PC's work; heck, I'm doing it right now with the KV40XBR800 I'm currently using. I just want 1:1 pixel mapping to go with a fixed-pixel display but due to Sony not using 1280x720 panels and most likely not accepting timings other than standard HD timings, this most likely isn't a possibility. :(

I'll consider moving to a bigger apartment as long as you foot the price difference between my current one and the new one. :D In all seriousness I actually probably could rearrange my living room to accomodate such a large beast should the need arise; it's just that it definitely couldn't drop in as a simple replacement for where the current TV is. :p

Originally posted by roblake
I got a call from my dealer an hour ago. He said to expect my 60XBR950 soon, as the truck containing the 50XBRs had just arrived.

I didn't even know there WAS a 50" XBR, but he assures me. Will be able to see the 50XBR on the floor middle of next week.

"One Test is Worth a Thousand Expert Opinions"
If there IS a 50" GWIII XBR then Sony has done a really good job hiding its existence. I do not believe this exists, but it would be nice to hear that 60" XBRs are arriving.

I'll see what they are passing off as a 50" XBR next week. Unfortunately, my salesman is on vacation next week ...

Can you keep us posted with the DVD player what sony is coming up with? I thought of getting the Samsung HD931 for xbr.


Originally posted by roblake
This afternoon dealer said Sony ES will be coming with a new DVD player. Lower end new Sonys expected middle of next week. He has no idea about DVI capability.

I just saw the new 70 inch Grand Wega at Santa Rosa, CA Good Guys. It was in bright light and still captured your eye with excellent color and definition. Several 50 inch Plasmas and 60 inch RP CRT's nearby and this baby stood out among all of them. Everyone coming into the store was gravitating towards this set. Black level wasn't inky black (due to LCD technology) but it was darn close! Dark scenes were more than satisfactorily dark with good shadow definition. Too many sets strive for unrealistic inky blacks at the expense of critical shadow detail IMHO.

The new floating picture look that is similar to Sony's new XBR plasmas is utilized in this set and it's gorgeous. The entire package reminded me of the large viewer in front of the Captain of the Enterprise! There was a DVD playing from Sony's new ES large capacity DVD player (holds 400 DVD's). This I believe is the first 12 bit DVD player and it was incredibly detailed with no hint of screen door effect or any of the other traditional gremilin effects associated with LCD/DLP technology.

Sony seems to have finally gotten this technology "right" and having it happen on the 70 incher is about all one could ask for. I have a call in now to my ISF tech asking his opinion of this unit. Eagerly awaiting his return call.

Originally posted by madipac
Can you keep us posted with the DVD player what sony is coming up with? I thought of getting the Samsung HD931 for xbr.

Absolutely! Will hit the dealer on Tues, Wed, and Thurs, just to be sure. I only wish I had more confidence in the salesman's certainty about things.

But I used to sell TVs when 10" B&W was the rage ...

There's a lot to like about the 50" GWIII, although I really wished the blacks were deeper. But I had to return the 50" because it broke (wouldn't turn on) after the first week. I was going to exchange it for another 50" when I saw the 60" XBR on the showroom floor. Before seeing it, I knew I didn't want to spend the $2,200 premium for the XBR, and I didn't think I could get a 60" downstairs in my family room either, but after spending some time with the XBR, I was sold.

* The blacks were definitely better on the XBR compared to the 50" GWIII. It's hard to tell in the showroom, but I think the blacks are good enough on the XBR not to be distracting as they sometimes were on the 50 GWIII.

* Like most of the TVs there, there was lots of glare on the XBR screen, but the XBR picture was sharper than the 50" GWIII, which already has a sharp picture. The non-glare screen on the 50 GWIII works well, but you can see the screen texture when panning bright areas, which is distracting.

* The viewing angle of the XBR is much improved over the 50 GWIII. It wasn't bad on the 50", just much better on the XBR. The XBR picture also looked uniformly bright across the entire screen, like plasma.

* The XBR's remote really caught my attention. It's made of metal (no plastic), and looks terrific and feels great in your hand. It's not back-lit, but it has the best key layout of any remote I've seen, which is really amazing coming from Sony. With the ATSC tuner built-in the XBR, I'll be using this remote a lot.

* The built-in ATSC tuner saves one component video input. It's best not do any component video switching with a A/V receiver, and with the 3 iLink inputs, I cannot see needing any more inputs.

Like a lot of us, I've been waiting for HDTV technology to mature to the point where I could get a great picture with reliable components at a reasonable price. If the blacks are as good as I think they are, I'll be very happy with the picture based on my experience with the 50" GWIII. I've got the 4 year extended warranty from CC, so I'm covered for any serious defects or design flaws. And I got about $500 of list price plus a $300 gift card, so I saved a few bucks.

The 60" XBR will be delivered on 11/17. If just hope I can get it downstairs.

probepro... this is not an attack :) just my thoughts and if at all a complaint to sony...

i was torn apart and back and forth between the xbr950 and the we610 (60")... i finally ordered the we610... i did not see either one in that size and only the we610 in the 50" size...
i am really p..d off towards sony that thay make a XBR model with better picture and better blacks... but than put that whole thing behind a mirror... i would have not mind to spend an extra $1500.- for the XBR, but the mirror is just unacceptable... what is the best picture worth if you see your window or lamp reflected in it !!
i was so excited to see that manufactures finally produce some TV's with non-glare screen like the we610... yes most tv's have a high glare screen, but that doesn't make it right !!!
nobody can tell me that the glossy screen of the XBR makes the difference !!

so WHY does sony make a high end TV with a glossy screen !!! i am bummed, but i have to go with the WE610... i am sure i will be happy with it, but WHY WHY WHY !!??

rant over....

Yes, it really is a shame Sony couldn't have done more with the glare on the XBR screen, because as you say, it will be a show stopper for some folks. But I wasn't entirely satisfied with the 50" GWIII screen either. In addition to being able to see the screen texture in bright white areas when panning, I noticed that bright whites seemed to glow, i.e., the seemed to be too bright, and actually caused eye strain. I was never able to adjust the picture and brightness controls to completely eliminate this because the sources vary so much.

With the XBR, Sony may be appealing to the videophile (couldn't think of a better word) who may have a room configured specifically with home theater in mind, and where glare has been kept under control.


Originally posted by flmgrip
probepro... this is not an attack :) just my thoughts and if at all a complaint to sony...

i was torn apart and back and forth between the xbr950 and the we610 (60")... i finally ordered the we610... i did not see either one in that size and only the we610 in the 50" size...
i am really p..d off towards sony that thay make a XBR model with better picture and better blacks... but than put that whole thing behind a mirror... i would have not mind to spend an extra $1500.- for the XBR, but the mirror is just unacceptable... what is the best picture worth if you see your window or lamp reflected in it !!
i was so excited to see that manufactures finally produce some TV's with non-glare screen like the we610... yes most tv's have a high glare screen, but that doesn't make it right !!!
nobody can tell me that the glossy screen of the XBR makes the difference !!

so WHY does sony make a high end TV with a glossy screen !!! i am bummed, but i have to go with the WE610... i am sure i will be happy with it, but WHY WHY WHY !!??

rant over....

Originally posted by Villageman
Ixion

Re: 60" display. Sales guy at EPA GG says they will have the XBR 60" on display Friday PM or early Saturday. Hopefully right alongside the 70"



FYI, I went to GG in East Palo Alto Friday afternoon. They only had the 70" XBR950 on display. They said they're expecting 15 units of the 60" in stock this coming week, but they didn't have it yet.

Regarding reflection, it's HORRIBLE! The 70" is on display with the store's doors located far behind and the reflection was unbareable. Although the screen is not glass, it reflected as if it was glass, much more reflection than the WE series or the Sammy DLP's or Panny LCD's. What was Sony thinking!! I was ready to buy a 60" XBR, but I probably cannot live with this reflection since i have too many windows in my living room.

Originally posted by flmgrip

so WHY does sony make a high end TV with a glossy screen !!! i am bummed, but i have to go with the WE610... i am sure i will be happy with it, but WHY WHY WHY !!??

rant over....

I feel exactly the same way!! I was ready to buy the XBR, extra cost was no issue, but the "mirror" is horrible. I have a Sammy 56" DLP which i'm returning (for other reasons) and i'll probably get the 60" WE610.

Note that I still think this is a great TV... if you're setup is in a dark, light controlled room, you will be very happy with this TV. The blacks and colors and brightness were awesome. The set looks great asthetically. The remote is solid metal, one of the best built remotes I've ever seen.

Damn that mirror screen!!

Originally posted by ericlhyman
1. What other stands besides the Sony one are people considering for the 70" XBR?

2. Are other potential buyers concerned about not waiting for the SXRD RPTs that Sony is supposed to introduce in 2004?

Where can we find out more about the SXRD?

Quote:

Damn that mirror screen!!

Not only the damn mirror screen, but the damn one way firewire! Last night I saw on the HDNET broadcast from Cedia that RCA's new DLP sets--haven't seen them but have read lot of negatives about them elsewhere in the forum--have built-in ATSC tuners with two way firewire. And they sell a companion 9 hour HD "tivo" that connects to it for $500 list.

I love my Tivo, before they went HD, watching monday night football used to be so great. Because we get it so early on the left coast I am often not home in time for the start. With Tivo I could skim thru commercials, half time, etc and catch up by the end of the game. Now with HDTV broadcast so beautiful I just have to set thru all that junk. I really want to be able to "tivo" HD and I thought Sony was making it possible.

Of course I guess I can get a Sammy 165 and the RCA hardisk thing and a WE 60" for about the same price as the XBR. Maybe that is the route for me. But the 70" is such a beautiful beast. Oh well.

I can't find any local dealers that sell RCA. Whats with that?

Originally posted by roblake
I got a call from my dealer an hour ago. He said to expect my 60XBR950 soon, as the truck containing the 50XBRs had just arrived.

I didn't even know there WAS a 50" XBR, but he assures me. Will be able to see the 50XBR on the floor middle of next week.

"One Test is Worth a Thousand Expert Opinions"

Well, the ground truth is that the " 50" XBR" is a plasma set! Stunning, but to my untrained (but critical) eye, it was no better an image than the 50" GWIII sitting nearby. And $11K to boot! "Some customers want the thinness."

I wouldn't pay $11K for thinness, even for my own overweight body!

Originally posted by Villageman
Quote:


...

I can't find any local dealers that sell RCA. Whats with that?

The "RCA" Web site is actually via the Thomson Web site ... They have a dealer finder, which was Sears and some independent dealers, as I recall, around here. [ Upon rechecking, the only stores they identify are Radio Shack! No way! The Radio Shack salesman didn't even grok what I was trying to explain to him. ]


http://www.thomsonscenium.com/StoreLocatorLanding/0,6870,CNUS-LNUE,00.html?gID=3&gParent=3&gLevel=1

Originally posted by ixion
Where can we find out more about the SXRD?

Try http://www.dcviews.com/press/Sony_SXRD.htm

I hate to admit it, but I really don't expect to get more than 3-4 years use out of my new GWIII 60 XBR. But in the mean time, I'll be able to enjoy a really great TV until the price and reliability improve on these emerging technologies.

I looked at the reflections of both the XBR950 abd WE's and have concluded that the XBRs have only slightly more "glare". The TRUE difference is that the reflections of the XBR is more "clear" due to the "g;ass-like" texture of the screen as opposed to the "milky" texture of the WE610, which produces more of a blurry reflection. However, when a bright light source is in front of either set, the clarity of the XBR's reflection makes it more noticable.

Just got my 60xbr today at noon. The set looks great! Love the glass, as it complements the contemporary look in our house. The only problem I have is the extended toe kick. Try as I might, I just couldn't figure out how to push the kick in. I tried the 2 white buttons on the buttom, but something still seemed to be stuck. So now it sits with the toe kick stuck out. I could live with it, but would love it better with it in.

I'm not a videophile, so the picture looks about like my previous 36inch crt. My wife doesn't think the picture looks as nice as a plasma, but then again it's not as expensive either.

BTW, I have not been able to see any stuck pixels yet. I'll try again some time later.

I live in Houston, so go grab them while you can.

Now it's time to find some tuning disks. Anyone knows where to get DVE at a retail store in Houston? Seems like no one in town is selling them.

I'm waiting until summer of '04 for an HD DirecTivo, which will also be able to record OTA ATSC. That way, I'll be able to record one ATSC program while watching another ATSC program. I think I would find using the TV's built-in turner too restrictive.

Originally posted by Villageman
Quote:



Not only the damn mirror screen, but the damn one way firewire! Last night I saw on the HDNET broadcast from Cedia that RCA's new DLP sets--haven't seen them but have read lot of negatives about them elsewhere in the forum--have built-in ATSC tuners with two way firewire. And they sell a companion 9 hour HD "tivo" that connects to it for $500 list.

I love my Tivo, before they went HD, watching monday night football used to be so great. Because we get it so early on the left coast I am often not home in time for the start. With Tivo I could skim thru commercials, half time, etc and catch up by the end of the game. Now with HDTV broadcast so beautiful I just have to set thru all that junk. I really want to be able to "tivo" HD and I thought Sony was making it possible.

Of course I guess I can get a Sammy 165 and the RCA hardisk thing and a WE 60" for about the same price as the XBR. Maybe that is the route for me. But the 70" is such a beautiful beast. Oh well.

I can't find any local dealers that sell RCA. Whats with that?

Originally posted by ixion
...Damn that mirror screen!!...

makes me feel better that i am not alone with this :D , can't wait to get my we610...

.

You guys complaining about the screen on the new XBRs are just a bunch of cheap babies ...

I'll take the new "glossy" screen over the old ugly "dull" looking one any day of the week.



"Tag" man

How do the blacks on your 60" XBR compare to your 36" CRT? I don't think anyone who has the new XBR set at home has said much about the blacks.

Originally posted by bigscreentv
Just got my 60xbr today at noon. The set looks great! Love the glass, as it complements the contemporary look in our house...

I'm not a videophile, so the picture looks about like my previous 36inch crt. My wife doesn't think the picture looks as nice as a plasma, but then again it's not as expensive either...

.

I thought this was common knowledge but blacks on an LCD display are never as good as they are on CRT. At least not yet.


"Tag" man

I'm not ashamed to say that I'm not a videophile, so I checked my 36 crt and it frankly had worse blacks than my new tv. I'm sure if I properly calibrated the sets, things would be different, but I really can't tell much difference. The blacks looked plenty black, but not quite as black as the black borders. The wife thought the blacks looked just fine, but then again, we've never really tweaked any of our sets. The cinema black option didn't seem to do anything.

Guess it's a case of - you really don't know what you are missing untill you've experienced it.

Got the 70" setup 3 days ago. It's HUGE. Better than being there especially in HD.

The "glare" is not an issue even in a room with a glass wall and 24' ceilings the picture is simply stunning. Very bright and clear. Just pull down the shades and turn down the lights and enjoy. The built in sound system is a nice bonus that isn't discussed much here.

OTA HD is a snap with an indoor RCA antenna. I've been able to get most if not all LA HD channels with minor tweaking even in Santa Monica. KCET HD, PBS stands out so far. Never thought I would spend the first few days watching PBS HD programming with my 2 year old soon. Both of us have been mesmerized by the picture. Can't wait to see what the Victoria Secret show looks like next week. Nemo is not bad either. Turn off the progressive.

I spent two hours at UE today looking at this set. Funny thing, I've been looking at LCD's and DLP's for six months now and studying them on AVS forum for 3 months. I went in today, finally ready to buy the Hitachi 50V500. When I saw the 70" XBR set up in a viewing room, I sat down on the couch and fell in love.

I understand that some people won't buy this tv because the reflective screen won't work in their house, but I'm shocked that anyone would question why Sony used this screen. This is a magnificent television and the screen is one of its best features. I don't like the 'silk-screen' effect of the other LCD and DLP tvs. It serves as a constant reminder that I'm looking at an imperfect tv. The XBR is like a plasma. If the viewing environment is right, you can lose yourself in the picture and forget that its a tv.

I sat about 9 feet from the 70" screen and was simply in awe of the picture. I couldn't even make out the pixels from 4 feet away. And the picture quality was beautiful. The blacks did seem to have the same crush that the GWIII has, but I assume that can be tweaked out with proper calibration.

Finally, the tv's cabinetry is a work of art. Absolutely beautiful.

I put off buying a big screen tv week after week because I wasn't completely sold on any of the tv's I'd seen. After months of waiting for the perfect tv to come along, I can say that I am very very happy that I waited. Now I know why Sony decided to stick with LCD technology instead of following Samsung into DLP.

One last note... after viewing the 70" XBR, I laughed at how small the 50" tv's look. Unfortunately, I can't afford the sticker shock of the 70" model, but I expect to have the 60" in my basement before baby new year arrives. For those who have purchased this tv or are about to, I applaud you.

I am ready to pull the trigger on a 60XBR950, Can you guys let me know what you guys have been paying for them, or what prices you have seen. Thanks

Yes, yes, the picture is clear and bright, but we expected that. What about the blacks?

I too was mesmerized by the PBS HD feed for the one week I had the 50" GWIII, until it broke. My 60" XBR ships on 11/17.

You mentioned that Nemo looked better with progressive scan turned off. How so?

Originally posted by CJR
Got the 70" setup 3 days ago. It's HUGE. Better than being there especially in HD.

The "glare" is not an issue even in a room with a glass wall and 24' ceilings the picture is simply stunning. Very bright and clear. Just pull down the shades and turn down the lights and enjoy. The built in sound system is a nice bonus that isn't discussed much here.

OTA HD is a snap with an indoor RCA antenna. I've been able to get most if not all LA HD channels with minor tweaking even in Santa Monica. KCET HD, PBS stands out so far. Never thought I would spend the first few days watching PBS HD programming with my 2 year old soon. Both of us have been mesmerized by the picture. Can't wait to see what the Victoria Secret show looks like next week. Nemo is not bad either. Turn off the progressive.

I just came back from looking at the 70" XBR GWIII and I'm puzzled by what I saw.

I watched the opening scenes of "A Bug's Life" played on the $699 400 disk Sony DVD via component. The salesman wanted me to watch the "full" version but I wanted to see the 'wide" version. I've never seen this DVD look bad but it did with this setup. Closeups looked good but when the perspective moved back a bit the PQ was not very good.

I was sitting at least 10" from the screen.

I'm going back with my own disks to see what they look like. Any advise from 70" GWIII owners will be appreciated.

I'm waiting until summer of '04 for an HD DirecTivo, which will also be able to record OTA ATSC. That way, I'll be able to record one ATSC program while watching another ATSC program. I think I would find using the TV's built-in turner too restrictive.


Like you I am going to have to wait for that too and when available I will order my HD Tivo or Dish PRV or VOOM or anything else the day it hits the market. But in the interim I am going to find a way to record HD--either with D-VHS, the RCA thing, or via computer. I would prefer not to have so many different boxes to contend with. That is why I hoped the Sony would output the OTA via firewire. I am willing to part with a few hundred for that convenience until the Tivo or Dish HD PVR's.

Taquirre--(you crazy dude) I guess I am one of the complainers about the high gloss. I have a question. taguirre, how does hating reflective Plexiglas cover screens makes one cheap? I miss the connection there.
Another question for you, Taquirre, How long have you had your XBR? How do you avoid watching yourself watching your TV? My only time with the XBR was about an hour in a showroom and no matter what was on the screen as soon as there was a dark scene I could see me setting there on the sofa in front of the screen. Very distracting.
I guess from years of watching TV I have become spoiled. I like to be able to read in my TV environment. If I wanted to sit with drapes pulled in a dark room I would go for a front projector with a 10 foot screen. To each his own, but we ain't necessarily cheap.

htwaits, could you expand on what was wrong with "A Bugs Life"? There are dozens of reasons why a DVD might look bad, but I think it is unlikely it was the disk it self. Store showrooms are the best and worst places to evaluate TVs. They're the best place because you get to see and compare all the model at once. But they're the worst place because we all play around with the equipment and settings, HDTV feeds for D* and are usually poor, the room lighting is atrocious, equipment is defective, and on, and on. Not sure what store you were at, but you would probably have a better experience going to a Tweeter if you want to do a seriuos evaluation of picture quality on the showroom floor.

Originally posted by htwaits
I just came back from looking at the 70" XBR GWIII and I'm puzzled by what I saw.

I watched the opening scenes of "A Bug's Life" played on the $699 400 disk Sony DVD via component. The salesman wanted me to watch the "full" version but I wanted to see the 'wide" version. I've never seen this DVD look bad but it did with this setup. Closeups looked good but when the perspective moved back a bit the PQ was not very good.

I'm going back with my own disks to see what they look like. Any advise from 70" GWIII owners will be appreciated.

Originally posted by CJR
Got the 70" setup 3 days ago. It's HUGE. Better than being there especially in HD.

The "glare" is not an issue even in a room with a glass wall and 24' ceilings the picture is simply stunning. Very bright and clear. Just pull down the shades and turn down the lights and enjoy. The built in sound system is a nice bonus that isn't discussed much here.

OTA HD is a snap with an indoor RCA antenna. I've been able to get most if not all LA HD channels with minor tweaking even in Santa Monica. KCET HD, PBS stands out so far. Never thought I would spend the first few days watching PBS HD programming with my 2 year old soon. Both of us have been mesmerized by the picture. Can't wait to see what the Victoria Secret show looks like next week. Nemo is not bad either. Turn off the progressive.

why turn off the progressive?

Originally posted by probepro
htwaits, could you expand on what was wrong with "A Bugs Life"?

The image (medium length shots) seemed to have some kind of mottled look around the characters heads. With these digital cartoons the image is so simple that you get used to seeing a clean rendition at all times. It wasn't.

Faces and heads in close up were what I'm used to with this movie. The longer shots looked over enlarged and rough.
... they're the worst place because we all play around with the equipment and settings, HDTV feeds for D* and are usually poor, the room lighting is atrocious, equipment is defective, and on, and on.

All true but probably not the case here. It was a "good" DVD, and a reasonable DVD player. The lighting was good because it was an overcast day. I was in a GG store that is one of their best. The 70" XBR is at the back of the store in a special viewing area with a living room type setup. When I was there Thursday the set was unwatchable because of reflection from the sun filled front doors. Today was overcast so there was little glare and I was able to see what was on the screen without being distracted.

Not sure what store you were at, but you would probably have a better experience going to a Tweeter if you want to evaluate a TV on the showroom floor before buying it.
Be glad to. Send airline tickets and money for a hotel. ;)

When I go back with my own disks I will make sure the set has reasonable options set and that it is either after sundown or an overcast day. I will also take material that I have seen on at least a 56" screen.

I think that I've never seen "A Bug's Life" on anything bigger that 50". It may not be able to stand up to a 70" screen. If any owner of a GWIII XBR has "A Bug's Life" I would like to hear what you think about it.

htwaits, you may want to try your DVD disk with both 480i and 480p. CJR recommended turning off progressive scan for Nemo, but didn't elaborate. For the short time that I had a 50" GWIII (it died after a week), I noticed that 480p looked blurry compared to 480i using a ATSC OTA turner. I didn't have access to a progressive scan DVD player at the time, but it might have had the same problem as the tuner. This issue with 480p is puzzling.

Originally posted by htwaits

When I go back with my own disks I will make sure the set has reasonable options set and that it is either after sundown or an overcast day. I will also take material that I have seen on at least a 56" screen.

I think that I've never seen "A Bug's Life" on anything bigger that 50". It may not be able to stand up to a 70" screen. If any owner of a GWIII XBR has "A Bug's Life" I would like to hear what you think about it.

For those of you that already have the new XBR, can you save picture settings (brightness, color, hue, etc.) for each input? This wasn't possible with the 50" GWIII, and the manual did a poor job of explaining it. The 50" GWIII remember the last picture mode (Vivid, Standard, Pro) for each input, but Vivid was the same for all inputs, as were Standard and Pro. If you change the settings for any of these 3 modes, you change it for all inputs. If found this to be less than ideal, and would have much preferred to save different settings for D*, S-VHS, ASTC OTA, DVD, etc. The 3 picture modes feature is fine, but I need to tailer each of them for each input.

Originally posted by probepro
htwaits, you may want to try your DVD disk with both 480i and 480p. CJR recommended turning off progressive scan for Nemo, but didn't elaborate. For the short time that I had a 50" GWIII (it died after a week), I noticed that 480p looked blurry compared to 480i using a ATSC OTA turner. I didn't have access to a progressive scan DVD player at the time, but it might have had the same problem as the tuner. This issue with 480p is puzzling.
I will definitely try it both ways. I assume they had their DVD player in progressive mode.

HT

If there is any way to view this set in a darker environment, see how well it handles black and near blacks in movies with darker scenes. This is my only complaint about the GWIII. The blacks don't go dark enough for me. I don't see how the XBR could have overcome this. It would seem that the darker screen would be a step in the right direction, but then the bulb is burning brighter, which would then seem to offset the darker screen benefit.

Thanks,

Jim

JimP,

My feelings exactly. My complaint about the 50" GWIII was also the blacks. They weren't real bad, but sometimes were distracting when watching dark scenes with the lights turned down. I prefer watching TV with the lights turned down, but the 50" WGIII's picture actually looks better with the lights turned up more than I'm use to. I had the 50" for a week before it died. CC is picking it up tomorrow (11/17), and replacing it with a GWIII 60" XBR, so I will be able to report on the blacks tomorrow.

From what I saw in the showroom, the XBR's blacks looked better than the 50" GWIII they also had on display, so I'm optimistic.


Originally posted by JimP
HT

If there is any way to view this set in a darker environment, see how well it handles black and near blacks in movies with darker scenes. This is my only complaint about the GWIII. The blacks don't go dark enough for me. I don't see how the XBR could have overcome this. It would seem that the darker screen would be a step in the right direction, but then the bulb is burning brighter, which would then seem to offset the darker screen benefit.

Thanks,

Jim

Originally posted by taguirre
.

You guys complaining about the screen on the new XBRs are just a bunch of cheap babies ...

I'll take the new "glossy" screen over the old ugly "dull" looking one any day of the week.



"Tag" man

i have seen a 60" WE in person but not a XBR... i guess here In Los Angeles we are the last ones to see new products... i canceled my XBR order and went ahead with the WE. for more than one reason.

i stood about 6-7' away from the 60"WE and the picture was perfect, no problems with seeing pixels, no reflection, nothing.
the sales person also made me stand in front of a GWIIXBR and told "look no reflection and there is even a light shining on it...." nice trick, put if i point a light from above on a mirror i would need to lay on the ground to see it... but with a window behind me it's a different story... and i am quite certain the the XBR screen on the GWIII series is not much different than on the GWII...
so... reflections for one. it's just a deal breaker.... i do not want to worry about sitting always in the dark to enjoy my tv. turn it on and watch it... if you got a movie room in the basement... knock yourself out.
... i also just think that the pic quality will not be that much better to justify the 1.1K difference... they both have the same technology and they both have a great picture... the black won't be making a big difference...
i also feel that i will be paying for an HD tuner i do not need... it will come with my direcTV HD receiver...
the design? i could not care less what anyone else thinks. if this TV looks to someone like a 1K TV, that's all good... as long as i am happy with the pic quality :)

for me i'd rather spend 1.1K less now and buy an other new TV in three or fours years, when the technology has improved again...

the money i saved on the tv i will be using to improve my input sources, HD direct TV and a better DVD player (but that is an whole other story, reading up on DVD players you get the impression that you should just keep on using your 5yr old player... it's seems like nothing than issues with the samsung or bravo...)

speaking of saving money :) i spend $79 on the stand for this TV and i love it.... it'll match the rest of my living room perfectly... plus it'll match the "cheap look" of my WE anyway :D

Hi all,

I'm going to purchase the 60" XBR950 soon, but I'm concerned by the return policies out there regarding dead pixels. I went to a local family-owned store here in Phoenix, and they said that once the TV is out of their store, I would have to deal with Sony directly. (What the...?) Are there stores that will replace the TV due to dead pixels at the store level instead of the Sony level? How does Circuit City rate for price and returns?

Also, has anyone connected an OTA antenna to the unit's HD tuner? If so, what OTA antenna do you recommend? I would need one that can be mounted indoors, like the Terk TV55. Any comments on that model or equivalent models?

My brain is absorbing a lot of HD information, but you folks are the experts and I would appreciate any input. :)

Thanks!

Originally posted by JimP
HT

If there is any way to view this set in a darker environment, see how well it handles black and near blacks in movies with darker scenes. This is my only complaint about the GWIII. The blacks don't go dark enough for me. I don't see how the XBR could have overcome this. It would seem that the darker screen would be a step in the right direction, but then the bulb is burning brighter, which would then seem to offset the darker screen benefit.

Thanks,

Jim
We have Magnolia stores in our area. One of them has a fairly dark room for RPTV sets. When they get a XBR I'll try it there. They don't seem to be able to turn their lights off but most of the locations in that room are pretty good for a showroom.

My wife and I checked out the 70" XBR last night at CC in Woodland Hills, CA. An HD loop was playing. This set has a great picture. The contrast on this thing is excellent and I could not notice a significant difference with the various Samsung DLP's all about. For what it's worth (since all these are out of the box anyway), we went to two stores and the Panasonic LCD RPT's looked washed out by comparison at both places. Also, she considers the cabinet so attractive that it need not be hidden behind a panel or wall. So, we would like to move forward.

Can someone PM me on what it the best way to proceed in buying one of these in the Palo Alto Bay Area now that the decision is made? Thanks.

I've had my 70" XBR950 for a couple of weeks now, and I am still amazed by the quality of the picture. The one impressive part is the ability of the TV to upcovert 480i content. TiVo, video games, DVD, regular TV all look great. The thing that looks poor on the TV is some of the regular resolution content that is upcoverted by the TV stations to broadcast on their digital channels. If the content isn't high definition, I get a much better picture watching the analog feeds from these stations. Either the TV stations are not using the best equipment for doing their conversions, or more likely the circuitry in the XBR is tuned to its display which is why it does such an outstanding job. If you are using a progessive DVD, I would recommend turning off its conversion and send the 480i picture to the XBR and let the XBR's circuitry do the conversion for you.

Someone also mentioned the sound. They are right, it is exceptional, it is just that you spend your time looking at the beautiful picture and don't notice how great the sound is.

Originally posted by Mysterio
Also, has anyone connected an OTA antenna to the unit's HD tuner? If so, what OTA antenna do you recommend? I would need one that can be mounted indoors, like the Terk TV55. Any comments on that model or equivalent models?

I am using the Zenith Silver Sensor (I am in Los Angeles) indoors and it is doing a good job of picking up all of the digital sations for me. It worked best for me when I mounted it vertical rather than horizontal. I bought this rather than the Terk because it seemed to receive better reviews.

flmgrp - assuming that the reflective screen of the GWII XBR and the GWIII XBR is your perogative, but, I have both and the GW3 is nowhere near as reflective as the GW2XBR. I don't know if going with the plexiglass screen for the GW3XBR is part of the "finer pitch" screen enhancement, but I feel that it's slightly more reflective appearance is worth it for the "look" of the set. I find that the floating screen design in a darkened rooms, is an ounce more "cinematic" than the non XBR.
However, if glare is one of the top criteria for you, then you should be happy with the 60" GW3. I think the PQ is very close between the GW3 XBR and non-XBR models, but the XBR definitely drew more people
Elbert

Originally posted by Villageman

Taquirre--(you crazy dude) I guess I am one of the complainers about the high gloss. I have a question. taguirre, how does hating reflective Plexiglas cover screens makes one cheap? I miss the connection there.
Another question for you, Taquirre, How long have you had your XBR? How do you avoid watching yourself watching your TV? My only time with the XBR was about an hour in a showroom and no matter what was on the screen as soon as there was a dark scene I could see me setting there on the sofa in front of the screen. Very distracting.
I guess from years of watching TV I have become spoiled. I like to be able to read in my TV environment. If I wanted to sit with drapes pulled in a dark room I would go for a front projector with a 10 foot screen. To each his own, but we ain't necessarily cheap.

I've had my XBR70 since 10/31 and while I don't see any reflections, I can see how some people may have issues given this is a rear projection set and thus has a large mirror behind the screen. Any direct light will certainly wash out the picture on any RP set. But if your room is designed with ceiling can lighting there just isn't any problem. If you can't control the direct light on the screen then you probably need to get some other technology. Don't take the experience you get in a store - I would think that your lighting at home would be much different. That's why many of the 'up scale' stores build 'rooms' to simulate your home environment.
best,
jg

Which stand did you buy for the XBR? How did you mount the center channel speaker? I am in the Detroit area and I am also thinking of using the indoor antenna.....did you mount the antenna in the roof or just in the house in one corner.....just curious?

Thanks


Originally posted by tburrows
I am using the Zenith Silver Sensor (I am in Los Angeles) indoors and it is doing a good job of picking up all of the digital sations for me. It worked best for me when I mounted it vertical rather than horizontal. I bought this rather than the Terk because it seemed to receive better reviews.

Originally posted by mevscreen
I am ready to pull the trigger on a 60XBR950, Can you guys let me know what you guys have been paying for them, or what prices you have seen. Thanks

Good Guys is having a 4-day 10% off everything sale right now. They are also one of the only retailers that has the 60" in stock.

Originally posted by mgoblue
why turn off the progressive?

It depends on your DVD player's ability to do 480p. I have the Panny CP-72 (cousin of the famous Panny RP-82) with the Faroudja chip and I find that 480p looks way better than 480i on both the XBR950 and Sammy DLP.

I have both the Sammy DLP and Sony XBR950 in my living room....

As you may have seen my prevous posts, I was very disappointed with the reflection of the Sony XBR screen. So I figured, the best way to really tell is to bring one home! I drove by GG on Saturday and by luck, they had just received a single 60" XBR950. It was in the box in the back, they didn't even have time to put it on display. I bought it right there on the spot.

So now I have both the 56" Sammy DLP and 60" Sony XBR950 side-by-side in my living room. See attached picture. I have the best wife in the world... not only did she let me bring both sets home, she let me temporarily set it up on our dinning room table!

I will do some more side-by-side comparisons and i'll post detailed results. I also received the HD300 and i'm having D* installed this week. I want to wait for this to be up before making any decision on the TVs.

Here's a picture of the 60" XBR950 in a bright room in mid-afternoon. You can see how the reflection is a big problem.

Here's a picture of the 56" Sammy DLP in the same room (sorry, video was not connected). You can see that it's much less reflective than the XBR950 in my previous post.

Dear Ixion,

Can you please post a picture of the Samsung with the windows shining directly in the middle of the image just as you did for the Sony.

You basically put the worst possible image you could get of the Sony, but on the Sammy the windows are not reflecting directly in the middle.

I think they will both look pretty bad with the window reflecting directly in the middle.


"Tag" man

My 60XBR950 will be arriving sometime next week and I'm still scrambling to find a stand (I don't want the SUGW3 because it doesn't have enough room for all my components). My question is do I need to have the toe kick fully extended if setting it on a stand? I've found a stand that's 21 5/8" in depth, but with the schematics I've seen, the 60XBR950 with the toe kick fully extended has a base depth of 23". Is it safe to push it in 1 3/8" so it will be flush with the stand?

What is the base size of the 60" and 70" XBR's?

This freakin TV's manual (page 18) states it's a 4 PERSON LIFT! What's up with that? Anyone with a TV care to comment on how fragile or heavy it is, and if it really took 4 people to move?

Originally posted by kirk_alexander
This freakin TV's manual (page 18) states it's a 4 PERSON LIFT! What's up with that? Anyone with a TV care to comment on how fragile or heavy it is, and if it really took 4 people to move?

It is a bit awkward at 4' x 6' and a couple of hundred pounds. My 70" was delivered by two average guys - they rolled it to my door on a dolly, unboxed it outside and the two of them carried it in by hand (no straps).

The important part of the instructions is to make sure they don't grab the bottom of the screen and make it a 'handhold'.

Also, since mine was the first set they had ever seen, they didn't know about the built in handholds and may have grabbed the screen --- but I was there and showed them the page from the manual and pointed out the handholds. Suggest you do the same....

I had my 70XBR950 delivered to my 4th floor media room 2 wks ago. Two guys carried it up a fairly tight stairwell (I live in a townhome). in my situation it would have been impossible for 4 people to carry it.

In terms of the glare, it has not been an issue for me. My room has a 3 pain sliding door to the left of the television and two small windows in front of the set. The room is still being completed, so there are now shades on any of the windows. I also have a 43" Sammy DLP (different room, about the same amount of light). I would say the 70" is slightly more reflective than my DLP; however it is not a problem. It probably would be if the sliding foors were directly in front of the television. I agree with another poster. If your application calls for a television being placed right infront of an unshaded window, there probably aren't very many sets that will look good? In my application (a bright room with a roof deck , where I plan to be able to watch, not critically, games from) the reflection is not an issue, but everyone should think carefully about there application an pic the set that meets there needs best.

I think the picture is stunning by the way!

I just purchased my 60XBR950 today from CC. I have not decided on a stand yet. I was thinking about putting it on the Sony SUGW1, its 58" wide, 15 3/4" high and 21 1/2" deep. It has plenty of room for components. I am going to take a tape to the store to make sure it will fit the base. The info on the Sony site is not correct. It states that the 60XBR950 is 67" wide when it is only 63" wide. Would love to know what the rest of you have been putting yours on.

Originally posted by mevscreen
I just purchased my 60XBR950 today from CC. I have not decided on a stand yet. I was thinking about putting it on the Sony SUGW1, its 58" wide, 15 3/4" high and 21 1/2" deep. It has plenty of room for components. I am going to take a tape to the store to make sure it will fit the base. The info on the Sony site is not correct. It states that the 60XBR950 is 67" wide when it is only 63" wide. Would love to know what the rest of you have been putting yours on.

I don't have my TV yet, but this (http://www.bello.com/AV/images/AVSC2050MClarge.jpg) is the stand I purchased for my 60XBR. It compliments the decor in our family room fairly well.

BTW, did you see my PM mevscreen?

Did they have problems carrying up the steps? I am buying the 70" and it is going to be difficult to take it to the basement from inside the house. I tried to measure the door openeing and the my stairs are at an angle in the middle of the staircase. Are their handles on the side for carrying the TV? SIlly question....is it possible to take it vertically down the stairs?
DId you decide on the stand? DVD Player?
Thanks


Originally posted by FEW
I had my 70XBR950 delivered to my 4th floor media room 2 wks ago. Two guys carried it up a fairly tight stairwell (I live in a townhome). in my situation it would have been impossible for 4 people to carry it.

In terms of the glare, it has not been an issue for me. My room has a 3 pain sliding door to the left of the television and two small windows in front of the set. The room is still being completed, so there are now shades on any of the windows. I also have a 43" Sammy DLP (different room, about the same amount of light). I would say the 70" is slightly more reflective than my DLP; however it is not a problem. It probably would be if the sliding foors were directly in front of the television. I agree with another poster. If your application calls for a television being placed right infront of an unshaded window, there probably aren't very many sets that will look good? In my application (a bright room with a roof deck , where I plan to be able to watch, not critically, games from) the reflection is not an issue, but everyone should think carefully about there application an pic the set that meets there needs best.

I think the picture is stunning by the way!

I wouldn't call them handles, but there are indentations in the molding designed for someone to carry the television. They put it vertical to get throught a door with a tight turn afterward. I certainly would not have wanted to carry the television, but these guys didn't seem to have a problem.

I am buliding a custom wall unit (I like everything hidden away). Which will give the television the appearance of hanging on the wall. I have the sony 300 mega changer for DVD distribution to three televisions. I will consider a high-end DVI DVD player once there are more options (I've heard mixed reviews about the Bravo and Samsung).

Good luck!

Originally posted by taguirre
Dear Ixion,

Can you please post a picture of the Samsung with the windows shining directly in the middle of the image just as you did for the Sony.

You basically put the worst possible image you could get of the Sony, but on the Sammy the windows are not reflecting directly in the middle.

I think they will both look pretty bad with the window reflecting directly in the middle.


"Tag" man

I didn't mean to put down the Sony, I'm actually favoring it over the Sammy. But the Sammy definitely has MUCH LESS reflection. The Sony is horrible with reflection. I'm still leaning on keeping the Sony because it's brighter and doesn't have a "silk screen" effect over the image. Plus I do most of my viewing at night.

I'm getting D* with HD300 installed tomorrow. I'll post a full comparison of the two sets once i've had more viewing time.

Not wanting to commit to a TV stand until the 60XBR950 arrives, I was eagerly awaiting information on the actual size of the base of this unit. CC now has one on the floor and I got the following:

Width of base: 31.5"
Depth of base from front of extended psedopod to rear of base: 20.5"
Height of lower edge of screen above stand: 5.5"
Thickness of polycarbonate screen: 5/32"

All measurements are approximate. The 20.5" depth opens up a whole new realm of stand/table possibilities.

I had my 70XBR950 delivered to my 4th floor media room 2 wks ago. Two guys carried it up a fairly tight stairwell (I live in a townhome). in my situation it would have been impossible for 4 people to carry it.

In terms of the glare, it has not been an issue for me. My room has a 3 pain sliding door to the left of the television and two small windows in front of the set. The room is still being completed, so there are now shades on any of the windows. I also have a 43" Sammy DLP (different room, about the same amount of light). I would say the 70" is slightly more reflective than my DLP; however it is not a problem. It probably would be if the sliding foors were directly in front of the television. I agree with another poster. If your application calls for a television being placed right infront of an unshaded window, there probably aren't very many sets that will look good? In my application (a bright room with a roof deck , where I plan to be able to watch, not critically, games from) the reflection is not an issue, but everyone should think carefully about there application an pic the set that meets there needs best.

I think the picture is stunning by the way!

Updating after about 1 week of use:

Picture - very BIG
- Analog cable (Adelphia) - acceptable
- Digital cable (Adelphia) - very good
-- QAM tuner does work with Adelphia digital in LA. Still trying to figure out Adelphia's channel numbering system. If anyone has any suggestions please let me know as I hate using cable boxes.
- OTA HD (RCA 1250 antenna) - Stunning
- DVD - Stunning
-- I prefer not using progressive. The unit manages the picture nicely without any help

"Mirror Effect" - The "glare"/"mirror effect" is noticeable when the unit is off during the day or when bright lights are on. When the unit is on, it is usually barely noticeable unless you ignore the picture, have OCD, and really want to see it. Dark scenes seem to bring on the effect. Bright scenes eliminate the effect. During bright scenes even a flashlight won't bring on the effect. With such a large picture it really isn't an issue unless you want it to be.

Not about to send it back. Even the wife finds the size acceptable now.

What's OCD?

Obcessive-Compulsive Disorder

Thanks, I knew that. ;)

I just ordered my 70" today and should be delivered next wed(before thanksgiving day). I didn't order the sony stand instead I went to generic stand and I think it is much better than the Sony. Looking for a decent DVD player that will go with this unit for now temporarily till Sony comes up with the new DVI output ones later thsi year. I dont mind buying something decent because I could use it in the bedroom later once I buy the one with DVI output.

Any suggestions?

Originally posted by CJR
Updating after about 1 week of use:

Picture - very BIG
- Analog cable (Adelphia) - acceptable
- Digital cable (Adelphia) - very good
-- QAM tuner does work with Adelphia digital in LA. Still trying to figure out Adelphia's channel numbering system. If anyone has any suggestions please let me know as I hate using cable boxes.
- OTA HD (RCA 1250 antenna) - Stunning
- DVD - Stunning
-- I prefer not using progressive. The unit manages the picture nicely without any help

"Mirror Effect" - The "glare"/"mirror effect" is noticeable when the unit is off during the day or when bright lights are on. When the unit is on, it is usually barely noticeable unless you ignore the picture, have OCD, and really want to see it. Dark scenes seem to bring on the effect. Bright scenes eliminate the effect. During bright scenes even a flashlight won't bring on the effect. With such a large picture it really isn't an issue unless you want it to be.

Not about to send it back. Even the wife finds the size acceptable now.

I didn't think this set had a QAM tuner.:confused:

I guess if you don't have a progressive dvd player, you should use the 3/2 pull down mode when you watch dvd's? Or should I go with High Density?

Originally posted by madipac
I just ordered my 70" today and should be delivered next wed(before thanksgiving day). I didn't order the sony stand instead I went to generic stand and I think it is much better than the Sony. Looking for a decent DVD player that will go with this unit for now temporarily till Sony comes up with the new DVI output ones later thsi year. I dont mind buying something decent because I could use it in the bedroom later once I buy the one with DVI output.

Any suggestions?

get the bravo D1 - it's cheap and has a DVI connection. Great way to find out what straight digital looks like on the XBR. www.vinc.com

Originally posted by Gruber
get the bravo D1 - it's cheap and has a DVI connection. Great way to find out what straight digital looks like on the XBR. www.vinc.com
The Bravo may not be a good choice if you want to use it through it's component output.

Check here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=259532&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

I bought the 70XBR950 at Ultimate Electronics on Friday. The salesman said that I was the first one to get one in Minneapolis. They delivered it Sunday morning. I wanted to buy the 60" last year but my wife wouldn't let me because she wanted a bigger set! (Great Wife) We both love this set and I'm glad I waited. I also got the SUGW3 stand, which I had to assemble. It was easy for two people to lift the set and lock it into the stand. Also, two delivery men carried it in, so no need for 4 people to move it. This is an awesome TV. Very stylish as the TV connects to the stand and it looks like one unit. There is 8" of space above the lower shelf so I will be able to get a decent sized center channel speaker and an HDTivo on there when it comes out. I was using an old JBL 100 speaker as my center channel before, great sound, but too big now. I connected my attic antenna and all the local analog and digital stations come in perfectly. The picture is bright, clear and sharp. Even the picture from my DirecTivo looks great on the Directv feed of the network stations. However, some Directv channels with high compression, like TV land, look poor.

I also have a Sony SAT-HD200 Receiver connected to the TV using component input and routed through my A/V Receiver. I can't see a difference between local OTA HD broadcasts whether they are coming from the internal tuner in the TV or the external HD200.

Does anyone know the native resolution of the Sony TV? The Sony Sat HD200 can have it's output locked on 1080i or 720p and convert from what the source is, or it will output 1080i or 720p as received. When I switch from CBS to ABC there is an extra moment as the format changes from 1080i to 720P. If I lock the receiver to one format, then the channel changes go a little quicker. Can anyone here give a recommendation as to how to set the output of the HD200? Should I lock it on 1080i, or 720p or let it switch based on the signal source?

Thanks to Hubbard Broadcasting, which owns the local ABC affiliate AND an independent station as well, we get an over the air version of HDNET. It is not the same as the version on Directv so I have an extra over the air HD station that has HD content 24/7. All the local TV stations in Minneapolis have their digital transmitters operating. I get 10 digital channels.

Don't be afraid to negotiate price on this set. There is about two grand of profit margin on the set alone. I got it for a few hundred over cost but I also bought the 5 year extended warranty.

Again, great picture, wonderful sound, beautiful styling.

1366 x 768.

CJR - I can't find anything in the XBR950 manual that goes over the QAM tuner. II was wondering if you can tell me if it just integrates with the analog tuner in the set and if POP (picture out of picture) still works on it.
Also - did your digital cable provider indicated that there might be scrambled digital channels that the clear qam tuner in the XBR950 cannot display?
Thanks!
Elbert

I have been planning a big screen for over 2 years. At first I planned for a Front projector, but after a while decided I wanted an instant on experience and to watch in daylight.

I had a Samsung DLP on order for ever and it never came. So I cancelled my order after 5 months and waited some more. After seeing the Samsungs I was glad I didn't get it. I didn't like the candy colored and edgy pic very much. Finally saw the last gen of the Sony's and decided RPTV was ready.

Waited for the new generation. I didn't like look of the WIIIs, the combination of the matte screen and LCDs inherent black level problems didn't work for me. Frankly I think the matte screens are a faux pas in the WIIIs that won't go well for Sony, as it really shows the black level problems.

I bought the 60" today because it was in stock and I knew if I didn't jump the holiday season would make these hard to get for the foreseeable future.

I got to see it next to the XBR 50" plasma. They do have a similar picture. In the store the Plasma a bit more contrast in the midtones. The black levels of the LCD were about 15% less subjectively than the plasma, which wasn't bad at all. It's not perfect, but I would say that subjectively the black levels look about 50% better than the last generation XBR and 25% better than the new WIIIs.

The best part of the picture in the showroom was the overall contrast was phenomenal. They have compensated for the black level by having tremendous brightness in the whites, yet there was texure and detail there. I haven't seen this performance in any other RPTV that I can think of. This will probably lend the TV to being viewed in a brighter environment, minimizing the black problems significantly.

The QAM Tuner is there and works.

My test was the following:
1. Started off with 3 days of analog cable service (Adelphia in LA)
- Auto Setup = Channel/Auto Program

-- Received analog channels 2-99 (SHOW, TMC, HBO were unscrambled/MAX was scrambled - Thanks Adelphia)
-- No digital channels were found

2. Upgraded to Adelphia digital cable three days later (wanted to see if digital provides a better picture, it does)
- Initially used Adelphia's Motorolla box
- Had to keep the XBR on Channel 3
-- Box worked fine but limits the XBR's split screen and favorite channel capabilities

- Directly plugged "Digital" CATV into "cable" input of the XBR
-- Received the old "analog" channels
-- Added digital channels = Channel/Digital Channels/Add
-- 30 minutes later the XBR had added 15 "digital channels"
-- These digital channels included about 40+ sub channels where I found some of the Adelphia digital lineup
---- Channels 145-152 (MTV and VH1 extensions), 181-185 (B-Mania, Chronicle, etc.), 501-502 (ESPN pay per view), 762 (CCTV-Intl Premium), 766 (ZEETV-Intl Premium)
-- Still trying to find the other digital channels because I don't understand Adelphia's digital numbering scheme (I don't think Adelphia is going to be real helpful for some reason)

I have found no documentation anywhere on the QAM tuner capabilities.

I'm going to try the "cable box and cable only" setup next...

Well I saw a post a few replies up that addresses this issue and I like what I've read. Anyone else have any opinions on this set (60" in my case) in a bright, multi-window room? I currently am on my 2nd Hitachi 50v500 which has a great picture, but I've been plagued by both crop circles and "smudges" (see the Hitachi thread if you want more info on that)--anyway, it makes me concerned about the "robustness" of the Hitachi. Placing a service call every 2-3 months is not acceptable. However, the Hitachi, like I said, had a great picture and virtually no glare which made it perfect for my room. If I can get my "glare" fears addressed, I may replace the Hitachi with the Sony. Thoughts are welcomed...

Doug

I saw the XBR at a Circuit City today. They had it hooked up to a crappy source, but I did like the screen. Yes, it has more glare than the GWIII non-XBR models. But the screen hides the "screen door" effect more and makes it hard to see the pixels. Since I'm considering the 60" TV for a small apartment, I want to be able to sit close and not see any screen door effect.

I looked at a 70XBR950 in a Tweeter showroom yesterday and noticed that the glare is most prominent at an angle. Another set and a light were positioned directly in front of the set, and a picture with a bright light on it was positioned on the wall to the right. From directly in front of the set there was no indication of glare/reflection from the set or light directly behind me. It was well diffused by the screen. However, when moving to an angle to the left of the set the lighted picture on the right was was plainly reflected.

I will note that the one picture I have seen posted on the forum showing the "mirror" reflection was taken from a fairly wide angle to one side of the set, not from dead-on center.

So, what does this mean? I believe the anti-reflective screen is optomized to minimize reflections and glare within a tighter viewing angle in the front than the sets stated 160 degree total viewing angle. This should therefore not be such a big problem unless you plan to do most of your viewing at a hard angle to the side.

Just an observation. It will work for me I think.

Light reflection is like a billiard game. Angle of incendent equals angle of reflection. In other words, if light was a ping pong ball coming in at any angle, the way it would bounce off the screen would be the same angle that you would see glare.

So you are saying it is not possible that the anti-reflective screen is optimized for forward viewing? If what you say is true then I should have seen a clear reflection of the set and light behind me in the screen. I saw only a vague reflection rather than the stark one seen from an angle.

I think we all know there are things that can affect the dispersion of light, so your simple explanation doesn't necessarily hold up.

The incident angle and the reflected angle are equal for a plane surface. If you have a grooved surface, as does the XBR screen, all bets are off ... see: "Diffraction Grating".

(There is a very large such grating on top of the Crawford Building at Case at East Blvd. and Euclid Ave. in Cleveland. On the rare sunny day in Cleveland, you can see the color change with the angle at which you look at it.)

Originally posted by BTDT
So you are saying it is not possible that the anti-reflective screen is optimized for forward viewing? If what you say is true then I should have seen a clear reflection of the set and light behind me in the screen. ..

i tested the XBR in exactly that situation and i clearly saw the reflection behind me... it is proofen by now that reflection and glare is very objective and every one is seeing it differently... for some it is ok, for some it isn't... for me it just wasn't worth while extra cash and minimal improvement in picture quality... considering especially that i can't or don't wont to darken my room every time i watch TV...

Has anyone attempted to connect the 70" 950 to a HTPC via DVI or iLink yet? If so, what video card are you using? What resolutions, any over or underscan? What adjustments in timing?

Thanks, any help will be greatly appreciated.

Gordon
Minneapolis, Mn

Originally posted by roblake
The incident angle and the reflected angle are equal for a plane surface. If you have a grooved surface, as does the XBR screen, all bets are off ... see: "Diffraction Grating".

(There is a very large such grating on top of the Crawford Building at Case at East Blvd. and Euclid Ave. in Cleveland. On the rare sunny day in Cleveland, you can see the color change with the angle at which you look at it.)

The XBR screen does not act as a gradient. If it did, the reflections would change color (as you described) as you move from left to right (or up and down depending on the direction of the grooves). From what I have seen, they do not change color, implying the screen is not acting as a gradient.

Originally posted by GW888
Has anyone attempted to connect the 70" 950 to a HTPC via DVI or iLink yet? If so, what video card are you using? What resolutions, any over or underscan? What adjustments in timing?

Thanks, any help will be greatly appreciated.

Gordon
Minneapolis, Mn

I have an ATI Radeon 9800 on order - spec sheet says it is DVI / HDCP compliant

Can anyone tell me if the Ikea Oppli stand will work with the 60" 950XBR?

I hope, I hope, I hope...

Well I bit today and now have a 60XBR950 on order after taking my Gamecube in to CC and verifying that there is only very minimal motion smear on their 70XBR950 - no motion smear could be detected in F-Zero and only an extremely minimal amount of it (non-distracting) could be found in Metroid Prime. :) Even better, they found one in-stock in the Johnstown, PA CC so I already have a delivery date of next Wednesday set up. It should be quite the happy Thanksgiving here, lol. :D

Originally posted by ArchieGates
Can anyone tell me if the Ikea Oppli stand will work with the 60" 950XBR?

I hope, I hope, I hope...
If everything you put on it doesn't exceed ~150 lbs it should work. It's 19.5" deep. How deep is the 60" XBR base?

It's 23" deep and 177 pounds in weight. Do you think that's too much for the Oppli?

Add me to the list of XBR950 owners. I purchased the 60" model from Good Guys today. I have been reading about HDTV's for 2 years now, and I believe with the XBR950 I have finally found the model that gets most everything right. I finally came to the conclusion that there's no such thing as a perfect HDTV. But, as my interest in the TV is primarily for Xbox gaming, I think it makes the best choice.

I had been sold on DLP technology for a while, but the way the Samsung sets handle the component inputs (having separate inputs for 480 and 720/1080) makes using an Xbox a real pain with that set. I also feel comfortable with the Sony's since they're on their 3rd generation RP LCD and these XBR models look fantastic.

The picture quality of the XBR looked awesome in the store. The only TV's that looked better to me were the top of the line Mits RPTV's (I could tell they had deeper black levels) but I have a small apartment and the burn-in thing was an issue for my Xbox.

The best thing was that I bought the set today on Thursday, and it's going to be delivered on Saturday. My only problem now is that it seems that the Oppli stand from Ikea isn't deep enough by 3 1/2 inches and the TV set exceeds the max weight of the stand by 22 points (177 vs 155). I need to find another affordable stand to fit the TV, because I'm definitely not going to pay those Sony prices.

My other dillemma is that Good Guys had a sale where I can get a Hughes Direct TV HD receiver and dish installed for $199 when I bought my TV. Should I have gone for this deal? I really want the HDirectTivo when it comes out, but I don't know when that will be.

Any advice as to whether I should wait for the HD DirectTivo? By the way, I can't get any over-the-air HD content because there is a big mountain blocking my view of the transmitter, even though I'm probably 15 minutes from it.

Originally posted by ArchieGates
It's 23" deep and 177 pounds in weight. Do you think that's too much for the Oppli?
Add the components and the overhang and I would feel like I was doing a "failure" study. It might work but not with my new TV -- if I had a new TV.

The stand seemed strong with under 150lbs on it. I'm not sure reinforcing it would work. I've done that in the past with another stand.

Originally posted by htwaits
Add the components and the overhang and I would feel like I was doing a "failure" study. It might work but not with my new TV -- if I had a new TV.

The stand seemed strong with under 150lbs on it. I'm not sure reinforcing it would work. I've done that in the past with another stand.

Good call. I have an Ikea table in my kitchen and it's very cheap. I shouldn't be taking chances.

I have a coffee table that I'll use temporarily. It's solid and about the right size. If anyone finds a good stand for the 60", please post some info. I want one that's low to the ground, because I don't really want to be looking up at the TV.

Originally posted by ArchieGates
It's 23" deep and 177 pounds in weight. Do you think that's too much for the Oppli?

you can put an elephant on that stand... i believe the only reason they limit it to 150lb is the caster wheels... take em off and set it on the ground and you have a real solid stand... plus it's the perfect hight without the wheels... go for it :) $79.- in black...

I wouldn't take a chance and buy the oppli stand. We bought ours from racksandstands.com. They are good. Call them and bargain and they already delivered my stand in just couple of days.....Good luck



Originally posted by ArchieGates
Add me to the list of XBR950 owners. I purchased the 60" model from Good Guys today. I have been reading about HDTV's for 2 years now, and I believe with the XBR950 I have finally found the model that gets most everything right. I finally came to the conclusion that there's no such thing as a perfect HDTV. But, as my interest in the TV is primarily for Xbox gaming, I think it makes the best choice.

I had been sold on DLP technology for a while, but the way the Samsung sets handle the component inputs (having separate inputs for 480 and 720/1080) makes using an Xbox a real pain with that set. I also feel comfortable with the Sony's since they're on their 3rd generation RP LCD and these XBR models look fantastic.

The picture quality of the XBR looked awesome in the store. The only TV's that looked better to me were the top of the line Mits RPTV's (I could tell they had deeper black levels) but I have a small apartment and the burn-in thing was an issue for my Xbox.

The best thing was that I bought the set today on Thursday, and it's going to be delivered on Saturday. My only problem now is that it seems that the Oppli stand from Ikea isn't deep enough by 3 1/2 inches and the TV set exceeds the max weight of the stand by 22 points (177 vs 155). I need to find another affordable stand to fit the TV, because I'm definitely not going to pay those Sony prices.

My other dillemma is that Good Guys had a sale where I can get a Hughes Direct TV HD receiver and dish installed for $199 when I bought my TV. Should I have gone for this deal? I really want the HDirectTivo when it comes out, but I don't know when that will be.

Any advice as to whether I should wait for the HD DirectTivo? By the way, I can't get any over-the-air HD content because there is a big mountain blocking my view of the transmitter, even though I'm probably 15 minutes from it.

Don't want to sound negative, but has anyone encountered any major recurring problems with the 60/70xbr950 so far? Obviously there there will be a few dead pixels which all LCDs suffer from, but any real image anomalies or manufacturer defects?

Thanks,
Doug

My 60" GWIII arrived this morning at around 8:45am PST. Right now, it's sitting on a temporary stand as I am waiting for my local Best Buy to get the Bush VS74377 in stock. I haven't done any cable management right now so it kind of looks like a rat's nest on the floor. Unfortunately, I didn't have much time to play around with the set yet as I had to leave for work soon after it got delivered. But I plan to do HTPC (Radeon 9800 Pro)/DVI testing this weekend and will report my results on Monday.

We have had no problems with my 70" which was installed on 10/31/03 and we absolutely love it. We use the split screen a lot, with a video game on one side and TiVo on the other. One limitation with the split screen is that you can only use one HD source. The other source needs to be regular TV or through the S-video or composite inputs. We could not watch HD television and also view the video game at the same time if it was hooked up with the component inputs. The video game is now back to composite cables, but to be honest I really do not see much difference between the two. This TV does an outstanding job of upconverting.

Originally posted by ArchieGates
Add me to the list of XBR950 owners. I purchased the 60" model from Good Guys today. I have been reading about HDTV's for 2 years now, and I believe with the XBR950 I have finally found the model that gets most everything right. I finally came to the conclusion that there's no such thing as a perfect HDTV. But, as my interest in the TV is primarily for Xbox gaming, I think it makes the best choice.

I had been sold on DLP technology for a while, but the way the Samsung sets handle the component inputs (having separate inputs for 480 and 720/1080) makes using an Xbox a real pain with that set. I also feel comfortable with the Sony's since they're on their 3rd generation RP LCD and these XBR models look fantastic.

The picture quality of the XBR looked awesome in the store. The only TV's that looked better to me were the top of the line Mits RPTV's (I could tell they had deeper black levels) but I have a small apartment and the burn-in thing was an issue for my Xbox.

The best thing was that I bought the set today on Thursday, and it's going to be delivered on Saturday. My only problem now is that it seems that the Oppli stand from Ikea isn't deep enough by 3 1/2 inches and the TV set exceeds the max weight of the stand by 22 points (177 vs 155). I need to find another affordable stand to fit the TV, because I'm definitely not going to pay those Sony prices.

My other dillemma is that Good Guys had a sale where I can get a Hughes Direct TV HD receiver and dish installed for $199 when I bought my TV. Should I have gone for this deal? I really want the HDirectTivo when it comes out, but I don't know when that will be.

Any advice as to whether I should wait for the HD DirectTivo? By the way, I can't get any over-the-air HD content because there is a big mountain blocking my view of the transmitter, even though I'm probably 15 minutes from it.

Take your CC receipt to Good Guys and see if they will give you a better deal. I would enjoy the current Direct TV HD box now and then sell it when the TIVO version comes out or use the old box in the bedroom.

Good Luck...

You may remember the disappointment I wrote about November 11th (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2931190#post2931190) when a salesman played "A Bug's Life" for me on the 70" XBR.

Some of you suggested that the XBR outperformed most DVD players and that I should try turning progressive mode off.

Boy did that make a big difference.

It was a chore for the salesman to turn off progressive mode because the Sony 400 disk changer had a menu switch on the back. The switch had to be changed before the interleaved option was usable from the on screen menu.

The 70" XBR now had no problem showing that "A Bug's Life" was back to it's old wonderful self.

I also watched the beginning of "TFOTR" until the four horsemen showed up in the forest. That scene was more black silhouette than very dark with details to be seen.

Everything else was great. Skin tones, fire works, flowers and forest were all great.

The other DVD I watched was "The Fifth Element" Superbit version. I watched the opening "visit" and the "recreation" of a perfect being from one perfect cell. I stopped once she found a taxi.

I'm in love with the PQ of this set. I know glare can be dealt with, and I hope one can get better detail in dark material with come easy adjustments or ISF calibration.

My big hurdle is that the 60" XBR is heavy (177lbs) and wide (63.5"). I've moved my wife up from a 50" Samsung (she thought it was very big) to a 56" Samsung. I used the "this 56" set is only 3 inches wider" argument. I'm trying to come up with a way to say "16.5 inches wider but look at that PQ" in a way that won't get me killed.

I blame all my troubles on those damned speakers. :rolleyes:

..."I stopped once she found a taxi"...

Reminds me of the scene from Jerry Maguire:

"You had me at 'hello'". (sniffle sniffle sob)

Yes, those side speakers are entirely annoying...

Originally posted by tburrows
We have had no problems with my 70" which was installed on 10/31/03 and we absolutely love it. We use the split screen a lot, with a video game on one side and TiVo on the other. One limitation with the split screen is that you can only use one HD source. The other source needs to be regular TV or through the S-video or composite inputs. We could not watch HD television and also view the video game at the same time if it was hooked up with the component inputs. The video game is now back to composite cables, but to be honest I really do not see much difference between the two. This TV does an outstanding job of upconverting.

So a split screen from two component or 1dvi and 1 component source is not doable? That's a weird "anti" feature. Even my Hitachi 50v500 can split screen 2 component sources. Not that it is that big a deal...split screen features are nice, but not ultra critical.

Doug

Based on hbwaits' suggestion to use a non-progressive scan DVD player, does that also mean that I'll get better performance on my Xbox with progressive scan turned off? Or does the Xbox output a better signal when it's set to 480p?

Another question: Does the set allow you to use the built-in speakers as a center channel? I already have a good center channel speaker, but I was just wondering. Any photos of the back panel of the Sony?

Originally posted by ArchieGates
Another question: Does the set allow you to use the built-in speakers as a center channel? I already have a good center channel speaker, but I was just wondering. Any photos of the back panel of the Sony?

For details on the back panel of the XBRs, go to:

http://www.gwinnetttv.com/video/tvs/bigscreen_tvs/sony/kdf70xbr950.htm

The lower right corner of this page offers the capability to download the 120-page User Manual for the 60" and 70" XBRs in PDF format. The back panel is diagrammed and detailed somewhere around page 22.

Originally posted by ArchieGates
Another question: Does the set allow you to use the built-in speakers as a center channel? I already have a good center channel speaker, but I was just wondering. Any photos of the back panel of the Sony?

The built-in speakers are on the far left and far right...there is no 'center channel' speaker built into the set. Suggest you place a good quality center channel speaker under the set - assuming you have a stand with a shelf that will accommodate it.

What you can do is to use the built-in speakers as your left and right front surround. This will work if your receiver has a pre-amp output for front left/right surround. Just plug them into whatever video input that you've connected the receiver to. Set you set volume to 50% and then adjust the volume on your surround-sound channels.

It works quite well. Very economical way to get front left/right surrounds - especially if the XBR950 is located in a corner. It's very difficult to get speakers that 'look good' when placed next to a set installed in a corner. And if you have the 70" even better - the speakers are farther apart and image well.

best,
jg

Originally posted by ArchieGates
Based on hbwaits' suggestion to use a non-progressive scan DVD player, does that also mean that I'll get better performance on my Xbox with progressive scan turned off? Or does the Xbox output a better signal when it's set to 480p?
No. The Xbox isn't doing deinterlacing of its image in games, it's already inherently progressive and is getting converted to interlaced on its way out if you don't turn progressive on. The TV would then have to deinterlace it back into 480p, kind of a wasteful process when you can already send it a 480p signal to begin with that by default must contain more information in it than a 480i signal ever could. :p

Originally posted by Gruber
The built-in speakers are on the far left and far right...there is no 'center channel' speaker built into the set. Suggest you place a good quality center channel speaker under the set - assuming you have a stand with a shelf that will accommodate it.

What you can do is to use the built-in speakers as your left and right front surround. This will work if your receiver has a pre-amp output for front left/right surround. Just plug them into whatever video input that you've connected the receiver to. Set you set volume to 50% and then adjust the volume on your surround-sound channels.

It works quite well. Very economical way to get front left/right surrounds - especially if the XBR950 is located in a corner. It's very difficult to get speakers that 'look good' when placed next to a set installed in a corner. And if you have the 70" even better - the speakers are farther apart and image well.

best,
jg


Be consistant between the audio and video side of your home theater. If you've just spent $5.5K or $7K on your TV, then you should consider one of the better audio systems. You are not likely to match the audio characteristics of good external speakers to those built into any TV set. Therefore, using a TV's internal speakers will always stand out and cause uneven pans when sound travels from one side of the room to the other.

A 70" TV takes up a nice bit of real estate. (love to have one) But it would unfair to believe that you should have such a nice set with audio that no where approaches the quality of the set. :D

Originally posted by Googer
No. The Xbox isn't doing deinterlacing of its image in games, it's already inherently progressive and is getting converted to interlaced on its way out if you don't turn progressive on. The TV would then have to deinterlace it back into 480p, kind of a wasteful process when you can already send it a 480p signal to begin with that by default must contain more information in it than a 480i signal ever could. :p

Thanks for the info. I just got my 60" XBR950 tonight and the first thing I did was play Xbox on it. Things do look better in progressive scan mode. But I was a little disappointed in the picture quality in 480p games. I decided to try the Monster Cables for Xbox and the difference was quite noticable. I see quite a few less jaggies on the image. Before, I was using the Microsoft brand component cables, and passing it through my Yamaha receiver as well. Now I'm going directly into the TV and things look great.

I have a DVD question. From what I've read so far, a non-progressive DVD player with a component connection is the best way to connect DVD's to the XBR950, correct?

From what I read ealier on these forums, it seems like DVI doesn't work too well with the Grand Wega. I'm using a component connection with a decent Pioneer DVD player, but I'd like to improve my image quality. Could better component cables help? The ones I have now are the RCA ones you see at Wal-Mart. They seem pretty thick, but I don't know how much a difference more expensive cables will make. Plus, I'm going through my Yamaha reciever now. How much picture quality do I lose by doing so?

Thanks for all the help. I want to get the most out of my set!

Well, I've had this up and running for about a day. Mostly good experiences.

First off the black level is not satisfying, but better than previous models. If the blank spaces around the tops and bottoms of anamorphic DVD screens were 50% grey instead of black (same goes for 4:3 modes) this would be much less of an issue. The stripes dont' let you forget about it.

Color depth and tone is excellent and very tunable. Brightness is exceptional.

With my Panasonic RP85 DVD, the S video is very noticably better than the progressive output. The XBR does not scale or process a progressive input , and S-video gets their full treatment.

I have to say that the scaling blows away just about every other reasonably priced external scaler I have seen. It could well justify the extra cost of the XBR. Analog cable looks better than I thought it would too.

I watched the Two Towers tonight - what a treat! There was one disturbing effect though. In the dark battle scenes bright fast moving spots of white (glints off of armour or swords) turned red. This was prominent and unmistakable. Some thing to do with a misalignment of the three lcds? I happen to be very sensitive to rainbow effect in single chip DLPs too. Anybody else see this effect? And is there a cure?

The other thing I can't figure out is how to get broadcast/antennae HDTV. The XBR has a HDTV tuner inside, but I don't know how to get to those channels. I bought a Radio Shack antennae for this, and I live within 2 miles of the San Francisco HDTV broadcast antennaes, so I am looking forward to this.

tuckers

Congrats on your XBR.

In which scene of Two Towers do you see the spots of red on white?

Do you have Avia or DVE to project a convergence screen. Although you can't converge with this set, maybe it'll help tie down if it's misalignment of LCDs or maybe something else.

As to how to setup your HD tuner. I've got the GWIII model which has the NTSC tuner, not the HD tuner, so I'm assuming that there are some similarities. On the remote press "TV/Video" until you see channel number on the upper right corner of the screen, press menu, right arrow to channels, down arrow to auto program, right arrow to start, then press enter(which is the"+"sign.) It should find what HD stations are available to it.

Originally posted by tuckers
With my Panasonic RP85 DVD, the S video is very noticably better than the progressive output. The XBR does not scale or process a progressive input , and S-video gets their full treatment.


Not true. All Grand Wegas scale all inputs at all the standard ASTC and NTSC resolutions, progressive or interlaced. With the latest GWs there may be a way to disable the internal scaler by feeding the DVI input a signal at native resolution. This is not possible with the GWII though.

If your DVD player looks better via S-Video than via component (interlaced or progressive), you should consider buying a new DVD player. The one you have sounds faulty. How does 480i via the components look?

A good deinterlacer in a DVD player should be able to outperform any deinterlacer built into a TV since the one in the DVD player has more information about the source material and is operating on data that is already digital. However, since the GW has to scale every input anyway, a DVD player with a built in scaler is probably not going to work as well as one that feeds 480p through the component inputs.

Originally posted by ADGrant
A good deinterlacer in a DVD player should be able to outperform any deinterlacer built into a TV since the one in the DVD player has more information about the source material and is operating on data that is already digital.


I think the GWIII XBR and Samsung DLP sets outperform a lot of "good" DVD players. Of course that depends on how we define "good" and in part how much we pay for "good". :)



However, since the GW has to scale every input anyway, a DVD player with a built in scaler is probably not going to work as well as one that feeds 480p through the component inputs.

Did you mean "feeds 480i"?

Originally posted by ArchieGates
Thanks for the info. I just got my 60" XBR950 tonight and the first thing I did was play Xbox on it. Things do look better in progressive scan mode. But I was a little disappointed in the picture quality in 480p games. I decided to try the Monster Cables for Xbox and the difference was quite noticable. I see quite a few less jaggies on the image. Before, I was using the Microsoft brand component cables, and passing it through my Yamaha receiver as well. Now I'm going directly into the TV and things look great.

I all depends on the games you play...Madden 2004 looks "terrible" at 480p, but True Crime and Soul Caliber 2 play at 720p and look much better; at least on the Hitachi 50v500...my 60xbr950 *should* come today--it was delayed by the 3-5 inches of snow we got yesterday :( and :).

Doug

Originally posted by htwaits

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by ADGrant
A good deinterlacer in a DVD player should be able to outperform any deinterlacer built into a TV since the one in the DVD player has more information about the source material and is operating on data that is already digital.


I think the GWIII XBR and Samsung DLP sets outperform a lot of "good" DVD players. Of course that depends on how we define "good" and in part how much we pay for "good".
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


IMHO A progressive scan DVD player that is outperformed by a built-in de-interlacer in a TV cannot be considered a "good" progressive scan DVD player.

I doubt the de-interlacer in the GWIIIs can outperform the Panasonic RP82 or XP-30/50 or similar models. However many other Panasonic models and almost all Sony models perform poorly as progressive scan players. Last time I checked Pioneer did not produce a single DVD player that could be considered "good" (as a progressive scan DVD Video player).

The good players do not cost anymore than similar players that perform poorly. For some reason there is no direct relationship between price and performance in progressive scan DVD video.

Originally posted by htwaits

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

However, since the GW has to scale every input anyway, a DVD player with a built in scaler is probably not going to work as well as one that feeds 480p through the component inputs.

Did you mean "feeds 480i"?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



No I meant "feeds 480p". I would not feed DVD video at 480i to any Grand Wega if I had a good progressive scan DVD player (see my above definition of what I consider to be a good progressive scan DVD player).

My two cents ....

I find it hard to believe that this TV would look better with a 480i signal than with a 480p from a good DVD player (RP82/XP30/X50).

It does not make sense. Something must not be right with somebody's setup.


"Tag" man

The 70" XBR that I saw looked like crap displaying "A Bug's Live" with progressive scan input from a Sony $699 (400 disk) changer/player. When switched to 480i input the same combo looked as great as it should. The XBR seems superior to Sony's changer DVD player.

How many of those great Panasonic DVD players are still in the stores?

My conclusion is that it's a good idea to try both 480p and 480i input and let your eyes make the choice.

Based on what you said what DVD player should I buy for 70XBR950? I had ordered a Bravo D1 and I want to get a second player in the mean time for me to play some good DVD's. Bravo is back ordered and I want to have a good Composite DVD player as well.....



Originally posted by htwaits
The 70" XBR that I saw looked like crap displaying "A Bug's Live" with progressive scan input from a Sony $699 (400 disk) changer/player. When switched to 480i input the same combo looked as great as it should. The XBR seems superior to Sony's changer DVD player.

How many of those great Panasonic DVD players are still in the stores?

My conclusion is that it's a good idea to try both 480p and 480i input and let your eyes make the choice.

Originally posted by htwaits
The 70" XBR that I saw looked like crap displaying "A Bug's Live" with progressive scan input from a Sony $699 (400 disk) changer/player. When switched to 480i input the same combo looked as great as it should. The XBR seems superior to Sony's changer DVD player.

How many of those great Panasonic DVD players are still in the stores?

My conclusion is that it's a good idea to try both 480p and 480i input and let your eyes make the choice.

Sony does not make good progressive DVD players. That is why I replaced my 7000 single disc player (which cost $900 in 1997 and was the best at the time) with a $200 Panasonic XP30. I am surprised the changer looked that bad though, perhaps it was faulty.

Certainly you should compare 480p to 480i, but if 480i looks better, you have a poor quality DVD player.

Originally posted by madipac
Based on what you said what DVD player should I buy for 70XBR950? I had ordered a Bravo D1 and I want to get a second player in the mean time for me to play some good DVD's. Bravo is back ordered and I want to have a good Composite DVD player as well.....

You need to look for a DVD player with the DCDi chipset such as certain specific Panasonic models. I suggest spending some time in the DVD hardware forum. If you can find a Panasonic XP-30 or XP-50 or RO-82, they would be an excellent choice as would the Denon 1600.

Well, I went back into the Panasonics rp82 settings and found that I did not have the progressive output configured correctly.

It just goes to show how good the XBR scaling is though that I thouroughly enjoyed the movie with 480i upscalled and progressed with the internal upscaler. I'm also using the BetterCables.com S-video and compoonent cables.

It's daylight now so I can't judge the difference that well, but the panny progressive does seem to have more detail, but the XBR upscaling might have a smoother more sophisticated appearance. I'll see tonight. Lawrence of Arabia in on the offer.

I have found the HDTV channels, and there is a Raiders game going in HDTV today, very nice picture!

My latest gotcha is that I can't get the Sony Toslink digital output to sync to my Audio Note DAC. What format is HDTV digital output in? And has anyone been able to sync with a DAC?

Originally posted by JimP
Be consistant between the audio and video side of your home theater. If you've just spent $5.5K or $7K on your TV, then you should consider one of the better audio systems. You are not likely to match the audio characteristics of good external speakers to those built into any TV set. Therefore, using a TV's internal speakers will always stand out and cause uneven pans when sound travels from one side of the room to the other.

A 70" TV takes up a nice bit of real estate. (love to have one) But it would unfair to believe that you should have such a nice set with audio that no where approaches the quality of the set. :D

JimP:
My main point was that the 70XBR950 fits extremely well in a corner (hardly any real estate used) - and sticking two tower speakers in front of it is well, ugly. So the alternative is to place your L/C/R on the shelf underneath the set ... which is certainly possible, or use the amplified internal speakers which will increase the distance between L/R.

Yes, when you pan using a test pattern there is a tonal difference. But trust me, Sony did an outstanding job with the soundsystem on this set. The internal speakers are excellent - well matched to the XBR set. This is not your normal TV... if you had one you would understand.

Gruber:

In any event, enjoy your XBR! :)

Originally posted by ADGrant
Certainly you should compare 480p to 480i, but if 480i looks better, you have a poor quality DVD player.
True.

Some folks don't realize that that progressive mode can be turned off and that sometimes the DVD player they have is less than great in progressive mode.

I have had my 60XBR950 for 3 days now. I have watched 6 different DVD’s and all looked better when watched with the progressive mode on, I have a Sony NS700P. I have tried switching to interlace mode, but there was a definite loss of quality. The HD channels that I receive look great, the only problem with that is that it is hard to watch analog channels now. (anyone els have that problem?) I did notice a problem with the blacks when watching a few minutes of the Sopranos tonight. In any dark scene it looked like, anything that was black had no definition, everything was just black. It looked like when you tilt you LCD computer screen and any dark color turns black. Any suggestions on how I can tweak that?

Anyone find or have access to the XBR950 Service Manual yet?

The standard user guide really offers no hints as to the real power of the unit. Its been trial and error so far for me for the past couple of weeks.

For example, there is no setup for OTA HD antenna, digital cable unscrambled and digtial cable scrambled in the manual only the cable or antenna only option or the cable box and cable only option. Finally figured it out: OTA HD to VHF/UHF, split cable, unscrambled digital cable to cable using the QAM tuner, and scrambled digital cable to Video 1. Can now split and surf between two out of three at a time. If only they had Triplet View instead of Twin View.

You could try this:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=317563&perpage=20&highlight=UMR%20doc&pagenumber=3

It's for the GWII series, but it may work.

Doug

Does the Sony 60" LCD Rear Projection HDTV 60XBR950 have HDCP capabilities?

Originally posted by cow736
Does the Sony 60" LCD Rear Projection HDTV 60XBR950 have HDCP capabilities?

Yes, DVI - HDCP connector is Video #7

Well, I just placed an order for our 70" XBR - we are eagerly anticipating. Also anxious to get our stand which is currently being built. It will be interesting to see how well we can coordinate these two items, as well the removal of our current RPTV + Furniture...

Originally posted by ebrigham
Well, I just placed an order for our 70" XBR - we are eagerly anticipating. Also anxious to get our stand which is currently being built. It will be interesting to see how well we can coordinate these two items, as well the removal of our current RPTV + Furniture...

I hear you. We ordered our 60XBR about two and a half weeks ago and have not received it yet. In the meantime, I have torn our old system down and rebuilt the new one (stand, center channel shelf, new receiver, new DVD player, HD STB, XBox) so the delivery guys can bring the TV in, set it down, connect a few cables, and be done.

Originally posted by mevscreen
I have had my 60XBR950 for 3 days now. I have watched 6 different DVD’s and all looked better when watched with the progressive mode on, I have a Sony NS700P.

Mev:

Congrats on your new 60". Have you thought about purchasing the Bravo and connecting though DVI?

How are you receiving your HD stations now and how are they connected?

Pleased with the TV? I just ordered one.

Thanks
Dom

Well I've had my 60xbr950 for 3 days now and love it (mostly). Previously I had a Hitachi 50v500 and the 2 units I had both had problems so I "upgraded" to the Sony (Circuit City has been great BTW in regards to this). The one gripe I have so far are the video settings. With the Hitachi, your video settings were stored for each video input and on top of that you had "day" and "night" settings. This meant 12 independent video settings (6 inputs x 2 type of settings per input).

For the Sony, if I'm reading the manual right, you have 3 settings for 7 inputs on the Sony. "Vivid" should be called "useless" because it destroys the black level detail, "standard" should be called "sub-standard" and then they give you one "pro" setting. The pro setting is the only useful one IMHO if you want a well calibrated/balanced picture. So you calibrate using the pro picture mode and now that mode is shared among all 7 inputs...am I wrong in what I am saying here/reading in the manual...I really hope so, but I fear that some mental giant at Sony decided that only 1 useful setting is good enough for 7 inputs.

Anybody have any vivid/standard settings that work well for them?

Doug

Originally posted by ArchieGates
I have a DVD question. From what I've read so far, a non-progressive DVD player with a component connection is the best way to connect DVD's to the XBR950, correct?

From what I read ealier on these forums, it seems like DVI doesn't work too well with the Grand Wega. I'm using a component connection with a decent Pioneer DVD player, but I'd like to improve my image quality. Could better component cables help?

It depends on the quality of your DVD player. I have the XBR950 and the Panny CP-72 (same internals as Panny RP-82). The 480p picture is MUCH better than 480i in my case. I use AudioQuest component cables and it looks incredible.

I use DVI to connect my Sony HD300 satelite receiver and it looks awesome. I have the HD300 set to pass the signal in native format and let the XBR950 do the conversion. I'd like to hear what others have been doing (native or converting to 720p)... I think I'll pose this question seperately with more detail.

I've been using a Sony NS715P (?) DVD player and have tried both progressive and interlaced modes. I had a hard time telling the difference once I enabled the 3-2 conversion on the set.

As for the DVI input, I plan to hook up a PC to it this weekend for testing. I also tried my DirecTV Samsung TS160 STB via the DVI connection and the blacks just got crushed. Viewing the TS160 via the component inputs gave a much better picture with regards to black levels and since you can only really tweak the pro settings to anything useful, tweaking the DVD component using DVE gave the best compromise to all the other inputs. When I tried tweaking the pro settings for the DVI input and the ST160, it really threw off the other input settings when in pro mode.

Doug

I have the 60" XBR950 and the Sony HD300 satelite receiver. I connect to the TV using DVI. The HD300 let's you select the output format, you can either let it pass everything in native mode or convert it. The interesting modes are as follows (I didn't deplay all of them here):

Native:
in=1080i/720p/480p/480i out=native (pass through untouched)

1080i:
in=1080i/720p/480p/480i out=1080i (everything converted to 1080i)

720p:
in=1080i/720p/480p/480i out=720p (everything converted to 720p)

Variable 1:
in=1080i/720p out=native, in=480p/480i out=480p

Variable 3:
in=1080i/720p out=720p, in=480p/480i out=480p

My question is: has anyone experimented with these settings? If so, which one works best for you?

You might think that converting everything as 720p would have benefits since the XBR has a 788p native resolution. But in my experiments, this was not the case... the 480 material looked bad.

I chose NATIVE because I assume that the XBR950's scaler/circuitry is higher quality than the HD300's, but I don't know that for a fact. Is anyone familiar with the internal chips used in these products, and is it true that the XBR is higher quality than the HD300?

I'm wondering if anyone's put together a tweaker's guide for the XBR950s. I know alot of what looks good is subject to individual tastes but there must be some settings that most agree is essential. For example, if selecting 480i from a DVD player, use cinemotion. But what about all the other pro settings like:
Mild Mode, Clear White, Detail Enhancer, Color Corrector, Black Corrector, Gamma Corrector, White Balance, and Cinema Black for DVD viewing?

Are there recommended settings for gaming systems (XBox, PS2, etc) especially in games where there are dark scenes?

Originally posted by ixion
I have the 60" XBR950 and the Sony HD300 satelite receiver. I connect to the TV using DVI. The HD300 let's you select the output format, you can either let it pass everything in native mode or convert it.
<snip>

My question is: has anyone experimented with these settings? If so, which one works best for you?

You might think that converting everything as 720p would have benefits since the XBR has a 788p native resolution. But in my experiments, this was not the case... the 480 material looked bad.

I chose NATIVE because I assume that the XBR950's scaler/circuitry is higher quality than the HD300's, but I don't know that for a fact. Is anyone familiar with the internal chips used in these products, and is it true that the XBR is higher quality than the HD300?

Interesting...the Sammy TS160 has 720p and 1080i (maybe 480i/p as well, not sure). I have it set to 1080i. Interesting thing I noted last night was that for 720p programming (ESPNH), switching the receiver from 720<-->1080i didn't make a difference, but when I was watching DiscoveryHD, outputting in 1080i filled the entire screen. When I switched the TS160 to 720 mode while on that channel, I got a "widescreen" type of picture where I had bars at the top and bottom of the picture.

Doug

Originally posted by frottage
Interesting...the Sammy TS160 has 720p and 1080i (maybe 480i/p as well, not sure). I have it set to 1080i. Interesting thing I noted last night was that for 720p programming (ESPNH), switching the receiver from 720<-->1080i didn't make a difference, but when I was watching DiscoveryHD, outputting in 1080i filled the entire screen. When I switched the TS160 to 720 mode while on that channel, I got a "widescreen" type of picture where I had bars at the top and bottom of the picture.

Doug

Sounds like the Sammy unit does some strange conversion because that does not happen with the HD300. It fills the entire screen with both resolutions.

Well, we finally got our 60XBR950 today along with our Denon 3803 from 6ave.com. Today was an early Christmas! HD, DVDs on our Denon DVD-1600, and XBox are amazing. SD is good, but I can't complain considering garbage in, garbage out. I have only found one green stuck pixel that disappears after 4 or 5 feet. It's not very bright. I have absolutely no complaints whatsoever, especially considering that TWC is adding a HD tier on December 4 with a slew of sports channels! Thanks to all the useful information on this forum, I am convinced we made the right choice.

I have been reading all the GWIII threads for the last 4 or 5 months and have yet to see anyone post their tweaked settings for the XBR. I spent about 3 hrs working with Avia trying to adjust the set, but I wouldn't mind comparing my settings to others'. Anyone want to post theirs?

Originally posted by ixion
Sounds like the Sammy unit does some strange conversion because that does not happen with the HD300. It fills the entire screen with both resolutions.

ID10T error...the Sammy STB was set for 4:3 screen...setting it to 16:9 fixed the problem. But the black levels from the DVI output suck...much better from the component outputs.

Originally posted by junior_jam

<snip>
I have been reading all the GWIII threads for the last 4 or 5 months and have yet to see anyone post their tweaked settings for the XBR. I spent about 3 hrs working with Avia trying to adjust the set, but I wouldn't mind comparing my settings to others'. Anyone want to post theirs?

congrats and "Merry Christmas" in your case. For some settings see:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2828567#post2828567

Doug

Is it possible to do a split screen(Twin View) for 2 HD sources? Like the built-in HD-Tunner and a HD-SAT on the DVI input?

I think the DVI and the Component connections look like they can only be displayed on the same one side.

Does any one have any experience with this feature yet?

Can someone please recommend a nice, affordable DVD player to use with my new XBR 950? Right now, I'm using a four year old Pioneer interlaced player. I've seen the Panasonic recommended before, but I can't find those for sale. If you can provide a link to where to buy a player, that would be great.

Also, what are some recommended component cables that are affordable. Does anyone use those "Acoustic Research" ones at Best Buy? Currently I'm using the RCA brand cables that they carry at Wal Mart. Are those sufficient, or would I notice a picture quality increase with better cables?

How big is the bottom of the 60XBR950? I like the Boltz TVXL1 TV STAND, Specifications: 46" wide, 17" high, 27" deep. Is it too small?

That stand should be fine assuming it's strong enough, the 60XBR950's base is roughly a rectangle 32" wide x 23" deep.

Originally posted by mgoblue
Is it possible to do a split screen(Twin View) for 2 HD sources? Like the built-in HD-Tunner and a HD-SAT on the DVI input?

I think the DVI and the Component connections look like they can only be displayed on the same one side.

Does any one have any experience with this feature yet?

Can't speak for the split screen using the BIT, but you CAN NOT do two HD (480p or above) sources. The HD (DVI or component) source needs to appear on the left. Pretty lame and I can't figure out why they would need to that since other manufacturers allow that feature. Minor gripe for now since I only have one HD STB.

Doug

I am considering buying a 60xbr950 but was wondering about the integrated HDTV. Has anyone been able to get HDTV from a cable connection using the integrated tuner? I would like to avoid using an external box. To be more specific I would be interested in experience with Comcast in Chicago.

With a intregrated ATSC Tuner all you need is a OTA UHF Ant. You can hook up the Ant. directly to the set.

Happy Thanksgiving!

Dave

Is there an optimal viewing distance for the 60XBR950? What do you guys that already own one recomend?

I sit around 9 feet from mine; looks fine to me (no screen door visible from there). I'd say screen door starts to become pretty noticable inside 6 feet and would be noticably quite distracting inside 4, but you wouldn't be sitting that close anyway, right? :)

Originally posted by frottage
ID10T error...the Sammy STB was set for 4:3 screen...setting it to 16:9 fixed the problem. But the black levels from the DVI output suck...much better from the component outputs.

Just FYI, the HD300 has two black level settings for DVI, the second one makes the blacks look really good.

Here's a picture of my 60XBR950 as set up on my modified (to make it a bit shorter) Z-Line Palisades stand. I'll admit that it's actually 2 photos chopped together - the TV image from a shot with no flash in a dark room combined with a shot in the same dark room with flash. :p

Originally posted by cheridave
With a intregrated ATSC Tuner all you need is a OTA UHF Ant. You can hook up the Ant. directly to the set.

Yes, but I live in a condo and can't put up an antenna. I am limited to the cable feed.

Originally posted by kdeleon
Yes, but I live in a condo and can't put up an antenna. I am limited to the cable feed.


Depending on the distance, you might be able to use an indoor antenna.

Go to www.antennaweb.org and enter the relevant information to see what kind of antenna you would need.

Regarding the built in tuner and cable reception: It will receive unscrambled analog and digital cable channels. I connected my cable tv coax to the cable input, ran channel setup and it found 33 digital cable channels and a number of analog channels. Most of the digital channels were blank, BUT I did receive all of the local digital channels that were available on the cable sysytem. The channel numbers were different then what the cable system box shows them as, but it works. The tuner is QAM compatible.

Runch Machine,

If you click on "Edit" you can delete your extra messages.

Hello all,
I am a new member and a new 60" XBR950 owner, but I have been lurking here on this forum for many weeks trying to make a decision on a new RPTV to replace my 27" Sony crt. I have waffled repeatedly from DLP to LCD, 42"to 50" to 56" to 60". I finally decided last week after multiple trips (at least 7) to the local high-end store that although the Sammy DLP has the "pop", the colors in my opinion are not as natural as plasma or the better LCD's. But until two days ago I was leaning toward a WE610 until I saw a 70" XBR950 sitting side-by-side with a 50" WE. Same feed, same light, and the XBR looked like plasma compared to the WE, and it was 20" more diagonal. I bought the 60" XBR that day and brought it home in the back of my truck. Yes, it was $1500 more than the 60WE610 but in comparison, it was only $250 more than the Sammy HLN617W, and it has a built-in tuner. The tuner will tune HD off the local TWC analog cable, all but the scrambled channels (HBO, Showtime), they showed me this in the store and said they told TWC about but they didn't seem too concerned. My digital cable will be installed tomorrow with the HD box, but right now I have about 5 HD channels using just my existing VHF/UHF antenna in my attic! Believe me folks, I work hard for my money too but when you see a side-by-side comparison between a 50 and a 70 and the 70" shines, there's got to be something to it. I see what you mean about the reflections, but no more than a CRT, just bigger, and there is an effective anti-glare treatment on the front glass that seems to enhance the clarity and brightness. I am using DLiquid's GWIII settings until I get a feel for this baby, but the WOW factor as y'all say is extremely high and the WAF is off the chart - and she was afraid it would be too big! Thanks to everyone for the valuable info in this forum, I'll probably be needing some advice as I get used to this puppy, let me know if I can do anything for any of you.

Originally posted by kdeleon
Yes, but I live in a condo and can't put up an antenna. I am limited to the cable feed.

I'm using the Zenith Silver Sensor indoor and it works great! I get all the major networks in HD (during prime time).

Originally posted by GWD54
Hello all,
I am a new member and a new 60" XBR950 owner, but I have been lurking here on this forum for many weeks trying to make a decision on a new RPTV to replace my 27" Sony crt. I have waffled repeatedly from DLP to LCD, 42"to 50" to 56" to 60". I finally decided last week after multiple trips (at least 7) to the local high-end store that although the Sammy DLP has the "pop", the colors in my opinion are not as natural as plasma or the better LCD's. But until two days ago I was leaning toward a WE610 until I saw a 70" XBR950 sitting side-by-side with a 50" WE. Same feed, same light, and the XBR looked like plasma compared to the WE, and it was 20" more diagonal. I bought the 60" XBR that day and brought it home in the back of my truck.

I did a side-by-side comparison of Sammy HLN567 and Sony 60" XBR950 in my home for a couple of weeks. I came to the same conclusion. The XBR had a greater WOW factor, more natural colors. Have a look at my previous post with a picture:

Post:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2936411#post2936411

Picture:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?s=&postid=2936411&fullpage=1

I am curious about how the XBR950 converts to its 1366 x 768 native resoltion. In essence what does it do with 720p and 1080i?

I hope the 720p image is "cropped" so that it displays the 720x1280 without any conversion. But I suspect everything is converted to the display's native resolution, no matter how "close" to that resolution the input is.

Nobody has spoken of conversion artifacts or distorted images. I ask because all non-integral conversion would cause some distortion, and many reviews I've read often point this out... like the 540p resolution of the Toshiba and Hitachi sets when feeding a 480i/p signal.

I also wondered if anyone compared the protective screen to other brands besides Sony and the posted pictures (Samsung was it?). Two of the best anti-reflective screens sit on the Pioneer Elite and the Mitsubishi. *Only* Mitsubishi's high end line... 711 and 713 series... since all their other sets have a mirror screen. I've also seen the Hitachi CRT RPTV's screen (don't have model number), and it looked very similar to the Mitsubishi's. Anyway, just looking for a little more diversity in comparisons!

-Pie

Saturday afternoon Tweeter delivered my 60XBR950. Very nice, but kind of short since I don't have a stand for it yet :). It has replaced the Toshiba 57HLX82 in the great room, with the Tosh being relegated to a lonely spot in the gameroom (at least until Toshiba shows up to pick it up later this week).

First impressions of the Sony XBR are positive:

- Very bright image, brighter than the Tosh LCoS. Good horizontal viewing angle, but not quite as good as the LCoS. Better vertical viewing angle, but this could be based on the improved brightness.

- Blacks seem good. Anything but "pro" mode definitely crushes black detail, of course, which seems to be due to the "black enhancement" that is turned on by default in both of the other modes.

- Took a bit to get SD looking decent. Picture on vivid absolutely sucked with serious blockiness and loss of dark area detail. Standard mode was better but still some blockiness/lack of smoothness to the picture. The compromise winner so far is Pro mode with ALL enhancements turned off but with some DRC tweaking upping the smoothness and setting detail ("reality") to a middle value. No blockiness. Provides a picture which is close to the good one I was getting out of the Tosh LCoS, but still haven't tweaked to get the same "punchiness".

- Watched a DVD, some SD, and some HD. Very good picture on DVD and HD of course, but obviously needs some tweaking to improve. Haven't done any formal tweaking as yet, just "eyed in" some better values.

- Inspected set on all-white, all-blue, and all-black screens. No sign of stuck pixels as yet.

- Cannot hear fan noise in my environment. Could hear it with the Tosh LCoS, although DirecTiVo fan is louder. Very minimal airflow out of the back of the set. No sense of heat either. Is this normal? I would hate to have things start melting down later....

All in all very positive so far. Great looking set in terms of case, and even my wife likes it. She has finally joined in to actively find a stand that she likes. The refund on the Tosh and the much lower price on this set are positives for her as well :).

I have Avia but plan to get DVE as well to tweak. I will probably make a first run at it later this week. If things go well for a couple of months I will likely also get the set ISF'd. The Tosh started showing problems before I got that done, so it never happened.

Oh yes, in terms of the protective screen:

- SSE visible on light backgrounds at current 12' viewing distance. Once set is on stand it will be more like 15' so we will see then. Not really an issue but I can see what everyone has been talking about.

- AR screen pretty much on par with the Tosh. For up front viewing no reflections from open bright windows noticable. On an angle with the windows, however, windows can drown out the image entirely. The same was true with the Tosh (very nice AR screen, IMHO), so I tended to not watch from that angle during certain times of the day. Note that reflections not a factor from two couches, only from recliner (Doh!).

Originally posted by BTDT
...
- Cannot hear fan noise in my environment. Could hear it with the Tosh LCoS, although DirecTiVo fan is louder. Very minimal airflow out of the back of the set. No sense of heat either. Is this normal? I would hate to have things start melting down later....

I can definetly feel heat and hear the fan from the back of the 60" XBR.

Or do we have to rely on the input device for that control? What about the advanced settings for Pro? Can they be used with DVI? For those that are using the Bravo D1 DVD player with the GWIII, are there picture adjustment on the player ?

Originally posted by probepro
I can definetly feel heat and hear the fan from the back of the 60" XBR.
Perhaps another question would be whether the fan runs all of the time or not? I guess I need to look into this more closely.

Originally posted by BTDT
Perhaps another question would be whether the fan runs all of the time or not? I guess I need to look into this more closely.

My fan is on all the time, and continues to run for 1-2 minutes after turnng off the the set.

Ok. I guess I can hear that fan shutting down a bit after the set is turned off as well. My viewing environment is, however, noisy enough I guess to make it a minor factor. You say you can feel heat, but to what extent do you feel the air flow?

I am just being picky here because I suspect that poor heat management is what toasted my Toshiba LCoS over time (it took 4 months to notice any ill effects).

Originally posted by BTDT
Ok. I guess I can hear that fan shutting down a bit after the set is turned off as well. My viewing environment is, however, noisy enough I guess to make it a minor factor. You say you can feel heat, but to what extent do you feel the air flow?

I am just being picky here because I suspect that poor heat management is what toasted my Toshiba LCoS over time (it took 4 months to notice any ill effects).

Well, I can tell there's definitely a slow fan blowing hot air. I would guess the temperature is like 120 degrees F. Definitely warmer than blowing my breath on the back of my hand, but only by a little.

I'm very sensitive to this kind of noise. The noise in mine is very quiet, and you definitely can't hear it when any music/soundtrack is playing. I can just barely hear it 6 feet away. It's kind of a fluttering noise instead of a high-pitched whirr so common in electronics fans.

I've got a Radeon card and have been trying to get this to display on the 60" XBR. Abybody succeed at this? What settings have people used?

Can I a pdf version of the 60XBR950's manual anywhere online? The tv is being delivered this Friday and I want to get a head start on it.

Thanks

Try www.gwinnetttv.com. Find their sales page for the 60XBR950. A link to the users manual is near the bottom of the page.

I received my 70XBR Tuesday of last week and wanted to report on some observations. It was bought at GG in Palo Alto at a very fair price. I got the five year warranty for $400.

1) Best picture so far is with a RP-91 running interlaced.
2) Contrast ratio visibly superior to my G15 projector that was measured at 750:1, and ran on a 100" grayhawk.
3) Contrast easily equal to or better than my NEC MP2 50" plasma.
4) Glare off the screen in a very bright room (large windows on three sides) during the day mandated some window covering.
5) Absolutely excellent picture, am now selling G-15 set-up.
6) Tweeked a bit with AVIA to good effect, brightness and picture both down 30 to 40%.
7) Overscan OOTB pretty bad at 7% and 5%, and not enough adjustment to get it down closer to desired levels. Still overscans 2.5 to 5%.
8) S-video on Direct TV satellite signal is watchable, but just. It seems equal to or perhaps slightly better than the G-15 which was running through a Faroudja NRS.
9) Picture quality very sensitive to viewing distance. We started out at 11 feet and are now very happy at 13 feet.
10) Have not yet tried DVI but will in a few weeks.
11) Easy to move and not that heavy.

I hope this is helpful.

Originally posted by ArchieGates
Can someone please recommend a nice, affordable DVD player to use with my new XBR 950? Right now, I'm using a four year old Pioneer interlaced player. I've seen the Panasonic recommended before, but I can't find those for sale. If you can provide a link to where to buy a player, that would be great.

Also, what are some recommended component cables that are affordable. Does anyone use those "Acoustic Research" ones at Best Buy? Currently I'm using the RCA brand cables that they carry at Wal Mart. Are those sufficient, or would I notice a picture quality increase with better cables?

Try the Momitsu V880 at www.********.com and run it straight DVI.

Very nice

Originally posted by DennyL
I1) Best picture so far is with a RP-91 running interlaced.

I've also found "interleaved" to be best with the demo 70" unit in the Palo Alto store using their Sony 400 disk DVD changer. Interleaved was also best in the Santa Clara GG's with their 60" XBR and a Sony DVD player from a home theater package.

I was thinking of the 60" XBR viewed from 9-10' but it's very hard to evaluate in stores.

I just got my 70" XBR connected via V880 DVI to the TV. The V880 can connect at 720p or 1080i. What should I choose? Also, how can you tell what the resolution rate is when you are watching a movie or TV channel?

Thanks

After 2 years of waiting, watching and researching I have finally decided that the 60XBR is the TV for me. Hopefully I'll have everything in place for me to take delivery of one by January. I have played with this set extensively (at various CCs in Houston) and like many here, am impressed by the picture quality and features.

I especially like the digital channel guide but my one gripe with it is that it changes the channels as you scroll down the list of channel numbers. I would have though that it would make better sence for it to stay on whatever channel you were watching even as you scroll down the channel guide and then only change channels once you push select or enter just like the guide on the new Mitsu TVs or on Time Warner's digital cable box. I'd appreciate any comments or thoughts on this. Does this seem like someting that could be corrected with a firmware upgrade? Wishful thinking?

Has anyone looked at any test patterns and checked out the xbr with regards to convergence? I just was going through DVE and put up one of their grid patterns and saw noticeable (is that redundant?) misconvergence in the upper right which extended about a third of the way over and almost all the way down the screen. The center looked "okay" with the left having the best convergence. Just wondering if I should get a replacement (well I probably will anyway since my screen (the actual screen) is crooked). The sony spec page claims "No Misconvergence" but I also realize that with 3 panels that might be hard to achieve. The misconvergence of which I speak is about 2 pixels wide and is visible is all picture modes (source was 480p via DVD player).

Doug

I'm sure some of you have seen the "GWIII buzz" thread, http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=316921. Anyone experience the buzzing problem or LAMP fault indicator on the XBR 60 or 70?

Thanks!

Not same lamp light flashing. The green light was flashing for some time and the TV didn't turn on. Removed the plug from the power strip and plugged it to the wall it worked fine. Dont know why?

Originally posted by frottage
Has anyone looked at any test patterns and checked out the xbr with regards to convergence? I just was going through DVE and put up one of their grid patterns and saw noticeable (is that redundant?) misconvergence in the upper right which extended about a third of the way over and almost all the way down the screen. The center looked "okay" with the left having the best convergence. Just wondering if I should get a replacement (well I probably will anyway since my screen (the actual screen) is crooked). The sony spec page claims "No Misconvergence" but I also realize that with 3 panels that might be hard to achieve. The misconvergence of which I speak is about 2 pixels wide and is visible is all picture modes (source was 480p via DVD player).

Doug
Two pixels wide is definite misalignment I think, and I would go for a replacement. What you will typically see in this and other technologies (even DLP) is a slight hazing of red/green on the edges of pixels. This is an optical thing and not misalignment. I have this very slightly myself, but not the wholesale problem you are having. I am surprised you couldn't see this in normal viewing.

Originally posted by BTDT
Two pixels wide is definite misalignment I think, and I would go for a replacement. What you will typically see in this and other technologies (even DLP) is a slight hazing of red/green on the edges of pixels. This is an optical thing and not misalignment. I have this very slightly myself, but not the wholesale problem you are having. I am surprised you couldn't see this in normal viewing.

Yeah, it if was just "hazy" I wouldn't complain, but you can see a good 2 pixels worth of green and purple to the right/left of a white vertical bar using the test patterns. The center is more acceptable (just slight hazy) with the left size being right on (no apparent "haziness")...I'll try to post a screen shot later today/tonight.

Just wondering how uniform other sets converge.

Doug

I think that "perfect alignment" on these sets tends to be spot-on alignment in the middle with progressively greater fringing of color as you go to the outside of the image. The fringing at the worst should be much less than a pixel in width, which makes it invisible beyond a foot or so.

BTDT, seeing as you're probably pretty sensitive to color impurity problems (as that was one of the things on the LCOS set with the 'racetrack' effect IIRC) and you've also got a 60XBR950 I figure you're the perfect person to ask. Of course everyone else with an XBR950 set can feel free to answer as well. :D My 60XBR950 has a moderate amount of the uneven color problem in dark scenes (see this (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?threadid=318726) thread if you don't remember what I'm talking about). It's not enough to drive me to say the set's unacceptable by any means, unless of course I know that it's not as bad on other peoples' sets or it doesn't even exist on them. In that case I'll insist on an exchange with CC. ;)

Note that if you look at rootkid's pictures you'll have to turn the brightness way up on your monitor to notice what he's talking about as his camera didn't do a very good job of picking it up. I don't think it means much due to the bright lighting, but I couldn't detect any of this issue on the 42WE610 or the 70XBR950 set up in CC last night. :p

JUST got the 60XBR950. A couple of questions to save time going thru the 120 page manual:

1. How to tell if a station is HD? Easy for 5.1 OTA vs. 5 Cable here, just put up PIP and note the difference in image and size. But 75.1 Cable SEEMS HD, but how to confirm?

2. Switching channels on OTA. I get one HD channel, 5.1. If I press the Channel up/down toggle, it doesn't change, but I CAN enter a channel and get it (but due to lack of antenna, the set hasn't "seen" those channels on autoscan yet ... soon to be fixed with a proper antenna).

Thanks

Originally posted by BTDT
I think that "perfect alignment" on these sets tends to be spot-on alignment in the middle with progressively greater fringing of color as you go to the outside of the image. The fringing at the worst should be much less than a pixel in width, which makes it invisible beyond a foot or so.

So having near perfect convergence on thel left, bearly visible fringing inthe center, and visible (at a foot) misconvergence on the right is probably not design intent.

Doug

Originally posted by frottage
So having near perfect convergence on thel left, bearly visible fringing inthe center, and visible (at a foot) misconvergence on the right is probably not design intent.

Doug I'd say so, mine is basically perfect in the center and off by about a half-pixel or so in each of the corners (which is where it's at its worst, which is for all intents and purposes perfect IMO).

Can anyone tell me about how much overscan they are seeing with their units? How much is considered acceptable? Is anyone seeing the picture shifted left or right more than can be compensated with the controls?

Is any of this addressable through the Service Menu?

Thanks!

Originally posted by Googer
BTDT, seeing as you're probably pretty sensitive to color impurity problems (as that was one of the things on the LCOS set with the 'racetrack' effect IIRC) and you've also got a 60XBR950 I figure you're the perfect person to ask.
Googer:

I haven't noticed this as yet on my set, but then again I haven't explicitly looked for it. I have, on a black screen or dark scene from a normal sitting position, quickly scanned for any color uniformity issues, but none were apparent in at least that casual testing.

This is on my list of things to check out more closely this weekend.

Mine appears to be slight off-center to the left; the Game Control (for horizontal centering) is plenty to take care of it. There are also plenty of service menu items that play around with sizing (via the scaler, not adjusting the optics) and centering. I'd think that if you're willing to tinker around you should be able to get it down to a very small amount of overscan (or even none if you want) fairly easily.

Originally posted by frottage
So having near perfect convergence on thel left, bearly visible fringing inthe center, and visible (at a foot) misconvergence on the right is probably not design intent.

Doug
I will say....no.

Originally posted by DennyL
Can anyone tell me about how much overscan they are seeing with their units? How much is considered acceptable? Is anyone seeing the picture shifted left or right more than can be compensated with the controls?

Is any of this addressable through the Service Menu?

Thanks!
Someone posted some thoughts on this in a "tweaks" thread yesterday I think. The overscan is somewhat significant, and apparently the adjustments did not allow it to be eliminated entirely. I haven't checked any of this myself.

Originally posted by roblake
JUST got the 60XBR950. A couple of questions to save time going thru the 120 page manual:

1. How to tell if a station is HD? Easy for 5.1 OTA vs. 5 Cable here, just put up PIP and note the difference in image and size. But 75.1 Cable SEEMS HD, but how to confirm?

2. Switching channels on OTA. I get one HD channel, 5.1. If I press the Channel up/down toggle, it doesn't change, but I CAN enter a channel and get it (but due to lack of antenna, the set hasn't "seen" those channels on autoscan yet ... soon to be fixed with a proper antenna).

Thanks
1. Good question. On the Guide an HD channel will typically display with a .1 or .2 behind it. Other than that I think the only visual indication is better PQ :). My DTC-100 used to tell me what format I was looking at, but I don't think there is anything like that for the Sony's built-in tuner.

2. This is normal. Until I executed the "Add Digital Channels" scan I could go up/down to anything digital. The scan itself too only a couple of minutes (even though the message said it could take 30!). Currently I only have digitial channels programmed in and haven't bothered to add the analog. These will seamlessly mix together in the Guide and channel up/down functions once you are done.

Welcome to the party!