Greenville, SC - HDTV [Text View] - Page 14

StrangeCock

07-12-06, 08:15 PM

Today I had an appointment with charter to install a cablecard in my tv scheduled between 8-12. I left my phone upstairs when I got up at 7:30 and when I went upstairs at 8:05 I had two missed calls and a new voicemail. The voicemail said that since I missed my precall I would have to reschedule.

I set this appointment up over a week ago. (And used a holiday at work to have today off.) At this point I am semi-furious but not steaming. When I call to see if they can still get the technician over today, they told me that the technician had already been to my house and they couldn't come back. I would have to reschedule and the earliest date is another week.

So it seems that the technician pulled up into my drive away at 8 am called my phone, no answer, and left. Without ringing the doorbell. There were three cars outside the house!

If I had any other options I would cancel charter today. I have too many trees to go the dish route and charter is the only cable company in the area.

Hahaha...good luck with that. True story: exactly two years ago, I got my HDTV. So I called up Charter to get a CableCard. I had to TELL THEM what it was. Needless to say, as Charter's first CableCard user in Greenville County, things did not go well. It took about 4 months to get in working properly. Then it stopped working a few weeks later. So I said screw it and got a box.

And the best time to schedule a Charter appointment is Sunday morning.

ckeegan

07-13-06, 08:41 AM

Hahaha...good luck with that. True story: exactly two years ago, I got my HDTV. So I called up Charter to get a CableCard. I had to TELL THEM what it was.

I feel your pain. I had been on the waiting list with Charter for 4.5 months for a DVR box, and finally got word (through the grapevine) that they had received shipment of 3,000 new DVR boxes that very day (7-3). After several transfers and about 30 minutes I finally got someone in the S'ville call center who actually knew what I was talking about. This whole time I'm thinking and hoping new technology was the reason for the delay (i.e. Moxi II by Samsung, or at least Moxi Mate capable, etc). Appointment time (1-3p) came and went, called to confirm, they said soon. 4:30, called again, and found out my appointment had vanished from the system. 6:00, eating dinner...doorbell! Same crappy box they've had out since '04. No HDMI, no increased storage, no mate capability, but wasted even more space with crappy games like the ability to throw virtual tomatoes at people on TV.

enoree

07-13-06, 09:12 AM

Charter is one of the worst rated cable-co's in the country. The more people dump them and go to sat. the better the message will get to them. My kid's had a snowy pic on their HDTV when they had charter on the analog's and they were told it was their set not the hook up or anything charter did, they dumped them and went to E* and guess what, NO SNOW.

onslowtn

07-13-06, 01:20 PM

Is the analog shutoff deadline in 2009 truly a hard date or will stations be able to ask for special temporary authority to operate analog signals months after that?

enoree

07-13-06, 01:30 PM

hard date as far as what has been put out.

sfollenius

07-15-06, 01:30 PM

Enoree's opinion does not necessarily reflect the views of the rest of us in this group ;-). I'm a Charter customer and am more than happy with the service and selection.

Charter has right now HDNet, HDNet Movies, ESPN-HD, Discovery-HD, HBO-HD, SHO-HD, Cinemax-HD, UniversalHD, TNT-HD, and the locals (whereas D* still has not even announced inclusion of HD locals in our market).

The only channel D* offers that Charter doesn't is ESPN2-HD, and they don't have Cinemax. D* or E*'s DVR might be better, but D* also "scales down" their HD channel resolutions (see the HD Lite threads in the Programming forum) so you're not getting the same quality.

I've looked at switchingy many times but after seeing D*'s HD quality in person I always stick with cable.

I switched from Charter to E*. I have the HD-DVR 622 and it is awesome, kicks Moxi butt. I am connected via Components and the Pict. Qual is way better on the SD content vs. Charter.

PLUS, GREENVILLE/SPARTABURG DMA is on the list to be added. Hopefully we get all 4 networks soon!

candler

07-15-06, 04:17 PM

Hey guys. I live in Candler and wondered what it would take to view OTA HD signals from the South Carolina networks. I haven't bought an antenna yet, and am wondering what antenna would do the job. My house is up on a hill, but surrounded by trees. At present, I have a little Terk Electronics VHF antenna that's not very good, but it does get WLOS and PBS. Also get WSPA's channel 7 Weather channel. I think I get WB, The Tube, and UPN as well. I'd like to see some NBC, CBS, and FOX. Do HDTV's need a special antenna to pick up the locals? Am I too far away? I guess I'm probably about 10 miles west of Asheville, but close to Mt. Pisgah, which is where the WLOS tower is. Just wondering before I go out and make a buying mistake.

Thanks all,

Candler

gjlowe

07-15-06, 09:42 PM

candler

07-15-06, 11:35 PM

Well I have an 8 bay CM antenna with a Winegard preamp, and I still only get PBS and WLOS. I too am in Candler, near Enka middle school. Since Charter has the rest of the locals that I care about now, I don't bother to try getting the South Carolina stations anymore. In fact, the last time I tried a regular indoor antenna, even WLOS and PBS wouldn't come in, but that was before they turned up their power.

Thanks for the reply. I have Charter as well, but just the regular cable box. When I try to tune in the HDTV versions of the locals, I get sound with a black screen. My HDTV accepts a CableCard. Do I need the CableCard instead, or perhaps a different cable box? If so, if you're looking at WLOS on Charter and WLOS OTA is the quality any different? If not, and I can go with a CableCard or different box, I might spring for it. I'm sure there's probably extra $$$ involved, probably an "HD pack" from Charter...etc...etc...etc.

Oxb

07-16-06, 11:17 AM

Thanks for the reply. I have Charter as well, but just the regular cable box. When I try to tune in the HDTV versions of the locals, I get sound with a black screen. My HDTV accepts a CableCard. Do I need the CableCard instead, or perhaps a different cable box? If so, if you're looking at WLOS on Charter and WLOS OTA is the quality any different? If not, and I can go with a CableCard or different box, I might spring for it. I'm sure there's probably extra $$$ involved, probably an "HD pack" from Charter...etc...etc...etc.

It sounds like you are trying to view the HD channels with thr regular cable box. That will not work. As you have found out you will hear the sound but there will be no picture.

There are 2.5 ways for you to get the HD offerings from Charter.

1. Get a HD cable box from Charter

2. Get a CableCard instead of the box. You would be able to get all of the HD channels but no guide, PPV or VOD. That may not matter to you.

2.5 Bypass the cable box and connect the cable directly to the television without a CableCard. That would allow you to receive the HD versions of WYFF, WSPA, WHNS and WUNF along with their respective subchannels. You would also get a few misc other channels such as the Music Choice channels and your neighbors VOD selections.

With choices #1 & 2 yes, there are $s involved and there is a HD pack etc.

One thing that you will not be doing right now is comparing OTA WLOS-HD to one carried by Charter. Due to a p***ing match between most cable companies and Sinclair - the owner of WLOS they are not carried by Charter.

candler

07-16-06, 01:05 PM

It sounds like you are trying to view the HD channels with thr regular cable box. That will not work. As you have found out you will hear the sound but there will be no picture.

There are 2.5 ways for you to get the HD offerings from Charter.

1. Get a HD cable box from Charter

2. Get a CableCard instead of the box. You would be able to get all of the HD channels but no guide, PPV or VOD. That may not matter to you.

2.5 Bypass the cable box and connect the cable directly to the television without a CableCard. That would allow you to receive the HD versions of WYFF, WSPA, WHNS and WUNF along with their respective subchannels. You would also get a few misc other channels such as the Music Choice channels and your neighbors VOD selections.

With choices #1 & 2 yes, there are $s involved and there is a HD pack etc.

One thing that you will not be doing right now is comparing OTA WLOS-HD to one carried by Charter. Due to a p***ing match between most cable companies and Sinclair - the owner of WLOS they are not carried by Charter.

Thanks again for the reply. Could I ask a few more questions? So does Charter's HD "look" as good as their OTA WYFF WHNS and WUNF counterparts? Do I have too many mountains between Candler and Greenville/Spartanburg to not even worry about ever picking up OTA WYFF, WHNS, and WSPA? Seems like I probably do, unless these stations have translators here. In that case, I'm wondering what kind of antenna to get, and if I need one on top of the house with a pole like I had when I was five years old :-)

I'm happy as all get out to even get WLOS-HD with the little Terk powered antenna that I have on top of the TV.

I was reading last night and it looks like you can upgrade to HD for $3.00 more a month. I wonder if the CableCard (since it doesn't do VOD or PPV) is any less money a month. I like the guides, but could live without them, but if the HD cable box is the same cost as the CableCard, then I'd just assume to have the guides. Also, I'm wondering if I just plug in the cable and bypass the box, seems like I'd lose the digital channels that are pretty high up on the channel list. I guess that's what the CableCard is for huh?

Oxb

07-16-06, 04:21 PM

I have compared WYFF, WHNS and WUNF OTA to Charter's offerings and as near as I can tell they look the same.

As for your antenna, the first thing that I would do is to check out Antennaweb (http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/welcome.aspx) and see what is available at your location. Be sure to tweak your location on the map if you need to because it does take elevations into account. As for translators, I do not know of any local digital translators in this area. We will see what happens in this area in the future. Somehow, I do not think that WLOS will be very interested in those seeing how they let the Sylva viewers just eat cake. (i.e. subscribe to cable or satellite after they lost the lease on the translator site) Of course that would not affect you since you live in Candler. You should be able to get WLOS without an antenna. Maybe even without a television. :)

If you have a splitter and a couple short lengths of coax hanging around, you might try splitting the cable and let both your cable box and television be hooked up to it. That will let you continue to receive the scrambled digital channels that you currently receive and use your internal QAM tuner to get 4 local channels.

jtdwab

07-16-06, 09:15 PM

Is the analog shutoff deadline in 2009 truly a hard date or will stations be able to ask for special temporary authority to operate analog signals months after that?

One thing I have wondered, as I have not taken the time to read all the law, is wether they are required to stop filming in analog. I am betting that all the law requires is that they stop transmitting an analog signal. In the long run all they have to do is start sending out their current programing from a digital transmitter. I think everybody assumes that in 09 the world will be presented in 1080 from then on out. So has anybody read this thing and knows what the requirements really are.

foxeng

07-16-06, 09:23 PM

The law only states that analog transmission will cease on Feb 17, 2009. It states nothing about a change to HD only.

Adam Tyner

07-17-06, 08:56 PM

I hadn't seen WYCW -- formerly WASV and now the Greenville DMA's CW affiliate -- mentioned in a while. They've been sending out a 1080i signal for a while but were still upconverting their programming the last time I flipped that way. Just gave it another look and noticed that they're passing network programming in full HD now.

Maybe no one else cares, but that means I finally get my weekly fix of Veronica Mars in high definition. :D

StrangeCock

07-17-06, 10:28 PM

jtbell

07-18-06, 12:40 AM

they're [WYCW 62-1] passing network programming in full HD now.

I happened to notice it for the first time tonight myself. I've been traveling since late June and came home just last night, so I'm wondering when it started. Someone posted here a while back that they were aiming for July 1. Did anyone notice it before tonight?

calvinb

07-18-06, 08:57 AM

Adam, what channel are you watching CW on? OTA, satellite, or cable?

StrangeCock

07-18-06, 02:27 PM

Adam, what channel are you watching CW on? OTA, satellite, or cable?

I can't speak for Adam, but I'm picking it up on 62.1.

FYI...they're also running two more Season 2 Veronica Mars episodes tonight, starting at 8:00.

Adam Tyner

07-18-06, 08:46 PM

Yeah, I was watching it over-the-air.

StrangeCock

07-18-06, 09:33 PM

Yeah, I was watching it over-the-air.

Hmmm...it's not in HD tonight. Maybe it was just a test.

Apps1

07-19-06, 09:23 AM

Hmmm...it's not in HD tonight. Maybe it was just a test.

The 8:00pm episode was not in HD, but when I flipped over to check out the 9:00pm show it was in HD.

jtbell

07-19-06, 10:01 AM

Maybe their normal programming on Monday at 8 is in SD and they didn't think to flip the switch to HD until the normal Veronica Mars timeslot.

On another subject, shortly after 10 last night, the HD signal disappeared on WYFF during CSI:SVU. I turned to WIS and they were showing a letterboxed upconvert of the SD feed. After a while the HD picture came back. So it was a network glitch, and not a problem at WYFF.

jtbell

07-21-06, 01:45 AM

WBSC(WMYA)-DT no longer has its channel all to itself. "TheTube" is now on 40-2 as well as on 13-3.

dolphan

07-23-06, 09:17 AM

Anyone picking up Digital OTA stations from around the Lake Lure, NC area with an antenna? If not do you think it is possible from there?

Perry T

07-23-06, 10:04 AM

I installed a Channel Master 7777 amplifier and it improved my signals greatly. I have added a splitter to add a second tv. The downstairs lead which comes right out of the splitter to an H20 receiver has good signal. The run upstairs is about 50 ft. to a H10-250 and I have a terrible signal strength. I am guessing I will need to add a signal amplifier inline for the upstairs line only? Is this correct? Also I get 21.1 at about 80% but I cannot get but about 12% for 13.1 . Aren't both transmitters located near each other?

PT

jerry birdwell

07-23-06, 02:04 PM

Anyone picking up Digital OTA stations from around the Lake Lure, NC area with an antenna? If not do you think it is possible from there?
Check Antennaweb, if you have an address. There are a great range of elevations in the area and the location will be a major factor. Certainly down near the town or lake will be difficult. Best bet is to wait for HD LIL from a satellite provider, and again an unobstructed view of the south-southwest sky is important.

jerry birdwell

07-28-06, 09:41 AM

I installed a Channel Master 7777 amplifier and x x x I am guessing I will need to add a signal amplifier inline for the upstairs line only? Is this correct? Also I get 21.1 at about 80% but I cannot get but about 12% for 13.1 . Aren't both transmitters located near each other?

PT
The amount of loss you imply in the 50' run of RG6 is excessive. Something is wrong...are you using a standard splitter--not a uhf-vhf separator, relatively new RG-6 coax, good tight connections? I would not think it wise to use a second amplifier until you determine why you have the signal loss.

As for the "close" locations of the two stations, in this mountainous area it can be very significant depending on your location. You should check AntennaWeb for your signal potential and obstructions between you and the two transmitters.

blooker

07-28-06, 09:47 AM

I've just finished a run to one of the antennas using RG11 that worked out for receiving 4.1DT. It's heavy, thick coax, but the loss is minimal on long runs and adapters are necessary to terminate in an F connector.

jtbell

07-30-06, 04:07 AM

I get 21.1 at about 80% but I cannot get but about 12% for 13.1 . Aren't both transmitters located near each other?

You're actually significantly closer to WHNS-21 than to WLOS-13. Also it looks like the front line of mountains is blocking WLOS significantly for you, whereas you may have a clear line of sight to WHNS.

I recently compiled and installed a program called 'splat' (http://www.qsl.net/kd2bd/splat.html) which calculates signal propagation according to the Longley-Rice model, using terrain data that can be downloaded from NASA. Among other things, it produces "coverage maps" which shows the signal loss (in dB) between a transmitter and all the points in a specified radius, using a series of color bands at 10-dB intervals.

I wish I could post a complete map out to 90 miles on my Web site, but it's about 40 megabytes uncompressed, and even as a reasonable quality JPEG it's 10-15 megabytes! Instead, I've posted a section of each that basically runs from Clemson to Greer:

WLOS (http://web.presby.edu/~jtbell/tv/wlos-mini.jpg)

WHNS (http://web.presby.edu/~jtbell/tv/whns-mini.jpg)

They show city and town boundaries, so you might be able to locate yourself fairly well. The color code goes like this:

dB - color
120 - yellow
130 - light green
140 - green
150 - dark green
160 - teal
170 - dull blue
180 - dull blue-violet
190 - solid blue
200 - dull lavender
210 - lavender

The dB is the amount of signal loss from the transmitter to the point in question, so a smaller number indicates a stronger signal, for the same transmitter power. It looks like most of Easley is in the 120 dB band for WHNS, and in the 160 dB band for WLOS. The two stations run at the same power, so your signal from WLOS could be 40 dB weaker than from WHNS!

Down here in Clinton, I'm in the 140 dB band for both stations, but near the inner edge for WHNS and the outer edge for WLOS, so I might have about a 10 dB difference. In practice, I have to fuss with the antenna orientation for WHNS, I think because of interference from analog channel 57 in Columbia. WLOS comes in very reliably for me, without any fuss, even though its signal isn't quite as strong.

blooker

07-30-06, 07:30 AM

jtbell,
Great post!

foxeng

07-30-06, 12:53 PM

I recently compiled and installed a program called 'splat' (http://www.qsl.net/kd2bd/splat.html) which calculates signal propagation according to the Longley-Rice model, using terrain data that can be downloaded from NASA. Among other things, it produces "coverage maps" which shows the signal loss (in dB) between a transmitter and all the points in a specified radius, using a series of color bands at 10-dB intervals.

I see that splat is written on Linux Slackware. What OS did you complie it on and what did you do to get it to run? I am running Fedora Core myself.

jtbell

07-30-06, 03:22 PM

foxeng

07-30-06, 04:38 PM

At home, I use Mac OS X 10.3. The "build" files that are supposed to automate the compiling and linking process didn't work "as is" because they (a) use a compiler option that my compiler doesn't recognize, and (b) one of the system libraries didn't link properly for some reason. I simply omitted that compiler option and used a different way of linking the library (gave the full path to the library /usr/lib/libbz2.a instead of using the compiler option -lbz2).

At my office, under OS X 10.4, the library linked OK but I think I still had to omit that compiler option.

After that, the programs run OK at the command line, except that so far I can't work in any directory other than the one where the terrain and configuration data files are kept. You're supposed to be able to put the path to that directory in a ".splat_path" file in your home directory, but it doesn't work for me. So splat looks for the data files only in the current working directory.

HHMM. Interesting. I got it to work fairly easily, once I got all of the data files for terrain and cities loaded. I had all of the libraries needed already loaded. I am using the splat-work directory and just writing the full path name, /usr/local/bin/splat and that is working just fine. I haven't tried the the .splat_path yet. Just wanted to see what it would look like and see if it is really worth all of the other things to make life easier. As I am typing this, it is compiling the first Longely-Rice map now. It should be finished in about 10 minutes and then I will know if I have it set up correctly.

Thanks for the link. I missed Doug Lung's article on it in January. Wished I had seen it. I really needed it about 4 months ago, but better late than never!! I wish it did do more things like if you enter the ERP it would calculate that, but I can convert the db loss to ERP manually. It just won't look as nice in db loss.

Gary J

08-01-06, 07:50 PM

I bought a condo in Cashiers, NC and the cable company is Northland. Anyone know about them? Any HD channels? I hear they offer triple play of TV, internet and digital phone.

Don F.

08-02-06, 10:44 PM

I bought a condo in Cashiers, NC and the cable company is Northland. Anyone know about them? Any HD channels? I hear they offer triple play of TV, internet and digital phone.

Gary, I have been waiting for someone to respond to your question, but there must a problem somewhere. Here in my little town they are in color.

Good luck.

Gary J

08-03-06, 07:02 AM

Do they at least answer phone calls?

Don F.

08-03-06, 06:33 PM

Do they at least answer phone calls?

Yes, but their "hold" button is at the top of the food chain. You may want to look at one of the sat systems. Of course no hd locals there yet. I like channel master. Big brother in D.C. says you can install an antenna anywhere it is needed to receive ota stations. Convenants will not prevent the need to receive.

Good luck.

jerry birdwell

08-03-06, 07:16 PM

Yes, but X X X Big brother in D.C. says you can install an antenna anywhere it is needed to receive ota stations. Convenants will not prevent the need to receive.

Good luck.
True...if you own the property...but there are some conditions with respect to apartments and condos. Just check the FCC rules before creating a neighborhood flap.

blooker

08-06-06, 08:52 AM

IMHO, if antennas are a problem, you live in the wrong neighborhood. :)

Try the below site for the straight scoop, especially the recent amendment for renters and non-owners:

http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/consumerdish.pdf

ministreak

08-09-06, 02:32 PM

HI,
Is there anyone that lives in Marion NC that is able to receive OTA HDTV? Also wondering if one needs a special antenna for the HD or will one of the old ones work?... Just wondering before I buy... I currently am able to pick up some analog channels via rabbit ears but haven't been able to get any DTV yet. Are the stations in my area just turning on the DTV in prime time or what? Thanks...

SmittS

08-10-06, 11:55 PM

I just recently had DirecTV installed in my apartment in Clemson(Tiger Town Village if you are familiar with the area) and am trying to get channels OTA with a crappy Terk HDTVi indoor antenna. I've mananged to get WHNS and WYFF at around 70% signal strength but am having trouble getting a steady signal from the CBS affiliate. I have an attic that I may be able to mount a larger UHF antenna in. Any tips? I'm a big noob to all of this so keep it simple please! Oh and are there any plans to start broadcasting locals in HD in our area?

Edit: I'd like to keep the price of the antenna below $80. I don't need to pick up WLOS. With ABC no longer showing MNF or the BCS I could care less about it, and it sounds like picking up WLOS is a crapshoot anyways.

John Coffey

08-11-06, 01:36 AM

I'm not familiar with Clemson's reception (I live in Mauldin) - however, I do have an antenna on my patio for high-def reception, and it seems to work fairly well.

What I have is a preamp hooked into a Channel Master #3021 (you can see it at: http://www.starkelectronic.com/uhf.htm). It picks up all the locals, as well as some of the Charlotte and Columbia channels. I like it better than the yagi I used to have mounted - simply because it has a wider beamwidth & I could avoid using a rotor. This antenna should mount easily in your attic.

Also...check out www.antennaweb.org's antenna recommendations for your address. (Results are below). It looks like you have a pretty good spread between towers, so you may wish to consider some of the wider beamwidth antennas if you can get enough signal.

* yellow - uhf WHNS-DT 21.1 FOX ASHEVILLE NC 19° 35.5 57
* yellow - uhf WYFF-DT 4.1 NBC GREENVILLE SC 28° 32.2 59
* red - vhf WNTV-DT 9.1 PBS GREENVILLE SC 58° 30.0 9
* violet - uhf WLOS-DT 13.1 ABC ASHEVILLE NC 10° 51.4 56
* violet - uhf WSPA-DT 7.1 CBS SPARTANBURG SC 47° 45.6 53

natsoundup

08-11-06, 09:13 AM

sure was nice seeing NFL football on Fox in HD last night...

Didn't watch much of the pre-season game...but am looking forward to the regular season.

Lee
Greenville, SC

jerry birdwell

08-11-06, 08:10 PM

HI,
Is there anyone that lives in Marion NC that is able to receive OTA HDTV? Also wondering if one needs a special antenna for the HD x x x Thanks...
Most TV stations in this area are broadcasting a digital signal in addition to their analog transmission. Most are UHF and a good UHF antenna of any brand will do just fine. However, some are better than others and a Channel Master 4 or 8 bay has proven to be very good for the area. The 4-bay can be found for well under your budget.
Having said that, I urge you to check: http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/Welcome.aspx
for digital signals available at your address and the most appropriate antenna size. You should be able to receive both Greenville-Asheville-Spartanburg and Charlotte stations, or more, depending on the mountains between you and the stations. Antennaweb will answer that question. Be aware that some stations will change channels in a couple of years and the mix will include more VHF stations.

Good Luck

ministreak

08-12-06, 08:31 AM

Having said that, I urge you to check: http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/Welcome.aspx
for digital signals available at your address

Thanks Jerry.

I have already checked that site lots of times and it brings up lots of stations. But when I click the Digital Only radio button there is none displayed. Also, among those channels that are displayed, are a mix of UHF & VHF. The Channel Master you suggested is UHF only....

You would think that if I can get a good signal on an analog channel that I could also get it in digital... (I'm only trying rabbit ears right not before I sink any money into an antenna). I seem to get no digital channels in Marion. Where do you suggest that I look for the channel master 8 antenna for a good buy? Thanks :) :)

dolphan

08-12-06, 10:32 AM

I just tried a $25 Radio Shack UHF antenna in Lake Lure NC and get all the Spartanburg digital stations without an amplifier. I have used this antenna in other locations and it always works well. FYI

jerry birdwell

08-12-06, 11:43 AM

jerry birdwell

08-12-06, 11:45 AM

dolphan -- What are the "Spartanberg digital stations"?

dolphan

08-12-06, 03:21 PM

dolphan -- What are the "Spartanberg digital stations"?

My mistake! I meant Charlotte stations. We are getting 3.1, 9.1, 18.1, 36.1, UPN 48.1?, 55.1 and 58.1. Antenna web shows them 58 to 90 miles away! This covers every network.

ministreak

08-12-06, 06:16 PM

ministreak: A quick check indicates you area is basically served by translator stations and there are no digital translators at this time. This indicates there is very little direct reception of the digital transmissions in your area. You probably are receiving analog signals from the local translators. I believe your Designated Market Area is Charlotte, and you may find good information on the Charlotte AVS forum.

Hi Jerry,
I got your eMail, thanks...
I don't understand that about a translator stations. That site says than I am fairly close to some towers (45 to 55 miles). Below is a link to 2150.com on my zipcode of 28752. The information they provide seems to be promising but I'm still not sure about it

http://www.2150.com/broadcast/default.asp?latitude=35%2E6816406&longitude=%2D82%2E0181351&magnetic_north=6&range=60&sort=distance&show_expired=False&show_construction=False&show_analog=False&show_low_power=False&action=Show+Stations

Do you think that the radio button (Show Digital Stations Only) on http://www.antennaweb.org means that it filters the display to show only stations that have digital ONLY…? As opposed to stations which output digital as well as analog? Confusing. I live in an area in which there are many stations around me within a 50-mile radius (as the crow fly’s) and no digital?

Mini
.
.
.
.

jtbell

08-13-06, 01:38 AM

ministreak:

What Jerry means by "translators" is that the stations that serve your area use separate low-power transmitters near Marion, because their main transmitters don't produce a good enough signal there. All the major Greenville/Asheville area stations have several such translators to serve specific towns in the western NC mountains. Occasionally, I see station ID screens on the air that list the translators, and I'm sure I've seen Marion listed on them. These are Greenville/Asheville stations so I'm pretty sure Marion is in the Greenville/Asheville DMA also, not Charlotte.

But as of now, there are translators only for analog signals, not digital ones. Just recently the FCC solicited applications from stations that want to operate digital translators, so it will be a while before digital translators come on line.

A little while ago I posted links to maps (generated by software called SPLAT) that show the relative strengths of signals for a couple of stations in the Greenville to Clemson area. Here are similar maps that include Marion for a few stations, cropped from the huge maps that SPLAT generates:

WSPA 7 (Spartanburg) (http://web.presby.edu/~jtbell/tv/wspa-mini-2.jpg)

WYFF 4 (Greenville) (http://web.presby.edu/~jtbell/tv/wyff-mini-2.jpg)

WBTV 3 (Charlotte) (http://web.presby.edu/~jtbell/tv/wbtv-mini-2.jpg)

The town labels aren't in the right place... look for the irregular blob which represents the Marion city limits, above the group of Marion labels.

For the color key, see my previous posting. To put it in perspective, I have Radio Shack's largest combination VHF/UHF antenna (VU-190XR) on my roof, with a pre-amplifier, and I can usually get reliable reception down to about the dark green range. For these stations, Marion is in the blue and violet ranges, which are even weaker.

ministreak

08-13-06, 09:52 AM

Thanks guys for the valuable information and saving me the cost of a worthless antenna.

I guesss another way to put it is, Maion, NC is just screwed as far as OTA digital reception is concerned. It least for the next few years...

Best Regards,
Mini

jerry birdwell

08-13-06, 11:25 AM

Re Marion, you are in the Asheville-Greenville-Spartanberg ADI and therefore you must have waivers from this area's stations to receive distant HD signals from satellite carriers. Also, AntennaWeb shows your strongest stations as "W43AU, WO8BJ1, WO6AI" which are the way translator stations are designated. Direct transmission from the area stations are designated by their regular call letters and channel numbers, i.e. WSPA 7, and since they are lower on the list they are weaker to receive in your area. The mountains play a major role! HD/DT translators have not been very high on local station's "to-do" list, but that may change now that the FCC has agreed to consider requests. Meanwhile, I would expect this area to get satellite delivered local DT/HD station signals (LIL) within the next year. That probably is your best bet.

Although Marion is at a relatively low elevation, I am surpsrised that the Charlotte stations do not reach your area better. As a matter of fact, one of my most reliable signals is bounced/reflected off a mountain side and with the mountains behind you and a good antenna I would think you would receive some digital signals unless you are very close to major obstructions. RS has a good return policy for antennas that do not work, if you care to experiment...but the $25 CM is an excellent UHF antenna.

Thanks, jtbell, for jumping in with valuable information.

jtbell

08-13-06, 12:47 PM

Jerry raises a good point about reflected signals. I don't know if SPLAT (or rather, the underlying Longley-Rice propagation model) tries to take those into account where appropriate.

ministreak

08-13-06, 02:22 PM

Good thinking about the reflected signals there.

I have a question about the antennas. for my area, do you think that the RS (VU-190XR) antenna would do a better job than the CM 8 bay... Noting that some are in VHF. Or do I even need to worry about that?

Both of these listed above are directional antennas, but is the RS model for longer range or are they equal?

I want to try something because it seems that I should be able to get something don't you think.

Mini

foxeng

08-13-06, 02:28 PM

No Longley-Rice I have seen shows reflections. That is not what it is suppose to show. It shows projected signal strength taking terrain into account from a certain height and location.

I too find it hard to believe that someone in Marion could not receive at least WLOS or UNC from Pisgah, or WHKY or the stations from the Dallas towers.

jerry birdwell

08-13-06, 04:17 PM

The only VHF DT for me is from Greenville (SC), SCETV's Channel 9 near/on Parris Mt. From Charlotte I receive only UHF DT signals. Of course, that will change in the future. My suggestion is that you try the RS antenna, and if poor results, return it. The problem is that you will have no comparison. But if you will read through several local-reception forums, you will find that the CM 4 or 8 bay antennas have proven to be most reliable and stand up well in comparisons.

Also, if you have read through this thread, you know that I have found only one place on 5 acres that can receive all local DT's with very few problems...such as seasonal changes that call for a slight adjustment in the direction my antenna is pointed. That makes a rotor very handy. I have searched over about 150 feet of elevation change and nothing matches about 6' above the corner of my 2nd floor deck and the location is behind many trees in a 180 degree arc, I can visually see only three DT towers some 19-20 miles south and the others are all hidden from sight by ridge lines or dense trees!. Be prepared to do a little searching.

dolphan

08-15-06, 08:46 AM

onslowtn

08-15-06, 08:51 PM

There is a station in Kingsport TN (WKPT) that has a analog low power transmitter in Kingsport in the middle of their full power coverage area. Their full power transmitters are analog 19 and DT 27. This LP translator overlaps WUNF DT in NE Tennessee. WUNF's coverage area actually ends in Kingsport and there is definitely overlap. I am outside of the coverage area of WKPT LP 25, but still get a weak signal and it clearly is making reception of WUNF more difficult. WKPT LP 25 has been operating at reduced power for a few months due to transmitter problems and my WUNF reception has improved greatly. Will WKPT be able to "flash cut" to digital on this same channel given the obvious overlap of coverage areas?

jerry birdwell

08-16-06, 10:41 PM

Hopefully Wayne Estabrooks will jump in here with an evaluation.

PS--Wayne, my reception of WUNF-DT continues to be a challenge, and the only reliable signal is from a highly directional, high gain antenna while WLOS-DT now is 95-100% on both of my antennas.

blooker

08-19-06, 06:52 PM

Anyone receiving PGA via OTA 7-1?

Apps1

08-20-06, 10:27 AM

Anyone receiving PGA via OTA 7-1?

I watched a few minutes yesterday. It was in HD.

lynesjc

08-22-06, 06:18 PM

rchalk

08-22-06, 07:27 PM

Alright, with my CM 4-bay in the attic I am getting solid and consistent reception from ABC, FOX, and NBC. CBS, however, remains a problem.

I believe it is because CBS is the station a little more off-axis than the others. Although the CM 4-bay isn't a highly directional rig, I think this is the problem.

My proposed solution is to get another 4-bay, pointing it directly at the CBS tower and then diplexing the two antenna feeds onto the one line running through my pre-amp and then into my hd tivo.

Any thoughts? I'd rather not mess with a rotor.

If you are going to do this, make sure that the two antennas are the same, and that the two feeders from the antennas to the combiner are EXACTLY the same length, and combine them with a two-way splitter. This will have the result of slightly reducing the signal strength from each antenna, but should result in a pretty good match.

The risk in combining antennas is that, unless the antennas and feed lines are exactly the same, the signals from one can cancel out the signals from the other. In more technical terms, they have to be "in phase" at all frequencies where both antennas can see the same signals.

Don F.

08-22-06, 09:16 PM

jakexxl

08-22-06, 10:30 PM

I am having a slight problem with 7 dt. Their signal has been borderline perfect forever, but lately I have a little video "wiggle" about every 60 seconds. No dropouts, or pixcel drops, for the lack of a better term, just a little wiggle in the picture. My signal runs 95 or higher.
Is it just my line of sight at the present time, or does anyone else have the same problem??

Thanks

I get something similar. I would probably classify it as a bit stronger than a "wiggle" though, at least in my case. There's no audio dropout/delay at all and no "freezing" of the picture ... just about a one-second period of pixelation (or pixel drops? -- not sure how to define it), almost always across the bottom part of the screen. I haven't timed it, but I would guess it happens every couple minutes or so. And has just recently started for me as well. Not sure when it started, since I really don't watch CBS much except for college basketball and NFL -- noticed it this weekend while watching the PGA Championship.

psycle_1

08-26-06, 10:48 AM

Can someone recommend me a setup for Black Mountain, NC 28711? I've gone to antennaweb and it doesn't list any DTV channels, even though I know I can pick them up. I've used a small Terk indoor antenna with my DVR-622 and was able to get WLOS, WYFF, and WHNS, although signal strength was pretty low and unstable. I'm tired of waiting on Dish to start transmitting locals in HD and when I called to ask, they gave me the basic generic answer - "I don't know."

Thanks for the help!

jerry birdwell

08-26-06, 06:28 PM

Can someone recommend me a setup for Black Mountain, NC 28711? I've gone to antennaweb and it doesn't list any DTV channels, x x x
Thanks for the help!

Black Mountain is fairly well blocked from direct signals from the local TV stations. That is why all local stations use translators for serving that area with analog signals. For that reason, Antenna web would not show DT signals. (Antennaweb does not report reflected signals.) Until the stations begin to offer Digital Translators in your area, that will not change. But in my experience (and many others), digital signals often can be received from a bounce off a taller structure in the area...such as a mountain side. Others, as have I, receive signals from across a mountain ridge (known as knife-edge effect). Your best bet is to experiment with a highly endorsed UHF high-gain antenna such as the Channel Master 8 bay that you can find on the Web. (Google search.) A bounced or reflected signal may not be the most stable, but it will get you started. Most likely that is what you are receiving with your present setup. Mount Mitchell behind BM is where I would start searching/scanning for DT signals.
Good luck.

jerry birdwell

08-29-06, 08:45 AM

Yesterday's settlement by Echostar with broadcasters probably will not speed up the HD LIL of local stations, and will result in more homes losing distant network signals. The full report from SkyREPORT:
BREAKING NEWS: Broadcasters Settle with DISH on Distant Nets
Broadcast groups representing TV stations affiliated with ABC, CBS, NBC and Fox said they have agreed to settle an eight-year copyright lawsuit against EchoStar, which operates the DISH Network satellite TV service.
The settlement, announced this morning, would allow EchoStar to continue providing distant ABC, CBS, Fox and NBC stations to eligible customers, but would require EchoStar to terminate service to ineligible customers. As part of the settlement, EchoStar has agreed to expand its delivery of local stations to cover a total of 175 markets during 2006.
EchoStar will also pay local network stations $100 million to help compensate for the alleged harm broadcasters said they have suffered for years resulting from EchoStar's allegedly providing duplicative programming from network stations in distant markets.
The settlement is subject to approval by a federal court in Fort Lauderdale, Fla.

Fox later stated it did NOT agree to the settlement.

blooker

08-29-06, 08:54 AM

Last March, my DTV HD receiver took a lightning strike. I bought an H20 the next day at Best Buy. It turns out the $100 I paid was a 'leasing' fee and I don't own the receiver. Sure enough, when I examined my monthly statement, there's also $5 for leasing. DTV sure slid this under the radar.

lynesjc

08-29-06, 12:03 PM

Now that it appears the Tivo S3 is fast upon us, what is the local experience with Charter on the cablecard front? Good, bad, ugly?

Does Charter implement switched digital video locally?

Do they simulcast analog on digital?

Adam Tyner

08-29-06, 04:47 PM

Does Charter implement switched digital video locally?

Do they simulcast analog on digital?Dunno about CableCard, but Charter at a corporate level was opposed to switched video the last I heard, and although they simulcast in some markets, the Greenville DMA isn't among 'em.

cruxer

08-30-06, 10:02 PM

Is anyone else experiencing audio sync issues with 40.1? I'm using an D* HD10 as a receiver. I just recently (within the last week or 2) noticed that the audio is completely out of sync with the video for HD and non-HD programming. Watching the SD version on 13.2 works fine.

--Cross

Don F.

08-31-06, 05:50 PM

jtdwab

09-01-06, 08:54 AM

Anybody getting WLOS or did the storms knock them out again. I was getting reception the last few months after they got things working better but now I get zero.

Anyone else?

Oxb

09-01-06, 09:02 AM

I glad to hear that it is not just me. I have not been able to receive WLOS in a reliable manner for a week or so.

Apps1

09-01-06, 09:06 AM

Anybody getting WLOS or did the storms knock them out again. I was getting reception the last few months after they got things working better but now I get zero.

Anyone else?

WLOS is coming in fine for me.

hokiefan

09-01-06, 11:35 AM

Hello from Baltimore :).

I am trying to get some info on station WYFF. Do they stretch their 4:3 SD programming to 16:9? I am trying to to determine if this is a Hearst policy or a local one, as our local NBC (WBAL) stretches all their SD content and its really annoying. Thanks for any info you can provide!

Rich

jerry birdwell

09-01-06, 12:03 PM

WYFF monitors this forum and frequently responds to questions. Wait a day or so for an answer.

bstratton1

09-01-06, 03:17 PM

The lip sync problem on 40.1 should be fixed now. We were preparing for our MY40 launch and in the process our audio encoder went Tango Uniform. The tube audio thing is still being researched as much as possible.

Adam Tyner

09-01-06, 03:55 PM

I am trying to get some info on station WYFF. Do they stretch their 4:3 SD programming to 16:9?Not that I've seen.

cruxer

09-01-06, 08:05 PM

jakexxl

09-02-06, 11:29 AM

The Notre Dame at Georgia Tech game is on tonight on WLOS at 8 pm. We're planning on having some people over to watch it (my wife's an ND alum) but I got to thinking that I better check to make sure that it wouldn't be blacked out where we are, which is the Clemson area. I don't know at all how the policy works, but every once in awhile we get Atlanta stuff blacked out here ... for instance, I know Georgia Tech football games on ESPN in the past have been fine, but Braves games on ESPN are sometimes blacked out.

So ... does anyone know for sure if it will be on where I am? Is there a definitive way to find out? Is this particular game even subject to blackout?

Thanks!

Gary J

09-02-06, 01:23 PM

Seems like WLOS would know!

popweaverhdtv

09-02-06, 06:45 PM

I live just outside of Weaverville, NC in the Reems Creek Valley area and finally bought an LCD HDTV (with Built-In HD Tuner). I got the HD Package from Charter and was disappointed to find out that WLOS, WMYA and WYCW weren't available in HD. I gave in and bought an Indoor TV Antenna from RadioShack (VHF/UHD/HD/FM, 22dB amplifier with gain control; Model #15-1878). Being in a lower level apartment with obstructions (i.e. trees) and no clear sky, I was able to get the digital signal from WLOS-DT 13.1, 13.2 and 13.3 (a few bars of signal strength, but a clear picture and dolby digital sound, nevertheless). I do have a few questions and I apologize if these have already been answered within this thread.

1) WLOS is broadcasting in 720p resolution according to the guide on my LCD-TV. I'm watching the UNC football game and it isn't in HD. Is this the choice of ABC or WLOS? Has anyone viewed any programming in HD on WLOS?
2) WLOS-DT 13.2 and 13.3 are stretched from 4:3 to 16:9 (being that it's 480i resolution). Has this always been the case?
3) Anyone read anywhere about whether Charter and WLOS, WMYA and WYCW will agree to carriage of signals in HD? Any online resources are welcome!
4) This isn't a question, but more of a comment that I hope the local stations in this market seriously consider making their translators Digital/HD quickly, as well.

Thank you in advance for any answers that you may be able to give me. I'll be reading through the thread to get caught up with HDTV activity in this market.

Thanks,
PopWeaverHDTV

Don F.

09-03-06, 03:47 PM

1) WLOS is broadcasting in 720p resolution according to the guide on my LCD-TV. I'm watching the UNC football game and it isn't in HD. Is this the choice of ABC or WLOS? Has anyone viewed any programming in HD on WLOS?
Thanks,
PopWeaverHDTV

I didn't see that game, but it may not have been an abc feed. It was probably picked up from Jefferson Pilot, or some other independent producer. I watched most of the Georgia game on 21.1, it was a standard feed on an hd station. Not real pretty. Just a guess on the NC game. You will see many programs produced in standard def, but broadcast by an hd transmitter. I think must receivers identify the actual signal, not the program. But I could be wrong....

I was wrong, found the UNC wed site and abc was the carrier. But as Jerry says below, not all network programs are hd, not to mention in 16.9....

jerry birdwell

09-04-06, 05:23 PM

Ix x x
1) WLOS is broadcasting in 720p resolution according to the guide on my LCD-TV. I'm watching the UNC football game and it isn't in HD. Is this the choice of ABC or WLOS? Has anyone viewed any programming in HD on WLOS?
2) WLOS-DT 13.2 and 13.3 are stretched from 4:3 to 16:9 (being that it's 480i resolution). Has this always been the case?
3) Anyone read anywhere about whether Charter and WLOS, WMYA and WYCW will agree to carriage of signals in HD? Any online resources are welcome!
4) This isn't a question, but more of a comment that I hope the local stations in this market seriously consider making their translators Digital/HD quickly, as well.

Thank you in advance for any answers that you may be able to give me. I'll be reading through the thread to get caught up with HDTV activity in this market.

Thanks,
PopWeaverHDTV

The FCC is just beginning to consider Digital translators.
WLOS has great HD from the ABC network, mostly during prime time. Excellent quality. Most major sports in HD, but not all.

Better hope that 13.2 continues to be SD because 13-1 would suffer if the bandwidth is split for two HD feeds! 13-2 is the Anderson station, and while I cannot receive it, I read above that their HD is good quality...when available.
You should be receiving 33-x (PBS) which comes from the WLOS tower. The mountains south of you probably block WYFF, WHNS and WSPA. all of which have a number of hours of HD during the week.

I suggest you take time to scan through previous pages for other comments regarding local HD and solution to reception problems. You will find comments regarding WLOS owner Sinclair's position regarding HD on cable.

lynesjc

09-05-06, 11:11 AM

1) WLOS is broadcasting in 720p resolution according to the guide on my LCD-TV. I'm watching the UNC football game and it isn't in HD. Is this the choice of ABC or WLOS? Has anyone viewed any programming in HD on WLOS?

The ABC 3:30pm games are typically not in HD. It's an ABC decision, not WLOS. However, the OTA digital feed, even when it is not HD, is noticeably better than the sat feed from D*. You don't realize how bad D*'s SD can look until you compare to OTA digital.

The UNC game was a good example of this.

jakexxl

09-05-06, 04:22 PM

I have a small Terk antenna (don't know the model # offhand) in the attic that picks up pretty much all the OTA channels I want just fine ... all of them except 21-1 (Fox). 4-1, 7-1, and 13-1 all come in with a constant signal strength of at least 80 -- and I never really have problems with any of them. I guess I should mention that I live in the Clemson area. So does anyone else have problems with Fox? Anyone have any suggestions for me? I have a pretty clear shot (little to no trees) between the antenna and the sky.

If anything, I would have figured I would have problems with 13-1 due to the distance but have none whatsoever. Based on the map I get at antennaweb.org, directionally 21-1 falls between 13-1 and 4-1 ... so at least from the little bit of knowledge I have with these things, it would seem that I should be able to get 21-1 just fine. Sometimes, for instance during prime time (not sure if they "turn up" their signal then), it's okay. Definitely hit-and-miss though ... and during the day, including on weekends, it's just awful. Pretty much no signal at all. Any tips?

Don F.

09-05-06, 05:13 PM

LilGator

09-06-06, 10:41 AM

Anyone here in Greenville that can give me some info on Charter HD? Which local networks can I get in HD, and is it possible (I'm just off Wade Hampton/Pleasantburg intersection - two-story house) to get the big four with a decent antenna? And go DishHD for ESPNHD?

* yellow - vhf WNTV-DT 9.1 PBS GREENVILLE SC 325° 4.9 9
* yellow - uhf WSPA-DT 7.1 CBS SPARTANBURG SC 15° 19.9 53
* red - uhf WRET-DT 43 PBS SPARTANBURG SC TBD 95° 30.3 43
* violet - uhf WMYA-DT 40.1 MNT ANDERSON SC 169° 17.2 14
* violet - uhf WGGS-DT 16.1 TBN GREENVILLE SC 324° 4.8 35
* violet - uhf WYFF-DT 4.1 NBC GREENVILLE SC 323° 21.1 59
* violet - uhf WYCW-DT 62.1 UPN ASHEVILLE NC 340° 25.6 45

This shows WYFF-DT, and WSPA-DT, but doesn't show WLOS-DT or WHNS-DT. Will I be able to get those ?

Which would be the more reliable and which would be the cheaper route to get the big four in HD, and then ESPNHD? Charter HD, or DishHD (Bronze)/OTA ...?

If OTA, what's a recommended antenna for where I am? Thanks!

calvinb

09-06-06, 12:55 PM

LG, at this point Charter has NBC, CBS, and Fox. No ABC (WLOS). With a good antenna and possibly a pre-amp, you should "easily" get all the locals (for free), plus various PBS stations 40-1, 62-1, etc. I believe Charter also has ESPN HD (but not ESPN2HD) in their package. As far as an antenna goes, you would not go wrong with a Channel Master 4-bay or 8-bay (8 might be overkill). Bigger is better though. Lots of good info on this forum -some very educated folks around here.

LilGator

09-06-06, 01:31 PM

Thanks calvinb, that's good to hear, it would be awesome to be able to pick up Fox and ABC as well as the other closer towers, I'll give that a shot first with an outdoor UHF on my roof ... then invest in a CM7775 if WLOS is giving me trouble. (7775 is all I need if I only have UHF, right? not the 7777?)

If that goes well, I'll probably just opt for the bronze DishHD and grab ESPNHD/ESPN2HD, it's only $29.95 (10mos.) at the moment...

What about this new CW network ... replacing WB and UPN?

Is Smallville in HD a possibility ? :P

EDIT: Looks like CW launches Sept. 18 on WYCW-DT, what is now/used to be the WASV-DT UPN...

WYCW-DT 62.1 UPN ASHEVILLE NC 340° 25.6 45

should be doable, eh? kewl...

calvinb

09-06-06, 01:40 PM

With ABC carrying CFB in HD every Saturday night (Texas/OSU this weekend) it would indeed be a shame to not get WLOS-DT in some way, shape or form. Fox will have lots of NFL and MLB action also, not to mention the BCS bowls this year. I would get a pre-amp that does both UHF and VHF (if possible?). I have the 7777 and get Fox and ABC very well. I think the story is that more and more digital stations will be going to VHF in the coming years. Maybe someone else can help me with that.

LilGator

09-06-06, 01:49 PM

Gotcha, makes sense ...

And WHNS is broadcasting HD (720p), correct? Prison Break ... 24 in January ... NFC NFL action here in a bit, yeah?

Hmm, didn't know about VHF being used for DT ... why is that ?

skull1971

09-06-06, 02:52 PM

brpc

09-06-06, 03:09 PM

lynesjc

09-06-06, 03:26 PM

I have no problem picking up WLOS in HD with Off Air indoor Terk antenna. Does anyone know if Charter is going to add ESPN 2 HD? I was told by service rep that ESPN 2 & another HD channel would be next added channels(this was back in July)

It's really surprising how bad Charter's HD offerings are. No ESPN2HD is a big deal. You know you're bad when even D* has more HD...

lynesjc

09-06-06, 03:26 PM

LilGator

09-06-06, 03:35 PM

whoa.. huge thread.. newbie poster here but long time reader.. we used to live in Raliegh-Durham-Fayetteville area so I knew I could get hdtv channels from Time Warner but
we recently moved to yancey country north east of Asheville, nc.. we live in Burnsville, NC and of course our cable company (country cable *yes country* lol) doesnt provide hdtv channels at all.. does anyone else live in this area and can we receive the hdtv channels from greenville, sc area? i wanted to purchase a 42" lcd hdtv soon or possible a dlp but if i cant get any hdtv channels.. i guess my xbox 360 and other video games will have to suffice :) (currently still using old sony trinitron so i really need an upgrade)

thanks

Ouch, antennaweb isn't showing any Digital stations in your range ...

green - uhf W67DV 67 PBS BURNSVILLE NC 5° 2.9 67
lt green - vhf W02AT 2 CBS BURNSVILLE NC 5° 2.9 2
blue - vhf W12AU 12 ABC BURNSVILLE NC 5° 2.8 12
blue - vhf WJHL 11 CBS JOHNSON CITY TN 19° 38.0 11
blue - vhf WCYB 5 NBC BRISTOL VA 21° 39.6 5
blue - vhf WETP 2 PBS SNEEDVILLE TN 310° 59.6 2
blue - vhf W09AS 9 NBC BURNSVILLE NC 5° 2.9 9
violet - uhf WVLR 48 REL TAZEWELL TN 294° 78.3 48
violet - uhf WEMT 39 FOX GREENEVILLE TN 295° 24.9 39
violet - uhf WKPT 19 ABC KINGSPORT TN 19° 38.0 19
violet - vhf W08BF 8 CBS SPRUCE PINE, ETC. NC 101° 10.8 8
violet - vhf W08BF1 8 CBS SPRUCE PINE, ETC. NC 101° 10.8 8

Best you could do is point a strong antenna with a preamp southwest towards Asheville, south to Greenville and southeast to Spartanburg. You could also point west to Knoxville, the big four are in digital there, but that's a stretch ... over 100mi I believe, so I dunno man...

jakexxl

09-06-06, 09:08 PM

Recently went with the hd package from Dish, but I lose the signal when it starts to rain. It doesn't have to be a heavy down pour, fairly moderate and the signal is gone.

The question is, does anyone have any experience with dish "covers", as far as holding the signal during moderate to heavy rain??

Don,
I've had Dish for a little over 3 yrs now. At first, I had some major problems like the ones you're describing -- any decent rain and my signal would go out. After calling and complaining to them a couple times, I finally got one of their CSR's to "off the record" recommend squirting some Rain-X on the actual satellite dish. (In case you don't know, Rain-X is a water repellent for automotive windshields and windows.)

Anyways, I tried it and absolutely works. I get up their and spray it (and wipe it down) about once a year and have had pretty much no problems at all. Whereas I once was seeing a significant dropout once every 3 or 4 weeks (on average) ... I now get one maybe once a year, like when there's a huge huge storm.

Hope it helps for you too. DISCLAIMER: I take no responsibility if it doesn't work, screws up your signal more, or if you fall off your ladder trying to spray your dish. :cool:

jtbell

09-07-06, 12:39 AM

Hmm, didn't know about VHF being used for DT ... why is that ?

In this area, right now only the Greenville ETV station sends its DT signal on VHF (channel 9). However, after the analog shutdown in 2009, WLOS plans to move its DT signal from ch 56 to ch 13, and WSPA plans to move its DT signal from ch 53 to ch 7. So at that time, we OTA folks will need both VHF and UHF capability.

VHF signals require less transmitter power than UHF and aren't blocked as much by trees etc. On the other hand, they're more easily disrupted by impulse noise from electrical appliances, power lines, etc., in the receiver's neighborhood. This is especially bad for ch 2-6, which is why WYFF isn't moving its DT signal to ch 4 in 2009.

LilGator

09-07-06, 08:34 AM

Awesmoe ...

I picked up a $25 4-foot outdoor RadShack antenna last night on the way home from work, and assembled, stood it up in my bedroom facing northish... picked up NBC, CBS, ABC, a billion PBSs, The Tube, The WB (MyNetworkTV now), and UPN (The CW now) all digital...

ABC was perfect for most of the evening, but about 10pm, it started to fade, and by 11, it was totally unavailable.

WHNS didn't pick up at all, I guess putting this on the roof should help some, is there a different direction I should point ? I rotated a bit finding the best signal for the analog feed 21.0, which wasn't all that great, and then scanned, but it still didn't find it.

Will a preamp help with finding WHNS-DT, and retaining WLOS-DT's signal ?

lynesjc

09-07-06, 10:24 AM

pre-amp was critical to getting good results for me, but YMMV

cruxer

09-07-06, 02:57 PM

...

EDIT: Looks like CW launches Sept. 18 on WYCW-DT, what is now/used to be the WASV-DT UPN...

WYCW-DT 62.1 UPN ASHEVILLE NC 340° 25.6 45
...

FYI since WYCW replaced WASV, they've evidently gone to more power on 62.1 & .2. I never used to be able to sniff their signal with my little desktop Zenith antenna (I'm in Mauldin.), but now they're one of my most reliable pick-ups. :)

--Cross

dagap

09-07-06, 04:26 PM

Hello. My parents are in Hendersonville NC 28739 and becoming interested in moving to HD. They're currently on cable (Mediacom). My father stopped by their office today and was told ABC, CBS, and NBC are not available in HD.

antennaweb only lists two digital stations (WSPA CBS 7.1 and WNTV PBS 9.1). Yet DirecTV's online waiver eligibility gizmo (directvdnseligibility dot then decisionmark then period com) insists that WLOS ABC, WHNS FOX and WYFF NBC are also available with a grade A, B, and A signal strength respectively.

Any guidance would be appreciated. They want to be confirm programming before shopping for a HDTV. Satellite would be okay, but HD locals aren't available and wouldn't they need waivers given the reported signal strengths?

John Coffey

09-07-06, 09:11 PM

Hahahaha...According to DirecTV's qualification tool, my house in Waynesville (28786) "supposedly" has a Grade A signal for HD reception for all 4 networks. Let's put it this way...despite my yagi antenna & preamp (which picks up WEMT pretty well) the only way HD signals make it to my house is through Charter. Must I repeat.. HAHAHAHA!!! Isn't it strange how their qualification tool is the ONLY one that shows that I have HD reception.

BTW...I just pulled up the Mediacom channel lineup & it looks like they have some of the national HD nets (HDNET, UHD, etc.) available. I would bet that it won't be too long before they implement the local channels- it's probably just a matter of getting contracts in place.

jerry birdwell

09-08-06, 05:15 PM

Hello. x x x Satellite would be okay, but HD locals aren't available and wouldn't they need waivers given the reported signal strengths?
In this mountainous area, OTA can be a problem...but for Hendersonville you should be able to get off air DT/HD signals from most of the local network affiliates which are very nearby. All broadcast DT/HD and in good quality for the most part. Hendersonville (depending on specific address) is surrounded by stations and it may be difficult to receive all with only one antenna setting. However, DT signals have proven to be reliably received from a wide angle, using such antennas as the 4 or 8 bay Channel M UHF bowtie antenna. Again, all network stations send both analog and digital signals. I am surprised that you did not get an encouraging report from AntennaWeb...the best source of info on local reception. Other future possibilities for your parents are HD LIL from satellite providers, which I anticipate early next year. No, stations probably will not grant a waiver for HD signals in that local stations' analog signals are available on the satellites, and that satisfies the "served" qualification of the SHVIA. Most cable systems are rapidly adding local station HD signals, except that Sinclair (WLOS/ABC) is holding out for pay. The FCC is now considering DT translators, but I don't remember the need for translators for the local stations in the Hendersonville area. Translators may be a couple of years in the future...and are not high priority for the local stations.

mgtr

09-09-06, 07:38 AM

I have been off the forum for some time, plus recently moved into an area where OTA will be tough (down in a valley + many tall trees). I called D* and they said we were not on the list for HD locals. Anybody hear anything about when this might occur? We will be gone all winter, so if they are available by next May, we will be in tall cotton.

Weller7

09-09-06, 01:07 PM

Dagap:
I am in the Etowah, NC area and have good OTA reception for all major channels except CBS. There is a mountain between my location and the CBS transmitter to the Southwest. If you have a clear path to Pisgah Mt. you can get PBS, ABC and WB. Fox and NBC are south of my location. UPN is north. The order of the channels above also reflects the signal strength I get. I use a simple UHF loop in the attic facing about north-south with good success. Your receiver will have to have a hookup for OTA in addition to cable/sat input. Hope this helps.

walterc

09-09-06, 09:37 PM

The guy who pre-wired my new home a few years back for DirecTV recently came out again to help me split off my OTA feed to go to another room. He is also a sub for DirecTV. While he was here he said that DirecTV is telling all their subs that HD Locals will available in this area some time in January.

A couple of days ago I had another DirecTV tech come out to install my new 5 lnb dish and HR 20-700, and he too said that he heard January. Take it for what it's worth and realize that projected dates are usually on the optimistic side, but two different people saying the same thing would seem to give this some creditbility.

By the way the HR 20 is the new HD DVR which replaces the HR 10-250. Right now the ota tuner on the HR 20 is disabled, but everyone says it will be enabled some time in October through a firmware upgrade. Everyone also says it's going to have one of the best ota tuners available in any device. In case you're wondering, you do still need an OTA setup of some kind even when HD locals are available through DirecTV so you can pick up the CW in HD or any PBS HD stations, or if you're like me and like to have a back-up when the satellite goes out for some reason. I'm going to hook my HR 10-250 back up until they activate the ota on the HR 20.

I don't check these forums often, but I'll try to check back in every once in awhile, and I'll definitely give you an update when the OTA is activated. Right now my weakest signal is ABC out of Asheville, and it's a steady 85 so I probably won't benefit too much from a better ota tuner, but others might.

cpalmer2k

09-09-06, 10:25 PM

Don F.

09-10-06, 08:47 AM

Boy I'm glad I have Charter... don't know if signals have dropped or what but tonight I can't pick up 7 without breakups OTA, and I'm not getting WYFF or WHNS at all over the last few days.

I think my Pre-Amp may have kicked the bucket. Anyone have any recommendations on a replacement?

Watched all four last night, 21 was the weakest at 84, 4 & 7 were 100, best of all 13 was in the low 90s. I use a cm 7777. Good luck

Don F.

09-10-06, 06:54 PM

jerry birdwell

09-11-06, 08:42 AM

Post from SkyReport:
"DirecTV also said it's moving forward with its HD plans. By the end of the second quarter, DirecTV had launched local HD channels in 36 markets, reaching a total of 58 percent of all TV households. During the second half of the year DirecTV plans to launch 25 more local HD markets, reaching more than 70 percent of all TV households."
Lets hope that this DMA is included in the next 25, but I suspect subscriber pressure will help.

bstratton1

09-12-06, 11:44 AM

bstratton:

Haven't seen very many complaints on the 13.1 signal lately, especally from me. I went with the dish 622, and have been very happy. Your signal will range from 75 during the soaps, up to 95 in prime time. Don't care about the mid p.m. broadcast. Are you guys where you want to be with your transmitter? Thanks

We are not at our full power just yet. As stated back a few months ago, we are running around 85% or so. We are going up there today actually, with a tech from Acrodyne Transmitters to attempt one more time to proof the transmitter and get it up to 100%. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

gjlowe

09-12-06, 11:47 AM

lynesjc

09-12-06, 01:11 PM

If anyone here gets a Tivo S3, please post and advise of your cablecard experience with Charter.

bstratton1

09-12-06, 01:49 PM

Does anyone know if WLOS is going to be getting the HD versions of Wheel Of Fortune and Jeopardy? I realize this may be a silly questions since it IS Sinclair after all, but the listings on my Windows XP MCE did have them labeled as HD yesterday.

No time soon, because they are syndication shows and we receive them thru Non-HD satellite feed. They are currently upconverted to HD, as you may know, but not true HD. Being Sinclair, or not, has nothing to do with this.

The next shows I anticipate to be in HD on ABC are the evening news, soaps and late night shows, and probably in that order (pure speculation on my behalf). GMA has gone HD over the summer, and The View just started.

gjlowe

09-12-06, 03:01 PM

I understand that they are syndicated. I also understand that you probably (or actually do as you point out) purchase the syndicated block of programming and receive it in SD. ABC HD stuff has nothing to do with this. I realize you are doing HD for anything that comes from ABC as HD, and can only start doing HD for all of that programming you mention when the NETWORK does so.

What I was specifically wondering is when WLOS was going to begin receiving the HD versions of those shows and broadcasting them instead of the SD versions, as they are available NOW from Sony Television.

I apologize if my jab at Sinclair offended you, but it was only a jab. I mention them because as a corporation I have been unhappy with a lot of their decision making when it comes to things like carrying HD on cable and such. I do give them credit for putting ABC HD up on OTA for us. Just had to get my little poke in there... Sorry.

jtbell

09-12-06, 06:03 PM

WOLO-DT in Columbia started showing the HD versions of Wheel and Jeopardy last night. As per the WCCB/WOLO engineer who posts in the Charlotte and Columbia threads, they had to buy and install equipment so they can record the shows from a satellite feed and play it back at the scheduled time. Network HD programming is broadcast straight from a live network feed, with no recording involved at the local stations.

At some point the HD versions of Wheel and Jeopardy will be delivered to subscriber stations using the Pathfire system which is used for most syndicated shows including the SD versions of W and J, but the Pathfire upgrade to HD is apparently not ready for, uh, prime time yet.

I speculate that WLOS has held off on buying equipment to deal with a satellite feed for just two syndicated HD shows, pending conversion of the Pathfire system in the future.

price3

09-13-06, 10:00 AM

I was looking for the DirecTv local info too, but see it has just been asked a few posts above. I think it is strange that we are the #35/36 DMA and were not in the launch 36 or in the next 25 to add list either. Greensboro, #47 however, is on the list. I hope we can get on the radar soon. It really doesnt matter until the OTA tuners in the HR20-700 are activated, but I'm getting anxious!

bstratton1

09-14-06, 08:59 AM

I apologize if my jab at Sinclair offended you, but it was only a jab. I mention them because as a corporation I have been unhappy with a lot of their decision making when it comes to things like carrying HD on cable and such. I do give them credit for putting ABC HD up on OTA for us. Just had to get my little poke in there... Sorry.

No offense taken. I was just trying to clear up any mistaken assumptions. We do use the Pathfire delivery system alot here, so I would think we will show HD syndications once we are able to receive them via Pathfire.

jerry birdwell

09-14-06, 09:27 AM

lynesjc

09-14-06, 04:03 PM

tnmg

09-14-06, 05:33 PM

foxeng

09-14-06, 09:22 PM

Press announcement today: DirecTV activated high-definition local channel service in the San Antonio, Portland (OR) and Memphis market areas. With the addition of these new markets, DirecTV now offers local HD broadcast channels in 39 cities - or 60 percent of U.S. TV households.

D* has never observed market ranking for its new rollouts, but has obviously by-passed the nation's 35th largest market. Market ranks for the above are 37, 23, 44.

I have heard through 3rd hand info (so take it with a grain of salt, I have no idea if it is true or not) that market rollouts are based on the following in this order, total number of subs in a market, percent of total and new subs to take the new service in a market and are there any related other News Corp entities that might benefit in the market.

I know in our situation, according to independent consultants in the area who know this kind of stuff, our market has a higher than average sat sub base, with most of the D* subs with SD LIL making my market a good candidate for HD LIL upgrades. Of course, working for a FOX O & O I am sure played into it as well, but the fact we were not included in earlier releases I tend to believe being an O & O wasn't as high a factor as the sat sub number and the percentage of SD LIL subs. They are rolling out my market next month and they have already started installed the new HR20 HD DVRs along with the AT-9 antenna around here. I know of 2 installed already and 2 more to be installed this coming week.

gjlowe

09-15-06, 11:48 AM

If I just have the simplest package from Charter, does that also include the HD channels? I heard somewhere before the FCC required the cable companies to pass through the HD channels as well in the basic package. Any truth to this?

By FCC Mandate, you can receive your local digital channels as unencrypted QAM channels. You only need a QAM-capable tuner and a basic cable subscription. All other HD content is encrypted and requires either a cablecard or a compatible cable box.

jerry birdwell

09-15-06, 04:51 PM

Probably because of the mountains and the OTA analog reception difficulties, satellite penetration is high in this DMA. For that reason I expected LIL earlier, but have seen indications that it will be early next year for HD. But another problem that the Sat providers face until more Sats are launched is the spot-beam configuration. There seems to be a shortage for this area. Hard to get specific info on this. But, expect this market to be on one of the new sats. That should mean we will get MPG4 encoding. Anyone have better info?

skull1971

09-16-06, 08:43 AM

My special pricing expires at the end of this month. To make a long story short, I was going to switch to Dish last year and charter gave me this special pricing(HD, internet, Moxi, etc) for a year if I would stay. Anyway, I've been told I would have to wait another year before any special retention pricing would be available. Some new policy with Charter? I'm ready for Dish, but it stinks that I have to pay more money for internet services since Bell"behind the times"South says DSL is not available in the Taylors area. Anybody have any idea when & if BellSouth will ever be able to cover the area in DSL service?
Thanks

blooker

09-16-06, 09:56 AM

You might try satellite VSAT. Expensive ($100 mo plus install) for 500kbs, but better than dialup. Used it for 2 yrs until DSL arrived in my ville.
www.starband.com

rchalk

09-16-06, 04:08 PM

You might try satellite VSAT. Expensive ($100 mo plus install) for 500kbs, but better than dialup. Used it for 2 yrs until DSL arrived in my ville.
www.starband.com

Go to www.wildblue.com instead - it's $300 up front, then $50/month.

sic0048

09-16-06, 11:21 PM

tnmg

09-18-06, 03:05 AM

Has anyone else noticed the piss poor quality of the networks "HD" coverage of the football games today? ABC is the only one that has a decent quality, the others must really be compressing the signal because I am getting tons of motion artifacts. It's the first time I've noticed it being this bad (even my wife could see it was bad).

I was just curious if others noticed it.

The CBS feeds are always hit or miss for football, if you're lucky enough for CBS to broadcast the game in HD. Fox looked good. NBC tonight was pretty bad too. I get my local HDs through Charter. You?

tnmg

09-18-06, 03:09 AM

By FCC Mandate, you can receive your local digital channels as unencrypted QAM channels. You only need a QAM-capable tuner and a basic cable subscription. All other HD content is encrypted and requires either a cablecard or a compatible cable box.

So the local channels broadcast in HD are available with a basic cable subscription? I have found the channels on my TV without going through the box but didn't know if they removed/blocked those without the HD package. My TV has the ATSC tuner built in. Not sure about a QAM? I know when I hook up an antenna or straight out of the wall (no cablecard/box) I can get HD channels. So Discovery/ESPN would be encrypted, but my local HDs are included? Getting ready to swap to DirecTV but want to make sure I can still get locals in HD until they are broadcast from the satellite.

Thanks again

sic0048

09-18-06, 08:39 AM

sic0048

09-18-06, 08:58 AM

So the local channels broadcast in HD are available with a basic cable subscription?

Only with a QAM tuner. The cable company currently sends out the digital signal full time on all their lines, because they know the encryption cannot be circumvented - without the correct digital cable box, you cannot watch the encrypted digital channels. Also, the cable digital channels are sent out in QAM, not ATSC and QAM tuners are still a realitive novelty. Now if you do have a QAM tuner, then you should be able to pick up the unencrypted QAM channels without any additional equipment or cable subscription (basic cable subscription would be fine). Generally speaking, the local channels are the only ones that a cable companies sends out unencrypted becuase while QAM tuners are not extremely popular, they are readily available to the public and they don't want people watching their stuff for free.

Here locally, Charter sends out the local HD channels they provide (NBC, CBS, ABC, and SC PBS if I remember correctly). Additionally, the music channels are unencrypted, as are most of the "on-demand" channels. However, charter shifts the on demand channels quite frequently (ie Sex in the City is playing on 109-2 and without warning switches to 109-3) so it is rather hard to actually watch anything on those channels. There was also a period of time recently that ESPN-2, Sci-fi, and National Geographic were unencrypted, but I guess they discovered their error and started encrypting them again. So no joy on those channels now.

Wayne Estabrook

09-18-06, 09:12 AM

Even though most folks were watching football, this is to let you know about audio problems this weekend on UNC-HD. On Saturday we experienced a loss of audio with hiss and static during the 8 PM show due to equipment failure. On Sunday night during the Nature show, the 5.1 feed from PBS has the channel 1&2 audio interchanged with the channel 3&4 audio so surround appeared only on stereo TV with no dialog. We regret these technical problems.

rchalk

09-18-06, 05:11 PM

I generally watch mine OTA, however I can view charters locals through my MyHD-130 with QAM tuner. My comments were a result of watching OTA (honestly I didn't think to check Charters quality), but I suspect it was a network decision to compress the feed, so it would have been bad on all fronts.

It was bad again yesterday (Sunday).

I'm really disappointed in the networks and their decision to reduce the quality of their feeds. Anytime the camera panned there was motion artifacts - it was that bad. To me that is completely inexcusable. Fox, NBC, and CBS all had this problem for the games that I saw this weekend. As I said before, ABC seemed to be the only station not to have the motion artifacts - and this while they are broadcasting two other SD feeds OTA (a weather feed, and UPN or whatever they are calling themselves now), so clearly the networks have the ability to do it right.

Oh well, I'd be really pissed if I had to pay for HD and was getting that kind of signal.

I would not necessarily assume that it is the networks. All the local stations are broadcasting other crap - excuse me, valuable programming - on one or more subchannels, and reducing the available bandwidth for HD broadcasts. The result is dependent on the quality of the digital encoders, and their ability to do multiplexing, and it may be that WLOS has a better encoder. This is more likely the cause of the poor quality of the HD programming.

Once again, profits outweigh performance.

enoree

09-18-06, 07:29 PM

remember that ABC is 720p and CBS and NBC are 1080i, the subs will degrade a 1080i feed more than a 720p feed, plus 720p seems much better for fast motion, FOX is also 720p.

Adam Tyner

09-18-06, 09:13 PM

(NBC, CBS, ABC, and SC PBS if I remember correctly).NBC, CBS, Fox, and PBS.

jerry birdwell

09-19-06, 08:43 AM

Even though most folks . . . We regret these technical problems.
I had audio problems during Great Performances last night, with the narration missing during the account of the burning of the theater. Audio also switched between 2/0 and 3/2 during performances. Both 33-2 (NC) and 29-3 (SC) were bad. However, Rock Hill was perfect. Is this a continuation of your weekend problem?

jtbell

09-19-06, 04:06 PM

I had audio problems during Great Performances last night, with the narration missing during the account of the burning of the theater. Audio also switched between 2/0 and 3/2 during performances. Both 33-2 (NC) and 29-3 (SC) were bad.

I happened to watch part of the 9pm Great Performances broadcast on 38-3 (WNEH-DT Greenwood), and I had similar problems. When I didn't hear the narration but did see the subtitles, I thought that I must have my audio misconfigured so as to lose one or more of the original audio channels. I don't have a multichannel setup so I thought my mix might be missing the original center front channel and maybe the rear channels (I thought the music sounded a bit odd, too). I spent some time playing with the audio-setup menus, and was about to go look for the manuals when the narration returned, and I realized the broadcast was a bit flaky.

I recorded the midnight rebroadcast so I could watch the whole thing later, but haven't looked at or listened to any of it yet.

geezer480

09-20-06, 09:49 AM

I just got my Panasonic Plasma yesterday and I need some suggestions for an antenna for this area. The towers are all over the place so I'm looking for something that I can use without repositioning the antenna for the different stations.

I have DirecTv (HR20 install set for Friday) but as you know, no HD locals yet (and no local OTA on the HR20 yet either). But, when the OTA is enabled on the HR20, I'll need good signal strength on all the stations if I'm going to be able to schedule recordings (I can't reposition the antenna for each recording).

I hooked up a Radio Shack indoor antenna (cat # 15-1892 - can't post URL yet) last night and was able to get reception on several channels but it was not steady so it would drop out all the time.

I'm really hoping there's a solution for me.

Thanks.

Apps1

09-20-06, 09:55 AM

geezer480

09-20-06, 10:05 AM

Looks like a nice antenna. From the specs, it looks like it's highly directional though. My compass settings are from 289 to 153 degrees though. Here's my antenna web report:

* yellow - uhf WLOS-DT 13.1 ABC ASHEVILLE NC 289° 18.6 56
* green - uhf WYCW-DT 62.1 CW ASHEVILLE NC 219° 11.6 45
* green - uhf WUNF-DT 33.1 PBS ASHEVILLE NC 289° 18.6 25
* red - uhf WHNS-DT 21.1 FOX ASHEVILLE NC 233° 18.6 57
* violet - uhf WSPA-DT 7.1 CBS SPARTANBURG SC 153° 15.5 53
* violet - uhf WYFF-DT 4.1 NBC GREENVILLE SC 214° 19.8 59

I'm just wondering if it could "cover the spread".

Apps1

09-20-06, 10:26 AM

I use the XG-91 from antennas direct with a 7777 pre-amp from Channel Master and I get all avilable channes without rotating. I have a Hughes Tivo HD receiver for D*.

http://www.antennasdirect.com/91XG_HDTV_antenna.html

It works for me here in Greenville. There is a "sweet spot" where I pick up all local stations in the 80+ range. On a real windy day I someyimes have to rotate around to get WSPA without drop outs.

calvinb

09-20-06, 01:10 PM

Geezer, CM offers a rotor that would help you. You can even get one with a remote control, just what we all need, another remote. I have one, and used to use it as lot until WLOS-DT upped their power. Now I have found the proverbial "sweet spot". A good pre-amp would help you also. CM 7777 is quite popular.

calvinb

09-20-06, 01:12 PM

BTW, for all who are interested, the Ryder Cup will indeed be in HD all weekend. Universal HD on Friday and NBC HD on Sat-Sun.

blooker

09-20-06, 09:05 PM

Thanks for the Ryder Cup heads up.

Don F.

09-21-06, 05:00 PM

[QUOTE=geezer480].

I'm really hoping there's a solution for me.

With your towers more than 130 degrees apart, I would think a rotor and a good outside antenna would be a great early Christmas present. Good luck, and it will be worth the trouble.

price3

09-22-06, 01:35 PM

A rotor won't work for me either, because the tivo needs it to be pointed right even when I'm not there, plus I record stuff on 2 stations at once.

geezer480

09-22-06, 03:06 PM

rchalk

09-23-06, 08:15 AM

I still haven't found a solution. Yes, I could get one of the highly directionals with a rotator but, like price3 said above, I need to record 2 shows at once and they could be on any of the channels. Is there anyone else in Hendersonville that has a good system working for them?

If you can get away with two specific directions, try putting up two antennas, each pointed towards one of the two useful bearings, and combine them with a standard splitter hooked up in reverse to a single cable. I recommend that you use identical antennas, and identical cable-lengths to the combiner. This should work as long as the antennas do not both see significant signals from the same station, since this could cause possible subtractive combining if the received signals are out-of-phase. (this would probably be worst if one receives off the front, and one off the back.

If you need a preamp, put it in the combined line just below the splitter.

enoree

09-24-06, 08:31 AM

JonBrown

09-24-06, 01:19 PM

I live in the Greenville, SC area, right beside Furman Univ. I have the DirecTV installed OTA and their HD package. The HD channels all work, except ABC (13.1). My question is, would a pre-amp help boost the signal and allow me to view 13.1?? Would I be able to find a good pre-amp at Radio Shack, or should I go to a satellite/television specific store. Thanks for the help.

sic0048

09-24-06, 05:45 PM

IF you decide to go with a pre-amp, get a mast mounted pre-amp. It is a two peice unit with one part being mounted as close to the antenna as possible (hence the name mast mounted) and then a 2nd part, the power supply. It is located somewhere one the main line before it is split into the different feeds and somewhere close to an outlet.

A know most people like the Channel Master CM7777 and CM7778. You might not be able to find them locally, but order it on line.

Check this link out for a decent discription. http://www.solidsignal.com/tech_help_CM777X.asp

JonBrown

09-24-06, 06:24 PM

Thanks for the help. I just ordered the Channel Master 7777 pre-amp. It is supposed to arrive in 2 days, so I will post and update the situation.

bstratton1

09-27-06, 09:40 AM

WLOS needs to tell the folks in their control room to stay awake,during the ND-MSU game last night they went to local commercials during the most critical part ofthe game,I immediately used the remote on my rotor to swing to WSOC(Charlotte) which was preprogrammed on the remote,watched till the end there.When it was over I moved back to WLOS and it was back but in SD. When someone like an air traffic controller does not pay attention you get a crash like in Ky a few weeks back, I am thankful that they are not in that profession instead.

I apologize for the error. It was a programming glitch that cause the commercial spot to air at the wrong time, then the Operator switched back to the game after seeing this was wrong, but only took the SD feed in the confussion. Lucky for us we are not directing air traffic with desk top computers and the software we use for programming. This is only TV and not life threatening when a commercial runs in the wrong spot.

blooker

09-27-06, 11:13 AM

bstratton1 is cleared for the WLOS 13 approach. Winds are calm. The barometer is 29.91 There are no ripples in any of your DC voltages.

:)

JonBrown

09-27-06, 09:17 PM

Well, I installed the 7777 pre-amp, but still cannot get 13.1 ... it helped with 21.1 (no more hiccups) and I can get 40.1, etc. now, but still cannot get the ABC network in HD. Any thoughts??

mdavej

09-27-06, 10:01 PM

I'm in Greenville, so you're probably 10 mi. closer to 13's tower than me, but I get 13.1 fine with a cheap indoor antenna from Walmart. It's a middle of the line Phillips with rabbit ears and a loop and a built-in amp (30 db, I think). It was $20-$25, if I remember correctly. It's probably worth a shot, and easy to return if it doesn't work. I do have to aim it just right though. Using the signal strength monitor on my tv I get around 70%. One annoyance is the blinding blue power LED on the antenna base, which I promptly covered with electrical tape.

dashaund

09-29-06, 05:36 PM

but still cannot get the ABC network in HD. Any thoughts??

You say that DirecTV installed your OTA antenna...do you know what kind of antenna they installed? A preamp, even one as good as the 7777, only amplifies the signal that it receives. My guess is you're not even receiving WLOS. Have you tried aiming the antenna? Aim it toward Asheville to see what you get. The problem with a "hyphen" area likes ours with multiple cities with stations located in different cities is all of our towers aren't in the same direction. I've got my antenna aimed to where I can receive 4, 13, and 21, but not 7...I have to rotate the antenna to get 7. Where is the antenna? On the roof? The highest point on the roof is preferable. I live just south Travelers Rest (still a TR address) so I'm only about 15 mins or less from you. WLOS is the most difficult because of its distance. Also, the signal is a little weaker since we're in the foothills on the mountains. I have a 4 bay antenna 20ft high in the air and I can get WLOS consistently in the low 90s so it's not impossbile. Let us know about your setup so we can further assist you!

scg32

09-29-06, 07:42 PM

Anyone else having problems receiving 21.1? My signal strength has been down for several weeks and is causing drop-outs. Have they reduced power or something?

n4fw

09-30-06, 11:02 PM

Well, I installed the 7777 pre-amp, but still cannot get 13.1 ... it helped with 21.1 (no more hiccups) and I can get 40.1, etc. now, but still cannot get the ABC network in HD. Any thoughts??You may have multipath interference on WLOS-DT(13.1). Do you receive WUNF-DT(UNC-TV) on 33.1? It's located on the same tower as WLOS-DT.

JonBrown

10-01-06, 03:01 PM

Thanks for all the responses.

I do not receive 33.1 either. The antenna is located in the attic and is mounted on a stud ... it does not seem like it could be rotated. The antenna does not have any labels or other identifiers as to the make or model. It has a 18"x12" (approx.) wire screen as the main antenna, with an extension on the front that runs top to bottom that has two more "X" shaped antennas. That probably does not help too much, but maybe gives you a general idea. Hopefully the rumor about DTV offering locals in HD at the beginning of the new year will be true and all this will be moot come January. Thanks again for all the help and responses.

jtbell

10-01-06, 11:51 PM

Well, I installed the 7777 pre-amp, but still cannot get 13.1 ... it helped with 21.1

Scroll back to posting #3285 in this thread, where I posted links to maps that show the estimated "path loss" in the Greenville-Clemson area for WLOS 13.1 (should be the same for 33.1 since they're at the same location) and WHNS 21.1. You're up by Furman so you might be able to locate yourself fairly well by comparing with the Greenville and Travelers Rest city limits, and the "shadow" cast by Paris Mountain.

Much of the area between Greenville and TR is in the teal-colored band for WLOS but in yellow for WHNS. For two stations operating at the same power level, which these two are (at least approximately), that represents a difference in signal strength of roughly 40 dB in favor of WHNS. That's because the front line of mountains blocks WLOS from your direct line of sight.

In much of Greenville itself the WLOS signal improves significantly because the front line of mountains is further away and has a lower elevation angle from those locations.

Way down here in Clinton these two stations are roughly the same strength because I have a clear line of sight to both of them. Actually I get WLOS better because the WHNS digital signal on channel 57 gets interference from analog 57 in Columbia. I'm counting the days till analog shutdown! :D

brpc

10-02-06, 03:11 PM

just wondering if there are any other members that post in the Burnsville, Spruce Pine, Bakersville, Micaville areas? we live in Burnsville in the south toe area

dashaund

10-02-06, 07:27 PM

The antenna is located in the attic and is mounted on a stud ... it does not seem like it could be rotated.

Do you think there is anyway you can turn it? You basically have a standard UHF antenna that many of us have. Yes, there antennas are generally multidirectional (can receive signals in all directions), but they do have "lobes," or basically hotspots where it receives better in that direction. Try turning it towards Asheville and see what you get. It may improve, may not. I agree with jtbell though, you may be getting blocked by the mountain range. You're more to the north than me...I believe I'm on the fringe. I struggled receiveing WLOS for a LONG time until I decided to mount my antenna as high as it is. Now it comes in great! But I still get nada as far as analog reception here.

enoree

10-02-06, 09:48 PM

Out of curiosity I decided to tune to WCNC-DT (Charlotte) when Jeopardy and Wheel of Fortune were on tonight, both are in HD on WCNC-DT as well as on WOLO-DT ( Columbia). I guess someday this market will catch up, but in the meantime it's nice to have choices of where I get my DT from. I get most of the Charlotte DT's as strong as or better than the Greenville stations, especially CBS.

calvinb

10-03-06, 07:45 PM

Guys, I have a few tech questions. Just bought a new HDTV and need to split my OTA feed coming from the attic. Any particular type of splitter I need? (Available at Rat Shack?) Also, I'm running the CM 7777 pre-amp in the main room (trap in the attic next to the antenna). What does splitting the line do to the pre-amp? I'm assuming the main room still gets amped but the new display does not. Can I put another pre-amp next to the new display? (without buying another trap, running off old one) Thanks for any feedback.

tnmg

10-03-06, 10:50 PM

I've been thinking about making the jump to DirecTV for some time now. I am currently a Charter customer with the HD package and have for the most part been impressed with how the HD channels look on my TV. I watch/love HD football and watch just a few channels on the locals (Heroes, Jericho, CSI, etc.)

How does Directv's HD compare with Charters for those who have had both? I hate to sign a 2yr contract with directv and have my football full of artifacts/etc. Granted, the CBS feed stinks most of the time. The ESPN HD on Charter is unbelievable here.

Also, if you get the HD package with directv do you get the HD feeds from the nationals? On their website they list ABC/CBS/FOX/NBC HDTV from channels 80-89 in high def (WABC,WCBS,WNYW,WNBC). Would you get these channels as well as our locals? Or do you only get those if you can't get locals in our area? I'm confused.

Thanks for all your help, I just don't want to get stuck for 2yrs and have crappy HD football :P

gjlowe

10-04-06, 08:55 AM

dashaund

10-04-06, 08:55 AM

You can use a regular splitter, however you may loose a good bit of signal strength in the process ESPECIALLY if you've got a long cable run. Personally, I use a Channel Master four port distribution amplifier that I bought from Lowes and I LOVE IT! It's about $40, but it reamplifies the signal. Not only did I not lose signal strength, but I acutally gained a point or two. It works great, and I highly recommend it!

sic0048

10-04-06, 11:03 AM

You should use the splitter right after the power supply for the CM7777, not before.

StrangeCock

10-04-06, 11:23 AM

I was pumped to see Veronica Mars in HD last night. Then 9:00 came...and...fuzz-o-vision! I had to call WYCW to get them to switch. Shouldn't they figure this stuff out by themselves without prompting from their viewers?

calvinb

10-04-06, 01:51 PM

BlckMtnHD

10-04-06, 01:55 PM

If anyone here gets a Tivo S3, please post and advise of your cablecard experience with Charter.

I took delivery of my Series 3 yesterday in Black Mountain. I went to the Asheville Charter office to trade in my digital box for cablecards and was told I had to have a service call to install them. I am relatively certain they used to just give them out for self-install, but they have changed that policy. Anyway, I convinced her to not charge me for the installation, but was still disappointed that I had to wait a week for the installation. They also told me Charter was getting a new generation of cablecards in a few months.

My install is on Tuesday. I'll try to check back and let you know how it goes.

sic0048

10-04-06, 02:42 PM

Dashaund, if I use the distribution amp, must I remove the CM 7777? I DO have a long cable run from the antenna to the main TV. The power supply is right next to the main TV. Now my questions are: a. Do I put the splitter right next to the power supply and have two runs to the two displays? (one run about 6 ft and the other about 50 feet) OR B. install the distribution amp with or without the 7777? the 7777 does allow me to pull in WLOS-DT and some of the others. I cannot do without the results provided by the 7777.

Thanks for the help guys.

I persoanlly would try the set up without the extra distribution amp first and see what the results are. You can over amplify the signal and get poor results (because you are amplifying the bad with the good - too much bad is still too much bad). I don't think you will loose that much signal in the 50ft run, but I guess it all depends on a lot of variables (like the quality of the cable, connectors, etc). If the signal drop is too much for the long run, then I would look at getting an inexpensive in-line amp and adding it to the longer run only.

price3

10-05-06, 08:44 AM

dashaund

10-05-06, 10:17 AM

The signal is amplified out of the distribution, but not THAT much. Personally, I would run the output of the 7777 to the input if the distribution amp. I don't think you would overdrive it. If you do, you can always unhook it. You can try the splitter solution as well...just make sure you get a good quality one. Do you have some marginally weak signals that you watch? You might loose just enough dB that you won't be able to receive that signal. It's up to you.

CurtE

10-05-06, 11:05 AM

Does anyone know if the Clemson/Wake game on Saturday will be in HD? It's on ESPN - but that doesn't always mean it will be broadcast in HD. The ESPN website shows it as HD - but titantv.com does not?

Thanks.

dashaund

10-05-06, 11:15 AM

Does anyone know if the Clemson/Wake game on Saturday will be in HD?

Can't say for 100% sure, but on ESPNHD's site here: ( http://hd.espn.com/hd/ ), it says that it is in HD. I hope so. When I used TitanTV a while back, I noticed they didn't flag stuff correctly for HD.

CurtE

10-05-06, 11:23 AM

Thanks for the quick response...I hope so too! I know there is/was a possibility it may get moved to ESPN Classic because of the baseball playoffs? If that does happen, there's no way it'll be HD.

cruxer

10-05-06, 04:23 PM

Can't say for 100% sure, but on ESPNHD's site here: ( http://hd.espn.com/hd/ ), it says that it is in HD. I hope so. When I used TitanTV a while back, I noticed they didn't flag stuff correctly for HD.

I would go with what ESPN's site says. They're usually pretty accurate.

--Cross

Gary J

10-05-06, 04:30 PM

This (http://www.hdsportsguide.com/) site is accurate too. The even had today's NY/Det game updated.

blooker

10-05-06, 10:18 PM

I just switched from DTV to Dish because of the addtional HD channels on Dish. I'm one of those who watch HD because it is HD. (sort of like TV in the 50's; if it was on, you watched it)

While I was installing the Dish 3 LNB antenna (110 119 129), I still had DTV up and running and could switch between the two services. My eyes (no instruments available for for quantifiable measurements) told me Dish has the better quality HD transmissions. I was switching back and forth viewing the HDNet channel on a 50" plasma display.

Where I live, cable is not an option, so must use OTA and satellite.

gjlowe

10-05-06, 11:06 PM

tnmg,
The HD channels on DirecTv look great to me (although there isn't anything there I watch so I canceled the HD pack), but the earlier poster was correct and we do not yet receive locals in HD by satellite. Although we are the 36th largest market in the country and DirecTv has about 40 markets turned on. We are not even on the "coming soon" lists I have seen. Not sure why, but I'm not happy about it. I would stick with charter until we are added, it's a pretty big pain to get all the channels with an antenna depending on where you live.

There are probably a couple of reasons why, two of the biggest being:
the fact that Sinclair is loathe to allow their HD broadcast to be picked up by cable/satellite, and

Being the 36th market on paper does not mean that satellite providers see us as that important of a market. I think they look at customer base more than DMA rankings, and where they see the most potential for new customers or existing customer upgrades.

cblehm

10-06-06, 12:49 PM

By FCC Mandate, you can receive your local digital channels as unencrypted QAM channels. You only need a QAM-capable tuner and a basic cable subscription. All other HD content is encrypted and requires either a cablecard or a compatible cable box.

Can anyone confirm that they are receiving HD local channels with just a basic cable subscription (no cablecard or cable box) through Charter cable? Do you just connect the coax from the wall into the "Digital In" connector on the TV? I have a built-in QAM tuner on my Vizio HDTV, and I'm excited about the chance of getting NBC, CBS, FOX, PBS if possible. Also, are there any more HD channels in our Asheville Charter market that you can receive through the QAM tuner? I'd rather not subscribe at this time to the HD package and rent an HD box, so any information you guys can give me would be much appreciated. :)

gjlowe

10-06-06, 12:59 PM

Yes...I have confirmed this in the past. By law, they have to provide the unencrypted QAM signals for the locals if you have basic cable service. The local stations available on cable are WYFF (NBC), WHNS (Fox), WSPA (CBS), and WUNF (PBS). You can also receive the WUNC-Kids channel, and the weather subchannels on WSPA and WYFF.

calvinb

10-06-06, 01:40 PM

I can confirm that basic cable WILL provide HD to a QAM decoder. QAM will also allow you to see some crazy PPV stuff that your neighbors may be watching (and DVR-ing, as crazy as that sounds).

Dashaund and Sic0048, I am trying the OTA split today with a GE "Digital" splitter (9$ at Home Depot). I will be splitting on the TV side of the 7777 power injector and hoping for minimal loss. All my signals are pretty good right now so hopefully I won't need the distribution amp. Wish me luck and thanks for all the advice.

dashaund

10-06-06, 05:09 PM

TV side of the 7777 power injector

Correct way to do it! You probably will see good results if you're running solid RG6 cable throughout your path. I'm running a long run of cable so I had to have the amp to make it.

As far as the cable QAM channels, sure, if you've got cable this is great. As far as optimal signal quality, I wouldn't recommend it since it's getting recompressed and the cable company would probably opt to squeeze those first when they're running out of bandwidth.

enoree

10-08-06, 02:24 PM

I had a chance to compare the Panther game SD PQ between WSPA-DT and WBTV-DT today. Switching between the 2 back and forth I noticed a definite PQ difference between the 2. WSPA is a LOT fuzzier looking and nowhere as sharp as WBTV. The folks who run WSPA and WYCW should be emberrased by the SD PQ on both. It looks like a VHS that has been copied several times. No problems with the SD PQ on the other locals. If they are going to pass thru the SD on their DT they should at least make some effort to keep it watchable. Since the WSPA stations were sold a few years ago they have been really going downhill in regards to serving the community.

sic0048

10-08-06, 08:04 PM

As far as the cable QAM channels, sure, if you've got cable this is great. As far as optimal signal quality, I wouldn't recommend it since it's getting recompressed and the cable company would probably opt to squeeze those first when they're running out of bandwidth.

I usually watch my HD via OTA, but I do have a QAM tuner and will use is as a "backup" source. Today I couldn't get a steady signal (one without any dropouts) for NBC due to the wind, so I switched to QAM NBC HD via Charter. I have to say that there was no difference in picture quality between the OTA signal and the signal via Charter. So while I would normally agree to a statement like this based on my own presumptions, reality is that perhaps Charter has enough bandwith right now that is it not compressing the signal very much. At least that was the case while watching the Nascar race today.

The same was true for WSPA, but they were not showing the football game in HD, so it is hard to say it the HD quality would be different, but again, there was no noticable difference between OTA and Charter QAM based on my own A/B testing today.

John Coffey

10-08-06, 10:05 PM

I agree with sic0048 -- I have been pleased with Charter's HD quality so far, and really cannot tell a difference between the cable's quality and OTA quality. Of course, that could be just because Charter has not had to turn up compression to squeeze more channels.

dashaund

10-09-06, 09:04 AM

Well very good. I have Charter pipeline. I would get Bellsouth's DSL since it's cheaper and I do have phone service with them but it's not available in my area. And I have D* and don't want Charter's service, but they're the only method I can get broadband (I know D* has Hughesnet, but their prices are rediculous). Early on, the service went out every week for some reason, but they seem to have stepped it up it has been stable for about a year now. I almost have their support # memorized because I had to call constantly. Maybe they actually want to provide decent service now instead of getting booted out of town...

John Coffey

10-09-06, 10:25 AM

Oh...I have plenty of gripes with Charter -- primarily with analog PQ (I won't go into the billing dispute matter where the Greenville County attorney had to step in for me). Fortunately, here in my apartment, outages are not an issue.

bstratton1

10-09-06, 10:57 AM

the fact that Sinclair is loathe to allow their HD broadcast to be picked up by cable/satellite

Actually, Sinclair has approved Satellite to transmit our digital signal, just not cable.

gjlowe

10-09-06, 11:57 AM

So when DirecTV and/or DISH decide to add our market, they are allowed to use the HD signal? Why would they approve this for satellite and not for cable?

Apps1

10-09-06, 12:02 PM

So when DirecTV and/or DISH decide to add our market, they are allowed to use the HD signal? Why would they approve this for satellite and not for cable?

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. I would bet that satellite agreed to compensate.

bstratton1

10-09-06, 04:20 PM

I don't know any particulars, I just know that there is an agreement between Sinclair and both Dish/Direct.

calvinb

10-10-06, 06:57 AM

Hooray! My OTA split worked perfectly. I ended up using about 50' of RG6 to the new Westinghouse LCD (LTV-40W1) and its tuner is working quite well. Picking up Fox, WLOS-DT, and all the others. Thanks to Dashaund and sic for the advice. I'm a happy HD camper. It would seem the CM 7777 is powerful enough to boost the signal for two TV's thru a splitter. Very impressive.

dashaund

10-10-06, 08:00 AM

Great calvinb! I'm guess that the tuner in that Westinghouse is pretty good. I just know that my H10-250 leaves a little bit to be desired, so I had to have some "torque" inorder to have a watchable picture. Good luck with it! Hope you enjoy it.

jtbell

10-10-06, 09:00 AM

WSPA is a LOT fuzzier looking and nowhere as sharp as WBTV.

Likewise for WYCW versus WJZY. WJZY isn't quite as good as WBTV, but it's still a lot better than WYCW on upconverted SD material. I record Star Trek from WJZY and Amazing Race from WBTV in preference to the other two stations.

I wish WLOS or WMYA could carry Star Trek instead of WYCW. The new remastered-in-HD version would look fabulous on either of those stations, even in upconverted SD.

randysc1

10-10-06, 01:48 PM

Let's celebrate!
Just out on the DirecTv site. DirecTv to bring HD local to our area by year end! Just out on the DirecTv site.

http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=127160&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=914114&highlight=

DIRECTV to Deliver Local HD Programming in 67 Markets by Year End
Eighteen More Local HD Markets Named; Approximately 74 Percent of U.S. Television Homes will have Access to Local HD Channels from DIRECTV
EL SEGUNDO, Calif., Oct 10, 2006 (BUSINESS WIRE) -- Already leading the satellite TV industry in the delivery of local HD programming, DIRECTV will offer local HD broadcast networks in 67 markets, representing approximately 74 percent of U.S. TV households, by year end when it rolls out 25 more local HD markets in the fourth quarter.

Local news, sports and popular primetime programming from ABC, CBS, FOX and NBC will be available in HD to customers who subscribe to any TOTAL CHOICE(R) programming package that offers local channels. There is no additional charge for local HD programming.

The 25 local markets to receive HD programming from DIRECTV include:

-- Albuquerque, N.M. -- Mobile, Ala.
-- Buffalo, N.Y. -- New Orleans
-- Des Moines, Iowa -- Norfolk, Va.
-- Flint, Mich. -- Oklahoma City, Okla.
-- Ft. Meyers, Fla. -- Portland, Me.
-- Grand Rapids, Mich. -- Providence, R.I.
-- Green Bay, Wisc. -- Reno, Nev.
-- Greensboro, N.C. -- Santa Barbara, Calif.
-- Greenville, S.C. -- Spokane, Wa.
-- Harrisburg, Pa. -- Springfield, Mo.
-- Jacksonville, Fla. -- Toledo, Ohio
-- Little Rock, Ark. -- Tulsa, Okla.
-- Madison, Wisc.

"With 67 markets receiving local HD channels from DIRECTV by year end, we've set the stage for our historic capacity expansion in 2007," said Dan Fawcett, executive vice president, Programming Acquisition, DIRECTV, Inc. "This will enable us to leapfrog the multichannel video industry in terms of the sheer volume of HD programming available to our customers. With more than 44 million homes projected to have HD TV sets next year, we expect to be the video provider of choice for those consumers, offering the best lineup of HD programming, including local broadcast networks, sports, special events, and national networks, as well as original and exclusive programming."

With the launch of two new satellites - DIRECTV 10 and DIRECTV 11 - in 2007, DIRECTV will have the ability to deliver more than 1,500 local HD and digital channels and 150 national HD channels, in addition to new advanced programming services for customers.

DIRECTV currently offers standard-definition local channels in 142 markets, covering nearly 94 percent of television households in the country, as well as 42 HD local channel markets representing approximately 62 percent of U.S. TV households.

Customers can receive local HD channels by obtaining DIRECTV's H20 HD receiver or its new HR20 DIRECTV Plus HD DVR, which has the ability to record up to 50 hours of programming in the new MPEG4 transmission standard. DIRECTV is offering new customers who purchase a DIRECTV HD or HD DVR receiver a $100 mail-in rebate. (Limit one rebate per customer.) Existing customers are eligible for a $99 upgrade to the new H20 receiver and dish, plus $99 for each additional HD receiver.

Apps1

10-10-06, 02:18 PM

StrangeCock

10-10-06, 02:47 PM

With WLOS OTA still somehwere back in the stone ages, and Charter's unwillingness to give in to Sinclair's extortion, it looks like this might be the only reliable way to pick up WLOS in the near future.

So big bad DirecTV profits while Dumb (Charter) and Dumber (WLOS) can't seem to get their acts together.

Speaking of which, what's the latest on WLOS up there on that mountain? We've had good, working reception from NBC, CBS, and FOX for nearly two years now. But WLOS is still crap. It's better, but it's still crap.

Remember when we had to wait until all the snow melted, or whatever, to fix the problems in the Spring? Well, it's getting near snow time again up there. So are we looking at March 2007 before they even try to do something about it again? Where is the FCC on this whole thing? Shouldn't they be helping the public out on this issue?

Apps1

10-10-06, 03:02 PM

"But WLOS is still crap. It's better, but it's still crap."

WLOS is one of my most reliable channels. I understand some people have issues with this channel but many others receive it fine.

enoree

10-10-06, 08:49 PM

I get WLOS much better in Enoree than WSPA can even dream of. WSPA is the crappy DT here in S. Spartanburg County, while WLOS is a reliable 90-92 SS and stable. I even get WBTV ( Charlotte) better than WSPA.

John Coffey

10-11-06, 01:05 AM

This is in response to StrangeCock's recent posting.

First of all, I believe that Sinclair has a right to demand compensation of some sort for retransmission of their signal -- both legally and --IMHO-- ethically. As a Charter subscriber paying $160/month, I feel as though I pay enough to afford fair compensation to many programming providers.

Secondly, StrangeCock mentioned FCC involvement on WLOS's signal coverage. Billy or Jerry please help me out and correct me if necessary here, but I believe some of these reported reception complaints regarding WLOS are actually due to the FCC regulations.

For example, I remember talking sometime back with the Chief Engineer for WKSF, whose antenna is/was colocated on WLOS's tower. He made the comment that due to the height of the mountain and tower, WKSF could not transmit at the full power, but rather could only transmit at a power strong enough to provide the effect of full power in the surrounding area. The effect of this lower power output was a lot of dropouts in mountainous areas - even those close to Mt. Pisgah - because there was not enough power for WKSF to "punch" into some of the valleys.

I assume that WLOS-DT runs into the same problem, and is not able to transmit at as high of a power as some of the SC stations with towers located at lower elevations. It seems to me that this would cause (for lack of a better term) "shadows" in the coverage area.

Again, this is sheer speculation on my part, as I have not researched this on the FCC's website, and I openly welcome corrections, comments, or criticisms about my comments.

Green23

10-11-06, 11:05 AM

John Coffey

10-11-06, 11:40 AM

I've got a good signal here in Mauldin, with occasional breakups when planes fly over (we are in the filght path for GSP).

Apps1

10-11-06, 12:25 PM

WLOS 13.1 is consistently 30-40% near downtown Greenville while all other DT stations are steady 88% and higher (most in the 90's) including 33.1 from same location on Pisgah. (CM 8 bay with 7777, HR 10-250)

Station has exclusive ABC rights for area and doesn't give waivers, but can't provide signal as well as all other stations here.

I live near downtown as well and have the same receiver and antenna set up as you. I receive all channels, including WLOS in the high 80's. Strange.

mlyles

10-11-06, 02:20 PM

I have Dish Network in upstate SC. The audio is out of sync with the video on my local channels. Just wondering if someone else who has Dish in upstate can verify if it's my problem or a Dish Network problem. Channels 16 and 62 are the worst.

tnmg

10-11-06, 04:35 PM

DIRECTV to Deliver Local HD Programming in 67 Markets by Year End
Eighteen More Local HD Markets Named; Approximately 74 Percent of U.S. Television Homes will have Access to Local HD Channels from DIRECTV:

-- Greenville, S.C. -- Spokane, Wa.

Does this mean DTV HD quality will get worse?

tnmg

10-11-06, 04:37 PM

TNMG--

HD on DirecTV is down-rezed, so from a technical perspective, it should look worse. I have not watched it extensively, so I cannot tell you from a real world perspective. I am a Charter subscriber, and I agree that most of thier HD looks great. As for the locals, you can only get them via OTA antenna if you have DirecTV. At some point they may add this market to their HD Locals via satellite, but currently they are not available. You can only get the nationals with a waiver, and those are not easy to come by.

That's pretty much what I've read everywhere I've looked and has kept me from going to DirecTV. Getting locked in to 24 months of lower HD quality is not my idea of a good deal.

Now I'm thinking about Dish. They have a 30 day gaurentee. What's to lose? Any idea on Dish getting local HDs over the dish? Thanks for your help everyone!

jerry birdwell

10-11-06, 06:18 PM

Does this mean DTV HD quality will get worse?
Satellite delivery to this market should be with MP4 encoding and that will be better. But hopefully, with the new satellites and additional capacity we should see improvement and less need for so much compression.

foxeng

10-11-06, 06:26 PM

Markets who have HD LIL report no HD-Lite for the local stations. Side by side OTA vs D* locals are pretty much equal.

IfixitBIG

10-11-06, 08:39 PM

Anyone having trouble with FoxCarolina HD having audio drop outs on charter?
How about over the air?

jerry birdwell

10-12-06, 09:00 AM

We made the list! SkyRETAILER quotes DirecTV's announcement that this DMA is scheduled for HDTV. The announcement:

"DirecTV said it will offer local HD broadcast networks in 67 markets, about 74 percent of U.S. TV households, by the end of the year when it offers 25 more local HD markets in the fourth quarter.

Customers who subscribe to any Total Choice programming package that offers local channels will have access to local news, sports and primetime programming from ABC, CBS, Fox and NBC available in HD. There is no additional charge for local HD programming.

The 25 local markets to receive HD programming include: Albuquerque, NM; Buffalo, NY; Des Moines, IA; Flint, MI; Ft. Meyers, FL; Grand Rapids, MI; Green Bay, WI; Greensboro, NC; Greenville, SC; Harrisburg, PA; Jacksonville, FL; Little Rock, AK; Madison, WI; Mobile, AL; New Orleans; Norfolk, VA; Oklahoma City, OK; Portland, ME.; Providence, RI; Reno, NV; Santa Barbara, CA; Spokane, WA; Springfield, MO; Toledo, OH; and Tulsa, OK. "

gjlowe

10-12-06, 10:18 AM

Markets who have HD LIL report no HD-Lite for the local stations. Side by side OTA vs D* locals are pretty much equal.

Do you mean that the locals are coming in at their full 1080i or 720p resolutions? So technically speaking, these should look better than the premium HD channels on DirecTV?

gjlowe

10-12-06, 10:19 AM

That's pretty much what I've read everywhere I've looked and has kept me from going to DirecTV. Getting locked in to 24 months of lower HD quality is not my idea of a good deal.

Now I'm thinking about Dish. They have a 30 day gaurentee. What's to lose? Any idea on Dish getting local HDs over the dish? Thanks for your help everyone!

Of course, right after I responded to you DirecTV announced they would be carrying our market's local digital channels! I had Dish for awhile, and their quality was pretty good. I don't think they have announced our market yet though....

lynesjc

10-12-06, 10:30 AM

lynesjc

10-12-06, 10:33 AM

I keep asking but no one responds....

If anyone locally has a Tivo S3, please comment on your cablecard experience and OTA performance.

gjlowe

10-12-06, 10:33 AM

FYI, Charter isn't really advertising it, but now offers 10mb HSI in some areas of the Upstate. $80 w/o bundled services. Vaguely on-topic b/c it speaks to the upgrading of the capacity of their systems implying ample bandwidth for more HDTV.

ESPN2 HD and ABC would put you on par with D* if anyone at Charter is listening...

Yeah..they actually tried to sell me that 10Mbps service, and I was going to get it for a month, but they didn't even have it in their billing system, so they couldn't give it to me! This was a month ago, so they may have since fixed it. I agree about ESPN2 HD and ABC...

tnmg

10-12-06, 11:52 AM

Yeah..they actually tried to sell me that 10Mbps service, and I was going to get it for a month, but they didn't even have it in their billing system, so they couldn't give it to me! This was a month ago, so they may have since fixed it. I agree about ESPN2 HD and ABC...

I would love to have ESPN2HD and ABC... And I would love to see NFL Network HD also. Or just SD. Just bring back NFL Network!

tnmg

10-12-06, 11:54 AM

Of course, right after I responded to you DirecTV announced they would be carrying our market's local digital channels! I had Dish for awhile, and their quality was pretty good. I don't think they have announced our market yet though....

That was another of the reasons I kept passing on DirecTV. It didn't look like we were going to get the HD locals until the new satellites went up. Wasn't Gville supposed to get them before and get passed over?

Apps1

10-12-06, 01:54 PM

"Wasn't Gville supposed to get them before and get passed over?"

No, this is the first time they have been announced by D*.

dashaund

10-12-06, 03:42 PM

Station has exclusive ABC rights for area and doesn't give waivers, but can't provide signal as well as all other stations here.

Here in Travelers Rest it's coming in strong at 88%, on par with other stations. I agree with enoree, WSPA is the CRAPPIEST of them all. I get unreal multipath problems with them. And they've been here the longest and still don't have the kinks worked out! Looks to me like they don't care anymore. Their audio was out-of-sync for the longest time.

Does this mean DTV HD quality will get worse?

Umm...can't answer that. With the new MPEG4 encoding and new satellites, I'd say no. BUT, you never know with D*. I've seen them make some great moves, and seen them make some bad ones. Maybe with HD dedicated satellites, they'll make it better. Meanwhile, you can get your local HD stations for free and better picture and sound quality than D* will offer...

foxeng

10-12-06, 05:26 PM

Do you mean that the locals are coming in at their full 1080i or 720p resolutions? So technically speaking, these should look better than the premium HD channels on DirecTV?

That is what is being reported. Remember, the national channels are MPEG2 on the main birds and the HD LILs are MPEG4 on Spaceway 1 and 2.

lynesjc

10-12-06, 10:05 PM

John Coffey

10-13-06, 03:19 PM

Also...don't forget that DirecTV is launching a new spotbeam satellite this afternoon (10/13). There is speculation that this may be used for HD programming as well. See: http://www.satelliteguys.us/showthread.php?t=79223

megajam02

10-14-06, 01:09 PM

Hello all. I'm new to this forum. Anyone living in the Greer area that can give me advice on what kind of OTA antenna to go with? I will be purchasing a new TV soon, and I'm confused as to what antenna to go with. Any suggestions would be very welcome.

Thanks

blooker

10-14-06, 07:05 PM

Our new neighbor is in the process of moving here from Atlanta. He brought his E* antenna with him and we installed it this afternoon. The Atlanta HD locals look great here, so he will have a decision to make.

Danny Andrews

10-14-06, 10:06 PM

lyn, I had my cable cards installed today. Took less than an hour. No problem and it was the techs first cable card install. I don't know about OTA, though, as my reception here iin Anderson is terrible due to location and I did not set it up. From what I've heard from others the reception is great on the S3 from OTA.

dashaund

10-15-06, 12:21 PM

Anyone living in the Greer area that can give me advice on what kind of OTA antenna to go with?

Hi there and welcome to our forum! I live about 6mi N of Greer. I use an Antennas Direct DB4, however, the most recommended antenna is the Channel Master 4228, which you should be able to pick up at Lowes. I've never tested it myself, but it is a lot like what I have except it's bigger and has more gain (reception strength is measure in gain in case you didn't know). I guess if I was putting in a new install, that would be what I would go with, not that there is ANYTHING wrong with my DB4. Rooftop installs are the best, but you can do it with an attic mount. You'll have to play with the antenna and find its hot spot so that you can get all of the signals at once...you may not be able to though, and in that case, you can get a rotor. Good luck! Any more questions just ask!

megajam02

10-15-06, 03:04 PM

dashaund, thanks for the answers. Do you know if indoor antennas work in our area (or is an indoor antenna the same thing as an attic mount)? Also, what stations are you able to pick up where you are?

dashaund

10-15-06, 03:15 PM

Indoor antennas may be okay for a quick test or something, but wouldn't be adequate for a long term solution. You can forget WLOS with an indoor. No, this isn't the same as attic mount. I've read many folks having success with those, I think it all depends on independent location and what type of roof, etc... Where I'm at, I can get pretty much everything, but not at once I have to rotate. I get WYFF, WHNS, WLOS, WSPA (can get kinda jumpy under bad weather conditions), WBTV (Charlotte CBS...pretty easy to get and more solid than WSPA most of the time), WMYA, WYCW, and PBS out of Greenville, Spartanburg, and Asheville. Depending on weather condtions, I can regularly get 4 Charlotte stations pretty stabily. Of course, having my antenna about 25' off the ground doesn't hurt. The higher the better! And I don't even use a preamp.