Just hooked up my CM7777 preamp. It seems all of my problems may be fixed. I'm still having to use rotator to get WSPA. Can get everything else including WLOS at one time. If I rotate to get WSPA I loose WLOS, but at least a solid signal is coming throught on all channels!

Thanks to everyone with all the input. Hopefully things will only get better from here as the stations increase their power and get better at providing the feeds!

Now back to the Rams/Seahawks game in HDTV!

enoree & others
For many of the DT stations I now receive "almost" without problems I was totally unable to receive a usable analog signal. So I am really pleased with the digital revolution. The next generation of receivers addresses the problems we are having with multipath. Those receivers are due on the market this spring. No question a flat area has far fewer bounced signals, and the only more difficult transmission paths are the canyons of skyscrapers in larger cities. The strange aspect to this area is the subtle changes from season to season in transmission paths, especially for those stations that are not line-of-site, as I have reported several times in the past. So, enoree, I agree with your opinion, and appreciate you sharing your observations.

I was going to grab the CM7777, but I can't find it locally. I guess I'll have to order one. Does anyone know of a Greenville area retailer that carries it? Has anyone in this area tried the Winegard Squareshooter SS-2000?

Well, the football game was cutting out on me again, which has been normal for WLOS for me. I went to the attic and moved my Terk indoor HDTV from the floor to on top of the heater. It moved 4 feet further away from the direction it is pointing and 2 1/2 feet higher off the ground. Now a check of my signal strength show WLOS at 8 bars (was 4), UPN (ch. 62) at 8 bars (was 6) and NBC, CBS, WB and Fox all maxed out at 10 bars. I guess I don't need a new antenna after all. I'm really surprised how much of a difference that little move made!

I was going to grab the CM7777, but I can't find it locally. I guess I'll have to order one. Does anyone know of a Greenville area retailer that carries it? Has anyone in this area tried the Winegard Squareshooter SS-2000?

I asked that same question last week on this thread and was led to Warren Electronics (http://www.warrenelectronics.com/) .
I ordered the CM7777 and got it at my house in two days.
$57.93 + $8.75shipping=$66.68. Shipped to Liberty SC.
I ordered over the phone because I wanted to know the shipping charges.

Originally posted by crgnjul
I was going to grab the CM7777, but I can't find it locally. I guess I'll have to order one. Does anyone know of a Greenville area retailer that carries it? Has anyone in this area tried the Winegard Squareshooter SS-2000?

I've got the SS 1000 along with a CM7775 Pre-amp, and I get everything great. It is pointed almost due north, and I don't have to rotate it.

By all means get the unamplified version (SS-1000) and use a Channel Master preamp. Much better. That is the setup I use in Florida, very unobtrusive, works well.

Originally posted by Wayne Godfrey
Long time lurker - first time poster here :)

I sent an email to Charter yesterday asking about the status of getting WSPA-DT added to the lineup. Every other time I had asked the answer was always "soon".It might have been like this for a while, but I just noticed that Yahoo and Zap2it both list WSPA-DT as airing on channel 787 on Charter. While that's not the case (787 is inaccessible at the moment), that is a mildly interesting (and possibly suggestive?) error.

hrm WSPA is dropping the ball again.. no HD for the nfl today

I've got the football game in HD on WSPA. The audio is out of sync, but you can only tell when you see the person talking, which really does not happen in sporting events.

I've also got the game in HD. Did notice the audio synch problems during half time.

I'd rather have a micro-second audio sync problem on CBS than the wretched picture quality on FOX.

This GB/MINN game looks about as bad as HD can look. FOX better get their act together before the Super Bowl.

Um. The Fox picture looks 100 times better to me than CBS. Fox is 720p, so is my TV, so there is no conversion needed. CBS is 1080i, so my TV has to convert that. I wish my Patriots were on Fox all season.

WHNS is doing a fine job, as far as I'm concerned. I watched a lot of Panthers games in HD, and I thank them for that.

This isn't WHNS's fault...it's FOX's. Here's a thread about how awful it is:
AVS GB/MINN Game Thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=493231)

I stand corrected.

edit: not watching in HD today.

after it got going it looked OK to me... yeah it was far from the best HD I've ever seen, but it was still loads better than what ABC tossed out yesterday IMO

well i feel like an idoit but i finally found out where the strength of signal is on my tv. I can only pull 73 on my cbs channel which at 73 it locks and i have no problems. But i still lose picture if it goes below 50 which happens alot, Way more then i like. I have moved the antenna but i can not get over 73. this is only for CBS i have messed with the other channels yet but is 73 a low signal for CBS?

My tuner does not have a numeric signal strength, but rather shows up to 10 bars like a cell phone. I get 10 bars on CBS, but I'm up in Greer, so I'm a lot closer than you to the tower.

All:
Encouraging note from WSPA regarding both audio and late switching to HD during primetime:
<quote>

Hi Jerry Birdwell,

I'm sorry for the audio and switching problems. Today we removed some of the equipment that affects the audio to get back to basics and see if we can resolve the sync problems. Still looking into the switching problems. It has been more of a challenge than imagined.

Again we apologize to, and appreciate the growing DT audience and hope get these issues resolved soon.

Thank you,

Edgar Woodfin
Assistant Chief Engineer
WSPA-TV/DT
WASV-TV/DT
<end quote>

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
All:
Encouraging note from WSPA regarding both audio and late switching to HD during primetime:
<quote>

Hi Jerry Birdwell,

I'm sorry for the audio and switching problems. Today we removed some of the equipment that affects the audio to get back to basics and see if we can resolve the sync problems. Still looking into the switching problems. It has been more of a challenge than imagined.

Again we apologize to, and appreciate the growing DT audience and hope get these issues resolved soon.

Thank you,

Edgar Woodfin
Assistant Chief Engineer
WSPA-TV/DT
WASV-TV/DT
<end quote>


Last night was the first time in a long time that Monday night programming was not screwed up. Maybe a few e-mails have started to make them at least pay attention. Thanks.

Has anyone heard anything about WASV (UPN 62) going HD anytime soon? They're the last major station in our area to convert so hopefully it won't be too long.

I live in Simpsonville, and I get WSPA in the 90's on my Samsung tuner. Now that was as of this past weekend. I'll check it tonight and see if I get it any worse than that.

J. Burton

Originally posted by walterc
Has anyone heard anything about WASV (UPN 62) going HD anytime soon? They're the last major station in our area to convert so hopefully it won't be too long. Last I heard (around three months ago):

We're looking into the cost of the equipment right now. There's no set date on when you'll be able to see the programming in HD.

If you'd like to e-mail them for an update, their contact address is upn62@wasv.com (mailto:upn62@wasv.com).

If you have experienced problems/changes in WUNF-DT (33-2, etc), Wayne Estabrooks advises:
<quote>
We have had some technical problems there at WUNF with some glitches in the digital stream for a couple of weeks or more now. We have spent considerable time there troubleshooting the problem. When we would select the over-the-air backup stream from WUNG-DT things seemed to play ok. But when we selected the ASI stream from the digital microwave we had glitched every few minutes or more. My assistant Don Smith and Curtis Untalan, transmitter supervisor have been there working on the problem. x x x <end quote>

jb

Information regarding outside antenna restrictions:
http://www.fcc.gov/mb/facts/otard.html

Hi Everybody-

I'm brand new to HD and need help with an off-air antennae. I live right next to the Brashier GT campus in a little bit of a hole. DTV installed a Winegard antenna(unknown model # but it looks like a bird) that will only receive channels 13 and 21 in HD. 4 and 7 never come in no matter which way it is pointed. Do I need a different antenna or are there changes I can make to this one? Thanks!

It is not unusual to have to replace a DTV installed off-air antenna and to correctly orient the antenna for local signals. First, go to this website for an evaluation of your needs: http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/Address.aspx
Then, based on the experience of HD owners in your area, I strongly suggest you get a Channel Master 4 or 8 bay UHF antenna and install it either in your attic or on the roof. Test various possible locations for the best reception.

Most likely you will also get a response someone who is familiar with your specific area and will offer more advice.
After you solve your problem, I suggest you request a refund on the installation of the OTA antenna by your satellite installer.
Good luck.

Thanks, Jerry.

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
It is not unusual to have to replace a DTV installed off-air antenna and to correctly orient the antenna for local signals. First, go to this website for an evaluation of your needs: http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/Address.aspx
Then, based on the experience of HD owners in your area, I strongly suggest you get a Channel Master 4 or 8 bay UHF antenna and install it either in your attic or on the roof. Test various possible locations for the best reception.

Most likely you will also get a response someone who is familiar with your specific area and will offer more advice.
After you solve your problem, I suggest you request a refund on the installation of the OTA antenna by your satellite installer.
Good luck.
For what it's worth, the website is very inaccurate for my location. It reports only two DTV stations receivable at my location, but I am able to receive all except the WB station, and all except WASV are in the 70's or 80's for signal strength. Don't be discouraged by what you see there. Get an antenna, and try for yourself!!

I have never found the maps offered by Antenna web to not correctly locate the potential staions from a receiving address...and to graphically indicate the most logical antenna orientation. Send them a note if you believe there are missing stations that should serve your area.

Originally posted by bristol500
Hi Everybody-

I'm brand new to HD and need help with an off-air antennae. I live right next to the Brashier GT campus in a little bit of a hole. DTV installed a Winegard antenna(unknown model # but it looks like a bird) that will only receive channels 13 and 21 in HD. 4 and 7 never come in no matter which way it is pointed. Do I need a different antenna or are there changes I can make to this one? Thanks!

I'm not familiar with a model that looks like a bird. I've got the Winegard SquareShooter 1000 with a CM 7775 Pre-amp, and I get everything great. I point it almost directly due north. I'm in the Taylors area.

rchalk

For the record, antennaweb.org has never lied to me either. If you want that second opinion, try www.2150.com/broadcast/default.asp. I always like to throw this like out there whenever possible. It's an alternate to antennaweb.org, but it's like antennaweb.org on steroids. It delivers far more detailed information. The only difficultly is my must put in your latitude and longitude. The website will instruct you on how to find those coordinates if you don't already know them. Just some extra info!

Has anyone else on here had any trouble with WSPA lately as far as power levels go? I seem to be struggling to pick them up the past couple of weeks, I haven't repositioned my antenna, and all of the other stations come in like they usually do. I will also add that WLOS is breaking up, and I am now seeing that "pixelization" that some of the other viewers on here are seeing, so its not just Samsung viewers (my apologies :)). I think WSPA COULD be suffering from the same thing, but we'll wait an see. I had to watch the Colts vs. Pats game on WBTV...to think that an out of market station is stronger than the local one if kind of funny isn't it?

I'm in Greer (almost directly behind the Wade Hampton Lowes) and WSPA was great today. In fact, I stopped having my sync issue about 4 days ago on WSPA. Maybe I'm just in a good location, but since moving my Terk indoor HD antenna about 2 feet in height (still in the attic, just higher up) I have gotten 4, 7, 13, 21, 40, 62 without any problems...yep even 13 (WLOS) is now coming in great. I do get the 35's, which are UNC PBS or something, but those are channels that I just don't watch, so I can't tell you how good or bad they come in.

crgnjul,

The sync issue with WSPA has been cleared up because they haven't been passing through DD5.1.

DD5.1? Is that why it didn't sound like a 5.1 sound yesterday and only a stereo sound? Although 5.1 is nice and needed for movies and such, audio being in sync is much more important to me.

Re WSPA-DT, see my report on January 10.

Originally posted by dashaund
rchalk

For the record, antennaweb.org has never lied to me either. If you want that second opinion, try www.2150.com/broadcast/default.asp. I always like to throw this like out there whenever possible. It's an alternate to antennaweb.org, but it's like antennaweb.org on steroids.

This address gives a "not found" error...

The punctuation at the end of the sentence is breaking the link. Try http://www.2150.com/broadcast/default.asp

At least in my case (I didn't change the default magnetic declination setting), it doesn't seem to be providing any useful results, listing PBS stations as the only digital channels available within 87 miles or so.

http://www.2150.com/broadcast/default.asp

Yep, it's the period...sowwy. Didn't pay attention. The reason they're not showing up is because all of the stations EXCEPT PBS's license has expried! Evidently either their license HAS expired, or 2150.com hasn't received the license renewal's yet. Just check the "Include Expired Records" box. Check out the new WLOS transmitter...

Does anyone know why they broadcast a non-stretched 720p feed on 21-1, and a 480i feed on 21-2? I know at first they put weather radar on 21-2, but now it is a simulcast. Doesn't this degrade the 720p feed by taking up bandwidth?

Apps1

Well, to answer your question, yes and no. I agree, I'd rather have the weater radar. E-mail Stan (Stan.Crumley@foxcarolina.com) and tell him that. But really the HD signal doesn't HAVE to take up the entire bandwidth that the FCC allows. Does it look better when it does? It really depends, but usually its about the same. Check out this guys site (http://www.widemovies.com/dfwbitrate.html). He does a great job keeping up with the statistics on bandwidth. Anything over 16mbps looks pretty good. The FCC limit is 19.3mbps in a 6mhz spectrum. An SD signal takes up approx 1/5th of that, which is 3mbps and change, so that's about 16 or so. Of course, you have some "overhead" used, so it might be a little less that 16mbps. If anyone wants to correct my figures, feel free...I did it off the top of my head. 720p seems to not get as choked to light compression as much as 1080i. Heck, D* does more compression than WHNS does!

I think missing the NFL playoffs in HD although it's being broadcast here has finally convinced me to ditch cable and go with DirecTV. A couple of questions, is anyone here using the OTA antenna that DTV offers? Is it worth getting, or should I try to get a CM installed in the attic? Would a DTV installer set that up for me too? I'm in Mauldin, btw; antennaweb.org says I should be able to get the locals.

I thought about going to DirecTV for a long time, but my Internet access has stopped that. I can't get DSL, so Charter is my only option. I decided that if DirecTV was going to make me get the local channels OTA, then why not do that with cable? So I got an OTA tuner and an antenna and I get all the HD channels in the area. I'm in Greer, right behind the Lowes on Wade Hampton. My antenna is the IndoorHD by Terk. It's suppose to be a bad one, but it works for me.

cruxer:
I met with a DirecTV installer yesterday, and the subject of the OTA antennas came up. He confirms what many have said on this forum, the antenna supplied by DTV "just will not serve this area" of mixed location tranmitters. Get yourself a CM for the attic and solve many problems.

crgnjul:

If you are in a problem-free site, close enough to the transmitters and without major obstructions...the Terk is ok. Otherwise...

In case you tune to WYFF-DT and get no signal. The transmitter will be turned off at times during the day while their transmitter upgrade takes place. They should be up at full power by the second week in February.

Originally posted by cruxer
I think missing the NFL playoffs in HD although it's being broadcast here has finally convinced me to ditch cable and go with DirecTV. A couple of questions, is anyone here using the OTA antenna that DTV offers? Is it worth getting, or should I try to get a CM installed in the attic? Would a DTV installer set that up for me too? I'm in Mauldin, btw; antennaweb.org says I should be able to get the locals.

I didn't know there was a standard ota antenna that Dtv subs were suppose to you. The person that did my install is doing the SquareShooter 1000 for all his OTA antenna requests. It's more expensive, but coupled with a CM 7775 pre-amp I get everything with no problems. I would check with your installer and see what he normally does for OTA and go from there. They should install whatever you request for OTA but of course charges will apply dependent on the time it takes to do it.

I meant to post this sooner and apps1 beat me to it. As he stated, we are installing the full power upgrade and the transmitter will be down occasionally during daytime hours as a result. Barring something unexpected, we will be up during prime-time each evening.

Expect an extended outage on 1/20 or 1/21 as we drain and flush the cooling system. This is necessary since we have added additional plumbing to handle the two additional power amplifiers.

Doug

walterc

My DirecTV contact, who works directly for DirecTV in both sales and installation, says the company has turned down several requests to provide a wider range of antenna types for this area...but has turned down the requests. DTV offers only one type to subs who take advantage of the "free" OTA antenna. Contract installers offer a greater range for a fee.

I've got a couple of questions for everybody. First: for our Charter customers, can you hook up an OTA antenna to any of their HD STB's and watch HD on your monitor (assuming your TV does not have an HD tuner)? Will the STB incorporate the locals into the program guide? Which of the boxes work and which ones do not? I know they offer the Moxi (their DVR) and also another alternative. And secondly: anybody know if there is an HDTV on the market right now that has the built in HD tuner and also will act as a DirecTV tuner? In other words, can you buy this TV and then watch D* HD programming without one of their STB's?
Finally, what is the deal with ESPN2 HD and why is it not available on DirecTV? And if it is, what channel is it? There is a thread on the HDTV info page but it seems like that thread has been hijacked by a bunch of smartasses. I'm hoping for some straight answers here. Thanks in advance for any feedback.

Paul B. (Calvin is my dog.)

Speaking of WYFF, is there something wrong with their DD5.1 encoder or something? All of the HD shows seem to be in 5 speaker stereo with the same thing coming out of all the speakers. I'll have to check and see what my reciever is decoding it as, but it doesn't sound near as good as WSPA and WHNS (except the popping noises!). Does anyone else notice this, or is it just me?

Paul - I'm a Charter customer and use an OTA external tuner. I'm using a samsung tuner, only because my TV is samsung and when I bought everything Circuit City only had the Samsung tuner or a Magnavox. I don't use any Charter cable boxes on this TV. The OTA goes to the DVI input of the TV. The cable goes from the wall to the Tivo, to an S-Video input. I do have digital cable on another TV, but I don't watch enough of the digital channels that I want to deal with the IR blaster from the Tivo to the cable box.
I've called Charter and asked about the Moxi, but have been told it is not offered yet...only for select beta testers. Of course the only HD channels Charter offers that I care about are ESPN and NBC. So not a big problem for me anyway. Now, when they get all the local stations, then I'll care.

Originally posted by crgnjul
I've called Charter and asked about the Moxi, but have been told it is not offered yet...only for select beta testers.That's dumb since they have a billboard for the DVR on I-385. When was the last time you called, out of curiosity? I got a letter and a manual in the mail last month (I believe) that seemed to indicate that the beta period was over.

Of course the only HD channels Charter offers that I care about are ESPN and NBC. So not a big problem for me anyway. Now, when they get all the local stations, then I'll care. I think you might be surprised by what HDNet offers (well, more HDNet Movies than HDNet) -- I watch the two of those channels more than Charter's other offerings combined. HDNet Movies has a mostly older catalog, but they show some really great movies. A lot of dreck, sure, but there are some gems in rotation. In the past month or so, I've watched Annie Hall, Dog Day Afternoon, and Network on there, just to name a few. HBO doesn't show as many movies that attract my interest, but there are enough for it to be worthwhile for me to have, and I do like some of their original programming.

Originally posted by crgnjul
I've called Charter and asked about the Moxi, but have been told it is not offered yet...only for select beta testers.

The Moxi has been available in Spartanburg for several weeks now (not beta). Greer could be different since there's apparently a distinction between the Greenville and Spartanburg areas but you might want to check with them again because -- oddly enough -- many of their sales people don't have a clue.

Adam - I checked with them on Jan 4th, 2005 the last time. I don't watch many movies. The ones I want, I buy on DVD and watch that way. PrimeTime TV and the NFL are the big draws to me.

Wayne - I'm in Greenville County. A co-worker of mine is also in Spartanburg and he has the Moxi.

Again, once they have the local channels in HD, I will be begging for a Moxi.

Originally posted by crgnjul
Again, once they have the local channels in HD, I will be begging for a Moxi. ...although you might want to take the plunge if-slash-when they offer the local Fox and CBS affiliates. It seems enormously unlikely that ABC (and, I'd imagine for the same reasons, the WB affiliate) will be part of Charter's HD line-up anytime soon.

Yea, CBS and Fox are the big too. The only time I watch ABC is LOST, Alias and Monday Night Football. Speaking of - What's up with them moving Alias to 1am? That's just WRONG!

I don't think that's going to be a regular thing -- just wound up that way because of the basketball game. Things are scheduled as usual for that time next week, anyway.

Originally posted by crgnjul
Yea, CBS and Fox are the big too. The only time I watch ABC is LOST, Alias and Monday Night Football. Speaking of - What's up with them moving Alias to 1am? That's just WRONG!

Did anyone see if they passed along the HD feed at 1am? I dont think they have the ability to time shift HD.

a friend of mine here in Greenville has the Moxi and it is pretty neat. There is a VERY long thread about it in the hardware thread (70+ pages). It has lots of issues, one of them being the DVI port is not active and I don't believe you can input an OTA antenna. I'm wondering about the other Motorola box. does it have a "RF in" coaxial input - and does it work? Also, the Moxi SD is miserable for most channels, and I mean really bad even by Charter standards. If I were a Charter customer and wanted local HD access I would really disappointed with the hardware that is available. Thank God I am not.

I am in Asheville, and I have the Moxi. A couple of points:

1) The Moxi box is the Motorola 9012, and it does NOT accept an OTA antenna input.

2) I used to think like crgnjul did, but once I got HBO and Showtime HD...better than the best DVD you have!!! Unbelievable!! I watched X-Men 2, and it was better than the theater! (of course, I prefer my home theater to a real one even with SD TV)

3) The DVI port should be enabled with the 3.2 update in March.

tigerarch:
Describe the popping noise.

Jerry,

If the popping noise is what I experience on occassion. Its happens with the sub. Like their is a flaw in the signal.

Mike

Re popping noise:
I have a "loud" pop or snap when my Onkyo automatically switches to or from AC-3 (optical) when I switch the Samsung-160 from an analog source to DT (Channel 7 to 7-1 and back), after a couple of seconds pause. This only happens on a few stations, and I am told that it is caused by the station not providing a "mute" signal for the switch. I don't have that problem with WYFF-DT. Samsung has no solution to the problem. Haven't checked with Onkyo.

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
tigerarch:
Describe the popping noise.

When watching WHNS either live (like football) or recorded (like American Idol) the sound will go really loud for a split second, then back down to normal levels. It will do this every couple of seconds for a few minutes, and then stop.

BTW, ER last night sounded fine. It wasn't in 5 channel surround like it has been.

Is anyone else's WHNS signal all over the map today?

87, 70, 76, 81, 67, 84...no stability at all and tons of dropouts. I hope it settles down before the game starts.

My signal indicator is shown as bars, not numbers. It is showing FULL strength to me, but I've got dropouts all over the place as well. They even went to the SD signal for a couple minutes during the game.

It's like that for me too.

I've got my Directv dish and am loving it. I bought a little set-top antenna just for the weekend until I can get the real deal (I guess a CM4228?) installed in my attic. Anybody got any recommendations on a good supplier and installer? I'm surprised that I can actually get WHNS and WLOS pretty consistently with set-top, but WSPA and WYFF never seem to come in.

Cross

Really surprised you do not get WYFF in that WLOS and WHNS should be in about the same direction from you, and they are fairly close together...and all are tall towers. WSPA on Hogback should not be a problem from Greenville, but you may have some attenna adjusting to do. The CM in the attic may pickup all and more. from one position. WYFF is in the process of increasing power.

Originally posted by cruxer
I've got my Directv dish and am loving it. I bought a little set-top antenna just for the weekend until I can get the real deal (I guess a CM4228?) installed in my attic. Anybody got any recommendations on a good supplier and installer? I'm surprised that I can actually get WHNS and WLOS pretty consistently with set-top, but WSPA and WYFF never seem to come in.

Cross
If you have occasion to go to Atlanta, Fry's Electronics (near Gwinnett Place Mall) usually has the CM 4228 in stock. About $50.00

Has anyone with Charter and a QAM tuner in their set lost ch.7(WSPA) on channel 103.2? Mine went out about 4-5 days ago. I still get WYFF on
103.1, but not 103.2.

Thanks,

Originally posted by StrangeCock
Is anyone else's WHNS signal all over the map today?

87, 70, 76, 81, 67, 84...no stability at all and tons of dropouts. I hope it settles down before the game starts.

My WHNS was doing the same thing. I believe it was being caused by the high winds making my antenna sway. I took my 4228 antenna off of my tall mast and put it on a small mast right above the roof line and after that I did not get any more drop outs. It did go to SD for a couple of minutes.

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
Really surprised you do not get WYFF in that WLOS and WHNS should be in about the same direction from you, and they are fairly close together...and all are tall towers. WSPA on Hogback should not be a problem from Greenville, but you may have some attenna adjusting to do. The CM in the attic may pickup all and more. from one position. WYFF is in the process of increasing power.

I figured out that if I turned off the on-board amplifier, I had better luck getting WSPA, but still not consistently enough to watch the game. I'm thinking these are multipath issues, since AntennaWeb says WHNS' tower is the farthest from me, but I pull it in most consistently. I can also pull in WLOS, but the audio seems very out-of-sync with the video. I understand this is a problem (possibly) with the Samsung boxes (I think mine is an H10?), although I don't experience any problems on ESPNHD. Others having the Samsung 720P problem say that OTA stuff works perfectly; I seem to have the opposite problem. Oh well, I'm hoping that since I can get stuff to work with this cheap Terk antenna, once I move to the CM4228, everything will be rock solid.

--Cross

Cruxer, unless you have the Samsung TS-360 STB, you should be fine with your local HD channels. Here in Greenville, the Samsung will only have issues with non-sports HD programming on WLOS-DT (OTA) and ESPN-HD (DirecTV). I have the 720p problem both OTA (ABC) and satellite (ESPN-HD). For some reason, Fox's 720p stuff comes in fine for me (OTA) but I know others have issues with Fox and the Samsung 360.

Yes, my CBS-DT (Charter 103.2) feed died a few days ago as well...might as well though, it is the crappiest of all the DT signals. I get NBC on cable, and ABC-DT, Fox-DT, and UNC-DT feeds OTA with a cheap recoton rabbit ear antenna sitting next to the television...I love WLOS ota signal, LOST and The Sunday night Housewives and Boston Legal look great!

Did anyone else notice drop-outs with WLOS-DT Friday night? This is the first time since I got my pre-amp that a local channel has been unwatchable. I'm wondering if the wind was a factor.

I have had problems with WLOS for the past two days.

I tried to see if the signal was any better now than it had been , but even after doing a rescan I get no signal whatsoever from it. I do not buy the weather argument or the PBS is on the same tower at full strength argument about the cause for the loss of a usable signal here in Enoree, when THEY fixed the sound problem several weeks ago the problems started. THEY did something to their encoder to cause problems for some brands of receivers, someone there screwed something up but probably doesn't want to admit to doing it. My kids live next door and have a smaller outside antenna with no rotor and have a Sanyo set with built in tuner and get WLOS-DT just fine. So it's NOT a power level problem. it's a software glitch that they seem unwilling to fix problem, so I will just continue watching ABC-HD on either WABC-DT, KABC-DT or WOLO-DT(Columbia) and the staff and management of WLOS can take a hike.

Originally posted by enoree
I tried to see if the signal was any better now than it had been , but even after doing a rescan I get no signal whatsoever from it. I do not buy the weather argument or the PBS is on the same tower at full strength argument about the cause for the loss of a usable signal here in Enoree, when THEY fixed the sound problem several weeks ago the problems started. THEY did something to their encoder to cause problems for some brands of receivers, someone there screwed something up but probably doesn't want to admit to doing it. My kids live next door and have a smaller outside antenna with no rotor and have a Sanyo set with built in tuner and get WLOS-DT just fine. So it's NOT a power level problem. it's a software glitch that they seem unwilling to fix problem, so I will just continue watching ABC-HD on either WABC-DT, KABC-DT or WOLO-DT(Columbia) and the staff and management of WLOS can take a hike.
I have a Samsung 365, the Hughes/DirecTV DVR, and a built-in tuner in an RCA TV. The Samsung and the hughes both receive WLOS as channel 13-1 and -2, with signal strengths in the 80's. The RCA refuses to see it at all, either by scanning, or by direct entry. It is definitely not a signal strength problem, and the RCA used to work fine, so something has changed. The RCA tuner is of the same vintage as the DTC-100 (about 2 years old)

I got the RCA also, when they "fixed" the sound problem is when I lost them. Until they admit that they changed something on their end all the excuses that others make for them will be just a bunch of BS.

WLOS

I've got the Zenith 520 and it doesn't work on my box either. FYI, the Zenith is the same as the Sony 200 and 300. So I'd guess that those boxes don't work either.

WLOS no longer comes in on my DTC-100 either.

Originally posted by walterc
Did anyone else notice drop-outs with WLOS-DT Friday night? This is the first time since I got my pre-amp that a local channel has been unwatchable. I'm wondering if the wind was a factor.

I have been getting the drop outs for several days now. The wind was calm last night and I still experienced audio drop outs and some pixelization.

Re WLOS: There are several theories being kicked around among engineers as to the problems with WLOS-DT. My night-time reception of 56 makes it impossible to watch, although day-time is stable.
Two very recent bits of information from the station are: 1. Signal strength will not come about until late spring; and 2. The recent adjustment that corrected audio problems had nothing to do with reception problems.
In my case, the loss of a number of trees on the ridge line and near my receiving antenna marked the overnight change in reliability of WLOS DT, whether or not it was the cause.

Apps1, just so you know, my Samsung 360 720p problem is NOT fixed; repeat: I still have the same old problems with WLOS-DT on my Sammy STB. No change from a week ago or a month ago. Better hold on to that RCA. Curses...

Originally posted by calvinb
Apps1, just so you know, my Samsung 360 720p problem is NOT fixed; repeat: I still have the same old problems with WLOS-DT on my Sammy STB. No change from a week ago or a month ago. Better hold on to that RCA. Curses...

I guess only the DirecTV 720p problem has been fixed. Whatever D* did I wish they would pass the info along to WLOS-DT and the other OTA ABC stations that people are having problems with. Thanks

Well, looks like no Super Bowl in HD for us lowly Charter customers. That is...unless Charter gets on the ball in a few days.

Tommy, which charter box do you have? Am I correct in assuming that neither their original Motorola Hd box nor the new Moxi unit will allow an OTA antenna to be input? That is awful.

Charter not having the stuff I can get OTA is the exact reason I have not gone to getting HD from Charter. Once they get those channels, I'll move over and have an OTA tuner ready to eBay :)

Originally posted by calvinb
Tommy, which charter box do you have? Am I correct in assuming that neither their original Motorola Hd box nor the new Moxi unit will allow an OTA antenna to be input? That is awful. The Moxi box does not, but the STB they offered me originally -- the Motorola DCT-5100 -- did. Presumably the newer not-DVR-models from Motorola also have an antenna input as well.

Originally posted by tommyp007
Well, looks like no Super Bowl in HD for us lowly Charter customers. That is...unless Charter gets on the ball in a few days. Yeah, I'm genuinely surprised Charter didn't leap on that...it seems like carrying the Super Bowl in HD would be a great promotional hook, but once again, Charter drops the ball. As someone mentioned earlier in this thread, some Charter markets are carrying Cinemax-HD and Starz-HD, but I wouldn't expect us to be able to watch either of those any time soon...at least not through Charter, and considering how annoying their current re-compression is, I'm not sure if they even have the capacity locally to offer more channels.

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
Re WLOS: There are several theories being kicked around among engineers as to the problems with WLOS-DT. My night-time reception of 56 makes it impossible to watch, although day-time is stable.
Two very recent bits of information from the station are: 1. Signal strength will not come about until late spring; and 2. The recent adjustment that corrected audio problems had nothing to do with reception problems.
In my case, the loss of a number of trees on the ridge line and near my receiving antenna marked the overnight change in reliability of WLOS DT, whether or not it was the cause.

This seems to equate with my experience with WLOS yesterday. I was able to watch the (nonHD) game in the afternoon, but in the evening, I couldn't even get an unreliable signal. AFAIK, nothing is changed right around my house (no trees cut, etc.).

Of course once they fix that problem, I'll still have the audio sync problem. D* seemed to fix their Samsung/720p problems by changing something in the broadcast, and WHNS doesn't exhibit the same behavior. Any chance of getting WLOS folks to look at that too? Who is the contact person there for this type of issue?

thanks,
--Cross

Originally posted by cruxer
This seems to equate with my experience with WLOS yesterday. I was able to watch the (nonHD) game in the afternoon, but in the evening, I couldn't even get an unreliable signal. AFAIK, nothing is changed right around my house (no trees cut, etc.).

Of course once they fix that problem, I'll still have the audio sync problem. D* seemed to fix their Samsung/720p problems by changing something in the broadcast, and WHNS doesn't exhibit the same behavior. Any chance of getting WLOS folks to look at that too? Who is the contact person there for this type of issue?

thanks,
--Cross

jcarrier@wlos.sbgnet.com

Here's what I got from WHNS in response to an email asking the status of having Fox on Charter:


We have been working on an agreement that would allow Charter to rebroadcast our HD signal but at this time no agreement has been reached. At this late a date I do not believe that we will have an agreement in place prior to the Super Bowl. HD broadcast will be available over free off air reception of our ATSC HD signal 21-1 or on some receivers as channel 57.

Thank you for your interest in Fox Carolina HD.

Jerry W. Garvin

Chief Engineer


So no, won't be watching the Superbowl in HD. Hope it comes soon. Would like to at least watch 24 in HD.

Until about a week ago I received WLOS without any problems. I have made no changes in my equipment but now cannot get a watchable signal from WLOS. I use a samsung SIR-T151 and a SIR-T165 decoder. (SIR-T165 has its share of bugs but does provide a good picture). Sometimes I have to rotate my ant. to get WSPA but have always gotten a great signal from WLOS. I just turned on the 6:00 news to see if the picture had gotten any better and it hasn't. It is nice to know that I am not the only one having problems. I hope they figure the problem out soon.

I have the Samsung SIR-T451 and am not currently having any issues with WLOS or anything else I get OTA. I'm near Lowes on Wade Hampton.

I have the Charter Motorola DTC6200 HD box...no OTA input on this one. I don't mean to be a jerk to Charter about it, but with internet, HD programming, and the movie pack, they hit me up for over $125 a month. I just think they should expand their HD programming some. Heck, replace that Braves station with HD PPV or something during the off-season.

Originally posted by tommyp007
Heck, replace that Braves station with HD PPV or something during the off-season. Bravesvision (or whatever it's called) isn't accessible to me anymore...they were showing test patterns for a while, but not anymore. I think it was gone before Discovery HD Theater popped up.

does anyone with Charter HD and the Motorola DTC-5100 have an OTA antenna hooked up to it? Does the box integrate the info into the guide (if it works) ? I'm trying to counsel a newbie customer of Charter.

I haven't been able to pick up a WLOS signal in about 3-4 weeks. I used to get it without any drop outs. I have a rotator and have sweeped through 360 degrees to see if I could pick it up on another orientation. No luck for me. I am using a Zenith C32v37 with build in OTA tuner.

I hope they get the problem fixed soon (even better would be going to full power as I think the issue is power related).

I made them aware of the issues many of us are seeing and this is the response.

"Last Monday (1/31) we experienced a problem in our studio to transmitter
microwave system. The units are back at the factory at this moment and
we are running on a backup system. This may be causing the problem you
describe although I am not able to see anything wrong in the data stream."

I think most of the problems seem to pre-date this issue, but maybe when they get the repaired units back it will help.

I hope they get it back up to normal soon -- hopefully by the time the next new Lost show is aired!

It drops out so bad right now it's just not worth watching.

In discussions with WLOS, I get the impression that they have received relatively few documented complaints of the recent problems receiving their DT signal...although there is some indication they are ready to acknowledge that their data stream may be flawed. It is too bad we have so few responses from subscribers to create a more impressive report to the station regarding the recent changes. The station now suggests that we not change our systems until the repaired demod is returned and installed.

I should get notice of when that happens, and will post it here.

Originally posted by Adam Tyner
I'm not sure if they even have the capacity locally to offer more channels. FWIW, Charter is ditching some of the OnDemand PPV channels in the 800s to reclaim bandwidth at the end of the month. Maybe that'll be directed to make a little more HD available. Probably not, but I'll pretend to remain hopeful anyway.

Besides me, has anyone else been having problems receiving WYFF? I have not been able to receive any sort of OTA signal from them for at least the last two days? All of my other stations are normal. I have not had any problems with WLOS, as some have reported.

I'm getting WYFF (and everything else) just fine right now.

For the past week or so WYFF has been doing day-time work on its DT transmitter, and signing back on very late in the afternoon.
Unfortunately, no one from the station bothered to use this forum to advise us in advance of the need to be off the air. This, of course, causes many of us to make needless adjustments to our systems.

I will send them a note accordingly.

They have had some equipment failures during their install. The upgrade should be completed next week.

After Craig responded, I again tried, without success I might add. I went through the digital add-on option and even later I did a complete channel search. Now, I do not even show WYFF in the available channels.

Historically, WYFF has been one of my best channels, receiving in the 90's. I did have to re-aim my antenna in the fall. But, everything has been good since then.

Originally posted by loggerhead
After Craig responded, I again tried, without success I might add. I went through the digital add-on option and even later I did a complete channel search. Now, I do not even show WYFF in the available channels.

Historically, WYFF has been one of my best channels, receiving in the 90's. I did have to re-aim my antenna in the fall. But, everything has been good since then.

WYFF-DT OTA has been down since around 9:00 am Friday morning.

I am in Greenwood SC and am trying to pick up the HD OTA channels out of Greenville, SC which is about 60 miles away- CBS/7, NBC/4 and FOX21. Anybody from that area have any antenna/preamp combos that are working from that distance??
Less specifically, does anyone have any thoughts on on optimum antenna/preamp combos for fringe UHF HDTV reception from that distance??
Thanks in advance.

I also get no signal from WYFF-DT. I know there was an annoucement in this thread a while back that they were going to be doing some things to the system and to expect some outages. However, after several days without it I came to this thread to make sure it wasn't just my signal. Good to know that it is a WYFF-DT issue, but I am ready to have it back!

WYFF-DT is back up and the SS is higher than before, so I assume that they have increased the power level, whether or not its full power yet is anyones guess.

WYFF's Doug Durkee has responded to my original message regarding WYFF's DT outage:

>>My apologies. The installer don't give me an absolute schedule of when
they need to take the transmitter down. This should be over soon.

Doug


(Original message):


Your work (I assume) on the DT transmitter during the past week has caused confusion among HD viewers and, often, a lot of needless system adjustment. Why not use the AVS local forum to keep us informed?

Jerry Birdwell <<

Originally posted by krfuquamd
I am in Greenwood SC and am trying to pick up the HD OTA channels out of Greenville, SC which is about 60 miles away- CBS/7, NBC/4 and FOX21. Anybody from that area have any antenna/preamp combos that are working from that distance??
Less specifically, does anyone have any thoughts on on optimum antenna/preamp combos for fringe UHF HDTV reception from that distance??
Thanks in advance.

You'll really be pushing the limits of UHF reception at that distance. You might get great reception, but it is really going to depend on line of sight and obstructions that block line of sight.

As far as equipment, I think you need to stick with a good 8 bay UHF antenna like the Channel Master 4228A. A preamp is also going to be required - something like the Channel Master 7777, and a rotor to fine tune the orientation - like the Channel Master 9521A which includes a remote control so you can make adjustments from the couch.

All of these items can be purchased at Warrens Electronic Distribution Co. (http://www.warrenelectronics.com/)

I concur with sic0048 above, but beware of the windloading on the 4228 - a lot of bracing is required.

:)

The full power upgrade for WYFF-DT is complete. We now have an ERP of 1,000,000 watts.

Let me know how your relative signal strength is now compared to before the upgrade.

Doug

WYFF-DT was 80-82 before now 93-94. On a related note WSPA-DT has fallen off tremendously in SS recently, almost unwatchable with lots of drop outs, WBTV-DT in Charlotte has always been stronger here in Enoree than my "local' station WSPA-DT.

Originally posted by enoree
WYFF-DT was 80-82 before now 93-94. On a related note WSPA-DT has fallen off tremendously in SS recently, almost unwatchable with lots of drop outs, WBTV-DT in Charlotte has always been stronger here in Enoree than my "local' station WSPA-DT.

Thanks for the SS report.

I have trouble with WSPA and I can see their tower from my house. A poorly adjusted transmitter, even with a high signal strength, can be difficult to decode. Digital is much less forgiving than analog. I'm not sure why they're so difficult to receive. I'll have to check them on our analyzer.

Doug

Re WYFF-DT
I have always received a 100% signal from WYFF-DT when the using a CM 4 bay antenna without amplification, and with it oriented directly toward your tower. As of last night, it dropped to 93, and no adjustment would bring the signal back up. Other signals seem to be normal. Perhaps your signal now overloads my Samsung TS 160.

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
Re WYFF-DT
I have always received a 100% signal from WYFF-DT when the using a CM 4 bay antenna without amplification, and with it oriented directly toward your tower. As of last night, it dropped to 93, and no adjustment would bring the signal back up. Other signals seem to be normal. Perhaps your signal now overloads my Samsung TS 160.

Mine has gone from low 80's to mid 90's, and NO breakups.

On a related note, everyone was down a bit last night, which seems to happen to me during significant weather changes. WLOS was so bad that my recording of NYPD Blue was unwatchable, while normally it is solid.

Jerry, perhaps this affected you too. Normally a signal overload will be more noticeable on other stations that the one causing the overload, either as a reduction in signal strength due to de-sensitization, or as interference due to Intermodulation, but seldom as a reduction in the signal strength of the strong station.

As for WSPA, if they pay as little attention to their transmitter as they do to audio levels, network switching, audio sync, and overall operations of their DTV system, I wouldn't be at all surprised if the transmitter is out of adjustment.

Doug, can you look at the eye patterns from your place, and see just how good or bad it is?

It is amazing to me that WSPA, who along with CBS was the most agressive in pursuing the whole DTV endeavor, has now fallen so far behind the pack...

Originally posted by rchalk
can you look at the eye patterns from your place, and see just how good or bad it is?

I looked at the eye pattern this morning and it looks horrible. It's a wonder anyone is decoding their signal.

Part of the problem may be that Ron Peeler, their Chief Engineer, is in Afghanistan so they are a bit short handed.

Doug

Originally posted by douglasd5
I looked at the eye pattern this morning and it looks horrible. It's a wonder anyone is decoding their signal.

Part of the problem may be that Ron Peeler, their Chief Engineer, is in Afghanistan so they are a bit short handed.

Doug

Can you do the same thing for WLOS and let us know what it looks like?

Re WYFF-DT power increase. Only WYFF-DT has dropped in power and remained at 93 during the entire day. I get the same reading off the large all-band RS antenna in the attic as I get from the CM 4-bay outside. I have never not had 100% from the WYFF until now. I can see the tower's strobe from my antenna site. All other stations -- except WLOS-DT which appears to be off the air installing their repaired demod -- are performing as usual. WSPA-DT remains a reliable signal at 93-100%, the same as it has been since the power increase for that station. For the record, I also tried a simple dipole for WYFF in order to lower the signal, and got a drop to 86%. Otherwise, the signal is stable.
This is a mystery to me!

WLOS-DT
The station is back on the air tonight, and the signal/picture is rock steady after several weeks of unwatchable pictures and frequent audio dropouts.

I concur with Jerry. I had a solid signal with high signal strength and no drop outs tonight for the first time since the first of the year. I made no changes in my system, so WLOS obviously fixed something on there end.

Heck, the audio was even in synch. Let's hope this continues.

EDIT - changed time from 2 months to first of the year (I had a tough time pulling in the college bowl games - that was the start of the problem and it got progressively worse over the next week). Although it certainly felt like 2 months, I wanted to be accurate.

FYI, The FCC website is reporting that WLOS has elected to go back to channel 13 when the digital transition is over.

The audio during Lost was in-sync, but apparently it's not during the Duke/NC State game. Or at least, that's what a friend of mine who's watching the game in my living room just told me. The analog broadcast is fine.

I noticed WSPA-DT is now listed on Zap2it's TV listings for Charter Digital in Greenville as channel 787. Has Charter now added the local CBS station to their HD lineup? I don't have digital cable, so I can't confirm this.

I do not get it and I am on Charter in Asheville.

I hope WLOS's decision to go back to 13 proves to be better thought out than SCETV's use of VHF Ch 9 in Greenville, considering the multipath, the co-channel problems from the many "close spaced" Channel 13s throughout the region. And there is no station's signal that bounces around these mountains more than 13. I should know.

Originally posted by sitedesign
I noticed WSPA-DT is now listed on Zap2it's TV listings for Charter Digital in Greenville as channel 787. Has Charter now added the local CBS station to their HD lineup? I don't have digital cable, so I can't confirm this.

Not yet (in Spartanburg) but I noticed something odd last night.

I have the Charter DVR (Moxi). I was using the Find and Record function to schedule a recording for a show on CBS and noticed that in that menu it showed up on both channel 7 (SD) and 787 (HD). The channel did not show up in any of the other channel listings (Channels, HDTV, etc.) and I could not manually tune to it.

I hope this means it is coming SOON!

Now if they would just add WLOS because that's the only local channel that I can't get with my little indoor, set-top antenna.

How does Charter receive the digital channels? I have a feeling they would have an antenna to pick up the OTA signal and then just pass it along. Is this correct?

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
I hope WLOS's decision to go back to 13 proves to be better thought out than SCETV's use of VHF Ch 9 in Greenville, considering the multipath, the co-channel problems from the many "close spaced" Channel 13s throughout the region. And there is no station's signal that bounces around these mountains more than 13. I should know.

Today (2/10/05) is the day all television stations must tell the FCC what channel they will ultimately use for DTV. This is obviously a very critical issue and there are many factors that go into the making of the decision. After the transition, all television stations will be on channels 2 - 51. Since WYFF, WLOS, WSPA and WHNS were given DTV assignments above 51, staying on those channels is not an option. So WLOS's "decision" to go to 13 for DTV is about the only option. They could try to find another channel, but 13 is generally considered a good channel for DTV due to relatively low interference and low operating cost. WNTV's decision to stay on 9 is primarily due to the significantly lower operating cost of 9 vs. 29. Since SCETV has a station in Spartanburg, they don't need to cover it from Greenville, so the smaller coverage area of 9 vs. 29 isn't a problem.

I don't have any inside information, but you can expect WHNS and WSPA to go to their NTSC channels for DTV. In the case of WYFF, we could go to 4 for DTV, but low VHF channels (2-6) are now considered to be unsuitable for DTV due to significant interference issues. Impulse noise (sparkles in the video) and cochannel interference (wavy lines in the video) are annoyances in the analog world, but will kill a DTV signal. And we have major issues with both of these problems which are entirely out of our control. So needless to say, we have some work to do.

On another note for you Directv subscribers, Directv is investigating picking up the HD signals from the Greenville, Spartanburg, Asheville, Anderson market. Don't ask about when, because I don't know. But at least this is a good sign.

Doug

Originally posted by Apps1
How does Charter receive the digital channels? I have a feeling they would have an antenna to pick up the OTA signal and then just pass it along. Is this correct?

WYFF, both SD and HD, are fed to Charter via fiber optic cable. So Charter subscribers in the upstate will not see an interruption if either transmitter goes down. It is my understanding that Charter Asheville receives WYFF-DT off-air.

Doug

"On another note for you Directv subscribers, Directv is investigating picking up the HD signals from the Greenville, Spartanburg, Asheville, Anderson market. Don't ask about when, because I don't know. But at least this is a good sign."

This is good news. I think that by this time next year, those of us with Directv, will have made their last trip to the roof to fiddle with an antenna.

sitedesign, zap2it has shown WSPA DT as Charter 787 for a couple of months now. Not getting it in Anderson with charter.

Doug: Thanks for the information regarding the DT frequencies. As the former manager of a high band stations, I found significant problems in the analog world from co-channel, adjacent channel and reflections. New to the DT world, I hope you are right regarding its potential. As for power, my annual electric bill for a UHF transmitter 20 years ago was in excess of
$220k, and I have no idea what it would be today! Low band Channel 6 was the most "sparklie" plagued channel from power lines I ever experienced.

Furthermore, I feel the FCC was ill-advised in planning this transistion, and especially for assigning the DT 50's on a temporary basis with a built in plan for confusion--cable and satellite or not.

Originally posted by jerry birdwell


Furthermore, I feel the FCC was ill-advised in planning this transistion, and especially for assigning the DT 50's on a temporary basis with a built in plan for confusion--cable and satellite or not.

Giving every station in the country a second channel was a major task and obviously didn't work out well for everyone. The problem now with repacking is that the FCC doesn't seem to have a clue as to how this process is to proceed. They seem to be making it up as they go along. They have granted a channel 10 DTV license in Lancaster, PA and there is an existing channel 10 in Philadelphia only about 75 miles away. Maybe I'm missing something here, but this doesn't make any sense in light of the fact that the goal of the FCC was to not create any new interference.

It's going to be a bumpy ride.

Doug

Originally posted by Apps1
"On another note for you Directv subscribers, Directv is investigating picking up the HD signals from the Greenville, Spartanburg, Asheville, Anderson market. Don't ask about when, because I don't know. But at least this is a good sign."

This is good news. I think that by this time next year, those of us with Directv, will have made their last trip to the roof to fiddle with an antenna.

Apparently, DirecTV has indicated that Atlanta will have HD Locals by the end of 2005, along with several other large markets. The schedule for subsequent locations is not available yet. It will come, but don't hold your breath...

I also heard that EchoStar has purchased the satellite and spectrum from Voom, so expect some changes and additions there as well. If this is true, there should be an opportunity to expand HD offerings, since they won't have to keep all the SD duplication they have now.

Maybe they will even allocate a little wider bandwidth to the SD, so it will once again look better than a worn-out VHS recording of an off-air program!!!

Re adjacent DMA

The Raleigh stations have all taken UHF frequencies in the FCC selection, except one (11).

In the Triad Market, all stations took UHF except 8.

WLOS is coming in for me without breaking up like it was... BUT now it's doing something very weird. It's like it's dropping frames -- there's clearly jumps in the video every other second or so, but it's not dropping out, only skipping. The sound is coming in fine though.

It's much more watchable than it was, but it's kinda annoying now.

Likewise. Rock-solid signal strength...not even any slight fluctuations one way or the other...but the picture does seem to have a bit of digital jitter or something.

WLOS-HD, I agree with previous posts about the HD defects except the sound is STILL not in sync with the picture, never has been but is not near as bad as it was.

Originally posted by pixelman
WLOS is coming in for me without breaking up like it was... BUT now it's doing something very weird. It's like it's dropping frames -- there's clearly jumps in the video every other second or so, but it's not dropping out, only skipping. The sound is coming in fine though.

It's much more watchable than it was, but it's kinda annoying now.


Was this happening only during HD programming? What set top box do you have?

It was happening for me during 8 Simple Rules, I guess, which is in HD. I wasn't really watching it -- just flipping around -- but even in that few seconds I had it on there, the problem was very noticeable. I flipped back and watched a little bit of "20/20", which is not in HD, and I didn't see similar problems there.

I was watching using the integrated tuner in my Sony XS55.

Originally posted by Adam Tyner
It was happening for me during 8 Simple Rules, I guess, which is in HD. I wasn't really watching it -- just flipping around -- but even in that few seconds I had it on there, the problem was very noticeable. I flipped back and watched a little bit of "20/20", which is not in HD, and I didn't see similar problems there.

I was watching using the integrated tuner in my Sony XS55.

I know from personal experience and reading on this board that some set top boxes have problems with decoding the 720p signal being broadcast by WLOS. I know this problem exists with the Samsung 360 and the new H10's.

I watch WLOS fairly regularly (every episode of Lost, at least), and I've never had this problem before. I'm assuming it was just a hiccup related to HD-material last night. Since a couple other users mentioned it as well, and presumably we're all decoding with different hardware, I'm assuming everyone watching WLOS last night saw this.

Originally posted by Apps1
Was this happening only during HD programming? What set top box do you have?

Apps1 -- I don't have a set-top box, only the internals of my Mits 65511. It was both during HD programming, and non-HD commercials. I'll check it out again tonight & over the next few days, and if it changes, I'll post here. All other channels are fine.

I definitely noticed the frame skipping last night on WLOS. It's on the WLOS end.

On another note I have the CM 7775 Pre-amp which is UHF only. Below what channel number will this cause me trouble if some stations go to lower numbers near the vhf range?

I asked LG about the announced new chip for OTA receivers and received this reply:
<<At this time our sales office has not provided us with an expected release date for a 5th generation receiver. Currently, our set top boxes use the 4th generation chip.>>

I have not noticed any frame jumping with WLOS or other abnormalities. The sound has also been in synch for the shows that I have watched. However, I was out of town all weekend, and haven't watched very much, so perhaps I've just missed it.

Originally posted by pixelman
WLOS is coming in for me without breaking up like it was... BUT now it's doing something very weird. It's like it's dropping frames -- there's clearly jumps in the video every other second or so, but it's not dropping out, only skipping. The sound is coming in fine though.

It's much more watchable than it was, but it's kinda annoying now.

I had the following e-mail exchange with Jim Carrier at WLOS. I'll let him know that we still see the stuttering video and out-of-sync audio. Is it true that even those with non-Samsung STBs now see the issue?

Here's the e-mail:

Cross,

We have made several temporary adjustments and are waiting on some new
modules for our transmitter. Since making these adjustments we have
seen no errors here.

I am interested in hearing from you regarding any change in the video
freezes and lip-sync problems you describe.

You may not be able to receive us until next Tuesday evening because
we're operating at reduced power until the new modules are installed.

Thank you
Jim

Cross Ganaway wrote:
>
> Hi, I understand that you may be able to help me with an issue I've
> experienced in receiving HD broadcasts from WLOS. Several of us
> early-adopters of HD often swap advice/experiences on the following
> forum: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?threadid=322947.
> If you ever have a couple of months with nothing to do, feel free to
> read the whole thread!
>
> Those of us who have Samsung ATSC tuners seem to have an issue with
> ABC-HD feeds from WLOS when filmed programming is shown in HD. The
> video occasionally skips and is always out of sync with the audio. Live
> HD broadcasts and upconverted SD broadcasts don't exhibit the problem.
> FYI DirecTV was having the same issue with all of its 720p programming
> (ESPNHD, ABCHD and FOXHD for those who can't receive it over the air)
> over the satellite when using the same receivers. They recently changed
> something in their broadcast to fix the issue. At least we assume they
> did since they did not send an update to our receivers. Locally,
> WHNS-DT doesn't seem to be affected, even though they also broadcast 720p.
>
> Any help you can give would be greatly appreciated! I really want to be
> able to watch Desperate Housewives and Boston Legal in HD.
>
> Thanks for your time,
>
> --Cross

Re FCC Channel selection for this area:
Two stations, WSPA and WLOS have requested VHF frequencies -- 13 for WLOS, 7 for WSPA.
Channels 21 asked to remain on 21; 40 remains on 40.
WYFF postponed its request until the second round.

So...expect to need a highband VHF antenna for your future OTA DT reception.

I just hope Charter gets the local HD channels in their lineup before this happens.

I guess I won't be replacing my Rat Shack UHF/VHF antenna anytime soon with a UHF only model!

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
Re FCC Channel selection for this area:
Two stations, WSPA and WLOS have requested VHF frequencies -- 13 for WLOS, 7 for WSPA.
Channels 21 asked to remain on 21; 40 remains on 40.
WYFF postponed its request until the second round.

So...expect to need a highband VHF antenna for your future OTA DT reception.

This isn't good news for me either. I don't expect that Dtv will have local HD channels for this area until later 2006. Any thoughts on when this channel change will take place?

Originally posted by walterc
This isn't good news for me either. I don't expect that Dtv will have local HD channels for this area until later 2006. Any thoughts on when this channel change will take place?

Not until analog shutdown. These are just the channels that the stations have asked for when the transition is completed. There is no guarantee the stations will get it, but it is a good chance they will.

Aren't the top 30-40 markets supposed to be carried by D* either late this year or early next year? I believe Greenville is #33 so hopefully we won't have too long to wait.

Originally posted by walterc
This isn't good news for me either.

That's not good news for anybody. Many stations stuck on VHF are requesting UHF stations as their final channel assignment. Intentionally leaving the UHF band will basically blow their chances of expanding their OTA customer base and the leverage that comes with that. It affects the whole market's OTA potential by introducing one more hurdle for viewers to overcome.

Selfishly, it pisses me off because WSPA was my preferred (non-multicasting) CBS for NFL football and I won't be adding a VHF antenna just for that station.

Re WSPA-DT: I continue to experience problems with audio dropout and some pixelization on 7-1, and have seen no improvements in the past two weeks that it has been called to their attention. Any other comments before I send a note to the GM?
Otherwise, the other stations in the area have become fairly stable.

I still have problems with WLOS and the Samsung T360, but they seem unwilling or unable to fix it as D* did with their broadcast. All other stations come in great for me. No problems with WYFF, WSPA, or WHNS.

I checked WLOS tonight (watched Lost), and it was perfect.

Originally posted by CPanther95
That's not good news for anybody. Many stations stuck on VHF are requesting UHF stations as their final channel assignment. Intentionally leaving the UHF band will basically blow their chances of expanding their OTA customer base and the leverage that comes with that. It affects the whole market's OTA potential by introducing one more hurdle for viewers to overcome.

Selfishly, it pisses me off because WSPA was my preferred (non-multicasting) CBS for NFL football and I won't be adding a VHF antenna just for that station.

Oh come on, it isn't that bad! CM 4228's will pick up local VHF high channels with no problem. Every study I have seen shows that VHF high (channels 7-13) is "beach front property." (That is a direct quote told me by an engineer who studies such things.) I know of a case (well one of many), running 1 million watts on a mid UHF channel has slightly less coverage than a VHF high channel running 20,000 watts. You are talking about 2 to 3 kw of transmitter power on the VHF (that 20,000 watts ERP) verses around 60kw of transmitter power for that same UHF mid channel (1 million watts ERP) for the same coverage. The monthly cost savings is about 5 to 1 in favor of the VHF.

The problem is that on VHF high, the stations are densely packed in and in order to have comparable coverage is not always possible. It is almost impossible to compare apples and apples when you talk about analog coverage verses digital since with analog you look at the physical coverage area verses the population density and how many people do/will you cover in the digital world. The power levels also do not directly translate. The FCC has said that if a VHF high station operates at 316kw (max allowed), the equivalent digital power is 95kw. Problem is, unless your station is in the west, you aren't getting that 95kw. Most stations are getting anywhere from 1.5w to 35kw to replicate the analog coverage area. In most cases 15 to 35 works in the digital world for VHF high. In the northeast is a mess. Many of those stations elected to stay UHF since they knew what they had compared to what they might end up with if they stayed on their VHF channels. It is interesting to note that in New York City, several of the VHF high stations elected to go back to their analog assignments. We will see how that works out.

Also your medium and smaller VHF high stations just do not have the money to build full power UHFs and then a couple years rebuild to full power on VHF. I have talked to quite a few engineers who have said they just can't afford to do this twice so they will stay on their digital channel and live with it. The public perception that TV is a bottomless pit of money isn't the case. In my market only the UNC station and my station are returning to our analog channels. The others aren't because they can't afford it or their digital assignment is better than their analog assignment. There are many things that are going into these channel selections and money is driving factor. Here in North Carolina and South Carolina to a lesser extant, those stations that have either waited or can afford it, are trying to go back to their VHF high analog assignments but many of your VHF high power houses like WSOC elected to stay UHF looking at other financial opportunities that are better suited for UHF. Then you have stations like WOLO Columbia that decided to remain on their VHF high digital assignment than go back to their UHF assignment. Every station has their own unique reasoning. Broadcasting is a business first and that is exactly how this change is being handled. Of course this isn't any different than the big AM Radio frequency change after World War II. Many power house stations became back water stations and new power houses were born. Same thing is happening here. The difference is many of the power houses are trying to stay power houses.

Originally posted by foxeng
Oh come on, it isn't that bad! CM 4228's will pick up local VHF high channels with no problem.

All I know is that Channel 8 is the only Columbia station I cannot pick up - all the UHF stations come in just fine.

Originally posted by tigerarch
I still have problems with WLOS and the Samsung T360, but they seem unwilling or unable to fix it as D* did with their broadcast. All other stations come in great for me. No problems with WYFF, WSPA, or WHNS.

I've notified WLOS that we Sammy STB owners are still experiencing problems with their HD broadcasts. I'll keep you posted.

--Cross

RE WLOS DT, the Sammy 160 is handling the current 13-1, 2 signal without problems.

foxeng:
You have done a nice job covering the Broadcasters' positions, but there also are the consumers to be considered. UHF-only DT would have offered much more of a universal base of operation, simplify receivers and associated equipment, including antennas, and generally leveled the playing field.

No current UHF antenna covers the VHF high band adequately. The VHF band cannot support the industry in its entirety, thus I see no reason why one company should enjoy the efficiencies of a V transmitter over the many that will have UHF assignments. Yes, it does take power to overcome the higher frequencies' shortcomings, but from my observations of UHF-DT I believe there are advantages yet to be realized and some that already are very obvious. I am approximately 55 miles from DT-9 in Greenville; 70 from SD-9 in Charlotte and can assure you there are co-channel problems in receiving SCETV's DT signal. (And I recognize the DT signal is directional and not in my direction.) As much as I appreciate your frequent and good advice, I believe in this case you did not present a fair and complete review of the facts. Meanwhile, this again down-plays the importance of OTA, and promotes the middlemen carriers who are charging more and more for a service that includes 95% material that I do not watch.
The FCC should be doing a better job of guiding us into the digital era! And finally, not all highly qualified RF specialists agree with you.

Originally posted by CPanther95
All I know is that Channel 8 is the only Columbia station I cannot pick up - all the UHF stations come in just fine.

After looking at the coverage areas it is probably because of my analog 8. Our Grade B touches Charlotte. Even Bob can't get WOLO at his house because of me.

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
foxeng:
You have done a nice job covering the Broadcasters' positions, but there also are the consumers to be considered.

In the original DTV proposal it was all UHF only. Problem was not all of the stations licensed at that time would fit on UHF (there are even more now). It was then extended down to channel 7 and still many felt there would not be enough spectrum so it was set from 2-51.

You may or may agree with the methodology, but that is the reality of the situation. Now I will be the first to say that the way the government in general (Congress and the FCC) and the FCC specifically has handled the transition is a classic case of why government SHOULD NOT be the ones driving technology. This thing has been a classic case of SNAFU from the Democratic controlled Congresses of the 80s to the Democratic and Republican controlled FCC and now Republican controlled Congress. There is plenty of blame to go around. I truly do not think the public has been truly served, but then when is it ever? You are about to see Congress get right in the middle of this thing coming up this spring and everything from analog shutdown to digital must carry will be on the table. It will be a sight to behold, no doubt about it.

And for the last 50 years of TV broadcasting, there hasn't been a problem with VHF/UHF TV. Why should that change with digital? Those who receive their TV OTA already have the VHF/UHF equipment to receive the stations. The new OTA people of DTV are the ones who appear to have the problem and most of them have either cable or satellite along with the OTA antenna. The bottom line is no one in the industry sees VHF/UHF a problem. Now in the future that might become a problem, but at this point, no one sees it as such and in other markets where there are split V/U's the public doesn't appear to have problems with it either.
YMMV

So what happened to 52-59?

All:

WSPA-DT found a blown fuse was causing some of its problems. Please observe the stations and advise if there has been an improvement

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
So what happened to 52-59?

Your Blackberry will be using those channels along with your new G4 or G5 cell phone.

Charter Cable Question to All:

Does anyone know if Charter is broadcasting the local HD channels in clear QAM as required by law now? I have recently picked up a MyHD 130 tuner card for my computer which picks up unencrypted QAM 64 and 256 broadcasts. The only channel I am actually able to receive is Charter channel 103 which is WYFF-DT. I was just wondering if other people knew if Charter was broadcasting the other networks as well.

WYFF is the only one they are carrying right now, so I guess your answer is yes.

Thanks for the reply. After posting I searched this thread a found out the same thing. I've basically skipped the discussions about cable in the past as we do not get normal cable (just cable internet). Prior to reading the threads here I was a little confused because Charter's web site says you get the local channels with your HD subscription and specifically mentions NBC, CBS, and ABC, but obviously that doesn't apply to the Greenville market yet.

I guess I'll be patiently waiting for the other local channels to be picked up by charter so I can watch them as well. I think I would watch those channels primarily and use OTA as a back up. That way I won't get the dropouts that I get some nights with OTA.

Yeah... Charter's website is generic for all of their markets, so that page where they say you can receive all of those stations in HD is not applicable to every market. From what I have read on the Moxi discussion forum, WHNS may be the closest to inking a deal, with WSPA and WLOS close behind. No word on UPN, WB, or WUNF. Unfortunately after two different antennas, hours of rotating them, etc...I am totally limited to WLOS and WUNF OTA.

UPN's still stuck in standard definition locally, and I don't think Charter touts carrying PBS anywhere (although they very well may offer it in some markets), I wouldn't hold out for either of those anytime soon. If something did happen with WLOS, I'd expect WBSC to not be too far behind just because Sinclair operates both (although they don't own WBSC).

Charter's website is outdated even in those generic terms since they're offering Cinemax-HD and Starz-HD in some areas. Greenville isn't among them, but since they're ditching some SD inDemand channels at the end of the month, maybe some of that freed-up bandwidth will be dedicated towards new HD channels. I'm not banking on it, though.

Originally posted by foxeng
Blackberry will be using those channels along with new G4 or G5 cell phone.

That's my point.

Originally posted by foxeng
After looking at the coverage areas it is probably because of my analog 8. Our Grade B touches Charlotte. Even Bob can't get WOLO at his house because of me.

In this period of transition, I realize that everyone is trying to get all the major program suppliers, and in some locations, this means picking up stations from farther away than intended - i.e. watching Columbia from Greenville, Charlotte, etc. You have to remember, however, that this is not the intention of the industry as a whole, and from the broadcaster's point of view, is actually counter-productive. Charlotte stations need Charlotte viewers, etc. This is what pays the rent!!

As for the VHF-UHF argument, Foxeng makes the most important point. A 10-20 KW Solid-state DTV transmitter for channels below 13 is feasable, affordable, economical to operate, and virtually maintenance-free. On the other hand, a 60-100 KW UHF uses much more electricity, consumes $50,000 klystrons, and requires regular attention to keep it optimized. Just look at the signal deterioration of channels in this market recently.

From the receiving point of view, I have used a Radio Shack (Antennacraft) all-channel antenna, and a Channel Master 4228 at my home. The 4228 actually produces higher signal strength readings on Channel 9 than the all-band did. I cannot see ch. 8 from Columbia, so I have no comparison on other channels, but I'm guessing that on 7-13 it will work pretty well, while on 2-6 it will probably suck! However, most engineers will agree that 2-6 are probably the worst channels for DTV, due to impulse noise. and very few will choose low-band VHF.

From the position on the transition, it would probably have been better for all if the FCC had simply set a date, say 10 years from the original date, on which ALL stations would switch from Analog to Digital. This would have given the broadcasters time to re-equip, the transmitter manufacturers time to develop more efficient technologies (which are emerging now) and the public, along with the retailers, a clear picture (pun unintended) as to what they should buy/sell, and when.

We must all remember that this is a political situation, driven by lobby groups, and vote-buying, just like most other government policies. Service to the public is a commodity which the industry must provide in order to make money, but staying in business, and making a satisfactory profit for shareholders, is the first priority.

Richard: You left out a major point. It is preservation of the license that is all important...and serving the community/viewers still plays a role. Also, you can use a Terk for some statons, but not all. Finally, it is the ADI that the major stations serve, not individual commuities...and that is certainly more true in the hyphenate markets. This is still in the fun and games stage, and DXing is to be enjoyed.

Saw the following in the Moxi forum:

I AM GETTING TNTHD on CHARTER IN ASHEVILLE RIGHT NOW!!! Ch. 774!!!!

It looks like a raw feed as well...no commercials!!!

Hasn't filtered down to Greenville, tho', at least not as I'm writing this.

There were minor technical issues, simply because it was a raw feed...but overall it looked absolutely gorgeous! The Suns - Mavericks game looked stunning...this was an unexpected treat last night!

Hey guys do you know of anyone in G'ville area selling remote controlled rotors? i'm sick of running upstairs eveytime i want to change channels. I was unable to get fox for the superbowl and was hoping to get it for the race this weekend but it is hard as hell trying to get the signal good running backl and fore 80 times. thanks

jeccleston — Lowe's has them.

update: I checked the new Lowe's tonight and didn't see the remote controlled rotors there, so you'd have to go to the old Lowe's. The new store also had a much more limited antenna choice.

Tonight we're getting TNT on channel 774 showing the All-Star rookie game in HD. Hope this is a good sign of things to come. Earlier in the day, it was a test pattern saying "Turner HD"

I mentioned yesterday that we started getting 774. And there were no commercials as it was the raw feed last night!! I wish that was the case permanently!

I wonder how they'll handle this in Greenville since Discovery-HD is on 774.

Either way, I hope it gets done soon.

Discovery HD is 775 for me.

Does anyone know which, if any, stations in this area have already started using the broadcast flag? I've seen indications that WYFF-DT may already be uisng it and that it's always on. Is this correct? This concerns me since I get my HDTV through an HTPC and this could affect my ability to timeshift or schedule recording of shows for later viewing.

Originally posted by sic0048
Charter Cable Question to All:

Does anyone know if Charter is broadcasting the local HD channels in clear QAM as required by law now? I have recently picked up a MyHD 130 tuner card for my computer which picks up unencrypted QAM 64 and 256 broadcasts. The only channel I am actually able to receive is Charter channel 103 which is WYFF-DT. I was just wondering if other people knew if Charter was broadcasting the other networks as well.


I have a 42 Mitsi HD and a Moxie box from Charter, asheville, and I am tired of waiting. I get one local (NBC) in HD. I have now missed the Superbowl, the BCS, the World Series, and the Daytona 500. The Moxie makes the analog channels look worse than my 4-year olds handwriting. I WILL NOT MISS MARCH MADNESS!!!

I live in Asheville, on a hill, with little building, tree intereference. There are three choices: 1) A terrestrial tuner with QAM and a DVD burner. (Which one?); 2) Terrestrial tuner with QAM and a TIVO; 3) A HD card in my computer (which is better the MyHD130 or the new AVerMedia Ultra TV HD 1800 MCE [any released date or MSRP yet?])

Also with good indoor antenna what can I expect? How conservative is antennaweb?

You MAY be able to get WSPA or WHNS with an indoor antenna. I don't get a strong enough signal with my large OTA antenna from where I am in Candler, but even with the dinky little antenna that came with the HDTV Wonder card, I was able to get SOME signal. Without the interference, you should be able to get everything with an outdoor one though.

I ignorant about the moxi box, but I have to assume it does not have an antenna input. If it did, just hook and antenna up to it to receive OTA signals. An outside mounted antenna will always outperform an inside antenna. My guess is that you will have limited success trying to get the greenville stations via an indoor antenna in Asheville.

You can always pick up any cheap satelite HD box that has OTA inputs. You don't need to subscribe to the satelite service to use the OTA capabilities. E-Bay has some that are pretty cheap.

Originally posted by sic0048
I ignorant about the moxi box, but I have to assume it does not have an antenna input.Correct, it does not.

In my area of north Asheville antennaweb was right on. It said that I could receive WLOS, WUNF, WHNS, WASV and WYFF. When I first got an OTA tuner I tried it with a Silver Sensor. I was able to receive all of those stations. I put up a CM 4221 to attempt to get WSPA. The attempt failed.

I found it strange that with the indoor antenna that I could receive WLOS far better than WUNF. And to receive WUNF I get the best results when I point it approx 90 degrees from the best reception position for WLOS.

Perhaps something is afoot with Charter. here in Asheville...I'm not getting anything on channel 775, which was Discovery, and channel 774 is missing totally. Hmmmm...........

Well....Discovery is back on, but channel 774 is still gone.

Well......WLOS-DT is going down the tubes again, after the fix it was ok for a while, but now i get a good SS but the pic and sound freeze and unfreeze constantly making it totally unwatchable, there is no way they can convince me that its anything but a problem with their encoder, because WB40 is operated by them also and has no problems at all.

I am going to sell my Hitachi. I would like to sell locally. If anyone here is interested or knows some one who might be interested send me a PM. I paid $2,199.00 in 2000 and I will sell for $800.00.

Hitachi Ultra-Scan HD 36" PC Ready 4 X 3 HDTV. 36SDX01S.
600 line horizontal resolution.
Full 1080i capable with set top box.
ULTRABLACK digital pitch INVAR MASK picture tube.
PinPC function (Picture-in-PC).

Thanks

Hey guys. I currently live in Charlotte and I love my TIme Warner service. I have recently been promoted to come and live in Asheville, NC this coming May. I was just curious as to who is the cable provider for Asheville? Should I go with Directv? Is that what most of you use, Directv? or even Voom? Can you please tell me what your cable co. does provide? Thanks guys or all your help..........

The cable provider in Asheville is Charter. Their is at least one person on this thread that has the Charter HD service in Asheville. I am sure they will chime in with some details.

I am in Asheville and I have a Moxi with Charter HD. So far, things are quite good. I have also had DISH with HD and that was good too. I have no experience with DirecTV in this market. Charter's advantages are that the local NBC affiliate is in HD, you can record HD with the Moxi unit without having to actually purchase it, and as with most cable installations, you don't need a box in every room to get your expanded basic analog programming. The advantage with DISH is that you get an integrated OTA tuner in their boxes which does not come in the Moxi, so if you are in a favorable location, you could potentially receive all of your HD OTA stuff. Unfortinately for me, I have been relegated to WLOS-DT (ABC), and WUNF-D (PBS) only...even with my CM 4228 antenna and Winegard AP8275 preamp.

Well, I have the regular Motorola HD box, and currently Charter's HD offering is limited to HDNet, HDNet Movies, ESPN, Discovery HD Theater, Showtime, HBO, and NBC. So far, Charter always gives the "we're working on it" answer whenever i question when we may get any more Broadcast or cable networks.

well with baseball season around the corner I'm going to assume that Charter will bring back Braves Vision at least, which will give us all the Braves home games in HD if they're on one of the Turner networks

hey guys, I was hoping you could help me out with some information:

I live in Canton right now and have finally gotten tired of the lack of local HD channels that Charter offers! I would like to implement an OTA HD solution, but was wondering what channels I would be able to pick up? I have a clear view and leave on a hill that boosts me up just above the tree line. Any recommendations of OTA receivers? I wouldn't mind using a card for my computer if it would work properly and give me the same capability as a standalone box for my TV. Any special equipment necessary other than an OTA Hd receiver?

I appreciate the help!

The trouble with OTA is the networks are only on 2 hrs daily except for some sports. I have a large Radio Shack antenna and receive WLOS, WUNF, Fox-21, ch 62, now receive WYFF, and SC PBS ch 9 about half the time. have never picked up CBS. Ch 9 is HD 24 hrs, all the others 2hrs daily which is a crock. Reception is very tricky, even stations with a strong signal may drop out completely at times. Also WLOS has technical problems with dropouts and sound sync when on HD. My Dish 811 has no channel info and has to be rebooted every few days. My Directv Samsung 360 is a little less sensitive and the signal meter is completely usless.---- I have waivers on Directv and get CBS and NBC both east and west. They have ABC and Fox also but rots of ruck getting a waiver.

Fordw is correct about the number of network HD hours, however if you watch much SD content on the networks the OTA feed is far superior to what cable or satellite offer. Except for WASV which is bad either way.

Originally posted by Apps1
Fordw is correct about the number of network HD hours, however if you watch much SD content on the networks the OTA feed is far superior to what cable or satellite offer. Except for WASV which is bad either way.

How did you go about getting waivers to receive HD feeds from these through DirecTV? I thought about getting DTV, and most certainly will if I can get a deal like this!

Originally posted by jdogg707
How did you go about getting waivers to receive HD feeds from these through DirecTV? I thought about getting DTV, and most certainly will if I can get a deal like this!

If you have DirecTv they will apply for the waivers for you. Otherwise, I would contact each station to find out their procedure.

Directv applied for waivers for me. I got a card a few months ago that WYFF ond WSPA had approved and WHNS and WLOS had rejected. I was receiving the distant SD channels for $2.25/mo each and they added the HD channels when they came on. However they have changed the rules recently and I am almost certain they are no longer available. On another thread people are afraid to call Directv that they will cut them off. I want to commend WYFF, I did get Grade B reception, and also they are the only one to sign with Charter.

Originally posted by gjlowe
Unfortinately for me, I have been relegated to WLOS-DT (ABC), and WUNF-D (PBS) only...even with my CM 4228 antenna and Winegard AP8275 preamp. Bummer! And I was hoping it was my setup. I'm in (West) Asheville and can get only those 2 OTA with my Sammy 360 and CM 4228. They do come in clear, rich, and occasionally even audio sync'ed ;) (like tonight's academy awards). I've been using Charter HD since inception last March and have seen one channel (Discovery) added to the lineup in that time. I made a point of calling twice a week asking for HD Discovery, then specifically asking CSR to pass on my disappointment. Not sure it made any difference, but here we are. The Moto6200 has been a solid HD receiver and Asheville has come a long way since the days of Daniels. Along with Steve Curtis and Toby Sprinkle, we set up Asheville Cablevision's first ad insertion department back in the late eighties. This town's cable company has had half a dozen name/management changes, and I do hope Charter plans to stick around for awhile. The quality has gotten consistantly better, their internet service is (almost) finally business class, and the folks working the system are genuinely commited to their community.

I grumble about switching to Voom, but I'll probably hold out for Charter to flush out their basic HD lineup (we need ABC, CBS, Fox, UPN, WB and PBS) and if Charter would do one thing -- just one thing -- that would staunch any flow to Voom or D*TV it would be this: add HD VOD (video on demand).

The only thing that really worries me about the mid-term level of increased HDTV service here in Asheville is Charter's upcoming foray into VoIP. Tough enough for our local bunch of yahoos to come this far. But a phone provider too? It wasn't that many years ago that their infrastructure was barely solid enough to run broadband on. Has HDTV bandwidth been pre-allocated, or subject to the whims of marketing other services?

I look forward to Charter's continued improvement of quality of service and commitment to a robust HD lineup. In Asheville they continue to be the cost effective choice for packaging internet, SD and HDTV.

-David
(unaffiliated since about 1989).
4805 / HCCV / Moto6200 / SIR360 / Tosh3960 / XBox / HT room

Originally posted by acksnay
if Charter would do one thing -- just one thing -- that would staunch any flow to Voom or D*TV it would be this: add HD VOD (video on demand).I dunno. HD-VOD sounds fantastic on paper, but the current execution -- at least judging by the descriptions in the HDTV Programming forum -- apparently leaves much to be desired.

It wasn't that many years ago that their infrastructure was barely solid enough to run broadband on. Has HDTV bandwidth been pre-allocated, or subject to the whims of marketing other services?Charter is ditching several dozen SD PPV channels today or tomorrow. I'm not sure what they're intending to use that freed up bandwidth for. Could be for VoIP, could be for HD, could be for a combination or something entirely different.

I look forward to Charter's continued improvement of quality of service and commitment to a robust HD lineup. In Asheville they continue to be the cost effective choice for packaging internet, SD and HDTV.I'm not sure if that's a common perception in Asheville, but here in the Greenville area, everytime I've ever gotten in a conversation with anyone about Charter, it always results in a profane rant from whoever it is I'm talking to. Probably 15-20 different people at this point, same general result every time. I don't hate Charter the way most people seem to, but my primary interest at this point is HD, and that's obviously not remotely as much of a priority for Charter as it is for me.

I'm one of those Greenville users that hates Charter. If I didn't need them for my high speed internet, I'd switch to DirecTV so fast. If Bell South would just offer DSL in my area! I don't use Charter for HD as well, they really don't have anything to offer that I care about except ESPN and I just don't see that 1 channel being cost effective. I'm currently getting all the locals OTA with an indoor antenna placed in the attic. I'm one of the lucky ones as I don't even have adjust it at all. I found a direction to point it in which all channels come in without drops.

Ok folks. I'm thinking of getting the Moxi box thru Charter. Those of you who have one, could you answer a couple of questions?

1. I have a 51" Sony RPTV. The HD looks great, but all other channels are just ok. i've been told the non-HD channels look MUCH worse on the Moxi. True?

2. I've heard its very difficult to use. True?

Thanks!

Tommy

I know lots of folks that would get D* or E* if only Bellsouth would offer DSL in their area, it's ironic that Bellsouth is teamed up with D* and is losing out on subscribers because they are not smart enough to roll out DSL faster. I live in an area served by a co-op phone company and have had DSL for about 2 years now and they even have TV via their fiber optic system, with a DSL modem built in the set top box. Sounds like Bellsouth needs some new blood in management.

Originally posted by tommyp007
1. I have a 51" Sony RPTV. The HD looks great, but all other channels are just ok. i've been told the non-HD channels look MUCH worse on the Moxi. True?True, but this is supposed to improve to at least some extent with the 3.2 update that's probably going to hit next month.

The basic problem now is that if you can only choose one resolution as an output. If you choose 720p or 1080i, everything is upconverted/sideconverted to that resolution, including standard definition material. If you're watching a 480i show on an CRT-based HDTV, you're starting 480i, being passed a squashed 1080i image, and then presumably using your set to pillarbox that stretched image to its intended aspect ratio. That's a lot of fiddling, and that hurts the image quality.

The 3.2 upgrade will let you select multiple resolutions, so it won't scale material unless you want it to. Apparently it's not a night and day difference in terms of quality, so it still won't look as good as you'd see on a regular STB, but the difference is reportedly noticeable. Analog is the weakest point right now -- SD digital material doesn't look quite as bad.

However -- if you have a good splitter handy, you can always split the cable coming into the Moxi...use the Moxi to record just digital content, and use your TV's built-in tuner to watch SD programming you're not timeshifting.

2. I've heard its very difficult to use. True?Nah. The interface has its eccentricities, but I don't think it's hard to use.

Thanks Adam. I may wait a while until I know that the 3.2 upgrade has happened. Our current Moto HD box is fine, and I'm an old hand with a VCR, so taping isn't a big deal. I guess my main concern was the loss of PQ on the non-HD channels. I've had the TV long enough to understand how SD looks on a HDTV, but if it got much worse, I'd have to return the Moxi box. Most of our Tv watching is ABC, CBS, FOX, History, etc, so we actually watch very little of our current HD lineup (sigh), so the PQ of tose channels is my primary concern.

Anyone else have ops to chime in?

I have lived in the area since 1984 (!) and have had Charter off and on under various names during that period. I am a definite Charter hater, and would rather have rabbit ears or a coat hanger than Charter. I have had Directv since about 2000, and am very satisfied with it. Sure, they have some warts, but they are not arrogant, and their customer service has always been anxious to please ( and I have put them to the test a number of times).

I went the other way....I had BellSouth DSL and Dish Network...but the bottom line was that it was much less expensive to have everything through Charter, plus I could get 3MB downloads instead of just 1.5 for DSL, and I didn't have to buy the HD DVR box, so it really became a no brainer for me.

Originally posted by enoree
Well......WLOS-DT is going down the tubes again, after the fix it was ok for a while, but now i get a good SS but the pic and sound freeze and unfreeze constantly making it totally unwatchable, there is no way they can convince me that its anything but a problem with their encoder, because WB40 is operated by them also and has no problems at all.

I just wanted to confirm a similar occurance with WLOS. I'm a little surprised no one else has mentioned it. I currently don't receive any signal from WLOS. It doesn't register on my signal meter at all. This is even worse than before. At least the first time it was broken, I could receive a very pixilated, although quite unwatchable, image. I could also change my signal strength by rotating directions - but could never get it quite strong enough for a watchable picture. Now I get zero picture and rotating the antenna doesn't cause any increase in signal strength. It just sits at "bad" and never increases (my signal meter goes from "bad" up to "excellent" rather than a assign a numeric value).

So what ever was wrong with it before, it is worse this time. Let's hope they can get their act together and fix it in less than one month this time.

Originally posted by sic0048
I just wanted to confirm a similar occurance with WLOS. I'm a little surprised no one else has mentioned it. I currently don't receive any signal from WLOS. It doesn't register on my signal meter at all. This is even worse than before. At least the first time it was broken, I could receive a very pixilated, although quite unwatchable, image. I could also change my signal strength by rotating directions - but could never get it quite strong enough for a watchable picture. Now I get zero picture and rotating the antenna doesn't cause any increase in signal strength. It just sits at "bad" and never increases (my signal meter goes from "bad" up to "excellent" rather than a assign a numeric value).

So what ever was wrong with it before, it is worse this time. Let's hope they can get their act together and fix it in less than one month this time.

I noticed the signal was completely gone as well. My guess is there is a loss of power at the transmitter site. They do not have back up power for digital. It would be nice if they could keep us informed when this happens, but that might show a little concern for us digital wing nuts out here. They surely wouldn't want to set a precedent by providing us with any useful information.

Perhaps it was just power loss at the transmission site because they had it back up working last night. I was able to get nice, clean powerful signals from both 13-1 and 13-2.

Originally posted by gjlowe
I went the other way....I had BellSouth DSL and Dish Network...but the bottom line was that it was much less expensive to have everything through Charter, plus I could get 3MB downloads instead of just 1.5 for DSL, and I didn't have to buy the HD DVR box, so it really became a no brainer for me.

I'm not sure when you were last on Bellsouth DSL, but I get 3mb downloads, and I don't just mean in name either. On pcpitstop.com I tested at 3003 down and 318 up. This is incredible, and I don't live right next to a switching station either. And not to mention this was around 5pm. On cable your speed takes a definite hit during primetime hours. Also I've found Bellsouth DSL to be more stable.

I do own the HD DVR Tivo, and itis worth every penny. Being able to integrate my ota antenna into it and program it to record ota broadcast as well as through DirecTV is something I couldn't live without now.

Walter

Walter-- I had BellSouth just a few weeks ago. They do not offer 3MB in my area, and had no idea if and when they would. I agree that it was completely stable, as I only had one major outage in 3+ years with them. Their customer service was adequate at that timie.

I also liked being able to integrate the OTA with the satellite receiver, but all in all, I like the trade I made right now. I never had any HBO or Showtime channels and had never even seen VOD before, so those things alone have made me very happy. I never buy DVD's anymore because there is always something in HD or on VOD to watch, so I save money there too!

I intend to review my options again next year when my contract with Charter is up....it's always a good idea. Perhaps DISH or DirecTV will have newer offerings and better prices....perhaps they will have a new deal for internet services as well. Who knows? I do know that as consumers, we too often fall into the trap of believing once we have chosen a service, we have to stick with it. In fact, they are trying to sell their products to US, and thus, WE have the ability to choose the best service that meets our needs.

Oh...and there's nothing to say you can't have more than one...:)

In case anyone else is interested. This box works great for OTA for me. My problem child (WLOS-DT) comes in great and there is no stutter problem during their HD programming like the Samsung 360, and the H10 have. This box is $199.00 at Wal-Mart and is OTA only.

All - Re WLOS-DT

I sent a note to WLOS to verify its DT transmitter was off. Here is the response:
"Probably not when you asked, it is now. The antenna iced up again. Antenna will be replaced shortly so this problem will go away.
Jim"

"The antenna iced up again. Antenna will be replaced shortly so this problem will go away." [/B]

Any takers as to what happens first: new antenna, or Spring weather?

Anyone else having trouble with WSPA-DT ch53 tonight? I'm using a HTPC with a couple of HDTV tuner cards in it. One of them is the Dvico Fusion HDTV II and the other is the Sasem OnAir usb. Anyway, I'm getting a strong signal, or so the software says, but I get no video or audio. This is the same with either tuner I use. It almost seems as if they've done something weird with their transport stream that my HDTV tuner cards don't like. Anyone else having issues?

Originally posted by Stefan
Anyone else having trouble with WSPA-DT ch53 tonight? I'm using a HTPC with a couple of HDTV tuner cards in it. One of them is the Dvico Fusion HDTV II and the other is the Sasem OnAir usb. Anyway, I'm getting a strong signal, or so the software says, but I get no video or audio. This is the same with either tuner I use. It almost seems as if they've done something weird with their transport stream that my HDTV tuner cards don't like. Anyone else having issues?

I lost audio and video on my Hughes E86, but it looks fine on my US Data box. I believe they must have changed something in the PSIP because before there was no guide info on my US Data box and my E86 worked fine. Tonight there is guide data on the US Data box and the E86 doesn't have audio or video. I did a re-boot and a re-scan on my E86.

WSPA has confirmed that they did make a change to the PSIP yesterday. They would like reports of any receivers that are now having this problem, and they would like to know all the different type receivers viewers in this market are using. As people respond I will report info back to WSPA.

Thanks

Re WSPA DT, I have had a couple of days inwhich I lost signal frequently, several times per hour or could not receive it at all for a couple of hours. For stability, I had to re-orient my antenna last night. After that, it was ok. My receiver is a Samsung TS 160 -- but I lost other stations.

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
Re WSPA DT, I have had a couple of days inwhich I lost signal frequently, several times per hour or could not receive it at all for a couple of hours. For stability, I had to re-orient my antenna last night. After that, it was ok. My receiver is a Samsung TS 160.

WSPA uses a Samsung to monitor the signal, and they are looking to add receivers from other manufacturers. That is why they want to know the most widely used receivers in our area.

The so-called moxi box is finally available in the Asheville area.
A tech is scheduled to come out next Friday with one.

Any advise for the install?
[ I'll start slogging through the moxi forum in meantime ... ]

Originally posted by acksnay
Any advise for the install?Make sure everything's working before you let the installers leave. I know that sounds obvious, but they might leave something pending and say that it'll fix itself in an hour, but disregard that sort of thing.

In my case, I suffered through the following with installation:

1) my HD channels were no longer accessible (required talking to five different people at Charter before this was fixed; it turns out conflicting control signals were sent to the box)

2) I wasn't getting program listings, and the Charter installer didn't know how to fix it. (MoxiGuy in the HDTV Recorders forum told me how to manually trigger an update; if not for him, I would've probably had to wait for another tech to come out since they won't tell you how to enter the service menu over the phone.)

3) This might not be a concern for you, but two HD channels had their listings transposed, making recording extremely problematic. Normally wouldn't be a big deal, but when I only have 5 or 6 HD channels capable of being recorded in the first place, having two of them unrecordable really is a pain. There's nothing the installers can do about this, but if you notice it, pester them into letting you know who to contact to fix it. This was a huge ordeal for me to get resolved -- everyone I called at Charter gave me a different answer (some said it was because the Moxi was in beta; some people blamed Tribute Media; some people blamed Digeo), and it took an extremely helpful Charter employee in a different state to help me finally get it fixed.

But anyway, check to make sure the channels you use the most are there, and make sure you get program listings before you let the installer leave.

They have taken PSIP off for the week-end, so anyone who was not getting audio and video should be fine now. My E86 is back to normal. They will try again next week.

I don't know how many people fall into this group, but if you subscribe to Charter HD but don't subscribe to Showtime, you can watch Showtime-HD (along with the SD Showtime/The Movie Channel tier) for the next few days for free during the Big Fat Free Preview or whatever they're calling this stupid thing. Showtime-HD is channel 778 on Charter. Showtime's website lists all HDTV movies (http://www.sho.com/site/schedules/hdtv.do?filter=true&scope=thisweek&sort=time) slated to air, along with some other programming (http://www.sho.com/site/preview/home.do), and this promotion ends on 3/7.

Originally posted by Adam Tyner
Make sure everything's working before you let the installers leave. I know that sounds obvious, but they might leave something pending and say that it'll fix itself in an hour, but disregard that sort of thing.

In my case, I suffered through the following with installation:

1) my HD channels were no longer accessible (required talking to five different people at Charter before this was fixed; it turns out conflicting control signals were sent to the box)

2) I wasn't getting program listings, and the Charter installer didn't know how to fix it. (MoxiGuy in the HDTV Recorders forum told me how to manually trigger an update; if not for him, I would've probably had to wait for another tech to come out since they won't tell you how to enter the service menu over the phone.)

3) This might not be a concern for you, but two HD channels had their listings transposed, making recording extremely problematic. Normally wouldn't be a big deal, but when I only have 5 or 6 HD channels capable of being recorded in the first place, having two of them unrecordable really is a pain. There's nothing the installers can do about this, but if you notice it, pester them into letting you know who to contact to fix it. This was a huge ordeal for me to get resolved -- everyone I called at Charter gave me a different answer (some said it was because the Moxi was in beta; some people blamed Tribute Media; some people blamed Digeo), and it took an extremely helpful Charter employee in a different state to help me finally get it fixed.

But anyway, check to make sure the channels you use the most are there, and make sure you get program listings before you let the installer leave. I appreciate the tip Adam. I'll find a feature list and plow through it with the tech in tow.

Only 15% through the moxi box thread but I'm already a bit scared off from switching "up" from my 6200. Have the horrific SD quality issues been resolved or ought I think hard about keeping my original setup?

Originally posted by acksnay
Only 15% through the moxi box thread but I'm already a bit scared off from switching "up" from my 6200. Have the horrific SD quality issues been resolved or ought I think hard about keeping my original setup? The box you'll be seeing is considerably different than the one described in the early posts of that thread. Analog SD does still look pretty lousy, but it's watchable. The next software update is supposed to improve that. It should roll out fairly shortly through Charter, and some of the smaller regional cable services already have it.

Originally posted by Apps1
I lost audio and video on my Hughes E86, but it looks fine on my US Data box. I believe they must have changed something in the PSIP because before there was no guide info on my US Data box and my E86 worked fine. Tonight there is guide data on the US Data box and the E86 doesn't have audio or video. I did a re-boot and a re-scan on my E86.

Yes, I noticed that the EPG data was present also, whereas I had not seen it before. With my Sasem OnAir usb tuner I use a piece of software called "TSreader" and it supports EPG data. Anyway last night TSreader was locking the signal and showing the EPG data but was behaving as if there were no video or audio streams present. Thankfully tonight everything is back to normal. The EPG data appears to be gone. So, it does seem there is some correlation between WSPA-DTs implementation of the EPG data in their stream and my issues. However, I should mention that on many other stations, including many I recieve from the Charlotee, NC area, I'm able to get EPG data and have no issues. So it must be something specific to the way they were implementing it in their stream and not an issue with EPG data in general.

Here's something else I observed. In addition to the Sasem OnAir usb and the Dvico Fusion tuners, I also have a MyHD tuner card and after posting here I tried it. I also had issues with it getting video and audio. However, I was able to have some limited success with it. By switching back and forth between other stations and WSPA-DT repeatedly I was every once in a while able to get audio and video on WSPA-DT but not on a regular basis. Anyway, once when I locked on to the video and audio I recorded a small sample clip. So far any piece of software I have tried to use to open and playback this file doesn't seem to like it and will either crash or fail to play any audio or video. So there was definitely something unusual about their transport stream last night. I hope that if they must implement EPG data they do so in a way that doesn't break compatiblity with most tuners in this way.

Originally posted by acksnay
The so-called moxi box is finally available in the Asheville area.
A tech is scheduled to come out next Friday with one.

Any advise for the install?
[ I'll start slogging through the moxi forum in meantime ... ]


Split the signal until the 3.2 upgrade comes. I turned my Moxi box in. Well too much money to watch Duke vs Carolina like it was drawn by my 4 year old. Only the HD channels looked truely great on my misti TV. Make sure the do the upgrades to get VOD and the ticker. I had to call twice to get these added. GOOD LUCK.

Originally posted by kilbourne
Split the signal until the 3.2 upgrade comes. I turned my Moxi box in. Well too much money to watch Duke vs Carolina like it was drawn by my 4 year old. Only the HD channels looked truely great on my misti TV. Make sure the do the upgrades to get VOD and the ticker. I had to call twice to get these added. GOOD LUCK.
Hmmm. I made it through the Moxi thread and can see your advise is on the money. At this point I'm 90% ready to call, cancel my impending install, and stay pat with the Moto6200. I'm usually an early adopter of this sort of tech, but no way I'm willing to take a hit on picture quality for the convenience of DVR. My setup is front projection, so those SD issues would be especially magnified. Besides, I like my sports drawn by at least a 12 year old. :p

Splitting the signal is not an option without additional hardware. My Infocus 4805 does not have a built-in tuner.

I have to chime in here. As long as you change the video output setting to 480i instead of a progressive format, your SD picture will look fine. It took me a few weeks to figure that out, but boy did it work. I have been very happy with my Moxi box.

Originally posted by gjlowe
I have to chime in here. As long as you change the video output setting to 480i instead of a progressive format, your SD picture will look fine. It took me a few weeks to figure that out, but boy did it work. I have been very happy with my Moxi box. Hi gjlowe and thanks for the input. Is this the Moxi workaround where you switch between 480i for SD channels and 1080i for HD?

DVD and Charter HD is 95% of my big screen viewing. I put a TV card in my PC for local news/weather so I don't have the fire up the projector for SD. Seems whacked to be spending so much with Charter for so few actually viewed channels. I'd jump on a reasonably priced (~$50) HD-only package, but that's a loooong ways away (if ever).

Am researching whether to 0) do nothing and stick with the 6200; 1) go ahead with Moxi; 2) wait until 3.2 resolves PQ issues; or 3) jump into the deep end of the pool -- aka HTPC obsession -- and firewire the 6200 to XP.

Shouldn't the name of this thread be Asheville/Greenville/Spartanburg?
Of course we've all got separate cable head ends, but isn't the OTA in common?

Originally posted by acksnay
Shouldn't the name of this thread be Asheville/Greenville/Spartanburg?
Of course we've all got separate cable head ends, but isn't the OTA in common?

I think it may be time to have a seperate thread for OTA and cable. Most markets have a seperate thread for OTA and for cable providers. Since this was the OTA thread way before Charter started HD, maybe one of you Charter folks could start a new thread.

acksnay-- The thing to remember about cable is that you can watch all of the analog stuff in any room with a TV without a box, so the money I spend on cable is a better buy for my dollar than satellite. I too use the Moxi box basicially for HD programming and some movies in SD once in a while. The "workaround" for switching between SD and HD is a hassle, but not a huge deal, especially since 3.2 is supposed to fix this issue.

Yes. it should be GSAA (including Anderson) which is the original name of the DMA, but this forum modertor rejects that idea with the excuse that the FCC now designates the largest city name as the name of the DMA. There is a history of this discussion much earlier in this thread.

Originally posted by jerry birdwell
Yes. it should be GSAA (including Anderson) which is the original name of the DMA, but this forum modertor rejects that idea with the excuse that the FCC now designates the largest city name as the name of the DMA. There is a history of this discussion much earlier in this thread.
Ah so. Once more into the shadow of the foothills. ;) Thanks for clearing that up Jerry.

Originally posted by Apps1
They have taken PSIP off for the week-end, so anyone who was not getting audio and video should be fine now. My E86 is back to normal. They will try again next week.

Well, I'm getting WSPA-DT fine tonight and I'm also seeing the EPG data. So, looks like they finally got it all worked out tonight.