Wow, these things have gotten high!!I think I paid only $24 or so apiece for mine.

brickie

High is not the word. As much as I like mine, I'm not sure I would have dropped $90 a pair. Mine cost was in the order of Brickies. Suppy/Demand I guess. Still, at that cost I might start looking for an alternative. At the time, I think there were only 2 alternatives to pro shakers(buttkicker and Clark Tactile transducers.) Those were quite a bit more expensive at the time, but reportedly delivered much better performance.

I'm sure there are other alternatives available that don't cost as much(as the Clark and buttkicker).

At $90 a pair and the cost of something to drive them with, I might start looking for something else.

I tend to agree with you somewhat...The effect from them is quite good when hooked to the furniture properly,but $90 for a pair is way too high..I'd hold off for a bit and see if I ccould find them cheaper...

I'm going to see if I can find source where i got mine from and see if he has anymore and at what cost..

brickie

Originally posted by frostlich

I'm sure there are other alternatives available that don't cost as much(as the Clark and buttkicker).


I searched high and low... The Aura's are by far the cheapest. Next in line would be the low end Clark Transducer at 99.00.

The Auras do have the advantage of being small... so you can place them anywhere. With a Clark Transducer it seems you need 2 - 3" of clearence and due to the odd shape you have to mount it on the bottom of a sofa or floor.

It too bad I had to pay 90 + shipping for the Auras... I don't know anywhere in Canada where I could of bought them.

BTW, even when I tried to order from parts express they were 33.50 each.

Yeah, even their they have went up..a few months back they were on major clearance for $25 or something like that.Still looking for my source.

brickie

....is this it?

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=299-027

Those are the regular versions..

brickie

Here is mine with 4 bass shakers pro.It is hooked up to a separate sub amp.I'm using a 120 watt amp to avoid distortion.I sometimes get blurred vision when watching a movie due to the excessive shaking it does.

...looking for a pair of sub amplifiers to drive some bass shakers. Something with an 8 ohm power rating of around 120-150 W, with adjustable low-pass filter. Obviously, for this kind of application ruggedness takes precedence over sound quality. Any recommendations are appreciated, are there any good deals floating around?

Check partsexpress.com. They have several several plate amps between 75 - 300w available.

Do any of you have any extra FMods that you are looking to get rid of?

I don't at this time, but easier to get together with other members and buy them..You only need one, and of course cost is better this way.

brickie

Here's a Q:

Is there anyway to hook up bass shakers without the amp?

I'm using the ONKYO 601, and I am NOT using a sub.

How does an Aura Bass Shaker Pro compare to the cheapest Clark Synthesis tactile transducer? Is it worth the extra money? Better build, better shake per unit? If I go through all this trouble I don't just want an expensive joy buzzer in my seat :D, but I don't have the cash to get a Buttkicker or high end Clark.

Supposedly Clark Synthesis is now fusing the basic Silver TST229 and the Gold TST329 into the TST239 with the same $100 and under price of the TST229 and the power output of the TST329. I don't know when they'll be out, but they were announced at CEDIA '04 for a ship date of late October.

If it's true that the specs are relatively the same as the TST329 then wouldn't that be worth waiting for? Hmmm...



Dan

Dan for the price you need to try the shakers..I was quite amazed by their output.I too thought it might not be as much as what was being claimed..IT IS!!!!!! It's only artificial if you over drive them.

brickie

Hi all,

I just installed my shakers... rather than bolting them to the sofa I tucked them behind the seat cushion and the back cushion. This arrangement works great - no screws needed :)

I'm powering the shakers with an old 1982 Sony STR-VX33 140W amp. The amp provides more than enough power for the shakers!

I think I might of saved on taxes as well... Canadian Federal workers are on strike (I think that includes customs officers) and I noticed FedEx didn't hand me a brokerage bill.

Does someone have an opinion on the base and mid level Clark's vs. the Aura Pro's? At the new price the upcoming low end Clark's are looking more tempting, at least as specs. and warranty go.

Dan

Dan,

I haven't heard anything on the mid level Clarks. You could try posting the question in its own thread, and maybe get some help that way. I think the mid level Clarks are relatively new to the Aura units. For a while, I believe the Aura's were the only low cost option, that's why there's so much information about them.

Perhaps the mid level Clarks are a response to the Aura's?

Auras have gone up in price substantially. PartsExpress was the cheap source for the shakers but they have since sold out of them. Smarthome is the only other source I know of with <100.00 Auras. Other sites seem to be selling the Auras for 140+!

The Auras provide more than enough shaking power... you really don't want the shakers to be overly powerful as that makes the effect too artificial. One advantage Auras have over Clark transducers is the shape. Auras can be flush mounted to a seat and do not require extra clearence. Clark Trandsucers are odd shaped and must be mounted underneath a couch or sofa with a couple inches of clearence.

Has anyone ever hooked these up to some Berkline 088's? Thanks!

Keep in mind that the cheaper non-pro versions are still availible for great prices. Since people don't run them at full power, these should still have plenty of moving power to give the effect you want. I've been very happy with a single pair shaking a whole couch and wouldn't feel comfortable turning them up. it would be a bit too much shaking! Besides, the core of both are about the same size, the biggest difference being the heat fins, which probably aren't really necessary.

Awesome point.I assumed all of em went up in price.I believe most here use the regular with good success.Time to go hunting.

brickie

As some of you know, i am using this amp (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=300-793) to drive my Shakers.
The other day, working on my System, i noticed that it gets unusual hot during a movie. Is this normal?
:confused:

Is there any reason you shouldnt buy the non pro ? Since I cannot find them at the price I want I thought of just buying 1 per chair.

They overheat or whats the deal?

I assume you mean non pro shakers..They would be probably more than fine,especially at 1 per chair.I use pros, but many here are using the regular versions with great success..I'd go for it.As I often say, it doesn't take much power to get these going at all!!

bricikie

Brickie,
I know you are using the 50Hz fmod. Why did you pick that one over the 70Hz?

Anybody else have any opinions on choosing the right filter?

Colin.

For me, it was wanting them to shake only when necessary.I didn't want them shaking on a deep mans voice and that type of stuff..No science or anything behind it.I have tried the 70hz and have to admit I didn't notice or really feel a big difference between the two..

brickie

Thanks Brickie

Hi guys,

So I'm trying to figure out the draw on my shakers. I had originally wired them as per brickie's suggestion, I have 6 25W Aura shakers, 3 wired in series going to L channel, 3 going to R channel. Problem is, the amp that I'm currently using just died. I don't want to change the wiring, so I"m looking at getting a plate amp from PE and wondering if this will work (I need 2 channels) and what the actual Ohm rating would be for 3 wired in series. Can someone help? thanks guys!

Davey

Davey,

Sorry to hear your amp died.

Three 4-ohm shakers in series equals 12 ohms.

Two sets of three in parallel equal 6 ohms.

It would easily be a load most plate-amps could handle. (since they are usually rated for 4 ohm loads, and higher resistance loads (6-ohms) are easier for them to drive)

Joe L.

Hey JL,

So it would be better to change the wiring to parallel to equal 6ohms rather than have the 12 ohms? Also, on the plate amp, is there a left and right connection (2ch) so that each set runs off one 'side'? I'm not sure how the plate amp works....

thanks

davey

Davey,although I don't recommend the plate amp,it should work..If you have 3 wired in series on each channel the load is 12 ohms.Wire both channels to 1 out put of a plate amp(assume mono operation is what the amp is), then you'd have 6 ohms..should be fine in my opinion.

brickie

Hi Brickie,

What's the reasoning behind not using a plate amp??
thanks

davey

I use a Plate Amp from PE, 250 Watt, comes with Remote and i love it.

6 shakers connected to a single channel plate amplifier would be wired like this:


+-------------------+
| |
| |
| +-------+-------+
| | |
| | |
| Shaker1 Shaker4
| | |
Plate | |
Amplifier Shaker2 Shaker5
| | |
| | |
| Shaker3 Shaker6
| | |
| | |
| +-------+-------+
| |
| |
+-------------------+

Each string of three 4-ohm shakers in series (Shaker1,2,3) equals 12 ohms.

Two strings (of three), both paralleled and connected to a single channel plate amplifier would result in a 6 ohm load to the amplifier.

Joe L.
(Hope my crude ascii drawings line up)

Originally posted by colinsm
Brickie,
I know you are using the 50Hz fmod. Why did you pick that one over the 70Hz?

Anybody else have any opinions on choosing the right filter?



It's personal opinion. I have my shakers set to a standard 80hz (same as my subs) cutoff and it works great. The shakers amplify the effect of my subwoofers.

Others use 50hz to make them shake only when there is deep bass (i.e. a very deep rumble).

If your amp has a changable cutoff, try different frequencies to see what you like... then buy a FMOD to isolate the shakers at your selected cutoff.

I just bought 6 of them..Im excited to get them like you wont believe!

My question isnt about how to wire but the wire itself. I have a 500 yard roll of 22ga speaker wire. Would I need to spend the money on good wire again? I know I need 200ft so I am reluctant to run anything great since its just sub base frequencies.

What wire is everyone using?

22 gauge wire has a resistance of 16.8 ohms per 1000 feet.

If you wire the shakers as shown in my prior illustration and ran a 30 foot length of 22 gauge from each shaker back to the amplifier location and wired them series there it would result in 180 feet of wire in the series string.

180 feet of wire would have a equivalent resistance of about 3 ohms.

That resistance would be then added to the 12 ohm load represented by the three shakers in series for a total of 15 ohms. The total power would then be proportionally delivered to the shakers (approx. 80 % of the power) and the rest lost in the wire (approx. 20 % of the power)

Worst case scenario with 180 feet of 22 ga wire, turn the amplifier gain up about 20% higher and you would end up with the same power delivered to the shakers as if you had used short lengths of heavy gauge wire.

I would suggest that rather than purchasing new wire, unless you have very-very long runs of wire from your shakers to your amplifier, use what you have on hand. It will work just fine.

Joe L.

(Other wire gauge resistances)
20 gauge wire has a resistance of 10.5 ohms per 1000 feet or 1.89 ohms for 180 feet of wire.

18 gauge wire has a resistance of 6.6 ohms per 1000 feet or 1.118 ohms for 180 feet of wire.

16 gauge wire has a resistance of 4.2 ohms per 1000 feet or 0.756 ohms for 180 feet of wire.

14 gauge wire has a resistance of 2.6 ohms per 1000 feet or 0.468 ohms for 180 feet of wire.

12 gauge wire has a resistance of 1.7 ohms per 1000 feet or 0.306 ohms for 180 feet of wire.

Originally posted by J. L.
22 gauge wire has a resistance of 16.8 ohms per 1000 feet.

If you wire the shakers as shown in my prior illustration and ran a 30 foot length of 22 gauge from each shaker back to the amplifier location and wired them series there it would result in 180 feet of wire in the series string.

180 feet of wire would have a equivalent resistance of about 3 ohms.

That resistance would be then added to the 12 ohm load represented by the three shakers in series for a total of 15 ohms. The total power would then be proportionally delivered to the shakers (approx. 80 % of the power) and the rest lost in the wire (approx. 20 % of the power)

Worst case scenario with 180 feet of 22 ga wire, turn the amplifier gain up about 20% higher and you would end up with the same power delivered to the shakers as if you had used short lengths of heavy gauge wire.

I would suggest that rather than purchasing new wire, unless you have very-very long runs of wire from your shakers to your amplifier, use what you have on hand. It will work just fine.

Joe L.

(Other wire gauge resistances)
20 gauge wire has a resistance of 10.5 ohms per 1000 feet or 1.89 ohms for 180 feet of wire.

18 gauge wire has a resistance of 6.6 ohms per 1000 feet or 1.118 ohms for 180 feet of wire.

16 gauge wire has a resistance of 4.2 ohms per 1000 feet or 0.756 ohms for 180 feet of wire.

14 gauge wire has a resistance of 2.6 ohms per 1000 feet or 0.468 ohms for 180 feet of wire.

12 gauge wire has a resistance of 1.7 ohms per 1000 feet or 0.306 ohms for 180 feet of wire.

many thanks.. Thats invaluable advice!

I have a spare receiver. I am going to wire 2 the center, 2 to the right and 2 to the left. That way I could achieve about 8.77 ohms per channel. Thats good enough for me. :cool:

J.L. is most definitely the man!! Taught me quite a bit about ohms and such here..The reasoning behind the receiver preferred over a plate amp was simply the volume control part of it..Granted I don't use a remote,many claim them to be invaluable in setup of the shakers. Plate amps themselves can be quite awesome.

brickie

Originally posted by brickie
J.L. is most definitely the man!! Taught me quite a bit about ohms and such here..The reasoning behind the receiver preferred over a plate amp was simply the volume control part of it..Granted I don't use a remote,many claim them to be invaluable in setup of the shakers. Plate amps themselves can be quite awesome.

brickie

I have a connection to JBL subs so i thought about buying a cheap 15" powered sub and stealing the amp but I think there is potentially more functionallity in the receiver amp.. Time will tell and things can be undone/redone!

Originally posted by J. L.
6 shakers connected to a single channel plate amplifier would be wired like this:


+-------------------+
| |
| |
| +-------+-------+
| | |
| | |
| Shaker1 Shaker4
| | |
Plate | |
Amplifier Shaker2 Shaker5
| | |
| | |
| Shaker3 Shaker6
| | |
| | |
| +-------+-------+
| |
| |
+----------------+

Each string of three 4-ohm shakers in series (Shaker1,2,3) equals 12 ohms.

Two strings (of three), both paralleled and connected to a single channel plate amplifier would result in a 6 ohm load to the amplifier.

Joe L.
(Hope my crude ascii drawings line up)

Hi Joe,

I take it in the paralleled config in ascii above that all + wires are connected together and all - wires are connected together, and in the end you just have one + and one - running to the plate amp??

Thx

Davey

I got my 6 shakers today.. I tried to hook them up as shown but the darn things are always on.

my receiver (a jbl DCR600) says that the sub takes care of all frequencies below 150hz I believe. So all i am getting is audio thru the shaker. Is there something I am doing wrong or is this receiver just not going to work?

Originally posted by Want2race
I got my 6 shakers today.. I tried to hook them up as shown but the darn things are always on.

my receiver (a jbl DCR600) says that the sub takes care of all frequencies below 150hz I believe. So all i am getting is audio thru the shaker. Is there something I am doing wrong or is this receiver just not going to work?


Your receiver's cross over is way too high - do you have an option to use 70hz or 80hz?

If not, you can use a 70hz low-pass Harrision Lab F-Mod to filter out the higher frequencies.

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=266-252

You can also try a 50hz low-pass filter.

BTW, if you order from Harrision Lab's eBay store, you can mix-and-match the filters.

BTW, how are you hooking up your shaker amp? On your primary surround sound amp... are you splitting the sub-out to the shaker amp?

Originally posted by mshe
Your receiver's cross over is way too high - do you have an option to use 70hz or 80hz?

If not, you can use a 70hz low-pass Harrision Lab F-Mod to filter out the higher frequencies.

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=266-252

You can also try a 50hz low-pass filter.

BTW, if you order from Harrision Lab's eBay store, you can mix-and-match the filters.

BTW, how are you hooking up your shaker amp? On your primary surround sound amp... are you splitting the sub-out to the shaker amp?
There really arent any options on the receiver,,

Im using 3 channels on the amp. 2 shakers in series per channel.. Thinking it should work

I started a massive search for those things that are basically RCAs but limit frequencies.. Could not find them for the life of me. Tried 19 different local shops..

Well I bought a Plate amp today.. i went to a local place trying to buy a funked up sub with a good amp.. i walked out with a 15" 290watt plate amp and just junked the rest.. The cost $30 from friends I do business with often.

So I get home and setup the 6 of them in a way that should yield 8ohms. It works, but its really weak in my mind.. Are these supposed to be a violant shake? Not even attached they seemed to be weak, I connected them to my stadium box and weaksauce..

Whats the deal? I'm now really tempted to return them. I expected a seat shaking experience but i think theres more noise than shaking.. 290 watts should be plenty but seems rather weak!

Need more details as to something sounds wrong..With 3 under my couch the shake can get very extreme if I want it..Are you attached to furniture directly or a riser of sorts?

brickie

I've got 4 Aura Pro Shakers (kicking myself for not buy more when PartsExpress had them). Any way, I need to build a wooden support structure inside the couchs. Does it matter what species of wood I use? Meaning does hickory (which is very hard and stiff) transmit vibrations better that oak; oak being better than pine. Or does it just not matter? What about plywood?

Whatever wood you use,you'll be fine..If it's a hardwood you may have to drill all holes first, but i'm using rugular ol MDF and it works awesome!!

brickie

Originally posted by Want2race
So I get home and setup the 6 of them in a way that should yield 8ohms. It works, but its really weak in my mind.. Are these supposed to be a violant shake? Not even attached they seemed to be weak, I connected them to my stadium box and weaksauce..

Whats the deal? I'm now really tempted to return them. I expected a seat shaking experience but i think theres more noise than shaking.. 290 watts should be plenty but seems rather weak!

Oh yes - definately should be a shaking experience. Actually very little sound comes out of the shaker... unless you're passing the shakers high frequences.

Perhaps the amp is overrated for 290W? Or is the amp rated at 290W for a 4ohm load?

How about rewiring only 2 of the shakers to the amp... then give it a try?

Originally posted by mshe
Oh yes - definately should be a shaking experience. Actually very little sound comes out of the shaker... unless you're passing the shakers high frequences.

Perhaps the amp is overrated for 290W? Or is the amp rated at 290W for a 4ohm load?

How about rewiring only 2 of the shakers to the amp... then give it a try?

Tried that. Actually the amp caught fire this morning. I am EXTREMELY irritated.. I'm just about ready to return them

So I get home and setup the 6 of them in a way that should yield 8ohms
I'm not sure how you wired 6 to result in 8 ohms. In fact, don't think it is possible. 6 shakers wired in any way that results in equal shaking would end up as 24 ohms (all in series), 6 ohms (two paralleled series strings of three shakers), 2.6 ohms (three parralleled strings of two shakers), or all in parallel (0.6 ohms)

If you are not too irritated, then you might provide more details of how you wired the shakers. It might help others attempting the same configuration.

If your amplifier caught fire then either:

It was defective to start with and why it was offered at a bargain price.
or
it was not designed for anything but an 8 ohm load (unlikely)
or
Your wiring of the shakers resulted in either a very low resistance load (way less than 4 ohms) or a short-circuit, and because the amplifier did not have any over-current protection, it self-destructed. (most likely)
or
one of the shakers has an internal short circuit (least likely)

A short circuit in your wiring would explain the low amount of shaking you experienced even though you attempted to put over 250 watts power into them. It mighth also explain the quick demise of your amplifier.

Joe L.

I think the amp was in fact defective.. I suppose shite happens!

so can someone recommend a passive sub amp to me? I dont really want a sub plate amp and if something rack mounted exisst cheaply I would grab that up!

No remote, but a Crown XLS 202 or higher would more than do the job.

brickie

Originally posted by brickie
No remote, but a Crown XLS 202 or higher would more than do the job.

brickie

And I would need 1 50hz Fmod passive crossover right?( i know some ppl say 70hz..)

That is correct..You could even try it without one at first to see if you like it..You may find that you don't need to use an f-mod.Really is personal choice.

brickie

Anybody install the standard Aura's lately? I'd like to hear from somebody actually using these to good effect.

I too am now kicking myself for not grabbing some Pro shakers from partexpress back when I was lurking this thread in the beginning.

What are these things, gold? Pork bellies? Drives me nuts when mass-produced electronics behave like commodities.

I'd really like to add some shakers to supplement my new subs, but wondering now if I missed the boat on the Aura's and should just wait around for another product/deal. The standard versions just don't give me any warm fuzzy feeling that they'd be powerful enough...and at $100+ bucks a pair it sounds like the Pro's are overpriced for the effect you can expect.

I'd try the standards...but after shelling out for them and then an amp of some kind, it would be a big letdown if they were just a buzzy, weak, or gimmicky effect. Besides, weren't they going for like $10 less a pair before compared to now?

Grrrr...darn my one bout of uncharacteristic restraint! :mad:

The pros were dirt cheap compared to what they're asking for them now too..I guess you can thank all of us for driving the prices up..LOL

brickie

Many here do report extremely great success with the regular Aura's!

just out of interest.. how much were the pros?

I have the regular ones now.. Im not amazed by them. I took apart my sub and use that amp to power it and it shook a good bit. But then again if it shook much more it would probably be problematic!

i paid something around $27.00 for the pro's at PE, back in May.
I bought 8 of them, glad i did.
;)

I'm about to hook up my aura pros this weekend. I am going to split my LFE out to a power amp. Since my crossover on the receiver is set to 80Hz will I even need to bother with the FMOD?

Mike

Ok I have read thru all the post and I still have a question. I have a amp that is rated 80w per channel at 8ohms. I want to put three standard aura bass shakers in a series in my couch. I then want to run another cable to my chair with one shaker. Will I be able to do this?

You can put two in series on each of the two channels (total of 4 shakers) and each channel will then have an 8 ohm load. Physically, three would be mounted on the couch and one on the chair.

Or...

You can put three in series on one channel of your amplifier (a 12 ohm load), and put one on the other channel of your amplifier (a 4 ohm load) and then adjust your left/right balance control so the one chair shakes an equal amount as the three in the couch. This solution assumes your amplifier can deal with a 4 ohm load at a 10 to 15 watt level. (Since the 80 per channel amplifier will probably be loafing driving the shakers, odds are it will do fine unless it has short-circuit protection circuits that are tripped)

Joe L.

I just bought a 1000 watt power amp.. Either its gonna be awesome or its gonna blow the shakers.. Either works for me at this point!

I did get the 40hz passive x overs so I hope to see some very occasion hard hits..

And I know 1000 watts will kill 6 shakers but I dunno if it will ever get over 200 watts.

Im very jealous about how cheap the pros were... Thats damn frustrating..

i paid something around $27.00 for the pro's at PE, back in May

Was that each or per pair? (If it was per pair I'm really going to slap myself...again). I know I'm just making myself more annoyed...but I can't help it. :) Like a wound you're not supposed to scratch but can't stop.

Somebody needs to put one of those paper cones around my head like a dog after a trip to the vet so I can't see the keyboard and continue lamenting this.

I wanna shakeshakeshake, shake my groove thing.

Was that each or per pair?

ooops, i just checked my paperwork.
I paid $24.88 for each Shaker, not 27.
:)

If someone doesnt mind could I get a quick check of my logic.

I have 6 shakers, all normals no pros :( and I just bought a 240 watt Sub Amp. Firstly is that enough ?

25watts RMS x6 is 150 watts so 250Watts rms should work well.Or so I think.

I intend to wire them all in parralel! That way I hope ( or think... ) I will end up 4ohms,

Anything sound or look like a potential problem ?

I appreaciate the help!

Thanks J.L for the help. I will try the three on one channel and one on the other channel. The problem is hard wood floors and the chair is not close to the couch. Thanks. Jeff

Originally posted by Want2race
If someone doesnt mind could I get a quick check of my logic.

I have 6 shakers, all normals no pros :( and I just bought a 240 watt Sub Amp. Firstly is that enough ?

Way more than enough.

25watts RMS x6 is 150 watts so 250Watts rms should work well.Or so I think.


I intend to wire them all in parralel! That way I hope ( or think... ) I will end up 4ohms,

Anything sound or look like a potential problem ?

I appreaciate the help!

6 shakers in parallel would result in a 0.66 ohm load to the amplifier. Since you are the same person that blew up an amplifier you took out of a subwoofer I can only guess that those shakers were also mis-wired to present a load too low for that amplifier. If you wire them all in parallel, expect another fried amplifier.

Either you have :

a)lots of money to burn (literally)

or

b) no ability to read the prior posts on how to wire 6 shakers and understand series vs parallel vs combinations of series-parallel,

or

c) you are a shill... attempting to get attention.

If "a" - keep a fire extinguisher handy
if "b" - hire a professional to wire your amplifier/shakers
if "c" - spend your money on a psychologist... it is better if they help you

Originally posted by J. L.
Way more than enough.


6 shakers in parallel would result in a 0.66 ohm load to the amplifier. Since you are the same person that blew up an amplifier you took out of a subwoofer I can only guess that those shakers were also mis-wired to present a load too low for that amplifier. If you wire them all in parallel, expect another fried amplifier.

Either you have :

a)lots of money to burn (literally)

or

b) no ability to read the prior posts on how to wire 6 shakers and understand series vs parallel vs combinations of series-parallel,

or

c) you are a shill... attempting to get attention.

If "a" - keep a fire extinguisher handy
if "b" - hire a professional to wire your amplifier/shakers
if "c" - spend your money on a psychologist... it is better if they help you

thanks for the ass ripping.. I found the diagram you did on page 14 :) very helpful! Thanks

Actually - I tried your diagram on page 2 when the amp blew...

Man, my internet computer has been down..Anyhow I paid around $24 or so for my pros as well..2 regular seem like they should be close in output to a pro.I hate the price gouging on the pros now, but you knew it was coming..Even I didn't have a chance to get more.

As for the fmod,it's personal choice.I suggest you try it without it at first and see what you think..If you find the shaking inappropriate,then a fmod may be in order.

brickie

Originally posted by brickie
Man, my internet computer has been down..Anyhow I paid around $24 or so for my pros as well..2 regular seem like they should be close in output to a pro.I hate the price gouging on the pros now, but you knew it was coming..Even I didn't have a chance to get more.

As for the fmod,it's personal choice.I suggest you try it without it at first and see what you think..If you find the shaking inappropriate,then a fmod may be in order.

brickie

Im tempted to buy a few cases of regulars.. Ive seen a pair of regulars go for $90 on ebay!

yeah, I know what you mean..Could make a few bucks if so inclined.I may buy 1 just to test out, t be able to give a review of it.

brickie

The good news Is I rewired my non pros and found that 1 of the wires had come out of its heat shrink tubing after the solder joint broke and arked with the body, Thus the amp fried. With that fixed, my ohm meter is showing 5.7 ohms which is pretty good to me! :)

I'll bet they will shake a bit better with the short-circuit corrected.

Happy to learn you took the time to look at the wiring.

The resistance you measured sounds exactly as expected for two paralleled strings of three in series.

Joe L

No testing yet besides the meter.. still waiting for an amp that I havent caught on fire yet!

Ok one more silly question do I need to cut a round hole in the wood I am mounting the shaker to? Ok now a regular question so if two regular shakers equal 1 pro should I mount 4 under my couch? The couch is 7 feet long.

Originally posted by xterraml
Ok one more silly question do I need to cut a round hole in the wood I am mounting the shaker to? Ok now a regular question so if two regular shakers equal 1 pro should I mount 4 under my couch? The couch is 7 feet long.

I cant say about the second part but i would think 4 shakers on 1 couch would be overkill.. thats some serious shakage!

And the first question.. no you dont have to cut any holes.. just screw them in!

I have 3 on a 7foot couch and that's plenty - when they were working haven't rewired yet) I had to turn the amp way down so the effect wasn't locatable....

davey

Davey was that the Pro or non-Pro models?

Well, I got a hold of some Pro shakers. I didn't get the deal you guys got, but I didn't pay $100 a pair either.

Got em new in box. Wound up paying about $6.60 more per shaker than the partsexpress deal, which isn't too bad, but I did get hit with a bit in shipping...and I got stuck with an extra pair that I don't need. I only need three pairs, but I now have four.

Looking forward to hooking them up, but now I need to find an amp. Too bad yard-sale season is over. I've got one I can borrow to test with, so I'll be able to hook em up and see how they work, but I'll need to find a more permanent solution.

Those plate amps are a fairly reasonable price given the crossover adjustment is right there and everything, but I have no idea where I could put it/mount it. It won't exactly sit in a rack or on a stack of components. I think I read something some posts back about some kind of WalMart Wonder that would do the trick...

Samurai Jack

Where did you find your Pros at?
Want to part with your extra pair? :)

Where did you find your Pros at?

There's been some "reasonable" deals on ebay without having to pay by money order or any such nonsense...although the starting bids are continuing to rise.

I'm guessing a lot of these sellers bought a load from partexpress and are now reselling them at a markup for profit. (Isn't ebay just swell?). :rolleyes:

http://www.want2race.net/hometheatre/PICT0590.JPG
http://www.want2race.net/hometheatre/pict0589.JPG

I cut my plate amp into teh wall.. Its behind the seats so nobody will see it :) unless you take the back off one of them..

Want2race,

Nice seats...are those 088's? (I'm thinking 088's are what I will put into my room). How do the shakers work on them? Pleasing? IIRC, you're using a Pro per seat, correct?

I suppose I could do something like that with the plate amp if I had to, but I'd rather it be just another component in the rack. My rack is going to be hard enough to place without other odd bits n' ends to install elsewhere. But I guess I can get creative if I have to. Not like my walls are even up yet. :)

Originally posted by Samurai Jack
Want2race,

Nice seats...are those 088's? (I'm thinking 088's are what I will put into my room). How do the shakers work on them? Pleasing? IIRC, you're using a Pro per seat, correct?

I suppose I could do something like that with the plate amp if I had to, but I'd rather it be just another component in the rack. My rack is going to be hard enough to place without other odd bits n' ends to install elsewhere. But I guess I can get creative if I have to. Not like my walls are even up yet. :)

The seats are from a friend who sells couches.. Helal deal, Hella comfortable.. Only down side is that the shakers were hard to mount and let the mechanism function.

I have 1 shaker per chair. The non pros.

It shakes, its set to shake hard and low so I intend for them to only work below 50hz. I want it to be rare and not part of every scene.. I'll tell you how hard they shake when the amp arrives tomorrow.

Cool, keep me posted, Want2race. Sounds like you're doing it pretty much the way I hope to. I'll be interested to hear how it all works out when calibrated.

I've got a pair of Hsu STF-2s doing the "air compression," but I think it would really add something viceral to those ultra-low freq. effects, like you say. Darla tapping on the fishtank in "Finding Nemo" is really cool...sounds like the room is being pounded on by a giant outside. It's a really low-freq event.

But having the shakers actually put a little tactile thump into your chest would really add to the immersion and make the effect even more convincing. A little special something to make guests go "whoa" without being able to put their finger on why it seemed so real.

My subs are completely hidden from view, too :D With a little creativity in room construction, I hope to make all my speakers all but invisible. I like the idea that one can't point to a speaker and go "wow, nice speaker." Rather, only the overall experience presents itself in an enveloping, inseperable fantasia.

I just searched www.aurasound.com. Here's the info found comparing Pros vs non-Pros

Specification................Bass Shaker.............Pro Bass Shaker
Frame size...................5.4" W x 2.2" H.........5.4" W x 2.2" H
Force, Peak..................20 Lbf (89 N)...........30 Lbf (132 N)
Effective Impedance......4 Ohms....................4 Ohms
Power, Continuous........25 Watts RMS...........50 Watts RMS
Power, Max..................50 Watts RMS...........75 Watts RMS
Height.........................2.2"........................2.2"
Diameter......................5.1"........................6.2"
Weight........................3.0 lb......................3.0 lb
Resonance Freq (fo)......40 Hz......................40 Hz
Usable Freq Range.........20-80 Hz.................20-80 Hz

Let's compare the specs.
So the frame size is the same. I'm assuming this is the mounting flange.
The Pros have more peak force. I wondering how important this is. From what I've read, most people turn down the volume. That would reduce the force.
The Pros handle more power both continuous and max. Again turning down the volume would reduce the power being sent to the shakers. Lower continuous and max power handling wouldn't matter
The Pros have a larger diameter. How much of this is fins and how much of this is magnet or "piston" size?
Weight is the same. Surprising. That's says there can't be much more magnet or piston.
Resonance Frequency is the same. From looking at their Force vs Freq graph, that where the peak output is. 40 Hz. The same for both Pro and non-Pro
Usable Frequency Range is the same.

I'd say that
1 - You might get away with 1 Pro Shaker vs. 2 or 3 non-Pro Shakers per larger piece of furniture (i.e., couch or love seat) but driving it harder. You may issues here with the impedance.
2 - One non-Pro Shaker should be fine per chair.
3 - Driven at the same lower volumes or watts, you should be able to mix and match Pro and non-Pro.
4 - I think Pro is just a non-Pro with the extra fins for cooling. Allowing you to drive it harder.

I sent an email to Aura Sound asking:

1 - Driven at the same output (i.e., volume or watts) does the Pro Bass Shaker produce more vibrations than the Bass Shaker? I understand that the Pro will produce a higher peak force at it's max input power. I'm more curious that if they were both driven at lets say 5 watts, would the Pro produce more Lbf or N (newtons)?
2 - Besides from the fins on the Pro Bass Shakers, are there any internal differences between them and the Bass Shakers? Like a bigger piston, bigger magnet, etc.

Enquiring minds need to know.

Looking forward to that reply and let me know when you get the package PAW.

brickie

Thanks Brickie. I looking forward to the package. :) I have my doubts about a reply from Aura Sound. It seems like when I ask companies these type of questions, they never respond.

PAW mine are nonpros and plenty powerfull enough for the job.

davey

My email to Aura Sound ask:

1 - Driven at the same output (i.e., volume or watts) does the Pro Bass Shaker produce more vibrations than the Bass Shaker? I understand that the Pro will produce a higher peak force at it's max input power. I'm more curious that if they were both driven at lets say 5 watts, would the Pro produce more Lbf or N (newtons)?
2 - Besides from the fins on the Pro Bass Shakers, are there any internal differences between them and the Bass Shakers? Like a bigger piston, bigger magnet, etc.

Their answer was:

No difference at 5 watts same Lbf...fins dissipate heat better (stability in coil impedance) no difference in internal composition.

Comparing the Pros to non-Pros:
The internals are the same
Same output at lower inputs
Fins are just for cooling

So, unless you are driving the Pros harder, the non-Pros should work just fine.

Time to call Parts Express and order some non-Pros before they run out.

I got my amp today and it didnt fry!!

It does hum like a crazy mofo.. SO I am off to buy a ground loop isolator as soon as this post is submitted.

Basically the non pros kick ass! They shake my big theatre seats VERY VERY well!

My only complaint is partsexpress advertise a 240watt amp on their site and when I got it the instructions say 200watt. I dont like this and will call to see what they say soon.. It even says patt 300-804

OK. $16 fixed it.

These things rock!

Thanks all for your help

btw- Im driving my amp flat out @ 240watts but only doing 40hz and below so I wont overheat anything/burn my chair!

PAW, way to do some excellent research. I wound up buying Pros just as a safety margin. Now I know I spent about $100 I didn't need to. Ouch.

Oh well, I do like the way the Pros look (even though no one will see them but me, I'm a bit crazy that way), and I like the banana-plug type connectors better, so I still feel a bit better about them. But yeah, it sounds like there's no reason not to save a bunch of money and go with the standard shakers. Reap the rewards of your legwork and buy em up, good for you!

So here's the other question...just how much power do you really need for an amp to drive these things? I'm going to do 6 shakers using the 3-in-series-on-each-channel method for a 12 Ohm load. I found a stereo receiver I can pick up cheap (like $10) that does (per channel) 55W at 8 Ohms and 50W at 6 Ohms. Will this do the job? Or do I need to keep looking for some more power?

Thanks!

That is more than enough power!!!! That is the same specs of the cheap $20 or so receiver that I picked up used..Can't get halfway on the volume,and this is with 6 shakers wired as you plan to as well..You'll be fine.

brickie

Samurai Jack
Sorry for that Ouch. I just had to know.

Yep! Got to order another 2 or 3 pair of the non-Pros.

I know what you mean about the fins. They do look cool!

As far as power, I can't say. For $10, it's worth a shot. If it doesn't work, just resale it and keep looking. Heck! I bet you can find someone to trade your extra pair of Pros for a reciever or amp with more power. :)

anyone know how i can keep my amp temps down ? or whats acceptable?

I touched mine after a long movie and it was rather warm..

anyone know how i can keep my amp temps down ?

Yeah, get some with fins like mine! :D

Sorry, couldn't help myself.

What's rather warm? I think they'd have to get pretty hot before they were any kind of a real hazard. How do you have them attached?

That is more than enough power!!!!

Cool, thanks brickie. Good to know that'll suffice. At least I'll be able to stick the old receiver in a rack and it won't look out of place. Guess I'll still need an fmod now, though. Anybody have one leftover from buying a pair they're looking to part with?

Samurai Jack
If you don't find a single, I'd be insteaded in splitting a pair.

Originally posted by PAW
My email to Aura Sound ask:
...snip...
2 - Besides from the fins on the Pro Bass Shakers, are there any internal differences between them and the Bass Shakers? Like a bigger piston, bigger magnet, etc.

Their answer was:

No difference at 5 watts same Lbf...fins dissipate heat better (stability in coil impedance) no difference in internal composition.

Comparing the Pros to non-Pros:
The internals are the same
Same output at lower inputs
Fins are just for cooling

So, unless you are driving the Pros harder, the non-Pros should work just fine.

Time to call Parts Express and order some non-Pros before they run out.

Those are some expensive heat-sinks. :) (I guess the binding posts are expensive too)

Kinda glad I got the non-pros...

Joe L.

Originally posted by Samurai Jack
Yeah, get some with fins like mine! :D

Sorry, couldn't help myself.

What's rather warm? I think they'd have to get pretty hot before they were any kind of a real hazard. How do you have them attached?

http://www.partsexpress.com/images/300-804m.jpg
Its got some fins y0.. they are all about 120 degrees

Originally posted by Want2race
http://www.partsexpress.com/images/300-804m.jpg
Its got some fins y0.. they are all about 120 degrees 6 in a method that provides 5.7ohms.

basically I have the cutoff set to 40hz and the volume at full power. So the shakers dont shake often but they hit hard when they do..

Its stuck in the wall.. and since I just lost my insurance carrier.. I dont want any fires!

Its got some fins y0

Noooo, I meant fins on your shakers! (Sorry, still trying to justify that $100 premuim somehow after being humbled by PAW, hehe).

You run six shakers at a full 240 watts? Isn't there a way to wire them where you wouldn't have that much impedence and wouldn't have to drive the amp quite so hard?

And yeah, in the wall I'd worry about what amounts to a space-heater. I don't think 120 degF is nearly hot enough to cook drywall or anything, but it doesn't strike me as entirely safe either.

Want2Race
I'm assuming you asking if 120 degree F is too hot. I'm not an expert but I wouldn't think that's a problem. Heck! That's just a summer day in Pheniox.

PAW,

Were you thinking about going with a 70Hz or a 50Hz fmod? I can't quite decide. I don't want these shaking at the wrong time...but I DO want them to shake (they need to earn their keep after what I paid, heh).

Samurai Jack
Take a look at this graph

Freq vs. Force (http://www.aurasound.com/bassshaker/images/spec/ast_2b_4_b.jpg)

There's very little force at 70Hz.

Does the fmod do a hard cut off? If so, it the 70Hz might be worth a try. Else, I'd go with the 50Hz.

I'm leaning toward the 50Hz

I would buy the fmods on ebay.. there is someone selling them for $23 and you can pick any 2 you want.. so why not take 1 of each!

Personally my systems running 40hz.

and finally I called parts express tech support.. The guy said run it flat out and it will turn off if it gets too hot.. but he doesnt think it will! So thats what I am gonna try one day soon!

Interesting to note that one of the bullets reads:

* LPF (low pass filter), if used, should be set to 100Hz

I think the fmod has a "steep" but not "hard" cutoff.

I'd hate for a well-engineered LFE effect to register on the shakers as just a...silence...silence...SUDDEN THUD...silence...SUDDEN THUD.

Up at 70Hz, you'd either:

(a) catch a bit more "subtlety" form the effects, where you get a little force from the slightly higher low-freq tones, and a LOT more from the lower-freq tones, for the overall effect of having a shake kind of roll-on and roll-off when the effect requires it (imagine Sauron exploding in the prologue to Lord of the Rings: Fellowship of the Ring, the descending-scale slurred wave)

OR

(b) get shake where it takes away from the subtlety of the shaker effect overall, and/or shakes (although more softly) at questionable times, making the shaking too often, too noticeable/gimmicky, and fatiguing.


70Hz sounds pretty low to me. I'd say (b) is more likely up at around your receivers more standard, say, 90Hz. I think the effect of the 70Hz fmod, given the graph you linked to, is more likely to produce (a), as in something desirable. But I'm not sure.

Somebody take a guess...what freq. is a car door slamming? Or Darth Vader's voice? Or some similar stuff that you wouldn't want causing a shake?


At first I was leaning towards 70 to capture everything...then 50 to make sure this wasn't something people would immediately notice and localize...then 70 again after seeing the graph...and now after typing this, I feel like I talked myself down to 50 again. :D

What's the general consensus, or is there one?

I would buy the fmods on ebay.. there is someone selling them for $23 and you can pick any 2 you want.. so why not take 1 of each!

I guess that's a pretty good idea, but it looks like it's up to $27 if this is the right one...and I'm sending a question to see if he'll mix/match.

About the cutoff slope:

"FMODs™ are packaged in pairs and can be combined with other FMODs™ to obtain bandpass ranges or with other types of crossovers to change the slope and crossover frequency point. FMODs™ feature a 12 dB per octave crossover slope."

"The crossover frequency is at the -3db or half power point - this is standard. The slope is the rate of signal attenuation or drop."

Hi guys,

I received two pair of shakers (non-pro) from PE today. For the interested Canadian parties, delivery took three weeks, PE's price was $30USD per pair, plus another $30USD shipping = roughly $90USD out PE's door. GST was $7.50CDN, handling fee was $5CDN. Total CDN price to my door was $125 for the two pairs, so roughly the standard double-the-USD price-converted-to-CDN currency formula.
Here's where this dummy needs a little help. I've got my amp, I'm clear on how to safely and efficiently run them, but I'm just not sure how to physically attach the speaker wire to shakers. The Pro's have banana plugs, the regular models don't; they have two blades with which to make the connection. Surely my installing pal won't have to break out his soldering iron, will he? Thanks for any help you might provide, fellas.
By the way, anybody know where to get a 50hz FMOD in the GTA? I'll try out the shakers without one (my old Yammie receiver crosses at 90hz), but I'll get an FMOD if the need arises.
Thanks again, and cheers!

DS.

partsexpress also carries the fmods, Dave.

And I wish I could help you with those blade connectors...but I have no idea how those work...part of the reason I liked the banana plugs on the Pros. Easy install, easy uninstall, easy re-install (my room is a work in progress).

Thanks for responding, Jack. Yep, PE carries the FMOD (hadn't considered that at the time of placing my order), but I think I'd prefer to find one locally. Perhaps a car-audio joint will know what I'm talking about, because the Shack sure as heck won't!
As for the blade connectors, I surely can't be the first dude to have questions about this, now can I? I bow before the assembled knowledge of the board...Cheers!


DS.

The Shack might have the blade connectors. I couldn't vouch for the quality. Else break out the wire cutters, soldering iron and your favorite connectors. No biggie!

Originally posted by Dave Simpson
Thanks for responding, Jack. Yep, PE carries the FMOD (hadn't considered that at the time of placing my order), but I think I'd prefer to find one locally. Perhaps a car-audio joint will know what I'm talking about, because the Shack sure as heck won't!
As for the blade connectors, I surely can't be the first dude to have questions about this, now can I? I bow before the assembled knowledge of the board...Cheers!


DS.

I spent 9 hours looking for fmods locally.. It wasnt happening.. I would just HIGHLY recommend you buy them online

Just ordered a mix/match pair of FMODs from the HLabs ebay store. A couple bucks more than partsexpress, but this way I get a 50Hz and a 70Hz and can try them out and decide which I like best.

Hey guys,

I was in the shower prior to going to work tonight racking my pee-brain trying to come up with a solution to this blade connection conundrum. Seems to me that this hobby can sometime become complex enough (and I enjoy this aspect) that I overlook the most obvious solution. So unless someone can convincingly argue against this course of action, I'm going to simply attach the speaker wire (likely 16ga) to the blade and wrap the entire affair with electrical tape. And that'll be that. It may not be quite as good as soldering, but I don't prefer any solution as permanent as that. It doesn't need to be pretty, just effective. Can anybody clearly explain why I should not proceed in this fashion?
As for the FMOD, that'll be a bridge to cross.
Thanks again, and cheers.

DS.

Originally posted by Dave Simpson
Hey guys,

I was in the shower prior to going to work tonight racking my pee-brain trying to come up with a solution to this blade connection conundrum. Seems to me that this hobby can sometime become complex enough (and I enjoy this aspect) that I overlook the most obvious solution. So unless someone can convincingly argue against this course of action, I'm going to simply attach the speaker wire (likely 16ga) to the blade and wrap the entire affair with electrical tape. And that'll be that. It may not be quite as good as soldering, but I don't prefer any solution as permanent as that. It doesn't need to be pretty, just effective. Can anybody clearly explain why I should not proceed in this fashion?
As for the FMOD, that'll be a bridge to cross.
Thanks again, and cheers.

DS.
I cut the spade connectors off and used wirenuts! Then wrapped them in electrical tape. They work PERFECTLY!

2 things I will suggest. #1 is most car audio places have those blade type connectors. So that could be the easiest answer. Again I would wrap them with electrical tape to make sure they dont shake free. Or heat thrink tubing.
The other idea is just use butt connectors (like the red ones or maybe blue) and just crimp both sides in.. Works for car audio which has equal or more vibration.

I soldered mine but after i acciedently moved a chair and the wire broke I switched to wirenuts just because its very fast to attach/remove.

PE included all the connectors for the blades in my order, plus speaker putty for mounting them and extra screws. I order 3 pairs from them, shipping on 3 pairs + 2 fmods was $17 usd to alberta. I'm happy.

You guys are horrible. I was looking for something on this board, don't remember for what, and now I have 6 standard bass shakers on their way from PE and just bought an old Sony receiver from my neighbor. Damn you people and your AVSForum website.

Seriously, I love this board, I had never even heard of this product until now. I have gone through all 19 pages but still have a few questions I am hoping I can get answered before the shakers arrive on Monday.

I have 2 couches in my living room, 1 with 3 seats, 1 with 2 so I wanted to run 5 shakers. Is this feasible to do or should I just run 4? The receiver is a 100x2 8 ohm Sony.

How would I run 5 split 3 and 2? All of this ohm talk makes my head hurt, I just want it to work right. And with all of the changing sides on ohms what would be the best way to run 2 and 2?

Can I just mount these pigs to frame of the couch, inside of course? Or is it better to have it fire right at your butt?

I appologize if this has been answered already, it took me 2 days to get through this thread at work, if I saw it...I forgot it by now.

And lastly does anyone have a 50hz fmod they are looking to sell?

P.S. My wife hates you all.

You guys are horrible. I was looking for something on this board, don't remember for what, and now I have 6 standard bass shakers on their way from PE and just bought an old Sony receiver from my neighbor. Damn you people and your AVSForum website.

LOL...welcome to the club...I wish I could stop comming in here because every time I do I find some other AMAZING deal that I just HAVE to go blow a wad of cash on RIGHT NOW. :D

At first I was just a very curious lurker, wondering if I could somehow pull off some HT magic when I finished my basement on a slim budget. Then it was front projectors becomming truely afordable (the AE100 tempted, the X1 proved irresitable). Then it was a DIY screen and planning room building. Then it was the Zenith DVB-318 upcoverting-over-component (whoops!) $200 DVD player. Then it was a DIY anamorphic lens. Then it was the Panamorph powerbuy. Couple weeks ago it was the Hsu STF-2 subs (I got a PAIR of them for $300). Now it's the Aura shaker deal.

I haven't even gotten my shakers or reciever delivered yet...and I'm already doing heavy research into Axiom, Ascend, Onix, Klipsch, Paradigm, and the like for new, "real" speakers to replace my toy HTiB Sonys.

I don't have a wife to hate you guys...but you've gotta wonder how much of this is why I haven't found one! :o

Samurai Jack,

It is a horrible disease we have...it causes some marital ripples from time to time, as I am sure you could imagine.

My bass shakers are arriving from PE on Monday, so I am getting all the leg work done this weekend. I don't think I have been so excited about a product for the HT in a long while. I should have them done early next week, so if you feel like making a trip out to Aurora, you are welcome to experience them for your self.

And for what it is worth, the front of my system is Klipsch reference series and I love them. They take a while to get used to, because the highs are very crisp...but once you get used to them they are fantastic.

I just realized that my family room (a.k.a., HT) is open to the crawl space below. :rolleyes: Does any one have experince with mounting Pro Shakers under the floor? That way your feet shake also. :cool:

Should I mount them to the joists or the subfloor?

I'm assuming I will need more power to feel the shake? So, my old 35 W reciever might not be enough. :eek:

Any worries about damaging the floor or structure? I more concerned about future squeaks than the floor collapsing. ;) I know our subfloor is attached to the joists with construction adhesive and nails. Could that break loose and cause squeaks?

Originally posted by PAW
I just realized that my family room (a.k.a., HT) is open to the crawl space below. :rolleyes: Does any one have experince with mounting Pro Shakers under the floor? That way your feet shake also. :cool:

Should I mount them to the joists or the subfloor?

I'm assuming I will need more power to feel the shake? So, my old 35 W reciever might not be enough. :eek:

Any worries about damaging the floor or structure? I more concerned about future squeaks than the floor collapsing. ;) I know our subfloor is attached to the joists with construction adhesive and nails. Could that break loose and cause squeaks?

I tried mounting 6 on my stadium seating box.. Basically the effect was much less than having 1 per chair!

To move that much area you really need a Clark or a Buttkicker I believe...

brickie

I looked closed at my crawl space. There's duct work right under the seating area. It looks like cold air return. The space between the joists are encased in sheet metal. So, back to mounting them in the seats. I swung by Lowes at lunch. I picked up an oak board to attach to the love seat and mount the shakers on. I flex it and a pine board. The oak was much stiffer. Yes it cost several time more but what the heck!

Originally posted by PAW
I looked closed at my crawl space. There's duct work right under the seating area. It looks like cold air return. The space between the joists are encased in sheet metal. So, back to mounting them in the seats. I swung by Lowes at lunch. I picked up an oak board to attach to the love seat and mount the shakers on. I flex it and a pine board. The oak was much stiffer. Yes it cost several time more but what the heck!
Cull cut cart is your friend! weird offcuts for near nada!

I used HSD or high density fiberboard.. Glued to edges to provent lamination

Originally posted by PAW
I just realized that my family room (a.k.a., HT) is open to the crawl space below. :rolleyes: Does any one have experince with mounting Pro Shakers under the floor? That way your feet shake also. :cool:

Should I mount them to the joists or the subfloor?



You might want to get a Clark Synthesis Transducer ... they were designed to be mounted underneath the floors.

Originally posted by the crane
I have 2 couches in my living room, 1 with 3 seats, 1 with 2 so I wanted to run 5 shakers. Is this feasible to do or should I just run 4? The receiver is a 100x2 8 ohm Sony.

Can I just mount these pigs to frame of the couch, inside of course? Or is it better to have it fire right at your butt?

I appologize if this has been answered already, it took me 2 days to get through this thread at work, if I saw it...I forgot it by now.

And lastly does anyone have a 50hz fmod they are looking to sell?

P.S. My wife hates you all.

Send you a PM reply.
Simple Answer - Hook up all 6 (3 per couch - 3 left - 3 right channel) Go back to page one post 1 and 2 and add a 5th and 6th shaker. It won't hurt your equipment just lessen the effect ALITTLE.

FYI: I can't turn my receiver up more than 60% without over shaking my rump. I don't have FMOD. I rather enjoy receiving as much LFE signal as possible thru the shakers (I have a low quality sub). Only exception is plain old MUSIC from a CD - you might be suprised how much bass some songs really have when you crank up the shakers!

Mounting will vary with each couch. Try attaching to wooden fram when possible, otherwise strap them to the seat springs under the couch. (Those plastic zip tie things).

Thanks bob

Finally got all six shakers hooked up. For what it's worth, I prefer the 50Hz fmod.

The effect is very nice. It's better than just "enhanced bass." It really lends a new, unique quality to the whole movie/gaming experience (where LFE is concerned). Properly calibrated it's subtle, and smooth. Not gimmicky or localized at all.

I've been particularly enjoying it for playing Halo 2 on XBox, since the extra sense of immersion realy heightens the enjoyment of the game.

Big thumbs up for this project...it'd be hard to give up the tactile sensation and go back to "regular" bass now.

Congrats man!! It really is an incredible, cheap way to enhance the movie going experience..The beauty is that you can set it to what works for your setup and there is no right or wrong...I was using a 50hz fmod,but kinda like it without it..Makes the shakers just that extra little bit more lively..Who knows, I may go back to the fmod..But that is the beauty of being able to experiment.

brickie

I watched Master and Commander with my amp set to 40hz.. It actually got too much.. I think I want a 30hz one now..

WOW!! haven't watched that movie yet,but I know I felt the same way with the last LOTR movie when I watched it with my shakers..And the fmod was installed then...Would hate to see what it feels like now with it temporarily removed.

brickie

Anybody have a receiver with a second zone and hooked up shakers to it? Would it be bad to feed a split LFE from the receiver back into the receiver on an unused input?

Hey guys.
I have everything hooked up and the shakers are great. One problem I am finding is that my sub is not working and the shakers are. If I unhook the y at the main receiver and plug the sub in it works. But as soon as I hook the y up and connect the sub and shakers the sub does not work and the shakers do. Any ideas?

i'm about to mount my shakers. i'm going with putting them under the couch. i have 3 per couch so i'm centering them under each of the 3 cushions. as far as positioning them from front to back, what do you recommend?

under your tail bone?
under your crotch?
under your thighs?


thanks for any input!!

Originally posted by xterraml
Hey guys.
I have everything hooked up and the shakers are great. One problem I am finding is that my sub is not working and the shakers are. If I unhook the y at the main receiver and plug the sub in it works. But as soon as I hook the y up and connect the sub and shakers the sub does not work and the shakers do. Any ideas?

Have you tried the sub on both sides of the y to see if it is a bad y?

Sounds like a bad "Y" too me to..

brickie

Sorry about that yes I tried the shakers on both sides of the y and they work. I tried the sub on both sides and neither worked. I am at a loss here. Thanks for the help.

xterraml...bad subwoofer cable? Does the sub work if you remove the Y cable? I'd just say go get a different Y and see.

jimmy666...I think most have been mounting it direct center...so I guess that'd be under your crotch. Although I don't think position will really have much effect. The sensation isn't localized (that's the whole point). It just feels like "bass."

Suuuuure, brickie...sell me on the fmod and then tell me you don't even use it!!

I found a bit too much comming through without it. I like to have them set high...a strong rumble...but I don't like them buzzing for no reason, so I filter. If you have them set pretty low to begin with, I can see using no fmod at all...but I think you'd still get some unwanted buzz during the wrong point of a movie here and there.

I just switched from using my girlfriend's 30 watt-per-channel receiver to the 100-watt-per-channel one I bought off ebay. Somehow the wimpy one sounded better (both Sonys). Or maybe I'm just imagining things.

I've already gotten so used to the effect that I have a hard time telling if it's on or not...until I shut it off entirely.

Part of the issue seems to be that the subwoofer output (that I'm branching off of with the Y splitter) is volume-dependant. So the level of effect depends on what I have the main recover volume at, not just what I have the shaker reciver volume set at. Annoying since I play video games at slightly less volume than I watch movies.

Ah well, I'll figure it all out.

Recently bought 6 coaster loungers based on the feedback on this forum. I then went to PE and got 6 bass shakers. Here is how I plan on hooking them up with some questions.

Onkyo 502 receiver sub out with y splitter to Dayton Sub and split again to Sony 250 watt receiver. Question 1 - any quality loss by splitting so much-concerned mostly about my Dayton Sub (100 watt version) Receiver has an impedance swich - question 2 should I set it at 4ohms or 8ohms. Run the Sony at Two Channel and set speakers to large and sub to no. Run 3 shakers in series off left and 3 in series off right.

Am I missing anything? Would purchasing a seperate subwoofer amp add any significant benefit?

I started this hobby on a whim about 2 months ago-so I am a relative newbie. However, I am picking things up fast thanks to this forum.

Samurai Jack
Yes The sub works if I remove the y and plug directly into the receiver. I am going to return the y and try another one.
Thanks everyone

SoccerGuy,

Don't worry about splitting. You're just splitting a signal...nothing carrying any power (the power comes from the sub's amp and your shaker amp), so there's not much to worry about.

Seperate sub amp? You already said your sub is 100 Watts...which I assume means it's powered? In that case you're just sending it a signal (via a single subwoofer cable). It provides it's own power...absolutely no need (or way) to "amp" it seperately. Correct me if I'm misunderstanding you.

The way you're wiring (same as me, 3 in series per channel, 2 channels) you will have a 12 Ohm load (4+4+4) so you want your impedence switch set to 8 Ohms. This is important.

However, I found I had to run one string off the RIGHT channel for the A-speakers and the other off the RIGHT channel for the B-speakers...since the input is mono...I didn't getting anything out the left terminals. Somebody clue me in if I'm being dumb.

Anyway, welcome to the forums...they are just great aren't they? No place else on the web with this much quality info about this stuff. Highly addictive!

Shake shake shake! I can't wait to get home and try and figure out why there seems to be a difference between the last reciever I used and this new (er...old) one. It's bugging me that there seems to be a difference...there really shouldn't be. Both are Sonys. This shouldn't be this mysterious. Power is power in this case, right?

Last one did have an analog Bass knob on it...when turned too high seemed to muddy the shaking a bit...but when turned up just a bit, it kind of when from shake/vibrate to thud/kick. Hmm. Seriously, I might be just kind of imagining things at this point. I've already gotten so used to them. It's like staring at your projector for the 1000th time wondering "is my Green level set just right??"

Samurai Jack,

Thanks for your reply. I was referring to the separate amp to power the shakers rather than my old Sony receiver-if there is any benefit or not.
If the input is mono, do I need to split again before the receiver (to get the left and right inputs)?
You are 100% correct about this stuff being HIGHLY addictive. My wife thought I was crazy when I was in our theater with my SPL meter adjusting the sound levels, or calibrating our projector (again). It seems every time I log on to the forum, I find something else to add or try in my theater. With the info from this forum, in the last 2 months I
Purchased a projector (Optoma H30)
New Receiver (Onkyo 502)
New Speakers (Fluance)
Avia Calibration Disk
SPL Meter
Popcorn Popper (power buy)
Home made screen (Behr SS with WOP and Ultra White-10 feet diagonal)
Shakers
Coaster Loungers
Signs (Dolby Digital/DTS)
Excel Ticket Maker (this was the best....FREE)
Currently, I am reading about building some risers for my new coasters.
I LOVE THIS PLACE!!!

Ok back to my tech guru's. I replaced the y with a new one and still have the same problem. I have found out that if I plug both the sub and shaker receiver into the y the sub does not work. But as soon as I unplug the shaker receiver my sub works. The shaker receiver produces sound no matter if the sub is plugged in or not. Help???:confused:

Could the shaker reciver becausing a short some kind of way when plugged in? Can you try a different receiver (shaker)?

brickie

Wish I had one but I will look into it. Does it matter which input I use on the shaker receiver?

Does the receiver produce sound then using the internal tuner (if there is one)? If that's good then try a different input connector. It sounds like maybe you are plugging the cable from your Y into a output on the receiver. Try the CD/TV/AUX input connectors.

i'm running 3 shakers in series on each channel. i'll need around 60 feet of wire. what gauge should i use to get plenty of power to the shakers and still be gentle on the amp?

As I described in this post http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4599465#post4599465
Just about any guage wire will do. (They were asking about using 22 guage wire they had on hand)

I used 16 guage when I wired my shakers.

Joe L.

"Does the receiver produce sound then using the internal tuner (if there is one)? If that's good then try a different input connector. It sounds like maybe you are plugging the cable from your Y into a output on the receiver. Try the CD/TV/AUX input connectors."

No I have tried all the inputs to the Shaker receiver. I have noticed that when I plug ithe one out to the shaker receiver the sub will give off a low buzz for a second? If the shaker receiver has a short how can I fix the problem.

Does anyone have some ideas about a mounting method that gets the shakers into place but doesn't attach them to the furniture itself? Specifically for a couch?

Originally posted by madpoet
Does anyone have some ideas about a mounting method that gets the shakers into place but doesn't attach them to the furniture itself? Specifically for a couch? There's some other transducer that mount under the feet of a couch. There's AVS special going on. Check the speakers, power buys and accessories forums. Just be warned they are pricey!

Mounting the shakers is pretty easy. Flip over the couch. You'll see a black, thin fabric stapled on. Pull out the staples. There's the wooden frame. You can attach them to the frame or attach a board or plywood to the frame. Then attach the shakers to the board or plywood. Run your wire. Restaple the black fabric and no one is the wisher.

I'm not positive about what you're trying to do.

I think the key is you have to have something solid to transfer the "shake."
Since the auras are smaller, I think the shaking seems to be more localized.

I've heard of the bigger units, (Buttkicker, Clark) being mounted seperate from the furniture. I think somebody had it attached to the riser, or subfloor. However, I question if the aura's would provide good enough performance in this application.

I was a bit hesitant to rip apart the underneath of my sofa as well. As long as you take your time, and not force/rip anything you should be alright.

I should have explained that the couches get moved frequently. I guess I can deal with it using longer wire that I might otherwise. I saw the transducers and tey look nice, but $1000 compared to the $100 or so I will spend on the shakers, they'd have to rock my freaking world.

How about some concealed audio jacks somewhere on the sofa? That may offer you a quick connect/disconnect solution rather than running the longer wires.

OH! Just use plugs and jack to make the speaker wire detachable. I'm going to use stacking bananna plugs from Parts Express. One plug (acting as a jack) will be mounted to the edge of the couch. I'll drill a hole though the center of the jack and screw it to the frame. The other plug will be attached to the wire. "Plug it in! Plug it in!" Oh wait, that's a commerical. Here's the plugs

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=091-334

It also comes in red.

Thanks for the suggestions. That looks like a better solution.

-MP

Originally posted by frostlich
I was a bit hesitant to rip apart the underneath of my sofa as well. As long as you take your time, and not force/rip anything you should be alright.

I took some pictures while mounting my shakers, (brand new Couch) click on my signature, and scroll down.
;)

Originally posted by frostlich
I was a bit hesitant to rip apart the underneath of my sofa as well. As long as you take your time, and not force/rip anything you should be alright. If you talking about that thin, black fabric. I bet it's cheap. Any uphoslter should have it. I will reuse mine, just like in Deja-vue's pic, because I don't want to hassle with going to get more.

Great pics Deja-vue!

Great pics Deja-vue!

Thanks! :) It was a fun-project.

Deja, does the mount you made sit flush to the springs or is there a little room between the springs and the board?

Originally posted by madpoet
Deja, does the mount you made sit flush to the springs or is there a little room between the springs and the board?

Yes, there is plenty of Room between the Springs and the Plate.
The Plate is Hardwood, i wanted to make it as tight as possible.

Is the reason you made it such a large square to maximize the contact area with the frame?

Yes, i figured that the effect would be best if i catch as much frame as possible.
The Room is there, and i had the Couch apart already, so why not do it right the first time?
I don't want to do this again anytime soon. Taking the Couch apart and put it together neatly was somewhat time-consuming.
:)

I just put 6 pro shakers on my new couch. I am using the 250 watt plate amp from parts express. I honestly was expecting more shaking but it still adds a great effect to movies and games.
I only used 18 guage wire. Do you think if I would of went with 16 or 14 it would shake "harder"?

Thanks,
Mike

The heavier wire would be a little beter,but with that many shakers you shouldn't be able to sit down!!!!!! Iv'e only got 3 on my couch with a 50 watt per channel receiver and the shaking can be over the top if I let it!!!!!! How do you have them wired,really sounds like something is wrong..

brickie

brickie,
I have 3 wired in series and the other three wired in series than I run them paralell to the amp. Maybe I chose the wrong spots on the frame to mount the shakers. Seems to be my luck.

Mike

That sounds right..Are they all on 1 channel or 3 on each?Could be a mounting problem..You really need to hit ome wood and get them mounted securely..I have 3 on my couch and if I turn it up it would startle people..6 should easily be overwhelming if you want..

brickie

One thing I was wondering about was a crossover confusion. I have my LFE split to my sub and to my sub amp that I use for the bass shakers. I have no way to bypass the crossover on the sub amp. I have my crossover on my processor at 80 Hz. Could the two crossovers be causing problems?

Mike

:)

I just installed 8 Aura shakers into my HT room. Overkill but 6 are on the main sofa and 1 each on 2 of the HT seats.

My quick and simple review.
For < $200.00 this is the best and cheapest upgrade you can make to a HT.
Movies come to life with the shakers.

Shakers from PartsExpress, Cheap KLH amp from Best Buy.

Absolutely!!!

brickie

Ordered a pair of Aura Bass Shakers from www.partsexpress.com on Sunday. UPS delivered them yesterday. I installed them in our sectional today. I split the LFE output of our receiver, and fed the signal to an old Knight Kit Amplifier to drive the shakers. Tested them with Ice Age DVD this evening. I must say, they work very well!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sounds awesome!!Another satisfied customer.

brickie

i'm thinking of trying a few differrent fmod's to see which one i like best. is there anywhere to purchase just one of each frequency? they're pretty pricey to buy a few pairs and only end up using one in our situation

for you that have tried them. if any at all, which one have you decided to stick with?

Jimmy, I was using a 50 hz but have sense then decided not to use one for now..I like the effect without one a little more..Sorry, but I need to hold unto it just in case you were wondering if I want to sell it.Try ebay but iv'e always seen them sold as pairs.

brickie

Either in this thread or the Bass Shaker thread (in accessories?) someone found a online place or ebay that sold them individually. He picked up one each of 50 & 70 hz fmods to try out. Poke around a bit. It shouldn't be too many pages from the end of either thread.

Deja, how did you remove and reattach the black fabric? Did you pull the existing staples, or just gently rip it off them? And what kind of staples did you use to put it back on?

Thanks,
MP

madpoet, since the Couch was brand new, i wanted to be really careful not to mess it up.
I pulled the staples piece by piece with a little screwdriver and some pliers.

I already had a Staple gun from Homedepot ( $25.00 or so ) and simply stapled it back on.
The staples i used were about 14 mm long, i think.

Note also that i used Carriage-bolts to attach the Shakers, with locking nuts.
I do believe that Woodscrews or the like will shake loose over time.
;)

Here is the Shaker bolted down securely to the Hardwoood that will go into the Couch:

http://www.itprofessionals.tv/Shakers/DSCN6310.jpg

In my love seat, the original staples were tough! I used a small - medium sized flat screw driver (to sometimes pry them up) and needle nose pilers to pull them out. I haven't put the black fabric back yet. That may be a challenge. The frame is oak or some other hard wood. I'll first try my manual staple gun. Else I'll have to borrow or rent something heavier duty. You'll want to replace the staples with something similar in length and width to the original. If it's not the exact size, no biggie. Just FYI, this black fabric is call a dust cover. It's mainly appearance. You CAN leave it off. It MAY help keep the inside of the couch cleaner and fewer spiders.

I would tend to disagree about wood screws shaking loose.Drive them in good and I just can't see em coming loose.I would say carriage bolts are probably more secure.

brickie

Well maybe this will be my holiday project ;). I have my shakers waiting.

-MP

Cant wait to get my ht so I can Get bass shakers they look awesome!!

You don't have to wait until then to enjoy the benefits of them..Mine are hooked to my couch and love seat,and i'm loving every movie I watch with them.

brickie

I dont have anything yet.

Ohhh, that presents a slight problem..

brickie

lol I know

in my new apartment I've constructed a home theatre with a 96"x54" screen, Paradigm speakers all around and an X1 projector. my neighbor upstairs has been complaining about the bass so more often than not, my subwoofer has been left inoperative -- even has a lamp sitting on it now. anyway, about a month or two ago, I mentioned to my girlfriend that the bass shakers might be a good alternative to the sub. we never discussed it again, but lo and behold, she surprised me on christmas eve with two pairs of the 25w shakers. the next day I flipped both of our couches over and effortlessly installed the shakers. wanted to thank all the contributors in this thread that helped make the installation painless. one question...

I have an Onkyo TX-SR800 7.1 reciever. I am not currently using the additional two (DD-EX or DTS-ES) rear channels. instead, I have the LFE signal (that would normally run to my powered sub) split and going back into the receiver thru an AUX input. I then have that input signal routed to play thru the rear surround channels via the Onkyo's "Zone 2" feature. the shakers, then are wired to those speaker terminals in a series.

I can control the intensity of the shakers by adjusting the subwoofer level on the receiver by +/- 12db, and have the crossover set at 40hz. but what i've found is that each movie (tested with Matrix, Phantom Menace, Spider-Man 2) requires a different level to optimally incorporate the shakers into the experience. I prefer an easy listening level matched with a subtle rumble from the shakers, so they aren't being pushed very hard.

my question is simple. do you think this set-up is okay? more importantly, will it be okay if i add one more shaker to the series on each channel creating a 12ohm load? or am i going to kill my reciever?

cygnet74,

At some point you will find a shaker level that works for most movies and leave the setting there. At least that is what I did.

I do occasionally find a movie where it is still too much, so for those a second setting was found. Usually, the subwoofer needs to be turned down at the same point anyway, so adjusting the LFE output level is the way to do it.

As you said, it does not need to be teeth rattling to be effective.

Oh yes, adding a third shaker in series with two others resulting in a 12 ohm load instead of an 8 ohm load would result in an easier load for your amplifier, so go for it.

One other thing, you have a winner for a girlfriend. Congrats.

let us know how it works out for your neighbors. Hopefully, less complaints.

Joe L.

im looking at the diagram right now and i am wondering where the rca cables that get split go... into "VCR" in? on the back of my old amp. please help... i know im a nooooooobster

sorry let me be clear... i dont know where "in" l and r are... and so you know its a old pioneer receiver with prologic.

The inputs on back of amp should be clearly labeled and color coded as well.

brickie

but whats the label im looking for?

whats "in"... in what?

Assuming the use of an old Pro-Logic receiver, any analogue input (other than 'phono'...duhh!) ought to do the trick. VCR, CD, Tape, LD...whatever. Knock yourself out, and start shakin'...! Cheers.

DS.

great answer thank you... thats what i thought anyways ;) heh

THE GREASY GUY

elwopo!

I have just placed an order for the new Clark Silver-Plus transducer, a pair of FMOD 50 Hz lowpass filters (only come in pairs at Parts Express) and an audio Y-splitter.

Can one Clark shake a loveseat or are two necessary?

I'm wiring the one shaker to the other free amp in my stereo Samson pro amp (the other powers my SVS sub). It does 350 watts/channel @ 4 ohms. The only problem is that I can't control the shaker's volume individually with a remote, although there is an input control knob on the amp for each channel.

Did I do good?

Dan

You did good Dan. Experiment is the only way to know if one shaker is enough. I also ordered a new silver-plus model. Going to attach this one under the living room floor.

I was wondering how I would be able to hook up bass shakers to a futon and how many would be good for one futon.

I'm running 6 Auras wired in 3 in series - Using a Panasonic 100 watt amp. to drive shakers - the signal from the main amp. is going to 2 subs so its split a third time for shaker amp. - Going into CD in on the shaker amp.

I have to turn the shaker amp. up to 90% to get any kind of shake in the couch. Whats wrong? It should go gang busters at 50%?

The crossover is set to 80 on the main amp and the shaker amp is set to stereo with the speakers set to large which sends the whole spectrum.

The only other variable is I had to mount the shakers on a thin strip of wood under the couch which said strip is nailed into the frame. The couches are recliners so there is not many mounting options like using a separate piece of wood.

Can you eliminate the mounting issues by testing the shaker (i.e. should it jump around when running not mounted)?

Also can you expect to get shaking by sending a subwoofer test tone from the main amp to the shakers.

Any help would be appreciated its just not the experience I expected.

I would conduct a few test if possible..Your setup is similar to mine except that your receiver is MORE powerful than mine.And I can only turn mine up half at most.actually a little below half.

Can you eliminate the extra "y" split to see if maybe it's bad? Even plug in shaker amp straight to LFE out to see what happens.Play a demo scene like the pod race and see what happens.Try it sitting in couch or chair,and also reach under and grab shaker to see if you can feel it vibrating.This will tell you if it's a mounting problem.

brickie

How thin and rigid is the thin wood? If not rigid/solid enough, the vibes won't be coupled effectively.

I had similar problems because like you, I have a couch with recliners. I was driving 4 pro's with an Adcom 555II ~160watts per channel(2 shakers/channel). I was cranking it way up to the point of seeing overdrive warnings on the amp! Still, I could barely feel the shakers.

My shakers were screwed into the wooden part of the frame, but my guess is that the vibrations weren't coupled well enough through the rest of the chair to the seat. On my couch/recliners there doesn't seem to be much in the way of direct contact between the wooden framing and the metal reclining mech of the seat.

The challenge was to find a decent mounting place close as possible to the bottom of the seat, and still have clearance for the reclining mechanism.
I found that underneath were 2 metal railings running directly beneath the seat from the front of the sofa to the back. They were even nice enough to have small holes already so I didn' t have to drill. A 3/4" of plywood cut to measure, secured with drywall screws into these rails and I'm all set. No problem getting the shakes now.

My point is that for my situation, attaching to the wooden frame didn't work well. I found a way to attach a piece of plywood to the metal part of the seat frame. Thats my best result.

However, the seat is a bit less confy because when you sit down, you make contact with the plywood that is under the cusion. Not much you can do about it in my case, but I wouldn't have it any other way. Good Luck!

Thanks for your replys, I will try remounting and also test the y spliter.

i have 2 couches with shakers. one on A-left and the other A-right. when i swing the balance all the way left or right it still doesn't totally cut the effect from the other channel. basically i want to be able to turn one couch totally off if it is wanted by the viewers. to do this by remote would be that much better. could i run one couch off A and one off B? would i wire one wire off the LEFT-positive and the other RIGHT-negative? is this possible?

or could i leave them wired like they are and somehow flip a switch that allows the signal to go through the speaker cable or not? by remote?


my HT is still in the calibrating process. but so far i've found that everybody that has experienced the shakers has different opinions of how much to push them. some friends say crank 'em. some say turn them off. i want to be able to do both. one couch shakes and one doesn't

any ideas???

Run them in a A + B configuration..Didn't say how many shakers you have,and how many per couch..But in that config you could always simply use the remote to switch B or A off if necessary.Once again assume they are being ran off a receiver that allows this..

Just checked my Pioneer 814, and I can have any config of A or B that I need.Hope this helps.

I'd wire them so that I had an even amount on each channel.Let's say you had 3 per couch,and want control,and EVEN shaking power.I'd wire 3 to the left A channel, and then 3 to the left B channel.Turn balance all the way to left and in A + B they both shake.A, tan couch shakes,B only the brown couch shakes.Or turn them off completely for no effect..There are many ways you can do this.

brickie

brickie once again is the man

yes i have 3 on each couch. unfortunately i don't have remote power to run A/B control, but that's no big deal. i wasn't sure if running them off one channel only had any effect of receiver performance or not.

thanks so much

Not at all..Glad to help.

brickie

First time poster, long time lurker...

Just picked up 6 of these last week...and scored a (way too much) Radio Shack 250w PA amp for $80. Now I just need to secretly install them when the girlfriend isn't looking. We're doing the Extended Editions of the first two LOTR movies on Saturday for a group of friends and I'm dying to see their reaction. I just hope I can get this done by then on the sly.

Thanks to everyone for the info here.

Btw, I'm wiring them 3 in series and then one series per channel.

I have a couch in the backrow and a futon with a metal frame in the front. Not sure how I'm going to hook the shakers up to the futon but I'll figure something out.

Rotoman, good luck..I did mine secretly as well and let the wife and family experience them before telling the "secret".

If I wer you,i'd find a way to bolt some wood to the futon frame(underneath), and then mount the shakers to that.Hope it works out for you.

brickie

Originally posted by Rotoman
First time poster, long time lurker...

Just picked up 6 of these last week...and scored a (way too much) Radio Shack 250w PA amp for $80. Now I just need to secretly install them when the girlfriend isn't looking. We're doing the Extended Editions of the first two LOTR movies on Saturday for a group of friends and I'm dying to see their reaction. I just hope I can get this done by then on the sly.

Thanks to everyone for the info here.

Btw, I'm wiring them 3 in series and then one series per channel.

I have a couch in the backrow and a futon with a metal frame in the front. Not sure how I'm going to hook the shakers up to the futon but I'll figure something out.

Tell use how things work out:D :D

If I have an amp that will control the crossover (say I set it to 50 Hz) I wouldn't need to worry about fmodding it right? Cuz the amp is performing the crossover for me. Do I understand this correctly? I kinda thought you could control this with most amps. No?

Add me to the growing list of bass shaker owners. Just ordered from PE for $29.80/pair x 2. I read through this whole thread. Man, is it long!

You are correct.If your sub lfe is set at a 50 hz cross over then adding a 50 hz crossover in would be unnecessary.

brickie

Thanks brickie!

You're welcome..Let us know how they turn out!

brickie

Hey folks here is an article I found :
http://www.keohi.com/keohihdtv/accessories/aura/aura_guykuo_mod.html

I just ordered some of the 25w shakers, and i'd rather nto have to make a plywood frame to fit into the bottom of my couch. I should just be able to screw it straight into the frame assuming i find a big enough piece of wood in the frame right?

Correct..I would try to put one under each cushion or as close as possible to minimze the effect being overly exaggerated in one particular location..

brickie

O.K. I got my bass shakers today. Is the silver wire negative or positive? and gold wire negative or positive? or does it even matter?

Huskerfan,

It really doesn't matter.

If you mount two or more to the same chair, then you might want to watch polarity.

If on separate chairs, and you can tell that your neighbor's chair vibrated 180 degrees out of phase with yours, then you are probably sitting very very close and should watch polarity since it might as well be one chair with you sitting so close together.

Personally, if not marked otherwise, I would use the copper colored wire as positive and the silver colored wire as negative. but, as long as you are consistent... it really doesn't matter.

Joe L.

Thanks Joe. As long as I am consistant I didn't really think it mattered, but I wanted to ask someone who knows more about this stuff than I do. And that would be just about everyone on this forum. ;)

Can I use the output from the subwoofer (my subwoofer is an active subwoofer) instead of buying an amplifer?

Thanks
Ken

The common wisdom is to use a separate receiver/amp. Doesn't have to be anything fancy. Just a used, old one you might be able to pick up at a garage sale for $10.

ken-ha:
More than likely your "active" sub is only active in and of itself.

Meaning, it is a powered subwoofer, but more than likely any outputs on the sub are line-level outputs and/or (in this case, worse) they may have an internal cross-over which brings the output on those terminals to a crossed-over level to handle satellite speakers. Which you wouldn't want your shakers buzzing when someone talks, etc...

Thanks, guys for the help.
I forgot to mention that I pickup 4 shakers about a month ago from Partsexpress but I just don't have time to wire them up yet.

Regards
Ken

Another source for a cheap amplifier could be at your local Pawn shop. Not many yard sales this time of the year (at least in Michigan)!!!

ya, and he's even further north than you!

I just checked the Bargain Finder and there's a stereo amp. selling for $50.
I think that should work.

Ken

A couple buttkicker questions I know I have seen posted before but can't find. I have hooked up my 4 kickers with the QCP and Buttkicker Amp and I am getting that slight hum in the speakers now. When I unplug the B-kicker amp it goes away. I know I read of a filter or ground loop that corrects this problem so can someone point me to it please.
My other question is about the little tiny splitter that comes with the kit I have a real nice heavy duty subwoofer cable going to my sub but now I am having to run it through this very cheap looking splitter that allows you to connect the B-kicker amp and your SW to the AV-subout. Do I need to upgrade to a better splitter for this hook-up?

Thanks

Setup:

I have connected two of my ButtKicker LFE's to the ButtKicker Amp. The ButtKicker Amp is getting a split feed from my Pio 55TXi sub-out (Y cable). The other part of the Y cable is feeding an MK MX-100 powered subwoofer.

Now for the question:

In receiver auto-calibrate, I can hear/feel the sub and the LFEs in action. However, in normal use, both are quiet. What could be going on here?

BTW, I am using the canon scene from Master & Commander to check it out. Without the split, my sub works as expected.

Anybody using the Audiosource amp 100 (50w x 2 @8ohms) or the amp One/A (80wx2) for thier shakers. I plan to run 4 in a parallel/series(4 ohm load) config to one channel and 3 in series(12ohm load) to the other, will I have enough power to drive them ?

That would depend on what your driving them into. Seating? ...or Risers? ....or Sub Flooring?

And what type of Shakers? The Aura Pros or the 25 Watt'rs?

I'm new here, (On this particular AVS Forum at least) but I've used both Full Range and Tactile Transducers for all of the last 27 years. My involvement predates the Auras,RBH's, Clark's, and of course the BK'ers. Some of 'em could call me thier Granddaddy, once removed, 'cause their designs came directly from the Transducer product I represented then, and now.

More specifically to the question asked, my experience with the Amp100 & 1A products was that they were rather anemic, and decidedly peaky in that when the sub woofer output was set to a level to match the dynamics of the content, making avoiding instances of gross clipping and the resulting "Chatter" problematical at best, and downright unavoidable if you switched from Dolby to DTS content. This always requires a re-calibration of the sub woofer input.

Even when using the 25 watt "Tin Cup" Auras, when you do "Multiples" in a parallel, you must allow for a amplifier that can deliver at least double the rated wattage per device to get the type of performance that any Tactile transducer, even the lowly 25'ers can produce.

Using that formula, by paralleling two Auras to 2 ohms then series'ing them up to 4, you create a situation that isn't very ideal.

A. At 2 ohms per each side of the series, the power presented to the circuit, seen as 4 ohms to the AS100, will effectually average 25 to 40 watts, with 80 watts peaks out to clipping on occasion To be sure, you can at most, only use the happy medium of 1/2 the rated output of the AS100 as your figure. 50 watts between 4 devices that have a hair trigger point where too much power will rattle then terribly, and just a little too little and you get almost no effect.

And then you want to series three together? Worse idea.

The AS100 has outputs that share the single Power supply. The output Bias of each channel is tied to the other. Driving two widely disparate loads will cause the Power supply to be unstable when reacting to the variables being presented across the outputs. The only way the equipment can maintain a balance (....if that's even possible when intense LFE signals hit...) is to defer sending more power to the side with the higher impedance and service the lower impedance load. Ohms law. This can badly tax the output stages of a powerhouse amplifier, let alone AudioSource's little Guys.

lastly on that three gang'er series. You'd be driving power into that circuit commensurate to what is need to supply each device with enough power to do it's job. But since every device is in a series, the entire circuit is only a strong as the power handling of a single device 25 watts. Ouch.

Never, EVER series before you parallel. Paralleling increasing the circuits overal power handling by whole increments. 4 - 4 ohm Auras @ 25 watts PHC each = 100 watts total, and you can easily allow that those 4 underachievers, working together in close proximity, and each receiving an honest dose of 20 watts of "Clean" continuous material will do a more effective job of delivering LFE resonance (...I hate the tern "Shake") with far less chance of being over driven.

But a 1 Ohm load? That's OK if you then series it with another. You get 2 ohms.

8 Auras. Now thats a job a AMP 3 can handle...per channel.

250 watts into 8 = 32.25 That's at full output, and let's not go there.

But drop down to my previous fraction of 15 watts per x 8

That's 120 watts continuous power from a 250 watt per channel amp. Plenty of headroom left. Plenty of power in reserve. A whole lotta ....,

I ain't gonna say it.

All I want to put across is this, the Holy Mantra all those who aspire to make structure and contents tremble should chant in private.

"Don't ever send a Boy, to do a Man's job."

I regularly install 8 Tactiles per install, with 16 not uncommon, and 24 plaguing me every so often. Unbelievably, a lot of the folks on the receiving end of these LFE Supplemental Systems don't want to spend nearly as much money for the effect as the effect delivers for them. But even so, they must have it.

So I try to bring a tactile experience to just about every 'dedicated' Home Theater client I do, and have done so consistently. And yes, I even do them on a budget.

Numbers mean more even disbursement of energy into the structural solid. More even disbursement of more power creates a more natural sensation, on far more akin to a true "Sound Effect" than to that of your having a Troll underneath your floor, hitting it with a hammer. That's what I feel happens when the tactile energy is too focused in one location.



325bim,

No matter what else I've said, do yourself a favor and obtain another aura. Duplicate your Parallel / Series circuit and you can use the AS100 to do a fair job.

..........but I'd still like to know what your driving them into. If it is Furniture then your efficiency factor is greater than a Platform or a sub floor. That doesn't change what you should change, but it does mean the AS100 should handle the chore OK.


OK, hold the wire;
I just took a little time to review this thread and I do see that the vast majority of you all are doing the Chair / Couch / Futon thing, while I'm focused primarily on Floors and Platforms. This means more units and more power and higher demands.

In light of that, I can now see why some feel free to series units. It doesn't take near as much power to shake a couch as a floor, so chances are you'll not be driving your amps as hard, nor risking a series burn-out at those levels.

And to think, someone like me who gives advice freely, yet still tells newbees they should review a thread before posting comments, is stone cold guilty of not doing likewise.

Perhaps I should slink back over to my Hobby, DIY Screens, and sling MMud over thar.

Chalk it up to just being guilty of browsing the Forum, and seeing a topic that was "near & dear".

Good luck, and keep the Tsunamis down to a respectable level.

No worries MississippiMan, it was a good read anyway. Plus, I'll know where to look when I need expert advice on wiring a platform. Thanks for the effort!

Originally posted by 325bim
Anybody using the Audiosource amp 100 (50w x 2 @8ohms) or the amp One/A (80wx2) for thier shakers. I plan to run 4 in a parallel/series(4 ohm load) config to one channel and 3 in series(12ohm load) to the other, will I have enough power to drive them ?

If you plan to drive more than two shakers I would find a amp that can drive 4ohm loads. I have 8 wired for dual 4ohm channels driven by a old RS amp that outputs 100RMS at 4ohms.
http://mysite.verizon.net/res02dad/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/p1060244.jpg

Holy Tactile Transducers MississippiMan!
Here's some more details:
I have 2 Klipsch 8" 100 w subs already, room size is 12x20x9. Main platform and riser framed, no seats on concrete slab.
I plan to mount the shakers(Aura 25w) in coaster style seats one per seat. The back row has four seats, the front three. Audisource says the Amp 100 is rated at 60w into 4ohms, which in a parallel/series config gives me 4ohms, and 15w per shaker. now the front row would be 12 ohms for three in series, and I'm guessing I might only get 12-13w per shaker. mntmst, is that 100w a channel, and do you have all eight driven off one channel? Thanks for the feedback.

Originally posted by 325bim
Holy Tactile Transducers MississippiMan!
Here's some more details:
I have 2 Klipsch 8" 100 w subs already, room size is 12x20x9. Main platform and riser framed, no seats on concrete slab.
I plan to mount the shakers(Aura 25w) in coaster style seats one per seat. The back row has four seats, the front three. Audisource says the Amp 100 is rated at 60w into 4ohms, which in a parallel/series config gives me 4ohms, and 15w per shaker. now the front row would be 12 ohms for three in series, and I'm guessing I might only get 12-13w per shaker. mntmst, is that 100w a channel, and do you have all eight driven off one channel? Thanks for the feedback.

It's a stereo amp, 100w per channel. The power supply and output stage has been modified for heavy duty operation. (replaced diodes, filter-caps and added fan for cooling). Driving 4 shakers per channel.

i need some advice on where to put my bass shakers, i have posted a picture of the bottome of my couch, please advise on the best place, i'm going to attach 2 shakers. TIA

Spikemike: It's a little hard to tell from your pic. If the 2 center supports are recessed above the absolute bottom of the couch, just run a board (hard pine, MDF or plywood) from one side to the other. Screw and glue (or liquid nails) to the 2 center supports. Just use wooden blocks (1X1 or 1.5X1.5) as long your board is wide. Glue and screw those to the board and the side of the frame. If you're using 2 shakers, position them closer to the center supports. If you're using 3, put one under each seat. If you have space under the board, mount them facing down toward the floor. You do want some clearence between the shaker and floor. If not, mount them on top of the board facing the seat. If you do the latter, you might want to tape them to the board and do a test sit. Sitting with your bottom directly on top of the shaker might not be pleasant (either on or off). OH! If your center supports are even with the bottom and the legs don't give enough clearence for the board and shaker, use 3 separate boards and the block/screw/glue method to span the openings.

well i gave it a go with my own idea for mounting, but the idea was flawed :( oh well, will have to give it another shot tomorrow, at least undo what i've already done, especially since the shakers aren't even shaking, they are just making the couch slightly uncomfortable.

Originally posted by PAW
Spikemike: It's a little hard to tell from your pic. If the 2 center supports are recessed above the absolute bottom of the couch, just run a board (hard pine, MDF or plywood) from one side to the other. Screw and glue (or liquid nails) to the 2 center supports. Just use wooden blocks (1X1 or 1.5X1.5) as long your board is wide. Glue and screw those to the board and the side of the frame. If you're using 2 shakers, position them closer to the center supports. If you're using 3, put one under each seat. If you have space under the board, mount them facing down toward the floor. You do want some clearence between the shaker and floor. If not, mount them on top of the board facing the seat. If you do the latter, you might want to tape them to the board and do a test sit. Sitting with your bottom directly on top of the shaker might not be pleasant (either on or off). OH! If your center supports are even with the bottom and the legs don't give enough clearence for the board and shaker, use 3 separate boards and the block/screw/glue method to span the openings.

I'm not sure if i entirely follow, so what you are saying is make a board the side of the whole bottom of the couch, and by some means attach it to the couch, with some 1x1s for the board to sit on and to the center supports. When you say the shakers are facing down, you mean attach the shakers to the bottom of the board with the cork end pointing towards cushions. It is only a 2 seat couch, so i don't need 3.

spikeman,

I have a picture of how mine looks on my web site. This is what PAW is talking about. I did mine pretty much the same way.

http://members.cox.net/gipper3/hometheater4

...and how can you go wrong with 18 pros, 6 per platform, each Platform receiving 350 Watts RMS @ 2.66 Ohms

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v425/MississippiMan/Tactilesafootw-Jameswatching.jpg



Furniture MUST be of an appropriate construction, or basically, your going to have to build into a Chair or couch the equivelent of a Platform anyway.

I say, even a Platform made of 2' x 4's and topped with 3/4" B/C Grade Plywood will do a far beeter job than 95% of the seat-oriented applications.

That so many advocate "Seats" just goes to show how much everybody both wants, and accepts Tactile bass as a "Gotta have" kind thing.


Equal disbursment of energy, with no one area being overdriven, will give you realistic bass effects, not just a form of bass Enema.

...unless your into that sort of thing.

I'll see if I can put up some pics of mine up for you. Until then, let me see if I can describe it more step by step detail. I'm going to assume the 2 center supports are recessed above the absolute bottom of the couch.

Measure from one wooden side of you couch to the other. Inside, underneath the couch.

Cut a board to fix. I think I needed a 6" wide board. 1" thick should be enough. With the understanding a finished, smooth board is only 3/4" thick.

Cut two 1"x1"x6" pieces of wood. They can be 1.5"x1.5"x6". The size isn't too important.

Place the 1"x6" board across center braces and touching the wooden sides of the couch.

Take 2" wood screws or drywall screws and attach the board to the center braces. You should drill pilot holes. You might want to counter sink the screws for looks. You can also add wood glue or liquid nails here.

Take your 1"x1"x6" pieces of wood. They can also be called cleats. Place them touching the wooden side of the couch and the board. You should drill pilot holes. You might want to counter sink the screws for looks. Screw through the cleat into the board. Then at 90 degrees, parallel to the board, screw through through the cleat and wooden side of the couch. You can toss in some glue or liquid nails at these joints.

Now I'm going to assume there is clearance UNDERneath the board for the shaker. So, it does not touch the floor.

Place the shaker so it's cork bottom will be facing up when the couch is in it's normal position.

Drill pilot holes and attach the shaker with 1" wood screws.

If there is not clearance underneath the board so the shaker doesn't touch the board, you need to measure and install shakers before you screw the board to the center braces and wooden sides of the couch. This is what I had to do. The cork bottom of the shaker will face down toward the floor when the couch is in it's normal position.

Wire 'em up and fire 'em up.

OH! You can replace the thin black fabric if you like.

MississippiMan, Are you employed by a theater company or what?!!! Man that is some set up!

thanks, that sounds pretty doable. As long as i can maneuver the screwdriver/drill into the right position.