We've got an Adelphia tech coming out this evening to check out our 3250. What kind of things should I make sure he checks. When I called to schedule the appt, the people in the office had no clue what firmware was or that their boxes could be upgraded/updated. I guess it's not too surprising.

If there's anything specific that he should be checking, I'd appreciate the info.

Thanks,

J.

Well, don't get too concerned about what CSRs know, many don't know squat and that isn't about to change anytime soon. If it is the firmware, there isn't much the tech will be able to do until it gets upgraded.

To check the firmware, Press and Hold the middle button in the cluster (with Ch +/- and Vol +/-) on the 3250 until the Email LED lights. Then press the Info button and use the Vol +/- buttons to scroll through the displays. One of the displays will show Software Status (or something like that). Look for something that says SARA 1.52.6.1 (that is the latest AFAIK). If you have 1.52.4.1, that is the version with audio problems. If oyu do have 1.52.6.1, then there may be something wrong with your box and it may need to be replaced.

Dave-

Thanks for the reply. Hopefully it is something wrong with the box and not an upgrade issue, that way it's as simple as replacing the box instead of waiting for Adelphia to upgrade their firmware. Who knows how long that could take.

I'll report what I find out.

J.

OK- So I checked which version I have...should I be alarmed that it's 1.52.3.1?

J.

Well, you can be alarmed, but there is absolutely nothing you can do about it. I don't recall any major audio problems with that version, certainly not like 1.52.4.1, but I just might not have been concerned about them at the time. There have been so many problems that some get lost in the shuffle. That was the first version I had when I got my 3270 back in Aug/Sep and it's now been upgraded twice (1.52.4.1 and 1.52.6.1).

If the tech offers to switch out the box for another one, it won't hurt, but it will (should) still have the same software. That's one of the first thing the unit does when the power is first turned on. It also re-downloads the software (reboots) when you unplug it for a while and plug it back in.

If the tech doesn't know what you are talking about, you can show him the Software Status screen and point out that there is a version 1.52.6.1 that appears to eliminate the audio problems (dropouts, cutouts, tinny sound). He/she can then get with whomever to get the latest software loaded and distributed to subscribers. Mine was udgraded 3-5 days ago and has been flawless (as far as audio) since. It could be that your cableco heard about the problems with 1.52.4.1 and are simply waiting for further word on 1.52.6.1 and will upload it soon. AFAIK S-A sends the latest software to everyone and the cableco's go from there. Some hold it and wait for everyone else. Others load it and help get problems fixed.

Of course, your particular problems may be totally unrelated to software. However, it's better to know a little about the software, etc., and get better service from the tech rather than getting a simple shrug of the shoulders, right? :)

I suppose I should be really unhappy since my cable co (Cox-OK) still
has us on version 1.50.18.17

Do you think there is anyway we will get an update by April 1st
for firewire and DVI to function.

Originally posted by Bobarino
I suppose I should be really unhappy since my cable co (Cox-OK) still
has us on version 1.50.18.17

Do you think there is anyway we will get an update by April 1st
for firewire and DVI to function. Bobarino - The DVI is functional with the new firmware. Adelphia has upgraded our FW twice now in Florida since the beginning of the year. I have DVI functioning well with a Sony GWIII set. You really need to press Cox and get the new FW downloaded to your box.

My Panasonic CT-34WX53 is connected to the 3250HD via DVI. Since the Panny only displays HD at 480p or 1080i, what happens when the cable co adds HD content from ABC, ESPN and Fox, all of which use 720p for HD? Will the STB up-convert to 1080i, down-convert to 480p, or am I S.O.L.?

I'm not exactly sure what happens with DVI, but I'll assume your Panny will accept 720p and convert it to 1080i if the 3250 doesn't. So, one of two things will happen; either the 3250 will convert it to 1080i or the Panny will. Either way you should have no problems.

Thanks, Dave. I took a closer look at the 3250 set-up guide and it says the STB will send DVI in a format supported by the TV. So it sounds like it will up-convert.

I think that is what it is supposed to do, but since I don't have DVI yet to see, I didn't want to say specifically that the STB would do the upconvert. Like I said though, either way you should be okay. I'd be interested to see how much of a difference you see as I'm sure DVI (and Firewire) will be working here soon, probably by the time I get back from vacation, and then I'll be looking for a DVI cable.

Cox just called me today to let me know the firewire would be turned on by April 1. He also said the DVI MUST be turned on by mid next year! Talk about customer service!! I inquired about this a month ago and the tech told me he would call me when he heard something! Nice job Cox!!

DoubleDAZ: Time Warner Maine activated DVI about a week ago, after a false start in late February. The improvement over component video is incredible. PQ on all channels -- analog, digital and HD -- is much improved. The update also remedied that annoying dark image problem that many of us have experienced on digital movie channels like HBO and Showtime. I'm a happy camper.

Originally posted by mainemojo
DoubleDAZ: Time Warner Maine activated DVI about a week ago, after a false start in late February. The improvement over component video is incredible. PQ on all channels -- analog, digital and HD -- is much improved. The update also remedied that annoying dark image problem that many of us have experienced on digital movie channels like HBO and Showtime. I'm a happy camper. Can you specify your equipment, cable box (3250HD?) and TV? Thanks.

Originally posted by mainemojo
My Panasonic CT-34WX53 is connected to the 3250HD via DVI. Since the Panny only displays HD at 480p or 1080i, what happens when the cable co adds HD content from ABC, ESPN and Fox, all of which use 720p for HD? Will the STB up-convert to 1080i, down-convert to 480p, or am I S.O.L.?

Just make sure you do the proper setup to allow only the formats your TV supports. The STB will convert non-supported formats even through DVI. My Panny LCD RP does not officially support 480i via DVI. It actually works but PQ is pretty bad. I disabled 480i from STB and now all SD channels are displayed as 480p via DVI.

DoubleDAZ: SA 3250HD, Panasonic CT-34WX53 connected via Monster DVI400 2-meter cable. Besides the overall improvement in PQ, the only drawback is increased overscan along the bottom of the Panny screen, but that's noticeable only on channels with newsticker scrolls, etc.

Just make sure you do the proper setup to allow only the formats your TV supports. The STB will convert non-supported formats even through DVI. My Panny LCD RP does not officially support 480i via DVI. It actually works but PQ is pretty bad. I disabled 480i from STB and now all SD channels are displayed as 480p via DVI.

Foxbat121: Thanks. That's the info I was hoping to get -- I've got all formats except 720p enabled in the STB setup. The Panasonic HDTV supports 480i, 480p and 1080i via DVI, which is especially nice, since 480i allows use of the set's "JUST" aspect; 480p only offers "4:3", "Zoom" and "Stretch".

Originally posted by captainsin
Cox just called me today to let me know the firewire would be turned on by April 1. He also said the DVI MUST be turned on by mid next year! Talk about customer service!! I inquired about this a month ago and the tech told me he would call me when he heard something! Nice job Cox!!

What software version are you running on your box ? I can't seem to get the DVI to work properly with the SA3250HD ? Mine is on version 1.52.3.0.1.

thanks
mp

I am about to go to Cox of Fairfax, VA and pick up the 3250, should it have the newest firmware installed on it? I need the DVI

Well, after getting the "B" board replaced in my Sony KV40XBR800 TV, I tried using the DVI port again, which works fine, but with the following issue:

Analog channels viewed through the DVI in 480p mode are terrible looking. This must have something to do with the conversion of the analog video into digital format. The black levels are mostly grey, and overall PQ is just terrible.

For this reason, and the fact that there is not much difference between 1080i on DVI or 1080i on component, I've switched back to using component video on my STB.

FYI, I'm using the SA3250 running firmware 1.52.3.1 on Charter Communications.

My opinion is that DVI isn't really ready for release on this box (still in beta), and that's why Charter's own documentation that comes with the STB says that the DVI port is not enabled, and for future use only. It would be nice, however, if all of these outdated cable companies would stop broadcasting half of their channels in analog and switch to an all digital lineup. The PQ benefits alone would be incredible. I always get a kick out of those cable ads (Comcast is famous for them) that try to tell you satellite is worse quality than digital cable... What a load of bs. I got much better PQ on D* just because all what would be your analog cable lineup is simply re-broadcast directly in digital, rather than converting the digital feed from the content providers into analog, then stuffing it down the line. All those digital to analog to digital and back to analog conversions make your PQ really suffer.

Originally posted by REL77
I am about to go to Cox of Fairfax, VA and pick up the 3250, should it have the newest firmware installed on it? I need the DVI

The latest firmware will be automatically downloaded into your box once you connect it to the cable line. Make sure you ask for 3250HD not 3250 which is a SD box.

Originally posted by Foxbat121
The latest firmware will be automatically downloaded into your box once you connect it to the cable line. Make sure you ask for 3250HD not 3250 which is a SD box.

Went and got the 3250HD today, but am not moving to new place till next sunday, so I just have it sitting in my basement now... Its so sad.... But only another week and a day till HD goodness

Adelphia just pushed version 1.52.6.1 in my area. Is the DVI enabled with this version?

Does the 3250HD use 6 pin or 4 pin connectors for its firewire (1394) port?

AUDIO DROPS:

On the 3250 there is an option for wide, narrow and normal audio. I had mine I believe on narrow, had the drops then changed to wide or normal(will check later) and the drops stopped. Solution not guarenteed but something to try.

Originally posted by uzun
Does the 3250HD use 6 pin or 4 pin connectors for its firewire (1394) port?

6-pin, the large connector with the "V" shaped side.

Just got my 3250HD box yesterday, after a repair tech happened to mention that they just got the DVI boxes in. Previously had the 3100HD.

Not surprised to find that the DVI-HDCP message comes on the screen when trying to using the DVI connection. I know my display is HDCP compliant, and when I called tech support, they actually knew what DVI was, but never heard of HDCP. Will have to call a real tech on Monday AM.

The box also had both optical and digital audio out. When using either of these audio outputs, there is a "snap" in the audio between channel changes. Also, the audio on the analog stations is at a considerably lower level than on the digital stations. The box also has 2 firewire connections.

I may be the first in my cable company to have received the box, so they probably have little, if any, customer feedback at this point.

I just have 1 question. Using DVI and 720, does it allow you to up-convert and stretch 4X3 480i programming to fill a 16x9 screen or is it all side bar?

Originally posted by Snoopy4
I just have 1 question. Using DVI and 720, does it allow you to up-convert and stretch 4X3 480i programming to fill a 16x9 screen or is it all side bar?
My Panasonic CT-34WX53 widescreen only does 480i, 480p and 1080i, and the 3250HD automatically formats all of them to 16:9 widescreen without sidebars via DVI. I don't think there's any reason it would be different at 720p.

Awesome. Thanks! Now lets hope the SA 8000HD does too.

Originally posted by mainemojo
DoubleDAZ: SA 3250HD, Panasonic CT-34WX53 connected via Monster DVI400 2-meter cable. Besides the overall improvement in PQ, the only drawback is increased overscan along the bottom of the Panny screen, but that's noticeable only on channels with newsticker scrolls, etc. Thanks, I'm trying to get a feel for whether or not I should get a DVI cable for my Hitachi 65TWX20B and SA3270HD. Probably will at the end of April when I get back from vacation.

Originally posted by Foxbat121
The latest firmware will be automatically downloaded into your box once you connect it to the cable line. Make sure you ask for 3250HD not 3250 which is a SD box. This is true, but not all cableco's are up to version 1.52.6.1 yet, so don't assume that is what you will get when you power up.

As I'm sure you all know, the 3250 converts the analog channels to a digital pcm stream. Well, has anyone else noticed that when this is done, the audio is VERY bright and harsh? There's a huge emphasis on dialog it seems and it's far too overexaggerated in my opinion.

When I am on a digital channel with DD, I don't notice it as much. Although I have to say for DD (with DVD's as well) I have always noticed that some are too overly bright, but I assume this is just due to the way they are mixed because brighter can sound better at first. Most are fine.

But the issue I mention above with the analog channels isvery bad. I can barely listen to it without getting annoyed. Am I the only one?

Originally posted by texaspledge
As I'm sure you all know, the 3250 converts the analog channels to a digital pcm stream. Well, has anyone else noticed that when this is done, the audio is VERY bright and harsh?

I've particularly noticed about a 15 db difference in the audio levels between analog & digital, with the digital being the louder level. If I'm watching something on an analog channel, when I jump to digital it's way too loud. That's all I have really noticed between the two, aside from there being an annoying "snap" at each change of channel.

Originally posted by Ron Tobin
I've particularly noticed about a 15 db difference in the audio levels between analog & digital, with the digital being the louder level. If I'm watching something on an analog channel, when I jump to digital it's way too loud. That's all I have really noticed between the two, aside from there being an annoying "snap" at each change of channel.

This is probably due to cheap analog to digital converters inside the 3250. In order to convert the audio from analog cable channels into PCM there are onboard analog to digital converters. I believe this box also has some built-in compression circuitry which tries to "normalize" the volume levels. Also, most cable plant operators are already compressing the crap out of analog channel audio anyway, and compressing it again at the 3250 is going to make everything sound like a really loud FM radio advertisement.

I really wish all of the cable operators and content providers would stop compressing their channels so much. It really sucks when I'm watching a movie in DD5.1 and my volume is set at 25 on my amp, then I jump down to an analog channel after the movie is over and all of a sudden I wake up the neighbors with some loud commercial and I have to turn my amp down to like 12 or so to have an equal volume level. Most cable customers are still on analog televisions, so this isn't as much of an issue, but I suspect that as more and more people get surround sound setups this issue will become more common and the cable operators might actually start to fix it.

The audio settings are completely controllable by the end user - you.
If there is a volume difference between the analog and digital audio of an analog channel, then you probably have the (analog) volume turned down on the box it'self. Try listening to an analog channel in analog mode, and depress the VOL+ buton on the front of the box until the bar graph is at 100%. Once done, compare that to the Digital output volume level. Depending on the dynamic range settings, they should be the same.
First half done.
The second half of the equation has to do with the dynamic range of both the box AND your Digital reciever. If both are set to High, then the louder signals will be OVERLY emphasized and very loud for almost all digital signals.
Brief description of Dynamic Range: Assume total signal level range is from 1 to 100 db for these examples:
Low: Range from low to high has a low ratio. Example: sounds from 1-40 db are all normalized to a semi flat 45db, while 60-100 db is normalized to a semiflat 55db. Most audio will fall within the middle 10db range. Laymans terms - Whispers are easily heard with dialog and explosions are not much louder than a yell.
Normal:Same as above, but expand the db range in the center from 10db to about 40db. Laymans terms - Whispers are now a lot softer, and explosions are a bit louder. Set volume level as best for normal dialog.
High:No compression on dynamic range. A whisper, even with an amp at half volume, will be very, very faint, almos inaudible by most standards. An explosinon will be extremely loud, to the point where it could be easily over driven.
This dynamic range setting is found on the box for digital output and on almost all digital recievers input. Try setting each to Normal and then adjust from there. Remember that if you set a low dynamic range for the box, there will not be much for the reciever to work with.

vegggas

I'm not @ my box now, but I thought it was narrow,normal & wide. Is that the same as low,normal & high?

Originally posted by 1SalesPro
I'm not @ my box now, but I thought it was narrow,normal & wide. Is that the same as low,normal & high? My 3270HD is Narrow, Normal, and Wide too. I believe I used to have it set to Wide on the DCT2000 before I got my 3270HD. I changed it to Narrow, I believe because of what vegggas was explaining in another thread sometime back, though I didn't know the exact reasoning at the time. The only difference I notice going from channel to channel, analog to digital, etc., is when 5.1 kicks in. :)

I should add that I have the 3270 volume maxed out and set to Fixed. I control volume with my HDTV remote or Denon 3803.

TWC in San Diego is currently planning on starting distribution of the 3250 in July so I've started reading up on it. The first post in this forum mentioned that DVI output disables analog component output. I would like to route the DVI out, via a DVDO iSCAN HD, to my projector and the analog output to my RPTV. Would switching between them be something I could do from the remote? Is swapping cables required?

There is no possible ways to switch between DVI out and Component out. Whenever a DVI cable is plugged in, component is disabled.

Originally posted by vegggas
The audio settings are completely controllable by the end user - you.
If there is a volume difference between the analog and digital audio of an analog channel, then you probably have the (analog) volume turned down on the box it'self.

Thanks Veggas. That did it. It was simply that the volume level was not at 100%. Once I increased it, the analog and digital levels are the same.

Now, if I can only get my cable company to send the appropriate software download to get my DVI to work, I'd be all set. Apparently I'm the first customer (and perhaps the only one so far) of Comcast Cable of Sarasota with the 3250HD box, and they're still trying to figure it out.

Originally posted by DoubleDAZ
My 3270HD is Narrow, Normal, and Wide too. I believe I used to have it set to Wide on the DCT2000 before I got my 3270HD. I changed it to Narrow, I believe because of what vegggas was explaining in another thread sometime back, though I didn't know the exact reasoning at the time. The only difference I notice going from channel to channel, analog to digital, etc., is when 5.1 kicks in. :)

I should add that I have the 3270 volume maxed out and set to Fixed. I control volume with my HDTV remote or Denon 3803.

I was posting from memory, so excuse the inconsistency in wording...
At FIXED volume, the analog output is at around 80% max. The digital is always at 100% max and is never variable, aside from the dynamic range adjustment(s). Dave should not see much, if any, change in volume levels from analog to digital with those settings. I can only assume that the receiver is also set to normal range too.

vegggas

Originally posted by Ron Tobin
Thanks Veggas. That did it. It was simply that the volume level was not at 100%. Once I increased it, the analog and digital levels are the same.

Now, if I can only get my cable company to send the appropriate software download to get my DVI to work, I'd be all set. Apparently I'm the first customer (and perhaps the only one so far) of Comcast Cable of Sarasota with the 3250HD box, and they're still trying to figure it out.

AFAIK, SA has not really released a TRUE version of software for DVI functionality yet. The versions that work have all been where the flag was not turned off by default. Their major focus has been on 1394 port activation with HDCP for the April Deadline. DVI is not required for many more months.
Ahh.. Sarasota... Many days spent sitting on the quiet beaches, visiting Mote's Marine laboratory, or gelling to the sounds of Pink Floyd in the planetarium at night... sigh...

vegggas

Originally posted by vegggas
AFAIK, SA has not really released a TRUE version of software for DVI functionality yet. The versions that work have all been where the flag was not turned off by default. Their major focus has been on 1394 port activation with HDCP for the April Deadline. DVI is not required for many more months.
Ahh.. Sarasota... Many days spent sitting on the quiet beaches, visiting Mote's Marine laboratory, or gelling to the sounds of Pink Floyd in the planetarium at night... sigh...

vegggas

So when the Comcast tech was so excited about now having DVI boxes, and encouraging me to get the 3250HD, he was clueless about whether or not it really works in DVI mode? Apparently, because I spoke to their "super tech" this past Monday about the DVI Alert message, and he has yet to get "right back" to me as promised, because he probably doesn't have a clue what to do about it yet. He's had me insert the DVI cable, reboot the receiver, a countless number of times, but is still scratching his head. Right now, I'm satisfied with the results out the component outputs.

Veggas - as for the 1394 port, what's supposed to happen? I have 2 of them, but my JVC 30K does not recognize the 3250HD when I plug it in. Is that another software download?

Sarasota -- great places you mentioned, except the Bishop Planetarium is temporarily closed, due to funding. But it will reopen again. Beaches -- you've got Lake Mead!!! I'm very familiar with Vegas as my brother has lived there for over 20 years, and my Mother and Grandmother, when they were alive, also lived there. Know the city well, and have witnessed the changes over the past 20+ years.

Previous versions of software had enabled the DVI port, but SA has not been actively working on software issues, especially HDCP content flag support. True DVI functionality will come soon, but current versions are still very buggy.
1394 - As of Today, April 1, 2004 All Cable MSO's are supposed to be able to offer at least ONE HD device that has a functional 1394 port to their customers. This is dependent on SA providing the software that enables those ports, but a lot should within the next 24 hours. MSO's should download a new software version for those ports either last night or today if the software is available (I'm not at home to check my current status).


Spent 20+ years in Tampa/St. Pete, but preferred the beaches in Sarasota (or anything South of Egmont Key), Ringling Museum and other areas down there. Lake mead is not the same, especially now with water levels down about 75 feet. sigh...

vegggas

Originally posted by vegggas
1394 - As of Today, April 1, 2004 All Cable MSO's are supposed to be able to offer at least ONE HD device that has a functional 1394 port to their customers. This is dependent on SA providing the software that enables those ports, but a lot should within the next 24 hours. MSO's should download a new software version for those ports either last night or today if the software is available (I'm not at home to check my current status).

My box is a SA3250 with the 1394 port blocked by a metal plate (from Charter). I just called them to request "new equipment" and they setup an apointment for Monday, April 5th, from 10:00 to 2:00. I would imagine they will give me a different type of SA3250 with at least one more port on it. Anyway, I will let everyone know when I get the new box and what the differences are.

When I spoke with the CSR, they seemed very knowledgeable and had just received an email or some other memo explaining the procedure to them, and didn't give me a hassle at all. I was kind of expecting to have to speak with a higher level tech or to get some kind of "we've never heard of it" statement, but I was pleasantly surprised.

Originally posted by DoubleDAZ
Thanks, I'm trying to get a feel for whether or not I should get a DVI cable for my Hitachi 65TWX20B and SA3270HD. Probably will at the end of April when I get back from vacation.

Right now I would say don't bother. I actually get worse PQ from the DVI port on all of the SD channels, especially the analog channels. I think the PQ is actually slightly worse on the HD channels as well, but it's much harder to A/B because connecting the DVI always disables the component outputs, so I can't just plug it in to two separate inputs on my TV and do a comparison.

IMO, the DVI is very buggy and still in beta, and the reason is not just HDCP and other issue related. The PQ seems to suffer as well.

Cox here in No. VA has upgraded my box's firmware to 1.52.6.1 from 1.52.4.1. Don't see anything actually improved. Maybe the firewire port is enabled now?

We've had that for a while now, it fixed a lot of audio problems that were in 1.52.4.1. It may have the Firewire software in it, but I doubt it. Cox here is saying they will be updating the software over the next few days, time will tell. Other places seem to be requiring a service call to activate the Firewire, but I don't know if this includes a software upgrade or not. I would think it would, otherwise why wait until now to activate the Firewire if it still the same software?

Does anyone have a working firewire port on the 3250? I don't think I have seen a post with it yet, only people saying soon.

Or most people, like me, just have no clue how to verify if it works or not. When I get the time, I will try to connect the firewire port to my laptop to see if it is enabled. If it works, I still need to find a PVR software that works with it.

Interesting read on the cox website:
http://www.cox.com/support/digitalcable/hdtv/pdf/DVI_HDCP.pdf

Dunno why cox would put this in the customer support area ... it describes a method for enabling / disabling DVI / hdcp at the headend for a particular 3250. This is independant of the firmware version.

If Firewire works the same way, you may need to individually call your cable company to get them to enable Firewire ...

Anyway ... an interesting read.

TW is installing one for me on Tuesday. I have been told it works. We'll see.

Willie
Cheesehead

Since noone has posted it yet, I guess noone has an enabled firewire port on the SA3250.

Has anybody successfully connected the 3250HD to the Panasonic plasma via DVI. By successful I mean it works without having to manually adjust anything ?

mp

This was posted in the "April 1st HD Cable Firewire STB Deadline Has Arrived! Do You Have One?" thread My post is below.

Originally posted by HiDefSooner
I traded some emails with a Cox engineer in OKC that I know...

If someone wants the 1394 port activated they will need to schedule a swap of your SA 3250 with the 1394 activated.



As soon as I saw your post, I called Comcast. They sheduled a tech to come out Friday, 4/9 to enable it. They have to install some software in the cablebox. They will bring a replacement box instead of installing it at my home or having me bring in the box. I've got my fingers crossed on this one. The comcast CSR said it should work.

akai,

Do you have the latest firmware version?

Maybe you should request a box with firewire enabled and see if DVI would work without problems on that one.

DVI ALERT
When I connected my DVI cable to my Toshiba 46HX83 DVI/HDCP input I got a screen saying:

"DVI Alert, Your HDTV does not suport HDCP. Please use YPrPb component connection to watch TV"

I checked my TV owners manual and it shows the DVI connection is HDCP compliant.

Wuzzup with that???

..........Lonnie

Software Versions

PTV OS: OS High Definition Edition 1.0
Flash: 1.52.3.1
Apps: Sara V 1.52.3.1

Originally posted by londawg
DVI ALERT
When I connected my DVI cable to my Toshiba 46HX83 DVI/HDCP input I got a screen saying:

"DVI Alert, Your HDTV does not suport HDCP. Please use YPrPb component connection to watch TV"

I checked my TV owners manual and it shows the DVI connection is HDCP compliant.

This is a known problem. Same situation here and I know that my display is also HDCP compliant. I suspect that there's a software download that your cable company needs to send. My cable company (Comcast of Sarasota) is aware of the problem, is trying to find a solution, and I'm sure they will.

Just be sure your cable company is aware of the problem and let them work on resolving it.

Ron,
Just got a reply from another thread, All I needed to do is reboot the box and have the DVI cable plugged in, the HDCP message didn't appear!
Now, if they could just do something about the non HD PQ, it sucks, and personally I think the DVI PQ isn't anything to rave about either. But I know from earlier post that this is inherit to this model. Does Pioneer or Motorola have these problems as well? I hope the 8000HD will have a better picture. Maybe it's just me, but my expectation are higher now after watching HD programs.

...Lonnie

Originally posted by londawg
Ron,
Just got a reply from another thread, All I needed to do is reboot the box and have the DVI cable plugged in, the HDCP message didn't appear!
Now, if they could just do something about the non HD PQ, it sucks, and personally I think the DVI PQ isn't anything to rave about either. But I know from earlier post that this is inherit to this model. Does Pioneer or Motorola have these problems as well? I hope the 8000HD will have a better picture. Maybe it's just me, but my expectation are higher now after watching HD programs.

...Lonnie

I've tried the reboot procedure and it doesn't work for me. Once it reboots, I'll get a picture on the channel that comes up, but as soon as I change channels, the DVI alert appears again. The only way to recover is to unplug the DVI cable.

My cable company (Comcast of Sarasota) is diligently working on this as well as trying to get the 1394 to be operable. I may be the first and perhaps only one of a handful of customers they have with the new 3250HD box. They primarily offer the SA3100 box. I'm patiently waiting as I know they will be able to resolve it.

Ron,

Don't bet on an early fix. DVI is currently a hit or miss thing and many cablecos using S-A equipment have simply deactivated it until the software is fixed. S-A is currently working on 1394-Firewire (not to mention 8000HD probelms) because that was supposed to be done by April 1 (who picked that date anyway?). AFAIK, DVI is not mandated until sometime next year, so there is no telling when it will actually work.

Just received my 3250hd today via comcast in ocean county new jersey after fighting with them for a month telling me they dont offer the box and only offer the 3100hd (long story). Anyways the firmware is 1.52.6.1 and the dvi works perfectly. Plugged it into the box and my sony kp51ws500 and worked fine no messages on the screen or no need to reboot. Sd channels definately look worse through the dvi. Hd is really hard to tell but it seems ever so slightly improved. Now if they can get the firewire ports active on this thing we'll be all set until the 8000hd dvr comes around in a few months.

mike

Oh, if it were that simple for everyone. :)

Originally posted by illumin8
My box is a SA3250 with the 1394 port blocked by a metal plate (from Charter). I just called them to request "new equipment" and they setup an apointment for Monday, April 5th, from 10:00 to 2:00. I would imagine they will give me a different type of SA3250 with at least one more port on it. Anyway, I will let everyone know when I get the new box and what the differences are.

Well, I learned another valuable lesson today:

Never overestimate the intelligence of the average cable technician.

When the guy showed up to swap my box, I asked him to look at the back of the new 3250 to see the port configuration. It was exactly the same as my current one, no Firewire port. You would think that when the work order said "Please swap customer's current HD box to the IEEE-1394 HD box per customer's request", that he might have checked to make sure he actually had the right box before leaving for my house.

Anyway, they had to reschedule and set it up for Friday, 4/9. Does anyone on Charter have Firewire working now? I have a feeling that it isn't ready yet and this is just a stalling tactic to keep customers from filing complaints with the FCC. Just pretend like you're going to do the install and show up with the wrong box. Make it look like installer error and the customers won't care enough to complain to the FCC. Should I take my tinfoil hat off now? ;)

illumin:
I have Charter in So Cal. I have a 3250HD with 1394 ports, as far as I know they are still not working. I have been working the local "Head End Manager" out of Monterey Park, CA. I have sent him the FCC doc's and he is supposed to be getting the software updates from SA. Suggest you press Charter and demand to talk to the Head End Manager. I had three techs and manager visit my home and none understood 1394 or DVI.

Where can I find a copy of the FCC regs/timelines?

Originally posted by 1SalesPro
Where can I find a copy of the FCC regs/timelines? Lots of places ... but the DVI / Firewire / CableCard stuff can be found at:
http://www.fcc.gov/headlines2003.html

Under the 'FCC Eases Digital TV Transition for Consumers' section.

Specifically:
http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-03-225A1.pdf

Originally posted by John P
illumin:
I have Charter in So Cal. I have a 3250HD with 1394 ports, as far as I know they are still not working. I have been working the local "Head End Manager" out of Monterey Park, CA. I have sent him the FCC doc's and he is supposed to be getting the software updates from SA. Suggest you press Charter and demand to talk to the Head End Manager. I had three techs and manager visit my home and none understood 1394 or DVI.

Thanks for the advice. I just had another tech come by today with another 3250HD box that still didn't have the 1394 interface. It seems like nobody knows what they're doing. I spoke with someone at the warehouse and they said "we have a few boxes with Firewire on them but they don't work currently. We're waiting for new boxes to arrive and they should be here in a month or so." I said fine, maybe I should go ahead and file a complaint with the FCC. They agreed to come out again tomorrow and put in one of the 3250HD boxes with 1394 on it, but weren't sure if it would work or not. The lady seemed to think that it works with some TVs, but not with others.

I'm kind of hoping that the new boxes they have ordered are Motorola 6200s because they seem to have a lot more functionality built in. I'll keep everyone posted on this.

It's about time these cable companies quit dragging their ass and comply with the FCC regulation. If I don't get a box with functional 1394 tomorrow I'm going to try and file a complaint with the FCC.

Originally posted by illumin8
I'm kind of hoping that the new boxes they have ordered are Motorola 6200s because they seem to have a lot more functionality built in. I'll keep everyone posted on this.

If your local cable co. is offering SA boxes right now, it is very unlikely you will get a Motorola boxes anytime soon because the headend equipments are not compatible with different boxes (SA vs Mot).

TV - Sony 40XBR700
Box - 3250HD
Sara V 1.52.3.1
Cable System - Comcast Clinton, CT


Any one else have lip synch problems with the 3250HD?

I do not use the digital out. Just plain red/white audio cables to my XBR.

Constantly having lip synch problems on Comcast NBCHD ABCHD HBOHD

Synch problems come and go. NBC was horrible tonight. ABC was horrible now is better. HBO just a little off.

I have been reading lip synch problems throughout the country.

Comcast technician was clueless when he came out. Nothing he could do.

Should I buy a reciever and try the digital out from box?

Anything else to try?

I begged comcast to upgrade SARA but that is worthless.

Originally posted by DaveB99
TV - Sony 40XBR700
Box - 3250HD
Sara V 1.52.3.1
Cable System - Comcast Clinton, CT


Any one else have lip synch problems with the 3250HD?

Should I buy a reciever and try the digital out from box?

Anything else to try?

I begged comcast to upgrade SARA but that is worthless. I have the same box and your problem is probably not your box but your stations. We had major audio problems with our local NBC and ABC stations here is Palm Beach and it took them 3-4 weeks to finally find and fix their problems. I have both cable and OTA boxes and the audio sync issues will occur on both units, indicating its the station and not your equipment. There are occasions when the network will have problems but NBC was fine last night. I suggest you try to contact your local stations and see if they are aware of the audio sync issues you are seeing.

DaveB99,
I can second what Kenni_o said. I am also in CT using Comcast, a SA 3250HD with the same firmware: 1.52.3.1 (which sucks BTW) and when I noticed allot of audio sync issues I found on the CT Local HDTV thread that the OTA guys had noticed the exact same audio issues on the same show at the same time. BTW I do use only a digital coax line to my receiver for audio and the audio sync is still an issue (worst on NBC / ABC HD channels).

What I think is the worst part of the SA 3250HD firmware 1.52.3.1 is that the box does that weird visual smear and audio muting. The video comes back fine fast but the audio is gone till you change the channel again. This is a reported issues with our box and that firmware version. I have been reassured that a new firmware (I believe, 1.52.6.1) resolves this issue. But at least this problem doesn't require anything as extensive as a full box reboot. Changing channels is at least an easy fix. Still shouldn't happen. *End Rant*

Originally posted by Beaker1024
DaveB99,
I can second what Kenni_o said. I am also in CT using Comcast, a SA 3250HD with the same firmware: 1.52.3.1 (which sucks BTW) and when I noticed allot of audio sync issues I found on the CT Local HDTV thread that the OTA guys had noticed the exact same audio issues on the same show at the same time. BTW I do use only a digital coax line to my receiver for audio and the audio sync is still an issue (worst on NBC / ABC HD channels).

What I think is the worst part of the SA 3250HD firmware 1.52.3.1 is that the box does that weird visual smear and audio muting. The video comes back fine fast but the audio is gone till you change the channel again. This is a reported issues with our box and that firmware version. I have been reassured that a new firmware (I believe, 1.52.6.1) resolves this issue. But at least this problem doesn't require anything as extensive as a full box reboot. Changing channels is at least an easy fix. Still shouldn't happen. *End Rant* I can second you back. Exactly the same issue with the box here in Florida. I'm waiting on Adelphia to upgrade their FW again. Last update at the beginning of February got us the DVI connection enabled but added some audio issues that you reported. Hopefully, we'll get 1.52.6.1 soon as I believe Adelphia is rolling it out in S. California already.

I need some quick advice.

I have a 3250HD with the latest firmware from SA. The number with the 6 in it. Supposedly the latest and greatest.

When I use the wizard I can only utilize 480p widescreen, 480i widescreen, and 1080i whereas in component I could use all of those plus the 4:3 versions. My TV will not take 720p direct.

When I try DVI auto I get black screens everywhere except a 1080i source. I have to set it to upcconvert 1 to get the SD and regular digital channels.

I thought DVI auto gives it straight to the TV and the TV converts which it will do in component when I use pass through.

What am I doing wrong or what step am I leaving out?

I talked to my cable folks yesterday and the first said DVI was now on, the second said it wasn't, and the third said he thought so but the guide wouldn't work. Go figure! I can make the DVI work and the Guide is there, but why would I lose three input formats going from component pass through to DVI auto?

DVI port may not accept all the resolutions the Component port can take. Check your TV's manual. On my Panny 50LC13, the component port can take all resolutions but the manual specifically lists DVI port does not take 480i although it actually kind of works but I can see it does not work well. I ended up ran the setup wizard again and took out the 480i resolution. And DVI works fine on SD channels.

No DVI will support 480i or any other interlaced signal, from my interpretation. That is why SDI has become desirable. Full digital signal that is not progressive so that it can be deinterlaced and rescaled.

Originally posted by 1SalesPro
No DVI will support 480i or any other interlaced signal, from my interpretation. That is why SDI has become desirable. Full digital signal that is not progressive so that it can be deinterlaced and rescaled. I have AutoDVI enabled to my Sony GWIII and it takes 480i just fine. In fact, the 3250HD will switch to 480i for all standard cable channels, it switches to 480P when on the Music Channels, then to 720P for ABC and 1080I for NBC and Showtime HD (this from Adelphia Cable).

Old Pirate - My Sony does not like the 480I/P Widescreen formats from the 3250HD box. It treats those formats as a compressed version of normal 480I/P giving you a small screen version of normal 480I. Did you try just using the 480I and 480P formats without selecting the Widescreen versions?

Originally posted by 1SalesPro
No DVI will support 480i or any other interlaced signal, from my interpretation. That is why SDI has become desirable. Full digital signal that is not progressive so that it can be deinterlaced and rescaled.

Your interpretation is wrong. My TV accepts 1080i via DVI just fine. 480i works but not very stable (manul says no 480i support).

No problem here with 3250HD DVI and 480i, 480p or 1080i (we don't have any 720p HD signals). PQ on all stations is much better with DVI than it was with component.

Originally posted by mainemojo
No problem here with 3250HD DVI and 480i, 480p or 1080i (we don't have any 720p HD signals). PQ on all stations is much better with DVI than it was with component.

When you got your 3250HD from your cable company, did DVI work immediately, or did they have to do something to get it to work? What's the SA software version?

Originally posted by Foxbat121
Well, it's good news and bad news. The good news is (1)once I selected pass-through mode, HD PQ seems improved a little through component (2) DVI is now activated. PQ through DVI is marginally better than component. But it seems to me the 3250 only negotiate HDCP after initial power up. As a result, whenever my TV(Panny 50LC13) powers down or switches input, only snow will show up on screen until I unplug the power and re-initialize the cable box. For now, I will just use component output instead.

So i have this same problem with Cox Fairfax, VA. I just got my 3250, and connect it via DVI (looks great). But when ever I power down the TV, and then turn it back on, i get snow. As long as the TV stays on (i can change inputs fine), and I can turn off the 3250 and turn it back on and get it to work, but as soon as I turn off the TV and then come back to watch it later, i have to unplug the 3250 power cord, and reboot it to get it to come back. I have a 57" Tosh 57H93 and am using the Monster DVI cable for now. When it works, it works great, but is there any way around this yet or am I stuck with having to unplug the device?

Originally posted by Ron Tobin
When you got your 3250HD from your cable company, did DVI work immediately, or did they have to do something to get it to work? What's the SA software version?
DVI was activated March 18. All I had to do was connect the cable -- no settings to change, no adjustments to make. Software is 1.52.3.1.

Originally posted by REL77
So i have this same problem with Cox Fairfax, VA. I just got my 3250, and connect it via DVI (looks great). But when ever I power down the TV, and then turn it back on, i get snow. As long as the TV stays on (i can change inputs fine), and I can turn off the 3250 and turn it back on and get it to work, but as soon as I turn off the TV and then come back to watch it later, i have to unplug the 3250 power cord, and reboot it to get it to come back. I have a 57" Tosh 57H93 and am using the Monster DVI cable for now. When it works, it works great, but is there any way around this yet or am I stuck with having to unplug the device?

Unfortunately you have to live with that so far even with the latest firmware 1.52.6.1. There is no other way around it until SA fix it with new firmware or new STB. SD channels on DVI look even worse than component. For now, I just use component instead of DVI.

Originally posted by Foxbat121
Unfortunately you have to live with that so far even with the latest firmware 1.52.6.1. There is no other way around it until SA fix it with new firmware or new STB. For now, I just use component instead of DVI.

Is this something that they do plan to fix, or is this just the way it is?

Originally posted by REL77
So i have this same problem with Cox Fairfax, VA. I just got my 3250, and connect it via DVI (looks great). But when ever I power down the TV, and then turn it back on, i get snow. As long as the TV stays on (i can change inputs fine), and I can turn off the 3250 and turn it back on and get it to work, but as soon as I turn off the TV and then come back to watch it later, i have to unplug the 3250 power cord, and reboot it to get it to come back. I have a 57" Tosh 57H93 and am using the Monster DVI cable for now. When it works, it works great, but is there any way around this yet or am I stuck with having to unplug the device? I think you have the first DVI version of firmware (1.54.3.1). I believe they corrected that with their next firmware version (1.54.4.1) but I'm not 100% sure of that. If I remember right, you can correct the problem by just pulling the DVI cable from the box and re-connecting it. I remember the problem has something to do with polling done by the STB to see if the TV is connected to the DVI. During polling if the TV is not present it locks out the DVI connection. I hope I'm right on that. Anyway its a known problem but is fixed with the right version of fw. Mine is working correctly now but did act exactly as you describe when the DVI was first enabled,

i will have to check the fw when i get home tonight

Nope. Cox in Fairfax, VA never had 1.52.3.1 firmware. The first version of firmware that activates the DVI is 1.52.4.1 and now 1.52.6.1 (updated in 4/1 or 4/2). The DVI problem fixed by 1.52.4.1 vs 1.52.3.1 is that you see HDCP alert message everytime you change channel in STB.

Originally posted by REL77
i will have to check the fw when i get home tonight I know they fixed it cause I've turned mine off and on for the last month and it's worked everytime. I even use the 3250 box for just listening to the music channels without the TV on. That would kill the DVI connection for sure the next time you turned on the TV with the first version of fw. Now I do this all the time and the DVI path stays up. So it has been corrected.

Originally posted by Foxbat121
Nope. Cox in Fairfax, VA never had 1.52.3.1 firmware. The first version of firmware that activates the DVI is 1.52.4.1 and now 1.52.6.1 (updated in 4/1 or 4/2). The DVI problem fixed by 1.52.4.1 vs 1.52.3.1 is that you see HDCP alert message everytime you change channel in STB. I think your right on the HDCP firmware fix on version 4.1. But I know they did something to correct the DVI link problem cause mine is fixed and working properly for about a month now. I'll check to see what version of firmware I have tonight.

Well, DVI port to me is still the same as before. Everytime I turn off the TV or even change the input on TV, I will get snow. I noticed that when you first plug in the DVI cable, you will not get HDCP error in 1.52.4.1. But other issues I've experienced so far didn't get fixed. Note, it varies depends on your TV manufacturer. From my reading of HDCP specification, the SA firmware is still not up to task (you can view my posting a few pages back). Current firmware correctly issue HDCP hand shake when you hot plug in the DVI cable. However, HDCP spec also calls for STB to monitor and issue HDCP hand shake if it finds out TV is off and then on or, in my case, TV is switched to different input and back at least EVERY TWO SECONDS. This is what caused my issue as well REL77's issue.

Originally posted by Foxbat121
Well, DVI port to me is still the same as before. Everytime I turn off the TV or even change the input on TV, I will get snow. I noticed that when you first plug in the DVI cable, you will not get HDCP error in 1.52.4.1. But other issues I've experienced so far didn't get fixed. Note, it varies depends on your TV manufacturer. From my reading of HDCP specification, the SA firmware is still not up to task (you can view my posting a few pages back). Current firmware correctly issue HDCP hand shake when you hot plug in the DVI cable. However, HDCP spec also calls for STB to monitor and issue HDCP hand shake if it finds out TV is off and then on or, in my case, TV is switched to different input and back at least EVERY TWO SECONDS. This is what caused my issue as well REL77's issue. So do you think the problem has more to do with the TV manufacture and their handling of HDCP with the 3250? I have a Sony GWIII and did not every get the HDCP error message. When my DVI came active, the connection would remain active except when the TV and STB were turned off. I would remove the DVI cable from the STB to get the connection back. I could cycle through my inputs without an issue. About a week after the DVI was enabled, I noticed that I turn the box off and on and the DVI would stay active. I assumed that I got a new firmware fix. Anyway its been up for 3-4 weeks now without a problem. Somehow it got corrected.

Originally posted by Foxbat121
Well, DVI port to me is still the same as before. Everytime I turn off the TV or even change the input on TV, I will get snow. I noticed that when you first plug in the DVI cable, you will not get HDCP error in 1.52.4.1. But other issues I've experienced so far didn't get fixed. Note, it varies depends on your TV manufacturer. From my reading of HDCP specification, the SA firmware is still not up to task (you can view my posting a few pages back). Current firmware correctly issue HDCP hand shake when you hot plug in the DVI cable. However, HDCP spec also calls for STB to monitor and issue HDCP hand shake if it finds out TV is off and then on or, in my case, TV is switched to different input and back at least EVERY TWO SECONDS. This is what caused my issue as well REL77's issue.

I cant remember what you said, what kind of TV do you have?

Ken,

Yes, it has to do with TV's handling of HDCP. However, HDCP implementation spec. put the burden on STB (HDCP source) to adapt to different ways of implementation of TVs. But really who knows who's to blame. All I know is that there are couple of brands of TVs have problem with SA box.

REL77,

I've the same issue as you. In addition, my TV won't maintain HDCP connection if I switch my TV's input away from DVI. My TV is Panny PT-50LC13.

This may be an obvious question, but i just don't know --

How can you tell which resolution (480i, 480p, 1080i) the display is receiving?

Thanks

oliver

Originally posted by Foxbat121
Ken,

Yes, it has to do with TV's handling of HDCP. However, HDCP implementation spec. put the burden on STB (HDCP source) to adapt to different ways of implementation of TVs. But really who knows who's to blame. All I know is that there are couple of brands of TVs have problem with SA box. Thanks for the information. I figured there must be difference implementations of HDCP with all the difference error messages indicated in this thread. Is there a chance that SA tossed in a fix in its fw for the DVI drop that works with my Sony but didn't work with your Panny? That may explain why mine started working and yet others don't.

Originally posted by python153
This may be an obvious question, but i just don't know --

How can you tell which resolution (480i, 480p, 1080i) the display is receiving?

Thanks

oliver If you have AutoDVI enabled, the 3250HD will provide a small text box in the lower right hand corner of your screen for maybe 3 seconds telling you what format it's in every time it changes. It does this when you change to a channel that has a different format. If you change to a station with your current format, you will not get the text box. For example, if you go from a SD station at 480i to say NBC-HD station, you get a message "Normal 1080i". If you then goto an ABC-HD station, you'll get "Normal 720P. That's only if your set will accept all these formats.

Thanks Kenni_o for reply, I am not using DVI and I don't think it get enabled.

Another question: it seems all of you can get to diagnostic menu or setup wizard without any problem. but I don't think I am doing it the right way.

power off DHCT, then press and hold SELECT button, since power is off, nothing is on the TV screen. Same thing with GUIDE plus INFO button together. what did I do wrong? (my video input is set to component 2, which connect the box).

Thanks

Oliver

Originally posted by python153
Another question: it seems all of you can get to diagnostic menu or setup wizard without any problem. but I don't think I am doing it the right way.

power off DHCT, then press and hold SELECT button, since power is off, nothing is on the TV screen. Same thing with GUIDE plus INFO button together. what did I do wrong? (my video input is set to component 2, which connect the box).
1. First the caveat, use at your own risk!

2. You get to the diagnostic screens (as you call them) by:

----a. Turn box ON.

----b. Press and hold the Select button (middle button in cluster) until the Message light blinks.

----c. Press the Info button (while the Message light is still blinking, you don't have much time).

----d. Use Vol +/- buttons to scroll through display screens. The 4th screen, Software Status (I believe), tells you the software version number that you see a lot of us talking about. It should look something like 1.52.3.1, 1.52.4.1, or 1.52.6.1 (the latest). There is a bunch of info in these screens, including signal strength and S/N ratio.

----e. Press the Exit button to exit.

----NOTE: These are displays only, AFAIK there is nothing you can change.

3. You get to the Screen Resolutions Setup options by:

----a. Turn the box OFF.

----b. Press and hold the Guide and Info buttons at the same time.

----c. The first setup screen should appear on your TV.

----d. Follow the instructions to cycle through each resolution and enable/disable the ones you want. Most folks enable 1080i (or 720p depending on HDTV) and 480i to minimize the time it takes to convert from one to the other when scanning through channels.

----e. Press the Exit button to exit.

----NOTE: You can end up with a blank screen if you enable a format that your TV does not support.

Dave,

I appreciate you give the steps, I tried all of them. Nothing come out from it.
The mail/message light never blinked.

???

oliver

And GUIDE and INFO (when power is off) doesn't work either.

oliver

Did you use the buttons on the box rather than the remote?

Yes, I did. All operations were done on the box. It has no response whatsoever!!!

Oliver

Your location is not in your info, so we can't help much, because no on can step up and say "hey, I have the same MSO and system..." It could be that you are not running SARA software too, but with no location to compare to, it's just a guess. Add your location in your profile, we don't need your address, but a city and state go a long way, and you could even add your cable co somewhere.

You should only try the setup without the DVI cable connected. Try using component for the best setup and test. Some TV DVI inputs will handle different signals in different ways, and may not allow "some" non native signals to pass.

vegggas

Vegggas,

I have update my profile. Just to be clear, my cable operator is Time Warner NC.

I am not using DVI port, the video output is set as component 2 (with a Panny PT53) . Like I mentioned, cable box (3250HD) doesn't respond, the TV is blank screen (not snow white). I have browse through all the posts in this thread, and seems I am the only one with this problem.

Can they possibly disable the button? or any other things I could try?

Thanks


Oliver

TWC dropped of an SA3250HD box today, with firewire. I'm having a LOT of problems with it.

1) All output from DVI is at 1080i, regardless of the channels resolution. My Pioneer 3510HD did not do this, it output all channels at their proper resolution (480, 720p, 1080i). This box is not handshaking with the TV properly, or not trying. When I use DVI all output from the box is fixed at 1080i.

2) When I try to record to my JVC40000 via firewire, the VCR claims all the channels are copy protected. The cable company tells me they are not copy protected, and it worked with a 30000 that another customer had.

3) When I use component out, all channels come out at the proper resolution EXCEPT for Discovery HD Theater, which for some reason the box outputs at 480i.

Overall performance and PQ is considerably lower than it was with the Pioneer 3510HD. This is a pretty crappy box overall, but I really need it for the firewire. Is there something I can tell the cable company about firewire that they need to do, so it doesn't output all streams as copy protected?

One more note on the 3250, if I view the firewire output of the 3250 on my Sony 65WS550 TV, all is fine. It displays fine, and all the resolutions are correct.

Originally posted by uzun
TWC dropped of an SA3250HD box today, with firewire. I'm having a LOT of problems with it.

1) All output from DVI is at 1080i, regardless of the channels resolution. My Pioneer 3510HD did not do this, it output all channels at their proper resolution (480, 720p, 1080i). This box is not handshaking with the TV properly, or not trying. When I use DVI all output from the box is fixed at 1080i.
Is your box set for fixed 1080i format? That would cause you to send everything at 1080I. Most cable company's deliver the box set for 480i and 1080i formats only. You will need to get into the box setup mode and make available all the formats that your set will handle. Their are instructions in this thread or on the SA site that walk you through the complete setup menu. That should correct one of your problem if you are using component cables.

For DVI, you will need to go into the setup mode using your remote (push SETUP button on your remote twice), go to PICTURE FORMAT, change it from FIXED to AUTODVI. This should correct the DVI issue.

Here is a like to the SA Setup guide instructions:
http://www.scientificatlanta.com/explorerclub/getting_started/HDTV%20Setup%20Wizard%204003114%20Rev%20A.pdf

There is no such option on my SA3250, I'm running passport software in it perhaps that's why. If I press info and guide simultaneously the box just warns me to hit CBL to power on the box. If I hit settings twice it just toggles it off the screen. To get to the more settings menu, I have to hit settings then A. Once in the more settings menu, there is no option to change the picture format when DVI is connected. You can specify output formats when DVI is not connected, but once DVI is connected it takes that ability away, and always outputs every signal at 1080i.

Someone mentioned getting a "snow screen" after turning off the TV and SA 3250HD box. I have the same problem, but have found a quick fix although I'm trying to find a correction.

If the station your box turns to at start up is a SD, non digital channel, switch to a HD channel. My set up flutters and resets to the proper format and the picture is fine. The same thing works in reverse. If it comes on to an HD channel and shows snow I can switch to an SD channel and it finds the signal and then it works everywhere.

Digital gremlins are tough little buggers. Never had this problem with component but the subtle DVI improvement is probably worth the momentary startup problem.

I have done all the normal setups and know they are correct. It's either in the handshake between the two units or in the box.

Just got my Comcast SA3250 replaced with one that includes a working firewire port. I connected it to my Sony KDP-65XBR2 TV and the HD channels come in a little better than the component connections. I can view all digital channels thru the firewire. Basically channel 101 on. For those of you who care about the verisons, here is what I have. Besides the 1.56.4.1, I didn't know which was important.

Rom Image 1.56.4.1
OS 3.8.2.1
Sara 1.56.4.1
Powerkey Lib 3.5.20.130
HAL Driver 2.2.1.2
ATI Driver 1.2.15.110
firebus 2.5.7.1
fbdtcp 2.5.3.1
PHAL3 Driver 3.4.11.0

I have a 3250HD hooked up to a JVC 30K. HD displays and records fine through firewire, but on SD channels viewed through firewire via the JVC, the picture is shifted to the left, and random noise shows up on the right side. I have a contact at TWC that I'm working with, so will report it to him. Has anyone else experienced this?

I got ahold of a JVC 30k and it does record off my SA3250 as well. The problem is tapes made in this manner will NOT play back on the JVC 40k. They play back for a split second, then the screen goes black. Clearly the data on the tape has something in it that makes the JVC 40k think it's copy protected, even when played back off a D-VHS tape recorded on a JVC30k

Originally posted by fcsmith
I have a 3250HD hooked up to a JVC 30K. HD displays and records fine through firewire, but on SD channels viewed through firewire via the JVC, the picture is shifted to the left, and random noise shows up on the right side. I have a contact at TWC that I'm working with, so will report it to him. Has anyone else experienced this?

I had a similar/same issue. But in my case, the noise on the right happened to be an HD image of Disney's Tarzan, which I had just played off a D-VHS tape a few minutes prior. I pulled the plugs on the 3250 and the JVC -- and left 'em unpowered for 5 minutes -- and this fixed the problem.

HOWEVER! I *may* have just been receiving 480i/p data over the firewire, and pulling the plugs got me back to HD. Worth a try tho.

-Pie

Originally posted by Old Pirate
Someone mentioned getting a "snow screen" after turning off the TV and SA 3250HD box. I have the same problem, but have found a quick fix although I'm trying to find a correction.

If the station your box turns to at start up is a SD, non digital channel, switch to a HD channel. My set up flutters and resets to the proper format and the picture is fine. The same thing works in reverse. If it comes on to an HD channel and shows snow I can switch to an SD channel and it finds the signal and then it works everywhere.


That's a great tip! I just tried out and worked. I just changed my 3250's start up channel to an analog channel. Now I just need to turn on the STB and then tune to HD channels which will cause HDCP handshake again to resolve the snow screen issue.

Originally posted by uzun
2) When I try to record to my JVC40000 via firewire, the VCR claims all the channels are copy protected. The cable company tells me they are not copy protected, and it worked with a 30000 that another customer had.
....
I got ahold of a JVC 30k and it does record off my SA3250 as well. The problem is tapes made in this manner will NOT play back on the JVC 40k. They play back for a split second, then the screen goes black. Clearly the data on the tape has something in it that makes the JVC 40k think it's copy protected, even when played back off a D-VHS tape recorded on a JVC30k
You wouldn't happen to be "the other guy" on Time Warner San Diego using firewire? If so, I'm the guy with the JVC 30K!! (I was the first one to get firewire going from TWCSD, or so they told me.)

A tech called me an hour or so ago to ask about the copy protection being on (errantly), and he described a situation very similar to yours (had a 40K, bought a 30K to test with). And he told me about the 30K/40K tape incompatibility problem. Sounds like you!

I personally believe there's errant data embedded in the stream. My Mitsubishi 73711 will detect the 3250, but cannot display anything from it over the firewire. I can record by running the 3250 direct to the 30K. When I play this recording back over firewire to the Mits, I'm in blocky image hell. So the Mits definitely hates something in the stream, and I suspect it's the same thing causing this "copy protection" issue with the JVC.

If you are "the other guy" you know about clearing the copy protection problem for record by turning the 3250 and JVC off, then back on (not removing power, but just cycling on/off switch)...

Anyway, I think we should compare notes, since we're the beta testers at this point! I've been posting in the "Record to Macintosh" thread, though you probably know much of what I've said already...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=386740&perpage=30&pagenumber=6

On another note... Curious if anyone else has a Mitsubishi and uses the 3250.

-Pie

Yea I'm "the other guy" with the firewire cable box from TWSD. I have a Sony KDP-65WS550, a JVC 40000, and the SA3250HD cable box on the firewire bus. I have the SA3250HD plugged into the JVC 40000, which is in turn plugged into the 65WS550. I can view all the digital channels fine using the 65WS550. The JVC40k passes the information through just fine. The JVC 40k recognizes the data stream out of the SA3250HD just fine, but it only briefly flashes the picture before the whole thing goes black.

I then hooked up a JVC 30000 to the SA3250HD on its second firewire port. It would record and playback OK, for the most part. When I took tapes recorded with the 30000 and put them in the 40000, it would briefly display the picture, then it would go black. I could watch the tape progress, using the on screen display and see that the output format (480i/720p/1080i) would switch appropriately, and the sound format would also switch just fine. It would only display a black picture and no sound despite this.

When you try and record using the 40000, it says REC PROHIBITED (103). When you try and play the tapes back, it says Copy Protected Material (203).

So basically something is odd about the firewire stream out of the SA3250HD. The JVC 30k seems to be OK with it, but even taking a seemingly "good" tape out of the 30k and putting it into the 40k results in the same symptons, it can see the data fine, it briefly flashes the start of the picture, then blacks everything out.

Not trying to stir things up (too much anyway), and I'm not doing any recording of my own yet, so I could be way out of line, but it appears that the JVC devices may be working correctly.
Situation 1: Can not play tapes recorded from one machine in another.
With the DTCP working correctly you shouldn't be able to record on one HD device and play it back on another. The datastream in the tape device may have been "married" to the original recording device, thereby preventing circulation. This sounds exactly like what the studios would want to happen. They say "Fine, go ahead and make your purchased recording of your premium content, but you can't give it to a friend, or resell it on ebay".
Situation 2: No HD recording on 40k unit.
With the release of the 1394 ports and software, studios may have been scrambling and mandating that providers put up the "copy never" flag. That flag may go unnoticed by the older generation (i.e. before everything was finalized) 30k units, but immediately stops the newer 40k units.
I think recording to a 40k device will be worked out soon, with some provisions, but swapping tapes will be a thing of the past.

vegggas

I would agree with vegggas. Judging by the fact that all the HD channels (even the local broadcasting channels) requires HDCP encryption via DVI port on SA3250HD box, I bet it's SA or Cable Co.s play it safe and turn on copy protection on all contents in HD.

TWC says they are not, and that the broadcast channels are copy freely. I can record OTA HDTV on one machine, and play it back fine on another. When I record the same channel through the SA3250HD, it shows up as copy protected. So somehow some sort of copy flag is being turned on inadvetently along the line, when they come through the cable box. TWC tells me the OTA stream I get from KPBS should be identical to their stream, clearly it isn't since the OTA version records on all recorders, and plays on all recorders fine, whereas the KPBS off the SA3250HD is seen as copy protected by the JVC 40k.

Originally posted by vegggas
Not trying to stir things up (too much anyway), and I'm not doing any recording of my own yet, so I could be way out of line, but it appears that the JVC devices may be working correctly.
Situation 1: Can not play tapes recorded from one machine in another.
With the DTCP working correctly you shouldn't be able to record on one HD device and play it back on another. The datastream in the tape device may have been "married" to the original recording device, thereby preventing circulation. This sounds exactly like what the studios would want to happen. They say "Fine, go ahead and make your purchased recording of your premium content, but you can't give it to a friend, or resell it on ebay".
Situation 2: No HD recording on 40k unit.
With the release of the 1394 ports and software, studios may have been scrambling and mandating that providers put up the "copy never" flag. That flag may go unnoticed by the older generation (i.e. before everything was finalized) 30k units, but immediately stops the newer 40k units.
I think recording to a 40k device will be worked out soon, with some provisions, but swapping tapes will be a thing of the past.

vegggas

The tapes should play just fine in any 5C compliant DVHS player. However, dubbing the tape would be another story if the recorded content was delivered as "copy once."

Yeah, what Joe said...!!

The Mitsubishi is also 5C compliant and refuses to play the stream. The 30K sometimes go into "copy protection" mode, and turning the 3250/30K off/on fixes it. Time Warner assured me as well that they have Copy Protection turned off. So this all points straight at the 3250. Well, this and a bit of info from rcliff in the the "How To: Recording to Mac over Firewire" thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=3650265#post3650265

Originally posted by rcliff
Some answers... There is a bizarre compatibility issue between the Mits and SA firewire output that SA is now aware of and hopefully going to fix via flash. This results in the firewire output on the SA boxes getting muted when the Mits is connected anywhere in the firewire chain. This sucks for now. Well it's back to the Sony box for now for me.

That seems to settle it. I'm now hoping there's a way to clean the mpeg streams I've recorded to my Macintosh... Star Wars tonight!!

Anyone know of programs that convert MPEG2 TS --> MPEG2 PS --> MPEG2 TS??

-Pie

TWC SAYS they have copy protection off, but they haven't looked at the data stream out of the SA3250HD to determine if it really is. Clearly it is not, or there's something else wrong with the data stream, because I can record and play back KPBS HDTV from my antenna all that I want. If I try and record the same program from KPBS out of the SA3250HD, it says REC PROHIBITED, and claims the program is copy protected if I try and play it back.

TWC claims the OTA HDTV stream from KPBS is identical to the stream I should get out of the SA3250HD, but clearly it isn't. Somewhere along the lines copy protection, or some other flag, is being turned on when the broadcaster has NOT turned it on.

Originally posted by uzun
TWC claims the OTA HDTV stream from KPBS is identical to the stream I should get out of the SA3250HD, but clearly it isn't. Somewhere along the lines copy protection, or some other flag, is being turned on when the broadcaster has NOT turned it on.
Steve the Tech made the same claim to me. He's not really taking everything into account.

AFAIK, the OTA mpeg stream must be commutated/packetized into a format the Cable Company transmits, QAM 256 probably. This must then be decoded and re-assembled at the box, then sent down the firewire stream, which is yet another packetized encoding! (From what I can see in the FW 3.0 AVC spec.)

I don't know all the intiricacies of ATSC and Cable formats, but that, in a nutshell is how it should work. In a perfect world, the MPEG2 data *should* still arrive at the TV in the same format... but there are a number of steps between PBS transmission and cable delivery to our TVs.

So to say it's identical is sorta true, but there's a lot that can happen... and go wrong... in between... Including the copy protection becoming embedded (by a bug, or by design) into the stream.

And just FYI, Steve points the wrong way to Mount Soledad from my house... so he might be wrong about a few other things too... :)

Anyone else have any speculation? Or info on cable xmission formats?

-Pie

Originally posted by fcsmith
I have a 3250HD hooked up to a JVC 30K. HD displays and records fine through firewire, but on SD channels viewed through firewire via the JVC, the picture is shifted to the left, and random noise shows up on the right side. I have a contact at TWC that I'm working with, so will report it to him. Has anyone else experienced this?

In L.A. with TWC about 30% of the SD digital channels viewed thru the JVC 30K are showing correctly. The rest have the picture compressed into the left 3/4 of the picture. The right quarter is a fixed picture from the last good channel.

After an initial bout on downrezzing everything to 480i, I have had no problems recording 1080i.

Originally posted by Alan Sh
In L.A. with TWC about 30% of the SD digital channels viewed thru the JVC 30K are showing correctly. The rest have the picture compressed into the left 3/4 of the picture. The right quarter is a fixed picture from the last good channel.

After an initial bout on downrezzing everything to 480i, I have had no problems recording 1080i.
I reported the right part of the screen as "random noise", but you're right - it is from the last good channel. Every SD digital channel I've checked does this, but I haven't looked at that many. I'll check more of themm to see if some are displaying correctly.

I experienced the initial downrezzing as well, but it hasn't appeared since. Is your box running Passport? I'm guessing so since our boxes are acting pretty much the same.

Can anyone who is successfully recording via firewire to DVHS confirm that the 3250 does support timed recording? If so, does it use it's own internal clock to determine when to record as opposed to the way the Samsung SIR-T165 relies on the time/date the station transmited by the station?
Thanks,

This thread is already confusing enough, but now with Firewire questions we have to also worry about which software (SARA or Passport) is being used. :(

Originally posted by Killroy
Funny thing is that I can't seem to find a firebus version anywhere on my list...maybe that's the difference that makes it work since I am still stuck on 1.52.6.1

I received my SA3250 late Friday with the same firmware, 1.52.6.1. It does not show a firebus version, and my PC does not see a new firewire device when I connect it. Can someone confirm that the firebus setting in the firmware listing is the key to indicating that the firewire has been enabled?

Arg :(

Willie

Originally posted by Killroy
Funny thing is that I can't seem to find a firebus version anywhere on my list...maybe that's the difference that makes it work since I am still stuck on 1.52.6.1 Yeah, we don't have that version yet in Phoenix. I guessed we'd have it Apr 7 and KWH guessed Apr 12, no one else would venture a guess. Obviously, he has the better chance of being right. :)

Originally posted by Willie
Can someone confirm that the firebus setting in the firmware listing is the key to indicating that the firewire has been enabled?] I can't confirm it, but that's the only version posted so far that has Firewire enabled. It's up to you whether or not you consider that confirmation. :)
1.52.6.1 fixed a bunch of audio problems.

Foxbat,

Your TV's native resolution is 720p, correct? So when you have 480i disabled on your 3250HD and Auto-DVI on, does the 3250HD upconvert 480i signals to 480p, and then your TV upconverts the 480p to 720p? Or does the 3250HD upconvert the 480i into 720p and hence your TV doesn't have to convert anything?

"I just changed my 3250's start up channel to an analog channel."

How exactly do you set the 3250 so that it starts just at a single designated channel every time?

Thanks in advance.

Monster Cables
I know this has probably been mentioned here, but are Monster Cables worth the price? been thinking about getting some.

Originally posted by jrock65
Foxbat,

Your TV's native resolution is 720p, correct? So when you have 480i disabled on your 3250HD and Auto-DVI on, does the 3250HD upconvert 480i signals to 480p, and then your TV upconverts the 480p to 720p? Or does the 3250HD upconvert the 480i into 720p and hence your TV doesn't have to convert anything?

Yes, but I like to let 3250HD pass native format and let my TV do the scaling as it does a far better job than 3250. BTW, after I run the setup wizard to disable 480i format, I have to unplug and reconnect the DVI cable again so that the STB will convert 480i to 480p via Auto-DVI.

How exactly do you set the 3250 so that it starts just at a single designated channel every time?


Just press Settings button on remote twice and you will find the setting for power up channel.

tazlv,

if you mean Monster DVI cable, save your money and buy a $10 computer DVI cable. It won't make any difference unless you want more than 12 feet cable length. As for Monster Component cable, it's nice but you can find cheaper ones at half the price for the same perfomence.

the general view is monster cables are not worth it, cheaper cables that are just as good canb e had for less

I've used a lot of cables, if you're going to spend the money for better performing cables, Better Cables, Nordost Optix & Audioquest YIQ3 are close to the cost of Monster's upper level cables and you can customize with BNC terminations, s video y/c breakout if neccessary, the flexibility is better, come in "custom" lengths per seh to eliminate clutter and IMO the performance is better also. I have some nice nice Monsters but there are better configurations for the $.

Originally posted by fcsmith
.... Is your box running Passport? I'm guessing so since our boxes are acting pretty much the same.
On my TWC system channel 199 with a name of Diags says that I am running Passport 3.2 build 021. The select key or select and exit did not bring up message indicator.

Firewire only problems:

I am consistently getting an audio drop out of perhaps 1/4 of a second about every five minutes on playback. Are you or anyone else getting this?

The guide does not appear and I don't see how that can be fixed. The analog channels also do not appear and I am guessing that is non-fixable also.

Timed recording controlled by the 3250 did not work. I resorted to the Radio Shack 15-1996 solution. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2637237&highlight=151996#post2637237) That has worked so far.

Question for the guys with the working firewire and jvc recorders:

Can you play back your tapes over the firewire to the 3250?

Thanks a lot,
Derek

Originally posted by Derek K.
Question for the guys with the working firewire and jvc recorders:

Can you play back your tapes over the firewire to the 3250?

Thanks a lot,
Derek
Unfortunately, no.

Originally posted by fcsmith
Unfortunately, no.

Bummer.

Is there some sort of an IR Blaster/VCR Commander available for the SA3250HD? Something that plugs into the 3250HD, and will control a VCR to turn on/off when the 3250HD's VCR timers go on and off?

Yes, there is, but I believe it's an option that has to be provided/supported by the cableco.

I have had it with my DVI, having to reset the cable box after each time i turn off the TV to get the handshake to work, i am just going back to Component till a new firmware comes in out In VA

REL77,

Did you try the above mentioned tip that switching between analog channels and HD channels? It works for me.

Originally posted by Foxbat121
REL77,

Did you try the above mentioned tip that switching between analog channels and HD channels? It works for me.

Yeah, I tried, it still didnt work, i was really hoping it would have, but didnt... Oh well, I am sure a new firmware isnt to far away?

Originally posted by uzun
Is there some sort of an IR Blaster/VCR Commander available for the SA3250HD? Something that plugs into the 3250HD, and will control a VCR to turn on/off when the 3250HD's VCR timers go on and off?

On a TWC Passport system VCR Commander works as described here. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=3676128#post3676128)

That's exactly what I need, I'll try and get one from TWC here in San Diego. Thanks for the tips!

Originally posted by uzun
That's exactly what I need, I'll try and get one from TWC here in San Diego. Thanks for the tips!

Sorry, but you're going to have to live with the Pioneer 3510HD. TWC San Diego doesn't use the Sci Atl 3250HD box.

I should know...that's what I have.

Originally posted by 1SalesPro
AUDIO DROPS:

On the 3250 there is an option for wide, narrow and normal audio. I had mine I believe on narrow, had the drops then changed to wide or normal(will check later) and the drops stopped. Solution not guarenteed but something to try. Can you direct me to this option? I only see "Fixed" and "Variable. I'm experiencing audio dropouts with my new SA3250HD when connected to the Digital Audio Out only. The STB is on ROM Image/SARA 1.56.4.1. I don't have dropouts when using the Analog Audio Out Left and Right.

Originally posted by Alan Sh
On my TWC system channel 199 with a name of Diags says that I am running Passport 3.2 build 021. The select key or select and exit did not bring up message indicator.

Firewire only problems:

I am consistently getting an audio drop out of perhaps 1/4 of a second about every five minutes on playback. Are you or anyone else getting this?

The guide does not appear and I don't see how that can be fixed. The analog channels also do not appear and I am guessing that is non-fixable also.

Timed recording controlled by the 3250 did not work. I resorted to the Radio Shack 15-1996 solution. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2637237&highlight=151996#post2637237) That has worked so far.
I recorded Daredevil to my JVC 30K from HBO last night, and on playback I am getting the audio dropouts that you describe. I'm assuming that the problem is with the recording process of the JVC. The dropouts weren't present during the portions of the movie that I viewed while taping it (i.e. the dropouts weren't in the stream being fed to the JVC through the firewire connection), and I played back a pre-recorded tape immediately afterward with no problems.

Hi! This is probably a dumb question, but here goes:

I currently have Adelphia digital cable. I just got an HDTV (Samsung DLP).
Adelphia will rent me this SA3250 box for about $8/month above what I currently pay for cable (which is $0.00 since the house I rent includes basic digital).

The problem is that Adelphia only carries Showtime (which I don't subsribe to or want), PBS, and ABC in HD here in Orlando.

So....does this cable box have an input so that I could install an antenna and pull all the HD OTA channels and use the SA3250 to tune them?

Thank you,
Jeff

No, the 3250HD does not have an OTA tuner.

Well, I just tested the Optical Audio Out and it drops the audio even worse than the digital. Analog R/L is the only way to get stable sound. Is this a bug? I can't believe SA hasn't fixed it if it is...

I have a SciAtl 3250HD, and I use TWC San Diego, I also have a 3510HD. I only got the 3250HD for its firewire, the 3510HD is VASTLY superior in every other regard.

I found the main reason my 3250HD would "lose synch" over firewire with my JVC 40k. The most common reason was turning on and off the TV, which is also a firewire device. Setting the tv to i.Link standby, where it keeps 1394 connectivity even when off fixed the problem. The Cable box was hooked directly to the JVC 40k, but for some reason it would lose synch with it even though the TV was further down the line, when the TV was turned on or off.

Originally posted by fcsmith
I recorded Daredevil to my JVC 30K from HBO last night, and on playback I am getting the audio dropouts that you describe. I'm assuming that the problem is with the recording process of the JVC. The dropouts weren't present during the portions of the movie that I viewed while taping it (i.e. the dropouts weren't in the stream being fed to the JVC through the firewire connection), and I played back a pre-recorded tape immediately afterward with no problems.
I take it back, I don't think it's the JVC 30K after all. HBO is the only channel that gives me audio dropouts when I record and play it back. Every other HD channel records and plays back fine. It's strange that the dropouts only occur when I record HBO and play it back, but not when I watch it live through the firewire connection.

Originally posted by fcsmith
...... It's strange that the dropouts only occur when I record HBO and play it back, but not when I watch it live through the firewire connection.

I also watched a movie on HBO thru the 30k without any dropouts, yet had dropouts when I played back the recording. I have had audio dropouts while watching thru the JVC 30k.

The problem seems confined to HBO and Showtime but not always. Two upconverted 4:3 movies on these channels had no errors.

In testing the errors it has caused on occasion such severe pixelization and loss of audio I have had to reboot both the 3250 and the 30k on several times.

The VCR Commander is working almost too perfectly since it allows me to queue multiple movies ahead of time. After checking a the start of a recording I left it in. The next movie clobbered it.

The general thrust of this thread with regard to firewire recording to D-VHS decks deals only with the JVC 30k and 40k. Has anyone tried firewire recording of HD content from the SA3250 to the Mitsubishi line of D-VHS decks (i.e. 1100u and 2000u)....? Has it been successful?

Question for those of you whose Firewire Port functions on the SA3250HD.

What did your cable provider have to do to enable this capability? What software version do you have on the SA box?

My JVC30K does not "see" the SA3250HD at all.

Originally posted by Ron Tobin
What software version do you have on the SA box?
Sara 1.56.4.1
firebus 2.5.7.1
fbdtcp 2.5.3.1

Not sure if the firebus / fbdtcp drivers can be loaded independantly of the rest of the software ... but that should be most telling (whether or not firebus / fbdtcp is installed).

If the DVI is activated on the SA3250 is there simply a DVI to VGA adapter (for output to a CRT projector) that will work with it? So far the low end transcoder I have tried for component is a step down compared with D*. In fact is this is as good as TWC gets I'll stick with D*.

Willie

Originally posted by Willie
If the DVI is activated on the SA3250 is there simply a DVI to VGA adapter (for output to a CRT projector) that will work with it? So far the low end transcoder I have tried for component is a step down compared with D*. In fact is this is as good as TWC gets I'll stick with D*.

Willie

It won't happen because DVI port on the SA box (or all other cable boxes) requires HDCP. There won't ever be such device as HDCP compatible DVI to VGA adapter.

How does the output of the SA3250 look when paired with a good transcoder?

Willie

I finally got my 3250HD from TWC in NYC last Friday, and I've been trying to run it through its paces since then. I have a Samsung 165, a JVC 30K, and a Mits 2000 all daisy chained together. At first I plugged the 3250 to the front firewire jack of the 30K and it would not recognize it. The back firewire jack of the 30K goes to the 165, so I plugged the 3250 to the empty firewire jack in the back of the Mits and now it was reecognized by the JVC. The 30K now shows the 3250 on I-1, the Mits on I-2, and the 165 on I-3.

The TWC NYC HD lineup consists of CBS, NBC, FOX, ABC, PBS, Discovery, HBO, and Showtime. I have been able to record off all of them with no problems, except Discovery. There must be something wrong with the data stream on this channel because when I switch to it all I get is a black screen when I view it via the 30K on I-1. When I switch to the 3250's component output the channel is viewable with no problems. Sometimes this channel will cause the firewire output on the 3250 to lock up. When that happens no output is seen on the 3250's firewire for any other HD channel, and a reboot is necessary to restore the connection.

Something else that seems to happen at random is that when switching to an HD channel the 30K will flash the message "COPY RESTRICTED PROG, OUTPUT 480I VIDEO (302)", and the 30K will then downconvert the component output to 480i. This has happened about four times in the three days I've had the box. I have been unable to pinpoint the cause of this as it seems to happen without rhyme or reason and no warning, and a reboot is needed to restore full 1080i output via firewire. The component output is not affected by this glitch.

I have not been able to get the Mits 2000 to record from the 3250 at all. How are you guys doing it? If I switch the Mits to D1 and press record I get the CP ERROR message after about 35 seconds. I'm only able to record with the 30K, but these tapes do play back on the Mits with no problems. I was also able to record on both decks at the same time, the 3250 to the JVC, and the 165 to the Mits, and the recordings came out fine. This was definitely a capability I was very much looking for.

Overall the box serves its purpose, but the software appears to still be somewhat flaky. The inability to control a DVHS deck from the box (like the 165 does) is a drawback, but not a major one.

I am able to record from the 3250 to the Mitsu 1100, I just press the firewire button on the front of the DVHS, and then hit record. Playback is perfect, but I can't watch what I am recording through the firewire. I have also not figured out how to program a recording. I am able to program OTA recording via netcomand from my 55711 integrated tuner to my Mitsu DVHS.

I am not able to watch cable via firewire. But I am able to record from the 3250 and playback via netcomand. I have them daisy chained as followed.

3250-->Mitsu 1100 -->Mitsu ws55711

Finally! Bdraw is the only one who has actually answered the question I've posted in several places over the last week or so, i.e. will the Mits D-VHS decks record from the SA3250...? It figures that there are AVS members doing this, or trying to as Vic is, but they've declined to speak up. Thanks bdraw!

Now, the second question I've got is can a JVC 40k deck be included in the mix to allow component out to a component-in display device (in my case a Sony XBR910). It would be lined up as follows:

SA3250-->(firewire)Mits 2000u-->(firewire)JVC 40k-->(component)XBR910.

It would seem that you could get the best of all worlds with this arrangement, i.e. get the reliability of the Mits deck for time shift or archive recordings and use the JVC for back-up, D-Theater, and its component output - and view everything on a component-in HDTV. This assumes the JVC would "pass-thru" the Mits recordings from firewire to component.

This is what I would like to do to achieve my "perfect" recording solution (at least until there are firewire enabled DVR's).

I just had the 3250HD installed by Comcast yesterday, switched from D*, all ports active. I wanted to connect the FW to my Toshiba 51HX93, and they talked but couldn't get a stable connection, the engineers tell me SA will work on a fix.

But my issue is with the Auto - DVI format. I did a search of this thread and didn't find it, so I thought I would ask. When I set the box to Auto DVI and I tune to a SD signal, the picture appears but is shifted to the left about 2-3 inches. A black bar is on the right, and scoreboards (NBA game, for example last night) is shifted off the screen. I think it is okay on the HD stations. Anyone else have this problem, as I mentioned it is connected to a Tosh 51HX93. On my Samsung box there was a raster adjustment for the DVI picture, which I assumed would fix this, any solution on the SA3250HD box.

I really would like to use the Auto-DVI since my TV will do a nice stretch on the SD channels, and not the HD's .

Thanks,

Andy

Originally posted by archiguy

Now, the second question I've got is can a JVC 40k deck be included in the mix to allow component out to a component-in display device (in my case a Sony XBR910). It would be lined up as follows:

SA3250-->(firewire)Mits 2000u-->(firewire)JVC 40k-->(component)XBR910.

This is what I would like to do to achieve my "perfect" recording solution (at least until there are firewire enabled DVR's).

I got my 1100 from a guy on the tampahdtv forum, who was doing something very close to this. I traded him my 30k for his 1100. He did tell me he was able to record with the 1100 and playback with the 30k, but I don't know his exact configuration. I would guess that he was taking the tape out and putting it into the other player.

Originally posted by DoubleDAZ
dt_dc. I was going to add that, but I was too lazy to put it all together, thanks.

Glad I found this thread. I was going through the setup on my 3250 that I just got yesterday. I have a Mits Platinum. When I went to the advanced setup to try to select what formats the set supported, the 3250 bombed when it got to the 720p format. I kept waiting for it to clear and it would not. I was on the phone with Cox tech support, and needless to say they did not have a clue. Finally, I found this thread, and with the "select" and "vol+" keys I was able to get out of it. Is there anyway I can walk through setup to make the 3250 upconvert all 480p/i signals to 1080i without going through that portion of the setup?

Cant express enough how helpful this thread has been so far. Everyone here is great.

Grady

Grady,

Yes. On SA's web site, it posts a simpler version of seting up a fixed resolution for the box. You just need press a certain sequence of the buttons on the box to set it to whatever resolution you want without looking at your TV.

Originally posted by Alan Sh
I also watched a movie on HBO thru the 30k without any dropouts, yet had dropouts when I played back the recording. I have had audio dropouts while watching thru the JVC 30k.

The problem seems confined to HBO and Showtime but not always. Two upconverted 4:3 movies on these channels had no errors.

In testing the errors it has caused on occasion such severe pixelization and loss of audio I have had to reboot both the 3250 and the 30k on several times.

Just want to confirm drop outs in my neck of the woods too. If I try to play back ANY recording to my Mits 73711, I get such bad pixelization, drop-outs and stuttering, it's total destructo. The JVC 30K's internal decoder is more "robust" but still suffers from audio drop-out gallore.

I have noticed the problem is inconsitent. I have some recordings that play almost perfectly (almost), while others just go straight to pixellated hell.... So before ruling other stations as "perfect" I would recommend doing several test recordings.

I have noticed that I get a lot of "discontinuity" errors on packets recorded from the 3250 to my computer. An OTA capture of PBS gave a perfectly clean stream -- about 2 minutes after a fairly "dirty" capture of the same station from the 3250. This is the only anomaly I (with my limited experience) found.

I am hoping a solution lies with the cable box here. Otherwise, I will have audio drop-out on all my recordings to the 30K, and I will never be able to play a recording to my Mits over firewire ever again. And that's lame!

-Pie

Ok, the problems have gotten more severe after the first couple of days. Last night I could not record any shows in HD. Every time I turned on the box the JVC deck would display the dreaded COPY RESTRICTED PROG, OUTPUT 480I VIDEO (302) message, and no amount of reboots would get rid of it. This would happen on every HD channel, including the locals. The box would also sometmes lock up after a reboot if the firewire cable was connected to it, and it would not power up for a long time. When I unplugged the firewire cable it then rebooted quickly and properly.

I went through at least ten reboots after getting the COPY RESTRICTED message before I gave up trying to record for the night. Then when I turned the box back on at almost midnight everything was ok. Of course, by that time I had already missed The Sopranos, which was the only thing I really wanted to record :mad:

I let Bob Watson's office know about the problems and an engineer from TWC is supposed to call me back to talk about them. I'll let you guys know how that goes.

Originally posted by vruiz
I went through at least ten reboots after getting the COPY RESTRICTED message before I gave up trying to record for the night. Then when I turned the box back on at almost midnight everything was ok. Of course, by that time I had already missed The Sopranos, which was the only thing I really wanted to record :mad:

This may sound silly, but worth a try anyway...

For me, it's not the reboot that fixes the problem (using a JVC 30K). It's pushing the power on/off on the cable box. Make sure the JVC is ON, then just push the power button on the SA 3250... may take a couple of pushes since it doesn't always detect being pressed (bad sign when the power button has a bug!). When the 3250 comes back on (instantly) that *should* cure your problem.

Well, I think *may* is probably a more appropriate term...

-Pie

Hope someone can help, needless to say I am less than pleased. I cant help but think it is something in the settings. I tried running the advanced wizard for the setup, but when it stepped to the 720p, which my Mits does not support, the screen went all goofy and I could not see anything to lock that format out. I had to use the manual process found in this thread to regain my picture. I am currently running 16 x 9, upconvert and my HD is beautiful. My problem lies on all of the non hd channels. I honestly believe that my analog signal on this same set was much better for these channels, and this does not make sense to me. I even tried running the composite signal out to a seperate input on my Mits, and the picture was no better. The color seems reasonable, it is just very grainy. I would have thought on a digital signal I could have at least carried a 480 signal on the standard digital signal. I have yet to try the rf signal out to a rf input on my Mits. All help to all of the above dilemma is greatly appreciated.

Originally posted by Foxbat121
Grady,

Yes. On SA's web site, it posts a simpler version of seting up a fixed resolution for the box. You just need press a certain sequence of the buttons on the box to set it to whatever resolution you want without looking at your TV.

I was already aware of the process on the front of the box to recover from a non support format, but was hoping to find some way to entirely lockout the 720 format. The SA website offered nothing in this regard that I could find.

Originally posted by Grady
I would have thought on a digital signal I could have at least carried a 480 signal on the standard digital signal. All the analog channels (usually 1-99) are still analog and a larger, widescreen HDTV will only magnify the poor PQ. In most cases, these channels will look worse through the box, especially over the component connection, than they did on your previous TV. Many folks either split the incoming cable and run a direct line to the TV or use the S-Video out of the box for these channels, whichever looks better to them.

The digital channels (usually 100 and up) should have a very good PQ, though you may find that these also look better on the S-Video connection.

I now use a direct line for analog channels and a component connection for all others, even though I still have the S-Video hooked up.

Of course, a lot depends upon your components, connections, box setup, and incoming signal quality. The main thing is that just because you have an HD box with digital service doesn't mean that all channels are digital.

Originally posted by Grady
I was already aware of the process on the front of the box to recover from a non support format, but was hoping to find some way to entirely lockout the 720 format. The SA website offered nothing in this regard that I could find. When you go into setup (advanced, I think they call it), you are given the option to test each available resolution and enable/disable them based upon what your HDTV supports. The only resolutions I have enabled are 480i and 1080i even though some incoming signals are 480p and 720p. Using just the first 2 minimizes the switching of resolutions when changing from HD to non-HD channels, etc., and I could not see any difference in PQ when using 480p/720p on my Hitachi.

Originally posted by Grady
I was already aware of the process on the front of the box to recover from a non support format, but was hoping to find some way to entirely lockout the 720 format. The SA website offered nothing in this regard that I could find.

Maybe I misunderstood your message before. There are two ways to do this:

(1) SA used to post a quick resolution setup using keys on the box to set your box to a fixed resolution everytime you turn the box on.

(2) You can also use the Setup Wizard (turn the box off and press Guide and Info button together). You can step through the wizard and remove any resolution you don't want the box to output.

Originally posted by Foxbat121
Maybe I misunderstood your message before. There are two ways to do this:

(1) SA used to post a quick resolution setup using keys on the box to set your box to a fixed resolution everytime you turn the box on.

(2) You can also use the Setup Wizard (turn the box off and press Guide and Info button together). You can step through the wizard and remove any resolution you don't want the box to output.

Could not find anything on the SA website of value. The problem I had when I attempted to go through the advanced setup instead of the wizard was that it wants to display each resolution for 30 seconds or so and then you tell it wether or not you wish to keep the resolution. However, when it went to the 720, which my Mits does not support, and the screen went black with only prompt on the tube saying no signal, it never rolled back out of it. I assume it was waiting on my prompt, which I could not see what it wanted. I then had to use the manual mode found in this thread to roll back to display I could see. But, the advanced setup screen was gone. Guess I will try again and see if I can determine ahead of time what the prompt is to block out that resolution before it hits.

Regarding the poor quality on the analog signals through this box, I will attempt the s video signal to a seperate input on my Mits, or put a splitter ahead of the box and run a line to an analog input on the Mits.

Originally posted by Grady
Guess I will try again and see if I can determine ahead of time what the prompt is to block out that resolution before it hits.Yeah, that's what many folks had to do. The prompt for 720p is the same as all the others. If memory serves me, it's simply the Select key on the remote and it turns the resolution off if it's on and vice versa. I know early on a lot of Mits folks had problems with this because of the 720p.
Regarding the poor quality on the analog signals through this box, I will attempt the s video signal to a seperate input on my Mits, or put a splitter ahead of the box and run a line to an analog input on the Mits. Just don't expect too much. Like I said, the big screen magnifies a bad PQ, but a direct line is the best you can get and the S-Video may be just as good. For the most part, the only analog channels (1-99) we watch these days are HGTV, FOOD, TLC, and Discovery. Even then I tend to watch them through the box. I don't notice much difference in PQ and the box is set to pass-through so my Hitachi can do the stretching in 4:3 Expanded mode.

Originally posted by DoubleDAZ
For the most part, the only analog channels (1-99) we watch these days are HGTV, FOOD, TLC, and Discovery. Even then I tend to watch them through the box. I don't notice much difference in PQ and the box is set to pass-through so my Hitachi can do the stretching in 4:3 Expanded mode.

Same here. I want my TLC, History, HGTV. I am fortunate to get DiscoveryHD here for $4.95 a month, but feel it is well worth it. I find myself more and more just watching HD despite the lack of programming. I think we are up to 8 channels here in Oklahoma City.

Originally posted by Grady
Could not find anything on the SA website of value. The problem I had when I attempted to go through the advanced setup instead of the wizard was that it wants to display each resolution for 30 seconds or so and then you tell it wether or not you wish to keep the resolution. However, when it went to the 720, which my Mits does not support, and the screen went black with only prompt on the tube saying no signal, it never rolled back out of it. I assume it was waiting on my prompt, which I could not see what it wanted. I then had to use the manual mode found in this thread to roll back to display I could see. But, the advanced setup screen was gone. Guess I will try again and see if I can determine ahead of time what the prompt is to block out that resolution before it hits. Grady - you keep discussing the advanced setup using the wizard but did you try the remove the 720p using the front panel keys? The first post in the thread has those instructions but I copied them below. You should be able to manually reset you box then enable just the formats you want using the process below:

Instructions for Quick Settings to select output resolutions the TV accepts: Done after the box has gotten it's initial download from your MSO. These should be done using the HD outputs for true displays, but may be "falsely" viewed with SD outputs.
1) With power on, press the select button on the box and wait 2-3 seconds for the message indicator to light
2) Press "VOL-" to enter HD select resolution mode - The display will read HdSr - Times out in 20 seconds
3) Resolutions are set as follows: 480i = CH+, 480P = CH-, 720P = VOL-, 1080i = VOL+ and the display will show each resolution as the output is displayed over the HD outputs. Whichever output you select last will be the primary output when going into the setup wizard

I also have issues with audio dropouts from HBOHD to a JVC 30K. I thought it was my new (buggy) 30K causing the problem, but after reading through these posts, it looks like it could be a 3250HD issue. I didn't try using the analog audio output, but my guess is that this would have been fine.

I made some recordings from HDNET and didn't have any audio issues.

-D

Just setting up my first HT and would like some help with the following:

1. Using the 3250HD with my Hitachi 46F500 via DVI, is it safe to assume that the cable will be DVI-D?

2. Reading this thread, it looks like the DVI setup is a bit "scary" -- is this really the case?

3. Finally, I am also adding the SA Explorer 8000 DVR and it looks to me like the DVR takes a direct cable feed from the 3250 and then I can use s-video out to my AVR. Is this how it is being done by those who have both boxes?

Thanks.

1. Yes, DVI-D single link
2. It is sometimes. DVI on these thing still has a long way to get right.
3. What you need is SA8000HD version to replace the 3250HD. Non-HD version of SA8000 can not be used together with 3250HD directly from what I read. Of course, you can always split the cable to feed both boxes directly and switch the outputs from your TV.

Is it worth attempting the DVI input or should I just go to component?

Charter doesn't offer the 8000HD yet, and so it is the 8000 for now. However, they are installing both the 3250HD and the 8000 and so there must be some way to make it work. As I mentioned, the 8000 has a coax cable in and so it looks like it takes a feed from the 3250HD.

Perhaps someone else has this configuration?

Originally posted by thr61
Perhaps someone else has this configuration? The 8000 can not take a signal from an external box ... it's gotta be hooked up to cable via coax.

Two options:
1. Split cable at wall ... one feed to 3250, one to 8000
2. If the 8000 or 3250 has the RF Bypass module you can use that (it acts like the TV/VCR button on a VCR ... when in 'Bypass' mode full RF gets passed along ... when not in 'Bypass' mode you get video via channel 3).

Hmmm...

When I look at the user manual and hook up details from the SA explorer site, it clearly has a cable line in that says it is to be connected to the cable box:

SA Explorer 8000 DVR Install (http://www.scientificatlanta.com/explorerclub/getting_started/4002771B.pdf)

When I look at the 3250HD back panel diagram, it looks like a DVI-I cable is needed. My tv has DVI-D.

There are cables made to do this, but can anyone confirm that the 3250HD is in fact DVI-I?

Thanks.

thr61: I've got the 3250HD connected to a Panny CT-34WX53 via Monster DVI400 DVI-D. In my experience the PQ is much better than component on all channels -- SD, digital and HD.

Originally posted by thr61
Hmmm...

When I look at the user manual and hook up details from the SA explorer site, it clearly has a cable line in that says it is to be connected to the cable boxI see: Cable In - Connects to cable signal from cable service provider

Which means ... it needs the full cable signal from your cable company ...

Like I said above ... if your 3250 has RF Bypass (mine doesn't) then you could run coax from the 3250 to the 8000 ... or if your 8000 has RF Bypass (again, mine doesn't) then you can run coax from the 8000 to the 3250.

Otherwise, you're going to need a splitter.

Originally posted by thr61
There are cables made to do this, but can anyone confirm that the 3250HD is in fact DVI-I?The connection is DVI-I. A DVI-D or DVI-I cable will both work equally well.

But only DVI-D part is in use. So why waste money on a DVI-I cable. It requires HDCP on the TV which will only work with DVI-D signal. Make sure your TV supports HDCP.

"I've got the 3250HD connected to a Panny CT-34WX53 via Monster DVI400 DVI-D." says post 2 above.

"The connection is DVI-I. A DVI-D or DVI-I cable will both work equally well."
says post 1 above.

These cables looks different to me. Is it really true that one can use either a DVI-I OR a DVI-D?

Help!

DVI-I = DVI-D + DVI-A.

And many of use are using a DVI-D cable right now.

Thanks. I will get the DVD-D.

It is funny though that the "extra" inputs seem to be either four small squares (on the I) or a small slot (on the D)

Go figure....

Correct me if I'm wrong, but DVI-D is sufficient if you're also running optical digital audio out from the dedicated jack to a receiver capable of decoding the DD5.1 bitstream.

That has nothing to do with audio. DVI ports only deal with video. DVI-D is digital only port. DVI-I includes both digital video and analog video. HDMI is the one you think of which does include both video and audio.

Good DVI FAQ. (http://www.pacificable.com/DVI_Tutorial.htm) Also a good place to get very good, yet affordable DVI cables. The thought of giving monster $100 for a $20 cable makes me want to puke.

Should I be happy?

Took delivery of a new 3250HD box from TWC-NYC an hour ago. The DVI-D out works with my high definition LCD panel, and is shown at a native 1920x1080 with borders on top and bottom.

I had thought that HDCP would prohibit this, but it works!

Should I be concerned that the 6/1/2004 FCC date when HDCP is required will obviate this functionality?

V E R Y H A P P Y guy now, but will I be once again disappointed after June 1?

Help.

Is anyone running these two devices together? My local cableco (Charter in Worcester MA) is offering these together.

I have checked with the local HDTV thread, but have not gotten any feedback on how the two are working together.

This is a stopgap for me until the 8000HD is available.

If you are using these together, can you let me know how you like them AND, more importantly, how they are set up?

Thanks.

Originally posted by thr61
Is anyone running these two devices together?Yes.

Running them both is the exact same as running them seperately ... except that they both respond to the same remote codes which can be kindof a pain.

What exactly are you looking for?

I am glad to find someone running both...

I am primarily trying to decide about setup and interconnects, but also weighing this against returning a replaytv.

In terms of setup, it looks to me like the approach is to:

=>connect 3250HD directly to TV using DVI or componenet

=>connect 3250HD directly to AVR for audio using optical

AND THE TRICKY PART:

=>connect 3250HD to Explorer 8000 using coax cable (seems to be the only way in)

=> connect SD signal from E8000 to AVR using s-video out

=>connect E8000 to AVR audio using optical

Viewing HD WITHOUT the ability record will require selecting TV and DVI

Viewing and recording SD will use AVR switching

This seems cleaner to me than the ReplayTV approach AND it removes the remote lag one gets with replay. Plus, once the E8000HD is available, I can upgrade.

Is this your setup and experience?

Thank you again!

OK,

My panasonic PV-HD1000 gets nothing when connected to the 3250HD firwire 1394 outputs. Is it my D-VHS or is it the 3250HD box?

THR61 - why not just split the coax cable before the boxes and then treat each as a different video source? S video through AVR to TV when watching DVR and DVI direct at TV when watching HD? You still have to switch the AVR in both cases for audio. Seems pretty simple to me.

I have a 3250 and a RTV5040 with its own digital cable box (so I can watch the 3250 and record a different show. 5040 through the AVR via SVideo and 3250 to TV via DVI.

ejfiii --

That sounds reasonable. I have ordered an MX700 and so setting this up to work via the remote should make it even simpler.

I have a 5040 but am likely going to return it as I don't like the IR blaster setup and the E8000 and 3250HD integrate nicely. Plus, once the 8000HD is available, I can record HD.

Thanks again.

Tim

Hey Tim, if you can, you may want to consider changing to a MX800 over the 700. This includes RF. So what you can do is set the rf receiver to output controls for one of your boxes on one ir flasher repeater, and the other on a second. This way you can control each box completely individually of each other. I am not sure how you are otherwise going to get around that. I have an 800 and will never use any other remote. In fact, I like them so much, I became a dealer. Its just a fantastic piece of equipment.

Let me know if you want additional explanation of what I am talking about.

E. J.

Originally posted by thr61
Hmmm...

When I look at the user manual and hook up details from the SA explorer site, it clearly has a cable line in that says it is to be connected to the cable box:

SA Explorer 8000 DVR Install (http://www.scientificatlanta.com/explorerclub/getting_started/4002771B.pdf)

It doesn't say anything about connecting to a cable box. It simply says "Cable In - Connects to cable service from cable company". This box is a self contained unit, which includes all functionality. How stupid would SA be to require a separate cable box when the DVR clearly has to already have at least one tuner?

When I watch an HDTV channel on the 3250HD, the composite and S-video outputs are letterboxed with gray bars.

Is there any way to make those bars black instead of gray?

<<It doesn't say anything about connecting to a cable box. It simply says "Cable In - Connects to cable service from cable company". This box is a self contained unit, which includes all functionality. How stupid would SA be to require a separate cable box when the DVR clearly has to already have at least one tuner?>>

Agreed. But, since the 8000 doesn't support HD, my cableco is ALSO installing the 3250HD and then linking them together.

I am guessing that based on prior posts, they are splitting the signal.

From what I understand the SA8000 must connect directly to cable line because it must use its digital cable tuner to tune to the digital channels directly. My local Cox's website actually mentioned you have to install 3250HD and SA8000 box separately on two different TVs (go figure), not together.

Called Charter. They split the signal between the 2 boxes.

Originally posted by Foxbat121
From what I understand the SA8000 must connect directly to cable line because it must use its digital cable tuner to tune to the digital channels directly. My local Cox's website actually mentioned you have to install 3250HD and SA8000 box separately on two different TVs (go figure), not together. They probably said that because AFAIK the remotes/codes control both boxes and you would be hard pressed to use both boxes on the same TV without a major workaround. If one box is on and the other off, both will switch (box that is on will go off and the other will come on) when you hit Power on either remote. The same is true of most other keys, not a pretty picture. :)

Actually not that hard to solve at all. See post 459 above. An MX800, a little tin foil and tape and you are all set.

My SA 3250HD box can't seem to ever remember the settings that I select. I constantly need to reset the Picture Format to "Pass Thru". ..it switches back to "Fixed" when I turn the box off...any ideas?

Originally posted by Tiko
My SA 3250HD box can't seem to ever remember the settings that I select. I constantly need to reset the Picture Format to "Pass Thru". ..it switches back to "Fixed" when I turn the box off...any ideas?

Mine does this too. It seems to do it every night at 3:00 AM. I normally have mine set to Upconvert 1, which allows the SD channels to use 480p and the HD channels to use 1080i. Every day I have to go into the menu and change this setting back. SA must do a lousy job of testing these units, because a problem like this should never be seen by a customer. Makes you wonder if they have any beta testers at all because surely someone would have noticed this if they used the box for more than one day.

Originally posted by ejfiii
Actually not that hard to solve at all. See post 459 above. An MX800, a little tin foil and tape and you are all set. Yes, but many folks aren't going to go out an buy such a remote for $300-$500. The general populace needs to be warned about the problem before they take the units home and find out there is a conflict. Plus, your general cable installer is not going to know about such remotes or how to program them, etc. It's a lot easier to simply tell folks to use them on separate TVs in the house. Perhaps one day cable installers will become more than that and be more well-versed on HT, but for now they simply run the cable and hook up the box. IMO, anyone who expects more is simply fooling themselves.

Originally posted by illumin8
Mine does this too. It seems to do it every night at 3:00 AM. I normally have mine set to Upconvert 1, which allows the SD channels to use 480p and the HD channels to use 1080i. Every day I have to go into the menu and change this setting back. SA must do a lousy job of testing these units, because a problem like this should never be seen by a customer. Makes you wonder if they have any beta testers at all because surely someone would have noticed this if they used the box for more than one day. I suspect the cableco is sending hits down the line that is causing this reaction. Here they are still testing DVI and 1394. The settings get reset often, not just at night, though that is when it happens most.

Early in the morning is usually when they update your IPG too, so there could be something being sent with that doing the reset. They may be able to fix this in software, but I don't have the 1394 software yet to see if it is fixed in that version or not. Anyone know?

Dave, I am under no illusions that a cable installer will know anything about these remotes. People have to be smart consumers - which starts by coming here and learning.

I don't see a $400 investment in a good remote control that allows you to do what you want to do as overpaying. How much do we have invested in our HT setups? If someone is looking for a DVR, HDDVR, and HD cable, then surely they aren't hooking this stuff up to a 17 inch black and white TV in the bedroom. Basically, if you want to control two boxes by the same manufacturer in the same component stack, then you have to do something. And as far as I know, the MX800 is one of the few soultions that will allow you to do this. Ain't no free lunch in this hobby.

ejfiii,

I didn't say it was overpaying. I happen to agree with everything you've said. I was simply pointing why the cableco might tell folks to hook the units up to different TVs. The average consumer is simply not going to fork over that kind of $$, including many (most) folks here. I have quick and easy access to all my remotes, so I don't have a real need for something like an MX800, though I have been looking at them. The HD-DVRs now coming into service also minimize my needs for such a remote.

Forgive me for not reading all these posts, as there are too many to go through.

Every person that I know who has one of these boxes via TeleMedia says they will only do 1080i and cannot be set to output 720p. That means if you have a 720p display, you are forced to have this rather low quality box upconvert ESPN and ABC to 1080i, then have that signal converted a second time to 720p. This can only result in a noticeable loss in picture quality. My TeleMedia friends have said 720p stations look 480p at best through this box on a 720p display.

TeleMedia's boxes also have disabled DVI and no Firewire. The component outputs look kind of harsh. The picture quality I get via DISH Network is easily superior. I've also seen HD on a Motorola box and it looks better than via the 3250.

Of course, my only choice is TeleMedia. :(

I hear you Dave. But the fact remains that if you want to hook up two boxes to the same TV, you have to figure out a way to control them. Certainly the 800 is less than a Crestron system. ;)

BTW - seems like lots of AVSers have MX700/800 - perhaps more than you think.

Perhaps it will become a moot point once the HD DVRs are released as now you will have one box that does it all.

Originally posted by illumin8
Mine does this too. It seems to do it every night at 3:00 AM. I normally have mine set to Upconvert 1, which allows the SD channels to use 480p and the HD channels to use 1080i. Every day I have to go into the menu and change this setting back. SA must do a lousy job of testing these units, because a problem like this should never be seen by a customer. Makes you wonder if they have any beta testers at all because surely someone would have noticed this if they used the box for more than one day.

I found a few things out when testing my box at the start of this thread. Every night, my box would try to get an IPG and service update. The next day it would be sluggish and the guide would take several seconds to display, and then it would only display the name of the show, and not the description. At the same time, all my settings would reset back to default.
The REAL problem is that there is a limited amount of memory in the 3250. The memory gets shuffled around and reset during the IPG update and EOD (Entertainment On Demand) update if your system has that feature. The real fix is an update from the MSO and SA to update the memory utility in the box and the nightly downloads in the operating system for the cable co.
This helps the situation dramatically, but there is a workaround I found that helps, no matter what your cable co is using. My solution was to go into the settings and set the TIMER: Turn Off to Daily at 2:55 am. Then I set the TIMER: Wake-up to 3:05 am. If your sleep habits dictate a longer turn off period, turn it off sooner and then turn it on later, etc. Your results may vary, but this helped my guide, memory and other problems until the cable co had a new download. Even after the download, I chose to set all my boxes with the daily turn off and turn on settings and have minimized my problems with all of my boxes.

vegggas

Originally posted by vegggas
My solution was to go into the settings and set the TIMER: Turn Off to Daily at 2:55 am. Then I set the TIMER: Wake-up to 3:05 am.

This sounds like it might work as a workaround, but what if I'm watching TV at 3:00 am (I frequently am, especially on weekends)? Will the box turn off for 10 minutes then turn back on? 3:00 AM seems to be some magic time period because the screen always goes grey for a few seconds at this time.

Originally posted by illumin8
This sounds like it might work as a workaround, but what if I'm watching TV at 3:00 am (I frequently am, especially on weekends)? Will the box turn off for 10 minutes then turn back on? 3:00 AM seems to be some magic time period because the screen always goes grey for a few seconds at this time.
Yes. You are telling the box to turn off at 2:55, so it's going to turn off. There are other settings that just do weekdays, try one of those first, or just try it tonight. The problem is the amount of memory on the box. During update, if the box is on, a lot of settings and IPG data are in cache memory that has to be used if all other memory is used up. Turning off the box, writes and stores the settings in non-volatile memory until it's turned on again.

Does your IPG data only show the title and not the description, until you actually access it, and then it takes several seconds to "pull" the data? Even taking a few seconds to pull guide data is a clear sign of too much info and not enough memory.

Your Milage May Vary..., but it worked for me.

vegggas

Vegggas, I think you are on to something. When they update the IPG while the box is on, it does not download all the data and, as far as I can tell, I only get like 2 days worth of programming. If I leave the box off though, I get about 7 days worth, and I've never noticed any problems with sluggishness either way. I never noticed the timer stuff and will try that tonight so I won't have to leave the box on all the time. I'll see if doing things that way will keep the Format from being reset to Fixed all the time too.

Originally posted by Matt_Stevens
Every person that I know who has one of these boxes via TeleMedia says they will only do 1080i and cannot be set to output 720p. That may be because TeleMedia is only supplying a 1080i signal and not passing what they receive. I get 720P here in Phoenix on Cox Cable with my 3270HD (same as 3250, different face color), at least that is what my Hitachi TWX is telling me. It upconverts it to 1080i, but shows what is being received from the box.

The other thing that could be messing it up is the software they are using, SARA or Passport, though I don't know for sure, I have SARA. I was playing around with my daughter's 3250HD running Passport in NC a couple of weeks ago and I don't believe I was able to get 720p to her Sony, but I don't remember for sure. YMMV.

Originally posted by thr61
Is this your setup and experience?No

As has been noted several times on this thread ... coax needs to be split, run to each (8000 and 3250) and from that point on ... each are seperate inputs (to your AVR or TV ... whichever).

As has also been noted on this thread, the main issue when running both (8000 and 3250) is that they both respond to the exact same remote codes. While this won't cause much of a problem most of the time ... there may be instances where you are channel-surfing on the 3250 and find yourself (unknowingly) cancelling a recording on the 8000.

There are solutions to the remote codes issue ... but it should also be noted that a good universal remote is NOT in itself a solution. It doesn't matter if you're using a universal remote ... or the SciAtl remotes ... if both boxes are on and you hit 'Channel Up' ... both boxes will perform a channel up. Like I said, not usually an issue but there may be times when it is very unwanted.

I used the 'low tech' approach of manually turning one box on ... then the 'power' button on the remote would end up switching between the boxes (turning one off and the other on). More elegant solutions can be found ... but that worked for me.

Originally posted by Matt_Stevens
Forgive me for not reading all these posts, as there are too many to go through.

Every person that I know who has one of these boxes via TeleMedia says they will only do 1080i and cannot be set to output 720p. That means if you have a 720p display, you are forced to have this rather low quality box upconvert ESPN and ABC to 1080i, then have that signal converted a second time to 720p. This can only result in a noticeable loss in picture quality. My TeleMedia friends have said 720p stations look 480p at best through this box on a 720p display.


Matt,

I am able to switch between 480p, 720p, and 1080i on the Quick settings menu on my box just by using the remote. It is very quick and easy to do. I am also on Tele-Media/Adelphia with a 3250HD box.

Originally posted by Erik Garci
When I watch an HDTV channel on the 3250HD, the composite and S-video outputs are letterboxed with gray bars.

Is there any way to make those bars black instead of gray?

Yes. To change the color of the side bars, go into the General Settings menu (press the Menu button twice). Highlight "Set: TV Borders" in the Preference column. You have 3 choices: light, medium, and dark. The dark setting changes the side bars to black. The other two settings turn the bars shades of gray.

Originally posted by BillN96
Yes. In the settings there is a Background Color setting (Later today I will post the exact name). It is a little deceiving because the options are "Light", "Medium", and "Dark". The "dark" setting makes those bars black. The other two settings turn the bars gray and white respectively.
My 3250HD does not have that setting. It does not appear in the list after I press "Settings" and then press "A" for more settings. Perhaps mine uses a different version of the software.

Originally posted by Erik Garci
Perhaps mine uses a different version of the software. It's not only a different version, it's different software altogether, it's Passport whereas the other is SARA. :)

Audio dropouts on the 3250:

Last night watching West Wing I noticed audio dropouts every 5 minutes or so: toggling between Narrow/wide did not help

But the next menu gives you a choice of dolby digital or 'other': the 'other' setting still provides a digital audio output with no dropouts

Originally posted by BillN96
Yes. In the settings there is a Background Color setting (Later today I will post the exact name). It is a little deceiving because the options are "Light", "Medium", and "Dark". The "dark" setting makes those bars black. The other two settings turn the bars gray and white respectively. I believe the setting is called "TV Background". You get to it by pressing the setting button twice and it should be just above the "Picture Format" settings. Besides changing the side bar colors, it will also set the color of the screen between channel changes.

Has anyone observed his 3250HD changing output mode mysteriously? I've mine set for Passthrough, but every couple of days it's switching to fixed. The STB is running SARA 1.52.6.1. Checking the box's uptime doesn't indicate a reboot happening. Ideas?

3250HD running passport in New York city does not have the passthrough mode(s) and cannot change border colors. FWIW!

Paul



Originally posted by courier72
Has anyone observed his 3250HD changing output mode mysteriously? I've mine set for Passthrough, but every couple of days it's switching to fixed. The STB is running SARA 1.52.6.1. Checking the box's uptime doesn't indicate a reboot happening. Ideas?

Originally posted by courier72
Has anyone observed his 3250HD changing output mode mysteriously? I've mine set for Passthrough, but every couple of days it's switching to fixed. The STB is running SARA 1.52.6.1. Checking the box's uptime doesn't indicate a reboot happening. Ideas? Yes, it happens often depending where you are and what the cableco is doing. For the past week or so it was happening every night, but it has been stable the past 3 days now.

We have not been able to find any real clues as to what specifically causes it, but we suspect the cableco is testing things and sending signals, perhaps with the IPG data, that ends up resetting the Picture Format to 'Fixed'. They could also be doing minor tweaking of the SARA software that causes it to reset without actually loading a new version. It also seems to happen at different times throughout the Metro Phoenix area, but that could be because they schedule things by area. We don't believe there is anything inherently wrong with the boxes.

I've simply become accustomed to checking it each morning when I get up and resetting it if needed. It's a pain, but it's not that big a deal and everything else seems to be working oaky. For a while, it would happen one or more times during the day while you were watching something as it changed to/from commercials. I guess things could be worse.

I simply switched to DVI port because I can't live with the non-passthrough mode which got reset almost daily. I can live with a few resets (by switching between SD and HD channels) a day to make DVI work correctly:) Since AutoDVI is the default setting, it doesn't matter how they reset it.

I have been trying to read and search through this thread, but haven't found exactly what I was looking for.

Just got the SA3250 from Comcast and my DVI-D Dual link cable will be here by the weekend. Before hooking it up I wanted to see if there were any specific tips and directions I should follow given this particular set (namely a 760p display).

Any directions and/or links would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Zebras23

I have been cooperating with Cox in Fairfax Co., Virginia as a beta tester for them to get the 1394 ports fully operational on the SA3250HD set top boxes. I also had a call from the Cox corporate engineer in Atlanta this morning concerning the beta testing. I just got the new SA firmware (via a download from Cox) today and I can report full success. Using my JVC 40K D-VHS I can now record HBO, NBC, ABC and CBS (those are the only HD channels I currently subscribe to with Cox). However, I have no reason to believe there would be any problem with any of the other Cox Fairfax HD channels when using SA3250's new firmware. Currently Cox has set the broadcast channels (NBC, CBS and ABC) to "copy freely. Also Showtime is set to "Copy freely" while HBO is set to "copy once". I would expect only HD pay-per-view programs to be set to "copy never."

Ron Jones
www.dtvmax.com

Ron,

You are connecting the 40K directly to your 3250HD through the 1394, right?

I just caved in and order one 40K myself, but my 3250HD box is under TWC's passport system. Is Cox passprt as well?

Paul



Originally posted by Ron Jones
I have been cooperating with Cox in Fairfax Co., Virginia as a beta tester for them to get the 1394 ports fully operational on the SA3250HD set top boxes. I also had a call from the Cox corporate engineer in Atlanta this morning concerning the beta testing. I just got the new SA firmware (via a download from Cox) today and I can report full success. Using my JVC 40K D-VHS I can now record HBO, NBC, ABC and CBS (those are the only HD channels I currently subscribe to with Cox). However, I have no reason to believe there would be any problem with any of the other Cox Fairfax HD channels when using SA3250's new firmware. Currently Cox has set the broadcast channels (NBC, CBS and ABC) to "copy freely. Also Showtime is set to "Copy freely" while HBO is set to "copy once". I would expect only HD pay-per-view programs to be set to "copy never."

Ron Jones
www.dtvmax.com

Originally posted by Paul Chiu
Is Cox passprt as well?Cox Fairfax = SARA (not Passport)

PS: Ron ... thanks! (from a fellow Cox Fairfax customer who didn't have time to go through this with them)

Firewire success: Comcast, Eatontown, NJ

My Sony KLV32XBR LCD Now recognizes my S/A 3250HD via iLink!!

Picture/Sound appear: menus do not

Very Good News:)

Smilp v4.1.1.7
SARA v1.56.4.1

I have been using my 3250 HD via DVI connected to my Hitachi 46F500 HDTV.

I set it up several weeks ago and the DVI connection worked right out of the box and did so through last night.

However, tonight, turning on Fox HD, I received an error saying that my TV does not support HDCP and I need to use component. I know, for a fact, that my set is HDCP compliant. And of course, it worked fine last night.

Is this a common error that occurs with this box? I am using Charter and will post to that thread as well, but am interested in experiences, and hopefully a fix, for this problem.

I did read through this thread and have not been able to fix the problem by going to an SD channel (I still get a DVI error) and I cannot seem to access the advanced set up menu. I tried the instructions about turning the box off and then on and then hitting guide and info together, but no luck.

I (sigh) will likely need to call Charter as the HD via DVI worked last night and stopped tonight.

well im glad im not the only one who is finally seeing this problem ive been going through for the past 2 months ever since they updated the frimware to 1.52.6.1 and the HDCP client. This box has caused more issues than it can handle. I think im going to fwd this entire thread to my General Manager and see what he thinks. Ive tried many of times to get people on a lower level to see what Im seeing but to no avail. So when I get word, I will post to you guys.

thr61,

Unplug the STB power and let it reboot. Switching to SD channel is only useful when you see snow screen instead of HDCP alert message. If the Guide+Info button trick doesn't do anything to your box, you're probably running different software in the box, i.e. Passport.

I have the PT-50LC13 and I just got the box installed today. The installer hooked it up saw that HDCP error and said their was nothing I could do but use other cables as my TV was not HDCP complient. Well after he left I looked it up and it is. I unpluged it and truned it back on, that worked but after I turned it off it did it again. I'll read through the thread to see about that Guide+Info trick.

Not a good start.

Newmie

Trying to get to the bottom of a 3250HD IEEE 1394 problem. Anyone that can help with this, please do. If you look around, you will find my track record on getting problems fixed with 3250HD units is pretty good. It will help us all.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=406622

Thanks

Originally posted by courier72
STB is running SARA 1.52.6.1.

Courier72: what's the date code on your SARA 1.52.6.1? And which MSO are you on?

Ron Jones : what's the date code on your SARA 1.52.5.1?