Thanks, I really appreciate the information.

Has anyone heard rumblings of new HD stations being added?

There's been rumblings about TNT and I would expect they'll get ESPN2 sometime in the not too distant future. Comcast is terrible about adding new channels, I have had HD for about 2 years now and all they added was discovery, fox(which should have been there in the first place, and the BS 725 "HD special events" channel. The lineup of the major networks, FSNHD, the INHD channels, discover, and the major movie networks is pretty nice. By far my biggest complaint is that they have yet to add lots of on demand HDTV movies. This would be a fantastic service and I'd use it all the time. I'd also obviously like TNT, espn2, and whatever else I'm missing. They claim to be "the leader in HDTV" which is a huge joke.

I'd love it if they would add TNT-HD especially with the basketball season just starting. I saw the highlights from TNT-HD yesterday on Sportcenter and it looked really good.

As for ESPN2HD, I'm not in too much of a hurry, but I hope they add it before the baseball season starts next April.

I'd like ESPN-HD before the college football bowl season. In, fact I'd like it now, while we are still in the college football season.

Hi, does anyone know if Comcast in the SF area on IRC or HRC frequency? I guess I just need a confirmation from someone as I was able to program my LC-26D6U to pick up Digital channels when setting the cable type to IRC, but can't locate any when setting it to HRC. However, I thought Comcast uses HRC.

Also, with IRC I was able to pick up even radio channels (no image of course). Also, on channel 9.4 the TV froze and nothing would function, I had to unplug it to power it off. I am wondering any body out there had similar experiences. Could it be the signal jammed the TV?

Went downstairs last night to watch the West Wing at about 9pm (which I have set on Series Record - first runs only) and was surprised to find that it didn't show up in my list of recorded DVR programs. Checked the TV listings in the SF paper which confirmed that it was supposed to have been a new episode. This is the first time it's happened to me, i.e., the DVR failed to record a program it was supposed to. Meanwhile, Rome, which was also set on Series Record, came in just fine. Any clues as to what happened? Should I revert back to weekly, manual programming? Thanks.

I specifically asked, "What channels are included in the $5 HDTV package?"
However, those asterisks seem to imply that having Limited Basic Cable along with a HD STB (and hopefully a CableCARD) should allow you to receive INHD, INHD2, and Discovery HD Theater. Of course, maybe their CSRs are just as confused as we are.

I just picked up an HD tuner from Comcast in Fremont today... was told I'll only get 6 HD channels with limited basic cable (702-709). I'll be hooking it up this evening and will report what I find!

Comcast replaced my original 6412 from January of this year with a Phase III box on Friday. The analog picture now looks digital. Just awesome. I was very happy. Utill I noticed I was missing some channels. 17 to be exact. I have the Digital Silver package plus standard cable and am considered by Comcast to be a "grandfathered" AT&T customer. The channels I am missing include:
122 Toon Disney
143 MTV Jams
180 NFL Network
182 Fine Living
201 Discovery Home
204 DIY
216 Nick Too
222 Fit TV
271 Disc Times
274 Military Channel
265 Biograghy
276 History International
406 Outdoor
471 VH1 Country
472 MTV Hits
484 GAC
504 LMN

The dispute I am having with Comcast is they claim I should have not been getting those channels since I upgraded to the HD DVR box. They said since I changed my "technology" (meaning the box) and am a grandfathered AT&T customer those channels go away I explained that when I called and ordered the DVR in January, no one ever said I would be getting less programming. If they stated that then, then I may have just stayed with my TIVO and utilized an OTA. They were very accomodating in getting a 6412 to me quickly in January. Bottom line is they they want all of us "grandfathered" AT&T people to go away. I pay $92.19 a month and that includes HBO and Starz. I spoke to a couple CSR's that were the absolute bottom of the barrel. They were trying to tell me that this box will not get those channels anyhow. "We have a new signal and your box will not understand it". After that call, my temples practicall exploded. Do you have any suggestions on how I should approach this. Besides cancelling and getting a DISH? Thanks in advance.

Speaking of OnDemand, the new Showtime drama, Sleeper Cell that airs in Dec will have the first 2 episodes available through OnDemand sometime in Nov. I can't find the original article that mentions the OnDemand viewing so anyone who is interested will have to do some searching or check the OnDemand schedule, if there is such a thing.

Of course, there is no OnDemand or Showtime-HD in many Comcast systems in the bay area so this would only pertain to you lucky folks who get both.

http://www.sho.com/site/announcements/050914sleeper.do
Showtime - Announcements

Speaking about Premium channels, Comcast is giving me the Digital Silver Package at a special rate for 6 months but they used Starz as the placeholder for the Premium channel. For HD and in general, is there a big difference between HBO, Showtime and Starz since I don't watch them so could use some input.

Went downstairs last night to watch the West Wing at about 9pm (which I have set on Series Record - first runs only) and was surprised to find that it didn't show up in my list of recorded DVR programs. Checked the TV listings in the SF paper which confirmed that it was supposed to have been a new episode. This is the first time it's happened to me, i.e., the DVR failed to record a program it was supposed to. Meanwhile, Rome, which was also set on Series Record, came in just fine. Any clues as to what happened? Should I revert back to weekly, manual programming? Thanks.
Had the same thing happen last week. Did not record Close To Home or Boston Legal. Both set up as series recordings. I was watching the WS game and expected it to pop up the switch channel message, never happened and I forgot about it while watching the game. I wasn't happy, when I finally started to trust this box it turns out that I still have to make a backup on the DirecTV HD-TiVo unit, as it's never failed.

I have also seen some weird icons in the guide for programs that have been set to record. The first red circle in the 3-4 circles that indicate series recording has had a line through it, even though it was a new ep and there were no conflicts.

My guess is that the FOX signal disabled the record function to keep you watching the lowest rated series games ever aired. :p :D

In anycase, this box is going to have to regain my trust again...ridiculous, it's a piece of electronics...TiVo has had it right for years.

Speaking about Premium channels, Comcast is giving me the Digital Silver Package at a special rate for 6 months but they used Starz as the placeholder for the Premium channel. For HD and in general, is there a big difference between HBO, Showtime and Starz since I don't watch them so could use some input.
Well, HBO is very lax about showing their movies in OAR if that's important to you. But they do have probably the best original series, Rome, Deadwood, The Wire and a few others.

Showtime, Cinemax and Starz I believe do movies OAR. Showtime has a few good series, Huff and Weeds, the previously mentioned Sleeper Cell and there's the L Word which is good TV although the subject matter may not appeal to all.

If it's movies, I would go for Cinemax or Starz. If it's series, I would go for HBO or Showtime. It's really a matter of personal choice. PQ can and has been excellent on any given channel but they do have their moments.

Is everybody NOT receiving MNF in hd tonight?

I am also not getting MNF in HD!

MNF looks fine, 7:05pm, peninsula

I'd love it if they would add TNT-HD especially with the basketball season just starting. I saw the highlights from TNT-HD yesterday on Sportcenter and it looked really good.

As for ESPN2HD, I'm not in too much of a hurry, but I hope they add it before the baseball season starts next April.

According to the Comcast.com website, TNT is to be available in November. In the comcast.com HD section, they say TNT HD in November for promoting the TNT NBA Thursdays. Here is a link: http://comcast.p.delivery.net/m/p/com/mic/HD_Index.asp

According to the Comcast.com website, TNT is to be available in November. In the comcast.com HD section, they say TNT HD in November for promoting the TNT NBA Thursdays. Here is a link: http://comcast.p.delivery.net/m/p/com/mic/HD_Index.asp
That's undoubtedly for areas that already have TNT-HD. The west coast, with a few exceptions, seems to be devoid of Comcast systems that carry TNT-HD. Comcast has had TNT-HD for more than 9 mos or so IIRC.

Phase 3 denied:

I attempted to exchange my box to a shiny new Phase 3 at the Foster City Office and was told that they do not have those there. They offered to call me when they arrive, but I won't hold my breath.

Does anyone know which offices have the Phase 3?

Thanks

Had the same thing happen last week. Did not record Close To Home or Boston Legal. Both set up as series recordings. I was watching the WS game and expected it to pop up the switch channel message, never happened and I forgot about it while watching the game. I wasn't happy, when I finally started to trust this box it turns out that I still have to make a backup on the DirecTV HD-TiVo unit, as it's never failed.

I have also seen some weird icons in the guide for programs that have been set to record. The first red circle in the 3-4 circles that indicate series recording has had a line through it, even though it was a new ep and there were no conflicts.


I have this same issue showing again for this Tuesday night and don't understand what the problem is unless a 9-10 show, "House" is running longer than the 60 mins the guide indicates and somehow the 6412 knows this. Although last week it was a different channel as the WS was on.

Anybody else see this? If possible try setting up CiC, BL, House and Closer To Home and see if Close To Home has a red circle with a line through it.

I suspect that if the 6412 allowed start times later than the guide indicated start time the problem may be resolved. Maybe I could try a manual record...

Well, setting a manual record for 10:01 to 11:00 for Close To Home did the trick, it accepted that. The weird thing is, if I cancel House and try and setup Close To Home as a series or regular single record, it still wouldn't take it. Maybe a bug in the guide data for that 10pm slot..or that particular show..who knows..

I got my Phase 3 box from the Burlingame office and they were still just testing them about 3 weeks ago....hot off the press apparently.

Phase 3 denied:

I attempted to exchange my box to a shiny new Phase 3 at the Foster City Office and was told that they do not have those there. They offered to call me when they arrive, but I won't hold my breath.

Does anyone know which offices have the Phase 3?

Thanks

Picked mine up at the Berkeley store on Adeline St.

I got mine at the Rohnert Park office.

Had the same thing happen last week. Did not record Close To Home or Boston Legal. Both set up as series recordings. I was watching the WS game and expected it to pop up the switch channel message, never happened and I forgot about it while watching the game. I wasn't happy, when I finally started to trust this box it turns out that I still have to make a backup on the DirecTV HD-TiVo unit, as it's never failed.

I have also seen some weird icons in the guide for programs that have been set to record. The first red circle in the 3-4 circles that indicate series recording has had a line through it, even though it was a new ep and there were no conflicts.

My guess is that the FOX signal disabled the record function to keep you watching the lowest rated series games ever aired. :p :D

In anycase, this box is going to have to regain my trust again...ridiculous, it's a piece of electronics...TiVo has had it right for years.

Well that news isn't so good. I ran a search yesterday across all forums and saw that there were some folks in another part of the country using a different box and cable provider, but who had almost identical problems to me. They said it was the bi-annual time change that throws things off with respect to the scheduling of series recordings, and suggested to always check the recordings on those two days of the year. I figured that's what I had experienced, but if you had the same problems last weekend, then it looks like from here on out, I'll be double checking the recordings to see if they're actually scheduled, assuming I'm home to do so, that is.

Well, HBO is very lax about showing their movies in OAR if that's important to you. But they do have probably the best original series, Rome, Deadwood, The Wire and a few others.

Showtime, Cinemax and Starz I believe do movies OAR. Showtime has a few good series, Huff and Weeds, the previously mentioned Sleeper Cell and there's the L Word which is good TV although the subject matter may not appeal to all.

If it's movies, I would go for Cinemax or Starz. If it's series, I would go for HBO or Showtime. It's really a matter of personal choice. PQ can and has been excellent on any given channel but they do have their moments.

Interesting... Thanks for the input though.... I know it has to do with personal choice. I just didn't know how they compared with each other since it seems like all the stuff people mentioned here are on HBO like Six Feet Under, Sapranos and some others. The only thing I remember from Showtime was one of my friends talking about watching Red Shoe Diaries about 10 years ago. How are the movies on HBO or Showtime though?

P.S. Does anyone know if the 30 sec skip still works on the Phase III box?

My 30 second skip still works with my Phase III box.

Quick question on bay area comcast service. If I want to add a splitter, can I use one of the plain Jane ones (5-500 mhz I think), or do I have to use a special one? I want to do one run straight to the TV since my wife doesn't like using the HD comcast box ;).

OR, I just thought of another option. Can I bring the cable directly to the tv, then run coax from the loop-out port to the cable box? I'm going HD using DVI and optical from the comcast Motorola box, but want to sometimes use the TV alone.

Interesting... Thanks for the input though.... I know it has to do with personal choice. I just didn't know how they compared with each other since it seems like all the stuff people mentioned here are on HBO like Six Feet Under, Sapranos and some others. The only thing I remember from Showtime was one of my friends talking about watching Red Shoe Diaries about 10 years ago. How are the movies on HBO or Showtime though?

P.S. Does anyone know if the 30 sec skip still works on the Phase III box?
Again, that's really personal choice on who has the better movies.

http://www.hbo.com/premieres/index.shtml?ntrack_para1=topnav3
HBO.com: Movie Premieres

http://www.sho.com/site/movies/hh.do
Showtime - Movies - Hollywood Hits

If I had to choose one out of the four, I would go with HBO. Although, there are times during the year I would prefer Showtime, but that's just me.
(Of course I don't get that choice as we don't even have Showtime-HD in Santa Rosa.. :rolleyes: )

JonDotCom: You can pick up the cable splitter from you local COMCAST office. Split the cable 'out of the wall' into 2 parts, one straight to the tv ANT1, say, and the other to the stb.

You need a 1,000mhz (1Ghz) splitter for digital cable.

MNF: was not in HD for the first few mins here. Comcast asleep at the switch again.

HBO vs. - if it's any help, I'm getting rid of HBO. I've had it for about a year now, and I can only tell you this, the movies are OK, though a lot of them have bad macroblocking (they compress the signal). As for the "original" shows - I haven't seen one that I could stand to watch. But then I don't really watch "dramas" or the like, on any channel. Every time I look at the guide, it seems like there's some crappy show on HBO, and a couple of good movies that I WOULD watch on Showtime (or Max or Starz etc...)

Though if you want to watch their "original" shows, and if they got rid of the macroblocking, HBO would be ok.

As far as HD movies, I'm hoping HD-DVD (or Blu-ray, whatever) will come out next year and I can pick up my Netflix subscription again. =)

MNF: was not in HD for the first few mins here. Comcast asleep at the switch again.


That wasn't a Comcast issue, it was screwed up all over the country. MNF initiated a new intro piece and apparently it wasn't ready for prime-time.

Well that news isn't so good. I ran a search yesterday across all forums and saw that there were some folks in another part of the country using a different box and cable provider, but who had almost identical problems to me. They said it was the bi-annual time change that throws things off with respect to the scheduling of series recordings, and suggested to always check the recordings on those two days of the year. I figured that's what I had experienced, but if you had the same problems last weekend, then it looks like from here on out, I'll be double checking the recordings to see if they're actually scheduled, assuming I'm home to do so, that is.
Yeah, it's odd for sure. The box acts as if there is only one tuner when trying to set up a recording normally. When I did manual, it took, otherwise it said there was a conflict with BL even though I was only setting up recordings for the 2 shows in that time period.

I've had it for about a year now, and I can only tell you this, the movies are OK, though a lot of them have bad macroblocking (they compress the signal). As for the "original" shows - I haven't seen one that I could stand to watch. But then I don't really watch "dramas" or the like, on any channel.

The macroblocking is due to low bitrate. They're sending it out over the Sat. with low bitrate and at our end, we get macroblock city. Just check out any movie with lots of motion (driving rain (daredevil), flickering lights (matrix reloaded), etc.) and you get an unwatchable film. I've complained many times and it does no good. No reply. No nothing from HBO.

Best,
jeff

bobby94928, thanks for confirming that the 30 sec skip still works on Phase III since I rememeber reading in the Moto 6412 with iGuide thread someone saying
it was disabled in the Phase III boxes with newer firmware.

JonDotCom, you need a splitter that's 5Mhz-1000Mhz.

As for the other option, it might or might not work depending on if the loop-out allows 2 way communications.

I have a Mitsubishi HSU-80 SVHS VCR which is connected like this...

Cable from wall goes to input A
Cable Box loop output goes to DCT6412
Input B is the cable from the 6412's RF output which I used a RF Demodulator

so on my VCR, if I choose input A, then anything behind my VCR would get the wall signal. If I choose input B, then the signal hits the 6412 as well as things behind the VCR.

Again, that's really personal choice on who has the better movies.

http://www.hbo.com/premieres/index.shtml?ntrack_para1=topnav3
HBO.com: Movie Premieres

http://www.sho.com/site/movies/hh.do
Showtime - Movies - Hollywood Hits

If I had to choose one out of the four, I would go with HBO. Although, there are times during the year I would prefer Showtime, but that's just me.
(Of course I don't get that choice as we don't even have Showtime-HD in Santa Rosa.. :rolleyes: )

Yeah, I know it's a personal choice. It seems like they are all good. I did the promo for HBO last year and the one for Showtime before that. It seems like one channel is better than the other one depending on which month it is...

Any idea why the Motorola DCT6200/2005 DVI connection would only work for about 10 seconds? Anyone else using this box and the DVI connection?

When I picked it up, the lady at comcast said she wasn't shure the dvi port was supported.

Maybe your TV doesn't have HDCP.

Only thing you can try is turn on the TV first, then the box. Also your TV must have HDCP, but most do, if it was made in the last 2 years or so.

Otherwise, return the box, yes DVI is supposed to work.

When I picked it up, the lady at comcast said she wasn't shure the dvi port was supported.

The office people are instructed to say that; this means only that they do not have DVI (or HDMI) cables to give you. Yes, the DVI (and HDMI on phase 3) do work.

Only thing you can try is turn on the TV first, then the box. Also your TV must have HDCP, but most do, if it was made in the last 2 years or so.

Otherwise, return the box, yes DVI is supposed to work.

Yes, in the product specs, it says "(HDCP)" next to DVI (monitorlink) in the product specs.

There is also a "monitorlink control port (RS232C) next to the dvi input... I wonder if that's some proprietary mitsubishi dvi vodoo thing???

Yes, in the product specs, it says "(HDCP)" next to DVI (monitorlink) in the product specs.

There is also a "monitorlink control port (RS232C) next to the dvi input... I wonder if that's some proprietary mitsubishi dvi vodoo thing???

dunno. on my SHarp, the RS232 allows you to control the tv...it duplicates some remote functions as well as doing some other things like direct input selection, etc. probably meant for use by a service tech?

Sharp LC owners, have you experienced tv freeze up on some digital channels? I was switching channels, and it happened to me about 4 times now. One time I was on this one channel, suddent the picture disappeered and a error message of "No Broadcast now" showed up. After that, I can't change channel, nor can I turn off the tv. Is this something wrong with the TV, or with the cable connection? I use a RG59 cable.

Well, missed Bladerunner on HDnet, but, it's playing soon on INHD2. Now that all but the locals are encrypted, have people successfully recorded off Firewire the INHDs?

Well, missed Bladerunner on HDnet, but, it's playing soon on INHD2. Now that all but the locals are encrypted, have people successfully recorded off Firewire the INHDs?

Those channels have been encrypted in Sacramento for quite some time, and no problem recording via firewire to a Mits DVHS deck.

Maybe I'm going crazy, but I swear that HDTV programming with my new setup looks little if any better than standard definition TV. Am I simply expecting too much?

I just bought a Samsung TX-R2678WH 26-inch 16:9 tube HDTV, and connected it to the Comcast-provided Motorola HDTV receiver box. I'm not sure of the receiver's model number, but it's a receiver only and not a DVR. It might be the Moto DCT5100.

The receiver is connected to the TV by component video cables. I have configured the receiver to output a 720p signal, although I also tried setting it to 1080i and I can't really see any difference.

HDTV programming such as prime-time network shows, KQED-HD, or INHD looks really nice. The trouble is, so does standard-definition on the Science Channel or National Geographic. Either way, I get a nice solid, colorful, clear picture. Maybe there's some more detail on the HD programs, but it's not obvious. My wife and I did a test where we repeatedly swtiched back and forth between a HD broadcast of Pirates of the Caribbean and some random show on G4 TV, and the difference was minimal. In fact my wife was hard-pressed to tell which was the HD channel and which was standard definition, since I hadn't told her beforehand. We've repeated the experiment with several other channels and programs too.

I can think of a few possible explanations:
- Motorola receiver degrades HD output to near standard-definition quality?
- component video cables degrade the picture?
- I need a better TV because this Samsung stinks?
- I need a larger TV because you can't appreciate HD on a 26" inch screen?
- I need new eyes?
- I'm simply expecting too much?

Help!

You need a larger TV. Most analog SD (assuming decent signal) looks pretty good on anything 32" and less especially CRTs.

Maybe I'm going crazy, but I swear that HDTV programming with my new setup looks little if any better than standard definition TV. Am I simply expecting too much?

I just bought a Samsung TX-R2678WH 26-inch 16:9 tube HDTV, and connected it to the Comcast-provided Motorola HDTV receiver box. I'm not sure of the receiver's model number, but it's a receiver only and not a DVR. It might be the Moto DCT5100.

The receiver is connected to the TV by component video cables. I have configured the receiver to output a 720p signal, although I also tried setting it to 1080i and I can't really see any difference.

HDTV programming such as prime-time network shows, KQED-HD, or INHD looks really nice. The trouble is, so does standard-definition on the Science Channel or National Geographic. Either way, I get a nice solid, colorful, clear picture. Maybe there's some more detail on the HD programs, but it's not obvious. My wife and I did a test where we repeatedly swtiched back and forth between a HD broadcast of Pirates of the Caribbean and some random show on G4 TV, and the difference was minimal. In fact my wife was hard-pressed to tell which was the HD channel and which was standard definition, since I hadn't told her beforehand. We've repeated the experiment with several other channels and programs too.

I can think of a few possible explanations:
- Motorola receiver degrades HD output to near standard-definition quality?
- component video cables degrade the picture?
- I need a better TV because this Samsung stinks?
- I need a larger TV because you can't appreciate HD on a 26" inch screen?
- I need new eyes?
- I'm simply expecting too much?

Help!

Add to your list the most probably answer:
- I need to watch my 26" set from 4 feet away to see the increased resoluton?

Also, remember that most of the HD movies seem to be just standard definition movies that have been upshifted to HD ... so they will not show any more detail. But, the real 1080i and 720p material should look much, much better than any SD.

Well, missed Bladerunner on HDnet, but, it's playing soon on INHD2. Now that all but the locals are encrypted, have people successfully recorded off Firewire the INHDs?
From what I understand, INHD crops their movies to the 1:78 16x9 HD standard. Blade Runner was released in 2:35 and was shown on HDNet in the proper OAR.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=598812
Bladerunner on INHD2 on 11/12 - AVS Forum

You need a larger TV. Most analog SD (assuming decent signal) looks pretty good on anything 32" and less especially CRTs.

2nd that. You need a bigger TV to notice the difference.

HDTV looks real and pixel-free if you have a great TV. I'm using a sub-$500 42" CRT at 1080i and I love it.

2nd that. You need a bigger TV to notice the difference.

HDTV looks real and pixel-free if you have a great TV. I'm using a sub-$500 42" CRT at 1080i and I love it.
Care to share the name of that sub-$500 CRT set. I'm looking for a new set for the guest bedroom, heck, for that price I'd get one for the master bedroom too. :)

Laters,
Mikef5

yeah, a HDTV CRT for less than $500 is too good to pass.

42" CRT, is that a typo? i thought the biggest one made was the Sony 40" which is now discontinued?

very curious...

42" CRT would be RPTV (rear projection)

If you have a CRT (direct or RPTV) use 1080i output from the cable box, since that's the "native" rez of the set.

It should look worlds better, but you might need to get up close with a small TV, and of course make sure you're actually watching HD and not just DTV. About 80% of what they have on the local channels (702-707) is not HD, just upconverted DTV. Try watching Discovery HD (722?) or the INHD (719-720) you should be able to see the difference (assuming you're actually using HD output, DVI or component and -NOT- s-video which is NOT HD.)

INHD usually plays movies in OAR. I know I've seen a few 2.35 movies on it. When's Blade Runner on? I hope it's a new transfer, because the DVD tranfer is abysmal...

INHD usually plays movies in OAR. I know I've seen a few 2.35 movies on it. When's Blade Runner on? I hope it's a new transfer, because the DVD tranfer is abysmal...
INHD will probably use the same transfer HDNet used and it was excellent given the film is over 20 yrs old. Much, much better than the DVD, which is garbage by today's standards. With the film being dark in nature to begin with, the HDNet showing was amazing considering. Hopefully they won't crop it to 1:78.

Don't know when it's on, don't get INHD...

BTW, in Nov HDNet has Bullitt in HD. :) :) :)

Blade Runner will be on INHD2 on Nov 12 6PM PST and Nov 15 7PM PST.

http://inhd.com/product.jsp?prodId=37515&mp=cb2

Thanks for the replies... it seems that I really need a larger set than 26" to see a big difference with a HD signal. Maybe I need a bigger house too, since it's about 8 feet from the TV to the sofa. I think a big screen TV in a room that size would be too much.

If you have a CRT (direct or RPTV) use 1080i output from the cable box, since that's the "native" rez of the set.

How do you determine that? My Samsung CRT supposedly has 800 scan lines, according to the specs. Wouldn't 720p more closely match the set's capabilities, and result in less scaling going on?

Thanks for the replies... it seems that I really need a larger set than 26" to see a big difference with a HD signal. Maybe I need a bigger house too, since it's about 8 feet from the TV to the sofa. I think a big screen TV in a room that size would be too much.


How do you determine that? My Samsung CRT supposedly has 800 scan lines, according to the specs. Wouldn't 720p more closely match the set's capabilities, and result in less scaling going on?

Mystery solved. HD material comes in two flavors 720p (1280x720) and 1080i (1920x1080). Standard SD material is (720x480). If your TV can only resolve 800 lines ... well, I think you see where I am going with this ... all material is going to look pretty close to SD.

But, to answer your question. Assuming you have a Motorola HD STB. Turn it off. Then walk over and press the MENU button on the actual box (don't use the remote). The setup screen should appear on your TV ... set aspect (16:9 or 4:3) depending on the aspect of your TV, set resolution (1080i, 720p, 480p, 480i) based on what your TV input will accept for HD (1080i probably ... check your manual), set 4:3 override to 480i (but, come back later and experiment with it). Now hit power, then power again and rerun your tests.

Standard SD material is (720x480).
Actually, most of Comcast digital SD stuff is 528x480i.

does using rg59 vs rg6 cables make any difference at all for comcast cable?

Most of my runs are RG59 and my digital service works just fine. If you are adding new cable, get RG6.

Actually, most of Comcast digital SD stuff is 528x480i.


Yeah it would be nice if they were 720x480i....what a joke

Mystery solved. HD material comes in two flavors 720p (1280x720) and 1080i (1920x1080). Standard SD material is (720x480). If your TV can only resolve 800 lines ... well, I think you see where I am going with this ... all material is going to look pretty close to SD.

Hm, I thought 800 lines was pretty good, actually. Most of the larger LCD and plasma sets I've looked at have a native resolution of 1366 x 768 or less. In fact I can't think if I've seen any sets that actually have 1080 lines. So with 800 lines, I would think that my little Samsung would resolve as sharper or sharper a picture than the larger 1366x768 sets.

Hm, I thought 800 lines was pretty good, actually. Most of the larger LCD and plasma sets I've looked at have a native resolution of 1366 x 768 or less. In fact I can't think if I've seen any sets that actually have 1080 lines. So with 800 lines, I would think that my little Samsung would resolve as sharper or sharper a picture than the larger 1366x768 sets.

I think you're confusing the horizontal and vertical resolution. I looked at this set early in the year and was turned off by direct comparisons to LCD screens. Samsung's claim of even 800 lines is dubious. There is some good info here:
http://www.highdefforum.com/archive/index.php/t-8047.html

curious, does the West Wing sound "robotic" to anyone else? Only on the hidef channel tho.. on analog it sounds fine.

curious, does the West Wing sound "robotic" to anyone else? Only on the hidef channel tho.. on analog it sounds fine.

Interesting. i was going to post about West Wing. i didn't check the audio last night against the SD channel, but the HD feed sounded a bit echoing...i had assumed that was due to the live broadcast and we were getting an "auditorium like" reverb.

anyway, the reason i was going to post was to point out that i thought the video on the HD feed was spectacular. this is the second time i've seen a "live broadcast" on NBC, and i want to say that on my set the picture looks stunning. very natural colors (probably helps that i just calibrated my set using DVE), fantastic resolution down to pixel level. very nice. i wish all shows could look this real (as if i were really there as opposed to oversaturaed appearance and excessive mpeg compression on comcast's part)

Interesting. i was going to post about West Wing. i didn't check the audio last night against the SD channel, but the HD feed sounded a bit echoing...i had assumed that was due to the live broadcast and we were getting an "auditorium like" reverb.

anyway, the reason i was going to post was to point out that i thought the video on the HD feed was spectacular. this is the second time i've seen a "live broadcast" on NBC, and i want to say that on my set the picture looks stunning. very natural colors (probably helps that i just calibrated my set using DVE), fantastic resolution down to pixel level. very nice. i wish all shows could look this real (as if i were really there as opposed to oversaturaed appearance and excessive mpeg compression on comcast's part)
The broadcast was delivered direct at 1080/60i instead of the usual filmed 24p at 1080/60i. I thought it looked very good as well.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6488155#post6488155
Live dramatic TV on NBC - The West Wing: The Debate. - AVS Forum

thanks for the info, keenan. wish more shows were delivered in this format. very natural picture.

Well, it looks like my box is finally crapping out on me. The only way I can get it to record programs is to actually wait for the program to start, and then press the record button. Any programs that I had pre-scheduled to record (whether series record or not) fail to record, even though they show up with a red icon in the guide and the red record LED illuminates, indicating that it is supposed to be recording. Second, if I record a program manually while it's airing, the swap feature doesn't work anymore - the system seems to lock up and I get a black screen saying "this channel should be available shortly." Finally, I'm intermittently getting rather long delays (sometimes between 30-60 seconds) from the time I enter a command on the remote until it finally gets executed on the box (this last annoyance has been going on for a couple of months now). I'm still on my first DVR from January, so maybe it's lived past its lifetime.

Anyway, aftr reading through some of the recent pages and talking to a phone CSR, I'm planning to head down to my local office (SF) this week and try to pick up a Phase III box. Two quick questions which I didn't see: 1) Will they give me the HDMI cable, or do I need to supply that? 2) For those who have experienced the analog PQ improvement, are any of you using a RP-CRT display, or has everyone moved on to fixed pixel displays? I bought one of the last of a dying breed, a Pioneer Elite Pro-730HDi a year ago, and continue to be stunned by its natural film-like PQ. Other Elite owners have said that component continues to be the ideal connection for this set, so I'm wondering if HDMI will do anything for me w.r.t analog PQ. Thanks.

Does anyone know whether or not InHD Tuneup display Geometry or Overscan pattern??? ...... I was able to calibrated the color decoder/geometry and overscan on my Mits RPTV using Avia + DVE + I2C to what I thought was to perfection.

What are these test patterns on INHD you refer to? When/where can they be viewed?? I've used an Avia DVD to calibrate my TV, but will the calibrated picture as seen from my DVD player be the same as what is output from the HD cable box (DVD player and cable box both enter the TV through the same, switched DVI input...)? Or is separate calibration usually needed for each picture source?? Thanks.

CRT is an interlaced technology by definition (well, except for computer monitors). So naturally their "native" rez is going to be 1080i. But I guess 800 lines is pretty good for a 26" set. Larger CRTs (or HD projection sets) should have the full 1080 scan lines. It's the horizontal resolution that's harder to spec because it's basically an analog technology so the only way to find out how many pixels it can resolve is to test it with test patterns. But most of the better CRTs should hit 1400-1600 horiz. rez. (by 1080 scan lines)

Last-gen LCDs and DLPs topped out at 1366x768, but newer "1080p" models have the full 1920x1080 panel res.

Honestly though, at that size, 8 feet away, I'm not surprised that there isn't a world of difference between "good" SD and HD. My folks have a 34" JVC (crt) and it has a fine picture but I always can't help think how much better my 46" RPTV looks with a good HD (1080i) signal..

In my area 114 is not carrying anything. I think most areas are roughly the same except for 550Mhz systems. The subchannels change every few weeks. Encryption comes on and off depending on your area. The locals are always unencrypted. Don't be surprised if stuff moves or gets encrypted overnight.
So if I buy an HDTV set with an integrated QAM tuner, or an HDTV tuner card for my PC with a QAM tuner, the channel numbers for the local HD stations will change frequently? Doesn't that make having a set with an integrated QAM tuner virtually useless? Or have I misunderstood? I was thinking about setting up a Windows Media Center PC with an HD capable QAM tuner card, but it sounds like that might be a huge pain in the ass if the channel mappings are constantly changing.

"But most of the better CRTs should hit 1400-1600 horiz. rez. (by 1080 scan lines)"

There is only one direct view CRT that will do that resolution- The Sony's with "Super fine pitch".

I think walk was referring to some of the 9" CRT RPTVs.

BTW, it's my understanding that those 1080p digital displays that are just hitting the market are not real 1080p, they use a "wobulating" chip technology that does not present a full 1080x1920 image on the screen at the same instant.

What happened with the ABC HD feed last night? i caught the last half of Commander in Chief and it was in 4:3 and SD...

So if I buy an HDTV set with an integrated QAM tuner, or an HDTV tuner card for my PC with a QAM tuner, the channel numbers for the local HD stations will change frequently? Doesn't that make having a set with an integrated QAM tuner virtually useless? Or have I misunderstood? I was thinking about setting up a Windows Media Center PC with an HD capable QAM tuner card, but it sounds like that might be a huge pain in the ass if the channel mappings are constantly changing.
It just depends on the season. The HD locals have been pretty stable recently in their channel mappings. I noticed the SD multicast channel moved a little. In the past KQED and KGO had the most movement, but mainly within the same channel (ie their subchannel moved). KPIX and KTVU were pretty constant. If you are recording the whole 6MHz (38.4Mbps) then it doesn't matter so much if the subchannel moves, just if the main channel moves. Main channel moves are less often but occasionally do occur, especially if Comcast is making space for something new. From their standpoint, digital is great because 99% of us are using a virtual guide so we shouldn't know any better. However if you are using QAM tuner w/o CableCARD, you don't get the virtual channel mappings and are exposed to all the changes.

BTW, it's my understanding that those 1080p digital displays that are just hitting the market are not real 1080p, they use a "wobulating" chip technology that does not present a full 1080x1920 image on the screen at the same instant.
For the projection units yes, but true 1920x1080 pixel resolution LCDs flat panels are getting more popular now.

Am the only one who thinks that there should be a simple way for network affiliates to show a program in HD, even if they delay the program for a few seconds?

Once again, a brief delay screwed us all out of seeing Boston Legal in HD. As you know, ABC goes straight from Commander-In-Chief to BL. But at 10:00pm or 10:01, Channel 7 interrupts for a 30 second -> 1 minute update with election results, and then BL is shown SD.

Do the affiliates still not have the simple techology to record the HD broadcast and air it? I continue to think it's quite dumb that an extraordinarily brief delay = no HD.

This was okay and a part of life a few years ago, but with every network TV drama in HD, it's past the time for excuses.

ah...pappy97, thanks for at least explaning why things weren't in HD last night for ABC. i was a bit baffled because i saw that Boston Legal was also in SD.

For the projection units yes, but true 1920x1080 pixel resolution LCDs flat panels are getting more popular now.
Yes, I should have referenced DLP. I've read that Sharp? LCD panels are supposed to have a very nice image...haven't seen one yet though.

Sharp LC owners, have you experienced tv freeze up on some digital channels? I was switching channels, and it happened to me about 4 times now. One time I was on this one channel, suddent the picture disappeered and a error message of "No Broadcast now" showed up. After that, I can't change channel, nor can I turn off the tv. Is this something wrong with the TV, or with the cable connection? I use a RG59 cable.
I'm a LC37D5U owner and like your self I have experience not one but many problems with the unit. In fact this is my 3rd tv! I purchased a GB5U then replaced by SHARP with a DB5U....and now th D5U.
The problem is still the same an annoying channel display pop up. IT DRIVES ME INSANE!!
I have also experience a channel jumping while a watching digital and HD.
I have analog cable and a TERK HDTVI indoor antenna...not the strongest combo but hey a $300 TV should not give you such a dumb problem!!
Also with this unit it seems very hard to get even the strongest channel in HD such as FOX and PBS....and I do have the "no broadcast now" problem while watching tv but no freez ups.
My suggestion? Get on the case with 1800besharp dispatcher and have your unit replaced if still in warranty...

I can't speak for your units, but for the 45" I was able to pickup OTA with just RS double-bowtie indoor antenna.

With QAM I don't have any problem picking up the unencrypted channels, no lockup either. Never seen the popup problem you guys are mentioning but other 37" folks mention it is probably a bug in Sharp that only shows up with signal strength or no audio broadcast situations. Most people don't see the problem. One guy used to see the problem with Comcast, but moved to a different area with Charter and the problem never showed up again.

Last night I finally got my PVR PC up and running and connected my Sharp LC37D5U to it via Firewire/IEEE1394. Looks like everything works (hooray!). Just a little background, I don't have a cable card or anything so the only channels I get are FOX (2.1) NBC (116.2) CBS (5.1) ABC (7.1), the channel that plays HDNET reruns (98.2) and a few others ones I don't care about.

So the problem now is, I can only seem to record 2 channels..... NBC (116.2) and the channel that replays HDNET stuff (98.2). I read about this thing called 5C encryption that seems to disallow certain content to be copied over Firewire. I also was under the impression that only Premium digital channels (such as ESPN-HD, Discovery-HD, etc) would be 5C encrypted. But I could be wrong and Comcast is also 5C encrypting some of the broadcast channels that I can't seem to record such as FOX, CBS and ABC.... Does anyone have anymore insight into this 5C encrypting with regards to Comcast's digital broadcasts in the bay area?

Today I received a flyer in the mail from Comcast extolling what is available in my area. Among the HD channels was "INHD 1&2" listed as "new" of course I am not getting them. I think I deserve some compensation from them for false advertising.

I got a similar toilet paper substitute from Comcast today also, only it was extolling the virtues of OnDemand...something we don't get here, along with not getting the INHDs either.

You would think Comcast would save themselves the CSR headaches of answering "not in your area" to people that would call to get these unavailable services.

the channel that plays HDNET reruns (98.2)
To borrow a page from Prince, that is the channel formerly known as KRON.

Basically KRON has nothing to broadcast since they lost NBC affiliation. They have some deal with HDNET to transmit old HDNET stuff.

it's too bad someone else with real content couldn't use the bandwidth in place of KRON...replays of 3 year old games and random stuff isn't all that interesting.

how about WB-HD, for eg? not necessarily my cup of tea (my wife likes to watch), but i think it would be better than the reruns that go over and over again all the time on 704...of course, to make matters worse, the program guide never describes what is really being shown on 704.

I'm a LC37D5U owner and like your self I have experience not one but many problems with the unit. In fact this is my 3rd tv! I purchased a GB5U then replaced by SHARP with a DB5U....and now th D5U.
The problem is still the same an annoying channel display pop up. IT DRIVES ME INSANE!!
I have also experience a channel jumping while a watching digital and HD.
I have analog cable and a TERK HDTVI indoor antenna...not the strongest combo but hey a $300 TV should not give you such a dumb problem!!
Also with this unit it seems very hard to get even the strongest channel in HD such as FOX and PBS....and I do have the "no broadcast now" problem while watching tv but no freez ups.
My suggestion? Get on the case with 1800besharp dispatcher and have your unit replaced if still in warranty...

Thank you very much Lui. So I just simply call the 1800besharp and tell them the problem, they will give me a replacement? Is there something specific I need to say? You know sometimes if they can fool you they will. So I'm afraid if I am not saying the wrong phrase or asking the right question, they'll just blow me off.

As for the channel display popup, I have seen that many times. It would display a square box on the upper right hand corner of what channel it is. I bought the unit from a supposedly authorized dealer online recently.

I got a similar toilet paper substitute from Comcast today also, only it was extolling the virtues of OnDemand...something we don't get here, along with not getting the INHDs either.

You would think Comcast would save themselves the CSR headaches of answering "not in your area" to people that would call to get these unavailable services.

funny...out here in SaraMilGatos, the flyer they sent us actually got it right for once


It mentions INHD1/2 as new channels in our Area (true, just added)
It leaves out ShoHD, KRON-HD, CinHD, StarzHD, HDSE (true, we dont have them)
It mentions that HSI has a 4Mb/Sec max (true, we havent been upgraded to 6Mb+)
It does not mention OnDemand (true, we dont have it)

amazing...

and it's headline is

"YOU TALKED. WE LISTENED"

haha

and of course it doesnt tell you that most everybody else (but Keenan) has all of this other stuff...and they pay the same as us :mad:

Does anyone know of any free HBO or Showtime weekends coming up? I think they turn off the scrambling and then my MyHD can tune them in and record movies.

- Phil

funny...out here in SaraMilGatos, the flyer they sent us actually got it right for once


It mentions INHD1/2 as new channels in our Area (true, just added)
It leaves out ShoHD, KRON-HD, CinHD, StarzHD, HDSE (true, we dont have them)
It mentions that HSI has a 4Mb/Sec max (true, we havent been upgraded to 6Mb+)
It does not mention OnDemand (true, we dont have it)

amazing...

and it's headline is

"YOU TALKED. WE LISTENED"

haha

and of course it doesnt tell you that most everybody else (but Keenan) has all of this other stuff...and they pay the same as us :mad:

The one I got listed as available HD channels we don't actually get, KRON-HD, FSNBA-HD, INHD, INHD2, Showtime-HD, NBATV-HD and NFL-Network. Out of the total of 17 they list, we get 10.

Not counting the music channels, we still have more analog channels here than digital ones. :rolleyes:

It's just insulting and agravating, the letter I got is addressed to my name and Current Resident, and it's just loaded with flat out lies.

I would like to think that this letter is an indication that all the above we be available here soon, but, I've been getting this same crap for over a year, it is literally a textbook definition of "junk mail".

"YOU TALKED. WE LISTENED"
And when you call in to complain, the automated voice response system says
"You called our bluff, we blinked first" :)

Can somebody give me a clue as to what's going on here? (I'm a relative newbie at this stuff). I live in SF and I have two TVs, a Panasonic Plasma with QAM and ATSC, and also a new Toshiba LCD with QAM and ATSC.

My issue is this

1) With the Panasonic plasma, I can get 3-1, 5-1, 9-1,2,3 (KQED) and also 116-1 (NBC)
2) With the Toshiba LCD, I can only get NBC, but instead of being 116-1, NBC is on 11-1. I can't get any other HD on the Toshiba LCD.

What could I possibly be doing wrong? If I force the toshiba to 9-1, it says that there's pretty much no signal. ???

The two TVs are in different rooms of a condo building. I have no idea if one room is split from a different condo unit or what not. What should my next steps be? Get an HD OTA atennae? Get a signal amplifier?

Thanks

Make sure your Toshiba is using QAM and is using "Standard" cable frequencies (vs HRC, IRC)

NBC lost PSIP information sometime last month. You probably scanned it in when it still had PSIP, and that is why it shows up at 11.1 (the actual underlying physical frequency is still 116.1, PSIP is just doing a virtual mapping)

Hmmmm,

I checked the specifications on the Toshiba and it says the digital cable tuner is
"Digital Cable 64 QAM, 256 QAM"

I searched through the whole manual (and the TV menus) and there's no setting for "HRC" vs QAM. In fact, I don't know what is HRC.

I scanned and rescanned all the channels and still 116.1 gets mapped to 11.1. I don't get 3.1, 5.1, or 9.1,2,3. Is it possible that these channels are mapped to a different channel by my television?

Thanks

Okay, this gets even weirder ... I called Toshiba customer support and they told me me that "different manufacturers have different QAM tuners; the Toshiba QAM tuner is going to have a tough time pulling in 3.1, 5.1, 9.1,2,3. The only way to reliably pull these in is to get a cable card..."

This is really confusing me because my Panasonic plasma can tune those channels just fine!

QAM is the modulation. When I say standard, hrc, irc, that is the frequency separation. Basically what you want is QAM/standard. The other thing I was suggesting is to double check you are configured to use the QAM tuner vs ATSC/8VSB tuner. It's a long shot, but it is possible you are just picking up OTA NBC using ATSC tuner and that is confusing the issue.

What Toshiba is telling you is incorrect. If you can't get the unencrypted locals, something is wrong. We just don't know what yet.

It is possible they put the PSIP back on 116.3. I haven't checked in a week. Then the reverse could have happened, Panny scanned when PSIP wasn't present and Toshiba scanned with PSIP present. Some TVs don't adjust the displayed frequencies or PSIP information after initial scan. This confuses people because other people say the channel has switch subchannels, but your TV is still displaying the old subchannel so you think nothing has changed.

Try swapping the TVs. That will tell you if it is a problem with your specific cable runs. It could be that one of the feeds has more attenuation, so it cannot lock onto the digital signals. If that works, then you need to find out why the one feed has low signal quality. Digital channels are mostly in the upper frequencies on the cable, so they tend to attenuate more than the lower frequencies.

Greg


Can somebody give me a clue as to what's going on here? (I'm a relative newbie at this stuff). I live in SF and I have two TVs, a Panasonic Plasma with QAM and ATSC, and also a new Toshiba LCD with QAM and ATSC.

My issue is this

1) With the Panasonic plasma, I can get 3-1, 5-1, 9-1,2,3 (KQED) and also 116-1 (NBC)
2) With the Toshiba LCD, I can only get NBC, but instead of being 116-1, NBC is on 11-1. I can't get any other HD on the Toshiba LCD.

QAM is the modulation. When I say standard, hrc, irc, that is the frequency separation. Basically what you want is QAM/standard. The other thing I was suggesting is to double check you are configured to use the QAM tuner vs ATSC/8VSB tuner. It's a long shot, but it is possible you are just picking up OTA NBC using ATSC tuner and that is confusing the issue.

What Toshiba is telling you is incorrect. If you can't get the unencrypted locals, something is wrong. We just don't know what yet.

It is possible they put the PSIP back on 116.3. I haven't checked in a week. Then the reverse could have happened, Panny scanned when PSIP wasn't present and Toshiba scanned with PSIP present. Some TVs don't adjust the displayed frequencies or PSIP information after initial scan. This confuses people because other people say the channel has switch subchannels, but your TV is still displaying the old subchannel so you think nothing has changed.

Hmmm.. I swapped TVs (it was rather difficult, mind you :-) ) and I got the same results, so I think I can rule out the cable feeds being too different (or one having more high freq attenuation than the other). Moreover, the Toshiba and its cable feed gets what seems like a bazillion and one digital cable radio stations, so I can definitely say that the QAM tuner on the Toshiba is working. On the Toshiba, signal level is at 100% (according to the signal strength function on the TV) on the digital channels that I *do* get, I just don't get ABC, CBS, KQED, etc. Only NBC.

Thanks, yes, I did check and I just rechecked to make sure that the TV is using the QAM tuner and the not ATSC tuner. Hmmmmmmmmm.

Hmmm.. I swapped TVs (it was rather difficult, mind you :-) ) and I got the same results, so I think I can rule out the cable feeds being too different (or one having more high freq attenuation than the other). Moreover, the Toshiba and its cable feed gets what seems like a bazillion and one digital cable radio stations, so I can definitely say that the QAM tuner on the Toshiba is working. On the Toshiba, signal level is at 100% (according to the signal strength function on the TV) on the digital channels that I *do* get, I just don't get ABC, CBS, KQED, etc. Only NBC.

Thanks, yes, I did check and I just rechecked to make sure that the TV is using the QAM tuner and the not ATSC tuner. Hmmmmmmmmm.
Do you have any amps on the line? Sometimes the signal can be too strong.

It is not surprising tuning 9.1 didn't give you anything. There isn't anything on that channel, it is a virtual channel. The physical channel varies, but here are the ones for my area. Use the "QAM" column as that is the physical frequency you need to tune to:
Mhz psip cbl qam
555 5.1 705 79.1 KPIX-DT CBS HD
555 2.1 702 79.2 KTVU-DT FOX HD

717 704 111.2 KRON-DT/HDNET KRON HD/HDNET

747 11.1 703 116.1 KNTV-DT NBC HD
747 11.2 186 116.3 KNTV-W NBC Weather

753 7.1 707 117.1 KGO-HD ABC HD
753 7.2 194 117.2 KGO-DT ABC DT
753 9.2 189 117.3 KQED-E KQED Encore
753 9.1 709 117.4 KQED-DT KQED HD
753 9.3 190 117.5 KQED-W KQED World
753 9.4 191 117.6 KQED-L KQED Life
753 9.5 192 117.7 KQED-K KQED Kids

i was recording the same sarah Mclanclan Live concert, but i go 2 different file sizes accordingly, i've made sure they have the same start frame and stop frame, wondering if comcast is encoding the same show differently? the one hour show differs about 500M.

bxz

Do you have any amps on the line? Sometimes the signal can be too strong.

It is not surprising tuning 9.1 didn't give you anything. There isn't anything on that channel, it is a virtual channel. The physical channel varies, but here are the ones for my area. Use the "QAM" column as that is the physical frequency you need to tune to:
Mhz psip cbl qam
555 5.1 705 79.1 KPIX-DT CBS HD
555 2.1 702 79.2 KTVU-DT FOX HD

717 704 111.2 KRON-DT/HDNET KRON HD/HDNET

747 11.1 703 116.1 KNTV-DT NBC HD
747 11.2 186 116.3 KNTV-W NBC Weather

753 7.1 707 117.1 KGO-HD ABC HD
753 7.2 194 117.2 KGO-DT ABC DT
753 9.2 189 117.3 KQED-E KQED Encore
753 9.1 709 117.4 KQED-DT KQED HD
753 9.3 190 117.5 KQED-W KQED World
753 9.4 191 117.6 KQED-L KQED Life
753 9.5 192 117.7 KQED-K KQED Kids



Funny thing is that you guys are talking about QAM/std,hrc,irc now. I posted a question earlier about SF's comcast modulations. Anyway, I have a LC26D6U, and the only way for me to pickup the Digital channels is by using IRC. with a HRC scan I don't get any digital signal. My hookup is cable directly into LC26D6U's digital tuner. Btw, where can I get info on psip? what is it?

I have Sharp Aquos and I use Standard for the QAM tuner with Comcast, everything comes in fine. IRC works also. HRC doesn't. I believe the 6MHz offsets are different.

Re: PSIP, basically it is the meta-data to name, number, and navigate DTV. Channel names, virtual channel #s, guide data, clock, etc.
http://www.psip.org/documents/PSIP_guide.pdf

edit: Whoops it is on, right now. Looks stunning, but cropped to 1.78...


--
and then it cuts off in the middle to the hockey game.. arrgh!


-

So I guess we're not getting Blade Runner on INHD2 tonite, because of the hockey game.

The listings say it will be replayed at 7pm PST on Tues nite (11/15) - assuming there isn't any game on then either, I guess... :(

Thank you sfhub, I'll give std one more scan to see what is up.

I just upgraded my DVR from P2 to p3 in the Foster City office. The pictures look much better even via composite (I still need to get HDMI cable).
I kept my old remote and now I have to enter 002 to switch to channel 2 or 055 for channel 55. In my old p2 DVR I did not have to enter all of these leading zeros.

Does anybody know if this is a setting that can be changed or do all Phase 3 DVRs work this way?

Thanks.

I just upgraded my DVR from P2 to p3 in the Foster City office. The pictures look much better even via composite (I still need to get HDMI cable).
I kept my old remote and now I have to enter 002 to switch to channel 2 or 055 for channel 55. In my old p2 DVR I did not have to enter all of these leading zeros.

Does anybody know if this is a setting that can be changed or do all Phase 3 DVRs work this way?

Thanks.

Yes, it can be changed.

On your remote, press menu and then menu again. Go to Setup and press Select on your remote. Go to Guide Setup and press Select on your remote. Now, go to Channel Entry and change it to Auto Tune.

You're finished. You can now press 2 and it goes to channel 2.

Hmmmm,

At the end of the day, the only way I can get KQED digital channels as well and ABC digital and CBS digital is to use an OTA antennae with the Toshiba.

Anything I try with the Comcast cable feed only nets me NBC Digital and a whole bucketfull of digital radio stations. No amps on the line ... I tried almost everthing. Tuning to the qam #s you have me doesn't work.

Perhaps I should have gotten an Aquos, but I couldn't resist the Toshiba pricing. Unfortunately, nothing in the TV setup gives me the ability to change receiver modulation from QAM to IRC or HRC.

So I can keep the OTA antenna (luckily the TV has 2 coax inputs) or I can see if Toshiba has a firmware upgrade in the future....

Thanks

Hmmmm,

At the end of the day, the only way I can get KQED digital channels as well and ABC digital and CBS digital is to use an OTA antennae with the Toshiba.

Anything I try with the Comcast cable feed only nets me NBC Digital and a whole bucketfull of digital radio stations. No amps on the line ... I tried almost everthing. Tuning to the qam #s you have me doesn't work.

Perhaps I should have gotten an Aquos, but I couldn't resist the Toshiba pricing. Unfortunately, nothing in the TV setup gives me the ability to change receiver modulation from QAM to IRC or HRC.

So I can keep the OTA antenna (luckily the TV has 2 coax inputs) or I can see if Toshiba has a firmware upgrade in the future....

Thanks

jhleung,

Just as a point of reference, when you hooked the Comcast cable to the Toshiba did you connect it to Antenna 1 ?? On some sets you must connect the direct cable feed ( for QAM ) to that connection, the other antenna connection is for OTA. I didn't see what area you are in but there should be no reason why you can't tune into unencrypted channels on Comcast, I do with my LG and my Sony.

Laters,
Mikef5

So I can keep the OTA antenna (luckily the TV has 2 coax inputs) or I can see if Toshiba has a firmware upgrade in the future....

If you can't get the other locals with the QAM tuner, it is very likely you won't get them with a CableCARD too. If you wanted to pursue this, from a bureacratic standpoint, it is probably easier to get a CableCARD then tell Toshiba their CableCARD doesn't work. This will probably get them moving quicker than if you say you can get the unencrypted locals. If you get a good rep, you won't need to go through this, as they will understand something is wrong right away.

edit: Whoops it is on, right now. Looks stunning, but cropped to 1.78...


--
and then it cuts off in the middle to the hockey game.. arrgh!


-

So I guess we're not getting Blade Runner on INHD2 tonite, because of the hockey game.

The listings say it will be replayed at 7pm PST on Tues nite (11/15) - assuming there isn't any game on then either, I guess... :(
Isn't there 2 INHDs? What do they show on the other one that they pre-empt a movie channel to show a hockey game? With 2 channels it would seem they could manage somehow to make it work.

If you can, you're actually better off viewing this movie on HDNet as it's shown OAR and the HDNet bug disappears after the first few minutes. It's too bad hell will probably freeze over before Comcast carries HDNet as they really do it right.

Yep, there are 2 INHDs, but the deal is that they always prempt on the INHD2 channel. That's their agreement. Off-topic, I have a similar deal going on this coming Saturday night. FSN-Bay is going to show the hockey game between the Coyote and the Sharks prempting the USC vs. Fresno St. college football game. It'll be joined in progress after the hockey game. :mad:

Yes, it can be changed.

On your remote, press menu and then menu again. Go to Setup and press Select on your remote. Go to Guide Setup and press Select on your remote. Now, go to Channel Entry and change it to Auto Tune.

You're finished. You can now press 2 and it goes to channel 2.


Thanks, it worked.

Thanks, it worked.

You're welcome. That's what we're here for, to share what we've learned.

Anybody else only getting PCM audio from their Motorola 6412? No digital audio, no 5.1 surround sound ... every channel is coming through with non-digital audio.

Anybody else only getting PCM audio from their Motorola 6412? No digital audio, no 5.1 surround sound ... every channel is coming through with non-digital audio.

Are you using an HDMI cable associated with a 6412 Phase III box? If so, that's a known issue allegedly to be fixed with firmware release 12.22. The quick fix for right now is to use component cables until the release is downloaded.

Are you using an HDMI cable associated with a 6412 Phase III box? If so, that's a known issue allegedly to be fixed with firmware release 12.22. The quick fix for right now is to use component cables until the release is downloaded.
I'm using component cables with an optical audio out from the 6412 III. The problem was fixed by just turning the box off for a couple minutes & turning it back on. Thanks.

I'm using component cables with an optical audio out from the 6412 III. The problem was fixed by just turning the box off for a couple minutes & turning it back on. Thanks.

Cool, glad ya got it working correctly.

I spoke with a Comcast customer service rep the other day and he suggested that by the end of this year or early next year, all the digital local broadcasts will be scrambled and that customers will have to have a cable box or a cablecard to unscramble them. His reasoning is as follows: the only reason they are not scrambling local digital broadcasts right now is because they are currently carrying both analog and digital local broadcasts, and that if we are paying for analog, then they can't charge us again for digital. However, now that they are slowly migrating to complete digital (he claims Castro Valley is already completely digital) Comcast will no longer have to broadcast local digital channels in the clear. Is there any merit to his claims?

I do not feel they are correct. There is a discussion over in this thread.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=594916

If they do encrypt HD locals, I think they will have complaints from both users and local stations. Cable attitude is evolving to the point some MSOs feel they have a right to charge again for stuff that is broadcast over the air. Reading the sections pointed out in the above thread, this is against FCC regulations.

Being advertising based, I think the locals would object to Comcast encrypting their channels and charging more for them when the local stations don't get a penny. So not only does Comcast benefit from rebroadcasting locals (by people paying for basic service), they get to charge even addition premium for this content. This may end up changing the ball game, and cable MSOs will need to pay locals to carry their content. Cable MSOs are strongly against paying a penny for local content they claim is broadcast for free. This is very disingenuous if on the flip side of the coin, they have no problems charging their subscribers a fee for something the MSOs obtain for free and refuse to pay for.

It is also against public policy of freeing up the airwaves for the analog cutoff. A significant reason the analog cutoff is not as big of an issue as it could be is because many folks get their TV signal from cable. Migration will be impeded if people are buying new TVs expecting to get HDTV service, only to find they need to put up antennas to get "free" OTA or pay even more to the cable company.

This is mitigated by the fact that analog cable is still being carried as well as HDTV locals being in the clear. Irrespective of whether it is right or wrong, if people hesitate to buy these new digital capable TVs, it will make it more difficult for analog cutoff to happen. I think FCC will side with consumers and enforce rules that locals be carried in the clear as they do with analog locals.

You may ask what does cable have to do with OTA analog cutoff while cable MSOs are still broadcasting analog? What the big deal? The big deal is cable will eventually do an analog cutoff and FCC has only delayed a big fight if they can't enough new digital capable TV sets into consumer hands by the time that happens.

I don't want to get too much off target, but I think an all digital cable migration will drastically increase electricity usage. These digital tuners use more power than cable-ready tuners (which use virtually zero power in standby). If you go to an all digital system you can't expect everyone to immediately replace their TVs with new ones. There will be an explosion of STB usage and thus power usage increase, will also increase since these cable boxes are usually on 24/7 using the same amount of power regardless of whether they are on or off. If you average 3 STBs per household, that's like turning on 100watt light bulb 24/7 for every affected house.

I spoke with a Comcast customer service rep the other day and he suggested that by the end of this year or early next year, all the digital local broadcasts will be scrambled and that customers will have to have a cable box or a cablecard to unscramble them. His reasoning is as follows: the only reason they are not scrambling local digital broadcasts right now is because they are currently carrying both analog and digital local broadcasts, and that if we are paying for analog, then they can't charge us again for digital. However, now that they are slowly migrating to complete digital (he claims Castro Valley is already completely digital) Comcast will no longer have to broadcast local digital channels in the clear. Is there any merit to his claims?
There is zero chance of that, the FCC mandates that they provide those major network channels in the clear but just to be on the safe side I'll give Mr. J a jingle and see what's up but I personally don't believe CSR's in the first place, they are script readers only and are usually the last to know any thing.

Laters,
Mikef5

There is zero chance of that, the FCC mandates that they provide those major network channels in the clear but just to be on the safe side I'll give Mr. J a jingle and see what's up but I personally don't believe CSR's in the first place, they are script readers only and are usually the last to know any thing.

Zero is an awfully absolute # :)

To me, regulations for local digitals to be unencrypted, are laid out very clearly in this post, as well as references to the actual FCC regulations.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5856618#post5856618

My take on this is if Comcast decides to encrypt digital locals, I suggest everyone just raise a huge stink with FCC and bombard them with complaints. Comcast doesn't want any more regulatory attention than necessary. I'm confident they will back down (maybe even claiming it was a technical glitch) because they have much bigger fish to fry than encrypting digital locals. I can't believe it is worth their time to worry about this unless we are stealing service, since we are all already paying for basic service as a minimum entry fee. A few VOD movies a month would easily make them more than they can charge for digital locals (and the associated migration to D*TV if the big advantage of cable TV - no STB needed - is removed)

Zero is an awfully absolute # :)

To me, regulations for local digitals to be unencrypted, are laid out very clearly in this post, as well as references to the actual FCC regulations.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5856618#post5856618

Thanks for the link. I think that is a loose interpretation of the regulations. The basic tier now doesn't require a box and are not encrypted now, so how would they make this change to encryption and still not require a box or charge for it above the price of the basic tier ?? I think I really need to get that email off to Mr. J

Laters,
Mikef5

You might provide the FCC reg numbers for him as well. I'd be interested in what he says as there are, in fact, cable companies encrypting local HD channels.

Thanks for the link. I think that is a loose interpretation of the regulations. The basic tier now doesn't require a box and are not encrypted now, so how would they make this change to encryption and still not require a box or charge for it above the price of the basic tier ?? I think I really need to get that email off to Mr. J
I think that is a strange way to word the question. If the basic tier doesn't require a box and is not encrypted right now (by FCC regulation), and this is extended to digital locals, why shouldn't we expect the same? Why should we start with the premise that for digital locals they are allowed to make the change to encryption (of locals) and how would they be able to do that and keep it STB-free? I'm not talking about premium or pay tier. That they can encrypt if they'd like, obviously.

I think we are getting a little carried away over what one CSR said. :)

That said, it woud be interesting to here from Comcast.

I think that is a strange way to word the question. If the basic tier doesn't require a box and is not encrypted right now, and this is extended to digital locals, why shouldn't we expect the same? Why should we start with the premise that for digital locals they are allowed to make the change to encryption (of locals) and how would they be able to do that and keep it STB-free? I'm not talking about premium or pay tier. That they can encrypt if they'd like, obviously.

Ok, to avoid all confusion I just set Mr. Johnson an email asking if in fact this is what Comcast has in plan to do. No need to try and interpret any thing, just get it straight from the horses mouth, so to speak. Mr. J. has always been straight and forth right with me so I will wait to see what he has to say.

Laters,
Mikef5

Ok, to avoid all confusion I just set Mr. Johnson an email asking if in fact this is what Comcast has in plan to do. No need to try and interpret any thing, just get it straight from the horses mouth, so to speak. Mr. J. has always been straight and forth right with me so I will wait to see what he has to say.
Sounds good to me.

I think we are getting a little carried away over what one CSR said. :)

That said, it woud be interesting to here from Comcast.
You're right Keenan much a do about what a CSR said but if you read the link that was provided, it seems that there is at least one cable company that thinks that it is ok to encrypt ALL digital siganals that they provide, might as well go with D* or Dish if this is really the case and why buy a digital tv with a digital tuner when you can't use it except for OTA stuff, I'm sure the tv manufacturers would love to know that the tuners that they are required to put into these sets are useless.... :confused:

Laters,
Mikef5

You're right Keenan much a do about what a CSR said but if you read the link that was provided, it seems that there is at least one cable company that thinks that it is ok to encrypt ALL digital siganals that they provide, might as well go with D* or Dish if this is really the case and why buy a digital tv with a digital tuner when you can't use it except for OTA stuff, I'm sure the tv manufacturers would love to know that the tuners that they are required to put into these sets are useless.... :confused:

Laters,
Mikef5
I read the link, in fact I think I posted in that thread. Charter seems to interpret it as being allowed. Ken H has said that there seems to be a difference of opinion among cablecos on the regulation. He has also mentioned that Comcast does not follow the encrypt policy that other cablecos do so it will be interesting to here from the horse's mouth.

I think it is almost a year since Comcast added an HD channel in their lineup - that was the Fox channel. Any chance that we will be getting a new one? Thank you.

I think it is almost a year since Comcast added an HD channel in their lineup - that was the Fox channel. Any chance that we will be getting a new one? Thank you.
We are talking about removing channels by encrypting them, not adding channels. Please stay on point :) :) :)

:eek:
holy smokes...there is alot of posts about this...I thought we learned long ago to ignore claims like this that came from a conversation with a CSR...
:D

I had a Comcast DVR installed a few months ago and then didn't use it for about a month and it was working. I got a new TV and have installed everything at a different coax outlet, but now the guide doesn't work and neither does the DVR. Is there anything I can check in the service menu to see what's up? Any suggestions? Thanks.

Are you sure that the coax outlet you are hooked up to is, indeed, connected all the way back to where Comcast enters your home? Are you getting a signal at all? It might be time to call Comcast.

I had a Comcast DVR installed a few months ago and then didn't use it for about a month and it was working. I got a new TV and have installed everything at a different coax outlet, but now the guide doesn't work and neither does the DVR. Is there anything I can check in the service menu to see what's up? Any suggestions? Thanks.


Building on what Bobby said...It sounds like you might have installed a 1way amp (or incorrect splitter) on this leg of the cable that is letting the signal get from Comcast to the DVR but is preventing the signal from the DVR getting back to comcast (the box needs to be able to talk back to comcast in order for some of the functions to work).

I received a message saying that TV Game and Fuse would be moved to Digital Classic in November 14th. However, I tried to access those channels yesterday and I received a message saying that I have to subscribe to those channels.

Has anyone had any luck?
BTW, I have the Digital Silver Package.

Building on what Bobby said...It sounds like you might have installed a 1way amp (or incorrect splitter) on this leg of the cable that is letting the signal get from Comcast to the DVR but is preventing the signal from the DVR getting back to comcast (the box needs to be able to talk back to comcast in order for some of the functions to work).

Interesting. I am getting all the channels ... including the HD ones, just no menu. I guess I could move the box downstairs to test when I get home.

I'm planning to split the coax 'out of the wall', sending one branch to the 6412 (and from there to the TV via HDMI) and the other branch directly into the TV (ANT-1) which will have a Cable Card. The Comcast rep tried to tell me that I couldn't have both a stb AND a CC attached, but that' BS, right? Don't many of you do this?

I'm planning to split the coax 'out of the wall', sending one branch to the 6412 (and from there to the TV via HDMI) and the other branch directly into the TV (ANT-1) which will have a Cable Card. The Comcast rep tried to tell me that I couldn't have both a stb AND a CC attached, but that' BS, right? Don't many of you do this?

The BS alarm is going off

I'm planning to split the coax 'out of the wall', sending one branch to the 6412 (and from there to the TV via HDMI) and the other branch directly into the TV (ANT-1) which will have a Cable Card. The Comcast rep tried to tell me that I couldn't have both a stb AND a CC attached, but that' BS, right? Don't many of you do this?
From a connection standpoint that is BS. Whether they will give you CC for the same price as you are currently paying or the DVR is a different question. I don't know which the rep was addressing.

From a connection standpoint that is BS. Whether they will give you CC for the same price as you are currently paying or the DVR is a different question. I don't know which the rep was addressing.

They did give me the CC and said it would cost $5/month. So it took it and will try it out to see if PQ is any better for SD analog channesl via CC. If not, I will return it. From other discussion above, I now also need to see how SD analog channels look when I change the 4:3 Override on my 6412 from 'OFF' to 480i and 480p. This gives me a variety of things to try to see if SD analog PQ can be improved for my gear--fun and games!

Just heard from Mr. J. about the all digital change over and what will or will not change when that happens. This is verbatim
____________________________________________________________ ____________

Comcast is beginning to deliver 100-percent digital video signals in several communities, and we expect to expand this initiative to nearly all of our markets over the next six to 12 months.

The first step in the all-digital transition is to digitally simulcast the approximately 80 analog channels that are offered as part of basic cable service.

The transition to all digital will offer several benefits for consumers and cable companies, such as higher picture quality and the network capacity to offer more new and interactive services to all customers.

· Offering signals in an all-digital format results in a higher picture quality, which is especially important as consumers are quickly adopting digital electronics like HDTVs and digital video recorders (DVRs). Providing 100-percent all-digital signals adds more value for our customers who are buying new plasma, LCD, and other HDTV sets or using DVRs.

· The ability to create different packages is limited in an analog world. Going all-digital will help us add more value for customers by giving us the ability to provide differentiated levels of services to meet their needs.

· Taking the steps to go all digital will dramatically expand system capacity, giving us the ability to provide interactive services to all customers and to offer more new services like thousands of hours of video-on-demand (VOD) content, 30-50 high-definition channels, high-definition on-demand content, expanded IP phone service features and increased speed of our high-speed Internet service.

· We also want to be prepared to be able to deliver our signals to a wide range of consumer electronics. As technology advances and consumers can potentially use multiple devices to view video entertainment (for example, televisions, PCs and phones), digital transmission of signals is a fundamental requirement.

The transition to digital simulcast is seamless to all customers, regardless of the Comcast services they have:

· It does not result in a change in the price of any Comcast services.

· There is no change in the location of any Comcast Cable channels.

· There is no change in the way analog-only customers receive their service from Comcast at this time. Once all-digital signals are available, we could begin to introduce all-digital set-top boxes so these customers could begin receiving all channels in a digital format without changing their current cable subscription.

· Comcast customers with a digital cable, HD or HD/DVR set-top box will receive all channels in a high quality digital format without any change in the way they currently select channels and use digital cable services.

In summary, there is no immediate effect on customers in terms of equipment, tiers of service, or prices associated with providing 100-percent digital video signals. Customers do not need to do anything at this time.
____________________________________________________________ __________

So, for those that thought that they are going to encrypt ALL digital channels, I think the last part says it all, there is no change in the way you now currently select channels and use digital cable services. Thanks Mr. J. for the info now.....
Lets get the digital simulcasting going I need more HD, at least 30 or 50 of them :)

Great info, Mike (and Mr. J.). I wonder if the simulcast of the analog channels will be a Bay Area wide thing or if will be based on the region/district (kind of like when the DVR's were first introduced).

Great info, Mike (and Mr. J.). I wonder if the simulcast of the analog channels will be a Bay Area wide thing or if will be based on the region/district (kind of like when the DVR's were first introduced).
The way it was explained to me is that it is Bay Area wide ( the dvr rollout was suppose to be Bay Area wide there was a communication screw up ) but we'll know more when it happens. Boy, it just dawned on me ( must be old age ) he said HD VOD, now that I would enjoy.....:)

Laters,
Mikef5

I read through the reply very closely, but it does not say anything about encrypting or not encrypting Digital Simulcast or HDTV locals.

I know this is an issue because we just went through this with the "grandfathering" of INHD1/2, ESPN-HD, DISC-HD. Comcast's view of "no change" is from the standpoint of someone using an STB or CableCARD. It says nothing about someone using a QAM tuner w/o CableCARD, which I thought was the point of the discussion. We know from grandfathering that even though Comcast said it wouldn't affect customers who had HDTV service prior to the cutoff date, it actually did affect customers using QAM w/o CableCARD.

The specific wording says:
"Comcast customers with a digital cable, HD or HD/DVR set-top box will receive all channels in a high quality digital format without any change in the way they currently select channels and use digital cable services."

To me, that means it does not necessarily apply to QAM tuners w/o CableCARD. If there was further clarification that HDTV locals would not be encrypted, then that would answer the question very directly.

Basically all it really says is they are going to virtually map the Digital Simulcast channels into the analog channel slots so you won't know any better even though the RF has changed and the signal is now digital. Of course we know that this virtual mapping will only take place if you have CableCARD. w/o CableCARD you will be exposed to the underlying RF.

Maybe you could ask the question more directly:
Are there *any* plans for FOX-HD, CBS-HD, ABC-HD, NBC-HD, KQED-HD, or KRON-HD to be encrypted?

I read through the reply very closely, but it does not say anything about encrypting or not encrypting Digital Simulcast or HDTV locals.

I know this is an issue because we just went through this with the "grandfathering" of INHD1/2, ESPN-HD, DISC-HD. Comcast's view of "no change" is from the standpoint of someone using an STB or CableCARD. It says nothing about someone using a QAM tuner w/o CableCARD, which I thought was the point of the discussion. We know from grandfathering that even though Comcast said it wouldn't affect customers who had HDTV service prior to the cutoff date, it actually did affect customers using QAM w/o CableCARD.

The specific wording says:
"Comcast customers with a digital cable, HD or HD/DVR set-top box will receive all channels in a high quality digital format without any change in the way they currently select channels and use digital cable services."

To me, that means it does not necessarily apply to QAM tuners w/o CableCARD. If there was further clarification that HDTV locals would not be encrypted, then that would answer the question very directly.

Basically all it really says is they are going to virtually map the Digital Simulcast channels into the analog channel slots so you won't know any better even though the RF has changed and the signal is now digital. Of course we know that this virtual mapping will only take place if you have CableCARD. w/o CableCARD you will be exposed to the underlying RF.

Maybe you could ask the question more directly:
Are there *any* plans for FOX-HD, CBS-HD, ABC-HD, NBC-HD, KQED-HD, or KRON-HD to be encrypted?

I don't know how much plainer it can be expressed, if you have digital cable you will receive it without change. If Mr. J had meant that they were going to use encryption he would have said so and just to ease your concerns I specifically asked about those specific channels and the answer was, without change. Don't read more into it than there is, it is not in Comcast's interest to pi** off their customers and believe me I will hold their feet to the coals if not. I went through the fiasco with the DVR rollout and will again if need be but I know Mr. J. and his commitment to his customers and I am satisfied with his answer and I hope you are too, if not I don't know what more I can say.

Laters,
Mikef5

I don't know how much plainer it can be expressed, if you have digital cable you will receive it without change.
...
I hope you are too, if not I don't know what more I can say.

Look, I'm not trying to get in a big fight here. It truly is ambiguous to my eye.

I would be completely satisfied if there was a simple one word yes/no answer to the simple question I posed above. I don't want to have to assume there will be no encryption because Mr. J would have said so if there was.

I'm having trouble understanding why it is so obviously clear but reads ambiguous to me. This is the way I parsed his response:

Comcast customers with a
digital cable (set-top box),
HD (set-top box),
or HD/DVR set-top box
will receive all channels ... without any change in the way they currently select channels

Comcast customers using an internal QAM tuner with no CableCARD may or may not fall into this group. It is ambiguous to me because they can encrypt and still satisfy the above statement. The same exact ambiguity just happened a month ago with grandfathering and encryption of INHD1/2,ESPN-HD,DISC-HD.

If there was no statement from any CSR to consider, then I wouldn't be as picky, but there was a statement about encryption, so I was/am looking for an explicit statement to the contrary, not an implied statement.

I don't know how much plainer it can be expressed, if you have digital cable you will receive it without change. If Mr. J had meant that they were going to use encryption he would have said so and just to ease your concerns I specifically asked about those specific channels and the answer was, without change. Don't read more into it than there is, it is not in Comcast's interest to pi** off their customers and believe me I will hold their feet to the coals if not. I went through the fiasco with the DVR rollout and will again if need be but I know Mr. J. and his commitment to his customers and I am satisfied with his answer and I hope you are too, if not I don't know what more I can say.

Laters,
Mikef5

I've got to agree with sfhub. If you asked him about the encryption issue, his statement did not adddress it at all. He simply stated:

"Comcast customers with a digital cable, HD or HD/DVR set-top box will receive all channels in a high quality digital format without any change in the way they currently select channels and use digital cable services."

Nothing about internal tuners.

In case my concern is not clear, this is the previous statement (apparently also from Mr. J) regarding encryption of INHD1/2,ESPN-HD,DISC-HD:Existing HDTV customers will be “grandfathered” and WILL NOT be impacted by this change.http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6344279&&#post6344279

Well, I am/was an existing HDTV customer and I *was* impacted by the change. My STB was not affected. My internal QAM tuner was affected. I know I wasn't the only existing HDTV customer to be impacted.

I am concerned about being "not impacted" in the same way with HDTV locals.

Look, I'm not trying to get in a big fight here. It truly is ambiguous to my eye.

I would be completely satisfied if there was a simple one word yes/no answer to the simple question I posed above. I don't want to have to assume there will be no encryption because Mr. J would have said so if there was.

I'm having trouble understanding why it is so obviously clear but reads ambiguous to me. This is the way I parsed his response:

Comcast customers with a
digital cable (set-top box),
HD (set-top box),
or HD/DVR set-top box
will receive all channels ... without any change in the way they currently select channels

Comcast customers using an internal QAM tuner with no CableCARD may or may not fall into this group. It is ambiguous to me because they can encrypt and still satisfy the above statement. The same exact ambiguity just happened a month ago with grandfathering and encryption of INHD1/2,ESPN-HD,DISC-HD.

If there was no statement from any CSR to consider, then I wouldn't be as picky, but there was a statement about encryption, so I was/am looking for an explicit statement to the contrary, not an implied statement.

I understand your concerns and I am not trying to be combative with you and if you took it that way accept my apologies. I'm just not as worried about this as you seem to be. Because of my dealings with Mr. J in the past I have no reason to question his motives or his statements. Also I never believe a CSR they are script readers at best, the people in these forums know more than most of them do and are more up-to-date on their facts than they are. What did concern me was that Charter Cable was encrypting their basic tier and that's why I contacted Mr. J. in the first place to see if they were going to follow suit and to me it seems that they have no intention of doing that, but I see that you are not convinced. Here's what I will do if this comes to be, if they encrypt all digital channels I will use all of my contacts with the newspapers and tv and once again put Comcast to the light but I can assure you they have no plans to do this. Also, I can't control how Mr. J. answers the question, maybe, in his mind it is clear that they are not changing any thing.

But here's some good news, we haven't even started digital simulcasting or are even close to getting rid of the analog channels, that's 6 months to a year away if all goes well and we all know about Murphy's Law.... if something can go wrong .. it will... :) So there's plenty of time to wait and see what really happens.

Laters,
Mikef5

sfhub has a valid point. The statement does not address the concerns of direct connection(QAM tuner) customers. And history has already proved once, that what is said or not said, is crucial to what actually happens.

Shouldn't be too hard to get a direct answer and put the issue to bed.

Lets get the digital simulcasting going I need more HD, at least 30 or 50 of them :)
This is hilarious, they haven't even done the 64>256 QAM conversion up here yet..

For anyone who is interested, DirecTV,

Spaceway F1 began transmitting local HD signals to customers in Detroit on Oct. 20, and four markets -- Chicago, Philadelphia, Atlanta and San Francisco -- will begin receiving local HD broadcast channels this month. DIRECTV will also launch HD locals in Tampa, Dallas, Houston, Boston, Washington D.C., Los Angeles and New York in December.

From the following thread,

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=604495
Spaceway 2 (F2) Launched, next HD LIL markets announced. - AVS Forum

For anyone who has Comcast for both cable and internet, they just dropped a flier advertising various promotions for new customers. Almost as an afterthought, it includes," For existing cable customers, get $14 off internet service."

I figured they wouldn't extend it to me since I've used cable for internet access for more than a year, but I called anyway. Surprisingly enough, they are taking $14 a month off my internet bill for the next 6 months. Call 'em to get the discount.

JB

where are you located?

San Ramon - the flier was apparently dropped throughout the East Bay, not sure where else.

JB

For anyone who has Comcast for both cable and internet, they just dropped a flier advertising various promotions for new customers. Almost as an afterthought, it includes," For existing cable customers, get $14 off internet service."

I figured they wouldn't extend it to me since I've used cable for internet access for more than a year, but I called anyway. Surprisingly enough, they are taking $14 a month off my internet bill for the next 6 months. Call 'em to get the discount.

JB

That's always been there, AFAIK. Broadband pricing is discounted if you also take TV service.

You can do better than that, IMO and IME. With SBC offering the $14.95 promo, the bar has been set. SBC also offers a 3 Mb/s download package at $29.95. That's comparable to the current download with Comcast.

Simple scenario, you call to "point out" how the competition is so much cheaper. Unless you are already under a promo, there is ZERO reason you should be paying more than $30/mo for broadband on a combined TV/broadband account. I'm certainly not.

As soon as my dish buyback promo ended, I was on the horn. It was a drop in price or a move to SBC. One or the other was happening. Granted, I may remain capped at 4 Mb/s when they upgrade to 6 Mb/s in my area, but I generally don't need all that download speed anyway.

$40+/mo for broadband these days is out of touch with the market dynamics. Once SBC gets their ducks in a row on the TV stuff, the price competition should get even better.

Picked up a PIII box down at my local office yesterday (SF). Pretty painless. No wait, and the rep said she had about 40 of them. No HDMI cable was provided.

Hooked it up last night and was pleasantly surprised to see the improved picture quality on the analog channels (currently running component). It's a noticeable difference.

I was a bit worried that I would lose some "extra" channels that I had been getting at no cost after the box swap (Showtime HD, Max HD, FSW, etc.), but it turns out there was a silver lining. Not only did I not lose those channels, I'm picking up some other channels such as Speed, ESPN News, etc.

I'll probably wait to switch to HDMI until the DD/firmware issues that I've read about get resolved.

According to the above few posts - they're moving to an all digital format right?

Well, currently, you have to subscribe to a digital package to get the 6412 DVR.
For those of us who don't care about the digital content, that's $20/month for a DVR.

Now, if they move entirely to digital, with no change in prices (as posted above), will we be able to get the DVR for only $10/mo? Or are they sstill going to hook us for "digital classic" at an additional $10/month?

Basically, I want a DVR w/o paying for "digital classic." Any idea if that'll be possible?

thanks

Robert

related to rmcalhany's remark.

it seems that if they do an all digital solution, they will provide "simple" STB for free to the basic analog group of customers. this seems like quite the expense on their part, but i guess they are mandated by the FCC to make these available...of course, if they start charging, i'm sure they'll start losing some customers. if i recall correctly, one can actually (after owning the equipment) subscribe to satellite (at least Dish N) for only local stations at $6.99/mo (which is less than the $12.50 or so we pay for limited basic cable, but in the latter case, it can be used on several TV sets and not require any STBs.

anyway, i digress. if they give a Digital STB to all customers for each TV, then hopefully the upgrade to HDTV will only be $5 per set as opposed to tthe $11.95 fee they currently charge after the first HD set is "activated."

related to rmcalhany's remark.

it seems that if they do an all digital solution, they will provide "simple" STB for free to the basic analog group of customers. this seems like quite the expense on their part, but i guess they are mandated by the FCC to make these available...of course, if they start charging, i'm sure they'll start losing some customers. if i recall correctly, one can actually (after owning the equipment) subscribe to satellite (at least Dish N) for only local stations at $6.99/mo (which is less than the $12.50 or so we pay for limited basic cable, but in the latter case, it can be used on several TV sets and not require any STBs.

anyway, i digress. if they give a Digital STB to all customers for each TV, then hopefully the upgrade to HDTV will only be $5 per set as opposed to tthe $11.95 fee they currently charge after the first HD set is "activated."

I disagree, they will probably supply a cheap, low end digital box that can be used by non-digital customers. But, if you want to step up to the DVR they will probably still require stepping up to a digital package level of expense. It is the amount you are paying that gets you the services, not their transmission approach.

The plan as I understand is to do analog and digital simulcast first before switching to all digital. The timing between between ADS to all digital could end up being quite long as people have a lot of analog equipment. There are TVs, VCRs, DVRs, etc. Not all this stuff will work with new STBs. You'd be surprised how many people can't stand using STBs. Also people don't like to be forced to dump old equipment if it is working for them.

IMO they will end up moving the not so popular channels over to digital to free up some bandwidth but still have analog digital simulcasting for a while, just with reduced # of analog channels.

However, we will see how the market reacts once this stuff starts getting put in place.

The "Free" STB you guys are talking about is probably going to cost them around $30-$50. It won't have the bells and whistles of the Motorola box you are used to. There was a picture of a test model earlier in the thread.

--snip --

The "Free" STB you guys are talking about is probably going to cost them around $30-$50. It won't have the bells and whistles of the Motorola box you are used to. There was a picture of a test model earlier in the thread.

"Cost them around $30 - $50", cost us maybe an extra $10/ month on our cable bill - a rental rather than a purchase.

I have basic cable (analog) but can get all the local stations in digital (many HD) using my LG 4200A. I do not have a digital service 'cos I don't think it is worth the extra money. Do I think I will still be able to get these digital local stations once Comcast implements its plan? - No way, not without paying them more money. Comcast is in the business to make money - charge whatever the market will bear.

Luckily my OTA service works well and PBS is the best (Nova, Frontline, American Experience, etc.) and so well worth my donation every year.

peter

I have basic cable (analog) but can get all the local stations in digital (many HD) using my LG 4200A. I do not have a digital service 'cos I don't think it is worth the extra money. Do I think I will still be able to get these digital local stations once Comcast implements its plan? - No way, not without paying them more money. Comcast is in the business to make money - charge whatever the market will bear.The thing is you are *supposed* to get the HD locals unencrypted according to FCC regulations. I wouldn't be so quick to voluntarily give up something you've paid for and are supposed to get.

In fairness, Mikef5 says Comcast has no plans to encrypt HD locals, but that is based somewhat on trust. The actual response from Mr. J did not address the question directly of whether HD locals would be encrypted.

The plan as I understand is to do analog and digital simulcast first before switching to all digital. The timing between between ADS to all digital could end up being quite long as people have a lot of analog equipment. There are TVs, VCRs, DVRs, etc. Not all this stuff will work with new STBs. You'd be surprised how many people can't stand using STBs. Also people don't like to be forced to dump old equipment if it is working for them.

IMO they will end up moving the not so popular channels over to digital to free up some bandwidth but still have analog digital simulcasting for a while, just with reduced # of analog channels.

However, we will see how the market reacts once this stuff starts getting put in place.

The "Free" STB you guys are talking about is probably going to cost them around $30-$50. It won't have the bells and whistles of the Motorola box you are used to. There was a picture of a test model earlier in the thread.

interesting stuff. i don't _hate_ STB's per se, but it certainly adds an extra box which plain takes up space, regardless of whether they charge us for it or not. for our bedroom situation, that is going to be a pain since i don't know where i'd put the box. in fact, that's one selling point of cable over satellite: analog cable doesn't require a STB (again, regadless of cost). to me, that's a plus.

then again, if they do this transition slowly from ADS to full digital over a few years, it will be less a painful process. surely, any new set i buy will hopefully have some form of cable card or built in digital tuner that will properly take in the digital signal from the wall without the need for a STB.

for the record, i'm using the limited basic with the HD option on one of our sets. i really don't watch that much TV. i only have interest in the major networks and of course getting these in HD on my HD set (or sets to come). i'm quite pleased that for our non-HD sets, i can get by without a STB.

(yes, i'd love a PVR, the the extra money to go to digital cable classic in addition to the extra $10/mo makes the price way too steep for our limited watching habits)

I disagree, they will probably supply a cheap, low end digital box that can be used by non-digital customers. But, if you want to step up to the DVR they will probably still require stepping up to a digital package level of expense. It is the amount you are paying that gets you the services, not their transmission approach.
I think it's the DCT700 that was shown here earlier that would downconvert the digital to analog for basic subs.

There is a new DVR model, the DCT3412 and DCT3416 that are being rolled out in DS areas.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=604142
Official Comcast 3412 & 3416 STB Discussion - AVS Forum

I think it's the DCT700 that was shown here earlier that would downconvert the digital to analog for basic subs.

There is a new DVR model, the DCT3412 and DCT3416 that are being rolled out in DS areas.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=604142
Official Comcast 3412 & 3416 STB Discussion - AVS Forum

The 34xx looks pretty cool, although no one has said if the 'Motorola Media Center' features work. I miss how I was able to share shows througout the house with my Replay units.

As for Digital->Analog converter boxes, my guess is by the time these become absolutely necessary, these things will be no bigger then a little dongle.

There is a new DVR model, the DCT3412 and DCT3416 that are being rolled out in DS areas.



I'm waiting for Barovelli to magically appear and show us pictures of 3412's sitting in his warehouse :)

actually better yet...how about 3432's

(which is possible since he had the DCT-700's on the test bench months ago...)

although the xx32 (ie the ones motorola offers with the 320Gb drive) is a pipe dream since Comcast seems to have settled on just the 120 or 160Gb versions :(

I got 2 quick question, and any help is appreciated

1. Does the HD DVR comcast box now have HDMI in it? Mine only has DVI, but I got it the day it came out.

2. Anyone know if the campbell/saratoga area now finally has showtime HD. (I can't call comcast and ask them because they are all idiots over there...). Note we had showtime HD, but they took it away when they gave us discovery HD....because we supposely have the worst bandwidth in all of CA.

I think it's the DCT700 that was shown here earlier that would downconvert the digital to analog for basic subs.
Here's the DCT700 along with pictures from Keenan
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=542401

Notice the only outputs are composite and RF. No Component/DVI/HDMI/SPDIF/TOSLINK/Firewire.

1. Does the HD DVR comcast box now have HDMI in it? Mine only has DVI, but I got it the day it came out.

The 6412 Phase III box has HDMI out but doesn't have DVI. Both the Phase II and III have component outs.

All is not well in paradise...

About halfway through ER last night, watching it time shifted on my new PIII box, I started to get small blocks of green, red, yellow, and black that filled up the screen, making the program unviewable. At first I thought it was something to do with the feed, (since throughout the show I was also experiencing intermittent audio drop-outs), but when I switched channels, the blocks were still there. They were on all my channels. I went back to Lost, which I had recorded the night before and watched off the new PIII with no problems, and lo and behold, the blocks were there. Audio was still intact in all cases. Went to another input to pick up the signal off my OTA HD box, and the blocks were gone. Then I went upstairs to check the signal on my set running a cable card, and there were no issues.

Given the symptoms, I'm guessing that the problem is either a) with the box, or b) with the component cables. These were the same cables I had been using with my previous box without problems. I rechecked the connections at the back of the unit and all looked good. Getting to the back of my TV is another matter as it's quite difficult. What do you think, should I make the effort to first swap out the cables, or just take the box back and exchange it for another one? However I look at it, both solutions are an inconvenience.

Here's the DCT700 along with pictures from Keenan
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=542401

Notice the only outputs are composite and RF. No Component/DVI/HDMI/SPDIF/TOSLINK/Firewire.
So no HD then obviously. You can watch the digital channels OK, but with a crappy picture. I wonder if they will force basic cable subscribers to use this box for digital local channels including HD which would then not be HD any more ;-(

peter
p.s. you wonder why many people small a rat when Comcast makes this type of statement... "improvements" mean increasing the prices and reducing the quality for those not willing to pay these high prices / price increases that Comcast will state are justified by the "better service"

All is not well in paradise...

About halfway through ER last night, watching it time shifted on my new PIII box, I started to get small blocks of green, red, yellow, and black that filled up the screen, making the program unviewable. At first I thought it was something to do with the feed, (since throughout the show I was also experiencing intermittent audio drop-outs), but when I switched channels, the blocks were still there. They were on all my channels. I went back to Lost, which I had recorded the night before and watched off the new PIII with no problems, and lo and behold, the blocks were there. Audio was still intact in all cases. Went to another input to pick up the signal off my OTA HD box, and the blocks were gone. Then I went upstairs to check the signal on my set running a cable card, and there were no issues.

Given the symptoms, I'm guessing that the problem is either a) with the box, or b) with the component cables. These were the same cables I had been using with my previous box without problems. I rechecked the connections at the back of the unit and all looked good. Getting to the back of my TV is another matter as it's quite difficult. What do you think, should I make the effort to first swap out the cables, or just take the box back and exchange it for another one? However I look at it, both solutions are an inconvenience.


I've had this happen a few times when I was playing button tag with my remote, read doing many functions very quickly. I found that by depowering the box, not just shutting it off, but unplugging it, briefly, fixed it both times that I've seen it.

I've had this happen a few times when I was playing button tag with my remote, read doing many functions very quickly. I found that by depowering the box, not just shutting it off, but unplugging it, briefly, fixed it both times that I've seen it.


This is the solve-all for P III DVR boxes. As of now I think the firmware needs quite a bit of updating as mine has crashed numerous times and frozen too. Luckly, all you need to do is reset it, and you don't lose anything unless it was recording while this happens. It's yet to just die on me while I was gone and not record something so it's bareable.

p.s. you wonder why many people small a rat when Comcast makes this type of statement... "improvements" mean increasing the prices and reducing the quality for those not willing to pay these high prices / price increases that Comcast will state are justified by the "better service"
Basically Comcast's wet dream is to have everyone hooked on VOD with nothing satellite can do about it. To make that dream a reality, they need to free up bandwidth whether that is in your best interest or not. Digital is more efficient than analog but analog is more convenient for the end user. They'll throw in an HD channel here and there to keep your grumbling to a minimum, but I suspect the bulk of this bandwidth is gonna get allocated to VOD.

On the other hand, if you flip the view and give users PVRs with enough tuners and large enough hard drives, I think they can have a much better VOD experience and not tie up all the bandwidth.

I'm waiting for Barovelli to magically appear and show us pictures of 3412's sitting in his warehouse :)

actually better yet...how about 3432's

(which is possible since he had the DCT-700's on the test bench months ago...)

although the xx32 (ie the ones motorola offers with the 320Gb drive) is a pipe dream since Comcast seems to have settled on just the 120 or 160Gb versions :(

A cherrywood finish workbench? Let's not give anyone any ideas.

3412? That's a digital only DVR, aye?. None yet for for the South. The 700s are still sitting in wait state.

Buzz now is around the EMTA.

http://static.flickr.com/27/62480642_672121018d.jpg

Still looking for help unpacking them. ;) ;)

A cherrywood finish workbench? Let's not give anyone any ideas.

3412? That's a digital only DVR, aye?. None yet for for the South. The 700s are still sitting in wait state.

Buzz now is around the EMTA.

Still looking for help unpacking them. ;) ;)

hmmm....who's eMTA is that? I figured you would get motorola's but it doesnt look like theirs?

http://broadband.motorola.com/catalog/productdetail.asp?image=large&productID=388

...and plenty of help is available here for unpacking any of your new toys :) (well maybe not for the DCT700)

Looks like this,

http://www.arrisi.com/product_catalog/listers/index.asp?id=367
Arris | Home

Clear QAM squashed in Sunnyvale?

I live in Comcast's 550 MHz Sunnyvale slums, and have used an EyeTV 500 to tune in to clear QAM HDTV for the last year.

This last week, all my Clear QAM TV stations went away - I still get musicmatch stations, analog TV, and internet service. I've gone through a couple of tuning sessions to see if anything pops back up, to no avail.

If this is going to be the case, on top of taking away Discovery HD and ESPN-HD, I'm just going to dump Comcast in favor of a good DSL company! I don't watch a lot of TV, but I like to see football in HDTV, and liked the quality - both technical and editorial - of Discovery HD.

I was previously mulling over cutting back on cable money (considering the amount of money I'm already paying Comca$t), but with ESPN-HD and Discovery HD, I barely justified it to myself. Now? Well, let's just say that if this doesn't resolve itself soon, I'm calling customer support to pull the plug!

My area still has HD locals unencrypted. Hopefully your experience is an isolated temporary glitch and not a sign of things to come. Otherwise we will have to send Mikef5 into action.

Clear QAM squashed in Sunnyvale?

I live in Comcast's 550 MHz Sunnyvale slums, and have used an EyeTV 500 to tune in to clear QAM HDTV for the last year.

This last week, all my Clear QAM TV stations went away - I still get musicmatch stations, analog TV, and internet service. I've gone through a couple of tuning sessions to see if anything pops back up, to no avail.



I just called my parents (who also live in the 550Mhz Slums of Sunnyvale) and had them check the channel status using the diagnostic screens on their Cable box...It shows that the HD Locals are still in the clear....And I'd bet that they are also clear in your area (at least I'm certain they havent purposely encrypted that channels). They may have been doing some upgrades that affected your tuner though. It looks like some of the regular digital channels are now 256QAM..which is a good thing since they need to convert those in order to free up some bandwidth to squeeze in InHD1/InHD2/FSNBA-HD on your system...We also have a 550Mhz system in Saratoga and they did that upgrade a few months ago and then added those channels...hopefully you will get them soon also (assuming you subscribe to digital classic :rolleyes:

I've had this happen a few times when I was playing button tag with my remote, read doing many functions very quickly. I found that by depowering the box, not just shutting it off, but unplugging it, briefly, fixed it both times that I've seen it.

I gotta remember that these boxes are getting to be more and more like computers. That's the second time in 3 months where a hard reset (unplug and replug) has solved a problem. Thanks!

I just called my parents (who also live in the 550Mhz Slums of Sunnyvale) and had them check the channel status using the diagnostic screens on their Cable box...It shows that the HD Locals are still in the clear....And I'd bet that they are also clear in your area (at least I'm certain they havent purposely encrypted that channels). They may have been doing some upgrades that affected your tuner though. It looks like some of the regular digital channels are now 256QAM..which is a good thing since they need to convert those in order to free up some bandwidth to squeeze in InHD1/InHD2/FSNBA-HD on your system...We also have a 550Mhz system in Saratoga and they did that upgrade a few months ago and then added those channels...hopefully you will get them soon also (assuming you subscribe to digital classic

Thanks a lot for checking.

The EyeTV 500 is supposed to be able to handle 256QAM - I'll have to double-check the tuner itself somehow. (Find a friend with working 256QAM and plug it in, I guess.) I'll wait until the middle of the week to see if the problem clears itself up.

I'll also simplify my cabling setup (i.e. reduce splits) to see if that fixes things - could signal strength become critical in a 256QAM transistion?

Thanks a lot for checking.

The EyeTV 500 is supposed to be able to handle 256QAM - I'll have to double-check the tuner itself somehow. (Find a friend with working 256QAM and plug it in, I guess.) I'll wait until the middle of the week to see if the problem clears itself up.

I'll also simplify my cabling setup (i.e. reduce splits) to see if that fixes things - could signal strength become critical in a 256QAM transistion?

I believe the HD Channels have been 256QAM from the start (along with the 4 KQED Digital Channels), so if you got those before than your system was handling the 256QAM...All the original digital channels were 64QAM, and they are moving those...They also may have shifted around some of the channels to fill the bandwidth better as they feed up space. If I remember, they said 707 was sitting at 117Mhz, and it was definetely listed as Clear (and 722/DSCHD was ENC). Good luck "clearing" up your problem.

and yes, 256QAM takes more signal but I havent seen any issues since the conversion (everything is good and I have several splitters)

I believe the HD Channels have been 256QAM from the start (along with the 4 KQED Digital Channels), so if you got those before than your system was handling the 256QAM...
Yes that is correct. The OTA HD is around 19Mbps per 6MHz and 256QAM is around 38Mbps. They wanted to fit 2 OTA (+subchannels) per 6MHz so they used 256QAM from the start for HD channels.

256QAM is more sensitive to signal problems than 64QAM.

Constant HD Video Stutter problems in Martinez, CA on Comcast. The INHD, local channels except Fox sports all seem to stutter. So far only ESPN HD and FoxHD doesn't stutter. It's extremely annoyning. I'm just curious if this is something that can be fixed by Comcast or is it more likely an issue with my houses internal wiring? Also, On-Demand doesn't seem to stutter but HBO-HD stutters constantly.

I have two new Motorola 6412 Phase III DVR's. Only one is hooked up to an HD TV right now. My TV is an HP Pavilion 65" DLP.

Did anybody have this problem before and how did you fix it? (Hopefully you've fixed it!)
I've searched through this thread and there were a few posts on video stuttering and suggested trying a new cable run with no splitters or connecters. I'll try that tomorrow but was curious if there were any other suggestions.

Update:Now no stutter on INHD watching Laker Game... and No stutter on Posiden adventure, ESPN sunday night football game, HBOHD show Rome. . Something change at night? Very weird....

Thanks, B.

We finally closed on our house in Livermore and are moving in this week. I will be using D* for most everything as I have an HDTivo already. But I really want to get the Giants and Sharks in HD.

I have the Comcast Silver package right now in out apartment and was wondering if I transfer service to my home what is the absolute minimum I need to keep getting the FSN HD games? I have a cable card/QAM tuner set so I would prefer to not need a box. Will basic cable still get me ch. 720? Or will it get scrambled without having a digital package? Any help would be nice so I can call BS on the CSR when I call!

TIA.

We finally closed on our house in Livermore and are moving in this week. I will be using D* for most everything as I have an HDTivo already. But I really want to get the Giants and Sharks in HD.

I have the Comcast Silver package right now in out apartment and was wondering if I transfer service to my home what is the absolute minimum I need to keep getting the FSN HD games? I have a cable card/QAM tuner set so I would prefer to not need a box. Will basic cable still get me ch. 720? Or will it get scrambled without having a digital package? Any help would be nice so I can call BS on the CSR when I call!

TIA.

InHD1/InHD2 and FSN-HD are part of Digital Classic...You can add Digital Classic on top of basic cable for $9.95/mth. Just have them add the Digital Classic 'Tier' not the Digital Classic 'Package' (the package also includes Expanded basic)

Constant HD Video Stutter problems in Martinez, CA ....
I have two new Motorola 6412 Phase III DVR's. Only one is hooked up to an HD TV right now. My TV is an HP Pavilion 65" DLP.
Thanks, B.

I recently replaced my last remaining "old 6412" with a new phase III and immediately got "stuttering" (pixelation) on the same cable that the old box seemed to work fine on. I removed an amplifier/splitter on that line and the phase III then worked fine. Looks like the phase IIIs might be more sensitive to single strength than the old boxes (?).

InHD1/InHD2 and FSN-HD are part of Digital Classic...You can add Digital Classic on top of basic cable for $9.95/mth. Just have them add the Digital Classic 'Tier' not the Digital Classic 'Package' (the package also includes Expanded basic)
Let us know if you success in getting that package (I hope you do - 'cos then I'll try for a 3rd time!) - I have called twice and spoken to 2 different reps and have been consistently told that I need Expanded Basic in order to put together a package that includes INHD1/INHD2 and DISC-HD (I also needed Digital Classic and the HD service). The minimum cost was around $60/month.

Peter
p.s. this topic was discussed at length a month or so ago - when Comcast started encrypting these HD channels

I found all that when I searched on the topic. It was all so confusing that's why I posted. Do you think I will get grandfathered in since I am just moving service?

I don't think think INHD, INHD2, Discovery HD Theater, and ESPNHD require digital service. I subscribed to the $5 HDTV service (along with $45 basic expanded service) after Comcast started encrypting those channels. They would not offer CableCARD service and gave me a STB instead. I now receive the above channels along with the local HD channels. I e-mailed Comcast, and they stated that the $5 HDTV service included the local HD channels, INHD, INHD2, and Discovery HD Theater (if they were offered locally). It would also include ESPNHD if I subscribed to basic expanded service. They did not mention anything about digital service. I recommend e-mailing Comcast yourself to find your local channel lineup.

I wonder what their "official" reasoning is for not offering CableCARD unless you get the digital package. If you are paying the $5 for HDTV service it would cost them less to give "rent" you CableCARD. The unofficial reason most likely has to do with losing you as a VOD customer.

If one of the main purposes of CableCARD is so you can opt out of leasing STB, any scenario where you get an STB should be drop in replaceable with a CableCARD, as long as your TV is capable.

I don't think think INHD, INHD2, Discovery HD Theater, and ESPNHD require digital service. I subscribed to the $5 HDTV service (along with $45 basic expanded service) after Comcast started encrypting those channels. They would not offer CableCARD service and gave me a STB instead. I now receive the above channels along with the local HD channels. I e-mailed Comcast, and they stated that the $5 HDTV service included the local HD channels, INHD, INHD2, and Discovery HD Theater (if they were offered locally). It would also include ESPNHD if I subscribed to basic expanded service. They did not mention anything about digital service. I recommend e-mailing Comcast yourself to find your local channel lineup.

what the CSR told you is wrong.!

I found all that when I searched on the topic. It was all so confusing that's why I posted. Do you think I will get grandfathered in since I am just moving service?

i _think_ you will get grandfathered in if you move "locally." if i recall correctly from the original posting from Mr. J, that was supposed to be the case.

what the CSR told you is wrong.!
But what the CSR did for him is right(eous) :)

I believe Comcast encrypted INHD and ESPN because of the new sets showing up with cable tuners (QAM enabled). They probably weren't worried about the relatively small number of geeks using QAM tuners in their computers but those small LCD HD sets with QAM tuners in the kitchen they get no extra money got them scared. DiscoveryHD has always been encrypted here.

Sigh...
Chronicle reports Comcast will raise rates around 7%, for expanded basic (analog)...
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/11/23/BUGGNFSM9Q1.DTL
Nearly $50/mo.

Sure they've done a lot of improvements, but that's what the last 2years of 6% increases were for, right? and satellite competition?

The 7% is to cover all the VOD they are licensing and providing for "free" to differentiate themselves from satellite.

The 7% is to cover all the VOD they are licensing and providing for "free" to differentiate themselves from satellite.
No big surprises here - I posted a few thoughts earlier this week before this was announced. You ain't seen nothing yet IMHO... just wait until Comcast figure out how to exploit the move from analog to digital cable to make more profits.

-> Comcast is in the business to make money - charge whatever the market will bear.
and
->"improvements" mean increasing the prices and reducing the quality for those not willing to pay these high prices / price increases that Comcast will state are justified by the "better service"

Just remember that there is basic cable at about $12/month where you get all the broadcast channels in HD, and there is always OTA which is free! You do have other choices besides expensive packages from Comcast and satellite providers.

peter

No big surprises here - I posted a few thoughts earlier this week before this was announced. You ain't seen nothing yet IMHO... just wait until Comcast figure out how to exploit the move from analog to digital cable to make more profits.

-> Comcast is in the business to make money - charge whatever the market will bear.
and
->"improvements" mean increasing the prices and reducing the quality for those not willing to pay these high prices / price increases that Comcast will state are justified by the "better service"

Just remember that there is basic cable at about $12/month where you get all the broadcast channels in HD, and there is always OTA which is free! You do have other choices besides expensive packages from Comcast and satellite providers.

peter

Yup. Although I believe the specific term is "what the monopoly market will bear" ;)
Hey, time for more re-regulation, huh? :) Wish RCN would expand some more...

Unfortunately re cheap basic cable, Comcast has effectively snared all of us on this forum by requiring expanded basic to get the HD-DVR. And I can't get a DVR for OTA either (directTV etc. ones require satellite still.)

I am also one of those people who HATE STBs, and have lots of other analog CATV tuners and devices- DVD recorders, Tivo, VCR, etc.
If they DROP analog cable entirely, I'M OUT OF HERE.
Unless they somehow give out a broadband decoder for me... (eg ALL analog channels decoded from digital, and rebroadcast to me... none of this "tune channel 3" crap. Similar annoyance for the digital simulcast of FM... umm, I like to use my STEREO to tune in radio, not my TV..!

With this price increase, I may have to drop my digital cable tier. I've mostly watched my fill of INHD/DiscoveryHD eye candy anyway. So Comcast will lose $10 instead of gain $7...
hmm, except then they charge more for my HD-DVR stb, right? crap! they've thought of everything...

Edits:
I did math wrong, it's around a $3 price increase, not 7... death by small cuts , but not as bad as $7/mo.

For OTA DVR, I did find a Sony ATSC HD-DVR (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00067TYEK/002-5288436-5052006?v=glance&n=172282&%5Fencoding=UTF8&m=A3LJ5WMKNRFKQS&v=glance) (250gb/30hr), around $600+ ... works with CableCard, too. TVGuide EPG.
If you can get good OTA reception and don't like analog cable channels, it will pay for itself in 1 yr :)
Though I do like my SciFi and Discovery channel, so guess I'm still stuck...

The 7% is to cover all the VOD they are licensing and providing for "free" to differentiate themselves from satellite.

Seen "Karaoke On Demand" yet?

The license fee for "Layla" is incredible. :rolleyes:

Seen "Karaoke On Demand" yet?

The license fee for "Layla" is incredible. :rolleyes:

:D :D :D :D :D :D

Got some more tinder for the fireplace today, a flyer raving about OnDemand. Comcast ought to be cited for unsolicited and untruthful junk mail. Not to mention all the poor trees that get cut down to send this waste of paper out every month.

Instead of wasting money on these nice glossy, heavy bond, full color, 4-page flyers on services we don't get, try getting us those services instead. These flyers being sent to areas that do not receive these services is just rude and obnoxious.

With all respect to Keenan and his travails, here is my situation.
We have two homes, one in Los Gatos, and one in Aptos.
In LG, we get Fox, NBC, CBS, ABC, PBS, INHD, INHD2, DiscoveryHD, ESPN and
HBO in HD. We don't get On Demand. Like Keenan, we continue to get bombarded with print and televised promotions for stuff we can't get.
In Aptos, it is even worse. We only get Fox, NBC, CBS, PBS, DiscoveryHD, ESPN and HBO in HD. We don't even get ABC, since Comcast 'over the hill' doesn't have carriage of a live ABC HD signal! But, what is interesting, is that we get On Demand. The system over here is evidently even older, and lower capacity, than the 550Mhz systems. Not sure why we get On Demand instead of more HD channels. Pretty dumb marketing move IMHO.
Anyway, who has a more heart wrenching story than Keenan or me?

I currently have the Comcast Standard Cable package (limited basic and expanded basic service) and was told that all I need is the Comcast HD box ($5 extra/mo.) to view HD material. With the Standard Cable package, will shows such as ESPN and Fox Sports Net be broadcasted in HD in addition to my local channels? I have talked to 4 service reps: 2 of them say I will be able to and the other 2 say I need to upgrade to Digital Classic. Any help will be appreciated.

I currently have the Comcast Standard Cable package (limited basic and expanded basic service) and was told that all I need is the Comcast HD box ($5 extra/mo.) to view HD material. With the Standard Cable package, will shows such as ESPN and Fox Sports Net be broadcasted in HD in addition to my local channels? I have talked to 4 service reps: 2 of them say I will be able to and the other 2 say I need to upgrade to Digital Classic. Any help will be appreciated.
If you have a QAM digital tuner in your TV or have a digital QAM tuner box then you can get all the broadcast channels in HD with limited basic - you don't need a HD box in this case and you don't need to spend more money.

Which HD materials do you wish to view - the 4 main broadcast networks plus KQED or more stuff such as INHD1, INHD2, DISC-HD, ESPN-HD etc? My understanding is that for these you need the Digital Classic tier. There is some debate even here if you can get these special HD channels by adding Digital Classic to limited basic or you have to add it to the expanded basic service. According to my phone call with Comcast I would need to add it to expanded basic (pushing the price way up)

So bottom line is - it all depends on your TV set (QAM tuner or not) and which HD stations you wish to watch.

peter

Plumeria,

Thank you your response. I just called the San Francisco station and the CSR with whom I spoke with stated that all I would need is the HD box in addition to my Standard Cable package. I had him individually check if ESPN HD and FSN HD would be available in addition to the local HD channels with my current Standard Package, and he confirmed them both. So once I get some free time, I plan on heading over to the station to swap boxes.

Plumeria,

Thank you your response. I just called the San Francisco station and the CSR with whom I spoke with stated that all I would need is the HD box in addition to my Standard Cable package. I had him individually check if ESPN HD and FSN HD would be available in addition to the local HD channels with my current Standard Package, and he confirmed them both. So once I get some free time, I plan on heading over to the station to swap boxes.


Good luck...but I suspect you will be disappointed...I'm not sure what the CSR checked...but FSNHD requires Digital Classic which is another $10/mth (since its shown on INHD2, which is part of that)...

unfortunately the CSRs seem to be wrong more than they are right (which is sad since a question like yours should be so simple for them to answer)

Anyway, who has a more heart wrenching story than Keenan or me?

Go a little more south - Monterey has the same HDs as Santa Cruz, but no On Demand.

Am I the winner? :(

Anyway, who has a more heart wrenching story than Keenan or me?

How about knowing that the "ghettocast" systems will not be upgraded until late 2006 or mid-2007?

fitprod

I read some older articles from about 9 months ago that said Comcast and TiVo had signed some sort of agreement. The net result was that sometime in 2006, you would be able to get an HD DVR from Comcast that uses the TiVo interface software. But I also saw a confusing mix of other articles from around the same time that suggested that the deal had been called off, then on again, then...

Does anybody know for sure if an HD TiVo option is coming from Comcast, and if so, when?

I read some older articles from about 9 months ago that said Comcast and TiVo had signed some sort of agreement. The net result was that sometime in 2006, you would be able to get an HD DVR from Comcast that uses the TiVo interface software. But I also saw a confusing mix of other articles from around the same time that suggested that the deal had been called off, then on again, then...

Does anybody know for sure if an HD TiVo option is coming from Comcast, and if so, when?

That would be news to me...I haven't heard anything about the deal being called off. And I think they said "late 2006".

Good luck...but I suspect you will be disappointed...I'm not sure what the CSR checked...but FSNHD requires Digital Classic which is another $10/mth (since its shown on INHD2, which is part of that)...

unfortunately the CSRs seem to be wrong more than they are right (which is sad since a question like yours should be so simple for them to answer)

davisdog,

Does Digital Classic include all the channels that Standard Cable has? I also have another TV that is not HD and has the regular Comcast box. If I upgrade to digital classic, will all the shows still be viewable on that box or will I need to upgrade it? Thanks.

The 7% is to cover all the VOD they are licensing and providing for "free" to differentiate themselves from satellite.
It might be to pay for all that crap I get in my mailbox too. I can't believe this outfit has raised prices 6% twice in the last two years and is raising it another 7% this coming year. Those are incredible amounts of increase. It's a shame that not all areas benefit from all these increases. Nothing has changed in the last 2 years in the Santa Rosa area other than HSI being added to a larger portion of the city.

We still have more analog channels than digital ones..and it's the end of 2005..

Of course we want to make sure the Comcast executives are paid handsomely,

Burke Reups with Comcast
By Mike Farrell 11/23/2005 2:31:00 PM

Comcast Corp. chief operating officer Steve Burke signed a new employment agreement with the cable giant Tuesday, bumping up his annual salary to $2 million from $1.23 million in 2004, with a bonus of at least 300% of his base pay ($6 million) if performance targets are met.

According to the employment agreement, filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission Wednesday, Burke will also receive credit as part of the MSO’s deferred-compensation plan of $1.68 million in 2006, rising to $2.04 million in 2010.

According to the agreement, Burke did not receive a signing bonus, grant of stock options or restricted-stock units or other special one-time benefits for entering into the agreement.

http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6286744.html?display=Breaking+News&referral=SUPP&nid=2226
Multichannel News: The Cable Industry Book-of-Record

Could some of those performance goals possibly be getting higher revenue without having to provide more services..?

Between CATV and high speed internet access, our Comcast bill getting rediculous. One of the few reasons I have stuck with Comcast this long is that I don't need a set-top box for every TV in the house, which would be necessary for satellite TV. As soon as Comcast switches to all digital, that advantage will be gone.

If the satellite companies ever get their act together and start offering the locals in HD, I will dump Comcast, and that's from someone who lives in an area with an 860MHz, full service cable system.

-Steve

Between CATV and high speed internet access, our Comcast bill getting rediculous. One of the few reasons I have stuck with Comcast this long is that I don't need a set-top box for every TV in the house, which would be necessary for satellite TV. As soon as Comcast switches to all digital, that advantage will be gone.

If the satellite companies ever get their act together and start offering the locals in HD, I will dump Comcast, and that's from someone who lives in an area with an 860MHz, full service cable system.

-Steve
DirecTV has been offering KPIX, KNTV, KTVU and KGO, all in HD since 11/22. Requires a new STB and dish, and by playing CSR roulette it should be free with a rebate involved. KQED, the UPN and WB stations will be added in about 6 mos and a HD-DVR should be available at the first of the year. These are all in the MPEG4 format which folks in Detroit have been saying is indistinguishable from the OTA feeds of the same stations.

An update...UPN, WB and PBS, all HD, are already on transponders for the Detriot market although not live as of today. Our local UPN-WB-PBS should go live much sooner than 6 mos it appears. Eventually all HD channels in the SF market will be on DirecTV...Comcast better step up to the plate, and soon, especially in my area.

DirecTV has been offering KPIX, KNTV, KTVU and KGO, all in HD since 11/22. Requires a new STB and dish, and by playing CSR roulette it should be free with a rebate involved. KQED, the UPN and WB stations will be added in about 6 mos and a HD-DVR should be available at the first of the year. These are all in the MPEG4 format which folks in Detroit have been saying is indistinguishable from the OTA feeds of the same stations.

An update...UPN, WB and PBS, all HD, are already on transponders for the Detriot market although not live as of today. Our local UPN-WB-PBS should go live much sooner than 6 mos it appears. Eventually all HD channels in the SF market will be on DirecTV...Comcast better step up to the plate, and soon, especially in my area.

Keenan,
Thanks for the info! I haven't spent much time following the satellite services lately. DirectTV's website still only mentions the local HD channels as being available with an OTA antenna (seems to be maintained about as often as Comcast's website).;)

-Steve

I am curious as to why people are so up in arms about having to use an STB. I understand that it adds another component to your setup but, in my opinion, it isn't the end of the world. I would speculate that most of us on this thread are fairly in touch with our "geekness" and have scores of "devices" scattered throughout the house. You're going to be in the same boat w/ DirecTV -- if not more so. I am relatively young (late 20's) and as far as I can remember, STB's have been around just as long as cable. Remember the old TV's in the 70's and 80's that only had tuners that went up to channel 13? STB's were necessary to any cable. Now with the advent of the cable card, I can see why people would be a little peeved to have to pay a "rental fee" for the card -- but unless your TV was purchased in the last year or two, it's not even an option. So why would one base their choice of content providers on whether or not you have to use an STB? In my opinion, I don't mind puting a little mini STB on older TV's if it means everything gets moved to the digital spectrum. Having more digital bandwidth for us and more analog bandwidth for emergency providers far outweighs having a little STB on our older TV's. Just my opinion.

davisdog,

Does Digital Classic include all the channels that Standard Cable has? I also have another TV that is not HD and has the regular Comcast box. If I upgrade to digital classic, will all the shows still be viewable on that box or will I need to upgrade it? Thanks.

Ninerfactor,

All of your boxes will have access to the same channels...The non-HD box just will get a blank screen since it can't handle the high resolution picture.

If you order the "Digital Classic Package" it will bump your bill up $10 and that will include everything you have now + a few additional HD Channels (Discovery-HD, InHD1, InHD2, FSNBA-HD....) and some additional Non - HD Channels and Digital Radio channels that you may or may not care about ...here's the non-HD channels that are added with Digital Classic in my area


120 Noggin
121 Discovery Kids Channel
136 G4
161 Game Show Network
162 BBC America
178 Weatherscan Local
183 Style
220 Discovery Health
228 BYU
229 EWTN
272 The Science Channel
273 National Geographic
400 Comcast Sports Net - West
402 ESPNews
404 Outdoor Life Channel
405 The Golf Channel
407 ESPN Classics
501 Turner Classic Movies
502 WE: Women's Entertainment
503 Independent Film Channel

Go a little more south - Monterey has the same HDs as Santa Cruz, but no On Demand.

Am I the winner? :(


Considering that your office is the only 1Ghz Comcast system in the Bay Area, NO!!!! :D

I am curious as to why people are so up in arms about having to use an STB. I understand that it adds another component to your setup but, in my opinion, it isn't the end of the world. I would speculate that most of us on this thread are fairly in touch with our "geekness" and have scores of "devices" scattered throughout the house. You're going to be in the same boat w/ DirecTV -- if not more so. I am relatively young (late 20's) and as far as I can remember, STB's have been around just as long as cable. Remember the old TV's in the 70's and 80's that only had tuners that went up to channel 13? STB's were necessary to any cable. Now with the advent of the cable card, I can see why people would be a little peeved to have to pay a "rental fee" for the card -- but unless your TV was purchased in the last year or two, it's not even an option. So why would one base their choice of content providers on whether or not you have to use an STB? In my opinion, I don't mind puting a little mini STB on older TV's if it means everything gets moved to the digital spectrum. Having more digital bandwidth for us and more analog bandwidth for emergency providers far outweighs having a little STB on our older TV's. Just my opinion.

You make a good argument Fender. I personally have been using STBs since I ordered the Z channel in LA back in the 70s. Cable was only a twinkle at that time where I was and the Z channel offered me movies without commercials and the like. It had an encrypted OTA signal. The price for it was like $12 a month, but I didn't care, I was a geek even then.

There is one hole in your argument though. There are a great many TV viewers out there that only subscribe to the bare minimum and they have several TVs. If you need a STB for each TV and you get one for free you still have to pay for the extras. Those subscribers don't pay any extra today and they are the ones that have real issue with the need to pay for additional boxes.

Now, if the cable companies decide to charge one set price for any and all STB required to service your needs, then you will get less resistance.

I am curious as to why people are so up in arms about having to use an STB. I understand that it adds another component to your setup but, in my opinion, it isn't the end of the world. I would speculate that most of us on this thread are fairly in touch with our "geekness" and have scores of "devices" scattered throughout the house. You're going to be in the same boat w/ DirecTV -- if not more so. I am relatively young (late 20's) and as far as I can remember, STB's have been around just as long as cable. Remember the old TV's in the 70's and 80's that only had tuners that went up to channel 13? STB's were necessary to any cable. Now with the advent of the cable card, I can see why people would be a little peeved to have to pay a "rental fee" for the card -- but unless your TV was purchased in the last year or two, it's not even an option. So why would one base their choice of content providers on whether or not you have to use an STB? In my opinion, I don't mind puting a little mini STB on older TV's if it means everything gets moved to the digital spectrum. Having more digital bandwidth for us and more analog bandwidth for emergency providers far outweighs having a little STB on our older TV's. Just my opinion.

Well, for one thing, STBs take up extra space. My wife has a small flip down LCD TV mounted under a cabinet over the counter top. If we had to use a STB, it would have to sit on the counter top or be inside a cabinet, neither of which is very convenient. Same goes for the wall mounted LCD TV in our bedroom. There's no place to put a STB except on top of a piece of furniture somewhere, and then cables would have to be rerouted. We do use a STB for our main display in the living room to watch HDTV. But for all of our other TVs, it much more convenient to simply connect an RG6 cable to the back of the TV and use its internal tuner and remote. Of course, when all TV's finally have digital tuners that are compatible with both OTA and CATV, then it won't be an issue (other than the expense of upgrading).

-Steve

Using the STB for PC recording has the advantage of not tuning on ur HDTV, which is the main reason i choose STB instead of Cablecard, actually i always leave the STB on

I am curious as to why people are so up in arms about having to use an STB. I understand that it adds another component to your setup but, in my opinion, it isn't the end of the world. I would speculate that most of us on this thread are fairly in touch with our "geekness" and have scores of "devices" scattered throughout the house. You're going to be in the same boat w/ DirecTV -- if not more so. I am relatively young (late 20's) and as far as I can remember, STB's have been around just as long as cable. Remember the old TV's in the 70's and 80's that only had tuners that went up to channel 13? STB's were necessary to any cable. Now with the advent of the cable card, I can see why people would be a little peeved to have to pay a "rental fee" for the card -- but unless your TV was purchased in the last year or two, it's not even an option. So why would one base their choice of content providers on whether or not you have to use an STB? In my opinion, I don't mind puting a little mini STB on older TV's if it means everything gets moved to the digital spectrum. Having more digital bandwidth for us and more analog bandwidth for emergency providers far outweighs having a little STB on our older TV's. Just my opinion.

It's not just for TV's. It's for everything else too. I understand benefit of more bandwidth & all-digital, but... I think they could more easily do that by moving all the pesky niche (eg shopping/misc) channels to digital, free up their analog, etc... but doubt contracts let them do that...

In any case, the main competitive issue for Comcast is that widespread availability of CATV analog tuner devices, means analog cable customer's don't NEED a STB. Satellite DOES.
If they remove analog cable for majority, then they lose competitive advantage (only VOD and maybe locals are in their favor)... price (and customers) would go to Satellite..

But, re TV's: why no want STB?
- extra space/heat/power/yet another component in the rack, wasted
- yet ANOTHER remote !!! (BIG pain in the ass)
- wasted advanced features of TV tuner (PIP, noise reduction etc)
Sure, if every TV had a CableCard slot, and Comcast would actually support it properly, that would help a lot. But they don't, and that means paying $$$ for new TVs. (Sure you'd have to anyway for Digital OTA conversion, but w/ analog cable, you avoid that!)
- fee (likely?) to rent addnl boxes for all TVs/tuners
Positive: each old TV gets better picture, more channels, and EPG- ok, that's good

My main personal reason, beyond STB on top of each TV:
- I have lots of other RECORDING devices that are CATV- Tivo, two DVD recorders, PC, etc. along w/ my Comcast HD-DVR. I use them all a lot.
EACH of them would need a STB to be able to tune in anything, unless I hooked them all up to a "central" STB, and only recorded one show at a time (no channel tuning conflict). I want each of them to be able to tune in ANY single channel, at ANY time, independent of each other.
Most of them have IR blasters , so they should properly tune their own "slaved" STB, and it could work, but it's a big pain in the butt (see above space/power/heat/cost)...
I can at least handle these technically, but logistically it's a pain. I simply don't have enough outlets, for one..
If Comcast put some node- or house-level remodulator, that took the digital signal and re-modulated to all the analog CATV before my house, I'd take that. I want all channels on my RG6 cable, not just Ch3...


For "plain " majority of analog users, w/ only a few TVs, STBs are not TOO much of a pain... especially if Comcast offered them for free, w/ good remotes, and they were small.
But, a lot of those same "simple" users already have enough problems understanding, working with and using the current Digital cable STBs as it is now, I'd imagine... especially if they have VCRs. ("why do I have to set to channel 3? Which remote do I use again? Why can't I record one show and watch another on TV?") ....

Good points, Bobby, Steve, and cgould. All of my TV's are either RP or CRT so I didn't think of the whole "wall mounting" thing -- all of my TV's are on stands/cabinets. Also, I got rid of my VCR's, Tivo, etc. a long time ago so that doesn't affect me either. It will be interesting to see if they offer a house-level conversion box.

Re: Set top boxes -
They don't have to be where the TV is located. If RF controlled, they can be put anywhere. Many Sat. boxes are RF controlled. We have a D* box that is controlled by an inexpensive home distribution system and BEV sat. box that are RF controlled. We can change the channels from any place where there is a TV. I don't think there are any cable RF controlled boxes, tho.

Re: D*. We have a first generation box. In the mean time, several months ago, upgraded our basic cable to Comcast HD and are addicted to the DVR. We originally got BEV 4 years ago for the HD - they still have lots more than Comcast - but didn't get their DVR which just came out.
If D* does begin offering more HD, not only local channels but "national" ones, our rental DVR fm. Comcast is GONE. Comcast doesn't even offer UPN and WB HD. BEV does. If D* comes thru, we may drop BEV altho I'll miss some of the channels we don't get here - mainly the BBC.

...mike

I noticed over in one of the Comcast DVR threads scanpa has posted that Comcast is not going to support external drive storage due to copyright issues. If Comcast wants to stay competitive they are going to have to come up with a DVR that has more space than the pathetic amount they have now. This DVR will not even hold a weeks worth of programming of HD material.

With HDD so cheap nowadays I don't understand what the deal is with using puny 120GB drives.

I've got the 6412 and I've been seeing a lot of extreme lag recently. Sometimes when I press a button on the remote, the box doesn't process it for quite a while, sometimes up to 30 seconds. If I press more than one button when this occurs, the box will lag and then execute all the button presses one after another.

This seems to be worse when watching or recording an HDTV channel.

Anyone else see this? Is there a cure? Newer firmware, perhaps?

I've got the 6412 and I've been seeing a lot of extreme lag recently. Sometimes when I press a button on the remote, the box doesn't process it for quite a while, sometimes up to 30 seconds. If I press more than one button when this occurs, the box will lag and then execute all the button presses one after another.

This seems to be worse when watching or recording an HDTV channel.

Anyone else see this? Is there a cure? Newer firmware, perhaps?
I do. And, it is much worse on one box than on the other (newer) one.

But it's worse than just remote lag-- the screen is very slow to refresh. Reminds me of spyware on my computer...

I do. And, it is much worse on one box than on the other (newer) one.

But it's worse than just remote lag-- the screen is very slow to refresh. Reminds me of spyware on my computer...

So is this improved on the Series III 6412? I still have the Series I as I really didn't have the need to swap boxes. However if the "lag" is minimized with the Series III then it might be worth trading in.

FCC is expected to "recommend" that cable companies offer channels a-la-carte -- i.e. allow customers to subscribe to singel channels rather then tiered groups. I'm sure the cable co's will say "Thanks for the recommendation...no thanks".

http://money.cnn.com/2005/11/29/technology/personaltech/fcc_cable.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes

I noticed over in one of the Comcast DVR threads scanpa has posted that Comcast is not going to support external drive storage due to copyright issues. If Comcast wants to stay competitive they are going to have to come up with a DVR that has more space than the pathetic amount they have now. This DVR will not even hold a weeks worth of programming of HD material.

With HDD so cheap nowadays I don't understand what the deal is with using puny 120GB drives.

Nuts- this is indeed the largest problem with the box... :mad: It's always a race to watch stuff, and question whether to keep eye-candy stuff or not (hey Comcast, you're wasting a chance for us to demo HDTV + DVR to friends, if we have to keep deleting stuff and not keeping cool DiscovHD demos on :)
I love my 120gb Tivo. Wish I could expand my DVD recorders :)

A little disingenuous excuse, since people can dub out via firewire & fake dVHS already on PC... thought bit more of pain (realtime only) than just sucking everything off an external drive..
and I can always dub via SVideo to DVD-R/RAM and copy that way (although it won't be HD.)

If they're going to choose this, agreed, they should at least put in 250gb drives or more (at least 160gb, for 1wk?), like Sony did...

Edit: PS Keenan, do you have a link to that thread/post?

FCC is expected to "recommend" that cable companies offer channels a-la-carte -- i.e. allow customers to subscribe to singel channels rather then tiered groups. I'm sure the cable co's will say "Thanks for the recommendation...no thanks".

http://money.cnn.com/2005/11/29/technology/personaltech/fcc_cable.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes
No kidding, we'll see a-la-carte over cable's dead body. Only if they are forced to offer it will it happen and no doubt it will require a minimum subscription rate such as how the DVR is.

No kidding, we'll see a-la-carte over cable's dead body. Only if they are forced to offer it will it happen and no doubt it will require a minimum subscription rate such as how the DVR is.
Oh don't worry, those cable guys are sly. They will find a way to make the a-la-carte cost more than the bundled before they offer it. Then they will point to FCC as the reason your bill is going up.

The same thing happened when they forced MSO to break down your bill into itemized sections. They increased the per outlet fee and broke it down per section. I don't think I've ever seen my cable bill go down unless I drop stuff.

Edit: PS Keenan, do you have a link to that thread/post?
It's in the 6412 thread, in the last couple of pages, a post by scanpa, who is usually on the money with his info.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=558602&page=20&pp=30
New moto 6412 with HDMI and SATA - AVS Forum

Oh don't worry, those cable guys are sly. They will find a way to make the a-la-carte cost more than the bundled before they offer it. Then they will point to FCC as the reason your bill is going up.

The same thing happened when they forced MSO to break down your bill into itemized sections. They increased the per outlet fee and broke it down per section. I don't think I've ever seen my cable bill go down unless I drop stuff.
Exactly. They'll do it, but it will just as expensive as full subscriptions.

I still can't get over Comcast raising the rates, 6%, 6% and 7% in the last 3 years. It's nice to have a monopoly, I think everyone should have one. :eek: :D

My Toshiba 46HM95 QAM tuner can not pick up Fox/CBS (79-1/2) and KGO/KQED HD (117-1/2), it can only pick up NBC/KRON HD (116-1, 111-2), my other QAM tuner can pick all these HD channels using the same cable outlet, signal strength is very good.

Have anyone had similar problem ? I guess it's Toshiba problem.

I've got the 6412 and I've been seeing a lot of extreme lag recently. Sometimes when I press a button on the remote, the box doesn't process it for quite a while, sometimes up to 30 seconds. If I press more than one button when this occurs, the box will lag and then execute all the button presses one after another.

This is really annoying, and I did not realize how annoying it really is until I fired up the good old ReplayTV the other day. The ReplayTV responds instantly to any infrared command -- what a concept! I think Motorola's software engineers need a serious refresher course on real time systems design. Either that, or Motorola needs to start paying their engineers better than McDonald's hourly rates ;-)

This is really annoying, and I did not realize how annoying it really is until I fired up the good old ReplayTV the other day. The ReplayTV responds instantly to any infrared command -- what a concept! I think Motorola's software engineers need a serious refresher course on real time systems design. Either that, or Motorola needs to start paying their engineers better than McDonald's hourly rates ;-)
That's really ironic, people used to complain that ReplayTV was slow to respond. This 6412 lag must be real bad.

That's really ironic, people used to complain that ReplayTV was slow to respond. This 6412 lag must be real bad.

Two different kinds of lags. The Replay lag is the same lag that any IR blaster will receive (the Replay was actually better then Tivo's IR blaster). You had to wait for Replay to recieve the command, give it to the STB, and then the STB would process it. All in all it was about 5 seconds. The "new" lag, of course, is the fact that the STB is receiving the command but not doing anything with it for a much longer amount. I've seen it delay up to 60 seconds.

Can anyone answer my previous question? Does the Series III improve upon this?

Two different kinds of lags. The Replay lag is the same lag that any IR blaster will receive (the Replay was actually better then Tivo's IR blaster). You had to wait for Replay to recieve the command, give it to the STB, and then the STB would process it. All in all it was about 5 seconds. The "new" lag, of course, is the fact that the STB is receiving the command but not doing anything with it for a much longer amount. I've seen it delay up to 60 seconds.
Nah, really, Replay has that kind of lag too. I have 5 of them, I should know.

Nah, really, Replay has that kind of lag too. I have 5 of them, I should know.

That's odd. I had 3 different Replay units for about 3 years (the 45xx and 50xx series) and never had the kind of lag I see on the Moto box. If anything, the STB would completely ignore the commands that were being sent to it via the IR blaster -- it never "cached" them like the Moto box does and then executes them 30 seconds later. Oh well.

My Toshiba 46HM95 QAM tuner can not pick up Fox/CBS (79-1/2) and KGO/KQED HD (117-1/2), it can only pick up NBC/KRON HD (116-1, 111-2), my other QAM tuner can pick all these HD channels using the same cable outlet, signal strength is very good.

Have anyone had similar problem ? I guess it's Toshiba problem.
Looks very similar to the sub-channel problem after 8pm we used to have with Comcast and the LG 4200A which somehow Comcast fixed (search for "after 8pm" and you should find the thread here). Channels share the same main channel.

Try and tune to 117-3 (KQED Encore) before 8pm and see what happens (if anything). However your problems sounds worse since you can get neither Fox nor CBS.

peter
p.s. do you get anything on 98-8?

I noticed over in one of the Comcast DVR threads scanpa has posted that Comcast is not going to support external drive storage due to copyright issues. If Comcast wants to stay competitive they are going to have to come up with a DVR that has more space than the pathetic amount they have now. This DVR will not even hold a weeks worth of programming of HD material.

With HDD so cheap nowadays I don't understand what the deal is with using puny 120GB drives.

On probably that same thread, someone linked to the Phase III guide: http://broadband.motorola.com/catalog/product_documents/Final%20DCT6400%20Series%20III%20Product%20Data%20Sheet%2052 4553-001-a.pdf.

Note that it states it has DES encryption. I wonder exactly what is encrypted. The contents of the hard drive? The uplink/downlink of the Ethernet?

That's really ironic, people used to complain that ReplayTV was slow to respond. This 6412 lag must be real bad.
You want slow, try the DirecTV HD-TiVo, it's slooooow. I have a Dish Network 942 as well and it screams, it responds instantaneously, the 6412 falls in the middle.

I've got the 6412 and I've been seeing a lot of extreme lag recently. Sometimes when I press a button on the remote, the box doesn't process it for quite a while, sometimes up to 30 seconds. If I press more than one button when this occurs, the box will lag and then execute all the button presses one after another.

This seems to be worse when watching or recording an HDTV channel.

Anyone else see this? Is there a cure? Newer firmware, perhaps?

Got our box last spring. No real problem w. the remote commands then. Starting about July it got worse and worse as time went on. The problem isn't consistent. Sometimes it will execute commands w.o. a problem, othertimes a VERY serious lag. It seems worse if you enter a series of commands.
It has nothing to do w. the remote. If I press a button on the box itself there is sometimes a lag as well.
I never had a lag problem w. a sat. box - altho none of them were/are DVRs. Our lst generation D* box still works fine.

...mike

...mike

Looks very similar to the sub-channel problem after 8pm we used to have with Comcast and the LG 4200A which somehow Comcast fixed (search for "after 8pm" and you should find the thread here). Channels share the same main channel.

Try and tune to 117-3 (KQED Encore) before 8pm and see what happens (if anything). However your problems sounds worse since you can get neither Fox nor CBS.
p.s. do you get anything on 98-8?
Thanks. My Toshiba can pretty much tune into other digital channels that my other QAM tuner sees, including 104-1/2 and many music channels that are in the clear. As for 117 and 79, Toshiba couldn't see any sub-channels in these two.

There doesn't seem to be anything on 98-8 in San Mateo (both tuners). I am still waiting for Toshiba's reply on getting a firmware update.

Thanks. My Toshiba can pretty much tune into other digital channels that my other QAM tuner sees, including 104-1/2 and many music channels that are in the clear. As for 117 and 79, Toshiba couldn't see any sub-channels in these two.

There doesn't seem to be anything on 98-8 in San Mateo (both tuners). I am still waiting for Toshiba's reply on getting a firmware update.
So 117-3 before 8pm didn't work? Different problem from the LG one - sounds like a toshiba fix is needed

peter

No, it didn't. I was aware that when KQED switches from digital multicast to HD at 8pm, it is problematic for some tuners/DVR. Apparently Toshiba tuner just couldn't see the sub-channels at 79 and 117 :-(

For those wondering when Tivo will be available on Comcast boxes, the Chron has article that says by the middle of '06. http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/11/30/BUGC3FVRUF1.DTL

It's a pretty funny read -- the main topic of the article is how Tivo is trying boost revenue and appease the Network gods by offering "Commercials OnDemand".