I'm sure I'm just imagining cause and effect, but has anyone with the lovely 6412 DVR noticed an upsurge in the usual sluggish response to commands with the advent of the new advertising system on the guide? I had to do an unplug reset three nights ago, and I had one of those frustrating sessions last night where the box is lagging minutes behind your keypresses. Hadn't run across this in quite some time. I'm wondering if downloading all those stupid ads is increasing the problem.

I'm sure I'm just imagining cause and effect, but has anyone with the lovely 6412 DVR noticed an upsurge in the usual sluggish response to commands with the advent of the new advertising system on the guide? I had to do an unplug reset three nights ago, and I had one of those frustrating sessions last night where the box is lagging minutes behind your keypresses. Hadn't run across this in quite some time. I'm wondering if downloading all those stupid ads is increasing the problem.
I get that at least every two days. I haven't noticed a big difference.

I've been confused on this ever since I've seen/heard about it. How is that listed on the bill? On my bill it lists "DVR Service With HDTV......$9.95". I don't recall, but I'm guessing if you just have the HD-capable STB, the 6200, it would be listed as "HDTV Service...$5.00"?

I guess Comcast doesn't really list the equipment, they instead list the "service"....which is interesting because Comcast has always claimed they don't charge for "HD".

Let me ask this, does anyone have this $5 HD charge with just Limited Basic and no STB?

High Definition TV - 5.00
Limited Basic - 16.99
Digital Addl Outlet 6.95

This gives me 2 MOTO6200 boxes.

How much is cable card, because my new plasma takes cable card...

High Definition TV - 5.00
Limited Basic - 16.99
Digital Addl Outlet 6.95

This gives me 2 MOTO6200 boxes.

How much is cable card, because my new plasma takes cable card...

my god you get ESPNHD with that?? lucky. and here you are complaining about UHD! i have to put down at least 70/mo to get the same thing.

High Definition TV - 5.00
Limited Basic - 16.99
Digital Addl Outlet 6.95

This gives me 2 MOTO6200 boxes.

How much is cable card, because my new plasma takes cable card...
Is this currently what you pay for 2 HD STBs? For my second TV, I have a 6200 and I pay 5.00 for High Definition TV and 6.95 for an additional digital output for that TV alone. So if your only paying $11.95 extra for 2 HD STBs, you are getting a good deal.

I expect that a cable card (with HD subscribtion) will cost an additional $11.95 just as an additional HD STB should cost. However, since you are not paying that amount for each STB, who knows?

For a house that already has HD service and isn't grandfathered into pre-Comcastic rates, CableCard is billed at $5/month as "additional HDTV service". For me, the HD-DVR on my non-CableCard display is $9.95/mo and an additional non-HD-STB is $6.95/mo. For me, the big tickets are "basic and expanded cable" at $48.25/mo and Digital Silver at $29.95/mo. Keep meaning to pull the plug on Digital Silver but also keep thinking eventually I will get interested in one of those HBO drama in high def.

And to respond to something a few posts back, as of six months ago at least, CableCard still required a cableco visit. They don't trust us to be sophisticated enough to do the install.

My mistake earlier on saying Los Gatos would be like San Rafael. I meant Santa Rosa. Hey, I'm a South Bay guy and get those northern cities confused!!! Kind of like knowing the difference between Finland/Norway/Sweden!!!
Anyway, things still seem a bit confusing and not positive for those of us in the 550 areas, although at least we get FSN-HD in Los Gatos.
I also sent a note expressing my concerns to Mr. Johnson at Comcast. He sent a reply saying that Comcast is committed to 're-investing' in the 550 systems. He said that the system in Antioch, Pittsburg, and Bay Point is being upgraded now. He also said there will be announcements in the next 90-120 days as to which systems are next. He emphasized that they are committed to re-investment in Los Gatos, Saratoga and Milpitas. I guess we'll have to wait and see. I will wait the 90-120 days, but if there is no news I'm joining Keenan on Dish.
Mike

i'm in l.g. too. what hd channels are you currently receiving from comcast?

The Dish Network web site will give you a complete list of channels. 15, I believe, are Voom channels. Go to: http://www.dishnetwork.com/content/programming/dishhd/offer/index.shtml

There are four HD locals via the satellite - KGO-ABC, KPIX-CBS, KNTV-NBC and KTVU-FOX. Using the OTA tuner I get those four plus WB20, KBCW44, KRON4 and KQED in HD.

The 622 DVR has been very reliable. I've had it since February and have had no trouble with it. It has three tuners... two satellite and one OTA, 350 GB hard drive, and good 9 day program guide.

I'm not worried about the court cases.

The $67 is for one DVR that is good on one HD set and as many other sets that you want to tie into its RF distribution system. I have two analog TV's hooked up to it.

HBO? I have no idea. You'll have to check the site I gave you above.


Sounds like you want a lot but don't want to pay for a lot, Lem. You've probably got the best deal you're ever going to get.

Networked streaming video is coming, but not for a while... and I bet they'll charge a lot for it too.

Larry
SF


did you have to pay any fees for start up or installation? did you have to buy any equipment? did you have to make any commitment re length of your subscription? thanks

High Definition TV - 5.00
Limited Basic - 16.99
Digital Addl Outlet 6.95

This gives me 2 MOTO6200 boxes.

How much is cable card, because my new plasma takes cable card...
CableCARD is listed as "Additional Digital Outlet", so it's $6.95, the fact that it's a CC is not even spelled out on the bill.

The "High Definition TV - 5.00", are you sure it's not listed as HDTV equipment fee? Comcast's yearly price lists have it as an equipment fee, there is no mention of HDTV fee anywhere.

CableCARD is listed as "Additional Digital Outlet", so it's $6.95, the fact that it's a CC is not even spelled out on the bill.

The "High Definition TV - 5.00", are you sure it's not listed as HDTV equipment fee? Comcast's yearly price lists have it as an equipment fee, there is no mention of HDTV fee anywhere.
My bill says HDTV additional service $5.00.

did you have to pay any fees for start up or installation? did you have to buy any equipment? did you have to make any commitment re length of your subscription? thanks

You have to lease the DVR... was $199, but with all the deals now, you get it for next to nothing, I think. Installation was free and included a new dish for the HD channels. I had to commit for 18 months.

Check the E* web site for the latest deals.

Larry
SF

My bill says HDTV additional service $5.00.
Mine says DVR Service With HDTV--$9.95. So essentially Comcast charges $5.00 for the HD STB but call it "HDTV service". If you had just Limited Basic and no STB you'd still get HD but you wouldn't be charged the $5 fee, that only comes into play when you need HD equipment. So, they call it "service", I call it "equipment", and Comcast corporate says they don't even have an HD charge. Typical...

Mine says DVR Service With HDTV--$9.95. So essentially Comcast charges $5.00 for the HD STB but call it "HDTV service". If you had just Limited Basic and no STB you'd still get HD but you wouldn't be charged the $5 fee, that only comes into play when you need HD equipment. So, they call it "service", I call it "equipment", and Comcast corporate says they don't even have an HD charge. Typical...
I guess they do it that way since they cannot charge for a digital outlet for $6.95 when you don't have digital.

DVR Service with HDTV = $9.95 - that's for the DVR box (DCT 6412 or 3412), they do not offer a non-HD DVR box by the way...

Digital Addl Outlet = $6.95 - that's for any additional digital box, I happen to have:

HDTV Additional Service = $5.00 (DCT 6200)

So... the 3412 DVR is $6.95, then the add'l 6200 is $11.95. :( Actually now that I realize it's $12/mo... I should get rid of that thing. I don't watch HD on it very much.

They seem to be putting it on in prime time. Comcast, we want it gone completely as it serves no real purpose except to annoy.

I've seen them too and they're very annoying and I'm glad they're only shown in primetime, coz I'm enjoying their absence right now!

:rolleyes:

Niner game looks great on NFLHD!

Niner game looks great on NFLHD!

i think it looks slightly better on KPIX. but its the same feed hehe.

two different comments:

1. i went to the comcast office in Santa Clara today to return my cable modem and gave a formal complaint regarding these lame ads in the Guide. the other person in line also agreed and made a complaint too. hopefully if there is enough fuss, they will get rid of this waste of screen real estate.

2. i see the 49er game is on 705 and 725. initially it was only on 725 (was in SD at least right at 7 on 705). anyone think 705 looks quite a bit better than 725 (less grain and cleaner picture)...both are of course better than SD, but i think the picture looks a lot cleaner and punchy on 705 to me.

2. i see the 49er game is on 705 and 725. initially it was only on 725 (was in SD at least right at 7 on 705). anyone think 705 looks quite a bit better than 725 (less grain and cleaner picture)...both are of course better than SD, but i think the picture looks a lot cleaner and punchy on 705 to me.


Yup.

Came to post exactly that.

Same audio and video feed, but inferior picture.

So 725 is more bandwidth constrained?

You have to lease the DVR... was $199, but with all the deals now, you get it for next to nothing, I think. Installation was free and included a new dish for the HD channels. I had to commit for 18 months.

Check the E* web site for the latest deals.

Larry
SF

Looks like they still charge $199 for the HD-DVR but credit you back $200 for signing up ($20 programming discount/month for 10 months).

+ $50 signup fee if you dont commit to any term...

If you commit to 18months then they waive the signup fee and give you 'priority' support

Yup.

Came to post exactly that.

Same audio and video feed, but inferior picture.

So 725 is more bandwidth constrained?

Probably, but I would assume its the feed from the "NFL Network" since they will be getting that via Satellite from a different provider... not something that Comcast is doing to constrain bw one channel or another...

of course I can't see 725 since I'm on a 550Mhz network :(

705 looks ok

i just like the HD NFL logo in the upper right hand corner ;)i think it looks slightly better on KPIX. but its the same feed hehe.

A's are playing on channel 720 and some how the picture looks much better than it has in the past. Game wasn't in the Comcast guide but I found it while channel surfing during half time of the 49er game. 49er game looks very good, KPIX seems to have all their ducks in a row with their HD programing.

Laters,
Mikef5

I have a cable card, they had to install it. They don't charge me a dime for the card. I also don't get charged for HD even though I get it. The first guy that installed the CC didn't have a clue. Another guy had to come out. All the second guy did was to make sure the "codes" were fine on the card. The "codes" didn't match up from the first guy. The second guy knew what he was doing.

I have a cable card, they had to install it. They don't charge me a dime for the card. I also don't get charged for HD even though I get it. The first guy that installed the CC didn't have a clue. Another guy had to come out. All the second guy did was to make sure the "codes" were fine on the card. The "codes" didn't match up from the first guy. The second guy knew what he was doing.
I expect that the HD that you are getting is just the unencrypted locals. Is that correct? If you are getting any of the encrypted channels, I would then think Comcast probably screwed up. If your only getting the unencrypted channels, why did you get a cable card since your built in tuner would do the same?

If your only getting the unencrypted channels, why did you get a cable card since your built in tuner would do the same?
He does have the benefit of tuning using the cable channel #s and if he's getting the encrypted channels too, then that's a pretty good deal for $0/month.

I expect that the HD that you are getting is just the unencrypted locals. Is that correct? If you are getting any of the encrypted channels, I would then think Comcast probably screwed up. If your only getting the unencrypted channels, why did you get a cable card since your built in tuner would do the same?


I have the silver digital package, so I get all the locals plus Discovery HD, ESPN HD, and HBO HD. I'm also in a 550(Sunnyvale) area which sucks major ass. :mad: :(

I have the silver digital package, so I get all the locals plus Discovery HD, ESPN HD, and HBO HD. I'm also in a 550(Sunnyvale) area which sucks major ass. :mad: :(
Maybe Comcast is giving 550 Mhz customers a break with the cable card since you are getting screwed so badly on content. Since you have a CC instead of the STB which is included with the 1st digital connection, the only thing they are not charging you for is the HDTV service ($5.00) and feel they shouldn't since they provide such limited HD content in 550 Mhz systems and why do it to you again.

I just noticed a new channel 726 - Universal HD. Did everyone else notice that?

does this mean espn2 (on channel 724) will be gone and replaced by universal HD? that sucks.
Update to channel changes from Mr. Johnson.
____________________________________________________________ ____________

You are welcome to post this on the site.

2006 US Open

Yes, we have made a temporary arrangement with Universal HD to carry the US Open Tennis Championship on Channel 726.

The US Open begins today, Monday, 8/28 and runs through 9/10.

After 9/10, Universal HD will be temporarily removed until it is permanently launched at a later date.

Channel line-ups that have ESPN 2 HD, will get Universal (550 MHz systems will not).

TNT HD Launching on September 20th

TNT HD is launching on channel 726.

In order to receive this channel customers must subscribe to Standard Cable, Digital Classic and HDTV.

Please note that this add takes place on the same day as the INHD2 drop.

INHD2 drops from Digital Classic; channel 720

Effective Date: 9/20/06

FSN Bay Area HD games will continue to be carried on 720.

____________________________________________________________ ________

So that is the official word on the channel changes for now.
UHD will be here temporarily ( for the US Open) and TNT-HD is coming in Sept and INHD2 will be gone.

Laters,
Mikef5

sorry i misread. now i see what you mean - if i currently have espn2 HD then i would have universal HD (on 726) now. thanks.
does this mean espn2 (on channel 724) will be gone and replaced by universal HD? that sucks.

i'm pretty eager to see if 720 will carry the FSN college football game today. it isn't listed on the guide but that isn't unusual, since last night's A's game wasn't listed either. the big game will be on this new FSN college football broadcast and i wanna hold a big game party and it would be that much better to have HD to entice people to come :)

I am getting a cableCard installed this coming tuesday. My tv is currently pulling in the unencrypted HD cannels and giving me some digital versions of some channels. Given that my service is Basic and Expanded would the CC give me anything extra? A previous poster mentioned that i would benefit by the channel listing on the CC? Is it true?
Currently my TVGOS does not list the local HD channels.
BTW even if you tell them you are not retarded they insist on "assisting" you with the install for a one time fee of a cent less than $16.
Mostly I am doing this to test the cablecard system of my tv but it would help if there is an added benefit?
I currently get ESPN2HD too. I would love to get Discovery HD which I don't currently :(

I am getting a cableCard installed this coming tuesday. My tv is currently pulling in the unencrypted HD cannels and giving me some digital versions of some channels. Given that my service is Basic and Expanded would the CC give me anything extra? A previous poster mentioned that i would benefit by the channel listing on the CC? Is it true?
Currently my TVGOS does not list the local HD channels.
BTW even if you tell them you are not retarded they insist on "assisting" you with the install for a one time fee of a cent less than $16.
Mostly I am doing this to test the cablecard system of my tv but it would help if there is an added benefit?
I currently get ESPN2HD too. I would love to get Discovery HD which I don't currently :(
Cable card does not support TV Guide but does organize the channels the same as a STB (eg. 707 is ABC instead of 7.1).

Normally you do not get any additional channels with a cable card unless you subscribe to HD service.

Are you still getting ESPN2 HD? Comcast was previously providing both an encrypted as well an uncrypted version of ESPN2 HD but the unencrypted version had stopped transmitting when they started NFL HD Network about two weeks ago on my cable system?

Maybe Comcast is giving 550 Mhz customers a break with the cable card since you are getting screwed so badly on content. Since you have a CC instead of the STB which is included with the 1st digital connection, the only thing they are not charging you for is the HDTV service ($5.00) and feel they shouldn't since they provide such limited HD content in 550 Mhz systems and why do it to you again.


I really like HBO boxing, plus it is football season now.> :) I also live in an apartment complex which does not allow us to have satellite dishes. I have no choice.

Normally you do not get any additional channels with a cable card unless you subscribe to HD service.


This is incorrect. The HD channels will come with whatever programming package you subscribe to. For example, ESPN and Discovery, etc. will come with Digital Classic. There is no HD programming package.

There is an HD equipment charge, if you need Comcast equipment to decode the encrypted channels, of which there may be some HD channels.

Why Comcast calls this "HD service" is confusing when it is really for HD-capable equipment.

Before Comcast encrypted Discovery-HD and ESPN-HD in my area I didn't need any equipment from them other than the cable coming out of the wall to receive those channels and all 5 locals in HD. The only thing that has changed is that they have since encrypted those channels(even though we were promised they would be grandfathered..right.. :rolleyes: ) and now you need a Comcast supplied decryption device to view them.

Maybe Comcast is giving 550 Mhz customers a break with the cable card since you are getting screwed so badly on content. Since you have a CC instead of the STB which is included with the 1st digital connection, the only thing they are not charging you for is the HDTV service ($5.00) and feel they shouldn't since they provide such limited HD content in 550 Mhz systems and why do it to you again.
Nice idea but there's not a chance in hell that's what they are doing. Comcast has not shown any price consideration/deviation between full blown systems and the ghetto 550 systems, and they won't, until enough people dump the service and it starts to reflect on their bottom line.

If you just have standard basic I don't think there's much you'll get with a cable card. I'm pretty sure even Disc-HD isn't included without one of the digital packages.

Th only channels you'll get with that package would be the local HD and all their sub-channels, I think there's one or two a piece from KNTV and KGO, but you don't need a CC to get those, all it adds is having the channels listed as they are in the Comcast guide as opposed to how your display would list them.

The only time CC would provide any additional channels is if you had Digital Classic/above or one of the premium channels.

Comcast was previously providing both an encrypted as well an uncrypted version of ESPN2 HD but the unencrypted version had stopped transmitting when they started NFL HD Network about two weeks ago on my cable system?
Second unencrypted ESPN2-HD is still showing up in some areas.

Cable card does not support TV Guide but does organize the channels the same as a STB (eg. 707 is ABC instead of 7.1).

Normally you do not get any additional channels with a cable card unless you subscribe to HD service.

Are you still getting ESPN2 HD? Comcast was previously providing both an encrypted as well an uncrypted version of ESPN2 HD but the unencrypted version had stopped transmitting when they started NFL HD Network about two weeks ago on my cable system?

I am in Santa Clara and yes I think it(ESPN2 HD) is still unencrypted since I get it with just my TV tuner with the cable form the wall.
So essentially what I am hearing is that there is no added channel benefit...oh well...no harm in trying i guess. one time fee of $16 is chump change.
After about 3 CRs I was finally surprised to get hold of a lady who exactly knew what CC was and also knew what it would and what it wouldn;t give me. That is when I had gone ahead and ordered it to be installed. She had mentioned that I could subscribe to the bare minimum digital service for $5/m to get the digital channels.
I want to try it out without subscribing first. I wanna see if I start getting the digital versions of all the channels that I get currently. I would be happy as heck if I am able to get ComedyCentral and HGTV in digital using the CC. Although my tv does a good job even with analog I am sure digital would help with PQ quality.

my god you get ESPNHD with that?? lucky. and here you are complaining about UHD! i have to put down at least 70/mo to get the same thing.

I'm a grandfathered HD subscriber.

I'm a grandfathered HD subscriber.

doesn't change my initial reaction. its simply not fair to expect them to keep servicing you on the same level as i get while paying far less.

so much HD football today... i've never seen 4 channels run football at the same time (FSN, ABC, ESPN, ESPN2). comcast tailors to the sports nut. thank you comcast for providing the most complete HD sports lineup around. now please let me never see that damn ad on the onscreen guide again.

calbear...... our team was demolished!

so much HD football today... i've never seen 4 channels run football at the same time (FSN, ABC, ESPN, ESPN2). comcast tailors to the sports nut. thank you comcast for providing the most complete HD sports lineup around. now please let me never see that damn ad on the onscreen guide again.

calbear...... our team was demolished!
Comcast has nothing to do with what is shown on the networks, if you want to give out kudo's then the networks deserve those kudos not Comcast. The same programing is shown on Dish and Direct and while I love to watch HD as much if not more than the next guy, Comcast does not deserve praise any more than Dish or Directv do. All they do is show the programing they don't produce the stuff. I intend to write to the stations and express my gratitude to them for their efforts to do more HD content and ask them to continue with more especially sports. This is not a slam on you just pointing out to give credit where credit is do. ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

doesn't change my initial reaction. its simply not fair to expect them to keep servicing you on the same level as i get while paying far less.
So this should show you a little what it's like to be in a 550 MHz area, we pay the same as the rest of the Bay Area and get less, Fair ??? not in my view.

Laters,
Mikef5

Comcast has nothing to do with what is shown on the networks, if you want to give out kudo's then the networks deserve those kudos not Comcast. The same programing is shown on Dish and Direct and while I love to watch HD as much if not more than the next guy, Comcast does not deserve praise any more than Dish or Directv do. All they do is show the programing they don't produce the stuff. I intend to write to the stations and express my gratitude to them for their efforts to do more HD content and ask them to continue with more especially sports. This is not a slam on you just pointing out to give credit where credit is do. ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

never said they produced it, just said they provided the feeds. they've always picked sports above all else (see UHD for olympics, ESPN2HD for world cup, UHD again for tennis and TNT HD presumably for NBA). these are decisions made by comcast to carry these channels. that's why they get my kudos and my big fat check every month. sure they are carried by D* and E* but not in the same way. look at all the complaints about crappy PQ on the programming forum by people with different providers. with sports, PQ is by far the most important element.

lots of people are actually pissed they aren't carrying more general programming in HD but my response is... sports produces fresh material right now, which is more than I can say for all these looping channels.

So this should show you a little what it's like to be in a 550 MHz area, we pay the same as the rest of the Bay Area and get less, Fair ??? not in my view.

Laters,
Mikef5

that's why i've always suggested comcast bay area price discriminate and make you guys pay less! i'm on ur side!!

never said they produced it, just said they provided the feeds. they've always picked sports above all else (see UHD for olympics, ESPN2HD for world cup, UHD again for tennis and TNT HD presumably for NBA). these are decisions made by comcast to carry these channels. that's why they get my kudos and my big fat check every month. sure they are carried by D* and E* but not in the same way. look at all the complaints about crappy PQ on the programming forum by people with different providers. with sports, PQ is by far the most important element.

lots of people are actually pissed they aren't carrying more general programming in HD but my response is... sports produces fresh material right now, which is more than I can say for all these looping channels.
Nikeykid,
I've been on other forums, Dbstalk and statelliteguys, and I hear just the opposite. People like that they get more HD and for the most part are pleased with the picture quality. The same is here, some people think Comcast's picture quality sucks and others thinks it's the greatest. I have good quality but then again I don't get half the stuff that the rest of the Bay Area does. Because Comcast carrys the major networks and the major sports channels doesn't mean they deserve squat, they have them because they are money makers. Now if Comcast carried a station that the other providers don't, like Setanta Sport, then I could see giving them credit. They provide a signal and nothing more, their choice of stations is based on what brings in the most profit for the lest cost, just like the rest of the providers.

Laters,
Mikef5

Hi bleary,

I don't have EXPANDED BASIC here in Cupertino and I get more HD channels with only a small uptick over Limited Basic but a DEAL nevertheless.

When I say 'Incremental' I mean ESPN-HD/2, Discovery-HD, FSN-HD, etc. This is in addition to the normal Fox, ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS in HD.

In a former post I said:

Well, I'm pleased to confirm that, at least here in Cupertino, it is possible to get the incremental, non-premium HD channels for around $30/Mo.

I just got my cableCARD ($00), Digital Classic ($9.99), HD Service ($5.00) added to my current Limited Basic ($15.10) service.

The CSR that took my order absolutely stated, even argued, that getting Digital Classic, without also getting STANDARD CABLE too, would not allow me to get the additional HD channels over the locals in HD, that I already had at $00. (INHD1/2, DiscoverHD, ESPNHD).

I did have to pay them to "roll a truck" to put a CableCard into my set. I think it was $20 or so.

Tim

I am in Santa Clara and yes I think it(ESPN2 HD) is still unencrypted since I get it with just my TV tuner with the cable form the wall.
So essentially what I am hearing is that there is no added channel benefit...oh well...no harm in trying i guess. one time fee of $16 is chump change.

After about 3 CRs I was finally surprised to get hold of a lady who exactly knew what CC was and also knew what it would and what it wouldn;t give me. That is when I had gone ahead and ordered it to be installed. She had mentioned that I could subscribe to the bare minimum digital service for $5/m to get the digital channels.

I want to try it out without subscribing first. I wanna see if I start getting the digital versions of all the channels that I get currently. I would be happy as heck if I am able to get ComedyCentral and HGTV in digital using the CC. Although my tv does a good job even with analog I am sure digital would help with PQ quality.

Hi bleary,

I don't have EXPANDED BASIC here in Cupertino and I get more HD channels with only a small uptick over Limited Basic but a DEAL nevertheless.

When I say 'Incremental' I mean ESPN-HD/2, Discovery-HD, FSN-HD, etc. This is in addition to the normal Fox, ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS in HD.

In a former post I said:

Well, I'm pleased to confirm that, at least here in Cupertino, it is possible to get the incremental, non-premium HD channels for around $30/Mo.

I just got my cableCARD ($00), Digital Classic ($9.99), HD Service ($5.00) added to my current Limited Basic ($15.10) service.

The CSR that took my order absolutely stated, even argued, that getting Digital Classic, without also getting STANDARD CABLE too, would not allow me to get the additional HD channels over the locals in HD, that I already had at $00. (INHD1/2, DiscoverHD, ESPNHD).

I did have to pay them to "roll a truck" to put a CableCard into my set. I think it was $20 or so.

Tim
Getting the package you have has never been a problem, it's when you want the DVR where things get really expensive.

I still don't understand what that HD Service--$5.00 charge is though, if Comcast is going to charge that $5 you should be getting a HD capable STB. I would call Comcast and tell them to remove that $5 charge. Or at least list the CableCARD as being a $5 a month charge.


Mikef5, maybe you could get Mr. J to clarify what that is, my contention is that it's an HD-capable equipment charge. In the above case, TBoyd really doesn't get his CableCARD for free, or rolled into the sub price, he's really being charged $5 a month for it. Maybe it's how Comcast is getting around regulatory issues about charging for HD, they charge for the equipment instead, odd though that they list it as "HD service".

Mikef5, maybe you could get Mr. J to clarify what that is, my contention is that it's an HD-capable equipment charge. In the above case, TBoyd really doesn't get his CableCARD for free, or rolled into the sub price, he's really being charged $5 a month for it. Maybe it's how Comcast is getting around regulatory issues about charging for HD, they charge for the equipment instead, odd though that they list it as "HD service".
Jim,
Mr. Johnson is out of the state for a couple of weeks, when he comes back I'll bring this up to him. You might want to remind me, the mind is a fragile thing at my age :D

Laters,
Mikef5

Huh? What are you talking about? :p

Well the ads are gone in Alameda for now. Haven't shown up in primetime the last 2 nights, which is good. Any other other areas ad-free now? Any others still have ads?

South San Jose is ad-free as of noon Sunday. Let's hope it stays that way.

There is a great thread by Keenan on what HD is received in various areas.
LG gets Fox, NBC, CBS, ABC, KQED, INHD, INHD2, Discovery, ESPN and HBO.
We don't get NFL, Showtime, ESPN2.
We don't get VOD at all.
We appear to be one of the 'better' 550 systems since for some reason we get INHD and INHD2.
Mike

i'm in l.g. too. what hd channels are you currently receiving from comcast?

Livermore is also add free and has been since Friday. Thank you Comcast.

jeff

Fremont has also not shown the ads since Friday night. Hopefully they are gone for good and not just a weekday primetime issue.

ad free in Santa Clara since Friday when i complained in person to Comcast. (yeah, i'm sure it was that face-to-face confrontation that saved us all the problems for now. :) )

ad free here in walnut creek as well.

Hi, sorta newbie question here.

I'm in Santa Clara with Standard cable + HD.
As I understand it (regardless of location), I should be getting channels available in the 702 -> 709 range.

Then there are a whole bunch of channels that I might get if I'm lucky to be in an unencrypted area.
Are the following such channels?
ESPN (723), which I'm getting loud and clear.
INHD and INHD2, also comes through. (Is FSN HD available on INHD2 regardless of INHD2 encryption?)
DSC-HD, also receiving fine.
ESPN2 (724) was receiving fine, but recently have been getting transmit issues (bad signal)
NFL-HD (725) occasionally I receive this fine...other times, it doesn't even change to this channel (frozen previous channel)...I assume that's when there's no programming.
UHD (726) was receiving fine (watched Knight Rider one night), but now same thing as ESPN2. signal doesn't seem to be solid.

Are there any other Santa Clara subscribers out there (on the N/E side of 101)? Can you tell me if you're also experiencing these image quality issues on the new channels?

Also, if I have any of the above information incorrect (perhaps clarification on what technically should and shouldn't be encrypted....from the front page of this thread, I got the impression that INHD, INHD2, and ESPN should be encrypted for Standard Cable, but there was no mention of the new 724-726 channels)

Thanks for any help!

Originally Posted by nikeykid

calbear...... our team was demolished!

That was worse that the Texas Tech game a couple years back :eek:

I thought the FSNHD game looked pretty good. It's great to see so many HD games this year...at one point we were flipping between about four games that were all being broadcast in HD at the same time.

That was worse that the Texas Tech game a couple years back :eek:

I thought the FSNHD game looked pretty good. It's great to see so many HD games this year...at one point we were flipping between about four games that were all being broadcast in HD at the same time.

ABC, ESPN, ESPN2, FSN-HD all had college football running at the same time on saturday. that's like 4x more football than last year. the future of HD is exciting!!

Then there are a whole bunch of channels that I might get if I'm lucky to be in an unencrypted area.
Are the following such channels?
ESPN (723), which I'm getting loud and clear.
INHD and INHD2, also comes through. (Is FSN HD available on INHD2 regardless of INHD2 encryption?)
DSC-HD, also receiving fine.
ESPN2 (724) was receiving fine, but recently have been getting transmit issues (bad signal)
NFL-HD (725) occasionally I receive this fine...other times, it doesn't even change to this channel (frozen previous channel)...I assume that's when there's no programming.
UHD (726) was receiving fine (watched Knight Rider one night), but now same thing as ESPN2. signal doesn't seem to be solid.

Are there any other Santa Clara subscribers out there (on the N/E side of 101)? Can you tell me if you're also experiencing these image quality issues on the new channels?

Also, if I have any of the above information incorrect (perhaps clarification on what technically should and shouldn't be encrypted....from the front page of this thread, I got the impression that INHD, INHD2, and ESPN should be encrypted for Standard Cable, but there was no mention of the new 724-726 channels)

Thanks for any help!

i get all of the above stations all the time with limited basic cable + digital classic + HD.

(all via the Motorola Comcast 6200 HD box (no-DVR) supplied by Comcast). i live in the N/E portion of Santa Clara (near Rivermark).)

Derek

i get all of the above stations all the time with limited basic cable + digital classic + HD.

(all via the Motorola Comcast 6200 HD box (no-DVR) supplied by Comcast). i live in the N/E portion of Santa Clara (near Rivermark).)
I've seen similar reports from others... but I'm confused. I get "expanded basic" (analog, no set-top box for about $45/month or so.

Does "digital classic" replace "expanded basic"? I don't believe channels like Discovery, HGTV, and Comedy Central are on "limited basic", so I'm curious if you get those on "digital classic" (thus eliminating the need for "expanded basic", unless you have other sets that want to get the expanded analog channels).

What does this package (limited basic + digital classic + HD) cost you, and do you have to also pay for the 6500 HD box or is that included in the "+ HD"?

lemketron,

no, digital classic does not replace expanded basic. it adds a few channels like ESPN-Classic, SciFi, music channels, and some other "higher number" digital channels that i don't really watch.

so you don't get comedy central, discovery, HGTV, etc. )channels 36- ~72) but by getting digital classic, i end up with the added HDTV stations such as:

ESPN-HD
ESPN2-HD
TNT-HD/UHD (the former to be coming 9/20)
Discovery-HD
FSN-HD
INHD

in addition to the local stations which are available without the $9.95 digital classic fee.

perfect plan for me because all i want really are the local networks and ESPN-HD and FSN-HD. for people who were doing limited basic + HD since 2003, they get all of these without paying for digital classic. they get grandfathered into the extra channels above (not SciFi or ESPN-Classic, but the HD ones). i had that great deal ($19 a month!) at my former house, but i couldn't keep that sort of plan when i recently moved. so i pay around $30 a month for my plan of limited basic + HD + digital classic these days.

hope this helps clarify things.

Agreed. I am hoping with the addition of TNT-HD, that basketball season will take the same turn, but I am not holding my breath. :rolleyes: ABC, ESPN, ESPN2, FSN-HD all had college football running at the same time on saturday. that's like 4x more football than last year. the future of HD is exciting!!

OK. So the comcast dudes showed up. Yes, the cableCARD is sooo heavy that they had to send in two people :rolleyes: One master and ther other a grasshopper.
Well bottomline:
Good - I am getting one additional channel. yippee. Its a big one too. ESPN-HD. Monday nights won't be the same again !!
On the bad side - I lost some channels which my tv tuner had stealthily tuned for me. The demand one's i think from the neighbors. I've to find a way to get all at the same time. Maybe I'll split the cable and feed the AIR RF input as well.

OK. So the comcast dudes showed up. Yes, the cableCARD is sooo heavy that they had to send in two people :rolleyes: One master and ther other a grasshopper.
Well bottomline:
Good - I am getting one additional channel. yippee. Its a big one too. ESPN-HD. Monday nights won't be the same again !!
On the bad side - I lost some channels which my tv tuner had stealthily tuned for me. The demand one's i think from the neighbors. I've to find a way to get all at the same time. Maybe I'll split the cable and feed the AIR RF input as well.

I said earlier that I would be extremely happy if I get ESPN-HD and DSC-HD. So I am 50% extremely happy. i.e I am happy !! I don't watch DSC as much anyways. But I want to see that beautiful HD PQ on DSC which people often talk about. no biggie.

bleary: congrats.

IMHO, beyond DiscoveryHD theatre, one of the most amazing picture qualities on my set from Comcast is Sportscenter / Baseball Tonight -- ie, when they are in the studio. i can basically put my face within 1 ft of my 32" LCD and i don't see any pixelation nor artifacts. the picture quality is outstanding and it feels like you are in the studio audience watching the show. (of course the highlight reels aren't as good)

bleary: congrats.

IMHO, beyond DiscoveryHD theatre, one of the most amazing picture qualities on my set from Comcast is Sportscenter / Baseball Tonight -- ie, when they are in the studio. i can basically put my face within 1 ft of my 32" LCD and i don't see any pixelation nor artifacts. the picture quality is outstanding and it feels like you are in the studio audience watching the show. (of course the highlight reels aren't as good)

looking forward to see that tonight. thanks for the tip. hope my tip of the nose doesn't get burnt :eek:

Recently there haven't been any posts about ADS. Any new areas getting ADS?

thanks,

Recently there haven't been any posts about ADS. Any new areas getting ADS?

thanks,

I would imagine that all systems capable of doing ADS have already done so. Someone mentioned Walnut Creek getting it in about 6 months but that's because it's currently being re-built. If you're in a 550MHz area, I wouldn't expect it anytime soon.

I would imagine that all systems capable of doing ADS have already done so. Someone mentioned Walnut Creek getting it in about 6 months but that's because it's currently being re-built. If you're in a 550MHz area, I wouldn't expect it anytime soon.

ADS has not been implemented in my area yet. The rebuild in my immediate area Redwood Shores has been completed a while ago. I know I'm at least 750 if not 850. San Mateo Head end. Was told by a CSR a couple weeks ago that they were going to start this month. Won't hold my breath.

John

ADS has not been implemented in my area yet. The rebuild in my immediate area Redwood Shores has been completed a while ago. I know I'm at least 750 if not 850. San Mateo Head end. Was told by a CSR a couple weeks ago that they were going to start this month. Won't hold my breath.

John
There is nothing to hold your breath for. It is just a marketing issue and the possible eventual future of eliminating some analog channels.

On the bad side - I lost some channels which my tv tuner had stealthily tuned for me. The demand one's i think from the neighbors. I've to find a way to get all at the same time. Maybe I'll split the cable and feed the AIR RF input as well.


That plan did not work as the cableCARD seems to hog the QAM tuner. When I fed the AIR input it tuned only the 13 broadcast channels. So unhooked the cableCARD. Will use it only on Monday nights for ESPNHD. Kind of a pain to reach back behind the tv to do this. but oh well at least I get to see ALL the games in HD !!

ADS has not been implemented in my area yet. The rebuild in my immediate area Redwood Shores has been completed a while ago. I know I'm at least 750 if not 850. San Mateo Head end. Was told by a CSR a couple weeks ago that they were going to start this month. Won't hold my breath.

John

I guess it's possible that some capable headends just haven't received the boxes yet -- maybe they have too many 6412s they're trying to get rid of.

mterzich, it's not a marketing issue -- if you've noticed, Comcast does not advertise ADS at all. And there are some advantages to it: better picture quality on the analog channels (more noticible with larger TV's), smaller footprint, longer buffer times, and more recording capacity (because of smaller file sizes, not larger hard drive).

Rohnert Park has recently, and quietly, gone to ADS. My 6412 just started receiving channels 2-99 digitally all by itself. No need for the 3412.

I would imagine that all systems capable of doing ADS have already done so. Someone mentioned Walnut Creek getting it in about 6 months but that's because it's currently being re-built. If you're in a 550MHz area, I wouldn't expect it anytime soon.

I hope this is not true. I am in north San Jose (95134) and we are not in 550Mhz.. we get all the current channels. We certainly don't have ADS. My main motivation is also clarity for the regular channels. I will try to call up.

I have a 73'' and a 50'', both being fed ADS. PQ hasn't improved much on either analog or digital (analog means 2-82 digital) channels, IMO. There's pixelation, contouring, etc.

It's hard for me to imagine this situation improving much over the next N years. the only improvement I see is channels moving to HD. Upconversion can be ok. on Fox, for example, they've been showing upconverted Cops and it looks pretty darn good. So it can be done and Cops is a pretty good stress test for upconversion.

Best,
jeff
... Comcast does not advertise ADS at all. And there are some advantages to it: better picture quality on the analog channels (more noticible with larger TV's), smaller footprint, longer buffer times, and more recording capacity (because of smaller file sizes, not larger hard drive).

I hope this is not true. I am in north San Jose (95134) and we are not in 550Mhz.. we get all the current channels. We certainly don't have ADS. My main motivation is also clarity for the regular channels. I will try to call up.
I've been following this thread for a few weeks now, but somehow I missed the part where someone explained what ADS is. I googled "Comcast ADS" but that was interpreted as "Ads" rather than "A.D.S."; I assume people are (ranting, but) not raving about the Comcast "Ads" but what is ADS?

Here's a guess: "All Digital System" ? Does that mean putting all of the analog channels into the digital slots, which would explain why some suggest it's not possible on a "550" system (which I assume is an older system that is bandwidth limited to 550 MHz)? Does any of this affect someone (like me) with no STB? If ADS means putting more channels on digital slots, would those be tunable with a TV's built-in QAM tuner?

It stands for Analog/Digital Simulcast and yes, its the first step towards moving all the analog channels to digital (eventually, for right now they have both on the system, hence "simulcast").

Greeno, with screen sizes that big I don't think there's very much anyone can do with standard def. The compression situation may improve when/if the move to MPEG4 is made, but the limiting factor is still the low resolution of SD source material itself.

Since Petaluma went ADS I've noticed SOME analog channels (2-82 that is) look better, and some about the same or maybe worse, but we have/had a pretty horrible old analog system here. I have a 46" RPTV and a 23" LCD. The biggest improvement was on Cartoon (ch 54) which is probably because of the material, large areas of solid color and limited motion = compresses very well, plus analog artifacts are very easy to spot with material like that - PLUS the fact that they are running it at 704x480, as opposed to a lot of the ADS channels they squeeze thru at 528x480 :( ...

I've been following this thread for a few weeks now, but somehow I missed the part where someone explained what ADS is. I googled "Comcast ADS" but that was interpreted as "Ads" rather than "A.D.S."; I assume people are (ranting, but) not raving about the Comcast "Ads" but what is ADS?

Here's a guess: "All Digital System" ? Does that mean putting all of the analog channels into the digital slots, which would explain why some suggest it's not possible on a "550" system (which I assume is an older system that is bandwidth limited to 550 MHz)? Does any of this affect someone (like me) with no STB? If ADS means putting more channels on digital slots, would those be tunable with a TV's built-in QAM tuner?

Please see the first post in this thread. It explains quite elaborately what it means.

That plan did not work as the cableCARD seems to hog the QAM tuner. When I fed the AIR input it tuned only the 13 broadcast channels. So unhooked the cableCARD. Will use it only on Monday nights for ESPNHD. Kind of a pain to reach back behind the tv to do this. but oh well at least I get to see ALL the games in HD !!
Usually if a TV has a coax input labelled "AIR" that input only has an ATSC tuner, not a QAM tuner. Most TVs in the past haven't had dual-QAM tuners. CableCARD utilizes the QAM tuner so it is occupied.

Please see the first post in this thread. It explains quite elaborately what it means.
Ah, that was very helpful, thanks. I hadn't taken the days (or weeks) needed to read the previous 400+ pages, but the first message on the first page of this forum thread does indeed answer a bunch of questions!

ADS has not been implemented in my area yet. The rebuild in my immediate area Redwood Shores has been completed a while ago. I know I'm at least 750 if not 850. San Mateo Head end. Was told by a CSR a couple weeks ago that they were going to start this month. Won't hold my breath.

John

Are you sure? I'm fed from San Mateo and I am definitely getting it. I know because my new Sony TV has a QAM tuner in it and I can pick up the various 256QAM versions of the analog tier.

As an aside, I believe that pretty much everyone should have ADS by now. If your system doesn't it means the standand channel map they use in the Bay Area isn't being used in your system (ie 550 Mhz systems), so I don't know when that would change. They may be waiting to do the 550 systems with MPEG-4 gear, as that will need a lot less bandwidth, but it will be awhile before it shows up in this market.

It's possible your box hasn't been commanded to use ADS of course, but that should not be confused with the signals not being transmitted on the coax.

BTW, I have found ADS no great improvement. Many of the channels are significantly compressed, and since I am 1 drop from an optical node have enjoyed great analog cable performance. I would say tuning the analog signal on the TV vs. the QAM256 version sometimes yields a much better signal. Other times the ADS signal is better, but never by very much. I think they need to ease up on the compression or tune the encoding if this is going to be a net win for folks.

Thanks,
Mike

There is a great thread by Keenan on what HD is received in various areas.
LG gets Fox, NBC, CBS, ABC, KQED, INHD, INHD2, Discovery, ESPN and HBO.
We don't get NFL, Showtime, ESPN2.
We don't get VOD at all.
We appear to be one of the 'better' 550 systems since for some reason we get INHD and INHD2.
Mike


no fsn hd channel in gatos?

no fsn hd channel in gatos?

INHD2 = FSN HD ... until 9/20

I would say tuning the analog signal on the TV vs. the QAM256 version sometimes yields a much better signal. Other times the ADS signal is better, but never by very much.
I wonder what this will mean for folks who get TiVo S3 boxes? Presumably the channels would be available in analog or digital flavor; I wonder if the box will present both (and have each listed in the program guide)? Hopefully they'll all show up in the channel selection, and you could (on a channel by channel, analog vs. digital basis) select which channels to keep and which to ignore...

Of course, it may all be moot for me since I'm in Sunnyvale.

As an aside, I believe that pretty much everyone should have ADS by now. If your system doesn't it means the standand channel map they use in the Bay Area isn't being used in your system (ie 550 Mhz systems), so I don't know when that would change. They may be waiting to do the 550 systems with MPEG-4 gear, as that will need a lot less bandwidth, but it will be awhile before it shows up in this market.


San Jose North (91534) is cerntainly not a 550 system (we have On Demamd and all the hd channels). But I don't think ADS is implemented here. I have non-dvr STB (6200). I have tuned used using QAM tuner in my TV and there are only a few analog channels which are broadcast in (clear) digital.

Do you think some of the channels are not in clear and my STB may not be capable of switching to ADS?

Anyone from around (north) San Jose who has ADS?

And this is my breaking point. If we lose FSN-HD on 9/20, there is absolutely no way I'll stay with Comcast, except for the most basic analog offering for the glut of old TV's around my house. For our three HD sets, I will switch to satellite in a heartbeat.
My understanding, however, from the vague and contradictory Comcast info, is that INHD2 will be replaced by TNT HD in Los Gatos, and FSN HD will preempt INHD programming when available.
Let's hope!
Mike

INHD2 = FSN HD ... until 9/20

AMy understanding, however, from the vague and contradictory Comcast info, is that INHD2 will be replaced by TNT HD in Los Gatos, and FSN HD will preempt INHD programming when available.

That is what was communicated to us by Mr. Johnson via Mikef5.

I would say a 50'' is not that big by today's standards. 73'', well, it's big ;-)

I'm with you Mike on this topic. Analog (direct feed into NTSC tuner) is always better at my house.
You're also right that they need to ease up on the compression. Pixelation during motion is a sure sign of the transmission being bit starved. Don't these guys monitor what they send out?

jeff
BTW, I have found ADS no great improvement. Many of the channels are significantly compressed, and since I am 1 drop from an optical node have enjoyed great analog cable performance. I would say tuning the analog signal on the TV vs. the QAM256 version sometimes yields a much better signal. Other times the ADS signal is better, but never by very much. I think they need to ease up on the compression or tune the encoding if this is going to be a net win for folks.

Thanks,
Mike

Can anyone confirm that Tuesday's A's/Rangers game from FSNBA-HD was on INHD? Apparently the game didn't show up on DirecTV's feed and those folks are trying to figure out where the problem lies.

Well, it looks like I may be going to Dish sooner than I thought. Dish just uplinked FSNBA to Sat 129 so I would figure after the testing is done it will be made available sooner than later. With the Charlie chat on 11 Sept, I would think that would be a good time to announce it's availability ;) .

Laters,
Mikef5

Well, it looks like I may be going to Dish sooner than I thought. Dish just uplinked FSNBA to Sat 129 so I would figure after the testing is done it will be made available sooner than later. With the Charlie chat on 11 Sept, I would think that would be a good time to announce it's availability ;) .

Laters,
Mikef5
Yes, very cool, and with the local HD looking very good from Dish lately it's just about the time to pull the plug on Comcast.

Dish also uplinked DNS-HD feeds from the LA stations, of which we should get ABC, CBS and NBC. Actually, we already get CBS(KCBS) as it's been there all along.

Yesterday, or maybe it was the day before.... INHD1 was dark, while INHD2 carried the A's game that was scheduled for INHD1. What the? This some kind of prelude to when they move FSN to INHD1?

To answer a question from the last page - the 6200 is capable of ADS. That is, it will remap the lower "analog" channels 2-99 to use the digital versions. However the box may need to be reset or re-authorized or something. Others have also noted that adding a 3412 to your account may get both boxes refreshed with the new all-digital mapping... But short of that, you could try leaving the 6200 unplugged overnight.. or calling Comcast and getting them to reset your box/account info.

well, i've had comcast for a couple weeks now. i'm happy with the picture, and haven't really noticed any channel line-up gaps that make or break the deal. we'll see after college football season continues...

but i have to say this. the motorola 6412 is the worst box i could imagine. the delay from teh remote is absolutely rediculous. up to 4 minutes!!!!! yeah, then all of a sudden my tv freaks out as it executes commands that i entered a while back. what a joke.

AND

the DVR doesn't even work on mine. oh it records and takes up space, but it won't display my listings. none of my timers work. you can only pause for 30 min. coming from the dish DVRs, i find this thing utterly deplorable. ohk, and you can't jump ahead without programming a custom buttom.

there's no way i'm keeping this DVR. its a joke. i'll make my own and if its 5c encrypted i may find myself back a dish faster than i thought. i'm really bummed by the quality of the hardware they provide. its awful.. you get what you pay for at dish and thats obvious to me now

you can only pause for 30 min. coming from the dish DVRs, i find this thing utterly deplorable.

Buffer, or "pause time" is based on the content you're buffering. The larger the data stream (bitrate), the shorter the time. I believe QAM256 HD gives you 15-20 minutes, QAM256 SD gives you about 90 minutes, and analog SD gives you about 45 mintues of buffer. I agree though...this was hard to get used to when moving from ReplayTV which gave you as much buffer as you wanted as long as there was enough disk space to handle it (I remember pausing for 9 hours one time).

Yesterday, or maybe it was the day before.... INHD1 was dark, while INHD2 carried the A's game that was scheduled for INHD1. What the? This some kind of prelude to when they move FSN to INHD1?


INHD was running the same game nationally, that's why INHD was blacked out. its no different than ESPNHD showing an A's game and having it blacked out locally because FSN is showing the same game. local beats national everytime.

it is not a prelude to INHD1 being blacked out when FSN moves there. The key is, who is providing the feed? INHD or FSNBA? in yesterday's case it was INHD, not FSNBA providing the feed on 719. FSNBA was providing the feed on 720.

Can anyone confirm that Tuesday's A's/Rangers game from FSNBA-HD was on INHD? Apparently the game didn't show up on DirecTV's feed and those folks are trying to figure out where the problem lies.

black out black out black out. D* was probably providing INHD's feed, not FSNBA's feed (ironically they are the same feed, just different providers). If D* doesn't show FSNBA HD's feed specifically and just INHD's, tough luck!! you can't see it locally.

black out black out black out. D* was probably providing INHD's feed, not FSNBA's feed (ironically they are the same feed, just different providers). If D* doesn't show FSNBA HD's feed specifically and just INHD's, tough luck!! you can't see it locally.
Okay, black out due to it being a nationally televised game? If it was blacked out locally, what national channel was it on? Was it the MLBEI national game?

D* doesn't have a carriage agreement for INHD so I can't imagine that was the problem.

Was the A's feed sent to the other INHD channel instead of the normal one?

Okay, I see where you stated it was the national game so it must have been the MLBEI game for the day. Does that happen everytime it's the national game, it's blacked out on the "normal" INHD/FSNBA-HD channel?

If it's the national MLBEI game it shows up on CONUS channel 95 for D* subs who have MLBEI subscription, I don't know if it did or not. I think I've figured out what they did. I was inquiring for a poster in another thread, thanks.

Was the A's feed sent to the other INHD channel instead of the normal one?

Okay, I see where you stated it was the national game so it must have been the MLBEI game for the day. Does that happen everytime it's the national game, it's blacked out on the "normal" INHD/FSNBA-HD channel?


yesterday was a classic case... 719 was blacked out because it was the INHD national game (same feed as FSNBA but with INHD logos) but 720 showed the game with FSNBA logos. happens all the time. happens also when ESPNHD is showing a game, blacked out locally if it involves giants or a's. doesn't matter if only ESPNHD is providing an HD feed and your local RSN is not, baseball doesn't care. baseball wants you to see local ads. booyah.

to summarize:

INHD (719) showed the INHD game with INHD logos to the rest of the nation except us.

INHD2(720) showed the same game with FSN logos to just us.

D* probably didn't carry FSNBA HD's feed, which is why its blacked out in the bay area. baseball figures, that's ok, D* customers can still watch it on their FSNBA-SD channel. baseball doesn't care that you have an HD set, all the rules apply. to say blackout rules are dated and arcane would be understating it.

Sorry to have asked in the wrong forum, I didn't know all the different ones existed. Please move my thread if it's required, and I appologize for staying on this thread for now, for the sake of continuity.

The problem is that while FSN carries A's game on SD channel 40, but on HD, it's either on 719 INHD ot 720 INHD2, very rarely is it on both 719 and 720 (I saw it once this year). When the game is on 719, there's usually soemthing completely unrelated to baseball on 720. I guess what I don't udnerstand about this blackout policy, is that the local SD braodcast is on FSN channel 40 in either cases, why then does it make a difference if I get the HD in 719 or 720, when the HD version is only carried in either 719 or 720, and not both at the same time?


nikeykid
Do you mean the the guide is wrong most of the time? That the game should usually be on 719 and 720 at the same time?


you are getting ur channels mixed up. 719 shows INHD programming, including national baseball games, and sometimes they pick up our local teams. it's no different than if ESPN covered the A's. So INHD = national

INHD2 gets preempted with LOCAL HD sports. INHD2 itself is not providing the feed, the local FSN is. that's why most of the time giants a's games are on 720. in the rare case that both FSN is showing the game and INHD is showing the same game, 719 is blacked out. otherwise you can watch all the INHD games on 719 that involve like red sox and twins or other teams that do not involve ours.

INHD = national
INHD2 = FSNBA when there is a game on. 720 becomes the HD version of channel 40. starting 9/20 it will no longer carry INHD2 programming so no one will ever be confused again :)

the guide is wrong a lot.

its not brain science people! :\

I called up CSR and she initially said whole of San Jose is on ADS, then checked to confirm that 95134 is not on ADS. She said it should be converted by end of the year.

She also said once that is done, I will have to change my 6200 box and get 7 series (non-HD) or a HD dvr. Is that really true? Is there anyone receiving ADS with 6200 box?

I guess I am one of the few with not so good analog reception. It also varies channel to channel and with time of day. On my TV digital channel looks much better.. quite a few months back Digital version version had horrible colors but now it looks fine.

its not brain science people! :\
or rocket surgery? :p :D

:d

At Comcast, "CSR" = Constantly Says Rubbish.

Yes you can get ADS with the 6200. At least I can.

They are going to "make" you upgrade to the DVR box huh? Are they going to make you pay for it too, or give it away for free? No, once again the CSR didn't know what s/he was bathering on about.

or rocket surgery? :p :D

its not rocket science or brain surgery! brain science is my shorthand version :)

At Comcast, "CSR" = Constantly Says Rubbish.

Yes you can get ADS with the 6200. At least I can.


thanks. Exactly what I wanted to hear!

They are going to "make" you upgrade to the DVR box huh? Are they going to make you pay for it too, or give it away for free? No, once again the CSR didn't know what s/he was bathering on about.

Actually this time, upgrade she offered was good... but she still might not know what she was talking about. She said I could digital classic to get dvr (i.e. $15 more) over my limited basic. I read many times here that this is not possible. My Tivo contract will come to an end in couple of months and I can take this offer if it is possible then.

thanks. Exactly what I wanted to hear!



Actually this time, upgrade she offered was good... but she still might not know what she was talking about. She said I could digital classic to get dvr (i.e. $15 more) over my limited basic. I read many times here that this is not possible. My Tivo contract will come to an end in couple of months and I can take this offer if it is possible then.
It's not possible in Santa Rosa. If you succeed be sure to let us know.

To get the DVR in Santa Rosa, you need Standard Cable(Limited Basic + Expanded Basic) + Digital Classic, with fees and a $9.95 DVR rental charge, it runs about $75 a month.....for a total of 7 HD channels...such a deal.... :rolleyes:

the guide is wrong a lot.

I got the rest from reading your previous posts, this is the only part I needed confirmation on. Thanks.

Are you sure? I'm fed from San Mateo and I am definitely getting it. I know because my new Sony TV has a QAM tuner in it and I can pick up the various 256QAM versions of the analog tier.

As an aside, I believe that pretty much everyone should have ADS by now. If your system doesn't it means the standand channel map they use in the Bay Area isn't being used in your system (ie 550 Mhz systems), so I don't know when that would change. They may be waiting to do the 550 systems with MPEG-4 gear, as that will need a lot less bandwidth, but it will be awhile before it shows up in this market.

It's possible your box hasn't been commanded to use ADS of course, but that should not be confused with the signals not being transmitted on the coax.


Thanks,
Mike

Mike: Thanks for your response. A couple specifics. I have a 6412 Phase III DVR, a Panasonic TC-32LX60 with an ATSC tuner. I'm definetly not in a 550 area (KNTV 703 - 747MHZ, DHDTV 722 MHZ). I hooked my TV directly into the cable outlet and found the following: KGO shows 7, 7-1 HD and 87-4; KPIX 5, 5-1 HD and 87-3; KTVU 2, 2-1 HD and 87-1. These along with other none network channels. So they are there on the cable but not activated on the box. I'll just have to wait for them to activate the box.

Thanks,

John

She also said once that is done, I will have to change my 6200 box and get 7 series (non-HD) or a HD dvr. Is that really true? Is there anyone receiving ADS with 6200 box?

6200 has no issues getting ADS. There may be other reasons she is saying to switch your box, but the capability the box to receive ADS is not one of them. As long as the box can get digital cable (ADS or otherwise) and it can get channel mappings (which it must) then it can get ADS.

If they wanted to obsolete the 6200 for some reason, then they could use as ADS as a pretext for swapping your box.

Well, it looks like I may be going to Dish sooner than I thought. Dish just uplinked FSNBA to Sat 129 so I would figure after the testing is done it will be made available sooner than later. With the Charlie chat on 11 Sept, I would think that would be a good time to announce it's availability ;) .

Laters,
Mikef5


Good News!

Time for 550Mhz Comcast customer to call Dish and switch...there are no excuses left (I also think I read where Dish has uplinked InHd even (although not live just yet...)

Hey....although i love watching all these HD college football games, is anyone watching ABC and Oklahoma-Washington? It looks AWFUL compared to the other games!! Everything is a bit fuzzy, like it is out of focus...no macroblocking though. Sometimes when they come back from commercial, it looks great for a second then it looks like someone pushed the "make it fuzzy" button. Anyone else seeing this? Maybe comcast is reducing bandwidth...?

Hey....although i love watching all these HD college football games, is anyone watching ABC and Oklahoma-Washington? It looks AWFUL compared to the other games!! Everything is a bit fuzzy, like it is out of focus...no macroblocking though. Sometimes when they come back from commercial, it looks great for a second then it looks like someone pushed the "make it fuzzy" button. Anyone else seeing this? Maybe comcast is reducing bandwidth...?


I noticed the exact same thing while watching the oregon stanford game.

Mike: Thanks for your response. A couple specifics. I have a 6412 Phase III DVR, a Panasonic TC-32LX60 with an ATSC tuner. I'm definetly not in a 550 area (KNTV 703 - 747MHZ, DHDTV 722 MHZ). I hooked my TV directly into the cable outlet and found the following: KGO shows 7, 7-1 HD and 87-4; KPIX 5, 5-1 HD and 87-3; KTVU 2, 2-1 HD and 87-1. These along with other none network channels. So they are there on the cable but not activated on the box. I'll just have to wait for them to activate the box.

Thanks,

John

That's your problem. You said it has an ATSC tuner. This is for OTA programming, not cable. You need a TV with a QAM tuner that can decode the programming on the cable system.

thanks,
mike

Hey guys,

Is there any reason why my guide (Mountain View) always seems to have a lot of "To Be Announced" after about 7 days. I thought we should have pretty much 14 days complete almost all the time. I can see a few of these, but it's very common after about 7 days.

Thanks,

DG
Mountain View

Well, I took the (albeit shallow) plunge and scheduled an appointment today to have my 6200 replaced with a CableCARD. Being that I'm on a 550 system (and thus don't have OnDemand), all I'm really giving up is the interactive guide. Setup cost was quoted at $15 even.

Much to my surprise (after reading some of the posts here), the CSR that answered the call actually knew what a CableCARD was.

One less piece of equipment (and one less remote to futz with). W00t! :D

Hey....although i love watching all these HD college football games, is anyone watching ABC and Oklahoma-Washington? It looks AWFUL compared to the other games!! Everything is a bit fuzzy, like it is out of focus...no macroblocking though. Sometimes when they come back from commercial, it looks great for a second then it looks like someone pushed the "make it fuzzy" button. Anyone else seeing this? Maybe comcast is reducing bandwidth...?

its def on ABC's end, its the infamous "blur" problem that plagued CBS's march madness coverage. if you look at ESPNHD, there is no blur problem. the fresno st oregon game looks great, whereas the OSU/Texas game on ABC has some blur issues. otherwise both have great PQ.

That's your problem. You said it has an ATSC tuner. This is for OTA programming, not cable. You need a TV with a QAM tuner that can decode the programming on the cable system.

thanks,
mike

Mike,

Apparently the TV must have QAM capabilities but the specs don't list it. I have 2 options for the RF connection. One is Antenna and the other is Cable. I set it up as Cable and plugged it directly into the outlet. The numbering sequence is kinda confusing but I do receive channels that are in the clear and can view them. Examples are KGO analog 7, KGO-DT HD 7-1, KGO DS 87-7, KRON 4 analog, KRON 87-2 DS, KRON 111-8 HD, Court TV 65 analog, 85-4 DS, etc. So the channels are there I just don't know why my 6412 III isn't DS'd. Doesn't make sense.

John

Are you saying you don't get channel KGO HD at 707 on 6412? That is surprising.

Mike,

Apparently the TV must have QAM capabilities but the specs don't list it. I have 2 options for the RF connection. One is Antenna and the other is Cable. I set it up as Cable and plugged it directly into the outlet. The numbering sequence is kinda confusing but I do receive channels that are in the clear and can view them. Examples are KGO analog 7, KGO-DT HD 7-1, KGO DS 87-7, KRON 4 analog, KRON 87-2 DS, KRON 111-8 HD, Court TV 65 analog, 85-4 DS, etc. So the channels are there I just don't know why my 6412 III isn't DS'd. Doesn't make sense.

John

Are you saying you don't get channel KGO HD at 707 on 6412? That is surprising.
I think he is saying his 6412 isn't remapping ch7 to 87.7.

This has been discussed before. The easiest way to get DS for your 6412 appears to be to get a 3412, then in a few days your 6412 will start with the DS. I think (but don't recall for sure) even after you remove the 3412 the 6412 will still have DS.

That's your problem. You said it has an ATSC tuner. This is for OTA programming, not cable. You need a TV with a QAM tuner that can decode the programming on the cable system.
For some reason, recent panasonic LCDs have only listed ATSC but they do have QAM tuners.

Are you saying you don't get channel KGO HD at 707 on 6412? That is surprising.

The numbers I am referring to are how they appear when connected directly from the TV to the cable bypassing the 6412. What I am looking at is the TV's channel guide. Yes I do get KGO HD at 707 on the 6412.

John

I have a Motorola 6412 Phase III DVR and I'm seeing alot of pixelation during fast moving scenes while watching HD programming. I never had this problem when I had my cable connected from the wall to the tv. Is there a setting in the 6412 that I can change to correct this problem? I'm not using any splitters and my box is connect to my tv via HDMI.

Thanks in advance.

Watching FOX and CBS HD football and finding that the wide angle camera views are not that good, The close angle views are pretty sweet.

Anyone else noticing that?

Russ, I'm finding that the camera quality seems to vary by position for many FB games so far. I'm guessing that the networks are skimping on camera costs (maybe not even "HDTV" gear) in light of the still-miniscule HDTV market. Joe and Jane 6pak won't notice a thing. ;)

Watching FOX and CBS HD football and finding that the wide angle camera views are not that good, The close angle views are pretty sweet.

Anyone else noticing that?

Yup, the beggining of the 49ers Cardinals game looked aweful. Now it switched to analog for a bit and it's back to HD. I don't like Fox's HD so far b/c it seems compressed. CBS looked fine for this morning's game.

I don't think the game is HD but 480i widescreen.

Yup, the beggining of the 49ers Cardinals game looked aweful. Now it switched to analog for a bit and it's back to HD. I don't like Fox's HD so far b/c it seems compressed. CBS looked fine for this morning's game.

The 49er game, while widescreen, is not HD, it is 480P widescreen. Fox's HD looks OK when it is true HD.

Yup, the beggining of the 49ers Cardinals game looked aweful. Now it switched to analog for a bit and it's back to HD. I don't like Fox's HD so far b/c it seems compressed. CBS looked fine for this morning's game.
The FOX 49ers game is not in HD, it's 480i upconverted to 720p. 49ers/Cards was not one of the HD games for today from FOX.

The field level shots are not that bad at all for an upconvert, but the distance shots betray the fact that it isn't HD.

The field level shots are not that bad at all for an upconvert, but the distance shots betray the fact that it isn't HD.

The field shots seem to be good in both FOX games today and the CBS game, while the distance shots for the 49s game is horrible, they weren't that great for the Seattle/Detroit game or for the St Louis/Denver game.

Yeah all the field level shots look good....

So Fox hasn't added any HD trucks since getting 6 a couple of years ago?

Seems like ABC/ESPN has, if ESPN is showing two games on Monday.

What about CBS?

So Fox hasn't added any HD trucks since getting 6 a couple of years ago?

Seems like ABC/ESPN has, if ESPN is showing two games on Monday.

What about CBS?
CBS is still doing only 3 NFL games a week in HD this season.

CBS is still doing only 3 NFL games a week in HD this season.
Well, I'd rather have 3 games a week done right than the BS that Fox is putting out as their HD and I don't care how many games they have, the picture quality sucks. ABC is even worse than what Fox is doing. The game I watched kept going in and out of focus so much it actually hurt my eyes to watch it. IMHO, ABC has the worse HD pq, followed by Fox, then NBC, ( who actually did it right on today's game) and CBS who at least does HD right. They may not do alot of sports but they do alot of other HD and do it right. I would prefer that CBS did more sports but they seem to be trying to give the viewing audience a multitude of different programing done in HD. I know it might be really hard to believe but there are actually people out there that would rather watch other programing done in HD rather than watch sports done in HD :eek: :p
I know it's hard to believe but it's true... :)

Laters,
Mikef5

I wasn't complaining about the amount of games from CBS, I was just stating the fact that they are doing only 3 per Sunday in HD. Their plan is to add capacity to do all their games in HD by 2009 I believe, adding one each season. I have no problem with the way CBS is moving with their HD.

What really bugs me is FOX and their non-HD baseball every Saturday, especially aggravating is the exclusive window they have that prevents anyone else from airing baseball games, HD or otherwise during that window.

I wasn't complaining about the amount of games from CBS, I was just stating the fact that they are doing only 3 per Sunday in HD. Their plan is to add capacity to do all their games in HD by 2009 I believe, adding one each season. I have no problem with the way CBS is moving with their HD.

What really bugs me is FOX and their non-HD baseball every Saturday, especially aggravating is the exclusive window they have that prevents anyone else from airing baseball games, HD or otherwise during that window.

on the other hand, CBS has a spankin new HD studio and a new graphics package that finally makes them look "cool", where as FOX went to more old school graphics. I'd forgive them for 3 HD games a week just for that :)

Since KBCW has been advertising the Raider game tomorrow night, that must mean that the game was sold out, which would mean ESPN won't be blacked out...?

Since KBCW has been advertising the Raider game tomorrow night, that must mean that the game was sold out, which would mean ESPN won't be blacked out...?

raiders game sold out, i read somewhere. we'll see the game in the bay area!

Yeah, Monday night games are about the only time they do sellout. :rolleyes: :D

Yeah, Monday night games are about the only time they do sellout. :rolleyes: :D

I heard on the radio that Raider ticket sales are up 40% already and season tickets are up 35% due to lack of PCL and prices going down. We may actually see a few more this year.

any one else disappointed in the picture quality during the Giants game tonight? especially the "primary" camera facing home plate...was it foggy/hazy at the park? even later in the evening, it never looked that great. i guess i've been spoiled by the stellar FSN-HD broadcasts along with the few they've shown on 702.

I heard on the radio that Raider ticket sales are up 40% already and season tickets are up 35% due to lack of PCL and prices going down. We may actually see a few more this year.
Add to that a new coach, new QB and a Moss that looks like he wants to play, the Raiders might be fun to watch this year. :)

I wish we could get Comcast to keep UHD...Battlestar Galactica in HD is stunning, as is the other Universal Programming. The Hoff in HD makes you want to cry tears of Joy. HD Knight Rider is *why* I bought an HDTV...

I wish we could get Comcast to keep UHD...Battlestar Galactica in HD is stunning, as is the other Universal Programming. The Hoff in HD makes you want to cry tears of Joy. HD Knight Rider is *why* I bought an HDTV...

i can't really say which i prefer w/o seeing TNTHD ever (i like watching the NBA in HD tho), but UHD has some great stuff. i try to stay optimistic and hope one day it'll come back permanently, and hopefully sooner than never.

I wish we could get Comcast to keep UHD...Battlestar Galactica in HD is stunning, as is the other Universal Programming. The Hoff in HD makes you want to cry tears of Joy. HD Knight Rider is *why* I bought an HDTV...

Wait a sec...the recently added UHD is not a permanent addition to the Comcast HD lineup?

Wait a sec...the recently added UHD is not a permanent addition to the Comcast HD lineup?

Where ya been pappy?????

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8305413&highlight=mr+j#post8305413

I wasn't complaining about the amount of games from CBS, I was just stating the fact that they are doing only 3 per Sunday in HD. Their plan is to add capacity to do all their games in HD by 2009 I believe, adding one each season. I have no problem with the way CBS is moving with their HD.

What really bugs me is FOX and their non-HD baseball every Saturday, especially aggravating is the exclusive window they have that prevents anyone else from airing baseball games, HD or otherwise during that window.
Jim,
I wasn't directing that comment directly at you, just my feelings on what CBS was doing as compared to the other stations. There's another thread that considers CBS a cheap station for only doing 3 HD games a week. I just wanted to remind people that TV doesn't revolve around sports, even though most of us wish it did :p
Besides, how could I accuse you of complaining ??? That would be like the pot calling the kettle black :D

Laters,
Mikef5

any one else disappointed in the picture quality during the Giants game tonight? especially the "primary" camera facing home plate...was it foggy/hazy at the park? even later in the evening, it never looked that great. i guess i've been spoiled by the stellar FSN-HD broadcasts along with the few they've shown on 702.
I noticed that also. I think the problem was the placement of the centerfield camera. It was having to make up for the difference in contrast from the bright sunlight to the darker area of homeplate so it gave it a washed out appearance from that angle. Also, the lens was probably getting a glare on it, they didn't use a proper filter to get rid of the glare. I think if they could've moved it's angle to the plate it might of helped with that problem. The rest of the shots were much better, just that one angle really looked washed out.

Laters,
Mikef5

of course, i probably wouldn't have been as disappointed if it weren't for the disappointing loss :(

i guess it's good we got that out of our system. here's hoping for a good solid push these final 3 weeks!

I noticed that also. I think the problem was the placement of the centerfield camera. It was having to make up for the difference in contrast from the bright sunlight to the darker area of homeplate so it gave it a washed out appearance from that angle. Also, the lens was probably getting a glare on it, they didn't use a proper filter to get rid of the glare. I think if they could've moved it's angle to the plate it might of helped with that problem. The rest of the shots were much better, just that one angle really looked washed out.

Laters,
Mikef5

of course, i probably wouldn't have been as disappointed if it weren't for the disappointing loss :(

i guess it's good we got that out of our system. here's hoping for a good solid push these final 3 weeks!
Disappointing loss ??? How about a good old a$$ whooping.. ;)
We can only hope this is not a trend and they'll get their act together. Why can't they be like their little brothers the A's ??? :p
They're pretty much a shoe in for the play offs.

Laters,
Mikef5

Jim,
I wasn't directing that comment directly at you, just my feelings on what CBS was doing as compared to the other stations. There's another thread that considers CBS a cheap station for only doing 3 HD games a week. I just wanted to remind people that TV doesn't revolve around sports, even though most of us wish it did :p
Besides, how could I accuse you of complaining ??? That would be like the pot calling the kettle black :D

Laters,
Mikef5
:p :D

BTW, a programming note. I happen to buzz ahead in the PG and I noticed that next Monday KTVU is airing a Giants game....during the same time period as "Prison Break"...not a worry for me as I can get it from another provider, but does KTVU have record/playback capability, to possibly show at a later time period?

With a serialized show like "Prison Break", missing an episode sucks.

:p :D

BTW, a programming note. I happen to buzz ahead in the PG and I noticed that next Monday KTVU is airing a Giants game....during the same time period as "Prison Break"...not a worry for me as I can get it from another provider, but does KTVU have record/playback capability, to possibly show at a later time period?

With a serialized show like "Prison Break", missing an episode sucks.
Doesn't KTVU have a sister station ??? I think KICU is the sister station to KTVU and normally if there's a conflict with programing they use that to show the normally scheduled shows. Just a guess but I think they have done this in the past.

Laters,
Mikef5

Keenan,

I just checked the Comcast guide and my guide shows Prison Break still scheduled but the list I got from KTVU shows the Giants playing on that day. I checked the Giant's site and it shows the game at 5:35 pm on KTVU so my guess is that it will be on KTVU and Prison Break will be on KICU. Not for sure but a good guess.

Laters,
Mikef5

Doesn't KTVU have a sister station ??? I think KICU is the sister station to KTVU and normally if there's a conflict with programing they use that to show the normally scheduled shows. Just a guess but I think they have done this in the past.

Laters,
Mikef5

That's exactly what they have done in the past. However, when I just looked at my guide, I don't see a baseball game, I see Prison Break, tonight, next Monday and the following Monday. :confused:

That's exactly what they have done in the past. However, when I just looked at my guide, I don't see a baseball game, I see Prison Break, tonight, next Monday and the following Monday. :confused:
You know I just checked every Tv guide web site that I subscribe to and they all show Prison Break and the Giants game is no where to be seen except on the Giant's web site and it says it's on KTVU at 5:35 pm. Prison Break doesn't come on until 8 pm. That would be pushing a game to last 2 1/2 hours and not taking into account of extra innings or the game going longer. So....................we'll have to wait until Monday to see what's on, or write some more emails to KTVU to see what's up. :rolleyes:

Laters,
Mikef5

Anyone planning to get a S3 TiVo to use with Comcast? BestBuy will have the S3 available in about one week.

I can't figure out what Comcast will charge for 2 Cablecards. What it looks like to me is $16.95/mo, the same they would charge for 2 6200's. Any thoughts?

UHD was still up on channel 726 in Rohnert Park this morning. This afternoon it's gone. I guess we've got 9 days until TNT-HD livens up.

UHD was still up on channel 726 in Rohnert Park this morning. This afternoon it's gone. I guess we've got 9 days until TNT-HD livens up.
If you don't live in a 550 MHz area. I've got a bad feeling we won't be getting TNT-HD on the 20th. IF they keep channel 720 for FSN-HD, they don't have the bandwidth to add TNT-HD to our area. We'll see on the 20th but I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for it.

Laters,
Mikef5

Anyone planning to get a S3 TiVo to use with Comcast? BestBuy will have the S3 available in about one week.

I can't figure out what Comcast will charge for 2 Cablecards. What it looks like to me is $16.95/mo, the same they would charge for 2 6200's. Any thoughts?

I'm holding off until Comcast releases the Tivo software -- that way I can see what the differences are and if it's worth paying $800. I think in the Bay Area, Comcast charges the same for the cable card as they do for the STB. I have a plan that includes one STB so it would be an additional $6.95 for me.

You know I just checked every Tv guide web site that I subscribe to and they all show Prison Break and the Giants game is no where to be seen except on the Giant's web site and it says it's on KTVU at 5:35 pm. Prison Break doesn't come on until 8 pm. That would be pushing a game to last 2 1/2 hours and not taking into account of extra innings or the game going longer. So....................we'll have to wait until Monday to see what's on, or write some more emails to KTVU to see what's up. :rolleyes:

Laters,
Mikef5
That's weird, I swear last night I was going through and checking my recordings and next Monday, the 18th, there was a Giants game listed, I noticed it because Vanished showed the recording marker right after the Giants listing and it alerted me to a missing Prison Break. Now, it not there, strange.

Anyone planning to get a S3 TiVo to use with Comcast? BestBuy will have the S3 available in about one week.

I can't figure out what Comcast will charge for 2 Cablecards. What it looks like to me is $16.95/mo, the same they would charge for 2 6200's. Any thoughts?
The way I figure it, I shouldn't need any CableCARDS or STBs, all I want to record is the local HD and that comes with Limited Basic. The question is how the S3 is going to find the channels, if it works like my Mits display tuner I should be set.

If BB has them, I'll be getting one and I'll be sure to post how it works out here.

I asked a tech at the livermore office if this would work and he said it wouldnt. He said the 6412 wont pickup the digital signal by simply plugging in a 3412 in addition to the 6412. Take it for what its worth though, as comcast techs arent always the brightest of bulbs...if you know what I mean ;)
I think he is saying his 6412 isn't remapping ch7 to 87.7.

This has been discussed before. The easiest way to get DS for your 6412 appears to be to get a 3412, then in a few days your 6412 will start with the DS. I think (but don't recall for sure) even after you remove the 3412 the 6412 will still have DS.

Anyone planning to get a S3 TiVo to use with Comcast? BestBuy will have the S3 available in about one week.

I can't figure out what Comcast will charge for 2 Cablecards. What it looks like to me is $16.95/mo, the same they would charge for 2 6200's. Any thoughts?

I actually asked Comcast the cost for cablecard and the lady said they were free, however there is an installation fee of about $16.

Still not sure if the S3 is worth about $800 right now. I record via firewire, MyHD 130, and a Fusion card, so I basically have a 3 tuner HD DVR and so far it's been working pretty well. Not as good as an S3, but good enough.

I think I'll hold off, however they have a deal for Lifetime subscribers to transfer their lifetime subscription to an S3 for $200.... that would make the total $1000, but I would be able to keep my Lifetime...

I asked a tech at the livermore office if this would work and he said it wouldnt. He said the 6412 wont pickup the digital signal by simply plugging in a 3412 in addition to the 6412. Take it for what its worth though, as comcast techs arent always the brightest of bulbs...if you know what I mean ;)

I really have to laugh. I, for one, know that you don't even need the 3412 to get DS. I have a 6412 that went DS all by itself a few weeks back.

Now, the other piece is if our 6412 user is looking to find KGO-DT with his 6412, he's not going to find it on channel 87.7, it's at 707, period.

According to Engadget's "Hands On" review of the Series 3 Tivo, it does NOT have multi-room viewing or TivoToGo -- both are lacking in order to comply with the CableLabs certification. Also, Keenan, they say that while you can scan and tune for unencrypted QAM signals, you couldn't map those channels to their respective networks. So right now it looks like we'd be paying $800 for Tivo's better interface and larger hard drive...that's about it. Not having the TivoToGo or multi-room viewing is kind of deal breaker for me.

http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/12/hands-on-with-the-tivo-series3/

If you don't live in a 550 MHz area. I've got a bad feeling we won't be getting TNT-HD on the 20th. IF they keep channel 720 for FSN-HD, they don't have the bandwidth to add TNT-HD to our area.

From one 550'er to another, just be thankful you have FSN-HD at all (not available here in Sunnyvale).

Anyone else confused as to why one 550 system has more HD channels than another? I've got:

FOX, NBC, CBS, ABC, KQED, DSC-HD and ESPN-HD (no KRON, but who cares 'bout that... :rolleyes: )

I'm assuming you've got the same + FSN-HD? Can I come over to watch the Sharks next month? :p

According to Engadget's "Hands On" review of the Series 3 Tivo, it does NOT have multi-room viewing or TivoToGo -- both are lacking in order to comply with the CableLabs certification. Also, Keenan, they say that while you can scan and tune for unencrypted QAM signals, you couldn't map those channels to their respective networks. So right now it looks like we'd be paying $800 for Tivo's better interface and larger hard drive...that's about it. Not having the TivoToGo or multi-room viewing is kind of deal breaker for me.

http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/12/hands-on-with-the-tivo-series3/
I'm still going to give it a try, with one CC charge, the TiVo sub charge and Limited Basic I should still be saving about $40 a month. At $800 the unit will pay for itself in 20 mos....so, I don't know, I'll have to see how it goes...I'm so aggravated with Comcast, even if the cost is the same, at least they won't be getting as much of my money.

I asked a tech at the livermore office if this would work and he said it wouldnt. He said the 6412 wont pickup the digital signal by simply plugging in a 3412 in addition to the 6412. Take it for what its worth though, as comcast techs arent always the brightest of bulbs...if you know what I mean ;)

Just plugging in the box does not have an effect. Adding a 3412 or 700 to an ACCOUNT will cause any existing boxes to switch to the ADS lineup.

I'm still going to give it a try, with one CC charge, the TiVo sub charge and Limited Basic I should still be saving about $40 a month. At $800 the unit will pay for itself in 20 mos....so, I don't know, I'll have to see how it goes...I'm so aggravated with Comcast, even if the cost is the same, at least they won't be getting as much of my money.

S3 price is expected to come down (may be with rebates etc) in Jan-Feb right after period for lifetime transfer option from older Tivos ends. Apparently this is what happened with S2.

lemketron,

so i pay around $30 a month for my plan of limited basic + HD + digital classic these days.

I want to convert, but I can't make sense of the numbers. When I go to Comcast website to "shop" www.comcast.com/shop/buyflow/default.ashx I get:
Basic Cable $12.79
HD $5.00
Digital Classic $59.20

So what am I missing. This does not add up to $30/mo??? Digital Classic seems way to high?This is more than I pay for my grandfathered "Bronze" package with all channels plus a few premiums.

I think a lot of us who only care about HD will make this switch if we can understand EXACTLY what to tell COMCAST to do (or alternatively, where to go ;) )

I want to convert, but I can't make sense of the numbers. When I go to Comcast website to "shop" www.comcast.com/shop/buyflow/default.ashx I get:
Basic Cable $12.79
HD $5.00
Digital Classic $59.20

So what am I missing. This does not add up to $30/mo??? Digital Classic seems way to high?This is more than I pay for my grandfathered "Bronze" package with all channels plus a few premiums.

I think a lot of us who only care about HD will make this switch if we can understand EXACTLY what to tell COMCAST to do (or alternatively, where to go ;) )

There are 2 Digital Classics:
package includes Standard Cable (Expanded + Limited Basic) $59.20
tier is $10 and can be added to Limited Basic (Expanded Basic is not needed)

interesting. so you're saying that once comcast inputs it in their system it will send the digital signal automatically? regardless if the box is actually plugged in or not?

I swapped out my 6412 for a 3412 and once I got home I lost channels 2-107. when I called comcast, they confirmed the 3412 wont work in my area. I took it to back to the Walnut Creek office to have it swapped out for another 6412 and the customer service rep said it will be around 6 months before we will be able to use a 3412 in our area.
Just plugging in the box does not have an effect. Adding a 3412 or 700 to an ACCOUNT will cause any existing boxes to switch to the ADS lineup.

Rburks:

the website doesn't show what you want as it's listed digital classic includes expanded basic. if you order by phone, ask for

limited basic + HD + digital classic. the latter is $9.95 on top of the 12.79 and 5.00 you list (and there then are a some taxes that will bring it to around 30 bucks/mo.

good luck

The TiVo S3 can be ordered directly from TiVo starting today here (http://tivo.com/2.0.3hdDvr.plt.asp). A FAQ for the S3 is here (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=315791).

Does anyone know if multi-stream Cablecard is available in SF area? This single card, according to the FAQ, will allow dual tuner operation on the S3.

Rburks:

the website doesn't show what you want as it's listed digital classic includes expanded basic. if you order by phone, ask for

limited basic + HD + digital classic. the latter is $9.95 on top of the 12.79 and 5.00 you list (and there then are a some taxes that will bring it to around 30 bucks/mo.

good luck

And my final question...

If I convert and then am unhappy have I lost my Grandfathered channel lineup at my old price???? :(

where did KRON HD go in san jose 95136? it used to be at 115.8. now i can't find it any more.

comcast couldn't keep UHD at least until TNT came in town? yeesh. so only one poster has gotten a message about MHD? i wonder if that will be added too.

lol...when Comcast finally gets this current round of musical channels worked out, let me know and I'll have the first post updated.

In other news, I placed an order at 7am this morning for the S3 HD-TiVo. :)

lol...when Comcast finally gets this current round of musical channels worked out, let me know and I'll have the first post updated.

In other news, I placed an order at 7am this morning for the S3 HD-TiVo. :)
I'm going to order an S3 also. Do you think we can get multi-stream cablecard and avoid having to get 2 single-stream cards?

I'm going to order an S3 also. Do you think we can get multi-stream cablecard and avoid having to get 2 single-stream cards?
I don't think Comcast has them, or even if they will.



Barovelli, seen any multistream CableCARDS yet? The correct answer is YES. :p



Mikef5, can you contact Mr. J about multistream CableCARDS? I know they are a reality, it's just a matter of whether Comcast will have them or not.

I asked a tech at the livermore office if this would work and he said it wouldnt. He said the 6412 wont pickup the digital signal by simply plugging in a 3412 in addition to the 6412. Take it for what its worth though, as comcast techs arent always the brightest of bulbs...if you know what I mean ;)
There are multiple posts in this thread confirming the observed behavior of plugging adding 3412 to account enabling DS on 6412.

The conjecture is you are changed to a slightly different billing/service profile when you get a 3412 and that profile applies to all the boxes on your account.

interesting. so you're saying that once comcast inputs it in their system it will send the digital signal automatically? regardless if the box is actually plugged in or not?

I swapped out my 6412 for a 3412 and once I got home I lost channels 2-107. when I called comcast, they confirmed the 3412 wont work in my area. I took it to back to the Walnut Creek office to have it swapped out for another 6412 and the customer service rep said it will be around 6 months before we will be able to use a 3412 in our area.
The DS signals are always being sent (with the current infrastructure)

The only difference is basically whether the virtual channel mapping tells your box to tune to the analog channel or the DS channel. Since 3412 is only able to tune the DS channel (it has no analog tuner) adding 3412 to your account appears to trigger the DS virtual channel mapping to be used by all STBs in your account.

The way I figure it, I shouldn't need any CableCARDS or STBs, all I want to record is the local HD and that comes with Limited Basic. The question is how the S3 is going to find the channels, if it works like my Mits display tuner I should be set.
So it looks like the concern we discussed last week about whether CableCARD would be necessary to get the guide/channel mapping working has turned out to be a valid issue:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=315791

Does the S3 support unencrypted digital cable channels, aka QAM in-the-clear, without a CableCARD?
Partially. Clear QAM channels can be tuned directly by entering the correct channel number. Recordings can be scheduled by time and channel. There is no guide data for digital cable channels without CableCARD, and hence no Season Passes or Wish Lists are possible. There is currently no way to manually map channels. TiVo is looking into the possibility to provide mapping in the future.

So the answer is S3 will be able to record without CableCARD, but it will essentially become a manual digital VCR because you won't be able to schedule from the guide and you won't have the important TiVo features like Season Pass and Wish Lists. The recordings won't have the title and episode information from the guide either. IMO this represents a big loss of functional convenience and if you get an S3 for use with Comcast, you should plan on getting 2 CableCARDs to go with it (until someone can verify multistream is available)

You could of course record OTA if it is available in your area, but presumably the reason one has Comcast with limited basic is because OTA is inconvenient or unavailable.

I'd be interested in seeing what people end up paying for the CableCARDs for their S3s.

Is it $16 install charge, free CableCARD(s)

1st CableCARD included, $6.95 for 2nd CableCARD

possibly with a sprinkling of $5 HD outlet fees thrown in for good measure

or worst case we don't support S3 so we can't give you CableCARD right now

or a multitude of other combinations.

Yes, initially I'll need to have 2 CCs and then I'll play with it with the CCs in and out. Even if I need 2 CCs I think the cost should be free+1, or $6.95 total, but that remains to be seen.

Does anyone here have just 2 CCs from Comcast, no other equipment?

You know, while it's irrational, I'm so aggravated with Comcast at this point I really don't care if it turns out to cost me more(I don't believe it will though) just as long as Comcast isn't the one getting my money.

Is it $16 install charge, free CableCARD(s)

1st CableCARD included, $6.95 for 2nd CableCARD

possibly with a sprinkling of $5 HD outlet fees thrown in for good measure

or worst case we don't support S3 so we can't give you CableCARD right now

or a multitude of other combinations.
I think it should be the install charge plus the 1st card free plus $6.95 for the second, and there might be a $5 HD equipment charge as well.

I'm pretty sure they have to support the S3 per FCC regs, and there shouldn't be any issue with getting more than one either.

But this is Comcast we're talking about...

Yes, initially I'll need to have 2 CCs and then I'll play with it with the CCs in and out. Even if I need 2 CCs I think the cost should be free+1, or $6.95 total, but that remains to be seen.
Maybe if the design is done right, S3 will be able to use the channel mappings from the CableCARD in the the first tuner for the 2nd tuner (which didn't have a CableCARD for cost reasons). Of course the 2nd tuner wouldn't be able to record encrypted, but since it is likely your first CableCARD is included in the package you have, that will essentially become zero incremental cost if you only plan on recording the unencrypted QAM.

Maybe if the design is done right, S3 will be able to use the channel mappings from the CableCARD in the the first tuner for the 2nd tuner (which didn't have a CableCARD for cost reasons). Of course the 2nd tuner wouldn't be able to record encrypted, but since it is likely your first CableCARD is included in the package you have, that will essentially become zero incremental cost if you only plan on recording the unencrypted QAM.
I don't think one cablecard will allow dual tuner operation. From the FAQ:
What about one single-stream card?
If only one CableCARD is inserted, the entire system reverts to single-tuner operation. You lose dual-tuner support for antenna and analog cable, as well as digital cable. Unlike the S2DT, the S3 is not capable of asymmetric operation.

Also here (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=315849) is an interesting experience someone had with Comcast in getting cablecards for S3.

I don't think one cablecard will allow dual tuner operation. From the FAQ:
Thanks for pointing that out. There seems to be still a little wiggle room for engineers to come up with a better solution.

If by plugging in single CableCARD the 2nd tuner is completely disabled because of hardware restrictions then there is no wiggle room.

However, they could have meant instead that if you use CableCARD (ie QAM tuner) then antenna/analog on the 2nd tuner is lost.

"You lose dual-tuner support for antenna and analog cable,"

and the 2nd part

"as well as digital cable."

could have just been interpretation that if you use S3 you'll want to use CableCARD because of the loss of features if you don't, so while the 2nd tuner might still be active (for QAM but not ATSC/NTSC), it wouldn't make sense that someone would use it in this fashion because of the lack of guide mappings. The significance of this interpretation would be a future software update might allow the CableCARD to just be used for virtual channel mapping downloads and not be used for decryption at all, and possibly in that case you could use S3 to record the HD locals with full TiVo functionality.

If they really wanted to mean the 2nd tuner is disabled, they could have been more clear and written it as:
"You lose dual-tuner support for antenna, analog cable, and digital cable."

Admittedly this is just wishful thinking and it could quite possibly be that the 2nd tuner is useless from the hardware standpoint when only one single-stream CableCARD is inserted.

This potential optimization only comes into play if you don't care about recording encrypted channels and just want to record HD locals, but also don't want to pay $6.95 for the 2nd CableCARD (ie a situation Keenan would be in and I think I would be in the same boat)

Alternatively if they come up with some ability to map channels either automatically through nightly downloads or through manual mapping that would be sufficient as well.

What about one single-stream card?
If only one CableCARD is inserted, the entire system reverts to single-tuner operation. You lose dual-tuner support for antenna and analog cable, as well as digital cable. Unlike the S2DT, the S3 is not capable of asymmetric operation.

I'd be interested in seeing what people end up paying for the CableCARDs for their S3s.

Is it $16 install charge, free CableCARD(s)

1st CableCARD included, $6.95 for 2nd CableCARD

possibly with a sprinkling of $5 HD outlet fees thrown in for good measure

or worst case we don't support S3 so we can't give you CableCARD right now

or a multitude of other combinations.

So how can a person get someone at Comcast who knows what they're talking about and selling?

wendek
still OTA for now

Sad to see UHD go, as I was hoping to get all of BSG season 2. I had left my box on 726 overnight, and when I first went on on Monday UHD was showing a replay of Agassi's last match, but, then when I scrolled through the channels, and hit 'info' on a currently playing show, the stupid box switched to that channel and I couldn't get back to UHD (just the waiting for channel message).
I did scroll through SD-TNT, and unless some of the movies are in HD (need to check their web-site (http://www.tnt.tv/hd/)) the channel will stay unwatched. UHD wasn't great but, at least it had some shows I'd watch, including Firefly in October/November. Ahhhhhhh!
No money to get the S3 TiVo, but, certainly tempting with the lame 6412 I'm currently using. 120GBs it throughly inadequate for recording even a week's worth of HD programming--12-13 hours is 2 hours for only SIX nights, so forget if there's a movie you want to watch. I'm not even sure you'd be able to record the 'Complete' Star Wars on Cinemax this fall!

Well, searched around the TNT-HD site, and other than the 'search-and-replace' HD FAQ, I found no indication that anything the broadcast on the TNT-HD channel was actually in HD!!! So unless their little 'flash movie' that wouldn't load says something, I would then assume that everything is just up-converted SD--as their own site doesn't say anything either way.
Sports are probably done it HD, but, I find basketball intensely boring, and Nascar only good for the crashes, and even then...and probably the original shows are in HD. Which doesn't give me much reason to ever watch the channel. I wonder if Comcast will note the viewership change between UHD, and TNT-HD, if any?

P.S. any word on getting KBCW in HD?

I have a cablecard enabled TV in the bedroom and it's receiving TNT-HD on 726. I noticed this last night when I was playing around with the TV. The downstairs TV with STB (6412) is currently blocking out 726.

I don't think Comcast has them, or even if they will.
Barovelli, seen any multistream CableCARDS yet? The correct answer is YES. :p
Mikef5, can you contact Mr. J about multistream CableCARDS? I know they are a reality, it's just a matter of whether Comcast will have them or not.

The answer is yes, Comcast don't have them. :p

No ETA. I really don't hate cable cards - do hate the hokey pokey dance that different hardwares make you dance to get the things to activate & map.

In the flurry of stuff going on here -
We were lucky to have some Tivo S3s hooked up in the footprint, so it's not tooo odd to hear the request. Call center has heard of it...cost should be same as if you had 2 CC TVs, 1 free, 1 additional for $(insert local charge)

ADS - lets put this one to rest. When you put an ADS box on an account, the acccount MUST be tagged as ADS or the 3412/700 won't display 2-8x. Any other set tops on the account follow the new leaders (or die). ADS is rolling along unrequested in some areas, slowly.

The answer is yes, Comcast don't have them. :p

No ETA. I really don't hate cable cards - do hate the hokey pokey dance that different hardwares make you dance to get the things to activate & map.

In the flurry of stuff going on here -
We were lucky to have some Tivo S3s hooked up in the footprint, so it's not tooo odd to hear the request. Call center has heard of it...cost should be same as if you had 2 CC TVs, 1 free, 1 additional for $(insert local charge)


Thanks, so "free" on the first one and the "Additional Digital Outlet" charge for the second one, works for me. :)

Does Comcast still insist on a truck roll or can the cards be picked up at the office?

Does Comcast still insist on a truck roll or can the cards be picked up at the office?

AFAIK, it's still a tech only install. All that voodoo to get things happily co-joined takes a human at the scene and often a second one via crystal ball network.

I think I'm going to wait to see what Comcast has to offer in regards to the Tivo software. Like I said initially, because multi-room viewing and TivoToGo are not enabled on these, the only thing I can see as being a difference between what Tivo offers and what Comcast will offer (for the Tivo software) is a larger hard drive. But I can see Keenan's point...anything to keep money out of Comcast's pockets. :D

Barovelli, have you seen any movement in regards to the Tivo software on the Comcast system? Still on track for a "by the end of the year" release?

With the release of the Series 3 TiVo today, I figured it was time to call Comcast to find out about CableCard and HD service in Walnut Creek (my current provider Astound told me that each CC would be $6.95/month because they just treat CC's as digital cable boxes :mad: ). The Comcast rep I spoke with said they didn't charge anything extra for CC. Then when I asked him which HD channels, Comcast provided in the area, he said NBC, ABC, FOX, KRON,... UPN, PBS, ESPN, ESPN2, ESPN Universal,...

Wait, back up for a second... I asked him again about that... Me: UPN? Rep: yes. Me: in HD? Rep: yes. Me: And did you say Universal HD? Rep: it says ESPN Universal - ESPNU.

Has anyone heard this or seen these channels on Comcast in the Bay Area?

Hey guys, I currently use a regular Moto 6200 STB and I just upgraded my display this week to a Mitsubishi 2007 Model DLP with HDMI and Cablecard functionality. I'm just following this thread right now and I'll do my best to keep up after the years I havent looked around here but can somebody tell me if there is a NON-DVR STB available now that has native HDMI output?

With the release of the Series 3 TiVo today, I figured it was time to call Comcast to find out about CableCard and HD service in Walnut Creek (my current provider Astound told me that each CC would be $6.95/month because they just treat CC's as digital cable boxes :mad: ). The Comcast rep I spoke with said they didn't charge anything extra for CC. Then when I asked him which HD channels, Comcast provided in the area, he said NBC, ABC, FOX, KRON,... UPN, PBS, ESPN, ESPN2, ESPN Universal,...

Wait, back up for a second... I asked him again about that... Me: UPN? Rep: yes. Me: in HD? Rep: yes. Me: And did you say Universal HD? Rep: it says ESPN Universal - ESPNU.

Has anyone heard this or seen these channels on Comcast in the Bay Area?

UPN either means UHD or theCW. i would like both please.

ESPNU is espn university, which only shows college sports. eh... its in SD, didn't know we had it yet, i thought comcast and disney didn't agree to terms with that channel.

Is anyone having problems with the sound on KNTV HD channel 703? I can hear the background sound like cars, office noise but no dialog from the characters. Also it is not showing the Digital Dolby 5.1 on the info banner. I get the sound okay when there are ads showing. KNTV channel 3 is okay. I have no problems with HD Channels 702, 704, 705, InDemand, etc. I called Comcast and they say they have no reports except one earlier from someone complaining about KTVU.

John

Service back to normal about 15-20 minutes ago. Info banner now showing Digital Dolby 5.1 on KNTV 703.

cost should be same as if you had 2 CC TVs, 1 free, 1 additional for $(insert local charge)

Someone in the TiVo forum reported that because the 2 CableCards are assigned to a single device, they should be treated as a single outlet.

That depends on who's doing the should-ing. ;)

Someone in the TiVo forum reported that because the 2 CableCards are assigned to a single device, they should be treated as a single outlet.

That's an interesting (and valid) argument. I'm curious as to how Comcast will handle this.

s3 is really expensive... 800 bucks + monthly charge (12.99) that is more than comcast's?? two cable cards?? another 6.95 tacked on. i don't see why some of you are jumping ship, even tho the 6412 is crap, it still records HD. TiVo's turn off is price... argh...... i just don't see why there is such excitement. ......

it makes cool noises..... ok.... it doesn't have a delayed response....... ok..... THX...... er..... i don't know what that is exactly but you prob can't get that off a normal show. tell me what i'm missing.

Is anyone having problems with the sound on KNTV HD channel 703? I can hear the background sound like cars, office noise but no dialog from the characters. Also it is not showing the Digital Dolby 5.1 on the info banner. I get the sound okay when there are ads showing. KNTV channel 3 is okay. I have no problems with HD Channels 702, 704, 705, InDemand, etc. I called Comcast and they say they have no reports except one earlier from someone complaining about KTVU.

John

Service back to normal about 15-20 minutes ago. Info banner now showing Digital Dolby 5.1 on KNTV 703.
It was the same in Fremont for about an hour and a half.

s3 is really expensive... 800 bucks + monthly charge (12.99) that is more than comcast's?? two cable cards?? another 6.95 tacked on. i don't see why some of you are jumping ship, even tho the 6412 is crap, it still records HD. TiVo's turn off is price... argh...... i just don't see why there is such excitement. ......

it makes cool noises..... ok.... it doesn't have a delayed response....... ok..... THX...... er..... i don't know what that is exactly but you prob can't get that off a normal show. tell me what i'm missing.
Depends on what your needs are. I only need the one box for only one display and I can understand fenders reluctance at this point as he needs more boxes for more displays.

As far as cost, the below should be pretty close to a comparison between the Comcast 6412 and the Tivo S3.

Over a 3 year period, Comcast with the 6412 will cost me about $2800.
(Standard Cable + Digital Classic + DVR rental + local taxes, fees, etc)

Over a 3 year period, the S3 will cost me about $1950
(Limited Basic + CableCARD(2) + TiVo service + local taxes, fees, etc).

Monthly, Comcast $76, S3 about $55.

Plus, the things that don't show in the numbers. The 6412 is crippled with only 120gbs of storage space, not even enough to store a full week of HD programming. The S3 storage could be almost unlimited, out of the box, it's over twice that of the 6412. The S3 records OTA HD, the 6412 does not. The S3 sends native output, the 6412 does not(this is very nice since the 6412 is certainly not a world beater in this area, and it allows for external scalers to do a much better job of deinterlacing and scaling). There's probably a few other things, but one of the biggest for me is that Comcast is not getting as much of my money. If/when they decide to show their 550MHz subs a little respect, then this dynamic may change.

It's not for everyone, that's for sure, but I like the numbers and the comparative differences in the products.

That's an interesting (and valid) argument. I'm curious as to how Comcast will handle this.
Use a formula that will give them the highest rate of return, one generally not good for the consumer. :rolleyes: :D

Anyone else's box go into reset/DL mode this morning? I'm in Foster City...
My 6412p1 was doing continual reset cycle this morning, I powered it off for a bit, now it's doing DL (firmware download)... for last 10mins...

maybe it's finally crashed, fate telling me to splurge for the Tivo S3, hehe :)

Update: been doing "dl" w/ rotating LEDs for over an hour. I unplugged, got some error codes, then it restarted the dl process. Didn't think would take this long...

Before I got DL, in between reboots, I did see my shows in My DVR, so HDD shouldn't be dead... I have my USB fan back on, since it's been hot lately.

Depends on what your needs are. I only need the one box for only one display and I can understand fenders reluctance at this point as he needs more boxes for more displays.

As far as cost, the below should be pretty close to a comparison between the Comcast 6412 and the Tivo S3.

Over a 3 year period, Comcast with the 6412 will cost me about $2800.
(Standard Cable + Digital Classic + DVR rental + local taxes, fees, etc)

Over a 3 year period, the S3 will cost me about $1950
(Limited Basic + CableCARD(2) + TiVo service + local taxes, fees, etc).

Monthly, Comcast $76, S3 about $55.

Plus, the things that don't show in the numbers. The 6412 is crippled with only 120gbs of storage space, not even enough to store a full week of HD programming. The S3 storage could be almost unlimited, out of the box, it's over twice that of the 6412. The S3 records OTA HD, the 6412 does not. The S3 sends native output, the 6412 does not(this is very nice since the 6412 is certainly not a world beater in this area, and it allows for external scalers to do a much better job of deinterlacing and scaling). There's probably a few other things, but one of the biggest for me is that Comcast is not getting as much of my money. If/when they decide to show their 550MHz subs a little respect, then this dynamic may change.

It's not for everyone, that's for sure, but I like the numbers and the comparative differences in the products.
Did you intentionally leave out Digital Classic when you did the pricing for the S3? Or do you only care about the broadcast networks and don't want ESPN-HD, DSC-HD, InHD, FSNBA-HD, etc.?

lemketron,

no, digital classic does not replace expanded basic. it adds a few channels like ESPN-Classic, SciFi, music channels, and some other "higher number" digital channels that i don't really watch.

so you don't get comedy central, discovery, HGTV, etc. )channels 36- ~72) but by getting digital classic, i end up with the added HDTV stations such as:

ESPN-HD
ESPN2-HD
TNT-HD/UHD (the former to be coming 9/20)
Discovery-HD
FSN-HD
INHD

in addition to the local stations which are available without the $9.95 digital classic fee.

perfect plan for me because all i want really are the local networks and ESPN-HD and FSN-HD. for people who were doing limited basic + HD since 2003, they get all of these without paying for digital classic. they get grandfathered into the extra channels above (not SciFi or ESPN-Classic, but the HD ones). i had that great deal ($19 a month!) at my former house, but i couldn't keep that sort of plan when i recently moved. so i pay around $30 a month for my plan of limited basic + HD + digital classic these days.

hope this helps clarify things.

I am doing my due dilligence to switch from current COMCAST package w/ 6412 DVR to COMCAST Basic+Digital Classic+HD.

We have 5 TVs, 4 are analog and will use no box, so assume will only get a few channels on them. The 5th is the one I care about. Sony SXRD with QAM tuner. My objective would be to eliminate the Comcast box if at all possible. I know I give up HD recording, but rarely use it now. Plus, can add S3 later if I want. Some questions I would really appreciate info on:

1) What channels will an analog TV with no box get?

2) Can I get all the channels listed above with QAM tuner w/o the box or a cable card?

3) Currently I split my cable to the box and one directly to the TV. Though we (in San Carlos) are not switched to ADS yet, the QAM tuner hooked straight ot cable can pick up all the digital channels 2-81 scattered about 86.x - 88.x). Will I lose these when I switch my plan? Or when they go encrypted?

4) I have found many of the HD channels direct from cable via QAM, but not Discovery, IND1 or 2, NFLHD, FSN-HD, or ESPN2. Did I miss these, or is the only way to pick these up is via a box or CC?

5) Also, if it ends up I need a CC to get these channels, I should be able to get that free from COMCAST?

I really appreciate all the analysis others have done on this forum. I too feel "trapped" by the high costs, but don't want to make the switch to find I am missing something I really wanted to have, only to have COMCAST then tell me sorry, you lose your Grandfathered rates and now have to pay MORE than you did before.

So again, many thanks to those out there blazing this trail.

Can't wait for the S3. Assume it will ABSOLUTELY require either CC or box?

I am doing my due dilligence to switch from current COMCAST package w/ 6412 DVR to COMCAST Basic+Digital Classic+HD.

We have 5 TVs, 4 are analog and will use no box, so assume will only get a few channels on them. The 5th is the one I care about. Sony SXRD with QAM tuner. My objective would be to eliminate the Comcast box if at all possible. I know I give up HD recording, but rarely use it now. Plus, can add S3 later if I want. Some questions I would really appreciate info on:


1) What channels will an analog TV with no box get?

normal CATV, eg 2-78 or so..
Edit: correction, with "Limited" (cheap) Basic cable, you will get higher channels (above broadcast, eg 20+? or so) filtered out.

2) Can I get all the channels listed above with QAM tuner w/o the box or a cable card?

Some channels are encrypted, eg Discovery, ESPN-HD, etc- need STB or CC for those. See #4 below.
Networks should be "in the clear".
A lot of this is updated in the first "sticky" page of this thread, please check it..

3) Currently I split my cable to the box and one directly to the TV. Though we (in San Carlos) are not switched to ADS yet, the QAM tuner hooked straight ot cable can pick up all the digital channels 2-81 scattered about 86.x - 88.x). Will I lose these when I switch my plan? Or when they go encrypted?

Not sure, but you'd need CC or STB to do the automatic remapping for the channels. Probably they'd be in the clear, at least "basic cable" channels.

4) I have found many of the HD channels direct from cable via QAM, but not Discovery, IND1 or 2, NFLHD, FSN-HD, or ESPN2. Did I miss these, or is the only way to pick these up is via a box or CC?

They are encrypted. Need STB box or CC.


5) Also, if it ends up I need a CC to get these channels, I should be able to get that free from COMCAST?

Comcast has quoted $15.99 for install, cable card(s) free.


I really appreciate all the analysis others have done on this forum. I too feel "trapped" by the high costs, but don't want to make the switch to find I am missing something I really wanted to have, only to have COMCAST then tell me sorry, you lose your Grandfathered rates and now have to pay MORE than you did before.

So again, many thanks to those out there blazing this trail.

Can't wait for the S3. Assume it will ABSOLUTELY require either CC or box?


S3 REQUIRES dual cable cards to work properly w/ digital cable/HDTV.
It can manually tune QAM channels but can't tie the channel to a station, so won't do any guide data/recordings for it except manually.

Keenan:

I'm trying to do the same Apples/Apples comparison that you did. For reference, why did you change your Comcast service to "Limited Basic" vs. "Standard/Digital Classic?"

Thx.
John

Depends on what your needs are. I only need the one box for only one display and I can understand fenders reluctance at this point as he needs more boxes for more displays.

As far as cost, the below should be pretty close to a comparison between the Comcast 6412 and the Tivo S3.

Over a 3 year period, Comcast with the 6412 will cost me about $2800.
(Standard Cable + Digital Classic + DVR rental + local taxes, fees, etc)

Over a 3 year period, the S3 will cost me about $1950
(Limited Basic + CableCARD(2) + TiVo service + local taxes, fees, etc).

Monthly, Comcast $76, S3 about $55.

Plus, the things that don't show in the numbers. The 6412 is crippled with only 120gbs of storage space, not even enough to store a full week of HD programming. The S3 storage could be almost unlimited, out of the box, it's over twice that of the 6412. The S3 records OTA HD, the 6412 does not. The S3 sends native output, the 6412 does not(this is very nice since the 6412 is certainly not a world beater in this area, and it allows for external scalers to do a much better job of deinterlacing and scaling). There's probably a few other things, but one of the biggest for me is that Comcast is not getting as much of my money. If/when they decide to show their 550MHz subs a little respect, then this dynamic may change.

It's not for everyone, that's for sure, but I like the numbers and the comparative differences in the products.

1) What channels will an analog TV with no box get?

normal CATV, eg 2-78 or so

I thought earlier someone posted that with BASIC+DIGITAL CLASSIC+HD you lose stations 20-78 or so???

Since DIGITAL CLASSIC is not specified on the COMCAST website this is very very confusing.

Anybody have this configuration that can specify exactly what channels you get with BASIC+DIGITAL CLASSIC?

I thought earlier someone posted that with BASIC+DIGITAL CLASSIC+HD you lose stations 20-78 or so???

Since DIGITAL CLASSIC is not specified on the COMCAST website this is very very confusing.

Anybody have this configuration that can specify exactly what channels you get with BASIC+DIGITAL CLASSIC?

Correct, sorry I misread the basic (not STANDARD or "Expanded basic") cable.
Thanks for the correction.
With "basic" (cheap) cable they normally put a filter on the line to block the higher channels, else any analog tuner could receive them. (no CC needed for analog)
Don't know what would happen to the ADS simulcast of these higher channels- I'd assume they may be encrypted or...

Digital classic can be on top of expanded / standard cable, and website should list the channels... both HDTV and digital. If you can find it on the messy site :(

You can also get digital classic on top of basic cable only, no "expanded" analog channels, that's a cheap ($10?) way to get the HD "encrypted" channels.
However in several markets, Comcast requires you have full "expanded" analog cable to get their DVR. If you are in this market (eg Bay Area), and want HD-DVR , but not the full analog channels, then switching to the Tivo S3 could mean significant savings.(like $30-40/mo?)

wish i knew for you. (pessimistically based on prior experience, i'd say you would lose your grandfathering)... i recently moved and lost my "grandfathering" for limited basic + HD (got FSN-HD,INHD,ESPNHD,etc.)when i transferred service so i had to add digital classic...but still for $30 a month, it's a better option than either satellite provider for my watching habits.

And my final question...

If I convert and then am unhappy have I lost my Grandfathered channel lineup at my old price???? :(

just to clarify the whole "analog channel" range for limited basic:

i get channels 2-35. 35 = food network is slightly snowy, but very watchable (i don't watch it often)...FX (ch 36) is very snowy and after that, its all gone. above around 73 (?), things come back in again so you get OLN, Golf Channel, and a few others in around 80 or so.

so basically, but downgrading from expanded basic to limited basic, one loses channels 36-73 (again, not sure where the signal comes back in again as i don't watch much up there....i think i recall TVLand comes in snowy if someone remembers what channel that is)

this is in Santa Clara and the same is true for a friend in Fremont, so i assume most filters will do the same thing.

When I had limited basic it also killed my HSI speed. They put a trap on the line to filter out channels 36-72 or so, but it also screws up the cable modem. Something else to think about if you have HSI and want to go that route.

Over a 3 year period, Comcast with the 6412 will cost me about $2800.
(Standard Cable + Digital Classic + DVR rental + local taxes, fees, etc)

Over a 3 year period, the S3 will cost me about $1950
(Limited Basic + CableCARD(2) + TiVo service + local taxes, fees, etc).

Monthly, Comcast $76, S3 about $55. Do you also have satellite service or something? Because with only limited and no digital package you won't get ESPN, FSN, MTV, TNT, CNN, Comedy, etc etc etc.. I don't think you'll even get the HD versions of ESPN, FSN (INHD) those might require a digital package... You're not really comparing apples/apples here.

Secondly, I think you have to factor in the cost of the Tivo hardware too, which are not trivial ($800?). I mean if you figured 3 years shelf life (I would want to get more but...) that's $22.22/mo alone.

Of course you get more storage and a better interface and much much better hardware (let's face it you get something that WORKS more often than not...) but it's hardly cheaper in the long run. Or, short run...

Did you intentionally leave out Digital Classic when you did the pricing for the S3? Or do you only care about the broadcast networks and don't want ESPN-HD, DSC-HD, InHD, FSNBA-HD, etc.?

He left out that he also has both Directv and Dishnetwork at his house ;)

Comcast is mainly for local HD since he lives in the boondocks of Santa Rosa and Comcast treats the area like the ugly stepchild because of that and he doesnt get most of those from Comcast..

although as long as he keeps throwing them all that money (for FREE channels) they may never upgrade :p

I didnt check my box before leaving for work this morning, but I had some serious compression issues (I think, but am not sure) last night with my 6412.

Here are the symptoms:

- Twitchy playback: Instead of panning smoothly the screen would sort of twitch when in busy scenes

- No Audio on Law & Order: I tuned into Law & Order SVU to find no sound on the channel at all. I changed channels, had perfect sound, changed back and nothing. After leaving it on the channel for about 10 minutes the sound started to come on but it was not synched with the picture. then the picture got super pixelated and froze. All other HD channels were working fine

Note: The twitchy playback was on ALL hd channels, and even occurred when I watched recordings in HD on my DVR. Very annoying. :rolleyes: Anyone else's box go into reset/DL mode this morning? I'm in Foster City...
My 6412p1 was doing continual reset cycle this morning, I powered it off for a bit, now it's doing DL (firmware download)... for last 10mins...

maybe it's finally crashed, fate telling me to splurge for the Tivo S3, hehe :)

Update: been doing "dl" w/ rotating LEDs for over an hour. I unplugged, got some error codes, then it restarted the dl process. Didn't think would take this long...

Before I got DL, in between reboots, I did see my shows in My DVR, so HDD shouldn't be dead... I have my USB fan back on, since it's been hot lately.

Thanks for the clarification.

I am looking forward to being able to utilize a 3412 in my area, as the current digital SD channels look much better than the analog SD channels. Guess I will just have to sit and wait, as usual, for comcast to upgrade our area :rolleyes: The DS signals are always being sent (with the current infrastructure)

The only difference is basically whether the virtual channel mapping tells your box to tune to the analog channel or the DS channel. Since 3412 is only able to tune the DS channel (it has no analog tuner) adding 3412 to your account appears to trigger the DS virtual channel mapping to be used by all STBs in your account.

When I had limited basic it also killed my HSI speed. They put a trap on the line to filter out channels 36-72 or so, but it also screws up the cable modem. Something else to think about if you have HSI and want to go that route.

I have limited basic and had HSI -- no problem. If I remember correctly, 35 is not part of limited basic, so I cannot complain to Comcast about the picture quality.

is there some sort of work flow you can point me too that has a comprehensive list of comcast's package tiers? (i do better with pictures)
or a bullet point list with general pricings post i might have missed in these 408 pages?

I am currently using OTA and only have Comcast's internet with out cable TV. sure, i checked out what i could get by plugging the cable into the TV, but i don't like having to chase the stations up and down the channels, and i am so used to my S2 TiVo's i miss the online guide. Are comcast's STB's really that bad compared to TiVo?

wendek
i'm on the fence between Comcast and DirecTV...

I have limited basic and had HSI -- no problem. If I remember correctly, 35 is not part of limited basic, so I cannot complain to Comcast about the picture quality.

yes, you are right, channel 35 is not part of the limited basic lineup.

i also had HSI at one point and was getting 3-6 Mbps (depending on time of day using speakeasy's speedtest) on limited basic, so i don't think the filter is a problem.

I am currently using OTA and only have Comcast's internet with out cable TV. sure, i checked out what i could get by plugging the cable into the TV, but i don't like having to chase the stations up and down the channels
wendek
i'm on the fence between Comcast and DirecTV...

Wendek,
First Comcast doesn't even list the DIGITAL CLASSIC folks are talking about here on their web site. You have to call to ask for it. Hence the confusion on exactly what it entails.

You said you do NOT have COMCAST TV Cable service, but you have cable internet, right? And you have plugged in the cable to your TV and you DO GET CHANNELS?

If this is true can you tell us which ones????? Please.

Did you intentionally leave out Digital Classic when you did the pricing for the S3? Or do you only care about the broadcast networks and don't want ESPN-HD, DSC-HD, InHD, FSNBA-HD, etc.?
Yes, because in order to get the Comcast DVR you have to subscribe to Digital Classic, with the S3 and the CCs you don't need to have Digital Classic and Expanded Basic. All I want to record is the local HD. To do that with Comcast and their DVR it costs me $76 a month, that's about $15 a channel.

My system doesn't have InHD or FSNBA-HD, in fact, the only extra HD channels other than the locals are ESPN-HD and Discovery-HD.

Keenan:

I'm trying to do the same Apples/Apples comparison that you did. For reference, why did you change your Comcast service to "Limited Basic" vs. "Standard/Digital Classic?"

Thx.
John
Copied my reply to hiker,

Yes, because in order to get the Comcast DVR you have to subscribe to Digital Classic, with the S3 and the CCs you don't need to have Digital Classic and Expanded Basic. All I want to record is the local HD. To do that with Comcast and their DVR it costs me $76 a month, that's about $15 a channel.

It was left off because I don't want it, but had to have it to get the Comcast DVR.

Yes, because in order to get the Comcast DVR you have to subscribe to Digital Classic, with the S3 and the CCs you don't need to have Digital Classic and Expanded Basic. All I want to record is the local HD. To do that with Comcast and their DVR it costs me $76 a month, that's about $15 a channel.

My system doesn't have InHD or FSNBA-HD, in fact, the only extra HD channels other than the locals are ESPN-HD and Discovery-HD.
No wonder this is confusing. I had expanded basic analog (no STB). I wanted two cable cards for my S3 TiVo, and I didn't want to lose the expanded basic channels.

My understanding is that in order to get ESPN-HD and Discovery-HD (and I do hope there's more in Sunnyvale but I'm not optimistic) that I needed to add "Digital Classic" (for $9.95/mo) in order for the (free, in lieu of a STB) cable cards to actually function. I'm pretty sure the cable cards won't do anything with just "expanded basic" (analog service), and I also understand that TiVO S3 w/o cable cards can't map the QAM channels to the program guide info (another item that points to the need for "Digital Classic" service to "enable" the cards, even if that DOES only add ESPN and DISC). The Comcast folks in the Sunnyvale office tried to tell me I needed "HD service" but I was under the impression that wasn't a "service" but a "box rental" and I definitely don't need that.

If someone could confirm that I really do just need to add "Digital Classic" (to enable the cable cards and to get the few additional encrypted HD channels that I'm unable to get with a QAM tuner) and not "HD 'service'", that would be great.

Is there any prayer of a chance that Sunnyvale will get more than ESPN-HD and DISC-HD? Last time I looked, ESPN-HD wasn't even encrypted; even if it's not, I don't watch enough sports to be worth $9.95/month (meaning Comcast is getting $9.95/month from me to essentially just map the cable card channels to my TiVo's program guide, and to get DISC-HD?). :mad:

Do you also have satellite service or something? Because with only limited and no digital package you won't get ESPN, FSN, MTV, TNT, CNN, Comedy, etc etc etc.. I don't think you'll even get the HD versions of ESPN, FSN (INHD) those might require a digital package... You're not really comparing apples/apples here.

Secondly, I think you have to factor in the cost of the Tivo hardware too, which are not trivial ($800?). I mean if you figured 3 years shelf life (I would want to get more but...) that's $22.22/mo alone.

Of course you get more storage and a better interface and much much better hardware (let's face it you get something that WORKS more often than not...) but it's hardly cheaper in the long run. Or, short run...
Yes, I have both Dish and DirecTV. DirecTV I will dropping at the end of the football season(Sunday Ticket, which frankly I wish I hadn't went with this year, but oh well).

Dish provides me with more HD than I can physically watch, and they are adding more all the time. Plus, the local HD from Dish has gotten very, very good quality-wise giving me another reason to drop DirecTV as I don't need their DNS LA HD feeds anymore.

The $800 was already figured in the total cost, along with the 3 year TiVo subscription.

I don't watch SD channels(other than FX, USA and SciFi and they all look better on Dish) and we don't get any of the extra HD channels you guys get up here, only Disc-HD and ESPN-HD. ESPN-HD from Dish, by virtue of it being 720p, looks identical to the Comcast version.

I had broke down all the costs last night but couldn't get it to format right when posting, I'll try again later, it listed all the costs by provider/equipment down to the local taxes and fees. For now, what I posted above cost-wise is pretty accurate.

is there some sort of work flow you can point me too that has a comprehensive list of comcast's package tiers? (i do better with pictures)
or a bullet point list with general pricings post i might have missed in these 408 pages?

I am currently using OTA and only have Comcast's internet with out cable TV. sure, i checked out what i could get by plugging the cable into the TV, but i don't like having to chase the stations up and down the channels, and i am so used to my S2 TiVo's i miss the online guide. Are comcast's STB's really that bad compared to TiVo?

wendek
i'm on the fence between Comcast and DirecTV...
This is a copy of the price list that every cable company is required to provide every year to it's subs. It's a year old and might be a little hard to read, but the prices haven't changed much, if at all.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v637/keenanj/CablePackages.jpg

This one is from the handout you can get at the Comcast office.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v637/keenanj/Prices.jpg

No wonder this is confusing. I had expanded basic analog (no STB). I wanted two cable cards for my S3 TiVo, and I didn't want to lose the expanded basic channels.

My understanding is that in order to get ESPN-HD and Discovery-HD (and I do hope there's more in Sunnyvale but I'm not optimistic) that I needed to add "Digital Classic" (for $9.95/mo) in order for the (free, in lieu of a STB) cable cards to actually function. I'm pretty sure the cable cards won't do anything with just "expanded basic" (analog service), and I also understand that TiVO S3 w/o cable cards can't map the QAM channels to the program guide info (another item that points to the need for "Digital Classic" service to "enable" the cards, even if that DOES only add ESPN and DISC). The Comcast folks in the Sunnyvale office tried to tell me I needed "HD service" but I was under the impression that wasn't a "service" but a "box rental" and I definitely don't need that.

If someone could confirm that I really do just need to add "Digital Classic" (to enable the cable cards and to get the few additional encrypted HD channels that I'm unable to get with a QAM tuner) and not "HD 'service'", that would be great.

Is there any prayer of a chance that Sunnyvale will get more than ESPN-HD and DISC-HD? Last time I looked, ESPN-HD wasn't even encrypted; even if it's not, I don't watch enough sports to be worth $9.95/month (meaning Comcast is getting $9.95/month from me to essentially just map the cable card channels to my TiVo's program guide, and to get DISC-HD?). :mad:

You are correct.

The only real point to get an S3 (vs the DT or other SD Tivo) is exactly for digital (SD and HD) channels. Some of these are "in the clear" and unencrypted, eg networks HD, and QAM tuners can see them.
Other encrypted channels, which are part of Digital Classic, like DiscoveryHD and ESPN-HD or whatever you get in your area (see the sticky First post for details), requires CableCard to authorize you.
Note that the S3 needs to CableCards to correctly map any digital channels, so you need to get 2 cards regardless of digital classic or not.

In the Bay Area, so far seems Comcast CableCards should cost you $15.99 installation/truck roll, and FREE 2 cards (it's a single, married device, NOT two outlets.) If you do NOT get Digital Classic for the encrypted extra HD/digital channels, they might charge a bit more for the cards, depends (since $9.95 incl a STB or card), but it should still be very minimal (like under $2ea card; max $6.95 or so digital outlet.)

You should NOT have to pay the $5 HD fee (that covers extra cost of 6200 box vs plain SD stb, not service.)
If you are a user not interested in full analog cable, this works out to a pretty good deal.

There are several threads covering this as well on the tivocommunity.com forums, check there as well.

Wendek,
First Comcast doesn't even list the DIGITAL CLASSIC folks are talking about here on their web site. You have to call to ask for it. Hence the confusion on exactly what it entails.

You said you do NOT have COMCAST TV Cable service, but you have cable internet, right? And you have plugged in the cable to your TV and you DO GET CHANNELS?

If this is true can you tell us which ones????? Please.

Well, they seem to move around so it's hard to nail them down and i mainly recognize most of them as what i also get as OTA. With QAM & ATSC tuners in the TV, i get the regulars in fuzzy analog 2-65 (or so), and in digital up to about 120.1 or so, ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, UPN-WB, KQED=5 stations, the Travel Channel, Animal Planet, ESPNHD (monday night football!) fuzzy Hallmark, fuzzy SciFi, The Country Music stations, OLN, Golf, the shopping channels, about 20 radio/music stations, the extra ABC & NBC stations, sometimes i get somebody's On Demand or a movie shows up, but i only recently plugged the wire into the TV again so i wouldn't miss the games, so i'm not sure, but there is probably a few more that i am getting.
i do get pretty fast broadband as it is.

of course it's not fun trying to figure out where ABC is today on the channel, which is why i will go ahead and pay some company for TV, either Comcast or dish, but just can't get over the $70+ a month for cable tv. TiVo's S3 starting to sound a little ok at $1k start up.

Wendek

No wonder this is confusing. I had expanded basic analog (no STB). I wanted two cable cards for my S3 TiVo, and I didn't want to lose the expanded basic channels.

My understanding is that in order to get ESPN-HD and Discovery-HD (and I do hope there's more in Sunnyvale but I'm not optimistic) that I needed to add "Digital Classic" (for $9.95/mo) in order for the (free, in lieu of a STB) cable cards to actually function. I'm pretty sure the cable cards won't do anything with just "expanded basic" (analog service), and I also understand that TiVO S3 w/o cable cards can't map the QAM channels to the program guide info (another item that points to the need for "Digital Classic" service to "enable" the cards, even if that DOES only add ESPN and DISC). The Comcast folks in the Sunnyvale office tried to tell me I needed "HD service" but I was under the impression that wasn't a "service" but a "box rental" and I definitely don't need that.

If someone could confirm that I really do just need to add "Digital Classic" (to enable the cable cards and to get the few additional encrypted HD channels that I'm unable to get with a QAM tuner) and not "HD 'service'", that would be great.

Is there any prayer of a chance that Sunnyvale will get more than ESPN-HD and DISC-HD? Last time I looked, ESPN-HD wasn't even encrypted; even if it's not, I don't watch enough sports to be worth $9.95/month (meaning Comcast is getting $9.95/month from me to essentially just map the cable card channels to my TiVo's program guide, and to get DISC-HD?). :mad:

You should be able to get Limited Basic + Digital Classic + the 2 CCs. You also shouldn't need to get/pay for, any "HDTV service" if the above is all you want.

As far as Digital Classic only having 2 HD channels, well, that's Comcast sticking it to their 550MHz system customers. Other subs in other areas get over twice as many HD channels for that same $9.95, you'll have to ask Comcast why that is.

Hope I didn't miss any questions directed at me. :p

If so, ask again, and I shall answer. :D

[QUOTE=keenan]This is a copy of the price list that every cable company is required to provide every year to it's subs. It's a year old and might be a little hard to read, but the prices haven't changed much, if at all.

s one is from the handout you can get at the Comcast office.

QUOTE]


Thanks!
I'm slow and just "heard" about Dish. I looked in this forum for a thread on Dish Network in our area but didn't see it. is there one i missed?

I really hate to have to go with Comcast for the HD since they make it so confusing. Direct TV seems so much more straightforward with their channel line up and pricing tho lots fewer HD stations and big start up $ costs. I do get really good OTA, tho! I just wanted a few more channels, and to be able to Tivo/record the HD shows i watch. And get NBC and ESPN.

wendek

[QUOTE=keenan]This is a copy of the price list that every cable company is required to provide every year to it's subs. It's a year old and might be a little hard to read, but the prices haven't changed much, if at all.

s one is from the handout you can get at the Comcast office.

QUOTE]


Thanks!
I'm slow and just "heard" about Dish. I looked in this forum for a thread on Dish Network in our area but didn't see it. is there one i missed?

I really hate to have to go with Comcast for the HD since they make it so confusing. Direct TV seems so much more straightforward with their channel line up and pricing tho lots fewer HD stations and big start up $ costs. I do get really good OTA, tho! I just wanted a few more channels, and to be able to Tivo/record the HD shows i watch. And get NBC and ESPN.

wendek

Try the thread below,

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8410571#post8410571
San Francisco, CA - DBS - AVS Forum

A much more active and up to date area would be DBSTalk at the below link,

http://www.dbstalk.com/index.php?
DBSTalk.Com - Your one stop place for Satellite News, Talk & Information!

and then theres SatGuys, which is probably the largest Dish forum around,

http://www.satelliteguys.us/forumdisplay.php?f=10
The Dish Network Forum - SatelliteGuys.US

Re: TiVo S3 and storage space. Weaknees has successfully upgraded an S3 to 750GB already. Let's see, that about 6 times the size of the 6412..?? :p :)

http://www.wkblog.com/2006/09/early_news_on_the_series_3_upg.html
WeaKnees Blog: Early News on the Series 3 Upgrades

With QAM & ATSC tuners in the TV, i get the regulars in fuzzy analog 2-65 (or so), and in digital up to about 120.1 or so, ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, UPN-WB, KQED=5 stations, the Travel Channel, Animal Planet, ESPNHD (monday night football!) fuzzy Hallmark, fuzzy SciFi, The Country Music stations, OLN, Golf, the shopping channels, about 20 radio/music stations, the extra ABC & NBC stations

FREE CABLE TV BY BUYING HSI?

Anyone else doing this? It sounds like you don't even need Basic Cable or Digital Classic to get stations if you buy the internet service???

That list sure sounds a lot like what I am pulling off the cable direct to QAM right now. Only difference is most of my channels do not move around much (other than the head-end monkeying a few months back)...

Anyone else?

FREE CABLE TV BY BUYING HSI?

Anyone else doing this? It sounds like you don't even need Basic Cable or Digital Classic to get stations if you buy the internet service???

That list sure sounds a lot like what I am pulling off the cable direct to QAM right now. Only difference is most of my channels do not move around much (other than the head-end monkeying a few months back)...

Anyone else?

well, i've had the cable internet for a couple years now and only recent took the time to plug into the new HD TV. there wasn't a big need since i get better signal for the analog stations via rabbit ears. Except NBC, never got it. But now that i want to see the games and maybe a few mickeymouse cartoons, then it looks like i'll have to spend a little more money.

The HSI is $56+ and if i get cable tv then it drops to $42+. They must have figured in the extra tv stations i'd get in case i tried the tv.

wendek

No you can't get "free" cable TV. They will put a trap on the line that filters out most channels. At best you'll get 72-83 or so, that's about what I got. I actually did this for couple of months, trying to save some money... unfortunately they also charge you about $16 MORE per month for having HSI without CATV, so it doesn't really make economic sense either...

unfortunately they also charge you about $16 MORE per month for having HSI without CATV, so it doesn't really make economic sense either...

Really?? My discount is only $5 ($44 compared to $49). Or did the raise the rates recently?

You should be able to get Limited Basic + Digital Classic + the 2 CCs. You also shouldn't need to get/pay for, any "HDTV service" if the above is all you want.
Well, that is the cheapest way to get two cable cards and the local (network) HD channels, but that drops the expanded-basic (analog) channels that I said I don't wish to drop. (What good is TV without Jon Stewart? ;) )

So, I signed up to add "Digital Classic" to my expanded-basic cable. As others have noted, that gets me my two FREE cable cards, and a program guide that matches my channels, and perhaps (?) some digital versions of SD channels (true?)

As far as Digital Classic only having 2 HD channels, well, that's Comcast sticking it to their 550MHz system customers. Other subs in other areas get over twice as many HD channels for that same $9.95, you'll have to ask Comcast why that is.
Yeah, that part stinks. Is this (550) the same reason we don't have digital phone service? I don't care to have it, but it would seem that if they ever want to provide it (the whole "triple play" billboard thing) then they'll have to upgrade the system some day... (I know, it could be a while. Fortunately we don't watch that much TV; we just can't stand to watch live TV at ALL without TiVo.)

Thanks!
I'm slow and just "heard" about Dish. I looked in this forum for a thread on Dish Network in our area but didn't see it. is there one i missed?

I really hate to have to go with Comcast for the HD since they make it so confusing. Direct TV seems so much more straightforward with their channel line up and pricing tho lots fewer HD stations and big start up $ costs. I do get really good OTA, tho! I just wanted a few more channels, and to be able to Tivo/record the HD shows i watch. And get NBC and ESPN.

wendek

Be sure you read up on DishNetwork (also referred to as Echostar or E*) with the links Keenan sent and www.dishnetwork.com

much more HD, a better DVR and comparable prices.

Well, that is the cheapest way to get two cable cards and the local (network) HD channels, but that drops the expanded-basic (analog) channels that I said I don't wish to drop. (What good is TV without Jon Stewart? ;) )

So, I signed up to add "Digital Classic" to my expanded-basic cable. As others have noted, that gets me my two FREE cable cards, and a program guide that matches my channels, and perhaps (?) some digital versions of SD channels (true?)


Yeah, that part stinks. Is this (550) the same reason we don't have digital phone service? I don't care to have it, but it would seem that if they ever want to provide it (the whole "triple play" billboard thing) then they'll have to upgrade the system some day... (I know, it could be a while. Fortunately we don't watch that much TV; we just can't stand to watch live TV at ALL without TiVo.)
So you have Standard Cable + Digital Classic and two CCs with no charge for the CCs? How did that work out? Did you have to go the "one digital device/outlet" route?

I just called Comcast to schedule the CC install and they wanted $11.95 a piece. :eek:

I told him that was wrong and he went on this spiel about how the cards each have an "HD" service charge of $5 as the cards were for HD. I explained that's basically BS and asked to speak with the supervisor. He comes back and says the cards would only be $6.95 a piece which is what it should as I will still have the DVR initially. But, once I turn the DVR back in I will only be using the S3, a single input/output digital connection, so I'm curious how that will play out, and why I'm curious about your "free" CCs.

No you can't get "free" cable TV. They will put a trap on the line that filters out most channels. At best you'll get 72-83 or so, that's about what I got. I actually did this for couple of months, trying to save some money... unfortunately they also charge you about $16 MORE per month for having HSI without CATV, so it doesn't really make economic sense either...


true. But i really only needed a good HSI and since i already got really great OTA including all the local HD channels, i figured $15 was cheaper than the $70+ they quoted me.
but it sounds like i can go with a cheaper group of packages and still get what i want, maybe. I don't need HBO, etc.

I thought the below from KQED would be of interest. Does Comcast give KQED a full 19MB for it's 9.1 HD channel?


HD
From: Red Dana, KQED TV9-DT9 Viewer Services
To update or unsubscribe: Do NOT reply to this address. Please carefully follow the specific instructions at the bottom of this note.
For any other feedback: <dtv@kqed.org>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I thought you might find one or more of the following programs interesting, airing September 16-23 on KQED HD (DT9.1 / Comcast 709). This includes the HD debut of one of KQED's locally produced series, "Check, Please! Bay Area", as well as the premiere of the next edition of KQED's latest National HD production, "Jean-Michel Cousteau: Ocean Adventures".

Please note that as of September 20th, the schedules for both KQED HD (DT9.1 / Comcast 709) and KQED Life (DT9.4 / Comcast 191) will change, and will no longer be in sync. OTA transmission has a physical limit, as set by the FCC. We can only transmit 6MHz, which handles about 19.3Mb of data. The fiber feed to Comcast is about twice as large, and will handle up to apx 35Mb of data, allowing us to take advantage of our full capabilities.

For Over the Air transmission, KQED HD will increase its broadcast day by 3 hours, and DT9.1 will sign on at 5pm (rather than 8pm). Correspondingly, KQED Life (DT9.4) will be signing off at 5pm. On Comcast Cable, both KQED HD (Comcast 709) and KQED Life (Comcast 191) will expand to a 24/7 schedule.

With the increase in HD broadcasting as of September 20th, we have much more programming available for your enjoyment, whichever way you receive your signal. As a result, I'll be changing this alert over to a weekly rundown of programming, in an effort to keep it from becoming too unwieldy while I wait for the web folks to help with a redesign, and a web-based presentation of all this info.

Enjoy!

Red Dana
Manager, Viewer Services - KQED TV9 & DT9
TV "Got a Question?" Area: < http://www.kqed.org/help/tv/tv-faq.jsp>