San Francisco, CA - Comcast [Text View] - Page 53

walk

10-05-06, 05:52 PM

RE: Fox dropping off your QAM during primetime - seen this before, try a rescan, or turn the TV off then back on AFTER they switch to the FOX HD feed. Something about the switch causes your TV to "forget" about that channel (no clue what or why, I don't have a QAM, just read about it here).

Re: that NFL map - well what did you expect, this is 49ers/Raiders country, of course they are going to show that game. Why parts of AZ isn't seeing it.... well heh that IS funny.
I don't care to see the McNabb vs TO Battle-of-the-Mouths game myself personally...

Re: 720 and 725, yeah but they are only on-air very rarely. (VERY rarely in the case of 725, often the guide will show something on but it will still just be the title card..) I don't think I'd count them as "half a channel". FWIW... More like 10% of a channel.

Re: overscanning the ABC logo - it's a good thing isn't it? :) Yes I have a RP-TV (projection CRT) and it has quite a bit of overscan. Sometimes during some of the INHD sports broadcasts the scoreboard thing is on the verge of being cut off. I'm sure they are just pushing things a little too close (or past) the title-safe area.

lolento

10-05-06, 06:23 PM

Bill

10-05-06, 06:55 PM

hermangerman

10-05-06, 07:15 PM

Here's my suggestion- get Dish with a VIP-622 DVR!

OK - I need KQED HD - looks like I can only get that over the air with DISH. Does anybody know if that is reasonable in Sunnyvale?

sfhub

10-05-06, 08:17 PM

Comcast has been out 5 times attempting fix my HD breakup. Signal strength and AGC are good. I even hooked up the box (6200) and a small television outside to prove that the problem was not in my house. Much worse at night.
Diagnostic screen show huge numbers of errors. Channels 707 and 709 (at 117 MHz) are usually OK.
Anybody else have this problem? Any suggestions for Comcast? Thanks.
I don't know if I had your problem, but I had those symptoms before. It took Comcast a long time and a lot of fingerpointing to figure out the problem. They went through the standard explanations of signal too weak, signal too strong, RFI, etc. etc. each of which was disproved. I had to bring my STB to the truck outside, because only certain trucks have the appropriate test equipment, to prove it wasn't inside wiring problem.

It turned out there was a diagnostic signal that was being sent out. It was supposed to be offset but someone misconfigured and it ended up overlapping one of the frequencies that was carrying HD. The net result was every few seconds I would get bursts of errors. The diagnostic screen went to something like 400-1000 errors in the sampling period. This only happened on FOX and CBS which share the same channel in my area.

hermangerman

10-05-06, 08:38 PM

I don't know if I had your problem, but I had those symptoms before. It took Comcast a long time and a lot of fingerpointing to figure out the problem. They went through the standard explanations of signal too weak, signal too strong, RFI, etc. etc. each of which was disproved. I had to bring my STB to the truck outside, because only certain trucks have the appropriate test equipment, to prove it wasn't inside wiring problem.

It turned out there was a diagnostic signal that was being sent out. It was supposed to be offset but someone misconfigured and it ended up overlapping one of the frequencies that was carrying HD. The net result was every few seconds I would get bursts of errors. The diagnostic screen went to something like 400-1000 errors in the sampling period. This only happened on FOX and CBS which share the same channel in my area.

Interesting. When the breakup is bad, I get as many as 80,000 correctable and many uncorrectable errors per sampling period. In my case, the problem occurs on ALL HD channels except 707 and 709. According to the diagnostic screen, these two are the only HD channels located at a relatively low frequency. RFI seems likely; Any idea how Comcast would find it if it mostly happens at night?

mterzich

10-05-06, 08:48 PM

Interesting. When the breakup is bad, I get as many as 80,000 correctable and many uncorrectable errors per sampling period. In my case, the problem occurs on ALL HD channels except 707 and 709. According to the diagnostic screen, these two are the only HD channels located at a relatively low frequency. RFI seems likely; Any idea how Comcast would find it if it mostly happens at night?
Does anyone else on your street have similar problems? If they do, the problem sounds like an intermittent cable system amplifier. Cable system amplifiers are placed approximately every 250-400 meters along the cable to reamplify the signal.

RBurks

10-05-06, 10:09 PM

On my 750 MHz cable system in Fremont, KQED HD is on 117.2, KQED Encore is 117.3, and I am not sure what is one 117.4, 1175, and 117.6 and none of them are PSIPed.

Do you know what size of a cable system is in San Carlos?

I am in an 860MHz area. I know the head end manager of our area has dinked with the PSIP's over the last few months, as HD channels will disappear for a few weeks, then suddenly reappear. And of course COMCAST just says HUH?

I will definitely try keying in 117 and 117.1 - 117.x to see what is there. Unfortunately I am in DC right now so will have to wait until Sunday.

But thanks to all as we try to work out the COMCAST secret codes with our secret decoder rings ;)

davisdog

10-05-06, 11:21 PM

Here's my suggestion- get Dish with a VIP-622 DVR!

That maybe too much for some people ...switching from 120Gb HD to 300Gb+...
and from a dozen HD channels to 30 or so...

:D

emiburke

10-06-06, 12:14 AM

KQED-HD is not "on" 9.1. OTA, it's on rf 30 subchannel 1 and on our 860-MHz cable it's on rf 117 subchannel 2. In both cases, it's supposed to have a PSIP data stream that identifies it as virtual channel "9.1". That PSIP is what's now missing on the cable. However, the HD streams from KGO (7.x) that KQED-HD and ENCORE share rf117 with do still have their PSIP data and I suspect that's what's messing up your tuner--i.e., it doesn't recognize PSIP-less subchannels mixed in with those having a proper PSIP.

My guess is that Comcast hasn't figured out how to split the PSIP properly, now that they're carrying WORLD, LIFE, and KIDS on a difffernt channel (or not at all), so they're not sending any PSIP for the KQED subs.

I also just noticed I am missing KQED-HD on my DVICO Fusion 5 USB tuner when I scan. I checked my other TV's and in my area, KQED-HD still shows up as 111.4 on my Sharp LCD TV qam tuner, but I don't see how I can manually dial this subchannel in on the Fusion tuner, do you know if there is any way to do this? The KGO channels are on 111.1, 111.2 and 111.3

avekevin

10-06-06, 12:27 AM

Anyone know where I can find KQED-HD in Santa Rosa (550Mhz)? I found the KQED SD channels on 20-13,14,15 but I never did find the HD channel.

Thanks!

Kevin

gaderson

10-06-06, 12:32 AM

That doesn't seem to accomplish very much since they would be prempting CW network HD series programs. Then how do people that want to watch the CW shows get to see them?

Umm, go back and read again. KICU is not KBCW, so the CW is fine, KICU is an independent that must be owned by KTVU, hence the 'sidecasts'. Can't they just put the game on 2-2 and give 2-1 to those of us who care little for baseball?

So KICU has a digital broadcast... do they really broadcast HD? If so, isn't Comcast obligated (FCC-wise) to carry it? Or are VHF stations the only ones that qualify for mandatory rebroadcast?

Sorry, just wishful thinking, as my recordings of Prison Break were not in HD, though they were digital. I though I had see House or something on them earlier in the year, but, must have been mistaken.

mterzich

10-06-06, 01:22 AM

Umm, go back and read again. KICU is not KBCW, so the CW is fine, KICU is an independent that must be owned by KTVU, hence the 'sidecasts'.
I got channel 36.1 (KICU-DT) mixed up with channel 20.1 (KBWB-DT). That is how little that I watch SD or OTA HD anymore. However, it appear that channel 20.1 is back to being an independent and no longer has any HD anyway.

keenan

10-06-06, 02:39 AM

Anyone know where I can find KQED-HD in Santa Rosa (550Mhz)? I found the KQED SD channels on 20-13,14,15 but I never did find the HD channel.

Thanks!

Kevin
All my equipment remaps KQED to the PSIP channel number, but it's in the 483MHz slot along with KGO.

cgould

10-06-06, 12:45 PM

I got my Tivo S3 CableCard install on 9/27 finally, and turned in my 6412 this week...
got the final bill just now, it's pretty confusing/disappointing.
Can anyone else confirm similar?

1. The cable cards ARE free, as they said. The truck roll cost $15.99, as they said.
BUT

They insist on still charging $6.95 "addnl digital outlet" fee for the 2nd card, even though it's in the same device, and I have Digital Classic (that covers only the first card.) This seems pervasive on online reports so far, something about the billing/service order system being incapable of considering 2 cards in one device (and if you tell them to remove the charge, sometimes it disables the 2nd card.)
Will try to fight this but unknown if can get it fixed soon.

They also charged $13.99 "reconnect addnl digital outlet" install fee, I guess for the 2nd card, or maybe because I still had the 6412? I'll be fighting this... :confused:

Wierder but: there is also a $1.50 "Tivo Digital Access" monthly fee. I have no idea WTF this is. Maybe they are confused and this is the coming charge to have Tivo software on the 6412? Or they're trying to stick it to S3 customers?
I'll try to fight this/get clarity on what it is, but... :mad:

so far this means w/ $6.95 AO fee and 1.50 tivo fee, it's $8.45/mo to have the S3, which compares poorly to 9.95 6412 DVR fee :mad:
(but at least I have twice the storage, better picture, and no remote lag / hangs crap.)

raghu1111

10-06-06, 02:00 PM

[ regd missing KQED in QAM ...] 561MHz should be channel 80.x

I scanned twice again and my TV did not see any channels at 80.x.

I had this question for a while: Is it possible for 6200/6412 to show channels that seem to be missing in othe QAM tuners? I wonder what causes this. one possibility is that signal is weak but 6200 (cableCARDS also?) has a mapping from 709 to 561MHz, so that it does not need to scan.

TPeterson

10-06-06, 02:23 PM

The most likely reasons for your QAM tuner not to show all of the channels that the 6200/6412 does are mainly that the tuner may not be able to correctly decode the subchannel mapping (PMT/PAT) from Comcast or that the channel is actually encrypted. I don't believe that there's a big difference in sensitivity between the two. Can you dial in channel 80 on your tuner? If so, does it indicate any signal strength there, even with a dark picture?

keenan

10-06-06, 03:33 PM

Wierder but: there is also a $1.50 "Tivo Digital Access" monthly fee. I have no idea WTF this is. Maybe they are confused and this is the coming charge to have Tivo software on the 6412? Or they're trying to stick it to S3 customers?
I'll try to fight this/get clarity on what it is, but... :mad:

so far this means w/ $6.95 AO fee and 1.50 tivo fee, it's $8.45/mo to have the S3, which compares poorly to 9.95 6412 DVR fee :mad:
(but at least I have twice the storage, better picture, and no remote lag / hangs crap.)
The $1.50 is supposed to be the charge for the second card with the first one "free" from what I've been reading in Comcast areas including the SF bay area. The problem was they couldn't figure out how to bill it. It sounds like your bill is showing both the old billing and the new billing methods.

I haven't turned my 6412 in yet, but when I do I'm expecting the $1.50 charge will be standardized, hopefully.

Bill

10-06-06, 06:30 PM

OK - I need KQED HD - looks like I can only get that over the air with DISH. Does anybody know if that is reasonable in Sunnyvale?
You can get all the HD OTA channels, including KQED, (not to mention all DTV channels) with the VIP-622 and you can record them all with it. You can have them install an OTA antennae when they install the Dish. They have a great new subscriber deal going right now.

fender4645

10-06-06, 06:50 PM

I say we just all go over to Bill's house whenever we want to watch something that Comcast doesn't offer. It'll save us all money and we can listen his rah rah Dish speech in person.

sfhub

10-06-06, 07:37 PM

the tuner may not be able to correctly decode the subchannel mapping (PMT/PAT) from Comcast
That's my vote.

+ your earlier theory of the problem being related to .2-.x subchannels having PSIP but .1 channel not having PSIP, or .1 being on different RF than .2-.x

Those are probably situations that may not have gotten full testing.

I know my area has no problems with KQED-HD, but we also haven't had any PSIP for KQED for a long time.

PerkyNot

10-07-06, 12:38 AM

mterzich

10-07-06, 12:55 AM

Don't know if anyone was watching the Tigers/Yankees game on ESPN HD tonight but I had some problems. I lost audio about 3 times during the game and totally lost the channel once. When I checked the Info button the Dolby 5.1 symbol was not there. Swapped channels sound returned and Dolby 5.1 returned. Changed channels another time sound returned and Dolby 5.1 returned. I have had this same problem recently but I don't remember if it was ESPN HD or another HD channel. I have a 6412 III and connected to the TV w/HDMI. Can't tell if this is the network or my equipment. Any ideas would be appreciated.

John
Don't think if that was an ESPN problem. At the same time I tried to change channels and the usual slow response occured but this time when it hit the channel, no sound ever occured. I tried muting and unmuting but that didn't help. Finally everything was stuck so I tried to power down. That took several minutes and when I tried to power back on, the LED on the DRV kept switching back and forth displaying the time and than channel every other second. Finally I pulled the plug to solve the problem.

Something must be going on at the same time in the whole bay area and not just on one cable system.

walk

10-07-06, 02:17 PM

I saw a couple of glitches on ESPN during the game also. It really stood out since that is one channel which is usually 100% rock solid. Nothing bad though, just minor <1 sec. dropouts.

mterzich

10-07-06, 02:50 PM

While I was surfing other threads, I noticed that people were complaining about the PQ on ESPN HD has degraded very badly over the past year yet I have not noticed that on my TV.

They had comments about a recent game on ESPN HD that it was horrible, grass was alive, and long views had a terrible PQ yet I didn't see any of that on my TV.

I noticed that the people complaining were all on the east coast using Comcast or DirecTV. Does anyone on the SF Bay Area Comcast see the problems with ESPN HD?

Is it possible that not all providers are getting the feed from Galaxy 10?

http://www.lyngsat.com/g10r.html

dcci

10-07-06, 03:01 PM

[QUOTE=cgould]I got my Tivo S3 CableCard install on 9/27 finally, and turned in my 6412 this week...[/QUOTE

Could you give us some more info on your experience (apart from their creative accounting!) w/the Tivo S3 w/CableCards from Comcast:

1) Was Comcast responsive in terms of getting the CableCards installed?

2) How's the TiVo program guide in terms of accuracy?

3) Does the TiVo in fact fix the lagging/freezing tuner problems of the 6412? Is channel changing fast?

Any other info would be appreciated!

TPeterson

10-07-06, 03:06 PM

Yes, I noticed the "alive grass" and in pans during MNF as well as on KNTV's Sunday night games of late. The macroblocking on the red wall at the Cowboys stadium was particularly annoying.

mterzich

10-07-06, 03:21 PM

The game they were talking about was a college football game on Wednesday night. The way they were complaining it was almost as if it was totally unwatchable. Suprising that I didn't notice any of the problems since I have a Sharp 45" 1080p HDTV and sit about 6' away. Maybe my eyesite is going bad.

Except for that game, I usually don't look for problems and try to enjoy the game so I could be missing some of the problems. However, I think I know what horrible is and that is usually something that is impossible to ignore.

SVcabron

10-07-06, 03:39 PM

Do you still get the free showtime preview this weekend, even though you have a cable card?

mterzich

10-07-06, 03:58 PM

Is it possible that some people are more sensitive to artifacts than other people. Similar in a way that some people are extremely sensitive to motion blur on even the fastest LCD while others don't have a problem at all?

Is it possible also that some HDTV may present things such as alive grass as motion blur? Maybe this could one possible answer since I have a LCD (and I don't believe I ever saw alive grass) and maybe it is bluring the image which is expected instead of making it look like the grass is alive.

As far bright colors (especially reds which I expect is well perceived by the human eye) when it macroblocks, that is very obvious on LCDs. Other things that are very obvious to me is when there are closeups of players running and macroblocking occurs. Strobe lights during dancing and lightening during a downpour during a fight scene also produces very noticable macroblocking.

cgould

10-07-06, 07:57 PM

I got my Tivo S3 CableCard install on 9/27 finally, and turned in my 6412 this week...

Could you give us some more info on your experience (apart from their creative accounting!) w/the Tivo S3 w/CableCards from Comcast:

1) Was Comcast responsive in terms of getting the CableCards installed?

Yes- when I called to schedule originally (a week before?), the guy asked immediately if it was for a Tivo, and I said yes, and he had confirmed the (expected) $15.99/free card prices (plus $6.95 outlet charge as long as I kept the 6412 dvr).

The tech was a comcast guy, not contractor, he'd already done several Tivos before, even had the same printout from Tivo's box how to install CCards... he'd been handing them out to other techs. He brought 4 cards in case. Both worked fine so far. He only had to call in w/ the serial #s, not host/id pairing. I helped him a bit w/ the Tivo interface, but he sat thru and we did full channel test.
The office staff was a bit reluctant to do the CCard tivo setup/hit, but my tech persisted and found someone.

2) How's the TiVo program guide in terms of accuracy?

Very good so far, as usual for Tivo. I haven't tried/noticed any "complex" stuff like last minute changing, but the "Tivo Central Online" remote web scheduling (now that my S3 is on broadband network) was very handy to quickly search & reschedule all my Season Passes , from the PC, rather than laboriously type in or find on the TV screen.

Only glitch seen so far is KQED-DT still showing "SIGN OFF" during the morning (6a-5p), even though now it's switched to 24hrs. I had to do a few manual recordings to get some stuff.

Also it has FSBAHD channel ID right, but it shows the INHD2 schedule/ programming listing still. I can't tell therefore if it will update to show "preempt" FSBAHD "real" programs or not. It does list TNTHD and NFLHD programs correctly.
I sent Tivo a correction note for the above 2 items.
Would still be much nicer if Comcast left us INHD2, instead of a stupid Rainbow screensaver, and pre-empt it for FSABHD stuff... (and have those in the schedule, noted.)

) Does the TiVo in fact fix the lagging/freezing tuner problems of the 6412?
Yes!! :D No problems w/ remote stuff or ffwd/rvs etc even while recording 2 HD and playing another. Some people reported remote delays/problems, apparently may be something about plasma displays giving off IR noise that blocks out the Tivo from reading the remote.
I also have my Harmony 880 set up for the S3, was straight off the website, no tweaks works fine.

So far the S3 has been rock stable for me. Nice.
My 6412 died the week before S3 came out which was all the nudge I needed...

Is channel changing fast?
Pretty much- for some reason analog is a bit slow, maybe 1-1.5sec delay, unlike my Sony SV2000... not sure if something w/ the multiple tuners setup. Was the same with and without cablecard. Not as fast as the 6412, but not too annoying.

So far, I like it - nice to have all my shows in one place, rather than switching between old Tivo and the 6412...
VERY nice to have 250gb, although I'm already getting close to full :) too much DiscoveryHD eye candy to catch up on...

Nice that it switches some key settings w/o needing power reset, eg the CC captioning w/ a few presses, TV aspect ratio (full/zoom/expand etc.), can go into settings to change display format (1080i mix, 720p, native etc.)... can show full channel/tuner diagnostics in a menu also, w/o having to reboot/lose channels.
That was a REAL pain from the 6412!

Also, having dual composite output for A/V means I can run SVideo/stereo to my DVD recorder for archiving (and now, I can also set the aspect ratio/letterboxing correctly, unlike crappy 6412), but still have analog stereo to run to the TV... so I don't have to ALWAYS turn on my A/V receiver for HD audio.

The S3 remote is programmable to control the TV or AV volume/mute/input switch, which is nice, although it's only set for one at a time. Harmony remote is nice for that.

The picture quality seems nicer, although hard to compare HD... I'm using component, can't compare HDMI.
The analog seems very good, maybe better than my Sony Tivo, and I significantly better than the 6412... (right now my S3 is set for 1080i hybrid, which means SD is upconverted to 480p).

Interestingly, the digital SD channels seem MUCH nicer/clearer on the Tivo than the 6412- I hated the mpg mosquito noise and low sharpness of the 6412, now it seems much nicer... not sure why? Maybe Comcast tweaked the bitrates and I never noticed? In any case, I'm happy recording digitals now, although I don't care/need ADS simulcast since my analog is so clean... but nice to get Digital Classic SD extra channels nicely now.

It is a bit of a big bite at $800-1000 to buy this puppy, rather than just lease the 6412 for $10/mo... but I think it's worth it so far, if only for the same/nice interface and reliable features, extra space, and no damn remote lag/hangs :)

sfhub

10-07-06, 10:15 PM

Pretty much- for some reason analog is a bit slow, maybe 1-1.5sec delay, unlike my Sony SV2000... not sure if something w/ the multiple tuners setup. Was the same with and without cablecard. Not as fast as the 6412, but not too annoying.
Historically analog channels were slower on PVRs because the design has them going through real-time mpg encoding followed by mpg decoding, while digital channels just go through mpg decoding.

nikeykid

10-07-06, 11:16 PM

yay nice to see berkeley highlighted in abc's snf. great win for the bears!! great shots of campus and the city. there's another one later in this year against ucla. we look good :)

millerwill

10-07-06, 11:22 PM

yay nice to see berkeley highlighted in abc's snf. great win for the bears!! great shots of campus and the city. there's another one later in this year against ucla. we look good :)

Yes, some really great shots. And the Bay Area did pretty well in Nobel Prizes this pas week, too.

fender4645

10-08-06, 01:56 PM

It's bad enough that we have to watch pretty much the worst 10:00am game but with all the break-ups/lack of HD on FOX, that just takes the cake.

lolento

10-08-06, 02:28 PM

Is there a reason why comcast's KTVUHD is broadcasting the game in SD while OTA KTVU-DT is in HD?

keenan

10-08-06, 02:33 PM

I just checked up here and it's HD.

keenan

10-08-06, 02:39 PM

It's bad enough that we have to watch pretty much the worst 10:00am game but with all the break-ups/lack of HD on FOX, that just takes the cake.
The breakups might be due to the time of year. This is when the sun is directly behind/inline with a lot of the sats carrying these signals.

TPeterson

10-08-06, 02:40 PM

Is there a reason why comcast's KTVUHD is broadcasting the game in SD while OTA KTVU-DT is in HD?I just checked up here and it's HD.Here too.

keenan

10-08-06, 02:49 PM

You want to see a horrible HD picture, check out the NASCAR race on KNTV, whoa, artifacting city. :p :D

lolento

10-08-06, 02:59 PM

Here too.

Are you guys using Comcast's box? I'm using my TV's internal QAM tuner....

mterzich

10-08-06, 03:10 PM

Are you guys using Comcast's box? I'm using my TV's internal QAM tuner....
I checked with the builtin QAM tuner as well as the Comcast DVR and both show HD on KTVU-DT.

TPeterson

10-08-06, 03:13 PM

I'm using MyHD MDP-130 tuner.

fender4645

10-08-06, 03:19 PM

For the first 10 minutes or so of Q2, there were a bunch of breakups and eventually the source turned to SD. It eventually went back to normal right before the half. All is good now.

mterzich

10-08-06, 03:19 PM

keenan

10-08-06, 03:41 PM

Maybe the System Administrator reorganized your cable system recently and moved channels around causing you to pick up the SD channel at 2.1 instead of the HD channel. Rescan to see if that solves the problem. Or he could have possibly accidently used the SD stream for the HD channel and the HD channel does not currently exist on your system.
No, it was due to sun interference issues, FOX network advised their stations they would switch to the SD feed during the 10-20 where the sun would be right behind the feed satellite.

rfb2000

10-08-06, 04:21 PM

I thought all the NFL games were supposed to be in HD this year?

ptysell

10-08-06, 04:24 PM

same here, i guess concast screws us again.

What i dont understand is why they still have KRON in HD. Dump KRON they have NO programming. Put in KICU for next years baseball games.

fender4645

10-08-06, 04:26 PM

same here, i guess concast screws us again.

What i dont understand is why they still have KRON in HD. Dump KRON they have NO programming. Put in KICU for next years baseball games.

Has nothing to do with Comcast. CBS only broadcasts (I think) 3 HD games a week. And I hardly think this game is HD-worthy from a national perspective.

ptysell

10-08-06, 04:28 PM

This is why I wish the FCC would just stick to their guns and stop pushing back the digital deal line.

rfb2000

10-08-06, 04:31 PM

Football in SD is so bad - almost unbearable to watch, and I want to watch this game.

keenan

10-08-06, 04:31 PM

Has nothing to do with Comcast. CBS only broadcasts (I think) 3 HD games a week. And I hardly think this game is HD-worthy from a national perspective.
Correct, 6 from FOX and 3 from CBS, and sometimes there's less.

Today's HD games,

FOX Games

1pm
St. Louis Rams at Green Bay Packers
Detroit Lions at Minnesota Vikings
Tampa Bay Buccaneers at New Orleans Saints
Washington Redskins at New York Giants

4pm
Dallas Cowboys at Philadelphia Eagles

CBS Games

1pm
Buffalo Bills @ Chicago Bears
Miami Dolphins @ New England Patriots

4pm
New York Jets @ Jacksonville Jaguars

nikeykid

10-08-06, 04:44 PM

same here, i guess concast screws us again.

What i dont understand is why they still have KRON in HD. Dump KRON they have NO programming. Put in KICU for next years baseball games.

to beat a dead horse, comcast is not the root of all evils. if they carry an HD channel, they pass it along as it comes off the networks. sorry, cbs is at fault, only 3 hd games a week.

kron shows mynetworkTV now. kicu has to start producing HD programming first. comcast can't carry an HD channel if there is no HD programming to begin with.

nikeykid

10-08-06, 04:44 PM

Football in SD is so bad - almost unbearable to watch, and I want to watch this game.

but you alone can't make CBS use one of their precious 3 games / week quota on the niners raiders game.

nikeykid

10-08-06, 04:47 PM

This is why I wish the FCC would just stick to their guns and stop pushing back the digital deal line.

what is wrong with people's preconceived notions? digital deadline means over the air has to be sent in bytes... 1s and 0s. that's all it means, there is no requirement that those 1s and 0s turn into a hidef picture.

now, HD makes it more attractive for the joe 6 pack to get a digital tv/STB, but the FCC could care less why j6p switches but just that they do switch.

wco81

10-08-06, 05:14 PM

So if the Raiders-49ers game isn't in HD, then the Direct TV LA feed wouldn't matter.

But looks like D* is blocking it during the game?

keenan

10-08-06, 06:54 PM

So if the Raiders-49ers game isn't in HD, then the Direct TV LA feed wouldn't matter.

But looks like D* is blocking it during the game?
Blocking it? KCBS-LA is showing the Raiders/49ers game on ch 81.

Good Dallas/Philly game on ch 725 though. :D

wco81

10-08-06, 07:16 PM

They had some sign apologizing for the channel being offline.

I figured it was them blocking it but must have been temporary.

jondoms

10-08-06, 11:01 PM

Pittsburgh San Diego in HD tonight.
Some blocking but looks good!

Go Bolts!

Anyone know what the raw channel numbers are for Hayward QAM only no STB?

Thanks

RBurks

10-09-06, 09:56 AM

Well my area hasn't had 9.1 at all for the last 11 months, but we have had KQED-HD that entire time at 117.2

When Terry says 117, I'm sure he means 117.x. 117 is just shorthand. There aren't any analog channels up that high so there is no ambiguity.

So regardless of what your scan says, what happens when you press 117.2 on the remote to manually select that channel? How about 117.1?.

OK I fat fingered in 117.1 and WALAAA there is KQED-HD.

What is interesting is my SONY SXRD QAM tuner is not seeing ANY 117.x channels. What is more odd is it is the only channel number w/o a ".x" sublist. There are empty ".x" from 99 to 120 (of course some are used), but 117 shows up as analog only (but hidden - no signal) and nothing for 117.x

Wonder why?

TPeterson

10-09-06, 11:05 AM

It's really no wonder at all. The PSIP data for KQED's subs are AWOL, while the KGO data are there, and your Sony doesn't know what to make of the messy data stream on channel 117.

nikeykid

10-09-06, 12:20 PM

fender4645

10-09-06, 12:29 PM

There's a rumor on the programming forum ("HD news" thread) that ktvu's news studios is about to go HD. there is equipment reportedly ordered.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8609179&&#post8609179

While I'll never say "no" to HD, I'm not that hyped on HD local news. I would much rather have the 1 1/2 buffer time and SD picture then 15 minutes of buffer and an HD picture. That's just me though and the way I watch the news: pause it, wait, and FF to the good parts.

I also noticed KABC/KGO were in the press release...

TPeterson

10-09-06, 01:04 PM

So, watch ch 2 then. ;)

fender4645

10-09-06, 01:08 PM

So, watch ch 2 then. ;)

And that's exactly what I'll do. :D

keenan

10-09-06, 02:19 PM

While I'll never say "no" to HD, I'm not that hyped on HD local news. I would much rather have the 1 1/2 buffer time and SD picture then 15 minutes of buffer and an HD picture. That's just me though and the way I watch the news: pause it, wait, and FF to the good parts.

I also noticed KABC/KGO were in the press release...
KABC is already doing their local newscast in HD and KGO is supposed to go HD fairly soon from what I understand.

ayewbf

10-09-06, 07:04 PM

Welcome to Comcastic Land!

I have never had a change to my account go the way I was originally told. I really had to think long and hard before getting the S3 because I knew it meant another trip to my local office to argue. At least they have a local office, unlike the sat providers, so you can go there and talk to a real person. I've had to deal with D* and E* about billing problems and it's maddening but the problems don't happen as much.

What I learned is that Comcast has codes they enter for each of the services so that their billing system will charge you correctly. But it seems the problem is that the wrong codes or wrong quantity of codes get entered by the CSR. On the subject of the $1.50/mo charge for S3 2nd cablecard, I saw the code in the memo I mentioned but didn't write it down.Yes comcastic indeed. I have to say I like my s3 a lot better than my directv hr10-250 however.
I waited, and my bill came with the wrong $6.95/mo. digital outlet charge instead of the $1.50/mo. charge. The bill actually specifically mentions this new $1.50 charge on the first page, but my account wasn't updated to the new billing code. Talked with customer service and they say it's fixed. The new billing code came available on 10/1 they say. Hopefully the fix will stick. Probably anyone who had an install before 10/1 will have to track this down themselves.

wish_i_had_hdtv

10-09-06, 07:50 PM

PerkyNot

10-09-06, 08:21 PM

wish_I_had_hdtv: re: Audio drop outs

I have been having the same problem. I am using the DCT6412 III w/HDMI. It just happen not more than 1/2 hour ago. This was on ESPN HD. It only seems to happened when there is a Comcast local ad on. I loose the Dolby 5.1 logo when I check the Info button. The only way to get the sound back for me is to change or swap channels. I believe it is a Comcast problem not your equipment. I believe saw the same complaint in this forum and DSL Reports Comcast. Maybe to get this resolved is to call Comcast which I have a couple times.

John

nikeykid

10-10-06, 12:16 AM

wow kntv's audio sucks... echo sounds on heros.

Derek87

10-10-06, 01:20 AM

tonight, there is no main audio track for Studio 60 on 703...fine on 3. sigh...

(ie, background music and background sound is there, but main dialog is not)

fender4645

10-10-06, 01:22 AM

That's just brilliant. I'm glad they got the commericals working fine though.

IndigoBlu

10-10-06, 01:23 AM

it's a shame, was looking forward to NBC's lineup tonight. however had to watch both heroes & studio 60 in sd, the audio is just terrible (and absent for studio 60)..

fender4645

10-10-06, 02:06 AM

Someone on another thread who's bio says he's from Alamo, CA said he picked up a 3416 at the local Comcast center. Maybe I'll try to go by at lunch tomorrow to see if they have any in stock.

keenan

10-10-06, 02:20 AM

it's a shame, was looking forward to NBC's lineup tonight. however had to watch both heroes & studio 60 in sd, the audio is just terrible (and absent for studio 60)..
Definitely a KNTV problem, audio was perfect for Heroes and Studio 60 from KNBC-LA.

It's a shame KNTV doesn't care about their digital signal enough to have at least one person paying attention to it to catch things when they go wrong.

OTOH, IIRC, KNTV is basically run from the LA network center during primetime, so it could very well have been the idiots down there although it's probably something to do with the new IRD KNTV just had installed.

So, bottom line, KNTV is the one at fault. :rolleyes:

Brian Conrad

10-10-06, 12:57 PM

It makes them look like they have rank amateurs running things (maybe they do). What I noticed was the audio switching on Heroes running most of the time like it was an ambient rear speaker feed then switch to normal then back again. So it sounded like someone was messing with it but they couldn't tell what they were doing as if they didn't have decent surround monitors (probably none at all and are just guessing off a stereo pair. I'd love to know what kind of gear they are running and see if I can download the manuals. Bet it is stuff that most folks here would figure out how to run in ten minutes.

greeno

10-10-06, 06:59 PM

walk

10-10-06, 07:03 PM

Hi all.... Very informative thread indeed....

I have been noticing a problem for the past few weeks on my setup - I am hoping that someone would have some words of wisdom for me...

So I have the Motorola 6412 hooked up via Optical cable to my AV receiver. When I am watching HD content on the network channels (ABC, NBC, CBS), the audio that is encoded in Dolby Digital gets through to my AVR and is decoded correctly and can be heard. The problem happens when there are commercial breaks and if the original audio is not Dolby Digital, I don't get any sound at all! My AVR still says it has Dolby Digital lock but there is no sound - which leads me to suspect that the Motorola is doing something funky. My AVR is an old Denon 2800 but it has performed flawlessly over the years and continues to do so in all other situations so I don't think the AVR is the issue...

Any ideas as to what could be the problem and how to fix it? Thanks in advance....
Your receiver just isn't switching from 5.1 to 2-channel properly.
Technically it's all "Dolby Digital" (AC3), unless you are on an analog channel, then it's probably PCM. But the HD programs are in DD 5.1 channel (your receiver probably displays "Dolby Digital") while the commercials are DD 2-channel (your receiver might display "Pro Logic" or maybe DTS:Neo6 if you're using that instead).

Try this, when that happens, turn the reciever off/on again, or switch inputs to something else then back to the 6412. If that brings the audio back, then that is definitely the problem. If not... then something else is, I guess..

Mikef5

10-10-06, 07:18 PM

Check out channel 702, news in HD, the first in the Bay Area.

Laters,
Mikef5

fender4645

10-10-06, 07:19 PM

Check out channel 702, news in HD, the first in the Bay Area.

Laters,
Mikef5

Well there it is. Not bad.

Edit: but it looks like all of their field cameras are SD, which means 90% of the brodcast is in SD.

Mikef5

10-10-06, 07:23 PM

Well there it is. Not bad.
Yep, turned on the news because they are showing the A's game tonight and there it was. They didn't do any hyping up the fact they were going to do HD at all, hope it stays that way.. ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

keenan

10-10-06, 07:30 PM

Well there it is. Not bad.

Edit: but it looks like all of their field cameras are SD, which means 90% of the brodcast is in SD.
Yes, but at least they're going widescreen with it, only seen a few things pillarboxed.

ayewbf

10-10-06, 07:31 PM

It makes them look like they have rank amateurs running things (maybe they do).And here I thought it was just the Sacramento DTV stations that had these sort of pilot-error-like problems :) Anyone know how to get their s3 tivo season passes to automatically record 2 sources at once (OTA DTV from sacramento and SF locals from comcast)? That would have saved my g.f. from having to watch studio 60 via subtitles.

fender4645

10-10-06, 07:33 PM

Yes, but at least they're going widescreen with it, only seen a few things pillarboxed.

That's true. Also it looks like their weather "Live Shots" were in HD. I wonder if they'll eventually get HD field cameras for their reporters.

keenan

10-10-06, 07:36 PM

That's true. Also it looks like their weather "Live Shots" were in HD. I wonder if they'll eventually get HD field cameras for their reporters.
Hope so, I never watch any local news but I might now, especially if the remotes are HD. I would have guessed KGO would have been the first to go HD, looks like they'll be second now.

Mikef5

10-10-06, 07:39 PM

I just checked my OTA setup and I'm getting 5.1 sound on KTVU but it's not on cable. No big deal for news but strange that Comcast isn't passing the 5.1 sound through.

Laters,
Mikef5

keenan

10-10-06, 07:41 PM

Also, remember this is not an isolated incident. Last week (or was it the week before), the had an odd blanking every 2-3 seconds - the entire screen would blank, like a very slow strobe. I also switched then to SD. Same last night due to the previously mentioned audio issue.

The local management should DEMAND that an engineer actually monitor the broadcast and make sure it's not foobared - both audio and video.

Best,
jeff
No it's not isolated, it's just NBC, business as usual. This sort of crap has been happening for years, I recall "Surface" last season having all sorts of the same problems, and if it's snowing, or really bad weather in NY, forget about it, they can't even get a digital signal out most times. NBC uses Ku band for their distribution whereas the rest use C band, that ought to tell you something.

keenan

10-10-06, 07:45 PM

I just checked my OTA setup and I'm getting 5.1 sound on KTVU but it's not on cable. No big deal for news but strange that Comcast isn't passing the 5.1 sound through.

Laters,
Mikef5
I'm getting 5.1 here in Santa Rosa.

keenan

10-10-06, 07:52 PM

And here I thought it was just the Sacramento DTV stations that had these sort of pilot-error-like problems :) Anyone know how to get their s3 tivo season passes to automatically record 2 sources at once (OTA DTV from sacramento and SF locals from comcast)? That would have saved my g.f. from having to watch studio 60 via subtitles.
Never tried it, but can't you just set up two SPs for the two different channels?

fender4645

10-10-06, 08:10 PM

That was the dumbest intro into a sporting event I've ever seen. And it's pretty obvious who the national media are rooting for in this series.

Go A's!

keenan

10-10-06, 08:13 PM

No, it's Go A's!! :p :D

walk

10-10-06, 08:17 PM

Biggest nightmare scenario for the national sports media: World Series on the West Coast.

At least they know half the games will be played in either St. Louis (media darlings), Tigers (feel-good story of the year) or New York (HQ Central of the entire world).
:p

keenan

10-10-06, 08:20 PM

Yup, Dodgers/Yankees would have been the matchup the media wanted(I know it's the one I wanted. :p )

10-10-06, 09:38 PM

Anyone know how to get their s3 tivo season passes to automatically record 2 sources at once (OTA DTV from sacramento and SF locals from comcast)?

One Season Pass works for a single channel only, so set up two separate Season Passes.

ayewbf

10-10-06, 10:29 PM

One Season Pass works for a single channel only, so set up two separate Season Passes.With two first-run only season passes for the same show, via my 2 different HD NBC channels, only one is recorded. This sort of thing has been a long-time known problem with the hr10-250.

10-10-06, 10:36 PM

With two first-run only season passes for the same show, via my 2 different HD NBC channels, only one is recorded. This sort of thing has been a long-time known problem with the hr10-250.

It's a feature, not a bug! :) Have you tried "first-run and repeat"? If that doesn't work, you may need to use "all with duplicate".

ayewbf

10-10-06, 10:39 PM

It's a feature, not a bug! :) Have you tried "first-run and repeat"? If that doesn't work, you may need to use "all with duplicate".I don't want to record re-runs. That behavior is NOT a feature, as it prevents exactly what would be most useful in this situation, and exactly what's implied by having 2 different first run season passes for the same show. The tivo shouldn't allow 2 first run season passes in the first place if it is not going to honor it.

shane55

10-10-06, 11:20 PM

Also, remember this is not an isolated incident. Last week (or was it the week before), the had an odd blanking every 2-3 seconds - the entire screen would blank, like a very slow strobe. I also switched then to SD. Same last night due to the previously mentioned audio issue.

The local management should DEMAND that an engineer actually monitor the broadcast and make sure it's not foobared - both audio and video.

Best,
jeff
Going to watch these two shows this evening (Heros and Stu. 60), I was infuriated that two weeks in a row Stu. 60 was messed up and now Heros (there are re-runs on sci-fi).

At KGO in SF (where I worked until recently), there is someone monitoring the feed 24x7. They have the 5.1 audio monitors. Also, there are several 'monitors' in the field that call in when there are errors. So... WTF??? Why didn't someone watching these shows call in while it was in progress, and if they did... why wasn't it fixed?

What's wrong with KNTV? :mad:

Sure am glad I continue to pay such a premium for Comcrap's POS recorder and ghastly broadcasts. :rolleyes:

'scuse me while I go back to my low-tech chisel and stone. I'm disillusioned with HD. :(

shane

JBauer2635

10-11-06, 12:17 AM

What's wrong with KNTV? :mad:
shane

I'll tell you what's going on with them. They are the root of all EVIL! Sure it was a great station when it still had ABC and WB but when it became NBC, the people who worked there became traitors. Craig Hererra, Formely worked at KFSN-TV (KGO's sister station in Fresno) BACKSTABBED the station without telling them goodbye, Kris Sanchez Formely woring at KGPE-TV in Fresno, BACKSTABBED again not telling them that she was leaving. How RUDE! :angry: :mad: Diane Dwyer and Noelle Walker both Tramps! Noelle can't even compare to Kris Pickel from KOVR CBS 13. She's real sexy! That's why whoever works at KNTV are TRAITORS! No wonder why I hate KNTV so much! I am mucdh happier watching KNSD because at least they have Wheel and Jeopardy! in HD every night from 7-8 PM! :) :D Try that for a chance KNTV!!

nikeykid

10-11-06, 12:31 AM

for all that complained about the lack of niners HD last week. get ready to complain again. thank you CBS.

http://www.gribblenation.net/nflmaps/06-CBS-L.gif

nikeykid

10-11-06, 12:58 AM

wow i've never been so excited to see the 10oclock news as i am today!! looks like their full lineup of news programming (morning news, noon news, 5, 10) are in HD!! good job ktvu!

JBauer2635

10-11-06, 01:04 AM

At least KTVU still has high watermarks when it comes to news and it's original! KTVU and KTXL are the original independent stations in northern California.

nikeykid

10-11-06, 01:07 AM

i actually like their use of 16x9 upconverts. it still looks a lot better than 4x3 analog. the transition from HD to 16x9 SD is smoother. hopefully they'll have an HD field crew sometime soon. and a copter too! they need to fix that audio lag tho, pretty noticable. that BUG IS HUGE.

will they show the HD highlights of the a's game?? guess i'll find out soon.

IndigoBlu

10-11-06, 01:12 AM

first HD news broadcasts, nice surprise! the upconverts look pretty nice, i didn't expect any field reports to be in HD anyways. the widescreen's great. KGO next? they've had their HD copter for a while now, pity they hardly show any HD shots from it like they did in the beginning..

mterzich

10-11-06, 01:27 AM

I would suspect that KTVU would now be able to serve HD syndication shows as they become available.

nikeykid

10-11-06, 01:30 AM

I would suspect that KTVU would now be able to serve HD syndication shows as they become available.

does that mean they could show HD highlights of local games now? if they can show syndicated shows that means they can record and distribute HD? i'm still waiting for KGO to show me jeopardy in HD!!

IndigoBlu

10-11-06, 01:49 AM

lol, i noticed on SD, they've had the anchors halfway off the screen a few times.

nice little segment on the HD broadcast :)

nikeykid

10-11-06, 01:53 AM

lol, i noticed on SD, they've had the anchors halfway off the screen a few times.

nice little segment on the HD broadcast :)

too bad that segment that they are now broadcasting in HD was in 16x9 SD!!! grrrrrrrr.

no HD highlights of sports yet. just something they can work on later on. i guess they aren't sportscenter yet.

mterzich

10-11-06, 02:04 AM

does that mean they could show HD highlights of local games now? if they can show syndicated shows that means they can record and distribute HD? i'm still waiting for KGO to show me jeopardy in HD!!
If the can get a distribution feed or tapes from FSN for HD highlights, I would expect so.

I'd expect that they should be able to record and distribute HD.

I'd suspect that KGO will start showing Jeopardy and Wheel shortly after their local news starts being shown in HD. They need the HD MPEG2 server that they'll probably purchase for the news and an dish to pickup the distribution feed. That is assuming that they have the HD rights to those shows.

ssmobin

10-11-06, 09:23 PM

what. the. fu*k. :mad:
for all that complained about the lack of niners HD last week. get ready to complain again. thank you CBS.

http://www.gribblenation.net/nflmaps/06-CBS-L.gif

ssmobin

10-11-06, 09:28 PM

that REALLY REALLY annoyed me. I still watched it though. The echo'ing cut in/out but was there for the majority of the show :mad:
wow kntv's audio sucks... echo sounds on heros.

ssmobin

10-12-06, 01:48 AM

Got the same message here. I havent watched MTV in about a year, lol

but hey, I will take all the HD channels I can get :D
Message on STB says MHD will be available from Oct 31st with HD service. This should be MTV HD right? I haven't tuned to MTV in months and months... nothing could be too bad in HD :)

wco81

10-12-06, 01:51 AM

Larry Kenney

10-12-06, 04:21 AM

I'd suspect that KGO will start showing Jeopardy and Wheel shortly after their local news starts being shown in HD. They need the HD MPEG2 server that they'll probably purchase for the news and an dish to pickup the distribution feed. That is assuming that they have the HD rights to those shows.

They've got the HD server. They've already shown several local HD commercials. They just don't have the receiver needed to receive "Jeopardy" and "Wheel" in HD. They say it's coming. Until it arrives they'll continue to use Pathfinder.

As for news in HD, they've still got a lot of equipment to purchase, including the main switcher for the news studio, so it'll be a while before you see any besides Sky7HD on KGO-DT.

Larry
SF

cgould

10-12-06, 11:11 AM

The $1.50 is supposed to be the charge for the second card with the first one "free" from what I've been reading in Comcast areas including the SF bay area. The problem was they couldn't figure out how to bill it. It sounds like your bill is showing both the old billing and the new billing methods.

I haven't turned my 6412 in yet, but when I do I'm expecting the $1.50 charge will be standardized, hopefully.

I called cust svc on 10/10, and told them they're billing me both ways...
asked them to take off the extra $6.95 "old" AO billing fee, and the one-time $13.99 extra install charge (above the $15.99), and they took it off no problem. Confirmed online. Thanks much guys...
now, I just need another 250gb of space on my S3 :) already full...

nikeykid

10-12-06, 12:25 PM

Any ideas on how much of MTV's programming is in HD?

They seem to have a lot of low-budget shows like the reality shows. Even videos, which they don't show much these days, may be filmed but will they bother doing the transfers to HD?

Main networks still show many of their reality shows in SD don't they?

MHD is not a simulcast of MTV. its a combination of MTV, CMT and VH1 musical programming. 100% HD. concerts and music videos is what i understand. no reality shows.

keenan

10-12-06, 01:48 PM

I called cust svc on 10/10, and told them they're billing me both ways...
asked them to take off the extra $6.95 "old" AO billing fee, and the one-time $13.99 extra install charge (above the $15.99), and they took it off no problem. Confirmed online. Thanks much guys...
now, I just need another 250gb of space on my S3 :) already full...
I checked my bill online yesterday and they've got it all screwed up, two installation charges of different amounts and two digital outlet fees...when the bill comes I'll have to go to the office and get them to straighten it out.

It's too bad the two ATSC tuners couldn't be configured as QAM tuners giving you the ability to record 4 cable channels. :D

My S3 has been working perfectly BTW, I couldn't be happier with it. (well, 4 QAM tuners would be nice. :p )

mazman49

10-12-06, 02:24 PM

Someone on another thread who's bio says he's from Alamo, CA said he picked up a 3416 at the local Comcast center. Maybe I'll try to go by at lunch tomorrow to see if they have any in stock.

Dropped by the Danville office to see if they had any 3416's. The rather rude and indifferent (Comcrapstic) employee told me they did not and that they would not be getting them anytime soon.

fender4645

10-12-06, 02:48 PM

Dropped by the Danville office to see if they had any 3416's. The rather rude and indifferent (Comcrapstic) employee told me they did not and that they would not be getting them anytime soon.

The guy that posted said he went to the Concord office. I'm not sure if you can go there because I think San Ramon is on a different headend. I haven't had a chance to go because I still need finish watching what's on my current 3412. I'll try and go this weekend.

That Don Guy

10-12-06, 03:37 PM

Re: that NFL map - well what did you expect, this is 49ers/Raiders country, of course they are going to show that game. Why parts of AZ isn't seeing it.... well heh that IS funny.

Three areas didn't get the Cowboys-Eagles game; San Francisco, Phoenix, and Jacksonville. Guess which three teams had home games on CBS starting at about the same time as the Cowboys-Eagles game on Fox?

It's an NFL policy to get people to go out and watch the local game (if it's blacked out) or to watch the local team on TV (if the game is aired) - whenever a local team is playing a home game, the network that is not carrying the game is not allowed to show a game at the same time in that market, even if the local team's game is blacked out, and even if it is that network's doubleheader day. The only time a home team's local area gets a doubleheader is if they are playing one of the two games and it is not blacked out. (Even this is relatively new - up through around 2000, the rule was that if a local team's home game was on TV, that station couldn't show any other game that day. This was really bad in San Francisco and New York, as it meant that if either the 49ers or Raiders (or Giants or Jets, in New York) had a home game that afternoon, nobody aired a doubleheader. Why the "no doubleheader if it is blacked out" rule still applies, I don't know, but I do know that there is little chance of the rules changing any time soon (the NFL even tried to stop Slingbox from being released out of fear that people would use it to get around the blackout rules).

-- Don

nikeykid

10-14-06, 12:11 PM

threads been dead for a little while. i'll BUMP.

I've been watching more of KTVU's HD news package and I still really like how the PQ looks, the graphics look. But integrating the 16x9 SD on the field really enhances the news experience to me, more so than merely having HD in the studio. just wait until HD field cams are the norm!!

RBurks

10-14-06, 01:46 PM

Mikef5

10-14-06, 02:10 PM

I love Comcast. It's so f'n COMCASTIC...

As of this morning I can no longer find ESPN via QAM. Understood we shouldn't have it in the first place, but then why still ESPN2?

I think I have a head end manager with his head up his end.

Oh yeah, still no KQED HD with correct PSIP.
Well RBurks, I've said many times in this forum that by announcing that you are getting channels that should be encrypted is the best way to lose them. Comcast does read this forum to see if there are major problems but they do read those other messages and will fix what they can including putting the channels that are suppose to be encrypted back to being encrypted. I don't think the head end manager had his/her head up anywhere, they may have been giving your area a good deal until it came to Comcast's attention that some of their channels were not being encrypted like they should be. Never look a gift horse in the mouth ;)

The KQED HD PSIP problem needs to be addressed to KQED, that is their problem, they are the ones that are suppose to put that PSIP data into the data stream not Comcast, all Comcast does is pass that data stream through as is. All of you that are having PSIP problems need to contact KQED and let them know that you are not getting the proper PSIP data from the signal that they are providing to Comcast. If they can't or won't do anything then you should contact Comcast to let them know that this is a problem for you.

Laters,
Mikef5

sfhub

10-14-06, 08:07 PM

The KQED HD PSIP problem needs to be addressed to KQED, that is their problem, they are the ones that are suppose to put that PSIP data into the data stream not Comcast, all Comcast does is pass that data stream through as is. All of you that are having PSIP problems need to contact KQED and let them know that you are not getting the proper PSIP data from the signal that they are providing to Comcast. If they can't or won't do anything then you should contact Comcast to let them know that this is a problem for you.
I believe there is some slight reconfiguring Comcast needs to do to propogate the PSIP info onto their streams.

There are many examples of the station having the PSIP info on their OTA feed and some Comcast areas having the correct PSIP and others not having the correct PSIP. Keenan for example always seems to have the proper PSIP when various other areas do not.

I remember people on this thread complaining to the Comcast system administrator for their area and the PSIP info magically showed up.

So while it is possible the new HD feed from KQED is missing PSIP (we don't have access to that feed so we have no way of knowing) it is quite possible (and I would say likely) this is a Comcast problem.

My area doesn't have PSIP info (and hasn't had for many months), except for 2.1 and 5.1. The OTA feeds have the PSIP info, so the only other explanation other than a problem at Comcast, is the feed provided Comcast is different from the OTA feed and PSIP is missing, but then that wouldn't explain why other Comcast areas do have PSIP.

If I have missed a post that definitively indicated the feed from KQED is missing PSIP, then I apologize for the distraction.

keenan

10-14-06, 08:54 PM

There are many examples of the station having the PSIP info on their OTA feed and some Comcast areas having the correct PSIP and others not having the correct PSIP. Keenan for example always seems to have the proper PSIP when various other areas do not.

I was going to mention that, it would seem that KQED is doing things right and that it's Comcast that is not getting the PSIP data out correctly in all areas.

amdspitfire

10-14-06, 09:26 PM

i have the most basic cable, for $12 and planning on getting a HDTV. Will i recieve any HD channels?

HDHTPC

10-15-06, 12:36 AM

Another new S3 TiVo Comcast customer here.

It took 3 times to get the cable cards to work.

The first guy came out with no cable cards and said "Tivo doesn't need them". When I showed him the S3 her called for someone else to come back (another half day of work lost). The next guy came and put both cards in at once, I handed him the TiVo cable card instructions and he said "don't need that... Just wait an hour and your channels will come in"... Days later still no encrypted channels. So the third guy comes out and says that they need to send another activation signal. I pointed out that TiVo guide says they need addtional pairing info like HostAddr, and such... He said they don't... They just need to one code for the cablecard itself. Third time was the charm and it all works now.

The S3 TiVo pairing screen still says Status="Waiting to Start" on both cable cards which I thought meant they weren't ready, but it appears to be working.

My bill now includes:

$50.00 Standard Cable
$10.00 Digital Classic Package
$1.50 TiVo Digital Access
$5.00 High Definition TV

(Are others seeing a similar set of bills?)

RBurks

10-15-06, 12:40 AM

Comcast does read this forum to see if there are major problems but they do read those other messages and will fix what they can including putting the channels that are suppose to be encrypted back to being encrypted. I don't think the head end manager had his/her head up anywhere, they may have been giving your area a good deal until it came to Comcast's attention that some of their channels were not being encrypted like they should be. Never look a gift horse in the mouth

ESPN is back again. So do they like us again, did I not offend their sensibility, or is it just plain FUBAR?

And since I pay for it I am not trying to pull the wool over anyone's eyes. Honestly I would far prefer for COMCAST to get things working correctly than to get free channels. Time is money, and COMCAST wastes a lot of mine (both).

And if we really want to discuss issues, then what is the COMCAST policy (or what should it be) for delivering HD OTA channels unencrypted via cable w/o a cable box? I think that is what most people want. If you want ESPN, UHD, TNTHD, DHD, HBOHD, etc pay for it and use the box or a cable card. And I just can't wait for ADS so I can pay for 5 more boxes providing complexity and functionality I don't want.

This is a simple question. Why won't COMCAST deliver Basic HD channels (FOX,NBC,CBS,ABC,PBS) via cable not requiring a box, given you are paying for basic cable?

Forget the HD Service charge too.

Just my opinion, and I am sure I am agitating the omnipresent COMCASTians who watch vigilantly over this. And if they do I think its a good thing. 4 weeks ago all of us "grandfathered" ATT customers were told no TNT-HD technically possible w/o changing to new Comcast policy, then all of a sudden 2 weeks ago they switched it on?

IT'S ALL ABOUT MONEY. No more, no less.

10-15-06, 12:54 AM

i have the most basic cable, for $12 and planning on getting a HDTV. Will i recieve any HD channels?

The broadcast HD channels are not encrypted.

10-15-06, 12:56 AM

My bill now includes:

$50.00 Standard Cable
$10.00 Digital Classic Package
$1.50 TiVo Digital Access
$5.00 High Definition TV

Get rid of the $5 HD charge. That's for HD box rental.

10-15-06, 01:01 AM

This is a simple question. Why won't COMCAST deliver Basic HD channels (FOX,NBC,CBS,ABC,PBS) via cable not requiring a box, given you are paying for basic cable?

I don't know what you're talking about. Those HD channels ARE being delivered in the clear. You don't need to get a Comcast box or pay extra fees to receive them.

10-15-06, 01:08 AM

I'm in Mountain View and had CableCards installed for S3 yesterday. Limited basic ~$15 and $1.50 for two CableCards. No additional monthly services/fees required.

Mikef5

10-15-06, 01:27 AM

This is a simple question. Why won't COMCAST deliver Basic HD channels (FOX,NBC,CBS,ABC,PBS) via cable not requiring a box, given you are paying for basic cable?
Simple answer is they are. The rest of the channels are encrypted because they are premium channels and require a box or cable card to decode and view. If you are getting them in the clear ( premium channels that is ) then you are getting a freebie and you're looking a gift horse in the mouth. :rolleyes:

Laters,
Mikef5

nikeykid

10-15-06, 01:43 AM

The broadcast HD channels are not encrypted.

he need to have a QAM tuner first! important that you remember that, otherwise u'll still need to get a box to get any HD from comcast. just any ol HDTV won't work.

Mikef5

10-15-06, 01:43 AM

ESPN is back again. So do they like us again, did I not offend their sensibility, or is it just plain FUBAR?

And since I pay for it I am not trying to pull the wool over anyone's eyes. Honestly I would far prefer for COMCAST to get things working correctly than to get free channels. Time is money, and COMCAST wastes a lot of mine (both).

And if we really want to discuss issues, then what is the COMCAST policy (or what should it be) for delivering HD OTA channels unencrypted via cable w/o a cable box? I think that is what most people want. If you want ESPN, UHD, TNTHD, DHD, HBOHD, etc pay for it and use the box or a cable card. And I just can't wait for ADS so I can pay for 5 more boxes providing complexity and functionality I don't want.

This is a simple question. Why won't COMCAST deliver Basic HD channels (FOX,NBC,CBS,ABC,PBS) via cable not requiring a box, given you are paying for basic cable?

Forget the HD Service charge too.

Just my opinion, and I am sure I am agitating the omnipresent COMCASTians who watch vigilantly over this. And if they do I think its a good thing. 4 weeks ago all of us "grandfathered" ATT customers were told no TNT-HD technically possible w/o changing to new Comcast policy, then all of a sudden 2 weeks ago they switched it on?

IT'S ALL ABOUT MONEY. No more, no less.
Wow, I thought I had an attitude problem with Comcast Corp. :confused:
My only point was to let you know what may have caused you to lose ESPN. It's not that you are paying for it or not, if you are fine but the rest of the people on your loop may not be paying for it, so how is Comcast suppose to know one way or the other or insure that you are paying for your premium channels .... by requiring a box be used for premium channels. It's a business and that's what they do and yes it's all about money. As far as the grandfather clause, they didn't have to do that at all, another good deal for you but how long did you think it would last?? If you like what you have then fine but if you want more than that then it will require you to fork out, yes, more money. At least you have the ability to get more channels, in the 550 MHz areas we're screwed until they finally do the right thing and upgrade us. Heck, I don't even get ESPN2-HD or TNT-HD at all, let alone in the clear.

Laters,
Mikef5

Mikef5

10-15-06, 01:51 AM

he need to have a QAM tuner first! important that you remember that, otherwise u'll still need to get a box to get any HD from comcast. just any ol HDTV won't work. He has to have a qam tuner or he wouldn't know that ESPN-HD and ESPN2-HD are being shown in the clear for his loop. The motorola box has to be programed to show the channels that you are paying for, or when they do a free preview of channels, that's the only way they would show up on the moto boxs.

Laters,
Mikef5

kerz

10-15-06, 02:10 AM

Anyone gotten the new software for the DVRs that I've seen mentioned on EngadgetHD? I'm waiting for my Howard TV subscription to run out before I ditch mine in favor of my new S3, and was curious to see if the new software made it any faster (or better in any fashion, hard for it to be worse).

jason

nikeykid

10-15-06, 02:20 AM

Mikef5

10-15-06, 02:24 AM

I believe there is some slight reconfiguring Comcast needs to do to propogate the PSIP info onto their streams.

There are many examples of the station having the PSIP info on their OTA feed and some Comcast areas having the correct PSIP and others not having the correct PSIP. Keenan for example always seems to have the proper PSIP when various other areas do not.

I remember people on this thread complaining to the Comcast system administrator for their area and the PSIP info magically showed up.

So while it is possible the new HD feed from KQED is missing PSIP (we don't have access to that feed so we have no way of knowing) it is quite possible (and I would say likely) this is a Comcast problem.

My area doesn't have PSIP info (and hasn't had for many months), except for 2.1 and 5.1. The OTA feeds have the PSIP info, so the only other explanation other than a problem at Comcast, is the feed provided Comcast is different from the OTA feed and PSIP is missing, but then that wouldn't explain why other Comcast areas do have PSIP.

If I have missed a post that definitively indicated the feed from KQED is missing PSIP, then I apologize for the distraction.
The KQED-HD channel that is provided to Comcast is not the same signal as the OTA signal, it is a separate feed. The OTA signal doesn't start until 5pm and the Comcast one is 24/7 and has different programing. I can almost guarantee that the missing PSIP data for the KQED-HD signal for cable is a KQED problem. To verify that get a hold of someone from KQED ( maybe Red Dana ) and ask if they are providing PSIP data streams to Comcast cable. I'll keep bugging Comcast to find out the real scoop and when it will be fixed but I'll bet dollars to doughnuts it's not a Comcast problem and if it is I'll be first in line to start the Comcast bashing. :)

Laters,
Mikef5

HDHTPC

10-15-06, 02:30 AM

My bill now includes:
$50.00 Standard Cable
$10.00 Digital Classic Package
$1.50 TiVo Digital Access
$5.00 High Definition TV

Get rid of the $5 HD charge. That's for HD box rental.

I just called them and they said that the $5 HD TV fee is required if I want to continue to get any HD channels on the S3. (They said chans 700-719)
I said I heard it was the rental fee for an HD box that they did not provide, and they said "no, that would be yet another $6 monthly fee for box rental if I wanted them to provide an additional receiver.

They also confirmed that the $1.50 "TiVo Digital Access" charge was for the 2nd cable card.

hiker

10-15-06, 09:56 AM

I just called them and they said that the $5 HD TV fee is required if I want to continue to get any HD channels on the S3. (They said chans 700-719)
I said I heard it was the rental fee for an HD box that they did not provide, and they said "no, that would be yet another $6 monthly fee for box rental if I wanted them to provide an additional receiver.

They also confirmed that the $1.50 "TiVo Digital Access" charge was for the 2nd cable card.
You should not be charged $5/mo for the "HDTV Equipment Fee" if you don't have a HDTV Comcast cable box. And you are entitled to a free HDTV cable box on your primary TV, see the 2nd to last answer in the FAQ here (http://www.comcast.com/customers/faq/FaqDetails.ashx?ID=2540). Take a copy of that FAQ page and your bill down to your local Comcast office and argue with them or ask for a manager. It worked for me. Also, I believe, the FCC requires there be no extra charge for the HD broadcast channels and you are already paying for the other non-premium HD channels with Digital Classic tier.

HDHTPC

10-15-06, 12:30 PM

You should not be charged $5/mo for the "HDTV Equipment Fee" if you don't have a HDTV Comcast cable box. And you are entitled to a free HDTV cable box on your primary TV,

It isn't listed as "HDTV Equipment Fee", rather it shows "High Definition TV".

This link seems to suggest I need that fee to get ESPNHD and DiscoveryHD:

http://www.comcast.com/shop/buyflow/default.ashx?Popup=true&RenderedBy=Products&FormName=ProductDetails&ProductID=20012&Title=Comcast%20-%20Product%20Details%20-%20High%20Definition%20Television

http://www.comcast.com/shop/buyflow/default.ashx?SourcePage=Cable

Enhance Your Experience $5.00/month

High Definition Television
Includes premium movie network.
Want to feel like you’re really THERE? HDTV is for you. Enjoy crystal-clear primetime shows, sports programs, and local broadcast channels — without an antenna, or any other clunky gear. Just install the HD box, and for A SMALL MONTHLY FEE you’ll dive into the huge and expanding universe of great HD networks like ESPN HD and Discovery HD Theater. And of course when you subscribe to premium channels like HBO® or Starz!® , they are all available in HD, too.

hiker

10-15-06, 01:51 PM

It isn't listed as "HDTV Equipment Fee", rather it shows "High Definition TV".

This link seems to suggest I need that fee to get ESPNHD and DiscoveryHD:

http://www.comcast.com/shop/buyflow/default.ashx?Popup=true&RenderedBy=Products&FormName=ProductDetails&ProductID=20012&Title=Comcast%20-%20Product%20Details%20-%20High%20Definition%20Television

http://www.comcast.com/shop/buyflow/default.ashx?SourcePage=Cable

Enhance Your Experience $5.00/month

High Definition Television
Includes premium movie network.
Want to feel like you’re really THERE? HDTV is for you. Enjoy crystal-clear primetime shows, sports programs, and local broadcast channels — without an antenna, or any other clunky gear. Just install the HD box, and for A SMALL MONTHLY FEE you’ll dive into the huge and expanding universe of great HD networks like ESPN HD and Discovery HD Theater. And of course when you subscribe to premium channels like HBO® or Starz!® , they are all available in HD, too.
The $5/mo fee shows up on my statement High Definition TV but it is the same fee that is described on the price list that is sent out with the January statement each year as HDTV Equipment fee. Keenan posted a copy of this list somewhere earlier in the thread. You can get a copy at your local office. The $5/mo is supposed to be charged only if you have a Comcast HD box. I have the HD box DCT-6200 on the same TV as the S3 and the lady at my office told me if I returned the box, they would drop the $5 charge.

You pay for Digital Classic tier, $9.95/mo, and that entitles you to ESPN-HD, INHD, DiscoveryHD, etc. The price list I mentioned shows those non-premium HD channels as part of Digital Classic tier.

walk

10-15-06, 01:55 PM

Well it is $6.95 for an extra digital outlet. So $5 + $1.50 is pretty good you're saving 45 cents I wouldn't complain too much...

Anyone watching the Houston vs Dallas football game on 705 right now getting really bad stutter? The Seattle-St.Louis game on 702 is fine, all other HD channels are fine... I tried everything, rebooted the box (as I do every Sunday morning it works a LOT better after a fresh reboot) and the "change to 720" menu trick but nothing works.

hiker

10-15-06, 02:02 PM

...
Anyone watching the Houston vs Dallas football game on 705 right now getting really bad stutter?
...
Watching 705 with TiVo S3 and no stutter here.

Well it is $6.95 for an extra digital outlet. So $5 + $1.50 is pretty good you're saving 45 cents I wouldn't complain too much...
There is no "extra digital outlet", I believe all on primary outlet.

walk

10-15-06, 02:13 PM

It's a little better right now. Still just a little hitch every couple seconds though. Must be the rain.

$6.95 is what they charge for extra cable cards that's what I mean.

hiker

10-15-06, 02:21 PM

...
$6.95 is what they charge for extra cable cards that's what I mean.
Not for the TiVo Series3. First card is free, second is $1.50/mo, special new pricing for S3.

HDHTPC

10-15-06, 03:36 PM

I guess I will roll the dice and call Comcast back and make another run at removing the $5 fee.

When the first installer came to install for the S3 he said the work order said to install a Comcast HD box. I said I didn't need it, and only wanted to make the S3 work, so they may have left the fee on my account even though they never left me a Comcast HD receiver.

Is everyone here paying the $49.95 "Standard Cable" fee at a minimum, or is there a way to order just digital if I only want HD chans and don't care about any of the analog chans?

10-15-06, 03:56 PM

Is everyone here paying the $49.95 "Standard Cable" fee at a minimum, or is there a way to order just digital if I only want HD chans and don't care about any of the analog chans?

If you just want 702-709, all you need is limited basic + $1.50 TiVo CableCard. For other HD channels, you need digital classic. Whether you can have digital classic without expanded basic is another story. When I called Comcast, I was told yes. When I went to the Mountain View office, I was told no.

hiker

10-15-06, 05:21 PM

fender4645

10-15-06, 05:43 PM

So I open my door last night on the front step is a small box with 'Comcastic' written all over it (literally). I open it up and there's a bag of chocolate covered popcorn (gross) and a bunch of Comcast flyers. It was obviously some promotion with a bagged popcorn maker.

Note to Comcast: I will NEVER open any food item that gets delivered to my door unless I'm expecting it. How do I know it's not laced with some chemical that makes me want to spend more on my cable? Hmmmm????

keenan

10-15-06, 05:48 PM

That's freakin' weird. :eek:

mattg

10-15-06, 08:04 PM

Mikef5

10-15-06, 08:14 PM

OK, I've tried the search function and have gotten different answers, but none of them have helped so far. I recently hooked up my new Pio 5070 to the coax cable that comes into my house. On my old analog TV I received espn, a&e, etc. but of course no HD channels because it lacked the proper tuner.

When doing a channel scan on the initial setup, the Pio found every network except NBC. I won't say what else it found, but the over-the-air networks are all there except NBC. I tried directly inputting channel numbers to no avail.

I do not, nor did I ever have a cable set top box. I don't even think I want one unless it's a DVR, and then I suppose I have options other than Comcast.

I live in Danville....can anyone help me find the "tuning coordinates" for NBC?

Thanks in advance.
Don't know what the channel numbers are for your area but what did you get for ABC or CBS ??
On some sets the channel numbers are the same as the OTA numbers, like on my Sony NBC is 11.1, ABC is 7.1 and CBS is 5.1 but on my LG tuner they are different ( CBS is 24.7 and NBC is 33.1 ). Since you don't have a Comcast box you can't see what frequency NBC is being sent on but that would give you an idea on where to look.

Laters,
Mikef5

KGD_007

10-15-06, 08:58 PM

Does anyone know if the Concord Comcast office has the 6416 available. Any reason why you would not upgrade to this unit?

Thanks,

Kris

10-15-06, 08:58 PM

I live in Danville....can anyone help me find the "tuning coordinates" for NBC?

This may not help because we're in different areas. In Mountain View, KNTV HD is 116-1.

mattg

10-15-06, 09:25 PM

Don't know what the channel numbers are for your area but what did you get for ABC or CBS ??
On some sets the channel numbers are the same as the OTA numbers, like on my Sony NBC is 11.1, ABC is 7.1 and CBS is 5.1 but on my LG tuner they are different ( CBS is 24.7 and NBC is 33.1 ). Since you don't have a Comcast box you can't see what frequency NBC is being sent on but that would give you an idea on where to look.

Laters,
Mikef5
Well, for example, KTVUHD is 2.001, CBS is 5.001, ABC is 7.001 and KQEDHD is 82.002.

I would have thought that NBC would logically be 3.001 or thereabouts.

mattg

10-15-06, 09:50 PM

Well, for example, KTVUHD is 2.001, CBS is 5.001, ABC is 7.001 and KQEDHD is 82.002.

I would have thought that NBC would logically be 3.001 or thereabouts.
That I receive the normal, non-HD NBC on channel 3 and 23. Channel 3 is out of San Francisco and 23 is out of San Jose, I believe.

Mikef5

10-15-06, 11:05 PM

Well, for example, KTVUHD is 2.001, CBS is 5.001, ABC is 7.001 and KQEDHD is 82.002.

I would have thought that NBC would logically be 3.001 or thereabouts.
Looking at your numbers I would try either 33.001 or 23.001 or even 11.001. The other numbers seem to follow the OTA numbering scheme except it adds 2 zeros for the sub net number. Can't hurt to try.. :)

Laters,
Mikef5

sfhub

10-15-06, 11:19 PM

The KQED-HD channel that is provided to Comcast is not the same signal as the OTA signal, it is a separate feed. The OTA signal doesn't start until 5pm and the Comcast one is 24/7 and has different programing. I can almost guarantee that the missing PSIP data for the KQED-HD signal for cable is a KQED problem. To verify that get a hold of someone from KQED ( maybe Red Dana ) and ask if they are providing PSIP data streams to Comcast cable.
If what you say is correct then everyone in Comcast Bay Area who gets 24/7 KQED-HD will not have PSIP for this channel.

Anybody want to add a data point? Keenan, do you get 24/7 KQED-HD or the after 5pm version?

I'm open to the possibility that KQED-HD lacking PSIP is a KQED problem and I'm also open to it being a Comcast problem. If someone says their area has 24/7 KQED-HD and has PSIP then I'm confident this is a Comcast problem. If nobody with 24/7 KQED-HD has PSIP, then I would lean towards KQED being the problem, but still can't tell for sure unless KQED (or Comcast) comment.

Clearly though there are *other* examples of PSIP problems which *are* Comcast's problem.

What I disagree with is:
> all Comcast does is pass that data stream through as is.

Obviously they do more than just pass the data stream as is because some areas get PSIP and others do not, for the same channel. If they passed the data as is, then everyone should get the same behavior. I'm not saying they reencode the stream, but the meta-data appears to have some modifications to translate into a QAM system.

FWIW my area didn't have PSIP info for KQED-HD even before the 24/7 upgrade while many other areas did have PSIP info for KQED-HD.

mattg

10-16-06, 12:12 AM

Looking at your numbers I would try either 33.001 or 23.001 or even 11.001. The other numbers seem to follow the OTA numbering scheme except it adds 2 zeros for the sub net number. Can't hurt to try.. :)

Laters,
Mikef5
I guess it's a mystery. I will probably go to a comcast office for help...hopefully they will be better than what I've read on this forum. :)

TPeterson

10-16-06, 12:19 AM

TPeterson

10-16-06, 12:27 AM

Obviously they do more than just pass the data stream as is....Yes, that's certainly true. One example is that they need to change the information about the signal modulation from 8VSB to 256QAM. Some cablecos weren't doing that and it caused some havoc with those tuners that literally trusted the PSIP data more than their own channel scans. ;)

mattg

10-16-06, 12:47 AM

Matt, your DTV is showing you the "virtual channel" assignments that it finds in the PSIP data along with the programs for FOX, CBS, and ABC, not their actual rf channels. The only rf channel assignment you listed is "82" for KQED, for which Comcast is not supplying PSIP data. It also isn't supplying PSIP data for NBC in my area, where NBC is on 116 (the same as C3 said). However, since KQED is on ch 117 in my area, I doubt that you'll find NBC on 116 in Danville. But if you check the other channels that your TV found in its scan, you'll likely find NBC someplace among them. (Hint: If you found ESPN-HD in the clear, you'll probably find NBC-DT and NBC-D2 on the same rf channel but with different subchannel numbers)
I haven't found ESPN HD yet and must do more reading to catch up on the technical terminology. Despite having only 20 or so posts, I've been lurking here for a number of years, but have only had an HDTV for a couple of weeks, so I just started visiting this forum. I will do another scan tomorrow of all channels just in case I missed anything. Thanks to all for the help...I'd still like to hear from any Danville Comcasters who may shed some light. Thanks again.

fender4645

10-16-06, 02:03 AM

A friend of mine picked up a 3416 this weekend at the Concord office. So those on the Martinez headend who want a whoppin 40GB of more recording space, have at it.

keenan

10-16-06, 03:50 AM

Anybody want to add a data point? Keenan, do you get 24/7 KQED-HD or the after 5pm version?

I get KQED 24/7. I was going to check today to see if my display's QAM tuner was still mapping it to ch-9 but never got around to it, too much football today, I'll try and check it tomorrow. Based on what Mike's saying, it shouldn't, I'll see tomorrow.

Okay, I just checked and, no, I'm not getting PSIP info for KQED-HD Ch 9.1 anymore. It's showing up at 67-2 up here in Santa Rosa. The rest of the stations, KPIX, KNTV, KGO and KTVU, and all sub-channels, all map to the correct station ID's. This must have changed when KQED started giving Comcast a separate feed apart from the OTA feed because I'm 99% certain I was getting a 9.1 mapping before, in fact I'm certain of it. Apparently KQED seems to think PSIP is not important for cable which sucks for people who rely on internal QAM tuners only.

Discovery-HD is still unencrypted on 76-4.

keenan

10-16-06, 04:39 AM

I haven't found ESPN HD yet and must do more reading to catch up on the technical terminology.
I don't know if it will help, but before ESPN-HD was encrypted here in Santa Rosa it showed up on ch 0, actually, it was a channel between the first analog(ch 2) and the last digital channel(don't remember what it was). It would just show ESPN-HD with no channel number on the TV's info display.

mike789

10-16-06, 02:35 PM

bobby94928

10-16-06, 02:41 PM

It's still in the works but won't be out until later this year and maybe into next year. It will roll out as the head ends are capable.

That Don Guy

10-16-06, 03:20 PM

It's still in the works but won't be out until later this year and maybe into next year. It will roll out as the head ends are capable.
Any idea on what, if anything, the monthly "TiVo fee" I have heard about for the new software will be? (Or would it just replace the existing $10/month fee for the Comcast DVRs?)

-- Don

sfhub

10-16-06, 03:50 PM

I get KQED 24/7. I was going to check today to see if my display's QAM tuner was still mapping it to ch-9 but never got around to it, too much football today, I'll try and check it tomorrow. Based on what Mike's saying, it shouldn't, I'll see tomorrow.

Okay, I just checked and, no, I'm not getting PSIP info for KQED-HD Ch 9.1 anymore. It's showing up at 67-2 up here in Santa Rosa. The rest of the stations, KPIX, KNTV, KGO and KTVU, and all sub-channels, all map to the correct station ID's. This must have changed when KQED started giving Comcast a separate feed apart from the OTA feed because I'm 99% certain I was getting a 9.1 mapping before, in fact I'm certain of it. Apparently KQED seems to think PSIP is not important for cable which sucks for people who rely on internal QAM tuners only.

Well, give it another day or two for more data points (or feedback from KQED/Comcast) but if nobody in the Bay Area is getting PSIP data for the 24/7 KQED-HD then it does seem likely (but not definitely) a KQED problem.

fender4645

10-16-06, 04:10 PM

Does anyone know when/if the Tivo interface will arrive on the Motorola box? Last year it was announced and was going to be available this summer, but now it's fall and nothing is out. Has this been dropped from the plan, or is it still in the works?
A few select markets are supposed to get it in the next 60 days. The mass rollout isn't supposed to happen until next Spring.

RBurks

10-16-06, 04:12 PM

I don't know what you're talking about. Those HD channels ARE being delivered in the clear. You don't need to get a Comcast box or pay extra fees to receive them.

Perhaps you have missed my CORE RANT about not getting PBS HD "in the clear". It appears the PSIP is not valid in my area of San Carlos. Multiple calls to COMCAST about this. And to a QAM tuner this appears no different than being ENCRYPTED - i.e., it does not show up "in the clear".

RBurks

10-16-06, 04:37 PM

Okay, I just checked and, no, I'm not getting PSIP info for KQED-HD Ch 9.1 anymore...This must have changed when KQED started giving Comcast a separate feed apart from the OTA feed because I'm 99% certain I was getting a 9.1 mapping before, in fact I'm certain of it. Apparently KQED seems to think PSIP is not important for cable which sucks for people who rely on internal QAM tuners only.

In the words of Kevin Costner to Kevin Kline in Silverado:
THAT'S WHAT I TOLD HIM

This problem has been going on for a while.

10-16-06, 04:51 PM

RBurks, have you tried subchannels of 117? TPeterson said KQED-HD should be there (in San Carlos).

sfhub

10-16-06, 04:54 PM

Perhaps you have missed my CORE RANT about not getting PBS HD "in the clear". It appears the PSIP is not valid in my area of San Carlos. Multiple calls to COMCAST about this. And to a QAM tuner this appears no different than being ENCRYPTED - i.e., it does not show up "in the clear".
Well in fairness I don't think it is because PSIP is not valid, but rather not present. I think we know for sure the signal some or most of us are getting doesn't have the PSIP, so someone between us and KQED must be failing to propogate *or* it isn't present on the source feed from KQED. If everyone in the Bay Area is missing PSIP for the 24/7 KQED then I think that it is more likely a problem with the KQED source.

I don't think it is fair to say "to a QAM tuner this appears no different than being ENCRYPTED" I think it would be fair to say to the QAM tuner *you* are using this causes KQED to not show up in scans.

For other QAM tuners, there could possibly be no issue. For other QAM tuners, this might only be a problem with the channel scan, but the end user can enter the RF channel # directly.

FWIW I will guess the problem has to do with 9.2-9.x having PSIP but no channel having PSIP for 9.1. I would further guess that Comcast could alleviate the issue (irrespective of whether the missing PSIP on 9.1 is Comcast or KQED problem) by stripping the PSIP from all KQED 9.2-9.x, but then you would need to remember the real RF channels.

FWIW my area doesn't have PSIP for any KQED or KGO channel and I have no problems receiving KQED-HD both by manually choosing the channel # and through scans via the QAM tuner in my Sharp Aquos.

sfhub

10-16-06, 05:03 PM

In the words of Kevin Costner to Kevin Kline in Silverado:
THAT'S WHAT I TOLD HIM

This problem has been going on for a while.
Well, Mikef5 didn't dispute whether KQED-HD was missing PSIP, he only suggested this was a KQED problem and they are the ones that need to fix it.

If you rant to Comcast about a KQED problem then there's not much they can do other than forward your rant to KQED. If you complain to KQED about a KQED problem maybe you'll get better results. There's a slight possibility Comcast can alleviate the problem by stripping PSIP from the other KQED-SD channels but that could lead to other complaints.

keenan

10-16-06, 06:40 PM

keenan

10-16-06, 06:45 PM

FWIW I will guess the problem has to do with 9.2-9.x having PSIP but no channel having PSIP for 9.1. I would further guess that Comcast could alleviate the issue (irrespective of whether the missing PSIP on 9.1 is Comcast or KQED problem) by stripping the PSIP from all KQED 9.2-9.x, but then you would need to remember the real RF channels.

FWIW my area doesn't have PSIP for any KQED or KGO channel and I have no problems receiving KQED-HD both by manually choosing the channel # and through scans via the QAM tuner in my Sharp Aquos.
I don't get PSIP data for any of the KQED digital channels, 9.1 to 9.x, they're all scattered in oddball places on the cable channel map. For example, 9.1 was 67.3, I found some of the 9.x channel in the 15.x range and others in the 20-something .x range. All over the place IOW.

keenan

10-16-06, 06:47 PM

Does San Carlos have more than one plant? If TPeterson is getting KQED-HD then RBurks should as well, I would think anyhow.

keenan

10-16-06, 06:57 PM

A few select markets are supposed to get it in the next 60 days. The mass rollout isn't supposed to happen until next Spring.
Being that the SF market is one of the "bad boy" areas, my guess is that it will be at least this time next year before it shows up here. :D

TPeterson

10-17-06, 02:18 AM

Does San Carlos have more than one plant? If TPeterson is getting KQED-HD then RBurks should as well, I would think anyhow.I don't know if there is more than one plant in San Carlos, Jim. However, FWIW, I recently inspected the contents of ch 117, which for me in San Carlos had been carrying all three KGO subchannels and (with time sharing) all 5 KQED subs--with PSIP data for all. That was before the switch to 24/7 KQED-HD. Ch 117 is now carrying the 3 KGO subs with full PSIP data, KQED-HD, and ENCORE. The latter two have no PSIP data beyond PMT/PAT entries to indicate their respective video and audio PIDs. There are also PMT/PAT entries for what used to be the other KQED subs but they point to the null PIDs.

Likely, it is this oddball mixture of PSIP and PMT/PAT that is breaking RBurks' QAM tuner.

I haven't been able to find the other 3 KQED subchannels anywhere so far but I've not spent much time looking either. All I can say for sure is that they're no longer on ch 117.

10-17-06, 03:12 AM

I haven't been able to find the other 3 KQED subchannels anywhere so far but I've not spent much time looking either.

Try 91-8, 91-9, and 91-10. It looks like San Carlos and Mountain View have very similar (if not the same) RF structure.

keenan

10-17-06, 03:25 AM

I don't know if there is more than one plant in San Carlos, Jim. However, FWIW, I recently inspected the contents of ch 117, which for me in San Carlos had been carrying all three KGO subchannels and (with time sharing) all 5 KQED subs--with PSIP data for all. That was before the switch to 24/7 KQED-HD. Ch 117 is now carrying the 3 KGO subs with full PSIP data, KQED-HD, and ENCORE. The latter two have no PSIP data beyond PMT/PAT entries to indicate their respective video and audio PIDs. There are also PMT/PAT entries for what used to be the other KQED subs but they point to the null PIDs.

Likely, it is this oddball mixture of PSIP and PMT/PAT that is breaking RBurks' QAM tuner.

I haven't been able to find the other 3 KQED subchannels anywhere so far but I've not spent much time looking either. All I can say for sure is that they're no longer on ch 117.
I think this is how ours is up here. There was another KQED channel right next to the HD channel and the others were in another spot clumped together. I didn't really check it that thoroughly after finding 9.1

TPeterson

10-17-06, 09:25 AM

Try 91-8, 91-9, and 91-10. It looks like San Carlos and Mountain View have very similar (if not the same) RF structure.TSReader reports all the subs on that channel as encrypted--but it's also rather low signal quality for me for some reason and has a ton of continuity errors and TEI errors, so TSR may be incorrect.

Mikef5

10-17-06, 12:22 PM

Comcast's response to the KQED missing PSIP data
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've just received an email from Mr. Johnson explaining the problems with the PSIP data and KQED. This is being posted as I received it so there is no question about what was or wasn't said and thank's to Mr. J. for taking the time to help answer the questions about this problem.
____________________________________________________________ _____

You are welcome to post this on the Forum.

I've noticed a good deal of discussion about the lack of PSIP data on
KQED and I wanted to take this opportunity to address some of the issues
that have been raised.

As usual, your analysis is accurate.

As some of the Forum members mentioned, PSIP data travels in the digital
stream of the channel, and provides guide information to customers with
direct connected QAM tuner TVs.

PSIP provides a channel number, a title for the channel (KQED) and can
include a title and description of the programming, and even a program
schedule.

It is required by the FCC that cable operators must pass PSIP through,
when the Broadcaster provides PSIP.

The issue is that when KQED HD converted to full-time carriage on
September 20, PSIP information was no longer made available to Comcast
by KQED.

Simply put the PSIP data was dropped by KQED not by Comcast because of
the very expensive hardware and software license that KQED would have to
purchase in order to provide the PSIP data.

All other broadcaster's HD channels have PSIP included in their video
stream.

We have held several discussions with KQED in an effort to find
potential solutions to the issue.

Needless to say, any solution will be costly and as a Public Television
station that must rely on contributions, versus advertising revenues,
KQED has to weigh the costs to deliver PSIP data versus investments in
programming and/or other critically needed technology.

From Comcast's perspective, KQED is a fantastic partner that is always
committed to going above and beyond the call to satisfy their viewers.
We should remain patience as they wrestle with this complex problem.

____________________________________________________________ ___

I hope this answers most of your questions and if you have any more questions about this I'm sure that KQED and Comcast can help answer them for you.

Laters,
Mikef5

raghu1111

10-17-06, 12:54 PM

Thanks Mike for the info.

Simply put the PSIP data was dropped by KQED not by Comcast because of
the very expensive hardware and software license that KQED would have to
purchase in order to provide the PSIP data.

KQED already sets correct PSIP data for OTA transmission. They must have most of the required software hardware. Do they need totally different set for sending to Comcast?

All other broadcaster's HD channels have PSIP included in their video stream.

most of the time NBC-HD is missing PSIP data. It is almost never at 11.1

keenan

10-17-06, 01:56 PM

It's interesting that KQED would go through the expense of setting up a completely separate signal for cable yet not add the expense of a PSIP generator as well. And this is a "Public Television station that must rely on contributions, versus advertising revenues, KQED has to weigh the costs to deliver PSIP data versus investments in programming and/or other critically needed technology"

What was the reason again why KQED is sending Comcast a different set of signals from their OTA transmissions? I like that they're doing it, in fact it would be nice if all the other stations would do the same, but it just seems as if they're spending money needlessly, especially for a PBS station.

Also, to the best of my knowledge, as far as PBS stations go, KQED is hardly a struggling independent. IIRC, KQED is second only to Boston's WGBH as the largest producer of PBS programming shown nationwide, and that takes a lot of money, so they're certainly not in the poorhouse.

mterzich

10-17-06, 03:01 PM

What was the reason again why KQED is sending Comcast a different set of signals from their OTA transmissions?
OTA in HD is not 24/7 and they wanted 24/7 on cable. At the same time they increased the bit rate of the HD channel from about 12 mb/s to 15 mb/s.

keenan

10-17-06, 03:14 PM

OTA in HD is not 24/7 and they wanted 24/7 on cable. At the same time they increased the bit rate of the HD channel from about 12 mb/s to 15 mb/s.
I understand that, but why? Why can't they do 24/7 OTA? I'm guessing that it's a patent admission that cable is a much larger/more important audience than OTA, and because they can get more bandwidth from cable they can run all their channels 24/7, something they can't do OTA because of bandwidth restrictions.

Makes sense I suppose.

mterzich

10-17-06, 03:38 PM

I understand that, but why? Why can't they do 24/7 OTA? I'm guessing that it's a patent admission that cable is a much larger/more important audience than OTA, and because they can get more bandwidth from cable they can run all their channels 24/7, something they can't do OTA because of bandwidth restrictions.

Makes sense I suppose.
They can't do 24/7 on OTA because of the 4 SD channels that they are broadcasting. I suspect that rate shaping (rate shaping is used by PBS and not decode/encode) the HD channel from the 17 mb/s feed to 9.5 mb/s would be too severe both in the rate shaping process as well as the very low bit rate of the HD channel.

Or I suppose they could eliminate one of the SD channels completely.

sfhub

10-17-06, 04:11 PM

Comcast response:
...
PSIP provides a channel number, a title for the channel (KQED) and can
include a title and description of the programming, and even a program
schedule.

It is required by the FCC that cable operators must pass PSIP through,
when the Broadcaster provides PSIP.
...

Thanks Mike. I didn't know FCC required cable operators to pass PSIP through.

Up until now I was just living with the missing PSIP (in my area) for KGO, KRON, and KNTV.

So now we have the start of a form letter to get PSIP fixed for the channels (other than KQED).

keenan

10-17-06, 04:14 PM

Thanks Mike. I didn't know FCC required cable operators to pass PSIP through.

Up until now I was just living with the missing PSIP (in my area) for KGO, KRON, and KNTV.

So now we have the start of a form letter to get PSIP fixed for the channels (other than KQED).
:D

Really, Mr. J actually laid bare some of the inadequacies of some of Comcast's plants. Bet he's not too popular with the engineering folks right about now. :p

Mikef5

10-17-06, 05:30 PM

:D

Really, Mr. J actually laid bare some of the inadequacies of some of Comcast's plants. Bet he's not too popular with the engineering folks right about now. :p
I would guess Comcast is not very popular with KQED right now ;) but if they are required to have the PSIP data in their video stream then they should do it and Comcast needs to pass it unchanged which they seemed to be doing. To me it looks like all the different digital tuners process the PSIP data differently and that there is no standard way of making that data available and understandable by all the tuners. My LG interprets the signals by their RF signal and my Sony uses the PSIP data, both are digital tuners but see the data differently. What's needed is standardization and being held to that common standard.

Laters,
Mikef5

keenan

10-17-06, 06:24 PM

I would guess Comcast is not very popular with KQED right now ;) but if they are required to have the PSIP data in their video stream then they should do it and Comcast needs to pass it unchanged which they seemed to be doing.

Laters,
Mikef5
I would say with almost 100% certainty that OTA stations are not required to send PSIP data for cable feeds. The reason being, KQED, being a PBS station, it seems a stretch that they would not be compliant with FCC regs.

Consider that the signal arrangement between Comcast and KQED has nothing to do with FCC OTA regulations, it's sort of like a separate company, "KQED-Cable Inc" that has a contract to send Comcast a KQED signal. Especially since it's a completely different signal than the one going out OTA.

Mikef5

10-17-06, 06:51 PM

I would say with almost 100% certainty that OTA stations are not required to send PSIP data for cable feeds. The reason being, KQED, being a PBS station, it seems a stretch that they would not be compliant with FCC regs.

Consider that the signal arrangement between Comcast and KQED has nothing to do with FCC OTA regulations, it's sort of like a separate company, "KQED-Cable Inc" that has a contract to send Comcast a KQED signal. Especially since it's a completely different signal than the one going out OTA.
You know Jim, this such a non issue to me. I don't really care if they do or don't but there are people in this forum that wanted to know why they weren't getting this PSIP data. If the stations provides PSIP data in their video stream then Comcast passes that signal with the PSIP data in it, they don't strip it out. If the stations don't provide that PSIP data there's nothing that Comcast can do about it but ask the station why they are not sending it or ask them to put it in there for their customers, if there is a big enough need for it, which is what Comcast is doing. Wether or not the FCC requires it to be there, I haven't a clue and it's just not important enough for me to research it. I'm merely the messenger... :p ;)

Besides, I'd rather be watching the Tigers beat the Mets tonight.... if they don't get rained out again ;)
Can you imagine a World Series without a New York team in it...... :eek:

Laters,
Mikef5

fender4645

10-17-06, 06:54 PM

Besides, I'd rather be watching the Tigers beat the Mets tonight.... if they don't get rained out again ;)

You mean the Cardinals?

philoneous

10-17-06, 07:20 PM

Wow, I was wondering what happened to KQED and then I read this thread - good detective work! Anybody living in the east bay have a channel # I can try for KQED (I have a Panasonic LCD w/ QAM tuner)?

Mikef5

10-17-06, 07:23 PM

You mean the Cardinals?
Yes, darn those mushrooms.... :p
Still in shock from the A's losing,,,,,

Laters,
Mikef5

Mikef5

10-17-06, 08:04 PM

Great, massive breakups on channel 702, just as they switched to the game. Anyone else or just us in the low rent area ???

Laters,
Mikef5

Mikef5

10-17-06, 08:16 PM

Ok, all better. I think they were just checking to see if my blood pressure was high enough :)
Now, back to the game.

Laters,
Mikef5

keenan

10-17-06, 08:35 PM

Besides, I'd rather be watching the Tigers beat the Mets tonight.... if they don't get rained out again ;)
Can you imagine a World Series without a New York team in it...... :eek:

Laters,
Mikef5
Actually, since neither the Dodgers or the Yankees are in it I'd rather be watching House, Prison Break and Bones right now. Can't they play the rest of these games during the day? :D

Mikef5

10-17-06, 10:16 PM

Actually, since neither the Dodgers or the Yankees are in it I'd rather be watching House, Prison Break and Bones right now. Can't they play the rest of these games during the day? :D
Since neither the Giants or the A's are in I wish the baseball was on some other channel, like ESPN-SD :eek: :D
I agree on some of the choices, House-- for sure, Bones-- is getting better so a thumbs up, but a thumbs down on Prison Break would rather see 24 instead ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

RBurks

10-18-06, 11:51 AM

Mikef5

10-18-06, 12:46 PM

Seems COMCAST has the ability to ADD a PSIP and they are not.Comcast does not have the ability to ADD a PSIP that is the responsiblity of the broadcast station. Comcast is a video provider all they do is provide you with what the stations are broadcasting/sending to them, that's it.
KQED-HD does in fact exist on my San Carlos service, at 117.1. But it has no PSIP so I can only get it by fat-fingering it in. I do not believe this represents an issue with my QAM tuner (or anybody elses) That in it's self should show you that KQED is not providing the PSIP data by the 117.1 number. The channel is there, just no PSIP data. What your tuner is doing is substituting the frequency of the channel because it sees no PSIP data to use so it defaults to using the frequency of the channel. If you had a LG 4200a tuner like I do you would see that for cable it doesn't use the PSIP data at all, it only uses the frequency of the channel for the cable connection but it does use it for OTA connection. Different tuners use this data differently and when it's not available will show the channel numbers differently. Contact KQED if this is a problem for you and see what they tell you. I don't know how to make this any clearer for you, maybe they can be of more help.

Laters,
Mikef5

hiker

10-18-06, 01:16 PM

Is there a way to equate the Inband Frequency to a channel number? For example, my STB shows chan 709 KQED-HD as 741.0000 MHz. Can I use that to arrive at the 117.1 (or whatever) chan number ?

mterzich

10-18-06, 01:41 PM

Is there a way to equate the Inband Frequency to a channel number? For example, my STB shows chan 709 KQED-HD as 741.0000 MHz. Can I use that to arrive at the 117.1 (or whatever) chan number ?
http://www.csgnetwork.com/tvfreqtable.html

sfhub

10-18-06, 02:48 PM

So I am not sure where this leaves us?
...
- KQED-HD does in fact exist on my San Carlos service, at 117.1. But it has no PSIP so I can only get it by fat-fingering it in. I do not believe this represents an issue with my QAM tuner (or anybody elses)
...
- It also appears that COMCAST is hot and heavy into moving stations around right now in preparation to go ADS. A digital scan one night will show active channels that will have no signal the next day.
...
Seems COMCAST has the ability to ADD a PSIP and they are not.
You need to be clear what the problems are. Having KQED-HD PSIP information so it maps to 9.1 and being able to have KQED-HD show up on your channel scan are related but slightly different issues.

The reason KQED-HD doesn't show up in your channel scans *is* an issue with your QAM tuner. KQED-HD shows up for others (including me) in the channel scans. It likely has to do with the strange combination of PSIP and null channels that has resulted from the 24/7 KQED-HD changes. Now if all you want is for KQED-HD to show up in your channel scans, then there are multiple places this can be addressed. You could contact your TV vendor to fix the QAM scanning problem. You could contact KQED-HD to add the PSIP information back. Finally you could contact Comcast to try to alleviate the scanning problem by looking into the null channels and PSIP arrangement for what is being sent, maybe they can clean things up a little so your QAM tuner won't have troubles.

Now if you must have KQED-HD PSIP'd to 9.1, then you are going to have to complain to KQED about that because Comcast isn't the person responsible for adding the PSIP data and they won't be introducing it themselves. In the case of KQED-HD, missing PSIP is a KQED problem.

keenan

10-18-06, 03:18 PM

So I am not sure where this leaves us?

To clarify some good questions asked in this discussion.

- KQED-HD does in fact exist on my San Carlos service, at 117.1. But it has no PSIP so I can only get it by fat-fingering it in. I do not believe this represents an issue with my QAM tuner (or anybody elses)

- I believe that there are multiple unique COMCAST services in my area (even neighborhood). I happen to be in an 850 area with ALL channels.

- It also appears that COMCAST is hot and heavy into moving stations around right now in preparation to go ADS. A digital scan one night will show active channels that will have no signal the next day.

- I had KQED-HD for almost a year at 9.1. It went away about 2 months ago.

Seems KQED has the responsibility to supply a PSIP with the channel and they are not.

Seems COMCAST has the ability to ADD a PSIP and they are not.

Does your QAM tuner show any other .x channels when it does a scan? If not, then it's definitely a problem, or design issue, with your tuner.

I had KQED-HD at 9.1 also until they went with a cable specific feed. Now, nobody is getting PSIP data for KQED.

For a cable channel I don't believe PSIP data is required by the FCC. You have to remember, cable is not OTA, cable essentially "buys" all these channels and repackages them for "sale" to you, they can pretty much put them wherever they want.

10-18-06, 05:36 PM

- It also appears that COMCAST is hot and heavy into moving stations around right now in preparation to go ADS. A digital scan one night will show active channels that will have no signal the next day.

I think you were looking at an on-demand channel.

pappy97

10-18-06, 07:43 PM

hiker

10-18-06, 08:08 PM

keenan

10-18-06, 08:11 PM

I must be out of the loop but it looks like people here are getting the Tivo S3 and replacing their Comcast Dual Tuner HD-DVR with it.

How is that working out for people?

How is the PQ from HDMI?

Can the TIVO S3 output different resolutions like a Scientific Atlanta/Pioneer box or is it like Motorola where you have to set it to output all 720p or 1080i?

Any limitations to using Tivo S3 instead of a dual tuner HD-DVR from comcast? Can you still use/watch on-demand? Can you order and watch PPV's?
Works great for me, couldn't be happier.

IMO, PQ is noticeably better than the Comcast box.

The S3 will output Native(480i, 480p, 720p and 1080i). It will also output combinations of 1080i+480p, 720+480p, or fixed at any of the above formats.

No OnDemand or PPV.

Also it looks like Comcast has the billing squared away as well. When looking at my bill today at the Comcast site is says,

Please note: Comcast will charge $1.50 per month for the second CableCARD for customers who require two CableCARDS for customer owned digital video recorders("DVRs").

My 6412 is going back on 10/24 which is when my billing cycle starts.

Plus, the S3 has dual OTA-ATSC/NTSC tuners as well.

pappy97

10-18-06, 08:12 PM

RBurks

10-18-06, 08:18 PM

The reason KQED-HD doesn't show up in your channel scans *is* an issue with your QAM tuner. KQED-HD shows up for others (including me) in the channel scans.

I just get more confused the more I learn.

So if I have this straight. A 2006 Sony SXRD XBR1 QAM tuner is the problem? This TV was voted product of the year for 2006, but I am sure a messed up QAM tuner was summarily ignored by all the techies. Not one person on the SXRD thread has ever reported a problem with the QAM tuner. And others have posted in this thread that they have no problems using a SONY tuner, so it must be "my" TV.

I get lots of .x channels, including almost every channel from 35-150 or so. Yes, these are digital channels. No it is not On-Demand. I have no problems receiving digital channels, including every channel others have picked up. Just KQED.

I am just trying to keep facts straight here, and seems the facts are moving as we find out more about the problem.

Point being, 3 weeks ago I was told "my" QAM tuner was the problem. So now we have discovered KQED HD has no PSIP. Yes, it would be cool if my TV allowed my to capture a digital channel w/o a PSIP, but I assume SONY does not allow that for a reason - mega corporate agreements, and limiting free access to stuff people shouldn't have.

I guess maybe I haven't paid my dues like those who have posted 1000's of responses, but hey, I am just trying to find out what is wrong. Seems I haven't been wrong about the problems, but it sure feels like a lot of heat on my end.

hiker

10-18-06, 08:20 PM

Thanks for the info, but does anyone know when is Comcast supposed to come out with DVR's that use Tivo's software? I have never used cablecard, but I understand that Cablecard does not support on-demand so a better option for me would be comcast with tivo software.
I don't think there is a firm date yet, other than sometime in 2007. Here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=682350) is a thread about it.

keenan

10-18-06, 08:39 PM

I just get more confused the more I learn.

So if I have this straight. A 2006 Sony SXRD XBR1 QAM tuner is the problem? This TV was voted product of the year for 2006, but I am sure a messed up QAM tuner was summarily ignored by all the techies. Not one person on the SXRD thread has ever reported a problem with the QAM tuner. And others have posted in this thread that they have no problems using a SONY tuner, so it must be "my" TV.

I get lots of .x channels, including almost every channel from 35-150 or so. Yes, these are digital channels. No it is not On-Demand. I have no problems receiving digital channels, including every channel others have picked up. Just KQED.

I am just trying to keep facts straight here, and seems the facts are moving as we find out more about the problem.

Point being, 3 weeks ago I was told "my" QAM tuner was the problem. So now we have discovered KQED HD has no PSIP. Yes, it would be cool if my TV allowed my to capture a digital channel w/o a PSIP, but I assume SONY does not allow that for a reason - mega corporate agreements, and limiting free access to stuff people shouldn't have.

I guess maybe I haven't paid my dues like those who have posted 1000's of responses, but hey, I am just trying to find out what is wrong. Seems I haven't been wrong about the problems, but it sure feels like a lot of heat on my end.

Earlier you posted the following,

- KQED-HD does in fact exist on my San Carlos service, at 117.1. But it has no PSIP so I can only get it by fat-fingering it in. I do not believe this represents an issue with my QAM tuner (or anybody elses)

to clarify, do you in fact get KQED-HD by fat-fingering in the channel number? In your most recent post it seems as if you are not getting KQED-HD.

If you do get the channel I'm not sure what the problem is.

Are you saying a scan does not pick it up? You have to input the exact channel number to have it display?

sfhub

10-18-06, 08:46 PM

So if I have this straight. A 2006 Sony SXRD XBR1 QAM tuner is the problem? This TV was voted product of the year for 2006, but I am sure a messed up QAM tuner was summarily ignored by all the techies. Not one person on the SXRD thread has ever reported a problem with the QAM tuner. And others have posted in this thread that they have no problems using a SONY tuner, so it must be "my" TV.
...
Point being, 3 weeks ago I was told "my" QAM tuner was the problem. So now we have discovered KQED HD has no PSIP. Yes, it would be cool if my TV allowed my to capture a digital channel w/o a PSIP, but I assume SONY does not allow that for a reason - mega corporate agreements, and limiting free access to stuff people shouldn't have.

The product of the year 2006 award has zip, absolutely zero, bearing on this problem. There is a particular circumstance with respect to how the channels are setup on Comcast after the 24/7 KQED upgrade that is likely not present in 99% of the markets out there.

Your QAM tuner is not picking up KQED on a scan. It has nothing to do with PSIP being missing in and of itself. The proof is your Sony picks up other channels that do not have PSIP. 90% of the digital channels you are picking do not have PSIP but your QAM tuner has no problem picking them up. Do you have PSIP for KRON?

The problem has to do specifically with KQED-HD and KQED-SD, PSIP, null streams, etc. It is simply a circumstance most other people outside the bay area will not be seeing. The channel feed from KQED to Comcast is different because they have a separate feed for KQED-HD that sends 24/7 HD while the SD channels come from a feed for the OTA streams.

TPeterson is in your area and can pick up KQED-HD with a channel scan. My area is missing PSIP for KQED-HD and I can pick up KQED-HD on a channel scan. What does that tell you? Well, missing PSIP for KQED-HD is not forcing *all* QAM tuners to have problems with the scan. It is causing *your* tuner, and possibly other derivative tuners, to have problems.

Clearly your TV *is* able to tune the channel, it just decided to *skip* the channel during a scan. This coupled with the fact that others don't have problems with the channel scan should really tell you this problem is specific to your equipment.

Now the fix for the scan problem could be potentially implemented in different places, including your TV's QAM tuner scan, KQED adding full PSIP, or possibly Comcast cleaning up some of the null pointers.

The reason you feel like you are getting heat is you are ignoring some quite reasonable comments from folks that have a lot of experience with these types of problems and your reasoning is because your TV is the 2006 product of the year.

sfhub

10-18-06, 08:53 PM

to clarify, do you in fact get KQED-HD by fat-fingering in the channel number? In your most recent post it seems as if you are not getting KQED-HD.

If you do get the channel I'm not sure what the problem is.

Are you saying a scan does not pick it up? You have to input the exact channel number to have it display?
From my reading, that is exactly what he is saying.

My feeling as well as TPeterson's is the organization of the channels with the pointers to null streams and the KQED-SD multicast split onto multiple channels coupled with KQED-HD not having PSIP is causing the QAM tuner scan to get confused and skip KQED-HD.

His TV is capable of tuning the channel, just the channel scan got confused and skipped KQED-HD.

John Mace

10-18-06, 09:10 PM

I set up a series program for the new Battle Star Gallactica season, and something weird is happening: BSG shows the current episodes several times during the week, and like a lot of shows these don't show up as repeats in the guide, so they all get recorded. But... they don't show up on my DVR recording list for that day. It shows as a planned recording if I find the show on the guide for that day, but not on the scheduled recording list. Has anyone seen this? I haven't noticed this happening with other shows that repeat (like The Sopranos).

Of course, this wouldn't be a problem in the first place if the guide showed those programs as repeats in the first place.

TPeterson

10-18-06, 09:16 PM

RBurks--

The current situation with Comcast is far from the first time that KQED's experiments in DTV have caused heartburn for a subset of HDTV owners. And I expect that it may not be the last either, as they seem determined to live on the bleeding edge. ;)

RBurks

10-18-06, 09:40 PM

to clarify, do you in fact get KQED-HD by fat-fingering in the channel number?
Correct

Are you saying a scan does not pick it up?
Correct

You have to input the exact channel number to have it display?
Correct

And thank you for bearing with me on this. It has been frustrating.

RBurks

10-18-06, 09:50 PM

Clearly your TV *is* able to tune the channel, it just decided to *skip* the channel during a scan. This coupled with the fact that others don't have problems with the channel scan should really tell you this problem is specific to your equipment.

This is where I am struggling. Fat-Fingering I can see 117.1 - 117.5 (KQED-HD plus the KQED Digital channels). When I scan there is simply no channel identifier AT ALL for 117.x . There is for 117, but not any digital channels.

I am hard pressed to understand why this tuner would skip one set of digitial channels at 117, yet pick up digital channels as low as 78 and as hight as 123?

Maybe this says its the tuner, but I just have a hard time understanding how a tuner works at 116 and 118 and not at 117??? Has this happened to others?

And again, thanks.

TPeterson

10-18-06, 10:07 PM

Your tuner is working at 117! You can tune 117.1, 117.2, etc., right? You can even tune the KGO subchannels there (7.1-7.3) right?? It just can't decipher the PMT/PAT information regarding the KQED subs. Not to worry, that will be fixed by KQED+Comcast sometime. Until then, you'll just have to continue entering the full channel numbers.

sfhub

10-18-06, 10:31 PM

Maybe this says its the tuner, but I just have a hard time understanding how a tuner works at 116 and 118 and not at 117??? Has this happened to others?
How about this, I'm going to pass you 100 boxes. All the boxes will be labeled either "good channel" or "garbage channel". Put the boxes labelled "good channel" on the table and the "garbage channel" in the trash.

Now when you actually get the boxes, some boxes are labelled "00000". What should you do with the box, put it on the table or throw it away or ignore it?

Basically the way things are currently set up, with the channels on 117, your TV's tuner scan doesn't know what to do with it so it just ignores them.

The problem is the QAM tuner's scan function and how 117 is setup. The QAM tuner itself is working because you can tune the channels by hand.

QAM tuners from other manufacturers have been shown not to have a problem with how 117.x is setup.

fender4645

10-19-06, 02:18 AM

Mikef5

10-19-06, 01:23 PM

For those that follow the saga and drama that is the CableCARD, there was interesting article in Ars Tech this week that talks about where it currently stands (with the new S3) and the future of non-integrated STB's. It's scary what the cable companies will do to lobby against this (and who they get on their side)

http://arstechnica.com/articles/culture/tivo-cablecard.ars/1
Well, I can see the cable industries point on wanting waivers for their basic customers to aid in the transfer to all digital cable so that the analog holdouts can still get all the channels on their analog tv's. But I do agree with Tivo that it should be a limited waiver to only those people and that the box does only that, connect the digital cable to the customers analog tv... period.. no PPV, no VOD, no HDTV, no cable card support ... nothing else. If they want more then they need to upgrade their tv's to digital and come into the 21st Century.

What they really need to do is make these cable cards work with all products. They should hold both the manufactures and cable companys to the same standard specifications and have no deviation to those specifications. It's the only way to get these things to work right, you are already seeing what happens when they don't follow the specs with the problem with PSIP in some tuners and it's now happening with cable cards. Get the things to work right first, then when it's working right add your bells and whistles.

Laters,
Mikef5

rjcrum

10-19-06, 02:11 PM

I've had my 6412 for well over a year now, in Sunnyvale (still devoid of a number of the HD channels others receive) and I still have a few lingering problems that seem to be well known by people here (and Comcast), yet nothing seems to be done about fixing them. Do others have these problems...and if so, what (if anything) can be done?

1. I still suffer from the agonizing delays that occur when pressing buttons on the remote to navigate around the 6412 menus. I find it difficult to believe that his has been a known problem for, oh, 2 years...and Comcast has done nothing? Do others still have this problem, or is it unique to me?

2. I still get *very* regular audio and video breakups on HD channels, mostly on ABC 707 (Desperate Housewives), and CBS 705 (CSI). Audio symptoms: audio disappears, sometimes for minutes at at time--audio at beginning of show has no center channel, missing all dialogue--audio is in "plain stereo" at beginning of show and switched to DD minutes later. Video symptoms: very visible pixellating, sometimes going on for minutes (usually accompanied by no audio). Some version of these problems happen on probably 20% of the shows we watch. Unfortunately, I don't know (and don't know how I *could* know) if it is 1) a problem with my 6412 2) a problem with Comcast's delivery of the show 3) a problem with the local station's broadcast or 4) a problem with the national feed.

This latter problem is so bad that we still record every single show that we record in HD on the 6412 on one of two TiVos that we have. Sometimes we ride out the dropouts/breakups for a while, but after about a minute, we often trash the HD recording and go watch it in SD on a TiVo.

Does anybody else have these problems? I have had Comcast out to check signal levels, cabling, etc. and they all appear to be fine, so they say that isn't the problem. But...one never knows.

Bob

deeseeel

10-19-06, 03:30 PM

Rjcrum,

I'm in Sunnyvale too and I still have both of these problems. The latter seems to have gotten worse too.

nikeykid

10-19-06, 04:55 PM

isn't it exciting for non-550ers who like basketball?? there will be never ending HD bball this season (NBA and college) between FSN, TNT, ESPN, INHD, ABC, CBS...... drool!

bldxyz

10-19-06, 05:50 PM

Just wondering if it was my reception or the broadcast:

Did anyone else have the audio drop out for about 15 seconds on ABC's Lost during Locke's vision of the Sydney airport last night?

(Ignore this - I meant to post this to OTA)

John Mace

10-19-06, 05:55 PM

jasonander

10-19-06, 06:12 PM

Rjcrum,

I'm in Sunnyvale too and I still have both of these problems. The latter seems to have gotten worse too.

I'm also in Sunnyvale and am experiencing major pixelation/audio dropouts on all (or rather, the limited Comcast ghetto) HD channels but ABC. Everything was fine about a week ago, but every day the problem has gotten worse and more channels are unwatchable. A technician came to look at my wiring today and tried replacing the cable box, but he was unable to find anything wrong with the signal and the new cable box had the same problem. He said Sunnyvale was having problems with its HD channels, but it was fixed a couple of days ago. I've basically been left hanging here with only 1 HD channel working... I'm very tempted to give Dish a call.

rjcrum

10-19-06, 06:56 PM

Hmmm.... three for three.

Anyway we can get a message to Mr. Johnson of Comcast and ask him what's going on in Sunnyavle? I'm tired of having to take up the storage on my TiVo to make up for a Comcast/Motorola problem.

Bob

sans_abri

10-19-06, 09:10 PM

Please help! I've been reading this forum on and off for the past year or 2 and know how damn knowledgeable you guys are. I havent seen anyone mention this (altho i dont read all posts), but has anyone seen bad Comcast HD quality for NBC? I have the motorola DVR and I'm content with the quality of the HD channels... all except for NBC. For whatever reason, I get terrible ghosting with all prime time HD content on 703!!! It's driving me nuts! Granted, I understand my LCD set isnt the greatest and the response time is not fast, but I've had zero problems with all the other channels. I read a post that showed the average bandwidth 703 is giving and it seemed comparable to the rest of the major HD channels, so I don't know what it could be. Any ideas? Anyone else have low digital hd quality with NBC-703???

Thanks for any help!

fender4645

10-19-06, 09:51 PM

Well, I can see the cable industries point on wanting waivers for their basic customers to aid in the transfer to all digital cable so that the analog holdouts can still get all the channels on their analog tv's. But I do agree with Tivo that it should be a limited waiver to only those people and that the box does only that, connect the digital cable to the customers analog tv... period.. no PPV, no VOD, no HDTV, no cable card support ... nothing else. If they want more then they need to upgrade their tv's to digital and come into the 21st Century.

What they really need to do is make these cable cards work with all products. They should hold both the manufactures and cable companys to the same standard specifications and have no deviation to those specifications. It's the only way to get these things to work right, you are already seeing what happens when they don't follow the specs with the problem with PSIP in some tuners and it's now happening with cable cards. Get the things to work right first, then when it's working right add your bells and whistles.

Laters,
Mikef5

I agree. If the FCC starts granting waivers left and right, they're just saying they don't back up their own laws. What I'm not sure is why they think this will affect Tivo. Cable companies aren't asking to waive last year's law of making CableCARDs available to everyone...they're just asking that they not be required to ship boxes who's encryption is integrated. Cable companies will still be required to make CableCARDs available to customers. At least that's how I read it...

fender4645

10-19-06, 09:53 PM