Using the remote on the pvr to change channels, record, view tv listings etc is very slow at times.

Called Comcast CSR and they said to unplug pvr and wait for about a minute before plugging it back in.

I don't see this slowness in the non-pvr HD box I also have.

Is this a design flaw, or can it really be corrected without having to unplug/plug pvr box?

That really ticks me off...the fact the CSR tells you to unplug/plug in the box, losing all of your guide data for a day. This is a "temporary" fix to a problem that has been around for well over a year and it WILL come back. Sometimes it takes a few weeks, and sometimes it can be a few minutes. But it WILL come back.

The "losing your guide data after power down" has to be the biggest design flaw of the Moto STB. I hope the genius who made the decision to put all of the guide data in volatile memory has long since been let go. The only saving grace is that Comcast is eventually switching over to Panny STB's.

I just received some info from an Action Line writer and he said Comcast plans to release a firmware update during the first week of December to fix this.

I just received some info from an Action Line writer and he said Comcast plans to release a firmware update during the first week of December to fix this.

Comcast/Motorola have released several firmware updates since this problem came about. I'll believe it when I see it...

Will this "guide update" be coming to the DCT6200's on that date as well? I'm in south San Jose.

Typical Motorola, fix one thing, break something else.

For those that want to see what the new guide looks like and what the changes are here is the link to it. http://www.comcast.com/improvedguide

There are some nice features in it but it might of been better to wait until this HDMI problem was fixed first. I know it only affects some HDTV's but if it's one of the major brands like Sony that could be a real headache for Comcast. I guess we'll just have to wait until the 16th to see if it's a problem at all.

Laters,
Mikef5

Will this "guide update" be coming to the DCT6200's on that date as well? I'm in south San Jose.
Ace of Space,

Just got a response to your question and this update is for all boxes.

Laters,
Mikef5

All Digital channels. I live in Pacifica. Have 6412 just noticed all channels are now Digital. Got a new channel. SCFI on 160. It is at a 591 MHZ , Old SCFI at 75 is 651 MHZ. The STB no longer has any analog channels

Has comcast started encrypting the KQED digital channels (World, Life, and Kids)? They first moved to to another frequency after KQED-HD went 24/7. But now I cannot find them thru scanning any longer.

I think it was MikeSM that posted about this unit a few months ago, well, it's shipping and it looks like there's support for MythTV, SageTV and possibly some others. I'll probably be trying one out in about a week.

http://www.silicondust.com/zxc/content/view/5/26/
Silicondust Engineering - HDHomeRun

Anyone else still getting charged $6.95/mo. "digital additional outlet" AND the $1.50/mo. "Tivo digital access" just to use a single s3 tivo with 2 cablecards? Comcast at their 800 number refused to stop charging both fees. First they argued that the $6.95 is for the additional card, and when I mention that the Oct. statement clearly states that the $1.50 is for the additional card, they claim the $6.95 is for digital access. When I tell them my digital classic fee covers digital access the argument proceeds back to the beginning. They also tried claiming the fee was for DVR access and I reminded them I am not leasing a DVR from them or even getting VOD service. They then also try to refer me to a cable card fee justification on their web page but cannot reference an actual URL. I assume they are thinking of the vague statement here: http://www.comcast.com/Customers/FAQ/FaqDetails.ashx?Id=2651
"There is no additional charge for CableCARD service above what you currently pay for Digital Cable service (NOTE: additional outlet charges for programming may apply)."

Bottom line is they claim I cannot resolve this over the phone and must physically visit the local office to plead a case. WTF?

Here's hoping the M-card is coming soon...

For those that want to see what the new guide looks like and what the changes are here is the link to it. http://www.comcast.com/improvedguide

There are some nice features in it but it might of been better to wait until this HDMI problem was fixed first. I know it only affects some HDTV's but if it's one of the major brands like Sony that could be a real headache for Comcast. I guess we'll just have to wait until the 16th to see if it's a problem at all.

Laters,
Mikef5

looks like all those features where copied from the Dish VIP622 Guide ;)

although they've still got a few to go to catch up :)

Anyone else still getting charged $6.95/mo. "digital additional outlet" AND the $1.50/mo. "Tivo digital access" just to use a single s3 tivo with 2 cablecards?

Do you have any Comcast set top box? I'm paying for limited basic + $1.50 for two CableCards. No other fees. If I get another S3 with two more cards, then I would have to pay additional $6.95 + $1.50.

Do you have any Comcast set top box? I'm paying for limited basic + $1.50 for two CableCards. No other fees. If I get another S3 with two more cards, then I would have to pay additional $6.95 + $1.50.No the s3 is my only cable tv box/tuner/whatever. I didn't get any equipment from comcast.

No the s3 is my only cable tv box/tuner/whatever. I didn't get any equipment from comcast.
I would go to the office, their software should have all the correct billing codes/listings. I just went today to pay my bill and the CSR went through my bill while it was on the screen. With just a S3 you should be paying for only one CC at $1.50 per month, the first one is part of the subscription price. I have Limited Basic and my total bill will be $19.37, including fees and taxes.

looks like all those features where copied from the Dish VIP622 Guide ;)

although they've still got a few to go to catch up :)
Out of all the UIs I've used on different DVRs, I like the Dish interface the best. It's fast, intelligently set up and gives you what you want to know quickly and easily.

I see Universal HD showing up in the program guide. When I select the channel it states I am not authorized to view it even though I subscribe to everything they have. I assume it will be available shortly. Is this channel going to stick or it there some special event coming up that UHD will be covering.

I see Universal HD showing up in the program guide. When I select the channel it states I am not authorized to view it even though I subscribe to everything they have. I assume it will be available shortly. Is this channel going to stick or it there some special event coming up that UHD will be covering.

I have it also on channel 727 in Rohnert Park, and have the same not authorized message. This is exactly what happened when they added MHD a few weeks back. It authorized a few hours later on its own. We were told by Mr. J a while back that UHD would return to us on a permanent basis in the future. I'd say the future is now.....

Yeah I noticed I have UHD on my guide as well, on channel 727. It's not authorized, but new HD additions are usually like that until mid-day, and they they become authorized.

Interesting of Comcast to add this, I guess it would mean that it's going to stay since there's no special event that they'd add it for. If it does stay, that would make 4 HD channels they've added this year.

Anyone know if Cupertino will get MHD or UHD?

We have TNTHD on 726 but it's not authorized.

I'm on basic but I get ESPN and ESPN2 HD, DHD and FSBA HD.

EDIT:

Right after I post the above, I went to check and now I can tune to 727 and 728.

However, those new channels are "Not Authorized."

But 726, which used to be "Not Authorized" is now saying "One Moment Please" and "This channel should be available shortly."

So I've gotten "Not Authorized" on the ESPN and DHD channels before and they came back.

Anyone else on basic getting these new channels, TNTHD, UHD and MHD?

UHD is now authorized in San Francisco. Looks grainy, although that might be the program that's currently on.

Are you getting UHD authorized on a basic subscription or some Digital package?

If you have Digital, you should be getting it. But it's more significant for many of us if you get it with Basic.

I have a subscription to Digital Silver, so yeah I'm getting it like I should be. I checked, and right now it's not encrypted so technically everyone should be getting it. But those people who are just on the basic subscription, they probably won't get it. Comcast puts most of their new HD channels on the Digital Classic tier.

Getting UHD 727 with DCT-6200 and TiVo S3 with Limited Basic + Digital Classic tier. I wonder if this is permanent?

Limited Basic?

Is that the same as Basic, which is the cheapest plan?

Then there is Expanded Basic? Then the Digital tiers?

UHD is back! now we can't complain about comcast taking one HD channel and putting another one on.

Limited Basic?

Is that the same as Basic, which is the cheapest plan?

Then there is Expanded Basic? Then the Digital tiers?
Standard Cable = Limited Basic + Expanded Basic
You can get Limited Basic ($15.80/mo. here) without Expanded Basic but Expanded Basic can't be subscribed by itself (must be subscribed with Limited Basic).

So can anyone report if they're getting the new channels on just Limited Basic?

Would be good to know.

So can anyone report if they're getting the new channels on just Limited Basic?

Would be good to know.
The only HD you should be getting with just Limited Basic would be the local channels, the rest would require Digital Classic or something higher, although, I'm still getting ESPN-HD and Discovery-HD currently with just Limited Basic here in Santa Rosa. Not a bad deal, the 5 local HD and the above 2 HD for $19 a month. :p

It looks like this section of the first post needs to be updated. Let me know what needs to be added and changed. I have no idea as on my ghetto system we only get ESPN and Discovery on the digital tier.



719 INHD (encrypted in most areas) 1080i
720 INHD2 (encrypted in most areas) 1080i (FSNBA-HD see note below)

FSN Bay Area HD (some Warriors, A's and Giants games inserted onto 720, pre-empting INHD2 programming) FSN Bay Area Website-- HD Schedule

722 Discovery HD Theater 1080i & DD 5.1
723 ESPN HD (encrypted in most areas) 720p & DD 5.1
725 ESPN2 HD (encrypted) 720p & DD 5.1
HD Special Events
-- NFL Channel HD (NFL Game of the Week, Weds. and Thurs. Evenings)
-- INHD programming (third INHD feed) whenever NBA game is on INHD
-- Other HD programming TBA

It looks like this section of the first post needs to be updated. Let me know what needs to be added and changed. I have no idea as on my ghetto system we only get ESPN and Discovery on the digital tier.



719 INHD (encrypted in most areas) 1080i
720 INHD2 (encrypted in most areas) 1080i (FSNBA-HD see note below)

FSN Bay Area HD (some Warriors, A's and Giants games inserted onto 720, pre-empting INHD2 programming) FSN Bay Area Website-- HD Schedule

722 Discovery HD Theater 1080i & DD 5.1
723 ESPN HD (encrypted in most areas) 720p & DD 5.1
725 ESPN2 HD (encrypted) 720p & DD 5.1
HD Special Events
-- NFL Channel HD (NFL Game of the Week, Weds. and Thurs. Evenings)
-- INHD programming (third INHD feed) whenever NBA game is on INHD
-- Other HD programming TBA

ESPN2HD is on 724
+ 725 NFL network (1080i, i think 5.1)
+ 726 TNTHD 1080i, DD5.1
+ 727 UHD 1080i, DD5.1
+ 728 MHD 1080i, DD5.1

BTW, National Geographic-HD and A&E-HD were lit up on Comcast Detroit today.

ESPN2HD is on 724
+ 725 NFL network (1080i, i think 5.1)
+ 726 TNTHD 1080i, DD5.1
+ 727 UHD 1080i, DD5.1
+ 728 MHD 1080i, DD5.1
What about INHD, isn't there just one of them now?

+ 725 NFL network (1080i, i think 5.1)


Does anyone know if we're actually gonna get the NFL Network's exclusive
live HD games starting this Thanksgiving night? I haven't seen anything on this channel lately,
and I thought we were supposed to get HD "Game of the Week" clips on Tuesdays and Wednesdays.......

Does anyone know if we're actually gonna get the NFL Network's exclusive
live HD games starting this Thanksgiving night? I haven't seen anything on this channel lately,
and I thought we were supposed to get HD "Game of the Week" clips on Tuesdays and Wednesdays.......

ch. 725 is showing the scheduled game of the week now, so perhaps that bodes well for next week ...

What about INHD, isn't there just one of them now?
Yes, here only one now. Chan 720 is FSNHD and shows no INHD2 programming anymore, only a FSNHD logo when no game is on. FSNHD ocassionally shows a college football game on Sat.

FSN Bay Area HD (some Warriors, A's and Giants games inserted onto 720, pre-empting INHD2 programming) FSN Bay Area Website-- HD Schedule


As I'm in the Sunnyvale 550MHz ghetto, I can't confirm this, but I believe the Sharks also end up on FSN Bay Area HD on occasion.

ch. 725 is showing the scheduled game of the week now, so perhaps that bodes well for next week ...

In HD?
(I'm not in front of my TV right now)

In HD?
(I'm not in front of my TV right now)

i've seen replays of games in HD on 725 at odd times this season. 725 will have the "exclusive" thursday and saturday games in HD.

Yes, here only one now. Chan 720 is FSNHD and shows no INHD2 programming anymore, only a FSNHD logo when no game is on. FSNHD ocassionally shows a college football game on Sat.
So 719 remains INHD and 720 is only live when there's a FSNBA-HD game? That seems like a waste of bandwidth.

Wow, I can't believe the disparity in systems, for $9.95 you guys get the following:

719 INHD
720 FSNBA-HD
722 Discovery HD Theater
723 ESPN HD
724 ESPN2-HD
725 NFL Network
726 TNT-HD
727 Universal-HD
728 MTV-HD

While for the same $9.95 we get:

722 Discovery HD Theater
723 ESPN HD

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

It looks like the below is what will replace INHD2,

http://www.tvweek.com/news.cms?newsId=11076
TV Week

BTW, check out the Detroit lineup,

199 National Geographic HD
200 A&E HD
201 Fox Sports Net Detroit HD
202 ESPN HD
203 ESPN2 HD
204 TNT HD
205 Discovery HD
206 INHD (MLB, Versus NHL, NBA HD, NFL Network)
208 Universal HD
209 MHD
215 HBO HD
219 Cinemax HD
223 Showtime HD
227 Starz HD
231 ABC HD WXYZ-DT
232 NBC HD WDIV-DT
233 CBS HD WWJ-DT
234 FOX HD WJBK-DT
235 My Network TV HD WMYD-DT
236 The CW HD WKBD-DT
240 PBS HD WTVS-DT

Comcast Santa Rosa simply sucks....

Ha ha!!! But we have KRON-HD!!!!! :D

Ha ha!!! But we have KRON-HD!!!!! :D

I think that is basically "My Network TV HD".

That would be their WMYD...they also get their CW station....



I still can't get over the difference in bay area systems, either we're getting screwed, or we're getting screwed, here in Santa Rosa.... :p :D

NFL Network...
So some of you in the Bay Area have actually seen something on here in the last month?

When we first got it, I was able to watch a few games. Some were in HD, and at least 1 was in SD(Like ESPNHD does sometimes). The last couple of weeks, I have tuned to it when the guide said a Football game would be on, and I have always seen the stupid INHD logo.

FSNBA HD..Is there a better place to get info on upcoming coverage than the guide? I seem to have "found" several events on even when the guide said "Off Air"

I am in Santa Clara. Any ideas?

Thanks.

p.s. My Guide says the N.O. vs Pittsburgh is on right now...I am still getting the annoying INHD logo..anyone else?

Anyone here using SageTV with either the MyHD or the Fusion QAM tuner cards? I'm looking for comments on which card works the best with Sage and Comcast.

Thanks.
Does SAGE support QAM nowadays? I went to their site after seeing your question, and their FAQ only mentions OTA tuners using BDA drivers...not QAM tuners..

I would LOVE to be able to find a useable QAM solution for my FusionHD5

EDIT: I just installed and set up SAGE and could not find any option for QAM.

So can anyone report if they're getting the new channels on just Limited Basic?


I have limited basic + 5$ "HDTV Service" in San Jose north area. The following are not authorized for me:
TNT-HD
UHD
MTV-HD
When I called Comcast, CSR said "Digital Classic" will not authorize me for these channels. When Comcast adds NG-HD, I hope to get it with Digital classic.

Hmmm. TNT-HD is part of digital classic in Mountain View.

$5 is not really HDTV service. It's just rental fee for the HD set top box.

How much is Digital Classic at least like $40-45?

I guess they wised up after leaving ESPN-HD and DHD open to the Limited Basic subscribers.

But then again, they did add ESPN2 HD, NFL HD, InHD, FSNHD to Limited Basic. They even left UHD for a time too IIRC.

Digital classic is $10/month that can be added to limited basic. All of those channels are now encrypted in Mountain View.

Hmmm. TNT-HD is part of digital classic in Mountain View.
$5 is not really HDTV service. It's just rental fee for the HD set top box.
How about MHD and UHD for you? I don't care much about these 3 channels but don't mind having more HD in general. I think I will actually add Digital Classic and see what happens.

Digital classic is $10/month that can be added to limited basic. All of those channels are now encrypted in Mountain View.
In Fremont last time I tried a few months back, I was not permitted to add Digital Classic on top of limited basic - just extended basic. I had tried two other times prior to that also without success. So I guess it depends on where you live.

peter

How about MHD and UHD for you? I don't care much about these 3 channels but don't mind having more HD in general. I think I will actually add Digital Classic and see what happens.

i have standard + digital classic and i get TNT, UHD and MHD.

I canceled digital classic before MHD and UHD were added, so I don't know.

In Fremont last time I tried a few months back, I was not permitted to add Digital Classic on top of limited basic - just extended basic. I had tried two other times prior to that also without success. So I guess it depends on where you live.

peter

Have you tried calling Comcast? The Mountain View office didn't let me, but the phone CSR had no problem with it.

$5 is not really HDTV service. It's just rental fee for the HD set top box.
Does it mean people with limited Basic and CableCARD (with Tivo S3) get Discovery HD, ESPN 1/2, FSNHD, INHD etc? I thought $5 covered these channels along with the box.

Does it mean people with limited Basic and CableCARD (with Tivo S3) get Discovery HD, ESPN 1/2, FSNHD, INHD etc? I thought $5 covered these channels along with the box.

Only if those channels are not encrypted. Any QAM tuner can pick up unencrypted channels. The $5 fee does not give you any additional channels.

thanks. that is surprising. So only way to get encrypted ESPN with limitedBasic is to get 6200 box?

No. The only way to get encrypted channel is to pay for it (unless you know how to break the encryption).

I am lost. On my 6200 box, Discovery HD, ESPN, INHD etc are all encrypted and I get them. Not sure if that comes under "paying" or "breaking".

I am lost. On my 6200 box, Discovery HD, ESPN, INHD etc all are all encrypted and I get them. Not sure if that comes under "paying" or "breaking".

if you have been a "longtime" HD subscriber, you may be grandfathered in to receive these channels.

for anyone else, they need to pay $9.95 for digital classic whether they have a 6200 or cablecard to decrypt these channels.

They even left UHD for a time too IIRC.
UHD was not really "left", last time around. When they added it temporarily last time for whatever event it was, it wasn't encrypted so anyone could get it.

I'm in the slums of Sunnyvale, where I get my HD through an Elgato 500 Mac tuner hooked in through Clear QAM.

KGO-TV-HD and KQED-HD are out for me. There are a lot of new encrypted digital channels, and I get KTVU-HD, KPIX-HD, KNTV-HD & KNTV-Weather, and the blasted bandwidth wasting KQED SD subchannels. (I guess Bay Area kids really need to be able to watch "Clifford the Big Red Dog" at 3:30 at night....)

Anyone else in the same boat? I'd switch to E*, but I can't hook that up to my Mac, and I like being able to burn DVDs with shows or sporting events I want to archive.

New person to the forum here. Thanks everyone for all of the great info. Now let me give you guys the HD skinny from my location in Oakland.

After being an analog subscriber for years, I've made the jump to Digital Classic. Before, I was receiving all of the local HD channels via the QAM tuner (By the way, does anyone know if KBCW will transition to HD anytime soon?). With the jump to digital, I'm now also receiving the following:

719: InHD
720: FSN HD (off air except for the occasional game)
722: Discovery HD Theater
723: ESPNHD
724: ESPN2HD
725: HD Special Events (seems to be off air all the time, but the intent seems to be the airing of the occasional NFL Network broadcast).
726: TNT HD
727: Universal HD (just came on air today, I believe)
728: MHD

Contrary to what some have stated on this board, I was told by Comcast that a digital tier is required to receive the cable HD networks. In fact, none of them were in the clear on my set prior to my going digital.

I also am renting a Motorola 3416 (which, by the way, I haven't seen any discussion of), which is an HD DVR with 160 gb hard drive. This is an additional $9.95/month on top of Digital Classic, which is $59.20. If I opted for no DVR, the HD box would have been just $5/month.

if you have been a "longtime" HD subscriber, you may be grandfathered in to receive these channels.
for anyone else, they need to pay $9.95 for digital classic whether they have a 6200 or cablecard to decrypt these channels.
Thanks. I had 6200 for an year. As long as Digital Classic gives these channels, its not bad. Discovery HD and ESPN are a must I think.

Does SAGE support QAM nowadays? I went to their site after seeing your question, and their FAQ only mentions OTA tuners using BDA drivers...not QAM tuners..

I would LOVE to be able to find a useable QAM solution for my FusionHD5

EDIT: I just installed and set up SAGE and could not find any option for QAM.
SiliconDust is working with the Sage folks right now on QAM. If you go to the SiliconDust site there's a forum specifically for Sage and I believe it is working now and they're working on the EPG portion of it.

You'll have to register for the Sage forum section and then you'll see it, and be able to access it at the following link.

http://www.silicondust.com/forum/index.php
Silicondust :: Index

Following link tells you how to join.

http://www.silicondust.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1985
Silicondust :: View topic - SageTV

I looked up some past threads on PSIP mappings of KNTV and none address the issue I'm having. For some reason (and I'm in Oakland) KNTV maps to 7.1 on my Mitsubishi set when it should be 3.1 or 11.1. So what I have now are KNTV and KGO occupying 7.1, which is retarded. I've rerun the channel scan, but it didn't help things. And to compound things, the PSIP channel titles and program titles are incorrect for some of the locals.

And by the way, I've been reading that some of you are or have been getting ESPNHD and/or Discovery HD in the clear. I can tell you guys that in Oakland, that is not the case. The only HDs in the clear here are the locals.

if you have been a "longtime" HD subscriber, you may be grandfathered in to receive these channels.


Wasn't this proven to be false? I remember Mr. J saying this would be case but it turned out not to be so. There is no way to un-encrypt them for internal QAM tuners with displays.

I looked up some past threads on PSIP mappings of KNTV and none address the issue I'm having. For some reason (and I'm in Oakland) KNTV maps to 7.1 on my Mitsubishi set when it should be 3.1 or 11.1. So what I have now are KNTV and KGO occupying 7.1, which is retarded. I've rerun the channel scan, but it didn't help things. And to compound things, the PSIP channel titles and program titles are incorrect for some of the locals.

And by the way, I've been reading that some of you are or have been getting ESPNHD and/or Discovery HD in the clear. I can tell you guys that in Oakland, that is not the case. The only HDs in the clear here are the locals.
Someone from your area will have to respond on the channel mapping problem as they are different system to system.

BTW, KBCW has been HD for a quite awhile, Comcast just doesn't carry it yet.

Woke up this morning and found my cable box turned off. Turned it and noticed that it had downloaded the new version of the I-guide over night. I've played around with it a bit, and all the promised changes are there, such as the On Demand time remaining timer, screen saver, etc. Only thing that's missing is Comcast Central.

Two more things I noticed are that after playing with the Diagnostics menu, it says the USB port is enabled. No idea if that means anything, or if it'll do anything, but that's what it says. The second thing is, after the guide update, my 6412 PII is noticeably slower than it was before. Anyone else notice this?

New person to the forum here. Thanks everyone for all of the great info. Now let me give you guys the HD skinny from my location in Oakland.

After being an analog subscriber for years, I've made the jump to Digital Classic. .
Did you add Digital Classic on to a limited basic (~$15 / month) or extended basic ((~$40 / month) service?

Thanks

Peter
p.s. to c3
> Have you tried calling Comcast? The Mountain View office didn't let me,
> but the phone CSR had no problem with it.
>
I called the Comcast number on several occasions and always the same answer - I could only add Digital Classic on top of Extended Basic

Another HD channel coming to Comcast in Jan???
Some sort of Golf/Vs/G4 Hybrid...

http://www.tvweek.com/news.cms?newsId=11076

Did you add Digital Classic on to a limited basic (~$15 / month) or extended basic ((~$40 / month) service?


We added Digital Classic on top of Extended Basic. I believe Extended Basic is required for any digital tier. I assume that because they advertise $59.20 for the "whole package", which obviously includes Extended Basic.

Limited Basic: 20.99
Extended Basic: 28.26
Digital Classic: 9.95
Total: 59.20

Yeah, I have a feeling Oakland gets charged a bit more than most parts of the Bay Area. I'd totally consider DirecTV if it was feasible to have in my apartment.

That new channel coming next year (Golf Channel/Versus) is nice for the golf and hockey, but how about adding HDNet and HDNet Movies like almost every other major cable/satellite operator.

Woke up this morning and found my cable box turned off. Turned it and noticed that it had downloaded the new version of the I-guide over night. I've played around with it a bit, and all the promised changes are there, such as the On Demand time remaining timer, screen saver, etc. Only thing that's missing is Comcast Central.

Two more things I noticed are that after playing with the Diagnostics menu, it says the USB port is enabled. No idea if that means anything, or if it'll do anything, but that's what it says. The second thing is, after the guide update, my 6412 PII is noticeably slower than it was before. Anyone else notice this?

Recieved the update here as well. Haven't noticed any slow down on the 3412 -- if anything it's a bit faster. Having to do 2 "clicks" to get to My Recordings may take a little while to get used to. Having the show info say 'HD' is benefitial -- we'll see how accurate this is though.

We added Digital Classic on top of Extended Basic. I believe Extended Basic is required for any digital tier. I assume that because they advertise $59.20 for the "whole package", which obviously includes Extended Basic.

Limited Basic: 20.99
Extended Basic: 28.26
Digital Classic: 9.95
Total: 59.20

Yeah, I have a feeling Oakland gets charged a bit more than most parts of the Bay Area. I'd totally consider DirecTV if it was feasible to have in my apartment.
You don't have to have Expanded Basic to add Digital Classic. You do have to have Expanded Basic if you want the Comcast DVR, but with the non-DVR-STB it's not required.

And yes, those rates for Oakland are high, your Limited Basic rate is about 25% higher than it is here in Santa Rosa.

Wasn't this proven to be false? I remember Mr. J saying this would be case but it turned out not to be so. There is no way to un-encrypt them for internal QAM tuners with displays.
It is false that grandfathered plans allow those channels to work with QAM-only tuners despite what was implied as possible by Mr. J's info.

However I think the reply above was qualified to explain why someone with a DCT-6200 was getting those channels.

It is false that grandfathered plans allow those channels to work with QAM-only tuners despite what was implied as possible by Mr. J's info.

However I think the reply above was qualified to explain why someone with a DCT-6200 was getting those channels.
That's what I thought. Someone with CableCARDS though should be able to get them if they were "grandfathered".

What were/are the circumstances that qualified you as grandfathered? This thread is way to big to find it, but if someone does, I'll get it posted in the first post.

Okay, I found the original post. There's a lot of discussion in the posts following this one.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6344279&highlight=grandfathered#post6344279
San Francisco, CA - Comcast - AVS Forum

Here is a message from Comcast about all the channels on their systems and what is going to happen to them tomorrow.
____________________________________________________________ _____________

You may post this information on the Forum

HD Channels to be encrypted on October 13th at 4:00am

Overview: Comcast will be encrypting our digital tier HD channels (ESPN HD, Discovery HD, INHD1, INHD2 and HDSE), wherever they are carried, so that new customers will only be able to view those channels if they subscribe to the appropriate level of service.

Existing HDTV customers will be “grandfathered” and WILL NOT be impacted by this change.

Customers who subscribed to HDTV service prior to 10/13/05 will be considered "grandfathered" and will not have their HD channel encrypted, regardless of their level of service.

If “grandfathered” HD customers move across town they will be able to transfer their HD service authorizations to their new location. Should they move outside of the Bay Area, to another state, for example, you will not be able to retain these services.

Customers Affected: This will affect new customers who receive an HD or DVR box, CableCARD customers, or digital television with a 256 QAM tuner and do not subscribe to the necessary minimum level of service.

Why This Is Happening: Digital tier HD channels are currently available, in error, to any customer who has an HD or DVR box, CableCARD television, or digital television with a 256 QAM tuner in it hooked up to cable. These HD channels are considered “satellite" HD channels and should have been viewable only to people with Digital Classic or higher.

(Please see additional explanation and definition of “satellite” channels, etc. below).

There are three (3) different types of HDTV Channels. The HD channels a customer receives are dependant upon the level of service a customer subscribes to. The three (3) types of channels are:

· Broadcast - The HD Format channels of broadcast networks like ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, & PBS.
· Premium - The HD Format channels of premium networks, like HBO & Showtime.
· “Satellite”
o The HD Format channels of other networks, like ESPN HD or Discovery HD

OR

o The HD Format channels not tied to a specific network, like INHD1 & INHD2.

There are three (3) levels of service associated with the three (3) different Channel Types. The following levels of service apply to the above listed HDTV Channel types.

· Broadcast – Level of Service: Customers must lease an HDTV box to access these channels. They do not need to subscribe to Digital Cable.

· Premium – Level of Service: Customers must lease an HDTV box, and subscribe to the Digital Premium Channel which they want to receive.

· Satellite – Level of Service: Customers must lease an HDTV box, and subscribe to a minimum of Digital Classic in order to receive these channels.

Here is a chart that outlines the details discussed above.



Customer Receives Customer Subscribes to Basic Cable and HDTV Customer Subscribes to Standard Cable and HDTV Customer Subscribes to Digital Cable and HDTV
Local HD Broadcast Channels – ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, PBS Yes Yes Yes
National (Satellite) HD Content – ESPN HD, Discovery HD, INHD, INHD2, HDSE No No Yes
HD Pay (Premium) Channels – HBO, Showtime, Starz and Cinemax Yes* Yes* Yes*


Remember, customers only receive the HD Pay Channel if they currently subscribe to the corresponding pay Channel – e.g., only HBO subscribers will receive HBO in HD.
____________________________________________________________ __

Call or write to your local Comcast provider to express your views on this matter. This effectively makes all intergrated tuners on tvs useless or external boxes like the LG 4200 useless. Cable cards are still one way and you would lose their cable guide, VOD and other services that require two way communications.
I am not a happy camper
Again this is a national thing from Comcast and not a local thing and not Mr. J's idea but Comcast's idea.

So Directv, Dish and now Comcast all require you to have their box to view their programming.... not good.

Laters,
Mikef5


The way I understand the above, is, since I received ESPN-HD and Discovery-HD with just the QAM tuner in my display, meaning with only a Limited Basic sub, I should still get those channels with a CableCARD equipped device such as the TiVo S3.

Does that sound right?

I'm still getting them now with just a Limited Basic sub but I believe that is because the service date for the last bill I paid was through Nov 24. My understanding is that after that date, my CableCARDS should still pass those channels, even without having a Digital Classic sub.

That's what I thought. Someone with CableCARDS though should be able to get them if they were "grandfathered".

What were/are the circumstances that qualified you as grandfathered? This thread is way to big to find it, but if someone does, I'll get it posted in the first post.

Okay, I found the original post. There's a lot of discussion in the posts following this one.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6344279&highlight=grandfathered#post6344279
San Francisco, CA - Comcast - AVS Forum



The way I understand the above, is, since I received ESPN-HD and Discovery-HD with just the QAM tuner in my display, meaning with only a Limited Basic sub, I should still get those channels with a CableCARD equipped device such as the TiVo S3.

Does that sound right?

I'm still getting them now with just a Limited Basic sub but I believe that is because the service date for the last bill I paid was through Nov 24. My understanding is that after that date, my CableCARDS should still pass those channels, even without having a Digital Classic sub.
I *think* the grandfather clause only applies if you haven't changed your HD sub at all since 10/13/05. I *think* if you move to digital classic and back, you likely have lost your grandfather status, despite being older and wiser. I *think* the reason this happens is the computer won't allow you to get on the grandfather profile after you lose it by going digital classic. Maybe you could argue and have someone override that behavior.

Even if you aren't grandfathered though, you could be getting those channels depending on how things are configured in your area. I don't know if you are guaranteed to get unencrypted channels with CableCARD. I seem to recall people mentioning they had a reduction in channels after getting CableCARD. I don't know if that was an implementation problem or configuration problem on Comcast's side.

I think as usual your mileage will vary and I'm sure people have different experiences regarding grandfathering.

I *think* the grandfather clause only applies if you haven't changed your HD sub at all since 10/13/05. I *think* if you move to digital classic and back, you likely have lost your grandfather status, despite being older and wiser. I *think* the reason this happens is the computer won't allow you to get on the grandfather profile after you lose it by going digital classic. Maybe you could argue and have someone override that behavior.

Even if you aren't grandfathered though, you could be getting those channels depending on how things are configured in your area. I don't know if you are guaranteed to get unencrypted channels with CableCARD. I seem to recall people mentioning they had a reduction in channels after getting CableCARD. I don't know if that was an implementation problem or configuration problem on Comcast's side.

I think as usual your mileage will vary and I'm sure people have different experiences regarding grandfathering.
I *think* you're probably right on all counts. :) I will pursue it though if that's what happens. The only reason I got Digital Classic in the first place was to qualify for the DVR. I was the first or second Comcast customer in Santa Rosa to even have HD from them and at the time, both ESPN and Disc were in the clear. Currently Disc is still in the clear.

Also I got my HDTV and DCT 6200 after Oct 13 2005 (in late Nov 2005) and I am fortunately authorized for channels before TNT-HD. I don't have Digital Classic. I guess one the following is working for me:
1. somehow grandfathered.
2. Implicitly Comcast is authornizing these channels on DTC 6200s but not on CableCARDS. (Is there any one with 6200 without these channels?)
3. Some error on comcast side.

You don't have to have Expanded Basic to add Digital Classic. You do have to have Expanded Basic if you want the Comcast DVR, but with the non-DVR-STB it's not required.
...
I think this might have changed. I have Limited Basic and Digital Classic but I have had those for a couple of years now.

Another poster mentioned that he thought Expanded Basic was a requirement for Digital Classic and I think so too. Here's why...
When I went into the local office back in Sept. to inquire about cablecards for the S3, I told the lady there that I had only Limited Basic and Digital Classic. She said that wasn't possible and told me that to get any digital pkg. that Standard Cable was required. She had to look at my account on the computer to verify what I was saying and then said I must have gotten that combination before the requirement.

So anyone tried lately?

On the new downloaded I guide....the guide doesnt stretch the entire length of the screen....anyone else experience this and possibly know how to change it to the way it was? Im also not liking this two click process to get to the my recorded shows.

Called Comcast about why not receving MHD and UHD. Lots of "grandfathered" thrown in, but in the end they agreed I should be receving these channels. So maybe everybody who is grandfathered should?

BTW - I was basically told to shut up and listen because he knew everything about the situation and grandfathered packages do NOT get any new channels. He went off to check something, and then got back on the line and said he was sending the authorization to my box. Would not explain.

Really interesting because this is the 3rd time they have sent updates to my 6412 III. First two did nothing. But at least have gotten the same answer to "granfathered" packages having access to MHD and UHD.

You don't have to have Expanded Basic to add Digital Classic. You do have to have Expanded Basic if you want the Comcast DVR, but with the non-DVR-STB it's not required.

And yes, those rates for Oakland are high, your Limited Basic rate is about 25% higher than it is here in Santa Rosa.

I'm somewhat confused. I'm also in the Oakland area, and currently have analog standard cable (with ESPN, CNN, etc.). Will I be able to get unencrypted (in the clear) HD channels (including ESPNHD) through my cable wire from the wall? It sounds like I should because I'm already subscribing to ESPN.

Would I need to upgrade to a digital cable package, rent the HD STB, or both?

Wasn't this proven to be false? I remember Mr. J saying this would be case but it turned out not to be so. There is no way to un-encrypt them for internal QAM tuners with displays.

clarification: i think what was true was that if you were paying $5/mo for the HD box, you were grandfathered into the channels that now require Digital Classic or above.

the grandfathering did not work for people with a QAM tuner since they weren't "subscribing" to any HD...

EDIT: sorry for the redundancy, i hsould have read the rest of the thread before responding...sounds like everyone now has this clearly...

I'm reluctant to press for getting Digital Classic for just $10 more on my Limited Basic sub.

They may decide I shouldn't be getting ESPN HD, DHD, etc.

I think this might have changed. I have Limited Basic and Digital Classic but I have had those for a couple of years now.

Another poster mentioned that he thought Expanded Basic was a requirement for Digital Classic and I think so too. Here's why...
When I went into the local office back in Sept. to inquire about cablecards for the S3, I told the lady there that I had only Limited Basic and Digital Classic. She said that wasn't possible and told me that to get any digital pkg. that Standard Cable was required. She had to look at my account on the computer to verify what I was saying and then said I must have gotten that combination before the requirement.

So anyone tried lately?
I just called Comcast and spoke to the lovely Melissa.

The good news (at least for me in Fremont) is that there appears to have been a policy change - and I can now add the Digital Classic Tier to my limited basic subscription for a total of around $20 / month plus a one-time charge of $15.99.

Now I wonder if I can get Discovery-HD and INHD for this price, or do I have to also pay the $5 HD fee? These are the only HD channels I am interested in.

peter

$20 is too much. These aren't even premium channels.

$20 is too much. These aren't even premium channels.
The $20 includes the basic cable and the Digital Classic Tier.

peter

Oh I thought it was $20 above limited basic, which is like about $15 before taxes.

The $20 includes the basic cable and the Digital Classic Tier.

peter

That doesn't sound right. Digital classic is $10. Your limited basic is only $10? Limited basic is going up to $20 in Mountain View.

It looks like the new software has at least fixed the issue where you go from an HD channel to an SD channel, the picture "pops" until you've paused, FF, RW the program. I guess we'll have to wait a few days to see if the remote lag is gone (although I'm not holding my breathe).

Keenan, when you get a chance the first post should be updated with the new guide version (v. 74.53) and the 3412's firmware is 16.20.

I'm somewhat confused. I'm also in the Oakland area, and currently have analog standard cable (with ESPN, CNN, etc.). Will I be able to get unencrypted (in the clear) HD channels (including ESPNHD) through my cable wire from the wall? It sounds like I should because I'm already subscribing to ESPN.

Would I need to upgrade to a digital cable package, rent the HD STB, or both?

Bill, you will not be able to get ESPNHD nor any of the cable HD networks in the clear in Oakland. Per that long Comcast note that someone just posted, you'll have to subscribe to Digital Classic and rent an HD box ($5 for non-DVR, $9.95 for DVR). Or, get a CableCard from the company. Though, according to one poster, if you opt for the non-DVR HD box, you might be able to drop the Extended Basic (leaving just the Limited Basic), then add the Digital Classic tier for just $9.95, which'll give you the HD networks. Otherwise, if you want DVR service, you must add Digital Classic on top of Extended Basic.

Does anyone have an opinion as to what's better between HDMI and component video? I have a Moto 3416 currently using component video, but there is an HDMI port.

That doesn't sound right. Digital classic is $10. Your limited basic is only $10? Limited basic is going up to $20 in Mountain View.
I think it is about $12... don't remember exactly - bill is auto-paid each month.

peter

Does anyone have an opinion as to what's better between HDMI and component video? I have a Moto 3416 currently using component video, but there is an HDMI port.

HDMI, if anything for convenience (you only need one cable for both video and audio). Also, HDMI is all-digital while component is analog for video so there will be some degradation in the converting.

Does anyone have an opinion as to what's better between HDMI and component video? I have a Moto 3416 currently using component video, but there is an HDMI port.
I can say that HDMI will get the bits from the 3416 to your display in an error free fashion (assuming the HDMI chain is working properly) but which one "looks better" is a different question.

There is the theoretical answer that says HDMI is better, but in reality PQ it is dependent on too many variables, including your display's processing, calibration, cables, etc. Sometimes HDMI will look better. Sometimes component will look better.

I suggest you just try both out with your equipment and pick the one that looks better to you.

There is also the matter of convenience of setup. Component is just easier to setup in many cases, switchers in receivers, no broken autonegotiation, etc. HDMI can be made to work, but it is notorious for being more complex with more to go wrong. It may just work with no problems if you have a simple connection, but if you have a more complex setup with switches problems can arise.

That might be a second consideration for you.

I think this might have changed. I have Limited Basic and Digital Classic but I have had those for a couple of years now.

Another poster mentioned that he thought Expanded Basic was a requirement for Digital Classic and I think so too. Here's why...
When I went into the local office back in Sept. to inquire about cablecards for the S3, I told the lady there that I had only Limited Basic and Digital Classic. She said that wasn't possible and told me that to get any digital pkg. that Standard Cable was required. She had to look at my account on the computer to verify what I was saying and then said I must have gotten that combination before the requirement.

So anyone tried lately?
I tried last Thursday, and when I had taken care of removing all the install charges for the additional outlets that didn't take place, and the extra CC install charge, and removing Expanded Basic, the CSR was ready to move on to the next customer. We went over what my bill would be and it included Limited Basic and Digital Classic and everything was fine. So I know you can get Digital Classic with just Limited Basic, at least in Santa Rosa. I subsequently removed DC as I couldn't see paying $9.95 for just ESPN-HD.

On a sidenote, Comcast was messing around with the poles on my street today and I lost all my digital channels. When I went to the office about that I asked about the grandfathering of the the 2 DC channels, it was like talking to a wall, I couldn't even make her understand that I could get Discovery-HD whether they wanted me to get it or not as is was unencrypted.

It looks like the new software has at least fixed the issue where you go from an HD channel to an SD channel, the picture "pops" until you've paused, FF, RW the program. I guess we'll have to wait a few days to see if the remote lag is gone (although I'm not holding my breathe).

Keenan, when you get a chance the first post should be updated with the new guide version (v. 74.53) and the 3412's firmware is 16.20.
Will do. I want to get clarification on this grandfathering thing and then I'll add the new channels, the FW and whatever else we have by then.

Bill, you will not be able to get ESPNHD nor any of the cable HD networks in the clear in Oakland. Per that long Comcast note that someone just posted, you'll have to subscribe to Digital Classic and rent an HD box ($5 for non-DVR, $9.95 for DVR). Or, get a CableCard from the company. Though, according to one poster, if you opt for the non-DVR HD box, you might be able to drop the Extended Basic (leaving just the Limited Basic), then add the Digital Classic tier for just $9.95, which'll give you the HD networks. Otherwise, if you want DVR service, you must add Digital Classic on top of Extended Basic.

Thanks KF, appreciate the tip. I'll call Comcast and try to get things set up.

So my box just spent 30 minutes or so receiving the latest update, and now it won't work. I can watch channels just fine and the channel up/down button work fine but NO menu, NO dvr recordings(was right in the middle of watching something too). Anybody have any idea what I can do about this? Needless to say I'm quite unhappy right now. I have the Motorola 6412 box with HDMI(phase 3 box).

So my box just spent 30 minutes or so receiving the latest update, and now it won't work. I can watch channels just fine and the channel up/down button work fine but NO menu, NO dvr recordings(was right in the middle of watching something too). Anybody have any idea what I can do about this? Needless to say I'm quite unhappy right now. I have the Motorola 6412 box with HDMI(phase 3 box).

The same thing happened to my Moto 6200 just after 3:00 am in Fremont. It initially came back up with ---- on the front, then blank, then wouldn't tune (up/down) off of channel 1. I thought it was a goner. After reading your post I tried manually entering 160 and SciFi came up, so at least I won't miss Galactica tonight. Luckily, my ReplayTV DVR provides my guide, because the Moto box now has nothing. It also seems like it is struggling to change channels, very slowly.

What did Comcast just push on us?

KernelG and Xaque,
Have either one of you tried power cycling by pulling the plug?

KernelG and Xaque,
Have either one of you tried power cycling by pulling the plug?

Yessir. Before I tried entering the channel manually, I actually pulled the plug and went out to the kitchen to make a sandwich. So it was without power for several minutes. Big sandwich. Came back in, plugged it in, and it thought about something for a few seconds before going right back to a blank channel 1. Even now, no guide comes up (not even an 'empty' one), no 'not authorized' warnings come up on pay channels, and there is nothing at all on channel 1, which should be On-Demand. It's like the entire UI is dead.

Just checked the older standard-def General Instruments cable box in the other room. It also has no guide data now, and no On-Demand channel.

So my box just spent 30 minutes or so receiving the latest update, and now it won't work. I can watch channels just fine and the channel up/down button work fine but NO menu, NO dvr recordings(was right in the middle of watching something too). Anybody have any idea what I can do about this? Needless to say I'm quite unhappy right now. I have the Motorola 6412 box with HDMI(phase 3 box).

same here.
I have no menu and no guide, but I can tune channels.

AND...the Moto 6412 III is ripping fast at tuning channels w/o the guide. I mean, faster than the QAM tuner direct from the cable. So it ain't the box - just software associated with the guide.

If anyone else finds their box in this state check it out! Channels switch and tune in under 1/2 sec vs the normal 2 secs.

Cool feature!

My experience with DCT-6200 and new update shows that it takes a while for the guide data to populate. Wait a few hours and see if it's there.

My experience with DCT-6200 and new update shows that it takes a while for the guide data to populate. Wait a few hours and see if it's there.


me too.. turn on the tv and no buttons are working only off and on.
How long to wait you think?
Too bad Comcast doesn't send out an annoucement for these sort of things. (i missed it if there was one.)

wendek

Apparently something (maybe update related?) caused my TiVo S3 with cablecards to lose all digital channels. Had to reboot the S3 twice before digital channels are viewable and now all ADS channels are back to analog. Anyone else had S3 problems lately?

Apparently something (maybe update related?) caused my TiVo S3 with cablecards to lose all digital channels. Had to reboot the S3 twice before digital channels are viewable and now all ADS channels are back to analog. Anyone else had S3 problems lately?
See my post above. I lost all digital channels yesterday, not sure when, I didn't turn anything on until 5pm, and I just assumed it was due to the work they were doing on the poles yesterday.

How do you re-boot the S3, pull the plug?

See my post above. I lost all digital channels yesterday, not sure when, I didn't turn anything on until 5pm, and I just assumed it was due to the work they were doing on the poles yesterday.

How do you re-boot the S3, pull the plug?
You can pull the plug, but it's easier to go to Restart menu. The first restart had problems getting back the channels and the S3 rebooting on it's own at the end of the restart and came up ok except for the loss of the ADS channels in digital.

Cool, I'm going to try that right now..

After seeing that the USB port was enabled after the new guide update, I wanted to see if it worked. So I plugged in my camera into the front USB port on the 6412, and the active status went from "No" to "Yes", and my camera went into PC mode as soon as I turned it on. I guess that means the USB port is active. I don't currently have an external hard drive, but if anyone does and tries to plug it in and see if it works, I'd appreciate it.

Thanks.

You can pull the plug, but it's easier to go to Restart menu. The first restart had problems getting back the channels and the S3 rebooting on it's own at the end of the restart and came up ok except for the loss of the ADS channels in digital.
That did it, thanks, wish I'd thought of that last night. Soon as I got it going the tech showed up at the door, he said the new guide download was causing problems all over the bay area.

After seeing that the USB port was enabled after the new guide update, I wanted to see if it worked. So I plugged in my camera into the front USB port on the 6412, and the active status went from "No" to "Yes", and my camera went into PC mode as soon as I turned it on. I guess that means the USB port is active. I don't currently have an external hard drive, but if anyone does and tries to plug it in and see if it works, I'd appreciate it.

Thanks.
Pretty sure the USB port has always been active for at least power, I plugged a laptop fan into it when I had my 6412. Doubt that it's active for data transfer though.

same here.
I have no menu and no guide, but I can tune channels.

AND...the Moto 6412 III is ripping fast at tuning channels w/o the guide. I mean, faster than the QAM tuner direct from the cable. So it ain't the box - just software associated with the guide.

If anyone else finds their box in this state check it out! Channels switch and tune in under 1/2 sec vs the normal 2 secs.

Cool feature!

argh none of my DVR's menus work, no guide........ can't access anything. i can change channels very quickly. doesn't matter if i'm in component or HDMI. comcast did you do any QC??

me too.. turn on the tv and no buttons are working only off and on.
How long to wait you think?
Too bad Comcast doesn't send out an annoucement for these sort of things. (i missed it if there was one.)

wendek

Same for me too (only channel buttons seem to work). Can't even access my recordings. I've pulled the plug multiple times, tried turning off the box, hitting menu and restore all defaults, but no luck. If I call Comcast, it tells me to "Please wait" for a couple of minutes, and then "We're sorry, we're unable to complete your call" after going through their menu system. :mad:

Guide update on 16-17 Nov. and possible problems with HDMI and phase 3 boxes
____________________________________________________________ __________

You are welcome to post this on the Forum.

Motorola has informed us there may be some HDTV set specific issues with the HDMI output on the DVR 6412 P-3 Digital Set Top box as a result of the upcoming A-24 TV Guide release.

This latest version of the guide is scheduled to be downloaded to our set-tops during the 1am to 5am maintenance window on the mornings of November 16 and November 17.

This issue has been escalated to the software developers and will require further development to create a fix. We do not have an estimated date when this work will be completed.

In the mean time, any customers that may have an issue should use the component outputs until the software patch is released.

Note: The customer will only get true High Definition from the HD channels when using the component cables. The RF cables will deliver a picture, however the picture will not be in true High Definition.

And to repeat, only some HDTV sets may be impacted, not every HDTV model will experience this issue and for those that do, please use component cables and outputs versus HDMI.
____________________________________________________________ ____________



My Sharp Aquos has this problem. Back to component cables for now. This is a pain because having to have the bulky component+audio cables makes the wiring really messy.

I only have manual channel input and channel up/down. No DVR recordings list. They have a recording on their phone screen saying that they are having problems downloading the guide. And their phone bank to talk to a live CSR times out and hangs up the call. This is in San Jose Comcast....

Same for me too (only channel buttons seem to work). Can't even access my recordings. I've pulled the plug multiple times, tried turning off the box, hitting menu and restore all defaults, but no luck. If I call Comcast, it tells me to "Please wait" for a couple of minutes, and then "We're sorry, we're unable to complete your call" after going through their menu system. :mad:

my power off and on CLICKS. i've never heard clicking noises added after a firmware update. god i need my dvr back before tomorrow, tons of football i need to record!!

I called Comcast - got dropped a few times, but made it through to hold and waited over 1 hour before giving up. Can only assume this is SYSTEM WIDE for all downloads last night.

Also confirmed this is effected my 6412 as well as my old DCT-2600 (?) I think that's what it is, about 6 years old - analog. Both have no menu's/guide/nothing. But both change channels extremely FAST right now.

Well, looks like I'm not the only one having problems with the new ( NON-EXISTING ) guide. Got up this morning and nothing, no guide, can't shift tuners, it's like they wipe the guide data completely from the system. Tried the unplug trick, no go, tried the factory reset, will not do anything so it won't do a factory reset. Not a happy camper. I'm going to have a cup of coffee and then shoot off an email to the head-end to see what happened. Talking to a CSR would be useless. Not a good way to start the day .... :mad:

Laters,
Mikef5

Sorry, I know these sorts of problems are a pain in the butt, but I can't help but be amused as this has a Motorola signature all over it.

Sorry, I know these sorts of problems are a pain in the butt, but I can't help but be amused as this has a Motorola signature all over it.

of course this is motorola's fault, but comcast you would think at least test the guide update first ... oh you know... to see if it still does all the basics!!

of course this is motorola's fault, but comcast you would think at least test the guide update first ... oh you know... to see if it still does all the basics!!
You'd think, OTOH, it may be that Comcast is just "buying" this guide update from Motorola so it would be Motorola's responsibility to see that it was working properly. When you buy a new part for you car, you shouldn't have to troubleshoot, or de-bug it before installing it.

Well, I fired off an email to Mr. J., I hope he can get the right people on this to get this fiasco fixed before the weekend. I'm still puzzled why this thing won't do a factory reset, that would have reloaded everything from scratch but I can't get it to even do a factory reset. Well, back to my coffee and donuts ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

Donuts? You have donuts? :p :D

BTW, I sent you a PM yesterday, whenever it's convenient.

A box
unplugged
and busy
will miss the sign

patience
peace
ack

Donuts? You have donuts? :p :D

BTW, I sent you a PM yesterday, whenever it's convenient.
To early in the morning not to have the spell checker on :D
I wondered why the doughnuts tasted funny ;)

I got the email and I'll check on it when the dust settles.

Laters,
Mikef5

Just got an email from Mr. J. about this problem

"We are aware of the problem...been on a conference call since 3:30am
which continues as I respond...we have about 125 or so customers on hold
in each of the three call centers...we have a message on 1-800-Comcast
telling customers we are working it....we will re-push the download to
those boxes where it did not take....this will mean a no picture
scenario for about 1o minutes....Motorola trying to determine root cause
of problem....difficult to estimate but we think a couple of thousand
boxes, all in the south, are seeing the problem...things are ok in the
rest of the Bay... "

So, to me it seems that most of the problems are on the 550 MHz systems. Is anyone who is not in the 550 MHz area also having this problem? If it is just in the south bay ( 550 MHz areas) then it would seem to me that it might be because our head-ends here are not upgraded enough to work with this new guide. Just a guess but it would be one thing I'd check on.

Laters,
Mikef5

I am in Campbell, which is not 550, and I am having this problem Noticed this morning that the clock was not being displayed as usual - just the channel number. When I tried the guide - nothing.

They told us this update would address the remote lag. They just didn't tell us that we had to give up the guide to get it :)

A box
unplugged
and busy
will miss the sign

patience
peace
ack
Dave,
Speaking in haiku's ??
You've been in the office to long, you need to get out and see the world :p
But really, do you think it might be a head-end problem ???

Laters,
Mikef5

wider than that . . .
So what do all the areas have in common ?? All in the same loop ?? Same head-end ?? According to the email it seems to be mostly in the South Bay, I'd be looking for something in common in those areas.

Laters,
Mikef5

... So I know you can get Digital Classic with just Limited Basic, at least in Santa Rosa. I subsequently removed DC as I couldn't see paying $9.95 for just ESPN-HD.
When you had DC, can you confirm if you got all the non-premium HD channels (HD-SE, TNT-HD, MHD etc)?

The shy
talk pm
to smile
retain gainful occupation

Oh, Barovelli and his codes. :D

The shy
talk pm
to smile
retain gainful occupation
What's really scary is that I understood that :eek: :p

Laters,
Mikef5

So, to me it seems that most of the problems are on the 550 MHz systems. Is anyone who is not in the 550 MHz area also having this problem?
Definitely more than just 550 MHz systems and also HDMI connections. I am in Mountain View, which is not a 550 MHz system, and connected via component. No guide, no menu, no DVR menu... Channel selection does appear to work. And yes, I did unplug the unit for a reset.

web

keep them plugged in and don't touch . .

Definitely more than just 550 MHz systems and also HDMI connections. I am in Mountain View, which is not a 550 MHz system, and connected via component. No guide, no menu, no DVR menu... Channel selection does appear to work. And yes, I did unplug the unit for a reset.

web
Comcast knew that some tv's would have a problem with their HDMI connections with this new guide update. What make of tv do you have?? I'm sure Comcast would like to know what make of HDTV's are affected by this update.

Laters,
Mikef5

Same for me too (only channel buttons seem to work). Can't even access my recordings. I've pulled the plug multiple times, tried turning off the box, hitting menu and restore all defaults, but no luck. If I call Comcast, it tells me to "Please wait" for a couple of minutes, and then "We're sorry, we're unable to complete your call" after going through their menu system. :mad:


They should have offered a recored announcement for callers to listen to when they make changes like this, so we don't have to go thru the whole call tree and get no body.

my guide's back on now, but it doens't look any newer than before ... ?
wendek

They should have offered a recored announcement for callers to listen to when they make changes like this, so we don't have to go thru the whole call tree and get no body.

my guide's back on now, but it doens't look any newer than before ... ?
wendek


i left for work around 10:30am.

still the same crap. no nothing except channel changer.

i was up around 2:30am when the box went nuts, displayed DL and i waited about 10 minutes before it rebooted itself...

i immediately called 1-800-comcast and got a message wait about 30 minutes.

so i waited... and waited... and nothing and went to sleep.

woke up to nothing...

stupid idiots... this sucks.

To early in the morning not to have the spell checker on :D
I wondered why the doughnuts tasted funny ;)

I got the email and I'll check on it when the dust settles.

Laters,
Mikef5
No, I must know the answer NOW!!! Just kidding, thanks. :p

All is well here in Moraga...although we go the guide on Wednesday night.

When you had DC, can you confirm if you got all the non-premium HD channels (HD-SE, TNT-HD, MHD etc)?
:D

In Santa Rosa, the only non-premium HD channels are Discovery-HD and ESPN-HD, great deal for $9.95 eh? Especially when you consider Discovery-HD is not encrypted so you're actually paying $9.95 for just ESPN-HD.

Anyways, the answer is no here, but should be yes in other areas that actually have those channels. There may be some older AT&T subs that have a little different lineup/subscription structure and won't get some of them, but in general, with Digital Classic you should get all of them.

Although, I've read that Comcast may implement a new tier/package, a sports/entertainment package, that may include some new HD channels so things may get changed around, but undoubtedly it won't happen around here for quite some time.

Well, looks like both my boxes finally took the updated guide. Phew, I was worried on how I would know what games are playing this weekend and at what time. I was afraid I'd have to ( shutter ) use a paper tv guide.. :eek: :p
Glad to see it's getting fixed even in the 550 MHz areas, especially mine ;) .

Laters,
Mikef5

Gotta give credit to the VP for getting on a conference call at 3:30 in the morning. I don't think I'd even hear the phone ring at 3:30 in the morning.

Gotta give credit to the VP for getting on a conference call at 3:30 in the morning. I don't think I'd even hear the phone ring at 3:30 in the morning.
I've heard it ring at that hour, of course I was in the Navy and on a Nuclear sub and my fear was the call was about a radiation leak... not a good thing to wake up to ;)
This was almost as bad, no guide, not being able to know what's on tv and maybe having to revert to the old standby ( shuttering again ) paper Tv Guide.... what a terrible thought :D

Laters,
Mikef5

2 Moto boxes are showing guide now. Interesting observations:

- Guide doesn't look much different, but takes up more screen space (especially channel info)

- My DVR Recordings are all showing up as TBD (though guide is in place for future recordings). Hopefully this sorts itself out

- While test driving the 6412 III the screen went blank. The little light on the front of the box continued to blink with remote inputs, but no picture, no guide, no nothing. It would not show channel number inputs or channel changes on the front panel. It was like the lights were on, but nobody was home.

- Oh yeah, the Moto's are back to their good ol' SNAIL'S PACE of changing channel. I knew the fast channel changes were too much to hope for.

Is UHD here to stay this time? I really hope so...Battlestar in HD is great, and of course there's nothing better than Hasslehoff HD.

Is UHD here to stay this time? I really hope so...Battlestar in HD is great, and of course there's nothing better than Hasslehoff HD.

I didn't even notice this. It's on channel 727. Did I miss something? Was this planned to come back?

I didn't even notice this. It's on channel 727. Did I miss something? Was this planned to come back?

came back earlier this week. it should be back now permanently, as comcast is completing the national rollout.

I didn't even notice this. It's on channel 727. Did I miss something? Was this planned to come back?
I forgot to post this, got the message on the 15th, must be all those mushrooms ;) . Yes, it's here to stay, if you have the bandwidth to get it.... ( insert my rant here ) maybe one day.......

Laters,
Mikef5

Comcast knew that some tv's would have a problem with their HDMI connections with this new guide update. What make of tv do you have?? I'm sure Comcast would like to know what make of HDTV's are affected by this update.

Laters,
Mikef5
It was initially not working with a component connection rather than HDMI. My display is a Mitsubishi 65813 RP-CRT. The new guide is now visible and accessible on my DVR and has begun populating itself with program information. Noticed that the propagation of program information is relatively slow compared to the old guide. It has been on for over two hours and there is no program information later than 9pm today.

OBW, I stopped by my local Mountain View Comcast office, which is just a couple of blocks from my home, to see if they had any of the 3416 DVR units. After the representative adamantly stated there were none available in the South Bay area, I talked with a service technician who was outside the office. He said that the Cupertino office has received a few and he would check inside the Mountain View office. Of course, there was at least one 3416 in the local office, so I immediately snagged it :p.

Will be comparing the PQ between the 3416 and the 6412 III this evening.

web

Comcast San Jose 95110 a 7??Mhz system: hd pvr from day one

Results- faster fast forward; pvr did not record my 9am/10am shows, guide only shows data through 7:30pm tonight, but shows places where it will record my series shows (las vegas); STUPID gui change - when I hit the button on remote to view list of shows that I've recorded, they have put up an intermediate screen that gives me options such as view recorded shows, view scheduled recordings and make recordings. Putting up this screen is a stupid idea and offers no UI enhancements (i have a background in developing products with excellent UI)

finally back to normal...

stupid thing when you press MyDVR button...

but then again, having DELETE NOW as the default action on the delete option, is even stupidier...

Comcast San Jose 95110 a 7??Mhz system: hd pvr from day one

Results- faster fast forward; pvr did not record my 9am/10am shows, guide only shows data through 7:30pm tonight, but shows places where it will record my series shows (las vegas); STUPID gui change - when I hit the button on remote to view list of shows that I've recorded, they have put up an intermediate screen that gives me options such as view recorded shows, view scheduled recordings and make recordings. Putting up this screen is a stupid idea and offers no UI enhancements (i have a background in developing products with excellent UI)
Does it take you to the screen you want if you hit MyDVR twice? I'm curious as that's how the Dish UI works.

Does it take you to the screen you want if you hit MyDVR twice? I'm curious as that's how the Dish UI works.

Nope. It just refreshes the same screen.

Next week the NFL Network will start to broadcast NFL games starting on Thanksgiving. Unfortunately for those in the San Lorenzo, San Leandro and Hayward systems we'll be missing out since Comcast doesn't offer the channel in SD or HD.

Are there any other 550 systems beyond this one that also don't get the NFL Network?

I might drop a note to the local paper to inform them that the tradition of NFL football on Thanksgiving won't be happening in our area.

My Sharp Aquos has this problem. Back to component cables for now. This is a pain because having to have the bulky component+audio cables makes the wiring really messy.
As a data point, I have a DCT-5100 with DVI to HDMI on my Sharp Aquos and it is working after the update.

My SW Ver is 74.53-3321 with firmware 16.20

I noticed my STB was on channel 1 / onDemand even though I hadn't watched anything on demand, so I figured my box got the update.

I noticed the component output has video even when I turn the box off when before it would disable component out.

I watched some onDemand HD and it works ok for me. I'm in 860MHz area.

EDIT: looks like it is fixed for others too.

Next week the NFL Network will start to broadcast NFL games starting on Thanksgiving. Unfortunately for those in the San Lorenzo, San Leandro and Hayward systems we'll be missing out since Comcast doesn't offer the channel on SD or HD.

Are there any other 550 systems beyond this one that also don't get the NFL Network?

I might drop a note to the local paper to inform them that the tradition of NFL football on Thanksgiving won't be happening in our area.
Santa Rosa does not get it, some systems in the south bay, and northeast Contra Costa both probably do not get NFL Network.

This is one of the channels that Comcast wants to put in that Sports/Entertainment package I referred to earlier.

One change to the guide that I do not like is how it handles Favorites.
I had programmed a few major channels as favorites, not bothering to add all the HD channels, since when I hit the button it would take me to the first, and I could glance down at the rest.

The new guide changes the guide from showing every channel (and jumping to the next one) when you hit favorites, to ONLY showing the favorite channels...so I now have to have every channel I ever want info on as a favorite..bummer.

This would be all right if it were persistant..but as soon as you take the guide off screen it goes back to showing every channel...

Ok, a pricing question.(Yes I have read much of the thread...)

I currently am paying for:
Digital Classic, Standard Cable, and 'DVR Service".

Does this look look like I am not paying for HD? I got this DVR when I went to HD.

I went to try to get an extra HD DVR, and was told I would have to pay $9.95 for HD service along with $6.95 for the DVR. I thought it would only be $9.95 for a DVR.

Does it REALLY have to be this hard to figure everything out? I feel like I am a "basic"' HD buyer, with no Premium channels, yetI have a 3 line item bill...

Apparently something (maybe update related?) caused my TiVo S3 with cablecards to lose all digital channels. Had to reboot the S3 twice before digital channels are viewable and now all ADS channels are back to analog. Anyone else had S3 problems lately?This happened to me too. Only 1 reboot required. Sometime between Wed. eve. and thurs. eve. After a reboot it was fine. When I checked my cablecard menu, "Time Since OOB Time Start" showed that the cards had been up for just over 30 days. My first guess was a classic 30 day timer bug. Except that there was a message on tivocommunity claiming that "unbound" cablecards do this after 30 days. I wonder if comcast's new cablecard protection mechanism changes will fix this (by making the cards officially pair with the headend). Or maybe it was just a coincidence that the cards went down right after 30 days of uptime...

I would go to the office, their software should have all the correct billing codes/listings. I just went today to pay my bill and the CSR went through my bill while it was on the screen. With just a S3 you should be paying for only one CC at $1.50 per month, the first one is part of the subscription price. I have Limited Basic and my total bill will be $19.37, including fees and taxes.
I went to the office and they supposedly took off the extra $6.95 (going forward and retroactively). Hopefully 3rd time is a charm. We'll see. I did also get them to turn on Digital Simulcast for my channels < 100. Took like 2 keystrokes/1 second for her to do it. Far easier than bringing home a STB in my opinion.

Since I was there, I also asked about the new cablecard pairing setup where they are supposedly asking for the cablecard details they didn't take down during the installs. She had no idea what I was talking about when I mentioned this. Also she'd never heard of cablecard unit addresses and said not to worry about it. Maybe this is only being rolled out in some areas not San Rafael. With my luck they'll turn this on when I'm out of town and break all my season passes :)

Anyone else annoyed by amber alert messages that don't just interrupt but completely cancel one's recordings that are in progress (on the tivo s3)? And this just to alert you about police activity occuring 3 counties away (2 hour+ drive)?

I received the downloads a couple of nights ago to my 6412 pII and my 3412, and my 6412 now has the spontaneous reboot problem, many times a day as i use it. it usually turns off when i'm accessing a scheduled recording, but not always, and even now that i'm pushing buttons every few seconds instead of at a normal speed, and after i unplugged it for 30 minutes. i've had it for 23 months and it's served me quite well, and I'd like to keep it as it's DVI and so is my TV, but it's looking like i'll have to turn it in once i watch my recordings or dump them to D-VHS.

Santa Rosa does not get it, some systems in the south bay, and northeast Contra Costa both probably do not get NFL Network.

This is one of the channels that Comcast wants to put in that Sports/Entertainment package I referred to earlier.

Yes, I heard the news about the NFL's lawsuit against Comcast, and I believe, some other cable companies. Funny that you mention that Comcast "wants to put" NFL Network in the sports package. In Oakland at least, the channel is already in the sports package, which I've inquired about and is $5/month. Are some of you folks getting it as part of Digital Classic? It sucks that I'll be missing out on the Thursday and Saturday games on that channel. Hopefully, the games will be turned on on channel 725 in HD.

Hi,

I got the guide/firmware upgrade on the DCT-6200 this morning. I am now unable to capture CBS HD via firewire because CCI is set to 0x02, instead of 0x00.
Anybody else seeing this? I'm on the San Mateo head-end. What can I do to fix this? Any help appreciated.

Edit:
Just talked to a CSR, and she had no idea what I was talking about. (sigh). I tried telling her that my HDTV wasn't getting the CBS channel via the QAM tuner, but she was pretty adamant that without a converter box I could not get any HD channels.

Thanks.

finally back to normal...

stupid thing when you press MyDVR button...

but then again, having DELETE NOW as the default action on the delete option, is even stupidier...
Yeah, that shortcut button is now gone, for all intents and purposes. I like the faster FF, though. You can really zip thru stuff fast now. But why did they eliminate the "Sports" function in the guide? It wasn't all that great, but better than nothing. If this fix gets rid of the remote stutter, it'll be worth it. I've had so many problems with that lately it's been pissing me off to no end. Anyone know if remote stutter is supposed to be fixed?

And why on earth is "delate now" the default option? How stupid do they have to be to keep that????

Quick question....is the setting on my moto dvr box (6412 III) suppose to be set on 720p, 1080i or doesnt matter? I have a HD LCD with naive resolution of 1366 x 768.

Hopefully, the games will be turned on on channel 725 in HD.
I think it will, I recall others here saying that the HD games will be shown on the special events channel and that they have seen the game of the week there in the past.

Quick question....is the setting on my moto dvr box (6412 III) suppose to be set on 720p, 1080i or doesnt matter? I have a HD LCD with naive resolution of 1366 x 768.
With that resolution the best thing to do is try both and see which one looks best.

I went to the office and they supposedly took off the extra $6.95 (going forward and retroactively). Hopefully 3rd time is a charm. We'll see. I did also get them to turn on Digital Simulcast for my channels < 100. Took like 2 keystrokes/1 second for her to do it. Far easier than bringing home a STB in my opinion.

Since I was there, I also asked about the new cablecard pairing setup where they are supposedly asking for the cablecard details they didn't take down during the installs. She had no idea what I was talking about when I mentioned this. Also she'd never heard of cablecard unit addresses and said not to worry about it. Maybe this is only being rolled out in some areas not San Rafael. With my luck they'll turn this on when I'm out of town and break all my season passes :)
CSRs will probably know nothing about the CC info. That info is going to be collected by a third party contracted by Comcast for the job.

Ok, a pricing question.(Yes I have read much of the thread...)

I currently am paying for:
Digital Classic, Standard Cable, and 'DVR Service".

Does this look look like I am not paying for HD? I got this DVR when I went to HD.

I went to try to get an extra HD DVR, and was told I would have to pay $9.95 for HD service along with $6.95 for the DVR. I thought it would only be $9.95 for a DVR.

Does it REALLY have to be this hard to figure everything out? I feel like I am a "basic"' HD buyer, with no Premium channels, yetI have a 3 line item bill...
I believe you should only be paying the $9.95 for the DVR. Someone with 2 DVRs will have to comment.

I just looked at the Comcast price list and it lists both items:

Digital Video Recorder Service Fee(Primary and Additional Outlets).............$9.95
Digital Video Recorder Digital Access Fee(Each Additional Outlet)...............$6.95

So yes, it looks like you pay additional $17 a month for the extra DVR.

To date, there is no "HD Service" in the bay area as far as I know, the HD channels come with whatever programming package you have.

CSRs will probably know nothing about the CC info. That info is going to be collected by a third party contracted by Comcast for the job.
But I would think going into the future Comcast would collect the information themselves during the install rather than resort to the contractors for eternity? :)

Maybe not now, but eventually they should know something about it.

Yes, I would think they would, I think UEI is collecting all the back data that should have been collected in the first place.

Who knows though, it may be something Comcast would rather just farm out than have to deal with themselves, IIRC, it's the FCC that wants the info, it doesn't seem to be critical to how the Comcast system itself runs.

Who knows what goes on in that dark tower in Philadelphia.... :p

I believe you should only be paying the $9.95 for the DVR. Someone with 2 DVRs will have to comment.

I just looked at the Comcast price list and it lists both items:

Digital Video Recorder Service Fee(Primary and Additional Outlets).............$9.95
Digital Video Recorder Digital Access Fee(Each Additional Outlet)...............$6.95

So yes, it looks like you pay additional $17 a month for the extra DVR.

To date, there is no "HD Service" in the bay area as far as I know, the HD channels come with whatever programming package you have.

According to my bill, I pay $9.95 for the extra DVR service and $6.95 for extra box. So for 2 DVR's I pay $9.95x2 and $6.95 for the additional box. The $6.95 for the "primary" box is deducted because of the Silver package (some, if not all, of the digital packages give you your first box free).

That jives with what the cost sheet says. So you're paying $16.90($6.95 + $9.95) for the extra DVR right? $9.95 for the first one with no other box or outlet fees.

According to this thread, KTVU and KGO broadcast in 720p. If that's the case, then can someone tell me why those stations' signals coming into my TV are 1080i? Is the 1080i coming from my STB (Moto 3416) or from Comcast? The former case implies the STB forces HD signals to 1080i. The latter case implies that Comcast converts to 1080i before delivering the signals.

In fact, all HD channels on my TV are being shown in 1080i, but I don't think there's a setting on my TV that forces all HD signals to that.

According to this thread, KTVU and KGO broadcast in 720p. If that's the case, then can someone tell me why those stations' signals coming into my TV are 1080i? Is the 1080i coming from my STB (Moto 3416) or from Comcast? The former case implies the STB forces HD signals to 1080i. The latter case implies that Comcast converts to 1080i before delivering the signals.

In fact, all HD channels on my TV are being shown in 1080i, but I don't think there's a setting on my TV that forces all HD signals to that.
It's the STB that's doing the scaling, it will only output either 1080i or 720p for HD channels, no native output. The signals themselves are sent through the cable in their native format. My Series 3 TiVo has a native output function which allows for 720p, and 1080i channels to be passed to my video processor in their native format. This allows for superior de-interlacing/scaling to be done on the signals before being sent to the display.

According to this thread, KTVU and KGO broadcast in 720p. If that's the case, then can someone tell me why those stations' signals coming into my TV are 1080i? Is the 1080i coming from my STB (Moto 3416) or from Comcast? The former case implies the STB forces HD signals to 1080i. The latter case implies that Comcast converts to 1080i before delivering the signals.

In fact, all HD channels on my TV are being shown in 1080i, but I don't think there's a setting on my TV that forces all HD signals to that.

Your 3416 can output 1080I or 720P. It can't do both at the same time. Yours is set for 1080I that's why all of your stations appear to be 1080I. You can change it to 720P but then all of the originators that are 108I (CBS, NBC, NFL) will be 720P on your TV.

Change your output to 720P and see if it looks any better on your TV. If it doesn't, Put it where you like it.

I just got the 3416 last weekend, but I haven't figured out a way to set the resolution. How do I do it?

KingsFan6,

There is an excellent Wikibook on the Motorola DVR. The 3416 is the same box as the 6412/6416/3412. Here's the link to the section of the Wikibook that explains how to access the user settings to change the box output from 1080i to 720p.

Wikibook on Accessing User Settings (http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/How_to_use_a_Motorola_DVR/Setup#Accessing_User_Settings)

FWIW, on my Fujitsu 50" plasma, I can't tell the difference between 720p and 1080i output, whether using either on a 720p feed (ESPN/ABC) or 1080i (NBC/CBS/just about everybody else). About the only obvious difference, on my set at least, is that the text in the DVR's onscreen menus/guides is much jaggier in 720p than in either 1080i or even 480p. This jagginess is not noticeable on the content itself--e.g., the text displayed in HD commercials such as fine print disclaimers. I've never seen an explanation for this.

If I'm missing something on the 1080i/720p issue, I'd love to hear from our forum cognoscenti what I should be looking for to detect picture quality difference. I know 720p is supposed to be better for fast motion, but I can't quite pick it up. Of course, I don't know of any way to do a comparison--it's not like you could find the same football game running on NBC in 1080i and ABC in 720p.

Tom

This new I-guide and firmware has some serious issues. I have not had to power cycle my 6412 phase 2 in a year. I had to do it twice last night.

It seems that during the 11pm "download" the box still freezes to remote codes. If you happen to be doing a 30 sec skip during that time it the bar stays on the screen and the only way to get out of it is to power cycle.....

I hope they get this fixed soon, I'm going to try using FF instead for now but it is a pain...

While I'm begging for guidance from the forum gods of SF Comcast HD, has anyone checked to see if the 16.20 firmware (which has now arrived in Mill Valley) does in fact solve the HDMI repeater issue that prevented using an HDMI output with an HDMI switching receiver? I'll do my own experiment, but with today's heavy day of college FB I don't think I want to risk family rebellion by going through all the junk necessary to test it just yet.

It seems that during the 11pm "download" the box still freezes to remote codes.

kevini

Is 11 pm a set time for guide downloads? That would explain a lot, as I have tended to get the dreaded remote command lag during my late evening channel surfing, after the rest of the family goes to bed, and 11 p.m. would be about the time that the symptoms appear.

Tom

That jives with what the cost sheet says. So you're paying $16.90($6.95 + $9.95) for the extra DVR right? $9.95 for the first one with no other box or outlet fees.

Exactly.

Hi,

I got the guide/firmware upgrade on the DCT-6200 this morning. I am now unable to capture CBS HD via firewire because CCI is set to 0x02, instead of 0x00.
Anybody else seeing this? I'm on the San Mateo head-end. What can I do to fix this? Any help appreciated.

Edit:
Just talked to a CSR, and she had no idea what I was talking about. (sigh). I tried telling her that my HDTV wasn't getting the CBS channel via the QAM tuner, but she was pretty adamant that without a converter box I could not get any HD channels.

Thanks.

I just found out the same problem happened to me. This in North San Jose area. The I-Link cannot be established (DVHS player showed "I-" but not "I-1"). I think Comcast turned off the firewire capability. :mad: Isn't that against the FCC rule?

Tim

I just found out the same problem happened to me. This in North San Jose area. The I-Link cannot be established (DVHS player showed "I-" but not "I-1"). I think Comcast turned off the firewire capability. :mad: Isn't that against the FCC rule?

Tim

Hey Tim,

Is it just CBS or all broadcast HD channels? For what its worth, I called again early this morning and got a CSR who seemed to at least understand what I was saying. He said that he couldn't do anything since it was a head-end issue but that if 3 people complained about the same issue, then it would be automatically escalated. Don't know how much of that is true, but if its possible please call and complain, specifically mentioning the CCI issue. Hopefully someone will take note and fix it.

Quick question guys, I'm about to purchase a TV that has built in QAM tuner. I switched from comcast to DTV, about a year ago. However the cable lines are still accessible. I get every single local digital channel via OTA, but it might be easier to just run the cable line then split the line from the roof antenna, which is only routed to the family room at the moment.

So my question is, are the local-hd channels in the clear and i can pick it up with the QAM tuner even though im not subscribed to ANY comcast service?

I'm in the south bay.

Local HD channels are in the clear i.e. KQED, CBS, ABC, NBC

Thanks a lot for the confirmation. Very excited to know this. I can now compare OTA to cables broadcast.

Local HD channels are in the clear i.e. KQED, CBS, ABC, NBC

But he'll still need to subscribe to at least Basic Cable in order to get these. If he's not a Comcast customer at all then I would think the line is shut off completely.

Hey Tim,

Is it just CBS or all broadcast HD channels? For what its worth, I called again early this morning and got a CSR who seemed to at least understand what I was saying. He said that he couldn't do anything since it was a head-end issue but that if 3 people complained about the same issue, then it would be automatically escalated. Don't know how much of that is true, but if its possible please call and complain, specifically mentioning the CCI issue. Hopefully someone will take note and fix it.

All HD channels were affected. I didn't check the CCI value, but I did a power cycle on the DVHS player... voila! It is working fine now. :rolleyes: I think the new DVR firmware caused the DVHS player to crash somehow. Did you try powercycling the DVHS player?

Tim

I'm in the Sunnyvale Area, and only CBS via firewire was effected for me. The other locals (FOX, NBC and ABC) are the same as before. I'm assuming they have turned on 5C for CBS to test around or it was some mistake. Maybe if enough people call to complain they will fix it. I had no luck with an online representative but will try to call in tomorrow.

But he'll still need to subscribe to at least Basic Cable in order to get these. If he's not a Comcast customer at all then I would think the line is shut off completely.
If he has internet service through Comcast, usually basic cable TV is still left enabled. However, if he has internet service without cable TV service the price is almost the same since comcast gives a $14.00 per month 2 product discount.

anyone who's programmed the SKIP function... are you finding that it's slower now?

i used to be able to press it 8 times and it's FAST...

now, i have to wait each time. maybe it's the remote lag thing, but dang... now it's even more suckier slow...

did the advertisers complain and motorola actually slowed it down????

I'm in the Sunnyvale Area, and only CBS via firewire was effected for me. The other locals (FOX, NBC and ABC) are the same as before. I'm assuming they have turned on 5C for CBS to test around or it was some mistake. Maybe if enough people call to complain they will fix it. I had no luck with an online representative but will try to call in tomorrow.
Okay, you're seeing the same symptoms as myself. So this appears to have changed on more than just one head-end. FWIW, I also emailed KPIX from their "Contact Us" page. Maybe if enough people complain to KPIX, they might do something.
Can you confirm that CCI is the issue? You can check that in the "Current Channel Status" page (item 6) in the diagnostics menu. CBS should have 0x02, other broadcast channels should have 0x00. Also, 5c is not on for any of the broadcast channels.

kevini

Is 11 pm a set time for guide downloads? That would explain a lot, as I have tended to get the dreaded remote command lag during my late evening channel surfing, after the rest of the family goes to bed, and 11 p.m. would be about the time that the symptoms appear.

Tom

Tom

I don't know if it is guide specifically but others have noted that at 2am EST, 11pm our time a push happens that definitely causes the lag.

Kevin

If he has internet service through Comcast, usually basic cable TV is still left enabled. However, if he has internet service without cable TV service the price is almost the same since comcast gives a $14.00 per month 2 product discount.

I wasn't sure if you got the discount for Basic Cable or if you needed to be at the digital level. He said in his original post that he "does not subscribed to ANY comcast service" so I'm assuming he means Internet as well.

FYI: This monrning I found my DCT 6200 was outputting 480p instead of 720p that I had configured. I changed the config back to 720 and it is working fine.

This new I-guide and firmware has some serious issues. I have not had to power cycle my 6412 phase 2 in a year. I had to do it twice last night.

It seems that during the 11pm "download" the box still freezes to remote codes. If you happen to be doing a 30 sec skip during that time it the bar stays on the screen and the only way to get out of it is to power cycle.....

I hope they get this fixed soon, I'm going to try using FF instead for now but it is a pain...
I'm also in Fremont but mine occurs most frequently around 3-5pm in the afternoon but recently it was occuring at all different times. A month ago it got very bad where I had to power down about every two days. Finally after two weeks of that, I removed the HDMI cable, powered down, and started using component cables. Since than (two weeks ago) I have not had any major problems and I only hung 5-10 seconds twice. I don't know if HDMI has anything to do with it but until the serious problems start to return with the component cables, I'm not reverting back to HDMI.

Ok, like everyone I guess, I got the firmware update.

Am I correct in saying they finally fixed the "SD channel stutters after tuning to SD from a HD channel" bug? Seems like it to me.

Right now though, I'm getting horrible stuttering on 703 (Sunday Night NFL). Looks like the old "change to 720p then back to 1080i" thing, but I'm recording Firefly so I can't turn the box off right now (hey UHD is back, totally sweet).
Edit: ok Firefly is over, so I powered off and toggled the resolution output, and that fixed the stuttering, like usual...

Also, I *think* I like the new Favorites setup, but it's going to take some getting used to.

I used to use the "Favorites" button to page thru the pages I liked (I would set the first channel on that page to a "favorite"). Just to ask...

IS there anyway to go back to the OLD "favorites" behaivior?

CBS-HD (705) has never been recordable via firewire for me. The service menu says 5c=0 but it still does not work. I've never been given an answer as to why that is. I just cannot record CBS-HD period, never, no how.

That's really too bad, as CBS has the best-quality HD (technically) on the market.

CBS-HD (705) has never been recordable via firewire for me. The service menu says 5c=0 but it still does not work. I've never been given an answer as to why that is. I just cannot record CBS-HD period, never, no how.
CBS-HD on my system has the CCI (Copy Control Information) broadcast flag set to 0x02 which I think is copy never. Even though 5c=0, I suspect that if CCI is not Copy Always, fireware copy has to follow the the CCI flag restrictions.

http://news.com.com/5208-1071-0.html?forumID=1&threadID=6992&messageID=46738&start=-147

I think the difference is that 5c is implemented by the cable operator and protects everything on the channels whereas CCI is implemented by the broadcaster and can be used on a show by show basis on any channel. CBS-HD appears to have it turned on all the time but I think other channels also use it when they want to protect a specific show (eg. Disney movies on ABC-HD). All premium channels seem to have CCI set to Copy Never.

I'm not 100% sure how 5c and CCI are suppose to react so if someone can comment I'd appreciate it. Is 5c implemented on all HD channels or no channels using just one 5c flag or on a channel by channel basis with a 5c flag for each channel? If it is only one flag for all HD channels, I can see why it is not set.

Since CCI is always set to Copy Never 24/7 on CBS-HD, I suspect that it is being set by the local station in all packets in the broadcast stream. Maybe KPIX doesn't realize that they have it always set to Copy Never and you could give KPIX a call and maybe they would remove it. KPIX may do that since they probably could care less if you copied the any of the network or syndicated programs and they don't have any HD programs of their own.

CBS-HD on my system has the CCI (Copy Control Information) broadcast flag set to 0x02 which I think is copy never. Even though 5c=0, I suspect that if CCI is not Copy Always, fireware copy has to follow the the CCI flag restrictions.

http://news.com.com/5208-1071-0.html?forumID=1&threadID=6992&messageID=46738&start=-147

I think the difference is that 5c is implemented by the cable operator and protects everything on the channels whereas CCI is implemented by the broadcaster and can be used on a show by show basis on any channel. CBS-HD appears to have it turned on all the time but I think other channels also use it when they want to protect a specific show (eg. Disney movies on ABC-HD). All premium channels seem to have CCI set to Copy Never.

I'm not 100% sure how 5c and CCI are suppose to react so if someone can comment I'd appreciate it. Is 5c implemented on all HD channels or no channels using just one 5c flag or on a channel by channel basis with a 5c flag for each channel? If it is only one flag for all HD channels, I can see why it is not set.

Since CCI is always set to Copy Never 24/7 on CBS-HD, I suspect that it is being set by the local station in all packets in the broadcast stream. Maybe KPIX doesn't realize that they have it always set to Copy Never and you could give KPIX a call and maybe they would remove it.

I think if more people complained about the CCI issue to KPIX they might reconsider/fix this problem. Could you please email KPIX from their website ("Contact us" page) and hopefully they'll take some notice. You might also try complaining to Comcast, but some patience and persistence is required as most CSR's don't know anything about CCI or OTA HD.

CBS-HD (705) has never been recordable via firewire for me. The service menu says 5c=0 but it still does not work. I've never been given an answer as to why that is. I just cannot record CBS-HD period, never, no how.

Can you check the CCI status on page 6 (Current Channel Status) in the service/diagnostics menu after you've tuned to 705 on the box and see if its set to 0x02. If it is, then you're seeing the same CCI issue affecting the rest of us.

anyone who's programmed the SKIP function... are you finding that it's slower now?

i used to be able to press it 8 times and it's FAST...

now, i have to wait each time. maybe it's the remote lag thing, but dang... now it's even more suckier slow...

did the advertisers complain and motorola actually slowed it down????

Yes it is slower. I have a 2.5 minute skip macro programmed into my remote (five 30 second skips). It now pauses noticeably between most of the skips.

Also, I *think* I like the new Favorites setup, but it's going to take some getting used to.

I used to use the "Favorites" button to page thru the pages I liked (I would set the first channel on that page to a "favorite"). Just to ask...

IS there anyway to go back to the OLD "favorites" behaivior?

Press "menu", then select the heart icon, then select "list 01". It's an extra couple of button pushes, but it's there.

Yes it is slower. I have a 2.5 minute skip macro programmed into my remote (five 30 second skips). It now pauses noticeably between most of the skips.
Do you guys have a 64xx or 34xx STB? I noticed this "lag" when I switched from the 6412 PII to the 3412. I haven't noticed any difference since they uploaded the new software/firmware so I'm wondering if the 64xx are "caught up" (so to speak).

I think the difference is that 5c is implemented by the cable operator and protects everything on the channels whereas CCI is implemented by the broadcaster and can be used on a show by show basis on any channel. CBS-HD appears to have it turned on all the time but I think other channels also use it when they want to protect a specific show (eg. Disney movies on ABC-HD). All premium channels seem to have CCI set to Copy Never.

I'm not 100% sure how 5c and CCI are suppose to react so if someone can comment I'd appreciate it. Is 5c implemented on all HD channels or no channels using just one 5c flag or on a channel by channel basis with a 5c flag for each channel? If it is only one flag for all HD channels, I can see why it is not set.
I don't know what the status entry "5C" means in the context of Motorola, but 5C/DTCP is a content protection system (encryption, keys, etc.) for digital buses like 1394. CCI is implemented within the 5C/DTCP standard.

I think it is more accurate to say 5C/DTCP/CCI are implemented by the vendor choosing to include a 1394 bus. CCI is the portion of the standard that allows the broadcaster to specify how they want their content treated (copy-freely, copy-never, copy one-generation, no more copies)

I suspect the "5C" status entry is related to whether the STB has detected a 5C-capable (recording) device on the 1394 bus. If you are using a PC then it doesn't support 5C thus 5C is zero. That is just my guess as to what the intention of that status code was by the designers.

So in that sense, none of this stuff is actually implemented by the cable operator. It is implemented by the STB maker and controled by the content broadcaster.

There is separate encryption between the head-end and the STB and that is something the cable operator does have some input over, but is again implemented by the head-end vendor and STB vendor. That inclues the CableCARD encryption.

I hope one of you can asssit me. Any of you haveing any probs with NBC HD on COmcast in the dublin area. It seems the NFL Sunday game seems to flicker . I got a 50 Samsung DLP usign HDMI , with the box set to 1080. I have had the tv for about 6 months and the past 2 NBC NFL games as well as Law and Order , Fridat Night lights, on NBC HD seems to flickeror semi freeze . It happened also in the fox hd durring a Sharks game. Is it the comcast signal, my box or my tv. All other HD chanles are perfect. Please advise.

Hi everyone, I hope this is the right thread for this. I am getting a Panasonic 42"9UK and right now have a series2 Tivo, which has no HD capability. Is it worth it to get the Comcast Motorola PVRs and deal with all of those issues? I'm planning to wait until Comcast has the Tivo software, but I have no idea how long that wait will be.

I hope one of you can asssit me. Any of you haveing any probs with NBC HD on COmcast in the dublin area. It seems the NFL Sunday game seems to flicker . I got a 50 Samsung DLP usign HDMI , with the box set to 1080. I have had the tv for about 6 months and the past 2 NBC NFL games as well as Law and Order , Fridat Night lights, on NBC HD seems to flickeror semi freeze . It happened also in the fox hd durring a Sharks game. Is it the comcast signal, my box or my tv. All other HD chanles are perfect. Please advise.
FWIW, I have Comcast HD in San Ramon and haven't had any of the problems that you've seen.

FWIW, I have Comcast HD in San Ramon and haven't had any of the problems that you've seen.

thanks, whats wierd is it;s only on the FOX SPorts HD Sharsks and NBC HD, all otther channels are clear as day...

anyone who's programmed the SKIP function... are you finding that it's slower now?
i used to be able to press it 8 times and it's FAST...
now, i have to wait each time. maybe it's the remote lag thing, but dang... now it's even more suckier slow...

I had programmmed two skip macros. They are now so slow that they are practically useless. Isn't it nice when Comcast decides to give us features that we don't necessarily want, while degrading the ones that we do? :mad:

Hi Everyone,

I have a Motorola DCT 6412 III dual tuner HD DVR connected to my Sony 42' via component cables. Yesterday I was watching the 49er game and certain camera angles were fuzzy, particularly the primary shot they use right before the snap of the ball. Also, when Fox broke in for highlights the highlights appeared fuzzy. By "fuzzy" I mean slightly soft focus, basically it looked like I was playing an SD DVD. Definitely not true HD.

I also noticed when watching the basketball game on TNT-HD on Thursday night the bright red uniforms of the players caused pixelation.

On the flip side the NBC football game last night looked great.

Any idea what the problem is? The 49er games used to look fantastic - this fuzzy issue is a recent problem, started about 2 weeks ago (before the firmware update, if that's what you're thinking).

Do I need to adjust a setting? Will my problem go away if I use HDMI? Or is this a Fox and TNT issue?

Thanks!

Alex

KingsFan6,

--snip--

FWIW, on my Fujitsu 50" plasma, I can't tell the difference between 720p and 1080i output, whether using either on a 720p feed (ESPN/ABC) or 1080i (NBC/CBS/just about everybody else).

--snip---

Tom
Are you sure your Fujitsu 50" plasma can even do 1080i natively? In my limited research the vast majority of High-Def plasmas go up 1024x768, meaning 720p. I think that you would need to go super-high end for a native 1080 plasma.

BTW - here is a good link
http://www.cnet.com/4520-7874_1-5137915-1.html


peter

While I'm begging for guidance from the forum gods of SF Comcast HD, has anyone checked to see if the 16.20 firmware (which has now arrived in Mill Valley) does in fact solve the HDMI repeater issue that prevented using an HDMI output with an HDMI switching receiver? I'll do my own experiment, but with today's heavy day of college FB I don't think I want to risk family rebellion by going through all the junk necessary to test it just yet.

I'm thinking of buying a Denon 2807 with HDMI switching. Big question: Will it work?

Thanks for the help regarding setting resolution settings via the STB. With my 3416 connected to a Mitsu WD52627 52", there's definitely a difference in PQ between 480i and 480p for a SD signal. 480i gives a smoother, albeit blurrier, picturer. 480p gives a more vivid picture in terms of the color brightness and less blur, but it does cause more graininess. Based on my learnings, it's probably best to stick with 480i, since it is native to SD. My TV then converts all incoming signals to 1080p anyway (Apparently, there's no way to override this setting). It's probably best to just let the TV do the de-interlacing and upconversion. Is this analysis sound?

Is it worthwhile getting an upscaling DVD player if the TV already converts all signals to 1080p?

Is it worthwhile getting an upscaling DVD player if the TV already converts all signals to 1080p?

I would check in the AVSForum thread about your actual TV.

When upconverting DVD players came out, it seemed like they had newer chips than the current TV's so the results were impressive.

I do not know if current model TV's are using the same conversion chips..if so, it should make no difference.

This was posted on another thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=741358
Just got off the phone w/ Comcast. They estimate that it will take 3 to 6 months for a fix and that we need to use component cables until they fix this.

Part of the reason for the 3 - 6 month period is that Motorola has a fixed release schedule for firmware... according to Comcast.

FWIW I have a DCT-5100 and the DVI port is still working fine after 16.20. There are some strange behavior with the diagnostic menus but the picture is coming out fine.

It just feels like this is an alpha release w/r/t smooth stable feel, but most things do work.

There must be something awfully important in this new FW for Comcast to push it out even though it's busted in a major way.

Check it out; the Comcast DVR problems made the SJ Mercury Action Line for yesterday: http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/16052232.htm

From the article:

I have been flooded with complaints about my response to the reporting of widespread problems with Comcast's DVR (Action Line, Nov. 13), the machine that, among other things, records programs for later viewing.

It doesn't work right, they reported. Its response to commands is slooooow.

They said that they have complained to Comcast about this flaw to no avail.

The good news is that Comcast said that they plan to download a fix by the first week of December.

Let me know (and I know you will) if that improves the performance of the DVR. Or not.

I didn't see the original November 13 column, but if we don't get a fix to the slow response by the end of the first week of December, we should let this action line guy know!

Anybody else heard about a slow-response fix???

EDIT: Sorry...I guess you have to be registered for SJM online to view the article.

SECOND EDIT: Well, I found the November 13 Action Line article at http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/columnists/action_line/16000122.htm . I can see why he said on the 19th that he was "flooded" with complaints about his response--he simply parroted back some standard Comcast BS about how to use your Comcast DVR. The question posed was one about sluggish performance...and Comcast didn't say *anything* about that in the 11/13 response. If we don't get a fix by the end of December, let's let Dennis Rockstroh (actionline@mercurynews.com) know!

Ok, like everyone I guess, I got the firmware update.


Also, I *think* I like the new Favorites setup, but it's going to take some getting used to.

I used to use the "Favorites" button to page thru the pages I liked (I would set the first channel on that page to a "favorite"). Just to ask...

IS there anyway to go back to the OLD "favorites" behaivior?
Surprised no one has posted this yet. The "new" favorites. Menu > setup > favorites setup.

You will notice there are five lines there. This means you can have up to five favorites lists. The list can be renamed also. So you, your wife/so, and three kids can have their own favorites list. Or as sole owner I have Discover, PBS, HD, Network, ALL favorites. I have not discovered yet if there is a limit to each list size.

This is setup, to use after setup when you press "Guide" you see the guide list, Guide entry is "ALL Channels' no list. Each press of the favorites will cycle through the five lists selected above. "Favorites" in "Guide" only selects a list. Use the arrow up/down or page up/down to see your program guide.

After selecting a "Favorite" list from "Guide" menu and you are now watching the favorites button will cycle through the "selected" list. The "list name" will appear as a tab on the upper left of the display bar.

The only thing where they missed on this one, is when you are in the "Guide" page and are selecting a list the "list name" does not appear.

Other wise the Favorites management has had a MAJOR improvement, this is a "good thing".

I have no trouble with the skip forward/backward.

-- Brandy

Are you sure your Fujitsu 50" plasma can even do 1080i natively? In my limited research the vast majority of High-Def plasmas go up 1024x768, meaning 720p. I think that you would need to go super-high end for a native 1080 plasma.
Peter,

You are right--my Fujitsu does not handle 1080i natively--it has to convert it to the native panel resolution of 768x1366. My point, though, was that I cannot tell the difference between, for example, having the Motorola take the 1080i broadcast of CBS and feeding that directly to the Fujitsu and that same broadcast converted by the Motorola to 720p and then fed to the Fujitsu. I also have not been able to detect any benefit from 720p sports broadcasts (which is supposed to be 720ps strong suit) even when fed at the native 720p to the Fujitsu, as opposed to a 1080i sports broadcast either fed directly to the Fuji or converted to 720p by the Fuji. I would think I should be able to detect something, but I can't. Maybe I'm just Joe Six Pack after all these high-end expenditures. ;)

There must be something awfully important in this new FW for Comcast to push it out even though it's busted in a major way.
Yeah it does make you wonder when things like HDMI 2-channel (when it should be 5.1 channel) audio fix and HDMI repeater fix need months and months of qualification.

I was checking my bill this month and saw the for my 2 DVR's, there is a charge of 9.95 each for the dvrs, and then a charge of 6.95 each for the digital connection. Is this correct?

I was checking my bill this month and saw the for my 2 DVR's, there is a charge of 9.95 each for the dvrs, and then a charge of 6.95 each for the digital connection. Is this correct?

Do you have a digital package that gives you your first STB free of charge? If so then the second $6.95 charge is erroneous.

Just read on a different forum that the mass rollout of the Tivo software for Comcast has been delayed from Jan '07 to late April '07. My guess is we'll see at least one more delay between now and then.

Do you have a digital package that gives you your first STB free of charge? If so then the second $6.95 charge is erroneous.

I do have the Silver Package and a 3rd stb (not dvr) that comes with it.

I do have the Silver Package and a 3rd stb (not dvr) that comes with it.

Ahhh...so you have 2 DVR's and 1 non-DVR STB? If so then your bill should look like this:

Non-DVR STB: Free
DVR 1: $6.95
DVR 2: $6.95
DVR Service for DVR 1: $9.95
DVR Service for DVR 2: $9.95

Ahhh...so you have 2 DVR's and 1 non-DVR STB? If so then your bill should look like this:

Non-DVR STB: Free
DVR 1: $6.95
DVR 2: $6.95
DVR Service for DVR 1: $9.95
DVR Service for DVR 2: $9.95

And it does! Thanks for clarifying.

OK, since my last post I've been doing a lot of forum reading, but I've really only made myself more confused. Here's my situation - I have a Sony KDF-A10 42' TV - native resolution is 720. I'm having issues when I watch some sports though (pixelation, blurring) and I noticed my system is upconverting Fox's football feed of the 49er game to 1080i. I am using a Motorola 6412.

Similarly I noticed pixelation in last night's Monday Night Football game. Same issue (I think) - 720 broadcast being forced to 1080 on my display even though it's native resolution is 720 as well.

Question - would my picture be better if I forced it to display as 720p?

Follow up question - how would I do that?

Thanks for any help, much appreciated! If this is too basic a question for this forum if anyone can give me the answer offline that would be great too.

Since your display device is 720p, there's no point in having your 6412 output 1080i. It should be set to output everything in 720p. (IIUC that the 6412 cannot be set to output "native" source formats and let your TV do its own conversions) That means that you'll avoid dual conversion of 720 feeds (720-->1080-->720) and only have the single STB conversion of 1080 feeds. Assuming that the 6412 does a decent job of that, your overall experience should improve.

I know this isn't related to Comcast, but I thought I'd ask since it's a Bay Area thread... Anyone know of a good trusted ISF Calibration person in the bay area who works with Pioneer plasmas?

Thanks!

Russ

OK, since my last post I've been doing a lot of forum reading, but I've really only made myself more confused. Here's my situation - I have a Sony KDF-A10 42' TV - native resolution is 720. I'm having issues when I watch some sports though (pixelation, blurring) and I noticed my system is upconverting Fox's football feed of the 49er game to 1080i. I am using a Motorola 6412.

Similarly I noticed pixelation in last night's Monday Night Football game. Same issue (I think) - 720 broadcast being forced to 1080 on my display even though it's native resolution is 720 as well.

Question - would my picture be better if I forced it to display as 720p?

Follow up question - how would I do that?

Thanks for any help, much appreciated! If this is too basic a question for this forum if anyone can give me the answer offline that would be great too.
If it is macroblocking (adjoining blocks of pixels are assigned the same color), that is usually caused by low bit rates. If it is pixelization (screen breakup), that is usually caused by low signal power. Neither on will be caused by whether the STB is set to output 720p or 1080i. However perform the following.

To change resolutions

With the TV powered on, power off the STB and press Menu.
A Menu will appear that allows you to change the output resolution.

To check signal power

Select the channel that you want to test the signal strength for.
Power off the STB and within 2 seconds press Select/OK.
A diagnostic screen will appear. Down arrow to d04 - Inband Status.
Right Arrow to select the option.
There used to be an AGC entry and if that approached 100%, signal strength was too weak. However that entry was eliminated on the last firmware update so you may or may not have that entry. However there are indicators for correctable and uncorrectable errors. If any uncorrectable errors are occuring, you will have breakup. If correctable errors are in the low hundreds or less, your signal strength is probably OK.

Since your display device is 720p, there's no point in having your 6412 output 1080i. It should be set to output everything in 720p. (IIUC that the 6412 cannot be set to output "native" source formats and let your TV do its own conversions) That means that you'll avoid dual conversion of 720 feeds (720-->1080-->720) and only have the single STB conversion of 1080 feeds. Assuming that the 6412 does a decent job of that, your overall experience should improve.

THEORETICAL QUESTION - What can we say about the opposite (sort of) situation. My TV is capable of 1080i input. So it makes sense to set output at 1080i on 6412, right? But what I have discovered is my TV is better at upconverting than the 6412. What is interesting now is I feel any artificats in my PQ I can assign to the motobox, not the TV.

Would it ever make sense to set the 6412 to output lower than 1080, because the TV upconverts better than the Moto? Maybe better PQ on 480 and 720 broadcasts, and less quality on 1080? Would one make more difference than the other?

If the scaler in the Moto is noticeably worse than the one in your TV, you'd like to eliminate its scaling operations altogether, which you can do if you bypass it with your QAM tuner, of course, but that doesn't solve the problem for the encrypted channels. I don't think that there's any a priori argument for up- versus down-scalings being "easier" and therefore better left to the Moto. Since, AIUI, the Moto doesn't have the option for you to disable its scaling, you're stuck with it at least on some feeds.

I'm thinking of buying a Denon 2807 with HDMI switching. Big question: Will it work?


Today I received an e-mail from Motorola that reads as follows:

"Thank you for choosing Motorola! I apologize for any inconvenience you
are having and I will be happy to help you.

This firmware on the DCT3412 should work with HDMI switching. I don't
see any problems with that. The DCT 3412 will give a Copy Protection
error when the firmware has not been updated to 12.35 for later.

You can visit our web site at xxx to access your
user's guide and frequently asked questions about your product. Thank
you for choosing Motorola.

Sincerely,


Angela Dawley
Motorola Email Support"

Any comments? Does it work? It would be a real downer to spend a $1000 on a Denon and the HDMI switching won't work.

Thanks in advance for any honest feedback.

THEORETICAL QUESTION - What can we say about the opposite (sort of) situation. My TV is capable of 1080i input. So it makes sense to set output at 1080i on 6412, right? But what I have discovered is my TV is better at upconverting than the 6412. What is interesting now is I feel any artificats in my PQ I can assign to the motobox, not the TV.

Would it ever make sense to set the 6412 to output lower than 1080, because the TV upconverts better than the Moto? Maybe better PQ on 480 and 720 broadcasts, and less quality on 1080? Would one make more difference than the other?

I would think that it makes sense to have as few devices as possible doing the conversions. Make a choice between the STB and the TV. I've heard that in most cases, the TV will do a better job.

In your example, to convert a 1080i signal to output to your TV at 720p just so that your TV will convert back up to 1080i is a bad idea because the multiple conversions will degrade the signal. If the signal is 1080i, let it travel that way from the STB to the TV. In your situation, if you had to decide on how to treat a 720p signal (as it comes in from the cable lines to the box), then output to your TV at 720p because you'll want to have your TV doing the conversion instead of the STB (assuming the TV does a better job).

OK, thanks a bunch for this, that's really helpful info! I changed my output to 720. Unfortunately as there are no sports on right now I can't tell if it makes any difference. It did seem to make the text in the on screen guide slightly aliased, and I thought perhaps the picture on HBO was a little softer but I couldn't really tell.

I also checked signal strength - I don't have the AGC entry but had no correctable nor uncorrectable errors on ESPN...I guess that's a good thing.

Your overall point is that this really won't make a difference with regards to sports though...do I have that right?

Thanks again!

Alex



If it is macroblocking (adjoining blocks of pixels are assigned the same color), that is usually caused by low bit rates. If it is pixelization (screen breakup), that is usually caused by low signal power. Neither on will be caused by whether the STB is set to output 720p or 1080i. However perform the following.

To change resolutions

With the TV powered on, power off the STB and press Menu.
A Menu will appear that allows you to change the output resolution.

To check signal power

Select the channel that you want to test the signal strength for.
Power off the STB and within 2 seconds press Select/OK.
A diagnostic screen will appear. Down arrow to d04 - Inband Status.
Right Arrow to select the option.
There used to be an AGC entry and if that approached 100%, signal strength was too weak. However that entry was eliminated on the last firmware update so you may or may not have that entry. However there are indicators for correctable and uncorrectable errors. If any uncorrectable errors are occuring, you will have breakup. If correctable errors are in the low hundreds or less, your signal strength is probably OK.

Being able to accept a 1080i signal does not mean the TV has 1080 physical lines. If the TV has to convert from 1080i to 720p, then it's better not to convert a 720p signal to 1080i and back to 720p.

Every Motorola STB user on Comcast should switch to 720p output on their STB until 1080p becomes a standard on Cable STBs. I know its going to be a long time until that happens but it fixes all the problems with most tv's and provides a cleaner picture, especially considering that a lot of channels broadcast in 720p already.

Every Motorola STB user on Comcast should switch to 720p output on their STB until 1080p becomes a standard on Cable STBs. I know its going to be a long time until that happens but it fixes all the problems with most tv's and provides a cleaner picture, especially considering that a lot of channels broadcast in 720p already.

I think every Motorola STB user on Comcast should demand that Motorola give their STB boxes (Via firmware update) to pass the native resolution of any particular channel to the TV, a la boxes from Pioneer and Scientific Atlanta.

It is ridiculous that I have to turn off the TV and press menu to go back and forth between the box outputting 720p and 1080i (and lower for that matter, for garbage SD content), and then turn the TV back on. This is especially troublesome when I want to watch shows off the DVR, but it is recording a show so you can't turn off the box to change the resolution.

OK, thanks a bunch for this, that's really helpful info! I changed my output to 720. Unfortunately as there are no sports on right now I can't tell if it makes any difference. It did seem to make the text in the on screen guide slightly aliased, and I thought perhaps the picture on HBO was a little softer but I couldn't really tell.

I also checked signal strength - I don't have the AGC entry but had no correctable nor uncorrectable errors on ESPN...I guess that's a good thing.

Your overall point is that this really won't make a difference with regards to sports though...do I have that right?

Thanks again!

Alex
It shouldn't make any difference other than 720p output is usually a little softer (which you appear to be seeing) even if you have a 720p TV.

Get a TiVo Series 3 with native output, it solves all of those problems. If you really wants to get crazy, like me, also get a video processor like the DVDO, Lumagen, etc. and get the best picture quality possible. :)