San Francisco, CA - Comcast [Text View] - Page 57

keenan

12-07-06, 12:44 PM

RBurks

12-07-06, 01:11 PM

if you can get OTA...

Thanks Keenan,
I found this very cool web site

http://www.antennaweb.org

Based on your street location it will show you the orientation of all OTA towers and their range. Everyone seems to say the directional Silver Sensor OTA antenna is what to get.

BUT...even OTA there is no KQEDHD (any PBSHS for that matter), and not KRON4HD. I would have thought those were OTA.

So is my only option to keep KQEDHD to stay with Comcastic?

Mikef5

12-07-06, 01:13 PM

Mikef5

12-07-06, 01:28 PM

BUT...even OTA there is no KQEDHD (any PBSHS for that matter), and not KRON4HD. I would have thought those were OTA.

So is my only option to keep KQEDHD to stay with Comcastic?
I'm in Milpitas and use a Radio Shack indoor amped antenna and I get all the OTA channels for the Bay Area . KQED and KRON4HD are broadcasting .... KQED is on 9.1 for HD and 9.2 through 9.5 for their SD stuff. KRON4 is 4.1 for their SD and 4.2 for their HD. I was told I'd never be able to get all the channels with an indoor antenna but that's not true, it really depends on your location and if there is anything blocking your line of sight to the towers but it can be done, I'm doing it.

Laters,
Mikef5

bobby94928

12-07-06, 01:35 PM

Thanks Keenan,
I found this very cool web site

http://www.antennaweb.org

Based on your street location it will show you the orientation of all OTA towers and their range. Everyone seems to say the directional Silver Sensor OTA antenna is what to get.

BUT...even OTA there is no KQEDHD (any PBSHS for that matter), and not KRON4HD. I would have thought those were OTA.

So is my only option to keep KQEDHD to stay with Comcastic?

KQED-HD is OTA on channel 30. KRON-HD is OTA on channel 57. You should get these as well as all the others.

rjcrum

12-07-06, 02:04 PM

Well, I made my annual complaint call to Comcast yesterday. I live in the Comcast slums of Sunnyvale, and call once per year about this time to ask:

1. When will the Sunnyvale network be improved with more bandwith (answer yesterday: in the second half of 2007)
2. When will Sunnyvale get additional HD channels (answer yesterday: when the network is improved)
3. Why do I pay the same for HD channels when I only get half as many as other locations? (answer yesterday: the HD prices are the same around the Bay Area, but the overall cable cost in Sunnyvale is less than other areas for this reason)
4. I threatened to move to Dish after seeing a newspaper promotional insert that showed the (what must be) 25 HD channels on Dish (answer yesterday: I understand your frustration, sir, and you certainly could contemplate a move to Dish).

After all that, the CSR said "well, let's see what we can do about this...." and proceeded to offer me the Digital Silver tier, with HBO, for one year, for $12 less per month than I'm paying for Digital Classic. So, for $12 less per month, I'm getting the additional Digital Plus and Digital Silver channels, along with HBO in all its flavors, including the HBO-HD.

I claim this as a slight moral victory. I pay less money per month, and get the one additional HD channel in Sunnyvale.

So...anybody else hear that Sunnyvale will be improved "In the second half of 2007"? It seems to me that it's always been 6 - 12 months out for the past 24 months.

Bob

PS: For all you Comcast HSI users out there complaining about cost, you might want to ask about the annual pricing plan. I pay for HSI once per year, which costs me $389.00, or about $32.42 per month. If you can manage the large chunck once per year, you can save a bundle on the cost!

grooves12

12-07-06, 03:01 PM

a. no, unless you are in a local headend that isn't encrypting where they should be

b. you can receive unencrypted OTA channels with your QAM tuner, but it'll be on weird frequencies (?), ie instead of channel 2.1, it might be 112.1. not sure the technical jargon but you'll have to manually discover where a lot of these digital channels will be. the benefit of the HD box is that you won't have to search and remember weird channels numbers, its always on 700-740.

Ok, pretty much as I though... is FSN-BA typically encypted, or does that fall into the "local" category?

nikeykid

12-07-06, 03:12 PM

Ok, pretty much as I though... is FSN-BA typically encypted, or does that fall into the "local" category?

encrypted. you'll need at least digital classic on top of your standard cable to get it.

walk

12-07-06, 04:30 PM

the palo alto server shows 19.5 mbps download and 365kbps upload.
the new york server shows 6 mbps download and 360kpbs upload.Yeah something is wonky with that test right now I think. It's supposed to be 6mb, though they do raise the speed from time to time.. 19mb seems way out of line though.

CNet has a test here: http://reviews.cnet.com/7004-7254_7-0.html
Might try that..

PS: For all you Comcast HSI users out there complaining about cost, you might want to ask about the annual pricing plan. I pay for HSI once per year, which costs me $389.00, or about $32.42 per month. If you can manage the large chunck once per year, you can save a bundle on the cost!That's interesting, I'll have to ask about that. Is that with modem rental or without?

rjcrum

12-07-06, 06:02 PM

That's interesting, I'll have to ask about that. Is that with modem rental or without?

Nope; I own my own modem. Only makes sense, given the price of the lease vs. price of purchase, IMHO.

Bxz

12-07-06, 07:28 PM

keenan

12-07-06, 08:15 PM

I received a call from comcast saying they wanna update the cable card and i must be sitting in front of my TV, anybody know what's the reason? I'm just afraid some trouble might be coming after they try to mess around some update, my CC now is pretty stable.

thx in advance.
BXZ
They called me a couple of weeks ago. They just need some of the pairing info read to them off the CC info screen. It was posted about here, maybe, a month or so back, in this thread. There are no adverse effects, at least I haven't experienced any. It's not really Comcast calling you, it's a third party data collection outfit contracted by Comcast.

bareyb

12-07-06, 10:09 PM

My Comcast appointment came and went without a hitch. They showed up at 12:20 on a 12:00 to 4:00 appointment window. They knew about TiVo, they came with 4 cards (I have two S3 Tivos) and they were in and out in about 40 minutes or so. Guess I got lucky.

The only problem I had with Comcast was my picture had this HORRIBLE HORIZONTAL SCROLLING LINES!!! Man I was bummed. Then I remembered this little gadget I bought about 4 years ago called a "Ground breaker" and it eliminated the lines. I asked the cable guys if they had those on the truck but they said they didn't. So if I hadn't though of that I may have dumped Comcast and gone back to Sat. Those lines were a definite dealbreaker. Now the picture looks almost exactly the same as my Satellite picture from DirecTV. I only compared the locals in SD (my HD TV is being delivered Sunday) but to me on that TV they both looked great. So I'm happy so far. I still have a lot of work to do running all the HDMI cables and such under the house, but that's another thread. ;)

Feels good to be away from DirecTV and back with Cable. It's just an easier system to manage and as far as I can tell the Cableco PQ is at least as good as it was with Sat.

nikeykid

12-07-06, 11:24 PM

fender4645

12-07-06, 11:37 PM

nikeykid

12-07-06, 11:50 PM

Where does CW broadcast from? Sutro?

yes, antennaweb.com says its from sf. ahhh its so annoying to switch between my 6412 and the ATSC tuner, and i have to switch the input on my receiver between optical and coaxial. maybe one day i'll pick up the s3 so i can use both seamlessly :(

fender4645

12-08-06, 12:06 AM

yes, antennaweb.com says its from sf. ahhh its so annoying to switch between my 6412 and the ATSC tuner, and i have to switch the input on my receiver between optical and coaxial. maybe one day i'll pick up the s3 so i can use both seamlessly :(

Must be nice. Here in Moraga they'd have to put the transmission tower on top of my house in order to get any sort of signal. :(

RBurks

12-08-06, 12:11 AM

inspired by all the antenna talk today, i went out and got an RCA indoor antenna, with the SOLE purpose of getting the CW-HD. it worked!! (but boy an antenna is ugly). no need to wait for comcast to give this to me. wow good PQ. btw does KICU-HD do anything with HD?

Where did you get it? I was told to go to Radio Shack or Circuit City, and to get a directional, but the broadcast towers are spread in almost a 180 degree pattern from my house. Can't conceive of how that will work, but I want to try too.

I have to go down and pick one up tomorrow. What specific one did you get? Does it give you a reception qulaity number?

nikeykid

12-08-06, 12:19 AM

Where did you get it? I was told to go to Radio Shack or Circuit City, and to get a directional, but the broadcast towers are spread in almost a 180 degree pattern from my house. Can't conceive of how that will work, but I want to try too.

I have to go down and pick one up tomorrow. What specific one did you get? Does it give you a reception qulaity number?

27 bucks at walmart (looks like i overpaid):

http://www.audiooutfitter.com/store/315529/ANT1251.html

definitely get an amplified antenna and try it out. what's a directional antenna?? i'm such an OTA noob.

no reception reading on the antenna itself, my TV does that for me.

keenan

12-08-06, 12:34 AM

Larry Kenney

12-08-06, 02:52 AM

I have reached the breaking point on cost too with the 5.9% increase in Jan. Approaching $150 is not an acceptable number.

So in doing my research on DISH it appears I will gain some interesting channels like FoodHD and HGTVHD that will add to domestic tranquility, but it also seems I will lose some core channels like KQEDHD, KGOHD, and FSNHD. Can anybody confirm? I also like the Sunrise Earth series that I think is on IND, so is that available.

I know I should go to the Dish site to ask, but I figure so many others on Comcast are considering switch right now that this would be relevant info for many.

Thanks.

Oh yeah 1 last one. Is the DISH DVR good, or does it make more sense to go S3? I have the lifetime subscription transfer offer I can take advantage of.

I simply agree with everyone else here. Comcast's tier structuring is simply screwing those of us who ONLY care about HD.

RBurks... With an HD package on Dish you get 25 HD channels or more... depending on the package you get. The most inexpensive package is the Bronze, which offers 25 HD channels. For an additional $5 you get 20 local SD and 4 local HD channels. The local HD channels are KGO-ABC, KPIX-CBS, KNTV-NBC and KTVU-FOX. They do not offer FSN, CW or PBS HD. You can also get HBO, Showtime and Starz HD but you have to sign up for those movie packages.

Oh, and the price? I pay $67 a month for 29 HD channels (including the four locals), 80 SD national channels and 20 SD locals. That includes the ViP-622 DVR.

I'm not sure of the latest deal from Dish, but at one point the DVR cost $199, but they were offering a $200 rebate... so you actually made a penny on the deal. For that price you don't get to own it... it's a lease deal. You'll have to check the Dish Network web site for all the details on the latest offer.

The ViP-622 DVR is fantastic! Yes, Tivo has a lawsuit against Dish regarding the theft of the Tivo software, but where Tivo has problems, Dish doesn't.

The software in the 622 is fast, and there is no waiting for a response. You can skip ahead 30 seconds with a push of a button on the remote (and no secret code had to be entered for it to work), you can go back 10 seconds, fast forward and rewind at four different speeds up to X300, and pause. This all works for both live TV and recordings.

(An interesting side note: it actually says in the Operation Manual for the 622 "You cannot fast forward live TV." Aw... that's too bad. It'd be nice if we could fast forward to tonight's winning lottery numbers! :-0 )

The EPG on the 622 is really good and covers a 9 day period. You see three hours of programming for seven stations at at time on the screen, and you can advance by program or by day. (My only complaint is that some of the digital sub-channels do not have programming information provided. It simply says "Digital Service".)

Recordings are easy to set up and you can make it a one time deal, all editions of the program, or every new edition of the program. Using guide information it knows what's new and what's a re-run, and I've been amazed at the accuracy. You can record a program daily, M-F, or on a specific day of the week. You can also set up manual timings for a specific channel and time period. For example, I have a manual timing entry for KGO-DT 7.1 for 5:30 pm to 6:59 pm M-F. That way I get ABC "World News" and the ABC 7 6:00 pm news as one continuous file.

The 622 can record two programs from the satellite and one from the OTA tuner simultaneously while I can be watching a fourth program that's already recorded. The OTA tuner is a good one, too. I get more reliable reception from it than I do from the built-in tuner on my Sony, the MyHD or the Hi-Pix cards that I use.

The 622 is reliable, has never missed a recording I've requested, and doesn't seem to have any user interface problems. I've had it since February and have only had to reboot it twice.

I hope that helps. I don't think you'll be unhappy if you made the switch to Dish.

Larry
SF

12-08-06, 03:18 AM

The ViP-622 DVR is fantastic! Yes, Tivo has a lawsuit against Dish regarding the theft of the Tivo software, but where Tivo has problems, Dish doesn't.

hardware, not software

Larry Kenney

12-08-06, 04:08 AM

hardware, not software

Thanks for the correction!

Larry

neoufo51

12-08-06, 07:05 AM

I came to the thread late. Anybody else not able to access TNTHD, MHD and UHD?

nikeykid

12-08-06, 11:34 AM

I came to the thread late. Anybody else not able to access TNTHD, MHD and UHD?

what city are you from and what cable package do you have?

RBurks

12-08-06, 11:50 AM

I came to the thread late. Anybody else not able to access TNTHD, MHD and UHD?

I would assume you do not get them because you are a "grandfathered" AT&T customer. In real terms that means you have been a long time, loyal customer. In Comcast terms that means you are a drain on them and they want you to switch out of your grandfathered clause.

This is the main reason I am looking to switch to an alternate supplier. I have spent many many hours on the phone arguing with them about new HD channels. My argument is simple:

I PAY FOR TNT AND MTV IN MY GRANDFATHERED AT&T PACKAGE, SO WHY AREN'T I GETTING THEM IN HD?

Response is:

THESE ARE NEW CHANNELS (code for you are screwed)

RBurks

12-08-06, 12:10 PM

Everything you ever wanted to know and didn't want to know about OTA antennas.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=546066
Antennas, rotators, boosters/preamps... for wide-band VHF/UHF - AVS Forum

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=381623
The Official AVS Antenna Topic! - AVS Forum

Thanks Keenan,
I have purchased a Philips 50db amped antenna and the Zenith Silver Sensor and will give them a try this weekend. If I can get pick up the the missing HD channels from Dish (KQED/CW/KRON) reasonably well, I will likely be on my way out of Comcast. Especially if the Dish DVR is so much more Tivo like than the current 6412. That is like driving an Edsel. And it does appear that whatever Tivo software push was coming has been delayed yet again further into 2007.

nikeykid

12-08-06, 12:26 PM

Thanks Keenan,
I have purchased a Philips 50db amped antenna and the Zenith Silver Sensor and will give them a try this weekend. If I can get pick up the the missing HD channels from Dish (KQED/CW/KRON) reasonably well, I will likely be on my way out of Comcast. Especially if the Dish DVR is so much more Tivo like than the current 6412. That is like driving an Edsel. And it does appear that whatever Tivo software push was coming has been delayed yet again further into 2007.

kron is that important to you??? wicked wicked games LOL.

madkiwi

12-08-06, 12:58 PM

You guys looking for speed tests, I think you'll find that Speakeasy works best.

http://www.speakeasy.net/speedtest/

walk

12-08-06, 03:21 PM

Wow Dish is that much huh, and you have to buy all your own equipment, for "HD-lite"? Pass.

neoufo51

12-08-06, 06:59 PM

what city are you from and what cable package do you have?
Redwood. I've been using Comcast for 3 years. Not grandfathered in at all and I had those channels before. I've got the Basic Silver package with HD.

nikeykid

12-08-06, 07:13 PM

Redwood. I've been using Comcast for 3 years. Not grandfathered in at all and I had those channels before. I've got the Basic Silver package with HD.

digital silver? if you have digital silver you should be getting those 3 channels.

ethune

12-08-06, 07:23 PM

Wow Dish is that much huh, and you have to buy all your own equipment, for "HD-lite"? Pass.

wow, do you read? $199 plus a $200 rebate = free

i just got my 622 yesterday and it blows the 6412 out of the water. not even close. i feel stupid for waiting this long to change. when you live in a town with a 550Mhz front end, comcast just plain sucks. next to go is HSI since they screw you for not having cable. dsl is ordered...

eric

RBurks

12-08-06, 07:24 PM

kron is that important to you??? wicked wicked games LOL.

KRON for Bay Area Backroads. I really like it.

Finished test of Philips and Zenith antennas. Both no-go's in my area. Nearest tower is 22 miles and furthest is 45 - with hills. I only get NBCHD, KPIXHD, and a couple of digital.

Also TV recognizes the input quality as not good enough and automatically scales the HD image to letterbox (both vertically and horizontally). I've seen it do it on a couple of DVD's, but first time on a TV signal. HD PQ is average at best.

Bummer - looks like COMCAST holds me hostage...

TPeterson

12-08-06, 07:29 PM

sfhub

12-08-06, 07:40 PM

Also TV recognizes the input quality as not good enough and automatically scales the HD image to letterbox (both vertically and horizontally).
Most likely what happened is the content you happened to be viewing at the time was letterbox SD (black bars top/bottom) that was upconverted to 16:9 HD by the station (adding the black bars on the left/right)

If you continued watching the channel, eventually by 8pm some real HD content would show up and there would be visible picture across the whole screen again, irrespective of whether the signal quality improved.

RBurks

12-08-06, 08:16 PM

RBurks--

I've never heard of a DTV that switches display size based on reception quality. I think that you're misinterpreting what you're seeing.

Here in San Carlos, you should be able to get KTEH-DT (50) and KICU-DT (42--ed.: Oops, better make that "52") with an indoor antenna, but depending upon where you are w.r.t. the Belmont hills, you may well need an amplified hi-gain outdoor antenna, such as the CM 7777 and CM 4228 that I use to receive San Bruno Mt. and Sutro stations.

I am sure you are right. I simply am not getting much contnet to look at. I live up in the hills, and yes the Belmont hills to the North block direct LOS to Bruno and Sutro.

I did however pick up a KICU-HD. Is there really such a channel?

Maybe I need to play with it more, but I appreciated the ease of tuning when I went back to the QAM tuned channels and the cable box/DVR.

Thanks for correcting me. Lots to learn.

TPeterson

12-08-06, 08:28 PM

KICU and KTEH both transmit from the south East Bay hills and are quite strong here (but in nearly the opposite direction from the SF stations. KICU-DT has two subchannels that they call KICU-HD and KICU-SD, but AFAIK there has yet to be any actual HD content broadcast on KICU-HD or KTEH-DT. I'm hoping that the KQED-KTEH merger will eventually mean that KTEH-DT also carries some HD programming, but that's not yet happened.

Yes, there's a lot to be said for the convenience of a cable connection. :)

walk

12-08-06, 11:02 PM

walk

12-08-06, 11:11 PM

You guys looking for speed tests, I think you'll find that Speakeasy works best.

http://www.speakeasy.net/speedtest/

Well....

From the SFO server:

27178 kpbs download (362 kpbs upload).

So yeah, 27 megabits?

I call shennanigans!

SFO (another try):
http://home.comcast.net/~j.walkup/speed26mb.gif
Seriously, this can't be right.... can it?
I got about 6mbits to the NY server.
15 to Seattle
21 to LA
9 to Texas
8.5 to Chicago...

:eek:

Tom Koegel

12-09-06, 12:17 AM

Well, it took awhile, but the woes brought on by "upgrading" my Cablecard network settings were finally resolved.

As I posted a few pages back, when Comcast's service company called me to obtain various IDs for my cablecard necessary for their rollout of network Cablecard 2.0 software, my cablecard died. This happened immediately after they input the information into the system. The service company rep tried a couple of network resets to no avail, as did Comcast's telephone CSR.

They sent a repairman out a few days later, and he did some sort of manual reset on the card. That accomplished zero. He then said "gee, you may need one of the new, blue Cablecards" (The original was red with the Comcast logo.) "Those old red cards are a pain." He didn't have the blue card (natch), but he promised to come back two days hence with one. Gave me his cell phone number and everything. He just never arrived.

I then called Comcast the next day--a Saturday--and to my shock and astonishment they agreed to send a rep to repair the card on Sunday. The rep, clearly not a Comcast employee but a contractor, brough several of the blue cards with him. First card worked like a charm. Of course, in keeping with standard Comcast policy, they had told the guy nothing about my problems, so we had to waste time proving to him that it didn't work and trying all the simpler fixes. But when he inserted the blue card, all was well.

Of course, when Jan. rolls around and they rollout the network Cablecard 2.0 software, I'll probably find that they don't have a record of my serial numbers and all access will be cut off.

tskrainar

12-09-06, 06:33 PM

Well....

From the SFO server:

27178 kpbs download (362 kpbs upload).

So yeah, 27 megabits?

I call shennanigans!

:eek:

About a week or two ago, I noticed a big speed jump, so I went and benched my connection (also w/Speakeasy), and hit just over 11mbit. If I can hit that on my Comcastic 550 system, I'd guess other areas are configured for considerably more bandwidth than I'm getting.

keenan

12-09-06, 09:39 PM

keenan

12-09-06, 10:32 PM

mmmm...those are funny looking basketball players....

Mikef5

12-09-06, 10:59 PM

FSNBA-HD is back in Santa Rosa. NBA-TV is back on ch 6 as well, showing the Mavs/Nuggets game right now.

Amazingly enough, the Comcast website even lists FSNBA-HD in the Santa Rosa lineup, although it doesn't show NBA-TV.

Hornets at Warriors is supposed to be on FSNBA-HD at 7:30 according to the schedule.
Are you sure it's NBA-TV and not INHD1 ??? I'm watching the Mavs/Nuggets on INHD1, Sharks are on FSNBA-HD.

Laters,
Mikef5

nikeykid

12-09-06, 11:42 PM

mmmm...those are funny looking basketball players....

everything looks different in HD keenan ;)

JimTurner2

12-10-06, 01:41 AM

First post to this thread so apologies if I'm not starting a new subject correctly. I just got my HDTV on Tuesday (Sharp LC42D62U). On Wednesday I picked up a Motorola 6200 STB at the Comcast Mountain View office and upgraded my Comcast service to Digital classic with HDTV (total $15/month for the upgrade).

That STB doesn't have an HDMI output so I used the component output connection to my TV. That seems to work OK and I have good PQ on the channels that I expected to get :) . Since the STB box does have a DVI-D output, I bought a cable that converts a DVI output to HDMI. I just connected that and I don't get any picture when I switch to the HDMI input on my TV :( .

Has anyone tried doing this with their 6200 STB? Suggestions as to what's wrong? DVI output of the 6200 STB not capable of being converted to HDMI by the cable? Bad cable? Bad HDMI input on my new TV (it has two HDMI inputs and I tried them both)? Would the situation be similar for the 6412 STB/DVR?

Jim Turner
Menlo Park

keenan

12-10-06, 02:42 AM

Are you sure it's NBA-TV and not INHD1 ??? I'm watching the Mavs/Nuggets on INHD1, Sharks are on FSNBA-HD.

Laters,
Mikef5
It's definitely NBA-TV on ch-6 up here.

According to the Comcast schedule, the Warriors were supposed to be on FSNBA-HD, not the Sharks.

keenan

12-10-06, 02:46 AM

everything looks different in HD keenan ;)
Playing BB with ice skates might be interesting. :p

wish_i_had_hdtv

12-10-06, 03:05 AM

Sorry I'm just surprised how much Dish HD-lite is. They send me flyers every week for $19/mo!!!! with 4 free rooms!!!! and 2 free DVR!!!! and etc...

Big difference to $67/mo, for HD-lite and I have to buy the dish/etc.... that's just not a good deal.

I pay about $76 now for full-HD cable, DVR, and 2 HD boxes. If I got rid of the extra box (and I can still tune in analog and clear-QAM channels on all TVs in the house) I could probably get the bill down to under $69/mo for full-HD, about 13 HD channels (11 full-time), 200+ digital SD channels, and no equipment fees, ever, nada zip zero...

Yeah if I lived in a 550hz area that only got 5-6 HD channels I would probably dump cable (or, just get basic cable for the clear-QAM local HDs) and get Dish. No argument there man.

I am paying $106 just for Cable TV currently for:

1. Digital Silver $30
2. Basic Cable $50
3. 2 DVRs: $26

Its going to go further up come January. I am looking for a better deal and Dish n/w certainly looks interesting. There seems to be a $20 discount for new subscribers. So, HD Silver (26 HD channels + 200 SD channels) for only $40 + local + DVR fees + tax which would be around $63/63. However, I am not clear on a few things:

1. Does the 622 DVR control 2 HDTVs? If not, I guess I need to get 2 of those.
2. Not sure if there is a discount for the h/w.
3. Not sure if I need to buy the Dishes as well.

BTW - what is Dish-lite? Never heard of it...

GBruno

12-10-06, 12:19 PM

raghu1111

12-10-06, 01:58 PM

I have a 6200 connected with DVI-HDMI cable to TV. I suggest you power toggle TV and cable box. May be there was some problem with HDMI negotiation.

Of course the STB or cable could be defective but that is rare.

EDIT: Most likely this is the reason: Go to system menu with your component out. System menu can be accessed like this : power off STB and press Menu within two seconds (there are more detailed instructions earlier in this thread). There you can set DVI/ OUTPUT, 4:3 Override etc. Below these is "Additional HDMI SETTINGS". This is a new option after recent upgrade. If you have that go to that (right arrow) and set HDMI/DVI Mode to "DVI". If I set this to HDMI, I don't get anything on TV. Your STB might have this set to HDMI.

Has anyone tried doing this with their 6200 STB? Suggestions as to what's wrong? DVI output of the 6200 STB not capable of being converted to HDMI by the cable? Bad cable? Bad HDMI input on my new TV (it has two HDMI inputs and I tried them both)? Would the situation be similar for the 6412 STB/DVR?

Mikef5

12-10-06, 02:21 PM

It's definitely NBA-TV on ch-6 up here.

According to the Comcast schedule, the Warriors were supposed to be on FSNBA-HD, not the Sharks.
The only reason I was asking is that I saw the NBA-TV logo on the screen but it was on channel 719 which down here is INHD1, so I thought maybe they had given you guys INHD1 and FSNBA-HD but since it's channel 6 for you ( I assume that's an analog channel ) that kind of shoots that theory down... :p
Well, at least you got the channels back and Santa still has time to give out more presents..... one can only hope ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

keenan

12-10-06, 02:49 PM

The only reason I was asking is that I saw the NBA-TV logo on the screen but it was on channel 719 which down here is INHD1, so I thought maybe they had given you guys INHD1 and FSNBA-HD but since it's channel 6 for you ( I assume that's an analog channel ) that kind of shoots that theory down... :p
Well, at least you got the channels back and Santa still has time to give out more presents..... one can only hope ;)

Laters,
Mikef5
It's a digital QAM channel, I wouldn't be able to see it otherwise with the HDHR. It's an unusual channel number though. Ch 6 was originally a local access channel, in fact the guide still reflects that. I believe it's where they got the bandwidth for FSNBA-HD. I'm guessing Comcast just hasn't remapped a new channel number for the programming currently on Ch 6. I notice that NBA-TV is on Ch 416 in Petaluma, I think, so eventually NBA-TV will get a new channel number here. Or, they'll take it off. I'd rather they used the other half of the 6MHz for another HD channel instead of some SD channels such as NBA-TV.

Mikef5

12-10-06, 03:01 PM

It's a digital QAM channel, I wouldn't be able to see it otherwise with the HDHR. It's an unusual channel number though. Ch 6 was originally a local access channel, in fact the guide still reflects that. I believe it's where they got the bandwidth for FSNBA-HD. I'm guessing Comcast just hasn't remapped a new channel number for the programming currently on Ch 6. I notice that NBA-TV is on Ch 416 in Petaluma, I think, so eventually NBA-TV will get a new channel number here. Or, they'll take it off. I'd rather they used the other half of the 6MHz for another HD channel instead of some SD channels such as NBA-TV.
Wow, so NBA-TV is SD or is it 4x3 HD ??? What a waste, it was HD ( 16x9 ) on INHD1 but then again it could of been an up-converted SD signal but it didn't look like it, INHD normally does good HD programing at least to these old eyes ... :p

Laters,
Mikef5

keenan

12-10-06, 04:20 PM

Wow, so NBA-TV is SD or is it 4x3 HD ??? What a waste, it was HD ( 16x9 ) on INHD1 but then again it could of been an up-converted SD signal but it didn't look like it, INHD normally does good HD programing at least to these old eyes ... :p

Laters,
Mikef5
It's a digital 4x3 picture, like SciFi, or any of the other digital cable channels(non-HD). I think Comcast just hasn't remapped a new guide-used channel number yet as I'm getting it on the actual cable QAM-RF channel, which happens to be ch 6.

pappy97

12-10-06, 04:46 PM

FSNBA-HD is back in Santa Rosa. NBA-TV is back on ch 6 as well, showing the Mavs/Nuggets game right now.

Amazingly enough, the Comcast website even lists FSNBA-HD in the Santa Rosa lineup, although it doesn't show NBA-TV.

Hornets at Warriors is supposed to be on FSNBA-HD at 7:30 according to the schedule.

Well then the Comcrap website sucks. Ever since the Sharks season began, last night's game was to be on FSNBA-HD.

It was more fun, however, with my season tickets in person. :D

Mikef5

12-10-06, 04:55 PM

It's a digital 4x3 picture, like SciFi, or any of the other digital cable channels(non-HD). I think Comcast just hasn't remapped a new guide-used channel number yet as I'm getting it on the actual cable QAM-RF channel, which happens to be ch 6.
Sort of like what KICU does in it's OTA signal, it's transmitted in 720p but is in the 4x3 format, I've never seen a 16x9 picture from them, such a waste but better than analog any old day. I use to watch KICU for the A's games but I'm hoping FSNBA-HD will do more of their games next year, at least they do HD the right way. I can't believe that I just watched the Raider's get their butts trounced on CBS in 4x3 HD, it's bad enough the Raiders lost so bad but a SD format sucks, at least the 49er's can lose in glorious 16x9 HD... ( I figured if I bad mouth them they'll win ) ;)

Laters,
Mikef5

keenan

12-10-06, 05:32 PM

Sort of like what KICU does in it's OTA signal, it's transmitted in 720p but is in the 4x3 format, I've never seen a 16x9 picture from them, such a waste but better than analog any old day. I use to watch KICU for the A's games but I'm hoping FSNBA-HD will do more of their games next year, at least they do HD the right way. I can't believe that I just watched the Raider's get their butts trounced on CBS in 4x3 HD, it's bad enough the Raiders lost so bad but a SD format sucks, at least the 49er's can lose in glorious 16x9 HD... ( I figured if I bad mouth them they'll win ) ;)

Laters,
Mikef5
Well, it's not being transmitted in 720p or 1080i, it's just whatever a normal digital cable channel would be broadcast at. No doubt there's still room at that freq for more SD channels, like some more jewelry shopping channels, can't have too many of those. :rolleyes: :D

JimTurner2

12-10-06, 05:41 PM

EDIT: Most likely this is the reason: Go to system menu with your component out. System menu can be accessed like this : power off STB and press Menu within two seconds (there are more detailed instructions earlier in this thread). There you can set DVI/ OUTPUT, 4:3 Override etc. Below these is "Additional HDMI SETTINGS". This is a new option after recent upgrade. If you have that go to that (right arrow) and set HDMI/DVI Mode to "DVI". If I set this to HDMI, I don't get anything on TV. Your STB might have this set to HDMI.

raghu1111,

Thanks for your response. I'll bet that you've identified the problem. My 6200 STB doesn't have the option that you mention on its system menu so I must not have the upgrade that you refer to. I'll contact Comcast tomorrow and see what I need to do to get that upgrade.

keenan

12-10-06, 06:02 PM

I am paying $106 just for Cable TV currently for:

1. Digital Silver $30
2. Basic Cable $50
3. 2 DVRs: $26

Its going to go further up come January. I am looking for a better deal and Dish n/w certainly looks interesting. There seems to be a $20 discount for new subscribers. So, HD Silver (26 HD channels + 200 SD channels) for only $40 + local + DVR fees + tax which would be around $63/63. However, I am not clear on a few things:

1. Does the 622 DVR control 2 HDTVs? If not, I guess I need to get 2 of those.
2. Not sure if there is a discount for the h/w.
3. Not sure if I need to buy the Dishes as well.

BTW - what is Dish-lite? Never heard of it...
I've responded to your post in the DBS thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9132239#post9132239
San Francisco, CA - DBS - AVS Forum

neoufo51

12-10-06, 07:05 PM

This blows. TNTHD, MHD AND UHD are still not working for me.

nikeykid

12-10-06, 07:23 PM

This blows. TNTHD, MHD AND UHD are still not working for me.

does it say, "this channel will be available shortly"?

walk

12-10-06, 11:24 PM

About a week or two ago, I noticed a big speed jump, so I went and benched my connection (also w/Speakeasy), and hit just over 11mbit. If I can hit that on my Comcastic 550 system, I'd guess other areas are configured for considerably more bandwidth than I'm getting.
I'm getting consistantly 19 to 27 megabits. That's basically un-capped (as I understand it this type of cable modem is good for potentially 30mbits). Wow.

I wouldn't expect it to last, though.

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17406858?r=95

http://www.dslreports.com/archive/comcast.net?zip=949&start=Search

bareyb

12-10-06, 11:51 PM

My Cable Cards are acting up. Sometimes they can tune a channel and other times it just sits there. One of the card didn't work all day and is now working... I called Comcast and they zapped it again but it didn't work. They referred me to a cable card specialist who doesn't work weekends. I'll let you guys know how it turns out. My fingers are crossed. I'd hate to have to go Satellite again. Just way too many new wires to run for an HD Dish...

12-11-06, 01:28 AM

Are you having problem with encrypted channels only, or unencrypted channels as well? CableCards are not tuners.

Bxz

12-11-06, 04:44 PM

The contractor mentioned comcast will roll out the 2.0 sw to enable some feature such as pay per view and VOD. I thought as the cablecard version 1, we won't be able to do that, will we?

BXZ

Well, it took awhile, but the woes brought on by "upgrading" my Cablecard network settings were finally resolved.

As I posted a few pages back, when Comcast's service company called me to obtain various IDs for my cablecard necessary for their rollout of network Cablecard 2.0 software, my cablecard died. This happened immediately after they input the information into the system. The service company rep tried a couple of network resets to no avail, as did Comcast's telephone CSR.

They sent a repairman out a few days later, and he did some sort of manual reset on the card. That accomplished zero. He then said "gee, you may need one of the new, blue Cablecards" (The original was red with the Comcast logo.) "Those old red cards are a pain." He didn't have the blue card (natch), but he promised to come back two days hence with one. Gave me his cell phone number and everything. He just never arrived.

I then called Comcast the next day--a Saturday--and to my shock and astonishment they agreed to send a rep to repair the card on Sunday. The rep, clearly not a Comcast employee but a contractor, brough several of the blue cards with him. First card worked like a charm. Of course, in keeping with standard Comcast policy, they had told the guy nothing about my problems, so we had to waste time proving to him that it didn't work and trying all the simpler fixes. But when he inserted the blue card, all was well.

Of course, when Jan. rolls around and they rollout the network Cablecard 2.0 software, I'll probably find that they don't have a record of my serial numbers and all access will be cut off.

nikeykid

12-11-06, 04:48 PM

atperson100

12-11-06, 05:08 PM

Found this on YouTube:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=oMtJ6wZPxbw
Looks like KGO HD news graphics. I wonder if its real.

mterzich

12-11-06, 05:09 PM

The contractor mentioned comcast will roll out the 2.0 sw to enable some feature such as pay per view and VOD. I thought as the cablecard version 1, we won't be able to do that, will we?

BXZ
What does he mean by 2.0 sw? Is that the software version of the cable card? I suspect that the cable card would need to be the version 2 hardware as well as the TV or Tvio would require both software and hardware to communicate with a version 2 cable card which is currently unlikely (interface with the cable card to display screens and accept entries).

sfhub

12-11-06, 05:11 PM

They mean the headend SW don't they?

Bxz

12-11-06, 05:27 PM

I think he means their sw2.0, but still not sure how VOD can be done. I told him if they'll send us CCv2, our TV won't be able to use it. anyway, we'll see next month.

What does he mean by 2.0 sw? Is that the software version of the cable card? I suspect that the cable card would need to be the version 2 hardware as well as the TV or Tvio would require both software and hardware to communicate with a version 2 cable card which is currently unlikely (interface with the cable card to display screens and accept entries).

keenan

12-11-06, 06:37 PM

Found this on YouTube:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=oMtJ6wZPxbw
Looks like KGO HD news graphics. I wonder if its real.
Looks good, I would imagine it will be very similar to KABC-LA. I'd have to watch KABC tonight to compare as I don't remember if it's the same setup.

keenan

12-11-06, 06:54 PM

They mean the headend SW don't they?
I think there's two different things being discussed here. What I believe the tech is referring to is what's called the "M-Card" which is a single CableCARD capable of decrypting 2 independent streams(channels). This is still a unidirectional device. For example, the S3 TiVo will only need one CC to still be a dual tuner device.

CableCARD 2.0 is a true bidirectional device which would allow VOD, PPV, etc. As far as I know there are no CC 2.0 devices on the market yet.

The S3 TiVo is apparently capable of being firmware upgraded to allow use of M-Card though.

Multi-stream Capability for “Plug and Play” Devices

Louisville, Colorado, November 13, 2006—Working in conjunction with various technology providers, CableLabs® has opened a streamlined process under which retail “Plug and Play” devices can receive multiple streams of programming from new multi-stream CableCARD™s (or M-Card™s). The CableLabs effort was supported by TiVo, Motorola, Digeo, Solekai, Digital Keystone, and ViXS.

The M-Card interface will allow multiple digital video streams to be decrypted simultaneously, even on unidirectional devices. Thus, a cable subscriber using an M-Card-enabled “Plug and Play” device can view one cable channel, while recording another. It is expected that DVR type devices will be the first to make use of the new multi-stream interface.

CableLabs has published new testing procedures to verify M-Card compatibility. In order to speed the availability of M-Cards for “Plug and Play” devices, CableLabs will begin offering verification testing of the multi-stream interface beginning with CableLabs Certification Wave 49 in January 2007. After initial verification, manufacturers may self-verify that their M-Card-enabled devices are compliant.

“Through the OpenCable™ testing and specification drafting process, CableLabs is uniquely able to bring the cable and consumer electronics industries together to produce innovative retail products,” said Richard R. Green, President and CEO of CableLabs. “Working cooperatively, our industries can delivery a better product for our mutual customers,” he added.

Founded in 1988 by members of the cable television industry, Cable Television Laboratories is a non-profit research and development consortium that is dedicated to pursuing new cable telecommunications technologies and to helping its cable operator members integrate those advancements into their business objectives. Cable operators from around the world are members. CableLabs maintains web sites at www.cablelabs.com; www.packetcable.com; www.cablemodem.com; www.cablenet.org; and www.opencable.com.

http://www.cablelabs.com/news/pr/2006/06_pr_mcard_udcp_111306.html
Multi-stream Capability for "Plug and Play" Devices

A review of the different CableCARDs,

http://www.opencable.com/primer/cablecard_primer.html
CableCard Primer

The primer is interesting in that it explains that CC 1.0 is actually capable of two-way operation and it's the host device that is the one that prevents the two-way capability.

wish_i_had_hdtv

12-11-06, 07:28 PM

I've responded to your post in the DBS thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9132239#post9132239
San Francisco, CA - DBS - AVS Forum

Thanks Keenan. I have susbscribed to that one too. :-)

I will dig into this a little bit more...

neoufo51

12-12-06, 03:22 AM

does it say, "this channel will be available shortly"?
YES! It's not working at all and I keep waiting. Anybody else in my area (Redwood City) having the same problem?

nikeykid

12-12-06, 03:35 AM

YES! It's not working at all and I keep waiting. Anybody else in my area (Redwood City) having the same problem?

i had the same problem with ESPN2HD and TNTHD for about 2 days recently, i called to complain my local headend is at fault, and they insisted they needed to send a tech to my house. so i let them, except the channels came back 2 days later and i canceled the appointment just in time.

i would call them and complain, but don't let them dupe you into an appointment. just let them know that all the other channels you subscribe to are OK.

phototrek

12-12-06, 11:21 PM

i had the same problem with ESPN2HD and TNTHD for about 2 days recently, i called to complain my local headend is at fault, and they insisted they needed to send a tech to my house. so i let them, except the channels came back 2 days later and i canceled the appointment just in time.

i would call them and complain, but don't let them dupe you into an appointment. just let them know that all the other channels you subscribe to are OK.
I am in Santa Clara. These two channels went out sometime last week - noticed when I wanted to record Lord of the rings. Called Comcast various times. They seem to believe that these channels aren't in my line-up. This is funny, because I am showing recordings from TNT-HD on my Tivo Series 3 as late as 12/3.
Funny thing is, when you go to the Comcast web site and look for the channel lineup for my address, you get a popup with SIX different lineups, two of which indeed don't have these channels. It's beyond me how their web site can't figure out which lineup I have, even though I provided exact street address; I suspect that their CSRs have the same issue telling which lineup I have.
A tech is coming on Wed to see what's up. I have no clue what could be causing it, nor do I particularly care as long as they can fix it. If the two cable cards got somehow stuck or whatever, who knows. I rebooted the Tivo numerous times and still no TNTHD. In my neighborhood everyone else has DTV or Dish, so it's not that I can go ask my neighbors...

Derek87

12-12-06, 11:35 PM

Back to a topic of a couple of weeks ago...

has everyone given up on being able to record KTVU and KPIX over firewire from A Motorola 6200 box to their PC/Mac?

i finally had the chance to catch up on the archives and sure enough i am now having the problems described by others trying to record Fox and CBS shows which have a broadcast flag which doesn't seem to allow an "unauthorized device" such a PC to record the stream at least once.

what i didn't see discussed above is _when_ this happened. i don't watch much CBS primetime or need to record it, but i know for a fact that i had previously been able to record Prison Break earlier in the season using my old Powerbook Ti. I gave up that recording method however because the playback speed was too slow. i revisited it tonight though with my new macbook and sadly confirmed that that is no longer possible (ie, recording KTVU). [i also tried the same PB just in case it was somehow a software version issue, but alas, it was not]

the previous posts seem to suggest that nothing can be done here. is that the case? does anyone have any insight as to why KTVU changed their broadcast flag recently? (i think i did my previous recording probably in October, episodes 3-4)

dr1394

12-13-06, 06:24 AM

Does anyone have any insight as to why KTVU changed their broadcast flag recently? (i think i did my previous recording probably in October, episodes 3-4)
The stations have been sending the broadcast flag for quite a while now. Here's a post I made in March of 2005:

http://archive2.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5377162&&#post5377162

Even PBS was sending it back then.

It's the firmware in the Motorola STB's that's changed. I first started seeing these complaints from 6412 Phase 3 users, but now it seems like all the Motorola STB's have this "feature".

Ron

nikeykid

12-13-06, 11:34 AM

I am in Santa Clara. These two channels went out sometime last week - noticed when I wanted to record Lord of the rings. Called Comcast various times. They seem to believe that these channels aren't in my line-up. This is funny, because I am showing recordings from TNT-HD on my Tivo Series 3 as late as 12/3.
Funny thing is, when you go to the Comcast web site and look for the channel lineup for my address, you get a popup with SIX different lineups, two of which indeed don't have these channels. It's beyond me how their web site can't figure out which lineup I have, even though I provided exact street address; I suspect that their CSRs have the same issue telling which lineup I have.
A tech is coming on Wed to see what's up. I have no clue what could be causing it, nor do I particularly care as long as they can fix it. If the two cable cards got somehow stuck or whatever, who knows. I rebooted the Tivo numerous times and still no TNTHD. In my neighborhood everyone else has DTV or Dish, so it's not that I can go ask my neighbors...

TNT and ESPN2HD are very new additions so i'm not surprised the website isn't updated yet.

Derek87

12-13-06, 11:48 AM

thanks for the explanation Ron.

follow-up idea (although it will cost me): does anyone out there use the Miglia miniTV HD device (seeing that the eyetv 500 is discontinued/hard to find)?

this handles unencrypted QAM, but will it have the same problem i'm having now with firewire? ie, i doubt its an "authorized device" but it would be taking in the raw cable stream from the wall for the local stations...

(i might try a amplified indoor antenna with it as well , but since Santa Clara is a hefty distance from the main tower, i'm not optimistic i'll get much that way)

thanks for any thoughts...

The stations have been sending the broadcast flag for quite a while now. Here's a post I made in March of 2005:

http://archive2.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5377162&&#post5377162

Even PBS was sending it back then.

It's the firmware in the Motorola STB's that's changed. I first started seeing these complaints from 6412 Phase 3 users, but now it seems like all the Motorola STB's have this "feature".

Ron

TPeterson

12-13-06, 12:45 PM

Derek--

Any of the non-Moto STB methods of capturing the clear-QAM transport stream (e.g., from personal experience, MyHD and FusionHDTV) will work fine. The Moto STB seems (so far) uniquely hung up on interpreting that BF as a 5C directive.

Derek87

12-13-06, 01:19 PM

thanks for the feedback. it seems then that this is the direction i should be looking into since all i really want to record are a couple of network shows a week.

i didn't intend to spend any more money on this little project, but it seems that in the end it is probably necessary and will buy the convenience of a little more useful software than just using things from the Developer toolkit for firewire.

Derek--

Any of the non-Moto STB methods of capturing the clear-QAM transport stream (e.g., from personal experience, MyHD and FusionHDTV) will work fine. The Moto STB seems (so far) uniquely hung up on interpreting that BF as a 5C directive.

keenan

12-13-06, 02:35 PM

You might take a look at the Silicon Dust HDHomeRun. It's a dual tuner device for both ATSC and clear-QAM.

http://www.silicondust.com/zxc/content/view/5/26/
Silicondust Engineering - HDHomeRun

A couple of reviews,

http://www.dvrplayground.com/article/13944/HDHomeRun--Record-OTA-HD-Programs-without-Installing-a-Tuner-Card/
HDHomeRun: Record OTA HD Programs without Installing a Tuner Card: DVR playground

http://www.techwandering.com/2006/12/12/hdhomerun-because-hdtv-isnt-just-for-tvs/
HDHomeRun - Because HDTV isn’t just for TV’s | TechWandering

atperson100

12-13-06, 03:22 PM

http://72.14.209.104/search?q=cache:5RlpUnj92J0J:www.tvnewsday.com/articles/2006/12/01/daily.2/&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=5&client=firefox-a
Here's a story saying that KGO will be doing HD news in the "next 90 days" and Chicago's WLS, too...

Derek87

12-13-06, 04:14 PM

thanks keenan,

looks like an intriguing device that sort of fits a unix/open source guy like myself (although i'd be using this with Mac's (which are of course unix too)).

it seems only 9th tee sells it and their return policy and credit card charging policies leave much to be desired. what i may just end up doing is try out the Miglia (which is less flexible but more "world tested") from the local CompUSA to see if i like it. if i don't, at least in theory, it would be returnable without any questions asked or difficulties.

You might take a look at the Silicon Dust HDHomeRun. It's a dual tuner device for both ATSC and clear-QAM.

http://www.silicondust.com/zxc/content/view/5/26/
Silicondust Engineering - HDHomeRun

A couple of reviews,

http://www.dvrplayground.com/article/13944/HDHomeRun--Record-OTA-HD-Programs-without-Installing-a-Tuner-Card/
HDHomeRun: Record OTA HD Programs without Installing a Tuner Card: DVR playground

http://www.techwandering.com/2006/12/12/hdhomerun-because-hdtv-isnt-just-for-tvs/
HDHomeRun - Because HDTV isn’t just for TV’s | TechWandering

keenan

12-13-06, 04:51 PM

thanks keenan,

looks like an intriguing device that sort of fits a unix/open source guy like myself (although i'd be using this with Mac's (which are of course unix too)).

it seems only 9th tee sells it and their return policy and credit card charging policies leave much to be desired. what i may just end up doing is try out the Miglia (which is less flexible but more "world tested") from the local CompUSA to see if i like it. if i don't, at least in theory, it would be returnable without any questions asked or difficulties.
If you have any trouble with the device talk to Nick(jafa) at Silicon Dust directly. Seems to be a pretty good guy and I'm sure a return issue could be worked out. Although judging from the Silicon Dust forum, and from my own experience using it with SageTV, it appears to be an extremely problem-free device.

Link to the forum,

http://www.silicondust.com/forum/index.php
Silicondust :: Index

phototrek

12-13-06, 10:28 PM

TNT and ESPN2HD are very new additions so i'm not surprised the website isn't updated yet.
The web site has been updated; it was the CSRs who looked at me quite strangely when I told them that I had TNTHD and then no more.

At any rate, the tech came today and made me feel really like a complete idiot. He was very nice, knowledgeable and forthcoming. He measured the signal and ... fixed the problem by replacing the cable coming from the outlet to the Tivo. How on earth can one spontaneously lose two channels because the cable decides to go bad? Needless to say, I was amazed and felt silly. He was clearly relieved that he didn't have to troubleshoot a cable card issue :)

Larry Kenney

12-14-06, 04:23 AM

Found this on YouTube:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=oMtJ6wZPxbw
Looks like KGO HD news graphics. I wonder if its real.

http://72.14.209.104/search?q=cache...lient=firefox-a
Here's a story saying that KGO will be doing HD news in the "next 90 days" and Chicago's WLS, too...

After seeing these two posts I checked with my old boss at KGO and he wrote:

"We are working on our HD control room for news. Look for KGO News in HD sometime early next year. We've already changed out the SD router for an HD one and we have changed the digital audio router as well. We're very busy here."

Larry
SF

wco81

12-14-06, 08:25 AM

KGO needs to first work on getting it's ABC broadcasts, especially sports, at least on par with other ABC stations, to get rid of the smearing/motion artifacts.

Sticman

12-14-06, 12:56 PM

I can't find this anywhere here so...

I'm using the Comcast cable connected directly to the QAM tuner in my TV...no comcast box.

Does anyone know where/if the KNTV ("nbc11) HD signal is present? It did not show up from the scan. I'm in SaraMilGatos. I know their HD signal is on VHF and not UHF...maybe comcast doesn't pipe it through because of that.

Thanks alot.

That Don Guy

12-14-06, 02:49 PM

On Wednesday night, whenever I tried to tune into InDemand HD (719) through my Motorola 6412 box, the screen froze with an image from the channel I was changing from. I think the Warriors-Kings game was being shown on that channel; it was definitely being shown on FSNBA-HD (720), and I had no problems with that station.

I assume the broadcast on 719 was being blacked out because of the NBA local area exclusivity rules. (Never mind that 725 was also airing "bonus coverage" of the same game...)
Is this screen freeze something that usually happens with Comcast in situations like this?

-- Don

fuhkinay

12-14-06, 02:51 PM

bobby94928

12-14-06, 03:08 PM

Is this screen freeze something that usually happens with Comcast in situations like this?

-- Don

Yes.....

Poochie

12-14-06, 04:57 PM

Anyone watch the Sharks game on FSN+ on Tuesday night? If so, did you get sound during the game?

I'm in the low-bandwidth section of Sunnyvale, and using my TiVo S3 I got video but no sound. My receiver (connected thru optical) read "Dolby D" but no sound was heard. I'm wondering if it was a FSN+ issue, a Comcast issue, or a TiVo S3 issue, that caused the game to be quiet. For reference, I've never had sound problems with analog, digital non-HD, or any of the HD channels, using my setup. Also, when I tuned the same channel (410) "live" on Wednesday night, when I was watching the game, I was hearing sound to go along with the fabulous Jewelry TV that sits there more of the time.

fyi, I'm also tracking the thread on TiVoCommunity's S3 section on "No Audio on Four Channels"

zalusky

12-14-06, 11:30 PM

After seeing these two posts I checked with my old boss at KGO and he wrote:

"We are working on our HD control room for news. Look for KGO News in HD sometime early next year. We've already changed out the SD router for an HD one and we have changed the digital audio router as well. We're very busy here."

Larry
SF

The news is one thing but what about forwarding their syndicated shows in HD like say Jeopardy and Wheel. I know their broadcast in HD. Also being able to tape delay the HD as well.

John Mace

12-14-06, 11:31 PM

I get nada on 720, which should be showing the Sharks game-- nada, as in it's like the channel isn't even there. Any info on what's going on...?

Larry Kenney

12-15-06, 03:01 AM

The news is one thing but what about forwarding their syndicated shows in HD like say Jeopardy and Wheel. I know their broadcast in HD. Also being able to tape delay the HD as well.

They're still waiting for the receiver to arrive that's needed to receive Jeopardy and Wheel in HD. Those programs are on a different satellite than the SD feed and the ABC Network HD feed and can't be received by the network dish and receiver. They're waiting for the equipment to arrive. When it's installed you'll see the shows in HD.

Tape delay in HD is probably a long way off. They don't do it enough to make it worth the expense.

Larry
SF

neoufo51

12-15-06, 05:38 AM

MANNAXMAN

12-15-06, 03:35 PM

I'm in the low-bandwidth section of Sunnyvale...
Does anyone know where the NON-low-bandwidth section of Sunnyvale is? I've heard that such a section exists, but all of the channel line ups for Sunnyvale on the Comcast web site are the same. I've been following this thread for just over a year, and I've never seen a post from someone that resides in this (fictional?) section during that time frame. Can anyone confirm such a section exists?

Brian Conrad

12-15-06, 03:49 PM

walk

12-15-06, 07:12 PM

That thing is a twisty maze of passages, all alike.

720 was blacked out last night because of the NFL game. (I guess they don't have the b/w to show both?) The Sharks game was on ch 40 (with sound). I guess the Warriors was on 410. I forgot they were even playing last night, didn't look for it.

John Mace

12-15-06, 07:38 PM

720 was blacked out last night because of the NFL game. (I guess they don't have the b/w to show both?) The Sharks game was on ch 40 (with sound). I guess the Warriors was on 410. I forgot they were even playing last night, didn't look for it.
Yeah, I ended up watching CH40. But the football game was on the NFL network. Does comcast ever broadcast that feed on 720? The guide said "Sharks". For a channel that is usually broadcasting nothing 90% of the time to be blacked out is just ridiculous. I can't wait to get rid of Comcast...

walk

12-15-06, 08:19 PM

I really couldn't tell you why, but in the past when they have used channel 725, they blank channel 720. I assume it's because they both share the same router or something.

bobby94928

12-15-06, 09:08 PM

I really couldn't tell you why, but in the past when they have used channel 725, they blank channel 720. I assume it's because they both share the same router or something.

In Rohnert Park, both 720 and 725 share the same frequency. Maybe that's it.

walk

12-16-06, 09:51 PM

mjhhmb

12-17-06, 12:16 AM

Must be. The NFL game is on 725 again, and again 720 is dark.

Also, anyone else notice the sound on the NFL game is L+R only? I mean, receiver is on Dolby Digital 5.1 but sound is only coming out of the L & R.. absolutely zero sound from Center or any surround speaker..
I noticed the audio issue on the NFL network game too, thanks for confirming. I had just set up a new HT system and wasted 20 minutes trying to troubleshoot the lack of surround.

neoufo51

12-17-06, 06:32 AM

BTW, though not HD I found out that Comcast is hiding Battlestar Gallactica OnDemand in the Cutting Edge section under SciFi. I wonder who puts together these menus? It should be under TV Entertainment. And if you look under Premium Channels you'll see more listings for Encore and Starz HD movies than in the HD movies section.
That's a godsend for me. I've been watching the show exclusively on this since they play it Friday nights when its just not a night to be staying home watching tv.

Of course, we will be getting the show on Sundays at 10 starting next month. Now, if only UHD would start playing Season 3 twice a week during the hiatus so people can catch up on the season so far in HD, and then play them a with a week delay from then on :(

bagofchips

12-17-06, 12:14 PM

I am in San Francisco (94116) and have Comcast Enhanced - not clear from their website if this means I'm getting digital clear QAM channels - I AM able to get VOD OD through my stb (which I don't even have connected to this TV, just trying to point out why I think I have digital). This indicates to me I get digital something. I recently got a MAG ma-32ef1ac (Staples Black Friday doorbuster). Unless what I've read is wrong, this TV has a QAM HD tuner, not just OTA. Assuming it does, doesn't that mean I should be able to pick up some clear QAM HD / digital channels when I do set up on the thing?

Btw, Comcast tech support was ridiculously incompetent - they didn't know what QAM is, didn't think I could get any HD / digital w/o having a box or card, and couldn't speak to what specifically is available in which metros!

So far, no dice...

davisdog

12-17-06, 12:28 PM

Not sure if anybody already saw/posted (don't read this thread as often since I switched to Dish (spend too much time watching all my HD now ;)

But the city of Saratoga announced recently that they signed an agreement with AT&T to be one of the first communities in the area to get project lightspeed (ie HD over telephone lines)

The city council bashed comcast for not upgrading the area and hoped this would spur competition...

It was in the local community paper (Saratoga News)...The website is down so I can't see the online version but I'll post it later.

nikeykid

12-17-06, 12:30 PM

bagofchips

12-17-06, 04:08 PM

(manual link deleted)

no QAM tuner, just ATSC. you will need to get a STB with HD to get HD from comcast.

Thanks... I have seen that, but I've also seen some posts on a few sites indicating in fact it does have QAM. Maybe it's urban myth. Channel setup / scan on "cable" indicates it's looking for digital channels, so not sure what it else it could have or be doing if QAM capability not resident? Or could it just be looking for OTA carried over the coax in a different way?

Thread 754996 here @ AVS (I can't post URLs until I've posted 5 posts, apparently, maybe somebody more trustworth can link it!) indicates there IS QAM (some confusion even in this thread!) need to split the signal to the OTA coax jack as well as the cable coax jack... while i've tried connecting the cable directly and singlularly to the OTA jack (null result), I'll try the split approach and report back.

Sticman

12-17-06, 06:15 PM

I assume you mean Los Gatos. I'm in Campbell and I get NBC11 HD on 79-1.

Hope this helps.
To anyone in SaraMilGatos...Help!

I'm just trying to find NBC 11's HD signal on Comcast's cable on a QAM tuner...cable plugged directly into the TV (no cable box).

79-1 has zero signal, so that's not it.

Thanks.

amdspitfire

12-17-06, 08:03 PM

To anyone in SaraMilGatos...Help!

I'm just trying to find NBC 11's HD signal on Comcast's cable on a QAM tuner...cable plugged directly into the TV (no cable box).

79-1 has zero signal, so that's not it.

Thanks.

i think its 33-1

amdspitfire

12-17-06, 08:07 PM

Mikef5

12-17-06, 08:22 PM

i think its 33-1
Yes, it is 33-1
CBS is 24-7 and Fox is 24-9 and ABC is 99-1 and KQED-HD is 99-2 ( that is the way my LG-4200a tuner sees them so it might be different on your tuner ).

Laters,
Mikef5

Sticman

12-17-06, 08:25 PM

i think its 33-1
That's it.
Thanks so much!

ethune

12-18-06, 11:10 AM

great news, I hope Los Gatos follows suite or comcast gets going...

since los gatos is verizon it won't happen. i wish they would do fios in our area but that is highly unlikely...

i moved to dish and couldnt be happier

eric

sfhub

12-18-06, 02:24 PM

Thanks... I have seen that, but I've also seen some posts on a few sites indicating in fact it does have QAM. Maybe it's urban myth. Channel setup / scan on "cable" indicates it's looking for digital channels, so not sure what it else it could have or be doing if QAM capability not resident? Or could it just be looking for OTA carried over the coax in a different way?

Thread 754996 here @ AVS (I can't post URLs until I've posted 5 posts, apparently, maybe somebody more trustworth can link it!) indicates there IS QAM (some confusion even in this thread!) need to split the signal to the OTA coax jack as well as the cable coax jack... while i've tried connecting the cable directly and singlularly to the OTA jack (null result), I'll try the split approach and report back.
Some of the Sceptre's from Costco also had QAM tuners despite only listing ATSC/8VSB and NTSC tuners in the specs. I don't know for sure about Mag either way, but sometimes with rebranding, there are shared components.

sfhub

12-18-06, 02:28 PM

I have a friend in SoCal with Charter cable and they use PSIP type mappings for some of their regular digital SD cable channels. I was surprised to see channels like 714, 715, etc. on their system. Would be nice if Comcast did that for the ADS digital simulcast channels here in Bay Area.

rjcrum

12-18-06, 02:50 PM

Well, I made my annual complaint call to Comcast yesterday. I live in the Comcast slums of Sunnyvale...

I also made a call to the City of Sunnyvale today, using the number provided on the bottom of my Comcast bill. If you call 408-737-4999 you get the City of Sunnyvale IT department, which is the organization that deals with Comcast.

I told her my frustration with the Comcast service offering in my part of Sunnyvale. I also told her that my annual complaint call to Comcast every year results in me being told that "in 6 to 12 months" the Sunnyvale network will be upgraded. Obviously, that isn't happening, as I received that same response in December of 2004 and December of 2005.

She was very nice, and told me that she would contact Comcast and ask them for an answer. I requested that I receive a written response from Comcast, preferably from Andrew Johnson (since he's the only person from Comcast who seems to speak authoritatively on the subject).

I refuse to believe that someone inside Comcast doesn't have network planning responsibility, and has a sheet of paper with the intentions for Sunnyvale on it. I *refuse* to believe that, and I believe Comcast should share their intentions.

For all of you other frustrated Sunnyvale people, I suggest calling Comcast and your city regularly to register your displeasure.

platypus

12-18-06, 03:46 PM

Minimum Package to Receive All Non-Premium HD?
-------------------------------------------------------------------

Can someone let me know what the minimum Comcast package you have been able to purchase is that will get you all non-premium HD channels.

In my area (Campbell, CA) I want:

702 KTVU (Fox)
703 KNTV (NBC)
704 KRON (IND)
705 KPIX (CBS)
707 KGO (ABC)
709 KQED (PBS)
719 INHD - 1
720 FSNBA (Check Local Listings for times)
722 Discovery-HD
723 ESPN - HD
724 ESPN2 HD
725 NFL Network HD
725 HD Special Events
726 TNT HD
727 Universal HD
728 MHD

I currently have the HD DVR (6412 I think) and some initial bundle they gave me with one of the digital packages plus HBO and high speed internet. It was around $100 a month, but now that the trial period is over it's up over $140.

So I'm looking to cut down my package to the minimum price that can get me the above HD channels with HD DVR box and high speed internet. Any advice would be great.

Will basic suffice?

-dcs

BTW, is it possible to get another bundle with a new trial price for another period as an existing customer? Note, I will not consider adding digital voice (phone service).

I know the original post is rather old, but I thought I'd share what I believe to be one of the best deals out there if you want Comcast HD but hate payin' the man.

I subscribe to one of their Spanish language packages called "Completo con HBO". It runs $59.99/mo (standard rate - not a limited term promotion) and includes channels 1-82, and all the HD channels listed above except for the 3 most recently added (726, 727, and 728). However, I also receive 730 (HBO HD), in addition to the 10 or so HBO channels in the 550 range. Finally, if you're a soccer fan (like myself), Completo gives you access to the Spanish language channels between 601 and 618, including 602 (Fox Sports Espanol) and 618 (Gol TV).

I tried calling Comcast the other day to see what it would take it get TNT, UHD, and MHD added to my line-up. The CSR told me I had to add Digital Classic for another $10/mo. However, when she tried to do so, the system wouldn't let her. Apparently, the Comcast product marketing geniuses have made a decision that the Completo package will not be compatible with any of the digital packages. I guess us Spanish speaking folks aren't sophisticated enough for digital. :rolleyes: And so, my only remedy would be to do everyting a la carte, which would be way too expensive. Essentially, what I'm currently getting for $60 would run me close to $85 (standard cable + Selecto (channels 601-618) + HBO). Digital classic would be another $10, so for now, I'm content to forego 3 HD channels given that the cost of entry is an additional $35/mo.

platypus

12-18-06, 04:06 PM

I have a couple of questions about receiving HD channels via Comcast in San Jose, CA (95112)

I plan on using a QAM tuner to receive my HD programming from Comcast.

A) Will I receive anything other than the local channels in HD??
B) Do I need to subscribe to the HD tier and be forced to rent the HD STB by doing so, in order to receive any channels with the QAM tuner?
I was over at my folk's place last night helping my father hook up a new Sony KVL-2500. He had exchanged his standard STB for a DVR and they gave him a 3416. Channels 2-99 did not show up in the line-up, and I couldn't figure out why (CSR wasn't very helpful either), and looking at the board today I saw that this is a common problem. However, the only other channels we got were FOX HD and NBC HD, but they showed up on channels 723 and 724, respectively. Furthermore, NBC HD (last night's football game) was terribly pixelated and ultimately unwatchable. He's going to exchange the box for another one today to see if it makes a difference, and yes, I will instruct him to leave it plugged in for 24 hours before we come to any conclusions.

In the meantime, I tried out the QAM tuner by running the RG6 from the wall directly into the back of the display. After searching for the digital channels (which took about 30-45 minutes), it came up with 163 channels total. Many of them were audio only (the music channels in the 900 range), but we were able to receive, from what I remember, 6 HD channels including: FOX (2.1), CBS (5.1), NBC (116.1), ABC (117.1), KQED (117.2), and what is normally channel 704 with a STB (or 111.8 via QAM as I recall). Unfortunately, we were not able to get ESPN HD, ESPN2 HD, INHD, Discovery HD, TNT HD, UHD, and MHD even though he is subscribed to those channels and gets them through his other TV and DVR. Does this mean that the HD channels above 709 are encrypted through QAM? Or should he be getting them? This is my first experience in using a QAM tuner. Not real user friendly given the channel mapping assignments. He'll end up with a box anyway, but it's too bad that there isn't a way to map them so that they show up on the display with the same channel assignments as if you had a STB (or CC).

TPeterson

12-18-06, 04:53 PM

MikeSM

12-18-06, 05:12 PM

Platy--

Yes, those channels are encrypted. There is a way to map the clear QAM channels to the same numbers used by Comcast and TitanTV, but it requires an HTPC with a MyHD tuner card installed. See the HTPC Forum for more info.

Just out of curiousity, are all the encrypted HD channels also sent encrypted across the 1394 interface? I know HBO and such are all 5C encrypted, but I am not sure that ESPNHD and TNTHD are. Have folks tried these channels with 1394 in our area?

I am in the process of doing a new Sage build to replace some old replaytv's that are SD only and not multimedia capable with a new system that has a consistent GUI across all the TV's in the house, and while I have an HDHomeRun for stuff sent in the clear, I need to choose to interface with my 6412 with either S-video to a PVR-150 (this can record everything the box is authorized to display, but only at SD resolution), or via 1394 (which lets me get everything in native digital including HD, but only for non-5C content).

While we don't watch HBO or showtime, the Closer in HD is a big draw in my household and so I'd like to find a way of capturing it in native HD. :-)

Thanks,
Mike

TPeterson

12-18-06, 05:23 PM

Mike, I don't have a Comcast STB to find out. Perhaps someone else here has the right hw to answer your question?

russwong

12-18-06, 08:43 PM

Just out of curiousity, are all the encrypted HD channels also sent encrypted across the 1394 interface? I know HBO and such are all 5C encrypted, but I am not sure that ESPNHD and TNTHD are. Have folks tried these channels with 1394 in our area?

I am in the process of doing a new Sage build to replace some old replaytv's that are SD only and not multimedia capable with a new system that has a consistent GUI across all the TV's in the house, and while I have an HDHomeRun for stuff sent in the clear, I need to choose to interface with my 6412 with either S-video to a PVR-150 (this can record everything the box is authorized to display, but only at SD resolution), or via 1394 (which lets me get everything in native digital including HD, but only for non-5C content).

While we don't watch HBO or showtime, the Closer in HD is a big draw in my household and so I'd like to find a way of capturing it in native HD. :-)

Thanks,
Mike

I believe it did when those channels were unencrypted in the early days, as I used to be able to record espnhd via firewire. Now that they are encrypted, it does not work anymore.

Not sure if that's what you are asking...

bagofchips

12-19-06, 01:28 AM

Thanks... I have seen that, but I've also seen some posts on a few sites indicating in fact it does have QAM. Maybe it's urban myth. Channel setup / scan on "cable" indicates it's looking for digital channels, so not sure what it else it could have or be doing if QAM capability not resident? Or could it just be looking for OTA carried over the coax in a different way?

Thread 754996 here @ AVS (I can't post URLs until I've posted 5 posts, apparently, maybe somebody more trustworth can link it!) indicates there IS QAM (some confusion even in this thread!) need to split the signal to the OTA coax jack as well as the cable coax jack... while i've tried connecting the cable directly and singlularly to the OTA jack (null result), I'll try the split approach and report back.

Alrightee, so case closed... split approach works... I get QAM demodulated HD signal through the OTA coax jack and ye olde analog off the cable jack.

TPeterson

12-19-06, 02:03 AM

Pretty much brain-damaged design to have the QAM tuner fed exclusively from the Antenna input! :rolleyes:

hiker

12-19-06, 08:36 AM

Just out of curiousity, are all the encrypted HD channels also sent encrypted across the 1394 interface? ...
Here in Novato I have Limited Basic and Digital Classic with DCT-6200 connected to JVC HD VCR. I can record all HD channels like ESPNHD, DSCHD, TNTHD, UHD, etc. Don't sub to any premiums so don't know about those. YMMV.

Tom Koegel

12-19-06, 09:52 AM

I got an email on the 6412 the other day announcing that Comcast had added the Tennis Channel to the Digital lineup (at 411). After poking around the Comcast website, it looks like I have to subscribe to the Digital Sports Tier in addition to Digital in order to get this channel. Before I waste time with a CSR, anyone know (1) how much this costs and (2) whether the other parts of the tier (notably a couple flavors of CSTV)are worth it? It's all low def, and hence not of great interest to me . . . but other members of my household are huge tennis fans and would probably enjoy the programming (even if low def). The NFL Network is listed as part of the tier, but I thought I had heard that Comcast was reversing course and intending NOT to force tier purchase for that channel.

bobby94928

12-19-06, 10:12 AM

jk5598224

12-19-06, 01:04 PM

btwyx

12-19-06, 01:13 PM

For what its worth, you can get most of the same channels (but not the Tennis Channel) in Comcast's "Premier tier" which cost 4c more than the Sports tier. When I signed up for that it had a couple more channels which were slightly more interesting, but they took those away the week after, and now they've added to the sports tier. I was just after the Speed channel. I was surprised to find the NFL network was in my digital tier already, I thought I didn't get that. I only checked on that for last week's Thursday game, and found its on 2 different channel numbers one in sports, one in digtial+, and I get both (and the part time HD version).

Can Comcast be any more confusing?

The differences in the 2 tiers are now:

Premier:
128*Bloomberg
506*Fox Movie Channel

Sports:
409*TVG Horseracing Network
411*Tennis Channel
417*NFL Network (also in digital plus)
418*College Sports TV (CSTV)
618*Gol TV

bobby94928

12-19-06, 01:18 PM

Hi Could somebody actually confirm that they are recieving The Tennis Channel?? I received the same message, but then contacted Comcast and they said it is not available. I beleive it is available, when I turn to 411 it says I have to subscribe to it...

Also anybody in Bay Area get a MOT 6416 installed???

I am getting the Tennis Channel on 411. It is available but you must subscribe to the Sports Tier or perhaps the Premiere Tier to get it..

keenan

12-19-06, 01:51 PM

We get NBA-TV in-the-clear up here in Santa Rosa, it came on when FSNBA-HD went live. The below is a flyer with the current lineup as of Dec 4th. Interestingly, it doesn't list NBA-TV

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v637/keenanj/SRCable1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v637/keenanj/SRCable2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v637/keenanj/SRCable3.jpg

amdspitfire

12-19-06, 03:44 PM

Fox Soccer channel now available in Los Gatos????

So far it was in sports tier and was not available to me but shows up in the above list under digital classic.

Edit: looks like santa rosa totally different packages.
Edit2: Digital premier tier is now available in LG! Ordered it with digital silver.

Are you guys only paying 29.99 for digital silver?

keenan

12-19-06, 03:50 PM

That above list is for Santa Rosa, it came in the mail about 2 weeks ago.

lemketron

12-19-06, 05:33 PM

...Can Comcast be any more confusing?
Yeah, you could live in Sunnyvale and wonder why they charge the same as anywhere else for a lot less channels... :confused:

btwyx

12-19-06, 05:59 PM

Yeah, you could live in Sunnyvale and wonder why they charge the same as anywhere else for a lot less channels... :confused:That's not confusing, that's just what you'd expect.

dipen

12-19-06, 09:34 PM

I have a QAM tuner in my TV and I sometimes pickup ON demand channels that other subscribers are watching! I can tell it's on demand b/c I see folks rewinding/fast forwarding the movies/shows. Has anyone seen this behavior? Just curious.

TPeterson

12-19-06, 10:00 PM

Never. :D

davisdog

12-20-06, 01:29 AM

That above list is for Santa Rosa, it came in the mail about 2 weeks ago.

and it probably wont change for another 2 years :eek:

fender4645

12-20-06, 02:06 AM

The latest in the saga that is Comcast and Tivo: http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6400579.html

keenan

12-20-06, 03:01 PM

and it probably wont change for another 2 years :eek:
Well, maybe, and maybe not...but I'm sure not holding my breath. :D

Because of a mistake in Comcast's billing, I'm getting all the HD channels minus the premiums for $16.79(plus $2.60 in local fees, taxes, etc.), and the CC charges have yet to show up on my bill, so I can't really complain. :p

keenan

12-20-06, 03:11 PM

The latest in the saga that is Comcast and Tivo: http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6400579.html
I wouldn't hold my breath on this either, given the seemingly inherent buggyness of Motorola DVR/STBs, implementation of a TiVo interface on these boxes may be a "one step forward, and two steps backwards" sort of thing where stability and reliability are concerned.

Remembering how this last FW push to these boxes has screwed up some portion of the HDMI interface, you have to wonder about the robustness of a TiVo UI being pushed to the Moto DVR/STB. I'm not knocking the idea, it's just that past history shows that this sort of thing could very well take much longer to iron out the kinks than anticipated. My guess would be sometime late 2007 before it was a functional, somewhat stable, reality.

pappy97

12-20-06, 03:19 PM

rsra13

12-20-06, 04:12 PM

will you be able to watch Lost earlier in SC? :)

keenan

12-20-06, 04:33 PM

Anyone here get satellite service from canadian provider StarChoice in addition to Comcast?

1.) How easy was it to get things up and running for SC? I have contacted a broker recommended by everyone and it seems quite easy. I also heard as long as you have the 75cm elliptical dish, getting reception in the Bay Area should be a snap (I want to get programming off both satellites).

2.) MY BIG QUESTION:

How does the HD pq compare to Comcast?

I plan to get the HD DVR from StarChoice. Say I use that DVR to tape Lost from one of the ABC HD feeds on SC. I also use the Comcast HD DVR to tape Lost from KGO HD 707.

Both boxes are outputting 1080i to my 1080p DLP Sammy (HLS-5087), assume I am getting the best signal possible from StarChoice's sat that has HD (Anik F2).

Which will give me the better PQ?

Thanks!!

I have both Star Choice and Comcast.

Setting up the SC dish is pretty simple, as long as you have to right aiming info. A lot of the parameters given at a lot of sites don't factor in the magnetic declination numbers, so you can be right on according to their numbers, but actaully have the dish mis-pointed. I use the following site as it factors in the mag/dec and I had a good signal on the first try, in fact, I still haven't tightened down the mount all the way. :p

http://emantechnology.com/lookangle.asp
Azimuth and Elevation Calculation for Your Satellite Dish

As far as PQ, I would have to say Comcast is the best, although depending on what station you're getting from SC it can be very good quality as well, it won't surpass Comcast, but it's very close. BTW, there is no ABC west station currently, you'll have to get your ABC from Detroit which means everything airs 3 hrs earlier. You can get both east and west HD feeds though which is nice, plus the Detroit PBS-HD station, which no US sat provider carries, and SC recently added NatGeo-HD, A&E-HD, Disc-HD and Showcase-HD. Not really sure what Showcase-HD is, it was just added yesterday. There's 4-5 other HD stations as well such as The Movie Network which airs original series from both HBO and Showtime as well as movies. The Movie Network had King Kong in HD months before any US provider had it.

The PQ is probably the best sat PQ you'll get(other than C-band) and in many cases, depending on channel and program, it's pretty much indistinguishable from Comcast.

I don't have the SC DVR, and since you'll be purchasing it instead of leasing/renting, I'd really check out the reports of it's quality/reliability, you think the Comcast Moto-DVR is sketchy, supposedly the SC Moto-DVR is worse.

If you have a decently powered PC already, you might consider the R5000 mod on the much cheaper non-DVR-HD-STB from SC. The overall cost is little more but I've been pretty happy with the setup.

BTW, AFAIK, the SC DVR is single tuner record only. It has two tuners, but only records from one at a time, so that's something to consider.

keenan

12-20-06, 04:37 PM

will you be able to watch Lost earlier in SC? :)
Yes, 3 hrs earlier, on WXYZ Detroit.

keenan

12-20-06, 05:15 PM

From the Hot Off The Press thread, boldened/underlined section by me.

Washington Notebook
FCC Eases Cable Competition Rules
By Corey Boles The Wall Street Journal December 20, 2006 3:02 p.m. ET
WASHINGTON -- The Federal Communications Commission on Thursday voted in favor of new rules governing the franchise system that exists across the U.S. for new entrants seeking to providing television service to consumers.

The new rules are aimed at making it easier for potential competitors to enter the video market. They are particularly aimed at facilitating entry by telecommunication companies such as Verizon Communications Inc. and AT&T Inc., who are keen to expand their presence in the video market.

FCC Commissioners voted 3-2 along party lines at the agency's monthly public meeting in favor of new rules that would impose a 90-day deadline on local governments to decide on whether to grant a new franchise.

They would also strike down requirements for new entrants to provide service to all residents in an area, known as buildout requirements in industry jargon.

---Wall Street Journal subscribers can read the entire story here

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB116664369395955925.html?mod=hps_us_my_companies

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9227265#post9227265
Hot Off The Press! The Latest Television News and Info - AVS Forum

pappy97

12-20-06, 05:29 PM

You da man Keenan, thanks for the info!

One big interest of mine in getting it is having HD primetime shows already taped on the DVR waiting for me when I get home, as alluded to in another post here. Lost is a good example. I don't want to wait until 10pm to watch it. I'd rather tape it off ABC East HD feed on SC, watch it at 8pm, and then watch other shows. This really helps as Wednesdays will be very busy for me the rest of the TV season as the household watches Jericho, Lost, and AI in HD.

Another huge plus is hockey coverage, especially the NHL network, which is like the NFL network, except it has live look ins to games.

Another huge gigantic thing for me is that when the Sharks play in Canada, there is chance the game will be in HD on a Canadian Feed. This is especially the case come playoff time, double especially if they play a Canadian team, you know FSNBA-HD won't do road games in Canada (yet, ever?). I hate the idea of watching CBC over FSNBA, but I'll gladly do so if it is CBC HD vs. FSNBA 480i garbage.

A nice bonus would be dirt cheap Sunday ticket (Comes out to US $80 per year!), although it isn't needed as the Global channels + various network feeds should provide at least 4-5 more games than you would normally see in the SF Bay Area. If SC ever gets HD feeds from Sunday ticket, it's an auto order for me. :)

I did not know it was not a dual taping device, that's good to know. It's fine with me because I won't be taping anything in the same timeslot, and only plan to use it to supplement my Comcast viewing.

rsra13

12-20-06, 05:32 PM

so, how much does it cost? Initial and monthly cost?

keenan

12-20-06, 05:34 PM

BTW, here's a brief listing of what's available on Showcase-HD,

Showcase HD available December 19, 2006
See and hear the difference of Showcase HD with the following programs:
Andromeda [Weekdays at 6am, noon, 7pm]
CSI [Monday – Thursday 11pm, 2am, 5am – Sunday 1am]
CSI: Miami [Monday – Thursday 12am, 3am – Saturday 10pm, 5am – Sunday 5pm]
G-Spot [Friday 10pm, 4am]
Huff (beginning February 25) [Sunday 10pm, 12am, 3am]
Kenny vs. Spenny [Thursday 9:30pm, Saturday 9pm]
Kink [Friday 9:30pm]
Lovespring International (beginning January 8) [Monday at 10pm, 1am, 4am]
L-Word [Thursday 10pm, 1am, 4am]
Regenesis [Monday at 9pm]
Rent–A–Goalie [Tuesday 9:30pm – Saturday 9:30pm - Sunday 9:30pm, 11:30pm, 2:30am]
Rescue Me [Tuesday 10pm, 1am, 4am]
Slings and Arrows [Sunday 8pm, 4am]
Weeds [Wednesday 10pm, 1am, 4am]

"Rescue Me" in HD.... :)

Link to a SC forum,

http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?p=474229#post474229
Official Star Choice HD Programming Discussion - Page 43 - Digital Forum

keenan

12-20-06, 05:44 PM

so, how much does it cost? Initial and monthly cost?
One nice thing about SC is they have a lot of ala-carte style programming choices,

https://secure.starchoice.com/english/store/signup_pr.asp
Star Choice - Store - Customize your TV experience

The current HD lineup is below,

http://www.starchoice.com/english/learn/programming/hdtv.asp
Star Choice - Learn - High Definition Television

Bell ExpressVu actually has more HD, but they send everything out at 720p(1080i channels included) and they sim-sub the US network stuff. OTOH, their DVR is probably a better unit as they're re-badged Dish Network equipment.

pappy97

12-20-06, 05:57 PM

so, how much does it cost? Initial and monthly cost?

Keenan is probably the authority, but I know for myself I need to spend $600-700 US to get the HD DVR + Dish,

around $50 Canadian (less than $50 US) per year for a broker to set up my account because technically I can't do so since I don't have a Canadian address.

Programming packages ranges from $20 canadian to $90 canadian, but it is ridiculous the sheer amount of programming you can get a la carte. It's very c-band like in terms of a la carte.

HD channels except A&E and another one are free.

pappy97

12-20-06, 06:00 PM

Bell ExpressVu actually has more HD, but they send everything out at 720p(1080i channels included) and they sim-sub the US network stuff. OTOH, their DVR is probably a better unit as they're re-badged Dish Network equipment.

The biggest dealbreaker on BEV in the Bay Area now is the lack of ability to get the HD channels. The HD channels are on a satellite whose "footprint" is not covering most of the US like it did before, as BEV doesn't want US grey market subs. SC doesn't seem to mind though. Most BEV subs in CA are now switching to SC.

I am just glad I waited to get involved in Canadian satellite until after BEV became a virtual non-option here.

KEENAN: So SC doesn't sim-sub???? If so, that is awesome!

keenan

12-20-06, 06:06 PM

The biggest dealbreaker on BEV in the Bay Area now is the lack of ability to get the HD channels. The HD channels are on a satellite whose "footprint" is not covering most of the US like it did before, as BEV doesn't want US grey market subs. SC doesn't seem to mind though. Most BEV subs in CA are now switching to SC.

I am just glad I waited to get involved in Canadian satellite until after BEV became a virtual non-option here.

KEENAN: So SC doesn't sim-sub???? If so, that is awesome!
I had forgotten about that, the BEV sats are creeping around up there(apparently they're old DirecTV birds) and BEV keeps repositioning the beams as the transponder power goes down.

No, SC currently does not sim-sub, it's just like watching KPIX or whatever on Comcast, local(to the station) newscasts and all. It was interesting watching the Seattle stations during that big storm they had up there recently.

walk

12-20-06, 06:43 PM

Just out of curiousity, are all the encrypted HD channels also sent encrypted across the 1394 interface? I know HBO and such are all 5C encrypted, but I am not sure that ESPNHD and TNTHD are. Have folks tried these channels with 1394 in our area?
As of today, keep in mind it can change any minute...

Locals (702-709), it's on a per-program basis. I.e. some shows are recordable, some are not. Mostly local programming (news, etc) is recordable, but some network programming (ABC Disney movies, etc) is not.

INHD - not recordable
FSN-HD 720 - usually not recordable, but it's been a while since I tried.
Discovery-HD - not recordable
ESPN(1) - not recordable.
ESPN2 - is recordable (go figure) I think.
NFL-HD 725 - ?? never tried.
TNT-HD - recordable
UHD - recordable
MHD - recordable
HBO, SHOW, MAX etc. - not recordable.

MikeSM

12-20-06, 08:04 PM

As of today, keep in mind it can change any minute...

Locals (702-709), it's on a per-program basis. I.e. some shows are recordable, some are not. Mostly local programming (news, etc) is recordable, but some network programming (ABC Disney movies, etc) is not.

INHD - not recordable
FSN-HD 720 - usually not recordable, but it's been a while since I tried.
Discovery-HD - not recordable
ESPN(1) - not recordable.
ESPN2 - is recordable (go figure) I think.
NFL-HD 725 - ?? never tried.
TNT-HD - recordable
UHD - recordable
MHD - recordable
HBO, SHOW, MAX etc. - not recordable.

Thanks! What about SD programming like the military channel, nat geo, DIY, etc...

Thanks,
Mike

walk

12-20-06, 11:55 PM

SD channels are hit or miss. Some channels are protected, some not.

Mikef5

12-21-06, 12:22 PM

For those of your that are wondering what is happening with the all house distribution system, it seems Comcast and others have invested in new different way of accomplishing this. Here's the article http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=113277&WT.svl=news1_4

What I find interesting is this system isn't just for one provider, you could have Comcast, Dish, Directv it doesn't matter they all would work with this. The test would be if they can get it to work with more than just one HD feed like AT&T's Uverse does right now and keep the video quality the same as it is now with cable. Oh, and for you Dish guys, this Intellon chip is already built into their new set top boxes now :)

Laters,
Mikef5

yunlin12

12-21-06, 02:04 PM

fender4645

12-21-06, 02:25 PM

Hi I was checking out Knight Rider on UHD last week, and it looks like an HD version. I wonder if UHD re-do those old shows for HD broadcast. I'm especially interested in knowing if their New Year's day Northern Exposure marathon will be in HD.

Yes they were able to get David Hasselhoff and Kit to come back and re-create each show so it could be recorded in HD. :D Just kidding. I believe the original show was recorded on film and was then remastered by Universal in HD.

walk

12-21-06, 02:30 PM

Everything on the UHD channel has been Hi-Def from what I've seen.

Unlike TNT's upconverted, face-squishing Medium-Def technology...

mjhhmb

12-21-06, 02:31 PM

All I can say is wow!

lol

I suppose it was inevitable...

fender4645

12-21-06, 03:02 PM

All I can say is wow!

lol

I suppose it was inevitable...

I saw that. It would actually be kind of cool if they didn't do it in obvious slow motion. It's like they filmed 30 minutes of it and then stretched it to 90 minutes by putting it in slow motion.

keenan

12-21-06, 03:54 PM

nikeykid

12-21-06, 04:54 PM

DROOL
https://uma.sbc.com/assets/files/San_Francisco_Oakland.pdf

wow look at that HD lineup. only thing missing is CWHD and FSNHD

keenan

12-21-06, 05:04 PM

I'm not sure why you'd want both east and west feeds of Showtime, HBO and Cinemax.

BTW, I sure wish Comcast would add Showtime back to the Santa Rosa lineup, I might consider spending more than the current $19 a month I am now if they added that and a few other HD channels.

pappy97

12-21-06, 06:55 PM

DROOL
https://uma.sbc.com/assets/files/San_Francisco_Oakland.pdf

wow look at that HD lineup. only thing missing is CWHD and FSNHD

...and PBS-HD, as in KQED.

pappy97

12-21-06, 06:59 PM

Looks like AT&T is putting the pressure on Comcast sooner than later. AT&T U-verse is rolling out in parts of the bay area already.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9234527#post9234527
AT&T Lightspeed - AVS Forum

There's about 3-4 more articles posted after the one linked to above.

Looks like parts of San Ramon(Comcast's back yard.. :p ), Danville, San Jose, Sunnyvale, Santa Clara, Cupertino and Saratoga.

My understanding of AT&T's Lightspeed service is that it doesn't have a dual tuner HD-DVR, in fact, you only get one HD stream at a time.

So if you have lightspeed, and in February want to tape Jericho on CBS HD at the same time as AI on FOX HD, it ain't happening, right?

In fact, as I understand, you can only receive one of those to your box, not even watch one, tape the other.

That plus the the lack of FSN-BA HD sounds like a deal breaker to me, BUT I'd love to save a few bucks.

My BIG hope is that Verizon sees AT&T aggressive nature towards the Bay Area Market and brings FiOS here NOW. I don't understand why Verizon is working on markets like Texas and Virginia, when Silicon Valley, the tech capital of the world, is ripe for something like FiOS.

hiker

12-21-06, 07:11 PM

My understanding of AT&T's Lightspeed service is that it doesn't have a dual tuner HD-DVR, in fact, you only get one HD stream at a time.
...So it sounds like if you wanted 2 DVRs it would not be possible to tune to a different channel on each?

pappy97

12-21-06, 07:13 PM

So it sounds like if you wanted 2 DVRs it would not be possible to tune to a different channel on each?

Yeah, if you go to AT&T's U-Verse site, they say in one of their packages you can get up to 3-4 receivers, but only ONE of them will be a DVR.

keenan

12-21-06, 07:44 PM

My understanding of AT&T's Lightspeed service is that it doesn't have a dual tuner HD-DVR, in fact, you only get one HD stream at a time.

That's what I've been reading, it only sends one stream at a time. For hard-core DVR users like us, U-verse is a waste of time, at least in it's present form.

OTOH, the large majority of TV viewers do not use a DVR so I'd imagine AT&T will certainly get a fair amount of customers, and the red-lining that the FCC just allowed for in their recent ruling will mean probably only customers located near the telco switch will get the service. Sort of like DSL, where the further you are from the switch, the lower the speed and even no service at the furthest points.

Jim12345

12-22-06, 02:32 AM

Finally!!! Received the official notice from Comcast yesterday. Week of January 17 Antioch gets upgraded from our 550Mhz system. Yea!!!

According to the Channel Guide attached to the letter we get a few more channels with Standard, many more with Digital classic and Digital Plus and best off all we get the slate of HD channels I assume most of you have gotten for a long time. Here is the HD lineup according to the guide...

*=new
702 KTVU
703 KNTV
704 KRON*
705 KPIX
707 KGO
709 KQED
719 INHD1*
720 FSNBA*
722 DISCOVERY
723 ESPN
724 ESPN2*
726 TNT*
727 UNIVERSAL*
728 MTV*

mazman49

12-22-06, 09:22 AM

Yeah, if you go to AT&T's U-Verse site, they say in one of their packages you can get up to 3-4 receivers, but only ONE of them will be a DVR.
I believe that the one DVR can be accessed by all the receivers in the home.

rsra13

12-22-06, 11:38 AM

fender4645

12-22-06, 12:35 PM

rsra13

12-22-06, 12:40 PM

Good to know.

U-verse at its current status is NOT for me.

timltucker

12-22-06, 01:25 PM

The way to look at it is you can watch/record up to 4 streams per household -- and only one of those streams can be HD. If you only have 1 TV in the house then it should work fine for almost anyone. However if you have to have multiple TV's and/or you want to record more than one HD channel at a time then you're pretty much SOL.

The service sounds fine for those that have a single HD TV and multiple SD TVs. That includes my family and most others I'd imagine. The recording limitation could also be less severe if they have a good selection of primetime HD VOD content.

One nice thing about the AT&T solution is that they already have the media server thing (viewing recorded programs on the DVR on any TVs set-top box). Maybe this will pressure comcast to finally ship theirs.

I'm no AT&T fan boy, but at $129 for the full service (300 channels + HD + High Speed Internet) on four TVs that compares well to my $215 Comcast cable bill for the same thing.

pappy97

12-22-06, 02:16 PM

The service sounds fine for those that have a single HD TV and multiple SD TVs. That includes my family and most others I'd imagine. The recording limitation could also be less severe if they have a good selection of primetime HD VOD content.

One nice thing about the AT&T solution is that they already have the media server thing (viewing recorded programs on the DVR on any TVs set-top box). Maybe this will pressure comcast to finally ship theirs.

I'm no AT&T fan boy, but at $129 for the full service (300 channels + HD + High Speed Internet) on four TVs that compares well to my $215 Comcast cable bill for the same thing.

I understand it is cheaper, but aren't you worried about the various HD programming conflicts?

Heroes and 24 (And MNF during NFL season); AI and Jericho; CSI vs. Grey's (although I can't stand these shows)

Anything HD on Tuesday night vs. AI

When they finally get FSNBA-HD (no reason AT&T shouldn't have it now that it is not Comcast exclusive), HD Sharks, Warriors, Giants, and A's vs. Primetime HD programming.

I personally don't need to record things to store permanently, I just want to be able to watch everything I want from a given night at my own leisure. AT&T doesn't seem to provide that and I don't want to "suck it up" and watch the SD version of any of the shows listed above.

walk

12-22-06, 02:33 PM

I'm not sure why you'd want both east and west feeds of Showtime, HBO and Cinemax.
So you can have your kids accidently flip on Skinemax at 8pm of course! :cool:

timltucker

12-22-06, 02:55 PM

I understand it is cheaper, but aren't you worried about the various HD programming conflicts?

Heroes and 24 (And MNF during NFL season); AI and Jericho; CSI vs. Grey's (although I can't stand these shows)

Anything HD on Tuesday night vs. AI

True enough, but at a $79 a month difference I can live with it. Think about it, that is a lot of money to pay Comcast every month just so you can record two HD programs at once on a DVR!

Personally the right solution for AT&T is to get those PrimeTime HD shows onto VOD. That way you don't need to record them locally on the DVR. Comcast has experimented with a hand full of PrimeTime stuff on VOD. Remember those Survivor episodes on VOD this fall at 99 cents a pop (not that I would ever pay 99 cents a pop to watch Survivor episodes in SD)? But if AT&T saved me $79 a month I'd be more than happy to pay 99 cents a pop to watch Heroes, 24, or Grey's in full HD with digital surround sound :p . That would be worth it!

To be fair to Comcast the main reason my bill is so high with them compared to AT&T's offer is all of the extra TV fees. I mean $6.95 digital outlet fees, $9.95 DVR fees, etc...and they all go up in January! AT&T is basically under cutting Comcast by eliminating these and saying they will give you 3-4 STB boxes in your service package. Maybe Comcast should take note and do the same?

keenan

12-22-06, 03:25 PM

keenan

12-22-06, 03:28 PM

Today in the Mercury News, in the Business section, there is an article about this. But in the key features it says: "Ability to program a DVR over the Web. DVR can record up to four programs at once; fast channel switching"

So, it can record 4 SD shows at once but only one HD show?

"Ability to program a DVR over the Web.

The S3 TiVo can do this as well, works pretty good. BTW, Dell has been selling the S3 for about $560, shipping included I believe. I think you have to actually call them to get as it's not listed on the Dell site anymore.

keenan

12-22-06, 03:29 PM

So you can have your kids accidently flip on Skinemax at 8pm of course! :cool:
Ah yes, sex education, courtesy of Comcast. :p

keenan

12-22-06, 03:32 PM

Good to know.

U-verse at its current status is NOT for me.
Nope, not for me either...although..if it's the right price, I would consider getting it just for the HD channels I don't get from Comcast!!

Barovelli

12-22-06, 04:24 PM

...AT&T is basically under cutting Comcast by eliminating these and saying they will give you 3-4 STB boxes in your service package. Maybe Comcast should take note and do the same?

Seen it happen in test offers. Could be a reality soon. Would be necessary in a pure digital system.

Is it fair to charge the same price to a sub in a studio apartment that needs only one box as a suburban castle with 4?

btwyx

12-22-06, 04:46 PM

Is it fair to charge the same price to a sub in a studio apartment that needs only one box as a suburban castle with 4?That puts me off a bit, we don't live in a Studio, but we only have the one TV and one TiVo. And this doesn't work with TiVo does it? (Not even a Series 3 with cable cards.)

wco81

12-22-06, 05:10 PM

Is there a thread on U-Verse for the Bay Area?

It would be nice to get impressions, not just for the video but also the data.

timltucker

12-22-06, 05:25 PM

Seen it happen in test offers. Could be a reality soon. Would be necessary in a pure digital system.

Is it fair to charge the same price to a sub in a studio apartment that needs only one box as a suburban castle with 4?

They should create service packages for both situations. My point is that Comcast doesn't even offer an equivalent package for those that want it.

As far as Comcast giving up those $8.00 (as of January 07) digital access fees I'll believe that when I see it. I personally do not think Comcast will hand out STB boxes for free when they go all digital.

Jim12345

12-22-06, 05:26 PM

Nice holiday present you got there, it's been a long time coming for some of our ghetto systems. :)
That's the truth. :)

Received another letter today saying the first group will receive the upgrade in December with full roll-out by mid-2007 so it appears they are doing it neighborhood by neighborhood.

Keenan, I think you'll find this sentence from the letter kind of amusing... ;)

"Understanding that many of the surrounding cities and towns already have access to the full plethora of products and programming that we offer,we thank you, our customers in Antioch, for patiently waiting for us to fulfill our promise to you, and remaining loyal to us."

bobby94928

12-22-06, 05:57 PM

Is there a thread on U-Verse for the Bay Area?

It would be nice to get impressions, not just for the video but also the data.

I just added a thread for the Bay Area U-verse.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=773450

ianchan1970

12-22-06, 06:12 PM

keenan

12-22-06, 06:41 PM

That's the truth. :)

Received another letter today saying the first group will receive the upgrade in December with full roll-out by mid-2007 so it appears they are doing it neighborhood by neighborhood.

Keenan, I think you'll find this sentence from the letter kind of amusing... ;)

"Understanding that many of the surrounding cities and towns already have access to the full plethora of products and programming that we offer,we thank you, our customers in Antioch, for patiently waiting for us to fulfill our promise to you, and remaining loyal to us."
Yes, it is rather amusing as there's no mention of paying a reduced rate for not having the "full plethora of products and programming that we offer". :rolleyes:

oldskoolboarder

12-22-06, 06:49 PM

pappy97

12-22-06, 06:53 PM

keenan

12-22-06, 06:55 PM

Question on Comcast packages when using w/ a Tivo S3 and a good OTA antenna.

If I have Tivos, is there any reason to NOT get the Standard Cable Package and just add the HD portion w/ HBO? I don't see where I'd get anything out of digital cable service if I'm not using the comcast boxes or ON DEMAND. Thoughts?
You'll need to equip the S3 with a CableCARD to de-crypt the HBO signal from Comcast, but you should be able to do what you want, you could get away with just Limited Basic and HBO if you wanted, no need to get Standard(Limited plus Expanded), plus you'll have all the local channels in HD as well.

The question is whether you'll need a digital package to get the HBO. AFAIK, you shouldn't need it as those premium channels are supposed to be available "ala-carte".

walk

12-22-06, 07:24 PM

I just started playing with recording HD channels via Firewire, and had success with local broadcast channels except for CBS (Letterman was on at the time).
When playing back the recorded files on VLC, the CBS recording would not show picture nor sound, but the other local channels did.

Has anyone else experienced this?
CBS is not supposed to be encrypted over Comcast cable, right?
Not "encrypted", but copy-protected. CBS-HD (705) is copy-protected 24/7 in my experience. I don't know why. Other local channels are protected on a per-program basis (some are, some not).

That's exactly what happens when a channel is protected. You get a large file, that gets bigger the longer you let it run, but it will not play back.

If you use CapDVHS it will tell you the frame size, bitrate, etc.. on a recordable show. If those boxes stay blank when you hit Record, then it's protected.

efball

12-23-06, 01:24 AM

The question is whether you'll need a digital package to get the HBO. AFAIK, you shouldn't need it as those premium channels are supposed to be available "ala-carte".

But the ala-carte price is about $19 which is completely wacked.

keenan

12-23-06, 03:17 AM

But the ala-carte price is about $19 which is completely wacked.
Agreed, Comcast is way out of line with their charges for premiums when compared to satellite, by a good 30-35%, and really out of whack when you consider $19 is about 3 times what Comcast pays the content provider itself. Hell of a markup.

JonDotCom

12-23-06, 02:34 PM

fender4645

12-24-06, 01:20 AM

Just picked up a Sony PS3 yesterday (a little 'Merry Christmas' to myself). I have to say the BD movies look pretty darn nice. I purchased Fifth Element and Total Recall and was very pleased with the quality. A buddy of mine has both a BD and HD-DVD player and he said BD movies tend to be a bit "soft" in comparison to HD-DVD. I've yet to see an HD-DVD movie -- can anyone confirm this?

efball

12-24-06, 02:28 AM

A buddy of mine has both a BD and HD-DVD player and he said BD movies tend to be a bit "soft" in comparison to HD-DVD. I've yet to see an HD-DVD movie -- can anyone confirm this?

Yes, most of the Blu-Ray players shipped have a firmware bug that makes the picture "soft". They have fixed the problem in the new units, but old units have to be taken to a service center for a firmware upgrade.

fender4645

12-24-06, 03:10 AM

Yes, most of the Blu-Ray players shipped have a firmware bug that makes the picture "soft". They have fixed the problem in the new units, but old units have to be taken to a service center for a firmware upgrade.

Interesting. I wonder if this affects the PS3's (I guess I'll have to Google it). Of course one of the big benefits of the PS3's is the ability to get firmware updates online, although I'm not sure if it applies to the BD hardware itself.

Talkstr8t

12-24-06, 04:07 AM

Yes, most of the Blu-Ray players shipped have a firmware bug that makes the picture "soft". They have fixed the problem in the new units, but old units have to be taken to a service center for a firmware upgrade.There's some misinformation here. The first Blu-ray Disc player, the Samsung BD-P1000, shipped with a noise reduction circuit set to maximum, resulting in a "softer" picture on MPEG-2 content. More recent builds of that player have had this setting adjusted, and older Samsung players can be firmware-updated by downloading and burning a disc image or having Samsung send an update disc. No other BD players were affected, this was purely a Samsung issue.

To the original question, the early HD-DVD titles definitely were considered to have higher picture quality than the early Blu-ray titles. Titles released in the last three months have been essentially identical, with hits and misses on both formats, but no one can credibly claim picture quality on one format is clearly better than that of the other.

keenan

12-24-06, 04:13 AM

BD is still using MPEG2 with a max of 25GB on a disc aren't they?

Do any of the BD players pass the hirez audio formats?

web

12-24-06, 12:08 PM

There's some misinformation here. The first Blu-ray Disc player, the Samsung BD-P1000, shipped with a noise reduction circuit set to maximum, resulting in a "softer" picture on MPEG-2 content. More recent builds of that player have had this setting adjusted, and older Samsung players can be firmware-updated by downloading and burning a disc image or having Samsung send an update disc. No other BD players were affected, this was purely a Samsung issue.

To the original question, the early HD-DVD titles definitely were considered to have higher picture quality than the early Blu-ray titles. Titles released in the last three months have been essentially identical, with hits and misses on both formats, but no one can credibly claim picture quality on one format is clearly better than that of the other.
Let be sure that it is clear the above statement about PQ is your opinion, not a fact. While Blu-ray titles have improved, there are still many valid, credible observations that do not agree the picture quality is essentially identical. OBW, the early HD DVD titles were not 'considered' to have higher PQ, they did and that was fact.

web

nikeykid

12-24-06, 12:15 PM

i have an hddvd player. choice was easy even if bluray had identital PQ since HDDVD players are about half the price and the first slew of titles were great. i hope i bet on the right horse!

keenan

12-24-06, 02:04 PM

Let be sure that it is clear the above statement about PQ is your opinion, not a fact. While Blu-ray titles have improved, there are still many valid, credible observations that do not agree the picture quality is essentially identical. OBW, the early HD DVD titles were not 'considered' to have higher PQ, they did and that was fact.

web
That's what I've read up in the BD/HD-DVD forums, that BD is suffering due to it's use of MPEG2 encoding, and although that may have changed, I stopped looking at those forums after I got the Toshiba A1. BD interests me but I get the impression that it needs a 2nd generation or so before it's prime-time ready. And certainly a price drop.

fender4645

12-24-06, 04:05 PM

That's what I've read up in the BD/HD-DVD forums, that BD is suffering due to it's use of MPEG2 encoding, and although that may have changed, I stopped looking at those forums after I got the Toshiba A1. BD interests me but I get the impression that it needs a 2nd generation or so before it's prime-time ready. And certainly a price drop.

I thought BD can do both H.264 (MPEG4) and MPEG2? Or are you saying the studios are releasing BD movies encoded only in MPEG2?

fender4645

12-24-06, 04:06 PM

keenan

12-24-06, 04:41 PM

Never mind -- found this on the Blu-ray wiki:

"Initial versions of Sony's Blu-ray Disc-authoring software only included support for MPEG-2 video, so the initial Blu-ray Discs were forced to use MPEG-2 rather than the newer codecs, VC-1 and H.264. An upgrade was subsequently released supporting the newer compression methods so the second wave of Blu-ray Disc titles were able to make use of this. The choice of codecs affects disc cost (due to related licensing/royalty payments) as well as program capacity. The two more advanced video codecs can typically achieve twice the video runtime of MPEG-2. When using MPEG-2, quality considerations would limit the publisher to around two hours of high-definition content on a single-layer (25 GB) BD-ROM."
Yes, I thought something like that was the case. Have any studios released BD titles with anything but MPEG2 though? The Wiki blurb seems to indicate they have. I'm just guessing, but I don't think they have, and can the current lineup of BD players decode the new codecs?

I've thought about a PS3 simply because of the price, it's cheaper than any of the standalone players, but none that I know of will do the new HiRez audio codecs. I could wrong though as I haven't paid much attention after the first few players were released.

Talkstr8t

12-24-06, 05:56 PM

BD is still using MPEG2 with a max of 25GB on a disc aren't they?The first titles were all MPEG2 on BD25 discs. Sony (and related studios Columbia and MGM) continue to use MPEG2. Most other studios are now releasing on AVC and/or VC-1. BD50 discs are now also fairly common, with several studios saying they expect 75-80% of future releases will be 50GB. All BD players must support MPEG-2, VC-1 and AVC.

Note that while MPEG-2 indisputably requires more disc space than VC-1 or AVC, the quality isn't necessarily worse. Paramount has released several recent movies on VC-1 for HD-DVD and MPEG-2 for Blu-ray and reviews indicate no perceptible difference in picture quality. See this (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=665702) thread for a (not completely up-to-date) listing of released and upcoming titles including what codec is being used.
Do any of the BD players pass the hirez audio formats?The PS3 decodes TrueHD in the player (or can pass it via HDMI 1.3 to similarly equipped A/V receivers, when available), and is rumored to have an upcoming firmware upgrade to support DTS-HD MA. The Panasonic player has announced that a firmware upgrade will enable both TrueHD and DTS-HD MA support on the DMP-BD10. The Sony and Pioneer standalone players are expected to support these in a future update, but neither have formally announced that.

Note that many titles have been released with lossless PCM, which provides theoretically identical quality to TrueHD and DTS-HD MA and is supported by all Blu-ray players. Also, all BD players must pass the core DD or DTS stream of the advanced formats, so you'll always hear at a minimum Dolby Digital 5.1 or DTS 5.1, so there is no disincentive for studios to only provide TrueHD or DTS-HD MA tracks, since all BD players will be able to decode the core 5.1 stream.
I've thought about a PS3 simply because of the price, it's cheaper than any of the standalone players, but none that I know of will do the new HiRez audio codecs.I've been enjoying my PS3 very much. In addition to being a superb Blu-ray player (incredibly fast and responsive, far moreso than any other player of either format), it's also a great media center, including SACD support, ripping CD's to its internal hard drive, excellent photo viewer, etc. The only important feature currently lacking is DVD upconversion, and reports are this will be provided via a future firmware upgrade. I'm also expecting that very interesting media-related projects will emerge via the use of Linux on the PS3, which is fully supported by Sony.

- Talk

Talkstr8t

12-24-06, 06:00 PM

Let be sure that it is clear the above statement about PQ is your opinion, not a fact. While Blu-ray titles have improved, there are still many valid, credible observations that do not agree the picture quality is essentially identical. While there may be observations as such, the general consensus is that PQ is now equivalent. In fact, if you average the numeric reviews of picture quality of recent titles (last two months) which many of the review sites use, you'll find Blu-ray has higher average PQ ratings than HD-DVD. Also far more BD titles include lossless audio than HD-DVD.

web

12-25-06, 01:15 AM

While there may be observations as such, the general consensus is that PQ is now equivalent. In fact, if you average the numeric reviews of picture quality of recent titles (last two months) which many of the review sites use, you'll find Blu-ray has higher average PQ ratings than HD-DVD. Also far more BD titles include lossless audio than HD-DVD.
Guess we will have to disagree (politely and civilly, of course :p) in our individual opinions of the general consensus regarding PQ comparison between the two formats. But averaging the "numeric" reviews is in no way a reliable quantitative means to compare PQ between the two formats. Come on, you know better than that ;)

Anyway, I am impressed so far with what I have heard about the PS3 as a "reasonably" priced Blu-ray player, which is consistent with what you posted. I have a unit inbound this week to check it out with some Blu-ray only titles. Will probably become "HD format neutral" if the PS3 and the titles live up to what I have read.

web

pappy97

12-25-06, 06:17 AM

What's with the Blu-Ray vs. HD-DVD debate HERE??

This is the same board where people have Comcast and Starchoice, just to get HD east coast locals.

Some people I bet here have Comcast, Dish, and DirecTV, just to get every single HD channel available to those in the US.

I thought most people here have a BD AND an HD-DVD player.

I have a PS3 AND the Xbox 360 HD-DVD add on. Surprised to see these debates in light of these cheap ways to enjoy these great formatS.

Let's stop arguing and enjoy both!

soheilm3

12-25-06, 11:55 AM

anyone ever have their tv show video for a few seconds and then cut out with audio still going? it just suddenly started happening and i think/hope it's the motorola box from comcast.

thanks
--soheil

ianchan1970

12-26-06, 01:51 PM

Not "encrypted", but copy-protected. CBS-HD (705) is copy-protected 24/7 in my experience. I don't know why. Other local channels are protected on a per-program basis (some are, some not).

That's exactly what happens when a channel is protected. You get a large file, that gets bigger the longer you let it run, but it will not play back.

If you use CapDVHS it will tell you the frame size, bitrate, etc.. on a recordable show. If those boxes stay blank when you hit Record, then it's protected.

I see, so Comcast's DVR outputs "junk" data on the Firewire port if a show is copy-protected...
But if I had a PC DVR (that received ClearQAM), would I then be able to record/transcode such copy-protected shows?

sfhub

12-26-06, 02:08 PM

IMO with respect to movie delivery BluRay and HD-DVD are basically buckets for the bits. An analogy would be whether you would care whether your movie is delivered via SATA or IDE hard drive.

Yes there are spec differences, and people like to become spec warriors arguing their format is better, but the reality is both formats are perfectly capable of delivering equivalent movie experiences that is clearly a step above DVD.

The early BluRay releases suffered from a perfect storm for bad PQ. They used bad film masters, they were also limited to mpeg on a SL 25GB disc (space hungry codec on space limited media), and the authoring experience was in its infancy. The results were the early releases looked very bad.

There was a noise reduction setting on the Samsung player that was set at high, but IMO this was really a red herring. Probably 90% of the poor PQ was because of the poor transfer and 10% due slight softness from noise reduction. Even after they "fixed" the NR setting, the bad titles still looked bad. Sony lost some credibility by blaming a hapless Samsung for BluRay woes when really their releases were just very bad transfers.

The 1080p vs 1080i output turned out to be another red herring as well. For movie delivery both 1080p and 1080i are exactly the same assuming your display or video processor performs inverse telecine (reverse 3:2) on 1080i sources. Further 1080i is not a limitation of the HD-DVD format, it is just a limitation of early players. The source content is still encoded at 1080p on the discs.

Anyway, back to the original statement. At this point both formats are perfectly capable of delivering very nice movie experiences. This is a far step from the early pre-release days when spec warriors claimed BluRay would blow HD-DVD away. It is also a far step from the actual launch results which saw HD-DVD step way ahead of BluRay.

I think it is accurate to say at this point the format itself is really not a factor for movie delivery. The factors are mainly price and studio support. The reason I don't group studio support with the format is because studios IMO just follow the money and whatever allegiance they have announced could change overnight if the sales numbers swing one way or another.

Price clearly is an advantage for HD-DVD at this point in time.

It is unclear who will be the winner, so IMO if you want to get into HiDef discs, just get the more affordable solutions and wait for a clear winner to emerge or the formats to merge via multi-format drives (like DVD+R and DVD-R ended up doing)

wco81

12-26-06, 02:37 PM

If you read some of the threads on AVS about the formats, they're already on to the next thing. Not just 1080p but 1080p24 mated with displays capable of refresh rates which eliminate judder.

Another issue is whether the "neutral" studios like Warner and Paramount are encoding at a lower bitrate than they could for their Blu-Ray releases. They may be targeting their encodes for a 30 GB disc rather than the 50 GB of Blu-Ray, which is also capable of higher bitrate overall.

web

12-26-06, 03:21 PM

TPeterson

12-26-06, 04:37 PM

I see, so Comcast's DVR outputs "junk" data on the Firewire port if a show is copy-protected...
But if I had a PC DVR (that received ClearQAM), would I then be able to record/transcode such copy-protected shows?Yes, the copy-protection interpretation of the broadcast flags in the transport streams is limited to the Moto STB (so far). So all clear-QAM tuners can record the programming. I believe that this includes firewire recordings from HDTVs that have built-in tuners, as well as the PC tuner cards, but I cannot confirm that personally (yet).

walk

12-26-06, 06:53 PM

If you have a PC-DVR yes you can record the clear-QAM stations (702-709) but not the other channels (719+). For those you would need a PC-tuner with CableCard(s), and so far there are none.

TPeterson

12-26-06, 07:57 PM

And if and when they appear, they'll likely be as bad about CP as is the Moto box. :(

mercado26

12-26-06, 09:55 PM

Hi,

I live in Milpitas and have been trying to get a successful 2-cablecard install in my Tivo Series 3.
I checked out tivocommunity but figured this might be a better place to post due to the "local" nature of the thread.

Currently my cards get everything in my subscription package except for ch719 (inhd) and
ch720 (fsn-ba)... these two channels show up as digital signal strength 0, even though I was
receiving them just last week with the rental DVR. I doubt the box itself is the problem, because
if it was, then I'd probably be receiving none of the HD channels.

I've tried calling the general 1-800 phone support but having the CSR's 'hit' the box doesn't do
anything. I've also called Comcast to see if they have the correct host/data pairing and
everything matches up with my box. On my 3rd and 4th truck visits, the technician "didn't read
page 2" of the work order so they didn't have replacement cards for swap testing. They said
they would "escalate the issue" but I suspect that is a code word for the circular file.

So... if anyone here has any tips on how to deal with Tivo cablecard installs (phone numbers,
people to contact, good experiences w/ individual techs, etc) I'd really appreciate it. I don't
really want to call up the 1-800 number and just blast the CSRs, but the squeaky wheel gets
the grease..

Thanks..

keenan

12-26-06, 10:08 PM

Some possibly interesting, possibly worthless, info from the Comcast 10K.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v637/keenanj/ComcastMarkets.jpg

http://yahoo.brand.edgar-online.com/EFX_dll/EDGARpro.dll?FetchFilingHTML1?SessionID=XDBdjmmKL9CGR9o&ID=4229080
COMCAST CORP (Form: 10-K, Received: 02/22/2006 16:10:40)

fender4645

12-26-06, 10:58 PM

That's neat. So we're their 3rd largest market but still get treated like the red-headed step child. Fun.

rsra13

12-27-06, 02:53 AM

Imagine if we were Cleveland or some place like that.

neoufo51

12-27-06, 08:57 AM

MHD, UHD and TNTHD and ONLY those HD channels still don't work for me even after making it known to the Comcast CSR's twice now. I've refused to get a tech to come over for obvious reasons. What else can I do to get help? I'm in Redwood City, BTW.

Mikef5

12-27-06, 12:19 PM

Finally

If you remember a couple of months ago I said that if Comcast didn't upgrade the 550 MHz areas and soon that I would be leaving for Dish. Well, I'm still here and you maybe wondering why. Here is the reason ......
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You are welcome to post this on the Forum. This release will be distributed to Bay Area media outlets today.

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

COMCAST TO INVEST

$80 MILLION DOLLARS IN BAY AREA

Since coming to the Bay Area, Comcast investment totals $663 Million

SAN RAMON, CA-December 27, 2006-On the eve of the New Year, Comcast, the Bay Area's leading provider of cable, entertainment and communications products and services, today announced plans to invest an additional $80 million dollars to turbo-charge the existing network infrastructure in eight Bay Area communities.

More than a quarter-million homes in Los Gatos, Milpitas, Saratoga, Santa Rosa, Hayward, San Leandro, Sunnyvale and Half Moon Bay will have their broadband network improved using the latest state-of-the-art 1 GHz technology. Over the next eighteen months, Comcast will be working with local city officials on our plans and notifying customers as we rollout out the most up-to-date broadband technology in their specific neighborhoods.

"An investment of this magnitude is further evidence of Comcast's commitment to our Bay Area customers and community," said Rick Germano, Regional Senior Vice President, Comcast. "When Comcast arrived in the Bay Area we promised to create a company that Bay Area residents could look to first for the communications products and services that connect them to what's important in their lives. This investment in turbo-charging the network which serves these cities is further proof of our steadfastness in honoring our pledge."

Over the next eighteen months the company will be laying over 2,200 miles of fiber-optic cable, (long enough to cover the distance from San Francisco to Chicago), in expanding a network that is scalable, reliable and highly integrated while continuing to provide our customers more convenience, choices and content. Upon completion of the project, customers in these eight cities will have access to more channels, video-on-demand, Comcast Digital Voice and the company's highly desired "Triple Play" which provides the entire suite of telecommunications services for one low monthly price.

Since Comcast acquired the 128 cable franchises in the Bay Area from AT&T, the company will have invested over $663 million dollars in improving California's infrastructure.

Each year, Comcast has continued to expand and enhance its products and services to better serve our customers needs. In 2006, Comcast products and services included:

Comcast Tripe Play:

Offering customers convenience and the best deal for video, voice and online for $33 each-great products for unbeatable price.

Comcast On Demand:

Provides Comcast Digital Cable customers more control than ever before to watch their favorite shows on their own schedule. Video-on-demand offers customers approximately 4,000 programs including movies, music, sports, news, instructional and entertainment programming and more selections available 24 hours 7 days a week. About 95% of the content is available at no additional charge.

Comcast PowerBoost:

Increasing our customers broadband performance, for no additional charge.

Comcast commitment and investment in the Bay Area community continued in 2006.

* Hiring more than 581 new employees.
* As part of our Comcast Cares Day, more than 3,000 employees, family and friends volunteered at 18 Bay Area schools-creating safer, cleaner and better environments for our children to learn and prosper.
* Through our Leaders and Achievers Program we invested $180,000 in scholarships for Bay Area high school students to continue their education.
* Each year through the Cable in the Classroom program, Comcast donates more than $1.2 million worth of video and High-Speed Internet services to schools in California.
* Partnered with community organizations, schools and libraries on various initiatives ranging from literacy to youth programs.

About Comcast

Comcast Corporation (Nasdaq: CMCSA, CMCSK) (http://www.comcast.com) is the nation's leading provider of cable, entertainment and communications products and services. With 23.3 million cable customers, 10 million high-speed Internet customers, and 1.6 million voice customers, Comcast is principally involved in the development, management and operation of broadband cable systems and in the delivery of programming content.

Comcast's content networks and investments include E! Entertainment Television, Style Network, The Golf Channel, Versus, G4, AZN Television, PBS KIDS Sprout, TV One and four regional Comcast SportsNets. Comcast also has a majority ownership in Comcast Spectacor, whose major holdings include the Philadelphia Flyers NHL hockey team, the Philadelphia 76ers NBA basketball team and two large multi-purpose arenas in Philadelphia.
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I posted this as I received it so that there would be no confusion on what was or wasn't said. This has been in the works for months and non disclosure sucks but I understand the reasons why it exists :D
Anyway, when this upgrade is finally finished ALL the areas will be at an even level and hopefully Comcast will finally get all the packages and the prices they charge for those packages to be the same no matter where you live in the Bay Area, no more ghettos. I would like to thank Mr. J. and Comcast for finally getting this done or at least started for now.

Keenan, two parts to look at, Santa Rosa and 1 GHz :eek: :D

Laters,
Mikef5