Bowing will be taken care of once the green gun is straightened and the blue/red converged over it. Shut off the rd and blue so that only the green is on. you can tweak it by eye, but I would use an actual mylar grid.

Anyone have any idea how to center the + marks on the user convergence screen? Even after doing a course and fine adjustment, and having the image almost perfectly centered and the overscan set properly, the user convergence marks are shifted way right still. As discused previously, if I center the convergence grid, it only moves the actual selector box [] and not the + marks. Its really more of a nuisance really.


Also, in looking through the Sony service manual, the factory spec for overscan is listed at 9%, so if using the AVIA DVD to set this, does that mean 4.5% on each side is optimal? It would make sense because 9% on each side seems like you would be losing a lot. Any one have any insight to this?

What kind of mylar grid do you mean and where do you get one. I have adjusted the green gun, then the blue and red on top of it and everything is now very close. If I had a grid of some kind, I could get it closer.

Originally posted by icodeit
Hey gang great thread.

I'm looking at the 51WS510 as they are on clearout prices with the 520 starting to hit the floor.

My question is how does the 4:3 expansion work on the sony? I know the modes, I'm just curious it when watching the running back cut I will miss the linebackers arm tripping him up? Meaning if you strech the window does it chop too much off?


The Sony 510 series has some OK stretch modes....... full, zoom, wide zoom, and normal. They pretty much do what those four photos show.

I use none of them..... :D For SD, I have my DirecTivo running into the cable input on my HD receiver(HTL-HD). I then use the stretch modes on it, which are much better IMO than the Sony's.

Hope this helps.

Yeah, I just do what Ramsrule does. My HD cable box is connected to my 51ws510 via DVI, so it automatically locks into "FULL" mode. I have a Zenith DVB-318 feeding a 1080i signal, so it also locks into "FULL" with DVD's. I use the stretch features of my cable box or DVD player when needed.

Thanks for the reply guys.

Went out on Sunday, and got a great deal on the Panny 53x54, so I didn't get the Sony. Everyone wanted about 400$CAN more for the Sony (based on the deals offered for Panny) so to save some bucks I got it instead.

I do like the idea about connecting via a HD receiver, and I might have to ask for more advice on that in the near future. For now however I only have a basic DSS (expressView) signal. So I think that I will have to look at the streched heads.

Originally posted by GeePSer
Ok, now I have the box [] centered on the + again. And using the AVIA dvd I have my overscan to ~5% and the image is about perfectly centered. But now my user menu convergence grid is shifted way to the right. The row of + marks on the righ side of the screen are almost halfway off the screen. If I shift the image over, obivously it is no longer centered. If I do a course convergence adjustment to all three colors, it will move my entire image, right? How can I get the grid correct without actually moving the image from the dvd player? I thought you said you have [] centered on the + again. If you undo your "centering convergence grid" step, all "+" should be in the center of [] again in user convergence menu. Also TPVP (or TPHP) has different settings on different wide modes, say if you made changes on Full mode, then you need to undo the change in Full mode too.

Originally posted by C.Y.
I thought you said you have [] centered on the + again. If you undo your "centering convergence grid" step, all "+" should be in the center of [] again in user convergence menu. Also TPVP (or TPHP) has different settings on different wide modes, say if you made changes on Full mode, then you need to undo the change in Full mode too.


When I moved the convergence grid back to where it was by default, it moved the [] box to the + marks - which were off center. When I had the grid centered by TPVP/TPHP it only centerd the [], not the + marks. So now the box and marks are centered on each other, but all shifted to the right side of the screen.
The part that sucks is that I dont remember if the marks were shifted like that when I first got it or not. I dont think they were, and have at one point or another put almost everyting back to factory settings to see if it would fix it.
The only thing I havent done is move the image (HPOS/VPOS) back to where it was originally - like I said before the image from the factory was shifted to the left a bit. So maybe by centering the image (moving to right), the convergence marks moved with it. I will try to check that out tonight.

Maybe post a picture of the grid ([+]) shift.

I will when I get off work.

Here is a pic. In the image, the convergence grid (TPVP/TPHP) is centered as well as an image using HPOS/VPOS. But you can see that that [] is centered (I have tape marks to mark physical screen center but you cant really see them). But the + marks are way off.

Does it really matter if the internal grid and brackets match up? I really don't see how it could.

Originally posted by Eddie Horton
What kind of mylar grid do you mean and where do you get one. I have adjusted the green gun, then the blue and red on top of it and everything is now very close. If I had a grid of some kind, I could get it closer.

I have an autocad file that you would have to take to a archetectual (sp) print type place to get.

If not that, you would have to measure and make your own (ack!)

Here is the master thread on it- http://www.hometheaterspot.com/htsthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=557003&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=1&vc=1

BlackbeardsSaint, can you forward that cad file to me? I can print it up at work on Mylar. That would make life a little easier - after about 10 minutes of staring at those grids I get a little crosseyed and makes it real hard to get straight!!

Maybe changing HPOS and VPOS will move "+" marks. Did you make a large adjustment? Try to change them back to see if "+" marks are back.

Originally posted by C.Y.
Maybe changing HPOS and VPOS will move "+" marks. Did you make a large adjustment? Try to change them back to see if "+" marks are back.


well, I just tried that tonight. It had no effect on the + marks. I move HPOS a significant amount and it did nothing. I cant figure out what might have affected the position of the marks.

If I dont figure it out this weekend, I am going to either return/exchange the TV or have a service call put in. Ive only had it for about 2 weeks - and got it at Circuit City. I can still return it with their 30day return policy. I might just have it serviced though (I have the extended warranty on it).

Any other thoughts that might move the marks?

Originally posted by GeePSer
well, I just tried that tonight. It had no effect on the + marks. I move HPOS a significant amount and it did nothing. I cant figure out what might have affected the position of the marks.

If I dont figure it out this weekend, I am going to either return/exchange the TV or have a service call put in. Ive only had it for about 2 weeks - and got it at Circuit City. I can still return it with their 30day return policy. I might just have it serviced though (I have the extended warranty on it).

Any other thoughts that might move the marks?

Not on your particular problem, but I can tell you that you wasted $300 on that extended warranty at CC. I fell for it too, but after checking the actual warranty that comes from Sony, the CC warranty overlaps the first year of the Sony warranty. In short, get your money back for the CC warranty and wait for your first year to almost expire from Sony -- at that point you can still get the warranty from either Sony or CC. One more thing, don't fall for that crap line from CC how their warranty covers power surges and Sony's doesn't. Big deal, for $40 you can buy a good surge protector from APC which comes with a $100,000 warranty covering anything attached to it.

Originally posted by Bogey62
Not on your particular problem, but I can tell you that you wasted $300 on that extended warranty at CC. I fell for it too, but after checking the actual warranty that comes from Sony, the CC warranty overlaps the first year of the Sony warranty. In short, get your money back for the CC warranty and wait for your first year to almost expire from Sony -- at that point you can still get the warranty from either Sony or CC. One more thing, don't fall for that crap line from CC how their warranty covers power surges and Sony's doesn't. Big deal, for $40 you can buy a good surge protector from APC which comes with a $100,000 warranty covering anything attached to it.

Well, not really. I didnt "fall for it". I worked at CC for 4 years until I graduated from college. I am well aware that the first year is still only the Sony warranty. I got a HUGE discount from the store - employee cost, I am very close to the store manager and he hooked me up. There are a lot of advantages to the extended warranties - I have seen it first hand for years. I wouldnt buy any type of HDTV without it. There are very few things I would buy the warranties on, but big screen tv's is one of them.


Back on topic:
I went to a local CC tonight to look at the other WS510's on display, and BOTH of them (a 46" and a51") had the + marks shifted to the right. The 46 wa not bad, but the 51 had it to the point where the far right tip was touching the edge of the screen. Neither was as bad as mine, but it was definately unusual to see both offset to the right. WTF?

Use the money you saved to get on one of Eliab's tours- www.avical.com and have him calibrate it!

He made my RPTV into a home theater.

Originally posted by BlackbeardsSaint
Use the money you saved to get on one of Eliab's tours- www.avical.com and have him calibrate it!

He made my RPTV into a home theater.

I was just reading some of your reviews of his calibrations. I checked out that site, and it looks like they will be in my neighborhood in december. I will definately get in touch with them about it. Thanks.

Could you share with us what he did to your set and what the cost is, Thanks!

Originally posted by C.Y.
Could you share with us what he did to your set and what the cost is, Thanks!

Take a look at the site. $750 for the full boat, it better be a damned brand new TV for that kind of $$! That's more than 1/3 the cost of my 550.

Originally posted by GeePSer
I went to a local CC tonight to look at the other WS510's on display, and BOTH of them (a 46" and a51") had the + marks shifted to the right. The 46 wa not bad, but the 51 had it to the point where the far right tip was touching the edge of the screen. Neither was as bad as mine, but it was definately unusual to see both offset to the right. WTF? I checked my set, the "+" marks on right side is closer to right edge than the left side "+" marks to the left edge. The difference is probably less than 1/4". Now I think "+" marks don't mean anything, the convergence points would be where "[]" marks are. Maybe service tech will know how to move "+" marks. If you are happy with your current set, maybe call for service first. If that doesn't work, you can then swap for another set.

I'm having a problem with my video 5 input, when I turn on my PS2 the screen scrolls left to right very fast starting a normal 480i game . Yet when I engage progressive scan on MVP 2004 the pic locks in looks great, shows at 480p in service menu mode. Reset the PS2 and the start screen is outta whack again? Yet will play 480i with the composite adapter in video1? Now I was prior to this issue tweaking my HD pic in the Video 6 input, so are changes made in either component input affect 480i this way. NOT the cables checked on 36" Panny, PS2 started fine, not the Vid 5 input, swapped HD cables & PS2 cables, picture scrolled in video 6??! HD played fine in Video 5. So is there a catagory input that will allow 480i, 480p, 1080i display adjustments, sounds like I locked 480i out from the video 5 input while in video 6? Search was no help for this unique screw up. TV is kp51ws510 ANYONE??

Why are you people obsessed with having those brackets and pluses lined up? As long as the bracket is somewhere near the pluses, you can still converge it. What's the big deal?

so I just got a kp51ws510 off Ubid for the bedroom. Supposed to be straight from the manufacturer repair shop so hopefully it wont prove to have been as bad an idea as it sounds - buying a used CRT off the internet with no returns and only the manufacturer warranty for protection.

Happy to join you all here. Excited too to finally do an in home shoot out between a DLP and a CRT. Will have a Sammy Kirk (HLN replacement under manufacturer warranty) arriving about the same time as the Sony.

Anyhow, I've got some massive tweaking sessions coming up and I'm trying to get as prepared as possible before hand. So are you guys still emailing that ws510 service manual around?

Any of you running HTPCs on these? I get one set up pretty easily on my current DLP but I understand its a little tougher on the Sony. Using DVI or Component adapter for ATI card? Do upscaled DVDs have the impact here they do on digital sets?

Also, what do you like from the motorola DCT6200 - DVI or Component out?

thanks in advance. and thanks already.
jb

Onecall.com has a good price on the Sony. I hope you didn't pay too much for a refurb.

over $300 less than onecall shipped an it included a Samsung SIR-T351 which hopefully will have had the digital audio fix. looks like it'll sell for $175 on ebay if I decide FOX,WB, and UPN aren't worth an antenna.

Originally posted by C.Y.
Could you share with us what he did to your set and what the cost is, Thanks!

Do a search here on Eliab. My review should come up ;)

I have an update about the user menu convergence marks, AKA "+" marks.

I have been sitting here for a couple hours messing around with settings - just greatful that my house and TV are still here after hurricane Charley hit - and found out how to adjust the position of the marks. There are two comments to make about them.
1: I believe they are totally aesthetic - meaning it has no real affect on the convergence itself, but in my case, they were so far off to the right that I couldnt tell if the right row was aligned or not.
And 2: this should probably be done immediately after you center the convergence grid itself (which moves the selection box, [ ], by TPHP/TPVP).

The settings to adjust the + marks are under PJE category and are OSDV/OSDH for vertical/horizontal adjustments. My initial settings were 57/11 respectively and I now have them at 58/5 which almost perfectly centers the marks. A pic is attached. Also, The adjustments for each 1 number value is about the thickness of the + mark lines, so it cant get 'perfect', but it can ge damn close.

For the "before" pic, scroll up a bit and see my previous attached image.
Here is the new one.

That is great news. It looks like OSDV has different setting for each wide mode (Normal, zoom, wide zoom and HD), just like TPVP.

Has anyone had any luck running an HTPC on this TV (particularly usig DVI)?

I can get 540p working but I really would love a decent 1080i mode.

I have done lots of searching, and I can get it to work, but it looks awful. Has anyone gotten this?

Hi all.. brand new Sony 46WT510 here.

Just wondering if there is a service entry or tweak that lets it display blacker-than-black (0 IRE), or is that not possible with this set? Overall the picture is good but I find the contrast, shadow detail in particular, to be quite lacking. :(

Also is the focus and internal calibration (I've done the flashfocus and manual calibration) really necessary or are they pretty good OOTB? I'd rather not open my brand new set and void the warranty :/

I have the 46WT500 which is the previous year model of the 510. It has no trouble passing blacker than black by default - no adjustments necessary.

As for flash focus - never push that button again. Do the service menu convergence and enjoy. Follow up with further service menu convergences as needed.

See this guide I'm hosting on my site for some additional tweaks:
http://mvgrafx.dyn.ca/~vmark/KPxxWS500.html

Hm, maybe it's my DVD player then. Denon 910.. I hunted around for a black level adjustment in the menu but there is none. I could have sworn it passed 0 IRE on my old TV (Sony 27" WEGA).

I'll have to try my old non-progressive player. I hope it's not the player though as the progressive image from the Denon is FAR superior to the Sony's crap "progressive" mode. Speaking of which, is it better to do the calibration (the thing where you line up the white crosses) in "interlaced" (and flicker-y) or "progressive" (more stable) mode?

Do the calibration in whatever mode you watch in. They're separate modes and will be saved separately.

For convergence, it does not matter whether you are in 960i or 480p. It does have separate data for "normal", "zoom", "wide zoom" and "HD" mode. That is, you need to do convergence four times. And if you do convergence in user menu, your changes will be lost once you hit flash focus. To save your changes, you need to do convergence in service menu and re-register flash focus. You can find all info in this thread.

I know that, I was wondering about the internal focus/calibration, ie open the set and fiddle with the guts :)

Only reason I used Flash Focus is the manual calibration was greyed out for some reason. Pushing FF fixed that. I must have done something to it in the service menu... weird.


Well, looks like my DVD player doesn't pass black level :( I swore it did (Denon 910). The reason I thought it was the TV is that cable/vhs/etc look washed out also. Well damn, anyone recommend a good proscan DVD player for this set, for under $250?

So I just returned my KP46wt510 for a KP51ws510, and I'm a little torqued about the results.

The 46 was perfect right out of the box, but the 51 is not. When the comcast guide is up, its a bit blurry (where the 46 was not) and the blue seems to be out of convergence. Could that cause what appears to be blur on the guide? I can't make out any other blurriness in text on the HD channels, but nothing is in place long enough for me to jump off the couch and check the convergence.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,
rb

Do a manual convergence. Only takes 5-10 minutes, no big deal.

Originally posted by walk
Do a manual convergence. Only takes 5-10 minutes, no big deal.

Either that he may need his VR's adjusted.

Originally posted by walk
I know that, I was wondering about the internal focus/calibration, ie open the set and fiddle with the guts :)

Only reason I used Flash Focus is the manual calibration was greyed out for some reason. Pushing FF fixed that. I must have done something to it in the service menu... weird.


Well, looks like my DVD player doesn't pass black level :( I swore it did (Denon 910). The reason I thought it was the TV is that cable/vhs/etc look washed out also. Well damn, anyone recommend a good proscan DVD player for this set, for under $250? I am not sure about your definition of calibration, it looks like you referred it to convergence in your post, that's why I tried to answer the convergence procedure.
Electrostatic focus and optical focus are not hard to do. Both can be accessed after taking out the front panel. I think doing electrostatic focus should be good enough (just be sure not to touch the screen pots).
User menu convergence will grey out if TV lost power. It forces you to use FF at least once before you can do user menu convergence. Like I said, just do service menu convergence and re-register FF, then you can use FF safely.
As far as DVD player, haven't you heard of Zenith 318 for $160? Get it now while you can.

C.Y. (or anyone who has done the focus on the ws510's),
In the guide listed here: http://mvgrafx.dyn.ca/~vmark/KPxxWS500.html it shows the SCREEN Pots as the bottom row, but in the Service Manual for the WS 510's it shows the FOCUS pots as the bottom row. (see pic below). Is the box itself labeled? I might open it up and look tonight, but I think my blue and red are out of focus a bit and might need some adjustment. I just want to make sure I dont adjust the SCREEN ones.

I think I followed the guide since I didn't have service manual when I did the focus adjustment. I remembered it has "R", "G", "B" labels, but I don't think it has "screen" and "focus" labels. I would say follow the guide (the top row is focus pots), but do it slowly and make sure you are moving pot on the right color column. If you don't see focus change, then you know it is the other one.
Also red and green is easy to do, but blue is kind of hard (it won't be as tight as red and green). And blue might change greyscale a little bit, so it's better not to touch blue as long as it is not off too much.

Edit: Do not follow the front panel removal method from the guide and service manual , ws510 is different. Also there is no seal around the panels.

The knobs usually have "screen" and "focus" next to the appropriate knobs.

Another quick ? for you - when you took off the front grill, did you notice any type of "warranty voided if this seal is broken" kind of things? I was about to pop off the front yesterday, but second guessed my self at the last minute.
On a related note, - when I worked at CC we used to sell these "mighty shield" aftermarket screen protectors that greatly reduced glare - but inorder to install the entire front of the screen had to be removed including the front grills on some units. We were guaranteed by the company that did the install that it would not void the warranty - so I guess you can get away with opening it up without voiding the manu. warranty.

Does anyone know how to reduce the overscan on this set. I entered the service menu to reduce the overscan on my sony crt rear projector. I had about 5% overscan and wanted to reduce it to about 2.5%. The service menu item that I changed was the HSIZ which was defaulted at 2. I could only change the default to 0 which did little in reducing the overscan. Does anyone know of any other value or method to reduce my horizontal overscan? I cant believe the default was set at 2. My sony 34hs420 HSIZ was defaulted at 37 and I was able to lower the value enough to adequately reduce the overscan. Are there any other sevice menu values or options available? Also the HSIZ value appears to be universal for all inputs and types(480i,480p,1080i). Thanks.

Originally posted by C.Y.
I think I followed the guide since I didn't have service manual when I did the focus adjustment. I remembered it has "R", "G", "B" labels, but I don't think it has "screen" and "focus" labels. I would say follow the guide (the top row is focus pots), but do it slowly and make sure you are moving pot on the right color column. If you don't see focus change, then you know it is the other one.
Also red and green is easy to do, but blue is kind of hard (it won't be as tight as red and green). And blue might change greyscale a little bit, so it's better not to touch blue as long as it is not off too much.

Edit: Do not follow the front panel removal method from the guide and service manual , ws510 is different. Also there is no seal around the panels.

Having gone through the calibration with Eliab, I fully concour.

Originally posted by GeePSer
Another quick ? for you - when you took off the front grill, did you notice any type of "warranty voided if this seal is broken" kind of things?

Nope!

Originally posted by Mr2Spyder
Does anyone know how to reduce the overscan on this set. I entered the service menu to reduce the overscan on my sony crt rear projector. I had about 5% overscan and wanted to reduce it to about 2.5%. The service menu item that I changed was the HSIZ which was defaulted at 2. I could only change the default to 0 which did little in reducing the overscan. Does anyone know of any other value or method to reduce my horizontal overscan? I cant believe the default was set at 2. My sony 34hs420 HSIZ was defaulted at 37 and I was able to lower the value enough to adequately reduce the overscan. Are there any other sevice menu values or options available? Also the HSIZ value appears to be universal for all inputs and types(480i,480p,1080i). Thanks.

There are a lot to mess with- HLIN, VLIN, HSIZ, VSIZ, and maybe a couple others (its been a while).

Originally posted by walk
Do a manual convergence. Only takes 5-10 minutes, no big deal.

by manual convergence do you mean the one in the on-screen menu, or the one that requires a service manual? I tried the link in this thread, but the key combination didnt seem to work on the 510.

thanks,
rb

I've been reading this thread and everything else I could find on my KP51WS510. I've done a few of the known tweaks here and there, but today I took the time and went through everything. I had already disabled SVM and corrected red push, so today I made sure my image and convergence grid were centered and got overscan to around 5%. Next I did the electrostatic and mechanical focus and was surprised at how simple it was. I took some paper, a red Sharpie, tape, and a tape measure and put some reference marks around the perimeter of my screen and did a full service menu convergence, turning off and on the different CRT's. I started with green, then mated the red with the green, and finally the blue with the green. Next, I copied the settings to all full modes and re-registered FF. My convergence, using the regular menu adjustments and even the service menu fine adjustments(without turning on and off individual CRT's), had never been dead on until today. What a huge difference all this has made. Last, I used the OSDV and OSDH settings in the PJE category to get my little "+" marks back right and voila!! Short of an ISF calibration, I don't think it could get any better. My better half and I have some friends who own a Hitachi Ultravision RPT, 51" I think, who always comment on how good my Sony looks compared to theirs. Can't wait till they see it now. It was great OOTB, but with a little research and time, it's simply superb. Thanks for all the info, guys.

Sounds great. How long did it take you, a whole Saturday or what?

On the 46WT510, the front looks different. I don't see any of those holes to pop off the front grill. Anyone done this on a 46"er yet?

Originally posted by rbalaian
by manual convergence do you mean the one in the on-screen menu,

yes the on-screen menu

Originally posted by walk
yes the on-screen menu

Why? Just go into the service menu- it's much easier and accurate.

Originally posted by Jim Banville
The knobs usually have "screen" and "focus" next to the appropriate knobs.

Just as a followup/Update - this is correct. They are all labeled - and the FOCUS knobs are the top row as per the tweaking guide. I don't know why the factory service manual show them differently.

Originally posted by walk
Sounds great. How long did it take you, a whole Saturday or what?

On the 46WT510, the front looks different. I don't see any of those holes to pop off the front grill. Anyone done this on a 46"er yet?

On the 510's you just have to remove 6 screws on the backside of the front panel - look on either side where the gray plastic wraps around and you will see some hex/phillips head screws. Take em out and remove the grill. And then there is a fiberboard panel you have to remove to get to the internals.

Originally posted by rbalaian
by manual convergence do you mean the one in the on-screen menu, or the one that requires a service manual? I tried the link in this thread, but the key combination didnt seem to work on the 510.

thanks,
rb
The key combination is correct - at least for me and everyone else. Try again - starting with the TV off. display : "5" : VOL + : Power .

while watching TV the other day, i noticed that my picture, especially when watching HD, has a kind of a subtle grayness to it. its kind of hard to explain so bear with me. the only reason i think i noticed it in the first place was because i changed channels and after the TV changed resolutions (i have my HD cable box set to pass thru) and the pic came back after about a split second it seems like some type of filter is applied to the pic which results in the "grayness".

the picture is still really great so this doesn't really bother me that much, but i figured i'd post about it to see if others notice the same thing. anyone else know what i'm talking about?

Tony,

Use Pro mode and turn the sharpness way down. These TV's produce some low level video noise which cannot be completely tweaked out. I agree that it is minor and overall the picture is outstanding.

Does anyone know how to adjust the color in the service menu?. I have Digital Video essentials and want to adjust the red, green and blue to get the colors as accurate as possible. Has anyone done this and what values did you change? I am assuming the best way to do this is to turn on each red, green and blue guns separately and adjust the RYR, RYB, GYR, and GYB values?

If you reduce red push, after color and hue adjustment in user menu (turn blue on only), green and red is pretty much dead on. I don't think you need to do something else.

CY

Are you saying I don't need to change any values in the service menu and only need to adjust color intensity and hue in the user menu? I thought the only way to reduce the red push is to reduce the red color correction/intensity in the service menu.

What I meant is after you reduced red push (which is in service menu), then just go to user menu to do color and hue adjustment with blue CRT on only. AFter that, you will find green (with green CRT on only) and red (with red CRT on only) is pretty much dead on too.

Can "lock in Full" be disabled?

Someone said there's a service mode tweak to disable this, called "JUMP". I found it, but when I switch it, it seriously messes up the whole picture.

Reason is I want to get an upscaling DVD player like the Zenith DVB318 but I also watch a lot of 4:3/non-anamorpic discs (Star Trek, MST3K...)

If you do a search here, you will see that post, but I don't know anyone actually tried it. I just use 318's zoom feature to view 4:3 and non-anamorphic contents.

The 318 has a variable zoom which can be used very effectively on 4:3 and non-anamorphic. You can zoom the whole picture, stretch only vertically, or stretch only horizontally.

Well, I'll take your word for it, although what you need isn't any kind of "stretch" or "zoom". What you need to watch 4:3 material in OAR is to put black bars on left & right i.e. "pillarbox". Does the Zenith do that, or are you stuck watching TV shows and other 4:3 material all stretched out and distorted? (Or using the S-Video output which I hear is terrible on the Zenith).

i'm noticing that my picture is slightly tilted a bit. its only realy noticable when i'm watching something like espn or a news channel with the ticker on the bottom, but the bottom left corner seems to be lower than the bottom right corner.

to make sure i wasn't crazy i pulled out my DVE disc and used the overscan pattern. i was right, there is definetly something going on because the lines arent straight across the screen. they get cut off at some points.

i'm not sure exactly how to fix this, if its fixable at all. anyone else have this problem in the past and know how to fix it?

I am sure we all had that problem of some sort at first. It can be corrected in the service mode adjusting the manual convergence grids.

Originally posted by tonytapes
i'm noticing that my picture is slightly tilted a bit. its only realy noticable when i'm watching something like espn or a news channel with the ticker on the bottom, but the bottom left corner seems to be lower than the bottom right corner. You can try coarse convergence adjustment, the info is in this thread. It seems like the item SKEW is what you need to do. In your case, you need to push joystick up to correct the tilt.

Originally posted by walk
Well, I'll take your word for it, although what you need isn't any kind of "stretch" or "zoom". What you need to watch 4:3 material in OAR is to put black bars on left & right i.e. "pillarbox". Does the Zenith do that, or are you stuck watching TV shows and other 4:3 material all stretched out and distorted? (Or using the S-Video output which I hear is terrible on the Zenith).
I don't think you want to use pillarbox (Normal) mode to watch 4:3 material, especially with the black bars. You could get burn in with that. Zenith 318 will let you zoom, so the image is not distorted (But you will lose some on top and bottom, just like ws510 "zoom" mode).

I found a minor problem about internal speakers off setting. I use external speakers and receiver and I thought I have turned off the internal speakers but it is not.
I connect ws510 "Audio Out (VAR/FIX)" outputs to my receiver audio input. In user audio menu, I set "speaker" to Off and "audio out" to Fixed. However, if I mute my receiver, I can still hear sound from internal speakers (very slightly though). It means speakers are not off completely. Does anyone notice this problem?
I also tried to turn TV volume all the way down (also tried mute) before I set the "audio out" to fixed (once set to "fixed", volume can't be adjusted), but the sound comes from internal speakers immediately right after "audio out" is set to fixed. Maybe it is a design issue?

Hey guys, great thread.

I've done all the minor tweaks (turning off SVM, EE, and red push) and just got HD digital cable last night. The Olympics look amazing. But I've noticed a bit of light ghosting on the right edge of everything. Not sure if thats the proper term, but its barely noticeble. Its most apparent on the boxes showing timing and olympic/world records. On the right edge of the boxes, you can see a faint bar, probably a manifestation of the right side of the box itself.

Any ideas? Some people have told me it could be the cables, others say it could be the cable feed coming in. I'm using a dvi cable from the HD box supplied by Cox. Has anyone else experienced this? I'd like to know whether is the cable or the tv since I can still return it (<30 days).

1. Be sure you have your CATV cable ground to your house ground.
2. Check for convergence
3. Try lower sharpness and have proper brightness and contrast (not in torch mode).

If it is still there, then it could be the "ringing". It seems like sony, toshiba and mitsu has a special image processing circuit and it could result this ringing effect. Try go to "normal" mode and watch the lines between graybar and 4:3 image. I heard you can get rid of ringing by modifying the circuit board. BTW, what is the tweak for EE (edge enhancement?)?

edit - Upon looking closer, mine has this white line/ghosting also. It's very faint and not noticeable from the couch, but it's there, especially on the edge between the 4:3 frame and the gray bars...

I also can hear sound from the speakers when they are turned "off"... Only affects PIP/TV since I go thru the cable STB or DVD player directly digital to my receiver.

The Right Handed ghosting, ringing is there, and can not be removed. It is the one bug about CRT RPTV that I do not like, try not to focus on it, you will hardly notice it.

There is no perfect display device.

It was said that a certain run of Mits. could have it tweaked out, they of course had other problems.

I have been watching this ghosting / ringing effect on all brands of CRT for several years.

I did not notice it previously on Analog RPTV's, probably too busy watching Scan lines!

With some soldering, the ringing will be gone. See 'Craigr' 's tweak at the SPot.

quick question about manual convergence in the service menu. when lining the grid up, what do you use as your outer borders?

i notice that, horizontally, there are two lines that are thicker than the others but vertically i can't see such lines. also, on some modes (wide zoom, 1080 etc) i notice there is a row of thinner boxes. should i move these off the screen?

i have everything pretty lined up, but was just curious about how others approach this.

has anyone come across a place that has the exact values to make everything (vpos, vsiz, hpos, red green blue crts etc) so that its lined up perfectly?

i'm noticing that when watching 2:35:1 material such as OAR movies on Showtime and DVDs the size of the black bars are different between the two sources. i'm noticing this.

for example, after lining up everything so that black bars are the same size on high def, when switching to DVD the black bars will be off.

any input is appreciated. THanks :)

Searched extensively but finding rare info about the 318 is a chore. Just got a zenith 318 knowing there were issues with some Sony RPTV's.

Per faq:

"Sony kp-53hs10, and on 1080i, it will lose sync on high contrast material, like explosions. It is not the dvb318, it is the sony and it effects the 61 inch model and the 2 xbr's from that year as well."

Didn't read anything about this happening with my model (65WS550) but sure enough while watching Braveheart in 1080i it cut out during the first field battle scene. This happend to anyone else? I'm using component and the picture is gorgeous when its not blacking out. Any advice would be appreciated. TIA

Does anyone know if the 51ws510 has color decoder adjustments? Other than changing the axis to 1 are there any other service menu values to adjust the red, green and blue colors? I have a 34hs420 and it has RY-r, RY-B, GY-r and GY-b values that allow to adjust the red and green color intensity and hue. The 51 does not have any similar values. Are they called something else?

Might be CUtS and DRVS, then again that might be for greyscale only.

CUTs and DRVs are for grayscale, not for color decoders. When you had your set calibrated, did you ask how to adjust color decoders for your 510?

any input on my above post?

I mostly watch DVD movies on my TV (KP51WS520) and sadly 85% of my movies are 2:35 ratio. I have no HDTV at this time and watch very little regular cable TV. I said sadly due to having black bars on top and the bottom in FULL mode. According to Sony Tech Support the black bars are considered static image and WILL result in burn-in even with contrast and brightness turned way down. They suggest to use Wide or Zoom mode. The trouble is the Zoom mode is too big and stretched and you can clearly see the scan lines (DVD player runs in 480p) and the Wide zoom is only slightly bigger then the full mode resulting in smaller black bars on top and the bottom.
Now my question is what is the best way to adjust the Wide or Zoom mode. Wide to enlarge or Zoom to shrink. The convergence grid in all three modes look identical and the ALCP command copies convergence from FULL to the other modes so in my mind they must be related. Yes, you can do touch ups in the other modes and save it however if you make bigger adjustments in Zoom modes like bringing all horizontal grid lines closer to the center in Zoom or more stretched for Wide zoom, how will it effect the FULL mode? The VSIZ command is probably global too. Is there any aspect ration command that could fix it? How does it effect FF?
Any suggestions would be appreciated.

I wouldn't do that if I were you. If your DVD player has variable zoom feature, you can make the top and bottom black bars smaller without changing AR too much. If you are worry about the burn in with top and bottom black bars, you can tune to an unused channel and run that snow image overnight once a while.

Mr2Spyder:
Does anyone know if the 51ws510 has color decoder adjustments? Other than changing the axis to 1 are there any other service menu values to adjust the red, green and blue colors? I have a 34hs420 and it has RY-r, RY-B, GY-r and GY-b values that allow to adjust the red and green color intensity and hue. The 51 does not have any similar values. Are they called something else?

BalckbeardSaint:
Might be CUtS and DRVS, then again that might be for greyscale only.
C.Y.:
CUTs and DRVs are for grayscale, not for color decoders. When you had your set calibrated, did you ask how to adjust color decoders for your 510?

I think the answer is that there are no decoder adjustments in the video processor (stay away from the Chroma decoder settings: it's not what you want) that don't modify grayscale tracking (for the 500 and 510's anyway), unlike the XBR's. This means that you are confined to user controls saturation & hue + overall brightness & contrast which means no way to compensate gain variations across intensity. If this is right a good gray scale cal is the most that can be done here. The good news is that I understand that gray scale calibration does take pretty well on the SONY's and +/- 100K uniformity is attainable from 20 to well over 80 IRE for most of these sets, but I cannot independently verify that this the case. The best OOB grayscale for these models is presumably the "warm" setting, which at least becomes more tolerable after resetting AXIS.

If anyone knows or thinks differently I'd like to hear from them

good luck

For those curious, I got a chance to play with the "520" model, the 46WT520 to be exact.

The major changes over the 510, besides cosmetic ones, look to be:
- HDMI instead of DVI, despite what the Sony web page says, this unit has one HDMI and NO DVI. The HDMI input (#7) does still have an analog L/R audio pair though.. The back panel is a little more compact.
- In HD mode you can change the Wide mode. Unfortunately the only choices are "Full", "Zoom" and "Wide Zoom". NO "NORMAL" aka 4:3 mode. :( So basically people who want to get rid of black bars with 2.35:1 movies (HD source) can zoom in, but that's it. You still can't watch 4:3 HD sources (aka upconverted dvd) in OAR/pillarboxed. Bummer.
- You can manually select SVM (low/med/high/off) and auto-color (on/off) from the user menu, and there's some kind of noise filter, but that's about it.

I only had a HD source to play with so I can't tell you what if any changes there are for non HD sources (most of the DRC options are locked out in HD mode as on previous models..)

I just bought a 46WT510 from CC less than 30 days ago, thinking about returning it for the newer model. I don't know if it's worth the trouble though, the changes don't really amount to squat (already disabled SVM and auto-color in service menu, don't need HDMI in fact I'd need a DVI converter, and the zoom modes are useless to me). The noise filter might be nice for lo-def sources though. The price is lower on the new model also ($1349 on sale right now, great deal) maybe I can get them to just cut me a check for the diff. and call it even... :/

I have a KP51WS510 and have never heard anything about "auto color", if I remember correctly. What is it and how do you set it or disable it?

"Trinitone" aka auto-color balance / auto-fleshtone.. whatever you want to call it..

On the 510 series, I guess 500/550 also, you have to disable it in the service menu. For the 520 they let you change it via the user menu, which is a good thing, but hardly matters if you're not afraid to brave the service menu. *I believe it's "UDCL" under "Category 2150P-4"

Originally posted by C.Y.
CUTs and DRVs are for grayscale, not for color decoders. When you had your set calibrated, did you ask how to adjust color decoders for your 510?

No, I was busy asking other dumb questions lol

Finally took the plunge and bought the 57we510 today (arrives next Monday). Under $1500 at Frys. I was planning on getting the 57x500 but when the dealer would not drop the price.......It's not worth double the price to me. My dvd is the 318 which should arrive any day now.

Can't wait to get that screen off and start tweaking !!!

Richard

C.Y.,

Have you tried removing all audio to the set ? Is the noise still there? If not, then you can run everything through your reciever and use zone 2 to the tv when that is the only audio you want.

Richard

Originally posted by BlackbeardsSaint
No, I was busy asking other dumb questions lol Maybe you can email him?

Originally posted by Richard Ulery
C.Y.,

Have you tried removing all audio to the set ? Is the noise still there? If not, then you can run everything through your reciever and use zone 2 to the tv when that is the only audio you want.

Richard I am not sure I understand what you said. Actually I did some search on other site and several owners also reported the same finding with speaker off. When you get your ws510, you can give it a try to see if you have the same result as mine.

Originally posted by walk
I believe it's "UDCL" under "Category 2150P-4" I think it defaults to "disabled" for movie and pro modes already.

C.Y.,

I assume you have a coax to the 510. Disconnect it. Do you still hear the speakers? If yes, then the only thing you can do is disconnect the speakers. If no, then you need to demodulate the coax to audio and video. I did a quick search but could not find one. ( the only one I found has been discontinued, $69. )The alternatives are to go digital or buy a cheap vcr to demodulate.

When I have had my pj ISF calibrated, They always do manual focus then magnetic then manual again.

Richard

Well you can unplug audio RCAs going into the set if you have any, but you can't do anything about it when using the TV tuner for PIP and such. You'd have to open the set and actually cut the wires to the speakers I guess. It's so low in volume that it's hardly worth doing that.

Maybe I didn't state it clearly. It only happens when you use internal tuner, so you need to have your CATV or Antenna coaxial cable connected to TV, output audio to your receiver and turn internal speaker off. The sound from internal speakers is faint but it is not supposed to do that.

When I flip through the inputs, the AUX input always has a very little 'snow' sound to it. It's normal.

You know you can "skip" inputs you're not using? :)

The sound isn't a big deal, push some pillows up against the speakers if it bothers you. :)

Originally posted by tonytapes
quick question about manual convergence in the service menu. when lining the grid up, what do you use as your outer borders?

i notice that, horizontally, there are two lines that are thicker than the others but vertically i can't see such lines. also, on some modes (wide zoom, 1080 etc) i notice there is a row of thinner boxes. should i move these off the screen?

i have everything pretty lined up, but was just curious about how others approach this.

has anyone come across a place that has the exact values to make everything (vpos, vsiz, hpos, red green blue crts etc) so that its lined up perfectly?

i'm noticing that when watching 2:35:1 material such as OAR movies on Showtime and DVDs the size of the black bars are different between the two sources. i'm noticing this.

for example, after lining up everything so that black bars are the same size on high def, when switching to DVD the black bars will be off.

any input is appreciated. THanks :)

hate to be a pest, but can any one comment on the above post?

thx

Your DVD player could shift image up or down a little bit, I think that is why the black bar looks different between DVD and HD.

Originally posted by walk
You know you can "skip" inputs you're not using? :)

The sound isn't a big deal, push some pillows up against the speakers if it bothers you. :)

Not the AUX.

Originally posted by BlackbeardsSaint
When I flip through the inputs, the AUX input always has a very little 'snow' sound to it. It's normal. I am not talking about AUX input and the snow sound. If you use a receiver, just try it out (1.use internal tuner, 2.send audio to receiver through "audio out(var/fix)", 3.turn internal speakers off and set to "fixed audio out", 4.mute your receiver, you will see what I meant.

Originally posted by BlackbeardsSaint
Not the AUX.

You can skip AUX as well. Under "channel fix" in the users menu, you can set it to video 1. It will no longer go to the AUX input, but if you arent using Video 1, it wont help much.

Hmm, you should be able to skip "AUX". I can. 46WT510

Aux 2? What input is it? (video1,2,3...)

Originally posted by C.Y.
I am not talking about AUX input and the snow sound. If you use a receiver, just try it out (1.use internal tuner, 2.send audio to receiver through "audio out(var/fix)", 3.turn internal speakers off and set to "fixed audio out", 4.mute your receiver, you will see what I meant.

No, I know, I just meant thats where I notice it.

Hey y'all, just wanted to post real quick about a problem I had with all of my component inputs last night:

The TV suddenly had decided to discard the color correction portion of all component signals. This happened while I was switching from an HDTV program to a menu within the HDTIVO; I don't believe there was a signal change, but all of a sudden, the green tivo menu screens were grey, and on the video, color correction was weird. Colors that were supposed to be red appeared green/muddy and things that were supposed to be blue appeared purple. It wasn't like the RED channel was off, it was more like the colors were shifted or something?
I hassled with the component cables in the back of the set, and noticed an obvious change when I pulled the chroma cable (loss of picture structure),
noticed a difference when I pulled the color cable (image went to black and white) but there was no difference when I pulled the final cable (is this supposed to be some hue correction signal?)
After verifying that it was happening on all component inputs, via all component devices, I decided it must be something in the set, so I unplugged it for an hour or so (not wanting to do the factory reset just yet) and the problem did not go away. After leaving it unplugged over night, and the problem still not going away, I knew that before I called sony, that I would need to perform the reset, since that's what they would tell me to do anyway.

Well, performing the factory reset (holding down the reset button on the remote while hitting the power button on the TV) fixed the problem. Good thing I kept detailed notes on all of my changes!

Now I'm just concerned that there's a problem with the set. Any ideas or has anyone seen anything similar?

For some reason I can't open the zip file on removing the screen. Can someone provide a direct link or explain the process for removing the screen on the 510? Thanks.

Richard

screen removal guide by gallobluechip
------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have just removed the Glare Screen, What a difference. No glare. Unbelievable. I can turn on any light in the house, any window, anything. If you have an option to do this, do it, its just amazing.

You have to remove the bottom panel first. There are 3 screws on each side located behind the panel. Remove bottom panel and place in front of tv. There are wires connecting the front panel controls and a/v connectors. I had about a foot of slack so it was no problem. This exposes 4 screws for the top panel. Now remove top panel. There are screws on top and on the sides and also the ones you just exposed below. You definetly need 2 people for the next procedure.
Remove the front panel and hold in place in front of the tv. The person on the left must reach in and unhook the wires connecting the autofocus sensors which are connected to the Rails on the inside panel. This will give you extra slack, maybe 2 feet, I had just enough slack so that I could lay the panel face down in front of the TV. (The best thing to do is place a coffee table if you have one in front of the TV and place a bedsheet on it.) Unscrew the rails holding the panels down. (You don’t need to remove the Sensors) The rails are wired together for the autofocus so just place them on the side. Slide the whole Screen assembly out and place on another bedsheet on the Floor. Lift up the Long Strips of black tape on 4 sides of panels and remove the Glare Screen. Get some cotton gloves and put the Tape back securely on the (2) screens that are left, Gloves prevent smears or marks. Place the 2 screen assembly back in the Front panel.

Reverse above procedure, put everything back in

Refocus and do convergence again.

This is a revision of a post I used to do this, just my advise on doing this procedure. I am not an expert but this above procedure worked for me. It took me 90 minutes to complete the procedure above. If you have been suffering with glare from these Sony's this seems to be the most cost effective and effective way to deal with the glare issue.

Also, some people Restack the Screen, but I believe that if you want to just remove he protective screen you do not need a spacer. The rails that hold
the 3 screens down hold the 2 screens down just as well. Also, this was done on a KP57WS510 and the screen stack did not lose any stiffness, I’m sure any smaller screens would be fine.

Good Luck
-------------------------------------------------------------------

C.Y.,

Thanks for the post.

Richard

I recently got the Sony KP46-WT510 and HD-Tiv (HR10-250), but have noticed a problem....


When I have the Tivo output 480p, in Panel mode, the picture is shifted to the right. Meaning the left sidebar is about double the width of the right sidebar. When I go back to the NPL, for example, the logos are partially cut off on the extreme right sides. Last night, I noticed that when I had a 480p signal in FULL mode, the shift was so extreme that there actually was a small sidebar on the left?????? Is this an issue w/ my TV or the Tivo??

I'm getting my HD OTA and occasionally the signal goes. Does anyone know how to get the station back without going through the whole add digital channels thing?

I know I can punch it in, but when I'm surfing through I can't get it back without going through the menu and adding all digital channels, which adds in about 7 channels that have no signal.

Does anyone know what the maximum native resolution for the 51ws510 is and where does the info come from? Is it 1920x1080i , 1440x1080i or 1280x1080i. Thanks, Mike.

There is no "native" resolution on a CRT, it's analog.

I think tests put the max resolution around 1600 horizontal, by 1080 lines.

I know this TV is made for HD and it looked amazing at the store (DVD is fantastic as well). BUT, we still watch most things in standard def and the picture is horrible (by my standards at least). Couldn't believe all the artifacts when watching "normal" tv. What is up? I had (still have, going to sell) an Hitachi 51" big screen tv that I bought 7 years ago that has a MUCH better picture for standard definition tv. I tried playing with all the different menu options, video modes (even watching it in 4-3 with bars on the side) I get the same artifacts, ghosting/pixelation. Sometimes people's faces are very blurry and other times they are ok. Text is "shaky" and flickers. I'm inputting through S-video from my DirectTV cable box (standard def only at the moment).

Is it this Sony or is this problem inherent with all projection HD tvs?

Thanks in advance for any help.

I can return this and go Grand WEGA or Hitachi 50V500A (will hurt my pocket) but if the standard def picture quality is a lot better then I probably will to appease my upset better half. Sounds crazy that I'm probably going to return an HDTV due to it's poor standard def display. Never thought it would be an issue!


-B

Garbage in, garbage out. Get an HD-ready DirecTV box, preferably an LG mfg. one (Sony HD-300, Hughes HTL-HD). Set it to convert everything to 1080i and connect it to your set with component cables. The overcompressed DirecTv channels will still look kinda blurry but the good ones will be fine.

Question for users of the WS510:

I currently own a 2-1/2 year old KP61HS20 with which I've been very satisfied. We recently purchased a second home in the mountains, and I'm thinking of moving the HS20 there and replacing it with a 65WS510 in our primary residence. I get my HD via Comcast cable and watch mainly sports programming, a few primetime shows, and also lots of movies on DVD. My wife has a broader palette and still tends to watch lots of 4:3 stuff. For these reasons, we've been really happy with the 4:3 aspect ratio of the HS20 over the past couple of years during this transition period as it does a great job with standard analog broadcast. I probably would not have considered replacing it yet, but if I'm going to spend $2000-$2500 for a new RPTV, I'd rather do it for the house where the set will get more use.

With that said, if anyone has made a similar switch, I'd like to hear your thoughts. I expect that the 65WS510 will perform better with HD and DVD source material, but I'm concerned that there will be a significant drop in quality on standard 4:3 analog stuff (although I imagine some of that may be compensated for by the smaller 4:3 image of the 65WS510 vs. my current 61" set).

My other concern with this unit is that it was released more than a year ago. How much of a factor is it (or will it be in the future) to buy a set these days that has a DVI-HDCP input instead of the newer HDMI input?

Another thing I really like about the HS20 is that it doesn't have a reflective screen on it. Is screen removal a possible DIY-job on the WS510 series?

When I was in the market a few years ago, I chose the HS20 over rival brands because I felt that the PQ was superior at the given price point. I guess I'm just kind of assuming that I would only be even more impressed with a newer generation Sony. This final question may be to the wrong group of owners, but am I doing myself a disservice by not looking at a 65" Mits or Tosh, for example? I've also seen some blistering deals on the 64" Pioneer Elite 730HDi, but that line of sets seems to have some issues with streaking.

TIA for any inputs.

Originally posted by platypus
Another thing I really like about the HS20 is that it doesn't have a reflective screen on it. Is screen removal a possible DIY-job on the WS510 series?
Yes, just follow the intruction posted on the previous page.

As mentioned before, the glare screen removal is one of the best bang for the buck mods you can do to your WS510. I was a little intimidated at first, but I was able to pull it off in about an hour without any hitches. The difference was amazing. I never thought I'd be able to watch my TV with the shades up in the middle of the day.

One tip: when you re-secure the black tape around the edges, don't pull it too taut or else you'll be able to see the tape border after the screen is put back together. You'll know what I'm talking about when you get to that step.

As for purchasing the set, I would wholeheartedly recommend it if you have seen the PQ for yourself and are satisfied with the price. I would think that having a DVI input and not the newer HDMI input won't be an issue for a while as I'm sure most companies will try to make their video sources backwards compatible for a while to reach the broadest market available.

I bought my 57WS510 in January and have not regretted it for a second. I think someone mentioned in a previous post that SD picture quality is going to depend largely on the source, not so much the TV. I just switched from Voom back to Time Warner (because I needed Road Runner) and I have to say that the Voom PQ for standard cable was much better than the PQ I'm getting now.

I just took delivery of a 51" WS655 which is the newer version of the WS550. I am thrilled with the picture quality so far. I also like the look of the newer WS655.

It's also got the cable card, which i'm using, and HDMI input. They also have the newer menus on the WS655 but they are not present on the WS520. The new menus are a big improvement in IMO.


Best of all though is the inclusion of the new "monitor" option in the menus of the WS655. This new "monitor" setting is also available on the 34" XBR960. It eliminates the red push and brings the colors into almost perfect alignment. This is so cool because it makes me a little less impatient to get this set ISF calibrated. The color is the most important thing to me so i'll worry about the ISF down the road.


So far so good. Anyone else looking at these newer models yet? I'm hoping someone starts an owners thread for these sets soon.

I've been looking at the both the 51" and 57" WS655 models. I've only been able to find two in stores (not surprising in Wyoming) and neither were hooked up to an HDTV source yet. I'll be looking to buy in about a month after we move. I look forward to hearing more owner reports about it too!

I was also curious to find out if the WS655 upconverts 720p to 1080i or if it somehow displayed 720p natively.


I only ask because the tv identifies each signal depending upon which channel you are watching.

Originally posted by Tigerriot
I just took delivery of a 51" WS655 which is the newer version of the WS550. I am thrilled with the picture quality so far. I also like the look of the newer WS655.


Can I ask why you went with the 51" instead of the 57"? Anything other than the obvious cost difference?

Thanks,

7

My decision was not motivated by cost at all. I think the price difference between the 51" and 57" models was only a few hundred dollars.

I had several reasons for going with the smaller of the two.

First off, the smaller size offers a little more brightness. Second, i'm well aware that the bigger you go with projection tvs the more flaws that are made apparant in all the material you watch. Lastly, with my space available in my basement anything bigger than 51" might have been too much. With my basement setup I sit about 9 feet from the tv. IMO 51" is perfect for that distance.

Hi all. I just bought a KP51WS520 and it arrived today. I know I have seen what this is called, and it's not that big of a difference either, but when on ESPN and the "Bottom Line" is up, half of it is cut off. If I then change the vertical alignment, it makes the top go up as im sure all of you already know.

My questions are:
1. What is this problem called??? overscan???
2. Are there any service menu tweaks and if so where are they found, because I have no idea what to look for?
3. Are there any other tweaks that could help do anything to the TV.
4. After viewing 100 hrs. I will do an auot focus. What will this do?
5. Will AVIA help that much?


Sorry for all the questions guys. I already know a lot about these TV's, but I dont know it all. Thanks to any of you who answer. I do appreciate it.

Originally posted by Steve S
Garbage in, garbage out. Get an HD-ready DirecTV box, preferably an LG mfg. one (Sony HD-300, Hughes HTL-HD). Set it to convert everything to 1080i and connect it to your set with component cables. The overcompressed DirecTv channels will still look kinda blurry but the good ones will be fine.

Another SD tip is to take your SD source(in my case my D*Tivo) and run it through the cable-in on the HTL-HD(my box of choice) that's been set as described above to output at 1080i...... the picture quality is much better for me this way vs. s-video connection either directly to the TV or through my AV receiver.

Tune in to channel 3 and rock on!

As always, YMMV.

Originally posted by hpman247

1. What is this problem called??? overscan???
2. Are there any service menu tweaks and if so where are they found, because I have no idea what to look for?
3. Are there any other tweaks that could help do anything to the TV.
4. After viewing 100 hrs. I will do an auot focus. What will this do?
5. Will AVIA help that much?

1. If you are in Full or Normal mode, then it is overscan.
2. Please read this entire thread first.
3. Please read this entire thread first.
4. Please read this entire thread first.
5. Both AVIA and DVE has overscan patten.

Anyone connect a PC to their CRT RPTV? Is it possible to do or will it most definitely result in burn-in? I mean how long would the static image have to be sitting on the screen for burn-in to occur? I'm asking this in regards to a KP57HW40 which should be similar to the KP51WS520 although an older model. Thanks.

Just so you know, I have read the entire thread, but some stuff that you guys sayto change in the SM are different. Like I dont have the "2150P-4." category in the service menu.

I have already changed the hsiz and vsiz, as well has axis adn that has helped. But I cant say anything was bad in the first place.

If you have AVIA or DVE disk, check with its overscan patten while you are in Full or Normal mode (not zoom or wide zoom mode). You will know how much overscan you have right away. It is good if all four sides show less than 5%. I hope you adjusted HSIZ and VSIZ with overscan patten, not just by eyeball it.

Originally posted by jagz
As mentioned before, the glare screen removal is one of the best bang for the buck mods you can do to your WS510. I was a little intimidated at first, but I was able to pull it off in about an hour without any hitches. The difference was amazing. I never thought I'd be able to watch my TV with the shades up in the middle of the day.

One tip: when you re-secure the black tape around the edges, don't pull it too taut or else you'll be able to see the tape border after the screen is put back together. You'll know what I'm talking about when you get to that step.



Has anyone successfully done this with the 65WS510? I'm concerned that removal of the outer screen may result in too much flex in the wider screen as compared to the 57WS510. Also, does this void Best Buy's extended maintenance/replacement agreement?

Bump !!! :D

Could someone please let me know what the default service menu value is for UGAM, Set in Movie Mode, Component/DVI connection. I think it's in the 2150P-4 area.... Thanks in advance!!!
One other quick question, I was going to start in on the electro-static focus and noticed the front grill does not remove the same as the one posted in the guide, could someone fill me in on the removal and access of the POTS for the WS510 and if there's anything I should look out for... Thanks again !!
Regards,
Steve

One other quickie, when I completed my service menu convergence and went to Re-Register Flash Focus using the link provided earlier and got an error message, this is what I done
1. Adjusted convergence
2. Wrote to memory
3. Exited internal display crosshatch pattern
4. Hit Flas Focous button on the front of the set....

Well when I hit the flash focus on the set I got an error message, don't recall what as I did not re-attempt this procedure again until I could find out if I'm doing it wrong for the WS510 model. Any and all feedback appreciated.
Ciao,
Steve

You can find the detailed info in this thread for your static focus and Re-register FF questions. Several people had posted step-by-step procedures and their own experiences.

Originally posted by C.Y.
You can find the detailed info in this thread for your static focus and Re-register FF questions. Several people had posted step-by-step procedures and their own experiences.

So what your saying is; a guy stopped by and asked for directions to the same place earlier and I should track him down to find out where I need to go ?? lol, j/k :):);)

Anyway I did see your post around page .5, did you find that it was worth your time to do it? did you actually find things out of focus or were they already dead on?. Just curious and wondering if I should give it a try while I'm cleaning my CRT guns....
Anyway you could post the default UGAM value for "Movie" setting ...Would be appreciated, thanks C.Y.

All I am saying is if you read every post in this thread, you should know the answer to your questions. Could you do that first? If you still have questions after that, we will be happy to answer for you based on our experience.

You don't really need to do optical focus, I think static focus is good enough.

UGAM settings for movie mode are all "0".

So my folks called last night after moving into a new house and, after having their Sony 51" CRT-RPTV (I believe its the 510) in storage for three months, their picture now has a bevy of red, curved lines running through the image.

It's more evident when the screen is black and the lines change size when switching between composite/component video. I'm stumped and was hoping one of you guys could help. Anybody seen this problem before or know of how to deal with it?

Thanks in advance. :)

Originally posted by C.Y.


You don't really need to do optical focus, I think static focus is good enough.

UGAM settings for movie mode are all "0".

Thanks so much !! I know what you meant, I'm on dial-up service in Italy and by the time I ever find what I'm looking for on the net I've almost lost interest !! :) :)

Originally posted by ericbee99
their picture now has a bevy of red, curved lines running through the image.
If they are retrace lines, try to read through this thread, you will find out where to adjust red screen pot.

So what is the definitive answer about the KP51WS520 , 720p and xbox? I've read people saying it up converts and others says it downconverts but I'd like to hear someone who's actually playing the games (Especially all the new ESPN sports titles, and RB63) and tell me what's happening with it. Mine comes tomorrow and I just want to know should I not get my hopes up.

My KP51WS520 came this morning. They called me about a quarter after 8 saying that it was going to be delivered between 9 and 11. Then 5 minutes later they ring the bell. I didn't know what happened. Well I gotta set it up now. I want to put the xbox straight to it but wifey working at home today and the last thing I want to hear is "I knew you got this just to play that game on"

Now you can go to service menu and tell us if ws520 upconverts 720p to 1080p or not.

as if I had a clue to what to do..... I'll figure it out soon enough. Right now I have to tweak this thing. Red is through the roof on it :(

FIRST IMPRESSION: Out the box I was NOT impressed, at all. I have a discerning eye as well as ear. I did just a few tweaks found on this thread and WOW!!! Detail is great!!! I'm running STNG:Nemesis DVD and oh I love it. I'm not even using component cables yet and it's 1,000 times better than the out the box performance. Maybe it needed time to warm up seeing it's a new set but I would assume that Sony would have put a few hours on it already through QC.

It's a bit dark as I did brightness and sharpness by memory. I'm going to find exactly where it was that I read these settings should be at. But I put in on Pro with Warm temp and did the convergence. Really the left crosses needed help but I'll do them all in more detail later.

Now I'm in a jam here. I have the HDTV cables for the xbox but I notice ALL the games that I will be playing are all in 480p (at least that's what it says on the box). The xbox doesn't look that great too me. I haven't did any tweaks to that input yet so I'll do that first before I pass judgment.

Yea, hey for fifteen hundred bucks I can be a prick! I want this thing to be perfect.

I WILL say this however, out the box performance of SD material is WAY better than I thought it would be. I'm very pleased about that. And seeing as I haven't done any tweaking on that input either I'm assuming it can only get better. That was a concern of mine as I didn't want wifey saying "Man we should just keep what we got"

Welcome to the Sony Owners clique..... :D

A quick comment on SD programming..... as you watch more HD material, you'll start to waver on the set's overall SD quality.

But it's nothing to do with the set.... just your picture quality tolerence levels increasing.

Enjoy the set!

Originally posted by totalownership
Now I'm in a jam here. I have the HDTV cables for the xbox but I notice ALL the games that I will be playing are all in 480p (at least that's what it says on the box). The xbox doesn't look that great too me. I haven't did any tweaks to that input yet so I'll do that first before I pass judgment.


On my KDP-65ws550, all xbox progressive signals are a tad dark, so I use my Vivid mode for that input. Note: I have calibrated that mode and turned down the torch settings it ships with. I initially used the Video essentials in the XBOX to set up that input, but then found out that the dvd playback on the xbox (non-modded) is interlaced. When I played anything in a progressive resolution, it got much darker.

Now, showcase titles (Ninja Gaiden, Halo2, Burnout, Freedom Fighters) look absolutely terrific, and I use them to show off the entertainment center before I use hd content.

edit: I forgot to mention, Freedom Fighters is a great 720p game (9+ ratings) you can usually find cheap, and Tony Hawks' Underground (1) is also 720p. (don't know if the new one is or not.).

On both of those games, I play in 720p, and can definintely tell a difference, and on fast moving image bits, I don't see any interlacing artifacts.

I did a few more user level tweaks and now the xbox is looking more and more sweet. I mean REALLY sweet. And DVD playback is just WOW! ESPN-HD makes me mad though. I didn't know they had those bars on the side. I thought it was in 16x9. Really hurts. I gonna write more but I gotta get back to the set. Just came back from buying some component cables, another fiber optic cable, speaker wire, audio equipment rack, xbox controller extender (where I originally have the set is just TOO close gotta rearrange the whole living room for the controller to get more distance from the screen.

ESPN-HD should be 16:9.
I'm not sure why you're getting bars on the sides. Is your HD feed through the HDMI/DVI input or is it through a component input?

Originally posted by jagz
ESPN-HD should be 16:9.
I'm not sure why you're getting bars on the sides. Is your HD feed through the HDMI/DVI input or is it through a component input?

He's probably talking about the "HD" bars that ESPN is using....... but I could be wrong.

Originally posted by Ramsrule
He's probably talking about the "HD" bars that ESPN is using....... but I could be wrong.

Yea those are the bars I was talking about, but after watching it later on I realize that SportsCenter is indeed in full 16x9 so that's a relief, however, if every NBA and NFL game is going to have those "ESPY"Bars :) I'm gonna write somebody. Will you newly found brethren write with me?!?!?! CALL TO ARMS!!!! LOL

I'm now REALLY pleased with the set. I think, just to keep things interesting, I'll switch back and forth from Pro to Movie from time to time.

About the xbox, well I'll say this. PROGRAMMERS PEOPLE HAVE HDTV SETS NOW, GET WITH IT!!
ESPN NBA,NFL 2K5 both look fantastic as far as, what I'm assuming they are, static non "on the fly" rendered graphics look amazing. HOWEVER, realtime graphics from a distance start to lose it. They're a bit jagged and don't even match with what's going on around them.

The test is another thing that boggles me. In ESPN NBA 2K5 all the text looks great and smooth and just amazing, HOWEVER when the freethrow instructions come on the screen they look HORRIBLE. I know this is all the game and not the set, but just in case I posted it here, you guys might know something I don't.

In regards to ESPN-HD..... they dont do all of their programming in HD..... there's a page on thier website that will give you their HD schedule. I dont have the link handy.

Primetime football(both college and NFL) will be in HD....... and the NBA will be in HD after the first of the year from what I remember.

good, I was beginning to start the onslaught and protest. :)

anyone that plays their ps2 on their 510, do you notice severe underscan? every game i play won't fill the screen. while some games allow you to mess with the screen position to remedy it a little, some games (like madden) don't.

its annoying to play with that inch thick vertical black bar on the left of the screen.

this only happens with my ps2. everything else like xbox, dvd player, cable is fine.

Yes.

It depends on the game though. I can make GTA:San Andreas in widescreen mode fit the screen very nicely (with the adjustment that you noted was sorely lacking from many games...)

I notice on my Xbox with the ESPN titles the startup it does that but it seems to fill up once the game gets to the main menu. I'm looking forward to seeing the Giants tomorrow but I have a funny feeling with my luck the HD truck will blow up leaving us to watch the game in SD. I'm really enjoying the set though. Had to rearrange my whole living room for it though. In another thread I had a layout of my apartment and that's where I originally put the set. But wifey and I decided that it was almost the same as sitting in the first 4 rows of a movie theatre LOL. So we moved things around. Almost seems like we have more space now.

My friend came over and I suspect he'll have a HD set by the middle of next week. His wife went down south for the week today so he should be ordering his tomorrow if I know him. His jaw dropped when he seen it. But he likes to have the screen in torch mode. I'm trying to educate him in the experience of having it turned down.

Tomorrow a bunch of the fellas are coming over so we'll be watching the games. I have to do some adjustments so I can have it right when they come.

I LOVE split screen!!!! Can't see how I lived without it all this time. Wright v Mosely on the main screen with FLA v FSU in the small screen. Who can ask for anything more.

Tonytapes, I do have a black bar on the left side of the screen while playing PS2 games. But I believe this only appears on 480i content. I haven't noticed this underscan with progressive content.

I'm having some strange intermitten problems with my 50" GWIII.

1. While watching none HD channel for a while my TV would loose the picture (sound is still working) and show just static noise (like the screen when you have no reception). Only way I been able to recover from this is to change to HD channel and come back to my orginal channel. Changing to other none HD channel does not fix it.

2. When I turn on my TV sometimes I noticed that there are two pictures of the channel (like Twin View but it's not aligned nicely side by side. It's litte bit offset and overlays each other some). If I switch to different channel and come back it's gone and normal again.

3. I have comcast HD 6208 tuner and it's been locking up intermittenly when I turn on my TV. TV picture would freeze with no sound coming out and only way to fix it is to unplug the Comcast tuner from the outlet and plug it in again.

Anyone else see or hear about these issues?

I have the same cable box. I experienced the problem(s) you are describing with my ws510 57 inch as well. What i found to be the problem was that i had gone in the Cable bxoes configuration and changed the progressive to interlaced or something of that nature, when i switched it back to default it fixed my problems and i havent experienced the issue since.

Im at work right now so i dont remember the exact specifics, but im almost 100% sure thats what your problem would be.

Originally posted by tonytapes
anyone that plays their ps2 on their 510, do you notice severe underscan?

I hate that!!

Ok, I have the 57WS510, I fixed the overscan issue, but now I need to set the convergence using the service menu. How do I do it? Thank you!

There are several posts in this thread on doing service menu convergence.

I tried looking for one that actually tells you how, and I can't find it. I even did the little search thingy. I've seen posts on what to do once you're already in the grid section of the convergence menu, but not ones on how to get into it.

You know how to get to service menu, then it should be easy for you to follow this instruction (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4097439#post4097439) posted in this thread. Are you saying this step-by-step instruction is not clear enough?

The set of instructions C.Y. linked are the ones I used. Make sure you're reading the 'hidden' text.

OK, those instructions helped a ton. However, I am still looking for the post on how to get rid of the football effect. Also, on the right side of the image, I have major convergence errors, but I can't get over far enough to correct them. Any ideas? Thanks!

Thos instructions should help with the football effect, specifially the following:


--------------------------------------------------------------------------
for ws510 series

OPERATION METHOD FOR COARSE ADJUSTMENT (first do it in NTSC Full mode)

1. Enter the service mode and select PJE category.

2. Press the 1 or 4 button on the remote commander to select the
item, and then use the joystick to change the data

3. Press button 6 to display the internal test signal (crosshatch)

4. Select GRN CENT (or any item you want to adjust). When BLU or RED is displayed, press the 3
button on the remote commander to change the adjustment color
in the order of GRN BLU RED.

5. In GRN, BLU, or RED mode, move the joystick up or down to change
the data in vertical direction, or left or right to change the data in a
horizontal direction.

6. Before returning to the service mode, press the MUTING +
ENTER buttons on the remote commander to write the data.
(You must complete step 6 to write the data. If you omit step 6 the
set data is returned to the data prior to the adjustment. Like fine adjustment, data can be copied from NTSC Full mode to other modes. And re-register FLASH FOCUS is required for it to work properly (not overwrite your changes).

Items available in PJE category for coarse adjustment
CENT
SKEW
SIZE
LIN
MSIZ (horizontally only)
MLIN (horizontally only)
PIN
KEY (vertically only)

For each item (and each color), there are two numbers shown on the screen, one for horizontal data and one for vertical data. Write down those numbers before making any changes, in case you want to change them back.

Ok, the things you need to adjust the football effect are pin, and key. Also you may have to work with the bow settings.

Pin is what's pushing the corners towards the center of the screem. Bow affects the over all bend of the screen, and key is a wave type adjustment.

If I get a chance tonight, I'll try and post what variables I changed, as I have them written down, and have been meaning to put them in my other diary post.

When you say Bow, what do you mean? Also, is any of this going to help with the convergence errors on the edge of the screen? The Pin fixed the football effect so I am happy about that, but now all that's left is the convergence. Also, I was reading about the color push thing, I adjusted the red, but I couldn't find the selections for the green and blue. The thing that I am refering to is this:

AXIS: 0 - 1 (reduced 'red push'). Had to make it in all modes
R-GR: 8 - 14 (evened out the reds a little)
G-YR: 6 - 8 (evened out the greens a little)

It's been a few months since I last asked and I hope I get a better response that the usual snotty "That's been answered already! Read all 23 pages of this thread!!! I refuse to answer!!!" that seems to be set up as one guy's macro.

I have a 51"-WS550, not a 510 and the service mode set-up NOT the same or even close enough to risk fumbling around. I was sent the 510 manual and it's categories are totally different.

I'd like an answer - not a sneer - about fixing the overscan and footballing on a 550, NOT a 510, please.

Thank you.

Didn't I post this coarse adjustment instruction (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4099127#post4099127) for you a long time ago? Buji and ClaytonMG both have ws550, if they can use this same instruction to fix the football effect, why can't you? Did you at least try the instructions? I really don't know what else you want people to help you. I spent quite some time to write those two instructions and this is the thank I got?
And what's wrong to suggest new owners to read all posts in this thread? Is 400 posts too much? Ws510 owners will know all the known tweaks by doing that. And ws550 owners can at least learn how to do SM convergence.

Actually I have a ws510, but the instructions were a major help and I am deffinately grateful for them. But do you know how to fix the convergence errors on the side of the screen?

I thought you have a ws550, I think Buji posted R-GR and G-YR adjustment because his ws550 supports color decoder adjustment for all three colors. Several ws510 owners (including me) had asked around to see if ws510 supports that too. Anyhow, based on our experience on ws510, once red is reduced and color and hue are adjusted, green and blue are pretty much dead on. You can do a search on this thread to verify it.
You will have to play around and try each item in the coarse adjustment to get the feel about each item and decide which one can do the job for you.
I don't know what you mean by "the convergence errors on the side of the screen".

Well on the far right of the screen, there's major convergence errors. If you go to THX's site and look under their optimizer section, they have a picture of exactly what's happening to me. Plus, do you mean when I adjust the color and hue in the basic menu? Not the service one? Thanks a ton again!

Yes, color and hue in user menu, but you can do it in service menu too.
I guess try to do coarse adjustment to bring it closer, then do fine adjustment the best you can.

I have a few quick questions concerning connecting my Denon DVD-1910 to my 57WS550 RPTV.

The 1910 says it uses a DVI-D connection and the TV says it uses a DVI-HDTV connection. My questions are:

1. Can I just buy a DVI-D to DVI-D cable, or do I need something different?

2. Is there really a difference between buying a $30 and a $100 DVI cable?

3. I have read some people say that the difference between a Component and DVI connection are negligeable, yet others say there is a big difference... any definitive answer, or is it all "in the eye of the beholder"?

Thank you all in advance for any advice given.

Bogey,
In theory, the DVI will provide better picture quality because there is no signal processing occurring that may degrade picture quality. Whether or not you notice the difference between component and DVI is another story. However, I think most people will agree that the visible differences become greater the bigger the screen size is. With a 57" TV, I'd probably go with the DVI input unless you need it for an HD source.

I think DVI-D and DVI-HDTV are referring to the same thing: a DVI input/output.

As to cheap cables vs. expensive cables, that is always a topic of hot debate on these forums and you can find plenty of arguments to support either side. You're just going to have to go with what you're comfortable with in this regard.

Originally posted by jagz
Bogey,
In theory, the DVI will provide better picture quality because there is no signal processing occurring that may degrade picture quality. Whether or not you notice the difference between component and DVI is another story. However, I think most people will agree that the visible differences become greater the bigger the screen size is. With a 57" TV, I'd probably go with the DVI input unless you need it for an HD source.

I think DVI-D and DVI-HDTV are referring to the same thing: a DVI input/output.

As to cheap cables vs. expensive cables, that is always a topic of hot debate on these forums and you can find plenty of arguments to support either side. You're just going to have to go with what you're comfortable with in this regard.

I have no other use for the DVI input on the TV, so I'll probably use it for the DVD player.

I figured the cheap vs expensive issue would remain unresolved. :) I'm looking at a Monster Cable DVI400-2M for about $73 shipped. Now how do I tell the wife that the cable for the $250 DVD player costs about 1/3 as much? ;)

**DISCLAIMER: the following is just my opinion**

I'm ambivalent when it comes to cables, but I have decided no more Monster Cables for me. I've had too many bad experiences with their products and for the price, I honestly don't think it's worth it.

In my opinion, just get an inexpensive DVI cable from ebay.

In my opinion, just get an inexpensive DVI cable from ebay.
I second that opinion.

Hey fellas, well after about a month break-in period I decided to call Circuit City and have them bring a Sony guy out here (at least I hope he's from Sony) to come and "Do over" my set. There's some bowing in the upright hand corner and I think the blues could be toned down a bit as they overlap the white in the convergence screen.

He should be here between a half hour from now to 2 1/2 hours from now ( we know how that "time range" thing goes )

I'll let you guys know what happens at that time.

Originally posted by totalownership
Hey fellas, well after about a month break-in period I decided to call Circuit City and have them bring a Sony guy out here (at least I hope he's from Sony) to come and "Do over" my set. There's some bowing in the upright hand corner and I think the blues could be toned down a bit as they overlap the white in the convergence screen.

He should be here between a half hour from now to 2 1/2 hours from now ( we know how that "time range" thing goes )

I'll let you guys know what happens at that time.

I'm really curious to find out what level of service you get with that. I know I mentioned "ISF Certification" to one of the sony certified techs who recently took a look at my set, and I got a blank stare.

I really hate talking bad about someone so I'll leave it like that. You ever heard the quote "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing" ?
I'm gonna have to go back in behind him and do it myself. I'm a little strapped now to be getting ISF in the picture. What I'm gonna do is have Circuit City at least bring a Sony certified guy out next time. And let him know that this is gonna probably be an all day thing. 2 hours ain't gonna get it.

I also think that the mylar screen overlay (at least I think it's mylar) I've heard people speak about might just be a piece of gold in surprise.

Originally posted by Bogey62
I have a few quick questions concerning connecting my Denon DVD-1910 to my 57WS550 RPTV.

The 1910 says it uses a DVI-D connection and the TV says it uses a DVI-HDTV connection. My questions are:

1. Can I just buy a DVI-D to DVI-D cable, or do I need something different?

2. Is there really a difference between buying a $30 and a $100 DVI cable?

3. I have read some people say that the difference between a Component and DVI connection are negligeable, yet others say there is a big difference... any definitive answer, or is it all "in the eye of the beholder"?

Thank you all in advance for any advice given.

Do you have any thoughts about the Denon 1910 with the WS550? I was thinking about this player for my 65WS550. I would like to hear any opinons good or bad.

mightyhonda

Originally posted by mightyhonda
Do you have any thoughts about the Denon 1910 with the WS550? I was thinking about this player for my 65WS550. I would like to hear any opinons good or bad.

mightyhonda

I'm pretty sure I'm getting the 1910 for Christmas, so I'll post my opinions after the 25th. ;)

BTW, if Santa does bring the 1910, I'm going to hook it up via DVI.

What's the difference in tweaking the WT vs the WS? Are there any guides out there for the kpxxWT510?

I just got a Sony 51ws520 last week and am having it ISF calibrated in the near future... I want to turn off the SVM though as I heard it really helps... I tried accessing the service menu via "DISPLAY, 5, VOL+, POWER" but it does not seem to work... How do I get into the service menu on the 520 and turn off the SVM? I will see a better picture with this off, right?

Is there a way to reset all service manual settings to the mfgr. default? I've been a bad boy, now I need a little assistance.

Thanks,

There is on the WS550, but I'm having a difficult time recalling it exactly. I think there's a reset button on the remote that you hold down while you power the set off with the button on the set.

EDIT: that seems to have been it, I have it in an earlier post when my component inputs went out.

Just curious: what are you trying to recover from?

I was changing the HSIZ and VSIZ. Then after cutting the tv off and then back on, the picture has started to shimmer in a vertical direction. It's very noticable when looking at the info screen for D*. I'm afraid that I may have changed another setting by accident. Another problem I'm having is that HD looks horrible anywhere on the screen other than middle. Right now I'm feeling like I scr#$% myself pretty good. And while someone is paying attention, can I go back, say, to input 5 or 6 and copy those settings to input 7? This was my DVI input that I messesd up.

Thanks,

PS
What button on the remote acts as the reset button.

I'm pretty sure on my remote, it's labeled 'RESET'. I'm at work though, and don't have the remote with me.

I had my 510 calibrated and he was able to use a color decoder to adjust all 3. Took him about 8 hours and the TV looks better than I thought it ever could.

Originally posted by skipfreely
I had my 510 calibrated and he was able to use a color decoder to adjust all 3. Took him about 8 hours and the TV looks better than I thought it ever could.

Tell me, did you like the picture to begin with? Did you just do the ISF calibration on a whim or was there something about the set you didn't like? I'm very curious about this.
I really REALLY enjoy my picture but if I not realizing the full potential then I want to get it all. But I DON'T want to get into a "diminishing returns" type of thing.

If anyone else has had it done please speak on your experiences. My set is a KP51WS520 so those who have had it done on that model I REALLY want to hear your take on it. However i would like to hear everyone's take on it.

Originally posted by Bogey62
I'm pretty sure I'm getting the 1910 for Christmas, so I'll post my opinions after the 25th. ;)

BTW, if Santa does bring the 1910, I'm going to hook it up via DVI.

OK, Santa did bring the DVD-1910, but I am having a major problem with the hookup via DVI on my WS550. :(

I am using a Monster Cable DVI-400 single link cable to hook the 1910 to the WS550. The picture in all modes (480, 720, 1080) look like total crap! It's as if you're looking at a GIF on the computer and the picture is only made up of about 256 colors. I switched to the S-Video output and the picture looks fine, well as good as S-Video gets.

I called Denon, but they have the day off... I called Crutchfield (where Santa purchased the 1910) and the tech guy there said it could either be the cable or the DVI output on the 1910. He offered to swap out the 1910 for me, but I said I'd get back to him if I decided to go that route.

Any help A.S.A.P. from any of you out there would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

It's unclear from the specifications for the KDP65WS550 whether its tuner can receive unscrambled digital cable; i.e. it has an internal QAM tuner.

Can someone let me know if they are using a WS550 to receive clear digital cable without a cable box?

Thanks.

Originally posted by totalownership
Tell me, did you like the picture to begin with? Did you just do the ISF calibration on a whim or was there something about the set you didn't like? I'm very curious about this.
I really REALLY enjoy my picture but if I not realizing the full potential then I want to get it all. But I DON'T want to get into a "diminishing returns" type of thing.

If anyone else has had it done please speak on your experiences. My set is a KP51WS520 so those who have had it done on that model I REALLY want to hear your take on it. However i would like to hear everyone's take on it.

I had issues with the CRTs like a lot of the 500 models (mine is 510). After they were replaced I wasn't happy with the picture and Sony sent out someone else to adjust. Well I knew the picture could be better and decided to drop the cash and get it calibrated.

I though the picture looked good with the original CRTs before I had any issues. It looks a ton better now. I wish I had before and after to show you just the difference in reds. My blacks are dead on now. My set also seemed to be darker using the DVI input. That was fixed, now everything looks spectacular.

Bill,
Try swapping out the DVI cable first before you get into the hassle of exchanging your player. If that doesn't solve it, exchange the player and see if that makes a difference. If not, then *gulp* you may have a bum TV (or at least a bum DVI input).

On another subject, I just calibrated my picture using DVE and it seems that my KP57WS510 has some green push. Anyone else experience this and if so, is there a way to adjust it short of a professional calibration?

Originally posted by skipfreely
I had issues with the CRTs like a lot of the 500 models (mine is 510). After they were replaced I wasn't happy with the picture and Sony sent out someone else to adjust. Well I knew the picture could be better and decided to drop the cash and get it calibrated.

I though the picture looked good with the original CRTs before I had any issues. It looks a ton better now. I wish I had before and after to show you just the difference in reds. My blacks are dead on now. My set also seemed to be darker using the DVI input. That was fixed, now everything looks spectacular.

So you feel that it's really THAT much better? Is it like "I wasn't viewing anything before I just thought I was" kind of feeling?

PS: How long did it take for the guy to do his thing? I guess it's about time now for me to get the real thing done. I've had my set for about 2 months now so I guess it's nice and broken in. One question I have is I noticed that some people are saying that even with ISF calibration you can suffer burn in. I do play alot of videogames on my set so I hope that doesn't kill me. But for the most part there isn't too many static images. Even the static image of the score switch sides when possesion changes so that isn't in the same place during the entire game.

I have "eyed" some changes but it just seems way too dark. I put contrast at about 25 percent and brightness at about 35-40 percent and it just seems to dark. I use the 'Pro" setting. I had a question about that also. Are those Pro, Movie etc. etc. just different settings of the same level of contrast brightness etc...

In other words. If I select Pro mode and turn up brightness etc.. will it then become vivid or are those controls relative within the different modes?

In other words. If I select Pro mode and turn up brightness etc.. will it then become vivid or are those controls relative within the different modes?
There are some inherent differences between the different pic modes that cannot be changed by the user (unless in the service menu). i.e. even if all settings are the same between the pic modes, they will still give you vastly different pictures.

If you're still on the fence about ISF calibration, try calibrating with avia or DVE first.

Chris

Originally posted by jagz
Bill,
Try swapping out the DVI cable first before you get into the hassle of exchanging your player. If that doesn't solve it, exchange the player and see if that makes a difference. If not, then *gulp* you may have a bum TV (or at least a bum DVI input).

Since my original post I took the 1910 to Circuit City and hooked it up via my DVI cable to a DLP set -- the picture looked just as horried there.

Crutchfield offered to swap out the 1910 for another one at no cost to me, so I went for that first. Funny thing is, now they are out of stock on the 1920 so I have to wait until the 21st to get another one!

Originally posted by jagz
There are some inherent differences between the different pic modes that cannot be changed by the user (unless in the service menu). i.e. even if all settings are the same between the pic modes, they will still give you vastly different pictures.

If you're still on the fence about ISF calibration, try calibrating with avia or DVE first.

Chris

Thanks, So a 50% contrast setting in Pro mode isn't the same wear and tear on the CRT like a 50% contrast setting on Vivid mode?

Thanks, So a 50% contrast setting in Pro mode isn't the same wear and tear on the CRT like a 50% contrast setting on Vivid mode?
I'm not sure about the answer to that because CRT wear and tear depends on more than just contrast setting.

I think (someone please correct me if I'm wrong) that burning out phosphors is more dependent on the "Picture" setting. The "Contrast" setting determines the black level of the TV whereas the "Picture" setting determines the white level. For example, if you have the picture setting turned way up, you will start to see "blooming artifacts" where bright parts of your picture start to become ill-defined and edges look blurred... they "bloom" past their intended borders. Whites may change colors if the picture setting is up too high which is an indication that you may be burning out phosphors.

ok. now I gotta go back to the lab. I guess I'll have to pick up that Avia Disc and do some experimenting. Which setting do you guys use most? Pro, Movie, Standard? (Notice I don't say vivid cause I know in here that's a dirty word :) )

If you haven't already, check out these tweaks. (http://mvgrafx.dyn.ca/~vmark/KPxxWS500.html)
The basic service menu adjustments will greatly improve your picture and improve things like red push and shutting down SVM in the different modes. These tweaks along with the glare screen removal (instructions posted elsewhere in this thread) made my KP57WS510 a whole different TV. I find I only have to use Pro mode after the adjustments made above. Note that unless changed in the service menu, Pro mode is the only setting (I think... not sure about Movie mode) with SVM turned off, which is desirable for an accurate picture.

Picking up Avia or DVE is a good idea too. I picked DVE because it was cheaper.

On another note, I have some green push going on... does anyone know what service menu adjustments I need to make?

Thanks for the link. Some of those tweaks make me a little uncomfortable. Funny, I can gut a million dollar Sun Server without a second thought but the thought of tinkering in my $1500 Sony makes me a tad bit nervous. I'll probably go ahead with it anyway. I just hate to her wifey "You screwed up our brand new TV". I'd probably wouldn't get dinner, washed clothes and "sumthin sumthin" for a year.

Jagz, I read the tweaks page you linked and need a clarificication if you can. Before I tap into the menu to adjust the centering etc. could you please explain in more detail what the default value numbers are? I suspect it becomes obvious once I start. I am new to this.

Thanks

Hey guys,

I've had a WS510 for about a year. Works great but lately i'm seeing a "blue haze" that I notice more than anyting on white backgrounds. Some people tell me i'm crazy and cant see it but this litteraly developed over night and I can tell its there. The best example I can give is football games. No matter what I change the color settings to the white lines (or anthing white really) has a blue haze to it. Its actually everywhere on the screen but way more obvious on white backgrounds. When i change the video settings to warm it gets a LITTLE better but I can still tell its there.

Can someone tell me how to reset this tv COMPLETELY? I"ve tried the reset button on the control but it doesnt seem to truely reset the tv because the color changes I make are still there. Let me know if you have any ideas.

Scoonie,

I don't know exactly what the default numbers represent, but it's always a good idea to write them down so that if you make a change and don't like the results, you can always defer back to the system menu default value.

Originally posted by fjrod
Hey guys,

I've had a WS510 for about a year. Works great but lately i'm seeing a "blue haze" that I notice more than anyting on white backgrounds. Some people tell me i'm crazy and cant see it but this litteraly developed over night and I can tell its there. The best example I can give is football games. No matter what I change the color settings to the white lines (or anthing white really) has a blue haze to it. Its actually everywhere on the screen but way more obvious on white backgrounds. When i change the video settings to warm it gets a LITTLE better but I can still tell its there.

Can someone tell me how to reset this tv COMPLETELY? I"ve tried the reset button on the control but it doesnt seem to truely reset the tv because the color changes I make are still there. Let me know if you have any ideas.

I may be completely barking up the wrong tree, but have you tried the convergence?

I too need too reset the TV completely. Some of the adjustments I made screwed up the edges. I wrote down the numbers at first, but then when i realized i'd have to write down like 192 different numbers, I kinda lost track and quit keeping track.

I noticed that the blue box in the user convergence screen is quite fuzzy (red looks fine) on my new 46WT520. I checked another unit at a different store, and it was also fuzzy. I had a service tech come in to focus blue, and he said the blue is SUPPOSED to be out of focus!

Is this true? Should I try to focus the blue myself? If blue is supposed to be out of focus, then how much and how do you measure?

Thanks,
Clark

yea, join the blue club. I have the blue "haze" also. It doesn't seem to affect the picture but who knows what I'm missing if this is corrected. You can really only see it when you go into the convergence menu around the crosses.

ClarkPark: I've heard this before, and I believe it has to do with how most people's eyes percieve color. I guess, blue is hardest for eyes to see, so it's 'defocused' so that it seems brighter? I think the end result is that every fine white line on the screen has a blue halo.

There are extensive steps listed on a site linked previously in this thread to reign in the blue focus, and I would imagine that you would have to dial down green and red values a little if the blue was correctly focused.

I believe this is one of the main things that an ISF calibrator does to make a set look sharper: focus the blue up and adjust the red/green values to re-balance the colors.

I haven't tried it yet cause I'm a chicken and I don't want to open my set up.

P.S. Found the link (http://mvgrafx.dyn.ca/~vmark/KPxxWS500.html)

P.P.S I do believe some members here have followed the physical focusing described at that link, but I can't remember whom. Perhaps they could chime up and offer encouragment enough for me to try it.

I also have the 46WT520 and the blue is soft, as it is on all crt's compared to red and green. It does make it a bitch to set convergence. Do your best to get it as sharp as you can. I have actually found that if you get real close to the screen on a 46WT520 and focus, it's a bit easier with the blue, because you can see the blue shift around the fresnel lines on the screen. A simple test to check convergence is to watch the end credits on a reference quality movie (Superbits are great< I think LOTR white on black also) or whatever that has white letters that scroll up on a black background. You can check convergence quite easily as a credit scrolls up the screen. You'll see if it's off.

Any interest in starting a 46WT520 thread? With so many changes in the SM compared to the 500/510 models and that it appears Sony has implemented some of the tweaks discussed over the years a 46WT520 thread might be nice. Comments?

Ok I know this is totally off topic but the link Buji posted for the Sony tweaks also has some pics of the guys gear.

http://mvgrafx.dyn.ca/~vmark/gallery/gear/dscf0112

But the thing of interest is the object he has on top of his set. That long glass cylinder. Funny thing about it is my woman's job FedEx one of those to her for a Christmas gift this year. I don't know about his but the one she has is a Galilieo (sp) Thermometer. (I know they have barometers also) Besides the one we have, this is the first I've seen it.

Just a note.

tweaks to my 46wt520:

I followed the KP-xxWS500 tweaks document:
-removed the front grill and adjusted electostatic focus (I had to break the paint seal over the screws), this helped a little
-removed back cover and adjusted optical focus by looking at the back of the screen, this helped a lot, I could not get all the fuzz out of blue, but got it a lot better
-readjusted eletrostatic focus, overall effect was definitely noticeably sharper image in HD
(I do not recommend the above to others because:
1. adjusting electrostatic focus probably voids warranty
2. adjusting optical and electrostatic focus exposes you to lethal voltages)

I also made the suggested service menu adjustments, but I could not make them stick after exiting service mode. After changing a parameter, I hit 'muting' and then 'enter'. Hit power to exit SM. Power back up and changes are erased! Anyone know how to save the SM changes on a 520?

BTW, in the service menu on 520,
-use RON, GON, BON in MCP to turn guns off
-2150P-4 has been changed to COLR
-2150P-3 has been changed to CLTY
-VSIZ and VPOS are in DEF1
-HSIZ and HPOS are in DEF2
(of course this is no help if you cant make them stick!)

Thanks,
Clark

Originally posted by Buji
There are extensive steps listed on a site linked previously in this thread to reign in the blue focus, and I would imagine that you would have to dial down green and red values a little if the blue was correctly focused.
P.S. Found the link (http://mvgrafx.dyn.ca/~vmark/KPxxWS500.html) Here's the current path to that document: http://mvgrafx.dyn.ca/~vmark/documents/KPxxWS500.html

There are extensive steps listed on a site linked previously in this thread to reign in the blue focus, and I would imagine that you would have to dial down green and red values a little if the blue was correctly focused.
I have corrected my blue and red levels using DVE, but I can't get the green levels correct at all within the user menu. Is there any way I can tackle this from the service menu (given that I have performed all the tweaks in the link provided)?

Did you try adjusting the G-YR value in the COLR portion of the service menu?

I have a WS510 so it doesn't have a COLR category and I couldn't find a G-YR value. Does anyone know the corresponding category and value in the WS510/WS550 series RPTVs?

Originally posted by clarkpark
tweaks to my 46wt520:

I followed the KP-xxWS500 tweaks document....
-Thanks,
Clark

Clark: Thanks for your post. I also have a 46/520. I've started a 520 thread at the beginning of the RPTV forum. Could you post any updates to your post there, it'll be more useful to other 520 owners, as many SM settings are different in the 500/510 series. Thanks much.

Every one of the links to tweaks that I tried in this thread are dead. Is there any other way to get these tweaks?:confused:

http://mvgrafx.dyn.ca/~vmark/documents/KPxxWS500.html

is working for me...

can someone do me a favor and measure the distance from the floor to the bottom of the screen on the 51" model?

double post

Originally posted by waitinthefire
can someone do me a favor and measure the distance from the floor to the bottom of the screen?

Since nobody replied yet... The measurement for the 57WS550 is approximately 24". I know this isn't what you want, but at least it will give you a ballpark idea.

And for the 57WS655 it's 24 7/8", from viewing screen bottom to floor.

Originally posted by BigFoot48
And for the 57WS655 it's 24 7/8".

I measured from the floor to the bottom edge of the viewable screen area (not the bezel that goes around the screen. Just thought I'd throw that in.

I've got a 51" WS550 and I'll measure it when I get home and post it in the AM, unless someone beats me to it. :)

UPDATE: D'oh!!! I got distracted and totally forgot to measure it. Sorry.

thanks. so i'm almost ready to order the WS520 from onecall ($1454.10), but want to know if it does in fact upconvert 720p to 1080i. also, if i'm using the HDMI input, does it overtake one of the component inputs? i've heard of some sets doing this.

Originally posted by waitinthefire
thanks. so i'm almost ready to order the WS520 from onecall ($1454.10), but want to know if it does in fact upconvert 720p to 1080i. also, if i'm using the HDMI input, does it overtake one of the component inputs? i've heard of some sets doing this.

Ok I can't say for 100 percent because I'm not using the video7 input but I will say for 99.999999999999% certainty that it doesn't share with anything else. I answered this somewhere else but here goes again (fingers hurting, lol)
Video1-4 are individual composite inputs, video 5 and 6 are component video inputs and video 7 is HDMI input. On that back they are labelled as such and when I go through the different input selections they are distinct and different.

good news. i just got my bestbuy preferred customer coupons for 10% off TV's. With the 520 at $1550 on sale this week, and the 10% off it takes it to $1395. Add to that the 6.75% sales tax, and the total comes to ~$1490, only 50 bucks more than onecall. i think i may go that route to avoid return anxiety of buying it online. Do they (BB) allow customers to pick the TV up same day, or must i wait til they deliver it?

Does anyone know is there is a color decoder correction in the SM of the WS655?? Also, Is fine convergence done the same as the WS510 models. I.E. PJE FDIS screen. Re-Register FF in "full" while in the SM? I ask because I am replacing my HW40 with a WS655 and I know the ins and outs of the HW40 and am hoping they are basically the same.

Gov

Originally posted by waitinthefire
Do they (BB) allow customers to pick the TV up same day, or must i wait til they deliver it?


Depends if its in stock or not.

So is there a definitive answer in regards to the up converting or down converting of 720p?

I just purchased this set but won't be picking it up until later this week. I will return it if it doesn't up convert and go with the Hitachi but I would like to know before I bring home.

I had researched prior to this but hadn't read contradictory info in regards to up converting until after I purchased it.


I was also curious about the extended coverage offered by Best Buy. Is it worth it for the $249 or can I extend with Sony directly?

from what I've read, the 510 series down converts 720p to 540p while the 520 is supposed to upconvert it.

I own a 57" 510, and get around this issue by using my HTL-HD STB to upconvert everything to 1080i at the box.

If you're considering a Hitachi, then you should have went that direction in my opinion. A much superior brand, but IMO the extra coin wasnt worth the added benifits. If it is to you, then by all means go with it. YMMV

When I change inputs I have to toggle through the various video selections I have: video 5 for DVD, video 6 for X-Box, and video 7 (HDMI) for DTV. Is there a way to drop the input for the VHF?
I changed the input label to Video 1 so that instead of looking at snow I get a black screen, but the channel skip function won't allow that input to be skipped...
Also, it is normal for this model to emit a high pitch ring when on? I traded in a Toshisba (because of a color malfunction) for this Sony. The very first time I turned it on I noticed this noise that I don't remember getting from the Tosh. Its difficult to say how loud it is, I don't have a sound meter, but late last night I had the volume down low and I could hear it clearly. It seems to come from the back of the unit. What causes this?

I've had my 520 since January and I haven't heard the noise you describe. I'm usually quite sensitive to CRT noise, so I've been absolutely thrilled to have a hard time telling if the set is on when the source is black :) -- I hope you can exchange for another unit...

I've been wondering it is possible to adjust the picture differently for each resolution. Whenever I watch something in 1080i, everyone looks way too stretched out vertically. I've tried to adjust things like VSIZ, but the problem is when I get it to the point where 1080i looks normal, the picture no longer fills out the entire screen when it displays 480i or 480p. Is there anyway to adjust the horizontal display values just for 1080i without it affecting the other resolutions?

I attempted to reach the tweak site, and it was down. Any other sources?

Wanted to reiterate Frank123's question and bump the thread. Is there any way to skip video inputs when toggling through? I only use Video 5, 7 and VHF. I hate fliping through video 1-4 to go from TV to DVD. Is there a SM adjustment to disable the ports? Seems like Sony should have made this automatic (or at least a user option).
-Rob

Wanted to reiterate Frank123's question and bump the thread. Is there any way to skip video inputs when toggling through? I only use Video 5, 7 and VHF. I hate fliping through video 1-4 to go from TV to DVD. Is there a SM adjustment to disable the ports? Seems like Sony should have made this automatic (or at least a user option).
-Rob

YES! Go into the menu system, and the setup tab I think is where all the various inputs are listed. It's where you can change the name of them..... well someone at Sony decided to get smart and hide the "Skip" functionality here..... so choose the imput you want to skip, and scroll through the list of default names until you come across "Skip". Select it.

You're now officially skipping that input.

If I remember correctly, the only input that cant be skipped is the VHF.

I did this all from memory, so I hope I didnt screw it up. Let me know if it works or not and if it doesnt, I'll check it when I get home from work this evening.

Thanks Ramsrule. I'll give it a shot tonight.
-Rob

That sounds about right, Ramsrule. I have mine set that way as well. I use diescrete codes to directly select which input I want though.

Has anyone had a PC work connected to the WS510. I read the thread but couldn't find one that worked. If you have can you please tell me how you hooked it up? I have an ATI 800xl video card and haven't had the greatest of luck at all. Thanks