Why ABC is only broadcasting in low power? Is this just during a test phase before turning on full power, or do they actually plan to just broadcast HD in low power full time?

Originally posted by dsmith901
Why ABC is only broadcasting in low power? Is this just during a test phase before turning on full power, or do they actually plan to just broadcast HD in low power full time?

The've been in low power the entire time they have been digital. I only hope they go full power soon.

A friend of mine on another big forum has alot of "back channel" communications. He told me that they should be @ full power soon. He wouldn't go into details of how soon "soon" is though :-(

I've been playing around with one of the USDTV boxes here in Bainbridge with mixed results. I can get WCTV, WFSU, WTWC, and WTLH here but none with great signal strengths. I'm going to take it back and concentrate on improving my antenna setup first, then invest in digital. I figure the receivers will be better, and there will be more to watch.

As for WTLH, you're not missing anything. It appears to be an off-air pickup, judging by some of the noise in the picture. I'm suprsed that they're not using the extra bandwidth on WTLF-24 to transmit the WTLH digital signal down there.

In listing the assignments for the Tallahassee market, don't forget that Georgia Public Broadcasting's WABW was assigned to channel 5. That signal will come from Metcalf, rather than the current Pelham tower. Albany should be able to pick up their WACS from Dawson on channel 8, so this would be a net increase in the network's coverage. I was suprised that they kept two low-band VHF channels (channel 5 for Pelham and channel 2 for the Augusta area), but given Georgia's budget problems, maybe the power savings is the reason. All but two of their stations will be on VHF after the transition.

I called Comcast today after visiting the ESPN website and looking at the schedule of all the games that are going to be carried on ESPN2 HD. Many of the major conference tournament games will be in HD on that channel with some on the ESPN HD channel too. I asked what plans they have for new HD channels including ESPN2HD, the cable channels that have been around for a while and the locals. I was told there are no plans and that 51% of this market is still analog. Also, only 3% of this market is using HD now.

I am sure their numbers only reflect their customers but it doesn't matter. Until Comcast perceives that a significant share of this market, which is small anyway, requires HD, they aren't going to do much of anything.

I guess I am going to go back to DireTV and suffer with DSL instead of cable internet.

Originally posted by kaneboats
I called Comcast today after visiting the ESPN website and looking at the schedule of all the games that are going to be carried on ESPN2 HD. Many of the major conference tournament games will be in HD on that channel with some on the ESPN HD channel too. I asked what plans they have for new HD channels including ESPN2HD, the cable channels that have been around for a while and the locals. I was told there are no plans and that 51% of this market is still analog. Also, only 3% of this market is using HD now.

I am sure their numbers only reflect their customers but it doesn't matter. Until Comcast perceives that a significant share of this market, which is small anyway, requires HD, they aren't going to do much of anything.

I guess I am going to go back to DireTV and suffer with DSL instead of cable internet.

I'm in the same boat as you. I will go to Direct soon and get DSL. I guess thats what I get for living in a small town. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by DavidML3
I'm in the same boat as you. I will go to Direct soon and get DSL. I guess thats what I get for living in a small town. :rolleyes:

Got a couple of questions for you guys considering DTV...

1. What do you think about Voom? They have that special where it's only a dollar for installation right now.

2. Have you guys seen the commercial from DirectTv that says they are launching a satellite that will alow 6000 different locals in high def? Does anyone know the rollout date for this and what markets are included?

Sorry for the Questions. It's just that living in Havana, I'm in a worse boat than you guys! LOL

Neil Griffin

Plz Check your PM

Originally posted by mahicks
Got a couple of questions for you guys considering DTV...

2. Have you guys seen the commercial from DirectTv that says they are launching a satellite that will alow 6000 different locals in high def? Does anyone know the rollout date for this and what markets are included?

The Directv commericial states 1500 channels. Spaceway 1 & 2 (KA Spots), Directv 8, 9, & 10 (some spotbeams KA & KU) will allow DTV to provide that many hd channels. There is a thread in the hardward forum about this. The first twelve markets to get hd lil from DTV are the top 12 television markets. There has been talk that if all goes well with the launch of Spaceway 1, that DTV will provide hd locals for the rest of the top 60 television markets by the end of 2005. By 2007 every market should have their hd locals b/c the launch of the sats are staggered. Tallahassee would most likely be a 2007 candidate.

Thanks AFH...

I was guessing on the amount of the channels. If it's gonna be 2007 I'll just hold on a bit longer, LOL..By then, I might not even be in Tallahassee !

What is irritating is to go into BB or CC and see all those 27-36" analog CRT TVs on sale. Why do they continue to sell those things? And then they complain that nobody wants to pay several hundred dollars extra for HD sets? The FCC should prohibit the sale of analog TV sets larger than 20 inches. Then maybe digital TV will have a chance, and we can all start getting the HDTV our tax dollars are paying for.

Does anyone have any information as to when Comcast will be doing a digital simulcast in Tallahassee?

Neon

Anyone with inside contacts know when Comcast will start carrying ABC in HD?

Put TNT in that mix too?

With the locals I understand why Comcast is limited from carrying their HD channels right now. I think they should be working harder and faster on it, but I at least understand. What I don't understand is why all Comcast HD subscribers don't have access to ESPN2 HD, TNT, etc. These are just cable channels, right?

I called comcast tonight to ask if they intended on offering additional HD channels. Their answer of course was no, but I did however(don't know if it was worth my time) request ESPN2 HD, and TNT HD.

Also, if I was to call the Office of Cable Regulations would they be able to look into why comcast is not pursuing HD more seriously.

Originally posted by 1998Nole
I called comcast tonight to ask if they intended on offering additional HD channels. Their answer of course was no, but I did however(don't know if it was worth my time) request ESPN2 HD, and TNT HD.

Also, if I was to call the Office of Cable Regulations would they be able to look into why comcast is not pursuing HD more seriously.

I think you should. If I had a contact email or # I would also. This is un-excuseable


Originally posted by kaneboats
With the locals I understand why Comcast is limited from carrying their HD channels right now. I think they should be working harder and faster on it, but I at least understand. What I don't understand is why all Comcast HD subscribers don't have access to ESPN2 HD, TNT, etc. These are just cable channels, right?

That is the same that I said. What is the reason behind not adding cable channels in HD?

We can take it to City Hall!!! Seriously, Tallahassee has an office for complaints against Comcast or other cable companies.

Cable TV complaints - 891-8292.

The city can't force them to carry anything of course, but Comcast does not like getting complaints (which winds up in their FCC files I would think), and it may be just the spur needed to get some action.

My brother had an idea of trying to run a candidate for a local or state office. His (or her) platform would include a bunch of vanilla stuff -- but the big plank would be demanding we get all the HDTV to which we are entitled. It would include forcing compliance with the existing requirements but also pushing for national broadcast access for anyone who cannot actually receive the HD feed of any of the networks. Of course the candidate would not win but the issue would at least get a bunch of press and all the candidates would have to take a position on it. So, who wants to run?

Can anyone provide an update on the status of ABC HD (or any other HD channels) on Comcast - please?

I don't think our Comcast really cares to be honest, that have rolled all the have to which is not much. And anything that is to become available on HD they will not make a priority. Tallahassee is very backwards on this as they are are on many other things just a price we pay for living here I guess. I mean how long has NBC been HD i know the issue there is Sinclair but a deal should have been reached by now.

No, the negotiations between Comcast and Sinclair are taking place at a national level. Even if the Tallahassee office would be willing to meet Sinclair's demands, the home offices would not allow such a contract due to the precedent it would set.

Neon

I just got off the phone with the chief engineer at WTLH.
Some progress is being made. Comcast was just in their offices last week to check things out regarding the feasibility of running some fiber optic cable out that way so they could acquire the signal and retransmit it over the Comcast system (the signal is too weak for them to pick up via antenna). He indicated that it is now up to Comcast whether they decide they want to do that or not (I have no idea how much that would cost).
If Comcast decides they want to move forward, he indicated it could be done pretty quickly.

I would suggest that people call the Tallahassee Comcast office and continually ask them if they will be carrying the FOX HD signal and see what sort of response they get.

I also called the ABC station manager for an update, but he is out of the office this week. I will try again next week. From an earlier conversation with him, he indicated they are also broadcasting HD at low power, so I suspect that whatever the outcome is between FOX and Comcast will also determine whether we see ABC HD on the comcast system.

As we all know, the status of NBC is directly linked to the negotiations (or lack thereof) between Comcast's national office and Sinclair. It is a waste of time even calling to the local NBC station.

Neon

I thought ABC was supposed to go to full power when they got HD up and running, which they should be by now, so a ground line should not be needed. The big problem is, of course, that Congress and the FCC will not hold to their original schedule to turn off analog transmitters next year. Hopefully the whole digital TV issue will reach a tipping point soon when enough taxpayers have digital TVs that they will get fed up with the crappy analog signals most of us are forced to endure and the politicos will get enough heat applied to do the right thing. Let us spray!

Originally posted by dsmith901
I thought ABC was supposed to go to full power when they got HD up and running, which they should be by now, so a ground line should not be needed.
From my e-mail correspondence from the station's engineer, I was under no assumption that power was going to be increased any time soon.

I think that is correct. When I talked to the ABC station manager, he made no mention of going to full power anytime soon.

Neon

Originally posted by NeonDeion
I think that is correct. When I talked to the ABC station manager, he made no mention of going to full power anytime soon.

Neon

What the &%@(X!+ is the point of broadcasting HD at low power? What are they going to do when the FCC shuts off their analog transmitter? Granted the date that happens appears to be receding further and further into the future. It is hard to believe the FCC allows stations to get away with low power broadcasting - full power should be a requirement for their license.

Hi everyone,

Anyone here receiving OTA here any channel besides CBS ?
Also, if so, Did you get weird echo sounds from time to time on CBS' shows past few days ?

Originally posted by AVPhan
Anyone here receiving OTA here any channel besides CBS ?
Also, if so, Did you get weird echo sounds from time to time on CBS' shows past few days ?
I guess you didn't want to read all the old posts since this has already been answered. :p I get ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS and UPN OTA with the use of an old fashioned VHF/UHF antenna and a rotator mounted on my chimney. I haven't tried UPN in quite a while since its not HD and I get UPN via D*. I have not tried to get Fox, but seriously doubt I can get it OTA. Since I get the East and West HD Fox feeds from D* I don't mind.

I have not experienced the echo. Is it on all programming?

Yes, I did and tried to see if anyone else. Thanks for the info.
I had not tried roof mount antenna yet, still on indoor double bow-tie. A couple installers intown had discouraged me from installing it so far.
Plus, I use Tivo for my programming, rotator will not help me unless I watch live.
Maybe it's time to mount and test my omni-directional antenna.

You're right about the Tivo. I've found no solution to using a rotator and Tivo.

If I get a HD Tivo, I may try buying a Winegard antenna and amp combo to see if I can pull in all the stations without a rotator.

Its a crying shame we have to go back to antena's on our roof tops in this day and age:mad:

Originally posted by sfoltz
I guess you didn't want to read all the old posts since this has already been answered. :p I get ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS and UPN OTA with the use of an old fashioned VHF/UHF antenna and a rotator mounted on my chimney. I haven't tried UPN in quite a while since its not HD and I get UPN via D*. I have not tried to get Fox, but seriously doubt I can get it OTA. Since I get the East and West HD Fox feeds from D* I don't mind.

I have not experienced the echo. Is it on all programming?

Are you picking up ABC in HD? If so, where do you live?

Yes, I pick up OTA ABC (WTXL) in HD. I live in the Northshire subdivision which is north of Welaunee Plantation off Roberts Road. Its approximately 2 miles off Centerville Rd.

Originally posted by sfoltz
Yes, I pick up OTA ABC (WTXL) in HD. I live in the Northshire subdivision which is north of Welaunee Plantation off Roberts Road. Its approximately 2 miles off Centerville Rd.

Thanks. I don't know how far it is from the ABC broadcast tower to you and Comcast, but it seems to me if you can pick up their signal so can Comcast, which presumably has a better antenna.

Hello, all. I am new to this site and appreciate the information in this thread.

I am in SummerBrooke on the north side of town. Per antennaweb Fox and NBC are 19 miles at 71 degrees, recommend red (NBC is, of course VHF), ABC 18.9 miles at 73 degrees and they recommend blue. I have some tall trees in between my house and the neighbors' in the direction of the broadcast antenna.

The question I have is, with the low wattage of Fox, etc., can I realistically pick these stations up? I can practically spit to CBS. For aesthetic reasons I would love an antenna in the attic, but I am aware that would cause additional problems. I have Comcast (at least for now) but if they don't do something soon I might go to the dish and get locals OTA.


Thanks.

rrmcdonald,

I did not have much success with an antenna in the attic. Given that we have both vhf and uhf HD stations and some of the towers are in almost opposite directions (PBS for eg.), I did not get much until I went with an outoor setup with a rotator. My house is tucked into the woods and I'm surrounded by very tall pines and hardwoods.

I'm not sure that Antenna Web is correct that WTLH (Fox) is at the same location as WTWC. In any event, I haven't gotten a "blip" on either of my HD receivers for Fox.

I have not tried some of the newer table top antennas, so I do not know how well they work. Faxman lives in Killearn Lakes area and he uses an indoor table top antenna so perhaps he can comment.

I'm getting WTXL-DT (Ch. 22) at a solid "93" on my Hughes receiver and I don't have my rotator specifically tuned to this station! I normally get a reading between 50 to 65. Could this mean the station has upped its power? Or is it just some atmospherical phenom.? I guess time will tell.

No new from Comcast, But the bill did Indicate we will be get the Travel Channel, History Interantional, and Biography. Who cares about these channels. They need to work on offering more HD.

Originally posted by 1998Nole
No new from Comcast, But the bill did Indicate we will be get the Travel Channel, History Interantional, and Biography. Who cares about these channels. They need to work on offering more HD.

Those new channels are added for one reason and one reason only - to "justify" their latest annual rate increase around July. Unfortunately it takes away bandwidth they could use for more HDTV channels.

Originally posted by rrmcdonald
Hello, all. I am new to this site and appreciate the information in this thread.

I am in SummerBrooke on the north side of town. Per antennaweb Fox and NBC are 19 miles at 71 degrees, recommend red (NBC is, of course VHF), ABC 18.9 miles at 73 degrees and they recommend blue. I have some tall trees in between my house and the neighbors' in the direction of the broadcast antenna.

The question I have is, with the low wattage of Fox, etc., can I realistically pick these stations up? I can practically spit to CBS. For aesthetic reasons I would love an antenna in the attic, but I am aware that would cause additional problems. I have Comcast (at least for now) but if they don't do something soon I might go to the dish and get locals OTA.


Thanks.

I'm in Killearn Lakes with pretty similar distances (3 miles and a couple of degrees difference). I'm getting NBC, CBS, PBS (and will try again for ABC based on Scott's post) with a Megawave amplified set-top antenna. The signals are not as good as I'd like at times so I'm considering getting a low-band VHF antenna and a good UHF only antenna and combining them in my attic.

My biggest concern with that setup is multi-path from CBS since there signal is so strong and close. I already get some with my set-top. I know I could add an attenuator, but we have a dish HD-PVR (tivo-like) and rarely watch anything live. Much like a rotor, I think I'll have issues unless there is such a think as an attenuator that only attenuates a small frequency range.

I've tried a couple of Rat-Shack omni-directional in my attic with no success.

FOX is temporarily currently transmitting from Bainbridge, but will be transmitting from Midway when the go full power. There is discussion and coordinates a couple pages up in this thread.

Bottom line... Try some stuff that has a good return policy :)

John

Sinclair Announces Digital Carriage Agreement with Comcast. Article is on Yahoo Finance.

Originally posted by Texadillo
Sinclair Announces Digital Carriage Agreement with Comcast. Article is on Yahoo Finance.

That's good news, or would be if I ever watched NBC. Now give us ABC (which i do watch), please?

Originally posted by sfoltz
I'm getting WTXL-DT (Ch. 22) at a solid "93" on my Hughes receiver and I don't have my rotator specifically tuned to this station! I normally get a reading between 50 to 65. Could this mean the station has upped its power? Or is it just some atmospherical phenom.? I guess time will tell.

Got a e-mail from WTXL's engineer and he said the station has NOT increase its power yet and that it must be the atmosphere. :(

Has Anyone else had HORRRIBLE audio issues with CBS HDTV lately>??????????

Originally posted by mahicks
Has Anyone else had HORRRIBLE audio issues with CBS HDTV lately>??????????

If you mean on its HD programs through Comcast - yes. It sounds like a severe echo-garble that fades in for several minutes and gradually fades out. Heard it on JAG a while back and on Yes Dear on repeat episodes. Is it there on OTA signals also? If so, then WCTV is the culprit (no surprise there). Otherwise it may be Comcast.

Been away; thanks, John.

Originally posted by dsmith901
If you mean on its HD programs through Comcast - yes. It sounds like a severe echo-garble that fades in for several minutes and gradually fades out. Heard it on JAG a while back and on Yes Dear on repeat episodes. Is it there on OTA signals also? If so, then WCTV is the culprit (no surprise there). Otherwise it may be Comcast.

I cannot get comcast, only OTA. Yep its there, exactly as you described it. I guess its a problem with CBS

Originally posted by mahicks
I cannot get comcast, only OTA. Yep its there, exactly as you described it. I guess its a problem with CBS

It is good to know it is not just us on comcast. It happened quite a bit durning the tournament last night.

Does anyone wonder why the NCAA championship is not broadcast in HD when ever it's on? Why just durring prime time? I know it's getting shot in HD throughout the day, so why only show it in HD at night?
It doesn't cost anymore once it's shot in HD to broadcast it does it? It might make sense if CBS broadcast any sub channels on digital but it doesn't therefore to me it doesn't make any sense :-{

The NCAA Championship was on in HD Thursday afternoon, but I think only the games from Cleveland and AZ are in HD.

All of them have been in real HD, at least in production and on the HD sat feeds.
My friends get them on DTV.

Originally posted by 1998Nole
It is good to know it is not just us on comcast. It happened quite a bit durning the tournament last night.

I called WCTV and complained. The engineer I spoke with said they have problems with their digital audio - it is local, not from CBS. He said he would make the head engineer aware of the problem. It is apparent to me that WCTV employees do not watch/listen to their own programming or they would hear it for themselves.

Does WCTV broadcast in 5.1?

Originally posted by 1998Nole
Does WCTV broadcast in 5.1?

Not sure, may be DD 2.0. I will check it and get back.

It's DD 2.0; never been 5.1

I spoke with the engineer at NBC (WTWC).
Since there is no an agreement between Comcast and Sinclair, they are going through the necessary preparations to get the NBC-HD signal on comcast. He could not give me a specific time frame. It depends on how long it takes to have certain equipment installed. I suspect it will be a few weeks.

Neon

Originally posted by NeonDeion
I spoke with the engineer at NBC (WTWC).
Since there is no an agreement between Comcast and Sinclair, they are going through the necessary preparations to get the NBC-HD signal on comcast. He could not give me a specific time frame. It depends on how long it takes to have certain equipment installed. I suspect it will be a few weeks.

Neon

I assume you meant to say "Since there is NOW an agreement..."

OK. Its time once again to hear from someone, anyone about Fox, ABC, and NBC (not that NBC really matters).

After all, its only 5 months until FOOTBALL!

Apparently as long as Fox and ABC are using low power Comcast will not carry their HD, and those stations have no plans to go full power. Fudge!!

Last I heard, Comcast was working with FOX to get a fiber optic cable laid in order to get the digital/HD signal. Have you heard differently, or are you just guessing?

Neon

Originally posted by dsmith901
Apparently as long as Fox and ABC are using low power Comcast will not carry their HD, and those stations have no plans to go full power. Fudge!!

What is the point of even bradcasting in HD then.

I did call Comcast Friday and they said that w/in 2 week like was said earlier in the thread they will begin broadcasting NBC. They also indicated they are "hoping to get ESPN 2HD" soon.

I can't believe CBS spends the kind of money they do on the NCAA Tournament and the money to broadcast in HD and then they let local affiliates like the pathetic one here fail to broadcast it in HD. It is time to demand HD events in HD. If we can't get them through the miserable local provider then we are entitled to get them from a national feed. I am working on a plan now to get some press for this issue.

The CBS affilate (WCTV) was intending to broadcast in HD.
They lost the HD feed on Saturday, before the games started.
Obviously they didn't get it fixed in time.

You can "demand" all you want, but it had nothing to do with WCTV not wanting to broadcast it in HD.

Neon

Neon,

Did you confirm this with the station? I figured it might be that a "skeleton" crew over the Easter weekend didn't throw the switch. Since WCTV has all the equipment in place, and, in fact, were broadcasting the games in HD, I figured there must be a technical problem.

im 24.8 miles from nbc's tower and im only 19 from pbs's tower, i can pick up pbs without a prob shouldn't i be able to get nbc as well, i am using a amplified indoor antenna, would getting a outdoor antenna and putting it on the roof help my reception?

Yes, I called the CBS station on Saturday and asked what was going on. After being transferred a few times, I spoke with the manager on duty, who told me what was going on.

Neon

Originally posted by sayanythingrock
im 24.8 miles from nbc's tower and im only 19 from pbs's tower, i can pick up pbs without a prob shouldn't i be able to get nbc as well, i am using a amplified indoor antenna, would getting a outdoor antenna and putting it on the roof help my reception?

Probably. The reason you probably can't get NBC has to do with the fact that WTWC broadcasts on channel 2, a low-VHF allocation. It's a REAL pain to get low-VHF digitals, often requiring either outdoor VHF antennas, or very very long rabbit ears indoors.

- Trip

Originally posted by Trip in VA
Probably. The reason you probably can't get NBC has to do with the fact that WTWC broadcasts on channel 2, a low-VHF allocation. It's a REAL pain to get low-VHF digitals, often requiring either outdoor VHF antennas, or very very long rabbit ears indoors.

- Trip

WTWC must (should) have known that, so why did they agree to such a low channel number?

yea thats weak, is there any chance if i do that could i pick up low power fox and abc? or is that too much of a stretch
scratch that 26.5 from nbc....abc 26.2 and fox 26.5
so if i get a decent antenna from antennadirect i should be able to get it?

Originally posted by dsmith901
WTWC must (should) have known that, so why did they agree to such a low channel number?

Probably to save money. Don't worry; it won't stay on channel 2. Sinclair has elected to move the station back to channel 40 after the transition.

- Trip

http://www.broadcastingcable.com/article/CA513847.html?display=Breaking+News&referral=SUPP

UPN to move to a subchannel of WCTV-DT. WFXU-TV/WTLF-DT to pick up WB.

- Trip

Originally posted by Trip in VA
http://www.broadcastingcable.com/article/CA513847.html?display=Breaking+News&referral=SUPP

UPN to move to a subchannel of WCTV-DT. WFXU-TV/WTLF-DT to pick up WB.

- Trip

So what does this mean HD wise? Will UPN be on Comcast in HD? If so, great (hello Veronica!). SD, however will be no better than what we get now. Downside is audio on WCTV-DT is so bad sometimes I want to scream.

As for WB, that is one of my favorite channels and would love to see it in HD, but if they start broadcasting analog OTA and Comcast carries that signal then PQ will suffer horribly. So I am not sure this is any improvement for WB fans.

As a D* subscriber, I see the UPN and WB moves as neutral at best. Possibly much worse.

I already get a WB station out of South Florida on D*. No, its not in HD, but unless the owners of WTLF (Pegasus) put a lot of money into this facility, its going to continue to be a low powered std def. digital broadcast. Furthermore, if UPN is going to be carried on WCTV's subchannel, I don't believe there is enough bandwidth to broadcast it in HD.

What's even worse is the possibility that CBS will no longer be in HD (at least over the air). Does WCTV have enough bandwidth to broadcast CBS in HD and carry UPN on a subchannel 24/7? Is this the real reason the CBS HD signal is gone?

Originally posted by dsmith901
So what does this mean HD wise? Will UPN be on Comcast in HD? If so, great (hello Veronica!). SD, however will be no better than what we get now. Downside is audio on WCTV-DT is so bad sometimes I want to scream.

As for WB, that is one of my favorite channels and would love to see it in HD, but if they start broadcasting analog OTA and Comcast carries that signal then PQ will suffer horribly. So I am not sure this is any improvement for WB fans.

What channel will Comcast bradcast UPN on? Looking at my guide it looks like I have 2 WB channels statring friday.

More info on the move (http://www.tallahassee.com/mld/tallahassee/business/11260747.htm)

The HD signal was backup last night (Tuesday).

Neon

Originally posted by NeonDeion
The HD signal was backup last night (Tuesday).

Neon Well, thats a good sign. I pretty much limit my OTA network viewing to sports, so I didn't know its was back up.

FWIW, the Democrat article states: "WCTV also will broadcast UPN in digital format on one of the high-definition channels . . . " Not exactly a statement of clarity.

I just did not think bandwidth is sufficient. I guess I get that from PBS's operation of airing 4 std def channels in the day and going to 1 HD channel at night.

Decided to check and the UPN signal is up on 6-2 (46-2). A screensaver-type logo is being broadcast. Its in std. def.

However, the good news is CBS (Young & the Restless right now) is in HD. So now the question is whether WCTV can broadcast both in HD.

Originally posted by sfoltz
Decided to check and the UPN signal is up on 6-2 (46-2). A screensaver-type logo is being broadcast. Its in std. def.

However, the good news is CBS (Young & the Restless right now) is in HD. So now the question is whether WCTV can broadcast both in HD.

I doubt there's any chance of WCTV broadcasting UPN in HD, in fact, I'd say the chances are similar to winning the lottery. While it's disappointing that the Tallahassee market will not be able to receive UPN programming in HD, if WCTV-DT were to broadcast UPN programming in HD along with their CBS programming, the CBS HD programming would look like CRAP!!

Another dead giveaway is that WCTV-DT is currently broadcasting the UPN logo in 480i. Also, for those who haven't seen it yet, check out the UPN logo on WCTV-DT (http://members.aol.com/dreamworker23/100_0270.jpg).

Oh yeah, and UPN Signs Affiliation Agreement With Gray Television Inc. for Station in Tallahassee, FL (http://www.wctv6.com/unclassified/1415337.html) for more information.

~Alan

The PA says UPN will be "available in analog format on multiple cable systems...," meaning no HD. So a digital broadcast signal will be converted to analog for the standard cable viewing, and then re-digitized on the STB. How lame can you get. They will probably screw up the audio as well. So will UPN still be ch. 24 on Comcast?

They had an announcement on the 6 o'clock news saying that it would remain on Comcast ch. 24.

I hope that the UPN HD programing would be repeated on ch. 6 HD on the weekends or late at night. Then I would be able to set the DVR to record them. I would love to see Star Trek: Enterprise in HD before it goes off the air. I don't know if their agreement with UPN would allow that.

The channel lineup on the Comcast website lists NBCHD on channel 181, but no longer has CBSHD listed on channel 182. Does this mean we have traded CBS for NBC?

I would not put to much into what is on the comcast web site. If you look at the local information page it say that DVR are coming soon and that HD is not available yet.

Tallahassee does not keep their page up to date. I've brought this to their attention a couple of time.

However, since they did change the channel lineup lets hope that NBC HD will be here soon.

I hope that NBCHD starts tomorrow with the rest of the new channels they are adding.

Originally posted by 1998Nole
I hope that NBCHD starts tomorrow with the rest of the new channels they are adding.

New Channels?? iS THIS SARCASM OR REALISM?

they are not HD channels, we are getting Travel channel on 42, Biography 115 and History Internationl 116, Weather Channel will be on 70.

Also there will be a Starz free preview April 7-10

i lost audio during the game on cbs anyone else over the air?

it was posted up on nbc's website. interesting even though i don't believe the whole dedicated to free over the air, they are putting out such a weak signal its disgusting. does sinclair own our abc as well?

and this.

Originally posted by sayanythingrock
i lost audio during the game on cbs anyone else over the air?

My Audio was crackly for a few minutes but straighted itself out.

On the HD front, I believe the only way Comcast will get off their lazy azz and produce more HD channels is pressure from Voom, DirectTV and DishNet.

The more commercials I see for these 3 putting out HD and bashing Comcast for its limited offerings, the better I feel.

Originally posted by BadMojo11
My Audio was crackly for a few minutes but straighted itself out.


This particular audio problem become routine on WCTV-DT broadcasts, at least in HD format. Every program I watch in HD has this echo-effect that creeps in and reaches the point of total intelligibility, and then fades out, lasting about 5 or more minutes in all. I for one am sick of it. I have already called their station and spoke with a junior engineer. Is there a site where we can complain to the FCC?

I got same thing too.

I called Comcast yesterday and was told that they had planned to add NBC in HD on 4/5/05, but there were problems and now it should be another 30 days or so. Nothing on ABC, though.

You may enjoy this response to my question of how Tallahassee can possibly be considered a local area for the Bainbridge Fox whichdoes not broadcast OTA here:

Nielsen Media Research measures audiences for broadcast and cable television. The Nielsen Media Research local market definition, also known as a Designated Market Area (DMA), was designed for the sole purpose of measuring viewing. DMA’s were never intended to be used for the purposes that other companies are now using them.

Because we look at every county to see what over-the-air stations receive the majority of viewing, we assign counties into a DMA based on majority viewing. A DMA consists of all counties whose largest viewing share is given to stations of that same market area.

In accordance with new government regulations, satellite service providers are using our DMA designations to help them determine which local stations are most appropriate to be included in the local broadcast service. Nielsen Media Research is not actually involved in those decisions, though our information is used.

Congress decided to use Nielsen Media Research DMAs to determine what local stations are carried by satellite providers, DESPITE the fact that this is not the what DMAs were ever intended to do. The U.S. government determines when and where the satellite companies may provide local service. Nielsen Media Research’s only role is to measure the TV viewing.

You may wish to contact your local congress member for more details on this ruling, or to find out how to get the local broadcast service you want. You can also check out the FCC's Web site at __ to read about the issues involved in this congressional decision.

We provide DirecTV with all Zip Codes in the country that cross county lines and that cross into a different DMA and it is DirecTV's responsibility to determine where in that Zip Code the HH resides.

Thanks for your interest, and I hope this information helps

Just curious if each night WCTV has problems with the sound on their HD broadcast? Are they aware of the sound problems? I am on Comcast if that makes a difference.

It seems like it has been an nightly problem and lasts just long enough to be annoying.

They know about the sound. If you guys complain about the sound they will go back broadcasting the standard picture.
If you care more about sound than you do picture then turn the channel to the regular BS feed, or try turning your stereo to 87.7 FM.

The sound is just as important as the picture. If the sound is garbled it really takes away from the nice picture.

I actually do flip the the SD feed as soon as the sound goes out, I'd rater suffer with the PQ than not no what the heck they are saying. I then check the HD on the next commercial.

Originally posted by rabblerouser
They know about the sound. If you guys complain about the sound they will go back broadcasting the standard picture.
If you care more about sound than you do picture then turn the channel to the regular BS feed, or try turning your stereo to 87.7 FM.

I'm not sure if I'm getting your meaning here. Are you saying that the people at WCTV know about the problem and their response is basically "who cares." Or are you saying they know about the problem and are working diligently to fix it?

If you mean the former, that's pretty outrageous and unacceptable. If you mean the latter, I can deal with that.

Just saw on ch. 40 a promo saying that HD is coming soon to Comcast ch. 181. Also said it would be in DD 5.1

Originally posted by Hammerheadfred
Just saw on ch. 40 a promo saying that HD is coming soon to Comcast ch. 181. Also said it would be in DD 5.1

WCTV is broadcasting DD 2.0 (and very badly), so maybe this will prompt them to get with the program (pardon the pun) and upgrade to 5.1.

Originally posted by Hammerheadfred
Just saw on ch. 40 a promo saying that HD is coming soon to Comcast ch. 181. Also said it would be in DD 5.1

Very Nice Hammered!

I see WCTV made the news section with their UPN arrangement, which explains in part why OTA stations are not inclined to carry HDTV when they can make more money splitting the bandwidth into 4 SD signals.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=530928

whats worse is the UPN video quality, it sucks....I know it's just EDTV, but still, come on!!! the commercials on CBS look twice as good as the programming on the "new" UPN station.

I just called Comcast and they said NBC is now available on ch. 181, but I'm not getting it down in Wakulla. They made an appointment to come out to see what is wrong.

Is anyboby getting it in Tallahassee?

The last I heard was that it had been delayed.

Also asked about TNT-HD. They said is no date for that yet.

Originally posted by mahicks
whats worse is the UPN video quality, it sucks....I know it's just EDTV, but still, come on!!! the commercials on CBS look twice as good as the programming on the "new" UPN station.

Admittedly, WCTV's UPN is one of the worst multicast channels that I have ever seen, but then when I can pick it up, it beats trying to pick up the mess that is WVAG's analog signal at my location. Not to mention that at least WCTV is allowing the majority of their bandwith to their CBS-HD channel.

~Alan

Originally posted by Hammerheadfred
I just called Comcast and they said NBC is now available on ch. 181, but I'm not getting it down in Wakulla. They made an appointment to come out to see what is wrong.

Is anyboby getting it in Tallahassee?

The last I heard was that it had been delayed.

Also asked about TNT-HD. They said is no date for that yet.

There was a promo on WTWC 40 that HD broadcast on Comcast would begin May 3.

I just spoke with a Comcast CS person who said ABC-HD has been assigned channel 180 and Fox-HD has been assigned channel 183, but she did not have a start date for these or for NBC-HD.

She also said Warner and UPN are switching channels; Warner will move to cable 24 and UPN will move to cable 6 (interestingly, WCTV's OTA channel). This is supposed to be imminent, but the TV guide is not being updated properly, so you will have to double check your recordings as they kick in to not lose anything.

Good news about NBC. May is a sweeps month, so no doubt they wanted to get going by then. Hope ABC and Fox feel the same. A review of "Lost" in high definition in the current EW magazine made me want to cry.

Originally posted by dsmith901
Good news about NBC. May is a sweeps month, so no doubt they wanted to get going by then. Hope ABC and Fox feel the same. A review of "Lost" in high definition in the current EW magazine made me want to cry.

"Lost" definately looks GREAT in HD (I get ABC-HD East & West via DirecTV), and hope that everyone in the Tallahassee, FL market are able to receive it soon as well. You definately wouldn't want to go back to the SD feed after you've seen it in HD.

~Alan

Originally posted by Alan Gordon
Not to mention that at least WCTV is allowing the majority of their bandwith to their CBS-HD channel.

~Alan

LOL...That was going to be my next negative statement. Am I the only one noticing a little more grain in the pic durring CSI and other prime time HD feeds since UPN came on? You could say it might just be my imagination running wild with the bandwith being split, but I noticed the softer picture before I even knew that UPN was being simulcast. What the rest of yours thoughts on this?

A Little OFF TOPIC QUESTION......

Since Voom is going under, I need to make a choice between Dish and Direct. Since both of their HD content absolutely sucks, this will NOT be a deciding factor. I am going to base my decision solely on who has the best SD picture quality, the least compression, artifacts, etc.

I used to have Direct TV before I switched to Voom, and I thougt DTV's SD signal was pretty poor on alot of channels. Is Dish Networks any better??

I could not stand the super soft, almost blocky picture on some of DTV's channels.
But......if dish networks is worse..........OK....you get the picture....

April 30th will be the saddest day of my life! (The day VOOM shuts down!) Their HD content was perfect, almost, if not on par with OTA. And their compression on SD content was almost non-existant, much better than DTV and Digital cable.

Originally posted by mahicks
LOL...That was going to be my next negative statement. Am I the only one noticing a little more grain in the pic durring CSI and other prime time HD feeds since UPN came on? You could say it might just be my imagination running wild with the bandwith being split, but I noticed the softer picture before I even knew that UPN was being simulcast. What the rest of yours thoughts on this?

I agree with you, but I just figured it was comcast.

In regards to COmcast piccking up the other local networks I will not expect anything or beleive any dates until they show up as a selectable channel.

Originally posted by mahicks
LOL...That was going to be my next negative statement. Am I the only one noticing a little more grain in the pic durring CSI and other prime time HD feeds since UPN came on? You could say it might just be my imagination running wild with the bandwith being split, but I noticed the softer picture before I even knew that UPN was being simulcast. What the rest of yours thoughts on this?

Honestly, at the moment I only watch two CBS (CSI: Las Vegas and CSI: Miami) shows in HD, and TiVo the SD feeds of some of the Monday night comedies in SD.

Also, I don't really sit and watch any programs on WCTV's HD signal much due to the fact that there seems to be no rhyme or reason to when I'm able to pick up their signal, and when I'm not. So, it's usually easier to just switch to CBS-HD East on DirecTV, which also has DD5.1 and closed captioning (it's sometimes hard to hear what's being said when other people are talking in the house). Once full power rules go into effect for 100+ stations (July, 2006), I'll start watching WRBL-DT in Columbus.

However, last time I looked, I couldn't tell any difference in PQ between WCTV-DT, but then that wasn't a particularly sharp broadcast. However, once a station starts multicasting, the change is usually noticeable regardless of what the affiliates might try to tell you. I recently had the opportunity to see "The Tonight Show" in HD via an affiliate in either Orlando (I think) that doesn't do any multicasting, which looked almost 3D compared to my local NBC affiliate (WALB-DT) which multicasts two channels besides their HD signal... though I have found that stations that broadcast in 720p (FOX, ABC) are less likely to show degradation of their HD signal from multicasting than stations that broadcast in 1080i (CBS, NBC, PBS).

~Alan

Originally posted by youknowwho
i used to live in Tallahassee... such a wonderful, beautiful place...


Super high real estate prices, one mostly useless and congested interstate, behind the times road logistics, backwoods technological advances, high cost of living, very political, extremely high kilowatt/HR electrical rate YET with some of the lowest quality of electricity ratings in the country, below average elementary and high-school education scores, bureaucratic and "good 'ol boy" business practices.........Oh yeah, a couple of great colleges, old oaks, Spanish moss, and the states capitol....whoo hoo, it is such a wonderful and beautiful place!!!


LOL........All this being said, even though it's all very true......I do love Tallahassee and the Big Bend area...

Originally posted by mahicks
I could not stand the super soft, almost blocky picture on some of DTV's channels.
But......if dish networks is worse..........OK....you get the picture....

I prefer DirecTV's picture to Dish Network, not to mention that I also prefer the DirecTiVo over Dish Network's PVRs, so we decided to stay with DirecTV even though Dish Network now has our locals (Albany, GA DMA), and DirecTV doesn't.

As far as HDTV channels go, DirecTV has Universal-HD, and Dish Network has TNT-HD. DirecTV has a deal with ESPN2-HD, and has some sports in HD with the sports packs and Sunday Ticket, Extra Innings.

DirecTV is launching three satellites this year, and while most of that bandwith is going into providing HD-LIL to larger markets, some of that bandwith will be going into adding ESPN2-HD, and most likely other HD channels in MPEG-4.

Dish Network will (probably) soon have the VOOM satellite, Rainbow-1, but has stated that they will not add ANY more HD until they switch over to MPEG-4, and that they will talk more about that probably sometime in September.

I hope that helped!

~Alan

Originally posted by mahicks
Super high real estate prices, one mostly useless and congested interstate, behind the times road logistics, backwoods technological advances, high cost of living, very political, extremely high kilowatt/HR electrical rate YET with some of the lowest quality of electricity ratings in the country, below average elementary and high-school education scores, bureaucratic and "good 'ol boy" business practices.........Oh yeah, a couple of great colleges, old oaks, Spanish moss, and the states capitol....whoo hoo, it is such a wonderful and beautiful place!!!


LOL........All this being said, even though it's all very true......I do love Tallahassee and the Big Bend area...

Well said, and I love Tallahassee, and will never leave.

Originally posted by mahicks
Super high real estate prices, one mostly useless and congested interstate, behind the times road logistics, backwoods technological advances, high cost of living, very political, extremely high kilowatt/HR electrical rate YET with some of the lowest quality of electricity ratings in the country, below average elementary and high-school education scores, bureaucratic and "good 'ol boy" business practices.........Oh yeah, a couple of great colleges, old oaks, Spanish moss, and the states capitol....whoo hoo, it is such a wonderful and beautiful place!!!


LOL........All this being said, even though it's all very true......I do love Tallahassee and the Big Bend area...

From what I read most Leon County schools are above the State average and several above the national average. As one who grew up here it galls me quite a bit when carpetbaggers cite all the negatives of the town, while conveniently ignoring the negatives of where they came from (and don't want to go back to).

gheesh DSmith....I was just doing a little ranting and joking. I really do like it here. If I didn't I would leave. But you have got to seriously look at the negative issues of the area too.

I don't appreciate being called a carpetbagger when I laugh off my post at the end AND state that I love this area....

BUT....if you want to get serious about it and split some hairs, I was not just referring to LEON county schools. I was also including the surrounding gadsden county. AND.......Heres an article about Floridas schools.
http://www.sptimes.com/2005/03/06/State/Schools_still_rank_ne.shtml

Also this is probably the "better" of the so called negative issues I posted on. I noticed you didn't dare comment on the rest of the issues in my post.

In conclusion....
I LOVE TALLAHASSEE AND THE BIG BEND AREA. IT HAS S-E-R-I-O-U-S issues with it but I LOVE IT

NOW PLEASE can we get back on TOPIC..

P.S. I apologize to everyone that took this the wrong way, If you like, I will gladly shoot myself :-}

I can't believe I just watched someone get called a carpetbagger on AVS.

We all have the right to make legitimate complaints, but the one about Tallahassee having bad schools was simply wrong and the poster needed to be called on it. A word of advice - when you move to a new town, be careful about denigrating it to the long time locals. They will often take it personally, especially if your complaint is not accurate.

I just talk to a CSR at Tallahassee Comcast and she had a list of their new channels that will be added and said that both ABC-HD and NBC-HD will be added May 5th and Fox-HD will be added in May also but did not have an exact date.

She also said that the local news would be added to the On Demand service at the end of May.

Still no info on TNT-HD.

Any other channels to be added besides what you mentioned?

I also got an email today from the GM of the FOX affiliate who confirmed that FOX will be available through Comcast "soon." He didn't give an exact date, as he said that Comcast was currently installing the necessary equipment, but that "it shouldn't be long" and to look for a press release in about 1 month.

Neon

The lady I talk to at comcast was reading from memo they received yesterday and didn't mention any other channel addtions. If there was I think she would have said because she threw in the part about local news being avaiable on On Demand.

Originally posted by Hammerheadfred
I just talk to a CSR at Tallahassee Comcast and she had a list of their new channels that will be added and said that both ABC-HD and NBC-HD will be added May 5th and Fox-HD will be added in May also but did not have an exact date.

She also said that the local news would be added to the On Demand service at the end of May.

Still no info on TNT-HD.

NBC's on-line promo says HD starts May 3, so it has already been pushed back? Great news about ABC. Now if I just had a HD DVD recorder.....

When they added CBS-HD it was on as much as a week ahead of time in some parts of Tallahassee. But of course Wakulla didn't get it until the announced day.

Got home and found TNT-HD on Comcast ch. 204.

You are so right....how in the world did you know this...

Thanks for the heads up Hammerheadfred, will this be it's permanant home I wonder.

Just caught that the Enterprise episode "In a Mirror, Darkly" is scheduled for 12:05 a.m. I have my HDTIVO set to record.

Originally posted by Hammerheadfred
Got home and found TNT-HD on Comcast ch. 204.

Yep 204. Now we are getting somwhere

I would like to thank Comcast for their very informative methods of letting their customers know of TNT-HD.

Originally posted by bec
Just caught that the Enterprise episode "In a Mirror, Darkly" is scheduled for 12:05 a.m. I have my HDTIVO set to record.

Do you mean WCTV is broadcasting UPN shows on HD after midnight? I hope so, but this is a shock if its true.

Originally posted by BadMojo11
I would like to thank Comcast for their very informative methods of letting their customers know of TNT-HD.

Actually i put on regular TNT and there is a scroll message that went across the top. I saw it when I was looking at the guide, since 204 still says to be announced for the show listing. But still would have been nice to see mention of it in a bill or something.

Originally posted by bec
Just caught that the Enterprise episode "In a Mirror, Darkly" is scheduled for 12:05 a.m. I have my HDTIVO set to record.

Well?! Was "Enterprise" in HD?!


~Alan

Originally posted by Alan Gordon
Well?! Was "Enterprise" in HD?!


~Alan

Nope :(

Someone mentioned that WCTV HD has dropped in resolution because of their simulcasting UPN and last night I noticed it myself. The PQ is much less detailed, more like widescreen SD than HD. There oughta be a law! Or at least a broadcast standard that says HD has to be at a minimum bit level. Let UPN use their own bandwidth (I thought they owned the same channel capacity as WCTV) and stop degrading our HD!

Hey everyone, I just wanted to say that comcast has updated the channel lineup on their website (finally). I notice TNT-HD was defined as "coming soon." I wonder if that means we'll get ABC-HD, NBC-HD, and Fox-HD early as well. Actually, on the website Fox-HD doesn't even have the "coming soon" logo next to it. In any case, I still can't get any network except CBS.

Hmmmm
172- DISCHD
173- ESPNHD
174- INHD
175- INHD2
176- HBOHD
177- CMXHD
178- SHOHD
179- STZHD
180- ABC-HD (pending)
181- NBC-HD (pending)
182- CBS-HD
183- FOXHD (pending)
190- PBSHD
.
204- TNTHD??? Why did they put this in the PPV range?

Also, the following NON- HD channels

191 - The FLorida Channel
192- WFSU Kids
193 - The Florida Knowledge Network

Could be moved to give a block of free channels 184-199 (190 is PBS) all for HD meaning 15 AVAILABLE

Possible free areas for moving/placing of channels

236-244 (9)
246-249 (4)
254-289 (36)
295-300 (6)

Originally posted by BadMojo11


191 - The FLorida Channel
192- WFSU Kids
193 - The Florida Knowledge Network



Are these really HD channels? I confess I have never checked them out.

I saw TNT in "HD" at 204, but the picture was slightly distorted; it looks as if they stretched the 4:3 version. Otherwise resolution was pretty good - not as good as HBO, but much better than SD. I forgot to check audio, but will be surprised if it is not DD 2.0. The Comcast on-screen guide did not list the shows, just "To Be Announced," but you could check the schedule at channel 61 (I think).

Originally posted by dsmith901
Are these really HD channels? I confess I have never checked them out.

No, they are just in the way, so to speak...

TNT-HD is DD 5.1 and a lot of their programing is stretched, but most of the sports, orignal programing and newer movies are in true HD.

Also PBS mutli-casts durning the day and switches to HD at night, but a lot of their programing is SD. Instead of stretching it they zoom in to where it almost fills the screen.

Originally posted by Hammerheadfred
TNT-HD is DD 5.1 and a lot of their programing is stretched, but most of the sports, orignal programing and newer movies are in true HD.

Also PBS mutli-casts durning the day and switches to HD at night, but a lot of their programing is SD. Instead of stretching it they zoom in to where it almost fills the screen.

Thanks. I manually set my 6412 to record "Lost World" this morning and when I peeked I saw the stretch is progressive toward the sides, which is good for static images or talking heads, but distracting on action shows or movies. The show is SD apparently, but it looks much better than the usual SD channels, so broadcasting it in faux-HD seems to help PQ.

Still haven't seen anything on NBC/ABC/FOX, darn it. I am dying to see "Lost" in HD. Hurry up, Comcast!!!

I called today to confirm NBC as well as ABC ,are still on schedule for MAy 3. No date for Fox.

anyone catch Conan last night in HD. so nbc and abc are coming may 3 sweet

Thank heavens things are finally moving. With JAG going off there was almost nothing left on the networks worth watching in HD.

"Are you ready for some football?" I am.

Originally posted by dsmith901
Thank heavens things are finally moving. With JAG going off there was almost nothing left on the networks worth watching in HD.

"Are you ready for some football?" I am.

Hell yeah, I mean I still enjoy watching the saved 4th quarter of the Jets PITT game in breathtaking HD....

But now that the rest of the networks will be here...I want to see many many college games in HD as well...

Originally posted by BadMojo11

But now that the rest of the networks will be here...I want to see many many college games in HD as well...

Like say, the FSU-UM game on MNF?

Exactly

Need input:

Anyone using the Comcast cable card? If so, please give details as to cost, performance, etc.

Anyone using the 6412 with a Panasonic HD plasma (50")? If so, what output format are you using? What connection type?

Thanks.

Has anyone taken any steps to, say, build a hushbox for the Comcast HD-PVR device?
I find the drive motor ring and seek noise to be extremely irritating. It's probably the loudest thing on my theater room, and at a much more irritating pitch than my HTPC.

In today's Tallahassee Democrat there was a full page add promoting ABC on 180 and NBC on 181 coming May 3. I can't believe they actaully are promoting it. The add also let everyone know that TNT was on 204.

One more broadcast channel left. Hopefully the wait for Fox will not be that long

They're coming on strong. If not for my investment in the HDTivos, this switch from Direct would be tempting.

I wonder what effect Dish Network picking up the 21 Voom HD channels will have on Comcast customers.

May be a good thing as it will put more pressure on Comcast to keep up!

Originally posted by Defiler
Has anyone taken any steps to, say, build a hushbox for the Comcast HD-PVR device?
I find the drive motor ring and seek noise to be extremely irritating. It's probably the loudest thing on my theater room, and at a much more irritating pitch than my HTPC.

My 6412, along with a Replay PVR and Panasonic DMR E80H are all inside a cabinet with glass doors. I drilled a series of small holes in the back at the top to improve ventilation, and the glass doors I keep slightly open. Makes a big difference noise wise.

I was flipping around and NBC and ABC were live at 11:15 tonight on 180 and 181. Now its time to work on Fox.

I got an email from the station manager at FOX about 2 weeks ago, and said that they were supposed to be on Comcast sometime in May. I suspect that Comcast worked with ABC/NBC first, since they are run out of the same place, so they could kill 2 birds with 1 stone, sort-of-speak.

Hopefully, we will have FOX before the season finale' of "24"...

Neon

Originally posted by NeonDeion
I got an email from the station manager at FOX about 2 weeks ago, and said that they were supposed to be on Comcast sometime in May. I suspect that Comcast worked with ABC/NBC first, since they are run out of the same place, so they could kill 2 birds with 1 stone, sort-of-speak.

Hopefully, we will have FOX before the season finale' of "24"...

Neon

I believe, as a previous post mentioned, the problem is more basic - the FOX OTA signal does not reach the Comcast antenna, and they were considering running a direct line feed to Comcast, which takes more time and money. ABC had the same problem, but they are a lot closer, so maybe that made a difference.

Now that we have the major networks, maybe WB and UPN will get with the program and start broadcasting HD. Anyone know if Sunshine Sports does HD?

any promotions on comcast cable?

cause i got rid of hd cable back in jan after football ended. plus my promotion ran out. so i just use basic cable

That's good to hear about Fox coming soon. I wonder if they will bring WFXU or WTLF with them, because I wish I could get the WB in HD. Does anyone know if the WB even broadcasts in HD, or any other way to get the WB in HD? Thanks.

Looking forward to looking watching "Lost" in HD on Wednesday!

Sorry, I just read the other post that said the WB doesn't broadcast in HD...but let's hope they get in gear

Originally posted by themole1093
Sorry, I just read the other post that said the WB doesn't broadcast in HD...but let's hope they get in gear

The WB as a network entity does broadcast hd shows, two of my favs being Gilmore Girls and One Tree Hill (I'll be watching in hd tonight). Your local WB affil must not be broadcasting the WB's hd programming. I remember watching the WB network premiere their hd programming when I was living in Jacksonville in Nov of 2002. WB has been broadcasting hd for 2.5 yrs.

It is about time Comcast is getting on the ball. As long as Fox is here by NFL season I am fine.


Anyword on Espn2Hd or even EspnHd in surround sound?

ABC HD Looks real good. Judge Judy is on and its full screen. ABC News is also filling the screen. Very Nice.

NBC looks AWFUL, blurry with lines across the screen (Maury povich) This program is also full screen. However, Dr. Phil is on now and looks good.

However, on CBS as often is the case, Oprah is not stretched having the black bars on either side.

Any ideas on this? Why Does ABC, NBC, and TNT fill the screens and CBS Oprah and Eyewitness News NOT fill the screen?

yea wondering if anyone watched leno or conan on nbc-hd and can comment on pq, also abc-hd quality, you are talking about upconverts. let get some HD, i wish i could comment but im in miami. conan looks awesome in HD can't wait to get home and see it on my DLP instead of my computer monitor down here. also has abc or nbc increased the power of their attenna's cause i could not pick them up at all but could get cbs with an antenna. thanks

Upconverts? Please explain.

So ABC, NBC, and TNT are upconverts and CBS is true HD?

ABC definitely has some native HD shows (Lost, Alias, etc.)
I haven't watched ABC-HD here in TLH yet, but surely they will broadcast those shows at their native resolutions and rates.

Tnt basketball is in HD the studio shots with Charles, Kenny etc are the best HD I have seen. Colors are very vivid

I watched ABC ("....Jim") last night and the PQ was lacking in detail compared to Deadwood on HBO, for example. It looked more like wide-screen SD than true HD. I don't know if the problem is with the 6412 up-converting 720p to 1080i or if the local ABC station is just broadcasting a minimal HD bit-rate, which would not surprise me. Hope "Lost" and "Alias" fare better tonight.

Originally posted by dsmith901
I watched ABC ("....Jim") last night and the PQ was lacking in detail compared to Deadwood on HBO, for example. It looked more like wide-screen SD than true HD. I don't know if the problem is with the 6412 up-converting 720p to 1080i or if the local ABC station is just broadcasting a minimal HD bit-rate, which would not surprise me. Hope "Lost" and "Alias" fare better tonight.

That's what I'm talking about. What I like about ABC, NBC and TNT is the full time screen filling. Some people in my family will not watch say, CBS, with the black bars.

So if anyone sees a program on ABC or NBC that is DEFINITELY supposed to be in HD, let us know. Also, if anyone sees a show on ABC or NBC HD channels with black bars, please alert.

yea i wonder if the bit rate is good running out of abc, you know how cheap the stations have been. lets post up lost and alias results tonight, let us know how they look

I'm amazed to hear that there are those that think the stretched image that ABC, NBC and TNT are showing are preferable to preserving the original aspect ratio. Don't you notice that the people on non-HD streched shows, like the local news, now look like blurry, fat images of their former selves? If you own a wide screen TV, I would think that you understand the benifits that widescreen DVDs provide vs pan and scan. Making 4:3 tv stretch to fit 16:9 is much worse. The best comparison I can think of is using Silly Putty to copy an image from the newspaper and the stretch it out. I know that some of you think that you are being robbed of some real estate when the image only fills up 70% of your screen, but who wants a bigger image if it looks that distroted. Besides if you want the image to fill the screen when watching CBS, use one of the stretch modes that are built into the TV. That way those of us who value quality over quantity can enjoy a crisp SD picture and those with bar phobia can enjoy their warped big picture

Hey buddy...maybe you should get your eyes checked.

The HD versions of ABC, NBC and TNT look MUCH better...

Originally posted by BadMojo11
Hey buddy...maybe you should get your eyes checked.

The HD versions of ABC, NBC and TNT look MUCH better...

On the other hand, perhaps it is you who needs the eye exam. I have yet to see a stretch that looks good, and I've seen it on just five out of the 40+ HD feeds I have watched. In fact, I think a poll of everyone here on AVS would find that a huge majority prefer the bars, even if they prefer to stretch, simply because then those who want the stretch can do it themselves.

- Trip

Originally posted by BadMojo11

So if anyone sees a program on ABC or NBC that is DEFINITELY supposed to be in HD, let us know. Also, if anyone sees a show on ABC or NBC HD channels with black bars, please alert.


Desperate Housewives is in HD but that comes on Sunday

All I know my friends, is that 180 looks worlds better than 7, and 181 looks worlds better than 12....

That's a good start...

"Lost" and "Alias" looked very good last night, though not up to HBO standards IMO. But I guess half a loaf is better than none. To my eyes the stretched SD shows mostly look bad - I would prefer just giving me the sidebars. TNT is almost unwatchable with their progressive stretch mode. The best solution for now would be to broadcast 4:3 material in that aspect and let the 16:9 displays zoom to fill the screen w/o distortion. For the future, IMO it is imperative that ALL digital broadcast material be created (or converted) in the 16:9 (or wider) format, whether SD, ED, or HD. We should never have to watch 4:3 images, either native or stretched, once the digital transition is complete. How the FCC screwed that up is just amazing to me.

Originally posted by dsmith901
[B To my eyes the stretched SD shows mostly look bad - I would prefer just giving me the sidebars. [/B]

I am glad I am easy to please....If what is appearing on ABCHD and NBCHD is "stretched SD", then stretched SD blows away regular SD.

Originally posted by BadMojo11
I am glad I am easy to please....If what is appearing on ABCHD and NBCHD is "stretched SD", then stretched SD blows away regular SD.

If they use a combination of zoom with very slight stretch it would just look like all the actors had gained about 10 lbs, and I could live with that. But just stretching a 4:3 image so everyone looks like they are in a fun-house mirror, or a progressive stretch where it seems like you are looking at the show through a large bottle, is way too distracting.

Well, is there anything that can be done about it?

The majority of the shows that are shown on the new ABC, NBC and TNT are not recorded or broadcast in HD. In other words the resolution and level of detail should in theory be no greater than any other digitally broadcast channel, the image is just streched from the normal squarish 4:3 image to fit the widescreen of HD tvs 16:9. The reason that the images look better than the standard ABC, NBC and TNT is that they are being broadcast digitally as opposed to the standard analog channels. On our cable systems, all channels below 100 are actually analog. Those above 100 are digital. You can ask any comcast tech and they will confirm this for you. The reason that people want the local ABC and NBC stations to broadcast in the original aspect ratio (OAR) of 4:3 is to avoid the picture distortion. In a couple of years or so all channels will be broadcast digitally, and hopefully in HD. In the meantime, I am very thankful that even though we live in a relatively small city, we are lucky enough to have more HD channels than much of the country. While I hope that our local ABC and NBC channels will reconsider the OAR issue, I will still cheer them everytime a true HD broadcast of a show like Lost or West Wing is broadcast in all of its amazing glory.

Originally posted by bleibow
The majority of the shows that are shown on the new ABC, NBC and TNT are not recorded or broadcast in HD. In other words the resolution and level of detail should in theory be no greater than any other digitally broadcast channel, the image is just streched from the normal squarish 4:3 image to fit the widescreen of HD tvs 16:9. The reason that the images look better than the standard ABC, NBC and TNT is that they are being broadcast digitally as opposed to the standard analog channels. On our cable systems, all channels below 100 are actually analog. Those above 100 are digital. You can ask any comcast tech and they will confirm this for you. The reason that people want the local ABC and NBC stations to broadcast in the original aspect ratio (OAR) of 4:3 is to avoid the picture distortion. In a couple of years or so all channels will be broadcast digitally, and hopefully in HD. In the meantime, I am very thankful that even though we live in a relatively small city, we are lucky enough to have more HD channels than much of the country. While I hope that our local ABC and NBC channels will reconsider the OAR issue, I will still cheer them everytime a true HD broadcast of a show like Lost or West Wing is broadcast in all of its amazing glory.

Thanks for this great post. Makes sense. I am enjoying watching the shows in digital format and can't wait until all channels look this good. I must have a good stretch mode (Panny 53X54 RPTV) because It doesn't have the 'distortion' you speak of. I am willing to accept less quality to avoid the possibility of burn in as a result of constant viewing of black sidebars.

I am very much enjoying the quality picture that is the NBA playoffs on TNT.

Originally posted by BadMojo11
Thanks for this great post. Makes sense. I am enjoying watching the shows in digital format and can't wait until all channels look this good. I must have a good stretch mode (Panny 53X54 RPTV) because It doesn't have the 'distortion' you speak of. I am willing to accept less quality to avoid the possibility of burn in as a result of constant viewing of black sidebars.

I am very much enjoying the quality picture that is the NBA playoffs on TNT.

The type of TV in this case has no effect on the stretch mode. The distortion is done before reaching the STB. Some people just notice it more than others. If you can't see any distortion, the easiest way to tell if the program is a true widescreen HD program, watch the commercials. When the program is HD the ads will be seen in 4:3 mode with the black bars. If the program is a stretched 4:3 program the ads will also be stretched and fill the entire screen.

Yes, I understand. What kind of TV do you have? Is burn in an issue with you?

Originally posted by BadMojo11
Yes, I understand. What kind of TV do you have? Is burn in an issue with you?

I have a Sony KDF-60sx955 rear projection LCD. As far as I know, burn in is not an issue with normal use.

Originally posted by Texadillo
I have a Sony KDF-60sx955 rear projection LCD. As far as I know, burn in is not an issue with normal use.

Yes, you have no fear of burn-in. If I had an LCD or DLP I would watch stuff in 4:3, but alas, I do not. So I accept a stretch screen. Fortunately, I picked a TV that has a very decent stretch.

Apparently the NBC and ABC HD's are having some sound issues....

The show Faith and Hope you can't even hear the dialogue at all (on right now)...and my wife tells me the sound goes out on some programs on NBC (like the news)...

Anyone else notice these issues?

Originally posted by BadMojo11
Apparently the NBC and ABC HD's are having some sound issues....

The show Faith and Hope you can't even hear the dialogue at all (on right now)...and my wife tells me the sound goes out on some programs on NBC (like the news)...

Anyone else notice these issues?

ON NBC and Joey last night I noticed a few time where the sounds was out for a split second. Also it seemed to have some lip sync issues as well.

I'm glad that the discussion regarding NBC's decision to stretch all 4:3 content has been re-ignited with all of new Comcast HD viewers. I've been suffering with it via OTA for a few months now.

When I asked NBC about it, they said 'just watch the other sub-channel'. Apparently they don't have a good enough HD set to see the significant difference in picture quality between the 1080i signal and 480i signal.

I'm strongly in favor of the station broadcasting the signal in its OAR with side bars or top/bottom bars and letting the set owner decide between burn in, distortion of the picture, and loss of content.

Is there ANY 16:9 HD set out there that does NOT have an internal ability to do its own stretch, or zoom? (I don't think so)

Is there ANY 16:9 HD set out there that CAN 'un-stretch' a stretched image? (I don't think so)

Do the (admittedly few) 4:3 HD sets out there have to watch squished HD content with the sides cut off or do they end up with top/bottom bars and a squished image.

For at lest the near future, the vast majority of the programming will continue to be produced in 4:3. Why should we suffer?

C'mon folks let's help NBC get there act together.

Originally posted by FaxMan


Is there ANY 16:9 HD set out there that does NOT have an internal ability to do its own stretch, or zoom? (I don't think so)



On my set when I hit the format button I get a message this is unavailavble in this mode, this is only the case on the HD channels. I can strecth, zoom, expand on the SD channels all I want.

I have a Mits 55807, it about 4 years old. If any one now how I can stretch on HD please let me know because I would like to see the differences.

It's actually extremely common for HDTVs to lack the ability to zoom or 'unstretch' an incorrectly broadcast HD signal, even in the $5000+ price range.
Myself, I only have those controls for SD signals. (Yamaha LPX-500)
If it ever becomes a problem, I'll pick up an iScan HD+

I admit there are some issues with the aspect ratio, but did anyone else see the Kentucky Derby today? It looked amazing. For what it's worth, I personally prefer keeping content in the OAR, but I worry about burn in. I noticed when they were showing extended periods of 4:3 material during the Kentucky Derby, they had a light red flickering pattern, very subtle, on the "black bar area" to prevent burn in. I thought that was very clever. It's too bad they can't do that on all their 4:3 programming, in my humble opinion. Honestly though, I'm just glad we had ABC and NBC added.

Comcast is running radio commercials in Tallahassee that says they will have FOX-HD by the end of May.

Has anyone tried to contact ABC/NBC about their decision to broadcast the stretch/zoom format rather than the OAR? If so, what did they say?

Neon

Look, I have watched the new channels closely (ABC, NBC, and TNT).

They look a lot better than any of the other digital channels (150-171 and 301-377)

Does anyone else think so?

Explanations?

Originally posted by NeonDeion
Comcast is running radio commercials in Tallahassee that says they will have FOX-HD by the end of May.

Has anyone tried to contact ABC/NBC about their decision to broadcast the stretch/zoom format rather than the OAR? If so, what did they say?

Neon

Basically, NBC says 'watch the SD feed'. I haven't tried ABC.

Folks, unless the FCC gets off their lazy asses this "stretch or don't stretch" issue is going to be with us even after the analog transmitters are turned off. Why? Because there is nothing in the digital broadcast standards that require non-HD signals to be 16:9. And since the stations save bandwidth transmitting SD in 4:3 mode they will do this the majority of the time as long as they can get away with it. The only solution I see is for the FCC to mandate ALL digital broadcasting to be 16:9, whether SD or HD.

NBC certainly needs to fix the sound issue...

has abc or nbc increased their attenna strength, im over on mission and tharpe and can't get either but i can get cbs?

Originally posted by sayanythingrock
has abc or nbc increased their attenna strength, im over on mission and tharpe and can't get either but i can get cbs?

Not that I know of, but...........

What kinda antenna are you using??
If you can get CBS, you should have no problem getting NBC with the proper antenna. Remember that NBC is broadcast on a VERY VERY low Channel 2 VHF, so you almost always need some type of VHF antenna.

yea i guess i will have to get an outdoor antenna, i was using an indoor jensen. but i am gonna opt for the terk outdoor one

Originally posted by 1998Nole
ON NBC and Joey last night I noticed a few time where the sounds was out for a split second. Also it seemed to have some lip sync issues as well.

I noticed that on several shows, including NBC. Since I record everything on the 6412 I found if you back up a second or two and replay the scene the dialoge is restored, which means the problem is with Comcast or the 6412, not the station.

Originally posted by BadMojo11
Look, I have watched the new channels closely (ABC, NBC, and TNT).

They look a lot better than any of the other digital channels (150-171 and 301-377)

Does anyone else think so?

Explanations?

You mean other than the fact they are HD and the others are SD? Even though a lot of their programming (ABC,NBC and TNT) originates as SD, broadcasting them through a HD transmitter at full power does seem to improve PQ. Keep in mind OTA broadcasts are not compressed as are those SD channels fed off a bandwidth limited satellite. For a long time while I had my 31" CRT and basic standard cable (not STB) I noticed that the WB shows originating as HD (Smallville/Charmed) looked much better than the other channels, including some broadcast in HD from WCTV (JAG) but carried as analog on my standard cable. Most of the SD cable channels you list are carried at minimal digital specs (low bit-rate) because of limited bandwidth on the satellites, and except for the premium SD channels they are going to look no better than the better analog channels.

NBC show "Revelation" lost audio ...NBC is struggling...

Originally posted by sayanythingrock
yea i guess i will have to get an outdoor antenna, i was using an indoor jensen. but i am gonna opt for the terk outdoor one

PLEASE DON'T WASTE YOUR MONEY ON THAT TERK ANTENNA!!

If all else fails, go to lowes and buy the small outdoor channelmaster antenna. It's about $30 and it's not too big

The 16:9 / 4:3 issue would pretty much go away if these cable boxes had an output setting called (for example) "native", that just passed the signal without any scaling.
My TV would be perfectly happy accepting 960x720 4:3; it doesn't need its hand held.

Law and Order on NBC had no sound at all last night as well.

I know NBC I know. If I don't like it watch SD.

Last night on ABC, "Lost" audio was mono with no surround sound. I thought there was something wrong with my AV processor but when I switched to CBS it had 2.0 surround. "Alias" only had 2.0 surround but at least it was surround. What the F is going on with the local ABC guys. How can they have stereo surround (2.0) on one main program and not another? Let us pray these audio glitches are just growing pains and get fixed pretty soon. Did anyone else notice the same thing?

Hey, some sound is better than none....

Originally posted by mahicks
PLEASE DON'T WASTE YOUR MONEY ON THAT TERK ANTENNA!!

If all else fails, go to lowes and buy the small outdoor channelmaster antenna. It's about $30 and it's not too big

yea thats what im going to do, i am going to return that piece, it got me no where, got the same channels as with a small antenna, i even got on the roof. ill go to lowes tomorrow thanks

Originally posted by sayanythingrock
yea thats what I'm going to do, i am going to return that piece, it got me no where, got the same channels as with a small antenna, i even got on the roof. ill go to Lowe's tomorrow thanks

You'll like that antenna....once you get it on a roof or up out of the way somewhere, it will hardly be noticeable...

Please remember that the Channel Master is a Yagi type antenna and is directional.....The antenna looks kinda like this:

>>>---<-:-


The <-:- side (the side with the shorter elements, or "V", side should point to-wards the towers. Use antennaweb.org to find the orientation of the TV towers at your location. The larger elements are the VHF portion of the antenna and are not as directional as the UHF side.

Also, DO NOT WASTE YOUR MONEY ON AN AMPLIFIER...MOST of the time it will overdrive the CBS signal around this area and cause you to get a poor signal, or no signal at all on most channels.

In this area, the only way to get better signal strength is usually to use a larger/better antenna, mount the antenna higher (BEST OPTION), and use RG 6 cable instead of RG59.

Hope I've been some help to you and I hope I haven't offended anyones intelligence or anything.

-Michael

thanks

this is weird i can pick up nbc but i can't pick up abc whats the deal?
i might go back and get the big antenna for out in the sticks, i think my association is gonna kill me

abc's tower is 26.2 miles from my house uhf and the antenna i got from lowes says it can do 30 miles uhf, should i go get the huge one that goes even farther uhf or do i have to keep putting this thing higher and higher, the roof is super hot today. gonna have to wait till it cools down

Originally posted by sayanythingrock
abc's tower is 26.2 miles from my house uhf and the antenna i got from lowes says it can do 30 miles uhf, should i go get the huge one that goes even farther uhf or do i have to keep putting this thing higher and higher, the roof is super hot today. gonna have to wait till it cools down

I would expect a larger antenna to work better when weather is less than optimum. Seems to me it should give you a better margin for error, for just a few bucks more.

You have to also contend with the fact that ABC is operating their digital signal at a low level and trees have a tendency to suck up the signal.

Originally posted by FaxMan
You have to also contend with the fact that ABC is operating their digital signal at a low level and trees have a tendency to suck up the signal.


This is correct. ABC's signal absolutely sucks, it's low power, and full of harmonics (according to a well known source on another board.) as it is. I wouldn't count on picking it up with the larger antenna from Lowes', If you really want it, I'd suggest a Channel master 2 bay or 4 bay antenna. It looks like a piece of screen with bow ties on it. You can also try raising that baby up. UHF is VERY VERY directional and doesn't go through trees and such very well. You might be able to raise, or lower it a little bit to get the signal strength up. Also, you should aim your antenna directly at the ABC tower if you want to have a chance in Hell of receiving it.

Any updates as to when FOX is expected to be on comcast?

A CR at Comcast said they are "still in negotiations" and that is holding it up. So its not just a technical issue.

Originally posted by mahicks
This is correct. ABC's signal absolutely sucks, it's low power, and full of harmonics (according to a well known source on another board.) as it is. I wouldn't count on picking it up with the larger antenna from Lowes', If you really want it, I'd suggest a Channel master 2 bay or 4 bay antenna. It looks like a piece of screen with bow ties on it. You can also try raising that baby up. UHF is VERY VERY directional and doesn't go through trees and such very well. You might be able to raise, or lower it a little bit to get the signal strength up. Also, you should aim your antenna directly at the ABC tower if you want to have a chance in Hell of receiving it.

Here's a picture (http://members.aol.com/dreamworker23/100_0140.jpg) of the Channel Master 4228 UHF-only antenna at my house. I have it hooked up to a Channel Master 7777 Pre-Amp, on a Channel Master rotator.

When I first got the antenna, I had it about ten feet off the ground and could occasionally pick up WTXL-DT, though it was usually only late at night. I still get a signal on it occasionally now, though not enough to pull it in.

However, even though this is a UHF-only antenna, I can occasionally pick up WTWC-DT with it, and though I can pick up WCTV-DT at night three or four days a week, WTWC-DT is the only Tallahassee station that I get a signal on their digital channel all day long, every day. Usually anywhere between the 10-27 signal range which is not so impressive except that I live 71.8 miles away from WTWC-DT's analog tower and I assume it's either the same or more for their digital signal.

~Alan

does anyone know what mhz our comcast system is running here, i heard the best around is 750 i think?

also does anyone notice any loss of quality from comcast hd to over the air hd when watching abc or nbc?

Originally posted by Alan Gordon
Here's a picture (http://members.aol.com/dreamworker23/100_0140.jpg) of the Channel Master 4228 UHF-only antenna at my house. I have it hooked up to a Channel Master 7777 Pre-Amp, on a Channel Master rotator.

When I first got the antenna, I had it about ten feet off the ground and could occasionally pick up WTXL-DT, though it was usually only late at night. I still get a signal on it occasionally now, though not enough to pull it in.

However, even though this is a UHF-only antenna, I can occasionally pick up WTWC-DT with it, and though I can pick up WCTV-DT at night three or four days a week, WTWC-DT is the only Tallahassee station that I get a signal on their digital channel all day long, every day. Usually anywhere between the 10-27 signal range which is not so impressive except that I live 71.8 miles away from WTWC-DT's analog tower and I assume it's either the same or more for their digital signal.

~Alan

Alan,
I was extremely impressed with WTWC's DT signal this evening,even though it was a little pixillated :-) Check the link below.

http://community-2.webtv.net/GregBarker/DXPHOTOS/

I emailed the General Manager of the FOX Affiliate (WTLH) and he indicated that the delay with Comcast is the result of both technical setup issues and contract negotiations. However, he said both would be resolved "soon." I also asked them to consider sending their digital signal in the OAR, like the CBS affiliate does, as opposed to that god-awful distortoin provided by the NBC/ABC affiliates.

Neon

hd here looks really good compared to d* i think our comcast system looks really good. oh what mb/s is abc and nbc running ota?

I am glad to hear that it is not my system that loses sound for NBC. I also now have a better understanding as to why many NBC shows are in 4:3. I thought I had screwed up my projection settings.

I am excited about Fox HD. Hope it doesn't take as long as NBC. Comcast had told me back in August we would have NBC in time for the Olympics.....well, better late than never (if we could only hear it).

Does anyone know if NBC is working on the issue? Do they even know what it is?

I have spoken to Brian Sadler, who is one of the engineers at ABC/NBC that use the same transmitter, with regard to the sound problems on both. ABC is often in 2.0 instead of 5.1, and NBC has the dropouts. If you have the HD-DVR you can back up the program a few seconds and hear what was lost in the audio. But so far only NBC has this problem. Brian sounded sincerely interested in making improvements, so feel free to contact him with your feedback.

Did Brian Sadler have any opinion on ABC/NBC airing their non-HDTV programming in the "stretch" mode than in the original aspect ratio (OAR)?
Frankly, the stretch ABC is using looks awful...and I don't want to watch the standard definition...there is a reason digital programming even without HD is preferred to analog.

Neon

Not HD related but 2 new channel have been added apparently

121 D.I.Y.
DIY (http://www.diynet.com/)


122 Fine Living
Fine Living (http://www.fineliving.com/)

I did call Comcast yesterday to ask a non HD question and while on hold they had a promo about all local broadcast channels being in HD by the end of May. After I asked my question I asked about Fox since it was named in the promo, and they are still having contract issues apparently. Hopefully not much longer.

"All local broadcast channels?" In case they are not aware, WB and UPN also broadcast locally. Not that it matters now, nothing worth watching on the networks until Fall.

ABC continues to broadcast in 2.0. I need to call Mr. Sadler again.

If you don't mind, when you talk to Sadler again, ask him about ABC/NBC airing the stuff in the original aspect ratio.

Last night during the Alias finale, they were manually stretching the commericals, and then switching back to the intended HD ratio for the show. The problem was that with all this switching, they forgot to change back to the HD signal for a while, and we ended up with a non-HD transmission of Alias for 10 minutes.

If they just let the programming air in its original aspect ratio, this wouldn't happen.

I am not sure why the ABC affiliate (and NBC) is so adamant about this. After all, ESPN (who is a sister company of ABC) and has been airing HD programming for quite a while, doesn't "stretch" their non-HD programs.

Neon

Today I spoke with the head engineer, Steve Sheridan, at ABC's local station, and he confirmed the audio glitch and said they have had some equipment problems, and that storms in the area caused some of it. I also discussed with him the general opinion of viewers here being mostly unhappy with the stretched SD signals, and he seemed surprised, but said he would consider making a change. I don't know if it is up to him or upper management, but let's think positive.

Thanks.
I sent an email to him a few weeks back about the stretching, but never got a reply. Do you think additional calling would help in the OAR crusade?

Neon

Thanks.
I sent an email to him a few weeks back about the stretching, but never got a reply. Do you think additional calling would help in the OAR crusade?

Neon

Yes, I wish everyone here would call and give their opinion on the stretch issue. The number is 893-4140. Ask for Steve Sheridan, or if he is not available ask for Brian Sadler.

I noticed last night (Tuesday) that ABC audio was in 5.1 again. Mr. Sheridan confessed they did not always monitor audio closely as to whether 5.1 was being output, and he said he welcomes calls about any problems from viewers.

Anyone seen the new price structure for NFL package on DT*? It has a HD tier that's $100 more now. Once again the best loyal customers get ripped.

Good News. I just spoke with Brian Sadler at NBC/ABC about the "stretching" of the signal for non HD stuff.

He indicated that they are adjusting their equpiment so that Comcast will receive a 4:3 signal for the non HD stuff, and a 16:9 sigal for the HD content. He is expected to have that done very quickly, probably by next Monday, June 6.

Now, if we could only get FOX onto Comcast....


Neon

My wife is gonna hate you guys if you keep it up...

Good News. I just spoke with Brian Sadler at NBC/ABC about the "stretching" of the signal for non HD stuff.

He indicated that they are adjusting their equpiment so that Comcast will receive a 4:3 signal for the non HD stuff, and a 16:9 sigal for the HD content. He is expected to have that done very quickly, probably by next Monday, June 6.

Now, if we could only get FOX onto Comcast....


Neon

Outstanding - very good news. Ditto on the FOX addition, at least by football season. Now if only WB and UPN would start broadcasting in HD I would be happy.

Well, NBC and ABC quit using the stretch on SD, that's the good new. The bad news is that they using that awful zoom that PBS uses. I tuned into the tennis matches over the week and could not tell what the score was because the top and bottom of the screen was chopped off and the top half the score was missing. The zoom also blows up the imperfections in the SD signal. I wish they would just go to the 4:3 oar with the bars on the side.

No kidding. This isn't any better. I will call over there tomorrow and find out if this is just a temporary thing or if they are just trying to piss off people.

Neon

Yep...it's even worse. Feel pretty steamed about it myself...

Looked FINE before.

Ok--just got off the phone with Brian Sadler again.
Here is what he told me.

Right now, they are broadcasting a 14:9 signal, which is characterized by their parent company (Sinclair) as a happy medium between a stretched signal and a 4:3 signal. Comcast, however, may be doing some additional stretching or zooming beyond what is being broadcast OTA--he wasn't sure what Comcast was doing. I mentioned that because of the "zooming", you can't see the score boxes for some sporting events, and he better brace himself for irate phone calls once football season starts. He agreed that would be an issue.

They are still working with their equipment to get things "better", and though no time frame was indicated, my impression was this is a relatively high priority item that they work on every day. I talked about how the CBS affiliate managed to have a 4:3 signal for the non-HD stuff and a 16:9 signal for the HD stuff, and he seemed to agree that was the ideal, but their equipment couldn't do that right now. Not sure why, but then again, I'm not an engineer.

He also mentioned that they have 3 groups they are trying to satisfy with respect to their broadcast signal:
1) Those receiving a digital signal, through comcast, but don't have an HDTV set--a 16:9 signal doesn't help these persons, apparently.
2) Those receiving a digital signal, through comcast, with an HDTV set.
3) Those receiving a digital signal OTA, with an HD set.

Obviously, everyone in this forum probably falls into groups 2 or 3, most of them in group 2. And while I think that is the group that deserves the highest priority on this issue (I mean, even people who get some HD stuff OTA also use a cable box for ESPN-HD, Discovery HD, etc., right?), only if you call them and let them know your preferences will they be able to make the correct decisions. The number is 893-4140.

Neon

Why worry about group No. 1? They can be dismissed because they can get ABC in 4:3 on cable channel 7, even using the digital decoder. They should not even be watching cable ch. 180. Or, if they are smart they will split the signal and get a better PQ on analog ch. 7.

Right now, they are broadcasting a 14:9 signal, which is characterized by their parent company (Sinclair) as a happy medium between a stretched signal and a 4:3 signal.

That's like going out with both girlfriends on the same night cause you think it'll make them both happy.

FWIW, could me in group 3 (w/ no comcast due to $) and yes, it looks just as bad OTA as I'm sure it does via comcast.

Came home tonight and both ABC and NBC were in 4:3 with the black bars on the side in SD. Much better picture.

It's amazing how quick something can get done with the people on this forum.

Thanks, NeonDeion for contacting the station.

I noticed that too, and when Law and Order came on, it switched over to HD without problems.

The only issue I noticed is that the volume was really, really low. But I can deal with that, given the improvements they've made.

Neon

Yea, nice work Neon. Are we really on the verge of having most of the major networks available OTA and by cable in HD in Tallahassee?

Next up we'll have to work on Comcast to get ESPN2 HD.

I'm going to give the Spielberg TNT "Into the West" thing a go this weekend. It's six weeks/episodes long so it will be almost football time when it's over.

I think we are getting close to having all the locals up. Nobody knows for sure what is going on with Fox (WTLH) and Comcast. I have an email out to the station GM, but haven't heard back yet--he is usually good at returning emails however, though the answers are usually vague.

People should call the engineering over at NBC/ABC and let them know how much you like this new format. They really do appreciate and welcome feedback, especially when it isn't a complaint. Ask for Brian Sadler, the phone # can be found earlier in the thread.

Neon

FOX will be great for FB in HD, but I don't watch any of their regular programming. Other than for FB, I would rather see WB and UPN in HD. The question I have is why are we not getting any satellite channels in HD, like SciFi? I am pretty sure they broadcast in HD.

I just spoke with Mike Brown, the engineer at WTLH. He said the HD equipment is on order, and should get there in 3 to 4 weeks. Once it arrives, it will take 3-4 days to get it installed and up and running. The link to comcast (fiber optic cable) is all set up and ready to go, as are contractual issues. So, look for FOX HD on comcast sometime by mid-July.

Neon

p.s. I may be wrong, but I have never heard of SciFi broadcasting in HD. What Comcast is doing on a national basis is starting to switch all their analog channels to a digital broadcast (called digital simulcast). That has happened in Tallahassee yet, but should happen sometime this year. That will improve the picture quality of those channels, and free up bandwith for comcast to offer other items, be it additional HD channels, VOIP, etc.

[QUOTE=NeonDeion]I just spoke with Mike Brown, the engineer at WTLH. He said the HD equipment is on order, and should get there in 3 to 4 weeks. Once it arrives, it will take 3-4 days to get it installed and up and running. The link to comcast (fiber optic cable) is all set up and ready to go, as are contractual issues. So, look for FOX HD on comcast sometime by mid-July.QUOTE]

Is this equipment you're referencing only for the Comcast link, or will it also boost Fox's OTA signal strength? I can get all the other networks OTA fine, but obviously no Fox at this point, and would love to have OTA fox NFL in HD this fall...

What Comcast is doing on a national basis is starting to switch all their analog channels to a digital broadcast (called digital simulcast). That has happened in Tallahassee yet, but should happen sometime this year. That will improve the picture quality of those channels, and free up bandwith for comcast to offer other items, be it additional HD channels, VOIP, etc.

Not sure I understand this. Switching all analog to digital would require everyone who does not already have one to use a digital tuner/cable box. Also, I don't think that will necessarily improve PQ, since poor quality analog usually looks worse when digitized.

As for the Scifi channel, I thought some of their stuff was HD, but I may be wrong. How can a major broadcaster such as Scifi not be already digital?