Has anyone else noticed horrible aliasing with curves in the picture? Any round objects (example - planets and storm trooper helmets in star wars) are incredibely jagged along the edges. It's worse than any other DVD player I've ever seen.

This is on an X1, calibrated with Avia. It looks awful and is horribly distracting to me. It's upconverted to 1080i, although it is just as noticable in every resolution, including 480p (which looks worse than even cheap 480p players).

I've tried messing with various settings, and I'm using firmware 4.3 if it matters. Nothing seems to help it one bit. Has anyone else experienced this? Any possible solutions/workarounds?

Originally posted by ttaudiott
What I have:
Plasma 50" HD Panny TH-P50HD5UY.

I am very tempted to buy a 318, using its component connection.

Any people with positive or negative experience?

Negative

Lots of macroblocking in black areas.

My local Zenith dealer cannot guarantee me I will get the older version that will upconvert over component. Where can I buy online that will guarantee I will get the older version, without a re-stocking fee if they are wrong? Is this a good match for the X1 projector? I'm currently using the Philips Q50 DVD player(with Faroudja). Thanks for any input.

Originally posted by Jim McC
My local Zenith dealer cannot guarantee me I will get the older version that will upconvert over component. Where can I buy online that will guarantee I will get the older version, without a re-stocking fee if they are wrong? Is this a good match for the X1 projector? I'm currently using the Philips Q50 DVD player(with Faroudja). Thanks for any input.

I would suggest calling Gochnauer's. I don't have their number, but you can find it at the beginning of this thread. They check their units and know what we are talking about if you specifically ask if it is the old firmware.

They have great customer service too. I just got mine, and love it.

Originally posted by Marco33
Negative

Lots of macroblocking in black areas.

Macro33,

I am no expert, but I do have a dvb318 and Hitachi 51s715 CRT RPTV, and I did notice balck mocroblocking in the space scenes of Episode IV. However, i suspected that this was due to me having the brightness too low. I have the unit connected over component cables, and using DVE I can see that this setup does indeed show the "blacker than black" bar on a test pattern for brightness. The Samsung 841 over DVI I was using before did not show this bar. Therefore, and I may be wrong, but I suggest that this macroblocking is due to the brightness being too low (mine is for a couple of films despite DVE calibration, not much, just a couple of %, but enough to make a difference). If the brightness is too low, then wouldn't everything below a threshold show up as the blackest black the tv can display? In that case, upping the brightness should help with this issue, since it would essentially put every black in a range that can be displayed differently (and not have a group of black levels that are displayed identicaly). I have not thoroughly tested this, but i did increase brightness from 53 to 56, and I no longer noticed the problem. Like I said though, I did not test two identical scenes like this (I will soon) so I can't say for sure this solves the problem. What do you think?

Originally posted by skro
I would suggest calling Gochnauer's. I don't have their number, but you can find it at the beginning of this thread. They check their units and know what we are talking about if you specifically ask if it is the old firmware.

They have great customer service too. I just got mine, and love it.

I don't know about great customer service I have had nothing but problems with them. i found out they lost my order because I emailed asking why I didn't get a tracking number and they said they have nothing with my name on record. So I called back again and gave the information which I then emailed to ask if the internet department got it and they did and said it went out yesterday yet I have no tracking number to speak for it. I hate companies that don't keep in touch with people once they get your money. I feel like I am being ripped off.

Well chalk up another new one in the Dec 2003 build date column. It did have a QC issue though. I heard something rattling around inside and it turned out one of the four screws that hold the transport mechanism in place was the culprit. Nothing a screwdriver didnt take care of.

Also, as coincidence would have it, I'd been previously using a simple Zenith DVB312 that someone let me borrow a while ago when the iScan I'd been using for a few years with an interlace player bit the dust. Both the 312 and the 318 use the same OSD when first turned on. On the 312 even in Progressive mode there's a good bit of smearing around the letters like in "Zenith" (even though the PQ on the DVD's themselves wasnt all that "bad"). On the 318 that screen is much crisper even in 480p and of course sharper still in 1080i.

Now need to find some time to watch actual movies and not just look at OSD's. ;)

Originally posted by skro
I would suggest calling Gochnauer's. I don't have their number, but you can find it at the beginning of this thread. They check their units and know what we are talking about if you specifically ask if it is the old firmware.

They have great customer service too. I just got mine, and love it.

Thanks, I just ordered one from Paul yesterday. Told me that it still has the upconverting capability.

Don't know the manufacturing date until I get it.

;)

Originally posted by mallu2u
Anyone got a Zenith where upconversion through component was disabled (due to new firmware)? I have never read that myself. Bought was BB and that had it working. Just curious.

anyone on above?

For those of you who got X1, where did you buy the cable adaptor from component input to VESA (computer monitor type) output?

I did not see this adaptor in the X1 box and could not seem to be able to locate a place which sells this thing cheap.

Appreciate your input!

I purchased the cable directly through infocus, as an add-on for the X1. It may not be the cheapest, but it's at least an officially compatible cable with gauranteed quality.

This is the official link (http://store.infocus.com/escalate/store/DetailPage?pls=infocus&bc=infocus&pc=SP-VESA-ADPT&clist=017080322b69:017080322b6b:&tab=desc)

On a related note, does anyone have any comments on the jagged and aliased edges that show up when viewing in 1080i? Is everyone else just seeing smooth edges on various shapes? Diagonal lines all look like a composition of straight lines stacked one on top of the other in a descending order.

Example:

--
.--
..--

Domino--No alias of any kind on 100 inch CRT. Complete full up test patterns to 540 horiz line at 1080i and 6.75 MHz full response (10 MHz bandwidth plus). 720 down about 20%.
Gochnauer service and response 100%. They are shipping DEC 2003 build date with identical software to MAR 2004. Hack it to region free easily.

Ordered from Amazon, shipped 9/21 from KY, arrived 9/23. Manf. date is 12/03 and component upconversion works well.

I haven't seen any jagged/aliased lines so far, although I have a CRT so YMMV. I have noticed that the dark areas look darker than I'm used to, even as the remaining black bars are brighter(?!). Otherwise a very nice picture; I can finally "retire" my TV's non-3:2 line doubler...

Is anyone using the 318 with X1 projector? I'm currently using a Philips Q50 DVD player(with Faroudja) hooked up to VGA/component input of X1, and was wondering if the 318 would give me a better image? If improvement would be very slight I probably won't bother. I do know the X1 looks great with 720p and 1080i HD. Thanks for any input.

Originally posted by Jim McC
Is anyone using the 318 with X1 projector? I'm currently using a Philips Q50 DVD player(with Faroudja) hooked up to VGA/component input of X1, and was wondering if the 318 would give me a better image? If improvement would be very slight I probably won't bother. I do know the X1 looks great with 720p and 1080i HD. Thanks for any input.

I seen a big difference with the 318 compared to my Denon DVM 1805. I also noticed a sound improvement. With the X1 I can center the screen fine. I am very happy with this unit. In fact I have two.
;)

Hi guys,

I cannot get the DVI-output from the DVB318 to work on my Sanyo HT32744 at all.

My player has the March 2004 firmware and works over the components just fine, but if I use a DVI-to-HDMI cable or the included DVI-cable with a Monster DVI-to-HDMI adapter, the darn thing locks up right away at the "HELLO" screen and needs to be unplugged.

If I start the player unhooked to the television then plug it in after the player initializes and says "NO DISC", the same thing happens: it immediately freezes and won't respond to input until I pull the plug on it.

Reading back in this monster thread I guess some other people have been having this problem with the player as well; has anybody figured out a workaround? I emailed Zenith's customer service but given their track record as far as support is concerned, I'm not planning on getting a response anytime soon and my RMA deadline is drawing close.

Thanks!

Same here. I have the HT30744. I still think the problem is with the Zenith 318 as it has HDCP handshake problem with some Mits, Toshiba models as well. And the list is growing. Most importantly, the damn player should not freeze up when the handshake fails. That alone tells me that the Zenith HDCP portion of the firmware is not up to the standard.
Like you, I received no response from Zenith.

Originally posted by ezekiel2517
Hi guys,

I cannot get the DVI-output from the DVB318 to work on my Sanyo HT32744 at all.

...

Thanks!

Have the same problem with my Zenith 318.

Monster dvi-hdmi cable to Panasonic 42PX20U.

Freezes at the HELLO screen.

Absolutely no problem over component. (Dec 2003 build)

GOT MINE FRIDAY 9/24. RIPPED OPEN THE PACKAGE TO MAKE SURE I GOT THE OLD SCHOOL zenith. The build is december 2003. so everybody can still get this amazing player!

No offense, but this is not the kind of post that should be in a FAQS thread. Aw, who'm I kidding at this point?

New owner (Dec 2003 build) has questions...

What's the problems w/ the build date I have (I don't have the patience to sift thru this thread)?

Should I skip the DVI since my tv only has a HDMI & I'd have to buy an adapter (& possible problems result)?

My Dish DVR has a grounded plug, will I have loop problems if using digital coax & component? What if DVR wasn't grounded???

Originally posted by Prozakk
New owner (Dec 2003 build) has questions...

What's the problems w/ the build date I have (I don't have the patience to sift thru this thread)?

None. You should have full run upconversion over DVI and component.



Should I skip the DVI since my tv only has a HDMI & I'd have to buy an adapter (& possible problems result)?

Only if you try component, calibrate it, and find that it's lacking or has flaws.



My Dish DVR has a grounded plug, will I have loop problems if using digital coax & component? What if DVR wasn't grounded???

Grounded = good. You should be fine.

I have a Toshiba 52HM84 and will be getting the DVB318 in the mail very soon. I am expecting to be able to use the components with full upconversion, but might consider using the HDMI/DVI interface.

Does anyone have a good source of a resonably priced DVI to HDMI cable?

Does anyone actually use the DVB318 with a Toshiba 52HM84 ?

If so - how does it perform?

Thanks,

Mario

If anyone was having problems with the X1 and jagged edges (which it seems I was the only one), try switching the DVD player to 16:9 output, and the X1 to 16:9 display. that fixed it for me, and didn't mess up the picture in any other way (stretching, etc). It doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me why this would be necessary, but now that it works, I won't complain. =)

Granted it's been week or two since I last viewed my regular 480p player on the X1, but I don't notice a gigantic difference in PQ. It's there, but not jaw droppingly huge. Maybe I'll hook them up together tonight and do a compare/contrast. My advice - upgrade if you have a 480i player, or if your 480p isn't giving you a great picture. If you plan on upgrading your projector within a year or two, it might be a good idea as well. That way you'll have a good player as soon as you upgrade (although this might be counterintuitive depending on how much prices go down over time).

As always, just my intial opinion.

Update 9-27.

Wild West Electronics no longer carries the 318.

Got mine today from Amazon. 12/03 build. :)

Anyone have the Mac DMP image? It's not on the site referenced by the FAQs anymore. I can do a PC disc burn, but only at work. I'd rather just do the Ma cimage directly.

Originally posted by bruman
some of you guys should read the manual and 2 inserts the Zenith came with. it clearly states in the manual and on 2 Attention slips(one yellow and one white) that this player does 1080i on both DVI and Component outs.

I don't know why some people are saying the things they are saying but Zenith has made it very clear what it does over component and yes that includes 1080i and 720p.

my instruction's don't say anywhere that it is reduced to 480p if 720p or 1080i is selected. it says just the opposite.

also anyone can tell just by looking at the picture and selecting through the settings what 480p and 1080i looks like. there is no mistake.

What about the difference between 720p and1080i?

I'm trying to figure out how to tell the difference because so far I cannot.

Actually 3-prong "grounded" can = bad. You might have ground loop problems.

I solved mine with a $6 widget (DC blocker and Ground Loop Isolator) stuck on the end of the coax cable. You can also use one of those 3-prong adapters (or just take cutters and lop off the 3rd prong) but that isn't exactly recommended...

maple--The 720p upconversion on component output is down around 20% in resolution from the 1080i which is clearly superior over all other modes.
The 6.75 MHz disapears and the horizontal line response drops to below 500 lines.

I guess what my question is: If I were of the the ones that had the new (non-upconverting via component) filmware, how would I confirm that this would be indeed the case.

Would I solely use my eyes to verify this (the picture quality difference between 720p and 1080i) or is there a numerical or otherwise definite way to go about it?

My build date was December 2003 although I still cannot make out the difference "picure quality-wise"

Thanks, Vince

Ordered 318 from Amazon, I got a Oct. 6-7 delivery date with the free shipping. I hope it will be here sooner, since the Amazon warehouse is just 20 or so miles down the road. If component upconversion is locked it will be going straight back since that is the only reason I ordered it.

Originally posted by Maple Red
I guess what my question is: If I were of the the ones that had the new (non-upconverting via component) filmware, how would I confirm that this would be indeed the case.

Would I solely use my eyes to verify this (the picture quality difference between 720p and 1080i) or is there a numerical or otherwise definite way to go about it?

My build date was December 2003 although I still cannot make out the difference "picure quality-wise"

Thanks, Vince

Well, if your eyes dont tell you, might your monitor indicate the type signal it's receiving? What type of monitor do you use?

On my PJ when I change inputs or resolutions (like as in using the Upconvert button on the 318) a graphic comes up on the screen for a moment indicating 480p, 720p, 1080i etc. So whether I would otherwise be able to tell the difference or not.. it knows the difference. ;)

has anyone had a picture stability problem like BayAreaML posted about above? i have the same tv - Mitsubishi WT42311 - as him and 1080i from the 318 looks great except for the top 2-3 inches of the screen wavering and skewing to one side. any possible fixes or is it just a tv compatibility issue?

Ordered mine from Amazon yesterday and recieved it today. Picture looks great on my Panny PT-300U. It is a Dec. build and upconversion works via component. I do see a small white band about 20 pixels long in the top left corner, in 1080i mode. If I switch to 720P or 480P it goes away. Back in 1080 it stays. Is there any way to get rid of this? I tried switching resolutions and turning power off and it still comes back in 1080i.

I ordered a 318 today from Amazon. Since there's no way to indicate a Dec 03 mfg date, are there any markings on the outside of the box that would indicate the date?

You have to look at the back of the unit. You will see a sticker there. Also, my white band went away. Hopefully they just pop up once and a while. Picture looks awesome!

Originally posted by gtv
Ordered mine from Amazon yesterday and recieved it today. Picture looks great on my Panny PT-300U. It is a Dec. build and upconversion works via component. I do see a small white band about 20 pixels long in the top left corner, in 1080i mode. If I switch to 720P or 480P it goes away. Back in 1080 it stays. Is there any way to get rid of this? I tried switching resolutions and turning power off and it still comes back in 1080i.

My Z 318 is connected to an Infocus SP4805. I also had a white band on the top left corner which drives me crazy.

I was able to fix it by switching my components cables and check the contacts and play with the overscan control on my SP 4805. This might work for you.

;)

Yeah,I also have the 318 and panny 300,just go into the 300's menu and adjust it upward a few ticks until you no longer see the white line in the left corner,what a great picture,Starwars looks incredible!!! I am just thrilled at the picture quality of this combination!!! Jim

GTV you have to power down the 318 and power it up in the mode you wish to use. Then it will have no little white line. If you switch into 1080i while the unit is on you will get the line most times.

maybe this is the best place to ask it:

To what extent does the firmware update resolve the white crush over DVI: not at all, by 50%, 80% or 100%. In the first post of this thread, one casual reader would assume it doesn't.

Just how many people did the test ? Is IslandGuy the only one ?!?!? He stated in the monster thread that the fix will indeed fix the white crush.

I own it right now but couldn't care less about the component connection as I have a 4805 PJ that's DVI-HDCP enabled.

Just a quick overview...I am using a Tosh 51h83 Tv DVB 318 via DVI and I have noticed the black crush issuess...will the go away if I use componet video or deal with it...Do I need to update the firmware/?
Dave

I've been using the component connections and I still get the black microblocking myself. I'll be throwing this thing up on the bay. Waste of money.

Originally posted by Marco33
I've been using the component connections and I still get the black microblocking myself. I'll be throwing this thing up on the bay. Waste of money.

Had the same problem. Sent mine back to Amazon for a full refund.

If you want to watch 4:3 material (old movies) in OAR you have to watch in 480p correct?

I was watching X-men 2 last night upconverted to 1080 i over component and noticed grain/shimmering (is that what white crush is?) in scenes where there is a lot of white (snow). Not sure what to make of it. This is on the new Pannasonic 50" DLP set.

Finally, I have a Hometheatre Master MX 500 remote. The FF/RW on the LG remote is a wheel not a button. Is there a way to have the MX500 "learn" that???

Any body have luck getting rid of white verticle line in upper left hand corner w/ 1080i and Sanyo Z1?

Search turned up a few hits, no answers, someone who got rid of 318 in favor of mom880

tia

See my post on the previous page about the white line. If you switch to 1080i you get the line. Power down the player and bring it up in 1080i without switching and you won't have the line.

Originally posted by eXcentris
If you want to watch 4:3 material (old movies) in OAR you have to watch in 480p correct? Correct.

This is one thing I hope they would change in a firmware revision. Have the player detect when it's showing 4:3 material and then either insert black or grey (maybe user-selectable) vertical bars on the sides to fill out the rest of the 16:9 frame.

And while you're at it LG, please add a special zoom mode for non-anamorphic widescreen material that stretches it properly automatically, instead of us having to eyeball it! My tv won't stretch/zoom the pic if it's receiving an HD signal.

As if they're listening to this post! Heh.

You guys all have display problems not related to 318 performance. There ain't no "black crush" or "black microblocking" or "gray shimmering" or "aliasing". Wow -- talk about paranoidal response to very nice electronic DVD player design that beats all at a reasonable price. Tell me what is any better at 1080i--there ain't nuthin'.

gil (in Seattle)

Gil, that's not correct.

There is a well known and documented digitizing artifact problem that the 318 has as well as a well known white crush issue over DVI. I have a CRT tube set, so I don't even have the excuse of "too sensitive/new technology."

The player certainly is better over DVI than component.

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-bin/shootout.cgi?function=search&articles=all&type=&manufacturer=53&maxprice=0&deInt=0&mpeg=0

Here are some highlights for you.

318 over DVI:



As always the Faroudja chip performed extremely well in all of our tests. It did fail the 2-2 Cadence test showing that the filter is not activated in the Faroudja chip.

Unfortunately the rest of the testing did not go as well.

No big deal, but tell me if this next section sounds familliar:



This player has a lot of issues in its core performance.

Yes, it sure as hell does.



It has some very severe pixel cropping in all resolutions, with up to 15 pixels being cropped from the right side of the image. There are also various amounts of Y/C delay when using the component outputs.

The 1080i resolution did the best in this respect with only about 5ns of Y/C delay, but the other resolutions showed at least a full pixel of delay.

The other resolutions are downright piss poor and almost unuseable outright. I know plenty of $50 Pro Scan players that have better pictures than the 480p and 720p out of this unit.


White levels for all output resolutions were on the hot side, varying from 102 to 104 IRE.

This is the red push/green undersaturation problem.


The player did pass blacker then black though as well as breezing through our chroma tests.

On the DVI side things are also a bit amiss. There seems to be some Y/C delay on all output resolutions but 1080i. Thankfully though, the DVI output still passes blacker than black, which is a shortcoming with a lot of DVI based players out there.

Like most of the inexpensive DVI DVD players out there, this one definitely has its issues. I love the fact that it uses the Faroudja chip and allows for scaleable resolutions via component, but the analog section needs some work. Hopefully Zenith can improve on the design with future models.

Not too bad at a $160, but this certainly proves your general dismissal of people's problems as incorrect. I WISH it were just all people's displays.


But we're not finished yet. Wait until you see what a mess component video is on this unit.

This test makes my point very well for me. About all this player can do right is 1080i over DVI, but even that's not rock solid. At $160, a lot of this is very forgiveable and the 1080i picture I get over DVI is quite nice.

But it is there and it's not all due to people's displays. Read that whole test and look at those figures over both DVI and component.

About all this thing is worth is $160. It shows. It's an excellent value/entry level upconverting player. That's all it is. I'm glad I have it and I enjoy it, but it has enough shortcomings for me, even on an HD CRT tube TV, like the layer change, that are making me save up money and getting to upgrade now vs. waiting for HD-DVD.

I'll be saving this as a my region free toy in a worst case scenario. ;) Hi-rez audio is summoning me... :p

Interesting read 'Q'. Odd, I was under the impression that because people were complaining about the white crush problem over DVI, that it performed better over component and that people bought it for it's upconversion capabilities over component.

I have mine over component now on the Panny DLP and, aside from the slight problem I noticed in X-Men 2 in white areas, I think the picture looks great. But I see absolutely no difference between 720p and 1080i. Is there a noticeable difference over DVI?

Originally posted by RobRoy
See my post on the previous page about the white line. If you switch to 1080i you get the line. Power down the player and bring it up in 1080i without switching and you won't have the line.
thanks, but that technique doesn't seem to work with my Z1. Must be an issue with the PJ. :sigh:

Q of Bandit--Thanks for the summary. Nothing in the complete review changes my observation that the 318 DID NOT CAUSE most of the recently identified (display) probems in this thread. I refer only to the 1080i and component output. It is still the best thing around without competition at that price and probably all the way to $1000. The most serious thing might be a few missed pixels (my display is CRT at 100 inch) and possibly y/c delay errors which I cannot find as excessive at any level using AVIA calibrator. Easily hacked to region free makes this one a big winner. I doubt that you will ever see any better performing unit until HD or Blu Ray show up--and then with higher DVD prices and heavy security to boot. I do not intend to buy all my titles (1400) again. The Zenith (with over 10 MHz bandwidth will produce EVERYTHING ON THE DVD with unparalleled ability.

Originally posted by eXcentris
Finally, I have a Hometheatre Master MX 500 remote. The FF/RW on the LG remote is a wheel not a button. Is there a way to have the MX500 "learn" that??? I don't know of any way to get the full jog-dial functionality out of it; however, I can tell you how I got mine to FF at 16x. The key is to start turning the dial before you press the key on the mx500 (in learning mode, of course). I actually pointed the original remote at the player so I could see that it was FFing at the desired rate (turning it all the way FFs at 100x, which is faster than I normally want), then put the mx500 in front of it. If you're really good you can set it up so both devices see the beam, and you don't have to move anything around...

Originally posted by dcheesi
I don't know of any way to get the full jog-dial functionality out of it; however, I can tell you how I got mine to FF at 16x. The key is to start turning the dial before you press the key on the mx500 (in learning mode, of course). I actually pointed the original remote at the player so I could see that it was FFing at the desired rate (turning it all the way FFs at 100x, which is faster than I normally want), then put the mx500 in front of it. If you're really good you can set it up so both devices see the beam, and you don't have to move anything around...

Thanks a bunch, I'll give that a try although I'm not sure if I prefer 4x or 16x. I wish there was something in between like 8x. Oh well...

Originally posted by Q of BanditZ
This test makes my point very well for me. About all this player can do right is 1080i over DVI, but even that's not rock solid. At $160, a lot of this is very forgiveable and the 1080i picture I get over DVI is quite nice.

So Q: did you apply the firmware "upgrade/downgrade/fix" ? If not, why ??? Guess you read that update (read the entire second post from Michael TLV)

Originally posted by dcheesi
I don't know of any way to get the full jog-dial functionality out of it; however, I can tell you how I got mine to FF at 16x. The key is to start turning the dial before you press the key on the mx500 (in learning mode, of course). I actually pointed the original remote at the player so I could see that it was FFing at the desired rate (turning it all the way FFs at 100x, which is faster than I normally want), then put the mx500 in front of it. If you're really good you can set it up so both devices see the beam, and you don't have to move anything around...

I have the same remote and that's how I got it to work (I stopped at 4x). I also used this same method with the Sony touchscreen remote as well.

Hi, newbie to the thread. After reading through all your posts, and finding out that the new 318 (september builds) doesn't have upconversion anymore, why was it removed? is there a legal reason? or something else? Also I'm wondering if anybody compared the zentih/lg to other upconversion dvd players like the samsung for example. are all upconversion dvd players the same in video quality that uses the dcdi farouja chip? I'm a bit confused on that matter. What makes zenith's upconversion aiblities so special since there are other upconversion dvd players around the same price(i can only think of the samsung 841/941 offhand)? I apologize if this is in the wrong thread, but any info is appreciated. I have a december 2003 build of the 318 and i'm using a 34xbr960 with upconversion over component and it looks absolutely stunning. it's like 100% better than my old sony 7700 dvd player (which i paid $650 for three years ago).

Originally posted by Cricricri
So Q: did you apply the firmware "upgrade/downgrade/fix" ? If not, why ??? Guess you read that update (read the entire second post from Michael TLV)

I've advised everyone to not bother with that firmware. We have mixed opinoins as to whether it even fixes the minor white crush issue over DVI. We do know that it seriously bothces the component upconversion.

The only way I'd say give it a shot is if you can have a way to reset the player if you don't like it and you don't care about ever using the component video.

Joey:

Hi, newbie to the thread. After reading through all your posts, and finding out that the new 318 (september builds) doesn't have upconversion anymore, why was it removed? is there a legal reason?

Yes, and a stupid one at that.


Also I'm wondering if anybody compared the zentih/lg to other upconversion dvd players like the samsung for example.

www.hometheaterhifi.com Hit the DVD Benchmark shootout near the bottom. Click the link, scroll down past the credits and you'll see some links for the tests.

Long story short, the Zenith arguably, at this low price range, is one of the best players of these types. It is also one of the few mainstream brands that offered (note past tense now) component upconversion. This will no longer be so with any new pressings of this model...or any other mainstream brand ever again. Component video upconversion is dead.



are all upconversion dvd players the same in video quality that uses the dcdi farouja chip?

At this price range, more or less, yes.


What makes zenith's upconversion aiblities so special since there are other upconversion dvd players around the same price(i can only think of the samsung 841/941 offhand)?

Well...they just happened to do a better job with some things. The Secrets site and some others here can give you a more technically sound description than that. It's really pretty nitpicky at this level. :p


I apologize if this is in the wrong thread, but any info is appreciated. I have a december 2003 build of the 318 and i'm using a 34xbr960 with upconversion over component and it looks absolutely stunning. it's like 100% better than my old sony 7700 dvd player (which i paid $650 for three years ago).

I'm actually surprised to hear this. The XBR960's own upscaling and such should easily BLOW away anything the Zenith could do. I'd let that TV handle all the chores and trade out that Zenith for an awesome pro scan player myself, but if you love what ya see, more power to ya!

That's an ungodly TV you have. I think you have the best TV on the market right now. *bows*

But Q, since the player is operating on a pure digital signal (before sending over component), and the TV would be working on an analog component signal, wouldn't the Zenith have an advantage in that regard? The sooner in the chain the upconversion takes place, the better, right?

Quick question: I went to Amazon looking for the DVB318 and I of course found it for a price a little higher than I wanted . BUT, there was a guy there selling it used at substantial savings. I emailed him to find out if had the original firmware as I'm ONLY interested in component upconversion. Of course he didnt know but I took a chance and ordered it anyway. Here's the thing, is there anyone out there that had recently ordered and received this player from Amazon? And if so, what build date have you received? I saw a couple of earlier posts that said they got December builds ( I'm hoping for that!) Has anyone recieved the newer firmware? ........Its HARD to even find this player now a days, and I agree, there will no more made ANYwhere with component 1080i upconversion. This Zenith is destined to become a classic! I just wanna see this baby on my Z2!

I bought one from Amazon and received it Monday. It's a 12/2003 build.

Thanks mrwilson!...thats encouraging! Now , does anyone want to share their experiences with this player on a Z2 pj? Or on any wxga pj? I'd appreciate the feedback!

Originally posted by jadon1
Quick question: I went to Amazon looking for the DVB318 and I of course found it for a price a little higher than I wanted . BUT, there was a guy there selling it used at substantial savings. I emailed him to find out if had the original firmware as I'm ONLY interested in component upconversion. Of course he didnt know but I took a chance and ordered it anyway. Here's the thing, is there anyone out there that had recently ordered and received this player from Amazon? And if so, what build date have you received? I saw a couple of earlier posts that said they got December builds ( I'm hoping for that!) Has anyone recieved the newer firmware? ........Its HARD to even find this player now a days, and I agree, there will no more made ANYwhere with component 1080i upconversion. This Zenith is destined to become a classic! I just wanna see this baby on my Z2!

So far, all the Amazon 318s have been December 2003 builds from the looks of this thread. I got mine last week and it had the orignal firmware.

BUT, if you're buying from one of the Amazon used/new sellers, those don't come from Amazon.com stock. So there no guarentee that they will be a particlar firmware since they can come from many different sources. Bsically treat these third party sellers like ebay... buyer beware.

i got a march 03 build from amazon about a month ago, which of course still does upconversion.

has ANYONE gotten a later build yet? (sorry, havne't been keeping up with this thread super carefully lately, just canning for updates on the macroblocking in dark scenes issue...)

Just received mine today (Oct 6) from Amazon. It does have the Dec. 2003 build date:D

Good catch, you're gonna love it.

Originally posted by jadon1
Now , does anyone want to share their experiences with this player on a Z2 pj? Or on any wxga pj? I'd appreciate the feedback!

I have a Z2 and 318 connected via DVI at 1080i, and am quite happy with it. I HAVE seen the known problems - white crush (only using a test DVD) and image cropping. But, if you can get past these things, and just watch the movie, it's a great combination.

Personally, I think the image cropping (which happens over both component and DVI) is a much bigger problem than the white crush. It's especially troubling when you have multiple sources. Initially, I had only the 318, but have since added an SA 8000HD set top box (via Component). The signal from the STB fills the entire screen, whereas the signal from the 318 does not.

When I only had the one source, I used the zoom and lens shift to get the image to fill the screen. But, with two sources and a ceiling mounted PJ, this is less practical.

Hope this helps.

-Gabe

Gabe, or anyone. Maybe I'm misundertanding. With the pixel crop issue, you mean to say that an otherwise perfectly aimed image form the projector has to be altered based on the source? I can understand using zoom to fill the screen, but the lens shift is a physical alteration. How can physically altering the lens solve a pixel cropping issue? Isnt that a fault with how the source is displaying the image? Also, does anyone have this issue over component? (when connected to a Z2)

Also, on a separate issue, are the July builds (on the 318) the official first batch that do not do component upconversion? This seems to be the fact since I've read in earlier posts that December and March builds are fine. Thanks to anyone who can shed some light on this!!

Apparently (best as I can discern), through March '04 builds are still OK.
My concern also; and G* e-mailed confirmation their next batch (due mid-Oct.) will STILL do the upcon via comp. (I want it NOW!!)

Anybody experience any video lag with the 318 over DVI?

Come on, guys.

318 is ONLY good for 1080i over compomnent
If you want any other resulotion or output, go with something else.

The macroblocking is a nature occurence when upconverting to HD. It is a form of artifact. Try adjusting the brightness level
on the monitor, it will not fix the problem, but it will improve it.

Originally posted by jadon1
With the pixel crop issue, you mean to say that an otherwise perfectly aimed image form the projector has to be altered based on the source? I can understand using zoom to fill the screen, but the lens shift is a physical alteration. How can physically altering the lens solve a pixel cropping issue? Isnt that a fault with how the source is displaying the image? Also, does anyone have this issue over component? (when connected to a Z2)


When I installed my projector, I adjusted the zoom and lens shift such that the "blue screen" produced when there is no input signal completely filled my screen. Typically, this is the way you want to have the projector set up. IE: Set it, and forget it.

This configuration works fine with my cable STB, which generates a correctly formatted 1280x720 (or 1920x1080i) signal. What I mean by "correctly formatted" is that not only is the signal timing correct, but also that the image information occupies the entire defined area within this signal.

I believe that this is where the 318 pixel cropping takes place - the timing of the signal that it generates is fine, but the image information carried in that signal does not completely fill the specified image area. This is apparent on both the base dvb318 screen, as well as when a DVD is being played. As you say, it is a fault with the source.

So, with the projector adjusted as stated above, with the 318 as an image source, there is a border on the top, bottom, and right of the image area that SHOULD be active but isn't. On my 92" screen, I would say this border is around 1", but I have not actually measured it. Assuming that it's an inch, there are about 16 pixels on the right edge of the screen that are not filled.

When my only image source was the 318, the easiest way to compensate for this was to use the lens shift and zoom to make the image fill the screen. This also resulted in the "dotted white line" at the top right of the screen getting shifted into the black border of my screen.

With the addition of the STB, I have changed things around so that my lens settings are somewhere in between ideal, and what I had for the 318.

I'm not aware of any other way to correct this problem, short of a REAL firmware fix for the 318. I doubt that the zoom on the 318 would work, b/c it would apply only to the active image area supported by the 318. Likewise, I don't think the digital zoom on the 318 has enough granularity to exapand the image by a hand full of pixels.

To answer your other question, YES this happens over component also.

As we all know, there is not yet a "perfect" DVD player. At least not in the price range of the 318. Since I don't NEED the upconversion over component, I'm hoping that the new Panasonic is an improvement over the 318. If it is, there will be one more uncrippled 318 available for someone in need of this otherwise great player.

-Gabe

I can't state this emphatically enough: The only thing this player really does well is upconvert to 1080i, technically, better over DVI than component, based on experiences and if you read things like the Secrets' shootout test results, which showed that DVI 1080i is the best way to go on this machine.

If that's not your first priority, and/or you don't even want/need upconversion, don't get this player.

720p on this player is a mixed bag at best and 480p is just downright poor.

10-8 update:

I am going to add this link to the main FAQs post WAAAY back at the beginning of this overlarge thread.

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-bin/shootout.cgi?function=search&articles=all&type=DVD+Player&manufacturer=53&maxprice=0&deInt=0&mpeg=0

That's the link to the Secrets' shootout test on the 318 under all conditions both component and DVI.

I hadn't bothered to read that myself until a couple of weeks ago, and in this case, I found that the test results perfectly match my personal experiences with this player that I've owned since February. FWIW.

Q: Nice update to the first post.

But what about changing the "such as" for "except for" in this affirmation:

"Some here have reported also that the firmware doesn't help with any of the known quirks, such as the DVI white crush. "

Michael TLV confirms that the white crush is resolved when applying the firmware. But everything else is true though.

Just for you guys that don't care about loosing the components upconversion but want to get rid of the white crush issue: YES the cure exists !

Well I'm about to give this player the boot! Panny DLP has a native resolution of 720p so an up-converting DVD player is useless. And as mentionned above, the player does a poor job at 480p and 720p. Not only that but it's de-interlacer sucks as I quickly found out by watching a couple of HK R3 DVD's.

10-8 Update: Cricricri's recommendation for wording done.

Question. I watch a lot of Asian R3 films and most of these have interlaced transfers. On those, I see a lot of rainbows, motion jitter, artefacts, etc...
Is there a setting on the LG that is better suited for this type of material?

Edited to add: Ok, I read the FAQ so I guess I can experiment with the Video/Film mode settings. But if there is another known solution to this please let me know. :)

I thought I'd check in, I got my 318 in a few days ago from Amazon. I got a Dec. 2003 build date, and everything works fine. At first I wasn't too impressed with the 1080i upconversion because I put in Star Wars FIRST it looked really sweet, but it also looked almost just as good on my old player a Sony NVP-725P at 480p, but I could tell a little difference. Then I put in some other DVDs and man some of them look awesome, much brighter, more contrast and very little mosqutio noise for example with Raiders of the Lost Ark I was blown away during the opening scenes in the temple. I will wright a full review of my experiences after I get a few hours on it.

The problem of Hong Kong R3 films is in the software, with absolute
horrible transfer.
But in the last year, many of the classics are released with DTS and new digital video transfer , into anamorphic proportion and true menu selections of subtitles etc.
I would check yesasia.com monthly to see the new releases of the old films, such as Once Upon a Time in China, The Chinese Cinderella, The Pandora Box etc.
And nicheflix.com carries many films , such as The Last Emperor , Kill Bill Vol 1, from Korea, Japan , many Legend labels of Bruce Lee's films, Miracle, Jacky Chan's movies all in great transfer.






Originally posted by eXcentris
Question. I watch a lot of Asian R3 films and most of these have interlaced transfers. On those, I see a lot of rainbows, motion jitter, artefacts, etc...
Is there a setting on the LG that is better suited for this type of material?

Edited to add: Ok, I read the FAQ so I guess I can experiment with the Video/Film mode settings. But if there is another known solution to this please let me know. :)

I just got a 50 inch GWIV. I also own a 5 - 6 years old "el cheapo" Sanyo DVD player which I would like to replace with a 318. My local dealer carries the LG 7832 (February 2004 build date) which I understand is the same as the 318.

How can I check if this version upconverts to 1080i via components?

Hi there.

I researched this thread 2 weeks ago, decided to buy DVB318 to use with Sharp Aquos LC-26GA4U. Ordered from Amazon, arrived today Dec 2003 build. Set it up via component.

While upconverting over component to 1080i, I have a 1 to 2 inch horizontal single white line at very top of screen (left-middle area). I recall something like this being discussed, but haven't found it by searching.

Thanks for any suggestions.

Originally posted by Denis54
I just got a 50 inch GWIV. I also own a 5 - 6 years old "el cheapo" Sanyo DVD player which I would like to replace with a 318. My local dealer carries the LG 7832 (February 2004 build date) which I understand is the same as the 318.

How can I check if this version upconverts to 1080i via components?

LG 7832 with build dates of Nov/Dec 2003 & Feb/Mar 2004 upconvert fine via component. If you really want to confirm this at the store, I suggest they have the player hooked up property and use a known DVD that can be problematic with the latest July 2004 builds via component. Based on my personal experience, I like others have found that Star Wars I or II, Spiderman, LOTR: FOTR, Master & Commander, Matrix, Army of Darkness to be problematic on the July 2004 (and likely newer) builds....these DVDs do NOT upconvert to 1080i/720p via component. I have since returned this player for a Nov 2003 and am now a happy camper who watches all his DVDs in 1080i via component.

Dave

Originally posted by Q of BanditZ
I can't state this emphatically enough: The only thing this player really does well is upconvert to 1080i, technically, better over DVI than component, based on experiences and if you read things like the Secrets' shootout test results, which showed that DVI 1080i is the best way to go on this machine.

If that's not your first priority, and/or you don't even want/need upconversion, don't get this player.

720p on this player is a mixed bag at best and 480p is just downright poor.

10-8 update:

I am going to add this link to the main FAQs post WAAAY back at the beginning of this overlarge thread.

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-bin/shootout.cgi?function=search&articles=all&type=DVD+Player&manufacturer=53&maxprice=0&deInt=0&mpeg=0

That's the link to the Secrets' shootout test on the 318 under all conditions both component and DVI.

I hadn't bothered to read that myself until a couple of weeks ago, and in this case, I found that the test results perfectly match my personal experiences with this player that I've owned since February. FWIW.

From the secrets testing, the only significant difference I see between component and DVI are (1) Video Levels test (can't figure out what this is from their site) fails on component, passes on DVI (2) Image cropping is an issue over component, but they didn't test for it over DVI. (Both formats had YC delay, but it was less at 1080i, hence the recommendation to use that resolution.) These two differences accounf for an 8 point difference on their 100 point scale. Sounds pretty negligible to me, can you explain why DVI is so much better, and what your experience has been?
thanks

Originally posted by AquosMan
Hi there.

I researched this thread 2 weeks ago, decided to buy DVB318 to use with Sharp Aquos LC-26GA4U. Ordered from Amazon, arrived today Dec 2003 build. Set it up via component.

While upconverting over component to 1080i, I have a 1 to 2 inch horizontal single white line at very top of screen (left-middle area). I recall something like this being discussed, but haven't found it by searching.

Thanks for any suggestions.

I just ordered the DVB 318.
I have the 37" version of your TV.
If you find a solution, please post it.
This is the first post that I have found with anyone mentioning a Sharp TV.

Thank You.

Quick Question - I have the DVB318 plugged into a Sammy HLP. My quick reading through these forums says that I should be turning progressive scan off ? Is this correct, and if so, how do I do this on the DVB318

Originally posted by jl0810
...these forums says that I should be turning progressive scan off ? Is this correct, and if so, how do I do this on the DVB318

Progressive scan basically takes the 480i (interlaced, screen info/image scanned in multiple passes) information which is on the DVD and turns it into 480p (progressive, entire screen info on one pass). Now if you own the 318 which is a upscaling player then you have three output resolutions:

480p (not so good due to Y/C delay so don't use this)
720p
1080i

Use the 720p or 1080i which even looks better to you on your TV. You ahve a nice DLP HD TV it can accept both. Yes your TV is 720p native.

The reason they mention to turn off Progressive scan on your DVD player for your TV is your TV has to always make the resolution 720p so it has a chip in it from Froduji (SP is wrong) the DCDi chip which is very very good. So the idea is to let (normal) dvd players just send the original 480i and let the TV do the work. But your 318 DVD player also has the DCDi chip in it to do the upscaling to the resolutions mentioned above.

Yes many have asked is it better to let the TV or DVD player to the DCDi chips work... the answer is let the DVD player do it.

You're kidding.

I would think the TV would 9/10 times at least be the better choice. This Samsung DLP set he's got is over 3 grand. The $160 Zenith is going to do a better job? That's news to me. I find that hard to believe.

Beaker, I'd like to learn more about that.

Also, not to put a fine point on this, but again, it amazes me how many people I see on these forums that buy these awesome, $3000 and up televisions...and then around and buy a $200 or less DVD player. I think people that are doing this are really selling themselves, and their awesome TV's, way short. ;)

If it were me, I'd get an awesome DVD player that does 480i or 480p, like say, the Denon 2900, for example, and plug it in there via component video and let the TV do its job.

In any event, if you go with the Zenith, the 480p is atrocious. Useless. Avoid it at all costs. The only way it does 480i, as best I know, is through S-Video and composite. At that rate, I don't see any point in owning it at all.

I'd agree with Q of Bandit that if you're not going to get this unit to install with 720p or 1080i upconverting via either component or DVI, you defeat the whole purpose of getting this particular unit. While it does a stellar job at the high resolutions, it fails to be much good at the conventional 480i or 480p.

This unit is designed to take advantage of the onboard chip to give you a better picture at near-HD signal pciture quality. It does that quite well. It is not designed to be a barebones base DVD player.

Okay - I'm not sure I follow all the recent posts - and I think I may have been insulted in at least one of them. :)

If the Zenith is outputing at 720p...and my TV is inputting in it's native format, 720p...then should I be concerned? Of course, I'm using DVI and all that....

No it should be fine.

The only conversions a TV will be doing instead of a DVD player is when the native resolution(s) of the two are not compatible.

It is an either/or situation, not an and situation.

Therefore, if the native resolution of your TV is 720P and you set your DVD to output anything but 720P, the scaler in the TV will convert the DVD signal to the TV's native 720P.

If, on the other hand, you set your DVD player to 720P, then the TV will just let it pass right through, and thereby not use the scaler inside the TV.
(and you generally want to scale as few times as possible)

As for which scalers are better, TV or DVD player, it all depends, and you should see what looks better to you. However, the Dcdi that is within the LG is pretty much the best there is. Therefore, whether your TV cost $500 or $50,000, if it does not have the Dcdi solution then the LG will likely do a better job.

There are two caveats here:

1. The Dcdi can be implemented differently on the chip level, and therefore not all Dcdi's are created equal.
2. There are other features to DVD players in addition to the scaler that are important (mpeg decoder, audio output stage, etc.).

Nevertheless, I wouldn't say price is a determining factor in the performance of DVD players, and I wouldn't hesitate to mate the LG with the most expensive of displays, as long as you know what, why, and how.

Originally posted by batorok
From the secrets testing, the only significant difference I see between component and DVI are (1) Video Levels test (can't figure out what this is from their site) fails on component, passes on DVI (2) Image cropping is an issue over component, but they didn't test for it over DVI. (Both formats had YC delay, but it was less at 1080i, hence the recommendation to use that resolution.) These two differences accounf for an 8 point difference on their 100 point scale. Sounds pretty negligible to me, can you explain why DVI is so much better, and what your experience has been?
thanks

Long story short, it is negligible for the most part, at least on lower end TV's like what I have.

For folks using more sensitive equipment and higher end TV's, it's not negligible.

Green push, red push, undersaturation, cropping issues, and a partridge in a pear tree all are the roll call for using component video on a lot of higher end TV's, projectors, and so forth. You can do a search and easily see how many "318 + whatever" threads we've had.

It's just better to go DVI if you can on more sensitive equipment.

And with the firmware, there's no more white crush (which isn't that bad to begin with, really) so you're left with something pretty solid, especially at this price.

With a fideling, calibrating, and what not, plenty of people have had success with component video and the Zenith on high end equipment. Some of them had no DVI to begin with, others just preferred it for whatever reason.

Probably no big deal either way.

Has anybody had problems turning the 318 on while a cable was connected to the DVI? Even without a DVD in the tray my 318 will be stuck at "hello" until I disconnect the DVI cable. If I unplug the DVI(while it's on) for a few seconds and then plug it back in, I can then watch the movie or eject the tray. I don't have this problem with component but need component for another device now.

I read this thread and the main 318 thread in their entirety a few months ago but I don't remember anybody with this issue. Searching was no help.

Didn't have the problem with DVI but encountered it when trying to connect a DVI to HDMI connection to a GWIV. I gave up and went to component.

referee,

I just got the dvb318 today, and connected it up with my sony kv-34hs420 crt. I'm experiencing the same exact problem! The player works beautifully on component. But once I tried the DVI, it froze up. The only way I can get the 318 to recover is to unplug it and plug it back in. I'd really love to see how it looks on DVI. And in this case, like jmmaher, I'm trying to connect to an HDMI connection. Maybe Zenith customer support can help? Anybody have any ideas?

Wei

Originally posted by referee
Has anybody had problems turning the 318 on while a cable was connected to the DVI? Even without a DVD in the tray my 318 will be stuck at "hello" until I disconnect the DVI cable. If I unplug the DVI(while it's on) for a few seconds and then plug it back in, I can then watch the movie or eject the tray. I don't have this problem with component but need component for another device now.

I read this thread and the main 318 thread in their entirety a few months ago but I don't remember anybody with this issue. Searching was no help.

Yes, that's somewhere in the original FAQs post. You cannot have both component and DVI cables connected.

I don't have anything plugged into the back but the DVI and an audio cable. Looks like it's going to have to be component for me. This is a let down, but I can deal with it. At least I have something to post in the firmware wishlist thread now.

Originally posted by Q of BanditZ
Yes, that's somewhere in the original FAQs post. You cannot have both component and DVI cables connected.

Not entirely true for me with my 4805 PJ: when both are connected, I can still view the DVI but yes, the component will only be usable if the DVI port is empty

Cricricri,
You don't have any DVI issues with the 4805 + 318? That is my setup too and I can't turn the 318 on with the DVI->M1 cable plugged in. I'm using the 10meter DVI->M1 cable that Infocus sells.

BTW, the cable works fine with my HDTV set top box.

-ref

Originally posted by AquosMan
Hi there.

I researched this thread 2 weeks ago, decided to buy DVB318 to use with Sharp Aquos LC-26GA4U. Ordered from Amazon, arrived today Dec 2003 build. Set it up via component.

While upconverting over component to 1080i, I have a 1 to 2 inch horizontal single white line at very top of screen (left-middle area). I recall something like this being discussed, but haven't found it by searching.

Thanks for any suggestions.

1. check your connection
2. click on the overscan button on the remote or the projector.

That fixed it for me.

Good luck,

;)

Originally posted by referee
Cricricri,
You don't have any DVI issues with the 4805 + 318? That is my setup too and I can't turn the 318 on with the DVI->M1 cable plugged in. I'm using the 10meter DVI->M1 cable that Infocus sells.

BTW, the cable works fine with my HDTV set top box.

-ref

Well, I'm still testing things so I never used DVI on startup (only components) so I don't know. But when I plug the DVI after booting, it works. The only thing that restrain me to finally apply the firmware fix is that I don't see any advantage (not sharper than components at 1080i) and I also get some shacking on some white horizontal lines with DVI. Not added lines, just that the image is not stable on the horizontal axis on some very white areas. Maybe it's because of the white crush ? Anyone ?

I have still to look more closely for focus uniformity after reading Martin Rendall post in the 4805 thread. Maybe DVI may help over components on this one.

Anyone know where I can buy the 318 and be sure it's got the old firmware? My lvd-2001 just died and I need a replacement.

amazon has the player on sale for $190. I ordered one last thursday. Got it in on Friday and it was Dec2003 build, which had the old firmware. It's not a sure bet, but there's a very good chance you'll get the older component-upconverting firmware. From what I understand, it'll take a while for the newer builds to start circulating. Hope this helps.

and if all else fails, u can return it.. :)

Amazon has a $30 coupon if you sign up for a Visa. You can apply the discount to the purchase of the 318. That will bring you price down to $160 with free shipping.

Originally posted by sorka
Anyone know where I can buy the 318 and be sure it's got the old firmware? My lvd-2001 just died and I need a replacement.

It must be a rash of failures, mine did too so I ordered from Amazon last week.

Originally posted by Q of BanditZ
You're kidding.

I would think the TV would 9/10 times at least be the better choice. This Samsung DLP set he's got is over 3 grand. The $160 Zenith is going to do a better job? That's news to me. I find that hard to believe.

Q, correct me if I'm wrong.

I wonder if doing the deinterlacing in the player might be better. The player would have a digital signal to deinterlace, then sends the deinterlaced signal out as analog, which the TV then only has to scale.

But if you do the deinterlacing in the TV, it will have to do it from an analog signal sent from the DVD player. What I'm getting at is, isn't it better to deinterlace from a digital signal (within the DVD player) instead of an analog signal (inside the TV)? That's assuming in the case above that both TV and DVD have the same deinterlacing chip.

Recieved my 318 from Amazon yesterday; it's a Dec. '03 build. Once it was calibrated the picture was absolutely stunning on my X1. Money well spent.

My setup, Infocus ScreenPlay 4805 and Zenith DVB-318, december issue, has been running with 1080i via component exceptionally well.

But the Q of Bandit keeps saying that DVD is better at 1080i per the Secrets shootout. Since I am a fan of any secrets shootout I have to believe that DVI is better, after all I still have the Panasonic XP-30 highly praised by the same secrets shootout.

So I ordered a M1-DA to DVI cable ( I already have a bunch of DVI cables but they are not M1-DA). Well it came in, I installed it. To my horror no picture. Well there is analog and digital DVI and mine is, guess what, the wrong type.

So the right one came in today. Again, same routine, installed it, picture on. everything is swell. But... what is this.. 480p. Where is my 1080i? No 1080i, 720p is not viewable. Life is good no? At least mine started.

At this point I am perplexed as to what caused all this nonsense. The 318 output (upconvert) 1080i and 720p on my component cables with no problem. So the problem is not the upconvert. My 4805 played both 1080i and 720p and 480p. So is this a cable problem? And what is this I hear about a new firmware upgrade for the 318?

So much time and money wasted and do much more to do!!!

I have given up the search for the ultimate picture, I am now just looking to watch movies on components at 1080i.



:rolleyes:

My setup, Infocus ScreenPlay 4805 and Zenith DVB-318, december issue, has been running with 1080i via component exceptionally well.

But the Q of Bandit keeps saying that DVD is better at 1080i per the Secrets shootout. Since I am a fan of any secrets shootout I have to believe that DVI is better, after all I still have the Panasonic XP-30 highly praised by the same secrets shootout.

So I ordered a M1-DA to DVI cable ( I already have a bunch of DVI cables but they are not M1-DA). Well it came in, I installed it. To my horror no picture. Well there is analog and digital DVI and mine is, guess what, the wrong type.

So the right one came in today. Again, same routine, installed it, picture on. everything is swell. But... what is this.. 480p. Where is my 1080i? No 1080i, 720p is not viewable. Life is good no? At least mine started.

At this point I am perplexed as to what caused all this nonsense. The 318 output (upconvert) 1080i and 720p on my component cables with no problem. So the problem is not the upconvert. My 4805 played both 1080i and 720p and 480p. So is this a cable problem? And what is this I hear about a new firmware upgrade for the 318?

So much time and money wasted and do much more to do!!!

I have given up the search for the ultimate picture, I am now just looking to watch movies on components at 1080i.



:rolleyes:

1) I don't think Q advocates using the 318 on DVI. With this player component is king. dvi had white crush. firmware "upgrade" marginally addresses it, but disables 1080i via component.

2) I don't think you can have both component and dvi connected. did you disconnect component before trying dvi? Also you may need to "reset" upconversion. turn player on . stop any dvd's that are playing. push upconvert button until it shows 1080i. then play dvd's via dvi at 1080i.

3) see item 1) about why not to use dvi with this player.

jeff

Thanks Jeff for your reply.

1. Let Q speak for himself. I do think he advocates DVI over component. Infocus also advocates DVI over components. The secrets shootout latest also mentioned a 10% improvement with DVI over cable, the reason I started buying DVI cables.

2. I do not have component and DVI connected at the same time as I already read most of the thread. As a matter of fact, I only buy the 318 because of this thread.

3. I did do the upconvert reset. When I stopped the player to do the upconvert (the only way this would work) there is no 1080i. There is 480p, 720p which is not viewable, and something like 1953X540 (?) but not viewable.

4. I agree that with the 318 component is king.

I only posted this to report my experience, hopefully, unique experience as I don't wish this on anybody.

Really this is the first time I have experienced this and I have followed this thread a long time and thought I have seen most of the problems.

It's got to be the cable.

:rolleyes:

Originally posted by chanc
Thanks Jeff for your reply.

1. Let Q speak for himself. I do think he advocates DVI over component. Infocus also advocates DVI over components. The secrets shootout latest also mentioned a 10% improvement with DVI over cable, the reason I started buying DVI cables.

2. I do not have component and DVI connected at the same time as I already read most of the thread. As a matter of fact, I only buy the 318 because of this thread.

3. I did do the upconvert reset. When I stopped the player to do the upconvert (the only way this would work) there is no 1080i. There is 480p, 720p which is not viewable, and something like 1953X540 (?) but not viewable.

4. I agree that with the 318 component is king.

I only posted this to report my experience, hopefully, unique experience as I don't wish this on anybody.

Really this is the first time I have experienced this and I have followed this thread a long time and thought I have seen most of the problems.

It's got to be the cable.

:rolleyes:

Chanc: you read my previous post, I have the same combo.
I use the DVI cable that came with the 318 with the SP-DVI adaptor from Infocus. I can see the signal via DVI at 1080i but the 4805 say it's indeed 1950X540 at 49 hertz or something like that. I think it's 1080i equivalent but I don't know for sure. But I don't see any advantage in sharpness with DVI over the components, nor in colour...
So I use components. You have the xp30 that has color-tint adjustments over 480p!!! Please tell me how the 480p and 480i of it compares to the 318's 1080i !!! Take care to make careful calibrations of 480p and 480i before comparing it to the 318.

Can't wait for your reply !!!

Sorry I didn't get back to this sooner.


Component and DVI performance are going to be pretty close, for all practical purposes. Certainly by the naked eye under most circumstances.

If you want to do component and/or that's the choce you've got, then do so with no worries.

Technically (let me emphasize that word) this player is better over DVI, but we're not talking about tremendous and earth shattering differences by any means.

SOME displays have had problems with component video that they didn't have with DVI. If you're not one of these people, more power to ya, you're home free! This is where that 10 percent comes in. ;) We've had threads around here about green undersaturation and all sorts of other nonesense with component video over CERTAIN displays. May not, and probably isn't, applicable to you.

If you have a choice, I'd use the DVI just to have the best. Why not? But certainly it's not worth a bunch of headaches and expense to make it happen. You're not giving up much, if anything at all.

Cricricri sounds like he's got the solution for you, so you should have your free choice as to whatever connection you want to use. Sounds like that's the ticket!

If you have to stay with component 1080i, don't worry about it, man. That's plenty good enough! :)


Originally posted by chairmantao
Q, correct me if I'm wrong.

I wonder if doing the deinterlacing in the player might be better. The player would have a digital signal to deinterlace, then sends the deinterlaced signal out as analog, which the TV then only has to scale.

But if you do the deinterlacing in the TV, it will have to do it from an analog signal sent from the DVD player. What I'm getting at is, isn't it better to deinterlace from a digital signal (within the DVD player) instead of an analog signal (inside the TV)? That's assuming in the case above that both TV and DVD have the same deinterlacing chip.

Excellent questions. I'm not really sure myself, which is why I was kind of asking the same thing you are. I've heard a lot of nice success stories and pleased people who have used the Zenith with your TV and its kin.

If you check the literature on your TV and go to www.zenithservice.com or wherever to see what the 318 has, you can compare and see which has the better components in it and make your decision from there.

cricricri,

My XP-30 is connected to a Sony HDTV and my Zenith 318 is connected to my SP 4805 in a different setup. I use fairly tight connectors for my component cables (Monster type) and it's not so easy to access the DVD players so I am really reluctant to experiment.

I can report that the XP-30 with the Faroudja chip, output a beautiful 480p signal to the Sony. Frankly I have a few DVD players and the XP-30 is my preferred player. There are tons of controls and the picture is fantastic.

The 318 with components output a 1080i to the SP4850 and I cannot complain about the picture. I am pretty sure that 1080i is better than 480p with the combo I have. I am not sure the XP-30 480p would be better than the Zenith 318 1080i. In any case I doubt if I would be able to detect the difference without sophisticated measurement equipment.

I am very familiar with the DVI-M1-DA converter by Infocus. It costs the same as the cable so I bought the cable.With DVI I saw the same exact 1954X540 upconvert by the 318 but no display, nothing but snow, I punch the autoimage to synch the picture but no dice. With DVI 720p is also snowy no picture, all i get is the 480p with the DVI-M1-DA cable.

It could be the DVI connections are not working properly. But which one?

Q of BanditZ,

I will stick with the component cables for now as I bought some really good ones. It's that 10% that I cannot see that I was trying to get. In any case I think there is something definitely wrong with my DVI cable AND/OR connections.

As you said most of us cannot see the 8-10% anyway.


:cool:

I was honestly wondering if your projector was HDCP compliant, based on the things you wrote.

Oh well, if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

Chanc,
Your connections are fine. I've tried hooking the 318 up to my Infocus 4805 with that DVI->M1 cable too and had the same results. From what I understand the only people that are able to do upconvert over DVI have an actual DVI (with HDCP) input on their display. People with an HDMI or M1 input are out of luck unless a firmware is somehow able to fix the problem. There are lots of threads in this forum about this issue now. HDCP is clearly evil.

Mabybe it could be included in the FAQ to help the newly disappointed?

-ref

There's a known issue in the industry about an HDMI<->DVI handshake issue.

Unless I'm really off my rocker, I think Chanc wasn't using an HDMI cable at all, so it's irrelevant.

I still think his projector probably isn't HDCP compliant, baed on everything he described here, in which case, no DVI cable of any kind will help him, that I know of.

It doesn't have to be in any FAQs. It's common sense and common knowledge: Try to mix an HDCP compliant device with one that isn't = fail.

Q,
Chanc's problem is relevant because the M1 input on the 4805 projector has the same problem as the HDMI input on any other display. Except for the obvious physical differences the M1 is an HDMI input(the M1 is a little more diverse, but I digress). But forget about the M1. I don't expect your FAQ to cover a somewhat rare input just to inform us Infocus owners. I'm sure anyone looking for a DVD player would love to hear about this incompatibility issue at the very least because HDMI appears to be where the industry is headed.

I realize now that many DVI players are having problems connecting to HDMI inputs but I certainly didn't know that a month ago when I ordered a DVI<->HDMI cable for my DVB318. I don't think this problem is as "common knowledge" as you think. Especially when everything should work according to the manual. What is a FAQ for if not to correct or supplement the manual?

I appreciate your maintainership of the FAQ, I just wish it had this information. If you would like, I'd be happy to write this section of the FAQ.

-ref

Originally posted by referee
Q,
Chanc's problem is relevant because the M1 input on the 4805 projector has the same problem as the HDMI input on any other display. Except for the obvious physical differences the M1 is an HDMI input(the M1 is a little more diverse, but I digress). But forget about the M1. I don't expect your FAQ to cover a somewhat rare input just to inform us Infocus owners. I'm sure anyone looking for a DVD player would love to hear about this incompatibility issue at the very least because HDMI appears to be where the industry is headed.

I realize now that many DVI players are having problems connecting to HDMI inputs but I certainly didn't know that a month ago when I ordered a DVI<->HDMI cable for my DVB318. I don't think this problem is as "common knowledge" as you think. Especially when everything should work according to the manual. What is a FAQ for if not to correct or supplement the manual?

I appreciate your maintainership of the FAQ, I just wish it had this information. If you would like, I'd be happy to write this section of the FAQ.

-ref

Ok, I guess I just didn't fully understand. Would you mind writing that up for me and PMing it my way? I'll put it in the FAQs right away. :)

Hey all....for anyone who wants to know....I just got mine from Amazon today (ordered yesterday) March Build Date!! Woo Hoo!! (Whew!)

Also received mine yesterday from Amazon; also "March 2004"....
Very, very happy (so far)with it's performance. Hook-up was simple enough and now I've got THREE remotes to learn. Only bug-a-boo was a result of my primitive ineptitude of connecting the @#$%^&* Onkyo speaker wires.....(what a KLUTZ!!!!)
Provided cables worked FINE with my tv, so the Bluejean upgrades due today are completely unnecessary. Being a klutz I ordered the 9 ft length and am willing to sell them ......just contact me and save some money.

Received mine from Amazon today, March 2004 build. I will hook it up tongiht via Component to my Mits 46809.

Just got mine a few minutes ago. Opened it up and it was also march. Can't wait to get it home. Looks like a stunning deal for $189. BTW, the super save free shipping from amazon came over night. I ordered it the day before in the evening and it shipped yesterday.

Right now I looks to me that all players people get from dealers still have the old builds. Do we need 5 people a day reporting that they still got the old build with their purchase? I rather would like that people report that they got the new build instead, this is the FAQ thread.

Those of us still acquiring players are GLAD to receive the "old" build, and regard the new firmware as bad news.....however inevitable; NO one is glad to report "bad news".....nor would MOST of us be anxious to hear it!!

Just tried to open the tray and nothing happens. I see the 'Welcome' message but nothing works. I Unplugged it and plugged it back in, pushed the On Button and I get the 'Welcome' message but still no response.

Is there a reset switch I can access?

Thanks...Ron

Again, stupid question: Ronone10- Do you have both a DVI and component cables plugged in at the same time? Sometimes that makes for freezes and glitches.

Eric,

That wasn't a stupid question. I have both component and dvi cables connected and have never experienced a problem. Yesterday, I upgraded to the Panasonic AE700 and had to get a DVI/HMDI adapter for the projector side of the DVI cable.

Based on your advise, I pulled the dvi cable and it works. So it must be the HMDI adapter. Is this a known problem using a DVI/HMDI adapter?

Fortunately, my 318 does upconvert using component.

Thanks...Ron

It's a weird quirk. There have been some known handshake issues using DVI/HDMI adapters on certain devices. It's been touch and go. Something obviously wasn't working right on that for you. Glad you have that isolated. It's not a problem with the player per se, just a quirk.

Oct. 22 updated, thanks to referee for this.

The DVB318's popularity can almost completely be attributed to its ability to upconvert on its component outputs. The few that want/need to use its DVI port will find that this output does a great job of upconverting too. There are a few hitches, however. The DVB318's DVI incorporates HDCP encryption so your display's DVI port will also have to be HDCP compliant to decrypt the signal.

You will run into problems connecting the DVB318's DVI to a display's HDMI(or M1-DA) input. In this type of connection it appears that the HDCP handshake is failing. People have had trouble turning their DVB318 on while connected like this, finding themselves stuck at "hello". It may be possible to turn the 318 on with nothing connected and then once the DVD is spinning plug the cable in. Some people believe that the problem is the DVI<->HDMI cable or the HDMI adapter but I prefer to think that the two devices have HDCP software issues. Hopefully this will be fixable in firmware someday.

I have an Optoma H30 Projector. I'm wondering how the 318 would work with this PJ using a DVI to VGA adaptor out and VGA into the projector?

Any Info appreciated.

Well...I have my new unit plugged into my z2 over component, and I can confirm what a poster put out here a while back. Image cropping! It's not severe, but on the right side of the image there is a good inch so (maybe a little more) missing. I guess I could use lens shift to compensate but that would throw off my alignment on my other sources. Its not a huge issue, and iy doesnt detract from the BEAUTIFUL picture, but its there. I blame these damn forums for making me pay attention to things I otherwise wouldnt have noticed!! ....But then again, if it wasn't for the forum, I may have never have found out about this great player and to watch for the "old" build dates. Oh well.....Its like a woman....can't live with'em ,can't live without'em!! :)

Hooked it up last night and so far I am VERY happy. There is a bit of cropping on the right side, but I can fix that on my TV, as I run the DVD player directly into one of the input's on my Mits.

I threw Toy Story 2 in and it's NEVER looked better. I do not get the horizontal white strip that others have mentioned, but I am going to try some other discs out to make sure. This keeps me from having to buy a new TV just to get DVI input (or spending close to a grand on the "promise" module)

Crud, double-post

Originally posted by Scarpad
I have an Optoma H30 Projector. I'm wondering how the 318 would work with this PJ using a DVI to VGA adaptor out and VGA into the projector?

Any Info appreciated.

Although there are cables thqat convert the DVI connector to a VGA connector, they are only feeding the pins on the DVI connector that already have the standard VGA analog signals on them to the VGA HD15 connector. Most computer DVI ports have both the digital DVI and the analog VGA signals coming out of the DVI connector (they call this DVI-I).

I beleive the 318 only outputs the DVI digital signals and doesn't have the VGA signals. DVI digital only is usually called DVI-D.


Now I suspose there could be a converter box that takes DVI digital and converts it to VGA analog, but at that point you lose the benefit of digital DVI output. Ylou might as well use the analog component from the 318.

Originally posted by referee
Chanc,
Your connections are fine. I've tried hooking the 318 up to my Infocus 4805 with that DVI->M1 cable too and had the same results. From what I understand the only people that are able to do upconvert over DVI have an actual DVI (with HDCP) input on their display. People with an HDMI or M1 input are out of luck unless a firmware is somehow able to fix the problem. There are lots of threads in this forum about this issue now. HDCP is clearly evil.

Mabybe it could be included in the FAQ to help the newly disappointed?

-ref

So are you saying that the 1954x540 at 49hz (or something like that) that my 4805 recognize with the DVI-M1 adaptor isn't 1080i ? I thought there's at least an upscaling on the horizontal axis but the vertical is pretty much the same as 480p. What do you think ?

Nope, I'm not saying that at all. You have true 1080i, for sure.

But were you able to turn the DVB318 on with the DVI connected or did you swap the connection after the player was started? I can get 1080i upconversion with DVI on the exact same setup as you but I need to swap cables after the player has been powered up.

So, yes, we can upconvert this way. But is it practical or useful? Not for me.

-ref

but is the 318 HDCP compliant? Or is the Infocus SP 4805 HDCP non-compliant?

The cable I used is a DVI-D at one end and M1-DA at the other end which is exactly the DVI pin with a different out shell, preferred by some projector manufacturers.

I also have a DVI-HDMI cable. The HDMI end is completely different than the DVI end.

So if I can summarize my situation, there is a quirk as a Eric put it between DVI and HDMI/M1-DA because of HDCP so that is the reason I don't get my 10% improvement?

:cool:

That's a good question, chanc. In our case, both the player and display(4805) claim HDCP compliance. Since both devices are update-able, there may be a fix in the future. That's what I'm waiting for. Until that day, I'm going to use the component outs.

And yeah, that is the reason. Although I'm not sure I'd agree with the 10%. The difference between upconversion over component and DVI is indistinguishable to my eyes.

-ref

Originally posted by referee
That's a good question, chanc. In our case, both the player and display(4805) claim HDCP compliance. Since both devices are update-able, there may be a fix in the future. That's what I'm waiting for. Until that day, I'm going to use the component outs.

And yeah, that is the reason. Although I'm not sure I'd agree with the 10%. The difference between upconversion over component and DVI is indistinguishable to my eyes.

-ref

The elusive 10% improvement was mentioned in the last secret shootout. I was very happy with components1080i picture, but why not the best possible picture leads me to this end. Frankly DVI for cumputer has been good for me, but for home entertainment like Comcast Motorola cable box, SP 4805 and DVD players, they have not impressed me.

And HDCP is another thing altogether and I gather HDMI is going to replace DVI?

In any case couldn't agree with you more on your post.

Technology is a bitch isn't it?

:D

Has anybody calibrated the DVB318 for the Infocus 4805? I've been trying to calibrate the DVB318 using DVE for quite awhile now. Even over component at 1080i, I am definitely having white crush issues. I also had color issues with this player. I had to bump up the red, blue, and green gains to 60. Does this sound typical to the 4805/DVB318 owners? Any help would be appreciated.

Please Help!

I watched Van Helsing over the weekend on the Zenith (connected via component to my Sanyo Z2 in 1080i)...all in all it was a great picture..BUT! In darker scens with a lot of shadows somthing was really wrong. The blacks seemed to be shimmering or "noisy" Was I seeing macroblocking issues? It got to the point where at times in very dark scenes it was almost unwatchable! I don't recall ever having these issues on my old progressive scan machine (JVC XV-F85GD) This is really bothering me. I DID NOT see any of these issues or any of the new Star Wars dvd's which of course have plenty of black scenes (outer space) Has anyone ekse noticed this issue on Van Helsing or any other movie? If so...whats the fix, if any? Thanks........

Originally posted by jadon1
Please Help!

I watched Van Helsing ....BUT! In darker scens with a lot of shadows somthing was really wrong. The blacks seemed to be shimmering or "noisy" Was I seeing macroblocking issues? It got to the point where at times in very dark scenes it was almost unwatchable! Has anyone else noticed this issue on Van Helsing or any other movie? If so...whats the fix, if any? Thanks........

No fix to offer but I noticed the same thing (1080i to X1) several times in VanHelsing. I have noticed it a few other times in other movies. It is usually in a scene with dark backgrounds and light from fire/flames.....

Yes you're seeing MB (macroblocking). In over 6 months I've only seen it once. Last week end in the day after tomorrow. MB is due to mpeg encoding errors being exaggerated by the 318 chipset. Usually it only pops up if the brightness is a bit too high.

Best,
jeff

Just an FYI, I was looking at Amazon, think about getting a 2nd one, but got the following:

This item is not stocked or has been discontinued.

I ordered mine last night on Amazon. My order seems to have gone through and my status is "Shipping Soon". Wonder if I will get it??

I called Amazon, and they said my order will be fulfilled. They were in stock when I ordered, but it seems they are all sold out for now. Interesting to see what firmware I get. If it is after June 2004, its going back.

Got mine last week, box was dented (inside double box), but works GREAT on component. Manufacturing date is Feb 04. Good enough that I just ordered a spare and it was even $10 cheaper.

Originally posted by Brian Hakey
I ordered mine last night on Amazon. My order seems to have gone through and my status is "Shipping Soon". Wonder if I will get it??

Also ordered mine from amazon yesterday, checked today and it said "shipping soon" too. Maybe we made the last cut?

Looks like it. I am using the Free Shipping (Super Saver), so I don't expect it to ship for another few days. If yours ships, let me know.

Well, I have the dreaded issue of freezing when connecting the DVI on the SB-318 to the HDMI port on my new JVC H-DILA. It seems like the DVD will play once, but then when I pause it and try to play again, it freezes. I need to test some more but those are the initial symptoms. Anyone have anymore workarounds besides start the disk and then insert the DVI cable? I sure can't think of anything. BTW, I have a high-end Monster DVI-HDMI cable. The best they make. So I do not believe the cable is any factor here.

Same issue with the Denon 1910 via DVI to a Samsung HLP 6163 - unless I choose the lowest Samsung setting (Cinema)....lots of ugly MB in the dark scenes. Same issue with Underworld - another good test.

Someone posted on the Denon 1910 site that this mostly went away by going component vs. DVI?

I will be feeding my new AE700 with the 318 via component. Being that the projector is 720 native, should I use the 720P or will I still have better PQ with 1080i? My 300 looks better with 1080i but the projector is 540 (so 50%).

Originally posted by RobZ
Being that the projector is 720 native, should I use the 720P or will I still have better PQ with 1080i? My 300 looks better with 1080i but the projector is 540 (so 50%).

Give them both a try! I have a RP LCD native 720p and the 318 player. Used 720p for a while then tried 1080i. At 1080i you will notice the DVD player no disc default screen is much smoother without any color bleeding. So to me the 1080i setting looked better than the 720p. [I also started out using DVI and switched to Component due to the fact the component just looked better with no issues.]

I also really wanted to use 720p for the 1:1 but I thought about it and my cable STB is in pass-through and the HD channels at 1080i look just as good as the 720p channels. If I didn't notice the difference running the 318 at 1080i = less to no color bleeding then I would have left it at 720p.

I've gotten to the point where I just go with what looks better rather than what in theory should be better.

Good luck and enjoy!

Quick question.

Is there a DVI to component cable I can use for this player? My TV (Samsung TXM3096WHF) only has component, no DVI. I would like to use the DVI feature on this player. If there is a DVI to Component cable, would it benefit me to use that instead of the component connection?

Thanks!

Originally posted by ShawnE94SL
Quick question.

Is there a DVI to component cable I can use for this player? My TV (Samsung TXM3096WHF) only has component, no DVI. I would like to use the DVI feature on this player. If there is a DVI to Component cable, would it benefit me to use that instead of the component connection?

Thanks!

Why not just use the component outputs of the player? (Unless you get one of the new crippled ones...)

The DVI output of the 318 is digital ONLY, so there is no way to convert it to component progressive. And, if there was, it would probably violate the DMCA or something because it would have to circumvent the HDCP.

Originally posted by gthomas
Why not just use the component outputs of the player? (Unless you get one of the new crippled ones...)

The DVI output of the 318 is digital ONLY, so there is no way to convert it to component progressive. And, if there was, it would probably violate the DMCA or something because it would have to circumvent the HDCP.

Well, you answered my question, thanks! I am currently using the component connections. I thought there was a connector that converted component to DVI, but I guess not. The reason I ask this is because I've been seeing allot of Macroblocking during dark scenes. I am told there is nothing I can do about that though, correct?

Originally posted by ShawnE94SL
Well, you answered my question, thanks! I am currently using the component connections. I thought there was a connector that converted component to DVI, but I guess not. The reason I ask this is because I've been seeing allot of Macroblocking during dark scenes. I am told there is nothing I can do about that though, correct?

There are converters (transcoders?) that will convert the analog form of DVI (same as VGA) into component. But these are not applicable to the 318 since it uses only the digital part of DVI.

As for the Macroblocking - the most common solution that I have heard of is to decrease the brightness on your tv/monitor/projector/...

-Gabe

I just got this player, a march build and I'm sending it back tomorrow. I hooked it up over component port upscalled to 1081 to my Fujitsu PDS-5002 and comparing it to me Panasonic RP-91, I'm not too impressed. I can hardly see any difference in the upconversion between the 480p Rp91. I know the signal is is 1080, I a can check that status on my display. I can't test using my DVI port since the port is unusable with always "out of rage" with any DVI s0urce. If the Fujitsu is upscalling the picture to with 480 p, maybe thats why I can't see any difference between the 2 or any "near HD" quality difference. I do notice the 318 is much worse on blacks espcially when the movie starts on the blank black screens, they look all pixilated.

Just my thoughts

Originally posted by gthomas
There are converters (transcoders?) that will convert the analog form of DVI (same as VGA) into component. But these are not applicable to the 318 since it uses only the digital part of DVI.

As for the Macroblocking - the most common solution that I have heard of is to decrease the brightness on your tv/monitor/projector/...

-Gabe

Thanks for your help agian Gabe! I appreciate your feedback. I'll try decreasing my brightness when I get home tonight. I don't know how much further I could co though. Brightness right now is set at 44, while contrast is set at 42. This is per a DVD Essectials calibration I did myself when I first got the player. I'll give it a shot though. Maybe I should turn my contrast up and brightness down.

Does anyone know where I can buy a Zenith DVB-318? I just picked up a Toshiba 52HM84 DLP and would really like to use the one HDMI port for something else I have in mind. Can't seem to find this DVD player anywhere. Amazon no longer has them in stock (stupid me, should have ordered it last week when I started looking).

Any place on line, or a B&M in NJ or NYC?

Thanks,
Michael

Michael-

Try Gochnauer Home Appliances & Home Video & Audio Electronics Center Online. I can't post URL but its an easy guess. I called them yesterday because I was also looking for one. They don't have any in stock but have a shipment coming in 2-3 weeks. Most of those are already allotted to customers but they said there are some still available. I went ahead and ordered and the price was good. Also, all the units have the old firmware that allows for upconversion via component.

I've had one on order at Gochnauers for almost a month. They were do in at the end of October, but I was informed yesterday that Zenith would not ship for another ten days or so.

Originally posted by mpauly
Does anyone know where I can buy a Zenith DVB-318? I just picked up a Toshiba 52HM84 DLP and would really like to use the one HDMI port for something else I have in mind. Can't seem to find this DVD player anywhere. Amazon no longer has them in stock (stupid me, should have ordered it last week when I started looking).

Any place on line, or a B&M in NJ or NYC?

Thanks,
Michael

BestBuy online has them at full retail($259.99) and are currently shipping.

I am most impressed with the picture quality of the DVB-318 hooked up
to a Runco CRT front projector on a 108" screen. This is upconverted via
component. Scan lines are not visible and the only obvious defect is a
1" band of missing picture down the right hand side. From a general
resolution point of view, ignoring color bandwidth, the picture quality is
comparable to what one generally sees on HBO HDTV.

I ordered my 318 from Amazon last Monday and received it yesterday. March 2004 build date, btw. Hitachi 57S715 arrives today from Sears, so I will finally be heading toward HD heaven!

Update 10-31

Micheal TLV's link to the ORIGINAL firmware for the Zenith 318. You don't like the new one? Now you can roll back!

http://www.keohi.com/keohihdtv/experttips/michaeltlv/lg_dv7832_firmware.html

Thanks for the sources, but I decided to just call every authorized dealer listed on Zenith's site within 50 miles. Managed to find one B&M with one in stock.

Hooked up to my Toshiba 52hm84 DLP via component, the picture is all it's hyped up to be. Even though my set is 720p native, to my eye the 1080i looks a bit sharper, with fewer digital artifacts.

There are some quirks and the remote is funky, but with the outstanding PQ and the great price, I'm totally happy.

Michael

Micheal probably will tell you himself. The webpage sure looks thorough. I would think you would apply it the same way you'd apply any other firmware: Burn the ISO onto a disc, insert in player, and run.

Someone please correct me if that's wrong.

I can probably help with this one. Download the .bin file of your choice. I think I remember reading that the file has to be called lgromout.bin to be seen by the DVB318. So if you want the component-capable firmware, you should rename the file accordingly. Burn the file to a CD-R. Throw it in and turn it on.

-ref

I gave the DVI version a try last night. The update was successful but it didn't fix my DVI<->HDMI problem. I'll be going back to the component version when I get the time. Too bad.

I'll add your instructions to the FAQs, Ref. - Update 11-1-04.

Does anyone have advice on whether I should have my TV's (Tosh HDX) 3:2 Processing turned on or off when using this player at 1080i?

Does it matter or does the 1080i output skip the 3:2 altogether anyway?

Thanks.

Originally posted by referee
I can probably help with this one. Download the .bin file of your choice. I think I remember reading that the file has to be called lgromout.bin to be seen by the DVB318. So if you want the component-capable firmware, you should rename the file accordingly. Burn the file to a CD-R. Throw it in and turn it on.

-ref

I gave the DVI version a try last night. The update was successful but it didn't fix my DVI<->HDMI problem. I'll be going back to the component version when I get the time. Too bad.

Too bad is right. Thanks for testing. Did you read the Micheal TLV's review of the twin LG? Component at 1080i is better than his Panasonic R91 480p. I had speculated earlier that Zenith 318 1980i via component might better than my Panasonic XP-30 480p to a SP4805. In addition DVI had all kind of white crush etc..



:cool:

Please forgive me, I have read as much as my eyes can take at this point.

Very simply, I am heading to BB to return a Tosh SD3960. If they have the 318, what build date (and where can I find it) should I look for? Am I correct that March 04' is the 'good' one?

This will be run via component into a Sanyo Z2.

TIA (again, sorry if this has been asked a million times)

Iguana Man,

Fortunately, with the availability of the earlier firmware, the build date is now insignificant.

Get your best deal and if it turns out to be necessary, just apply the earlier firmware to enable upscaling over component.

Take care

Originally posted by Iguana Man
Please forgive me, I have read as much as my eyes can take at this point.

Very simply, I am heading to BB to return a Tosh SD3960. If they have the 318, what build date (and where can I find it) should I look for? Am I correct that March 04' is the 'good' one?

This will be run via component into a Sanyo Z2.

TIA (again, sorry if this has been asked a million times)

"Does anyone have advice on whether I should have my TV's (Tosh HDX) 3:2 Processing turned on or off when using this player at 1080i?

Does it matter or does the 1080i output skip the 3:2 altogether anyway?

Thanks."

it should bypass it

Originally posted by cheathamcc
Michael-

Try Gochnauer Home Appliances & Home Video & Audio Electronics Center Online. I can't post URL but its an easy guess. I called them yesterday because I was also looking for one. They don't have any in stock but have a shipment coming in 2-3 weeks. Most of those are already allotted to customers but they said there are some still available. I went ahead and ordered and the price was good. Also, all the units have the old firmware that allows for upconversion via component.

That's what they told me three weeks ago. I pre-ordered then and am still hopeful, but am close to just going with Amazon.

I got mine this past monday from Amazon. Got the March date, as well, so the component upconvert is good to go. Everything is working well with this machine, so far, and I pretty satisfied. I've not done much A&B testing, so I can't really say how much of an improvement it is going from my Panny RP91 to the 318. I'm giving the RP91 to my parents this weekend, so I guess I won't be able to make the comparo. However, I'm still waiting for my Pioneer 563a to come back from the service center (those incompetent service people will never get it fixed...but that's a different issue). I'm hoping to be able to do a comparo between those 2 units.

Now after all that rambling....on to my real question. I tried to search this entire thread re: the subject of WMA files, but couldn't find anything past the first page, where it was mentioned that the unit "supports" WMA files. Has anyone actually tried to play a WMA file on this unit? I bought some WMA music files from Walmart's site, burnt them to a disc, but have not been able to get the unit to play the files. It plays my MP3 files fine, but when it gets to the WMA files, it seems to just skip over those.

Anyone with successful experience with WMA and the 318?

Thanks,

--Nhan

Originally posted by toothy mako
That's what they told me three weeks ago. I pre-ordered then and am still hopeful, but am close to just going with Amazon.

Mako,
they send out email today explaining what is going on. PM me if you didn't get it. With the old firmware out just go with whatever dealer you find/like.

I too have the black macroblocking problem. My DVB318 connected to a 42" Panny commercial Plasma via DVI. In dark scenes like at the beginning of Superbit fifth element i get the big black blobs crawling all over the screen. Very annoying. Picture is fabulous as long as there is some light in a scene - but all black and ick.

Does anyone know if a fix is in the works for this - or if the new DVI firmware addresses this problem ? Or if only some units have this problem and I should look to swap it out? I sent a note to zenith and will post any reply I get.

Anyone use WMA's on this player?

An FYI for those shopping for a DB318, I've only found 2 online retailers (besides ebay) that claim to have any availability, bestbuy and cousin's. All the retailers listed in the FAQ either don't deal with Zenith/LG or don't stock the unit anymore. I'm not sure if it's a supply problem, but I think that's likely given that LG has now come out with a DVB418.

I did some searches and couldn't find an answer... so posting my problem/question.

When playing some DVD's I am not getting any audio (I do get some very-low-end rumbling through the sub) during the previews and during the menus. When the movie starts, audio seems fine.

Any ideas on what my issue is?

The macro-blocking can generally be solved by lowering the brightness on your TV. The 318 is a very bright player, I had to lower my Sammy DLP from 56 to 34 when I calibrated with Optimizer. I have not noticed this player introduce any macro-blocking, besides what's part of the source material. Try the same disk on another player that does not have black crush and turn up your brightness, I'm pretty sure you'll see the same macro-blocking.

The 318 will not play .WMA or DIVX, I've tried.

As for audio problems, if you're running into a SSR, make sure you're outputting Bit-stream and using either component or optical. If not, set it for PCM. Some DVDs use 5.1 DD for their menus which I'm not sure if it will down convert to 2 channel for those without a SSR, whereas the movie will.

I am sure I read this somewhere in here...does the 318 support the memory feature of playing a disc where I left off, even if the DVD is removed? I just tried this, but the movie started off at the main menu? Thanks....

Thanks for confirming that. I guess I'll just call Zenith and complain, since they player is advertised to playback WMA files.

Originally posted by mmccking

The 318 will not play .WMA or DIVX, I've tried.

ok i just got my 318 from amazon yesterday and i played with it for a couple of hours on my optoma H30 projector. amazon has been out of stock for a couple of weeks and i had been checking daily. one day it came up for sale again and i ordered it. now its out of stock again. anyway, its a march 04 build date.
on my setup, i can not say that this dvd player is a huge step up from my cheap $70 toshiba. the two players required a big differnce in calibration but like i said im not too impressed with this player. maybe i need to do more adjustments. maybe its just my projector. anyway, if in the next couple of days i dont like what i see im just gonna send it back or give it to someone that has a setup that can better utilize this player.

I've been giving some thought to the cropping issue on the 318 - particularly on the right-hand side of the screen. Is it possible that the Zenith is generating a wider signal than necessary?

Most folks here are using 1080i which, in theory, should be 1920x1080, or two fields of 1920x540. But a few posts back, someone mentioned that their projector was reporting 1954x540, rather than the expected 1920.

If I take the 1954 number as the "active" image area, and assume that only 1920 of those pixels are actually carring information from the DVD, the remaining 34 pixels, when scaled to my projectors resolution and screen size correspond to roughly 22 pixels that are "blank", and a 1.37" black border.

Anyway, I was wondering if anyone else with a 318 has a display device that can report the resolution of the input signal. I am unaware of anything like this on my Z2, but maybe some other devices (like the 4805 of the above referenced poster) can provide some insight into this.

Basically, I'm looking for some way to convince LG that there is a problem with their DVD player, and see if there's some way we can get them to fix it.

-Gabe

Out of stock at Amazon, at Gochanuer's, and BestBuy has it on backorder for $260. Any others I should check?

can anyone verify that the dvb 318 plays thier backup dvd+r without any problems.

I want to purchase one but all my dvd's are +r.

Originally posted by Brian Hakey
I am sure I read this somewhere in here...does the 318 support the memory feature of playing a disc where I left off, even if the DVD is removed? I just tried this, but the movie started off at the main menu? Thanks....

Yes. It does.

;)

Found one online store selling the 318 for $189+ ship . I don't have any experience with them. Reselling rating is 7.xx out of 10.


SALE STORES CORP

http://salestores1.com

thanks you, chanc.

Originally posted by dayoff_88
can anyone verify that the dvb 318 plays thier backup dvd+r without any problems.

I want to purchase one but all my dvd's are +r.

I have played a DVD+R that a friend burnt. I do not have a DVD burner of any type myself. Played back fine.

I have played several DVD+R and DVD+RW's on the 318 all burnt with a Phillips DVR80 with no problems.

I've tried DVD +/-R and +/-RWs, and all work fine.

I also just tried this DVD player on my friend's panasonic LCD rear projection (via DVI at 720p), and it didn't look any where near as good as my 3.5 year-old Mitsubishi 55807 CRT RPTV. The Mits had been professionally calibrated, while not much tweaking was done to the panny unit. I thought the fixed pixels didn't need much fine tuning (other than brightness/contrast and some color adjustments). That was really disappointing :(

Originally posted by ddruker
I too have the black macroblocking problem. My DVB318 connected to a 42" Panny commercial Plasma via DVI. In dark scenes like at the beginning of Superbit fifth element i get the big black blobs crawling all over the screen. Very annoying. Picture is fabulous as long as there is some light in a scene - but all black and ick.

Does anyone know if a fix is in the works for this - or if the new DVI firmware addresses this problem ? Or if only some units have this problem and I should look to swap it out? I sent a note to zenith and will post any reply I get.

I believe all of the players have this problem. It is my one gripe with this player. And yes - my TV is calibrated correctly. But I agree with your view of the player - when the scene is well lit - it looks great, when it is dark - it looks like computer graphics. I am starting to look for a new player again. Maybe I'll just go back to my trusty Pioneer 563a.

I just got a 318 from Best Buy today. It arrived looking like hell and retaped (I think it has been previously sold). Anyhow, the build date is Dec. 2003 and it outputs through the component outs. My problem, however, is that I can't get it to display full screen discs in any way other than 16:9. I went into the video menu and changed the settings to 4:3 and pan and scan, but with no luck. I still get big gray bars on the top and bottom. My old sony doesn't do this. Any suggestions? TIA

This is just the nature of the player. It will only output 4:3 material as stretched. Since you are probably using 1080i upconversion, the 34hs420 won't allow you to switch from full mode. If you really want to have the pillarboxes for 4:3 content, you'll have to give up upconversion and switch to 480p mode. Then you should be able to switch into NORMAL mode. If it's any consolation, the 318 does a great job with the stretching of 4:3 material. Hope this helps.

wei

Originally posted by bshor
Out of stock at Amazon, at Gochanuer's, and BestBuy has it on backorder for $260. Any others I should check?

I am selling mine on eBay with a .99 bid

http://cgi.*********/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=50600&item=5731534539&rd=1

Uuugh stupid AVS filter, just make it cgi.********* and you are golden.

Maybe this has already been answered but I've noticed this tread has become HUGE!

I have a Sanyo 30 inch widecreen HDTV. I have the DVB318 hooked up via component cables. When I upconvert to 1080I the picture flashes between normal and a very green saturated colored picture. The player works fine upconverting to 720P.

I tried hooking it with a DVI-HDMI cable but it caused the player to lock up (I see this a known issue)

Anybody have any ideas what is causing this and how to fix it.

Thanks!

Talisin12:

I have the same setup (Zenith 318 to Sanyo 30"). I am using the Zenith's component cable. It works fine. I think one of the component cable connections is not good. Make sure the cable is not getting inference from the A/V equipments close by.

....or one of the component connections is loose.


Originally posted by buzzly
Talisin12:

I have the same setup (Zenith 318 to Sanyo 30"). I am using the Zenith's component cable. It works fine. I think one of the component cable connections is not good. Make sure the cable is not getting inference from the A/V equipments close by.

Finally got mine hooked up, received it from amazon last week. (march build) Right off the bat I have 2 issues and was wondering if it is normal for this player. I did a search and couldn't find any answers,

1 - The gears seem pretty loud to me when first initializing.... Normal?
2 - Avia disk had problems navigating through chapters.

First off, I apologize for not reading the entire thread, so this may have come up before, but this is what I discovered, today;

I have created a slideshow with several categories, on dvd (authored so it works in all dvd players, using an off-the shelf software solution). This dvd has worked without a hitch in several other players.

However, several times, it has locked up my Zenith to the point where I have to unplug the unit, to reset it. While I'm not too concerned about this, since I will shortly have a mediapc to cover all my slideshow/music needs, it does raise a concern of how robust the software is..

I am using component 1080i, so loading the latest firmware would not be an option for me (since it disables 1080i component on certain titles)

-Tom

Originally posted by AngelDriver
Finally got mine hooked up, received it from amazon last week. (march build) Right off the bat I have 2 issues and was wondering if it is normal for this player. I did a search and couldn't find any answers,

1 - The gears seem pretty loud to me when first initializing.... Normal?
2 - Avia disk had problems navigating through chapters.

I never noticed it being loud but didn't pay to much attention to it, regarding the navigation, are you using the keys in the upper part of the remote? From the remote layout it is easy to assume that the keys in the middle do the navigation but they don't.

Originally posted by tomes

I have created a slideshow with several categories, on dvd (authored so it works in all dvd players, using an off-the shelf software solution). This dvd has worked without a hitch in several other players.

However, several times, it has locked up my Zenith to the point where I have to unplug the unit, to reset it....

-Tom

It is my opinion that LG/Zenith sucks and I no longer support their products.

Gears/Loudness: I notice that mine seems to grind the gears a bit while trying to ID the disc. It's very quiet once it gets spun up and is playing the disc. On mine, the noise comes when the disc is first inserted and ends when the 'loading' icon appears.

Thanks, wblynch! I will do that, and post my findings!

Checked, and autoplay was in fact already disabled, so I guess it must be something else. I did author my own dvd movie with chapters and menus, and wasn't able to lock this one up. It was authored with a different program, and the recordable dvd was of a better brand. I'm guessing one of those two things may affect the player.

Originally posted by rd001
Gears/Loudness: I notice that mine seems to grind the gears a bit while trying to ID the disc. It's very quiet once it gets spun up and is playing the disc. On mine, the noise comes when the disc is first inserted and ends when the 'loading' icon appears.

mine does that and also whenever a layer change occurs.

double post

I just got my DVB-318. It has a March build date and it upconverts over component. I wasn't sure whether it would or not but I need to use DVI anyway so didn't really care but I guess it is nice to have that ability in case I need it in the future. I like this DVD player really well. It is being used with a Panasonic PT-L500U 720p LCD projector.

Chris

Any of you actually try the firmware that's out there? I loaded the DVI white crush fixer, and the DVD player didn't work through DVI. I reloaded the 'original' firmware, and it still didn't work through DVI.

Now I have a welcome screen that says 'LG.' It still upconverts via component but DVI is dead.

The DVI picture was outstanding on my 4805. One thing I noticed was that the 318 got very warm when I used DVI. Before I screwed around with the firmware, I had considered leaving the 318 powered up all the time so that I wouldn't have to remove and replace the DVI connector before I watched I movie. I became convinced that I would come home to a house fire...

Originally posted by PoseidonXXL
Any of you actually try the firmware that's out there? I loaded the DVI white crush fixer, and the DVD player didn't work through DVI. I reloaded the 'original' firmware, and it still didn't work through DVI.

Now I have a welcome screen that says 'LG.' It still upconverts via component but DVI is dead.

The DVI picture was outstanding on my 4805. One thing I noticed was that the 318 got very warm when I used DVI. Before I screwed around with the firmware, I had considered leaving the 318 powered up all the time so that I wouldn't have to remove and replace the DVI connector before I watched I movie. I became convinced that I would come home to a house fire...

I just ran mine using DVI for over 2 hours and it is still cool to the touch. It is in the open and well ventilated and I haven't noticed any heat issue at all yet.

Chris

Originally posted by PoseidonXXL
Any of you actually try the firmware that's out there? I loaded the DVI white crush fixer, and the DVD player didn't work through DVI. I reloaded the 'original' firmware, and it still didn't work through DVI.

Now I have a welcome screen that says 'LG.' It still upconverts via component but DVI is dead.

The DVI picture was outstanding on my 4805. One thing I noticed was that the 318 got very warm when I used DVI. Before I screwed around with the firmware, I had considered leaving the 318 powered up all the time so that I wouldn't have to remove and replace the DVI connector before I watched I movie. I became convinced that I would come home to a house fire...

Ran the firmware on mine and DVI was fine, both before and after.

Hi guys, sorry if this has been asked but....

Is there ANY way to know that the player is infact playing in 1080i via component?

How can i tell for SURE?

I just bought one with an old build date, but rumor has it that some stores sent the old builds into the company and the company disabled the 1080i component then sent them back!

Any ideas?

Originally posted by ChicagoBearsOwn
Hi guys, sorry if this has been asked but....

Is there ANY way to know that the player is infact playing in 1080i via component?

How can i tell for SURE?

I just bought one with an old build date, but rumor has it that some stores sent the old builds into the company and the company disabled the 1080i component then sent them back!

Any ideas?

Since apparently none of us can really tell if it is upconverting by watching the video displayed, you have just exposed a real fraud being bought by us gullible "videophiles". My Panasonic LCD projector has a menu item that tells me so I can know the video I am watching is improved and not just ordinary 480p. Since we really can't tell, I wouldn't worry about whether it upconverts using component or not. Just pretend that it does and the benefit will be the same.

Actually if you are using component and it lets you upconvert and your display on the front of your DVB318 shows 1080i or 720p, I believe it is one that works with component. I think without having the DVI port connected, the upconversion won't work on the models that don't allow component upconversion. Only DVI will work when it is connected so disconnecting the DVI port disables the upconversion but I don't have a DVB318 that disables upconversion with component so I don't know for sure.


Chris

"Since apparently none of us can really tell if it is upconverting by watching the video displayed"

Hmmm well if thats true then why does best buy claim its 2 times better than a standard dvd player at 480p?

Depending on your TV, certain stretch modes will not be available when the TV is receiving a 720 or 1080 signal.

So one way to tell is to hit your Stretch Mode / Picture Size button while the movie is playing and see whether any are blacked out.

Again this depends on your TV so it may not work but your TV manual may tell you about this...

my DVI is presently not working, but has anyone tried the DVI Detective appliance to see if that will help with the 318's lock-up through DVI?

http://www.gefen.com/kvm/product.jsp?prod_id=1378

Hey guys,

I'm needing to buy a new DVD player, and the prospect of upconverting sounds really good to me. I'm would be going over component to a 65" Mitsu diamond set.

The question I have is, Will I REALLY notice a difference in picture quality between this and a decent 480P player? I'm looking to get the Onkyo DV-SP502 and am wondering if I instead should go this route?

I'm used to the picture from an old Sony 9000ES DVD player at 480P. Will this Zenith impress me with the PQ or should I just go with the Onkyo?

I'm hoping some of you have gone through the same tough decision and can give me your thoughts!

Thanks,
Grey

Originally posted by Greyhawk68
Hey guys,



The question I have is, Will I REALLY notice a difference in picture quality between this and a decent 480P player?


Thanks,
Grey


according to best buy , YES
they claim its 2 times better

May I suggest something for the FAQ??

Can we please move the FAQ back to being a FAQ and move the general DVB-318 discussion to one of the DVB-318 threads?

This thread is getting way too long for anyone to easily find the FAQ information.

Also, maybe we can clean up a bit and have people go through and delete their frivilous postings about deliveries and other things that are out-dated now.

Thanks for considering these thoughts.

NO. we cant, deal with it, the end

I read all 37 pages, so can you

Wow... very helpful Mr. Chicago...In 4 total posts you've managed no real HELP that I can see. First, I realize what BB says and what the SPECS say. I'm asking real owners of the unit in a real forum whether or not they see a difference, thankyouverymuch...

Secondly having an actual FAQ and a separate discussion make total sense to me. Although I would have the FAQ outside of this forum on an actual webpage.


But saying, "NO, deal with it, the end" is rude and NOT what this forum is about...

Grrrr....

Grey

Originally posted by Greyhawk68
I'm asking real owners of the unit in a real forum whether or not they see a difference, thankyouverymuch...

Don't expect a big improvement over a good 480p DVD picture. I have a Panasonic PT-L500U 720p front projector and Sony XBR910 direct View monitor and a JVC XV-SA602SL DVD player in addition to the DVB318. I prefer the DVB318 picture with the 500 and prefer the 602 picture with the XBR. DVI didn't offer any improvement over component when using the DVB318 with either display. I am going to keep the DVB318 connected to the Panasonic and be done with any further comparisons or tests. I am very happy with DVD picture quality all the way around now which is what I hoped to achieve.

I read all I could bear about upconverting DVD players and found many complaints and many praises about all available models. I don't like to buy something and return it unless it is defective so I picked the one I decided would work best for me based on what I read and plan to hold onto it. Maybe somebody can explain why the DVB318 only offers improvement with my LCD projector and actually looks worse with my excellent XBR910. Then again, that is only my opinion.

Chris

Originally posted by ChicagoBearsOwn
NO. we cant, deal with it, the end

I read all 37 pages, so can you

Hello...This is not what we would expect from our users on the site. You are kindly asked to refrain from making such posts in the future for this type of post offers no help or information nor is seeking any help or information in any way.

Thank you.

Thanks Chris. That's what I thought. I think I'm going to go with my Onkyo so I get the benefit of SACD and DVD-A too. Thanks for your help!

Take Care,
Grey

The improvement for the upconverting DVD players is going to depend on the internal scalers inside your TV set if it has a poor quality scaler then the upconverting DVD players will show a good improvement. There will be a sight improvement for everyone because when the DVD scaler which is very good does its scaleing the dvd signal is still digital and has not been converted to analog yet for output over component. If you are using the DVI output then the signal stays digital all the way so no loss is introduced prior to your TV's scaler.

Best improvement for upconverting DVD players is output over component into a TV with a poor quality scaler.

Next best improvement for upconverting DVD players is output over DVI into a TV with a poor quality scaler

Very little improvement if any for upconverting DVD player is output over DVI into a TV with a good quality scaler.

Have had the LG unit for a while and it's a really "bright" player. ne1
know if there is a sevice menu tweak or something of the sort
to tame this bad boy. Starting to get tired of changing the TV settings after
switching inputs.

I have the HDCP problem with the 318 connected to an Infocus 4805 over DVI. It won't boot, is totally unusable.

So, I'm just checking in, that there are no solutions for this? I have to use component for my HD DVI box, as that box also has HDCP issues with the 4805.

Is anybody able to use a 318 with a 4805 with DVI? I, too, have the Infocus DVI to M1a 10 meter cable. Does it work with a different cable?

Barring any fix, then, I would need a different dvd player that could output a nice image over DVI that works with the 4805.

Any suggestions?

Thanks,

Wes

If I read you right here, make sure that, if you're using a DVI cable that you have NO component cables also plugged into the unit.

Is the Infocus 4805 HDCP compliant or not? If it isn't, you're probably close to being out of luck, unless someone has some kind of clever workaround. :(

I removed the component connections when I plugged in DVI.

The Infocus is listed as HDCP compliant, each unit is tested by Infocus with an "HDCP tester" to ensure compatibility. That's according to an Infocus design engineer, who's word is trusted in the projector forum.

My frustration is that all these products claim to be HDCP compliant, yet they can't talk to each other!

What I'm trying to find out is if anyone has a workaround for this, or if I have to go shopping for a new dvd player. . .

Thanks for the help,

Wes

Though the 4805 says that it's HDCP compliant, I can't get my DVB318 DVI working either. If you're set on DVI, there are other alternatives (DVD player wise). You can PM me f you want. I'm using my DVB318 though component on my 4805.

Greyhawk-

It seems that your question about PQ and how big a jump you can expect is ultimately somewhat subjective.

Everyone has had their own opinions on the upconvert PQ ranging from worse to no improvement at all to amazing PQ.

My own experience has been that I saw a definite benefit in the sharpness of my image and while I wasnt totally blown away, it was a definite, clear upgrade from my Toshiba SD-3915 and I would recommend it to others based on my experience.

The best thing to do is to pick one up through BestBuy or somewhere else with a good return policy and judge for yourself - you may be very pleased with the results.

In response to the PQ question, I found the DVB318 to have a better pic than my 480P DVD players...it's an outstanding picture.

Hey, I just installed the Firmware that allows component upconversion and I now get scan lines, what can I do about this?

Little history, I had the original firmware and sent the unit in for work. When I got it back, it wouldn't upconvert because the new firmware prevented it. I never had scan lines before.

Running it into a Infocus 4805

Avia disk freezes after the explanation of what the test pattern is and what your looking for "We will now display the test pattern so that you can adjust your picture..." Then nothing, it never gets to the pattern.
Any advice? Or has anyone else had any issues.

Thanks.

Originally posted by mrigsby
Hey, I just installed the Firmware that allows component upconversion and I now get scan lines, what can I do about this?

Little history, I had the original firmware and sent the unit in for work. When I got it back, it wouldn't upconvert because the new firmware prevented it. I never had scan lines before.

Running it into a Infocus 4805

I have the same combo. You have a ground loop issue now that you're using a analog link. Try plugging both the PJ AND the player in the same outlet, that should cure it. Even so, I have a few: shut down the player for 5 seconds and power it on again, that helps.

To use the 4805 with DVI: plug component when booting and AFTER THAT, plug DVI AND unplug components. You'll be OK before going nuts or sick of doing the routine after a while...

AngelDriver: This has been ID'ed countless times... turn off auto-play and you will be OK.

Cricricri,

I thought having Component and DVI hooked up at the same time was a major glitch fest?

Just try it: If I remember well, you can see a DVI picture when both are hooked, but not component (or vice-versa). Never tried to boot the 4805 when both are connected, but use my routine, and it would do fine.

Thanks, I'll try it

Originally posted by Q of BanditZ
This firmware is for restoring full component video upconversion to the Zenith 318 if you have a model that has the "newer" firmware. Is there a similar firmware for the LG LST-3510A that disabled upconversion on the RGB output for commercial DVDs?

******************REGION FREE PLAY***************************
DISCLAIMER: The following information involves basically an unoffical hack that many seem to have had success with. It is not endorsed nor has it originated from Zenith or LG Electronics in any way, shape, or form I've read on VideoHelp.com that the download for the 5000 series worked for the LG LST-3510A.
Can anyone confirm?

Thanks

Whats the verdict of the most recent build Pic quality over DVI at 720p?
I've read that it isnt to good at 720p over component but how about over dvi? Thanks.

Originally posted by tubby
Whats the verdict of the most recent build Pic quality over DVI at 720p?
I've read that it isnt to good at 720p over component but how about over dvi? Thanks.

I haven't tried 720p over component but I liked the 720p picture over DVI. Switching back and forth, I decided I liked the 1080i picture over DVI better so that is how I have been using it. I have a Panasonic PT-L500U 720p LCD front projector so I was surprised. I may do some more comparisons. I preferred the 720p over 480p and thought I was set. I can't find fault with the picture and the differences are not great, just a subtle preference.

Chris

Originally posted by tubby
Whats the verdict of the most recent build Pic quality over DVI at 720p?
I've read that it isnt to good at 720p over component but how about over dvi? Thanks.

The major issue I see with 720p over either component OR DVI is the color bleeding. Take a look at the opening screen at both resolutions... at 1080i the edges around the DVD logo are clean... at 720p there is red color smearing. I don't know if that is visible in actual material or not?