Feel free to send me the pic, to my regular email addy in my sig.

Your set is missing horizontal sync in this pic.

What you're describing in terms of timing of the problem and its intermittancy indicates it's still thermally related, so yes I would expect it to have come from the PS board not being completely resoldered. Perhaps this is an unusual wrinkle because we have little experience with what happens over time when not all the joints are resoldered. The normal thing on a virgin aged but completely unsoldered board is for the worst ones to go bad first, but who knows when you simply do some of them and not all? The whole resoldering op becomes a wild card.

Send me the board, I really don't need the pic, as I am sure of what I'll see. But send it along if you'd like.

Hopefully your set is working properly upon turnon from dead cold, which is what I require if you are going to be sending me a board. I need a firm baseline of your set working fine from dead cold, and only having problems after the set warms up. If any bad thing has gone permanent, something downline from the PS board has usually been damaged and we have to go to the next level of troubleshooting.

AND DON'T USE YOUR SET FOR VIEWING UNTIL THIS HAS BEEN HANDLED PROPERLY. Whatever is causing this to happen is just one of many possibilities, if your board was not totally resoldered at the time. DO NOT allow it back to normal operating temp while in this compromised condition, showing evidence of intermittent connections.

You may have a major spike ready to happen within the next viewing period, that could damage your set very expensively, possibly totalling it on you.

:eek:

UNPLUG YOUR SET until this has been handled adequately.


b

Mr. Bob,
The set was good when I turned it on again after cold dead, but I unplugged it within 20 seconds. I have read your previous thread and had some idea how the bd should be packed, big bubble wrap on it, 15x15x22 oversized box (I will try see if I can get it in ups or post office), and lay it slanted. Can you email me back (john.contact@gmail.com) the shipping address? I’m in Boston, I know I have to wait for few hours for LA time. I will wait till get your feed back and start disassemble the ps bd. Looking forward to hear you soon.

John

Mr. Bob,
The set was good when I turned it on again after cold dead, but I unplugged it within 20 seconds. I have read your previous thread and had some idea how the bd should be packed, big bubble wrap on it, 15x15x22 oversized box (I will try see if I can get it in ups or post office), and lay it slanted. Can you email me back (john.contact@gmail.com) the shipping address? I’m in Boston, I know I have to wait for few hours for LA time. I will wait till get your feed back and start disassemble the ps bd. Looking forward to hear you soon.

John

Be sure to leave the frame attached to it for support, you really only need to remove one screw to remove the PS board (plus the wiring connectors).

Be sure to leave the frame attached to it for support, you really only need to remove one screw to remove the PS board (plus the wiring connectors).

I have few pictures they were taken 3 years ago, may be you can point out which the one screw and frame. You might think I did it before why cannot do it now. I just want do it right.http://www.flickr.com/photos/yujiang/3930829559/sizes/l/[IMG]

Be sure to leave the frame attached to it for support, you really only need to remove one screw to remove the PS board (plus the wiring connectors).
http://www.flickr.com/photos/yujiang/3930829559/

Be sure to leave the frame attached to it for support, you really only need to remove one screw to remove the PS board (plus the wiring connectors).

The picture couldn't show up, don't know why.

Be sure to leave the frame attached to it for support, you really only need to remove one screw to remove the PS board (plus the wiring connectors).
Try it one more time.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/yujiang/3930829559/

John

Be sure to leave the frame attached to it for support, you really only need to remove one screw to remove the PS board (plus the wiring connectors).

Still didn't work.

The picture couldn't show up, don't know why.

You have to have a host to host the pic, I use Webshots, its free.

I'll see if I can find a pic of the one screw, going from memory its in the lower left quadrant of the board as you look from behind the TV. After removing that screw and all the connections the whole board and frame slides up and off.

I think its in this hole. Also I now see a few screws have to be removed to get the wiring loop thingys off too.

http://inlinethumb25.webshots.com/11736/2260352890042310107S600x600Q85.jpg (http://entertainment.webshots.com/photo/2260352890042310107QOSICR)

I think its in this hole. Also I now see a few screws have to be removed to get the wiring loop thingys off too.

http://inlinethumb25.webshots.com/11736/2260352890042310107S600x600Q85.jpg (http://entertainment.webshots.com/photo/2260352890042310107QOSICR)

Thanks! Yes, I see the screw in side. Do you what others have to be removed? Sorry for asking too much...

Thanks! Yes, I see the screw in side. Do you what others have to be removed? Sorry for asking too much...

Well, right by that one screw for the frame is a screw that holds the loop thingy for the main power cord into the board, that has to be removed plus IIRC there is one ground wire screwed to the frame on the left side (don't forget to put that back on later!)

Yeah you can see the grounding wire and screw in this pic, it looks like there might be another one at the top left too:

http://inlinethumb36.webshots.com/44387/2407186950042310107S600x600Q85.jpg (http://entertainment.webshots.com/photo/2407186950042310107igkaKx)

Yeah you can see the grounding wire and screw in this pic, it looks like there might be another one at the top left too:

http://inlinethumb36.webshots.com/44387/2407186950042310107S600x600Q85.jpg (http://entertainment.webshots.com/photo/2407186950042310107igkaKx)
I removed 4 screws, 1 on the top and 1 on the bottom of left side with black wire, 1 in the hole and 1 with the loop for power cord, but the frame is pretty tight bond to the back, it seems is glued to the back.

John, I just sent you the info you need by email, to the email addy you provided.


Once the screws you have already removed are outa there, and the rest of the screws stay, keeping the board secured to its metal frame for shipping solidity, just pull upward on the whole board and it will come up and fall into your hands. It's on slots mounted to the wood.

Don't take those out, leave them there. Once the board is free, guide it out thru the wiring and pack it in the big bubble wrap, not the small stuff. And follow the directions I just sent to you.

Great job, and great pix! They should help lots of people on this thread.

And thanks, mt, for chiming in -

;)

b

Mr. Bob,
I have read your previous thread and had some idea how the bd should be packed, big bubble wrap on it, 15x15x22 oversized box (I will try see if I can get it in ups or post office), and lay it slanted. John

Actually it's UPS or Fedex.

USPS has limits I don't like - like not leaving a receipt when they take a box away - seems none of them do - requiring me to wait in line if I want to take it down to them. Otherwise it could disappear from my front porch once I set it out there and there would be no proof USPS got it. I live in a good neighborhood, and always get boxes left for me, but that outgoing box status with no evidence of pickup is just one more needless worry I'd rather not have on my mind.

So I prefer to take returning boards down there and drop them off myself.

UPS and Fedex rarely have the kind of lines I always find at the post office. And they are not far away.

DHL isn't even in the running anymore, they stopped doing consumer deliveries and pickups.

So UPS and Fedex, please -


b

Yeah you can see the grounding wire and screw in this pic, it looks like there might be another one at the top left too:

http://inlinethumb36.webshots.com/44387/2407186950042310107S600x600Q85.jpg (http://entertainment.webshots.com/photo/2407186950042310107igkaKx)

Any other screws?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/yujiang/3931055731/

Actually it's UPS or Fedex.

USPS has limits I don't like - like not leaving a receipt when they take a box away - seems none of them do - requiring me to wait in line if I want to take it down to them. Otherwise it could disappear from my front porch once I set it out there and there would be no proof USPS got it. I live in a good neighborhood, and always get boxes left for me, but that outgoing box status with no evidence of pickup is just one more needless worry I'd rather not have on my mind.

So I prefer to take returning boards down there and drop them off myself.

UPS and Fedex rarely have the kind of lines I always find at the post office. And they are not far away.

DHL isn't even in the running anymore, they stopped doing consumer deliveries and pickups.

So UPS and Fedex, please -


b

Bob,
I got your email, will follow your instruction. But after I removed 4 screws as mt said, the bd still couldn't removed. Any thing else I'm missing?

Bob,
I got your email, will follow your instruction. But after I removed 4 screws as mt said, the bd still couldn't removed. Any thing else I'm missing?

I have some problem for attaching picture in here so I sent a picture by email, hope you can tell me what should I do next.

mt, thanks for previous guidance, any idea why the bd still so tight? I wish you can see the picture too.

The whole board should slide up about 1/4" to 1/2", then out. Is it moving up at all?

The whole board should slide up about 1/4" to 1/2", then out. Is it moving up at all?

Got it, a little trick;). Thanks so much! Now is time for packing:)

Yes, it's mounted on slots. DON'T remove THOSE screws, the big ones the slots mount onto! Once the board has been removed you're home free and can ship it.

Glad you gave it that one last test to make sure it's turning on properly from dead cold. You said you did, and then turned it off after 20 seconds.

It should be emminently ready for shipping now.


b

Yes, it's mounted on slots. DON'T remove THOSE screws, the big ones the slots mount onto! Once the board has been removed you're home free and can ship it.

Glad you gave it that one last test to make sure it's turning on properly from dead cold. You said you did, and then turned it off after 20 seconds.

It should be emminently ready for shipping now.


b

Bob, the bd is on the way to you shipped next day air by UPS, just sent a email to you, check the details in there.

Great, I'll be watching for it -

b

Alright. I've read where Mr. Bob talks about the importance of cleaning the optics, I've read his guide on page 28(?) of this thread in terms of using Sprayaway and paper towels. But before I even go there, I need to know how to get in the front of the TV!!

http://i795.photobucket.com/albums/yy234/shutyertrap/TVscrews.jpg

Am I to remove the actual screen? If so, is it just the screws where the yellow arrows are pointing that I need to remove?

Or am I to remove the screws where the red arrows are pointing?

Since I don't have the service manual for the 510, I don't really wanna just start unscrewing things willy nilly. Especially when there's that high voltage sticker right there!

Some more questions (and maybe you guys can just provide the answers before I even need to ask them)...

--Where do I get the Sprayaway cleaner? I live in SoCal, can I just get it at a Home Depot or Lowes, or is there a specific store. I have some foaming glass cleaner they sell at Costco, but it tends to run as well as foam.

--Anyone have a diagram or photos of taking the guns apart for getting at the four lenses? What screws I'll need to undo, and any pitfalls awaiting me?

--I'm assuming this is a yes also, but I'm asking anyways...do I need to clean the mirror since I'm doing the guns? If so, do I use the Sprayaway on that too, or do I need to use a Windex type product?

--When wiping the lenses (in one direction, with a rolling motion, yeah I got it!) is the paper towel supposed to be dry or do you pre-wet it?

Those are the questions I immediately have. As you can guess, I've never opened this set up in the 9 years I've owned it. Sad I know, but I didn't come across this forum until just this year, and I didn't know any better!

Appreciate the help.

Chris

Well the red screws have nothing to do with the screen. IIRC the yellow ones do though.

I got my Sprayway at a Walmart Supercenter. :D

Not sure where you got 4 lenses. I count 9 lenses plus the mirror. I used Sprayway on the mirror too.

There is the top lens on each gun, the bottom lens on each gun, and the coolant cover below the lenses on each gun. 3 guns x 3 = 9 There are 4 screws that hold each lens barrel to each gun/coolant cover.

The towel is dry but the lens is wet.

Good luck.

...Since I don't have the service manual for the 510...

Why not? Its free here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=16543391&postcount=1815

Thank Zodiac

Thank you thank you thank you!:D

And big thank you to Zodiac for posting it. Can't believe I missed that post, especially since about a month ago I was scouring the net for the manual (but being a cheap bastard) that I didn't have to pay for.

Here's hoping I don't get myself into to much trouble...

--Anyone have a diagram or photos of taking the guns apart for getting at the four lenses? What screws I'll need to undo, and any pitfalls awaiting me?

--I'm assuming this is a yes also, but I'm asking anyways...do I need to clean the mirror since I'm doing the guns? If so, do I use the Sprayaway on that too, or do I need to use a Windex type product?



Here's 3 of the 4 screws to remove each lens barrel (one at each corner).

http://inlinethumb64.webshots.com/42111/2327907600042310107S600x600Q85.jpg (http://entertainment.webshots.com/photo/2327907600042310107UBerus)

Some pit falls:

1) Getting mosture into the lens barrel, between the lenses (it helps if you hold the barrel up so the cleaner doesn't run into it)

2) Scratching the lenses. I would not rub a dry towel on dry lens (especially a paper towel).

3) Stripping the screws

4) Dropping the lens barrel or dropping something on it (like a screwdriver)

5) Put each lens barrel back in the same spot (doing them one at a time eliminates that pitfall), facing the same direction (not rotated 180* off)

You will need to redo the convergence after doing a deep cleaning.

No, do NOT use Windex, or any other cleaner with ammonia on an aluminum surface mirror. Sprayway is good.

More on cleaning optics: http://www.keohi.com/keohihdtv/learnabout/generaltips/screenoptics/cleaningtheoptics.html

Okay, so yes to the yellow arrows pointing to the 4 screws for removing the screen. Looking at the exploded diagram in the manual, is it then just a matter of lifting up on the screen? Looks like its sitting on a lip or something.

Understand the need to redo the convergence, but I won't need to deal with refocusing the lenses will I? With the convergence, is it just the standard blue and red, or will I need to get at the green through the service menu too?

Curious about the focus, cause the corners of my set have never been that sharp. When I first got the set and had an ISF guy calibrate it, he mentioned that he couldn't get the corners sharp, but then he didn't open up the set either. Then I just read Mr Bob saying that most of the Elites OOB needed some focusing. All I know is that whenever I've done some touch up on the convergence, the blue and red are always bending away from each other in at least two of the corners, and it's a matter of settling for what's least offensive, not perfect.

I'll go look for the Spraway at *shudder* Wal-Mart today (hate that store, but sometimes ya gotta go. Maybe I'll check Target first :rolleyes:).

I just did the standard single & multipoint convergence in the user menu.

The focusing should stay the same unless the wing nut is loose or something. If you want it better, now would be a good time to do it because it will also throw the convergence off. Its pretty easy to do the manual focusing using the cantilever method Mr. Bob talks about.

The screen removal should be obvious once you start doing it. After the frame (trim) is removed there are 3 brackets at the top and one on each side. Most of the screws holding those brackets on just have to be loosened slightly and the bracket slides over and off. There is one or 2 screws that have to come completely out of the brackets. You will also want to completely remove the screws on the side brackets of you do the cantilever method of focusing, so that you don't scratch the screen as you slide it to the side. Don't use any wet cleaning method on the screen, or so I've heard.

Why not? Its free here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=16543391&postcount=1815

Thank Zodiac

I just tried to get the serv man'l and was spun round and round and round again. Never did get access to it, tho I now have a very pretty account there...

:confused:


b

Here's 3 of the 4 screws to remove each lens barrel (one at each corner).

http://inlinethumb64.webshots.com/42111/2327907600042310107S600x600Q85.jpg (http://entertainment.webshots.com/photo/2327907600042310107UBerus)

Some pit falls:

1) Getting mosture into the lens barrel, between the lenses (it helps if you hold the barrel up so the cleaner doesn't run into it)

If you're doing the cleaning with the lenses in place with a liquid cleaner, be sure to immediately put a paper towel on the bottommost edge of the lens inside the edge, to catch any runoff before it can go inside and fog up the inner lenses. Sprayway's foam has no such worries as long as you don't keep it there for a long time. 1 minute max. The heat of the sys will cause anything left there longer to start to dry out.

I find it easier to clean the lens tops with them in place, rather than being held in the air. Lens bottoms, hold them in the air, upside down.


2) Scratching the lenses. I would not rub a dry towel on dry lens (especially a paper towel).

Ditto, and in spades! Nor a microfibre cloth or anything else dry. NO dry method is safe for plastic lenses.


3) Stripping the screws

4) Dropping the lens barrel or dropping something on it (like a screwdriver)

5) Put each lens barrel back in the same spot (doing them one at a time eliminates that pitfall), facing the same direction (not rotated 180* off)

Or 90* off.


You will need to redo the convergence after doing a deep cleaning.

Only the static/crosshairs. The dynamic won't need any great deal of specific attention just because of the lens removal, but it may need some, so it's best to do the removal etc BEFORE redoing your convergence to a high precision degree, either way. After years of drift, removing and reinstalling the lenses really only requires the crosshairs be redone, there won't be enough change in the high precision to worry about the dynamic just because of that, since the original conv will have become so sloppy by then anyway.

No, do NOT use Windex, or any other cleaner with ammonia on an aluminum surface mirror. Sprayway is good.

Windex WITHOUT ammonia is also good, as is Glass Plus.

More on cleaning optics: http://www.keohi.com/keohihdtv/learnabout/generaltips/screenoptics/cleaningtheoptics.html

I just tried to get the serv man'l and was spun round and round and round again. Never did get access to it, tho I now have a very pretty account there...

:confused:


b

Yeah, its not working for me now either. :confused:

I was just about to create an account when I noticed the 'download now' button that had suddenly appeared on the left hand side of the screen. Whammo, instant download!

Went to check the cleaning supplies the wife has, and whaddya know, there's a can of Sprayway in there! Nice.

Just to be clear...

Spray the cleaner directly on the lens, and then let it sit for what, 20-40 seconds? Then use a dry paper towel and drag towards me in one motion. Do I apply much pressure, or just use the weight of my hand? After that initial wipe, will I need to apply more cleaner and do another go around?

Also wondering if I can use Kimwipes, which is what we use to clean filters and lenses for motion picture cameras. It's funny, cause when cleaning the camera lenses, I was always taught (and this came from the techs at Panavision) to start in the middle of the lense and spiral out to the edges. Granted, these are glass lenses, so that probably makes all the difference. I think that's why I'm asking so many questions, cause I've got a set of habits that I want to apply here cause it seems like the same kind of thing, yet I know isn't.

Anyways, appreciate the info Mr Bob and MT Goat, keep it comin'!

Spray directly on the lens, guarding against runoff by absorbing it at the lowermost edge. Allow the wetness to stay on the lens for 10-15 seconds, to reach under the gritty particulates and suspend them in liquid/foam. Then use a crumpled up dry paper towel, which of course gets wet when you apply it to the wetted lens.

Use a gentle streetsweeping motion, lifting the grit UP and away from the lens surface as you go towards yourself. Use only enough force for firm contact, no more, no less. Each swipe will come up with the lens dry in that area at the end of the swipe. 3 swipes per lens - left middle and right.

Do it a second time if there are still swirls. I'd stop there. Better to leave a little on there than scratch something indelibly.

I'm not experienced with Kimwipes -


b

I'm not experienced with Kimwipes -





As far as for something to use in delicate cleaning applications. It looks like they might be better for cleaning the optics than paper towels are.
I don't see any mention of them having any sort of chemical treating, they are soft, absorbent and extra low lint.

http://www.kcprofessional.com/us/product-details.asp?prd_id=34705

" KIMTECH SCIENCE* KIMWIPES* Delicate Task Wiper, 2-ply, offers a unique combination of low-lint tissue softness and multi-ply absorbency that's perfect for a multitude of delicate tasks.

* Multi-ply absorbency, wipes up liquid and dust
* Wipes clean - extra low-lint and extractable performance
* One-at-a-time dispensing"


And they are also not that expensive, as it looks like you can get them for under $10 for a box.

:)Fixed my daughter's Pro-Elite-510 tonight,had the famous power problem. I did my research on this forum and located the bad solder joints and did the entire power board. Thank you to every one for the invaluable information here.
The connection point that was the worst,one pin at E3 had come disconnected altogether. I would suppose that was the major area. The TV comes in great,much better than some of them in the stores today.

Y'oughta see what she's capable of fully tricked out.

;)


b

As far as for something to use in delicate cleaning applications. It looks like they might be better for cleaning the optics than paper towels are.
I don't see any mention of them having any sort of chemical treating, they are soft, absorbent and extra low lint.

http://www.kcprofessional.com/us/product-details.asp?prd_id=34705

" KIMTECH SCIENCE* KIMWIPES* Delicate Task Wiper, 2-ply, offers a unique combination of low-lint tissue softness and multi-ply absorbency that's perfect for a multitude of delicate tasks.

* Multi-ply absorbency, wipes up liquid and dust
* Wipes clean - extra low-lint and extractable performance
* One-at-a-time dispensing"


And they are also not that expensive, as it looks like you can get them for under $10 for a box.

Tried to get some today, the closest outlet is in Eugene Oregon, and they wanted over $200 for something like 18 cases, as it is a special order.

Think I'll stick with the tried and true...

:o

b

Hi Bob, quick question for you or any one who can offer some help. I have a Pioneer elite pro 520 that is in great working shape.
A few days ago I decided to give the service menu a go and adjust the overscan problem I get while watching dvd's or playing my 360. I wrote down my starting points incase I had to abort and soon noticed that when I had the picture where it needed to be to fit the frame, the convergence was out of wack. Without a service manual I didn't want to get started in that whole ordeal so I reset the horizontal and vertical to stock settings.
After doing so I noticed the picture is now darker than it once was. I have to adjust the brightness much higher than normal to get a watchable picture on certain games or programs. Colors are all true as they have always been but the black level seems to be somehow set very low.
Any idea what could cause this or what service code I could tinker with on my settings to correct this.
Any help would be much appreciated.

Jason

A few days ago I decided to give the service menu a go... Without a service manual I didn't want to get started in that whole ordeal...
Any idea ... what service code I could tinker with on my settings to correct this.
Any help would be much appreciated.

Jason

Jason, do not fool around in service mode without the service manual. It's not a service "menu"; there is no menu. It is truly opaque. Even with the service manual, it's not easy to navigate. You need the manual just to begin to understand what the remote's buttons do in service mode.

You can buy the paper manual from Pioneer (recommended; it's thick) or download a bootleg copy from the 'net (not recommended; it's copyrighted). Just don't leave home without it.

Thanks for the tip bweissman. I'm planning on having a pro stop buy and finally get this overscan problem straightened out and hopefully get this TV calibrated to it's true potential. I just hope the typical TV repair man has the knowledge to tackle the job.
I want to hang on to this TV for as long a possible before going the plasma route.

Its hard enough to figure out the service mode WITH the service manual, I'd never go in there without it.

Its been said by Mr Bob that the easiest way to reduce overscan is the shimming mod.

Tried to get some today, the closest outlet is in Eugene Oregon, and they wanted over $200 for something like 18 cases, as it is a special order.



There are also sellers on Amazon that have them if you only want to buy just one box, and for under $10.

Without a service manual I didn't want to get started in that whole ordeal so I reset the horizontal and vertical to stock settings.

You may want to at least D/L the service manual for the x10 series sets, most of the adjustment information should be the same as for the x20 series. And if nothing else, it's certainly a LOT better, than having no service manual at all!

http://www.mediafire.com/file/320o0qiyzmy

Thankyou for the link John....I appreciate it.

Cleaned my optics yesterday for the first time ever on my 510. Heart was pounding the whole time cause I didn't wanna screw up anything! Anyways, thanks to you guys and the service manual that was made available, I never felt like I was outta my league.

Things that surprised me...

--My mirror wasn't dusty at all. Cleaned it anyway, but despite shining the flashlight on it and giving the finger rub, it was pretty clean.

--I was warned about dropping screws, and I didn't. But there was this little rod coming between the red and green guns the made removing and replacing the back corner screws of those guns a nerve racking experience for me. Normally I'd use a magnetic tipped screw driver, but I erred on the side of caution knowing there's magnates in the TV. You guys can tell me if I was being silly or not.

--Removed the lens pack and wasn't expecting the almost cup like final lense. Debated for a few minutes whether I was supposed to be cleaning it or not (it needed it) cause I don't recall anyone mentioning a lens of that deep a concave. Then I fretted about how much spray to use. Might have used a little too little on that first one, but the rest of them I foamed up pretty good.

Hard for me to judge how well I did with the physical clean. I saw streeks and things that on a film camera lens I'd have gone to town on, but here I just worried I'd scratch things.

Convergence went well. Never knew the proper way of doing it till I read the service manual, breaking the screen up into quadrants, then color, and ONLY doing verticals, then doing horizontals. Made it much easier, and more accurate then I've ever been. Also, doing it with before putting back on the anti glare screen, man that saved my eyes!

So I snapped some before and after pics using everyone's favorite Fifth Element scene...

http://i795.photobucket.com/albums/yy234/shutyertrap/TVv1.jpg

My black level was at 10, I turned it back down to 0, which was where it was at when first calibrated 9 years ago. Debating whether that's too dark or not.

http://i795.photobucket.com/albums/yy234/shutyertrap/TVv2.jpg

I didn't time code for exact screen shots, so that might explain the sudden appearance of her right eyeball, but I love how inky the blacks are again in general.

http://i795.photobucket.com/albums/yy234/shutyertrap/TVv3.jpg

Here's where I'm really not sure about the black level. Top pic, you can see her face and more white of her outfit. Bottom the face is not really visible, and the white is fairly shadowed (again this might be due to them not being exactly the same grab), but it's so much crisper now. In the below pic it's a case of seeing the policeman's eyes or not. When in motion I didn't have a problem with it, so I don't know.

http://i795.photobucket.com/albums/yy234/shutyertrap/TVv4.jpg

This one illustrates one of the things that really made me wanna clean the optics. See how the bright white light halos in the top pic? I cropped it out of the photo, but it was haloing into the letterboxing! Whenever there'd be a scene with someone standing in front of a bright window, they'd just be a silhouette. Working in the camera department, I know most cinematographers would have exposed for this. So I figured it was the dust on the lens causing this. Happy to see that with the cleaning, no more halo!

Little bummed that I didn't get rid of this small blemish that is visible in the lower portion of my screen (no pic), as it is now obvious it's not any of the lenses. Must be on one of the mirrors underneath somewhere. I'm not going there! Also, I think I've now made the minor screen burn in I have from stupidly watching things in 4:3 even more prominent. It's really only visible with almost white screens, but more so now. Oh well, what am I gonna do. I can live with it.

Think I'll save up for the HDFury2 over there at Monoprice now that I have a PS3, and then think about forking over the bucks for a proper calibration again. Then again, the overscan is driving me nuts these days too...:confused:

I'm very much in the same situation you are shutyertrap. I had my set calibrated several years ago but I was never fully happy with the result. I tinkered with the adjustment box inside the tv and have things looking much better...stunning really, although the blacks seem a tad too dark.

I had the service Tech out today to help with my overscan issues and from what he explained, it's a major undertaking with these sets. Not only did he want to charge me 500.00, he also needs to have the entire set hauled into his shop. The day this set leaves my house is the day it's gone for good. Can't even begin to imagine the hassle of loading this beast in my truck without damaging the hell out of the casing.

Unless I get a magical visit from mr. Bob, I'd say this is as good as it gets untill I decide to make the jump to flat panels. I love this set to death and hate the thought of seeing it retire early but the overscan issue is starting to get to me.

How to take care of overscan: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1129740

You may want to at least D/L the service manual for the x10 series sets, most of the adjustment information should be the same as for the x20 series. And if nothing else, it's certainly a LOT better, than having no service manual at all!

http://www.mediafire.com/file/320o0qiyzmy

Will this manual also work for the 710? It lists the 510 and 610 but not the 710. Is there much difference?

Thanks
Zip

Hi Bob, quick question for you or any one who can offer some help. I have a Pioneer elite pro 520 that is in great working shape.
A few days ago I decided to give the service menu a go and adjust the overscan problem I get while watching dvd's or playing my 360. I wrote down my starting points incase I had to abort and soon noticed that when I had the picture where it needed to be to fit the frame, the convergence was out of wack. Without a service manual I didn't want to get started in that whole ordeal so I reset the horizontal and vertical to stock settings.
After doing so I noticed the picture is now darker than it once was. I have to adjust the brightness much higher than normal to get a watchable picture on certain games or programs. Colors are all true as they have always been but the black level seems to be somehow set very low.
Any idea what could cause this or what service code I could tinker with on my settings to correct this.
Any help would be much appreciated.

Jason

Anytime you come back out of sm the User settings auto revert back to midpoint. At your Elite set's age the pic will not only be dirty as all getout, but dim as well, needing the realignment of the Screen controls I perform in my calibrations when needed - which is at all times on these x10 Elites.

So you were prolly running your Black Level at plus 12-15 before, and now it's back to 0, which is way too low at your set's age without the Screen trimpot realignment. It takes a special sequence of registers to get the brightness changed, and unless you did that, your sm br will not have changed.

I can coach you in that realignment over the phone if you wish.


b

Thanks for the tip bweissman. I'm planning on having a pro stop buy and finally get this overscan problem straightened out and hopefully get this TV calibrated to it's true potential. I just hope the typical TV repair man has the knowledge to tackle the job.
I want to hang on to this TV for as long a possible before going the plasma route.


Do NOT go with the typical repairman! The net is rife with horror stories of what happens when you do that. If you do and have to be bailed out, it's much more expensive to first undo the damage they have done and start over, than to simply have a CRT grade calibrator do it from scratch OOB.

There are very few CRT capable calibrators left, most have moved on to the much easier to do - and less time consuming - flat panels to calibrate.

I am one of the few left who has dedicated himself to carrying on CRT's blazing tradition till there are no more of them. Please consider flying me in or find someone else to fly in, WHO IS TRULY QUALIFIED TO CALIBRATE THEM. The learning curve on them is immense, and most repair techs have their hands full just doing repairs, have no time nor patience for that CRT learning curve, where the image STRUCTURE is handled. I and and an even smaller number of select calibrators - count them prolly on one hand - are the only ones who do both repair and calibration.

Chances are you'll have to fly somebody in, one way or the other.


B

Will this manual also work for the 710? It lists the 510 and 610 but not the 710. Is there much difference?

Thanks
Zip

Only differences will be in the sizes of the guns, lenses, mirrors and screens. The electronics and sms are the same for all 3 sizes.

b

Thanks for the info Bob...I may take you up on that phone consultation. I wish I'd known about the factory reset when you enter the service menu. I'd never have tinkered with it if I knew.
You are correct about the CRT based knowledge of the typical TV repair man. I knew I was in trouble 5 min. in with this guy. He offered no helpfull insite and basically was trying to push me to upgrade with a newer (flatter) model.
$45.00 house call for basically nothing.

Thanks too for the link Mt-goat. Interesting stuff.

Just sent an email to you.

J

b

Sorry, email for Bob.

J

I wish I'd known about the factory reset when you enter the service menu. I'd never have tinkered with it if I knew.


Actually it just resets the USER settings to OOB, which is midpoint on all bargraphs. Not a factory reset, tho there may be one in there. Personally if there is, I don't want to know how to spring it!

:p


b

Hi everyone,

I'm a proud and frustrated owner of the 710. After trying all sorts of voodoo magic short of sacrificing a goat, I finally stumbled across this forum and was relieved to find others too had the blue flicker + pop/shutoff problem.

As I understand it, in 90% of the cases, all I need to do is re-solder the PS board and the problem will go away. I'd like to, if possible, resolve the situation myself (can't afford to lose this TV, or pay for repair services at this point).

Thing is, I have no soldering experience, but I have been looking up guides/video tutorials. The other problem is, I'm completely lost as to what I'm looking for even after I remove the PS board. I've seen pictures in this thread of the board and its removal, but I'm not sure what I should be trying to resolder. Anyone that can point me in the right direction? (I'm horrible at visualizing, so pictures would be a big help).

Welcome Richard!

I don't know what others will say, but I'll tell you as another proud 710 owner - I know how much this beauty cost me in the beginning. A good soldering job is only a flash in the pan compared to having to purchase another set! I would not begin my soldering career on this set. And I consider myself handy. Pay someone who knows what they are doing.

Thing is, I have no soldering experience, but I have been looking up guides/video tutorials. The other problem is, I'm completely lost as to what I'm looking for even after I remove the PS board. I've seen pictures in this thread of the board and its removal, but I'm not sure what I should be trying to resolder. Anyone that can point me in the right direction? (I'm horrible at visualizing, so pictures would be a big help).


The power supply board in these Pioneer sets, or any other circuit board for that matter. Is NOT the kind of thing you want to try and learn how to solder on! Very sloppy work or overheating the parts while trying to solder them has the potential to kill the boards and also make them if not unfixable, at the least very expensive to have someone else take over and try and correct any gross errors that were made in trying to solder it.

Again! If you have no experience at all in soldering circuit boards, these boards are NOT the things to be trying to learn on! But if you still want to try doing it yourself, find some junk circuit boards to practice on first! But for someone with no soldering experience at all, the best bet is, take out the board yourself, and have someone else who has experience in soldering printed circuit boards do the actual re-soldering on it.

Not only that, but what happens when you accidentally leave a solder bridge in there that you couldn't see, and you blow your set up (techspeak, of course... :rolleyes:) FAR too much is riding on this one op to allow it to be done by anyone unqualified to get it done right. Stop messing around with DIYer consciousness on something like this. Don't even THINK of resoldering this board yourself if you've never soldered before. One false move and your entire set could be toast.

I have been saying for years on this thread, don't try this if you're an amateur. ONLY qualified experienced professionals should attempt this repair, and most qualified locals only resolder the presently relevant points, leaving tons of other points to go bad later. The points they resolder stay because they did a good job on them, but other points go out later and you're back where you started. I have personally resoldered many boards sent to me in this condition, where the boards treated by local repair personnel worked fine for a couple of months and then went bad again. I see the meager number of excellently done solder joints that made the set work again, and know exactly why it didn't last - 99% of the solder conns on that board need it, not 10%. Nor 20%, nor even 85%. 99%, including 100% of the joints in the original defective solder flow op which have not been resoldered yet except for heat sinks and test points.

If left untended these points eventually cause a hinky connection in just the wrong place and cause a lightning bolt to be sent down into the rest of your set. That's what spikes are, and line conditioners are dedicated to keeping them away. No line conditioner can protect you from spikes sent out by the power supply board itself tho, which is far downline from the conditioner and takes over where the conditioner leaves off. There is no protection from spikes PRODUCED by the PS board. The rest of your set, fed completely - and directly - by the PS board, is open and completely vulnerable to anything sent out by the PS board, including spikes caused by intermittent connections.

These are tremendously sophisticated sets, and were not designed to be operated on poorly connected, intermittent power supplies that cause huge spikes when the connections start to go hinky. They were designed to be operated on rock solid power supplies, that never waver and never vary. Even using your set in the condition you've described is literally playing Russian Roulette with it. ANY set in this condition needs to be turned off immediately if not sooner, unplugged, and not allowed to warm up to cruising temp again AT ALL until this instability situation has been totally remedied. Not partially. Totally.

There is no substitute for getting the resolder op done correctly, either by yourself if you are a professional grade solderer, or by a local tech if he will take direction on EXACTLY how and how much needs to be done, or by me. If you want it done right, send it to me and I'll take care of it. My boards don't go out again later. Many on this thread have sent their boards to me, and they are very happy campers right now.


b

Great, I'll be watching for it -

b

Bob,
I put the PS bd back to my 510-HD within 30min, watched TV for 4h last night and 1h this morning. The set had no problem at all. I guess it is no surprise for you, just add one more success in your record:rolleyes:. I had the faith too but little bit concern the twisted picture (‘missing horizontal sync’ as you diagnosed) which I haven’t see it before in the forum, and afraid it could be something else. Bob, it is no doubt you are the master for those set, not saying this is your only fieldthough:o. Now I think I will be worry free at least for few years, and anything happed it would be somewhere else, not the bd for sure. And I know there are someone I can always count on, thank you Bob and mt_goat! You guys rock:)

John

Sorry, email for Bob.

J

Please ID yourself on the email you sent. I have no idea who you are and have no idea whether any of the emails I HAVE received mighta been from someone who MIGHT be you! The initials JCBM and name John just don't give me much to go on...

:confused:


b

Bob,
I put the PS bd back to my 510-HD within 30min, watched TV for 4h last night and 1h this morning. The set had no problem at all. I guess it is no surprise for you, just add one more success in your record:rolleyes:. I had the faith too but little bit concern the twisted picture (‘missing horizontal sync’ as you diagnosed) which I haven’t see it before in the forum, and afraid it could be something else. Bob, it is no doubt you are the master for those set, not saying this is your only fieldthough:o. Now I think I will be worry free at least for few years, and anything happed it would be somewhere else, not the bd for sure. And I know there are someone I can always count on, thank you Bob and mt_goat! You guys rock:)

John

Glad I could help. Still not sure exactly who you are and what the sit is/was or which listing in my owner's book will turn out to be you, but glad I could help anyway!

:o

b

Glad I could help. Still not sure exactly who you are and what the sit is/was or which listing in my owner's book will turn out to be you, but glad I could help anyway!

:o

b

Bob,
I'm the one who sent the bd to you for re-solder 2 weeks ago. You did it and sent back to me yesterday. If you check the previous forum back to page 67 #1998 with the ID JCBM, you will see all the talks back and forth that how I got my problem and how you guys (you and mt_goat) instructed my got the bd out...

Sorry for the confusion and thanks again for all the help!


:)

John

:)

Again, you did quite a service for us by posting your pic of that sideways picture, those slanted lines. First time I remember seeing it here on this thread. Good to know all it takes to cure that is the resolder op.

;)

b

I decided to try my hand at this repair job after all. Thanks to the information littered throughout this epic thread (and some youtube tutorials on soldering), I managed to go through and resolder the PS board on my 710. I am happy to report that my 710 appears to be alive and well, without any of the blue flicker/pop/screen shutdown that plagued it before.

Admittedly, this should have been left to a professional (or at least someone with soldering experience), but if you're low on cash, 20 dollars on soldering gear and a few hours of your time might be the ticket to salvation ... or tanking the whole thing altogether. Beginner's luck in my case, I guess.

It's a very satisfying experience if you're feeling adventurous.

So Bob, when will you be venturing south to Los Angeles next?

Our Fire Staion was given an 510HD by someone who "upgraded to LCD". It came without a remote and badly in need of calibration and even more importantly, of your handiwork. During the next few days I'll be reading all of this thread in hopes I can try a little DIY. But if you were ever in the area...

Fly me in. It's cheap, between LAX and OAK. Love to come down and seeya -

;)

b

PS -

You'll need the official remote to do any calibration on it. Not some universal, the real thing. If you can't score one, you need to at least borrow one from someone, for my trip to be worthwhile -

Cleaned my optics yesterday for the first time ever on my 510. Heart was pounding the whole time cause I didn't wanna screw up anything! Anyways, thanks to you guys and the service manual that was made available, I never felt like I was outta my league.

Things that surprised me...

--Removed the lens pack and wasn't expecting the almost cup like final lense. Debated for a few minutes whether I was supposed to be cleaning it or not (it needed it) cause I don't recall anyone mentioning a lens of that deep a concave. Then I fretted about how much spray to use. Might have used a little too little on that first one, but the rest of them I foamed up pretty good.

Then again, the overscan is driving me nuts these days too...:confused:


Thanks for sharing your experience. When you cleaned your lenses did you take the lens barrel apart and clean each of the lenses, or did you just remove the lens pack for the base and clean the top and bottom lenses ?

When I last looked at my lenses I noticed the red and green lens pack have a piece of silver metallic tape, about a quarter inch wide and 2 inches long going across the lens (should of taken a pic – sorry). Is this tape stripe normal ? I was tempted to disassemble the lens pack/barrel to take it off, but thought I better check here first before I get that involved !

My picture looks fine, except there is a light yellowish/red patch about 3 inches wide near the center of the screen and I’m wondering if its because of this tape ? The patch is not usually noticeable unless the screen is white, so it’s annoying when watching a hockey game (with the white rink).
Appreciate your help and thoughts.

When I last looked at my lenses I noticed the red and green lens pack have a piece of silver metallic tape, about a quarter inch wide and 2 inches long going across the lens (should of taken a pic – sorry). Is this tape stripe normal ? I was tempted to disassemble the lens pack/barrel to take it off, but thought I better check here first before I get that involved !

Yes, the tape is there for a reason. It's kind of a kludge, but it helps compensate for the unavoidable variations in gray scale due to the 3-gun geometry of RPTVs. Search for "lens striping" or, sometimes, "lenstriping (http://www.keohi.com/keohihdtv/experttips/michaeltlv/lenstriping.html)" to learn more.

My picture looks fine, except there is a light yellowish/red patch about 3 inches wide near the center of the screen and I’m wondering if its because of this tape ? The patch is not usually noticeable unless the screen is white, so it’s annoying when watching a hockey game (with the white rink).

I suppose it's possible that the lens striping tape has gotten moved from where it ought to be, causing this patch. But it could be anything; it's just as likely an insect crawled into one of your guns and died there.

Man...I guess this thread will never die. ;)

So earlier this year I had the power supply problem with my 710. Had it fixed, and all has been well with that (even had Mr. Bob do a calibration on one of his east coast trips).

Well now I'm having a new problem and based on some posts in this thread I'm thinking it might be my convergence board? My convergence seems to go off on a regular basis now. Like, almost daily. It's not a huge difference, but is definitely visible on the white backgrounds (particularly screen graphics). Seems to be more so the red than the blue, but that could just be because the red is more noticeable. And yes, it is after the set has had plenty of warm up time.

So is this most likely the convergence board? Am I doing any further damage to it by continuing to run the set?

I know Mr. Bob has a service where I can send the board to him for repair, but I would rather not have to wait the 2-4 weeks it may take to get it back.

Replace your convergence ICs. No need to replace the whole board.


b

Replace your convergence ICs. No need to replace the whole board.

b

So is that something that I can do myself? And where does one order new IC's? I know from this thread there is mention of using 180s instead of the 110s that are stock for this model.

When I last looked at my lenses I noticed the red and green lens pack have a piece of silver metallic tape, about a quarter inch wide and 2 inches long going across the lens (should of taken a pic – sorry). Is this tape stripe normal ? I was tempted to disassemble the lens pack/barrel to take it off, but thought I better check here first before I get that involved !

My picture looks fine, except there is a light yellowish/red patch about 3 inches wide near the center of the screen and I’m wondering if its because of this tape ? The patch is not usually noticeable unless the screen is white, so it’s annoying when watching a hockey game (with the white rink).
Appreciate your help and thoughts.

I have never seen a 510/610/710 Elite need lenstriping, because it already has it. It's built in, UNDER the lens barrel. What's built in on them works fine! Excellent white field uniformity, OOB. No need to add to it. Adding to it just UNbalances things again, which is probably what's causing your white field NON uniformity.

Putting tape on plastic lens surfaces can RUIN THEM. The adhesive eats into the plastic. Personally I would remove it, but VERY carefully.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out.


b

So is that something that I can do myself? And where does one order new IC's? I know from this thread there is mention of using 180s instead of the 110s that are stock for this model.

I order mine from Melissa at Union Electronics. You can also get them at MCM.

Yes, owners do it themselves all the time. Or send the board to me and I'll see that you get the upgraded 180 versions installed. I keep them in stock.


b

I order mine from Melissa at Union Electronics. You can also get them at MCM.

Yes, owners do it themselves all the time. Or send the board to me and I'll see that you get the upgraded 180 versions installed. I keep them in stock.


b
Thanks Bob. Anything else on the board I should consider replacing as a preventative measure? I saw some mention of the resistors?

I have seen resistors fry on other brands, but never on a Pio. We replace the ICs and be done with it, and it always works. I know there is a reference out there to resistors that "drift off value" on these, but I have never seen that. It certainly is not what causes the failures, or we would see those offnesses in the picture as well, in not being able to fully control our points.

Not.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

:p

Just replace the ICs and try it out again. If it works properly, you're done!


b

I have never seen a 510/610/710 Elite need lenstriping, because it already has it. It's built in, UNDER the lens barrel. What's built in on them works fine! Excellent white field uniformity, OOB. No need to add to it. Adding to it just UNbalances things again, which is probably what's causing your white field NON uniformity.

Putting tape on plastic lens surfaces can RUIN THEM. The adhesive eats into the plastic. Personally I would remove it, but VERY carefully.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

b


I'm agree and would like to remove the tape, which must of been factory installed as it on one of lenses inside barrel. I was going to take pics and record disassembling so I can get reassemble them to the same positions. At least they will all get a good cleaning. Anyone taken these apart before and can advise me of some pitfalls before I take these apart ?

Are the mechanical strips in there, each one - of the outer 2 guns - held in on 1 side by a Philips screw? On the other side by being clamped in and held in by that same Philips screw?

(The green one doesn't have metal strips, the red and blue do, each with its Philips screw on the opposing side...)

If so and that's all that's there, don't even go in there except for the cleaning aspect. That's the factory issue. NOT metallic tape, applied onto the lens itself.

If metallic tape, yer on yer own. Good luck and don't screw anything up...

Any lens that you unscrew the 4 screws on and remove, be sure and put it back in EXACTLY the same position as it came out - not 90, 180 or 270 degrees different.

And DON'T touch the wingnuts! Loosening them will allow your mechanical focus to be altered, and there's no indication at this point that altering the position the wingnuts are presently in will improve your focus. Could very well make it worse.

You should definitely send pix up here to this thread before continuing.

BTW, "silver metallic tape" would be reflective, which is the LAST thing we want in there.


b

Are the mechanical strips in there, each one - of the outer 2 guns - held in on 1 side by a Philips screw? On the other side by being clamped in and held in by that same Philips screw?

(The green one doesn't have metal strips, the red and blue do, each with its Philips screw on the opposing side...)

If so and that's all that's there, don't even go in there except for the cleaning aspect. That's the factory issue. NOT metallic tape, applied onto the lens itself.

If metallic tape, yer on yer own. Good luck and don't screw anything up...

Any lens that you unscrew the 4 screws on and remove, be sure and put it back in EXACTLY the same position as it came out - not 90, 180 or 270 degrees different.

And DON'T touch the wingnuts! Loosening them will allow your mechanical focus to be altered, and there's no indication at this point that altering the position the wingnuts are presently in will improve your focus. Could very well make it worse.

You should definitely send pix up here to this thread before continuing.

BTW, "silver metallic tape" would be reflective, which is the LAST thing we want in there.


b



Thanks MR Bob, wise advise as always. I'll take some pics and post.

Also I must be a bad shopper as I cannot find SprayWay cleaner in my area (near Philadelphia). You think the monster cleaner would work just as well, It's what I've used on screens with good results.

http://www.monstercable.com/productdisplay.asp?pin=1562

NO!

That formulation was created for glossy and flat-finish direct view plastic screens like the fronts of LCDs in laptops, and flat panels. It works well for such things. NOT for our sets.

In CRT RPTV tech we NEVER touch the plastic viewscreens unless absolutely necessary. If left alone they never need any more than a light dusting with a clean dry terrycloth towel IF NECESSARY - if dust is on them - in the direction of the vertical ribs. Usually even that is not necessary, and leaving them completely alone is the best policy.

Using anything that would make them glossy and gleaming, thus reflective - like Pledge - would ruin them. I had that done while I was not at home - and thus without my knowledge nor consent - to my pre-HD 60" Mit by a well meaning woman visitor many years ago, and for that - and a few other good reasons - she was never permitted to step foot in my home again. Those swirls NEVER came out again. They were still there years later.

:eek:

I have no idea what this Monster cleaner would do to your optics in there, but ABSOLUTELY KNOW that it is not needed in this case. So don't be a cowboy out there, and have us find out the hard way. STAY AWAY FROM THIS CLEANER FOR CRT RPTVS.


If you can't find Sprayway use Glass Plus, which is commonly available pretty much anywhere, in local grocery stores. It works just fine - just as well as Sprayway for the cleaning aspect - you just gotta watch the runoff factor, because it is liquid and not foam, like Sprayway is.

Don't use anything with ammonia - or Ammonia D, in the case of Windex - in there.

And don't use either Sprayway OR Glass Plus on the plastic front view screens. Leave them completely alone. Optics cleaning is done on the INNER optics - inside the optical cavity, usually by removing the front view screen.

ONLY.


b

I'd just about guarantee that the Monster Screen cleaner will do some sort of negative thing to the projector gun lenses if you attempt to clean them with it, or even quite possibly irreversibly damage them! Monster Screen cleaner has caused problems for many people on some Plasma TV screens that are coated with a anti reflective coating. And if it can cause problems when it's used on something it's supposedly designed for, I would never let it get even anywhere near the lenses on CRT projection guns!

Even Monster has caution warnings on possible damage issues with using it!


http://content.monstercable.com/product_content/screenclean_caution.jpg

Thanks for your input guys about not using the Monster cleaner. I was getting annoyed that I could not find sprayway class cleaner. On the weekend I decided to wash my car. Last year I received a car wash gift pack pail that had all sorts of cleaners in it and to my surprise I found that it had a bottle of sprayway cleaner in it LOL. All this time I had a bottle in my garage !


In CRT RPTV tech we NEVER touch the plastic viewscreens unless absolutely necessary. If left alone they never need any more than a light dusting with a clean dry terrycloth towel IF NECESSARY - if dust is on them - in the direction of the vertical ribs. Usually even that is not necessary, and leaving them completely alone is the best policy.
b

I have a clear protective contrast screen on the front of my unit. On my set, the screen with the ribs is behind this contrast screen, and is referred to as the Fresnel/Lenticular? according to the sm. Do you keep the contrast sheet off ?

I did once clean the clear contrast screen with the monster cleaner about a year ago and it seemed to work ok, but I’ve never cleaned the Fresnel/Lenticular with anything other than compressed air and a cloth as you suggest.

Now that I had the proper sprayway cleaner I decided it was time to give my lenses a good cleaning, and as I noted earlier, to remove what appeared to be striping tape on the lens. See below (attachment Lineups) the 3 lenses and you can see what I thought was the tape stripe on the red and blue lenses.

I first removed the Red barrel and brought it over to a clean table to clean it up. It cleaned up very nicely with the sprayway cleaner. With the barrel now off the crt assembly, I could see that there was still a remaining lens still there, it appears to be about a 2 inch deep concave which I was not able to remove to clean it on the other side. This lens seemed firmly attached to the crt assembly so I could only clean the top (exposed) side of the lens. Should I have been able to removed this lens and cleaned both the top and bottom ? I did not want to put any pressure on trying to remove it so just left it there and figured cleaning only the top half was better than nothing. The mirror looked clean, so only blew it with compressed air and a light towel swish to remove anything noticeable.

The interesting part of procedure is that what I thought was stripe tape on the lens was actually a metal “bar” under the barrel screwed to the CRT assembly. Photo attached as lens StripR. I don’t know if this is right but I removed it. What is the purpose of this light interference bar ?

Anyways I cleaned all 3 of the lenses and picture is looking much better, even my wife noticed the difference and made an unsolicited comment asking “Why does the picture looks so much better !” :)

But I still have a problem which I’ll discuss in another post to keep the post topic clear.

The purpose of the strips is white field uniformity, which is the purpose of all lenstriping, and as I said before, Pioneer was already on top of that. See post 2080, above.

If you had tried to get to the back of the concave coolant cover, you woulda released coolant, which woulda fallen onto your ECBs beneath. Coolant is conductive, and is the LAST thing you want falling onto your circuit boards. The backs of those coolant covers are sealed and not exposed to airborne contaminants like the other lenses are, so don't need any cleaning attention anyway.

Good that you left well enough alone.

Your mirror is still VERY dirty, which you'll see when you shine a BRIGHT flashlight onto it from a steep angle. Touch one small spot near the outside of the mirror lightly with the back of a dry finger knuckle and that patch will disturb the smokiness. You'll see that when you shine your bright flashlight on it.

Cover the lenses before doing the mirror, as the spray will fall on the newly cleaned lenses. I always do the mirror first so I don't have to worry about that, but since you've already cleaned your lenses...

It usually takes me 5-6 passes of doing the mirror before it's finally 95% clean, which is all you need and all you'll get anyway. Check it by standing above the chamber and keeping your eyes out of the light path, so you don't get blinded by the light. When the mirror has almost no streaks left, it's good to go.


b

Thanks for your response Bob, after rereading your earlier post I now understand what you meant by mechanical strips. I’ve got them off for now and all seems ok, maybe next time I get back in there to clean the mirror I’ll reinstall then and see if I notice a difference, unless you believe they need to be reinstalled asap.

Despite the cleaning and all, I’m still having the problem of the reddish-yellow spot near the center of the screen. On a blue screen it looks like darker blue spot. I took a few pics to see if it helps identify a problem and a place to look.

In the first pic, I had a test blue screen from DVE and you can see the darker blue that I’ve circled. On these pics is does not show anywhere near as bad as it really is for some reason. Also the screen was uniformly blue, not as badly discolored as this pic would have you believe.

On the test overscan picture you can see a slight discoloration in the same area. (Yes I hate the overscan on this set, but that's another project for later).

This spot is very obvious on a white screen, like watching something like Ice skating. When ever I tried to take a pic of a white screen my camera started doing odd things.

My convergence is good and when in the user converge screen everything looks nicely lined up with while lines. Any ideas ?

From your description your blue appears to be pre-aged in that area, or maybe there is some kind of growth in there impeding the blue in that area. I can't really see it on your pix.

Look directly into your blue lens and see if anything is growing in there. I call it "cooties in the coolant".

b

My 510 just suddenly went way out of whack losing all convergence and geometry. The colors are separated by feet. Red, blue, and green are basically just in separate areas of the screen and there is no proper geometry to speak of either. Any ideas on what the problem and fix might be? Costs?

At this point I am most likely going to get rid of it, so if anyone is interested PM me.

That would be a crime, getting rid of such a fine piece of equipment.

Your convergence ICs have croaked, it happens a lot on CRT tech, no matter what the brand. Just replace them and keep on truckin', just like a thermostat in a car.

Have you seen the images I have been able to bring out of 510s just like yours, all over the country? Check out page 45 of this thread for images of your model year lineup of the 510/610/710s, plus a 530 calibrated on the image structure strictly by its owner. And many other pix I have sent up. If you want to see what CRT is capable of, check out the Screenshot War thread, and my own Don't Dump your CRT RPTV! thread. I just put up some new pix from my set, but didn't put them here because this is a Pioneer thread and mine's a Mit. They do show what CRT is capable of, tho.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=695922&page=199

You should keep your set, it is only midway thru its service life and still capable of HD that's head and shoulders better than most of what's out there today, to buy new. Unlike most of the modalities out there today, CRT just keeps on going, and going, and going...

It has many happy years ahead of it, of producing stunning, stealth grade images. I would love to calibrate it and then take pix of it and send them up here to this thread.


b

I have a clear protective contrast screen on the front of my unit. On my set, the screen with the ribs is behind this contrast screen, and is referred to as the Fresnel/Lenticular? according to the sm. Do you keep the contrast sheet off ?



Yes. IMHO it does nothing but get in the way of what you're trying to see. If there's lights on in the room you see reflections off of it that interfere with seeing into dark areas of your pic, and even in a completely dark room it can slew the grayscale off from calibrated settings. You have to calibrate a set with them on or off, there are often different settings for each.


b

I haven't done any soldering on the board. I've given it back to him to finish touching up (including those under the white silicone goop). He's also going to double-check the fuses and recheck for solder bridges. Should know more on Monday.

Whatever happened on this? Did I miss something?


b

I have this exact same problem with my Pioneer Elite Pro200. Do you know where I can get a copy of the service manual? Electronic would be great. I've tried remove a dozen screws and still cannot remove the PS. Any help would be great.
Thanks, Floyd

I have had queries about the 200 all year, but nobody has sent me a board yet to work on. Seems they are having the same intermittencies as the lineup this thread is about.

I have seen lots of cold solder joints in the Pioneer non-HDready big screen line, no matter what the year. Is yours HD or not? If you want to send me the pertinent boards and all they need is resoldering, I can do that.

Let me know what you find out -


b

After reading some of the posts here - mostly Mr Bob's - I feel good that I picked up a pristine Pro610 about 2 yrs ago for $750 including a JVC dvd/surround sound system. But I also feel bad that it lives in my garage with the pool table and the bicycles! It gets watched for college and NFL football on Time Warner HD on the weekends, but I know it's not being used to it's full potential - just too big for the living room! :(

A 610 is 58". A 710 is 64". My 65" Panny is 65".

I sit 8' back from my 65" Panny, eyes to screen. How far back do you sit from your 58" 610?

After my calibrations are completed I encourage - sometimes I insist - that they sit as close to their newly optimized CRT display as is now possible - if only for at least a minute or 2 - just to see what the new potential is, POST calibration.

As a result I have my owners sit 6' back from a 510, 7' back from a 610, and 8' back from a 710. Many times the owners just LEAVE those viewing chairs there, the improvement has been so strong, and the pic they can now watch so much bigger than before. And much crisper.

How far back are you sitting from your 610? If it's like 10'-12' and that is why your living room seems too small, with calibration chances are it won't be. Would it fit more comfortably in your prime viewing area - your living room - if you were sitting only 7' back, eyes to screen?

I guaranty you'd be getting better use out of it than you are right now.

:p

b

unfortunately it's physically too big, not screen-size too big. Panasonic 50" plasma fits into a hole in the wall - big piano-black 610 doesn't! I like the look, but my wife doesn't enjoy the "2001 - A Space Odyssey" monolith effect.:(

Too bad. You won't get that amazing CRT fidelity, and for a song. You'll have to be out thousands instead, for that plasma -

:(

b

Well, I replaced the ICs in my PRO-710HD...and I'm not sure it fixed my problem. I ordered 2 new chips from MCM Electronics (http://www.mcmelectronics.com/product.aspx?productid=STK392-180) and had them professionally soldered on since I didn't trust myself to do it. It's only been a few days, but my convergence seems to shift ever so slightly, even after the full warmup period. Bear in mind, the shift is very subtle, and seems to only be the red. It's barely noticeable, other than when I'm looking at the multi-point grid or when there are light colors against a dark background.

Any ideas? Bob, I'm not sure if this is relevant, but it seems to have started happening after you did my calibration, which included correcting the overscan (but NOT using the shim method).

I have never seen a 510/610/710 Elite need lenstriping, because it already has it. It's built in, UNDER the lens barrel. What's built in on them works fine! Excellent white field uniformity, OOB. No need to add to it. Adding to it just UNbalances things again, which is probably what's causing your white field NON uniformity.

Putting tape on plastic lens surfaces can RUIN THEM. The adhesive eats into the plastic. Personally I would remove it, but VERY carefully.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out.


b

I wonder why Pioneer went away from lens stripping on later models. On 530HDi they only installed it on the RED gun. On 730HDi they don't use them at all.

Well, I replaced the ICs in my PRO-710HD...and I'm not sure it fixed my problem. I ordered 2 new chips from MCM Electronics (http://www.mcmelectronics.com/product.aspx?productid=STK392-180) and had them professionally soldered on since I didn't trust myself to do it. It's only been a few days, but my convergence seems to shift ever so slightly, even after the full warmup period. Bear in mind, the shift is very subtle, and seems to only be the red. It's barely noticeable, other than when I'm looking at the multi-point grid or when there are light colors against a dark background.

Any ideas? Bob, I'm not sure if this is relevant, but it seems to have started happening after you did my calibration, which included correcting the overscan (but NOT using the shim method).

Major changes happen in the o'scan redux op if you don't use the shim method, and perhaps the set needed to settle a bit with the new settings. The whole conv paradigm gets pushed into entirely different areas for the registers to go.

And some of us see these things a lot more readily than others.

Age can be a factor. I have heard of conv drift starting to happen spontaneously after the set has been operating faithfully for years. In which case replacing the aging ICs seems to do the trick.

How far from your set do you sit? That can be a factor in more readily seeing errors.

Remember that aside from the 45 minute warmup period on turn-on, it also takes 100 hours for new conv ICs to "burn in", or stop drifting. After that 100 hours your conv should be much more stable than during the first 100 hours of their service life, where a lot of drift happens, just naturally.


b

Man...I guess this thread will never die. ;)

...

I know Mr. Bob has a service where I can send the board to him for repair, but I would rather not have to wait the 2-4 weeks it may take to get it back.


"May" being the operative word here. It is always subject to the workload of PS boards awaiting my attention, and my workload of other stuff needing doing, here in my home area.

Today I had nothing scheduled and there were no other boards here to do - had gotten them all off to their owners again, well within promised turnaround spec - and a board arrived here at around 11am. So I hopped on it. I got it out to Fedex again before pickup time today. Same day service, no extra charge.

Can't always promise that - sometimes things are so backed up that I have to charge extra to follow the request I sometimes get, to put someone's board to the head of the line and get it back to them next day - but sometimes we all get lucky.

Like today -


b

Remember that aside from the 45 minute warmup period on turn-on, it also takes 100 hours for new conv ICs to "burn in", or stop drifting. After that 100 hours your conv should be much more stable than during the first 100 hours of their service life, where a lot of drift happens, just naturally.
Bob, this could very well be the issue. I definitely don't have 100 hours on the new ICs yet.

Relax then. All will be well soon -

;)

b

I have the 710 and when I picked it up it didn't turn on. I found the 5-amp fuse was blown. I replaced it and the TV came on. I then had the power supply re-soldered (thanks Bob) and the TV worked great for about four days and the 5-amp fuse went again.

Now everything I could find in this thread points to the ICs being bad. Does this seem right?

I don't have access to the TV to see which led is lighting up on the boards. My mom is using the TV in a different state.

Any and all help is appreciated


Ken T

Going strictly on probabilities, your answer sounds correct.


b

I just added some pix to my Don't Dump your CRT RPTV! thread - not your specific brand, but definitely shows what CRT is capable of. Is a Mit, so keep that in mind and enjoy, even if you'd just like to see what YOUR set can look like with the appropriate care and attention -

;)

b

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17508339#post17508339

So today I sent off my third board done in a day. The workload has been light recently, allowing me to be there for that. I am sure owners who are getting their boards back quickly will be overjoyed to be getting their sets going again back to solid operations in record time.

It's good for me, and it's good for you owners too. I do try to do this all the time. Can't always, but I do try!

;)


b

Over the weekend I received a bonus ! I found an elite 510 on the web that the owner was giving away for free and was only about an hour from my home, so now I have 2 510s! I cost me $24 to rent a uhaul. It was not working and he was not going to get it fixed as he called a service tech and they told him is would cost him big bucks to fix it, without even looking at it. The symptom is the classic PS board problem. I removed the Power Supply board and the soldering is very flat and I can see visible holes/cracks in solder of some of the larger test points and some halo’s on other points. I spent 3 hours on the resoldering yesterday, about another 1-2 to finish the job. I had resoldered the PS on my existing unit and this new set looks in a little worse condition, but hopefully my soldering skill is now even better second board around. I’m hoping the unit will power up after the resolder operation. The unit appears as if it has never been opened up so it’s very dusty inside, and the outside cabinet is scuffed up more than I’d like with some paint chipped off near the bottom, and a couple scratches on the protective plastic, and the grill cloth needs work.

Not sure what I’ll do with it when it’s working, but thinking I'll use it to learn how to perform the shimming process before I perform it on my existing set. Also may consider swapping the guns to get the ones with the best performance in my existing set.

Just remember to inspect inspect inspect! The double and triple inspections I perform on each and every board after my resoldering process are very time consuming, but absolutely necessary. You don't want to stick your resoldered board back in to your otherwise fully operational set if there's even a CHANCE of having missed something.

;)

b

Thanks MR Bob I will heed your advice. I usually do a 4x4 square then swap the iron for a magnifying glass to inspect what was just done. The hardest ones are on the connector pins such as the E3 as they are very small. Is there a problem bridging the points that are listed as the same, ie I see 3 consecutive ground pins, a few consecutive 5V and 12 V’s pins on the connectors which seem to all go back to the source on the board ? Also do you reflow and add solder to the lines that look like ‘worm trails” on the board ?

It's OK to join those doubles and triples you mentioned.

I add solder only, I don't remove any. No need to.

No, I don't redo the "trails", no. No need. The heat/cold-expand/contract phenom doesn't happen at the trails, it happens at the components themselves, including raised resistors, ICs, transistors and heat sinks - tho the heat sinks don't get directly connected to anything in there, and can be spared the resoldering process. Which is good, because resoldering heat sinks requires a whole next level of heat from that of normal soldering iron temps. And thus special soldering equipment, which thankfully is not needed.

Test points can also be skipped, because they don't go anywhere or do anything while the unit is operational.


;)

b

Thanks for sharing your experience. When you cleaned your lenses did you take the lens barrel apart and clean each of the lenses, or did you just remove the lens pack for the base and clean the top and bottom lenses ?

When I last looked at my lenses I noticed the red and green lens pack have a piece of silver metallic tape, about a quarter inch wide and 2 inches long going across the lens (should of taken a pic – sorry). Is this tape stripe normal ? I was tempted to disassemble the lens pack/barrel to take it off, but thought I better check here first before I get that involved !

My picture looks fine, except there is a light yellowish/red patch about 3 inches wide near the center of the screen and I’m wondering if its because of this tape ? The patch is not usually noticeable unless the screen is white, so it’s annoying when watching a hockey game (with the white rink).
Appreciate your help and thoughts.

Sorry I didn't respond sooner...stopped getting emails about new posts for some reason. Anyway, seems like you've moved well past your question based on what I've read. Still, I'll answer the question.

No, I didn't take apart the barrel. I couldn't figure out how it came apart, or if it was supposed to, so I only cleaned the lenses that were exposed. The deep concave lenses threw me for a loop too. Still worried I didn't clean them correctly.

So all total, I cleaned nine surfaces, ten if you count the mirror.

Tell ya what though, reading this thread is both a benefit and a nightmare! I'm so worried about convergence boards going out and if/when my PS board is gonna die, despite not seeing any problems to cause worry.

I do know my wife is starting to complain about not being able to read text at the bottom of the screen due to the overscan, so that's starting to work in my favor when it comes to justifying the day I can afford Mr Bob to fix it :)

Thanks for your clarification, sounds like your cleaning was similar to mine. I'd think if you cleaned the 3 concave lenses on the CRT assy with sprayway and it looked good under light, you're OK.

Are you saying your PS board has never been resoldered and its still working OK ? That's an interesting scenario, if you want to proactively resolder it, or wait until it finally goes. Sounds like it just a matter of time before it goes. I'd be tempted to do it before it goes, on my timetable, vs having it go just before the superbowl game, and chancing other boards also going ?

My wife is also bugging me about the overscan. The NFL game scores on Fox are always hidden. I'm hoping this latest 510 I'm working on will power up and I can use it to learn on ( probably donate it to the church when I'm finished with it)

On another note I see there are 3 service manuals for the 5/6/710. 2 of them are availalbe here, anyone seen the third version, ie,ARP3086 Service Manual S/M(NEW)PRO710HD/610HD/510HD, or know if it has any additional useful information ?

Yep, owned the set for 9 years now and have never had the blue flicker of death. Maybe SoCal climate is not so bad for the boards?

Here's another question for Mr Bob...

Even after cleaning my lenses, there's still a (for lack of a better word) blemish that is on my screen. Are there other surfaces below the guns that could potentially need cleaning? I've mentioned it before, but years ago I had a lizard find its way inside my set (saw the little bastard's silhouette crawl up my screen!) and think it's possible he could've left a deposit on some surface. When it didn't go away after cleaning the lenses, it really left me puzzled. Ideas?

I haven't seen anything about it on the Pio, but some other brands have had a problem of something growing in the coolant and making it cloudy.

From your description your blue appears to be pre-aged in that area, or maybe there is some kind of growth in there impeding the blue in that area. I can't really see it on your pix.

Look directly into your blue lens and see if anything is growing in there. I call it "cooties in the coolant".

b

I'm wondering if I'm having the same problem ( see post 2087), and I've heard about replacing the coolant but not really sure what it entails. Has anyone done this on a 5/6/710 and can give some advice or share the steps ? When replacing the coolant are you also able to clean the inside of the lower concave lens and remove the "cooties in the coolant" ?

Yep, owned the set for 9 years now and have never had the blue flicker of death. Maybe SoCal climate is not so bad for the boards?

Here's another question for Mr Bob...

Even after cleaning my lenses, there's still a (for lack of a better word) blemish that is on my screen. Are there other surfaces below the guns that could potentially need cleaning? I've mentioned it before, but years ago I had a lizard find its way inside my set (saw the little bastard's silhouette crawl up my screen!) and think it's possible he could've left a deposit on some surface. When it didn't go away after cleaning the lenses, it really left me puzzled. Ideas?

That surface of your screen prolly needs cleaning. The inner one is the fresnel, but the smooth side is usually what's facing the mirror. Not an easy task, and things could go wrong, so only do that blem. Be careful -

b

I'm wondering if I'm having the same problem ( see post 2087), and I've heard about replacing the coolant but not really sure what it entails. Has anyone done this on a 5/6/710 and can give some advice or share the steps ? When replacing the coolant are you also able to clean the inside of the lower concave lens and remove the "cooties in the coolant" ?

Have not seen this being an issue with the CRT Elites. Unless absolutely needed, this op should be avoided like the plague.

b

To all,

I have a Pioneer Elite Pro510HD that is in working condition. Input 1 in HD works but all others are off aligned. Can be fixable if you have the time to sit and fix all the grids in factory mode. I'm in North Jersey and willing to let the TV go for a meer 200.00 dolllars or sell any of its parts before i let it go. All the parts on the TV are in working order. If anyone is looking for anything, please contact me at rajtailor7@verizon.net. Especially if you are looking for the power supply board. It's only about 2 years old since I replaced it and goes for over $400.00, I'll sell it cheap.

Seems a shame to break up a fully operational set, by offering the parts individually. This should only be done on a set which has been disabled and will not be fixed, where lots of the parts are still good.

I recommend you sell this set only as a fully operational unit, not part it out. $200 for a fully operational set that cost over $5000 when new should bring you a buyer promptly!

;)


b

I have a PRO 610-HD which I purchased new in 2000. No Power Board problems until now (I think). What I am seeing is constant horizontal noise stripes up and down the screen. Very distracting and causes me to believe the set is in trouble.

I had a tech come out to clean the lenses and reconverge, hoping that the cure for my problem I have was a simple PM away. Well, the picture does look a lot better but the noise bars are still there. The tech advised me that he felt it was probably the Power Board but could be the Deflector Board (the guy actually owns the same set).

I am having difficulty biting off $650 to fix this set. Any advice is greatly appreciated.

PS - I started fixing electronics in the early 1980's. Have the capacity, just need some direction.

Sounds like noise bars, also called hum bars. Grounding in your sys among your sources is not right, probably not any of the internal boards are at fault.

Check which source component is causing the problems by removing one after the other until this goes away. Cable is usually the primary offender on this kind of thing.

Which can be remedied by using a ground isolating signal conveyor on the coax line.


b

Thanks Bob. I'm on it.

Grounding is a tricky animal. Too much can cause ground loops, too little can cause ingress noise. Gotta play around with it. Let us know how it turns out -

b

I think we just had this problem too.. We didnt notice any tell tale signs, then i was told the tv just started going dimmer and dimmer then shut off...

When we attempt to turn it on, we get one loud click followed by 9 'chirps' as the tv seems to be attempting to turn itself on..

I watched the back of the TV as this happens.. after the 8th chirp a red light comes on next to the P.S Assembly label, Then a 9th chirp happens a slight second after that light comes on. Its not as in rythym as the other 8 chirps..

I took the board out and attempted to soilder the 'lines' but not alllll the dots. I'm an amateur at it (done guitar work, built a pedal, soldered a playstation, so my work isn't too sloppy, definately no bridges), but when i put it back in, it still does the exact same thing, So i dont think i made it any worse but I didnt make it any better.. I can hear a slight hum from the back of the tv which seems to change in pitch slightly after its been on a few seconds.. Could something else be our problem? We hate to toss this 64 inch.. But it's just not worth it to us to spend 250+ to have some repair guy fix it..

forgot to add, i bought a multimeter and each of the 5 fuses reads 0.00 (with an occasional - sign coming up, but thats probably from this cheap multimeter not having the best tolerances). So I believe the fuses to be in working order.. Is there no FU101 fuse? I just see 102 and 103.. wierd.

If your PS board is vertically mounted it's the same one as on the x10 series, which is what this thread is all about. If not - if it's floor mounted - then nothing in this thread really applies.

Sounds like you have something going on there that has nothing to do with the PS board. Perhaps the conv ICs have started shorting, which might cause this.

In any event, you have every right to not sink any more $ into your set, but if it were my set, I certainly would not limit the $ I would spend to less than $250. That's just a slap in the face to how good this set is capable of looking, and that it is capable of stomping on most of the fixed pixel competition out there - and ALL of the highly affordable fixed pixel - in its size range, when its capacities have been fully optimized. Remember it is capable of the same performance as the Elite versions. The only significant difference is the high gloss piano black finish on the Elites. The electronics and optics are the same between the 2 series.

I would get the thing fixed and its performance optimized. It's a 58"! Have you seen what they charge for that size out there???

But that's just me...

:p

b

I'm wondering if I'm having the same problem ( see post 2087), and I've heard about replacing the coolant but not really sure what it entails. Has anyone done this on a 5/6/710 and can give some advice or share the steps ? When replacing the coolant are you also able to clean the inside of the lower concave lens and remove the "cooties in the coolant" ?

Have not seen this being an issue with the CRT Elites. Unless absolutely needed, this op should be avoided like the plague.

b


Mr Bob,

I looked into the blue crt today and can see the "blemish" which is giving me the yellowish patch on a white screen. So I'd like your opinion on an approach. I have 2 510's one is my viewing set (the one with the blemish on the blue crt) and the other is a working set that I play around with to test with and will eventually donate to an organization like our church. However the one I am planning to donate has a nicer pic than my viewing set, but its cabinet is badly messed up. It was given to me because it was not working (PSB problem) and the cabinet is badly scratched, dented and abused, but the pic and crt are in great condition.

What would be ideal would be to swap the insides of the one I am to donate with the one I wish to keep, but I know that would be a big job. I'm wondering however if it might be doable to just swap the crt trays (ie the tray with all 3 guns attached) ? OR would it be better to try and only swap the blue gun ? It looks like to swap the tray would be a matter of disconnecting the reconnecting many connectors, then a reconvergence ?

Everything in your set is matched up to everything else. The only way to consider doing something like this is to swap everything out that connects to anything else critical - meaning boards and CRT array. Speakers, front panel, viewscreens, mirror etc. do not apply, they can stay.

It'll be a big job, but not undoable. Mit makes their light box come out with some inline connectors disco'd and 11 screws, so it can be taken down to anyone's shop and worked on. Pioneer doesn't make it quite that simple, but I know that at least the CRT array comes out fairly straightforwardly, as we know from the shimming op.

I'd wager that the boards come out also, with relatively minor effort.

But both sections have to stay a matched set.


b

If it was me.... I know I'd swap whatever parts I needed to between the two sets in order the have a set with the best possible picture for myself.

If you have the two sets on hand to do such a thing, why would you not? Granted the cabinet in the one with the best parts is banged up, I can certainly understand why you would not want the set that looks physically banged up, but it also has the better picture due to it's internal parts being in better condition. So why give away the better picture aspect of it to someone else? When you have the option of swapping out the better internal parts from it, over into the set you are keeping.

Everything in your set is matched up to everything else. The only way to consider doing something like this is to swap everything out that connects to anything else critical - meaning boards and CRT array. Speakers, front panel, viewscreens, mirror etc. do not apply, they can stay.

It'll be a big job, but not undoable. Mit makes their light box come out with some inline connectors disco'd and 11 screws, so it can be taken down to anyone's shop and worked on. Pioneer doesn't make it quite that simple, but I know that at least the CRT array comes out fairly straightforwardly, as we know from the shimming op.

I'd wager that the boards come out also, with relatively minor effort.

But both sections have to stay a matched set.


b


I'll try swapping all the boards and tray this weekend. I looked it over and it may not be too bad, it seems the boards are on a mounting plate which is only held in with one screw, then they pull out, just lots of cables to disconnect and keep track of. One disconnect that I'm concerned about is removing the the 3 high voltages lines from the FBT to the CRT's. Do these come of easily ? I'll keep set unplugged for over 24 hours, so I hope this is not a safety issue ?

Man that cabinet must really be trashed for you to dive into that project. Have you considered just swapping out the front trim pieces?

Man that cabinet must really be trashed for you to dive into that project. Have you considered just swapping out the front trim pieces?

Yup, My set, is likely similar to yours, high gloss black finish and well maintained. The second set (with the better pic) dull finish all around, ie top sides and front, also many scratches dents and dings. The front grill appers to have been their cats play toy, the sides at the bottom have large pieces of the paint chipped off. I cant image how it got this bad. The front protective screen has plenty of scratches on it (so its just going to stay off). My wife has already warned me that we will not swap this unit for our good looking unit :)

I'll try swapping all the boards and tray this weekend. I looked it over and it may not be too bad, it seems the boards are on a mounting plate which is only held in with one screw, then they pull out, just lots of cables to disconnect and keep track of. One disconnect that I'm concerned about is removing the the 3 high voltages lines from the FBT to the CRT's. Do these come of easily ? I'll keep set unplugged for over 24 hours, so I hope this is not a safety issue ?

I'd try to not undo those HV wires, try to keep them intact. If you must, be sure to mark them thoroughly, so you can get them back EXACTLY in the hole each came out of before.

If you must, be sure to bleed them to ground, preferably thru a 100 ohm resistor, then straight to ground, before allowing them to dangle. And DON'T allow them to touch any circuit board or component at any time. Just like they can shock you, they can also short to components on your ecbs, esp. the more delicate ICs.


b

Ok, so, hypothetical question here. Sprinkled all throughout this excellent and informative thread are warnings from the estimable MrBob to TURN OFF your set as soon as it starts exhibiting these problems, or you risk further damage. So, what if, um, a "friend" of mine who happens to own a Pro-610 set started having the blue flash/turn-off problem a few years ago, but instead of googling the issue, finding this thread, and fixing the PS board, he just lived with the problem this whole time? And what if that theoretical dumb friend of mine now has a set that won't turn on at all? Would it be worth it for that incredibly foolish friend to go ahead and resolder that PS board anyway? Or am I, I mean, is he basically screwed at this point?

FWIW, once in a while it does turn on...in fact his daughter watched a movie on it yesterday, but for the most part his TV sits in the corner of the room, hulking and inert. :(

Er, to clarify, the green power light does come on when he turns the set on, just no picture appears on the screen.

I dunno, has your "friend" learned his lesson???

:D

If it still turns on from dead cold, turn it off within 40 seconds of turnon and keep it unplugged until fixed correctly. Sending it to me would be one way.

If the green light stays on but no pic is showing up, hit the Menu button and see if anything comes up. If the Menu comes up but not any pic, then chances are the prong carrying the power to the video board has come unsoldered on the PS bd, which would be corrected in my resoldering op. I have had that happen several times now, and my resoldering cured it every time. No promises of course, but looks good, anyway.

If no Menu comes up but it is not shutting off, the same thing could still be at fault. In any case your PS bd absolutely needs the resoldering op, one way or the other. Even if it does not correct the disappearing picture.


b

LOL, yes I have learned my lesson.

So I pulled the board and had my brother hit every solder point on the PSB. Plugged it back into the set and powered on...it came right on, picture right up, but the image was split vertically and displayed multiple times. Like so: (pic removed...no need)

Could this be a result of something we did on the PSB? Or did I hose something up when I connected everything back? I'm kind of afraid to do anything now, in light of my prior transgressions...

Any advice is appreciated!

[edit] Never mind: cable box was set to output 720p and my set needs 1080i. Once I switched to 1080i the screen split went away.

Great! Glad you have finally prevailed, and that you didn't hurt anything in the process.

Now get your optics cleaned and see how bleary your set has been for years! Crystal clear viewing awaits you as soon as your entire light path is squeaky clean again. All 10 affected surfaces.

Make sure you do it SAFELY. Any damage you do to the optics is instantaneous and permanent.


b

Thanks again for your advice, Mr Bob. You are right about the optics; once I got everything hooked up and figured out the 1080i thing I was a little surprised at how sub-par the picture was compared to how it should look. I don't know if the time it spent unplugged reset something back to the factory settings, or if I am just paying more attention to it now, but it needs help! Not sure I am brave enough to open the front up and clean the optics b/c I am terrified of scratching something, but at the very least I need to do a convergence again.

Where did I leave my toothpick... :)

Yikes! Got into the convergence menu with my trusty toothpick and the vertical lines are jittering all over the place. Horizontal lines are solid but the vertical lines look like sine waves. That can't be good...time to do a little more research...

A very wise man. He knows when to either quit for now or call in reinforcements. Those optics on the Elites - and even on the non-Elite Pioneers - are stellar, and deserve absolute carefulness.

If you are in HD 1080i when you go into the conv sm, of course the vert lines will be squiggly, because the first screen is 480i. The next ones are the aspect ratios, the final one called H is the HD. I believe the Screen button on the remote is what scrolls them, one after another, among the buttons in the upper left corner of the remote. If you are sending in HD, you gotta scroll till you hit the H to have proper sync.

If you don't have a service manual on the Elites, you're doing yourself a disservice if you're trying to do any part of a calibration. They don't have easy scrolling menus like other brands. It's all random access, meaning you gotta know what you want and what button to push ahead of time, to get your desired result.


b

Yikes! Got into the convergence menu with my trusty toothpick and the vertical lines are jittering all over the place. Horizontal lines are solid but the vertical lines look like sine waves. That can't be good...time to do a little more research...


You may want to go to this post, and D/L the x10 series service manual from the link provided in the post.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17271328&postcount=2045

This just in from someone whose board I resoldered recently. Reprinted by permission -



The board arrived within a few days of you mailing it back. Good thing I double boxed it because the outer box was pretty smashed by UPS, but the board was fine inside. Anyway, I got it reinstalled a few days later, though getting some of the white connectors on was difficult to tell if they were fully seated. On power up everything was fine. Since then I've seen about 4 DVD movies and it appears to be working fine. The picture has been sharp and steady so it looks like it's on its way to a longer, healthy life.

I also did a little research and based on your recommendation and bought a Blu-ray player—the Panansonic DMP-BD60K. It had high reviews, was a affordable (on sale for $159), and has the features I want. I bought a couple of BDs to test it out the picture (over component) is as sharp as the high-def signal I get from my Cable DVR. Further, it plays old standard DVDs with a slightly better picture than over the Sony DVD player I had.

So, all around I'm very pleased. The Pioneer Pro510 appears it is breathing on it's own and back to life. Thank you! I'm now able to play Blu-ray high-def disks over the component inputs (which many people had told me was impossible without HDMI). And, on the Blu-ray player my library of DVDs look better than before even though it's not upconverting them. After I got it all back together I adjusted the convergence for all the inputs, but most of the points needed little adjustment.

You've saved another Pioneer Pro510HD from its mid-life crisis to live on to a healthy and ripe old age!

—A Colorado Customer

I'll try swapping all the boards and trays this weekend. I looked it over and it may not be too bad, it seems the boards are on a mounting plate which are only held in with one screw, then they pull out, just lots of cables to disconnect and keep track of

Just an update, last week I completed the swap of the internals of the 510's, and it was not as bad as I expected. All the boards were each connected to mounting trays which were only secured with 1 screw. I took a video of the setup before I started to disconnect cables and swaping which was helpful for a couple reconnection uncertainties :) . The crt tray was obviously the biggest task but still not too bad. Overall it took about 3-4 hours and that includes a nice cleaning and dusting of the boards and interior. Also the convergence had not change that much when I powered everything up. I was surprized at that since one unit was shimmed and the other was not. I pleased at how this turned out and with the upgraded picture and set.

Wow! Great job! This is one for the archives.

One shimmed and the other not??? Then be sure to redo your optical focusing, which will definitely be different between the old and new/shimmed and not shimmed versions.

Of course I recommend the Cantilever Technique for that -

;)

b

If there's an LED lit up on the defl bd, that bd needs to be replaced. We don't even try to fix them. You can order one from me or get it yourself.

Hopefully that will do it...


b

So I finally got around to replacing the deflection brd(since this is my spare TV sitting in the garage) w/ a new deflection brd and the same thing happens.
The 5A fuse blew again but not the 6.3A and the Deflection Serv Assly LED was lit. Did not see the LED lit on the Conv Brd. Could it be something else downstream or the pwr supply brd? This is my 2nd pwr supply brd(that I ordered from Pioneer). Any ideas?

Wow! Great job! This is one for the archives.

One shimmed and the other not??? Then be sure to redo your optical focusing, which will definitely be different between the old and new/shimmed and not shimmed versions.

Of course I recommend the Cantilever Technique for that -

;)

b

Yea, this was actually kinda fun in our warped kind of way. I certainly learned a lot about the sets. The biggest pain was when I was nearly finished and accidently dropped a screw onto one of the boards. I could not find it so ended up removing the boards again until I found it (it fell between the 2 boards on the signal assy tray).

When I moved the crt assembly I also moved the shimms along with the CRT tray so the focus hardly changed. I did a fine tuning and all looks good.

When I made my shimms I used 2x4's and cut them into 2x2 squares. I then marked where the screws were positioned on the crt assy were and where the tray centering detent/punchouts were positioned. I then drilled 3 holes in the blocks so the 2 screws went straight through block to the frame, and the centering detent rested in the block. I then position the block in the tray at it most rear position against the metal punchout so that I knew exactly where the tray was to rest on the frame. This worked well since I was sure that the tray was exactly parallel to it's original position, just 1.5 inches higher. As a result, the convergence and focus required very little adjustment, which was good because it was approaching nap time :)

Other than the video I didn't take any pictures to post, as the job does take some concentration, but if anyone needs help or plans on doing this just pm me and I'll be glad to offer some advice and guidance.

So I finally got around to replacing the deflection brd(since this is my spare TV sitting in the garage) w/ a new deflection brd and the same thing happens.
The 5A fuse blew again but not the 6.3A and the Deflection Serv Assly LED was lit. Did not see the LED lit on the Conv Brd. Could it be something else downstream or the pwr supply brd? This is my 2nd pwr supply brd(that I ordered from Pioneer). Any ideas?

Sorry, this seems to be beyond the scope of this thread, and I certainly have not seen this before, myself. You might have to bail to getting a local tech out on it.


b

The red convegence on the left side of the screen cannot be adjusted horizontally. The big center is OK, the outside right upper, center and lower are OK, the center top and bottom are OK (all can be moved up,down, left, right) but the left side upper, center and lower red will cannot be adjusted horizontally. I replaced the 2 IC's - used STK392-110 from Sanyo, but this did not fix the issue. What else can I try? Again its only the left side of the screen.
TIA Robiwan

The 110s are very old by now, I would never use them unless absolutely necessary. The 180s are the best upgrade to that series pricewise and qualitywise. I would sub with the new ones.

However, these symptoms don't fall into the IC replacement category, and probably will require looking at either the coil involved or the convergence generator circuit, which generates the waveforms the conv needs to operate.

Looks like you may need a tech in for this one.


b

Last summer I was offering my Pro510 for free to anyone who would take it away because of the failing Power Supply Board. I was fully prepared to spend $4000.00+ to attain a TV of equal capability. That was until I googled upon this forum.

In every respect, except for the powerboard problems, my Pro510 looked absolutely brand new. The black laquer finish made it look and feel at home next to my Steinway Piano.

With the advice of many of you, including the now famous Mr Bob, my power board was repaired, and my Pro510 continues to assume a central position in our Home Theater. That it has now lasted 10 years and still rivals the best Plasmas and LCDs is a tribute to Pioneer and you folks.

Thanks for saving me a bundle of money. Merry Christmas.

Dave

Thanks Mr Bob for the quick reply. What would be the possibility of replacing the convergence board and fixing this problem? Is that worth it or is it time to get a new flat screen?
TIA Robiwan

These boards are availalbe from Pioneer, tho there's no guaranty that the problems you are seeing are not caused elsewhere in the unit by the conv gen circ or a faulty coil, as stated previously. A coil being faulty would be a real long shot, cuz if there's something wrong with a coil, it doesn't usually affect things variably, like just on one side. It usually works or doesn't work, period.

A defective op amp in the gen circ could cause a variable result tho, saw that happen on my old Advent front projector.

I would replace that board and see if that does it. You can always return it if it doesn't do the trick and get your $ back, minus only the shipping and maybe a restocking charge. If it does work, then of course you'll probably need the geometry and convergence redone on your set, from using a virgin conv bd. If you change out your ICs again to the new 180s instead and that does the trick, chances are it will leave your geo/conv paradigm alone for the most part and only require some conv trimming.


As for whether you should consider retiring your set, buying new and thus limiting your viewing capacity to what is presently out there in the marketplace, I think everyone reading this thread knows already how I feel about that. See the post above yours from djones (no relation). That says it all.

For those of you who are new and don't know how I feel about that, please see this thread, started by me over 3 years ago and still going strong. We just clocked our 200th page recently, and it has lots of pretty pictures when you hit the right pages, starting with this one. You can't get blacks like that with anything but CRT or the most expensive plasmas or front pjs out today - the really expensive ones, most of which still don't do as well as CRT -

Don't Dump Your CRT RPTV!

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=695922&page=203

;)

b

I have a pro 200 that had the board pulled and fixed. I am putting it back in and have everything connected but one wire and for the life of me I cannot find where it goes. It should be an easy one to find. I am reinstalling the power supply board. The wire that I need to know where it goes is the red wire with a spade connector and grey rubber boot coming off of the FBT. The only other wire that goes into this FBT is the anode cable. I would really appreciate help with this.

If it's a thin red wire coming out of the FBT, it goes to the focus block. There will be one vacant socket, and that's where the spade will go. It supplies the focus block with its intermediately high voltage.


b

That was it, thanks for your help. This was driving me mad.

You got it. Glad I could help -

;)

b

I've got a Pioneer SD-582HD5 that's starting to get a bright flash over the screen. Happens with satalite channels and DVD's. Is this probalem related to these televisions as well?

I've got a Pioneer SD-582HD5 that's starting to get a bright flash over the screen. Happens with satalite channels and DVD's. Is this probalem related to these televisions as well?

Yes. It very likely IS the bad solder problem on the power supply board.
As your set being a SD-582HD5, definitely falls under the same service manual that covers the 510/610/532/582 sets. And they ALL use the exact same power supply boards.

Here is a link to get the manual for free, in pdf form.
(note: for all you x20 and x30 series owners, you could also use this same manual for most things)

http://www.schematicsforfree.com/archive/file/Video/Products/Pioneer Pro610A3051.pdf

GLCII, everything you need to know is in the above posts, I just finished mine and it is working well.

I sure do thanks you folks for helping me out with this. Especially that service manual. Sure does look helpfull.

Am I to take that the power supply board is the board where the power cord fits onto? And all I have to do is check the solder and maybe resolder some of the loose solder points? Or maybe get a new or refurb'ed part # AWV1809 or AWV1808?

Again Thanks!

If you want the fix to last. You need to resolder ALL the connections on the board. Do not just resolder a few connections that look marginal, do ALL of them!
Also, the refurbed boards from Pioneer. Usually will fail sometime down the road after you put one in, for the same reasons.
Their method they use to wave/machine soldering of the power supply board, is marginal at best.

I'm probably going to take a look at it today. I haven't seen how far apart the solder joints are away from each other. I've only soldered a few times and don't want to have solder spread to another joint. But If I do solder,I will solder all as you suggested. If by chance I did buy a new board, as long as I knew for sure what it was, I would go retail and not refurbed.

I bought this tv in 2001 and it's always been a good set. I guess it should be for $5000.00 from Best Buy and $3800.00 online plus another $250.00 delivery from NY. I went with online.

Actually a well set up solder flow machine usually does an excellent and permanent job of soldering everything on the boards. There are many boards in that unit, yet this is the only board that ever had this problem. I believe the reason the replacement Pioneer boards fail is because they resolder them the way most local techs do - just the presently bad conn's.

The tiny number of exceptions to 100% as to what needs to be resoldered on that board have been stipulated by me many times on this thread. Suffice it to say that no, as Johnla says, you cannot get away with just resoldering a smattering of the bad joints. Doing that will come back to bite you on the butt later. And when it does, the result may be your set getting totalled, since the more innocent conn's may have already been soldered now properly, leaving the much more UNinnocent ones still in play and ready to let themselves loose later.

If you don't want to take any chances and are not a repair or assembly professional who does this type of thing every day, don't even think about doing it yourself. Far too much is riding on it. Those joints are very tiny and very close to each other. It's extremely easy to do a solder bridge and not realize it. Who knows what would happen then, on turn-on? I don't, and don't want to learn the hard way! If you are a beginner at soldering or even journeyman class, leave it to an extreme professional who does it every day.

If you want it done right, send it to me. My way of doing it is the ONLY way that works, and works permanently. I am the one who came up with the only permanent fix for this problem that has been proven for years now, to be 100%.

If you just buy a replacement board - new boards disappeared years ago, the only boards now available from Pioneer are refurbs of core charge returned boards - you will be sacrificing the original board your set was calibrated on at the factory, and hence the board your entire unit was originally set up on. They are a matched set. Keep them that way. Don't buy a refurb that not only will be a different board from the one your unit was set up on, but was also not resoldered properly as a refurb - not resoldered the only way possible, to keep this problem from ever coming back. 100% minus a tiny number of very logical and simple exceptions. 99% net.

;)

b

I have a sd-583hd5 projection tv. The picture is just too good to justify buying a plasma. Within the last few months, I started to experienced the pop/sutoff problem. So, i pulled the PS board (and took it to the tv repair guy to ressolder the board. I just picked up the board and was inspecting it prior to plugging it up. I am scarred sh!tless because I see some points soldered together as one (i.e. bridged) but i do not remember them being that way prior to dropping off my board. I did talk to the manager, he looked at it and said they were supposed to be that way.

Here are the locations of the bridges. I'd appreciated and feedback:

Specifically,
1. connection E5:
-- the 1st two soldered pins (25v and unlabled pin just below the "E5") are bridged together

2. connection E1:
-- the two grounds pins (#9 & 11-- at opposite end of "E1")are bridged
-- the middle 9v pin is bridged to another pin (Pin # 6 & 7)

Do you think these bridges are ok?

============================================================ ==============

Hooorrraaahhh. I took a chance, re-installed the ps board, turn the tv on: so far, so good. 20 minutes and no shutoff yet...

Thanks for the advice Mr Bob. PM me on the details of getting the board to you and what it will take to get the job done.

I haven't looked at it yet so I'm not sure what it looks like or how bad it is. Other than what I see the TV doing and it isn't that bad yet but is steady getting worse.

On a side note: Does anyone have a Hi-res picture of this board?


goodguygonebad

If I get in there, I'll post a pic to look at. Closeup.

On a side note: Does anyone have a Hi-res picture of this board?



Here is some photos of the board, that in the past have been posted in this thread.

http://home.comcast.net/~larryh791/elitepsfix.html

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=16547117&postcount=1819

I have a sd-583hd5 projection tv. The picture is just too good to justify buying a plasma. Within the last few months, I started to experienced the pop/sutoff problem. So, i pulled the PS board (and took it to the tv repair guy to ressolder the board. I just picked up the board and was inspecting it prior to plugging it up. I am scarred sh!tless because I see some points soldered together as one (i.e. bridged) but i do not remember them being that way prior to dropping off my board. I did talk to the manager, he looked at it and said they were supposed to be that way.

Here are the locations of the bridges. I'd appreciated and feedback:

Specifically,
1. connection E5:
-- the 1st two soldered pins (25v and unlabled pin just below the "E5") are bridged together

2. connection E1:
-- the two grounds pins (#9 & 11-- at opposite end of "E1")are bridged
-- the middle 9v pin is bridged to another pin (Pin # 6 & 7)

Do you think these bridges are ok?

============================================================ ==============

Hooorrraaahhh. I took a chance, re-installed the ps board, turn the tv on: so far, so good. 20 minutes and no shutoff yet...

The connectors contain many redundancies in their legs. All are labeled, so you just gotta use your intuition. If 2 legs are both labeled the same thing, they can be joined by a solder bridge.

But the 9v that is up against the 11v must - obviously - not have a bridge between the 2.


b

Thanks for the advice Mr Bob. PM me on the details of getting the board to you and what it will take to get the job done.

I haven't looked at it yet so I'm not sure what it looks like or how bad it is. Other than what I see the TV doing and it isn't that bad yet but is steady getting worse.


Anyone wanting me to do their board for them needs to contact me personally and directly, outside of this thread. Please call or email me - not pm me please, I'm just a couple of pms away from overflow - and I'll get back to you with info about what to do next.

it isn't that bad yet but is steady getting worse.

You're already on borrowed time. Stop using your set immediately, and don't allow it up to cruising temp again - even once - until it gets fixed properly. The next incident you have may be the one that takes your set down, and hard. Many sets have already been totalled because this advice was not heeded. The owners have contacted me directly needing to go to the next level, which is a lot more expensive to fix.

:rolleyes:

Some are willing to afford that, and others just aren't. Their sets are currently occupying local landfills.

The additional repair fees are certainly doable, as the additional boards needed can still be procured from Pioneer. But completely unnecessary, with the advice I have just given here. Again.

If your set is experiencing intermittent problems, stop using your set! It's that simple. Get it fixed properly before allowing it up to cruising temp again. Even once.


b

If anyone near or in Dallas/Arlington, Houston, Austin or San Antonio area is interested on having their sets calibrated Mr. Bob will be in Texas the later part of January. If you are interested PM me or Email Mr. Bob.

Looking forward to it.

Hello,
This is my first posting after reading this thread. Thank you to everyone for posting such valuable information. I have an (almost) nine year old Pioneer SD-582HD5 that is dead. I had never had any flashing, it just went dark one day while I was watching. When plugged in, upon pressing the master power switch I hear the customary click and the front light goes green, but no picture or menu. I had a local Pioneer repairman come over, he went right to the PS board. After a few silent minutes he told me that he had an eighty percent certainty that he could fix it for about $500. I did not like those odds, plus that was above the figure my wife and I had agreed upon, so he closed the set up and left with a house call check in hand. After he left I powered the set to find only the front red light would light up. I found this forum and opened the back up to find the black heat-sinked IC on the PS board dangling, (I beleive it is IC 204.) I pulled the board and re-soldered that IC, put the PS board back in and plugged it back in. Now I was back to the front green light, but still no picture. I then did a complete re-solder of the PS board, with no change. I do not see any LEDs "on" either on the PS board or the convergence board. What are my next moves?

Dead Pioneer Elite Pro 620.

Hi. I have this rear projection sitting in my garage and I don't know what to do with it. I know I can get it fixed for about $500 but went with a new 151 instead.

I don't want to throw out the 620 in the trash - someone must want it or even the parts for it... any ideas?

Thanks for your help.

Dead Pioneer Elite Pro 620.

Hi. I have this rear projection sitting in my garage and I don't know what to do with it. I know I can get it fixed for about $500 but went with a new 151 instead.

I don't want to throw out the 620 in the trash - someone must want it or even the parts for it... any ideas?

Thanks for your help.

Where are you located?

Hello,
This is my first posting after reading this thread. Thank you to everyone for posting such valuable information. I have an (almost) nine year old Pioneer SD-582HD5 that is dead. I had never had any flashing, it just went dark one day while I was watching. When plugged in, upon pressing the master power switch I hear the customary click and the front light goes green, but no picture or menu. I had a local Pioneer repairman come over, he went right to the PS board. After a few silent minutes he told me that he had an eighty percent certainty that he could fix it for about $500. I did not like those odds, plus that was above the figure my wife and I had agreed upon, so he closed the set up and left with a house call check in hand. After he left I powered the set to find only the front red light would light up. I found this forum and opened the back up to find the black heat-sinked IC on the PS board dangling, (I beleive it is IC 204.) I pulled the board and re-soldered that IC, put the PS board back in and plugged it back in. Now I was back to the front green light, but still no picture. I then did a complete re-solder of the PS board, with no change. I do not see any LEDs "on" either on the PS board or the convergence board. What are my next moves?

If you actually totally resoldered that PS board, then I personally am at a loss. I have had boards with exactly that same problem come in several times so far and every time, resoldering the board fixed it. Let us know what you found out, once it's going again.

BTW, did you resolder under the white caulking? Did you resolder each and every leg of the plugin connectors, esp. the white ones?

Leaving an IC dangling is definitely in violation of some version of consumer protection laws, whatever those are for your area. If the tech actually did that, he needs censuring.


b

Bob,
Thanks for the reply. I have a replacement for IC 204 on order (just in case it was damaged).

I did not solder under the caulking where the wire jumper is held down. I was afraid that I might pull the pads up. I will go back in cut the caulking and solder there.

I solder in small areas, checking my work as I go wearing magnifying head goggles. Than I did a total board check, fixing anything that did not look correct, paying special attention to the connectors. I used my thumb to check for any connector rocking against the board. E3 rocked and I re-soldered it for a third time. I really want this set to work again.

Thanks again for your input.
sparky22nj

I scrape the caulking off, so I won't damage anything. Cutting it can be done if done right, if not you may score across and sever a run without realizing it. You may find more than one connection hidden by the white caulking.

Even so runs can be damaged if you press too hard, so I am glad you are aware of that type of precaution.

The white connectors press down, you really don't need to resolder them to get them to not rock.

If you block one of the goggles and just use one eye, you won't be so crosseyed later nor eye-fatigued, and your vision will more effortlessly stay 20-20.


b

I had 6 or 7 joints hid under the white caulk, remove it very carefully. I looked at them with a 30x magnifyer and they didn't look all that bad but upon resoldering them some opened up a hole big enough to lose your soldering tip in. Recheck every thing, mine has ran fine now for the past three weeks. Cleaned the mirrow and lens also, made the picture much sharper.

Hello,
This is my first posting after reading this thread. Thank you to everyone for posting such valuable information. I have an (almost) nine year old Pioneer SD-582HD5 that is dead. I had never had any flashing, it just went dark one day while I was watching. When plugged in, upon pressing the master power switch I hear the customary click and the front light goes green, but no picture or menu. I had a local Pioneer repairman come over, he went right to the PS board. After a few silent minutes he told me that he had an eighty percent certainty that he could fix it for about $500. I did not like those odds, plus that was above the figure my wife and I had agreed upon, so he closed the set up and left with a house call check in hand. After he left I powered the set to find only the front red light would light up. I found this forum and opened the back up to find the black heat-sinked IC on the PS board dangling, (I beleive it is IC 204.) I pulled the board and re-soldered that IC, put the PS board back in and plugged it back in. Now I was back to the front green light, but still no picture. I then did a complete re-solder of the PS board, with no change. I do not see any LEDs "on" either on the PS board or the convergence board. What are my next moves?

You didn't mention checking the fuses, just in case you forgot. :D

I had 6 or 7 joints hid under the white caulk, remove it very carefully. I looked at them with a 30x magnifyer and they didn't look all that bad but upon resoldering them some opened up a hole big enough to lose your soldering tip in. Recheck every thing, mine has ran fine now for the past three weeks. Cleaned the mirrow and lens also, made the picture much sharper.

;)

b

You didn't mention checking the fuses, just in case you forgot. :D

If any of the fuses is blown it won't power up. Which it definitely is doing, if the green light is staying on.


b

If any of the fuses is blown it won't power up. Which it definitely is doing, if the green light is staying on.


b

Yeah, ok I read it too fast. :D

Someone, anyone... give me some advice.

I have a broken elite 620 that I need to get rid of and I don't want to throw it in the trash.

I'm sure people can use the screen or some of the parts or even the casing.

I've placed an ad on craigslist, and I've even called a few tv repair stores. Does anyone have any other suggestions before it goes out into the bulk trash for good?

Thanks for the help.

Where's it at?

Calling around to repair shops is probably a good idea. Techs who can easily fix it and get a fine, working set out of it for nothing, will probably haul it away for you.

I do. I did with a 610 that is presently sitting in my garage, awaiting my fixing and reselling it.


b

Mr. Bob,

I scraped the white silicone up enough to solder the pads underneath, replaced the IC that had been left dangling (just in case), did a visual inspection on the component side & re-soldered everything but the test points.

I put the PS board back in and checked all connector wires (found one loose ground wire on E5). I powered up the set everything is the same, green light but no picture or menu. Help, I'm out of ideas.

Thanks for any suggestions,
sparky22nj

If your green light is staying on, your set is not going into protection, which is a good thing. Lack of pic/menu probably indicates one of the DC power supplies is not getting to its board downline, somehow someway.

How does a tech make a multi-pronged IC that is bonded to a heat sink with a strongly wrenched in screw "dangle"? Has that dangling IC been bonded to its heat sink again, properly? As I recall from memory it has 4 or 5 legs. Again, how can such a thing be made to "dangle" when it was originally in there very solidly, from the factory?

Feel free to contact me off board and we'll talk more about this. Your set's condition is no longer on the beaten path here. You can talk with me off board or get local service repair help, but I see no easy answers here, at this point.


b

Bob,

Thanks again for all you do here, very much appreciated.

Regarding IC204, I opened the back prior to the repairman arriving. IC204 (five leads) is the only one with the black heat sink, which does not have a screw-down to the board, just posts that insert through holes in the board.

When I first looked at the PS board, IC204 was screwed tight to it's heat sink (good), but the heat sink was hanging down at an angle. The heat sink was not anchored tightly to the board. The white silicone on the component side was holding it loosely away from the board at an angle. So before anyone touched the board here at my house, IC204 was not up to snuff, mechanically anyway. It did seem to be soldered, which was almost the only thing holding it to the board.

After the repairman left and I found this forum, I opened the back and saw that the IC and heat sink were now hanging at a much worst angle.

Right now the new IC is screwed to the heat sink, soldered to the board and I applied silicone to the back of the board to grab the heat sink posts that come through the board in order to hold it tight.

Anyway this is too much information for most readers. I dug out my old multimeter, only to find it's display dead. So I will be picking up a new multimeter and giving you a call.

Thanks again,
sparky22nj

Any IC that has 5 legs really doesn't need to be screwed down to the board or anchored to it in any way, as long as it's not too big a heat sink. 5 legs is more than enough to hold that one tightly, when soldered adequately.


b

Any One would like to put together a sea /tac Tour to get "Mr Bob" up here
to do his magic on our RPTV's ????i have a pio elite 510 & 730hdi would love to get shim & cal from the "master"!! pool plane fare and it will send him up here to do his stuff..Plus a lot of exchanges of knowledge and that will benefit us in years to come. :D

I'm ready when you are!

;)

b

My neighbor is having a problem with their pioneer SD-P5181-K (looks like a 52 inch pioneer but no HD). The red light is on but when you press the on button the unit does not power up, it’s as if it’s stuck in stand-by mode. They did not notice blue flashing of anything, it just started this problem all at once. Does this line of Pioneer suffer from the same cold solder joint problem that my 510 previously had ? I looked inside the their unit and it is a different power board from the 510. If you guys here think it possible that a resoldering the power board will work I’ll do it for them (for the fun of it). Any thoughts ?

I'm new to the party here as my 9+ year old Pioneer SD-532HD5 started exhibiting the flashing syndrome described by many here Friday night plus then it would go bright for a while then drop down. I found this thread and following instructions removed the back panel and the power supply board and found some brownish solder points which I suspect are the culprits. I've included a picture here of the board with some of the burnt posts indicated.

Power Supply Board Picture

My neighbor is having a problem with their pioneer SD-P5181-K (looks like a 52 inch pioneer but no HD). The red light is on but when you press the on button the unit does not power up, it’s as if it’s stuck in stand-by mode. They did not notice blue flashing of anything, it just started this problem all at once. Does this line of Pioneer suffer from the same cold solder joint problem that my 510 previously had ? I looked inside the their unit and it is a different power board from the 510. If you guys here think it possible that a resoldering the power board will work I’ll do it for them (for the fun of it). Any thoughts ?

Pioneers have had these cold solder joint problems for years, long before the HD line. Chances are you will improve things if you look it over and find some bad ones.

But when it goes off suddenly like that, it's usually one or both of the conv ICs giving up the ghost. If you don't find any cold solder joints, that would be my next avenue of attack -


b

I'm new to the party here as my 9+ year old Pioneer SD-532HD5 started exhibiting the flashing syndrome described by many here Friday night plus then it would go bright for a while then drop down. I found this thread and following instructions removed the back panel and the power supply board and found some brownish solder points which I suspect are the culprits. I've included a picture here of the board with some of the burnt posts indicated.

Power Supply Board Picture

You have obviously not read this whole thread. No big surprise, it's a long one!

Those are the big resistors, and were added later. That's why they still have the rosin on their conn's. Nothing wrong there. If you don't see browning of the top of your board, under those resistors, you know there's been no overheating going on.

But you gotta STOP USING YOUR SET NOW. Otherwise you're playing Russian Roulette with it and are just looking for trouble. Unplug it until fixed correctly. Do not allow it up to normal operating temp again until this sit has been remedied completely.

Send it to me and I'll take care of it permanently. Survey this thread and you'll see that I've been on this like flies... oh, you know! for years. Or if you're a qualified professional do it yourself. But don't farm it out to local repair techs, who will only band-aid it and you'll be right back where you started within a year.

My resoldering jobs on these boards are permanent. Contact me directly - no pms please! - and I'll get you what you need, to save your set. I only have 4 boards in the wings right now here, awaiting my attention. It's been worse, I have at times had 7...


b

I am still Pioneer Pro 610HD Owner. Since last 5 yr, I have installed new power supply board, I am still good. No more Blue flash..

I bought this TV in 2001 July...And had first blue Flash in Jul 2003...But In 2005, I got new Power supply board...I am worry free since last 5 year.

That's good, because I just had an inquiry from an owner named Ken in Massachusettes whose board was replaced by Pio a few years back and has now gone out again. This was after he had tried to resolder his first board himself and had it last just a couple of days, as he is an admitted amateur and did a very sparse job of it. I pointed out that it's a good thing that job of taking care of just the ones that are bad now didn't expose the rest of his set to the more advanced ones, the ones that take your set down. Which happen later. There's a lot to be said on this sit, for "nipping it in the bud", where the first ones to go are the most innocuous and innocent. The ones later, when this sit is not handled promptly, are the more seriously damaging ones to your boards downline.

He inquired as to how long these sets last and whether it was worth it to put money into the repair. I sent him to page 45 of this thread, but he can't open pix at work, will do so at home instead.

He talked about the nightmare of going out and finding something to replace it with, how to dispose of his current set, etc... All of which for him was a nightmare. He'd much rather keep his set.

We also talked about its being a monster compared to the flat screens of today and I asked him if he had speakers beside it, as part of his home entertainment sys. He said yes.

I then pointed out that to me that thickness of his set is a perk. It brings the actual image much closer to your view than a flat screen will. With a flat screen a foot or 2 farther back it reduces the size of the screen dramatically, necessitating spending more $ on a bigger flat panel to make up for the diminshment of size due to added distance, eyes to screen.

And the fidelity of fixed pixel is still not ready for prime time on most of what's out there, compared to what these CRT babies are capable of. Not in overall performance, all things considered. IMHO, CRT is still the best.

He is sending his PS board to me, and is on the list of owners wanting to be in on my next tour to his area. Which is Mansfield Massachusettes, in case anyone else in or around that area is interested as well -


b

Bob,
Please let me know when you are in Chicago Area.
May be if you have a time, I can have you looked at my TV...Since, I have to keep my TV always Black Level 13...from 0.
If I keep Black level 0 then it looks too dark...

What do you say?

Standard condition at your set's age. My calibration covers realigning the energy your CRTs get so your set gets back to normal - perfect (brightness) shadow detail at midpoint, once I'm done with it. No extra charge.

For on location/tour info, contact me directly and I'll get you on the schedule, once one comes up. Or be the organizer, and let's get busy and start one for your area! In any case get me your contact info directly, not by pm please. I'll feed you any leads I currently have, and there are several in the wings right now as we speak.

A couple named Violet and Bruce are sending their board to me as we speak, and live in Chicago. I'll put you in touch with them if you'd like -


;)

b

Standard condition at your set's age. My calibration covers realigning the energy your CRTs get so your set gets back to normal - perfect (brightness) shadow detail at midpoint, once I'm done with it. No extra charge.

For on location/tour info, contact me directly and I'll get you on the schedule, once one comes up. Or be the organizer, and let's get busy and start one for your area! In any case get me your contact info directly, not by pm please. I'll feed you any leads I currently have, and there are several in the wings right now as we speak.

A couple named Violet and Bruce are sending their board to me as we speak, and live in Chicago. I'll put you in touch with them if you'd like -


;)

b


I would be happy to get your service.
Please let me know. Appreciated. Pankaj.

Please contact me directly, by email or phone. Not by pm please -

b

sure.
Thanks Bob.

I want to report that I had Bob resolder the power supply from my Pioneer SD-532HD5 and I swear the set looks better than when it was delivered 9 years ago. Next I will have Bob over sometime to get rid of that darn overscan it has.

Can't wait!

;)

b

I I have a new problem with my 710. I’ve had the power board redone by Mr. Bob, so that should be good. The problem I was having was the 5 amp fuse would blow every once in a while (one 6.3 fuse blew once). I did notice that it would blow the fuse when the set was warmed up and I would shut it off and turn it back on before it had a chance to cool off. I thought the problem was the ICs. I had two 180s installed (Sanyos) and now as soon as I try to turn the set on the 5 amp will blow.

I thinking since it started doing this after the new ICs were installed that the ICs were bad to start with or the tech did something wrong on the install. I looked at the solder joints and they actually look good.

What do you guys think?

Ken T.

Before you do anything, check for any stray "whiskers" between the pads the IC legs are soldered to. Do a continuity check if you have any question, between any 2 legs and see if they are connecting together when they shouldn't be. Some side by side conns are supposed to be conn'd together and most are not. Both ICs get hooked up identically, so the readings you take should be the same, unless they changed something between them as part of the design.

If you find nothing there, proceed to plan b -

Whenever something you did causes a bad result, start with undoing what has been done so far. Replace those ICs again, both of them, and see what happens. If it then works, you know that one of those new ones had to be bad to start with. Perhaps it somehow slipped thru QC. I've seen it happen. You can then go on to testing the 2 you took out to see which one was bad, or just toss both of them and be done with it. I would.


If it still doesn't work, hmmm...


b

Just curious, is the LED on u'r deflection assly brd lit up when this happened? My set has a similar problem w/ the 5A fuse blowing and the LED on the defln assly brd lighting up....Keep us posted as I would like to know how u get this resolved.

I I have a new problem with my 710. I’ve had the power board redone by Mr. Bob, so that should be good. The problem I was having was the 5 amp fuse would blow every once in a while (one 6.3 fuse blew once). I did notice that it would blow the fuse when the set was warmed up and I would shut it off and turn it back on before it had a chance to cool off. I thought the problem was the ICs. I had two 180s installed (Sanyos) and now as soon as I try to turn the set on the 5 amp will blow.

I thinking since it started doing this after the new ICs were installed that the ICs were bad to start with or the tech did something wrong on the install. I looked at the solder joints and they actually look good.

What do you guys think?

Ken T.

Just curious to know what my fellow Pioneer owners who have bought the HDFury2 think of it. I'm a PS3 owner, and kinda sick of everything being downconverted to 480p. My question is, by using it, will the 720p content upconvert since it's now running through an HDMI cable? What's the biggest plus you've noticed using it?

I guess I'm just looking for that final excuse to purchase one, but the $150 price tag keeps making me question whether its worth it or not. Thoughts anyone?

If you're interested in upconverting your 480i library to 1080i get one, you won't go wrong. Otherwise pass, as HDMI does nothing to improve the 1080i HD signal. You won't do any better than component for normal HD.

RGB might allow your computer to jimmy with your colorations if you have the proper card for it, but for regular HD, like Bluray, component is the cat's meow and your pic won't get any better because of having HDMI involved.

HDMI is just another way to step on your otherwise primo HD signal.

The only advantage of HDMI is if your player puts out a better signal on its HDMI, and you want to get that sig to your display intact. In that case the Fury is essential.

DK the answer to your 720p question, but I suspect that would also wind up as 480p in the end, just like component.


b

My question is, by using it, will the 720p content upconvert since it's now running through an HDMI cable?


No, not unless you can set the PS3 to upconvert it. Neither just the HDFury or HDMI can do that.

DK the answer to your 720p question, but I suspect that would also wind up as 480p in the end, just like component.


b

Hmmm, guess I really need PS3 owners that are using the HDFury2 to answer this then. I do know the PS3 will upconvert DVD, but I don't know what it does with games. So many are in 720p, and I see the downconvert everytime. Frustrating that Pioneer didn't put that option in the TV, but at the time how could they have known?

I personally don't care that much about upconverting my DVDs, I'm happy with how they look as is (thanks Pioneer Elite DVD player)! I already knew that with Blu-Ray movies it doesn't matter if it's coming through component or HDMI, so this is strictly a game issue that I'm having. Unfortunately, on gaming sights, nobody has a clue about anything other than LCD and Plasma, and it's very limited even about that. I know this isn't techinically a '510 Promblem', but I appreciate you guys humoring me all the same.

You should buy my 65" Panasonic CRT. It was the last CRT triple-gun RPTV to ever do 720p native, while also keeping 1080i native, both separate from each other and independent of each other, with separate structure - geo/conv - memories, one for 720p and the other for 1080i.

All other CRT RPTVs that came after that either upconverted whatever 720p they received to 1080i, or simply would not read 720p at all, which is the case of my latest gen 73" Mit. With all the bells and whistles their latest and greatest ever CRT RPTV had, it didn't upconvert 720P! Any 720p hitting it just leaves it blank. Black screen.

The Panasonic, OTOH, displays 720p perfectly, as 720p.


b

Thank you to all who have posted the steps to fix the board. My 2000 HD-610 just had the terrible "flash" and then no picture. I followed the steps posted after reading the entire thread, and reinstalled the board tonight! The picture looks better than ever! I will monitor for other instances of blue flashes but resoldering seems to have done the trick! A million thanks to all!

Hope you did all the soldering that is necessary to do, which is 99% of it. Otherwise you'll have been under a false sense of security, and will be back where you started again soon.

If you did you have nothing to worry about, and congrats! So glad we could help.

;)

b

I am about to pickup a Pioneer 610hd that seems in good order. Very pretty 1080i from Satelitte, yet has not been maintained in a long time. No complaints from the owner and I watched it for 1/2 an hour and no flashing popping, coloration effects or power downs. I picked it up for $100.

I have a Wii. I also have a HTPC that is currently equipped with an Athlon XP 2800 and an Nvidia 6200. The Nvidia has VGA and DVI-D. It is also eqiped with a Hauppage WinTV FM GO. Pretty crappy NTSC tuner with svideo input that can take the Wii signal and display it fullscreen and deinterlace the signal.

I am really wanting to get all my Digital Movie Library to 1080i on the set right away and have been need help deciding what I am going to have to do to the HTPC to make it capable. Also, I want to get the Wii as good as can be.

It seems that with the existing video card I will have to get to component or to RGB/hv as those are the two best connections that do 1080i on the Pioneer. It Also seems that 480i, 480p and 1080i are available over both component and RGB/HV? As a side note, I've read that some RPTV ownersa with PCs were able to hack something like a 540p signal to their 1080i only TV; did I missunderstand what they had done? or did they actually achive a 540p display on the RPTV?

It also seems that I can tweak the Nvidia to output sync signals that'll get the output capable of being transported to the RGB/HV 15pin D-sub connector or the component Y,Pb,Pr/3-RCA connectors . I am unsure how to deal with the RGB/HV transport.

If there is a considerable advantage to RGB/HV (maybe the NVidia is more programmable toward it, or the picture quality is better, or the Pioneer deals with it better) vs. the component-ins?

It seems that the HDFURY is the best way to get to RGB/HV via DVI-D output, connecting the HDFURY to the TV with a short, high quality 15 pin straight-thru cable. Is that correct?

Yet if the Component is of equal quality and capability, is there some simpler method to get from DVI-D OR DIRECTLY from VGA-out to the Pioneer?

The last portion of this is really also in regard to assessing the HDFury Line.

I will probably never get a Blue-Ray player other than in the PC. Nor do I see getting any other HDMI sources. I will be downloading from major services and playing content from the PC. Yet there may be a draw to get a better picture from the PC only supported over HDMI, such as DeepColor. Another factor may be the image centering issue/over-scan. Another would be Gamma adjustment. Another may be the 0-255 vs 16-243 corrections. Is that Valid Thinking?

So I wonder how I should connect this TV now, for the short term, with this HTPC that is obviously underpowered for HD content, and wheteher in the long run I will want to lean toward a newer Nvidia chipset that has HDMI ouput?


I know this is a big set of questions for a posting, but it is difficult walking back into fixed frequency display devices after so many years. I have no idea what our current desktop cards are capable of in terms of driving them. But I do see the value in this TV, it is very pretty. And it seems like a workhorse. Like an Old HP laserjet.

Could you folks help me out trying to identify how to assemble all this stuff in the short term and maybe give me a tech refresh so I can figure out how to design around this thing (the Pioneer) into the future?

Oh yeah, and correct me where I am wrong, and deluge me if I seem full of crap or misguided?

It would be so much appreciated.

I don't have any answers to offer, but I do have to say this...you picked up a 610 for $100?? You lucky bastard!

Now here's Bob and many others to tell you to get that thing cleaned and calibrated...

@shutyertrap
As I understand them, the hdfury's don't upscale at all. If you want the Pioneer to do 1080i, you have to output a 1080i signal somewhere, it does NO upscaling and neither does an HDfury. Can't the PS3 output 1080?

Did I read in the manual that the Pioneer downscales though? Is that what happens to the 720p signal?

@anybody?
I guess I am also curios, is the centering fix that the HDFury claims essentially a problem fixable via overscan adjustment on the set?

I mean does everybody experience this? And is it a maintenance issue?

@Rooot

No, I know the Pioneer can't upscale. The PS3, since it's also a Blu-Ray player, has the ability to upscale DVDs to 1080, so long as you are connected with an HDMI cable. That got me wondering if that was only for DVD, or if it'd also upscale the games that are in 720p to 1080. My guess is 'no', as there are no settings in the PS3 menu specifically related to that. That's why I was curious about other PS3 users and their Pioneer 510/610/710 experiences. As for what the Pioneer does with a 720p signal, not sure. My guess is that it downscales to 480p, but I honestly don't know.

The only reason I was thinking of buying the HDFury2, was cause it does that HDMI to component conversion, thus allowing full use of the PS3's abilities. If it doesn't affect the games though, I won't bother dropping the $150. Rather save that for the day I can afford Mr Bob and his ability to fix the overscan issue (that btw REALLY rears it's ugly head when playing games who's onscreen HUDs love to sit at the top corners of the picture. Can't even play GTA 4 because it cuts off most of your instructional text.)

Did I read in the manual that the Pioneer downscales though? Is that what happens to the 720p signal?


As for what the Pioneer does with a 720p signal, not sure. My guess is that it downscales to 480p, but I honestly don't know.

Nope, the 510/610/710 does nothing with a 720p signal, nada, as in it will not even display anything that is 720p. It can not accept a 720p signal, so you get no picture at all.

It can not accept a 720p signal, so you get no picture at all.

Um, what about all the broadcast TV that is in 720p? Or like I said before, said games? Yes, I have told my satellite box and PS3 what resolutions my TV can display, so what happens with those signals?

Um, what about all the broadcast TV that is in 720p? Or like I said before, said games? Yes, I have told my satellite box and PS3 what resolutions my TV can display, so what happens with those signals?


For broadcast TV, you need a tuner that converts the 720p to 1080i, and you set the tuner to always output at 1080i, which all off air HD tuners, cable boxes, and satellite receivers will do. Even the optional off air HD tuner that Pioneer sold for the x10 series sets, that is all it did for 720p. Sorry to be blunt here, but simply put, NONE of the inputs on the TV can do anything with a 720p input, you get nothing on the screen if you try that. No matter which input you use, the external inputs on the TV can only accept and display 480i, 480p and 1080i signals. Without something else to do a conversion to the signal first, it can not accept or even show a picture from a 720p or 1080p input signal through any of it's external inputs! Same goes for 720p games, trying to directly send any x10 series Pioneer RPTV any type of 720p signals, it flat out won't work. The TV itself can not process any type of 720p external input signal to do anything at all, and if you try to do so, the end result is you will get no picture.

@johnla
can you comment on getting pc VGA output to RGB/HV using NVIDIA or ATI in their current generation?

As per Pioneer

http://208.220.235.52:7001/eSupportJSP/cp_SolutionFind3.jsp?solution_id=F12078



"PRO610HD, PRO510HD: RGB Connection
Hooking up a personal computer to RGB terminal

The RGB input jack is designed for use in connecting a digital tuner with RGB signal output
It should never be used for connecting to personal computer or other device."


http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Support/Knowledgebase

I don't understand. I am confused by your use of quotation. Is that Rhetorical?

Do you mean to say that it is not supported by Pioneer, or definitively; that no use of powerstrip, HDFURY or other means will allow anything other than a "digital tuner" to connect and provide desirable viewing signal? And thus, specifically, that a PC connected via HDfury or with appropriate ??????? (i dunno WTF I am asking here, if I knew I wouldn't be asking) martian, reverse-amplified, over-thrusted oxygen boosted flux capacitor signal cable wont output just great?

I get the feeling that no matter wtf Pioneer says, many people have had success delivering a 1080i correctly synced cable to the pioneer and I want to know how and if its cheaper via component, or DVI or hdmiwith an HDFury or something else......

But thx.....anyway I already read all that in the manual.

That is what Pioneer says, and if you want to do anything else with the RGB input, then Pioneer is kind of telling you are on your own. And for how cut and dried they worded it, that pretty much means Pioneer officially does not support the use of a computer. And yes, the HDFury works on them, but no matter what you use, external tuners, satellite TV, cable TV, HDFury, DVD players, video game systems, or a computer. You can only send the TV itself the types of signals that the TV natively can accept, which is 480i, 480p, or 1080i. Whatever type of device you use to feed a signal to the TV, it must output in at least one of those formats in order to show a picture.

Now if you want to know what to try a set a HTPC video card to output at in HD, in order to feed the sets RGB input jack. The spec is, 1080i 33.75 kHz 60Hz, and it's the same spec if you want to use a component input for 1080i.

These are not like old CRT multisync analog CRT computer monitors, which often times could take a wide variation of input signals and show a great picture. If you try and feed this TV with something other than one of it's very limited range of native input rates, it will not know what to do with them and it will not give you a viewable picture.

My latest-ever-gen 73" Mit does exactly the same thing. Nada on 720p.

This is regardless of which input or input format is used. It's all in the decoding process, well beyond the input selector. Just was not designed to do anything with 720p, leaves it absolutely blank.


b

I'll let you know what I find. It's going to take a while though. The set is in Fla. and I live in Va. so I can only work on the set when I get down there.

I checked the ICs for shorts/whisker and didn't find anything. I'm going to try and replace the ICs first and see what happens.

I didn't see a light on the deflection board, just on the power supply board and board with the ICs

Thanks for all the help.
Ken T

Make sure all 4 fuses are a go. If one is blown, the LED on the conv bd could still light up and the set still not work.

Had that happen recently and replacing the blown fuse cured it. Works fine now.

b

That was the first thing I looked at. I even replaced them to make sure. I'm hoping to get back down there in April or May.

Ken T

My story is a little different than most on here. I was tolling my local freecycle page and someone was giving away a 510. I looked it up...found this forum. Asked the guy about it's history and why he wanted to get rid of it. Well, typical PS problem. He bought an LCD to replace it after 6 months. So I took a chance, picked it up... it was working when I got there. He wwas running it at 1080i via RGB from his DirectTV. Picture was a little dark and fuzzy.

Took it home, turned it on...still working. Last night... took it all apart. Label says 2001 on it, so this must have been near the end of the run. Took out the PS, found a bunch of cold solder joints...resoldered the entire board. Put it in...worked! Noticed the convergence appeared much better...was surprised by that. Recalibrated, dusted off the lenses, cleaned the screens.

Sat down to watch a movie. Wow...this is a great TV...Especially for free. The guy told me I saved it from the local recycle. That wouldn't have happened if I didn't find this forum. Thanks guys...especially Bob. I am tickled with my new toy.

Joe

Great, another one lives on! :D

Great that you could save another one! Yeah, the conv regulators that provide the voltage rails to the conv sys were probably getting their conn's really hinky in there, and are solid again now.

Next order of biz is to clean the optics, and that means all 10 surfaces that will need cleaning by now, of the 28 total optical surfaces in there (9 per gun plus the mirror, of which only 3 per gun need cleaning). Believe me, you'll be amazed all over again, check out my website for why...

;)

b

Same prob. here as most everyone else. Has been going on for 3 or 4 years now. :mad: CRAP! I should have looked around for a solution on the web a LONG time ago! Anyway, I'm just trying to get a updated, condenced fix on my prob. I believe I need to remove my power supply & re-solder it? Is that correct? I'm pretty handy but soldering circut boards is not on my resume so I will just take it out & bring it to a local elec. geek I guess. Still not sure where board is or how to access it... any pics or general assistance would be greatly appreciated! THX!!! :) Also, Mr. Bob, I've been curious about cleaning the optics as the unit is 10 yrs. old and I'm SURE they are dirty... 2 dogs in the house... again, thx in advance for any help!

I believe I need to remove my power supply & re-solder it? Is that correct? I'm pretty handy but soldering circut boards is not on my resume so I will just take it out & bring it to a local elec. geek I guess. Still not sure where board is or how to access it... any pics or general assistance would be greatly appreciated! THX!!!

Links to some pictures are in this post.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17914065&postcount=2167


Yes, the blue flash is the classic result/symptom of poor/failing solder connections. However, make sure whoever solders the board is good and is also experienced at soldering printed circuit boards, if he is not, get someone else to do the board, these boards are really NOT the place to try and learn how to solder printed circuit boards! And make sure that he also re-solders each and every solder joint on the board!

You've been playing with fire for 3 or 4 years here. You are extremely lucky you have not caused damage downline because of this. Eventually enough conn's go bad that the one that causes a giant spike - a lightning bolt, essentially - to go down into the rest of your set happens, and then it starts getting really expensive, many times totalling the unit. If it still turns on properly from dead cold as we speak and shows the regular coherent picture, keep it cold - on for no longer than 40 seconds - unplug it, and get it fixed.

Whatever you do, do not allow it back up to normal operating temperature again - even once - until restored to 100% efficacy. Completely fixed. Not just partially, but completely.

And no you don't have to do every joint on the board. Just 99% of them. Anything less and you're playing Russian Roulette with it again.

And no, don't just use a local tech. Most local techs will resolder the joints now needing attention and call it good. This will fix your set for now. Your set will work perfectly for the time of their warranty period and the tech will be allowed to keep his money, but sooner or later the rest of the joints on that board will start to go bad and you'll be right back where you started. I and one other tech I know do it right - solder everything in there that truly needs it, which is 99% of the conn's in there, with only very specific and highly limited exceptions. Hundreds of them, many of them very very small, where an unintentional solder bridge is very easy to do. Don't even think about trying it yourself if you are not a professional in the field, doing soldering every day as either a repair tech or a circuit board assembler working in a plant, like I did at Tektronix years ago. Way too much is riding on it.

I am available if you want to send it my way, contact me off board please, not by pm. I am readily accessible by Googling Mr Bob or checking out my website.


Advice and live, on the phone coaching on optics cleaning is also available, from my over 20 years of experience at that and all things related to calibration. Thanks for asking -


b

i have an 8 year RPTV and about a year ago it started doing sudden intensity jumps to a darker level, I tried turning off the RLS feature but saw not difference. It quit doing it recently, but the intensity of the set is lower than in the past. Is this pointing to a PS issue or does it just needs cleaned (never has) or both. I have been loking for instruciotns on how to clean the guns (i understand you have to go thru the front screen) Does anyone have a manual or recommend where to get one for this purpose.

Both. Probably. As a x20 series we really don't know yet.

Your set may be from the first half of that model year or the second. The first half used the same defectively soldered board as the year before, the one this thread is all about. Or it could be from the second half of that model year, where they used a completely different, redesigned PS board, where cold solder joints were never a problem.

If your PS board - the one at the end of your power cord from the wall power outlet - is vertically mounted, we can help you here. If it's floor mounted it's from the second half of that model year, and you'll probably need local service repair help.

In either case part of the dimness you're seeing on your images is due to your optics definitely needing a thorough and professional grade cleaning, which I am glad to coach you on over the phone. The static charge built up in your set due to the 30 KV used in its operation definitely does a number on your optics. They literally suck all the airborn particulates in the air down onto them - or up against, in the case of the mirror - every minute the set is on. This keeps the air extremely clean, and your optics extremely dirty. Go to my website for more on this.

Don't take doing that op lightly, your set's optics are very fragile and extremely scratchable, which is permanent. I am not talking big scratches here, I am talking small ones. Thousands of them. If you do things wrong, they form a "scuff", which is thousands of tiny scratches at a time, and this is worse than one big scratch, tho not by much. Neither is good. So be extremely careful when doing your optics cleaning, you only get one shot at it each time you do it, and what you get is what you get. Permanently.

And - almost needless to say - they are irreplaceable. Not much is left to buy from Pioneer anymore, and lenses have never been easy to get ahold of if damaged as it is.

If you want to do it from my 20 plus years of experience in such things, contact me directly, no pms please. There is a lot of bad info out there on optics cleaning of plastic lenses and front surface mirrors, some of it erroneously attributed to Mr Bob. I cringe every time I see the words, "Mr Bob says to use microfibre towels", and other such tripe. Please don't believe everything you see out there. Much of it is bunk, and for info you want from me, it's best to get it from the horse's mouth...

Mine!

:p

Let us know about that vertically vs. floor mounted thing, on the PS board -

b

I have the 710 now that I'm trying to do some trouble shooting on. I want to pick up another set that I could use to test some of the boards on, like the power board. I would keep the original boards with the original set.

I have found a couple of sets on Craigs List for cheap but I don't know if I can use them for what I want. The sets are a Elite Pro 700 HD and a Elite Pro 75. Are the boards from the 710 interchangeable with either if theses?

Thanks for the help.

Not that I know of. All boards in the 510/610/710 series are interchangeable with each other, other than that I have no idea. I know the info about the PS board above makes those in the x20 series affected by that info have the same power board, and I would suspect all the other boards in those 2 series are the same.

But DK what happened in the final half of the x20 model year. I know the PS board was changed, DK what else.

I'd avoid the 700 like the plague, tho. Its convergence sys is guaranteed to make your brain blow up - or melt down, probably both - after about 5 hours of dicking with it...

:p


b

Thanks Bob, that's what I was afraid of. I just keep looking until I find what I need,it's just a matter of time.

Too bad you don't live around here. Out in the garage I have a fully functional 610, and in the sun room a fully functional Panny 65", both CRTs.

b

I finally got my Flashing Screen straightened out. A guy named Bill Covert in Monroe Michigan that works at a Durochers Appliance/Service Center resoldered the power board for $65.00. Now the Pioneer SD582HD5 looks good again with no blue/white flashing. I went there armed with the info I got here and told him what it was doing and what people discovered as being the problem. He was the only person out of all but one service techs I talked to that was even interested in looking at it. The other one was Mr. Bob

Bill said he would let people send in their boards if they wanted and he would resolder them. So if anyone in here is from the Michigan area or surrounding states, keep him in mind.

Mr. Bob Thank You for your help as well. Your input was Priceless!!!

Just hope he listened to us here on this thread and didn't take the path of least resistance. It's easy to make the set work again, properly but not necessarily reliably, which can only be proven out over time.

The challenge is to make it stay that way. Permanently. Like all the other perfectly efficacious boards in there, that never fail even many years down the line. Like all good electronics.

If it/he took one minute less than 2 full hours on the resoldering process, plus one minute less than a minimum of another half hour on the inspection process - which takes a major amount of time as well, at least 1/4 of the time taken soldering - I would still be suspicious as to whether it will last for you. If he only did the joints that are bad now, as most local repair techs do, be ready for a whole new crop of them to go bad soon, with the expansion and contraction of the heat and cold on all those hinky joints continuing, at least 45 minutes per off/on cycle at least once per day, average.

If he did only enough to make it work OK now and didn't do the necessary amount of overkill it, the next time it goes down it could go down hard, from a joint going down early, that would not have gone bad at all if all the required ones needing it - even tho they didn't look like they need it now - had been done first time around. Not doing all those joints affected now and in the future could very well take your set down permanently, or make it go over the price of what you want to pay to get it going again.

This of course does not happen when I do things, as I apply the necessary overkill, every time. I don't play Russian Roulette with anybody's boards.

Without enough of the joints being resoldered, even if it has been made to work successfully now, you're much more likely to have a catastrophic event that will take your set down hard, than you will if it's still in the beginning stages. That's because a lot of intermediate joints that woulda taken longer to go, will now be exposed and thus susceptible to damaging your set now, a lot sooner than they would have otherwise. Doing a partial job of the resoldering takes out a lot of very effective decoys, leaving a lot of the really important joints exposed - and much more damaging when they go than the earlier ones are.

If he truly did all that needed to be done to restore your board completely, my hat's off to him. Len over at Home Theater Shack does this I am sure, and I am confident of others who read what I say here and know it to be true also, and practice what I preach.

For the rest, I hope you enjoy Russian Roulette!

:p

b

Mr Bob,

Got to the 620 this weekend and pulled the back cover. Power supply is vertically mounted on the right side of the set. Guess this means it can have the same bad solder joints as the x10 series Elites. What are the specifics on what I would be seeing if the solder joints were going bad? Also was able to look up and see the color guns. I was suprised to see very litlle dust on the top lenses. I see more dust on my tube TV's after 2 weeks.

You have to know how to look for the dust. Believe me after 10 years of regular operation under HV statically charged conditions, it's there.

Shine a very strong flashlight at a steep angle from the side, at each lens. That will show you. Lick your finger and draw a happy face in one of them if you don't believe me. Just don't do this dry! Lick your finger first.

Being vertically mounted to the bulkhead of the unit, your model is definitely one of the earlier ones, that still used the PS board from the x10 series. Send it to me and I'll take care of it for you.

The tests are what it does once warmed up. If the intermittent conns and the brightness fluctuations only happen after warm up, that's all you need to know. Shut your set down and unplug it before it gets worse.

Do not allow it to warm up to operating/cruising temp - for any space of time longer than 40 seconds after turn-on - even once until fixed completely and permanently. Doing so is playing Russian Roulette with it. Don't know about you, but I don't do such things with instruments - or their potential replacements - costing thousands and thousands of dollars.


b

At the suggestion of Mr. Bob, I thought I would add this to this thread, in addition to some other avenues.

Quite some time back I came into possesion of a Pioneer Elite Pro710-HD. After some time it came into some problems (from my e-mail to Bob):

"Anyhow, as the subject suggests, I came by a used Pioneer Elite PRO710-HD 64" unit. Since I bought it some 6 months ago, it has developed a number of problems. Initially, the blue projector would start to go very bright, flash a few times and then go 'POP' back to normal display. Occasionally the unit would stop functioning until it was turned off for a half hour or so and allowed to cool down (presumably). Finally, the spin cycle of our washing machine killed it - that is to say, our washing machine started shaking to house while the TV was on and suddenly the image got wavy and something in the TV started to audibly whine."

I ran through some quick tests at Bob's suggestion, and confirmed that the unit operates correctly and that the issue should only occur at full temperature, indicating, in his opinion, that the set needs a traditional full resolder of the PS board.

I have kept the set for quite some time in the hopes that I'd be able to set aside enough savings to afford the repair and even a calibration of the TV. However, I have since quit my job in order to focus more fully on school work. Now, I've been informed that I will need to be moving out of my house by the end of July.

For that reason, I'd like to offer up my set for free. Being what it is, and knowing that it is repairable for somebody with a little more money that myself, I see no reason to throw it away. The unit is located in Bellingham, Washington and is truly free on the condition that the 'purchaser' pays for all the related costs of removing it from my house and getting it to its final destination. I'm generally at school 12-16 hours a day, so this will include movers, crating and freight if you are not in the Bellingham region. If you are in the Bellingham region, you'll need to bring your own trailer, etc etc.

As a note, the unit does weigh 400lbs and is not on a ground level access. It must be taken down an eight-set of stairs to reach the front door of the house. You can contact me via reply or by PM if you're interested in the unit.

I thought I'd post this here for a while before I start advertising the set on more local channels in the hopes that somebody who understands what they're getting into might be interested in picking it up.

Regards,
Matt

Seems to have been established that the set turns on properly from dead cold, and only malfunctions after warming up. Classic symptoms this thread began with, where the resoldering op should do it. Under these conditions there has rarely been any deviation from that.

Hopefully someone will snag this great offer, and skedaddle home with it.

:)

Contact me if you want me to do the soldering for you...


b

I finally got my Flashing Screen straightened out. A guy named Bill Covert in Monroe Michigan that works at a Durochers Appliance/Service Center resoldered the power board for $65.00. Now the Pioneer SD582HD5 looks good again with no blue/white flashing. I went there armed with the info I got here and told him what it was doing and what people discovered as being the problem. He was the only person out of all but one service techs I talked to that was even interested in looking at it. The other one was Mr. Bob

Bill said he would let people send in their boards if they wanted and he would resolder them. So if anyone in here is from the Michigan area or surrounding states, keep him in mind.

Mr. Bob Thank You for your help as well. Your input was Priceless!!!

Like you, last year I pulled my Pro-510 PS Board out and took it to a local expert in the Washington D.C. area to be re-soldered. My cost was similar to what you paid. Almost a year later, I've had no problems.

Mr Bob provides the "Gold Standard" for this service and has singlehandedly added years of great viewing life to these fine Pioneer RPTVs. His prices reflect that "Gold Standard". His promise that your Power Supply Board will work or he will fix it warrants consideration. My repair shop would not make that promise without having the entire TV for inspection.

If you decide to shop around due to price sensitivities or other reasons be sure to do your research. In addition to Mr Bob's suggestions, you should provide the following directions, as a minimim, to your repair shop:

--------------------------------------------------
From: Name and Contact Information

RE: Pioneer Elite, Pro-510 HD (Ser #.................) Power Supply Board. This board was originally poorly engineered at factory, with thin solder at many points.

Work: Inspect board under good light and magnification and resolder as required.

1. Check entire PS Board for cold solder joints, joints that appear dull, dry, ring fractures, haloed. Remove old solder (if required), reapply new solder.

2. Potential bad/cracked/fractured joints and connectors which require resolder as a minimum:

a. IC202, IC204, E2, E3, E5
b. T101 (the large transformer in the middle of the board)
c. Copper Coils
d. Large Filter Capacitor
e. Check for broken solder joints on connector E3 (especially 12+ supply and GND, Pin 13) and the joints for and around IC204 and IC202 …"cold solder" with possible ring fractures.
f. Check regulator, rectifier, transformer leg joints for cracked solder joints.

3. When complete, please closely inspect for solder bridges and stray solder dots which may cause shorting when power is applied.

-----------------------------------------

These directions come from a review of the many potential PS board fault points noted by members of this forum. I'm not claiming it is all inclusive or that it will correct every PS board problem. It worked in my situation with my repair shop at a price I considered reasonable. With these directions they could assess the time involved and provide a cost estimate. I welcome additional inputs to this list.

Dave

I don't agree. I think you'll be seeing problems again within a year.

The entire board was badly soldered at the factory, and those points that are not bad yet will go bad in the future. Pinpointing like you have done there will only set you up for a more serious problem later. A point source solution is not the answer. Only a shotgun approach will permanently cure the situation.

With very few and very limited exceptions, which I have elaborated upon many times here in this thread, the entire board has to be resoldered. Some techs would do that for $65, but it takes hours, and the finer, more seasoned and experienced techs simply would not. I would not, not for only that much.

Your info is from the start of this thread. That was literally years ago and we have come a long way since then, and no, you can't just do what you said and prevail, on a permanent basis. Doing what you said is NOT the answer. Parts of it are good, but all due respect, the critical stuff is flawed.

If your tech spends a minute less than an hour and a half with the actual soldering of your board, plus between 20-45 minutes inspecting it later, the job that needs to be done will not have been done. Many techs will need to take a lot longer than that, to do it right. Takes me a couple of hours just for the soldering. Most simply won't have the patience. They will see all those super small conn's, very prone to solder bridges, and not even try on those, lest something get improperly connected between them.

The "Gold Standard" you speak of in not just reputation. It's based on results, results that have been hard fought for and hard won, and sometimes very expensively.

But the information I put out stays the same. You can't do it halfway and expect reliable, repeatable and 100% efficacious results. To do so is actually dangerous, why is explained a few posts or pages back from here.

This end of the thread has all the good info. The start of this thread is by now hopelessly outdated.


b

I don't agree. I think you'll be seeing problems again within a year.

The entire board was badly soldered at the factory, and those points that are not bad yet will go bad in the future. Pinpointing like you have done there will only set you up for a more serious problem later. A point source solution is not the answer. Only a shotgun approach will permanently cure the situation.

With very few and very limited exceptions, which I have elaborated upon many times here in this thread, the entire board has to be resoldered. Some techs would do that for $65, but it takes hours, and the finer, more seasoned and experienced techs simply would not. I would not, not for only that much.

Your info is from the start of this thread. That was literally years ago and we have come a long way since then, and no, you can't just do what you said and prevail, on a permanent basis. Doing what you said is NOT the answer. Parts of it are good, but all due respect, the critical stuff is flawed.

If your tech spends a minute less than an hour and a half with the actual soldering of your board, plus between 20-45 minutes inspecting it later, the job that needs to be done will not have been done. Many techs will need to take a lot longer than that, to do it right. Takes me a couple of hours just for the soldering. Most simply won't have the patience. They will see all those super small conn's, very prone to solder bridges, and not even try on those, lest something get improperly connected between them.

The "Gold Standard" you speak of in not just reputation. It's based on results, results that have been hard fought for and hard won, and sometimes very expensively.

But the information I put out stays the same. You can't do it halfway and expect reliable, repeatable and 100% efficacious results. To do so is actually dangerous, why is explained a few posts or pages back from here.

This end of the thread has all the good info. The start of this thread is by now hopelessly outdated.


b

Thanks for responding. I keep coming back to this thread because of the civility of the posters. I defer to your expertise and experience in disagreeing and thinking I will see problems within a year. I'll let you know what happens...so far not a single symptom of impending failure.

My objective for repair was to eek one more year or two of life out of my fine 11 year old Pro-510 while assessing and moving to another display technology. I wasn't seeking permanent solutions, wanted a repair at a cost which seemed reasonable to me (while accepting the risk), and decided I wasn't going to spend more money should other failures occur. Other people's objectives might dictate a different repair approach.

There are qualified technicians in my area who can resolder these PS boards. If we decide to give them to someone other than you to repair, I believe we should provide them both general and specific instructions (which I do). Clearly, a point source solution is not the sole answer to repairing these boards. I will thoroughly review the last few pages of the thread to ensure I'm up-to-date and to find flaws in my "critical stuff" as you say.

Here are my take-aways from your response:

1. Ensure the tech is fully qualified to do the work. If they say it will take less than two hours be skeptical and ask more questions.

2. Resolder the entire PS board. Post-soldering inspection must be thorough and detailed. This is critical.

Dave

Thanks for the respect you have shown me on these issues, Dave. Appreciate it.


Much as I need the business of resoldering these boards on my own, since very few CRT RPTVs are getting calibrated anymore while being swamped with the continuous flow of fixed pixel, the more that actually get saved by somebody's resoldering process the better. CRT is still the best medium out there, as evidenced by the Screenshot War!!!!!!!! thread,

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=900831&page=148

and there are still enough of us CRT afficianados around for CRT to still be the best for years to come, emminently worthy of the finest calibration attention. Flat panel may look sexy, but it still does not have the maturity CRT has gained thru many years of use and renovation and fine tuning. With floor standing front speakers on either side of your Elite CRT unit you need its depth anyway, and that same depth puts your screen 2 feet closer to your eyes than flat panel does. 2' is a huge percentage of the eyes to screen viewing distance most home viewers have in their viewing rooms, and when you compromise that with getting a flat panel, you have to get a commensurately bigger flat panel - with commensurately huge cost increases - to compensate and wind up where you started, as far as size of viewed picture goes.

So I have no problem with my CRT set being thicker than a flat panel. I actually like that. Puts it that much closer to me.


So I am going to repeat something you'll find in this thread if you look, but it could take you awhile.


What does NOT need to be resoldered are the test points, the heat sinks, and anything else that has already been soldered correctly.

Test points go nowhere during operation. The only thing connected to the heat sinks is a cap - which means the heat sinks are directly connected nowhere in there, as such needing no resoldering. And many of the joints were resoldered later and are still glossy and gleaming, like good/well soldered joints should be. This would include the big resistors, the horizontal output transistor - THE main power supply part - and the 4 leg diode bridge, among others.

Everything else - 99% of the board - still needs to be resoldered, including many super small joints that are really close to each other and very prone to a "solder bridge" happening between them. Which of course is a dead short, and NO circuit design can sustain misconnections like those without a high risk of damage, both to the board itself and to boards and other circuits downline from it, since this board - the power supply board - directly powers up the entire unit.

That's why the inspection process afterwards is so critical and cannot be skimped on, timewise. It takes what it takes, and I always triple inspect my boards before sending them out, make sure I haven't missed anything.

Those of you who have seasoned, exprienced techs or assemblers closeby might want to print out these messages here - including my last post, which also contains critical info for any tech wanting to actually take this task on - and take them with you when you interview your local tech.

Those of you who simply want the tried and true Image Perfection resoldering job done on your PS board and don't want to take any chances, do the Gold Standard and send your boards to me. The Gold Standard is well within reach of anybody who paid $5000/6000/7000 for these units back when they were new. Some I've heard of paid over $12,000 for their 710 back then. Doesn't matter how much - or how little - you may pay for a new HDTV today. What matters is that to not keep your set going, you'd be throwing away that original $6000/6000/7000/12000. That means whatever you pay for a new set today, add that to what you originally paid back then, and that's your actual total expenditure, deal done, today.

Thanks again, Dave, between us maybe we can continue to save these boards and the Elite CRT units they power up. I have already saved tons of Elite and non-Elite CRT units so far, and intend to continue to keep saving them for years to come. For optimum performance each one saved will need cleaning and calibration, and to be brought back to new condition, which is also very affordable. And better than new status if desired. I intend to be here for that as well.

With your help here, maybe even more of them can be saved.

;)

Mr Bob