I'm new to the forum and not sure if this is the correct place to post this.

I own a Pioneer Elite Pro-510 HD monitor, have had it about 4 years. I'm using a Zenith Sat-520 DirecTV HD receiver, component input.

Yesterday, the screen starts acting up. I'm watching a Showtime HD channel, the screen starts going lighter then flashes blue and goes back to normal brightness. This occurs about every 5 minutes or so, then become intermittent.

I change channels, same problem. Switch to the DVD, same problem.

Anyone have experience with this?

Thanks.

DJ

Hi DJ

It sounds like you have a service issue. This was my favorite CRT. Most of the problems that I have had with the Elites have been in the power supplies or convergence board. I sold my PRO510 to a friend so I would have room for other HD sets, but I am having a new power supply put in my PRO119 as I still want to have an excellent SD set until we get HD over cable.

Thanks Seth, I'll see if I can find a reliable service company here in Dallas. If anyone knows of a good one, I'm on the East side, please let me know.

DJ

Hi DJ,
interestingly, I have the exact same problem with my Pioneer 610. Mine may be further along than yours. Mine flashes and changes brightness, but every now and then, it just powers itself off. I can't turn it back on with the remote after that and I have to cycle the main power on with the television's front switches. I just thought my set was getting old, however this roblem sounds common to a component in the set if you have the same problem. I was thinking all along that it was a problem with the blue crt and to replace it wouldn't be worth the money. Please let me know how the service works out as I think if it isn't too elaborate, I just might go for it myself.

Thanks,

Bernie

I have same problem with Pro-510 HD, I see blue flashes and increase in brightness level after while back to normal, no specific interval and happened with all input and modes.

I went to the Pioneer web site and found some local authorized service companies. Called one, described the problem. He said the same thing everyone else's service guy said, he'd never heard of that and will need to see it happen.

He'll be over tomorrow, I'll let you know how it turns out.

DJ

Thanks djguy for directing me here. I want to keep in contact on this problem. I contacted service yesterday and he said he would try to make it out this way today to look at problem. I'll post the results here as soon as I can, and hope you will do the same djguy.

The service guy was able to see the problem while he was doing some PM on the monitor. He thinks it's one of 3 things:

1. The sub-video assembly
2. The blue crt
3. The blue crt's drive assembly

He can't tell for sure at this point. He's leaning toward the blue crt or the drive assembly. I think we are going to work out a deal where he will replace the current drive assembly and see if this takes care of the problem. If not, the old assembly goes back and we come up with plan B.

DJ

DJ,
thanks for the running update; keep us posted. For me there will be some sort of go/no go decision based on the cost of repair. My local repair shop thought that if it got into replacing CRT's the cost could become prohibitively high; i.e., better to buy a new TV vs. investing so much in a TV that is 3 and 1/2 yrs. old (especially since I have a bit of 4:3 burn-in).

Thanks,

Bernie

Here's the latest. After I posted that last message about what 3 things it could be, the repair guy got on the phone to Pioneer. They gave him some ideas about how to track the problem down.

Bottom line ... it appears to the be the blue crt drive assembly. The CRT itself is OK. He switched assemblies (blue for green) and we watched to see if we got a blue flash or a green flash. The flash was definitely green.

I don't have a price yet, but apparently this is the least expensive part on the list of possible problems. I'll let you know what price he quotes for the part installed if I can do it without breaking forum rules. It might have to be PM for anyone interested in how much this is going to cost.

BTW - this guy is great. He spent a lot of time on this and was very thorough. If anyone in N. Texas needs a high-end Pioneer guy, let me know and I'll PM you his name and number. He does projection and plasma work.

DJ

Originally posted by Bliang
DJ,
thanks for the running update; keep us posted. For me there will be some sort of go/no go decision based on the cost of repair. My local repair shop thought that if it got into replacing CRT's the cost could become prohibitively high; i.e., better to buy a new TV vs. investing so much in a TV that is 3 and 1/2 yrs. old (especially since I have a bit of 4:3 burn-in).

Thanks,

Bernie

Hi Bernie.

I was telling the repair guy about what you said about the monitor switching off. He said that made sense. The microprocessor will cut the power as a safety precaution if it senses a problem. The only way to override the power down is to use the power button on the monitor itself. That will force the power back on.

DJ

DJ,
thanks again for the rolling updates. It just seems so strange that the blue drive is the one that's faulty on a number of sets. Judging by the way you were able to swap with the green and make the green "fail" it seems like the drives are equivalent and therefore equally likely to have the drive fail on red or green as well. Once again, keep us posted on your final result. BTW if you are uncomfortable osting final repair cost, I would definitely appreciate it if you would PM.

Thanks,

Bernie

Originally posted by Bliang
[B] It just seems so strange that the blue drive is the one that's faulty on a number of sets. Judging by the way you were able to swap with the green and make the green "fail" it seems like the drives are equivalent and therefore equally likely to have the drive fail on red or green as well.

That's a good point Bernie. What's strange is that since he left, after switching the drive assemblies back, the problem has not happened again. It was intermittent to start with, so it may be just a matter of time before it starts up again.

DJ

I still haven't notice the blue flash since the repair guy switched the boards back. Anyone think it's possible the crt drive assembly and cables just need to be reseated?

The blue crt is on the right, which also happens to be where I placed my subwoofer (to the right of the set). Just guessing - it's possible vibration could have caused this problem.

DJ

DJ,
in my case, the problem can go away for days or perhaps a week or two without any evidence, but it always comes back. That's why in my case I thought I was going to just wait until my TV failed. For me the problem is very intermittent.

Bernie

DJ and others:

My technician couldn't make it on Tuesday, but his sidekick said she would do some investigating. She called Pioneer and was told that when system acts up go into display to determine if all the colors are there. Other than I still didn't quite understand what they meant by that, they also told her that I should move the set out and bang my fist or hand onto the back. I did this and noticed it didn't seem to work, that is, until I tried it a second time. It worked and through last night all the colors on the display were picture perfect. That was one night, we"ll see how it turns out tonight. I'll keep you posted.

Bill

Originally posted by Bliang
DJ,
in my case, the problem can go away for days or perhaps a week or two without any evidence, but it always comes back. That's why in my case I thought I was going to just wait until my TV failed. For me the problem is very intermittent.

Bernie

If that's what's happening on my set, I can live with it for the time being. Mine still has not exhibited the blue flash since the repair guy left.

he called Pioneer and was told that when system acts up go into display to determine if all the colors are there. Other than I still didn't quite understand what they meant by that, they also told her that I should move the set out and bang my fist or hand onto the back.

Wow, are you kidding or did they say to do that for real? If so, that's scarey as hell.

DJ

Blue flashes and brightness problem disappeared by itself since last three days.

DJ:

I wouldn't joke about this matter, that is what Pioneer's instructions were. The picture was without problems last night. I have had these flashing problems since late last year. You mentioned that it may be that the boards are not properly seated after unit being in service for a period of time. I really gave the TV several hard whacks with my hand. As I said it didn't have an effect the first time I tried it, so really gave it some real hard whacks in the back the second time. By the way, my subwoofer is not far from the right side of TV. I haven't moved the TV back against wall yet, and will wait to see how often this big buzzard needs to be whacked.

I know this sounds crazy, but believe me I couldn't have made it up. By the way, is your technician planning on replacing the blue driver unit? After living with this problem since late last year, I can't believe that a few whacks could solve the problem. For right now I'm waiting to see what happens. I have had two whole evenings of TV without those blue explosions.

Bill

Whacking a TV to fix an intermittent problem is a time-honored tradition.

I was going to suggest it myself but the set is so large and heavy, I figured it would be ineffective.

Originally posted by sawmill
DJ:

I wouldn't joke about this matter, that is what Pioneer's instructions were.

By the way, is your technician planning on replacing the blue driver unit?

I believe you, I'm just shocked that Pioneer would suggest such a thing.

No, I told him to hold off ordering. He didn't get as far as finding out how much it would cost. If the problem is gone for now, I'm going to wait to see how this thing plays out before I shell out for a new part.


Originally posted by Larry Hutchinson
Whacking a TV to fix an intermittent problem is a time-honored tradition.

I was going to suggest it myself but the set is so large and heavy, I figured it would be ineffective.

Yeah, over the years I've whacked a few components here and there with mixed results. I just figured the set would be too sensitive for shock treatment. :eek:

Learn something new every day.

DJ

DJ: I personally think that this is a "seating" problem with a board in the chasis. Otherwise why would the whacks seem to temporarily take care of the problem. In other words your technician simply removing and reinserting the board in your unit may well have solved the problem. Last night turned unit on and there it was, that exploding bright and blue. Gave the set a couple whacks, nothing, then gave it a few more and then thought this is nonsense, so moved the set back against the wall and the picture was just fine for the evening. Will call the technician and have him unplug and reinsert the blue driver board. If this doesn't solve the problem will probably buy a fine little 6 lb. projector and install in room in basement. And if this little baby gives me problems, I can simply pick it up and drop it on the floor. I "would or will" miss the fine picture that I usually had on the Pioneer.

Bill

Boy, am I glad I found this thread! I just noticed the blue flash on my 510 tonight. At first I thought it was the program I am watching (CSI). But then I also noticed that it went bright and then dimmed. Now I know I wasn't seeing things...On second thought, I guess I shouldn't be glad that my TV has problems...

Anyway, are any of you still having the problem after you whacked the TV? I may try doing that before I call the repair guy.

DJ:
Can you send me your repair guy's info? Thanks,

Ming

Originally posted by MSL
Anyway, are any of you still having the problem after you whacked the TV? I may try doing that before I call the repair guy.

DJ:
Can you send me your repair guy's info? Thanks,

Ming

Hi Ming. Sorry to hear you are having the same problem we've been having.

Since the repair guy fiddled with the blue CRT's drive assembly, basically reseating it, I have not re-experienced the blue flash.

However, I have reevaluated the repair guy. The blue flash is gone, but he talked me into unneccesarily fine tuning the convergence. When he did his fine tuning, he totally screwed up the focus. I had to call him back out to fix it, it's still not as good as it was. I would no longer recommend this guy to anyone.

DJ

DJ, thanks for the reply. I may try to fix it myself this weekend. Sorry to hear about the convergence problem.

Ming

DJ & MSL, finally had repairman in yesterday. He said that the connection with the blue crt board appeared to be loose. He did some soldering but when I turned the unit on last night the flashes returned for about a half hour then disappeared for the rest of evening. Whether this improved the situation, I am not sure. He said if this didn't work, he would order and replace the blue crt board. He commented the board is not real expensive, but I will wait and see if I get the blue flashes tonight. It appears to me the blue flashes were not as pronounced during that 30 minute period last night. Let me analyize this situation tonight and tomorrow and I'll get back on the board here to let you know what happens.

I really like the texture of the pictures of the Pioneer 510 and want to give it every chance, within reason, before making a final decision on what I am going to do.

Bill

I opened up the front panel of my 510 last night and re-seated the blue CRT connector. I didn't get any blue flashes last night. However this morning I did get a few, but not as much as before. I am going to try to clean the connector today and see if that helps.

Ming

Originally posted by MSL
DJ, thanks for the reply. I may try to fix it myself this weekend. Sorry to hear about the convergence problem.

Ming

Thanks Ming. I went in and fine tuned the convergence, point by point, and now it looks as good as it did before I paid that yahoo good money to muck it up. I guess I can't complain too much as the blue flash problem has still not returned and now the picture looks pristine again.

Has your blue flash come back after you reseated the blue crt board?

I have to agree with what others have said, it's very odd that the only board that needs reseating/reconnecting is the blue crt. There has to be some logical reason for this.

Does anyone know how to contact someone at Pioneer who can talk about this problem?

Thanks.

DJ

Originally posted by sawmill
DJ & MSL, finally had repairman in yesterday. He said that the connection with the blue crt board appeared to be loose. He did some soldering but when I turned the unit on last night the flashes returned for about a half hour then disappeared for the rest of evening. Whether this improved the situation, I am not sure.

Bill has the blue flash returned since you wrote this post?

DJ

Hi DJ,

After I re-seated the blue CRT cable, the blue flash went away a few hours but returned the next morning (maybe cooled down?). Last I checked, the TV will now flash and stay at high contrast level for a length of time (5-10 minutes) before returning to my normal setting. I am going to check the other connectors. Doesn't it make sense that if it flashes blue, the other CRT should be off?

Ming

DJ: The blue flash is back and I am going to call the repairman this afternoon for a price on replacing the blue board. MSL: My set at times will also stay at high contrast level for period of time. This whole situation is one big pain. It would seem to me that someone at Pioneer would have run into this problem sometime in the past. If my blue board is replaced and that does not solve the problem, I probably will write this TV off. It wouldn't take long to go over the replacement cost.

Bill

Hello All,

I've been reading your post eagerly waiting a solution. I too have the "blue flicker" including the flash outs that cause the unit to shut off and require a master shut off to restart the unit. A friend with the same set knows a service tech who I will consult and report the results.
If anyone has any other suggestions regarding service personnel, I'm in Miami.

Originally posted by MSL
Doesn't it make sense that if it flashes blue, the other CRT should be off?

Ming

I don't know Ming. None of this makes sense. Why did mine stop? He didn't replace anything, ,just messed around with connections and reseated the board. In fact, he actually banged on the bottom of the board with a tool.

DJ

Originally posted by sawmill
It would seem to me that someone at Pioneer would have run into this problem sometime in the past.

I visited the Pioneer web site and sent email regarding the blue flash problem as well as complaining about my service tech. They responded that I needed to call them. So I did.

According to the service rep I spoke to, if a problem is one that has been reported "enough times" a service bulletin is issued by Pioneer detailing the problem. According to this rep, he'd never heard of the blue flash problem. I told him he should visit the AVS forum and look up this thread as there are several of us experiencing the problem. I came to the logical conclusion that if there were this many people having the problem here, then there must be many times that number who aren't members of this forum and don't have access to the thread.

He wasn't impressed.

So I guess the official Pioneer stance is this is not a widespread issue.

That's pretty odd since the repair guy who worked on my set contacted his Pioneer advisor who had a pretty good idea of what to look at and how to run the problem down. Sounds to me like he'd heard of it enough times to know exactly what to do.

For the amount of money I spent on this set, I would expect a little more out of Pioneer.

DJ

Technician called and he is ordering the CRT blue board. So I guess we will be able to soon know if this is the problem with the 510. He has already been paid for his prior call and labor. I consider that money down the hatch. Without getting into problems with the AVS board, will simply say that the replacement board costs less that $100.00. Of course he will also charge labor for inserting the board. Needless to say, technician doesn't have the answer, nor I guess does Pioneer or anyone else.

Bill

Originally posted by sawmill
Technician called and he is ordering the CRT blue board. So I guess we will be able to soon know if this is the problem with the 510. He has already been paid for his prior call and labor. I consider that money down the hatch. Without getting into problems with the AVS board, will simply say that the replacement board costs less that $100.00. Of course he will also charge labor for inserting the board. Needless to say, technician doesn't have the answer, nor I guess does Pioneer or anyone else.

Bill

Bill, if you don't mind. Keep us informed as to whether or not the board being replaced fixes the problem for you. I still haven't had the blue flash return, but that doesn't mean it won't.

Thanks for keeping us up-to-date.

DJ

Originally posted by sawmill
Technician called and he is ordering the CRT blue board. So I guess we will be able to soon know if this is the problem with the 510. He has already been paid for his prior call and labor. I consider that money down the hatch. Without getting into problems with the AVS board, will simply say that the replacement board costs less that $100.00. Of course he will also charge labor for inserting the board. Needless to say, technician doesn't have the answer, nor I guess does Pioneer or anyone else.

Bill

bump

When I last posted, the board for the blue crt had been ordered. Yesterday the technician brought out the new board, but rather than install it he decided to remove back lower cover and went to the power supply board and tapped different places while I watched from the front. When he tapped the a certain place, the set flickered blue, as had been happening in the past. He spent about 35 to 40 minutes soldering and the problem seems to be solved. Evidently the solder gets old on these sets, so I guess there will be many more instances of blue flicker problems in the future on the Pioneer sets. He thought it strange that Pioneer hadn't issued a bulletin on this problem. He intends on contacting them regarding the problem. The board for the blue crt was not used and he is going to return it to Pioneer. Well, watched the set last night and no flickering problem, and although this could be my imagination, I think the colors are much deeper. Got my fingers crossed, but believe the problem has been solved.

Bill

[i]Got my fingers crossed, but believe the problem has been solved.

Bill [/B]

Hi Bill, thanks for the update.

Would you mind PM'ing me with the name and phone number of your repair guy? Starting 2 days ago my blue flash problem was back ... with a vengeance.

I'd like to talk to your guy directly so I know what to tell my service guy to look for.

Thanks

DJ

Thanks for the info, Bill. After reading your post I decided to poke around the back of the TV. I opened up the back cover (with power cord off the wall) and looked specifically at the PC board where the power line comes in. I noticed a alot of heat sinks on that board. Some of the solder seems to have pulled away from the pin. So I re-soldered some of them, plug in the power and turned on the TV. The flashing problem did not go away. It actually stayed at high contract. So I decided to try something else. This time (leaving the TV on) I started tapping some of the heat sinks with the handle of the screw driver. Every time I tap a heat sink, the blue flash will occur (just like Bill said). The closer I got to the row of white connectors on top of the board the worse the effect. So I "wiggled" some of those white connectors. The TV flashed blue and everything went back to normal. I then tapped all the heat sinks again and no more flashes. It seems that the connector weren't seated properly. I have the TV on over 6 hours now, and the problem hasn't come back. I will observe it a few more days and see if the problem returns.

Ming

BTW, it's probably not a good idea to mess with inside of the TV with power on if you are not comfortable with electrical stuff, since high voltage supply is right next to the PC board.

Originally posted by MSL
Thanks for the info, Bill. After reading your post I decided to poke around the back of the TV.

It seems that the connector weren't seated properly. I have the TV on over 6 hours now, and the problem hasn't come back. I will observe it a few more days and see if the problem returns.

Hi Ming.

Wow ... good work. Now I know what to tell my service guy when I call him. I'm one of the ones who would not be comfortable poking around near the high-voltage supply.

Maybe between us we've got this thing tracked down.

Bill and Ming, please let us know if that blue flash comes back.

Thanks.

DJ

Well, I don't have the blue flash problem but I wanted to chip in my own 510 Elite problem....a shifty and intermittent red convergence problem. Put simply, the reds will displace themselves to the left....sometimes jittering back and forth and sometimes just staying displaced. It's been serviced once but since it's intermittent they never saw the problem. Good gawd, these problems that occur just sometimes just drive me up the wall and I see I'm not the only one!

The set is four years old and I'm about to chuck it, that's why I'm reading this forum....to get ideas on a new set.

Anyway, I bet it's a convergence board which will cost in parts $300-$500 IIRC then tack on labor. Then......there is always that possibility (almost a certainty given my luck with this set) that my ISF calibration will be FUBAR'd, which will necessitate another $200-300. The calibration is necessary......all (most???) the Elites about four years old have a bad vertical overscan in Full HD mode that makes people (that's where I first noticed it) and everything else look too 'tall.' The ISF guy that did my set measured it at almost 15% on the vertical plane (5% horizontally)! Anyway I saw this on another Elite so I surmised it was a general Elite problem.

OK, now I feel better.

I had a new service guy come out. He talked to someone at Pioneer who claims the "blue flash" problem has to do with the Sub-video assembly and not the Drive Assembly for the blue board. Actually, unfortunately, this makes more sense since I always considered it kinda weird that only the blue board would go out.

He checked all the PC boards for solder problems and reseating problems. Said everything looked good.

He checked the overscan (mine's at about 4%), the focus, convergence etc. He made a remark that his company doesn't do ISF adjustments because it's a known industry fact that convergence won't stay put, it travels a bit. I found that interesting since the previous service guy charged me big bucks to make the convergence adjustments.

He also said he works on several different manufacturers sets and he considers the picture on the Pro series to be about the best. He then said the sets are pretty much "bullet proof".

Anyway, I'm still waiting on a price for the subvideo assembly board. I'll keep you guys posted.

DJ

One thing that my ISF guy did that made a difference was what he termed 'mechanical focus.' I'm not gonna try to explain what he did (cause I'm not sure myself), but he reached in the Elite and made a mechanical adjustment that effectively sharpened the scan lines. Bad at first....cause now you can see the fricken scan lines more easily. Move your couch back a foot or two and the scan lines disappear and but you're picture is sharpened. Regarding convergence, yes it does shift with time, which is why they give you such flexibility to adjusting the convergence yourself....but in my case the red jitters back and forth and that is not normal.

Originally posted by DanP
One thing that my ISF guy did that made a difference was what he termed 'mechanical focus.' I'm not gonna try to explain what he did (cause I'm not sure myself), but he reached in the Elite and made a mechanical adjustment that effectively sharpened the scan lines. Bad at first....cause now you can see the fricken scan lines more easily. Move your couch back a foot or two and the scan lines disappear and but you're picture is sharpened. Regarding convergence, yes it does shift with time, which is why they give you such flexibility to adjusting the convergence yourself....but in my case the red jitters back and forth and that is not normal.

I don't know how many of us in this thread have called Pioneer directly and complained, but I suggest that since this seems to be a problem we all share we should each make sure Pioneer knows about it. If they hear from enough of us, they will have to admit it's a problem that is common to these sets.

Call 1-800-421-1404 and navigate to Customer Service - Complaints. We don't need to let them sweep this under the rug. It's ridiculous that with a fairly short period of time we need to sink considerable money into an already expensive set for what appears to be a design or production flaw on their part.

DJ

Im here in Miami. My Elite 510 had the same blue flashing/screwed up contrast problem.

I bought my set in NYC.

Anyone have any further info on a fix? Or has Pioneer responded?

Thanks

Hi Steve,

Sorry to hear about the problem. After I "re-seated" some of the connectors, I haven't seen the flashing problem again (knock on wood). Maybe DJ can let us know how his service call went.

Ming

Pioneer is not going to respond.

In fact the last service guy I called out was aware of this forum, and holds it in contempt. He basically told me the people here are full of it.

He decided it was the sub-video assembly board. He made that decision even though the set never once flashed while he was in my home. The cost for repairs? The board is $650 and installation $300. While he was looking at the set he made some adjustments. After he left I was watching the set, way too much red. I called him and he said he'd be out the next week to fix that. It's been 3 weeks, he hasn't been back. I finally went in to the guts of the set and found what he had done and fixed it myself.

My call to Pioneer's complaint department didn't do much good. The set is out of warranty, of course. I made the argument that after having spent thousands on a set they should fix what is apparently a flaw in their hardware. They don't agree. I was told that I should expect expensive repairs when I buy an expensive set. I let them know I would never again buy a Pioneer Elite product.

The service guy had tapped around on the inside of the set before he made his pronouncement that it was the sub video assembly board. For 3 weeks after he left no blue flash. Now it's back again. I've had it with Pioneer AND their freeking authorized service people. Tired of getting ripped off.

DJ

I love the picture quality of my 510, but this will be my last Pioneer set as well. The bullet-proof image is overrated. All this trouble does not justify the high cost.

Ming

MSL

Has your fix taken? Is the flash gone?

Just want to know before i head into the set and start fiddling around. In the meantime, Im currently "on hold" with pionner complaints.

Theyve "never heard" about the problem and suggest having a Pioneer tech come by. My biggest problem now is wondering what kindve axe i can take to this thing to chop it up into small enuf pieces to chuck into the trash.

We need to make this a big PROBLEM for Pioneer guys. Lets post on other boards as well.

Originally posted by MSL
I love the picture quality of my 510, but this will be my last Pioneer set as well. The bullet-proof image is overrated. All this trouble does not justify the high cost.

Ming

Reading about all these problems we're having makes me think twice about how much to spend. Perhaps these TVs should be viewed as disposable after just a few years....and not just the CRTs but the other technologies. That poll about satisfaction with DLPs.....the failure rate is wayyyyyyy unacceptable. I'll never drop $5K on another TV again. They are too unreliable and service cost too high.

Stevegee, my set haven't had the problem ever since I fiddled with the connectors. One of the connector (smaller, 8 pins I think) seem to be the culprit. Just touching the wiring leading to the connector will cause the screen to flash (the TV is on while I am doing this). Several times the screen actually went black. I turned off the TV, re-seated several of the connectors, and the problem hadn't return. I am leaving the back cover of the TV off for now in case I need to do it again.

Ming

Originally posted by stevegee
In the meantime, Im currently "on hold" with pionner complaints.

Theyve "never heard" about the problem and suggest having a Pioneer tech come by.

They are lying through their teeth. They had to have heard of it because I've called twice and complained AND I've had 2 different service companies out with the same complaint. Both service companies talked to their Pioneer rep who HAD heard of the problem.

My guess is they don't want to get into a recall situation.

I spent a good deal of time on the phone with their Complaint Department Supervisor.

At one point I told him to send me the board, that I would get it installed somehow. He told me he didn't want to bypass the service companies because he wanted to maintain a good relationship with them.

So there it is straight from the horses mouth.

1. They'd rather maintain a good relationship with their service company than the people who have spent thousands on their products.
2. They EXPECT expensive parts in the set to fail not long after the warranty expires. I guess that just means more post-sale money for them (parts) and their service company partners (parts markup and service).

My bottom line is there's no way in hell I would ever spend money with Pioneer or their partners again. If I can't fix the blue flash myself, I'll let the set go until the board fails then replace the set with something a lot less expensive.

Lesson learned, thanks Pioneer. You obviously don't need my business.

BTW - for anyone who wants to join me in writing a letter to the Pioneer Division manager who is over the complaints department, here's the info:

Kathy Yulich
P.O. Box 1760
Long Beach, CA 90801

Also .. both service reps had done such a lousy job "adjusting" the set I had to spend a lot of time fixing what they had fixed. I bought a DVD (Avia) that had test patterns and instructions on how to fine tune a High-Def set. Now, when it's not flashing blue, the picture is the best its ever been. The Avia DVD was well worth it's price.

DJ

frankly, I think we should keep it at the top. For a warning for any future potential Pionneer customers. This is how Pioneer treat purchasers or their "Elite" line.

My blue flashes problem is back after it disappeared for short time. I calibrated my TV two months ago and spent like $500.00. I am thinking not to spend any more money on this TV and stay away from PIONEER rest of my life.

In my earlier thread I gave a description of what the technician did with my 510. My set has been working without blue flashes ever since. It seems that they are now using solder that contains no lead, such as in the 510, whereas earlier the solder they used contained lead. The solder without lead is affected by heat and does not last as long. As I stated earlier, the technician went in and spent quite a time resoldering. Maybe just getting a technician that knows how to solder and set him to work would be the answer. Of course, Pioneer would rather sell you a new board.

Bill

Just one more thought. This is the law, "there shall be no lead based solder used in the U.S."

Bill

Blue flashes continue for about two hours and the TV blacks out, total black. I turn the TV off for fifteen minutes. I turn the TV on and it works for fifteen minutes and again blacks out. Please help with any comments and suggestions

I'm glad I'm not the only one with this issue. I'll try my fist when my set acts up later. (It's like a cough). It's a lot more cost effective then the repair guy. Do you guys have any updates on this problem?

Originally posted by sawmill
Just one more thought. This is the law, "there shall be no lead based solder used in the U.S."

Bill

Bill, I sent you a PM.

Thanks.

DJ

Originally posted by vijaydalal
Blue flashes continue for about two hours and the TV blacks out, total black. I turn the TV off for fifteen minutes. I turn the TV on and it works for fifteen minutes and again blacks out. Please help with any comments and suggestions

Vij ... don't know what to say other than what's been said earlier in this thread. You can try to find someone who will check out the board connections and solder joints or you can go with Pioneer selling very expensive replacement parts through their authorized service companies. Pioneer is not going to own up to any responsibility for this.

As part of the ongoing problems I'm having, now my Pioneer DVD player has decided it will no longer read DVDs. Is it any coincidence that the DVD player lasted about as long as the Monitor? I'm starting to see a theme here. I have a DVD player that I purchased when DVDs first came out that is still working (Sony). I bought the Pioneer for the progressive scan, which the Sony doesn't have.

I can say that without a doubt I will never purchase another Pioneer product.

DJ

I had a convergence problem (reds going out of whack) shortly after the warranty expired. They were good enough to give me one free repair even though it technically wasn't under warranty. Unfortunately, the problem was intermittent and either the service people couldn't diagnose the problem properly or didn't fix the right thing because the problem reoccurred. And, unfortunately, Pioneer wouldn't help me further. Certainly, I won't attempt to fix it again because repairs are expensive and the warranty on repairs is so short (30 or 90 days.....can't remember)....not to mention they didn't get it right the first time.

I too won't purchase another Elite nor will I purchase another TV so expensive. I think there are reliability issues throughout the industry and spending $5K or more seems a bit foolish to me. Whatever the replacement, I'll have an extended service policy to protect me from these crazy repair costs.

Originally posted by DanP
I too won't purchase another Elite nor will I purchase another TV so expensive. I think there are reliability issues throughout the industry and spending $5K or more seems a bit foolish to me. Whatever the replacement, I'll have an extended service policy to protect me from these crazy repair costs.

Maybe so for HD sets. I have a Toshiba 35" that I bought at least 10 years ago. Only had to repair it once ... when a freak lightning storm blew out all ungrounded electronics in the house. I spent less than $2,000.00 on the Toshiba, back when 35" was a pretty good size set. That's the kind of reliability I expected out of Pioneer. Sadly disappointed.

DJ

I have a repair guy coming out today ths is NOT affiliated with Pioneer. I'm going to ask him to do what Sawmill's repair guy did. Check the board in the back of the set where the power cord comes in and possibly resolder where needed. Hope this works because my blue flash problem is getting worse.

DJ

DJGUY: Im very anxious to hear how this goes.

I had a local, non-authorized repair guy in a few weeks ago. Unfortunately, it was before I discovered this thread. Naturally, he couldn't replicate the problem on that visit, but I'm not sure what he looked at. It only happens often enough to drive me nuts.

I'm really not willing to spend $500-$1000 repairing a set that was built almost 5 years ago. By the same token, I can't see leaving the set on the curb either.

Please keep us posted on your experience today.

Folks, I am another one with the very same problem with my 610. It comes and goes. Do you think it would help if we sent them a email containing this hole forum?

Found this from the Keohi Site. Is this the same problem?

Tear/Flash Problem


<< Back to Pioneer Tips


The problem as described by Pioneer owners and the fix:


Owner 1


"What I see periodically is a very fast, usually light colored flash that goes upward somewhat from left to right, with several shorter lines that radiate from the bottom of the large one, downward and to toward the left. It's somewhat like a momentary breakup of the horizontal sync.


It's so brief that it's easy to miss, but I definitely see it on my x510, which was manufactured in Dec 99'. It ONLY occurs on NTSC, never on HD, and I'm so happy with the set otherwise I just haven't got myself worked up to put the heat on the dealer or Pioneer to get it resolved. I would like to get it resolved, but I guess I also have some misgivings about letting anyone touch the set."


Owner 2


"The flash/tear problem on the x10 series supposedly has been taken care of. My 710 has no flash/tear problem. It is my understanding that the older 510 & 610's had a flash/tear problem. Pioneer has identified the problem and it is a simple fix that the local service center could order the parts and fix. A lot of people that purchased newer 510 & 610's have posted in the forum and have said that they are not seeing the flash/tear problem."


FIX to the Flash/Tear Problem


"There is a fix by pioneer for the flash tear problem. It is their "service information" memo No. SI-H54078-G dated Feb. 10, 2000. The service remedy includes changing a resistor (RSV16S4715) and adding a capacitor (CKCYB222K5). They also have to readjust the H-phase because picture will shift horizontally after applying the fix."


The service bulletin states that it is applicable to the 510HD, 610HD, *AND* SD582 and SD532 models._ The 710HD is NOT mentioned in the bulletin.


Here is an account by Charles Ledbetter:


"I had my 610HD repaired today for the flash/tear problem. It's unquestionably fixed. I sat in front of it for several hours afterwards and it never flashed once. It's never gone that long since the day I bought it.


As stated before, the repair is a resistor and a capacitor. The resistor is TINY. So small that the technician took my board back to his shop so he could solder it under a magnifying glass._


The repair DID NOT reset any factory defaults. All settings and convergence were just as they were before the repair.


This problem has been put to bed."

Originally posted by gary miller
DJGUY: Im very anxious to hear how this goes.

I had a local, non-authorized repair guy in a few weeks ago. Unfortunately, it was before I discovered this thread. Naturally, he couldn't replicate the problem on that visit, but I'm not sure what he looked at. It only happens often enough to drive me nuts.

I'm really not willing to spend $500-$1000 repairing a set that was built almost 5 years ago. By the same token, I can't see leaving the set on the curb either.

Please keep us posted on your experience today.

The repair guys came out and I showed them sawmills post. They looked at the board where the electrical cord goes into the set and they were able to see the blue flash by tapping on the board. They said it looks like there are some problems on the board and they took the set with them as they don't do the work in-home. Cost to repair including initial visit, transporting the set to and from the shop and repairing the board - $499.00.

At least these guys were open to suggestion rather then the previous repair guys who just wanted to replace the most expensive board in the set with no guarantee that would fix the problem (which it probably wouldn't have).

They still have the set and estimated 10-14 working days before I get it back. I'll report back on the results once I have the set back and watch it a couple of days.

BTW - the room I had the set in was a tight fit to get it out the door. The repair guy took the plastic panel off the set and promptly broke the set's internal mirror. I looked at the panel after he smashed the mirror and it said NOT to remove the panel as it holds up the mirror. This does not give me great confidence in their abilities. They promised to replace the mirror and check for and fix any other damage that might have been done when the mirror fell inside the set. I'm OK with that as long as they fix what they broke at no charge to me.

Here's the scorecard:

2 different Pioneer authorized service companies - both FAIL miserably
1 non-Pioneer authorized service company - mixed results, no final score yet.

DJ

Originally posted by macav
Found this from the Keohi Site. Is this the same problem?

Tear/Flash Problem


<< Back to Pioneer Tips


The problem as described by Pioneer owners and the fix:


Owner 1


"What I see periodically is a very fast, usually light colored flash that goes upward somewhat from left to right, with several shorter lines that radiate from the bottom of the large one, downward and to toward the left. It's somewhat like a momentary breakup of the horizontal sync.

From this description, it does not sound like the same problem. I have never seen any lines radiating out nor is the flash "light colored", it's always a brilliant blue.

I'm not saying the problems aren't related, I'm going to pass this info onto the service folks working on my set.

Thanks for the info and the great site (Keohi).

Jerry

My recollection is that the flash/tear problem came from Pioneer's progressive "purecinema" circuit. This circuit is bypassed automatically in HD mode. You can bypass the circuit for DVD by using a progressive player.

I wish this blue flash issue was as simple to cure.

I have a 710 with same prob, pioneer repair guy, declared it a HIGH VOLTAGE BOARD! on order for 2 months!! No part yet!

Zorro ... I think your guy got it right. That's probably the board my service people are repairing.

Just curious, how much are they going to charge you for the board and for the installation?

Jerry

Well, well, lucky I found this thread. My TV (510) has also been showing these symptoms over the last month or so. I think I will try my hand at looking at it thanks to Ming's advice and see if it improves before following up with Pioneer as it seems they are doing a less than stellar job of satisfying its customers who have spent a fair bit of coin on these TVs.

jerry, check ur pm!pls

Originally posted by Jehan
Well, well, lucky I found this thread. My TV (510) has also been showing these symptoms over the last month or so. I think I will try my hand at looking at it thanks to Ming's advice and see if it improves before following up with Pioneer as it seems they are doing a less than stellar job of satisfying its customers who have spent a fair bit of coin on these TVs.

Yeah for a problem they keep saying they've never heard of, this one appears to be common. Damn good thing we can talk to each other and get to the bottom of this. Thanks for nothing Pioneer.

Jerry

I have the same problem as described here in my PRO-610 that I bought in June 2000. The screen contrast brightens up and then drops to normal and then up again. After a while the set shuts off, probably due to fault protection. I called my dealer and his service tech wasn't very familiar with the problem. He said it could be a board or the power supply or cold solder connections. I wanted to find out what was wrong before he starts charging $75/hour for troubleshooting outside the warranty period. My PRO-610 was manufactured in May 2000. Can others please post their manufacture dates here?

I got tired of this problem and put the set in the garage and covered it up. Then I bought a new 62" Mitsubishi DLP, but I'm still interested in fixing this set after spending nearly $6000 plus another $700-$900 in ISF calibration. As another poster said, I have too much time and money in this set to simply leave it out on the curb or put it on Ebay for the parts.

Since so many people are experiencing this problem, Pioneer should fix it for us or take it back from us and give us $2000. However, I doubt this will ever happen.

RSG: My set was built in November of 99.

Is it fair to assume that the "high voltage" board is synonymous with "power supply" board?

A friend of my mine has the standard 53" non-elite Pioneer that was bought in Dec 1999 from Onecall.com and he purchased a 5 year warranty as well. He had the same problem and the authorized service tech came out to his place and claimed cold solder connections on multiple boards. He went over several boards with a soldering gun and now my friend has his convergence screwed up, but apparently this flashing contrast has stopped. I don't know what the tech fixed (messed) up by doing this, but the tech won't come out any more saying the problem is fixed.

I'm kind of pissed off at Pioneer.

I don't know about the problem being caused by cold solder. I usually don't experience the flash until the set has been on for some time. I would buy loose solder as the cause maybe.

It appears the common thread is the power supply or high voltage power board. Not sure if they are different boards or one in the same.

Pioneer wants us to basically rebuild the sets starting with the most expensive board and working our way down. The told the 2nd service guy I called out there was no question it was the video sub-assembly board. I checked Pioneers parts list for this set and, of course, the video sub-assembly is by far the most expensive part.

It's a huge understatement to say that I'm disappointed with Pioneer and the games they are playing with their customers. I didn't realize they were so hard up they were willing to take us for a ride, even if it costs them future business.

I've already started replacing Pioneer components in my home system. As the Pioneer components fail, they will be replaced with their competitor's components. It's just my way of saying Thank You Pioneer for all you've done.

Jerry

Jerry, do u have part # name! ur service guys r thinking of replacing?

I saw power supply board is $299

Jerry: I also thought there was a correllation between warm up time and flash incidents. Lately, though, the flashing regularly occurs the moment I turn the set on. I usually try a "re-set" by turning the set off for 15-20 seconds. Sometimes the symptoms will reappear immediately. Other times it won't manifest itself again for hours.

I own a number of vintage B&W movies on DVD. This type of program material seems to agitate the flashing symptoms more readily then anything else. Perhaps the high contrast nature of B&W cinematograpghy presents more of a burden for the power supply.

I called Pioneer authorized repair service center and explained my blue flashes and screen black out problem. I also sent to link to our forum. Three days later he told me that he called Pioneer and they told him to replace all three CRT Board, cost around 450 to 500. That will take care of my blue flashes, no guarantee it will work. My Second problem screen blacks out. He told me that I don’t know how to fix. He does not want to visit my home unless I agree to replace CRT Boards.
I told him, when I am ready to pay your visit charges, you suppose to come my home check the problems, give me estimate in writing with warranty on your parts and labor, he refused.

Hi Zorro, no I didn't get the part number before they took the set. They are not actually replacing it. They said they repair boards at the component level, so they will fix it not replace it.

It's the board where the power cord comes into the back of the set. The board resides in the lower right corner after you take the back panel off. It's easy to spot, lots of large heat sinks attached to it.

Jerry

i asked my guy, he said, expected in one more week, they call it DIGITAL BOARD? LOL

Does anyone in this thread have any updates on their findings with this issue?

I'm experiencing the same flickering on my Pro610 and am extremely frustrated by it, and it seems to be getting worse day by day. At first I only noticed it on SD signals but now it is prevalent on HD and DVD inputs as well. :mad:

I'm probably going to have a tech come out and look at it later this week but I'd like to know what to have them look for and/or do if anyone else finds out anything. I'll post what I find out as well.

Thanks,
Jeff.

Originally posted by vijaydalal

I told him, when I am ready to pay your visit charges, you suppose to come my home check the problems, give me estimate in writing with warranty on your parts and labor, he refused.

That doesn't seem right. I would think that Pioneer will want to know about this. If not, then we have even less reason to be a repeat customer of theirs.

Originally posted by DanP
That doesn't seem right. I would think that Pioneer will want to know about this. If not, then we have even less reason to be a repeat customer of theirs.

Vijaydalal, I agree with Dan, this does not sound right at all. I would not use a service company that makes demands. Unfortunately, I don't think you will get far by complaining to Pioneer. I've been there done that. I was told by Pioneer's complaint department that if I had a problem with a service company that they wanted me to file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau. They evidently will only take a complaint as being serious if you, the client, goes through the BBB first.

Pioneer gets low marks in every contact I've had with the company's 'Customer Service'.

Jerry

The independent service company I hired to finally make repairs on the set, returned the set last night.

They said they re-soldered most of the joints on the power supply board and found one bad capacitor, which they replaced.

So far I have not seen the blue flash problem since I got the set back. If I see it come back I'll let everyone know.

Jerry

My pioneer service guy said, soldering is not a permanent solution, it could re occur!

Originally posted by zoro
My pioneer service guy said, soldering is not a permanent solution, it could re occur!

That doesn't surprise me. Is he willing to guarantee a "permanent" solution?

If the soldering and the capacitor replacement fix the problem, that's what I am looking for.

So far Pioneer is batting zero on this problem. Most of their service people have no idea how to fix it, but they are quite willing to sell $650.00 boards in case that "might" be the problem.

Jerry

I had my service guy come in and follow the process outlined by Ming and Sawmill. In short, he was able to easily replicate the flashing by tapping on the heat sinks before re- soldering and re-seating the connections on the board. He agreed that some of the original solder points looked suspect. He spent the better part of an hour on the board. He completed his work, tapped on the heat sinks and the flashing was gone.

I've been watching the olympics all evening in HD without blue flash disruption, so I'm cautiously optimistic.

Zoro, I don't know why a soldering solution would be any less permanent then the factory solder, which took more then 4 years to fail.

I'm grateful you guys shared your experiences here. I'm hopeful it saved me the frustration of a very expensive authorized Pioneer fishing expedition.

Thanks!

Just a thought - I used to have a NEC many years ago that had issues with solder connections. I re-flowed the connections and got out the old IR thermometer. Turns out the heat sinks were not big enough and the joints got too hot and eventually failed. After the second repair I bought a very quiet fan and positioned it to blow air across the area (easier than finding a bigger heat sink). I did not have another failure until I gave the TV away (replaced it with a 710). YMMV :)

Gary, how much is charge for soldering? and particularly, which board?

Originally posted by zoro
Gary, how much is charge for soldering? and particularly, which board?

I was charged for a "house call" which was less then a hundred dollars.


There's been some confusion here about the nomenclature for this board. My repair guy referred to it as the "power supply" board. In passing, when I referred to it as a "high voltage" board, he corrected me. He indicated it was actually a low voltage board. I don't know the official Pioneer part name, but he agreed there was no reason to replace it. In any case, it is indeed, as Jerry pointed out, the board located inside the set where the power cord enters. There are heat sinks next to it.

I can't comment on a potentially defective capacitor. It was never discussed in my case. So far, so good though. I'll report back if the flashing re-occurs.

By the way, this was the 2nd house call, so I actually paid twice. The first time was before I discovered this thread. He couldn't replicate the problem and I wasn't much help. In fairness, he made no guarantees prior to each visit. I agreed to those terms. He did seem pretty confident though, after yesterdays visit, that the problem was solved. Time will tell.


I probably would have paid more for the repair if everything was done in one extended visit. In any case, I thought the guy was quite fair and he seemed quite competent.

I understand, house call cost!! How much additional for soldering including call

Zoro, he's already told you. The cost of the soldering was included in the house call charge.

UPDATE: Had my set back a couple of days now, still no blue flash. Picture looks great.

Jerry

so around $15-$200 fixed? am I right?

Originally posted by zoro
so around $15-$200 fixed? am I right?

Yes, under $200.00 fixed...at least I think it's fixed.

On the other hand, the authorized Pioneer guy talked in circles. I called him twice but he never got back to me with an estimate or game plan. Instead, I simply found a guy that was skilled with a soldering gun and knew his way around a circuit board. He came at my insistence and didn't take advantage. I was fortunate.

My 510HD also began displaying the intermittant blue flash problem a few months ago. I see the problem on all of my video inputs, and have even seen it on inputs where the component (such as my DVD played) is off. Switching to a "dead" input while the problem is occuring clearly demonstrates that the problem is happening in somewhere in the blue CRT. The flash is blue and the variable brightness and/or contrast also has a blue tinge.

This seems like some sort of power fluctuation to me but I have no idea how to fix it or work on my TV.

I've already spent a little over $200 at an authorized service center. They resoldered some of the connections (supposedly at the advice of Pioneer tech support) and the set was fine for a few weeks. Unfortunately the problem has recently occurred much more frequently (perhaps 10 - 15 times per day) so I had the service center pick the set up earlier this week. The service tech called me today and said that Pioneer tech support suggested that he replace "two circuit boards". When I asked him how much it was going to cost he said $1600! I told him there was no way I was going to put that kind of money into this set when a new CRT RPTV can be had for that much. The service tech was also shocked at the high price of these replacement components. He said Pioneer had a "board level replacement policy" when it came to repairing faulty components. So much for taking the time to figure out which component is faulty! The service tech suggested I complain to Pioneer customer service because he felt that there were probably some simple (and cheaper components) that were at fault.

I called Pioneer customer service (1-800-PIO-NEER) and spoke to a woman named Felicia. She gave me case # 169971 and told me that she would look into why the service center didn't work this out with part/tech support. Essentially I was left feeling that it was "not my business" to get in the middle of a "dispute" that was occurring between

She said she would into it with the tech support folks at Pioneer and she would call me back in 2 or 3 working days.

I'm going to send this thread to the service technician. Maybe he can also mess around with the connections near the heat sinks.

Please make sure that if you have this problem that you call Pioneer customer service and receive a call number. I'm sure they will need a high "frequency of occurence" in order for this issue be investigated properly by their engineers. We should also try to get our service techs talking to one another. My service center is:

TVCR, Inc.
(561) 795-2500

I've also made a captured the problem on home video. I'll try to upload it to a web site so others can use my video for reference. Stay tuned.

I called Pioneer, they didnt have damn clue!! asked me to call service centre!

But service centre give u warranty of their work for 3 months! you should get refund for faulty repair and donate TV to charity! and Live HAPPILY thereafter!lol

Originally posted by siloreed
My 510HD also began displaying the intermittant blue flash problem ... Switching to a "dead" input while the problem is occuring clearly demonstrates that the problem is happening in somewhere in the blue CRT. The flash is blue and the variable brightness and/or contrast also has a blue tinge.

This seems like some sort of power fluctuation to me but I have no idea how to fix it or work on my TV.

I

Silo ... the blue flash is definitely NOT somewhere in the Blue CRT. It's on the low-voltage power supply board (the first board where the power line comes into the back of the set).

Pioneer's stock advice is to replace as many expensive boards as possible. They are not interested in fixing the problem, at least your problem. They seem more interested in re-selling us the sets one piece at a time.

So far several of us have had success with service techs (non-Pioneer authorized) who were willing to listen to us and really look at that low-voltage power supply board. Once they resoldered the connections the blue flash went away. In my case the tech also replaced a capacitor.

I've contacted Pioneer's complaint department multiple times. I talked to a supervisor there for over 30 minutes the last time I called. His job evidently is to stonewall non-warranty customers and make sure we don't insult his dignity. He told me Pioneer's priority was to maintain good relations with their service centers over good relations with their customers. I can see why, how else are they going to keep the high priced, unnecessary replacement parts shipping to ignorant customers such as ourselves?

I've had it with Pioneer and their authorized service people. I found a place here in Dallas that will fix a board at the component level rather than start replacing the guts of the set willy nilly. My suggestion to you is to do the same where you are at. If you can't get that kind of service out of the company that picked up your set, find another. There's no sense in paying good money for replacement parts that aren't going to fix the problem.

The more I hear from people in the situation we are in, the more I have come to believe my original investment in Pioneer gear was a mistake. It's a mistake I will never again make.

Just replaced my Pioneer DVD player with a Samsung. Pioneer's short-sighted policy of screw the customer will come back to bite them on the rear end.

Jerry

I agree, no pioneer TV etc for me either!! Being their prices so hefty upfront, showing back, is absolute disgusting!

I shared this thread with the technician servicing my set. He says that he is unable to reproduce the problem by tapping on the heat sinks as in MSL's message.

I just got off the phone with Pioneer customer service. They claim they are aware of this problem and this very message board. They also claim that there may also be a fix in the works but can't promise when the fix will be. They claim that I will be called back when they have more information.

I still have my fingers crossed.

Here is a 2 MB video clip that demonstrates my problem:
http://bellsouthpwp2.net/s/i/siloreed/Pioneer%20510HD%20problem.wmv

thats great siloreed!! it is absolutely pathetic, that pioneer gave only 4 years life span to their mega bucks sets!

Originally posted by siloreed
Here is a 2 MB video clip that demonstrates my problem:
http://bellsouthpwp2.net/s/i/siloreed/Pioneer%20510HD%20problem.wmv

Siloreed, after watching your video, the problem your set has is the EXACT same problem my set was exhibiting. The tech who can't replicate the problem by tapping on the heat sinks is either pulling your chain or he's not trying hard enough. This is the problem several of us have had fixed by addressing the problems on the low voltage power supply board (solder joints). It's a relatively inexpensive fix, provided you don't let them talk you into unnecessary repairs.

Good luck.

Let us know if Pioneer ever claims to come back with a fix. We could save them the time as we already know what it is ... despite their best attempts to tell us otherwise.

Jerry

I'll second Jerry's sentiments. My tech had no problem replicating the flash by tapping on the heat sinks. More importantly, once the soldering was completed, the flashes were gone. Perhaps you can ask him to check while you sit in front of the set.

Pioneer's position seems unfathomable, especially because the fix is relatively simple.

Anyone know a good lawyer who might be interested in a class-action suit against Pioneer?

If we are getting this kind of response just on this forum, you know the problem is pretty widespread with these sets. This problem is not what I would consider "normal wear and tear", but more accurately I would consider it a design flaw or production flaw.

Pioneer not wanting to even acknowledge the situation, then trying to take advantage by selling high-priced boards that won't even fix the problem really aggravates me.

I'd be happy to sign up for some litigation against these folks.

Jerry

siloreed,

I have the EXACT same problem on my PRO-610. Eventually the problem gets worse and the set has fault protection which causes it to shut down.

I'd like to be part of a class action suit as well.

I' am with you by all means!!
This is outrageously ridiculous value for my 8 grands!

Hi,
I have a Pioneer Elite Pro510HD that has a problem described below. It seems similar to what you folks are discussing...

Problem:
Started initially with getting a loud popping sound and loss of video and audio. I had an authorized service center look at it. They replaced the main card (that's what they told me). The problem persists, except that the loud popping sound is gone. Now only the video and audio are lost. Leaving the TV off for a short time (5-10 min) fixes the problem. But it can repeat itself quite quickly. Does not hapeen all the time and hence the service center is unable to pinpoint the exact cause.

From siloweed's movie clip about this problem it seems like the same problem like what's being discussed here.


Thanks
- Premal

Guys is there any way to calcuate value of used televisions? If I wana dispose it!! as my pioneer service guys are NO SHOW on repeated calls!!

Time to buy new set, soon after CEDIA!!

Pioneer..HANDS OFF!!

Thanks to Siloreed for pointing me to this forum. I have just sent this link to my service technician...let's see what they do with it. Please keep posting anything you find on this issue...and I'll do the same.

I thought I'd update the site. I came home today and after reading the posts on this thread...I just kicked around the side/rear of the tv and was able to reproduce the problem. It went of, kicked a little bit again and the picture was back...I am certain the problem that's been happening on my TV is the same as the one being discussed on this thread....

Can someone confirm that by resoldering the low voltage part mentioned in this thread the problem does go away...I really don't want to give any more money to Pioneer...

thanks much.

Originally posted by premald
Can someone confirm that by resoldering the low voltage part mentioned in this thread the problem does go away...I really don't want to give any more money to Pioneer...

thanks much.

I can confirm that after my service repair people serviced the low voltage board, the blue flash problem has not returned.

I am 100% sure the problem has been fixed by resoldering the board.

Good luck.

Pioneer sucks.

Jerry

Originally posted by premald
Hi,
I have a Pioneer Elite Pro510HD that has a problem described below. It seems similar to what you folks are discussing...

Problem:
Started initially with getting a loud popping sound and loss of video and audio. I had an authorized service center look at it. They replaced the main card (that's what they told me). The problem persists, except that the loud popping sound is gone. Now only the video and audio are lost. Leaving the TV off for a short time (5-10 min) fixes the problem. But it can repeat itself quite quickly. Does not hapeen all the time and hence the service center is unable to pinpoint the exact cause.

From siloweed's movie clip about this problem it seems like the same problem like what's being discussed here.


Thanks
- Premal

Hi Premal: I never experienced the loud popping sound, but, then again, I bypassed the internal audio day one.

If you want to spend a lot of money and time replacing CRT's, associated housings and boards, that's your call. If I hadn't discovered this thread that's what I would have done.. or left this set for dead.

However, I haven't had one incident of "blue flash" since the day my tech re-soldered the low voltage board. As far as I'm concerned, the case is closed.

well, i am giving it away, nefore it pops!

Originally posted by gary miller
Hi Premal: I never experienced the loud popping sound, but, then again, I bypassed the internal audio day one.

If you want to spend a lot of money and time replacing CRT's, associated housings and boards, that's your call. If I hadn't discovered this thread that's what I would have done.. or left this set for dead.

However, I haven't had one incident of "blue flash" since the day my tech re-soldered the low voltage board. As far as I'm concerned, the case is closed.

Hi Garry,
Thanks for replying back. As I had mentioned earlier, the popping sound has gone and based on siloreed's video I confirmed that the problem is what's being discussed here. Unfortunately I had already spent some money trying to fix this problem but to no avail. Since they had a 30 day warranty on the work they are still willing to look at it. ...based on this thread (which I sent the tech)...we are going to be soldering the low voltage supply boards today...I am really hopeful that this problem will be gone after today....
Thank you
- Premal

I had the tech come out today. We were able to see the blue flashing as soon as he started tapping on the low voltage power supply (at various places). He took the board off and soldered some stuff. Didn't help still had the problem. At this point he sprayed some coolant (that freezes the components to -85 degrees). As soon as he sprayed it on/near the white connectors area the problem stopped happening.
He removed the board again and resoldered the connector part of the board and since then the problem does not seem to happen.

The TV is going to be on for the rest of the day...let's see if this problem is gone. If I don't see it for a few days...I'll post back the status for the others....

Hope this helps

Thanks again to all.
- Premal

Does anyone have the service manual in a PDF file that shows the PRO-510/610/710 low voltage power supply board? It would be of great help.


Thanks,


rsg_1...

Hi,
This thread was really helpful. I had my tech follow all the instructions from this thread and my problem is fixed.

It's been over a month and have not seen this probem.

I wanted to thank all those contributed to this thread.

- Premal

has anyone had their 10 series tv fixed without buying a new board in the dallas area? i'd like to find out who you got to repair your tv and how much it cost. i thought that my 710 was an isolated case until i ran across this thread.

Originally posted by kalin02
has anyone had their 10 series tv fixed without buying a new board in the dallas area? i'd like to find out who you got to repair your tv and how much it cost. i thought that my 710 was an isolated case until i ran across this thread.

Bayard Electronics on Mockingbird Lane. Don't have their number handy, but it should be easy to find.


Only problem with Bayard ... is they insist on taking the set back to their shop for the repair. Adds cost to the total repair bill, and of course it's a hassle. I believe my total repair bill came in under $500.00 for initial visit, toting the set out, repair of the board at the component level, and returning the set. They kept the set for about a week.

Jerry

Hello everyone,

I'm new here, and my 4 year-old Pro610HD had the same problem. Mine started acting up about three weeks ago, so I did a search on several forums, and thankfully found this thread. I fixed mine, so far no problems.

Up front, I would like to thank everyone for their contributions to this thread, and many, many thanks to Siloreed, for posting the link to his video. As soon as I saw it, I knew I was in the right place.
This post is quite long and I apologize for it's length, but I feel this information will be helpful to others.

Disclaimer: This information is provided as-is and based on my observations. I assume no responsibility for what you do to your set or, in the extreme, your health. If you feel uncomfortable going about this, then call a technician and provide him with the info from this entire thread.

Diagnosis:

I began by tapping the heat sinks on the power supply board (part # AWV1795), and got a few flickers of blue, but that was about it. I was about to put the cover back on when I decided to tap the connectors that go to it. Immediately, the screen went ballistic - it can be only described as "blue thunder"! I decided to work on it ASAP.

The following is a general procedure based on what I did to fix the board. Allow yourself an afternoon to do this, TAKE YOUR TIME. BTW, I recommend to everyone to buy/beg/borrow or steal the two service manuals that go with the x10 series HDTV's. These are ARP3051 and ARP3047, they contain info on how to get to the service menus, and parts lists and schematics as well.

Board Removal and inspection:

Turn off main power switch, wait a few minutes and UNPLUG SET. Wait several minutes to completely drain high voltages. The power supply board is large vertical board in the back on the right side, AC cord goes to it.

There is an RF coil near the connectors at upper left, be careful not to squash it with your thumb when disconnecting wire harnesses. (oops....) After removing all those screws, handle board with two hands, as it flexes quite easily. For some reason the actual PC board is very thin, in relation to the weight of the components. Try not to flex it too much, or it may cause more broken solder points. Rest the board on blocks of wood when working on it.

Use an 8x magnifying loupe (available at photographic supply houses) or glass to inspect solder joints, as you will not be able to see breaks with the naked eye or reading glasses. A cold solder joint can be described as being dull gray and/or pebbly in appearance, sometimes accompanied with a "fracture ring" around it. Found quite a few on my board. Gently wiggle the component on the other side to see if the actual joint wiggles as well. if it does, re-solder it.

As I suspected, there were broken solder joints on connector E3 (12+ supply and a GND) and the joints for and around IC204 and IC202 looked "cold" with possible ring fractures. It's amazing how little solder was used on these joints, especially the connectors. (shame on Pioneer's QC...)

Re-soldering:

This section assumes that you have had previous soldering experience, such as an electronics hobby kit, repairing something on a circuit board, etc. Again, if you are not comfortable doing this, have someone who knows how do it for you.

Work on the board in a well-lit area, such as a workshop. (a dinette set with chandelier lighting just doesn't work!) A desk lamp for additional lighting helps. Prop the board up to prevent flexing. I suggest using a magnifying headset such as an OptiVisor (available online or dedicated tool supply shops) to see what you're doing while soldering, some of these joints are quite small.

Use an AC-powered 30-40 watt soldering iron with a fine tip. Cordless units, such as a Wahl, are okay, but pressing the "on" button gets tedious after awhile, and because of the wait time for heat-up, may not be consistent. Do not use a high-wattage soldering gun, the trick is to solder the joints, not vaporize them... I used a Weller soldering station set on "4" with good results. The iron must be hot, meaning that the solder liquifies instantaneously on contact. Also used fine 60/40 rosin core solder, for PC work. Clean the tip on the iron frequently, using a wet sponge.

It's your choice if you decide to re-solder all the joints on the board, I only did the questionable ones. On the connector pins, however, I desoldered these with a vacumn pump and re-soldered them. I did ALL the connector pins just to be safe. Re-flowing solder on the other components should be sufficient, just do it quickly to prevent over-heating of the actual component. You can also use clip-on heat sinks on the component leads, if you can reach them. (the board heat sinks sometimes get in the way)

When you're finished, inspect your work - look for free-floating solder "blurbs", and make sure you didn't solder two joints together accidentally. Re-install the board, and hopefully, the flicker is gone for good.

Well, that's about it. I hope this info helps someone in the future, I know this thread helped me. Thank you again.
--Dave G.

I have a Pioneer pro 610 elite.....

I have had intermittent blue flashes, screen gets lighter and lighter then like magic goes back to original great picrure...

I had Magnolia Audio Video in Seattle out 2 times and I trucked my Pioneer to then 2 times (no easy task)...

Finally they came out a few days ago and performed a soulder on the power board. According to Pioneer, there is an area on the power board that this soulder fixes as it has not acted up since..Weak soulders in a certain area of the power board cause the picture variance and also can cause "pops" through the speakers.

But I have had other problems and I am now dealing with a side to side shake which is most noticable when I'm on Directv menu screen viewing words.

It is less apparent when I'm watching moving video. They are now coming out to my house ( Magnolia) with many different boards to change them out and see if this solves the problem. They already tried a new convergence board and it did not solve the problem. When the ISF tech was doing a convergence, or should I say TRYING to do a convergence he noticed this problem because he could not get the convergence perfect with the slight shake.

Anyway I hope you will check with your retailer and have them call Pioneer about the soulder on the video board...


I hate to give up this tv because with the internal doubler there is nothing else out there that does as great a job as this Pioneer for viewing SD signals, which for now most channels are...


Lance

Hi Lance100,

That sounds like the same problem I had years ago, when I first got the set.

My story relates to red convergence problems, same as DanP posted earlier. Mine would flicker to the right, and the manual convergence wouldn't sit still. Constantly had to re-adjust it.

Fortunately at the time, my set was still under warranty. Each time my local service guy would come out, he would have to call Pioneer, explain the problem over and over, and order new boards. It would take a few days for the boards to show up. A new service appointment was made, and he would put the boards in. Over a period of 2 months, he swapped out the power supply, high voltage, digital convergence and sub video boards. Same problem kept occurring. Finally, Pioneer told him to order and replace the red CRT deflection yoke. This cleared up the problem... for about 2 months.

BTW, be aware that you're not allowed to keep the new boards as he swaps them out, they go back to Pioneer. How on earth do you localize a problem if there are two boards in involved?? I say that under warranty, you should be able to keep ALL the new parts!

By that time, I was PO'd. I said "screw the warranty". I unplugged the set and went in through the front. I located the connector for the red CRT yoke (white, with one blue and one red wire), disconnected it from the HV board, re-seated it, and bingo! No problems since. Later on I read somewhere in the Keohi site that the red convergence drift is "normal" for a 6 month burn-in. Bah. It finally settled down after 8 months.

I had a theory that the actual connectors for the wire harnesses are poorly designed and/or defective, but now after reading this thread, I know it is more likely bad solder on the connector pins. Perhaps someday I will re-solder that board as well, if the problem comes back.

I'm sure that by now, Pioneer is aware of this forum and problems with the Elites. (read some of the earlier posts in this thread) But it is more profitable for them to sell expensive boards rather than 'fess up to quality-control problems. Most likely they will not fix solder problems for free, not now or in the future, unless it involves a huge majority of units with the same symptoms, like the "green line" problem with x30 Elites.

Anyway, good luck with your service company, I'm sure they'll find the problem. I agree that the line-doubler on the set is the finest I've seen. With the prohibitive cost of plasma displays and the questionable mechanics of DLP's (a color wheel?? c'mon....) I plan to keep this set as long as possible.

--Dave G

Add me to the list of unhappy Elite customers. My 510 started having this issue about a week ago. It's getting progressively worse every day. I'm contemplating between ordering a replacement board from Pioneer for 300 bucks or just junk the set and buy something new.

-MarcW

Sorry to hear that Marc. Since I repaired my set it's been trouble free.

I started this thread about 6 months ago, and rather than fading away it just keeps gathering steam. I think that's a testament to Pioneer's shoddy production and QC. I've been buying Pioneer products since the early 80s. No mas.

It's a shame Pioneer has decided that stonewalling customers who spent thousands of dollars on just one product is the way to go, losing that type of high-end customer and the resulting bad PR couldn't be good for them.

Sayonara Pioneer. Enjoy the money I spent on this set, it's the last you'll get from me.

Jerry

Great thread. I am gonna have to find someone to come out and resolder my PRO-610HD. Have had it forever and been putting up with the flashes too.

Thanks for the info guys! This forum rocks!

Justin

Just a quick update. Using the information from this thread, I carefully removed the low voltage board (required patience, a philips head screwdriver and about 20 minutes) and gave it to a buddy with good soldering skills (along with a copy of Dave610's post and $20).

I got it back within an hour, reinstalled it and everything seemed to come up just fine (Whew!). It's been nearly 24 hours and still no blue flash. Using nVidia, I was able to get the picture -properly- adjusted for the first time in months.

I really appreciate the effort and investigation you guys put into this. Starting to actually like my PRO-610HD again. . . .

Justin

That's great, Justin! Glad my info was helpful to you. My set has been working flawlessly for about three weeks now, hope yours stays fixed, as well. My next project is cleaning the mirror and lenses, still doing a lot of research on the subject.

BTW, not intending to hijack this thread or anything, but how does nVidia fit in as far as adjusting your set? I thought they made graphics cards and software for PC's....

-Dave

I have a six / seven year old Elite 1009W (16x9) that suffers from a "pop" then shuts itself off problem that has gone from once a month to almost every day. It sounds like there is some arcing and the a protection shutdown. You turn off the main power and back on until the set finally comes back on. Sometimes takes a couple of times, other times five or ten times.

Also, I can't use the s-video inputs now because I will get one gun shift in color periodically (it jumps left an inch or so, then jumps back) -- seems similar to the blue flash but slightly different.

I'm half tempted to open the set and find the power board and ask someone at work to re-solder the joints...

And I'm guessing I could find the power board by just tracking down where the AC power cord goes. Does this board have any part number that I could look for on my board without removing it? Any ideas if I might have the same type of problems?

Thanks.

Charlie

Hi Charlie,

Go to parts.pioneerelectronics.com and enter "Pro1009W" in the "model number" search field. (I would give you the direct link, but I'm not allowed to post URL's yet, as I am a new member. Sheesh....) It will give you a list of parts available for your set.

The power supply board is different from the ones Pro x10HD series, it is listed as part#AWV1565. It sounds like the power supply and HV/deflection circuitry are on the same board.

An alternate site for parts would be partsolver.com, just enter "PRO1009W" as your model number.

The problem you are describing sounds like a problem with the high voltage/deflection circuit, possibly a bad flyback transformer (this provides high voltage to the CRT's), or something to do with a faulty deflection coil on one of the CRT's. (this might explain the convergence jump you're seeing) However, it could be a solder joint, they are known to deteriorate over time, due to normal heat dissipation. I'm only guessing at this point, as I am do-it-yourselfer, not a technician.

Your best bet would be to call your local TV repair service and have them check the boards for faulty solder joints, and let them figure out where the arcing sound is coming from. Good luck!

I'm bumping this. My set is doing the same!

I have an Elite 610 manufactured in January 2000. I've been having the "blue flash" problem for months. The local authorized Pioneer service center, working with Pioneer service engineers, "diagnosed" the problem to require replacing the three CRT driver boards. Cost: >$500. When that did not work, the authorized service center and Pioneer decided I had to replace the sub-video board. Cost: another $500. When that didn't work, Pioneer and the technician said the set needed a new blue tube. And that's where i drew the line, searched the web, and found this thread.

After reading about the power supply solder problem, I this morning went at it. The first thing I did was unplug all the cables going into/out of the power supply board, and cleaned the connections with tuner spray. Then I re-plugged the wires and turned the set on. Not fixed - the blue flash appeared almost immediately.

The next thing I did was try the suggested solder fix. I removed the power supply board, and re-soldered as many joints as I could see that appeared cold. None appeared obviously defective, but I resoldered anyway. I paid particular attention to the sockets for connecting the plug wires, on the theory that these may have cracked due to the stress and strain of plugging in the wires. After soldering, I reinstalled the board. So far, with the set running about an hour, I have seen no evidence of the problem. I am cautiously optimistic that it's fixed.

I own a 58" 610 manufactured in April 2000, which has been exhibiting all of the same symptons. It recently started turning itsself off.

Maybe education is an investment. My son is a EE at Motorola - sounds like it's time to ask for a favor in return for all of those tuition bills .... And yes, the set is still great. I went in this weekend to look at LCDs from Sony and Hitachi, and at Mitsubishi DLPs. The video noise on the screen up close on all of these sets is a real turn off. And once I pointed it out, the young salesperson saw the screen door effect whenever any of these sets panned across a bright sky - we weren't seated all that close to the sets. Now if the 610 will just continue working until the improved 1080p fixed pixel displays emerge over the next year.

Dennis -

I suggest you ask your son to re-solder the power supply board for you, assuming you don't want to do it yourself. My set's been on all day (blizzard here in NY), and since I fixed the board this morning the TV's been perfect. No more flashes, and the black level and contrast are once again rock-steady. It's as nice a picture as I remember it was so long ago before the problem started.

Larry

my soldering skills are as bad as can be.

Larry, where in NY are you !!,you feel like soldering another one ??? $!$

IBill -

'm in Westchester County - near White Plains. I take it you are experiencing the same flashing problem? What model set do you have? Have you taken off the back of your TV yet to expose the power supply board? If so, when you tap on the heat sink while the TV is on (use the blunt, insulated end of a screwdriver for this and do not touch anything inside with metal or your fingers!!!), you should be able to induce your own flashes. That is a tell-tale sign that the problem with your set is in the power supply solder joints. I believe I know now where the problem joint is - I actually believe it's only one. But I have yet to test that theory.

Anyway - if you live close by I'll be glad to look at your board and re-solder it for you. It only takes about a 1/2 hour to do it. However, of course, I offer no guarantees and no liability in the event when you put your board back in something doesn't work.

FYI - the set's been running for days now since my fix reported above and I can definitively report that the flashes are gone.

Larry :,!!! that would be great !!

I live in Yonkers but work at Arrowwood,I could probably drop it off one day
{if that is ok with you ?} from what I gather,it's pretty easy to take the board out ?,and that no unsoldering is needed to be done to get the board out ??, and that the board itself is very thin and to be gentle with it !!

I have a Pro Elite 510 HD
the P/S # is AWV 1795
{I gave Pioneer my serial # and they confirmed the part #}

I'll get into the lower back portion of the set this evening and try to induce it., it is exactly like most describe it.
I get what looks like a split second slight blue flash followed by intermittent brightness.... and sometimes a popping sound ?takes an hour or so to get it to do it.

this would be so cool of you to do and of course,
I do understand "no guarantees" on anything ,but it's worth a shot !!!

let me know if I can drop it off !!! or meet up somewhere
whatever is best for you !
thanks again !!
Bill

just a quick follow-up....
I got into the rear of the set a little while ago,man was it dusty in there ?,I vacuumed gently inside the cabinet I replugged the power cord
in and had someone watch for the problem to occur,and sure enough as soon as I tapped lightly with a small wooden handle,the problem started
it actually seems worse since inducing the problem {happening much more frequently}

I'll help you if I can. I don't know my schedule this weekend - I'm usually tied up with work, but I'll check and let you know. If I can find the time, you can bring your board over and I'll solder it while you wait. It really doesn't take very long. Send me a private message with your phone number, and I'll get in touch with you.

What you report is also common to my experience. There is a large aluminum heat sink on the board to cool what appears to be either a power transistor or a 3-terminal regulator. When you look on the underside of the board, which you can do when the board's removed, you will see that the heat sink is screwed into the board from the rear using a copper screw. This screw makes contact with what appears to be a ground pad. There will probably be a glob of solder from the factory attempting to solder the screw to the ground pad to ensure a good joint. This is the joint I think is failing. I believe that oxidation builds up over time between the screw and the pad, and the solder joint on my unit appeared to be a cold joint to boot. This oxidation and poor solder joint would explain why ,when you tap on the heat sink, the problem is induced and also why it can become worse. Again, this is only a theory as to where the problem resides. If you want to try an experiment before bringing the board over, you might want to consider tightening that screw (careful - not too much!) and then reinstalling the board. Maybe that's all you'ld need to do to get your TV working again.

I pulled out the board a few hours ago,it wasn't that hard,only trouble for me was that the white plugs in the upper left portion of the board were pretty tight and took awhile to back out {being thatthey were together for so long they shouldn't be a problem from now on .

I tried tightening the 3 screws that hold the large sink,they were pretty tight already ?,1 thing I did notice was that large sink had what looked to be a solder point besides the 3 screws that was never soldered ?,
also noticed another item on the board that was missing 1 solder point.

I recall (could be wrong) there is only one screw for the heatsink that has a blob of solder on it, because only that one screw connects to a pad that is in turn connected to something else (i.e., part of the circuit). It's ok if some screws or items do not have solder - sometimes, wires poke through the board of components that do not use that connection.

Anyway - I would, as I said, tighten the screws and then put the board back in and see if you still have the problem. Maybe you can avoid soldering.

Larry :,
I put the board back in,just not with all the screws{easier to take out next time !}and it's still flashing.

1 of the screws has solder but a very very small amount,but all the scews were tight.

I also sent you a PM yesterday with contact info !

never got your PM - could be that my spam filters intervened. Could you send again? I'll be sure to look for it.

scroll up to the top of the screen and get into members area,then into the pm's,are they still not listed in there ?
shouldn't have anything to do with your spam control since the pm's are all on this server ??.

Hello all, I too am an owner of a 510 elite. I am experiencing a buzz type noise coming from the same power supply board. the noise is eminatting from the transformer. It seems to buzz during certain hi contrast scenes. The picture also starts to bend. Especially noticeable when the menu is displayed. The other problem is a white line that is visible on the extreme right of the blue crt. This line is visible as a blue halo when the picture content is black. It is also visible when there is no input present. I switched the blue signal connector to the green crt and the line traveled with the signal. There seems to be a problem in the signal path. Has anyone experienced any similar problems.

PS. Pioneer techs do not seem to be any better here in Canada either.

THX. Regards, Tom.

Tom -

Never heard of the problem you are having. But from the symptoms of a buzzing transformer, I would start my investigation by probing the voltage levels on the power supply board before trouble shooting downstream.

Larry

Originally posted by Tamas
Hello all, I too am an owner of a 510 elite. I am experiencing a buzz type noise coming from the same power supply board. the noise is eminatting from the transformer. It seems to buzz during certain hi contrast scenes. The picture also starts to bend. Especially noticeable when the menu is displayed. The other problem is a white line that is visible on the extreme right of the blue crt. This line is visible as a blue halo when the picture content is black. It is also visible when there is no input present. I switched the blue signal connector to the green crt and the line traveled with the signal. There seems to be a problem in the signal path. Has anyone experienced any similar problems.

PS. Pioneer techs do not seem to be any better here in Canada either.

THX. Regards, Tom.

A month ago I called my local Elite retailer asking how much they would charge to clean the lenses and mirror on my 510 (eventually I did this myself without problems). They quickly changed the subject to power supply and said I would need to change that out because apparently they got word they were defective. I told them I didn't need a new PS.....I don't have any problems with it. BTW, this is not a 'recall' of any kind....I would need to pay for it. Ha!

I find it difficult to even set black level, and the gray scale is hosed. I am not happy at the way this expensive set has been deteriorating. Techs seem to only want to deal with catastrophic failures, otherwise as long as their is a picture " their is nothing wrong with the set" is the answer or the tubes are aging and this is "normal". I understand these sets are more complex, however, the money that we all spent on these sets should have been an indication of better design and higher quality build.

as soon as I can scrape up the dough....I'm going to have to order a new PS board. mine must be getting worse as the set shut itself down this evening for the 1st time ever ?,I had to unplug/replug to get it to reset.

I'm not very good at soldering and don't know of anyone else that can do it... :confused:

the board will cost you about $300. that will solve your problem, but it is an expensive way to do it. your set probably shut down because one or more of the board's failing solder joints got worse when you removed and flexed the board. not surprising. my set also shut down sometimes. others on this board have reported this symptom as well. re-solder the board, and all your problem should go away.

Originally posted by lrogers
the board will cost you about $300. that will solve your problem, but it is an expensive way to do it. your set probably shut down because one or more of the board's failing solder joints got worse when you removed and flexed the board. not surprising. my set also shut down sometimes. others on this board have reported this symptom as well. re-solder the board, and all your problem should go away.

I posted awhile back that my Pro 1009W constantly (well, a couple of times a day) does the "pop" and then turn off, and it needs to have the main power button turned off and on multiple times before it will stay on. Is this the same way others behave when they turn off? I'm tempted to open the set and find the board the power goes to and have it re-soldered...

Anyone with other than the 510 or 610 that can report a similar problem fixed by the re-solder?

Charlie

My 4+ year old PRO510HD started this blue flashing sometime last year. Had the local service center come out to fix it. At first he just "tightened" some connections. That didn't work. Then he ordered and installed replacement CRT driver boards. That didn't work and it was coupled with a terrible customer service experience that I won't go into here. Finally I gave up and just got my set back. Did a search here (must have searched the wrong areas last year) and look at all the people having exactly the same problem. That video clip is priceless. I showed the same type of thing to the service tech and it didn't help them.
So, the answer is that the problem is in the low voltage power supply board? I'm planning on giving the instructions posted by Dave610 to the only OTHER Pioneer service center here in Houston to see if I have better luck. I have no confidence in my soldering skills :)

Originally posted by lrogers
What you report is also common to my experience. There is a large aluminum heat sink on the board.

My 710 started doing the blue flash also on all inputs. I found this thread and followed the instructions. I also removed the lower board with the smaller heat sinks and found more questionable connections that I re-soldered.

problem went away for a few days and now it's back again. Anyone have any more suggestions to fix this problem?

schematics would be nice to have for this set. Does anyone know where I can purchase them online? The service manual that is offered on the net doesn't have the detail that I need.

Just had the TV tech finally show up and follow Dave610's instructions. He said he found poor connections where specified. Put it all back together, tapped like mad and no flashes. So now it's a waiting game to see if it's really fixed.

Terrible, an expensive TV that lasts only 4 years. Gave mine away and bought a JVC D-ila and I'm very happy with it. my $ 0.02.

Originally posted by drjjr
Just had the TV tech finally show up and follow Dave610's instructions. He said he found poor connections where specified. Put it all back together, tapped like mad and no flashes. So now it's a waiting game to see if it's really fixed.

Dr, keep us posted. I am still having the problem but it is much more intermitant since I applied the fix. It might happen and I just turn off and on the set and the problem doesn't show up any more that night. Sometimes it comes back a couple of times and turning off and on the TV makes it stop. Before it would happen every night after the TV warmed up for 10 mins.

I had a 700 and participated in the AVS group 710-swap several years ago.

Since then I've been very happy with my TV. It started with the blue flashing several months ago and after discovering this thread I decided to do it myself (since no one had reported success with Pioneer). I finally did it last Sunday. It took about 3 hours, removing the PC board connectors and unscrewing it was probably the biggest pain. I reflowed all and resoldered some of the connector joints, in particular the ones described in the prior message. I probably did ~70 altogether (it has been 20 years since I soldered anything).

We've watched ~10 hours since then with nary a sign of any flash. The picture has returned to near-perfection and is still the best that money can buy (IMO).

The stories of Pioneer stone-walling sound similar to the initial response to our 700HD complaints (bad de-interlacer). This time, though, they don't seem to be caving... too bad, they build (built?) great televisions.

JimB -

If it's still flashing, I would take the board out again and solder some more joints. The flashing problem should go away with proper re-soldering. You are running a risk of ruining the blue CRT - and if you do that, it will cost very big $$ to repair.

Originally posted by JimB
Dr, keep us posted. I am still having the problem but it is much more intermitant since I applied the fix. It might happen and I just turn off and on the set and the problem doesn't show up any more that night. Sometimes it comes back a couple of times and turning off and on the TV makes it stop. Before it would happen every night after the TV warmed up for 10 mins.

Well, two nights in a row since the rework and I haven't seen the flash. I'll post back in a week if I still haven't seen it...or sooner if I do. It is just enough of an intermittent problem for me to only be cautiously optimistic at this point. But I will declare victory if I haven't seen it after week or so.

Still no flashes to report after a little more than a week since the rework.
Thanks to everyone here who made it easy for the tech.

exactly what does the joints that people are soldering look like? i'd like to try to repair my 710 but don't want to spin my wheels trying to figure out how to do it.

solder as many as you can. no one to my knowledge has reported what the particular problem joints are. my vote is the solder covering the screw that attachss the large heat sink to the grounding pad. i would definitely re-flow/re-solder that joint.

Originally posted by kalin02
exactly what does the joints that people are soldering look like? i'd like to try to repair my 710 but don't want to spin my wheels trying to figure out how to do it.

In my case, the tech who repaired my set was able to reproduce the problem by poking the solder joints with a pencil. When he located the problem joint, he resoldered it. That was two years ago. No problem since.

Hello Guys,
Since I bought this 610HD in July 2001 and I have phillips extended warrenty 5yr,
I had same probles since last summer. Since then Technician keeps changing lots of things but problem is still there. I sill have one year warrnety left which expired on july 2006. I am lucky to buy that warrenty but Problem is still there.

Now, I can print this thred and show to my tech and hopefully problem will be sovled.

Thanks for all your hard work and suggestions.

Edit: Please subcribe all elite users.
Thanks

Good luck with the Tech Panka. I showed posts from this thread to 2 different repair techs. 1 ignored it, the other at least read it a little.

I bought a power supply board from Pioneer about a month and a half ago. Even though I have absolutely no repair skills, I was able to replace the board myself.

NO PROBLEMS WHATSOEVER since I replaced the power supply board. No more blue flash EVER.

ANYONE READING THIS THREAD, DO NOT LET THE TECHS OR PIONEER TELL YOU A LIE. The solution to the problem described in this thread is the POWER SUPPLY BOARD and nothing else.

It's a shame a supposedly standup corporation like Pioneer thinks nothing of screwing the clients who paid big bucks for a top of the line set.

Since this all began I have not purchased another Pioneer product and will not do so for the rest of my life. I take every opportunity to let people know what a rip off Pioneer is and how that company should be avoided at all costs.

SPREAD THE WORD!

Jerry

Good luck with the Tech Panka. I showed posts from this thread to 2 different repair techs. 1 ignored it, the other at least read it a little.

I bought a power supply board from Pioneer about a month and a half ago. Even though I have absolutely no repair skills, I was able to replace the board myself.

NO PROBLEMS WHATSOEVER since I replaced the power supply board. No more blue flash EVER.

ANYONE READING THIS THREAD, DO NOT LET THE TECHS OR PIONEER TELL YOU A LIE. The solution to the problem described in this thread is the POWER SUPPLY BOARD and nothing else.

It's a shame a supposedly standup corporation like Pioneer thinks nothing of screwing the clients who paid big bucks for a top of the line set.

Since this all began I have not purchased another Pioneer product and will not do so for the rest of my life. I take every opportunity to let people know what a rip off Pioneer is and how that company should be avoided at all costs.

SPREAD THE WORD!

Jerry


Hi Jerry,
I agree with you. In my country, Customer is believed as god in business.
Anyway,
Which part number did you order?

AWV1795 POWER SUPPLY ASSY (FOR OLD MOD)
AWV1872 POWER SUPPLY ASSY (FOR NEW MOD)

I bought my TV in july 2001. I do not how to look part number?

Thanks for reply in advance.
Please help my tech to fix my problem

I got Download Service manual in PDF version only "Adjustment" and "General Information" Chapter. Anyone interested please PM me. It's free. I will email you.

Download here (http://icdweb.cc.purdue.edu/~snyderje/610serv_man.PDF)





http://icdweb.cc.purdue.edu/~snyderje/610serv_man.PDF

Direct link (http://parts.pioneerelectronics.com/advancedSearch.asp?searchString=SERVICE+MANUAL&searchChar=P)

ANYONE READING THIS THREAD, DO NOT LET THE TECHS OR PIONEER TELL YOU A LIE. The solution to the problem described in this thread is the POWER SUPPLY BOARD and nothing else.




I'll second the point. 3 months after I had the resoldering done per instructions in this thread, I have had no more blue flashes.

Anyone near chicago? I am interested to fix my TV

http://www.keohi.com/keohihdtv/brandspecific/pioneer/pincushioning.html

Any Suggestion to buy service manual from this site

Pro-610HD Service manual (http://www.manualscenter.com/shopping_cart.php?keywords=Pro-610hd&currency=USD&sort=2a)

I am sooooo relieved to find this support group :)

My TV started doing this exact same problem 6 months ago.

My problem has been fixed also but solder joints alone wouldn't fix it all the way. I ended up jumpering the big heat sync so it would by-pass it competely. used a short piece of shielded copper wire. problem fixed since Feb. now.

It's hard to beg but someone please post picture of Boards and what is to be done?

I just talked to my tech on phone while he was at home about problem. and evenif I did not tell about problem with power supply board, he said " He is going to order POWER SUPPLY BOARD". Now' that is impressive.................

Hello Guys, as somebody suggested in this thread, I did put small home FAN on back of TV and Problem looks gone When FAn was ON. TV was on more than 12 hrs on saturday and sunday but no blue flash and automatic shut-off. When fan was off, I was getting blue flash and automatic shut off...............

You figure out yourself. Now, Whenever tech changes my power supply board, I will still use FAN to prevent future ELITE problem. FAN was very quite so I could not hear from 13 feet away from my TV.

My problem has been fixed also but solder joints alone wouldn't fix it all the way. I ended up jumpering the big heat sync so it would by-pass it competely. used a short piece of shielded copper wire. problem fixed since Feb. now.

Can you please post picture of what you did?

First off I would like to thank everyone who has contributed to this Tread. Especially Dave610 for the excellent instructions.

My 510 has been acting up for about 6 months with the same problem most people here have been talking about(The blue flash, power down, and pop) It had gotten so bad last Thursday (going out after being on for 5 minutes, then letting it "cooldown" for 15 minutes) that I decided to call a serviceman to come out and take a look at it. Friday afternoon at 2:30 called and had a serviceman scheduled for Wednesday afternoon. At 2:45, I searched the Web and found this thread. I printed out a number of pages and showed them to my wife. We both felt the same way. I think Gary Miller said it best

" I'm really not willing to spend $500-$1000 repairing a set that was built almost 5 years ago. By the same token, I can't see leaving the set on the curb either. "

On Sunday morning I pulled the cover off the back of the set had my wife watch the screen and touched the different areas of the board with the handle of a screwdriver. This gave me an idea of which connectors and heatsinked IC's to concentrate my soldering to. I carefully pulled the board off and took to a work table to do the work. Initially I just heated each of the solder points up to reflow the solder to make a good connection. After doing that I decided to add some solder to each. I did everyone of the "White" connectors on the top left of the board. I also did all the IC's which Had a Heat Sink. There were also about a dozen others that looked suspect so I did those too. I carefully returned the board and tested it out. I touched the same areas with the handle of the screwdriver and NO flickering/Blue flash. I has been 24 hours without a problem.

So for about $0.50 of solder and $2.00 of electricity the problem looks gone.

First off I would like to thank everyone who has contributed to this Tread. Especially Dave610 for the excellent instructions.

My 510 has been acting up for about 6 months with the same problem most people here have been talking about(The blue flash, power down, and pop) It had gotten so bad last Thursday (going out after being on for 5 minutes, then letting it "cooldown" for 15 minutes) that I decided to call a serviceman to come out and take a look at it. Friday afternoon at 2:30 called and had a serviceman scheduled for Wednesday afternoon. At 2:45, I searched the Web and found this thread. I printed out a number of pages and showed them to my wife. We both felt the same way. I think Gary Miller said it best

" I'm really not willing to spend $500-$1000 repairing a set that was built almost 5 years ago. By the same token, I can't see leaving the set on the curb either. "

On Sunday morning I pulled the cover off the back of the set had my wife watch the screen and touched the different areas of the board with the handle of a screwdriver. This gave me an idea of which connectors and heatsinked IC's to concentrate my soldering to. I carefully pulled the board off and took to a work table to do the work. Initially I just heated each of the solder points up to reflow the solder to make a good connection. After doing that I decided to add some solder to each. I did everyone of the "White" connectors on the top left of the board. I also did all the IC's which Had a Heat Sink. There were also about a dozen others that looked suspect so I did those too. I carefully returned the board and tested it out. I touched the same areas with the handle of the screwdriver and NO flickering/Blue flash. I has been 24 hours without a problem.

So for about $0.50 of solder and $2.00 of electricity the problem looks gone.

Very good explaination

37 Unhappy Elite TV owners...........

I can think of rest of pioneer elite TV owners................

Since technician changed power supply board, TV was on almost 12 hrs, no blue flash or spark. Problem is gone for good.

Thanks guys...........

Now, I can enjoy my elite without any worry.......... :)

in 4 days, My TV was automatically shut-off randomly two times. but no blue flash or spark. I still do not under stand, in front of my eyes, Tech changed power supply board and TV is still doing shuts-off. Thank god there is no more blue flash........................

....

I bought a power supply board from Pioneer about a month and a half ago. Even though I have absolutely no repair skills, I was able to replace the board myself.

NO PROBLEMS WHATSOEVER since I replaced the power supply board. No more blue flash EVER.
....

JerryJerry, in your post #128 above (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=4681806&&#post4681806), from last November, you said that your problems had been solved. No more flashes. Then the next post you make in June says you ordered a power supply board from Pioneer a month and a half ago. :confused: Did I miss something? Reading between the lines, does this mean that the problem reappeared on your previously repaired (resoldered) board?

I'm a new addition to the blue flash brightness problem club. My Elite 610 was bought new in late December 2000, not sure of the manufacture date right now. The blue flash/brightness problem first appeared last week, about 4.5 years later. I'm long out of warranty. I found this thread (and another at HT Spot) so am naturally reading everything posted above over the past year+ with interest. In my case, I've never had the power shutting off problem, at least yet.

I'm like a lot who have posted here. Don't want to give up on this set just yet because I really like it otherwise and don't really have the funds to upgrade to a comparable new TV. I need to decide if I can find somebody to do the soldering for a reasonable price, or try it myself (haven't soldered in years and never much or very well then), or break down and just buy the new PS board from Pioneer. So I'm interested to know if the re-soldering jobs aren't lasting very long.

At least I know not to bang my head against the wall with Pioneer...

Thanks for any input or updates.

I had my 510 fixed (soldering the board) two months ago and it's been perfect very since. I don't know how long it will last, but so far so good.

John

Jerry, in your post #128 above (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=4681806&&#post4681806), from last November, you said that your problems had been solved. No more flashes. Then the next post you make in June says you ordered a power supply board from Pioneer a month and a half ago. :confused: Did I miss something? Reading between the lines, does this mean that the problem reappeared on your previously repaired (resoldered) board?

I'm a new addition to the blue flash brightness problem club. My Elite 610 was bought new in late December 2000, not sure of the manufacture date right now. The blue flash/brightness problem first appeared last week, about 4.5 years later. I'm long out of warranty. I found this thread (and another at HT Spot) so am naturally reading everything posted above over the past year+ with interest. In my case, I've never had the power shutting off problem, at least yet.

I'm like a lot who have posted here. Don't want to give up on this set just yet because I really like it otherwise and don't really have the funds to upgrade to a comparable new TV. I need to decide if I can find somebody to do the soldering for a reasonable price, or try it myself (haven't soldered in years and never much or very well then), or break down and just buy the new PS board from Pioneer. So I'm interested to know if the re-soldering jobs aren't lasting very long.

At least I know not to bang my head against the wall with Pioneer...

Thanks for any input or updates.

Because I have extended phillips service, I had tech to change board. But other 36 elite owner first tried to solder joint if you want I can upload image of board. It's so easy. When You open back of TV, you see righthand side board where power supply go. Just tap lightly on white connector on toplofty corner on power supply board with screwdriver, You will get Blue Flash/spark.
Anyway, Just solder power supply board. Most of All projection problem due to bad solder joint.

I've started google searching for Soldering Tips and How-to-Solder instructional material. There's some good stuff out there. I'm pretty busy at work right now, but as soon as I get the time I may just get the iron and solder and practice a little to see if I want to give it a go. Thanks.

in 4 days, My TV was automatically shut-off randomly two times. but no blue flash or spark. I still do not under stand, in front of my eyes, Tech changed power supply board and TV is still doing shuts-off. Thank god there is no more blue flash........................

Since I unplug my TV from outlet about 4 hrs to reset memory, I never had automatic shut-off in three days over 12hr watching TV.

But Just in case I also running FAN befind TV to cool off TV.

Everything runs smooth over week.

Jerry, in your post #128 above (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=4681806&&#post4681806), from last November, you said that your problems had been solved. No more flashes. Then the next post you make in June says you ordered a power supply board from Pioneer a month and a half ago. :confused: Did I miss something? Reading between the lines, does this mean that the problem reappeared on your previously repaired (resoldered) board?

I'm a new addition to the blue flash brightness problem club. My Elite 610 was bought new in late December 2000, not sure of the manufacture date right now. The blue flash/brightness problem first appeared last week, about 4.5 years later. I'm long out of warranty. I found this thread (and another at HT Spot) so am naturally reading everything posted above over the past year+ with interest. In my case, I've never had the power shutting off problem, at least yet.

I'm like a lot who have posted here. Don't want to give up on this set just yet because I really like it otherwise and don't really have the funds to upgrade to a comparable new TV. I need to decide if I can find somebody to do the soldering for a reasonable price, or try it myself (haven't soldered in years and never much or very well then), or break down and just buy the new PS board from Pioneer. So I'm interested to know if the re-soldering jobs aren't lasting very long.

At least I know not to bang my head against the wall with Pioneer...

Thanks for any input or updates.


Hondo, you read between the lines correctly.

The service company that "repaired" my set (3rd one for the same problem) did fix it TEMPORARILY. However, I don't think they ever completely understood what I was asking them to do and evidently they did not do a good job because the flash did return.

My advice is ... if you feel competent enough to resolder the board yourself, do it. Can't beat the price. However, if that doesn't work, replacing the board yourself is cost effective. I spent considerably less buying and replacing the board myself than I paid that last service company to resolder it.

Since I replaced the board, my set has had no problems.

________________________________________
START RANT

Hindsight is 20/20. When I started this thread over a year ago, if I had known then what I know now I would have saved myself well over a thousand dollars on unnecessary service and botched repairs. I would have simply bought the board and replaced it myself (took me about half an hour). Total cost around $285.00 for the board, after you mail your old one back to them.

The problem I had back then was I TRUSTED Pioneer. I thought they would KNOW what kinds of problems their products were prone to and how to fix the sets. When they recommended a service company I thought they would only be sending me to COMPETENT, QUALIFIED service techs who could diagnose and fix the problem.

I WAS WRONG ON ALL COUNTS.

Their service companies evidently exist to squeeze as much money out of their victims, uh, I mean clients, as possible. They care little about whether or not they are actually finding and fixing the problem. It's much easier and more profitable to sell you unnecessary "adjustments" and "maintentance" than to actually fix the set. And god forbid they don't replace the whole thing, one board at a time, starting with the least likely board, until you have paid them to completely rebuild your set at a cost well above the original purchase price.

It's a SCAM.

Thanks Pioneer. You lost a good customer for life.

Nice marketing plan.

END RANT


DJ

Thanks for the reply DJ.

I completely understand how frustrated this has made you. I'd feel the same way in your position. As it is, I haven't spent a dime yet, but I'm not happy with this problem, as it betrays a rather serious shortcoming in design of the "Elite" line. Such a high-end set should not fail on such an issue in a mere 4 years.

But even accepting that such a problem can happen, the response (or lack thereof) by Pioneer is what's most unacceptable. Seeing the posts here and elsewhere it is quite clear that this is a generic problem with the x10 Elite series. Yet, Pioneer does not acknowledge it as such. They should have investigated these problems when reported by multiple owners, concluded that it's a generic design flaw, issued a service bulletin, and offered a complimentary repair to appease their best customers, even though out of warranty. Such an approach would engender some loyalty on my part towards Pioneer, even given the design flaw. How a company responds to issues is much more important than the fact that they arise in the first place.

I'm not in a position to spearhead anything, but I'd be glad to join in any class-action litigation against Pioneer on this issue if somebody were to initiate it. Any lawyers here?

Thanks again to all for posting your experiences on this issue. It's a great help to others like me who now have the problem. At least I can direct my efforts to resolve it more efficiently (and inexpensively).

In my case, I'm seriously considering getting a few items at Radio Shack and trying the re-soldering approach myself first (after a little practice). I figure it can't hurt, as long as I'm careful not to mess anything else up. If that fails I will no doubt just order a new PS board. I don't plan to pay any service techs to touch it, if I can at all help it.

Ironically, the past few days the problem on my set has been happening a lot less frequently. But it still occurs a couple times a night (instead of dozens of times) and I know it's just a matter of time before it's worse again.

Once a tech changed power supply board, after 10 days, MY TV automatically shuts-off every half hour....Just blank screen but green light stays on...... Do you guys know why?

Any suggestion will be appreciated.........

Thanks for the reply DJ.

I completely understand how frustrated this has made you. I'd feel the same way in your position. As it is, I haven't spent a dime yet, but I'm not happy with this problem, as it betrays a rather serious shortcoming in design of the "Elite" line. Such a high-end set should not fail on such an issue in a mere 4 years.

But even accepting that such a problem can happen, the response (or lack thereof) by Pioneer is what's most unacceptable. ...

I'm not in a position to spearhead anything, but I'd be glad to join in any class-action litigation against Pioneer on this issue if somebody were to initiate it. Any lawyers here?

Hondo, once again you've hit the nail on the head.

I was actually told by a Pioneer Customer Service SUPERVISOR that, after owning the set for 5 years, I should expect to pay expensive repairs on high-end products like the Elite. Balderdash! I have a relatively inexpensive Toshiba 35" set that has not had a problem in 10 YEARS!

The customer service response (and I use the term customer service very loosely in regards to Pioneer) is completely unacceptable. Almost as unacceptable as the bumbling inability of their service companies, WHO WERE IN TELEPHONE CONTACT WITH PIONEER, to diagnose the problem, let alone come up with a solution.

My wife has urged me to find a Class Action lawyer. If there is anyone else on this forum who would like to become part of a class action suit, say so. I have a couple of lawyers that I'm considering contacting.

DJ

I am with you in lawsuit. We will share everything wahtever comes or go

I'm not surprised by Pioneers lack of response to this problem. I was one of the unlucky ones who bought the 700 5 years ago with the line doubler problem. It was a complete nightmare to try and get any help with this problem between Pioneer and the dealer where I bought the set. I took in a portable DVD player into my dealer to show him the problem and he still looked at me like I was crazy. After months of letters, calls I finally was able to get Pioneer to swap out my 700 with a 710 but at a cost of $1000. This made my investment into the set $9K because of their incompetence. There were many others who can tell you their horror stories with Pioneer with the 700HD.

After 12 days, My TV has blue flase evenif Tech changed power supply board which is brand new. May be defective part................

And Blue Flash was about 30 seconds continous well, I have to open my TV in long week-end and solder power supply board myself..........

I do not understand this thing....TV is going MAD or I am going MAD :mad:

EDIT: This week-end I opened my TV again but Tech did not change power supply board. He did change something else..
Anyway, To re-solder power supply board is way to go...

I have used my 510 as my rec room television for watching late night television and movies for the past 5 or 6 years. I was surprised a few weeks ago, when I started to experience the blue flash. Mainly I was surprised because this set is only on for a few hours per day, and I really would not have expected to have problems. I assumed that it was the Blue CRT and the set was on its last legs (not worth any substantial investment to repair given the cost of new units), but I came accross this forum and noted this thread. I will try to execute the repair, and if that doesn't work then try replacing the board. It produces a great picture and I hope I can keep it working for at least a few more years.

Pioneer has had cold solder joint problems that cause shutdown for years, ever since the SDP line of SD units. I have repaired many of them, and almost without exception they always come down to cold solder joints.

"Cold solder joint protocol", as I call it, means going to any solder conn's that have a "halo" around the leg where it meets the pad. One of the worst I ever saw was in a ceiling pj, where the pad was very big - off the flyback - and the halo was enough to almost see thru, a chasm! Very obvious.

This can most easily be seen by holding your flashlight such that you are viewing the solder connection dead on, but with the light hitting it from the side.

Some cold solder joints are invisible to the naked eye, even to a microscope. Only intuition and experience can help you there. They look perfectly good, but can be completely disco'd. Rare, but true.

Then resolder, using good "solder technique". Which means making sure there is enough flux to keep the solder joint gleaming and glossy, refreshing any "dried out" connections. Just touching the joint lightly with your solder will usually lend it enough flux to do the job, without having to add too much solder in the process.

Temperature of your soldering iron tip is important. Keep a sponge handy to wipe your soldering iron tip on, both to clean it and get it gleaming again, and to control the temp, which can easily go into overrun just by sitting there unused. Dragging it across the sponge will cool it to just the right temp when done right.

Look for raised resistors - raised off the board for the purpose of dissipating heat, sometimes with a hole in the board beneath them. To see if they are cold soldered, move them from above the board, and see if the leg moves underneath the board. If so, it is probably a weak joint and should be resoldered. If not, it is tight and secure and probably does not need any further attention.

Anything with a heat sink could cause cold solder joints, just from the expansion and contraction of heat up and cool down. This is especially prevalent in today's convergence ICs, which run ungodly hot in there.

Be very careful of solder bridges, make sure your lighting is very very good. If you unknowingly short 2 legs together by being just a bit sloppy, the results could be devastating to your set. Use a flashlight and view everything you have soldered from several different angles, and if still questionable, from above, THROUGH the board from the top, observing from the bottom where the light shines thru from the top.


Mr Bob

you have a 38th set doing this on this thread now...I purchased my 710 in may 2000..hey the extended warrenty just ended and bam, the blue flash and brightness issue, exactly as the fella's video showed within this thread...So nice to know that I can try and mess with this or buy a new board. Very informative thread, thanks all who participate....
Keith

I just had a tech out to re-solder bad joints on my power supply. He downloaded some "tech tips" from someplace. Thought they might be useful to you folks.

______________________________________________________

Symptom: Picture is "washed out" and pale looking.
Cure: Replace Signal assy.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: December 07 2004
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Picture goes dim and flashes blue.
Cure: Resolder connections at IC204 on Power Supply Assy. (5V
regulator).
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: November 16 2004
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Intermittently no video or OSD, video flicker or
brightness changes, and may also hear a load pop noise. Audio
and High Voltage are ok.
Cure: Check solder on pin 13 of connector CN203 (E3) on the
Power Supply board. This is 12v supply to the Video board.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO520HD, PRO610HD, PRO620HD,
PRO710HD, PRO720HD, SD532HD5, SD582HD5
Tip Date: August 25 2004
The Tech Name: Bruce Phillips

Symptom: Picture OK in center but too red, too blue, or too
green around the edges and corners.
Cure: Recolder ground connections on CRT drive boards.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: April 30 2003
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Intermittantly blows CPU
Cure: Solder bridge on Power Supply Assy - J109 & J110
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: April 30 2003
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Picture dark and slightly greenish.
Cure: Replace Video Assy.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO-610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: December 20 2002
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: set shuts down when selecting input 1, 3 or 4.
Cure: Replace defective Signal Assy. AWV1800 or AWV1866
depending on serial number. Use AWV1800 for serial numbers
beginning with ****0 and AWV1866 for serial numbers beginning
with ****1.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: August 20 2002
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: No video (RGB input only).
Cure: Replace digital convergence assy. Don't forget to swap
EEPROM. This symptom is caused by a problem with the BLANK 2
signal.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD583HD5
Tip Date: May 23 2002
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Picture has horizontal pin appearance (concave on
sides) but raster acutally extends to edge of screen with too
much overscan. Picture is shifted to the left.
Cure: Replace defective sub video assy.
Models Covered: PRO510, PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: May 07 2002
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: PD shutdown occurs. LED indicates vetical failure.
Replacing the convergence amp or digital convergence assy does
not help.
Cure: Replace power supply.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: May 07 2002
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Picture is scrambled. Looks like hor. sync is missing
on all inputs, including tuner, with the exception of the
"component" inputs. OSD looks ok. Monitor out signal also
looks fine.
Cure: Defective Signal Assy. (AWV1800 for early type, AWV1866
for VA type)
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: April 22 2002
The Tech Name: Tony Perkins

Symptom: Set shuts down (convergence amp PD indication) or has
poor convergence on one color that can not be adjusted.
Cure: Check for poor or missing solder on G1, G2 and G3
connectors on the Convergence Amp Assy.
Models Covered: PRO510, PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD,
SD532HD5, SD583HD5
Tip Date: April 02 2002
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Powers up immediately when AC is applied. No
functions work, no picture, no sound. Power LED stays green
and unit will not shut off.
Cure: Found defective video assembly (AWV1799).
Models Covered: PRO510HD
Tip Date: February 20 2002
The Tech Name: Tony Perkins

Symptom: Makes popping sound when changing channels.
Cure: Replace Audio assy.(AWZ6472)
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: February 14 2002
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: Shuts down. Convergenc PD LED on.
Cure: Found R922 (5.6K, 1Watt) open.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: February 13 2002
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: Each time the set is turned on, the Full and 4x3
convergence is bad. If you cycle through the different screen
modes and come back to Full or 4x3, the convergence will
correct itself.
Cure: Change the Digital Convergence Board. Remember to swap
the memory IC. It was not defective.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: February 08 2002
The Tech Name: Bernie Shelton

Symptom: Set is on for 10 min. then a loud "snap" is heard and
the set goes into shutdown.
Cure: Found fractured solder connections on T101, switching
transformer. Resoldered and restored normal operation.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO520HD, PRO610HD, PRO620HD,
PRO710HD, PRO720HD
Tip Date: January 30 2002
The Tech Name: Tony Perkins

Symptom: Intermittent red horz linearity shift on Cinema Wide
and HD screen modes.
Cure: Replaced Digital Convergence assy (AWZ6460/AWZ6461) and
swapped eeproms.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: January 21 2002
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: No video or on-screen, and the raster was bowed in on
both sides. Confirmed bowing by turning up the green screen
control.
Cure: Found defective video assy ( PRO***: AWV1799, SD***:
AWV1804 )
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, SD532HD, SD582HD
Tip Date: November 16 2001
The Tech Name: Tony Perkins

Symptom: Symptom: Picture flashes green until warm up, then
picture turns green. Crt and crt drive have been replaced.
Cure: Cure: Replace Video Assy ( AWV1799)
Models Covered: PRO510, PRO510, PRO710
Tip Date: November 05 2001
The Tech Name: Mike LaRocco

Symptom: Set is in shutdown mode. Diagnostic LEDs indicate a
problem in the vertical circuit.
Cure: Replace defective C909 or C911 on Convergence Amp. assy.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: October 04 2001
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Green flashes in the picture on all inputs except
component. Changed every board in the video path and unit
still had the problem.
Cure: Found bad EEPROM, IC2454, 24LC32A(I)P, on the Signal
PCB. Tech. transferred the old EEPROM to the new board and
consequently transferred the problem. {For future reference:
This EEPROM doesn't need to be forwarded to the new board. It
only stores customer settings.}
Models Covered: PRO510HD
Tip Date: July 12 2001
The Tech Name: Tony Perkins

Symptom: Composite input doesnt work. Component input OK
Cure: Found defective AV I/O Assy (Elite: AWV1802 or Regular:
AWV1807).
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: June 28 2001
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: Symptom: Yellow blotch in upper right corner
Cure: Cure: Mirror shifted in mirror case. Move mirror to
proper location.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: June 18 2001
The Tech Name: Mike LaRocco

Symptom: Picture has 2 lines ea. at top & bottom, 1/3 in from
sides; 10" x 1/8" with dashes. More noticable on dark
background.
Cure: Replace sub video.
Models Covered: PRO510, PRO610, PRO710, SD532, SD582
Tip Date: June 06 2001
The Tech Name: Bob Shoemaker

Symptom: No picture, No OSD.
Cure: Found Sub Video Assy defective.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: May 23 2001
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: Buzzing noise from power supply during high contrast
scenes.
Cure: Normal noise from the switching power supply transformer.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: May 14 2001
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: No sound from speakers and audio output jack.
Cure: Found 12v missing on AV I/O Assy (AWV1807 or AWV1802).
Cause: Pin 26 (12v) was corroded on the Video Assy (AWV1804 or
AWV1799)
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: May 07 2001
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: Will not go into AUTO PRESET START after going into
factory adjustment mode.
Cure: Reset the TV using MAIN POWER switch.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: March 14 2001
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: Wavy horizontal black and colored lines throughout
picture.
Cure: Found Digital Convergence (AWZ6460) defective.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: March 14 2001
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: Snowy picture on RF input.
Cure: Defective RF switch assy. (AWF1088).
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, SD532HD5, SD582HD5
Tip Date: January 12 2001
The Tech Name: Tony Perkins

Symptom: Set seems to have differentPCBs or different
convergence offset data from the information shown in the
service manual.
Cure: There are 2 versions fo these models. If serial number
begins with ****0, useservice manuals ARP3051 and ARP3047. If
serial number begins with ****1, use ARP3086 along with
ARP3051 and ARP3047. PCB assys are not interchangable! See
page 2 of ARP3086 for more info.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO710HD, PRP610HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: January 08 2001
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Horizontal centering is shifted to the right when
used with RCA DTC-100 satellite receiver. Dark vertical line
appears on the left side of the screen.
Cure: This RCA receiver outputs non-standard video signals.
Using the TV's service mode, adjust horizontal phase for 33MHz
to re-center the picture. However, the picture may then be
offset for other HD sources. Some DTC-100 units now have a new
menu that allows the customer to change the retrace timing.
Menu - #8 - There you can find various monitor settings
including retrace timing, picture centering and more.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD, SD532HD5,
SD582HD5
Tip Date: September 27 2000
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Convergence is very bad in full and 4:3 mode when you
first turn on the set. If you step through screen modes and
come back to full or 4:3, it is immediately OK. If you turn on
the set in any mode except full or 4:3, it is OK.
Cure: Change "Digital Convergence Assy" AWZ6460. Remember to
swap both EPROMS, IC1410 and IC1656. The set should need only
very minor touchup of convergence.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, SD532HD5, SD582HD5
Tip Date: September 22 2000
The Tech Name: Bernie Shelton

Symptom: Shuts down. D321 LED turns on.
Cure: Defective RED CRT drive IC (TDA6120Q). Check deflection
assy Q612 (2SC5043) shorted and R634 (10 ohm) burnt.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: July 17 2000
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: Blue will not move horizontally but vertically OK.
Cure: Found defective Digital Convergence Assy (AWZ6460).
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: July 13 2000
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: Multiple short scan lines in picture. Also in menus.
OK after 15 minute warm-up.
Cure: C226 on Power Supply Assembly. (Location B7, page 113.)
It is a filter in the 9V supply.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, SD532HD5, SD582HD5
Tip Date: June 28 2000
The Tech Name: Bernie Shelton

Symptom: Difficulty adjusting and saving "HD FULL" or other
33KHz settings in service mode (including convergence)
Cure: Service mode requires proper source to be connected to
INPUT1. See page 206 in the service manual, step 2. USE INPUT
1 ONLY! If adjusting for RCA satellite receiver (DTC-100), you
must have a 1080i input source connected to input 1. Use an HD
signal generator or RGB to component converter. Contact your
OTS for more info. Also check SI bulletin for pincushion fix
and mod.
Models Covered: PRO510, PRO610, PRO710, SD532HD5, SD582HD5
Tip Date: June 27 2000
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Horizontal line appears across the screen.
Cure: Electricity charged in high voltage section jumps into
IP BLOCK on the SUB-VIDEO Assy. This causes the PLL circuit to
unlock. Change a resistor and add a capacitor and possibly
re-adjust H Phase. R3270 (470 ohm) RD1/4PM471J and Capacitor
(2200pf) CKSRB222K50.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD
Tip Date: April 25 2000
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: One color out. If adj. screen, others cut off.
Cure: Replace drive IC, TDA6120Q or Assy.
Models Covered: PRO510, PRO610, PRO710, SD582, SD583
Tip Date: April 14 2000
The Tech Name: Bob Shoemaker

Symptom: Horizontal pin cusion in all or some screen modes.
Cure: Replace defective deflection assy. (AWV1809) Or see SI.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, SD532HD5, SD582HD5
Tip Date: February 07 2000
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: Remote control sensor doesn't seem to work. Buttons
on the front panel works.
Cure: Found poor crimping on connector near T12 (Signal Assy.)
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO610HD, SD532HD5, SD582HD5
Tip Date: January 25 2000
The Tech Name: Alan Sasaki

Symptom: No Power or Intermittent operation, then no power
Cure: Resolder regulator ICs 5601 and 5602 on video assy
(AWV1799)
Models Covered: PRO510, PRO610
Tip Date: November 23 1999
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

WOW!

Wish I had this kind of resourcing for all my repairs! At first I thought it would all be resoldering cold solder joints, and yes that accounted for many of the repairs. But as I read on I saw that there is a lot more there than just that.

Am saving for future reference.

BTW, swapping EEproms when you need to replace a board is the best way to retain all the work done up to this point on your geometry and convergence. They are the memory ICs, containing all your g & c work. Knowing just where they are on the board is the trick, and hopefully they will not be many-legged SMDs - surface mounted devices - which can be a real pain to unsolder.

Thank you Les!


Mr Bob

Very nice, Les. I can see two of these problems that fit perfectly on my 5 year old 510. My solution was to buy a plasma. :p

Symptom: Picture dark and slightly greenish.
Cure: Replace Video Assy.
Models Covered: PRO510HD, PRO-610HD, PRO710HD
Tip Date: December 20 2002
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Symptom: Set shuts down (convergence amp PD indication) or has
poor convergence on one color that can not be adjusted.
Cure: Check for poor or missing solder on G1, G2 and G3
connectors on the Convergence Amp Assy.
Models Covered: PRO510, PRO510HD, PRO610HD, PRO710HD,
SD532HD5, SD583HD5
Tip Date: April 02 2002
The Tech Name: Jeff Andrews

Tech came today and fixed the power board which was causing the set to shut down. He also ajusted the convergence in the service mode for HD. Years ago when the set was originally calibrated the tech was not able to enter into the service mode for HD because I had an RGB connection rather than component. Today, I switched to component so he could enter the HD service mode. The tech suggested leaving the component input. I had always thought the RGB was the better way. I noticed now I can ajust color levels where you can't on the RGB connection. Opinions as to the best connection for HD, RGB or component. My set is the 610. Thanks

I tried both RGB and components on my HD610 but component was brighter and colorfull. I would stay with component

Hondo, once again you've hit the nail on the head.

I was actually told by a Pioneer Customer Service SUPERVISOR that, after owning the set for 5 years, I should expect to pay expensive repairs on high-end products like the Elite. Balderdash! I have a relatively inexpensive Toshiba 35" set that has not had a problem in 10 YEARS!

The customer service response (and I use the term customer service very loosely in regards to Pioneer) is completely unacceptable. Almost as unacceptable as the bumbling inability of their service companies, WHO WERE IN TELEPHONE CONTACT WITH PIONEER, to diagnose the problem, let alone come up with a solution.

My wife has urged me to find a Class Action lawyer. If there is anyone else on this forum who would like to become part of a class action suit, say so. I have a couple of lawyers that I'm considering contacting.

DJ

Djguy, my Pro-710 has begun exhibiting this problem (lightening, then darkening, over and over again) this past week. I got it in 2000, when I was part of the "Pro-700 for Pro-710 trade-in for $1000" group. I'd be interested in being part of such a suit.

-Brett

I was going to live with the blue flash for awhile,while considering whether to replace the board or attempt to execute the repair. I don't have much experience soldering, so I was somewhat reluctant. However, the set starting shutting off rather frequently, so this weekend I elected to attempt the repair. A few tips for those considering the repair. Many of the connections are extremely small and close together. It is a necessity that you have a wet sponge and an exacto knife in order to be as precise as possible. It is also important when you remove the board to use a screwdriver that has been magnetized as those small screws holding in the board are very small and tough to find when they get away.

I found removal to be tedious, but fairly straight forward. I did not test the board for bad spots with the power on, as I have already had some extremely bad experiences with electricity. I removed the board (power board previously identified as the verticle board on the bottom right of the television), which consists of simply removing all of the connections that plug in and then all of the screws. As I mentioned the screws are very small and fall through the air holes in the frame when you drop them, so be prepared to move the television around and search for a dozen of those little screws.

You have to move all of the harnesses out of the way, and then the board pulls out quite easily. I was extremely careful in transporting the board, given that it has many heavy pieces mounted to it making it pretty flimsy.

I purchased a soldering kit that stated that it was specifically designed for working with small electronics, and I had two exacto knives handy. I also purchased some very thin solder at the hardware store that stated it was designed for use in small electronics. The total cost for all items was nominal. It was very thin, and ideal for re-soldering the joints. It was also very easy to work with, because only a very, very small drop of solder would be produced.

Originally, I was only going to resolder those points corresponding to the connectors, but once I got going -I ended up re-soldering almost the entire board. It took a couple of hours, but once you get a system going it was fairly simple.

I always approached with the solder from the direction that was the opposite of the closest connection. Some of these points are extremely close together and you have to be very careful that the two points don't inadvertantly end up connecected.

As I was going, I used the exacto knife to make sure that there was complete separation of any two close points. Anywhere that looked even remotely too close, I was able to reheat and use the exacto knife to ensure that there were no inadvertant connections.

It took 2 hours or so just to solder all of the points. I originally did not intend to, but there were 2 or 3 different areas that looked suspect , especially those areas around E5 and C204 (someone had previously stated that E3, 202 and 204 were the worst for them-for me it was E5 and 204). Additionally, there were a few other points scattered around the board that looked suspect, so in the end I ended up doing most, if not all of the board.

After it had cooled for awhile, I went back with the iron and the exacto knife to make sure there weren't any areas that might be too close. I feared that I might have touched something when I was working on a subsequent area, or that something might have shifted while it was drying.

I then reassembled the television, and left it on for 48 hours. I have yet to see the blue flash nor have I had the television shut off.

Tremendous success, and I sincerely wish to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread. Not only is the television functioning without the shutoffs and without the blue flash and loss of contrast, but the picture is the best that it has looked in years. I must have had the loss of contrast far longer than I thought, as the picture looks fantastic.

It may sound like a daunting task, but with some patience and precision it can be done. I would love to keep this set working for many more years.

Its been two weeks since my power supply board resolder and there have been no failures. So, I declare it a success! Good luck to others.

I must have had the loss of contrast far longer than I thought, as the picture looks fantastic.




Try cleaning the optics now.

Any Pio HDready set of the x10 generation became needful of optics cleaning several years ago for the first time, and by now your set will be needful of a second cleaning, under normal usage of several hours a day.

Your contrast between the lights and the darks will improve immeasurably, and the detail in dark areas will now be present, after not having been present for your eyes to see for years, if it has never been done since new. The "glow" around bright objects with black backgrounds will disappear once fully cleaned.

You will probably have to do the deeper optics cleaning as well, but you won't know until and unless you do the regular optics first.


Mr Bob

Today, other tech came and order part # AWV1872 for my TV.
Now, I am on Right track and no worry for another 4 yrs.. :cool:

I believe I am having the same problem but so far it is very intermittent. I certainly admire everyone's work in finding a resolution to this problem. I have a feeling it will help many more people to come.

Sadly, I am in the middle of moving so my 610 is in storage with most of my other things until the house is finished so I can't test the tapping method for another 6 months or so.

I am also a little peeved at Pioneer in their lack of customer service. These TVs may look amazing but that alone isn't enough when you spend 6k on one.



How should one go about cleaning one of these or is there somewhere I could be directed to find out how?

Thanks

How should one go about cleaning one of these or is there somewhere I could be directed to find out how?

Thanks


This is a reprint from an answer to a question in the Ask A Calibrator section at the SPot about a certain type of optics cleaner - one of the dry type, I believe - and whether it should be used on RPTVs:



My optics cleaning technique is to suspend ALL the gritty particulates that have built up over the years in liquid before attempting to do ANYTHING with them.

Lenses are usually made of plastic, and are extremely susceptible to being scratched. Even glass lenses can be scratched.

High voltage attracts the smallest of particulates to your optics, including smoke, and it is VERY IMPORTANT not to scratch your optics.

It is also important not to allow any of the liquid to go down into the space between the edge of the lens and the lens barrel. If it does, it will cause the inner lenses to fog up. There are usually 4 lenses in a stack, in each lens pack. 3 guesses as to why I know that...

So when you send your spray to the optics, you DIVE, DIVE, DIVE with your aborbent material to the lowest part of the lens surface, to make sure that doesn't happen - that the liquid doesn't penetrate to the lower levels of the stack, to the inner lenses.

The best stuff I've found for wetting the surface is an aerosol, because it foams up and doesn't run. Don't know what the name of it is, I've only used it a couple of times, when the customer already had it lying around. I usually use non-ammoniated Windex, or Glass Plus, and very very carefully. Non-ammoniated because of the first surface mirrors used in HDreadys. Don't want to be mixing aluminum with ammonia.

Once the mist has penetrated the contaminants and lifted the grit off the surface, a careful swipe in one direction only will get the critical mass of grit off the surface, to one side of the lens. A rolling motion as you do so, like a streetsweeper, is best and will very cleanly remove the bad stuff.

Usually takes several very careful swipes, all in the same direction, to gather and remove all the particulates - and you're done. Then one more very light cleaning swipe -

It is better to leave trace streaks than to rub till the surface is clean. Rubbing is VERBOTEN! Doing so will "scuff" the plastic with thousands of permanent streaks, which you will then rub harder and harder only to find out they don't come out, and you've just exacerbated the situation gravely. 3 guesses as to how I found out about THAT one...


As such, no I don't think these things are the thing to use, unless and until the surface is 99% clean already. I use pure wood fiber paper towels - not shop towels, which contain lanolin and will NEVER get your mirror clean - and the wetting materials mentioned above. On the outer lenses, the mirror, and the inner CRT coolant covers, where you remove the lenses to get to them.

This method has been doing it for me - and very pristinely - for years and years and years.

It's all in the wrist.


Mr Bob





Later:


Some further notes -


When you check ANY of the optics for contaminants, shoot your flashlight at the lens surface FROM THE SIDE. It never looks that bad when you hit it head-on - but Lordy, when you shoot it from the side, MAN, that's dirty...

I usually do just a quick bump from the back of one of my fingers - no more than 3/8" long - to the surface, just to see if that bump turns clear black, in the middle of the gray dust. If it is dirty, it does. If not - if that surface was black and remains black after bumping it with the back of my finger - I may just leave that surface alone.

On the lenses facing up, often to make my point in front of the client, I wet one finger - don't want to DRYRUB any gritty particulates - and draw a happy face in the middle. Viewed from the front at an oblique angle, with the flashlight hitting it from the side, that usually does the trick, when that happy face jumps off the surface at you, revealing how clear your optics are SUPPOSED to be...


If you are removing and going under the lenses, be sure and check the rear surface of the lens pack - the one the becomes exposed when you remove the lenspack, whose surface faces the CRT. It is usually full of smoke, and responds the same way to the "touch" test mentioned above.

When you shoot the Windex in there, be sure and clean the outer surfaces of overspray, before cleaning the lens itself. If you don't - if you just leave it - its moisture is trapped and will eventually fog everything up in there, after you have put things back together.

3 guesses as to how I found out about THAT one...

If you do it after cleaning the surfaces in question, more lint - and other new contaminants - fall onto the surface you just cleaned, than if it is the other way around.


I have found that the actual coolant covers themselves are usually plastic, tho I have seen glass ones - very expensive to do it that way - on Runcos and Pioneer Elites. You can tell by looking at the edge. If it is plastic, you won't really see that edge, it will be inside where the coolant is and not available to your view.

If it is glass, you will see the curvature end, and straight flat glass will go to the edge of the circular chamber, usually just over 1/4" in all directions.


I just completed this protocol on a 6 year old Runco 770 at Harbin Hot Springs last week, and a 9 year old Pioneer PRO-119 last night in Redwood City. The Runco had VERY thick dust on the entire lower half of its glass coolant cover, and its keeper couldn't get over how distinct and impressive the colors had become, later.

The response from the Elite owners was that they had NEVER seen it look that good, even when new. At 9 years old...


Naturally, the rest of my calibration protocol was also applied in each case, after hours of fine precision work.

But the importance of the light path remaining clear as glass in a projection system cannot be stated strongly enough. There are MANY surfaces to deal with in a projection environment, NONE of which exist in a directview environment.

EACH of those surfaces needs its own individual attention.

Especially in the face of the high voltage of the CRTs, which always wants to cause floating airborne contaminants to cling to nearby surfaces over time, hour after hour - multiplied by hundreds of hours of use over time - PER YEAR!

This is definitely an op that cannot be left to chance.


Mr Bob





Later again:


I just learned the name of the foam, which I think has been the same in all cases, just from the look of it.

It is SprayWay Glass Cleaner. Locally, it is available at Restoration Hardware, somewhere here on the Peninsula in the Bay Area.

Elsewhere, I do not know where to get it.



Mr Bob

Tech did change power supply board 3 days ago, and TV was on everyday more than 12hrs.

No More blue flash

Cheers!!!!!!!

It's been almost one month since power supply board changed by tech.
Problem is gone forever. But funny thing I had two times dream about blue flash.
But In real no more blue flash. I am praying when I am watching TV that Now, NO MORE BLUE FLASH..........

I know it's funny that I had blue flash on TV in dream.......... :cool:

I found this thread today while reading other threads about the new DLP's. It is amazing that so many people have had this problem. I had a service technician come out before I found this thread to try to fix the issue on my 4-year old 610, and he could not figure out what it was, although he thought it might have something to do with one of the boards. But the foks at Pioneer customer service acted like they were mystified about this problem and claimed to have never heard of anything like it before. I believed them, since before I came upon this thread, I had no reason not to. I am really pissed at Pioneer and feel they are either completely dishonest, or incompetent. I may choose to get a repair, but then again I may just buy a new TV just so I don't have to look at the Pioneer Elite name on the front of my set.

P.S. I've been away awhile, and I keep forgetting what an awesome resource this forum is. Thanks for all who have been working and posting to solve this problem.

Hello Folks. I also wanted to add my thanks to the people who took the time to correspond and provide insightful solutions. Although the focus seems trivial viewed against the actions in LA & MS, I’m compelled to give thanks to those who work collectively to provide benefit for those who seek it. I was an early poster who found the thread before a potential solution was considered. I left and dealt with the “blue flash, pop & fade-out” problem. Shutting the set down each time and praying it would come back on. I recently had to move the set to add a second line for the HR10-250 which, as a result of the vibration from the move, made my “PRO”-510 useless. It began to shut off more than it was on. I’m not sure if anyone else has experienced it but, the problem can become very frequent. After researching the Sammy 6768 and ready to roll the “PRO” to the curb, I figured I would check back with the thread to see if any progress was made. Nice progress folks- I performed the surgery (soldering) last night and it’s only been a short time but it’s amazing what $25 of soldering equipment at Radio Shack can do. “PRO” works and seems stable. Picture actually looks better. I checked all the connections but focused on E3, E5 (power harness connections), IC204 (per the techs download) and the ground screw that I think DJGUY mentioned. I was ready to trash the unit and figured I would give it a shot. After performing the soldering and getting positive results, I would recommend trying the procedure. The back cover has lots of screws, don’t be intimidated. The power board is a little tricky to get out only due to screw locations and it’s flimsy. Labels are on the board to find the trouble spots. Soldering takes patience but with proper heating (not overheating) of the items to be soldered and the solder, I was comfortable with the connections. I didn’t have any issues w/ bleeding into other ckts but used solder sparingly. Applied where needed (weak connection or open terminal hole)
Materials:
- Shop light
- Magnifying glass
- Soldering iron w/ a small tip (surprisingly, I didn’t need an ultra small)
- Small strand silver solder
- Wet kitchen sponge to keep tip clean and control heat

Thanks to all!

I found this thread today while reading other threads about the new DLP's. It is amazing that so many people have had this problem. I had a service technician come out before I found this thread to try to fix the issue on my 4-year old 610, and he could not figure out what it was, although he thought it might have something to do with one of the boards. But the foks at Pioneer customer service acted like they were mystified about this problem and claimed to have never heard of anything like it before. I believed them, since before I came upon this thread, I had no reason not to. I am really pissed at Pioneer and feel they are either completely dishonest, or incompetent. I may choose to get a repair, but then again I may just buy a new TV just so I don't have to look at the Pioneer Elite name on the front of my set.

P.S. I've been away awhile, and I keep forgetting what an awesome resource this forum is. Thanks for all who have been working and posting to solve this problem.

If you are not comfortable with solder then why not just buy new power supply card. Fix N Forget for another three years.

The back cover has lots of screws, don’t be intimidated.


Removing the back of the unit is OK. But DON'T REMOVE THE ANGLED BACK. UP WHERE THE MIRROR IS. The whole thing falls apart and your mirror nosedives into your screen, possibly breaking the mirror and definitely scoring the hell out of your screen!

There are special screws to keep you out. DON'T DEFEAT THEM! This applies to most PRO units, don't go looking for the exceptions.

Guess how I know all this...yup...



- Soldering iron w/ a small tip (surprisingly, I didn’t need an ultra small)
- Small strand silver solder

Thanks to all!


You need a medium tip for the kind of heat you need on this size connection.

But silver solder??? I have never used silver solder for electronics.

That said, I just attended a Mit training seminar, and they are now using LEAD FREE solder! You can't use std. 60-40 solder like we always have, on those ultra new circuits. And you can't use lead free solder on the circuits of the 510. One will not work with the other. Say goodbye to simply $25 worth of RS products...

It also will turn out with a dull finish when done like that, rather than the gleaming finish we all strive for in our solder technique at present.

In their DLPs, there also are no longer any single sided boards. The minimum board layers now are 2 - double layer, with feedthrus.

And there are some boards in there with 8 - count 'em, 8 - layers!

Things, they are a changin'...


Mr Bob

If you are not comfortable with solder then why not just buy new power supply card. Fix N Forget for another three years.

I am considering this, but I also have two small spots that have developed in the center of the screen. One is pink and is pretty visible, and the other is yellow, and is not too visible from normal viewing distance. A tech that came out to look at it said he thinks that there is some kind of burn in or something on two of the CRT's (Pioneer customer service had no clue of what was causing this problem either) and the tech said he thought both CRT's would have to be replaced (for $600 each). Thus, to make the TV fully functional again, it would be replacing the power supply card and at least one CRT, maybe two, for a total of about $1500?

I am considering this, but I also have two small spots that have developed in the center of the screen. One is pink and is pretty visible, and the other is yellow, and is not too visible from normal viewing distance. A tech that came out to look at it said he thinks that there is some kind of burn in or something on two of the CRT's (Pioneer customer service had no clue of what was causing this problem either) and the tech said he thought both CRT's would have to be replaced (for $600 each). Thus, to make the TV fully functional again, it would be replacing the power supply card and at least one CRT, maybe two, for a total of about $1500?



The pink one is probably actually magenta, or blue/red, indicating a missing spot on your green gun. The yellow one is probably actually red/green, indicating a missing spot on the blue gun.

If you go in and look at a white screen you will most likely find those 2 spots on the guns mentioned, when you look down into the lens of each one. Sometimes spots like this are visible without the TV being on, when you look directly at the CRT face like that while shining a flashlight in there, at different points of the CRT face.

If they are near the middle, chances are the sweeps died their normal natural death upon turn-off, but before the beam had lost its energy, and it stayed a bright dot for a little too long, damaging and sometimes literally vaporizing the phosphors - which are relatively delicate in nature - in that area. Sometimes the same thing happens and streaks occur, sometimes dashed streaks. Mit had a big problem with that back in the V10 chassis days, and had to replace many guns, sometimes all 3 guns needing replacement. I did a few of them.

I'm afraid I agree with the tech.

Sorry, I know that's not good news.


Mr Bob

If they are near the middle, chances are the sweeps died their normal natural death upon turn-off, but before the beam had lost its energy, and it stayed a bright dot for a little too long, damaging and sometimes literally vaporizing the phosphors - which are relatively delicate in nature - in that area.

That's basically what the tech explained probably happened too. Thanks for the confirmation.

I have had my set for about 6 years, so I consider myself lucky compaired to some of you other folks. I noticed about 3 weeks ago the same problem with the screen flashing and the contrast changing from bright back down to normal. I doubt I could get a service guy her to do the solder trick. I will probably wait till after Christmas to have the set repaired. I live in Tarpon Springs Florida, if anyone has had a tech come out ,and be willing to do the solder trick please let me know who you used. Otherwise I will just have that powersupply board replaced.

First off I would like to thank everyone who has contributed to this Tread. Especially Dave610 for the excellent instructions.

I carefully pulled the board off and took to a work table to do the work. Initially I just heated each of the solder points up to reflow the solder to make a good connection. After doing that I decided to add some solder to each. I did everyone of the "White" connectors on the top left of the board. I also did all the IC's which Had a Heat Sink. There were also about a dozen others that looked suspect so I did those too. I carefully returned the board and tested it out. I touched the same areas with the handle of the screwdriver and NO flickering/Blue flash. I has been 24 hours without a problem.

So for about $0.50 of solder and $2.00 of electricity the problem looks gone.

Having experienced the "blue flash" problem for a month or so on my 5-year-old SD532HD5, I decided to delve into the "fix"...one afternoon while my wife was shopping and not due back home for a few hours :-)

So I removed the PS board, set up my workstation with some good lighting, my trusty 40W Radio Shack med. tipped iron, and re-flowed the connections in a systematic manner.

I added some solder where I thought was appropriate, but mainly just re-flowed the existing solder. A couple of connections looked like cold joints, since they were a dull gray color.

I replaced the board and buttoned things up.

No more blue flash...yeah! BUT...after an hour or so...the audio and video shut down!

I unplug the set for 5 minutes, re-plug and turn on. Voila! Sound and picture! But after a half an hour...yes, you guessed it...no A/V again.

So I just turn the set off, figuring down the line that I'm going to have to shell out for a new PS board at least...IF I can even find one.

Soon the wifey gets home and turns on the set. I skulk off to another room and wait for the inevitable "Honey, there's something wrong with the TV" cry.

Which happens about a half-an-hour later, right on schedule.

Of course, I play dumb, not telling her what I had done while she was out.

I do mention to her that I had read a thread here that owners were having trouble with the power supply board in these sets.

We then discuss new TVs and I point out that we have had good use and much enjoyment from our Pioneer, but maybe it was time for a new DLP 1080p, which could be had for roughly the same price we paid five years ago for the Pioneer.

Not uttering a word, she gets the Pioneer SD532HD5 owner's manual out, goes to the Troubleshooting section, and TELLS ME to open the front panel, press the RETURN button, turn off the main power button, unplug and replug the unit.

Of course, the TV turned on perfectly and had been operating flawlessly for the last 72 hours...no blue flash, no intermittent shutdown...just glorious HD programming.

So now she thinks SHE fixed the shutdown and blue flash problem.

Maybe she actually did!

Thank you to every one that has posted here. Just sorry I did not find this thread earlier! I was just about to dump the set. PRO 510. This will save big $$$.

I too have had the bright/normal thing (just as discribed above) going for 4 months now. The local Pioneer approved service shop could not find the problem when called 3 months ago. My hands are not good enough to solder. So I just call the service shop to either solder or just replace the power board.

Again Thanks every body.

tmmuch -

Well, that's one for the archives. But then again, I HOPE the unit was not still plugged in when you went in. ALWAYS unplug an RPTV before going in! You would not want the cat to step on the ON button of the remote across the room while you are in there with your hands full of circuitry...

Replugging it in after you were done SHOULD have done the master reset you are talking about.

I thought you might have accidentally caused a solder bridge - which is when you inadvertently get too much solder in between 2 connections, causing them to short out against each other.

This is more likely to happen the more connections you do. So it's best to stick to what needs to be done and only expand where you really feel it's necesary.

Congrats to the wife!

Oh, and to you too...

:cool:

Mr Bob

tmmuch -

Well, that's one for the archives. But then again, I HOPE the unit was not still plugged in when you went in. ALWAYS unplug an RPTV before going in! You would not want the cat to step on the ON button of the remote across the room while you are in there with your hands full of circuitry...

Replugging it in after you were done SHOULD have done the master reset you are talking about.

I thought you might have accidentally caused a solder bridge - which is when you inadvertently get too much solder in between 2 connections, causing them to short out against each other.

This is more likely to happen the more connections you do. So it's best to stick to what needs to be done and only expand where you really feel it's necesary.

Congrats to the wife!

Oh, and to you too...

:cool:

Mr Bob


Yes...the unit was unplugged when I dug in there!

The reset procedure as described in the Owner's Manual, however arcane and unlikely it seems, got the job done...at least for now. Maybe that "Return" button degausses something...I dunno.

From whatever I've been able to decipher from this thread, there doesn't seem to be one definitive solder joint causing the flash, so I carefully touched up most, if not all, of them.

But my wife...I think I'll keep her.

If you are not comfortable with solder then why not just buy new power supply card. Fix N Forget for another three years.

It's been almost one month since power supply board changed by tech.
Problem is gone forever. But funny thing I had two times dream about blue flash.
But In real no more blue flash. I am praying when I am watching TV that Now, NO MORE BLUE FLASH..........

I know it's funny that I had blue flash on TV in dream.......... :cool:

But funny thing I had two times dream about blue flash.

Interesting, you had two "dreams" about the blue flash, and yet Pioneer (according to them) has not even had two complaints about the blue flash. I guess they're not staying awake nights worrying about it. :mad:

Interesting, you had two "dreams" about the blue flash, and yet Pioneer (according to them) has not even had two complaints about the blue flash. I guess they're not staying awake nights worrying about it. :mad:


The reason for dreams, I think, is I had blue flash problem for almost 18 months. So I fall in love with blue flash. and you know what happens in LOVE........Dreams........... :D

some of elite owners are very lucky that they found thread quick with brother GOOGLE......................... :p

Hello,

I posted my work 8-31-05. Just checking-in to let it be known I'm still problem free.

Thanks again to all who contributed to finding solutions & listing their finding on this site. My PRO510 has a second life and its owner is happy.

I too have a Pioneer set (PRO 510HD) with the "blue flash" issue. I contacted Pioneer more than a year ago and have had a service tech come out. Unfortunately at the time it never flashed while he literally stood in front of the set for an hour or more so he requested I bring the set in. Obviously that's nearly impossible. It's been doing the power-down trick for the last few months so it's definitely time I do something. So I emailed Pioneer today about it. This was their response when I asked them if they had any other reports like it or a recall. I also asked what they would to to help...

"There were no recalls on the listed model. There also were no noted problems with the unit."

That's it! That's all they saidl. So I replied...

"Odd since I know of several other owners who have reported this issue to Pioneer within the last year. Either way I still have an unusable set. What do you suggest I do with it?"

Haven't heard back yet. In the meantime I may just order a new power supply board and the service manuals (unless someone knows of a free pdf version of the service manuals) and replace the board. I don't like it, but I want my set back.

You can find a link to a pdf of the most useful parts of the Service Manual here:

http://www.keohi.com/keohihdtv/brandspecific/pioneer/pioneer_tips.html

direct link to the pdf:

http://web.ics.purdue.edu/~snyderje/610serv_man.PDF

Ya'll may have saved my 510. I have been having the blue flash (minor irritation) and the 'pop/shutdown' (major irritation). I got on this forum due to a frantic search to save my 510 after an authorized tech diagnosed problem as a bad transformer or a dying tube. After an extensive review of this forum, I had my business' mechanic, electrician, electronics wizard come to the house. We pulled the power supply card which he too criticizied as flimsy and 'old tech'; he did like the support frame it was on. Using the forum notes I printed, he quickly went to work and found exactly the
same solder problems that you all have detailed. The whole process took less than 90 minutes. Even though it's only been a few days, I have had no further problems and seem to have an improved picture. I'll try to post again in a few days.

Here is an outline of what he did:
1. resoldered pins 1 - 13 at E3 (1&2 were partiallt cracked, 13 conpletely)
2. TC (or JC) 202 & 204: area around them heat discolored and joints looked cold but intact - resoldered
3. E2 - resoldered partial cracks on pins: GND, GND, and 304
4. generally resoldered all connector pins

He strongly believes that primary problem was #1 above. Best of luck to all and thanks so much for your efforts.

Roger

With this kind of repair history, I am just glad Pioneer designs these things to withstand this kind of abuse.

There are other kinds of designs where if there is a non-connection in one part of the circuitry, it can cause problems in other parts of the circuitry which can then domino effect even further downline. One part can be deprived of voltage, causing another part to get too much voltage, and all of sudden damage is everywhere.

I once tried to fix a problem on a Phililps board of a Magnavox bigscreen, and because the owner did not want to spring for a new board, I spent 6 months trying to ferret out the problem. Never could. He finally junked the set.

On a Sony, I once forgot to reconnect ONE thin little black ground wire at the HV sample circuit, and when I turned it back on, HV had no path to ground and took out an IC halfway across the board - while leaving everything else alone - and damaged the power supply board beyond my ability to fix it, requiring replacement. Also blew the blue gun, requiring replacement and recalibration of that, as well. When I say be thorough about putting things back together in there, and DON'T DISCO ANYTHING YOU DON'T NEED TO, I mean it.

There are hazards in there we have no way of knowing about, and that's us seasoned professional repair people. I have well over 20 years in the repair end of things - not just in the calibration end, where there's more than 20 years under my belt also.

I know another tech who maintains all his own stage gear, and provides humonguously powered stage gear to the entertainment industry here in the Bay Area. He once sat me down and had me WRITE OUT a schematic, rather than just using a copier on it, just to teach me one thing about electronics that I had not quite achieved critical mass of knowledge on yet. He was fixing a Macintosh Audio amp once - a huge one, part of a rack of huge ones for stage use, you'll see them at concerts, banks of them, providing the tens of thousands of watts used in coliseum concerts - and pointed out why they were so easy to fix, all due to the designs they used that kept any damage strictly contained, and minus any bouncing around and/or domino-effecting to other parts of the circuitry.

Back then, Macintosh Audio used to provide seminars all over the country - clinics where you could bring in your amp, of whatever brand, and they would run a distortion test on it free of charge and give you a readout of its overall power level and at what power level it would distort. As far as their own amps, if it was broken they would fix it for you, also at no charge. I once saw one of their techs let out a shout, and 2 minutes later he was holding up a part in his hemostat - it was one tiny little quarter watt resistor!

That's all it takes to bring down a monster amp, BTW.

So while owners on this thread have every right to be upset about the customer service end of this whole thing, and while solder flow/manufacturing should have made their solder connections to last, rather than wearing out, let's raise a toast to the designers of the Pioneer bigscreens, where their designs allow us - even those of you with very little technical experience - to go in there and use the data given here to simply go ahead and fix them, right here, right now. Usually first time, and with no aftershocks. And a lasting fix.

Gotta give the devil his due. The design department deserves recognition. You wouldn't be that lucky on all brands.

Here here!


Mr Bob

If the Pioneer/Elite low-voltage card was designed/built like a MC-225, this forum wouldn't even exist :-)

Up until a month ago, I have had a love hate relationship with my Pro-610. After reading this thread, I'm glad to see that I haven't been alone in my frustration (it must be that whole misery enjoys company thing).

I originally purchased my unit in April 2000, and and in 2003 began to see the blue, fade, pop. After describing the problem to Pioneer in 2003, they told me that it must be something singular to my unit and also threw in the "it doesn't matter anyway since your warranty has expired" line just to make me feel better. Upset that my $6000 "top of the line" tv had only lasted three years, I was even more disturbed by the fact that Pioneer didn't even seem concerned about documenting the problem just in case other owners had a similar issue.

About a year an a half ago, I bit the bullet and paid a local tv repair shop to take a stab at fixing the problem. After $250 and still no solution, I was on the verge of giving up. Last month, in one last desperate attempt for inner peace, I tried another google search to see if anyone else was having the same problem. Needless to say it was a good day when I found this thread.

I just wanted to thank everyone here for taking the time to post their experiences-especially RABID11 for the detailed instructions on repairing the Power Supply board. The day after I found this site, I went to Radio Shack, bought a new soldering iron and commenced the operation he described. My TV has been flicker free for over a month, and for now, back in good grace.

I would also like to go one step further, however, and add my name to the list of folks interested in a class action lawsuit. While my repair worked, I'm no professional and it's anyone's guess as to how long it will hold up. Unfortunately, by making the repair, I'm afraid that I no longer have a defective board and from the sounds of everyone else's experiences, Pioneer would probably turn around and blame me for any defects to their "perfect" product. Oh well, so much for justice. Anyway, thanks again everyone for the help.

Add me to the list of people with this problem.

Add me to the list of people who fixed the problem with solder.:)

I very much appreciate the effort that many put in on this. It saved me a lot of hassle, and several hundred bucks, for certain.

As to the Class Action lawsuit, I'd say forget it. The lawyers will end up getting most of the money, and we'd be left with $500 coupons for Elite Plasmas. No, thanks.

So, my TV is back to working perfectly, but it doesn't make me feel too well, being left in the lurch on a $5000 set, warranty or not. I'll spend my money more wisely next time, I suppose.

Todd

Back when my problem first started the local tech actually asked me if the flash was blue and if there was a pop. At the time it was subtle enough that I couldn't tell him whether it was or not. I called a couple of days ago and had the phrases "blue flash" and "definite pop" added to my ticket (which they still had handy). I got a call back later in the day stating that they knew exactly what the problem was and told me a range of how much it would cost to fix ($200-$500). It's a range because he will decide whether to replace or resolder the board once he takes a look at it. I don't like paying to fix something that is blatantly poor manufacturing, but at least I'll have my set back soon.
I agree that it's nice that the rest of the set is built to handle the abuse. Pioneer must be like Chrysler - good design, poor manufacturing quality.

Please excuse my lack of knowledge - So I'm asking for help.

Background
Two weeks ago the approved repair shop took my credit card number but forgot to order the board -AWV 1795- so Wed I ordered it directly from Pioneer and call them to install - which they now say they will not do the install becaused I got the board myself.

Can I install it my self? If so can some one give me a few instuctions. I understand I should unplug the set and not mess with the "angled" back panel just the lower part. But where will I find the old AWV 1795 as I face the back of the set and is there any thing special I should watch or be specially careful not to touch etc. I am over 60, so I'm not too good at this stuff.

Thanks

I'm also a proud owner of a defective PRO510HD. I'm experiencing the dim, intermittent flash, intermittent pops and the latest issue: SELF POWER OFF!.

The unit is powering off at least once a day. I turn it off at the main front switch and allow it to rest before powering back up. Whent it shuts down, only the front red LED remains lit and no matter what you do it will not power up.

I plan to resodder the power supply PCB, but is there a specific PCB or component that is causing the self power off?

Thanks to all who have reported all there findings it has been very usefull and entertaining.

Please excuse my lack of knowledge - So I'm asking for help.

Background
Two weeks ago the approved repair shop took my credit card number but forgot to order the board -AWV 1795- so Wed I ordered it directly from Pioneer and call them to install - which they now say they will not do the install becaused I got the board myself.

Can I install it my self? If so can some one give me a few instuctions. I understand I should unplug the set and not mess with the "angled" back panel just the lower part. But where will I find the old AWV 1795 as I face the back of the set and is there any thing special I should watch or be specially careful not to touch etc. I am over 60, so I'm not too good at this stuff.

Thanks

It's so easy. Everybody can do it. Just follow instructions as in this thread.

1. Open Back of TV. Power board is right side of back.
2. Unplug all white connector softly
3. unscrew everything on that borad.
4. replace new board.

I will upload picture when I will get to home.

Pankaj2000

Thanks for your reply. Hope it is as easy as it seems in your instructions-

I have old fat fingers so handling the screws might be a challenge. Hope there are not too many. Picture would be helpful

Thanks again.

Jerry

GrandpaJ,

Why not call a local (not authorized) TV repair guy and tell him what needs to be done. I am sure they would come out and do it for a nominal fee.

It's so easy. Everybody can do it. Just follow instructions as in this thread.

1. Open Back of TV. Power board is right side of back.
2. Unplug all white connector softly
3. unscrew everything on that borad.
4. replace new board.


Any of this genre are completely out of warranty by now, so whoever you use, just make sure they know what they are doing. They do NOT have to be factory authorized - industry-speak for being a registered warranty station with that brand/manufacturer - to be excellent techs. Warranty rates are typically abysmal, and I for one do NOT do warranty work for any but a select few brands.


If you do it yourself, let me add one quick note to the above:

UNPLUG IT!

I kid you not, there have been times when even a seasoned pro repair person like myself forgets to unplug a set he's about work on!

And I don't mean just turn it off! UNPLUG IT! There are passive circuits still alive and waiting for commands in there whenever it is plugged in.

And you DON'T want your cat walking over the remote while your back is turned, if you DIDN'T unplug it!


Mr Bob


PS - I would be glad to travel to Ventura and do the whole thing for you, including a masterful calibration.

These units deserve the best treatment. Unlike most brands, Pioneer defaults their Contrast to midpoint on User, while most brands default it to max. Torch Mode.

As such, Pioneers are typically run all their lives at mid contrast light levels, meaning their CRTs are much younger 5 and 10 years down the line than most other brands, unless those other brands are owned and operated by videophiles, who know better.

You easily have another 5 years of life on your unit, if you have operated it under normal viewing conditions and operating times, of looking BETTER THAN NEW - and true videophile quality at all times - if cleaned and calibrated on a regular basis.

Keep it going!

Pankaj2000

Thanks for your reply. Hope it is as easy as it seems in your instructions-

I have old fat fingers so handling the screws might be a challenge. Hope there are not too many. Picture would be helpful

Thanks again.

Jerry

Some good suggestions. Also, look about midway back in the thread, there are detailed instructions for replacing the board. I'm not good at these kinds of things, yet I was able to replace mine. A few things you might want to be aware of ...

Once you have unplugged the set and removed the back and unscrewed the screws on the board, the board is still attached to the set by 2 screws you can't get to on the back of the board, you must shove, gently, the board up to clear those 2 screws.

Also, I bought a book of labels for electrical wiring from home depot and labeled all the connectors I disconnected. It would be easy to get confused as to what goes where when you install the new board. I put labels on the wires/connectors as well as on the old board where they connected ... so I could go back and look at it as I was installing the new board.

Handle the board carefully as it bends easily, which could damage it.

It took me about 30 minutes and, by working slowly and carefully, I was able to do the install with no problems.

Good luck.

Jerry

Mr Bob

Thank you for reply. I sent you a PM.

Jerry

Once you have unplugged the set and removed the back and unscrewed the screws on the board, the board is still attached to the set by 2 screws you can't get to on the back of the board, you must shove, gently, the board up to clear those 2 screws.

These are big guide screws on the wooden floor of the unit. They slot into the bottom of the board's metal casing, which you have to remove the board from, via many small screws. This carrier casing has lots of metal on the bottom, impeding easy entry to much of the soldering spaces on the bottom of the board. The board must be completely removed, including all screws except the big guide ones for the slots, for the resoldering at hand. Leave alone those big guide ones, mounted to the floor of the unit.

Be careful of the screws that hold the heatsinks on, some of them are insulated with plastic add-ons.



Also, I bought a book of labels for electrical wiring from home depot and labeled all the connectors I disconnected. It would be easy to get confused as to what goes where when you install the new board. I put labels on the wires/connectors as well as on the old board where they connected ... so I could go back and look at it as I was installing the new board.


That would be good on a Pioneer. Mit keeps EVERY plug-in labeled, in both the plug and its jack. Pioneer does not.


Handle the board carefully as it bends easily, which could damage it.

It took me about 30 minutes and, by working slowly and carefully, I was able to do the install with no problems.

Good luck.

Jerry


Good tips. A few pages back I did a big writeup on good soldering technique, for anyone who wants to do the soldering end of it themselves.


Mr Bob

Mr Bob

Thank you for reply. I sent you a PM.

Jerry


Got it. Sent you one back.