Found this interesting.

Was dubbing some films I had earlier recorded on VHS from Turner Classic Movies onto DVD (VHS connected directly to DVD recorder bypassing the 960). These are rare silent and early sound classics that have not been shown on TCM since and not available on DVD.

Those that were originally recorded when I switched to Cablevision of New York were fine. However, the ones taped before that were from a small local Satellite/Cable company which had video noise problems caused by the provider's scrambler. This was not apparent on the broadcast itself and the copies were still tolerable. Before dubbing these onto DVD I could see the noise appearing much worse than on my old, analog set and the picture itself was waving.

I assumed this meant the tapes weren't watchable at all, however, after reconnecting the VHS player to the 960 the noise was mostly cleared up and the waviness gone. Do you think this was because the limited VHS resolution was being output at 480p via component rather than composite to the 960?

Joe, you're probably right on with your thoughts of scrambling. What's most likely happening is the VCR is able to "track" the scrambled signal, but when outputting to DVD, the DVD expects to see clean synch pulses from the VCR and it doesn't get them, so it can't play the DVD. The scrambling is acting like a copy protection scheme.

Professionally, the way around this is to insert clean synchronizing pulses with a device called a "frame synch" in line between the VCR and the DVD recorder. Of course, these devices are broadcast-level, and therefore are not yet affordable to hobbyists. So your best bet is probably to wait until the movies are re-broadcast--which could be a long wait, but will eventually happen. Sorry I don't have better news.

Mark

Joe, you're probably right on with your thoughts of scrambling. What's most likely happening is the VCR is able to "track" the scrambled signal, but when outputting to DVD, the DVD expects to see clean synch pulses from the VCR and it doesn't get them, so it can't play the DVD. The scrambling is acting like a copy protection scheme.

Professionally, the way around this is to insert clean synchronizing pulses with a device called a "frame synch" in line between the VCR and the DVD recorder. Of course, these devices are broadcast-level, and therefore are not yet affordable to hobbyists. So your best bet is probably to wait until the movies are re-broadcast--which could be a long wait, but will eventually happen. Sorry I don't have better news.

Mark


Hi Mark,

Thanks for the feedback. I've been doing exactly what you've suggested over the past 2-1/2 years; re-recording those old classic films when being repeated by TCM. Even though I'm unable to dub most of what I collected on VHS, those older recordings actually look very clean and clearer than when I used to watch them on my older 32" analog set.... and I suspect the 960's upscaling and DRC has a lot to do with it.

Like most, I replaced my favorite pre-recorded VHS titles with pre-recorded DVD while saving money by recording others from both digital (only when in letterbox) and HD stations; recordings from digital stations appear exactly as the broadcast and more vibrant than any pre-recorded tape and even those downconverted from high definition look surprisingly sharp and colorful even when compared to the original source. Again, I'm sure this is due to the 960's upscaling process.:)

tvh3ad....I'm in Framingham and,if the set is as described by you,I'll give you $275.I can pick up in Newton.Let me know.Don't know how to use PM here.

Joe, you're probably right on with your thoughts of scrambling. What's most likely happening is the VCR is able to "track" the scrambled signal, but when outputting to DVD, the DVD expects to see clean synch pulses from the VCR and it doesn't get them, so it can't play the DVD. The scrambling is acting like a copy protection scheme.

Professionally, the way around this is to insert clean synchronizing pulses with a device called a "frame synch" in line between the VCR and the DVD recorder. Of course, these devices are broadcast-level, and therefore are not yet affordable to hobbyists. So your best bet is probably to wait until the movies are re-broadcast--which could be a long wait, but will eventually happen. Sorry I don't have better news.

Mark

Hi Mark,

Quick question: my brother said he would lend me his Sima which he used to descramble copy protection on pre-recorded VHS and DVDs. Do you think this will clear up those recorded pulses caused by that misfunctioning de-scrambler? Won't see him until August.

Hi Mark,

Quick question: my brother said he would lend me his Sima which he used to descramble copy protection on pre-recorded VHS and DVDs. Do you think this will clear up those recorded pulses caused by that misfunctioning de-scrambler? Won't see him until August.

Joe, I have no idea. Sorry. But it's worth a try!

Mark

Joe, I have no idea. Sorry. But it's worth a try!

Mark

Well, even if they have to remain on VHS, the picture quality is so much better on the 960 than they appeared on my old analog set that I can actually enjoy watching most of them.

I thought this would be the opposite since the older set was masking the difficiencies of VHS resolution. And not only does the 960 clear up the video noise but the wavey picture which was also apparant on the older set is hardly noticable.:)

You had an old wavy picture because of the macrovision copy protection that this type of setup used 25-30 years ago. IIRC, the sync was screwed up enough to where a TV could try and lock on to it (although many had the wavy pictures you speak of) while another recorder could not lock on it to copy it.

The 960 just is able to lock onto a weak sync/macrovision protected circuit - as every virtually every TV in the past 20 years has been able to do as well :)

$395 / best offer was how I posted to CL. Had not mentioned price in this forum at all.

FYI: the set eventually sold for $350.

You had an old wavy picture because of the macrovision copy protection that this type of setup used 25-30 years ago. IIRC, the sync was screwed up enough to where a TV could try and lock on to it (although many had the wavy pictures you speak of) while another recorder could not lock on it to copy it.

The 960 just is able to lock onto a weak sync/macrovision protected circuit - as every virtually every TV in the past 20 years has been able to do as well :)

Hi Beach,

Thanks for the explanation. The provider was Community Home Entertainment which is no longer in our area. They had a very poor system and even as late as 2002 only used SA cable boxs with a RF jack output through channel 3 (and only a few premium stations heard in surround sound). I didn't switchover to Cablevision earlier because Turner Classic Movies was at first unavailable and then available for an additional $10 a month.

The macrovision was so screwed up that even my 32 inch Toshiba purchased just eight years ago couldn't handle the distortion on my VHS recordings. So I didn't even bother watching those tapes on the 960 till this time and was amazed to find the picture so steady. All I had to do was adjust the wide-zoom vertical size in the service menu to get rid of the white line on the extreme left side of the picture.

There is currently a brand new one for sale on ebay if anyone is interested.

It's been on my watch list for over a week. The unit is new in the box, never used, and has no shipping; it can only be picked up locally in the South El Monte, California. Good luck to those living near by, the current single bid has been sitting at $499 for a few days with less than 3 hours to go.

Sold for $565 to a very lucky winner.

Sold for $565 to a very lucky winner.

Considering what I know about these sets having gone through a few as well as some issues out of the box, I would much prefer a used one with the remainder of a 5 year warranty than that "new" unit and a warranty that Sony will never honor as new.

I have a KD-34XBR960 and when I turn it on there is no picture and the STAND-BY light just flashes 7 times, pauses and repeats. Does anyone know what the 7 flashes mean? Is it like the Trouble Codes on my car?

I have a KD-34XBR960 and when I turn it on there is no picture and the STAND-BY light just flashes 7 times, pauses and repeats. Does anyone know what the 7 flashes mean? Is it like the Trouble Codes on my car?

I have a service manual on PDF, give me your email and I'll tell you when I find (Lost it in 1TB of crap).

I have a KD-34XBR960 and when I turn it on there is no picture and the STAND-BY light just flashes 7 times, pauses and repeats. Does anyone know what the 7 flashes mean? Is it like the Trouble Codes on my car?Here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=928945) is a thread that may help.

Here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=928945) is a thread that may help.
Thank You Very Much!!
Found the thread and the info.
Just turned the TV on and it worked fine using Component Video Input, but the HDMI Input displays a Black Screen, but the TV does display Video 7 and below that Receiver(which I think I labeled Video 7. Any ideas on how to fix that?
Guess I won't be turning the TV off again until I get the parts and find someone to install them.

Most of today's HD sets upconvert 1080i to 1080p. Models I've seen displayed in stores don't really appear as crisp or vibrant than the 960 but, of course, floor models are usually over-peaked and not the best of examples.

Would never get rid of my 960 but am curious if the 1080p feature is a drawback or if there is really little difference in picture quality between that and 1080i.

There's another 960 (http://cgi.ebay.com/Sony-Trinitron-Wega-KD-34XBR960-34-inch-HDTV_W0QQitemZ220268920557QQihZ012QQcategoryZ3320QQssPageNam eZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) available on eBay...

Local pickup, Venice, CA

Joseph,

FWIW, I think that you'll find that a lot of other 960 owners won't give up their 960s because the picture.

However, if you want 1080p, you've got to get a new TV. But, to truely appreciate 1080p, you need a LARGER screen size than 34"...

JHowever, if you want 1080p, you've got to get a new TV. But, to truly appreciate 1080p, you need a LARGER screen size than 34"......and a 1080p source device as well, I would venture.

Not owning a Bluray player yet, and thus only having 1080i source from TV, I'll keep my 960 until it dies (or I do). The Olympics pictures are absolutely STUNNING (might I add SHARPNESS=MIN and open up that discussion again??)!

Really have never seen color and 3D-like realism as gorgeous as this on any other set I've ever seen. I don't think anything but a CRT can produce this kind of presentation (and response to rapid motion, e.g. badminton). Night track events at the Bird's Nest, in-studio hosts and guests, beach volleyball venue, equestrian jumping, table tennis, badminton, swimming, track cycling, it just goes on and on. They really have figured out the lighting and makeup and clothing and studio sets required by HD cameras, AND IT LOOKS GORGEOUS!!!

I've said it before and I'll say it again... my 960 is really like a window peering through a space-warp to Beijing. No sense of TV at all. It's like 3D reality.

You'll never pry it away from my hands. For 1080i input, it's absolutely perfect for me.

Joseph,

FWIW, I think that you'll find that a lot of other 960 owners won't give up their 960s because the picture.

However, if you want 1080p, you've got to get a new TV. But, to truely appreciate 1080p, you need a LARGER screen size than 34"...


Please don't get me wrong, I will NEVER give up my 960 - it's by far the best out there, especially if its 34 inch size is not an issue (its fine for me since I sit less than six feet away from the screen).

Had a feeling the upconversion to 1080p was required to improve pictures on the more larger, flat screen sets (same is true regarding upconverting DVD players). With the 960's line doubler, DVDs outputting at 480p (with good source material) are stunning so I don't see the need for BluRay for the small difference it might make.

...and a 1080p source device as well, I would venture.

Not owning a Bluray player yet, and thus only having 1080i source from TV, I'll keep my 960 until it dies (or I do). The Olympics pictures are absolutely STUNNING (might I add SHARPNESS=MIN and open up that discussion again??)!

Really have never seen color and 3D-like realism as gorgeous as this on any other set I've ever seen. I don't think anything but a CRT can produce this kind of presentation (and response to rapid motion, e.g. badminton). Night track events at the Bird's Nest, in-studio hosts and guests, beach volleyball venue, equestrian jumping, table tennis, badminton, swimming, track cycling, it just goes on and on. They really have figured out the lighting and makeup and clothing and studio sets required by HD cameras, AND IT LOOKS GORGEOUS!!!

I've said it before and I'll say it again... my 960 is really like a window peering through a space-warp to Beijing. No sense of TV at all. It's like 3D reality.

You'll never pry it away from my hands. For 1080i input, it's absolutely perfect for me.

Absolutely right!:):):):):)

Regarding the sharpness control, I've done some tweaking with the service adjustments. With the user sharpness set to mid-point and edge enhancement at medium, I was able to obtain a more sharper picture with no grain by adjusting the MIDE to 51 (1080i) and 47 (480p), SYSM, SHOF, LTV at 3 for both and UCOF at 1 (1080i) and 2 (480p). Believe it or not, I'm able to raise the sharpness for both to 43 (clear edge medium for 1080i and high for 480p), in the PRO mode.

Joseph,

Agreed. If it wasn't for the fact that the 960 weighs almost 200 lbs... Otherwise, yep, it's almost perfect. And very few realize that. Thankfully, it also had 7 video inputs, including HDMI.

Heck, it got mine for as an open box item from Fry's for ~$340.

:D

Please don't get me wrong, I will NEVER give up my 960 - it's by far the best out there, especially if its 34 inch size is not an issue (its fine for me since I sit less than six feet away from the screen).

Had a feeling the upconversion to 1080p was required to improve pictures on the more larger, flat screen sets (same is true regarding upconverting DVD players). With the 960's line doubler, DVDs outputting at 480p (with good source material) are stunning so I don't see the need for BluRay for the small difference it might make.

Respectfully disagree my fellow 960 owner. :)

Real high definition like BD is well past a "small difference" even on "smaller screen" sets like these. You're missing out. :) Get a BD player, set it to 1080i like I have on mine and prepare for shock and awe. :eek: You'll really see what this TV is made of and is all about.

Respectfully disagree my fellow 960 owner. :)

Real high definition like BD is well past a "small difference" even on "smaller screen" sets like these. You're missing out. :) Get a BD player, set it to 1080i like I have on mine and prepare for shock and awe. :eek: You'll really see what this TV is made of and is all about.

If we review past posts, we'll find it's a mixed bag regarding Blue-Ray vs. standard DVD with those who own the 960. Some agree and some disagree on this issue.

BTW - do you use a switch box or an a/v receiver for two HDMI connections?

Heck, it got mine for as an open box item from Fry's for ~$340.:D

Wow. Got a 20 inch non-HD LCD for my mom that cost more!

BTW - do you use a switch box or an a/v receiver for two HDMI connections?

I do, I use a Monoprice 4x1 HDMI switch (v2.5). Over a year ago, I had to returned their 5-port switch for their new 4-port switch.

I was having a problem with what I determined to be a HDMI issue. After getting the 960's HDMI card/board replaced (Fry's extended warranty), I still wasn't able to use the 5-port switch with the Oppo Digital DV-981HD.

I was able to return the 5-port switch for Monoprice's new 4-port switch and everything (Oppo, DIRECTV HR20-700 and H20-100, and a XBox 360) works just fine!

Thanks to Monoprice for the excellent customer service.

So, if you're planning on getting one, make sure that it has the latest and greatest firmware. I just checked and Monoprice (http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=101&cp_id=10110&cs_id=1011002&p_id=4088&seq=1&format=2) has a new 1.3b certified 4x1 HDMI switch (REV.3.0) for $39.10.

:D

I do, I use a Monoprice 4x1 HDMI switch (v2.5). Over a year ago, I had to returned their 5-port switch for their new 4-port switch.

I was having a problem with what I determined to be a HDMI issue. After getting the 960's HDMI card/board replaced (Fry's extended warranty), I still wasn't able to use the 5-port switch with the Oppo Digital DV-981HD.

I was able to return the 5-port switch for Monoprice's new 4-port switch and everything (Oppo, DIRECTV HR20-700 and H20-100, and a XBox 360) works just fine!

Thanks to Monoprice for the excellent customer service.

So, if you're planning on getting one, make sure that it has the latest and greatest firmware. I just checked and Monoprice (http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=101&cp_id=10110&cs_id=1011002&p_id=4088&seq=1&format=2) has a new 1.3b certified 4x1 HDMI switch (REV.3.0) for $39.10.

:D


Yes, I might be. But is the built-in equalizer something the user sets or just an internal mechanism?

If we review past posts, we'll find it's a mixed bag regarding Blue-Ray vs. standard DVD with those who own the 960. Some agree and some disagree on this issue.

BTW - do you use a switch box or an a/v receiver for two HDMI connections?

Yamaha 2700 AVR. For me it's no mixed bag. BD kicks @$$ on the 960 like any other true high def source would/does.

Please don't get me wrong, I will NEVER give up my 960 - it's by far the best out there, especially if its 34 inch size is not an issue (its fine for me since I sit less than six feet away from the screen).

Had a feeling the upconversion to 1080p was required to improve pictures on the more larger, flat screen sets (same is true regarding upconverting DVD players). With the 960's line doubler, DVDs outputting at 480p (with good source material) are stunning so I don't see the need for BluRay for the small difference it might make.

With my PS3 on my XBR960, I like to play games in 720P for the reason that computer generated images and text benefit from the smoother image, but movies and general TV viewing are much better in 1080i; especially Jay Leno and the local news.

Yes, I might be. But is the built-in equalizer something the user sets or just an internal mechanism?

I'm assuming that it's something that's internal, as I never had to do anything with respects to my 4x1 switch.

I have a KD-34XBR960 and when I turn it on there is no picture and the STAND-BY light just flashes 7 times, pauses and repeats. Does anyone know what the 7 flashes mean? Is it like the Trouble Codes on my car?

I don't know if this is the same, but you might want to check out this thread (http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=32030&forum=34&start=0&select_page_number=1) over in the Agoraquest forums.

It's possible you might be having a problem with the D-board. Hope this helps.

Yamaha 2700 AVR. For me it's no mixed bag. BD kicks @$$ on the 960 like any other true high def source would/does.

I have the Yamaha RXV-1000 6.1 A/V receiver (needed to connect a separate amplifier for the extra channel). Great sound but was made prior to the commercial use of HDMI so it only has RCA and S-Video inputs and outputs.

Q, how do your standard-definition DVDs look upconverted to 1080i as opposed to 480p? While there has to be a difference between true 1080i and material upconverted to that resolution, is there any noticable improvement? Again, it's been a mixed bag on that subject but I also read on line that upconverting SD is only necessary for larger LCDs and not smaller HD CRTs (BTW - my cable box is set to upconvert standard-definition stations to 480p instead of 1080i in order to use the 960's wide-zoom which I really like).

Q, how do your standard-definition DVDs look upconverted to 1080i as opposed to 480p?

Very good. Obviously depends on the quality of the player involved. Earth shattering/night and day difference? No.


While there has to be a difference between true 1080i and material upconverted to that resolution, is there any noticable improvement?

Yes. It's the difference between real high definition vs. something that isn't real high definition. Upconverting DVD can look very nice but you can't "add" something that isn't there to begin with.

BD and other HD sources have higher bitrates, more lines of resolution, information etc. than a DVD does. I'm sure you know all this.

Maybe I have great eyes or something (not really), but I can be across the room maybe 10-12 feet away and I can always easily tell when a real HD program/source is on vs. something that isn't.

I typically watch at about 6-8 feet. Real HD is like looking through a window on this thing. I can't imagine a better picture although I wouldn't mind a bigger screen. ;)


Again, it's been a mixed bag on that subject but I also read on line that upconverting SD is only necessary for larger LCDs and not smaller HD CRTs

It's not true but frankly there's only way for you to settle this: Stop reading. Start seeing for yourself. :)

(BTW - my cable box is set to upconvert standard-definition stations to 480p instead of 1080i in order to use the 960's wide-zoom which I really like).

Whatever works for ya!

If this is the only HD you've ever seen then the day you get a chance to fire up a BD on your TV you're in for a real pleasant shock methinks. :)



Had a feeling the upconversion to 1080p was required to improve pictures on the more larger, flat screen sets (same is true regarding upconverting DVD players). With the 960's line doubler, DVDs outputting at 480p (with good source material) are stunning so I don't see the need for BluRay for the small difference it might make.

These kinds of comments suggest to you me you've never seen some of this stuff for yourself. I can assure that you are mistaken in that bolded statement. :)

Like DVD, you have good BD's and not so good BDs (re: BD's rushed to the market, not remastered the way they should be, etc.) Those subpar BDs you'd probably see less of a difference over upconverted DVD but good-great BDs will blow you away, guaranteed.

If there's any way you can rent or borrow some kind of BD player and a few BD discs and take things for a test whirl, I hope you can do it. You'd connect via HDMI and set the player to 1080i for IMO at least, the best results.

Hi Q and thanks for all the input.

I once saw a BluRay demonstration disc on a 42" Sony LCD. The picture was indeed stunning. The demonstration included showing the difference in picture quality between BluRay and standard DVD. But what I saw was a standard definition picture of much less quality than I was used to seeing -- smaller images appeared softer with less detail. I know my DVDs look so much better

My guess is Sony showed standard definition without enhancement (i.e., 480i, upconversion to 1080i or TV upscaling) to emphasize the up to six times resolution factor. While there is an obvious difference between HD broadcasts and DVDs (I've had cateracts removed from both eyes so my vision is now as good as yours LOL) the gap in picture quality is far less than that of the demonstration. Discs with excellent mastering (i.e., Star Wars, etc.) blow me away as well. Of course, that has to be attributed mostly to the 960 being a flagship HD monitor, CRT and only 34".

So it's not really a debate between SD and BluRay - I know Star Wars in Bluray would blow me away even further. But the difference (being played through the 960 and Panasonic DVD recorder) doesn't warrant the high cost of a player and discs at this time.

Ciao,
Joe

Hi Q and thanks for all the input.

I once saw a BluRay demonstration disc on a 42" Sony LCD. The picture was indeed stunning. The demonstration included showing the difference in picture quality between BluRay and standard DVD. But what I saw was a standard definition picture of much less quality than I was used to seeing -- smaller images appeared softer with less detail. I know my DVDs look so much better

CRT tubes are underestimated in this regard simply because, as you well know, you have this major push to move on to flat panel.

No doubt: Bigger screen = differences more readily noticeable and apparent, but that doesn't mean you don't get a real nice benefit off of a great set like our Sony 960's. :)



My guess is Sony showed standard definition without enhancement (i.e., 480i, upconversion to 1080i or TV upscaling) to emphasize the up to six times resolution factor. While there is an obvious difference between HD broadcasts and DVDs (I've had cateracts removed from both eyes so my vision is now as good as yours LOL) the gap in picture quality is far less than that of the demonstration. Discs with excellent mastering (i.e., Star Wars, etc.) blow me away as well. Of course, that has to be attributed mostly to the 960 being a flagship HD monitor, CRT and only 34".

No question about it. I'll continue to push you on this point, though: HD broadcast can't touch the best BDs or HD-DVDs out there.

You still haven't seen the absolute best your TV can do. ;)



So it's not really a debate between SD and BluRay - I know Star Wars in Bluray would blow me away even further. But the difference (being played through the 960 and Panasonic DVD recorder) doesn't warrant the high cost of a player and discs at this time.

Ciao,
Joe

Up to you, but I think if you actually saw BD running on your set at 1080i it would haunt you forever. ;)

... I'll continue to push you on this point, though: HD broadcast can't touch the best BDs or HD-DVDs out there.
...

Please explain how 1080i60 (unconverted HD broadcast) "can't touch" 1080i60 (maximum display rate of the 960, regardless of source). Put in practical terms, your statement sounds like nonsense...
Frank

A few words to ponder....

bandwidth

compression

macroblocking

Please explain how 1080i60 (unconverted HD broadcast) "can't touch" 1080i60 (maximum display rate of the 960, regardless of source). Put in practical terms, your statement sounds like nonsense...
Frank

The same way DVD (480i/60Hz) looks much better than digital SD cable (480i/60Hz)

this is the the same group those satellite companies go after with their "Who needs blu-ray...we are 1080p too" ad campaigns. :rolleyes:

Very uninformed people being taken for a ride. so sad.

You still haven't seen the absolute best your TV can do. ;) Up to you, but I think if you actually saw BD running on your set at 1080i it would haunt you forever. ;)

Callibration and proper user settings also help.

I know the excitement of finding out how much better the 960 can perform after tweaking some of the original factory service settings. While not having paid a professional for a thorough callibration (which might result in the absolute best) I was still able to greatly improve geometry, overscan, color decoding, focus and clear edge (based on other posts, Sony reference points and HD cross hatch patterns). Also stored the old INHD test patterns on DVR for user settings (with aid of blue filter glasses).

I guess the question here is whether the 960 is good enough to show the difference with Blu-Ray? Really?

Well, with a larger set, the difference between Blu-Ray and broadcast HD is definitely noticeable. And against DVD, it's night and day. As I imagine it certainly would be on the 960 as well...

And certainly a lot of the source degradation from broadcast HD, that's absent on Blu-Ray, would be apparent on the 960...(More forgiving of course if you sit farther away...)

Callibration and proper user settings also help.

I know the excitement of finding out how much better the 960 can perform after tweaking some of the original factory service settings. While not having paid a professional for a thorough callibration (which might result in the absolute best) I was still able to greatly improve geometry, overscan, color decoding, focus and clear edge (based on other posts, Sony reference points and HD cross hatch patterns). Also stored the old INHD test patterns on DVR for user settings (with aid of blue filter glasses).

All true. :)



I guess the question here is whether the 960 is good enough to show the difference with Blu-Ray? Really?

Yes. :)



Well, with a larger set, the difference between Blu-Ray and broadcast HD is definitely noticeable. And against DVD, it's night and day. As I imagine it certainly would be on the 960 as well...

And certainly a lot of the source degradation from broadcast HD, that's absent on Blu-Ray, would be apparent on the 960...(More forgiving of course if you sit farther away...)

All true. :)

I guess the question here is whether the 960 is good enough to show the difference with Blu-Ray? Really?

Yes if you use the component inputs with well shielded cables instead of HDMI. HDMI on this set is not implemented properly...there is an artificial softening effect that can't be gotten rid of. If you want the sharpest picture, you have the use the component inputs, which I do for Blu-ray. Before I discovered this, the difference between blu-ray and regular DVD was minimal. The set in general is about 15-20% sharper using component.

Yes if you use the component inputs with well shielded cables instead of HDMI. HDMI on this set is not implemented properly...there is an artificial softening effect that can't be gotten rid of. If you want the sharpest picture, you have the use the component inputs, which I do for Blu-ray. Before I discovered this, the difference between blu-ray and regular DVD was minimal. The set in general is about 15-20% sharper using component.

Now that's an interesting take. I compared the two with our HD cable box and found the component picture lacked the punch of HDMI (using HD test patterns for the best settings).

A few words to ponder....

bandwidth

compression

macroblocking

Susceptibility to noise is not a consideration in a "can't touch" comparison. Your statement requires the broadcast assumption that there is no macro blocking or bandwidth limitations, and only the minimum required compression, just as you will insist on a well-mastered BD source.

The same way DVD (480i/60Hz) looks much better than digital SD cable (480i/60Hz)

Thank you for supporting my point.

What you're recalling is that digital video is much better than analog TV, the comparison that made DVD a tremendous success. Today, I find it very hard to distinguish one digital source from another when both are 480i60 and under the same initial quality assumptions required above.

I'm still curious how you guys think equal data rates always look better in a 960 coming from one source than another ... more reliable, certainly, but always better? I don't buy it.

Frank

Susceptibility to noise is not a consideration in a "can't touch" comparison. Your statement requires the broadcast assumption that there is no macro blocking or bandwidth limitations, and only the minimum required compression, just as you will insist on a well-mastered BD source.



Thank you for supporting my point.

What you're recalling is that digital video is much better than analog TV, the comparison that made DVD a tremendous success. Today, I find it very hard to distinguish one digital source from another when both are 480i60 and under the same initial quality assumptions required above.

I'm still curious how you guys think equal data rates always look better in a 960 coming from one source than another ... more reliable, certainly, but always better? I don't buy it.

Frank

It's unfair to ask us to assume you are watching TV under laboratory conditions. The practical reality of broadcast TV is far different...

Who exactly is offering broadcasts of 480i at DVD bit rates? And Blu-Ray bit rates for video and audio are much higher than broadcast...

It's just a question of whether the 960 is good enough to show the difference and others here clearly believe it is...

That's interesting about the component versus HDMI output quality. I have a 960N in a box that I haven't used in a while since I bought a Philips 37PF9631D. I've been meaning to get the 960N out for a comparison but just haven't got around to it yet. My JVC DVD player could switch from 480i to 480p by pressing a button and I definitely preferred the 480p of the player versus the upscaled 1080i of the TV though by using DRC I could get them pretty close. However, the 480p just looked smoother as well as more detailed.

Since I now have both a HD-DVD and a Blu-ray player maybe I'll take a look at the 960N's HDMI picture quality. HDMI implemented in the Philips LCD definitely gave the edge in picture quality to HDMI versus component on my Toshiba HD-A2.

JGD

This is my experience and observations - yours may vary.

DVI circuits on the 910 (designed 2003) and HDMI on the 960, a set which uses circuits/chips designed in early 2004, are sadly lacking. It seems that the newer HDMI circuits have the technical know how that was lacking in the pre- mid 2006 era. I find most sets and devices designed prior to roughly mid-2006 lacking in design of the HDMI circuit and component looks better (remember most SA cable boxes/dvrs also fall into this pre 2006 category - the newer cable card boxes are updated).

Here's a way to prove it with the 960. Connect a cable STB with an IEEE 1394 output to the 960. Switch between it and HDMI. For me, the HDMI is softer and leaves you with a "thin veil of fog" on the picture. The IEEE 1394 ports/circuits were much more mature than the other digital types when this set was designed. It strips away this "light fog" on the picture and gives you more clarity.

I have no doubt that accessory items mentioned from the last 2 years for the most part have better HDMI circuits in them and thus deliver a better quality picture than we saw with the Q1 2004 design. However, the Sony still has an inferior HDMI circuit.

Thus again, I thought it was pretty well known that component looked better than HDMI (though cable card looks the best and followed closely by IEEE 1394).

Thus again, I thought it was pretty well known that component looked better than HDMI (though cable card looks the best and followed closely by IEEE 1394).

Interesting.

You're actually the first I've heard this from. Have you had each input calibrated?

Originally Posted by RWetmore:

"If you want the sharpest picture, you have the use the component inputs, which I do for Blu-ray. Before I discovered this, the difference between blu-ray and regular DVD was minimal. The set in general is about 15-20% sharper using component."

The drawback is that component cannot output a 480i DVD upconverted to 1080i. Was there no difference between 480p (via component) and upconverted 1080i (via HDMI)?

I find most sets and devices designed prior to roughly mid-2006 lacking in design of the HDMI circuit and component looks better (remember most SA cable boxes/dvrs also fall into this pre 2006 category - the newer cable card boxes are updated).

I have no doubt that accessory items mentioned from the last 2 years for the most part have better HDMI circuits in them and thus deliver a better quality picture than we saw with the Q1 2004 design. However, the Sony still has an inferior HDMI circuit.


Yes, I noticed an immediate improvement in picture quality between the older (off the shelf) SA 4200 HD box compared to a brand new (in-box) SA 8300 when upgrading to DVR in January, 2006. But I also noticed the component picture paled in comparision to HDMI (no matter how much adjustment was made using HD test patterns).

Even though my 960 was manufactured in May, 2005 could any improvements have been made to the HDMI circuitry compared to earlier models?

It's unfair to ask us to assume you are watching TV under laboratory conditions. The practical reality of broadcast TV is far different...

Who exactly is offering broadcasts of 480i at DVD bit rates? And Blu-Ray bit rates for video and audio are much higher than broadcast...

It's just a question of whether the 960 is good enough to show the difference and others here clearly believe it is...

The parameters of the comparison are not mine; I understand the practical issues, but they were excluded by the OP. The salient point is that 1080i60 is 1080i60 is 1080i60. Starting with a 1080p24 signal won't get you any better image than the best 1080i60 on these CRTs, regardless of initial bit rate.

Belief is irrelevant, beyond the choice of whom you believe, especially in factual situations. I question opinions that are counter to the facts to see what the poster is really saying.

Frank

The parameters of the comparison are not mine; I understand the practical issues, but they were excluded by the OP. The salient point is that 1080i60 is 1080i60 is 1080i60. Starting with a 1080p24 signal won't get you any better image than the best 1080i60 on these CRTs, regardless of initial bit rate.

Belief is irrelevant, beyond the choice of whom you believe, especially in factual situations. I question opinions that are counter to the facts to see what the poster is really saying.

Frank


1080/24? (Not the kind of bit rate difference I was referring to...I'm talking about, for example, ATSC vs Blu-Ray rates. A key factor actually being compression...)

I hope we get away, generally, from the idea that DVD is good enough. DVD looks quite flat and boring in comparison to Blu-Ray. And I will certainly try to avoid renting or purchashing DVDs in the future, if there is any prospect of being able to get the same on Blu-Ray. (Have you seen the new 2001 on Blu-Ray or Casino Royale -- it's amazing looking.)

With its standout blacks and contrast ratio, the 960 remains an excellent display. And it just seems a shame to waste it on DVDs... :)

Yes, I noticed an immediate improvement in picture quality between the older (off the shelf) SA 4200 HD box compared to a brand new (in-box) SA 8300 when upgrading to DVR in January, 2006. But I also noticed the component picture paled in comparision to HDMI (no matter how much adjustment was made using HD test patterns).

Even though my 960 was manufactured in May, 2005 could any improvements have been made to the HDMI circuitry compared to earlier models?

1) The SA8300HD does not have a great HDMI circuit - it is 2004/2005 era design, but it was better than the 4200. The only HDMI circuit change to the SA8300HD came when they went to the HDC, which again, is a 2006+ design. As you found out, it starts with quality at the source, but the HDMI connection of the 960 has been known to be lacking.

2) No, all 960s have the same circuits except for the picture tube and Sony even states as such on their ESI support pages. They are considered the same set (with interchangable picture tubes) in Sony's eyes.

I don't own the XBR960 model, but i do own the HS420 model and on my set there is a clear difference in sharpness using HDMI over component, it's not drastic but it's a bit sharper overall. keep in mind that by default some of the service menu settings used for HDMI have softening filters on under the MID5 section in the service menu, disabling these blur filters will greatly affect how sharp the HDMI input will get.

1) The SA8300HD does not have a great HDMI circuit - it is 2004/2005 era design, but it was better than the 4200. The only HDMI circuit change to the SA8300HD came when they went to the HDC, which again, is a 2006+ design. As you found out, it starts with quality at the source, but the HDMI connection of the 960 has been known to be lacking.

2) No, all 960s have the same circuits except for the picture tube and Sony even states as such on their ESI support pages. They are considered the same set (with interchangable picture tubes) in Sony's eyes.

Hi Beach,

Know of any improvements to the SA 8300HD since 2006?

Hi,

I recently did the anti-reflective coating remouval procedure. I had to take the TV apart.
The layer of plastic came off well, but when I re-assembled my tv, all the colors and luminosity is screwed up, the screen is now un-viewable. It cant be fixed by the main image settings, but i noticed the problem diminish when i lower the brightness to zero.

Anything obvious to you? Did a connector not go back in right? What else could have happened (could have been damaged)?. Do I need recalibration or am I screwed?

Let me know if you have any advice (other than not opening a 220lbs TV) ;)
Thanks!

Hi,

I recently did the anti-reflective coating remouval procedure. I had to take the TV apart.
The layer of plastic came off well, but when I re-assembled my tv, all the colors and luminosity is screwed up, the screen is now un-viewable. It cant be fixed by the main image settings, but i noticed the problem diminish when i lower the brightness to zero.

Anything obvious to you? Did a connector not go back in right? What else could have happened (could have been damaged)?. Do I need recalibration or am I screwed?

Let me know if you have any advice (other than not opening a 220lbs TV) ;)
Thanks!When you say, "take the TV apart", how apart was it? Did you mess with anything at the gun end of the crt? There are physical adjustments there that will create MAJOR problems if knocked out of alignment. I would suggest you go back in and make sure everything is reconnected that you disconnected. Have you checked your input cables?

Hi,

Thanks for the response, i took it apart enough to remove the tube completely.
I guess its possible that some physically adjustments got moved at the gun end. I will check everything again. Any way to get a schematic of what should be where? What kind of MAJOR problems are we talking about, something that a pro can re-calibrate, or could it results in parts needing to be replaced? The picture looked great before. I don't if it has to do with the input cable as even the input display label is all out of focus and saturated in the top left corner. There are a few things that can be manually turned, i tried them all (putting them back to the original position afterwards), and nothing seems to be changing the picture at all. Would a picture help of the image help? Basically everything is saturated and bleached all out of focus.

Hi,

Thanks for the response, i took it apart enough to remove the tube completely......:eek: That takes big brass ones.
The service manual has about 20 pages of specific wire dressing details. If you removed or bumped the deflection yoke and/or focus neck assembly, you may need a professional to realign them.

i thought that was the only way to remove this defective plastic layer. Sony would do nothing about it.
ANyways, I followed your advice, re-checked the cabling with the service manual, and a blue wire was off, so i re-soldered it, and it works!
Thanks for the pointers!!!!Really appreciated!

Hi Beach,

Know of any improvements to the SA 8300HD since 2006?

Re-Read #6056.

Unfortunately, the SA8300HDC has serious other issues.

2) No, all 960s have the same circuits except for the picture tube and Sony even states as such on their ESI support pages. They are considered the same set (with interchangable picture tubes) in Sony's eyes.

Last Update
8/15/2006 Event ID
E30048388 Model
KD34XBR960N, KD34XS955N, KV34HS420N
Subject
What is this model



SYMPTOMS

Where is the service info on this ?

RESOLUTION

Same as none N model.
The N stands for non AR film CRT.
There were two different types of CRT's that were used.
The coating on the glass was different.
During early production they used a AR film coating, then they switched to an non AR coating type of CRT.

The CRT available in WRPC will be the non coated type once they run out of the coated type. Unless they are replacing the CRT there is no difference, and even if the CRT is replaced the customer should not see a difference.
For all practical reasons all KV34HS420, KD34XBR960, KD34XS955 are N Models.

MORE INFORMATION

Unit/Model Details

Links



Unit/Model Detail

Unit(s): SN Start SN End Factory Family Name Product Category
KD34XBR960N SEE SM SML DA4 TVP
KD34XS955N 4000318 4000318 SML DA4 TVP
KV34HS420N 4000953 4000953 SML DA4 TVP

Re-Read #6056.

Unfortunately, the SA8300HDC has serious other issues.

Thanks Beach, sorry for the inconvenience.

- Joe

I've had my 960 since November 2006 and have been thrilled with its performance. However, several months ago I noticed a tiny shadow (maybe 2” high, 1” wide) on the lower left side of the screen (maybe 5” from the bottom). Against a pure white background the shadow looks gray, but on a pure colored background the shadow takes on a colored tinge. This phenomenon has gotten worse over time with the shadow getting slightly larger, another one appearing a few inches higher and a third one starting on the right side of the screen. Does anyone know what is causing this and how I might be able to correct it or at least stop its progress? I could really use some help now as my 2 year factory warranty expires in late November. Thanks in advance for your replies.

Fred

I've had my 960 since November 2006 and have been thrilled with its performance. However, several months ago I noticed a tiny shadow (maybe 2” high, 1” wide) on the lower left side of the screen (maybe 5” from the bottom). Against a pure white background the shadow looks gray, but on a pure colored background the shadow takes on a colored tinge. This phenomenon has gotten worse over time with the shadow getting slightly larger, another one appearing a few inches higher and a third one starting on the right side of the screen. Does anyone know what is causing this and how I might be able to correct it or at least stop its progress? I could really use some help now as my 2 year factory warranty expires in late November. Thanks in advance for your replies.

Fred

Well, if it was just the left, it could have been that the landing needs adjusting, but as you note the color tinging that is getting worse it most likely is an Apeture Grill Failure in the tube.

These are most common on the triniton tubes in the lower left hand side of the tube and the upper right, but can happen anywhere.

Its not uncommon. If you did not have a warranty, it would be about a $1500 job - in fact, they might try to give you a credit on a new TV.

Suddenly noticed a quarter-inch horizontal overlap of the picture on the right side of the screen when watching non-HD material in the zoom and wide zoom modes via the HDMI. Unplugged the 960 for about five minutes but the distortion was still there. Hoped it was due to the cable company but adjusting the service mode horizontal position further right accomplished nothing. Was able to eliminate it by increasing the horizontal size by one digit (made it two just to play it safe).

Decreasing the horizontal size further toward zero (shrinking the picture) increased the overlap proportionatly.

Is this an indication that a problem could be brewing or could a slight overlap naturally develop over time necesistating an adjustment in horizontal size? Also, is there a service code that could simply eliminate overlap in the NON-HD zoom modes? Again, no overlapping appeared in full-screen HD HDMI (or component video from the DVD player in video 5).

FYI - when adjusting geometry in the past I don't believe I ever noticed an overlap of the picture - just too much shrinkage left and right.

UPDATE:

This evening I again reduced the horizontal size to see if the overlap on the right was still there. It was, but I could not tell if it was still an overlap or just a thin white line down the edge of the right side.

Unlike yesterday, the overlap (or white border?) did not increase as the horizontal size was further reduced (the line stayed proportionate alongside the edge of the picture). I was also able to decrease the horizontal size more than yesterday before it began to appear.

Is it possible this is being caused by the cable provider (scrambling system, etc.?) and picked up by the 960 because the overscan was set so close to 0%?

In any case, this weekend I plan to redo my wide-zoom service settings since a slightly altered horizontal size could slightly affect overall geometry.

Again, thanks in advance for any help that could be provided.

- Joe

2nd UPDATE:

Tonight again decreased the horizontal size of the SD picture and the distoration, which began as an overlap and changed to a bright line the next day, no longer appears.

Although slight expansion of the horizontal size covered up the distortion (while retaining proper overscan settings) I was still concerned that if there was an acutal problem with my set, it would eventually get worse, no matter how much I adjusted the horizontal. Now my guess is it was not a manufacturing defect (because the 960 is not like HAL and capable of diagnosing and repairing the problem itself) but rather work done by the cable provider which would not be noticed on monitors where the overscan percentage wasn't close to zero.

Do you think my hunch is right or mere wishful thinking?

FINAL UPDATE:

It's not the 960.

Local provider must have been doing something with its scrambling system. That thin white line seen on the right (non-HD stations only) is only noticable when compressing the horizontal size of the picture on the cable feed - it's not there doing the same for OTA. Had the line and overlapping not been so pronounced last Tuesday (the provider made some sort of adjustment the next day) I would not have known it ever existed and not have worried something was wrong with the set.

Hi,

I am a happy owner of a sony KD-XS955 (now that the anti-glare layer is off).
I wanted to get an opinion from the members and owners of this TV about inputs and PQ.

Basically my questions are:

1) What looks better on this TV (or at least what should technically be better from your experience or the specs), using HDMI (with a 3 port HUB) or the components? I use a PS3, HD cable box, and computer to this TV.

2) I'll be having a ISF technician come over to calibrate my set tomorrow. He has not done this particular TV, but many Sony direct TVs. Is there anything I should specifically ask him to check and calibrate that may get overlooked?

3) As this is my first time getting my set calibrated, what are the things that I need to make sure is done?

My first question is also relevant to how I calibrate which inputs to what devices.

Thanks in advance!

In my experiences:
1.) Component looks better than HDMI(FWIW, mine is a 6/04 build date). I use it for Xbox360, HD-DVD and PS3. What I mean by better is it is sharper and not as dark. My calibrator(ChadB) recommended using component as well.

2.) Ask your calibrator if he can align the edges of the screen with magnets. Mine was a bit off and took almost 3 hours to get it straight.

3.) Have the TV on for about a 30mins before your calibrator comes. Clear away any loose wires, make sure the room is the lighting conditions that you would normally want when watching TV.

Question to you...How about commenting on your TV when it had the anti-glare coating vs. without it? Thanks!

Is it worth trying a used 34xbr960 for $450 with no insurnace it wont dump on day two......-or-......a 40xbr700 that although also used was offered with a 30day return if it dumps on me or has any real issues for full refund for $350?
Or a new Vizio VP322 with factory warranty for $512?
--this is for bedroom set

In my experiences:
1.) Component looks better than HDMI(FWIW, mine is a 6/04 build date). I use it for Xbox360, HD-DVD and PS3. What I mean by better is it is sharper and not as dark. My calibrator(ChadB) recommended using component as well.

2.) Ask your calibrator if he can align the edges of the screen with magnets. Mine was a bit off and took almost 3 hours to get it straight.

3.) Have the TV on for about a 30mins before your calibrator comes. Clear away any loose wires, make sure the room is the lighting conditions that you would normally want when watching TV.

Question to you...How about commenting on your TV when it had the anti-glare coating vs. without it? Thanks!


I only know of 1 ISF calibrator who will open up a 34XBR960 and attempt to play with the magnets.

Is it worth trying a used 34xbr960 for $450 with no insurnace it wont dump on day two......-or-......a 40xbr700 that although also used was offered with a 30day return if it dumps on me or has any real issues for full refund for $350?
Or a new Vizio VP322 with factory warranty for $512?
--this is for bedroom set

How much space do you have? If the 960 will fit without you bumping into it or have to climb over stuff to move around then it is worth it.

I only know of 1 ISF calibrator who will open up a 34XBR960 and attempt to play with the magnets.

The other option to that would be to either take the set to an authorized TV repair center or have them come to you. I inquired about having my 24" Sony CRT getting aligned at a Sony authorized TV repair center and they said they can do it. They don't do ISF calibrations, nor did they seem to know much about it, so I would have an ISF certified person come to do it. Chad is only in my area about once or twice a year and unfortunatley, my scheduling couldnt be met with his the last 2 times. Yes, it would require more money and time to do, but if someone is serious about getting their 960 to it's full potential, I feel it's worth it.

How much space do you have? If the 960 will fit without you bumping into it or have to climb over stuff to move around then it is worth it.

Space is not concern, just throwing $500 away on the 960 if it craps out on me within a year or less.

Space is not concern, just throwing $500 away on the 960 if it craps out on me within a year or less.

I understand. I don't have $500 to throw away so I know where you're coming from. Since I own a 960 I'm biased to say go for it.

As a side note D Mc and crew will be 12-4 while pimp slapping TO on their way to the division championship. :cool:

What does the 34xbr960 have over the 40xbr700?(PQ, connections, etc.)
Can't find much info at all on the 40xbr700.

What does the 34xbr960 have over the 40xbr700?(PQ, connections, etc.)
Can't find much info at all on the 40xbr700.

I think the 700 is a 4:3 compared to the 960 16:9. I don't think the 700 has an HDMI input but I could be wrong.

Scratch it all and sorry for all the OT.
Just committed to a 36XBR800almost half the money and this is a bedroom set. Also this is in my city and not a 45 minute drive to another city.(philly)
Thanks for your help John.

Scratch it all and sorry for all the OT.
Just committed to a 36XBR800almost half the money and this is a bedroom set. Also this is in my city and not a 45 minute drive to another city.(philly)
Thanks for your help John.

I assume you are planning on watching, primarily, non-widescreen content...

No, primarily the other way around, but in 16:9 mode the 34xbr960 is less than 1" wider and only .5" higher, only 5.9% more screen.
The gas saved and the 2 and change instead of 4 and a half are my main reasons....but I did check 16:9 real estate on the two. :)
I am also getting the stand the xbr800 came with from sony for free, where as the one in Philly had no stand.

I know the PQ will be inferior, no doubt, but for the money and effort invloved that's o.k. and it will still look good after I calibrate it.

If the 960 was local I possibly would buy that instead, especially if he would go lower than the almost 5 bills it would have cost me with gas and tolls.
This is jus tan extra tv that will see not much use but still wanted a good picture.

Scratch it all and sorry for all the OT.
Just committed to a 36XBR800almost half the money and this is a bedroom set. Also this is in my city and not a 45 minute drive to another city.(philly)
Thanks for your help John.

Anytime.

How does one remove the anti-glare coating on these sets. I have a 36xs955 and do find the picture dark.

How does one remove the anti-glare coating on these sets. I have a 36xs955 and do find the picture dark.

I think that was an extra feature of the 960. I don't think we have one like it on the 36xs955

Saw some others doing this, so figured it was kosher:

I'm selling my XBR960 along with a Bell'O audio/video stand (glass/metal). Both purchased around August '04.

Set still has an extended warranty on it (through Tweeter) to late October 2009.

Set has not been professionally calibrated (only what my eye thought looked best), though I'm not one for high brightness or saturated colors. Set has no marks or dents on it, it's been lovingly cared for.

Available for pickup in Boston area.

PM me if interested.

Saw some others doing this, so figured it was kosher:

I'm selling my XBR960 along with a Bell'O audio/video stand (glass/metal). Both purchased around August '04.

Set still has an extended warranty on it (through Tweeter) to late October 2009.

Set has not been professionally calibrated (only what my eye thought looked best), though I'm not one for high brightness or saturated colors. Set has no marks or dents on it, it's been lovingly cared for.

Available for pickup in Boston area.

PM me if interested.

That's somebody else's set, right?. Would feel sad if you were selling your 960 since you were the first to congratulate me upon my purchase of the 960 back in August of 2005.

Hi everyone,

I have a 960 that is having a strange issue. All of the on-screen menus, including volume, the show that's on, input, etc. do not display any text. The translucent grey background comes up where the display should be, but that's it. I can't even tell what channel I'm on.

I suppose it could be worse, as the set is otherwise functional, but it's still rather annoying. Especially since it happened briefly once before, when it was under warranty. It never recurred, so I never called to have it checked.

Any ideas for a solution?

Thanks in advance for any suggestions you may have.
Will

Hi everyone,

I have a 960 that is having a strange issue. All of the on-screen menus, including volume, the show that's on, input, etc. do not display any text. The translucent grey background comes up where the display should be, but that's it. I can't even tell what channel I'm on.

I suppose it could be worse, as the set is otherwise functional, but it's still rather annoying. Especially since it happened briefly once before, when it was under warranty. It never recurred, so I never called to have it checked.

Any ideas for a solution?

Thanks in advance for any suggestions you may have.
Will

Try leaving it unplugged overnight?

I'm way behind the curve. I just bought a KD-34XBR960 as my first foray into HDTV. This set can be had pretty cheaply now, if you can lift it. Anyway, I have some questions about setting it up.

Does it make sense to buy a DVD player at this point, or go for Blu-Ray? If Blu-Ray, should it be stand alone or PS3?

Since there is only one HDMI input, how do you make the most of it? Do you need a receiver to do the switching so multiple devices can be connected by HDMI? Right now I have the cable STB (Comcast) connected to the TV by HDMI. Is satellite better for HDTV?

Thanks in advance for any help.

I'm way behind the curve. I just bought a KD-34XBR960 as my first foray into HDTV. This set can be had pretty cheaply now, if you can lift it. Anyway, I have some questions about setting it up.

Does it make sense to buy a DVD player at this point, or go for Blu-Ray? If Blu-Ray, should it be stand alone or PS3?

Since there is only one HDMI input, how do you make the most of it? Do you need a receiver to do the switching so multiple devices can be connected by HDMI? Right now I have the cable STB (Comcast) connected to the TV by HDMI. Is satellite better for HDTV?

Thanks in advance for any help.

First where you bought it at? Lol the reason im asking is that i been lookin for one.I would suggest getting a Ps3,plays your old dvd's.video games blu rays.You can find a switcher to switch between ps3,cable, and for sound you can use the optical from tv to receiver.

Just out of curiosity, what setting does this group prefer for it's 4x3 material? Wide-zoom allows the center to appear closer to it's original geometry but at the same time picture quality becomes a little less sharper due to increased stretching that increases the picture size and cuts off the sides.

I always left it in native 4x3.

I used wide zoom for a while but once I realized burn-in wouldn't be an issue I left it at "normal" for 4x3 material.

Hey is the KV-34XBR910 a good buy for 500? How does it compare to the 960? Thanks

Just out of curiosity, what setting does this group prefer for it's 4x3 material? Wide-zoom allows the center to appear closer to it's original geometry but at the same time picture quality becomes a little less sharper due to increased stretching that increases the picture size and cuts off the sides.I use Wide-zoom for 4:3 SD except for the occasional letterboxed program where I switch to zoom. I use Full for HD and anamorphic SD.

Hey is the KV-34XBR910 a good buy for 500? How does it compare to the 960? Thanks

I don't know if it was a problem with the particular set I bought, but I found that the 910 I bought last year produced a much dimmer picture that than 960 in my bedroom, even after getting it ISF calbrated. I bought mine for $500 used, but I got the show to throw in a Samsung OTA turner for free so I could watch HD OTA. I'd try to push for something closer to $400 if they're willing to negotiate. $500 is okay if they thrown in the custom stand or OTA tuner). It's missing a few features that they put in the 960, the menu isn't as precise (and my calibrator *hated* having to use the 910's menu when calibrating as it uses a bunch of dashes for picture levels instead of showing a number) and it doesn't have the OTA and QAM tuners. It's still worth getting it you can't get a 960, but don't pay more than it's truly worth. I paid $475 to two different sellers for the two 960s I have now, one for just the tv, the other had the custom stand thrown in for free (I gave the 910 to my mom last weekend when I got my new 960).

Just out of curiosity, what setting does this group prefer for it's 4x3 material? Wide-zoom allows the center to appear closer to it's original geometry but at the same time picture quality becomes a little less sharper due to increased stretching that increases the picture size and cuts off the sides.
I stick with true 4:3 for movies and shows that are shot in that format, but I use wide-zoom for some games. Really, in games like Paper Mario: Thousand Year Door you really can't notice the picture distortion much at all.

fwiw, Anyone looking for a 960 in the North East might check this out as its owned by an ISF Calibrator:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14751744#post14751744

Hey is the KV-34XBR910 a good buy for 500? How does it compare to the 960? Thanks

I can't speak for how well the 910 stacks up to the 960 (but on paper the 960 is better due to the cablecard, integrated HD tuner, etc)....

But my reason for posting was to say I just bought my (new to me) XBR960 for $300. No stand with it but I didn't need it anyway (I never used the stand with my KV-32HV600 that I upgraded from).

I did get a steal on this thing (I found it on Craigslist). I'd been seeing the 960 go for $400-450 here in Atlanta, but this guy had a girlfriend harping at him to get it out of their apartment so he priced it low to move it quickly.

Man I love this set. It looks great (he had it ISF calibrated). I was so happy with my HV600, but I'm just in love with this XBR960. (especially since 90% of what we watch is HD, it's nice to have that big HD picture)

Same thing happened to me. I just picked up a 960 yesterday from a guy on craigslist, same story, girlfriend wanted it out of the apartment. Only $400, including the matching stand. I've been watching these things since they started selling them in 2004!

If anyone is selling or knows someone selling a 960 in Orlando, Fl, please PM me.

If anyone is selling or knows someone selling a 960 in Orlando, Fl, please PM me.

Craigslist has them in Atlanta, Austin, Charlotte, Chico, Dallas, Houston, Los Angeles, New Jersey, New York, Orange County, Philadelphia, Roanoke, Rochester, Salem, San Antonio, San Diego, San Francisco, Tri-Cities, Washington DC

and did I mention Orlando?

http://orlando.craigslist.org/ele/829530215.html

http://orlando.craigslist.org/ele/812218102.html

I bought a 960 off ebay. A little more than $475. The tv works fine, as I saw that it worked when I got there to pick it up, but I've got a couple issues that need resolved:

HDMI is not working. I'm not sure if this is a cable issue or what. Do I need HDMI for blu-ray or an upconverting dvd player?

The "video" sign in the upper left corner doesn't go away.

The menu button doesn't seem to always work-I may need a new remote from sony. I was able to calibrate a little in Pro mode.

Ideas, suggestions?

The "video" sign in the upper left corner doesn't go away.

Ideas, suggestions?

Try pressing the "Display" button on the remote control, that should take care of the "video" sign.

HDMI is not working. I'm not sure if this is a cable issue or what. Do I need HDMI for blu-ray or an upconverting dvd player?


There were some HDMI board failures on the 960s, it may need repair. Try contacting the owner and see if he has any advice. You don't need HDMI to view really great HD signals, component will carry 1080i and below perfectly well. Your problem will be too few HD inputs on the TV, so you may want to invest in a decent quality component splitter. I bought a Philips HD auto-switcher from Walmart a few years ago that's worked great.

Okay, that's what I thought about HDMI. I'll just use component and buy a new remote from Sony-hopefully that should take care of the video sign.

This kind of sucks since my Oppo only has HDMI. Perhaps it's time to upgrade to a 983 or sit it out for their blu ray.

Are there any calibration settings in this 204 pager? I've been playing with picture and brightness settings in pro mode, but that's been about it.

Otherwise, I'll sift through the entire thread.

Guys, thanks for all your help!

Six months ago I bought my first 960 off craigslist. Paid $350 including the matching stand and DVD player. Saturday I picked up my second 960 for $200! Both units purchased from first owners....not a scratch on them....work perfectly.

Everyone that comes in the house and sees the picture quality of my TVs, remarks something along the lines of, "Geez, I think that picture quality is better than my flatscreen."

I feed both TVs with an antenna from my attic.... Pure HD signal...sometimes I'm still amazed by the picture!

Boys, it's a buyers market!

I'll echo WJonathan's comment about HDMI board failures.

I bought mine from Fry's a couple of years ago. It was an "open box" item and I bought their extended warranty. The HDMI worked initially, but the HDMI board had to be replaced and it's been working fine ever since.

Was the HDMI problem listed in the auction? Double check with the seller and see if he was aware of it. It's possible he might not have used the HDMI and was unaware of it.

Alternatively, since you purchased it on eBay, did you get an offer from SquareTrade.com (http://www.squaretrade.com) for a warranty? It might be worth it in the long run.

He didn't have a blu-ray player and I don't think he knew much about TVs. Someone at CC sold him on this thing and he likes cnet. He knew little about calibration, different models, etc.

Really nice guy, very honest, wanted to help me out, so I don't think its a stretch to say he never used hdmi, especially if it's a tv with one hdmi output.

He was NOT a videophile.

I'm less concerned about that than I am with the "video" sign to go away and getting a remote that fully works- I suspect those problems go together, since the display button and the menu button don't work on the remote :)

I didn't get the ebay warranty, etc. I just got the one he had from Sony- which expired, so it's sort of meaningless. It was so cheap, that I'm not sure what I'll do down the road. I may hold out still for a kuro or panny in two years.

I went down to bestbuy to look for a stand for this sucker, but I've got an alternative that should work better.

btw, I picked up an XD-E500 player from Toshiba and passed on the new panny blu ray (bd35), since the Toshiba has a region hack- I've got WAY too many hong kong dvds. I wished that Panny had a region hack, too.

Looks like I can't upconvert any dvd without hdmi.

Are there any calibration settings in this 204 pager? I've been playing with picture and brightness settings in pro mode, but that's been about it.You think this one is extensive?

You need to go to this "Sony tweaks" thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=531494) for a complete discussion and how-to in "service mode". It's long, but what you want is there.

Many categories of "calibration"... geometry, color, brightness/contrast, etc.

Don't forget that every XBR960 CRT is an analog device, with slight differences from every other XBR960. So each and every numeric setting from one user will not necessarily be the "correct" value for your set. While many values will definitely be universal for all users, lots of settings are affected by things such as "convergence magnets" on the back of the picture tube and which are thus unique to each and every set.

So... just be careful when entering the world of the service menu. And be sure to write down all of your current settings before you start playing.

Okay, so I talked with guy I purchased the tv from and he used HDMI as his source for cable...it was not an easy move getting this tv back to my house and I was scared I may have broken it a couple times. I blame myself.

I'm just wondering if the way it was moved, turning it on it's side and then using a dolly to move it may have messed some things up internally.

Is there a way to reset the tv???

Okay, so I talked with guy I purchased the tv from and he used HDMI as his source for cable...it was not an easy move getting this tv back to my house and I was scared I may have broken it a couple times. I blame myself.

I'm just wondering if the way it was moved, turning it on it's side and then using a dolly to move it may have messed some things up internally.


These TVs are very fragile and very heavy. It's always an unfortunate possibility to damage the set whenever it's moved. There's a reason it came new packed in an ungodly amount of styrofoam. The guns can easily be 'bumped' out of alignment, and I've also heard tales of strange on-screen displays/input errors similar to the ones you're describing appearing around the time of a move.


Is there a way to reset the tv???

Somewhere there should be a master 'reset to factory defaults' option. Although I don't remember offhand where it is. Please note that with this TV and it's outstanding analog source upconverting, you'll actually get a much nicer upconverted image by setting your DVD source output to 480P and letting the television's Cinemotion and Super Fine Dot Pitch engine do the work through the component inputs. In my experience on this set, it's a dramatically better picture then the Oppo (or any other up-converting player) outputting 1080i and hooked up through HDMI. This TV's own ability is the secret to all it's crazy admirers. Don't underestimate the power of the last Trinitron !

All is well.

Had my oppo at 1080p, hence the black screen, so the HDMI is working fine.

Remote seems to work completely now, as well.

I noticed this with the tv, as well. It didn't really matter what the dvd player was, since this tv does a better upconversion than any player I've thrown at it.

The edge enhancement feature is interesting and seems to even sharpen scenes more than I thought possible (Although it may induce some slight ghosting?).

Still, blu ray over HDMI is so much better than component. The clarity with blu ray on this set is amazing. My bd35 is the first blu ray player that looks like a normal dvd player, but it's still slow (and this was supposed to be the fastest player out there besides ps3).

Is there a way to reset the tv???

.....Somewhere there should be a master 'reset to factory defaults' option. Although I don't remember offhand where it is. ....A few words of advice.

Under NO circumsatances should you attempt a RESET of ANY kind unless you desire a LONG , DIFFICULT road of restoring your set from the ashes.

Y'all have been warned, AGAIN.:p

All is well.

Had my oppo at 1080p, hence the black screen, so the HDMI is working fine....;)

I've got a dead line of resolution across my screen. It's not really noticeable unless I'm a foot away from the tv, but I'm wondering what to do about it.

Blu ray looks ridiculous on this set, amazing sound, really amazing picture.

Also, I've noticed some slight ghosting during black scenes. I saw some in Casino Royale today. Does the edge enhancement feature cause that or is it just phosphor CRT based?

I've got a dead line of resolution across my screen. It's not really noticeable unless I'm a foot away from the tv, but I'm wondering what to do about it.You're sure you're not just seeing the two tiny horizontal wires that hold the aperture grill against the back of the glass? Usually they're located about 25% down from the top and 25% up from bottom.

EVERY Sony Trinitron picture tube, be it in a computer CRT monitor or a TV, has two such very tiny wires that are visible if you get very close to the tube and look for it. That's simply how the tubes are made and all Trinitron owners have seen them at one time or another and just gotten used to them.

Move back to normal viewing distance, and don't look for them. After a while you just will not see them.

Is this what you're referring to?

Okay, that's what I'm seeing :)

Man, you guys know your stuff!

Okay, that's what I'm seeing :)Excellent.

Actually, they're really only most easily visible against a stable solid white background, such as you might see in a composition window for a computer's email or word processing program and where you're pretty close to the CRT screen.

Any other dark background, or one where the content is in motion (e.g. normal TV watching), makes it absolutely impossible to see these wires.

That's the price of "Trinitron perfection" I guess. XBR960 owners, be content.

Are there any calibration settings in this 204 pager? I've been playing with picture and brightness settings in pro mode, but that's been about it.

Otherwise, I'll sift through the entire thread.

Guys, thanks for all your help!

Congratulations on your new 960. Can tell how much you love it just like the rest of us do.

Regarding the service menu, be sure to write down original factory settings to set them back to the way they originally were to avoid making any mistakes. I would also suggest printing out the master list of all service codes in the suggested thread by group - it provides the actual SONY default setting for each item plus space to write down your adjusted setting.

I'm not a technician so I skipped those callibrations requiring more technical expertise, just comparing factory settings to the suggested default to see which was better (fortunately, most were set the same). I got bold in group seven by tweaking the system, special sharpness, sharpness, edge enhancement and mide using a cross-hatch pattern recorded onto DVR from the old INHD test patterns for setting up HD (no longer broadcast).

The cross-hatch pattern was vital to set proper geometry (groups nine and ten). The instructions on pages 15 through 23 did not include all items so I referred to the others in both groups to fine-tweak it even more. Only other geometric items I did myself was for top, bottom, left and right blanking (group 11) to rectify overscan.

I also saw there was a general group consensus regarding the red/green corrections (group 8) and adjusted them accordingly with excellent results.

I then went into the user settings still using those INHD test patterns with blu-filter glasses. I got an even more beautiful picture on the PRO mode for both HD and 480p DVD than ever before. I then adjusted the user settings in the MOVIE mode and after a comparising the two found the whites and sharpness (with no grain) were enhanced slightly better in MOVIE so that's the mode I'm now use for all my viewing.

If you are using a blu-ray player then get a blu-ray DVD with a THX Optomizer for reference. There are too many internal test patterns and the 960's own crosshatch for geometry really didn't really work well, actually creating distortion instead of alleviating it. I also was able to get two pairs of blu-filter glasses for about $5 (including shipping) directly from the THX website.



Hope this helps,

Joe

Are there any calibration settings in this 204 pager? I've been playing with picture and brightness settings in pro mode, but that's been about it.Just in case you didn't find this in the "tweaks" thread, attached is my latest XLS which shows all of my service menu settings, for all inputs, and for all input resolutions.

As has been repeated, and can't be repeated enough, you should "write down" (or record in an XLS like this one, which you can clone and then use as your starting point for your particular XBR960) all of your existing settings for all service menu items before you start any kind of tweaking. That way at least you should be able to recover, should disaster strike or perhaps if you just want to go back to what you had before you started.

Also... someone else's settings are not necessarily right for your set, because of many factors (e.g. magnets on the picture tube). But at least you can look at some set of values, such as in my XLS, and at least try it out for yourself and then decide if it's better or worse. Having an XLS like this, with your current settings, makes it very convenient for future reference and discussions.

Finally, you absolutely must have a cross-hatch test pattern in order to adjust geometry and overscan (not to mention convergence). Various sources for these patterans exist, but I'm attaching a BMP which if you can connect your computer to your 960 you should find useful for this purpose.

Again... my geometry settings are unique to my 960, because of the "magnet job" I've had done to my set. So my service menu settings relating to geometry are obviously only really applicable to my set. But at least you can look at them for reference.

But what EVERYBODY touches is in group 2170P-4, items 7-10, to adjust color (and eliminate "red push"). These are ABSOLUTELY CRUCIAL and will improve your colors dramatically. Note that a calibration DVD (with colored filter glasses) is very helpful for this job.

Also, color adjustments in the service menu complement what you've done in the user menu for color, hue, color temp, and color axis... so this is not a trivial adjustment in just one place. Lots of fingers in the pie.

Good luck.

Hi DSperber,

Saw your above post and agree with you 100%.

Not only did proper geometry settings eliminate bowing and linear distortion but correcting the overscan enabled the picture to be sharper. Out of the box the picture just barely reached the ten percent horizontal safety lines (5% for vertical). With overscan now set to approximately 2% we are no longer missing information along the edges and the picture itself is no longer "over-stretched" which had caused the 960's resolution to appear less crisp than it should have been.

Also want to point out to Gmarceau that items 7-10 under 2107P-4 are the user settings found in the main menu and that even a slight adjustment in one (other than hue) requires re-adjusting the others.

Christ, this is turning into a monster!

You guys are speaking to me in Chinese right now. I never thought it would happened, but I've become the guy who buys the home theater stuff and has no idea what he's got. At least I don't have the thing on vivid with the contrast on max ;)

Okay, guys, I'm a complete noob here. I bought this tv, because I knew it was basically the Rolls Royce of hdtvs. Since the industry is pushing flat panels, despite the tech not quite being up to CRT (yes, even the mighty Kuro), I purchased this sucker at a great deal. So, with this in mind...

Service menu: How do I access it, what will it help me do with set geometry, calibration, etc?

Grain: I get lots of grain in my blu ray, but I can't figure out if this is noise or just film grain. I should note that I've got clear edge on high and I really like the look of it, but I'm figuring softening the picture will reduce the grain. My panny bd35 player is also set to "fine", so the picture is amazingly crisp.

My calibration: Pro mode, warm setting to get closest grey scale, with contrast at about 55-60%(38-40) with color @ 27 and brightness anywhere between 24-26, with sharpness @ 32-34. How much better can I get than this?

DRC: I never played with it, I actually kept it on Custom 1. It greys out on blu ray. Cinemotion gets greyed out too, as it's the last setting I kept on when I had my dvd player hooked up.

Pro calibration: Bite the bullet and do this right? I'll try to find someone who's an expert with calibrating a tv and not a BB employee. There's got to be guys out there with lots of experience working on 960s.

Hi Gmarcaeu,

Don't worry, you are no different than most of us when it comes to home theater.

To access the service menu, turn the TV off, then press, in this order, the buttons on your remote for display, 5, volume up and power. The service menu will then appear on top.

To access the item you wish to adjust:

1) Press the 2 button to scan up and the 5 button to scan down until you reach the desired group that the item is located in (the group code appears in the upper left corner).
2) When in the desired group, press the 1 button to scan up and the 4 button to scan down until you get to the item in question (the item number appears to the right of the group number).
3) To adjust the item press the 3 button to raise the adjustment and the 6 button to lower it (the adjustment number appears to the right of the item number).

NOTE: Even though an adjustment may be changed, it must be saved before the power is turned off (otherwise it reverts to the setting you first saw). You will see the word "service" in the upper right hand corner. To save your adjustment 1) press the muting button (the word "service" will then change to "write") and b) then press the "enter" button (the word "write" will then turn red. Wait a few seconds till the word "service" re-appears. The change will then be saved.

Continue this procedure for each item you adjust. When you wish to exit the service menu simply turn the TV off.
Before attempting any service adjustments it's best to get a blu-ray callibration disc which will have all the test patterns necessary to make them. Use the pages I suggested to set the geometry and overscan. Then adjust the sharpness and edge-enhancement items I mentioned before. DON'T FORGET TO WRITE DOWN EVERY ORIGINAL SETTING B-E-F-O-R-E MAKING YOUR OWN ADJUSTMENT SO YOU CAN RETURN TO IT IF YOU FEEL YOU MADE IT WORSE OR IF YOU MADE AN ADJUSTMENT ON THE WRONG ITEM (I've done that often!). By adhering to these cautionary steps you can scan the range of each adjustment to see what seems best for you; even after saving the adjustment if you later feel you made a mistake you can then go back into the service menu and return the item to it's original setting - SO WRITE DOWN THE ORIGINAL SETTING NUMBER BEFORE DOING ANYTHING ELSE.

If you want to adjust the color decoders within the service menu, these are the settings most seem to agree on: RYR-14; RYB-15; GYR-6; GYB-4 (I do not know how to tweak them using test patterns).

Then go into your user menu but before you begin any tweaking I suggest setting the color temperature at "cool" to keep the whites more natural and go into the advanced settings to see that the red color push is set to "default" (after tweaking if you find the picture too red then set it to "monitor" and tweak the color and hue again. Then follow the disc instructions for tweaking the picture, brightness, color, hue and sharpness in each mode (VIVID, STANDARD, PRO and MOVIE) to see which one you like best (most of us stay away from vivid and standard). You're sure to be happy.

Note that the DRC options are disabled when using 480p, 720p or 1080i sources. They only work on 480i (VHS or non-upconverted standard definition signals from your cable box).

As far as graininess, it's common with older films that haven't been remastered for DVD all that well. I was watching one DVD which was pristine and then put on another only to find it much harsher. Newer DVDs tend to be mastered much better than those made many years ago. I found by adjusting the sharpness, super-sharpness, clear-edge and midi changes in the service menu I was able to increase the settings for sharpness and edge enhancement to bring in more detail without the picture becoming harsh and grainy.

Am sure this seems overwhelming at the moment but with a little time, experimentation and patience you'll get the hang of it. Limit the service adjustments to geometry, sharpness and those suggested color decoders and you'll be fine.

Service menu: How do I access it, what will it help me do with set geometry, calibration, etc?Check the notes at the bottom of my XLS (service menu tab):

Enter Service Mode = [PowerOff] - [DISPLAY] - [5] - [VOL+] - [PowerOn]
Menu item Next = [1]
Menu item Previous = [4]
Group Next = [2]
Group Previous = [5]
Adjust item value Up = [3]
Adjust item value Down = [6]
Save New Settings = [MUTE] - [ENTER]
Exit Service Mode = [PowerOff]
Warning: [7]-[JUMP]-[ENTER] and [7]-[9]-[ENTER] will reset the NVM data. Avoid key [7].


My calibration: Pro mode, warm setting to get closest grey scale,To each his own, but I feel "warm" is too red for my tastes.

I prefer to start from "cool" (a bit bluish), and then adjust other things to match so that the resulting color (especially skin tone) is most natural.

The basic axiom is that you need to be in PRO mode to have total control and eliminate factory built-in presets and biases. Otherwise, you'll be adjusting things to compensate for biases inherent in those other modes... so you might as well just start in PRO (essentially "flat") and go from there.


with contrast at about 55-60%(38-40)Of course this depends on your viewing conditions, but if you are in PRO mode I think "picture" (i.e. contrast) of 38-40 is too high. Remember this setting depends on what your input source is and its particular characteristics. HD sources (720p and 1080i) via component video or HDMI should not need this much contrast (but that's just me).

On the other hand, SD inputs (480i) on INPUT1/INPUT3 from VCR or similar may require this value. In fact, my own values for SD are also 39-40.

I have my 720p/1080i HD source on INPUT6, with user menu settings to match. I have my 480p DVD(SD) source on INPUT5, to keep it specifically separate from HD and to allow its own separate user menu settings.

Personally, for my HD input I have picture at 34-35.


with color @ 27

Seems low, probably due to your use of "warm". 31 is the default, and I find it works well for HD input and "cool". But again, remember that the 2170P-4 color adjustments in the service menu are crucial and will interract with these user menu adjustments. You've got to have "lots of fingers moving at once".


and brightness anywhere between 24-26Again, seems low... if you're in PRO mode. 31 is the default and 31-32 should be right for HD inputs.


with sharpness @ 32-34.Try MIN!!!!!!!! For HD input, you want NO edge enhancement. (I know... I'll hear from some people, but I won't listen.) It may take a day or two to get used to, but this is how HD should be viewed (IMHO, and per my calibration DVD).

Now for 480i SD input, I've got sharpness set at 19. But this is very much dependent on your source... OTA roof antenna, cable system S-video, satellite receiver S-video, VCR, etc..


DRC: I never played with it, I actually kept it on Custom 1. It greys out on blu ray. Cinemotion gets greyed out tooOnly relevant for SD inputs, not HD.

Personally, I find "progressive" with my D* S-video source to be excellent.


Pro calibration: Bite the bullet and do this right?Certainly your decision. Naturally if you have artifacts like convergence problems (e.g. rainbowing of lines in the corners), curvature and bowing that cannot be straightened out with the service menu tweaks, etc., you may need a qualified service technician who can apply magnets to the back of your picture tube (which definitely is the only way to fix certain problems). And then your service menu adjustments will have to be redone, to be compatible with the effect of the magnet job.

I don't think ISF people do magnet jobs, but I may be wrong.

Anyway, you can absolutely do much yourself... and you'll be surprised how quickly you will pick up the technique once you actually try something out. The key to learning is to try an adjustment you know will be of benefit and tweak it "one unit" up or down, and carefully watch what happens on the screen. You'll absolutely see the result of that one increment, and you can then decide if it's better or worse, with either more adjustment needed in the same direction or more in the opposite direction.


To help you out adjusting geometry/overscan (assuming you have a cross-hatch test pattern available), you might read this post (from the 2005-2006 archives (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=6346890&postcount=511), so click on that link when asked if you want to). This is sort of my "recipe".

There were several others posted over the past few years that provided more commentary and that you might also find helpful. Start with this one, again from the 2005-2006 archives. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=8452998&postcount=2037)

Hi Dsperber,

Service tweaking definately makes a profound affect on all user settings. I even believe service adjustments on one set could be quite different than that of another while resulting in the same exact picture quality. A perfect example is the difference in the way we adjust sharpness.

You keep your user sharpness near minimum whereas mine is around 45 with clear-edge set to high. The reason has to be our service settings for MIDI (which gives over 60 different combinations of contrast, brightness and sharpness), super-sharpness, clear-edge, etc. My adjustments affected the range in user sharpness, making it more subtle than it was out of the box. Hence, I now have a smaller but finer range of sharpness to work with (and those factory service pre-sets did cause the picture to appear harsh and grainy at those higher settings).

Of course, had my user adjustments been different I might have found it necessary to have the sharpness and clear-edge set much lower like you do.

I even believe service adjustments on one set could be quite different than that of another while resulting in the same exact picture quality. A perfect example is the difference in the way we adjust sharpness.

You keep your user sharpness near minimum whereas mine is around 45 with clear-edge set to high. The reason has to be our service settings for MIDI (which gives over 60 different combinations of contrast, brightness and sharpness), super-sharpness, clear-edge, etc.Starting with my first use of DVE years ago, I followed Joe Kane's suggestion to TURN DOWN SHARPNESS TO WHATEVER MINIMUM YOU CAN.

The explanation was that "sharpness", "edge enhancement", etc., is artificial processing added to the signal from the provider. You are not seeing any additional information from the original content... you're just seeing electronically added artifacts, which is simply something added artificially.

Even if other tweaks are used to compensate for and reduce newly created artifacts such as "dot crawl" etc., it's all just one artificial technique to compensate for the results of another artificial technique. Why do any of this (per Joe Kane)? At least that's how I view things.

Granted, I have not touched MIDI at all (other than MID3 for geometry) for sharpness, focus, etc., from whatever the factory settings are. So I cannot comment firsthand on what things might look like if I did fool with these settings. Personally, I don't think I need any adjustment to sharpness or focus.

But I do know I have turned off sharpness for my HD inputs, and turned off edge enhancement. In this way I am seeing whatever is provided by the content provider... insofar as "edges" are concerned. And the picture is stunning. Pure, clear, sharp, and stunning.

To each his own I suppose. I guess a side-by-side comparison would be a convincing experiment, but that's hard to arrange.

Christ, this is turning into a monster!

Pro calibration: Bite the bullet and do this right? I'll try to find someone who's an expert with calibrating a tv and not a BB employee. There's got to be guys out there with lots of experience working on 960s.

I went with a Pro calibration and am very happy with that. You can locate one at http://www.imagingscience.com/ this is for ISF calibrations.

To each his own, but I feel "warm" is too red for my tastes.

I prefer to start from "cool" (a bit bluish), and then adjust other things to match so that the resulting color (especially skin tone) is most natural.

The basic axiom is that you need to be in PRO mode to have total control and eliminate factory built-in presets and biases. Otherwise, you'll be adjusting things to compensate for biases inherent in those other modes... so you might as well just start in PRO (essentially "flat") and go from there.


Of course this depends on your viewing conditions, but if you are in PRO mode I think "picture" (i.e. contrast) of 38-40 is too high. Remember this setting depends on what your input source is and its particular characteristics. HD sources (720p and 1080i) via component video or HDMI should not need this much contrast (but that's just me).

On the other hand, SD inputs (480i) on INPUT1/INPUT3 from VCR or similar may require this value. In fact, my own values for SD are also 39-40.

I have my 720p/1080i HD source on INPUT6, with user menu settings to match. I have my 480p DVD(SD) source on INPUT5, to keep it specifically separate from HD and to allow its own separate user menu settings.

Personally, for my HD input I have picture at 34-35.




Seems low, probably due to your use of "warm". 31 is the default, and I find it works well for HD input and "cool". But again, remember that the 2170P-4 color adjustments in the service menu are crucial and will interract with these user menu adjustments. You've got to have "lots of fingers moving at once".


Again, seems low... if you're in PRO mode. 31 is the default and 31-32 should be right for HD inputs.


Try MIN!!!!!!!! For HD input, you want NO edge enhancement. (I know... I'll hear from some people, but I won't listen.) It may take a day or two to get used to, but this is how HD should be viewed (IMHO, and per my calibration DVD).
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I've adjusted picture down around 34-35 and that feels about right. I was okay with 31 on brightness until I had the lights off and the screen would go black- it's too bright. 26-27 is better for that. I'm sorry, but I need to know that black is black. I'll sacrifice some black detail.

The color setting is good for warm, but I'll try a neutral setting. If I take the red out, then the color goes up to 31-32.

If I can play around with the service menu's color then I think I'll be close to where I want to be.

I'll also try to get rid of clear edge and sharpness, although I like a sharp picture- it's getting weird seeing the pores in everyones face, though...

"I guess a side-by-side comparision would be a convincing experiment, but that's hard to arrange".

Hi DSperber,

- at well over 200 pounds, that would indeed be tough.

I agree with Mr. Kane that sharpness should be set at a neutral setting to avoid over-processing or too soft a picture. I suggest checking to see if item 0 under 2170P3 (SYSM) is set to 3. This is described as "special sharpness" with four optional settings: 0/1=peaky boost; 2=broad boost; 3=flat. While the default is 3 (flat) my factory setting was 2 (broad). Switching to 3 combined with MIDE (item 16 of this same group) might explain our differences in user sharpness and edge enhancment.

BTW - SONY lists the HD user sharpness default at 29 which is almost midpoint in the user menu. My actual setting is 41 (not 45 which was a typo), an increase of slightly under 20%. As we both know, picture and brightness levels affect sharpness so in movie mode mine are 44 (picture) and 27 (brightness).

Color is 40 with hue at R-1. These user settings along with the adjusted codes listed by SONY for the four 2170P4 color settings (in lieu of the defaults) make the shades of blue equal when viewed through blue-filter glasses.

Again, it would be very interesting to do a side-by-side comparision, however, after two hernia operations I'm not willing to take the risk! But since we both relied on HD test patterns I'm sure any differences in picture quality would be minute.

Starting with my first use of DVE years ago, I followed Joe Kane's suggestion to TURN DOWN SHARPNESS TO WHATEVER MINIMUM YOU CAN.

The explanation was that "sharpness", "edge enhancement", etc., is artificial processing added to the signal from the provider. You are not seeing any additional information from the original content... you're just seeing electronically added artifacts, which is simply something added artificially.

Even if other tweaks are used to compensate for and reduce newly created artifacts such as "dot crawl" etc., it's all just one artificial technique to compensate for the results of another artificial technique. Why do any of this (per Joe Kane)? At least that's how I view things.

Granted, I have not touched MIDI at all (other than MID3 for geometry) for sharpness, focus, etc., from whatever the factory settings are. So I cannot comment firsthand on what things might look like if I did fool with these settings. Personally, I don't think I need any adjustment to sharpness or focus.

But I do know I have turned off sharpness for my HD inputs, and turned off edge enhancement. In this way I am seeing whatever is provided by the content provider... insofar as "edges" are concerned. And the picture is stunning. Pure, clear, sharp, and stunning.

To each his own I suppose. I guess a side-by-side comparison would be a convincing experiment, but that's hard to arrange.

ClearEdge doesn't make things look bad, though. However, I need to get rid of all sharpness and compare, but things don't look fake on the screen or enhanced, they just look clear as opposed to blurry. This is mostly the case with background. I do have to try both again.


Also, I still can't get into the service menu. Poweroff, display, vol+ and power on? Do I have to be on a certain channel- I'm on video 7 for the HDMI.

You left out the "5". Each step of the sequence needs to be completed within one second of each other. (Except the power off, of course.)

Attached is a page from the service manual. You should try to get a copy of the service manual if you are using the service menus. I paid for one some years ago but they are available free I believe.

When I tried to obtain a service manual directly from SONY they wanted to charge me $60. I believe there are other websites that made copies and sell them for less. Many of the pages you would want can be found on the AVS link for the SONY SERVICE CODES.

I played with some service codes. The MIDE and SYSM settings were what allowed me to get some good clarity. I set MIDE to 22 and SYSM is at 0. Edge enhancement now looks artificial.

I played with the settings from the link, but all the adjustments for screen placement didn't really matter to me. Whatever the settings were that played with contrast and greys made the set darker. Actually, my old settings are way too dark for the changes. I think I'll go back to factory settings on the darks.

My panny bd35 seems to have a red push to it when playing blu ray. I've set the color to neutral and the advanced setting is set to monitor.

I played with some service codes. The MIDE and SYSM settings were what allowed me to get some good clarity. I set MIDE to 22 and SYSM is at 0. Edge enhancement now looks artificial.

I played with the settings from the link, but all the adjustments for screen placement didn't really matter to me. Whatever the settings were that played with contrast and greys made the set darker. Actually, my old settings are way too dark for the changes. I think I'll go back to factory settings on the darks.

My panny bd35 seems to have a red push to it when playing blu ray. I've set the color to neutral and the advanced setting is set to monitor.

That's what we all did at the beginning - fooled around with different adjustments to get a feel of them and over the next few days go back in and try another series of changes.

IMOP edge enhancement tends to look artificial if SYSM is set to anything other than flat. With MIDE one needs to go through the entire range of settings in order to determine which one suits you best since is setting is a combination of others found under other service codes.

Do you have a Blu-Ray disc that contains the THX optomizer (usually included in the special feature menu of discs that are THX certified)? If so, I strongly suggest using it for precision setting of user brightness, picture, sharpness, color and tint. Blue filter glasses work with the color pattern by just showing the words "color" and "tint" with recise color and tint achieved by adjusting each level until all letters appear in a uniform shade of blue. Again, if you (or anyone else) needs a pair they cost only a few dollars and can be purchased through www.thx.com.

Hopes this is of help. Any questions, just ask.

Joe

I'm sort of happy with my settings now- maybe.

I went into neutral color and set the advanced setting to monitor and then set the color back up to 31. That's done. I think there's greater accuracy to that than using a warm setting to get some accurate grey scale in Pro mode.

Brightness setting is based off of a black screen in a dark room. That's been going to 28-29.

Picture/contrast has been right around 33-35 and that seems excellent.

I've got the color space settings per the service code recommendations in this thread.

Geometry is pretty solid. Solid enough. I may move the horizontal setting a little to the right.



MIDE is something else that I don't get. I'm not sure what it does with sharpness. There was a sharper setting at 23 than 22, but it seemed too artificial. I also remember 19 was sharp, as well. It went in a group of sharp, sharper, flat, for a few times between 14-15 to somewhere in the high 20s.

I have started exploring the service code menus on my KD-34XBR960, I decided to see what was in the overscan area of my set and I adjusted the horizontal and vertical sizing, stretch, and shutter parameters so I could see the entire crosshatch pattern (1920x1080). I have included here jpg's of my adjusted geometry before looking at the overscan area (image1) and then (image2) where I can see the entire perimeter, almost.

I was surprised to see such distortion in the overscan area, although it explains some to the extreme geometry adjustments I am having to make. First, note the clipping in the upper left corner. It is not due to the curving of the left vertical but due to a hard to see here bending of the canvas inward away from the left corner that blanks off the image. What is causing this and how do I correct it? Second, note the inward bowing of the right vertical. With some adjustments the far right vertical will actually fold over the second right vertical. I think that this is caused by the beam hitting the edge of the tube and overlaying on the rest of the image.

If I move the image to the left to avoid the distortion on the right, I loose more and more of the image in the upper left corner

I want to correct these faults before adjusting convergence. My adjusted geometry doesn't look to bad but I am having to use shutter adjustments to cut off too much of the image. I want to see the perimeter line of the entire crosshatch without distortion.

I originally removed all of the permalloy magnets installed by a Sony technician to remove color blotching because they caused some pretty severe distortion which he said he could not correct. I have played with reattachment of the magnets but cannot correct the convergence issues. If I can improve the distortion in the overscan area, it would help a lot in making it possible to correct the convergence.

It's also kind of interesting that the upper left corner and center right distortions of the crosshatch pattern are the locations of the color blotching that I adjusted out with landing parameters!

I am new to the forum, so please bear with me if my terminology is not correct. Please tell me what is right. There is a plastic frame for the CRT. There is the visable CRT screen area. There is a scan area that the guns cover in the screen area. Then there is an image area in which the image overlays within the scan area. What I called the "canvas" was the scan area which in my case is not showing the entire image and it is not a rectangle. It is not easily shown, but the left side of the scan has a curved edge that bends away from the left side as it gets closer to the upper left, where I loose the image. The geometry adjustments change the grid lines in the crosshatch but do not effect the curve in the perimeter of the scan.

Comments are encouraged.

MIDE is something else that I don't get. I'm not sure what it does with sharpness. There was a sharper setting at 23 than 22, but it seemed too artificial. I also remember 19 was sharp, as well. It went in a group of sharp, sharper, flat, for a few times between 14-15 to somewhere in the high 20s.

It might seem there is little sequential logic in the range for MIDI since some low range numbers appear only slightly different than those much higher while the differences in sequential adjustments are quite obvious. My guess is that subtle changes in contrast begin every third number with different settings for brightness and the same contrast setting (or vice-versa) sandwiched in-between. Again, MIDI is a combination of brightness and contrast which automaticly affects sharpness (even if sharpness is not adjusted by MIDI as an individual component).

I have started exploring the service code menus on my KD-34XBR960, I decided to see what was in the overscan area of my set and I adjusted the horizontal and vertical sizing, stretch, and shutter parameters so I could see the entire crosshatch pattern (1920x1080). I have included here jpg's of my adjusted geometry before looking at the overscan area (image1) and then (image2) where I can see the entire perimeter, almost.

I was surprised to see such distortion in the overscan area, although it explains some to the extreme geometry adjustments I am having to make. First, note the clipping in the upper left corner. It is not due to the curving of the left vertical but due to a hard to see here bending of the canvas inward away from the left corner that blanks off the image. What is causing this and how do I correct it? Second, note the inward bowing of the right vertical. With some adjustments the far right vertical will actually fold over the second right vertical. I think that this is caused by the beam hitting the edge of the tube and overlaying on the rest of the image.

If I move the image to the left to avoid the distortion on the right, I loose more and more of the image in the upper left corner

I want to correct these faults before adjusting convergence. My adjusted geometry doesn't look to bad but I am having to use shutter adjustments to cut off too much of the image. I want to see the perimeter line of the entire crosshatch without distortion.

I originally removed all of the permalloy magnets installed by a Sony technician to remove color blotching because they caused some pretty severe distortion which he said he could not correct. I have played with reattachment of the magnets but cannot correct the convergence issues. If I can improve the distortion in the overscan area, it would help a lot in making it possible to correct the convergence.

It's also kind of interesting that the upper left corner and center right distortions of the crosshatch pattern are the locations of the color blotching that I adjusted out with landing parameters!

I am new to the forum, so please bear with me if my terminology is not correct. Please tell me what is right. There is a plastic frame for the CRT. There is the visable CRT screen area. There is a scan area that the guns cover in the screen area. Then there is an image area in which the image overlays within the scan area. What I called the "canvas" was the scan area which in my case is not showing the entire image and it is not a rectangle. It is not easily shown, but the left side of the scan has a curved edge that bends away from the left side as it gets closer to the upper left, where I loose the image. The geometry adjustments change the grid lines in the crosshatch but do not effect the curve in the perimeter of the scan.

Comments are encouraged.

Hi,

Seems like you're much more technicaly inclined than I am so please know my comments are more layman than anything else.

I don't believe a cross-hatch should be used to adjust overscan. Overscan patterns have specific lines indicating safety zones whereas horizontal or vertical size based on areas where the cross-hatch lines end could be too extreme and cause inward bowing.

Also, was that the 960's internal cross-hatch pattern that you used? Please know using this cross-hatch caused major geometrical distoration not only on corners but throughout the entire screen when viewing regular 16x9 material whereas I was able to properly adjust the geometry (as well as could be expected for a CRT) by using patterns from an external source instead. Why, I don't know, but it worked.

Please note my horizontal overscan test pattern lines in the upper left corner don't appear perfectly straight whereas the equivalent lines in my cross-hatch pattern do. And while viewing 16x9 content this distoration is hardly noticable.

Hope this helps. Let me know.

Joe

how do you access an internal cross hatch pattern, Joe?

how do you access an internal cross hatch pattern, Joe?

I really don't recall since I came across them once when scanning through the service menu. I didn't record the item number because I had a frightening experience and swore never to access them again.

We were unable to remove the patterns and watch the cable box connected to Video 7. Did not know a different item (PATN) is used to turn off the internal test pattern generator rather than a setting within the pattern mode itself. When accessing the generator the default for PATN is automaticly changed from "0" (off) to "1" (on).

Not knowing this I contacted Sony customer service which was also unaware of how to resolve the problem. Was told to call the technical service department during regular business hours. Not wishing to lose a night's sleep I went through the pain staking process of going through every item and adjustment until finally coming across group QM and item #1 (PATN). It was on 1 and setting it to 0 of course enabled the picture to finally return.

Naturally, in my excitement I failed to remember one needed to WRITE that new setting (0) to retain the disabling of the test pattern generator. Therefore the patterns kept re-appearing after turning the set off to get out of service. Realized my mistake after two or three times turning the set on and off.

When the test patterns are accessed one can still surf through other service items to make the necessary adjustments. Guess I don't need to worry now but there were so many different types of test patterns (white level, etc.) available I figure that temptation might cause me to mess up other settings cause so many of them are intertwined. Also, the 960's volume has to be lowered to zero before invoking the patterns (otherwise you'll hear a piercing high pitched noise).

Again, sorry I don't have the actual service code available but I think you'll be better off using external patterns which proved to be more accurate.

The crosshatch pattern I used came from KenTech at the beginning of The Sony Service Codes forum. I will attach it here to this message. Actually it is labeled as a conversion test.

The point of using this pattern is that I wanted a reference of where the extent of the 1920x1080 image perimeter would be. I had hoped to be able to get the whole image within the scan area, which I cannot. Exposing the overscan area is the only way to see where the image perimeter is.

The crosshatch pattern I used came from KenTech at the beginning of The Sony Service Codes forum. I will attach it here to this message. Actually it is labeled as a conversion test.

The point of using this pattern is that I wanted a reference of where the extent of the 1920x1080 image perimeter would be. I had hoped to be able to get the whole image within the scan area, which I cannot. Exposing the overscan area is the only way to see where the image perimeter is.

Actually, it is convergence (which is accurate when no color is seen on the white) but that is the extent of my technical expertise LOL.

Just because the entire image may not apear on the screen does not necessarily mean you have improper overscan. The best way to tell is with the overscan test pattern with safety margins.

Since you followed the steps for vertical and horizontal centering and sizing in sections 4.1 (full) and 4.4 (wide zoom) in the AVS Sony service code link, did you continue with the rest of the geometry settings in those two sections? Adjusting the horizontal and vertical size at minimum affects the VSCO and SLIN, causing boxes on the sides to not appear the same as those in the middle of the cross-hatch pattern.

- Joe

The crosshatch pattern I used came from KenTech at the beginning of The Sony Service Codes forum. I will attach it here to this message. Actually it is labeled as a conversion test.Check out this pattern (which I attach again). It is 1920x1080, has the overscan perimiter inside of the external rectangle, has a centering-pattern, has cross-hatch, has tiny dots inside of each cell for terrific value adjusting convergence, and all around is a wonderful pattern.

It came from DisplayMate for Windows Video Edition.

Originally Posted by Fizzboom
The crosshatch pattern I used came from KenTech at the beginning of The Sony Service Codes forum. I will attach it here to this message. Actually it is labeled as a conversion test.

Originally Posted by DSperber:

Check out this pattern (which I attach again). It is 1920x1080, has the overscan perimiter inside of the external rectangle, has a centering-pattern, has cross-hatch, has tiny dots inside of each cell for terrific value adjusting convergence, and all around is a wonderful pattern.

It came from DisplayMate for Windows Video Edition.

Fizzboom,

As you can the top, bottom, left and right rows of the crosshatch pattern should not appear on the screen. Is your overscan now actually correct?

- Joe

I have gone through section 4.1 Full Mode Adjustment and have a copy of 4.1 to 4.6. My geometry looks very good except for that the upper corners show a bend toward the sides that will not adjust. I was thinking that the static mode adjustments may never have been accurately set but didn't want to fiddle with rotation of the yoke magnets. I made adjustments so that I was not beyond the overscan perimeter, so I do not see the distortion I was looking at before. I would like to make proper shutter adjustments but don't have a procedure.

The overscan.zip file is a .bmp. I need a .jpg to use it with the memory stick and the memory stick window always obscures the lower part of the any image with a control bar.

I have been looking in the AVS Service Codes forum for the rest of the adjustment procedures from the same manual as 4.1 to 4.6 above but have not found them.

As I stated in earlier messages, I removed the small square permalloy magnets put in place by the technician and it greatly improved my geometry. The only permalloy magnet left in place is one narrow strip at an angle of 10 o'clock. I have tried to use the small magnets to correct horizontal divergence in the upper corners but they are not very effective and cause assymetrical distortion.

I am still in a learning mode here and will readjust some things after I am confident about what the interactions from one menu to another are. In any case, my picture quality has been improving. I am a little confused right now about making adjustments other than the full screen 1080i. The QM menu test pattern selections for 480i look like full screen patterns. When I am using one of these patterns does my set need to be tuned to a channel that has 480i content?

Hi Fizzboom,

Glad to know you're making progress.

Regarding corner geometry, though not listed in those instructions there are a few more items under category 2170D-2 that will help further. If you haven't come across them, they are:

9 - UXCG (upper extra corner pin gain)
10 - LXCG (lower extra corner pin gain)
11 - UXCP (upper extra corner pin position)
12 - LXCP (lower extra corner pin position)

There might be more but these seemed enough to tackle the problem for me.

Overall, many settings affect both full and wide-zoom. For those that are dependent upon mode, can you view the cross-hatch pattern through video 7 in wide-screen as well? If not, can it be seen via a non-HD output (video one through five)? If so, just set the picture mode to wide-zoom. If not, check to see if you have a standard definition DVD with a THX optomizer (this is included with any THX certified DVD and can be found by clicking the THX logo that appears in the special features menu) -- the color pattern also has rows of squares you can refer to (though not as extensive as an actual cross-hatch pattern it should be sufficient). Just set your picture to wide-zoom.

Hope this non-technician has been of some help and do let me know if there are any other questions you might have.

Ciao,
Joe

The overscan.zip file is a .bmp. I need a .jpg to use it with the memory stick and the memory stick window always obscures the lower part of the any image with a control bar.Any photo editing program can convert BMP to JPG.

I've attached a JPG for you (from Photoshop conversion).

Can't help with the obscuring of the lower part of any image on a memory stick... but it's going to make it tricky to adjust things down in the lower part of the screen real estate.

Fizzboom,

Here's the AVS link with instructions of how to access the internal test patterns:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7393075&&#post7393075

IMPORTANT REMINDERS:

1) Turn your volume all the way down to "0" before accessing the test patterns (otherwise you will hear a loud, piercing sound).

2) When finished using the patterns the only way to turn off the internal test pattern generator is to then go to group QM, item #1 (PATN). When you access the pattern generator, QM item #1 also automaticaly goes from "0" (off) to "1" (on) and needs to be set back to "0" to enable the video source to again appear.

3) Although setting QM item #1 back to "0" returns you to the actual video source remember to WRITE the change back to "0" to retain the off setting. If you don't, when turning the set back on the patterns (and not your video source) will still appear on the screen and QM item #1 will still be at "1" (on).

I finally decided to bite the bullet and jump into the Section 2: Set-Up Adjustments.

Making these static adjustments was not as risky as I thought they may be. I ended up having to push the yoke assembly about another eighth inch into the tube. You have to remove the support wedges around the yoke to do this. This got rid of any telltale color blotches at the edges and gave me much better geometry even without adjustments. Anyone doing this should be careful not to overtighten the setscrew securing the yoke in place or you could break your tube.

I was having difficulty making the static horizonal line convergence adjustments with permalloy magnets. The manual refers to rotatable disk magets which do not exist on my set or are missing. I can see slots at each corner of the plastic support in front of the purity control and vertical static adjustment handles. The horizonal convergence pot RV9001 only takes care of the center of the screen. Adjustment of the four static adjustment handles would not allow correction of horizonal line convergence over the whole screen.

Just a note hear: Convergence of the horizonal lines is actually vertical convergence of the three color dots.

After trying all sorts of magnet placements around the yoke and on the tube, I determined that these small permalloy magnets could not possibly fix my problem. My center convergence was fine. At the sides the divergence from the horizonal line was progressively worse from bottom to top with the center of the lines perfect. I tried tilting the yoke to correct the problem with no luck.

Finally I found some strong ferrite cylindrical magnets that I placed at the upper slots of the plastic support in front of the adjustment handles. This had a dramatic effect and converged the horizonal lines effectively. The strength of the magnets is enough that their fields are probably intersecting across the tube. In addition it made the correction without any vertical line distortion. The vertical lines at the sides did need some convergence adjustments but everything was symmetrical and easily corrected.

The only concern I have is if for some reason the presence of the strong magnets will have some risidual effect over time but everything looks fine right now.

I finally decided to bite the bullet and jump into the Section 2: Set-Up Adjustments.

Making these static adjustments was not as risky as I thought they may be. I ended up having to push the yoke assembly about another eighth inch into the tube. You have to remove the support wedges around the yoke to do this. This got rid of any telltale color blotches at the edges and gave me much better geometry even without adjustments. Anyone doing this should be careful not to overtighten the setscrew securing the yoke in place or you could break your tube.

I was having difficulty making the static horizonal line convergence adjustments with permalloy magnets. The manual refers to rotatable disk magets which do not exist on my set or are missing. I can see slots at each corner of the plastic support in front of the purity control and vertical static adjustment handles. The horizonal convergence pot RV9001 only takes care of the center of the screen. Adjustment of the four static adjustment handles would not allow correction of horizonal line convergence over the whole screen.

Just a note hear: Convergence of the horizonal lines is actually vertical convergence of the three color dots.

After trying all sorts of magnet placements around the yoke and on the tube, I determined that these small permalloy magnets could not possibly fix my problem. My center convergence was fine. At the sides the divergence from the horizonal line was progressively worse from bottom to top with the center of the lines perfect. I tried tilting the yoke to correct the problem with no luck.

Finally I found some strong ferrite cylindrical magnets that I placed at the upper slots of the plastic support in front of the adjustment handles. This had a dramatic effect and converged the horizonal lines effectively. The strength of the magnets is enough that their fields are probably intersecting across the tube. In addition it made the correction without any vertical line distortion. The vertical lines at the sides did need some convergence adjustments but everything was symmetrical and easily corrected.

The only concern I have is if for some reason the presence of the strong magnets will have some risidual effect over time but everything looks fine right now.


Hi Fizzboom:

Glad things worked out OK.

- Joe

I scoured the retail landscape high and low, in spite of scrutiny from friends and family, to find this elusive gem, and I’d just like to say that after coming here and reading what all you folks have to say, I finally feel vindicated. :)

Just thought of this.

I have the cable wire split before going into the box. My cable system is all digital and I'm able to watch unscrambled stations using twin view But since the right-hand screen only supports non-digital sources would that be affected once the digital conversion takes place?

Just thought of this.

I have the cable wire split before going into the box. My cable system is all digital and I'm able to watch unscrambled stations using twin view But since the right-hand screen only supports non-digital sources would that be affected once the digital conversion takes place?

If your system is all digital now, then you should not be able to watch anything in the right hand side. It sounds like they have a mix of duplicate analog/digital now if you can still use the right hand twin view.

Use a vcr for the right hand side and you get PIP.

Use a vcr for the right hand side and you get PIP.

Was concerned about still being able to see certain unscrambled stations on the right-side once the transition begin. While our provider has been all-digital for years, as Beach notes some seem to still be duplicated in analog (which explains why these stations are repeated on different channels using the 960's QAM tuner).

Been waiting for Blu ray to go 2.0 and now I'm tempted to get a player but is it worth it with only a 34 inch display? Can you notice any sound improvement with only built in speakers? I have no reciever or surround sound system :o Thinking of getting the Panny BD-55K (unless suggested otherwise)
I know new players are coming spring '09 (Denon,Oppo,Pioneer) Do I wait?
HELP! :confused:

I want to get that player, too. It will provide the audio directly into my "older" 7.1 receiver. If you appreciate HDTV through your TV now, Blu-Ray is the next step better. Maybe someone here has a Blu-ray on a XBR now..

I had thought that the HDMI wasn't working on the tv at first and then I got a blu ray player and hooked it up via component. I didn't get what the big deal was.

Then I figured out what I did wrong and the HDMI WAS working.

I cannot go back to dvd now. Blu ray looks awesome on this set. It's like having a mini kuro...next year's model :)

If you haven't properly watched blu ray, you won't understand. 34 inches is definitely large enough to make a difference. It put my Oppo dv-981 to shame.

The sound coming from the speakers was definitely crisper, sharper, and all around better than dvd- even from the Oppo.

Buy a panny bd-35, ps3, or sony S550 and take the leap.

I want to get that player, too. It will provide the audio directly into my "older" 7.1 receiver. If you appreciate HDTV through your TV now, Blu-Ray is the next step better. Maybe someone here has a Blu-ray on a XBR now..

Got mixed emotions about getting a blu-ray. I know it will provide the most outstanding picture quality out there but at the same time so many of the DVDs released today also offer incredible pictures due to advanced digital mastering. One can see how far standard definition DVDs have come by comparing any original 007 DVD with the newly released frame by frame digitally remastered version.

Which brings up a point that's bothering me. Like many of you, my wife and I have an extensive collection of DVDs. We're now beginning to again watch some that we hadn't seen in seven and eight years. Couldn't help notice the slightly grainier picture on titles such as "A Summer Place", "From Hell" and "Lost Souls". Reducing the 960's user sharpness and edge enhancement (perfect for discs released the past half decade or so) eliminated the harshness at the expense of way too soft a picture.

We originally saw these discs on an older, non-digital, non-component 4x3 32 inch set. They're now being viewed for the first time on the 960 with it's super fine-pitch picture tube, superior line-doubling process, etc. The 960 certainly enhances older discs of good quality but also brings out the deficiencies inherent in some other older ones.

So my hesitation in purchasing a blu-ray player is that I'm happy with the way new releases on standard DVD appears on the 960 while the 1080i upconversion of a blu-ray player would probably also bring out more of the grain appearing on many of those older ones.

From what I've read, 1080i upconversion isn't necessary for screens under 40 inches and CRTs. Am I wrong? Would a player's 1080i upconversion actually smooth out the grainess better than the 960's line-doubler? If so, I might consider investing in a standard player with upconversion to enhance those older discs.

Blu-Ray is to broadcast HDTV what DVD is to broadcast SD. Well, close enough I think, but I guess it would depend on how close you sit to the set...

I got a Panny bd-30 about 4 months ago and hooked it up to my 960. There is a definite improvement if you move in close. I've got the audio running through a very nice 5.1 Rocket speaker setup with a separate 3 channel Aragon amp driving the LCR speakers and an Onkyo 805 handling the two surrounds. If I sit back on the couch, maybe 8 feet away, the video difference isn't so noticeable. I watched the second Pirates of the Caribbean on SD and Casino Royale on Blu-Ray recently, back to back. The production values were so high on both of them there was very little video quality difference from where I was sitting. Moving in closer and I could see it though. If you are casually watching with family and friends from mid room I don't think it matters as much. Half the distance and you start to "get it". The sound quality was more noticeable to me.

I did watch the new remastered Blu-ray releases of the Godfather series and they were noticeably improved over the SD versions, esp. the first one. I think it comes down to how critically you want to watch. The quality improvement is there but it's not exactly night and day.

Hi Harvest,

I also noticed a difference between DVD and BluRay when watching a store demonstration, however, it was on a 46 inch Sony LCD and the bigger the screen more is the need for BluRay or upconversion. I also agree the difference would not be like night and day when viwed on the 960's superior 34-inch CRT.

I still wonder if 1080i upconversion eliminates the grain apparent on some older DVDs in lieu of a 480p ouput enhanced by Sony's line-doubler system. The on-line consensus is that upconversion is necessary for screens larger than 40 inches so it's my guess that upconversion has no affect on graininess inherent on some discs made during the early years of DVD (before the digital mastering process improved to what it is today).

The more superior the screen, the more obvious the massive difference in resolution and bit rate should be. Upconversion does nothing truly real in this regard. For any movie I really cared about, there's no way I would buy a DVD if a Blu-Ray were available...

But the 960 is a great screen, so I think we're really talking about size and viewing distance here...

The more superior the screen, the more obvious the massive difference in resolution and bit rate should be. Upconversion does nothing truly real in this regard. For any movie I really cared about, there's no way I would buy a DVD if a Blu-Ray were available...

But the 960 is a great screen, so I think we're really talking about size and viewing distance here...


That's what I always thought as well, so I guess the lesser quality picture on some older DVDs would be even worse on other sets and would not be helped by any 1080i upconverting. It's apparent this is a reflection of older digital mastering. For example, newly remastered Bond films open with a frame-by-frame digital mastering demo comparing the old videos to the new ones; essentially that's how many of our older ones appear - a little grainy and a little more harsher with less vivid color. Yet other very old ones like "South Pacific" are beautiful. And the original "Goldeneye" (one of the first DVDs to be released) depends upon scene.

Now I know why so many titles like the "Die Hard" series are released a second time -- their original digital mastering was just not up to par. Too bad there are so many of those types to replace.

I wanted to post about the 960's I had calibrated on Saturday (I have two). I engaged the services of Chad Billheimer (http://hdtvbychadb.com/), both because he was available and had experience in using magenets to correct the geometric distortion often found in these Sony superfine pitch sets. He arrived earlier than expected, and spent five hours working on the living room set, then another three doing geometry and convergence corrections only (per my request) on the bedroom set. He was very meticulous in his work, redoing geometry over and over again, then checking it with a cloth tape-measure, until he was absolutely sure that it was the best that it could be. He used magnets to correct as much of the distortion as possible, fixed the convergence, calibrated ALL the input types on the set, sometime repeatedly for different resolutions supported by HDMI and OTA (1080i, 720p, 480p, 480i), and even adjusted a piece of hardware inside the TV to give the picture a tighter focus. The colors weren't very off to begin with (around 6850K pre-calibration) and were a bit saturated according to Chad, but he somehow made the colors seem stronger and better... the TV looks utterly fantastic now. For the bedroom set, I had had the colors calibrated by another technician at the beginning of the year, so I had him apply magnets to correct the geometry. He even found issues with the convergence (which was WAY off and not fixed by the prior tech) and fixed that, in addition to almost completely eliminating some purple blotches that were appearing on the upper left and right corner of the screen. Even though it wasn't a "complete" calibration for the bedroom set, it is MUCH better looking than it was before. As I'm a bit iffy about some of the work that was done on it at the beginning of the year, I am already planning to hire him again next year to tweak the bedroom set some more. He's a bit pricier than some techs, but again, he calibrates all inputs not just 2 or 3, and he is more than willing to make sure you get the most performance out of your equipment and for me that work ethic and attention to detail matter more than saving $200 vs. another tech.

By the by, while talking about the sharpness, I talked with him about how I've heard it's better to have the sharpness turned off completely. Chad told me this was incorrect for this particular set. Some TVs do need to have the sharpness turned to 0 to eliminate edge enhancement, but others actually artificially blur the picture when you turn the sharpness down below a certain point. I've had the sharpness turned down to 0 for the last 10 months and have been unhappy with how the sets looked, but kept it at 0 since I thought that was "correct". After Chad made the proper sharpness adjustment, HD looks WAY better and I enjoy watching TV and blu-rays a lot more now. If you're concerned about edge enhancecement, just remember that having it at 0 isn't necessarily correct, and if you're actively unhappy with an overly soft picture, there is nothing wrong with turning up the sharpness if it DOES look better.

Hi Shadow,

Lucky you, having two 960's while there are so many others out there wishing they were the owners of just one.

Happy for you with the way the callibrations came out and being so happy with the way the picture now looks. I know the feeling, having done some service tweaking myself but obviously not with the expertise and extent of Mr. Billheimer (mine were for geometry, overscan, sharpness and midi - used color adjustments recommended by Ken Tech).

And thanks for letting us know that lower sharpness settings are not recommended for the set. After tweaking with the MIDI, I was able to actualy have my sharpness go up to the mid-forties with medium edge-enhancement. The result is a razor sharp picture with no snow, graininess or harshness on both HD and 480p DVD (as posted earlier, there is a slight grain on some much older DVDs but that is due to the mastering and not my settings).

Talking about being floored by the picture, have you or anyone else in this forum seen the DVD release of 2007's "Journey To The Center Of The Earth" in 3-D? The movie itself was so-so but from the first frame to the final closing credit the 3-D effects were nothing short of fantastic! Was like those viewmasters we had as kids.

Since the 960 already has some sort of three-dimensional feel to it, I doubt the special effects would appear as mind boggeling on a flat screen LCD. While halos could be seen along with a certain amount of eye-strain wearing those red and blue glasses I would really recommend this DVD for the unique experience of seeing 3-D on one's 960 - and it comes with four pairs of glasses.

Hi Shadow,

Lucky you, having two 960's while there are so many others out there wishing they were the owners of just one.
Lucky me! :D It was a bit difficult getting them though... I had to drive three hours from Charlotte to Durham to pick up the one for the bedroom; after I told the seller I needed to delay the trip a week due to rain (6 hour round-trip in bad weather? No way!), he got a little squirrely started asking me if I was no longer interested in the set. I managed to get it the next weekend and also picked up a 910 (used electronic store threw in Samsung HDTV tuner with it to make up for the lack of ATSC tuner). I got the 910 ISF calibrated, but then it broke 4 months later, and I had to pay $500 to get it fixed. When I found a guy in Charlotte was selling his 960 for $475, I gave the 910 to my mom (she used a 27" JVC from 1998... composite was the best connection on that sucker) to use with the Toshiba A-2 player I gave her for Christmas (yes, she was using the A-2 with a composite connection up to that point; I gave her an HDMI to DVI cable to use with the 910).

Happy for you with the way the callibrations came out and being so happy with the way the picture now looks. I know the feeling, having done some service tweaking myself but obviously not with the expertise and extent of Mr. Billheimer (mine were for geometry, overscan, sharpness and midi - used color adjustments recommended by Ken Tech).
What's midi?

And thanks for letting us know that lower sharpness settings are not recommended for the set. After tweaking with the MIDI, I was able to actualy have my sharpness go up to the mid-forties with medium edge-enhancement. The result is a razor sharp picture with no snow, graininess or harshness on both HD and 480p DVD (as posted earlier, there is a slight grain on some much older DVDs but that is due to the mastering and not my settings).
While settings will obviously vary between sets, try a sharpness of 25 sometime with Clear Edge turned off... that's the setting on both my sets right now, and I think it brings out the detail without adding any visible edge enhancement. When Chad was doing the geometry, we experimented with the clear edge while viewing a geometry test pattern. It seemed to create a sort of "ghost" line next to some of the geometry patterns on screen; you might be better off with that feature of the set turned off, IMO.

Talking about being floored by the picture, have you or anyone else in this forum seen the DVD release of 2007's "Journey To The Center Of The Earth" in 3-D? The movie itself was so-so but from the first frame to the final closing credit the 3-D effects were nothing short of fantastic! Was like those viewmasters we had as kids.
Nope, haven't seen it. I might have to check it out.

Since the 960 already has some sort of three-dimensional feel to it, I doubt the special effects would appear as mind boggeling on a flat screen LCD. While halos could be seen along with a certain amount of eye-strain wearing those red and blue glasses I would really recommend this DVD for the unique experience of seeing 3-D on one's 960 - and it comes with four pairs of glasses.
What amazes me is that after getting the 960 calibrated by Chad, the tier 0/tier 1 blu-ray discs I have (Speed Racer, Iron Man, Incredible Hulk, Shoot Em' Up) really do look 3D and like I'm looking through a window instead of at a pre-recorded image on a TV. After experiencing this, I'm still surprised by some of the posters in this forum who insist that blu-ray isn't worth watching on this set due to the size. I notice a huge difference in DVD and hi-def media. In particular, my HD-DVD of Dawn of the Dead is like night and day compared to the upscaled version of the regular DVD. Unless you drop 6K on a Pioneer Kuro, there really isn't any other consumer-level tv out there that equals the 960 in terms of picture quality.

A little off-topic, but I'm planning to get the new Echostar OTA DVR that's coming out in November to complement my home theater system (okay, I only have a single set of Insignia bookshelf speakers, but still). I've never had a DVR before, but hopefully it'll provide a good quality image when playing back recordings. Given the small size of the custom 960 stand, the only question is where I'm going to put the bugger after I get it. Is there anywhere on AVS to ask about A/V racks to hold home theater equipment?

I wanted to post about the 960's I had calibrated on Saturday (I have two). I engaged the services of Chad Billheimer (http://hdtvbychadb.com/), both because he was available and had experience in using magenets to correct the geometric distortion often found in these Sony superfine pitch sets.Thanks for your report. It's the second direct view CRT report that I've been able to include in the list (Post#1) that's linked at the bottom of my post.

If anyone knows about other direct view CRT calibration reports please let me know.

Hi Shadow,

The 960 is worth a long, tiring trip in bad weather as long as it's safe to drive.

Fogive the typo - I meant MIDE and not MIDI. From what I understand, MIDE (2170P-3 item 16) gives 64 combinations of brightness, contrast, sharpness, etc. so one has to pick the best one.

My guess is with the clear-edge off and sharpness set to 25 my set might also appear the same as it now if I had chosen a different MIDE. When determining my service setting (movie mode) I kept sharpness in the middle and turned edge enhanacement off. Some options were too soft, too harsh, too dark, etc Once I settled in the one that looked best (using a HD crosshatch pattern) I then made the finer adjustments with the user settings. Had the user sharpness been lower and clear-edge kept on I might have arrived at a different MIDE with the same results. I do know that the change in sharpness going from 0 to 63 is more subtle now than it was before re-adjusting MIDE.

With these settings I don't have any "ghosts". The cross hatch lines aare sharp, straight, not edgy and the white does not bleed across into the black.

My DVR fits on the adjustable shelf of the 960's custom stand. Am I correct that you're not a cable/dish/phone susbcriber since you are using an OTA antenna? If you are a subscriber, then why not simply rent the DVR from your provider? There can't be anything OTA that isn't on cable/dish/phone.

So many of today's DVDs are digitally mastered by a state of the art process which delivers a fantasticly beautiful picture on the 960 thanks to the set's great super-fine CRT, line-doubling process, etc. No doubt it would be enhanced even more on bluray in subtle ways like more of the 3-dimensional feel you noted, etc. But I think down the road bluray will be the norm and the question will be for naught.

Now get "Journey" in 3D to enjoy the experience, even if not so much the film itself.

Joe

My DVR fits on the adjustable shelf of the 960's custom stand. Am I correct that you're not a cable/dish/phone susbcriber since you are using an OTA antenna? If you are a subscriber, then why not simply rent the DVR from your provider? There can't be anything OTA that isn't on cable/dish/phone.
I've been using OTA since 1998 when I was in college. I realized that I didn't really watch anything except the local channels, so it was a waste of money for me. While I have the occasional reception problem due to living near an airport, the locals look great in hi-def, and have better image quality that if I got the same channels through satellite or cable. The DVR I get (echostar, TIVO, or even an old Sony if the guide still works after the digital transition) needs to have a free guide (or lifetime subscription) because I just don't want to deal with any monthly bills. I pay upfront for the equipment and/or guide costs and I can forget about needing to pay $12 a month or whatever.

Currently, my custom stand has a receiver and a PS3, so even if I was willing to try to stack components, the size, heat output, and shape of these two devices make it impossible to put anymore AV gear in the stand. As it is, I have my Gamecube sitting on top of one of the Insignia speakers because I have nowhere else to put it.

Back in August, I bought the Tivo HD with lifetime support. It was $399 at that time. On cable and antenna. Cox installed an "M" card so I can record two channels simultaneously. I could not see another monthly fee.

The only strange thing is that Tivo does not separate the cable input and the antenna input. So, for example, if I select 51 on the Tivo, I go first to 51 antenna and channel up to get to 51 cable (golf). Of course the 960 fed directly does not have this problem.

I am feeding my 960 with component and HDMI and component is brighter with my current settings.

FYI.

I am feeding my 960 with component and HDMI and component is brighter with my current settings.

FYI.

My HD also appeared brighter when comparing HDMI to component but I found component could not obtain the same deep black utilizing HD test patterns for picture and brightness adjustments. The reduced black level caused the picture to lack in overall depth compared to HDMI .

i'm color blind and often enjoy not noticing the reportedly-wrong colors on my 34xbr2.
years ago i used the service manual info to adjust the geometry so it's straight on
the bottom and a little curved on the top, instead of vice versa.
recently my 9-yo son helped me adjust the color setting on the video-5,
hdr-230 HD-PVR input so people do not appear green.
(actual green people look nicely tanned to me).

I own this set, calibrated by both Chad few years ago and Greg Loewen more recently and let me tell you: this is the best TV in the world.

Today I tried a 34xbr2 (2nd best TV in the world) remote control on a 34xbr960 tv (best tv in the world).
Nothing spectacular occurred. The xbr2 remote did work on the expected/overlapping xbr960 functions - no easter-egg or secret picture-in-picture/side-by-side picture functionality ;) .
I like the way the sony web site reminds us that the xbr960/xbr2 have internal
ATSC tuners and are ready for "the DTV transition". As if we OTA-DTV utopians had forgotten about the ATSC tuners. :}

I agree with your ranking, owning both myself.

Correction: My mistake in reading your posting, my #2 is a Sony 32XBR2 (squared) also known as a 32XBR100.

those 32 & 36 4:3 XBRs were awesome TVs also! Probably the #1 4:3 TV,
although I am partial to the panasonic 32xf56 (fx56?) which does great with an external semi-working QAM tuner (i think it does QAM64 but not QAM256, or something. it's a bit low on the brains to fully demodulate QAM, let's say).

How do folks deal with adapting for more component inputs on their 34xbr960 or xbr2?
the HDMI on the 960 is shweet, I would like that feature but I'd probably prefer a 3rd component/1080i input.
I use a gamestop component-video-switcher but it's just so annoying and non-remotecontrolled.
What do other folks use/prefer to switch component-vid for their XBR960s or XBR2s / etc ?
thank you and may all your electron beams remain optimally aligned.

How do folks deal with adapting for more component inputs on their 34xbr960 or xbr2?Zektor HDS4 (http://www.zektor.com/hds4/index.html).

4-in, 1-out, optical/coax digital audio in and out (with built-in transcoding between optical/coax), along with component video and L/R analog audio.

And... remote control.

I have INPUT5 (on my 34XBR960) set for 480p from DVD player, and INPUT6 accepting output from HDS4 (where I have four 720p/1080i HD sources as input). That way I can set user/service adjustments for 480p (ED) separate from 720p/1080i (HD) on the two separate component video XBR960 inputs.

I was just curious about this: what does Super Fine Pitch mean in terms of resolution?

Also, how can I change the bottom half of the picture in the service menu- playing with the geometry? I can adjust the top half, but the bottom won't budge. At least, I don't have an idea what section it's under.

Thanks

kd34xbr960

Is the monitor video out a digital signal? I want to attach a dvd recorder without a tuner to and record digital televison OTA.

I am suspect that it is analog because of the PIP is analog. I don't want to purchase the video recorder to find out.

I was just curious about this: what does Super Fine Pitch mean in terms of resolution?

Also, how can I change the bottom half of the picture in the service menu- playing with the geometry? I can adjust the top half, but the bottom won't budge. At least, I don't have an idea what section it's under.

Thanks
Consumer level CRTS have a resolution far below 1920x1080. The Superfine pitch sets have a resolution of 1400x1080, which is closer to the 1080i standard.

I was just curious about this: what does Super Fine Pitch mean in terms of resolution?

Also, how can I change the bottom half of the picture in the service menu- playing with the geometry? I can adjust the top half, but the bottom won't budge. At least, I don't have an idea what section it's under.

Thanks

For the bottom only:

Under 2107D - 1
Item 16 LVLN (vertical lower linerearity)

Under 2107D - 2
Item 8 LCP (lower corner pin correction)
Item 10 LXCG (extra lower corner pin correction)
Item 12 LXCP (extra lower corner pin position)

Also, if you want to change the bottom overscan (either too much or too little picture) I believe it is:

Under 2107D - 3
Item 5 BBLK (Bottom Blanking Shutter)

Hope this helps -- let us know.

Joe

Consumer level CRTS have a resolution far below 1920x1080. The Superfine pitch sets have a resolution of 1400x1080, which is closer to the 1080i standard.

Does this mean the 960 doesn't meet the resolutation standard for HD? How could that be possible if many consider it has the best HD picture available?

Does this mean the 960 doesn't meet the resolutation standard for HD? How could that be possible if many consider it has the best HD picture available?

As has been noted in various threads, both ISF and THX list resolution as the #4 item in terms of importance for a good picture.

Also remember that the award winning Kuro Plasmas did not do 1920x1080 until the last generation.

Does this mean the 960 doesn't meet the resolutation standard for HD? How could that be possible if many consider it has the best HD picture available?

It has superior motion handling, blacks, and colors compared to any other set on the market. Technically, there are LOTS of sets on the market that don't meet the "true" standards on the market as a lot of 720p LCD sets have resolutions higher than 1280x720. The set has resolution higher than 720p so you can consider it a true hi-def set, even if it doesn't handle a full 1080 signal.

I went back to a warm setting on my display and I kept the default setting on advanced video. I like nuetral, but since I can't really monitor grayscale, or have any interest in getting my tv professionally calibrated ($$$), I've gone to back to what looks best.

color and brightness are at 31- brightness at 28 was crushing blacks slightly. Shadow detail has slightly improved. I'm over the whole "can't see where the screen ends and the bezel begins" stuff. I was going kuro crazy there :)

Does anyone have any settings that got 2.2 on gamma? I tried some of those service menu settings with shadows and blacks, but I felt the picture suffered. I can't remember if it was Joe or someone elses, so I went back to factory settings.

I had played around making the hue colors equal @31 in the service menu. My setting was initially 30 or closer to red. Well, it seems it's true what they say about sony tvs, the picture has a slight green tint now. So, I've set the picture control with the hue at a -1 towards red. My controller is screwed up and the menu button only works on the tv.

My bluray player has slight red push to it, but I feel it evens out the sony's natural settings.

Do some xbr960's support HDCP and some not? I have an Samsung DVD-R135 DVD player the plays DVD's through the HDMI port no problem. My time warner cable box will not work with my HDMI and I get an on screen message saying my TV doesn't support HDCP. My PS3 and xBox play games fine through HDMI, but when I play a Blu-Ray movie on the PS3 or stream Netflix movies through the xBox I get a HDCP error. Is anyone else experiencing this? Is it that the my XBR960 doesn't support HDCP or has my HDCP circuitry gone bad?

Thanks

Thanks Beach and Shadow for explaining why it's not necessary to have the highest resolution currently available in order to get the best possible picture on HD. Thought it was an important spec but as with other things, it's just another case of manufactuerers and salesmen pitching something that's not as important as it appears.

Isn't it good to know that even with all the advances made in flat panel and DSP technology the past few years that other than the Kuro plasma there still isn't a set that touches the 960?

I've grown attached to my 34xbr960 over the past four years, but I decided it was time for something larger. Anyone know what a good resale price is for this set?

I've grown attached to my 34xbr960 over the past four years, but I decided it was time for something larger. Anyone know what a good resale price is for this set?

Here is one in Plano for $450:
http://dallas.craigslist.org/dal/ele/947258214.html

Ebay often has them, and over the last few months they go for between $150 and ~ $400 on auctions. They often have a "Buy It Now" price of $350 to $500.

All have been for local pickup only, of course.

I plan to sell my 960 and stand if I get a good price but before doing so I would like to know if its possible via the service menu to determine how many hours the set has been turned on.

Today, I went into the service menu to see if this information was available. I knew that there are tons of picture adjustments in the service menu but I'm not interested in tweaking those. I didn't find any section that listed the amount of hours the set has been on but I did see a heading named info. I would think if the amount of time the set is turned on has been tracked, it would be under the info section but I certainly didn't see it there.

Is this information simply not tracked by the set? I am estimating my set has only been on for about 1300 hours but mostly for my own curiousity I would like to know the exact hours if this information is available. Thanks

Heh, you found my craigslist post. I only asked the question here because I'm not getting many hits on it. I'm sure there isn't a huge market for tube sets outside of the enthusiast circle.

I just bought this set the other day. The girlfriend says I can't open it til christmas(I sneak when shes sleeping). Got it from craigslist for $400. It looks awesome, I passed on all the LCDs and Plasmas(some were OK) for this set cause imo a nice CRT can't be beat for image quality. Thing is the guy bought 2 of these in nov06 and they have both had moderate use, nothing heavy. My question is, should I get it calibrated? Or can I get close to the most out of it myself(I understand most settings bar the SM)? It has some geometry and convergence issues in the top left and bottom right is this easily solved? Other than that it looks unbelievable I just wanna get the best picture possible.

I will scour this thread but if anybody could direct me to a guide or anything that would be much appreciated. Thanks.


Edit* - I went back a few pages and seen some of Dsperber's posts so I'm gonna try out some that stuff in a few.

I just bought this set the other day. The girlfriend says I can't open it til christmas(I sneak when shes sleeping). Got it from craigslist for $400. It looks awesome, I passed on all the LCDs and Plasmas(some were OK) for this set cause imo a nice CRT can't be beat for image quality. Thing is the guy bought 2 of these in nov06 and they have both had moderate use, nothing heavy. My question is, should I get it calibrated? Or can I get close to the most out of it myself(I understand most settings bar the SM)? It has some geometry and convergence issues in the top left and bottom right is this easily solved? Other than that it looks unbelievable I just wanna get the best picture possible.

I will scour this thread but if anybody could direct me to a guide or anything that would be much appreciated. Thanks.


Edit* - I went back a few pages and seen some of Dsperber's posts so I'm gonna try out some that stuff in a few.


That's quite a Christmas present from your girl friend and I don't blame you for sneaking off to watch it when she's asleep. And at $400 for even a two year old set, that was a great purchase.

Glad you found Dsperber's posts because re-callibrating my own set definately helped. I first had to re-adjust the overscan (factory setting cut off too much of the edges) and not only did I resolve the problem but the picture then became sharper by no longer being stretched out of proportion. Then needed to re-adjust geometry since both are related to the other (see my posts 6121 and 6149 for the actual items needed for geometry plus color and Midi).

See Ken Tech's posts numbers one and two under SONY KD34XBR960SERVICE CODES in the AVS FORUM for detailed information on how to make your adjustments and for a spreadsheet with all the factory pre-sets and suggested adjustments. Don't be hesitant to try out your own as long as you take the precaution of writing down your original factory settings so as to return to them and not worry about having done something wrong.

With a 960 under the tree, am sure you and yours are going to have a very merry Christmas indeed. And you're right, today's LCDs, Plasmas and DLPs still don't make the grade of this discontinued Sony CRT.

Joe.

I have an HDMI compatibility issue with my KD-34XBR960 TV and my PS3. I've searched in various places on this and other forums, but can't seem to find the answer for my particular situation described below.

I own two Sony TVs: A KV-34HS510 for 4-5 years, and a KD-34XBR960 which I just purchased. I also have a 60 GB PS3. I had the PS3 hooked up to the '510's DVI input via an HDMI -> DVI cable. No issues. I could view both games and Blu-Ray movies with no issue.

I connected the PS3 up to the 34XBR960 with a new HDMI-HDMI cable. I get neither sound nor video (just a black screen). I reset the PS3's display settings by holding the power button for 5 seconds at power ON. No difference.

To make sure it wasn't the HDMI cable or the HDMI input on the TV, I hooked up my Samsung DTB-H260F to the '960's HDMI input. Initially, I only had video with no sound, but I was able to go into the Samsung's menu and change the audio output from Dolby 5.1 to PCM and then I had both video and sound. So I know the TV's HDMI port works, and I know the HDMI cable works. I know the PS3's HDMI port also works, because it works with my 'HS510 (via the DVI input).

I have gone into the PS3's display settings and manually tried setting the output to HDMI, but all I get is a black screen on the '960 and no sound. I contacted Sony PS3 help by phone and they took me through all the usual stuff I had already tried (mentioned above).

Anyone had this problem and know how to fix it? Should I just abandon the HDMI input on the '960 and get an HDMI --> component interface instead?

I don't know about how to fix your problem but I know that you wouldn't need a hdmi > component adapter cause the ps3 has component output. gl with fixing your issue.

I tried all of kentech's settings and it's odd because, although the color is even better than before, I've got this weird sort of horizontal line ghosting thing going on during some dark scenes.

They are about an inch apart from each other and it's faint, like phosphor trails, but I'm not sure if this was spurred on by adjusting the color settings of the gamma or what? There was another adjustment, I've got to look back at the chart, I think it was ycn or something like that. When setting this to a level of 3, it darkened the picture slightly.

Anyway, blacks are excellent with the SBRT at 28 and GAMR,G,B are set at 3. I think these were major, while all the color space adjustments were somewhat minor, yet it looks better. Especially when I bumped up some 3 rgb settings to 27.

I just picked up the 34xbr360 I am asking how should I hook it up? I have a sony upconvert DVD. Do I use the one HDMI input to hook up from the satelite to the TV and use the upconvert dvd with composite??

I just picked up the 34xbr360 I am asking how should I hook it up? I have a sony upconvert DVD. Do I use the one HDMI input to hook up from the satelite to the TV and use the upconvert dvd with composite??

I have had mine hooked up exactly the opposite of that for the past 3 years. The upconvert DVD players generally only upconvert SD DVD's over HDMI. They only send 480p over component. The sat box outputs the same signal over component and HDMI.

So your saying if I run the dish network line composite to the tv it will still get a 1080i image?? I thought to get HD I needed to send the signal from the dish to the one input for the HDMI conection on the set. Then just run the DVD through composite.....

So your saying if I run the dish network line composite to the tv it will still get a 1080i image?? I thought to get HD I needed to send the signal from the dish to the one input for the HDMI conection on the set. Then just run the DVD through composite.....Don't know if your use of the word "composite" is accidental or intentional. But it's wrong. It should be "component" (i.e. the 3-cable red/green/blue type of connection). You can get HD source material to the 960 through this type of cable, as well as HDMI/DVI.

If you use COMPONENT video from Dish Network box to the 960 (INPUT5/INPUT6) you will be receiving 720p/1080i HD content on your 960... just as if you used the HDMI path from E* box to the 960.

"Composite" (i.e. usually the yellow RCA cable) actually is another type of connection... but not at all HD. It is strictly for SD content, namely 480i. It's actually slightly worse than S-video (i.e. cable whose connectors have 4 tiny pins inside of a shell) connection, which is another SD 480i method (better than composite).

If using HDMI from your upconverting DVD player to the 960 is the only path out of the player supporting upconverting SD DVDs and providing upconverted 1080i to the 960 (i.e. the player's COMPONENT video output provides 480p and not the upconverted 1080i) then you should use the one HDMI connection on the 960 for this purpose, as was mentioned in the previous reply.

As was also stated, the E* receiver provides the identical output over both its HDMI connection as well as its COMPONENT connection.

Again... "composite" (yellow RCA) is NOT an HD cable. It is strictly for old-fashioned 480i SD.

So your saying if I run the dish network line composite to the tv it will still get a 1080i image?? I thought to get HD I needed to send the signal from the dish to the one input for the HDMI conection on the set. Then just run the DVD through composite.....

The xbr960 has 3 sets of inputs:

Inputs 1-4= Composite, 480i maximum
Inputs 5-6= Component, 1080i maximum
Input 7= HDMI

Inputs 1-4 are useless for Hi Def. You want to use HDMI for your DVD upconverting player on Input 7. You then need to get a set of component cables for your sat. box and connect it to input 5 or 6. Your sat box produces an identical image over HDMI or Component. Your DVd player will upconvert to 1080i only over HDMI. It will only output 480p over component.

I just picked up the 34xbr360 I am asking how should I hook it up? I have a sony upconvert DVD. Do I use the one HDMI input to hook up from the satelite to the TV and use the upconvert dvd with composite??

If you want to use more than one source through HDMI (Video 7) there are switch boxes that allow you to connect two or three devices to a single HDMI input. I forgot the one that was recommended by a forum member about a half year ago.

BTW - I've asked this question before. How do DVDs upconvered to 1080i look on the 960 compared to being output at 480p?

The TV upconverts to 1080i itself afaik so I guess it depends on how good of a chip you're using.

If you want to use more than one source through HDMI (Video 7) there are switch boxes that allow you to connect two or three devices to a single HDMI input. I forgot the one that was recommended by a forum member about a half year ago.

BTW - I've asked this question before. How do DVDs upconvered to 1080i look on the 960 compared to being output at 480p?

It depends. DVDs at 480p look slightly better than upscaled to 1080i on my PS3. On the otherhand, 480p looks WAY better than 1080i on my Toshiba A-2. Just depends on the player, really.

Thank you very much. Just one more question. If you can get high def with component why then is the hdmi needed?

Also i am getting my tv today...just want to know your opinion how does it stand up to todays lcd's??

Thank you very much. Just one more question. If you can get high def with component why then is the hdmi needed?

Component Video is still analog and doesn't offer many options for content protection. HDMI is all digital and much easier to impliment various DRM schemes, like HDCP. Naturally, the big media corporations would like everyone to use HDMI, so they have as much control over what consumers do with their content as possible. The tradeoff for consumers is that HDMI is an all in one solution. The one HDMI cable carries both audio and video signals. With component, you need 3 cables just for the video plus one or two more for the audio. In real life use, there is very little difference in quality between the 2, if any.

Also i am getting my tv today...just want to know your opinion how does it stand up to todays lcd's??

I'm happy with the 960 and there is hardly an individual in this forum that has or will be parting with it except in the case where bigger screen size is concerned or that they'll be moving and it's too heavy to lug.

BTW - if you still want two devices with HDMI outputs hooked up to the 960, attached is a link for the switch box that seems to be recommended by many.

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=101&cp_id=10110&cs_id=1011002&p_id=4088&seq=1&format=2

Also i am getting my tv today...just want to know your opinion how does it stand up to todays lcd's??

It does more that stand up to them. It punches them in the nuts and stuffs them in a garbage can. I do recommend a calibration in where the calibrator does an overscan reduction and a convergence though. It improves the screen immensely.

I haven't posted for a couple of weeks but I have been spending a lot of time trying to get the best geometry, convergence , and focus adjustments on my 960.

In my last post, I indicated that I had used some strong ferrite magnets to correct color fringing in the upper corners. This did not work as well as I thought because it limited the effect of other adjustments. Using permalloy magnets to correct the corners results in an upward bend of the horizontal lines in the upper left and a downward bend in the upper right. This assymetrical combination cannot be corrected with geometry adjustments. So, I decided to live with a little non-convergence in the upper corners.

There are three pot adjustments on the circuit board that sits on top of the static convergence yoke assembly. This circuit board looks different than what I see in sections of the manual. VR2 is YCH (effects red/blue diagonal convergence, separate from hexapole magnets), VR3 is TLV (vertical tilt, effects red/blue horizontal scan line alignment), VR1 is H-TRP (which I haven't found a description for, effects convergence in some way). VR2 should be adjusted to obtain even separation of the red and blue vertical scan lines before they are converged. I adjusted VR3 and VR1 to get the best balance for vertical convergence on horizontal scan lines

My experience with convergence of horizontal lines is that it can not be made perfect over the entire screen. There are a few tricks I used to get the best image. It takes a lot of time to get the static convergence magnets adjusted for the best compromise and it is best done with with a dot matrix, although for some things it helps to look at a crosshatch. Balance is all important. It may be necessary to adjust the TLH plate which slides horizontally across the neck of the tube in order to balance the convergence of the red and blue vertical scan lines on the far left and right sides. The H-STAT pot on the CX board is an overall static convergence adjustment of the vertical scan lines (horizontal convergence). Make the dynamic convergence adjustments afterwards to bring the red and blue dots together as close as possible. Focus adjustments are interrelated with convergence. The center focus should provide tight white dots. Try to get the left and right side dots to be as round as possible. Sacrifice the center dot geometry in order to make the side dots look better. Check your convergence again with a crosshatch pattern. Red line convergence is the most important because misalignment is very apparent on light colored image objects. Allow misalignment of the blue lines if it is a choice between red and blue. Keep going back and forth with all of these adjustments until you get a feel for your limitations, then make your final compromise. One last thought on focus: Best focus with the dot matrix does not always give you best image quality, text is very telling and adjusting for clear text without color edging is important.

One program I use as an image quality check is The Letterman Show. The background has a lot of detail and it is in high-def 1080i. I find myself watching the program and thinking about how good my picture looks and not paying attention to the program.

Now for a few questions to throw out there to the experts:

I have noticed that while paging through the service adjustment sections, occasionally I get a momentary sharp focus of my test pattern that I can never obtain with focus adjustments. What is going on here?

All the work I have done in service adjustments has been for 1080i. How do I force the set into other resolution/aspect ratios for their adjustments. I don't want to mess up the work I've already done for 1080i. Also, what does "DTV" mean under Service in the upper right of the service menu. Sometimes the service menu shows the resolution of the channel that it is tuned to but not always??

I recently picked up a 960 and also have (red gun) convergence issues with text in the upper corners. I have a very basic question: is the only way to adjust the convergence through the trim pots you mention on the yoke, or are there adjustments via the service menu I should try first? If the service menu is the recommended initial adjustment, is there a post that specifically identifies which parameters to adjust? If the trim pots are the only method, can you post a photo of what I should be looking for?

I recently picked up a 960 and also have (red gun) convergence issues with text in the upper corners. I have a very basic question: is the only way to adjust the convergence through the trim pots you mention on the yoke, or are there adjustments via the service menu I should try first? If the service menu is the recommended initial adjustment, is there a post that specifically identifies which parameters to adjust? If the trim pots are the only method, can you post a photo of what I should be looking for?
I am not the expert here and am new to this forum. The adjustments I have made are not something most people would try. I am an electrical engineer but not a tv technician. I have worked with a lot of electrical equipment and usually take a cautious approach to my meddeling. Working on the 960 with the cover off is not something I can recommend to someone who doesn't have a general knowledge of the safety and equipment risks involved. I joined the forum to try and find others with some detailed knowledge about this set so I could make some improvements, and I share what I find out by experiment.

That said, certainly, learning how to use the service menu adjustments can be of value to anyone who is careful and methodical. It is imperitive to not change anything in the service menu without writing down all of the existing parameter values in case you need to go back to original settings. Never use the reset option on purpose or by mistake.

Convergence of vertical lines is actually an exercise in moving the three color scan lines horizontally into a single vertical line or three color dots together into one round white dot (not easily done over the entire screen). Convergence of horizontal lines involves moving the three color scan lines vertically into one horizontal line.

The problem with Convergence of Horizontal Lines is that it can not be done from the service menu and is rather tedious even for a trained technician. Actually, after spending some time working on it, I am surprised that there is not an easier way to do it. There is the option of using permalloy magnets that takes the skill of a magician to use and after having a service technician take care of it on my set, my set had uncorrectable geometry distortions which he could not fix.

Adjusting the static convergence with its multipole magnets and other adjustments I made would be hard to describe in a procedure. I had to develop a feel for it over a couple of weeks of trial and error.

From the service menu, you can make the vertical line convergence adjustments. Also, focus, landing adjustments and I think to a small degree geometry adjustments do effect horizontal line convergence. If there are major horizontal line convergence problems then either a technician is needed or you have to do it yourself. I lost faith in my service technician so took the plunge myself. This is not a solution for everyone.

If you are going to make service menu adjustments, you need to experiment with adjustment for a couple weeks before getting serious about making major adjustments. Start by reading the beginning of the AVS Sony Service Codes forum. See if you can get in and out of the service menu ok. Make a small change, save the change, shut off the set. Learn the menu a small piece at a time. Be sure to have a copy of the service menu spreadsheet. All of these things and more are found in this or the Codes forum. Ask an open forum question now and then and someone here will likely respond in a day or two.

Good luck

I am not the expert here and am new to this forum. The adjustments I have made are not something most people would try. I am an electrical engineer but not a tv technician. I have worked with a lot of electrical equipment and usually take a cautious approach to my meddeling. Working on the 960 with the cover off is not something I can recommend to someone who doesn't have a general knowledge of the safety and equipment risks involved. I joined the forum to try and find others with some detailed knowledge about this set so I could make some improvements, and I share what I find out by experiment.

That said, certainly, learning how to use the service menu adjustments can be of value to anyone who is careful and methodical. It is imperitive to not change anything in the service menu without writing down all of the existing parameter values in case you need to go back to original settings. Never use the reset option on purpose or by mistake.

Convergence of vertical lines is actually an exercise in moving the three color scan lines horizontally into a single vertical line or three color dots together into one round white dot (not easily done over the entire screen). Convergence of horizontal lines involves moving the three color scan lines vertically into one horizontal line.

The problem with Convergence of Horizontal Lines is that it can not be done from the service menu and is rather tedious even for a trained technician. Actually, after spending some time working on it, I am surprised that there is not an easier way to do it. There is the option of using permalloy magnets that takes the skill of a magician to use and after having a service technician take care of it on my set, my set had uncorrectable geometry distortions which he could not fix.

Adjusting the static convergence with its multipole magnets and other adjustments I made would be hard to describe in a procedure. I had to develop a feel for it over a couple of weeks of trial and error.

From the service menu, you can make the vertical line convergence adjustments. Also, focus, landing adjustments and I think to a small degree geometry adjustments do effect horizontal line convergence. If there are major horizontal line convergence problems then either a technician is needed or you have to do it yourself. I lost faith in my service technician so took the plunge myself. This is not a solution for everyone.

If you are going to make service menu adjustments, you need to experiment with adjustment for a couple weeks before getting serious about making major adjustments. Start by reading the beginning of the AVS Sony Service Codes forum. See if you can get in and out of the service menu ok. Make a small change, save the change, shut off the set. Learn the menu a small piece at a time. Be sure to have a copy of the service menu spreadsheet. All of these things and more are found in this or the Codes forum. Ask an open forum question now and then and someone here will likely respond in a day or two.

Good luck

It would be highly advised that before you change any settings, jot down the ALL the default settings before you begin tweaking. You'll also need a test display pattern generated from a reliable high quality source.

I would suggest buying the proper signal generators (eh-hem, ebay Tektronix), but If you cannot afford that then I would try but not entirely recommend the MacGuyver approach:
Use Nokia monitor test (http://www.google.com/search?q=Nokia+Monitor+Test+1.0.0.1&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a) with a signal generated by your PC. Connect the pc to the XBR960 by way of an HDMI-DVI adapter (or DVI/DVI if your PC has DVI). Ideally it would be best if you set this up with dual monitors, 1: being your standard PC screen using any resolution and 2: being the XBR960 set to 1920x1080i. If you are using ATi or nVIDIA graphics, there should be an advanced option to interlace the output.

Use the default screen with the colours, contrast and geometry to adjust the shape and geometry. Then go to the convergence menu: to use this, adjust the convergence till the red, blue, and green lines match up both horizontally and vertically.

http://majorgeeks.com/download960.html

Legal Note, I have done this with countless PC CRT's but never the XBR960. I am not a pro or a tech, but I have some general knowledge of it. Please advice from a certified professional before changing or messing with your tv.

I was noticing that DVDs (480p) weren't looking as good as they used to. Checked the service menu and found my adjustments under 2107P-3 for 480p were reset to original factory settings. No problem since all my adjustments are written down and now the picture is as vivid as before.

But I'm stumped. These 480p settings were saved a few months back and that was the last time I was in the service mode (prior adjustments for color correction, geometry and 1080i were not affected). A few weeks ago I did need to unplug the 960 because the picture didn't come on. Could this have caused it's memory to lose the last round of settings like a PC crash?

Some might recall that during the past week or so I had again been asking about upconverting DVD players and bluray. Will admit I was becoming disenchanted but thought it was just a mood swing since I remembered how happy I was when making my last user and service adjustments. Never occured to me to check service settings.

So I might be confused but at least am happy once again. Also glad I'm not the only one staying up late to post in this forum!

I am setting up a AV receiver for the first time and this is all new to me.

When watching TV stations on my sbr960, how to I route Digital audio to the receiver? Analog out is always there, but when watching OTA HDTV, can I route that TV digital audio to the receiver?

If it is there on the optical out watching HDTV, is the optical out dead for an standard view channel? [I know, they are soon gone].

Suggested integration approaches?

I am setting up a AV receiver for the first time and this is all new to me.

When watching TV stations on my sbr960, how to I route Digital audio to the receiver? Analog out is always there, but when watching OTA HDTV, can I route that TV digital audio to the receiver?

If it is there on the optical out watching HDTV, is the optical out dead for an standard view channel? [I know, they are soon gone].

Suggested integration approaches?

http://akamaipix.crutchfield.com/products/2004/158/h158kd34xbr-b.jpeg

On the back of your XBR960, there is an Optical TOSLINK jack for digital Audio (PCM/Dolby Digital). However, it only works when you are watching a Digital source from either the HDMI port or OTA HD using the ATSC tuner. Using the NTSC tuner (analogue), the TOSLINK jack will not work.

On my Integra DTR-7.6 I have it set it up so that digital sources take priory over analogue ones. For example, MY XBR960's analogue and digital is connected to "Video 1" on my reciever. So when I switch the TV to a non-digital source the reciever senses there is no digital audio and automatically selects the analogue inputs. I get the best of both worlds and don't need to even think about it or change my AV receiver around.

It's possible that yours may do the same.

I am in need of a stand for my XBR960, I'd love to get the one made just for this TV but its very hard to find. Does anyone have any alternative suggestions that are moderately priced?

http://akamaipix.crutchfield.com/products/2004/158/h158kd34xbr-b.jpeg

On the back of your XBR960, there is an Optical TOSLINK jack for digital Audio (PCM/Dolby Digital). However, it only works when you are watching a Digital source from either the HDMI port or OTA HD using the ATSC tuner. Using the NTSC tuner (analogue), the TOSLINK jack will not work.

On my Integra DTR-7.6 I have it set it up so that digital sources take priory over analogue ones. For example, MY XBR960's analogue and digital is connected to "Video 1" on my reciever. So when I switch the TV to a non-digital source the reciever senses there is no digital audio and automatically selects the analogue inputs. I get the best of both worlds and don't need to even think about it or change my AV receiver around.

It's possible that yours may do the same.

I have an optical cable going from our HD DVR directly to our Yamaha receiver with an HDMI from the DVR directly to the 960. When I retained the HDMI connection but used the 960's optical out to the receiver only two-channel surround was heard - no 5.1 signal was passed on by the Sony.

I've been told the 960 does not pass along 5.1 signals. If this isn't the case was there something I did wrong? There is no analog connection between the 960 and the receiver to over-ride a dolby digital signal. Switching the DVR's audio out between HDMI and Dolby Digital had no effect.:confused:

I have an optical cable going from our HD DVR directly to our Yamaha receiver with an HDMI from the DVR directly to the 960. When I retained the HDMI connection but used the 960's optical out to the receiver only two-channel surround was heard - no 5.1 signal was passed on by the Sony.

I've been told the 960 does not pass along 5.1 signals. If this isn't the case was there something I did wrong? There is no analog connection between the 960 and the receiver to over-ride a dolby digital signal. Switching the DVR's audio out between HDMI and Dolby Digital had no effect.:confused:




It could be that your receiver does not have the proper features/ability or is not configured properly and not the XBR960.

Since it passes dolby digital through TOSLINK, reasoning suggests that it will.

I believe it does pass surround to the AV reciever, While watching leno in surround mode with out a center channel using my old DTR-5.5, it was near impossible to understand the monologue or half the show. Swapping back to the built in stereo TV speakers, Leno was clear as day.

Due to moving to a new city, My XBR960 is disconnected at the moment and I am unpacking all my gear. When I have it reconfigured again with the newly added Center Channel, I'll be sure to retest it and report back on my findings.


Also note that since I have moved, I now have new (better) equipment and speakers. So I will

Addendum to my previous post in your quote: My DTR-7.6 automatically switches between analogue and digital when a digital source is not active.

What is overscan? Is that a picture that is slightly larger or blown up? How does one correct it- through the service menu?

What is overscan?Conceptually it is like "cropping an image" in Photoshop. You draw a slightly smaller "cropping rectangle" inside the original 100% image, and then "crop image".

The "excess" area outside the cropping rectangle, to the edges of the original 100% image, is lopped off (i.e. "cropped") and disappears. This process eliminates irregularities or other undesirable anomalies around the outer edges of a photo image and produces a new, slightly smaller image which is presumably cleaner (or provides a more desired subject area in the case of true photo image cropping).

Effectively, you lose some percentage of the 100% image implicit in the content... say 5% from each dimension (e.g. 2 1/2% lost on the left and right edges, and 2 1/2% lost on the top and bottom edges).


Is that a picture that is slightly larger or blown up?Well in the case of overscan, once the cropping is performed the remaining "inner" image is actually enlarged to fill the same space on the screen that was previously occupied by the original 100% image.

So in that sense, and using my 5% overscan example, the inner 95% of the original image is all you will see. And this 95% which remains will appear to be "slightly magnified" (in comparison to the same area in the original 100% image) to fill the entire screen so it looks like 100% of the screen is still being used but it's actually occupied by only 95% of the source image which was sent by the broadcaster (or DVD player, or whatever).


How does one correct it- through the service menu?Yes. Many many posts in this and other threads on "overscan" and how to correct it.

Try starting from this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=8452998&postcount=2037).

You will have to click on the proper secondary links to retrieve posts from the archives from (a) 2005-2006, and also (b) prior to 2005.

While the final numbers you end up with will clearly depend on the characteristics of your particular set, the general "recipe/approach" described in the above posts is still applicable.



NOTE: the visible effect of "reducing overscan" is to actually make more than 95% (to continue with my example) of the original 100% image now appear on the screen. Say... 97% now.

Since the screen size is still physically the same and will never change, the result is to "slightly shrink" what's presented so that now 97% of the original 100% fills the entire physical screen. This is instead of the previous 95% of the original 100% which was displayed.

In other words, if you have 0% overscan you display 100% of the true original broadcast image on 100% of your screen. That's the true image, in its true size displayed using 100% of available real estate. Any non-zero overscan percentage will "crop the original" and then "magnify the remainder" so that it still fills your display screen. But as you increase overscan, you see less and less of the original and whats left appears "magnified" as compared to the original. As you reduce overscan (from some percentage to a smaller percentage) it now appears "shrunken" from what you were just looking at, since a bit more image is now shown in the same physical display screen.

This question is directed at DSperber.

In looking at your Service Menu XLS that you recently posted, you show columns for different resolutions with C,H,A, and S identifiiers. What do these mean?

All the work I have done in service adjustments has been for 1080i. How do I force the set into other resolution/aspect ratios for their adjustments. I don't want to mess up the work I've already done for 1080i. Also, what does "DTV" mean under Service in the upper right of the service menu. Sometimes the service menu shows the resolution of the channel that it is tuned to but not always??

What is overscan? Is that a picture that is slightly larger or blown up? How does one correct it- through the service menu?

You've probably noticed it before, especially when watching CNN or some news program with a ticker at the bottom of the screen. It's when the picture is scanned out side of the plastic bezel/frame and parts of the image are cut-off. It has "over scanned" outside of the viewing area.

Think of a movie projector that has is projecting an image too big for the silver screen and parts of the image are hitting the curtains or walls, in that case you can say it's (metaphorically) overscanning.

It could be that your receiver does not have the proper features/ability or is not configured properly and not the XBR960.

Since it passes dolby digital through TOSLINK, reasoning suggests that it will.

I believe it does pass surround to the AV reciever, While watching leno in surround mode with out a center channel using my old DTR-5.5, it was near impossible to understand the monologue or half the show. Swapping back to the built in stereo TV speakers, Leno was clear as day.

Due to moving to a new city, My XBR960 is disconnected at the moment and I am unpacking all my gear. When I have it reconfigured again with the newly added Center Channel, I'll be sure to retest it and report back on my findings.


Also note that since I have moved, I now have new (better) equipment and speakers. So I will

Addendum to my previous post in your quote: My DTR-7.6 automatically switches between analogue and digital when a digital source is not active.

Hi,

Specifically, the signal is not 5.1 coming from the 960 while it is when coming directly from the DVR-HD. The 960 reduces it to 2.0.

This question is directed at DSperber.

In looking at your Service Menu XLS that you recently posted, you show columns for different resolutions with C,H,A, and S identifiiers. What do these mean?

All the work I have done in service adjustments has been for 1080i. How do I force the set into other resolution/aspect ratios for their adjustments. I don't want to mess up the work I've already done for 1080i. Also, what does "DTV" mean under Service in the upper right of the service menu. Sometimes the service menu shows the resolution of the channel that it is tuned to but not always??

Hi Fizzboom,

The spreadsheet provided by Ken Tech in the SONY SERVICE CODES forum indicates which settings are universal and which can be adjusted for different resolutions (480p, 1080i, etc.). Simply switch the video source to something that is 480i/p (i.e., a DVD player) and your new settings will have no affect on those for 1080i.

What is overscan? Is that a picture that is slightly larger or blown up? How does one correct it- through the service menu?

Just be aware that adjustments to correct overscan will require further adjustments in geometry since both horizontal and vertical size affects the overall geometric proportion. When I first corrected mine, objects on the extreme sides appeared slightly wider than when they appeared further toward the center.

Geometry is easy to correct using a crosshatch pattern on DVD essentials (or something similiar) and following the steps outlined in the service manual. Before finalizing the overscan I also suggest switching between HD and non-HD stations to be sure the picture doesn't bend in slightly in any of the corners (which will indicate too much overscan).

This question is directed at DSperber.

In looking at your Service Menu XLS that you recently posted, you show columns for different resolutions with C,H,A, and S identifiiers. What do these mean?The "C" reflected component video input. "H" was HDMI input. "A" was built-in ATSC tuner. "i" was 1394 firewire input. "S" was 480i S-video input.

I provided an input source signal for each of the SBR960's inputs, coming either from my DVR, or from my JVC DT100U, or from my 480p DVD player, or from my 480i SD JVC S-VHS VCR, or from my computer (my ATI Radeon 9800 Pro and Catalyst drivers support DVI-to-component output, which I connected to the XBR960, using DisplayMate for Windows Video Edition to generate the cross-hatch overscan test pattern at varying resolutions).

Firewire, HDMI and component video out of my JVC DT100U is at "native" resolution", so if I played back a 720p recording the output was at 720p to the XBR960. 1080i recording is output at 1080i.

DVD player is component video out at 480p.

I have my 480p DVD source going to INPUT5, separate from my 720p/1080i sources going to INPUT6 (through a component video switch). This allows me to use separate adjustments on the XBR960 for ED and HD sources.

As was pointed out, some geometry/overscan adjustments are "global" and some are unique by input and/or resolution. I went through all of the combinations during my adjustments and for making the XLS, just so I'd have everything shown for each combination... even if it's really global for everything.

What is overscan? Is that a picture that is slightly larger or blown up? How does one correct it- through the service menu?

The best test for overscan is ESPN News HD. If that's not available on your system, ESPN2HD shows it every morning between 5-6am. I recorded it on my dvr and used it as a test pattern when i adjusted my set.

BTW, I skipped the first 2 steps of 2170D and went straight to mid3. I am happy with the changes and everything looks right to my eyes, but exactly what did I miss out on with not adjusting 2170D 1&2? Just curious.

BTW, I skipped the first 2 steps of 2170D and went straight to mid3. I am happy with the changes and everything looks right to my eyes, but exactly what did I miss out on with not adjusting 2170D 1&2? Just curious.As with Photoshop, I describe the 2170D adjustments as the "canvas"... i.e. the background. This defines the "outer limits" of what can be seen.

I describe the MID3 adjustments as the "image"... i.e. the foreground. You can adjust the image size (i.e. the boundaries of the image), and conceptually slide the whole thing around on the canvas.

Ideally, you spread the canvas with the 2170D controls to allow the entire screen to contain the image. Then you adjust the image on top of the canvas with the MID3 controls, to allow the image to occupy the entire canvas... i.e. the entire screen.

Of course these adjustments typically reflect some non-zero amount of overscan because flat-screen CRT's are not as perfect around the extreme edges of the rectangular screen as fixed-pixel flat panel displays. The point of having a little overscan is to eliminate video noise and non-image broadcast signal data that appears at the extreme edges and usually will be visible if you have set 0% overscan.

If you only played with MID3 and it looks good to your eyes, that's what matters. If you have a cross-hatch test pattern that's the true test as to whether or not you really needed to touch 2170D or not. If you have some show you can use (like the ESPN news mentioned, or CNN HD) where they have a crawl on the bottom, or a bug, or as with the election season they had stationary graphics on the left and right side of the screen, this can be used as a "real world test".

Anandtech goes in to some detail on the issue of overscan with computer monitors.

http://www.anandtech.com/multimedia/showdoc.aspx?i=2181

If you only played with MID3 and it looks good to your eyes, that's what matters. If you have a cross-hatch test pattern that's the true test as to whether or not you really needed to touch 2170D or not. If you have some show you can use (like the ESPN news mentioned, or CNN HD) where they have a crawl on the bottom, or a bug, or as with the election season they had stationary graphics on the left and right side of the screen, this can be used as a "real world test".

Thanks for the explanation. I read your Photoshop analogy in the original instructions and didn't understand why I should care about the "underlying layer" if I was going to fill the entire screen with the mid3 corrections anyway. But the 2170D settings make more sense now.

It's funny you mention the Election Night graphics, NBC's left and right text made me realize just how bad my overscan was. I was missing almost 2 full letters on each side. I knew from the Fox HD bug my overscan wasn't perfect, but I try not to get too picky about minor stuff or it winds up driving you insane. It's like the aperture grill wires in CRT's, if you notice them once, your eyes will be drawn to them for the rest of your life:)

I used to obsess over getting rid of all the minor annoyances with displays. I eventually got tired of nitpicking all the defects or whatever and now just focus on the most important aspects of a display which to me are color, contrast, black level, and resolution. I seriously don't care anymore if a ticker at the bottom of the screen isn't 100% straight. I own a samsung LCD, and a sony SXRD so I've seen perfectly straight and to me it's not that big a deal. Overscan though needs to be minimized as much as possible(again imo).

I'm happy with the 960 and there is hardly an individual in this forum that has or will be parting with it except in the case where bigger screen size is concerned or that they'll be moving and it's too heavy to lug.

BTW - if you still want two devices with HDMI outputs hooked up to the 960, attached is a link for the switch box that seems to be recommended by many.

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=101&cp_id=10110&cs_id=1011002&p_id=4088&seq=1&format=2

Buy.com has a great deal for anyone looking for an HDMI switch. I bought this same model last Xmas season for $25 and it works great with my 960. I have used it with an HTPC(DVI/HDMI cable), PS3, Toshiba A2 and a Sony S350 Blu Ray at various times over the past year, all without a single glitch. Don't drag your feet though, at $10.95 with free shipping, this will be gone fast.

http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=204972580

Hello:

I picked up my 960 last Friday. The guy said when you unplug it and let it sit it takes a while to come on. I had three of us take it home and up the stairs. Turned it on at 9:30pm. The picture didn't come on and it was 10pm? I called the guy he says this is what it does when unplugged. I hook up my other tv and watch it. AT 6:30 am I turned it off and back on and the picture showed up and it was great. Turned it off 5 times no problem. Went to bed and turned it off each night and came right back on with out a hitch. Love the upscale DVD. Looked at 4 movies over the weekend on HDMI. I can't wait to see what BLUE RAY looks like. Is there really a difference?? Thanks for all the help!

Also how do you work the Picture in Picture function? Also does it matter if I use monster 1000 HDMI cables or something less exspensive?

Thanks.

I also heard this tv has a problem with the PS3 due to the 720p resolution. Since most high definition is in 720p (ESPN) or 1080i how does the 960 show 720P?? :mad:

You'll love Blu-ray. It's as good as it gets.

Monoprice has cheap hdmi cables that everyone swears by. I have 2 myself.

The PIP is called Twin View and if you have digital cable/sat it's mostly going to be useless because it can only show low res in the 2nd window.

Someone else can talk about the 720 upscaling, I've never totally understood it but the 960 will have no trouble all with 720.

I also heard this tv has a problem with the PS3 due to the 720p resolution. Since most high definition is in 720p (ESPN) or 1080i how does the 960 show 720P?? :mad:

Not true. There are 1080i PROJECTION CRTs that can't display a 720p signal (the 960 is a direct-view), forcing the PS3 to drop to 480p*, but this set will scale the 720p signal to 1080i

* EDIT: 480p, not 720p.

Hi Hitman,

Congratulations on your new 960. DVDs look so great upscaled that I don't know how much better blu-ray would look if both were digitally mastered equally.

The picture-in-picture function is called "twin view" and all you need to do is to press the twin-view button on the remote to activate it. Slide the directional button left and right to highlight the desired screen to hear audio and switch between inputs (NOTE: all video sources can be seen on the left, only non-digital sources will be displayed on the right). Slide this same button up or down to adjust picture size (one gets larger as the other gets smaller).

Press "twin view" once more to go back to full screen. The screen that was highlighted will be the one that remains on.

I made the mistake of purchasing a very expensive HDMI cable and later found that price doesn't affect picture quality, it only protects the cable more from breaking (how often would that happen?).

Can't comment on 720p resolution since all my HD stations are upconverted to 1080i.

Do you have your cable wire split so you can watch unscrambled stations without the box? If so, the set might have taken more than a half-hour to initially power up if it was scanning the available unscrambled stations to lock into memory.

You'll love the 960!

Also how do you work the Picture in Picture function? Also does it matter if I use monster 1000 HDMI cables or something less exspensive?

Thanks.

PiP only works when the smaller picture is an analogue ATSC source and it cannot display an HDMI image in the PiP box.

Don't overspend on HDMI cables, in fact monster isn't very high quality. Monster is like an ugly chick in very expensive pretty clothes.

Blue Jeans Cable offers the highest quality Cables for the most reasonable prices. Their HDMI cable has a higher build quality than Monster for a fraction of the price.

Hello:

I picked up my 960 last Friday. The guy said when you unplug it and let it sit it takes a while to come on. I had three of us take it home and up the stairs. Turned it on at 9:30pm. The picture didn't come on and it was 10pm? I called the guy he says this is what it does when unplugged. I hook up my other tv and watch it. AT 6:30 am I turned it off and back on and the picture showed up and it was great. Turned it off 5 times no problem. Went to bed and turned it off each night and came right back on with out a hitch. Love the upscale DVD. Looked at 4 movies over the weekend on HDMI. I can't wait to see what BLUE RAY looks like. Is there really a difference?? Thanks for all the help!

The beauty owning a crt and one it's best assests is that it can display video in it's native resolution and does not need a video scaler, thus avoids interpolation. By upscaling your video, you are adding artifacts, noise, and interpolating the image.

Yes, there is a difference between Blu-Ray and DVD. You can test this on your XBR960 with out ever buying a Blu-Ray player or disc. Just connect an antenna, tune your TV to Jay Leno on NBC in SD, then switch over to Leno in 1080i.

EDIT: My Local PBS stations (2x ch3 and ch16) occasionally simulcast the same program: One in 480i and on another channel in 720P. A few other stations in my area do the same except they do 1080i and 480i.

I recently picked up a 960 and also have (red gun) convergence issues with text in the upper corners. I have a very basic question: is the only way to adjust the convergence through the trim pots you mention on the yoke, or are there adjustments via the service menu I should try first? If the service menu is the recommended initial adjustment, is there a post that specifically identifies which parameters to adjust? If the trim pots are the only method, can you post a photo of what I should be looking for?

I have the same issue in the top right corner.

The XBR960 features auto-convergence and it will self adjust the red during the first few minutes of operation. If you still feel the need to adjust convergence and believe the auto-convegence is not doing it's job, then be sure that your CRT is fully warmed up before you make any adjustments.

My red convergence issue usually disappears after a few minutes of running in it's typical operating temperature.

Not true. There are 1080i PROJECTION CRTs that can't display a 720p signal (the 960 is a direct-view), forcing the PS3 to drop to 720p, but this set will scale the 720p signal to 1080i

Correct, a lot of early manufacturers were trying to promote one resolution over another (format war). Later manufactures realized this was a losing battle for both sides, so in response to some consumer demand they created sets added support for all resolutions.

Not all HDMI switches are alike, many feature differences separate them.

See Robert Heron's explanation and review.


http://zdpub.vo.llnwd.net/o2/ziffdavisplayer/flvplayer2.html?show=PCMAG&movie=R88
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,2327355,00.asp

For those concerned about multichannel from their XBR960's TOSLINK jack, go back a few pages and read this

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13738458#post13738458

Yes, there is a difference between Blu-Ray and DVD. You can test this on your XBR960 with out ever buying a Blu-Ray player or disc. Just connect an antenna, tune your TV to Jay Leno on NBC in SD, then switch over to Leno in 1080i.

Agree there is a difference between bluray and standard DVD but not like the example cited above. Even though both are 480i/p, there are other factors that enable standard DVDs to have much higher picture quality than standard TV broadcasts.

The only way to compare the two is the DVD version to that of blueray.