HDTV for Mac OS X from Elgato! [Text View] - Page 3

gaderson

11-02-05, 04:00 AM

Well, looks like I'll be joining the multi-tuner group.
I had a scare on Monday. Went to wake up my MDD from sleep and nothing. Started up from the power button. But, my eyeTV 500 stayed amber...nooooo. I quick got a new 500 from my local Apple store. When I got home I found that that one was amber too. So, I switched to go through my FW800 dock to the tuner (from a LaCie FW800 card), and lit up and all was ok. So, looks like the Firewire ports on my MDD died again (replaced the motherboard within the first few months).
So, I got a Firewire hub (http://us.kensington.com/html/6400.html), and have hooked up both tuners.
New one wants to update firmware (is at 1.0.0). So, looking back I should be able to update with no problems? Try Wednesday night with lost and Veronica Mars.

Now, I keep hearing hints from ElGato that they're working on a version that can utilise multiple drives, anyone hear more? I do look at iEyeCaptain, but, since he hasn't set up the ATSC sub-channel issues (i.e. 2-1, 2-2 etc.) I haven't looked too closely.
I keep trying to record on a full drive. Twice with Alias--weird bug too, it stops when the drive is full, but, the program still thinks it's recording. So I come back from work to find these 10+ hour, still recording. Usually have to force-quit to get out of the 'loop'.

MacHound

11-02-05, 12:50 PM

Well, looks like I'll be joining the multi-tuner group....

I keep trying to record on a full drive. Twice with Alias--weird bug too, it stops when the drive is full, but, the program still thinks it's recording. So I come back from work to find these 10+ hour, still recording. Usually have to force-quit to get out of the 'loop'. I'm embarrassed to admit I've seen the same thing happen multiple times. I always delete the "10+ hour" recording, immediately reboot and run DiskWarrior. DW hasn't reported any directory errors but I go ahead and rebuild the directories anyway just to be sure. Knock on wood, I haven't lost any data. Letting drives fill to the last sector is definitely not good hard drive hygeine and I hope to avoid doing so again in the future. I'd like to think ElGato could do something to save us from our own mistakes. EyeTV ought to have some way of anticipating a full drive before it actually happens. I'll not say this is an unavoidable problem, which is why I haven't complained to ElGato about the full drive issue.

How do you like your Kensington PocketHub? I was torn between the PocketHub and IO Gear's 6-port FW hub. Unfortunately I chose the IO Gear. It worked well with my PowerBook G4 for a couple months until I moved it to my 1.5 GHz Mini a few nights ago. Within a couple days I began having mysterious system freezes which I tracked down to the hub. On my PowerBook I had no problem with five of the hub's ports filled and two EyeTV-500's drawing bus power. But plugging in more than two devices with it (one an EyeTV-500) on the Mini caused all manner of problems. The same five devices connected in series to the Mini's FW port exhibited no problem. All of my drives are externally powered; only the EyeTV-500 draws significant bus power.

I don't trust the IO Gear hub enough to use it again on my Mini. I'm not sure about using it with my PowerBook either. I lack confidence in the hub now and I'm just not sure I want to take a chance with it burning something out. This IO Gear hub didn't get much use for $45.

Joseph S

11-02-05, 08:26 PM

So, looks like the Firewire ports on my MDD died again (replaced the motherboard within the first few months).

If you have firewire ports, get the firewire protectors!! Well worth the piece of mind. Too many items have blown MB ports. Keep up your re-sale value. If you only use the PCI ports, not really as big of an issue. The protectors also cut down on ground loop hum on my G5 tower. You'll need a powered hub or AC adapters for the EyeTV's though.

These are what I'm talking about.
http://fwdepot.com/thestore/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=port+isolator&x=0&y=0

almostinsane

11-02-05, 10:31 PM

Anyone upgraded to 10.4.3 yet? Does EyeTV 500 still work?

gaderson

11-02-05, 11:48 PM

I'm embarrassed to admit I've seen the same thing happen multiple times. I always delete the "10+ hour" recording, immediately reboot and run DiskWarrior. DW hasn't reported any directory errors but I go ahead and rebuild the directories anyway just to be sure. Knock on wood, I haven't lost any data. Letting drives fill to the last sector is definitely not good hard drive hygeine and I hope to avoid doing so again in the future. I'd like to think ElGato could do something to save us from our own mistakes. EyeTV ought to have some way of anticipating a full drive before it actually happens. I'll not say this is an unavoidable problem, which is why I haven't complained to ElGato about the full drive issue.

Well, I set a feature request to ElGato, and they said...well seemed like tough luck. But, I'm thinking of at least trying out Automator to create a script to warn me when I down to a few 10s of Gigs (wow, hard drives have grown quickly). I didn't even think to check with DiskWarrior, I do have a spare drive that I can use to do a full copy backup to restore if problems. Had problems with another drive, which DiskWarrior chocked on, a first.

How do you like your Kensington PocketHub? I was torn between the PocketHub and IO Gear's 6-port FW hub. Unfortunately I chose the IO Gear. It worked well with my PowerBook G4 for a couple months until I moved it to my 1.5 GHz Mini a few nights ago. Within a couple days I began having mysterious system freezes which I tracked down to the hub. On my PowerBook I had no problem with five of the hub's ports filled and two EyeTV-500's drawing bus power. But plugging in more than two devices with it (one an EyeTV-500) on the Mini caused all manner of problems. The same five devices connected in series to the Mini's FW port exhibited no problem. All of my drives are externally powered; only the EyeTV-500 draws significant bus power.

Well, only had it a few days, but seems ok, I'll need to keep an eye on it. Also thinking of getting one of those mini drive cases. Trying to decide between newer's ministack (http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/ministack/), and WiebeTech's maxelerate (http://wiebetech.com/products/maxelerate.php). Both an external hard drive, but, also USB and Firewire hubs.

I don't trust the IO Gear hub enough to use it again on my Mini. I'm not sure about using it with my PowerBook either. I lack confidence in the hub now and I'm just not sure I want to take a chance with it burning something out. This IO Gear hub didn't get much use for $45.

At MacWorld the IO Gear people seemed quite good, and knowledgable, but, Firewire has always seemed to have problems. (And we though it would end 'SCSI Voodoo'.

gaderson

11-02-05, 11:50 PM

If you have firewire ports, get the firewire protectors!! Well worth the piece of mind. Too many items have blown MB ports. Keep up your re-sale value. If you only use the PCI ports, not really as big of an issue. The protectors also cut down on ground loop hum on my G5 tower. You'll need a powered hub or AC adapters for the EyeTV's though.

These are what I'm talking about.
http://fwdepot.com/thestore/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=port+isolator&x=0&y=0

Well there's and idea. So it's the other side that's having problems? The power works fine through my Firewire ports, I can even charge my iPod, but, no drive will mount. Thankfully I got a FW800 card that works fine. I even had problems with a 6 to 4-pin
that was connected to my DVHS decks.

Joseph S

11-03-05, 02:10 AM

Did I just write "piece of mind?" That's just embarrassing.

gaderson

11-03-05, 03:49 AM

Well, recorded Leno and Letterman ok, got different sizes but, not sure on my signal from the local NBC.

MacHound

11-03-05, 07:03 PM

Anyone upgraded to 10.4.3 yet? Does EyeTV 500 still work? Works fine for me. I'm impressed that, so far, nothing appears seriously broken with 10.4.3. What's even more impressive is NOT A SINGLE SAFARI CRASH since I updated! Woo hoo! I was previously getting 10+ Safari crashes a day. Titan TV was particularly bad for crashing Safari, especially when I set the view window to 6 hours. Even Titan doesn't crash Safari anymore. Strong work, Apple!

ultimate

11-03-05, 07:08 PM

Anyone upgraded to 10.4.3 yet? Does EyeTV 500 still work?

It still works for me.

Dennis

strpyw

11-20-05, 12:12 PM

Since I bought that elgato eyetv500, I have seldom used it because i don't have a powerful enough mac to play the recording.
I like to know what the experts think now.
I have a imac 20 inch that has usb 2.0.
How about the little usb 2.0 drive that Lacie and Iomega are selling ,that can play vob file directly .
Do i need to convert the recorded files to vob or using toast to convert to video ts first?
The pnp sever is an alternative, that i rather have a portable unit that can plug in anywhere to play, since i don't have an hdcp display, so component ouput/input is my only option.
And i read the wireless transfer is not that great.
What is the best way then to play these recordings in my situation?

jwcrash

11-20-05, 12:16 PM

It still works for me.

Dennis

Same for me. :D

gaderson

11-21-05, 07:15 AM

That's not the bug. I get the "Schedule conflict" window when I shouldn't.

Schedule two shows for two tuners. Close EyeTV and try to schedule something else on any day/time. The schedule conflict window pops up as the app opens even though there is no real conflict because there are two or three tuners attached.

Well, now working with two tuners, I've also come across the "schedule conflict". I've also started to have truncated recordings, and not sure what that's from.

seank

11-21-05, 02:28 PM

strpyw,

I don't see how a device that can play vob files will be of any use with high definition transport streams recorded with the EyeTV 500, unless you compress it down to a non high def format.

-Sean

druber

11-22-05, 10:10 AM

I agree with Sean. If your computer isn't fast enough to play back the recorded HDTV, I think you'll find reencoding to a lower resolution to be just as frustrating. Hopefully I'll have a Linkplayer in about 6 weeks and can see how that works as a solution. Seems 10 times more graceful as a solution than reencoding, and tons cheaper than a dual G5. I'd love to be right about this..

toots

11-22-05, 11:18 AM

As long as the streamer can keep up with the bitrate, I think it's an entirely graceful solution. I use a Roku to stream off my Mini. The Mini's got plenty of horsepower to record from two EyeTV-500s, and the Roku's got plenty of horsepower to decode/display at full resolution. I would expect that if the Linksys can fetch the data fast enough, it should do fine (and I mention this, because streaming the data fast enough to keep up with an HD feed seems to be the common bottleneck on these devices, rather than the MPEG decode process).

tyronetime

11-22-05, 04:19 PM

I've checked through the thread to see if this issue has been addressed, but did not find any mention of it. I'm wondering if anyone has a solution for the problem below...

Wouldn't it be great if you could automatically set your EyeTv scheduled programs (e.g. The Daily Show, which records every night at 11pm) to export say, to an iPod compatible format, upon the completion of the recording? That way, you could wake up the next morning, drag the newly exported program into iTunes and update your new iPod...

Seems like a great next step for EyeTv and new iPod users.

I emailed Nick over at Elgato, and he said that the next version of EyeTv is on its way with an Export to iPod preset...but he indicated that no support for scheduled exporting will be included (said it may be possible in the future).

Does anyone have an AppleScript to automate this scheduled export function?

Thanks!

Joseph S

11-22-05, 05:32 PM

How are people expoting to DIVX 6/HD (Included with Roxio's Toast) from EyeTV? I get a "Divx AVI Component is Not Installed" message when I try to export.

Component is installed in "/Library/Quicktime/" and does work with Toast using the "Burn with Toast" option in EyeTV and saving as a disc image.

ThomasW

11-24-05, 06:08 AM

Just to confirm:

With the EyeTV hard- and software it is possible to time a recording...Will the Mac fire up from being shutoff, to start the recording at the proper time ? Or are you required to let the Mac be turned on but in sleep mode ?

I am considering a purchase of the EyeTV 610 for cableTV, but will wait until next year when HDTV will be available via cable here.

Thomas

ThomasW

11-24-05, 06:57 AM

Searched and got an answer to my question; Yes, it does indeed start up the Mac even when shut down. Very nice !

Thomas

adamf

11-24-05, 11:40 AM

Tyronetime,
This is a great idea. This would seem to be doable with an automator action (10.4 and above), especially once ElGato has the preset inside their software (though doable through quicktime possibly before?). If I get a chance, I'll try to play around with it.

gaderson

11-25-05, 02:16 AM

I've found a weird bug in eyeTV. It's so far happened whenever I record a bunch of shows on Wednesday. After the recordings are finished, I try and watch the last show recorded (Invasion), and instead of opening the show it opens the tuner window set to the last station it was on. I can open other recorded shows and play them, but, when I try and open that last show I keep getting the live feed of the channel.
I'm using two 500 tuners, so not sure if that's significant. I'll see next time if it opens up with a particular tuner (the title bar notes the tuner number).
Quitting and restarting clears things up and I can then watch that last show.

Anyone else come across something like this?

Joseph S

11-25-05, 03:28 AM

Anyone else come across something like this?
Something like it, yes. Exactly like it, no. What I have seen is if I have two shows start recording at the same time I may get two recordings with the same name showing up in the Program list. Opening one or other brings up the same recording and they link to the same file directory. If you let it go and quit when done, you'll find all is normal and your recordings went as scheduled. I don't click on recordings when recording as I get a crash every once in a while with that. Choosing "Open Live window" and closing the rest works better for me.

imlucid

11-25-05, 10:29 AM

I've seen something similar. Usually what works is selecting another show and then re-selecting the show you want to watch and hitting play.

gaderson

11-25-05, 11:25 PM

I've seen something similar. Usually what works is selecting another show and then re-selecting the show you want to watch and hitting play.

Well, I've tried opening several other shows, and still the one opens up with the 'live' channel. So, as JoeS notes quitting fixes it.

slick316

11-26-05, 09:30 PM

This thread is huge, and its a lot to read through. I was wondering a few things, hopefully someone can answer them.
The EyeTV 500 is just for HDTV right? Meaning, for SD channels, I would need the EyeTV 200?
And is the Mac Mini capable of recording High Def content using the EyeTV 500 without slow down, meaning, no stuttering in the video or anything?
Trying to decide with one to get, with me working, I am missing some of my shows, and most of them come on HD stations (like 24 on FOX, LOST on ABC). I don't want to buy both, any suggestions? I get ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, and WB on the OTA antenna. They are both around the same price, thats why its a hard choice.

imlucid

11-26-05, 10:02 PM

The EyeTV is for ATSC, both HD and SD. ATSC is the digital signal. NTSC is the old analog signal and the 200 has a tuner to decode that.

slick316

11-26-05, 11:36 PM

I don't get it, you don't have to explain if you don't want to, but if I only recieve HD OTA, and my normal cable isn't digital, does that mean my cable is NTSC, while the HD OTA is ATSC?

imlucid

11-26-05, 11:39 PM

Thats correct!

So if you want to record HD, you need the 500, if you want to record off your analog cable, you'll need to get a 200 as well...

:(

slick316

11-27-05, 12:31 AM

Dang, that's a tough choice. Most of the shows I watch are in HD but it would be nice to record stuff off of other channels to, this is hard.

Maybe Elgato will make a EyeTV that will do both just for me :)

zmatzkin

11-27-05, 07:45 AM

I don't get it, you don't have to explain if you don't want to, but if I only recieve HD OTA, and my normal cable isn't digital, does that mean my cable is NTSC, while the HD OTA is ATSC?

Is your cable not digital, or do you just not PAY for digital? If there is digital cable available on the line, the 500 will see it and you can record every digital cable channel that is "in the clear"...

Z

Ladd

11-27-05, 10:45 AM

if you want to record off your analog cable, you'll need to get a 200 as well...(That's 98 percent correct.

I have an EyeTV500 and analog cable service. Because (it is my understanding) cable companies are required by law to transmit without encryption (Clear QAM) the HD version of local over-the-air network channels, I receive from my analog cable service the digital HD programming on NBC, ABC, CBS and FOX. So without subscribing to digital cable packages, I get to watch any HD programming on those stations -- Pro Football, LOST, etc. I also get dozens of music stations of all flavors that can just be listened to on your computer or actually recorded by the EyeTV just like TV programming.

Additionally, the EyeTV500 can easily record any OTA digital channel that you might receive at your home via roof or table-top antenna. I live about one hour West of Washington D.C. and I pick up 39 digital stations free of charge. This includes all the local networks that I mentioned above that come in Clear QAM via cable, so I have a backup source for those stations. Few of the others are in HD (PBS and MPT are) but the airwaves are full of programming that the EyeTV500 can snag.

So yes, your answer is correct -- the EyeTV500 can't record analog programming. But I wanted to point out that with a wire from your roof antenna and a wire from your cable wall jack plugged into the back of the EyeTV500, there is a LOT of digital programming available, some of it in HD, that is available without having to purchase upgraded cable service.

slick316

11-27-05, 01:12 PM

Is your cable not digital, or do you just not PAY for digital? If there is digital cable available on the line, the 500 will see it and you can record every digital cable channel that is "in the clear"...

Z

Correct, I do not pay for digital cable, I just recieve a few digital channels for some reason over my analog subscription.

I just read on Elgato's site that the 500 is capable of recording in HD only with a dual G5. Is this true? I want to get the one that will work best with my Mini.

Ladd

11-27-05, 08:54 PM

Correct, I do not pay for digital cable, I just recieve a few digital channels for some reason over my analog subscription.See my post immediately prior to yours -- you are getting unencrypted Clear QAM.

I just read on Elgato's site that the 500 is capable of recording in HD only with a dual G5. Is this true? I want to get the one that will work best with my Mini.The EyeTV500 will RECORD from just about any Mac with a FireWire port. If you want to PLAY it back in full HD, either to your monitor or a connected HDTV, you will need to have a pretty fast dual G5.

Almost any reasonably modern Mac can play back a recording, but it will play back at 1/4 resolution. Still looks good, but it ain't HD.

Since I do not have a fast G5, when I want to watch the EyeTV HD recordings on my living room HDTV, I run the programs through Toast 7 and turn them into DVDs. Also not HD, but still looks quite good.

An alternative would be to connect to your Ethernet network a device such as an AVel Linkplayer2 DVD player connected to your home theatre system-- it will stream the native HD file from your Mac to itself, decode the HD properly and output it to your HD set. This is a true HD playback solution to using your EyeTV500 as a PVR.

MacHound

11-27-05, 10:59 PM

Adding further support to the previous remarks, I record simultaneous 1080i streams using two EyeTV 500's on my 1.33 GHz PowerBook G4 and I have plenty of CPU cycles left over to get my real work done without any noticeable slowdown. Playback is even better. Using the open source program wizd (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=496964&page=1&pp=30&highlight=wizd+and+bookmark) to stream content from my Powerbook to my Linkplayer2 only uses 3-5% of my CPU cycles so the laptop fan doesn't even kick on.

Just make sure you do your homework over at the I-O Data Forums (http://www.iodata.com/usa/forum/index.php) before buying a LinkPlayer, and most especially think long and hard before upgrading your LP2 to the latest firmware. The June 24 firmware still works well for me despite a few annoying quirks. Someday media players won't be cutting edge technology, but for now the LP2 remains a reasonable output solution. The Snazio and Zensonic players sound pretty good too.

I fantasize ElGato will eventually bundle an EyeTV 500 tuner with a digital media player in the same box. But that seems unlikely given the relatively small Mac market and high development costs such a player would entail.

gaderson

11-28-05, 02:33 AM

I fantasize ElGato will eventually bundle an EyeTV 500 tuner with a digital media player in the same box. But that seems unlikely given the relatively small Mac market and high development costs such a player would entail.

You're probably right. But, with EyeConnect, and EyeHome they would seem to be quite willing to work with other manufacturers.

gaderson

11-28-05, 02:57 AM

Adding further support to the previous remarks, I record simultaneous 1080i streams using two EyeTV 500's on my 1.33 GHz PowerBook G4 and I have plenty of CPU cycles left over to get my real work done without any noticeable slowdown.

I'm currently using two 500s also, on my dual 1.25GHz G4 (with a java P2P program in the background sucking up cycles--though the new Java update meant both CPUs are no longer pegged), and have successfully record with one on my 800MHz TiBook.

I've also played with a 400MHz iMac I got from a friend, that did ok, but, with 128MB of RAM it did have trouble, but, didn't try to find out if it was eyeTV or just running Tiger. I'll likely get more RAM, and see what it can do. Certainly recording to an external FW drive (I think it has a 10GB drive in it). Also want to rack-mount it so I can use it as a server/renderer (though the cool Marathon Boxes are no longer produced). :(

doctormyeyes

11-28-05, 04:06 PM

So, am I correct in assuming that with an EyeTV500, a Mac mini, and a Linkplayer, I would have a complete HD record/playback system?

Any pitfalls, limitations?

Thanks

toots

11-28-05, 04:09 PM

Same pitfall as usign a Mini, EyeTV500 and a Roku HD-1000, namely that the EyeTV software comes up with some really funky names/locations for the recorded files.

It helps to have some software running to create links with sensible names to the recorded programs. But, that's mainly a UI issue more than anything else.

doctormyeyes

11-28-05, 04:13 PM

Let's say I'm planning to be a light user, maybe recording a couple of hours of programming a week. Shouldn't I simply be able to locate the files by searching my hard drive by date created, and then rename them?

Thanks again. I'm new to this stuff, I've lived with a DVD based front projection system for years, finally getting HD cable installed this weekend.

zmatzkin

11-28-05, 04:40 PM

So, am I correct in assuming that with an EyeTV500, a Mac mini, and a Linkplayer, I would have a complete HD record/playback system?

Any pitfalls, limitations?

Thanks

If you add EyeConnect to the list, yes. No funky names to deal with, no other server sw needed, and no finding, renaming, aliasing, or moving files...

And you have a wired network too, right?

see previous discussion here in this very thread...

Z

dankwonka

11-28-05, 06:34 PM

hello,
kind of a newbie, hopefully someone can help me out. i just ordered an eyeHome. i have a fast dual 2ghz G5. i want to be able to playback dvds that i have stored on my harddrive as video_ts files to my dvi/hdmi Sharp Aquos HDTV. preferably i will do this wirelessly through my airport express. will i be able to transmit quality video and 5.1 sorround sound?

also, will it be possible to record HDTV off of my digital Time Warner Cable - Scientific Atlantic 8300 HD-DVR? i am located in new york city, don't know if this is relevant info.which eyetv system will i need to enable me to do this? does one exist?

anyhelp will be much appreciated. thanks!!!

adamf

11-28-05, 06:59 PM

Running Eyetv 500 with 1.8.3. Tried to (scheduled) record a show at 7am. Came down and saw the 2g Dual G5 had come out of monitor-off mode with Dashboard showing, the record button was flashing, so I left. I returned to find a zero length, unplayable video.

Any thoughts, help?

TIA. Adam

MacHound

11-29-05, 04:26 AM

So, am I correct in assuming that with an EyeTV500, a Mac mini, and a Linkplayer, I would have a complete HD record/playback system?

Any pitfalls, limitations? You are correct. I started a thread on this subject (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=547351) a while back. Again, beware of the 10-31-05 firmware update if you buy a LinkPlayer2. Several people can no longer play HD content reliably after this update.

Don't forget to look at the Zensonic Z500 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=482136&page=1&pp=30) which is scheduled for release on 12-12-2005. It looks to be a worthy competitor to the LinkPlayer2. The Snazio SZ1350 is also worth checking out. All three players use the same Sigma chip but different components and firmware.

doctormyeyes

11-29-05, 06:38 AM

Thanks again.

almostinsane

11-29-05, 09:08 PM

Got a question on exporting...

When choosing a program to export what is the point in choosing 'MPEG Program Stream'? It is already recorded in an mpeg-2 program stream. All I have to do is locate the file on the disk.

Anyone know? Seems pointless.

Joseph S

11-29-05, 10:15 PM

If you don't have to export don't. Videolan can already play the files. Just copy it out and rename it. EyeTV can't play the audio from exported program streams.

almostinsane

11-29-05, 11:15 PM

Got it, thanks. But is there *any* reason to export it to a progam stream?

Joseph S

11-30-05, 12:34 AM

Yeah, because if EyeTV could read them back instantly it would make the whole "EyeTV Archive" crap a thing of the past. Just doesn't work.

MacHound

12-01-05, 02:30 AM

If you don't have to export don't. Videolan can already play the files. Just copy it out and rename it. EyeTV can't play the audio from exported program streams. Here's a faster and safer way to access your EyeTV Archives from VLC or a media server: make a collection of named symlinks to your show files (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6162878&&#post6162878). That obviates the manual entry of filenames and it leaves your Archives untouched. (Renaming the Archive files themselves makes them unrecognizable to EyeTV.) Copying 1080i files out eats up massive amounts of hard drive space whereas a symlink only takes 4 KB.

toots

12-01-05, 08:58 AM

Actually, it records as an MPEG-2 Transport Stream. Exporting to program stream has some utility under the following circumstances:

1) Your playback application doesn't understand Transport Streams, but does understand Program Streams

2) Your specific recorded program is semi-broken in that it doesn't contain proper PMT/PID (? did I get those right?) information. The built-in EyeTV player can handle this, but many other transport stream players will just end up displaying a silent black screen at a very high bitrate.

Joseph S

12-01-05, 12:26 PM

Copying 1080i files out eats up massive amounts of hard drive space whereas a symlink only takes 4 KB.
I think you forgot about my prior post. :) My "EyeTV Archive" doesn't fit on one disk ;) , I have countless nested "EyeTV Archvies."

I don't copy anything out unless I'm attempting to build an unflawed recording by combining orginal run with rerun footage. However, if you're going to do away with your "EyeTV Archive" structure and can use program streams or the .mpg you can copy or drag it out.

JerryNY

12-01-05, 12:48 PM

The new 1.84 version just released has a nice little feature. From the info on version tracker:

Watch two or more channels at the same time - With digital television products (EyeTV 300/310, 400/410, 500, 610, EyeTV for DTT, Miglia TVMini) EyeTV 1.8.4 can play and record two or more TV channels that reside on the same transponder/multiplex simultaneously. To open an additional live TV window, hold down the Control key while selecting "Open Live TV Window" from the File menu. This is considered an advanced feature, for more information see the FAQ entry at http://faq.elgato.com/index.php/faq/more/320 ."

-Jerry C.

Joseph S

12-01-05, 01:04 PM

Do I now have 6 tuners with my 3 boxes????? Off to try this.

JerryNY

12-01-05, 01:06 PM

Do I now have 6 tuners with my 3 boxes????? Off to try this.

Theoretically more! I think you can open as many channels as are available on the transponder so you can easily have 3-4 on one eyetv box. The Mac is going to get hammered though ;)

-Jerry C.

JerryNY

12-01-05, 01:08 PM

I have 5 channels open as I type this ;)

-Jerry C.

Joseph S

12-01-05, 01:10 PM

These may make nice Christmas presents for your relatives in other markets. :) Always good to have out of market sources when your own affiliates are prone to butcher your favorite shows.

4MB to go on the download.

All it needs is the ability to schedule by box so you can effectively position multiple antennas.

zmatzkin

12-01-05, 01:13 PM

Theoretically more! I think you can open as many channels as are available on the transponder so you can easily have 3-4 on one eyetv box. The Mac is going to get hammered though ;)

-Jerry C.

You can only open multiple channels on the SAME multiplex. So for OTA you can open the main channel and the SD subchannels. For example, I was able to watch 6-1, 6-2, 6-3 at the same time this morning. Not all that exciting. I didn't get a chance to try with clear QAM - has anyone tried yet? How do transponders/multiplexing work for QAM?

Z

JerryNY

12-01-05, 01:15 PM

Joseph S

12-01-05, 01:16 PM

TitanTV multituner bug is still there so don't go clicking those meatball icons. Beware!!

You can only open multiple channels on the SAME multiplex.
Confirmed here as well. Both windows on same box change with changing channels. That really needs to be re-worded. Pretty deceiving.

zmatzkin

12-01-05, 01:16 PM

4MB to go on the download.

Geez, that takes about 10 seconds here...

Z

zmatzkin

12-01-05, 01:24 PM

Exactly right, but QAM seems to be all over the place on TWC here in NY. I had 5 channels open at the same time but they seemed to be unrelated, just random channels throw together in some cases.

-Jerry C.

Hmmm, and I'm guessing the HD feeds all get their own transponder? So this probably won't help anyone interested in recording 2 HD shows at once with one 500... bummer...

Z

Joseph S

12-01-05, 01:26 PM

Oh, yeah. No firmware update included.

JerryNY

12-01-05, 01:37 PM

Hmmm, and I'm guessing the HD feeds all get their own transponder? So this probably won't help anyone interested in recording 2 HD shows at once with one 500... bummer...

Z

Well not exactly. PBS-HD and CBS HD share a transponder. FOX HD and WORHD share another. CBS HD and NBC HD share another, so I can record Joey and Survivor now simultaneously. So in certain cases it can be useful it seems.

-Jerry C.

JerryNY

12-01-05, 01:42 PM

Scratch that NBCHD and ABCHD share one, not cbs and nbc. So no Joey and survivor at least.

-Jerry C.

Joseph S

12-01-05, 01:44 PM

So in certain cases it can be useful it seems.
But you can't schedule to specific tuners. If you could then you could make this feasible, but if you already have multiple tuners this isn't going to do anything to help you. It needs the ability to schedule say "Joey on 1 and Suvivor on 1" and "Fox on 2." The live windows are labeled per unit #, should be possible. Only hope they do more with this real soon.

JerryNY

12-01-05, 01:49 PM

Actually I just tried to schedule two shows at once on my single 500. I tried to schedule Joey @ 8PM on NBC and the Pope movie on ABC which also starts @ 8PM. If I try to do it w/o any live tv windows open I get the conflict thing pop up. If I open those two channels first so they are currently playing it does let me schedule both fine.

-Jerry C.

Joseph S

12-01-05, 01:54 PM

If I open those two channels first so they are currently playing it does let me schedule both fine.
Similar to the "It's ok" to schedule with TitanTV with app open or via remote scheduling, but don't dare try without it open or everything's will be a false "conflict."

jyeesf

12-01-05, 08:58 PM

Looks like new updates for the EyeTV - among the highlights are recording and viewing multiple streams with one tuner as noted above....

http://www.elgato.com/index.php?file=support_updates_eyetv

FyKnight

12-02-05, 12:54 AM

Has EyeTV really not even been able to record one stream and watch another on the same multiplex before now? If this is the case then I'm shocked! However did people in the UK put up with it? They've got only 3 or 4 multiplexes with half a dozen different SD channels on each.

MacHound

12-02-05, 06:53 AM

Nobody has mentioned it, but 1.8.4 adds "export to iPod Video" with H.264 or with MPEG-4, which ElGato says encodes up to five times faster than H.264 and has higher resolution output. Has anyone tried it yet?

This is a more exciting development for the iPod Video than anything Apple has done... except making the iPod Video, of course.

jdt

12-06-05, 04:20 PM

Looking for a price point for a used EyeTV 500 (about 6 months old).

John

rezzy

12-06-05, 06:48 PM

El Gato may have some refurbs left. I forget how much they are.

Joseph S

12-06-05, 06:54 PM

El Gato may have some refurbs left. I forget how much they are.

Wow. They're even cheaper than before. $199. Not cheap, but cheaper and.... :D very tempting. Do they have a buy your fourth and get the fifth free?

Joseph S

12-07-05, 05:07 PM

That new price was too tempting and for only $5 more shipping for one.... I'm past halfway home to that ultimate 9 tuner easy timeshifting with buffering system I want. Hopefully, the multituner support will continue to improve so I can assign recordings to specific boxes. Would like to improve antenna position for one station. Most of the stuff I watch is on the same days and at the same times. With the goofy start/stop times I'll now be able to stop the 3hour mega recordings on single channels which was a means around the start/stop time problems on ABC/NBC.

toots

12-07-05, 05:35 PM

Looks like new updates for the EyeTV - among the highlights are recording and viewing multiple streams with one tuner as noted above....

http://www.elgato.com/index.php?file=support_updates_eyetv

I can always figure this out from reading through the prefs xml files, but is there any easy way from the app to figure out which streams are on the same channels? Failing that, anyone in the boston area know the Comcast channel/stream assignments off the top of their heads?

It'd be wikkit kewl if'n I could record four shows at once off my two EyeTVs, 'specially on those (thankfully rare) occasions when there are actually four shows on at once that I want to see.

Or, if I recall correctly, all the major network SD channels on my local Comcast are on the same channel, so maybe I could record all of prime time SD at once every night.

Ladd

12-07-05, 05:55 PM

You may have heard that when using EyeTV 1.8.4 with any digital EyeTV box that you can view and/or record multiple channels at the same time by holding down the "Control" key and selecting "Open Live TV Window". This opens up another window with one of any of the other broadcasts that share the same multiplex frequency.

Via OTA (over the air) broadcasts, typically NBC, ABC, CBS or FOX, these other broadcasts are usually a sub-channel, often weather info. In my area using an EyeTV 500, CBS is 9.1 and their weather broadcast is 9.2. Using the "Control -- Open Live TV Window" trick plays both of these broadcasts at the same time.

What has been reported today on the Accelerate Your Mac! web site is that if you do this when your EyeTV digital box is connect to cable, you also can play multiple broadcasts that share the same multiplexor -- but they could very well be completely different network channels, not sub-channels.

Again, in my area, if I have a window open playing the clear-QAM broadcast of CBS, using the "Control -- Open Live TV Window" trick plays FOX. While viewing NBC, I can open a window showing ABC.

Want to watch and/or record two football games at the same time? Record CSI:NY when it is on opposite Alias? Here ya go! :)

I'm pretty sure you can't schedule multiple recordings this way -- you have to open the second (and third, etc.) windows and enable recording manually.

zmatzkin

12-07-05, 06:24 PM

What has been reported today on the Accelerate Your Mac! web site is that if you do this when your EyeTV digital box is connect to cable, you also can play multiple broadcasts that share the same multiplexor -- but they could very well be completely different network channels, not sub-channels.

Actually, that was reported right here in this thread, 6 days ago...

My HD combos via comcast are ABC/NBC, PBS/CBS, and FOX/WB. Pretty cool... But yes, discrete scheduling would be even better...

Z

Joseph S

12-14-05, 12:02 AM

Tuners 4 and 5 have arrived. :D Scheduling buffer protection here I come.

Oops, I'm out of short RF canare cables. Should be here by the weekend.

MacHound

12-14-05, 02:07 PM

Tuners 4 and 5 have arrived. That's totally out of control! I can't keep up with the stuff I record from a single EyeTV 500 (and occasionally my second 500). No wonder you have 50 hard drives full of stuff! Ever think about buying drives in 100 lots from the OEM?

Joseph S

12-14-05, 02:39 PM

That's totally out of control! I can't keep up with the stuff I record from a single EyeTV 500 (and occasionally my second 500).

Yeah, but it's more for the buffering and busy days. Now I can add padding to most recordings since so many of my favorites run outside of the usual time limits. I have too many 2 hour recordings that I only want an hour of or two half hours of. Need to save time and space. I got these two for the price of the original. Most of the massive space requirements are treasured sporting events that needed multiple duplication. Two Superbowl drives plus the never ending pregames and an ALCS/World Series/celebrations eats up a lot of space.

No wonder you have 50 hard drives full of stuff! Ever think about buying drives in 100 lots from the OEM?
Only averaging about 10 filled per year, so no. :)

Joseph S

12-17-05, 05:17 PM

zmatzkin

12-17-05, 08:39 PM

I'd hold off on going above three. Having problems gettign the app to acknowledge more than 3. :( Need the buffering protection bad, too. Using separate powered hubs with some powered units isn't helping either. Have even tried all 5 on same powered firewire hub with 2 self powered.

How about putting the 2 new ones on a different Mac? You can get old machines pretty cheap that will still run Tiger...and you don't need much performance to record...

Or you could donate them to a couple of us that have just one lonely 500...

Z

Joseph S

12-17-05, 09:56 PM

How about putting the 2 new ones on a different Mac? You can get old machines pretty cheap that will still run Tiger...and you don't need much performance to record...

Yes, I can. But you lose a lot separating them. When you put two on one and three on another you only end up with only one buffer. I'd be stuck having one box record only one station each night alternating the buffer. With all units working together I'd have two buffers at all times for three shows along with all data in one location.

The software still lacks the ability to schedule by seconds so you could end one at say x:59:50 and start the next show at x:59:55. This is another reason why I want the buffering additional tuners would provide. It's too much of a hassle to record two hour chunks, edit them both, and possibly have to re-record because the end result has screwed up info in EyeTV after the "rebuilding" of the data files. All the ABC stuff I like and some NBC and Fox stuff violates the top of the hour rule. CBS is a little better, but they have some programs running to 59:40 as well.

MacHound

12-18-05, 02:38 PM

Yes, I can. But you lose a lot separating them. When you put two on one and three on another you only end up with only one buffer. I'd be stuck having one box record only one station each night alternating the buffer. With all units working together I'd have two buffers at all times for three shows along with all data in one location. I'm afraid you lost me on that explanation. What do you mean by "buffer?" Do you mean the overlap between recordings? If that's the case, it seems to me if you had one Mac recording overlapping ABC shows and the other Mac recording CBS shows you'd have two buffers, no?

Joseph S

12-18-05, 03:28 PM

I'm afraid you lost me on that explanation. What do you mean by "buffer?" Do you mean the overlap between recordings?
Yes. But the buffer isn't always needed for one station and outside of Mondays for NBC and Sunday's for Fox it isn't needed for all three hours on one station. With them all together I can move the buffer around between all networks to create a stable recording schedule which given the TitanTV bug is tough to enter each week. There's also the issue that a four unit DVI KVM is significantly more $ than a two unit DVI KVM on top of the fact that a mini plus a storage solution is not that cheap either.

Joseph S

01-09-06, 04:00 AM

There's a lot of updates in the EyeTV FAQ, took one lead from another site and found much more...

Playlists and new layout. Yeah!
[EyeTV 2] How has the EyeTV Programs window been improved?

Originally, the EyeTV Programs window had one section, which consisted of all recordings and schedules intermixed.

The EyeTV 2 Programs window is organized into a number of sections, accessible from the Categories column on the left. Recordings, Schedules, Channels and Program Guide are the default sections, and Favorites and Playlists can also be added to the Categories column.

There are contextual buttons at the top of the Programs Window (Info, Play, Toast, iPod, New) and an Action menu which looks like a gear. Depending on what is selected, the choices will adjust accordingly.

At the bottom left corner of the Programs Window there is a button with a + sign. Use that to add a Playlist or Favorite Channels list. You can also add those items from the File menu, with New Playlist or New Favorite Channels.

At the bottom right corner of the Programs Window there is a slider. Move it to the left, and items displayed in the Programs Window will shrink. Move it to the right, and they will be magnified

Crap res iPod stuff
[EyeTV 2] How do I export video to a new (5G) iPod?

The easiest way is to highlight the recording you wish to export in the EyeTV Programs window, and then press the iPod button at the top of the EyeTV Programs window. That will export the file to a MPEG-4 format, and add it to an “EyeTV” playlist within iTunes.

If you want more control over the file type, then use one of these two presets, via the Export command from the File or Action menus.

The “for iPod (default)” preset encodes using Apple’s default QuickTime H.264 320x240 settings.

The “for iPod (recommended)” preset uses MPEG-4 compression, which encodes up to five times faster than H.264. The MPEG-4 preset also has higher
resolution output, which results in better quality, but generates a larger file. We recommend this preset as it provides the best quality for viewing either on an iPod screen or on a TV screen.

Neither preset requires QuickTime Pro. H.264 export requires QuickTime 7.0.3 or later.

Here are the specifics of each preset:

iPod (default)
H.264 Video, 320x240 or 368x208, 600 kbps, 29.97 or 25 fps, baseline profile, multipass
MPEG-4 Audio, 48000 Hz, stereo, 128 kbps

iPod (recommended)
MPEG-4 Video, 544x408 or 640x360, 1500 kbps, 29.97 or 25 fps, one pass
MPEG-4 Audio, 48000 Hz, stereo, 128 kbps

WTF? We actually get a program guide??? Say goodbye to that damn TitanTV scheduling bug. :D There's more about colors/labels for shows too.
[EyeTV 2] How do I update the built-in Program Guide?

EyeTV needs to periodically check with the Online Program Guide (TitanTV or tvtv), to download 7 days worth of information. Go to the EyeTV menu > Preferences > Guide, locate the Program Guide section, and use the Update option to select Every Day or Manually for your check.

You can also update the Program Guide from within the EyeTV Programs window:

• If you need to update your Channel Lineup, that option is in the Action menu of the Channels section.

• To update the Guide, that option is in the Action menu of the Program Guide section.

You still have the option to manually visit the TitanTV or tvtv websites, and download information about one schedule at a time.

Other cool stuff:
Searching with search by genre.
Manually add missing channels

[EyeTV 2] How do I backup my recordings?

The EyeTV Archive now has easy to understand file names. The packages ending with .eyetv are recordings, and .eyetvsched are schedules. By default, the EyeTV Archive is now in the Documents folder. If you have moved it, or just need to re-locate it, highlight a recording or schedule in the EyeTV Programs window, and then select Show in Finder from the Action menu (which looks like a gear).

Backing up an EyeTV recording or schedule is very simple - move the .eyetv and .eyetvsched files with the corresponding names in and out of the Archive. Restart EyeTV for the changes to take effect.

You can also drag recordings from the Recordings section of the EyeTV Programs window, to the Finder. That will make a copy of that recording, in the
.eyetv format. Move that copy to wherever you like, even to another EyeTV Archive.

If .eyetv files are moved elsewhere in the Finder, then double-clicking them will launch EyeTV.

We shall see how the above works. Needs to be able to allow for simple renaming just like other progs where x.ts is different from y.ts.

More:
Conversion of old Archives to new format
[EyeTV 2] My EyeTV Archive has changed, and now other programs can’t read it

If you had a pre-existing EyeTV Archive, then the older folders, with names like 0000000008fb0a05, have been changed into the new .eyetv packages. The contents of both are exactly the same, but the .eyetv package is easier to handle, and is double-clickable.

.eyetvsched - A package containing an .eyetvp file. It represents a schedule, and will disappear when recording is complete. If a schedule repeats, then the .eyetvsched package will remain.

.eyetv - A package containing .eyetvi, .eyetvp and .eyetvr files, along with an .mpg of the actual recording. A package is a container, similar to a folder, that can’t be examined by double-clicking.

To open these packages, right-click (or Option-click) and select Show Package Contents.

Some third party programs, like the CyTV streaming software, will have to be updated to read the new EyeTV Archive format. Toast 7.0.2 and EyeHome 1.7 already support the new EyeTV Archive format.

There is no way for EyeTV to automatically change the new EyeTV Archive format into the older format. If you want to manually change an .eyetv package into the old format:

1) Open the .eyetv package
2) Copy the numerical name of the .mpg file
3) Create a new folder in the Finder, with that same numerical name
4) Copy the entire contents of that package into the new folder

That folder can be used with an older version of EyeTV. If placed in the regular EyeTV Archive, EyeTV 2 will automatically convert it back to the .eyetv format.

Note how the above conversion process is concerning. It's still using the damn hexcode names inside the package!!! This must go!!!!!!!! There's no reason why text from the title can't be the file name.

toots

01-09-06, 11:16 AM

I took the same lead and worked through most of the added pages in the faq.

I'm a little wary about the archive format changes, since it means I'll prolly have to upgrade/update the cron hack I use to create links to the programs with real program names.

I'd really like them to update the app to allow scheduled recordings of multiple streams on the same frequency.

Joseph S

01-09-06, 04:00 PM

Sounds like 2.0 will be a paid update. I hope that's not the case, but if it runs >3 units and can schedule a season pass as individual recordings I'd be far happier paying up some more to save on hassle and still keep the OS X stability and superior tuner reception to MyHD. Sure hope those cards that came in the latest boxes offer some sort of a discount.

toots

01-09-06, 04:10 PM

Well, I'm sure iEyeCaptain will be a paid update, but I haven't heard any hint that the stock ElGato 2.0 software is going to cost anything.

MacHound

01-09-06, 04:36 PM

Well, I'm sure iEyeCaptain will be a paid update, but I haven't heard any hint that the stock ElGato 2.0 software is going to cost anything. How can iEyeCaptain be a paid update? It's still in beta testing.

I'm one of the first few people to have bought iEyeCaptain and maybe the first to pay full price -- voluntarily. Graham Jones is a great guy. He offered my money back since I was an early tester. What more can I say?... he's one of us. I wouldn't expect any mischief from Graham.

zmatzkin

01-14-06, 11:44 PM

So, no reports on 2.0?? I think it is a great upgrade and well worth the introductory price... It even seems faster, snappier... especially during editing... And I love the built in guide. My few recordings so far have gone perfectly.

I am curious about how it is working for you guys with multiple 500's...?

Z

jwcrash

01-14-06, 11:57 PM

It even seems faster, snappier... especially during editing... And I love the built in guide. My few recordings so far have gone perfectly.

Does it work with Divx 6.0? The last version of Eyetv didn't...this is a feature I'd love to see actually working.

Joseph S

01-15-06, 12:57 AM

I am curious about how it is working for you guys with multiple 500's...?

Same three tuner restrictions. Same TitanTV website bug. Same no recording or buffering by seconds.

But...

1) EyeTV .pkgs allow you to watch without flipping archives. Just double click.
2) Season Passes that really work!!!!!!!!! (Reruns get their own .pkg and if a name is the same, you just rename the pkg)
3) Guide helps make scheduling easier, though it does need several improvements.
4) Rerecording seems to work better for me this time around.
5) You can split long recordings by:
a) Saving as a clip.... WHICH ALSO GETS IT'S OWN PKG!!!!!!!!!!!!!
b) Renaming and editing both.

If they can correct the flaws above to allow unlimited units and scheduling by seconds, then the TitanTV website bug wouldn't even need to be addressed because you would never have to go to the site again. Just click it in the guide and you've got a recording set with buffers on either side is what I want.

The new interface however needs a lot of work. Way too many buttons and not enough hotkeys to do simple tasks. Items like the timeline also need to be moved away from buttons and the "stop" button should be a warning unless "feature" disabled. Also need 2+ weeks of guide data.

If you use it a lot it's definitely worth the money, but you can get an additional unit plus software for $149 more. :D That said, the "retail" $79 price is something that is way out of line for customers that bought their hardware or purchased the software already for $79.

imlucid

01-15-06, 02:11 AM

So far I'm happy with it and two 500 tuners.

However I still haven't been able to get anything to show up in the program guide (even after trying the "Update Titan TV Guide" from the action popup).

But other than that I don't have any issues so far...

avramd

01-19-06, 09:51 PM

Is there a post around here that summarizes the issues with using multiple EyeTV 500's on a single mac? If so, could someone please point me to it? If not, how do people feel about starting an EyeTV 500 FAQ?

I've just ordered two of them, I'm a newbie to this group. My hope is that I can cancel my cable and TiVo subscriptions entirely. I'm trying to piece all this info together, but so many of these posts make casual references to issues that I don't know the details of yet.

1) Joseph S, if you're reading this, could you explain what you mean by having "two buffers", and why putting 5 tuners on one machine would give you this, but three and two, on two machines would not?

2) It seems that there is some complexity with recording shows that don't end on hour boundaries. Could someone explain the issue please, and what, if anything can be done about it - particularly with two tuners?

3) Any other gotchas I'm going to have to look out for?

4) People here keep talking about getting some kind of funky DVD player, and streaming the HD streams to it as a decoder to watch HD from a low-powered mac. I gather this is all for people who dont' have a firewire port on their TV? I've been watching HD off of my mac mini for almost a year now, using Apple's D-VHS to stream the recordings to the TV. This is how I was planning on watching the EyeTV 500 recordings as well - am I going to have trouble doing this?

Thanks!

Joseph S

01-19-06, 10:49 PM

Is there a post around here that summarizes the issues with using multiple EyeTV 500's on a single mac? If so, could someone please point me to it? If not, how do people feel about starting an EyeTV 500 FAQ?
Maybe in the future. I'm real busy through the end of January. Shouldn't be too tough.

I've just ordered two of them, I'm a newbie to this group. My hope is that I can cancel my cable and TiVo subscriptions entirely. I'm trying to piece all this info together, but so many of these posts make casual references to issues that I don't know the details of yet.
If you have great OTA, this shouldn't be an issue. The new guide certainly isn't Tivo in terms of actively seeking out shows in all timeslots, but it works great for setting up a regular schedule or browsing upcoming shows. It won't catch the rare times CBS throws the leftover Threshold episodes onto the schedule.

1) Joseph S, if you're reading this, could you explain what you mean by having "two buffers", and why putting 5 tuners on one machine would give you this, but three and two, on two machines would not?
EyeTV has a "buffer" feature such that you can start and stop all recordings "x" minutes before and after. I find minutes is not very useful and would prefer seconds. However, I could make minutes work if I could add more tuners to the process. Last year I lost a bunch of shows to ABC's annoying schedule of putting Lost and Desperate Housewives in the schedule with runtimes in excess of 60 minutes, but often less than 61 or 62 minutes. I want a buffer so I don't have to check to figure out if Lost runs 70 minutes this week and 61 the next. I don't want to use >1 machine for recording based on storage options. A consolidated HD farm is better for me.

2) It seems that there is some complexity with recording shows that don't end on hour boundaries. Could someone explain the issue please, and what, if anything can be done about it - particularly with two tuners?

Same as above, plus 2.0 offers a new "feature." Previously, if you scheduled a block recording of say Alias + Night Stalker + Invasion you couldn't really split it up because even if you chose to "Save Clip as Recording" it merely created a new .mpg within the other's folder. All "clips" were tied to the same hexcode folder.

2.0 doesn't do that. You can just record a chunk and split it up.

With two tuners you can schedule oen recording to go from say 7:59 - 9:10 and the other from 8:59-10:01. With just one tuner you can only do 7:59-9:01 and 9:01 to 10:01. In cases like DH/Grey's Anatomy you may find that the second show actually started at 9:00:45 as opposed to the 9:01 that is listed as the second start time.

In general, you get an idea of how the networks work and you come up with solutions. ABC is a the lone oddball that never wants to tell you when something starts/stops. Lost and Desperate Housewives are the common culprits, but there have been others. CBS starts Survivor at 8:00:XX, CSI at 9pm, but WAT at 10:01pm. NBC runs ER at 9:59. This stuff is a nightmare and I want more buffers so I don't have to figure out what's going on at the network level.

3) Any other gotchas I'm going to have to look out for?
DO NOT SCHEDULE VIA TITAN TV's WEBSITE IF YOU HAVE >1 TUNER. IT WILL TURN YOUR SCHEDULE INTO A MASS OF CONFLICTS THAT AREN'T REAL. :)

4) People here keep talking about getting some kind of funky DVD player, and streaming the HD streams to it as a decoder to watch HD from a low-powered mac. I gather this is all for people who dont' have a firewire port on their TV? I've been watching HD off of my mac mini for almost a year now, using Apple's D-VHS to stream the recordings to the TV. This is how I was planning on watching the EyeTV 500 recordings as well - am I going to have trouble doing this?
If you don't have a fw port on your TV, playback of HDTV transport streams requires a G5 machine. That's why some use a media playback device to do the job. You won't be able to use a G4 mini and watch HDTV at full res, but it's really not bad compared to what you would think. Their decoder does a great job downres-ing material. Others can fill you in on how they playback via virtual D-VHS. I don't do that much anymore because my Mac can handle the full res playback as is. Some are using "Symlinks" which create standard names/links for the .mpg hidden in the eyetv package or eyetv hexcode named folders.

MacHound

01-20-06, 01:30 AM

4) People here keep talking about getting some kind of funky DVD player, and streaming the HD streams to it as a decoder to watch HD from a low-powered mac. I gather this is all for people who dont' have a firewire port on their TV? Yes, you have it right. Media players are a crutch for those of us with Macs that can't do reliable full frame video, or for those who don't have a Firewire TV or prefer not to mess around with vdVHS and its quirks. I have an I-O Data LinkPlayer2 which is far from a perfect solution, but it allows me to stream video from either of my Macs to my plasma TV. When it works the Liniplayer2 is quite satisfactory. When it doesn't work it's frustrating.

Other popular media players include the Snazzio SZ1350 (http://www.snazio.com/Links/Net%20DVD%20Cinema.htm), the Zensonic Z500 (http://www.z500series.com/specs.php), or the Roku HD-1000 (http://www.geek.com/hwswrev/conel/roku/). JVC has a rebranded LinkPlayer2 with a couple of added features. All of these players have their supporters and plenty of upset customers with pet peeves that player XXX doesn't do advertised feature YYY. All of the media players are laden with bugs and misfeatures, some with more prospect for an eventual solution than others. Any way you cut it this is life on the bleeding edge.

Someday we'll have compact Macs that can handle anything we want to throw at a HDTV. Someday everything will work seamlessly. We're a lot closer to that ideal than we were last January. I look forward to the day when I can pull my LinkPlayer2 off its shelf and slide an IntelliMac Mini CoreDuo in its place.... probably not this year, if Apple ships a Mac Mini CoreSolo with underpowered video and no digital audio output -- we'll just have to see what the rest of the year brings.

In the meantime consider yourself lucky to have a Firewire capable TV.

I adore my two EyeTV 500's. It's a product getting close to perfection, especially when ElGato irons out the new EyeTV 2.0 software quirks.

avramd

01-20-06, 01:43 AM

MacHound: I do consider myself lucky that I have a f/w TV - f/w wasn't even a consideration when I chose it, I didn't know word one about vDVHS then ;-)

Joseph: Ok, by "buffer" you just mean recording extra so you don't miss part of a show that runs just outside of an hour boundary, right? Essentially, you want a tuner per network so that you never lose a show to a 1 minute overlap, with a show on another network, right?

Or is it worse than that - when NBC "Super-sizes" a show by 10 min like they did Friends, does the EyeTV schedule think it ends at 8:30 anyway? Is it incapable of understanding a schedule that doesn't end on a 30 minute boundary?

Thanks for all your help, guys.

For heaven's sake, if only Tivo would stop being a hardware vendor, and start porting their software to anything that blips. At $13/month, you'd think there'd be money in it.

gaderson

01-20-06, 01:47 AM

DO NOT SCHEDULE VIA TITAN TV's WEBSITE IF YOU HAVE >1 TUNER. IT WILL TURN YOUR SCHEDULE INTO A MASS OF CONFLICTS THAT AREN'T REAL. :)

Hey, Joe (what you doing with that remote in your hand), sorry had to riff, really can you give a better description of this. I've only seen this once or twice in 'the wild'. I mentioned it to the elgato guys at MacWorld and mostly got dumb looks. So, can we give Nick@elgato a real bug report for this? I did have a recent recording that had a conflict--tried to schedule Bones against Lost and Veronica Mars, and when I said 'no' it also killed my Veronica Mars, but, kept the lost schedule.
I have just two tuners, but, I should be able to duplicate it. Maybe we need a 'undo' or backup of our schedules to keep us safe.

Ladd

01-20-06, 11:39 AM

If you don't have a fw port on your TV, playback of HDTV transport streams requires a G5 machine. What this?

I actually DO have a Firewire port on my TV (Sony calls it iLink). What do I need to search for to find the discussion about this method of how to get EyeTV500 HD recordings out of my Mac and into the TV?

avramd

01-20-06, 12:44 PM

The application is called VirtualDVHS. It is written by Apple. It is free, it comes in the free download of the Firewire SDK. It is just a "sample" of what you can do with Firewire. It's imperfect, the interface is ugly, and it's weak in features. And it's not totally reliable. But except for some occasionally rebooting and rediscovering, it's really slick.

It pretends to be a Digtal VHS to your TV, so your TV will copy the streams it's receiving to your mac. Then it will play them back to your TV. It's very easy for the mac, it is just copying the data onto the wire, and your TV already has a hardware decoder in it, the same one that displays the signal to you in the first place. The stream is only 10 or 20 mbit/sec, I forget which.

EyeTV does the same thing, records the raw HD streams to your mac, so it's streams can be pumped over firewire to a TV by vDVHS. I think you have to change the filename extension to get it to recognize them or something.

It's discussed in depth elsewhere on one of these forums. I just leanred that Firewire SDK 2.0 (http://developer.apple.com/sdk/#FireWireX) is out, I've been using 1.9 - never tried 2.0. There is also a page out there somewhere on how to use it to copy recordings from a Motorola HD DVR (cable STB).

To answer your next question, if we have this, why do we need EyeTV? Because at least as of 1.9, there was absolutely no programming capability. There is a hack out there somewhere that lets you schedule recordings via iCal, but there is no way to turn your TV on & off, or to set the channel.

toots

01-20-06, 01:03 PM

Well, that and 1 STB + 1 Firewire TV + 1 EyeTV = 3 simultaneous recordings, I'd assume.

avramd

01-20-06, 01:12 PM

true. Just one of them isn't programable, and the other one, if you want to get it to your mac, takes as long as the length of the program. Plus you'd only do that to edit it - if you just want to watch it, the DVR already does that better than either EyeTV or the Mac.

bradbomb

01-28-06, 08:21 PM

Is anyone else having problems with EyeTV 2.0 making the area on the menu bar where the clock crash so you cant access the sound, monitor, or sherlock?

imlucid

01-28-06, 08:30 PM

Haven't had that issue so far...

CraigD

01-29-06, 01:37 PM

Is anyone else having problems with EyeTV 2.0 making the area on the menu bar where the clock crash so you cant access the sound, monitor, or sherlock?

Not having that anomaly, but I noticed that when EyeTV 2.0 is running with an HD channel on it uses around 63% of CPU on an original DP2GHZ G5.

avramd

01-30-06, 08:39 PM

Hello,

I have one channel that works fine, and was discovered during auto-tuning, but doesn't show up in the program guide.

Has anyone else seen this, or does anyone have a fix? It is enabled in the channels tab, and my titantv online account shows the channel, but it doesn't appear in the program guide.

Thanks,
Avram

Joseph S

01-31-06, 04:39 PM

I have to say the new scheduling and "season pass" functioning is working better than expected. I haven't had a single crash and it has been going strong this past month without issues while I've been on the road and home but once. You may need to rename stuff when you transfer, but compared to the massive re-recording and hexcode crap of the past this is a piece of cake. Couldn't be much happier with v. 2.0. Obviously, still hoping for more tuner support and individual tuner scheduling options but I'm more than satisfied that I don't have to babysit the tuner and scheduling one bit compared to v.1.8.1's flakiness this past summer.

Has anyone else seen this, or does anyone have a fix? It is enabled in the channels tab, and my titantv online account shows the channel, but it doesn't appear in the program guide.
Have you tried fooling with the online guide's assigned channel name? Other than that I'm really not sure. I haven't had to tinker much. It's somewhere in an advanced guide mode, but I don't remember where.

avramd

01-31-06, 04:59 PM

I "fixed" the missing channel problem. On a hunch, knowing that this station is almost 60 miles away, I figured maybe their database just doesn't believe I can receive this channel. So I changed my zip code to something that's much closer to the missing station.

Before doing this, if I clicked the channel, then did sproket->Assign EPG, this station would not show up in the EPG list (even though it's in the channel list), and no EPG was set. After changing my zip code, it did show up in the EPG list, and was already assigned. Then I had to do another update, and finally, I have program info for the channel.

What surprises me though is that several other channels from the same distance and farther work fine with my real zip code. Perhaps they transmit with less power, and the database is aware of that as well.

gaderson

02-03-06, 04:09 AM

Hey, Joe (what you doing with that remote in your hand), sorry had to riff, really can you give a better description of this. I've only seen this once or twice in 'the wild'. I mentioned it to the elgato guys at MacWorld and mostly got dumb looks. So, can we give Nick@elgato a real bug report for this? I did have a recent recording that had a conflict--tried to schedule Bones against Lost and Veronica Mars, and when I said 'no' it also killed my Veronica Mars, but, kept the lost schedule.
I have just two tuners, but, I should be able to duplicate it. Maybe we need a 'undo' or backup of our schedules to keep us safe.

Well, I finally got into conflict hell. I've had only a few problems when scheduling with TitanTV, but, tonight, after restoring my internet connection, and actually just trying to turn on my 'disabled' schedule of 'lost' it all started. So, not even TitanTV is the only problem. But, once I cleared it up, and only scheduled two shows at once, I was home free.

Joseph S

02-03-06, 09:17 AM

Hey, Joe (what you doing with that remote in your hand), sorry had to riff, really can you give a better description of this. I've only seen this once or twice in 'the wild'. I mentioned it to the elgato guys at MacWorld and mostly got dumb looks. So, can we give Nick@elgato a real bug report for this? I did have a recent recording that had a conflict--tried to schedule Bones against Lost and Veronica Mars, and when I said 'no' it also killed my Veronica Mars, but, kept the lost schedule.
I have just two tuners, but, I should be able to duplicate it. Maybe we need a 'undo' or backup of our schedules to keep us safe.

There's a lenghty description in this thread somewhere, but...

1) Schedule recordings for two shows at same time for two tuners.
2) Schedule recording for one tuner at a specific time
3) Close EyeTV.app
4) Use TitanTV webpage to schedule a second recording at same time as step 2.
5) As Eyetv.app loads to enter new program from TitanTV webpage it will bring up conflicts for each and every instance where two shows are scheduled to record at the same time.

Essentially, on opening it fails to recognize that there are two tuners or three tuners... Didn't have this "feature" prior to 1.8. If you use "remote scheduling", manual, or built-in guide it doesn't happen.

gaderson

02-04-06, 05:24 PM

There's a lenghty description in this thread somewhere, but...

1) Schedule recordings for two shows at same time for two tuners.
2) Schedule recording for one tuner at a specific time
3) Close EyeTV.app
4) Use TitanTV webpage to schedule a second recording at same time as step 2.
5) As Eyetv.app loads to enter new program from TitanTV webpage it will bring up conflicts for each and every instance where two shows are scheduled to record at the same time.

Essentially, on opening it fails to recognize that there are two tuners or three tuners... Didn't have this "feature" prior to 1.8. If you use "remote scheduling", manual, or built-in guide it doesn't happen.

Ok, first try, and...
Got to step 4, and as soon as I hit the link in Safari, it started up eyeTV. But, the only conflict it noted was the first one. The second set of shows were not exactly the same times, but, both recorded at the same time.
Second try, I scheduled a set of 30-minute shows, and I also, only got a conflict with the first set, but, it doubled up the second show. The show in step 2, was changed to the same as what I had scheduled through TitanTV.
I'll keep trying variations, but, certainly that's one annoying bug. I see that elgato has a more involved process for submitting bugs, so I'll get started.

gaderson

02-10-06, 02:42 AM

scruffyTheMac

02-10-06, 03:22 AM

Well I've got an unusual problem that appeared this week: the program guide is empty past ~3am on Sunday 2/12. Repeated manual updates don't get any additional data.

Is anyone else seeing anything like this? By Sunday morning, I'm going to have a completely empty program guide. :mad:

JerryNY

02-10-06, 08:36 PM

Ok, so I've started going through my hard drives and creating the new 'named' archives, but, anyone figure out a work around, for when several recordings are all in the same folder? I tried putting them in their own Hex-numbered folders, but, then they disappear from eyeTV entirely, so? I need to try and get things back, and go slow to see what I can do. Hopefully I'll be able to get them back in. Joe noted that when saving clips eyeTV creates a new folder, so I can probably just go back and make new clips of the entire show, for those that don't convert over.

Are you talking about converting the old style folders with hex numbers into the newer sleeker packages? I found that all I had to do was alter one character of the info like the title or summary section in EyeTV of the recording and it updated the folder to the new package format.

-Jerry C.

Joseph S

02-10-06, 08:38 PM

Are you talking about converting the old style folders with hex numbers into the newer sleeker packages? I found that all I had to do was alter on character of the info like the title or summary section in EyeTV of the recording and it updated the folder to the new package format.

Then you know what a royal pain that is with the new "8 steps to edit info" in EyeTV2. You have to edit close edit close again to get it to work. Some of us have years worth of stuff and the conversion takes forever. Your tip helps, but it's still a pain. There's no hotkey for it and you can't create one with menumaster haxie either.

gaderson

02-11-06, 03:51 AM

Are you talking about converting the old style folders with hex numbers into the newer sleeker packages? I found that all I had to do was alter one character of the info like the title or summary section in EyeTV of the recording and it updated the folder to the new package format.
Then you know what a royal pain that is with the new "8 steps to edit info" in EyeTV2. You have to edit close edit close again to get it to work. Some of us have years worth of stuff and the conversion takes forever. Your tip helps, but it's still a pain. There's no hotkey for it and you can't create one with menumaster haxie either.

Yes, a real pain, but, as I mentioned that only works if there's just one show in the folder, if there are multiple shows in a folder it doesn't work. So, I've only got say half of some archives converted, since the others don't.

gaderson

02-21-06, 03:05 AM

Just upgraded to 2.0.1, and no problems so far. Recorded House and 24 ok, so we'll see. And, mostly repeats this week so a good test week.

CarlRx

03-06-06, 05:47 PM

Thinking of taking the plunge, but...

I am wondering if there is an effecient way to record HD with an EyeTv 500 then edit and output to DVD (at 720 x 480)--even if it takes hours.

Is A/V sync an issue?

Is exporting to iMovie or FCP or express an option for editing?

Is there a better option?

Anyone have input on Eye vs TVMiniHD?

I used to to some of this with an AccessDTV card in PC land but always had to fight with sync issues and reception issues b/c QAM recording not available.

Thanks!!

--Carl

CarlRx

03-12-06, 03:51 PM

bump.

please... any answers?

imlucid

03-12-06, 04:29 PM

EyeTV makes it pretty easy to take recorded content and output to DVD. The easiest is in conjunction with Toast software, but you can also do it by exporting the movie and importing into iDVD.

Ladd

03-13-06, 10:27 AM

EyeTV makes it pretty easy to take recorded content and output to DVD. The easiest is in conjunction with Toast software...Agreed. I have an EyeTV 500 and Toast 7 and it is very simple.

Record programming in EyeTV. Open up Toast 7, click Video Tab, select "DVD-Video" from slide-out window on left, click "Formats" button, select "EyeTV" from pop-up button, select desired recorded program.

While you can burn directly to disk at this point, I usually select "burn disc image" instead -- that way my DVD drive isn't locked to Toast during the hours it can take to process the file down from HD rez to DVD rez. When the disc image is made, then you can burn that image to DVD in a few minutes, also using Toast.

Depending on if you are archiving or simply transporting programming from your Mac to your living room TV, you can burn this image to DVD minus or plus R, or DVD-RW (rewritable). You can also choose to edit out the commercials using the EyeTV software.

You can easily fit one, hour-long program with commercials on a disc; if I am simply burning a DVD-RW disc on the computer to watch on the TV in the living room, I have found it easier to burn the whole show including commercials (fast-forward through the commercials when watching), than taking the time to edit out the commercials (and not actually seeing any part of the show, thereby spoiling it).

If you are archiving, then you might wish to edit out the commercials as then you can then fit two episodes on a single-layer disc without any compression, or three episodes on a disc with only minor compression. This is with single-layer discs; you can fit much more on dual-layer discs.

Any other questions, fire away! :)

jwardell

03-13-06, 11:11 AM

Has anyone heard any word from ElGato integrating with apple's Front Row or better yet MediaCentral (http://www.equinux.com/us/products/mediacentral/index.html)?

toots

03-13-06, 11:22 AM

Boy, that would be a winner, wouldn't it?

Lazlo

03-13-06, 08:33 PM

While Apple did hire the former CEO of Elgato to be their lead in Germany, I wouldn't hold my breath. There is no strategic reason for Apple to support anything associated with DVRs. It would only undermine the iTunes Music Store and their emphasis on buying and downloading shows. Granted, you aren't going to be able to download HD shows for a long time, simply due to bandwidth issues, but I don't see Apple going in that direction.

But, if Apple decides to support Transport Stream files, that would be enough for me.

MediaCentral, however is another story, being written by someone else. It already has support for EyeTV files.

Carl, in EyeTV 2, there is a specific export option for iMovie and iMovieHD.

Joseph S

03-13-06, 11:47 PM

It already has support for EyeTV files.
But not EyeTV 500 files or .ts.

I really could use that UB of EyeTV right now to let me watch my Archives while I'm recording the current shows on the G5. Playing with VLC is fine for live stuff, but for archiving I want a decent copy that I know is not full of little glitches.

Lazlo

03-14-06, 08:02 AM

But not EyeTV 500 files or .ts.
It plays my 500 files. Somewhat choppy, but they do play.

Joseph S

03-14-06, 10:25 AM

Yeah, but I want to know my Archives play fine before trashing or not re-recording a re-run.

seank

03-17-06, 02:03 PM

I have one EyeTV 500. It has two firewire ports on the back. The official statement from Elgato is that you shouldn't connect another device to the second firewire port. So, I am not sure why it is there.

I think this might have to do with it not providing enough power through the firewire port for devices that need power. If you have a self powered device, I wonder if it would work fine.

Has anyone experimented with this?

-Sean

imlucid

03-17-06, 02:06 PM

I have two EyeTV 500's daisy chained this way. Both have power supplies on them so they are not using bus power.

I haven't seen any issues with this setup.

Kevin

Joseph S

03-17-06, 02:13 PM

Crossposted from other thread for completeness:

http://elgato.com/index.php?file=support_updates_eyetv2

EyeTV 2.1 Universal Binary now Available

Update:
Please check to see if you can pass DD stream to your receiver, I can with the Dual G5 but the Mini fails to do so with this new UB. I can pass downrezzed audio via "System Sound Output" but no DD. VLC and DVD player work fine. For general use and playback it still seems it needs work for the Intel machine as I get some hesitations with using the app that I don't see on the G5, but it runs 720p with 2-3 bars on on Activity monitor and half bars on 1080i.

jwcrash

03-17-06, 03:43 PM

If you have a self powered device, I wonder if it would work fine.

Has anyone experimented with this?

-Sean

I daisy-chained a self-powered Firewire HD through my EyeTV without problems.

toots

03-17-06, 04:10 PM

Yeah, I'm pretty sure the issue is they just don't want downstream devices drawing power that the EyeTV might otherwise want.

Joseph S

03-17-06, 04:29 PM

Tried the old USB Sonica too after the built-in fails with EyeTV. Pref pane doesn't load, but I can select it in sound pref pane. Downrezzed works, Digital doesn't. Still no Mac Mini solution for my archives where ABC/NBC DD audio drops need to be ruled out on recordings. :( Awaiting response from el Gato.

imlucid

03-17-06, 04:31 PM

Yikes, you're not getting any sound with the new EyeTV? That's a killer. I'll have to see if I experience the same issue tonight when I get home.

Joseph S

03-17-06, 04:52 PM

I can get downrezzed stereo via "System Sound." I cannot get Dolby Digital output with the MacMini. G5 has no issues with v2.1

gaderson

03-17-06, 06:46 PM

I have two EyeTV 500's daisy chained this way. Both have power supplies on them so they are not using bus power.

I haven't seen any issues with this setup.

Kevin

I have two eyeTV 500s daisy chained, bus-powered, and have had no problems.

Lazlo

03-17-06, 06:48 PM

I can verify that, Joseph S. I can get "System Sound Output", but not "Digital Audio Output".

imlucid

03-17-06, 06:49 PM

Yeah when I play DD, my receiver flashes the DD icon like the signal is coming and going over and over.

But stereo is working...

Joseph S

03-17-06, 06:57 PM

lewisr

03-19-06, 07:34 PM

toots

03-19-06, 08:29 PM

Well, I'm not 100% on whether it's legal, but it's exactly what I'm doing.

I think it's legal 'cause the FCC requires them to provide the local stations unencrypted, and you gotta wonder why they'd do that if they didn't also mean that you could connect the cable to your own dang tuner.

When I did it the first time, I had some pretty severe DC/low frequency ground loop problems that manifested as a picture/audio breakup every 45 or so seconds. Not only did I get that breakup on the EyeTV, but also on the Comcast supplied DVR right next to it. Installing a low-frequency filter (like one of the ones that Comcast used to use on non-internet jacks) on the line feeding the EyeTV seems to have cleared that problem up fine.

Just the standard note:

The ONLY stations that you'll get reliably (for sure) are the locals.

In a more practical sense, I receive about 70 tunable things: All of the HD locals, all of the SD locals, all of the music channels, and occasionally, whatever channels get temporarily assigned to somsone watching video on demand.

I do NOT get TNTHD, UHD, Disc-HD, or any of the premium HDs, as they're all encrypted.

Budget_HT

03-19-06, 09:07 PM

Hi everyone,

I can't seem to get a straight answer from Comcast - but is it legal for me to plug a cable right into my EyeTV 500 to take advantage of its QAM capabilities? The answers I got from their telephone reps varied from unhelpful (uh, I think so, but the Internet won't work if you do that) to the wrong (there's no way you can install new jacks on your own.)

I am looking to do this, since the OTA antenna I purchased is not an ideal solution, but want to be sure I am not breaking any laws or will have the Comcast theft-of-service police calling me.

Incidentally, I am a paying subscriber of their Digital TV service - I am NOT - N-O-T looking to get something for free. Just don't want to be paranoid if and when I hook the sucker up.

Thanks in advance,
Lewis
You are legally entitled to receive non-encrypted QAM channels from your local cable company. I know dozens of folks here who subscribe to basic analog cable at $13 per month and receive the local digital channels over cable using a QAM tuner, either built-in to their TV or an external box.

Comcast CSR's, supervisors and engineers we have dealt with do not understand this at all. They continually try to sell digital service and a STB that you really don't need.

The only way you would be illegal is if you were not paying for at least their lowest cable package.

Stop worrying and enjoy your digital reception!

Lazlo

03-19-06, 09:15 PM

lewisr

03-20-06, 09:22 AM

Ditto, toots.

Lewis, especially if you are already paying for Digital Cable, I can't imagine that they could claim that you are stealing anything.

As far as I am concerned, I'm not stealing anything by hooking up a tuner that can receive the regular networks. If Comcast chooses not to encrypt a particular channel and I get to receive it, then it's their fault. I pay for analog cable, and as far as I can tell, they just send every signal to every cable on their network. This reduces their cost, since they don't have to inplement technology to send the particular signals to particular houses. That's what their cable box is for. If they want to tell me to stop tuning in the stations I shouldn't get, they should either stop sending it to me or start encrypting everything they don't want me to see.

Thank you everyone for your responses. BTW this forum rocks - I've known about it for some time but have been afraid to post my relative naievete. :)

I must confess to being a bit of a paranoiac - the general (if not overwhelming) consensus is that it's perfectly OK and legal to connect an EyeTV or similar QAM decoding device to your cable, as long as you're paying for the service, of course. However despite my digging (including Comcast's video subscriber TOS written in like 4-point font) I cannot find anything that definitively addresses this one way or another.

On the one hand, I would think it would be no different than in the "old days" splitting cable yourself and running it into a "cable-ready" TV - that was perfectly legal, right? But on the other hand, things are quite different, and from what I've read here, though I have not tried it myself yet, there is a LOT coming through that unencrypted QAM pipe that should NOT be there - e.g. "In a more practical sense, I receive about 70 tunable things: All of the HD locals, all of the SD locals, all of the music channels, and occasionally, whatever channels get temporarily assigned to somsone watching video on demand."

Now don't get me wrong, I don't disagree with the philosophy presented here that if you're paying for it, you should get it. But there are all sorts of clauses in the TOS about "connecting unauthorized equipment to the cable system" - what would one need to do to make it authorized?

On the flip side, I don't think El Gato would sell the device as something to be used with "Clear QAM Digital Cable" if the MSOs had an opposition to it. But one could say the same of radar detectors, which are legal in some juridictions but could lead to losing your license in others.

I guess I am just confused and am hoping for some sort of concrete "OK" before attempting to use the cable that I am paying for to enjoy television on a computer that I paid for. I know it sounds crazy, but my trust level of big corporations in the era of DMCA is miniscule.

At the very least, this post should make for some interesting flaming. :)

Thanks,
Lewis

toots

03-20-06, 11:06 AM

Well, I'll say this:

Yeah, as far as I know, it's no different from connecting a "cable ready" TV to the cable. In fact, in the near future, we're all supposed to be able to connect our own tuners to the cable, albeit with the addition of a cable company approved cable card. I don't know that this has any bearing on the immediate subject though.

On the other hand, there are numerous posts over in the HDTV reception topic where people talk about connecting QAM tuners (be it built-into the TV tuners, or PC connected tuners like the EyeTV) to the cable, and it happens in front of people who purport to work for Comcast, and I've yet to see one of them pop up and say "Hey, you can't do that!"

I am similarly paranoid. I used to take to heart the TOS clause that said that I'm not allowed to use a cable modem router (yeah, it used to say crap like that), so I'd go out of my way to hide my router equipment whenever a Comcast guy came out on a service call. But, when they finished installing my first HDTV decoder box a couple years ago, the tech said to me "You should also probably reboot your router now," so it ain't like they don't generally understand what people are doing.

I'm pretty sure they will object if you connect any equipment to the cable that causes problems for them or your neighbors, and here's my warning again: It has been my experience that connecting an EyeTV-500 (which is in turn connected to and powered by a G4 mini) directly to the cable can cause grounding problems that cause interference on nearby cable boxes (like a DCT 6208). They could potentially get very cranky about that if you cause your neighbors reception problems, or nearly as cranky if you call them out on a service call only to discover it's your equipment causing the problem.

So, I'd kind of recommend that you test this particular configuration for any problems (like the one I had) just to cover your bases.

JerryNY

03-20-06, 08:34 PM

I was wondering if anyone here also uses DVDSP and tried making hybrid HD discs on standard red laser media using EyeTV TS's. The newest update in DVDSP may or may not have made life much easier for putting EyeTV TS files onto these disc, the new Core Duo mini plays these very well btw. I found that by taking a standard EyeTV mpeg file and just demuxing it in MPEG Streamclip I could drop these right into DVDSP w/o transcoding whatsoever. Just a straight up import. Was it always this easy or did this last update to DVDSP which seemed to also make the discs compatible with HD-DVD players as well help in this regard? It has been confirmed elsewhere that these discs play in the new Toshiba HD-DVD consumer player. I was just wondering.

-Jerry C.

imlucid

03-20-06, 08:56 PM

Hmm, I wonder how easy it would be to automate a process of importing EyeTV shows through DVDSP into an autoplay HD-DVD folder on your hard drive?

markgo

03-27-06, 04:16 PM

el Gato is having the engineers look at it. My reciever never switches to DD with EyeTV 2.1 on Intel, remains DPL II with no sound. The G5 sends DD as expected and my receiver switches.

They say, "If there is an issue, say with EyeTV 2.1 on Intel Macs only, then we will fix that quickly."

Joseph, do these Intel Mini comments imply that you have switched your whole multiple EyeTV setup over to an Intel mini?

Regardless of that, with the exception of Dolby Digital are you now satisfied that EyeTV 2.1 is stable enough for your (highly demanding ;) ) setup?

I've been holding off on my living room mini until all the pioneers have taken the arrows in the back. Getting close now, though...

--Mark

P.S. I'm partly asking just to bump this thread. First time in almost a year it's not on the front page of the HTPC/Mac forum :)

Joseph S

03-27-06, 05:11 PM

Joseph, do these Intel Mini comments imply that you have switched your whole multiple EyeTV setup over to an Intel mini?

Regardless of that, with the exception of Dolby Digital are you now satisfied that EyeTV 2.1 is stable enough for your (highly demanding ) setup?
I have two on there but only for live viewing presently. Without DD support I can't weed out the errors for my favorites. Still have 3 on G5 and it's recording nightly. Really hoping they fix this now.

Lazlo

04-04-06, 09:31 PM

EyeTV gurus, I have a "0 seconds" recording problem that seems to be linked to my FireWire drive not spinning up fast enough. EyeTV2, EyeTV 500, OS 10.4.5 running off of the internal hard drive, shows recorded to a miniStack 320GB. I have the mini set to sleep after 1 hour, but also set the EyeTV 2 software to check for remotely scheduled recordings every 3 hours.

mini <-FW400-> miniStack <-FW400-> EyeTV 500

Any idea if swapping the FW drive and EyeTV 500 positions will remedy the "0 seconds" problem? (I could try keeping the FW drive spinning all the time, but would rather not.) Is there some other known remedy? Am I completely off base in my diagnosis?

I did clone the OS to the external drive, so I could see if running the OS off that makes a difference. (Again, something I'd rather not do, since the FW drive is much louder than the internal. Occasional clicking is ok while recording or playback, but I'd rather not hear the FW drive do all of the OS work.)

Joseph S

04-04-06, 10:20 PM

Try 10.4.6 and report back to class. ;) Sounds like it may be the issue. Before doing anything drastic I'd upgrade and recheck with the upcoming DD enabled EyeTV app we're all expecting. For stuff you need I'd probably just record to the main drive while you trouble shoot or don't let the drives spin down. Check your antenna too. Sometimes the 0 seconds were from a dropout of signal and failure to check again by EyeTV.

Lazlo

04-04-06, 11:35 PM

Thanks for the advice. I'm installing 10.4.6 now, so I'll see how that goes. Don't think it's a signal problem, as I'm primarily recording major networks with the Clear QAM tuner on my cable. Signal strengths are typically >85% and steady.

Keeping my eyes (ears?) open for the DD app update as well. :)

(Forgot to mention, it's a Core Duo mini, FWIW.)

toots

04-04-06, 11:43 PM

Showoff.

(I was gonna get a Core Duo mini, honest. Up until this financial crunch.)

I'm jealous of your mini.

Lazlo

04-04-06, 11:50 PM

My favorite part about owning a MINI Cooper and two Mac minis - nobody claims that I'm compensating for anything. ;)

ultimate

04-05-06, 12:39 AM

EyeTV gurus, I have a "0 seconds" recording problem that seems to be linked to my FireWire drive not spinning up fast enough.

When I've had zero second recording problems, it was usually related to something in the psip information. Rescanning for channels fixed the problem. So, if the upgrade didn't help, you might consider running the auto-tune again. Also, if it's one particular channel, they do have engineering problems occasionally so it might not be your setup at all.

Dennis

Lazlo

04-05-06, 08:21 AM

Two more "0 seconds" recordings last night after installing 10.4.6, setup via remote scheduling. Swapped the positions of the FW drive and the EyeTV 500, and trying a directly scheduled recording and will setup another remotely scheduled recording once I can get to TitanTV again.

Lazlo

04-05-06, 09:00 PM

The directly scheduled recording (through EyeTV 2) worked. The remotely scheduled recording through TitanTV (done from another computer) is a "0 seconds" failure.

Setting up to record "The Evidence" immediately after my "Lost" recording via remote recording.

Lazlo

04-05-06, 11:25 PM

Duh. TitanTV is sending the record, but when my EyeTV pulls it off the TitanTV server, it claims that some of them are unavailable. So, that appears to be the source of my "0 seconds" problem.

Should I report a bad lineup to TitanTV based on this? The channel numbers are all correct, but the identifiers are slightly wrong (a remotely scheduled record might show up as a recording on WJZDT1 (unavailable), as opposed to WJZ-DT in the EyeTV listing).

Joseph S

04-07-06, 01:56 AM

Titan won't do jack. I've been trying for a year for a correction on Leno/Conan start/end times and they haven't corrected a thing. Change TitanTV listing to be "WJZ-DT" and it should be fine.

Anyone bought the TVMini HD yet??? Is it any good? I really want >3 tuners on a single box and I can't do that with >3 EyeTV 500s. If it fails to allow >3 tuners in EyeTV, I'll have another tuner and mini antenna for the road as I struggle to get my Alias final eps while moving across the country this Spring. The other good news is I can then stash a Mini, FW drive, and a tuner or two off my parent's Comcast QAM and get something absurd like 4 or 5 markets worth of HD affiliates within 90 minutes of travel. I really hate relying on poorly run multicasting affiliates for my Network programming.

jwardell

04-07-06, 08:54 AM

I'm confused about your problem Lazlo. It seems you are setting your mac to go to sleep after an hour. So if it's asleep it won't be awake to record the show. Perhaps when you wake it up it realizes this and instead of giving you an error saying you missed the recording, it just stores a 0 second recording.
In other words, you should set the comput to never go to sleep.

wilsonsoohoo

04-07-06, 12:49 PM

I've found that the computer is perfectly happy waking itself up to record and going back to sleep again when it's done.

Lazlo

04-08-06, 12:20 AM

Pretty sure I isolated the problem to TitanTV and EyeTV not using the same names for channels. Haven't fixed it yet, but I'm satisfied that there is a solution.

And, yes, I have watched the system wake up and start recording a show properly.

toots

04-08-06, 12:49 AM

better or worse than paint drying?

Joseph S

04-08-06, 12:51 AM

The solution is fixing it on TitanTV's website. It's detailed in the EyeTV Manual how to change the website references for channel names under QAM section.

gaderson

04-08-06, 05:39 AM

But, I've run into a problem between ATSC and QAM. I was having drop-outs/macroblocking when recording QAM, but, when I tried to set up dual recordings (both QAM and ATSC at once), it defaults to which ever is there. Not only that, but, which ever channel is higher in the list view (for a custom program guide) gets shown in the regular schedule guide. I've sent a request to elGato so we'll see. Note how if you have both QAM and ATSC setup for the same channel, only one of the channels will show up. Took me for ever to figure out why I could only see my ATSC channels when 'checked' in the Channels windows.
Most of my 0s recordings have been because of a bad signal--the local PBS channel's antenna when down, and also some bad aiming of the antenna.

Lazlo

04-08-06, 10:45 AM

better or worse than paint drying?
When it works, better. Much better.

Lazlo

04-08-06, 10:52 AM

The solution is fixing it on TitanTV's website. It's detailed in the EyeTV Manual how to change the website references for channel names under QAM section.
Thank you Joseph. I'm sure that with some more work on my end, I'll get it fixed.

avramd

04-09-06, 10:51 PM

Hello,

A few days ago, my EyeTV 2 ran out of EPG data. Now when I do an update, it connects to the website successfully, but does not download any data. I've done a tcpdump on the transaction, and it does just a single simple http GET, and the response has no content, and that is it. Then it stops.

Does anybody have any tips or suggestions? This did occur about a week after I did do some work w/ EyeTV, so I could have messed something up. But I can't think of anything I did other than schedule some recordings.

I have rebooted, not that that should be necessary, but just to check.

Thanks,
Avram

imlucid

04-09-06, 11:49 PM

You could change your zip code settings in EyeTV or run the auto setup again (and re-scan your stations). That could possibly help...

Joseph S

04-10-06, 05:29 PM

We will soon find out if >3 HD tuners works if they're different types in EyeTV 2.1. 1 TVMiniHD ordered today. :D

Update:
But, I've run into a problem between ATSC and QAM. I was having drop-outs/macroblocking when recording QAM

Hmm. I finally got done with Alias S4 and noted frequent macroblocking on QAM and even OTA likely due to amp issues, but these were also made before and during the whole "crashing" firmware timeframe with 1.8.x. I haven't done any QAM this year, but I noted that my recording of S5E1 (OTA) with the current firmware and likely no amp based on hazy memory had no macroblocking or glitches at all. :D It sure is nice having one machine record and the other to watch live/timeshifted at night.

MacHound

04-11-06, 02:54 AM

I'll be interested in reading your impressions of TVMini HD. The price is definitely more attractive than EyeTV 500. I'm thinking of picking one up for my brother-in-law as a gift to go with his first-ever computer -- a 17 inch CoreDuo iMac refurb -- which he received on Apple's 30th Anniversary (4-1-06).

These new Intel Macs seem to appeal to people who never would have considered buying a Mac in G3-G5 days. I'm so pleased to have converted another family member ... though another brother-in-law just wasted $500 on a garbage Dell box that he's already having all sorts of trouble with. Now he's throwing good money after bad with a $100/hr PC guru home visit. Why won't people listen???

Joseph S

04-11-06, 02:32 PM

Four HD tuners now fully functional in EyeTV 2.1. :D

TVminiHD is very small and will fit in a pocket. About the size of the original 20GB iPods. Took a load of EyeTV for the usb power to kick in. Seems to stay alive afterwards. There is only one RF input for either QAM or OTA as opposed to EyeTV 500 which has dual inputs. There is no PSU connector and it uses a mini usb connector on the box. The antenna is also portable as the antenna screws off the base. However, your mileage is going to vary with the antenna. Given the size of the unit and the fact that it's on USB2 you should be able to fudge it on the road, but don't expect 100% signal strength for everything or anything. EyeTV shows it as "Miglia TVMini HD" in "Live Windows."

I assume based on this that you can now have 3 EyeTV 500 and 3 TVMiniHDs on the same box. Whether the HD can handle 6 HD tuners at once is another story. It seemed to handle 4 fine in very limited testing.

6 HD Tuners on a Mac Pro Tower, Priceless. :D :D :D :D TVMiniHD is $50 more than the EyeTV 500 reburbs at $200.

jwardell

04-11-06, 10:09 PM

I've found that the computer is perfectly happy waking itself up to record and going back to sleep again when it's done.

That's great! Are you specifically scheduling the computer to wake up at a specific time in Energy Saver or does EyeTV do it all on its own?

MacHound

04-11-06, 10:23 PM

"Took a load of EyeTV for the usb power to kick in. Seems to stay alive afterwards."

Care to elaborate? The unit has trouble when bus-powered???

Does TVMini HD seem like a decent substitute for EyeTV 500 overall? Any difference in reception strength or channel locating ability?

wilsonsoohoo

04-12-06, 02:15 AM

That's great! Are you specifically scheduling the computer to wake up at a specific time in Energy Saver or does EyeTV do it all on its own?

The EyeTV software seems to take care of that without me getting involved. It's pretty slick. The software also claims that if you have the right login settings (so EyeTV doesn't have to enter your login password) it will turn the computer on to make a recording if it is off. I haven't had the guts to try that one yet.

Joseph S

04-12-06, 04:22 AM

"Took a load of EyeTV for the usb power to kick in. Seems to stay alive afterwards."
Care to elaborate? The unit has trouble when bus-powered???
It's only bus powered. There isn't an alternative aside from a hacked usb cable. If you plug it in it will not light up or use power. However, as soon as you load up EyeTV it will begin functioning. It will stay on until restart or disconnection. It gets pretty hot which is probably the reason for the aluminum housing. I don't see power issues. I think I can see bandwidth issues when running two live feeds (1 FW and 1 USB2). It seems to drop playback frames, but not recording frames on the Miglia while the FW unit's live window is keeping up. Subjective and tough to prove. I wouldn't think it will play three live streams with three of these on the bus though USB2 should be able to do it.

Does TVMini HD seem like a decent substitute for EyeTV 500 overall? Any difference in reception strength or channel locating ability?
I think it's a different product. It's smaller and more portable than EyeTV, although I've had no probs travelling with the EyeTV in the past. Only one input limits options and the reception is roughly 4-6% points lower than EyeTV. The reception is fairly solid though. Didn't have to rescan for the new unit.

If you want something that's going to sit there and do nothing but record, I'd get the EyeTV. If you are already at 3 EyeTVs and the software can't take 4 without going to another tuner product, get the Miglia. Or if you want something for trips get the Miglia. I was looking to get around the 3 tuner limit and this solves that. It also gives me a portable solution that should do fine. With the new program splitting functions I can now get four to six networks at once all night without having to worry if something starts/ends at 9:01:42 and the other starts at 9:01:43. This requires a solid signal for everything you want which isn't always possible with one antenna. Getting to pick and choose which tuner records specific programs would help this out.

As long as the HDs can take it, there's no more worrying about whether or not my recording got cut short or if I can get all 4 top shows the networks try to stick on Thursday nights together at the start of each season. Just hope the software and hardware continue to improve from here on out. I once needed 9 tuners to do now what I can do with 4 or 5 thanks to the splitting off as new files function in EyeTV 2. I can also be more flexible in scheduling overlaps for common schedule deviants so I don't have to always record 2 or 3 hour chunks to split later. I can also take that 4th or 5th or 6th tuner onto another box and use another antenna to up the odds that even a signal reception won't spoil my chances of recording programs I really want to archive.

Very pleased to know 4-6 tuners is possible already. Looking forward to anything else that might come our way in the next few years, but I think we're set for a while.

Here's the list of stuff I'd like in 2.2 - Tuner specific records if desired, a "super-fine" edit mode to go by frames, .ts imports to the library. 3.0 can add Front Row integration.

gaderson

04-12-06, 04:43 AM

Here's the list of stuff I'd like in 2.2 - Tuner specific records if desired, a "super-fine" edit mode to go by frames, .ts imports to the library. 3.0 can add Front Row integration.

Good luck on "super-fine" edit. I got the impression from the ElGato guys that they were at the mercy of whatever the stream gave them. Seems that the vagaries of the transport stream wrapper means that they can only guess at the frames, some streams have them, but, others do not. But, if we keep prying, they may get it working for streams that can. They talked about how the break would sometimes seem rather random, and that there was nothing they could do. But, maybe there's something on the Windows side we could port?

gaderson

04-12-06, 04:44 AM

The software also claims that if you have the right login settings (so EyeTV doesn't have to enter your login password) it will turn the computer on to make a recording if it is off. I haven't had the guts to try that one yet.

This did work for me a few times, when I didn't start up the computer before heading to work. Even seemed to start early enough for the whole boot process to get finished be for it started the 'buffer'.

Joseph S

04-12-06, 11:50 AM

Good luck on "super-fine" edit. I got the impression from the ElGato guys that they were at the mercy of whatever the stream gave them. Seems that the vagaries of the transport stream wrapper means that they can only guess at the frames, some streams have them, but, others do not.
You can do it with VideoRedo on a frame by frame basis so it can be done. It even shows an audio graph so you can cut at the right times. Only problem is then you have to re-rerecord in EyeTV and the editing process in VideoRedo takes about 10x the time it takes in EyeTV both in selecting cuts and processing the file.

Joseph S

04-12-06, 07:48 PM

And I'll add based on the few clips I've recently edited on VideoRedo I'm impressed with the results. It even corrected a slight glitch that caused a stuter in EyeTV and the cuts were flawless with nice transitions. Only thing missing is perhaps a way to insert black space where stations cut too quick along with fixing the crappy interactions with the editor. :D

Did the read/write with the help of MacDrive too.

MacHound

04-14-06, 01:16 AM

Joseph, thanks for the follow-up on your Mglia. I'm uncertain what to get for my brother-in-law. Maybe a refurbished 500 is the better option. He doesn't need the Mglia's portability. USB bus power with those funky Y-cables is a big turn-off for me. They work better with some computers than others. I have a USB bus powered 2.5" external HD enclosure that works just fine with my PowerBook and my old PowerTowerPro clone but it doesn't get enough power from my G4 Mini to run. USB bus power is hit-or-miss. Lack of an optional power brick for the Mglia makes me want to avoid it.

Video ReDo has many nice features, but I also had some bizarre results such as a couple of streams that had every other video frame removed by the Quick Fix feature while the audio track was left intact. Playback was very strange, with the audio proceeding at a normal pace for a few seconds before skipping forward to catch up with the 2x speed video. The original file played perfectly in EyeTV and VLC. So the takeaway point is... be sure you look at your Video ReDo output file before deleting your original stream.

Joseph S

04-14-06, 02:58 AM

I'm keeping all my Alias original material. With single runs, no HD OTA for S1, local screwups, and TNT being 5c'd, it's a pain to get this in HD. I didn't run Quickfix on the episode that had the glitch. I just edited it and the problem was solved. Playback in VLC has no error on the same scene with the new version. Haven't yet tried to rerecord/EyeTV playback because I accidentally missed a commercial break.

dmward

04-16-06, 12:38 PM

This is probably the best place to ask this quesiton.
I can record .TS streams from my DCT6412 to my MAC mini.
However, there seem to be no media player other than VLC that will play the streams. VLC does not do a good job with the streams. There are significant interlacing artifacts. Using something like Steamclip results in significant quality loose.

I have the impression from this thread and others that eyeTV 2 will play the TS streams. True?

If so I will purchase it from Elgato to use as a player. Wonder if it can also be used to program recording from the DCT6412s?

David

MickeyDora

04-16-06, 01:22 PM

However, there seem to be no media player other than VLC that will play the streams. VLC does not do a good job with the streams. There are significant interlacing artifacts.

VLC is a great app...have you tried using the de-interlacing filter...set it to blend or discard if you are having CPU/frame drop issues.

dmward

04-16-06, 02:41 PM

I'll give that a try on the Mini connected via DVI to our 42" Sony.

I just tried it on a clip on the PowerBOOK and it does seem to improve things.

I am using a Heist eposode as my test. It has some scenes early on that show the artifacts quite badly.

Thanks for the suggestion.

David

Joseph S

04-16-06, 02:58 PM

I am using a Heist eposode as my test. It has some scenes early on that show the artifacts quite badly.
If your affiliate multicasts that's a likely source of the pixelation many of us see on NBC programming like Heist, Sports, Las Vegas, etc. It could also be due to the DVI cable. How long of a run? Colors for the artifacts?

dmward

04-17-06, 07:08 AM

I am probably desicribing the artifacts poorly. It is not pixalation. It is the horizontal ripping look from poor interlacing.
The suggestion above about changing the deinterlacing setting does have a definiate impact. now there is a jerkyness. I presume this has something to do with missing frames of momenary pausing while the mini processes the stream.

The DVI-HDMI cable is 6 feet so that should not be a problem.

This is a 1.42G Mini with 1 gig RAM. I was hoping that it would be able to keep up with an HD stream for playback, but apparently not.

Zoom player on a 3.0GHz P4 with 512M does a very nice job. I was hoping for the same performance here.

If Eye2 plays the streams well it is worth the investment since nothing else seems to be able to do the job. Or perhaps it is a matter of more processing power required.

David

Lazlo

04-17-06, 09:59 AM

David, I have a 1.25 GHz G4 mini and EyeTV2. That combination isn't going to be able to keep up with a full resolution HD stream by a long shot. EyeTV is smart enough to downscale the stream to 1/4 of whatever the original is. But even then, depending on what bitrate you are viewing, my G4 will only run about 20 out of 30 fps, and it is jerky as a result.

The only recourse I could recommend is re-encoding your .ts files into H.264 format at about 5 Mbps. If you test out different resolutions and bitrates, you should be able to find something that the G4 can play and provides good picture quality. Seems like a pain but it should work.

The only alternatives are to get an Intel mini (a Core Duo will be necessary to playback full frame rate, full resolution HD streams), or something like the Roku HD1000, which has the hardware decoders necessary to playback HD video. One user here, toots, has that very setup - G4 mini + EyeTV 500 + Roku HD1000 for playback - and it works for her.

toots

04-17-06, 11:06 AM

Yeah, the G4 mini has plenty 'nuff horsepower to record the transport streams off two EyeTV-500s simultaneously, but there's no way that it can keep up with full screen playback of even one stream.

The Roku does that fine (for varying values of "fine") via the third-party app Mplay, but I'm sure VLC would work just as well.

ghjaxman

04-17-06, 01:31 PM

I have the same setup as Toots and the Roku works for me as well. I also just got a Sony HC1 HD camcorder and the Roku plays those files as well.

I use the Roku for also all of my movie viewing, music and home movies.

dmward

04-17-06, 07:46 PM

The playback standard that I have is the Moto DCT6412.
It looks very good, as one would expect. The pain is that there is simply not enough storage space on the two boxes for the stuff we want to record. We save the entire season of 24 before watching it for example.

Am I hearing that the Roku Media Player will give a CT6412 type picture via the hardware decoders? That would be fine. In fact that would permit pulling a stream from a server to more than one TV location right?

Thanks,
David

toots

04-17-06, 08:36 PM

I have two Roku HD-1000s, one connected to a 1080i set, one connected to an old SD TV. Both stream off the same Mac Mini using NFS with no problem.

The 1080i decode is full-res, smooth, and as close as I can tell, easily as good as what I get from my DCT-6208. Only downside is that the Roku does NOT have DVI outputs, so when I compare the DCT to the Roku, both are via component connections. Since my old HD set only has component inputs, that's not an issue for me, but I'm sure it would be for others.

dmward

04-18-06, 06:37 AM

Thanks Toots,
I am using component out of the two DCT6412s now since My Sony only has one HDMI connection. (Mini is using it)
The ability to have more than one HDTV playing a stream does have benefits.
I presume the remotes for the RoKu are OK for FF through commercials etc.

David

MacHound

04-18-06, 09:18 AM

I have an I-O Data AVeL LinkPlayer 2 which I use to the same ends as what people are describing for the Roku. I think the LP2 audience is quite a bit bigger than the Roku's, so you might want to look into that option if you are determined to get a media player. But I would offer a cautionary note: media players will always lack the flexibility that a HTPC would give you, and you're at the manufacturer's mercy for firmware updates. Media players are all loaded with annoying bugs and misfeatures. From what I've read Roku is no exception.

I would suggest saving up for a CoreDuo Mini instead. You'll probably be happier with that solution for the long run.

dmward

04-19-06, 06:28 AM

Mac,
your point is well taken. My wife's only interest is playing the programs she wants to watch, skipping through the commercials. She loves Tivo's interface, tolerates the one Comcast has on its HD dvrs and would be intolerant of a buggy media player.
That means the interface on the MAC would have to be remote click simple for her to be comfortable with it.
That is one reason the Eye2 software is appealing. It sounds like it is close enough to Tivo to be something she might learn to use.
Naturally, playback quality is a critical consideration.
Also, its ability to schedule the DCT6412 for recording to the Mini via firewire.

David

gcbrowni

04-19-06, 08:12 AM

Related to David's comment about is wife; is the UB version with a single 500 now stable and rock solid?

I'd like to get rid of my stand-alone Samsung OTA HD tuner and my DirecTivo and move to an Elgato 500 storing to my basement NAS, all driven by a core duo mini. This would be the only source in my home, other than the DVD drive on the mini. The reports here seem to indicate that the core duo can handle the playback now that the UB version is out. What I have not seen is anything indicating that the UB version is stable enough to handle day-to-day recordings. Can anyone confirm that is the case? And the interface is good enough to use on a day to day basis?

Joseph S

04-19-06, 02:44 PM

What I have not seen is anything indicating that the UB version is stable enough to handle day-to-day recordings. Can anyone confirm that is the case? And the interface is good enough to use on a day to day basis?
Definitely stable enough for day-to-day. The interface is better than most. The only issue is you need a mouse to set the schedule. Scheduling is a piece of cake and you can now split a long recording and it will make separate files for you. The Core Duo can handle 1080i x 2 EyeTV Live Windows at once. The current release version fails to pass DD51 due to a bug. It has been a month since that EyeTV version 2.1 release and the issue has definitely been corrected, but that fix has not been released.

My recording schedule is massive tonight thanks to Alias being back. I'll be recording Fox, CBS, ABC, and NBC during the 9-10Eastern hour. If I had 5 I'd add Veronica Mars on UPNHD too, but I'll probably do that with the mini along with another backup of Alias to splice in if necessary. :)

4 tuners on the G5 - EyeTV x 3, Miglia
2 tuners on the Mini - EyeTV x2

:D

Now all I need is to hope my local affiliate doesn't screw up Alias, yet again. :(

dmward

04-20-06, 09:30 AM

Can Eye2 schedule recordings from the DCT6412? If it could that would be Ideal.

Using iRECORD to schedule the recordings on the DCT6412 works but there is not a program guide so it is less desirable.

Using the EyeTV QAM tuner is redundant to the DCT6412.

Am I correct in interperting the comments here to mean the Eye2 will play the m2t files that are downloaded from the DCT6412?

David

Joseph S

04-21-06, 01:50 AM

EyeTV can't schedule the DCT6412. It can play/re-record the m2t files but you can't skip ahead until it's re-recorded. If you just want to play use VLC, it works great. The 500 has two ports on for QAM and one for OTA.

I have found that the My Intel Mini's 120GB HD is fully capable of dual error free records with two 500s attached if you are in a bind. I'm also having some issues with the Miglia TVMiniHD. I wouldn't recommend it at this time until those issues are sorted out. It seems to drop "lock" status on my G5 far too frequently and worse with more fw tuners attached. Haven't had the chance to test the mini which has newer USB2 implementation than the G5. Seems like it doesn't get power all the time. Driver? vs TV Mini Hardware? vs G5's USB2 bus. Anyone know of a hack to power this thing via a individually powered USB2 cable? I don't have the know how to create the cable myself. A powered hub isn't enough, I want this thing getting power whether it asks or not.

gaderson

04-26-06, 07:19 AM

I just setup a new archive on a hardware RAID (0--Wiebetech Rackfire+), and I can't seem to compact edits in the most recent shows I recorded. I was able to compact some shows that I had recorded, and edited on other drives. But, I keep getting "The last operation could not be complete because of an error of type -36 (there was and I/O error) occurred."
I tried the 'Live TV Buffer' delete, a few times, and still it won't work.
Also the first time I started the 'compact' I was playing the file, just before the first cut point. Each time it fails within a minute or so of starting the compact--I get a bit of the progress bar.

Basically what I sent to ElGato, but, anyone else successfully work with a RAID? Hopefully this is something else, otherwise my RAID 5 will really be a bust.

seank

04-26-06, 12:36 PM

I just got a ReadyNAS NV. I only have one disk in it at this time.

I have moved my EyeTV library to the NAS and it seems to be working fine. Recording and playback works smoothly. Editing is surprisingly smooth. The only slowdown I have noticed is when I am compacting after making edits. It is not terribly slow, but it is definitely slower than when my library was on a local disk.

Overall I am very happy with the ReadyNAS.

On a side note, does anyone know if two computers each with an EyeTV 500 can share the same library?

-Sean

Joseph S

04-26-06, 01:47 PM

I wouldn't share. You'll have both loading up to do records. You can just double click on the files though now and edit them too.

jdryyz

05-03-06, 02:13 PM

I've been reading through this thread for a while now (I was a little surprised to hear that EyeTV 500 slipped passed my radar) and I'm not clear if all the issues have seen sorted out at this time. I would be using the item on a Dual 1.8GHz Powermac G5 connected to either over-the-air HD or unencrypted cable (based on which works out better).

From what I have been able to gather, these are some of the issues:

1) "0 seconds" recordings

2) crashing

4) not capturing DD 5.1 in the stream

5) problems encoding in Toast (I have version 7)

Are any of the items still occurring at present?

Thanks.

Jeff

Ladd

05-03-06, 03:57 PM

I have an EyeTV 500, running the EyeTV 1.8.5 software (the 2.x version requires Mac OS X 10.4.x and I'm still at 10.3.9).

My data point answer to your questions is that I have never had any of the troubles that you list.

Additionally, I daily use Toast 7 to convert recorded HD programming to DVD (complete with 5.1 audio) so I can watch it in the living room "on the big screen".

jdryyz

05-03-06, 06:19 PM

That sounds great! Now if there are enough positive reports like this, I will soon be a new elgato customer.

Incidentally, I am running OS X 10.4.6.

I have an EyeTV 500, running the EyeTV 1.8.5 software (the 2.x version requires Mac OS X 10.4.x and I'm still at 10.3.9).

My data point answer to your questions is that I have never had any of the troubles that you list.

Additionally, I daily use Toast 7 to convert recorded HD programming to DVD (complete with 5.1 audio) so I can watch it in the living room "on the big screen".

Lazlo

05-03-06, 06:34 PM

I can report similar success with EyeTV 2, though the current version does not support Digital Audio output on the Intel mini. Elgato is aware of the problem.

I don't have Toast, so no comment there.

jdryyz

05-03-06, 07:14 PM

Thanks for the input, Lazlo. Sorry to hear about the digital audio problem. I would think that wouldn't be an issue for EyeTV since it would only have to "point to the system resource". Perhaps universal binary related?

I can report similar success with EyeTV 2, though the current version does not support Digital Audio output on the Intel mini. Elgato is aware of the problem.

I don't have Toast, so no comment there.

wilsonsoohoo

05-03-06, 07:54 PM

Here's your second data point:

Same experience as Ladd's

jdryyz

05-03-06, 11:24 PM

Excellent!

Here's your second data point:

Same experience as Ladd's

MacHound

05-05-06, 01:18 AM

Data point #3 -- it's bedrock stable! I was one of the people having frequent zero second recordings under EyeTV 1.8.1. That's all a thing of the distant past. I haven't seen a zero second recording since last summer. EyeTV 500 is a great product. I own two of them.

jdryyz

05-05-06, 12:38 PM

Awesome! Are there any hardware/firmware versions I need to be sure I'm using also?

Data point #3 -- it's bedrock stable! I was one of the people having frequent zero second recordings under EyeTV 1.8.1. That's all a thing of the distant past. I haven't seen a zero second recording since last summer. EyeTV 500 is a great product. I own two of them.

toots

05-05-06, 01:33 PM

I'm another one having good luck with 1.8.5.

Just buy the box, download the latest version of the software and it takes care of firmware updates for you.

grubavs

05-05-06, 05:37 PM

I'm another one having good luck with 1.8.5.

Just buy the box, download the latest version of the software and it takes care of firmware updates for you.

I hope it's OK with the moderators...
there are REFURB EYETV 500s at El Gato's website:

http://elgato.com/index.php?file=shop_onlineshop_eyetv500_refurb

Phantom Gremlin

05-06-06, 04:07 PM

Joseph S

05-07-06, 01:35 AM

Too bad for El Gato.
I didn't miss a story this week did I??

MacHound

05-07-06, 09:51 AM

Too bad for El Gato. Last year I was quite inclined to purchase a 500 but the reports of all the problems put me off. Once a product gets a reputation for flakyness, people tend to stay away. Can you name any tech product that didn't experience flakiness at some point in its lifecycle? Sure, my original 128 KB Mac was pretty solid when it shipped but that computer had two OS files plus some fonts. These devices are a bit more complex than a 128K Mac.

Why not give ElGato credit for fixing EyeTV 500's problems rather than bashing them for issues that no longer exist?

In the aftermath of 2005's debacle ElGato learned the importance of thoroughly testing their code. Many companies never learn that lesson. ElGato is to be commended.

flexion

05-07-06, 02:44 PM

Too bad for El Gato. Last year I was quite inclined to purchase a 500 but the reports of all the problems put me off. Once a product gets a reputation for flakyness, people tend to stay away.

Now it may make more sense to wait and see what Apple and/or TiVo come up with.I've been using both a 500 and a 200 (on different machines with very few problems.) The 200 has been running 24 hours a day on a G5 for over 3 months. It is always recording a program. It is nearly always exporting a different one as well. Much of the time is is also compacting a third, while I edit a fourth. It rarely crashes or I would be more careful with it. It's fairly easy to tell when it's internal data structures have gone awry. Simply edit a scheduled program to lengthen it into the next one, and look carefully at the error message it gives. If it makes sense then it's probably fine, otherwise you'd best restart it before you do much more.

By the way, all of this is going on while I use the machine in other ways as well.

My only complaints are that although you can split a file there doesn't appear to be a way to concatenate the pieces. And it drops a second or so between successive recordings. It be be much smarter if it allowed overlap (recording into two different files simultaneously so that you could avoid having recordings ruined because the station schedule slips a bit in time.)

Other than that I think it's a truly fantastic product. It beasts the bejesus out of Tivo across the board--ease of use, picture quality, editing ability, conversion and preservation options, etc. Just one example of a feature which is missing from Tivo but very important. You're taping a show while watching it and it's clear that it's going to run long. With Tivo the best you can do is quickly schedule another to start after the first and loose the bit it drops between them. But with the EyeTV software you can easily extend the recording length so that the ending doesn't get clipped.

Phantom Gremlin

05-07-06, 04:52 PM

I didn't miss a story this week did I??
If you missed a story I missed the same story.

What I was trying to say is that little companies like El Gato have a window of opportunity for their products. I believe that window is closing. Soon, larger companies like TiVo and Apple may have competitive products.

Phantom Gremlin

05-07-06, 04:59 PM

Can you name any tech product that didn't experience flakiness at some point in its lifecycle?
Yes I can (more or less).

I was an early adopter of the S1 standalone TiVo. Given that is was such a new product I was very impressed by its overall stability. It never crashed. It never deleted shows already recorded. It always recorded the shows it was asked to. Etc. Etc. Etc.

Yes, the modem was horribly flaky. But that was a peripheral issue (bad pun). Contrast this with El Gato in which the fundamental device operation was horribly flaky.

Phantom Gremlin

05-07-06, 05:09 PM

Just one example of a feature which is missing from Tivo but very important. You're taping a show while watching it and it's clear that it's going to run long. With Tivo the best you can do is quickly schedule another to start after the first and loose the bit it drops between them. But with the EyeTV software you can easily extend the recording length so that the ending doesn't get clipped.

No, you are wrong about this. But since there have been so many TiVo models and software versions, let me specify what I just now tried on my DirecTV R10.

1) I hit "record" to start recording a program.

2) I hit "list" then hit "select" on current program.

3) I selected "change recording options".

4) I scrolled to "stop recording" and used right arrow to extend time by 5 minutes.

5) I hit "select" a few times to finish updating the fields.

6) THERE IS NO STEP 6. :)

I can't see how that could be any simpler.

Joseph S

05-07-06, 08:13 PM

Soon, larger companies like TiVo and Apple may have competitive products.
Maybe, but elGato seems to be continually adding support for other devices and there's no DRM. If they can officially allow >3 FW boxes with scheduling by tuner I will be one happy customer.

gaderson

05-09-06, 01:40 AM

No, you are wrong about this. But since there have been so many TiVo models and software versions, let me specify what I just now tried on my DirecTV R10.

1) I hit "record" to start recording a program.

2) I hit "list" then hit "select" on current program.

3) I selected "change recording options".

4) I scrolled to "stop recording" and used right arrow to extend time by 5 minutes.

5) I hit "select" a few times to finish updating the fields.

6) THERE IS NO STEP 6. :)

I can't see how that could be any simpler.

That's pretty close to what one would do with EyeTV--granted with a mouse.

1) Hit 'record'

2) Go to 'Recordings' list in 'EyeTV Programs' window (if not open).

3) Scroll down to recording, select.

4) 'Get info' and drag 'end' arrow to the right, or directly edit the 'raw' end time.

5) Close window, and maybe click in the main window to go back to the list.

6) Well, no step 6 either!

You must have started reading here at just the right time. When I first got my 500 it worked intermittently, but, within the next update it was fine. Those with more 'mature' hardware (e.g. 200, 310 etc.) had no problems, but, ours were fixed, and within a month only a few of us still had problems. You do know that the people having trouble will be the first to post, and the happy ones are at home watching their recordings.

chefklc

05-09-06, 11:06 AM

phantom gremlin--this is going to appear to be a personal and direct response to what you've recently posted on this thread--but it's really not. I've looked at your posts, and am going to refer to some specifics, but what I'm ultimately trying to say is much more general. I'm prompted by nothing other than the fear that your posts mislead the casual or newbie visitor to this forum, that you're appearing to besmirch a very good company, a company very loyal to Mac users (unlike Tivo) and that you're appearing to do it WITHOUT any direct experience of their products--nor much experience recording and archiving high def programming.

You might have been an early adopter of the S1 Tivo--but since then what other HD DVR/PVR/STB devices do you have personal experience with as an early adopter? While you've been watching and recording SD content--many of us have been watching AND recording AND archiving HD. Have you been, and if so, how? That'll help those of us who have direct experience with El Gato understand where you might be coming from.

You moved up from a Series 1 standalone to the SD DirecTivo bandwagon, you also have the LG4200 QAM tuner, and yet you still offload content from your Tivo to a Panny dvd recorder? It also appears you don't use a Mac for much in a home theater context--do you? So your experiences are very different, and seem less well-rounded, from others in this forum. That's not a negative--that just means we're a diverse group. But many of us have moved forward from where you still are a long time ago--and El Gato has been key in that movement.

As just one example, I've used an LG 3410A for a coupla years not only to record high def via OTA and QAM--but archive same over firewire--talk about being an early adopter! Yes, there's a lot I still like about that prickly plagued device--but the Mac + EyeTV500 combo kicks its ass, hands down.

So, are you speaking from hands-on experience when you write of El Gato that "the fundamental device operation was horribly flaky?" Or are you relying on impressions you've formed from reading the accounts of others here, and perhaps misinterpreting them, chiming in with a partially self-fulfilling prophecy to justify why you've waited so long to move forward?

Have to say, flexion's post above rings true to me in terms of an El Gato vs. Tivo comparison--and is another reason why this Mac home theater forum is a special on the net, it's because many of us used these other devices and methods as well--you want to compare Tivo to El Gato, recording HD over firewire via PC versus Mac VirtualDVHS, DirecTivo to the LG 3410A, El Gato EyeTV500 to the Sony HDD250--someone here can, and can place the pros, cons, featuresets, value-proposition, etc in context--explaining why as users they prioritized what they did and made the decisions they did.

In your case, Phantom Gremlin--are you still recording SD with a DTivo and then offloading (with loss) to a Panny dvd recorder, via what--S-video and RCA? You have an EH50--I once used a Panny DMR-E80H with my long since given away Tivo Series 2 and really--this is circa 2002/2003 content management, an outmoded way of thinking, and rather time-consuming, convoluted and low res at that. And my Panny had a built-in hard drive, unlike your model, which in theory made things easier. Is it accurate to say you're doing DirectTV and DirecTivo for SD and not HD? And you're watching QAM HD from Comcast via your LG STB tuner? If so, how are you archiving that HD? If you're doing more than just tuning, then your comments about El Gato's flakiness would carry more weight--even if those comments do not stem from first hand experience.

Moving on, I think you're on stronger ground, and no one would disagree with the general sense behind your statement: "little companies like El Gato have a window of opportunity for their products." However, some in this forum--who have actually used Macs for a while AND own El Gato products--would disagree when you assert: "I believe that window is closing. Soon, larger companies like TiVo and Apple may have competitive products."

It just may be that Apple won't see an advantage any time soon to subsuming what an El Gato has provided as a third party vendor, that with the current quickly changing tides of technological advancement and shifting standards the time isn't right yet for them to act--and instead let the third party vendors deal with interfacing with the cable/sat providers.

And actually, I'm pretty sure I'm not alone within this forum to think the window on Tivo hardware itself closed a few years ago, and any new HD cable-compatible device from them will be too little, too late, for us. Who here would eagerly return to a high upfront cost, a monthly service fee, a lifetime fee even if resurrected, DRM, proprietary limitations imposed on storage, movement and conversion of HD files? Not too many, I'd suspect. Especially not with EyeTV500 refurbs readily available for $199 with no monthly fee, no DRM, etc.

and the happy ones are at home watching their recordings

yes, wise words these, though I'd amend this to say the happy ones are at home watching and archiving their "HD" recordings, with no DRM, unlimited storage and unencumbered movement around their home.

Now it may make more sense to wait and see what Apple and/or TiVo come up with.

Some of these same folks have been waiting for years already, what's a few more months or years?

To try to wrap things up, and yes, I realize there's a risk in generalizing: my assessment of Mac users in this forum who have hands-on experience with an El Gato device is that their opinions don't support your view from afar, they are overwhelmingly positive, especially for the price paid. We strongly recommend EyeTV now, and have in the past. And most of us have recorded and archived HD in other ways, yet still choose El Gato.

My advice, as both an early adopter of Tivo and El Gato, is to pimp the prospects of Tivo somewhere else. Most of us who use Macs, and have used both Tivo and El Gato, have long since moved past Tivo.

(Just caught a mistake I made: edited to add the Panny DMR-EH50 does have an HDD, just like my DMR-E80, though when utilized for Tivo "save to vcr" functionality both are still just as limited by S-video and RCA analog in.)

seank

05-09-06, 12:59 PM

Has anyone tried to have two computers each with an EyeTV 500 device on the same network using the same library file?

I tried this yesterday. I am using my ReadyNAS box as my EyeTV storage library. I manually set each device recording a channel. I then watched a pre-recorded show on one of the devices. So two shows were being recorded and one was being played back, all across the network at the same time, to and from the NAS box. Everything performed flawlessly. Both recordings were fine and there was no problem playing back the pre-recorded show.

The problem comes in when setting a scheduled recording. If I set a show to record on one device both devices will end up recording it. Similarly, if I set a show to record on one device and then attempt to set a different show to record on the other device at the same time it will tell me there is a conflict and that I have to either cancel the existing scheduled record and or change the one I am trying to set.

Can anyone think of a way around this? Since both devices are sharing the same library they are sharing the same schedule file. It seems it would be fairly simple for Elgato to fix this, but who knows if they will (I will submit a request).

But can anyone think of a workaround? Or is there a simple solution that I am missing?

-Sean

wilsonsoohoo

05-09-06, 03:27 PM

Lazlo

05-09-06, 08:16 PM

Sean, I would guess that a lot of your problem results from using a single schedule file.

Is there some reason you don't have both EyeTV boxes attached to a single Mac? Joseph S has clearly illustrated the functionality of that setup. (I'm guessing it is because you have Mac/EyeTV setups in separate rooms attached to separate televisions and want to access all of your content from either place.) Can't think of an obvious way around it right now, myself.

Ok, maybe I can. Set up separate EyeTV Archive directories on each machine like normal. On one machine write an Automator or Apple Script that looks for new shows in the other EyeTV Archive directory every 10 minutes or so and copies an alias of each new show to the local Archive directory. That way you don't have to move files around, but can access them from either machine. Not sure how you go about getting those shows to show up in the EyeTV Recordings area, but perhaps that is an exercise left for the reader. ;)

Joseph S

05-10-06, 10:49 AM

I found a partial work around for the overlay being hidden without a display or gHead/Dviator attached. If you view the the stream info you can see dimensions, framerates, etc. Good enough to put off express shipping a $27 part for a few weeks.

The QAM setup is much easier to do in 2.x. The only issue is that the chennel listing still contains a whole bunch of unused SD/encrypted items. Being able to assign a guide channel data to a specific QAM channel was much, much easier than doing it manually. Plus the epg now works as well.

1 fully functional single unit EyeTV 500 remote setup sucess. :D

seank

05-10-06, 12:21 PM

Would it help if you made one device start 3 minutes ahead of the scheduled time and the other 2 minutes ahead? I think you can do this in the preferences area. Maybe the problem is that they are starting too close together.

Good idea, but it didn't work. The EyeTV software looks for overlapping schedules not just overlapping starting times.

-Sean

seank

05-10-06, 12:38 PM

Lazlo,

I think you are on the right track with the use of aliases.

I do want an EyeTV 500 hooked up to a separate TVs (and separate macs) in separate rooms. Yet I want each one to be able to browse recordings which have been made on either device.

I played around quite a bit with aliases yesterday. The EyeTV software is somewhat friendly to aliases placed in the EyeTV Archive folder. In fact, you can place in the EyeTV Archive folder an alias to a folder containing other EyeTV recordings, and those recordings will show up fine in the EyeTV software.

So yesterday I created separate "Archive" folders on my NAS box for each EyeTV and then placed an alias to each one in the other's folder. The recordings showed up fine on each Mac when running the software. The problem is that the schedule files also show up fine so I have the same problem of not being able schedule two recordings at the same time (not to mention that single scheduled recordings results in both EyeTVs making the same recording).

I then had the bright idea of using Tiger's smart folder function. I created a smart folder that shows only the recording files from each Archive folder and placed these smart folders in the other Archive folder. I thought this would work, but apparently the EyeTV software will not see into a smart folder like it will a real folder or an alias to a folder.

So it appears that until Elgato provides this built in functionality, your idea of some sort of script that monitors each folder and puts an alias of recordings each other folder every so often might be the only solution.

-Sean