Folks:
Anyone tried one of the new SA 8300s with HDMI and a DVR? I know that some Time Warner companies are currently testing them... Curious to see how they are working.

Folks:
Apparently we're the first TWC area to test the new SA 8300 or else everyone else signed non-disclosure agreements and are keeping quiet. :D

I guess I'll just try and get one and report back...

The ones here have HDMI - the DVI is history.

HDTVFanAtic:
I see - I was repeating info I got from my TW techie. HDMI works. How does the DVR work? How is the operating system? Any major (or minor) glitches in the implementation? Usability?
Thanks.

Do they also have component video connections for HD output?

Folks:
I got my local TWC to give me one of these to try out for a month in exchange for my comments. I will go pick it up as soon as I figure out what kind of connection cable I need (it has HDMI out and I only have DVI in) and order it from Pacific Cables. Then in short order, I will let you folks know what it can do and what its connectivity is like. I will also post pictures of the front and back sides (unless they expressly forbid it, but I would ask for permission first :D).

More in a week or so...

Gosh HDMI and not DVI - guess I might know what I am talking about :D

I'm in Rochester and Time Warner just started general deployment of the 8300HD units last week. They have 700 people on a waiting list since mid June for these boxes. They had been stocking up on the 8300HD units waiting for a software update that just arrived last week. I understand the 8000HD units had a lot of problems. So I was able to return my 8000 non HD unit this past Friday to finally get an HD DVR. I ordered the HDMI to DVI in cable Friday for $31 from Pacific Cable and it will arrive tomorrow for me to hook up. I understand the software update TW got enabled this port.

HDMI to HDMI:
http://www.pacificcable.com/Picture_Page.asp?DataName=HDMI-2
or
HDMI to DVI:
http://www.pacificcable.com/Picture_Page.asp?DataName=HDMIDVI-2

The box is very impressive so far and I'm using the Pass through mode with component currently till my HDMI cable arrives tomorrow.

The only problem I've seen to date now is that my box crashed twice. I was changing channels at a fast rate and it blew up. The second time I was watching one channel and using PIP when I was changing the channel again at a fast rate on the smaller PIP and the whole box crashed. Does anyone know of a way to report these crashes or bugs to TW? I know the system logs them within the unit as I could see the crash debug details.

I also want to find out if the SATA output is working to add another hard drive for storage. I understand SA was waiting for the SATA 2 specs to become final before enabling this port.

http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1558,1405051,00.asp

I just wished the interface would improve to be more like Tivo. It is so hard to find your shows to record and the guide only goes 7 days forward which can be a pain if your traveling.

Incase anyone wants the current software details of the SA-8300HD they are:
# ROM Image. . 1.85.8.5
# OS. . . . . . . . .6.8.6.5
# SARA. . . . . . .1.85.8.5
# PowerKEY LIB 3.6.1.3
# HAL2 Driver. .1.0.22.1010
# PHAL3 Driver. 3.5.9.1015

Also attached is a PDF of the 4 pages in the manual of interest to folks.

Craig

I'm using the Pass-thru mode with component currently What is "pass-thru mode" with component video connections?

What display are you using with the DVR? If your display is CRT based(RPTV or CRT FP), you should find that the component output involves less A/D to A processes.

I like that Serial ATA connection. I'd noticed this feature in S-A's PRs, but it looks as though they'll be qualifying a bunch of off-the-shelf drives for expansion. It'd be nice to just go to Fry's, pick up an external 320 GB SATA drive, plug it in and suddenly have another 40 hours of HD recording space.

Mike,

I wonder if they can allow any connected media drives without some sort of highly restrictive CP and verifiable media playback connection? If component connections are a no-no, how can they allow HD movie jukeboxes without some serious CP involved?

Originally posted by merc
What is "pass-thru mode" with component video connections?

What display are you using with the DVR? If your display is CRT based(RPTV or CRT FP), you should find that the component output involves less A/D to A processes.

In the settings you can change the default of Fixed to Pass Through (couldn't do this on the SA 8000HD). This mode will allow the signal to pass through the box without conversion. For example, if you are watching SD, a 480i signal coming in from the coax cable will be passed through to your output cables and to your monitor exactly as received. If you are watching a HD feed with 1080i, then it will be passed through without conversion. If you are watching, say HD ABC, the 720p signal will be passed through to your monitor without any conversion. So, there is no upconversion. This will keep 480i channels at 480i, so you can probably use your tv to zoom/set aspect from there and will likely handle the signal better than SA.

This ability is very advantageous since it can reduce the number of conversions of the signal, and hence, increase the PQ (at least in theory). Of course, it might get even better if it could be left in the digital domain which an active DVI or HDMI port supports.

I'm only currently using component because my HDMI cable didn't arrive yet. I just got the box on Friday and TW didn't supply any cables.

In the settings you can change the default of Fixed to Pass ThroughIf I understand you correctly, pass through is an option, and you can still select 1080i output via component if you desire... right? Since my HDTV doesn't support 720p and that's what ABC uses, I can't use the pass-through setting.

I used to own a Panasonic HD STB which you could set for 1080i plus 480i/480p passthrough. All HD signals were output as 1080i but Fox 480p was passed through...

cdp1236 & merc:
I still haven't gotten my 8300 (TWC folks have been on vacation since last Wednesday...) so I can't confirm on my own but I am curious how the "pass through" works on HDMI/DVI. I understand how it works with a component connection but it doesn't quite work the same with my Pace 550 through DVI. On that STB, the display (in my case, a Samsung DLP) does not have the full range of aspect ratio settings when using the DVI connection. Is this because of the display or the Pace box?

I will report later when I (finally) get the 8300 and fool around with it for a while...

Originally posted by merc
If I understand you correctly, pass through is an option, and you can still select 1080i output via component if you desire... right? Since my HDTV doesn't support 720p and that's what ABC uses, I can't use the pass-through setting.

I used to own a Panasonic HD STB which you could set for 1080i plus 480i/480p passthrough. All HD signals were output as 1080i but Fox 480p was passed through...

Yes, this is an option. You can select fixed and when you do that set fixed when your at 1080i and all output will be up converted to that signal. They also give you an option of upconvert-1 & upconvert-2 in addition to fixed/pass through within the settings menu.

However when it does the auto setup it scans all modes and tests. So if your HDTV doesn't support 720p it just wont allow that option. Then you can still use pass thru or just upconvert everything if you want. You will have to test and see which mode gives you the better PQ.

Originally posted by cdp1276
So if your HDTV doesn't support 720p it just wont all that option. Then you can still use pass thru or just upconvert everything if you want.Exactly ... if you enable everything BUT 720p in the 'setup wizard' ... and then use 'pass through' ... the box will automatically pass everything BUT 720p through. 720p will be converted to 1080i (by the box). This was how I had my 3250HD set up ... and I'm very much looking forward to being able to set my 8000HD up the same way.

Folks:
I finally got my 8300 and set it up via the HDMI connection to my DLP. During setup through the digital connection, there is no option for "pass through" (which I was able to get on the Pace 550). In essence, I had to "accept" all the resolutions that I wanted for my display. I see no difference in letting the 8300 convert 1080i to 720p (my DLP's native resolution) or letting the DLP scale the picture.

NOTE: There is no firewire port on the back of the 8300. The manual shows two but the back panel is solid in the area where the firewire ports are supposed to be. Otherwise, it is as the images posted in the manual by cdp1276 above.

PQ looks as good as the Pace on SD analog, SD digital and HD. I am recording a couple of things to see how the DVR performs... More later...

Folks:
I recorded an HD video program (Trading Places) and an HBO HD movie last night and the PVR worked great. I can't tell the difference between live and PVR.

I don't know enough about the OS since this is my first PVR, but the guide looks EXACTLY like the Time Warner program guide except you have an option to record a program in addition to tuning the channel in immediately or setting a timer. The guide only goes one week ahead. When you select record, you get a screen that allows you to fine tune the time, specify whether or not you want to record once or regularly, and how long you want to keep the recording for. When you invoke the "List" you get a list of recorded programs that you can play, rewind, block, etc. and when you play, there are three levels of fast-forward and fast-reverse.

Just a note - on live viewing, I am getting an HDCP error message (on various channels) that blanks out the picture and instructs me to hook up my display via component because my display doesn't support HDCP. This stays on for 30 seconds or so and then the picture comes back. Not sure where the problem is since my display is HDCP compliant.

Originally posted by merc
I wonder if they can allow any connected media drives without some sort of highly restrictive CP and verifiable media playback connection? If component connections are a no-no, how can they allow HD movie jukeboxes without some serious CP involved? I'm not entirely sure that it's a problem. If you're storing protected content, you have to store it in an approved encrypted form, whether it be stored on the drive in the DVR or one on the outside of it. Obviously, if someone wants to, they can pry the DVR's case open and scoop out the drive it comes with and try to get anything they're interested in off.

The same problem exists in storing any protected content to hard removable media, like D-VHS tape, Copy One Generation content can certainly be stored on those. Copy Never material can't be stored in any permanent file--just in the DVR's up-to-90-minute-long trick-play buffer, the end of which it has to continually erase after it fills up, and dump altogether if you change channels. That buffer would be on the internal drive.

Originally posted by mnilan
Folks:
I finally got my 8300 and set it up via the HDMI connection to my DLP. During setup through the digital connection, there is no option for "pass through" (which I was able to get on the Pace 550).

I got my HDMI to DVI cable today and switched my connection from component to HDMI just now. The system settings automatically switched to an auto HDMI/DVI connection and now I no longer have a pass-thru mode like I did with component.

mnilan did you compare your software levels to mine? I was just curious if your box has the same revs and who did you get your HDMI to DVI cable from? I have never seen the HDCP error you have.

While watching TV tonight I now have a problem on HD channels it loses the signal almost like a flicker and goes black. I tried turning the box off and back on but no luck helping. I did go back and forth betweejn SD & HD which fixed the problem. It seems like the box processing chip using HDMI/DVI can't keep up with rendering the signal. I never had the issue with the component connections.

9/14/04 - Update I reported the black out issue on HD channels to TWC and they have it as a known issue. I hope to hear back from them soon on a fix that I hope will be software/firmware fixable.

What's the story with the availability on these 8300's? Are they still in beta/trial, and how'd you guys go about grabbing one (I'm in NYC)?

I'm not at all impressed by the 8000HD that I got recently, having all sorts of issues with it, not to mention non-working DVI. Hoping this box is better.

Thanks!

Are any of the 8000HD's able to use the pass through feature? I know my 8000HD doesnt have it as an option. I've heard that some of the cable companies boxes have this and some don't.

By the way, I live in the western new york area and have adelphia.

Mine has pass-through and active DVI in Houston with SARA software on Time Warner Cable.

Folks:
The user manual for the 8300 says that the pass through function is not available when the STB is connected through HDMI. Instead there is something called "Auto HDMI" but there is no explanation of what it does...

Folks:
My 1st post to this thread.
I recently got a SA 8300HD
hooked up to my Samsung DLP hln617w.
I am with Austin TWC.
I see some motion artifacts when viewing live HD.
Whenever there is significant motion on close
ups, I see pixellation effects. I did not notice any
such effects with my previous 8000HD (that had other
problems = soft HD PQ)
Other than that, the HD PQ is as good as PACE 550 box.
Has anyone else seen similar effects on 8300HD?
Thanks
Ron

I am in Austin too and just picked one up. I will let you know what I see after watching some football tomorrow!

For you guys in Austin, TX. Are you using the HDMI output? TWC in Austin is telling me that the HDMI output is not currently active on the 8300HD.

I have not tested the HDMI becos I do not have a
HDMI-DVI adapter.
However a senior person with TWC austin has tested the HDMI
and we were told (on yahoo "cable" group) that HDMI
is not active, ETA approx. Oct 2004, same time frame as
DVI ETA on 8000HD.




Originally posted by cinergi
For you guys in Austin, TX. Are you using the HDMI output? TWC in Austin is telling me that the HDMI output is not currently active on the 8300HD.

Originally posted by cinergi
For you guys in Austin, TX. Are you using the HDMI output? TWC in Austin is telling me that the HDMI output is not currently active on the 8300HD.

I picked up an 8300HD last week here in Austin. I'm using a HDMI to DVI cable to connect the STB to an HDCP compliant plasma. Picture is excellent. Have not had time to calibrate or test yet.

Originally posted by Deedle
I picked up an 8300HD last week here in Austin. I'm using a HDMI to DVI cable to connect the STB to an HDCP compliant plasma. Picture is excellent. Have not had time to calibrate or test yet.


Are you sure the HDMI output is active? The reason I ask is the yahoo cable group is saying it is not active until the new code comes out in October.

I heard these 8300 boxes can do multi room viewing of recordings has any one tried it yet?

Mike,

The 8300 is an update of the 8000. It will be offered in three models: SD, HD and MR. The HD model has been released and is what is being discussed here. I don't know (or care) if the SD has been released The MR is MultiRoom and apparently has not been released yet. As I understand it, to use the MR function you will have to have a "special" SA box in each room.

Originally posted by cinergi
Are you sure the HDMI output is active? The reason I ask is the yahoo cable group is saying it is not active until the new code comes out in October.

Yes, I'm sure. In fact, when first turning on the STB, a message is displayed stating something to the effect of "Your display is not HDCP compliant...". This message is only displayed for a split-second and then everything works as expected.

It is possible that I have a unique 8300HD. Its more likely, however, that at least some of these boxes are being handed out here in Austin with the HDMI port active.

Ok, so after reading this thread, I went to TW and picked up the new box, just because it was new and I wanted to get it before they were all taken, like when I went and got the 800hd. I still have my 8000hd, b/c I didn't want to unhook it if they didn't have any 8300hd's.

So, what are the advantages of the new box. So far I see:
SATA connection
HDMI connection ( I have a LCD projector w/o DVI so this doesn't help me).

Are there any other +'s or -'s to this box.


Thanks,
Brandon

Brandon, not really from my perspective. Same crappy UI and programming guide with no first run flag (in Austin). Some clear pixelation on fast moving scenes (like football). It does have a pass through function which is nice but has the disadvantage of blacking the screen for 2 seconds as it switches input modes. Another nice feature is that the HDTV broadcasting standard is shown on the unit display. In other words, Channel X is 720P or 480i or whatever.

Football is awesome in HD though. Well worth the boxes problems especially with Fox now broadcasting in HD.

Deedle, They told me that the HDMI port wasn't active so maybe they are still checking it or the CSR had her facts mixed up. Unfortunately I don't have a HDMI port only a DVI on my projector and I haven't gotten the adapter yet.

JHK

Folks:
The information I have from the local Time Warner Cable folks is that the SA 8300 is being beta-tested in a couple of places - at least here in Syracuse, NY and in Austin, TX. One of the reasons for the beta testing is that there are problems with the HDCP handshaking.

(I found this VERY interesting): Apparently, HDCP is not actually a precise "standard" that everyone follows. Instead, the consumer electronics manufacturers each have their own unique implementation of it. As Time Warner learned with the Pace 550 STBs and is dealing with currently with the SA 8000 STBs, this requires figuring out the problems with EACH manufacturer and the SA 8300 is no exception. What has to be done through beta-testing is to find out which manufacturers' displays (and peripherials) are having problems, find out the nature of these problems and then get SA to create solutions. It appears as if some of these solutions can be done through software/firmware updating but others require modification of the physical STB.

The "fix" for the DVI port on the SA 8000s is apparently behind schedule (read: WAY behind schedule) so Time Warner (at least) is focusing on the 8300 now because it is HDMI and this is backward compatible with DVI. So, it appears as if those of you who are waiting for the DVI to be activated will probably find yourselves with an SA 8300 before that happens. NOTE: Some displays will work with the SA 8000 implementation of DVI but it doesn't look like there is going to be a national rollout of DVI for the SA 8000...

This is interesting because the delay isn't the cable companies' fault nor is it Scientific Atlanta, nor is it any individual manufacturer. What we have is chaos and no one to blame. Kind of makes you wonder why they wouldn't just tell us... We will just have to be patient.

On my own beta-testing of the SA 8300, the Samsung DLPs obviously have a problem with the HDCP handshaking. The first 8300 I tested would drop out of HDCP sync quite often, display the error message (see an earlier posting for the message), and then go back to the program after 30 seconds to 2 minutes. The new one I have not only has fewer breaks in the HDCP sync but also the breaks don't even last long enough for the error message to show up on the screen. (NOTE: This is quite intriguing to me. If anyone has any ideas why the frequency and duration of breaks would be different, please let me know). It is still quite distracting however and is not acceptable. The DVR has the same issue with HDCP sync.

The only other problem I have noted is a rather strange implementation of aspect ratio control. I have some fooling around to do, but currently, the 8300 shows 4:3 programs in a stretch mode (I HATE that and since I don''t have any burn-in concerns, I don't ever use stretch) because I have a 16:9 display. Because it is a digital HDMI connection, my display's aspect ratio control is disabled... I haven't finished trying to address this and will report back to you folks as developments warrant...

Mnilan,

I believe that the 8300HD is in regular release in many areas. At least it is in Rochester (NY). I think that Time Warner here has been holding back on making the 8000HD available as they wanted to instead invest in the newer model.

Dave:
Yes, the beta-test area is "Central New York" and includes Rochester. My reference to "Austin, TX" will reveal that TW in Houston is also releasing them. However, according to my "informant," they don't all have their HDMI active - the beta-testing involves the SA 8300 HD (not the SA 8300 SD or the SA 8300 MR) with the HDMI port active. Sorry for the confusion.

Mnilan,
What model series Samsung DLP do you have, HLM HLN or HLP that You have the HDCP prolem with?

walford:
I have the HLM 507W with the board upgrade. If I understand correctly, this means the internal circuitry is essentially the same as the HLNs.

Mnilan,

As far as the customers are concerned the 8300HD is NOT being rolled out as a Beta here in Rochester. TW here had apparently been waiting for the 8300HD (as opposed to the 8000HD that I have had on Beta since April) for their large scale roll-out.

The following is a thread from a local (it covers Syracuse too) HDTV web site where several people are discussing the 8300HD. As you can see, HDMI is active here.

http://www.rochesterhdtv.com/viewtopic.php?t=316&highlight=

Originally posted by cinergi
For you guys in Austin, TX. Are you using the HDMI output? TWC in Austin is telling me that the HDMI output is not currently active on the 8300HD.

I was told the same thing... the firewire ports were in the same boat according to them as well. I dont have a HDMI compliant TV so I cant even test... makes me want to order my fp PJ quicker tho! :)

Dave:
You may be correct - I'm just reporting what I got from TWCNY. Thanks for the link. I'll keep an eye on it.

I just picked up a 8300HD here in Austin. I can report that the HDMI port is active and works with my display. The picture quality is noticeably better than component but you lose the ability to change the aspect ratio via your display device.

Originally posted by cinergi
I just picked up a 8300HD here in Austin. I can report that the HDMI port is active and works with my display. The picture quality is noticeably better than component but you lose the ability to change the aspect ratio via your display device.

You don't lose the ablity to change aspect ratio on SD channels (mine goes widescreen). With HD channels yes but that is by design as you shouldn't be changing those anyway if they are true HD.

Originally posted by cdp1276
You don't lose the ablity to change aspect ratio on SD channels (mine goes widescreen). With HD channels yes but that is by design as you shouldn't be changing those anyway if they are true HD.

With component I can change aspect ratios on SD channels, but with HDMI it does not work correctly. For example, when I change from full to normal (4x3) on a SD channel the picture is squeezed from the top and bottom making it look like something close to 2.35 or 2.7

Hey guys,

I just picked up the 8300HD from the Round Rock TWC office and am having some issues the way it's hooked up. I have a Toshiba 57HX93 that I am using component cables to hook up from the box. I'm also running the coax digital audio out to my Denon receiver. The audio only sounds good on the hi-def channels, and is very low in volume on the SD channels. Also, why doesn't the stretch modes stay remembered for each channel? I can no longer control the stretch mode via my tv, only from the box.

Thanks,

Eric
Round Rock, TX

Originally posted by erp2863
Hey guys,

I just picked up the 8300HD from the Round Rock TWC office and am having some issues the way it's hooked up. I have a Toshiba 57HX93 that I am using component cables to hook up from the box. I'm also running the coax digital audio out to my Denon receiver. The audio only sounds good on the hi-def channels, and is very low in volume on the SD channels. Also, why doesn't the stretch modes stay remembered for each channel? I can no longer control the stretch mode via my tv, only from the box.

Thanks,

Eric
Round Rock, TX

I set mine to pass-through on the setting screen and the screen ratio does not seem to need to be changed at all. The only time I get bars is when a show on an HD channel is not in widescreen. Outside of this, the only other complaint I have is I want some first-run flag love in Austin!

Eric, I had the same problem with the low level audio. I was using standard RCA cables and I switched over to a Toslink (optical) cable which fixed this low volume problem. Before making the switch, I had to max out my receiver to +10 db to get decent sound volume!

I have also noticed the funny stretch behavior. When I went through the setup, I enabled all the modes and 480i normal was stretched like widescreen. A problem for this weekend.

Just thought I would report that there is a known software bug with the 8300HD boxes that causes the guide info within the 7 day retrieved period to be lost. I also have seen it drop recordings that were scheduled due to this guide issue. I have a meeting tomorrow morning with the Rochester DVR manager at TWC to discuss my issues and I can report back after that tomorrow. She also told me Time Warner Corporate is in the process of evaluating several vendors for external serial ATA drives and plan to recommend a few brands soon. One vendor's hard drive, has been sent to the Corporate testing center. There will be more than one hard drive selected for use however. But be warned the DVR will register the additional hard drive space and use it as needed, but you will not be able to select which hard drive to record content to. Also, encryption will still be in effect. You will not be able to record a movie to the external hard drive and then connect the hard drive to a PC for viewing. The content will still be encrypted. The only way to view the content will be through the DVR.

cdp1276 - good news about the SATA. I purchased the exact same drive that is in the DVR (Maxtor DiamondMax Plus 9 SATA-150 160GB) figuring it would have to be on the supported list. I purchased an external enclosure and a standard SATA cable. To my surprise, the "SATA" port on the back of the 8300HD is not a standard SATA port. It is close, very close, actually close enough to force it in, but it's (at least mine) is not standard. This seems odd to me, could you ask about that? Anyone else notice this?

Thanks

I had my meeting with TWC today. I will try and log a summary of the current issues here for everyone's knowledge.

1) There is a guide issue that causes programs scheduled to record to NOT record and be missed as well as future days guide data not present. For that matter some scheduled all episodes of new episodes on this channel programs just disappear without you deleting them from the queue. Corporate TWC has raised this issue for resolution above SA and has the highest priority.

2) Box crashes are being looked into and they have my logs and information of what I was doing to cause it. In fact all box crashes are reported on a monthly basis to SA and if they fall below a certain level SA pays TWC a rebate. This forces these types of issues to also get high attention.

3.) My box blacking out on HD channels (rarely) might be a cable issue TWC says. I'm not accepting that but if it happens again, I will try a TWC approved cable. If it then happens with their cable they will further investigate with SA, but she also told me it could be my brand new Sony Plasma DVI connection. They recently had one with the non DVR box where a customer had one DVI Pin on a Panasonic plasma that wasn't soldered to the board.

4.) The Maxter DiamondMax Plus 9 SATA-150 160GB drive is the main one being looked at to be the first approved. The SATA port on the back is active and is 100% SATA compliant she says. She will get me more information on the roll-out of external drives soon.

5.) I had bookmark issues (stopping a recorded show to resume watching from that point later) not resuming where you stopped but rather at the beginning. I was told this is working and you have only one bookmark currently. So if you have multiple people in the house that stop two playbacks of shows it will only keep that point of the most recent. This is suppose to be improved soon as they deploy the multi-room version. Also as note if your box reboots, it loses the bookmarked location.

6.) I raised the volume issue and it was reported that this is the programming channel, not the box or TWC. If someone has specific data on this I would be happy to let them know for you.

I think that is about all for now...

Originally posted by cdp1276
4.) The Maxter DiamondMax Plus 9 SATA-150 160GB drive is the main one being looked at to be the first approved. The SATA port on the back is active and is 100% SATA compliant she says. She will get me more information on the roll-out of external drives soon.


Good news, thanks.

For comparison, here is the SATA port on the back of the 8300HD:

This is a standard SATA cable:

And this is an example of a standard SATA drive enclosure:

Anyone knows why after switching to a HDMI to HDMI connector between my TV(Sony 960) and the SA8300, my cable remote no longer controls the volume? The volume control moves the volume's visual representation on the screen up and down but the sound stays the same.

Is this normal or am I missing something???

Thanks!!!

Originally posted by TheMostToyzWins
To my surprise, the "SATA" port on the back of the 8300HD is not a standard SATA port. It is close, very close, actually close enough to force it in, but it's (at least mine) is not standard.There's probably some special cable with their custom connector on one end and the standard connector on the other that they want you to buy. Gotta profit from people adding expansion drives somehow. :D

Originally posted by ghostrider1
Anyone knows why after switching to a HDMI to HDMI connector between my TV(Sony 960) and the SA8300, my cable remote no longer controls the volume? The volume control moves the volume's visual representation on the screen up and down but the sound stays the same.

Is this normal or am I missing something???

Thanks!!!
Not sure what you had before, but the visual representation on the screen from the STB is for ANALOG audio out. Your cable remote, by default, will control the analog audio outputs from the STB only, unless you reprogram it for your TV set's volume control. The HDMI connector integrates the Digital video and Digital audio on one cable, so you have to control the volume on your end device - the TV set (sort of the way your DVD layer passes DD audio to your set or receiver to be adjusted)

vegggas

Thanks vegggas!!!

The guy at my cable company(TW) told me that it should work, so I was a little confused when it did not.

Thanks again for the explanation!!

Folks:
Just to let you know, I am waiting for a Samsung service rep to come fix my DVI port on my DLP which seems to be responsible for the once intermittant HDCP error message (it is now constant). I will resume evaluating when they are done.

cdp1276:
What kind of display are you using? Unfortunately, it sounds like you are having the exact same problem as I had with HDCP handshaking... Hmmm... It is a "known" problem in the sense that the cable companies have been having a rough time with the variety of HDCP implementations by equipment manufacturers (not just SA but the display folks as well). So they are having some people in Central New York and in Texas try out the STBs to see what needs to be fixed before they do a general release of the SA 8300. At least this is my current understanding in my conversations with a Time Warner tech and SA.

My HDMI --> DVI cable is from Pacific Cable and works fine.

I have not looked at the software versions on the SA 8300 as it is disconnected right now (back to my Pace 550) awaiting Samsung's service call. I will do that when I get it hooked up into my system again.

Originally posted by mnilan

cdp1276:
What kind of display are you using? Unfortunately, it sounds like you are having the exact same problem as I had with HDCP handshaking... Hmmm... It is a "known" problem in the sense that the cable companies have been having a rough time with the variety of HDCP implementations by equipment manufacturers (not just SA but the display folks as well). So they are having some people in Central New York and in Texas try out the STBs to see what needs to be fixed before they do a general release of the SA 8300. At least this is my current understanding in my conversations with a Time Warner tech and SA.

My HDMI --> DVI cable is from Pacific Cable and works fine.

I have a Sony Plasma model KDE42XBR950 using the DVI in on the back of my media receiver for the plasma. I also got my HDMI --> DVI cable from Pacific Cables. I feel it is software problem and not the cable. I had the blackouts occur many times over the weekend when I was doing a lot of channel changing between sports some in HD some in SD. I also don't think it is an issue with my TV or connections. Thoughts?

cdp1276:
I am just in the process of learning about these difficulties, so I am only now forming my conclusions and still need to hear from several pending sources (e.g., Samsung, Scientific Atlanta). However, what I have learned is:

- There are a variety of displays that are having problems with forward compatibility with HDMI. We see some problems here and you will see postings in the DVD forum, for example, of similar HDCP difficulties with HDMI-output DVD players. This seems to be due to lack of coordination among consumer electronics manufacturers but WE, the consumers will pay for this.

-Scientific Atlanta and Time Warner are doing responsible things to alleviate the HDCP problem but the consumer equipment manufacturers do not have their act together.

I do not know if there are solutions. Read this sentence again. I have not had a cogent reply from Samsung yet so I don't know if the sloppy implementation (i.e., forward compatibility of DVI for HDMI) is software or hardware or some combination. Even if it is software alone, that doesn't mean that it if "fixable." We may be stuck with only DVI to DVI connections. This would be MAJOR bad news for us because the new STBs and other source components are coming out with ONLY HDMI connections and if we are forced to use component connections, we may very well only be able to receive don-rezed content. This would REALLY piss me off.

Let me repeat, however, I am still collecting information and learning about this emerging problem so I can't provide conclusive advice/information right now. I will report back as I find out more about the HDCP situation. It has only been in the last few months that we have seen the satellite companies and now the cable companies activating HDCP connections, so we don't have much data yet. And, the consumer electronics companies aren't talking....

mnilan,

I suspect that if one has HDCP problems with HDMI, they will also have the same problems with DVI. They both use the same standards. The difference is the connectors plus HDMI has provision for the digital audio connection.

Dave:
Yes, that is the logic I have been using in my conversations with Time Warner, Scientific American and Samsung. Time Warner agrees except that they say that they are having similar problems with a variety of different manufacturer's displays and claim the problem is 1) the HDMI specification, although it does require backward and forward compatibility with DVI does not provide details of HOW this is to be accomplished so 2) the equipment manufacturers each have their own "flavor," some of which (including my Samsung DLP) introduce HDCP handshaking timing errors. So, in practice, there is a difference between HDMI and DVI. I have had no problems with DVI and HDCP but HDMI to DVI from the SA 8300 is unwatchable due to frequent HDCP error messages as I have described above.

I am still waiting for Samsung to reply to my queries and will post any updates.

Originally posted by davehancock
I suspect that if one has HDCP problems with HDMI, they will also have the same problems with DVI. They both use the same standards. The difference is the connectors plus HDMI has provision for the digital audio connection.

I also agree with this logic as I never had the problem with component hooked up. As I said with mine I've never seen any HDCP error messages but rather the display of HD content at times is lost on channels. The sound is fine but the picture just kind of blacks out. Tries to come back and displays for a split second and then gone again. It happens on every HD channel when it gets into this weird state. Then as soon as I go to an SD channel and back to that same HD channel it is fine. I can then switch as much as I want on HD content and it never happens. It is just the switch at times from SD to HD the box gets into a weird state unable to convert the signal and handle processing the HD mode.

Albany NY TWC has been rolling out the 8300HD DVR's, as well.

I picked up mine Friday, with the hope of finally having a digital connection from my DVR to Toshiba 57H83 HDTV. (I had a 8000HD DVR with the DVI port disabled).

I purchased a HDMI to DVI cable and hooked it up today. I could not get a picture to display on the TV, so I called TWC Albany. After I got by the CSR who knew nothing, she transferred me to a tech who told me the HDMI port was not active. However, he said he has heard that it works with some TV's and not others.???

So, it seems like I wasted the $30+/- on the HDMI to DVI cable.

There is a thread on the AlbanyHDTV.com (http://www.albanyhdtv.com) website on the 8300HD DVR, but only two people have them so far.

I have not looked at the software versions on the SA 8300 as it is disconnected right now (back to my Pace 550) awaiting Samsung's service call. I will do that when I get it hooked up into my system again.
Time will tell, but I doubt the Samsung service call is going to help. As this thread indicates, you aren't the only one having trouble with the HDMI/DVI output from the SA8300. Scientific Atlanta is still working on some known issues with HDCP on the SA8300, and it will probably be several months before they are all resolved.

Are there any major UI improvements from the 800HD? In particular, is 'timeslipping' useable now? The two 8000HD bugs (that you have to rewind a recording manually to the beginning and that the playback kicks you out when the live show is done) are driving me up the wall....

Is the 8300 out in New York City yet.? I know they have the 8000.

krom,

The UI and recording functionality is the same on the 8300 and 8000HD. The 8300 does have a faster processor, so it is more responsive.

Thanks, bfdtv.

BTW is this SARA or Passport you guys are using on the 8300HD?

One last question - can you output simultaneous SD on the s-video and HD on the component outs with the 8300HD? (which you have been able to do with every box until the 8000HD)

Originally posted by kromkamp
Thanks, bfdtv.

BTW is this SARA or Passport you guys are using on the 8300HD?

One last question - can you output simultaneous SD on the s-video and HD on the component outs with the 8300HD? (which you have been able to do with every box until the 8000HD)

Early on in this thread I posted the software revs if that helps you and would lead me to believe my Rochester TWC 8300HD is SARA:

# ROM Image. . 1.85.8.5
# OS. . . . . . . . .6.8.6.5
# SARA. . . . . . .1.85.8.5
# PowerKEY LIB 3.6.1.3
# HAL2 Driver. .1.0.22.1010
# PHAL3 Driver. 3.5.9.1015

With regard to outputs I've been able to output from S-Video, HDMI, and standard Coax at the same time.

# SARA. . . . . . .1.85.8.5
There's your hint.

thanks cdp1276, that is encouraging. If you get a chance do you think you could try s-video and component at the same time? (ie. HD on component and downrezzed SD on s-video).

Thanks,

Andy K.

<shameless bump>

My 8300hd outputs HD and SD simultaneously.


Larry

Drool, that's just what I need...I have a coax line going from the receiver that's in the living room to the kitchen, and ever since I got the 8000HD I had to do the messed up procedure of activating PIP, switching to the channel that I need, and swapping pictures in order to get it on the analog coax out. Not only is this seriously annoying, but it's also flaky, where PIP will turn off after a random amount of time.

Now if only the 8300 became available in NYC :(

I was told today by Rochester TWC DVR manager that Scientific Atlanta was on-site two days last week and captured data regarding the many issues I've described in this thread. She says Scientific Atlanta is working very hard to resolve these issues and she will keep me posted on their progress and as to when a new version of software will be available.

In addition to what I already posted in this thread around guide issues I had one show in my list get deleted without me doing so. And then last week Wednesday the box recorded Lost on ABC. I finally got a chance
to watch that late at night. I got about 15 mins into it and was fast forwarding through commercials when I pressed play to stop the fast forward. Well it started to play and I could hear the sound but the picture was frozen. Soon after that there was no response from the box no matter what buttons I pressed and sound stopped. So I went over and pulled the power plug to have the box reboot and attempt to resume watching my show. Well guess what.....when it finally came back up and I went into my list, LOST was LOST!!! The entire recording was gone from my list almost like I had deleted it.

Is anyone else having these issues or am I the only one really taxing the recording of the box with a list of 10+ shows each week?

I have not had the box delete recordings on me.

However, while watching live programs and switching channels, I have had the box freeze on me twice. When this happens, the box will not respond to any buttons on the remote or on the box itself. I have to manually pull the power cord out from the back of the box and replug it in. I wait until the time displays on the STB's screen again and it seems as if everything is back to "normal".

I have had the 8300HD in Austin for 3 weeks to the day. The only real problem so far is that the box has rebooted several times when I've been changing channels on the PIP window. The PIP will go black and after maybe 10 seconds or so the box reboots. The box has always come back up just fine except for the last time it happend this past Friday . Friday the box came back up but I could no longer record anything. Disconnecting\reconnecting the power cord fixed that but in the process I lost one of the two shows I had recorded.

Is anyone having the same problem a couple of us have? - While the 8300 does a fine job of recording HD programs, the recording of SD feeds is pretty bad - very fuzzy. Yes, it is watchable, but of much lower quality than the original SD feed.

Craig

chenrikson,

In order to record analog channels (0-99), the box has to convert them to digital. This is not a lossless process; it degrades the picture. Standalone DVRs like Tivo and ReplayTV provide multiple quality settings, so you can choose between say 23 hours at "best quality" or 80 hours at "basic quality," but the SA just uses one mid-level setting that you cannot change.

In contrast, digital channels (100+) are recorded at identical quality to the original, because the original digital bitstream is recorded to the hard drive without any modification. On satellite, all channels are distributed digitally, so all channels are recorded at 100% quality, but on cable, many of the channels are analog (0-99), so degradation occurs on those.

I just replaced my SA 800HD with the new 8300HD. I have a Marantz S3 DLP front projector with a 92" screen. The quality of the 8300HD is SIGNFICANTLY better than the 8000HD.

I have a Pace 550 HD cable box, which I kept when I got the 8000HD since the quality of the 8000HD was bad (pictures were soft and didn't have the resolution of the Pace). However, the 8300HD picture quality is a lot better than the 8000HD.

Casual comparisons between the 8300HD and the Pace seem to indicate that they are about equal. However, this comparison was based on live TV. I haven't done any critical comparisons between the Pace and the 8300HD yet, but based on quick comparisons, it's hard to say that the 8300HD isn't as good as the Pace. I have the Pace connected via DVI. I still have the 8300HD connected via component since I'm still waiting for my HDMI to DVI cable. I expect the quality to improve with the HDMI/DVI cable.

I haven't evaluated if the picture quality of a recorded show is as good as the live show.

Yesterday, my 8300HD started recording 2 shows simultaneously at 8:00 PM. I started watching one of the shows being recorded around 8:10 PM. Every few seconds, maybe every 5 to 10 seconds, the audio would drop out for about half a second. I am using the digital coaxial output of the 8300HD into my receiver. Has anyone else had audio drop out problems with the 8300HD? I'm wondering if I should try to use the toslink optical audio output to see if that helps.

Does anyone know how to check what firmware is in the 8300HD? Is there a special key combination that needs to be pressed to access that information?

bfdtv -- Thanks - that makes sense -- but the quality level chosen is really pretty low. I suppose this is to increase recording time.

Otherwise -- the HD quality is MUCH better that the 8000HD was, and is also better than DISH HDTV. I was beginning to think that my set had a problem, but the 8300 cleared that up -- and the "Pass Through" option is also a MAJOR improvement.

Now, if they would just do something about that lousy guide!!. SA knows everyone hates it, but I guess some cable operators like it because it makes you go thru all the channels rather than just a limited list of what you want. (Sigh)

Craig

Does anyone know how to check what firmware is in the 8300HD? Is there a special key combination that needs to be pressed to access that information?

Yes, press and hold down the select key on the 8300HD box. Then when the mail icon lights up press the info button on the box. Then you will see a menu of all the data on the box. Scroll through the pages and one screen shows all the levels. I would suspect your at the same levels I posted early in this thread. TWC is suppose to push a new release sometime this month but knowing SA's speed of light development it will likely be November.

Craig -- Our current SARA version in Albany, NY seems to be 1.85.8.a4, not quite up to your level.

Craig

Originally posted by chenrikson
Craig -- Our current SARA version in Albany, NY seems to be 1.85.8.a4, not quite up to your level.

Actually I suspect we are at the same level. You looked at page 3 of 30 and you should have gone to page 17 of 30 and you will see the actual SARA levels and I suspect they are the same as mine.

Does anyone have a detailed descrption of the following picture settings: upconvert-1, upconvert-2, and fixed? Looks like upconvert-1 upconverts non-1080i to 1080i (but passes through 1080i signals??) and upconvert-2 converts non-720p to 720p (but passes through 720p signals??)? I haven't seen in any of the 8300HD manuals a detailed description of these picture settings. If anyone knows, please respond.

Thanks.

Originally posted by randman
Does anyone have a detailed descrption of the following picture settings: upconvert-1, upconvert-2, and fixed?

Fixed - Displays all content at whatever resolution you selected, based on what you selected in the wizard. You force the output to a single output and the box scales to that input. Easily changed in the settings menu of the box.
Pass Through - Passes the input signal through to the output with no change, unless you disable certain resolutions. For example 480i in to 480i out, 480P in to 480P out, 1080i in to 1080i out, 720P in to 720P out. If you disable 720P, 720P in will go to 1080i out.
Auto HDMI/DVI - If you are using the HDMI port, you will see this option instead of the Pass Through option. Resolution is automatically formatted to the scan rate supported by the TV.
UpConvert 1 - All 480i and 480P signals get upconverted to 480P. All 720P and 1080i signals get upconverted to 1080i.
UpConvert 2 - All 480i and 480P signals get upconverted to 480P. All 720P and 1080i signals get converted to 720P.

Here is a PDF on the 8300HD DVR, I'm not sure if it was already posted along this thread?

http://www.sciatl.com/customers/source/7004920.pdf

cdp1276 - thanks. Some follow up questions:

Upconvert 1: if the signal is already 1080i, does the 8300HD merely "pass through" the 1080i signal w/o doing anything to it?

Likewise, for upconvert 2: if the signal is already 720p, does the 8300HD merely pass through the 720p signal w/o doing anything to it?

Auto HDMI/DVI - my projector supports 1080i, 720p, 480i, and 480p. I plan on using an HDMI/DVI converter cable to connect the 8300HD to my projector's DVI input (still waiting for the cable). You mentioned that with auto hdmi/dvi, "resolution is automatically formatted to the scan rate supported by the TV.". If my projector supports all the aforementioned scan rates, then what does auto hdmi/dvi do?

Also, if I connect a cable to the 8300HD's HDMI output, do you know if component output will continue to work (I have a TV in addition to a projector in the same room. Sometimes, I want to use the TV, but the TV only has compoonent inputs).

Thanks.

I have the same question about the auto HDMI/DVI setting. My projector (DLP) accepts all resolutions but then scales whatever it gets to 720p.

I want the 8300HD to just pass thru whatever signal it gets to the projector. How is this accomplished with the 8300HD using a HDMI cable?

Thanks.

Yes, the HDMI/DVI is basically a pass through mode. You will see as soon as you connect that input you no longer have an option for pass through. The component outputs also still work. When I got my HDMI to DVI cable I was flicking back and forth from component to DVI to compare the quality so that is how I'm sure they both output.

...but if the passthrough option disappears once the HDMI cable is connected, do the component outputs use the last mode that was set before the HDMI cable was connected? In other words, is the component output still passthrough?

P.S. On the "cable" list, the TimeWarner rep said they will soon be offering HDMI to DVI-D cables for about $50.

I asked the tech when he installed my 8300HD the other day about HDMI cables, he said that the office had them, but not officially. Still testing I guess.

Different Time Warner systems have different prices & policies.

Pradeep & InvaderZim - please add your location to your profile. It would help understand what system you are on.

Thanks

I have the 8300hd in Winston-Salem, North Carolina through TWC. So far so good, I'll keep you posted.

Originally posted by davehancock
Different Time Warner systems have different prices & policies.

Pradeep & InvaderZim - please add your location to your profile. It would help understand what system you are on.

Thanks

Done, I hope. I'm in Austin.

Does anyone in the Los Angeles area have one yet, or know about their release? I just got the 8000HD, but I really want DVI (or HDMI). Thanks.

I dunno if anyone else has experienced this, but when I hook up the 8300 to my PT-47x54 via HDMI, the co-ax digital output no longer outputs a Dolby Digital signal. Only pro-logic. As soon as I yank the HDMI cable, DD resumes. Which makes the HDMI output on the 8300 all but useless to those with HDMI input TVs and surround receivers, at least till we get some with HDMI switching.

Originally posted by Pradeep
I dunno if anyone else has experienced this, but when I hook up the 8300 to my PT-47x54 via HDMI, the co-ax digital output no longer outputs a Dolby Digital signal. Only pro-logic. As soon as I yank the HDMI cable, DD resumes. Which makes the HDMI output on the 8300 all but useless to those with HDMI input TVs and surround receivers, at least till we get some with HDMI switching.

Ouch. That is a real limitation. I think future products will implement HDMI by chaining (each component will have multiple HDMI inputs and outputs. I suppose the same thing would happen even if you are going from HDMI to DVI. I have a 8300 coming Tuesday and am not sure whether to connect via component or HDMI-DVI. Is the difference significant?

Hate to spend for a HDMI-DVI cable only to end up using component. I only have one DVI input into my Fujitsu P50. I was also thinking of getting the new Bravo D2, so maybe the best solution for now is running component for the 8300 and DVI for the Bravo D2.

Anyone see a real difference between component and HDMI/DVI? Do you still get pass-through?

I'm guessing that HDMI->DVI won't turn off the DD output, simply because the DVI isn't transmitting any audio. So the 8300 continues to operate the digital output in normal fashion. Also no-one else that uses HDMI->DVI has complained about the loss of DD audio.

On my RPTV, I really can't see any difference between the HDMI and components anyway.

Originally posted by TheMostToyzWins
cdp1276 - good news about the SATA. I purchased the exact same drive that is in the DVR (Maxtor DiamondMax Plus 9 SATA-150 160GB) figuring it would have to be on the supported list. I purchased an external enclosure and a standard SATA cable. To my surprise, the "SATA" port on the back of the 8300HD is not a standard SATA port. It is close, very close, actually close enough to force it in, but it's (at least mine) is not standard. This seems odd to me, could you ask about that? Anyone else notice this?

Thanks

The SATA port on the 8300HD is a standard SATA-2 external port. The problem would be with connecting the L-shaped SATA-1 connectors (being that there was no external connector spec for SATA-1). I believe they are both 7 pins. There are cables with SATA-1 on one end and SATA 2 on the other.

I will be getting a 8300HD on monday - since my tv only has a dvi female - what dvi and hdmi adaptor will I need.
hdmi male (goes into 8300hd - if the hdmi on 8300 chasis is female ) to dvi female (so dvi male side of long cable canbe connected)
or
hdmi female (goes into 8300hd - if the hdmi on 8300 chasis is male ) to dvi female (so dvi male side of long cable canbe connected)
What connector is at the back of 8300 hdmi male or female?

Originally posted by Ash Sharma
I will be getting a 8300HD on monday - since my tv only has a dvi female - what dvi and hdmi adaptor will I need....

Ash Sharma, look at the first few posts in this thread. I gave a link to the cable you need as well as attachments that show the front/back of the 8300HD.

Thanks, Craig

Regarding Pradeep's problem: I wonder if the issue is the 8300 shutting off Digital Audio from the digital audio jack on the 8300 when HDMI is used OR if his monitor is shorting out the digital audio pin on the HDMI connector?. What happens when the connector is removed from the monitor? Also what about the optical digital audio out from the 8300? Does it get disabled when HDMI is used. If not, and your receiver has optical inputs - this may be an effective "work-around".

I can see the problem here - its again the "bleeding edge" of HDMI. The prime difference between DVI and HDMI (besides the smaller connector with HDMI) is the inclusion of digital audio in the spec (for HDMI). The problem is that most monitors do not have digital decoding.

OK I tried pulling out the HDMI from the TV, and leaving it plugged in at the 8300. Same thing, audio immediately reverts to DD. Tried optical, same problem as the co-ax.

It will be interesting to see if others have the same problem on different TVs.

Well if it is not plugged into the TV and is plugged into the 8300 and there is no digital audio out it must be the 8300.

Hmmmmmmmm!

No, when it's not plugged into the TV and it's plugged into the 8300 there is no problem, I get DD. So it could well be the TV.

Originally posted by Ash Sharma
I will be getting a 8300HD on monday - since my tv only has a dvi female - what dvi and hdmi adaptor will I need.
hdmi male (goes into 8300hd - if the hdmi on 8300 chasis is female ) to dvi female (so dvi male side of long cable canbe connected)
or
hdmi female (goes into 8300hd - if the hdmi on 8300 chasis is male ) to dvi female (so dvi male side of long cable canbe connected)
What connector is at the back of 8300 hdmi male or female?

How are you getting an 8300 from houston??

OK I had called TWC this weekend and they told me that they have 8300 and I should go to a store and pick it up.
I went to the store this morning and was told that the 8300 and 8400 (did not know the 8400 ever existed) are in the warehouse and have not been released. They took any number and told me that they will call me as soon or the Units are released.

Not sure if anyone has posted this document, but it provides some useful information on the 8300HD connection options. Note - I had to chop out most of the pages b/c the file was too big so I just included the pages I refer to.

It confirms on pg. 6 that the S-Video out and Coax Out remain active, no matter what mode the box is in (HD or SD mode). Composite and component still share the Y (green) connection so you have to choose between one or the other just like with the 8000HD - HD mode uses component, SD mode uses composite. Can someone with the 8300HD confirm whether or not component is capable of outputting 480i in HD mode? On the 8000HD, if the box is in HD mode, component can only output 480p, 720p and 1080i - pretty annoying b/c all SD is upconverted. I guess it is not as critical here b/c you can always use S-Video in parallel for SD channels.

Other interesting point related to Pradeep's issue with the coax and optical digital audio outs not working when you use HDMI. On page 8, it looks there is a simple way to override the digital audio setting for HDMI - seems that when HDMI downcoverts digital audio to 2 channel to work with your TV, all of the digital outputs are downcoverted as well. If you switch off digital audio for HDMI it should output digital audio to coax and optical. Hopefully this will be an option for Passport users (I'm in NYC where we have passport) as well as SARA users, given that Passport users currently have less options (basically no options) available.

Hope this is helpful.

Eric

Originally posted by Pradeep
No, when it's not plugged into the TV and it's plugged into the 8300 there is no problem, I get DD. So it could well be the TV.

I don't think it's your TV - see the bottom of the last page of my attachment above.

EricScott:

Please specify the software your 8300 is using. With SARA, you can output any signal via component, starting with 480i.

Originally posted by Jim Boden
EricScott:

Please specify the software your 8300 is using. With SARA, you can output any signal via component, starting with 480i.

Jim,

I don't have an 8300 (unfortunately). In NYC, TWC uses Passport. I have an 8000HD and on the 8000HD, if you select 480i plus any other output format (which will obviously be the case), then 480i is not output over component - it is converted to either 480p, 720p or 1080i (in that order) depending on which formats are selected.

So it sounds like you can get true pass through via component on the 8300 w/ SARA where 480i is passed as 480i, 720p as 720p and 1080i as 1080i? Yet another improvement over the 8000HD.

Thanks for the tip regarding the digital output setting Eric. Unfortunately my SARA box doesn't have such an option, the only audio option it has is fixed or variable volume :( Maybe in the future...

Got my 8300 this afternoon. First impressions...

-HD picture looks consideraby sharper than 8000 with same component, but I only to got stare at an HBO HD feed on the 8000, then switch to the 8300 and it it took the box several minutes to set up.

- pass through works as promised, however I also ran an s-video to my plasma and still find that for SD, S-video is a better match (smoothes out a lot of noise).

-have not tried HDMI -> DVI. Ordered cable. Will see if there is an improvement over component when it arrives.

-channels lock in faster (switch faster) even when going from HD to SD or reverse.

That's all I can say for now.

David

MarketingProf, if you used s-video output does that mean the SA8300HD has simultaneous component and s-video outputs now?

Originally posted by Joxer
MarketingProf, if you used s-video output does that mean the SA8300HD has simultaneous component and s-video outputs now?

It works for me. I switched between inputs on my plasma and the signal was always present via the component or s-video feed. So, I guess the answer is yes.

The answer is definitely yes - see the attachment I posted on the previous page. Clearly says that S-Video is always active in the manual.

Originally posted by EricScott
The answer is definitely yes - see the attachment I posted on the previous page. Clearly says that S-Video is always active in the manual.

Thats great news since the biggest limitation of the SA8000HD is that it disables the composite and svideo outputs in HD mode. I hope more cables systems upgrade to the SA8300HD as soon as possible. Does anyone in a Passport market have the SA8300HD yet?

Originally posted by Ash Sharma
OK I had called TWC this weekend and they told me that they have 8300 and I should go to a store and pick it up.
I went to the store this morning and was told that the 8300 and 8400 (did not know the 8400 ever existed) are in the warehouse and have not been released. They took any number and told me that they will call me as soon or the Units are released.

Please post back and let me know when you recieve one of these, i am dying to use dvi on my tv for something other than my computer (which i hardly ever use)

OK my 8300 has begun to Not record scheduled recording the red recording indicator come on and it shows up on the recorded list until the recording is over. then its gone from the list.
also whether live TV or something i am recording i can not rewind it like i used to anyone have any ideas?

Ken:
Is the disc full perhaps?

nope 7% used on the disc. Called customer service have a service call for Tuesday. plus a credited the pvr for the month.

Common problem with the 8000 after the disk has been full. Even after clearing the disk, the problem will remain. To fix, turn off the unit. Unplug the power cable for 30 seconds. Hold and continue holding the power button while plugging in the AC power cord, until the after the unit boots and begins loading the data (about 15 seconds). Wait for the unit to download all the software and the clock to come back on (about 2 min) before turning on the unit.

vegggas

Since last night, I'm having exactly the same problem as Ken Greene with my 8300HD. Here's what I posted to the [Cable] and [Explorer8000] Yahoogroups:

My 8300HD, which has worked nearly perfectly since I got it a couple of months ago, has now decided that it doesn't want to let me schedule any more recordings. There are four shows left in the upcoming recordings list, and when I select additional one-time or repeating recordings from the guide, it lets me go through the motions but the program in the guide doesn't change color and the show doesn't appear in the "upcoming recordings" list.

I rebooted it with the three finger salute (Vol+/Vol-/Info) twice without any change.

Has anyone else had this problem, and what did you have to do to fix it? It plays what it recorded just fine, and it did record a movie last night at about midnight. The hard disk is just over 50% full.

Might this be another daylight savings time glitch? I still remember the one that took down the 8000HD last March.

VEGGGAS: I can try the procedure you described, but you didn't state if it would cause all recordings to be lost. Does your procedure include a format, or must it follow a format?

Thanks!

--- Uwe (TWAustin/SARA)

No, it does not erase any programs. It puts SA boxes in a dumb state until they can fully download all the software and re-initialize the box. It will then redownload the guide data too as each guide area is hit.
I've seen this problem after a hard drive has become full and sort of locked the recording buffers.

vegggas

Originally posted by vegggas
No, it does not erase any programs. It puts SA boxes in a dumb state until they can fully download all the software and re-initialize the box. It will then redownload the guide data too as each guide area is hit.
I've seen this problem after a hard drive has become full and sort of locked the recording buffers.
vegggas

Thanks for replying. I got home from work and verified the box still wouldn't let me select any programs. So I followed the procedure you outlined -- took about 5 minutes and now the box works again! I was able to re-enter all the repeating recordings and now they turn red in the guide and appear in the "Scheduled Recordings" list. I did not lose any of my existing recordings.

I really do wonder if this is caused by the disk filling up. I have it set to auto-delete the oldest recording (even if not expired) and always have several movies that are eligible for deletion. So in theory, the box should never fill up, but given the quality of the software, I guess it could happen.

Thanks again!

Now if only I can get my hands on one, so I can really test it out and write up a review on it like the 3250 and 8000 earlier....
Looks like January for Cox to deploy them around here...

I wonder if Ken Green did this to fix his box or if he let the cable co come out and swap out it out?

vegggas

nope i didn't do anything yet and the last two days it has been workig flawlessly. so well that when the tech called to confirm him coming by lastnight i canceled him.

We just got these in Toronto. SARA 1.85.11.5...

It seems they *still* havent fixed the kick-out bug when timeslipping!!! Man I cant believe its still not fixed!

kromkamp:

Thanks for the heads up. I asked Rogers about the 8300 and got no response from their web site. Guess I'll call in and check it out. I want to replace the 8000HD and understand the 8300 is better in most respects, including having simultaneious SD output.

Can you confirm any of this?

TIA.

kromkamp:

I called Rogers and they said they don't have the 8300HD yet because of shipping delays from SA. Do you actually have one?

I can confirm that I have one (picked one up from the main outlet at 333 Bloor), and that it has correctly working simultaneous SD/HD output.

Once I get a chance to watch some HD ABC or CBS I'll be able to tell if the picture is more detailed than our 8000HD boxes were.

kromkamp:

Thanks for the info. I look forward to seeing your opinion on its PQ.

Originally posted by Pradeep
I dunno if anyone else has experienced this, but when I hook up the 8300 to my PT-47x54 via HDMI, the co-ax digital output no longer outputs a Dolby Digital signal. Only pro-logic. As soon as I yank the HDMI cable, DD resumes. Which makes the HDMI output on the 8300 all but useless to those with HDMI input TVs and surround receivers, at least till we get some with HDMI switching.

Here's the answer:

You need to override the setting by pressing settings button twice and to audio: digital out and select DD instead of HDMI. That will force DD audio to HDMI, Dig audio out and optical audio out.

HDMI will automatically select 2 channels if your TV does not support DD unless you do the override.

Hope this helps.

Originally posted by Nedtsc
Here's the answer:

You need to override the setting by pressing settings button twice and to audio: digital out and select DD instead of HDMI. That will force DD audio to HDMI, Dig audio out and optical audio out.

HDMI will automatically select 2 channels if your TV does not support DD unless you do the override.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for the suggestion, but the "Audio: Digital Out" selection is NOT in the setting menu.

BTW, for everyone else's info, this can be found on page 8 (pg14 of the pdf) here: http://www.scientificatlanta.com/explorerclub/getting_started/4003986.pdf

I have complained to Time Warner every day for a week and will continue to do so until this is corrected, but my hopes are not high.

Cheers

Mine does! You may have a different software installed.

Nedtsc,

I *think* you answered the question I was trolling for. I'm using the 3250HD and was considering upgrading to the 8300HD simply for the HDMI out, but heard about the two-channel-over-coax issue (I'm using HDMI for video only -- coax goes to my receiver).

If I interpret your post correctly (and assuming the 8300HD's in Toronto have the most up-to-date firmware), your fix will allow me to send HDMI video to my Pio display *and* DD over coax to my receiver?

Ross

Unfortunately my first post on AVS Forums, so can't provide direct links to websites, as such I've ommited the www from the start of website names.

Following up a bit more on the SATA port:

It is definitely a SATA II external port. This can be seen in the SATA II specs at serialata.org. Go to "Sata Technology", then "Specifications", then "CabCon Volume 2 Specification". Look at page 25 and you'll see the port that's on the back of the 8300HD.

The interesting question is whether hooking up a SATA I drive to this port will work. There is a SATA II -> SATA I cable offered by COMAX Technology at comaxtech.com. Part # 221303D should do the trick.

The u.s. distributor for COMAX is Cruz Systems at cruzsystems.com. They don't list the 221303D on their website but may offer it.

Unfortunately I don't have ready access to an external SATA I drive to test. If someone does have one handy, perhaps they can get the appropriate cable from Cruz and post results back here?

-Adam

I spoke to Cruz last week, they don't have any plans to order any themselves, but could get them in within 8-10 weeks. That was for an order of 5 cables. I'm going to go ahead and order on Monday.

Watch out for the correct model number, last time I checked it was the 2213C that had SATA I on one end and SATA II on the other. When you click on the link to the 221303D version, the picture it brings up still says 2213C

It sounds like we have discussions going on again as in the humongous 8000HD thread.

I presume the 8300HD has both Passport and SARA software, just like the 8000HD. If so, people should specify what version their cable company is using. There will be differences, leading to confusion.

kromkamp:

Based on your post, I went to Rogers on Bloor yesterday and bought one. I love the simultaneous SD output because I have a Faroudja NRS scalar, which I couldn’t use with the 8000HD, but can with the 8300.

Subjectively, I find its PQ better than the 8000, but haven’t done enough critical watching to say for certain. So far, I’m much happier and am returning my rental 8000HD.

There’s a new recording option, from the same channel at the same time, when recording all episodes. Not as good as recording only the first showing, but a small improvement.

I’ve noticed the hard drive is much noisier than the 8000HD’s. I hear the actuator a lot more, even when doing a channel change. When powering it on, it does the same. I wonder if it powers down after it’s been idle for a while.

I read on SA’s web site that the 8300 is supposed to act as a video distribution system, but don’t see anything in the provided documentation. I was under the impression that you could pass a recording to another cable box located somewhere else in the house. Maybe I don’t understand it correctly.

For others reading this, we have SARA in Toronto.

Reading SA's brochure again, it appears there are different models of the 8300HD, just to confuse things. Evidently, there's one called the Multi-Room DVR, which is different from the "regular" DVR. This is the one to get for distributing recordings around your house.

I wish manufacturers would use unique model numbers to differentiate their boxes to reduce confusion for the consumer.

Jim,

I believe that the video distribution feature goes with a new model (SA8300MR) that is not yet available (anywhere).

davehancock:

Thanks for the reply. You're right about the model number. What I would prefer to see, though, is something like the 8400HD. IMO, using the prefix of 8300 for different boxes is confusing, leaving room for lots of confusion.

Jim, I think you will find there are actually 4 models of the 8300; SD, HD, MR-SD, and MR-HD. I believe S-A uses different models numbers internally, as the 8000HD is often referred to as the 8010 in technical documentation, at least according to the Cox folks here.

Jim,

Are you using HDMI? Do you know if its is active on these Rogers boxes? My primary interest in the 8300HD is the HDMI out (I'm currently using the 3250HD with component out).

Rogers at Yonge & Lawrence doesn't have 8300's yet...

Ross

I've had the 8300HD in my system for a couple of weeks now, and I'm getting a repeating problem. Sometimes, when I PAUSE, FF and REW on live tv too many times, the box freezes and then reboots. After reboot, everything is fine again, until I do the same thing.

Anyone else?

Do I need to get it swapped?

Thanks for any insight.

David

Ross in Toronto:

I don't have an HDMI-capable display and don’t see the need for it. If I understand it correctly, you need a display which can handle audio and video as HDMI passes both. I have no interest in bypassing the audio in my home theatre system, which would be a major step backwards. I don’t know if it's been activated or not, but it does show up in the Audio menu. Maybe Rogers tech support can answer that question.

Based on kromkamp’s post, I bought one at 333 Bloor St., which is Rogers' main Toronto store. They still had a couple of them left on Friday. No one at Rogers seems to know about them yet. I asked about it on their web site and was told they aren't, so go figure. I guess they haven't been out long enough for Rogers staff to be aware.

MarketingProf:

Are you on Passport or SARA? If SARA, I will try to duplicate the problem here.

Originally posted by Jim Boden
MarketingProf:

Are you on Passport or SARA? If SARA, I will try to duplicate the problem here.

I'm sure he has SARA, as I have seen the same problem but since I got the latest update of software in late October haven't seen the box crash anymore. What version SARA software do you have is the real question.

cdp1276:

I'll check and report back. How about your version???;)

Originally posted by Jim Boden
cdp1276:

I'll check and report back. How about your version???;)

Sure, our upstate NY market is up to SARA 1.85.14.1

cdp1276:

Thanks. We're at SARA 1.85.11.5 here in Toronto.

I set up a few scheduled programs yesterday. Today, I checked the list and none of them was there. The programs were supposed to start recording tonight, so I haven’t actually recorded anything yet.

After reading similar comments earlier in this thread about losing recorded programs, I’m wondering if there is some serious problem here (SARA 1.85.11.5). Does anyone have any input on this??? I set up the recorded programs again today and will wait to see what happens next.

Also, I noticed the 8300 doesn’t report as strong a signal as the 8000 does, using exactly the same cable. The picture seems OK, but I don’t understand why they would be different.

Sorry guys. I was actually watching a hi-def movie with my wife instead of playing and tweaking. Imagine that for a switch!

I'm running SARA 1.85.8.5. I take it 1.85.14.1 is the latest?

Any help would be appreciated...

David

Jim Boden, yes I have seen that problem many times before I got the latest version of software 1.85.14.1. If you have read the many posts I've posted I detailed many of these problems. I'm now happy to report with this version I've not seen any more problems and all is working well. I hope you all can get up to the latest rev of software that finally makes the box stable. Let's see if they can now revise some UI issues and add some features. I wont hold my breath...

Jim,

Thanks for the info. I do have an HDMI capable display, hence my interest. Audio will be via digital coax since I don't have an HDMI capable receiver. It's really video PQ that I'm chasing after here.

The Rogers guy at Yonge & Lawrence knew exactly which box I was talking about. He told me that currently 333 Bloor (as you pointed out) and the Yonge & Davisville locations are the only places I could pick one up.

Ross

cdp1276:

Thanks for the reply. I went back and reread your earlier posts.

Now I have to bug Rogers cable again, which was a fruitless exercise for the 8000HD. After almost 6 months of nagging them, they have done nothing about software upgrades.

I still have the 8000HD on rent, so my strategy is to demand they stop charging me for it until they get SARA up to your level. I purchased the 8300HD and trying to record in advance is pointless, making it almost useless as a DVR.

I spoke with a nice lady at Rogers and showed her this thread for specifics on the lost recording problems. I also gave her the latest version number for SARA (thanks cdp1276):D

How much do you guys in Canada have to pay for an 8300? Once you buy it, I guess you don't pay the monthly rental? Can you rent them instead of buying?

I've had the SA8300HD for a few weeks now (after upgrading from the SA8000HD), and with the new Fox season I'm starting to use it more now, since Fox is the one station I can't record with my PC HDTV card OTA.

And really, it's hard to imagine how it could be more disappointing.

1. It still has the same usability issues as the SA8000HD. Ending a recording changes the channel to "live", even if you're currently in the middle of watching that recording. There is no "play from previous position", so you have to FF to your previous position. Also, starting to watch a recording after it has started requires you to RW from the current position to the end. These usability issues are so fundamental I can only assume that they've never tried to use their own product.

2. I was recording a program tonight and was watching a previously recorded program. Twice within a span of 30 minutes, while fast-forwarding through commercials, the entire box froze. Only a full power cycle would bring it back to life, and that requires a 5 minute reboot. Not only did this annoyingly interrupt the show I was trying to watch, it ruined what I was trying to record.

Basically, this product fails both from a usability point of view and from a functional point of view. SA shows no sign of actually doing any work on these issues, and TWC is happily handing these units out to their customers (and charging them monthly for this piece of garbage).

I'm not sure I have anything particularly productive to contribute, but hopefully, if SA actually reads these forums, they'd realize they have a long way to go before this machine is ready for primetime. And for those hoping for/waiting for the SA83000HD....don't get your hopes up.

$800. to buy and $25/mo to rent.

I got mine for $699 after taking a $100 "incentive" into account.

Originally posted by Jim Boden
kromkamp:

Based on your post, I went to Rogers on Bloor yesterday and bought one. I love the simultaneous SD output because I have a Faroudja NRS scalar, which I couldn’t use with the 8000HD, but can with the 8300.

Subjectively, I find its PQ better than the 8000, but haven’t done enough critical watching to say for certain. So far, I’m much happier and am returning my rental 8000HD.

I'm positive its much better - I was watching something the other day and thought to myself it was some of the best HD I've seen in a while. Only afterwards did I remember I swapped boxes.


There’s a new recording option, from the same channel at the same time, when recording all episodes. Not as good as recording only the first showing, but a small improvement.

I agree, a small improvement. This option still records duplicates if they are on the same channel at the same time on another day, though. And god only knows what its gonna do the first time something you've got set to record changes timeslots (probably nuke your entire list of recordings or something suitably dumb in SA fashion).

I cant believe this is literally the only UI improvement in how many firmware releases? They chose to fix this over the horrible timeslipping bugs, or over better conflict resolution features (like when a scheduled recording changes timeslots and conflicts with two already scheduled shows, I'm guessing it nukes all 3 of them still)


I’ve noticed the hard drive is much noisier than the 8000HD’s. I hear the actuator a lot more, even when doing a channel change. When powering it on, it does the same. I wonder if it powers down after it’s been idle for a while.

I havent noticed that. It could be manufacturing tolerance on the HD in your box.

Originally posted by Jim Boden
I set up a few scheduled programs yesterday. Today, I checked the list and none of them was there. The programs were supposed to start recording tonight, so I haven’t actually recorded anything yet.

After reading similar comments earlier in this thread about losing recorded programs, I’m wondering if there is some serious problem here (SARA 1.85.11.5). Does anyone have any input on this??? I set up the recorded programs again today and will wait to see what happens next.


I havent experienced this yet with the 8300HD, but theres no doubt these boxes all like to decide not to record things!

kromkamp:

The hard drive is a Maxtor, the same as the 8000HD, so I am surprised.

I redid my programming setup after losing the first ones, and it's working for the time being, but I'll keep a close watch.

BTW: You might have noticed they've finally implemented the Archive to VCR feature, which was missing from the 8000HD.

The UI really does suck. I have a 4 year old SA 3100, and it's exactly the same as the new ones.

Originally posted by Chris Carollo
I've had the SA8300HD for a few weeks now (after upgrading from the SA8000HD), and with the new Fox season I'm starting to use it more now, since Fox is the one station I can't record with my PC HDTV card OTA.

And really, it's hard to imagine how it could be more disappointing.

1. It still has .... Merged your thread into this one.

Chris, I feel your pain. Clearly appealing to our respective cable companies is just not going to work.

I wonder if there is anyway we might be able to somehow get word to the people at SA that matter?

Looking at the SA website 'careers' website, it looks like all the Software positions are located in Chennai, India. So indeed it is very likely that the people designing the software for these boxes will never get to actually use them....

Originally posted by kromkamp
So indeed it is very likely that the people designing the software for these boxes will never get to actually use them....

...it's only a matter of time...

http://english.people.com.cn/english/200007/13/eng20000713_45414.html

Ross

Does anyone know why so many device codes, specifically for the Denon 3803 receiver, were dropped? The remote with my 3270 was able to control the Denon, but there is no code for the 8300 remote (AT8400).

Looking at the eClub docs, it looks like there is a Rev B remote that has a code for the Denon, but I have a Rev D remote and the code doesn't work. :(

I searched through the posts on SATA drives, but didn't see one that said someone actually had one hooked up and working. Does anyone?

As you can see I just gotmy 8300HD and have a gazillion questions. :)

I just started renting the SA8300HD (PN 4006781 w/ internal 160 GB HD) from Cox here in the Phoenix area a couple of days ago. In general, this box is great. However...

I was playing around with some HD recordings and it appears that one hour of HD uses up 8% of the availabe drive space. That equates to about 12.5 hours of HD recording. I had been recording the HD transport stream to my HTPC hard drive through the IEEE1394 port on the SA3250HD box and a 1 hour program was just over 8GB. So the conclusion I come to is that I only have approximately 8 x 12.5 = 100 GB of usable recording space on the internal 160 GB HD. What happened to the other 60 GB? I know there is a 1 hour live buffer which would account for another 8GB. That still leaves another 52 GB or so unaccounted for. I thought this box was supposed to record 20GB of HD.

Anyone have any insight on this issue?

You can use the "Copy To VCR" feature in more interesting ways than just archiving. e.g. I have my 2nd output on the 8300HD going to an ATI all-in-wonder card on my PC, which then streams video to any other PC in the house (including wireless to notebook). Now if I want to watch something on the main tv and the kids want to watch a PVRd show at the same time in the office they can. Just start the "Copy to VCR" on the show they want to watch (which gets streamed to office PC) and then resume doing whatever you want on the main tv.

2nd minor point - if you need to do a long run between the PVR and your 2nd TV (or PC), the RF output on the 8300HD also supports the "Copy to VCR". Quality isn't great but it works.

Minor inconvenience is that they can't control the 8300HD output but they can use ATI's built in PVR features to pause if they want to.

-Adam

Anybody in this thread/forum have the 8300HD in the Columbia, SC T-W market? Thanks!

Originally posted by Vidguy

I was playing around with some HD recordings and it appears that one hour of HD uses up 8% of the availabe drive space. That equates to about 12.5 hours of HD recording.

Vidguy,

Most people have reported 20 hrs HD recording on either the 8000HD or 8300HD. I wonder if you need a larger sample (record more HD programs). Another thought is that perhaps Cox is using a higher data rate (less compression) than other cable systems.

Good morning everyone,
for my first post I thought I'd dive right in with a doozy. I have kind of an odd off beat question that I figured if anyone could tackle it would be y'all.

Does this unit have any other video outs other than the HDMI or Component? If not here's the follow up question how does "digital cable" (that being SD non HD) look through component. Can non HD or SD be viewed through component and still be viewable on a NON HDTV? Is this question making sense?

Let me explain-I'm close to making the HD plunge ($ willing sooner than later) however, in the meantime my biggest gripe with TW has been their lack of broadcasting in DD 5.1. Now as I understand it I can get 5.1 through this new HD 8300 DVR as it has an optical out (yay!). I've already worked with the folks at Time Warner who have been very helpful in saying they will swap my current DVR box to this new one so I can get the 5.1. However, I have yet to determine through the Technical support if there are any other video outs (S video perhpas?) or if I can watch non HD/SD programing through a compoenet connection to a NON HDTV and have the picture be okay.

I know evvery unusual request and yes the easy thing to do is just get and HDTV and be done with it. Tell that to my wallet (LOL).

Have I made sense here? Thanks in advance
Alex

Alex,

I'll take an initial "stab" at your question, though others may expand/correct it a bit.

First of all, I suspect that the issue on 5.1 is not that Time Warner is not "broadcasting it" (they are), but that the Digital Box that you have currently does not have an digital audio output. I'm in Rochester, NY and Time Warner here carries lots of stuff (on the Digital Tier) with 5.1 - even the HBO/Showtime "On-Demand" channels. Of course, the original source needs to have 5.1.

The 8000HD/8300HD boxes do have "other" video outputs. They both do have S-Video outputs connections. Unfortunately, how the S-Video outputs work are dependent on the operating system used on the box. This depends on the particular cable system. Someplaces the S-Video is active on any SD channel and in other places it is only active in Picture in Picture or "Copy to VCR" operations.

But the great news for your situation is that these HD DVRs can be setup to primarily output SD (480i). Then the S-Video IS active at all times and you can get composite on the "Y" component output. So you can get the unit now and use it with your SD TV. The only problem is that some cable systems will not provide a HD DVR to customers unless they actually have a HD-Ready TV.

Another "heads up" is that some current users of the 8300HD have reported that when HDMI is used that 5.1 is turned off. I am not sure if this has yet been resolved anywhere. I should also note that these DVRs also have both optical and coax digital audio outputs.

Originally posted by davehancock
But the great news for your situation is that these HD DVRs can be setup to primarily output SD (480i). Then the S-Video IS active at all times and you can get composite on the "Y" component output. So you can get the unit now and use it with your SD TV. The only problem is that some cable systems will not provide a HD DVR to customers unless they actually have a HD-Ready TV.

Another "heads up" is that some current users of the 8300HD have reported that when HDMI is used that 5.1 is turned off. I am not sure if this has yet been resolved anywhere. I should also note that these DVRs also have both optical and coax digital audio outputs.
A HA! Thanks Dave that's what I wanted to see. I've got the HDbox situation without having HDTV worked out already. It's amazing what happens when a Time Warner retail manager overhears a conversation that a sales guy with CC and I were having about me switching back to DTV b/c I can no longer live without 5.1. ;)

I never would have left DTV in the first place but I'm in an area that was covered by Pegasus. Don't know if you know about that wholde deal but let's just say Pegasus failed to meet my needs. Now they are gone and I could go back to DTV if I wanted. All of this was by chance that the TW guy just happned to be in the store, heard he was about to lose a customer, and attakced-as a sales guy myself, I was impressed he spoke up.

So back to the point here....I connect from the 8300DVR via S Video out for video directly into the TV. Then connect the sound via coaxial or optical the receiver and viola I finally have TW cable with 5.1? I may shed a tear I'm so happy. I've been waiting for this moment since 1999. Oh, and yes I know not all shows are broadcast in 5.1. The frustrating part was not getting the ones that were due to cable boxes that didn't have the digital output!

Texas_Longhorns:

I have a SARA 8300HD and the SD output is active ALL THE TIME. This is not the case with the 8000HD. I got rid of the 8000 because of this limitation and replaced it with the 8300.

If you connect either optical or digital out to your receiver, there's no reason you won't get DD 5.1 when it's being broadcast.

Originally posted by Jim Boden
Texas_Longhorns:

I have a SARA 8300HD and the SD output is active ALL THE TIME. This is not the case with the 8000HD. I got rid of the 8000 because of this limitation and replaced it with the 8300.

If you connect either optical or digital out to your receiver, there's no reason you won't get DD 5.1 when it's being broadcast.
:D 2/2 batting .1000! Thanks guys that's exactly what I wanted to see.
Alex

Make that 3/3, the S-Video is also active on my 8300 here in Phoenix running SARA 1.85.14.1 software. I never had an 8000, but IMO this 8300 is one nice unit. The HD PQ seems a tad brighter than on my old 3270, analog colors seem more robust though the image is slightly grainier, and digital PQ seems about the same. All in all I had absolutely no qualms about returning my 3270. I'm just glad I was able to turn my $500 purchase into a $10 rental way back when. :)

Originally posted by Vidguy
I just started renting the SA8300HD (PN 4006781 w/ internal 160 GB HD) from Cox here in the Phoenix area a couple of days ago. In general, this box is great. However...

I was playing around with some HD recordings and it appears that one hour of HD uses up 8% of the availabe drive space. That equates to about 12.5 hours of HD recording. I had been recording the HD transport stream to my HTPC hard drive through the IEEE1394 port on the SA3250HD box and a 1 hour program was just over 8GB. So the conclusion I come to is that I only have approximately 8 x 12.5 = 100 GB of usable recording space on the internal 160 GB HD. What happened to the other 60 GB? I know there is a 1 hour live buffer which would account for another 8GB. That still leaves another 52 GB or so unaccounted for. I thought this box was supposed to record 20GB of HD.

Anyone have any insight on this issue?

Not all content is the same size or bitrate, therefore "xx Hours of recording time" is varible based on the channel content and broadcaster.
Look at This Thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4585868#post4585868) For a better understanding of the concept.

vegggas

vegggas,

FWIW, I did a quick check when I had approximately 6 hours recorded taking 34% and I computed a 17.7 hour capacity usingmy fuzzy math. I think VidGuy knows program sizes will vary, but I don't know what hour of programming he recorded for his test. If he happened to select one of the larger sized programs, that would certainly skew his computation. Since he is a member of our local forum, I gave him some of my numbers from the DVR HDD Info screen just to make sure his are similar. I'll have to try the technique from the link you posted sometime to see how hard it is to catch the file size.

Originally posted by davehancock
Another "heads up" is that some current users of the 8300HD have reported that when HDMI is used that 5.1 is turned off. I am not sure if this has yet been resolved anywhere. I should also note that these DVRs also have both optical and coax digital audio outputs.

Apparently, this issue has been resolved by some people (see post #140 earlier in this thread)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4611601#post4611601

Some users have reported not seeing the necessary option in the user menu. Seems that you need a more recent firmware.

Ross

For the record, the San Diego feed at full bitrate from Cox, will fill my drive with only about 19 hours of content. HBO, on the other hand, will hold about 26 hours of content easily. Starz HD programming will hold even more, depending on content.
You should also consider that the percentage of drive space used is just an estimate based on the closest whole number to the total remaining space of the drive, including the space of the buffers.
As an example, if you calculated your drive space total (100%) divided by space used (34%) = 2.94 and multiply that by your hours used (6), you get your value of 17.7 hours of total estimated space.
In reality, you should be multiplying by the TOTAL amount of hours stored including the 1 hour of buffer time. 2.94 x 7 = 20.5 hours of estimated HD recording space.
That's not to say the 1 hour buffer is included in your total recording time, but if you base your estimated recording time on remaining space available, then it has to be factored in as a variable to the equation.
Confused yet? I have filled my drive many times to see what happens and it does hold roughly 20 hours of HD content, give or take some time, depending on the source material.

vegggas

edit: if you ever do fill your drive, it will go to 99% and then have buffer problems. Once that happens, you have to delete some content to make space available. Then you MUST power off the box, pull the AC plug for 30 seconds, then while holding the power button, insert the power plug while it reboots and resets the software.
v

vegggas, do you spend all your waking hours testing this stuff? Thanks for the info.

Originally posted by DoubleDAZ
vegggas, do you spend all your waking hours testing this stuff? Thanks for the info.
I still haven't tested an 8300 yet, but SA follows a series of models throughout a product's history, so it gets to be easy after a while. And yes, I do spend a lot of time testing this stuff. Who needs sleep anyway?

vegggas

Quick question what us the digital out on this box? Digital Coaxial or Optical?
Thanks,
Alex

Originally posted by Texas_Longhorns
Quick question what us the digital out on this box? Digital Coaxial or Optical?
Thanks,
Alex

Both.

Originally posted by Manatus
Both.
thanks

Were the issues with Samsung DLPs and HDMI ever resolved?

Hi, I just got an 8300HD PVR about two weeks ago, and I can't figure out how to match the remote to my Amp. I tried searching for a remote guide on TW & SA websites, but no match for the remote they gave me. All the prior remotes say to press and hold Select + AUX and it will blink twice. Mine doesn't blink twice. Any ideas? My remote looks just like all the previous generations, except it has an Audio button as well as AUX on the top. 5 total.

I've got SA looking at an unusual condition on my 8300HD. The mute does not work on Digital audio out. The display says mute but it isn't silenced at the 8300. The display at the STB says 00 output level but still talking. In other audio out selected the mute works. Last night I tested all outputs and digitals don't mute but stereo pair and modulated RF audio content do mute. Anybody else?

TerryB

Originally posted by TerryB
I've got SA looking at an unusual condition on my 8300HD. The mute does not work on Digital audio out. The display says mute but it isn't silenced at the 8300. The display at the STB says 00 output level but still talking. In other audio out selected the mute works. Last night I tested all outputs and digitals don't mute but stereo pair and modulated RF audio content do mute. Anybody else?

TerryB

Yup. Same here. Noticed it a couple of weeks ago. (SARA TWC)

TerryB - are you testing the SA8300HD for TWC - Houston or is it now available to regular customers?

When I hit either volume up/down or mute on my remote, it seems to default to the "TV" button (TV lights up, not cable).

I'm still looking for anyone who has had success hooking this DVR up via the HDMI to a Toshiba 57H83 (or any Toshiba) DVI port.

Anyone....?

JFR0317,
As far as I know they are not yet released. The only new issue is the mute problem I have seen but so far no verification on another rig. Maybe specific hardware problem. On the otherhand, mute works on "other" but not DD. Would you believe the SA tech couldn't test Fiber output?

TerryB

I though I read somewhere that the Volume Button does not control digital audio outs, that has to be controlled by your receiver or whatever you have them connected to.

I believe volume controls have no effect on digital outputs. This has been the case with every SA SARA digital box I've ever seen, including old ones going back 5 years. Maybe Passport is different, but I doubt it.

Originally posted by Jim Boden
I believe volume controls have no effect on digital outputs. This has been the case with every SA SARA digital box I've ever seen, including old ones going back 5 years. Maybe Passport is different, but I doubt it.

That's been my experience. (SARA, TWC)

David

Pradeep,
You need to program the remote to use the receiver volume. Digital out only switches off at a certain low point but does not vary between on and off. Back in the manual for the remote it tells you how to move the volume control to which ever device should be in charge without loosing the other control functions of the STB.

TerryB

Originally posted by TerryB
Digital out only switches off at a certain low point but does not vary between on and off.
Actually, my old 8000HD behaved like that, but my new 8300HD keeps the digital out at a fixed level even when the volume is all the way down and even if I mute it.

David

I just got my 8300HD. I have a couple of questions. In the documentation FAQ section, it asks if you've been tuned to a program from the start do you have to rewind a program to the beginning to record the whole thing. The answer was no. However, I tried this last night, and wound up with only the last 57 minutes of Law and Order. I had just recorded West Wing, so that tuner was on NBC, and was watching CSI:NY when I flippped over and hit record.

Also, in the advanced settings menu, can someone describe what Fixed, Pass-Through, Upconvert-1, and Unconvert-2 are for exactly. I understand the first two, what was do the unconverts do?

Originally posted by trekkerj
Also, in the advanced settings menu, can someone describe what Fixed, Pass-Through, Upconvert-1, and Unconvert-2 are for exactly. I understand the first two, what was do the unconverts do?

Your answer was actually back on page 5 of this thread.

Fixed - Displays all content at whatever resolution you selected, based on what you selected in the wizard. You force the output to a single output and the box scales to that input. Easily changed in the settings menu of the box.
Pass Through - Passes the input signal through to the output with no change, unless you disable certain resolutions. For example 480i in to 480i out, 480P in to 480P out, 1080i in to 1080i out, 720P in to 720P out. If you disable 720P, 720P in will go to 1080i out.
Auto HDMI/DVI - If you are using the HDMI port, you will see this option instead of the Pass Through option. Resolution is automatically formatted to the scan rate supported by the TV.
UpConvert 1 - All 480i and 480P signals get upconverted to 480P. All 720P and 1080i signals get upconverted to 1080i.
UpConvert 2 - All 480i and 480P signals get upconverted to 480P. All 720P and 1080i signals get converted to 720P.

Has anyone ever had a problem with AutoErase not erasing? I had my recordings set to Save 1 episode with Auto Erase and my recorder ran out of room in the middle of a recording.

Any suggestions?

MarketingProf,
What software are you running there?
SARA or PASSPORT?

The mute ought to work in the STB, that's my issue but I've been told it should mute.

TerryB

SARA

Does anyone have Passport on one of these boxes? (If so, it might bode well for my Passport-dependent TWC provider getting the boxes soon).

What remote did you get with your 8300HD PVR? The one TW gave me had no manual, and I can't find one online. It looks just like the All Touch 8550, except it has an AUD button instead of VCR. I can't get the program component command to work (Select + button, flashes all twice). Any ideas?

Man it's annoying not having a 30 second skip button. Anybody know if an IR code exists to do this even if the remote doesn't have a button for it? Do any other SA PVRs have this?

Originally posted by trekkerj
However, I tried this last night, and wound up with only the last 57 minutes of Law and Order. I had just recorded West Wing, so that tuner was on NBC, and was watching CSI:NY when I flippped over and hit record. AFAIK, this is how it works (though I may not say it right). The active tuner is the one you are watching and that is what goes into the buffer. When you hit record, within the first hour anyway, it simply transfers the buffer to the HDD. It then continues recording so you get the complete program. The other tuner is not active in the same sense. That is, there is nothing going into the buffer until you switch active tuners.

In your case, once West Wing finished recording, the tuner was available for another recording. When you switched over from CSI:NY, you then made it the active tuner and it's program started going into the buffer. When you hit record, you began recording from the point at which you switched and that is why you got only the last 57 minutes, at least IMHO.

Semuda,
Remote I have is a Universal Electronics Atlas DVR/PVR 5-Device Universal Remote Control.

Start here.


http://www.uei.com/products/cable/atlas.html

TerryB

Well I've done my due diligence and read throgh all 12 pages of this post and hope you will answer a few (very) elementary questions on the 8300.

I am very interested in the noise the unit makes. I plan to use it in a bedroom. I have a rReplayTV recorder in the family room and I could not live with the fan noise in the bedroon. So how noisy is the8300 when it is off. If you are not watching TV but have a scheduled recording start, is there any additional noise?

Does the fast forward work like a VCR? You just see the motion move at a faster speed. Are there different fast forward speeds. I am reading there is no 30 sec skip or jump of any sort - correct?

I understand you can record two shows at the same time due to dual tuners. Does that mean the cable is split before entering the 8300. If so might that degrade the picture at all? Can you record two shows and watch a third live show?

I have HDMI as well as component. Is there a real advantage to using HDMI?

Will I have any problem recording 'copywrited' material such as movies?

I have read that this is a problem but do not really understand what it means:
Ending a recording changes the channel to "live", even if you're currently in the middle of watching that recording.
Does it mean that when you are watching the beginning of a show that is recording at the end when the recording is finished it kicks you out of watching the show and then you have to go back to the beginning of the recorded show and fast forward to where you were when it kicked you out.

Is watching a non-hd recorded show any worse than watching a non-hd show live, as far as picture quality goes?

Last question is really asking for an opinion - is having the ability to hd record worth the problems documented here - freezing and lost shows. ReplayTV is quite reliable but, of course, not hd.

Thanks for taking the time to answer.

Originally posted by kelmk
Man it's annoying not having a 30 second skip button. Anybody know if an IR code exists to do this even if the remote doesn't have a button for it? Do any other SA PVRs have this?

I have been experimenting with a macro that uses FF a delay, and the play button. I just tried it tonight, and though it is not a true quickskip, it is close. I used a 2 second delay and it was a bit long, so I will shorten it until I get exactly 30 sec. Here is my macro:

FF
FF
FF
Delay 2sec
Play

I think 1.5 sec delay might do it.

I use the MX800 and like to program my channel button to quickskip when pressed forward, and replay when toggled back. That is the way I have it programmed on my HDTivo and it works great. I never use the channel button anyway since I use the guide to navigate.

To do it with the 8300 you would program a button in the LCD with the macro above and provide a shortcut from the channel up button.

If someone finds the exact sequence for a 30sec skip before I do, please post it.

I started noticing some pretty bad pixelation on 2 of my HD recordings on different channel tonight. Has anyone experienced this or know what this means? My box has plenty of 'breathing' room, so I don't think it could be overheating. I didn't notice it last night on my recordings.

Originally posted by marchristensen
I am very interested in the noise the unit makes.I can barely hear mine with my ear right next to the unit, but I've heard others complain about theirs.
Does the fast forward work like a VCR?Yes, but there are 3 speeds; FF1 (4X), FF2 (10X), and FF3 (30X). You can experience some video freeze if you don't press the button fast enough to go from FF1 to FF2 to FF3. There is no 30 sec Skip and there is no auto Jumpback. You can similate Jumpback by pressing Play and then the Replay button.
I understand you can record two shows at the same time due to dual tuners. Does that mean the cable is split before entering the 8300. If so might that degrade the picture at all? Can you record two shows and watch a third live show?No, the cable is not split and I've noticed no degradation of either recording. You cannot watch a third live program, but you could split your cable and use another TV input to watch an analog channel.
I have HDMI as well as component. Is there a real advantage to using HDMI?Don't know, I use Component.
Will I have any problem recording 'copywrited' material such as movies?Only those set to Record Never, which will mostly be PPV. Not sure if this is all in place or not yet.
I have read that this is a problem but do not really understand what it means:
Ending a recording changes the channel to "live", even if you're currently in the middle of watching that recording.
Does it mean that when you are watching the beginning of a show that is recording at the end when the recording is finished it kicks you out of watching the show and then you have to go back to the beginning of the recorded show and fast forward to where you were when it kicked you out.Yes.
Is watching a non-hd recorded show any worse than watching a non-hd show live, as far as picture quality goes?My experience thus far is PQ is the same, live or recorded for ALL programs, HD or SD.
Last question is really asking for an opinion - is having the ability to hd record worth the problems documented here - freezing and lost shows. ReplayTV is quite reliable but, of course, not hd.I have not had any problems at all with lost recordings, etc. I have set up some daily and weekly recordings and also set up individual recordings every night. They have all recorded without problems.
Thanks for taking the time to answer.You're welcome. :)

Trekkerj,
Remember that the link between most programming sources and your PVR has a satelite inthe chain somewhere. The weather can interrupt even the signals down to the Big Ugly Dish at you cable headend for example. There used to be folks commenting on specific sat. transducers which were acting up too. Sometimes you'll find related channels like a couple Discovery channels will act up when nobody else is having a problem. I haven't seen any problems like that which I would blame on my box.

TerryB

Marchristensen:

Just to add to DoubleDAZ excellent comments, I believe you can record 2 programs at once and play back a recording at the same time. Can anyone else confirm or deny this?

As far as PQ goes, the box always plays back from the hard drive no matter what you’re watching. This accounts for the 1 hour buffer and the fact that you can pause, backspace etc. a live program. This would not be possible without using the hard drive at all times.

So last night I'm watching my Hokies slaughter Maryland (sorry Terp fans), and I never change the channel, but I'm not recording the show.

The guide shows the game going from 7:30-10:30. At 10:20 or so I decide I want to record the rest of the game. I hit the record button on the remote and accept to record the whole game according to the guide (7:30-10:30).

I had forgotten that the game was obviously going to go longer than 10:30. Now, at about 10:25 it starts recording. I figured I would get the last hour of the game since there should be an hour or so in the buffer. But, at 10:30 it stops recording and when I bring it up on the list, 5 minutes is all I got.

Any explanations? Maybe 5 minutes of time is not enough to dump the buffer to the hard disk?

David

DOUBLEDAZ - Just wanted to thank you for your complete and excellent response. You really gave me the info I was looking for. I find your answers encouraging and I intend to go for the 8300. Not sure when, though, as the technology is very new at Cablevision, and they do not seem to do so well with new Tech.

Jim - I appreciate the insight into PQ - what you say definately makes sense. Thanks.

Originally posted by Jim Boden
Just to add to DoubleDAZ excellent comments, I believe you can record 2 programs at once and play back a recording at the same time. Can anyone else confirm or deny this? Yes, you can. I meant to add that comment and then got distracted. :)

Originally posted by marchristensen
DOUBLEDAZ - Just wanted to thank you for your complete and excellent response. Your welcome. I try to help when I can, but someone usually beats me to it. :)

FWIW, to be sure there are problems with the 8300, but I have not found any that don't have a workaround, etc., or keep me from thoroughly enjoying this unit. I've been working on some Tips & Tricks ala vegggas' excellent posts re the 8000HD and have posted them in a new thread.

I have my 8300HD set to record Joey at 8pm (or any time on nbc), and same for ER at 10pm. When I looked at my scheduled recordings, for next thursday, it was scheduled to record Will and Grace at 8pm, and the Seinfeld special at 10pm, neither one of which I selected, but they are in the same time slot as Joey and ER usually are. Why is this happening?

Trekkerj
I suspect the DVRs use time only after the initial look forward in the guide. My 8000 screwed up for a while after the Daylight time change. "Trust but verify".

TerryB

I'm not sure I understand what you are saying.

Trekkerj,
I believe that when you make a show choice on a record request the name of the show is found during that week but from then on it uses a time target instead of the show name. I had NCIS selected to record in the first Tuesday of November but it was screwed up because the machine somehow didn't plan on the show being 1 hour later in its schedule. The machine does not see the time of the show being adjusted for DST or specials or orevrunning shows preceeding. It marks the desired time when the request is made and that's it.

TerryB

Then how does the 'record on this channel in ANY time slot' work if it isn't based on the show name? Then you really have to check the scheduled recordings each week and plan for any changes? That's a nice pain in the neck.

Does anybody know if Time Warner in Austin has enabled the HDMI port on the 8300HD? I just hooked up an hdmi - Dvi cable to my set and I get an error that my set does not have an hdcp compliant DVI port and I know it does.

sdarnell:
I am just learning that what you are talking about is called an "HDCP handshaking error." I am having this problem with the 8300 while I don't have it with the Pace 550. Apparently (and this is NOT definitive yet) the Pace 550 is more tolerant of a negative value being returned when the HDCP is checked (and it is checked often). However, the SA 8300 is not so tolerant so when it gets one negative value, instead of waiting until the next HDCP check (as the Pace 550 does), it just puts up the HDCP error message and shuts down. Scientific Atlanta and Time Warner are aware that this is a problem but only for some displays (mine is one of them 8^). I don't know what the final resoultion of this issue will be, but consumers are definitely stuck in the middle while the BIG boys point their fingers at each other and deny responsibility... Since I am in the middle of a (now two month long) process to deal with this issue, I will keep you posted here of any progress. I expect to have this dealt within a couple of weeks. However, I thought the problem would be dealt with in a week two months ago...:mad:

Originally posted by trekkerj
Then how does the 'record on this channel in ANY time slot' work if it isn't based on the show name? Then you really have to check the scheduled recordings each week and plan for any changes? That's a nice pain in the neck. It sounds to me like it will check times based on program titles during the setup process, after that is goes strictly on the timeslots found during the setup process. If anything changes afterward, it will simply record based on the timeslots already set and you will miss it.

This really is a hokey way of doing things, especially without explaining it. I guess, in their defense, the LIST would have to constantly check the IPG to see if anything has changed since the recordings were setup and I'm fairly confident it does not do this. I assume Tivo does, so you can set Tivo once and you never have to worry about it again, though I have never used Tivo, so I don't know for sure.

trekkerj:

I'm not totally understanding the answers to your question. In my experience, when you select a program to be recorded, it uses the program name from the guide to get its information. There's a possibility that something is wrong in the IPG data, which is controlled by your cable company. Perhaps you should check with them. I have no problems on my cable system of this type. I have recordings set up for several different programs and it always works properly.

I'll check with my cable company. When I go a week ahead to next Thursday, if I highlight Will and Grace to cancel the recording, I find that on the next screen it still thinks it's Joey. So maybe the guide data is messed up.

TitanTV and Excite both show an hour-long Will & Grace next Thursday, Joey returns the following Thursday, so I don't think the guide is messed up.

trekkerj:

How many days ahead can you see the guide? I can only do 7 days here.

I only get 7 too. Are you guys seeing pixelation and blips in your recordings? If not, are you hard rebooting your device regularly?

semuta:

I've never seen the problem you're mentioning and only booted the box when it was new (SARA). Maybe it has something to do with your cable company. Occasionally, there can be glitches due to compression.

I only have 7 days of programming guide data also. If I look at my scheduled recordings, it shows Joey Thurs 11/25 8pm. If I look at the guide itself, for the same time period, it shows (correctly) Will and Grace, highlighted in red for recording.

trekkerj: How did you set up your recording? Did you simply go to the IPG and select Joey or did you create a manual recording for the Joey timeslot every Thursday?

Jim, if I follow this right, he set up a recording for Joey. That should record every Thrusday night from 700-730 (MST), except next Thursday when Joey is not on. However, after the IPG got updated through next Thursday, his LIST now shows a scheduled recording for that night and this would appear to be incorrect. Have the shows for which you have recordings scheduled been on each week or has there been a week where something else was on and it didn't record?

I just set up a recording for all episodes on this channel in this timeslot for House. I know it is not on next Friday because it is moving to it's regular timeslot. I will be able to check tomorrow, after the IPG is updated tonight through next Friday, to see if a recording is scheduled for next Friday.

I just got the box a couple of days ago. Wednesday afternoon, I was setting up my programs. I loaded up the Guide. Scrolled to yesterday for Joey. Highlighted it. Hit record. Selected all episodes, all time slots (in case it should move or get a supersized episode). Seems to me like the equivalent of a tivo season pass. That's all I did. Now the scheduled recordings and the guide don't match for next thursday. In the scheduled recordings, Joey shows up for next week, while W&G is highlighted in the guide. Also, at 10pm, I have an ER repeat recording, but the Seinfeld story is on. It's also highlighted. I actually WANT to record that, so I'm not sure if I should leave it alone, or do a manual recording. Something fishy is going on.

Originally posted by marchristensen
I am very interested in the noise the unit makes. I plan to use it in a bedroom. I have a rReplayTV recorder in the family room and I could not live with the fan noise in the bedroon. So how noisy is the8300 when it is off. If you are not watching TV but have a scheduled recording start, is there any additional noise?

....


I have HDMI as well as component. Is there a real advantage to using HDMI?


I have an 8000HD in the bedroom, and for some reason in the middle of the night, maybe around 2am, the hard drive will spin up for a few mins. Then it winds back down. (Box is off).

As for the 8300HD, it's in the living room. It doesn't have a noisy fan like the Replay, but if you were for example recording two shows, whilst playing back a third recording, the hard drive does make a fair bit of thrashing noise. A shirpy noise. Assuming it doesn't wind up in the middle of the night, or have a recording scheduled for then, it should be OK.

If you connect via HDMI->HDMI cable, chances are that you will no longer have Dolby Digital audio output, only prologic. It's controlled by a setting in the 8300HD, not many of us have that setting available (as far as I know only the Canadians).

Originally posted by Pradeep
If you connect via HDMI->HDMI cable, chances are that you will no longer have Dolby Digital audio output, only prologic. It's controlled by a setting in the 8300HD, not many of us have that setting available (as far as I know only the Canadians). What do you have for options in the General Settings/Audio: Digital Out setting? I have DD/HDMI/Other and I don't even have an HDMI hookup. From what I have read, when you connect an HDMI cable, this setting automatically gets set to HDMI and you have to reset it to DD. If you don't have these options, I would certainly consider calling the cableco to see about getting them activated. I assume they control them and you should not have to give up DD because of an HDMI connection.