Let me be the first to thank Topp for posting settings and SM tweaks for this set. The information is very much appreciated, and will undoubtedly help many of us get our Panasonic DLPs to look better than we could have on our own. The grayscale setting was especially appreciated.

Thanks!!

Ben

Originally posted by dingJam
Let me be the first to thank Topp for posting settings and SM tweaks for this set. The information is very much appreciated, and will undoubtedly help many of us get our Panasonic DLPs to look better than we could have on our own. The grayscale setting was especially appreciated.

Thanks!!

Ben

Although I do not have the 50dl54 yet, I must say, thanks Topp!!! It's a ton of useful information :)

Originally posted by zeeeter
. . .maybe, but when you look at the issue of noisy fans on personal computers, the difference comes down to whether you bought a $5 - 90 db fan or a $20 - 30 db fan.

On a $3500 MSRP television, you'd think that a $20 fan would have been a better option, and a retrofit might just do the trick. If that is the only problem people are finding, what a deal this TV is (and I think it is a steal for the PQ). If Panasonic step up, admit a problem and fix the concerns (unlike Sony with their GWIIIs where they replaced the bulb and the driver but even today refute that there was a problem) then Panasonic deserve some kudos. Lets see what they do.

You hit the nail on the head. Perhaps they changed fans and some of us have the $20 fans and others got stuck with the $5 fans.

Each situation is unique. The evaluation of noise is limited but the easiest way is to indicate how far one is sitting and what level do they need to set the volume such that the fan noise is masked. If those who believe they have quiet fans, I would be curious as to what their viewing distance and sound levels are to mask the fan noise.

Originally posted by Topp Robertson
Section 14 describes how to enter and exit Service Mode. It mentions a handy shortcut to get the set into service mode: Press “VOL” (-) on TV and “Recall” button on remote control simultaneously for at least 3 seconds. It works.

That was all the useful information I got out of the service manual.

To sum up, this set performs very well and makes a very accurate image. For the do-it-yourself person, I would recommend using DVE or equivalent to set the Picture, Brightness, Color and Tint controls. Set Sharpness to 0, Set Color Temp to Warm and set Picture Mode to Cinema. Use a 720p input signal vs. 1080i if possible. Get into the Service menu and set HPOS and VPOS to center the screen and set WB to 01. That should give you the most accurate display possible short of a professional calibration.

End of Part 4
Wow! You are the man! I did adjust my HPOS and VPOS a while back to center the image. I'll try the WB later on. I already love my picture, so if it actually improves more, that would be awesome.

How does it say to exit the SM? Is the only way by turning the TV off?

EDIT: One more thing. If I am understanding correctly, the standard and cinema settings have totally different curves even though the settings (color, picture, etc) may be the same for each one? I'm guessing vivid is just not good at all, right?

Ed

Just got the Panny and it looks great over Comcast HD cable! But I cannot get any resolution to work from my HTPC to the panny other than 768xsomething [not in front of the unit right now]. I tried FaSST2001's custom resolution of 1200x678 and I don't even get a picture. I've also tried other standard windows resolutions (eg 1280x720) and the Panny only displays a small portion of the screen. I have to pull the mouse over to the sides to see other portions.

I'm connected via DVI-HDMI using a Sapphire R9000 card. Any thoughts as to why I can't get a higher resolution? BTW, I can get 1024x768 over Svideo but it looks terrible.

Please help!

Topp,

GREAT job, thanks for the info.

Originally posted by Boxster_T
Just got the Panny and it looks great over Comcast HD cable! But I cannot get any resolution to work from my HTPC to the panny other than 768xsomething [not in front of the unit right now]. I tried FaSST2001's custom resolution of 1200x678 and I don't even get a picture. I've also tried other standard windows resolutions (eg 1280x720) and the Panny only displays a small portion of the screen. I have to pull the mouse over to the sides to see other portions.

I'm connected via DVI-HDMI using a Sapphire R9000 card. Any thoughts as to why I can't get a higher resolution? BTW, I can get 1024x768 over Svideo but it looks terrible.

Please help!
That sounds like the same thing that happens if you set a 1280x720 resolution through the VGA input. You get the virtual desktop and it scrolls with the mouse. The only thing I can think of is that the 9000 doesn't do well with those resolutions, but I think it should. Are you on the latest Catalyst drivers, at least 4.7? I'm not too sure what else to tell ya. You may want to post in the HTPC forums well as some of those guys are very knowledgeable.

Also, if you do get it working correctly, that custom res should be 1200x675. I thought I changed it in that previous post, but maybe I missed it somewhere.

Ed

Originally posted by FaSSt2001

EDIT: One more thing. If I am understanding correctly, the standard and cinema settings have totally different curves even though the settings (color, picture, etc) may be the same for each one? I'm guessing vivid is just not good at all, right?

Ed

Same question. I thought that the different modes simply had different default settings and that if you set each mode to the exact same settings (color, tint, brightness, etc...) you'd get the exact same picture.

Originally posted by Topp Robertson

Here are pictures of the Sharpness test pattern from my signal generator at 1080i and at 720p. Notice that the 720p image correctly resolves the smallest vertical bars, but in the 1080i image they fade to gray. Much better detail at 720p. The HDMI input was used for these images.



Would you expect the same results over component, i.e. my LG player is connected via component and does upconversion to 720p and 1080i so should I set it to 720p?

And thanks for all the info, it's greatly appreciated!

Hrmm, so the focus/skew can be adjusted easily, albeit only manually?

Topp, how difficult do you think it would be to adjust it?

Thanks.

Andrew

Oh, and another thing...

Anyone using the DV318B (or one of its clones) on this set? What are your findings/settings?

Hi Topp,

I followed your advice but now i'm stuck on service menu mode. I can't seem to get out. I've tried your shortcut function but it didn't work. Please help....

Is there a way to back to factory default if one screws up?

Thanks,
RC

I thought I just post a pic. Picture does not do justice to the set.
Dvd player is connected via component out

one more

Help with Dish 811? or my Panny?

When I use my DVI/HDMI cable from my Dish 811 receiver to my set, the picture is dark and has virtually no red. However, when I use my component cables, the colors are fine. Dish just sent me a new receiver today, but I have the same problem. The cable vendor said they tested the cable out before it was shipped and apparently it worked flawlessly. Has anyone had any HDMI/DVI display issues with their Panny? Do you suspect this is a Dish network hardware problem? Know of any simple fixes?

Thanks,
Adam

Originally posted by darkandlong
Oh, and another thing...

Anyone using the DV318B (or one of its clones) on this set? What are your findings/settings?

I have the LG equivalent but just got my tv and haven't had a chance to calibrate with DVE yet. I'll post results after I do.

Originally posted by jv59
SeatleDesi,

My set arrived today. It is an awesome set.
My HTPC is ready, however my hdmi/dvi cable has not arrived yet.

Thanks for for the testpatterns link.

jv59

what's the feedback when using the test patterns rom phillips? Does it do 1280x720 well? Doos anyone see any color banding on greyscales and blues?

For FaSSt2001 and eXcentris: The Picture Mode Settings didn't seem to modify any other user menu settings like Picture or Brightness. They changed the gamma curve primarily. The Cinema setting was the closest to a correct gamma setting in the range of 2.0 to 2.5. The gamma curve for Normal was nearly a straight line (bad). I didn't even try Vivid. Normal and Vivid would make images look brighter, but they would be a less accurate reproduction of the orignal image.

For eXcentris: I would expect the same results on the component input for 1080i vs. 720p. I didn't try it because dangerfish was using a DVD player at 480p on the component input. I would experiment with your player at 480p and 720p to see which has the better up converter, the player or the set. Going to 1080i is not a good idea because the set would have to down convert that to 720p anyway.

For darkandlong: It looked fairly easy to adjust focus and tilt with the mechanical adjustments, but you would need the service manual. If you have this problem it should be covered under warranty.

For biohoa: Just turn the set off or unplug it to get out of service mode. I didn't see a reset control to factory defaults. Write down everything before you change anything, as always.

Cheers! :)

Get into the Service menu and set HPOS and VPOS to center the screen and set WB to 01. That should give you the most accurate display possible short of a professional calibration.

Hello Topp Robertson,

After getting into the WB section of the service menu I see
00F900 is the setting you are suggesting 00F901 ?

Thank you very much just want to be sure i get it right !

Ok, new member to forum here. =)

That being said I'm looking this model, the JVC d-ila (52 inch variety) and the mitsu 52725.

All things being equal, and ... er saving $400 over the mitsu would this panasonic be a decent buy? I have dtc-100. I did note that there were *two* rgb inputs and err, could I hook the dtc-100 directly to it and would that rgb use 1080i or 720p? Or is that rgb input only for computers and basically I need to keep on using the rgb to component converter I currently have.

thoughts?

I will be making a purchace in two days here...just doing research now. Overall, here's how I kind of have it rated:

1) Mitsu 52725 -- glare screen seems to be biggest deal. highest cost, no real other issue.
2) pana pt50DL54 -- noisy? no off air tuner (but I do have the dtc100). A little less configurable. $400 cheaper. 6 element color wheel? (mitsu is 7)
3) Jvc d-ila -- one trick poiny in that they have chosen a *differing* method of doing high def -- seems to have chassis problems. Images that I've seen in the display rooms tended to be "jaggier".
4) RCA 52 scenium (new one) -- cheap. cons -- err, it's rca.

Anyway, any thoughts? Sorry to intrude .... I'm thinking Mitsu...but I just saw the panasonic for the first time last night and ... was *really* impressed with it. It also looked aesthetically much more pleasing...and the extra saved doughage can go directly into a stand.

thanks for any input

tani

Originally posted by terfmop
Help with Dish 811? or my Panny?

When I use my DVI/HDMI cable from my Dish 811 receiver to my set, the picture is dark and has virtually no red. However, when I use my component cables, the colors are fine. Dish just sent me a new receiver today, but I have the same problem. The cable vendor said they tested the cable out before it was shipped and apparently it worked flawlessly. Has anyone had any HDMI/DVI display issues with their Panny? Do you suspect this is a Dish network hardware problem? Know of any simple fixes?

Thanks,
Adam

I can say without a doubt that it is your dish 811, I am on my 3rd replacement up here in canada , which is called 6100, and it is very bad via DVI or Composite cables (RCA) dark dark dark picture. Do a google search on "Dish 811 dark picture" and see what you find. You will be pissed.

Originally posted by Topp Robertson

For eXcentris: I would expect the same results on the component input for 1080i vs. 720p. I didn't try it because dangerfish was using a DVD player at 480p on the component input. I would experiment with your player at 480p and 720p to see which has the better up converter, the player or the set. Going to 1080i is not a good idea because the set would have to down convert that to 720p anyway.



Since I'm rather new to this technical stuff let me see if I understand this correctly. I think that what you are trying to tell me is that the native resolution of this tv is 720p correct? So if I set the DVD player to 480p, the tv will do the up conversion to 720p and if I set the DVD player to 720p, the player does the conversion. And as you stated, it's a matter of determining which of the two (tv or player) does a better job at up converting.

In essence, you are telling me that I really didn't need to buy a DVD player with up conversion capability. :)

Originally posted by tanilium
Ok, new member to forum here. =)

I did note that there were *two* rgb inputs and err, could I hook the dtc-100 directly to it and would that rgb use 1080i or 720p? Or is that rgb input only for computers and basically I need to keep on using the rgb to component converter I currently have.
tani

I can't really answer the question, as I have not seen the new model yet. I will say that if the RGB input is important to you, make sure you get a definitive answer. I have a 1st gen Panny DLP, and the RGB input is not a full HD input; it will allow you to connect at resolutions up to 800x600 (actually, you can connection 1024x768, but it then scales it down). I believe I remember seeing that this was also the case with 2nd gen set, but I'm not sure about the new one. Also, the DTC-100 would not work on the component inputs using a transcoder of the first gen set, because the sync and frequency were non-standard.

If anyone needs here you go.

Pages 1-11 PT-50 / 60 DL54

Interesting. I had assumed that the existing method of rgb to component conversion (adapter) would still work.

I've *seen* the lip synch problem occur occasionally. Oddly, flipping channels seemed to always correct it.

I'm going to update the dvd player to the s-97 (panny) when it comes out, too. I guess...the dtc100 *might* be replaced sooner than I had anticipated. =(

The rgb inputs as I saw it, were going to be computer related anyway...the dtc100 was more of a "hahha, it'd be cool if this finally worked" deal.

tani

Originally posted by tanilium
I've *seen* the lip synch problem occur occasionally. Oddly, flipping channels seemed to always correct it.

The sync issue I was referring to is the monitor sync, i.e., squiggly lines v. a fully resolved picture. Although I don't really remember the facts, I recall being told that it had something to do with the monitor requiring tri-level sync and the DTC-100/converter doing something else.

If anyone need here you go.

Pages 12-22 PT-50 / 60 DL54

If anyone needs here you go. Sorry English Only.

Pages 23-33 PT-50 / 60 DL54

Originally posted by tanilium
Ok, new member to forum here. =)

That being said I'm looking this model, the JVC d-ila (52 inch variety) and the mitsu 52725.

All things being equal, and ... er saving $400 over the mitsu would this panasonic be a decent buy? I have dtc-100. I did note that there were *two* rgb inputs and err, could I hook the dtc-100 directly to it and would that rgb use 1080i or 720p? Or is that rgb input only for computers and basically I need to keep on using the rgb to component converter I currently have.

thoughts?

I will be making a purchace in two days here...just doing research now. Overall, here's how I kind of have it rated:

1) Mitsu 52725 -- glare screen seems to be biggest deal. highest cost, no real other issue.
2) pana pt50DL54 -- noisy? no off air tuner (but I do have the dtc100). A little less configurable. $400 cheaper. 6 element color wheel? (mitsu is 7)
3) Jvc d-ila -- one trick poiny in that they have chosen a *differing* method of doing high def -- seems to have chassis problems. Images that I've seen in the display rooms tended to be "jaggier".
4) RCA 52 scenium (new one) -- cheap. cons -- err, it's rca.

Anyway, any thoughts? Sorry to intrude .... I'm thinking Mitsu...but I just saw the panasonic for the first time last night and ... was *really* impressed with it. It also looked aesthetically much more pleasing...and the extra saved doughage can go directly into a stand.

thanks for any input

tani
The RGB inputs would be of no use to your tuner. They only accept 800x600 resolution and anything larger is scaled down to that. I truly think it's a waste of VGA inputs on a TV as now I have to use component or HDMI for my computer.

One note, the Panasonic has an 8 segment color wheel.

As for which one to choose, I chose the Panasonic because I hated the glare screen of the Mitsubishi and I didn't want any of the integrated stuff. I did really like the Mitsubishi other than those issues though. The JVC just lacked inputs and I never saw one that looked great.

Ed

Originally posted by tanilium
Ok, new member to forum here. =)

That being said I'm looking this model, the JVC d-ila (52 inch variety) and the mitsu 52725.
...
2) pana pt50DL54 -- noisy? no off air tuner (but I do have the dtc100). A little less configurable. $400 cheaper. 6 element color wheel? (mitsu is 7)
...

tani

Bad news for anyone (like me) who's waiting for the Panny integrated tuner sets to come out. I sent Panasonic customer support an email asking when the 50DLD64 would be released, and yesterday I got the following reply:

Thank you for your inquiry. Panasonic will not have information on our up coming models until the end of November.

Thank You,
Panasonic Consumer Support


It looks like they'll lag the Toshiba 52HM94 by a few months, and who knows, they may not come out until around the time Samsung releases its integrated models.

I have a D* Samsung SIR-TS360 HD receiver hooked up to the PT-50DL54 via DVI/HDMI cable. Also had it hooked up via Component with the same results. I have the 360 output set to 720P for all modes including SD channels. For 4:3 mode, I have selected Pillars.

The problem I see is that the screen width for SD isn't quite a 4:3 ratio. The screen width for regular SD channels is 36 inches. In order to have a true 4:3 ratio, based on the height of the set, the screen width (before the black bars kick in) should be around 33 inches.

Now, on the ESPN HD channel, the width of the display before the HD bars kick in is 34, not exactly 33, but still better than 36.

If I change the display output on the 360 to 480i, the SD channels now display in 4:3 mode at 30 inches (everything looks obviously really skinny this way).

Would someone with the same equipment mind taking a few measurments to see what width the 4:3 mode SD channels are for comparison to my set? I'd like to see what other's have so that I can definitively say I have a defective receiver.

Thanks!

Thanks Topp for your quick response. I was getting a bit nervous there fiddling about in the service menu. Like you said the best way out is to unplug and the tv will reboot itself. Can you explain what is the function of 3D Y/C and how I can't turn it 'on"

Overall I'm very pleased with the Pany sans the rainbow/oil slick effect in shows like CSI:NY or any dark scenes. Oh well it's a matter of give and take.

RC

I have a black shadow at the bottom center edge of the TV, like something is blocking the projector. Has anyone had this problem?

Also, I have DVI HDMI cable running from Comcast HD DVR, but I cant get a picture with the HDMI selected....TV problem, box problem, cable? I cant figure it out and I dont have any other DVI devices..

Other than that TV is unreal. UVA/Clem game right now is solid.

I saw where the width of the base was posted but did not see the depth of the base, so if someone could please measure that I would appreciate it. My set should arrive sometime between Monday and Thursday next week and I am rapidly making a make do stand until I can finish my final one.. am wanting to lift the set a couple of inches above the top shelf :) Wanting to keep the IR sensor open from behind my center channel else I will have to place speaker above the set and I'd prefer not to do that! Thx

Originally posted by eXcentris
I have the LG equivalent but just got my tv and haven't had a chance to calibrate with DVE yet. I'll post results after I do.

Fantastic, I'd really appreciate it.

Are you running component or DVI/HDMI?

I'd like to find a setting that helps reduce the black macroblocking but still helps maintain decent picture quality.

I noticed the macroblocking with the LG a lot on Man on Fire... I need to find one of my own DVDs that exhibit the same artifacting so I can test the different upscaling, picture settings, and even cables

As of right now I'm through the component, 1080 upscaled and using the supplied flimsy component cables.

I have yet to be able to find (haven't looked much) a DVI/HDMI adapter. I also didn't really want to invest in one until I heard that the player will work on the Panny's HDMI input.

After playing with some of the test patterns on my Avia DVD, I think i am able to be more specific with some issues with my picture quality. When I displayed the gray 'ramp' pattern, the "halo-ish" effect was present. This is most noticeable when there is a gradient of color (especially blue...going from dark blue to light blue). Does anyone have this problem with the gray ramp, how can I limit this effect?

darkandlong, I'm using component because I plan to use HD tv on HDMI. I have quality component cables and, after reading Topp Robertson's post, I have my player set to 720p (see his comments on 1080i). I haven't noticed any black macroblocking but I have noticed the occasional rainbow.

jdavis37, the depth of the base is 11 1/2"

Tergmop - "color banding" is present on my PT50DL54 as well. I notice it most often on out of focus scenes. Sometimes on scenes with lighted flat surfaces, like walls. You know it should be smooth gradient or blur. But instead it is in circular steps.

I am still not sure whether it is a result of MPEG compression. I do know it can be. But if you are using Avia, the compression on the images should be non-existant. Which leads me back to the TV.

I do realize I am being hyper critical in an attempt to differentiate what is an expected picture and what is a problem.

Does anyone here experience the halo effect around figures? I was watching Leno in HD the picture and color reproduction are great but Jay and his guests have hazy outline around them. I guess it almost look like a 3D

I turn the Sharpness down to zero and the parameters based on Topp;s.

Cables

I looked at prices on component cables and DVI/HDMI adaptor cables. There is a big difference between cheap and expensive cables. Does anyone know whether, for the 50-inch Panny, there really is a visual difference between the cheap and expensive cables?

Fan Noise

Originally posted by Clear Image
Fan Noise

Hi all. I just sent this email to Panasonic Canada:

______________________________________
"I've had a PT-50DL54J for 2 days. Serial no. MX42530293. Not yet registered. I have a noise problem from the fan or color wheel--or both. Using a Radio Shack analog SPL meter, set on C weighting slow response, with the microphone 1/8 inch from the plastic fan vent, I measured 84-94 dB as I moved the mic slowly across the vent. 94dB! The noise is annoying at my listening position and I must set the volume at 15-17 to mask it. The noise has a slight motorcycle quality (quick da-da-da's). When I turn off the TV, the motorcyling noise stops first (the color wheel?) and then the remaining noise stops a bit later (fan?). At a forum regarding this TV, several owners complained of excessive noise. Several other owners said the TV is very quiet and they must put their head 6-12 inches from the vent to hear the noise. Do you have a quality control problem on this noise issue and what can you do to reduce the noise on my TV? Do you want to repair or replace the TV?"
_______________________________________

I'll let you know what happens.
___________

I just received this reply from Panasonic Canada:

__________
Your email has been directed to my attention for reply, I am sorry to
hear of the problems you are having. Les I would like you to contact
Quality/Sonnx Service in Winnipeg at 953-0110 and have them come out and look
and listen to your set. It is possible the color wheel may be causing
excessive noise but I need them to determine this. Indeed your decible
readings if accurate indicate excessive noise.
__________

Another post indicated that my measured noise levels might have been inflated by the rush of air by the microphone of the SPL meter. So it will be interesting to see what happens. One thing though, the Panasonic reply did not answer my question regarding possible quality control problems on noise.

Originally posted by eXcentris
darkandlong, I'm using component because I plan to use HD tv on HDMI. I have quality component cables and, after reading Topp Robertson's post, I have my player set to 720p (see his comments on 1080i). I haven't noticed any black macroblocking but I have noticed the occasional rainbow.

jdavis37, the depth of the base is 11 1/2"

Hrmmm... You haven't noticed any black macroblocking at all? maybe 720p is the way to go then... Man on Fire was really really bad on 1080i.

eXcentris... thanks for the depth information :) Will help make this TV shuffle, home theater re hook up ordeal alittle easier :))

eXcentris, I'm interested to hear what picture settings you are running.

I see the black macroblocking all over with the LG DVD player. Just watched Twisted and The Punisher, and it was definitely noticeable in both 720p and 1080i. More so in Twisted... Punisher looked a lot better in overall PQ, probably a better job of mastering the DVD?

I know I'm going to need to tweak the settings a bit, since I don't want to shell out for a $1500+ DVD player with HD DVD on the horizon.

Originally posted by darkandlong
eXcentris, I'm interested to hear what picture settings you are running.

I see the black macroblocking all over with the LG DVD player. Just watched Twisted and The Punisher, and it was definitely noticeable in both 720p and 1080i. More so in Twisted... Punisher looked a lot better in overall PQ, probably a better job of mastering the DVD?

I know I'm going to need to tweak the settings a bit, since I don't want to shell out for a $1500+ DVD player with HD DVD on the horizon.

Well as I said I haven't run DVE yet (will do this weekend) so for the time being I use the cinema mode with the settings suggested by Topp Robertson from his calibration. I haven't seen black macroblocking but then again I'm not sure what it is or what the heck I'm supposed to see. :)
And since the native resolution of the Panny is 720p, it doesn't make sense to set the LG (Zenith) to up convert to 1080i because the tv will down convert to 720p anyway. So you really have two choices, either you leave the LG at 480p and let the tv up convert to 720p or you set the LG to 720p and pass that to the tv. All depends on which piece of hardware has the better scaler. Makes me think that an up converting player isn't required with the Panny at all though...

One thing I know is that the LG sucks with interlaced material though. I watch a lot of Asian R3 films and most of those are interlaced transfers and I see all sorts of rainbows, motion jitter, etc... I wonder if there is a setting on the LG that would "fix" this problem, i.e. one that would handle interlaced material better. Maybe I should read the manual. :)

Finally managed to connect my PC to the panny.

I noticed a problem with the my set.
About 2 - 3 inches of screen on right side(top to bottom), seems to loose focus a bit. The text in that area seems to be a bit blury. It is difficult to see this problem with an image. But with text, it can be easily seen.
The left side of the screen seems to be fine.

Has anyone seen this problem ? Is this normal ? Guys please advice.
Thanks,
J

Originally posted by eXcentris
Well as I said I haven't run DVE yet (will do this weekend) so for the time being I use the cinema mode with the settings suggested by Topp Robertson from his calibration. I haven't seen black macroblocking but then again I'm not sure what it is or what the heck I'm supposed to see. :)
And since the native resolution of the Panny is 720p, it doesn't make sense to set the LG (Zenith) to up convert to 1080i because the tv will down convert to 720p anyway. So you really have two choices, either you leave the LG at 480p and let the tv up convert to 720p or you set the LG to 720p and pass that to the tv. All depends on which piece of hardware has the better scaler. Makes me think that an up converting player isn't required with the Panny at all though...

One thing I know is that the LG sucks with interlaced material though. I watch a lot of Asian R3 films and most of those are interlaced transfers and I see all sorts of rainbows, motion jitter, etc... I wonder if there is a setting on the LG that would "fix" this problem, i.e. one that would handle interlaced material better. Maybe I should read the manual. :)

The artifcating is really noticeable in dark scenes or in blacks. In well mastered movie (ie the Star Wars trilogy) I only noticed it off and on in some scenes and very rarely. A good part to look is in Return of the Jedi, when Vader, Luke and the Emperor are hangin out... Look at their clothing, and you may see it depending on your brightness.

Some examples I've noticed in the movies I've recently watched:

Taking Lives: When Jolie and her partner enter the suspect's apartment, their coats and the front door have washed out artifacting in the blacks.

Man on Fire: When Denzel makes his late night cell phone call to Walken, the blacks and contrast in the trees is just bad.

Twisted: When Judd returns home in chapter 3-4 you notice it when she goes to her dark closet to see a picture of her mother

The Punisher: Not that bad, actually. Had a hard time noticing it. Look at any blacks and you might see it.

Bright scenes like the intro to DVE looks amazing but the dark scenes in some movies really disappoint me.

This thread has grown quite long! In recent posts I've been reading about macro issues and wanted to ask if this is an issue with the Panny set , or with the DVI enabled DVD players being discussed? I was assuming it was more an issue with the dvi based dvd players but wanted to make sure. Seems there are many similar posts in the dvd player section. Since I'm planning on staying component for a while ( have a decent low end Pioneer Elite player ) it wont be an issue for me unless it is a Panny issue in general. I'm not going to do any dvd player upgrades until HD DVD either materializes or dies officially on the vine. Thx

darkandlong, I own none of the movies you mention so I can't make a comparison. :)

However, I have watched Alien 4, X-Men 2 and Terminator 3 which all have pretty dark scenes and I haven't noticed this black macroblocking you mention. I'll try to keep an eye for it. Or if you can find an example in a movie we both own, I can try to compare.

Good Lord you folks in the RPTV forum can churn out mega-threads like nobody's business.

Just dropping in to say: I've tested the new Panny DLP a couple times with HD, DVD and cable signals and I think it's a superb display. Rich, sharp, detailed, smooth. Just great.

Cable channels were pretty much excruciating to watch, but that's par for the course with most DLPs I've checked out. And it's too bad for me that I still see rainbows on these things, including the Panny. But overall, each time I enter a store and the Panny DLP is playing I find myself gravitating toward it.

Originally posted by eXcentris
Well as I said I haven't run DVE yet (will do this weekend) so for the time being I use the cinema mode with the settings suggested by Topp Robertson from his calibration.

I have done a DVE calibration and my settings were amazingly close to Topp's (within 1 or so of each setting). I'd say for those without DVE can use Topp's numbers with faith the display quality is at or near it's best.

If you want to put your TV to the test throw in copy of "Master and Commander" one of the darkest opening scenes ever...

wooot!

I caved and bought the PT50DL54 today. Having it delivered on Oct 13th (wednesday) along with a few new couches :)

Can a few owners please post a few pics of their setup? I need to find a stand for my panny between now and wednesday. I'm thinknig of going to Costco to see what they have...

Also, If someone would be so kind to just measure the "BASE" of the panny so i know how wide an area i need for my stand? thanks!

Excentris: what cables are you using for DVD and XBOX? Monster Components? what model? I need to pick these suckers up too!

Anyone else feel free to chip in and recommend good cables for my xbox and dvd player hookups.

thanks!

Originally posted by salukis
I have done a DVE calibration and my settings were amazingly close to Topp's (within 1 or so of each setting). I'd say for those without DVE can use Topp's numbers with faith the display quality is at or near it's best.

I can vouch for that. I just did mine and got the same results (+ or - 1) for each setting.

I need to buy the advanced A/V pack for the Xbox so I'm still using S-Video for now. For component cables, I just go to my favorite HT store and have them make them (they buy rolls of all sorts of cables) to the length I need. Cheaper and as good if not better than Monster.

Future Shop and other B&M carry a stand that specifically fits this tv. It sells for about $300-$350. That's the one I bought.

VIZUAL,

My set should bed elivered next week and it will be afew months in all likelihood before I finish my custom built cabinet ( is in it's final design stages and heading for procurement of the wood, screens, etc ). I'll post apicture of the final product. However, I needed an inexpensive stand option in the meantime but wanted something that would pass the gf test, and still actually be functional. I spent approx $90 at Home Depot/Lowes ( not adding in the gas money I spent from making about 12 trips lol ). It is avery simple but clean design and I can email a ppicture if you want. And it does not require any skills to make other than what you learne din Kindergarten, and some very basic wood cuts ( like cutting a 24 inch board down to 22 15/16, and so on ) It looks almost good enough to become a permanent solution, and hides some of the home theater wiring and components. Plus, it's sturdy enough for me to stand on!

The base dimensions are mentioned already in this thread. I think someone said the width of the base is somewhere around 41 inches wide and is 11.5 inches deep, but I am using memory so please read through this thread to find the dimensions! Good luck :)

Originally posted by jdavis37
VIZUAL,

My set should bed elivered next week and it will be afew months in all likelihood before I finish my custom built cabinet ( is in it's final design stages and heading for procurement of the wood, screens, etc ). I'll post apicture of the final product. However, I needed an inexpensive stand option in the meantime but wanted something that would pass the gf test, and still actually be functional. I spent approx $90 at Home Depot/Lowes ( not adding in the gas money I spent from making about 12 trips lol ). It is avery simple but clean design and I can email a ppicture if you want. And it does not require any skills to make other than what you learne din Kindergarten, and some very basic wood cuts ( like cutting a 24 inch board down to 22 15/16, and so on ) It looks almost good enough to become a permanent solution, and hides some of the home theater wiring and components. Plus, it's sturdy enough for me to stand on!

The base dimensions are mentioned already in this thread. I think someone said the width of the base is somewhere around 41 inches wide and is 11.5 inches deep, but I am using memory so please read through this thread to find the dimensions! Good luck :)

jDavis, I'd love an email with the photo of your set and possibly instructions of how you went about it? I'll probably be making a quick trip to Costco tommorow to see if they have anything. If I can save a bunch though on the stand that'd be great. I can't believe Monster Ultar component cables up here cost 299.99$ haha sheesh.

Viz.. will get an email out in next day or so.. have unfinished version complete but making some mior changes.. and will post photo of Panny sitting on top of it as soon as the set arrives!

Rgearding component cables, there are many good on lines places which sell better than Monster cables at a serious discount. Bettercables.com is one such place

http://bettercables.com/componentvideo.html

I have not done any comparisons between average monster component video cables and higher end ones to know how significant the differences are. Im currently running a pair of monsters that I bought via ebay for about $60 for the set.

http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/cables_video.html Again, no experience with their component cables but most of my HT system is Outlaw as well as their optical cables.

http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/component/componentprices.htm

Blue Jean Cables seem to get fairly high praise...

Everything I have listed here is medium priced and should be as good as monster if not better. I do believe better cables does result in better performance. however, I also think there is a point where one has reached diminishing returns.

If you are interested in a higher end company:

http://homegrownaudio.com/digital_component.html

Pricing here is fairly high. I am using some of their Silver Serpent II silver interconnects and have found their cables to be very well made. Would assume these component cables are very well done, even if expensive!

Good luck on the cables :)

Originally posted by eXcentris
darkandlong, I own none of the movies you mention so I can't make a comparison. :)

However, I have watched Alien 4, X-Men 2 and Terminator 3 which all have pretty dark scenes and I haven't noticed this black macroblocking you mention. I'll try to keep an eye for it. Or if you can find an example in a movie we both own, I can try to compare.

I was thinking of tryingh Apocalypse Now: Redux as I know the scenes with Kurtz are dark... Haven't tried it yet though.

I'm trying to think of some really dark scenes. Do you own Heat? I may try the scene where Kilmer and Deniro walk away from the heist when they are being watched by Pacino...

I'll probably try this on Monday, as I do nothing but watch Football on Sundays.

Originally posted by Clear Image
Fan Noise



I just received this reply from Panasonic Canada:

__________
Your email has been directed to my attention for reply, I am sorry to
hear of the problems you are having. Les I would like you to contact
Quality/Sonnx Service in Winnipeg at 953-0110 and have them come out and look
and listen to your set. It is possible the color wheel may be causing
excessive noise but I need them to determine this. Indeed your decible
readings if accurate indicate excessive noise.
__________



When you turn off the set, the fan stays on for about half a mintue, then it shuts off, if the noise disappears, then you likely have a problem with the fan and NOT the colour wheel.

BTW, my in-laws bought the new HITACHI LCD RPTV and my fan is at least 2X as loud as theirs, making me believe that I have a specific case of a defective unit.

Settings

____________________________________________________________
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by salukis
I have done a DVE calibration and my settings were amazingly close to Topp's (within 1 or so of each setting). I'd say for those without DVE can use Topp's numbers with faith the display quality is at or near it's best.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I can vouch for that. I just did mine and got the same results (+ or - 1) for each setting.
____________________________________________________________



Are you guys are talking about the settings for color, tint, brightness, etc.? If so, can you list the settings? I can't find them in previous posts by Topp.

Ok,

So I was in Future Shop today browsing a little for equipment before the arrival of my Panny on Wednesday. First of all, I need to pickup a kick-ass DVD player.

I noticed they stocked Monster HDMI cables for the time (At least first time I've seen them myself). My understanding is there currently is not a single DVD player with HDMI in/out is there?

When are they expected? Is the Panasonic S-97S (i think that's it) going to have HDMI? that probably would be the most ideal dvd player for a panny TV I guess? Or should I just get the LG that eXcentris here is talking about. The fact that the 1080i output w/ the LG is borked with the panny makes me want to hold off on the LG unit.

I've also been eyeing the Pioneer DV-578A-S. Anyone have any experience with it?

If there are HDMI compatible DVD players already out on the market could someone please post a link to one (Marantz? Denon?) so that I can read about it or possibly a link to some reviews? THANKS!

NATIVE DISPLAY
--------------------

One more thing, and pardon my ignorance cause I'm still learning all this hubba bubba tech. stuff regarding TVs..

The PT50DL54 natively displays in 720p (1280x720) right?

So does this make it pointless to get a upconverting/scaling DVD player which does 1080i?! I'm thinking about the Denon 2910 but if my tv will downconvert everything to 720p anyway, what would the point be :)

I would like to take a shot a calibrating one of these puppies. PM me if you are in Sugar Land or close by and would like my help.

Im very interested in picking up this tv.
I would like to know how it handles fast motion, gaming and how fast does it turn on.

Thanx

Originally posted by vizual
The PT50DL54 natively displays in 720p (1280x720) right?

So does this make it pointless to get a upconverting/scaling DVD player which does 1080i?! I'm thinking about the Denon 2910 but if my tv will downconvert everything to 720p anyway, what would the point be :)

Yes, the PT50DL54 is 720p (1280 x 720) native.

Yes it does makes sense to get an upconverting DVD player. The Denon is a great option.

And BTW, contrary to popular belief, 720p is an "upconvert" from 1080i (540p). There is more data in 720p than 1080i. Of course there is more data in 1080p than 720p, but that isn't an issue most people are concerned with (yet.)

Enjoy

From the following web page about DLP they say"

http://www.dlptvreview.com/dlptelevision.html

"Because of the high speed with which the micromirrors on a DMD switch on and off--approximately 50,000 times per second--DLPs display moving images with ease and virtually no motion artifacts or image streaking. Which means that DLP TVs are well suited for gaming."

It's a great set for watching fast action. As for how fast can you turn it on, maybe 20 seconds before you have a picture and a minute before the lamp is at full brilliance.

I love this set!

Originally posted by jpvision
Im very interested in picking up this tv.
I would like to know how it handles fast motion, gaming and how fast does it turn on.

Thanx

This is a great TV, I do not own one, but have spent a LOT of time with it and have been impressed.

No problem with fast motion. Never actually timed it, but I'd estimate 20 seconds to turn on.

thanks for the feedback. im torn between this set and the tosh 52hm84.

Someone mentioned that the glare screen can be removed. Is this true? I haven't seen anything that looks removable on this set.

It was real close...but they lowered the price to within 200 of the panny so I opted for the mitsu.

oh, well. getting a panny dvd player here asap...so all is not lost. =)

tani

did anyone order this tv from amazon.
if so how was the experience.

jpvision.. I'll let you know this week.. my set has arrived in charlotte NC and am expecting a phone call tomorrow to schedule a delivery time. Neat thing is my VISA card has built in extended warranty protection so it will ahve a 2 year warranty versus 1 year, and since Panny covers the bulb for 1 yr, means it will be covered for 2 :) I was a little hesitant to go this route but finally said the price was simply too attractive, and the Panny's picture is just too good! Also, my gut feeling tells me technology overall is changing rapidly, and I really did not want to sink $4K in aset now with so many changes coming down the pipes. Hopefully, later this week I can give you a thumbs up!

Originally posted by jpvision
thanks for the feedback. im torn between this set and the tosh 52hm84.

same decision i had to make.

in the end the picture was slightly more umm, "full" on the panny imo when I compared the two, plus the fact that from what i gather toshiba customer care really stinks from what I gather..

Looking forward to enjoying my panny with the 5yr extended (doesn't inc. bulb but...ahwell)

Originally posted by TheMostToyzWins
Yes, the PT50DL54 is 720p (1280 x 720) native.

Yes it does makes sense to get an upconverting DVD player. The Denon is a great option.

And BTW, contrary to popular belief, 720p is an "upconvert" from 1080i (540p). There is more data in 720p than 1080i. Of course there is more data in 1080p than 720p, but that isn't an issue most people are concerned with (yet.)

Enjoy

Ok, so just to follow up on this...

if 720 is an upconvert from 1080i = 540p (interlaced is the term?)
does this imply that 720p is a better picture than 1080i?

the 'p' after 720 means progressive i guess? (total noob i know haha)

The reason I'm asking is I was under the impression 1080i was the best you could get right now as far as PQ output goes. I've been debating getting the Denon 2910 but if I can save a couple hundred and just get the LG DV7832 which eXcentris has that i'd do that for now.

eXcentris and some others were saying the LG DV7832 has problems w/ the PT50DL54 in 1080i but is picture perfect with 720p!

if 720p is the best rigth now I don't think I'd care and that should hold me over till HD DVD :)

EXCENTRIS :
You have your LG hooked up through component right? I think I'm going to hook my DVD player & XBOX through component and save Cable TV for HDMI.

Originally posted by Clear Image

Are you guys are talking about the settings for color, tint, brightness, etc.? If so, can you list the settings? I can't find them in previous posts by Topp.

Topp Robertson's settings are on page 22.

Mine are:

Color: 25
Tint: 28
Brightness: 24
Picture: 59
Sharpness: 0

This is for Cinema Mode using component 1.

Originally posted by vizual

EXCENTRIS :
You have your LG hooked up through component right? I think I'm going to hook my DVD player & XBOX through component and save Cable TV for HDMI.

Yup! And I plan to hookup Xbox on component and HD box on HDMI.

My only problem with this set so far is that I do see the occasional rainbow when watching movies. I don't see them at all when I watch tv. Maybe because I keep the image in 4:3 format for tv, who knows.

Here's a pic I took with my crappy digital camera. The stand is made by Techcraft specifically for this tv. Forget about the DVD player on the ground, I was just experimenting. :)

Tech Craft actually makes 2 stands for these Panasonic TV's they are shown on the LCD TV sets and stated as stands for the LCD models but the pt50dl54 uses the same case as the LCD set. Anyway be careful when ordering the tech craft stand. The color that matches the 2004 DLP set's is the Tech Craft PLC5464(2004 color) and NOT the PLC5060(2003 color)otherwise they are exactly the same stand. The new one cost more of course ;-)

Here is a picture of my setup. I cant say enough good things about this TV. I love it for SD, HD, DVD, and XBOX. I really cant find any faults with it.


Has anyone hooked up a DVD player via HDMI to this set. If so, do you get audio out of the TV. I cant get audio when watching an HD channel if I am only hooked up by HDMI from my TIVO. Others have told me that the TV cant handle the DD soundtrack but I do not think that should be the case.

So here's my decided purchases to accomodate my PT50DL54 tommorow:

TV STAND
------------

Many here recommended the PLC5464 TechCraft. Will look for it but I don't see it listed on the Future Shop website. The Canada FS website recommends the TechCraft PTV48 as the matching stand for the Panny. WTF?!

If I can't find the PLC5464 TechCraft matching stand I'm leaning toward the TechCraft PTV58 60" Stand located here: Stand (http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?logon=&langid=EN&dept=2&WLBS=fsweb17&sku_id=0770HDS0010032964&catid=11008&newdeptid=2)

DVD Player
-------------

LG DV7832NXC

Making sure it is Feb/Mar 2004 or Oct/Nov 2003 build so that I get the 720p / 1080i support over component.

DVD Cables
--------------

Video:

Monster THX Ultra Series 1000 (1 metre) Component Video Cables

I want the best picture possible through video and I'm really too lazy
to go out getting custom cables built. So this is what I'm gonna get :)

Audio:

I'm really torn here between two:

a) Monster THX Ultra Series 800 (1 metre) Composite Audio Interconnects
b) Monster Composite THX I100-8 Audio Interconnect

The price difference is about one hundred dollars between (a) & (b).
Considering that for the time being I don't even have a proper A/V Receiver
or audio speaker setup, and that I plan on using the native television speakers I think I might go with (b) for the cheap $50 audio cables.
Anyone agree here? I mean when I upgrade my audio system, then I'll
upgrade my cables too. Just doesn't seem worthwhile to get expensive
composite audio cables if you're using the default television speakers?

GAMING
----------

Monster GameLink 400 X (3m) Component Video with Analog Audio

For my XBOX...should be swiss.


ahwell...thoughts? Would be interesting to hear thoughts on my cable selections as like I said, I'm new to all this stuff but loving every minute of it! :p

Originally posted by vizual
Ok, so just to follow up on this...

if 720 is an upconvert from 1080i = 540p (interlaced is the term?)

does this imply that 720p is a better picture than 1080i?

the 'p' after 720 means progressive i guess? (total noob i know haha)
Yes, p=progressive and i=interlaced. There has been a LOT of debate over what is a "better" picture (1080i vs 720p) and it comes down to "beauty is in the eye of the beholder". However, ABC, FOX, ESPN have spent a lot of money, published many papers and decided that the more expensive 720p was the best investment for them. That said, others (non-sports promoting) like CBS, NBC, have opted for 1080i (less expensive equipment.)

It is a fact that this TV is 720p native and will display the best picture with a 720p input.

HDNet Facts
HDNet is the first national television network broadcasting all of its programming in 1080i HD, the highest-quality format of high-definition television (HDTV).
I Thought 1080i is best ,Takes more computer power to render I know that.I know HDNET has a better picture then ABC.

Originally posted by jojo57
HDNet Facts
HDNet is the first national television network broadcasting all of its programming in 1080i HD, the highest-quality format of high-definition television (HDTV).
I Thought 1080i is best ,Takes more computer power to render I know that.I know HDNET has a better picture then ABC.

What my n00b knowledge tells me is that 'p' progressive scan means double the scan lines...

so while the resolution might be greater with 1080i (1920x1080i?)

720p is infact 1440 (double the scan lines?) beats me how it really works. haha

Anyone notice SSE (silk screen effect) on their set? I see this on scenes with white background. It can be described as:

"Silk Screen" or "Panty Hose" effect. When looking at bright scenes (white background, shots of the sky) it looks as if there is a piece of nylon stretched over the screen. Also can be described as grainy aspect or as a swarm of mosquitoes.

Viz,

Your cable questions can probably be better answered in the home thater section since you will get a wider range of specific knowledge and opinions. There is a great deal of differing opinions about cables, and whether or not they actually make a true difference, so be prepared for that aspect. I perosnally think cables do make a difference. That said, I'm not convinced high end cables are that sigificantly different from one another, but it also depends on the equipment. I bought Homegrown Audio Silver Serpent II interconnects. Silver is known to slightly favor the mids and highs ( is why some cables are mad eusing both silver and copper ). For my system, it worked well because my KEF reference speakers tend to be very laid back andneutral sounding. The silver livened them up just a hair.

I noticed you have picked monster cables in general. I think there are other options via the internet which afford similar quality at lower prices, and you may be able to save some money. And you don't have to have custom made cables. While I have never bought from them, Bluejeancables.com seems to have a good reputation for making quality cables at a lower than monster price. If you are happy with monster and don' tmind paying the price ( I beleive for same price you can get a higher quality cable on line ), then I feel certain you will be happy with your choices. Most decent quality cables perform well enough. It all depends on how anal you want to be about it. As long as you are not buying junk and assuming you do not have a super critical eye/ear ( and aren't looking for problems all the time ), and given there will be no reference point for an A/B comparison, I don't think it wil matter greatly which cables you buy in that price range. Good luck :)

PS And enjoy your Panny! Mine is due to arrive on Wed the 12th... can't wait :)

Folks, please post more pics of your setup...TV/Stand/PQ

Thanks

eXcentris

What is the build date on your LG DVD player?

I picked one up today that is February 2004 which I think still has the fully compatible 720p/1080i output through component.


As well, when I went into this store to buy the player. It was the first store I've seen that actually had the REAL matching stand by panasonic for this TV..

I asked for the price and it was about 3 figures starting with an 8 (CAN)
That's ridiculous for a stand. jesus. heh

Originally posted by dangerfish

Has anyone hooked up a DVD player via HDMI to this set. If so, do you get audio out of the TV. I cant get audio when watching an HD channel if I am only hooked up by HDMI from my TIVO. Others have told me that the TV cant handle the DD soundtrack but I do not think that should be the case.

If I set my HDTivo to stereo/PCM output on HDMI then sound does come from the TV through HDMI. Unfortunately you also lose the TIVO's Dolby Digital out through the optical output (to my reciever) when you do this. If you set the TIVO to play and record Dolby Digital, then no sound through HDMI to the TV (not sure if this is the fault of the TV or the TIVO). My solution is to run an analog stereo cable from the HDTivo to the TV, and set the TV to recieve analog audio inputs when HDMI is selected (its in the setup menu somewhere). Then, I keep the HDTIvo set to output Dolby Digital. The Tivo sends digital audio to my reciever, and simultaneous analog audio to the TV. Then I can use the TV without the receiver when I want to (or when my wife wants to) and I keep the DD signal active to my reciever.

Ben

Vizual, my LG also has the Feb 2004 build date so you'll be fine.

Question,
Can you use your VCR to record in HDMI, I realize it won't be HD. If not, do I have to use TV to record.
thanks
Caboman

Does anyone know, about Dish HD Channels. Do they use 1080i or 720p.
I have noticed that using 1080i output from Dish HD 811 receiver gives me a much sharper and absolutely stunning picture than 720p output setting.

I assume that Dish Receiver is doing a lousy job converting 1080i to 720p. Whereas the PT50DL54 is doing a much better job in taking the original 1080i from HD Receiver and converting to 720p.

Any comments?

yeh i've noticed that as well in my store
the pannys converter is much better than our samsung hd receiver and that of the hd tivo as well....i'd keep it set as outputting whatever the native resolution is and let the panny do the rest

Hello, can anyone tell me a little more on how the xbox plays and looks on this set? Is there any delay that you have noticed? How is the picture quality? And if possible please show a few pics if you have them. I cant decide on this set or a front projector. THANKS and later

Originally posted by 440forpower
Hello, can anyone tell me a little more on how the xbox plays and looks on this set? Is there any delay that you have noticed? How is the picture quality? And if possible please show a few pics if you have them. I cant decide on this set or a front projector. THANKS and later

I'll post a few tommorow or Thursday. My set should be arriving tommorow and I ran around today buying my DVD player and proper cables for it, and
my XBOX.

Heck, I've already got a FIFA 2005 launch party planned for Thursday evening..Maybe I'll take some shots of that for you!


On a side note, I bought the LG DV7832 NXC today. It's a February build so I still have the great component upconversion.

I find it ridiculous though that the price of my component cables + audio interconnect cables, JUST for my DVD player, cost more than the DVD player itself. Given I went out and bought the top of the line monster THX Ultra 1000 video and 800 Ultra Audio cables, but still...

seriously..cables more than the dvd player. that's just weird in hindsight right now :)

Does anyone use, and is it recommend to buy, a really good surge protector for this equipment (DLP TV + DVD + XBOX)?

I have a regular run-of-the-mill surge protector lieing around which I was going to use. I laughed today though when I was looking to buy my cables and the sales guy at FS is trying to sell me this Monster super-d00per surge protector for 150$...

Originally posted by av_freeman
Does anyone know, about Dish HD Channels. Do they use 1080i or 720p.
I have noticed that using 1080i output from Dish HD 811 receiver gives me a much sharper and absolutely stunning picture than 720p output setting.

I assume that Dish Receiver is doing a lousy job converting 1080i to 720p. Whereas the PT50DL54 is doing a much better job in taking the original 1080i from HD Receiver and converting to 720p.

Any comments?

I also felt the same with my cable box. So I pass the signal natively from my cable box to the tv, and let tv take care of the signal. This is also giving me the best picture.


J

Anyone using the new Pany in a setting where it is positioned above eye level? I am evaluating TVs to fit in a space above the fireplace. I almost bought the Samsung 50" DLP but a CC rep warned me about having to look up causes the screen to look a lot darker.

I posted this question in the wrong place but...
At a B&M I was quoted a price on the panny for around $3100 with free delivery plus a 5 year extended warrenty thrown in. (Doesnt include the lamp though.) Does this sound like a good deal?
Thanks, I'm a noob, first post.

Rob

Originally posted by dingJam
If I set my HDTivo to stereo/PCM output on HDMI then sound does come from the TV through HDMI. Unfortunately you also lose the TIVO's Dolby Digital out through the optical output (to my reciever) when you do this. If you set the TIVO to play and record Dolby Digital, then no sound through HDMI to the TV (not sure if this is the fault of the TV or the TIVO). My solution is to run an analog stereo cable from the HDTivo to the TV, and set the TV to recieve analog audio inputs when HDMI is selected (its in the setup menu somewhere). Then, I keep the HDTIvo set to output Dolby Digital. The Tivo sends digital audio to my reciever, and simultaneous analog audio to the TV. Then I can use the TV without the receiver when I want to (or when my wife wants to) and I keep the DD signal active to my reciever.

Ben

I have discovered the same thing although I am able to get audio from SD channels via HDMI thru the TV, just not HD channels. It is my belief that this is a problem with the TIVO and the only way I can think to test it is to get a DVD player with HDMI and see if it passes the audio. Panasonic tells me that the TV should have no promblem playing audio via HDMI thru the TV no matter what the source.

Originally posted by gtadell
Anyone using the new Pany in a setting where it is positioned above eye level? I am evaluating TVs to fit in a space above the fireplace. I almost bought the Samsung 50" DLP but a CC rep warned me about having to look up causes the screen to look a lot darker.

When I first got my TV, I had to put it on top of my old entertainment center which was 52 inches tall. So the bottom of the screen was about 5 ft up in the air. I thought the picture looked great. Did not seem too dark to me.

Originally posted by rmerm1
I posted this question in the wrong place but...
At a B&M I was quoted a price on the panny for around $3100 with free delivery plus a 5 year extended warrenty thrown in. (Doesnt include the lamp though.) Does this sound like a good deal?
Thanks, I'm a noob, first post.

Rob

In a word, no. You can get this set around $2800 delivered and no tax. Search it on the internet. I don't know how much the extended warranty is worth. Is there tax on the $3100?

First - I would like to thank everyone that is a member of AVS for all the great information and advice.

440forpower - with regards to your question regarding xbox game on the Panny. I had been waiting for the AE-700 and had planned on an 92" screen until I saw the new 60" panny. I have had it now for three weeks and the picture is stunning! I prefered PC games over the xbox because of the better graphics and clarity on the crt monitor. However, xbox in high definition and blown up to 60" - lets just say PC is getting dusty!! With the xbox HD pack through component, 480p and higher games look amazing!! Even DVD through the xbox looks great! Although I plan on picking up an HDMI DVD player by year end.

Blacks are black, picture is true. SD through digital box is decent, but I find myself sticking to the 7HD channels. HD programmed shows like CSI, Las Vegas and NFL justify the additional $30 for the 7 HD channels. HD as it has been said often in this forum is WOW!

My advice, if you can afford it, 60" is definately sweeter then the 50", and the picture quality and multiple component jacks will make you forget about projectors.....at least for a little while.

Fan noise is noticable in a quiet room, but is no louder the the xbox hard drive or cable box fan. You will never notice it while watching a movie or playing games.

:cool:

Originally posted by Red Dwarf
In a word, no. You can get this set around $2800 delivered and no tax. Search it on the internet. I don't know how much the extended warranty is worth. Is there tax on the $3100?

yes there is tax added on. Comparing the warrenty Magnolia would charge $400 for 4 years including lamp. Is the general consensus that B&M might have less negative consequences if there was a problem. Otherwise I'd love to save the additional $

Originally posted by Red Dwarf
In a word, no. You can get this set around $2800 delivered and no tax. Search it on the internet. I don't know how much the extended warranty is worth. Is there tax on the $3100?

extended warranty here in CAN cost me 500 for a 5yr premium extended.
so that works about about right I think? 300 U.S for the 5 yr?

Originally posted by Tub-n-it
Blacks are black, picture is true. SD through digital box is decent, but I find myself sticking to the 7HD channels. HD programmed shows like CSI, Las Vegas and NFL justify the additional $30 for the 7 HD channels. HD as it has been said often in this forum is WOW!

Noticed you are in Toronto?

Rogers offers more than 7 HD channels don't they? HD Programming is a different story I suppose.

Does the Rogers HD Cable Box support HDMI? Or do you need a HDMI -> DVI Converter?

Originally posted by rmerm1
yes there is tax added on. Comparing the warrenty Magnolia would charge $400 for 4 years including lamp. Is the general consensus that B&M might have less negative consequences if there was a problem. Otherwise I'd love to save the additional $

What percentage here buy from b&m vs internet? What is satisfaction rate from internet purchase?

Visual - I actually live just outside Toronto. But I thought I would use the city everyone recognizes since the AVS forum is global.

My cable supplier is Cogeco and unfortunately they do not have as many HD channels as Rogers. Cable box supports DVI, not HDMI but I am currently running the cable box through component keeping the HDMI free for a new DVD player.

HD programming picture is so nice I find myself watching all the PBS HD shows just so I don't have to watch SD tv. If that new US satellite ZoomHD was available in Canada, cable would be bye-bye. If I could drop the 100 plus SD channels and just pay for the 7 HD channels I would.

For anyone sitting on the fence - 60" DLP Panny and good High Definition feed - simple amazing!!

Originally posted by gtadell
Anyone using the new Pany in a setting where it is positioned above eye level? I am evaluating TVs to fit in a space above the fireplace. I almost bought the Samsung 50" DLP but a CC rep warned me about having to look up causes the screen to look a lot darker.
The salesman is right, you have to have it eye level or else the brightness declines pretty quick. So unless you tilt it in such a way that the screen surface is perpendicular to the eye axis, a DLP would not be the best choice in your case.

TODAY IS A GOOD DAY!

:D :p :D

LOL Viz, welcome to the Panny owners club :)

Are you an English Scrote? I think I can call you that as this is an old Welsh Tosser speaking . . . :)

Originally posted by zeeeter
LOL Viz, welcome to the Panny owners club :)

Are you an English Scrote? I think I can call you that as this is an old Welsh Tosser speaking . . . :)

Thanks! It's a priviledge to join the family!

Sorry, no I'm not an English punter. The flag was only there for World Cup qualifying last weekend. As my native homeland, Estonia, has a slim if not nill chance of qualifying ever. On the global scale then I support the English, as well as being a diehard EPL fan.

To All:

What is out of the box calibration like on the 50DL54? Will I need to make quite a few adjustments to get the best quality picture or is it pretty decent right out of the box normally?

read back through the posts - lots on calibration - most find that the cinema setting is dead on - perhaps toning down the sharpness to your liking.

"Sorry, no I'm not an English punter. The flag was only there for World Cup qualifying last weekend. As my native homeland, Estonia, has a slim if not nill chance of qualifying ever. On the global scale then I support the English, as well as being a diehard EPL fan."

Funny - off topic (sorry guys) but being Welsh I historically support two teams at any sport - Wales, and whoever is playing England.

:)

Saddly, I think I'm going to have to give the Panny the boot and go with LCD. :( I see (not often) rainbows when I watch movies and I thought I could tolerate them but they are getting more and more annoying. In fact they've gotten into my head! I sit down to watch a movie and have to keep telling myself "keep still, don't move your head, what? was that a rainbow?" which of course doesn't make the movie watching experience very pleasant... I'm going to keep experimenting with room lighting, seating position, etc. until friday and make a decision then. Too bad because I love this set! And considering the number of hours or reading I've done before I purchased the Panny, I don't especially look forward to having to start the process all over again to select an LCD set. :(

We've been waiting for the 60" to come out, but based on several websites, it looks like it won't be available in the US until 2005. Some websites are simply out of stock or taking preorders, but a couple actually say "SHIPMENTS DELAYED RELEASE IN 2005". TVAuthority says they no longer offer it.

I don't understand why they aren't releasing it to the US until 2005 when they are widely available in Canada. Too bad we can't get one from Canada, but the lack of any warranty is just too much of a risk.

Time to review the other options. Maybe the 725 or 825 series Mitsubishi will be out soon, and the glare problem is fixed.

Originally posted by vizual
TODAY IS A GOOD DAY!

:D :p :D

wow, a snapshot into the future :D

(pic date, Oct 14?)

enjoy the tv, hopefully i'll be able to join the boat soon :)

eXc.

I hope whatever decision you reach works well for you. I'm ignoring the rainbow issue entirely and am training my brain to forget I ever heard of it lol My set is due to arrive at any minute and it is a non returnable purchase so I"d better like it lol

But, if we start to look for problems, we will find them. LCD's ahve their issues as well, one of which does bother me and that is the black level. I think the Hitachi 810 looks very good overall but side by side against a Kirk Samsung, it still had less black/shadow detail to my eyes. But, it does have a very pleasing picture quality overall, and it may be that you can find a LCD that works great for you. Or maybe you will forget to keep looking for rainbows and learn to love your Panny DLP all over again :)

Originally posted by eXcentris
Saddly, I think I'm going to have to give the Panny the boot and go with LCD. :( I see (not often) rainbows when I watch movies and I thought I could tolerate them but they are getting more and more annoying. In fact they've gotten into my head! I sit down to watch a movie and have to keep telling myself "keep still, don't move your head, what? was that a rainbow?" which of course doesn't make the movie watching experience very pleasant... I'm going to keep experimenting with room lighting, seating position, etc. until friday and make a decision then. Too bad because I love this set! And considering the number of hours or reading I've done before I purchased the Panny, I don't especially look forward to having to start the process all over again to select an LCD set. :(

If it's not often that you see them, as you say, I really can't understand why you'd swap them. Your panny is still fairly new. Don't make any rash decisions. Hopefully your brain will adjust to not thinking about it.

LCD is the *LAST* of the newer technologies i'd go with right now. In fact, if (and it's highly unlikely) i end up returning my Panny i'd go with a CRT before an LCD i think.

Thanks guys, weird thing is I almost never see rainbows when I watch tv but I do when I watch movies on DVD. Maybe because I watch tv in 4:3 mode, or maybe because I have lights on when I watch tv but I watch movies completely in the dark. I also watched 2-3 movies before I got my stand so the tv was on the floor and I didn't notice any rainbows. Anyway, I still have about 10 days to make my decision so I'm going to keep experimenting with seating position, lighting, etc...

Originally posted by vizual


LCD is the *LAST* of the newer technologies i'd go with right now. In fact, if (and it's highly unlikely) i end up returning my Panny i'd go with a CRT before an LCD i think.

Look at both the LCD Panny and the DPL side by side. The DLP kicks it's butt. The picture is sharper and the colors are better. IMHO DLP isn't such a "risky" technology. Your mileage may vary. :D

I thought the 8 color wheel was supposed to reduce rainbows by a lot.

Originally posted by vizual
TODAY IS A GOOD DAY!

:D :p :D

Ah yes brings a tear to my eye - I still remember the day I brought my baby through the door - the slim box, lightweight - the oos and the aahs from the family - excuse me while I get a tissue...

he he he - great set - nothing but sweet pictures and great nights watching movies

Originally posted by abarsami
I thought the 8 color wheel was supposed to reduce rainbows by a lot.

me no see no rainbows

Originally posted by jpvision
did anyone order this tv from amazon.
if so how was the experience.

My first order was cancelled due to very low price @ amazon. The second amazon order went through fine. Monster DLP TV arrived within seven days of order. Very fast shipping by Vanns at resonable price.

Here is for someone's earlier question regarding Panny DLP & DN 811 HD receiver:

The picture looks great on Panny - 811 HD receiver using component cables came with 811 box. I haven't had chance to play with DVI interface yet.

Originally posted by 440forpower
Hello, can anyone tell me a little more on how the xbox plays and looks on this set? Is there any delay that you have noticed? How is the picture quality? And if possible please show a few pics if you have them. I cant decide on this set or a front projector. THANKS and later

I have Panny DLP hooked up with XBOX using microsoft HDTV kit. The regular non HDTV nicklodian game looks good with rich colors and other non hdtv racing and demo xbox games look great. The DVD movie in 16x9 ratio looks great. I am shopping around for 720p HDTV xbox game. I am sure it will be super. I will post more pictures.

wow jagman that pic looks awesome.

Hi.

I am trying to hook up my PC to this TV... I got a DVI -> HDMI cable the picture shows up at 1280x720 but the top/bottom and left/right are cut off... this doesn't happen when I watch TV just when I hook up my PC. I installed powerstrip and tried to use the 1200x675 resolution but that doesn't change anything but make the picture blurry.

Help? Thanks.

First Impressions:

Watched GLADIATOR - Batle Of Carthage scene on DVD

Looked pretty good. This was before I discovered the CINEMA mode of the TV. Was watching on VIVID.

Played XBOX FIFA 2005 and looked good as well...

My main quam is though, coming from a 20" that I've been using since university (since I didn't watch that much telly in the first place) I'm not as impressed as I thought I would be. I was expecting to be blown out of the water, which I'm not entirely. Right now I just have that, "Oh ok, it's 50" compared to my old 20". Ofcourse it will look bigger and lively mood."

Bear in mind this is FIRST FIRST FIRST impressions straight out of the box with VIVID set as my viewing mode. CINEMA does look significantly better.

This has been asked numerous times but is there a way to tell exactly what the TV is outputting? I mean I have the LG set to 720p through component but I want to know if the TV is actually showing it as 720p as well?

With my XBOX connection through components using MONSTER XBOX Component Cables, the heads and such are still a little jagged.. I expect perfectly nurbed heads and everything in 480p XBOX. :)

As well, I made sure I set my xbox video settings to accept high definition signals, but even during kickoff in FIFA 2005 certain player names seem a little blurry when seeing their jersey back. Is this just because my eyes have not adjusted fully to DLP? :)

Anyway, I need to experiment more with settings. Still need to figure out how to save settings for a specific input. This is possible right?

As well, is there a way to specifically tell whether XBOX is playing in HD 480p? I guess that goes back to asking is there a way to tell what the television is outputting?

Thanks everyone! Will post some pics tommorow when I get home from work.

My only concern right now delaying me from buying this tv is: no memory based inputs.

Seems like cinema mode is the best.

But if I have dvd, sd, xbox - I can't use cinema mode for all (unless I adjust the brightness each time) ... on my current tv xbox games need more brightness. Dvd need less brightness and sd needs even less brightness. Based on my preference.

Short note for now.. my Panny arrived early this monring.. did the Amazon deal for those who want more details please PM due to the rules of the forum.. no problems, and the carrier brought my set upstairs for me, etc. Out of box, it's great. I'm very happy thus far and will post a pic in the next couple days as I have to run for now. Add 1 more happy Panny DLP owner to the bunch!

I got my Panny DLP 50" last Saturday.

First thing I could connect to it was the XBOX. I tried Ninja Gaiden at first. Very nice picture. Only problem is when there is a camera pan (like looking around in first-person view): this results in posterization of the picture, which is not very nice. I understand that all DLPs have this problem. I wish one will come with an explanation for this, as I can't figure why this happens. Silent Hill 4 is not very impressive, but I see it doesn't even support 480p (go figure...). Image and sound have no sync problem so far when playing games. Thumbs up for playing XBOX games.

Second, I connected my non-progressive scan old DVD player. I watched Toy Story, it was very good. Tried Gosford Park, it wasn't very good. I suspect the DVD is right, but I would need a better DVD player and a bit of tuning the picture. I'm looking for a progressive scan DVD player at this point before commenting further. Consumer Reports rates the Panasonic S47 pretty well.

Third, I got the HD receiver yesterday morning from my cable company. On PBS, there is a documentary which is wide-screen format, so I assume it must be HD? Really not impressed by the picture. I realize there is a lot of compression going on in there (all the little squares all over the place). I'm thinking "is it what HD is?"... I decide to wait for the evening to see the shows that I know for sure are HDs (NBC, CBS, ABC, FOX, Movie Network, etc). Now I was pleased, very nice, the compression wasn't to the point of defeating HD most of the time.

Next step is to hook up my HTPC in order to play PC games on it (Uru, Myst, Syberia, ect.) I'm waiting for the parts to arrive and will comment on this, should be one month from now.

Although I'm still in the process of hooking the Panny with better components (DVD player) and fine tuning it to optimize the picture, I'm very please with it at this point.

The fan is not silent, but not noisy. My XBOX is more noisy. But I think it could bother me watching a movie during quiet scene. I heard the Toshiba has a very silent fan. I plan on making a custom cabinet for this TV, I guess I will design it in such a way to dampen the noise of the fan.

I'm worried about the vent where the air is pulled in. I don't see any sort of filter, so it will end up pulling dirt and fur (we have a dog that sheds a lot) in it... I will have to try to figure something for that. I bought this TV for the long run, I usually keeps my TVs for at least 5 years.

I see rainbow once in a while. But when I really watch the content, I realize rainbows are non-issue. Of course if I look actively for them, I can easily find then whenever there is a contrasted white spot over a dark area. But when I'm in front of the TV is to enjoy the content, not to roll eyes in all directions while blinking.

The posterization with camera pan is the thing to be addressed in my mind, not the rainbows. But I can live with this, other technologies available have issues that I personally could not deal with compared to what DLP offers.

Cheers, Ray.

Could someone please post a screenshot of what the SERVICE MENU looks like?

I do not have a DVE Calibration DVD and I figure I need to make my adjustments using Topps settings earlier. I'm just a tad paranoid of going into SERVICE MENU cause I don't even know what it looks like :)

What is a good way to test for OVERSCAN?

What is a good way to test for tilt and what is it exactly???

What exactly is posterization that people mention during the camera PAN in Ninja Gaiden?

I'm pretty oblivious as to what I should be looking for to tweak my set.

As well, a step-by-step of what settings need to be tweaked and to what, according to Topps postings would be nice please... Call me overly paranoid if you will :)


Thanks in advance!

Originally posted by povmec
First thing I could connect to it was the XBOX. I tried Ninja Gaiden at first. Very nice picture. Only problem is when there is a camera pan (like looking around in first-person view): this results in posterization of the picture, which is not very nice. I understand that all DLPs have this problem. I wish one will come with an explanation for this, as I can't figure why this happens. Silent Hill 4 is not very impressive, but I see it doesn't even support 480p (go figure...). Image and sound have no sync problem so far when playing games. Thumbs up for playing XBOX games.

Are you using the HD pack with component cables or just composite? If you are using component, you really shouldn't be seeing anything like what you're describing with a 480p game. All the 480p games I've played have looked fantastic.

Third, I got the HD receiver yesterday morning from my cable company. On PBS, there is a documentary which is wide-screen format, so I assume it must be HD? Really not impressed by the picture. I realize there is a lot of compression going on in there (all the little squares all over the place). I'm thinking "is it what HD is?"... I decide to wait for the evening to see the shows that I know for sure are HDs (NBC, CBS, ABC, FOX, Movie Network, etc). Now I was pleased, very nice, the compression wasn't to the point of defeating HD most of the time.

Are you sure you were watching PBSHD? There shouldn't be much if any compression artifacts at all. My PBSHD looks amazing. What cable provider do you have? I don't think most cable providers compress the HD signals or if they do, it's very minimal. I could be wrong though. Also, it must be nice for your cable provider to have all the locals (NBC, CBS, ABC, FOX) in HD available :D . I have Comcast here and they only offer ABC right now. It sucks and I wish they would move a little quicker to get the rest.

Ed

Originally posted by vizual
What exactly is posterization that people mention during the camera PAN in Ninja Gaiden?
See this Jayzen’s DLP Artifacts Page (http://www.n-fusion.com/ziskj/DLP.htm) for posterization (or whatever is the real word). Mainly it appears as a drop in color resolution of a static area of a scene when it is panned on the screen.
I'm trying hard to figure why it happens, and I think there is a possible explanation for this, but I'm going to read more to see if it make sense.

Originally posted by povmec
See this Jayzen’s DLP Artifacts Page (http://www.n-fusion.com/ziskj/DLP.htm) for posterization (or whatever is the real word). Mainly it appears as a drop in color resolution of a static area of a scene when it is panned on the screen.
I'm trying hard to figure why it happens, and I think there is a possible explanation for this, but I'm going to read more to see if it make sense.
I guess I need to play Ninja Gaiden and see what this is like. I don't really pay attention or look for stuff like that though, so maybe that's why I don't see anything like that on any games I've played. Oh well, hope you really enjoy your TV!:cool:

Ed

Originally posted by FaSSt2001
Are you using the HD pack with component cables or just composite?

I use component, and the XBOX is set to know that my display support up to 720p.
Originally posted by FaSSt2001
Are you sure you were watching PBSHD?

100% sure, there was the logo in the upper left hand corner. There was clearly the blocky look of a compressed MPEG content.
My provider is Videotron (I live in Montreal, Canada), they currently have 11 HD channels, among them the four big (NBC, ABC, CBS, FOX) from detroit.
But as I said, in the evening, the picture was stunning when I watched a bit of Lost, Law & Order (I think?), and an HD movie from TMN. I just wish they would broadcast more show using HD... Why is Survivor not in HD!

Well since I don't see posterization, I still say that rainbows and SSE are the issues that need to be addressed. :)

And Visual, before messing around in the service menu, just go and buy DVE. :)

Originally posted by povmec
I use component, and the XBOX is set to know that my display support up to 720p.

In your XBOX video settings do you have your VIDEO MODE set to NORMAL or WIDESCREEN?


The panny is a widescreen TV but I seem to lose quite a bit of detail if I set it to widescreen. If I set it to normal it looks much better.

Are we supposed to be playing most of these games with the NORMAL setting on the XBOX and is the WIDESCREEN setting there only for games that support 16:9 Widescreen on the back of the game box?

I'm attaching a couple files.. one, I built an inexpensive but functional stand to hold my HT gear and TV until I complete my real piece of furniture! Hidden from view are my Power Amp and CD player which are tucked away under the fabric.

Total cost for this madeshift rack was about $80. I have photos taken during the construction for anyone interested. it's fairly flexible and can color coordinate easily as you see fit. Doesn't take much no how other than how to glue things, a few screws, simple cutting and drilling, etc.

Second photo is to show how the set looks while placed on top with my center channel in front of the set. The set is high enough that my center channel does not block the IR port on the TV significantly. I hurried these photos so please do not use them to guage the PQ of the set. it loks superb! Hope the pics help!

http://users.adelphia.net/~jdavis37/stand.jpg

http://users.adelphia.net/~jdavis37/pannyonstand.jpg

PS the stand/set ARE level.. the small amount of lean is lens distortion ( wide angle lens from an angle )

jdavis 37
Congratulations. Glad to here the experience with amazon went well
Hope you can post a review

jp :) Thx I'm watching some of the Miami Louisville game and have to admit.. football truly was designed for HD :) I have not done a lot of tweaking but did use some of the settings mentioned by others here.

Initial impressions have been very good. I am not a videophile and I do not tend to seek out problems. If I se them, though, I do notice them lol

Early on.. my room must be noisy or maybe I do not have dog hearing but the fan is very quiet.

Cinema mode is alittle dim in bright daylight but still a better more comfortable viewing experience. VIVID mode appears to be a D ILA imitation! Simply too bright for my tastes but not quite as harsh as the D ILA when turned up!

LOTR's Two Towers.. as impressive as the Panny Plasma I had briefly regarding the dark shadow detail.

Only thing negative i have seen was some very brief dithering when the camera panned across a screen full of LED numbers. But in fairness, it may have been Adelphia's feed.

Short take thus far.. it's incredible and the Amazon price make sit feel even better lol. My stand is 18 1/2 inches high and that seems to be agreat height for this set given my seating position. I don't see rainbows and I don't see the screen door effect. I'm almost dreading getting my LASIK surgery in January for fear this may change :)

First day.. grade card is 100% positive and getting better ! Now back to From Hell with Johnny Depp!

thanx for the post
i'll be pulling the trigger this weekend

my beautiful new panny on it's stand :)

I was told I had to keep the shipping box around for 15 days incase I have a problem with it so that they can re-package it..ahwell.

I’ve had the 60” for about 3 weeks now. When I first received the set, the PQ was great, even on SD. However, over the past few weeks, I noticed the PQ is getting worse than before. I mostly watch Cinema Mode adjusted to Topps settings as indicated in the posts before, however, the PQ is still very grainy, I notice more clay faces and posterizations than before. Blacks seem a bit grayer? Also, some sections of the screen don’t light up from time to time – according to the troubleshooting section in the manual this is normal. Is this what DLPs are all about? Anyone else experience picture degradation? Keep in mind this is SD cable (Rogers), DVDs are crystal clear.

Are there any other settings that can be adjusted? Anything in the service menu?

Thanks!

Degrading picture

Originally posted by Omega2002
I’ve had the 60” for about 3 weeks now. When I first received the set, the PQ was great, even on SD. However, over the past few weeks, I noticed the PQ is getting worse than before. I mostly watch Cinema Mode adjusted to Topps settings as indicated in the posts before, however, the PQ is still very grainy, I notice more clay faces and posterizations than before. Blacks seem a bit grayer? Also, some sections of the screen don’t light up from time to time – according to the troubleshooting section in the manual this is normal. Is this what DLPs are all about? Anyone else experience picture degradation? Keep in mind this is SD cable (Rogers), DVDs are crystal clear.

Are there any other settings that can be adjusted? Anything in the service menu?

Thanks!

Since DVD's haven't degraded, it is possible that the Rogers cable feed into your house/apt has degraded in signal strength. This might explain your situation. Consider telling Rogers about your problem so that a cable repair tech can come to your location to measure signal strength and signal to noise ratio. Degradation in signal strength of cable feeds are not unusual, expecially when the season changes.

Hi,

Long time lurker, first time poster.

Thank you all for all your great posts. I was very close to pulling the trigger on this set, even set unseen. Fortunately, I found a local Tweeters in that carried this Panny. To my dismay, the same problem I had with the Toshiba appeared in the Panny.

The Panny was sitting next to a Mits at Tweeters. I don't know if either were calibrated, but they had the same feed. My initial impression was that I liked the Panny better. However, after awhile, the color on the Mits (a bit softer) seemed more soothing to me than the Panny. The slight difference in color doesn't offset the price, nor the glare from the Mits.

My main problem that I have with the Panny, and the Toshiba as well, is that I seem to feel a discomfort/headache when I look at the Panny. This didn't happen initially, but occurred shortly there after. It didn't matter how far I was standing from the set (which was about 10 to 12 feet away) when it happened. Is this due to the brightness of the set? Has anyone else experienced this, and if so, does it go away?

I really do like the Panny, but if I'm going to get a headache or feel sick from watching it, obviously I can't buy it.

Now, if this problem can be resolved, would any of you go with the 46" Toshiba? I saw it being sold at Costco.com, and their life time return policy makes it very attractive compared to the Panny.

Thanks in advance for your help. Hope to get this before the winter sets in so I can wait it out...I hear it's going to be a harsh one!

Aust.. the Mits out of the box is much darker than the Panny or the Toshiba. From my viewing experiences, the Toshiba was the brightest of the three.

As many have reported here, the first thing to do is change the picture to CINEMA mode. The VIVID default setting is overly bright for my eyes, and only usable if the room is very very bright.

Your eyes, though, simply may prefer the Mits and , if so, it's your set! There wa no way I could use the glare screen of the 525 series and removing it also removed some of the black detail. Plus, I simply liked the Panny better than the other 2, then got it for about $1000 off retail so how could I argue? I'm very happy with it thus far!.

My room has 8 windows but I did not think it was overly bright since I have shades over the windows. TodayI could see a little bit of glare on my screen though it was very mild. Made me realize had I bought the Hitachi LCD or the Mits DLP, there is no way I could have watched the set during the day without buying new room darkening blinds !

Go back and try the Cinema mode.. it may help. If not, buy the Mits :)) In the end, it's your eyes and viewing (dis)pleasure that counts!

Hello Everyone,

Thanks to all for all the great info on the panny. Espescially Topp!

This is my first post. I have a question for Topp or whoever else may be able to help out. I know you can't program settings for each input but from what I understand can't Vivid, Standard and Cinema be programmed from factory settings to appear however you prefer. The only difference I see between them is Color temp setting (which can be changed) and the factory picture settings which can also be changed. In theory I should be able to make the 3 look the same, no? Or is their some other differences between the 3 that I'm unaware of?

I know that in Topps recommendations Cinema had a better gamma curve than Standard. What if I change the color temp in Standard from normal to warm and set all other picture adjustments the same?

I did try to set Standard and Cinema to the same settings and to my untrained eye they appeared the same. Am I missing something?

Thanks to all.

jdavis37,

Thanks for your advice. I'll definitely have to try out the Cinema mode and see if that helps. I wonder what I'm experiencing is early eye strain. But wonder why the Toshiba also causes the same problems.

Do you also experience some discomfort when viewing it in the VIVID setting?

I hope it works out for the Panny. It seems like it's the best bang for the buck out there right now....besides the new RCA. Heaven forbid that I might have to get an RCA!

Aust,

I saw the Toshiba at Best Buy but really discounted what I saw there due to their horrible layout and numerous split feeds, etc. Th eBB nearest me recently changed thir store layout and the big screen tv area was made worse as they have the Toshiba on the floor and you basically have to lie down in order to see the picture. I'm just not that familiar with it though my memory seems to recall it has 2 lamp power settings ( not sure on this though.. may want to check the Toshiba thread ). If it does, the higher power may have been selected.

Often in stores they choose to set the sets to the brightest they can get them. Even the manufacturers do this.. Panny defaults to VIVID out fo the box. The JVC D ILA out of the box is so bright I feared sunburns lol But, the brightness often attracts people INITIALLY. The MITS 525 series picture is very very subdued and Ive overheard people walking past it because the xxx brand was just more "vivid"

In both Tweeter stores I visited, the Panny was set to VIVID. however, they had the set right by the fornt door with tons of light streaming in so it was ok. In general, most of these sets have a lot of room to adjust the brightness. Try the Topp settings suggested on page 22 of this thread. I have mine set that way with exception of the sharpness which I am running at 13.

In VIVID mode I can't say I get eye strain or fatigue but it is just too much in my face. I had to briefly go to VIVID yesterday due to some really bright sunshine and the cinema mode was a little dim for watching From Hell, a really dark movie. But yes, in general, the VIVID mode is bright enough I cans ee why it could cause eye strain or fatigue.

But, give your eyes credit as they may simply like a different TV better. I love the Panny look and am very happy with my choice, plus it fit my budget very nicely. I do't feel I compromised at all but I also do not play game son my set, etc.. so I don't need to have features such as memorized settings for each input, a night/day memory, etc. I think the new Hitachis do all that. Good luck :)

what signal should be sent from cable box to the TV ? 1080i or 720p ect...I have comcast cable and a explorer 3250hd box if that matters. I know the NR of the tv is 720 so i'm assuming thats best?

Anyone experienced video / audio sync issues with the Panny?

I was watching Star Wars DVD ( A New Hope ), and the scene in the CANTINA just before Guido shoots first (ugh...) and the AUDIO was way out of sync with the video. I just tapped the FFWD on my DVD Remote and it was fine again though...

Weird?

My 60" Panny DLP arrived yesterday evening, and everything is great, except....the fan noise.

55 dB in a silent room, measured standing in front of the set. :( Measured anywhere close to the vent and it's off the charts.

The sound is really annoying during daytime TV, and intrusive even when watching just below reference, because quiet scenes are never really quiet.

My wife doesn't even want to stay in the same room at this point (her favorite seat is about 10 ft back), so I'm hoping Panasonic can do something...and quick.

PQ is awesome on DVD & XBox, but if this can't be fixed, it's a showstopper. :(

Originally posted by vizual
my beautiful new panny on it's stand :)

I was told I had to keep the shipping box around for 15 days incase I have a problem with it so that they can re-package it..ahwell.

hi vizual

that's stand is nice. where did u get it?

thx

Originally posted by eXcentris
Saddly, I think I'm going to have to give the Panny the boot and go with LCD. :( I see (not often) rainbows when I watch movies and I thought I could tolerate them but they are getting more and more annoying. In fact they've gotten into my head! I sit down to watch a movie and have to keep telling myself "keep still, don't move your head, what? was that a rainbow?" which of course doesn't make the movie watching experience very pleasant... I'm going to keep experimenting with room lighting, seating position, etc. until friday and make a decision then. Too bad because I love this set! And considering the number of hours or reading I've done before I purchased the Panny, I don't especially look forward to having to start the process all over again to select an LCD set. :(

hi excentris

i have an LCD panny rptv. i started seeing screen door effect in some channel.
then everytime i see a good scene..my mind kept on searching for SDE..
too bad. (is there a technical term for this issue?.

now, i have reduced the sharpness and the SDE seems to have reduced.

(fyi...before u buy an rptv lcd)

Originally posted by Quill
My 60" Panny DLP arrived yesterday evening, and everything is great, except....the fan noise.

55 dB in a silent room, measured standing in front of the set. :( Measured anywhere close to the vent and it's off the charts.

The sound is really annoying during daytime TV, and intrusive even when watching just below reference, because quiet scenes are never really quiet.

My wife doesn't even want to stay in the same room at this point (her favorite seat is about 10 ft back), so I'm hoping Panasonic can do something...and quick.
I was considering the 50" Panasonic DLP along with the 52" Toshiba DLPs (all 3 of them!). Any audible noise like you described would annoy me a great deal. I'm someone who got irritated when I would hear the transformers buzzing within our subwoofers. Fortunately, there was a fix to this problem. Doesn't sound like there is one for the fan noise within the Panasonic DLP other than to enclose the unit (in our home, it would be out in the open on a stand).

Michael

Michael,

Forums always seem to amplify problems and lead one to draw a conclusion that the % of trouble is higher, perhaps, than it actually is. I also notice atrend where 10 positive posts are less regarded than a single negative. I am sure some people have true issues and will leave it at that. Just don't be swayed by those posts as being indicative of every set sold. I am a member of several forums and see the same pattern in each of them. New product comes out, several positive posts, a negative post, Oh my God an ISSUE and subsequent fear in buying.

I bought my Panny 50 from Amazon and knew going in I had no return priveleges. Something I gave up for the $1000 savings. Set arrived Thursday morning and has been HD viewing bliss since. No fan noise, no issues, no tilts, no anything other than a great set and one very happy camper. If you are less than confident, buy from a place which has a good 30 day return policy and rest easy.

Well I took a look at a few stores in my local mall (Manchester, New Hampshire) and I couldn't find the new Panasonic DLP. I check out Sears, Cambridge Soundworks and Best Buy. None of them even knew Panasonic had come out with a DLP. The guy in Cambridge thought I was out of my tree when I told him. I guess I'll have to keep looking.

I have seen the Samsung, and if the PQ is as good (or better) on the Panasonic, for less money, then that's a real winner.

Originally posted by jdavis37
Forums always seem to amplify problems and lead one to draw a conclusion that the % of trouble is higher, perhaps, than it actually is. I also notice a trend where 10 positive posts are less regarded than a single negative. I am sure some people have true issues and will leave it at that. Just don't be swayed by those posts as being indicative of every set sold.
I would have to agree. It seems that the people who end up with problems are more likely to post online in hopes of finding a solution (or just to complain) than someone who is happy with their purchase.

I wish the decision on which HDTV technology to go with was more clear cut like it was in the days of CRT direct views. CRT, DLP, LCD, and D-ILA RPTVs plus plasma TVs all have their strengths and weaknesses. I keep leaping from plasma to DLP to LCD, then back to plasma, and so forth.

Michael

Originally posted by kculp
Playing regular progressive scan DVD looks ok, doesn't justify the expense of the TV obviously.
Really? Just OK? Wow, I would have expected DVDs to look pretty darn good on all HDTVs. My wife and I won't get a chance to try the Panny DLP with a DVD until next weekend, so if the above is true, maybe we won't waste our time.

For everyone else, I am only on page 9 of this thread (out of 46 pages as of this post). I read the last page or two (making a couple of posts), then decided to start from the beginning. So, if the above is not true, I would like to hear those opinions.

Michael

Michael,

Agree on which technology, etc. It is a rapidly changing field and I suspect prices will also drop to a large degree. Something hAS to give if they expect for most of the world to switch to HD ready sets ( not everyone has $2000 USD , etc ). This was why I decided against going for a 60 inch screen and buying locally at near retail. I saw a 50 inch Pioneer plasma this summer , display unit, for $4500, but after taxes, etc it was still $5K. I'm not wealthy and just could not see dropping that kind of money for a TV set. I nearly decided on the 42 inch Panny EDTV plasma as a cost effective solution, but after seeing it head to head against the Samsung Kirk model, the amount of detail difference was very noticeable. DLP blacks lok better to me than LCDs and that is an area where my eyes are sensitive to. I saw the Panny and liked the set overall. It's abasic set without many frills etc but it doesn't need them to look great. Im watching ESPN HD now with the Saints/Vikings and wow :) The Amazon price was very cheap and thus it met my needs, relaizing in a couple or three years I may be looking at all new technology all over again. Goo dluck.. it's a tough decision when you are spending this much money, and on a tv at that!

PS Fan is still almost inaudible, no issues with the set, no rainbows, no tilt, and so on. Just agreat experience thus far!

I did finally hear back from Panasonic on when the 60" will be available-THEY HAVE NO IDEA. Sounds a little like Samsung.

Originally posted by iamtarun
hi vizual

that's stand is nice. where did u get it?

thx

It's a stand from Future Shop / Best Buy. It is the "Z-Line Titan Z40-1S"

Got it for 299 Canadian and thought it was pretty good.

Regarding FAN NOISE...

I haven't noticed the fan at all and I sit about 8 feet away exactly. I'm still using the native side speakers on the panasonic and my volume level is at about 11 or so? Only been watching DVDs and XBOX. Need to get cable still. I've been aware of the fan issue but I haven't noticed it yet once. Guess I lucked out?

THe only thing I noticed was that one occurence of Audio Delay / Video Sync in this one scene in Star Wars DVD. Hope it was an anomaly :)

Originally posted by vizual
Regarding FAN NOISE...

I haven't noticed the fan at all and I sit about 8 feet away exactly. I'm still using the native side speakers on the panasonic and my volume level is at about 11 or so?

I’m happy to see some of the sets aren’t prone to the excessive fan noise, as that means there’s a decent chance that mine is simply defective, and not poor design.

And it really doesn’t matter how loud the movie is, because during the inevitable quiet scenes, the dialog is overlaid upon a steady WHRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR sound.

Ok, so I know a lot of people have compared the Panny to the Samsung and Toshiba. What about the Panny in comparison to the LG RU-52SZ61D? I got a quick look at this set over the weekend at BB, but the place was mobbed, and I couldn't really get anyone to help me play with the feeds to really see the PQ.

Has anyone looked at this set in-depth. I have yet to see the Panny DLP, but I can't wait with all the talk it's getting here.

And I feel I should temper my fan noise complaints with a comment or two about PQ. In short, it's outstanding.

SD is way better than I thought it would be, and DVD & XBox are awesome (though XBox varies by game). No HD box yet.

Panny owners: I highly recommend doing the tweaks Topp talks about on P22. After doing the tweaks and calibrating with VE, I found the set becomes much more film-like and natural looking.

I just got my new panny 50" from Amazon. Interesting thing is that in the booklet that comes with it, they describe it as being 54" diagonal. They must mean including the speakers, because I ripped out my tape measure and the picture is exactly 50" in diagonal.

Anyway, service from Amazon was amazing as usual. Got here in four days. Delivered in the house, set up already (no stand yet).

Speaking of stands, I have seen pictures of people's stands. I am tempted to go either with the Panasonic matching one or the BDI Icon 9424. Any thoughts on either?

After reading all the comments, I had to go see the televisions for myself. I went to Good Guys and Best Buy. My BB now has a Magnolia HI-FI inside, so I was able to see some pretty snazzy equipment. Looked at all the sets (almost opted for plasma again, but then got too cheap to do it). I went in to look at the Toshiba, I ended up with the Panasonic. It was set up next to the Mitsubishi. I liked the Mitsu, but I couldn't justify the jump in price. Actually, I thought the Panny had the best picture of the bunch.

Anyway, I hope to have it on a stand by Friday, so I would like to hear from you guys as to what the best stand would be. Looking for three things, quality, the ability to put some components there and a center channel. Let me know.

Thanks.

RJ

I think we should set up a poll on the Panny's fan noise. And see how much it really affects the sets owners and to what extent, how loud it is.

Originally posted by RudyMeister
I think we should set up a poll on the Panny's fan noise. And see how much it really affects the sets owners and to what extent, how loud it is.

Done! :)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=459730

I have ordered a PT-50DL54 and am looking forward to receiving it in a couple of weeks. Can anyone confirm that the lamp in this unit is covered under the USA 1-year parts and labor warranty? I phoned Panasonic and the CSR said it was because it could be considered a part, but I've read reviews on Amazon that say their lamp wasn't covered because Panasonic considered it a consumable.

Also, the dealer was trying to sell me a 3-year extended warranty for $300 that he described as being a mirror image of the original Panasonic warranty. However, when I asked him if it covered the lamp he said no, so either it isn't a mirror image of the Panasonic warranty or the Panasonic warranty doesn't cover the lamp.

Originally posted by Quill
Done! :)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=459730


Thanks Quill!!!

Has anyone noticed problems with the FOX HD during the Red Sox/Yankee games. A lot of quick interruption/fliker, hard to describe, you'll know what mean if you are experiencing them.
thanks,
Caboman

Also, when I turn on the set, the picture is disfigured, almost a split screen 60/40. It goes away once I change the channel, not sure what is causing this. I use a GEFEN 4x1 switch, but rarely change outputs.
Caboman

Originally posted by caboman
Has anyone noticed problems with the FOX HD during the Red Sox/Yankee games. A lot of quick interruption/fliker, hard to describe, you'll know what mean if you are experiencing them.
thanks,
Caboman

Yes, the screen would quickly jump to being off-center and then quickly back again. I wasn't sure if this was my local San Antonio affiliate or a national problem.

I have also experienced the flickering on FOX HDTV. Have you tried the slow-mo on the Comcast cable box's DVR? It flickers like crazy. I have my cable box set to output to 720P.

Caboman,
Yes, I have seen the Fox problem. Kind of like a loss of vertical sync.
I have seen this problem in both local and Direct channel 82, so it looks like it originates with Fox. Since it's always of short duration, I do not find it irritating.

Without searching this entire thread. Can anyony tell me if there is an online review for this tv? thanks.

Originally posted by wabbit
I have also experienced the flickering on FOX HDTV. Have you tried the slow-mo on the Comcast cable box's DVR? It flickers like crazy. I have my cable box set to output to 720P.

How do you know its set for 720P output?
Caboman

With the cable box turned off, press menu on cable remote. You will be allowed to set output to 720i, 720p, 1080i, etc.

Malomead, did you find your panny dlp at Bjorn's?

Thanks in advance!!

Originally posted by GoSpurs99
Malomead, did you find your panny dlp at Bjorn's?

Thanks in advance!!


I do not own a Panny DLP but I actually did go to Bjorn's today to check but they do not carry Panasonic. The only place I could find it was CompUsa and unfortunately I was unable to compare it to other DLPs there.

I am interested in the 60" when it becomes available. Does anyone know if the specs on the 60" will be otherwise the same as the 50"? I'm hoping it will have 2 HDMI inputs.

Well today I got a chance to see all the DLP's on my list (Sammy P5063W, Mits 52525, LG 52SZ61D, and the Panny 50DL54). I saw the Sammy and LG side by side at BB. I actually liked the color of the LG better. The skin tones looked more natural, as well as the others, and the blacks seemed a bit more defined. It could have just been the settings, but the PQ of the set is nice. My only concern is the quality of the actual manufacturer.

Then in a higher end HT store, I saw the Sammy, Mits and Panny (in that order left to right on the shelf) all side by side. I stayed there for over 30 minutes. I first watched each set for about 5 minutes alone, not looking at the other sets. Then I compared the sets together with some of the scenes on Discovery HD. There is no doubt in my mind. The Panny is the best set.

The Mits is a nice set, but boy did they blow it with that high glare screen. Why spend over $4k on a set and have all that glare.

When the new house is finished, and I have the extra change burning a hole in my pocket, the Panny will make it to my family room. Also, the high end HT store had it at about 13% off the retail price. I don't know if that is a good price for this new set, but given the picture quality, I would pay it compared to the price of the other sets.

2 weeks now with the Panny 60 DLP. I am very happy with the set. With good input (HD) sitting with my nose 11 1/2 ft from the screen provides stunning a stunning view. The ball games have been great and I am not even a huge fan. Truly wonderful. However if the input is not from a quality source the bad features are also amplified. I think it deals with black grey issues quite well but as for any of these types of sets I checked out it is not perfect but ok. The fan noise is there but it is not noticeable during a program. It is a bit disappointing that there is any fan noise but it does not detract from the viewing in any way up to now. Very happy with this set.

well the fan noise on this set is a cause for concern to a prospective buyer like myself, albeit just a tiny bit of a concern. But a concern it is and it can detract me from buying his set.
The noise poll so far, shows almost 50% of people saying that there's a noise. Of course a smaller percentage of this number, the noise seems like a deal breaker.
What's unfortunate for me is that, this set is not being sold anywhere locally. So far I can see the Samsung 5085 at BB and its PQ is very nice indeed. Watching football games on it is simply stunning. I just don't like the stand and the price of the samsung.
The other alternative is the Tosh 46". It was being sold by Costco but they seem to have run out of stock for now?

Originally posted by RudyMeister
well the fan noise on this set is a cause for concern to a prospective buyer like myself, albeit just a tiny bit of a concern. But a concern it is and it can detract me from buying his set.

I own the 60" dlp (with fan noise), and I would still heartily recommend this set--though I'd reommend purchasing from a store offering liberal return policy, just in case you get a set with noise problems. The PQ is great.

I truly believe a low level of fan noise is inherent--and acceptable--in all DLPS, and that there are simply a few that are defective, and abnormally loud.

I have tech coming over tonight to look at my set, so I'll know more in about 8 hours.

Originally posted by Piri
However if the input is not from a quality source the bad features are also amplified. I think it deals with black grey issues quite well but as for any of these types of sets I checked out it is not perfect but ok.

Have you applied the service menu tweaks listed by Topp in this thread? After applying them, even basic analog cable is "pretty good" across 90% of the channels. (HD box is on the way...).

Here's a summary (thanks again Topp!!).

To sum up, this set performs very well and makes a very accurate image. For the do-it-yourself person, I would recommend using DVE or equivalent to set the Picture, Brightness, Color and Tint controls. Set Sharpness to 0, Set Color Temp to Warm and set Picture Mode to Cinema. Use a 720p input signal vs. 1080i if possible. Get into the Service menu and set HPOS and VPOS to center the screen and set WB to 01. That should give you the most accurate display possible short of a professional calibration.

Service menu instructions: THE USUAL DISCLAIMER APPLIES! YOU CAN SERIOUSLY MESS UP YOUR TV DOING THIS, SO DO SO AT YOUR OWN RISK!

Set sleep timer to 30 minutes
Go to cable / antenna input and switch to channel 124
Turn volume all the way down with the remote
Press down volume button on the unit itself
CHK will appear in red in the top-left corner.
Press the power button on the remote control to get into the service menu
with "CHK" displayed.
Press power on the unit itself to exit the service menu
(turns off the unit but doesn't erase your user mode settings).

Rudy,

I bought my set on line and knew going in that I had no 30 day return privelege, etc. But I have been a member of several forums and they all share soime similarities. One, a lot of nice, helpful people who have a vast rang eof kowledge. Two, new product information, reviews, feedback, etc. And three, a problem is experienced by some percentage of people ( remmeber, MOST happy owners are just not on the forums ) and it becomes an "issue" that makes readers afraid to buy. If the problem were severe enough that thousands of sets were being returned, it would be a bona fide issue. Some people without question get a set which has a loud fan or osme otherwise unplanned issue. No matter what brand you buy, you will run that risk. I just hate seeing forums problems scare people from buying a product. It has a warranty, and hopefully Panny will stand by their product and repair the ones which have problems. But read any forum here about any set, and if you read long enough, it will sacre a perosn from buying anything. Sometimes you just have to roll the dice and take a chance. My Panny thus far is perfect. No fan noise to speak of, great picture, and I am one very happy camper! Plus I bought it using a VISA which doubles the manufacturer's warranty. Good luck but please do not let few forum problems steer you away form the set you decide on. Statisitcally, you would need at least 1000 RANDOM surveys of Panny DLP owners to be able to have any certainty to what the survey is telling you. 100 people surveyes gives an estimated error od the survey at 3.2%. If 25 people respond, the error is about 20% which is far too high to ascertain anything meaningful from the survey. And when asking people on a forum to repsond to a survey, it has a built in negative bias. Again, goo dluck! I'm back to my Panny and another dark scene movie lol

Anyone? I'm just trying to find any online reviews for this set.

Originally posted by Piri
2 weeks now with the Panny 60 DLP. I am very happy with the set. With good input (HD) sitting with my nose 11 1/2 ft from the screen provides stunning a stunning view. The ball games have been great and I am not even a huge fan. Truly wonderful. However if the input is not from a quality source the bad features are also amplified. I think it deals with black grey issues quite well but as for any of these types of sets I checked out it is not perfect but ok. The fan noise is there but it is not noticeable during a program. It is a bit disappointing that there is any fan noise but it does not detract from the viewing in any way up to now. Very happy with this set.

You have a 60" Panasonic DLP? Where did you get it? When I spoke with the Panasonic rep on the phone today, he told me that they are not going to release the 60" until next year.

I like the panasonic 50" a lot, but have not been able to find the 60"

jt-kline

Have you applied the service menu tweaks listed by Topp in this thread? After applying them, even basic analog cable is "pretty good" across 90% of the channels. (HD box is on the way...).
No I have not. I don't think I am brave enough.
You have a 60" Panasonic DLP? Where did you get it?
Yes. I am in Canada. These sets are widely available here at a variety of outlets including A&B sound, Sears, The Brick, London Drugs. I bought mine from A&B sound.

Piri

Originally posted by wabbit
With the cable box turned off, press menu on cable remote. You will be allowed to set output to 720i, 720p, 1080i, etc.

Why would you want it set to 720P ipo 108i?
Caboman

I believe that 720p mode is supposed to be better....

Here's a snipet from another website (http://alvyray.com/DigitalTV/Naming_Proposal.htm)

In the progressive system, 720 lines are presented to the human eye every 1/60th of a second while the so-called 1080I system presents only 540 lines. Therefore a more accurate name for the interlaced system is 540I. It also more accurately represents the fact that the interlaced system is lower in quality than our 720P system. Not only is 720P superior to 540I in quality (note the well-known artifact: interlace flickers), but it is cheaper! And it is naturally compatible with computers (which all use progressive scanning). Now you can understand the title of this page: It is 720P that is greater than 540I - formerly known in old-speak as 1080I.

Did some quick research on the net and noted how fan noise is an issue on DLP projectors. Apparently a spec. of 30 dB or so is considered quiet. Since this is the same technology on the TV's and fan noise was an issue on projectors were there limitations on the fans they could use on the TV's.

Is it possible but unlikely that the colour wheel is making the noise?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by wabbit
[B]I believe that 720p mode is supposed to be better....

There have been plenty of 720p vs. 1080i debates here and elsewhere, but they aren't really relevant to this set. This TV displays 720p native and can't display anything else. The only question is how to handle a 1080i program: let the STB convert it to 720p or feed the 1080i signal to the TV and let it do the converting. It comes down to which has the better scaler.

RE: fan noise

I do not own this set...only researching it as an option at this point...but here's my thought/question:

I build a lot of custom PC's where silence is of paramount importance. I can say with a fair amount of certainty that whatever fan Panasonic is putting in the set--there is some other fan built with equivalent CFM ratings that will be MUCH quieter.

I've found the best products to utilize the HYPRO bearing technology (HYdro dynamic wave oil PROtection system) from Fenshen Electronics. Commonly sold as brand names ADDA and JARO. I've not only made silent PC's, but also CISCO routers and other gear silent too.

So I guess the question is, does anyone have a name/model number/size of the fan that is loud? When Panasonic service replaces the fan, what is different? Didn't someone say it wasn't the fan but some other case vibration?

Originally posted by Ciao
Did some quick research on the net and noted how fan noise is an issue on DLP projectors. Apparently a spec. of 30 dB or so is considered quiet. Since this is the same technology on the TV's and fan noise was an issue on projectors were there limitations on the fans they could use on the TV's.

Is it possible but unlikely that the colour wheel is making the noise?

The noise seems to really be coming from the fan....

After the tv is turned off, both the lamp and fan stay on for a short period of time.

The lamp turns off after ~ 10 seconds. The fan turns off after ~ 45 seconds. the noise is pretty much the same when the tv is on and when the tv is "powering down" (lamp off but fan going). when the fan does finally shut off you really notice the silence. unless the color wheel is also spinning when the power is off i dont think it is the wheel. also the amount of air being forced out of hte tv at the fan vent indicates that the fan blades are turning at a pretty good rate and thus is pretty loud.

I have temporarily constructed a "shield" from cardboard and a towel and this helps a bit. I was a little concerned about blocking the airflow but then I noticed that the Panasonic stand actually covers the fan vent even more than my solution so i think i am ok for now.

i wonder if the fan is connected by the same type of 3 pin connector as is found in most PCs...

I looked at a samsung dlp at costco and noticed that the fan was clearly visible from the outside of the case. it appeared to be spinning much slower than the fan on my panasonic and i assume it is probably much quieter. the panasonic's fan is not really visible from the outside.

finally, i am the only one in my family who seems to be bothered by it. for everyone else it just sort of blends into the background noise. i am pretty sensitive to fan noise after having replaced fans, power supplies, etc in order to silence our PCs

Rather than trying to fix the fan noise, you could try fixing your head. :)

Does the sound of your air conditioning or heating system annoy you in your home? Does the sound of your tires on the road annoy you when driving? The answer to both of these questions is hopefully no. Why not? Answer: because you accept these noises as part of the operation of your house or your car and you tune them out. Not all noises are easy to tune out, but low-level pseudo white noise from a small fan certainly can be. Train yourself to accept the fan noise as part of the operation of your tv.

i would like to thank the many people in this forum for the information they have posted. I pulled the trigger today on the 50in from amazon and am now awaiting its arrival.

Originally posted by jpvision
i would like to thank the many people in this forum for the information they have posted. I pulled the trigger today on the 50in from amazon and am now awaiting its arrival. Amazon are a good reseller. However in this case they are about $400 more than you can get it from other good resellers. If you like, you can easily cancel your order with them and email me for details of where I bought mine last week. zimberto@comcast.net .

An excellent lead here from Zim. Saves hundreds if it proves a reliable supplier. Meanwhile, does anyone have info on a Hitachi 60-inch LCD model (just arrived locally at Conn's) which states it's 1080p? Salesperson did not appear to know much about any of the technologies involved, was more interested in the in-house financing aspects of the sale. Still, Panasonic DLP appeared to have the sharper picture, but it could have been the feed/setup on each set. However, I did like the relatively larger cabinet top of the Hitachi which would accommodate a reasonably sized center channel speaker. Previous Samsung Tantus models (HLN series) had this feature, but everyone seems to have forgotten to take center channels into account with progressively thinner tops. NOT a positive selling point in my opinion. The Panasonic has about the classiest remote, but you have to scroll through inputs. JVC DILA has direct access to inputs, but fewer connections in rear. This is too big a purchase to get wrong, and no perfect answer appears to loom for the near future. The Panny seems to score the most points overall, even if it isn't number one in all aspects.
All posts along these lines are very much appreciated.

I'd be interested to hear from anyone who has seen the PT-50DL54 (DLP) beside a PT-50LC14 (LCD). Personally I've seen the PT-50LC14 beside other LCD tvs and it didn't hold up well. Picture was soft and colors were dull.

Originally posted by Zimberto
Rather than trying to fix the fan noise, you could try fixing your head. :)

Does the sound of your air conditioning or heating system annoy you in your home? Does the sound of your tires on the road annoy you when driving? The answer to both of these questions is hopefully no. Why not? Answer: because you accept these noises as part of the operation of your house or your car and you tune them out. Not all noises are easy to tune out, but low-level pseudo white noise from a small fan certainly can be. Train yourself to accept the fan noise as part of the operation of your tv.

Actually I drive a Lexus so you'll have to explain this thing called road noise ;)
....but I do get your point and after time you do get used to the fan noise. it's just too bad that it is something you have to learn to live with. the real question is how does the panasonic compare to other dlp sets. is it noticibly louder than other dlp sets or about the same? I wonder....

Some plasmas also have cooling fans which can be pretty loud as well, i think plasma manufacturers are now coming around and making quieter models, some are even fanless now. i'm sure people who bought early generation sets just accepted it as part of owing a plasma but now that manufacturers have addressed the issue the difference to some people between an older generaiton noisy set and a newer quieter set is like night and day.

I was at my local store here and they have a PT-50DL54 (DLP) beside a PT-50LC14 (LCD) and it is quite easy to tell the difference. Much better contrast on the DLP and much better depth to the picture which makes it appear almost 3D. I have been looking primarily between Sammy 63 and Panny and I definately like the Panny better. Oh the other thing about the Panny DLP which is different then the LCD is there is more black around the outside of the screen. However both have the stupid speakers which the more I look at the screeen it annoys me. I am waiting for the Sammy 74 series to arrive and I am hoping this will induce a modest price cut in the Pannys at which time I am gonna snatch up the 50" DLP Panny.

Fan Noise

I have previously indicated on this forum my annoyance with fan noise on my 50-inch DLP Panny. A service tech came to my house and indicated that the noise level was normal. The back of my Panny is against a wall. I now put a 2'x4' sheet of 3" Sonex (sound absorbing foam) between the Panny and the wall behind it, with the bottom of the Sonex resting on the same stand as does the TV. This does help some. I am going to experiment with using Sonex to build baffles of sorts around the air vents on the left and right side of the back of the TV. This will be a bit trickier since room must be left for air to flow freely through the vents.

You have a 60" Panasonic DLP? Where did you get it? When I spoke with the Panasonic rep on the phone today, he told me that they are not going to release the 60" until next year.>>>

I just returned from CC where they had the Panasonic and the Sony 60" units side by side. The Panasonic's price was much lower than the Sony.
They both exhibited great PQ, and the Panasonic had less overscan than the Sony.

Picked up a nice stand for my Panny today. This one (http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Z-Line-Designs-TV-Stand--23541S-/sem/rpsm/oid/69535/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do). Will post photo later in the week if anyone is interested.

Originally posted by Zimberto
Picked up a nice stand for my Panny today. This one (http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Z-Line-Designs-TV-Stand--23541S-/sem/rpsm/oid/69535/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do). Will post photo later in the week if anyone is interested.
Please do. I'd like to see it. I thought the Panasonic base was wider than the 43" width of this stand, but maybe I was mistaken. If it fits, it looks like a nice stand at a good price.

Originally posted by Zimberto
I'd be interested to hear from anyone who has seen the PT-50DL54 (DLP) beside a PT-50LC14 (LCD). Personally I've seen the PT-50LC14 beside other LCD tvs and it didn't hold up well. Picture was soft and colors were dull.
I concluded the opposite when comparing the PT-50LC14 side by side with the Sony GWIII LCD set. I thought the PT-50LC14 had a sharper picture and more vivid colors. However SD material looked slightly better on the Sony. I also looked at the PT-50LC14 side by side with a Hitachi LCD (can't remember which model). The picture quality was nearly identical. But the Panasonic had less glare, and I like the VGA connector.

I spent even more time on multiple visits to the store comparing the PT-50DL54 with the PT-50LC14. Through most of the process I was leaning towards the DLP. But then I noticed some odd, greenish splotches on faces with the DLP. "Greenish splotch" is an overstatement; they were quite subtle. I think this may be the same effect that others have referred to as "clay faces" in some of the other DLP threads. It was barely noticable with HD; it really only bothered me with DVDs. On the other hand, the DLP definitely had a better picture in dark scenes. I ended up choosing the LCD because a good portion of my TV time is spent watching DVDs, and because my room is bright (4 7' windows), which negates some of the dark scene advantage of the DLP. They're both great sets, and I could probably be happy with either one.

Originally posted by bradvoy
Please do. I'd like to see it. I thought the Panasonic base was wider than the 43" width of this stand, but maybe I was mistaken. If it fits, it looks like a nice stand at a good price. I believe it's 40.5". If you read the reviews, one person is actually using it with a 50" Panny.

Originally posted by bradvoy
I spent even more time on multiple visits to the store comparing the PT-50DL54 with the PT-50LC14. Through most of the process I was leaning towards the DLP. But then I noticed some odd, greenish splotches on faces with the DLP. "Greenish splotch" is an overstatement; they were quite subtle. I think this may be the same effect that others have referred to as "clay faces" in some of the other DLP threads. It was barely noticable with HD; it really only bothered me with DVDs. On the other hand, the DLP definitely had a better picture in dark scenes. I ended up choosing the LCD because a good portion of my TV time is spent watching DVDs, and because my room is bright (4 7' windows), which negates some of the dark scene advantage of the DLP. They're both great sets, and I could probably be happy with either one. I was looking at the PT-60LC14 today in Circuit City and was impressed. One thing though, I was watching a SD football game and I'm sure I saw pretty obvious smearing. If you could live with that you can get the 60" LCD set for about the same price as the 50" DLP one. The 60" screen has over 40% more screen area, so it is significantly larger.

what has been getting better picture results for dvd 480p or 480i?

Originally posted by jpvision
what has been getting better picture results for dvd 480p or 480i?

I was worried my archaic 480i player would look crappy on my 60", but the opposite is true. I'm quite happy with the picture with interlaced, so any improvement when I go to HDMI is icing on the cake!

Originally posted by jpvision
what has been getting better picture results for dvd 480p or 480i?

using a zenith dvb318 dvd player i upconvert to either 720p or1080i. either of those settings are better than the 480p image.

prior to the zenith, i used a sony progressive scan player. in 480i mode i had video skipping issues. pressing the progressive button eliminated those problems but the picture still wasnt completely satisfying so i bought the dvb318 and i am really happy that i did.

I received my TV today in perfect condition. Very happy with it! I have yet to connect it to a HD source though, so I can't yet see it at its best.

BTW, on more piece of trivia about this set: the box it comes in is 63"x40"x21" (LxHxW)

Originally posted by Zimberto
Picked up a nice stand for my Panny today. This one (http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Z-Line-Designs-TV-Stand--23541S-/sem/rpsm/oid/69535/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do). Will post photo later in the week if anyone is interested. Unfortunately this stand is too high by about 6". Doesn't sound like much but it makes a big difference to viewing comfort and how it fits in the room. I'll have to try and return it.

BTW, I reckon that for the average couch/armchair, the optimum (flat top) stand height for this TV should be about 16".

Originally posted by roblim
using a zenith dvb318 dvd player i upconvert to either 720p or1080i. either of those settings are better than the 480p image.

prior to the zenith, i used a sony progressive scan player. in 480i mode i had video skipping issues. pressing the progressive button eliminated those problems but the picture still wasnt completely satisfying so i bought the dvb318 and i am really happy that i did.

I have the equivalent DVD player in the LG model but have now been told that since the TV will upconvert, there is no need to purchase a DVD player that does so as well.

What do others think?

Is there a way I can see how much overscan my set has out of the box other than going into the service menu?

As far as Topps tweaking settings go, the only thing I gather worth really tweaking in the SM is the overscan if it exists? Am I wrong? I already set all my picture settings to the CINEMA values he provided.

Originally posted by vizual
Is there a way I can see how much overscan my set has out of the box other than going into the service menu?

As far as Topps tweaking settings go, the only thing I gather worth really tweaking in the SM is the overscan if it exists? Am I wrong? I already set all my picture settings to the CINEMA values he provided. He also suggested setting the white balance "WB" to "01" rather than the default "00".

Originally posted by Ciao
I have the equivalent DVD player in the LG model but have now been told that since the TV will upconvert, there is no need to purchase a DVD player that does so as well.

What do others think?

take a look at this article-
http://www.projectorcentral.com/480i_vs_480p.htm

the signal ends up at 720p either way but i think that the dvb318 does a better job upconverting hte signal than the tv.

there is also a samsung dvd player that upconverts over dvi only. when i saw the samsung player at a circuit city i didnt see that much of an improvement in the picture quality when the player did the upconversion. but in that case it was hooked up to a capt. kirk samsung dlp.

Service Menu: WB at 01

I haven't received my high def receiver yet. But, with standard definition, I didn't like the WB at 01. The colors look dirty to me. Did anyone else have this impression?

So got the 50 inch panny on 9/30. Once day later I called the store I purchased from and told them that fan noise was a problem. They have a rapid response staff for the immediate problems on big purchases. Anyway, they started a ticket and I was called on it about a day or two later. They said they would order replacement fans. Yes, fans, apparently the panny has 2 fans inside of it. So a week goes by, then I call. One fan is in stock, the other is not. So I wait another week, same story. Finally this week I am getting pissed. I call my salesman back and ask him to look into this. We go back and forth for a couple of days as he checks into it. Slow I know but it turns out Panny is having problems with the fans and because they are replacing them rapidly they are out of stock. The store is setting me up to get a replacement set. I paid more initially but its becoming worth it for this reason alone.

I would characterize the fan noise and beyond tolerable. I can tolerate the HVAC sounds, I can tolerate the noise my PC makes, or my XBOX or ReplayTV, but the panny was excesive and very high pitched.

So the TV will be replaced and I will post once I get it. Hopefully by the weekend. I fully expect a quiet fan and zero problems or its going back until this gets fixed.

Originally posted by forkball
So got the 50 inch panny on 9/30. Once day later I called the store I purchased from and told them that fan noise was a problem. They have a rapid response staff for the immediate problems on big purchases. Anyway, they started a ticket and I was called on it about a day or two later. They said they would order replacement fans. Yes, fans, apparently the panny has 2 fans inside of it. So a week goes by, then I call. One fan is in stock, the other is not. So I wait another week, same story. Finally this week I am getting pissed. I call my salesman back and ask him to look into this. We go back and forth for a couple of days as he checks into it. Slow I know but it turns out Panny is having problems with the fans and because they are replacing them rapidly they are out of stock. The store is setting me up to get a replacement set. I paid more initially but its becoming worth it for this reason alone.

I would characterize the fan noise and beyond tolerable. I can tolerate the HVAC sounds, I can tolerate the noise my PC makes, or my XBOX or ReplayTV, but the panny was excesive and very high pitched.

So the TV will be replaced and I will post once I get it. Hopefully by the weekend. I fully expect a quiet fan and zero problems or its going back until this gets fixed.

I had the exhaust (large) fan replaced (verified small fan was not making the loud whirly noise) with the SAME model fan. No difference. I'm getting a new set, likely SAME model fan.

Are you getting a redesigned or different model fan?

Don't forget to vote on the fan noise issue on p. 47, here's the link.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=459730

Originally posted by forkball
So got the 50 inch panny on 9/30. Once day later I called the store I purchased from and told them that fan noise was a problem. They have a rapid response staff for the immediate problems on big purchases. Anyway, they started a ticket and I was called on it about a day or two later. They said they would order replacement fans. Yes, fans, apparently the panny has 2 fans inside of it. So a week goes by, then I call. One fan is in stock, the other is not. So I wait another week, same story. Finally this week I am getting pissed. I call my salesman back and ask him to look into this. We go back and forth for a couple of days as he checks into it. Slow I know but it turns out Panny is having problems with the fans and because they are replacing them rapidly they are out of stock. The store is setting me up to get a replacement set. I paid more initially but its becoming worth it for this reason alone.

I would characterize the fan noise and beyond tolerable. I can tolerate the HVAC sounds, I can tolerate the noise my PC makes, or my XBOX or ReplayTV, but the panny was excesive and very high pitched.

So the TV will be replaced and I will post once I get it. Hopefully by the weekend. I fully expect a quiet fan and zero problems or its going back until this gets fixed.

I contacted Panasonic about the fan noise and was referred to a local service center. I'm holding off on contacting the service center bec I dont think a replacement fan is going to be a real fix.

The noise is tolerable, however I definitely think that it could be much better. I don't expect near silence but something half as loud would be great. My feeling is that the fan noise is not a manufacturing defect (one off problems). I think it is really a design defect (every tv makes the same amount of noise) it is just that some people notice bec of the size of the room, placement of the tv, sensitivity to noise, etc.

I hope that i am wrong and that replacing the fans results in a much quieter tv bec that would be fixable relatively quickly. but my hunch is that pansaonic is just replacing the old fans with essentially the same noisy fans. it will probably take enough complaints before someone at pansaonic realizes the noise is not tolerable for a significant number of custoemrs and therefore an improved, perhaps larger and slower spinning fan, is available. i think it is still important to contact panasonic and let them know about your concerns.

Just for the record my fan noise is not excessive. My 921 receiver is about as loud. I want to pass on though that after 28 days of ownership my lamp blew. I am guessing I have less than 30 hours on the set. When the service guy comes back to replace the lamp I will know how many hours are on it. They evidently reset the set to zero after bulb replacement.

I am not trying to discourage anyone from purchasing this set. For me it was the best of the DLP's I viewed. Just wanted to post in case lamp failures become an issue.

Anybody have trouble with the Split Screen on this set? I can't seem to get it to work. I have Direct TV through S video into the set as well as the cable. I either see nothing or the same picture in both screens depending on which component I'm viewing in.

Can somebody give me a detailed hook up explanation that will make the picture in picture work.

Thanks

I'm also a new owner of the 50" panny. Got my unit last Saturday. I also hear the fan noise. It is noticible during quiet scenes of a movie. I sit 12' away from the screen.

I have a Z-line Maxxim stand. What type of stand is everyone else using? I curious to find out if the OE stand from Panasonic helps with reducing the fan noise level.

Since I am getting a new set I am not getting a new fan. So I am not sure what the replacement's part numebr would be or anything.

Since I really like this set so much I would consider cracking it open to see about replacing the fans myself if the problem still existed after I got the new set. I would just replace the fans depending on their power connectors of course, with ones that would be quieter. I have a computer background and I know that a fan can be made quiet if they want to while still moving a sufficient amount of air. Unless the vent holes are causing the noise I hear, which I do not think is the case, then it should be taken care of by just using "quiet" PC fans. I would also just switch the damn fans out if there was every another problem and I needed to have the unit serviced to avoid warranty issues.

In terms of a stand I use one from IKEA. I have no idea what the name is. I bought it 4+years ago. I am going to in the next few month's make one of my own out of either Cherry or Oak. I am leaning toward Cherry.

I doubt the stand would dullen this noise unless the stand had quite a bit of sound absorbing foam around the vent opening.

-Anybody have trouble with the Split Screen on this set? I can't seem to get it to work. -

I have had the Panny for about a month now, and the remote has started acting up, including Split Screen being flakey. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. I also can't get the aspect ratio button to work anymore, and the source selection seems intermittent. I thought it was just weak signal, but new batteries haven't changed it. Now I see that someone else is having problems, it's time to call in the service guy.

I'll keep you posted of progress. Love the image quality though. Fan noise acceptable.
bp

Floman -

Thanks for the reply.

I don't think my problem is a system problem. Probably just a connection or setup problem. I'm kind of an idiot with these things. Could you, or anybody, explain how the tv should be wired up through a Direct TV box to see the picture in picture?

There's probably a very simple solution for this. Maybe as simple as switching a channel preset or something similar?

Could you, or anybody, explain how the tv should be wired up through a Direct TV box to see the picture in picture?

Because you are using a set-top box (STB), you can only ever output one channel at a time to your TV. That's why you saw the same picture on both sides at once. In short, all the outputs on the STB show the same channel, all the time.

Unless you get a dual-tuner STB (or an additional receiver), you will be unable to see different channels on each side of the screen simultaneously.

What you can do, however, is have your TV channel on one half, then any other source (besides HDMI or VGA) shown on the other. As an example, I've often got an Xbox hooked up via component on one half of the screen, with cable TV playing on the other.

To do this, simply make a mental note of which input your Xbox is plugged into, then, while watching TV, press the split screen button, then swap, then "TV/Video" followed by the number corresponding to the Xbox input.

Hope that helps.

Originally posted by ayeow
I'm also a new owner of the 50" panny. Got my unit last Saturday. I also hear the fan noise. It is noticible during quiet scenes of a movie. I sit 12' away from the screen.

I have a Z-line Maxxim stand. What type of stand is everyone else using? I curious to find out if the OE stand from Panasonic helps with reducing the fan noise level.

Gosh I was hoping I would not hear the like of your comments...but if you can hear the fan noise from 12' away then the fan noise is an issue.

My sitting position is only about 9' away at most :(

I have a home theater PC placed beside my TV and I can here the (quiet) fans in it, but not in the TV. I also have a PC in my bedroom and at my desk as work. I have HEPA air filter fans in each room in my house as well. All in all I spend very little time NOT listening to fans, so I have just tuned them out. I really think it's a choice of allowing the noise to upset you or not, but the sound of the fan in my 50DL54 is non-existent as far as I am concerned.

Originally posted by forkball
Since I am getting a new set I am not getting a new fan. So I am not sure what the replacement's part numebr would be or anything.

Since I really like this set so much I would consider cracking it open to see about replacing the fans myself if the problem still existed after I got the new set. I would just replace the fans depending on their power connectors of course, with ones that would be quieter. I have a computer background and I know that a fan can be made quiet if they want to while still moving a sufficient amount of air. Unless the vent holes are causing the noise I hear, which I do not think is the case, then it should be taken care of by just using "quiet" PC fans. I would also just switch the damn fans out if there was every another problem and I needed to have the unit serviced to avoid warranty issues.

In terms of a stand I use one from IKEA. I have no idea what the name is. I bought it 4+years ago. I am going to in the next few month's make one of my own out of either Cherry or Oak. I am leaning toward Cherry.

I doubt the stand would dullen this noise unless the stand had quite a bit of sound absorbing foam around the vent opening.

Do you have to remove the entire rear cover in order to access the fans? I can't even see the fans by looking into the vents so I wonder where they are located.

I am not sure as to the location of the fans but if with the new set I get to the replacement point, I will find them:)!

Originally posted by ayeow
I'm also a new owner of the 50" panny. Got my unit last Saturday. I also hear the fan noise. It is noticible during quiet scenes of a movie. I sit 12' away from the screen.

I have a Z-line Maxxim stand. What type of stand is everyone else using? I curious to find out if the OE stand from Panasonic helps with reducing the fan noise level.

No, stand won't make a difference unless the set is vibrating. I've placed my set on a carpeted floor and it is just as loud, even the carpet can't absorb the noise.

I am planning to purchase panny extended warrenty. Anyone has panny warrenty? How many years and cost? TIA!

I don't have the extended panny warranty. I did purchase an extended warranty through Tweeter when I bought the set. 5 years cost be $349 in the Chicago area. It also cover bulb replacement and a once per year tune-up/cleaning. I paid more buying from a brick and mortar store but because I did I will have a new set Sunday due to fan noise issues delivered and set up in my house and they will remove and haul away the old set. I just have to open the damn door for them. To me its worth the extra cost.

I have the 60' set with the OE Panasonic stand about 16' from my sitting position and I still hear the fan noise during quiet scenes or when flipping channels (there is a 1-2 sec quiet moment).

The OE stand does not dampen the noise at all nor does it make it worse.

The fan grill does not vibrate or cause the noise since when you cover the grill with your hand for a few seconds the noise is virtually the same. Also, the grill appears to be part of the cabinet and not a replaceable part.

The problem is with the design of the fan. I aleady had my whole set replaced and the "problem" is still there. I like the set too much to give it back and tend to crank up the volume to drown out the fan whenever possible.

I think the fan noise issue is overblown. Yes, it is audible at low volume. Deal with it. What you have with the Panny DLP is a picture that is clearly superior to all the other DLPs out there. I have had the set for a month and I am still amazed at the picture on Hi-Def channels. It is simply outstanding.

I returned my 50lc13 (Yes, I know it's not a DLP) in part due to the fan noise. We had it for over three weeks, the first week it was dead silent. By the third week the fan noise was audible all over the first floor, and we were turning up the volume to drown it out. By the end of week three, it sounded like a coffee grinder, overpowering the Xbox's drive, the PVR's drive, and even quiet conversation. (OK, not really, but it was annoying.) It was simply insane to keep a $3k device with .50cent fans grinding away.

At the end, I was so PO'd about the L-cheepo fans that had CC pick up the TV.

If you don't have a "bad fan", great.

But some of us did.

What I don't seem to understand is that...some folks claim that the noise is from the fan and others stated that the noise is from the color wheel.

Frankly...I think if after you turn it off and the noise is still there then it's from the fan, otherwise it's from the color wheel.

Can someone clear this up? or do we need to start a poll on whether it's from the fan or the coloer wheel.

Originally posted by Destin
I think the fan noise issue is overblown. Overblown? :D

Amazon Purchase

I am ready to purchase. Two questions:

1- Will panasonic warranty apply if purchased from amazon ?

2- can I purchase a Panasonic extended warranty if purchased fronm Amazon ?

Originally posted by rdkaz
Amazon Purchase

I am ready to purchase. Two questions:

1- Will panasonic warranty apply if purchased from amazon ?

2- can I purchase a Panasonic extended warranty if purchased fronm Amazon ?

The answer is YES to both questions.

As I've said previously in this thread, although Amazon is an excellent reseller you can get this TV from other good Internet retailers for 20% less than Amazon are charging.

Originally posted by RudyMeister
What I don't seem to understand is that...some folks claim that the noise is from the fan and others stated that the noise is from the color wheel.

Frankly...I think if after you turn it off and the noise is still there then it's from the fan, otherwise it's from the color wheel.

Can someone clear this up? or do we need to start a poll on whether it's from the fan or the coloer wheel.

My set has two distinct annoying sounds. One is a high pitched whine that stops immediately after the power button is pressed (diagnosed as the color wheel). The other is a medium frequency "WHRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR", which continues as the set cools down when powered off (one (or both) of the cooling fans).

My local service outlet has a color wheel on backorder, as well as a new fan assembly on its way for me.

I hope it helps, because I love the PQ!

<Anybody have trouble with the Split Screen on this set? I can't seem to get it to work. -

I have had the Panny for about a month now, and the remote has started acting up, >

Well, it was all pilot error. The aspect button only works for 480p and 480i, and since my
Dish 811 is set to 1080i (looks better than 720p) the aspect button won't work. It does work on my DVD player which is 480p. However the 811 also has an aspect button, which works on all channels, so I can change the ratio anyway.

Someone above explained the split screen issue. So obvious when you actually apply neurons to it.

The source selection was intermittent because my center speaker was partially obscuring the IR receiver! I moved the speaker an inch to the left , and the remote is now fully functioning.

Will accept free brain transplant.

Originally posted by floman
Will accept free brain transplant.

No way! You're going to have to pay me for mine.

I sit 8.5 feet away and the fan noise is not noticeable at all.

I guess I lucked out?

I am waiting for this TV to arrive in the local stores here so I can have a look at the PQ and also listen for the fan noise. I wish Panasonic would take care of this soon since many people here are complaining about it.

The rule is to use a bigger fan at a lower rpm - applies to computers as well.

So Yesterday Tweeter was kind enough to just flat out replace my 50" after I had waited 3+ weeks for replacement fans. I turn the set on and what do I hear? Yep, the exact same noise.

I am not at all pleased by this. I know some people in this forum do not have a problem with fan noise and that is great for them. Unfortunately I am not one of the chosen few who can tolerate such a sound. So the way I see it I have a few options. Return the set for a full refund or exchange it for a different modle. That would suck as I love the PQ. I could call them up and insist that they try to repair the issue with the set. I have little confidence that they can. Or I can crack open the box, and figure out a way to replace the fans myself with quieter PC grade ones that move an equal amount of air. The latter option may void some form of my warranty but I would risk it. If I had a problem I figure I can just return the original fans to the unit before a repair tech came out. The final option which I am not thrilled with is to just live with it and if I try I know I will throw my shoe into it at some point when the noise pisses me off enough.

If anyone knew the CFM of the fans or had any info on the fan assembly, that would be great. I would appreciate anything you might have. Does anyone have the service manual? I would be curious about anything it might have regarding the fans.

Thanks