*Edit* Since this is the official thread, please make sure the rules are followed. DO NOT POST PRICING. DO NOT POST DEALER LINKS. DO NOT PM OR ASK FOR PMs REGARDING THE ABOVE.

For the official Tweaks thread start here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=465849


For Daniel's post regarding his experiences with the AE700, see this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4407288

-MP




This site is in German but it says that the Panasonic 700 will be released in September 2004.


http://www.meinheimkino.com/wbb2/thread.php?threadid=3548&sid=70dd7a497420d4ded4b1b6635f7c20d1



http://www.produkte.panasonic.de/product/product.asp?sStr=3@-@1@271@@@@@@@PT-AE700E@Heimkino-Projektor@&altMod=N&upper=&prop=






Auflösung : 1280 x 720
Helligkeit : 1000 Ansi Lumen
Kontrast : 2000 : 1

Smooth Screen
Lens Shift : ja
H/V Keystone : ja
Eingänge: YUV, HDMI, ...

Rear :

Estimated- How much will this projector cost in the US???

Somewhere close to the current L500U price.

Awesome, i am not going to purchase the sanyo z2 then, i will wait to see how good the Panasonic ae700 is, wow! :)

so what is it suppose to be like, how does it differ from the ae500?

what are the upgrades? (maybe lens shift??)

when will it be in production in the usa???

thanx

Don't expect to see it in the US for 4-5 months, unless you import it or they drastically change how they release projectors. If you sift through the info about you can see the differences (lens shift, better contrast and lumens on paper anyway)

Originally posted by bjamez05
what are the upgrades? (maybe lens shift??)

thanx

That is what the little knob is next to the lens ... a lens-shift joystick like on the Sharp B10S ... very nicely done Panasonic!

Pass along the 3 year warranty that we see recently and this thing is a winner.

This one could make me switch to LCD! I love all those inputs in the back and 2000:1 contrast ratio and hopefully great bulb life.

oh ok,

well i am then prolly going to purchase the sanyo Z2 and then in the future i will upgrade when there are really good pjs for $2000 and under! :)

thanx guys for the information!

Edward... there's no way on god's green earth this thing will have a legitimate 2000:1 CR you know ;). Look at the Panny 500's published vs real world specs. If this thing manages to top 1000cr without cheating I'll be happy, but surprised.

I know..... I wish they wouldn't fudge (a lot!) with those stats. I am not in a hurry to upgrade, but you have to admit that those specs made you blink!

man, why would they ditch DVI? i'd rather see them ditch the VGA input, afterall, most new computers have DVI.
i know DVI is no longer intended for HT, but i don't know a single person that has a computer with both DVI and VGA that would rather use VGA, period.

They have HDMI, and the adapter is about $30.

Originally posted by Kamus
man, why would they ditch DVI? i'd rather see them ditch the VGA input, afterall, most new computers have DVI.
i know DVI is no longer intended for HT, but i don't know a single person that has a computer with both DVI and VGA that would rather use VGA, period.

They didn't ditch DVI ... the Scart is an input only put on the European models. The back of the L700U which will be released in America will look a little different.

Funny the D5 panel has 50% more contrast then the D4. It would be nearly impossible to jump 70% in contrast.

Anyone having deja vu from last year right now? All the happy speculation to be later met with so many problems. :)

Are the D5 panels smaller then the D4?

I don't think they are using the D5 panels anyway. I thought it was still the D4s. That aside, keep in mind that the CR level that the D4 CAN achieve is at least 1000 based on the Epson 500's measured CR. So if this unit could top that, then outstanding.

2000 CR is a mighty claim for D4. If it were D5 it might be worth it. I do like the slick design.

MP
Did you ever work your problem out yet with the Cinema 500?

If Panasonic can produce a projector with twice the contrast of the AE500 and lens shift for the same money, then they will really have a winner, despite the skepticism here.


Now about that vertical banding...

I think I've got it traced to my cables. Once I fired up my PC and started running DVI as opposed to component, everything looked superb. It is definately a step up from the Z2 and L500. I would probably not pay much more than what I paid for it, but at the price I got it I'm content.

Man, I hope it would come out late (like begin of next year) but not sooner.

I want to be able to enjoy ;) mine new toy for couple of months

Hmm. I am kinda interested in if it will do 1280*720 at 50hz!(pal) And do you see that they have moved the air intake to the front or back? Don't know which yet :) And if panasonic want to beat the z2 in the noise compartement, then the AE700 have to be only 23db!!!

Thanks to dvd jan, nice to see at least one norwegian here!
Do you have the link to the german site?

Edward... there's no way on god's green earth this thing will have a legitimate 2000:1 CR you know . Look at the Panny 500's published vs real world specs. If this thing manages to top 1000cr without cheating I'll be happy, but surprised.


The AE500 actually reaches already a measured CR of 1200:1 . They didnt lie about the AE500, i dont expect them to lie about the 700 then...

Regards,
Ekkehart, www.cine4home.de

Ekkehart, you've got more experience than me but where have you seen real world measurements of the AE500 at a 1200:1 CR? Are we talking high power with the AI on or something? Everything I've seen said they overbilled it... and then of course there is the lumens ;).

Even the Epson 500/Yammy 510X, in Cinema Black mode (which is about 75% iris and 315 lumens) only managed a CR of 1050:1 in the WSR review and they said it was the best they'd ever seen in an LCD projector.

No way an ae500 gets 1200 CR when properly calibrated. An Epson 500 barely makes it over 1k.


See this review

After tweaking, I measured 365 ANSI lumens in Normal mode. Brightness ranged from 645 lumens in Dynamic mode to 120 lumens in Cinema 1 mode. The projector is not terribly bright; don’t expect it to blow you away under high ambient lighting. A plain matte screen is best with this projector, although a gray screen would pull those black levels down more.

Contrast performance was very good with readings of 242:1 ANSI (average) and 328:1 peak (checkerboard). Brightness uniformity on average to any corner was 55%, which isn’t anything to write home about. (The best LCD projectors can usually achieve 70% or better brightness uniformity.) Low brightness uniformity means you might see a hot spot if you used a high gain screen with the PT-AE500U.


http://www.hdtvexpert.com/Pages/ae500.htm

wow.. and my ae500 is only 6 months old...

should i upgrade? or wait another year when they will release a 1080p pojector :-)... i think that will happen :-)

since i'm using HTPC via dvi, how will this then work? can i get an adaptor to connect my DVI ouput to HDMI ?

Originally posted by Robert Clark
Now about that vertical banding...

Exactly! This is my main concern right now. Do I dare to hope they have eliminated the VB-problem on this?

If the Ae700 uses the old D4 panel I personally say no if you have the 500u. However if it has the D5 panel then ys it will be an upgrade. I doubt the AE700 will be using the D5 panel.

Originally posted by trailergod

since i'm using HTPC via dvi, how will this then work? can i get an adaptor to connect my DVI ouput to HDMI ?

Yes, DVI to HDMI cables are available and not too expensive.

No way this thing will hit 2000:1 and I am sure everyone who has been in this game for a few years realizes that. I mean, most DLPs don't truly hit 2000:1 so this new LCD won't magically better them in CR when it has been proven over time that LCD is inferior to DLP with respect to CR. I say the 700 will hit 1000:1 if they are using the D4 panels and maybe 1200:1 if they are using the D5 panels. That is just my guesstimate:)

All I know is I won't be upgrading to the next batch of LCD pjs even if they do provide better CR than the Epson 500. I think my Epson 500 will be good enough for me for at least 2-3 generations. The next PJ I want to get is a 1080p pj (dlp, lcd, sxrd, whatever) that has great contrast and not many problems. Hopefully in 2-3 years that pj will become a reality and will be around 5 grand in price.


Ekkehart,

If the Panny L500 hits 1200:1 then the Epson must hit like 1600:1.:)

Seriously, you are the only person who has said the Panny can hit its rated spec when the thing is properly calibrated.

They didn't ditch DVI ... the Scart is an input only put on the European models. The back of the L700U which will be released in America will look a little different.Yes, they did. :p There’s no relation between an added SCART connector and missing DVI. Current European models have the same inputs as the North American ones (including DVI), with the addition of a SCART connector.

So I’m certain that the North American model will be missing the DVI input as well.

Cheers.

Mid next year will be two years with my 200u. This could be the machine I upgrade to, maybe. No sign of HD-DVD yet so if that peeks it's head out sometime next year, I'm upgrading. If not I'll wait another year for the AE-800 :)

Watch the AE700 will be perfect but for some reason it won't do something like 1:1 pixel mapping.

After Panasonic did this with the 300u I will never trust them again.

Hi Monkey_Man and others,

Interesting to see you guys know so much about a upcoming product!

For me I only want the END of VB.

regards,

Li On

If the AE-700 does away with VB I'll upgrade my AE-500 in a heart beat. To me - the elimination of VB would be the most important modification Panasonic could make. That would be #1 on my wish list. Lens shift would be #2 - and is very welcomed. Any increase (however small) in contrast ratio would be #3.

Is there any indication whether Panasonic will continue with their (moronic) separate Consumer and Business models of the 700? I qualify for an employee discount on the consumer model, but not on the business model. And since they recently stopped selling the consumer model of the 500, I have to either wait for a consumer 700 or decide to buy a different projector without discount. Any hints?

VB is a problem that shouln't exsist at all. i mean, CR and fill factor is technology limitation, but VB is just bad quality control.
so it seems better blacks are in order, this is very welcome, as they are defenetly lacking in the current model, a bit of increased fill factor will help a bit in the peek a boo scanlines department.. but to be honest, i expected this to pretty much go away, as i thought they'd use 1080p instead of 720p. (even with out the added fill factor on the new panel 1080p would beat it in a heartbeat!).

so hopefully, this time around epson and all of their clients will hopefuly have better quality control and give us a VB free display.

If the 700 uses d4 panels too, i would think that the vb is exactly the same. Db specs where are you! I'm so exited about how little noise it will make.

Here you have a picture

http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/files/ae700_highresized.jpg

Nacho.

Hmm... they changed the form factor anyway.

PT-AE700E pdf (http://www.produkte.panasonic.de/product/fs_pdf.asp?id=PT-AE700E&sDateiPfad=http%3A//217.7.21.86/pdf_printing_neu/index.asp%3Fsrc%3D1%26group%3D271%26model%3DPT-AE700E)

Does anyone know how to translate a pdf?

1000 ANSI in normal mode
850 ANSI in eco mode

Could this be right?

Also says 27 db in normal mode, wonder what it is in eco mode?

Doubtful, unless they've decided to stop inflating their specs ;)

Threads mereged, we didn't need 2.

Originally posted by madpoet
Hmm... they changed the form factor anyway.

Lol! I think it looks like a philips product now. But it looks simple and beutiful to me.

This picture shows that the air intake is still on the side.
And on the other you can see the air filter.

http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/files/ae700_highresized.jpg

http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/download.php?id=9270

Another specs link.

AE700 (http://www.produkte.panasonic.de/product/product.asp?sStr=3@-@1@271@@@@@@@PT-AE700E@Heimkino-Projektor@&altMod=N&upper=&prop=)

Google translation....

Here (http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.produkte.panasonic.de%2Fproduct %2Fproduct.asp%3FsStr%3D3@-@1@271@@@@@@@PT-AE700E@Heimkino-Projektor@%26altMod%3DN%26upper%3D%26prop%3D&langpair=de%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=%2Flanguage_tools)

Thanks for all the info so far! Here's hoping no VB

- Brett

Thanks for the translation B.Wilson.

Does hdmi have the same problems with cable length as dvi does?

Looks like panasonic want to be ahead of the z3, because last year panasonic released the 500 first in japan then in america and at last europe. And now AE700 will have WORLD RELEASE at september. Go for it Panasonic!

I am a noob with pj's so please help me out here. Just when I am ready to pull the trigger and make a decision between the Panny 500 and the Z2, I find that IF is pulling out the 5000 and now panny is pulling out a 700.

Is this always the case. Am I ever going to find a time when it is not prudent to wait and see... Or is this abnormal?

DSL

The lack of DVI might be more hurtful for HTPC users than evryone realizes, this *could* mean no 1:1 pixel maping (at least digital 1:1), the reason is, on "HDTV inputs" there's overscan in the panny 500, and if this is treated as one, it will probably have overscan, hopefuly they'll add an option to enable/disable overscan (i belive this overscan is so that 1.85 movies fit the screen entirely)

If this is really released in september and the specs turn out to be half of what they claim then you should get the 700. Hopefully Vb is worked out and the contrast is 1000 or better calibrated. That would be twice the projector my 500u is now. I'll get one myself. I can live with the 1280x720 still. As long as this projector performs.

I was thinkin about the Yamaha 510. What do you guys think?

Originally posted by Kamus
The lack of DVI might be more hurtful for HTPC users than evryone realizes, this *could* mean no 1:1 pixel maping (at least digital 1:1), the reason is, on "HDTV inputs" there's overscan in the panny 500, and if this is treated as one, it will probably have overscan, hopefuly they'll add an option to enable/disable overscan (i belive this overscan is so that 1.85 movies fit the screen entirely)
an HDMI <> DVI adapter should solve this problem.

Heimkinofeeling polyurethane promises the Pt-ae700e.

if we're to believe the hype this projector will leave no more desires open.

I assume it will be on display at the CEDIA show this year. Can't wait to see it :)

reaper

yipchunyu, that's my point exactly, the HDMI input will probably be just a "HDTV input" wich means it will have overscan if it's treated like one, but like i said, hopefully they'll just add an option to turn overscan off.

Originally posted by Kamus
yipchunyu, that's my point exactly, the HDMI input will probably be just a "HDTV input" wich means it will have overscan if it's treated like one, but like i said, hopefully they'll just add an option to turn overscan off.

i heard that Hitachi's TX100 has the overscan control (don't know it's true or not). Just hope the AE700 has the same kind of function.

UK supplier AVland now have it on their site. Not sure there's any new info in it.


http://www.avland.co.uk/panasonic/ptae700/pt-ae700.htm

based on the web site's info. 14' will project how big an image? both the min and max

Originally posted by yipchunyu
i heard that Hitachi's TX100 has the overscan control (don't know it's true or not). Just hope the AE700 has the same kind of function.
yup, the Hitachi TX100 has the overscan control (default at 100)

Originally posted by Dr_F
UK supplier AVland now have it on their site. Not sure there's any new info in it.
http://www.avland.co.uk/panasonic/ptae700/pt-ae700.htm

1,399.95 GBP = 2,578.40 USD
United Kingdom Pounds United States Dollars

Is that MSRP?

If not, my apologies for putting something other than MSRP on the site.

reaper

Until we know official MSRP, speculation is fine. All indications are that it will be in our price range, and early word was that it would be close in cost to the existing MSRP for the L500U.

Originally posted by yipchunyu
based on the web site's info. 14' will project how big an image? both the min and max
Well, from my calculations based on the website info, I get a throw-ratio range of 1.18-1.45 (short-throw, with fairly small zoom-range) So for 14' projector distance, you are looking at image size between 115"-142"... Seems too big to me (not enough lumens to support this size. And your seating distance will have to be accordingly distant.) You probably need a pj with a longer throw ratio. Or find a way to shorten that mounting distance a bit..

Well, I hope it's MSRP. That's a bit high if it's street price. That could set back my purchase another few months. Is avs planning to offer the unit for sale, madpoet? I'd love to buy it from avs at a great price.

reaper

Ask the sales people ;) I just mod here! AVS has traditionally not carried many LCD projectors (despite my pleas to the contrary). Start bugging them if it's something you'd like to see.

If I were in the UK, I would not think this projector is worth £600 more than the Pj-Tx100 unless the contrast really is 2000:1

Ah... but here in the US, this thing will likely be around HALF the price of the Tx-100.... ae700 will almost certainly be worth HALF a tx100.

In fact, if it even comes close to tx100 performance (and it may well SURPASS it for all we know), Hitachi will have a real hard time selling any tx100s here.

Originally posted by exsodius
Thanks for the translation B.Wilson.

Does hdmi have the same problems with cable length as dvi does?

Looks like panasonic want to be ahead of the z3, because last year panasonic released the 500 first in japan then in america and at last europe. And now AE700 will have WORLD RELEASE at september. Go for it Panasonic!

HDMI is a better standard than DVI. If I could quote the HDMI.ORG Faq:

Does HDMI accommodate long cable lengths?
Yes. HDMI technology has been designed to use standard copper cable construction at long lengths. In order to allow cable manufacturers to improve their products through the use of new technologies, HDMI specifies the required performance of a cable but does not specify a maximum cable length. Cable manufacturers are expected to sell reasonably priced copper cables at lengths of up to 15 meters. As semiconductor technology improves, even longer stretches can be reached with fiber optic cables. Longer cables are available with fiber or amplifiers.


Link to HDMI article here (http://www.hdmi.org/faq/faq.asp)

That would be nice, nice long fibre optic cable runs for your video! If you have DVI connectors that's fine too - there is adaptors available.

Oh no!

Panasonic have remowed all info from the specification links!

Maybe a hacker laid this sites out on panasonic web pages.
Maybe this only was a false alarm?


ae700pdf (http://www.produkte.panasonic.de/product/fs_pdf.asp?id=PT-AE700E&sDateiPfad=http%3A//217.7.21.86/pdf_printing_neu/index.asp%3Fsrc%3D1%26group%3D271%26model%3DPT-AE700E)

ae700spec (http://www.produkte.panasonic.de/product/product.asp?sStr=3@-@1@271@@@@@@@PT-AE700E@Heimkino-Projektor@&altMod=N&upper=&prop=)

I'am pretty sure it gonna be announced at Cebit 2004. Someone just find a link in advance. Someone at Websupport must have seen the bandwidth or someone reported it to them (panasonic forum member) and they shot it down...

Originally posted by potus
Well, from my calculations based on the website info, I get a throw-ratio range of 1.18-1.45 (short-throw, with fairly small zoom-range) So for 14' projector distance, you are looking at image size between 115"-142"... Seems too big to me (not enough lumens to support this size. And your seating distance will have to be accordingly distant.) You probably need a pj with a longer throw ratio. Or find a way to shorten that mounting distance a bit..

thx for your calculation. I think it's quite similar to the old one. May be I need to find a better way to mount it.:(

I have an L500. Could somone give me a hint on how to calibrate it? :-) Please?

AE 500 tips and tricks
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=319257
THis forum has an excellent search function :-)
Mike

Wow!
It is very cool to see the release of this new PJ.
I was considering the AE-500 as my next projector. I will be watching the reviews on the new 700 very closely.

Craig :)

Originally posted by suffolk112000
Wow!
It is very cool to see the release of this new PJ.
I was considering the AE-500 as my next projector. I will be watching the reviews on the new 700 very closely.

Craig :)

You're in the same situation then me. I'am planning to buy next year and if the projector really have 1:2000 CR and the same retail price than the AE500 i'll definatly buy this one!

Thank you :-) I have a memory the size of a small pea... I just need some coaching some times.

Originally posted by exsodius
Oh no!

Panasonic have remowed all info from the specification links!

Maybe a hacker laid this sites out on panasonic web pages.
Maybe this only was a false alarm?


ae700pdf (http://www.produkte.panasonic.de/product/fs_pdf.asp?id=PT-AE700E&sDateiPfad=http%3A//217.7.21.86/pdf_printing_neu/index.asp%3Fsrc%3D1%26group%3D271%26model%3DPT-AE700E)

ae700spec (http://www.produkte.panasonic.de/product/product.asp?sStr=3@-@1@271@@@@@@@PT-AE700E@Heimkino-Projektor@&altMod=N&upper=&prop=)

Did anyone download the pdf before they pull it? I am wondering how much lens shift can this thing do. I almost put my money down for TX100 but it only can do 1/4 horizontal lens shift. If AE700 can do 1/2 lens shift, it will be big plus for me.

Originally posted by uranium
Did anyone download the pdf before they pull it? I am wondering how much lens shift can this thing do. I almost put my money down for TX100 but it only can do 1/4 horizontal lens shift. If AE700 can do 1/2 lens shift, it will be big plus for me.

It didn't say anything about that. But i think this links where scams. I read ae500 specs at the same site and it looked like this was copied and edited. With just a few changes. So i think we got fooled by this.

I wont get more exited until cedia is finished, and we get the real stuff.

Originally posted by uranium
Did anyone download the pdf before they pull it? I am wondering how much lens shift can this thing do. I almost put my money down for TX100 but it only can do 1/4 horizontal lens shift. If AE700 can do 1/2 lens shift, it will be big plus for me.

Here it is.(remember maybe fake)

• Highly soluble (prisvärd?) 16:9 panel with 1.280 x of 720 pixels
• hp mixing CCIT place
• Lense SHIFT function
• 1,000 ANSI lumens
• contrast relationship 2000:1
• horizontal +vertikale trapezoid correction

noncommittal price recommendation 1,999.00 EURO

LCD projector
Panasonic brings perfect to cinema atmosphere home! For genuine Kinofeeling in the own four walls the new LCD projector PT-AE700E provides. The newest model of the AE series makes home cinema owing to its equipment characteristics and for one 16:9 LCD chip an unforgettable experience.

The projector is HDTV suited with a resolution of 1280 x 720 pixels and provides owing to new Smooth screen technology, a contrast relationship of 2000:1 as well as a hp mixing CCIT place and a luminous intensity of 850 ANSI lumens for a super sharp and clear picture, which leaves no more desires open. Numerous connection types leave no more desires open. The horizontal and vertical trapezoid correction works against inadvertent distortions. Owing to the Lense SHIFTS function is ensured a increased Einstellungsflexiblitaet without losses of the image quality. So the equipment can be positioned at will in the area. By means of new Design Panasonic creates true schmuckstuecke for each modern living room, which is almost noiseless thanks 27 railways operating noise in the image mode. Heimkinofeeling polyurethane promises the PT-AE700E.

Panasonic PT-AE700
Progressive scan technology compatibility allows for high quality images
HDMI (High-Definition Multimedia Interface) Digital Link
Lens Shift Joystick
10bit full digital processing & digital gamma processing
27db Low Fan noise
Powerful images produced by a 16:9 wide LCD panel
Short focal lens lets you enjoy large-screen images across a small room
Brightness of 1000 ANSI lumens, 2000:1 high contrast ratio
Compact and Portable, Simple Configuration
Smooth screen technology
High Resolution panel 1280x720 Pixels
Vertical and Horizontal Keystone adjustment
Full 10 bit Processing & Gamma Correction
1024 shades of gradation (1 billion colours)
Short throw capability 100 inch diagonal at a distance of 3.1m


Specifications for the PTAE700 Projector

Power supply AC: 100 V - 240V, 50 Hz/60Hz
Power Consumption 180W (<1 W on standby)
LCD Panel 0.7" (diagonal) polysilicon TFT Wide LCD Panel (x3 RGB)
Pixels 1280×720
Lens 22 - 26.2mm
Manual zoom
Lamp 130UHM lamp
Brightness: 850 ANSI Lumens
Scanning Frequency for RGB signals fH 30 kHz - 70 kHz, fv 50 Hz - 87 Hz
YPBPR signals 480i/480p/576i/576p/720p/1080i.
Colour system NTSC/NTSC4.43/PAL/PAL-M/PAL-N/SECAM
Projection Size 40" - 200" (16:9 Aspect ratio)
Throw distance 1.2m to 7.4m
Installation Front/Rear/Ceiling/Desk
Video Inputs S-Video: 1xMini DIN 4-pin
Composite Video:1xRCA phono socket
Component Video: RCA phono sockets x 3
RGB Scart
HDMI Input
PC: D-sub HD 15-pin
PTAE700 Dimensions Width 280mm
Height 85mm
Depth 269mm
Weight 2.9Kg
Operating Temperature 0oC - 40oC (32oF - 104oF)
Operating Humidity 20% - 80% (no condensation)
PT-AE700 Supplied Accessories AC cord
AV cable
Remote Control
Lens Cap

Thanks exsodius. I guess I'll wait until Cedia to find out then.

I'm confused with the spec lumens. Why does it say 1,000 ASNI Lumen at one end and then 850 Lumens at another? Well, maybe it doesn't matter... Only the calibrated brightness counts anyway.

Originally posted by uranium
I'm confused with the spec lumens. Why does it say 1,000 ASNI Lumen at one end and then 850 Lumens at another? Well, maybe it doesn't matter... Only the calibrated brightness counts anyway.

Exactly!

This is one of the reasons i thougt they had only edited the AE500 site :)
AE500 has 850 ANSI. And i dont think AE700 will have the same.

Wait and see.

Hmmmm...well, if this projector comes out along the same time lines as with every other year, I guess late November we'll see AE700's being imported from Japan or maybe the UK?...in North America late December 04/Jan 05?

It'll be interesting to see how the projector does in reviews etc.

From Epson's release, I think that the only way for Panasonic to get to 2000:1 is to use the AI trick with a huge color temperature. I just don't see anything close to 2000:1 in the new D5 panel (unless CR for an LCD is additive, but that's a different discussion...).

From http://www.epson.co.jp/e/newsroom/news_2004_06_28.htm:
Sample specifications (for 0.7-inch, 720p model)

Technology | D4 | D5 |
Effective pixels | 1284 x 724 |
Screen size (diagonal) | 0.7" (1.8 cm) |
Pixel pitch | 12 µm | 12 µm |
Aperture ratio | 50% | 60% |
Contrast | 500 : 1 | 750 : 1 |

Note the fill factor increase and the CR increase (is that a 2250 theoretical maximum up from a 1500:1 theoretical maximum?). However, a 50% bump in contrast gets you to around 1300:1 without a filter, but with using the AI feature (~50% increase there) assuming that the D5 panels are even ready for production-level shipment.

Later,
Bill

Which makes me ask how Hitachi and Epson 500's contrast are each able to rival the Panny 500 and Sanyo Z2 while using the same LCD panel. Granted, its not a hugh difference, but its there, and some argue its big enough that it makes the picture quite a bit better.

They don't rival the Z2 and Panny 500, in the Epson's case they stomp it into the ground ;). The Epson had a calibrated CR of something like 1050:1 in Cinma Back mode. That far outstrips what Panasonic and Sanyo did, and with the same panels.

That's also why I was curious as to whether LCD theoretical contrast was additive across the panels. Yes, the Epson is very close to DLP in its picture, and it blows away any other LCD I've ever demo'ed.

Later,
Bill

"That's also why I was curious as to whether LCD theoretical contrast was additive across the panels."

Oh, I thought you were joking. Every part in the optical path with an affect on CR is contributing to black level, and adding to the black levels always means less CR.

Right. I wasn't going to say exactly how much better they are, as I don't know myself exactly. Point is, both Epson and Hitachi are better, and yet they have the same panels as the Panny and Z2.

I guess when one projector has better contrast, its only a matter of tweaking to get the black level correct. I imagine you can pretty well make the absolute black level of lower contrast ratio PJ close to the higher contrast ratio PJ, but of course, brightness will be reduced and so there you have the deficiency of contrast ratio.

Taking away light only lowers contrast. Black is black and you want all the light you can get in the overall design. Of course, with LCD's, black level is still an issue regardless of contrast ratios. So far the Epson seems to be doing the best. I wonder how the Epson 200 fairs against the Hitachi PJ TX100. One things for sure, I don't think the light modulation is as effective in boosting contrast ratio as overall design is.

Originally posted by noah katz
Oh, I thought you were joking. Every part in the optical path with an affect on CR is contributing to black level, and adding to the black levels always means less CR.

Noah - This doesn't make sense to me. Black level is set by the light source and then the ability of things in the light path to block that source. Since I'm a pretty simple guy, I see that there are two easy ways of calculating an LCDs theoretical maximum CR: the highest CR of any one component panel or the additive CRs of all of the panels. Until the Epson came along, my understanding was that it was the CR of one panel (the first method). However, I'd be pretty surprised if the iris and filter more than doubled the theoretical CR of the D4 panels in the TW500. Hence my question as real (but still for another topic).

Back on topic, even if CR does work as an additive function, there's still no way for the Panasonic to hit 2000:1 at anything approaching D65.

Later,
Bill

Originally posted by uranium
I'm confused with the spec lumens. Why does it say 1,000 ASNI Lumen at one end and then 850 Lumens at another? Well, maybe it doesn't matter... Only the calibrated brightness counts anyway.

At the orginal link in German at the bottom of the Forum the Admin states that in normal lamp mode its 1000 lumen and in econo lamp mode its 850

is this (or was this) the legit specs?? or all we all getting excited for nothing? AS USA AND AUS PANASONIC havent said a word???

Originally posted by noah katz
"That's also why I was curious as to whether LCD theoretical contrast was additive across the panels."

Oh, I thought you were joking. Every part in the optical path with an affect on CR is contributing to black level, and adding to the black levels always means less CR.
Okay, you guys have me confused as to what you are saying. Adding to the black level can mean the same CR if you are also increasing the white level the same amount. For instance, changing a bulb from low to high should raise the black level, but basically leave the CR the same.

I think these CR numbers quoted for the panels must be ANSI or just very conservative on/off numbers. Other than light path complexity and extra reflections, 3 panels shouldn't have lower CR than a single panel any more than 3 projectors stacked would have lower CR than one projector by itself.

--Darin

Darin,

I was responding to what sounded like the idea that CR would *improve* with more paqnels.

Noah - a fourth panel in serial with the three parallel ones would improve CR. My curiousity is piqued now due to the performance of the Epson 500 with respect to its "theoretical" performance of 500 CR. Per Darin's point, that may be max ANSI contrast, but I'm not sure why Epson would hype an ANSI CR number, given the criticism of on/off CR.

As I said, you guys are agreeing with how I thought it worked prior to getting the Epson...

Later,
Bill

Bill,

Oh, right, *that* additional panel:)

another site about it in the uk http://www.avland.co.uk/panasonic/ptae700/pt-ae700.htm

Panasonic AE700 was officially announced in Japan.

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/av/docs/20040902/pana.htm



release in Japan: Oct 08
list price: No MSRP. but they hope 250,000 Yen
new 130W UHM lamp. ET-LAE700(3000 hours).
bright: 1000 lumen (<- AE500: 850 lumen)
contrast: 2000;1 (<- AE500: 1300:1)
optical zoom : F1.9¢¦F3.1 (<- AE500:F1.9¢¦2.2)
lens shift fuction
HDMI input
size; 335¡¿270¡¿95mm (<-AE500: 280¡¿269¡¿80mm)
weight : 3.6kg (<- AE500: 2.9kg)


- Panasonic Japan is saying that AE700 uses D4 panel. (not D5 panel).
- Epson new projector (TW200H) seems to use D4 panel, too.
- D5 panel is not yet adapted on any projector.

Arigato Kaneda!

Apart from what you mentioned, I'd note:

Dynamic iris
Eight-point colour management (as in the Hitachi TX100)
2x zoom - you can fill a 100" screen from 3m-6m distance

Great stuff..hopefully we can get our hands on it by the end of the year (shame about no DVI plug though). I emailed price Japan yesterday and I received a reply today, which quotes:

"Sorry we don't have any information about about Sanyo Z3, Panasonic AE700, Sony HS51"

It's always an exciting time when a new projector gets announced, especially an LCD which is affordably priced, has strong black levels, 1080p support, no VB (oh well...maybe next year).

So, it seems as though the DLP camp is always saying that it is worth getting a DLP and sacraficing resolution to get the better contrast ratio. The unit in mind is the 4805. But, when I look at the contrast ratio and brightness of the 4805, I see 2200:1 and 750 lumens. Comparing that to this AE700, I see 2000:1 and 1000 lumens.

It doesn't seem like there is a huge gulf of difference. Is that because the LCD data they are providing is not believable? Have the specs always been this close but real life experience shows DLP to be better? Or is due to the improvement of LCD technology and this round of LCD projectors might actually be close to DLP as far as contrast and black levels are concerned?

reaper

Originally posted by Grubert
Arigato Kaneda!

Apart from what you mentioned, I'd note:

Dynamic iris
Eight-point colour management (as in the Hitachi TX100)
2x zoom - you can fill a 100" screen from 3m-6m distance

Dynamic iris as in same as what Sony and Epson are announcing/doing? Where did you find this information?? All I can find is the AI-function / Kunstliche Intelligenz which I thought was the same lamp modulation as on the AE500. If true this machine just got really interesting IMHO

Originally posted by lungan71
Dynamic iris as in same as what Sony and Epson are announcing/doing? Where did you find this information??

Paragraph 1 of their release announcement translated by babelfish:

"Dynamic iris"
Being linked the lamp light intensity and the gamma data with the contraction mechanism of individual development, according to the image scene, it controls. At the same company, it has made the world first as a liquid crystal projector. Because of this, worldwide first contrast 2,000: It was compatible 1 and brightness 1,000lm.
The "dynamic iris" and, being linked also the gamma data to real time simultaneously, the light intensity of the illuminant lamp is controlled according to the former image scene in addition to "projector AI technology", it controls. The dynamic range was made to expand, you say that expression power "of black" was expanded.

And I thought my English was bad.

Thanks Grubert. Guess I was just surprised that they despite dynamic iris only speced a CR of 2000:1 when Sony claims 5000:1 with similar technology. Panasonic hasn't exactly underspeced their previous LCD-projectors so why would they now.

If you are trying to develop a machine that specs well, and you have a dynamic iris, why not go for the gold (literally)? Especially given how many people shop on specs alone.

Think about it this way:
Contrast Ratio is just that - a ratio of maximum light output vs. minimum light output. There is nothing in the measurement that indicates "usability".
If 0 IRE is .001 lumens, and 100 IRE is 2 lumens (aka 2000:1), is this really usable?
How good is the AI controlling the IRIS? The specs on the mechanics for most irises are quite good (e.g. millisecond range), but the AI is realitiscally going to be the limiting factor. If the AI is "slow", or if it misses entirely, then you end-up with a cool toy that is totally unusable.

Now, all that being said, who's going to buy first? Because I relaly hope they got it right the first time out. But I doubt it...

Later,
Bill

PS: Sony is claiming 6000:1, but that may be pushing it in terms of black crush...

What makes you think they will not get it right?

Because they haven't yet.... first time for everything I suppose.

Panasonic just released the info on their Japan site

http://panasonic.jp/theater/projector/index.html

Hope they will fix the VB once n for all.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

woohoo! Good news!

However, I'm sad :o due to the fact that’s I just acquired the Hitachi TX100 and now something else come out better.

Very sad

Ok, here it is... this is an English product brief for the Aussie version it seems. Thanks for providing it xframe:

Get it here (http://www.stansel.org/AE700E.pdf)

Thank you madpoet!

I was close to buying an AE500 this month. I will definately wait the extra couple of months for this to come out. I've heard it will be out the end of the month overseas. Hopefully it will be in the states by Xmas.

Hmm, so they claim that dynamic iris in conjunction with lamp modulation gets you the best of both worlds? (bright images, and at the same time, dark ones??)

i was under the impression that closing the iris reduced light output, can someone explain how this is possible?

Wow, a 2x zoom plus lens shift, that should make it definitely one of the most flexible ones. What kills me though is, if they can have a powered lens shift (I assume that from the joystick control), why stop short of a powered zoom? Still, unless there's something seriously wrong with the picture, or the price is way higher than the AE500, this looks hard to beat.

First shipment into australia expected September 24

Light leakage is reduced by using twin blades. As the exhaust fan is on its front, the projector only needs a narrow site.

Front mounted fan? I'd rather see them say "There is NO light leakage."

Uwe,

I don't think that the projector has powered lens shift.
If you look at the front view of the projector (page 4 of the brochure) you can see the joy stick, that manually adjusts the lens shift.

Horst

Kamus, I think they change the gamma dynamical and try to maximise intrascene contrast on any given frame --- no other way I can imagine to achieve the effect. Does it really work? Will the image still look like intended? Well I think we have to wait for the first review. I am wondering if a true D65 calibration is possible with these dynamical features.

--Peter

empire it is always like that

Originally posted by Horst
I don't think that the projector has powered lens shift.

I did see the joystick, which looks like a tiny little nub. If it's indeed just a mechanical stick, considering the tiny size and I'm sure a certain mechanical resistance of the lens shift mechanism, I envision quite a lack of accuracy in getting the right adjustment. You know, it sticks, then all of a sudden releases and overshoots. That's why I was assuming a power shift. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

dakyman:

Any idea what the Aussie MSRP is ? Are Panasonic discontinuing the AE500 immediately and substituting it with this model or just positioning the AE700 at a higher price segment initially ?

I might buy this over my other short listed projectors (4805,TX100) if it lives up to the brochure. Do they ever ? :) The reality is in Australia all 3 projectors will probably be within 200 US dollars of each other after some gentle haggling.

On a side note the only 3 brands we get reasonably priced in Australia are Panasonic, Hitachi (the tx100 actually being cheaper here than the US) and BenQ. Sony, Infocus and Optoma rape us over here :(

Here is it AE700 (http://www.produkte.panasonic.de/product/product.asp?sStr=3@-@1@271@@@@@@@PT-AE700E@Heimkino-Projektor@&altMod=N&upper=&prop=)

Aviable 01.10.2004 in germany.
Also has a new pdf.

This baby is mine :)

RGB:
Horizontal: 30–70 kHz, Vertical: 50–87 Hz

YPBPR:
480i (525i): fH 15.75 kHz; fV 60 Hz
576i (625i): fH 15.63 kHz; fV 50 Hz
480p (525p): fH 31.5 kHz; fV 60 Hz
576p (625p): fH 31.25 kHz; fV 50 Hz
720p (750p): fH 45 kHz; fV 50 Hz yeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaahhh!:)
720p (750p): fH 45 kHz; fV 60 Hz
1080i (1125i): fH 33.75 kHz; fV 60 Hz
1080i (1125i): fH 28.125 kHz; fV 50 Hz

S-Video/Video:
fH 15.625 kHz; fV 50 Hz (PAL, SECAM, PAL-N)
fH 15.75 kHz; fV 60 Hz (NTSC, NTSC 4.43, PAL-M, PAL 60)

So now we know that this will work via component. But still wonder how it will be with dvi to hdmi at 50hz?

Yep, the AE500 will cease immediately as of AE700 arriving here Sept 24, and pricing is exactly the same at both dealer and retail level as the AE500.

Hmm thats very good news. i have seen the ae500 as low as $2850 AUD in australia. Do you think we need to pre order or are they brining in large amount ?

Having the lens shift is great but the real plus for me is the 2X zoom. You dont see many of the Japanese brands with that sort of long throw capability in their models.

Orders have been placed this week, initial stocks wont be massive, so dealers are pre-ordering now. Its very much going to be a first in first served situation, this first shipment wont last long, there are already currently large back orders on the AE500 as it is.
By the way, actual stocks will arrive before the sales team even get their demo model!

Interesting. As always, it will be interesting to see how the AE700 fairs in reviews and tests by folks around the world.

My main concern is that with all this talk of an increase in the contrast for this AE700, what will the checkerboard contrast be like compared to its nearest rivals, the Hitachi TX100 and Epson 500/Yam510? Lamp and Iris modulation sound interesting, but there are too many scenes with dark black areas and bright light areas, and those scenes need the native LCD contrast to be high. Thats measured by the checkerboard, right? I think I get the point about the gamma correction, but all this "on-the-fly" stuff isn't exactly my cup of tea. Shoot this puppy out against the TX100 and Yam 510.

What we need to know about the upcoming AE700:

1) Whats it like in low lamp mode compared to the above PJ's?
2) How's the vertical banding?
3) Peak-a-boo's? Smooth screen is unique to Panny but its old hat when peak-a-boo's lessen the benefits.

Is it just me, or does it seem like the projectors are starting to come out a little earlier, like the AE700, and sometimes out of the blue, in the case of the Hitachi TX100. Maybe the release of the Hitachi TX100 spurred the AE700's release to be a month or two sooner?

Isn't DVI an RGB spec? My guess is that it would be in the 50 - 87 Hz spec. As for how robust the implementation is, well, hasn't that been an on-again/off-again issue for a while now? ;)

Later,
Bill

It's on the Swiss site now to! I am just in the process of building my HT so this should be mine come tax return time! :)

"Having the lens shift is great but the real plus for me is the 2X zoom."

Keeping optical quality good over such a range is normally difficult/expensive (usually the short throw end of the range suffers), so don't be surprised if the full range isn't really usable.

"Peak-a-boo's? Smooth screen is unique to Panny but its old hat when peak-a-boo's lessen the benefits."

What are peek-a-boo's?

Thanks

I wonder how loud it is with the AI on (high lamp mode)...? It only lists a dB rating (26) for low lamp mode.

With the L500 (AE500), it was my understading that AI mode did increase the contrast slightly but it wasn't really a feature people used due to the increased fan noise and reduced bulb life.
-Matt

Originally posted by noah katz
What are peek-a-boo's?
Thanks
Beginning with the L300 and continuing on the L500, Panasonic used their proprietary screen door reducing technology called smooth-screen. It seems to be some sort of integrated IMX lense that overlaps the pixel edges with their neighbors ever so slightly. It works great, I have the L300 and you'd be surprised it's only 960 x 540! Hardly any screen door (way better than other LCDs) and a very smooth image.

However, all LCDs have scan line artifacts that can occasionally *pop* out at the viewer. It seems to be a non-issue on most LCDs but Panny's smooth-screen tended to increase it's chances of being visible. People got all freaked out but then someone found a "flicker" adjustment in the menu. I haven't seen any "peak-a-boo scan lines" since adjusting it and don't consider it to be an issue anymore. I heard it was even less visible on the L500 over my L300, so I wouldn't worry about it on the L700 either.
-Matt

Peak-a-boo's are when you briefly see scanlines or what looks like screendoor. Usually happens on vertical motion/vertical pans. Its something you see on most PJ's, but starting with the L300, it seemed to be more noticable for some people and most suspected the smoothscreen. Since it had so little pixel structure and screendoor, when there were peak-a-boo's, they stood out like a sore thumb. I believe doing the flicker tweak and defocussing will minimize it enough to make it a non-issue. Doing some research myself regarding the L300 vs the L200. I see them occasionally on my L200, but when its tweaked and defoccused, its hardly noticable.

The L500 has the peak-a-boo also, but to a lesser extent than the L300. I saw a Z1 and it had really noticable peak-a-boo scanlines until defocussed and then there were non at all. I imagine the AE700 will be similar to the 500 in terms of peak-a-boo's.

I guess we can hope to see reviews of the AE700 in the not too distant future. If the Sanyo Z3 comes out soon too, that'll be good. Competition can only be good. Hopefully bring down the prices of all these projectors a tad.

...and I hope like the German shootout with the Z2, HS20, Panny 500 and Hitachi TX100, we see some shootouts showing the measured non-AI checkedboard contrast. Some tests and shootouts don't measure the contrast. I want to see comparative numbers.

Tax return time? Amen, the wife has already been told that's where ours are going to :)

- Brett

IS the price likely to be higher than the RRP of the AE500?

IT looks nice, might hold off on the 4805 until I can see this one running...

price will be the same as ae500.

Seems like a much better unit - cant wait to see it!

Consolidating the AE700 threads here. Please don't start new ones.

So, any news on the AE900??

...you're kinding, right?

When the 500 was out, and still is out now, there are the 200 and 300 being sold along side them in Canada. I wonder if there are lower and/or higher models than the AE700 planned in the US and or Canada.

Screenshot of the ae700 in action.

As you can see, it has awesome contrast!

Originally posted by JPinTO
So, any news on the AE900??

Beats 2004 Qualia, same price as the AE300, 500, 700.


:D

Wow! Yeehaaw. That is awesome contrast! I like the test room. Odd colour choices but I like the results.

Regarding to Panasonic i get so confused. Normalmodus, ecomodus, highlampmodus, AImodus.........

When they say 26 db in normalmodus what does that mean?
1. AI off?
2. Ecomodus?
3. Or is there a ecomodus below normalmodus that is even more quiet?


And i am thinking this lens shift maybe would be a waste for me? My ae100 i hanging a lot down from the roof to match the screen height. But it looks like there are no 2" offset anymore. If you center the joystick on the lensshift the picture is also centered from the lens. So in my case i have to pull the joystick up or down to the max to get the right screen hight for my upset. So this is very disapointing to me because what i expected was: With lens shift i could put my projector very close to the ceiling, and adjust the picture more downwards with this lensshift thing. And then i wouldnt have to worry about banging my head into the projector anymore.

Please come with some input on this one.

Presumably 26dB will be in economy mode. This projector uses AI to control an iris, rather than the bulb, so noise won't be nearly as distracting as with the AE500's AI mode. Also, the iris is a better modulator of light than changing lamp voltages. As a result, I would expect this thing to have a better chance to hit it's numbers than the AE500 did. However, the question is whether it will be usable.

Later,
Bill

Originally posted by exsodius
Regarding to Panasonic i get so confused. Normalmodus, ecomodus, highlampmodus, AImodus.........

When they say 26 db in normalmodus what does that mean?
1. AI off?
2. Ecomodus?
3. Or is there a ecomodus below normalmodus that is even more quiet?


And i am thinking this lens shift maybe would be a waste for me? My ae100 i hanging a lot down from the roof to match the screen height. But it looks like there are no 2" offset anymore. If you center the joystick on the lensshift the picture is also centered from the lens. So in my case i have to pull the joystick up or down to the max to get the right screen hight for my upset. So this is very disapointing to me because what i expected was: With lens shift i could put my projector very close to the ceiling, and adjust the picture more downwards with this lensshift thing. And then i wouldnt have to worry about banging my head into the projector anymore.

Please come with some input on this one.

I agree, the PDF file is vague in these 2 areas. The PDF file implies that is a combination of iris control and lamp control, but doesn't exactly say that.

Also, the projection placement map doesn't state where and if keystone kicks in for placement outside the screen height (in an offset area).

I guess we will have to wait and see. I'm also wondering about the 2000:1 on/off. Divide that by 5 and you get 400:1 which is like the Panny PTL-75U. Maybe the D5 panels will be worth waiting for.

Don

This on/off numbers are almost certainly recorded with iris open & high lamp mode vs iris closed and low lamp modus... I bet if you power down this ai system for a true D65 calibration you will get something like 1k:1... I am really wondering if this triple action of iris, lamp and gamma modulation is compatible with a D65 calibration at all...

--Peter

If cr is measured as you guess ae-700 is not even close to Epson tw-200 and tw-500. They stated 2500:1 or was it 3000:1 contrast "ratio".
The only thing I saw as missing was a built in color filter.

Originally posted by drpp
This on/off numbers are almost certainly recorded with iris open & high lamp mode vs iris closed and low lamp modus... I bet if you power down this ai system for a true D65 calibration you will get something like 1k:1... I am really wondering if this triple action of iris, lamp and gamma modulation is compatible with a D65 calibration at all...

--Peter

Lamp modulation in itself should change the colour temp of the bulb - happens every time in a studio when the voltage to a lamp is changed. I can't imagine how the iris would impact on colour temp, any ideas? Gamma is kind of scary.

ted

Ekkehardt aka Cine4home posted numbers in his Hitachi TX100 review which clearly indicated that closing the iris affected colour temp to an extent that it was visible with plain eyes... Seems it has to do with the straylight which is produced in the OE. If there is a plus of blue and green, then of course closing the iris should affect colour temp. But maybe the Panasonic iris is not closed to such an extent.

If I understood what they are doing it should work like that.

a) Lamp and
b) iris are modulated to optimise for black.

but this would lead to an unacceptable dim picture and therefore

c) gamma is 'corrected' to 'stretch' intrascene contrast to a maximum(?).

Look at the pictures given for illustration, you see earth infront of black sky with bright stars. Let's assume sky is black and stars have maximum brightness. You cannot increase the luminace difference between those, but you can increase the difference between the brightest and the darkest earth parts to a certain extent. This would most probably mean to make the brighter earth parts brighter (does that make sense?). Well this might look 'better' and this might no longer look as dim as it would without this 'correction', I for a part would say this is no longer the original intrascene contrast. It should look different compared to a 'reference PJ' with true 2k:1 on/off contrast, shouldn't it?

If you had luminance histograms from the original and the gamma-corrected scene (just like a digital camera would produce) these could no longer be identical, no way. My question is: do I want that? I know that I would take a true 2k:1 CR @ D65 PJ if I had to choose. But maybe I am totally wrong and this works like a charm...

--Peter

Edit: some minor reformulations and added a few sentences.

Originally posted by donyoop
Also, the projection placement map doesn't state where and if keystone kicks in for placement outside the screen height (in an offset area).

According to the specifications section that placement drawing is for the lens shift. It also talks about keystone of 30 deg in the horizontal... no mention of vertical.

How "natural" is the gamma of crt? From what I understand the crt really extends the available contrast in the original signal by its nature.

Originally posted by LMCid
Beats 2004 Qualia, same price as the AE300, 500, 700.


:D

You probably aren't off by much. I'm guessing AE900 will be 1080P with 5000:1 CR for $2k. I'm waiting! :D

Originally posted by JPinTO
You probably aren't off by much. I'm guessing AE900 will be 1080P with 5000:1 CR for $2k. I'm waiting! :D

Only problem is the Qualia 2005 would probably be out with 1620P, 6,500:1 CR, weighting 120 pounds for $45,000.00.

I'm posting this one more time, due to the low response:) (still thanks to donyoop)

"And i am thinking this lens shift maybe would be a waste for me? My ae100 i hanging a lot down from the roof to match the screen height. But it looks like there are no 2" offset anymore. If you center the joystick on the lensshift the picture is also centered from the lens. So in my case i have to pull the joystick up or down to the max to get the right screen hight for my upset. So this is very disapointing to me because what i expected was: With lens shift i could put my projector very close to the ceiling, and adjust the picture more downwards with this lensshift thing. And then i wouldnt have to worry about banging my head into the projector anymore.

Please come with some input on this one."

Originally posted by exsodius
I'm posting this one more time, due to the low response:) (still thanks to donyoop)

"And i am thinking this lens shift maybe would be a waste for me? My ae100 i hanging a lot down from the roof to match the screen height. But it looks like there are no 2" offset anymore. If you center the joystick on the lensshift the picture is also centered from the lens. So in my case i have to pull the joystick up or down to the max to get the right screen hight for my upset. So this is very disapointing to me because what i expected was: With lens shift i could put my projector very close to the ceiling, and adjust the picture more downwards with this lensshift thing. And then i wouldnt have to worry about banging my head into the projector anymore.

Please come with some input on this one."

Your post is a bit hard to understand, but if you look at the pdf posted by madpoet you'll see the placement diagram. It looks like you'll be able to do what you want -- as long as the projector actually does what the pdf claims.

exsodius

from the diagram in the product pdf, it looks like the vertical offset at maximum lens shift will be 13% of the picture height.
If you have a screen that is 100 cm high, you would have the lens of the projector 13 cm above the top of the picture.

Horst

Originally posted by Horst
exsodius

from the diagram in the product pdf, it looks like the vertical offset at maximum lens shift will be 13% of the picture height.
If you have a screen that is 100 cm high, you would have the lens of the projector 13 cm above the top of the picture.

Horst

Thanks.

My projector is now ceiling mounted. And its about 6 cm below the top of the screen. My screen is 107cm high and 13% of that is 13,91cm plus 6cm is 19.91cm. If i understand corectly i could actually lift my projector 19.91cm up from my current mounting. Right?

Just heard "real street estimates"...

PT-AE700 -

U.S. Dealers stock in hand "October 2004"

Start the salivation!

I.

The cracker site says "in stock- Late January 2005".

It further states..."This unit replaces the PT-L500u"

No price listed yet.

Originally posted by LMCid
Only problem is the Qualia 2005 would probably be out with 1620P, 6,500:1 CR, weighting 120 pounds for $45,000.00.

LOL! You should post this on the >$3500 board... they should get all excited about it. They're getting their panties in a knot because the HS51 is specing 6000:1 CR and *gasp* it's an LCD. The horror!

Can someone explain *why* a manufacturer would purposely overstate outputs?

Surely they get a better reputation by being honest? Or would that be only with the geeks at the expense of the greater buying population. (the sort of people who like Bose)..

I don't think it is "purposely".

1) how calibrated is the projector makes a big difference - what is the brightness, once calibrated as opposed to out of the box, what is it for theatre mode instead of brightest mode? If I get the same projector and then give it to you will we both calibrate it the same way?

2) how they calculate makes a difference (some are more stringent then others) - do you measure sound beside the vent, a foot a way, where you assume the persons ears will be - a slight difference might be the difference between 32db and 26 db. do you measure brightness at the tip of the lens or a foot away or 12' away where the screen might be

3) specs look good even when you don't know what they mean, so better specs help with sales. so if you can measure it in a way to get better specs then why not (from the manufacturers perspective) it gives it an advantage

Originally posted by rezokl1
Can someone explain *why* a manufacturer would purposely overstate outputs?


The problem is that there is quite a difference between a good calibration and one that is acceptable for your average man on the street. So to avoid this, everybody uses the maximums. That is why projectors also have a number of less than perfect modes for use with the less than perfect TV signal- upping the brightness at the expense of color accuracy. For those that just want a big TV, that might be all they need.

The ae500 seems to have a bad reputation among people on this thread, for wildly overstating the available contrast. This is odd since most reviews I remember reading last year seemed to suggest it managed quite well as long as you used the AI.
Here is one for instance
http://www.areadvd.de/hardware/Panasonic_PT-AE500.shtml
Sorry it is in Germany, but there is always bablefish.

It is louder in high brightness mode with AI on, but I thought a lot of people used it like that and were very happy with the contrast is produced?

Liam

Originally posted by rezokl1
Can someone explain *why* a manufacturer would purposely overstate outputs?
Specs sell a lot of projectors. My guess is that this is especially true with business projectors where a buyer for a company is just looking at a list of specs and picking a projector based on those. I've heard that at CEDIA a lot of dealers are concerned with specs for models because they know this affects sales directly.

If a person goes into a store and there are 2 projectors that are the same price and will end up being identical after calibration for home theater, but one has higher specs for lumens and CR, which one do you think people are more likely to buy? In the long run they do need to be careful about this though.

Fortunately, many home theater projectors have been designed in ways that actually hurt their peak specs but help their imaging performance after calibration. As has basically been pointed out, the specs may not be overstated exactly. They just may be stated for a mode that wouldn't be ideal for home theater.

--Darin

Well I for one love the Panny L500u. It blows away the picture on my crt based rptv by a huge margin. I can only imagine how little the difference will be between it and the L700. I am perfectly happy........ for the next 20 minutes at least.

Depends upon what people use to form their opinions, but specs certainly play a role for many. One other point is that for example the definition of on/off is stretched to a certain extent by manufactures. It should mean IMO the ratio of full on/full off without changing the projector settings inbetween. If you have an iris you could plot the values at the different iris settings. But you should not use the smallest iris setting for full off and the largest for full on etc. This is a variant of on/off but not what I am intersted in. But of course some manufactures do exactly this and you can observe how the numbers melt away if a serious reviewer checks them.

--Peter

Personally, I can't wait! I sold my house in June complete with L300u projector, Dalite motorized screen, and Atlantic Technology surround sound. Lucky B*stards! Now I just have a 32" TV. I've had the same movies from Netflix for 3 months. I don't want to watch them at home. We go out every Friday night now to the movies spending around $20+. Looks like I'll have to wait until tax refund time next year before I get my new theater, but when I do It'll be the PANNY 700!

Originally posted by Illya Friedman
Just heard "real street estimates"...

PT-AE700 -

U.S. Dealers stock in hand "October 2004"

Start the salivation!

I. October!!! It's time to look into selling my 300.:eek: Is there somewhere other than ebay for such things?

Yep, your neighbour...

--Peter

Originally posted by drpp
Yep, your neighbour...

--Peter Heh, you clearly don't know my neighbour....

Originally posted by dakyman
Yep, the AE500 will cease immediately as of AE700 arriving here Sept 24, and pricing is exactly the same at both dealer and retail level as the AE500.

Where are you getting this info from? Panasonic Australia don't seem to know anything about it. Their only response is definitely not this month, there is no release date for it at the moment at all.

I get my info from Panasonic Australia! It probably wont be retail this month, the 24th is just the initial due date, once its here it still takes a little while to clear.

The Panasonic 700 will be shown at Cedia and Panasonic is saying October for US release.

Originally posted by DB2
The Panasonic 700 will be shown at Cedia and Panasonic is saying October for US release.
Looks like late september... straight from the horse's mouth.
Panasonic's Cedia Press Release for the new PT-AE700U (http://www.panasonic.com/consumer_electronics/pressroom/cont2.asp?Filter=12&cont_id=774)
-Matt

Wait a minute... the press release lists the new AE700U as MSRP'ing for $2999.99 while a quick check on Panny's site shows the AE500 listing at $2499.99.

Does anyone remember what the AE500 originally listed at? Is the $2499.99 a reduced MSRP? If not, knowing that the AE500 originally streeted at about $2K does this mean the AE700 will street for somewhere over $2K?

If so that may turn off some buyers who can now get an AE500 for ~$1500. Considering it is not any higher a resolution and only boosts contrast a little (partly via the loud, hi-lamp mode AI feature which no one seemed to use on the AE500), it might be a tough sell at a $1000 premium... If someone wants lens shift they can just get the Z2....
-Matt

remember it is a newer panel too, has HDMI, yes has lens shift, higher brightness, supports PAL frequencies better, blah blah, but long story short, at dealer level, it costs exactly the same wholesale as the AE500 currently does. And to clarify even further, AE500 will not be available anymore regardless.

Originally posted by xframe88
remember it is a newer panel too, has HDMI, yes has lens shift, higher brightness, supports PAL frequencies better, blah blah, but long story short, at dealer level, it costs exactly the same wholesale as the AE500 currently does. And to clarify even further, AE500 will not be available anymore regardless.
Don't get me wrong, I would fully expect them to be the same price (as the AE300 was when it was introduced also).... it's just the different MSRP's that started me thinking they might want to increase their base price incrementally. In my opinion it would be a bad move. There is something about that 1999.99 price that makes it seem oh-so-attainable...

That said, your first point was that it uses new panels. I'm pretty sure it doesn't and just uses the same Epson D4 panels the AE500 used.

BTW, I just found this AE700 Japanese Site (babelfish translated) (http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?url=http%3A%2F%2Fpanasonic.jp%2Ftheater%2F projector%2Findex.html&lp=ja_en) and after reading the whole thing, there appear to be some more pluses and minuses we haven't discussed yet. Everything on the front page is translated but they are pictures so you still can't read it... just click on the "1" and everything is in english from there (then go from page to page with the "next" link at the bottom).

(-) Max Contrast uses Dynamic Iris AND lamp light intensity controls -- They used the lamp light intensity controls (known as AI) on the Panny AE500. From most reports it did slightly improve contrast but it also required you to use the high lamp mode which decreased your bulb life and was noticeably louder. Verdict... most didn't find it worth it. Hopefully the AE700 has two settings, one for AI and one for DI (dynamic iris) and they can be used independently. If so, you'll be able to only use DI but won't get the full 2000:1. If not, and the noise bothers you, you'll be stuck with the panels native contrast which is probably on the order of 800:1 or so.

(+) Front Vent -- They really seem to hype this feature on the Japanese site. The benefits include mounting very close to the rear wall, not getting dirty walls from the exhaust :D and being able to coffee tabling mount without hot air blowing at the sofa (a problem I actually had with my L300u). They also mention the front exhaust is mounted away from the lens so as not to put heat in the projection path. On a side note, having a front exhaust means you can vertically mount it on the wall as talked about here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=3560497#post3560497) . This is something I've always wanted to do instead of a regular (ugly) wall mount with a TV arm.

(-) Larger and Heavier -- I'm surprised no one mentioned this yet but it's larger in every dimension (length, width, height) and weighs over 1.5 lbs. more. This won't necessarily be a drop in replacement for an AE300 or AE500.

Just some more things to consider...
-Matt

no need to do japanese translation, the oz final pdf was posted here recently

Matt,

Did you also notice that the Panasonic web site lists the MSRP for the AE300/L300 as $2799.99? Therefore, I'm guessing that they are still showing the prices as of the original release date. When I bought my L300 in Februaary 2003, the street prices (from AVS Forum dealers) was consideraby less than the current listed MSRP (and it's even cheaper now).

In Germany MRSP is 1999€ but some dealers are taking orders at 1657€ already.

Originally posted by xframe88
remember it is a newer panel too,

Are you saying this is not the the D4 panel that was used in the AE500?

ted

The AE700 has the same D4 panel. D5 panels are not out yet.

Mods,

Can this thread be made a sticky ? If it keeps slipping off the first page, some one may start a new thread.

Thanks

Rick

Done.

Originally posted by madpoet
The AE700 has the same D4 panel. D5 panels are not out yet.

Thanks poet, though as much - just wanted some confirmation. Am looking forwad to comparisons with the HS51 and the new Sharp DLP.

ted

EDIT: No pricing or dealer info.

can anyone who attended CEDIA give us a review on this unit?

Try this thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=444814

Can someone double check my math here...

For an 80" wide screen, you should be able to place the projector up to 20" to the left or right of the screen (as long as you stay fairly even vertically with the screen). This is based on the .25H shown in the .pdf.

I would guess that a placement such as this wouldn't be a problem with a matte white screen. But... I've read that with the higher gain, ambient light rejection screens an off center placement might be an issue.

I would need to also buy a pulldown screen with this PJ. Having to place it offset, I'm guessing I might be stuck with matte white.

Comments? Does anyone have experience with this type setup with any PJ with lens shift?

How does the Sanyo Z3 compare to the 700?

Was the Z3 shown??
Where have you guys found to be the best source for CEDIA info, Ive found Audioholics web site pretty good.

I put some AE700 thoughts in this thread...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4335862#post4335862

Originally posted by dazbug
How does the Sanyo Z3 compare to the 700?


How would we know ? Neither is out yet.

Well with a statement like "The future can never beat the past. Be Nostalgic !!" at the end of your message, you may as well stick with the AE100 or Z1 anyway :P

Originally posted by Flippermatt
How would we know ? Neither is out yet.

Well, both were originally supposed to be at CEDIA. Sanyo pulled out of the show at the last minute though. So, we cannot compare...

reaper

All these new cool PJ coming out!

Is this likely to convert DLP fans given the higher res , or is LCD love it or hate it? And yeah, they suck for bright rooms right? :)

Originally posted by dakyman
Well with a statement like "The future can never beat the past. Be Nostalgic !!" at the end of your message, you may as well stick with the AE100 or Z1 anyway :P

I´ll stick with the ae-700, You stick with your mama.

I'll say it again. There is the need for another big shootout soon. All these cool projectors. AE700 - Z3 - PJ TX100 - Infocus 5000 etc etc. Once they are all out there, it will be interesting to see how things settle.

Any chance all these mid-priced 1280 x 720 LCD projectors all competing for our dollars may cause the prices to drop just a little bit or at least moderate them a bit? It would be nice if competition kept the prices from balooning. I fear that the companies will pull one of the old "Well, now that the technology has been tested and proven, we're going to improve the PJ's and give you more toys but make you pay more"...basically taking a cool and fairly inexpensive technology that lets people buy into quite reasonabley, and takes the next step up and places it out of most peoples reach. Hope the gaps are kept small. I wonder if there's a market for Panasonic to do another 960 x 540 like Sanyo is doing with ZX1 or whatever its called.

So does anyone smell a barrage of local area shootouts this winter? :)

What does this mean? Taken from ae700 specs.

"Lampensparmodus 2 Modi "

Does this mean 2 modus for eco and 1 for normal. Or is it the same old 2 modus in total.

And specs says 26db in normal modus, this must be wrong. Ain't it 26db in eco modus?

In 2003 japan got the AE500 first, but now it looks like the rest of the world gets the ae700 first. Strange.

Looks like i have to rebuild my ceiling mount to fit the 700!

Originally posted by Borg
Can someone double check my math here...

For an 80" wide screen, you should be able to place the projector up to 20" to the left or right of the screen (as long as you stay fairly even vertically with the screen). This is based on the .25H shown in the .pdf.

I would guess that a placement such as this wouldn't be a problem with a matte white screen. But... I've read that with the higher gain, ambient light rejection screens an off center placement might be an issue.

I would need to also buy a pulldown screen with this PJ. Having to place it offset, I'm guessing I might be stuck with matte white.

Comments? Does anyone have experience with this type setup with any PJ with lens shift?

Anyone have comments about screen choice with this type setup with this PJ? By the way, pj central now has the details:
http://www.projectorcentral.com/Panasonic_Home-PT-AE700U.htm

Borg

My understanding is that you can offset the projector in the horizontal plane by 0.25 * screen width. This means that for an 80" wide screen, the projector can be 20" horizontally offset from the centre which will be 20" in from the edge and not 20" outside the edge.

Hope this helps.

William

Yeah, thats what I show too, thanks!

PJ central says 5000 hour lamp life for the 700 in their Cedia report. Wow! Read what they have to say about the pixel structure.... I'm looking forward to their full review.

http://www.projectorcentral.com/cedia_2004.htm

I'd also like to know what allowances - if any these companies have made to prevent problems like dust blobs occuring on their new projectors.

What kind of screen do you chose for this projector ? And what HDMI cable ?

hmm, the CEDIA report says that it will be shipping in 4-6 weeks. But a press release posted by someone earlier in this thread says that it will be shipping late September:

http://www.panasonic.com/consumer_electronics/pressroom/cont2.asp?Filter=12&cont_id=774

I just called their consumer line (800-221-7262). Actually, I called their consumer line, who argued with me that it was an industrial product, so then I called the industrial line, who told me that it was a consumer product, and then I called the consumer line again.

Anyway, the second time I called, I managed to convince the sales rep to ask around to see if anyone knew when it would be available. She came back, and said that no one had any information about this product at all. I told her that a panasonic press release listed end of September as a release date, and asked if that was reasonable. All she could say was "well, that usually means that it would be available late September or early October". Thanks :(

You really have to love Panasonic customer service.:rolleyes:

This projector seems like a good compromise for me. I am building my theater right now and have been intending to buy a fairly high-end single chip HD2+ unit. The more that I think about it, I would really like to invest in a 3 chipper DLP and could live with a lower end bridge unit.

I think this unit has some nice pluses, especially lens shift and the big zoom. I will have a fairly long throw.

Could I get away with pairing this with a 110" Studiotek 130 or is there a screen that I am not considering for use with a future 3 chip DLP and this box?

Thanks,

AugDog

A dealer from Germany says that the product will arrive in October

ricardofelisbert

I am going to be using a 6 meter Monster 400 HDMI.

Since ae700 is apparently going to be sold only through Panny's "Professional" channel, do you suppose that any AVS Forum sponsors will be able to carry it? I would really like to support them if I can.

um Not at all sure what this means, but its apparently being sold through Panasonic's 'broadcast' division, which seems to deal in profession A/V for TV and Cable systems and the like. But the press release (on the broadcast division site mind you) specifically referers to it as a HOME cinema device.

No bleapin' wonder everyone's confused. It would be one thing if this thing wasn't projected (pardon the pun) for launch for awhile, but this ALOT of confusion to straighten up in 2 to 6 weeks! Does anyone believe they'll somehow have all their call center personell imbued with knowledge within the next 2 weeks?

:( all I want is a pretty picture. Can't I have my pretty picture, panny, please?

From my understanding the professional division means it will be sold through Visual Apex (AVSForum advertiser), Projectorpoint (AVSForum Advertiser) and the like. This would also mean it will not be sold through online computer stores like newegg and onecall.

I have no direct info from Panasonic to support this assumption.

What is the scart input on this thing? Is this the RGB input?

Scart is a european standard connector, and can be used to send rgb, component, composite, s-video. It's big and bulky. You guys in the states have the neater component (3 phono component?) on your devices for higher quality connection.

And why did you feel the need to do that? Read the forum rules.

Wow. Is it just me or are we going to see the Panny AE700 street 2 or 3 months before the L200/L300 and L500 came out in each of their respective years of release. This is super cool. Anyone try to order one yet from Visual Apex or anywhere else?

I just emailed them about release date. I'll post back when I hear...
-Matt

Visual Apex now lists it for sale on their site, along with free shipping.

Curious. Why is it on the VA website when its not even on the Panasonic USA website yet?

They are taking pre-orders.

Just ordered one. We will see what happens. Visual Apex does have a nice tear sheet posted. Seems to be the same one that I think was posted in German. Didn't remember seeing anything on bulb life.

http://www.visualsystemsgroup.com/ProductSupport/PT-AE700U.pdf

Thanks zoolap on the that scart connection.

Reply from VA...

"We are actually taking pre-orders for the PTL700U now. We expect to get our allocation between late September and late October-only Panasonic knows for sure!

If the last 3 years are any indication, we will sell through our first allocation very quickly.

The best bet is to get on our pre-order list and have a unit reserved for you. It is no risk to you; we take all your information down, then we’ll call you when the projectors arrive. We then call you and ask if you would like to go forward with your order. If so, we ship. If not, we delete the order and sell to the next person on the list."

Hopefully AVS doesn't mind us discussing this here as they don't sell Panny (I already asked Jason!). If it's in violation, please remove.

That is still a month delivery window... nothing definite yet.
-Matt

Originally posted by mpjohnst
Reply from VA...

"We are actually taking pre-orders for the PTL700U now. We expect to get our allocation between late September and late October-only Panasonic knows for sure!

If the last 3 years are any indication, we will sell through our first allocation very quickly.

The best bet is to get on our pre-order list and have a unit reserved for you. It is no risk to you; we take all your information down, then we’ll call you when the projectors arrive. We then call you and ask if you would like to go forward with your order. If so, we ship. If not, we delete the order and sell to the next person on the list."

Hopefully AVS doesn't mind us discussing this here as they don't sell Panny (I already asked Jason!). If it's in violation, please remove.

That is still a month delivery window... nothing definite yet.
-Matt I'm on the list!!! Thanks mpjohnst!:D

I'm fighting the urge to pre-order!!!!!!!! As long as the 700u is VB free I'm in. My only worry is the operation in AI mode. What will the high fan speed sound like? AI on my old 500u was too loud for me.

I think this around I will wait for reviews before I plunge in head first.

I heard the same timeframe from a different rep at VA when confirming my pre-order. At least they are consistent.

Originally posted by Monkey_Man
I'm fighting the urge to pre-order!!!!!!!! As long as the 700u is VB free I'm in. My only worry is the operation in AI mode. What will the high fan speed sound like? AI on my old 500u was too loud for me.


Do we know yet if you will be able to use the panamorph with it? Is the throw ratio 2.0 or greater?

The throw ratio is 2.77!!! At zero zoom.

I'm still confused. Is the AE700 Japanese or is the AE designation gonna be used in the US as well.

In other words, do we USA'ers have to wait until January/Feb for the L700U for a USA warrantee?

I don't believe so. I think they might have finally smartened up and stopped with all the stupid different model names.

Hope the non-AI mode leaves the AE700 performing as good at contrast and black levels as competition such as the Hitachi PJ TX100.

Something tells me that AE700's may be snapped up with S97 dvd player's if that player is received well.

Originally posted by AugDog
Just ordered one. We will see what happens. Visual Apex does have a nice tear sheet posted. Seems to be the same one that I think was posted in German. Didn't remember seeing anything on bulb life.

http://www.visualsystemsgroup.com/ProductSupport/PT-AE700U.pdf

Thanks zoolap on the that scart connection.
Projectorcentral is stating 5000 hours in econo mode

Hello Forum...I have taken the plunge! Ordered the -700!! Now we will see!:cool:

Panasonic's web team is often the last to get clearance to post stuff of even info. I know it drives them nuts.

Hey All !!

I'm the happy owner of the good old Sony VPL-W400Q, and for a long time i have been thinking of an upgrade, to something like the AE500, but all the Talk about VB has made me thing again.......So i also wait for info about VB on the AE700......only thing is, that the AE500 price is going down like a brick in water here in Denmark...and then the question is...will it be much of an ubgrade ???? Hmmmm

:confused:

The CONFUSED Dane will just have to wait !!!

*************** seems to have them for about 250,000 yen -that equates to about $3000 Aussie, so it seems considerably higher than the A$2200 AE500...

I too have noticed the 500's price dropping.

AugDog, muadib and andersls,

Congratulations guys! I always love to hear about the Pioneers out there walking point for the rest of us. Challenging the norms and taking the great leaps of faith. Keep us up to date on your PJ purchase. Reel that puppy in and fire it up. Report back with your findings and feedback at your leisure. Actually, asap! ..lol.. :)

Does anyone know if Canadian Panasonic is getting the AE700 any time soon? Just curious, as the price will probably be the typical "rip-off the average consumer" joke. Still, its nice to know about availability.

...and I did some research and the French of Canada are taking pre-orders for the AE700. These French of Canada are in Quebec :p

There is only one problem with walking point right? :)

Sometimes you step in a heaping pile of s*%#, but so be it.

For me this thing is fairly inexpensive and will probably donate it after a year or so. Just looking to have some some fun in the meantime.

I still need a screen suggestion. I am thinking 106-110" in Studiotek 130 or do I need to go with a gray screen? I would like to be able to reuse whichever screen I chose with a 3 chip DLP in the future.

Also, what should I look for as vertical banding?

I can't explain it very well. Watch the AE700 PJ when you get it and simply describe any positive or negative aspects of the picture. If you have vertical banding and you describe it here, people will likely recognize it. To me, it looks like vertical lines made up of short line horizontal lines. It doesn't look like scanlines or anything else. It varies from machine to machine and the flicker tweak usually helps reduce it.

I had heard from another forum from a an atendee that there is only one designation this time as in AE700.
they are going target there Authorized Sellers and refuse service on greymarket or unauthorized Internet Dealers
so be careful where you buy it at if you want it Warrented
Visual Apex is and Authorized Panasonic dealer :)

Well I have been looking for a pj for about 3 months and have been using a variety of sources for information. I must say that these forums are far and away the best source out there. Thanks for all your help.

Anyway, I pre-ordered the 700u and I am excited.

Thanks again.

DSL

One question here:

If the ae700 is using the same panels as the ae500/l500u, why would it not have vertical banding any longer? I'm concerned that this will still be an issue...

It's not the panels, it's how they are driven. I'll upgrade to the 700u only if it's 110% VB free.

Monkey_man, what screen are you currently using with your panny's? Are you going to stick with it if you upgrade to the 700?

I have the Z2 now which is almost the same as the 500u. I used to own the 500u but sold it because it wouldn't work as well as the Z2 with a Panamorph lens. I run a 2.35:1 Da-Lite High Power. I like the Hi-power 1000X better then my old digital grey Goo screen.

Thanks. What is the gain on that thing?