MtnMike, and G.B. :

I calibrated my 55WF this weekend and I'll let youknow something very interesting: the grayscale(s) for the GWIV are universal to high, neutral, and warm- meaning regardless of the input/input resolution the GAIN and BIAS values stay the same. I also found that with the exception of S-video (I didn't bother with composite), Axis=0 gets the color-decoder as close to perfect as possible. So the only REAL issues with variance from input to input are Contrast and Brightness, wich if you don't have the proper test-pattern, you can't adjust properly anyway.

The GWIV will not crush whites, but you can "run out of blue" causing a 100 IRE window/field/section of test pattern to turn a light shade of pink.
With Contrast and Brightness set properly in PRO mode, I measured average Gamma on my set at 2.61- better than the last 4 displays that I've calibrated recently. I was also able to get DE to 5% or lower from 20 IRE to 100 IRE, DE was greater than 20% at 10 IRE (as it is with ANY display!).

Overall grayscale tracking was +800/-200 K from 10 IRE through 100 IRE, within 200K from 20 to 100 IRE. These are the best Grayscale/ Gamma results I've ever measured on a digital display of ANY kind. Usually there's a compromise between Grayscale and Gamma, where I have to sacrifice a little accuracy on one to get what I want with the other.

So from one point of view, Mike is correct in saying that a professional calibration is the only way to get consistent results for all inputs, but I would also have to say that a professional calibration is the only way to make these things really "shine".
From input to input my user-menu settings are almost identical (since there are 2 with S-vid, and 2 with YPbPr, and they all depent on color temp.) For those of you that don't have the ability to successfully input HDTV patters via the antenna input or cable- you should be very happy.

Dan

Yes , Every Set is not the same. But if you live to far away from a local calibrator it's good to get some good ideas of how to get it close.....Close is better than Vivid....

I totally agree with you there. I would think that if you could take a large enough sample of sets (WE,WF,and XS) and get those results- then you could probably have reliable figures. But one set of results from one or two TVs is not enough, especially if those sets weren't calibrated by the same person. Once I can compile the results from a few of these things that I've calibrated- I'll be in a better position to make statements about "average values" for the GWIV chassis. Until then, I can only take it set-by-set.

I'll eventually be able to get people "close" (within DE of say, 7%). I just need more calibrations first.

Dan

Originally posted by G.B.
Yes , Every Set is not the same. But if you live to far away from a local calibrator it's good to get some good ideas of how to get it close.....Close is better than Vivid....

LOL:) ..I burned out my corneas on vivd. Seriously though, standard is much easier on my eyes and I'm sure it's eaiser on the lamp as well.

What is an expected range of prices for a professional calibration? How do you find people trained to do this?

Originally posted by DanFrancis
MtnMike, and G.B. :

I calibrated my 55WF this weekend and I'll let youknow something very interesting: the grayscale(s) for the GWIV are universal to high, neutral, and warm- meaning regardless of the input/input resolution the GAIN and BIAS values stay the same. I also found that with the exception of S-video (I didn't bother with composite), Axis=0 gets the color-decoder as close to perfect as possible. So the only REAL issues with variance from input to input are Contrast and Brightness, wich if you don't have the proper test-pattern, you can't adjust properly anyway.

The GWIV will not crush whites, but you can "run out of blue" causing a 100 IRE window/field/section of test pattern to turn a light shade of pink.
With Contrast and Brightness set properly in PRO mode, I measured average Gamma on my set at 2.61- better than the last 4 displays that I've calibrated recently. I was also able to get DE to 5% or lower from 20 IRE to 100 IRE, DE was greater than 20% at 10 IRE (as it is with ANY display!).

Overall grayscale tracking was +800/-200 K from 10 IRE through 100 IRE, within 200K from 20 to 100 IRE. These are the best Grayscale/ Gamma results I've ever measured on a digital display of ANY kind. Usually there's a compromise between Grayscale and Gamma, where I have to sacrifice a little accuracy on one to get what I want with the other.

So from one point of view, Mike is correct in saying that a professional calibration is the only way to get consistent results for all inputs, but I would also have to say that a professional calibration is the only way to make these things really "shine".
From input to input my user-menu settings are almost identical (since there are 2 with S-vid, and 2 with YPbPr, and they all depent on color temp.) For those of you that don't have the ability to successfully input HDTV patters via the antenna input or cable- you should be very happy.

Dan

Axis=0 does eliminate red push, without effecting blue. My set measured -15% in green with a shift towards blue. I had to adjust the color decoder to correct this. Did you find the same?

Originally posted by smcapilo
... I don't have a clue what the DRC, Live Color, and BN Smoother do.

...

There isn't a lot of info readily available. I would prefer an official "in detail" section on Sony's website, but apparently they will give you tweaks, charge you for buying a set that has such tweaks, but give you no instruction on how to use them. I guess Ferrari never included a driving manual, either, so I guess I can understand that position, but if my company provided tweak circuitry that they were proud of, I would want to pass on a little more info.

Live color? I see little if any difference, but I'm not sure what I'm looking for. My best guess is that even if I did, the effect would be subtle and not that useful.

BN smoother? Here I see NO difference, but since BN stands for block noise, I would think you would have to be viewing heavily compressed high-motion video for it to provide any benefit. Other than that, since it is not automatically on all the time, it must compromise things in other ways. I leave it off, and without pretending to know why, I recommend that to everyone unless you are seeing macroblocking artifacts.

Digital Reality Creation? Sony has had this for some time, and it uses the terrific rescaler to do a number of things to SD video only, chief among them virtually "erasing" scan lines, which on a 60" RP could be troublesome since there are only 480 of them. In that regard it appears to work very well. There is also some noise reduction in DRC, but if you have DBS as your main SD source, there isn't really a need for noise reduction. It does seem to soften the blow on noisy analog OTA signals pretty effectively.

I think DRC also includes some mild image enhancement. If you freeze video and look at the jaggies, certain settings look better than others. There are presets for film-based, graphic-based, and high-motion content, but they are nearly identical, so this is subtle as well. The concepts of "clarity" and "reality" are not easy to grasp, and adjusting them is so mild as to not really give the user much feedback about what is really going on.

While I see DRC as confusing and its use sometimes questionable, it is still one of the major things that sets Sony sets apart from the crowd when reproducing SD material, which is important since not that much is HD as of yet. I just wish I understood it and the other tweaks better. Bottom line, the Sony does a terrific job whether we understand these tweaks or not. Hopefully other posters can add to our knowledge.

Finally a string of info other than how much we are willing (or wanting) to spend on these sets. Dan, Tomncat and GB thanks for the insightful info.

Dan I'll anxiously be standing by for your final report. I agree with you on the grey levels ETC. I normally run on pro with adjustments on picture and brightness. I agree both the XS and WF are top of the line in LCD's in the areas mentioned.

I still maintain the calibration is only as good as the source (signal) into the set. Therefore your best results with any DVD calibration disk will be porportional to the quality of the player and its output to your set.

bberns,

Yes, in s-video I had to make color decoder adjustments in addition to axis=0. I don't use Avia as my source for test patterns, I use my Sencore piece which has different patterns (2 specificly for color decoders).

As far as parameters like DRC, BN reduction, and Live Color; they are not "tweeks", they are "FEATURES". "FEATURE" do not necessarily make the television more accurate. Manufacturers make their living off of selling you the benefits from the added "features" to each "upgraded" model.
I ususally get the most accurate picture from turning that stuff OFF, when I do a calibration.

Dan

Dan, This is true. I was told a long time ago . If you can talk to the designer you can get to the bottom of how to set things up & what each feature does the best, & why he put this on the set. Years ago I had radio broadcast transmitter manual that had the wrong info. They thanked me for letting them know. Sony will tell you on line it is in the manual....Some of the functions don't work in HD but do in SD & vis-versa. So in our manual many times it say's this may or may not work with what you got on the input. The designer did not write the book in this case or each item like DRC & how to set it would be described as goo as Umr & others in our forums that have done hands on work with the menu's , not just a good manual writer. Umr has it at 1 to 1, this looks good, last year a man recommended 1 to 100 or bottom line all the way to the right. Looks a bit softer so some inputs may look good like this. Some of this is on Sony DVD players & they give you a better description of how to set them in that manual.

Got my 50' WE620 for about two weeks. Do a test on a 2 years Sony progress scan DVD with different video source. And didn't notice any significant PQ improvment on different input. Checking with a group of friends and we all came up with a same conclusion in the following ranking, and it's not making sense:

S-Video - best
Composite - Good
Component - OK

In fact, all video input source give very good picture, but S-Video seem just little out performance but not significant.

I try monster cable, Radio Shack cable and cheapy cable, can't seem to have any PQ improvment on differenct cable.

I try to come up some explanation myself: The Sony Wega Engine just reprocess all these analog signal to improve PQ, therefore can't see the clear winner on different source. Is it make sense?

What happen here?? Isn't it the component will improve PQ significantly? What do I miss here?? How to improve PQ here??

Please Help
Thanks,

I too found the same results with trying to improve PQ tesults. The WEGA guts do all the work in improving the signal, so there is little improvement to be seen with a diff DVD player or better cables. Just gotta wait for HDDVD.

There's a simple answer to these issues: use the component output of the DVD player INTERLACED. The deinterlacer/scaler is better in the Sony than it is in the DVD player. When I piped the DVD signal into the TV post-calibration I thought it looked great, then I realized that the player wasn't in progressive mode- so I changed it, and the picture became doo-doo-rific.

Component should always provide a better picture than s-video or composite. And it isn't cables, because mine is still using the "temp" garbage that comes with the DVD player (I didn't want to steal my good cables from my projector).

Dan

I am so frustrated. I went through 2 Samsung HLP-5663W TVs because there was a really bad green grain in them. If you watch a dvd, or TV you could see it. It was most noticable on the THX greyscale pattern. I actually took a picture of it to show people. After posting other people were complaining about a green cast or tint. I figured there was a problem with the Samsungs. I got fed up. I return and got a SONY KDF-55XS955. I got it today. Boom. Same thing green spots and grain in greyscale. DVDs look grainy on soilds and tv too. Now I tried using xbox dvd player over component. I tried dvd ove hdmi. Same thing. I tried same thing with sumsung. So its got to be on mine end some how. I disconnected everything from TV. I just hooked up DVD to TV. Same thing. I tried just hooknig xbox up to TV. same thing. I check outlet wiring. All good. I put voltage meter 117 rock solid. I hooked up a ups and put tv and dvd into ups so that TV and dvd would run off the power of the UPS battery to take the outlet out of the loop. Same thing!!!! WTF. Only thing I havent tried is to move tv to another room. What the hell could be happening?

Here is a picture of green spots in greyscale.

Looks to me like it's a grayscale issue. I can see green in the 50% block and the 10% block of the Pluge pattern. One way you can verify this is to use the 10 step horizontal pattern of Avia under advanced test patterns, that gives you 10 steps of grayscale to look at- see if you cna see the green in the majority of the steps, if so, the set needs to be calibrated to get rid of that.

Samsung's different models all have different "tints" to their grayscale- the 43s are typically red/blue, the 50s are typically blue, and the 60+s are typically green. They can all be fixed (until you get down low- 30 IRE and lower- then you just lose control over grayscale tracking, that comes from 8 or 10 bit processing versus the newer 12 bit).

Welcome to the world of seeing display flaws. It's a blessing and a curse.

Dan

Originally posted by DanFrancis
bberns,

Yes, in s-video I had to make color decoder adjustments in addition to axis=0. I don't use Avia as my source for test patterns, I use my Sencore piece which has different patterns (2 specificly for color decoders).

As far as parameters like DRC, BN reduction, and Live Color; they are not "tweeks", they are "FEATURES". "FEATURE" do not necessarily make the television more accurate. Manufacturers make their living off of selling you the benefits from the added "features" to each "upgraded" model.
I ususally get the most accurate picture from turning that stuff OFF, when I do a calibration.

Dan

I use a Milori unit. I have not calibibrated the S-Video input as I do not use it. I found similar green decoder errors via DVI & Component.

But what were you using as the test? Was it the pattern in Avia? Or did you use a different pattern? I'd like to try to verify your readings vs mine.

My VP-401 has a pattern for color decoder verification (like the Avia pattern) and a pattern for color decoder adjustment (uses sections of the primaries with the secondaries).

Let me know, I want to check it out.

Dan

I'm having a perplexing issue with my new 50WE655. When I play a widescreen move that's widescreen, the TV automatically switches incorrectly to the "Zoom" mode, instead of "Full Mode" - cutting out part of the picture.

This would make sense if the input picture was 4:3 letterbox - but this even happens to DVDs that are 2.35:1 anamorphic and 1.85:1. I have to toggle the wide mode manually back to "Full" everytime.

Is there a setting that I'm missing somewhere? The DVD player setting is already set to 16:9, so that shouldn't be the issue. I'm using a JVC XV-N412S player.

Is anyone else running into this on their Wega IV? What does the TV default to when you play an anamoprhic widescreen DVD, Full or Zoom?

bent98,

Originally posted by bent98
...Same thing. I tried same thing with sumsung. So its got to be on mine end some how. I disconnected everything from TV. I just hooked up DVD to TV. Same thing...
If you are seeing the same green pattern on two different Samsung DLPs and a Sony LCD, then I would agree it is something other than the TVs that is causing this problem.

When you say you disconnected everything from the TV, does that include all coax (Antenna, cable TV, satellite TV) inputs? Do you have any dimmer switches in the house? Or maybe a large, unshielded subwoofer near the TV?

Also, as Dan asked, what are you using to produce this test pattern?

Michael

I am using the THX test partern from toy story. Also I Just took tv into my kitchen and plug it there(only part of house i can fit tv) Same thing. But like I said I hooked TV up to UPS and ran it on battery and it does same thing. Theres no way it should do this out of box. DVD's, HDTV shouldnt do that. Infact You can even see theres like noise on my Panny Welcome screen on my S97 dvd player. I had a 61 inch hitachi RPTV 4:3 for 6 years in same spot. No problems what so ever. I am at a loss. I would say a line conditioner might help but like I said I ran it off the batteries of UPS.

Originally posted by DanFrancis
... As far as parameters like DRC, BN reduction, and Live Color; they are not "tweeks", they are "FEATURES". "FEATURE" do not necessarily make the television more accurate. Manufacturers make their living off of selling you the benefits from the added "features" to each "upgraded" model.
I ususally get the most accurate picture from turning that stuff OFF, when I do a calibration.

Dan

Potato, po-tah-to.

The goal is not to make the display "accurate", anyway. The goal is to allow the user to massage non-standard material to make it more acceptable for a given situation.

I agree that much tweakable stuff doesn't usually really improve things in most cases, and that too much of any of these types of things can make the PQ worse, but it appears that Sony at least gets it in that regard...that folks who don't know or understand what they're adjusting or why can get themselves into trouble. Which is probably why the adjustment ranges are small and the effects are subtle, which is a change from 15 years ago, when that was not the case.

I, too, leave most of this stuff off, but there is no crime in using them to your advantage in the proper application. An attitude of "never do that" or "always turn sharpness to zero" reminds me of the audiophile snobs that sniff haughtily at preamps with tone controls. In that example, it's more important for me to hear things the way I want to than the way the record producer originally envisioned it, and the record producer is just going to have to find some way to live with that. As a wise man once said, "I may not know art, but I know what I like." Same with video.

Ironically, BTW, the sharpness control on the Sony XS seems to have absolutely no effect at all on HD content, and once again you don't really need a sharpness control for HD anyway.

Hi, would anyone please post a file with the full list of out-of-the-box settings in service menu for KDF-**WE655. I would really appreciate it. Thank you.

how do you know if you have a GWIII or IV?

I own the KDF- 50WE655 - it looks just like the 42 pic here - so i imagine I have a GWIV = Had it about 2 weeks

I agree with TomCat wholeheartedly.

Before I got my 55XS, I was almost prompted to get the AVIA DVD, but thank goodness I did not. The TV in my opinion is great out of the box, and I've done several tweaks to it using the user controls to my own liking.

Obviously I avoided problems such as red-push, blue-push, poor blacks, blah blah blah but seriously, I just believe that this stuff is way too overhyped.

Just like TomCat has said, it is quite unfortunate how people really aren't focusing on what they like to personally see on their TV..but rather reproduce 'accuracy' the best they can.

finally found I have a single stuck pixel. no biggy you cannot see it unless your standing next to the TV, and its off to the left side.
But I did find "only when standing next to TV" that there appears to be some dust or specks on the inside of the screen. "visible on light color background only"

Sitting at our viewing distance 9-10ft I dont see any issues.
Still tweaking the settings.
But I would like to know if anyone has seen the dust issue I saw?

55WF655

Originally posted by sreiter
how do you know if you have a GWIII or IV?

I own the KDF- 50WE655 - it looks just like the 42 pic here - so i imagine I have a GWIV = Had it about 2 weeks
KDF-**WE655 is GWIV model.

I'm no expert, so please don't pound me for this - but..(see my posting below about "Remote")

What are you using for audio? Do you have surround or a home theater? I'm thinking interference (somehow). I say this because I read a post elsewhere on AVS Forum about someone having green vertical stripes on their display that they thought was caused by their new home theater. (I think its in the Home Theater threads).

E

Originally posted by bent98
I am so frustrated. I went through 2 Samsung HLP-5663W TVs because there was a really bad green grain in them. If you watch a dvd, or TV you could see it. It was most noticable on the THX greyscale pattern. I actually took a picture of it to show people. After posting other people were complaining about a green cast or tint. I figured there was a problem with the Samsungs. I got fed up. I return and got a SONY KDF-55XS955. I got it today. Boom. Same thing green spots and grain in greyscale. DVDs look grainy on soilds and tv too. Now I tried using xbox dvd player over component. I tried dvd ove hdmi. Same thing. I tried same thing with sumsung. So its got to be on mine end some how. I disconnected everything from TV. I just hooked up DVD to TV. Same thing. I tried just hooknig xbox up to TV. same thing. I check outlet wiring. All good. I put voltage meter 117 rock solid. I hooked up a ups and put tv and dvd into ups so that TV and dvd would run off the power of the UPS battery to take the outlet out of the loop. Same thing!!!! WTF. Only thing I havent tried is to move tv to another room. What the hell could be happening?

Here is a picture of green spots in greyscale.

ok, this may be BS but its a fact occurrence in my home. I'm thinking it may be similar to the "mysterious" display appearing as posted in this forum for the GW when you swear you never touched the remote.

I have a Hitachi crt that is over 10 years old - never once did the display appear. Just got my new 55XS955 and donated the Hitachi to my son, who is home from college.

He hooks up the Hitachi to his Onkyo SS system (upstairs and away from my SS system and the new XS). Well, the channel display on the Hitachi mysteriously appears from time to time as he does whatever up there.

His observation? Some kind of interference (from the audio. PS2, whatever) that effects the remote. If the (infrared) remote is pointed at the Hitachi, the mysterious display happens. If he points it away (backwards), then problem is solved.

Huh?

E

I have observed a few very small dust flecks, covering less than a single pixel, on my 42we655. They are not visible from more than a foot or so from the screen.

Originally posted by wwwTOPDJcom
finally found I have a single stuck pixel. no biggy you cannot see it unless your standing next to the TV, and its off to the left side.
But I did find "only when standing next to TV" that there appears to be some dust or specks on the inside of the screen. "visible on light color background only"

Sitting at our viewing distance 9-10ft I dont see any issues.
Still tweaking the settings.
But I would like to know if anyone has seen the dust issue I saw?

55WF655

It seems to be quite common. I have looked at about 25 of the WF and XS models either on the floor or fresh out of the box at different stores. Before I took mine home from the store I made sure they opened the box and I was able to put the tv through some basic checks for dead pixels, good screen geometry, and specs between the glass. Honestly more then 50% of the sets I checked had one of the above. Even a few Panasonics I looked at had the same problem. Your only hope is to get a set with the least problems and live with it and hopefully from where you're sitting you won't be able to spot the problem. My current WF55 has a few dead pixels but you have to be a foot from the screen to find them (and even that takes some time), so once you back up they fade into the picture and from our couch are no where noticeable.

The store I bought it from is letting me look at a few more as an exchange to keep me happy but the 4 I dropped by to look over were just as bad if not worse. They either had bright dead pixels, or had a nice black spec pepper corn size in some cases between the screen. The only explanation I got from the store was that these issues, dead pixels and specs are within the manufacturers parameters for errors. 2 out of over 1 million pixels is fine and as long as the spec is not viewable from +6 feet it gets by too. They came close to saying I was being to critical but I guess most people wouldn't even notice these things (except for people like us who want to know everything about our products and come to places like this to see what else we can critique on...am I right???).

So the search for the holy grail is on, but heh if I have to keep my current one in lue of the other problems you might get with an exchange it wouldn't be the worst thing. Overall I'm still a happy camper.

OK,

I've now personally witnessed a 2nd 60XS that makes noise. Aren't you guys hearing this at low levels? its getting to be an issue for me.
My brother in law bought the same set and we're both noticing it now.

comments?

Aceman

Originally posted by Aceman
OK,

I've now personally witnessed a 2nd 60XS that makes noise. Aren't you guys hearing this at low levels? its getting to be an issue for me.
My brother in law bought the same set and we're both noticing it now.

comments?

Aceman

Alas, my 60XS isn't one of the mysterious "silent" sets some people talk about. Oh, it's not loud... much quieter than a PS2 or Xbox... about the volume of a DirecTivo. It's only noticeable during absolute silence in a movie... but it's there. It's not an objectionable noise either... a slight low "whir". I would say for us it's *not* an issue.

One thing to note that it's louder for the first minute or so after turning on. If it stayed at that volume, I would consider it an issue. But thankfully after a brief period the sound dips to a reasonable level for us.

PQ looks great out of the box in "normal" mode, so I'm happy with the purchase. Looking forward to more HD programming....

is there suppose to be a Warranty card in the BOX to fill out to register the
55WF ?

I have the 55XS and there is no warranty card, but there is a warranty information card. I doubt that there is any warranty card as well - that stuff is obsolete these days.

Also you really need is basically the receipt of purchase of the TV that shows that you bought the TV within one year (the time of the manufact warranty). The info card also has the Sony warranty contacts.

thats what I thought, thanks
I got mine from one-call, took the 5 year extended plan, 18mo Sony interest free. With the rebates its quite a good deal on a proven TV Model.
I don't want to have to worry about fixing it if it has a major issue.
I know it's most likely to not have one. Knock on wood :)

Aceman --

I wonder how you are feeling about your XS955? For example, "Would you recommend it to a friend?"

As you may remember, I have the Mitsubishi 62575 that I'm still considering replacing with the 55XS955. Today I found that my MITs would not receive or decode any OTA HD!!!! This may be the straw that breaks the camel's back, so the MITs may be on its way back to the store, thus my question to you.

It seems that this thread has generally "smaller" problems reported (fan noise, weak remote) for comparison, go check out the "62575 owner's thread" (or some similar title). For what it is worth, my MITs has fan noise as well, so I do not think the Sony will be a problem for me.

My MITs has the following, I've yet to see any of these type problems reported on this thread, so in my mind, Sony has the edge:

1. Tilt - 3/8" rise from bottom left to right. The top is only 1/8", I'm afraid the picture is not tilted but rather distorted.

2. Smudges - I have several small smudges and one larger one that I can see during light backgrounds from 12 feet viewing distance.

3. Rainbows - DLP.

Thanks.

RH in Corrales.

I hosed up the MITs number, the thread I meant to reference is:

"62725 Owner's ...."

RH

I really don't think the Sony remote is weak but it is very directional. It needs to be pointed at the lower right corner of the set...that's where the sensor is.

Originally posted by corrales_avs

It seems that this thread has generally "smaller" problems reported (fan noise, weak remote) for comparison, go check out the "62575 owner's thread" (or some similar title). For what it is worth, my MITs has fan noise as well, so I do not think the Sony will be a problem for me.

OK, I've now personally witnessed a 2nd 60XS that makes noise. Aren't you guys hearing this at low levels? its getting to be an issue for me. My brother in law bought the same set and we're both noticing it now. comments?

I too have recently recieved a 60xs955 and now have noticed the fan noise. But mine I believe is louder. I can hear it during the show or dvd that im watching.

I read the manual and it mentions that fan noise is normal but I might be returning mine and trying to get a replacement to see if i can get a "quiet" set.

I realize I should have posted here rather than the general forum.

I just purchased the 60WF655 to be delivered 1/8. I've been really struggling with what stand to get with it. I bought the set at one of those AV/Furniture store combos and got a nice deal on the set and a 5-yr extended warranty. At the time of the set purchase I had my eye set on a 22" high mahagony finish cocktail table with a nice shelf 6" above floor height for my components, cable box, etc. In fact, dickered and got a nice deal on that as well and got the cocktail table home only to unpack it and find a big crack on the tabletop.

I'm going back this afternoon to return the coktail table (after the Packer game of course) and may just cave and get one of those modern looking gray front/glass TV stands even tho it really doesn't go with our traditional decor.

Does anyone have this set and can do a quick measurement of the dimensions of the base that the set sits on?

Thanks.

I don't have the set, but someone in another forum posted that the base was about 37 inches. Hope that helps, the Sony Cut Sheet on Sony Style.com doesn't have a base measurement

Long time lurker here. I just wanted to say thanks for everyone's expert advice on this forum. With everyone's input and knowledge I just pulled the trigger on a 55xs955 this new years day and am having it delivered on Tuesday. I just got finished putting together the Sony stand. I wanted to post and thank everyone for contributing to the best online resource for HDTV. Now all I need is a good DVD player. Thanks Again!!

I want to echo the post above by "John Kirst". Thanks for all the info
regarding the Sony models. I pulled the trigger on the KDF-42WE655
a little over two weeks ago. Its absolutely amazing.....

Well...I ended up just exchanging for another mohagony coctail table. Couldn't see going with a metal stand that would stick out in my living room when I really wanted wood. It's got a shelf 12" off the floor with 9 3/4" of clearance and two arge pull out drawers underneath the shelf. That wil still give me plenty of room for the components and the trim and low profile will act as its own "cord management. I'm going to either do a shelf or a shelf rack for the center channel. The table itself puts the base at 22" off the floor, so overall I think it will work nicely.

The only problem now is that the set is being delivered Saturday in plenty of time for the Packers-Vikings playoff game at 7pm; however, I'm in a dance band and our gig starts at 7pm. What a bummer!!

I also picked up the 42WE655 yesterday. I'll have it later this week.

Just for my 55WF a few days ago and have a couple of issues:

1) When I hooked up my DVD and played a 16:9 film, after about 20 or so minutes the screen automatically changes to the 4:3 which is my default settings on the TV. This doesn't happen when watching normal TV

2) While I was initially concerned with the blacks of the TV, now I'm seeing too much black with very little contrast. Watching Star Wars Episode III there were scenes where everything was black and nothing was discernible. I tried various settings but to no avail. Help??

Richjam, you might try switching your DVD player to output the component signal (if that's what you're using) as INTERLACED vs. PROGRESSIVE. My Pioneer DVD player has a problem with deep blacks in progressive (i.e., 480p) mode, where 480i mode is stunning - a whole different look. In addition, your new TV may well have a better deinterlacer than your DVD player, so you may get better quality all-'round.

Just something to try, YMMV.

Originally posted by richjam


2) While I was initially concerned with the blacks of the TV, now I'm seeing too much black with very little contrast. Watching Star Wars Episode III there were scenes where everything was black and nothing was discernible. I tried various settings but to no avail. Help??

I'm biting my tongue to resist commenting on the "Episode III" typo... :p

But seriously, I know what you are talking about. I watched Return of the Jedi (a dark movie) last night on my Avia calibrated 60XS. Before starting the movie I checked with the THX optimizer and everything was spot on. However, some of the dark scenes seemed too dark for me... I bumped up the brightness during the movie to enhance the shadow detail and it looked pretty good. Then I checked the optimizer after the movie and my blacks were way high... the pluge drop shadow in the THX logo was very pronounced.

So I don't know what to think now- Go with what looks good, go with the calibration, or somewhere in between?

Originally posted by richjam
When I hooked up my DVD and played a 16:9 film, after about 20 or so minutes the screen automatically changes to the 4:3 which is my default settings on the TV. This doesn't happen when watching normal TV


This is part of the OSD bug which I have reported to Sony (I'll bet the displays came on when the screen changed). Any small glitch in the video signal can cause this such as a vcr going into fast play.

Sony called me back finally (after over a month) and said they are going to come out to "replace a part" very soon. I'll let you know if this is really a fix or they are just trying to shotgun the problem.

Jeff

Originally posted by mrpackerguy
The only problem now is that the set is being delivered Saturday in plenty of time for the Packers-Vikings playoff game at 7pm; however, I'm in a dance band and our gig starts at 7pm. What a bummer!!

I think the Vikes/Packers game is at 3:30, not 7. Do this longtime Vikes fan a favor, and have your team put mine out of its own self imposed misery. Start 5-1, finish at 8-8 is pathetic... :mad:

Originally posted by jmdaniel
I think the Vikes/Packers game is at 3:30, not 7. Do this longtime Vikes fan a favor, and have your team put mine out of its own self imposed misery. Start 5-1, finish at 8-8 is pathetic... :mad:

Yeah...and they gave Tice another year. Can't believe it.

BTW, Vikes fan too, but they're beating themselves...Washington didn't even need to show up yesterday.

I finally got my 42WE655 last week. It was an upgrade exchange from Sony for my problematic 40xbr800. I've never subscribed to HD service from my cable provider so this is my first opportunity to see true HD using my roof top antenna. It's amazing how the NTSC channels can come in so poorly with ghosts and all, but the HD channels are crystal clear. As far as SD is concerned, most of the digital cable channels look good on this set but I think the XBR800 did a better job of cleaning up the analog stations. They seemed sharper on the XBR, but I am able to get a decent picture by adjusting the DRC.

Fortunately I'm able to get quite a few free HD channels in the Chicago area although many of them are only providing SD or showing blurry up converted stuff in HD. I was impressed with the PQ of Lost on NBC but most of their broadcasts are 4:3 with bars on the side (good PQ though). Almost everything on ABC is broadcast 16:9 but a lot of the shows seem soft like they are up converted 480i. I watched a lot of football this weekend and all the games looked great. The funny thing is that PBS actually provides the most consistently excellent PQ. The Crossroad Guitar Festival they broadcast the other day looked amazing. I hope the big networks get their act together soon.

Overall I'm pretty happy with the set. The blacks aren't as good as my XBR was but that doesn't bother me. DVD's, HD and most SD looks great. I have not seen any stuck pixels from normal viewing distance (and have no intention of searching for them). The fan does get loud for a couple seconds when I first turn the set on but then gets quiet enough that I forget about it.

My only real complaint at this point is that my cable provider, Wide Open West, does not provide any of the local HD “in the clear” and all the digital channels are encrypted so I'm stuck with the cable box. They told me they don't have cable cards yet.

This set is going to turn me into a couch potato.

Originally posted by Perryt
My only real complaint at this point is that my cable provider, Wide Open West, does not provide any of the local HD “in the clear” and all the digital channels are encrypted so I'm stuck with the cable box. They told me they don't have cable cards yet. What about Comcast? Go get yourself a little HD DVR. Oh yeah!

Originally posted by Buck's SCSW
What about Comcast? Go get yourself a little HD DVR. Oh yeah!



I used to have Comcast until they took away my Speed Channel and said I would have to pay another $5 a month for it. WOW turned out to be less expensive and included Starz and DIY in thier basic digital package. Those were extra with Comcast.

Originally posted by Perryt
I used to have Comcast until they took away my Speed Channel and said I would have to pay another $5 a month for it. WOW turned out to be less expensive and included Starz and DIY in thier basic digital package. Those were extra with Comcast. Unfortunately, now you're getting what you pay for. Make the switch and pay the $5. From what I've read on this forum it's worth it.

I'd start with the calibration but then tweak that to what you prefer. Who cares if it is "correct" if you're not happy with the results?

Originally posted by DaverJ

So I don't know what to think now- Go with what looks good, go with the calibration, or somewhere in between?

I have the 55XS hooked up with only its optical audio out into my receiver. I can receive audio from analog channels and digital channels fine through this optical out.

However, I noticed that if you tune to any analog (NTSC) channel via using the favorites menu, no sound will be output. This problem can be fixed if you tune to any digital channel, and then tune back to the analog channel using the channel +/- buttons on the remote.

Anybody else experiencing this and know a way around this? Not really a big problem but it'd be great if I can actually put some analog channels in my favorites list.

Originally posted by Buck's SCSW
Unfortunately, now you're getting what you pay for. Make the switch and pay the $5. From what I've read on this forum it's worth it.

I would actually have to cough up an additional $30 to get the same services I have now. The only benefit to me is that I could get a cable card, which would make life easier for my wife. She has an irrational fear of remotes and doesn't want to learn anything more than pushing the power/ch/vol buttons. As weird as it sounds, she just doesn't want to learn how to switch between the cable box and antenna.

I recently purchased a 60XS955, and have been working to set it up for best results. I've used Video Essentials and adjusted the Video settings in the user menus.

My question is this: does it matter which setting I start with (Vivid, Standard, Movie, Pro), or does the use of Video Essentials end up with the same results regardless of which mode I start with?

As a separate question -- I'm using the original Video Essentials --- is there an advantage in buying the latest version or Avia?

Unfortunately I'm in the wilds of Alabama, and an ISF certified tech is hard to come by. I want to do the best I can in a do-it-youself mode!

Thanks for listening!

I got my 55XS955 on Sunday - traded (up?) from a 60WF655. My initial impressions are (OOB) that it's really very little different from the WF. I was hoping for improved audio, but that's at best only marginal (not that I was expecting output equal to digital into a quality amp). I compared the anti-reflection and also didn't see a noticible difference (the WF was fine in that regard, especially compared to my previous shiny screen Hitachi). I haven't tweaked anything yet, so I can't speak for the "extra" tweakability of the XS. Of course there's the extra HDMI input, but since I have nothing in the first input, getting a second was no great shakes. Bottom line, IMHO, is that, unless the looks of the XS appeal to you, or you need the second HDMI input, you may as well get the WF and spend the money saved on a bigger screen or a high quality DVD player. Again, this is just one person's opinion, but I have had both in my house, so it may count for something.

Anyone else have this? My KDF50WE655 has a "pop" in the audio when changing channels. It's not present when using the internal speakers.

Originally posted by oldnacl
I got my 55XS955 on Sunday - traded (up?) from a 60WF655. My initial impressions are (OOB) that it's really very little different from the WF.
What video settings did you settle on with the 55XS955 using your DVD player, and were they different than what you had with the 60WF655?

Michael

Originally posted by RichardK
Anyone else have this? My KDF50WE655 has a "pop" in the audio when changing channels. It's not present when using the internal speakers.
I am assuming you mean a pop in your HT system (receiver, prepro, amps), is that correct? How is your TV connected to your HT system?

Michael

OK so am I correct in assuming that the only real way to tweak these IV's is to get the Avia disc? People on the UMR thread were saying the menus were way different on this set, and that his tweaks wouldn't work. Anyone gotten any UMR style tweaks down on the IV sets yet?

I get mine in 10 days.

B

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
I am assuming you mean a pop in your HT system (receiver, prepro, amps), is that correct? How is your TV connected to your HT system?

Michael

Correct. Standard RCA cables from the fixed/variable audio outputs to the preamp. Actually I just noticed the pop is only in the right channel. I plugged the audio output into a battery powered headphone amp and got the same result. Same result using the fixed or variable setting.

No question that there's a problem, I just wanted to make sure this isn't "normal" for the set before I have the locals take it apart.

CableCard vs. Cable Box

One of the reasons I chose the Sony 55WF was the cablecard and next Friday Comcast will be installing my 'digital cable'. Given that my neighbor has the Comcast box which not only has the on-demand but also the ability to record which is an extra $10/month (TIVO-type), I'm now not sure which way to go. For simplicity, the Cablecard is obvioiusly hard to beat and I doubt if I'll ever subscribe to Pay-per-view and I expect to purchase a DVD recorder in the next few months. I also heard from a friend of mine that his SD picture was noticeably better with the CableCard than the box. Your thoughts??

Originally posted by RichardK
Correct. Standard RCA cables from the fixed/variable audio outputs to the preamp. Actually I just noticed the pop is only in the right channel. I plugged the audio output into a battery powered headphone amp and got the same result. Same result using the fixed or variable setting.
In case you haven't done this yet, you might want to switch the cables for the audio output, using the "left" cable for the right, and the "right" cable for the left. If the pop switches sides, you may have a bad cable. If it stays on the same side, then the audio output or jack may be the problem.

BTW, does the pop occur for all TV sources or is it just one specific, external source, like the DVD player? If it is just one external source, I would check that out also.

Michael

Originally posted by richjam
CableCard vs. Cable Box

One of the reasons I chose the Sony 55WF was the cablecard and next Friday Comcast will be installing my 'digital cable'. Given that my neighbor has the Comcast box which not only has the on-demand but also the ability to record which is an extra $10/month (TIVO-type), I'm now not sure which way to go. For simplicity, the Cablecard is obvioiusly hard to beat and I doubt if I'll ever subscribe to Pay-per-view and I expect to purchase a DVD recorder in the next few months. I also heard from a friend of mine that his SD picture was noticeably better with the CableCard than the box. Your thoughts??

Just picked up the 42WE655 a few weeks ago and went through the same dilemma, cable card vs. Cable Box HD-DVR. After a bunch of friends told me I was an idiot if I didn't get the HD-DVR, I caved to peer pressue. Guess what, they were right. I'm now hooked on being able to record HD programs and come back at any time and play them at my leisure....

You are correct that a TV's built in tuner is a tad better at SD but for me the DVR's features and capabilities smoke than one small advantage.

Good luck.....

The more crap you hook your cable through before reaching the tv,...... the worse the picture.... Cable Card is the way to go... However, Time Warner Cable in Charlotte now has a DVR that will record HD content... I haven't seen it in action but it sounds pretty cool...

Michael - I spent a while searching the forum as I was disatisfied with DVD playback PQ, even considering buying the Sony NS975V player mentioned frequently in this thread. I tried a couple DVD players that I own, both recent models and the picture was extremely grainy (for lack of a better description). I played with the settings on the DVD player, component out, S-video out and finally I set it to 480i connected by component cables and the PQ improved noticibly, to the point where I'm satisfied. I also noticed, as mentioned in this thread, that older DVDs were more likely to exhibit the problems I was experiencing. I'd like to know whether the Sony NS975V (or any other suggestions - Toshiba?) makes a significant (as in worth spending another $300) difference playing the older movies - anyone?

Alot of movies have grain iun the picture especially old ones. It is from the source material. You would need some type of noise reduction processing to get rid of it. My Holo3D graph 2 card did a decent job of getting rid of some of that noise for the price. But you would probably need to get something like the Aloglith, which is over $2000, to really do an excellent job of cleaning up the picture.

Originally posted by oldnacl
I'd like to know whether the Sony NS975V (or any other suggestions - Toshiba?) makes a significant (as in worth spending another $300) difference playing the older movies - anyone?

I would like to second this request. I'm moderately happy with low end Pioneer through component cables at 480i (found that to work better than 480p on this set), but will a good upscaling DVD player look noticeably sharper? I hate to have a set as good as the 60XS an not feed it the best signal...

-dw

Originally posted by Mheav
The more crap you hook your cable through before reaching the tv,...... the worse the picture.... Cable Card is the way to go... However, Time Warner Cable in Charlotte now has a DVR that will record HD content... I haven't seen it in action but it sounds pretty cool...

I went the HD DVR route and I'm pleased. The Comcast tech brought a CableCard with him but talked me out of it....you don't just lose pay-per-veiw, you lose the channel guides too. (according to the tech, anyway. I can live w/o PPV, but being able to find out the name of the channel and program is pretty important) The box that Comcat provided is the SA8000 HD DVR which is actually an older model, so they've had the ability to record HD for some time.

Originally posted by oldnacl
Michael - I spent a while searching the forum as I was disatisfied with DVD playback PQ, even considering buying the Sony NS975V player mentioned frequently in this thread. I tried a couple DVD players that I own, both recent models and the picture was extremely grainy (for lack of a better description). I played with the settings on the DVD player, component out, S-video out and finally I set it to 480i connected by component cables and the PQ improved noticibly, to the point where I'm satisfied. I also noticed, as mentioned in this thread, that older DVDs were more likely to exhibit the problems I was experiencing. I'd like to know whether the Sony NS975V (or any other suggestions - Toshiba?) makes a significant (as in worth spending another $300) difference playing the older movies - anyone?

From my experience, No, the Sony NS975V is not worth the extra $300(plus another $120 for HDMI cable) I did not notice enough difference between it and my old player (Jvc 502) that justified keeping it.
While there is more clarity in the picture, the difference is very subtle, but is now where close to HD IMO. Maybe when the price drops and if I can purchase a less expensive HDMI cable online, maybe.

Originally posted by hdiesel1977

While there is more clarity in the picture, the difference is very subtle, but is now where close to HD IMO. Maybe when the price drops and if I can purchase a less expensive HDMI cable online, maybe.

Thanks for this response.

Is there a noticeable PQ loss viewing through composite cables?

Originally posted by hdiesel1977
Maybe when the price drops and if I can purchase a less expensive HDMI cable online, maybe.

Less expensive HDMI cables. (http://www.ramelectronics.net/)

Originally posted by RichardK
Anyone else have this? My KDF50WE655 has a "pop" in the audio when changing channels. It's not present when using the internal speakers.

I have the same thing happen but only when I'm running audio from my cable box (via Optical cable) to my AV Receiver using my surround speakers. It only occurs when switching from a digital channel with a Dolby (5.1 or Pro Logic) audio feed to a SD signal with a stereo feed. It happened on both my Sony RP CRT television and my new 60WF655 using the same sound system. I don't recall it ever happening when using the television's internal speaker. So I concluded it is not related to the TV, must be the cable's audio signal.

One thing I notice on my 60WF655 is that when I change between an HD channel and a non-HD channel, the picture gets real wavey during the transition. Is this normal? It didn't happen on my RP-CRT television. It doesn't seem to hurt anything.

KAD

Originally posted by oldnacl:

"I'd like to know whether the Sony NS975V (or any other suggestions - Toshiba?) makes a significant (as in worth spending another $300) difference playing the older movies - anyone?"

_________________________________________________________

I have the Sony 975V and find the PQ stunning. I have watched 14 DVD's since buying it and all have looked fantastic. I am using the players HDMI out to HDMI in on my set and tweaked both the player and that input (Video 7) with DVE. I have no complaints.

As far as cost goes, yes a little pricey. Got the 975V at "Soundtrack" (Ultimate Electronics) for $285 and my 5ft HDMI cable at Sonystyle USA ( http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_ParametricSearch-Start;sid=v4t7Gaudne57EepHXH5xEuSN69c6fY2qCiY=?search_keywor d=hdmi+cable&selected_category_name=None&SearchAll.x=4&SearchAll.y=0) for $50.00. I figure this upconverting interim technology will suffice until HD-DVD players become available in a couple of years at an affordable price.

I have to agree on the 975 PQ, awesome. So to me it is certainly worth it. When I put on really good material like Joe Kane's calibration disc (Digital Video Essentials) it looks amazing. It doesn't have the film like quality of an HD feed, say Seabiscuit in HD, but it looks great. Most people would not be able to tell at a glance it wasn't HD

Originally posted by RichardK
Anyone else have this? My KDF50WE655 has a "pop" in the audio when changing channels. It's not present when using the internal speakers.

I often get pops through my HT Receiver but I believe it is the switching of audio streams from the broadcast. For example, when watching the Rose Bowl it was a bit annoying when they switched feeds and sources and my receiver switched gears (metaphorically of course)

Originally posted by Dave72
I've been lurking for a month now, but decided to join the fold. Thanks to everyone for the great information posted here, it's been very helpful.

I've had my 55xs955 since November 13th and yesterday while watching a DVD on my Sony NS975V, the picture went pink. Since this is my second 975 (first one initiated the tray lock by itself and would not release) I thought that maybe I have another bad 975. Switched to my Direct TV source (both the HR10-250 and the 975 run off Monster 400 series HDMI cables) and it was pink as well. Everything had a pink/reddish hue and very dark areas were dark green, not black. Yellows are now orange, greens are blue. Tweeter is sending someone out tomorrow to look at it (they better just replace it before Christmas) - does anyone know what's going on or has anyone experienced this? Thanks


Tweeter replaced my 55XS on 12/15/04 with a new unit. Their tech department said that my problem sounded like something they could not fix, so they just replaced it So far so good with the TV, I'm still not sure aobut the NS975V though. If you hit the tray open button too quickly after turning it on, the player just turns off. I'm used to players opening as soon as you hit the button. I am thinking very hard about switching to the 2910. Another friend bought a NS975V and it did not work straight out of the box. Does anyone else feel like this player is a p.o.s.?

Originally posted by richjam
CableCard vs. Cable Box

One of the reasons I chose the Sony 55WF was the cablecard and next Friday Comcast will be installing my 'digital cable'. Given that my neighbor has the Comcast box which not only has the on-demand but also the ability to record which is an extra $10/month (TIVO-type), I'm now not sure which way to go. For simplicity, the Cablecard is obvioiusly hard to beat and I doubt if I'll ever subscribe to Pay-per-view and I expect to purchase a DVD recorder in the next few months. I also heard from a friend of mine that his SD picture was noticeably better with the CableCard than the box. Your thoughts??

I have a Sony 55XS955 and have Comcast. I had the cable card for the first month and had no problems and loved the monthly cost (free!). The HD channels are superb, digital is very good and analog is good. However, I missed not having the onscreen TV guide and wanted the ability to record so I decided to get the DVR (Motorola DCT 6412) from Comcast on Monday.

I hooked up the DVR using component and the HD channels looked great (no different than the cablecard), however the analog channels were _awful_! The difference between the cable card and the DVR box was very noticeable. I tried changing the connection using S video and that was just as bad if not worse. So I decided to keep both.....

I used a splitter on the main cable feed with one coax going into the TV's cable input (for the cable card) and the other into the DVR. As long as I'm not watching analog channels I've been using the DVR. When I want to watch Seinfeld reruns on TBS I use the cablecard input.

Yous shouldn't need the cablecard for analog channels or any digitals sent in the clear. Just like a regular tv doesn't need a cable box to tune analog cable channels.

Originally posted by Dem4ers
I have a Sony 55XS955 and have Comcast. I had the cable card for the first month and had no problems and loved the monthly cost (free!). The HD channels are superb, digital is very good and analog is good. However, I missed not having the onscreen TV guide and wanted the ability to record so I decided to get the DVR (Motorola DCT 6412) from Comcast on Monday.

I hooked up the DVR using component and the HD channels looked great (no different than the cablecard), however the analog channels were _awful_! The difference between the cable card and the DVR box was very noticeable. I tried changing the connection using S video and that was just as bad if not worse. So I decided to keep both.....

I used a splitter on the main cable feed with one coax going into the TV's cable input (for the cable card) and the other into the DVR. As long as I'm not watching analog channels I've been using the DVR. When I want to watch Seinfeld reruns on TBS I use the cablecard input. Pretty cool man. I am buying the same TV and switching to Comcast from Satellite, and I thought about this very scenario. Have you noticed a drop in PQ in either source? Does it enhance your ability for TwinView (PIP)? Did you try tweaking your TV to enhance the non-HD picture? Thanks for your feedback.

Originally posted by Dem4ers


I hooked up the DVR using component and the HD channels looked great (no different than the cablecard), however the analog channels were _awful_! The difference between the cable card and the DVR box was very noticeable. I tried changing the connection using S video and that was just as bad if not worse. So I decided to keep both.....


I'm not sure if yours is the Motorola DVR "Moxie" box, but I have it and started noticing with my Charter cable that the analog stations were grainy on my RCA 35" (getting a 60WF655 delivered Saturday) I called and Charter sent a tech out who said they just learned of a "shielding" flaw in the splitter inside the DVR box whereby it's not shielded properly. He claims they were going to fix it, but since Charter is going all digital in January, it shouldn't matter. So, I guess I'm expecting my analog channels, for now to be (twice) as worse looking as they are now until the all-digital is up-n-running. The tech said Charter is adding 10-12 more HD channels for a total of 17 or so, but when I ordered my HD service yesterday, they said they had run into licensing problems with the "A&E HD package" which includes A&E, Biography, the History Channels so that might not be available for awhile. Also, they were "in negotiation" with Fox.

I have been searching looking for a still image capture that someone posted comparing HDMI vs. analog input on one particular scene from Shrek 2. It showed a close up of a boy's face and you could clearly see the difference between the two.

Does anyone have a link to this?

Thanks.

Dave

Originally posted by davis03
I have been searching looking for a still image capture that someone posted comparing HDMI vs. analog input on one particular scene from Shrek 2. It showed a close up of a boy's face and you could clearly see the difference between the two.

Does anyone have a link to this?
Is this it?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4723356#post4723356

Michael

Folks,

someone on a ecoustics board said they read in a manual (i'm assuming service since i don't recall seeing it in the user manual) that you can "nullify" unused inputs so you don't have to hit TV/VIDEO button umpteen times to go from video 6 to video 5. Anyone aware of this??

Aceman

Originally posted by Aceman
someone on a ecoustics board said they read in a manual (i'm assuming service since i don't recall seeing it in the user manual) that you can "nullify" unused inputs so you don't have to hit TV/VIDEO button umpteen times to go from video 6 to video 5. Anyone aware of this??
Yes, and it is a user set option. Go into the Setup menu and select the option to Label Video Inputs. One of the labels you can apply to an input is "Skip". Doing so means that input will be skipped when you press the TV/Video button.

Michael

Michael,

many thanks! that's an awesome feature IMO (especially when there are 8 inputs!).

Aceman

Originally posted by Dem4ers
<snip> I hooked up the DVR using component and the HD channels looked great (no different than the cablecard), however the analog channels were _awful_! <snip>
Dem - I have the DCT-6412 and KDF-42WE655. I agree, analog SD = awful.
If I didn't love the HD, digital SD and DVR so much, it would go back. I have the cable split into the Sony's cable input so I can watch via it when I just can't stand the quality out of the DCT.

If you poke around Motorola's web site, they have some discussion of this issue:

******
http://broadband.motorola.com/dvr/analogFAQ.asp

Why do some of my basic cable channels look worse than they did before I got this " HD DVR digital cable box?

The circuitry that enables the DVR functions can on certain non-digital channels distort the image slightly. The distortion is usually a minor fuzziness. If the distortion is more than a slight fuzziness, then contact your cable provider. There may be a problem with either the set-top box or the signal into your home.

What we are doing about it: We are working on a next generation of analog-to-digital encoding with more sophisticated picture improvement techniques. This will improve the situation, but will not make converted analog pictures look as good as pictures that are originally created in a pure digital format or transmitted in a digital format.

******

I translate this to mean - "we know analog sucks on our DVRs, we might or might not improve it in future models, thank you".

Jeff

Dem4ers - I have the DCT-6208 single tuner version of the 6412 from Comcast and the 50WE655. The best analog viewing I found to be using the DVI-HDMI connection. Next best was splitting the cable and connecting to the cable input, then the worst was using component.

Originally posted by Buck's SCSW
Pretty cool man. I am buying the same TV and switching to Comcast from Satellite, and I thought about this very scenario. Have you noticed a drop in PQ in either source? Does it enhance your ability for TwinView (PIP)? Did you try tweaking your TV to enhance the non-HD picture? Thanks for your feedback.

I haven't noticed a drop in PQ from using the splitter, but I am only using the "naked eye". HD is still stunning and digital channels are quite good. Twin view is unchanged from my original set-up (cablecard only), however the right (non HD capable) screen only displays the cable input, not the DVR input. (Since I am receiving the same channels with both the cable card and the DVR it doesn't matter.)

I haven't tried any tweaks as I feel the picture is fine as is, but I may experiment if and when I get the time.

Originally posted by HD_OCD
Dem - I have the DCT-6412 and KDF-42WE655. I agree, analog SD = awful.
If I didn't love the HD, digital SD and DVR so much, it would go back. I have the cable split into the Sony's cable input so I can watch via it when I just can't stand the quality out of the DCT.

If you poke around Motorola's web site, they have some discussion of this issue:

******
http://broadband.motorola.com/dvr/analogFAQ.asp

Why do some of my basic cable channels look worse than they did before I got this " HD DVR digital cable box?

The circuitry that enables the DVR functions can on certain non-digital channels distort the image slightly. The distortion is usually a minor fuzziness. If the distortion is more than a slight fuzziness, then contact your cable provider. There may be a problem with either the set-top box or the signal into your home.

What we are doing about it: We are working on a next generation of analog-to-digital encoding with more sophisticated picture improvement techniques. This will improve the situation, but will not make converted analog pictures look as good as pictures that are originally created in a pure digital format or transmitted in a digital format.

******

I translate this to mean - "we know analog sucks on our DVRs, we might or might not improve it in future models, thank you".

Jeff

Jeff - I fully concur with your translation!

Originally posted by mats038
Dem4ers - I have the DCT-6208 single tuner version of the 6412 from Comcast and the 50WE655. The best analog viewing I found to be using the DVI-HDMI connection. Next best was splitting the cable and connecting to the cable input, then the worst was using component.

Thanks mats038, I will pick-up a DVI-HDMI cable to see the difference (and reduce the wires).

I picked up a 55WF655 about 3 weeks ago. In general, I'm loving it, but I've started having a problem. I'm using an antenna and the built in tuner to get my HDTV locals, and can picke them up with no problems (I'm about 2 miles from all the towers). I started noticing problems with the local CBS channel 6.1 where the TV would drop the signal for about a second, and then pick it back up. It would sometimes not happen at all while i was watching, sometimes it would happen about 4 times per hour. Now, when I go to 6.1 the picture shows for about a second, and then it says "No Signal" and goes black. If I change channels, and change back, same thing: picture for a second, and then nothing. Now, I've been watching a black screen for about 10 minutes, and the signal just won't come back. I have the diagnostic window open, and the signal strength is bouncing back and forth between 95 and 98. The status says Lock. All the other channels are working fine, including the Analog channel 6.

What the heck is wrong. Is this a problem with my tuner? Any ideas?

Thanks very much,
John

John,

Sounds like a problem with the station's signal. If was your tuner it would behave that way on your other OTA channels. What you are experiencing is not all that unusual for OTA reception depending on your antennae and other factors.

Hi. I've got a KDF-55WF655, and so far I really like the set. Haven't tried the SM tweaks yet, but I'm pretty happy with the HD and DVD quality. The problem is my xbox. I've got the Monster HD cables connected to my component input, and I've switched the xbox to 480p mode but my games all have a very "jaggie" look to them. I know that on a big screen it will magnify the flaws, but I've read of others getting a smooth picture, even on a big screen. Could the fact that Sony uses a native resolution of 488p be causing the problem??

If anyone has settings for their Xbox input that their happy with, I'd love to know what they are. Thanks!!

Kevin

I have Insight cable and after buying a KDF50WE655, had them come out to install HD. When they arrived, I was informed they ran out of cablecards so they would set me up with a DVR HD unit.

After they had installed and set up the unit, the SD looked horrible. Since my viewing is primarily the news nets and DVDs, SD quality is pretty important to me. I had them take it out. The guy thought the problem was there wasn't a way to just send the signal straight through - it had to go to the hard drive, then to the TV so I was getting a view of compressed SD.

With just digital cable coming straight from the coax, my SD is as good as my old set. I can live with this until CNN/MSNBC/FOXNEWS goes HiDef. I was kind of bummed, though.

Originally posted by jaobrien6
I picked up a 55WF655 about 3 weeks ago. In general, I'm loving it, but I've started having a problem. I'm using an antenna and the built in tuner to get my HDTV locals, and can picke them up with no problems (I'm about 2 miles from all the towers). I started noticing problems with the local CBS channel 6.1 where the TV would drop the signal for about a second, and then pick it back up. It would sometimes not happen at all while i was watching, sometimes it would happen about 4 times per hour. Now, when I go to 6.1 the picture shows for about a second, and then it says "No Signal" and goes black. If I change channels, and change back, same thing: picture for a second, and then nothing. Now, I've been watching a black screen for about 10 minutes, and the signal just won't come back. I have the diagnostic window open, and the signal strength is bouncing back and forth between 95 and 98. The status says Lock. All the other channels are working fine, including the Analog channel 6.

What the heck is wrong. Is this a problem with my tuner? Any ideas?

Thanks very much,
John


This is a long shot but it's worth asking. Is CBS's digital signal physically located on channel 6 or is it in the UHF band. The reason I ask is because the FM frequency band is very close to channel 6. A strong FM signal could cause interference with that channel. Most OTA digital stations are in the UHF band, that's why I said this is a long shot. You can check the physical channel in the diagnostics window. If it is actually located at channel 6, then you might try an FM trap to block the FM being picked up by your antenna.

Are you in an urban area? Maybe its a multipath problem. What kind of antenna are you using?

Perry

I must be blind. While at the store checking out the kdf-55wf655 I could not find the front inputs (s-video, composite, audio) as stated on the Sony site. Where are they?

On the left side of the front panel, up underneath the bezel. Push to pop open the trap door.

TimT

Originally posted by sasha509
I must be blind. While at the store checking out the kdf-55wf655 I could not find the front inputs (s-video, composite, audio) as stated on the Sony site. Where are they?

Mtnmike,
That's what I thought at first, but the behavior last night where it would show 1 second of the audio and video everytime I switched to the channel, and then would go black, made me think that maybe the signal was broadcasting fine, but my tuner was having issues with the signal. Not really sure, though. If there's anyone else in the Portland, OR metro area reading this, it'd be interesting to know if they've seen this behavior with an antenna. 'Cause if it's a problem with the signal, everyone should be having a problem, right?

Perryt,
I'd have to check when I get home, but I *believe* that the physical channel is 40, so I guess there wouldn't be an FM interference problem. I'm not in an urban area, more of a suburban area. No tall buildings, but some tall trees. The antenna I'm using is a Silver Sensor that I have inside my family room.

Thanks for the quick responses,
John

Depending on the length of your coax try moving the antennae around the room when this occurs. Also the antennae is an indoor. If you could temporaily rig an outdoor antennae and check. Call the station and ask if others have complained about the same problem.

Originally posted by jaobrien6
Mtnmike,

Perryt,
I'd have to check when I get home, but I *believe* that the physical channel is 40, so I guess there wouldn't be an FM interference problem. I'm not in an urban area, more of a suburban area. No tall buildings, but some tall trees. The antenna I'm using is a Silver Sensor that I have inside my family room.

Thanks for the quick responses,
John

If you haven't done this yet, post your problem in the Portland OTA HD thread.

So, I've noticed that when there is white/black contrast in scenes on DVD or HD content, such as the credits rolling in a movie, or one particular building of the back drop to Jay Leno's set, the TV has a strobe-light flicker effect.

It's especially noticeable when movie credits roll, particularly when they are white on a black background.

I'm assuming this is normal...but why does it happen? It's annoying! :mad:

Originally posted by Perryt
If you haven't done this yet, post your problem in the Portland OTA HD thread.

Thank you very, very much Perry. Being new to HD, and only having the TV a few weeks, I hadn't explored all the HD programming forums here yet, and didn't even know there was a Portland thread. I went in there, checked out the last page to see if anyone else had the problem, and low and behold, others reported the exact same conditions at the same time last night: strong signal, no audio or video. The fact that I could get a picture for a second is what seemed weird to me, and made me wonder if it was a problem on my end, but since others had the problem, I guess I'm fine after all.

Thanks!!

John

Originally posted by doose1174
So, I've noticed that when there is white/black contrast in scenes on DVD or HD content, such as the credits rolling in a movie, or one particular building of the back drop to Jay Leno's set, the TV has a strobe-light flicker effect.

Strobe-light flicker effect? I'm not aware of anything like that...or maybe I don't know what to look for? Do you mean that the bright whites over dark background tend to flicker quite rapidly like a strobe light?

Perhaps it could be the source of that particular program. See if you can reproduce it on say a DVD.

Originally posted by doose1174
So, I've noticed that when there is white/black contrast in scenes on DVD or HD content, such as the credits rolling in a movie, or one particular building of the back drop to Jay Leno's set, the TV has a strobe-light flicker effect.

It's especially noticeable when movie credits roll, particularly when they are white on a black background.

I'm assuming this is normal...but why does it happen? It's annoying! :mad:

Actually, I've noticed this on the 60xs955 as well. The effect is similar to looking at a PC crt monitor running at 60Hz, where you'd notice the screen constant flickering. Like doose1174 said, it's reproduceable w/ rolling movie credits w/ white on black background from any source. I haven't notice this occurrence in other types of scene (beside the movie credits). But then again, I haven't really been looking for it, whereas w/ the movie credits, it's very obvious.

Has anyone compared the XS to the XBR950? The XBR is all digital while I am not sure if this applies to the XS.

-Brian

Yes, the XS is all digital as well, as it is a Grand WEGA. Furthermore, it has HDMI (digital) inputs so it can accept digital sources.

I just recieved my DVI to HDMI cable and Im using with an older Nvidia 64 meg gforce2 GTS quite impressed with nvidia's new forceware drivers
Im running 1280 x 720 720p in the nvidia hdtv setting
webpages look amazing. wife just came home and looked at me funny for having the internet on the TV :)
Anyways I bought the 6ft DVI to HDMI cable gold plated for 14.65 shipped to my door.

Squawks,

What leads me to believe otherwise is the fact that the XBR has the following:

Enhanced Direct Digital II Circuitry: The first step in the digital processing system, Direct Digital II circuitry with integrated 3D Comb filter, increases signal-to-noise ratio when converting the signal from analog to digital by reducing the number of Digital to Analog conversions.

The XS does not appear to have this.

-Brian

Color settings question - KDF55WF655:

Using the original Video Essentials DVD and the included blue filter to set the color level results in a setting close to the default. Same result using the THX Optimizer with the VE blue filter. I've also noticed that most people's posted settings concur with this. But this doesn't look right! Not everybody should be sunburned and their clothing shouldn't glow! Also, Picture at Max can't be right either, yet everyone seems to set it that way. Watching HD PBS and ABC OTA broadcasts with the settings listed below look real (the so-called looking through the window effect). If I set the Color setting much higher than 14 there's no more looking out the window, but into a neon sign. Is my TV that much different from everyone else's?

USER Settings

Picture 46
Brightness 31
color 14
Hue R1
Sharpness 10
Temp Neutral
Noise Reduction off
Mild Mode Off
Power saver Reduced

Thanks,
RAF

TopDJ,

Where did you get your cable? I want to hook up my PC as well, and have a NVIDIA 6800GT.

Here RAF


My KDF-55XS955 Tweaks!
I had a Samsung HLP-5663W and was not happy with the output. I exchanged for a Sony 55xs955. Out of the box I was disappointed. The Sony looked worst then the Samsung. Thankful I read the forums and also with some help from UMR I tweaked a few settings in service mode. I will post all the SM settings as well as my user settings. If anyone would like they can use this as a starting point.

I have a Panasonic S97 DVD player hooked up HDMI. I disabled all so called enhancement features. Color space used 4:4:4. Also set blacks to darker. I am running player in 480p mode and not using 720p or 1080i mode as per UMR. He explained that the scaler in the Sony is superior to the one in the dvd player.


All settings should be done for 480p, 720p, 1080i. You have to switch your resolution in service mode for each. Some settings are global and some settings may be already defaulted in certain video modes. Also make sure you use Pro mode when you’re doing your adjustments. Let me first share with you my user menu PRO mode settings


USER Settings

Picture Max
Brightness 38
color 38
Hue R1
Sharpness 0
Temp Warm
Noise Reduction off
Mild Mode Off
Power saver Reduced
Advanced Menu (everything Off in adv and all gain and bias set to 0)

Next there are some basic tweaks in SM to help with clarity of picture.

Category DCP-ADJ2

SHFO 15

Category DCP-USER

AXIS 0

Category DCP-MID5

MHFM 2
MVFM 3
MVLS 0
MHLC 0

After making these adjustments I saw the picture look a lot sharper and clearer. I was happy to see improvements; however I still was not satisfied with color accuracy. Flesh tones seemed to red and also sometimes too green. The next set of adjustments help in getting the grayscale in order.
The XS model has a white point adjustment in the advanced user menu. Unfortunately it’s a very very fine adjustment. A course adjustment needed to be done to achieve an accurate grayscale.

Category DCP-ADJ1

RDRV 131
GDRV 140
BDRV 96
RCUT 230
GCUT 237
BCUT 239

I also wanted to adjust the overscan. 4:3 seemed to be dead on. 16:9 was slightly off. Here are my settings for 16:9 adjustments.

DHPH 102
DVPH 12
MDHS 224
MDVS 122

Originally posted by Stryker412
TopDJ,

Where did you get your cable? I want to hook up my PC as well, and have a NVIDIA 6800GT.

here is where I found them and there just as good as any I tried

http://www.monoprices.com/products/subdepartment.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10209&style=

bent98,

I saw your post. One of the reasons I asked about this. I had previously applied UMR's tweaks, but that is all I did in the SM other than check lamp hours. The images don't glow with the color setting that high on your TV?

Everyone else,

What is your color setting?

Thanks,
RAF

55WF Cablecard and how to use a DVR or VCR

Can someone tell me how to hook up a DVR or VCR when a cablecard is used? A friend of mine ran into a similar problem with his Pansasonic in that you can't split the Digital cable signal and the 'video out' is only functional when the TV is on. Gee, tomorrow the Comcast Cable Guy is showing up and I want the CableCard but without DVR or VCR???

Originally posted by richjam
55WF Cablecard and how to use a DVR or VCR

Can someone tell me how to hook up a DVR or VCR when a cablecard is used? A friend of mine ran into a similar problem with his Pansasonic in that you can't split the Digital cable signal and the 'video out' is only functional when the TV is on. Gee, tomorrow the Comcast Cable Guy is showing up and I want the CableCard but without DVR or VCR???

You can't do what you would like to do. The TV doesn't have any video outputs, and since the digital signal is decrypted inside the TV, there is no way to get a video signal out of the TV to use as an input into a DVR / VCR.

If you want to record the signals from Digital cable, you'll need to get the settop box :-(

Why would you not be able hook it up as diagrammed in the Users Manual. Go to page 39. You would not be able to record in digital, but you would be able to record with your VCR.

http://www.sonystyle.com/intershoproot/eCS/Store/en/documents/specifications/KDF55WF655.pdf

Originally posted by Bghead8che
...Direct Digital II circuitry with integrated 3D Comb filter, increases signal-to-noise ratio when converting the signal from analog to digital by reducing the number of Digital to Analog conversions.

The XS does not appear to have this.

-Brian

Let's think this through.

In the XS, digital inputs by way of HDMI are immediately converted to analog by a Si19993 chip. 8VSB signals are immediately converted to analog just after demodulation. All signals (now all analog) are immediately applied to an analog switcher, the output of which goes to a 2D comb filter, which is bypassed for all signals that were originally not of composite origin.

So, analog signals that were NOT originally digital are then converted to digital for DRC processing, while analog signals that arrived at the set as digital signals do not get further converted, at least according to the schematic. This means that digital signals are converted to analog once, while analog signals are converted to digital for DRC processing and back to analog for display. That about covers the total universe of D/A and A/D conversions in a HD set. One D/A for digital, a pair of conversions for analog. That's it.

So, how can an integrated 3D comb filter, which is ONLY applied to analog processing that originated as composite, have anything to do with reducing the number of conversions, which amount to one D/A for HD signals and one A/D and one D/A for analog signals? DRC works in the digital domain, so it appears that that conversion remains intact, and all signals are eventually converted to analog for display, so removing that conversion is also impossible.

And how does signal to noise ratio have anything at all to do with digital conversions? It doesn't. Apples and oranges. Sounds like marketing hype.

I don't believe that the number of conversions is lessened, or that the S/N is improved, or that this would make a difference. And I KNOW that the comb filter has no effect on non-composite and HD signals. The XBR may have a 3D comb filter while the XS has a 2D, but that only is relevant for originally composite SD signals, as comb filtering is not applicable to originally component or digital signals, nor is it needed.

A 3D comb filter is an improvement only on stationary images, also, as it works identical to a 2D filter on motion. On stationary images it may preserve a bit of resolution, so the single improvement on an XBR that you may see over an XS is slightly higher rez on SD composite images...as long as they aren't moving.

But if you are buying an XBR and intending to connect composite sources, you are basically wasting your money anyway, making the 3D comb filter virtually worthless to pretty much everybody. That would be almost as silly as buying the XBR because it has the 3D comb filter.

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
Is this it?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4723356#post4723356

Michael

Something's fishy here. Are we expected to believe that a state-of-art conventional DVD player is outputting 1080i?

Originally posted by TomCat
Something's fishy here. Are we expected to believe that a state-of-art conventional DVD player is outputting 1080i?
I'm not sure I understand the question. According to Sony's NS975V web page (http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?ProductSKU=DVPNS975V&Dept=hav&CategoryName=hav_DVD_DVDPlayers), the NS975V is capable of upscaling DVDs to 720p and 1080i through its HDMI output.

Michael

Originally posted by TomCat
Something's fishy here. Are we expected to believe that a state-of-art conventional DVD player is outputting 1080i?

Fishy indeed. The poster implies that the 480p display does not contain all the "data on the disc". DVD-video discs are only encoded at max resolution of 480p anyway. I suspect the difference in his picture is due more to how the TV processes his 480p component input versus his HDMI input. I have to believe if his 480p component was tweaked to remove all noise reduction and bandwidth limiting filters that the level of detail would be virtually the same. Comments?

Jeff

Originally posted by HD_OCD
DVD-video discs are only encoded at max resolution of 480p anyway.
I think that standard DVDs are encoded at 480i.

Michael

xs955 owners: how do you like the PQ of fast moving video, say HD football?
are there motion artifacts? pixelization? On Sammys whenever the camera panned to follow the football, I saw pixelization and they disappeared when the camera stopped moving. Thank you.

RAF:
I agree with you about the color setting. I run my 42we655 with a color settings between 16 and 20, depending on the input. Anything higher looks like a comic strip to me. I thought I was the only one here who thinks the standard setting for color is WAY too high.

Originally posted by fwsurfer
xs955 owners: how do you like the PQ of fast moving video, say HD football?
are there motion artifacts? pixelization? On Sammys whenever the camera panned to follow the football, I saw pixelization and they disappeared when the camera stopped moving. Thank you.

I have a WF, not an XS, but when playing NCAA Football 2005, I did not notice anything like that. The lag in the Sammy DLPs that I've read about on here made me shy away when I was making the decision on which TV I chose. Gaming on the Sony is great.

I agree I am running a PlayStation-2 through video component and optical digital. What a mind blowing experience

Originally posted by HD_OCD
Fishy indeed. The poster implies that the 480p display does not contain all the "data on the disc". DVD-video discs are only encoded at max resolution of 480p anyway. I suspect the difference in his picture is due more to how the TV processes his 480p component input versus his HDMI input. I have to believe if his 480p component was tweaked to remove all noise reduction and bandwidth limiting filters that the level of detail would be virtually the same. Comments?

Jeff

The true test would be to compare 480p and 480i against 1080i through the HDMI interface.

rmcewan would it be wishful thinking on my part to have you post the images of this experiment for that scene? Then we would know if the limitation is the analog interface, or the relative upconversion capabilities of the DVD player vs. TV.

The DVD player can output 1080i through the HDMI interface, since this is an encrypted link. It won't do this through the 'analog hole'

TopDJ,

I just ordered the DVI-HDMI cable from that site. Question for you, I noticed on another site that there are two different types of DVI cables. Can I use a DVI-D cable with my video card or do I need a DVI-I? Or is DVI-I only used if you hook it to your VGA output through the DVI-VGA converter? Sorry, really confused here.

I sent you a PM but it said you might not have them active so I posted here.

you'll notice 3 rows of 8 pins each; these 24 pins are the only pins required to transmit the three digital channels and one clock signal. The crosshair arrangement on the right is actually a total of 5 pins that can transmit an analog video signal.

This is where the specification divides itself in two; the DVI-D connector features only the 24-pins necessary for purely digital operation while a DVI-I connector features both the 24 digital pins and the 5 analog pins. Officially there is no such thing as a DVI-A analog connector with only the 5 analog pins although some literature may indicate otherwise. By far, the vast majority of graphics cards with DVI support feature DVI-I connectors.

The idea behind the universal nature of this connector is that it could eventually replace the 15-pin VGA connector we're all used to as it can support both analog and digital monitors

to better understand this go here http://www.datapro.net/dvi.html
http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/dvi/

So in summary if I connect only to the DVI connector on my card and not the VGA the, DVI-D will be ok right?

thats what I did using the single link DVI-d to HDMI single link
worked and I dont even have a current video card its a 1999/2000
I didnt think it was going to work, but for a 15 bucks it was worth it :)
just have to go get a newer card so I have support for Sonys funky res.

I ordered today hopefully I'll have it by mid next week, and I'll let you know how it looks on a new card. It may just be a limitation of the drivers that limit the resolutions.

get the new nvidia drivers, read the PDF file it supports quite a bit
http://download.nvidia.com/Windows/66.93/66.93_ForceWare_Release_65_Graphics_Drivers_Release_Notes.pd f

user guide http://download.nvidia.com/Windows/66.93/66.93_ForceWare_Release_65_Graphics_Display_Property_Users_G uide.pdf

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
I think that standard DVDs are encoded at 480i.

Michael

Yep - you are correct. DVD-video is 480i as encoded on the disc. Thanks.

Jeff

RMP in KY:

Thanks for responding. Either my message got lost among all the others in this thread or you and I are the only ones that don't think everything should look like a comic strip like you mentioned.

Everyone else:

One more time. What is you color setting? Mine is 14.

Thanks,
RAF

I'm considering the purchase of the 42" Grand Wega and happened to notice that the KF-42WE610 is approx. $500 cheaper than the KDF-42WE655. What is the difference between these two and is it worth spending an extra $500 for the newer model?

Thanks,
Chris

For RAFABAMAD -

For TiVo (connected via S-Video), my settings are:

Mode - Standard
Picture - 49
Brightness - 49
Color - 34
Hue - 0
Sharpness - 35
Color Temp - Neutral
NR - Medium
Mild Mode - Off

For DVD (connected via component, at 480i):

Mode - Pro
Picture - 51
Brightness - 25
Color - 31
Hue - 0
Sharpness - 0
Color Temp - Warm
NR - Off
Mild Mode - Off

NOTE: I tried DVD at 480p, but blacks were seriously crushed. Changing to 480i and letting the TV do the de-interlacing fixed that problem and seriously improved my picture.

Originally posted by fwsurfer
xs955 owners: how do you like the PQ of fast moving video, say HD football?
are there motion artifacts? pixelization? On Sammys whenever the camera panned to follow the football, I saw pixelization and they disappeared when the camera stopped moving. Thank you.

I have never, ever, ever seen motion artifacts created within my XS, unless you include SD/DBS source material, where they are fixed in the original source (typically from the decoder in DTivo). I have seen minor compression artifacts on rare occasion in OTA HD, but I know from working in broadcasting that they are also inherent to the transmission, and not a factor of the display, and thus not true motion artifacts generated in the XS. I have also never seen them in digital broadcasts that were not part of 3-channel multicasts, which is probably what causes them in the first place.

When I began this journey we were a few months away from GWIVs, and GWIIIs were on display. In one particular CC with very high-quality source material, there was a GWIII smack dab next to a Sammy DLP. There were glaringly obvious motion artifacts on the Sammy, and absolutely none on the GW. Same content, same source. That was the day I scratched DLP off my list...anything that timeshares the light source color-by-color can't possibly avoid motion artifacts completely, and that proved it to me. I never actually saw DLP rainbows, tho, but the motion artifacts were bad enough.

One of the many reasons I bought a XS was because of how well it handled motion compared to most other sets out there. If the source is good, there will absolutely be no motion artifacts, so gaming should have none. Also, both 1080i and 720p NFL broadcasts both look equally terrific on this set, and do not have motion artifacts (but in my market neither FOX nor CBS does multicast).

I'm sorry for this inane question, but I've been hunting around in the service menu and can't seem to find "lamp hours" for the WE655.

The WE610 has them listed under "OPTION E" nicely labled "LAMP HOURS". Does anyone know what I'm doing wrong.

I'd like to know how long this set has been used.

Originally posted by fwsurfer
xs955 owners: how do you like the PQ of fast moving video, say HD football?
are there motion artifacts? pixelization? On Sammys whenever the camera panned to follow the football, I saw pixelization and they disappeared when the camera stopped moving.
I am not into football as much as I was some years ago, but tonight my daughter was watching the Jets-Chargers game when a message came on the screen saying that the DTV feed was experiencing problems. That's when I realized we were looking at ABC's standard analog channel (we have cable TV without cable card or digital box).

After seeing this message, I changed to the next channel (7.1), which happens to be the HD feed for ABC in our area. Lo and behold, HD football in the Mohrmann household! My daughter, wife and I proceeded to watch the remainder of the game in HD (720p). I lost track of the number of times we said "Wow", but man what a difference.

To answer your questions, I did not see any obvious motion artifacts or pixelization in the game. It was apparent that they were having some problems with the HD feed, but the actual camera panning within the game was very good. Until this evening, my favorite TV for HD sports that we auditioned was the Panasonic 50" LCD. Now, it's the 55XS955. How convenient that we own one! :D

Michael

Originally posted by aftab
I'm sorry for this inane question, but I've been hunting around in the service menu and can't seem to find "lamp hours" for the WE655.

I'd like to know how long this set has been used.
I have the same question for the 55XS955. I figure we are approaching the 100 hour mark, at which time I would like to proceed with a thorough calibration using Avia, DVE, and S&V Tuneup.

Michael

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
[BTo answer your questions, I did not see any obvious motion artifacts or pixelization in the game.[/B]

I watched the entire game, and indeed they had a few technical difficulties where the DD 5.1 HDTV feed would actually revert to stereo SD (with sidebars) for a few seconds.

I didn't notice any pixelation at all...or any blurring of any sort.

I've said it many times already on many different threds, but pixelation/blurring due to the properties of LCD RPTVs is nothing but a myth. Any observed pixelation/blurring is caused from the source, i.e. the camera (not enough lighting, too small aperture, etc.). An easy way to counter this myth is to put in a digital movie (i.e. any Pixar DVD) and watch any scene with fast moving objects. No pixelation or blurring whatsoever.

Michael, regarding your calibration after the 100 hour mark...I didn't know that LCD RPTV's should be "broken in" before being calibrated (I am aware that CRT RPTV's should be broken in before calibrating them) - who/what informed you of this?

I was about to buy an AVIA disk but I found a neat little Easter egg: in any THX-certified DVD (i.e. Monsters Inc., Finding Nemo) there is a THX Optimizer set-up which displays various test screens to adjust proper brightness, contrast, blue tint (with THX glasses), geometrics, sharpness, and color accuracy. It even has a sound optimizer to adjust levels of your speakers in a theater setup (although most receivers these days already have one built in).

Originally posted by Squawks
Michael, regarding your calibration after the 100 hour mark...I didn't know that LCD RPTV's should be "broken in" before being calibrated (I am aware that CRT RPTV's should be broken in before calibrating them) - who/what informed you of this?
That is a good question! I thought I had read during my research last year that some people here suggested allowing 100 hours or so on a new lamp before fine tuning the video settings on a RPTV (DLP/LCOS/LCD). Maybe I misunderstood what was being said? :confused:

Michael

Checking lamp hours on a GWIV:

It is still under Option_E, you just have to press jump 3 times to get there.
Press Display - 5 - Volume+ - Power with the set off.
Press Jump three times (top left will show PANEL)
Press 2 nine times and at bottom left will be LampTM with the number of hours to the right of it (also shows LampCT, which may be the number of times the set has been turned on?)

Anyone else care to reply to my earlier post about color settings?

Thanks,
RAF

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
That is a good question! I thought I had read during my research last year that some people here suggested allowing 100 hours or so on a new lamp before fine tuning the video settings on a RPTV (DLP/LCOS/LCD). Maybe I misunderstood what was being said? :confused:

Michael

I would say that it's a good idea to let it run any set for a while so that any defects show up before you invest time/money into calibration. No point in calibrating a set that ends up going back to the dealer or needs a repair that will cause a recalibration to be needed.

I am not sure what just happened is a problem or not, since the 55XS955 is our first widescreen TV in our home. My wife was watching Dirty Dancing: Collector's Edition (1987) (http://www.michaeldvd.com.au/Reviews/Reviews.asp?ID=3704) when the display changed from 4:3 matted to 16:9. FYI, the DVD player is a 5 year old Sony DVP-S530D outputting 480i, if that is important. Up to now, all 4:3, 1.85:1 and 2.35:1 movies have been displayed in their respective aspect ratios.

The review in the link above says that the aspect ratio of this video is 16:9, but it is not 16x9 enhanced. The DVD box says it is in 4:3 widescreen, which I take to mean that the 16:9 presentation is within the 4:3 window.

The 4:3 Default in our 55XS955 is set to Normal. When I checked the TV, the Wide Mode was set to Zoom. So, I went ahead and set it Normal and back came the 4:3 matted widescreen presentation. Problem is, less than a minute later, the TV switched back to Zoom Mode in order to fill the screen.

So, either this is normal for these "types" of movies, or the TV is confused, or the DVD player is confused. The only thing I am certain of is that I am confused!

Michael

Michael,

I'm having the same issue with my 55WF Sony. While playing a DVD on the 16:9, it automatically jumps to 4:3. A previous poster said it was a design flaw and Sony was to fix it.

Originally posted by richjam
I'm having the same issue with my 55WF Sony. While playing a DVD on the 16:9, it automatically jumps to 4:3.
I could understand taking a 16:9 movie and playing it back at 4:3 as being an issue. The thing is, if it were common, you would be reading about this problem a lot on this forum. It may be related to something else, like compatibility issues with certain DVD players (standalone, recorders, PCs, etc.).

My situation is it seems that the 55XS955 "knows" that the DVD movie is in 4:3 widescreen and to set itself to Zoom Mode to fill the screen to its sides. I can start with the Wide Mode set to Normal (and 4:3 Default set to Normal), start playing the Dirty Dancing DVD, and the 55XS955 resets its Wide Mode to Zoom.

To go one step further, if I stop the DVD, I get the DVD player's splash screen, and the 55XS955's Wide Mode goes back to Normal. Continue the movie and the 55XS955's Wide Mode switches to Zoom.

I would almost say that our TV is working correctly, except that I don't see anything in the manual describing what is going on. Maybe this is just how these DVDs are encoded, to tell a 16:9 TV to zoom until it is filled in horizontally (and vertically by the same proportion).

Originally posted by richjam
A previous poster said it was a design flaw and Sony was to fix it.
Sony has actually acknowledged there is a flaw in the GWIVs and is going to fix them?

Michael

I did a cablibration on my 60 XS last week. I also own an XBR950 so I am familiar w/ tweaking Sony LCDs.

A few things that stood out.

1. The XS colors were dead on. Almost no tweaking needed.
2. The user menu sharpness control has NO effect on the HDMI inputs.
3. Out of the box this TV is very "blurry". W/out tweaking the service menu the TV was not even able to display 450 lines of resolution.
4. My Pioneer Elite 59Ai looked much better on progressive than interlaced. I would not suggest using interlaced unless you have a very poor DVD player.

The really love the GWIV but I could not live w/ the Out of the box settings.

-Brian

Originally posted by Bghead8che

4. My Pioneer Elite 59Ai looked much better on progressive than interlaced. I would not suggest using interlaced unless you have a very poor DVD player.



Good report. My findings support yours, except my Pioneer DVD player (the SACD/DVD-A combo) looked better in interlaced. Actually, the setup menu on the Pioneer looks much better in progressive, but once I got into movies, motion in the menus and content had artifacts. This was running through component cables, I don't have any HDMI/DVI sources yet.

I noticed that when using Avia in progressive mode the blacker than black pluge didn't show up, but in interlaced it did. This is another reason I liked interlaced better. I assume this is normal?

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
I could understand taking a 16:9 movie and playing it back at 4:3 as being an issue. The thing is, if it were common, you would be reading about this problem a lot on this forum. It may be related to something else, like compatibility issues with certain DVD players (standalone, recorders, PCs, etc.).



I have this problem with my WE655 and Sony's DAV-FR1 home theater system connected via component. As long as the output is set to interlace, there are no issues: 16:9 disks appear widescreen and 4:3 disks appear full screen without having to change the display setting. However, when the DVD player output is set to progressive, things are completely scrambled, with 4:3 appearing zoomed and 16:9s unzoomed (that is, filling only the center of the screen both side to side and top to bottom). What's worse is when switching back to TV, the display settings don't revert to normal and you end up watching zoomed TV (yuck).

Since I'm the only one in the household who notices the difference, I just live with the interlace setting. Occaisionally I will alter the settings for one movie and then put it back so the kids DVDs play without having to fiddle.

I thought perhaps I just hadn't figured out the right combination of settings and display defaults. Now I suspect there really is a problem. If it were some other brand of DVD player, I might buy the compatibility issue arguement, but you'd think Sony would get it right with their own stuff. This is kind of a shame to be forced back to interlace with gear capable of progressive and also since the Sony player and TV are otherwise well integrated - one button puts both the player and TV in the right modes. Everything works with the out-of-the-box default settings, so you have to figure most people are happily watching with interlaced output, blissfully unaware of the problem.

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
Sony has actually acknowledged there is a flaw in the GWIVs and is going to fix them?

Michael

Does anyone have more details on how/when to get the fix? I searched the thread and couldn't find anything relevant.

As long as the output is set to interlace, there are no issues: 16:9 disks appear widescreen and 4:3 disks appear full screen without having to change the display setting. However, when the DVD player output is set to progressive, things are completely scrambled, with 4:3 appearing zoomed and 16:9s unzoomed (that is, filling only the center of the screen both side to side and top to bottom).
Same thing on my 42WE655. If the component output from the DVD player is interlaced, the TV can read the flag imbedded in the video signal and set the wide mode accordingly. However, if the component output is progressive, then the flag seems to be masked and the TV's wide mode needs to be set manually.
FWIW, I don't think this is a flaw in the set because I remember reading several years ago (when the auto wide-mode feature first appeared on the Sony TV's) that it only worked properly when fed a 480i signal, regardless of input type (S-video, component, or composite). Of course, I could be wrong, but my TV works like Famous Grouse's and Mike Mohrmann's.

Originally posted by aftab
I'm sorry for this inane question, but I've been hunting around in the service menu and can't seem to find "lamp hours" for the WE655.

The WE610 has them listed under "OPTION E" nicely labled "LAMP HOURS". Does anyone know what I'm doing wrong.

I'd like to know how long this set has been used.
AFTAB -

Reading Lamp and Panel time:

In standby mode (TV off) do the following:

1. Press "Display", "5", "Volume +", "Power ON"
2. Press "Jump" 3 times.
3. To display the Lamp time, press "2", 9 times.
Example Display:

PANEL NVM OK 9 OPTION_E
0 LAMP 0 Diff 1
LampTM 14 LampCT 71

Shows:
lamp time = 14 hours
lamp ON/OFF cycle is 71 times

4. To display the Panel time, press "1", 7 times.
Example DIsplay:

PANEL NVM OK 9 OPTION_E

7 SH SFT1 10 Diff 1
PanelTM 14h

Shows:
Panel time = 14 hours

Jeff

Originally posted by Famous Grouse
As long as the output is set to interlace, there are no issues: 16:9 disks appear widescreen and 4:3 disks appear full screen without having to change the display setting. However, when the DVD player output is set to progressive, things are completely scrambled, with 4:3 appearing zoomed and 16:9s unzoomed (that is, filling only the center of the screen both side to side and top to bottom).
I guess I am not explaining our situation very clearly. Our DVD player is not progressive scan, so the output is 480i. Our 4:3, 1.85:1 and 2.35:1 movies appear fine.

It is the movies labeled as 4:3 widescreen that act differently. Most discussions of these letterboxed movies mention using your TV's zoom mode to fill in the screen. Our 55XS955 seems to be performing the zoom function automatically.

Again, we are widescreen/HDTV novices, and what is occurring with our 55XS955 may in fact be normal.

Michael

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
I guess I am not explaining our situation very clearly. Our DVD player is not progressive scan, so the output is 480i. Our 4:3, 1.85:1 and 2.35:1 movies appear fine.

It is the movies labeled as 4:3 widescreen that act differently. Most discussions of these letterboxed movies mention using your TV's zoom mode to fill in the screen. Our 55XS955 seems to be performing the zoom function automatically.

Again, we are widescreen/HDTV novices, and what is occurring with our 55XS955 may in fact be normal.

Michael
Michael,

It is hard to know exactly what you are experiencing. First, go into your TV's menu and set "4:3 Default" to OFF. The TV itself should now stay in the last Wide Mode setting you chose, regardless of input.

Your DVD player may also have manual or automatic ZOOM/WIDE mode settings - you'll need to figure out if it is effecting anything.

The final possibility is that the DVD Disc itself is a combo disc that can be played in 16:9 or 4:3 mode via the SETUP menu chosen from the disc's main menu. When the disc has the option of 4:3 or 16:9, I always choose 16:9 from the disc menu.

(Hope I didn't just confuse matters more)

Jeff

They have alway's said set your DVD player to 16:9. Set the wide mode to wide zoom to fill the screen the best proportion. Set default the same if this is what you want. If you don't it will go to what ever default setting you tell it. If it is off ,it will stay where you put it in the wide mode. Some might change it for a show or something, so default will put it back where you like it for most shows. This was past forums. If some one could make this more cleat it would be a big help.

Bghead8che -

Have you ever posted your GWIV settings - since you have changed them out of the box to suit your needs - would love to see what you did.

Brian

Originally posted by G.B.
They have alway's said set your DVD player to 16:9. Set the wide mode to wide zoom to fill the screen the best proportion. Set default the same if this is what you want. If you don't it will go to what ever default setting you tell it. If it is off ,it will stay where you put it in the wide mode. Some might change it for a show or something, so default will put it back where you like it for most shows. This was past forums. If some one could make this more cleat it would be a big help.

I'll try...

A 480i source (like your DVD player) can be sending video in 4:3 or 16:9 aspect ratio. Your TV can tell by the signal timings which aspect ratio the source material is in.

Your Sony TV has a setting called "4:3 Default". This setting tells the TV which Wide Mode choice to use when the TV detects that the source video is arriving as 4:3 aspect ratio.

SO - if "4:3 Default" is set to "FULL" (for example), then every time the TV detects a 4:3 source, it will change it's Wide Mode setting to "FULL". If the source goes back to 16:9, then the TV will set Wide Mode back to whatever it was last set to.

This confuses some people, because the wide mode setting seems to be jumping around with different content.

If you set the 4:3 Default setting to OFF, then the TV will simply keep it's wide mode setting at the last one you chose, and you will probably find yourself manually changing it as source material changes from 16:9 to 4:3 and back.

If this doesn't make sense, please ask questions about the specific points you are confused about and I'll try to clear it up.

Jeff

Originally posted by HD_OCD
It is hard to know exactly what you are experiencing. First, go into your TV's menu and set "4:3 Default" to OFF. The TV itself should now stay in the last Wide Mode setting you chose, regardless of input.

Your DVD player may also have manual or automatic ZOOM/WIDE mode settings - you'll need to figure out if it is effecting anything.

The final possibility is that the DVD Disc itself is a combo disc that can be played in 16:9 or 4:3 mode via the SETUP menu chosen from the disc's main menu. When the disc has the option of 4:3 or 16:9, I always choose 16:9 from the disc menu.
Our DVD player does not have a Zoom/Wide mode, it is a pretty basic, old non-progressive scan player. I checked the DVD disc and it only has a single format output (4:3 widescreen, aka letterbox).

I have the 4:3 Default option set to NORMAL and the Wide Mode set to NORMAL. With these settings, I should be seeing the movies in their default aspects, i.e. no stretching or zooming. I know of no other movie that resets the Wide Mode away from NORMAL.

This is what happens except for the Dirty Dancing: Collector's Edition disc, which is 4:3 widescreen. The 55XS955 automatically sets the Wide Mode to ZOOM while the movie is playing, and resets the Wide Mode back to NORMAL when the movie is stopped or ejected.

Michael

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
Our DVD player does not have a Zoom/Wide mode, it is a pretty basic, old non-progressive scan player. I checked the DVD disc and it only has a single format output (4:3 widescreen, aka letterbox).

I have the 4:3 Default option set to NORMAL and the Wide Mode set to NORMAL. With these settings, I should be seeing the movies in their default aspects, i.e. no stretching or zooming. I know of no other movie that resets the Wide Mode away from NORMAL.

This is what happens except for the Dirty Dancing: Collector's Edition disc, which is 4:3 widescreen. The 55XS955 automatically sets the Wide Mode to ZOOM while the movie is playing, and resets the Wide Mode back to NORMAL when the movie is stopped or ejected.

Michael

Michael -

View a known 16:9 source on your TV and double-check the Wide Mode setting - I bet it is set to ZOOM. There is no NORMAL for 16:9 sources. I am pretty sure the TV remembers Wide Mode independently for 16:9 sources.

Just for grins - change 4:3 default to OFF and see if the Wide Mode will stick where you set it when watching the DVD.

Also note that many DVDs will change aspect ratio between the Main Menu, the Logo / titles and the content - this could be causing the change in aspect ratio you are seeing.

Jeff

HD-OCD, thanks Jeff. I like wide zoom & most in the past forums have landed on this. You was the first to come in & explain it quite well. I set my default to w. zoom as well. When you do the THX it has sowed to be ok with the tests they have. Some products now like L.G. SAT.REC. when they send HD in 4:3 you can wide mode it. Sony has it locked till you put it on 480 P. then you may change wide mode. What was your final settings ? wide mode, 4:3 default?

Originally posted by G.B.
HD-OCD, thanks Jeff. <snip> What was your final settings ? wide mode, 4:3 default?

I personally prefer a 4:3 Default = Normal and Wide Mode = Full for 16:9.

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
Our DVD player does not have a Zoom/Wide mode, it is a pretty basic, old non-progressive scan player. I checked the DVD disc and it only has a single format output (4:3 widescreen, aka letterbox).

I have the 4:3 Default option set to NORMAL and the Wide Mode set to NORMAL. With these settings, I should be seeing the movies in their default aspects, i.e. no stretching or zooming. I know of no other movie that resets the Wide Mode away from NORMAL.

This is what happens except for the Dirty Dancing: Collector's Edition disc, which is 4:3 widescreen. The 55XS955 automatically sets the Wide Mode to ZOOM while the movie is playing, and resets the Wide Mode back to NORMAL when the movie is stopped or ejected.

I have the same settings. But I noticed that if I set the zoom mode to wide zoom from the remote for a 4:3 disc, it keeps that setting regardless of the menu setting.

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
I guess I am not explaining our situation very clearly. Our DVD player is not progressive scan, so the output is 480i. Our 4:3, 1.85:1 and 2.35:1 movies appear fine.

It is the movies labeled as 4:3 widescreen that act differently. Most discussions of these letterboxed movies mention using your TV's zoom mode to fill in the screen. Our 55XS955 seems to be performing the zoom function automatically.

Again, we are widescreen/HDTV novices, and what is occurring with our 55XS955 may in fact be normal.

Let me give a brief description. Firstly ALL DVDs are encoded in a 4:3 frame. It’s all old fashioned NTSC supports. When the DVD is 16:9 enhanced (also called anamorphic), the picture is squished so it can use more vertical resolution. The DVD player will unsquish it. Some discs are not anamorphic, so that on a widescreen TV you get black bars on all 4 sides. This is where the zoom mode is useful.
See this link for more info…
http://www.thedigitalbits.com/articles/anamorphic/index.html

I would wager that you at one point selected wide zoom from the remote. If you have any 1.33:1 aspect ratio discs, try them and see what the TV does.

Originally posted by Craig F
I would wager that you at one point selected wide zoom from the remote. If you have any 1.33:1 aspect ratio discs, try them and see what the TV does.
Nope, I have the Wide Mode and the 4:3 Default set to Normal. My wife and daughter watched a Full Screen (4:3) movie last night and it was displayed in 4:3 with side bars.

Originally posted by Craig F
Some discs are not anamorphic, so that on a widescreen TV you get black bars on all 4 sides. This is where the zoom mode is useful.
The movie in question, Dirty Dancing: Collector's Edition, is not anamorphic. I was expecting the black bars on all sides except that the 55XS955 automatically switches to Zoom Mode for this movie.

If I manually set the Wide Mode to Normal while the movie is playing, I get the black bars on all sides, but within a short period of time the 55XS955 switches the Wide Mode back to Zoom.

BTW, for a widescreen movie on the 55XS955, the Wide Mode that applies is Full (as noted before, Normal is not appropriate with a widescreen movie). I'll need to check later today to see what the 55XS955 sets the Wide Mode to for a 1.85:1 or 2.35:1 movie, though I suspect it will be Full and not Zoom given our defaults.

Michael

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
Nope, I have the Wide Mode and the 4:3 Default set to Normal. My wife and daughter watched a Full Screen (4:3) movie last night and it was displayed in 4:3 with side bars.


The movie in question, Dirty Dancing: Collector's Edition, is not anamorphic. I was expecting the black bars on all sides except that the 55XS955 automatically switches to Zoom Mode for this movie.

If I manually set the Wide Mode to Normal while the movie is playing, I get the black bars on all sides, but within a short period of time the 55XS955 switches the Wide Mode back to Zoom.

BTW, for a widescreen movie on the 55XS955, the Wide Mode that applies is Full (as noted before, Normal is not appropriate with a widescreen movie). I'll need to check later today to see what the 55XS955 sets the Wide Mode to for a 1.85:1 or 2.35:1 movie, though I suspect it will be Full and not Zoom given our defaults.

Michael

Definitely strange behaviour. Have you tried changing '4:3 Default' to OFF ? I'd be curious of the Dirty Dancing DVD still jumps back to Zoom after a few seconds with '4:3 Default' set to OFF.

Jeff

I have the Sony NS975V upconverting player over HDMI and have not experienced any of these issues on my 55WF655. The screen displays whatever I have my TV and player set to display in aspect ratio and viewing size can be adjusted accordingly.

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
BTW, for a widescreen movie on the 55XS955, the Wide Mode that applies is Full (as noted before, Normal is not appropriate with a widescreen movie). I'll need to check later today to see what the 55XS955 sets the Wide Mode to for a 1.85:1 or 2.35:1 movie, though I suspect it will be Full and not Zoom given our defaults.
I tried out several widescreen DVDs this evening, and each time the 55XS955 switched from a Wide Mode of Normal (our selected option) to Full. Once the DVD was stopped or ejected, the Wide Mode reset back to Normal. Exactly what I would expect.

So, something must be flagged that tells the 55XS955 to set a Wide Mode of Zoom instead of Full when the Dirty Dancing: Collector's Edition plays. Unfortunately, this is one of those letterboxed (4:3 widescreen) movies that loses a lot of quality when zoomed.

My wife wants to get the latest version ("Ultimate Edition", sheesh!), which I believe is an anamorphic DVD, solving the problem for this movie. But I am curious how the Sony knew to switch to Zoom mode (which is the correct way to fill in this movie) rather than Full mode (for widescreen DVDs) or staying at Normal mode (our default for 4:3 DVDs, given that they label this DVD as 4:3 widescreen).

Michael

Originally posted by AkaStp
MtnMike, I know you live near me and we're over 5000 ft altitude here. When I was going through the 55XS955 menu while previewing at the store today I came across an altitude setting (for >1500m). The store had it set to off. Setting it to on didn't do anything obvious. Have you changed that setting? Any idea what it does?

I seem to remember reading here somewhere that the high altitude setting bumps up the fan speed.

Originally posted by davis03
I seem to remember reading here somewhere that the high altitude setting bumps up the fan speed.

that makes sense, because thin air cannot carry as much heat away.
now the big question, will running the higher speed make the LCDs and bulbs last longer? in a non high altitude area

Originally posted by DaverJ
Good report. My findings support yours, except my Pioneer DVD player (the SACD/DVD-A combo) looked better in interlaced. Actually, the setup menu on the Pioneer looks much better in progressive, but once I got into movies, motion in the menus and content had artifacts. This was running through component cables, I don't have any HDMI/DVI sources yet.

I noticed that when using Avia in progressive mode the blacker than black pluge didn't show up, but in interlaced it did. This is another reason I liked interlaced better. I assume this is normal?

I have the same Pioneer "universal" player and have it set the same way - progressive (480p) had artifacts, was too soft and had black crush. Interlaced (480i) looks great!

AkaStp wrote:

MtnMike, I know you live near me and we're over 5000 ft altitude here. When I was going through the 55XS955 menu while previewing at the store today I came across an altitude setting (for >1500m). The store had it set to off. Setting it to on didn't do anything obvious. Have you changed that setting? Any idea what it does?


I have no idea what it does, but since I am above 5,000 ft I switched it on. The manual does not refer to why one would need it.

Mike

Originally posted by davis03
I seem to remember reading here somewhere that the high altitude setting bumps up the fan speed.

Yes - I can't find the post, but I thought I read that it kicks in a higher fan speed during use and that the fan stays on a bit longer when the set is put in stand-by.

Hi Guys,

I just received my 42WE620 on the weekend and I need your advice on the dead pixel issue.

Unfortunately, OOTB, my set has a green (dead) permanent pixel in the top left hand corner. At first I hadn't noticed it, but after switching Wide modes and going to "Normal", with the black outline, I noticed a green pixel. I must admit that it is quite hard to spot even when you are looking for it from a distance. It's impossible to spot when an image takes up the whole screen.

After close inspection of the screen, I found another dead pixel in the bottom right hand corner of the screen, this one was also green, but was not as bright, making it almost impossible to spot unless your face is 3 inches from the screen.

My question is this. Should I return the set and try my luck with another one?...Or do I just live with it since it is not in the center and doesn't really hurt the viewing experience. I just this set from Futureshop here in MTL. (Which is basically Best Buy in the US). I don't know what their policy is regarding dead pixels, but I don't think it would be a problem returning.

My gut feeling is that I should return it since the set is brand new and I believe that it should not come with this "defect". It clearly states in the manual that these "dead" pixels can happen and are inherent in the design of the technology...blah blah blah.

Another question that I have is how many other people have dead pixels? Is this common among these sets? If I return it and get another one, what's to say that I don't get one with a dead pixel in the middle?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Last night I decided to try to tweak my 50we655. Couple of questions...I have four imputs into the tv, my dvd is in the hdmi imput, the satalite reciever is in one of the component hookups, a ps2 in another component hookup, and an off air antenna in the coaxial. Question one, when I was looking at the thx screen on the dvd I couldn't depict the eight squares on the screen no matter how I changed the picture, contrast, brightness, ect... what am I doing wrong? Another question, from what I can understand from the umr tweaks and other people that have tweaked their tv's that after you change the values in one component you have to go to the next component and change the values in that component... is that correct? If that is correct how come there are different values for example when I start on dvd, change the values and then switch to the tv antenna the values are different starting values. Is this normal?
Last question when I try to change the UPIC or UBRT values, the tv automatically brings me back to the starting values. Why can't I change? Any help will be appreciated.

Originally posted by bisache
...Another question, from what I can understand from the umr tweaks and other people that have tweaked their tv's that after you change the values in one component you have to go to the next component and change the values in that component... is that correct?
<Yes, that is correct>
If that is correct how come there are different values for example when I start on dvd, change the values and then switch to the tv antenna the values are different starting values. Is this normal?
<Yes, this is normal, that's why you have to change settings for each input. They are remembered independently by the TV.>
Last question when I try to change the UPIC or UBRT values, the tv automatically brings me back to the starting values. Why can't I change?
<UPIC and UBRT seem to be the same as the settings from the menu. They would not stick for me either if tweaked from the service menu (they'd snap back). Just set them where you want them from the user menu.>


Also, read all of this thread...
UMR GWIII Tweaks (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?threadid=331875&highlight=gwiii)

And then this one...
GWIV Tweaks Thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=465144&highlight=GWIV)

Just got my 42WE655 today.

Old setup:
http://www.myimgs.com/data/Stryker412/setupold.jpg

New setup:
http://www.myimgs.com/data/Stryker412/setupnew1.jpg


:eek: :D

Originally posted by rob_silva
Hi Guys,

I just received my 42WE620 on the weekend and I need your advice on the dead pixel issue.

Unfortunately, OOTB, my set has a green (dead) permanent pixel in the top left hand corner. At first I hadn't noticed it, but after switching Wide modes and going to "Normal", with the black outline, I noticed a green pixel. I must admit that it is quite hard to spot even when you are looking for it from a distance. It's impossible to spot when an image takes up the whole screen.

After close inspection of the screen, I found another dead pixel in the bottom right hand corner of the screen, this one was also green, but was not as bright, making it almost impossible to spot unless your face is 3 inches from the screen.

My question is this. Should I return the set and try my luck with another one?...Or do I just live with it since it is not in the center and doesn't really hurt the viewing experience. I just this set from Futureshop here in MTL. (Which is basically Best Buy in the US). I don't know what their policy is regarding dead pixels, but I don't think it would be a problem returning.

My gut feeling is that I should return it since the set is brand new and I believe that it should not come with this "defect". It clearly states in the manual that these "dead" pixels can happen and are inherent in the design of the technology...blah blah blah.

Another question that I have is how many other people have dead pixels? Is this common among these sets? If I return it and get another one, what's to say that I don't get one with a dead pixel in the middle?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Welcome to LCD my friend! The one thing you don't want to hear after spending much money on these TV's is that the defect you are seeing is "within the specification" from the manufacturer. But only you can decide whether the dead pixels you found are something you can live with. I personally have looked at many of these sets and if you look hard enough it's almost impossible to find a set without one dead pixel. My KDFWF55 has about 3 but you would be hard pressed to find them if I did not show you where they were. Unfortunately the store's sets they offered as an exchange for this one had as many if not more then the set I currently have so I'm going to have to live with it. As long as you get a set with good geometry, no color problems, fan problems, etc... those few (hardly noticeable) dead pixels might be the least of your worries.

Good luck but a few dead pixels might be more the norm then not and of course you can find a problem with anything if you look hard enough.

Thanks for the reply rob.

I tend be of the same opinion as you. However, spending 3K on a TV and having dead pixels right out of the box is a tough thing to swallow.

I can definitely live with the 2 or 3 dead pixels that I have as they are out of the way and nowhere near the center of the screen. There's only 1 full green pixel stuck that is only visible on a black screen when you're looking for it. The other 2 are very difficult to find.

My fear is that I will ask for another set and possibly have more dead pixels in worse areas, or, I may get lucky and get one with none at all. It's a damn tough call.

Anyone else have any insight on this?

I have so many half-dead black pixels on my 55XS that I lost count at around 15...or when I couldn't keep track of the ones I already counted. I can only see them on a static image with bright colors. I can only see them up close at around a foot away from the screen. I can't see these pixels any further, and they are nearly impossible to detect in moving images. Thank goodness I don't have any *stuck* pixels of a fixed, bright color - I believe those are much more conspicuous. But, the rule of thumb is that if you can't see it from typical viewing distances...why care?

Originally posted by HD_OCD
Also, read all of this thread...
UMR GWIII Tweaks (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?threadid=331875&highlight=gwiii)

And then this one...
GWIV Tweaks Thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=465144&highlight=GWIV)

But. . . I thought that the UMR tweaks in service mode could not be used on the IV. Someone said the service menu is not the same. I just don't want to screw anything up. Any thoughts?

Thanks!

B

I don't believe this!!

I purchased the 55WF for many reasons including the CableCard. Had Comcast hook it up and it works great with no depreciable effect to SD (unlike cable boxes) and no extra remote. HOWEVER, there is no way to hook up a VCR or DVR !! What were the designers thinking??? The only solution would be to either a) split the incoming signal and be satisified with only non-digital for the VCR/DVR or pay for a cable box or cable box / DVR which Comcast would love to rent me. Am I all wet???

Comcast also told me that despite the optical cable out on the television, the cable card does not provide 5.1 sound for the HD channels that support it... is this also true? that right there may be the difference between the cable card and the box for me

I have been looking at the KDF-50WE655 & the KDF-55WF655 and I'm wondering why some refer to the 50WE as an "Entry level TV". What makes the 50 "entry level" and the 55 not?

I have seen them side by side and the picture quality looks the same. So what am I missing?

Originally posted by briley1
But. . . I thought that the UMR tweaks in service mode could not be used on the IV. Someone said the service menu is not the same. I just don't want to screw anything up. Any thoughts?
Thanks!
B
If you hit the 'jump' button twice after entering the service menu you will access the same menu structure that UMR documented.

I personally have not found UMR's grayscale numbers to be satisfactory on my GWIV set and I am waiting until I can get the cal equipment before I mess with these parameters. The only thing I did in my Service Menu was set AXIS to 0 as explained in this thread and in the two threads I linked, and I run color temp = warm. Other GWIV owners have found similar numbers to UMRs to work (especially the fiilter/enhancment tweaks). If you read the GWIV tweaks thread all the way through, I think you will find all your answers.

I suggested reading the other thread so you could get an idea about how the service menu works and how the TV saves different values for various inputs and formats, the UMR GWIII thread is full of info that applies to GWIV as equally as GWIII.

Jeff

Originally posted by tke522
Comcast also told me that despite the optical cable out on the television, the cable card does not provide 5.1 sound for the HD channels that support it... is this also true? that right there may be the difference between the cable card and the box for me
I have a WE42655. According to the manual, the optical output is only active when a digital channel is being received. And, according to the manual the output carries PCM or Dolby Digital. What this tells me is that the output *should* pass Dolby Digital from HD channels being received via cable card, and that it should pass regular PCM from non-HD qam channels. What it won't do is convert analog audio to PCM from regular analog cable channels. (Note: I personally do not use the optical output from the TV, so I have not confirmed what the manual says.)

Jeff

Originally posted by rob_silva

However, spending 3K on a TV and having dead pixels right out of the box is a tough thing to swallow.


I agree, it is a tough pill to swallow. But if two or three bad pixels that you can't see from your normal view distance is the worst problem you have with your TV, then my advice would be to keep it. Yes, given the current state of technology and the ridiculous prices we pay for these things, we should expect no less than perfection. And you might get really lucky and get a replacement that has absolutely zero defects (which is the way it should be), but there is an equally likely chance you will get something as bad or worse.

Now I would have balked at my own advice two months ago before I purchased my 60XS. But after returning my first one for having a noisy fan (but not a single pixel/geometry/PQ problem), getting a second one which had PQ problem with faint vertical lines visible on all inputs, (but no pixel or fan problems) and finally getting a third which has three blue pixels and a slight discoloration or smudge about the size of a thumb print near the bottom of the screen (which is only visible when the screen is all black), I have decided I will stop here and start enjoying the TV. If I had it to do over again I would have just kept the first one and got it serviced, rather than deal with all the hassle and stress of two returns. If I ever have any serious problems with this one, then I will have the smudge problem investigate at that time.

For me, a few bad pixels is like pissing yourself in a dark suit...no one will notice except you (unless of course some stands too close to you ) :)

Originally posted by barnabas
. But after returning my first one for having a noisy fan (but not a single pixel/geometry/PQ problem),

Barnabas...

I think I have one of the first sets you mentioned. Could you describe the "noisy" fan... mine is not really bad in my opinion and but would love to have a quieter one if possible.... I would describe mine as a low "whir" that can be heard only during silent parts of movies. Not nearly as loud as an Xbox, but louder than a DirecTivo.

Personally I have not spent ANY time looking for dead pixels that can't be seen in normal viewing (I have none) nor have I killed all the sound in the room to see if I could hear the fan. Sure as heck if I did I would focus on these things from that time forward to the point I could "hear" the fan all the time and "see" dead pixels in every viewing. In other words if I can't see it or hear it in normal conditions why would I want to know about it? Or for that matter why would I even worry about it?

Originally posted by NoPlasmaYet
I have been looking at the KDF-50WE655 & the KDF-55WF655 and I'm wondering why some refer to the 50WE as an "Entry level TV". What makes the 50 "entry level" and the 55 not?

I have seen them side by side and the picture quality looks the same. So what am I missing?

Marketing mostly.

All of the GWIV models have very similar electronics and Wega Engine. PQ is very close across the line. The 42WE655 and 50WE655 are identical except for size and are Sony's least expensive LCD RP sets. That makes them 'entry level'.

The 55WF655 and 60WF655 are close enough that they share the same Owner's Manual with the WE655 sets. The WFs have a few more features. Adjustable lamp brightness is perhaps the most important one. They are bigger and cost more. The bigger sets use a brighter more expensive lamp. Not quite 'entry level'.

The XS models add a few more features and a styling change to the WF sets. They are also a few hundred dollars more.


50WE or 55WF? Pick the size that best fits your viewing room.

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
Nope, I have the Wide Mode and the 4:3 Default set to Normal. My wife and daughter watched a Full Screen (4:3) movie last night and it was displayed in 4:3 with side bars.


The movie in question, Dirty Dancing: Collector's Edition, is not anamorphic. I was expecting the black bars on all sides except that the 55XS955 automatically switches to Zoom Mode for this movie.

If I manually set the Wide Mode to Normal while the movie is playing, I get the black bars on all sides, but within a short period of time the 55XS955 switches the Wide Mode back to Zoom.

BTW, for a widescreen movie on the 55XS955, the Wide Mode that applies is Full (as noted before, Normal is not appropriate with a widescreen movie). I'll need to check later today to see what the 55XS955 sets the Wide Mode to for a 1.85:1 or 2.35:1 movie, though I suspect it will be Full and not Zoom given our defaults.

Michael

Just to add to the confusion, my JVC DVD player has two wide modes called "16:9 auto" and 16:9 normal". The documentation really doesn't explain the difference. I usually use 16:9 auto, but I've found DVDs where the other setting works better on a KDF-60WF655. With "South Pacific", 16:9 auto sends the picture as 4:3 letterboxed and the TV automatically switches to Zoom mode to fill the screen. Switching to 16:9 normal on the DVD player sends the picture as a 16:9 so the Zoom isn't needed, and the picture is slightly better. With "Cabaret" 16:9 auto sends a picture with black bars on all 4 sides and none of the TV picture settings fix it - the picture can be stretched vertically, but not horizontally. Changing the DVD player to 16:9 normal allows the picture to be expanded correctly using the various zoom modes. When DVD transfers are made of old movies, there is apparently a lot of variability in how they are created.

Originally posted by DaverJ
Barnabas...

I think I have one of the first sets you mentioned. Could you describe the "noisy" fan... mine is not really bad in my opinion and but would love to have a quieter one if possible.... I would describe mine as a low "whir" that can be heard only during silent parts of movies. Not nearly as loud as an Xbox, but louder than a DirecTivo.

It was a 'whirring'. Probably what I would expect to hear if I were sitting next to a slide projector, except that it could be heard anywhere in my 18x13 living room. Obviously you wouldn't hear it during a surround sound action movie, but watching something that's primarily talk like Leno at volume between 10-15 it was kind of annoying. The second one even had distinctive voice, although not as drastic. More of a higher pitch sound, slightly audible in a totally quiet room, but not noticeable otherwise. Definitely acceptable in my opinion. The third is completely silent. Can't hear it at all even with volume off until I'm right next to it. My impression is they all have some kind sound to them, some more than others. I guess it all depends on one's tolerance for white noise.

After my experiences I wouldn't recommend exchanging, especially if your PQ and all else is good. You might regret it. Get it serviced if it really bugs you and you have in-home service in your area.

Originally posted by Mtnmike
.... Sure as heck if I did I would focus on these things from that time forward to the point I could "hear" the fan all the time and "see" dead pixels in every viewing. In other words if I can't see it or hear it in normal conditions why would I want to know about it? Or for that matter why would I even worry about it?

Why? Its a feature. In my home it drowns out the Fridge noise and dishwasher when the wife launches that puppy, too.

(Nah, its really not that noisy, nor an issue with me).

Andrew535,

Thanks for the reply. I did download the manual and, except for the bulb, the WE & WF seem the same. The different cabinets don't bother me. I find that's something I only notice when it's new.

The room the TV will go in is approximately 15' x 11'. My sitting position is between 11' to 12' (depends on how far back I recline). I am concerned about the vertical viewing angle. I want to be able to see a good picture when I’m sitting done or when standing. The 50WE manual states a viewing angle of +/- 30 degrees (off center) & the 55WF has +/- 27.5.
So the 50WE may work a bit better….

I have tried to see how a set looks from different angles in the store, but the results are inconclusive (plus I tend to get funny looks when I’m bobbing and weaving around the display model).

Anyway, maybe I’ll just flip a coin. At least it gives me one thing to be concerned about along with dead pixels, green pixels, blue streaks, green blotches, and (of course) LCD aging………………..

Originally posted by NoPlasmaYet
I am concerned about the vertical viewing angle. I want to be able to see a good picture when I’m sitting done or when standing.


Vertical viewing *is* something to take note of, especially standing close to the set. The other day I was showing the 60xs to some friends and the husband was saying "Honey, sit down and see how good this set looks". The wife replied "I can see how good it looks standing..." husband "No, sit down and look." Wife sits down and says "oh... I see what you mean... wow!"

The point is, it does look good looking from a down angle, but the details and colors really pop when you are directly in front. Side to side is less of a problem.

On an unrelated note, we flipped over to the HD showing of West Wing, one of my wife's favorite shows. We were used to a well-filmed television show, but in High Definition widescreen it's a freaking feature film! We weren't watching "TV" anymore, we were at the movies! :cool:

OK, I'm getting ready to go buy the 60WF655 in a little while. The only concern I have is a few comments lately about macroblocking on high stress shows like CSI where they do a lot of flash and quick changes form light to dark and back again. Does everyone that has the GWIV's have this problem? If so, has anyone called in a trouble on it?

I think what they are seeing is bandwidth problems with the source. I have a 60XS and haven't watched a lot of HD programs, but I did see Motley Crue on Leno with the flashing lights and noticed occasional pixelation, but to me it looked like MPEG compression as opposed to the TV not being able to display the resolution.

Motion and flashing certainly doesn't show up in heavy action parts of DVDs that I've watched or Xbox games I've played. If it was was problem of the set, it would show it no matter the source, right?

Some say if you watch fast action & get macro blocking , it helps to switch to 720 P. MPEG has this problem & also butterfly's around words & detail.

Well, I went ahead and bought it. Gets delivered next week.

Where did you order it from? onecall looks best. jo

I ended up getting it from a local B&M. They came within $50 of the onecall price and had a much better price on the extended warranty.

I cant find a b&m in the los angeles area with one instock.

This place had 14 in their warehouse.

OK,

I'm getting close to buying a KDF-50WE655 (this one won the coin toss vs the KDF-55WF655), but I'm still concerned about having to stay in that "sweet spot" to get the full brightness & color. I did the math and based on what Sony says (+/- 30 degrees off center) I should have a vertical window of 6 feet (+/- 3 feet from screen center,at a sitting distance of 11 feet). Can anyone confirm this? I don't want the image to change when I recline in my chair.........................

Also, is dust a problem. I have hot air heat and it's very dusty............

Originally posted by NoPlasmaYet
OK,

I'm getting close to buying a KDF-50WE655 (this one won the coin toss vs the KDF-55WF655), but I'm still concerned about having to stay in that "sweet spot" to get the full brightness & color. I did the math and based on what Sony says (+/- 30 degrees off center) I should have a vertical window of 6 feet (+/- 3 feet from screen center,at a sitting distance of 11 feet). Can anyone confirm this? I don't want the image to change when I recline in my chair.........................

Also, is dust a problem. I have hot air heat and it's very dusty............

Get the 55. At 11 feet, you won't regret it, and if you negotiiate correctly, the $ difference is negligible, if any.

Originally posted by Mtnmike
Personally I have not spent ANY time looking for dead pixels that can't be seen in normal viewing (I have none) nor have I killed all the sound in the room to see if I could hear the fan. Sure as heck if I did I would focus on these things from that time forward to the point I could "hear" the fan all the time and "see" dead pixels in every viewing. In other words if I can't see it or hear it in normal conditions why would I want to know about it? Or for that matter why would I even worry about it?

I agree 100%. Ignorance is bliss - I don't want to find one minor imperfection that I normally wouldn't see except on close inspection, and then find myself constantly looking for it when I'm watching the TV.

I feel bad for barnabas - my TV after about 3 weeks doesn't seem to have any of the problems you have described.

For people talking about fan noise, I have never heard it when the TV was on. In fact, I think my Xbox and Comcast cable/DVR actually are louder. I do hear the fan crank up for a few min when I turn my box off, but that is it (and it's still pretty faint).

Originally posted by NoPlasmaYet
OK,

I'm getting close to buying a KDF-50WE655 (this one won the coin toss vs the KDF-55WF655), but I'm still concerned about having to stay in that "sweet spot" to get the full brightness & color. I did the math and based on what Sony says (+/- 30 degrees off center) I should have a vertical window of 6 feet (+/- 3 feet from screen center,at a sitting distance of 11 feet). Can anyone confirm this? I don't want the image to change when I recline in my chair.........................

Also, is dust a problem. I have hot air heat and it's very dusty............

My trig is a little rusty.
KDF 50WE655:

11ft * tan(30) = 6.3 ft up or down!

KDF 55WF655
11ft * tan(27.5) = 5.7 ft up or down!



We have the 50 on a stand that puts the center right at eyelevel when we are on our couch. We sit about 7 1/2 feet back. Picture still looks good standing up from behind the couch at about 10 feet back. You should be fine.

I'd also like to note that the PQ is better when viewed at a lower angle as compared to viewing the TV at the same angle above the sweet spot.

Of course the sweet spot is the best spot, but I'm just saying that personally if you had to go either a little too high or too low, go with the too low viewing. The PQ doesn't get some dim as opposed to viewing the from too high a height. That means you're totally fine reclining. I like to lay down on my couch and watch TV when I'm feeling lazy. It turns a tad dimmer but it's really a non-issue. Hell, it actually makes the blacks look more black, heh.

Originally posted by dmbatch
...The only concern I have is a few comments lately about macroblocking on high stress shows like CSI where they do a lot of flash and quick changes form light to dark and back again. Does everyone that has the GWIV's have this problem?...

If anyone is seeing this on an XS (or other Sony) it is not a problem with the set, but with the signal path leading to the set. It's true that any macroblocking you see happens in the set itself (and manifests on the screen) but the CAUSE is the source, and not the display. This is not true of every display, as some manufacturers' sets handle bitstarving and other problems better than others, and some just plain add artifacts of their own. But the Sony is innocent of this, not contributing to or aggravating such problems.

Can anyone tell me how the speakers sound on the WF655? Where are they mounted? Which direction do they face? I'm looking to buy a Sony rear projection set this week and won't be using an external audio system.

Originally posted by Vance Albert
Can anyone tell me how the speakers sound on the WF655? Where are they mounted? Which direction do they face?
For the sound, your best bet would be to go and listen to one. The speakers are on each side of the screen behind the charcoal gray panels, facing directly forward.

Michael

Vance the sound on the WF655 is OK as TV speakers go. The XS actually has a better speaker system, but you will never have solid quality 5.1 reproduction unless you use a AV receiver and run an optical digital line to the receiver and out to a surround sound speaker setup.

I just wanted to let anyone know who was thinking of buying a WE model that the picture is fantastic. I finally got to watch a full movie last night (LOTR:FOTR) and it was simply amazing. I could even pick up small details like who was wearing too much makeup in a scene. It simply made the whole DVD watching experience 100x better. That and I got a new SVS sub. :) It was definitely worth ever penny.

jmdaniel, Squawks, and Andrew535

Thanks for you replies. Funny, but most stores don't have much room in front of the sets. Trying to view a 50" TV (that's on a 2' high stand) from 3' away just doesn't look good........

jmdanie(quote)
"Get the 55. At 11 feet, you won't regret it, and if you negotiate correctly, the $ difference is negligible, if any."

I have found the sets to have a $370 difference in price. So, I'm still not sure that the 55 is worth that much more (to me).

Is buying a big screen TV supposed to be this much work???

I am trading in a Mitsubishi DLP 62725 for the Sony 60XS955, I suffered from eye strain and the occasional head ache from the rainbows.

My new set comes in a week or two and I'll share my experiences and any differences noted between these two highly regarded sets in case anyone is interested.

RH in Corrales

Originally posted by NoPlasmaYet
jmdaniel, Squawks, and Andrew535

Thanks for you replies. Funny, but most stores don't have much room in front of the sets. Trying to view a 50" TV (that's on a 2' high stand) from 3' away just doesn't look good.......Is buying a big screen TV supposed to be this much work???

I'm sure the stores would love it if it were easy, but for the common person it is extremely difficult to comparison shop, because there are so many issues surrounding HD, the various formats of set, and all of the devices used to generate or receive programming. Not only that, but HD is a very complex subject and is not well understood by the lay person. Also, there are few resources for such information exactly because it is a complex issue that is difficult to understand without really studying it. Store managers and employees are sometimes much more in the dark than their customers are.

If you made it to this forum, rest assured that you have probably found one of the key wealths of information that will guide you on your path. The even better news is that while one needs to do the groundwork, the reward for doing so is a true payoff in the satisfaction of finally getting what you set out for.

I think we are at the stage where we are once again considering a new DVD player for our 55XS955. All has been good since we received the replacement to our 1st 55XS955 that was experiencing the video dropouts. Many here thought that our two 5 year-old DVD players (Onkyo Integra DPS-5, Sony DVP-S530D) were at fault, but it has been over 3 weeks with the 2nd 55XS955 and we are not having the video dropouts.

My question is this: will we truly see any video improvement over our older, non-progressive scan DVD players? With the 1st 55XS955, we purchased the Sony NS975V to see if our older players were at fault with the video dropouts. Not only did the 1st 55XS955 have the video dropouts with the 975, it also looked worse than with the other two players, regardless of whether the 975 was at 480i or 480p. To add insult to injury, the 975 had a lip sync problem at both resolutions.

I realize problems like the chroma bug and such may be corrected with a new player, but will the overall video presentation be a lot better with a new DVD player or just a little better? One of AVS's Sony experts, umr, recommends a progressive scan DVD player connected via component video for the Sony LCD RPTVs, like the Denon 2900, rather than being connected via HDMI, like the Denon 2910.

We have a pretty good DVD picture now with the DPS-5, but I think it is a little soft and does exhibit a few video artifacts. This might be a DVD player problem or it might be something that I can correct in the Service Menu. I really don't want to spend $1000+ on a DVD player, knowing that HD DVD will be out in the next year or two. Both the 2900 and the 2910 can be purchased for $550-600, which seems like a reasonable, interim solution. It will be worth the money if either will improve our DVD playback noticeably, not marginally.

I'm open to all suggestions. :)

Michael

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
I really don't want to spend $1000+ on a DVD player, knowing that HD DVD will be out in the next year or two. Both the 2900 and the 2910 can be purchased for $550-600, which seems like a reasonable, interim solution. It will be worth the money if either will improve our DVD playback noticeably, not marginally.

I'm open to all suggestions. :)

Michael Wow Michael. If spending $600 on a two-year solution for a DVD player is a reasonable solution, more power to you. I'm suprised to see you write this. I would say upgrade to a nice upscaling DVD player, if not the Sony then the Panny S97, and sit out and wait to see what happens with HD-DVD or Blu-Ray. I'm shocked that any knowledgable consumer (and you are certainly that) is dropping serious money on a DVD player with this new format around the corner.

NoPlasmaYet,

I sent you a PM.

Originally posted by Buck's SCSW
Wow Michael. If spending $600 on a two-year solution for a DVD player is a reasonable solution, more power to you. I'm suprised to see you write this. I would say upgrade to a nice upscaling DVD player, if not the Sony then the Panny S97, and sit out and wait to see what happens with HD-DVD or Blu-Ray. I'm shocked that any knowledgable consumer (and you are certainly that) is dropping serious money on a DVD player with this new format around the corner.
Well, I was considering that in two years we would move any DVD player we purchase now to our bedroom TV (36" tube) to replace what will then be a 7+ year-old DVD player getting long in the tooth. Our DPS-5 is becoming increasingly fickle about reading DVDs, and at the rate it is going we may need a new DVD player very soon anyway.

I can understand the appeal of the upscaling DVD players, but after reading umr's assessment on how the Sony Wegas look great with a player like the Denon 2900 via component @480p, I wonder if an upscaling player is really a benefit. No matter what gets sent to the 55XS955, it is going to rescale it to its native resolution (768 or 788).

We just found the Sony 975 to be a disappointment, and I believe that the Panasonic S97 will not be much better. After the experience with the 975, I am skeptical that any sub $1000 DVD player is going to be noticeably better than our current DVD players (as in "WOW"!).

Michael

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
Well, I was considering that in two years we would move any DVD player we purchase now to our bedroom TV (36" tube) to replace what will then be a 7+ year-old DVD player getting long in the tooth. Our DPS-5 is becoming increasingly fickle about reading DVDs, and at the rate it is going we may need a new DVD player very soon anyway.

I can understand the appeal of the upscaling DVD players, but after reading umr's assessment on how the Sony Wegas look great with a player like the Denon 2900 via component @480p, I wonder if an upscaling player is really a benefit. No matter what gets sent to the 55XS955, it is going to rescale it to its native resolution (768 or 788).

We just found the Sony 975 to be a disappointment, and I believe that the Panasonic S97 will not be much better. After the experience with the 975, I am skeptical that any sub $1000 DVD player is going to be noticeably better than our current DVD players (as in "WOW"!).

Michael Good points all. But if you have the money to burn it's not an issue anyway. And if you can justify sending the player to the bedroom all the better.

The question becomes: do you really need a $600 player for your bedroom? Maybe you do, but off the cuff I would say you probably don't. Why not save some dough to invest in better gear later? It's none of my business frankly, but spending the money is not the logical choice.

Originally posted by Buck's SCSW
Good points all. But if you have the money to burn it's not an issue anyway. And if you can justify sending the player to the bedroom all the better.
It's not a matter of having money to burn, although we have been sitting on our "video" budget for 3 years now. I could ask the same of people who spent $700+ on a TV stand. If it is what you want and you can afford it, why not? I just think we owe our 55XS955 a better DVD player, and I don't think that the Sony 975 or the Panasonic s97 is that player.

Originally posted by Buck's SCSW
The question becomes: do you really need a $600 player for your bedroom? Maybe you do, but off the cuff I would say you probably don't. Why not save some dough to invest in better gear later? It's none of my business frankly, but spending the money is not the logical choice.
The $600+ DVD player is for NOW. If a $300 DVD player would give us our "wow" factor, then I would spend $300 on a new DVD player. I appreciate the concern for our financial situation, but the question still remains: how much better can we do than our current DVD players? Our first-hand experience with the Sony 975 didn't convince us that a $300 DVD player was going to be satisfactory.

Michael

Just take the Sony and be happy! :D

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
My question is this: will we truly see any video improvement over our older, non-progressive scan DVD players? With the 1st 55XS955, we purchased the Sony NS975V to see if our older players were at fault with the video dropouts. Not only did the 1st 55XS955 have the video dropouts with the 975, it also looked worse than with the other two players, regardless of whether the 975 was at 480i or 480p. To add insult to injury, the 975 had a lip sync problem at both resolutions.

Michael

I can't answer your question about upscaling, but I can tell you from personal experience that there is a huge difference between different dvd players, even outputting at the same (480p) scan rate. I went through about 5 ( I bought on ebay, and sold back on ebay when I wanted to try something new). My current player, a philips 963SA, looks very clear and sharp at 480p with a well transferred dvd, almost HD quality. I would say it looks as good as the movies they show on UHD or HDNetMovies in 1080i (I have a 42WE655 television). Historically, there have been issues with the philips line of dvd players, and my intent is not to try to sell you on philips. Rather, I believe that a well designed dvd player can make a huge difference. I don't believe it's just the faroudja deinterlacing, but the actual mpeg decoder that makes a difference. I used to have an old panasonic 480i dvd player and it looked very sharp as well (unfortunately, the early pany's had a reputation for a poor transport, and mine died young). The "Secrets of Home Theater" dvd benchmark website is very helpful for deciding on a dvd player; often times the price doesn't correlate with the performance.

In summary, yes you will probably see a big difference in video quality with different dvd players.

regards,

pb.

I finally have time to tweak my KDF-50WE655 (today) and cannot find the GWIV Tweaks thread. Help!

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=465144&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

Hi. I own a 55WF655 and wondered if any other owners have connected theirs to a PC. I've got an ATI card with DVI out and connected it via DVI/HDMI cable. I can see the desktop on the tv, but the picture extends off the edges of the screen. The best resolution I can get to work is 1280x720. Has anyone else had any success using a pc with this set? If so I would be interested in what resolution you're using and what tools you may have used (i.e. powerstrip). I've read through the HTPC forum, but haven't found many posts specific to Sony sets.

Originally posted by Buck's SCSW
I would say upgrade to a nice upscaling DVD player, if not the Sony then the Panny S97, and sit out and wait to see what happens with HD-DVD or Blu-Ray. I'm shocked that any knowledgable consumer (and you are certainly that) is dropping serious money on a DVD player with this new format around the corner.

That depends on how affordable HD-DVD and BR will be when they hit the market. Just curious, do we know what kind of price tag these things will carry? So let's say you wait for a year or two for them to hit the stores, then another year or two to drop below $500, and another year or two for content to become widely available. By then the next great thing will be 'just around the corner' and the waiting game begins again.

I had a $80 Toshiba with component. Looked fine. Convinced myself it could look better, so got a Denon 2910. Looked like crap through component. Looked about even with the Toshiba through HDMI. Kept it anyway since I got a deal on it and needed a second DVD, plus I liked some of the user controls on the 2910.

Point to Michael is you might be seeking the Holy Grail, and it might not exist. I've had my GWIV since October and personally I have obsessed about everything from minor defects to technological limitations to stand height to DVD players. I have noticed deficencies that I would have never even payed attention to had I not read about them on this forum. I have finally convinced myself to start enjoying and stop seeking video nirvana and have been happy ever since. Find a store with a liberal return policy, find a DVD player that looks good to YOUR eyes, and like one of the previous posts says don't assume higher price = better.

Originally posted by Buck's SCSW
I'm shocked that any knowledgable consumer (and you are certainly that) is dropping serious money on a DVD player with this new format around the corner.

That new format is probably NOT 'around the corner'. What you are looking at is format wars for who knows how many years which will delay and slow down consumer acceptance and catalog growth. Look what heppened with SACD and DVD-Audio. Look how many years it took for DVD to replace VHS - and the difference in quality between those two is obvious on EVERY TV. With HD-DVD the difference is going to require a good HDTV plus pristine transfers of modern source material to be obvious.

They've already annouced what movies are going to be available when the players are introduced. You know what - the list is short (less than 100 titles). That is not going to cut it. Plus I think with these new players they are going to emphasize the playback quality of the new formats - and not the playback quality of the DVDs you already own. So when you go out and buy one of these new players that 100's of DVDs you already own aren't going to look that great on the new player.

Buying a good quality DVD player now is a sound investment.

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann:

My question is this: will we truly see any video improvement over our older, non-progressive scan DVD players? With the 1st 55XS955, we purchased the Sony NS975V to see if our older players were at fault with the video dropouts. Not only did the 1st 55XS955 have the video dropouts with the 975, it also looked worse than with the other two players, regardless of whether the 975 was at 480i or 480p. To add insult to injury, the 975 had a lip sync problem at both resolutions.

Michael

I have had the Sony 975V connected via HDMI to a 55WF655 for over a month and have played numerous DVD's. I have had absolutely no complaints about this player whatsoever. The PQ is stunning. The DD & DTS sound via optical is awesome. This really shines to near HD playback quality with Superbit™ DVDs.

Maybe I have been lucky with this player, but I have seen many similar statements about the 975V over HDMI to either the XS or WF. Just how much more quality in PQ and sound (if any) are you getting for that additional $300 to $350 with the Denon?

Originally posted by barnabas
I had a $80 Toshiba with component. Looked fine. Convinced myself it could look better, so got a Denon 2910. Looked like crap through component. Looked about even with the Toshiba through HDMI. Kept it anyway since I got a deal on it and needed a second DVD, plus I liked some of the user controls on the 2910.

Point to Michael is you might be seeking the Holy Grail, and it might not exist.
This is what I was wondering. Maybe the scalar in the TV evens out the playing field? I don't know. Of course, you read the Secrets DVD benchmark tests and you see how the older Panasonic DVD players of a couple of years ago (RP-82, XP-30) perform better than their current players.

Michael

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
This is what I was wondering. Maybe the scalar in the TV evens out the playing field? I don't know. Of course, you read the Secrets DVD benchmark tests and you see how the older Panasonic DVD players of a couple of years ago (RP-82, XP-30) perform better than their current players.

Michael
Personally, I think the problem is the new Genesis FLI2310 deinterlacer (follow on company to Faroudja). Seems like all the dvd players that use this chip have "mosquito noise" and macroblocking artifafacts. The older faroudja chips (FLI 2200, for one) didn't seem to have these artifacts. If you could find a good condition denon 1600 or 910 on ebay, I think you'd be pretty happy (these both use the FLI2200 deinterlacer).

Originally posted by Mtnmike
I have had the Sony 975V connected via HDMI to a 55WF655 for over a month and have played numerous DVD's. I have had absolutely no complaints about this player whatsoever. The PQ is stunning. The DD & DTS sound via optical is awesome. This really shines to near HD playback quality with Superbit� DVDs.

Maybe I have been lucky with this player, but I have seen many similar statements about the 975V over HDMI to either the XS or WF. Just how much more quality in PQ and sound (if any) are you getting for that additional $300 to $350 with the Denon?

Me too. I have said this a couple of times on this (and other forums) but I have the 975, use the HDMI connection (coaxial digital audio out to my AV Receiver) and it is great, absolutely no problems on a variety of material. I have a 60XS and so far think that the approximately $275 I spent on the DVD player was a real bargain, I would do it again. The recent review in S&V seems to bear this out (at least the part you could read)

Lovin my new 55wf655.

Question...I have D* and a single LNB dish. Do you think SD will improve with the triple LNB?

Thanks

Appreciate any feedback to my warranty questions on the 60xs per the following thread (sears) ...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=496789

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
My question is this: will we truly see any video improvement over our older, non-progressive scan DVD players?

I'm open to all suggestions. :)

Michael
Depends what you are upgrading from. We saw a substantial improvement, more than I expected, upgrading our 5 year old DVP-S360 to the mid-line NS775.

If you didn't like the NS975 you won't care for the $100 775 either. They share many of the same parts.

With the HD DVD players due out so soon I was hesitant to get anything. Figured I give the 775 a shot and if it wasn't much better we'd take it back and wait a year.

The 775 is good enough that we will wait for the HD DVD market to develop before getting another player. A few recycled iMax titles isn't going to cut it. Decent sell-through, maybe $3.99 new release rentals would do it for sure.

Originally posted by Andrew535
Depends what you are upgrading from. We saw a substantial improvement, more than I expected, upgrading our 5 year old DVP-S360 to the mid-line NS775.

If you didn't like the NS975 you won't care for the $100 775 either. They share many of the same parts.
I am not sure what to think. The NS975V looked no better (my wife says it was worse) than our 5 year-old Onkyo Integra DPS-5 (and 5 year-old Sony DVP-S530D), plus the NS975V had a lip sync problem (direct video connection to TV). Neither of our DVD players are progressive scan.

Yet, many other XS955/WF655 owners have experienced an obvious improvement with the NS975V over their older DVD players. Either we had a defective NS975V, the other owners had crappy DVD players, or our DVD players are better than most sub $500 DVD players today.

Michael

Originally posted by Andrew535
$3.99 new release rentals would do it for sure.

Heheh, hopefully those stores won't charge more for HD-DVD rentals. I don't think they would, seeing that VHS and DVD rent prices are the same (I think). Unless they release HD-DVD ROMs/cartridges then I can see their reasoning in charging more, as they are more bulkier, perhaps.

The HD-DVDs I am sure will be more expensive than regular DVD but still, I'd buy a HD-DVD for $35 any day over a regular DVD that costs $22. I don't like the idea of feeding my HDTV low quality stuff. It's almost like buying high quality audio equipment but never playing DVD-audio or SACDs.

Originally posted by jmdaniel
Get the 55. At 11 feet, you won't regret it, and if you negotiiate correctly, the $ difference is negligible, if any.

OK, this has me thinking (probably not a good thing). Overall cabinet size between the 50WE & the 55WF is real close, so I can fit either one.
I looked further at pricing and found a good price on the 55 (less of a difference from the 50 than I have seen). SO things should be pointing towards the 55, a no-brainer, perhaps....

Well I started reading about "ideal distances from the screen and 11.5' shows up for the 55" set. OK, my viewing distance (when I'm sitting) is between 11' & 12'. Everything (still looks good), but wait. It seems that this is for HD feeds and many articles recommend sitting further back for SD broadcasts.

Since much of what I watch is recorded (from cable onto my DVD recorder's hard drive) and DVD's am I better with the 50" set????

NoPlasmaYet
FWIW, here's my $.02.
After looking, comparing, and agonizing, I got a KDF-50WE655 a few weeks ago. Most of my viewing is SD, not that I necessarily want it that way, but that's a function of program availability. Like you, my regular viewing position is about 11' away. The HD, when available, is fantastic on this unit. Even better after I got it home. As far as SD, you can view the SD stuff in Normal size (yuck, hey you spent big $), Wide (ok if you like a big screen full of short fat people), Zoom (big screen but with heads cut off), or Wide Zoom (just combine Wide and Zoom). I find that the Zoom mode works out best for SD. To me, not as objectionable. However, that means that the picture is enlarged. The bigger the picture, the more the imperfections show. The 50 is not too bad at 11-12 feet distance. I found that the 55 at that distance did not come off as well. I kept going back to the 50. Besides, will everyone that will be viewing the set be sitting at the same or greater distance.
One man's opinion.

Please, no Toshiba recommendations. No offense, but two different models went south on me way before they should have.

My cheap $79 JVC XVN412 even connected component and set to progressive scan just isn't cutting it with the 60WF655. The colors are fine, but it's not sharp and definately no WOW factor. In fact, I was getting a better picture through S-video on my 35" RCA.

I need a middle-of-the road recommendation under $175. I don't need HDMI or DVI and am leary from the reviews of the Zenith. Seems to me a decent progressive scanning DVD Player should do the trick.

Thanks.

Originally posted by mrpackerguy

I need a middle-of-the road recommendation under $175.


DVP-NS775

Originally posted by Michael Mohrmann
I am not sure what to think. The NS975V looked no better (my wife says it was worse) than our 5 year-old Onkyo Integra DPS-5 (and 5 year-old Sony DVP-S530D), plus the NS975V had a lip sync problem (direct video connection to TV). Neither of our DVD players are progressive scan.

Yet, many other XS955/WF655 owners have experienced an obvious improvement with the NS975V over their older DVD players. Either we had a defective NS975V, the other owners had crappy DVD players, or our DVD players are better than most sub $500 DVD players today.

Michael

I tried the 975V with my 50WE655 and noticed very little improvement over my 5 year old Sony DVD Player via HDMI.

Originally posted by Squawks
The HD-DVDs I am sure will be more expensive than regular DVD

They don't need to be. The manufacturing cost is a tiny fraction of the retail price. It is more of a marketing decision, much like the sell-through decision that gave us the $19 DVD.

Setting DVD title prices low was a big sucess. Wouldn't suprise me to see it repeated.

Getting the large rental chains to carry HD-DVDs is less likely.

Originally posted by blackngold19
I tried the 975V with my 50WE655 and noticed very little improvement over my 5 year old Sony DVD Player via HDMI.

I wouldn't expect much difference between component and HDMI. All the GWIV sets convert the HDMI signal back to analog component and route it through the same analog switch used for the component inputs.

Differences would be due to the DA conveters or maybe differences in settings between the 2 inputs.

Andrew:

I wouldn't expect much difference between component and HDMI. All the GWIV sets convert the HDMI signal back to analog component and route it through the same analog switch used for the component inputs.

So I don't need a switch for my HD receiver and DVD player?