As has been discussed a number of times (ad nauseam) in this thread, only the aired broadcasts and our personal conjectures are considered discussion fodder for this thread. You are welcome to use the spoilers thread, or create your own thread if you want something in-between. But for this thread, and with loads of history behind it, we stick with what is broadcast.

So yes, the podcast is a spoiler. Since the game isn't directly related to the show (i.e. you won't miss anything important if you don't play the game), it's probably more off-topic than a spoiler. But it's still better in it's own thread.

Xesdeeni

I thought CPanther said the game/web site was allowed - at least thats what I took post #15882 to mean. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

That was the initial thinking since they ran the info during the show. Now there's a separate thread for the Hanso website and games since there were complaints that it cluttered this thread up.

Most of the website discussion centered more around passwords, activities, etc. than any real info about the show. Just to keep it clean, we should keep the Hanso stuff separate, at least until the end of the season. After that, I'd still say that info derived from the website over the summer should be fair game since it was part of the regular broadcast. If there is overwhelming disagreement, then we can continue to keep them separate.

So to be clear, you're saying:

1. Any interesting "extra info" we gather from the officially "blessed" web game can be discussed here, as long as it's interesting and not just passwords and other low level details.

2. But any interesting "extra info" we gather from the officially "blessed" podcast is still off limits.

This doesn't really make a lot of sense to me. If you ever listen to the podcasts you will see that they take great care to not give away any real spoilers. Most of the info relates to debunking various wild fan theories and otherwise answering fan questions. I would think that this official debunking and other information would be of interest here in order to cut down on potentially dead end theories.

"Officially blessed" has never been relevant.

So, what do you think the chances are that the scene in the preview of the person plunging off the cliff will not even be in tonight's ep? 50/50? Were they using the old "scenes from the remaining ep of the season" ploy on us again? And who is it? Clearly their intention was to make the viewers think it was Eko given the immediately prior cuts. But I really doubt they'd do him in now and it didn't look much like him falling to me anyway (the few times I've seen it now at regular speed). Seems like their usual red herring, misdirection tactic to me.

And speaking of the immediately prior cuts, (Eko and Locke? pushing the plane), I'd assumed that was the drug runner plane but was it not already at the bottom of a cliff (having fallen there with Boone in it)? And did Eko and Charlie not burn that plane up during the "memorial" service for Eko's brother? I didn't notice in the previews that it looked burned at all but I wasn't paying that much attention when I've seen it.


ron

And speaking of the immediately prior cuts, (Eko and Locke? pushing the plane), I'd assumed that was the drug runner plane but was it not already at the bottom of a cliff (having fallen there with Boone in it)? And did Eko and Charlie not burn that plane up during the "memorial" service for Eko's brother? I didn't notice in the previews that it looked burned at all but I wasn't paying that much attention when I've seen it.
ron

I didn't see that preview, but you're right I thought they burned that plane as well - also, when it fell didn't it land upside down?

Doesn't exactly look like the plane. Who has a picture of the plane?

So to be clear, you're saying:

1. Any interesting "extra info" we gather from the officially "blessed" web game can be discussed here, as long as it's interesting and not just passwords and other low level details.

2. But any interesting "extra info" we gather from the officially "blessed" podcast is still off limits.

This doesn't really make a lot of sense to me. If you ever listen to the podcasts you will see that they take great care to not give away any real spoilers. Most of the info relates to debunking various wild fan theories and otherwise answering fan questions. I would think that this official debunking and other information would be of interest here in order to cut down on potentially dead end theories.Err, I think that is the point. This is the thread for wild-eyed wonder and speculation - big dreams and ideas - not necessarily driving hell bent for the "One-Right-Answer™". You do not necessarily receive the top grade in English Lit. for a paper describing the author's actual meaning and intent. These speculations and plot ideas should sink or swim on their own merit against the events broadcast.

In my personal opinion, another big difference is that the "game" attempts to remain [in story].

An added factor is that the game appears to be designed to enhance and compliment, rather than be integral or revealing. Therefore, interesting tidbits and [foreshadows] may be present in the information, but you do not know if it is a red herring, meaningless trivia, or someone's creative interpretation [that was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea]¹.

But with information from a pod-cast, even clarifications ("WE are the..."), everything is said [out of story], even if there are no big revelations.

I have all the pod-casts, but I have yet to take the plunge and listen to them. I was wavering when keenan went over to the dark side, but this makes me pause. I've been thinking of saving them for a long road trip at/near the season end.

v/r,
C-F

¹ apologies to DNA.

No, but it could've taken that amount of time for:

a) Jack's dad to die/be-killed

b) Jack to be notified and fly to Australia

c) Jack to be in the airport flying back to the States

FWIW, I don't know why the "week" time period is getting bandied about, it could've been any period of time that had passed...4 days...8 days...15 days even. ;)


If I remember correctly, Jack didn't find out that his dad was dead until after he was already in Australia. He had talked to his mom stateside, and she sent Jack to bring him home. They didn't seem to be talking like he was already dead at the time. If that is the case, for all we know, Jack is already en route to, if not in Australia when Christian dies. Which shortens the whole proposed timeline.

Rewatching last week's episode again, the conversation at the airport bar between AL and Christian Shephard sounded more like he was recruiting her to get on the plane. And the way he said "Sarah" when he named her, it definitely implied some emotion or knowledge of that name's importance to AL.
Couple that with Jack's halucinations in the second episode of season 1, the empty coffin, and Christian Shephard's potential connections with a number of Lostaways, I'm beginning to think daddy ain't dead. Between him and the special forces dude in Sayid's last flashback, I think one of them could be the "him" Gale keeps referring to.

Rewatching last week's episode again, the conversation at the airport bar between AL and Christian Shephard sounded more like he was recruiting her to get on the plane. And the way he said "Sarah" when he named her, it definitely implied some emotion or knowledge of that name's importance to AL.
Couple that with Jack's halucinations in the second episode of season 1, the empty coffin, and Christian Shephard's potential connections with a number of Lostaways, I'm beginning to think daddy ain't dead. Between him and the special forces dude in Sayid's last flashback, I think one of them could be the "him" Gale keeps referring to.

I've had the same thoughts, but then I remembered the scene where Jack ID's Christian's body in the morgue in season 1. So that kinda puts a crimp in that idea.

I've had the same thoughts, but then I remembered the scene where Jack ID's Christian's body in the morgue in season 1. So that kinda puts a crimp in that idea.

That's always been a stumbling block for me too, but given Jack's emotional state at the time, the distance he was standing and the brief time he looked at the body, it could well have been a fake he was looking at. Have you ever been to a wax museum? It's incredible how lifelike they can be. I don't think it's unfeasible to think that Hanso's reach can extend to a mortician or two.

If I remember correctly, Jack didn't find out that his dad was dead until after he was already in Australia. He had talked to his mom stateside, and she sent Jack to bring him home. They didn't seem to be talking like he was already dead at the time. If that is the case, for all we know, Jack is already en route to, if not in Australia when Christian dies. Which shortens the whole proposed timeline.

I think that's right, but we don't know when Christian dies. It's implied that it's the night after he and Sawyer meet/drink, but we don't know if that's the same day/night that was shown in the last episode (it's certainly looking like it) or a later one.

Someone on here should just buy me the first season on DVD and I'd be happy to reference any previous episodes for the board! :)

Rewatching Couple that with Jack's halucinations in the second episode of season 1, the empty coffin, and Christian Shephard's potential connections with a number of Lostaways, I'm beginning to think daddy ain't dead. Between him and the special forces dude in Sayid's last flashback, I think one of them could be the "him" Gale keeps referring to.


It's pretty doubtful that Christian Shephard, Chief of Surgery at a major hospital (at least until his son rats him out), would have the time to lead a double life as a Hanso upity-up, much less conceal that fact from his wife and son while constantly boozing it up. However, the concept of that would be pretty cool; talk about a shocker!

That being said, we do have Jack's "hallucinations" and the empty casket that definitely muddy those waters.

It's pretty doubtful that Christian Shephard, Chief of Surgery at a major hospital (at least until his son rats him out), would have the time to lead a double life as a Hanso upity-up, much less conceal that fact from his wife and son while constantly boozing it up. However, the concept of that would be pretty cool; talk about a shocker!

That being said, we do have Jack's "hallucinations" and the empty casket that definitely muddy those waters.


Yet he finds the time to be a father to his lovechild located halfway around the world!

"Christian Shephard"

Up until the most recent posts, I've just been calling him "Jack's Dad."

But there's definitely a lot of extra meaning intended for a name like that. Don't remember that being discussed in this thread (but I'm sure it has), so I'll just throw that out there (again).

Yet he finds the time to be a father to his lovechild located halfway around the world!Maybe I missed something, but where was it indicated that he ever found any time to be the father to his (supposed) love child halfway around the world?


ron

I think that's right, but we don't know when Christian dies. It's implied that it's the night after he and Sawyer meet/drink, but we don't know if that's the same day/night that was shown in the last episode (it's certainly looking like it) or a later one.

Given that Jack was in his father's Sydney hotel room with all his belongings still there (pills, wallet, etc.), makes me think that his father's "death" may have occurred within 24-48 hours of Jack's arrival in Sydney. Can't remember if the bed in the hotel room was made or was slept in. That would shorten the time period to less than 24 hours assuming housekeeping at the hotel was worth a sh**.

I have all the pod-casts, but I have yet to take the plunge and listen to them. I was wavering when keenan went over to the dark side, but this makes me pause. I've been thinking of saving them for a long road trip at/near the season end.

v/r,
C-F


When did I do that? I've downloaded them, like you, including the BG podcasts, but I've only listened to one BG one, never listened to a Lost podcast.

I'm still on the side of light and innocence(and no doubt a degree of ignorance as well). :D

When did I do that? I've downloaded them, like you, including the BG podcasts, but I've only listened to one BG one, never listened to a Lost podcast.

I'm still on the side of light and innocence(and no doubt a degree of ignorance as well). :D

I've listened to about half a dozen of the BSG (don't leave out the "S", Jim!) podcasts and found them quite interesting and informative of the process they go through to make a TV show. Haven't listened to any of the LOST podcasts yet - do they need to be watched along with the show as the BSG's do, or are they "stand alone"...?

I've listened to about half a dozen of the BSG (don't leave out the "S", Jim!)
Battlestar is one word, not two. :p

Battlestar is one word, not two. :p

Gotta' go with the flow, Dude. BSG seems to have won out in the court of public opinion (and on the pages of AVS). ;)

And speaking of the immediately prior cuts, (Eko and Locke? pushing the plane), I'd assumed that was the drug runner plane but was it not already at the bottom of a cliff (having fallen there with Boone in it)? And did Eko and Charlie not burn that plane up during the "memorial" service for Eko's brother? I didn't notice in the previews that it looked burned at all but I wasn't paying that much attention when I've seen it.Could be it's a chunk of the Oceanic plane, which somehow seems to have otherwise mysteriously disappeared from the island?

Doesn't exactly look like the plane. Who has a picture of the plane?You're right. I just checked the website to watch the preview and paused it right there too and it doesn't really look like the small plane. It looked like the fuselage of the plane to me before and right after that clip they show a picture of one of the heroin statues so I guess the power of suggestion in my mind connected the two :). So now I wonder if it's not the drug plane, what it is then? Also, they actually show the hands/arms of a black man hanging on to some vines or something before they show the person falling too so I may be wrong on that as well. So I guess the previews have clearly done their intended job on me ;). Not that I wouldn't have been watching already anyway though...


ron

< 2 hours!!!!

40 minutes in and not a word, what's up

?

;)

:)

Nice sleight-of-hand concerning Eko. Notice how the show always picks right up whenever he's spotlighted?

ahahahahahahahahahahah

That film is officially the best part of LOST!!!!

Would you like to watch that again? :D

"Would you like to watch that again?"

Man, you beat me to it :(

sublymonal.com

I get a coca-cola site down for maintenance

I got a series of televisions screens with static on them rotating in a circle around the word "OBEY". There's also a banging mechanical sound in the background.

I;m sure it's a plat on the word subliminal

Wow.

Maybe they should just make the show about Ecko. He is the best character. The Libby moment at the end was lame.

Ericglo

wow

"A crummy commercial?"

MY WIFE WAS RIGHT FROM THE GEt go....I will add to the story that the kids were REMOVED because they were NOT allowed in the experiment!

Maybe they should just make the show about Ecko. He is the best character. The Libby moment at the end was lame.

Ericglo

did you want her to ruin the surprise?
Come on, you knew she wasn't going to say it

sublymonal.comThe fine print at the beginning of the commercial said "paid for by sprite". Last week the commercial said "paid for by abc"

The fine print at the beginning of the commercial said "paid for by sprite". Last week the commercial said "paid for by abc"


they should really make it less obvious cuz we all saw it too

So the pearl uh? I guess there are 9 stations...are they all experiements? I think they answered maybe 2 questions but posed another 343434343432984293842934 more....I love Lost

why is LYMON cap's at sublymonal.com. Pretty weak ending did i miss something? Michael staring at the screen? Wheres the cliff hanger there?

That was another great ep, IMO. I also think the Eko character is great (followed by Sayid). So the pearl is the same as the question mark?

why is LYMON cap's at sublymonal.com. Pretty weak ending did i miss something? Michael staring at the screen? Wheres the cliff hanger there?

you don't need a cliffhanger after an episode like that

I agree, Ecko's backstories are always the best....also note, though I'm sure it was obvious, the father was the psychic that Claire went to...so he was obviously lying about the girl...for what reason, we do not know

why is LYMON cap's at sublymonal.com. Pretty weak ending did i miss something? Michael staring at the screen? Wheres the cliff hanger there?
lymon.com goes to a Sprite site.

got into sublymonal.com got past the tv screen and got a subliminal code unlocked, got a sevret code, just don't know where to input it

click on the screens really fast

GOTO THE BIOS!!!!!!!!

How could both Locke and the girl (who nearly drowned) see Eko's brother whom neither of them knew? (They also ran into Libby at the airport...there just might not be a backstory on her). This experiment either began on the mainland, or the crash happened in the heads of the losties, since there are no supernatural goings-on.

I installed Flash 8 to get into sublymonal.com now when i go to hansooeg.com it tells me I don't have the proper flash player. What a crock of ****. These guys can't synchronise there site.-

you don't need a cliffhanger after an episode like that

I agree, Ecko's backstories are always the best....also note, though I'm sure it was obvious, the father was the psychic that Claire went to...so he was obviously lying about the girl...for what reason, we do not knowI thought he was the guy Bernard's wife went to see??

How could both Locke and the girl (who nearly drowned) see Eko's brother whom neither of them knew? (They also ran into Libby at the airport...there just might not be a backstory on her). This experiment either began on the mainland, or the crash happened in the heads of the losties.


how did Locke see the plane and how did he know that Boone was going to die?

how did Locke see the plane and how did he know that Boone was going to die?

Both Locke and now Eko have been "fed" special dreams, shortly after they contacted the smoke monster/Cerberus. I'm guessing it still has some mental contact with them, and for some reason wanted to guide them to that Pearl hatch. Why? Who knows... but apparently either to get them to stop pushing the buttons, or conversely to keep pushing it.

I thought he was the guy Bernard's wife went to see??


nope...http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0636291/

I installed Flash 8 to get into sublymonal.com now when i go to hansooeg.com it tells me I don't have the proper flash player. What a crock of ****. These guys can't synchronise there site.-

I've got flash installed, but I think that the problem is that the site is being overwhelmed with traffic and the flash detection is failing.

I changed the url to this, http://thehansofoundation.org/index.html?detectflash=true, and got through.

Both Locke and now Eko have been "fed" special dreams, shortly after they contacted the smoke monster/Cerberus. I'm guessing it still has some mental contact with them, and for some reason wanted to guide them to that Pearl hatch. Why? Who knows... but apparently either to get them to stop pushing the buttons, or conversely to keep pushing it.

yup...to honestly say the whole island is an experiment cannot be 100% correct because there are still a ton of unexplained questions...

I've got flash installed, but I think that the problem is that the site is being overwhelmed with traffic and the flash detection is failing.

I changed the url to this, http://thehansofoundation.org/index.html?detectflash=true, and got through.

getting cannot detect flash...

Something else for all us map examiners. Looking at the "official" translation of the map that was released, there is talk of "the pearl" or "possible CV IV" NOT in the middle question mark area, but over on the right side, by one of the possible six hatches, closest to the Swan.

So I would say we did not see in this episode the "?" hatch after all.

Apparently Heir Apparent might be a anagram...

http://www.wordsmith.org/anagram/anagram.cgi?anagram=Heir+Apparent&include=&exclude=&d=&n=5&m=&source=adv&a=n&l=n&q=n&language=english&where=

LYMON

Sprite = Lime/ Lemon ???

My DVR cut off right as Hurley was going to talk to Libby. What did I miss?

He said,"I'm sorry I forgot about the blankets!" Then broke down .......

I didn't care for the cliche "Name then die!" bit but the episode was the best one in a looooong time!

Wanna bet someone was documenting the goings-on at the hatch when Michael shot AL, and that Ecko has those in the journals he took?

Wanna bet someone was documenting the goings-on at the hatch when Michael shot AL, and that Ecko has those in the journals he took?

Perhaps...but it also looked pretty dusty and abandonded in there...and they would have had to scurry out of there pretty fast and cover the hatch door, which was covered by the plane's tail ;)

Something else for all us map examiners. Looking at the "official" translation of the map that was released, there is talk of "the pearl" or "possible CV IV" NOT in the middle question mark area, but over on the right side, by one of the possible six hatches, closest to the Swan.

So I would say we did not see in this episode the "?" hatch after all.
Why would you say that when there was a big ? mark right over it?

Perhaps...but it also looked pretty dusty and abandonded in there...and they would have had to scurry out of there pretty fast and cover the hatch door, which was covered by the plane's tail ;)

I would expect there is another entrance/exit, like back at our "Losties" bunker.

My DVR cut off right as Hurley was going to talk to Libby. What did I miss?
Mine cut off right as she opened her eyes and looked like she was going to say something? What happened next?

I keep adding an additional minute each week to the DVR and STILL it gets cut off!

Why would you say that when there was a big ? mark right over it?

On the map there is a central large ? hatch/area, with tunnels apparently leading to it from the other hatches.

The orientation video tonight said this pearl hatch was 5 of 6, so, combined with how on the map the pearl is labeled over on the bottom-right side, I think it is just one of the standard 6 "regular" hatches, and is not the central nexus hatch on the map. Also note tonight that there were apparently no extra tunnels or anything inside this hatch, unlike what you might expect in the central nexus hatch on the map.

Mine cut off right as she opened her eyes and looked like she was going to say something? What happened next?

I keep adding an additional minute each week to the DVR and STILL it gets cut off!

She got this really horrid look on her face and said "Michael".

Jack thought she was asking if he was OK and said he was fine.

Then she looked even more shocked and died.

On the map there is a central large ? hatch/area, with tunnels apparently leading to it from the other hatches.

The orientation video tonight said this pearl hatch was 5 of 6, so, combined with how on the map the pearl is labeled over on the bottom-right side, I think it is just one of the standard 6 "regular" hatches, and is not the central nexus hatch on the map. Also note tonight that there were apparently no extra tunnels or anything inside this hatch, unlike what you might expect in the central nexus hatch on the map.
Not quite what I meant.

http://kjordan.net/questionthumb.jpg (http://kjordan.net/question.jpg)
And to accentuate it:
http://kjordan.net/questionmarkthumb.jpg (http://kjordan.net/questionmark.jpg)

Plus on the map it had "The Pearl?" so the person who drew that had no idea where or what The Pearl was. We don't actually know what the suiggles mean or if the hatches are connected. Plus, why would they connect the central hatch to the hatches they are monitoring when the central one is supposed to be a secret? Not to mention it's fairly close to The Swan like this hatch is. The person who drew the map probably went up on the cliff and saw the ? mark and that's what he put down on the map. It was also covered up so he probably didn't go inside. Where he got The Pearl from without going inside is another question.

Ecko is a great character. He's one of the most direct-speaking people imaginable; nary a wasted syllable. I also like that he's a sympathetic born-again Christian character with some depth. Yes, he used to be a heinous criminal and even a murderer, but even he was not beyond redemption--that's a strong positive message in my book. Thanks, LOST writers...you guys rock!

So the report Locke printed out looked like it had date and times from April of 2002.

So the report Locke printed out looked like it had date and times from April of 2002.
Not sure how you're getting that, I'm not really sure how to interpret what was on it.

http://kjordan.net/printoutthumb.jpg (http://kjordan.net/printout.jpg)

Mine cut off right as she opened her eyes and looked like she was going to say something? What happened next?

I keep adding an additional minute each week to the DVR and STILL it gets cut off!

Hate to sound cheeky, but why not just pad up by 5 minutes at once and be done with it? Does your DVR not allow that much padding? My life is easier because I Tivo both Lost and Invasion, so doesn't matter if Lost runs over the limit, as that will get recorded during Invasion..

On the map there is a central large ? hatch/area, with tunnels apparently leading to it from the other hatches.

The orientation video tonight said this pearl hatch was 5 of 6, so, combined with how on the map the pearl is labeled over on the bottom-right side, I think it is just one of the standard 6 "regular" hatches, and is not the central nexus hatch on the map. Also note tonight that there were apparently no extra tunnels or anything inside this hatch, unlike what you might expect in the central nexus hatch on the map.

Where do the vacuum tubes go?

Edit: I ask this because it seems highly unlikely that a central station would have tubes going to a non-central station...original dayglow map writer may have been inaccurate and ?=Pearl. Pearl is not central and the central location is somewhere else. Or it was part of the experiment and the ? was put there to stop anyone from looking further.

Great, I've become a victim of an early DVR cut off. I have my Lost series recording set up to record 2 minutes after the scheduled recording and this is the first time I've had a problem. My DVR cut off when Jack was in the bathroom, after Sawyer was comforting Kate... can someone tell me what happened from that point til the end?

I've changed the recording options to record friggin 10 minutes after. I swear they do this just to screw with people with DVRs.

Where do the vacuum tubes go?
That was explained in the video. They put the notebooks in a container and put it in the tube and it goes directly to "us." Where the people the instructor was referring to are, we don't know. Possibly in the camp Michael was talking about? I doubt the tube system would take it off the island. I find it curious he went by a different name though. Dr. Marvin Candle in the first and Dr. Mark Wickman in this one.

Hate to sound cheeky, but why not just pad up by 5 minutes at once and be done with it? Does your DVR not allow that much padding? My life is easier because I Tivo both Lost and Invasion, so doesn't matter if Lost runs over the limit, as that will get recorded during Invasion..

It sure would be nice if you would answer the question and then deliver the sermon... this time around Comcast didn't have the schedule correct... it usually has the extra time on Lost episodes in the guide so this isn't a problem, but on this episode it didn't, so a few people who are aware they should pad the DVR recording (like myself) still got screwed.

That was explained in the video. They put the notebooks in a container and put it in the tube and it goes directly to "us." Where the people the instructor was referring to are, we don't know. Possibly in the camp Michael was talking about? I doubt the tube system would take it off the island.

See my edit...sorry...

See my edit...sorry...
See the previous page(s) where I put a screenshot. There's definitely a ? mark above this station.

Ecko is a great character. He's one of the most direct-speaking people imaginable; nary a wasted syllable. I also like that he's a sympathetic born-again Christian character with some depth. Yes, he used to be a heinous criminal and even a murderer, but even he was not beyond redemption--that's a strong positive message in my book. Thanks, LOST writers...you guys rock!

From tonight's flashbacks, I think Ecko's faith was a sham all the way up to the point he heard what Charlotte had to say at the airport about his brother appearing to her.

Another random thought...Henry Gale was in the monitoring station which is why Zeke knew they had broken into the Swan ("opening doors you have no right opening"). He then abandons his station since Desmond is now no longer in charge and gets caught.

So the report Locke printed out looked like it had date and times from April of 2002.

My guess would be those are a log of every time someone enters the numbers.

Another random thought...Henry Gale was in the monitoring station which is why Zeke knew they had broken into the Swan ("opening doors you have no right opening"). He then abandons his station since Desmond is now no longer in charge and gets caught.
Apparently they stopped keeping track (i.e. sending and printing reports) a long time ago though since the notebooks were covered in dust.

Not quite what I meant.

http://kjordan.net/questionthumb.jpg (http://kjordan.net/question.jpg)
And to accentuate it:
http://kjordan.net/questionmarkthumb.jpg (http://kjordan.net/questionmark.jpg)

Plus on the map it had "The Pearl?" so the person who drew that had no idea where or what The Pearl was. We don't actually know what the suiggles mean or if the hatches are connected. Plus, why would they connect the central hatch to the hatches they are monitoring when the central one is supposed to be a secret? Not to mention it's fairly close to The Swan like this hatch is. The person who drew the map probably went up on the cliff and saw the ? mark and that's what he put down on the map. It was also covered up so he probably didn't go inside. Where he got The Pearl from without going inside is another question.

Ahh ok, I thought you might be referring to that apparent question mark.

However, note that when Eko went back down to taste the soil, he specifically said it was a CIRCLE. You can see in your top picture it probably used to be a full circle, and just part of it is overgrown a bit. He said someone must have built it to try and guide the plane to land there... it certainly seems like we have at least 3 instances then of someone attempting to guide people to this particular hatch.

See the previous page(s) where I put a screenshot. There's definitely a ? mark above this station.

I know, great screenshot...not doubting the mark (ground salted so nothing would grow), just doubting that it's the center ? on Locke's map since the location is called the Pearl and it's 5 of 6 and there are clearly 7 locations on Locke's map. Then he goes and throws his map into the vacuum tubes so now someone else finds out that they know about the possible central location. I'm probably wrong, I'm just not buying it.

My guess would be those are a log of every time someone enters the numbers.
Any idea how to read the timestamps when they're in a format like 41602072:05?

Edit: Seems 2:05 is the h:mm, and 41602 might be mddyy, but what's the 06, 07 and 08 between the date and the time?

That was explained in the video. They put the notebooks in a container and put it in the tube and it goes directly to "us." Where the people the instructor was referring to are, we don't know. Possibly in the camp Michael was talking about? I doubt the tube system would take it off the island. I find it curious he went by a different name though. Dr. Marvin Candle in the first and Dr. Mark Wickman in this one.

Right on both points... clearly the pearl is not a "central" location otherwise it would be the endpoint or collection point of the pneumatic tube system. And yes perhaps Wickman is the guy's real name? Or I suppose it's possible that the pearl itself served as yet another psych test of some sort.

Apparently they stopped keeping track (i.e. sending and printing reports) a long time ago though since the notebooks were covered in dust.

Again, don't mean to be a pain, but the one dust covered notebook that Eko leafed through was empty. Full notebooks were supposed to be sent into the vacuum tubes, so they would not be available. There may be other notes, which may be why Eko wanted to take them.

My guess would be those are a log of every time someone enters the numbers.

That was my guess as well.

I know, great screenshot...not doubting the mark (ground salted so nothing would grow), just doubting that it's the center ? on Locke's map since the location is called the Pearl and it's 5 of 6 and there are clearly 7 locations on Locke's map. Then he goes and throws his map into the vacuum tubes so now someone else finds out that they know about the possible central location. I'm probably wrong, I'm just not buying it.
I don't see why it wouldn't be the center ? on Locke's map since they headed right towards it. Perhaps the ?/Pearl isn't the main station, it's obviously just a station where they monitor. They don't even know what the other stations think they're doing, they just take notes and do printouts.

Right on both points... clearly the pearl is not a "central" location otherwise it would be the endpoint or collection point of the pneumatic tube system. And yes perhaps Wickman is the guy's real name? Or I suppose it's possible that the pearl itself served as yet another psych test of some sort.
Actually I believe the Pearl is the center point, at least the point where it was on Locke's map.


Again, don't mean to be a pain, but the one dust covered notebook that Eko leafed through was empty. Full notebooks were supposed to be sent into the vacuum tubes, so they would not be available. There may be other notes, which may be why Eko wanted to take them.
Well, yes, but the place shouldn't be so dusty if it was inhabited recently. And I'm not sure Eko took back any notebooks, it was mostly loose paper which was probably printouts.

I don't see why it wouldn't be the center ? on Locke's map since they headed right towards it.

You may be right...just not sure how to reconcile 5 of 6 as shown in the video vs. clearly 7 locations (6 peripheral and one center) on Locke's map.

I don't see why it wouldn't be the center ? on Locke's map since they headed right towards it.

So your main argument is it must be the central location because they said they were going to try and head towards it? But who's to say they were going the right way? Are we sure that North is towards the top of the map? We don't know do we?

Also if you can grab a screen capture of the map when he handed it to Eko I'd like to see it. If some of the other stations were also labelled with question marks, then who's to say which question mark they chose to head towards?

Also one other thought... keep in mind it appears Eko is under the influence of some sort of mind control, which is giving him (and Locke) wild dreams. He basically walked straight towards the plane location without really stopping or getting lost, almost as if he was being mentally led in the right direction. But again, if they're being led there, who knows if that would be the central spot on the map. I don't see a reason why it would be.

OK, I haven't had a chance to go back and replay the segment, but what was the comment that after, I believe, an 8 day shift the observers were to go to - a ferry or something and they would be transported to the accommodations. Anyone else make out that statement or am I totally confused???

You may be right...just not sure how to reconcile 5 of 6 as shown in the video vs. clearly 7 locations (6 peripheral and one center) on Locke's map.
Hmm, I'm trying to remember, The Staff is the medical bunker and the Arrow is the one the tailies found. We know the Swan well. I'm thinking the Others are in the one below the Arrow to the right since it says "Why so many Dharmatel relays in such an untenable location?" Since we've seen the ?, that just leaves the Flame and the one to the right of the Swan. Although there is a scratched out bunker too, which we don't know what that was. Rousseau was occupying one, possibly the scratched out one. So I'm thinking the one with the Others is the main bunker. There's not many others that could be the main bunker since the others are right next to the Losties.

http://kjordan.net/doorthumb.jpg (http://kjordan.net/door.jpg)
Although there is a ? slightly above the Swan, so it's possible that that's what they stumbled onto. Who knows, they're both really close :confused:

But that just means there's even more hatches :eek:

My two minute DVR padding wasn't enough for me either.

Pardon me while I go break a law....

OK, I haven't had a chance to go back and replay the segment, but what was the comment that after, I believe, an 8 day shift the observers were to go to - a ferry or something and they would be transported to the accommodations. Anyone else make out that statement or am I totally confused???

I think it said they would work for 3 weeks, and then go back to the barracks.

I think it said they would work for 3 weeks, and then go back to the barracks.
"At the end of your 8 hour shift, proceed to the Pola Ferry (or possibly Apollo Ferry or something like that) which will take you back to your barracks to prepare for your next shift."

Glad I'm using Tivo, which, so far, knows how long each episode is.

Where did the sublymonal commercial appear (in which commercial break)?

My two minute DVR padding wasn't enough for me either.

Pardon me while I go break a law....

I think starting tomorrow you can watch tonights episode for free on ABC.com.

Couple of things make me think the Pearl is another type of psych experiment:

1. It has its own monitoring camera built in, Locke looked at it briefly.

2. The guy's name in the video is actually Dr. Waxman. ( http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0154236/ ) Now that sounds very suspiciously similar to his other known alias "Dr. Candle". Leads you to suspect both are just made up names.

Also I've seen some speculation elsewhere as to why this orientation was on videotape, but the other one is on film. Some people think the very real magnetic fields we've seen demonstrated in the Swan might mess up a videotape, so they had to use film there.

Glad I'm using Tivo, which, so far, knows how long each episode is.

Where did the sublymonal commercial appear (in which commercial break)?
It was around 55 minutes in I think.

Couple of things make me think the Pearl is another type of psych experiment:

1. It has its own monitoring camera built in, Locke looked at it briefly.

2. The guy's name in the video is actually Dr. Waxman. ( http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0154236/ ) Now that sounds very suspiciously similar to his other known alias "Dr. Candle". Leads you to suspect both are just made up names.

Also I've seen some speculation elsewhere as to why this orientation was on videotape, but the other one is on film. Some people think the very real magnetic fields we've seen demonstrated in the Swan might mess up a videotape, so they had to use film there.
That actually says it for the season finale and I'm sure he said Wickman in this episode. But that still fits in the whole Candle theme. Candle, Wax, Wick.

For those of you with DVR's and having problems viewing the entire show; why don't you
record the show right after LOST? This should correct the problem. Or go buy a TIVO!

I think starting tomorrow you can watch tonights episode for free on ABC.com.
How many pixels will they give me?

For those of you with DVR's and having problems viewing the entire show; why don't you
record the show right after LOST?
Because this has only happened to me once this season.

This should correct the problem. Or go buy a TIVO!
As soon as TIVO lets me edit out commercials and recompresss episodes in MPEG-4 so I can burn them onto DVD-Rs.

Because this has only happened to me once this season.


Same here. Do you have Comcast? I think their guide was incorrect for this one episode.

How many pixels will they give me?
About 700x395 at full size.

Ever notice.. Each week, on the dartboard in the hatch, the darts always seem to land on 4, 8, 15, 16
vegggas

Same here. Do you have Comcast? I think their guide was incorrect for this one episode.
My DVR uses the zap2it.com XML listings.

I was hoping that the Hanso Foundation's Dharma experiment on "remote viewing" would have been something more exotic than "nanny-cams" in the various hatches. Oh, well.

I'm really curious why Mr. Eko believes the work of pushing the button is so important, when Locke now sees what Jack was suspecting: that is was some type of psychological experiement. You know, do it because you think it is important. Like rewatching episodes for minute clues....or going to bogus websites to look for minute clues....like...wait, hold on....the timer is running out...I have to go enter the numbers....

I was hoping that the Hanso Foundation's Dharma experiment on "remote viewing" would have been something more exotic than "nanny-cams" in the various hatches. Oh, well.

We don't know that the closed circuit observation system in the Pearl actually is the "remote viewing" thing, do we? I have to believe there's another shoe to drop with regard to that.

I'm really curious why Mr. Eko believes the work of pushing the button is so important, when Locke now sees what Jack was suspecting: that is was some type of psychological experiement.

Eko has taken over the "Man of Faith" role from Locke, and is supposed (from his brother in the dream) to restore Locke's faith in the Island. Locke is sort of "lost" right now, as the purpose of his being on the Island gave him a new confident persona. Right now, that persona is gone and he's just a frustrated loser again. Eko needs to "rebuild" him.

Interesting that the only closed circuit cameras that were working (Locke tried to turn them all on) were the ones in the Swan and the Pearl. Not even the Staff (medical) bunker's camera was working. So, we learned nothing about the other Dharma stations from Locke & Eko's visit to the Pearl.

But you can bet that Locke's map that he let go into the pneumatic system (which wouldn't work on just a piece of paper - don't they need the vacuum sealed with those containers to work properly?) will end up playing a role down the line.

Someone posted that you can get past the tv screens on the sublymonal.com site by clicking a bunch of times. It's actually the numbers. After 4, 8, 15, 16, 23, and 42 clicks, the screen updates and changes the 'clickable' screen.

When the father/psychic was talking to Echo about being a fraud, can someone let me know what he told Echo, I missed that exchange.

Thanks

Someone posted that you can get past the tv screens on the sublymonal.com site by clicking a bunch of times. It's actually the numbers. After 4, 8, 15, 16, 23, and 42 clicks, the screen updates and changes the 'clickable' screen.


And you get the "secret code" of Heir Apparent....whatever the hell that means. What a crock of sh*% :(

Did anyone find out where to enter "Heir Apparent"?

Anyone know what the login in Middlewerks Bio is for?

Lost is going to have a problem if they keep killing off all the hot chicks.

- Tom

But you can bet that Locke's map that he let go into the pneumatic system (which wouldn't work on just a piece of paper - don't they need the vacuum sealed with those containers to work properly?) will end up playing a role down the line.

It shouldn't go anywhere (but probably did). It'd be like shooting a spitball through a 3" PVC pipe.

Did anyone find out where to enter "Heir Apparent"?

Anyone know what the login in Middlewerks Bio is for?
n/m

It shouldn't go anywhere (but probably did). It'd be like shooting a spitball through a 3" PVC pipe.

No, it would work.

The vacumn seal helps the larger/heavier canister move through the tube.

I've seen paper and plastic cups shot through them one at a time without any problem. (Various size cups without any issue)

The vacumn of the system would have sucked his piece of paper no problem since it was so light.

...this time around Comcast didn't have the schedule correct... it usually has the extra time on Lost episodes in the guide so this isn't a problem, but on this episode it didn't, so a few people who are aware they should pad the DVR recording (like myself) still got screwed.

I'm on Comcast and I got the whole episode + previews.

http://img417.imageshack.us/img417/4552/times9vs.jpg

Any idea how to read the timestamps when they're in a format like 41602072:05?

Edit: Seems 2:05 is the h:mm, and 41602 might be mddyy, but what's the 06, 07 and 08 between the date and the time?Well, it's not Modified Julian Date (MJD) because 41602 would be "October 12, 1972", but the orientation video was dated 1980.

MJD calculator: http://www.csgnetwork.com/julianmodifdateconv.html

National Time Service formats: http://tf.nist.gov/service/its.htm
Daytime Protocol (RFC-867)

This protocol is widely used by small computers running MS-DOS and similar operating systems. The server listens on port 13, and responds to requests in either tcp/ip or udp/ip formats. The standard does not specify an exact format for the Daytime Protocol, but requires that the time is sent using standard ASCII characters. NIST chose a time code format similar to the one used by its dial-up Automated Computer Time Service (ACTS), as shown below:

JJJJJ YR-MO-DA HH:MM:SS TT L H msADV UTC(NIST) OTM

where:

JJJJJ is the Modified Julian Date (MJD). The MJD has a starting point of midnight on November 17, 1858. You can obtain the MJD by subtracting exactly 2 400 000.5 days from the Julian Date, which is an integer day number obtained by counting days from the starting point of noon on 1 January 4713 B.C. (Julian Day zero).

YR-MO-DA is the date. It shows the last two digits of the year, the month, and the current day of month.

HH:MM:SS is the time in hours, minutes, and seconds. The time is always sent as Coordinated Universal Time (UTC). An offset needs to be applied to UTC to obtain local time. For example, Mountain Time in the U. S. is 7 hours behind UTC during Standard Time, and 6 hours behind UTC during Daylight Saving Time.

The label UTC(NIST) is contained in every time code. It indicates that you are receiving Coordinated Universal Time (UTC) from the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST).

I agree that Locke's map will have some role in the future..

Did anyone else notice an obvious splicing in the video tape between when Waxman mentioned the ferry and his final comments? I've seen some poorly hacked videotape before, and the satic before and after the transition from the wide-shot where he mentioned the ferry and the close-up of his final comments looks like it was a dirty splice/cut job. I wonder what kind of details were left out? Perhaps the actual destination of the ferry (like a ship or platform off-shore, or another island).

Also, Locke or Eco noticed a camera in the ceiling of the pearl, so that means someone could have been watching them.

Also, the camera in the Swan (and the other stations) could be going somewhere else in addition to the pearl... Perhaps the cameras in all the stations are still active, and only the feeds to the pearl have been interrupted, so someone could still be watching everything from somewhere else..

Also, I agree that the "salted circle" was in fact meant to be a circle, although it could be seen a a question mark.. I think the circle represented the pearl. Perhaps, from the proper vantage point, there would be some feature that made the other stations apparant as well. Maybe from high-up there's a swan feature at the swan, an arrow feature at the arrow, etc. Perhaps they're used to aid the resupply aircraft in delivering their cargo.

For those of you with DVR's and having problems viewing the entire show; why don't you
record the show right after LOST? This should correct the problem.

Actually I do record the next show but what happened was Lost stopped recording at 9:01 and Invasion didn't start recording until 9:05!

I have a Comcast dvr Moto PIII and I set my recording up to start 3 minutes early and then leave the end as is, end of show (no “extra” time inputted). So it will record until the show is done. I also record Invasion right after and have it set up the same way and there is a little over lap as I start that show a couple minutes earlier as well and again leave the “stop” or ending recording as is.

A thought I had about the logs Locke printed. Do you think anyone has printed a log which would mean somebody has been monitoring them? It would be easy for them to figure out assuming they remember when they started pushing the button. 1440 minutes in a day and they push the button every 108 minutes and there is a time stamp that records when the button has been pushed, etc. So they push the button roughly 13 or so times a day?

So what do you guys think they were looking at off-shore in the previews? Somebody opening up a bio-dome door in the sky? Maybe a second sun rising? ;)

So what do you guys think they were looking at off-shore in the previews? Somebody opening up a bio-dome door in the sky? Maybe a second sun rising? ;)

Maybe a Walt who will appear to have aged more than a year in just a few weeks. :eek:

Two things:
- The preview for next week looks awesome. We are going to get a full dose of The Others. Looks like quite a few of them.

- Anybody else notice that the question mark plus the cross-like shape of the plane formed the symbol for the band Blue Oyster Cult?? Coincidence? Probably. Ominous? Absolutely! ;)
(My wife called me a nerd when I mentioned it. Sigh.)

Based on the previews, it appears we're going to see at least a portion of what Michael went through when he visited the others. It looks like Zeke captures him with some kind of bollo device.

Lost is going to have a problem if they keep killing off all the hot chicks.

- Tom

Michelle Rodriguez - NO

Cynthia Watros - YES

Wolfie

Two things:
- The preview for next week looks awesome. We are going to get a full dose of The Others. Looks like quite a few of them.

- Anybody else notice that the question mark plus the cross-like shape of the plane formed the symbol for the band Blue Oyster Cult?? Coincidence? Probably. Ominous? Absolutely! ;)
(My wife called me a nerd when I mentioned it. Sigh.)

It's probably a cult symbol for the Dharma Initiative.

Wolfie

For those of you with DVR's and having problems viewing the entire show; why don't you
record the show right after LOST? This should correct the problem. Or go buy a TIVO!

The TVGOS on my Sony DVR does not always get the extra 2+ minutes so I pad the ending. Last week I padded one minute and missed about 30 seconds of the show so I figured if I padded 2 minutes, I'd be good to go this week....oh well..

Also, I record CSI:NY right after Lost and can deal with missing a couple of minutes but would prefer not to miss more. Guess I need another DVR....

Actually I do record the next show but what happened was Lost stopped recording at 9:01 and Invasion didn't start recording until 9:05!

I had the same problem, and recorded both Lost & Invasion. I have a sa8300hd. Do you have the same box ? If so, what cable system are you on ?

Somehow, at around 10:15p ET I was able to go back and catch the 4 missed minutes by switching to ch 707 (ABC-HD on Cablevision) and rewinding back to 10:01p to catch the missed parts. The 8300hd is a very flaky box

OK, I haven't had a chance to go back and replay the segment, but what was the comment that after, I believe, an 8 day shift the observers were to go to - a ferry or something and they would be transported to the accommodations. Anyone else make out that statement or am I totally confused???
Yes, there was a comment about a ferry, and the video "conveniently" messed up at that point. Interesting ... you think they would be fairly close to a large land mass for there to be a ferry ... but aparently still far enough away that you can't see it from the Island.

The more that gets revealed, the more questions there are.

So what do you guys think they were looking at off-shore in the previews? Somebody opening up a bio-dome door in the sky? Maybe a second sun rising? ;)

Maybe another plane crashing ?

I'm thinking Libby is not going to remain dead.

- They introduced the "miracle" of the girl who drowned and came back to life the next day.

- They have not explained nearly enough of her back story mental ward connection with Hurley.

- The "Michael" blurt at the end has given the losties no real information since they took it as a question, not an ID of the shooter. There will be no tension for Michael about being discovered unless Libby is still around in a coma or something to possibly rat him out.

Has any official statement been made that she is off the show?

I'm thinking Libby is not going to remain dead.

- They have not explained nearly enough of her back story mental ward connection with Hurley.

Why does she have to be alive to have a back story??? She may not be gone, but she's dead.

Another point:

The papers Eko took do appear to be a printout of the activity on the terminal in the Swan station. if this is true, the other critical information that they might contain is the log of Michael's conversation with "Walt" or whoever was posing as him.

This could reveal quite a bit to the other Losties...

Why does she have to be alive to have a back story??? She may not be gone, but she's dead.

How can Hurley find out about their past if she is now dead? What relevance can her former insanity have to their current situation if she is now dead?

Why does she have to be alive to have a back story??? She may not be gone, but she's dead.

How can Hurley find out about their past if she is now dead? What relevance can her former insanity have to their current situation if she is now dead?Maybe Hurley will have a revelation and remember all sorts of stuff about Libby.. So we'll get a Libby flashback via Hurley (Flashback will focus on Libby, but be in Hurley's mind).

I guess they have to do it this season, though. Doesn't she have a new series lined-up for next year?

So what do you guys think they were looking at off-shore in the previews? Somebody opening up a bio-dome door in the sky? Maybe a second sun rising? ;)
Something that happens when they stop pushing the button. :eek:

I'm thinking Libby is not going to remain dead.

- They introduced the "miracle" of the girl who drowned and came back to life the next day.

- They have not explained nearly enough of her back story mental ward connection with Hurley.

- The "Michael" blurt at the end has given the losties no real information since they took it as a question, not an ID of the shooter. There will be no tension for Michael about being discovered unless Libby is still around in a coma or something to possibly rat him out.

Has any official statement been made that she is off the show?
Right on! I didn't think of that either. LIBBY'S NOT GOING TO STAY DEAD! Last week my wife said Michelle R. appeared on the Good Morning America show after her death. That was another way to point to Michelle being dead and Libby not. But if Watros didn't show up on the show, and nothing is being said about her leaving the show, hmmm... bet we'll see her come back to life. Someone's got to spill the beans about Michael, anyway.

Why does she have to be alive to have a back story??? She may not be gone, but she's dead.

How can Hurley find out about their past if she is now dead? What relevance can her former insanity have to their current situation if she is now dead?

When Eko was approached by the "miracle girl" in the airport, Libby certainly appeared to have more involvement than merely a casual passer-by.

And why would Hurley need to find out about her connection to him as long as we do.

And how does Jack learn that Claire's his half sister or not?

We'll continue to learn about connections that the characters may not.

cpanther95,

Any possible way of starting a new string called: "How to record an entire episode of 'Lost' on a DVR" ?????

I guess my point is that, yes, Hurley could find out about Libby's insanity in a flashback, but how is it at all relevant unless she is present on the island to have that insanity be meaningful to the current story?

Otherwise, Hurley would have a revelation about her in the asylum, mention it to the others and their response would be, "Really? Libby was crazy? Wow. Too bad" and they would just move on. It would have ZERO bearing on the plot if she is dead. At least it seems so to me right now.

Did anyone find out where to enter "Heir Apparent"?

Anyone know what the login in Middlewerks Bio is for?


Does no one care about thiese or did no one else figure it out.

Also, I tried to call the phone number for hours and only got abusy signal, anyone know what the Hansoorg phone number connects you to?

Here's a continuity issue that bugged me.

In the airport Eko was clean shaven. On the episode where they crashed on the beach, I seem to recall that Eko already had a bit of a beard. Can anyone confirm this or deny it with a screen shot from that ep?

Thanks.

- Anybody else notice that the question mark plus the cross-like shape of the plane formed the symbol for the band Blue Oyster Cult?? Coincidence? Probably. Ominous? Absolutely! ;)
(My wife called me a nerd when I mentioned it. Sigh.)
BOC symbol also used in a recent episode of Supernatural.

I always knew that Lost needed "More cowbell!"

cpanther95,

Any possible way of starting a new string called: "How to record an entire episode of 'Lost' on a DVR" ?????

Yeah, it's called: "Networks, please keep to the hour to hour (or half-hour) format we've all grown accustomed to" :)

Also, I tried to call the phone number for hours and only got abusy signal, anyone know what the Hansoorg phone number connects you to?

I think it connects you to IDOLS-02 and votes for Elliot Yamin. :D

Interesting that the only closed circuit cameras that were working (Locke tried to turn them all on) were the ones in the Swan and the Pearl. Not even the Staff (medical) bunker's camera was working. So, we learned nothing about the other Dharma stations from Locke & Eko's visit to the Pearl.

But you can bet that Locke's map that he let go into the pneumatic system (which wouldn't work on just a piece of paper - don't they need the vacuum sealed with those containers to work properly?) will end up playing a role down the line.

Those cameras would have been in good positions to view Michael shooting Ana Lucia and Libby. Maybe the VCR that Locke and Eko used to play the Dhama tape can also record and someone could have possibly recorded the shooting. So Michael may still be held accountable for what he did.

Here's a continuity issue that bugged me.

In the airport Eko was clean shaven. On the episode where they crashed on the beach, I seem to recall that Eko already had a bit of a beard. Can anyone confirm this or deny it with a screen shot from that ep?

Thanks.

My thought was that it was a different flight. Didn't he also have his priest uniform on in that scene? After the crash, he had on a business suit. On the other hand, maybe he borrowed Zeke's beard.

So we are all in agreement that the Pearl has been abandonded and has not been used for some time. The video said copyright 1980 and the technology is old, so its been down there for awhile.

We also all agree that Wickman, Waxman are in fact the same person (possibly a twin? a bad twin?)

We all agree that the Swan is a "Skinner Box" of some sorts..i.e.: a psychological experiment and that the Pearl, might also be a psychological experiment but it is yet to be seen what the purpose of the experiment(s) are and whether the entire island is devoted to the experiments.

Just trying to keep everything straight...as it is easy to get confused by everything.

Maybe Hurley will have a revelation and remember all sorts of stuff about Libby.. So we'll get a Libby flashback via Hurley (Flashback will focus on Libby, but be in Hurley's mind).

I guess they have to do it this season, though. Doesn't she have a new series lined-up for next year?

I think she shot a pilot but that's something of a crapshoot. Only a fraction of pilots that are shot actually end up with a network slot. She could still be a "recurring" character, however, and take part in flashbacks as opposed to a "regular" character.

But I doubt she'll end up "not really dead" as some here have postulated. The Hanso Foundation may be mysterious and powerful, but even they can't possess the god-like power to return the dead to life even if they can tinker with bodily functions and speed the healing process. Cells begin to die almost immediately w/out oxygen, etc.

I had the same problem, and recorded both Lost & Invasion. I have a sa8300hd. Do you have the same box ? If so, what cable system are you on ?


I have the Motorola DCT-6412 (phase 2 I think) and I'm on Cox.

So what do you guys think they were looking at off-shore in the previews? Somebody opening up a bio-dome door in the sky? Maybe a second sun rising? ;)
Are we sure there is a next season, maybe they are looking at a Coast Guard Cutter!

They said it was almost 2 hours after the young girl was "revived"...perhaps she was on a specific energy point (the places the guy that Rose went to try to get healed)...and perhaps the Island is a very large specific energy point...so nothing is impossible

Another DUMB theory:

All of the characters on the island are merely clones, only they don't know they're clones. All the memories of the "parent" person, and a few concocted ones have been placed in the clone's brains.

The 'real' characters are observing their own potential behavior under extremely stressful and obviously manipulated conditions in order to improve themselves in real life. Kind of a cross between "The Game" and "The Island".

That will explain how Walt ages a year in a month, clones age faster. That is why Locke can walk and Rose doesn't have cancer.

Dumb, maybe not so dumb.

lol- Hey, all theories and ideas are welcome, because lets face it, with this show anything is possible.

- The "Michael" blurt at the end has given the losties no real information since they took it as a question, not an ID of the shooter. There will be no tension for Michael about being discovered unless Libby is still around in a coma or something to possibly rat him out.
I disagree with the second part of this observation. Michael could still be in fear of discovery, based on the fact that the activities in the swan are monitored and documented at the pearl.

Maybe mentioned, anyone else notice the upside down apparent autopsy report in the scene zooming in on the tape player? Didn't study it in detail, but I did notice that it had something along the lines of some Medical Center in Honolulu, Hawaii at the top of that report.

Wasn't the miracle girl incident in Aussie?

"My thought was that it was a different flight. Didn't he also have his priest uniform on in that scene? After the crash, he had on a business suit. On the other hand, maybe he borrowed Zeke's beard."

I had the same thought as well. When the "dead" girl showed up I assumed that he would bail out on the flight and ultimately end up on the same fligh (number) on a different date, giving him time to change clothes and grow facial hair.

When Libby showed up, it seems as though that possibility went out the window.

So, does anyone have screen caps from the Eko crash/beach scene episode?

First, with Libby saying "Michael".... When Michael first described to everyone what happened, didn't he say he heard the gunshots first, then got out of the bedroom and the two women were already shot before Henry shot him and then ran out.... So right there, when Libby mentioned Michael's name, they should have picked up on it (or maybe they'll figure it out next episode), that Libby wouldnt have known aobut Michael being shot if she was already unconscious.

Second, on the monitoring station, one camera per hatch is not going to show you a lot. Obviously, all we saw was Jack walking from one room to another. If they were really monitoring and recording movements/actions for a real purpose, there would have been a whole bank of screens for each individual hatch, so the observer could see everything going on. This is obviously just another part of the whole experiment, to see how long these people will actually record stuff.

The dad of the "dead-and-then-not-dead" girl was the psychic Claire went to see, correct? So he's not a quack after all, he just hadnt encountered someone as messed up as Claire, so he only thought he was a phony until he met her, cuz he obviously saw somehting real frightening inside Claire.

In the previews for next week, its gotta be something more than seeing Walt when they show everyone on the beach looking out over the water. It looked like to me that whatever they were looking at was lighting up the whole sky, seemed everyone's face was really bright, as if something had a bright light pointed at them, so perhaps a plane or helicopter with its searchlight.

I also agree that the monitoring station is not the center, too small and simple. But they cant be too far away from the real center bunker. I think the area of grass that they made look like a ? was probably really a circle (the Pearl) and the producers just made it appear to us as a ? to throw us off.

And the guy who does the Orientation Videos, he changes his name probably so that the people in the experiment think they are the only ones, and if somehow a participant from one experiment met another participant, they wouldnt know they were part of the same grand experiment cuz they would think a different person was in charge.

"My thought was that it was a different flight. Didn't he also have his priest uniform on in that scene? After the crash, he had on a business suit. On the other hand, maybe he borrowed Zeke's beard."

I had the same thought as well. When the "dead" girl showed up I assumed that he would bail out on the flight and ultimately end up on the same fligh (number) on a different date, giving him time to change clothes and grow facial hair.

When Libby showed up, it seems as though that possibility went out the window.

So, does anyone have screen caps from the Eko crash/beach scene episode?

When the ticket lady handed Eko his ticket, she said "Flight 815, gate 23".

He must have changed his clothes at some point, and they should work this into a flashback, or this would be a real big continuity error.

I wonder if Locke/Eko tell anyone about this other hatch.

If they do, will that try to find the camera in their hatch and disable it? That'd be interesting and probably very smart, but I'm guessing we never see them disable the camera. Would be easy since they pretty much know exactly where it is.

lol- Hey, all theories and ideas are welcome, because lets face it, with this show anything is possible.

Well, it's my theory and I'm sticking with it. Sure would make a great series finale to see ALL of the characters (dead and alive) at the cocktail reception at the end of the clone experiment. ;) ;) ;)

"Originally Posted by morgan1112
- Anybody else notice that the question mark plus the cross-like shape of the plane formed the symbol for the band Blue Oyster Cult?? Coincidence? Probably. Ominous? Absolutely!
(My wife called me a nerd when I mentioned it. Sigh.)"

It's probably a cult symbol for the Dharma Initiative.

Wolfie

Actually, It did look like BOC's symbol, which is no surprize, since the guitarist name is Buck DHARMA, and its fairly well known that Stephen King is a big BOC fan, and since the producers already acknowledge Mr. King as a show influenence....it all ties together in one neat little X-Mas gift pack.

So we are all in agreement that the Pearl has been abandonded and has not been used for some time. The video said copyright 1980 and the technology is old, so its been down there for awhile.


Why does old technology mean the bunker was abandonded?

We all agree that the Swan is a "Skinner Box" of some sorts..i.e.: a psychological experiment and that the Pearl, might also be a psychological experiment but it is yet to be seen what the purpose of the experiment(s) are and whether the entire island is devoted to the experiments.



How do we know that the Pearl is actually the Skinner Box, and that the button in the Swan actually does something? If the "teams" are lied to in the orientation film for the Swan, why are we so sure that the Pearl film is accurate?

We have not been given answers, what we have been given is more questions!

Aint this fun!

My thought was that it was a different flight. Didn't he also have his priest uniform on in that scene? After the crash, he had on a business suit.

Eko was wearing a business suit at the airport when the "drowned" girl talked to him, not his priest's uniform.

Actually, It did look like BOC's symbol, which is no surprize, since the guitarist name is Buck DHARMA, and its fairly well known that Stephen King is a big BOC fan, and since the producers already acknowledge Mr. King as a show influenence....it all ties together in one neat little X-Mas gift pack.

Posts like these are the exact reason why I keep up with this thread religiously. Thumbs up!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Has anyone considered that the psychic is dharma? And, that he orchestrated the so-called "miracle" to, in a chain of events, get Eko on the flight? (his "daughter" would've had to be in on the scam of course)

He also would've been responsible for getting Claire on that flight too (if this is the same psychic...I know he's a different one from Rose's), which is why I considered the possibility.

Posts like these are the exact reason why I keep up with this thread religiously. Thumbs up!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Has anyone considered that the psychic is dharma? And, that he orchestrated the so-called "miracle" to, in a chain of events, get Eko on the flight? (his "daughter" would've had to be in on the scam of course)

He also would've been responsible for getting Claire on that flight too (if this is the same psychic...I know he's a different one from Rose's), which is why I considered the possibility.

It also struck me that Libby was also DHARMA, and she just broke into the conversation between Eko and the miracle-girl in the airport to make sure that the girl was on track to get into Eko's mind. The nod that the girl gave seemed to be an indication that "I am in control.. he is taking the bait !!"

Rose went to a "healer" not a psychic. And the "psychic" admitted to Eko he was a fraud, which is like calling yourself a con man.

I'm confused about Eko's explaination as to why he believes it's important to keep pushing a button that does nothing. Just to have a purpose?

Also, considering what's going on between the losties and the others, woulden't you think it might be an idea to try to take control of as many of the bunkers as possible? Might'nt that give you an advantage?

So maybe we'll see a Libby flashback via an other, and not via Hurley?

Uh, doesn't Michael have some explaining to do about why AL was shot on the couch and not in the armoury? If she had gone to shoot fake Henry, wouldn't that all be taking place where he was locked up? If there had been a struggle for the gun, why wasn't there any furniture knocked over? It's pretty far fetched to assume that AL let Henry out of the armoury, let him get the jump on her with no sign of struggle and then sit down on the couch and get shot.

Wasn't the psychic's claim of being a fraud just a way to keep a lid on the whole "rising from the dead" thing?

Actually, It did look like BOC's symbol, which is no surprize, since the guitarist name is Buck DHARMA, and its fairly well known that Stephen King is a big BOC fan, and since the producers already acknowledge Mr. King as a show influenence....it all ties together in one neat little X-Mas gift pack.

Something that occurred to...
The punk band The Minutemen. Two of the members were named Boon and Hurley (I'm not sure how 3rd member Mike Watt fits into this) AND were influenced by Blue Oyster Cult (Mentioning Eric Bloom in a song, and covering "The Red and the Black").

Two of the members were named Boon and Hurley (I'm not sure how 3rd member Mike Watt fits into this)

Michael.....hmmmm......nope, doesn't ring a bell. ;)

Uh, doesn't Michael have some explaining to do about why AL was shot on the couch and not in the armoury? If she had gone to shoot fake Henry, wouldn't that all be taking place where he was locked up? If there had been a struggle for the gun, why wasn't there any furniture knocked over? It's pretty far fetched to assume that AL let Henry out of the armoury, let him get the jump on her with no sign of struggle and then sit down on the couch and get shot.

It was implied in the previews for next week's show that Michael's story will start to fall apart and he will fall under suspicion, possibly for some of the incongruities you mention.

An interesting question is whether Michael is considered "good" or "bad" by the Others, especially now that he, too, has killed. And would the possible fact that he killed under Others' pressure affect that judgement?

It's looking more like the losties are rats in a maze; part of an experiment, under observation. But that raises more questions in my mind about The Others. The Others have represented a real threat to the losties, even a mortal threat. That doesn't fit the experiment model, in my way of thinking.

Why does she have to be alive to have a back story??? She may not be gone, but she's dead.

How can Hurley find out about their past if she is now dead? What relevance can her former insanity have to their current situation if she is now dead?

How did Locke know Eko's brother's name in his dream? The island will tell him.

It also struck me that Libby was also DHARMA, and she just broke into the conversation between Eko and the miracle-girl in the airport to make sure that the girl was on track to get into Eko's mind. The nod that the girl gave seemed to be an indication that "I am in control.. he is taking the bait !!"It seems to me that they've just done a masterful job with the Libby character because she's such a big question mark. It would be totally believable that she would intervene when witnessing a large, imposing man going off on a small young girl. They have shown her to be an apparent person of compassion in numerous instances... Then again, there are the possible indications that there could be something else more sinister going on there too. And that could be totally believable as well... I'm really looking forward to finding out more about Eko's motivation/feelings regarding his new found purpose and how it all relates. It's definitely a bit puzzling at this point to me as well.

And I could swear I saw Libby breathing there after her apparent "death" ;) :D


ron

...And I could swear I saw Libby breathing there after her apparent "death" ;) :D


ron
Yes! I noticed this too, her chest was clearly moving up and down, I thought maybe it was just bad acting, but...

Michael.....hmmmm......nope, doesn't ring a bell. ;)


Yeah, I know.
It seemed a little too obvious
Anyway, Hurley and Boon are/were the last names of the band members.

Anyone else think that the cameras caught the whole Michael shooting, and that someone else may have been in the monitoring station to observe it? Like maybe the "others" told him to do it, and that they would watch from a remote station to verify that he is on their side?

"My thought was that it was a different flight. Didn't he also have his priest uniform on in that scene? After the crash, he had on a business suit. On the other hand, maybe he borrowed Zeke's beard."

I had the same thought as well. When the "dead" girl showed up I assumed that he would bail out on the flight and ultimately end up on the same fligh (number) on a different date, giving him time to change clothes and grow facial hair.

When Libby showed up, it seems as though that possibility went out the window.

So, does anyone have screen caps from the Eko crash/beach scene episode?

Nope, no beard on the beach, and he was wearing his suit at the airport.

That actually says it for the season finale and I'm sure he said Wickman in this episode. But that still fits in the whole Candle theme. Candle, Wax, Wick.

What was the date of the Swan Orientation film? The Pearl Orientation videotape was dated 1980 and "Wickman" appeared to have both arms intact. In the Swan Orientation film "Candle" appeared to have a prosthesis for his left (I believe) arm.

Cells begin to die almost immediately w/out oxygen, etc.
yes, but if you look closely, right after she died and JAck closed her eyes, they pulled away and Hurley was holding her hand and crying and you could see her breathe.

Could be a production error, but for the most part, production errors on this hsow tend to be on purpose.


Why don't they send a stick of dynamite though the tube and wait to see where it blows up? :D

Why don't they send a stick of dynamite though the tube and wait to see where it blows up? :D

<Guinness voice>
Brilliant!!!
</Guinness voice>

:D

Why don't they send a stick of dynamite though the tube and wait to see where it blows up? :DDude, that is the absolute best idea to date!!!!! Just need a long fuse!

As far as Libby breathing is concerned, everybody knows she wasn't REALLY dead - she has a new series. :p

I am confused about something, in Locke's dream, Eko climbed the cliff, just like in the dream. In the dream, Eko fell off the top, but didn't fall off after the actual climb. What's that about? Why didn't Locke tell Eko about the fall when Eko started to climb for real? Why does this show make you question everything? Why do I keep hearing voices?

So right there, when Libby mentioned Michael's name, they should have picked up on it (or maybe they'll figure it out next episode), that Libby wouldnt have known aobut Michael being shot if she was already unconscious.
Libby didn't know Michael was back. So for her to say his name first only meant that she recognized Michael and it was the last thing she remembered when she went into a coma, ergo the first thing she spoke when she came out.

Why don't they send a stick of dynamite though the tube and wait to see where it blows up? :D


Can you imagine the reaction of the guy at the other end? :eek:

Of course, the dynamite is so unstable, it probably wouldn't survive the whole trip being banged around in the tube.

<Guinness voice>
Brilliant!!!
</Guinness voice>
Are you referring to the girl that does the PTI voiceovers. I wonder if she is hot? ;)

Are you referring to the girl that does the PTI voiceovers. I wonder if she is hot? ;)
I believe it's a reference to the commercials with the two animated guys that invent ordinary stuff.

Another DUMB theory:

All of the characters on the island are merely clones, only they don't know they're clones. All the memories of the "parent" person, and a few concocted ones have been placed in the clone's brains.

The 'real' characters are observing their own potential behavior under extremely stressful and obviously manipulated conditions in order to improve themselves in real life. Kind of a cross between "The Game" and "The Island".

That will explain how Walt ages a year in a month, clones age faster. That is why Locke can walk and Rose doesn't have cancer.

Dumb, maybe not so dumb.

Sorry dude, we hashed this out a while back....some ppl jumped on board my theory...but even I'm doubtful now :-)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=4828119&highlight=clone#post4828119

I believe it's a reference to the commercials with the two animated guys that invent ordinary stuff.
OK, I think i remember the commercial*. On PTI, Guinness is a sponsor and this girl says the "Brilliant" line as well.

Disclaimer: I have a TiVo, so I watch very few commercials. :D

yes, but if you look closely, right after she died and Jack closed her eyes, they pulled away and Hurley was holding her hand and crying and you could see her breathe.

Could be a production error, but for the most part, production errors on this hsow tend to be on purpose.


While Libby, the LOST character, is absolutely, positively, most assuredly dead, Cynthia Watros, the very-much-alive actress, continues to have this pesky habit of having to breath. (David Blane she ain't.) I'm sure she was trying to be as still as possible; don't think I'd go so far as to call that a production error. ;)

Does no one care about thiese or did no one else figure it out.

Also, I tried to call the phone number for hours and only got abusy signal, anyone know what the Hansoorg phone number connects you to?

At the hansofoundation.org site you need to go sign up for the newsletter. You can enter any name you want and hit next. At the next screen you need to enter a password which is "breaking strain" and then hit next. You might have to keep clicking on next or reenter the password because the screen deteriorates on purpose. You will know you got it when you see a greenscreen dialogue of persephene logging in.

You then need to go to the bios, specifically Mittlewerk. There, within the text of the bio, you will see a text box. There you enter "heir apparent" and enter.

You should then see a dark misshappen hole in the middle of the screen which shows a room with the back of a girl appearing in the hallway. Click on the girl, she turn's around and the picture closes fast on her face. Next a document from Caltech (Mittlewerks supposedly attended) shows up with lots of info (some names also that look familiar) and a red underline appears under a tuition heading. Click on the underline and some writing appears on the top of the paper saying they don't have a record of this guy (I'm assuming Mittlewerk), with a voice quoting the last two written lines, "why does he call himself a doctor" and "who is this clown?".

After some more of you see it, we could perhaps go back and forth on the names, people and perhaps who the girl might be.

Great, I've become a victim of an early DVR cut off. I have my Lost series recording set up to record 2 minutes after the scheduled recording and this is the first time I've had a problem. My DVR cut off when Jack was in the bathroom, after Sawyer was comforting Kate... can someone tell me what happened from that point til the end?

I've changed the recording options to record friggin 10 minutes after. I swear they do this just to screw with people with DVRs.

Mine has never cut off, and I don't pad the ending at all...Perhaps it's an issue with your local affiliate? Or perhaps it's your DVR. (I have an HD DirecTivo...always get the full ep, including the trailers for next week...)

First, with Libby saying "Michael".... When Michael first described to everyone what happened, didn't he say he heard the gunshots first, then got out of the bedroom and the two women were already shot before Henry shot him and then ran out.... So right there, when Libby mentioned Michael's name, they should have picked up on it (or maybe they'll figure it out next episode), that Libby wouldnt have known aobut Michael being shot if she was already unconscious.

That's what I thought after last week's episode. How could AL open the the vault and get shot on the couch, Libby get shot 10 ft away, but Michael comes in last and gets shot while in the vault?

And since Libby didn't know Michael was back, there's no reason for his name to be the first thing she said when she came to. I believe Michael said that the girls were shot before he got into the room. His timeline doesn't work.

Why don't they send a stick of dynamite though the tube and wait to see where it blows up?


Probably because the jolt as it begins to accelerate up the tube would set it off immediately, killing everyone in the "pearl" bunker in the explosion!


What, you want Arzt part Deux?

:)

First, with Libby saying "Michael".... When Michael first described to everyone what happened, didn't he say he heard the gunshots first, then got out of the bedroom and the two women were already shot before Henry shot him and then ran out.... So right there, when Libby mentioned Michael's name, they should have picked up on it (or maybe they'll figure it out next episode), that Libby wouldnt have known aobut Michael being shot if she was already unconscious.

They trust Michael and they don't trust Henry, so they are not in the frame of mind to question Michael's story or piece together what happened. There are other things that don't make sense if they thought about it... For example Ana Lucia being shot on the couch and Libby being shot right there in the hallway. How could Henry Gale have escaped the armory, stolen Ana Lucia's gun, then manage to shoot them when they are seemingly not expecting it. Had Michael's story been real, you'd expect that Henry would have overpowered Ana Lucia in the armory and shot her there.

I'm sure later someone will start questioning what happened.

Mine has never cut off, and I don't pad the ending at all...Perhaps it's an issue with your local affiliate? Or perhaps it's your DVR. (I have an HD DirecTivo...always get the full ep, including the trailers for next week...)

That's right; it's a local schedule issue. I have an SA8300HD-DVR from TWC and the program guide always has the correct start/stop times for every prime-time show, and I've never had a problem. All any DVR can do is follow the guide info fed to it.

What was the date of the Swan Orientation film? The Pearl Orientation videotape was dated 1980 and "Wickman" appeared to have both arms intact. In the Swan Orientation film "Candle" appeared to have a prosthesis for his left (I believe) arm.
According to TV.com, 1980 as well :confused:

Then again, I'm looking at the summary for "?" and someone put in they though he called himself Dr. Wendhall.

Edit: wikipedia agrees with the date, but they agree with me that he called himself Dr. Wickman.

Edit2: Yep, watched the Swan video and it is 1980 at the end.

They trust Michael and they don't trust Henry, so they are not in the frame of mind to question Michael's story or piece together what happened. There are other things that don't make sense if they thought about it...

I'm sure later someone will start questioning what happened.


The way Michael shot himself was a very odd angle (assuming someone else would have shot him). Was Michael even treated for a gunshot wound?

Regarding the stick-o-dynamite idea: If the thing didn't blow up upon being jostled in the tube, the vacuum would extinguish the fuse. Either way, it would provide no clue as to the terminus location.

Regarding Libby's chest movement, post-mortem: Stop staring, ya pervs! ;)

http://img417.imageshack.us/img417/4552/times9vs.jpg

Well, it's not Modified Julian Date (MJD) because 41602 would be "October 12, 1972", but the orientation video was dated 1980.

MJD calculator: http://www.csgnetwork.com/julianmodifdateconv.html

National Time Service formats: http://tf.nist.gov/service/its.htm
Well, I'm certain on the right side at least since the difference is 1 hr 48 mins (or the 108 minutes on the clock).

The way Michael shot himself was a very odd angle (assuming someone else would have shot him). Was Michael even treated for a gunshot wound?
Yeah, he had a sling on his arm.

Why does old technology mean the bunker was abandonded?

I was saying the dust and overal disorder of the hatch made it look like it has been abandonded...also the fact that it was covered by the plane (which we know fell recently) and buried before that, suggests that no-one has been down there since hte Losties landed/crashed on the island


How do we know that the Pearl is actually the Skinner Box, and that the button in the Swan actually does something? If the "teams" are lied to in the orientation film for the Swan, why are we so sure that the Pearl film is accurate?

We have not been given answers, what we have been given is more questions!

Aint this fun!

Thats what I'm saying...They could all be experiments tied together in a complex experiment...whether or not the button does something or not, is still at question

http://newspaperads.philly.com/rop/ads.aspx?advid=408750&adid=2947506&cat=5804

That's what I thought after last week's episode. How could AL open the the vault and get shot on the couch, Libby get shot 10 ft away, but Michael comes in last and gets shot while in the vault?

And since Libby didn't know Michael was back, there's no reason for his name to be the first thing she said when she came to. I believe Michael said that the girls were shot before he got into the room. His timeline doesn't work.

It's obvious that his story of the events won't hold up to scrutiny, but he's probably counting on the other Losties being moved to action without stopping to think it through.

It's obvious that his story of the events won't hold up to scrutiny, but he's probably counting on the other Losties being moved to action without stopping to think it through.

yeah remember, they're main suspect is now missing and Jack is trying to save Libbys life...they haven't had much time to think about the timeline of it all...I'm sure they will start to question it once things get settled (relatively)

As far as Libby breathing is concerned, everybody knows she wasn't REALLY dead - she has a new series. :p

I am confused about something, in Locke's dream, Eko climbed the cliff, just like in the dream. In the dream, Eko fell off the top, but didn't fall off after the actual climb. What's that about? Why didn't Locke tell Eko about the fall when Eko started to climb for real? Why does this show make you question everything? Why do I keep hearing voices?

I think in Locke's dream he was dreaming that he was Ecko. In the dream Ecko was limping like Locke would and when he reached the top Ecko's brother looked at him and said "Wake up, John" So in the dream Ecko didn't fall, Locke did.

http://newspaperads.philly.com/rop/ads.aspx?advid=408750&adid=2947506&cat=5804

You know, when they start doing things like this, people are going to start believing there really IS a Hanso Foundation!

Sometimes what starts out as a small joke turns into an even bigger one. It is almost as good as the controversy over the reported use of dihydrogen monoxide by some famous athletes.

While Libby, the LOST character, is absolutely, positively, most assuredly dead, Cynthia Watros, the very-much-alive actress, continues to have this pesky habit of having to breath. (David Blane she ain't.) I'm sure she was trying to be as still as possible; don't think I'd go so far as to call that a production error. ;)

As a living person, she will likely continue to blink and move her mouth, too, but they didn't have her do that in the sequence where she supposedly died. Shortly thereafter, in what was at most a 2 second shot, you would think she could manage to stay in character (dead) for that amount of time. Unless of course they wanted to foreshadow something or just give us debate fodder.

I thought the Swan video was 5 years after the Pearl. 1985. I believe Mr. Candle made a reference about an “incident” that occurred at the Swan 5 years earlier (the video w/ the fake arm) and in the Pearl Video he has both arms. So in the Pearl video they made it sound like the reason the Swan participants were doing exercises because they thought it was important and the Pearl was there to observe (hint a maze with no cheese). However, this was 5 years before the incident so maybe the button pushing at the Swan is important like Ecko and his brother said. So it’s possible, Candle/Waxman lost his arm in this incident at the Swan.

That's what I thought after last week's episode. How could AL open the the vault and get shot on the couch, Libby get shot 10 ft away, but Michael comes in last and gets shot while in the vault?

And since Libby didn't know Michael was back, there's no reason for his name to be the first thing she said when she came to. I believe Michael said that the girls were shot before he got into the room. His timeline doesn't work.So you assume that getting shot immediately makes one unconscious then? Think again. There's nothing inherently wrong with the timeline of his story and it could quite easily work. Many of the other details may not add up though. Maybe after they all calm down a bit and send in the resident Island CSI they may begin to question things more closely. Then again, since it's LOST, maybe they won't ;).


ron

. Shortly thereafter, in what was at most a 2 second shot, you would think she could manage to stay in character (dead) for that amount of time. Unless of course they wanted to foreshadow something or just give us debate fodder.
That was my point. It was a very short shot, so she should have been able to hold her breath for its duration.

Again it could have just been a production error, but most of Lost's "production errors" are there for a reason.

As for what enlightenment a Libby backstory might tell us... if Libby is Dharma and was a plant in the mental hospital as opposed to a real patient, that would be significant.

More and more inconsistencies likely to catch up with Michael at some point...
o Where is the gun he originally left with?
o Mr. Friendly told Jack and crew that Michael wouldn't find them.
o If the Others normally wear regular clothes (Claire's flashbacks), but dress in costume for the "benefit" of the Losties (Kate find in medical hatch which Jack now knows about), Michael only saw what the Others wanted him to see.

It all makes me think he was captured and bribed/brainwashed/programmed to release Henry and maybe more (deliver certain Losties to the Others). AL and Libby were just collateral damage to keep him from being exposed before he could complete his mission.

That was my point. It was a very short shot, so she should have been able to hold her breath for its duration.

Again it could have just been a production error, but most of Lost's "production errors" are there for a reason.

What ended up on screen after editing was 2 seconds. Shooting the scene itself likely took considerably longer and the poor girl had to breathe. It's a non-issue, just as Ethan's slight chest movement was after he was shot, and I think that discussion took 2 pages worth of bandwidth. Nothing to see here folks, move along....

At the hansofoundation.org site you need to go sign up for the newsletter. You can enter any name you want and hit next. At the next screen you need to enter a password which is "breaking strain" and then hit next. You might have to keep clicking on next or reenter the password because the screen deteriorates on purpose. You will know you got it when you see a greenscreen dialogue of persephene logging in.

You then need to go to the bios, specifically Mittlewerk. There, within the text of the bio, you will see a text box. There you enter "heir apparent" and enter.

You should then see a dark misshappen hole in the middle of the screen which shows a room with the back of a girl appearing in the hallway. Click on the girl, she turn's around and the picture closes fast on her face. Next a document from Caltech (Mittlewerks supposedly attended) shows up with lots of info (some names also that look familiar) and a red underline appears under a tuition heading. Click on the underline and some writing appears on the top of the paper saying they don't have a record of this guy (I'm assuming Mittlewerk), with a voice quoting the last two written lines, "why does he call himself a doctor" and "who is this clown?".

After some more of you see it, we could perhaps go back and forth on the names, people and perhaps who the girl might be.

typing "breaking strain" doesnt allow you to click the "next" button.... hitting enter after typing that password makes the site say "gotta go" and it resets itself back to the newsletter signup screen to enter a screenname. any ideas?

http://lax.war3.com/Lost/snapshot20060511165904.jpg

it looks as if one of the ceiling tiles is missing....am I just grasping at straws? or could that be significant?

Also, from the JayandJack site, a few people have checked the Gary Troup videos and have found that the actor in the videos (the interview videos with Gary Troup) is the same as the guy who got sucked into the turbine in the Pilot...I think a few here were questioning whether Gary Troup is dead or not...guess he is

I kind of want to read Bad Twin now...jesus christ, this marketing is ridiculous

As a living person, she will likely continue to blink and move her mouth, too, but they didn't have her do that in the sequence where she supposedly died. Shortly thereafter, in what was at most a 2 second shot, you would think she could manage to stay in character (dead) for that amount of time. Unless of course they wanted to foreshadow something or just give us debate fodder.You know, when I first mentioned her breathing this morning I put a winky after it because I just knew some people would want to attach some meaning to it. I'm sure she's dead. Whether it was a simple production mistake that another "take" should have fixed, or if they did it purposely to rile up all the conspiracy theorists is the question. It was so obvious that I think they did it on purpose myself. They wouldn't do that would they? ;)


ron

it looks as if one of the ceiling tiles is missing....am I just grasping at straws? or could that be significant?

Very significant when it comes to re-sale value. :)

You know, when I first mentioned her breathing this morning I put a winky after it because I just knew some people would want to attach some meaning to it. I'm sure she's dead. Whether it was a simple production mistake that another "take" should have fixed, or if they did it purposely to rile up all the conspiracy theorists is the question. It was so obvious that I think they did it on purpose myself. They wouldn't do that would they? ;)


ron

Um, no. They're not that anal. Us, however.... :rolleyes: :)

You folks just cannot get off Libby's chest, can you? So to speak...

You folks just cannot get off Libby's chest, can you? So to speak...

I would get off on Libby's chest...

lol too easy

At the very end of last night's episode when Michael was standing in the back of the armory with a crazed look on his face, was there a body next to him on the bed covered with a blanket? I thought I caught a glimpse but don't have Tivo / DVR to check it out.

Not sure how you're getting that, I'm not really sure how to interpret what was on it.

http://kjordan.net/printoutthumb.jpg (http://kjordan.net/printout.jpg)



I haven't seen anyone explain it this way, but I think it's as simple as showing the number of hours and minutes that have expired since the beginning of the experiment. I think this because the clock countsdown from 1hr8min, and each number on the printout increases by 1:08. So the last number we can see on this screenshot of the printout is 41602090:05. So for this we'll ignore the minutes after the :, so that leaves us with 41602090 hours, divide that by 24 for hours in the day, and then by 365 for days in the year...and that leaves us with roughly 4749 years that the experiment has been going on? That doesn't sound right, but all my calculations are correct...aren't they? Or maybe it's not the number of hours and minutes that it's showing, because I swear when I started writing this the numbers increased by 1:08, and now they're increasing by 1:48, the producers must have changed something :p . Ok I've been looking at them for too long, I knew I was right at the beginning, I forgot that 108min is 1:48. hahahahahaha

At the very end of last night's episode when Michael was standing in the back of the armory with a crazed look on his face, was there a body next to him on the bed covered with a blanket? I thought I caught a glimpse but don't have Tivo / DVR to check it out.

I believe that was AL.

Well, yes, but the place shouldn't be so dusty if it was inhabited recently. And I'm not sure Eko took back any notebooks, it was mostly loose paper which was probably printouts.
My place is inhabited daily, and it's *plenty* dusty. ;)

Um, no. They're not that anal. Us, however.... :rolleyes: :)Oh, I think maybe so. Nothing anal on their part IMO though. More like mischievous. It was so obvious that to me it would seem to have been pretty hard to miss in the editing process. I don't know that they would have actually "planned" it per se. But I could definitely see them in the editing process after noticing it saying, "Aww heck. Let's just leave it in. Should be good to stir the pot a little", and then having a good laugh over it.


ron

So what do you guys think they were looking at off-shore in the previews? Somebody opening up a bio-dome door in the sky? Maybe a second sun rising? ;)
The Statue of Liberty, half buried in sand on the beach... ;)

I haven't seen anyone explain it this way, but I think it's as simple as showing the number of hours and minutes that have expired since the beginning of the experiment. I think this because the clock countsdown from 1hr8min, and each number on the printout increases by 1:08. So the last number we can see on this screenshot of the printout is 41602090:05. So for this we'll ignore the minutes after the :, so that leaves us with 41602090 hours, divide that by 24 for hours in the day, and then by 365 for days in the year...and that leaves us with roughly 4749 years that the experiment has been going on? That doesn't sound right, but all my calculations are correct...aren't they? Or maybe it's not the number of hours and minutes that it's showing, because I swear when I started writing this the numbers increased by 1:08, and now they're increasing by 1:48, the producers must have changed something :p .
The timer is every 108 minutes or 1 hour and 48 minutes. It certainly does seem that the 3 numbers before the colon do keep track of hours since I looked at the part after that where they do a real closeup and it goes up to 12 and it does seem to rollover correctly. But then real question is is the 41602 also a part of the hours? Because like you said, that means 4749 years :eek:

Mine cut off right as she opened her eyes and looked like she was going to say something? What happened next?

I keep adding an additional minute each week to the DVR and STILL it gets cut off!
I had my DVR set to 10:05 and it still cut off some.

typing "breaking strain" doesnt allow you to click the "next" button.... hitting enter after typing that password makes the site say "gotta go" and it resets itself back to the newsletter signup screen to enter a screenname. any ideas?

You just have to keep at it. Eventually it will let you in. I had to enter it a couple times and keep clicking where I knew the next button was until it let me in.

Having said that, I never encountered what you report. However, when I went back to do it again I got different messages saying I had already logged in and new greenscreen messages saying nothing has changed and to check back later. I guess there is a cookie placed in your computer.

Nevertheless, I was still able to go to the bio of Mittlewerk and enter the "heir apparent" password and have the next video show up.

As a matter of fact, I just went back in and went straight to the bio site, entered the password and it showed the next video/steps. I guess that confirms the cookie in your computer.

More and more inconsistencies likely to catch up with Michael at some point...
o Where is the gun he originally left with?
o Mr. Friendly told Jack and crew that Michael wouldn't find them.
o If the Others normally wear regular clothes (Claire's flashbacks), but dress in costume for the "benefit" of the Losties (Kate find in medical hatch which Jack now knows about), Michael only saw what the Others wanted him to see.



Perhaps Michael found other others. With the balloon, Desmond, Rousseau, the drug plane and 815, it is possible that another group of castaways exist on the island.

In the preview, it appears that we're getting a bit of Michael's "what really happened" backstory though.

In the preview, it appears that we're getting a bit of Michael's "what really happened" backstory though.Agreed.

I'm on Comcast and I got the whole episode + previews.


Comcast Los Angeles. Cut out right after she opened her eyes.

It seems to me that I would check all entries that accepted didn't appear. In all those years it had to happen and Locke would know for sure if Henry pushed it.


I haven't seen anyone explain it this way, but I think it's as simple as showing the number of hours and minutes that have expired since the beginning of the experiment. I think this because the clock countsdown from 1hr8min, and each number on the printout increases by 1:08. So the last number we can see on this screenshot of the printout is 41602090:05. So for this we'll ignore the minutes after the :, so that leaves us with 41602090 hours, divide that by 24 for hours in the day, and then by 365 for days in the year...and that leaves us with roughly 4749 years that the experiment has been going on? That doesn't sound right, but all my calculations are correct...aren't they? Or maybe it's not the number of hours and minutes that it's showing, because I swear when I started writing this the numbers increased by 1:08, and now they're increasing by 1:48, the producers must have changed something :p . Ok I've been looking at them for too long, I knew I was right at the beginning, I forgot that 108min is 1:48. hahahahahaha

It seems to me that I would check all entries that accepted didn't appear. In all those years it had to happen and Locke would know for sure if Henry pushed it.

The numbers also can't be a date, if it's going by day, because if it changes every 1h48hm, then after 13 of the numbers, one of the beginning numbers should changed because it would then be the next day.

Another BOC connection?... Oyster -> Pearl

http://newspaperads.philly.com/rop/ads.aspx?advid=408750&adid=2947506&cat=5804

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/5650/hanso6oj.gif

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=namastenamaste - a bow and gesture of greeting or parting with the palms together in front of the chest; also, expressing respect through this gesture and bow
Etymology: Sanskrit `homage; bowing to you'
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=sanskritSan-skrit - An ancient Indic language that is the language of Hinduism and the Vedas and is the classical literary language of India.

Maybe the extra digits in the log are just an indication/encoding of which button in which hatch:
41hhhhhh:mm
Hatch #4, Button #1?
hhhhhh=602072 would still be 68 years, though.

Both Locke and now Eko have been "fed" special dreams, shortly after they contacted the smoke monster/Cerberus. I'm guessing it still has some mental contact with them, and for some reason wanted to guide them to that Pearl hatch...Aromatherapy? You heard it here first...




Oh, I think maybe so. Nothing anal on their part IMO though. More like mischievous. It was so obvious that to me it would seem to have been pretty hard to miss in the editing process. I don't know that they would have actually "planned" it per se. But I could definitely see them in the editing process after noticing it saying, "Aww heck. Let's just leave it in. Should be good to stir the pot a little", and then having a good laugh over it.Like Shannons' bodybag appearing to twitch when Sayid threw dirt onto it.

It seems to me that I would check all entries that accepted didn't appear. In all those years it had to happen and Locke would know for sure if Henry pushed it.

That's the first thing I thought when I saw the printout. Check to see if Henry pushed the button!

Perhaps Michael found other others. With the balloon, Desmond, Rousseau, the drug plane and 815, it is possible that another group of castaways exist on the island.

Yeah, I think there are at least two other groups besides the Losties. There's the Zeke/Ethan group and the ragged clothes/kids with teddy bear group.
There also may be other individuals on their own like rousseau. Plus, what happened to Desmond?

Comcast Los Angeles. Cut out right after she opened her eyes.
I think the episode was 65 minutes long. It was going to be 61 minutes long according to zap2it and other sources. I had a two minute pad. That cut off the last two minutes.