In USA Today's recap, it said that AAA asked to be written off the show. Both his parents died last year and he wanted to return to London and work on a film.
Ok...that makes me feel a lot better.

Not better that his parents died, of course, but about Eko...

~Dan

Anyone notice that Jack asked Ben if his "neck hurt, any numbness in your fingers and toes?" Jack said in the previous epi that the tumor was at L4. For those symptoms to occur he would have to have a cervical vertebral tumor. Not really important, just an observation.
I thought the X-rays showed the tumor in his neck. Are you sure he didn't say C-4? L-4 would cause the toe problem due to sciatica inflammation.

I thought the X-rays showed the tumor in his neck. Are you sure he didn't say C-4? L-4 would cause the toe problem due to sciatica inflammation.

I'm pretty sure the xrays were of his lumbar spine.

I have a problem reconciling the Eko that apparently became a priest, was silent for weeks, and was building a church with the Eko of the last session's flashbacks that seemed acting in his own selfish interest thoughout, never feeling guilty even at the end. They don't seem like the same person. Did the writers have a brain fart or was all this just needed to get him off the show for a drunk driving arrest or contract dispute or something?

Though I liked seeing the pi$$ed off nano-giraffe finally do something dynamic.

- Tom

Eko went through some phases on the island.

First he was more in a survival mode after the crash.

Then as I recall he found his brother's body and the plane. This put him into church-building mode.

Then he gave up on the church plan when "Yemi" (actually smokey) appeared to him and sent him off on the button pushing idea.

Then finally after the button pushing was literally blown up by Locke he went back into his more natural "meanie" mode.

Random stuff...

- Juliette was crying in the opening scene of the first episode of this season (which intrigued me quite a bit).

- According to Ben, Ben just found out about the tumor two days before the plane crash.

- It is possible that the reason for Juliette's crying (and her effort to pull herself together and act normal) was because of the news of Ben's tumor.

- I don't think Juliette hates Ben as much as we've led to believe. I have a feeling that both Juliette and Ben are playing Jack and us.

Hong.

How did he and his brother come to be on the same island? Why did his 'brother' appear to him and appeal to him to keep pushing the button? Why did the monster spare him the first time yet kill him the 2nd?The plane, drug-filled statues and Yemi's supposed-body were all staged on the island (IMO). The Others somehow know as much about Eko as they know about Jack. The question is; who would go through so much trouble to track the lives of the Losties, and why? We know they have intell on Jack's life and likely Desmond, per season 2's ending.




Some have theorized that the smoke monster is a type of defense system. Whether it is defending the Dharma stations or something else is not clear, but some have also theorized that its name is Cerberus which was on the blast door map, and in mythology is a guard type being.I believe the smoke cannot read minds, but rather invokes memories via (don't laugh) aromatherapy, or something. Could also be giving the Losties a whiff of some sort of mind-altering drug. Perhaps the vaccine is immunity to the smoke monster.

A big shout-out to the AVSr (petergaryr?) who first suggested nano-technology. The producers debunked that theory, but I'm still holding onto it....especially after Eko's demise. His spotlight-eps were the ones that always picked the show up when it dragged a bit.

The plane, drug-filled statues and Yemi's supposed-body were all staged on the island (IMO).


I think that is the big question...did the others know the plane was going to crash and who would be on it.

On one hand, assuming they knew, then yes, they could have set up the plane, statues and Yemi. Ben saying that he found out about the tumor 2-days before a spinal surgeon falls from the sky would all be a set up.

On the other hand, if they didn't know...what are the odds that Eko would crash on the same island as Yemi? Also, if they didn't know, then we could take Ben's words as the truth...he truly was amazed a spinal surgeon fell from the sky.

I'll expound on my "all in the mind of Leonard" theory. Leonard reads in the institution. He reads the books that we see and are mentioned on the show. He weaves/creates the story (LOST) out of pieces of each of the books he reads. At the end of the show you'll see him with all of these books around him and they'll possibly show him writing his own book, the name of which will be... 'LOST". OR... could the show be a concoction of the book club members? Hmmm...

I hope we don't have 2 more characters whose flashbacks we have to sludge through.

I don’t think we have to worry about that. I suspect their life expectancy will be very short. :)

One can only hope!

Right. cough.Are you just mocking me? :p Or do you really think they'll just leave all those questions unanswered? How did any of them end up there? Why have several of them seen "apparitions"? What makes Smokey do what it does? Those are all major question that apply to the whole island not just Eko. I don't doubt that there will be some smaller questions that go unanswered. But so far it seems to me they've spent a lot of time and effort integrating this whole story. I just don't see them not answering the bigger questions and Eko doesn't need to be alive for them to do it. One thing I think we can say for certain though. Whatever the answers they eventually end up giving us are, some people are not going to be happy with them ;).

I have a problem reconciling the Eko that apparently became a priest, was silent for weeks, and was building a church with the Eko of the last session's flashbacks that seemed acting in his own selfish interest thoughout, never feeling guilty even at the end. They don't seem like the same person. Did the writers have a brain fart or was all this just needed to get him off the show for a drunk driving arrest or contract dispute or something?If I'm understanding your post correctly, the flashbacks from last night showed Eko right after his brother was shot and flown off on the plane. It would seem that his "conversion" happened at some point after that (and before he got to the island). I kinda think there will be some more flashbacks of Eko that fill in a little more of his backstory at some point probably.

for rezzy: Aromatherapy? Now that's an explanation I wouldn't be happy with :D. That's just not sinister enough for Smokey...


ron

One can only hope!


they can off the guy- but some eye candy needs to take shannon's place.

;)

I thought the X-rays showed the tumor in his neck. Are you sure he didn't say C-4? L-4 would cause the toe problem due to sciatica inflammation.

I just double checked and he did say L4, but actually the radiograph lesion looks to be at L2. Never the less it's not important. Carry on.

I just double checked and he did say L4, but actually the radiograph lesion looks to be at L2. Never the less it's not important. Carry on. :)

I believe the smoke cannot read minds, but rather invokes memories via (don't laugh) aromatherapy, or something. Could also be giving the Losties a whiff of some sort of mind-altering drug. Perhaps the vaccine is immunity to the smoke monster.


so the smoke monster farts and the losties trip out. :D sorry i couldnt resist. As much as I am disappointed that the likelihood of this all being a prophecy or fate is becoming less and less reality, I cannot help but be puzzled by where they are going next.


it seems for them to have the surgery next week would be way too soon, but thats the only cliffhanger i could think of, besides them running into the scary guy with one eye.

The plane, drug-filled statues and Yemi's supposed-body were all staged on the island (IMO). The Others somehow know as much about Eko as they know about Jack.
. . .

I believe the smoke cannot read minds, but rather invokes memories.
Here's my thought:

The Others have a great deal of information about our Losties because they come from countries where such information is routinely collected and stored--medical records, bank records, ATM transactions, etc. The VA can lose a single laptop computer, and suddenly the Social Security numbers of tens of thousands of veterans are compromised. The amount of available information out there is overwhelming.

Then along comes Eko. Who is he? Where did he come from? What's his Social Security number? Guess what...he has no financial records; he has no medical records; there's no record of him at all, except for an airline ticket issued to a priest from Nigeria. To the data collection spooks, Eko is an *unperson*.

The Others claim to know who among the Losties is Good, and who is Bad. But they know nothing about Eko.

So, how do they find out?

Easy--they have their security system run a brain scan on Eko.

After analyzing the data, there's some question about his Good/Bad status. (He is--was--obviously, conflicted.) So the security system is tasked to find out if Eko regrets the Bad things he's done--by asking him to confess his sins (which then gives absolution)...

When he refuses to confess, and actually states that he has done nothing wrong, the security system's logic then decides that Eko is Bad. And then it completes its mission of eradicating Bad...

~Dan

That new chick is in the November issue of Maxim... what a hottie

And what about the research team in Antartica and Desmonds wife from the end of S2?

And what about the research team in Antartica and Desmonds wife from the end of S2?

they're going to be in the December issue of Maxim.

And what about the research team in Antartica and Desmonds wife from the end of S2?

they're saving that for Season 6....

The Others claim to know who among the Losties is Good, and who is Bad. But they know nothing about Eko.




I thought Eko was one of the tailies the Others tried to kidnap on their first night on the island....and didn't the infiltrator later tell AL that they only took (or in Eko's case, tried to take) the "good" ones?

Yeah, Nikki is kinda hot!

http://www.kielesanchez.net/pictures.html

Yeah, Nikki is kinda hot!

http://www.kielesanchez.net/pictures.html

and that was probably her entire audition review.

I thought Eko was one of the tailies the Others tried to kidnap on their first night on the island....and didn't the infiltrator later tell AL that they only took (or in Eko's case, tried to take) the "good" ones?
Didn't Goodwin tell Ana-Lucia that the Others probably wanted to take the strongest that first night to avoid any trouble?

The children weren't taken until the next raid...after Goodwin had submitted his list...

~Dan

I can't say I'll miss eco. I liked him at first, but his tendency to just barge in and do rash things without even making a tiny explanation to the other losties was just obnoxious. It didn't seem realistic that anybody would treat the guy as civilly as they did. SO I'm kinda glad the island beat him up. Interesting character, but they just made him a bit too extreme.

And if killing him makes room for a hot chick with fake boobs, I surely can't complain. The other girls on the show have nice faces and all, but this one has a SMOKIN bod! Ratings anyone?

On the other hand, if they didn't know...what are the odds that Eko would crash on the same island as Yemi?Slim to none. He fell for their phony island setup, but in reality, the plane probably never got out of africa. Yemi was shot right as it took off, so chances are good he actually died. Eko (IMO) really died for killing those Others in season 2 who were kidnapping the Losties.

He believed he was being judged for not repenting/confessing, but that was a head-game (illusions) induced by Smokey. BTW, I saw a brief interview where AAA hinted that his character could possibly return in flashbacks; I hope so.

or she's crying because her lover/husband/leader/whatever Benry just found out 2 days ago that he has a big honking tumor on his spine that she doesn't have the medical knowledge/ability to do anything about.

I still think they're a pair and are still playing Jack, even if he inadvertently saw the xrays. They simply adjusted their manipulation strategies.

That's a thought. But why the hostility towards Ben as they watched the plane go down? LOSTies weren't around to fake it then.

Kristin from EW (http://www.eonline.com/gossip/kristin/blog/index.jsp?uuid=01de5f6d-ba35-455f-9f9d-56064335fcb0&page=1) on LOST (her thoughts on Eko's demise, and some SPOILERAGE...beware)

I also noticed some of the background people talking about Mr.Eko at one point, made me realize that these folk actually seem to know what's going on--which makes it even funnier to me. They know about the adventures, the backstories etc, and still generally they are perpetually out of the action. We need a name for this group, I can't think of a clever one.


OK, lets have a name that group contest.

So far I've seen:

Frosties (I guess a derivation of forgotten Losties)

Innies and Outies

And I was going to throw out Lost Losties or Rosties (Red Shirt Losties...) but so far my vote goes to Frosties.

OK, lets have a name that group contest.

So far I've seen:

Frosties (I guess a derivation of forgotten Losties)

Innies and Outies

And I was going to throw out Lost Losties or Rosties (Red Shirt Losties...) but so far my vote goes to Frosties.

Losers.

Kristin from EW (http://www.eonline.com/gossip/kristin/blog/index.jsp?uuid=01de5f6d-ba35-455f-9f9d-56064335fcb0&page=1) on LOST (her thoughts on Eko's demise, and some SPOILERAGE...beware)

From Kristin's article: nobody's watching "LOST" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z_zVROAdLU)

This is classic!

~Dan

Yeah, Nikki is kinda hot!

http://www.kielesanchez.net/pictures.html

God bless you afrogt.

I'm surprised that so many dislike the two Background People being injected into some of the adventure. It's funny to me, in a way they're amateurs but somehow realistic, where the 'stars' are almost pro's in a way, yet constantly miss the freakin obvious. The woman noticed *all* the tv sets, only one signal--duh!. Even the guy did the plain and obvious thing--enjoyed a nice moment on a real toilet for the first time in months.

OK, lets have a name that group contest.


Ken and Barbie. ;)

OK, lets have a name that group contest.

So far I've seen:

Frosties (I guess a derivation of forgotten Losties)

Innies and Outies

And I was going to throw out Lost Losties or Rosties (Red Shirt Losties...) but so far my vote goes to Frosties.

AndTheRest (...cue Gilligan's Island tune...here on Losties Isle...)

OK, lets have a name that group contest.

So far I've seen:

Frosties (I guess a derivation of forgotten Losties)

Innies and Outies

And I was going to throw out Lost Losties or Rosties (Red Shirt Losties...) but so far my vote goes to Frosties.

I thought they were Frosties because they were always left out in the cold? :)

OK, lets have a name that group contest.

So far I've seen:

Frosties (I guess a derivation of forgotten Losties)

Innies and Outies

And I was going to throw out Lost Losties or Rosties (Red Shirt Losties...) but so far my vote goes to Frosties.

Lostettes?

Ken and Barbie. ;)

The Kens and Barbies!

Why is it the interesting characters (e.g. Eko, Ana Lucia) keep getting killed off while the boring ones (e.g. Jun, Sun, Charlie and Claire) remain?

Why is it the interesting characters (e.g. Eko, Ana Lucia) keep getting killed off while the boring ones (e.g. Jun, Sun, Charlie and Claire) remain?

We all wanted AL dead from day one, remember?; no one could stand her!

A big shout-out to the AVSr (petergaryr?) who first suggested nano-technology. The producers debunked that theory, but I'm still holding onto it....especially after Eko's demise. His spotlight-eps were the ones that always picked the show up when it dragged a bit.

Actually, I think that may have been me. (archie takes a little bow) :) There were several of us who had read "Prey" that started up the nanobot theory. I don't know which one of us was the very first, but it might have been me. I certainly don't care enough to go back and research it, though. ;) But, on behalf of peter, I'll gladly accept your shout-out. :D

And, regardless of the producers attempt to throw us off the track, I still maintain, like you rezzy, that a nanobot cloud is the only possible explanation that would have any relevance at all in the "real" world. And, clearly, the producers are trying to move the plotline more in that direction than in the fantasy/sci-fi direction.

We all wanted AL dead from day one, remember; no one could stand her!
She was one hard-ass bitch, but I sure did like her bod. :)

We all wanted AL dead from day one, remember; no one could stand her!Maybe that's why I "liked" her... I guess I can relate to her character. :rolleyes:

Really, what's the point with Claire? What happened to Desmond's girlfriend? Where is Rousseau? How long will the writers keep making up new story lines without tying anything together, because I don’t believe Lost is going to be around for a season 6 or 7 to finish its story arc.

Vir, "What do you want, you moon-faced assassin of joy?" (http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/guide/071.html)

From Kristin's article: nobody's watching "LOST" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z_zVROAdLU)

This is classic!

~Dan

haha thats awesome...wow Maggie Grace=hot


and Kristen is an idiot if she thinks JJ is still running the show or has anything to do with it...

What happened to Desmond's girlfriend?

I found it interesting when Ben told Jack that Juliet was selected to interrogate him because of her resemblance to Jack's ex-wife (Boy, that must be one thick dossier they have on Jack! Wonder if they know what his seventh grade sweetheart looks like, too?). Fact is, Desmond's g/f Penny looks even more like Juliet. Maybe they're all sisters! :D

Maybe that's why I "liked" her... I guess I can relate to her character. :rolleyes:

Aw, we like you Optivity!

From Kristin's article: nobody's watching "LOST" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z_zVROAdLU)

This is classic!

~DanClassic indeed... that's some really funny, wild & wacky stuff! :D

I forgot they had to kill off Shannon too :rolleyes:

I have a problem reconciling the Eko that apparently became a priest, was silent for weeks, and was building a church with the Eko of the last session's flashbacks that seemed acting in his own selfish interest thoughout, never feeling guilty even at the end. They don't seem like the same person.
- Tom

Tom, they do this constantly with the flashbacks - they show one flashback that portrays the character favorably, then show another flashback that shows the character negatively. Perhaps the point is to demonstrate that most people have good and bad sides, and need to ultimately make a choice to be one type of person or the other. Sounds like a bad Star Trek episode. ;)

Actually, I think that may have been me. (archie takes a little bow) :) There were several of us who had read "Prey" that started up the nanobot theory. I don't know which one of us was the very first, but it might have been me. I certainly don't care enough to go back and research it, though. ;) But, on behalf of peter, I'll gladly accept your shout-out. :D

And, regardless of the producers attempt to throw us off the track, I still maintain, like you rezzy, that a nanobot cloud is the only possible explanation that would have any relevance at all in the "real" world. And, clearly, the producers are trying to move the plotline more in that direction than in the fantasy/sci-fi direction.

I'm pretty sure it was you and/or CPANTHER who suggested Prey. I know when I saw the cover, then read the book I was amazed that the writers have debunked the nanobot theory.

In that book, the nanobots could assume any form including human. That seemed to be a good fit for why Jack's dad was on the island without it being a psychotic episode for him.

So, if it isn't nanobots, I can't wait to see what the writers are going to use as the explanation. One thing is certain: it ISN'T a pissed off giraffe. :D

I'm surprised that so many dislike the two Background People being injected into some of the adventure. It's funny to me, in a way they're amateurs but somehow realistic, where the 'stars' are almost pro's in a way, yet constantly miss the freakin obvious. The woman noticed *all* the tv sets, only one signal--duh!. Even the guy did the plain and obvious thing--enjoyed a nice moment on a real toilet for the first time in months.

That's a great thought - it's almost like the writers have given us viewers a couple of surrogates on the show. Kind of like, here's what we'd do if we were injected into the episodes: we'd actually notice the tv sets, or we'd actually use the toilet. :p

Interesting idea!

OK, lets have a name that group contest.

So far I've seen:

Frosties (I guess a derivation of forgotten Losties)

Innies and Outies

And I was going to throw out Lost Losties or Rosties (Red Shirt Losties...) but so far my vote goes to Frosties.
Well, I pick Frosties.

Frosties

I'm pretty sure it was you and/or CPANTHER who suggested Prey. I know when I saw the cover, then read the book I was amazed that the writers have debunked the nanobot theory.

In that book, the nanobots could assume any form including human. That seemed to be a good fit for why Jack's dad was on the island without it being a psychotic episode for him.

So, if it isn't nanobots, I can't wait to see what the writers are going to use as the explanation. One thing is certain: it ISN'T a pissed off giraffe. :D

I'm almost positive it was Archiguy. I know it wasn't me because I read Prey as a result of this thread. After reading it, I also became convinced it was the only explanation that would make sense.

Only two other possibilities:
1) They never actually explain the monster.
2) It was an hallucination and an outside observer would have seen Eko running himself into tree after tree like a pinball.

I'm sticking with the nanobots - in spite of any producer comments.

I'm almost positive it was Archiguy. I know it wasn't me because I read Prey as a result of this thread. After reading it, I also became convinced it was the only explanation that would make sense..


Only two other possibilities:


1) They never actually explain the monster.
I would have to personally hurt them

2) It was an hallucination and an outside observer would have seen Eko running himself into tree after tree like a pinball.

The even better trick would have been to lift himself up high into the trees then smash himself down to the ground, all the while making whistling and rattling sounds. Yeah, right. Not nanabots.


I'm sticking with the nanobots - in spite of any producer comments

Count me in.

I'll expound on my "all in the mind of Leonard" theory. Leonard reads in the institution. He reads the books that we see and are mentioned on the show. He weaves/creates the story (LOST) out of pieces of each of the books he reads. At the end of the show you'll see him with all of these books around him and they'll possibly show him writing his own book, the name of which will be... 'LOST". OR... could the show be a concoction of the book club members? Hmmm...


odd are that it will be a scratch-and-sniff children's pop-up book

[QUOTE=Aliens]Exactly right, nutty, and thanks for expanding on that. I should have inserted the overlap time period in my post so as not to confuse everyone.


Thanx, just thought people needed to know. There is much more invovled in a 28 days shoot per episode.

And, regardless of the producers attempt to throw us off the track, I still maintain, like you rezzy, that a nanobot cloud is the only possible explanation that would have any relevance at all in the "real" world. And, clearly, the producers are trying to move the plotline more in that direction than in the fantasy/sci-fi direction.
Not to rain on The Pulitzer Prize ceremony ;) :D , but the nanobot theory going on here is about as “real” as boobs on women in the 21st century. If nanobots aren’t remotely like fantasy/Sci-Fi portrays – and if it is assumed the producers want the show to stay “real” – then it can’t be nanotechnology. If, however, the producers are going in a fantasy/Sci-Fi direction, then any explanation outside of what current scientific study is aware of is possible and none of us will be able to solve the ‘puzzle.’ Is that cruel or unfair? I don’t know; it wouldn’t bother me one way or the other. But I don’t think a lot of what is happening on this show will turn out to be what anyone on this planet is familiar with from a "real" standpoint.

I’m leaning toward some ‘visions’ of the dead being of a holographic nature.

The popular idea of so-called nanobots, powerful and at risk of running wild, is not part of modern plans for building things “atom-by-atom” by molecular manufacturing. Studies indicate that most people don't know the difference between molecular manufacturing, nanoscale technology, and nanobots. Confusion about terms, fueled by science fiction, has distorted the truth about advanced nanotechnology. Nanobots are not needed for manufacturing, but continued misunderstanding may hinder research into highly beneficial technologies and discussion of the real dangers.

http://www.crnano.org/BD-Nanobots.htm

Not to rain on The Pulitzer Prize ceremony ;) :D , but the nanobot theory going on here is about as “real” as boobs on women in the 21st century. If nanobots aren’t remotely like fantasy/Sci-Fi portrays – and if it is assumed the producers want the show to stay “real” – then it can’t be nanotechnology.


Have you read "Prey" yet, Aliens? It's a typical Michael Crichton potboiler, follows his typical formula (at least until he morphed into a typical raving anti-global-warming lunatic in his last book). You can gobble it up in a few hours. You may have a different opinion once you've read it. Just sayin... ;)

Have you read "Prey" yet, Aliens? It's a typical Michael Crichton potboiler, follows his typical formula (at least until he morphed into a typical raving anti-global-warming lunatic in his last book). You can gobble it up in a few hours. You may have a different opinion once you've read it. Just sayin... ;)
Read a book, what? Are you crazy? what is a book? Were am I going to have time to "READ" a book between must watch TV shows, Heroes and Lost, reading these long threads(easily 6-10 pages per episode), and just being a plain old TV addict.

LOL

That book will be a movie sometime, I will read(watch) it then.

Not to rain on The Pulitzer Prize ceremony ;) :D , but the nanobot theory going on here is about as “real” as boobs on women in the 21st century. If nanobots aren’t remotely like fantasy/Sci-Fi portrays – and if it is assumed the producers want the show to stay “real” – then it can’t be nanotechnology. If, however, the producers are going in a fantasy/Sci-Fi direction, then any explanation outside of what current scientific study is aware of is possible and none of us will be able to solve the ‘puzzle.’ Is that cruel or unfair? I don’t know; it wouldn’t bother me one way or the other. But I don’t think a lot of what is happening on this show will turn out to be what anyone on this planet is familiar with from a "real" standpoint.

I’m leaning toward some ‘visions’ of the dead being of a holographic nature.



http://www.crnano.org/BD-Nanobots.htm

The fact of the matter is, the black smoke cloud, if it did pick Eko up and toss him around like a ragdoll (assuming it is not a hallucination), cannot be explained with present day technology. But nanobots are, indeed, theoretical, and it is posited that they will actually be able to do the things this monster can do--albeit in the far distant future, not today. The producers have said that their show is grounded in science, or pseudoscience. Of course, if you think about it--nothing is out of bounds under the title "Pseudoscience". Even the paranormal can be considered pseudoscience.

Neal Stephenson also has a book out on nanobots, which is much more interesting than Crichton's Prey:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Diamond_Age

Read a book, what? Are you crazy? what is a book? Were am I going to have time to "READ" a book between must watch TV shows, Heroes and Lost, reading these long threads(easily 6-10 pages per episode), and just being a plain old TV addict.

LOL

That book will be a movie sometime, I will read(watch) it then.

While my question wasn't directed at you, nutty, I can easily sympathize with your plight. I simply can't find the time to read anymore either because there's simply too much good frakkin' stuff on TV these days. I really miss sitting down with a juicy novel, though; that's one of life's great pleasures. :(

On the other hand, it's looking like most of the new shows I picked to watch this year are going to get cancelled, so that ought to free up some time! :D

So, by my recollection, Bernard is the only Tailie left. I found it amusing that the Eko character was going to London just as the actor that protrays him is.

The fact of the matter is, the black smoke cloud, if it did pick Eko up and toss him around like a ragdoll (assuming it is not a hallucination), cannot be explained with present day technology. But nanobots are, indeed, theoretical, and it is posited that they will actually be able to do the things this monster can do--albeit in the far distant future, not today. The producers have said that their show is grounded in science, or pseudoscience. Of course, if you think about it--nothing is out of bounds under the title "Pseudoscience". Even the paranormal can be considered pseudoscience.

Neal Stephenson also has a book out on nanobots, which is much more interesting than Crichton's Prey:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Diamond_Age

Given that J.J. Abrams has had a finger in this show, and given the nebulous science used in Alias (eternal life, Rambaldi prophesies, Vaughn being shot like 400 times point blank and living to tell about it), Lost could go in any direction to explain Smokey.

I have no problem with a "reality" answer to it, a paranormal one, or a sci-fi one. What I prefer in a show is consistency. If you tell me you are writing a show and everything in it has a natural explanation, then show me a black smokey thing that can pick people up, toss them into trees and then smash them into the ground, I get a little nervous knowing that such things actually exist. ;) I mean, I'm not taking the garbage out at night anymore.

What I don't like is telling me a show is based on one premise (reality based) then pulling a deus ex machina where aliens, ghosts, or shapeshifters are the explanation [not that there's anything wrong with them per se if the premise is sci-fi or fantasy].

That always feels like a cheat when the genre is switched in mid-story. However, so far the writers have given a show with enough surprises and clever writing that I am highly invested in it. I hope they don't follow the pattern of the aforementioned Alias: really good first and second season, bizarre third and downhill from there.

Have you read "Prey" yet, Aliens?
I haven’t, but I looked and it’s in my wife’s collection. I’ll have to ask her what she thought of it. At 365 pages, it looks like that will be a good book to sit down with this winter. I’ve been into reading shorter books for the summer so I can do other meaningless things. :D

odd are that it will be a scratch-and-sniff children's pop-up book

I guess you know where we could go with that!

I haven’t, but I looked and it’s in my wife’s collection. I’ll have to ask her what she thought of it. At 365 pages, it looks like that will be a good book to sit down with this winter. I’ve been into reading shorter books for the summer so I can do other meaningless things. :D

Trust me, it goes down fast. Really, really fast. It's the way he writes. You can blow it out in a weekend.

The fact of the matter is, the black smoke cloud...(assuming it is not a hallucination)...

Whose hallucination would it be, since we viewers were the only ones who saw it? (plus, Locke and the others heard it happening)

Anyone else think the black smoke took the shape of an elephant (with the trunk throwing Eko around)? I just played that part back and thought it resembled one.

I hope we don't have 2 more characters whose flashbacks we have to sludge through.Yes, it would be absolutely HORRIBLE to see her flashback... about her hard times as a stripper ;)

...

Only two other possibilities:
1) They never actually explain the monster.
2) It was an hallucination and an outside observer would have seen Eko running himself into tree after tree like a pinball.

I'm sticking with the nanobots - in spite of any producer comments.

Well, thanks for making me look like a giggling school girl to my colleagues in the office. :rolleyes:

I have been giggling for the past 10 minutes imagining the whole scene in my head. TGIF, or my boss would have thought I was crazy !!

:D :D :D

I'm almost positive it was Archiguy. I know it wasn't me because I read Prey as a result of this thread. After reading it, I also became convinced it was the only explanation that would make sense.
...

I'm sticking with the nanobots - in spite of any producer comments.
Agreed.

I pooh-poohed the nanobot theory when it was first posted. I mean, come on. But, then I read Prey, and now, what else can it be?

~Dan

While my question wasn't directed at you, nutty, I can easily sympathize with your plight. I simply can't find the time to read anymore either because there's simply too much good frakkin' stuff on TV these days. I really miss sitting down with a juicy novel, though; that's one of life's great pleasures. :(

On the other hand, it's looking like most of the new shows I picked to watch this year are going to get cancelled, so that ought to free up some time! :D
I know it wasn't directed to me, I just putting my 2 cents in. It is friday and I have had no work today.
I have been lucky so far on the new show front. Heroes, studio 60, 30 rock, and Standoff are the ones that were on the list. Saw 30 rock, just didn't find that funny at all. Studio 60 was funnier. Anyway only studio 60 looks to be on the chopping block.

I've got it...

My mom has always said that the answer to this show is that "LOST" doesn't describe the people on the island... it describes the viewers.

So taking that in mind, Ben/Henry represents the producers of this show. He tortures the Losties for no reason, just like the producers torture us viewers.

AND... Ben/Henry always lies... just like the producers always lie when they tell us stuff like "It's not nanobots," or "the show is grouded in science." ALL LIES!!!!

PLUS... The other televisions in the other hatch remind us as viewers that there are other things to watch! (Like Airwolf, for example.) The main Losties represent the viewers who have been down with the show from day one, who never think of watching something else. The new "eye candy" represents the casual viewer who after watching one episode of Lost immediately realizes, "Hey! Maybe we can watch something else!" ;)

I haven’t, but I looked and it’s in my wife’s collection. I’ll have to ask her what she thought of it. At 365 pages, it looks like that will be a good book to sit down with this winter. I’ve been into reading shorter books for the summer so I can do other meaningless things. :D
365 pages wow, there are better things to do like christm, oops HOLIDAY SHOP, I don't want to offend anyone.
Watch the many, many (insert music star) holiday specials. Nick and Jessica do "the divorce".
Charlie Brown will have that stick for a christmas tree again. Just like the Grinch will try to steal it.
Watch the snow fall(very relaxing), I live in NYC so that is the best time to enjoy it because the next morning it is black.

Question - is anyone here on the board watching Lost for the first time this season? I wonder what newcomers think of the show so far.

If they are trying to gain new viewers, the first 6 shows have not been staged properly. The writers should have set up a 6-show mini arc with and ending coming this week. Instead, they open up with a teaser of Otherville, drag out the imprisonment episodes, and bam - "Stay tuned for fall season finale next week"

From a long time Lost viewer, I think they have lost some momentum from last year's fantastic season.

Question - is anyone here on the board watching Lost for the first time this season? I wonder what newcomers think of the show so far.

If they are trying to gain new viewers, the first 6 shows have not been staged properly. The writers should have set up a 6-show mini arc with and ending coming this week. Instead, they open up with a teaser of Otherville, drag out the imprisonment episodes, and bam - "Stay tuned for fall season finale next week"

From a long time Lost viewer, I think they have lost some momentum from last year's fantastic season.
You are one of the few that say last season was fantastic. I am a plane crash viewer(day1), but last season left something to be desired. In my view there were too many filler episodes. (Rose's flashback right before the thanksgiving break when Bernard returned, Bernard's flashback one when he is trying to be rescued to name a couple) There were more questions then answers, but that has been a norm for this show. Last season it picked up steam towards the end which made it more of a must watch show but then the summer got in the way. Same thing is happening now. The beginning a little so so, but slowly getting better and better. Then another summers break just this time during the winter. But this season right now has me impatient for the return which is a good thing for 1St day viewers.

Unrelated: I have to thank all you guys. Some of you knew and some us didn't know who was going to die. The preview sure let us know it was someone, but I don't even think they showed EKO. We might have thought, speculated, or just had inside knowledge. But despite all this no one let the cat out of the bag. It made it that much more of a "holy S@#$" moment. Thanks guys.

...
It made it that much more of a "holy S@#$" moment. Thanks guys.

It was more of an "uh oh!!" moment for me.

OK, we can argue what the smoke monster is all day, and not know. But do we now have an inclination as to what its purpose is? People have wondered why did it scan Eko previously and not kill him, only to let him (or tell him) to push the button, and now it has killed him. It certainly appears that the Smokey McMonster is a judger of some kind.

If Dharma was established for the betterment of mankind, could Smokey have been created as an entity or force to force evolution of mankind? In other words, the Dharma folks may have had a theory that atonement in an individual makes an individual a better person, and strengthens society (this is a similar concept to the Catholic Church, where atonement (confession) makes you a better person, but you have to be truly sorry, otherwise it doesn't mean anything.

Eko was judged, and the monster allowed him to exercise his free will--are you sorry for what you have done? Eko emphatically said, "No!" So Smokey did its job and eliminated him.

Why Smokey would have wanted him to push the button is beyond me, though, unless the button (electromagnetic containment system) affected Smokey in some way?

Anyone else think the black smoke took the shape of an elephant (with the trunk throwing Eko around)? I just played that part back and thought it resembled one.
I didn't notice that, but when Eko was at the stream and the cloud appeared, I thought it looked like a bear (at least the head and shoulders), just before it took off upon Locke's approach...

~Dan

Unrelated: I have to thank all you guys. Some of you knew and some us didn't know who was going to die. The preview sure let us know it was someone, but I don't even think they showed EKO. We might have thought, speculated, or just had inside knowledge. But despite all this no one let the cat out of the bag. It made it that much more of a "holy S@#$" moment. Thanks guys.


I was very worried that it might be Eko, after some comments Kristin made. Also, it was reported that Mrs Klugh was the Other who was supposed to die. But because they decided to off Eko, they changed it to 'trixie', to maintain cast diversity.

Read a book, what? Are you crazy? what is a book? Were am I going to have time to "READ" a book between must watch TV shows, Heroes and Lost, reading these long threads(easily 6-10 pages per episode), and just being a plain old TV addict.

LOL

That book will be a movie sometime, I will read(watch) it then.

Whats a matter your house doen't have a toilet? :confused: plenty of time to catch up on reading. ;)

Whats a matter your house doen't have a toilet? :confused: plenty of time to catch up on reading. ;)

That's where I read magazines - in my "reading room"!

Whats a matter your house doen't have a toilet? :confused: plenty of time to catch up on reading. ;)

That's where I read magazines - in my "reading room"!
lol

Going way OT: I never understood that “tradition.” My stepfather did it with the puzzle section of the newspaper, and my brother does the same thing. I guess I’m so full of it, when it’s time to go, I go, and get on to newer and fresher things. At least I still have a workable constitution. :rolleyes: :D

OK, we can argue what the smoke monster is all day, and not know. But do we now have an inclination as to what its purpose is? People have wondered why did it scan Eko previously and not kill him, only to let him (or tell him) to push the button, and now it has killed him. It certainly appears that the Smokey McMonster is a judger of some kind.

If Dharma was established for the betterment of mankind, could Smokey have been created as an entity or force to force evolution of mankind? In other words, the Dharma folks may have had a theory that atonement in an individual makes an individual a better person, and strengthens society (this is a similar concept to the Catholic Church, where atonement (confession) makes you a better person, but you have to be truly sorry, otherwise it doesn't mean anything.

Eko was judged, and the monster allowed him to exercise his free will--are you sorry for what you have done? Eko emphatically said, "No!" So Smokey did its job and eliminated him.

Why Smokey would have wanted him to push the button is beyond me, though, unless the button (electromagnetic containment system) affected Smokey in some way?

Anyone remember The Changeling episode from Star Trek TOS? Nomad was a creation that was damaged (an incident) that caused it to judge the perfection of lifeforms it encountered and to eliminate those which are imperfect.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Changeling_%28TOS_episode%29

I wonder if Smokey was designed originally as an intelligent security system that was able to determine whether or not a visitor to the island were "good" or "bad" and take appropriate measures.

lol

Going way OT: I never understood that “tradition.” My stepfather did it with the puzzle section of the newspaper, and my brother does the same thing. I guess I’m so full of it, when it’s time to go, I go, and get on to newer and fresher things. At least I still have a workable constitution. :rolleyes: :D

Thanks for sharing. :eek:

At least I still have a workable constitution. :rolleyes: :D

LOL! :D

Tom, they do this constantly with the flashbacks - they show one flashback that portrays the character favorably, then show another flashback that shows the character negatively. Perhaps the point is to demonstrate that most people have good and bad sides, and need to ultimately make a choice to be one type of person or the other. Sounds like a bad Star Trek episode. ;)


I agree with the jarring [mood swings] / [personality change]. But that might have been the purpose of the flashback sequences.

I believe Mr. Eko's life (and persona) is sort of like pin-ball.*

It seems that Mr. Eko has had several "Revelations". Boy to Warrior to War Lord to Priest to Vigilante to Doubting Thomas to Priest. He seems only retain his latest earnest heading until some other force re-directs it.

He was right, he has done what he [felt he] had to do. While he had been recently seen by us [and "Smokey"] after the crash as a reflective, repentant character -- given his final moments, it seems to have been just another phase. He had just visited the Psychic and then the crash, then the "Others", etc... This did not make him a "good" person, it made him a "reactive" persona with rapidly shifting morals and discard-able touch-stones.

Assuming any of that is remotely close, he was a fun character, that I ultimately hated to see played realistically vice as a truly repentant soul. They could always go back to play out Eko's time in London and mission towards Claire's Psychic.

v/r,
C-F

*Acknowledgements and Apologies to CPanther95. (but in fairness, I wrote that last night, but the link died before I could post it...)

OK, lets have a name that group contest.

So far I've seen:

Frosties (I guess a derivation of forgotten Losties)

Innies and Outies

And I was going to throw out Lost Losties or Rosties (Red Shirt Losties...) but so far my vote goes to Frosties.

I kinda like 'outies'
Its like Kate/Jack/Sawyer/Locke/ etc are the cool 'in' crowd, the heroes, and the rest are just 'outies'

Extras?

Lextras?

v/r,
C-F

..and Kristen is an idiot if she thinks JJ is still running the show or has anything to do with it...JJ, Lindelhoff and Carleton Cuse (producers of Lost) all sat down together for a Nightline interview two weeks ago.



for rezzy: Aromatherapy? Now that's an explanation I wouldn't be happy with :D. That's just not sinister enough for Smokey...
Okaaay....LSD, then. That better?



Actually, I think that may have been me. (archie takes a little bow) :) There were several of us who had read "Prey" that started up the nanobot theory. I don't know which one of us was the very first, but it might have been me. I certainly don't care enough to go back and research it, though. ;) But, on behalf of peter, I'll gladly accept your shout-out.Sorry 'bout that. Regarding Smokey; if it's a monster and not advanced nano-technology, then they're all truly doomed. I'd be quite disappointed with that theory. And it's not too late for the producers to read our comments here.

Okaaay....LSD, then. That better?

Much better! Psychedelic drug therapy. That'd be a trip...


ron

Whats a matter your house doen't have a toilet? :confused: plenty of time to catch up on reading. ;)
the toilet is the thinking thank, That is where you lay back(sit back) make decisions for your day, what good deeds you might perform, decide what you will wear and at the end of the day, make sure everything planned was done, make sure you had a productive day and reflect to see if you satisfied life's challanges.
Like reflection pond, just smaller. Just don't look inside when you are done!

One of the producers had said some that plot events would parallel "The Third Policeman" novel. Perhaps Eko is the character who most resembled the murderer/thief in the book, who undergoes a series of bizarre hallucinations.

From EW.com

When the producers of Lost first conceived the character of Mr. Eko, he was simply a gentle, upstanding Nigerian priest. And after an onscreen career full of drugs and thugs, Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje jumped at the chance to play such a role. ''When you're a large black man in Hollywood, the obvious stereotype is one of force and menace,'' says the 39-year-old actor, whose 6'2'' build and hulking shoulders are just as imposing in person. ''I thought I wouldn't mind showing a different facet to my character.'' The good news? Once the producers saw a tape of his breakthrough performance as prison bully Simon Adebisi on HBO's Oz, they knew he was the man for the job. But his sheer power in the role compelled them to give Mr. Eko a new complexity, to add a darker edge, to make him...a former drug thug.

It was as if Akinnuoye-Agbaje himself had been plopped down in the middle of an irony-filled Lost flashback. The switch, he says, came as ''a bit of a shock. I was devastated.'' But he ultimately embraced the backstory, in which Eko assumed the identity of his Catholic clergyman brother, Yemi, who'd been killed by government troops when he tried to stop a drug deal. ''This guy murdered and plundered to stay alive, but he traded his soul for his brother's,'' explains Akinnuoye-Agbaje, referencing Eko's childhood decision to kill a man so his brother wouldn't have to. ''He's running around in his priest outfit still killing people. If you're an actor, that's just delicious.''

As soon as Akinnuoye-Agbaje arrived in season 2 as part of the ''Tailie'' invasion, Eko's struggle to embrace his dual nature instantly helped make the character a looming presence on Lost — no easy task on a sprawling series that at the time featured 14 regular cast members, including some scene-stealing Emmy nominees. Eko made such an impression on castaways and fans alike that his Nov. 1 death — after the island's mystical smoke monster gave him a brutal bashing — was all the more unexpected.

Though producers say they envisioned Eko's death from the beginning and knew Akinnuoye-Agbaje might not be sticking around for the long haul, the actor is the first Lost star to vote himself off the island. (He's the fifth series regular to leave the show.) After Eko's first flashback episode aired last season, Akinnuoye-Agbaje felt ''the character was complete. It was such a well-written episode that I knew I would be able to sew him up in a season.'' Says exec producer Carlton Cuse: ''In a perfect world it would've been great to have Mr. Eko for a little longer. But it was the best time to go our separate ways.''

Tearing into a lobster at Cafe Med in L.A., Akinnuoye-Agbaje looks more like a pre-priesthood Eko, sporting braids, ripped jeans, and a white tank top. He sprinkles his speech with casual references to his devout Buddhism, but exudes a high-energy charisma that's nothing like Eko's Zen state. He also talks more — a lot more — than his character, and often explodes with deep laughter.

Speaking in his native British accent (which he's never used in any role), he explains why leaving ABC's hit show was actually a ''joyous'' moment. His heightened profile, he says, has opened doors to potential financiers for his longtime pet project: Akinnuoye-Agbaje plans to direct and star in an autobiographical film he wrote about growing up in foster care and on the tough streets of London. (Africans who emigrated to England in the 1960s and '70s often willingly placed their children in foster care while they adjusted to life in a new country.) ''People that I'd approached [for funding] are now approaching me,'' says the actor. ''It's an opportunity I can't miss.''

The script ends when he reunites with his parents as a teenager in the '80s, but in real life, what happened next provided plenty of material for a sequel. While he planned to follow in his lawyer father's footsteps, he got sidetracked by modeling gigs that eventually led to acting. After landing an episode of the Fox cop series New York Undercover in 1995, he was hooked. Roles in films like Congo, Ace Ventura: When Nature Calls, The Mummy Returns, and The Bourne Identity soon followed, but Akinnuoye-Agbaje made his biggest impact with a tour-de-force stint from 1997 to 2000 as gang leader Adebisi on HBO's violent prison drama Oz. Five years later, as he was shooting his role as (what else?) a powerful drug lord in the 50 Cent drama Get Rich or Die Tryin', the casting director for Lost — a show the actor had never seen — came calling.

Akinnuoye-Agbaje swears that he's never been as bad as his most memorable characters. ''I've never dealt drugs, killed anybody, [or] raped anybody,'' he says. ''But I know what it is to suffer. You don't have to go chop somebody's head off to know that pain.'' As such, it was his own pathos-filled history — both on screen and off — that gave Mr. Eko such a gloomy edge. At his suggestion, producers changed the original name, Omecca, to Eko in order to be consistent with Akinnuoye-Agbaje's own Nigerian tribal lineage; he also advised them to add a ''Mr.'' to the wayward priest's moniker. ''Carlton and I looked at each other like it was the silliest thing in the world,'' exec producer Damon Lindelof says. ''Then we kept saying it, and we realized there was something really cool about it.''

Akinnuoye-Agbaje's active involvement in his character's development became both a blessing and a curse over the course of his first season. ''Adewale's process is complicated,'' says Cuse. ''He needs to discuss it, process it, and make it his own. That's harder to do on a television schedule, but it ultimately leads to great work.'' His time in Hawaii — which can (for better or worse) leave a person feeling distanced from the rest of the world — proved difficult for him. He had to move to Oahu, a place he'd never been, in about two weeks. He was afforded little of the prep time he relishes. And he struggled with his newfound visibility. ''I felt like I'd landed on the moon,'' he says. ''I'm very private, and I don't like public influence on what I'm doing.'' Mostly, though, he struggled with playing the same person every week. ''I'm primarily a movie actor because there's a lot more flexibility,'' he notes. ''I never like to get lazy, sitting in a character two or three years, him getting fat and having grandchildren. I like to hit and run.'' Toward the end of last season, he met with Cuse and Lindelof to discuss his future, and agreed to stick around for a few season 3 episodes. ''There was an ongoing dialogue [when he signed on] about what the longevity of the character would be,'' Lindelof explains. ''And we all decided the shocking and emotional death would be the best way to go.''

As Eko's end grew imminent, the actor's offscreen life became more trying: Both of his parents passed away over the summer (''I'd rather not even mention it, to be honest. It's still too fresh''). In September, he was pulled over in Waikiki and charged with driving without a license, an unfortunate circumstance that called to mind the 2005 DUI arrests of fellow Tailies Cynthia Watros and Michelle Rodriguez. Charges were dropped when he produced his license — which he'd left in a pants pocket at home. ''[Media reports] tried to lump me [with Watros and Rodriguez],'' he says, ''but I don't drink.''

Despite leaving behind a powerful character on a huge hit show, Akinnuoye-Agbaje is happy to be scouting for projects back on the mainland. (So far, he's signed to voice the town crier in the upcoming Jim Carrey CGI feature Horton Hears a Who.) Already, island life is becoming a faded memory. ''When you're out there, you're trekking, you're sweating,'' he says. ''It's not the paradise that you think it is.'' He does, however, still keep ''a little bit of Hawaii'' with him in the form of a single black pearl on a black rope necklace. And lest you think he's ungrateful for an experience that made him a star, he carefully adds this coda: ''Lost has been a huge learning curve — spiritually, professionally, culturally. It'll always be a part of me.''
(Posted:11/03/06)

Ok, so I guess we had no choice...Eko had to go :-( I just wish his death had served a purpose, instead of just getting a beatdown from a pissed off giraffe. :-)

Alrighty now, I've just watched it a second time (Locke told me to) and I've formulated the following theory about the smoke monster. Ahem...

The Dharma Inititive has been developing nanotechnology on the island since the inception of the project. With the virtually unlimited funding provided by the Hanso Foundation, they got good at it fast, and kept their advances in robotics and nanotechnolgy concealed from the rest of the scientific world. But the computer technology of the time was still relatively primitive (this is all "pre-incident") as we have seen in the hatches. The whole thing fell apart and was abandoned a couple of decades ago. But the nanobot swarm is still there. Since the software that runs it was still relatively simple in those days, the nanobot swarm (Cerebus, might have spelled that wrong) can only function with relatively simple logic gates: i.e. good/bad, then, if repent, that falls under good, if not, then bad which means destroy, etc. You get the idea.

The Dharma remote viewing experiment worked with the nanotech scientists to somehow imbibe the nanobot swarm with the ability to "scan" the minds of anyone it chooses to. When it does that, it can start to exercise its prime function, which is to judge the goodness/badness of the subject and react accordingly. Thus, it functions as the island security system, eliminating any "bad" subjects for the good of the whole.

In addition, the swarm is able to create a "template" of a dead person, as in the case with Jack's father and Eko's brother and create a solid facsimile that can be seen and felt. Even use tools (Eko's brother's lighter evidently set his hut on fire)! It can even create a fax of someone from the very memories of the person being scanned. Witness Kate's horse.

Finally, we can expect every [major] character to eventually experience a "showdown" with Cerebus just as Locke and Eko have done. Thus Eko's last words to Locke about "we're next". Everybody will get their shot to be judged by Cerebus. In fact, the "incident" may have been Cerebus getting loose and somehow shedding it's protocols not to harm Dharma personnel. That may have been why they abandoned the island.

<Whew> Okay, that's my theory, have at it. :p

I like it!

Damm, that was going to be my morning's reading when I get my EW. iteki. Now you done it. Now I have to read something else while I am at work.

Alrighty now, I've just watched it a second time (Locke told me to) and I've formulated the following theory about the smoke monster. Ahem...

The Dharma Inititive has been developing nanotechnology on the island since the inception of the project. With the virtually unlimited funding provided by the Hanso Foundation, they got good at it fast, and kept their advances in robotics and nanotechnolgy concealed from the rest of the scientific world. But the computer technology of the time was still relatively primitive (this is all "pre-incident") as we have seen in the hatches. The whole thing fell apart and was abandoned a couple of decades ago. But the nanobot swarm is still there. Since the software that runs it was still relatively simple in those days, the nanobot swarm (Cerebus, might have spelled that wrong) can only function with relatively simple logic gates: i.e. good/bad, then, if repent, that falls under good, if not, then bad which means destroy, etc. You get the idea.

The Dharma remote viewing experiment worked with the nanotech scientists to somehow imbibe the nanobot swarm with the ability to "scan" the minds of anyone it chooses to. When it does that, it can start to exercise its prime function, which is to judge the goodness/badness of the subject and react accordingly. Thus, it functions as the island security system, eliminating any "bad" subjects for the good of the whole.

In addition, the swarm is able to create a "template" of a dead person, as in the case with Jack's father and Eko's brother and create a solid facsimile that can be seen and felt. Even use tools (Eko's brother's lighter evidently set his hut on fire)! It can even create a fax of someone from the very memories of the person being scanned. Witness Kate's horse.

Finally, we can expect every [major] character to eventually experience a "showdown" with Cerebus just as Locke and Eko have done. Thus Eko's last words to Locke about "we're next". Everybody will get their shot to be judged by Cerebus. In fact, the "incident" may have been Cerebus getting loose and somehow shedding it's protocols not to harm Dharma personnel. That may have been why they abandoned the island.

<Whew> Okay, that's my theory, have at it. :p

That would work for me, with one additional question: would the Others already have met Smokey and been judged "good"? Ben has often described themselves as "The Good Guys".

Alrighty now, I've just watched it a second time (Locke told me to) and I've formulated the following theory about the smoke monster. Ahem...

The Dharma Inititive has been developing nanotechnology on the island since the inception of the project. With the virtually unlimited funding provided by the Hanso Foundation, they got good at it fast, and kept their advances in robotics and nanotechnolgy concealed from the rest of the scientific world. But the computer technology of the time was still relatively primitive (this is all "pre-incident") as we have seen in the hatches. The whole thing fell apart and was abandoned a couple of decades ago. But the nanobot swarm is still there. Since the software that runs it was still relatively simple in those days, the nanobot swarm (Cerebus, might have spelled that wrong) can only function with relatively simple logic gates: i.e. good/bad, then, if repent, that falls under good, if not, then bad which means destroy, etc. You get the idea.

The Dharma remote viewing experiment worked with the nanotech scientists to somehow imbibe the nanobot swarm with the ability to "scan" the minds of anyone it chooses to. When it does that, it can start to exercise its prime function, which is to judge the goodness/badness of the subject and react accordingly. Thus, it functions as the island security system, eliminating any "bad" subjects for the good of the whole.

In addition, the swarm is able to create a "template" of a dead person, as in the case with Jack's father and Eko's brother and create a solid facsimile that can be seen and felt. Even use tools (Eko's brother's lighter evidently set his hut on fire)! It can even create a fax of someone from the very memories of the person being scanned. Witness Kate's horse.

Finally, we can expect every [major] character to eventually experience a "showdown" with Cerebus just as Locke and Eko have done. Thus Eko's last words to Locke about "we're next". Everybody will get their shot to be judged by Cerebus. In fact, the "incident" may have been Cerebus getting loose and somehow shedding it's protocols not to harm Dharma personnel. That may have been why they abandoned the island.

<Whew> Okay, that's my theory, have at it. :p
Ok I will be the first one. do you think the horse was part of the judgement like you said. if yes, why did Sawyer see it also? What about Hurley, what showdown was he getting to when he saw his friend and it was on the island. Even though they made it seem like his friend didn't exist later in the episode. Do you think that friend was brough back to him by blackie?
If it was to eliminate the baddiies, like you said, why has sawyer and kate been able to avoid it coming for them? Kate been chased serveral times already.
I am not questioning your theroy at all, just pointing out the "what about these characters"

oops, second one.

The Dharma remote viewing experiment worked with the nanotech scientists to somehow imbibe the nanobot swarm with the ability to "scan" the minds of anyone it chooses to. When it does that, it can start to exercise its prime function, which is to judge the goodness/badness of the subject and react accordingly. Thus, it functions as the island security system, eliminating any "bad" subjects for the good of the whole.I can pretty much get with that. The notion of a project gone awry makes perfect sense (remember the episode of ST:TNG where Wes' nano-project went crazy?). The whole Dharma experience was destroyed because AI took over, and as a collective hive (escaped and), started infecting and killing at random. I don't see it reading minds, but rather judging and/or executing people based on their island actions. Everyone will indeed meet the monster one day, and its code-of-ethics.

It also may spew some sort of pharmecutical that illecits or invokes memories as well as feeling of guilt (Eko inhaled). That's the part where the vaccine comes in. It was created quickly and in short supply. Without it, the Losties and Others are all toast. Smokey is no longer controllable by humans (unless Sayid finds and restores the controlling computer(s) :rolleyes:.

OK, lets have a name that group contest.

So far I've seen:

Frosties (I guess a derivation of forgotten Losties)

Innies and Outies

And I was going to throw out Lost Losties or Rosties (Red Shirt Losties...) but so far my vote goes to Frosties.

Extries.

Damm, that was going to be my morning's reading when I get my EW. iteki. Now you done it. Now I have to read something else while I am at work.
How about you reflect ;) or you could read PREY. lol

Damm, that was going to be my morning's reading when I get my EW. iteki. Now you done it. Now I have to read something else while I am at work.


Sorry dude, most ppl don't subscribe to the mag, and you have to be a subscriber to access most of the content on the site.

It may be abridged...perhaps the mag article will be longer?

In fact, the "incident" may have been Cerebus getting loose and somehow shedding it's protocols not to harm Dharma personnel. That may have been why they abandoned the island.
Except that they haven't abandoned the island. Ben, Juliet, and some of the other Others are at the Hydra station on the little island, but there's nothing to indicate that things aren't normal back at Otherville on the main island...

Other than that, I like your theory!

Oh, and as Peter said, perhap the Others have already met up with, and been judged by, the black cloud--and that's why they are so sure that they're "good."

~Dan

do you think the horse was part of the judgement like you said. if yes, why did Sawyer see it also?
Because the cloud is real, i.e., it has a physical presence. If it can imitate other people/objects/horses, then those imitations also have a physical presence. Anyone around during an encounter would see it.

Remember: Sayid, too, saw Walt when he was out in the jungle with Shannon...

~Dan

Because the cloud is real, i.e., it has a physical presence. If it can imitate other people/objects/horses, then those imitations also have a physical presence. Anyone around during an encounter would see it.

Remember: Sayid, too, saw Walt when he was out in the jungle with Shannon...

~Dan


I think the Walt sighting was from another "remote viewing" physic ability type experiment. IMHO.

Bye Bye Eko:

Hated to see Eko go. Read article in local paper about him defending himself as to being hard to work with. AAA said that is the way he always worked as an actor..

Hey General Custer answer your PM..

I think the Walt sighting was from another "remote viewing" physic ability type experiment. IMHO.
I’m with you, ft boomer. I’m not 100% sure what is happening during those ‘visions,’ but I don’t think they and Smokey are one and the same.

I think the Walt sighting was from another "remote viewing" physic ability type experiment. IMHO.
Well, that's what I originally thought, too...but now I'm not so sure.

Just another twist to the Lost mysteries--truly a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma...

~Dan

Tom, they do this constantly with the flashbacks - they show one flashback that portrays the character favorably, then show another flashback that shows the character negatively. Perhaps the point is to demonstrate that most people have good and bad sides, and need to ultimately make a choice to be one type of person or the other. Sounds like a bad Star Trek episode. ;)
Michael's series of flashbacks illustrated this princliple very well. he went from appearing to be a deadbeat Dad to showing him as someone who got screwed in a custody battle.

Of course, then he had to go and become Mr. Crazy Pants...

If Ben is in contact w/ the outside world, why does he not go to a real doctor for an operation on his tumor?

Maybe its poor medical benefits for Dharma employees, bad HMO.. :D

If Ben is in contact w/ the outside world, why does he not go to a real doctor for an operation on his tumor?

Excellent point. I think that Jack simply can't trust the "Others". Juliette and Ben are playing him like a fiddle.

Maybe its poor medical benefits for Dharma employees, bad HMO.. :D
So, Jack's the only doctor in his network? ;)

So, Jack's the only doctor in his network? ;)

Maybe not, but apparently he's the closest! (not to mention cost effective)

If Ben is in contact w/ the outside world, why does he not go to a real doctor for an operation on his tumor?
IIRC, Ben said to Jack: “Two days after finding out I had a tumor, a miracle fell out of the sky.” Referring to the plane crashing and Jack being a spine surgeon. Which would then lead one to ask: How did the Others know so much about the occupants of that aircraft?

My theory - the Others are or were quarantined from the real world because of some disease that once was prevalent on the island. Since they grew up in the area and became immune to its influences, they also cannot be cured by the island's influences.

Jack's best strategy is to operate on and cure Ben, and thereby get Ben into his pocket. Ben appears to still have more influence with the Others than Juliet and her co-conspirators.

Alrighty now, I've just watched it a second time (Locke told me to) and I've formulated the following theory about the smoke monster. Ahem...

The Dharma Inititive has been developing nanotechnology on the island since the inception of the project. With the virtually unlimited funding provided by the Hanso Foundation, they got good at it fast, and kept their advances in robotics and nanotechnolgy concealed from the rest of the scientific world. But the computer technology of the time was still relatively primitive (this is all "pre-incident") as we have seen in the hatches. The whole thing fell apart and was abandoned a couple of decades ago. But the nanobot swarm is still there. Since the software that runs it was still relatively simple in those days, the nanobot swarm (Cerebus, might have spelled that wrong) can only function with relatively simple logic gates: i.e. good/bad, then, if repent, that falls under good, if not, then bad which means destroy, etc. You get the idea.

The Dharma remote viewing experiment worked with the nanotech scientists to somehow imbibe the nanobot swarm with the ability to "scan" the minds of anyone it chooses to. When it does that, it can start to exercise its prime function, which is to judge the goodness/badness of the subject and react accordingly. Thus, it functions as the island security system, eliminating any "bad" subjects for the good of the whole.

In addition, the swarm is able to create a "template" of a dead person, as in the case with Jack's father and Eko's brother and create a solid facsimile that can be seen and felt. Even use tools (Eko's brother's lighter evidently set his hut on fire)! It can even create a fax of someone from the very memories of the person being scanned. Witness Kate's horse.

Finally, we can expect every [major] character to eventually experience a "showdown" with Cerebus just as Locke and Eko have done. Thus Eko's last words to Locke about "we're next". Everybody will get their shot to be judged by Cerebus. In fact, the "incident" may have been Cerebus getting loose and somehow shedding it's protocols not to harm Dharma personnel. That may have been why they abandoned the island.

<Whew> Okay, that's my theory, have at it. :p

Any one ever read a book called prey? in the book, a mans wife works at a plant in the desert where it's totally deserted, and they are allowed to do expirements that can cause a lot of waste and such, well one day he notices "someone" sitting in her car with her when she drives to work, but the "figure" was very "dark" and not "shaped" exactly like a person. He gets a call later about her getting into a car crash. there was no one else in the car.. he visits her work in the desert and the story ends up being that they were working on new "nanotechnology" that is able to "see". every little nano has a tiny camera, which at first was meant to go inside body's and look and destroy deseases. when all the nanos are together in a pack, it's like a big camera, and they can see. well after a while, these little nanos get their own personality and start killing everyone, suffocating them really, not picking them up and knocking them around ;). sounds a lot like lost theories, if you like lost and haven't read this book, i'd suggest it big time.

Any one ever read a book called prey? in the book, a mans wife works at a plant in the desert where it's totally deserted, and they are allowed to do expirements that can cause a lot of waste and such, well one day he notices "someone" sitting in her car with her when she drives to work, but the "figure" was very "dark" and not "shaped" exactly like a person. He gets a call later about her getting into a car crash. there was no one else in the car.. he visits her work in the desert and the story ends up being that they were working on new "nanotechnology" that is able to "see". every little nano has a tiny camera, which at first was meant to go inside body's and look and destroy deseases. when all the nanos are together in a pack, it's like a big camera, and they can see. well after a while, these little nanos get their own personality and start killing everyone, suffocating them really, not picking them up and knocking them around ;). sounds a lot like lost theories, if you like lost and haven't read this book, i'd suggest it big time.

You're late to the party Longhorns; it's been mentioned dozens of times here. But I for one appreciate that you're the first to actually give a synopsis of the book that's been talked about so frequently. I had no idea how the storyline actually went. Thanks. PS: Welcome to the thread!

Oh haha, sorry about that, i looked through this page to make sure i wouldn't look stupid and.....i do! lol no problem, one of my fav books, and one of the only ones i've read. And i def agree that it does have something to do with what archiguy said.

Any one ever read a book called prey? in the book, a mans wife works at a plant in the desert where it's totally deserted, and they are allowed to do expirements that can cause a lot of waste and such, well one day he notices "someone" sitting in her car with her when she drives to work, but the "figure" was very "dark" and not "shaped" exactly like a person. He gets a call later about her getting into a car crash. there was no one else in the car.. he visits her work in the desert and the story ends up being that they were working on new "nanotechnology" that is able to "see". every little nano has a tiny camera, which at first was meant to go inside body's and look and destroy deseases. when all the nanos are together in a pack, it's like a big camera, and they can see. well after a while, these little nanos get their own personality and start killing everyone, suffocating them really, not picking them up and knocking them around ;). sounds a lot like lost theories, if you like lost and haven't read this book, i'd suggest it big time.


Dude you are so late to this party

EDIT: As usual, someone beat me to it lol (and used the exact same phrase)

Welcome to the thread indeed.

Any one ever read a book called prey?Not yet, but thanks for the spoiler :rolleyes:. Anyways, I'm thinking this 'tumor' removal won't be routine at all :eek:.

Not yet, but thanks for the spoiler :rolleyes:.
Dude, you still haven't read it? Prey was published in 2002 and we've been talking about it here for a year now...

~Dan

Not yet, but thanks for the spoiler :rolleyes:. Anyways, I'm thinking this 'tumor' removal won't be routine at all :eek:.

That is only a mild spoiler for the book. It is still worth a read.

However, the ability of the swarm of nanobots to assume the shape of humans is what has a number of us confused as to why the writers have debunked this as an explanation for Smokey.

A million years ago, this photo of the book's cover was posted:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6923888&&#post6923888

If that's not Smokey, then it is his twin brother. :)

However, the ability of the swarm of nanobots to assume the shape of humans is what has a number of us confused as to why the writers have debunked this as an explanation for Smokey.

This is where I need my memory refreshed. Which episode did it show Smokey forming into a human? I don’t recall seeing that happen.

This is where I need my memory refreshed. Which episode did it show Smokey forming into a human? I don’t recall seeing that happen.

That's the part we can't "prove". It is more of a speculative guess.

Jack saw his father, Kate a horse, Hurley his friend from the institution, Shannon saw a very wet Walt, etc. In the last episode Yemi said to Eko, "You speak to me as if I were your brother", when clearly he wasn't. Barring a psychotic break, these people are interacting with something.

There has yet to be given within the actual show a "natural" explanation for these. In the absence of canon, some of us have looked at the plot of Prey where the black cloud of the nanobot swarm could mimic a human rather closely and speculated that it would be an explanation that wouldn't require a supernatural or sci-fi grounding.

The writers have said that isn't the explanation though.

I forget at what stage the writers debunked the nanobots, but it's possible that they have since changed their thinking.

I forget at what stage the writers debunked the nanobots, but it's possible that they have since changed their thinking.

Unfortunately, this entry from Wikipedia doesn't give the date that Damon Lindelof specifically denied the Prey connection:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_%28TV_series%29#Discredited_theories

I'm guessing they have a 'deny everything' policy. It's the only safe way. Whatever the fans shout out, deny it and say there's a rational explaination. If they didn't do this, sooner or later people would be able to 'read' them like in a poker game.
I say it's probably nanobots.

That's the part we can't "prove". It is more of a speculative guess.

Jack saw his father, Kate a horse, Hurley his friend from the institution, Shannon saw a very wet Walt, etc. In the last episode Yemi said to Eko, "You speak to me as if I were your brother", when clearly he wasn't. Barring a psychotic break, these people are interacting with something.

There has yet to be given within the actual show a "natural" explanation for these. In the absence of canon, some of us have looked at the plot of Prey where the black cloud of the nanobot swarm could mimic a human rather closely and speculated that it would be an explanation that wouldn't require a supernatural or sci-fi grounding.

The writers have said that isn't the explanation though.
Hurley's friend had nothiing to do with nano-tech. He was in Hurley's imagination. :)

Carlton Cuse dismissed the theory that the island is a reality TV show and the castaways unwitting housemates.

Maybe it's not beamed to the mainland, but the Losties are unwilling participants in a very strange closed-circuit experiment. Not a show per se, but is a harsh reality, anyway. I think the producers of Survivor should be taking notes.

Hurley's friend had nothiing to do with nano-tech. He was in Hurley's imagination. :)

In the institute for sure.

I'm not so sure about his appearance on the island. Could have been a psychotic break again for Hugo, but then again it could have been [fill in most popular theory for unexplained people and/or animals popping up on the island].

I disagree. I say the cloud is more para psychological in nature than technical.

If you can build a flying nanobot swarm, you could do a lot better than an Apple II in a bunker somewhere.

Just my .02 bits.
The bots are an A.I. experiment gone awry. They're self-replicating and getting smarter on their own.

The writers have said that isn't the explanation though.

I'm thinking that at this point the writers are figuring the show will be cancelled before they have to explain anything. They're winging it.

The problem I have with nano technology is that it breaks all the rules. If nanobots exist then ANYTHING can exist on the island, it becomes a Stargate type world where the only constraints are what the writers decide to throw at us. Not that that isn't true now, but at this point we are supposedly working in a world where gravity is a given and the sun rises in the east and sets in the west. Once that is thrown out then there really is no reason for all of us to keep guessing. It just becomes Deus ex machina, and nothing matters anymore.

In the last episode Yemi said to Eko, "You speak to me as if I were your brother"...

Along with the thought it was an apparition admitting that it wasn't actually Yemi, another way to interpret that scene is that Yemi has disowned Eko (as being his brother) since Eko failed to repent anything.

I forget at what stage the writers debunked the nanobots, but it's possible that they have since changed their thinking.

I think the specific quote was something along the lines that "it depends on how you define nanobots ;) "

So, they could technically call the monster anything but nanobots, and their dismissal of the nanobot theory becomes legitimate.

The problem I have with nano technology is that it breaks all the rules. If nanobots exist then ANYTHING can exist on the island, it becomes a Stargate type world where the only constraints are what the writers decide to throw at us. Not that that isn't true now, but at this point we are supposedly working in a world where gravity is a given and the sun rises in the east and sets in the west. Once that is thrown out then there really is no reason for all of us to keep guessing. It just becomes Deus ex machina, and nothing matters anymore.

then you can probably stop watchng b/c it's the only remotely (pseudo-)scientific explanarion for what we are seeing, barring aliens and the supernatural, which also are deus ex mechina.

I read Prey a few yrs back and when I saw the nanoswarm that was the 1st thing I thought of.

btw, smokey is unlikely to be a hallucination, since we occasionally see it stalking a character while he is unaware.

I'm thinking that at this point the writers are figuring the show will be cancelled before they have to explain anything. They're winging it.

lol. but anyhoo don't they have to dismiss any and all theories that come along. i mean what do we expect them to say? oops you got the show figured out. we are sooooo busted. i guess ya'll can stop watching now.

According to the Nov.6 Lost podcast the black smoke is not made up of nanobots and that they are tired of answering that question.

DEBUNKED: The Black Smoke may be a "nanoswarm" composed of nanocells found in nanotechnology, similar to Michael Crichton's novel "Prey"
Damon Lindelof answers a fan question in Issue 6 of Lost Magazine where he calls the theory of nanobots "absurd" and "least interesting."

http://lostpedia.com/wiki/The_Monster


"Lost" Executive Producer/Co-Creator Damon Lindelof , executive producers Carlton Cuse and Brian Burke at Comic-Con panel.

A fan asked how many days they expect the entire series to cover. Lindelof said, “You’re making a basic assumption that they’ve been there as long as they think they’ve been there.” He said that the third season may change the fan’s mind.

The monster is NOT nanobots.

The panelists attempted to answer recent rumors that the show would end after five seasons and switch over to feature films. Lindelof said that they have enough mythology for five seasons, and then they’d have to start “tapdancing,” which is something they didn’t want to do. However, they recognize that ABC has every right to keep the show on the air as long as they want to since they put the investment into it. Lindelof suggested that everyone in the room stop watching during the fourth season so they can get canceled and finish the show according to their plan.

http://www.wizarduniverse.com/television/lost/001075590.cfm

The problem I have with nano technology is that it breaks all the rules. If nanobots exist then ANYTHING can exist on the island
Haven't read The Third Policeman yet, have you? ;)

~Dan

Today's podcast also mentions when (which episode number) we might learn more about the captured tailies/children.

Hurley's friend had nothiing to do with nano-tech. He was in Hurley's imagination. :)
if I remember correctly, I will watch again Hurley and his friend never had any physical contact the first time. On the island he was getting hit and I think he actually grabbed him. That would be some imagination! But I will watch it again. Or someone else can give their opinion.

The panelists attempted to answer recent rumors that the show would end after five seasons and switch over to feature films. Lindelof said that they have enough mythology for five seasons, and then they’d have to start “tapdancing,” which is something they didn’t want to do. However, they recognize that ABC has every right to keep the show on the air as long as they want to since they put the investment into it. Lindelof suggested that everyone in the room stop watching during the fourth season so they can get canceled and finish the show according to their plan. That has been my biggest fear all along. Too much success can only serve to ultimately muck up the show. It's why I've not been unhappy that the initially huge ratings have dropped down to a lower level. When posters declare they will stop watching because the producers are "winging it" :rolleyes: , I think I will have to start thanking them for increasing the odds that the show will keep it's integrity :D.


ron

They're already tapdancing around some really good theories. Like Barth said, they're not gonna admit if anyone's hot/cold or getting warmer in regard to viewer guesses. Up to this point it's been real fun theorizing, but I hope it doesn't take 5 years to get real answers. Anyways, it's gonna take a heck of a cliffhanger to get me onboard for season 4.

Anyways, it's gonna take a heck of a cliffhanger to get me onboard for season 4.

I have no doubt they'll come up with a real doozy to keep you around. ;)

I just hope we get some closure from last year's cliffhanger. What of fair Penny and her arctic eavesdroppers?

They're already tapdancing around some really good theories. Like Barth said, they're not gonna admit if anyone's hot/cold or getting warmer in regard to viewer guesses. Up to this point it's been real fun theorizing, but I hope it doesn't take 5 years to get real answers. Anyways, it's gonna take a heck of a cliffhanger to get me onboard for season 4.
season 3 part 2 cliffhanger. Michael returns because he ran out of gas and was "circling the island" when he sees Peggy ship but she decides to go back to the island instead of bringing them to safety. She has to save her true love. Walt shows his true powers when he is forced to go back on the island. The bad Others make their debut but it ends in a standoff with them the losties and Ben "good Guy" others. LOST[U] End credits.

Rezzy would something like this make you stay?

Jorge on Conan tonight.

I don't want to see Michael anymore. I hope he gets trapped in a whirlpool (while Walt escapes).

That has been my biggest fear all along. Too much success can only serve to ultimately muck up the show. It's why I've not been unhappy that the initially huge ratings have dropped down to a lower level. When posters declare they will stop watching because the producers are "winging it" :rolleyes: , I think I will have to start thanking them for increasing the odds that the show will keep it's integrity :D.


ron
ugh. After the Fall Finale ABC will air the season premier of Day Break. What if, next January, Day Break is pulling in higher ratings than LOST is right now. Isn't that how that other J.J. Abrams show, Alias evenutally wound up getting the axe? It went on hiatus for a while, then they had to bring it back in a different time slot, and people lost interest or didn't care to follow it to its new time slot?

ugh. After the Fall Finale ABC will air the season premier of Day Break. What if, next January, Day Break is pulling in higher ratings than LOST is right now. Isn't that how that other J.J. Abrams show, Alias evenutally wound up getting the axe? It went on hiatus for a while, then they had to bring it back in a different time slot, and people lost interest or didn't care to follow it to its new time slot?

Highly unlikely. As anemic as LOST's ratings seem now compared to previous season's, they are spectacular and would be difficult to top. Heroes and Ugly Betty are the only two new series to even come close to LOST's numbers. (I think Hero is beating them now in terms of total viewers).

Daybreak would have to be a megahit for this to happen. And given the premise, i don't see it lasting that long. It has a short story arc, which is fine, I'd like to see the story, I just can't imagine wanting it to go on for more than one season.

Highly unlikely. As anemic as LOST's ratings seem now compared to previous season's, they are spectacular and would be difficult to top. Heroes and Ugly Betty are the only two new series to even come close to LOST's numbers. (I think Hero is beating them now in terms of total viewers).

Daybreak would have to be a megahit for this to happen. And given the premise, i don't see it lasting that long. It has a short story arc, which is fine, I'd like to see the story, I just can't imagine wanting it to go on for more than one season.Lost is consistently rated as one of the top ten shows as reported by the Nielsen Media Research's National People Sample (http://www.nielsenmedia.com/ratings/broadcast_programs.html), which should be "good enough" for it to remain in production; especially when you consider what else is being shown on must-not-see-TV.

Did anyone else catch the whispers coming from the black smoke just before it attacked Eko? Right after he says, "The Lord is my shepherd, I shall not want" the smoke billows for a moment, you can hear faint whispers, then it strikes. I tried to turn it up, but couldn't make it out. It's been a while since we've had to decipher whispers, was it anything significant?

P.S. - Sorry if this has been covered. I searched but didn't find any reference to this.

Lost is consistently rated as one of the top ten shows as reported by the Nielsen Media Research's National People Sample (http://www.nielsenmedia.com/ratings/broadcast_programs.html), which should be "good enough" for it to remain in production; especially when you consider what else is being shown on must-not-see-TV.
That was last years ratings, 20 mil tuned in. This year it was 17 mil from a comparable week. It has lost 3 mil viewers. in the past year but so far this year it has been going up since the second week decline from the premiere episode..

TOP 20 IN TOTAL VIEWERS (IN MILLIONS) 10/23/06 -10/29/06
1. Desperate Housewives ABC 21.238
2. Dancing With the Stars (Tue.) ABC 20.695
3. Dancing With the Stars (Wed.) ABC 20.016
4. CSI: Miami CBS 17.833
5. CSI: NY CBS 17.424
6. Sunday Night Football NBC 17.331
7. Lost ABC 17.087
8. CSI: Crime Scene Investigation CBS 16.825
9. Criminal Minds CBS 16.768
10. 60 Minutes CBS 16.546
11. World Series, Game 5 FOX 16.276
12. World Series, Game 4 FOX 16.113
13. Deal or No Deal (Mon.) NBC 15.830
14. Extreme Makeover: Home Edition ABC 15.627
15. World Series, Game 3 FOX 15.582
16. Two and a Half Men CBS 15.029
17. Heroes NBC 14.449
18. Cold Case CBS 14.160
19. Without a Trace CBS 13.367
20. Ugly Betty ABC 13.140

Did anyone else catch the whispers coming from the black smoke just before it attacked Eko? Right after he says, "The Lord is my shepherd, I shall not want" the smoke billows for a moment, you can hear faint whispers, then it strikes. I tried to turn it up, but couldn't make it out. It's been a while since we've had to decipher whispers, was it anything significant?

P.S. - Sorry if this has been covered. I searched but didn't find any reference to this.
I don't think that was mentioned. Maybe I will see it on line and listen for the whisppers.

That was last years ratings, 20 mil tuned in. This year it was 17 mil from a comparable week. It has lost 3 mil viewers. in the past year but so far this year it has been going up since the second week decline from the premiere episode..

TOP 20 IN TOTAL VIEWERS (IN MILLIONS) 10/23/06 -10/29/06
1. Desperate Housewives ABC 21.238
2. Dancing With the Stars (Tue.) ABC 20.695
3. Dancing With the Stars (Wed.) ABC 20.016
4. CSI: Miami CBS 17.833
5. CSI: NY CBS 17.424
6. Sunday Night Football NBC 17.331
7. Lost ABC 17.087
8. CSI: Crime Scene Investigation CBS 16.825
9. Criminal Minds CBS 16.768
10. 60 Minutes CBS 16.546
11. World Series, Game 5 FOX 16.276
12. World Series, Game 4 FOX 16.113
13. Deal or No Deal (Mon.) NBC 15.830
14. Extreme Makeover: Home Edition ABC 15.627
15. World Series, Game 3 FOX 15.582
16. Two and a Half Men CBS 15.029
17. Heroes NBC 14.449
18. Cold Case CBS 14.160
19. Without a Trace CBS 13.367
20. Ugly Betty ABC 13.140

For those of you who weren't aware, there is a huge world OUTSIDE of the US borders :rolleyes: and "LOST" in the second most watched program in the WORLD. (#1: CSI:Miami). There are more LOST viewers outside the US than inside.

And guess what? "American Idol" tanked in Bolivia. :eek:

Really, Boloivia's AI version tanked? I thought that show was a gold mine where ever it shows.

The fact that we have to sit here and discuss Nielson ratings is an utter sham, and as someone with a statistics degree it really makes me want to shoot myself in the face.

How many college students do any of you know that have been asked to participate in Nielson ratings? And how many older 35-50 year old homeowners do you know that have been asked? For me, the ration is about 4:0 in favor of the 35-50 year old homeowners despite knowing a lot more college students. The whole thing is a statistical sham and heavily weighted towards that demographic (while almost completely ignoring another demographic), hence the reason that the shows geared towards that demographic (reality shows like AI and Dancing with the Stars and crime dramas like CSI) always end up on top.

TV networks taking the Nielson ratings and extrapolating that to mean that show x is watched more than show y is like an election pollster taking the results from California and extrapolating that the democratic candidate wins every presidential election.

How many college students do any of you know that have been asked to participate in Nielson ratings?

The only time I was ever asked to participate in Nielson ratings was in college.

The fact that we have to sit here and discuss Nielson ratings is an utter sham, and as someone with a statistics degree it really makes me want to shoot myself in the face.

How many college students do any of you know that have been asked to participate in Nielson ratings? And how many older 35-50 year old homeowners do you know that have been asked? For me, the ration is about 4:0 in favor of the 35-50 year old homeowners despite knowing a lot more college students. The whole thing is a statistical sham and heavily weighted towards that demographic (while almost completely ignoring another demographic), hence the reason that the shows geared towards that demographic (reality shows like AI and Dancing with the Stars and crime dramas like CSI) always end up on top.

TV networks taking the Nielson ratings and extrapolating that to mean that show x is watched more than show y is like an election pollster taking the results from California and extrapolating that the democratic candidate wins every presidential election.I guess I'm glad I don't have a statistics degree if this is what it does to a person :eek:. I think the Nielsens are just a relative baseline that advertisers use to help make their purchasing decisions. I don't think anybody thinks they are 100% accurate (even the nielsen folks...).


ron

I guess I'm glad I don't have a statistics degree if this is what it does to a person :eek:. I think the Nielsens are just a relative baseline that advertisers use to help make their purchasing decisions. I don't think anybody thinks they are 100% accurate (even the nielsen folks...).


ron

That is what they're meant to be. Unfortunately it seems TV execs tend to put far more weight onto them than they're built to handle.

I guess I'm glad I don't have a statistics degree if this is what it does to a person :eek:. I think the Nielsens are just a relative baseline that advertisers use to help make their purchasing decisions. I don't think anybody thinks they are 100% accurate (even the nielsen folks...).


ron

But the fact is that, accurate or not, television shows literally live or die based on the statistics furnished to the networks by this company.

as someone with a statistics degree it really makes me want to shoot myself in the face.


Funniest thing I've read in a while. I agree (with the ratings comment not the shooting). :)

But the fact is that, accurate or not, television shows literally live or die based on the statistics furnished to the networks by this company.That is most definitely true. And it only seems to be getting worse every year unfortunately:(. Especially the initial ratings for new shows. Personally, I'm not convinced that the Nielsen numbers are totally out of wack. At least for what their main focus is (viewers of live TV). The DVR has created a problem in that regard. Probably worse than an initially unrepresentative sample I'd guess. Haven't I seen recently where they are now trying to address the DVR viewers somehow? Then again, how many DVR users actually watch the commercials? Advertisers may not care so much about their viewing anyway. Maybe the Nielsen numbers don't represent the actual total number of viewers (live or otherwise), but still do a pretty good job of rating the viewers that matter for ad buys anyway?


ron

I think the ratings have become less important over the years. If raw ratings were the only important factor, we wouldn't have multiple seasons of shows like 24, Smallville, Veronica Mars, the Simpsons, King of the Hill, and Alias. Networks seem to understand that they can't have a top twenty show in every time slot but they can make a profit from some shows with moderate ratings.

The fact that we have to sit here and discuss Nielson ratings is an utter sham, and as someone with a statistics degree it really makes me want to shoot myself in the face.

How many college students do any of you know that have been asked to participate in Nielson ratings? And how many older 35-50 year old homeowners do you know that have been asked? For me, the ration is about 4:0 in favor of the 35-50 year old homeowners despite knowing a lot more college students.

True enough. But what is the income of college students v.s. homeowners? I'm guessing it's 400:1 in favor of the 35-50 year olds. Am guessing that's who the advertisers are marketing to.

I'm currently in the 35-50 demographic and have never been asked to participate while in the demographic. When I was a recent grad ~26 yrs old, I participated in Nielson 2 times.....go figure.

But the fact is that, accurate or not, television shows literally live or die based on the statistics furnished to the networks by this company.
I thought it was all about focus groups these days...

No, it's all about ball bearings these days.

Good way to pass the time between episodes with all this ratings talk but it is 10 hours to show time. Lost is a top ten show in every demo that is important to ABC, We all know that. The ratings for the episodes have evened out at just over 17 mil viewers per week. With that said. Does anyone have any thoughts about tonights episode? Does anyone think they will have a cliffhanger? if so, will it be a good "can't wait till feb" episode or just a continuing the story line episode?

What's ABC's plan if "Day Break" tanks in the ratings? Do they suck it up and let it run or replace it with something else (that might be even worse!)?

They'll probably replace it with an hour long "Dancing with the Stars" highlight recap!

What's ABC's plan if "Day Break" tanks in the ratings? Do they suck it up and let it run or replace it with something else (that might be even worse!)?
I think ABC is just rolling the dice on this one. They have a show that will cater to the same younger crowd that watches LOST. They have already paid for the 13 episodes so they might air it no matter what the ratings might be like. Plus they have a very good ratings lead in with DWTS. But only time will tell. ABC might have the show starting the last three weeks of the sweeps period to maximize viewership for this show as DWTS ends its season. Remember this 2 part season is a good thing. Even though there were many ways ABC could have done it better or even worse.
I know I will watch it because I have always like the same day premise(as long as it is done correctly). My 9 pm wednesday time is already associated with LOST so watching a different channel and trying to get into it is out of the question.

Other than To Kill A Mockingbird being filmed in BLACK and WHITE and dealing with a black man on trial are there any other tie-ins with Lost?

The writers often like to throw in references to things like Carrie, The Bad Twin, The Stand, Watership Down, Turn of the Screw, and The Third Policeman, which are often red herrings, but sometimes supposedly have a clue in them.

The only thing that came to mind when she stated the movie was To Kill a Mockingbird is that the title comes from Atticus' statement about how one shouldn't kill Mockingbirds since they are nice/harmless or something along those lines.

So, I think the writers are trying to tell Jack that he shouldn't kill Ben regardless of what he thinks or what Juliette tells him.


Mitch

What's ABC's plan if "Day Break" tanks in the ratings? Do they suck it up and let it run or replace it with something else (that might be even worse!)?


or endless lost repeats like they did the previous seasons...

DVR users, 10:02 is listed end time tonight. Make adjustments if you haven't already

Nuttyinnyc,
Thanks for the heads up brotha!

I think ABC is just rolling the dice on this one. They have a show that will cater to the same younger crowd that watches LOST. They have already paid for the 13 episodes so they might air it no matter what the ratings might be like. Plus they have a very good ratings lead in with DWTS. But only time will tell. ABC might have the show starting the last three weeks of the sweeps period to maximize viewership for this show as DWTS ends its season. Remember this 2 part season is a good thing. Even though there were many ways ABC could have done it better or even worse.
I know I will watch it because I have always like the same day premise(as long as it is done correctly). My 9 pm wednesday time is already associated with LOST so watching a different channel and trying to get into it is out of the question.

I think the short arc of the story (13eps) stands in it's favor. As you say, we are already committed to that time slot anyway, and we know that we can watch 13 uninterrupted eps in a row and get to the 'end'. I'll definitely watch and see how it goes.

Nuttyinnyc,
Thanks for the heads up brotha!
It is the least I can do to help my DVR friends. Today of all days isn't a day you want to miss the last 5 min. you won't get a replay until Jan 31 or Feb 7, if there is any.

I think the short arc of the story (13eps) stands in it's favor. As you say, we are already committed to that time slot anyway, and we know that we can watch 13 uninterrupted eps in a row and get to the 'end'. I'll definitely watch and see how it goes.
that is true, I didn't think of it that way. This is scheduled as a 13 episode show. There might be a ending for it. Now you have me looking forward to it.

that is true, I didn't think of it that way. This is scheduled as a 13 episode show. There might be a ending for it. Now you have me looking forward to it.

If you go to the ABC website, you can see the first 20 minutes of Daybreak. It looks pretty compelling!

If it is true that the show is only going to be a 13 episode mini-series, than I am all for that. Like 24, you can guarantee it will be all wrapped up in a certain amount of time. For 24, an entire season sometimes drags on a little too long.

This concept is done in other countries frequently. In Mexico, soap operas are frequently designed as short stand-alone series, with a definite end.

I also remember reading of a show in Scandinavia when Lost started that was eerily similar to Lost, but it was a mini-series that took place over a discrete number of weeks, instead of dragging on for season after season.

...you won't get a replay until Jan 31 or Feb 7, if there is any.
As Dr. Phil would say, “The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior.”


NOT!!!

If you go to the ABC website, you can see the first 20 minutes of Daybreak. It looks pretty compelling!

If it is true that the show is only going to be a 13 episode mini-series, than I am all for that. Like 24, you can guarantee it will be all wrapped up in a certain amount of time. For 24, an entire season sometimes drags on a little too long.

This concept is done in other countries frequently. In Mexico, soap operas are frequently designed as short stand-alone series, with a definite end.

I also remember reading of a show in Scandinavia when Lost started that was eerily similar to Lost, but it was a mini-series that took place over a discrete number of weeks, instead of dragging on for season after season.
We just can't win over here. We have it both ways over here but the networks will never be able to satisfy everyone. TNT and USA shows their new series over a 8-13 week span, with no repeats. People want more. Scifi expands their series into 2 part seasons which is what LOST is trying to do. (Lost should have had an episode airing difference better than 6-17 IMO)People still want more even though though they will give us a 24 episode complete complete season with no repeats. We have also had non-stop shows (24 and AI, Scrubs had a repeat only 4 times last year)for 22-24 episodes but then people still complain because we don't get a rest or it goes a little too far. It takes a lot to commit 20 consecutive weeks to a TV show. No matter what they try we(the viewing public) will never be satisfied but at least they are trying to curb the rerun blues. At least they are listening to the viewers and trying something.

Great article in todays NY Newsday from Diane Werts about her dwindling interest in LOST..The article is titled "LOST, tangled up in darkness"..http://www.newsday.com/entertainment/tv/ny-etlost4964735nov08,0,815335.column?coll=ny-entertainment-headlines

Damn her butt looked good in that dress

Amazing episode. Jack was awesome. I didn't see that coming.

Can't wait till Feb. 7 to watch 16 weeks of Lost.

How'd we get this far into the season without...you know...him?

Great episode! Not only do we we get a great cliffhanger, we get a little Firefly/Serenity love with Nathan Fillion as Kate's love interest. :cool:

bravo, not a 20ft cliffhanger, but with still have agood one. we got a good one with the the opossible shoot out, Will Alex save saywer and Kate? will jack operate? Does he kill him because he ask for K & S to be there Do the losties start a resuce mission? So may thig scan happen 12 weeks, MO PROBLEM!!!
I was surprised that the comercials were just right. just enough that wasn't a competely overwel,.

The trio is boring. At least Jack wasn't whiny in this ep. No amount of plugging is going to get me to watch groundhogdaybreak.

Meh, I don't think they can do any better than the two spotlight-episodes featuring Eko (Psalm 23 last season & the one last week).

Good mini cliffhanger, I have to say I like the schedule plane, all things considered. This was a good number of episodes to get us involved, then a 12 week wait (8 would feel a little better I suppose) and nice run of 18 episodes. I can live with it.

On the subject of limited runs, it would be kind of cool if they not only made it a limited run of perhaps 4 seasons, but also filmed seasons 2-4 all at once, ala 'Lord of the Rings'--after they realized season 1 is a hit. That does result in savings (somehow) and we would know the scope of the series and that we will one day see an ending of it regardless.

I know this is an impossibility, just think it would be cool.

I really enjoyed the episode, just wish it was about an hour longer. Its going to be a long three months.

I am confused. Who let Jack out of his cage and why was there no one at the control room? The irony of Jack going through all this to free Kate and Sawyer was that they stayed for hours in an open cage and the Others did nothing about it / didn't care.

I'm surprised no one's asked this yet- but WHO'S JACOB?

Great episode! Not only do we we get a great cliffhanger, we get a little Firefly/Serenity love with Nathan Fillion as Kate's love interest. :cool:
I loved the part where he got drugged. Reminded me of that episode of Firefly where he got "married" on that.

I am confused. Who let Jack out of his cage and why was there no one at the control room? The irony of Jack going through all this to free Kate and Sawyer was that they stayed for hours in an open cage and the Others did nothing about it / didn't care.

I think they did it on purpose, they left the door open, and left the screens on so he'd see them together.

They intentionally set up Jack to get him upset @ KAte..

that is true, I didn't think of it that way. This is scheduled as a 13 episode show. There might be a ending for it. Now you have me looking forward to it.16! :D

Lost is not completing anything at all, yet I keep watching :)

I was really hoping and thinking that jack should just tell ben her plan to kill him in the surgery. It would probably shake things up with the others

I'm surprised no one's asked this yet- but WHO'S JACOB?

Exactly. Jacob didn't ask for Jack, Ben did. That implies that Jacob is the one who is really in charge and also the one who asked for Kate and James to be brought in.

More questions as usual.

I thought it was great that Jack unwittingly saved Sawyer (James) from being shot. (Well, at least postponed it.)

I loved the part where he got drugged. Reminded me of that episode of Firefly where he got "married" on that.


yeah i drew the connection to that too. it also helps that was the most recent episode of Firefly shown on Universal HD. My favorite so far.


i am having trouble understanding what they want me to think of Kate. Is she a badass or just a whore? ;)

but seriously, i thought for sure with all the arguing back and forth, kate was gonna swipe the gun away and save sawyer.

Exactly. Jacob didn't ask for Jack, Ben did. That implies that Jacob is the one who is really in charge and also the one who asked for Kate and James to be brought in.

Not necessarily. Jacob could just be Ethan's real name (are we sure of his real name?) or one of the other dudes Ben sent to investigate and report back. They reported back with a list of who would be good to take (for whatever reason), but then Ben added on Jack.

Did anyone else lose their HD feed? After about 5 minutes, while Locke was "explaining" what happened to Eko, suddenly Lost cut away to another HD ABC program... the ABC bug was in the corner... it was a shot of a high rise with some cheezy 70's sounding music. Then it cut back to lost in SD, and it was SD for the rest of the show. The most irritating thing was a news flash about the projection of the Democrats taking control of the Senate. It's big news but the scroll took half the screen and they threw in some terrible ABC news update music which mixed in with the music for Lost.

Good episode, but it sucks that I had to see the last Lost for three months ****ed up.

I wonder what that was when Locke saw the writings on Ecko's cane that said 'look north'? A way to be able to see the other island that Jack, Kate, and Sawyer are on?

Not necessarily. Jacob could just be Ethan's real name (are we sure of his real name?) or one of the other dudes Ben sent to investigate and report back. They reported back with a list of who would be good to take (for whatever reason), but then Ben added on Jack.

When the Other's witnessed the plane crash, Benry called him Ethan.

Slightly OT, but when I saw suburban Kate, she reminded me of Nikki Cox (Las Vegas) less the boobs and lips. Looking quickly, I saw a striking resemblance.

More OT, I never heard a reference to Jacob. When did that occur? Also, Ben seemed very concerned about Alex when he was about to go under. Anyone hear what he said under his breath when he was told she was on her way home, or something like that?

Malcolm Reynolds!!!shift+1!

More OT, I never heard a reference to Jacob. When did that occur? Also, Ben seemed very concerned about Alex when he was about to go under. Anyone hear what he said under his breath when he was told she was on her way home, or something like that?

When Danny pulls the other guy out of the OR observation room to go kill Sawyer, he says "Shepherd wasn't on Jacob's list anyway." So on this list- was it only Losties with say "questionable" pasts? Why not Jin then too? Or Eko? What was the criteria for the list?

My thoughts are that with all the authority Ben SEEMS to wield, Jacob can't be on the island(s). And if we assume Juliette really does want Ben out of the way, is it so she can be number 2? Or do we just assume she was full o' crap all along?

Dammit, why can't just one of these people, when they have the advantage as Jack did, ask WHAT IS GOING ON? I honestly don't care if it generates an answer but it's maddening how no one asks.

Wasn't Jacob Desmond's fiance's father's name?

Hmmm - Ben referred to Alex in an almost paternal manner. Perhaps we now have a better idea why Danielle shot Ben with an arrow.

I wonder what that was when Locke saw the writings on Ecko's cane that said 'look north'? A way to be able to see the other island that Jack, Kate, and Sawyer are on?

In the TV Titan description of the episode, it said "Locke finds a clue that may be the key to understanding the secrets of the island", whatever that is supposed to mean.

Maybe Eko somehow saw the second island?

Hmmm - Ben referred to Alex in an almost paternal manner. Perhaps we now have a better idea why Danielle shot Ben with an arrow.

Assuming the most obvious that Alex is Danielle's stolen baby, Ben and Juliette raised her as their own daughter. So Ben and Danielle......????

Was it Jack's intention to "spring" both Sawyer & Kate?

Was it Jack's intention to "spring" both Sawyer & Kate?


My question too. He didn't say "Kate and Sawyer, RUN", he said "Kate, Run!!!"...like he didn't care what happened to Sawyer.

My question too. He didn't say "Kate and Sawyer, RUN", he said "Kate, Run!!!"...like he didn't care what happened to Sawyer. I'm guessing you have to assume that Jack knows Kate would take Sawyer since he saw them in the cage together. Also, last season Sawyer told Jack he considered him a friend, so I don't think Jack would hang him out to dry.

Plus, I think Kate and Sawyer are going to find Desmond's boat and use it to get back to their island.

I'm guessing you have to assume that Jack knows Kate would take Sawyer since he saw them in the cage together. Also, last season Sawyer told Jack he considered him a friend, so I don't think Jack would hang him out to dry.

Plus, I think Kate and Sawyer are going to find Desmond's boat and use it to get back to their island.


Did Sawyer tell Kate they were on a different island before or after she talked to Jack in the holding cell?

Did Sawyer tell Kate they were on a different island before or after she talked to Jack in the holding cell?After she spoke w/ Jack.

I wonder:

1. what will be the flashback of Ben in season 7?
2. Will they invent flashback within flashback?

My question too. He didn't say "Kate and Sawyer, RUN", he said "Kate, Run!!!"...like he didn't care what happened to Sawyer.

Yes, and he also said something to the effect of I have to get off this island, not we. (Without going "back to the tape" I may have gotten that wrong. I just remember being startled by his choice of pronoun when there are 3 of them trapped by the Others.)

...And if we assume Juliette really does want Ben out of the way, is it so she can be number 2? Or do we just assume she was full o' crap all along?...

I'd hate to play poker with her (Juliette)!

What questions have been answered in the 6 episodes of Season 3? What new questions have arisen?

Since Ben was ready to go under the knife there seems no doubt that he has a tumor on his spine. Apparently, having a spinal surgeon fall out of the sky a few days after he learned of the tumor reinforces his belief in God. This strongly implies that the others can't leave the island, and Ben is dependant on Jack to do the surgery. Yet, the Others appear able to somehow aquire modern appliances, equipment and information from the outside world.

I've always had a feelling Danielle was actually one of the Others, it just feels strange she never seen any other person in the isalnd until she came across Sayid - - hard to believe.

I think there is defenitely a connection between Danielle and Ben.

I think there is a fundamental connection with Desmond's fiance or her father.

Just my 2 cents.

Did anyone else lose their HD feed?Yup, but I think it was our local station.

And I wasn't nearly as impressed with this episode. Backstories are nice, but they're starting to drag. How old is Kate anyway? She killed her step father, been married, been in a bank robbery, caused a friend to be killed. I forgot - how did she get to Australia? Someone else mentioned it earlier, but I wonder if she's pregnant now. If the whole point of taking them was to get Kate and Sawyer to hook up, my interest is going to wane pretty quickly. Especially if the writers continue their habit of not answering questions but creating new ones regularly. Because I haven't seen this season live up to the hype that all (or even some) of our questions would be answered.

Maybe Eko somehow saw the second island?And of course, neglected to tell anyone about it, cause it's so unimportant.

Yes, and he also said something to the effect of I have to get off this island, not we. (Without going "back to the tape" I may have gotten that wrong. I just remember being startled by his choice of pronoun when there are 3 of them trapped by the Others.)


Part of his ruse to get Benry under the knife and within Jack's control.

And of course, neglected to tell anyone about it, cause it's so unimportant.

He was a quick study and learned the rules well: tell no one critical information until it is too late.

Yup, but I think it was our local station.

And I wasn't nearly as impressed with this episode. Backstories are nice, but they're starting to drag. How old is Kate anyway? She killed her step father, been married, been in a bank robbery, caused a friend to be killed. I forgot - how did she get to Australia? Someone else mentioned it earlier, but I wonder if she's pregnant now. If the whole point of taking them was to get Kate and Sawyer to hook up, my interest is going to wane pretty quickly. Especially if the writers continue their habit of not answering questions but creating new ones regularly. Because I haven't seen this season live up to the hype that all (or even some) of our questions would be answered.

The only connection I could get out of Kate's backstory is that in the past she has been shown to run. In this case, even though she could get out of her cage anytime she wanted, she stayed for Sawyer's sake. Perhaps a way to show that she has changed?

The only connection I could get out of Kate's backstory is that in the past she has been shown to run. In this case, even though she could get out of her cage anytime she wanted, she stayed for Sawyer's sake. Perhaps a way to show that she has changed?

She wanted to run, not stay. The only reason she stayed was because Sawyer told her that they were stuck. Running would do no good as they were stuck on an island, like alcatraz.

Since there was no where to run, they both stayed.

What questions have been answered in the 6 episodes of Season 3? What new questions have arisen?

Since Ben was ready to go under the knife there seems no doubt that he has a tumor on his spine. Apparently, having a spinal surgeon fall out of the sky a few days after he learned of the tumor reinforces his belief in God. This strongly implies that the others can't leave the island, and Ben is dependant on Jack to do the surgery. Yet, the Others appear able to somehow aquire modern appliances, equipment and information from the outside world.

maybe because you can get into the Island(s), but you can never leave ?

Also, could Jacob be the eye-patch guy on the screen from the previous episode ?

Yup, but I think it was our local station.

And I wasn't nearly as impressed with this episode. Backstories are nice, but they're starting to drag. How old is Kate anyway? She killed her step father, been married, been in a bank robbery, caused a friend to be killed. I forgot - how did she get to Australia? Someone else mentioned it earlier, but I wonder if she's pregnant now. If the whole point of taking them was to get Kate and Sawyer to hook up, my interest is going to wane pretty quickly. Especially if the writers continue their habit of not answering questions but creating new ones regularly. Because I haven't seen this season live up to the hype that all (or even some) of our questions would be answered.

Her dead husband,at least the one played by the guy from Firefly, presented her with the two tickets to Australia as a honeymoon, the morning that she found out she was pregnant, and later killed him.

I think this backstory wasn't bad, we find out that she was on the run from the Feds, not just for killing her stepdad, but conning/killing ex-husbands as well.

Her dead husband,at least the one played by the guy from Firefly, presented her with the two tickets to Australia as a honeymoon, the morning that she found out she was pregnant, and later killed him.

I think this backstory wasn't bad, we find out that she was on the run from the Feds, not just for killing her stepdad, but conning/killing ex-husbands as well.


The tickets were to Costa Rica for their honeymoon. She couldn't go, because there was no way she would be able to get a passport. She didn't kill her husband, she just drugged him so she could get away. It also gave him an alibi (sp?) of sorts, so that he could say that he didn't know she was a fugitive, thereby protecting his job (Kate said all of this).

We don't know exactly how she got to Australia...can only assume that she was running from the marshal...but how she got there w/o a passport is a mystery.

The tickets were to Costa Rica for their honeymoon. She couldn't go, because there was no way she would be able to get a passport. She didn't kill her husband, she just drugged him so she could get away. It also gave him an alibi (sp?) of sorts, so that he could say that he didn't know she was a fugitive, thereby protecting his job (Kate said all of this).

We don't know exactly how she got to Australia...can only assume that she was running from the marshal...but how she got there w/o a passport is a mystery.

One other point. She found out she WASN'T pregnant. My wife and I rewound the ol' tivo to make sure, but it absolutely showed only a dash, not a plus on the pregnancy test.

Her dead husband,at least the one played by the guy from Firefly, presented her with the two tickets to Australia as a honeymoon, the morning that she found out she was pregnant, and later killed him.

Who said he was dead? Also, I thought the test said that she wasn't pregnant. It was negative. She told hubby that she almost had a baby.

Who said he was dead? Also, I thought the test said that she wasn't pregnant. It was negative. She told hubby that she almost had a baby.

Yeah, they made it a little overly obvious she wasn't pregnant zooming in on the +/- signs.

still kinda unnecessary, but it gave her a reason to cry on camera.

Yeah, they made it a little overly obvious she wasn't pregnant zooming in on the +/- signs.

still kinda unnecessary, but it gave her a reason to cry on camera.


I think the entire point behind this was to show that she CANNOT settle down and will always be running. She thought she was pregnant, then when she found out she wasn't, she had to leave as she didn't want to take this chance again as a child may keep her in place. The Marshall didn't believe it when she said she was done running.

Her dead husband,at least the one played by the guy from Firefly, presented her with the two tickets to Australia as a honeymoon, the morning that she found out she was pregnant, and later killed him.

I think this backstory wasn't bad, we find out that she was on the run from the Feds, not just for killing her stepdad, but conning/killing ex-husbands as well.

As pointed out by several folks...you need to go re-watch the show agian...it'll change your whole (flawed) perspective on Kate.

(From Marc Berman’s Thursday, Nov. 9, 2006, Programming Insider column at Mediaweek.com )

In the 9-10 p.m. battle of ABC’s Lost versus CBS’ booming Criminal Minds, it was another week of shared leadership. Lost was second in the overnights (11.6/17) and total viewers (17.10 million) and first among adults 18-49 (7.0/17), while Criminal Minds was just the opposite with an 11.7/17 in the overnights (#1), 17.54 million viewers (#1) and a second-place 5.1/12 among adults 18-49. As for Lost, considering we now have to wait another three months for an original episode, I wish there would have been some sort of resolution -- anything -- last night. Why we needed another back-story on Kate’s shady past (which revealed nothing new about the character) was beyond me. J.J. -- what’s going on?

• Source: Nielsen Media Research data
http://pifeedback.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/63310451/m/97010691

I was actually pretty disappointed with this episode. I've been a huge fan all the way through and was really excited about the "fall finale." But not much happened.

As a fan of the backstories, last night's really didn't give us new info about Kate.

And for what happened on the island, none of it was amazing. The best part was when John focused on Ecko's stick. I got really excited that we would see him find the other island, but I guess that will have to wait for Feb.

It seemed like this was a big set-up for the 2nd "half."


tim

I just wish they would have given us at least one answer to tide us over until Feb. We still know nothing more about the others than we did when the season began. What about Desmond's ex and the Russians (I think they were Russians) at the monitoring station? That was the big season 2 finale, but 6 episodes into this season and it hasn't even been mentioned. They don't have to solve the whole puzzle, but give us a SINGLE answer.

I just wish they would have given us at least one answer to tide us over until Feb. We still know nothing more about the others than we did when the season began. What about Desmond's ex and the Russians (I think they were Russians) at the monitoring station? That was the big season 2 finale, but 6 episodes into this season and it hasn't even been mentioned. They don't have to solve the whole puzzle, but give us a SINGLE answer.

I know. My big question is still this "How does Kate keep her underams so well groomed...no hair?" Razor, waxing, come on JJ, let us know something :D

I do agree with what you are saying, my feelings too.

What about the Black lady that was calling the shots when Walt was abducted. She seemed to be a major player with the others but has since disappeared.

Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy
Yes, and he also said something to the effect of I have to get off this island, not we. (Without going "back to the tape" I may have gotten that wrong. I just remember being startled by his choice of pronoun when there are 3 of them trapped by the Others.)


Part of his ruse to get Benry under the knife and within Jack's control.This is what I was thinking too. Maybe that's giving Jack too much credit, but I think he was just playing along and giving Ben the answer he expected to hear. It seemed like Jack at first felt some pangs of jealousy when he saw Kate and Sawyer on the monitor, but then quickly realized it was all too easy and that he was supposed to see them and get pissed off enough to agree to the operation to help himself. The only thing is, didn't the voice whispering on his intercom sound kinda like Alex? At first I thought it was and that would have made sense, trying to spring him. But that doesn't fit in with the other theory. So, maybe that was just misdirection to keep the viewers guessing?

One thing about the ep that bugged me a little. Having Kate and Sawyer going at it in/against one of their cages? Right then in that kind of situation? OK, I understand Kate being super hot and all, so you can't blame the guy I guess. But knowing that video cameras were trained on them? I can see Sawyer being a bit of an exhibitionist I suppose, but I have to wonder if that would have happened if Kate knew about the cameras too? Anyway, it made me think of a story a friend of mine told me years ago. He was on vacation in Mexico with his girlfriend and they had just gotten back to their bungalow from a margarita drinking session at a bar. They proceeded to, uh, "do what comes natural", and during the action they heard something outside. They looked up only to see this little Mexican kid peeping on them through the window. Being the self deprecating sort that he is, my friend said he felt like he was in a bad porno movie or something :).

It's going to be a long break till LOST fires back up, but all those back to back, continuous ep's starting in Feb should be great though.


ron

I sure hope they get moving come february. What a waste this first half has been. absolutely nothing has happenend.

No update on the dudes who monitoredthe electromagnetic activity.

No update on where Walt & Micheal end up in the boat (they are probably on the other island ;)

And It would be nice to have a flash back / recap of how the others spent the days on the island from the crash until now. (kinda like how they did the tallies recap)

What about Desmond's ex and the Russians (I think they were Russians) at the monitoring station?Not Russians but Portuguese, judging by the language they spoke.

The tickets were to Costa Rica for their honeymoon. She couldn't go, because there was no way she would be able to get a passport. She didn't kill her husband, she just drugged him so she could get away. It also gave him an alibi (sp?) of sorts, so that he could say that he didn't know she was a fugitive, thereby protecting his job (Kate said all of this).

We don't know exactly how she got to Australia...can only assume that she was running from the marshal...but how she got there w/o a passport is a mystery.
Did you notice the airline on which they were booked to Costa Rica? ;)

So Jack agreed to do the surgery on Ben in exchange for getting him (and Kate/Sawyer) off the island. Ben agreed readily, I'm assuming, because getting them off this second island would only put them back on the island they crashed on, no?

ok, i've been assuming they want kate + sawyer to mate and make little katsaws -- the dress, the adjoining cages, the do you love him bit -- and they got them together. but then, trixie's hubby almost killed sawyer. is the guy just going off script or is my theory shot?

also, anyone thinks alex is part of the con? at least, they're using her to con the trio. they made her believe they killed her b/f, so she would scare kate so kate would talk jack into the surgery, etc.

i agree that jack knew they were playing him w/ the control room. now why didn't jack just shoot ben in the gut then asked him a few questions, like "what is this place, who are you people, how do i get off this freaking island. make it good and i may patch you up; otherwise, i'll let you bleed out and solve your tumor problem the easy way."

that's assuming the gun wasn't loaded w/ blanks.

i agree they should've pulled the other dangling threads in -- more locvked and the prayer stick, more desmond's g/f -- to really get us excited for the spring. as it is, a little too little material for too long a wait