I've had the chance to communicate some with TWC about some of the pressing issues with the 8300HD. They are aware of the issues with HDMI and HDCP, and a fix is in the pipeline. Probably another 2-4 weeks or so ETA. Release dates may vary due to workload.

Here are the crux of the conversations, posted with permission.

1. Will the [HDCP firmware] revision also support Dolby 5.1 over HDMI?

TWC: The new Pioneer code mentioned below will be going to our TWC lab soon (anticipated to go there within 2 weeks). Once the lab has tested the software, we will put it out to customers.

Pioneer: Yes, but the 8300 hd has a hardware bug, below is the information and our workaround:
There is an issue with the HDMI port and Dolby Digital. When the HDMI cable is plugged into a HD set, the 8300 will query if the HDTV has a built in AC3 decoder. If the HDTV does not have an AC3 decoder, the 8300 will convert the audio to PCM 2.0 stereo. Unfortunately this also means the digital audio ports will output PCM 2.0 stereo. We have made a new modification to Passport which adds a new General Setting option. This new option will allow the subscriber to force Dolby Digital to the digital output ports.

2. Will the "Save to VCR" functionality that's implemented in the SARA software, be supported by Passport as well?

TWC: This is something Pioneer is looking at for the Echo 4.0 timeframe. The 4.0 code does not have a scheduled release date yet. So, we do not know the availability time frame.

3. What are TWC's plans regarding the Firewire and SATA ports on the 8300HD?

TWC: There are some technical issues that need to be resolved to support SATA. Pioneer is currently looking at Echo 5.0 for support (could be a summer time frame to the lab) for this feature. As for the 1394, Pioneer is awaiting driver support from SA on the 1394. There is no time frame as yet.

TWC: I hope these answers have been somewhat helpful. I know they do not give you the hard dates you would like to have. We work in concert with a variety of hardware and software vendors to make the digital systems work well. We are also trying to provide new services that customers desire. Release dates for code are projected and often changed due to issues that come up during testing. Please bear with us while we work through the technical issues of supplying and supporting these products.

Regards,
JnC

Dang, we are only on version "ResApp Version: PASSPORT Echo 1.8.095" on the 8300HD DVR. Considering the distance between the small Passport updates in the past couple years it's gonna be quit a long wait till version 4.0 or 5.0 comes around.

Does anyone else have a problem getting VOD (HBO, Showtime, PPV) on the 8300HD? I thought this was a TWCNYC problem and not the 8300's problem, but I went to my old Pioneer HD box and was able to get the VOD without a hitch. On the 8300, though, all I get is "one moment please...." forever.

Just tuned BBCA and golf shows from the VOD menus on NYC's TWC system (S. Manhattan). Just a few seconds wait. Perhaps a 'self-authorization', possible with a touch-tone menu when you call TWC initially, will bring in the VODs. Or a cold boot might do the job. -- John

Cool thanks John....

stlbluefan: My non-HD 8000 used to do this and it turned out to have a dead 2nd tuner. PIP wouldn't work either so that also confirmed a 2nd tuner issue.

Can you PIP/Swap ??

hall: yeah i can PIP/swap and i've recorded two shows simultaneously, so i don't think that's the issue. anyway, i rebooted four times before i was able to get the reboot sequence to advance past the second "ball" on the passport screen. once that was successful, i was able to get the VOD (although it still took about 20 seconds....).

thanks for your help!!!

Can you also ask them if they can add the black sidebar option for Passport, also output downcoverted HD channels to anamorphic rather than gray-bar letterbox on the s-video output?

Tuesday or Wednesday I called TWC Customer Support (after working hours) about a couple Encore channels being off and the recording said they were having difficulty with VOD services. Might be a nation wide problem.

Originally posted by michaeltscott
Hmmm. I was reading the manual for a recent DCR Samsung and it had a sound setting for DD5.1 output. Are you sure that your television doesn't? I'm not saying that it should have a setting that associates it with HDMI, like "Output 5.1 HDMI Audio". Just "Output 5.1 Audio" or something like that.

....

If, upon connecting to the display, the DVR sees in the E-EDID that it supports a particular audio format, that's the audio format that it will produce and send to the display for output. Since it only has one audio chip, it presumably can only convert the MPEG audio to one format of PCM using it, and it sends out that conversion over all of the digital audio outputs, HDMI, coax and optical.

...

A reasonable television implementation (IMHO) should have a setting which would disable its speakers. After that has been done, it would then give an indication in its E-EDID that it didn't support audio which would stop the DVR from sending it. Apparently, some televisions do this.

...


Yes my TV has a setting for 5.1 output. When activated, it will send out 5.1 audio from the internal tuner. What it won't do is send 5.1 audio from the HDMI port (actually right now I cannot get it to send any audio from the HDMI port). As far as I know, the Sonys with HDMI do not pass 5.1 either. Have you read any reports of a TV that does.

I don't have speakers attached to my TV. I have also tried disabling audio on the HDMI port. It seems to make no difference.

Originally posted by ADGrant
Yes my TV has a setting for 5.1 output. When activated, it will send out 5.1 audio from the internal tuner. What it won't do is send 5.1 audio from the HDMI port (actually right now I cannot get it to send any audio from the HDMI port). As far as I know, the Sonys with HDMI do not pass 5.1 either. Have you read any reports of a TV that does.

I don't have speakers attached to my TV. I have also tried disabling audio on the HDMI port. It seems to make no difference. Well, that kind of sucks, though I guess that it would take some work from the television. However, if I connected a DVD player directly to that television via HDMI (and there are several DVD players out now with HDMI connections), I'd expect the 5.1 audio output from the HDMI wire to emerge from the television's 5.1 connections. Of course, an alternate way of hooking such things up if you have an HDMI switching receiver (and some now exist), is to connect all of the HDMI devices to the receiver, select the one your want to play, and the receiver directly takes the sound from the HDMI wire and plays it, forwarding the signal on to the television.

Though the true solution would be for all of the televisions to work "properly", the practical one is the one that SARA has implemented, which is an option to have HDMI ignore the sound capabilities of the connected sink and always deliver 5.1. JnC's post above says that it's coming, though lord only knows when your cable provider might push it to the STBs.

Originally posted by michaeltscott
Well, that kind of sucks, though I guess that it would take some work from the television. However, if I connected a DVD player directly to that television via HDMI (and there are several DVD players out now with HDMI connections), I'd expect the 5.1 audio output from the HDMI wire to emerge from the television's 5.1 connections. Of course, an alternate way of hooking such things up if you have an HDMI switching receiver (and some now exist), is to connect all of the HDMI devices to the receiver, select the one your want to play, and the receiver directly takes the sound from the HDMI wire and plays it, forwarding the signal on to the television.

Though the true solution would be for all of the televisions to work "properly", the practical one is the one that SARA has implemented, which is an option to have HDMI ignore the sound capabilities of the connected sink and always deliver 5.1. JnC's post above says that it's coming, though lord only knows when your cable provider might push it to the STBs.

It does rather suck. Do you know of anyone who has managed to pass 5.1 audio from any source device to a TV via the HDMI input and had it passthru to the digital audio out. If so what source device and what TV.

Originally posted by ADGrant
It does rather suck. Do you know of anyone who has managed to pass 5.1 audio from any source device to a TV via the HDMI input and had it passthru to the digital audio out. If so what source device and what TV.

To me it sounds like there is at least one happy person among us.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4823344#post4823344

I think there is a firmware load that will fix this, but it hasn't been pushed here in Raleighwood, yet.

Originally posted by IamtheWolf
To me it sounds like there is at least one happy person among us.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4823344#post4823344

I think there is a firmware load that will fix this, but it hasn't been pushed here in Raleighwood, yet. That's a primarily SARA discussion and I think that he was talking about SARA, which is known to have a setting to disable HDMI audio. The reference to the documentation on Scientific Atlanta's site is one indication--all of that pertains to SARA. They don't keep any documentation of Passport online.

And to answer your question, ADGrant, no, I don't know of any such television.

Originally posted by Joxer
Can you also ask them if they can add the black sidebar option for Passport, also output downcoverted HD channels to anamorphic rather than gray-bar letterbox on the s-video output?

Just add 480P to the output formats on your 8300 and you'll get the black side bars on SD material.

Originally posted by michaeltscott
That's a primarily SARA discussion and I think that he was talking about SARA, which is known to have a setting to disable HDMI audio. The reference to the documentation on Scientific Atlanta's site is one indication--all of that pertains to SARA. They don't keep any documentation of Passport online...

I hope you're wrong. I went to the SA site and got the PDF, but it doesn't indicate SARA or Passport. I dropped a PM to the original poster to check if he has SARA or Passport.

Originally posted by IamtheWolf
I hope you're wrong. I went to the SA site and got the PDF, but it doesn't indicate SARA or Passport. I dropped a PM to the original poster to check if he has SARA or Passport.

Anything you read on the Scientific Atlanta website will pertain only to their own SARA software, no Pioneer Passport information whatsoever.

Originally posted by IamtheWolf
I hope you're wrong. I went to the SA site and got the PDF, but it doesn't indicate SARA or Passport. I dropped a PM to the original poster to check if he has SARA or Passport. I'll be shocked if SA's site has any documentation for Passport. Haven't you compared the graphics in that document to the graphics in your DVR's menus and found them to be different?

The only "official" documentation of Passport Echo online is this (http://www.pioneerbroadband.com/pdf/passportecho1.6gettingstarted.pdf), from the site of its creator, Pioneer Broadband. It's for v1.6 and the 8300HD comes with v1.8, but no one's reported any changes in the UI over v1.5 other than the multi-character guide searches, and that's documented in this v1.6 guide. It's a quick-reference type guide that only discusses a single setting option, but there are some tricks explained there (15-minute skip, multi-day guide skip, etc) that you might find useful.

Originally posted by michaeltscott
I'll be shocked if SA's site has any documentation for Passport. Haven't you compared the graphics in that document to the graphics in your DVR's menus and found them to be different?...

Yes, but I'd never take the docs at face value, not knowing if SW has changed, been updated, or even distributed before the docs could catch up.

Thanks for the info.

E

I am having to reboot my SA 8300 (using TWC) on a regular basis after it locks up while trying to change channels while recording. When it happens, I can't control it with the remote or even turn off via the unit. I have to unplug it. It mostly does it when I am recording something. I will be flipping through the stations fine until...bam. It just freezes up.

I've read that this is not unique to my unit. Does anyone know if replacing the SA 8300 unit fixes or minimizes the problem. Or is it a signal strength issue for which I need to call a tech out? I couldn't determine that via reading the thread. FYI - I already have a booster.

???

Tivo has a back door 30-second skip

I'm also curious about this. Mine lost video today (no tv video from the HDMI or component, but it had sound and would display menus. I tried a lot of different setting changes, but it took a reboot to clear it. My TV is a very tight fit in a built-in and getting to the power is real pain. Is there a button sequence to force a reboot?

Anyone else watching the Final Four with lots of digital trash? All other channels are fine.

Charlie

Originally posted by Thegov3
I am having to reboot my SA 8300 (using TWC) on a regular basis after it locks up while trying to change channels while recording. When it happens, I can't control it with the remote or even turn off via the unit. I have to unplug it. It mostly does it when I am recording something. I will be flipping through the stations fine until...bam. It just freezes up.

I've read that this is not unique to my unit. Does anyone know if replacing the SA 8300 unit fixes or minimizes the problem. Or is it a signal strength issue for which I need to call a tech out? I couldn't determine that via reading the thread. FYI - I already have a booster.

???

To reboot, you can just press the power button on the box (not the remote), and hold it pressed for about 10 seconds.

Regarding your tight fit, the older SA8000 was VERY sensitive to heat. The 8300 is supposedly less so, but it still may be the root cause of your problems.

-barry

I just came back from a trip and now my cable box will not output digital audio through either coaxial or optical. Did they just break the digital audio with a software upgrade. The only way I can watch HD channels with sound right now is to use HDMI with 2.0 analog. I can't get any sound on the HD channels with component outputs. Any help would be appreciated greatly!

I just came back from a trip and now my cable box will not output digital audio through either coaxial or optical. Did they just break the digital audio with a software upgrade. The only way I can watch HD channels with sound right now is to use HDMI with 2.0 analog. I can't get any sound on the HD channels with component outputs. Any help would be appreciated greatly!

I just came back from a trip and now my cable box will not output digital audio through either coaxial or optical. Did they just break the digital audio with a software upgrade. The only way I can watch HD channels with sound right now is to use HDMI with 2.0 analog. I can't get any sound on the HD channels with component outputs. Any help would be appreciated greatly!

Originally posted by ANGEL 35
Tivo has a back door 30-second skip This seems curiously non sequitir.

FYI, these SA boxes supposedly had a 30-second instant skip as well, but it was removed on request from the cable providers. They sell advertisement on some of the channels that they carry and giving people a means to avoid watching it is not particularly something that they have an interest in doing. Instant skipping in ad-length intervals is highly controversial, which is why it's a "backdoor" feature in TiVo. There's a button for it on the Replay remote, but their user's guide description for it carefully doesn't suggest using it to skip ads.

these SA boxes supposedly had a 30-second instant skip as well, but it was removed on request from the cable providers.

Does this mean that the box would still respond (skip ahead 30 seconds) if the correct signal was sent to it or is this feature completely dead?

I have just gotten the 8300 DVR (Time Warner) and am trying to coordinate it with Tivo use. I don't want to give up the Tivo, and Ideally, I would like to avoid renting a separate box just for the Tivo. I also don't want to limit the Tivo to analog channels. I have most of the basics down, but I am not sure if there is any way to control what goes to the s-video out (to Tivo) as opposed to the HD component out.

For example, if a Tivo recording is underway, can I watch something else using the second tuner without changing what Tivo is seeing, or will the signal routed to the s-video out automatically change to whatever I am watching on the HD component out? If I can't avoid that, then as soon as I start changing channels it will mess up the Tivo recording.

I know that the 8300 will protect recordings IT is making, so I can watch channel B while channel A is recording. Is there any way to watch the main display without changing the display routed to the s-video out?

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Originally posted by Jsipe
Does this mean that the box would still respond (skip ahead 30 seconds) if the correct signal was sent to it or is this feature completely dead?

It's disabled in the software and won't respond to any signal whatsover, even if such a signal existed. Some people use high-end universal remotes and have programmed a macro to mimick 30 second skip (as well as 1 minute and 3 minute skips etc).

Basically, no, you cannot route different channels to different outputs, with one exception. The box automatically routes whatever is in the PIP window to the OUT2 composite jacks. It only does this if the PIP window is being displayed. And here's the big problem with that: last time I checked (several weeks ago) there was a bug with PIP, and the window would automatically close after about 15 minutes if you didn't move it so take some similar action. So it's not very useful.

-barry

Originally posted by BL
I have just gotten the 8300 DVR (Time Warner) and am trying to coordinate it with Tivo use. I don't want to give up the Tivo, and Ideally, I would like to avoid renting a separate box just for the Tivo. I also don't want to limit the Tivo to analog channels. I have most of the basics down, but I am not sure if there is any way to control what goes to the s-video out (to Tivo) as opposed to the HD component out.

For example, if a Tivo recording is underway, can I watch something else using the second tuner without changing what Tivo is seeing, or will the signal routed to the s-video out automatically change to whatever I am watching on the HD component out? If I can't avoid that, then as soon as I start changing channels it will mess up the Tivo recording.

I know that the 8300 will protect recordings IT is making, so I can watch channel B while channel A is recording. Is there any way to watch the main display without changing the display routed to the s-video out?

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks.

don't know if anyone has seen this yet, here it is just in case, for your reading curiosity:

Seagate queues up 400GB DVR
Hard-drive maker Seagate has developed new digital-video recording technologies aimed at addressing concerns about capacity and digital-rights management.

Seagate representatives are demonstrating the new DVR features for cable service carriers at the National Cable Show conference in San Francisco this week. For storage-hungry consumers, the company is showing an add-on 400GB external hard drive, which is being tested with cable operators. The drive at the show attaches to the Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8300 Series DVR. Seagate is also showing a prototype 2.5-inch 120GB hard drive that can be added internally to set-top boxes.

FULL STORY (http://news.com.com/Seagate+queues+up+400GB+DVR/2100-1041_3-5653830.html?tag=nefd.top)

Originally posted by BL
I have just gotten the 8300 DVR (Time Warner) and am trying to coordinate it with Tivo use. I don't want to give up the Tivo, and Ideally, I would like to avoid renting a separate box just for the Tivo. I also don't want to limit the Tivo to analog channels. I have most of the basics down, but I am not sure if there is any way to control what goes to the s-video out (to Tivo) as opposed to the HD component out.



It is not possible to use a Tivo with the 8300. The 8300 will change channels anytime it needs to to record the shows you have scheduled it to record. Your options are, an additional cablebox, use the Tivo for the analog channels or finally, don't use the Tivo at all (you could sell it on Ebay).

Originally posted by michaeltscott
And to answer your question, ADGrant, no, I don't know of any such television.

It seems quite likely that the HDMI ports on all or most TVs are Video only or at least not 5.1. I have not yet heard of anyone passing audio successfully via HDMI.

Originally posted by ADGrant
It seems quite likely that the HDMI ports on all or most TVs are Video only or at least not 5.1. I have not yet heard of anyone passing audio successfully via HDMI. Well, it's not quite correct to say that they're "video only". They seem to pretty much all accept audio to output through their own speakers, which is the problem here. None of them do audio pass-through from HDMI to any digital outputs (which would require more than a trivial bit of additional hardware and firmware).

Originally posted by michaeltscott
Well, it's not quite correct to say that they're "video only". They seem to pretty much all accept audio to output through their own speakers, which is the problem here. None of them do audio pass-through from HDMI to any digital outputs (which would require more than a trivial bit of additional hardware and firmware).

I am sure your are correct. I don't know if my TV will route audio from HDMI to its own speakers because the speakers are still in their unopened box in a self storage unit. I would guess that, like me, a significant number of HDTV owners use an external sound system.

I have to say that so far, HDMI has been a big waste of time. I would have been better off if my TV had DVI ports. I am really not sure why the bothered rolling out an Audio/Video connector for HD that didn't support multi-channel audio. Multi-channel audio is part of the HD standard I believe.

Also, given that no TVs pass-through multi-channel audio from the HDMI input to the digital output, how the 8300HD handles audio when its HDMI connector is used is pretty stupid. Given how bad the SARA DVR software is (I used to have to use it), I should not be surprised. As one of my co-workers said, "it appears to have been designed by someone who does not watch any TV".

So with the 8300HD pick two of the following three choices, decent DVR software, multi-channel audio or digital video. Picking the first choice may require you to move. SARA is so awful, it might even be worth it.

Originally the HDMI output on the 8300HD looked much better than the component output on the 8300HD and that looked 10 times better than the component output on the 8000HD. However, last Saturday my 8300HD cable box rebooted and I put it back on the component input. The picture looked amazing. The best I have seen yet. So I thought I was on the HDMI input. Nope I was getting Dolby Digital and it was displaying input 5 on my Sony GWIV. I checked the HDMI input and it still looked the same as before but the component input now looks as good or (dare I say) better than the HDMI. Did TWC do a software update this weekend that fixed the component output picture quality?

I got the same software versions I had on my box since I got it when Raleigh/Durham/Fayetteville first released them. And I just rebooted mine two days ago.

Versions:
ResApp Version: PASSPORT Echo 1.8.095
OS Version: PowerTV 6.8.9.4sp
Driver Version: 1
ResApp Date: Dec 14 2004
OS Date: Aug 11 2004
PowerKey: PKEY_3.7.5.110-p +dvrs3
PowerKey Date: Oct 20 2004

Originally posted by ADGrant
It is not possible to use a Tivo with the 8300. The 8300 will change channels anytime it needs to to record the shows you have scheduled it to record. Your options are, an additional cablebox, use the Tivo for the analog channels or finally, don't use the Tivo at all (you could sell it on Ebay).

ADGrant: I played with the 8300 some more and I believe you are incorrect. The scheduled recordings on the 8300 appear to take place in the background or "pip" tuner, while Tivo records from what appears to be primary display, so when a recording starts on the 8300 it does not change the signal being routed to Tivo unless I am recording something on both tuners of the 8300.

So far all of my Tivo recordings have gone through with no trouble, except when I was watching a replay of something recorded by the 8300 or just plain changing channels on the HD tuner--then that appears to get routed to the Tivo as well. If I could figure out a way to control the output to the S-video out then I could protect those recordings as well.

The 8300 is great for HD recordings, but for ease of use, season passes, etc., the Tivo is still ahead, so I am not about to give it up., even if I have to rent a separate cable box.

Do you really do a lot of season passes on digital channels? Why not just put a splitter before the 8300, run the cable directly to the Tivo, and only use the Tivo for analog channels. The only thing you lose is digital channels that are not HD.

-barry

I admit that I don't do a ton of TIVO recording on digital channels, but the number is increasing all the time as everything from Mid-60's and up through 200 is all digital now.

I typically record Sopranos, and some other HBO stuff on the Tivo as well.

Part of the issue is that I tend to record things and then not watch them for a while. I have now been burned twice when I did that with my first HD DVR, the 8000. Once it apparently crashed, and for whatever reason all of my recordings were "gone" according to the DVR. The second time, the DVR just died--the front panel would not power up, no display, etc., and all my recordings died with it.

That has never happened with Tivo, and when I have had hard drive problems with the Tivo (failing hard-drive, etc.) I have been able to pull it out and copy the data onto a new drive. Since the SA box is owned by the Cable Company, I don't want to crack open their box.

So, I am still Tivo dependent, and it is my default recording system except for HD recordings. Maybe I'm just stubborn.

I feel your pain on osing stuff on the 8000. I've been lucky enough not tho lose anything, but I do worry about it. I wish they would make available the external drive for archive purposes, rather than (in addition to?) just using it for extra disk space.

-barry

The other problem I ran into was that if for some reason the local TW office codes your account as not having DVR service, you can't access any of your recordings and if it is after they have closed for the day, you are stuck.

Originally posted by BL
ADGrant: I played with the 8300 some more and I believe you are incorrect. The scheduled recordings on the 8300 appear to take place in the background or "pip" tuner, while Tivo records from what appears to be primary display, so when a recording starts on the 8300 it does not change the signal being routed to Tivo unless I am recording something on both tuners of the 8300.

So far all of my Tivo recordings have gone through with no trouble, except when I was watching a replay of something recorded by the 8300 or just plain changing channels on the HD tuner--then that appears to get routed to the Tivo as well. If I could figure out a way to control the output to the S-video out then I could protect those recordings as well.

The 8300 is great for HD recordings, but for ease of use, season passes, etc., the Tivo is still ahead, so I am not about to give it up., even if I have to rent a separate cable box.

The 8300HD is always going to use the "Pip" or background tuner first for recordings because it assumes you are using the other tuner to watch something. As you noted, it only uses the foreground tuner if it needs to record two shows. If you can guarantee that you will never record two shows at once then you may be ok. However, the DVR software will not warn you that you have set it up to record two shows so sooner or later you will run into problems.

The other problem you have noted is you cannot use your DVR when your Tivo needs to use it to record something. The S-Video output is simply displaying the same signal as the other outputs, just in SD form. The Pioneer software has no facililty to automate recordings to another device so I doubt you will find a way to control the S-Video output.

If you really want to keep using your Tivo and have it always record what it is supposed to, you will need another cable box. You will want to isolate the IR receiver though since both boxes will shar the same remote codes.

BTW I am not sure why you want want to record the Sopranos on the Tivo though. That is a HD show, wouldn't you want to watch it in HD.

Also the Pioneer Passport software has a season pass manager which is just as functional as the Tivo's (I have been using a Tivo since 1999). It also has a to-do list and title search function just like Tivo. The major drawback to using the 8300 is it only has one week of guide data. It doesn't have wishlists either but I never used them so I don't miss them.
However the 8300HD's advantages over Tivo are not limited to HD. Having two tuners is very useful as is support for 5.1 channel surround sound. Unlike the Tivo, it makes perfect copies of digital shows.

Now if you were using the incredibly bad SARA software, I could understand keeping Tivo around. In fact when I lived in a Cablevision area (the use SARA), I did keep my Tivo around to record the analog channels via a splitter. I still recorded HBO on the 8300 of course, PQ on the HBO HD channel is so much better.

Did you all see the announcement (http://www.scientificatlanta.com/newscenter/releases/05apr02%2D1.htm) by Scientific Atlanta of the MCP-100 Media Center DVR?
A fully functional cable DVR (built on the 8300 platform, HD optional) with built in DVD burner? NICE!!

Unfortunately (and not surprisingly) it has been copy flag neutered. It looks like it will allow you to burn network type programming, but the flagging system will make copies of first run movies from HBO or Showtime improbable. The ‘copy freely’, ‘copy once’, and ‘copy never’ tags are supported by the MCP-100.

Still, pretty cool!

BL,

I hear you about not wanting to let the Tivo go. I have mine hooked up to analog cable out of the wall - unfortunately (or I guess fortunately depending on how you look at it), in NYC TWC has converted almost all of the analog channels to digital. So I get very few channels on the Tivo. Basically I use the Tivo for 3 purposes:

1) To make backup copies of the primetime network shows in case the 8300 messes up. Since this is the vast majority of what I record it's a good backup. I have all of my recordings on the Tivo set to KAM 1.

2) For the improved guide functionality and search features. Since the 8300 added the Search feature I use this less and less. But I have my Tivo thinking that it receives the entire TWC digital lineup, even though it only gets the analog channels (I never channel surf on Tivo so what do I care). Then I can go into Tivo and set Wishlists (can't autorecord them) or use the View Upcoming Episodes feature in the season pass manager to see what's coming on in the next 2 weeks. Can get better show descriptions as well.

3) Home Media Option - I play my MP3's and occasionally look at photos in the living room.

So the Tivo doing valuable work for me (and the lifetime sub already paid for itself a while ago), but I have a really hard time actually watching the recordings it makes (on the rare occasions where I need to) on my Samsung DLP.

Just food for thought.

Item #2 is quite interesting. If it's really useful, maybe Tivo should investigate selling subscriptions to it's guide for people who do not have a Tivo. We could just use the guide over the internet to supplement our existing guide. Not a bad source of extra income for Tivo.

-barry

Originally posted by EricScott
BL,

I hear you about not wanting to let the Tivo go. I have mine hooked up to analog cable out of the wall - unfortunately (or I guess fortunately depending on how you look at it), in NYC TWC has converted almost all of the analog channels to digital. So I get very few channels on the Tivo. Basically I use the Tivo for 3 purposes:

...

2) For the improved guide functionality and search features. Since the 8300 added the Search feature I use this less and less. But I have my Tivo thinking that it receives the entire TWC digital lineup, even though it only gets the analog channels (I never channel surf on Tivo so what do I care). Then I can go into Tivo and set Wishlists (can't autorecord them) or use the View Upcoming Episodes feature in the season pass manager to see what's coming on in the next 2 weeks. Can get better show descriptions as well.

3) Home Media Option - I play my MP3's and occasionally look at photos in the living room.

So the Tivo doing valuable work for me (and the lifetime sub already paid for itself a while ago), but I have a really hard time actually watching the recordings it makes (on the rare occasions where I need to) on my Samsung DLP.

Just food for thought.

Nice use of the guide. I use to do the same thing. Unfortunately My Tivo is an original Series 1 with a lifetime sub so not only can I not use the home media option (not that I need to in a Manhattan apartment) but since I don't have a regular phone line any more, I can't use the guide either.

I agree on the quality of the recordings compared to a 8300HD. Now I have Passport, I don't really miss the software that much.

Originally posted by margoba
Item #2 is quite interesting. If it's really useful, maybe Tivo should investigate selling subscriptions to it's guide for people who do not have a Tivo. We could just use the guide over the internet to supplement our existing guide. Not a bad source of extra income for Tivo.

-barry

Pretty sure Tivo pays quite a bit to Gemstar for the guide info. There was a big lawsuit and settlement a while back which required Tivo to put the stupid red "TV Guide" logo on their IPG. So my guess is they break even or lose money on the guide. But it's crucial to the rest of their product.

Originally posted by BL
The other problem I ran into was that if for some reason the local TW office codes your account as not having DVR service, you can't access any of your recordings and if it is after they have closed for the day, you are stuck.

But, if this is an encryption key the head end is sending as well as authorization, that may allow the SATA external drive to be used by the same account on a [replacement] box (if Passport turns on SATA).

I have not tried to watch stored programs if the cable is out. If not, that's the rock vs. hard-place: recovery of the stored programs saved to SATA interface, or fix the ability to watch stored programs if the cable is out.

Hopefully, we don't get the worst of both...

v/r,
C-F

Long ago, I read somewhere, in an official looking document, that the boxes were intentionally designed so that you can not watch recorded shows without cable connectivity - this is some sort of security measure. I suspect that they won't be "fixing" that one any time soon.

-barry

Ok, new member here... I've tried to read the whole thread, but apologies if I missed anything...

just got a Panny TH37PD25 EDTV, and took delivery of an SA8300HD on Tues, couple of questions/observations... (I live in Cary, NC with TWC)

a) I had HOPED that the cable out of the STB would always be active, the way it is out of a VCR... as far as I can tell, it is not... it is only active when the box is on, and only with the tuned channel. Is this correct? Yes I have a reason for this... I did not want to have a splitter, so the SA would get the best signal.. but I still have a Panny PVR/DVD-R that I wanted to use (since it can burn DVD of its stored material), so I wanted to daisy-chain it after the STB so it would still operate as before.

b) With regard to the DD5.1, I have optical out hooked to my recevier... the only 5.1 I got was on some of the local HD stations, but none on the music channels (I do not have any movie channels)

c) looking over the thread it appears that no fix for the HDMI/5.1 conflict exists yet for Passport? (my HDMI cable is enroute in the mail.. using component for now) The PDF for the box at SA would seem to be relevant to the SARA software instead, but claims this is in the settings menu)

d) I see a lot of referencs to diag mode... but I gather it is informative only? ie. is there a "service" mode one can enter on the box to config anything (or maybe that is outside the scope of the forums?)

e) the panny does not seem to accept 720p.. so I have enabled 1080i and 480p (I think) on the SA... I cannot change the gray sidebars for 4:3 material (except by stretch)... no way to change their color (the Panny would allow me to change them if it was tuning the signal). As for the mode, I'm torn between having the STB upconvert, etc, b/c that makes the channel change faster, vs. the TV getting varied formats in which case each channel change "costs" 1-2 seconds.... perhaps HDMI is faster? And/or as a user being new to having a GUIDE, maybe I'll learn to "surf" that way and only really do ONE channel change once I've found what I want in the guide??

Thanks for any help,
Mike

Originally posted by zim2dive

a) I had HOPED that the cable out of the STB would always be active, the way it is out of a VCR... as far as I can tell, it is not... it is only active when the box is on, and only with the tuned channel. Is this correct? Yes I have a reason for this... I did not want to have a splitter, so the SA would get the best signal.. but I still have a Panny PVR/DVD-R that I wanted to use (since it can burn DVD of its stored material), so I wanted to daisy-chain it after the STB so it would still operate as before.

As far as I know, the coax connection always outputs the the signal going through the other outputs. That's as long as you have the box set to ouput non-HD signals. I use splitter and I can't tell if there's any signal loss.

b) With regard to the DD5.1, I have optical out hooked to my recevier... the only 5.1 I got was on some of the local HD stations, but none on the music channels (I do not have any movie channels)

The first 50 channels on digital cable are not digital (thanks TWC!) so they never output 5.1. The digital versions of local channels (in the 200+ channel numbers) have some 5.1 output depending on the source. Other channels seem to offer less than that. HD material outputs 5.1 depending on the source programming and not all HD shows broadcast 5.1.

c) looking over the thread it appears that no fix for the HDMI/5.1 conflict exists yet for Passport? (my HDMI cable is enroute in the mail.. using component for now) The PDF for the box at SA would seem to be relevant to the SARA software instead, but claims this is in the settings menu)

There is no certain fix for this at the moment in Passport. If you use your HDMI cable you will most probably lose any 5.1 through your optical.

d) I see a lot of referencs to diag mode... but I gather it is informative only? ie. is there a "service" mode one can enter on the box to config anything (or maybe that is outside the scope of the forums?)

Channel 999 is the diagnostic channel where I am. Useful for checking disk space and if something is broadcasting in 5.1. Other than that I don't mess around with it.

e) the panny does not seem to accept 720p.. so I have enabled 1080i and 480p (I think) on the SA... I cannot change the gray sidebars for 4:3 material (except by stretch)... no way to change their color (the Panny would allow me to change them if it was tuning the signal). As for the mode, I'm torn between having the STB upconvert, etc, b/c that makes the channel change faster, vs. the TV getting varied formats in which case each channel change "costs" 1-2 seconds.... perhaps HDMI is faster? And/or as a user being new to having a GUIDE, maybe I'll learn to "surf" that way and only really do ONE channel change once I've found what I want in the guide??

The STB always outputs grey sidebars and there is no way to change that from the 8300. At least most non-HD drama is being shot in 16.9 these days so zoom can fill the screen nicely. Look through the archive for tips on how to get the most from your guide, such as keeping one channel in your second buffer while you surf etc. The guide mostly dictates which channels I watch though.

I was annoyed by the channel flicker when surfing through HD material so I changed the settings to output everything at 1080i to avoid that. It's a matter of taste there. I don't notice any significant picture quality difference.

There should be more knowledgeable responses following but hopefully that's helpful to start with.

Originally posted by zim2dive
And/or as a user being new to having a GUIDE, maybe I'll learn to "surf" that way and only really do ONE channel change once I've found what I want in the guide??


Mike this post should give you some good shortcuts to make your guide surfing easier.

Passport Guide Tips (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=4547722&highlight=guide+tips#post4547722)

Originally posted by VisionOn
The first 50 channels on digital cable are not digital (thanks TWC!) so they never output 5.1. The digital versions of local channels (in the 200+ channel numbers) have some 5.1 output depending on the source. Other channels seem to offer less than that. HD material outputs 5.1 depending on the source programming and not all HD shows broadcast 5.1. I've never seen anything other than an HD program with DD5.1 audio. Well, I'm not positive on that... On premium channels like HBO, etc, aren't they just DD2.0 ??

Channel 999 is the diagnostic channel where I am. Useful for checking disk space and if something is broadcasting in 5.1. Other than that I don't mess around with it. What screen tells you it's in 5.1 ?? Heh, I just use my stereo receiver... :)

The tuning info page will indicate channels capable of DD broadcasts as AC-3 enabled. To be honest I can't remember if I've ever heard anything outside of HD shows in 5.1 since that usually covers all the programming I watch. The MOD channel broadcasts in 5.1 as well, depending on the movie.

update: Just checked and later tonight The OC and Tru Calling are indicated as DD in the guide on the regular Fox non-HD digital channel.

Thanks for all the info!

Got the HDMI cable yesterday, and sure enuf no more DD. I had been finding it on some of the HD channels.

I've seen several references to ppl emailing TWC for feature/bug requests... what is the addr for this, I might as well add my $0.02 to them. A suprising amt of these things depend on how much (constructive) feedback a company gets. Squeaky wheel and all that....

Follow-up question.. are any of the music channels (900+) DD5.1?

Thanks,
Mike

good question. I don't listen to the music channels and I don't remember how my receiver dealt with the signal last time I heard it. The diagnostic page indicates the the music channels have DD capability but given the lack of retail support for 5.1 music I'd wager that it's probably 2.0.

Originally posted by zim2dive
Thanks for all the info!

Got the HDMI cable yesterday, and sure enuf no more DD. I had been finding it on some of the HD channels.

I've seen several references to ppl emailing TWC for feature/bug requests... what is the addr for this, I might as well add my $0.02 to them. A suprising amt of these things depend on how much (constructive) feedback a company gets. Squeaky wheel and all that....

Follow-up question.. are any of the music channels (900+) DD5.1?

Thanks,
Mike

What TV are you using?

Originally posted by zim2dive
Got the HDMI cable yesterday... what is the addr for this, I might as well add my $0.02 to them. A suprising amt of these things depend on how much (constructive) feedback a company gets. Squeaky wheel and all that....

Follow-up question.. are any of the music channels (900+) DD5.1?

Thanks,
Mike

Call 'em at 919-595-4892 (Thats Raleigh, but its all good). Ask to speak with "Engineering"

The Music channels are 2.0, not 5.1 (according to my receiver).

Originally posted by VisionOn
Mike this post should give you some good shortcuts to make your guide surfing easier.

Passport Guide Tips (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=4547722&highlight=guide+tips#post4547722) Someone should have said something about this having been updated. Several useful things have been added since the original discussion, 6 months ago.

This thread really needs a FAQ in the root post. Of course, hall would have to maintain it :).

Originally posted by ADGrant
What TV are you using?

Panasonic th37pd25u ... does not have 5.1, but I believe will pass the signal to its audio digital out.

Different question.. I did a search but came up empty (tho maybe I didn't tickle it right)... I've got a pocket pc that does the programmable remote thing.. more of a "what if" thing.... I can't find any SA8300 CCF files that will work, even when I point the SA remote and "learn" the command.. nadda. The CCF files for my receiver, etc, work... I did find one slightly obscure reference online claiming the SA remotes do something that make it hard for most programmable remotes to mimic... can anyone point me to a solution?

Thanks,
Mike

Originally posted by zim2dive
I've got a pocket pc that does the programmable remote thing.. more of a "what if" thing.... I can't find any SA8300 CCF files that will work, even when I point the SA remote and "learn" the command.. nadda. The CCF files for my receiver, etc, work... I did find one slightly obscure reference online claiming the SA remotes do something that make it hard for most programmable remotes to mimic... can anyone point me to a solution?
Remotecentral.com

When you say .ccf files, those are most commonly used with Pronto remotes, and if your software on the pocket pc can use those, you're in good shape.

There are several ccfs on remotecentral.com for the 8300. I borrowed heavily from a couple, customized it to my liking, but haven't yet posted the result.

Enjoy,
/temple

Originally posted by zim2dive
Ok, new member here... I've tried to read the whole thread, but apologies if I missed anything...just got a Panny TH37PD25 EDTV, and took delivery of an SA8300HD on Tues, couple of questions/observations... (I live in Cary, NC with TWC)

a) I had HOPED that the cable out of the STB would always be active, the way it is out of a VCR... as far as I can tell, it is not... it is only active when the box is on, and only with the tuned channel. Is this correct? Yes I have a reason for this... I did not want to have a splitter, so the SA would get the best signal.. but I still have a Panny PVR/DVD-R that I wanted to use (since it can burn DVD of its stored material), so I wanted to daisy-chain it after the STB so it would still operate as before.

Don't be afraid of using a splitter. I had a problem with a few old splitters but i replaced them with a new cable-company-supplied high quality 4-way splitter and there is no degredation of my picture quality at all. I actually tested some recordings - i recorded part of a show with the splitter and another part with the cable directly into the DVR and playback was identical. I did this on a number of channels all with the same results - i couldn't tell which recording came through the splitter. My four splitter outputs go to my regular SD SA8000, my SA8000HD, a VCR, and directly into the TV.


e) the panny does not seem to accept 720p.. so I have enabled 1080i and 480p (I think) on the SA... I cannot change the gray sidebars for 4:3 material (except by stretch)... no way to change their color (the Panny would allow me to change them if it was tuning the signal). As for the mode, I'm torn between having the STB upconvert, etc, b/c that makes the channel change faster, vs. the TV getting varied formats in which case each channel change "costs" 1-2 seconds.... perhaps HDMI is faster? And/or as a user being new to having a GUIDE, maybe I'll learn to "surf" that way and only really do ONE channel change once I've found what I want in the guide??


I don't know if you've tried this yet but you can also connect your 8300HD's composite video output to your Panny's Composite input and watch 4:3 SD on that input instead, and use the Component input just for watching HD shows. Using the Composite input should allow you to utilize the TV's own stretch stretch modes on the 4:3 image and fill the screen (you may have to enable 480i to do this).

Originally posted by michaeltscott
This thread really needs a FAQ in the root post. Of course, hall would have to maintain it :). I could of course just add a link to it.... :) Does this forum software allow editing posts forever ??

Originally posted by templeofdoom
Remotecentral.com
When you say .ccf files, those are most commonly used with Pronto remotes, and if your software on the pocket pc can use those, you're in good shape.


So one would think :) but so far my SA8300HD is completely DEAF when it comes to hearing anything from my Pocket PC. I even tried taking the CCF files and re-learning the codes... still nothing. My Denon receiver "hears" it just fine. So I am mystified. :(

And among the several "remote" progs for Pocket PC, CCF seems to be the only "common" file format that can be imported.

Mike

Originally posted by RandyWalters
Don't be afraid of using a splitter. I had a problem with a few old splitters but i replaced them with a new cable-company-supplied high quality 4-way splitter and there is no degredation of my picture quality at all. I actually tested some recordings - i recorded part of a show with the splitter and another part with the cable directly into the DVR and playback was identical. I did this on a number of channels all with the same results - i couldn't tell which recording came through the splitter. My four splitter outputs go to my regular SD SA8000, my SA8000HD, a VCR, and directly into the TV.


Good to know... how does one convince them to give you one of theirs? Is this something they'd let me pick up at their office (vs. scheduling another service call?)

Thanks,
Mike

Originally posted by zim2dive
Good to know... how does one convince them to give you one of theirs? Is this something they'd let me pick up at their office (vs. scheduling another service call?)

Thanks,
Mike

The TW store here in KC has them for sale cheap (about $2.50). They are high quality and much cheaper than Radio Shack, Best Buy or Circuit City. I imagine it is the same in other cities they serve.

Ken

Originally posted by nighthawk750
The TW store... "TW store" ?? What's that ?? :) All we have are offices where you make payments, swap hardware, etc. I'd be real surprised if they had splitters available (for sale). I think they want to do that kind of work, not let customers.

I finally have gotten a new 8300 to replace the buggy and fuzzy old 8000. However, though the 8300's HD image is significantly sharper than the 8000's, it's not as sharp as I remember the image from my pre-8000 STB (3250?) being. Have I just gotten used to HDTV (it's going on a year since I bought the set), or is the 8300's image also not optimal?

Originally posted by hall
"TW store" ?? What's that ?? :) All we have are offices where you make payments, swap hardware, etc. I'd be real surprised if they had splitters available (for sale). I think they want to do that kind of work, not let customers.

Your description isn't far off; it's not a place where you can browse the merchandise. But they sell splitters, cable jumpers in various lengths, drop amplifiers and the like. They also exchange hardware and accept payments. I have found the quality of their products to be very high and the prices low. I purchased a 15db Motorola drop amplifier there for $45. They tossed in a couple of 6 foot jumpers for free. They said the amplifier carries a lifetime warranty. They seem to encourage users to do some of the work.

Ken

Guys:

I've got a friend who just hooked his 8300HD to his Sharp 45GD6U using HDMI cables. He's having problems with SD channels; the TV doesn't properly auto stretch, and after a few flicks up or down the dial, the screen goes blank as if the TV no longer recognizes the input signal. Not even the guide or info bar are displayed when this happens. Switching back to a HD channel works, though, as if the change in source signal is enough to make the TV recognize the input.

8300HD is passing 1080i, 720p and 480p. [I cannot comment on audio, for those who are interested.]

Is this a common problem with HDMI on this box, or is it the TV? If the TV is this a know issue with Sharps, or is it his particular unit?

Thanks.

Hello all,
A TWC technician came out yesterday to install by 8300HD. Despite all our efforts (and I do mean *our* the guy was very nice but had no clue about the box and how to set it up) we just couldn't get the network to recognize the DVR. Numerous reboots and unpluggings, and the Passport startup screen never got past one dot. We plugged the cable into another box and another SD DVR - the signal was there.

I use a splitter to my SD DVR and the new HD DVR, and did so before between the SD DVR and an HD cable box - no problems whatsoever. We took the splitter off and still no recognition.

He's coming out again to try another box. Anyone had this problem? Any pointers that might help us?

just sounds like you got a dead unit to me. Did you try plugging the unit into another outlet?

Originally posted by VisionOn
just sounds like you got a dead unit to me. Did you try plugging the unit into another outlet?

Update - the technician brought out another box, and it didn't work either. After calling around for a while, it seems there's a problem with the network and I'm not the only one having problems. Should be fixed by Friday, they said. I don;t know if this applies to boxes currently deployed, or just new boxes, but that's the story. I'm in Durham.

BTW, the technician went to a lot of trouble to find another box, and tried to be helpful, but he didn't have clue #1 about setting it up. I told him my component input didn't accect 480i and we need to set it up to convert to 480p, he said "Well, I'm glad you know about that stuff!"

TWC should train the folks installing these, yes?

And yes, I'm running a SD DVR off a splitter, so signal's getting to the box.

My Samsung acted similar when it couldn't negotiate the signal changes so I ended up just having the 8300 output at 720P (my TV's native resolution). I've compared some of the 1080i channels to how they look with a 720P feed from the 8300 and couldn't tell a difference.

I'd recommend choosing just one output. Even when my tv works like it should, it still takes it a second to change resolutions and it's just too long. You could also try component cables, I haven't done that yet. HDMI works well when it is working, but has issues with changes.

Charlie
Originally posted by Doug_L
Guys:

I've got a friend who just hooked his 8300HD to his Sharp 45GD6U using HDMI cables. He's having problems with SD channels; the TV doesn't properly auto stretch, and after a few flicks up or down the dial, the screen goes blank as if the TV no longer recognizes the input signal. Not even the guide or info bar are displayed when this happens. Switching back to a HD channel works, though, as if the change in source signal is enough to make the TV recognize the input.

8300HD is passing 1080i, 720p and 480p. [I cannot comment on audio, for those who are interested.]

Is this a common problem with HDMI on this box, or is it the TV? If the TV is this a know issue with Sharps, or is it his particular unit?

Thanks.

Originally posted by Bob Michael

BTW, the technician went to a lot of trouble to find another box, and tried to be helpful, but he didn't have clue #1 about setting it up. I told him my component input didn't accect 480i and we need to set it up to convert to 480p, he said "Well, I'm glad you know about that stuff!"


What TV do you have? I am in Cary NC and I have a Sony GWIV and the 8300 works perfectly for me. I have never heard of a TV that did not accept 480i over component. Are you sure that is a requirement on your TV? Is your TV HDCP compliant? If you want to use HDMI it will need to have that.

Originally posted by mpgxsvcd
What TV do you have? I am in Cary NC and I have a Sony GWIV and the 8300 works perfectly for me. I have never heard of a TV that did not accept 480i over component. Are you sure that is a requirement on your TV? Is your TV HDCP compliant? If you want to use HDMI it will need to have that.

I have Samsung HLN507W DLP set. It has one component input that will take 480i/480p, and two others that will take 480p/720p/1080i. So if I want High Definition over component, I have to not feed the input 480i. You can do that with the 8300.

I also have a HDCP-compliant DVI input on the Samsung, with a DVI switch box and the proper cables, but I wanted to set it up for both component and DVI for more flexibility.

Originally posted by Bob Michael
Update - the technician brought out another box, and it didn't work either. After calling around for a while, it seems there's a problem with the network and I'm not the only one having problems. Should be fixed by Friday, they said. I don;t know if this applies to boxes currently deployed, or just new boxes, but that's the story. I'm in Durham.

BTW, the technician went to a lot of trouble to find another box, and tried to be helpful, but he didn't have clue #1 about setting it up. I told him my component input didn't accect 480i and we need to set it up to convert to 480p, he said "Well, I'm glad you know about that stuff!"

TWC should train the folks installing these, yes?

And yes, I'm running a SD DVR off a splitter, so signal's getting to the box.

I thought about the signal quality but thought it was a long shot because the 8000 worked. Does the handshake work on a different system to a regular reboot? Still, given the shoddy performance of the MOD channels of late in my area it doesn't surprise me.

The guy who fitted mine was a third party tech and didn't know much about the box either, like where the digital coax cable went. If your guy had been a full TWC tech he would have checked the signal strength at the outside junction box thingy, like the tech who replaced my defective first unit did. :rolleyes:

Posted by margoba on 03-05-05 05:15 PM:

Just in case you didn't realize it, you can copy any show to DVD/VCR now, on the 8300HD, by merely watching the show, and recording while it plays. If you don't want to actually watch the show, you can power off the TV set after you start up the recording.

-barry

Does the HD output still have the gray letterbox?

Troy

RE: Does the HD output still have the gray letterbox?

It has grey pillars if you play it on a 16:9 TV, but if you play the DVD or videotape on a regular 4:3 SDTV, then no pillars.

-barry

Originally posted by Bob Michael
Update - the technician brought out another box, and it didn't work either. After calling around for a while, it seems there's a problem with the network and I'm not the only one having problems. Should be fixed by Friday, they said. I don;t know if this applies to boxes currently deployed, or just new boxes, but that's the story. I'm in Durham.

BTW, the technician went to a lot of trouble to find another box, and tried to be helpful, but he didn't have clue #1 about setting it up. I told him my component input didn't accect 480i and we need to set it up to convert to 480p, he said "Well, I'm glad you know about that stuff!"

TWC should train the folks installing these, yes?

And yes, I'm running a SD DVR off a splitter, so signal's getting to the box. I had the same issuies when I first went to the 8300. Signal strength has a lot to do wit the DVR having trouble syncing up it seems. Also leave it for like 30 mins. I have seen the handshake sometimes takes longer then it should. You can also the CSR's sned a hit to teh box.

Anyone know if the front inputs on the 8300 are enabled and work? If so how do check. I am trying to connect my digital camera to it to pass it to my plasma which is connected via commponant.

thanks

Originally posted by jumbolaya
Anyone know if the front inputs on the 8300 are enabled and work? If so how do check. I am trying to connect my digital camera to it to pass it to my plasma which is connected via commponant.

As far as i know the front inputs aren't active anywhere in the country.

Originally posted by stlblufan
Did you all see the announcement (http://www.scientificatlanta.com/newscenter/releases/05apr02%2D1.htm) by Scientific Atlanta of the MCP-100 Media Center DVR?
A fully functional cable DVR (built on the 8300 platform, HD optional) with built in DVD burner? NICE!!

Unfortunately (and not surprisingly) it has been copy flag neutered. It looks like it will allow you to burn network type programming, but the flagging system will make copies of first run movies from HBO or Showtime improbable. The ‘copy freely’, ‘copy once’, and ‘copy never’ tags are supported by the MCP-100.

Still, pretty cool! I missed this when you first posted it.

If it observes the CCI flags properly, then it should allow you to make a non-recordable copy of anything on Showtime or HBO, since nothing on those channels can be protected with Copy Never.

How would it produce a non-recordable DVD? I got no idea--maybe it will CSS-encode them, for what that's worth.

Another user here at AVS just posted today that he picked up an 8300HD at TW's Kettering office yesterday.... I've got too many programs recorded that I'm not willing to lose just yet.

Originally posted by hall
Another user here at AVS just posted today that he picked up an 8300HD at TW's Kettering office yesterday.... I've got too many programs recorded that I'm not willing to lose just yet.

Get an 8300 and for a month or two just record all your new stuff onto the new box, and once you've watched all the old recordings on your old box turn it in . . . .

Originally posted by mpgxsvcd
Has the DVI been activated for any of the 8000HDs yet. Specifically does anyone know when it will be active in Raliegh North Carolina?
As of Tues/Wed last week when they came and hooked up my DVR in Morrisville the HDMI/DVI port was not working as it was the first thing I tested after the cable guy left. I had not done any research and so didn't know any reason it would not work. Now I see it's a big deal. <sigh>
Wasted port on my TV (Sony 42" rear projection 42" Wega)

I have the same TV (42" Sony RP), and the 8300HD in NYC. The HDMI port is working on the 8300, so I used it. However, I soon switched back to component. To my (admittedly not golden) eyes, the image quality was the same, and the HDCP implementations of the HDMI hookup were flakey.

-barry

Originally posted by lymang
As of Tues/Wed last week when they came and hooked up my DVR in Morrisville the HDMI/DVI port was not working as it was the first thing I tested after the cable guy left. I had not done any research and so didn't know any reason it would not work. Now I see it's a big deal. <sigh>
Wasted port on my TV (Sony 42" rear projection 42" Wega)

My HDMI works (8300HD). Cary, NC.

I decided not to use it b/c I want to feed my upstairs TV off the coax output, and it seems that *IF* an HDMI cable is connected, and if the HDMI target (my downstairs Plasma) is OFF (and thus does not handshake), the other outputs are also cut off.... so I went back to component for DS, and use the coax to watch US (just me, so need to have it output 2 different channels)... my splitter just happened to be located close by so I figured I'd take the 8300 coax out, vs the raw cable signal.

Mike

Originally posted by zim2dive
My HDMI works (8300HD). Cary, NC.

I decided not to use it b/c I want to feed my upstairs TV off the coax output, and it seems that *IF* an HDMI cable is connected, and if the HDMI target (my downstairs Plasma) is OFF (and thus does not handshake), the other outputs are also cut off.... so I went back to component for DS, and use the coax to watch US (just me, so need to have it output 2 different channels)... my splitter just happened to be located close by so I figured I'd take the 8300 coax out, vs the raw cable signal.

Mike

After more research I am guessing this is because you got the 8300. They delivered an 8000 to me.

Lyman

Originally posted by lymang
After more research I am guessing this is because you got the 8300. They delivered an 8000 to me.

Lyman

My bust.. didn't read carefully enuf.... if you have HD, I'd call'em up and swap it out.

Best of luck!

Mike

Someone in my local San Diego HDTV forum who recently obtained an SA8300HD from Time Warner brought it up that it apparently keeps two fixed-length 8.4 GB trick-play buffers. On the DVR AVFS diag screen it shows the following lines:

TSB-0: 60min, 20mbps, 8.4 GB
TSB-1: 60min, 20mbps, 8.4 GB rec


(apparently, the annotation "rec" means that it's currently recording into that buffer). This information is not present on the same diag screen for the SA8000HD. His experiments have shown that no matter what the bitrate of the program he's watching, he gets 59 minutes of trick-play buffer, provided that he's been watching the channel that long.

In contrast, the SA8000HD apparently reserves 5.4 GB of space, about 2.7 GB per tuner, for trick-play buffering, which is a little less than 21 minutes worth of 18.5 Mbps average bitrate content (HDNet on my system) or 38 minutes worth of 10 Mbps average bitrate stuff (typical Fox-HD). Analog and SD digital-cable material should be lower bitrate still.

While the greater amount of trick-play time for high-bitrate content is nice, I don't know that I think that it's worth 11.4 GB more storage dedicated to it--that decreases the capacity of the unit by one and one-half hours of content at HDNet's bitrate and much more if it were used for lower bitrate stuff.

What's the story SA8300HD users? Does anyone have a nearly full unit? If so, can you see whether it has dynamically lowered the size of the trick-play buffers?

Originally posted by michaeltscott
Some people have seen a serious problem with chasing playback of a long program that's far into recording, like a football game after the first hour. If you hit play on the menu's entry, it'll start half an hour in and looking at the progress bar, it alarmingly looks as though the first half hour isn't even there. After it's done recording, everything fine--you got the whole thing. It's strange. I've tried this sometimes with a movie and not had the problem, but I seriously think that that had to do with the low encoding bitrate of movies on HBO and Showtime HD. If the average bitrate of the program you're watching is 10 Mbps, your trick-play buffer will probably be nearly an hour long; if it's 17 Mbps, it might not be 30 minutes. I think that chasing playback on these units doesn't play from the stored file--it tries to play from the trick-play buffer instead.

Last night I was able to start watching a show 1:15 into the recorded time.. no issue. Chase worked exactly as I would have expected it to. (this may be old news, but thought I'd post it just in case). 8300HD. TWC, Cary, NC. Perhaps its b/c the show was SD so it all fit in the "trick-play' buffer.

Mike

Originally posted by michaeltscott

...........
TSB-0: 60min, 20mbps, 8.4 GB
TSB-1: 60min, 20mbps, 8.4 GB rec

..............

What's the story SA8300HD users? Does anyone have a nearly full unit? If so, can you see whether it has dynamically lowered the size of the trick-play buffers?

I filled up the storage on my 8300HD and found that whenever I start recording a program and storage available < about 20 GB, programs are deleted to make it greater than 20 GB. The play buffer sizes above remain unchanged.

Originally posted by Alan Sh
I filled up the storage on my 8300HD and found that whenever I start recording a program and storage available < about 20 GB, programs are deleted to make it greater than 20 GB. The play buffer sizes above remain unchanged. So the usable storage of the SA8300HD is reduced by 11.1 GB versus the SA8000HD--that's a chunk. It's 88 minutes of 18 Mbps average bitrate HD content or 6 hours 37 minutes of typical 4 Mbps SD digital cable content.

(BTW, the guy at my San Diego forum reports that with no recordings his free space reads 16.8 GB--if yours reads 20 GB you probably need to reboot. Press and hold the POWER button until the LEDs read "boot". It will free the extra 4 GB allocated. Of course, it could be that it requires at least 3.2 GB more than the trick-play buffers free before it records and you don't have any bogus allocated store).

Morrisville, NC - my 8000 flaked hard last night during CSI Las Vegas (DAMMIT!) and I missed the last 15 minutes. In addition, it didn't record anything I'd scheduled last night (Daily Show). It was "OFF" this morning without even a time display. I had to hard reboot by unplugging, and then wait a LONG time for the boot sequence to finish. I've just called TWC and specifically requested the 8300 - we'll see if I get what I want. I've got a service call from 3-5 today and my fingers are crossed. I wasn't going to raise a stink till the 8000 lost me programming, and now that it has, I'm trying to pre-emptively avoid getting frustrated and upset. :-) Sure, I"m annoyed at missing some TV last night, but I'm not yet screaming.


Edit: Hot damn! Justin the cable guy was scheduled to put in Roadrunner today at 3-5. He called me at lunchtime wondering if I could accomodate him earlier since he was running "ahead of schedule." I said sure and hopped in the truck after eating quickly, and ran over to the apartment. He spent about 5 minutes and hooked up Roadrunner. I mentioned I was due for another tech as well to get a replacement HD-DVR but that I wanted an 8300. He ran out to his truck and came back in with an 8300 and had me hooked up in another 10 minutes. ;-) WOOT!

Now we'll see if there's better performance, less crashes, and any additional features on the 8300. Heh.

Lyman

Well, now that I know about the 8% reduction in usable storage space in the SA8300HD versus the SA8000HD, I'm not in any rush to get one. My trusty SA8000HD has served me well, without any major bugs. The only problem that's bothered me at all is its inability to do chasing playback while recording two programs--I experience lots of dropouts when I try to do that. (It has no problem doing it when making a single recording). Not a big deal, since I'm usually watching something already on the drive while recordings are being made; if there's nothing, I just wait for the first recording of the evening to finish.

I'd love to have the multi-character title/keyword guide searches, repaired bugs and improved PQ, but it's not worth the decrease in recording capacity. That 11.1 GB could give me one more day's opportunity to watch the oldest stuff on my DVR before it gets deleted, and I'm not willing to sacrifice that.

Now, when the sidecar expansion storage becomes available for the Passport model, I'm all over it. :)

I am very pleased to see the lead title character search feature. That is WELL worth the loss in space to me.
We shall see how well the unit performs compared to the 8000 which I had only for a few days and crashed repeatedly.

Lyman

Is there any FW port on 8300HD?

When I called them about active FW ports earlier this week, an apparently well-informed CSR DID KNOW what I'm talking about when I replaced the word 'firewire' with the acronym "IEEE1394" - he said if I'll order their service, I'll get 8300HD and its FW port active anyway but he also emphasized 3x they do not support it.
Also their PDFs shows it does have FW: http://www2.twcnyc.com/downloads/SA...stallManual.pdf

Does it? :confused: :confused: :confused:

If the 8300 series is similar to the 8000 series, various ports are *optional*, and the cable operators can order boxes with or without them. I'll bet most order them *without* to save a few bucks too.

Worse, your local TW could order 5000 boxes without Firewire ports but in order to meet the order, Scientific Atlanta has 4000 without, as spec'd, and 1000 with FW. They can supply them and I'm sure TW won't complain. Now someone with TW in NYC says "My 8300 has Firewire ports" and then someone goes to swap theirs but there are no more with FW...

It depends, I think. My local Time Warner stripped the FireWire ports from the 8300s. Some don't.

Sounds fine. :mad:
Sounds like my first ~20 year life experience under Commie rule... left hand has no idea about the right hand... :o

But since they HAVE to provide me active firewire ports upon my requests, it does mean they have to have some modell with firewire, right?

FCC regs (CFR Title 47, §76.640 (http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=8935612605557c7af17428a3a7f79859&rgn=div8&view=text&node=47:4.0.1.1.4.11.3.15&idno=47)(b)(4)(ii)) state that cable providers can't purchase any more digital STBs without working 1394 after 1 July this year:(4) Cable operators shall:

...

(ii) Effective July 1, 2005, include both a DVI or HDMI interface and an IEEE 1394 interface on all high definition set-top boxes acquired by a cable operator for distribution to customers.

(iii) Ensure that these cable operator-provided high definition set-top boxes shall comply with ANSI/SCTE 26 2001 (formerly DVS 194): “Home Digital Network Interface Specification with Copy Protection” (incorporated by reference, see §76.602), with transmission of bit-mapped graphics optional, and shall support the CEA–931–A: “Remote Control Command Pass-through Standard for Home Networking” (incorporated by reference, see §76.602), pass through control commands: tune function, mute function, and restore volume function. In addition these boxes shall support the power control commands (power on, power off, and status inquiry) defined in A/VC Digital Interface Command Set General Specification Version 4.0 (as referenced in ANSI/SCTE 26 2001 (formerly DVS 194): “Home Digital Network Interface Specification with Copy Protection” (incorporated by reference, see §76.602)).A 1394 connection compliant to the pile of specs in (b)(4)(iii) would be both recordable and would offer AV/C control of the device.

Unfortunately, there's nothing that says that they ever have to buy any more new HD STBs after that date--just the connections that any that they do buy must have. Also, nothing in the regs compels them to give you one, if they do buy them :).

Originally posted by T2k
Sounds fine. :mad:
Sounds like my first ~20 year life experience under Commie rule... left hand has no idea about the right hand... :o

But since they HAVE to provide me active firewire ports upon my requests, it does mean they have to have some modell with firewire, right?

But, for now, the one they have to provide you does not have to be a DVR, just a set top box.

TWC-KC
Passport
SA 8300HD

Firewire port is listed as active in software, but physical connectors are missing on the STB. Nothing but the solder pads on the PCB, and no holes in the case.

v/r,
C-F

Originally posted by margoba
But, for now, the one they have to provide you does not have to be a DVR, just a set top box.

Well, what if I have only one STB and it's an HD-DVR?

Originally posted by CANNON-FODDER
TWC-KC
Passport
SA 8300HD

Firewire port is listed as active in software, but physical connectors are missing on the STB. Nothing but the solder pads on the PCB, and no holes in the case.

v/r,
C-F

Complain - they should replace it.

Originally posted by T2k
Well, what if I have only one STB and it's an HD-DVR?

My understanding is that the regs state that they must provide you with a HD box that supports Firewire, if you request it. It can be any box that supports firewire; they do not have to provide you with the model or type that you request. The HD box, with Firewire, that they supply is not a DVR box.

I do believe that the regs change after July of this year, but the effect of those changes may take quite some time to filter down to the end users.

-barry

I've searched the forum and the user manuals but I can't find anything about this...

Does anyone know if the front inputs on the 8300HD are active?

If so, can you only view the input or can you record it?

Originally posted by CincySaint
I've searched the forum and the user manuals but I can't find anything about this...

Does anyone know if the front inputs on the 8300HD are active?

If so, can you only view the input or can you record it?

This has been mentioned further up in this same thread already.
The front inputs on my SA8300HD are not active and I don't see anyway to select that input at all for display or recording either with the latest Passport firmware.

Originally posted by T2k Originally posted by margoba
But, for now, the one they have to provide you does not have to be a DVR, just a set top box. Well, what if I have only one STB and it's an HD-DVR? I cite the relavant FCC regs in this (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=5520654#post5520654) post above. I left out one of the paragraph, CFR Title 47, §76.640 (http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=8935612605557c7af17428a3a7f79859&rgn=div8&view=text&node=47:4.0.1.1.4.11.3.15&idno=47)(b)(4)(i):(4) Cable operators shall:

(i) Effective April 1, 2004, upon request of a customer, replace any leased high definition set-top box, which does not include a functional IEEE 1394 interface, with one that includes a functional IEEE 1394 interface or upgrade the customer's set-top box by download or other means to ensure that the IEEE 1394 interface is functional.This says that after 1 April of last year they had to provide you with a box with working 1394 on request, but not any specific model. They only needed to have one model available with working Firewire (on my TWC system, this is the SA3250HD). The paragraph after that, which I quoted in that post, §76.640(b)(4)(ii), says that any boxes that they acquire after 1 July of this year have to have working 1394; this would include any DVRs.

As I also noted in that post, nothing says that they have to buy any new DVRs, or that they have to give you one if they do and you request one :). The wouldn't even have to tell you that they had them, if the sales CSRs were ever trained to know. After the first of July, you could keep calling and asking the service CSRs if they have DVRs with 1394 available.

Seems like attrition and/or new models ought to make Firewire equipped DVR's generally available by late 2006 give or take a few months.

-barry

Originally posted by CincySaint
Does anyone know if the front inputs on the 8300HD are active? Even if they're active for some people, it doesn't mean that Cincy TW boxes have them active....

My 8300 in South Pasadena, CA is not tuning to:

1102 KCBS HD
1104 KNBC HD
1108 KCET HD

I am just getting a gray screen and when I try to record the channel I get an error "can't record" Every other HD channel works as well as analog / digital channels.

On the other HD box in the house the Pioneer 3510 the channels are tuning in fine. I watched KNBC HD earlier this afternoon without a problem

Signal levels are good since new cable was run to the house - distribution amp was replaced.

Calling customer service results in wanting a service call.

I called customer service earlier this morning - it was confirmed that at the lobby in South Pasadena, CA the channels are going to gray screen or very choppy video.

Crap: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=5541157#post5541157

Is there any chance to get an 8300HD-based DVR instead of this 8001HD? It's slow like hell, DVI is disabled, no FW, no SATA port.

PS: It's TWCNYC - I'm already bringing today one of my Pioneers to the Queens Mall Payment Center to get another HD STB with active firewire (supposedly the old 3250 - why?), perhaps I can talk to somebody over there...

There are 8300HDs here in NYC. Sometimes they are hard to get, sometimes they are plentiful. You should try going to the pickup center.

Note that the 8300HD is faster than the 8000HD, and it does have HDMI (not DVI), but the HDMI is a bit flakey (especially with 5.1 sound), it has no Firewire, and it has a SATA port which has not yet been firmware enabled.

-barry

The South Pasadena, CA office is out of the 8300HD again.

The HD channels not tuning was finally corrected Tuesday late afternoon.

However, now whenever I view an on demand show - the box won't buffer. If I tune to a new channel and hit rew the box will tune to channel 0. The only way to get the box to buffer again is to press record then change the channel then back again and press stop. Then I can control live tv again.

And some of the recordings I had deleted showed back up in the list and when I select them they won't play but I can delete.

I wish there was a way to format the hard drive for passport.

Both tuners do work as I can record two shows.

I just swapped the 8300HD DVR for another one - the rep in the lobby tracked down a box for me.

I also swapped 8000 SD DVR for the 8300 SD DVR and this box has SATA and Firewire Ports. There are two firewire ports.

I was lucky enough to get an SA83000 from TWC New Jersey last month, and have been happy with the picture quality, menus etc. However, it has now started blanking out periodically, and I'm wondering if there is an easy fix so I don't have to call in a technician and/or risk getting an 8000 as a replacement.

Usually the problem happens when I switch to an HD channel -- the channel comes up with a blank, light grey screen. If I flip to a non-HD channel and then back to the HD channel, the problem usually corrects itself, but I have already lost unattended recordings due to the problem. It has also happened on a non-HD channel when trying to pause/rewind live programming. Again, I had to flip back & forth between channels to get it back, as simply hitting the "Live" button didn't work.

Any suggestions?

I would recommend unplug the box for a few minutes then plug it back in leave it unatennded for about 15 minutes. And also try to delete some programming. I find when the hard drive gets full I use to experience tuning problems with the 8000. You can also have a signal level problem going on.

If the 8300HD isn't sitting in the open, with plenty of space above, and no heat producing items below, might try relocating it. I also put my 8300HD up on small blocks to aid ventilation. Excess heat can cause glitches. Haven't tried it, but suggestions here to tune the menus on VOD channels (both tuners), stopping constant disk recording, might be worthwhile. -- John

Originally posted by Carnivore
I was lucky enough to get an SA83000 from TWC New Jersey last month, and have been happy with the picture quality, menus etc. However, it has now started blanking out periodically, and I'm wondering if there is an easy fix so I don't have to call in a technician and/or risk getting an 8000 as a replacement.

Usually the problem happens when I switch to an HD channel -- the channel comes up with a blank, light grey screen. If I flip to a non-HD channel and then back to the HD channel, the problem usually corrects itself, but I have already lost unattended recordings due to the problem. It has also happened on a non-HD channel when trying to pause/rewind live programming. Again, I had to flip back & forth between channels to get it back, as simply hitting the "Live" button didn't work.

Any suggestions?

Usually rebooting solves this problem, as powertoburn mentions (unplug and plug back in).

I just wanted to post and say that I've now had the 8300 for a few weeks and it hasn't crashed even once. As opposed to the 8000, which had crashed 2 or 3 times in the first 3-4 days I had it. The 8300 has behaved flawlessly, recording everything I want and I'm happy with PQ etc. Sure, I would prefer to have some control over some settings that I don't have control over, but overall I've been very pleased.

Location: Morrisville, NC

Lyman

I can beat that--I've had an 8000HD since last August and it hasn't crashed even once, or given me much cause for complaint, at all. I'll probably switch to the 8300HD at some point, but the 90-minute decrease in total HD recording time is a serious problem for me. I can hardly keep up with my television watching load given the buffer that the 8000HD affords :).

Originally posted by michaeltscott
I can beat that--I've had an 8000HD since last August and it hasn't crashed even once, or given me much cause for complaint, at all. I'll probably switch to the 8300HD at some point, but the 90-minute decrease in total HD recording time is a serious problem for me. I can hardly keep up with my television watching load given the buffer that the 8000HD affords :).

The biggest limitation of the 8000HD is the trouble it has with recording/buffering HD content on both of its tuners. If you try to record 2 HD programs simultaneously, or tune both tuners to HD channels, be prepared for many audio (and sometimes video) dropouts.

My normal use of the device is to record 2 HD programs while watching a third completed recording, and that works just fine. (At this point, my SD television watching is down to 10% or less). I will admit that where it sucks is recording 2 programs and trying to watch one of those programs while it's being recorded.

I can tune both tuners to HD channels and watch one without a problem; I can even tune both tuners to HD channels and record one of them and watch the recording in progress without a problem. It's just making two HD recordings and watching one of them where it screws up, for me, but only while I'm watching it. I can playback what I was trying to watch while it was recording without incident.

I'm certainly not saying that the SA8300HD isn't an improvement on the SA8000HD. One of these days, when the expansion drive is available for the Passport units, I will have to have one. However, its improvements aren't worth the loss of 90 minutes of recording space, out of 19 hours, 15 minutes (at 18 Mbps).

I just chime in here when people get harsh about the SA8000HD, to remind folks that many of us haven't had any major problems with it.

No problems here recording two HD programs and watching a third, pre-recorded one on my 8000HD... Still looking forward to swapping it out for an 8300HD though :D If anything, it's not worse than the 8000HD. The add'l RAM, more CPU horsepower, and at the moment, newer software are enough reasons to get it.

Many say the 8000HD was a step in PQ from their previous HD set-top (less DVR obviously) but I never had anything prior - the 8000HD was my first.

i posted this in my local twc thread... no reply, so i'm cross-posting here:

hello all...

my TWC HD DVR (i requested an 8300) will be installed on tuesday, for use with my panny 42PD50U EDTV. i'd like to get audio through both my tv speakers and my HT setup, and i have a couple of questions:

if i run HDMI to the tv from the STB, can i run optical from the STB to my receiver, or will only one audio out work at a time?

also, i've been reading about all the sporadic problems with HDMI with this box, so i'm also considering just using component video and analog audio RCA IC's to the from the STB to the TV, and then running optical audio from the STB to the receiver.

can anyone give me recommendations on these or other possible setups?

thanks in advance:
VA

I read your first post in the NYC group and didn't reply because I'm not particulary knowledgeable on audio, but since nobody else is replying, I'll give it a shot.

If you get an 8300HD, then all audio is 'piped' to all outputs; however that audio will be the same format. This means if your TV doesn't support 5.1 (and most don't) then regular stereo will come out of the HDMI cable _and_ the optical output.

I found the HDMI interface a bit flakey (too many HDCP errors), and went back to component. I don't have golden eyes, but I cannot tell the difference between video quality on HDMI and component.

-barry

As margoba states, using HDMI always (so far as I've heard) ends up with DD2.1 coming from the other digital audio outputs, S/PDIF and Toslink. I posted an explanation of why here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=5382050#post5382050).

SARA solves this problem with a set-up option which disables HDMI sound carriage. AVS Forum member JnC claims that some similar solution will be added to a future version of Passport (in the post just below my explanation, here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=5383064#post5383064)). You probably shouldn't hold your breath waiting for your provider to push that new version, whensoever they might get their hands on it.

What others have posted above about HDMI and 2 Channel is accurate.

Its a minor issue for me based on this set-up:
1. Use HDMI to TV and have it handle audio to TV (allows one remote). Only get 2 channel audio due to HDMI.
2. Use Component to TV and optical out to HT when I really want the audio quality of DD 5.1. (two remotes)

All cables are attached simultaneously. I just have to switch TV Input to Component and turn on my Receiver. No difference in PQ (to my eyes).

In No. 1 above, I can have it on and ALSO turn on Receiver (but it will only receive and play 2 channel due to "piping" described above).

I would love to get rid of the Component cables to simply remove clutter. Other than that, the above set-up would remain.

Even if HDMI worked, I'd still use it for Video to TV and have separate optical to Receiver (whether through TV or direct from STB). Thus, 2 remotes when I want the audio quality.

margoba, michaeltscott, IamtheWolf:

thanks for your replies, very educational and confirms what i suspected. my panny 42PD50U does have an optical out, so i may fiddle with that and see if the full audio signal will make the leap from HDMI to the optical...

barring that i think i'll just use component + RCA analog audio to tv for casual viewing, and run optical to receiver for HT. besides, i'm wary of the glitchy rep of the HDMI.

Related to the HDCP issues most have encountered is this ruling against the FCC's broadcast flag. Before you get your hopes up, don't overlook the last paragraph.

Court blasts FCC on broadcast flag (http://www.theregister.com/2005/05/07/broadcast_flag_shot_down/)

Originally posted by JnC
Related to the HDCP issues most have encountered is this ruling against the FCC's broadcast flag. Before you get your hopes up, don't overlook the last paragraph.

Court blasts FCC on broadcast flag (http://www.theregister.com/2005/05/07/broadcast_flag_shot_down/) In what way do you see the broadcast flag as being related to HDCP, except in that they are both DRM mechanisms? Their applications are markedly different, and the BF is mainly controversial in that it requires modification of devices that aren't even directly related to broadcast television (i.e., computing equipment).

There are no FCC requirements for anything to have HDMI-or-DVI/HDCP connections other than cable boxes and televisions labelled "Digital Cable Ready". Those requirements are a codification of a set of agreements between the cable television and consumer electronics industries (albeit an agreement that they were frogmarched into drafting by the FCC :)).

Originally posted by michaeltscott
...albeit an agreement that they were frogmarched into drafting by the FCC ...

I think you hit on the relationship. If one can be appealed, why not the other?

But I'm not an expert on the DRM protocols, just the messenger.

Originally posted by JnC
I think you hit on the relationship. If one can be appealed, why not the other?

But I'm not an expert on the DRM protocols, just the messenger. Thing is, all involved parties agreed that a unified standard for DTV-over-cable needed development, and it needed a way to protect the delivery of subscription digital content; the cable companies required that and the CE OEMs weren't adverse to providing it (it was those companies who voluntarily created DTCP and HDCP). They had more problems over licensing terms than anything else.

Again, the BF is problematic in that it's overreaching, attempting to regulate the construction of devices that aren't specifically for television reception.

The broadcasters aren't going to give up on this--they've sunk huge sums of money in developing and campaigning for it.

I just got an 8300 installed today. My old 8000 had to be rebooted 2-3 times a day.
What are the improvements over the 8000? Can the receiver output a picture simultaneously via the component and S-video (I'm asking bc want to record some stuff via a DVD burner) The 8000 could not do it.
THX

Originally posted by ensyed
I just got an 8300 installed today. My old 8000 had to be rebooted 2-3 times a day.
What are the improvements over the 8000? Can the receiver output a picture simultaneously via the component and S-video (I'm asking bc want to record some stuff via a DVD burner) The 8000 could not do it.
THX
The not having to reboot thing was enough of an improvement for me. :-)

Originally posted by ensyed
I just got an 8300 installed today. My old 8000 had to be rebooted 2-3 times a day.
What are the improvements over the 8000? Can the receiver output a picture simultaneously via the component and S-video (I'm asking bc want to record some stuff via a DVD burner) The 8000 could not do it.
THX

Yes the SA8300HD outputs simultaneous 480i output on the composite/s-video outputs while outputting in HD on the component output. The 8300HD has a faster CPU and more RAM too.

Ignorant question on my part... can the 8300HD output anything better than 480i on the composite? (ie. could you drive HD at the same time out the component to set 1, and out composite to set 2?)

Thanks,
Mike

Originally posted by zim2dive
Ignorant question on my part... can the 8300HD output anything better than 480i on the composite? (ie. could you drive HD at the same time out the component to set 1, and out composite to set 2?)

Thanks,
Mike

No. In the analog realm, HD can only be delivered through component connections and the best composite (including S-video) can do is 480i.

No composite and s-video connections are only capable of 480i no matter what the device. Only component and higher can do 480p, or HD formats.

Has anyone attempted to us the IR Extender port on the 8300HD DVR? I bought a new TV, and the DVR is now below the TV which limits the line-of-site for the remote. I have an IR extender, and plugged it into the IR port on the back of the unit, but it doesn't seem to work.

The IR port on the old Pioneer boxes were outputs, not inputs, meant to control an external VCR. I believe the IR port on the SciAm is the same thing. Too bad, though. I would also like to have a better IR receiver location.

I have done some extensive searching on this board, and I want to confirm with those who are more knowledgeable that I'm correct in my assumptions. If I have the SA8300HD with Passport and Time Warner Cable then I have no real way to transfer content in any decent resolution to some other kind of device. I know there's another thread about this but when I looked at that thread it seems to indicate you've got to have the SARA software and I just want to be sure. I had a friend who missed Crossing Jordan and I DVR'ed but I have no easy way to get him a copy as far as I can tell.

The firewire and other outputs are essentially useless, correct?

Lyman

If I remember correctly, the firewire ports aren't even active yet on the 8300HD and the analog outs on the 8000HD are pretty much useless for me.


Troy

Originally posted by lymang
I have done some extensive searching on this board, and I want to confirm with those who are more knowledgeable that I'm correct in my assumptions. If I have the SA8300HD with Passport and Time Warner Cable then I have no real way to transfer content in any decent resolution to some other kind of device. I know there's another thread about this but when I looked at that thread it seems to indicate you've got to have the SARA software and I just want to be sure. I had a friend who missed Crossing Jordan and I DVR'ed but I have no easy way to get him a copy as far as I can tell.

The firewire and other outputs are essentially useless, correct?

Lyman

Firewire is probably not enabled on your 8300HD, but all the other outputs should be active. I don't know what you mean by "any decent resolution." I do know that I have no problem archiving from my 8300HD (with Passport) to DVDs.

Originally posted by Manatus
Firewire is probably not enabled on your 8300HD, but all the other outputs should be active. I don't know what you mean by "any decent resolution." I do know that I have no problem archiving from my 8300HD (with Passport) to DVDs.

Do you do this via the component video outputs? If it would be more appropriate for a PM would you please just send me a quick PM on what you're doing? Are you capturing with a DVD Recorder or a PC? I'm curious about this. Thanks for your reply.

Lyman

Originally posted by lymang
Do you do this via the component video outputs? If it would be more appropriate for a PM would you please just send me a quick PM on what you're doing? Are you capturing with a DVD Recorder or a PC? I'm curious about this. Thanks for your reply.

Lyman

I use a DVD recorder, not a PC, and normally connect it to the 8300HD's S-video output for two reasons (1) I prefer to use the component output, instead of HDMI, to feed my display and (2) the DVD recorder requires a 480i signal, and the 8300HD will not output 480i over component unless that is the only resolution selected in the 8300HD's setup menu.

When a friend occasionally misses a TV show that I recorded, I, too, use composite out to a DVD recorder, and I find that recording an HD show to DVD at 480i produces a very decent copy. It is considerably better than the VHS tapes my friends used to get from me.

-barry

How can I use the front panel inputs to pass a signal through the 8300 and record off the svideo and RCA audio output jacks?
I use (1) component out to a projector and (2) svideo out to a computer to do video capture. I would like to be able to plug in a Replaytv or Laserdisc to the inputs and pass them through the 8300 to capure on the HTPC. The HTPC and projector are at the rear of the room and all other components are at the front by the screen, so I just want to use the one set of 25' cables to get the 8300s output back to the computer. I thought I would try the inputs to the cable box, but I don't see any way to select the front inputs from the remote or front panel.

The front panel video/audio inputs on the SA8300HD are not functional at all. Use a video switcher instead for extra composite inputs.

Been away for a while. Has this topic been discontinued?

It's still stickied. It has went (10) days without a post...

The next version of passport software sure is taking a long time to develope.

<sarcasm>Who needs a new version when the current one works perfectly?</sarcasm>

Pioneer has more than one version done and available. It's TW who's not implementing it. The s/w that's on the 8300 units *does* work on the 8000-series. I've got 1.159 on my 8000 and 8000HD. 8300s in this area, and likely others, have 1.180 or similar or higher.

I recently bought a Panasonic 42PX50U plasma, but it does not have the capability to stretch or zoom a 720p or 1080i signal over the component inputs. I'm using it with an SA8000HD and i had assumed that i'd be able to stretch or zoom pillarboxed 4:3 upconverted SD using the DVR's # key instead but this only stretches or zooms the image contained within the pillarboxed 4:3 area and the black bars remain left and right. I've tried every combination between the TV and 8000HD but nothing works. What i'm trying to do is stretch or zoom local and network news (which is upconverted 4:3 SD) on the HD channels (ch 1102-1111 on my TWC system) but it just ain't happening. It seems the 4:3 broadcast is trapped within the 720p or 1080i transmission so the TV is locking out all attempts by the DVR to change the aspect.

A guy in the Plasma forum says that his SA83000HD running SARA software is able to stretch upconverted SD on the HD channels so i'm wondering if anyone with an 8300HD running Passport software is able to fill the screen over component by using the # key?

If it works i may have to trade one of my DVRs for the newer 8300 series . . . .

Thanks !

i'm wondering if anyone with an 8300HD running Passport software is able to fill the screen over component by using the # key?

If it works i may have to trade one of my DVRs for the newer 8300 series . . . .

Thanks !
I have TWC and the SA8300HD w/Passport. It works. I use component and HDMI for separate input sources (they both work).

With Passport, I'm pretty sure that the 8000HD was unable to stretch HD channels (even SD broadcasts on HD channels). It could stretch SD channels. The 8300 can stretch both SD and HD channels.

-barry

Hi, I just got my samsung hlr5067 and I just got the 8300 from twcnyc when I hooked the box to the tv via hdmi the tv said no signal so then i hooked the box up via component and everything is fine. I was just wondering if anyone had this problem. If the tw nyc boxes have hdmi activated? I would like to use this $100 hdmi monster cable.
Any advice would be appreciated.

Hi, I just got my samsung hlr5067 and I just got the 8300 from twcnyc when I hooked the box to the tv via hdmi the tv said no signal so then i hooked the box up via component and everything is fine. I was just wondering if anyone had this problem. If the tw nyc boxes have hdmi activated? I would like to use this $100 hdmi monster cable.
Any advice would be appreciated.

Try this - switch the TV to the HDMI input then turn both the TV off and the 8300HD off. Both are now off. Now, first turn the TV on, THEN turn the 8300HD on and that should enable the HDMI connection.

I think it has something to do with the 8300 checking to see if the TV is HDMI compliant and for this the TV needs to be on when you first turn on the 8300HD.

Thanks Randy, will try it later. What a awesome setup you have!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am getting a SA 8300 box from TWC and was wondering how loud is the fan for the hard drive? I have a Sanus rack which is open with no doors. My apologies if this question was already asked.

Thanks for any help, Bill

I am getting a SA 8300 box from TWC and was wondering how loud is the fan for the hard drive? I have a Sanus rack which is open with no doors. My apologies if this question was already asked.

Thanks for any help, Bill

Judging from the 8000HD I don't think fan noise should be a problem. Does it have a fan? I thought they were simply air cooled.

However, the endless chirping from the hard drive may annoy you, but from what I've heard the 8300 is a quieter unit.

I use a DVD recorder, not a PC, and normally connect it to the 8300HD's S-video output for two reasons (1) I prefer to use the component output, instead of HDMI, to feed my display and (2) the DVD recorder requires a 480i signal, and the 8300HD will not output 480i over component unless that is the only resolution selected in the 8300HD's setup menu.

Is there any way to set up an unattended HD recording on the 8300 and insure that the program being recorded will also be sent to the analog outputs? I would like to set my DVD recorder to record the show simultaneously from the 8300's S-video output without having to remember to manually tune the 8300 to the channel to be recorded sometime before the recording.

I hear the hard drive more than a fan (if there is a fan in there)...

I am getting a SA 8300 box from TWC and was wondering how loud is the fan for the hard drive? I have a Sanus rack which is open with no doors. My apologies if this question was already asked.

Thanks for any help, Bill

The SA8300HD neither has nor needs a cooling fan.

http://img23.echo.cx/img23/5909/dscf3813a9jx.jpg

The SA8300HD neither has nor needs a cooling fan.

http://img23.echo.cx/img23/5909/dscf3813a9jx.jpg


Looks like your remote control needs recharging. ;)

Thanks for the replies. We'll be in trouble here if our pets lay on the cable box. A 180lb. pot belly pig might present more than a cooling problem!

Thanks again, Bill

I spent the past 3 weeks trying to get in touch with a Time Warner rep. I finally got in touch with a rep named Kermit. Here's what he had to say:

-Certain areas are using the SARA software, while others are using the Passport software. Those using the Passport software will have to get an adapter for their HDMI cables.

-Certain ports, like the USB are rendered useless due to the fact that the Passport software does not work with the SA box.

-One cannot install a second hard drive due to the issue involving the Passport software and the SA box.

-Time Warner does not have any plans to unify the software being used. They are offering services to people all over the country, but evidently every reigion gets different services made available to them. And the reigion dictates the software that is installed in the boxes.

-The reason given for their plans not to unify was never made entirely clear. I was basically told that it had to do with the worker's familiarty with the equipment and software being used. Only after pressing did I find out the other reason....

-If your box uses Passport, then it is quite likely that you are in a reigion that Time Warner is experimenting with. You're more likely to be the test market for their different services (On Demand, on screen guide, on screen billing). It has nothing to do with the worker's familiarity with the software or hardware. It's all about "test markets"

-When asked why release software that wasn't fully compatible with the box, I was told that due to customer response; Time Warner felt that it needed to get a HD box out into the market, regardless if it had a "few bugs".

-Time Warner does not have any plans to update the Passport software to make it more compatible with the SA boxes. Those with the Passport software are doomed to lead an incomplete Time Warner HD DVR experience.

The bottom line is this: We as customers are paying full price for equipment that doesn't work fully. Time Warner doesn't seemed to concerned with this fact, just as long as we're quiet and continue to pay our ever rising monthly cable bills.

Time Warner is also not concerned with breaking FCC regulations,(FCC regulations
prohibit the blocking of any ports supported by the manufacture
47CFR76.640: (Sec. 76.640 Support for unidirectional digital cable
products on digital cable systems.)) stating that since the software was never designed with hard drive expansion in mind, that they can not be held with blocking of ports.

I think you could have saved yourself 3 weeks of work by reading the older postings in this group (or the Yahoo Group). Almost every question that you have asked has been discussed before.

You don't actually state it, but the tone of your posting seems to imply that you wish you could switch from Passport to SARA. My impression is that Passport is MUCH, MUCH, MUCH better software. There are a couple of things that are better implemented on SARA, but Passport does a much better job of handling scheduled recordings, and it implements the Guide better. Admittedly, this is all based on other people's comments as I have never actually used SARA.

Also, the decision as to whether to use Passport or SARA is, as I understand it, primarily based on what brand of equipment your local TW operator uses for it's head-end equipment.

I have the Passport software, and I think I have a very complete DVR solution. Is it perfect? No. But, it is much better than anything else out there right now, and I'm very happy with it.

-barry

Regarding Passport software and test markets, I believe your source is wrong. From reading at this site, TW uses Passport in the majority of their markets, not SARA. As mentioned in a follow-up to your post, I was also under the impression that it's based on headend equipment. Here, *all* of TW's boxes use Passport, whether they're SA, Pioneer, etc, etc hardware.

TW doesn't write or own the Passport software. It's owned by Pioneer, the huge electronics company.

I can only go with what the rep from TW tell me. According to him TW uses the SA box in some markets with SARA, others with Passport. He is the one that said they used the passport in test markets.

I am fully aware of Pioneer, and what they do. The TW rep stated that they worked closely with Pioneer in developing the software. He said they developed it together.

I can only take this guy's word for what it is. If I am wrong in any way, it's only because I am repeating from the "source". The level 3 tech I was speaking to referred me to him, so I can only hope that he knew what he was talking about. At no point did he ever mention the headend equipment.

If I've erred in any way, please accept my apologizes. I made the calls before I knew of this forum's existence. I just found out about avsforums last night.

I can only go with what the rep from TW tell me. With that, I immediately think of what I read here, http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=545201:

the rep said "Yes, we are going to offer ALL our channels in HD very soon", i said WHAT!@$, " and he said "Yep, the Govt says we have too....."

:D

In my market, TWC uses Passport and Cox uses SARA. The Cox SA8300HD customers are always complaining about their SARA boxes missing recordings or re-booting once a day. I haven't heard of any of the TWC Passport SA8300HD customers have such serious problems. SARA offers a few nice extra setup features (like black vs grey bar selection) which would be nice, but overall reliability is more important and Passport seems to have that part covered. Also in my area Cox/SARA had the HD-DVR 6 months before TWC/Passport - so if one was a test market it was SARA in this case anyway. By the time TWC in my area finally released the HD-DVR it had most of the bugs worked out.

I can only go with what the rep from TW tell me. According to him TW uses the SA box in some markets with SARA, others with Passport. He is the one that said they used the passport in test markets.


This seems extremely doubtful. NYC gets Passport, and I don't see how anyone would ever consider NYC a "test market" for anything. NYC is the kind of market you test for, not in. (What are you going to do, test in a market of 7 million households for later release to a market of 10,000 households? It wouldn't make sense.)

I've only just got my 8300, but the Passport/Sara software have been around for a long time now. It's always been the case that I recall (going back to the original release of the 8000HD) that the Sara software was buggier and less desirable.

So far I have had no problems with my 8300HD running Passport.

-Time Warner does not have any plans to update the Passport software to make it more compatible with the SA boxes. Those with the Passport software are doomed to lead an incomplete Time Warner HD DVR experience.

doesn't that conflict with previous info stating TWC are planning to update the software to fix the HDMI audio problem?

I think the major problem here is that Kermit just hasn't been the same since Jim Henson died. :D

Is there any way to set up an unattended HD recording on the 8300 and insure that the program being recorded will also be sent to the analog outputs? I would like to set my DVD recorder to record the show simultaneously from the 8300's S-video output without having to remember to manually tune the 8300 to the channel to be recorded sometime before the recording.

I did this once during the first weekend of the Major League Soccer (MLS) season. The DVR would not let me set-up a recording of the first game. The error message indicated I needed to call xxx-xxx-xxxx to subscribe to that channel. The CSR said I would be able set it on the day of the game: the problem was I would not be around to do so. I decided to have the cable box power up at a set time, turn to that channel and to record the game via the analog output to my VCR. Anyways, I am going by memory but IIRC, here is what I did:

Press "settings"
Press "A" for more settings.
Look for a "power on" function, that turns the cable box on at a certain time and date. I believe you are able to specify the power-on channel in that same function.
You are also able to specify how long you want to keep the cable box powered on. When the cable box is powered on, the s-video (analog) output is active so you should be able to record from that output.

I will confirm this procedure when I get home tonight.

Often times the recording is using the 2nd tuner and the output will be showing the channel for the 1st tuner. So its difficult to be sure you are outputting the channel thats being recorded if you aren't there to check. But since the recording (for digital and HD channels) will be as good as the original - just wait until the recording is finished and then play the recording to record it to an external recording device. I do that and wait until I have several programs that I want to record externally and do them all once a week.

Press "settings"
Press "A" for more settings.
Look for a "power on" function, that turns the cable box on at a certain time and date. I believe you are able to specify the power-on channel in that same function.
You are also able to specify how long you want to keep the cable box powered on. When the cable box is powered on, the s-video (analog) output is active so you should be able to record from that output.
...just wait until the recording is finished and then play the recording to record it to an external recording device.
guamster: That is a good idea and I will try it also.

Joxer: I do this also but would like to eliminate the playback step.

It occurred to me on my way to work this morning that I might try setting up a manual recording of the same program, if the box will allow me, which would mean it wouldn't matter which tuner was selected. That would eat up twice the 8300 disc space, but hopefully I could delete the copy in a timely fashion. Has anyone tried this?

doesn't that conflict with previous info stating TWC are planning to update the software to fix the HDMI audio problem?


Brighthouse Networks has released the beta passport software I was testing to the public. We now have passport version 1.8.103. This has the new HDMI audio menu to fix the digital audio output problem.

guamster: That is a good idea and I will try it also.

Joxer: I do this also but would like to eliminate the playback step.

It occurred to me on my way to work this morning that I might try setting up a manual recording of the same program, if the box will allow me, which would mean it wouldn't matter which tuner was selected. That would eat up twice the 8300 disc space, but hopefully I could delete the copy in a timely fashion. Has anyone tried this?

there is an easier but more limited way to do this. Record the show directly to your VCR. Assuming your TWC is working the same way as in NC, TWC are also piping the standard cable package through the cable. Just add a signal splitter and send it directly to your VCR unscrambled to record most channels in the 0-99 range.

Barry, do you have an 8000HD or 8300HD ??

guamster: That is a good idea and I will try it also.

Joxer: I do this also but would like to eliminate the playback step.

It occurred to me on my way to work this morning that I might try setting up a manual recording of the same program, if the box will allow me, which would mean it wouldn't matter which tuner was selected. That would eat up twice the 8300 disc space, but hopefully I could delete the copy in a timely fashion. Has anyone tried this?

No, I don't believe the box will allow you to record the channel on both tuners. I've accidentally tried to do this before and the box would not let me.

I checked my box last night and I was really close. Go to "Settings," press "A" for more settings, scroll down to "Power Timer On" and specify the time you want the cable box to turn on and the channel you want to tune to. Next, go to "Power Timer Off" and specify what time you want the cable box to turn off - that is, if you even care that the box is powered off after you have made your recording. It worked for me so it should work for you.

Good luck.

there is an easier but more limited way to do this. Record the show directly to your VCR. Assuming your TWC is working the same way as in NC, TWC are also piping the standard cable package through the cable. Just add a signal splitter and send it directly to your VCR unscrambled to record most channels in the 0-99 range.

tgh wants to record an HD channel, which definitely would not be in the 0-99 range. :)

Barry, do you have an 8000HD or 8300HD ??


I have the 8300HD. Our cable system uses the 8000 for SD only.

I was just curious.... It seems that most TW areas roll out software updates all at the same time, give or take a week. I'm not counting the "test" areas, of course.

I haven't swapped my 8000 yet as we've had too many programs un-watched. Now that re-runs are kicking in, our "recorded" list is quickly dwindling down in size.

tgh wants to record an HD channel, which definitely would not be in the 0-99 range. :)

ah yes so he does. Duh. How quickly I forgot considering I read his original post only a few days ago. I blame Memorial Day, it's screwed up my internal clock. :D

I was just curious.... It seems that most TW areas roll out software updates all at the same time, give or take a week. I'm not counting the "test" areas, of course.

I haven't swapped my 8000 yet as we've had too many programs un-watched. Now that re-runs are kicking in, our "recorded" list is quickly dwindling down in size.

same here, my backlog of shows and the HDMI problem are the only things keeping me in 8000 land. As soon as someone in NC confirms the update I'm throwing in the towel.

Hopefully they will take a towel in exchange for an 8300.

Ba-dum! :rolleyes:

Brighthouse Networks has released the beta passport software I was testing to the public. We now have passport version 1.8.103. This has the new HDMI audio menu to fix the digital audio output problem.

I recently ordered a second SA-8300HD from TWC in Chapel Hill NC. It was brand new out of the box with a manufacturing date of 4/26/2005. It has 1.8.103 installed. My other SA-8300HD still has 1.8.095, which I use with and HDMI to DVI cable and digital optical out for 5.1 audio with no issues.

I looked at the settings menu of the new box with the .103 software and didn't see any audio settings for HDMI. This unit isn't connected with the HDMI out, so maybe it only has settings if the port is being used?

Let me know if you have questions that I can try to answer regarding this software version.

- Chris

Using standard software naming logic, a change from X.X.095 to X.X.103 won't include any "feature" additions, only bug fixes. In most cases, it will be changes that 99% of users never run into also.

This is the audio menu.

This is the audio menu.

Thanks for the picture. I don't have that menu selection in my settings control panel. Again, I don't have the HDMI port connected on the SA8300HD that has the .103 software, so maybe it is a context sensitive setting, i.e. only available if the port is being used? I can't think of any other reason it wouldn't be available on the same software revision. I guess I could move the box with the .103 to the setup with HDMI and see, but that is a bit of a hassle to do. Any ideas?

The software release seems to be in new boxes only. Customers getting a new 8300HD installed have the new audio menu but the previous customers are reporting they do not have it so a software download has not happened here yet. I have no idea how this works across multiple systems in other states.

The software release seems to be in new boxes only. Customers getting a new 8300HD installed have the new audio menu but the previous customers are reporting they do not have it so a software download has not happened here yet. I have no idea how this works across multiple systems in other states.

Right, but my new 8300HD with the new software v.103 doesn't have the Audio menu option displayed in the settings. I have two of the 8300HDs and the older one is still on the v.095. The settings menu is the same for both of mine. TWC doensn't seem to be pushing the new software to the field, at least not yet. I'm still really curious as to why my v.103 doesn't have the Audio option like yours does.

How do you check what version software you have?

Go to the first page of this thread. Someone asked right near the beginning and got the answer... I'm sure it's been asked numerous more times after that one too.

Tune to channel 999

I have had the 8300HD for a bit now and I like it a lot. The HD picture is quite good. The digital sd is fairly good as well. My question relates to my analog sd picture. I have read some suggest connecting through s-video. I have 480i,480p & 1080i enabled through a component connection to my mits crt hdtv. I watch sd in one of the Mits stretched modes.

I realize that we are limited to the quality of the actual analog signal itself, but how can I be assured that I am getting the best possible analog sd picture?

At this point, I can barely stand watching anything analog sd due to the picture quality and I am not sure if there are ways of improving this or if this is just the nature of having a 48" tv.

How do you check what version software you have?

For Raleigh-Durham TWC, simply tune to channel 999. Scroll down the left side menu to versions and you will see that displayed.

Other systems use other channels or other key toggles to get to the diag screen. There are a number of links in here on how to do this for various systems.

Question about the 8300HD: I have a Replay TV unit that I would still like to use for SD recordings. Does the 8300HD use the same remote commands for changing channels as previous TW Passport cable boxes? Is there an S-video out that can be used as an input to my ReplayTV and consistently pass through SD video cooresponding to the channels selected by the ReplayTV IR blaster?

Question about the 8300HD: I have a Replay TV unit that I would still like to use for SD recordings. Does the 8300HD use the same remote commands for changing channels as previous TW Passport cable boxes? Is there an S-video out that can be used as an input to my ReplayTV and consistently pass through SD video cooresponding to the channels selected by the ReplayTV IR blaster?

The remotes for TWC boxes are all the same, and use the same commands across the Scientic Atlanta line (don't have first hand knowlege of other boxes, like Pace, but the remote they supply is the same for all). The great thing about the SA8300HD as compared to the SA8000HD is that all the outputs work all the time, and there is an S-Video as well as Component, Composite, RF, and HDMI (although the Composite uses one of the RCA Jack outputs of the Component so you can only use one of those at a time). I don't use an IR blaster, but you should be able to use it with this box and should have no problems controlling it with your Replay and recording with the S-Video out to Replay S-Video in. I use S-Video out to my DVD-Recorder on my set up, with HDMI out to my TV. Works great.

The SA8300HD (unlike the older SA8000HD) now has a separate composite video RCA jack independent of the component video RCA jacks, plus an s-video output as well. All work simultaneously.

The SA8300HD (unlike the older SA8000HD) now has a separate composite video RCA jack independent of the component video RCA jacks, plus an s-video output as well. All work simultaneously.

Duh, my bad! Joxer is correct, the SA8300HD has seperate Component and Composite outs, which work at the same time. I'm embarrassed to say that I forgot that my second SA8300HD is currently hooked up that way, so I know it works!!

So has anyone confirmed that they have the new software and the fix in North Carolina? I have an older box with the 095 software and no fix. I would suggest you email TWC and inquire about when this update will be done. They don’t tend to do anything until a lot of people complain.

I heard from our local engineer at Brighthouse today and he said the new 8300HD boxes are a different production run that required the new software due to a minor hardware change. The release of the new software system wide is scheduled for July 1st because they need to include more code for the broadcast flag requirements.

So has anyone confirmed that they have the new software and the fix in North Carolina? I have an older box with the 095 software and no fix. I would suggest you email TWC and inquire about when this update will be done. They don’t tend to do anything until a lot of people complain.

I can confirm that I have a new 8300HD box in NC with the .103 software that doesn't have the Audio Settings menu that Barry showed from his menu in a previous post. I know that's not what you wanted to hear!!

I find the comment that the newer boxes require the .103 due to a hardware change interesting - the newer of my two 8300HDs is very quiet - really have to listen hard to hear it running. It is definitely quieter than my other 8300HD, which is already a big step up from my previous 8000 & 8000HD boxes. I wonder if this is just random selection or if they changed something in the hardware to address this.

I find the comment that the newer boxes require the .103 due to a hardware change interesting - the newer of my two 8300HDs is very quiet - really have to listen hard to hear it running. It is definitely quieter than my other 8300HD, which is already a big step up from my previous 8000 & 8000HD boxes. I wonder if this is just random selection or if they changed something in the hardware to address this.


Could be an improved hard drive. What model does the new unit have?

The release of the new software system wide is scheduled for July 1st because they need to include more code for the broadcast flag requirements.

What broadcast flag requirements?

I live in Charlotte, NC and was wondering if the HDMI port is enabled on the SA8300HD offered by TWC?

Thanks,

Tom Lamano

What broadcast flag requirements?

Good question, I guess the requirements the courts struck down at the last minute saying the FCC had overstepped their authority.

I live in Charlotte, NC and was wondering if the HDMI port is enabled on the SA8300HD offered by TWC?

Thanks,

Tom Lamano

The HDMI is enabled in TWC Raleigh-Durham, and I believe everywhere else as well. There is an issue that you can read about on this thread regarding the ability to pass Digital Dolby through the optical out when you have HDMI connected to an HDMI port on your TV. This isn't a problem if you go HDMI to DVI as I do. There is supposed to be a fix for this in an upcoming software release (v.103) that at least one poster (Barry928) has working.

Could be an improved hard drive. What model does the new unit have?

I checked the model numbers through the Diag screens on both units and they are the same: Model 4R160L0 Firmware RAMB1UU0.

I recently upgraded drives in a friend's Tivo, and after it was completed he complained how noisy it had become. We discovered that there is a firmware setting (3 levels IIRC) for the drive that you can address in DOS to make the drive "quiet", which seems to work by slowing the head speed down a little. Made a tremendous difference in the noise produced by the drive and is completely functional for its purpose. It went from audible clicking from across the room to imperceptible from 1 foot away. Perhaps SA is now setting the drives this way.

[COLOR=Black]I use Time Warner in the Beaumont Texas area. I just took my SA 8000 HD DVR into the office and exchanged it for the 8300HD DVR and so far everything' is OK, except many of the Tips don't work. They didn't work on the 8000 either. for example:

Diagnostic screen

When I press and hold the SELECT and EXIT buttons on the box, the DIAG never appears - the picture does not change, no matter how long I hold the buttons down. Also I am unable to get any channel above the music channel 949 - the next one is 2

Slow Motion

"Slow Motion - Hit PAUSE first, then hold down the Right Arrow key and it goes into Slo-Mo"

This doesn't work either. Clicking the RIGHT arrow only causes the banner to be displayed at the bottom of the screen. Clicking the right arrow again causes the time displayed in the banner to advance, but no change in the paused picture. I can't figure out what the changed time in the banner affects.

“Frame by frame advance - hit PAUSE first, then repeatedly tap the Right Arrow key”

This doesn’t work. Instead pressing the FF key advances the paused picture.

Commercial Advance (Sorta)

“When you're FF'ing through a block of commercials, hit PLAY as soon as you see the show resume, and the unit jumps back to the right where the show resumes. Takes practice and quick eyes to get it just right :-)”

Nope. It just starts playing from where PLAY was depressed.

15 Minute Jumps while playing

“Jump Ahead to 15 minute marks - When in FF mode you can jump ahead to the next 15 minute interval by pressing the Right Arrow key. “

Doesn’t work.

“Jump Backwards to 15 minute marks - Hit the Rewind key then press the Left Arrow key to go backwards. Handy when joining a show in progress and you want to skip back to the beginning.”

Doesn’t work.

Skip ahead 100 channels

“When in the Guide, hit the A key to skip ahead 100 channels at a time”

No. Instead switches to let you choose the Browse By mode for the guide – channel, Title, etc.

Advancing the date in the guide.

“When in the Guide, to quickly skip several days ahead, press a number key then quickly press the Right Arrow key. Use number 2 to scan two days ahead, use 4 for four days, etc. Same No Data rules apply as above”

Doesn’t work.

Any advice or help will be appreciated.

First off, it seems most TW areas use Passport software but are you sure yours does ?? If you've got SARA, none of these tips apply. Well, some might, but not all.

- Accessing DIAG mode should always work using the front-panel keys. Some areas can simply tune to a "hidden" channel (you can't access it via the guide). Press and hold SELECT and EXIT until it "dings". Release both buttons, then press EXIT once.

- Slow-motion and frame-by-frame I don't do...

- Commercial skip really does seem to nail it for us all the time. How it does it is a mystery but it's pretty good !

- Skip ahead 100 channels also works fine here.

- Skipping ahead days as described works here too.

Don't *you* find it odd that none of these things work for you but do for most, if not everyone else, who've tried it ?? Kinda suggests something wrong on your end...

Hall, thank you for the response. Perhaps I have SARA. I held down SELECT and EXIT for two full minutes - no ding - no change in picture.

I suspect the problem must be with the local Time Warner. I'm not incompetent, having been working with computers since 1953! Senile, perhaps, but not incompetent.

Hall, thank you for the response. Perhaps I have SARA.

A quick way to discover which operating system you have is to reboot the box (disconnect its AC cord for a few seconds and reconnect it) and watch the on-screen boot-up display. If you have Pioneer, you'll see Pioneer's copyright notice.

when I removed and restored power and then turned it on the screen said "Explorer Home Terminal - Scientific Atlanta.

when I removed and restored power and then turned it on the screen said "Explorer Home Terminal - Scientific Atlanta.

You've got SARA (and my sympathy). You may want to explore the SARA 8300HD thread instead of this one: Time Warner Cable (SARA) SA 8000HD & 8300HD (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=352604)

Thanks everybody. Damn. Now I'l try to find the SARA thread.

Dough! Manatus gave you the link. Click on it.

Does anyone know how to reset this thing. I just got my box the other day, and was expermenting last night. I wanted to see what choosing 720p instead of 1080i would look like and my screen went black. I have sound, but no picture, and can't see anything to change it back. After talking with TWC for about 45 minutes, they finally told me to just take the box in and exchange it. I have some programs recorded that I don't want to lose.

Does anyone know how to reset this thing. I just got my box the other day, and was expermenting last night. I wanted to see what choosing 720p instead of 1080i would look like and my screen went black. I have sound, but no picture, and can't see anything to change it back. After talking with TWC for about 45 minutes, they finally told me to just take the box in and exchange it. I have some programs recorded that I don't want to lose.


Rebooting will not change the scan rate you saved so try this to navigate blindly.

power on the 8300
press exit to make sure no menus are open.

press "settings"
press "A"
press cursor down 3 times
press cursor right 1 time
press select
press "A"
press exit

that should switch on 480p
tune to a non-HD channel

Does anyone know how to reset this thing. I just got my box the other day, and was expermenting last night. I wanted to see what choosing 720p instead of 1080i would look like and my screen went black. I have sound, but no picture, and can't see anything to change it back. After talking with TWC for about 45 minutes, they finally told me to just take the box in and exchange it. I have some programs recorded that I don't want to lose.Press these keys firmly and pause a second or two before hitting the next key because as i did this i noticed the menus were kinda slow to come up after each button press. If you press the next button too soon the box may not respond in time and that'll screw up the sequence so have patience with the next key push and give it a second or two before hitting the next key. If you do it right your picture should come back when you're done.......


1. First Press the Exit key or turn the DVR on if it's off.

2. Start by pressing the SETTINGS key on the remote once.

3. Now press the A key once. (for more settings)

4. Slowly press the DOWN ARROW key THREE Times. (scrolls down to Output Formats)

5. Press the RIGHT ARROW key once. (To enter the list of formats)

6. Press the UP ARROW key: Once for 480i, Twice for 1080i, or 3 times for 720p.

7. Press SELECT once (this dots or undots the chosen output format)

8. Press the A key to accept. Picture should now come on after a second or two.

9. Press Exit to get you out of the menus. In a few seconds your picture should re-appear. If it doesn't, repeat the sequence again and remember to press firmly and wait a few seconds between presses.

If you screw up in the middle of the sequence just press the Exit key, take a deep breath, and start over from the beginning.

Does anyone know how to reset this thing. I just got my box the other day, and was expermenting last night. I wanted to see what choosing 720p instead of 1080i would look like and my screen went black. I have sound, but no picture, and can't see anything to change it back. After talking with TWC for about 45 minutes, they finally told me to just take the box in and exchange it. I have some programs recorded that I don't want to lose.

Edit: Ugh, beaten to the punch! Both sets of instructions will probably work... here's what I wrote:

There might be a way to really reset it but you could always just try changing the output formats while "blind" using these instructions...

Turn on the box.

1. Press settings
2. Press "A" (yellow triangle)
3. Press down three times
4. Press right once
5. Press down once
6. Press select
7. Press "A" (yellow triangle)

That should do it, hopefully.

Edit: Ugh, beaten to the punch! Both sets of instructions will probably work... here's what I wrote:

There might be a way to really reset it but you could always just try changing the output formats while "blind" using these instructions...

It's funny how three of us responded within a 4 minute window :D

Last year a guy on the SA8000 mailing list blacked out his brand new big screen on a Friday night right before his big weekend of first-time TV watching so i guided him through this and saved the writeup in case i ever did it to my own TV (which didn't support 720p). He went too fast on the buttons but the 3rd time worked for him :cool:

I remember the first time I fired up my brand new out the box 8300 the default was 480i output tuned to a 480i channel. I was hooked up via DVI which does not support 480i so I get nothing but black and no way to see what the problem is until I finally switched to component and removed 480i from the output resolution. I wonder how many cable installers ran into that scenario and never gave DVI another chance.

Did anyone else have the cable installer try to hook up the 8300 to your HD set with a piece of RG-6 coax?

Mine had never heard of DVI or HDMI.

Thank you for the responses. I tried all three carefully, but still no picture- just sound. A friend told me he was directed by a tech to press a certain combination of buttons on the front panel of his 8000HD (my model) which allowed him to reset things using the LED screen... unfortunately he can't remember the buttons used.

Thank you for the responses. I tried all three carefully, but still no picture- just sound. A friend told me he was directed by a tech to press a certain combination of buttons on the front panel of his 8000HD (my model) which allowed him to reset things using the LED screen... unfortunately he can't remember the buttons used.

If the posted method didn't work, then either you're pressing the next buttons too soon or your DVR probably has the SARA software and is not Passport. Do you know which one it has? When using my method, you literally have to wait a second or two before pressing the next button. I say wait two full seconds between every push to ensure the box responds accurately.

If it is SARA, then i think it has a "Setup Wizard" that you can activate with the front panel buttons. Go to the appropriate SARA thread and look for info on this wizard thing and see if that works for you.

Here's another possibility - Passport (and maybe SARA) boxes can be manually switched to SD mode by simultaneously pressing the Vol- and Channel+ buttons on the front panel of the DVR where the display alternates between HD and SD. Get it to display SD then disconnect the component cables and connect either the RF output or S-Video/Composite and switch the TV to that input and see if you get a picture.

wharrisv,

You could simply connected a RCA (composite) video cable to use the setup menu to change the output format. ;)

wharrisv,

You could simply connected a RCA (composite) video cable to use the setup menu to change the output format. ;)

If the 8000HD is Passport, this won't work. The composite RCA video output is inactive when the DVR is in HD mode and only component works. The only way to activate this output is to put the DVR into SD mode but then the Output Formats menu is no longer there since the DVR knows it's now in 480i mode. You can get it to output SD this way, but i don't think there's any way to get the picture back in HD mode other than using the "Flying Blind" method (which has worked for three people that i wrote to).

Sorry, I guess I was assuming he had the 8300.

I am in Charlotte, NC and I have the 8000HD with Passport software. TW is swapping out my current box for an 8300 next week, but I have the NCAA Basketball championship game recorded on my current box. I don't think that there is any way that I can back it up to DVD (no other outputs other than component seem to work on my box) and I really want to keep this game. Is there any way to enable the other video outputs or is there a DVD recorder made that has component video input to record from? Or, can the TW technician transfer the content to the new box?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

I am in Charlotte, NC and I have the 8000HD with Passport software. TW is swapping out my current box for an 8300 next week, but I have the NCAA Basketball championship game recorded on my current box. I don't think that there is any way that I can back it up to DVD (no other outputs other than component seem to work on my box) and I really want to keep this game. Is there any way to enable the other video outputs or is there a DVD recorder made that has component video input to record from? Or, can the TW technician transfer the content to the new box?

Yeah you can transfer the game to a DVD recorder - i've done it several times. Refer to my post 4 posts previous about switching your 8000HD to SD mode and reconnecting the rear outputs. If the game was recorded in HD it will probably be letterboxed on your finished DVD, but at least you're able to save it.

Randy... thanks for your advice, I will try it. Basically, I just need to switch the 8000 into SD mode, connect the proper output cables and record. Then, I can switch back to HD, and I'm done, right?

Randy... thanks for your advice, I will try it. Basically, I just need to switch the 8000 into SD mode, connect the proper output cables and record. Then, I can switch back to HD, and I'm done, right?

Yup :cool: I used S-Video from the 8000HD to my Panny DMR-E30 DVD recorder, it looked a little better than with regular yellow composite.

It can get a little tricky switching the 8000HD back and forth from HD mode to SD mode, mine kept flipping back to HD mode when i took my fingers off the buttons but i finally got it to stick in SD mode and make my recordings. I had to press and release the buttons quickly.

Yup :cool: I used S-Video from the 8000HD to my Panny DMR-E30 DVD recorder, it looked a little better than with regular yellow composite.

It can get a little tricky switching the 8000HD back and forth from HD mode to SD mode, mine kept flipping back to HD mode when i took my fingers off the buttons but i finally got it to stick in SD mode and make my recordings. I had to press and release the buttons quickly.

Randy,
I'm just curious, but is there a reason you haven't moved to the 8300HD? Having used both the 8000HD and the 8300HD, the 8300HD seems like the better box for everything that I use it for, including burning to DVD with no fussing about changing from HD to SD. By the way, I see you've moved up to a Panny plasma screen - looks really nice in your setup picture. I've got the Panny 4:3 crt that you used to have and that has worked out very well for me particularly given the width space contraints I was working with.

Randy... thanks for your advice, I will try it. Basically, I just need to switch the 8000 into SD mode, connect the proper output cables and record. Then, I can switch back to HD, and I'm done, right?

You probably already know this, but just in case...You can leave the composite or S Video cables hooked up permanently to your DVD or other SD inputs and just toggle the box between HD and SD when required, as the 8000HD doesn't send anything out over those outputs when in HD.

Randy,
I'm just curious, but is there a reason you haven't moved to the 8300HD? Having used both the 8000HD and the 8300HD, the 8300HD seems like the better box for everything that I use it for, including burning to DVD with no fussing about changing from HD to SD.

By the way, I see you've moved up to a Panny plasma screen - looks really nice in your setup picture. I've got the Panny 4:3 crt that you used to have and that has worked out very well for me particularly given the width space contraints I was working with.

I would like to eventually swap my SA8000 and SA8000HD for a pair of 8300HDs, but i have yet to catch up with over a dozen British Touring Car and European Touring Car and Australian V8 Supercar races that i'd recorded onto my 8000 over the winter, and my 8000HD has an HD recording of an excellent Peter Gabriel concert that looks and sounds WAY better than the DVD version that i just bought so i just can't bring myself to give that up just yet. I've actually been checking the INHD site to see if they'll be rebroadcasting the concert again so i can run down and grab an 8300HD, record the show onto it, then turn the old 8000HD in :D

Another thing that's stopping me is the 8300 is so freaking cheap and ugly compared to the old 8000. Jeepers what are these designers thinking?

I resisted getting a plasma for over two years but the time came that i just had to give in and get one. Luckily SD programming looks as good on the new plasma as it did with my excellent 32" HD Panny tube TV so i don't feel so bad about abandoning it. Right now it's sitting alone and covered in the corner of the dining room while i figure out if i want to sell it or not. I love that TV but i no longer have a good use for it.

Another thing that's stopping me is the 8300 is so freaking cheap and ugly compared to the old 8000. Jeepers what are these designers thinking?



Randy,

Have you seen the 8300 in person? Personally I think it's a much sleeker and sophisticated looking design than the 8000. The 8000 looks like a kid's toy to me. The 8300 has a nicer looking display, smaller form factor and nice silver color.

To each his own but if you haven't seen the 8300 in person and are just going by the pics online, I would definitely not be concerned about the appearance of the box.

so what am i smoking!? everything i read says that the 8300hd has roughly 20 hours of capacity for HD. i have called TWC several times and they keep telling me that the 8300hd can store 40 hours of HD.... what is going on?

so what am i smoking!? everything i read says that the 8300hd has roughly 20 hours of capacity for HD. i have called TWC several times and they keep telling me that the 8300hd can store 40 hours of HD.... what is going on?

the SA specs you've read maybe referring to recording at the highest possible bit rate, resolution and quality to cover themselves, whereas TWC may be quoting more realistic (i.e. lower quality) specs.

Somebody else will probably be able to explain the technical jargon. I'm tired so those are the first words that entered my head. :)

so what am i smoking!? everything i read says that the 8300hd has roughly 20 hours of capacity for HD. i have called TWC several times and they keep telling me that the 8300hd can store 40 hours of HD.... what is going on?

Well, from personal experience (which is better than a book or TWC anyway!), it is much closer to 20 than 40. It's closer to 20 than even 25. Not very good for someone who tapes a lot of stuff for future viewing. Unfortunately there are no options to help. Anyone know when the external drive capability will be activated?

You might get close to 40 hours of bit-starved Showtime and/or HBO HD channels ! I recall in other threads that they come in around 8mb/s vs 18-19mb/s for a channel like DiscoveryHD Theatre.

Also, if you have your 8300 set for, 1080 and are recording SD channels, you will eat up your hard drive. When recording non HD always record in the 480 setting.

I would say, from my recordings, that there is 20 hours of HD space.

Also, if you have your 8300 set for, 1080 and are recording SD channels, you will eat up your hard drive. When recording non HD always record in the 480 setting.

I would say, from my recordings, that there is 20 hours of HD space.

that's interesting, I never realised that. I always thought it was just recording the incoming signal directly from the decoder and before it was converted into your specified format for output.

so what am i smoking!? everything i read says that the 8300hd has roughly 20 hours of capacity for HD. i have called TWC several times and they keep telling me that the 8300hd can store 40 hours of HD.... what is going on?

They're flat-out lying to you to make the DVR sound more appealing. The most HD i've ever gotten packed onto my 8000HD is 22 hours, and it was a mix of HDNet network primetime shows (which take up less space per hour than HDNet does).

Just like they told me my regular SD SA8000 will hold up to 50 hours - i've never been able to get more than 34 hours onto it in the two years i've had it.

Like they say: "Don't believe the hype" :eek: