SA 8000HD & 8300HD w/ Passport software (TWC) [Text View] - Page 6

RandyWalters

06-19-05, 04:47 PM

Compilation of various Passport Tips and Tricks, reposted from page 7 of this thread . . . . . .

Slow Motion - Quickly double-tap the PLAY key. To resume playback hit the PLAY key once.

Slow Motion - Hit PAUSE first, then hold down the Right Arrow key and it goes into Slo-Mo.

Frame by frame advance - hit PAUSE first, then repeatedly tap the Right Arrow key

Swap from one tuner to the other - Press the Pip's SWAP button only (don't press Pip)

Recording Options - after selecting a show to record, press SELECT again and a menu
pops up where you can change settings for that particular recording (like save until
manually erased, record entire series, start early/late etc)

Commercial Advance (sorta) - When you're FF'ing through a block of commercials,
hit PLAY as soon as you see the show resume, and the unit jumps back to the right
where the show resumes. Takes practice and quick eyes to get it just right :-)

Jump Ahead to 15 minute marks - When in FF mode you can jump ahead to the next
15 minute interval by pressing the Right Arrow key.

Jump Backwards to 15 minute marks - Hit the Rewind key then press the Left Arrow
key to go backwards. Handy when joining a show in progress and you want to skip
back to the beginning.

Create Manual Recording - Press REC and a menu will pop up giving you an option to
Create a Manual Recording. Press SELECT and you'll be able to navigate around and
create your manual recording just like you did with your VCR.

When in the Guide, see a particular channel listing by entering the direct channel
number using the number keys (like 7, or 200, or 1182 etc).

Another way to quickly skip through channels in the guide is to press the FAV button.
It will jump directly to the next channel on your List of Favorite Channels and is actually
more useful than when watching live TV. You need to first set up your list of Favorite
Channels for this to work if you haven't already done so.

When in the Guide, hit the A key to skip ahead 100 channels at a time.

When in the Guide, to quickly scan hours or days ahead, press and HOLD the Right Arrow
key and it starts advancing through the hours really fast and you can see the days advancing
too. When you get close to the day you want start watching the hours again and take your
finger off the button which will dump you close to the time you're looking for on that day.
If you go more than a few days ahead you'll probably see "No Data" for a few moments
while the new data loads. If you go too far ahead it will not load new data (i can go forward
about 5-6 days typically, but sometimes only 3 or 4 days).

When in the Guide, to quickly skip several days ahead, press a number key then quickly
press the Right Arrow key. Use number 2 to scan two days ahead, use 4 for four days, etc.
Same No Data rules apply as above.

To search by Theme, bring up the Guide normally then hit the B key to bring up the
list of Themes.

While searching by Theme, you can either scroll down by hitting the Down Arrow key
or hit the B key to skp to the next group of Themes (like Sports, Lifestyles, News, Family,
etc) then use the Down or Up Arrow keys to scroll through the subheadings in that group.
When you've highlighted a Theme you want (say, Sports) Right Arrow over into the
Programs section the pressing the B key again skips down one page at a time. Zero in
on the show you want using the Down or Up Arrow key.

To search by Title, bring up the Guide normally then hit the C key to bring up the A-Z column.
Then to search for a particular title, you can either scroll down through the A-Z alphabet to
the letter you want, or hit the C key to advance to the next page of letters. Once you settle
on a letter, Right Arrow into the list of Programs then either scroll down with the Down Arrow
key or hit the C key to skip down to the next title group. When you land on the show you're looking
for, hit the Record key and a menu will pop up giving you the option of recording that particular
showing or Recording the entire series. You can then go into your Series Manager and fine tune
the settings.

To make the Bar Graph or a Menu disappear no matter what you're doing, just hit the EXIT key.

You can change the way the DVR changes channels. If you press the * key this switches to
a mode where you will have to press the SELECT key to complete a direct channel change
or to skip to a specific channel in the Guide. So now you have to press 4 then quickly press
SELECT to complete the channel change. This is to prevent you from accidentally hitting a
number key then losing your existing show's buffer when the channel suddenly changes.
I hate when that happens! This mode eliminates that problem :-) To restore normal
operation, press the INFO button to bring up the progress bar, then quickly hit the * key.
Or reboot the DVR - that also resets this back to the default.

To get to the multi-page Diagnostics screen, simultaneously press and hold the front panel's
SELECT and EXIT buttons till DIAGNO appears then release the buttons, then press EXIT and
the the box tunes itself to the multi-page Diagnostics channel. To exit press Ch + or Ch -

EricScott

06-19-05, 11:29 PM

There's only a crude, manual method. I believe it's user EricScott who's done it.... He goes into the DIAG menu and notes the amount of disk space free. Then he records a program. Now you go back to the DIAG menu and note the difference in disk space free. There's a formula that gets the approx bitrate. He can certainly explain the pluses/minuses of his methodology. Regardless, it's "good enough" for most people and he's to be commended for going to all that work just to satisfy his curiosity !!

Actually that's not me but I do remember reading those posts.

archiguy

06-20-05, 11:25 AM

Actually that's not me but I do remember reading those posts.

It was Michael Scott who's done the most research on the SA HD-DVR's hard disk recording space and he's posted some lengthy analyses in other posts.

But it's pretty easy for anyone to get a handle on how much space an HD vs. SD recording takes up by going into the diagnostic area as outlined above. Then, you can make a pretty accurate prediction on how much space you have left and plan your recordings accordingly. That's the method I use and it works pretty well.

archiguy

06-20-05, 11:29 AM

ChrisFix

06-20-05, 02:17 PM

Here's an interesting problem I haven't figured out yet. Suppose you want to dump a recording off to a VCR, but want to watch another recording or "live" show on the other tuner (in HD via component) while your recording is outputting through the composite jacks to the VCR. How do you do it? I find that the machine seems to always want to output content from either one tuner or the other through both the component and composite jacks at the same time. I don't seem to be able to get one tuner to output over composite while watching the other through component.

Anybody have a solution for this? Does one even exist?

IIRC the Record to VCR function is not enabled with Passport, but is with SARA, so you will get the same "active channel" output from all the various outputs at the same time. In systems that support the fuction, there is a "Record to VCR" menu item for each program listing that you select to output that content over the VCR-out jacks, just not with Passport!

archiguy

06-20-05, 02:39 PM

Ah, figures. Thanks Chris. Just another reason (besides expansion drives) for us Passporters to be envious of the SARA folks. :)

ChrisFix

06-20-05, 03:40 PM

Ah, figures. Thanks Chris. Just another reason (besides expansion drives) for us Passporters to be envious of the SARA folks. :)

I agree that both of those capabilities would be very nice to have - particularly the SATA drive expansion. From what little I've read on the SARA threads, it isn't a perfect solution either. Is it really too much to ask to have everything work the way it's supposed to!? :D

VisionOn

06-20-05, 04:20 PM

Is it really too much to ask to have everything work the way it's supposed to!? :D

Yes, it is too much to ask. :)

It's a conspiracy. If things worked perfectly the first time around nobody would buy the "revised" version. I think they hold back on things like this, just so you have to keep buying better stuff.

hall

06-20-05, 05:21 PM

Eric Scott, Michael Scott ?? Come on, what's the odds of two guys with the last name "Scott" being active in this thread ?? :D

By the way, swapped out my 8000HD for the 8300HD this afternoon.... It's nicer looking than I thought. The pictures at SA's site look like the unit was beige or similar. This one is a nice silver shade.

dmcdayton

06-20-05, 07:21 PM

the thing is, TWC is smart, they are only charging a modest rental fee for what can sometimes be pricey equipment. I regularly change out my cable boxes for the new ones when they come available....but agree, I wish everything was tuned up and enabled, I wouldn't feel so bad about how much we pay

EricScott

06-20-05, 08:50 PM

allengl

06-20-05, 10:19 PM

This is the audio menu.

I have this fix on the 8300 box I picked up Friday in Chatsworth, CA office ( Los Angeles) However it stil doesn't cure the HDMI issue. When set at HDMI it will not send 5.1 to my receiver via COAX. Don't have a Optical cable to test. Also TV is incredibly loud when using HDMI. When I change to Dolby TV has no sound and 5.1 is passed. TV is a Sony KDF-55WF655, receiver is an older Sony. This of course is when I use a HDMI cable.

Barry928

06-20-05, 10:39 PM

What HDMI issue you are trying to solve?

hall

06-21-05, 12:03 AM

The software release seems to be in new boxes only. Customers getting a new 8300HD installed have the new audio menu but the previous customers are reporting they do not have it ... Define "new". My box has a manufacture date of 5/21/2005 and I do not have the setting. From poking around in the DIAG menus, I seem to recall that the s/w version is 1.8.103. Do I need to have a connection in the HDMI port for the setting to appear ?? I'm looking for an HDMI-to-DVI connector to pick up soon....

Barry928

06-21-05, 07:45 AM

Define "new". My box has a manufacture date of 5/21/2005 and I do not have the setting. From poking around in the DIAG menus, I seem to recall that the s/w version is 1.8.103. Do I need to have a connection in the HDMI port for the setting to appear ?? I'm looking for an HDMI-to-DVI connector to pick up soon....

If you convert HDMI to DVI then you do not need the new audio menu. Only HDMI to HDMI connections with displays that do not natively support 5.1 decoding have an issue with the current software.

I do not have the dates when the change occurred.

mpgxsvcd

06-21-05, 11:18 AM

Here is an email I received from TWC cable about the HDMI audio issue. It looks like they admit to a problem and they really don’t care to fix it. Please email them and keep bugging them about this problem. They will not fix it until enough people complain.

Thank you for contacting Time Warner Cable.

Currently, digital audio is fully functional for both optical and digital coax. To your point, there are software issues when connecting via HDMI (when tuning to a non-dolby digital source the audio cuts out). There is a software upgrade, but we have not received word when this will be available. Currently, the software is available in TWC systems that operate on the Scientific Atlanta resident app (we use Pioneer).

Thank you for taking the time to email us. Let us know if you have any additional questions.

Please let us know if we can be of any additional assistance.

Thank you for using Time Warner Cable.

Time Warner Cable Support
Raleigh, NC
919-595-4892
1-800-897-0662

hall

06-21-05, 11:43 AM

They don't care ?? Not sure how you interpret that from the e-mail.... As they say, this is an upstream problem that they have little or NO control over.

mpgxsvcd

06-21-05, 12:50 PM

They don’t care because they consider the Digital Audio to be completely functional as stated in their email. On the other hand they do not consider the HDMI connection to be critical feature of the box. Since the component connection works they consider the HDMI to be an optional feature. The problem is that they are required to have working HDMI or DVI ports on their boxes and they don’t. They get around it by saying that the HDMI works perfectly for video. However, if it breaks the audio then it should not be considered working. Anyway, if the HDMI audio issue doesn’t bother you then enjoy your TV. If it does bother you then the only thing that is going to make them apply the fix is if enough people complain. I have emailed them several times over the last two months and every time they admit there is a problem but they never say that they have any plans to fix it.

hall

06-21-05, 01:38 PM

The problem is that they are required to have working HDMI or DVI ports on their boxes and they don’t. Required by whom ??

On the other points, I'm by no means defending TW but they may just be trying to say "Be patient. We know it doesn't work today but the box is still usable with the other connections." :)

LL3HD

06-21-05, 03:20 PM

Required by whom ??

:)

The FCC

http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-238850A1.pdf

hall

06-21-05, 04:24 PM

I've seen lots of FCC requirements wrongly interpreted by people..... Time to read this one. Any relevant section ?? Nevermind, that's a nice short document. I'm guessing this is the section:

High-definition set-top boxes - Starting April 1, 2004, cable operators must supply, upon request, high-definition set-top boxes with functional 1394 “firewire” connectors. By July 1, 2005, all high-definition set-top boxes would also require a digital visual interface ("DVI") or a high definition multimedia interface ("HDMI").

If so, where does it mention an HD-DVR ?? Don't worry, it doesn't. I've seen this same "requirement" mis-quoted in regards to 1394 connections. So long as TW offers *A* cable box with 1394 or DVI/HDMI, they're in compliance. They DO NOT have to offer an HD-DVR or every box with said connections.

LL3HD

06-21-05, 04:29 PM

page 3
bullet 3
seems to fit

CANNON-FODDER

06-21-05, 10:11 PM

hall,
Is the wording in the actual prescribing document (regulation?) the same as that summary?

High-definition set-top boxes - Starting April 1, 2004, cable operators must supply, upon request, high-definition set-top boxes with functional 1394 “firewire” connectors. By July 1, 2005, all high-definition set-top boxes would also require a digital visual interface ("DVI") or a high definition multimedia interface ("HDMI").

Splitting hairs with that summary, STB with firewire connectors are required if requested with no requirement that any particular one be equipped - understood. But the DVI/HDMI applies to "all" and this sentence is not given the same 'request' caveat.

I would not consider the interpretation of that document to be wrong, but maybe the summary is out of context here.

Of course the cable company would fight to interpret "all" to mean [all new purchases from this point forward], and/or split another hair over DVR vs. STB...

v/r,
C-F

hall

06-21-05, 10:22 PM

mpgxsvcd

06-22-05, 11:50 AM

I actually asked a contact at TWC about this. He is in a position to be fully aware of these rules too. He said that as of today, if a customer wants 1394, he's got SA 3250HD boxes available for them.... :) After July 1, all set-tops manufactured do need both and that they'll be receiving compliant boxes in mid-July.

Yea I have heard that TWC plans to fix this right on the July 1st deadline. They know that they have to fix this issue for the 8300 but they seem to be putting it off as long as they can.

VisionOn

06-22-05, 12:05 PM

This may seem like a stupidly naive question ... what can you do with a FW port on the 8000 series? Adding an external hard drive would be good but Passport doesn't allow this, does it? Are we talking about basically just another AV connection method to FW equipped devicces?

hall

06-22-05, 01:00 PM

VisionOn

06-22-05, 06:41 PM

Apparently, and I don't know this personally, many D-VHS decks have Firewire inputs.

That said, don't *ever* expect to see a working 1394/Firewire port on the 8000 boxes. Well, I take that back and that's assuming that SA continues to manufacture the 8000 series after July 1... They may not though and simply replace it completely with the 82xx and 83xx boxes.

Sorry, by 8000 series I just meant all the 8XXX range. If you could link the 8300 directly to an external DVD burner/hard drive I can see that being a big benefit through Firewire. How does that fit in with FCC copy protection situation?

hall

06-22-05, 08:29 PM

If you could link the 8300 directly to an external DVD burner/hard drive I can see that being a big benefit through Firewire. How does that fit in with FCC copy protection situation? I'm not sure if you can "stream" like that do a DVD burner. It would likely be too slow (???). An external HDD also doesn't accept streaming data input. There needs to be an operating system involved that "talks" to the HDD. I'm not sure how it stands with the external SATA option available on the 8300 boxes with SARA software but it was assumed it will only work with certain HDD models and even then, the data will be encrypted on the drive just like it is on the internal HDD, only readable (today) by the DVR.

Barry928

06-27-05, 09:24 AM

I just got word that the Passport July 1 software update for the SA8300HD "will probably be delayed by a couple of weeks" due to some bugs discovered by the beta testers.

hall

07-01-05, 07:42 AM

I've had my 8300HD for maybe two weeks now and am quite happy with it. The SD channels, especially the digital ones, are better looking now. The analogs might be better but they still suck.... Hate to say it about the HD channels, but my eyes can't tell. Well, maybe they look brighter or more colorful (rich ?).

Couple things:

1) I got a DVI/HDMI cable and after setting my TV's settings to match what I had with component cables, the picture definitely appears darker.

2) I have to turn my TV on first, then the 8300HD. Otherwise I get a message saying my TV doesn't support HDCP (in fact, it does). I realize this isn't really an 8300 issue but am wondering if there's any workarounds ?? Using my Kameleon remote, it's not a problem as the power-on sequence I programmed just happens to work in the proper order.

3) When I turn the box on, I get an "L" shape blacked out on the screen (turned 90' counter-clockwise). This ONLY started after switching to DVI.

4) What's the total memory supposed to be ?? I thought it was more like 96mb total but when I checked mine, it was quite a bit lower.

RandyWalters

07-01-05, 09:15 AM

I've had my 8300HD for maybe two weeks now and am quite happy with it. The SD channels, especially the digital ones, are better looking now. The analogs might be better but they still suck........

You should try also connecting the S-Video output to one of the Video inputs on your TV and see how the analogs look on that input. Also try regular old Composite and see how that looks too. On some cable STBs this gives a better SD picture than DVI or Component does.

2) I have to turn my TV on first, then the 8300HD. Otherwise I get a message saying my TV doesn't support HDCP (in fact, it does). I realize this isn't really an 8300 issue but am wondering if there's any workarounds ??

There's no workaround any better than the remote sequence you're already using :cool:

margoba

07-01-05, 12:48 PM

There is one workaround for the HDCP problem - go back to using component cables! On my TV, the video image is actually better with component than with HDMI. Furthermore, I've never read anybody on this board who says the image is more than "very slightly better" with HDMI. I'll take the convenience and consistency of a component hookup over a very slight image improvement.

-barry

hall

07-01-05, 03:05 PM

TheDaveMan

07-04-05, 11:46 PM

margoba

07-05-05, 12:40 AM

I wasn't expecting an improvement in PQ by going with DVI. My TV is analog anyway so component cable is technically as good as I need. I switched to free up a set of component inputs for the PS2/XBox. :D

Yeah, my TV only has two sets of component inputs, so I had to buy a component A/B switch so I could put the 8300hd and two DVD's on my TV at the same time. But, HDMI was such a pain in the neck, that I'm thrilled to be free of it.

-barry

TheDaveMan

07-05-05, 07:54 PM

I think I've just discovered the lack of discernible improvement between component and HDMI->DVI. In any case, is there a known issue or fix related to the SA8300HD and overscan?

HDNet's test patterns are telling me I've got some pretty significant (although I wouldn't notice without the test patterns) overscan.

OK - after spending some time on the phone with tv company and TWC, I believe that I may have a solution to my problem - setting the SA8300 to pass-through mode. The only problem is, TWC reps were completely uninformed and unhelpful on this issue.

Can someone please tell me how to put the 8300 into pass-through mode?

margoba

07-05-05, 08:12 PM

TheDaveMan

07-05-05, 08:15 PM

Under Passport, there is no official pass-through mode, but you can achieve the same thing by doing the following:

Select "Settings", then press A for "More Settings"
Use the down arrow until you get to "Output Formats"
Use the right arrow to change "Output Formats"
Now make sure that 480P, 720P, and 1080i are selected (480i doesn't matter)
Then press A to accept as many times as necessary.

The box will now pass through all HD formats.

-barry

I've got those modes selected, and I still get significant overscan. I would think that the cable box is doing some scaling that is throwing things off, no? Or is this simply the result of the SA8300's less-than 1920x1080 resolution?

Is there really no way to activate true pass-through?

CANNON-FODDER

07-05-05, 08:21 PM

I know 480i doesn't come out of the 8000 without switching modes (and not that I can tell much difference on my 32" direct view CRT) but you should be able to get 480i if you want on the 8300 - on live TV after changing the channel, as long as you don't touch any of the time shifting buttons and aren't recording.

v/r,
C-F

margoba

07-05-05, 08:21 PM

margoba

07-05-05, 08:29 PM

Ah, Cannon-Fodder reminds me of a point I forogt. The 8300HD almost always converts 480i to 480p. The only way to get it to pass 480i through is to select the 480i output format, and DELSELECT all the others. If 480i is the only output format selected, then the box will actually output 480i, otherwise it converts it.

-barry

zim2dive

07-06-05, 08:33 AM

I just got word that the Passport July 1 software update for the SA8300HD "will probably be delayed by a couple of weeks" due to some bugs discovered by the beta testers.

I noticed this AM that

- my "system on" channel had been lost (had it set to CNN)
- all of my "favorite" channels below 100 had been removed from my favorites list (channels above 100/digital were still on the list)
- no guide info

might this indicate an update had happened?

Thanks,
Mike

RandyWalters

07-06-05, 08:49 AM

I noticed this AM that

- my "system on" channel had been lost (had it set to CNN)
- all of my "favorite" channels below 100 had been removed from my favorites list (channels above 100/digital were still on the list)
- no guide info

might this indicate an update had happened?

I've had several updates in the past 2+ years and none of the above ever happened. It sounds more like there's a temporary problem at the head end perhaps. Go into the diagnostic screen and see if you got new software.

IamtheWolf

07-06-05, 08:51 AM

I noticed this AM that

- my "system on" channel had been lost (had it set to CNN)
- all of my "favorite" channels below 100 had been removed from my favorites list (channels above 100/digital were still on the list)
- no guide info

might this indicate an update had happened?

Thanks,
Mike
Looks like TWC switched to all Digital from Analog for channels 100 and under this AM. That may explain it.

hall

07-06-05, 09:43 AM

Looks like TWC switched to all Digital from Analog for channels 100 and under this AM. That may explain it. Aren't they simulcasting both instead of just getting rid of the analogs entirely ??

VisionOn

07-06-05, 10:58 AM

yeah, I still get the analog feed but now the box only displays the digital signal. Which also means I now have audio dropouts and digital artifacts on a lot of the channels.

TheDaveMan

07-06-05, 12:47 PM

I don't think the box does any processing if you have the needed HD mode checked. You might try pressing the # key on the remote to be sure you are not in one of the zoomed modes. With the 8300hd, zooming now works on HD channels as well as SD.

-barry

Well, if I can't switch the box to pass-through, then I would think the box is doing it's own scaling. I had hoped that pass-through would have allowed me to correct overscan.

On my TV, with the SA8300, both standard and fill modes are exactly the same in HD, in either 720p or 1080i. Zoom works.

On SD channels, after TWX had me fiddle with the aspect ratio setting I had previously come to, the only way I can get the full SD picture now, pillarboxed, is to select stretch mode. If I don't, I get a pillarboxed, distorted image, *within* the "true" pillarboxes.

They're sending a technician over next week who will hopefully be able to shed some light on all this, as well as another problem I've been having with periodic screen flashes.

bigd86

07-06-05, 04:40 PM

On SD channels, after TWX had me fiddle with the aspect ratio setting I had previously come to, the only way I can get the full SD picture now, pillarboxed, is to select stretch mode. If I don't, I get a pillarboxed, distorted image, *within* the "true" pillarboxes.

Interestingly enough, I have this same problem when I set the main aspect ratio to Widescreen (16:9)-I need to set 4:3 to stretch to fill the "normal" 4:3 area in SD, otherwise the image is shrunken within my sets 4:3 window. HOWEVER, if I set the main aspect ratio to Standard (4:3) (even though my set is 16:9) and then set the sub menu to Letterbox 16:9 picture-all ratios come out as expected!
Strange-but true!

EricScott

07-06-05, 05:02 PM

The 8300, unlike the 8000, retains separate aspect ratio settings for HD vs SD channels - it may actually be resolution specific (in other words you can set 720p differently from 1080i) but I'm not sure about that.

I personally hate the gray sidebars that the 8300 inserts so my work-around when watching SD is to set the 8300 to "16:9/Stretch" (so there are no sidebars at all) and then I set my Samsung to "4:3" mode which inserts black bars on the sides - the image doesn't look distorted at all.

For HD, I have the 8300 set to "16:9/Sidebar" (so that the image isn't stretched unnecessarily) and I leave the Sammy on "Wide" mode.

Works great.

blabes12

07-06-05, 08:45 PM

The "trick play" buffer on my 8300HD DVR is behaving strangely. When I try to pause live TV, the box jumps to a different channel, and pauses the picture there. Replay and rewind of live TV don't work at all, presumably because the unwanted channel change clears the buffer.

Anyone seen this? I've already done both hard and soft restarts with no change in behavior... any other suggestions besides getting a replacement from TW?

hall

07-06-05, 10:33 PM

I have an anomaly with mine too.... I recorded Enemy at the Gate and every time I "Resume playback", it jumps to a PPV/OnDemand channel. I have to "List, Resume playback" a 2nd time to get it to play.

gattaca

07-09-05, 09:58 PM

Hi, I just upgraded from SA 8000HD --> SA 8300HD on TWC in Raleigh, NC. I moved up b/c I wanted to use the HDMI output to feed a DVI input on my Samsung DLP so I hit BB and picked up a HDMI --> DVI converter. My unit was manufactured in 5/2005 and has the "103" version of the Pioneer Passport loaded. Once plugged in the HDMI cable to the rear of the SA 8300HD, I lost ALL analog outputs from the unit (I heard relay click in) and then it put up the message about your system not supporting HDMI. I switched the TV to DVI and the picture returned.. but NO audio.

Please don't tell me that this unit is going to shutdown ALL analog outputs when it detects any HDMI connection... else how will you ever be able to VCR anything off of it? My setup has the DVI cable and a R/L cable going to the TV b/c my family doesn't always want to turn on the main sound system to watch tv. However, it seems that if I use the HDMI output to feed my DVI input on the Sammy, I am going to lose the analog output which is normally fed to the TV. I found the install manual for the SA 8300HD and it shows my hookup as valid.

I was able to get sound via the Digital COAX, but that does not help my situation where the family just wants TV w/ no super sound from the main amps.

Is this part of the HDMI problem mentioned earlier n this discussion? If so will it ever be addressed? I need those analog outputs to functon along with the digital outputs.

Thanks,
Vincent

EricScott

07-09-05, 10:02 PM

Gattaca,

I use the exact same setup - HDMI/DVI from the 8300 to my Sammy DLP and all of the analog outputs work fine. I can run component and S-Video at the same time. Haven't tried running analog audio (I use digital coax like you) but I can't imagine they wouldn't work.

The HDMI audio issue only comes into play when you use and HDMI/HDMI connection and want to get digital audio from either the optical or coax outs to feed an AV Receiver. But with your setup it shouldn't be an issue. The HDMI out on the STB knows it's not connecting to an HDMI in on the display so the optical and coax outs work fine.

So not sure why your analog outs are disabled.

gattaca

07-09-05, 10:45 PM

I agree 100%.. thanks for the clarification on the HDMI issue being HDMI/HDMI... I did not anticipate issues with this setup. However, it's been a LONG day and I think I just figured it out......duggggghh... need to move the R/L to the PC audio inputs on the rear of the Sammy.. my bad.. I'll pull the TV out tomorrow and move them. Thanks.. sorry for the trouble. Vincent

EricScott

07-10-05, 09:44 AM

That would explain in :)

No worries

flbikerchick

07-11-05, 11:29 AM

hall

07-11-05, 12:44 PM

This thread is for Time Warner customers who's boxes use Pioneer's Passport Echo software. With Passport, it is NOT possible to change the sidebar color. It IS possible with SARA software though. Verify what you're using and check back.... There are numerous threads here at AVS for the 8x00 series boxes for different cable companies and the different software interfaces used.

flbikerchick

07-11-05, 02:01 PM

RandyWalters

07-11-05, 02:29 PM

I just got the SA 8300HD, and the unit seems fine except for one thing. It says in the user's manual that it's possible to change the color of the sidebars from gray to black, but when we get into the General Settings menu, that option doesn't appear. It looks as if it's been "hidden" by the cable company. Does anyone know how to access that feature?

The user manual is for units with the basic SARA software, but it doesn't cover the Pioneer Passport Echo software that's laid on top of it by some cable companies.

Here's a couple links for Pioneer Passport Echo info:

http://www.pioneerbroadband.com/pdf/passportecho1.6gettingstarted.pdf

http://www.pioneerbroadband.com/passportecho/passportecho.asp

hall

07-11-05, 03:23 PM

It's Password, unfortunately in this case. Thanks for the info. In most people's opinion, Passport is "better" than SARA. Yeah, SARA has the option to change the sidebar color while Passport doesn't, but IMO, that's not that big of a deal...

tgh

07-12-05, 01:57 PM

This may be a local problem. I'm in Akron, OH using an 8300.

When I scroll thru program listings five days ahead then advance to to midnight of the sixth day, I'll sometimes get a brief "Downloading" message, but nothing downloads because the listings aren't yet available for that date. Problem is that a few days later when that date's program info is available. the 8300 seems to remember that there was nothing before for it and will not download the now-available data. It will download the next date's, however. The only way I've found to get the skipped date is a reboot.

Does anyone else have this problem and a better solution?

archiguy

07-12-05, 05:08 PM

In most people's opinion, Passport is "better" than SARA. Yeah, SARA has the option to change the sidebar color while Passport doesn't, but IMO, that's not that big of a deal...

Not mine. SARA has the BIG advantage of being able to add external drives to expand storage space. There's probably no reason why the Passport software won't accommodate this, but to my knowledge no cable system running Passport has attempted to modify it to allow this wonderful option for their customers.

dmcdayton

07-13-05, 12:45 PM

Has anyone verified receipt of TWC software upgradeo for 8300...I haven't noticed anything yet that would make me reconnect the HDMI cable to look for HDCP handshake.

hall

07-13-05, 01:03 PM

Last time I checked it was X.X.103.

What issue are you having with handshaking ?? Will it not sync up at all ?? With mine, I have to turn the TV on first, then the 8300. I don't have HDMI on my TV though, just DVI.

scsiraid

07-13-05, 01:28 PM

I was having a HDCP issue but I have figured out how to get around it. I had a DVI switcher (on all the time) which was aggrevating the situation.

Before:
When the TV was on and I powered on the DVR (and it wasnt recording), all was well. When I turned off the TV, the DVR detected the loss of HDCP and soft powered itself off. Turning the TV back and then repowering on the DVR worked fine. Now IF the DVR was recording.... different story. In this case, I couldnt force the DVR to re-handshake with the TV. Turning DVR off and on had no effect - got the 'no hdcp - use component' message. To correct the situation, i had to physically unplug the DVI cable from the switcher and plug it back in. This forced a handshake and all was well. It seems that when the DVR is recording it treats on/off transition differently or that the powered on DVI switcher wasnt letting the DVR recognize that the link had 'changed' when the TV was repowered on.

So... once I removed the switcher... all works fine... Powering up the TV and then turning on the DVR works. Turning off the TV still causes the DVR to soft power off state.

dmcdayton

07-13-05, 04:17 PM

I have an Infocus 4805. No combination of switching on/off etc has made it work. I get the "Your display is not HDCP compliant" or to that effect. See a page or 2 back discussion. Its my understanding the update that's coming should fix the handshake issues...hoping.

Hall,

How do you check the version for TWC Dayton 8300DVR running Passport?

hall

07-13-05, 04:26 PM

Heh, I mentioned that same "HDCP compliant" message myself.... I got my 8300HD just a couple of weeks ago and a DVI even more recently and ran into this. I believe you followed up with similar issues....

I can't recall the exact method for finding the s/w version. Search this thread for "diag" or "diagnostics" mode. It's something like holding down "INFO" + "EXIT" until it "dongs". Release both buttons then press "EXIT" once and release. The box will change to channel "611" (this channel # is specific to TW areas). Use the up/down arrow keys and look for something like "App version".

dmcdayton

07-13-05, 07:59 PM

Thanks Hall, I didn't know about many of those shortcuts. On my unit I figured out that the diagnostics menu is constant output to channel 611. So I can pull up program guide and switch back and forth from remote.

Looks like I have a 150GB Maxtor HD in my unit, I have a bunch of HD Movies recorded and its still showing 35GB free. I trust these numbers are meaningful?

I noticed in the diagnostic screen, there is a screen for copy protection(didn't see this in this thread, sorry if its old news but its new to me) that shows all the port's setup for CP. Looks like it might be a menu with options but I cant cursor over to it, I guess these must be hard coded setups.

Here's how my unit is set up:

HDMI port: Block HDMI - HDCP auth failed
HDMI port: Always use HDCP
YPrPb port: YPrPb CIT on
1394 port: Enable 1394 port always
Comp port: NA - Reserved
VOD: CCI Override

I would love to navigate over to the HDMI port: Always use HDCP and change it to "Never use HDCP"...boy that would fix my problems right now.

hall

07-13-05, 09:30 PM

Many of the screens are read-only, i.e. just information for us to read, NOT change. :) The copy-protection ones are definitely read-only. TW sets those settings and the set-top obeys 'em...

Yours always tunes to "611" ?? Do you turn the set-top *off* ?? I can go back and forth from ch 611 for some period of time after I get into DIAG mode but if I turn the box off, for example, I have to start over.

The HDD is a 160gb too, by the way, not 150gb.

paul watkins

07-14-05, 02:02 AM

Have not checked this thread in a month or so. Has there been a fix for the HDMI and DD 5.1 problems from the past? ie, can I use HDMI and optical and coax for DD...

Thanks

dmcdayton

07-14-05, 07:43 AM

Thanks Hall.

I noticed also on the "tuning" page, its channel dependent and lets user select for each channgel "Analog" "QAM 256" "QAM..do you know what the differences are?

I also notice that AC3 is turned off for me for each channel...is this referring to Dolby Digital AC-3?

I am still using a 5.1 channel ready receiver which works fine for my DVD player but have always wanted Dolby Digital for HDTV movies. I was looking to buy a DENON 3806 in the fall....but if TWC isn't providing a DD signal anyway, I'll just wait.

hall

07-14-05, 08:13 AM

Can't help with the "tuning" question, sorry. I've seen AC-3 listed as off and am not sure how that works. I do know that various network programs, CSI, for example, are in DD5.1, as well as DiscoveryHD Theatre and TNT-HD programs. When they're on and I turn my stereo receiver on, they're in DD5.1.

dmcdayton

07-14-05, 09:26 PM

So, its the 14th...anyone know where this TWC Passport upgrade went to that was scheduled for July 1st?

Barry928

07-14-05, 11:13 PM

No word yet on the 8300 passport software upgrade but I am scheduled to receive an advanced copy so I will post here when it arrives.

RAC2005

07-14-05, 11:47 PM

I have Time Warner Cable in Charlotte with the Passport software. I recently purchased a Pioneer Elite 43" plasma monitor. Zobo TV did the install and used the HDMI cables from the cable box to the TV. After realizing I had no 5.1 sound, I have been doing some research online and what I have been reading states that this is a problem with the SA 8000HD box from Time Warner Cable. Base upon what I have read, an HDMI>HDMI or HDMI>DVI connection will automatically select 2 channel stereo if your TV does not support Dolby Digital ( I have a plasma monitor) . In order to restore DD audio out to your receiver, you need to change the automatic setting. Press the Settings button twice and scroll to Audio: Digital Out. Change the setting from HDMI to Dolby Digital. This will force DD audio to the HDMI, as well as the digital/optical audio outs. It also read that if you have passport software on the 8300 (which I do)you can't change the audio setting to dolby digital. You are just stuck with it when using the HDMI cable and a separate optical for sound. Is there anyway I can get 5.1 surround sound without switching to component for video instead of HDMI. Zobo has been no help on this and said they have not heard of the issue. I find that hard to believe and wanted to see if other have had the same audio issue. Any info at all is appreciated.

Ryan

VisionOn

07-15-05, 03:18 AM

Search this thread. It's well known problem but I don't think anyone has come up with an easy fix unless their box shipped with the software upgrade.

scsiraid

07-15-05, 09:35 AM

I have Time Warner Cable in Charlotte with the Passport software. After realizing I had no 5.1 sound, I have been doing some research online and what I have been reading states that this is a problem with the SA 8000HD box from Time Warner Cable. Base upon what I have read, an HDMI>HDMI or HDMI>DVI connection will automatically select 2 channel stereo if your TV does not support Dolby Digital. In order to restore DD audio out to your receiver, you need to change the automatic setting. It also read that if you have passport software on the 8300 (which I do)you can't change the audio setting to dolby digital. You are just stuck with it when using the HDMI cable and a separate optical for sound. Is there anyway I can get 5.1 surround sound without switching to component for video instead of HDMI. Zobo has been no help on this and said they have not heard of the issue. I find that hard to believe and wanted to see if other have had the same audio issue. Any info at all is appreciated.

Ryan

You might try an HDMI to DVI cable with an adapter to convert the DVI back to HDMI. This should drop the audio links in the HDMI cable and might let the DVR output DD. My TV is DVI and with an HDMI to DVI cable, the digital output to the receiver works just fine with DD. May be worth a try....

Barry928

07-15-05, 10:17 AM

I thought the same thing about using the adapters to HDMI>DVI>HDMI but someone early on in this thread tested it and it did not work. The offending signals to drop are the communication signals instead of the audio signals. If you do not have a DVI input you need to have the new software menu. Many people have reported the newest production run of the SA8300 comes with the new software already loaded.

dmcdayton

07-15-05, 11:58 AM

Barry,

I tried swapping my 8300 for a new 8300 with May 24th build date...but it had the same Passport software....do you know what build date has the new Passport? Or did I misunderstand which software you're referring to?

hall

07-15-05, 12:02 PM

In a previous post, I mentioned which build date my 8300HD had and it wasn't much more than one month old when I got mine. It had the same (older) software, not this newer version. I'm betting that many TWC areas, including WOH, re-image the drives so that they're all using the same software version.

tzhang618

07-15-05, 12:26 PM

Does anyone know if TimeWarner has a Pioneer box that supports the HDMI cable? or is it just the SA version. And if its just SA, is the 8300HD box the latest version? thanks.

RAC2005

07-15-05, 12:35 PM

The 8300HD is the latest version according to the person I talked to form TWC Charlotte. The guy did say it was a known issue and they push updates to the cable boxes periodically, but did not say if or when it will be fixed. I received my 8000HD in early May.

Barry928

07-15-05, 12:40 PM

The information I received is that SA started producing the Rev. 2 8300 box with slightly different hardware that required the new software. We got the digital audio menu as a bonus of that new hardware requirement. The first person who emailed me to say the new software was in the 8300 was on June 3rd so a May build seems like it should be the new hardware but I don't know how different cable systems distribute hardware.

weth

07-15-05, 12:59 PM

tzhang618

07-15-05, 02:37 PM

Barry928

07-15-05, 03:05 PM

Also if I do decide to switch it, does TWC provide the HDMI cable? That factors in too, as they're quite costly (>$100) in stores. Please help. Thanks.

AVS sponsor Ram Electronics sells hdmi cables for $27.95 with free shipping.

http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/DVI-hdmi_cables.html

tamanaco

07-15-05, 04:42 PM

I picked up an SA-8300HD w/ passport from our local San Diego Time Warner office. In the setup menu it allows me to choose Auto, 2 channel, or Dolby Digital for digital sound output. On auto when hooked up through HDMI to Sammy DLP it chooses 2 channel. However, I am able to select Dolby Digital and get confirmed 5.1 sound through to my receiver. The Sammy doesn't talk Dolby Digital 5.1 and now no sound comes through the Sammy when in this mode.

Weth

Can you tell us what version of Passport Echo your SA-8300HD is running? I picked up one yesterday at the TWC office in 23rd street in NYC and it came loaded with version 1.8.103 of Passport Echo. With this version and the HDMI cable connected I DO NOT get the Setup Menu with Auto, 2 channel and Dolby Digital that you mentioned while connected with my HDMI Monster cable.

I have the HDMI cable connected to a Panasonic LCD TC-32LX50. With just the HDMI cable, I get SD and HD picture, but no sound. (The HDCP DD5.1 handshake problem that we're are so familiar with) I added RCA cables from the RCA output of the SA-8300HD to the Panasonic RCA inputs labeled "HDMI AUDIO IN" and now I get sound out of the TV speakers. I was surprised to find this RCA audio input next to the HDMI connector. My understanding was that with the HDMI cable I would not need a separated audio inputs. My guess is that Panasonic thought about those folks with components with DVI outputs. Using a DVI to HDMI cable those folks can connect to the HDMI connector and use RCA cables for sound.
This setup is great for my wife as she does not have to turn on the receiver to get sound from the TV.

As mentioned before, the problem with this setup is that I can not get DD 5.1 to my receiver. With the menu option to force DD 5.1 out, as Weth mentions, I also won't get sound out of the TV speakers, BUT I will probably be able to get DD 5.1 sound throught my receiver via the digital outputs of the 8300HD. This is what I need so that I can fully enjoy HDTV DD 5.1 programing comming throught my 8300HD. Does anyone else get these options with a 8300HD and Passport Echo 1.8.103? I just want to make sure that there is no other 8300HD "hardware" build that TWC is putting out there that enables this menu option. My assumption is that this option is only activated when a HDMI connection is detected and a newer version of Passport Echo (later that 1.8.103) is installed.

One last thing... is there anyone out there with a TV that can handle DD 5.1?

Thanks

weth

07-15-05, 07:34 PM

Can you tell us what version of Passport Echo your SA-8300HD is running?

I am also running Passport Echo ver 1.8.103

The choice on the menu does not come up if I am not connected via HDMI

Also clarification on the menu choices:

The choice comes under General Settings
Between Audio Level and Clock Options

The choices are
a) Two Channel Only
b) HDMI <-- Seems to let HDMI interface choose automatically (2 channel in my case)
c) Dolby Digital (no sound come from Sammy, but receiver shows DD5.1)

CANNON-FODDER

07-15-05, 08:11 PM

what I have right now is a TWC Pioneer HD box and a sammy DLP. I'm wondering if its worth the hassle to switch it my Pioneer to a SA 8300 HD box...does it really make a difference? I've been told that it makes a slight difference, but not sure what that really means.

Also if I do decide to switch it, does TWC provide the HDMI cable? That factors in too, as they're quite costly (>$100) in stores. Please help. Thanks.

Just wondering, are you talking about picture quality or DVR function?

I had the Pioneer Voyager 3510HD (I don't have DVI so no idea if that output worked here) and I enjoyed the picture quality on it.

I moved to the SA 8_00HD series to get the DVR functionality.

The 8000HD channel changing and menu speed was about equal to the Pioneer's but the 8300HD is faster than both.

I lost the Pioneer's very pretty SD anamorphic 16:9 picture over the composite that I could record on any old VCR, in favor of a much lower quality letterboxed SD signal on the 8300HD, so I don't archive much anymore (conspiracy?), but I don't have to because I just use the DVR.

Both have really wonky aspect control issues where at least two of the modes result in the same signal. Mostly, I seem to get to the ones that I need for my 32" 4:3 CRT with WIDE mode, so I can't really complain.

Couldn't justify two boxes for one TV, so I only have the SA box now.
Only thing I miss is the anamorphic SD output and it's quality. Looked as good as a DVD when I recorded from an HD source.

v/r,
C-F

tamanaco

07-16-05, 12:14 AM

I am also running Passport Echo ver 1.8.103

The choice on the menu does not come up if I am not connected via HDMI

Also clarification on the menu choices:

The choice comes under General Settings
Between Audio Level and Clock Options

The choices are
a) Two Channel Only
b) HDMI <-- Seems to let HDMI interface choose automatically (2 channel in my case)
c) Dolby Digital (no sound come from Sammy, but receiver shows DD5.1)

Weth, thanks for your quick response.

Maybe there is some difference in our hardware/software. To be more specific as I can see on the Diags screen that I'm running the same Passport version along with OS Version of PowerTV 6.8.9.4sp - OS Date: Aug 11 2004 Driver Version: 1. While I'm connected to my TV via HDMI cable I do not get that menu choice between the Audio Level and Clock Options. I have tried every single HDMI setting on my TV (Auto, Digital and Analog) and have turn the TV and DVR on/off in all possible iterations, but I still do not get that menu option.

The 8300HD Diags menu under Copy Protection show the HDMI Port status as: Block HDMI - HDCP auth failed... does yours? Anyone else getting this menu option with the same HDMI port status on a 8300HD and running Passport 1.8.103 while connected via HDMI?

Btw, maybe I'm going crazy, but I found that "sometimes" when I have the HDMI cable connected to the TV I can turn on the 8300HD by just powering the TV. Is this an HDMI interface feature?

Thanks again

weth

07-16-05, 02:17 AM

Maybe there is some difference in our hardware/software.

I don't know why it shows up on my menu and not yours. After reading that you couldn't get DD5.1 when connected HDMI, I was very surprised and pleased to find my unit has this option.

My op sys shows same version and date as yours (6.8.9.4sp)
Other settings for your comparison (from DIAG menu)
Copy Prot Section
HDMI port: Block HDMI - HDCP auth failed
HDMI port: Always use HDCP
YPrPb port: YPrPb CIT on
1394 port: Enable 1394 port always

Chan. App
Passport API ver: 61

Hardware
HWVer: 00000018
ManfID: 000002DE
ModelID: 0000206C
OUI: 00:02:DE

Versions
PowerKey: PKEY_3.7.5.110-p +dvrs3

Versions 2
HAL Driver Drv_1.0.31.11011
PHAL3 Driver PHAL_3.5.11.1001
PowerKEY LIB PKEY_3.7.5.110

tamanaco

07-16-05, 08:44 AM

Other settings for your comparison (from DIAG menu)

All those settings are the same in my DIAGS menu. Now I'm starting to wonder if there is something different with the HDMI/HDCP implementation of my TV. The TV manual says that the HDMI is Type A and that I can connect EIA/CEA-861/861B compliant devices. The compatible sampling frequency of audio signal through HDMI (L.PCM) are 48 kHz / 44.1 KHz / 32 kHz.

Does your TV have setting for the HDMI connector?

Btw, I just got this box, and I don't know if there a way to force the firmware to be downloaded to the DVR from TWC? In other words a way to execute a full hardware/firmware reset.

-----
Just figured out that like my old SA 3100 the 8300HD resets (reboots) by holding the power button in for a few seconds - So, I'll refine my question. Does rebooting the box force Passport to do a lookup for Passport updates at the cable network head-end?
-----

Thanks again

tzhang618

07-18-05, 03:27 PM

C-F, thanks for the info...I'm interested in maximizing my picture quality. And I've been reading that the SA 8300 with HDMI improves the picture quality, so I'm interested in switching, but also weighing if its worth it b/c everything you do with Time Warner is a chore onto itself. They gave me a busted box last time I switched a HD box and had to make another trip to get it.

According to you, its worth the trouble?

tzhang618

07-18-05, 03:57 PM

ChrisFix

07-18-05, 04:10 PM

yeah, I still get the analog feed but now the box only displays the digital signal. Which also means I now have audio dropouts and digital artifacts on a lot of the channels.

Could someone explain how this works? Are the channels now digital at the head-end but still broadcast as analog or something different? How would people without an STB be able to view channel 2 for example if it were digital?

Feeling confused...

hanzacra

07-18-05, 04:17 PM

Not for relatively short distances. HDMI is a digital signal, so you're either getting the data or you're not.

<long debate regarding expensive HDMI cables to follow>

scsiraid

07-18-05, 06:50 PM

There are a ton of different type of cables for all kinds of prices...can you tell me the difference b/t the high end and the lower end ones? Is it worth it to get the higher end ones? Would I be able to see the difference b/t the higher end and lower end? Any info on this would be great. Thanks!

Im a real believer in high quality cables for ANALOG signals.... but HDMI and DVI ARENT Analog. Im using an 'inexpensive' 6' DVI-HDMI cable that I got from ebay for less than 12 bucks including shipping. It works great. Beautiful pic. It looks a little better than component but not a huge improvement. Issues with digital interconnect wont be tint or snow or any of the typical analog phenoms. If you are getting digital dropouts you are going to lose the pic or have it go blocky. Issues should be quite obvious as compared to analog issues which can be subtle.

VisionOn

07-18-05, 07:19 PM

Could someone explain how this works? Are the channels now digital at the head-end but still broadcast as analog or something different? How would people without an STB be able to view channel 2 for example if it were digital?

Feeling confused...

The channels are being simulcast and sent to your home as both analog and digital signals. However, your digital STB is using the digital signal to display the channel and ignoring the analog signal that it previously picked up. That's my understanding.

If you plug your TV directly into the outlet you'll still get the regular analog cable signal, but the quality drop is more noticeable now.

Oh yes, the audio and signal dropouts I mentioned before were fixed by the TWC engineers later that afternoon. Looks and sounds great now.

CANNON-FODDER

07-18-05, 07:47 PM

tzhang618,
I say go to the storefront, pick up an 8300HD and let the two have at it on your TV, then pick the one you like. Should only be $5-10 more to keep the Pioneer for a month, or $15-20 to find out you don't like the 8300HD.
I have had all three side by side on a Zektor switch and I went with the 8300HD, but: I had to choose one, I wanted the DVR, and I have a 32" 4:3 Direct View CRT that has not had it's geometry corrected yet. I saw very little difference between the two (mostly color balance) in terms of their COMPONENT outputs on a 32" CRT.

Having only component, and no DVI/HDMI/HDCP whatsoever, I have no idea what HDMI will do for you - I can tell you that the DVR part is worth it (unless you are a TIVO elitist).

hanzacra,
that's funny, maybe this will forestall it*:
<Cheap buyer> INSULT
<Expensive buyer> RETORT
<Cheap buyer> COUNTER-RETORT
<Expensive buyer> QUESTIONING OF EQUIPMENT QUALITY
<Cheap buyer> SUGGESTION TO TRY IT YOURSELF
<Expensive buyer> NOTATION THAT YOU CANNOT SEE SIGNAL LOSS
<Cheap buyer> RIPOSTE
<Cheap buyer> ADD-ON RIPOSTE
<Expensive buyer> COUNTER-RIPOSTE
<Cheap buyer> COUNTER-COUNTER RIPOSTE
<Expensive buyer> NONSENSICAL STATEMENT INVOLVING HDTV PROGRAM
<Mod> RESPONSE TO RANDOM STATEMENT AND THREAT TO BAN OPPOSING SIDES
<Expensive buyer> WORDS OF PRAISE FOR NETWORKS
<Mod> ACKNOWLEDGEMENT AND ACCEPTANCE OF TERMS

v/r,
C-F

* with apologies to bash.org #23396 (http://www.bash.org/?23396)

hall

07-18-05, 09:41 PM

The channels are being simulcast and sent to your home as both analog and digital signals. However, your digital STB is using the digital signal to display the channel and ignoring the analog signal that it previously picked up. That's my understanding. This is what my contact at my local TW said regarding simulcasting:

Once we have the analog services duplicated in digital format, a digital customer will see the digital copy and (analog) cable ready folks will the analog copy.

Plain and simple.... I will still tune to channel "2" but with a set-top box, it will be digital. Analog customers, i.e. those without a set-top box will also get channel "2" but theirs will be an analog signal.

hall

07-18-05, 09:42 PM

Does rebooting the box force Passport to do a lookup for Passport updates at the cable network head-end? No, not as I understand things.... They will "push" the update to you when THEY have it ready and there's really nothing you can do to stop it or delay it or get it early. They likely do it in the middle of the night as MOST people aren't watching TV at that time.

hall

07-18-05, 09:44 PM

Im using an 'inexpensive' 6' DVI-HDMI cable that I got from ebay for less than 12 bucks including shipping. It works great. Beautiful pic. It looks a little better than component but not a huge improvement. Exact same thing here.... I think the cable cost me something like $6.95 and it's decent quality, nice-looking connectors, etc, etc. I have a RP CRT though so DVI really doesn't gain me much. The pictures by no means worse than it was with component.

jaysoffian

07-18-05, 09:52 PM

This is what my contact at my local TW said regarding simulcasting:

Once we have the analog services duplicated in digital format, a digital customer will see the digital copy and (analog) cable ready folks will the analog copy.

Plain and simple.... I will still tune to channel "2" but with a set-top box, it will be digital. Analog customers, i.e. those without a set-top box will also get channel "2" but theirs will be an analog signal.

One annoying thing about the switch to digital -- if you were recording any shows on the analog channels, you have to delete them and re-add them. The DVR sees analog 2 and digital 2 as different channels.

I was recording a bunch of shows from Food TV and the History Channel, so this was mildly irritating. However, I am greatly appreciative of the higher quality of the digital channels. Food TV was hardly watchable before. Looks great now.

As long as I'm on the topic of annoyances, here's my top two other 8300HD annoyances:

1) The guide is only a few days in advance. By scrolling forward a week (guide, 7, right-arrow) you can at least get it to load a full weeks data. But anything less than 2 weeks makes it hard to find future shows. And you can't add a show you know the name of that isn't in the guide yet (unlike TiVo). Sigh.

2) The DVR re-records shows already recorded. I rarely use "first run" since a lot of the stuff I record I haven't watched before, so I don't want to miss re-runs I haven't seen. But I don't need 4 copies of the same episode Iron Chef America in my playlist. Again, TiVo kept a 30 day history so it wouldnt' re-record repeats it had already recorded.

j.

VisionOn

07-19-05, 01:13 AM

2) The DVR re-records shows already recorded. I rarely use "first run" since a lot of the stuff I record I haven't watched before, so I don't want to miss re-runs I haven't seen. But I don't need 4 copies of the same episode Iron Chef America in my playlist. Again, TiVo kept a 30 day history so it wouldnt' re-record repeats it had already recorded.

j.

yeah, I have to go through the upcoming record list and delete duplicates in advance. It really needs a software update that allows you to specify if it should record the same program more than once.

RandyWalters

07-19-05, 01:29 AM

2) The DVR re-records shows already recorded. I rarely use "first run" since a lot of the stuff I record I haven't watched before, so I don't want to miss re-runs I haven't seen. But I don't need 4 copies of the same episode Iron Chef America in my playlist. Again, TiVo kept a 30 day history so it wouldnt' re-record repeats it had already recorded.

In your Series Manager you can use the "Episodes to Keep" feature to keep up to 1 episode so it doesn't save copies in your list.

VisionOn

07-19-05, 10:57 AM

In your Series Manager you can use the "Episodes to Keep" feature to keep up to 1 episode so it doesn't save copies in your list.

I thought that only dictated the number of total episodes of a particular show to keep, regardless of what they are. If a show is on several times a week and the same episode is repeated amongst them you still get the copies, just not as many overall episodes.

EricScott

07-19-05, 11:10 AM

I thought that only dictated the number of total episodes of a particular show to keep, regardless of what they are. If a show is on several times a week and the same episode is repeated amongst them you still get the copies, just not as many overall episodes.

You are correct - if an episode records daily and you set to KAM 1, then you will only have the last day's episode. Unlike Tivo, the Passport software does not actually track the episode but rather the show title. So while Tivo had the 28 day rule where it automatically knows if a particular episode was recorded in the past 28 days, there is no such feature on Passport.

But if a given episode airs multiple times in a week and that's the only episode, the Keep at Most 1 method will work fine.

tbenson81

07-19-05, 09:07 PM

I have a SA 8300 HD hooked up to my big screen tv via DVI to HDMI. Anyways - today when I turned on the tv - I received all sorts of strange colors - the tv would blink very fast and the colors would be red or green or go snowy. I have reset the tv and the box and still the same outcome. This has worked great for over a year now and I havent had any problems

I tried hooking the box up to the tv via component and everything works great. I hooked up with a NEW DVI to HDMI cable and had the same flashing colors.

Is this my box going bad or my DVI input on my tv going bad? Has anyone ever seen this before? I really hope its not my tv input. Is there a quick fix for this? Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

Could TW of messed something else up with a firmware upgrade?

Thanks,
Tony

scsiraid

07-19-05, 09:21 PM

I have a SA 8300 HD hooked up to my big screen tv via DVI to HDMI. Anyways - today when I turned on the tv - I received all sorts of strange colors - the tv would blink very fast and the colors would be red or green or go snowy. I have reset the tv and the box and still the same outcome. This has worked great for over a year now and I havent had any problems

I tried hooking the box up to the tv via component and everything works great. I hooked up with a NEW DVI to HDMI cable and had the same flashing colors.

Tony

You might try turning off 480i and 480p and see what happens. My sets scaler would sometime get confused with 480 on. I do get flashes as the DVR switches between formats but it settles down fine after a second or so.

tbenson81

07-19-05, 09:36 PM

Thanks for the reply scisraid!

The only output I have selected is 1080i. I havent changed this since I received the box and went back in and verified that it was still set to 1080 only.

This is a pretty strange problem. Even when hooked up via component - when I reboot the box, the screen will flash a couple times and turn red, but then the passport window comes up fine and the blue buttons load across the screen

A reboot with HDMI cable attached causes the screen to flash red, then green then go snowy - this cycle repeats and never goes away

ChrisFix

07-20-05, 01:22 PM

The channels are being simulcast and sent to your home as both analog and digital signals. However, your digital STB is using the digital signal to display the channel and ignoring the analog signal that it previously picked up. That's my understanding.

If you plug your TV directly into the outlet you'll still get the regular analog cable signal, but the quality drop is more noticeable now.

Oh yes, the audio and signal dropouts I mentioned before were fixed by the TWC engineers later that afternoon. Looks and sounds great now.

VisionOn,
Are your drop-outs still fixed? I'm in Chapel Hill and was away when they made the conversion to digital for channels 2-98, but when I returned this past weekend I've been getting drop-outs on all my channels - the newly digital and the previously digital and HD. There are audio and video blips at least every 10 minutes on every channel I've watched. It really stinks...

rcase13

07-20-05, 01:36 PM

VisionOn

07-20-05, 06:04 PM

Mine doesn't do that using component or HDMI. I say swap the box out... Then you will know for sure... Just be sure to catch up on all your shows first...

that's the only reason I haven't swapped my 8000HD box out yet ... too many shows to watch. By the time I clear some I have others lined up. :rolleyes:

mpgxsvcd

07-21-05, 11:51 AM

Is there any new news on when the HDMI audio menu will be added in North Carolina? Are there any areas that have it already?

archiguy

07-21-05, 12:01 PM

that's the only reason I haven't swapped my 8000HD box out yet ... too many shows to watch. By the time I clear some I have others lined up. :rolleyes:

I was faced with that problem when I was ready to swap out my 8000 for the new and improved 8300. What you do is, go ahead and get the new box (and absorb the additional rental charge for a couple of weeks) while you clear out the shows on your old box. Record anything new on the new box. Eventually, you'll clear out the old box and be able to turn it in "empty" and drop the extra rental fee. Splitting the cable signal is no big deal; I split mine 5 ways and it's fine.

Of course, if they'd ever enable expansion drive support for Passport and/or firewire ports (why hasn't anyone accomplished this yet??), you'd be able to move all your recorded stuff onto the external drive.

JnC

07-21-05, 02:15 PM

Is there any new news on when the HDMI audio menu will be added in North Carolina? Are there any areas that have it already?

From what I was told by a TWC engineer yesterday, some bugs were discovered during the testing phase of the new software. TWC doesn't want to fix old problems by introducing new ones. So they don't have any new 8300 code that's passed testing, and Passport 4.x hasn't been released yet either.

Frustrating I know. The good thing is that the longer we wait, the lower HDMI cabling prices are falling.

Regards,
JnC

margoba

07-21-05, 02:53 PM

I was faced with that problem when I was ready to swap out my 8000 for the new and improved 8300. What you do is, go ahead and get the new box (and absorb the additional rental charge for a couple of weeks) while you clear out the shows on your old box. Record anything new on the new box. Eventually, you'll clear out the old box and be able to turn it in "empty" and drop the extra rental fee. Splitting the cable signal is no big deal; I split mine 5 ways and it's fine.

Of course, if they'd ever enable expansion drive support for Passport and/or firewire ports (why hasn't anyone accomplished this yet??), you'd be able to move all your recorded stuff onto the external drive.

Afraid that's not the way the expansion drive works (at least not under SARA). When you install the drive, shows are recorded randomly on one drive or the other - the user has no control as to which drive they go on. There was even some speculation that maybe a single show could be split between the two drives. Additionally, all recordings are encrypted by a key that is box-specific, so even if you could move the drive to the new box, it wouldn't be able to read the data. Really depressing as far as I'm concerned. I was hoping to use it exactly as you suggested.

-barry

CANNON-FODDER

07-21-05, 08:24 PM

Yes, they should have set the encryption key to the account, so when the company sets up and turns on/off the channels, they send the key for the external drive. Of course that now makes use of the drive depend on the company, where otherwise it was only dependant on the box.

v/r,
C-F

hall

07-21-05, 10:54 PM

Interesting. I could have an external HDD with a set-top. The set-top dies but the external still works perfectly fine. Nonetheless, all the data on the HDD is effectively dead too then.... :(

margoba

07-21-05, 11:20 PM

Yes to both Cannon-Fodder and hall, that's the way I've been told that it works. Not the way I'd like to see it work, but I'll still cough up a few bucks for the external drive when it becomes available.

-b

swankdaddy7

07-22-05, 05:21 PM

I have Comcast in south Jersey and I picked up a 8000 HD from them yesterday to go with my Samsung 6168 DLP being delivered Monday. Is this model significantly inferior to the 8300? I don't know if they offer the 8300. It has a DVI on the back of the unit, should I expect this to work? The manual says something about it possibly being for "future use". Thanks for any help.

swankdaddy7

07-22-05, 05:25 PM

Is there a loss in picture quality when passing through a HD-DVR?

EricScott

07-22-05, 06:10 PM

ChrisFix

07-22-05, 08:53 PM

Most people feel the 8300 is a significantly better unit. The DVI out on the 8000 is most likely NOT active, whereas the 8300's usually have a working HDMI output. If you can get an 8300, I would strongly recommend it.

Having had both the SA8000 and SA8300, I agree that the SA8300 is an all around better choice (and I can confirm that the DVI on the SA8000 isn't enabled on TWC).

RandyWalters

07-23-05, 11:49 AM

Is there a loss in picture quality when passing through a HD-DVR?

I connected an SA8000HD and a Pioneer 3510HD to the same TV and tweaked the settings in the TV's user menu but HD definitely looks better through the 3510 than through the 8000HD (both connected via Component). Just about everybody report that the 8300HD does a much better job with HD than the 8000HD they had before.

SD (analog and digital cable) on an 8000HD looks poor because these units can only be connected via Component. Switching it to SD mode and connecting S-Video is a HUGE improvement in SD PQ. I had the same experience with the 3510HD box too. The 8300HD is good in that it's S-Video output is active at all times so you can connect this to the TV and watch SD on this input and get a great picture.

Eventually i'll get an 8300HD but for now i'm happy with my dual DVR setup.

GeoMetro

07-24-05, 09:52 AM

Hi All,

I just received my SA8300 from TWC in Raleigh. I have the audio out via Optical cable to my Denon AVR 1804 surround system.

I have noticed a huge difference in volume levels on some channels. If I i switch to 42 Weather Channel, volume is really loud compared to other channels. Then, there is issue of commerical volumes on Comedy Central for example - about 10 x louder than show I am watching.

I researched volume regulators, but didn't find anything for Optical connections, only Analog. Anybody have any solutions on how to level audio on this thing? Or, do I have to go to analog out and buy a Terk Volume Regulator?

Also, how do I find out what version of software I am running on 8300? Checked menus but couldn't find.

Thanks!

margoba

07-24-05, 04:12 PM

Warning: I'm being lazy here and asking this question before I've fully thought about it myself, in the hopes that somebody here has already thought about this and can save me some effort. Feel free to ignore this if it annoys you. :-)

I have an 8300HD connected by component to a Sharp LCD HD TV. I'm thinking about adding a surround sound receiver to the mix. If I do this, is there some way of configuring the wiring so I can choose whether to use the receiver or not depending on what I'm watching. I'm a lazy guy, and it doesn't seem worth it to fire up the surround sound just to watch a sitcom or two. But for movies, etc. it seems like I'd want full surround sound. Do most receivers allow a setup that allows a "real time" decision as to how to process sound?

Thanks,

-barry

EricScott

07-24-05, 04:27 PM

barry,

The simplest solution is to use rca connectors to connect the 8300 to the TV and at the same time run digital coax or digital optical to your receiver. Then you can mute your TV and turn on the receiver if you want surround sound but for normal viewing you can just use the TV's speakers.

hall

07-24-05, 05:47 PM

That's what I have done. I have (2) audio outputs on the 8300 in use, the red/white RCAs to the TV and a digital connection to my AV receiver. If we're watching normal TV shows, 90% of the time we use the TV's speakers. If the program has DD (2.0 or 5.1) audio, we're more likely to use the AV receiver for the audio.

tbuck410

07-27-05, 01:03 PM

Ok, picked up a new 8300 and a much better HDMI/DVI adapter cable, everything fits snug. Now I get an immediate HDCP error instead of a few seconds of image....I have to assume that TWC 8300DVR running Passport is just incompatible with Infocus 4805

Anyone running this setup successfully?

8300-> HDMI/DVI 1' adapter-> 30' DVI cable->M1 Adapter 6"->IF 4805

Wondering if there is some weird incompatibility going on...but when the image was displaying it looked perfect...definitely an HDCP handshake issue

Any update on this? I have TWC WOH (Dayton) also, with new Samsung TX-P3264 and new SA8300. I have had the same problem with HDMI>DVI and HDCP error. I have tried all the suggestions here and nothing works. I swapped SA8000 bc it didn't have DVI enabled and now have this error. I really need this input and would also like to see if pretty good pq would be better.

Barry928

07-27-05, 01:08 PM

I received the new version of the 8300 software yesterday to test. If all goes well I would expect a release soon.

tamanaco

07-27-05, 04:24 PM

I received the new version of the 8300 software yesterday to test. If all goes well I would expect a release soon.

Barry928, Without violating your NDA, what can you can tell us? Can you give us any details on what's new/fixed in this new release? Can you tell us the versions for Passport Echo and PowerTV that you received? Can you tell us if there are any new HDMI settings to force 5.1 DD out of the other digital outputs (Optical/Coax) while connected to the TV via HDMI?

Anything????

Thanks

Barry928

07-27-05, 04:42 PM

I am testing Echo 1.8.110. It has the same 3 way digital audio menu that is shipping in the rev. 2 versions of the 8300. The only additional improvement is the HDCP handshake now works on my InFocus 7200. Since my post earlier we are seeing some rebooting so I am doubtful this release will be widely distributed.

tamanaco

07-27-05, 09:49 PM

I am testing Echo 1.8.110. It has the same 3 way digital audio menu that is shipping in the rev. 2 versions of the 8300.

Hmmm, I missed your earlier post that mentions rev. 2 of the 8300. Can you clarify? Is this rev. 2 of the 8300 a "production" box or is it a limited release "test" box? If your box is a production box that is shipping, how can I tell if I have rev. 2 or an earlier release? I'm assuming that I can get this information via the diags screens. I'm with TWC NYC.

This hardware difference is "probably" the reason why I don't see the additional sound settings in my 8300HD that others have mentioned here. I'm running Echo 1.8.103 and connected to my TV via HDMI cable.

Thanks for your response

Barry928

07-27-05, 11:38 PM

The rev. 2 box has been in production since late May and comes loaded with the new audio menu in the Orlando market. I can't tell what is being distributed in N.Y. When I had the 1.8.103 software the digital audio menu was active.

grendel1972

07-28-05, 03:07 PM

tamanaco

07-29-05, 09:32 AM

I just received an 8300HD box in NYC. The digital audio setting are not available, and you cannot get any audio via the HDMI port and cable. I was told by TWC that they did not support HDMI yet, and had no release date yet for a software update.

Officially (What the TWC support guys say) TWC does not support HDMI, but the SA 8300HD box that TWC is shipping in NYC has all its outputs including HDMI enabled. Video via HDMI, in my case, works fine, but audio does not work at all. The menu that some TWC users get under setting "might" fix the HDMI sound problem even if TWC does not "officially" support HDMI.

I'm not sure if the HDMI implementation in the 8300 is WAD. Someone with a bit more knowledge than me, correct me if I'm wrong.

At first I thought the HDMI implementation was WAD. In other words, my TV does not support 5.1 DD and since it's directly connected to the 8300 via HDMI I get no sound. This is fine with me, but all the other outputs are dumbed down to 2-channel audio. This means no 5.1 DD via my receiver which is connected via one of the digital outputs of the 8300. (Someone mentioned earlier that this is due to the fact that the 8300 has only one sound chip and hence can only output one digital standard at a time to all its outputs - This makes sense - we have a hardware limitation) If my receiver had an HDMI imput/output (I'm speculating here) I should get 5.1 DD sound out of the receiver as it supports 5.1 DD and video would passthru to my TV via the HDMI/DVI/Componenent outputs. Of course, I'm assuming that the broadcast is in 5.1 DD.

Here is where I need someone with a bit more HDMI knowledge. If the program being broadcasted is NOT in 5.1 DD (most broadcasts are) shouldn't I get sound out of my TV and 2-Channel audio out of the sound outputs of the 8300? There is a handshake problem here. I shouldn't get sound out of my TV ONLY when the program broadcasted is in 5.1 DD.

I think we need THREE problems solved. 1. We want to be able to force 5.1 DD sound to the 8300 outputs, when a program is being broadcasted in that standard, we have a TV that can not handle 5.1 DD, and we want to get 5.1 DD sound out our receivers. (No sound out of the TV speakers) 2. Regular broadcasted programs (2-Channel audio) should work for with both the TV speakers and the receiver. 3. (I'm pushing it now) Convert/simulate 5.1 DD sound even if the broadcast is not.

Is there someone out there with a TV that supports 5.1 DD and is connected via HDMI that can share his/her experience?

I think some folks (myself included) were expecting 5.1 DD sound via the digital outputs of the 8300 while the programs were not being broadcasted in that standard.

Am I thinking straight?... Am I getting somwhere here? Should I stop smoking this stuff?

Manatus

07-29-05, 10:04 AM

Should I stop smoking this stuff?

Not necessarily, but you should do a little homework: the 8300HD HDMI audio issue has been explored exhaustively before, including in the TWCNYC thread, http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=297592&perpage=60&pagenumber=1.

tamanaco

07-29-05, 07:12 PM

Not necessarily, but you should do a little homework

I thought I had done my homework. I found this tread which is specific to the SA 8300HD w/ Passport Echo. The "no sound with HDMI" problem is a hardware/sofware implementation problem specific to the 8300HD with Passport Echo I beleive. I don't think this is just a TWC NYC only problem.

Specifically the SA 8300HD HDMI hardware and the Passport Echo implementation that enables/drives the HDMI interface. (HDCP also being part of this equation) How more specific can I get. I read about the problem in the tread that you mentioned, but no one has given any answer(s) specific enough to keep me following that tread.

Is the HDMI interface in the 8300HD WAD (as per the HDMI hardware/software standard) or is the TWC implementation of the HDMI interface using Passport Echo and the 8300HD different from the standard.

If it is different from the standard, then the issues might be solved by changes to the hardware/software implementation to adhere to the standard. (Some folks in this forum have already mentioned a rev. 2 of the hardware and a later "beta" release of Passport Echo. So, in this tread I have been getting some specific answers directed to the hardware/software problem) If TWC implementation follows the standard to the teeth, but TWC customers still have problems with the HDMI interface, then TWC can make changes to Passport Echo to accomodate the folks whose hardware fail the HDMI handshake.

This initial release of the HDMI standard as implemented by TWC might have some issues with existing hardware (TVs). As I said, if it's WAD then no sound should come out the receiving device (TV in our case) that can not support 5.1 DD when the brodcast is in that standard. Unless the TV can negociate/convert to the standard it supports (2-Channel audio in most new TVs).

Initial releases of comm protocols are sometimes technically sound, but semantically wrong. You can have all the verbs and elements in a protocol right, but if the message that you communicate does not make sense the listening device, nothing or the wrong thing will happen. I think his is where we are. I just hope that it can be solved with changes to Echo so that I don't have to exchange my box for a later rev.

Peace

spikemike

07-29-05, 10:25 PM

tamanaco

07-30-05, 07:55 AM

Well i just got a new box, and mine has an option to force dolby digital 5.1 even if the hdmi handshake only allows 2.0 audio. I was surprised when i noticed it. I got my box on Thursday, but the one i had at my old house hadn't gotten a firmware update to get this to work.

Where are you located? Is there any external label/sticker on the new box that shows you a revision number? Besides the menu option in Echo to force 5.1 DD, can you identify any other differences as you compare it to the old box? You mention a firmware update, what version of Passport Echo did you have before and what version do you have now?

Thanks....

spikemike

07-30-05, 02:27 PM

Where are you located? Is there any external label/sticker on the new box that shows you a revision number? Besides the menu option in Echo to force 5.1 DD, can you identify any other differences as you compare it to the old box? You mention a firmware update, what version of Passport Echo did you have before and what version do you have now?

Thanks....

I'm in San Diego, I haven't noticed anything else different, except scrolling left and right in the guide doesn't work quite right (the numbers don't update, but it does scroll). I don't have most of that info, how can i find out my current version of passport.

grendel1972

07-30-05, 09:50 PM

I just noticed the same problem with my 8300HD regarding the scrolling. Doesn't update when you do the fast scroll.

Waiting for a software update for this and the HDMI audio problem. I won't hold me breath.

hall

07-30-05, 11:24 PM

On the scrolling into the future, are you referring to how the times change but the program titles do not ?? I noticed that too. I'm positive the 8000 didn't do that (incorrectly). My wife disagreed and thought that's how it always was.

spikemike

07-30-05, 11:38 PM

yeah nothing updates on the screen, not the titles either, then when i stop scrolling the screen doesn't update until i press left or right again. My old 8300 did have the time scrolling for sure, i remember that much.

tamanaco

07-31-05, 01:48 AM

I don't have most of that info, how can i find out my current version of passport.

In order to see the Passport Echo version in the 8300HD you need to access the Diags screen/menu. To access this menu in the 8300HD boxes that TWC ships in NYC, you have to first tune to channel 611 (it might be a different channel in your area) then press and hold the Select and Exit buttons of the 8300HD until Diags is displayed on the LED. Tap Select and Exit again if the Diags menu does not appear on the screen of the default channel for your area.

The latest official release of Passport Echo (that I know about) is ver 1.8.103. You will most likely have this version, but as Barry928 mentioned, there is also a rev. 2 of the 8300HD hardware. No one has posted how to determine if one has this hardware revision. I "assume" that the revision information is either on the Diags menu or on an external label affixed on the outside of the box. If you have Passport Echo 1.8.103 and the menu under settings that allow you to force 5.1 DD, you "most likely" have a rev. 2 box.

spikemike

07-31-05, 03:03 AM

i do have version 1.8.103, the hardware info screen says i have HWVer 18.

weth

07-31-05, 04:15 AM

No one has posted how to determine if one has this hardware revision. I "assume" that the revision information is either on the Diags menu or on an external label affixed on the outside of the box. If you have Passport Echo 1.8.103 and the menu under settings that allow you to force 5.1 DD, you "most likely" have a rev. 2 box.

On the bottom of my 8300HD, The sticker states I have rev. 2.4 with a manufacturing date of 5/13/2005. Could that be the indicator of rev 2? As I have the menu choice of DD, 2 channel, or Auto HDMI.

CANNON-FODDER

07-31-05, 07:21 AM

Well,

I have Rev. 1.2 dated 02/09/2005.
I have the standard 'ole original production firmware set.

v/r,
C-F

hall

07-31-05, 08:08 AM

My 8300 was produced AFTER yours, if I recall correctly (I posted the date earlier in this thread), and I do NOT have this "rev 2" hardware.

tamanaco

07-31-05, 09:55 AM

On the bottom of my 8300HD, The sticker states I have rev. 2.4 with a manufacturing date of 5/13/2005. Could that be the indicator of rev 2? As I have the menu choice of DD, 2 channel, or Auto HDMI.

I also have rev. 2.4, but with a manufacturing date of 05/19/2005. Under Diags/Hardware I also have HWVer: 00000018 I think there has to be a hardware/software difference. I doubt that this a TWC geographically distributed (TWC pushed) software feature. But just in case, does onyone in the TWC NYC market have the menu option to force 5.1 DD?

When I press select in the Diags/Hardware to see the OEM Platform Info, I have BIP Ver: 3D167D05 HWConfigVer: 24. Under Diags/Chan. App I have Passport API Ver:61 What do you guys have?

CountZero75

08-02-05, 08:29 PM

Here is another data point for you guys. I just have a Toshiba 46HM94 delivered today! My 8300 is rev 2.4 with manufacturing date of 5/20/05 and firmware version 1.8.103. No DD 5.1 audio menu but get this, my HDMI from 8300 have no audio and the optical output from 8300 is outputing DD5.1!

Is this because my Toshiba has a DD decoder built-in and tell 8300 not to bother with audio? That won't make sense, would it? And way to get audio to the TV I ended up hooking up just a RCA audio cables from the 8300.

Very weird.

dmcdayton

08-03-05, 08:00 AM

Anyone know what TWC's deal is with this Passport software? There was supposed to be an upgrade to fix HDCP issues July 1st....when I ask TWC help desk they deny knowledge and say they find out when we find out.

Is this what we get for legislating legal monopolies? Or is this hollywood's fault for all the copy protection stuff that will be hacked in time for Christmas.

I pay almost $200/month for phone, cable, internet and have to scrounge an SVideo connection to make my HT work?

Sorry for rant, I hate wasting money, the least TWC could do is get it right.

hall

08-03-05, 08:39 AM

Anyone know what TWC's deal is with this Passport software? There was supposed to be an upgrade to fix HDCP issues July 1st.... Would you rather have this ??

"I am testing Echo 1.8.110 ... Since my post earlier we are seeing some rebooting so I am doubtful this release will be widely distributed."

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5945483&&#post5945483

tamanaco

08-03-05, 05:03 PM

No DD 5.1 audio menu but get this, my HDMI from 8300 have no audio and the optical output from 8300 is outputing DD5.1!

CountZero75, some folks have reported the same scenario. (DD 5.1 Audio to their receivers via the digital outputs of the 8300 when connected via HDMI) I'm a bit skeptical about these reports. I also get "sound" out of my receiver, but I don't think is DD 5.1. Can you run a little test for me? Can you switch channels and make sure that the Dolby Digital 5.1 light of your receiver stays on for programs that are being broadcasted in DD 5.1 and goes off when you switch to a channel that is broadcasting a non-dolby digital 5.1 program. Do you get sound out of your receiver in both cases? Can your receiver (dolby light status) descrimitate between 2-channel and DD 5.1? My receiver is not that sophisticated, but my ears tell me that is not DD 5.1 out of the 8300 because the sound is not distributed to the speakers as well as when I play a DVD with DD 5.1. But who knows maybe I'm also going deaf.

Can someone with a bit more knowledge clarify the following: What is the "default" sound format in which TWC programs are broadcasted? I have been assuming that the default broadcasting format is -not- DD 5.1 and that only a "few" programs were being broadcasted in that format. Hence, the reason why I'm skeptical of the little dolby light of my stereo. Does the 8300HD default to DD 5.1 to all its outputs regarless of what being broadcasted? I have read in the forum that the 8300HD defaults to 2-Channel Stereo to all its outputs when the HDMI handshake to the TV fails, but what is the case if there is no HDMI connection?

Just wandering....

CountZero75

08-03-05, 06:22 PM

CountZero75, some folks have reported the same scenario. (DD 5.1 Audio to their receivers via the digital outputs of the 8300 when connected via HDMI) I'm a bit skeptical about these reports. I also get "sound" out of my receiver, but I don't think is DD 5.1. Can you run a little test for me? Can you switch channels and make sure that the Dolby Digital 5.1 light of your receiver stays on for programs that are being broadcasted in DD 5.1 and goes off when you switch to a channel that is broadcasting a non-dolby digital 5.1 program. Do you get sound out of your receiver in both cases? Can your receiver (dolby light status) descrimitate between 2-channel and DD 5.1? My receiver is not that sophisticated, but my ears tell me that is not DD 5.1 out of the 8300 because the sound is not distributed to the speakers as well as when I play a DVD with DD 5.1. But who knows maybe I'm also going deaf.

When I switch channels yesterday, my receiver switches from DD5.1 to DPLII and vice versa depending on the TV programs. I can tell because the receiver's front display show the different modes, as well as the very distinctive lack of channel separation between in DD5.1 and DPLII.

Even within the same channel, let's say NBC, the sound output mode changes when the broadcast changes from the program to commerical. My receiver was showing DD5.1 when the program was showing, then switch to DPLII when the commercials were on.

pepar

08-04-05, 11:12 AM

In order to see the Passport Echo version in the 8300HD you need to access the Diags screen/menu. To access this menu in the 8300HD boxes that TWC ships in NYC, you have to first tune to channel 611 (it might be a different channel in your area) then press and hold the Select and Exit buttons of the 8300HD until Diags is displayed on the LED. Tap Select and Exit again if the Diags menu does not appear on the screen of the default channel for your area.

I've tried to access diag mode via this method, but am unable to do so. Six-one-one is not an active channel in my area, so I am can't tune to it. As I do not think my cable company is likely to divulge the correct keystroke combo, is there any other way to find out? (I'm not a TWC customer.)

TIA!!

humdinger70

08-04-05, 11:39 AM

I've tried to access diag mode via this method, but am unable to do so. Six-one-one is not an active channel in my area, so I am can't tune to it. As I do not think my cable company is likely to divulge the correct keystroke combo, is there any other way to find out? (I'm not a TWC customer.)

TIA!!

It's the other way around. Hit the Select/Exit keys on the STB, wait for the "ding" and the word "diag" to show up, then tune to channel 611. Works just fine on the 8000HD, should work the same on the 8300HD. :rolleyes:

pepco

08-04-05, 11:52 AM

I have the 8300HD/Passport with UR5-8400 remote from TW. Connected with HDMI to DVI.
I programmed the remote System on/off button to turn off the box and the TV.
They both turn off fine with no problems, but when I press system on the tv shows the HDCP compliant message and on the box the only thing on is the little symbol above auto on front of box. I then have to press CBL power buttons to get the 8300 on. I have read and read these forums.
Is there anyway to get the System on/off button to turn on both the TV and box with no HDCP message? Thanks

hall

08-04-05, 11:57 AM

Mine changes to channel "611" on it's own....

weth

08-04-05, 12:29 PM

Is there anyway to get the System on/off button to turn on both the TV and box with no HDCP message? Thanks

I have a Sammy HLP5063 connected to the HD8300 via HDMI. The HD8300 automatically turns on whenever I turn on the HLP5063, and I didn't program my remote that way. It seems to get a signal through HDMI to turn on.

It doesn't automatically turn off, that has to be down separately for each compenent. I have never gotten an HDMI compliance message.

pepco

08-04-05, 12:49 PM

weth, what button/buttons are you pressing to turn on the box and tv ??

weth

08-04-05, 01:44 PM

weth, what button/buttons are you pressing to turn on the box and tv ??

I just use the remote for the TV to turn on the TV and the 8300HD turns on. It even happens if I turn on the TV directly from the on/off button on the set itself. It didn't happen when I had it connected with compenent, but now with HDMI it does it. It seems to send a signal through HDMI to turn on.

I do have the apparent ver 2 box, since I am able to control the digital output and force DD5.1 through menu options on the 8300HD.

RandyWalters

08-04-05, 02:25 PM

It's the other way around. Hit the Select/Exit keys on the STB, wait for the "ding" and the word "diag" to show up, then tune to channel 611. Works just fine on the 8000HD, should work the same on the 8300HD. :rolleyes:

This "tune to ch 611" method doesn't work in all areas.

I have TWC/Passport and tuning to channel 611 shows up as ????? on the front panel and the box does nothing.

To get into the diagnostic menus i have to hold the Select and Exit keys until i hear a Ding noise and the word DIAGNO appears in the display then release the keys, then press Exit again the the box tunes itself to ch 1999 and displays the multiple page diagnostic screens. This works in several parts of the country. I cannot tune directly to ch 1999 though.

pepar

08-04-05, 03:20 PM

margoba

08-04-05, 05:56 PM

Are you sure you are holding down select and exit at the same time, on the box (not the remote)?

-barry

pepar

08-04-05, 06:16 PM

Are you sure you are holding down select and exit at the same time, on the box (not the remote)?

-barry

Thanks for the Homer Simpson moment, barry. DOH! (I've been using the remote.)

margoba

08-04-05, 06:54 PM

I think it's psychological. We get so used to using the remote, that we find it hard to distinguish between the two. :-)

-barry

humdinger70

08-04-05, 11:12 PM

I've tried to access diag mode via this method, but am unable to do so. Six-one-one is not an active channel in my area, so I am can't tune to it. As I do not think my cable company is likely to divulge the correct keystroke combo, is there any other way to find out? (I'm not a TWC customer.)

TIA!!

The key is you said you're not a TWC customer. The button presses mentioned only apply to the Pioneer Passport system. If you're on the SARA system, it's a different set of button pushes. Check the other forum for SARA for the answer you seek.

pepar

08-04-05, 11:30 PM

I was able to access the diagnostic mode by using the select and exit buttons on the box. Lots and lots and LOTS of info there. Most of it seems meaningless, at least to me, the user. I was able to confirm it is a 160GB drive. And it also said the IEEE1394 connection was active. I'll google the forum and see if I can find out just the heck one might attach to it . . .

Thanks all!

tbuck410

08-05-05, 06:44 PM

Any update on this? I have TWC WOH (Dayton) also, with new Samsung TX-P3264 and new SA8300. I have had the same problem with HDMI>DVI and HDCP error. I have tried all the suggestions here and nothing works. I swapped SA8000 bc it didn't have DVI enabled and now have this error. I really need this input and would also like to see if pretty good pq would be better.

It seems like every TWC area is different. I would just like to know if the HDMI port on the SA8300HD works for anyone in the TWC Dayton area. TWC says they do not support the HDMI. That may just mean they will not troubleshoot it, not that it doesn't work. I get the HDCP error and I am trying to determine if the output from the box is enabled, if the STB is bad, if the cable is bad, or if my HDTV is really not HDCP capable. Thanks :confused:

tamanaco

08-05-05, 10:02 PM

When I switch channels yesterday, my receiver switches from DD5.1 to DPLII and vice versa depending on the TV programs. I can tell because the receiver's front display show the different modes, as well as the very distinctive lack of channel separation between in DD5.1 and DPLII.

Even within the same channel, let's say NBC, the sound output mode changes when the broadcast changes from the program to commerical. My receiver was showing DD5.1 when the program was showing, then switch to DPLII when the commercials were on.

Wow, that's encouraging. Which output (digital/optical) of the 8300HD are you using to connect to your receiver? Whichever output you're using it appears to both hand-shake (connect) and negociated (change mode according to the source format) correctly.

Everyone that has posted in this forum, so far, has problems getting sound of their TV speaker(s) while connected to the 8300HD via HDMI exclusively (No additional RCA cables). The video portion of the HDMI signal works fine, but the sound portion of the signal does not even appear to get past the hand-shake state. At this point the experiences from the users that I have read about is that when the HDMI sound hand-shake fails, all the outputs of the 8300 default to 2-channel and the TV speakers stay silent. Your case appears to be different as you getting DD 5.1 and DPLII without changing settings in Passport.

I can not confirm or deny if my setup is working like your because my receiver does not switch mode to accomodate the source formats automatically. Some newer home theater receiver do. In your case everything appears to be fine except that your TV speakers do not work even when the broadcast swithes to DPLII... right?

Off topic:

I can also get to the Diags screen in channel 1999 using the method that RandyWalters mentioned.

Like others, when I turn on my TV the HDMI signal turns on the 8300, but when I turn the TV off the 8300 stays on.

I do not get the HDCP error

CountZero75

08-06-05, 11:06 AM

Wow, that's encouraging. Which output (digital/optical) of the 8300HD are you using to connect to your receiver? Whichever output you're using it appears to both hand-shake (connect) and negociated (change mode according to the source format) correctly.

I am using the optical output since my receiver, though pretty new, only has one optical input :(

Everyone that has posted in this forum, so far, has problems getting sound of their TV speaker(s) while connected to the 8300HD via HDMI exclusively (No additional RCA cables). The video portion of the HDMI signal works fine, but the sound portion of the signal does not even appear to get past the hand-shake state. At this point the experiences from the users that I have read about is that when the HDMI sound hand-shake fails, all the outputs of the 8300 default to 2-channel and the TV speakers stay silent. Your case appears to be different as you getting DD 5.1 and DPLII without changing settings in Passport.

Yep, my setup somehow is different than most of you guys. That's why I felt I have to post my result.

I can not confirm or deny if my setup is working like your because my receiver does not switch mode to accomodate the source formats automatically. Some newer home theater receiver do. In your case everything appears to be fine except that your TV speakers do not work even when the broadcast swithes to DPLII... right?

I have not tried that because I was concentrated on verifying the optical output signal and whether it sends DD5.1 or not. So I always had the TV on mute when I tested that. I'll disconnect the RCA audio and see what will happen when I am tuned to a SD channel.

hall

08-06-05, 11:08 AM

I would just like to know if the HDMI port on the SA8300HD works for anyone in the TWC Dayton area. TWC says they do not support the HDMI. I'm positive there are others from the Dayton area, who have posted here, that they're using HDMI. Personally, I'm using the HDMI port but I'm going to DVI with it (HDMI-to-DVI cable). If I turn the box on before the TV, I get an error message saying my TV isn't HDMI-compliant or something. If I turn the TV on first, then the 8300HD, all works fine.

One person from Dayton can't get his to work but it seems to be related to his projector. The two can't sync up.

IamtheWolf

08-06-05, 11:44 AM

....
Everyone that has posted in this forum, so far, has problems getting sound of their TV speaker(s) while connected to the 8300HD via HDMI exclusively (No additional RCA cables). The video portion of the HDMI signal works fine, but the sound portion of the signal does not even appear to get past the hand-shake state. At this point the experiences from the users that I have read about is that when the HDMI sound hand-shake fails, all the outputs of the 8300 default to 2-channel and the TV speakers stay silent. Your case appears to be different as you getting DD 5.1 and DPLII without changing settings in Passport.

....In your case everything appears to be fine except that your TV speakers do not work even when the broadcast swithes to DPLII... right?

1. Your first statement is false. I currently use HDMI from my Passport/Echo 8300 (old version) and receive sound through my TV speakers. The problem is the sound is only 2 channel, and not DD 5.1. If it were, I would feed optical out from my TV to my Receiver to complete the connection for when I want truly DD 5.1 quality.

So, when the sound handshake SUCCEEDS, the 8300 defaults to 2 channel. Proven by turning on my receiver and getting only 2 channel via the optical connection from the 8300 to my Receiver while the HDMI is active.

However, if I use Component (and thus NO SOUND to my TV), then my optical connection from the 8300 broadcasts DD 5.1 or 2 channel. This is similar to the experience of CountZero. (No sound to TV, sound from 8300 to Receiver). The difference is CountZero uses HDMI for picture (no sound) and I use Component for picture only.

2. Everything doesn't work fine for CountZero (I think). There is NO SOUND from HDMI. That my friend is what we've all been trying to get from TWC. DD 5.1 sound from HDMI so that our TV can relay it to our Receivers (and we can remove the Component cables). I also believe (as many have written) that there is no compromise of PQ using Component vs HDMI (until this is resolved).

So for now its HDMI and 2 channel (with Receiver off) for normal viewing and Component with DD 5.1 (with Receiver on) for movies, concerts and sports that broadcast DD 5.1.

pepar

08-06-05, 12:17 PM

I also believe (as many have written) that there is no compromise of PQ using Component vs HDMI (until this is resolved).

I believe you will not see a PQ difference between analog component and DVI/HDMI if your display is analog, e.g. - mostly - CRT-based TVs. For those with digital displays, i.e. fixed pixel, with at least a 1280x720 matrix, I believe that most will see a difference.

Edit: I'll qualify that further; most will see a difference with hi-def content.

davehancock

08-06-05, 12:33 PM

I believe you will not see a PQ difference between analog component and DVI/HDMI if your display is analog, e.g. - mostly - CRT-based TVs. For those with digital displays, i.e. fixed pixel, with at least a 1280x720 matrix, I believe that most will see a difference.

Edit: I'll qualify that further; most will see a difference with hi-def content.

Pepar,

I'm not sure what you meant with the Edit. Did you mean to say that most will see a difference on CRT-based TVs with HD content?

Even with CRT based displays it is incorrect to make an assumption that you won't see a difference. Many CRT displays immediately convert the component (analog) signals to digital for internal processing. By making a digital connection (HDMI/DVI) connection to these sets you eliminate an additional DtoA (in the 8300) and AtoD (in the display) conversion. The downsides of the additional cycle include:1) reduced linearity (shadow & highlight detail); 2) additional noise; 3 reduced bandwidth.

Granted, with a quality display these factors may be minimized to the point where you won't see a difference and that using component connections may be an acceptable solution to the HDMI audio problem. But I hate to see these generalizations become "rules". Unfortunately, the correct answer is that "it depends".

pepar

08-06-05, 12:56 PM

CountZero75

08-06-05, 01:18 PM

2. Everything doesn't work fine for CountZero (I think). There is NO SOUND from HDMI. That my friend is what we've all been trying to get from TWC. DD 5.1 sound from HDMI so that our TV can relay it to our Receivers (and we can remove the Component cables). I also believe (as many have written) that there is no compromise of PQ using Component vs HDMI (until this is resolved).

True, everything not working fine for me, but it is working well enough in my case. I don't have to switch between HDMI and component video in order to get DD5.1 so I am more than happy for the time being. HDMI+RCA audio is infinitely better than wasting another component video input for STB input alone.

If TWC resolves this HDMI audio issue then I would be able to pass STB DD5.1 audio as well as OTA DD5.1 to my receiver (not to mention I can unplug my RCA audio cables between STB and TV). My receiver does not have enough digital input (only one optical) to take all the outputs that I have (STB, DVD, XBox). Having said that, today I am buying a video/audio switcher that has optical audio inputs/output as well as component video so the issue may be mooted.

pepar

08-06-05, 01:48 PM

True, everything not working fine for me, but it is working well enough in my case. I don't have to switch between HDMI and component video in order to get DD5.1 so I am more than happy for the time being. HDMI+RCA audio is infinitely better than wasting another component video input for STB input alone.

If TWC resolves this HDMI audio issue then I would be able to pass STB DD5.1 audio as well as OTA DD5.1 to my receiver (not to mention I can unplug my RCA audio cables between STB and TV). My receiver does not have enough digital input (only one optical) to take all the outputs that I have (STB, DVD, XBox). Having said that, today I am buying a video/audio switcher that has optical audio inputs/output as well as component video so the issue may be mooted.

FWIW, unless you're in a noisy environment RF-wise, coaxial digital is the way to go as optical requires a conversion from electrical to optical and another one back again at the receiving unit.

hall

08-06-05, 03:12 PM

I believe you will not see a PQ difference between analog component and DVI/HDMI if your display is analog, e.g. - mostly - CRT-based TVs. I most definitely saw a difference between component and DVI on my rear-projection CRT. Is it "better" ?? Well, that's entirely subjective....

IamtheWolf

08-06-05, 03:16 PM

It may not be TWC's issue. From the HDMI 1.1 spec, section 7.4:
...

I believe that TWC admits that the software in use (here in Raleighwood) does not allow access to the menu that permits selecting DD 5.1 as output, and that 2 channel is being passed.

To the best of my knowledge, we're all waiting for the firmware upgrade or new Ver that facilitates the passing of DD 5.1 from the 8300 via HDMI.

ANGEL 35

08-06-05, 05:09 PM

CountZero75

08-06-05, 07:00 PM

FWIW, unless you're in a noisy environment RF-wise, coaxial digital is the way to go as optical requires a conversion from electrical to optical and another one back again at the receiving unit.
I am not sure what the relevant of the coaxial digital output is. If you read my posts you'll see that my receiver only has optical input, no coaxial. So I don't have a choice, even if I want to use coaxial. Furthermore, when I mention HDMI+RCA audio previously I mean analogue audio over RCA cable, not coaxial digital audio.

dontdothat88

08-06-05, 07:25 PM

IamtheWolf

08-06-05, 08:43 PM

i realise that if i spend 6 hours reading this thread i could probably find the answers, but i tried searching and cant find it. I have 2 8300 cable boxes from TWNYC. 1 of them gets the HDCP error using the HDMI cable, and i cant watch it at all using hdmi. The other gets HDMI video, but NO SOUND at all with it. I also cant pause/rewind live tv with the new one i just installed. If i hit rewind, nothing happens. I would call time warner but we all know what help they will be, "reboot the box, ok didnt work? we have to send somebody out, take a day off of work 3 weeks from now they will be there". thanks for any suggestions.
For the HDCP error, try shutting off both the TV and the STB. Then turn on the STB followed by the TV. I think the cable box has to be on first.

For the no sound error, are you sure there are no "settings" on the TV menu (e.g., fixed, variable) that determine whether sound is played? I think my Sony works that way, so its a combo of the HDMI and changing the TV's settings, too.

dontdothat88

08-06-05, 09:07 PM

For the HDCP error, try shutting off both the TV and the STB. Then turn on the STB followed by the TV. I think the cable box has to be on first.

For the no sound error, are you sure there are no "settings" on the TV menu (e.g., fixed, variable) that determine whether sound is played? I think my Sony works that way, so its a combo of the HDMI and changing the TV's settings, too.
yea i tried that already for the HDCP error,thanks. I'll check the settings but im pretty sure there are none, it works fine with component its just hdmi that has no sound.

ANGEL 35

08-06-05, 09:13 PM

IamtheWolf

08-07-05, 07:18 AM

I dont know what firmware i have,but i get 5.1 from my 8300HD. I have the optical output from the 8300HD to my receiver input. I have a SONY 960 T.V. I also get sound from my T.V. speakers. I use HDMI from 8300HD.
Given your post about having Ver 1.8.095 I think you'd be unique if your getting DD 5.1 while using HDMI. My understanding is that when HDMI is active and used for TWC, then only 2 channel is output from the 8300 (by all ports, including digital coax and optical). This has been my experience.

My Receiver detects and displays what is being received from the 8300.

How are you able to validate that you are truly getting DD 5.1 when HDMI is active? I have the same software version that you do (and this is the TWC Passport thread, not SARA).

Others, if I'm mistaken, then please correct what I've written here.

hall

08-07-05, 10:32 AM

i realise that if i spend 6 hours reading this thread i could probably find the answers... That is one thing that's bugged me about this site. They seem to prefer enormous, 100-page threads like these THAT NEVER DIE. Granted, I'd rather not see dozens and dozens of threads asking "How do I access the diagnostic mode on my 8300 ?" either.

pepar

08-07-05, 10:51 AM

I am not sure what the relevant of the coaxial digital output is. If you read my posts you'll see that my receiver only has optical input, no coaxial. So I don't have a choice, even if I want to use coaxial. Furthermore, when I mention HDMI+RCA audio previously I mean analogue audio over RCA cable, not coaxial digital audio.

Well, there ya go, CountZero75 - I didn't read all your posts. My bad. :(

ANGEL 35

08-07-05, 10:54 AM

Given your post about having Ver 1.8.095 I think you'd be unique if your getting DD 5.1 while using HDMI. My understanding is that when HDMI is active and used for TWC, then only 2 channel is output from the 8300 (by all ports, including digital coax and optical). This has been my experience.

My Receiver detects and displays what is being received from the 8300.

How are you able to validate that you are truly getting DD 5.1 when HDMI is active? I have the same software version that you do (and this is the TWC Passport thread, not SARA).

Others, if I'm mistaken, then please correct what I've written here.

You are right Im only getting 2 channel out put from 8300. My receiver is one giving me DD5.1. The optical out put from 8300 to receiver is working for me. I think Im right ??? :confused:

pepar

08-07-05, 11:13 AM

That is one thing that's bugged me about this site. They seem to prefer enormous, 100-page threads like these THAT NEVER DIE. Granted, I'd rather not see dozens and dozens of threads asking "How do I access the diagnostic mode on my 8300 ?" either.

Would you prefer short and uninformative threads? :)

While people should use the SEARCH function and perhaps creatively vary their search words and phrases, it's not nice to scold those who pop in with a question that's been answered/discussed many times. I've been the one looking for information as many times as I've provided it. Many times, in the back of my mind, I've wondered if the poster searched, but I've never said it. I'm sure others have thought the same thing on some of my posts, too.

So, search first, read your hits. If you're not finding the info you need, vary your search words. If you still can't find it - ASK! Before searching even, read the "stickies" as they always have valuable information and answers to common questions; that's why they're sticky.

hall

08-07-05, 12:50 PM

pepar

08-07-05, 03:05 PM

In another scenario, someone could search for answers on "DD 5.1 audio" or some variation. I'm not sure how the results are sorted, but let's say they're oldest to newest. You could find numerous posts about "the box outputs 5.1" and the like. How far do you keep checking ?? Later, people start posts and/or questions about a problem with DD 5.1 audio. That's the problem, you either read TONs of search results or you read the entire thread (entirely unrealistic) in order to find out what problems there are, which have been fixed, which still exist, and so on.

Seems like the same scenario to me. Search, read, search more, read more, not find answer and then ask. My point was that I'd like to see at least some effort put into finding the info before asking. If they've done that, I don't mind answering a question. It's a bit annoying, however, if the topic had been covered on the next to the last page as it shows no effort spent before asking. My other point was to put some thinking into the search; limit it to a particular forum, try being more specific if you return a thousand hits, limit the time frame to the last year, etc, etc, etc. Personally, I read the posts which are IRRELEVANT and then try to think how changing my search word(s) would eliminate them as a hit.

When I find the need to frequent a different sub-forum - this one for example because I just started using an 8300HD - I read the stickies that seem applicable and then cruise to find threads that seem relevant. When I find a thread, I read the first two pages or so and then the posts from the last 3-6 months to bring myself up to speed. People can't be expected to read 100 pages, but the first few set up the topic and the last 3 months of posts tell what the current issues are.

Just my $.02.

dontdothat88

08-07-05, 07:18 PM

pepar

08-07-05, 07:33 PM

a few more questions, i cant seem to find the answers to maybe somebody can help. As far as I can see, the firewire ports are still not active? I thought i remember reading that you could hook up a hard drive to it and expand the hard drive space, but after looking over this thread again i see somebody say its not active. Also, i have always had a problem when watching HD where the sound will cut off for a second or 2, or the pic will freeze for a second or 2, but since i installed a second tv and 2nd 8300, it happens alottt more. Is this just a weak signal? Im going to call time warner tomorrow, i cant pay $140 a month and have all of these issues this is crazy. thanks again

Nobody seems to have their Firewire activated, though in my diagnostics it says "always activate." If your cable system is using SARA software, there's a good chance your SATA is turned on. If the system uses Pioneer Passport Echo, your SATA is not yet active, though my provider tells me the SATA will be activated in "the 4th quarter."

Can't help with your dropout issue, but signal strength could be a factor. If you go into the diags, you'll see - among a whole LOT of things - signal strength.

bueller55

08-08-05, 12:57 PM

so i think i may have the same issue as some of you guys:

have my 6168 connected to my SciAtl 8300HD via HDMI...I am TWC customer in NYC...cannot get sound off TV...only off Home Theater (connected from box via digital coax)...but i am getting a dolby digital signal on my receiver...(i can tell because it's illuminated on the HT display)...there is no "audio out" menu option, so i can only assume i don't have the firmware upgrade...i have 3 questions:

1) is this the same issue that some of you are having (CountZero, I think you and I share the same symptoms on this)

2) what version of passport software would remedy this (i know i have to wait for TWC to upgrade, but just curious)

3) how can i check what passport version i have?

4) What am I sacrificing if I change connection to HDMI-DVI and use audio cables? Do I sacrifice PQ or sound quality? I'd prefer not to go this route since I'd like to free DVI up for my PC...

5) Is there any other workaround that I'm not thinking of?

Thanks for the help
r

CountZero75

08-08-05, 02:23 PM

1) is this the same issue that some of you are having (CountZero, I think you and I share the same symptoms on this)

For me, I don't think my setup is an "issue". Ideally, I would like to get audio via HDMI but my current setup, HDMI + RCA audio, means I still get audio from TV speakers. That's fine for normal channel surfing. If I want to better sounds for a movie/sport event/TV series, I just need to mute the TV and turn on the receiver. One good feature of my Toshiba is that it has a separate RCA audio in for the HDMI so I don't need to waste another set of input just for the TV audio.

mpgxsvcd

08-08-05, 02:54 PM

so i think i may have the same issue as some of you guys:

have my 6168 connected to my SciAtl 8300HD via HDMI...I am TWC customer in NYC...cannot get sound off TV...only off Home Theater (connected from box via digital coax)...but i am getting a dolby digital signal on my receiver...(i can tell because it's illuminated on the HT display)...there is no "audio out" menu option, so i can only assume i don't have the firmware upgrade...i have 3 questions:

If you don’t have the audio menu and you are using passport software then I am not sure how you can be getting the Dolby Digital signal when using the HDMI input. If you use the input without the software upgrade then you are actually getting 2.0 sound from all of the audio outputs. These outputs include the stereo rca analog, the coaxial digital, the optical digital, and the audio portion of the HDMI connection. If you see Dolby Digital on your receiver with HDMI then your stereo is probably incorrectly displaying the 2.0 audio as a full Dolby Digital signal. If you use HDMI with rca analog cables then your picture quality will be the same. However, the 2.0 audio that you will get without the software update is not true surround sound and the audio level is amplified way to high. Without the update the audio with HDMI is aweful!

bueller55

08-08-05, 03:59 PM

CANNON-FODDER

08-08-05, 09:02 PM

I wonder if the presence of RCA stereo audio inputs tied to the HDMI input means that CountZero75's Toshiba 46HM94 is not negotiating any digital audio at all through the HMDI connector, intending to get the audio through the analog RCA connections. So the handshake then would not cause the SA8300HD to downmix to digital stereo sound over the HDMI which is what limits the digital coax and optical outputs?

I could not find a manual for that TV, so that is just a shot into the dark.

v/r,
C-F

tamanaco

08-08-05, 10:59 PM

1. Your first statement is false. I currently use HDMI from my Passport/Echo 8300 (old version) and receive sound through my TV speakers. The problem is the sound is only 2 channel, and not DD 5.1. If it were, I would feed optical out from my TV to my Receiver to complete the connection for when I want truly DD 5.1 quality.

My first statement should have been better qualified (Most folks in >this tread< using Echo .103) but it is >not< false. There are users in this tread and other treads that do >not< get sound out their TV while connected via the HDMI exclusively... myself included. I use additional RCA cables to the HDMI RCA inputs of my Panasonic TV to get 2-channel sound out of my TV, but like most folks with HDMI and Passport .103, I'd like to use a single cable to the TV.

I'd say that you're one of the lucky ones, but you're using an "old version" which is not currently being distributed to new users. As I understand, TWC pushes the updates to Passport to certain markets at different times. So, if TWC pushes the updates to your 8300HD, then you might also end up with the same problem. I doubt TWC will distribute old releases to solve the problem, but I could be wrong.

What I was hoping to find in this tread was a solution for .103 users with no menu option to force DD 5.1 to all outputs and to hear the experiences of beta tester using later releases of Passport and see what they say about HDMI.

So, when the sound handshake SUCCEEDS, the 8300 defaults to 2 channel. Proven by turning on my receiver and getting only 2 channel via the optical connection from the 8300 to my Receiver while the HDMI is active..

The handshake is NOT a SUCCESS if the program broadcasted is in DD 5.1 and your 8300 is defaulting to 2-channel audio.

You have the older version and thus get 2-channel sound out of both - Not the case with some folks with the current release with or without the DD5.1 menu option. In my case there aren't any successful sound handshakes (DD5.1 or 2-Channel) via HDMI. When using HDMI exclusively, (No RCA cables to the HDMI inputs of the TV) I get 2-channel sound out of my receiver and no sound out of the TV speakers.

However, if I use Component (and thus NO SOUND to my TV), then my optical connection from the 8300 broadcasts DD 5.1 or 2 channel. This is similar to the experience of CountZero. (No sound to TV, sound from 8300 to Receiver). The difference is CountZero uses HDMI for picture (no sound) and I use Component for picture only.

I'm looking to solve the problem using only HDMI to the TV and digital/optical connection to the receiver. (No Component) Why you might ask?... My LCD is far from my HT System. I ran 12 feet HDMI and a long pair of RCA cables from my HT System to the TV inside the wall. It took me a loooong time to get these cables to the TV using a borrowed snake. Component cables are not an option for me. Anyway, HDMI is the future Component is the past.

2. Everything doesn't work fine for CountZero (I think). There is NO SOUND from HDMI. That my friend is what we've all been trying to get from TWC. DD 5.1 sound from HDMI so that our TV can relay it to our Receivers (and we can remove the Component cables). I also believe (as many have written) that there is no compromise of PQ using Component vs HDMI (until this is resolved).

So for now its HDMI and 2 channel (with Receiver off) for normal viewing and Component with DD 5.1 (with Receiver on) for movies, concerts and sports that broadcast DD 5.1.

I don't think this is the solution I'm looking for. I don't want my TV to relay anything to my receiver. Given the limitation of a single sound processor, the 8300 should output the same format standard being broadcasted to both my TV via HDMI and to my receiver via coax/optical. Most TVs in the market, including mine, do not support DD 5.1 so I don't expect my TV speakers to work when the program is being broadcasted in DD 5.1. (This would be nice, but I don't think my TV can do any conversion) I >do< expect the TV speakers to work when the broadcast is in 2-channel. The HDMI interface is an "intelligent" interface and is, most likely, telling the 8300 to switch to 2-channel because that is all it can handle. That's is fine, but once the 8300HD switches to 2-channel the TV speakers should work.

We all know that some of us with Passport .103 want the DD 5.1 Passport override option to force the 8300 when the broacast is in DD 5.1 and the HDMI has told the 8300HD to switch to 2-channel. This is one part of the solution.

Since I don't have the menu option, it is not clear to me what happens when one uses the DD 5.1 force option and the broacast is in 2-channel. Is this menu option available at all times? Does the 8300 simulate DD 5.1 when the broadcast is in 2-channel and this option is selected?

"HDMI and 2 channel (with receiver off)" Again, this is not an option for those whose HDMI handshake sound fails and want to use a single HDMI cable to their TV. As someone recently posted, HDMI might no be ready for Prime-Time. I agree with that assessment. Like most new communication interfaces, it will evolve and fulfill its promise.... So we hope.

tamanaco

08-08-05, 11:10 PM

CountZero,

How are you plugging in your audio with HDMI? into the audio portion of a component input? or are you plugging into composite? I tried plugging in audio from box to TV (in the component input) and still got nothing
r

Some TVs have RCA inputs associated with HDMI connector. My understanding is that these RCA inputs are there for folks that want to use the HDMI connection, but have a DVI output. These folks can use a DVI to HDMI cable to get the picture and RCA cables to get the sound. I have a Panasonic TC-32LX50 with these combo connectors. I currenly use these HDMI RCA connectors because the sound interface of the 8300 via HDMI is not working.

CountZero75

08-09-05, 12:38 AM

CountZero,

How are you plugging in your audio with HDMI? into the audio portion of a component input? or are you plugging into composite? I tried plugging in audio from box to TV (in the component input) and still got nothing

As tamanaco said, my Toshiba has RCA audio associated with the HDMI input. However, the Toshiba also has a menu option (HDMI Audio Selection) to allow me to specify which audio input to use for HDMI.

1) Auto
2) Digital
3) Analog

Selecting any one of the options has no effect when connected with only HDMI, or HDMI+RCA. The optical signal from 8300HD also does not change with any of the three options.

This is the strangness that I am referring to in my original post. Somehow, my Toshiba is telling the 8300 not to bother with audio at all over HDMI. Perhaps I have a defective HDMI connector on the TV? I really have no way to know since my DVD only has DVI output.

tamanaco

08-09-05, 08:00 AM

1) Auto
2) Digital
3) Analog

Selecting any one of the options has no effect when connected with only HDMI, or HDMI+RCA. The optical signal from 8300HD also does not change with any of the three options.

CountZero75, in my case, my Panasonic TV also has those three options for the HDMI connector, but none of them work to correct the sound problem when connecting with the HDMI cable only. Using HDMI+RCA works for me, but only when I manually select the Analog option.

humdinger70

08-09-05, 01:20 PM

I just recently upgraded to an 8300HD (I had an 8000HD for a short time, but it suddenly died on me and I exchanged it for my current 8300HD unit). Is there a setup wizard in Passport so I can set my box to "Passthru" mode? The reason is I want my TV to do the stretching on the SD channels. I currently have 480I, 480P and 1080I outputs active (my TV does not do 720P).

The issue I have is with one SD channel in particular. Most of the SD channels are in 480I, which allows me to use the edge-stretch mode of my 2001-vintage Mitsubishi. However, one of the channels I regularly view is AZN (the old International Channel). It sends out a signal in 480P ('480P' lights up in the front of the box). 480P does not allow me to use the edge-stretch mode and screws up the other settings.

My old non-DVR HD STB allowed me to use just 480I and 1080I and worked fine for my edge-stretching mode (HD programs correctly show up as 1080I standard).

Any help is appreciated.

pepar

08-09-05, 01:25 PM

ChrisFix

08-09-05, 04:16 PM

pepar

08-09-05, 04:25 PM

In my trial and error with setting output formats on the 8300HD, if you disable 480P, the box will upconvert to 1080i, not downconvert to 480i, for channels it "wants" to display in 480p. In my TWC area, they just upgraded to digital for all the analog channels below channel number 100. I have 480i, 480p, and 1080i selected as output formats, but the 8300HD forces 480p on all the SD digital channels now. If I then disable just the 480p, it displays those same channels as 1080i.

I'm relatively sure I'm getting 480i from standard definition channels and passing whatever - 720p or 1080i - the hi-def channels are being sent as. I'll look closer to see if anything is 480p. But I defer to you because you seem like you've specifically looked, whereas I've only casually observed. :)

EricScott

08-09-05, 04:38 PM

In my trial and error with setting output formats on the 8300HD, if you disable 480P, the box will upconvert to 1080i, not downconvert to 480i, for channels it "wants" to display in 480p. In my TWC area, they just upgraded to digital for all the analog channels below channel number 100. I have 480i, 480p, and 1080i selected as output formats, but the 8300HD forces 480p on all the SD digital channels now. If I then disable just the 480p, it displays those same channels as 1080i.

Works the same for me in NYC. The only way to force 480i output is to disable ALL other formats so 480i is the only supported format. Otherwise all SD channels (other than a few selected analog channels) are 480p. My Samsung doesn't accept 480i over HDMI or DVI anyway so not a big deal and the PQ is quite good on these channels at 480p.

Barry928

08-09-05, 04:49 PM

Any help is appreciated.

You could run an s-video cable for full time 480i and then just change inputs for that one channel.

IamtheWolf

08-09-05, 06:41 PM

My first statement should have been better qualified (Most folks in >this tread< using Echo .103) but it is >not< false.

That qualification changes the whole story, since you originally said "Everyone that has posted in this forum, so far, has problems getting sound of their TV speaker(s) while connected to the 8300HD via HDMI exclusively (No additional RCA cables). " http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5990768&&#post5990768

I'm equally guilty by saying "That my friend is what we've all been trying to get from TWC. DD 5.1 sound from HDMI so that our TV can relay it to our Receivers .." In your case, you prefer the 8300 to Receiver route (as may others).

Anyway, our setups are different, as are our versions. What may be satisfactory to each of us respectively is a matter of preference. With that, good luck in finding a workable alternative until the HDMI issue is resolved.

humdinger70

08-09-05, 06:59 PM

In my trial and error with setting output formats on the 8300HD, if you disable 480P, the box will upconvert to 1080i, not downconvert to 480i, for channels it "wants" to display in 480p. In my TWC area, they just upgraded to digital for all the analog channels below channel number 100. I have 480i, 480p, and 1080i selected as output formats, but the 8300HD forces 480p on all the SD digital channels now. If I then disable just the 480p, it displays those same channels as 1080i.

Yes, I have tried what you did and that's exactly what I discovered...my TWC area (San Diego) doesn't allow the "downgrade" to 480I. I'm not sure if any other channel has this issue. So far only AZN and it may be because TWC is forcing the signal to be upgraded to 480P. :rolleyes:

I don't like using the STB stretch mode, so I'll probably watch the SD channels with the gray sidebars - at least the picture maintains correct 4:3 ratio - no "fat" people. :D

EricScott

08-09-05, 07:05 PM

I don't like using the STB stretch mode, so I'll probably watch the SD channels with the gray sidebars - at least the picture maintains correct 4:3 ratio - no "fat" people. :D

One way to avoid having the gray sidebars but still maintaining hte correct 4:3 ratio is to actually have the STB stretch 4:3 and have your display shrink it back down to 4:3. Obviously this only works if your display can show a 480p image in 4:3 and if your display inserts black sidebars. On my Samsung HLP it works great. No distortion from stretching and then shrinking and the black sidebars morph nicely into the black bezel.

CountZero75

08-10-05, 09:55 AM

CountZero75, in my case, my Panasonic TV also has those three options for the HDMI connector, but none of them work to correct the sound problem when connecting with the HDMI cable only. Using HDMI+RCA works for me, but only when I manually select the Analog option.

Stranger, and stranger... What I find even stranger is that it seems I am the only Toshiba xxHM94 DLP owner here voicing my experience with HDMI. Is Toshiba that unpopular here? :) It would be great if another Toshiba owner can verify my experience.

hall

08-10-05, 12:33 PM

I have a Toshiba, but mine doesn't have HDMI input, only DVI....

wmwrose

08-10-05, 05:04 PM

Please excuse me if this question has been asked before: I've been trying to do a thread search but I keep getting "Server Busy" errors...

I have an 8300HD DVR connected via HDMI to my new SS 6168. Apparently it uses Passport (Kansas City area) as I cannot access the setup menu via the SARA instructions. My question is... By setting my output options in the onscreen "Settings / More Settings" menu to accept all 4 formats (1080i, 720p, 480i, 480p) - is that the same as selecting "pass-through"? And would this be the optimum setting for a 1080p set? I honestly cannot tell much difference in either the HD or SD PQ when I play around with the output settings (like setting it for 1080i only). I do notice some differences though in the "tuning in" on the channels when I switch... they sometimes get all garbled for a few seconds before the picture comes in.

Any feedback you can provide would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

EricScott

08-10-05, 05:08 PM

wmwrose,

Selecting all four formats is as close as you will get to pass through. Not sure if the 6168 can even accept 480i over HDMI though (I know my 5063 can't) so you may want to disable that and leave the other three selected. In NYC, virtually all of the SD channels have been converted to digital and only come through as 480p on the 8300 so you aren't getting true "pass through" - not sure if the same is true in KC. When I tried to enable 480i over HDMI and tuned to the one channel that is still processed as 480i (I think it was the food channel or something) I got an error and had to reboot the box. But having both 720p and 1080i selected is definitely what you want b/c the Samsung is going to have to scale everything to 1080p anyway - no need to let the STB mess around with the image as well.

wmwrose

08-10-05, 06:04 PM

EricScott

08-10-05, 06:13 PM

EricScott... Thanks! We do still have a fair number of analog channels in KC (about 75 or so), but good to know how to set this up. I will change it to 1080i, 720p, 480p this evening. Thanks again!

First test to see if the Samsung accepts 480i over HDMI. If it does than leave it on - can't hurt. That way 480i channels will be passed through and 480i channels which the box converts to 480p will pass through as 480p.

If 480i doesn't work over HDMI than just enabel the other 3.

wmwrose

08-10-05, 06:20 PM

Jason30

08-10-05, 11:22 PM

First test to see if the Samsung accepts 480i over HDMI. If it does than leave it on - can't hurt. That way 480i channels will be passed through and 480i channels which the box converts to 480p will pass through as 480p.

If 480i doesn't work over HDMI than just enabel the other 3.

Guys, I think this is exactly the problem I am having trying to help my dad set up his Samsung LN-R408D. Please read my other post for full details (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=568527).

Is my problem that the Samsung doesn't accept 480i? Also, any ideas why "480p widescreen" works but not "480p" mode? When I set the STB to "upconvert1" where it should make 480i into 480p and 720p/1080i into 1080i, that doesn't work over HDMI either with the SD channels. I'm just at the point now that I can't make this 8300HD work for HDMI where my dad wants to run the picture stretched over the display on SD channels rather than 4:3 letterbox. When I set the 8300HD to upconvert everything to 1080i I lose the option to "stretch". Only options are "normal" (comes out as 4:3 letterbox on SD channels) and two zoom modes which just crop the heck out of the frame. Thanks in advance for any help you guys can provide.

EricScott

08-11-05, 09:53 AM

Guys, I think this is exactly the problem I am having trying to help my dad set up his Samsung LN-R408D. Please read my other post for full details (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=568527).

Is my problem that the Samsung doesn't accept 480i? Also, any ideas why "480p widescreen" works but not "480p" mode? When I set the STB to "upconvert1" where it should make 480i into 480p and 720p/1080i into 1080i, that doesn't work over HDMI either with the SD channels. I'm just at the point now that I can't make this 8300HD work for HDMI where my dad wants to run the picture stretched over the display on SD channels rather than 4:3 letterbox. When I set the 8300HD to upconvert everything to 1080i I lose the option to "stretch". Only options are "normal" (comes out as 4:3 letterbox on SD channels) and two zoom modes which just crop the heck out of the frame. Thanks in advance for any help you guys can provide.

Jason,

I responded in the other thread - the samsung won't accept 480i over HDMI so that's the source of the problem. Unfortunately it sounds like your STB is running SARA software while this thread is dedicated to Pioneer Passport software so not sure how helpful people here can be regarding the various preset output modes on your STB - may want to try the 8300 SARA thread.