Hello guys,

Apparently there isn't an "Official BenQ 8700+" (or 8700 for that matter) thread yet like there is for the Optoma H77, Optoma H30, Infocus 4805...etc. I think it would be a great idea to have one chief thread to visit for all 8700+/8700 questions/info/comments. So hopefully we'll all start posting them here. Screenshots included...

Thanks guys!!

Great idea. how do we start one?

Originally posted by clubfoot
Great idea. how do we start one?

Heh! Wait for people to start posting messages? :) I'm sure when some one does a search for the "BenQ 8700+" (or 8700) they'll run across this thread. It only makes sense to group all related question/comments/info in this one thread.

Do you own a 8700+ ? :)

Brampton huh....heh...

| love my 8700. All the other threads from January until now have solved all the problems I have had. What a thread. I love the projector for the money.

DaViD, Carl Holt, etc...

Originally posted by MrRob
| love my 8700. All the other threads from January until now have solved all the problems I have had. What a thread. I love the projector for the money.

DaViD, Carl Holt, etc...

Hello MrRob,

Good to hear! :) How long has it been since your problems were solved? And everything's been honky dory since? :)

OuBthisSN,

What's up with your comment/attitude? "yeah, this thread is dumb..."?? While I agree that there should have been such a thread long ago when the 8700+ was released...the fact is there wasn't...so now that we have one why not support it? Having such a thread created can only be beneficial IMHO. How about inputing something useful and positive in the future instead of this negativity? AVS is a place for people to learn and ask questions in a friendly and open maner.

If only we could consolidate all the other 8700/8700+ threads as was done for another projector. Ideas any one? :)

Lighten up OuBthisSN! :)

It may be dumb that this thread was not started when the 8700 was first released, but that does not make this thread dumb.

I just purchased the 8700+, which makes this thread a welcome addition.

Thanks

I'm also awaiting my 8700 next week to replace my old XGA DLP unit. I've been searching and searching - I still think it's ok to start this thread for us new users. My questions are for now:

1. How is the 8700 with a qualityscreen greyline (2.14m=84" screen width). Is the unit bright enough ?

2. Is dithering a problem (my old XGA is terrible) ?

3. How is the Denon 3910 with DVI compared to as good HTPC with DVI and TheaterTek ?

4. Does the 8700 create "hot spotting" on a firehawk screen (Is firehawk a good choice).

/ Thanks

thank goodness there wasn't an "official 8700" thread.

have you tried to navigate and/or find anything in one of those official posts with 3500 posting... they are a disaster in my opinion, like a book without a table of contents or index.

Originally posted by hli
I'm also awaiting my 8700 next week to replace my old XGA DLP unit. I've been searching and searching - I still think it's ok to start this thread for us new users. My questions are for now:

1. How is the 8700 with a qualityscreen greyline (2.14m=84" screen width). Is the unit bright enough ?

2. Is dithering a problem (my old XGA is terrible) ?

3. How is the Denon 3910 with DVI compared to as good HTPC with DVI and TheaterTek ?

4. Does the 8700 create "hot spotting" on a firehawk screen (Is firehawk a good choice).

/ Thanks
1. Yes it is bright enough even to 100" wide in a light-controlled room.
2. Very little dithering
3. Probably better or similar in PQ and more reliable than HTPC
4. The FireHawk has some hotspotting but the output of the 8700 isn't as bright as some short-throw LCD PJ's where this could be an issue.

Hey great thread! I just got a 8700+ in and I am trying to configure it. So far the picture is pretty good!

However, this unit is replacing a NEC XG85 CRT so I am really worried about one thing....black levels. I never realized how great CRT black levels were until I got this unit in. And yes, I know that NOTHING will touch a CRT black right now for any price (except another CRT). But the best I can manage with my AVIA adjustments on the projetor is a very dark grey.

My question is what are people doing with their 8700's to increase perceived black levels. I am projecting onto a Carada 120" brilliant white screen (1.3 gain) in a completely light controlled theater. Are people using grey screens? How about ND filters on the lenses.

Also, is DLP still ahead of the LCD's in the black level department...I hear great things about the Panasonic 700 and the HS-51.

Thanks,
-Alex-

Hey guys!

Would just like to thank everyone for posting quetions/answers and comments (qxlxp too). Nice to see that there are people that can appreciate such a thread. I do. Even if there is no "table of contents". :)

Keep on posting!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by bairda
[B]Hey great thread! I just got a 8700+ in and I am trying to configure it. So far the picture is pretty good!

Also, is DLP still ahead of the LCD's in the black level department...I hear great things about the Panasonic 700 and the HS-51.
QUOTE]

Although LCD is coming along quite well, I don't think they would yet match the contrast possible on the 8700+ or similar DLPs. I was at a friends last night who owns a Panny 500. Although contrast/black level on that unit is quite good for LCD, it is very noticeably worse than my 8700+. My wife commented to me several times that the dark areas were noticeably gray compared to our setup. I have also seen the Epson 500 and its black level, although even better than the Panny 500 (I would guess comparable to or slightly worse than the Panny 700 in a calibrated environment), wasn't anywhere near as good as the 8700+.

Keep in mind that the Panny 700 is spec'd at 2000:1 and probably won't actually reach that in a properly calibrated environment. I just read a review in the other thread that in Cinema mode (which is recommended for various reasons including color) the 700 gets to 950:1. I have seen reviews of the 8700+ that measure a calibrated contrast over 2200:1.

Gray screens are great for increasing contrast but the two I have seen personally seem to cause problems with color to my eyes. I think that a white screen with some gain (like your 1.3) is probably close to ideal.

Originally posted by bairda
Hey great thread! I just got a 8700+ in and I am trying to configure it. So far the picture is pretty good!

However, this unit is replacing a NEC XG85 CRT so I am really worried about one thing....black levels. I never realized how great CRT black levels were until I got this unit in. And yes, I know that NOTHING will touch a CRT black right now for any price (except another CRT). But the best I can manage with my AVIA adjustments on the projetor is a very dark grey. I think you'd appreciate an ISF calibration for the 8700 coming from a CRT reference point. I know that the 8700 I have didn't have enough range with the user picture level settings for HD Component Video. Plus the gray scale does need some help as well.

I'd definitely invest in DVI source devices too, the 8700 likes them better.

Originally posted by Jim Noyd
1. Yes it is bright enough even to 100" wide in a light-controlled room.
2. Very little dithering
3. Probably better or similar in PQ and more reliable than HTPC
4. The FireHawk has some hotspotting but the output of the 8700 isn't as bright as some short-throw LCD PJ's where this could be an issue.

Thanks Jim.

I used to put a ND filter on my old DLP (600:1 Contrast, 1100 lumen), But after I got my grey screen it was just to dark, so I removed the filter. If I was to re-buy I would probably get some good white screen and then use filters for optimizing the black level. Which leads me to a new question: Has anyone use an ND filter on their 8700 ??.

/ HLI

Originally posted by hli
Thanks Jim.

I used to put a ND filter on my old DLP (600:1 Contrast, 1100 lumen), But after I got my grey screen it was just to dark, so I removed the filter. If I was to re-buy I would probably get some good white screen and then use filters for optimizing the black level. Which leads me to a new question: Has anyone use an ND filter on their 8700 ??.
Not with a gray screen. It will have rich dark blacks. The single chip DLP's want more light output help more than they need for better black levels IMO.

As far as black levels go, try setting brightness under "DLP" in the service menu to -2 after you have set it using DVE or AVIA. THX Optimizer is very good for setting contrast on this projector, as it shows crushed whites very easily.
As far as screen size I use an 106" Da-Lite Cinema Contour 1.3 gain and PQ is great!

It's true the search function can be frustrating. I'll list three threads that might be useful.

A couple of cautionary statements are warranted. First, specific numbers given for settings may not apply to your particular setup. Second, you do need a calibration setup to do a lot of what's described.

Here's a thread about the service menu:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=403476&highlight=drapp1952

And another thread about calibration with ColorFacts using AVIA as source:

http://archive2.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=383570&highlight=drapp1952

This thread describes the option of attempting to squeeze more contrast and improve black level using a CC20R or HOYA FLD filter to take advantage of gain riding on the 8700, and check out the threads I refer to in the first post of that thread. This can be considered where the picture is already quite bright as with a smaller screen and/or with a high gain screen (BTW, one might consider a CC10R for lower gain screen, larger picture, or older bulbs):

http://archive2.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=366809&highlight=drapp1952


Dan

Thanks for all the help and links. I changed the settings for the projector via the service menu per the discussed colorfacts settings and this improved the picture by a magnitude of degree.

I am debating whether to try the ND filters that some have tried. I get the feeling that the improvements with these filters are modest at best. Anyone else what to elaborate on their experience with filters and the 8700?

Thanks,
-Alex-

Check this (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=3343690#post3343690[/URL) out.

Using a CC10R or CC20R or a Hoya FLD will allow you to increase blue and green output, resulting in greater dynamic range. Contrast ratio and black level are improved, to some degree. Whether these improvements are worth the hit in brightness is likely due to how much brightness you've got to spare now. I found the incremental improvements in black level and CR worth it with a bright, new bulb. But, I have a 104" wide picture and as the bulb dimmed the brightness dropped to an unacceptable point so I removed the Hoya FLD I was using and recalibrated. I might experiment with a CC10R that could serve as a compromise filter now that my bulb is dimming more slowly.

Dan

Hello all. Great thread.

This is a great projector (especially for the price) and I guess I'll throw in my two cents about set up, based on my experiences both before and after an ISF calibration.

Screen- I would not, in any situation with a screen over 80" (which is probably all of us) get a grey screen. This is not a bright projector, once properly calibrated. The white screen is essential. For instance, on a 92" DaLite CinemaVision (1.3 white) the BenQ creates an image with 10.5-12 ft. lamberts, which is about right for a home theater, but could never be called very bright. This is, I remind you, at about 100 hours. Near the end of the bulb life, you might be looking at 8. Grey is a no no.

ND filters-With proper calibration, absolutly unnecessary.

Blacks- When I first set up my BenQ, I did a thourough AVIA and THX calibration, which by this time I have become very suffienct with. The picture was noticably improved from pre-calibration, however, the blacks still left much to be desired. I then had my ISF calibrator come out and spend a day with the projector, and now it is very hard to find any problems with the image. The blacks are so much richer and the dynamic range is just awesome. There is simply no way to self calibrate a unit without the proper equipment.

Anyway, I'm really enjoying mine, and good luck to everyone else!

Hey Grant

Glad to hear your happy with your 8700. who did you get to calibrate it, what did it cost you. could you supply me with this info as i have close to 200 hours on mine now and about ready to have it calibrated.

muncey

Originally posted by GrantMeThePower
Hello all. Great thread.......
... I then had my ISF calibrator come out and spend a day with the projector... There is simply no way to self calibrate a unit without the proper equipment....

Thanks, interesting. I have the DVE DVD and it's not trivial to use it. Anyways, I'll give it a try. An ISF calibrator a full day !! - here in EU (if possible) would cost you the same as a decent DVD player :-). I'm looking forward to see the 8700 combined with my Denon 3910 + DVI and qualityscreen greyline. I'm not using my pj that much. My 3 year old DLP has less than 350 hours. I hope my 8700 will stay bright until next generation arrives.

/ Regards

Hello guys,

Thanks again for the good posts! :)

My question to you is...I was told that it is "common" (10% of the time)...for bulbs to explode at the 200 hrs mark. Have any of you experienced that? Heard of freinds to whom that has happened to?

Haven't read about it here.

Installed my 8700+ today. I had a string of bad luck with my 8700, enough so that this time it was replaced with the newer model instead of trying to repair the original unit. Long story that I will not go into now. I would not say the problems I have had are indicative of the projector. I just seem to be a magnet for Murphy's Law.

I spent a couple of hours setting the unit up and establishing my color settings using DVE and the Gamma setting found in a different thread. After the first 15 minutes the picture cut out and the lamp LED started flashing. Three flashes, pause, then three more. I called customer service and they suggested sending in the unit again. This time I pushed a little harder and the tech suggested that I turn everything off, remove and reset the lamp. This seemed to do the trick. BenQ's support is second to none so I was glad to find out that there was something I could try before deciding to send the unit back.

I am in the unique position though that I can compare the 8700 to the 8700+. First the most obvious, the unit comes in a new box and has a glossy color brochure that includes pictures instead of drawings. If you compare the old and new manual you'll find that the layout is basically the same and that there may be 6 to 10 words that are different.

The projector case is the same. Enough so that unless you read the fine print on the sticker on the back there is no difference. Which is good since it did not occur to me that there could be some minor change in the case that would require a different mount. My existing mount worked just fine.

The 8700+ supports 526p, operates are 300 MHz, has the HD2+ chip, and a higher contract ratio. Accessing the service menu is the same and all the menus look the same.

Once I had the unit set up I put in some sample movies and noticed a slight improvement in the picture quality. My wife said that she did not see motion artifacts. She must be more sensitive to motion artifacts than I am because I have never seen them. She commented tonight that she was not really aware of the artifacts before until she noticed the lack of them on the upgraded unit.

The new unit has the 1.07 firmware. (There is another thread that says it is only available on the new units from the factory so do not even try to find it for download. It is not available.) IMO it appears that the newer firmware does at least two things. First the fan speed is a little higher than the speed of the old unit. It is still quiet but not as quiet as a unit with the 1.04 firmware. My 8700 still changed fan speed if the room got real warm even with the upgraded firmware. It did not cycle on and off like it did before the upgrade but it did change speeds. I did not notice louder fan off hand. My wife pointed it out. For some reason she seems keyed into these things. Once she pointed it out though I do have to agreed that it is a little louder. Maybe 1 or 2 db.

The only other thing that I can tell is different with the 1.07 firmware is that the grid pattern stays on until you turn it off. This was always a little nuisance with my 8700. On my 8700 the grid only stayed on for a few seconds. It never seemed to stay on long enough for me to properly adjust the unit to the screen size.

I guess there is one other item, it handles progressive component inputs better. I have two DVD players hooked up to the projector and will have an HD DirecTV tuner hooked up in the near future. My primary DVD player is a Bravo D1. The picture quality is still amazing if not a little better than before. The second unit is a Pioner Ellette 45A with progressive scan component video out. I primarily use this unit to play DVD-A and SACD. It also handles the non-anamorphic DVD's better than the D1. The 8700+ appears to handle the progressive input better than the 8700. I noticed this improvement right a way. Right after I found that the batteries in the Pioneer's remote had died. This improvement might be from the added ability to receive a native 526p signal, which I think is what the Pioneer unit puts out. At least that is what the 8700+ says on the screen when the unit is switched on.

No screen shots available and in reality would not show anything due to the limitations of digital photography and the size limit that can be posted.

First impression is that the 8700+ is an improvement over the 8700. I would not say it is enough of an improvement to justify upgrading from one to the other. It is enough of an improvement that you do see the difference.

More later once HD D* is up and running.

Thanks for the update Carl. What HDMI/DVI switch are you buying when you add the DirecTV HD PVR? I think it has HDMI out. You can convert the HDMI to DVI with an Ultralink adapter.

I'm actually going with just the HD D* receiver w/o the DVR. could no justify the cost. Also, I don't really want to use the projector as a day to day tv. 2000 hours can add up pretty quick with daily viewing. an HD DVR would only encourage that use. My intent was to only use for high interest programs.

The receiver I have is the Samsung SIR-TS360, which has a DVI output. I was hoping for suggestions on a DVI switch. For now I have the unit connected through my Denon 3801 receiver. The Denon has two component inputs, one from the Samy and one from the Pioneer DVD player. It will output the selected source to the projector.

From reading other threads I gather there are two or three type of switches available: manual, manual w/remote, and fully automatic. The manual unit requires the user to push a button on the from to select the source. The manual w/remote is the same expect you can use a remote control. The fully automatic detects which input source has an active signal then sends that signal to the projector. I am sure there are loss of signal issues with all of them.

Any suggestions on a decent unit that will not break the bank? I'll check out ultralink and the unit in the Power Buy too. (Power buy may be over by now.)

You may want to check these out, I just received this release this morning-
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

Gefen Upgrades its DVI Solutions for New Generation of DVI and HDMI Standards, Offers Less Expensive DVI-Only Computer Solutions

WOODLAND HILLS, CA -- October 19, 2004 -- To accommodate the evolution taking place within the technology based on DVI and HDMI standards, and more clearly differentiate products designed for HDTV environments (using DVI and HDMI) versus computer systems (using DVI only), Gefen has released several changes to its DVI and HDMI switchers and splitters.

Essentially, Gefen re-engineered its HDTV Switcher, 4x1 HDTV Switcher and HDTV Splitter products to address connection issues between new DVD players and set-top boxes with DVI or HDMI ports and HDTV displays with HDMI inputs. The resulting new products are the HDMI Switcher, the 4x1 HDMI Switcher and the 1:2 HDMI Splitter, each equipped with more sophisticated electronics to best handle the HDCP (high bandwidth digital content protection) and HDMI compliances.

The original HDTV switchers and splitters have been repurposed as less expensive DVI solutions for computer systems. These products, the Mini DVI Switcher, the 4x1 DVI Switcher and the Mini DVI Splitter, solve common computer connectivity problems while supporting DVI standards to the highest resolutions. All of Gefen's reengineered DVI products offer compatibility and interoperability among the computer and display components currently being manufactured.

"It's a natural progression as DVI is currently used primarily in the computer display industry, while HDMI is rapidly gaining momentum in the consumer-based HDTV arena," explained Hagai Gefen, president, Gefen Inc.

HDMI is smaller, backwards compatible with digital and analog interfaces and includes digital audio with the video in the same cable. For HDTV systems that use DVI or HDMI ports, Gefen‚s HDMI switchers and splitters are all fully HDCP compliant and support both DVI and HDMI standards, resulting in a product line that provides greater flexibility among electronics equipment in home theaters or any HDTV system.

Additional DVI products Gefen offers include the DVI Repeater, 2x2 DVI Switcher, 4x4 DVI Matrix and the 4x1 DVI/ADC Switcher, all accommodating DVI plus USB and analog audio as well as being rackmountable. For detailed information on Gefen's upgraded DVI and new HDMI solutions, visit www.gefen.com.

###

About Gefen Inc:

Gefen provides computer and electronics connectivity solutions through its ex-tend-it Professional Series, offering multi-platform extension, switching, distribution and conversion technologies. Gefen‚s new HDTV solutions split, switch, convert and extend high definition digital video at its highest resolutions. SDI, HD-SDI, HDMI, fiber optics, DVI, Dual-Link DVI, CAT5 and similar solutions are also available through Gefen as well as a variety of cabling.

For more information:

Linda Morgan
818-889-3970
linda@gefen.com

I am using a Bravo D2 DVD player. When using the 8700+'s DVI input, will the user controls like brightness and contrast be adjustable? I know some projectors don't allow adjustment of these controls when using the DVI input?

Thanks,
Tom

The 8700's have contrast, brightness, sharpness and color level controls on DVI. The Bravo D2 and 8700 combo is a very popular combo here on AVS.

Thanks Jim!

Carl, I have a DTronics 4x1 DVI switcher. It works well.

Dan

Thanks Drapp and Jim:

I had no idea how much those things cost. It's almost as much as the receiver (after rebates).

Back to the main topic. Here are some threads I have found interesting:

Brief mount discussion: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=458273&highlight=PE8700

Screen use with PE8700: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=451401&highlight=PE8700

Problem with happy ending: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=456037&highlight=PE8700

Accolades: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=452854&highlight=PE8700

Questions that led to firmware discussion: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=452157&highlight=PE8700

1.07 Firmware Discussion: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=449524&highlight=PE8700

PE8710 and PE8720 DIscussion: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=448717

AVScience Carries PE8700+, Call Jason: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=452600&highlight=PE8700

Focus: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=445800&highlight=PE8700

Fan Issue: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=443406&highlight=PE8700
and http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=422667&highlight=PE8700

Projector Central Review: http://www.projectorcentral.com/benq_pe8700+.htm

Anouncement on when 8700+ was introduced: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=385821&perpage=20&highlight=PE8700&pagenumber=1

Replacement Bulb: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=434732&highlight=PE8700

Big Service Menu Discussion: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=345564&perpage=20&highlight=8700%20secret&pagenumber=1

August 2003 Secrets Review (PE8700 not the +): http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_10_3/benq-8700-projector-8-2003.html

Best 8700 Firmware 1.04 Thread: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=379540&highlight=PE8700

Returns (This may scare some people): http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=409157&highlight=PE8700

Member review. Duate suggests an PE8700 without firmware upgrade: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=405317&highlight=PE8700

Calibation: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=383570&highlight=PE8700

Factory Settings: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=389873&highlight=PE8700


I'll add to and edit this list as time allows.

I just received a brand new PE8700 today. How can I tell if it has the DLP2+ Chip and the version of firmware installed?

Texas:

The only way to tell which chip you have is the little tag on the site of the box that says HD2+ DMA. It is also listed in the manual. (Should have a color glossy cover and pictures of the unit inside).

If it is like mine and was manufactured in August 2004 then it has the 1.07 firmware. The Manufacture date is on the little tag on the bottom of the unit. If you access the service menu it will also tell you the firmware.

Press menu, press ON, press menu twice. Be very, very, careful in this mode. It is best to look but do not touch. You'll know you are in the service menu mode when the connection information in the lower right corner of the screen is red instead of the standard green.

There are other ways to tell if you've a HD2+ chip inside. the obvious way would be the see if the box says so. Another way is to check if the serial number states that its manufactured after the famous S/N listed in projectorcentral.com The other way is to check to see if you can see the via hole of each mirror is filled or not.


I've used the service menu and its actually very crucial for calibrating the pj for optimal picture.

EG:
Contrast
Contrast in the user menu is way too coarse for proper tweaking. I tend to use the contrast setting in the Service menu->DLP->Contrast for optimal white levels as well as grey scale tracking.

Greyscale tracking.
Greyscale tracking calibration is best done in the service menu->Gamma. I can't exactly remember what is there alien terminology used in the benq SM, but there are 3 gamma settings for each of the RGB colours. 1 adjust the gamma levels entirely, the other adjust just the lower IRE and the last adjust the higher IREs. With the right combinations, the greyscale tracking can be adjusted very flexibiliy. Of course, the right way is to use a colourimeter, but greyscale colour temperature shifts can be eyeballed and eliminated using the gamma settings in the SM.

Macroblocking-like artifacts
Many have reported macroblocking-like on the BENQ even thou calibrated on Avia and DVE. (at least I have, esp on the opening sequence of Master and commander). They can be totally removed by setting the SM settings to "Film" mode and/or reducing the brightness to -2.


The user menu isn't the best I've seen for optimal calibration. Granted, it has all the usual adjustments to make, but the SM provided much greater flexibility than the UM. Becareful not to change other settings if you're not sure if you can reset them back should anything goes wrong. But personally, I find that there is no destructive changes that can be made in the SM if we jotted down all the factory settings prior to changing anything.

I'm enjoying every little bit of my 8700+.........Using mine with a SDI-modded pioneer DVDP, a Momitsu 880 and an iscan HD via DVI. Full digital is the way to go!

Im surprised you even noticed that much difference between the 8700 and the +, are you sure it did not look better because it was new, had a fresh bulb?

I had demo'd an 8700 about 8 months ago when the 8700 plus came out, I seen the 8700+ in action, and later found I could buy a 8700 for much cheaper, I wanted to see it in action before I dismissed the + even for saving close to a thousand dollars canadian, and I really noticed know difference so going with the 8700 non plus was a no brainer.

I even asked on here to make sure, and almost everyone said the difference was subtle at best. I think someone even said at the canuck shootout in between breaks they switched a + with a 8700 and nobody noticed the difference.

Obviously the plus has longer lamp life and updated firmware, but I never really noticed an increase in picture. Im surprised you noticed a noticeable increase.

Thanks for the responses guys. Mine was made in August 2004 too, so I guess it has the 1.07 firmware.

I'm in the process of buying a DVD player and the Directv HD Tivo box. I want a DVD player that upconverts to HD. I plan to use the DVI connection for my Directv HD Tivo Box. So my questions for other owners of the BenQ 8700. Which upconverting DVD player do you guys use and if it is a DVD player that can upconvert to component is that good enough or would you use a DVI switch instead?

texasbearfan,

I have the Zenith 318 (actually the Canadian equivalent LG 7832). I prefer the DVI output at 1080i, even with its limitations, compared to component with the 8700+. However, its 720p output stinks... noticeable color bleeding, etc.

If I were to pick again, I would choose something that did a good job with 720p (Momitsu V880, Bravo D2, Denon 2910, Panasonic S97). None are perfect but 720p native is very desirable with the 8700+.

Also, I personally would use a DVI switcher as I do find DVI to have better detail than component, at least with my player.

Will BenQ8700+ work at 72hz frames/sec vs 60 hz? I'm thinking of purchasing an Iscan and was just curious. Thanks

Originally posted by bujji
Will BenQ8700+ work at 72hz frames/sec vs 60 hz? I'm thinking of purchasing an Iscan and was just curious. Thanks

I just checked the service manual for you and it doesn't list that as a supported rate.

Made some changes to the list of threads.

Does anyone who has completed the firmware update want to loan/sell the adapter they made?

Also, does anyone have the remote codes for a Mx-700 that they can share... It appears one of my little ones has mis-placed the remote for my projector. :(

Thanks.

Elmer

Remote Central might have those remote codes for the 8700.

On a different note, I had an opportunity to hook the 8700+ I have up to my HTPC via a DVI cable. The difference between this input and the RGBHV I had tried was night and day. The DVI was MUCH sharper, much more saturated and much brighter. My RGBHV cables are no slouches as they are all 75 ohm Canare with solid, true 75 ohm BNC's. But, I had never used a digital connection to my display device (I was formerly using a CRT) and so I just want to know if this difference between analog and digital connections is so dramatic with other 8700 owners and in general with all devices that have both digital and analog connections.

Also, I purchased an AR "Master Series" DVI cable - 25' length from my local best buy as a temporary connect from my rack to the 8700. I have a fairly long run for the cable, so I was concerned about the cable quality. The AR looks fine from both my HD STB and HTPC, however, having no previous experience with Digital to Digital video display connects I am not sure what a "bad" DVI cable would look like. The AR cable was $300 and is quite impressive looking (thick, nice sleeve, good connects on both sides) but is it worth spending that much money on a digital cable? I mean, isn't this like digital audio cable...since it is digital, won't a bad cable mean that you won't get any signal at all (all or nothing with digital, right?)? I know that there are much cheaper cables that go for similar lengths, but is there an appreciable difference in qualtiy of DVI cables by spending more $$$?

Thanks,
-Alex-

Originally posted by bairda
Also, I purchased an AR "Master Series" DVI cable - 25' length from my local best buy as a temporary connect from my rack to the 8700. I have a fairly long run for the cable, so I was concerned about the cable quality. The AR looks fine from both my HD STB and HTPC, however, having no previous experience with Digital to Digital video display connects I am not sure what a "bad" DVI cable would look like. The AR cable was $300 and is quite impressive looking (thick, nice sleeve, good connects on both sides) but is it worth spending that much money on a digital cable? I mean, isn't this like digital audio cable...since it is digital, won't a bad cable mean that you won't get any signal at all (all or nothing with digital, right?)? I know that there are much cheaper cables that go for similar lengths, but is there an appreciable difference in qualtiy of DVI cables by spending more $$$? Delivery of digital RGB via DVI or HDMI is not as straight forward as all or nothing-especially with longer throws. When your signal transmission system is at its outer limits you'll first see some dropped pixels, then horizontal streaks and the posterization. If you have this issue you can see it develop by changing your DVI output from 480p to 1080i to 720p. As the bandwidth requirements increase, so do the artifacts.

I've been recommending Ultralink's HDMI PRO cable for long throw DVI or HDMI applications in conduit. For DVI, the HDMI PRO makes the system future-proof when sources and displays are upgraded to HDMI or progressive 1080 for HD content. Ultralink makes a HDMI Female to DVI Male adapter to connect the HDMI cable to DVI devices. William Phelps, renowed ISF calibrator is even running their system to run 1080p/60 from a Faroudja scalar or a HTPC to the JVC HD2K at 10 meters. Something he couldn't achieve with other brands of DVI cable.

Well I'm NOT happy with Benq PE8700+ so far. We got it a couple of days ago and set it up just to try it out until we finish the room. I borrowed a DVD player from the bedroom for the trial. I let it run about a half-hour. Next day I tried it with the camcorder for another half-hour. So far so good. Third day I got the High def box from comcast, wow,on the wall yet. played it about another half hour. Wife gets home from work I say come check out the picture on high def. from comcast. Turn it on, nothing, flashing red light. Next day my wife calls Projector People they tell her it's DOA send it back will sent a new new one. Today I call they tell me it needed a bulb so we fixed and you should have back by morning. After I hang-up I thinking do I want it back. What caused it to go bad in the first place. I just got a bad vibe. BTW I'm a rookie with HT.

Had the exact same thing. THe Lamp LED flashes the times, pauses, then repeats.

BenQ was quick to offer to replace the unit but I asked if there is anything I can try. They suggested unplugging everything, taking out the bulb for a couple of seconds, then reinstalling the bulb. This seamed to do the trick. Must be the bulb listened up during shipping and all in needed was to be reseated.

I have since watched the last 1/2 of DVE, and two movies. So far so good.

Let us know if this works for you.

Kind of sucks when you're trying to impress a wife that is not overly supportive isn't it. My wife is now now addicted then I am.

Originally posted by RaymondP
After I hang-up I thinking do I want it back. What caused it to go bad in the first place. I just got a bad vibe. BTW I'm a rookie with HT.

From my understanding the bulbs are very sensitive. Doing things like turning the projector on for frequent short intervals, turning the projector back on before the bulb completely cools off, etc can cause bulbs to fail early. Not saying you did any of this but it might be a possible cause. Last night my wife accidentally shut the projector off in the middle of the movie. Rather than powering up immediately, I waited about 15 minutes until the projector was cool to the touch to avoid starting a hot bulb.

But as with anything, it is possible to get a bulb with a defect from the start and I believe it is actually somewhat common in the front projection world... not just with BenQ. If you're happy with the image quality (which to my eyes is spectacular) I would give the new unit a try before getting too worried. Odds are you will go 2000 hours before having to replace the next bulb and you'll get a truly wonderful image in the meantime... enjoy your next 1,000 movies!!

Maybee old news to some, but tonight I was comparing the Component progressive through the BNC connectors with the DVI connection (Denon 3910). There is absolutely no doubt here. DVI is so impressing, that I will just forget about the Component when wiring the installation.

Another thing is that i really like the Black level "Enhanced" setting on the Denon 3910. I think read somewhere here that most people uses the "Normal" setting. Its really nice to see some real blacks for a change - . HD2+ and Denon 3910 - im hooked ...

Except for turning down sharpness and Brightness and turning off filter, I use the factory settings for the 8700. I tried many different movies and the settings seems to work for all different cases - great

/ HLI

Originally posted by Jag77


I've used the service menu and its actually very crucial for calibrating the pj for optimal picture.



How do you access the service menu?

Jeff

Jeff,

Open the Menu and press Power On (Green). The menu should dissappear and the osd in the bottom right should turn red. Press menu again and you should have some different options. Do the same to switch back.

Has anyone opened up the benq beyond the lamp chamber?

Having been into Home Theatre in a small way for many years (dvd's, 5.1 setup, AV amp etc.) I finally made the jump to a projector (BENQ 8700+) and am highly pleased I did. Having said that I must admit to aproaching madness (similar to another poster on another thread) with the exponential increase in complexity and options I now find myself battered with!

MY SETUP - BENQ 8700+, Da-Lite 133" Hi Contrast Matt White screen, iScan HD, HTPC, 2xXbox's, Sony VA80ES AV amp, Sony SS-T70ES speakers, Satelite Receiver

I have a few questions and will post some in other threads, but since this is the 8700+ thread, they may all be interesting to you guys (and gals?) out their with this great machine.

1) I bought the iScan HD, and apart from an initial problem with what seemed a very green shifted output via the Analog port, I didn't actually see any improvement worth it's US$1200 price tag, the only benefit I found was that it was the closest thing to an AV Amp that could handle the switching of all my devices, and in particular do it in the digital domain. My question is, has anyone else paired the iScan HD with the BENQ 8700+, and found it worth the effort and price? (I did read the projectorcentral.com review, that's one of the reasons I bought the iScan).

2) Trying to calibrate this properly may turn out to be harder than I hoped. I have found 2 good local calibrators, but only one has experience with this projector, and he does not have any documentation on the engineer's setup menu, and does not know what all the settings are for. Does anyone out there have any documentation on this?

3) If I keep the iScan, I will add the SDI option, and change from the HTPC to a new DVD player. My choice seems to be down to the Phillps 963SA and the Denon DVD-3910. Opinions so far seem to actually be leaning towards the Philips even though it is about half the price of the Denon! I will not use the player for audio (SACD etc.) only for movies. Has anyone used either of these with their BENQ 8700+, and or have any opinons what would be best for me?

Considering the cost of the iScan, SDI option, new DVD player with SDI coming to around US$3000, not so sure the improvement over the HTPC DVI output direct to the projector will be worth it.

Oh my GOD! sorry it turned out a bit long.

cyborgx-
Ask your calibrator to send me an email and I'll get the service manual forwarded to them.
jim_noyd@acker.com

Thanks, Jag.

After examining the service menu and changing back to regular menu, I now have a problem with the "ASPECT-ANAMORPHIC" showing in the lower right. It stays on until I hold the ANA button down for about five seconds then it goes away. The problem is, I now have to do this every time the projector is started or a menu is accessed. No biggie, but it gets a bit annoying. Any ideas on how to get this to not come up any more?

Thanks,

Jeff

Turn the power off to the projector from the rear switch, remove the power plug, cycle the projector power switch on/off, reconnect the power cord, turn back on the power from the rear switch, turn on the projector from the on/off power switch.

Hope this helps?

This may be a good question for the official thread.

Does anyone know the distance from the mounting plate to the center of the lens?

I've seen this posted somewhere around here before; but, I can't believe that it isn't included in the manual.

Originally posted by JediMaster Matt
Does anyone know the distance from the mounting plate to the center of the lens?


From the manual, 2.78" (70.64mm)

I see they fixed the offset table too. Now it notes the offset is in mm. The old manual for the 8700 did not have this notation so if you were not paying attention you would think there is a huge offset.

Thanks Carl... I have to admit the truth: I was only looking at the back of the manual instead of page 13. Oops.

Jim, I was hoping to use the distance from the mounting plate to more acurately measure the vertical offset to confirm floor to ceiling measurements.

Thanks guys!

Second request! Please help!

Does anyone who has completed the firmware update want to loan/sell the adapter they made?

Also, does anyone have the remote codes for a Mx-700 that they can share... It appears one of my little ones has mis-placed the remote for my projector.

Thanks.

Elmer

Regarding the DVI vs component inputs issue:

I get my HDTV via RCN cable service, and I normally use the DVI output at 720p. I've also looked at the output at 720p via component, and the difference is very subtle. On the sharpest source material - typically Discovery HD - the DVI input looks just a touch sharper. Otherwise, they seem equivalent (assuming you calibrate each one appropriately).

Oops. Just to clarify, I am trying to compare the output from these players via SDI modifications to them, not the standard devices.

Hello guys,

Have any of you 8700+ (or 8700) owners noticed any "smearing" during pans? Apparently some guy with an Optoma H77 has (on the Offical H77 & Screenshots thread). That there is a fix on firmware c12 or c14...etc. I've also seen this on an 8" CRT projector. Wondered if any of you saw this?

Also, are any of you using an iScanHD?

Thanks!! :)

I see smearing quite frequently with the 8700+, especially with HD during pans.

Yes, I've also seen smearing during pans on HD. I have an HD DVR, so I tried pausing the picture during a pan - the smearing vanishes while the picture is paused. I guess that means that the smearing is definitely a projector effect, not something to do with the HD compression. I'm not using iScan.

I always wondered if it was the source or the 8700+ that was smearing. I once told a BenQ tech about it and he wanted me to take a picture of it. Sounds like that would be nearly impossible.

Originally posted by 1st on the Block
I always wondered if it was the source or the 8700+ that was smearing. I once told a BenQ tech about it and he wanted me to take a picture of it. Sounds like that would be nearly impossible.

Thanks for commenting guys! But that is disappointing to say the least. :P I haven't bought mine yet thank God. Does this only happen with HD material? Or have you guys noticed while watching DVDs too? And is BenQ going to offer a "fix" for this?

According to a friend of mine. An Optoma H77 fan. He is guessing it's the scaler inside the projectors. Which was why I asked if any of you were also using an iScanHD. I was at a local CRT-projector Club gathering in August. They were having a scaler shootout. And I "believe" when they used a certain scaler (maybe the IscanHD) the smearing affect was either lessened or eliminated. This was back in late August.

Also, this Optoma H77 friend mentioned that Optoma has offered new firmware. Verions C12 and C14. Which "should" either lessen or eliminate the smearing affect.

Does this bother you guys? And do you think this is common in all digital projectors?

I suppose what you call smearing is the "False Contour Effect" which is common on all 1 Chip DLP projectors. Not much you can do about it...



Regards

and I thought it was my eyes, noticed the smearing also, or would you call it ? "motion blur" ..........


or what Riddick said above.........

What are you guys using for your HD sources, 720P or 1080i? Rogers Cable, Bell ExpressVu or Star Choice? Do you have a separate set of component cables, RGB or DVI going to the 8700+? Are you going through your receiver or processor? Just waiting for my daughter to finish watching a movie and I'll check it out on my setup and post something here.

Clubfoot, I tried a simple mechanical component switcher before I got a DVI switcher. DVI is clearer/sharper (using a DTronics 4x1 switcher) from a Voom Motorola STB, and from a Bravo D1. I use 720p from the Bravo D1 and from the STB 720p looks about the same as 1080i.

Dan

using Denon 1910 DVD thru DVI cable supplied with the 8700 at 1080i, and I often see what I would call motion blur sometimes on fast moving scenes........

I use a DVI input from a D1 and an HD component input from a Sansung ST360. I use the same component input from my Pioneer 45a.

I had an 8700 for about a year and now have the 8700+. I have never seen smearing.

Unfortunately, my ExpressVu HD went down tonight and I have to wait a few days for the new Smart Card. However, what I wanted to find out was if those using 720P were seeing motion blur versus those using 1080i and if the input source cable made a difference as well? I've watched the Olympics, hockey and football in HD and never noticed it on my 8700+, but then again I wasn't watching for it. As soon as the new card arrives I'll give it a very close look. thanks for all the responses.

Thanks guys!

So, from the few postings on smearing (blurring), it sounds like there's not much we can do. That one of you hasn't seen it. And, that basically, this is a fact of life owning a 8700+ (and I suspect for any DLP projector owner).

I just read that if you have a scaler like the IScanHD that can support 72hz and that your projector can as well...using a SDI dvd player...smearing is greatly reduced. As well, that digital projectors dont' fall under this category. Only CRT projectors.

I was so set on purchasing a DLP projector. Knowing you can't avoid it is a tad discouraging. Perhaps I won't notice it if I'm not looking for it. Because in another thread one member mentions how he has seen smearing on his CRT-rptv too...I had never seen smearing on a CRT-rptv when watching dvds. So go figure.

Keep the comments and advice coming! :)

I forgot to mention I have not seen smearing on the 8700 over the 13 months I've had mine.

I suspect the source when I hear about "smearing" problems, unless we're talking some of the older or lower end LCD displays where it's unfortunately pretty obvious.

Dan

I had the X1 before the 8700+ and I never saw the smearing effect I have on the BenQ. All sources have stayed the same over this time.

Originally posted by drapp1952
I forgot to mention I have not seen smearing on the 8700 over the 13 months I've had mine.

I suspect the source when I hear about "smearing" problems, unless we're talking some of the older or lower end LCD displays where it's unfortunately pretty obvious.

Dan

Hello Dan,

Thanks for posting!

How do you have your sources connected to your 8700? I read your profile. Are you using your DVI out from your Bravo D1? What are you using from your HD receiver, DVHS player....etc.?

Sounds more and more it might be the source as you mentioned. As some people are not seeing it. Some are not seeing it using other brands/models. Some get "hit upside the head" with the smearing. Heh...

Thanks 1st On the Block for your post too! :)

Later guys.

I recently acquired a Zektor DVS5.1 switch to hook up my Sony HD200, Denon 3910 and HTPC to the projector. The switch didn't seem to work with the 3910 so I unplugged it. However, when I now try to hook up the HTPC to the projector directly nothing shows up (i.e. blank screen, not even a bios screen). The Denon and Sony when hooked up directly work fine. Any ideas? I tried 2 different PCs that I know used to work with the projector. Is there a reset I can do to the projector? I had the projector calibrated and I would hate to lose my settings.

I do not see any "smearing" when the source is output at 720p. At 1080i, I do occasionally see some blurring in pans but it is never very severe or bothersome.

Originally posted by Dark7pt1
Thanks guys!

So, from the few postings on smearing (blurring), it sounds like there's not much we can do. That one of you hasn't seen it. And, that basically, this is a fact of life owning a 8700+ (and I suspect for any DLP projector owner).

I just read that if you have a scaler like the IScanHD that can support 72hz and that your projector can as well...using a SDI dvd player...smearing is greatly reduced. As well, that digital projectors dont' fall under this category. Only CRT projectors.

I was so set on purchasing a DLP projector. Knowing you can't avoid it is a tad discouraging. Perhaps I won't notice it if I'm not looking for it. Because in another thread one member mentions how he has seen smearing on his CRT-rptv too...I had never seen smearing on a CRT-rptv when watching dvds. So go figure.

Keep the comments and advice coming! :)

I run 720p, 1:1 mapped from a Lumagen HDP thru DVI and I see smearing especially on HD frequently. Even before having the Lumagen and feeding the pj direct 720p or 1080i I saw smearing.

nobody at all have any comments on my questions about pairing the iscan HD with the 8700+ or which SDI ported DVD player works best with it?

What players/scalers are you guys/gals using?

Originally posted by gthal
I do not see any "smearing" when the source is output at 720p. At 1080i, I do occasionally see some blurring in pans but it is never very severe or bothersome.

Thats very good to hear! But could you tell us about your components and how they are connected to your 8700+? Are you using component or DVI to the projector? Using an iScanHD? And are you watching dvds and HD programming in 720p?

Thanks!

Dark7pt1, I use a DTronics 4x1 DVI switcher for my D1 and Voom STB. I use component for the JVC 30000 but if I had a means to convert firewire to DVI (I know, the SIR-T165 is out there and I'm considering one - anyone know of a viable alternative?) I'd plug that in to the switcher as well.

Dan

For those who have never seen smearing on their 8700, let me say that it does not show up all the time. I can watch for a whole evening without seeing it once. The key factors for me seem to be:

1) It only shows up on HD channels. The sharper the channel, the easier the smearing is to notice.
2) I have yet to see it on a DVD.
3) It only shows up on reasonably fast pans across focused, high contrast objects. The perfect torture test is a medium fast pan across spectator's faces at a stadium. You won't see it on slow pans, and with very fast pans you may not notice it because it's harder to follow with the eye.
4) It's NOT like the blurring in film during a pan. It's more of a solarization effect, where there suddenly seems to be coarser steps in color and shade in the panning region.

I get HD channels via RCN motorolla cable box/DVR combo, feeding to the 8700+ through DVI. The cable box runs as 720p for all channels (so no scaling in the 8700).

My DVD player is an older Toshiba progressive model, connected via component cables and running at 480p.

I've also tried pausing the HD picture with the DVR while the blur is happening. The blurring effect seems to disappear while the picture is paused, so I don't think this is a source compression effect.

HD's sharper images - when the scene is relatively static - will make its deficiencies more apparent when the bit rate "Can't keep up," so to speak, with the information originally picked up by the HD camera (presuming the camera has this capacity in the first place), as when there's a pan of more complex scenes like crowds. Then you'll see artifacts that you may call smearing. Check out DVHS: even though it is also high def you'll not see smearing because it has almost double the bit rate of what HD satellite stations are transmitting.

So, we're back to the signal source, not the pj.

Dan

Thanks for you comments drapp1952/yegulalp! It's always good to hear different perspectives and experiences. In the end, I guess smearing is one motion artifact, that if seen is fairly inconsequential compared to other types. Is seen in some circumstances and not in others. Just a fact of owning a projector (digital or analog).

Have a great weekend guys! :)

Dan, I'm familiar with the source compression effects on HD that you mention. The summer olympics coverage was filled with motion-induced compression artifacts, and they were pretty glaring in my opinon. Those compression-related artifacts make the image look blocky and low-res in the area of motion.

The "smearing" effect I'm talking about looks quite different, and it doesn't seem to show up as often. I find it easiest to see on channels with the best signal quality - like Discovery HD or HDnet.

If you pause the image with a DVR, smearing goes away, but the compression -induced blocking artifacts are still there. That makes me believe that smearing is a projector effect, not a source effect.

Regarding smearing (hey, this is my first post in the thread! hmmm hehe), I'm thinking that the best way to try to reproduce the effect is to use a fast PC action game - such as UT2004 or some other first person shooter with lots of color and detail (NOT DOOM3 - it's too dark!). Looking around quickly and slowly, and see if you can spot any smearing. Works best if there are high detail and high contrast objects in view.

I haven't done this myself. Hmm, maybe you can use an XBOX and a copy of Halo or DOA3 or some other game with fast pans.

Oh BTW, if anyone wants the Benq 8700+ service manual, email me at rectalprolapse@gmail.com and I'll send it to you! Just make sure you have 3 megs free in your mailbox first! :)

Originally posted by maxleung
Regarding smearing (hey, this is my first post in the thread! hmmm hehe), I'm thinking that the best way to try to reproduce the effect is to use a fast PC action game - such as UT2004 or some other first person shooter with lots of color and detail (NOT DOOM3 - it's too dark!). Looking around quickly and slowly, and see if you can spot any smearing. Works best if there are high detail and high contrast objects in view.

I haven't done this myself. Hmm, maybe you can use an XBOX and a copy of Halo or DOA3 or some other game with fast pans.

I do have both games. No smearing at all. On the other hand I'm using a 32" directview tv and not a projector. :) The 8700+ is still on my short list of considerations...

Don't know if anyone has come across this, or if this is just usual, but when I use Avia to calibrate my Xbox connected to my BENQ 8700+ the settings only apply to the interlaced sources.

When I put a game in and it plays with at 480p or 720p, the settings are totally different.

I have tried manually inputting the same settings, but the picture seems too dark and too green, so I think I'll need to calibrate them seperately.

My question is, does anyone know of a way to output PROGRESSIVE calibration screens from the Xbox?

I know I could hack the box to get the DVD player to output progressive when playing DVD's but it sounds a bit time consuming, complicated and risky (and that's coming from an ex mainframe computer programmer!). Is there an easy way to hack it?

Perhaps someone knows of a game that has a THX calibration option in it?

The games look great on my 133" screen, but want them to look perfect!

Hey Cyborgx,
I was hoping you'd get some answers to your questions about the iscan HD. I am just finishing the drywall/painting on a new HT room, and am about to purchase the BenQ PE8700+, and based on the review at ProjectorCentral.com, I'm going to buy the iscan too. The DVDO folks have a 30 day money back guarentee, so I thought i'd give it a try.

NOW the question is, whether or not to buy the iScan HD or the iScan HD+! I don't understand how relevant HDCP compliance is going to be in the next couple of years.

Regarding screens: the consensus for the 8700 seems to be white. --- is that pretty consistent on this thread? Comments appreciated.

Ron

I was doing some testing with Halo 2 and my Benq 8700. Scanning back and forth does seem to add shimmer - not quite smearing. I don't know if it is the game or the projector. I will have to test with Unreal Tournament 2004 on my HTPC, if I can find the time.

Is it possible that the smearing and solarization, clay face, posterization effects are mainly from 1.07 version firmware? I have had 2 1.04 versioned 8700+ and a 1.07 8700+, and I never noticed any of those effects on the older firmware.

please let me know if my theory breaks.

thx
Davis

[QUOTE]Originally posted by sixpackd
[B]Is it possible that the smearing and solarization, clay face, posterization effects are mainly from 1.07 version firmware? I have had 2 1.04 versioned 8700+ and a 1.07 8700+, and I never noticed any of those effects on the older firmware.

Sixpackd, what has your experience been dealing with BenQ service, I see you're on your third projector replacement? And I'm awaiting my second replacement, because they did not send an 8700+ the first time and it's week three now!

As far as noticing the smearing I have not noticed it either on the two 1.04 units that I've seen either. I hope the 8700+ replacement is not a 1.07 now. :mad:

I have 1.04 in my projector. I don't generally see smearing.

However, while watching the remastered Goodfellas, I do see quite a bit of blurring in that movies copious amounts of panning. There is so much slow pans in the movie, with detailed objects in the background being panned over (textured walls, cars, people, etc.). It was quite noticeable. Again, I will have to do more testing. I don't see banding, but I see more blurriness than I think should be there...one day I will investigate this further.

I see quite a bit of solarization/posterization when first booting up Halo 2, when you continue/start a game and you get the cool loading screen with the shaft of light scrolling across. I cannot see the banding in the shaft on my CRT RPTV.

Clubfoot,

Although I would say that the unit doesnt seem to be as high in quality as I would have expected, I will say that benq's hot swap policy is very very good. I never had any problems with getting a replacement projector. the first replacement projector came in 2 days, and worked fine, the main problem was the optics, so when I was getting that projector swapped out, I asked for a 1.07 firmware projector. the next projector that I got was a brand spanking new projector. with the 1.07 firmware. This one has color wheel whine so its going back soon.

Max, is it possible that the solarization on halo 2 intro is just part of halo 2? i noticed it on a crt tv in 480i, my hi def mits on 480p as well as the 8700.

Davis

sixpacd

When I first hooked up my 8700+ I noticed a color wheel whine too but realized that it is spinning at a higher speed. That was the first day.

Now, about a month later, and after several films, I do not notice the wine at all. In fact my first impression was that the 8700+ was overall louder than the 8700. Now though, I notice it even less than the before.

If you sit in the room and concentrate on the projector and not the movie, you will notice it. But then again if you are looking for something to be wrong in anything you will find it.

Hi. I was just visiting the site as I haven't logged in for a while. I have an 8700 and it's been installed for about 9 months. I have noticed during sports telecasts that the centre of the picture spreads out a bit. It's like the there is a small zoom spot in the centre of the screen. I thought it was the tv reception or digital decoder until I noticed the same effect whilst watching Schrek2 the other day. Is this "smearing"? If not what is it and can I fix it. I have just contacted Benq in Australia to ask their opinion but have not yet had a reply.

Any help would be appreciated

Thx
Lucky Phil

Davis, you could very well be right. When I looked at it with my RPTV, it wasn't even warmed up and that fuzzes everything...I forgot about that. It's very obvious on the Benq, but if you see it on the Mits, it's definitely the game. :)

Luck Phil, did you by chance happen to press Wide on the Benq remote? I believe Wide mode on the Benq will actually stretch out the sides of an image, but leave the center unstretched. Try pressing the ANA button on the remote, and things should be fine...no stretching in Anamorphic mode. (BTW, using Wide mode will sometimes induce posterization/clay face - a great example is the Aragorn/Arwen bridge scene in the Two Towers - Aragorn's face gets all clay-like in Wide mode).

I second what Carl said...I barely noticeable my Benq's fans now, compared to it getting on my nerves a couple of months ago. I have a half-assed hush box, but it doesn't really help as I'm having airflow issues with it, so I leave the front of the box exposed. Oh well. :)

Originally posted by Lucky Phil
Hi. I was just visiting the site as I haven't logged in for a while. I have an 8700 and it's been installed for about 9 months. I have noticed during sports telecasts that the centre of the picture spreads out a bit. It's like the there is a small zoom spot in the centre of the screen. I thought it was the tv reception or digital decoder until I noticed the same effect whilst watching Schrek2 the other day. Is this "smearing"? If not what is it and can I fix it. I have just contacted Benq in Australia to ask their opinion but have not yet had a reply.

Any help would be appreciated

Thx
Lucky Phil Sounds like a hot spot from your screen as you see it with sports which are usually brightly lit.
What screen are you using and at what throw distance?
How is the 8700 mounted?

Ah, maybe you are right Jim...I saw the words zoom and stretch so I thought it was a scaling issue. :)

Jim
I am using a 100 inch fixed screen (screen technics) and the unit is ceiling mounted. The throw distance is about 12 ft however I will need to verify this. I had it professionally installed and we checked the throw distance and mounting position and height in line with factory recommendations so as there was minimal, if any, keystone correction required.

Which model and material from Screen Technics?

for those who don't notice the blur or "smearing", watch Fight Club, the scene that shows Edward Norton's apartment where the camera pans across the room and the catalog descriptions of the items in it are listed on the screen, the printed text blurs during the pan, but when paused is clear, so if any one doesn't notice this, please, please, let me know.........

About smearing. Are you sure you're not just seeing the result of low framerates (30 or 25 fps is low in my opinion)? If I run realtime 3D animations they seem blurry at such low FPS but at 60 fps+ it's much sharper with my NEC HT1000. Just a thought. :)

Can the 8700 colorwheel sync to 50 or 75 Hz when it's connected by DVI-D from a HTPS? This is the only thing that annoys me about my HT1000, that it doesn't change the colorwheel speed with refresh rate.

On another topic, how does the BenQ 8700+ look when displaying HDTV? Is it below average, average, good or excellent?

I notice that it is only 1080i, 720p, 576p compatiable whereas the Toshiba MT800 is 1035i, 1080p, 1080i 720p compatiable....does this make a big difference?

All my friends have rear projection TV's and they were sure this projector was not going to look as good. They watched for about 20 minutes and then left without saying anything else. I took that as a compliment. They are over all the time now.
My DVD's looked great from the Momitsu V880, I thought I shouldn't pay for a few high def....took the plunge and it looks fantastic! Do it!

Originally posted by VegasVec
On another topic, how does the BenQ 8700+ look when displaying HDTV? Is it below average, average, good or excellent?

I receive all of 1 OTA HDTV station. When it comes in I'd say the picture is good. I have a Samsung STS-360 (or something like that). I use the HD Component video out. Have not tried with the DVI output yet.

The HD stations on D* are good to excellent. More of a function of the original source material. Discovery HD is always excellent.
I have not subscribed to the HD premium stations.

Originally posted by VegasVec
I notice that it is only 1080i, 720p, 576p compatiable whereas the Toshiba MT800 is 1035i, 1080p, 1080i 720p compatiable....does this make a big difference?

The 8700 is also 480p. I'm not familiar with 1035i. It is not listed in the manual. No 1080p either. Is there anything that outputs 1080p yet? I've seen it listed as an input on a couple of projectors but not as an output.

Jim
My Screen Technics screen is matt white 16:9. I also checked the measurements from the projector to the screen and it is 11ft 6 inches.

Attached is a link to the website. My screen is the 100" in 16:9 code number 1210029.

I also checked the grid available within the 8700 installation menu and all of the squares are even in shape and size. The best way I can describe the problem is that it's like there is a 1ft area running horizontally across the screen and when the credits are scrolling up the screen they get to this area and appear slightly magnified. As mentioned I have only noticed this when watching HDTV however for the first time I noticed it whilst watching a DVD (Shrek2) the other day.

Fingers crossed you have a simple solution to my problem.

http://www.screentechnics.com.au/cataloguedetail.asp?startlink=Fixed+Frame+Screens&ProdNameID=CinemaSnap1

Thx
Phil

Originally posted by Lucky Phil
Jim
My Screen Technics screen is matt white 16:9. I also checked the measurements from the projector to the screen and it is 11ft 6 inches.

Attached is a link to the website. My screen is the 100" in 16:9 code number 1210029.

I also checked the grid available within the 8700 installation menu and all of the squares are even in shape and size. The best way I can describe the problem is that it's like there is a 1ft area running horizontally across the screen and when the credits are scrolling up the screen they get to this area and appear slightly magnified. As mentioned I have only noticed this when watching HDTV however for the first time I noticed it whilst watching a DVD (Shrek2) the other day.

Fingers crossed you have a simple solution to my problem.

http://www.screentechnics.com.au/cataloguedetail.asp?startlink=Fixed+Frame+Screens&ProdNameID=CinemaSnap1

Thx
Phil Lucky-
I haven't heard of this issue on the forums or seen it on my set up with the 8700.

And I don't know enough about your screen to comment on it.

Sorry, maybe others can help here.

Does the problem change or go away when you change the zoom ring on the projector? For example, if you have it zoomed all the way small or all the way big, set it to the exact opposite and see if it makes a difference.

Now that I said that, it's just another piece of information for troubleshooting - I couldn't tell you what to do if that affected the problem - make sure your lens is clean - When I was a "professional" projectionist at the local theater , myself and another guy spent 4 hours trying to fix a problem with smearing on the big screen. We cleaned that projector top to bottom, screwed around with the lamp focus and anything else we could think of. It was only when I pulled up the port glass to yell down "screw it, I can't fix it and I'm going home to bed" when I noticed the big greasy splotch on the glass where the last guy who did a lube job on the projector rubbed his greasy ass up against it.... Always check the glass and the optics!!

Originally posted by Donb01
Does the problem change or go away when you change the zoom ring on the projector? For example, if you have it zoomed all the way small or all the way big, set it to the exact opposite and see if it makes a difference.

Now that I said that, it's just another piece of information for troubleshooting - I couldn't tell you what to do if that affected the problem - make sure your lens is clean - When I was a "professional" projectionist at the local theater , myself and another guy spent 4 hours trying to fix a problem with smearing on the big screen. We cleaned that projector top to bottom, screwed around with the lamp focus and anything else we could think of. It was only when I pulled up the port glass to yell down "screw it, I can't fix it and I'm going home to bed" when I noticed the big greasy splotch on the glass where the last guy who did a lube job on the projector rubbed his greasy ass up against it.... Always check the glass and the optics!!

HAHA!! :) Funny story! But that's not what we mean by "smearing". If only it could be cured by a simple wipe of the lens. :)

speaking of physical lens smears, when looking at the lens on my projector there is what loooks like a very obvious finger print smear on one of the internal lens of my projector (not the outer lens), I am however very reluctant to go through the process of an exchange only because I don't seem to notice it on the output on the screen.......any one have thoughts on this..............

Thanks everyone for your input. I will try cleaning the lens and fiddle with the zoom. Let's see if Benq can add some comment, however they have not yet responded to my e-mail. The e-mail was sent because I was cut off whilst talking to the service technician. Maybe I wasn't cut off and the guy just hung up on me because this is a new glitch that they have no answer for. Time will tell.....

Lucky Phil

I just tried my Pioneer 59avi DVD player with firmware 1.506 and it did not work with the Benq 8700+. I was able to see all the menus of the DVD player, but the HDMI options menu was still greyed out. Also the HDMI light in the front of the player did not light up. When we played a movie, no video at all. Very stange. Anyone else see this before or have this player working via the HDMI output working with the 8700+?

Originally posted by fitsman
I just tried my Pioneer 59avi DVD player with firmware 1.506 and it did not work with the Benq 8700+... Anyone else see this before or have this player working via the HDMI output working with the 8700+?

Not with a Pioneer player but with an LG DVD player. It turned out that the devices needed to be turned on in a specific order. It has been a while since I had the problem. The LG player had some other issues so I took it back last July. If I remember correctly the projector had to be on first.

Try experimenting with the order; DVD first then projector, or projector then DVD player. That might to the trick. The 8700+ is fully HDCP compliant. Is the HDMI to DVD adapter you are using compliant?

Originally posted by Carl Holt
Not with a Pioneer player but with an LG DVD player. It turned out that the devices needed to be turned on in a specific order. It has been a while since I had the problem. The LG player had some other issues so I took it back last July. If I remember correctly the projector had to be on first.

Try experimenting with the order; DVD first then projector, or projector then DVD player. That might to the trick. The 8700+ is fully HDCP compliant. Is the HDMI to DVD adapter you are using compliant?

We tried them in both orders..Nothing worked. The adaptor is the one from Monster. It does not say HDCP anywhere on it. The model number is 400. Its funny how the setup menu for the DVD player worked, but not the video. Could that be the HDCP kicking in?

Originally posted by fitsman
We tried them in both orders..Nothing worked. The adaptor is the one from Monster. It does not say HDCP anywhere on it. The model number is 400. Its funny how the setup menu for the DVD player worked, but not the video. Could that be the HDCP kicking in?

Does the Pioneer have a DVI out? Have you tried that output instead? If so, how did that go? I realize the 8700)+ is supposed to be HDCP compliant but ya never know.

Just my 2 cents...

Could be.

When you say the setup menu worked I assume your saying that you could view it through the projector. The menu would not be protected.

Thinking back to the LG unit I had I seems to me a message popped up when a DVD was inserted. The player read the disk, found the need for HDCP copy protection in the software, checked to see if the DVD player and projector had established a handshake, and if it found the handshake was there would let the movie play. If the handshake had not happened then a message was displayed saying that an HDCP display is required to view the contents of the disk. The message would not go away until the disk was removed. It did not appear as though the LG unit check the connection each time a disk was inserted. It only checked the connection when turned on and stored the response in memory. When a DVD was inserted the player would check the response stored in the memory.

My comment on the adapter being compatible is only a hunch and is based on research I have been doing on DVI switches. The switches need to be compliant so the player and the projector can perform the handshake through the switch. I'm going out a limb and guessing that the same may be true for the adapter but I have no way of knowing. At least not now.

One thing I forgot to mention was that timing also played a factor in establishing the handshake. I found the thread where I had talked about this before:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=416425

To quote myself from the above thread:

Originally posted by Carl Holt
I was using the DVI connection. I found that the only way to get the HDCP handshake to work was to turn on the LG unit then turn on the projector. While the projector was warming up I would pop in the DVD. If I waited too long the handshake would not work. If I turned on the projector first the handshake would not work.

...

I've gone back to the Bravo D1. It has its problems too. I've been fortunate though in that it has never hung up on a disk.

I also use a Pioneer 45 that does not have DVI but does have a componant vido output. I have not have an HDCP connection problem with this unit. BUt then again I souldn't since it is not an HD device.

Unfortunately, it does not have a DVI output. But according to someone else on the board they said it was compatable with firmware 1.506 but not the earlier versions. I have 1.506. I hope Tweeter will let me swap it out for a Denon that does have a DVI.

Yes, I do have a PE8700 (not +) with a Pioneer 868AVi, and firmware 1.506, and mine works. Sorry.

I have been using the DVI input most of the time, but just noticed an issue when sending 480P to the BNC Analog port (need this when playing XBOX games).

480i looks fine, but with 480P there is a black strip down the left side, and about 7% of the screen is missing on the right (using Avia all the letters ABCDEFG are missing on the right).

Anyone else noticed this?

Would be grateful if someone could test their system and see if they have the same problem.

Thanks.

I have seen this as well with the Skyworth DVD player which has a 15-pin RGB output and connects to the BenQ via the RGBHV connectors. I assumed it was a sync problem but have not been able to resolve it.

Originally posted by Grubert
Yes, I do have a PE8700 (not +) with a Pioneer 868AVi, and firmware 1.506, and mine works. Sorry.

I guess it is down to 1 of 3 things:

1) The 868AVi is different from the 59AVi
2) The Monster adapter is not HDCP compliant
3) The 8700+ is different from the 8700

My guess is that it is one of the last 2, most likely being #2. It would be like Monster to miss that.

I think I am going to try and swap to the Denon 3910. From what I have read they are very similar in performance.

Thanks for the help

Brian

Hi,
has any one out there actually setup the 8700 with the iScan HD? If so, are you satisfied with the performance enhancement? What cable do you have connecting the two units (being a relative newbie to home theater, it appears to me I can "do it all" with a single DVI from the iScan to the projector.) Can you give me specifics about the cable -- I'm a bit confused by DVI-I and DVI-D. Lastly, what screen are you using? (I'm currently thinking of a 110" 16:9 Parkland Plastic painted with Goo Digital Grey Light).

comments/observations/lessons learned are welcome.
Ron

Originally posted by rcarsonxyz
Hi,
has any one out there actually setup the 8700 with the iScan HD? If so, are you satisfied with the performance enhancement? What cable do you have connecting the two units (being a relative newbie to home theater, it appears to me I can "do it all" with a single DVI from the iScan to the projector.) Can you give me specifics about the cable -- I'm a bit confused by DVI-I and DVI-D. Lastly, what screen are you using? (I'm currently thinking of a 110" 16:9 Parkland Plastic painted with Goo Digital Grey Light).

comments/observations/lessons learned are welcome.
Ron

Yes, I am running 8700 via iscan HD. Satisfied? Yes. What cable? I use a 2m DVI-D cable.

There is not much I can say about the dvi cable, except that I prefer as short DVI cables as possible to minimise video artifacts. I'm currently using a Draper high contrast grey screen, 80"x45".

Much to tweak in the service menu of the 8700. The RGBY adjustments in the user menu is actually very useful when used with Avia's red, green and blue colour bars.

iScan HD cannot output everything via the DVI. If you have analog inputs of 720P or 1080i they will be passed through to the analog output.

Originally posted by fitsman
I guess it is down to 1 of 3 things:

1) The 868AVi is different from the 59AVi
2) The Monster adapter is not HDCP compliant
3) The 8700+ is different from the 8700

My guess is that it is one of the last 2, most likely being #2. It would be like Monster to miss that.

I think I am going to try and swap to the Denon 3910. From what I have read they are very similar in performance.

Thanks for the help

Brian

Well we got a hold of a Denon 3910 which has both a HDMI and a DVI output. We hooked up the DVI output and we saw video, for only a few seconds and then it went blank for a few seconds, and then back again, and then blank....etc.....etc....etc...

We did not have the HDMI adaptor any more so we did not try the denon with the HDMI port.

Could we have a bad projector? Anyone using the Denon 3910 with the 8700+?


UPDATE: 11/19/04 - The Denon now works. We did nothing. We just shut everything off overnight and now it syncs. I think since we were using a Bravo D2 player without HDCP it was still expecting that...when we plugged in the HDCP players it would not sync. Leaving it overnight let them talk somehow. IT does not matter which one we turn on first now either. Not exactly sure what happened, but I am glad it works.


Brian

Hi all,

I'm looking for the throw distance, and I've found out that are conflicting data.

What I would like to know, guys, is the distance range for a 92" screen.

Think that it would be able to do it with a throw of 13.2'? Should I reduce it to 12'?

Cheers

Juan

I checked the projectorcentral.com site's calculator for the PE8700 and it states-
92" DIAGONAL 16:9 throw is from 9.1-11.1 feet
92" WIDE 16:9 throw is from 10.4-12.7 feet

What does the 8700's user manual state?

Hi Jim,

here is the square provided in the user's manual. As you can see, there are not slight differences. The least throw distance I can get, is about 12ft. The ideal would be 13.2 ft.


Cheers

Juan

I best way would be for you to go to the dealer or distributor where you plan to buy it and check it on that screen size as there is some discrepancy in the two sources.

or if some one has a similar screen here to check it for you.

Is anyone willing to loan me the cable they made so I can update the firmware on my 8700? The last offer has fallen through.

Thanks.

Elmer

I ceiling-mounted my 8700 using the information in the user's manual. I don't recall any problems with the throw distance information. As long as you're not trying to operate at the very edge of its adjustable range, you should be fine with the specs in the manual.

Dumb Question form Nube: Will the benq take any signal and put out a 16:9 image, or do I need a DVDO to accomplish this?

Thank you.

mark

You don't need DVDO for anything. The BenQ has plenty of image formatting options to choose from. Spend your money on a nice upsampling DVD player or HDTV service instead of a DVDO.

Re: Throw Distance.

I have mine 13 feet from the screen and I am projecting 110" diagonal (96" wide). I don't remember where I have my zoom ring set, but I have some room to move both ways.

I would assume that if you want a smaller image diagonally you would have to move the projector closer to the screen so you can still have room to move the zoom both ways. If you are trying to do 94" wide you are probably pretty close where you are at, and can zoom down to that.

Donb01,

could you please, tell me what zoom set do you have right now?

Moreover, I would be infinitely grateful, if you could reduce the zoom to the maximum, and measure what wide do you get then.

TIA

Juan

HI guys. I don't have access to my Service Manual right now. Is there anyway someone could post the timings for 720p60 on here or to send me the service manual? Thanks a bunch guys!

Hello

Posting from your little bro here with a 7800. On the 7800 I noticed that in scenes where there are contrasting colors (ie, black and white), the dark areas get washed out as if brightness is too high. Otherwise in all dark scenes the PJ is fine.

The white seems to be overpowering..does this happen on the 8700 and if so how do you correct it?

SpeedyHTPC - what you are describing is most likely due to light from the screen bouncing off walls/floors/ceiling and back onto the screen. If your room is not painted with dark colors, this will happen. When the whole scene is dark, there is no light to bounce around so everything looks okay.

Grant, email my gmail account ( rectalprolapse@gmail.com ) and I can email you the service manual PDF (2 megs).

Unfortunately I do have dark everything and this doesnt happen with my previous X1..

Thanks, Max! You've got mail.

I am pre-wiring for a BenQ 8700+, Denon 2910 DVD, Denon AVR-2805. I know I'll run DVI-I, but the component has 2 differnt types of input: RCA, as well as progressive component with BNC connectors. I'm confused as to the correct one to run. I also am confused as to what a 12 volt trigger is/does. Is this simply a cat 5 run so I can use a universal remote to send commands to the BenQ? Thank you for all your help.

Mark

The RCA component connectors are interlaced only. You'll want to use the BNC connectors for progressive-scan component (you'll need to get RCA-to-BNC adapters).

The 12 volt trigger supplies twelve volts (a plug is included so that you can solder them to whatever you want) only when the projector AND the lamp is on. You could, for example, power additional fans through the 12V trigger. However, when you turn off the projector, the fans will stop spinning as soon as the lamp goes off - that's rather annoying, because the Benq will still have its internal fans running at full power during the cooldown period.

Also, according to the schematic in the service manual, the 12V trigger should be able to pull 1 or 2 amps, despite the label on the plug saying it is 0.1 Amps only. Weird.

Mark, when I pre-wired, I ran every cable I could think of, S-video, 5 individual coax, component, DVI, phone, and a string in case I need to pull another or changed my mind later on. The trigger is usually used to tie to a motorized screen so that when you turn on the projector the screen drops down simultaneously.

Thanks for the help. Does the projector use IR for its remote? I'll run some cat5 for a stick on IR blaster for the projector. Did you use 2" conduit and did you run more than 1. I'll also put some coduit to the rear for a long throw projector in the future. Off topic but I noticed a bunch of digital optical inputs on the denon, what are these used for?

I am framing the soffit now, should be done by valentine's day. I hope no new/good/cheap/competative projectors come out between now and then...LOL.

Mark

Hi all,

the question is that reading the user's manual, I have seen that the DVI input is a DVI-I. Then would it be compatible with sources that output by DVI-D? Gess it won't. Anymore. Would it decode HDCP signals? Would it be HDCP compliant?

If anyone has used it with a DVD with such options (DVI-D, HDCP) e.g. denon 3910, I would be grateful to get some feedback about those points.

Cheers

Juan

The 8700's DVI input can be assigned as either analog RGB for DVI-I or digital RGB for DVI-D.
With the assignment of DVI-D it will accept sources that force or do not pass HDCP.

Many here are using DVI DVD players like the Bravo D1/2 and Denon's.

Originally posted by Jim Noyd
The 8700's DVI input can be assigned as either analog RGB for DVI-I or digital RGB for DVI-D.
With the assignment of DVI-D it will accept sources that force or do not pass HDCP.

Many here are using DVI DVD players like the Bravo D1/2 and Denon's.

Is this done automatically depending on the signal? Or do you set it somewhere in the Menu? And will it make a difference in PQ?

I don't know, but when I hooked up the Bravo D2 to the DVI input the pj found it which leaves me to believe that it is auto-detect. If not you can probably select it to be either analog or digital.

Hello guys,

I was just told by my Dutch buddy Daniel that in February 2005 we will be getting the PE 8720. The replacement for the 8700+. It will use the DarkChip3 and have an 8 segment colorwheel. Any one have some confirmed details about this upcoming projector?

Thanks!! :)

I'm going to pretend I never read that, and continue on with my 8700+. I'm always getting bit by the "upgrade" bug.

Originally posted by Jim Noyd
The 8700's DVI input can be assigned as either analog RGB for DVI-I or digital RGB for DVI-D.
With the assignment of DVI-D it will accept sources that force or do not pass HDCP.

Many here are using DVI DVD players like the Bravo D1/2 and Denon's.

Jim,

Bravo D1 doesn't get DHCP enforcement. That's a pity because there is no evidence that BenQ 8700 is HDCP. Anybody has proved with a Denon 2910/3910 or a Pio DV59?

Cheers

venezolano-
The point is that it is the source that forces the display to be able to detect an HDCP signal. So the Bravos will play DVI fine on any DVI display with or without HDCP.

The 8700's have HDCP on its DVI input.

Jim,

thanks for your response. I did notice about that some minutes ago.

Cheers

Juan

Any of you BenQ folks have a balanced, objective take on this one?

I'm buying a new pj and am torn between the HS51 (why are we waiting...) and the 8700+. Price diff, I believe is roughly $1K. Worth it? If so, why?

I realized the HS51 is still a mystery to most. If anyone has compared the HS20, that would be helpful, too.

Also, is it worth saving a little and getting the simple 8700. Is the "+" worth the "+ $"?

Dying to get on with it...

Originally posted by Dark7pt1
Hello guys,

I was just told by my Dutch buddy Daniel that in February 2005 we will be getting the PE 8720. The replacement for the 8700+. It will use the DarkChip3 and have an 8 segment colorwheel. Any one have some confirmed details about this upcoming projector?

Thanks!! :)

[Unconfirmed]

Contrast ratio 5000:1
Lens shift

PE8720 thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=448717)

Originally posted by Grubert
[Unconfirmed]

Contrast ratio 5000:1
Lens shift

PE8720 thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=448717)

Thanks Grubert for your input! :) I did find out that it will have a CR of 5000:1 and have an 8-segment color wheel and use the DarkChip3 technology and will allegedly be available in February 2005. Thats all I knew. I have bookmarked the thread you included!

For AKQJ10,

Chech this thread ------> http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=461425&highlight=HS51+shootout

It's a projector shootout! You should find that very interesting and useful. The HS51 did very well....

Anyone had any experience where their Benq pj (more specifically the 8700+) just blacks-out during routine viewing?

All I have to do is turn off the unit and then turn it back on and it will work again and displays the images as though nothing happened. I have not observed any pattern of any sort as to when it occurs for it is completely unpredictable. It can do it 10 minutes into a movie and then not do it again ever again or it can black out once every 30-40 minutes all at random times. The fan never is running fast when it occurs...

I am sending 720P to the pj via my LG DVD/HD Tuner combo unit LST-3510A over the component HD input via coax using BNC connecters. I am typically running with Anamorphic for the display setting. The strange thing is that it will not do it while watching video via the composite video input although I have not tried true HD sources yet.

I will be watching the beautiful image and then the screen will go completely black all of a sudden but right before it does, for just a second, a tiny bit of what would appear to be snow is all that the pj displays. This does not cover the screen totally but this is the only thing visible before the image goes completely black. Once it goes out, the menu on the pj does not even display until I cycle the pj off and then on again. I hope I will not have to send the thing back but I figured if there was a place to ask a question such as this, this thread would be the best place to do it. I appreciate any feedback!

This is just a guess, but because you say this only occurs on component, I wonder if your LG or a short in your component cable creates some kind of electrical spike that results in the BenQ equivalent of Window's dreaded "blue screen of death."

Maybe you can beg, borrow or buy another component DVD player and see if you still have a problem. If that doesn't solve it, try using a different component cable.

The key to troubleshooting is to change one variable at a time (e.g., the DVD player, the component cable, the input to the BenQ, a different power plug, etc.) until you hopefully isolate the problem as either belonging to the BenQ or some other piece of equipment.

Skinners, I heard similar problems for other projectors (in this forum and the DVD player forum I think). Apparently, some video sources output video out of spec, with the voltage or whatever being a bit too high and causing the projector to lose sync. Typically this occurs in very bright scenes.

Turning down the brightness in the video source might help, if such a setting is available on your LG.

Will unplugging the tuner and plugging it back in help? That may force the projector to resync.

Also, when this occurs, can you still get to the Benq 8700's menu? I just want to rule out a fault in the projector - if you get no menu, that would narrow down the problem to the projector.

Another thing you can try is to hook up another DVD player or tuner and see if it happens again. (EDIT: Oh, Kevin covered that :) )

Good luck!

Hi, :)

I own a BenQ 8700 (not "+").
When I look a Pal dvd in component 576p with my standalone player (Philips 963 with DCDI), no problems. Everything is fine.
But when I want to watch a NTSC movie with this player or NTSC/PAL materials with my HTPC (DVI, 1280 x 720@60hz with any player like Windvd, Powerdvd or VideoLan), I can clearly see sometimes some kind of little pixels blocks on vertical lines. It doesn't appear all the time but when I can see it, it's disturbing.
Of course, I took a look in the "Service" panel and I saw my BenQ was in "Graphics" mode and not in "Play dvd" mode. I activated the "Play dvd" mode.
It's now better but I still can see sometimes this kind of "special" vertical banding (I know that VB doesn't exist on Dlp projectors but the effect I see is almost similar) on some parts of the screen. :(
With TVHD trailers ( .ts, wmv...), it's fantastic and I cannot see any kind of weird "VB".

I wanna know something : if I buy a standalone player with 720p DVI output, will it better ?

With a HTPC, do you know what is the best frequency for the BenQ ? 60 hz, 59.990 ? Or something else ?

Thank you. :)

Prostic

Thanks a lot Kevin and maxleung for your thoughts and suggestions! I tried a different dvd player (albeit non-up-converting) and it works fantastic w/o an issue. I am going to send the LG in on warranty since obviously it is a little temper-mental. Thanks again, I appreciate your help very much!!!

Skinners, I just had my 8700+ replaced for similar symptoms that got progressively worst over a period of time. It started out with only the DVD player then progressed to the HD satellite receiver.

No problem skinners! Hopefully you can test it with an upconverting DVD player - there may still be an issue with higher resolutions on the projector, as clubfoot suggests.

Well, at least you are up and running for the time being. :)

Thanks again for all your help and suggestions! I sincerely appreciate them!

My bulb hit 2000 hours in 10 months on my BENQ PE8700 and says it needs to be replaced. The picture looks fine and I don't have the $400 to spend right now. If I reset the counter and keep viewing will I do any damage to the projector or just have my picture degrade over time?

Originally posted by Mudslide03
My bulb hit 2000 hours in 10 months on my BENQ PE8700 and says it needs to be replaced. The picture looks fine and I don't have the $400 to spend right now. If I reset the counter and keep viewing will I do any damage to the projector or just have my picture degrade over time?

From Page 3 of the Service Manual:

"Safety Precautions

2. The lamp becomes extremely hot during operation. Allow the projector to cool for approximately 45 minutes prior to removing the lamp assembly for replacement. Do not operate lamps beyond the rated lamp life. Excessive operation of lamps beyond the rated life could cause them to explode on rare occasions."

Also (and this is a surprise to me) from page 4.

"2.3 Lamp
2.3.1 Maker Ushio
2.3.2 Model NSH 210 MD
2.3.3 Type DC lamp
2.3.4 Lamp Wattage 210 watts
2.3.5 Lamp life 1000 Hours ( Typical )"

I think this is a miss print because the Manual states that the life is 1000 hours.

From Projector Central:

"Lamp: Type: 210W NSH
Life: 2000 hours"


Page 24 of the manual also lists all the warring messages you will get.

Will it cause damage after 200 hours if you simply reset the lamp timer? Based on the manuals, I'd say yes.

Of course it is up to you the amount of risk you want to take. $400 and new bulb good for 2000 more hours or save the money and be out $3800+ when the bulb goes bang and takes the rest of the projector out with it. Your choice.

I was wondering if any 8700 owners think the image is a bit fuzzy, even with sharpness turned to 10?

I have a 7800 but the PJs are very similar. Is it normal ?

Originally posted by SpeedyHTPC
I was wondering if any 8700 owners think the image is a bit fuzzy, even with sharpness turned to 10?

I have a 7800 but the PJs are very similar. Is it normal ?

No... my sharpness is set at 2 and I find it is very good. Now that is with DVD, I have not used the projector with my computer so I couldn't comment on that.

Carl, I believe the service manual that I got for the 8700 is not for the + model. I think the original lamp life was 1000 hours, and the contrast ration went from 2000:1 to 2500:1 on the + model....

I could be that the 8700+ is a "step model" and there is no formal service manual for it. The one I have is definately somewhat off the mark on some of the 8700+ specs...

Don:

You are 100% correct. The service manual is for the base 8700. I don't have a copy of the owner manual for the 8700 anymore but I believe you are correct, the older model only had a 1000 hour bulb, hence the different bulb numbers.

Hey guys-
I'm running my 8700+ off of a Denon 5900 via DVI and have been having problems with older DVDs that have not been "optimized for 16:9 displays." For example, I put in a copy of Top Gun yesterday and every once in a while I get what can only be described as what appears to be a scaling issue. The picture breaks in two with with a horizontal line separating the segments. These older DVDs are watched with the BenQ's aspect ration set to Letterbox. Newer DVDs play flawlessly and this is the only quirk I've experienced thus far with my PJ. If anybody has any thoughts, I'd love to hear them. Thanks.
-Terry

I don't think "Top Gun" is anamorphic. It only shows up on the middle of the screen when I watch it with my D1.

fairly new to posting here, been reading for years....just redid my entire setup except the speakers (which will be soon)

my new setup includes a benq pe8700+, da-lite 119" cosmo hcmw, pioneer elite vsx-59txi, denon dvd-3910 & sony sat hd-200.

my main question is i have been switching the dvi back and forth between the dvd & hd on the benq. i am either about the get a dvi switcher or move one the component permanently. which one should it be. i would think the hd only because the dvd does upscaling and the dvi will keep it all in the digital domain.

am i right?

Originally posted by Carl Holt


From Projector Central:

"Lamp: Type: 210W NSH
Life: 2000 hours"


Page 24 of the manual also lists all the warring messages you will get.

Will it cause damage after 2000 hours if you simply reset the lamp timer? Based on the manuals, I'd say yes.




I am a bit confused here. If the lamp life is a fixed 2000 hours is there no truth to all of the tips I am reading on how to extend lamp life? Things such as turning down brightmess.

Originally posted by cmorreale
fairly new to posting here, been reading for years....just redid my entire setup except the speakers (which will be soon)

my new setup includes a benq pe8700+, da-lite 119" cosmo hcmw, pioneer elite vsx-59txi, denon dvd-3910 & sony sat hd-200.

my main question is i have been switching the dvi back and forth between the dvd & hd on the benq. i am either about the get a dvi switcher or move one the component permanently. which one should it be. i would think the hd only because the dvd does upscaling and the dvi will keep it all in the digital domain.

am i right? Get the switch

any switch you recommend?

the gefen 2x1?

a logical choice

:rolleyes: thanks for all the info

Mudslide, as far as I know turning down the brightness will not help on the Benq, because it does not have a "low-contrast" mode like some other projectors. The Benq does not allow you to adjust the actual voltage of the bulb - you can't adjust it to save lamp life. Changing the contrast setting in the service menu or the user menu only affects the modulation of the mirrors (digitally) and will not physically dim the bulb.

(And turning down contrast too much will actually greatly reduce the dynamic range of the image and may cause posterization/banding. <-- Note: I haven't tested this yet...)

any switch you recommend?
You might want to consider getting more than a 2x1 switch in case you add DVI/HDMI sources in the future. At least a 4x1 switch. If you are going to be mounting the switcher in a rack then you really might want to look at some other options. The way the Gefen is configured the DVI cables are mounted on the left and right sides of the unit, instead of the back. The Dtronics and Zektor units route all cables from the back and fit on top of existing components or in a rack. The Zektor unit (5x1) also switches digital audio automatically with the DVI source, nice touch ;) . Pricey, but very nice switcher.

Good Luck

Originally posted by Carl Holt
I don't think "Top Gun" is anamorphic. It only shows up on the middle of the screen when I watch it with my D1.

Carl-

You're right about Top Gun not being anamorphic. Are you suggesting this is the cause of the artifact I'm experiencing on the BENQ. I would hope that displaying non-anamorphic material would be no problem for the projector. It doesn't sound unreasonable to expect the ability to competently display non-anamorphic source material when run through two relatively high end components. Right?

-Terry

Terry,

I have watched various non-anamorphic DVDs on the 8700 and have not seen the artifact you are referring to.

Any suggestions as to what could be causing it? Thanks Gthal.

If you are sending a 720p signal to the 8700 form the Denon it may not be a projector issue as the projector wouldn't need to scale or deinterlace the signal. Maybe your problem is the DVD player? Seems to me that if the projector was having a problem scaling a non-anamorphic DVD and the picture was splitting, that would only occur if the PROJECTOR was doing the scaling. Is there any way you could use a different DVD player to test Top Gun and if it happened again, it would be the projector, if not, probably your Denon.

It's certainly worth a shot. I'll give it a try. Thanks again.

Cilent1-

good point..thanks for the info!:cool:

Nobody has an idea about my problem with the BenQ (jaggedness with DVI from HTPC in 1280 x 720), describe in page 9 ? :)

You'd probably get more information on the HTPC forum, Prostic. Its most likely a computer set up and display issue rather than the projector doing something wrong. It'll display what its sent, you know what i mean? Good luck!

Did anyone check the benq8700's colour wheel for contaminants?

Terry:

The problem I ran into with Top Gun and other non-anamorphic material was not due to the projector, it was the DVD player. I use a Bravo D1 connected to the projector with a DVI cable. The D1 has a problem interpreting non-anamorphic DVD's It reads the DVD as a full screen source with black bars above and below (as if viewed on a 4:3 screen). The result is an image that only fills about 2/3 of the screen. If I use the Zoom feature on the D1 it fills the screen but the image quality suffers.

I also have a Pioneer 45A connected to the projector. This DVD player correctly interprets the DVD and sends an image to the projector that fills the entire 16:9 screen. However since the 45A does not use DVI, it uses component, the image is not much different than the zoomed D1 image.

My thought was that your DVD player may be having some trouble interpreting the non-anamorphic image and is introducing the artifacts.

I had an 8700 for a year and now have an 8700+. With my system I have not seen artifacts from either projector that I can attribute to the projector. It has always been a source issue.

I now have an HD D* receiver (Samsung) also connected. No artifacts from that either. The picture quality from the D* HD stations varies significantly based on the source material. Material recorded in HD is much better than the old movies that HDNet converts to HD and even that is a function of the transfer quality.

IMHO most image issues can be tranced to the source rather than the projector.

Hey guys-
I'm running my 8700+ off of a Denon 5900 via DVI and have been having problems with older DVDs that have not been "optimized for 16:9 displays." For example, I put in a copy of Top Gun yesterday and every once in a while I get what can only be described as what appears to be a scaling issue. The picture breaks in two with with a horizontal line separating the segments. These older DVDs are watched with the BenQ's aspect ration set to Letterbox. Newer DVDs play flawlessly and this is the only quirk I've experienced thus far with my PJ. If anybody has any thoughts, I'd love to hear them. Thanks.
-Terry

Hmmm. Firstly, the one fault of the BenQ is that it's built-in "letterbox zoom" mode really sucks... all sorts of jaggy-scan-line looking artifacts that are NOT there when I use the zoom-mode on my Momitsu DVD player...one of the reasons I bought the Momitsu so I could watch non-anamorphic DVDs (widescreen) and have the better-mastered ones look at least watchable.



<b>lamp question</b>...

The BenQ could do with a tad more brightness. Wondering if a *different* replacement lamp could be purchased other than the one desribed? Does the BenQ use a standard bulb of some kind that's produced by more than one manufacturer? Does anyone else make such a bulb that's any brighter, or that lasts longer? Or that's *cheaper* ?!?

-dave

GrantMeThePower : Thanks for your answer. :)
I tried yesterday Dscaler 5 decoder and now, everything is fine. The picture is wonderful. Might be something wrong in XP registry with VLC and Windvd. :confused:

Now that the battle with my HTPC is finished, i have another problem.
Directly with the BenQ. :(

I have a weird spot in the upper right of my screen, with a source as a dvd or without any source.
It's very strange.
I was so tired yesterday that i didn't verify (by "defocusing") if the reason was a dust behind the lens.

Have you got an idea about that ?

Thanks. :)

Prostic.

Carl:
It stands to reason everything you said. The projector has given me no problems at all save what I mentioned in the above post. I just don't understand how Denon's flagship universal player that cost me just about 2K when I bought it has a problem doing such a basic thing. The only issue that comes to my mind is as you mentioned. The player is having problems talking to my 8700+. When I got the Denon, I couldn't believe all the settings and options you could configure. When I ran it with anamorphic source material the results were breathtaking. So rather than "fix what wasn't broken," I left most of them alone. Maybe it's time whip out the old manual and revisit the 5900's setup menu. There has to be a way to fix this without chucking the player. Thanks everyone for your input.

prostic

i had the same thing, it was dust. benq fixed it in one day.

muncey

Muncey : Thanks for your answer. :)
No possibility by fixing it myself ?

Prostic.

i don't know.
benq service is very good and prompt though.

muncey

David, I recall a thread around here (or the <$3500 forum, I can't remember) about a company that refurbs bulbs. You send in your old bulb, and they replace some parts in the bulb (filament?) and ship it back to you. The price is less than half the cost of a new one.

Unfortunately, I do not know where to find the thread. And from what I remember, none of the people who used the service have a Benq 8700, but supposedly they should be able to do it, as they need your old bulb anyways.

The url you're looking for:

http://www.jopprugroup.com/plamp.htm

That sounds *very* suspicious. Lamps are high-tolerance items manufactured in factories in pressurized environments blah blah blah...had can someone open up a lamp and replace "parts" in their garage?

Hmmmm. Anyone actually know what goes on? Their on-line description was very wanting for technical details about what they're doing...

-dave

I have just plugged in my new 8700+ and am attempting a calibration( colorfacts6500). In "FACTORY" mode , the pj won't let me make changes to "HD ADJ -> RGBHV Format -> R-G-B OFFSET or GAIN"

What am I doing wrong??

What input are you using?

I believe HD ADJ is only for RGBVH and YPbPr connections. If you are using DVI, you need to go into Color Balance and adjust gamma gain (high IREs) and gamma offset (low IREs).

Originally posted by DaViD Boulet
That sounds *very* suspicious. Lamps are high-tolerance items manufactured in factories in pressurized environments blah blah blah...had can someone open up a lamp and replace "parts" in their garage?

Hmmmm. Anyone actually know what goes on? Their on-line description was very wanting for technical details about what they're doing...

-dave

Dave,

There have been several posts from people who have used this rebuild service and all had positive comments. They change the bulb and reuse the reflector assembly. I have not replaced a lamp yet but I will give the rebuild option try when the day comes.

Rich V

I am having a problem with my 8700+

When I change inputs, the bottom right side of the screen has a little gray box that shows the aspect ratio and also which input you are using. This used to shut off automatically after a second or two. Now, it stays on all the time. Is there any way to get it to go off? I'm hoping that there is a way to get it off via pressing a button on the remote or via the user menu or service menu. Hopefully, I hit a remote button accidentally. If you have any idea what I can do to resolve this problem I would GREATLY appreciate your input.

Thanks,
Tom

Hi,
Someone else had the same problem recently. I think the solution was to unplug the Power cord for a while...not so sure though






Regards

Originally posted by Riddick
Hi,
Someone else had the same problem recently. I think the solution was to unplug the Power cord for a while...not so sure though
Regards

Yes, that's the solution. It happened to me once and that solved the problem.

What mode does everyone use?

Anamorphic, Wide, Thro, Letterbox. I am feeding HDTV thru my Directv HD-DVR .

What is the 'thro' button do? My picture gets smaller when I press it and it says 720px60 in the lower right corner. Am I doing something wrong? Because I thought this projector is native 1280x720?

I am confused.

thanks for the help.

I use Anamorphic for all 16:9 mastered HDTV or DVD material and Standard for SD 4:3 material.

The Anamorphic mode will not scale 16:9 mastered material and will give you 0% overscan display on DVI.

Good info, thanks. When u say "0% overscan" do you mean there is no upconversion? Then, why does "thro" give me a smaller image?

Now, I just got to get my DVI working. For some reason on my Directv HD-DVR it says "HDCP not enabled" in the setup. It's really pissing me off.

Dave Boulet re refurbishing PJ lamps.

They do not actually do anything to the lamp itself. What most people consider to be a projector lamp is actually an assembly consisting of a lamp tube mounted within a reflector and sometimes enclosed in a capsule.

What these people are doing is to replace the lamp tube and reuse the reflector assembly. Hopefully they are sealing or re-encapsulating the assembly as needed to return it to factory specs - that I don't know.

We do this on a regular basis in the Civic Centre I work for. We have 575 Watt HMI follow-spots that have a large lamp in a reflector assembly. It costs nearly $600 to replace the assembly. For a small non-profit Civic Centre with several of these devices that can be quite expensive. We can buy the replacement lamp for $200 and mount it back into the old reflector ourselves. The hardest part of the process is making sure the lamp is aligned properly within the reflector. Otherwise you don't get the maximum light output, or you get a dark spot somewhere in the pool of light cast by the device.

I have no doubt these guys can replace the lamp tube in the average projector assembly. The main thing is that they align it properly and replace all protective filters, seals, etc. I know the Benq is supposed to have a "sealed optical path" and I wouldn't want that to be compromised. I am hopefully at least a year away from having to replace my lamp, so I will continue to monitor the experiences of others in this regard.

I had made the adjustments (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=403476) on my BenQ and the result is excellent for DVI input. (Thanks to takisot) On the other hand, with these settings, when I using the component-HD input, colorimetry was disastrous and not natural. Is there anyone which has to carry out a good calibration (with colorfact or others) by using the component-HD input?

Thanks !

To adjust HD component, enter the Service Menu, go down to “HD Adj” and then make changes to the YPbPr values (be sure to first write down the original values). Unless you have a colorimeter, you will have to eyeball it (not very accurate but better than nothing). Here are the notes from the service manual:

SM Default Settings:

Brightness 60
Contrast 76
Saturation 49
Pb offset 60
Pr offset 60


Brightness: A/D converter green offset 0~127
Contrast: A/D converter green gain 0~255
Saturation: A/D converter red and blue gain 0~255
Pb-Offset: A/D converter blue offset 0~127
Pr-Offset: A/D converter red offset 0~127

If you are anywhere near Salt Lake City, let me know and I may be able to calibrate it for you using the OpticOne colorimeter and Accupel signal generator.

I live in Quebec (Canada)!
That is a little far for a calibration ; -)

That is for that which I would have liked to have the settings input component-HD of another user... And there are far too many adjustments so that I do that in the eye!

thanks !

I'm not using the component input. If I get a chance, I will calibrate the component inputs and let you know what I ended up with.

Thank you very much!
That would be very nice of your share!

PS: It is better specify to you than I use BNC component-HD G/Y - B/Pb - R/Pr input.

Hi all
Is there a way BenQ projector can be set up to accept a YUV signal on the BNC input

I unplugged my 8700+ and it corrected the problem.

Thanks,
Tom

Hugh?

The BNC connectors are the only means of providing a progressive-scan input...and will work with YUV component-progressive just fine.

-dave

Does anyone have an opinion as to how the 8700+ compares to the new Sony?

Does either work with low ambient light? Like sconces on low so people don't trip out the door of our light tight basement HT?

After digesting all the info I could on this projector, I am left with a question. I have seen some reviews stating HDTV picture quality to be "good" not excelent. What are your guys thoughts? I currently have my locals from OTA and Dish Network HDPak. The only thing Im going to be watching on this projector would be HD programming and DVDs.

I am located in the Washington/Baltimore region, yet don't really know a place that has this projector setup for viewing. I would also like to compare it with the infocus 7205. Thanks for any help/suggestions!

CinePost,

I've seen the Sony HS51 and I agree with the majority opinion that it is not a bright pj. The BenQ is brighter, although I have found it necessary to use a High Power (higher gain screen) given my 104" wide image. So, if you're planning on some light in your theater, even indirect, be more wary of the Sony. Otherwise, the Sony throws a similar picture to HD2 or HD2+ DLPs I've seen.

A Da-Lite High Power or perhaps a Firehawk screen could limit the effect of low light from sconces.

hokiefan,

Which reviews are you referring to? Most I've read indicate the BenQ does well with HDTV sources, and that's been my experience.

Dan

Has anyone seen these projectors face off. I need to make a decision quik. I saw the 5700 in action and the colors are breathtaking, but the resolution is only 1024x576p. I havent seen the Benq in action so I have nothing to compare the two. Are the colors on the Benq8700+ as good as the 5700.

Mike - I haven't seen the 5700; but, I have spent time with the 7200 (MT8u) and the 7205 and have spent close to 200 hours with my 8700+.

Here's my take on the color balance.

Out of the box the Infocus (or the Toshiba rebrand) is closer to being D65 with good color. The BenQ takes a little work to get its color accurate. If you start with the settings in this very thread - you'll get in the ball park and then be able to calibrate from there.

Overall, I think it's close to being a draw with color. Contrast is no contest, with the 8700+ hands down the winner.

As long as you don't go crazy with screen size (like over 110" without going with a screen with some gain); then the BenQ is hard to beat. If you want 120"ish or don't want any gain, then the Infocus line is great.

Both are going after different audiences.

*The one thing I "miss" on my 8700 is a VGA port. I have to use either RGBHV or DVI for hooking up my PC.

How many of us here turn down the yellow adjustment in the user menu? I find that by turning the yellow down from 17 to 10 gives a somehow better image.

I'm using a SDI iscan HD fed to 8700+ via DVI.

Someone try this please?

Originally posted by drapp1952


hokiefan,

Which reviews are you referring to? Most I've read indicate the BenQ does well with HDTV sources, and that's been my experience.

Dan [/B]


Ok maybe I'm going crazy. I was on projectorcentral today reading reviews and they had an article comparing the 7205, another pj, and the 8700. They stated that the 7205 looked better with hd content. I of course cant find it now, and they dont even have thier 7205 review up anymore??? Wierd.

I'm pretty much sold on the 8700, considering the price. One more question, I will probably be buying from socalelectronics. I've tried to search for any horror stories but cant find any, so I assume they are reputable? :)

hokiefan:

I'm not familiar with the company you mentioned but IMHO the best place to purchase the unit is www.projectorsolution.com. This is where I got my unit. There service is top notch. I unfortunately had a problem with my 8700 when I first got it and again almost a year later. In both cases Projector Solution (formerly Alliant Solution) helped resolve my issue promptly with results beyond what I expected. This is one of the few companies that actually put the customer first.


CinePost:

After a year I have decided that my HT is not light controlled. I have windows with bark shades that let light leak in around the edge. Like you I often leave on the rope lighting around the ceiling when watching HDTV so people do not trip in the dark. I have a 103" Carada classic cinema white screen (close to 0 gain). I have no problem with picture quality. THe only time the light is a problem is when I turn the sconces on full. I put natural white light bulb in the sconces and when they are on all the way is does wash out the screen. Take a tour of my HT using the tag under my name.

My projector seems to show blue on the top and green on the bottom of horizontal lines and it gets progressively worse towards the lower lines. To a lesser extent it also appears on vertical lines. It appears on test patterns from my 1:1 mapped video processor and the internal test patterns.

Does anyone know what could be causing this?

Krobar - you are seeing chromatic abberation. It's a distortion in the lens. A lot of projectors have this issue (I know I've seen it on the 7200 + 7205). The degree of error may vary slightly when you change the zoom on the unit.

So, unless it's extreme - there's nothing you can do other than change the zoom and throw.

I'm probably looking in the 92inch diagonal range. I will have complete control of light.

That depends on what you want in the image...at that size, you can pick anything. Heck, a Da-Lite Matte White might look good to you! If you want the super-bright plasma look, a Da-Lite High Power would be great (and might burn out your retinas - but it would look great - unless you want to keep blacks black).

You can check the Screens forum for some tips.

Currently I am projecting a 65" diagonal image onto a plain matte white screen. One day I'll go bigger...but I love the punchiness of the image! I have nearly 200 hours on the bulb right now...it is a bit dimmer than when it was new, but plasma-bright!

Mike,

At that size you won't need to be as concerned about bulb dimming as your pj ages. Still, you might consider a 1.3-1.4 gain screen such as a Carada Brilliant White or any number of like screens from other companies. If you want to go really bright you could consider a High Power but it is very dependent on viewing angle for appreciable gain, or a quite expensive Vutec Silver Star that's less angle-dependent.

Dan

Stewart FireHawk MicroPerf will get you an actual gain of 1.1, I'd even ask Stewart about the new GrayHawk RS designed in conjunction with Joe Kane.

I want the picture to look as accurate as possible. Should I stick with a white screen with a gain of 1.3? This will be my first projector and screen so I need all the help I can get. Also how far back should I place the projector from the 92inch diagonal screen, I want the image possible.

Mike-
I would only go with a 1.3 gain white screen unless you have dark walls, etc. and complete light control. Speak with Stewart's sales people, they are great at helping recommend a material for a PJ and a specific application.

The 8700's have a short-throw lens so the throw distance will be close to a 1.4-1.5 x 16:9 screen size. But don't rely on that estimate, look in the manual it will give you the range of distance including the zoom. Another great source for calculating your mounting range is projectorcentral.com. Go to the review of the PE8700/+ and select "Projector calculator" put your screen with or diagonal in and you'll the mounting range supported.

Originally posted by Mike Butny
I'm probably looking in the 92inch diagonal range. I will have complete control of light.

Mike,

I am using the Da-Lite Cinema Vision fabric (1.3 gain) and think it is just about perfect in my theatre. I have very good light control and darker walls and I find the color of a white screen to be preferable to a grey screen. With the 8700+, I find black level and contrast to still be very, very good on the 1.3 gain screen as well IMHO.

Does anyone know what might be connected to the YCbCr connection (RCA) vs the YPbPr (BNC)? I know these are colorspace definitions but all I've seen are devices that go into the YPbPr connections. Another definition says these two are interchangeable. So on the Benq 8700, whats the difference?

The YCbCr on RCA is for standard definition NTSC
the Y/Pb/Pr on BNC's is for high definition ATSC

Where would you plug 480i to? Why does Y/Pb/Pr work? Isnt 480i considered standard definition?

Bottom line,

the Y/Cb/CR RCA connection are compatible with component YUV (luminance + 2 color-difference channels) 480 interlaced only.

The BNC connectors will work with component YUV at 480P, 720P, and 1080I as well as full RGB+ timing signals such as you'd have using a break-out VGA cable from a PC source.

-dave

I'm assuming that the 7800 is similar as we have the same connectors as the 8700 but a 7800 owner has the 480i on the BNC and it works..thus my confusion on the real use of the RCA connection.

What HDMI or DVI players are people using with the PE8700+, and can anyone confirm that they are actually sync'ing with the Projector properly? I have the Panasonic S97 connected to the PE8700+ HDMI-DVI. The Projector states that it is receiving 1280x720@60Hz. The DVD player shows the HDMI status as 576p. The picture looks pretty good, but I wonder if it could be better if the DVD player sync'ed properly. Hooked the S97 to my Sony XBR CRT and it properly ID'ed all of the HD modes.

Is the PE8700+ HDCP compliant or not?

I'm using the Momitsu v880 at 720P DVI. I think that's the "usual" solution on the forum. Results are excellent...and the momitsu has a "zoom" button to scale non-anamorphic material to properly fit the screen (with better results than the "letterbox" aspect ratio on the projector itself!).

PAL discs also play flawlessly, though the pop-up menu always states "720P 60Hz" even though in theory the DVD player is putting out a 50Hz signal. I see no motion artifacts when playing PAL discs so I do not think any PAL-NTSC conversion is taking place.

-dave

My BenQ is connected with a DVD player Zenith DVB318.

In 1080i, I have small white lines just out of the top of the picture area and that disturbs me! I thought that it was the player of DVD but one said to me in the FAQ of the DVB318 that it was my projector.

In 720p the small white lines are not there but the quality of the image is better in 1080i...

Can some one how solve this problem ?

Thanks !

Do you run DVI from the Zenith? I tried going 1080I a few times DVI from my momitsu (I think that 720P looks a tad better with the Momitsu) but never noticed any white lines of any kind...

Yes I run DVI From the Zenith. He have the firmwhare for corect the white crush on DVI.

In 720p the picture is excellent...but it seems a little bit better to me in 1080i...If I considere not these cursed small white lines !