Hello Radsman,

Thanks for the report. Another item off the list!

Enjoy the player!

Paul

Great, I was waiting for the DVD+R !!!

Now, where to buy ??? Any B&M carrying it ??

Thanks !

If you live in Southern California you may be able to get it at Ken Crane's, according to reports. Other than that, I have no idea.

Paul

I first off want to start by saying, thanks Paul, You did a great job with this thread and I have decided to buy this DVD player. I put in a order last friday when it was shown unavailable from ONECALL. I have been anticipating a email saying they have more in and that I was going to be in the first batch of people that get it. I got to impatient and decided to shoot them an email today asking about the availabiliy. This was there response...

"We will have more here on Friday or Monday and will be able to fill
all of our current orders and still have some left over. "

So for all of you that are looking to get one of these like myself, here is your chance.

I hope this was helpful, and keep up the good work, I will be posting my opinion of this player when I get it...

I first off want to start by saying, thanks Paul, You did a great job with this thread and I have decided to buy this DVD player. I put in a order last Friday when it was shown unavailable from ONECALL. I have been anticipating a email saying they have more in and that I was going to be in the first batch of people that get it. I got to impatient and decided to shoot them an email today asking about the availability. This was there response...

"We will have more here on Friday or Monday and will be able to fill
all of our current orders and still have some left over. "

So for all of you that are looking to get one of these like myself, here is your chance.

I hope this was helpful, and keep up the good work, I will be posting my opinion of this player when I get it...

Good to hear about onecall !!

I'll check Ultimate Eletrocnics tomorrow...

Thanks

steeevoboy,

You're welcome! Enjoy the player.

I'm in the process of trying to figure out a method to improve my picture taking so that the quality can really be captured by the camera.

Paul

I tried two DVD+Rs too and they worked just fine.

Originally posted by steeevoboy
This was there response...

"We will have more here on Friday or Monday and will be able to fill
all of our current orders and still have some left over. "

So for all of you that are looking to get one of these like myself, here is your chance.


That is great news! I called today to find out if they had any status and they told me that they finally had a definite date, Dec 1. I guess that the word hasn't been passed around to the folks on the phones.

I just ordered a S97S direct from Panasonic.com and their price is $299.95. Shipping is free but they add tax to the order. For me this was $22.98 for a grand total of $322.93. Their estimated shippind date is on or before 11/22.

Here's an update!

I received an email from Panasonic that my S97S has a back order date of 11/8! That's only a week! Woo Hoo

Good luck on those purchases!

Just an FYI: The matching, HDMI-equipped, Panasonic SA-XR70 receiver is scheduled to go on sale in Japan on Dec. 1. If past history hold up, that means the receivers should be available in the USA around Dec. 15. Six weeks and counting!

Paul

I recently checked the firmware version of my player. It is 85E528.

After connecting the DVD-S97 to my Samsung 22" LCD TV, I am quite pleased with the player. I used a HDMI to DVI cable and upconverted to 720p, but in some way, I see little difference from that and 480p component. My LCD TV has a native resolution of 720p.

That is all I can say for now.

Paul,

Sorry that was a couple of days ago & I can't remember the exact sites, but one was in Canada and the other was in England, plus a couple of other US ones.

The evil Gollum from "The Return of the King" via HDMI-DVI 720p:

http://www.onesimos.com/gollum-720pHDMI.jpg


Remote controls for the DVD-RP82 (black) and DVD-S97S (gray):

http://www.onesimos.com/remote-controls.jpg

How do you go about programming open/close on an universal remote?

My firmware is also 85E528.

hey, not to make this post more complicated, but it'd be supercool if y'all could have a consistent format when posting comments. Namely, I'd think that including TV model and type (CRT, CRT RPTV, DLP RPTV, Plasma, LCD, CRT/LCD/DLP front projector, etc.) , DVD source, and whether you are using DVI or HDMI connection to your set would help us poor folks to better make up our minds on this set.

thoughts?

I have remotes here you can compare. There are for of them with the first two provided here. The other two are on the next post.

You'll see why the DVD-RP91's remote is one of the best out of all! =)

Here is the other pic.

Can you find out which one is RP91's? I also the the DVD-A470EN's remote and it looks very idential to the RP9's except for some subtle differences(remote not shown).

Certainly this player seems to be a worth achievement but...

How can the Macroblocking problem be considered acceptable?

Is there any response from Faroudja? This is hardly the first player to have a problem with the 23XX chip line. What gives?

OK, I feel like a dunce. I have tried for several days now at home and at work to place an order on Panasonic's website. Each time it takes me from the first info screen, says it is calculating my order, and returns me to the same first info screen. I never get farther than that. Someone a few posts back said they ordered from Panasonic. Any advice on why I can't get an order through?

Originally posted by steeevoboy

"We will have more here on Friday or Monday and will be able to fill
all of our current orders and still have some left over. "



steeevoboy,

Great news. I preordered last friday as well but have been looking everywhere I could to see if I could find the player sooner (was expecting thanksgiving timeframe). Given One Call's price, I am pretty content to wait a week for the player.

Originally posted by ricksm3
OK, I feel like a dunce. I have tried for several days now at home and at work to place an order on Panasonic's website. Each time it takes me from the first info screen, says it is calculating my order, and returns me to the same first info screen. I never get farther than that. Someone a few posts back said they ordered from Panasonic. Any advice on why I can't get an order through?

Their site had that issue a few days back. Now its fixed, ever since they had the text saying "Available in 3 week". Try ordering now. Will work.

Originally posted by mallu2u
Their site had that issue a few days back. Now its fixed, ever since they had the text saying "Available in 3 week". Try ordering now. Will work.

I did. About 20 minutes ago. Same problem.

yes rick. u are right. they website is not allowing to place orders again. I tried that abt 3 days back and was able to. (but did not place the order). Maybe they dont want to take orders right now!

Low IRE gray/pink: It is noted that HDMI->HDMI seems to introduce a slight "pinkish" cast to gray. It can be seen with 10IRE field on Avia disc.


Have you been able to adjust this out?

Originally posted by AkaStp
Ultimate Electronics are supposedly getting their first batch in later this week with more to follow later in the month. They apparently have plenty not yet spoken for.

The price in their computer was pretty high though (close to original MSRP on Panasonic's site). Maybe it will come down.

I have been following comments on the new Panny playere and the new Sony player. My conclusion: New Sony seems to have less problems and built as well and about the same price. I am thinking the PQ will be about the same on both players. Of course, your conclusion may be different than mine which probably proves either player is acceptable.

Originally posted by npc2396
Low IRE gray/pink: It is noted that HDMI->HDMI seems to introduce a slight "pinkish" cast to gray. It can be seen with 10IRE field on Avia disc.


Have you been able to adjust this out?

Yes, but I want to see some other reports. I think it is related to the marcroblocking. During the evaluation around that time (while looking at macroblocking), I had the color turned *way* up. Turning the color back to correct levels eliminated or hid the problem. Thus, the "Macroblock Survival Kit" notation concerning the critical adjustment of color -- and not to boost it.

Paul

Originally posted by ToddMcF2002
Certainly this player seems to be a worth achievement but...

How can the Macroblocking problem be considered acceptable?

Is there any response from Faroudja? This is hardly the first player to have a problem with the 23XX chip line. What gives?

Now that I've had this player for 3 days and have played around with a bit, the macroblocking issue is really a non-issue for my set up. The reason I say that is because I have only noticed it on one of the DVDs I own (Toy Story2). I am beginning to believe it is more content and MPEG compression implementation than anything else. Just last night, I put Shrek on and not a hint of macroblocking.

My sense is that this is a tradeoff issue between picture scaling quality and compression. In other words, may be, there is relationship between how well MPEG decoder is implemented with Faroudja chipset on the overall image quality - especially macroblocking. Clearly DVD content compression differs based on just how much "stuff" the producers want to put on a single disk (yes I know there are limits).

So the responsibility of fixing this lies with whom? DVD makers? Faroudja? Player mfg who implement the chipset?

I am not an electrical engineer, so this may be really off base but I can't help but to think that this is a tradeoff between overal PQ and occausional macroblocking that may be considered negligible...

Originally posted by ToddMcF2002
Certainly this player seems to be a worth achievement but...

How can the Macroblocking problem be considered acceptable?

Is there any response from Faroudja? This is hardly the first player to have a problem with the 23XX chip line. What gives?

Hello Todd,

All consumer video products have defects. All consumer DVD players, regardless of price has video defects -- including yours - that people are willing to accept in a tradeoff for other benefits.

For example, some people find a single bad pixel in a flat panel acceptable, others find it unacceptable. Different threshold points for different people. Obviously macroblocking is a threshhold point for some people. The macroblocking has been reported in this thread since the first evaluations. A picture has been posted. Some workarounds have been presented. It's up to the purchaser to determine whether or not the macroblocking is acceptable.

Remember when jagged lines with waving flags was the "hot topic". Some players *still* don't get it right. Remember CUE? Still around. Pass Blacker than Black? White Crush? Does the 'S97 have these problems. Nope. There's a lot to admire with this player and room for a little improvement.

I have written a letter to Genesis reporting the problem for the FLI23xx series. A response is being awaited -- if it ever comes.

Paul

In reguards to the firmware being reported as 85E528.....

How do you get it to display on the S97?

Paul,
Are you in the DFW metroplex? If so, do you know about the DFW hometheater forum? There's not much going on in this forum, but we do get together sometime to compare projectors, DVD players ,etc..
With your knowledge, I'd love if you could join us sometime. Thanks.
http://dhtg.napurano.com/forum/

Hello tvuong,

I'm not in the DFW metroplex, instead I'm way down in Austin!

Paul

Originally posted by badabing
In reguards to the firmware being reported as 85E528.....

How do you get it to display on the S97?

Badabing:

(as posted by Sango):

"To perform version check. Press and hold on unit "PAUSE" + "OPEN" and press 7 on remote. The full version will be displayed on the LCD read out and the last 3 numbers on the right is the version number."

The info, slightly revised (no LCD readout!) is now in the "MISC" section.
Thanks Sango!

Paul

Originally posted by mangopony
I have been following comments on the new Panny playere and the new Sony player. My conclusion: New Sony seems to have less problems and built as well and about the same price. I am thinking the PQ will be about the same on both players. Of course, your conclusion may be different than mine which probably proves either player is acceptable.


Well, a head to head shootout should give us an objective answer to this. Any takers??

I'd do a comparison if a DVP-NS975V would show up at a B&M in Austin.

I'm not sure how mangopony reached the conclusion. I haven't seen any DVP-NS975V reporting at nearly the depth of the DVD-S97. Personally, I think there are remarkably few problems with 'S97 - video-wise and operationally. Time will tell.

As for the DVP-NS975V there have been some rumblings about passing BTB via the HDMI and some sort of sound issue but I haven't followed those too closely.

Paul

Anyone seen any evidence of a black model on tap? I haven't seen any, but since Panasonic saw a need to add an "S" to the model number to denote silver, I'm hoping that implies that a "DVD-S97K" will be coming.

silvertone: And the next question becomes: Is either one noticeably better on 'problems' and PQ than my 3-4 year old Sony ns700p? I believe I have a very good picture and never one problem during this time. I believe some people try to hard (spending to much money) to try to make 480I look like 1080I. But that is certainly their right.

Originally posted by Paul Bigelow
I'd do it if a DVP-S975V would show up at a B&M in Austin.

Paul
Is there an Ultimate Electronic(UE) in Austin? I saw the Sony S975V and the Denon 1910 at my local UE yesterday. Too bad they don't have the S97, and none of their saleman know anything about this player.

By the way, Paul, thank you for all the valuable information you have set forth here. I am sure it is appreciated by everyone.

Originally posted by mangopony
silvertone: And the next question becomes: Is either one noticeably better on 'problems' and PQ than my 3-4 year old Sony ns700p? I believe I have a very good picture and never one problem during this time. I believe some people try to hard (spending to much money) to try to make 480I look like 1080I. But that is certainly their right.

Indeed it is, during this special day.

We have the Sony player number. Here's what's right and what's wrong with it:

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-bin/shootout.cgi?function=search&articles=all&type=&manufacturer=5&maxprice=0&deInt=0&mpeg=0#SonyNS700P

All in all, it probably is a decent player, but as can be seen with the critical testing, it's far from perfect as well. A lot of people these days would have a problem with the reported CUE. We'll see how the 'S97 fares sometime in the future.

Paul

tuong,

Yes there is. I keep calling and they keep saying it is unavailable. I'll check again.

Paul

"Hello tvuong,

I'm not in the DFW metroplex, instead I'm way down in Austin!

Paul"

Austin is a nice city, where I live too !!!

Originally posted by mangopony
silvertone: And the next question becomes: Is either one noticeably better on 'problems' and PQ than my 3-4 year old Sony ns700p? I believe I have a very good picture and never one problem during this time. I believe some people try to hard (spending to much money) to try to make 480I look like 1080I. But that is certainly their right.

The following is a direct quote from the Secrets site about this particular player:

"Video quality was quite good. Unfortunately, this player has the chroma bug. It's not as bad as some, but it's there and quite noticeable on certain material. One feature that was missing that some people are interested in is aspect ratio control. The Sony DVPS9000ES offered the ability to windowbox 4:3 material, but we were unable to find this feature on the NS700P.

All in all, this is a very fine player, marred only by a tendency to stay in video mode a little long, and the chroma bug. If the chroma bug isn't an issue for you, we'd certainly rank this player well above average for its price point"

Oh boy, "Gunfight at the OK Corral" coming up.

In the words of Samuel L. Jackson in "Jurassic Park": "Hold on to your butts."

Thanks tvuong!

Paul

Will be comparing with a DVP-NS975V. Have created a place holder for FAQ/Brain Dump. All of this will depend upon whether or not the Sony exhibits the 1080i jitter at HDMI as seen with the Denon DVD-1910. If there isn't an immediate "deal-breaker", I'll proceed with the work.

Paul

"480i via HDMI: Not Available, cannot configure"

Newbie here....

What this does mean ? Is it if I try to watch a non anamorphic dvd using HDMI ??

Thanks !!

Originally posted by mecl
"480i via HDMI: Not Available, cannot configure"

Newbie here....

What this does mean ? Is it if I try to watch a non anamorphic dvd using HDMI ??

Thanks !!

480i HDMI/DVI would be a preferred output if you were going to feed the player thru a higher quality external scaler, then onto the display. That way the high quality external scaler would be doing ALL of the heavy lifting.

In this regard, many folks still argue 480i SDI is the best way to go.

At some point, I hope someone can make a definitive comparison of a 480i HDMI/DVI signal externally scaled, with a HMDI/DVI 720p/1080i sent directly to the monitor.

IMHO, we are getting very close to the point where the internal processing of the upscaling player, is catching up with external processing. Particular in a "best bang for the buck" type of comparison.

Originally posted by AkaStp
They told me $279 which is a $20 discount. To be honest, given its newness and the fact that demand is high, I'm surprised there is any discount at all available right now. The cost of being an early adopter. ;)

Which place gave you that price AkaStp? Sorry I got a bit out of the loop! =)

Thanks

Sango

Sango: ultimate Electronics

Originally posted by Bytehoven
At some point, I hope someone can make a definitive comparison of a 480i HDMI/DVI signal externally scaled, with a HMDI/DVI 720p/1080i sent directly to the monitor.

You might suggest a way to make this type of comparison "definitive". Otherwise, I would expect the quality (or at least characteristics) of the display to induce an influence on this type of test. And, the end result would be -- less than "definitive", wouldn't it?

gp

P.S. I agree with your comment regarding the closing gap between external processor and scalers.

Originally posted by mallu2u
Sango: ultimate Electronics

At the end of last week, UE in Hurst told me that they were getting them on 11/3 and the price was $383.95. This info was in their computer.

YMMV. Who knows though.

I just ordered this player off OneCall and they said they were getting a shipment in first thing next week and it would go out then. Considering I am not buying a TV until next month, I am cool with the cheap price (~30 off MSRP after shipping). Does anyone think I am not smart in getting a DVD player before a TV? I am tentatively planning on the Toshiba DLP 52HMX94. Anyone see any glaring problem with this combo? Thank you for all the expert advice.

Something to add:

It is noticed that there is video output at the component jacks when HDMI is connected and enabled (the component is *not* upconverted).

Paul

Paul - for the last time, running HDMI to a HDTV and running optical/coax out to a receiver is perfectly cool for getting DTS ES, DD EX, et.c etc. etc. etc., right? Just turn audio off of HDMI and things are peachy, correct?

Can someone open their DVD-S97 and tell us the model number of the MEI MPEG decoder?

Thanks

Sango

Originally posted by Lodey
Paul - for the last time, running HDMI to a HDTV and running optical/coax out to a receiver is perfectly cool for getting DTS ES, DD EX, et.c etc. etc. etc., right? Just turn audio off of HDMI and things are peachy, correct?

The answer is absolutely YES. My set up is exactly what you are asking. HDMI to monitor/tv, optical out to AV receiver. Plays DD PL-IIx, DTS/ES and what ever is encoded as the sound track as long as your AV receiver can decode the signal. Once you go out to optical/coax, you bypass any audio DAC from the DVD player. If you're interested in the DVD-A, well, your stuck with plugging in RCA cables to AV receiver with 5.1 input or straight to speakers.

Since HDMI sends audio, I did turn off the audio for HDMI (not sure if it makes a difference actually).

Hope this helps - I just happen to read this post and thought Iwould give Paul's fingers a break... He's also taken on a similar role for the Sony player.

Competition is name of game. If Sony new player is less than $300, it seems to me, the new Panasonic has to be priced at that level as well.

mgkg3 - THANK YOU SO MUCH!
Order is placed... waiting to enjoy... I have a 2000 Sony player with 480i - not sure what to expect going from that to this player on a new HDTV.

just picked up the last s97 from Ken Cranes in Huntington Beach. Sales Guys just opened box to display new player when I arrived...even gave me a 10 dollar discount for it being just opened! Sweet! Can't wait to see the results on the new toy.

I'm unhappy. Panasonic messed up. The MSRP IS $399 and Ultimate Electronics are selling it for $383 where I live :(

WilliamG: There are other good players for less than $300.

I own a Panny XP30, but am very interested in the upconversion and for a second player. I'm going to still pick it up and test it on my Panasonic Plasma tonight to see if the macroblocking is obvious.

Hmmm, that's weird... OneCall just sold it to me over the phone for (MSRP less $125 than your UE price of $383)

WilliamG

I've got an email confirmation and ship date from Panasonic for $299 + tax. Their site originally had a $399 MSRP but they have changed this to $299. During that time, I believe there were problems trying to order the player because of the mess-up in their price calculator.

Originally posted by keyman
WilliamG

I've got an email confirmation and ship date from Panasonic for $299 + tax. Their site originally had a $399 MSRP but they have changed this to $299. During that time, I believe there were problems trying to order the player because of the mess-up in their price calculator.

Panasonic I think had it mispriced, unless it's NOW mispriced at $399 on their website.

Originally posted by WilliamG
Panasonic I think had it mispriced, unless it's NOW mispriced at $399 on their website.


Add to cart, and the price goes from $399 to $299.

It looks like Pansonic did fix the price and then now it's messed up again lol!

Well I brought the player home from Ultimate. What is interesting is that the macroblocking is definitely definitely there. In 1080i mode, even the Panasonic splash screen is macroblocking mayhem. Oddly, it's nowhere NEAR as bad as the Zenith DVB318 with this issue, but still not enough for me to keep it over my XP30 :(

Yep this player is going back. If you have Monsters Inc, here's a good test of nasty macroblocking for you.

Skip to chapter 11, and right at the start of chapter 11 the camera pans back and you can see the floor where Sully is walking. NASTY. XP30 has none of this nasty artifacting.

Oh well! I've yet to see a player with as good a PQ as the XP30. Guess I'm sticking to it!

Ach! Really? Hmmmm - never seen macroblocking... hope I am not disappointed.

WilliamG, the RP82 would be that match he he he!

Just curious, what setup to you have which you used the S97 on?

Hnmm I wonder if someone can take a digital picture of the macroblocking of the DVD-S97 to see how it is.

Macroblocking can appear as a 'residual image' type thing, especially on strong colours such as all green, or all black screens. You'll notice it really easily in animation, and on fading in or fading out shots. Really ugly. There's a picture on the first page of this thread of it.

I was running the S97 on my Panasonic 42PD25UP via HDMI. That's a 42" ED Plasma. I'm not going to argue whether running a scaled 1080i image is better than running 480p on my plasma, since I've seen for a fact that 1080i is a little sharper.

Also, the RP82 is the same as the XP30, except the RP82 has DVD-Audio capability. The video quality is exactly the same between the two units, and it's the video quality that is the most important to me. I couldn't care about ANY other feature! I'm just absolutely amazed that these major companies can't get the macroblocking GONE!

S97 via HDMI to the xs955. Eevrything looks great but I cannot tell the differnce between 480 760 and 1080i...albeit my viewing time for each resoultion was a few seconds. I setup the s97 on all 3 modes and couldn't tell much of a diff. I then checked the sony manual to see if the TV had to be set to those resolutions as well but could not find anything....Does anyone know if the xs955 auto detects the source material or is there a setting somewhere. Any info would be appreciated. The picture looks stunning but I just want to be certain if it can look better...

Thanks in Advance.

Sango,

There is a picture of macroblocking on the first post.

Paul

I am interested in the answer to Swansongs question also if anyone has an answer for it, I will also be using the s97 on a 955, and swan, you say it does look good via HDMI?
Oh, and are you running the HDMI to the tv, and then an optic out to your receiver?

I am not currenlty using a receiver...Audi is coming from the TV via the HDMI connection. The 2 movies I have tested so far are Monsters INC. and Empore Strikes back.

Another reason why I might not be seeing a difference is that the TV is somehow upscaling the signal from the DVD player when it's set at 480p?

Thanks Paul,

So those fuzzy things I'm seeing is the macroblock.
-------
WilliamG,

A super minor difference between XP30/50 and RP82. RP82 has 2ns Y/C delay while XP30/50 saids it's less than 5 !!

Originally posted by Sango
Thanks Paul,

So those fuzzy things I'm seeing is the macroblock.
-------
WilliamG,

A super minor difference between XP30/50 and RP82. RP82 has 2ns Y/C delay while XP30/50 saids it's less than 5 !!

This is true, but is not anything an end user would notice, ever. Even the DVD Secrets shootout say the same thing. I can't see any difference between the 2 players.

Macroblocking however...I can see a mile away. I can't see any justification for this player or the DVB318 Zenith until Genesis fix their currently rubbish Faroudja chip generation.

I wish I could get the unit but not at this point in time because I do want to see for myself when hooking it to my Hitachi RPTV (57TWX20B).

As far as PQ goes ignoring macroblocking, does the colors look more full than the XP30?

In reguards to Faroudja, will have to wait for a FLI24XX then. Possibly Panasonic will have a DVD-S100 then ! =)

Thanks

Sango,

Correct. As stated in the description, the background in this fade-in should look virtually smooth with a hint of grain if one looks close up. In this case, the blocks form, and appear to "dance around" a bit as the picture fades in. The whole process in this case is just a second or so. In other cases with prolonged dim scenes, dim color scenes, or scenes with large patches of almost solid color the issue can be seen for longer periods of time. The "Survival Kit" posting on the first place explains what can be done to help alleviate or hide the macroblocking.

Paul

Originally posted by Sango
I wish I could get the unit but not at this point in time because I do want to see for myself when hooking it to my Hitachi RPTV (57TWX20B).

As far as PQ goes ignoring macroblocking, does the colors look more full than the XP30?

In reguards to Faroudja, will have to wait for a FLI24XX then. Possibly Panasonic will have a DVD-S100 then ! =)

Thanks


I can't honestly say the S97 looks any better than the XP30, but then again the macroblocking is leading me to a biased response. The PQ IS good, but the MB is just so crazy ugly that it wouldn't even matter to me if the PQ was better aside from that. It's very very distracting.

ok now that I've had the chance to view each mode for about 15 minutes each...I noticed there was a subtle differnce at about 6ft from the screeen. When I stepped back about 12 feet or so and tested again...the difference was not subtle....1080i looked crisper than 480p. I still don't think the difference is a huge one...perhaps someone more adept at tuning their TV can spot a bigger difference or perhaps my eyes aren't very picky at all....With all that said though..the image is truly stunning...The Empire Strikes Back almost looks like HD on some scenes. The transfer was done so well on this DVD, I can't belive this movie is 20+ Years Old.

For $289 I think I did pretty well with this player. Thanks to everyoen on this thread that contributed...

I think we can accurately assume that the Panny S97 is NOT a better DVD video reproduction unit than the Panny XP-30/50 or RP82. I would be flabbergasted if it was. Kris Deering will tell and I will guarantee he will rate the S97 below those.

Browsing player's manual, I've found several interesting settings. Paul, could you please comment, have you use them and what was an effect:

1) TV Type (Select to suit the type of television). Possible options: Standard (Direct View TV), CRT Projector, LCD TV/Projector, Projection TV, Plasma TV. Does this setting affects the picture?

2) HDMI RGB Range. Options: Standard, Enhanced: When the black and white images are not distinct. Does it switches from PC to Video range?

3) There are three types of video filters: Depth Enhancer, MPEG DNR and 3D-NR. You've said that 3D-NR reduses MB somewhat; have you tried the rest?

Thanks!

Question: Why didn't Panasonic 'improve' upon the xp-30 and reintroduce that fine player?

Macroblocking question:

It looks like most of these tests are being done at 1080i. Are the same results true if this (or others with the 2310) are used at 720p?

Thanks.

This macroblocking stuff is starting to freak me out. With OneCall supposed to be sending me my S97 next week, I am getting concerned that I might regret buying this unit from an internet store that doesn't allow the return of opened boxes. I am getting this unit rather than getting a non-upconverting DVR, which would cost about the same thing. I sure hope this unit produces a better PQ and the macroblocking doesn't make me regret my jumping on the S97 bandwagon.

I ordered from Sound Center in Mississippi, which Panasonic directed me to. They shipped it yesterday and apparently have units on hand. They are the largest ditributor of Panasonic products in the US. I have no connection with them, Don't know if I'm allowed to post their number, but if it gets deleted you can call Panasonic and ask.
Sound City's number is 800-530-7227; many times it busy.

Price was $277 plus shipping. Thought this might help some of us East Coasters who've been shut out.

MB is a total dealbreaker for me. Why is it so hard to get an upconverting player that works correctly? I think maybe we should all carefully consider upconverting as a fad and accept that it's not able to tide us over to HD-DVD.

Originally posted by jayrader
MB is a total dealbreaker for me. Why is it so hard to get an upconverting player that works correctly? I think maybe we should all carefully consider upconverting as a fad and accept that it's not able to tide us over to HD-DVD.

The problem is clearly the Faroudja chip. There appears to be a few choices: 1) go with the new upscaling Sony that uses a different chip (although one post claimed the Sony has CUE problems, and that the Panasonic PQ overall was better than the Sony), 2) skip these upscaling players, or 3) go with the Denon 3910 (or possibly the 2910), which has reduced the MB problem dramatically (especially at 720p), the Pioneer Elite 59ai, or the new Onkyo or Integra.

Is it confirmed that the S97 has less macroblocking than the Denon 3910/2910?

Originally posted by BillP
The problem is clearly the Faroudja chip. .... 3) go with the Denon 3910 (or possibly the 2910), which has reduced the MB problem dramatically (especially at 720p) ...


I have read the same elsewhere, but if Denon is able to reduce this problem using the same Faroujda chip, why can't (or haven't) others? (Panasonic)

Or for that matter, has enough testing been done on the Panasonic at 720p to tell if they have done the same improvement or not?

Upconverting is for those displays that can actually benefit from the process. My Panasonic TC-22LH1 does a mediocre job of scaling 480i/p signals to the display's native rate -- stairstepping and jagged edges are the result. However, when fed with a 1080i signal, the picture is smooth and free of the problem. So, it make sense for me to feed 1080i every, single time into the TV. With amongst the present upconverting DVD players the 1080i signal can result in macroblocking, green depression, lack of detail, CUE, mediocre deinterlacing, and any of the other numerous DVD core/deinterlacing issues. Compare that to DVD XP30/50 players which are, without a doubt, special and produce some of the finest 480i/p signals available in a price that is "consumer friendly".

In my case, because of the display, there's a choice to be made:

XP50: Continuous stairstepping and jagged diagonal lines at 480i/p and there is no way around it. Visible in everything. Can not reduce the effect one bit. This effect will happen with *every* 480i/p source.

DVD-S97: Macroblocking at 1080i. The effect can be minimized with careful adjustment.

V880: Less detail and mediocre deinterlacer at 1080i. Can't improve these problems.

DVP-NS975V: CUE and "green depression" at 1080i. Can't fix CUE and "green depression" can be helped a bit by increasing the color (at the expense of red/blue accuracy)

So, in my case, even with one of the very best players in the world (XP50) there is a serious issue it can't address. The problem isn't the XP50's fault but is something the DVD-S97 can overcome.

In the end, it may be that the upconverting players aren't for everyone. In my case, however, it's a necessity.

Paul

Miach,

I well I think that the MPEG decoder has to be re-written. Most likely Denon re-written their's the firmware update. Panasonic might have an update but at this point in time it's unknown.

Sango

Sorry if this pulls off topic a bit, but I want your opinion Paul and anyone else.

I think the picture on the Sammy HD841 actually is very dang good. Based on that and the probs that that machine supposedly had and the fact that I am NOT a videophile but just know what appears to look good to my eye...would you recommend the Panny s97 or not? Given of course the problems noted such as MB, which I wonder I will ever see if I don't particularly see anything wrong with the 841. I have 2 weeks to return the 841 to BB.

Can one of you very informed AVS members tell me if you think this DVD player would be a good fit for the Toshiba DLP 52HMX94?

- Texas Intruments HD2+ "Mustang" DLP chip (1280 x 720 pixels)
- PixelPure digital video processing (upconverts all video signals to 720p)

Even I am curious whether Panny S97 would be recommended over Sony 975 or not?

Originally posted by Sango
Is it confirmed that the S97 has less macroblocking than the Denon 3910/2910?

No, based on Kris Deering's report on the 3910, I bet the 3910 has less MB than the S97, especially at 720p.

I haven't had a chance to view many DVDs on my new player until last night. Watched two (embarrassingly dumb) movies back-to-back ("White Chicks" and "Garfield") and both looked terrific on my 50" Sammy HLP set. I have VOOM and the DVD signal looked almost as good as the best HD signals. Can't say much for the movies, but I'm very happy with this player so far.

Haven't yet hooked the audio output to the 5.1 input channels on my Yamaha receiver, so I can't yet comment on anything other than the audio over the HDMI connection, which sounded pretty good.

Originally posted by lancestorm
I think the picture on the Sammy HD841 actually is very dang good. Based on that and the probs that that machine supposedly had and the fact that I am NOT a videophile but just know what appears to look good to my eye...would you recommend the Panny s97 or not? Given of course the problems noted such as MB, which I wonder I will ever see if I don't particularly see anything wrong with the 841. I have 2 weeks to return the 841 to BB.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it. If you're happy with the 841, just enjoy.

Originally posted by ahro
I ordered from Sound Center in Mississippi, which Panasonic directed me to. They shipped it yesterday and apparently have units on hand. They are the largest ditributor of Panasonic products in the US. I have no connection with them, Don't know if I'm allowed to post their number, but if it gets deleted you can call Panasonic and ask.
Sound City's number is 800-530-7227; many times it busy.

Price was $277 plus shipping. Thought this might help some of us East Coasters who've been shut out.

Wow. That was easy. Never heard of these folks before but I went with it based on the referral from Panasonic. Said I should get it in 2-3 days. For what it's worth, I called One Call to follow up on my order to see what they say about delivery and if the next batch will cover their orders. I was told they will be getting 200 - 250 in early December. They weren't sure how many pending orders.

Originally posted by Lodey
Can one of you very informed AVS members tell me if you think this DVD player would be a good fit for the Toshiba DLP 52HMX94?

- Texas Intruments HD2+ "Mustang" DLP chip (1280 x 720 pixels)
- PixelPure digital video processing (upconverts all video signals to 720p)

Lodey,

I don't know. I don't have any projection display.

Paul

Originally posted by ricksm3
Wow. That was easy. Never heard of these folks before but I went with it based on the referral from Panasonic. Said I should get it in 2-3 days. For what it's worth, I called One Call to follow up on my order to see what they say about delivery and if the next batch will cover their orders. I was told they will be getting 200 - 250 in early December. They weren't sure how many pending orders.

Any idea what their return policy is? I am on the OneCall order list but if this place allows a 30 day return for a full refund I would gladly pay a little extra.

Originally posted by EricScott
Any idea what their return policy is? I am on the OneCall order list but if this place allows a 30 day return for a full refund I would gladly pay a little extra.

Duh!. No, I don't. I was so surprised to find someone who said they could lay one in my lap in a couple days I just went ahead and ordered it without asking this rather relevant question. Guess I'm trusting Panasonic and the primarily positive reviews here.

Maybe ahro knows since he ordered from there before I did.

Originally posted by ricksm3
Duh!. No, I don't. I was so surprised to find someone who said they could lay one in my lap in a couple days I just went ahead and ordered it without asking this rather relevant question. Guess I'm trusting Panasonic and the primarily positive reviews here.

Maybe ahro knows since he ordered from there before I did.

Been there, done that :)

I'm sure the player will be fine - I'm pretty confident b/c the chances of me paying a 15% restocking fee and return shipping are pretty slim unless I'm really unhappy. But having options is always better than not.

If anyone knows this place's return policy that would be helpful. Also is there a website. I googled it and came up with nothing.

Folks, I have no idea who you spoke to here, but I'll have units in the next couple of days. Sorry for the confusion.

Jason

OneCall return policy:

http://ww1.onecall.com/Policies.mpt?Pos=122&L_TK=5_4_0_263_0_0_0_0_0_0

I have the new Panasonic 53" rear projection 53X54 with HDMI. I know that there are questions about whether a player like the S97 would make a big enough difference for a non digital television, but I haven't heard any answers. Anybody out there with some first hand experience? I did just return the Denon 1910 because of MB and Green tint. Just looking for the best possible picture without being annoyed by too much MB, slight MB I may be able to deal with if the picture is that much better, but if it isn't what do you guys suggest for a player?

Originally posted by JKA/V
Folks, I have no idea who you spoke to here, but I'll have units in the next couple of days. Sorry for the confusion.

Jason

Well, that sux. If I had known that, I would have just waited. Thought I had plenty of time to see if it actually arrives from Mississippi before canceling my other order. I don't need two!

EricScott,
The OneCall return policy is worse than just the 15% and return shipping if the box is open. Basically, if you open the box, there is no return. The return charges are if you have not opened the box. Therefore, if you try it out and don't like it, tough luck. I must say that I am very pleased to have found OneCall. They are a pleasure to work with so far, but the return policy sucks.

My opinion. A dvd in 480I looks very good to me. But almost no one seems to be satisfied with this. I really wonder why. I view my DVDs over a simple Sony DVD player and the picture looks great on the Panasonic 7UY plasma. I have a great sound system to go along with picture. I prefer stereo by the way.

Some people enjoy new hardware like some people like new ties. Is a new one of either *truly* necessary? Probably not, but some people (including me) pursue our hobby of electronic hardware vigorously. Other people do not.

I'm glad you like stereo. I have a very nice old vacuum tube stereo that doesn't give me any problems and sound glorious -- why would people ever want solid state?

IMHO

Paul

Ken Crane's has the player in stock at their Los Angeles store.

Originally posted by ricksm3
Duh!. No, I don't. I was so surprised to find someone who said they could lay one in my lap in a couple days I just went ahead and ordered it without asking this rather relevant question. Guess I'm trusting Panasonic and the primarily positive reviews here.

Maybe ahro knows since he ordered from there before I did.

No, Ahro doesn't know. I'm just as "dumb":p as you and didn't ask the question because I was so delighted they actually had some on hand and could ship the same day. I guess we'll find out

Interior pic, zoomed

Interior pic zoomed, chip1

Interior pic of the chip#2

Thanks JKA/V!

Paul

Interior pic chip#3

Interior pic chip#4

Jason, I sent you a PM about the camera you're using.

BTW, it looks like the production date on the Genesis chip is 0416 -- April 2004?

Paul

Paul: Having played with both now, which one would you recommend- Panny or Sony?

Interior pic chip#5

Interior pic chip#6

Looks like it from this end Paul (on chip build date).

It is nice that JKA/V is providing photos of the chips found in the DVD-S97, but what chip is the de-interlacing, the MPEG decoder?

I wonder too what camera you're using Jason!! It sure does a better job than mine!!

Canon S1 IS (keep in mind, one of the biggest camera dealers in the U.S. :) )

Jason

ah I see.

Thanks for both the pic and the post! =)

Originally posted by mallu2u
Paul: Having played with both now, which one would you recommend- Panny or Sony?

Macroblocking is a "deal breaker" for some, for others "CUE" is a "deal breaker", yet for others "green depression" is a "deal breaker".

I like the Panasonic's detail, color, deinterlacing, and centered image. The macroblocking is somewhat disappointing but I can live with it given the other benefits. I like the Sony's detail, decent deinterlacing, quick disc navigation, and lack of macroblocking. The CUE, "green depression", and off-center screen are disappointing with the Sony.

Both, IMHO are fine players with flaws (like any other player).

Paul

Paul,

Since you've already reviewed both and have compared the Panny with 880, would you be putting direct comparison btw Sony and Panny?

Its probably a lot of work but my sense is that many on the forum is looking just for that.

For me, I already bought the S97 and am quite happy with the PQ. On my TH-50HD6UY plasma panel (1366x768), I notice macroblocking on a rare occausion and not at all on most DVDs I've watched so far so its not a big deal (my S97 is set with RGB Enhanced and User brightness +1, nothing else adjusted @1080i). Most of my adjustment is done on PDP side.

Yes, I realize some folks are very, very particular about the technical fact that it may be some bugs associated with, eventhough it is only noticed using test disks and patterns. For me I just watch and enjoy good PQ 99.9% of the time:)

Regards,

Which player has more features and/or is more user friendly? Seems to be overall Panny is a better pick. Is that true?

Anyone knows if Panny releases firmwares to resolve issues?

Guess I am trying to narrow to one. If I order from Onecall, Panny cannot go back. Therefore the Qs. Sony I can bring home from Tweeter and return but the Panny shall stay. Therefore want to be sure Panny is better of the two before ordering it.

Today, I had to return the HDMI to DVI cable I bought from Blue Jeans Cable because of the HDCP problem. I find the so-called "handshake" between the DVD-S97 and my LCD TV an annoyance. DVD picture quality upconverted in 720p and 1080i is acceptable, but I was not impressed.

Even though the S97 is an improvement with the DVD-RP82, the macroblocking and minor image cropping made me uneasy about continuing to own the S97. If Secrets scored this player less than the RP82, I may as well sell it at eBay and wait until Blu-Ray/HD-DVD players become affordable (i.e. below $300).

Will the S97 output 720p / 1080i images via component, or only via the HDMI.

The user manual is kind of vague on this point.

Thanks

Only 480i/p on component, 480p/720p/1080i on hdmi only.

It also saids on the Panasonic website as well upconverting via HDMI.

Originally posted by megamii
Today, I had to return the HDMI to DVI cable I bought from Blue Jeans Cable because of the HDCP problem. I find the so-called "handshake" between the DVD-S97 and my LCD TV an annoyance. DVD picture quality upconverted in 720p and 1080i is acceptable, but I was not impressed.

Even though the S97 is an improvement with the DVD-RP82, the macroblocking and minor image cropping made me uneasy about continuing to own the S97. If Secrets scored this player less than the RP82, I may as well sell it at eBay and wait until Blu-Ray/HD-DVD players become affordable (i.e. below $300).

What areas do you consider the S97 and improvement when compared to the RP82?

Thanks

Hello Paul,

I don't think this question has been asked yet so I'll ask. When viewing video based material using the 480i output how evident are 4:2:0 ICP artifacts?

I'm sure you know what icp is but I'll link the Secrets write-up on it anyway. If interested the ICP discussion begins about half way down page.

http://128.121.62.219/volume_8_2/dvd-benchmark-special-report-chroma-bug-4-2001.html


I find ICP most evident in background lights and is quite similar to how CUE manifest itself.

For example here's a photo I took of how ICP manifests itself (Pioneer dv-59avi) on a portion of the Snell Wilcox pattern from DVE.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?s=&postid=4486658&fullpage=1

Thanks for any input you can provide.

Hugh2,

I haven't looked at the 480i output that much -- only to verify the particular items on the list. I'll take a look.

Paul

I just purchased my S97 at Ken Crane's so I will have a full report out on its performance with the Panasonic 53X54 RPTV. If you have anything specific you guys want me to check out, let me know.

Akastp,

I didn't see any problem particular to the HDMI->DVI connection -- none of the widely reported crushing typically reported for the connection, for example. The other discussed issues are still present, however.

Paul

Anyone test the performance on a DLP - with 720p native res?

look, I'm climbing out on a limb, and I don't even own a unit yet!

here's some conjecture:

720p/1080 via HDMI is great for those with fixed res displays that that -any- input (including 480i) and process the heck out of it to display at native res. Thus, there will be greater difference for those of you with plasmas/dlp/lcd than any of us that are CRT based (RP or Direct View) for obvious reasons. The CRTs are "multi-res", sorta, in much the same was as your CRT montor may have a fixed aperature mask pixel size but can display pixels of various sizes (think zooming into a photoshop image.)

I betcha that macroblocking, et al. are directly a result of zooming compressed material, in much the way that zooming the heck out of a jpeg emphasizes the problems inherent in the compression algorhythm. CRT displays will soften any differences, both denying the pixel-acurate presentation of fixed-pxl displays, and having the advantage that it often looks a hell of a lot more like film (another analogue medium).

The bottom line, then, is whether or not it's better to feed your TV native 480i, progressive scan 480p, or 480p/720p/1080i via the HDMI/DVI route. What would make it better or worse would then entirely be a factor not only of what this player does (with its fancy Genesis chip) but what your -TV- does with this fancy new signal.

When I first heard about this upconversion phenomenon, I figured it was alchemy, the kind of marketing ploy that has led to manufacturers branding "Digital Headphones!" and other ilk. Then again, HTPCs, with good software, can do a pretty decent job of upsampling if the new image isn't so much bigger than the one you started from (you can't take a 720x480 pixel and make a billboard poster print, but making it 1.5x the size, while introducing some errors, still might on the whole do nice things to the image.)

So, all along, my ideal with this player would be to have everything that my RP-82 has now - good features, solid build, great sound, and rock solid 480i/p picture (note that progressive scan has to do with cadence adjustment, and -not- any pixel upsampling).

I, for one, never use the "remix" or "enhance" features on my '82 for sound. CD PCM is 44.1/16, and re-processing it up to 96 khz seems a silly waste. Many of these remixers simply re-eq some high frequencies to make things more "bright", making it seem that you are getting somehow gold from coal.

Is the 1080i-from-480i a coal-from-gold phenomena? Perhaps for those of us with CRTs it is. I still can't imagine that the picture detail blowin up twofold or so would be substantially better on my box than the pic I get from my '82 (I'd love to be proven wrong - in that case, it would be because of the sophistication and dexterity of the upsampling algorhythm, overcoming some errors while zooming the picture up to a higher pixel display count). All this would be moot, however, if the box has all the features and capabilities of the famed RP-82 with the added bonus of HDMI!

My gut thought - The MB problem jut may be tied directly to the way each manufacturers TV manipulates native signals to display on fixed-pixel devices. In combination with the upsampling being done player-side, you get funky results.

I thus posit the following: buy this if you own plasma, dlp, lcd, or if you don't already have an '82, '91 or equiv panny player.

Would love someone to tell me I'm wrong, was looking forward to curing the upgrade-itis that's been plaguing me a while now... :)

I've seen it asked a few times, but not answered defninitively. Is the macroblocking problem on the S97S there at both 720p AND 1080i? Is it a lot less at 720p? I just picked up a 720p projector and I'm thinking of getting the S97S to replace my current crapola DVD player, but if the upconverting players all have problems, I'd rather just go get a decent 480p player for $50

Akastp,

I have the Monster 400 HDMI->DVI cable. It's a lot of money and probably overkill. I like it and it works for me. I'm not making any claims of "improved picture quality".

Paul

James,

I attempted to answer the question in in the first post. Under the heading for the various resolutions the HDMI->DVI, the macroblocking is indicated at 720p. The degree to what it exists is dependant upon source material, display, and configuration. The best thing to do is to find a DVD-1910 adjust the display properly and have a look. The macroblocking at all resolutions (except component 480i) reminds me of the DVD-1910.

Paul

Just got off the the phone with Dax at OneCall. Claims his supervisor told him that OneCall would get a bunch of pannies on Friday or Monday. I don't know what the definition of 'a bunch' is but he did state that there would be enough to get mine out. I believe I am one of the 26 original B/O.

I hope you enjoy your player!

Hugh2,

The ICP looks fairly nice on the Panasonic for both 1080i and 480i. The close up photo looks more like the new Sony DVP-NS975V.

I took some pictures of the pattern and will work on getting them posted.

Paul

AkaStp
Get an HDMI-to-DVI cable. If you get one of the adapters, you're adding another connector in the signal path. Though it may not cause you problems, it's generally not good to add another connector and an adapter adds two more connectors.

While this is not your setup, many have reported that the DVI-to-HDMI adapter puts excessive strain (due to the extra weight) on the HDMI chassis connector/circuit board and may cause the pins on the board to separate.

Originally posted by Paul Bigelow
Hugh2,

The ICP looks fairly nice on the Panasonic for both 1080i and 480i. The close up photo looks more like the new Sony DVP-NS975V.

I took some pictures of the pattern and will work on getting them posted.

Paul

That's terrific, I look forward to viewing the photos.

Thank you very much

and see if the panasonic HDMI-HDMI cabloe is up to snuff to other HDMI - HDMI cables like RAM or Monster.

TIA

Thanks Paul for all your work - it is appreciated.

I have two questions for you or anyone else with this player and an opinion.

1. I have a Mits (52725) which is supposed to have an excellent scaler. Since you cite the scaling as the best bit about the S97S and you need it for your TV, I'm wondering what you would use in my situation, the S97S or the XP-50 which you seem to like better except for the scaler. I'm new to this so I might be missing something here. I'm undecided now because of the MB which I'm sure I'll notice, but I really like the HDMI, so I may just wait and see.

2. Does this player have an auto start feature to skip previews / FBI warning etc. like I've heard the Zenith 318 does? I just scanned / searched the manual (.pdf) and couldn't find anything.

Thanks.

-X

Hey gcmail
How does the S97 look with your Panasonic 53" rear projection 53X54 with HDMI?

Originally posted by SwanSong
and see if the panasonic HDMI-HDMI cabloe is up to snuff to other HDMI - HDMI cables like RAM or Monster.

TIA

I do not have any other HDMI-HDMI cable to try at the present time.

Paul

Captainx0r,

Your're welcome!

1. If the TV has an excellent scaler, then, macroblocking aside, I think one will see little difference, PQ-wise, between the XP50 and S97 at 480p component.

2. I haven't been able to skip the warnings -- a big message appears if I try!

Paul

Originally posted by sharkshark
I thus posit the following: buy this if you own plasma, dlp, lcd, or if you don't already have an '82, '91 or equiv panny player.
Would love someone to tell me I'm wrong, was looking forward to curing the upgrade-itis that's been plaguing me a while now... :)
That is exactly my situation? Upgrade to upconverting player or wait till HDDVD/BluRay? I have a HD2 DLP front projector and RP91 running 480i to the projector with great picture (to me at least). I, like most people in this forum, always find a way to improve picture quality. The battle for me is try to convince my wife every time I spend money to upgrade. She cannot tell a different on picture quality between my last 4 DVD players, she can tell HD is better though(Duh?).

Sony DVP-NS975V comparison posted in the "SHOOTOUT/COMPARISONS" section.

Paul

tvuong,

That's precisely why I'm not going to spend a huge amount of money on a DVD player. I have D-VHS and the HD recordings will "blow away" every DVD player of mine and every one I've seen. Still, one needs a DVD player for the present.

HD-DVD/BluRay is definitely the future, IMHO.

Paul

Originally posted by Paul Bigelow
Sony DVP-NS975V comparison posted in the "SHOOTOUT/COMPARISONS" section.

Paul

Very helpful. How do you find out if your TV allows you to set the SD or HD color matrix? I have a Samsung DLP (HLP5063) so I plan to use either player with HDMI at 720p.

Thanks again Paul.

Eric,

Have a look at your Samsung manual and read through the setup and adjustment sections.

My Panasonic LCD does not allow for selection at 1080i and 480i, but allows for selection at 480p.

Paul

Anyone know of a distibutor that ships to Canada?

Originally posted by Paul Bigelow
tvuong,

That's precisely why I'm not going to spend a huge amount of money on a DVD player. I have D-VHS and the HD recordings will "blow away" every DVD player of mine and every one I've seen. Still, one needs a DVD player for the present.

HD-DVD/BluRay is definitely the future, IMHO.

Paul

How do u record HD into D-VHS? How is the quality and price/performance?

Originally posted by mallu2u
How do u record HD into D-VHS?
Firewire/iLink.

Originally posted by mallu2u
How do u record HD into D-VHS? How is the quality and price/performance?

Have a look and read through this forum on AVS. Search on D-VHS.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=42

Have you purchased that DVD player yet? ;)

Paul

Nope. Waiting for your comparison, which you just posted. I think I am leaning towards S97 now. I have Sony 60'' XBR RPTV. What do you say Paul, with all the SD/HD Matrix stuff yuu mentioned for Sony Player? I am surprised you are keeping both. Why?

Paul,

Any ideas on how to program the open/close button on an universal remote? Will I first have to get another Panny DVD player remote that has open/close, then program onto the universal remote?

I didn't have an SACD player, so now I do.

Remember, I think both are fine players. If a TV has the color matix selection at HD resolutions, the Sony might make a better choice for some people.

Paul

Originally posted by jrock65
Paul,

Any ideas on how to program the open/close button on an universal remote? Will I first have to get another Panny DVD player remote that has open/close, then program onto the universal remote?

Try programming the universal remote with Panasonic DVD remote codes from the built in database and check. If the remote has common Panasonic commands, it may have the code already. With a Universal URC-200 I captured (learned) the command from an XP50 remote. The URC-200 built-in database may have the Panasonic open/close code but I didn't try.

Paul

Will someone with both the Zenith DVB318 and the Panasonic S97S please post a comparison between the two. In my opinion my DVB318 definitely has a sharper image then the RP82/XP50 due to upconversion so if the S97S has a sharper more accurate PQ without the cropping and HDMI/DVI HDCP issues I will buy it and sell DVB318.

That would be sweet. Thanks for the tip, akastp, I'll basically be looking for either one of the two. Radio Shack's site doesn't mention either one, but it might be too early for the bigger chains to be getting these newer products in yet. I'll keep looking.

Just got the S97 from Panasonic's Mississippi distributor and played with it for about 15 minutes. Have not read the manual yet. So far it looks great, using 'The Final Countdown' as reference disc. There does seem to be some underscanning. I haven't noticed any macroblocking YET at 720p using my Panasonic 500 PJ display. I'll try using my RP82 remote later to see if the open/close button will work.

I think thus far it looks better than the Denon 1910 in terms of PQ, and you actually have control over color saturation, which was my big complaint about the Denon. So far I'm happy, but I've hardly used it. This is my going on gut instinct, non technical, non-scientific appraisal -- it beats the Denon hands down for me; PQ, build, control. remembering where you stopped, even after disc is removed. More later.

FYI, I have the S97 back in stock, at least for a few minutes from the looks of folks ordering it...

Jason

Originally posted by flamboyant1220
Hey gcmail
How does the S97 look with your Panasonic 53" rear projection 53X54 with HDMI?

Working long hours won't have it set up till tomorrow night -- I'll have a full report out on Sat.

Originally posted by JKA/V
FYI, I have the S97 back in stock, at least for a few minutes from the looks of folks ordering it...

Jason

Sweet - did you get enough to fill all current orders as you someone had suggested earlier?

Yes, no problem there, and there are some left over, but as I mentioned... not for long ;)

Originally posted by JKA/V
Yes, no problem there, and there are some left over, but as I mentioned... not for long ;)

Then why when I check my order does it say "backordered" :)

Just kidding - called and they said it will ship later today or early tomorrow. Works for me.

Jason!! Can you open the the next batch if you can to see if they have a later build date? =)

Hehe, no. One open is enough :)

Jason

Originally posted by JKA/V
Hehe, no. One open is enough :)

Jason

Sango can buy one, open it, and let us know! ;)

My guess is that it won't be December build.

Paul

There you go :)

eheh Sorry Paul!! I'm tight on $$$ to buy any HT related equipment !!

Well I did pre-order my copy of Guld Wars (http://www.guildwars.com) which came with a free pre-sell kit which I have! =)

To let everyone know, Friday will be the last day to receive free three-day FedEx shipping at OneCall for ordering the DVD-S97.

As for the RP82's open/close button, it does open the DVD tray of the S97. Putting the DVD players on top of each other a few days back, I observed that the DVD tray opens and playback discs (DVDs, CDs, CD-Rs, etc.) faster on the S97 than the RP82.

Since I did not mention what I unit I bought, it is a September 2004 build and it was made in China.

Megamii, hehe I already knew that since the DVD-S47 !
The tray is slimmer too and I thought at first it was flimsy if I did a Karate at it (opps)!.

Can you tell me in your view how your S97 pairs up to the RP82 in terms of PQ(ignore macroblocking) and the sound quality via analog.

Thanks

Sango

Is CUE the same as, or different from the "green depression" color matrix problem? If it's different, why isn't it mentioned in the shootout? Do you feel that it isn't very noticeable under normal viewing?

Thanks!

Jeeper,

Thanks for pointing that out. It was an oversight. No CUE on this player. Has nothing to do with "green depression".

Paul

For me, I notice underscanning is less on 1080i than 720p, on my setup -- a 720p LCD projector. The RP 82 remote works for open/close disc on the S97. So far I'm liking it, will keep my RP82 as backup. My Denon 1910 along with 6ft DVI monster cable goes up on Ebay this weekend.

Cool - my order placed Monday should go out soon too, I guess.

In all of this frenzy about upconverting players, I haven't heard anyone mention the benefit of circumventing a digital to analog conversion for a cleaner signal. Is this still a definite benefit?

I could endure some minor MB artifacts if I got a cleaner signal....

Has anyone compared this player head-to-head with the Panny XP30?

Damn I like Onecall. Apparently they have units in as I just ordered mine yesterday and just got a tracking number today saying it shipped. They must have recevied a lot of units.

Originally posted by jayrader
In all of this frenzy about upconverting players, I haven't heard anyone mention the benefit of circumventing a digital to analog conversion for a cleaner signal. Is this still a definite benefit?

I could endure some minor MB artifacts if I got a cleaner signal....

It depends on the display unit. If the display unit is a digital display (Plasma, LCD-based), then there is no D/A conversion, and since DVI/HDMI it is not compressed image, it should be better. If the display unit is CRT-based (direct view or projection), then there is D/A conversion some place. It can be done on DVD player or on the display unit itself.

So, to answer your question, I have found that on my HD feed from both DirecTV and OTA antenna reception (ATSC tuner) through DVI-based input to my digital monitor gave ever so small improvement over RGB-based, sub-D 15pin (analog) input (image is bit more crisp with DVI, especially on fonts and digitally created images). In the latter case, it went digital source to analog back to digital to be displayed (D/A -> A/D).

Unfortunately, these maianstream players do not output upscaled images via component because it is not HDCP compliant. One can compare 480p DVI and component but I have never done that...

Sort of an answer but not a direct one.

Akastp,

From page 3 of the XR50 manual:

CAUTION!
Do not place anything on top of this unit or block the heat
radiation vents in any way. In particular, do not place tape
decks or CD/DVD players on this unit as heat radiated from it
can damage your software.

This was the same warning that came with SAXR10. That receiver can get pretty warm and I do not have the DVDXP50 on top of it.

I would not place the 'S97 on top of the SAXR50.

Paul

Originally posted by ricksm3
I did. About 20 minutes ago. Same problem.

Rick: The site is fixed. Now you can order on the Panny website as well.

It's been one week.

Whew!

Paul

Originally posted by hurtz777
Will someone with both the Zenith DVB318 and the Panasonic S97S please post a comparison between the two. In my opinion my DVb318 definitely has a sharper image then the RP82/XP50 due to upconversion so if the S97S has a sharper more accurate PQ without the cropping and HDBI issues I will buy it and sell DVB318.

I have the DVD318 and expect the S97 to be arriving by Monday. If no one has posted comparison's between the two by then, I will happy to do so.

Originally posted by Paul Bigelow
It's been one week.

Whew!

Paul

Website? Nope. They fixed the site but one could not order it. Would throw back at pricing page. Rick and I tried ordering 2 days back with no luck. Now its back.

Or you mean...just one week and all this discussion!

Originally posted by Paul Bigelow
It's been one week.

Whew!

Paul

Thanks for all the input you have done this past week. Mine is on the way today order from One Call........You Da the Man Paul:D

Originally posted by mallu2u
Website? Nope. They fixed the site but one could not order it. Would throw back at pricing page. Rick and I tried ordering 2 days back with no luck. Now its back.

Or you mean...just one week and all this discussion!

Right! That's what I mean. It's been a whirlwind week! :)

At least we have some information about the two players.

Paul

Originally posted by robert dawson
Thanks for all the input you have done this past week. Mine is on the way today order from One Call........You Da the Man Paul:D

Thanks Robert!

I hope you like the player. Let us know how it work out! What DVD player have you been using?

Paul

Originally posted by Paul Bigelow
Right! That's what I mean. It's been a whirlwind week! :)

At least we have some information about the two players.

Paul

Wow, Paul, do you realize that your thread has 720+ responses in a week. Thats about 100 a day!!! I think it actually has slowed down a bit from the first 4 days or so....

How's your fingers, eyes and back doin'?:D

mgkg3,

The thread is getting pretty big -- slowing down a bit but we'll see what happens when more player gets into more hands.

Haven't really even tried out the audio yet. Hoping to get a SA-XR70 in mid-December.

Fingers - OK
Back - OK
Eyes - a bit shopworn! :)

Paul

Yeah thanks again Paul... mine is on its way too... even though I won't hook it up to a TV until the end of this month, I wanted to make sure I got one. Now the question...if I am not going to hook it up to a TV for a month, I might as well open it, since in a month, I won't be able to return it anyway, right?

Originally posted by Paul Bigelow
Thanks Robert!

I hope you like the player. Let us know how it work out! What DVD player have you been using?

Paul

Paul I have been using my Denon 1600 and the XP 30.....and a Dreamx a upconvert dvd player over component.....works ok but I have been waiting over 8 months for the release of this new Panny S97....I to hope it works and I feel it will because of the quality of the Panny dvd products seem to be the best for the price...:D

Hi again Paul,

Just curious if you've found the time to post the pics of ICP issue we spoke of earlier. I've searched but can't seem to find them but that doesn't mean there not here somewhere.

Thanks again.

Originally posted by Lodey
Yeah thanks again Paul... mine is on its way too... even though I won't hook it up to a TV until the end of this month, I wanted to make sure I got one. Now the question...if I am not going to hook it up to a TV for a month, I might as well open it, since in a month, I won't be able to return it anyway, right?

If it's from One Call and you *know* you are going to open it eventually, be aware that there's is a 15 return policy for defects. It might be best to open it upon receipt, check for defects , power it up, and hook it up to some sort of TV and play a DVD to determine basic functionality.

Paul

Originally posted by Hugh2
Hi again Paul,

Just curious if you've found the time to post the pics of ICP issue we spoke of earlier. I've searched but can't seem to find them but that doesn't mean there not here somewhere.

Thanks again.

Hello Hugh2,

No I haven't. My apologies. I plan to tonight. When I post them they can be accessed via the "PICTURES" section in the first post. I'll place the notations there now.

Paul

I compared the picture of the S97 to my XP30 before I returned it. Not sure what to say really. The macroblocking was the reason I returned it, but the picture was very good aside from this.

I had the DVB318 previously and I returned that too for macroblocking, but the macroblocking on the 318 was HORRIBLE. Blacks looked more 'blueish' and it left horrible image retention all over the screen when words on my Panasonic ED plasma faded out. I did however definitely like the upconverted image a little more than the XP30 at 480p, but macroblocking killed the deal both times.

I'll reiterate. If you want to see an easy example, go to any fading shots in a movie and watch. Also, chapter 11 of Monsters Inc, you'll see the floor shimmer and blocking right at the start. Ugly with both the DVB318 and the S97, and lovely with the XP30.

*hugs XP30*

OneCall has stock & is shipping. My backorder left today. Order form shows open stock available.

I had the DVB318 previously and I returned that too for macroblocking, but the macroblocking on the 318 was HORRIBLE. Blacks looked more 'blueish' and it left horrible image retention all over the screen when words on my Panasonic ED plasma faded out. I did however definitely like the upconverted image a little more than the XP30 at 480p, but macroblocking killed the deal both times.

I too have the Zenith and often wonder how it got all the rave reviews for video quality when the macroblocking is so bad. I agree with every word of the above. If the S97 also has macroblocking, it looks like I'll be sticking with my RP82.

Pic1

Pic2

Hugh2,

ICP pictures posted. In the Pictures section. DVE patterns FULL ASPECT 4:3 pillarbox for 1080i HDMI and 480i Component.

Paul

Originally posted by gtaylor74
I too have the Zenith and often wonder how it got all the rave reviews for video quality when the macroblocking is so bad. I agree with every word of the above. If the S97 also has macroblocking, it looks like I'll be sticking with my RP82.

The 'S97 most assuredly has macroblocking.

Paul

Just got the "in stock" email from One Call and placed the order - I'm hoping it will be a good match with my Sammy HLP6163...

I got mine last night and set it up with Avia. It's replacing the venerable RP91. I'm using a Mits RPTV and 480p component.

I think I need to do some more tweaking, because after running Avia and doing little else, I subjectively prefered the RP-91 for the film based stuff I played. Video material was no contest in favor of the 97.

I should have some more time this evening to delve into the adjustments, but I didn't get the wow experience I was expecting initially. Of course, that's not to say I won't after I can spend some time playing with it.

CRT RPTV? If so, you may be the first. Do tell.

ps. cummon, that was a big post of mine up there... :)

Originally posted by ritesh
Hi Paul,

Thanks for bringing my attention to this thread (from the one in Plasma forum).

I think I have the same Hitachi ALIS plasma as you, I am curious how exactly this (and other players you've had) mate with the plasma? Is the macroblocking visible, at all modes or does it go away at say 1080i? Finally which setting did you like the best with that particular display, 480p/720p/1080i (considering that the native res. of the panel is 1024x1024)? When you do test the Component out, I would be interesting how that goes with the plasma as well?

Sorry for the barrage of questions, but really appreciate your responses...

thanks,

regards,

Ritesh

Hi Paul,

Perhaps it escaped your attention.... I posted this a while back, when things were really hectic on this thread......

May be now is the time to re-surface this post....

Any responses...

thanks,

regards,

Ritesh

Hello Ritesh,

My apologies for not answering sooner.

The S97 appears to work work with the Hitachi. No HDCP communications issues. No crushing issues as of the result of the HDMI-> DVI connection. Just my impression but I preferred the 1080i -- maybe the Hitachi likes the 1080i just a bit better -- it just seemed to have a bit more "life" at that resolution. The macroblocking is present. I didn't have much time to look at the display very long at each resolution. Haven't had a chance to try out component connection with the Hitachi.

Best regards,

Paul

Paul, I've replied back so you cah check it out!

Thanks

Sango

I mentioned in a previous post on the reason why I returned my HDMI to DVI cable. The reason had to do with the so-called "handshake." Is this something that can be overcome, such as getting a TV with an HDMI input, or is it the fact that my LCD TV's DVI input accepts analog (for PC use) or digital signals (for DVD or STB use)?

Thanks for the pics of ICP Paul,

Those bullseyes look as good as I'd expect if the signal were running through the Faroudja chip. I'm not sure what to make of at this point, either there is a chroma filter in the chain somewhere (but I'm certain your display doesn't employ one) or the MPEG decoder has a few good tricks up it's sleeve.

Regardless those resluts are what I was hoping for. Threadbare ICP as I noted on the 59avi (zero chroma filtering) is extremely distractive and annoying to me and was the reason I eventually returned the unit.

After I returned the 59avi frustration drove the unrelenting impulse to purchase an Iscan HD so I'm presently looking for a inexpensive player (with warranty) that will send a decent 480i over component to the Iscan. Eventhough the Iscan does have a chroma filter I'd rather not use filters unless absolutely necessary. I'll have to wait a couple weeks before a player lands on a shelf in these here parts but I'm anticipating a positive result due to the DVE Snell Wilcox test looking quite good, negligable y/c delay and none evident ICP.

Thanks again for the providing the information I was looking for.

Originally posted by Vergiliusm
I got mine last night and set it up with Avia. It's replacing the venerable RP91. I'm using a Mits RPTV and 480p component.

I think I need to do some more tweaking, because after running Avia and doing little else, I subjectively prefered the RP-91 for the film based stuff I played. Video material was no contest in favor of the 97.

I should have some more time this evening to delve into the adjustments, but I didn't get the wow experience I was expecting initially. Of course, that's not to say I won't after I can spend some time playing with it.

I was thinking about getting one of these to replace my RP-91 also. I would be hooking up mine to a Pioneer Elite 630. I really want to hear some reviews with RPTV's and how bad the macroblocking shows up on a CRT PRTV.

Would it be any different than a DLP or Plasma?

Thanks

Jim

Paul-

I remember that you bought the Toshiba 5970 and then prompty returned it. (I did the same).

How would you compare the macroblocking on the S97 to the macroblocking on the Toshiba? This is my only point of reference on macroblocking, and it really frustrated me for the couple days I had that player (other things did too). I ended up watching things through the componenet rather than the HDMI because it annoyed me that much.

Thanks.

I was thinking about getting one of these to replace my RP-91 also. I would be hooking up mine to a Pioneer Elite 630. I really want to hear some reviews with RPTV's and how bad the macroblocking shows up on a CRT PRTV.

I can't speak for the S97, but I have my Zenith 318 hooked up to my Elite 530 and the macroblocking is easily noticeable. The Zenith's component output is better but it is still there. It's DVI output is terrible. Again I can't speak for the S97, but with the Zenith it is easily seen and very distracting on my Elite 530.

I've also got an RP91 which is awesome at 480i into the Elite. I much prefer it over the Zenith because I can't stand the zeniths macroblocking and pixel cropping. I also have an RP82 I use as my everyday player and it is slighly better than the RP91. My advice would be to make sure if you get the S97 get it from a place with a good return policy cause the Elite tends to show the macroblocking.

gtaylor74, did you recieve my message!?!?

Yes I did. I'm out of town on business and won't get to try it out until the weekend. I'll let you know what I think. Thanks Sango.

Originally posted by Paul Bigelow
Hello Ritesh,

My apologies for not answering sooner.

The S97 appears to work work with the Hitachi. No HDCP communications issues. No crushing issues as of the result of the HDMI-> DVI connection. Just my impression but I preferred the 1080i -- maybe the Hitachi likes the 1080i just a bit better -- it just seemed to have a bit more "life" at that resolution. The macroblocking is present. I didn't have much time to look at the display very long at each resolution. Haven't had a chance to try out component connection with the Hitachi.

Best regards,

Paul

Thanks Paul,

I think I'll try it out when it's available here in Oz; I've recently tried the Denon 2910; and the green push was quite apparent on my Hitachi. Perhaps Panasonic is the one I've been waiting for many months.....

Thanks again,

regards,

Ritesh

Until today, I've been using the S97's HDMI cable with an HDMI-DVI converter. To minimize cable lengths, I ordered a 1m HDMI-DVI cable from Pacific Cable (I get some flashing "lines" due to my 10m DVI cable run on dark pictures).

I got it today and it does not work. The picture comes on for a fraction of a second and it goes to white snow. That is a Copy Protection error. I read about someone else reporting the same problem from another vendor :(

Originally posted by motoman
I was thinking about getting one of these to replace my RP-91 also. I would be hooking up mine to a Pioneer Elite 630. I really want to hear some reviews with RPTV's and how bad the macroblocking shows up on a CRT PRTV.

Would it be any different than a DLP or Plasma?

Thanks

Jim

I'll have a CRT RPTV report out on Saturday.

Well from the posts on this player I have been getting some mixed signals. Everyone has said there is macroblocking, is there a cheaper HDMI player out there that doesnt experience this? I am thinking very seriously about buying this DVD player but I am not sure this unit is not without it's problems.

I will be connecting to my AE700 via a HDMI cable. I guess I was hoping for the perfect "no problems" DVD player.

I also am trying to figure out which dvd player to use with my AE700.
Does the Sony color problem happen with the AE700?

Which would be recommended for the AE700 projector?

Thanks!

Jordan "AstroCat"

Or the AE500 for that matter.

I have $300 to spend. If these upconverts have these problems that machines a couple years ago did not, then...

WHAT SHOULD I GET?? So many mixed and confusing signals from this thread....

Is it me or is the 1080i bullseye and "+" much blurrier than the 480p?

Does anyone know if stores like bestbuy and circuit city are going stoke the s97 I called a couple of them and they did not even know of this player.

Originally posted by gmelendez
Does anyone know if stores like bestbuy and circuit city are going stoke the s97 I called a couple of them and they did not even know of this player.

I went to both BB and CC in NYC last weekend looking for the S97. BB said - "is it a brand new model? if it's a brand new model we probably won't have it for a few months - we wait to see if things sell well before we stock them" - kind of a funny response.

CC claimed they were in the computer but not in stock yet, so I'd imagine they will be getting them.

Is it me or is the 1080i bullseye and "+" much blurrier than the 480p?

Have to say that I agree on that :confused:.

/The Reaper

Paul,

Thanks so much for this excellent review.

Do you, or anyone else, know if the Panasonic or the Sony has discrete IR codes for ON/OFF?

Thanks,

Sooke

I am frustrated and looking for advice. I apologize if this has already been adressed. I had the sam931(crap audio) then this new panny came out and the sony. I have a panny AE500U and I have always liked my sony dvd players. Well I just purchased the new sony and it does not work through hdmi > dvi to my player. Onecall says that it is my "crappy" projector which I love and it cannot possibole be the brand new first run attempt at a new upconverting sony player. The real question is - Will this new panny dvd player work on my AE500? I want an upscaler so bad it hurts. Please help!

Originally posted by arrowshine
I am frustrated and looking for advice. I apologize if this has already been adressed. I had the sam931(crap audio) then this new panny came out and the sony. I have a panny AE500U and I have always liked my sony dvd players. Well I just purchased the new sony and it does not work through hdmi > dvi to my player. Onecall says that it is my "crappy" projector which I love and it cannot possibole be the brand new first run attempt at a new upconverting sony player. The real question is - Will this new panny dvd player work on my AE500? I want an upscaler so bad it hurts. Please help!

<lancestorm also waits patiently to hear a response because he might be in same situation>

Originally posted by gtaylor74
I can't speak for the S97, but I have my Zenith 318 hooked up to my Elite 530 and the macroblocking is easily noticeable. The Zenith's component output is better but it is still there. It's DVI output is terrible. Again I can't speak for the S97, but with the Zenith it is easily seen and very distracting on my Elite 530.

I've also got an RP91 which is awesome at 480i into the Elite. I much prefer it over the Zenith because I can't stand the zeniths macroblocking and pixel cropping. I also have an RP82 I use as my everyday player and it is slighly better than the RP91. My advice would be to make sure if you get the S97 get it from a place with a good return policy cause the Elite tends to show the macroblocking.


Thanks for the info GTaylor. I still use my RP-91 as a progressive scan player (blue light on) Would I get a better picture on the Elite using 480i setting?

Thanks again. I think I might pass on the S97 for now.

Jim

Originally posted by ToddMcF2002
Is it me or is the 1080i bullseye and "+" much blurrier than the 480p?

Don't read anything into the sharpness of those pictures. My camera was probably too close to the LCD. The picture is not intended to be for any sharpness determination.

Paul

Originally posted by ToddMcF2002
Is it me or is the 1080i bullseye and "+" much blurrier than the 480p?

The comparison was between 1080i and 480i but I noticed that same thing. I also noted that the other Snell Wilcox comparisons show the upsampled photos and HDMi being more blurry than 480p and 480i component evidenced primarily in the numbers and text portions of the test.

Similarly the screenshots of Willy Wonka show the same trend where 480p and 480i over component show more detail and focus while the upsampled and HDMi signals seem to soften the picture somewhat. Though these observations are contrary to what everyone is reporting they are consistent with my own observations from using an upscaling player which I've confirmed with my own photos.

So far I've seen photos of two comparisons of upscaling (mine and Pauls) and in each case, IMO after viewing the photos, the upscaling softens the image. If anyone here is adamant that an upscaling player provides a sharper better focused image (like I've read over and over again) over the non upsampled countered part please take some photos which show this and post them. My usual healthy skepticism is starting to run amok here.

AE700 & S97S
------------------

My S97S is on its way home to meet AE700. Thank you all for helping me make a decision about buying this player.

All I am hoping to get is a superior PQ than my 3 year old SONY NS700P. NS700P does a prety good job but lacks the 720p upconversion. I know the MB is present. But I am okay with that if it is not going to showup 99% of my viewing time.


I also considered buying SONY DVPNS975V. I didn't care for DVD-Audio or SACD. In my book, the following points were pluses on S97S side:

1. Faroudja Processor for upconversion ( Same one used in higher priced Denon 3910 ?)
2. I already have a panny projector that came out in the same time and hoping that panasonic have tested this player with their projector.
3. From the specs, it looks like you have more controls/adjustments available than sony player.

Now, my concerns:

1. My online retailer will not accept returns once I open the box. If anybody has already tested this player with AE700 (or SONY NS975V with AE700), it would be a great help if you can report your findings here. Then I will get a chance to decide before opening the box.

2. Is NS975V going to have a better PQ than S97S on AE700 regardless of the video processor differences?

Please let me know your thoughts on these points.

Thanks.

Hugh2,

Some points concerning this player, camera, and the pictures:

Player:
1. A bit of edge ehancement is noted at 480p
2. There is loss of detail (already documented in the first post) with pillarboxed 4:3 material.

Camera:
1. Seems to add contrast
2. Pictures I have taken of color patterns show the color to be a bit "off".

Put together: loss of detail due to pillarbox, plus a bit of edge enhancement, plus a three/four year old Toshiba 2.1 MP camera that alters the image (doucmented as well) and it adds up to a picture that might be fun to discuss but not particularly good for critical evaluation.

I would never, ever make a buying purchase depending upon screen shots.

Paul

Originally posted by gmelendez
Does anyone know if stores like bestbuy and circuit city are going stoke the s97 I called a couple of them and they did not even know of this player.

I talked to a Panny salesman the other day and they told me this player shall not be sold by BB or CC. Limited retailers for this player. Best bet would be to call them or find from their website abt dealers in your region or etailers.

Originally posted by AkaStp
RichAV, are you saying that it works ok with the S97's HDMI cable and an HDMI-DVI adapter (that is my intended configuration when I hook up the S97 tomorrow) but not with a HDMI-to-DVI cable (my eventual intent if S97 is a keeper)? If so, would that not mean that the latter cable is defective? Perhaps purchase a (Monster) HDMI-to-DVI cable from BB or CC to try with to determine if it is the cable or not. You can always return it.

Looking forward to your review of the player.

I hooked up the S97S to my AE700 last night and everything seemed ok. I'm coming from a RP-91 component which also looked good with the AE700.
Tonight I will be hooking up the S97S with an HDMI cable and then we'll see how that looks, which is the whole point of "upgrading" from the RP-91.

I will say the only thing that bums me out about the AE700 is the VB, it really is noticable and more so than any other projector I've personally tested, which incldues recently the Sanyo PLV-60 (my old one) and the Yamaha LPX-510 (way to much SDE at 1.5x width seating).

Jordan "AstroCat"