sorry removed -another search showed me i am on a different version.

I can't for the life of me get the diagnostic menu to appear. I have tried so far:
Using the Power button on the unit (not the remote), turn off power, then press both the GUIDE and INFO buttons at the same time
and
Press and hold the Select button on the front of the unit until the Mail light starts to flash, then press the INFO button.
and
Press and hold the Pause button on the remote until the Mail light starts to flash (around 10-15 seconds), then press the Page Up (-) button. On some remotes, the Page (+) button might need to be used instead.

I am in NYC on time warner - 8300HD - any ideas? thank you!You are on Passport - this thread is for SARA. Check this thread. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=453804&page=1)

Not to be disagreeable - I'd always recommend trying HDMI with most any set.I agree. Just be aware that there may be some problems with HDMI, particularly using 480i and DD audio.

I agree. Just be aware that there may be some problems with HDMI, particularly using 480i and DD audio.That's why I suggest trying (and not spending a bundle on the cable). However, there are work-arounds for 480i (which is not a problem for all sets).

OK Pros, I've just done a lot of checking and every SD station that I attempted to rewind using the DVR was totally pixelated!

ALL of the digital stations, including the HD stations, after rewinding, were perfect!!!

Any ideas?

Is this a Time Warner or an SA8300 issue??

I don't think I've had an SD recording work right in 4+ weeks.

Time for a new box???

I don't think I've had an SD recording work right in 4+ weeks.First off, we need to get the terminology straight. SD is Standard Definition, it can be analog or digital. So, the fact that you say digital and HD channel recordings work okay, I assume you are having problems with your analog channel recordings.

If that assumption is correct, how do those channels look live?
What are the signal strength numbers, etc?
What version of software are you using?
Since you are on TWC, are you using SARA or Passport software?
How do the recordings look when you simply select the channel from the recorded list and play it back from the beginning?
Why are you rewinding and is that the only time they get messed up?

First off, we need to get the terminology straight. SD is Standard Definition, it can be analog or digital. So, the fact that you say digital and HD channel recordings work okay, I assume you are having problems with your analog channel recordings.

If that assumption is correct, how do those channels look live?
What are the signal strength numbers, etc?
What version of software are you using?
Since you are on TWC, are you using SARA or Passport software?
How do the recordings look when you simply select the channel from the recorded list and play it back from the beginning?
Why are you rewinding and is that the only time they get messed up?

1) You're right...it's the analog recordings (2-99??)

2) ALL channels look perfect live

3) SARA 1.89.17.1

4) Not sure how to determine the signal strength

5) I initially noticed the problem when attempting to watch programs that I'd recorded earlier.

2-99 rarely record properly

101 and higher always seem to record perfectly.

6) I eventually noticed that it was only analog stations (2-99) that had replay problems. I found I could test quickly by switching to a station and rewinding after a few seconds.

NOTE: I just re-checked...98 and 99 look fine initially, but are totally pixelated when I rewind them for 10 seconds. If I go back to "real" time, they again look fine.

101 and 102 look fine initially AND are perfect during replay when I rewind them for 10 seconds!!?? They never seem to break up / pixelate!!

philherz, have you tried a hard reboot? From page 1 of this thread:


Hard Reboot. A Hard Reboot will refresh all available software and modules on the system, as well as clear out the memory cache. The IPG and other data may take up to 30 minutes or more to fully download.

* Turn off the 8300 and wait 5 or more seconds.
* Unplug the power cord from the 8300 and wait 5 or more seconds.
* If you are resetting an external drive too, unplug it's power cord at this point and wait 5 or more seconds, then plug the power cord back into the external drive and wait 5 or more seconds.
* Press and hold the power button on the 8300's front panel. While the power button is depressed, plug the 8300 power cord back in. Continue to hold the power button until the 8300 display says "boot" and/or begins to cycle a few times (usually about 15 seconds).

NOTE: A Hard Reboot will resolve MANY issues with not only external drives, but memory issues too. You should WAIT until the reboot is completely finished before powering up. It usually takes about 5 - 10 min, depending on your application and IPG data. The best way to determine when the download is finished is to watch the front panel indicators. On the front panel, where the : (colon) seperates the hours and minutes, the bottom " . " dot will appear after all the OS firmware has been loaded. An STB getting a download or initializing will be blank. Leave the STB alone until the dot appears.

philherz, have you tried a hard reboot? From page 1 of this thread:Also, there are instructions in there for finding signal levels, etc. One thing to look for is if the channels are indeed still analog. Many cableco's have switched to all-digital and remapped the digital channels to the same numbers as the old analog channels. I believe you can check this by looking at the Tuning Mode on page 4 (and others) of the diagnostics. If it says QAM, then AFAIK it's actually digital, not analog. It seems like there have been previous posts discussing problems with just those channels, but I don't remember if it was during digital simulcast testing, etc. Either way, I can't imagine what would cause problems with recordings only. If everything in the first 2 posts failed to resolve the issue, I would have swapped boxes a long time ago. This is certainly not normal operation and I used to record a lot of analog stuff before Cox went all-digital here.

One question I didn't see answered was how the recordings look when selected from the List and replayed from the beginning.

BTW, there IS some kind of conflict resolution in SARA 1.89. I have Grey's, CSI, Shark, and ER all scheduled to record each week. Tonight's convoluted NBC schedule has caused a 3-3-way conflict at 9:00 (really 8:53) and ER lost out. SARA has even set next week's place-holder for ER already and has decided to record Shark and Grey's tonight. I still haven't figured out the exact scheme, but Grey's is a 2-hour episode starting at 8:00, so that makes sense. CSI also starts at 8:00, so both will be recording when ER starts at 8:53 (yes, 8:53 sheesh). I guess it makes sense then that ER loses out. Not sure what would have happened if ER started at 9:00 though. Past experience with 1.89 leads me to believe either ER or Shark would have lost out, but I've been unable to pinpoint which, hasn't happened enough yet.

Another example of an abbreviated recording. Last night I was recording one show from 8:00 to 9:00. I wathed a previously recorded show that I finished at 8:32. I did not erase, but did STOP and tune to another channel. While the record light stayed on until 9:00, the recording only has 32 minutes (I checked and it does stop at that time). I do have an external disk attached and working (SARA version 1.88)(Cablevision NY). I did a hard re-boot after this occurence, I am doubtful though that this will solve it.

Humm, Cablevision and 1.88 probably means one of those a100 versions, as in 1.88.xx.a100 or something less traditional than simply 1.88.19.1. Seems like those always have some problems the rest of us don't. ????

BTW, there IS some kind of conflict resolution in SARA 1.89. I have Grey's, CSI, Shark, and ER all scheduled to record each week. Tonight's convoluted NBC schedule has caused a 3-3-way conflict at 9:00 (really 8:53) and ER lost out. SARA has even set next week's place-holder for ER already and has decided to record Shark and Grey's tonight. I still haven't figured out the exact scheme, but Grey's is a 2-hour episode starting at 8:00, so that makes sense. CSI also starts at 8:00, so both will be recording when ER starts at 8:53 (yes, 8:53 sheesh). I guess it makes sense then that ER loses out. Not sure what would have happened if ER started at 9:00 though. Past experience with 1.89 leads me to believe either ER or Shark would have lost out, but I've been unable to pinpoint which, hasn't happened enough yet.


This may be my biggest grip with the SARA software. I wish I could set priority. Like there was a show that I wanted to record every night at a certain time. I think they were all first run so i set up a recoding. On one of the days there was a conflict, so i canceled it on that day with the conflict screen, but it seemed to cancel the whole setting up of the recording. I am like "fine, don't record on thursday but its cool to record any other day".

Humm, Cablevision and 1.88 probably means one of those a100 versions, as in 1.88.xx.a100 or something less traditional than simply 1.88.19.1. Seems like those always have some problems the rest of us don't. ????Yes , I used to have those "short recording" problems with my 8300HD and external hard drive and 1.88.17.a100 software. The problem has (knock on wood) completely gone away since the upgrade to 1.89 in early February.

philherz, have you tried a hard reboot? From page 1 of this thread:

I'll try this later today.

As per the other question, neither a quick replay of something I'm watching, nor viewing a previously recorded program from the list works for channels 2-99.

101 and higher work perfectly!!

I'll try this later today.

As per the other question, neither a quick replay of something I'm watching, nor viewing a previously recorded program from the list works for channels 2-99.

101 and higher work perfectly!!
Aren't most of your 2-99 channels duplicated somewhere in the 101+ range? Try to watch there then when you want to rewind it'll work.

BTW, there IS some kind of conflict resolution in SARA 1.89. I have Grey's, CSI, Shark, and ER all scheduled to record each week. Tonight's convoluted NBC schedule has caused a 3-3-way conflict at 9:00 (really 8:53) and ER lost out. SARA has even set next week's place-holder for ER already and has decided to record Shark and Grey's tonight. I still haven't figured out the exact scheme, but Grey's is a 2-hour episode starting at 8:00, so that makes sense. CSI also starts at 8:00, so both will be recording when ER starts at 8:53 (yes, 8:53 sheesh). I guess it makes sense then that ER loses out. Not sure what would have happened if ER started at 9:00 though. Past experience with 1.89 leads me to believe either ER or Shark would have lost out, but I've been unable to pinpoint which, hasn't happened enough yet.
Because Grey's is repeated on Friday, you would expect the DVR to record CSI, Shark, and ER on Thursday, and pick up the Grey's episode on Friday instead. This way you get all the shows that you requested.

Aren't most of your 2-99 channels duplicated somewhere in the 101+ range? Try to watch there then when you want to rewind it'll work.There are some issues here:
1) What is analog and what is digital varies from system to system. philherz is in Buffalo and that system just changed from Adelphia to TW - so things there really may be in a state of flux.
2) Often (usually? - but you just don't know about ex-Adelphia systems) the channel listing on STBs is mapped so that if a channel is available on digital the STB will tune the digital.
3) Because of this mapping function, the same actual channel is tuned no matter what the number on the guide. So if, for example, CNN is on the guide at channel 20, and on channel 101: tuning to either will get you the digital bit stream on the 687MHz QAM. There is no way to get the analog CNN (159MHz) on the STB! The only way to get analog CNN is to run the cable RF directly to the TV.

Now, as I said, things may be screwed up in Buffalo (I've seen some funny things happen there with Adelphia) so the above may not apply - but it does apply lots of places. As the other Dave has pointed out, the sure way of knowing what is going on is to go to the diagnostic screens. :)

Because Grey's is repeated on Friday, you would expect the DVR to record CSI, Shark, and ER on Thursday, and pick up the Grey's episode on Friday instead. This way you get all the shows that you requested.Oh sure, and if it's repeated 3 months from now, I suppose it should defer to then. Tivo might work that way, though I doubt it, but my recordings are set for New episodes, so that wouldn't work anyway. In a way that is a good suggestion though. That way I'd automatically get the reruns of the episodes I missed. :)

There are some issues here:
1) What is analog and what is digital varies from system to system. philherz is in Buffalo and that system just changed from Adelphia to TW - so things there really may be in a state of flux.
2) Often (usually? - but you just don't know about ex-Adelphia systems) the channel listing on STBs is mapped so that if a channel is available on digital the STB will tune the digital.
3) Because of this mapping function, the same actual channel is tuned no matter what the number on the guide. So if, for example, CNN is on the guide at channel 20, and on channel 101: tuning to either will get you the digital bit stream on the 687MHz QAM. There is no way to get the analog CNN (159MHz) on the STB! The only way to get analog CNN is to run the cable RF directly to the TV.

Now, as I said, things may be screwed up in Buffalo (I've seen some funny things happen there with Adelphia) so the above may not apply - but it does apply lots of places. As the other Dave has pointed out, the sure way of knowing what is going on is to go to the diagnostic screens. :)

Most of the stations that I've tried to record on 2-99 (they just started getting all pixelated 4-5 weeks ago) are also on the HD lineup and those ALWAYS work fine!

I went to the diagnostic area last night and saw a lot of things marked "unavailable" or similar, but I have no idea what any of it was about or what to look for!!

Will try the hard reboot later.........

thnx

Hello all,

I have a 8300HD DVR, Time Warner Cable, Ithaca NY.

Over the past several weeks my DVR recorder has apparently decided that I can no longer record the NBC Nightly News on Ch 863. No matter how I set up the recording - by time slot, manually, etc... - I have had problems recording this show on a regular basis -- and with increasing frequency. This behavior is truly bizarre for two reasons:

1. I have had zero problems recording all other shows.

2. The NBC Nightly News is highlighted on the main program guide as a
show that is to be recorded. Under "List" it shows up on the list of scheduled recordings. When the show is actually on and I press "Info" on the remote, the channel banner on the TV indicates that it is being recorded. The record indicator is lit up on the DVR. And nothing actually ends up being recorded on the DVR (or, perhaps it does not show up in the list of recorded programs).

Finally, my DVR is never more than 40% full, so it isn't a memory issue. Any ideas? Could this have something to do with the recent change to broadcasting this particular show in HD?

prof,

As indicated near the end of post #2 in this thread, this is a known bug in SARA 1.89.x.x. No specifics are available, so it's hard to tell why it happens in some cases and not others. I suspect there is a recording, but you can't get to it in the list. Just a thought, but you might try rebooting after the recording ends and before you do anything else to see if it then shows up in the list.

There are some issues here:
1) What is analog and what is digital varies from system to system. philherz is in Buffalo and that system just changed from Adelphia to TW - so things there really may be in a state of flux.
2) Often (usually? - but you just don't know about ex-Adelphia systems) the channel listing on STBs is mapped so that if a channel is available on digital the STB will tune the digital.
3) Because of this mapping function, the same actual channel is tuned no matter what the number on the guide. So if, for example, CNN is on the guide at channel 20, and on channel 101: tuning to either will get you the digital bit stream on the 687MHz QAM. There is no way to get the analog CNN (159MHz) on the STB! The only way to get analog CNN is to run the cable RF directly to the TV.

Now, as I said, things may be screwed up in Buffalo (I've seen some funny things happen there with Adelphia) so the above may not apply - but it does apply lots of places. As the other Dave has pointed out, the sure way of knowing what is going on is to go to the diagnostic screens. :)

Hard Reboot seems to have fixed the problem.

Can't believe I waited so long to try that......DUH!!!!!

Hard Reboot seems to have fixed the problem.

Can't believe I waited so long to try that......DUH!!!!!Happens to the best of us. Glad it seems to have worked!

I did a hard re-boot and my abbreviated recording time issue has not re-occured even though I tried all scenarios that caused it before. Since I would like to solve this issue before it happens again (and I don't have a recording I expected to get), I have the following question: Is there any harm, or any advantage, in doing a prophylactic hard re-boot every week?

No, there isn't. Many folks reboot on a regular schedule to avoid such problems.

Thanks for the response. I will do so and hope it clears up all my problems.

Most of the stations that I've tried to record on 2-99 (they just started getting all pixelated 4-5 weeks ago) are also on the HD lineup and those ALWAYS work fine!That's not surprising. The HD channels are on a separate QAM.

Some basics here: An analog TV channel takes 6MHz on cable. Cable uses a digital modulation scheme known as QAM. A single QAM channel also occupies the same 6MHz space and can deliver 38.8 Mbps of data. That data can be divided up many ways. For HD, they put 2 (or 3 :eek: ) channels on one QAM. HD is basically 18Mbps, so they can put 2 there with a little left over. Or they can put 12 (that's right TWELVE) SD channels there.

The typical "expanded basic" cable line up has around 70 channels, which occupies 500MHz of channel space on cable. If that was converted to digital, you would put those 70 channels into the space taken by 6! (36MHz) Cable would like to "reclaim" that space and has been generally moving in that direction by "digital simulcasting" - sending out both analog and digital versions, with the hope (there are lots of issues) of switching everyone to digital. I understand that Comcast has announced that they will do this in Chicago.

As I said there are lots of issues (example: I have 8 TVs in my house, only one has a digital STB - is cable going to GIVE me one STB for each?) and there are several potential solutions. Various FCC mandates (analog shut-off, ban on integrated security, must carry, etc.) play into this.

I went to the diagnostic area last night and saw a lot of things marked "unavailable" or similar, but I have no idea what any of it was about or what to look for!!

Will try the hard reboot later.........

thnx
I sent you a PM about helping you with this.

prof,

As indicated near the end of post #2 in this thread, this is a known bug in SARA 1.89.x.x. No specifics are available, so it's hard to tell why it happens in some cases and not others. I suspect there is a recording, but you can't get to it in the list. Just a thought, but you might try rebooting after the recording ends and before you do anything else to see if it then shows up in the list.
Thanks Dave, I didn't realize it was a well known problem. It figures it is the one show
that I really want to record!

I did a hard re-boot and my abbreviated recording time issue has not re-occured even though I tried all scenarios that caused it before. Since I would like to solve this issue before it happens again (and I don't have a recording I expected to get), I have the following question: Is there any harm, or any advantage, in doing a prophylactic hard re-boot every week?I was doing a hard re-boot every week to prevent problems until the hard re-boot itself became a problem. Most of the time the hard re-boot worked fine, but one night after a hard re-boot the box would not work properly. It displayed an error message stating that advanced services were not available, but the following day the box was working correctly. Other posters have reported seeing the same error message. Another night after a hard re-boot, the box seemed to be downloading the firmware in a continuous loop (numbers were counting up on the front panel) for over an hour, but the following day the box was working correctly. After this happened, I decided to stop doing a weekly hard re-boot. Now, I just do a hard re-boot to fix problems.

I was doing a hard re-boot every week to prevent problems until the hard re-boot itself became a problem. Most of the time the hard re-boot worked fine, but one night after a hard re-boot the box would not work properly. It displayed an error message stating that advanced services were not available, but the following day the box was working correctly. Other posters have reported seeing the same error message. Another night after a hard re-boot, the box seemed to be downloading the firmware in a continuous loop (numbers were counting up on the front panel) for over an hour, but the following day the box was working correctly. After this happened, I decided to stop doing a weekly hard re-boot. Now, I just do a hard re-boot to fix problems.
I understand prophylactic rebooting, but I have to go with "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." :)

i suggest using a new prophylactic every time.

Better then me I got 49 minutes of 24, my wife had the TV on but was not watching it as whe was on our desktop computer with no line of site to the TV. She said she heard the sound freeze and looked that the TV and the picture was frozen for about a minute then it came back.
The next morning when we checked what was recorded it only showed 24 with 49 minutes. We were taping two programs at once as well.
This normally happens to us on channel 702 not 705 but it happens enough that we have moved tapping all channel 2 shows to the bedroom (Non-HD Tivo) and I was surprised to see this on channel 5.

Exact same thing with me. 49 minutes exactly. Same thing also happened to me last week with Jericho. I am going mad trying to figure this out.

Exact same thing with me. 49 minutes exactly. Same thing also happened to me last week with Jericho. I am going mad trying to figure this out.There was a comment about this yesterday here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=10453728&&#post10453728)
What is your version of SARA? If it is 1.88 something, that is the problem. If so, complain bitterly to your cable company and try to get them to push the 1.89 version to you.

i suggest using a new prophylactic every time.
It was only a matter of time. ;)

I continue having problems with tileing, pixelation and complete gray screen on one of the network HD channels in particular and somewhat less on other HD channels. Minutes ago, just after the Derby ended, channel went Gray and stayed that way for several minutes. With SARA 1.89.18.1, diagnostics pg 5/39 shows no errors. Should I be looking elsewhere?

I continue having problems with tileing, pixelation and complete gray screen on one of the network HD channels in particular and somewhat less on other HD channels. Minutes ago, just after the Derby ended, channel went Gray and stayed that way for several minutes. With SARA 1.89.18.1, diagnostics pg 5/39 shows no errors. Should I be looking elsewhere?

Look at page 5 - let us know the levels there - particularly S/N.

xnappo

What is your version of SARA? If it is 1.88 something, that is the problem. If so, complain bitterly to your cable company and try to get them to push the 1.89 version to you.

It has been awhile since I checked but it was 1.99.100 something if I recall correctly.
Same problem with Jericho thank goodness the episodes are on the web to watch.

It has been awhile since I checked but it was 1.99.100 something if I recall correctly.
Same problem with Jericho thank goodness the episodes are on the web to watch.

Cablevision is still on 1.88 the short recordings are due to issues with the broadcast channels. The NYC FOX and CBS stations were/are having breakup problems on their HD channels. It's effecting all providers and OTA and even people with S3 Tivo's are getting short recordings.

If it is an issue with the broadcast channels, and not the STB, how is it that many people stop this occuring by hard re-booting their STB?

If it is an issue with the broadcast channels, and not the STB, how is it that many people stop this occuring by hard re-booting their STB?
Hard reboots will fix memory issues that cause short recordings. The recent short recordings that were happening on WNYW and WCBS were due to signal breakups from the broadcasters.

Ok, the first/second posts have once again become one. I've edited out a lot of "the", "a", "button", etc., and tried to shorten some other things. If I've gone to far, I'm sure someone will let me know (RussB, please do your usual great job of finding my mistakes :) ).

I also added the link to xnappo's Passport SATA database.

Ok, the first/second posts have once again become one. I've edited out a lot of "the", "a", "button", etc., and tried to shorten some other things. If I've gone to far, I'm sure someone will let me know (RussB, please do your usual great job of finding my mistakes :) ).

I also added the link to xnappo's Passport SATA database.

Thanks as always Dave - looks good!

Do you think it would be useful to add this to 'Additional Items of Interest'?:

Image of the SARA Guide:
http://gallery.avsforum.com/data/508/medium/sara_guide.JPG

Image of the Passport Guide:
http://gallery.avsforum.com/data/508/medium/passport_guide.JPG

Regards,
xnappo

Thanks as always Dave - looks good!

Do you think it would be useful to add this to 'Additional Items of Interest'?:

Image of the SARA Guide:
http://gallery.avsforum.com/data/508/medium/sara_guide.JPG

Image of the Passport Guide:
http://gallery.avsforum.com/data/508/medium/passport_guide.JPG

Regards,
xnappoYou bet, consider it done.

There was/is a mandate that cable companies provide a HD STB with 'functional' 1394 interfaces by April 1, 2004 upon request. And there is a mandate that HD STBs acquired by cable operators after July 1, 2005 include a 1394 interface. It has been debated on whether this means it has to be functional or just be there. I think it means it has to be functional.Click here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7131770&&#post7131770) to go to my post that explains this. There are some posts before (#1447) and after (#1478) it that are relevant. This discussion was over a year ago.

Even if you get a 8300HD with working firewire ports, they will not work with a PC because it doesn't provide sufficent protection to prevent illegal copying of programs. A D-VHS recorder or TV with firewire ports is needed to use the firewire ports.

Back in 2004 I had an 8000HD hooked up to a HTPC via firewire, and I was able to record HD programs without any issues through media center. Have they disabled the port completely on the 8300?

Back in 2004 I had an 8000HD hooked up to a HTPC via firewire, and I was able to record HD programs without any issues through media center. Have they disabled the port completely on the 8300?No, but many channels now have 5C copy-protection flags that limit copying of content from those channels, like HBO, etc.

Is there a bug on how it decides what to record. For instance I have Sopranos set to record same channel same time. I also have 24 and Heros set to record on Monday's at 9pm. Well tonight luckily I was sitting here and it decided to take the Sopranos priority over Heros. This has only happened a few times. Last week it recorded 24 and Heros properly. Although my guide shows all three highlighted red only two will record. It's as if it flips a coin and there is an odd man out on what it wants to record.

You bet, consider it done.

Looks good, thanks!

xnappo

Is there a bug on how it decides what to record. For instance I have Sopranos set to record same channel same time. I also have 24 and Heros set to record on Monday's at 9pm. Well tonight luckily I was sitting here and it decided to take the Sopranos priority over Heros. This has only happened a few times. Last week it recorded 24 and Heros properly. Although my guide shows all three highlighted red only two will record. It's as if it flips a coin and there is an odd man out on what it wants to record.Not sure why you'd call it a bug since there is no "defined" scheme in play. FWIW, I believe there has been some sort of a conflict resolution scheme added to a recent release though, but I have been unable to pin down any specifics.

In tonight's case, I believe it chose Sopranos and 24 over Heroes because Heroes runs over by 1 minute. I don't know what the schedule was last week, but it appears to simply have chosen the 2 recordings that best fill the timeslot. You didn't say if you have anything scheduled in the next timeslot that could have had an influence, but like you, I would have chosen the 2 Series recordings over the timeslot recording.

I checked Titan/Excite for next week's schedule, but it only says all programs are 1 hour, including tonight's Heroes which is 1 hr 1 min. So, I'l have to wait until tomorrow to look at next weeks schedule to see if the situation will be the same. If it is, then I assume it will once again choose Sporanos and 24 over Heroes.

Not sure why you'd call it a bug since there is no "defined" scheme in play. FWIW, I believe there has been some sort of a conflict resolution scheme added to a recent release though, but I have been unable to pin down any specifics.

In tonight's case, I believe it chose Sopranos and 24 over Heroes because Heroes runs over by 1 minute. I don't know what the schedule was last week, but it appears to simply have chosen the 2 recordings that best fill the timeslot. You didn't say if you have anything scheduled in the next timeslot that could have had an influence, but like you, I would have chosen the 2 Series recordings over the timeslot recording.

I checked Titan/Excite for next week's schedule, but it only says all programs are 1 hour, including tonight's Heroes which is 1 hr 1 min. So, I'l have to wait until tomorrow to look at next weeks schedule to see if the situation will be the same. If it is, then I assume it will once again choose Sporanos and 24 over Heroes.

Thanks DD,

I guess bug was a term I used loosely in this situation. I didn't notice that Hero's was scheduled to run 1 min over. FWIW I did record Sopranos in it's original timeslot on Sunday at 9:00pm. So what I had to do last night was cancel the Sopranos recording then scroll to next week and re-add it to the recording list. I just wish they had changed the record all option to add "record all in this timeslot anyday" and left the "record all in this timeslot this day" instead of changing it and leaving only two options. Also there may be a way that I'm not aware of but when there is a conflict recording and you have to cancel a recording it deletes the season pass instead of an individual recording.

I've searched this forum for a bit, it might have been answered but I have been unable to find it. I am used to the Tivo tuner swap feature, allowing you to switch between two channels and having both being recorded. Apparently you can do this with a motorola unit. Does anyone know if you can do it with the SA 8300HD unit?

Thanks

FWIW I did record Sopranos in it's original timeslot on Sunday at 9:00pm. So what I had to do last night was cancel the Sopranos recording then scroll to next week and re-add it to the recording list. I just wish they had changed the record all option to add "record all in this timeslot anyday" and left the "record all in this timeslot this day" instead of changing it and leaving only two options. Also there may be a way that I'm not aware of but when there is a conflict recording and you have to cancel a recording it deletes the season pass instead of an individual recording.

You don't have the "first run" option?

Even if the SARA software version has the option, some local guide information does not contain the [properly formatted information]. Same thing in El Paso, no 'First Run' option, so we do everything manually.

v/r,
C-F

I've searched this forum for a bit, it might have been answered but I have been unable to find it. I am used to the Tivo tuner swap feature, allowing you to switch between two channels and having both being recorded. Apparently you can do this with a motorola unit. Does anyone know if you can do it with the SA 8300HD unit?

Thanks

Sure (if I understand correctly). Hit PiP->Swap->PiP.

xnappo

I guess bug was a term I used loosely in this situation.Many people do, but it's simply poor design vs a bug. :)

I just wish they had changed the record all option to add "record all in this timeslot anyday" and left the "record all in this timeslot this day" instead of changing it and leaving only two options.You didn't mention what software version you are using, but 1.89.x.x (and perhaps some 1.88.x.x versions) has 4 options:
This channel, First run
This channel, This day, This time
This channel, Any time
This channel, Any day, This time
As someone else pointed out though, the database needs to contain the data for these options to work, specificially the First Run flag.
Also there may be a way that I'm not aware of but when there is a conflict recording and you have to cancel a recording it deletes the season pass instead of an individual recording.Unfortunately, this is the way it currently works and it is a PITA. Hopefully, this is also something that gets changed at some point.

I've searched this forum for a bit, it might have been answered but I have been unable to find it. I am used to the Tivo tuner swap feature, allowing you to switch between two channels and having both being recorded. Apparently you can do this with a motorola unit. Does anyone know if you can do it with the SA 8300HD unit?Huh? If both tuners are being recorded, simply changing channels takes you from one to the other, though you do get a Change Channel Notice screen asking you to press Sel if you really want to change. Perhaps I don't understand the question.

Huh? If both tuners are being recorded, simply changing channels takes you from one to the other, though you do get a Change Channel Notice screen asking you to press Sel if you really want to change. Perhaps I don't understand the question.I interpreted his comments the same way at first. On further reflection, I think he meant "having two channels buffered simultaneously", so that if you were interested in two programs that were on at the same time, you could watch one up to a commercial break, then swap over to the other program using the other tuner and watch it timeshifted for a few minutes, then switch back to your original program without dumping either buffer.

If that's what he meant, then I think xnappo's reply this morning might do the trick, though I've never tried that PIP-swap technique before.

Personally, if I were ever in that situation, I'd just record one or both of the programs. I don't see any benefit in using the timeshift buffer(s) for this purpose, and I'd be seriously torqued if I accidentally hit the wrong button (like ch up/down) and wiped out the buffer.

You may be right. I've seen a post or 2 mention using PIP/Pause to view 2 live programs, but I've never tried the technique myself. Like you, I see no need when both can be recorded and viewed at leisure.

I reread the OP and am still not sure. The difference with Tivo/Moto is that they both might have bookmarks to return you to the same location between switches or they automativally pause or something. With SARA you'd have to be pretty handy with the Pause, etc., to avoid dumping one or both buffers by accident as you said.

I suppose the technique would be useful to keep track of 2 sports events in relative real-time and not miss any action, but I can't envision ever doing that myself. Even now I record Nextel and NHRA racing. I usually watch one live (or join in progress) and then watch the other. I can't see myself switching back and forth, pausing, etc.

At any rate, I think the OP has enough info to answer the question. :)

I tried it once when the wife was interrupted and had placed her show on pause. (Mostly because I have not internalized all the gotcha's about hitting record for a show in progress and I loose parts most times.)

I learned to not gamble...

v/r,
C-F

I have an 8300HD with Cox in Fairfax county VA and right now my box is only sending the signal to the tv in 1080i. I figure I should have it send the signal in its original format and let my sharp aquos convert it to 1080p. On this forum I have seen the pass-through option as the one I want for this purpose but I can't find it when I press settings twice and look at Set Picture Format. I only see fixed, auto dvi/hdmi, upconvert 1, upconvert 2? Do I have a different version or a newer software that does not have that option? If so then what option should I use and how should I get the cable box to not do any upconverts on the signal?

Thanks.

I believe its "auto dvi/hmdi" try that one. Does your TV have an info or displa button that will show you the incoming resolution? You can test to see what its passing then. Fox and ABC are 720p and NBC and CBS are 1080i. So you can switch between those channels and see if it sees a different incoming signal.

ETA: I forgot there is also a setup where you can pick what resolutions to pass. I forget how to get to that one, but you would what to have them all selected.

I have an 8300HD with Cox in Fairfax county VA and right now my box is only sending the signal to the tv in 1080i. I figure I should have it send the signal in its original format and let my sharp aquos convert it to 1080p. On this forum I have seen the pass-through option as the one I want for this purpose but I can't find it when I press settings twice and look at Set Picture Format

The "pass-through" option doesn't show up if you have an HDMI cable connecting your 8300HD to your TV. It's there only for component connections. The "auto dvi/hdmi" option is supposed to pass the original signals's resolution to your TV, but many people find that the box reverts to 480i when you turn it off, or if you switch inputs on the TV to a DVD player or any source other than the box.

I have an 8300HD with Cox in Fairfax county VA and right now my box is only sending the signal to the tv in 1080i. I figure I should have it send the signal in its original format and let my sharp aquos convert it to 1080p. On this forum I have seen the pass-through option as the one I want for this purpose but I can't find it when I press settings twice and look at Set Picture Format. I only see fixed, auto dvi/hdmi, upconvert 1, upconvert 2? Do I have a different version or a newer software that does not have that option? If so then what option should I use and how should I get the cable box to not do any upconverts on the signal?The Display Format Summary section in the first post explains that Auto-HDMI replaces Pass-Through if you use HDMI. There is also some info in the first post on what the different formats are, especially the 480i/p Standard and Widescreen formats. You don't want to simply enable all of them.

There was a comment about this yesterday
What is your version of SARA? If it is 1.88 something, that is the problem. If so, complain bitterly to your cable company and try to get them to push the 1.89 version to you.

Yup. 1.88.23.a100. I am going to try to see what they say about 1.89...

I just got an 8300HD dvr recently and sometimes i am using my tv when the cable box is off (playing video games, watching dvds) and I've noticed that the dvr appears to turn on the hardrive, turn it off, repeated. I never noticed this with my old non-HD dvr but I also always had that box turned on when I used the tv. Is it doing maintenance or defragging or something?

The Display Format Summary section in the first post explains that Auto-HDMI replaces Pass-Through if you use HDMI. There is also some info in the first post on what the different formats are, especially the 480i/p Standard and Widescreen formats. You don't want to simply enable all of them.

Great thanks. I flew right over that part. My tv does the stretching so I should only enable 1080i, 720p, and regular 480i/p and disable the widescreen options.

Thanks.

I just got an 8300HD dvr recently and sometimes i am using my tv when the cable box is off (playing video games, watching dvds) and I've noticed that the dvr appears to turn on the hardrive, turn it off, repeated. I never noticed this with my old non-HD dvr but I also always had that box turned on when I used the tv. Is it doing maintenance or defragging or something?
It's buffering the show on the last station to which you were tuned (i.e. "pause live TV").

TTx

Cynagen PM'd me this tip (thanks). I'm not sure how useful it will be, but the following section has been added to the first post. It might be useful for those who use 1080i and then want to use 720p for sporting events without redoing the setup.

Change Default Format. Default format can be changed without going through Setup Wizard:
Press/hold Select until Mail LED lights.
Press Vol Down (-) button - display changes to "HdSr" (HD Screen Resolution?)
Press Ch Up (+) for 480i
Press Ch Down (-) for 480p
Press Vol Down (-) for 720p
Press Vol Up (+) for 1080iNote: Does not appear to work using remote.

I played around with the Change Default Format tip a bit yesterday, trying the different settings. Somehow I ended up locked in HD Zoom mode and lost the Picture Size option in Quick Settings. I tried resetting to 1080i, then tried the Setup Wizard, etc. A reboot eventually fixed it and returned the Size option. I admit I might have pressed some other button combinations, but I'd like someone else (RussB ?, RemyM ?) to play around with the tip just to be sure the indicated buttons react as they should and aren't what got me stuck in zoom mode.

Great thanks. I flew right over that part. My tv does the stretching so I should only enable 1080i, 720p, and regular 480i/p and disable the widescreen options.
No, you should enable all the formats your TV can handle, ordinarily. Only disable the widescreen options if your TV cannot display them correctly.

Probably one of three things has happened:

(1) Your external drive is no longer being "seen" by the 8300--possibly due to the SATA cable's becoming disconnected, partially or otherwise, or

(2) Your external hard drive has failed, or

(3) You have a bad encosure.

The fact that all of your recordings still appear in the Recorded List--and that some still play--is proof that the internal hard drive is still working. If your external drive has not failed, and if you are able to reconnect it and it is recognized by the 8300, your recordings should still be there and available to you to watch.

Have you checked the diagnostic screens to see how much disk space is being reported, and also whether or not a second drive is being reported? Do that first, then power down and check all cables, starting with the cabling in your external enclosure. Make sure all cables are firmly seated, then reconnect the external hard drive, power it on and wait for it to spin up, then do another hard reboot and see if you get the message that the external has been detected and will work with the 8300. Even if you don't get that message, see if you can access any of the recorded programs that were unavailable before. If so, it was a cabling problem. If not, put the hard drive in your computer and run diagnostics on it. If it tests bad, and is still under warranty, send it back to the manufacturer. If it tests okay, then you may have a bad enclosure. Otherwise, I'm out of ideas!

Let us know the outcome.

Scarlett
Scarlett,

It has taken some time for me to try your advice, but life got in the way. I ran the diags via my PC (SeaTools/Seagate) and it showed to be ok. I reconnected the HDD to the DVR and after three "hard boots", she came to life. Odd. My old recordings are still accessible (5 Heroes episodes, etc), so I'm a happy camper. Thanks again for the assist!

TTx

No, you should enable all the formats your TV can handle, ordinarily. Only disable the widescreen options if your TV cannot display them correctly.Not necessarily false, but that may only be because the unit defaults to the Standard format if both Standard and WS formats are enabled. If you enable the WS format, then the 8300 does the stretching for SD channels and most folks want their TVs to do that because the TV does a better job, hence the Standard option. Enabling both may not do any harm, but it doesn't do any good either. Either you want the 8300 to do the stretching (WS) or you want your TV to do it (Standard). Enabling both causes the 8300 to have to make a decision when tuned to an SD (4:3) channel and that can lead to unexpected results.

I finally got around to viewing an episode of 24 that was reported as 52 minutes. What actually happened was that the 8 minutes were missing from several spots in the middle of the recording. I actually reached the end of the show. I am not sure if that helps anybody explain what caused the loss of minutes. Since I have done a hard re-boot this issue has not reappeared. Shows on CBS, FOX and ABC were reported as less than one hour. All in the period of April 20 through May 3. Cablevision is my provider.

genes,

It's still difficult to pinpoint what actually happened after the fact. Most of us have had unexplained reboots, etc., from time to time. Sometimes we know the cableco is doing some testing and signals might get crossed. If you are missing content in the middle of recordings, that usually indicates that the unit rebooted, maybe more than once. When that happens, recording stops until the boot is finished and then resumes recording, hence the missing content. Sometimes people report similar problems with sleected channels, mainly FOX, but again, it's virtually impossible to pinpoint what happened, especially if you weren't there at the time. When they first released the 8300 here, they seemed to be always sending some kind of signals that caused problems. Also, they might be troubleshooting a problem for someone and simply got the address wrong when they sent a reboot signal and your box ended up getting rebooted. These kinds of problems are why some users reboot weekly, monthly, etc.

DoubleDaz,

No reboot took place, I was in the room when it was recording. Also the periods of lost content were all shorter than the time a re-boot takes. There have been some reports of trouble with the Cablevision transmission in this period. But, it is curious that the problem stopped when I took your advice and did a hard re-boot. I am trying to determine the cause so that I can prevent this in the future.

Maybe if enough people stopped paying for the DVR service, the cable companies will insist that their software providers get the bugs out of SARA and Passport!

Meanwhile, why not use either a DVD recorder or, heaven forbid, VHS machine to time-shift programs that you probably will watch only once. I mean, I like 24, but would I ever watch an episode of this terrorism soap opera more than once? Once you've followed the plot, is there anything else to see on a second viewing?

Meanwhile, why not use either a DVD recorder or, heaven forbid, VHS machine to time-shift programs that you probably will watch only once. Well, one reason is that these methods are NOT HD! :rolleyes:

Meanwhile, why not use either a DVD recorder or, heaven forbid, VHS machine to time-shift programs that you probably will watch only once. At first look, I was thinking: Wow, I kind of look at that completely opposite. I would only record to media* something I want to keep and DVR the stuff I only want to watch and delete.

But on a second reading: I hope you have not already given up your DVR to start off the protest, that [method of change] pretty much always falls victim to apathy and/or "The Tragedy of the Commons"...

* DVD or VCR (I can do anamorphic again now with SARA :) ) or HTPC/MAC/IEE1394 when I get around to being fancy and storing HD.

v/r,
C-F

Well, one reason is that these methods are NOT HD! :rolleyes:

If I wanted to save stuff permanently in HD, I sure wouldn't want to depend on the hard drive in my cable box for long-term storage, since my cable provider's solution to every problem is "reboot; if it doesn't fix the problem, bring in your cable box and exchange it." Bye-bye, saved programs...

So I've chosen not to pay the extra $6/month that TWC (northeast Ohio) wants from me to turn on the DVR service in the SA8300HD box. Oh, and that hard drive is spinning all the time, even though I'm not paying for the DVR service.

If I wanted to save stuff permanently in HD, I sure wouldn't want to depend on the hard drive in my cable box for long-term storage, since my cable provider's solution to every problem is "reboot; if it doesn't fix the problem, bring in your cable box and exchange it." Bye-bye, saved programs...

So I've chosen not to pay the extra $6/month that TWC (northeast Ohio) wants from me to turn on the DVR service in the SA8300HD box. Oh, and that hard drive is spinning all the time, even though I'm not paying for the DVR service.But you were talking about "time-shifting":Meanwhile, why not use either a DVD recorder or, heaven forbid, VHS machine to time-shift programs that you probably will watch only once.. And I answered the "why not".

But wait: I now see that all you want to do is to bash the 8300. I see that now. :rolleyes:

The problem is that what one user considers bugs another considers simple design flaws. And there are many, many reasons for those, not the least of which are copyrighted/patented features/processes that someone considers too expensive to license at any point in time, the need to support legacy hardware, and simple oversight. Then there are the different cableco's doing things differently enough to cause their users unnecessary problems, problems that many of us never experience with the same hardware/software.

As I've said many times, I have no real problems with the 8300/SARA and Cox here in Phoenix has provided me a sufficient signal to minimize problems. I know there are others here in this thread who, like me, have not experienced lost/missed/short recordings. That makes it difficult for me to join in any boycott of something that does what it purports to do, albeit maybe less efficiently than some other DVRs, but does them nonetheless. Anyone dissatisfied certainly has options, even those who cannot receive a satellite signals.

The biggest single problem cable continues to face is the myriad of different systems. OCAP will help in that regard. Using a single source for IPG data would also help standardize things. Cableco's continue to act like they are in competition with one another when the plain fact is that they don't difrectly compete against one another except in a very few isolated areas. Does anyone really think TWC is going to over-wire a Cox market and compete directly? They should be banding together to solve common problems and standardize things so they can reduce overall costs and better compete with satellite and the telco's.

Just my $.02 worth.

If I wanted to save stuff permanently in HD, I sure wouldn't want to depend on the hard drive in my cable box for long-term storage, since my cable provider's solution to every problem is "reboot; if it doesn't fix the problem, bring in your cable box and exchange it." Bye-bye, saved programs....And I don't know of a single DVR on the market by any vendor that is designed for the purpose of "archiving" any content, including HD. I don't know for sure, but I don't think anyone has invented a medium thats last forever either and all PC-like devices, including DVRs, are subject to failure of one component or another. I could be wrong, but I believe every current DVR can off-load content to DVD or tape one way or another, though maybe not in HD. Many, including the 8300, can off-load HD content, subject to copy-protection rules of course. So, you can record/watch/delete any program and you can off-load "allowed" content to other media for long term archiving. What's the beef?

Maybe if enough people stopped paying for the DVR service, the cable companies will insist that their software providers get the bugs out of SARA and Passport!
Or maybe that would give them the opportunity to push some scheme where they have more control and we have less. No thanks.

Actually, I would suggest the exact opposite. That is, if people don't subscribe to the DVR service, then there is little incentive, financial or otherwise, to improve the software. But, when it is selling, it is likely to get the attention.

Isn't this all quite moot anyway given the advent of open cable box competition coming soon to your neighborhood? Maybe I'm mistaken on this. But, once this happens, then the competition will force the improvements (assuming competition really materializes).

why not use either a DVD recorder or, heaven forbid, VHS machine to time-shift programs that you probably will watch only once.

Does a DVD or VHS hold over a week of recordings for when I'm away?
She who can not be ignored would have a huge problem if certain Lifetime programing was not recorded because the 6 hours on the tape was used up taping 2 yankee games while we were on vacation.

bgooch posted some OCAP articles over in the TWC thread. I reposted them in the second post in this thread. Since I've merged the first 2 posts into 1 again, I will try to use the 2nd post for this kind of temporary infomation and add a link to the 1st post.

Does a DVD or VHS hold over a week of recordings for when I'm away?
She who can not be ignored would have a huge problem if certain Lifetime programing was not recorded because the 6 hours on the tape was used up taping 2 yankee games while we were on vacation.

To each, his/her own. I can't see the point of watching games that have already taken place. After all, you know the score--all the suspense is gone. But that's just me :rolleyes:

Maybe if enough people stopped paying for the DVR service, the cable companies will insist that their software providers get the bugs out of SARA and Passport!

Meanwhile, why not use either a DVD recorder or, heaven forbid, VHS machine to time-shift programs that you probably will watch only once. I mean, I like 24, but would I ever watch an episode of this terrorism soap opera more than once? Once you've followed the plot, is there anything else to see on a second viewing?One reason I wouldn't want to go back to only using a VHS machine or a DVD recorder is that you can only record one program at a time. For example, if you are not watching TV on Wednesday evening at 9 PM CT and want to record both CSI: NY and Lost it is impossible to do using only a VHS machine or a DVD recorder but it is simple to do with a DVR.

Many people do, but it's simply poor design vs a bug. :)

You didn't mention what software version you are using, but 1.89.x.x (and perhaps some 1.88.x.x versions) has 4 options:
This channel, First run
This channel, This day, This time
This channel, Any time
This channel, Any day, This time
As someone else pointed out though, the database needs to contain the data for these options to work, specificially the First Run flag.
Unfortunately, this is the way it currently works and it is a PITA. Hopefully, this is also something that gets changed at some point.

1.88.25.1

Sorry it took me so long to respond. Wedding coming up 11 days :eek:

One thing though. As I was flipping through the menus one of the screens had a bunch of Software Anomalie Warnings on it. Whats that?

One thing though. As I was flipping through the menus one of the screens had a bunch of Software Anomalie Warnings on it. Whats that?I have tons of those too, so I don'tthink it's anything to worry about and I seriously doubt they have anything to do with your problems. Are your recording options different than those I posted?

Oh, and congrats on the wedding.

I have tons of those too, so I don'tthink it's anything to worry about and I seriously doubt they have anything to do with your problems. Are your recording options different than those I posted?

Oh, and congrats on the wedding.

Yes I only have the two options. On this channel any day in this time slot and on this channel at any time.

Is there a way to find out when a software rollout is due or can I request one?

About the wedding. Thanks. I'm glad it's winding down to be honest.

Yes I only have the two options. On this channel any day in this time slot and on this channel at any time.

Is there a way to find out when a software rollout is due or can I request one?

About the wedding. Thanks. I'm glad it's winding down to be honest.
You can always ask, but I suspect they'll wait now until OCAP, etc., later this year, assuming they are working on that. You're probably missing the First Run option because they need to upgrade their IPG data. The option has been in the software since at least 1.85.x.x. The other option, naturtally the one you really want, is in 1.89.x.x and that kind of leaves you out there for now. I suspect if you had the First Run option, you might not need the other one as much, but they will probably wait to upgrade both the software and IPG when they implement the other stuff. If you can talk to someone in engineering, you can probably have a fairly good conversation, but I doubt any 1st/2nd tier CSR will have an idea what you are talking about.

FWIW, weddings are always a source of anxiety. My youngest daughter and I both eloped to escape all that, but I got enough of it when my oldest got married. I was glad when that was over too, but it was all worth it. :)

My youngest daughter and I both eloped to escape all that, but I got enough of it when my oldest got married.

That really didn't come out right :)

xnappo

That really didn't come out right :)
Good catch! :)

Has anyone setup a database showing a go/no go for using HDMI AVRs with the new firmware?

Is it now a known good capability? I've seen posts that HDMI switching works with some receivers and doesn't with others both pre- and post- 1.89 firmware.

I'm trying to be sure 8300 -HDMI> AVR -HDMI> TV will work before I drop money into a new AVR, but I guess there's always component and optical. :(

Many, including the 8300, can off-load HD content, subject to copy-protection rules of course. So, you can record/watch/delete any program and you can off-load "allowed" content to other media for long term archiving. What's the beef?

My beef is that the length of this thread and several others attest to the poor design of the 8300HD and its various software options. Yet those of us getting cable are stuck paying for this piece of ____ if our cable company chose it for HD and we don't want Cable Card (which has other problems, like no access to On Demand features).

I read through a few dozen pages of this thread but didn't see an answer to what I was looking for. In the intrest of me not going blind, could someone give me an answer on this question?
I know that to get frame by frame advance, I should hit pause, and then the FF or RR buttons become the frame by frame. But when I do this, I just get fast forward or reverse. No frame by frame. Am I doing something wrong?

Try hitting PLAY two times quickly. This info would be found in your 8300HD manual and/or the remote manual.

Hitting play twice gives me slow motion. Not the same.
The manual says to get frame by frame to hit pause. The the FF button would give me frame by frame each time I hit it after that. Doesn't work.

Hitting play twice gives me slow motion. Not the same.
The manual says to get frame by frame to hit pause. The the FF button would give me frame by frame each time I hit it after that. Doesn't work.
If you think about it, hitting FF would simply give you FF whether you're at PLAY or PAUSE. I know that doesn't answer your question, but I it seems internally at conflict.

If you think about it, hitting FF would simply give you FF whether you're at PLAY or PAUSE. I know that doesn't answer your question, but I it seems internally at conflict.

I agree. Was just going by what the manual claims will work. It lied. Figured that I wasn't the only one, and someone would know the "trick" to making it really work.

The manual says to get frame by frame to hit pause. Then the FF button would give me frame by frame each time I hit it after that. Doesn't work.

It works that way for me.

It works that way for me.

Hmmm... I have two and it doesn't work for either of them. Has anyone else ran in to this bug?

What software version is the box running?

How do I find that out? Is it in settings?

The instructions are in the first post of the thread.

Thanks. I'll go back.

Looks like this one: Image of Passport IPG

Looks like this one: Image of Passport IPGThis thread is for the SARA software version of the 8300HD. Using SARA, pressing Pause and then FF does do frame-by-frame advance.

The manual you read that gives that sequence was likely for the SARA software. (SARA is a Scientific Atlanta product, and is the "default" user interface for the box. Cablecos can choose to use a different user interface, like Passport, instead of SARA, but then the SciAtl manual is no longer very useful.) I have never seen a Passport user manual.

This thread is for the SARA software version of the 8300HD. Using SARA, pressing Pause and then FF does do frame-by-frame advance.

The manual you read that gives that sequence was likely for the SARA software. (SARA is a Scientific Atlanta product, and is the "default" user interface for the box. Cablecos can choose to use a different user interface, like Passport, instead of SARA, but then the SciAtl manual is no longer very useful.) I have never seen a Passport user manual.This brings up a point. There have been lots of "little" features (like this) that SARA has and Passport doesn't. While Passport is claimed to have a more "TiVo-Like" interface, SARA seems to have the hardware functionality more fully developed.

But, unfortunately, the individual doesn't get to choose (unless he chooses to move).

This is not a good example for that though. PASSPORT does frame by frame using PAUSE and the cursor buttons, subject to the REW [suspected jump to fully formed frame] limitation/design feature. Actually, they can hold down the cursor buttons to get forward [slow-motion] without having to time the double-tap on PLAY. Holding FF on SARA does not seem to work for me here.


Am I the only one who sees a bunch of replies to pepar, but not all of his messages?

v/r,
C-F

My beef is that the length of this thread and several others attest to the poor design of the 8300HD and its various software options. Yet those of us getting cable are stuck paying for this piece of ____ if our cable company chose it for HD and we don't want Cable Card (which has other problems, like no access to On Demand features).The thread is long and many complaints/problems have been addressed/fixed with the latest software, though it is still nowhere near Tivo in feature set. The design of the 8300 (or any other DVR for that matter) has little to do with your initial post/complaint. No matter what DVR you use, you are subject to HDD failure and loss of recorded content. I and others have 8300's that are well over 2 years old and they are still going strong with few/none of the problems others have had. If you read through the thread and pay attention to the posters location/cableco/version you will see that many problems are cabelco-oriented to specific versions of the software, usually unique versions for a specific cableco.

Also, software design it very subjective. SARA, Passport, what-have-you all do what they say they will. True, if you don't like it, your only option is to switch services or buy a Tivo S3, but that's life. That's a beef with the cableco for being too cheap to pay for something more to your (and my) liking. Soon, we should have more options avialble to us via OCAP compatible hardware/software, for a price. Just like the Tivo S3, everything comes with a price, and cableco's are just now getting to the point where options become a reality and legacy support tends not to be the limiting factor it has been to date.

FWIW, cablecard only limits your ability to order PPV, etc., through the device, you can still make the phone call to order it.

Am I the only one who sees a bunch of replies to pepar, but not all of his messages?No, you are not. Me guess is he may have deleted them when the discussion was moved to the right thread, Passport.

FWIW, cablecard only limits your ability to order PPV, etc., through the device, you can still make the phone call to order it.Until the cable company implements SDV. :rolleyes:

Until the cable company implements SDV. :rolleyes:

Yep, we have SDV here in Austin. Plus though technically you can order pay-per-view via phone, you can't use in-demand/on-demand pay-per-view which has a much much larger selection.
xnappo

Yep, we have SDV here in Austin. Plus though technically you can order pay-per-view via phone, you can't use in-demand/on-demand pay-per-view which has a much much larger selection.
xnappoYeah. probably a bad argument and not what he's looking for anyway. See my sig, right Dave? Of course, one can always buy an S3 and keep a cable tuner/DVR around for PPV/VOD. The bottom line is there are always alternatives, maybe just not cost-effective ones or ones that a given user wants/can afford. OCAP should help as will alternatives via Verizon FIOS, etc. Post Feb 2009 should provide even more alternativers, but my guess is cable will continue to hold it's own, though it will surely lose share as alternatives enter the arena.

I deleted my 'First Run only on this channel' for "Boston Legal" because it was preempted this week and the DVR would not allow me to record two other shows at the same time even though "Boston Legal" was not in the Electronic Program Guide. I tried to recreate the 'First Run only on this channel' for "Boston Legal" the next day after the other recordings were made but it wouldn't let me because I have a 'First Run only on this channel' for "Desperate Housewives" and "Brothers & Sisters". I am on SARA version 1.88.25.1 and the place-holders are 9 days out. I know I can record "Boston Legal" using a manual recording or selecting the show before it and changing the times. Is there any workaround to allow me to set up a place-holder for "Boston Legal" without deleting the place-holders for "Desperate Housewives" and "Brothers & Sisters"?

Just wait to five days before the scheduled show (today) when Boston Legal will show up in the program guide and you should be able to set it up.

The lst two nights, I set a manual four-hour recording for the Baseball game and started watching from the beginning about 45 minutes later. Each night the recording stopped when I reached a point about 20 minutes behind. I have an external hard drive attached (SARA), which has been working with only a few momentary dropouts. The fan on the drive is making lots of noise and running around the clock. Any thoughts?

The lst two nights, I set a manual four-hour recording for the Baseball game and started watching from the beginning about 45 minutes later. Each night the recording stopped when I reached a point about 20 minutes behind. I have an external hard drive attached (SARA), which has been working with only a few momentary dropouts. The fan on the drive is making lots of noise and running around the clock. Any thoughts?Well, you could try unplugging the drive and clearing enough room on the internal drive to capture a 4-hr HD recording, and see if the problem repeats.

I deleted my 'First Run only on this channel' for "Boston Legal" because it was preempted this week and the DVR would not allow me to record two other shows at the same time even though "Boston Legal" was not in the Electronic Program Guide. I tried to recreate the 'First Run only on this channel' for "Boston Legal" the next day after the other recordings were made but it wouldn't let me because I have a 'First Run only on this channel' for "Desperate Housewives" and "Brothers & Sisters". I am on SARA version 1.88.25.1 and the place-holders are 9 days out. I know I can record "Boston Legal" using a manual recording or selecting the show before it and changing the times. Is there any workaround to allow me to set up a place-holder for "Boston Legal" without deleting the place-holders for "Desperate Housewives" and "Brothers & Sisters"?My 8300 recorded Boston Legal too, but I don't recall what the IPG showed here. The recording displayed Boston Legal in the list.

I've always believed there are two title fields in the actual database, one for display and one for recording, but don't ask me to prove it. I've used this technique in the past when I've had to abbreviate a field for display but retain the original data. This is the only thing that I know of that explains recording problems like this and your need to delete the scheduled recording in order to schedule the others. I know there are other techniques to do the same thing, but they don't explain the "incorrect" recordings. "Boston Legal" had to be in the database somewhere. IMHO my argument is bolstered by the fact that DWS started at 8:00 and BL is normally slotted at 9:00 (AZ time). I believe the part of the IPG we don't see was incorrect.

I didn't try to record anything else, so my series recording scheduled next week's episode as expected. Also, I'm running SARA 1.89.19.1, so the place-holders are not 9 days out like they were in 1.88. Unfortunately, since the 1.88 place-holders do keep you from scheduling what it "thinks" is a 3rd recording, there is little you can do until you get 1.89 or until next fall. You "might" be able to schedule it after the IPG updates next Tuesday morning. Like I mention in the first post, the place-holders do get reset, but I'm not sure what happens now that DH and B&S are done for the season. I assume both timeslots are highlighted in your current IPG.

"Boston Legal" had to be in the database somewhere. IMHO my argument is bolstered by the fact that DWS started at 8:00 and BL is normally slotted at 9:00 (AZ time). I believe the part of the IPG we don't see was incorrect.

A first run Boston Legal was in the IPG when the Tuesday 5/22 data first came out and it scheduled it to record. Then ABC made a change and pushed BL back a week so DWTS could be 2 hours. When the guide data got changed the 8300 didn't notice that BL wasn't airing and instead recorded the last half of DWTS labeled as BL. At one time I thought mine used to recognize when this happened and not record but this is about the 3rd time I have seen this happen.

DoubleDAZ,

You are correct about the two fields in the database but I don't think that was the problem. I think the EPG first downloaded data that had "Boston Legal" being aired but later on the EPG data was updated with "Dancing with the Stars" replacing "Boston Legal" this week. The DVR didn't update its scheduled recordings with the new information and that is why there was a conflict when I tried to record two other shows. This is a known problem with 1.88.25.1, but I don't know if it has been fixed in 1.89.x.x.

The reason "Desperate Housewives" place-holder is preventing me from scheduling "Boston Legal" is that it is scheduled on "Tue 5-29" from 8:00 to 9:02 PM CT. The "Brothers & Sisters" place-holder is scheduled on "Tue 5-29" from 9:02 to 10:00 PM CT. I don't think the place-holders will change until there is a new show in the Fall. Both time slots are highlighted.

I even tried to change the times in the place-holders but they just went back to the original times that they had.

This is not a big deal but more of an annoyance about how SARA handles place-holders. I think I will just have to set a 'First Run only on this channel' for "Boston Legal" in the Fall.

Thanks RemyM, I thought I had seen BL in the IPG at one time for the week. I'm all but positive though that other IPG changes during a given week have been processed correctly by the 8300 software. I don't want to beat a dead horse, but I'd be willing to bet that if we could view the actual database file, all fields, we could see exactly what happened and why the second hour got recorded as BL. I'd also be willing to bet that on the other occassions this has happened to you, it involved the second hour of a last minute change to the first hour program leavidng bad data set for the second hour timeslot. IIRC there was another program that had a First Run episode switched out after the week began not too long ago (Cold Case or something) and the rerun episode was correctly skipped. This would tend to say there is still an IPG check at the time the recording is supposed to start. Not that the 8300 software is full of logic, but it would be kind of illogical to actually schedule a program for recording and not consider last minute IPG updates. I think we'd also see a lot more problems just like this.

DoubleDAZ,

You are correct about the two fields in the database but I don't think that was the problem. I think the EPG first downloaded data that had "Boston Legal" being aired but later on the EPG data was updated with "Dancing with the Stars" replacing "Boston Legal" this week. The DVR didn't update its scheduled recordings with the new information and that is why there was a conflict when I tried to record two other shows. This is a known problem with 1.88.25.1, but I don't know if it has been fixed in 1.89.x.x.

The reason "Desperate Housewives" place-holder is preventing me from scheduling "Boston Legal" is that it is scheduled on "Tue 5-29" from 8:00 to 9:02 PM CT. The "Brothers & Sisters" place-holder is scheduled on "Tue 5-29" from 9:02 to 10:00 PM CT. I don't think the place-holders will change until there is a new show in the Fall. Both time slots are highlighted.

I even tried to change the times in the place-holders but they just went back to the original times that they had.

This is not a big deal but more of an annoyance about how SARA handles place-holders. I think I will just have to set a 'First Run only on this channel' for "Boston Legal" in the Fall.Well, the place-holder problem goes away with 1.89, they are back to 7 days and when using the First Run option, reruns are not highlighted in that timeslot and do not prevent scheduling a new series recording. I have done this often during the different breaks in schedules this year. That's how I found that SARA now employes some kind of conflict resolution.

Tonight I have 2 First Run series scheduled for Shark and GA. However, those did not prevent me from adding a new series First Run schedule for Studio 60 for the next few weeks. If I was still using 1.88, I'd have to cancel one in order to schedule Studio 60 just like you did for BL. If Shark and GA were new next week, one of them wouldn't have been recorded, probably the one (GA) that usually starts a minute or 2 late. I'm not sure what would happen if all 3 started at 9:00 though and haven't been able to set up that specific test. I have confirmed it skips the one that starts off the hour.

I even tried to change the times in the place-holders but they just went back to the original times that they had.

This is not a big deal but more of an annoyance about how SARA handles place-holders. I think I will just have to set a 'First Run only on this channel' for "Boston Legal" in the Fall.

While placeholders don't effect things that were already scheduled. They do prevent you from scheduling a new recording of the show sitting in the same time slot, on the same channel, of the placeholder, except as a manual recording.

At least that's how it is in 1.88. As DoubleDAZ points out in the previous post it's been improved in 1.89, which I'm still waiting for.

..........which I'm still waiting for.I suspect we won't see anything until OCAP is implemented. I've heard nothing about any new releases. veggas?

Well, the place-holder problem goes away with 1.89, they are back to 7 days and when using the First Run option, reruns are not highlighted in that timeslot and do not prevent scheduling a new series recording. I have done this often during the different breaks in schedules this year. That's how I found that SARA now employes some kind of conflict resolution.

Tonight I have 2 First Run series scheduled for Shark and GA. However, those did not prevent me from adding a new series First Run schedule for Studio 60 for the next few weeks. If I was still using 1.88, I'd have to cancel one in order to schedule Studio 60 just like you did for BL. If Shark and GA were new next week, one of them wouldn't have been recorded, probably the one (GA) that usually starts a minute or 2 late. I'm not sure what would happen if all 3 started at 9:00 though and haven't been able to set up that specific test. I have confirmed it skips the one that starts off the hour.In SARA 1.88, reruns are not highlighted and do not prevent other programs from being scheduled. It acts the same as SARA 1.89.x.x, except the placeholder is 9 days out instead of 7 days. I have a First Run scheduled for "Grey's Anatomy" and I was able to set up a First Run for "Studio 60" and set up a 'On this channel at any time' for "Shark." The "Grey's Anatomy" shows are not highlighted because they are reruns. I haven't watched "Shark" very often so I want to catch up on some of the episodes this Summer.

I think the only time place-holders are a problem is at the time they are scheduled for. Either 9 days after the last First Run show for SARA 1.88.x.x or 7 days for SARA 1.89.x.x.

Thanks RemyM, I thought I had seen BL in the IPG at one time for the week. I'm all but positive though that other IPG changes during a given week have been processed correctly by the 8300 software. I don't want to beat a dead horse, but I'd be willing to bet that if we could view the actual database file, all fields, we could see exactly what happened and why the second hour got recorded as BL. I'd also be willing to bet that on the other occassions this has happened to you, it involved the second hour of a last minute change to the first hour program leavidng bad data set for the second hour timeslot. IIRC there was another program that had a First Run episode switched out after the week began not too long ago (Cold Case or something) and the rerun episode was correctly skipped. This would tend to say there is still an IPG check at the time the recording is supposed to start. Not that the 8300 software is full of logic, but it would be kind of illogical to actually schedule a program for recording and not consider last minute IPG updates. I think we'd also see a lot more problems just like this.I have had the same experience that RemyM has had with SARA not cancelling scheduled recordings for First Run if the show was put in the EPG and then later removed. I think if the show is marked as new and then later changed to a repeat it may be handled differently but I haven't tested that.

I just upgraded to an 8300HD DVR. On my previous box, an 8000HD DVR, I could set it to HD mode and view the picture-in-picture in SD on the RF cable output. I have my HD front projector connected to the component outputs and a SD TV on the cable output from the 8300. I really like not having to switch back and forth from HD mode to SD mode as I did before, but I miss being able to watch a HD movie on the big screen and "keep up" with sports scores on the small SD TV in the corner by hitting PIP during the slow parts.

I know you can output SD content with the archive to VCR function but is there any way to view the PIP full screen on the cable or composite out? That the one and only thing I miss about the 8000.

Thanks

BTW, one glitch I've noted since getting SARA 1.89.19.1 is a propensity to seemingly record blank programs. I just tried viewing my recording of Dark Storm from the SciFi Channel from yesterday and it was blank. This has happened a number of times in the past since getting 1.89. I didn't bother to stop the recording playback. I just brought the list up, selected another recording, started it, then brought the list back up, reselected Dark Storm, and it played without further problems. I haven't been able to identify any specific scenario, just that's it's happened a number of times, like once or twice a week out of 30+ recordings per week. The drive is never more than 50% full and I don't keep recordings very long before watching/erasing them. Anyone else?

Sorry, DD, I didn't follow you. By "blank programs", do you mean the DVR is not recording the program correctly? You said that by selecting a different program, then coming back to the problem recording and trying to play it again resolves the problem, so is this just a transient issue and you ultimately gain access to the entire recorded program?

In any event, I have not experienced a problem like this with 1.88.x.x. On very rare occasions (it's happened three times in ~20 months), I will have multiple programs show up on the list that refuse to play back (when I try to start playback, I only get the default playback screen that's there when no program is selected). When this happens, selecting a working recording and then coming back to the problem recording does not resolve the problem. Usually, a hard reboot does solve the problem, although once I had a single program consistently refuse to play back even after multiple reboots, and I eventually had to delete it. That was a couple of months ago, and that specific problem has not recurred.

BTW, one glitch I've noted since getting SARA 1.89.19.1 is a propensity to seemingly record blank programs. I just tried viewing my recording of Dark Storm from the SciFi Channel from yesterday and it was blank. This has happened a number of times in the past since getting 1.89. I didn't bother to stop the recording playback. I just brought the list up, selected another recording, started it, then brought the list back up, reselected Dark Storm, and it played without further problems. I haven't been able to identify any specific scenario, just that's it's happened a number of times, like once or twice a week out of 30+ recordings per week. The drive is never more than 50% full and I don't keep recordings very long before watching/erasing them. Anyone else?This has been mentioned before. Click here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=10278047&&#post10278047) to go to post #5385 and also look at posts 5386 and 5388. There was no real solution, just workarounds to play another recording and then retry the problem recording and if that didn't work to reboot and then retry the problem recording. Sometimes, neither workaround worked and the problem recording never would play.

Ruus,

See, I knew my memory was failing. :)

I didn't recall seeing this before 1.89, but obviously I did, maybe just not as often for the stuff I record. I've been trying to pin it down to certain channels, etc., but no luck so far. I have never had to reboot though, simply switching to another recording and back has always worked for me. Guess I need to add this to the first post for future reference/workaround.

Sorry, DD, I didn't follow you. By "blank programs", do you mean the DVR is not recording the program correctly?I mean I get a blank/black screen when trying to playback some recordings. The Title/Info are there and the recording length is correct, etc. As I mentioned in the previous response to Russ, so far switching recordings has always worked for me.

I think the 2 issues are similar, but different enough to require separate workarounds and I think I'll add them both to the first post. I could add them to the Remaining Bugs section, but I think I'll just add them to the Recording section.

I think the 2 issues are similar, but different enough to require separate workarounds and I think I'll add them both to the first post. I could add them to the Remaining Bugs section, but I think I'll just add them to the Recording section.I guess it's like roaches: If it happened to me, it's probably happened to hundreds of other folks too. But the problem I experienced happens very rarely, and I didn't experience it before I added my external drive (though I have no way to know if that's related or not).

I've always just chalked it up as a "miscellaneous glitch requiring a reboot", like dozens of odd, unrepeatable, and mostly harmless behaviors that Win95 used to exhibit. If I were maintaining the list of bugs, I doubt I'd even add it.

But that's just me.

I doubt I'd even add it.I wouldn't either, but it's easy enough to say:

1. If you get a blank screen, simply switch recordings, then go back and try again. If that doesn't work, try a reboot before giving up/deleting.

2. If you get the Playback Channel screen, try a reboot before giving up/deleting.

... If you get a blank screen ...I have seen something similar, on SARA 1.89.

I was watching TV while recording a program ("60 Minutes" on Phx Cox channel 705), and hit PIP to check another channel, and got the usual small window, with numerals and "REC" to indicate that the other tuner was being used to record a program (actually the same program, but on Cox channel 5, a season pass I had forgotten about), but otherwise the small window was totally black. I closed the PIP window and opened it up again just to make sure it wasn't going to display anything. I don't think I tried a "swap", because I didn't want to "TILT" ("abend", whatever) the 8300HD. I usually try to treat this little toy with kid gloves.

I waited until both recordings had completed, because I know if you cancel one recording while another is underway you may lose both of them, and when I played back the "other" recording -- i.e., "60 Minutes" on channel 5 -- it was fine. I don't recall the exact sequence -- whether I started any other recordings before I looked at the one I expected to be all black, for example.

I say this was similar to what was described in the posts above because I saw something as totally black that later turned out to be a proper recording; it's different because I saw it occur "live". (Gosh -- four paragraphs starting with "I". Gotta work on that!)

Edit... Maybe I should add that Cox channel 5 is one of the ones I often have trouble viewing, apparently because of a low signal level on some QAM channels (103, in this case) by the time it reaches my 8300HD. But in the past, when I had problems with low signal levels, it seemed to manifest itself as short recordings: SNL cut off after something like 80 minutes, for example. In this case, the portions of the channel 5 recording I checked had no visible or audible glitches, and it showed as the correct length in the list of recorded programs.

Just tried that (recording 703/003)and it took a couple of seconds for the small window to kick in, but it eventually displayed the other channel/recording, so it definitely doesn't happen all the time. Oh well, as long as I can add some words to the first post letting folks know there might be times a recording looks blank but isn't and give some workarounds to try. Thanks for the info.

BTW, you can always try me, me, me, me. :)

I believe we had that blank screen on playback problem with an old version on Cablevision. One work around was to channel up and then back to your playback channel.

I'll try to remember to try that if/when it happens again and add it to the first post if it works. I don't get these very often and with summer here, my recording volume is a bit lower until the fall.

I wouldn't either, but it's easy enough to say:

1. If you get a blank screen, simply switch recordings, then go back and try again. If that doesn't work, try a reboot before giving up/deleting.

2. If you get the Playback Channel screen, try a reboot before giving up/deleting.Shouldn't this 2nd one be a HARD reboot. I've had that problem a couple of times in the old days (1.85 - 1.88) and it seemed that the directory was "out of whack" - the Hard Reboot squared it away.

RE: Type 1, yeh, I've observed it too, but never thought much about it. Just discovered on my own the switch recordings thing and moved on. I can't absolutely confirm that it came with 1.89 (could have had it with 1.88).

Shouldn't this 2nd one be a HARD reboot. I've had that problem a couple of times in the old days (1.85 - 1.88) and it seemed that the directory was "out of whack" - the Hard Reboot squared it away.Yes, it should. I knew I should have gone back and checked the OP. :)

RE: Type 1, yeh, I've observed it too, but never thought much about it. Just discovered on my own the switch recordings thing and moved on. I can't absolutely confirm that it came with 1.89 (could have had it with 1.88).Russ mentioned he has it with 1.88 too and I checked the links he gave to find that I mentioned it back with 1.88 also.

I wouldn't either, but it's easy enough to say:

1. If you get a blank screen, simply switch recordings, then go back and try again. If that doesn't work, try a reboot before giving up/deleting.

2. If you get the Playback Channel screen, try a reboot before giving up/deleting.Since you changed number 2 to say hard reboot, shouldn't number 1 also be a hard reboot? I have never been able to tell what problems are fixed with just a reboot and what problems require a hard reboot. The hard reboot seems to create its own problems sometimes (for example, the box starts displaying numbers on the front panel and doesn't finish even after an hour or I get a message stating Advanced Services are not available.) I try a regular reboot first and if that doesn't fix the problem then I try a hard reboot.

The Equipment:
Panasonic Plasma 50pz700u
Panasonic DVD Recorder / VCR combo DMR-ES46VS
Scientific Atlanta 8300HD cable box from TWC (soon to be Comcast)

The setup:
Both boxes are connected to the TV with HDMI cables.

The problem:
After I do the HD Setup Wizard on the cable box, no matter if I do "A" for Easy Setup or choose "B" and do the advanced set up and choose all the screen resolutions.
Everything works initially - all stations come in great, HD is HD, etc.

But if I change inputs on the TV, by clicking TV/Video on the remote and choosing HDMI 2 for the DVD Recorder / VCR combo; as soon as I change inputs, even if the combo drive is off, immediately the cable box switches to 480i mode even though all I did was change inputs. Now the TV is displaying the HDMI 2 input, but the front of the 8300HD shows 480i. I can play DVD's no problem.

Next I change inputs back to the HDMI 1 cable box and sure enough EVERYTHING is in 480i. I go to Settings on the cable box and try changing the Picture Format to DVI/HDMI auto or anything else and it just stays in 480i mode regardless of what setting I choose or what channel I put it on. I have to go thru the whole Setup Wizard again to get the cable box working.

This is driving me nuts and I appreciate any help!

Short answer is to switch to Component and avoid the HDMI/HDCP hassles you are experiencing. Unlike Component, HDMI is not simply a connecting cable, there are some things that happen "behind the scenes" and cause any number of problems.

I don't use HDMI, so I'll let someone else give you the long answer. This and similar HDMI issues have been discussed many, mnay times in this and other 8300 threads. I'd suggest searching, but I wouldn't know what search term to suggest to get useable results.

I have version 1.88.25.1 and just received a new box tonight and I am still get repeats being recorded. As soon as I got the box hooked up tonight I went through and programed my typical shows (at least the ones that were still running) knowing they would be repeats. Nine o'clock comes around and it starts to tape "Criminal Minds" even though it is a repeat.

Anyone have this issue and know what I need to do to resolve it? Comcast people thought this firmware was suppose to fix this.

I have version 1.88.25.1 and just received a new box tonight and I am still get repeats being recorded. As soon as I got the box hooked up tonight I went through and programed my typical shows (at least the ones that were still running) knowing they would be repeats. Nine o'clock comes around and it starts to tape "Criminal Minds" even though it is a repeat.

Anyone have this issue and know what I need to do to resolve it? Comcast people thought this firmware was suppose to fix this.Just for the record, exactly which recording option did you select?

Just for the record, exactly which recording option did you select?

I went through the "guide" and highlighted the program and hit "select" then picked all episodes and new first run on this channel.

Well, FWIW, I still have my First Run series recording scheduled and it didn't record the rerun here on Cox using SARA 1.89.19.1. I don't suppose you happened to look at the IPG before recording started to see if it was highlighted or not? I guess it could be that the First Run flag was incorrect in your IPG, but that's impossible to determine after the fact.

I have version 1.88.25.1 and just received a new box tonight and I am still get repeats being recorded. As soon as I got the box hooked up tonight I went through and programed my typical shows (at least the ones that were still running) knowing they would be repeats. Nine o'clock comes around and it starts to tape "Criminal Minds" even though it is a repeat.

Anyone have this issue and know what I need to do to resolve it? Comcast people thought this firmware was suppose to fix this.I also have 1.88.25.1 and I can't set a "First Run only on this channel" recording if the show is a repeat. The show is not highlighted and no entries are added to the Scheduled Recordings. I have to wait until the show is new before that option will work.

If the Electronic Program Guide doesn't have the First Run Flag, you shouldn't see the "First Run only on this channel" recording option.

Do you have this option when you select "All episodes"?

Did you get a new firmware version?

If so, what firmware version did you have?

What exactly did Comcast say was supposed to be fixed?

Well, FWIW, I still have my First Run series recording scheduled and it didn't record the rerun here on Cox using SARA 1.89.19.1. I don't suppose you happened to look at the IPG before recording started to see if it was highlighted or not? I guess it could be that the First Run flag was incorrect in your IPG, but that's impossible to determine after the fact.It's also impossible to determine before the fact if you're using 1.88.x.x, as the First Run Flag is not indicated anywhere in the program listing.

At least, I've never seen it. I'd swear I saw somewhere that the "First Run" indication in the IPG was new with 1.89.x.x, but I can't seem to find the post where I picked up that info, so maybe I'm dreaming it.

My guess is that his IPG just isn't marking new episodes with the First Run Flag correctly. It's not unheard of.

Well, I used a rerun to set a First Run recording. Of course, the program is not highlighted in the IPG and there is nothing in the Scheduled Recordings list (just like Russ said), so it shouldn't record, I'll know in a few minutes. (Edit: As expected, nothing started recording.)

I've never run into a problem of recording reruns with a First Run schedule. Like Russ, I'd be curious to know how you got it set. Are you sure you didn't accidently select a different option? What is in your Scheduled Recordings list? Anything for that timeslot next week?

I'd ask if there might have been an old schedule you'd forgotten about, but you said it was a new box with SARA 1.88.25.1, so that rules that out. It sounds like you've been having this problem for some time, is that correct?

It's also impossible to determine before the fact if you're using 1.88.x.x, as the First Run Flag is not indicated anywhere in the program listing.If you are on 1.88.x.x, the only way I know of is to set a "First Run" and see if the show is highlighted.


At least, I've never seen it. I'd swear I saw somewhere that the "First Run" indication in the IPG was new with 1.89.x.x, but I can't seem to find the post where I picked up that info, so maybe I'm dreaming it.
It is listed in the "New Features - 1.89.x.x" topic near the bottom of the first post.


My guess is that his IPG just isn't marking new episodes with the First Run Flag correctly. It's not unheard of.I also think this might be the problem.

You should be able to see if this is the problem by setting a "First Run" on a repeat show and if the show is highlighted in the IPG then the First Run Flag is not being set correctly.

It is listed in the "New Features - 1.89.x.x" topic near the bottom of the first post.It also mentions Tribune Data Version 2 is needed or all episodes will be flagged as New, but since he said he was using 1.88.25.1, I'm not sure what impact this would have, though part of this could really have been included in the later 1.88's just like the DST fixes, but then I'd think you'd have similar problems.

but I can't seem to find the post where I picked up that info, so maybe I'm dreaming it.Tsk, tsk, forgot about the first post, did we? :)

It also mentions Tribune Data Version 2 is needed or all episodes will be flagged as New, but since he said he was using 1.88.25.1, I'm not sure what impact this would have, though part of this could really have been included in the later 1.88's just like the DST fixes, but then I'd think you'd have similar problems.The first run works fine for me except I don't see "New" indicated in the IPG because I am still on 1.88.25.1.

Tsk, tsk, forgot about the first post, did we? :)No, I went and looked at the first post, and did a thread search. I'll claim exhaustion--I had a rough day at work yesterday, and wasn't thinking straight. (I was also looking for "first run", not "NEW Flag"--doh!) :o

If you are on 1.88.x.x, the only way I know of is to set a "First Run" and see if the show is highlighted.Now, see, that's usin' your noggin'! Good suggestion.

(I was also looking for "first run", not "NEW Flag"--doh!)Yeah, I wish they'd settle on a single term and stick with it. I guess New is shorter to display, but First Run is in the option list. Maybe I can change it to First Run/New Flag. ;)

I just received this box from comcast after buying a house in the next town over, This is the biggest piece of crap HD/DVR box I have ever used. When was this thing made?, its menus and styling are ancient. Its slow as hell and horridley laid out compared to my motorola i had.

I also have 1.88.25.1 and I can't set a "First Run only on this channel" recording if the show is a repeat. The show is not highlighted and no entries are added to the Scheduled Recordings. I have to wait until the show is new before that option will work.

If the Electronic Program Guide doesn't have the First Run Flag, you shouldn't see the "First Run only on this channel" recording option.

Do you have this option when you select "All episodes"?

Did you get a new firmware version?

If so, what firmware version did you have?

What exactly did Comcast say was supposed to be fixed?

The firmware I have is what I listed previously.

I was originally told several months ago that my local Comcast didn't have the capability for the "first run" flag, but later figured out after reading the intro to this post that the 1.88 firmware added that option and at the time I forget what version we had but it was 1.88. Now that we have this version Comcast is saying it should work, but it isn't.

Yes, I can see the "first run" when selecting all episodes. I had to reprogram what I could last night and all episodes where repeats and I was able to set up recordings.

Well, I used a rerun to set a First Run recording. Of course, the program is not highlighted in the IPG and there is nothing in the Scheduled Recordings list (just like Russ said), so it shouldn't record, I'll know in a few minutes. (Edit: As expected, nothing started recording.)

I've never run into a problem of recording reruns with a First Run schedule. Like Russ, I'd be curious to know how you got it set. Are you sure you didn't accidently select a different option? What is in your Scheduled Recordings list? Anything for that timeslot next week?

I'd ask if there might have been an old schedule you'd forgotten about, but you said it was a new box with SARA 1.88.25.1, so that rules that out. It sounds like you've been having this problem for some time, is that correct?

Yes, I have had this problem for a while. I know I have it set up right as I double checked and it is set to "first run". It recorded Criminal Minds and CSI:NY last night when it shouldn't have.

I have a SA 8300HD from TWC connected to my Sony 40v2500 via HDMI.

I turned on all the formats on the box (480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i, etc) and the Picture Format setting is set to Auto DVI/HDMI. It works fine when I initially set it up but when I cycle through the input source on the TV (TV/Video button or Video Source on the remotes) it resets the box to 480i only. To fix this, I have to turn the box off and do the Guide/Info initial setup thing again.

I read somewhere on this thread that if you use HDMI the Pass Through Picture Format option is replaced with the Auto DVI/HDMI setting. The Pass Through option is definitely not available to me, however, a friend of mine has the exact same box/tv/hdmi connection and the Pass Through option is available to him. He is not having the problem where it resets to 480i only. I talked with a rep at TWC and they weren't very helpful, but they did mention that the Pass Through option is what I should use. They told me to replace the box to see if that fixes it.

Has anyone else seen this problem? I tried searching these threads but the mind boggles at how huge this site is and I didn't find anything addressing my issue. Thanks for your help.

Jeff

If you set the box to initiate in an SD channel and then tune to a HD channel, it should work correctly. Did for me, good luck.

I just received this box from comcast after buying a house in the next town over, This is the biggest piece of crap HD/DVR box I have ever used. When was this thing made?, its menus and styling are ancient. Its slow as hell and horridley laid out compared to my motorola i had.Two of our adult children have the Moto HD DVR (both Comcast, one in Maryland, the other in Atlanta) and THAT is a piece of junk compared to the SA8300HD! Perhaps the menu's on the Moto box are more "stylish" than on our SARA based SA8300 - but that beauty is only skin deep!

Problems with the Moto: No digital sound out when tuning to a program being recorded; fixed resolution out (can only select ONE HD resolution); no ability for external drive; internal drive too small; etc.

I have a SA 8300HD from TWC connected to my Sony 40v2500 via HDMI.

I turned on all the formats on the box (480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i, etc) and the Picture Format setting is set to Auto DVI/HDMI. It works fine when I initially set it up but when I cycle through the input source on the TV (TV/Video button or Video Source on the remotes) it resets the box to 480i only. To fix this, I have to turn the box off and do the Guide/Info initial setup thing again.

I read somewhere on this thread that if you use HDMI the Pass Through Picture Format option is replaced with the Auto DVI/HDMI setting. The Pass Through option is definitely not available to me, however, a friend of mine has the exact same box/tv/hdmi connection and the Pass Through option is available to him. He is not having the problem where it resets to 480i only. I talked with a rep at TWC and they weren't very helpful, but they did mention that the Pass Through option is what I should use. They told me to replace the box to see if that fixes it.

Has anyone else seen this problem? I tried searching these threads but the mind boggles at how huge this site is and I didn't find anything addressing my issue. Thanks for your help.

Jeff

I'm on Comcast and experience the same issue. I believe one of the firmware revisions changed from "Pass through" to "Auto DVI/HDMI". Mine says "Auto DVI/HDMI". Talking with the service tech at the house last night, he said that is an issue with the HDMI that the resolution gets confused. You should be able to get it to pick up a HD signal by switching from a 720P station i.e. ABC to a 1080i station i.e. NBC and the resolution should fix for the time being.

Do yourself a favor and select one of the upconverts and let it ride. Allows channel surfing to happen a little quicker as it doesn't need to determine the resolution before tuning.

If you set the box to initiate in an SD channel and then tune to a HD channel, it should work correctly. Did for me, good luck.

I don't see where I have a choice for what channel it initiates to. It defaults to some TWC public access station which is SD and it doesn't work.

Are you suggesting that if could set it to initiate to the "right" channel, I would have to turn the box on and off to get the HD working again? Not a huge deal, I guess, but would prefer not ever having to turn it on and off.

Thanks for your input.

I read somewhere on this thread that if you use HDMI the Pass Through Picture Format option is replaced with the Auto DVI/HDMI setting. The Pass Through option is definitely not available to me, however, a friend of mine has the exact same box/tv/hdmi connection and the Pass Through option is available to him. Jeff: One of the "features" of HDMI is the ability for the set to signal back to the source (8300 in your case) what resolutions it wants. Hence the "Auto DVI/HDMI" label instead of "Pass-Through". The problem that you are running into is a poor communications protocol between your Sony and the 8300. Not really sure "whose fault" it is (other than the HDMI organization, who should have had better specs and test cases). You will see "Pass-Through" only when the component connection is used.

I'm on Comcast and experience the same issue. I believe one of the firmware revisions changed from "Pass through" to "Auto DVI/HDMI".

So this explains why mine friend's is working and mine isn't. Are you saying my firmware is newer than his?

Thanks for the rest of the advice. What exactly is the difference between the different Upconverts?

So this explains why mine friend's is working and mine isn't. Are you saying my firmware is newer than his?

Thanks for the rest of the advice. What exactly is the difference between the different Upconverts?

From the first post:

# UpConvert 1 - All 480i/480P signals converted to 480P. All 720P/1080i signals converted to 1080i.
# UpConvert 2 - All 480i/480P signals converted to 480P. All 720P/1080i signals converted to 720P.

Most likely you have the newer firmware. This issue use to happen even through Component on one of the older firmware for "passthrough."

BTW, the upconvert will mess up you're TV's ability to stretch SD channels if you don't like the bars down the side. You have to use the cable boxes stretch which usually isn't as good as what the TV would do. At least with my TV, I can't stretch a progressive signal via the TV.

i cant seem to get into Diagnostic Mode. ive tried boh methods below and neither work. i have time warner cable and a 8300hd dvr box. i didnt read through all 189 pages of this thread, so im not sure if this method doesnt work on time warner. thanks


Diagnostics
Diagnostic Mode. There are two ways to enter Diagnostic Mode:
Press and hold Select on front of unit until Mail light starts to flash, then press INFO.
Press and hold Pause on remote until Mail light starts to flash (around 10-15 seconds), then press Page Up (-). On some remotes, Page (+) might need to be used instead.

i cant seem to get into Diagnostic Mode. ive tried boh methods below and neither work. i have time warner cable and a 8300hd dvr box. i didnt read through all 189 pages of this thread, so im not sure if this method doesnt work on time warner. thanks


Diagnostics
Diagnostic Mode. There are two ways to enter Diagnostic Mode:
Press and hold Select on front of unit until Mail light starts to flash, then press INFO.
Press and hold Pause on remote until Mail light starts to flash (around 10-15 seconds), then press Page Up (-). On some remotes, Page (+) might need to be used instead.Are you sure that you have SARA (and not Passport) and are on the correct thread? Check the first post here to see how to tell the difference.

It would also help if you put your location in your profile so we could easily see what city you are in (like NYC is Passport, not SARA).

Does anyone know how to play an external source (such as a camcorder) via the SD8300. There is A/V Composite terminal in the front, but don't know how to use it. I can connect my camcorder directly to TV, but SA8300 has a better scaler, so I would prefer to pass it through it. Thanks.

Does anyone know how to play an external source (such as a camcorder) via the SD8300. There is A/V Composite terminal in the front, but don't know how to use it. I can connect my camcorder directly to TV, but SA8300 has a better scaler, so I would prefer to pass it through it. Thanks.

Plug the camcorder into the inputs on the box, press the video source button on the remote, press play on your camcorder.

The firmware I have is what I listed previously.

I was originally told several months ago that my local Comcast didn't have the capability for the "first run" flag, but later figured out after reading the intro to this post that the 1.88 firmware added that option and at the time I forget what version we had but it was 1.88. Now that we have this version Comcast is saying it should work, but it isn't.

Yes, I can see the "first run" when selecting all episodes. I had to reprogram what I could last night and all episodes where repeats and I was able to set up recordings.

Yes, I have had this problem for a while. I know I have it set up right as I double checked and it is set to "first run". It recorded Criminal Minds and CSI:NY last night when it shouldn't have.The "first run" menu option has been in the code for a long time. It only appears if the program guide supports it. It sounds like the program guide is not correctly identifying first run episodes. I think either the program guide is not the correct version and always reports the program is first run or the first run flag is not being set correctly. Call Comcast and request to speak to someone who is familar with the DVR and see what they say.

Does anyone know how to play an external source (such as a camcorder) via the SD8300. There is A/V Composite terminal in the front, but don't know how to use it. I can connect my camcorder directly to TV, but SA8300 has a better scaler, so I would prefer to pass it through it. Thanks.If you have SARA (this is a SARA thread) you should be able to activate the front panel connection via the "Video Source" button on the DVR's remote.

I wouldn't be too sure about the quality of the 8300 scaler though. Besides, if your Camcorder has an S-Video output, you will get better quality using that into the display than composite through the 8300.

I recently changed over from composite cable to HDMI. Using a OCTAVA 3x1 HDMI switch box. Now 90% of the time when I power my 8300HD on, the preset channel comes up frozen as if it were in pause, and no audio for perhaps a minute. I then get audio, but, image is still frozen. I must change channels in order to unfreeze my video. Again, this does not happen 100% of the time but, probably 90% of the time. I kill power to my 8300HD most evening unless I have something to record earlier the next am.

I recently changed over from composite cable to HDMI. Using a OCTAVA 3x1 HDMI switch box. Now 90% of the time when I power my 8300HD on, the preset channel comes up frozen as if it were in pause, and no audio for perhaps a minute. I then get audio, but, image is still frozen. I must change channels in order to unfreeze my video. Again, this does not happen 100% of the time but, probably 90% of the time. I kill power to my 8300HD most evening unless I have something to record earlier the next am.When you say that you "kill power to my 8300HD" do you mean that you disconnect the power from the 8300 - or just turn it off (via front panel POWER button or the remote)? Disconnecting power is not a good idea as it forces a reboot when the power is plugged back in - which takes time. (Of course, a hard reboot every so often is not a bad idea.)

I have it powered thru a Triplite box, and yes it does reboot each morning, but, I was asked to do it by Cox due to my many problems with tiling, and "grey" channels, I don't mind it rebooting as it only takes a couple of minutes anyway. On occasion, it does count thru each and every address prior to it completeing the boot, and on occasion it reboots itself.

I have it powered thru a Triplite box, and yes it does reboot each morning, but, I was asked to do it by Cox due to my many problems with tiling, and "grey" channels, I don't mind it rebooting as it only takes a couple of minutes anyway. On occasion, it does count thru each and every address prior to it completeing the boot, and on occasion it reboots itself.That (rebooting every morning) is not normal operation for most people. I suspect that your issue may well be due to the reboot (how the box exits the reboot). As not many folks regularly do this, you are not likely to get a lot of responses.

1st DH, thanks for UR input, as further data from me, I have only been using HDMI for about a month which is when I noticed the image freezing on start about the same time. I actually have been doing my am boot for the greater part of 6 months without this kind of problem being appearant prior to using the HDMI cable and swithbox. My setup picture is set to Auto DVI/HDMI. Cox is making a housecall in 2 days perhaps they will see something. Would U recommend that I discontinue the daily boot?

Would U recommend that I discontinue the daily boot?I'd sure suggest seeing if you have the problem without the boot. HDMI/HDCP is a fickle thing. Another thing to try: See if you have the problem (with the boot) via a direct connect to the display (could be the switch box). Also is the switch and/or display connected to the Triplite (so they are powered on/off too). Finally, did you say what the display is?

Display is Sony KDF-55SX955 and it is powered through my triplite. I have a 2nd triplite that controls my eSATA, OPPO DVD, and Octava HDMI switch. These I do not power off each night, only the 8300HD and Sony. Octava was installed at same time I changed over to HDMI cable. I will try a direct connect of 8300 to Sony to see its affect.

My menu doesn't have an option for "fixed audio" and everytime I turn it on I have to volume up to 30. If I don't do this it seems that I have to crank my receiver up to hear anything. Is there any other way to manually "fix" the audio at a certain level other than the standard in the "middle" it turns on at?

Also, does anyone else have a huge list of errors on Page 14 under Software Anomalies? I'm wondering if this is normal or not.

In regards to my issue with the "first run" flag, I have a CSR with Comcast that frequents our local HD forum and he stated he'd get a message to the engineers to see if they were putting the right info into the IPG.

Just to be sure, you are saying you don't have an option in your General Settings for Audio:Volume Ctrl (Fixed or Variable)?

Also, how do you have the 8300 connected to your receiver? RCA cables or Digital Optical/Coax cable?

And, yes, many/most/all of us have multiple errors in that section.

Just to be sure, you are saying you don't have an option in your General Settings for Audio:Volume Ctrl (Fixed or Variable)?

Also, how do you have the 8300 connected to your receiver? RCA cables or Digital Optical/Coax cable?

And, yes, many/most/all of us have multiple errors in that section.

I have both audio types out as my receiver (Marantz SR780) doesn't process 2.0DD into a pro-logic, so in order to not be listening to non 5.1 audio in stero mode, I use the RCA cables.

Yes, the only audio option I have in general settings is for wide, narrow, and normal.

Just to be sure, you are saying you don't have an option in your General Settings for Audio:Volume Ctrl (Fixed or Variable)?Yes, the only audio option I have in general settings is for wide, narrow, and normal.I don't have an HDMI connection, but I know that some Settings choices can change if an HDMI connection is used. Maybe another HDMI user could say whether this is one of those options that's affected.

I don't have an HDMI connection, but I know that some Settings choices can change if an HDMI connection is used. Maybe another HDMI user could say whether this is one of those options that's affected.

Oh ya, I'm using HDMI to DVI cable, so maybe that is it, but one would think you would still have an option to tell it to either be fixed or variable.

Does anyone know why, when I try to rewind a program I'm watching, sometimes the box immediately jumps all the way back to the beginning of the buffer.

In other words, if I was watching a channel for 35 minutes (the last 15 minutes of one program and 20 minutes into the current program), as soon as I press rewind it will immediately jump back past the beginning of the current program to the time I changed to the channel.

Also, the time bar often doesn't show the correct position. Sometimes if I've been watching a one-hour program for 50 minutes, when I press rewind it shows that I'm near the beginning of a short program.

I've tried both soft and hard reboots and it still does the same thing.

Cox San Diego
SARA v1.89.18.1

Oh ya, I'm using HDMI to DVI cable, so maybe that is it, but one would think you would still have an option to tell it to either be fixed or variable.Ok, here's the setup:

Component cable from 8300 to HDTV.
Digital optical audio cable from 8300 to AVR.
All Channels digital.
Volume control set to Variable.

1. Volume indicator moves, but no effect on AVR volume level.

2. Volume set to near Max. Unit tuner Off, then back On. Volume level remained where it was, did not get reset to midway or any other setting.

I suspect that since you don't have the Fixed/Variable option, your cableco has preset the level and there is nothing you can do short of getting them to change their setup.

Since you are using HDMI, do you have a General Settiings/Audio: Digital Out option (HDMI/Dolby Digital/Other)?

been gone awhile, again...

Digital audio is not variable and depends on the end of line amp (AVR or TV) for volume control. With HDMI audio, it depends on the display as to what kind of audio you request from the STB.
Variable audio is for analog output only. If you have an AVR that doesn't process DD2.0, change the output to PCM or "other" for the analog equivelent. Also, almost all displays (possibly every single one) force the STB to only send DD2.0 or PCM and not 5.1 over HDMI because the display doesn't have a 5.1 input. Some cable co's offer an override to output 5.1, which the displays can't handle.

vegggas

NOTE that he is using HDMI > DVI cable. That might have something to do with it as DVI does not handle sound.

Does anyone know why, when I try to rewind a program I'm watching, sometimes the box immediately jumps all the way back to the beginning of the buffer.

In other words, if I was watching a channel for 35 minutes (the last 15 minutes of one program and 20 minutes into the current program), as soon as I press rewind it will immediately jump back past the beginning of the current program to the time I changed to the channel.

Also, the time bar often doesn't show the correct position. Sometimes if I've been watching a one-hour program for 50 minutes, when I press rewind it shows that I'm near the beginning of a short program.

I've tried both soft and hard reboots and it still does the same thing.

Cox San Diego
SARA v1.89.18.1
This almost always happens when you are watching a delayed program, which is in the buffer, and the buffer is filled. A way to make this happen is to watch a live program, then hit pause or jumpback to enter the buffer, then let the buffer fill by not going back to live.

vegggas

BTW - I've been testing the cablecard version of the 8300. It works the same as the current versions with PPV, VOD, eSATA, etc. So yes, two way host devices do exist that can use cablecards as a decryptor.
I think that the eSATA drive will be married to the cablecard and not the STB, but I need to investigate this further as time and materials allow.

I'm debating starting a new thread for the CC 8300 - thoughts?

vegggas

BTW - I've been testing the cablecard version of the 8300. It works the same as the current versions with PPV, VOD, eSATA, etc. So yes, two way host devices do exist that can use cablecards as a decryptor.
I think that the eSATA drive will be married to the cablecard and not the STB, but I need to investigate this further as time and materials allow.Why would the eSATA be married to the cablecard? Perhaps I don't understand what you mean by "married" (did you mean the encrypted key comes from the CableCard and not the STB?)

I'm debating starting a new thread for the CC 8300 - thoughts?

vegggasIf you see no difference in operation (and I think that you shouldn't) I think that we would be best keeping everything here. Perhaps start a thread, explain what the SA8300HDC is and point to this thread (IN BIG BOLD LETTERS).

Why would the eSATA be married to the cablecard? Perhaps I don't understand what you mean by "married" (did you mean the encrypted key comes from the CableCard and not the STB?)

That's the basic premise of the mandate for moving to Cablecrd devices. The decryptor is in the cablecard and no longer embedded on the STB. From that basic logic, the decryption could be married to the card and no longer just the STB. However, that is not proven yet since we don't know if the drive it'self has to be married to the STB via the interface, causing a twofold "marriage" constraints. Maybe the decryption could be handled by the same card, with a different STB, but you can't connect the drive to another STB without reformatting... hmmm...

If you see no difference in operation (and I think that you shouldn't) I think that we would be best keeping everything here. Perhaps start a thread, explain what the SA8300HDC is and point to this thread (IN BIG BOLD LETTERS).
I was thinking the same thing, but then considered the possibility of a new section dedicated to CableCard and then OCAP and finally DCAS functionality of like devices. The next 9 -12 months are going to see drastic changes in look, feel and operation of new technologies. Samsung's new two way TV will be available soon to take advantage of cablecard with IPG and VOD as well as OCAP compatibility for ALL Time Warner headends by July with Comcast and Cox following 6 - 9 months later.

vegggas

This almost always happens when you are watching a delayed program, which is in the buffer, and the buffer is filled. A way to make this happen is to watch a live program, then hit pause or jumpback to enter the buffer, then let the buffer fill by not going back to live.I am able to reproduce this problem, but I have no way to tell if this exactly is what is being done by the OP.

1. I was recording the Nextel Cup.
2. I joined it in progress by selecting the Start From Beginning option.
3. When I saw the race might be rain-delayed, I hit the Live button.
4. It was on a commercial, so I hit REW.
5. That instantly took me to the beginning of the buffer.

I tried several more times to make sure and each time it took me to the beginning of the buffer, it did not simply rewind.

I should add that I tried this with my recording of the NHRA races, also still in progress, and could not get it to do the same thing. The only difference I can see between the 2 recordings is that the Nextel Cup one is past the 1 hour buffer and the NHRA one is not. I will try it again when it is.

This almost always happens when you are watching a delayed program, which is in the buffer, and the buffer is filled. A way to make this happen is to watch a live program, then hit pause or jumpback to enter the buffer, then let the buffer fill by not going back to live.

vegggas

I am able to reproduce this problem, but I have no way to tell if this exactly is what is being done by the OP.

1. I was recording the Nextel Cup.
2. I joined it in progress by selecting the Start From Beginning option.
3. When I saw the race might be rain-delayed, I hit the Live button.
4. It was on a commercial, so I hit REW.
5. That instantly took me to the beginning of the buffer.

I tried several more times to make sure and each time it took me to the beginning of the buffer, it did not simply rewind.

I should add that I tried this with my recording of the NHRA races, also still in progress, and could not get it to do the same thing. The only difference I can see between the 2 recordings is that the Nextel Cup one is past the 1 hour buffer and the NHRA one is not. I will try it again when it is.

By the way, this was happening when I tried rewinding directly from "live" mode, and was not a program that I was recording.

Cox San Diego
SARA v1.89.18.1

[QUOTE=lancer1991]My menu doesn't have an option for "fixed audio" and everytime I turn it on I have to volume up to 30. If I don't do this it seems that I have to crank my receiver up to hear anything. Is there any other way to manually "fix" the audio at a certain level other than the standard in the "middle" it turns on at?

U R possibly looking at wrong sound setting...
Directly under that setting is one that varries sound control...
Under my settings

Audio : Digital out Hdmi ect...
Audio : Range narrow ect...
Audio : Volume Crtl fixed ect...
Hope this helps
Also check remote settings for 8300 as to Vol crtl... 2 diff settings

NOTE that he is using HDMI > DVI cable. That might have something to do with it as DVI does not handle sound.I think we're missing 2 points (or at least not commenting on them):

1. He doesn't have the Audio:Volume Ctrl option. I assume this is a cableco setting.

2. He sets his 8300 volume to a certain level and when he turns it off then back on, it is reset to some default. Mine doesn't do that regardless of the Fixed or Variable setting. AFAIK, the fact that the 8300 volume control is only for analog should not have any impact on this. In view of item 1, I assume this is also a cableco setting, just like some cableco's disabling the Viewer: Power On option in favor of forcing their channel.

It seems to me that no matter how he sets his audio (HDMI, DD, Other), he is going to have a noticeable volume difference when he switches from the optical to the RCA connection, hence the desire to set the 8300 volume level to match the optical level and have the 8300 leave it set. Am I missing something?

BTW - I've been testing the cablecard version of the 8300. It works the same as the current versions with PPV, VOD, eSATA, etc. So yes, two way host devices do exist that can use cablecards as a decryptor.
I think that the eSATA drive will be married to the cablecard and not the STB, but I need to investigate this further as time and materials allow.

I'm debating starting a new thread for the CC 8300 - thoughts?I guess I'd tend to agree with "The Other Dave". If that is the only difference, I don't see the need for a new thread YET unless we simply want to "start over" and clear out the past. I know AVS has a limit where they will archive this thread and have us start a new one, like they recently did with HOTP, but I don't think we are near that yet. Once we see how OCAP/DCAS is going to affect things, we'll be in a better position to envision how many threads, how to organize them, etc.

However, post #2 is available for a separate CC8300 Tips post, if that is an alternative to a new thread. I don't know how one goes about transferring control from me to you, but you know I will post whatever you send me, without editing, if need be.

As for the CC8300, I assume it will rent for essentially the same price (or less?) than the current 8300. Of course, you may not know, since it's in test, so that's more of a comment than a question. :)

Samsung's new two way TV will be available soon to take advantage of cablecard with IPG and VOD as well as OCAP compatibility for ALL Time Warner headends by July with Comcast and Cox following 6 - 9 months later.

vegggas

vegggas,

Do you think TWC is going to try to push out Navigator nation-wide in July?

xnappo

That's the basic premise of the mandate for moving to Cablecrd devices. The decryptor is in the cablecard and no longer embedded on the STB. From that basic logic, the decryption could be married to the card and no longer just the STB. However, that is not proven yet since we don't know if the drive it'self has to be married to the STB via the interface, causing a twofold "marriage" constraints. Maybe the decryption could be handled by the same card, with a different STB, but you can't connect the drive to another STB without reformatting... hmmm...I suspect that is a different decryption mechanism. First you have the security mechanism related to gaining access to a bitstream (HBO, for example) then you have the more simple encryption/decryption for the bitstream recorded on the drive (internal or external). Again, this is what I suspect. I'd appreciate clarification from someone who knows.


I was thinking the same thing, but then considered the possibility of a new section dedicated to CableCard and then OCAP and finally DCAS functionality of like devices. The next 9 -12 months are going to see drastic changes in look, feel and operation of new technologies. Samsung's new two way TV will be available soon to take advantage of cablecard with IPG and VOD as well as OCAP compatibility for ALL Time Warner headends by July with Comcast and Cox following 6 - 9 months later.

vegggasHow about a thread devoted to these new technologies? BTW, I've been watching OCAP & DCAS as closely as I can and wonder if we are perhaps expecting a bit too much from these. A devoted thread would be a good place to hash that out (assuming that the various "anti-" forces {anti-cable, anti-TW, anti-Comcast, anti-Bush :rolleyes: } stay away).

As for the CC8300, I assume it will rent for essentially the same price (or less?) than the current 8300. Of course, you may not know, since it's in test, so that's more of a comment than a question. :)I don't think that it will be much different than how most cable companies handle the SA8000HD vs the SA8300HD: they are both essentially the same service (HD DVR) in their computer system. What the customer gets is what's in the truck. The way the rules are set-up with the FCC encourages "recycling" existing boxes - so if a customer orders HD DVR service he doesn't know what he will get: SA800HD, SA8300HD, or SA8300HDC (that's the model number of the CableCard SA8300HD).

How about a thread devoted to these new technologies? BTW, I've been watching OCAP & DCAS as closely as I can and wonder if we are perhaps expecting a bit too much from these. A devoted thread would be a good place to hash that out (assuming that the various "anti-" forces {anti-cable, anti-TW, anti-Comcast, anti-Bush :rolleyes: } stay away).I agree with this concept until actual impact gets a little clearer. If anyone starts it, I'll link it in the first post. If it's popular enough, maybe we can get it Sticky'd. :)

Samsung's new two way TV will be available soon to take advantage of cablecard with IPG and VOD as well as OCAP compatibility for ALL Time Warner headends by July with Comcast and Cox following 6 - 9 months later.

vegggas
vegggas,

Do you think TWC is going to try to push out Navigator nation-wide in July?

xnappo
All (or a heavy majority) of their Headends will be OCAP ready for Navigator use by 7-07. The suspected plan is to have Navigator software running for all those headends, but recent issues may or may not push that date back.

vegggas

That's the basic premise of the mandate for moving to Cablecrd devices. The decryptor is in the cablecard and no longer embedded on the STB. From that basic logic, the decryption could be married to the card and no longer just the STB. However, that is not proven yet since we don't know if the drive it'self has to be married to the STB via the interface, causing a twofold "marriage" constraints. Maybe the decryption could be handled by the same card, with a different STB, but you can't connect the drive to another STB without reformatting... hmmm...

I suspect that is a different decryption mechanism. First you have the security mechanism related to gaining access to a bitstream (HBO, for example) then you have the more simple encryption/decryption for the bitstream recorded on the drive (internal or external). Again, this is what I suspect. I'd appreciate clarification from someone who knows.
I was just doing some early speculating, and don't expect to be able to actually use the same drive across multiple STBs but it does sound like it could be possible.
I will get a new drive soon, but only have one new HDC STB right now, so a real test won't happen for a long time.

vegggas

I was thinking the same thing, but then considered the possibility of a new section dedicated to CableCard and then OCAP and finally DCAS functionality of like devices. The next 9 -12 months are going to see drastic changes in look, feel and operation of new technologies. Samsung's new two way TV will be available soon to take advantage of cablecard with IPG and VOD as well as OCAP compatibility for ALL Time Warner headends by July with Comcast and Cox following 6 - 9 months later.

How about a thread devoted to these new technologies? BTW, I've been watching OCAP & DCAS as closely as I can and wonder if we are perhaps expecting a bit too much from these. A devoted thread would be a good place to hash that out (assuming that the various "anti-" forces {anti-cable, anti-TW, anti-Comcast, anti-Bush :rolleyes: } stay away).
The OCAP developers conference showed a lot of promise and ALL of the cable co's were fully behind it with their own methods of deployment. TW said they were going to be fully compliant in all their headends by July and Cox and Comcast said they are following with the first major (excluding trials already underway) rollouts later this year and more next year.
A seperate thread should be needed as the technology becomes more available to consumers. The Navigator thread is a good start, but is limited to just the use of their own STB interface. As the Samsung TV and then the consumer STB's become available, there will be lots of confusion at first. It's a crapshoot as to wether a consumer will even understand OCAP at this early stage.
vegggas

If you have SARA (this is a SARA thread) you should be able to activate the front panel connection via the "Video Source" button on the DVR's remote.

I wouldn't be too sure about the quality of the 8300 scaler though. Besides, if your Camcorder has an S-Video output, you will get better quality using that into the display than composite through the 8300.

Thanks. I will check with the SA Remote (which I rarely use, as I have programmed another remote with the functions I use most). SA-8300HD scaler works well for my 1080p TV.

My camcorder has S-video but, I don't think SA8300-HD has a S-Video connection in the front. It just has a Composite (Yellow, While and Red).

My camcorder has S-video but, I don't think SA8300-HD has a S-Video connection in the front. It just has a Composite (Yellow, While and Red).Exactly. Dave's point was that S-video direct to your TV might be better quality than composite through your 8300, despite any superiority of the 8300's scaler.

My menu doesn't have an option for "fixed audio" and everytime I turn it on I have to volume up to 30. If I don't do this it seems that I have to crank my receiver up to hear anything. Is there any other way to manually "fix" the audio at a certain level other than the standard in the "middle" it turns on at?

Also, does anyone else have a huge list of errors on Page 14 under Software Anomalies? I'm wondering if this is normal or not.

In regards to my issue with the "first run" flag, I have a CSR with Comcast that frequents our local HD forum and he stated he'd get a message to the engineers to see if they were putting the right info into the IPG.Keep us posted with any new info on the "first run" flag issue. Good Luck on getting it fixed.

I think we're missing 2 points (or at least not commenting on them):

1. He doesn't have the Audio:Volume Ctrl option. I assume this is a cableco setting.

2. He sets his 8300 volume to a certain level and when he turns it off then back on, it is reset to some default. Mine doesn't do that regardless of the Fixed or Variable setting. AFAIK, the fact that the 8300 volume control is only for analog should not have any impact on this. In view of item 1, I assume this is also a cableco setting, just like some cableco's disabling the Viewer: Power On option in favor of forcing their channel.

It seems to me that no matter how he sets his audio (HDMI, DD, Other), he is going to have a noticeable volume difference when he switches from the optical to the RCA connection, hence the desire to set the 8300 volume level to match the optical level and have the 8300 leave it set. Am I missing something?

1. correct
2. yes, it defaults to the middle.

I stumbled across it one day while playing with the buttons on the front of the box to adjust settings that the volume buttons worked (remote is programed to control volume for some reason), so I turned it all the way up and found I didn't need to crank up my receiver as much to get the same volume and to me that seemed good. The other day when it was shut off it went back to the middle even though I cranked it all the way up. Today it doesn't seem to be doing it. It stays where I left it. Of course yesterday the box locked up in some stretched aspect ration and I could not get it to go to any other aspect until shutting it on and off several times and changing the Picture Format thorugh all the upconverts and pass-through.

I just got this replacement box and it's a mess. I'm going to exchange it out.


Keep us posted with any new info on the "first run" flag issue. Good Luck on getting it fixed.

The CSR sent me back an e-mail today saying that his wife records everything and never stated any issue with repeats since they integrated the latest firmware. I just took a picture tonight of my scheduled recording, as it was recording "House" this evening, to show it was set to "first run" and still recording repeats. I'll send him the photos and let him and the engineers scratch their heads.

Two of our adult children have the Moto HD DVR (both Comcast, one in Maryland, the other in Atlanta) and THAT is a piece of junk compared to the SA8300HD! Perhaps the menu's on the Moto box are more "stylish" than on our SARA based SA8300 - but that beauty is only skin deep!

Problems with the Moto: No digital sound out when tuning to a program being recorded; fixed resolution out (can only select ONE HD resolution); no ability for external drive; internal drive too small; etc.

No clue what box your "adult children" have from moto but that ones sounds ancient as well. I could do all those things expect the external drive(never tried so i dont know)

No clue what box your "adult children" have from moto but that ones sounds ancient as well. I could do all those things expect the external drive(never tried so i dont know)
6412 Series III. One is in Montgomery County, MD, another in Atlanta. I know (at least on both of their DVRs) that there is no "pass-through" operation. For HD you have to set it for either 1080i or 720p. So, if set for 1080i, a 720p program will be converted to 1080i. Really sucks if you have a typical plasma (1366 x 768p) - the 720p will be converted TWICE. Once by the box to 1080i, again by the display to 768. With pass-through, there would be only one conversion - by the display to it's native resolution.

Also the recording capacity of these boxes are lower (120GB vs 160GB on the SA).

Tribune data, the provider of IPG data for some vendors seems to be having some spotty issues with new vs. repeat flags. There are random reports from users with SA, Motorola, and Tivo that are recording repeats of some shows that are only supposed to record "new" episodes.
The recent spike in activity seems to point to the data services gathering of data as incorrectly flagged as new when they are repeats.

vegggas

vegggas,

I had season passes set up for some of the programs folks here have recently complained about and I did not have any problems skipping repeats, so it definitely must be limited to "some vendors". There is a reference in the first post for New Features for SARA 1.89 that Tribune Data Version 2 is needed for the New flag to work correctly. There must be something in later versions of 1.88 to as that seems to be where the most SARA complaints come from. Perhaps it's as simple as some cableco's with 1.88 are using Version 2 and some with 1.89 aren't.

The data is spotty in some markets and not a global issue with Tribune's data. I'm just noting that there seems to be a spike across the board for multiple vendors and hardware types that repeats are being flagged as new.
BTW - Now is a GREAT time for users to clear out all their old recording wishlists and season passes. We know it's going to be 5 - 6 months or more for some shows to return and all that keeping the passes does is increase the possibility of a conflict with bad data.

vegggas

We've got "TV Guide" data here and in the last year, I've felt that the new/repeat flag worked quite well.

Except for the well documented national cases, the "new" flag has worked in Las Vegas since it's inception many moons ago too.
There are reports, just on AVS alone, for the SA8300, MOTO DCT series, and Tivo units with bad flag data for the past week. Sine not everyone posts their location, it's hard to track.

vegggas

I have recorded analog channels and they look bad (it doesn't look like that when watching live), its like it recorded the program and there is like a layer in front of it. I actually prefer watching a VHS recording over that. Is that normal for analog channels?

I am having someone look at my cable tomorrow for signal strengthen certain channels. I sometimes get this thick scrolling vertical line (dimmer than the rest of the picture) its never shown up on HD channels but its been on analog and VOD channels, I have unhooked the HDMI cable and rehooked it and have hooked it. I have hooked the coax directly from the wall to the tv and its fine. If I switched out my DVR would I lose my recordings?

I have recorded analog channels and they look bad (it doesn't look like that when watching live), its like it recorded the program and there is like a layer in front of it. I actually prefer watching a VHS recording over that. Is that normal for analog channels?No, the recording should look like watching it live. Analog channels will not look as good as digital channels. Some TVs will make them look even worse.

I am having someone look at my cable tomorrow for signal strengthen certain channels. I sometimes get this thick scrolling vertical line (dimmer than the rest of the picture) its never shown up on HD channels but its been on analog and VOD channels, I have unhooked the HDMI cable and rehooked it and have hooked it. I have hooked the coax directly from the wall to the tv and its fine. If I switched out my DVR would I lose my recordings?Yes, your recordings would be lost. Also, any settings and the programs you have set to record would be lost. The DVR requires the signal to be in a certain range for it to work properly. Maybe, you could have the tech swap the DVR as a test and see if that fixes the problem. If it does, then watch any recorded programs you want to see before returning the bad DVR. I think it is probably a problem with the signal not the DVR so make sure the signal is ok before swapping the DVR. Good Luck. Let us know how it turns out.

I have recorded analog channels and they look bad (it doesn't look like that when watching live), its like it recorded the program and there is like a layer in front of it. I actually prefer watching a VHS recording over that. Is that normal for analog channels?Actually what you are seeing is the action of the A>D converter and MPEG-2 compressor in your 8300. Analog signals must be digitized and compressed in order to be recorded onto the hard drive. Most cable systems today are "simulcasting" many of their analog channels (meaning they carry both analog and digital versions of their SD channels). When you record one of these digital SD channels you record exactly what you see. But if you record one that is analog only - then the relatively poor quality on-board A>D converter shows.

I am having someone look at my cable tomorrow for signal strengthen certain channels. I sometimes get this thick scrolling vertical line (dimmer than the rest of the picture) its never shown up on HD channels but its been on analog and VOD channels, I have unhooked the HDMI cable and rehooked it and have hooked it. I have hooked the coax directly from the wall to the tv and its fine. If I switched out my DVR would I lose my recordings?It sure sounds like a ground loop to me. Changing the box is no answer - but youmay want to check other connections between the box and the TV. Your cable guy might be able to help.

The cable guy said to swap out the box after I am done with recordings to see if it helps get rid off the loop. My cable system doesn't simulcast any of their analog stations. I have some interference coming from the line outside to my house and even when he ran a direct line it didn't completely fix it, it looks like I will have to dig up my yard and that might not fix it.


Also he told me that they were going to stop offering DVR's in August do to some federal law with copyright. You can be grandfathered in if you already have one. I have never heard this.
Has anyone heard this? Is this true?

The cable guy said to swap out the box after I am done with recordings to see if it helps get rid off the loop. My cable system doesn't simulcast any of their analog stations. I have some interference coming from the line outside to my house and even when he ran a direct line it didn't completely fix it, it looks like I will have to dig up my yard and that might not fix it.


Also he told me that they were going to stop offering DVR's in August do to some federal law with copyright. You can be grandfathered in if you already have one. I have never heard this.
Has anyone heard this? Is this true?I haven't heard this either and I don't think it is true.

The courts did rule that a Networked DVR violated copyright law. CableVision was testing using a Networked DVR located on its property to replace single DVRs at customer's homes. CableVision is appealing the ruling.

Starting in July, the FCC has mandated that Cable companies offer DVRs that seperate decoding the signal encryption from the DVR box. The cable companies will use cable cards to do this now. Later, they will use OCAP and download software to the DVR that does this.

Maybe, he confused these two items.

Later, they will use OCAP and download software to the DVR that does this.Russ, OCAP has nothing to do with the FCC mandate for seprabile security, it is DCAS (Downloadable Conditional Access Security) that does that. The OCAP connection is that the cable companies will likely roll-out DCAS when they roll-out OCAP, though right now OCAP is further along than DCAS.

Also he told me that they were going to stop offering DVR's in August do to some federal law with copyright. You can be grandfathered in if you already have one. I have never heard this.
Has anyone heard this? Is this true?The story is this: Long ago the FCC mandated that cable stop deploying new cable boxes (of any type) that have integrated security. They have posponed this action a couple of times, but have set the final date for July 1, 2007. The way that most cable companies will comply is to start using cable boxes that use a M-Type (Multi-Stream) CableCard. The 8300 models that meet this are SA8300C (SD version) and SA8300HDC (HD version). This regulation allows cable to "re-use" the cable boxes that they currently have deployed (so if he swaps out your box they can use that box for another customer, even a new customer). As these boxes cost about $150 more than the current boxes (the boxes cost more + the cost of the CableCard), the cable companies are not moving to them any sooner than they have to - this will likely produce spot shortages. It appears that you are on a small system, they may not be able to afford these more expensive boxes and perhaps plan on "freezing" their customer base (which would be pretty stupid). Estimates I've seen indicate that boxes that incorporate DCAS (the software that essentially replaces the function of the cable card) will not be available till sometime in 2008, so maybe they will "freeze" till then.

Russ, OCAP has nothing to do with the FCC mandate for separable security, it is DCAS (Downloadable Conditional Access Security) that does that. The OCAP connection is that the cable companies will likely roll-out DCAS when they roll-out OCAP, though right now OCAP is further along than DCAS.
Huh?????

The PRIMARY purpose of the "Integration Ban" (aka "separable security")
is so users can BUY and attach "navigation devices" to cable systems
(aka STB, DVR, HDTV, HTPC, etc)....hence must work on ANY CABLE SYSTEM.
See Title 47, Part 76, Subpart P (Section 12xx):
http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr;sid=afd34206b8a2de2643d0fbd1ddf48b0e;rgn=div5;vie w=text;node=47%3A4.0.1.1.4;idno=47;cc=ecfr#47:4.0.1.1.4.16

A variety of ways COULD implement the Integration Ban requirement, but
only ONE has been proposed and ADOPTED by the Consumer Equipment
Association (CEA) and National Cable and Telecommunications
Association (NCTA) via the "Plug and Play Agreement" and subsequent
(very expensive) development in consort with CableLabs:
http://www.ncta.com/DocumentBinary.aspx?id=524

Here's NCTA (and "Hollywood" studio) rejection (with extreme prejudice) of
CEA's recent proposal for a non-OCAP "navigation device" (e.g. low-cost STB):
http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdf&id_document=6518539869

If you read through the CEA filings under CS Docket No. 97-80, you'll find
a very heavy emphasis on "common reliance" agreements, whereby
both the cable companies and the consumer equipment companies should
use (and struggle with) the SAME OCAP/MCARD implementation.

More re "common reliance" p/o Integration Ban can be found here:
http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-257519A1.pdf
http://pacer.cadc.uscourts.gov/docs/common/opinions/200608/05-1237a.pdf

=============================
One-Way CableCARD was the first step of the joint CEA/NCTA agreement.
And will continue to be supported....

Two-Way CableCARD (requiring the addition of a Reverse Data
Channel QPSK or QAM-256 modulator) is the next step--but I haven't
heard of any that DIDN'T work with OCAP, as demonstrated by
NTCA (and "Hollywood" studio) rejection of CEA's non-OCAP STB
proposal (with extreme prejudice).

A DCAS PolyCipher proposal is the current front runner for eventual
implementation, but will have to pass the very stringent security concerns....
Given the Blu-Ray/HD-DVD AACS security breach via PC based players,
it's gonna be a very steep uphill battle......and may have some very
specific hardware constraints.....

==============================
BTW: There are some SMALL cable companies that were waivered to use
some proprietary DCAS and SmartCARD implementations....
but are not approved for long term implementations.

================================
PS: OCAP is not just about meeting the Integration Ban--it's a leap
forward in architecture, including software downloads of new capabilities
to user owned equipments (more like a PC) and high speed QAM-256
(vice low speed QPSK) for FDC/RDC (up/down) control channels to
speed up interactive applications, provide "instant" channel changing
and FF/RW for SDV/VOD/PPV programs and reportedly is also needed for DCAS.

Huh?????
YES: Thats right. Though OCAP is a broad integration effort that partially meets the FCC broad objectives, the specifics of the July 1, 2007 mandate involve ONLY downloadable security. And that was what I was commenting on because the tech had commented that there will be a freeze on the boxes.

You will find no OCAP mandate in the FCC rules or Reports & Orders - only a security mandate. It was the "lever" that the FCC chose to pull to force the Navigation Device Issue.

It's pretty clear that DCAS (which would replace the CableCard security function) will need the new software platform provided by OCAP - but it is not the other way around (OCAP does not replace either DCAS or CableCards).

The 2nd link you provided was the cable industry's response to CES and the real goal of that document was to try to get the FCC to delay the 7/1/07 Integration Ban yet again. So the document is sort of out of context. As a minimum, one needs to read the CEA document that they are attempting to rebut.

That's cuz I didn't have the links ready to go in my bookmarks....

Here's CEA's 12 page letter and Attachment A Technical Requirements:
http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdf&id_document=6518539867
http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdf&id_document=6518539868

As you can see, the primary thrust was a non-OCAP STB with separable security.

I think this (great) informtion should be on it's own managed thread for informational purposes with the possibility of some limitation in access to posting until more is known.
The reason for the limitation is to limit questions for unknown developing technology (with some NDA issues too) and to prevent multiple posts about what consumers "think" it should do for them.
I want to get the information out there, but with some infomed protected thread that's not inundated with infighting and complaints.

vegggas

Exactly. Dave's point was that S-video direct to your TV might be better quality than composite through your 8300, despite any superiority of the 8300's scaler.
Thanks. That's what I do, my TV has connections at the back, which is not convenient, so I thought why not use the front terminals on SA8300HD for camcorder connections.

BTW, my SA9300 Remote does not have any input selection button. My unit is a Cable rental unit. Could it be that I have wrong remote control?

Thanks. That's what I do, my TV has connections at the back, which is not convenient, so I thought why not use the front terminals on SA8300HD for camcorder connections.

BTW, my SA8300 Remote does not have any input selection button. My unit is a Cable rental unit. Could it be that I have wrong remote control?
Cableco's use a variety of "compatible" remotes which work to varying degrees. Unfortunately, I don't know of a front panel key sequence to switch video inputs to the front connections (maybe someone else does). Your best bet might be to contact the cableco to see if they have different remotes and if one of them has the Source button you need. Failing that, you might consider connecting a set of cables (with female ends) to the back of your TV and running them to the front so you can then connect your camcorder cables.

BTW, my SA9300 Remote does not have any input selection button. My unit is a Cable rental unit.Besides the other Dave's advice, you might also find that some of the low cost "universal" remotes support the 8300 and have a functional "input" button.

Besides the other Dave's advice, you might also find that some of the low cost "universal" remotes support the 8300 and have a functional "input" button.

Thanks. May be I will ask the Cable guys first. It is not a big deal, but it just bothers me that there are terminals but they can't be used.

BTW, is there anyway to get digital HDTV recordings out of SA8300, to a computer harddrive !! I don't like the reduced quality route using Composite connections.

Some people have been able to transfer UNENCRYPTED (e.g. local HD) programs from
SA8300HD to Mac, Windows and maybe even Vista PCs:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=403695
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=593271

And quite a few find that the cable company has messed up the Firewire interface....

Have SA8300HD and 58PX60U Panasonic. CANNOT get into setup wizard to fix problem with HD channels switching so slow. I am using HDMI. Channels change very slowly in HD. Think it's trying to upconvert to 1080I. Was gonna change it to "upconvert 2" Any help would be appreciated.

Craig

Have SA8300HD and 58PX60U Panasonic. CANNOT get into setup wizard to fix problem with HD channels switching so slow. I am using HDMI. Channels change very slowly in HD. Think it's trying to upconvert to 1080I. Was gonna change it to "upconvert 2" Any help would be appreciated.Have you read the first post? What have you tried?

The Setup Wizard is for enabling/disabling specific resolutions (480i, 720p, 1080i, etc.) while the Upconvert2 option is in General Settings/Set: Picture Format. Even with various resolutions enabled and the format set to Auto-HMDI, channel changing should not be adversely affected unless you are tuning from one resolution to another. Even then, you should set the reformat take place and it should still only take a tick.

You may want to try a "hard" reboot to clear things out and see if that helps.

Hello,

I'm totally new at all of this (1 week experience). I installed Vizio 50Plasma, Onkyo HT-S907, SA 8300HD. The system constantly reverts to 480I on restart, rather than staying with the 1080I as set up.

I have called Suffolk (NY) Cablevision and reset the box, Onkyo-no suggestions other than its a cable co problem, Vizio-which said the sa box was a problem.
If I reset the boxafter turning sys on it is ok til I turn it off. Then it reverts to 480i on restart.

I apologize for being so new at this that the info on the forum is unclear to me.
How can I learn how to optomize the system in the shortest amount of time. As you can see I don't really even know how to use the forum efficiently.

Thanks in advance for any direction.

Hello,

I'm totally new at all of this (1 week experience). I installed Vizio 50Plasma, Onkyo HT-S907, SA 8300HD. The system constantly reverts to 480I on restart, rather than staying with the 1080I as set up.

I have called Suffolk (NY) Cablevision and reset the box, Onkyo-no suggestions other than its a cable co problem, Vizio-which said the sa box was a problem.
If I reset the boxafter turning sys on it is ok til I turn it off. Then it reverts to 480i on restart.

I apologize for being so new at this that the info on the forum is unclear to me.
How can I learn how to optomize the system in the shortest amount of time. As you can see I don't really even know how to use the forum efficiently.

Thanks in advance for any direction.

It doesn't lock in the configuration until it goes through a POR (power on reset). Set it the correct way then unplug it and plug it back in.

xnappo

Hello,

I'm totally new at all of this (1 week experience). I installed Vizio 50Plasma, Onkyo HT-S907, SA 8300HD. The system constantly reverts to 480I on restart, rather than staying with the 1080I as set up.

I have called Suffolk (NY) Cablevision and reset the box, Onkyo-no suggestions other than its a cable co problem, Vizio-which said the sa box was a problem.
If I reset the boxafter turning sys on it is ok til I turn it off. Then it reverts to 480i on restart.

I apologize for being so new at this that the info on the forum is unclear to me.
How can I learn how to optomize the system in the shortest amount of time. As you can see I don't really even know how to use the forum efficiently.

Thanks in advance for any direction.

If xnappo's suggestion doesn't work, see the following thread:
Reverts to 480i (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=767661)
I had this same problem with a panasonic plasma and it seems to be HDCP handshaking related. I was able to solve it as per my post #10 in the above thread. Xnappo's suggestion did not work for me. Despite multiple attempts by myself and a cable technician.

If xnappo's suggestion doesn't work, see the following thread:
Reverts to 480i (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=767661)
I had this same problem with a panasonic plasma and it seems to be HDCP handshaking related. I was able to solve it as per my post #10 in the above thread. Xnappo's suggestion did not work for me. Despite multiple attempts by myself and a cable technician.Since this seems to keep coming up, I've added that link to the first post.

Here are some links to stories about the FCC's July 1, 2007 regulation:

Rent or Own? The New Cable-TV Dilemma (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=10745670&&#post10745670)

July 1, 2007: Cease the Use of New Set-Top Boxes with the Security Function (http://www.jsitel.com/hot_topics/SetTopBoxe-Lert.htm)
The FCC requires that by July 1, 2007, all MVPDs must cease selling or leasing new set-top boxes with integrated security and non-security functions. The FCC’s purpose for this rule is to position set-top boxes as “consumer electronic devices” available at retail outlets, while still allowing video/cable providers to have control of the security functions. After the July 1 deadline, when video/cable providers distribute new set-top boxes to subscribers, the units: 1) must utilize technologies that physically separate the security element in the set-top box; e.g., units that have slots for insertion of CableCARDs; or, 2) have “downloadable security” functions. The downloadable security process enables a video/cable operator to download the security functions into the set-top box at the customer’s location.

Most people now are familiar with the analog TV cutoff date of February 18, 2009. However, another cutoff date that affects the cable TV industry is looming far sooner, July 1, 2007. That's when the FCC says that Cable Operators may not purchase or deploy any set top cable box that has integrated security (for special services, premium content, etc.) (http://www.ipodobserver.com/story/31624)

Integration Ban - Q & A (http://www.ncta.com/IssueBrief.aspx?contentId=3553&view=3)

The FCC Media Bureau put the kibosh on Comcast's request to ditch the "integration ban" on January 10, 2007 that goes into effect on July 1, 2007. The FCC decision means that the ban will go forward as scheduled and cable operators will no longer be able to distribute set-top boxes with an integrated security component. (http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070111-8599.html) Note: This was reworded to specify the actual date instead of yesterday.

Note the word "new" in the regulation. Here is the current regulation including the correct date with a link to the regulation:

§ 76.1204 Availability of equipment performing conditional access or security functions. (http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr;sid=afd34206b8a2de2643d0fbd1ddf48b0e;rgn=div5;vie w=text;node=47%3A4.0.1.1.4;idno=47;cc=ecfr#47:4.0.1.1.4.16.3 .5)

(a)(1) A multichannel video programming distributor that utilizes navigation devices to perform conditional access functions shall make available equipment that incorporates only the conditional access functions of such devices. Commencing on July 1, 2007, no multichannel video programming distributor subject to this section shall place in service new navigation devices for sale, lease, or use that perform both conditional access and other functions in a single integrated device.

This information was first posted in the Comcast - Motorola DCH Set Top Box Thread. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=789805&page=1&pp=30) The discussion about what changes are required commencing on July 1, 2007 based on the FCC regulation starts with post # 17 then skips to post # 22 and continues to the end of the thread (currently post # 31). What do you think it means?

I just got the SA 8300HD because I could not get my TiVo Series 3 to work. It seems to record just fine, but when I play back recorded content to my JVC rear projection, I get lots of freezes and hang ups. When I start wathcing it is fine, but if I start to fast forward, then the problem accentuates. I did a quick search in this thread but did not find any exact similar problems. This is playing via HDMI to my HDTV at 1080i. The picture quality is great and even the frozen frames are in good high def. Just nothing is moving. The freeze lasts for anywhere from 5 secs to 30 seconds or more. Is this just a bad unit?

How can you tell if it recorded fine if you've never been able to watch it successfully?
It almost sounds like you've just got a bad cable signal and you're experiencing dropouts (during the record).

I just got the SA 8300HD because I could not get my TiVo Series 3 to work. It seems to record just fine, but when I play back recorded content to my JVC rear projection, I get lots of freezes and hang ups. When I start wathcing it is fine, but if I start to fast forward, then the problem accentuates. I did a quick search in this thread but did not find any exact similar problems. This is playing via HDMI to my HDTV at 1080i. The picture quality is great and even the frozen frames are in good high def. Just nothing is moving. The freeze lasts for anywhere from 5 secs to 30 seconds or more. Is this just a bad unit?

If live is okay, I think you may have a bad hard drive. Look at the bottom of the box to see the build date. TWC is my area doesn't test the drives very well on returned boxes.

xnappo

I recently got an hdtv, so I got the sa hd8300 from TW Houston. I hooked it up and every now and then when I switch channels, it acts like it can't can't get the signal well, it flashes the picture for a second, then goes black. It does this back and forth. I can turn the box off then on, and it will work fine again. Has anyone else seen this? Is this the TV or the Box?

I have noticed recently where the box will not record an entire show. It will leave out the last few minutes. I think this is where the show actually goes over the giving time slot. Really anoying.

I recently got an hdtv, so I got the sa hd8300 from TW Houston. I hooked it up and every now and then when I switch channels, it acts like it can't can't get the signal well, it flashes the picture for a second, then goes black. It does this back and forth. I can turn the box off then on, and it will work fine again. Has anyone else seen this? Is this the TV or the Box?Are you connected using HDMI? When you turn it off/on, does it then work ok with the same channels that had problems? Is it always the same channels?

I have noticed recently where the box will not record an entire show. It will leave out the last few minutes. I think this is where the show actually goes over the giving time slot. Really anoying.If the program goes past the scheduled End time, there is certainly nothing the box can do. If you suspect a program, like a sporting event, might go over, you can alter the End time or simply record the next program too to be safe. I routinely do that with NASCAR and the NHRA on Sunday's.

I recently got an hdtv, so I got the sa hd8300 from TW Houston. I hooked it up and every now and then when I switch channels, it acts like it can't can't get the signal well, it flashes the picture for a second, then goes black. It does this back and forth. I can turn the box off then on, and it will work fine again. Has anyone else seen this? Is this the TV or the Box?

I have noticed recently where the box will not record an entire show. It will leave out the last few minutes. I think this is where the show actually goes over the giving time slot. Really anoying.You should read the first post in this thread which has a lot of good tips and tricks. Also, you may want to read the Houston, TX - TWC (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=383882) thread. On June 19, 2007 the Time Warner Cable name becomes Comcast with payments being made to Comcast Houston. Comcast took control at the start of the year. Maybe, the thread name will change too. ;)

Any one know if there is a requirement that Cable Card 2 be physically compatible, in the sense that existing devices (Tivo) can update software and use them?

Is it possible?

Is it likely?

Any one know if there is a requirement that Cable Card 2 be physically compatible, in the sense that existing devices (Tivo) can update software and use them?

Is it possible?

Is it likely?
Not sure what you are talking about but the physical requirements of the cablecard are all the same, and it's only a decryptor of the stream from the host device. It's the host devices, such as Tivo, who need to figure out a way to send a return signal back to the headend to request OnDemand, PPV, SDV channels, etc. Tivo did not build such hardware into their current generation units. To that end, I am already using a CableCard equipped DVR where everything, including OnDemand, PPV, and SDV work beause the host device uses a return system embedded into the chassis (SA8300HDC). The cablecard, even the original single stream cards have been two way compatible from the start.

vegggas

Not sure what you are talking about but the physical requirements of the cablecard are all the same, and it's only a decryptor of the stream from the host device. It's the host devices, such as Tivo, who need to figure out a way to send a return signal back to the headend to request OnDemand, PPV, SDV channels, etc. Tivo did not build such hardware into their current generation units. To that end, I am already using a CableCard equipped DVR where everything, including OnDemand, PPV, and SDV work beause the host device uses a return system embedded into the chassis (SA8300HDC). The cablecard, even the original single stream cards have been two way compatible from the start.

vegggas

While technically correct - this is a bit misleading. Below is my interpretation of what vegggas has said and the Wikipedia article information. It may be total rubbish.

The reason the 8300HDC can do pay-per view etc has nothing to do with the cable card - the card is just to handle the decryption of received data. The box and the head-end have a pre-defined proprietary upstream communications protocol which allows the box to request data.

The Series 3 Tivo obviously does not have access to this proprietary scheme.

There are two solutions proposed for this.

The first is having the CableCard 2.0 specification require the ability of CableCard 2.0 equipment to run OCAP ON THE HOST DEVICE(not on the card itself - CableCard 2.0 is a change in the specification, not the physical card here). The code to request channels would be downloaded into the device by the head-end. OCAP in general provides for standardized communication between the device running OCAP and the head-end.

The second proposal is to drop the OCAP requirement and have cable card 2.0 have a standard scheme to request data. So the difference here is the cable company would not be downloading code into the host via OCAP - less control for them. The consumer companies want this to happen, but it doesn't look like it will right now.

The only way a Series 3 Tivo could possibly work with Pay-Per-View/SDV is if they built in a mechanism to download some portion of the OCAP communications stack from your cable company. It is unlikely this is possible.


Clear as mud? Read the Wikipedia article, it is very good.

xnappo

Are you connected using HDMI? When you turn it off/on, does it then work ok with the same channels that had problems? Is it always the same channels?

.

I am hooked up through HDMI. When I turn it off then on, it work for a while, then it will happen again. It usually happens when I go from an analogue channel to a digital HD channel (not just on 1 certain channel). For exampe when I go from channel 12 to 312.

I called Vizio, the manufacturer of the TV, and they said that they thought it was a problem with the HDMI connection, and that the SA8300hd box did not communicate well with the TV. They suggested: 1, switching out the box; 2: upgrading the firmware on the cable box; or 3 using the componet cables. I asked them why there is a problem, and he told me that there isn't a standard set for HDMI, so different cable box companies work well with different TVs. I had a Sceptre before this, and it worked fairly well with HDMI.

Any suggestions?

Any suggestions?I think what they told you is essentially correct, except maybe for switching out the boxes. While the box could be faulty, it's more likely not the problem. There is an interesting post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=10741895&&#post10741895) in the SATA thread that might be worth checking. Seems the cable itself might be "short" and causing connection problems.

Switching to/from SD/HD channels usually doesn't cause such problems, while switching TV inputs does, but HDMI is notorious for having problems. The spec is pretty loose and while some DVRs work correctly with a given TV, not all do. Software upgrades to the 8300 seem to have helped, as have firmare upgrades to some TVs. I haven't even tried HDMI because of all the problems, including audio hassles with 5.1, and with a CRT-based HDTV, the potential payoff is just not worth it to me.