I have Cablevision in NY, and I had the same problem. After months of driving myself crazy troubleshooting, I traced it back to the compressor in my small wine cooler in the next room. I just happened to notice it on a late night TV binge when it was quite. Every time the compressor kicked in, there was a sound drop out. I was able to duplicate the drop out by changing the temp and causing the compressor to kick in. I moved the cooler to the another outlet on the other phase of my electric and no more drop outs in a month now. Could it be that simple for you or is my case just unique?

I have my SA8300HD on a APC UPS Smart-UPS 700V. I still had issues for a while with FOX having audio drops. This issue was confirmed by OTA people in my same area. It was the local network broadcaster having issues that Comcast just passes along. This happened agian with CBS and it was confirmed as the local broadcaster's signal that the cable co just passes along.

I do believe that a compressor motor on the same circuit could also create issues with the box that could create audio drops.... most definately. I am just chiming in with the story of my local area broadcasters issues creating the audio drops.

Back on this Copy to VCR issue: I called Cox Tech Support in Fairfax, and of course they were LESS than clueless. Technician did not even know what I was talking about with the SARA operating system. I mentioned Vegggas's information about the problem first occurring with version 1.87.16.1 and fixed by version 1.87.27.1. I could almost feel the blank stare that the tech must have assumed with that information. Anyway, can someone give me the proper entry codes to display the SARA version number that is currently in the box? Maybe I can call them back and hopefully talk to a senior level tech that at least knows that the box actually operates with operating system software. Thanks in advance...

Ok, tried enabling 480i in addition to 1080i, 720p and 480p with my 8300hd and my Philips 42pf9630a/37. Egads, 480i looks horrible!!!! I guess the Philips internal scaler is not designed to work well with 480i. Letting the 8300hd do the 480p upscaling looks WAY better. So, 480i is unenabled again.

When the 8300 is hooked up via HDMI there is no pass through option. Or am I missing something.
HDMI is cool if everything was 16x9 HD but we are not there yet. Would component be better way to go?

When you have the 8300 setup with HDMI "pass through" is replaced by "Auto", the TV and the box talk to each other and come up with the best setting for the channel and the TV.

I beleive if you do the extended setup on the 8300 and turn off the or not enable the 480p or I then the Auto mode won't select that, but I haven't tried that.

I'm setup in auto mode with HDMI and all displays settings are enabled.

I understand, It does automatically set the size, when I view a HD Channel it works fine, It's when I view SD content, I get the bars on both side, I was just worried about screen burn in. I have a 30 Toshiba Widescreen Tube TV. It Has HDMI and everything else to.

Back on this Copy to VCR issue: I called Cox Tech Support in Fairfax, and of course they were LESS than clueless. Technician did not even know what I was talking about with the SARA operating system. I mentioned Vegggas's information about the problem first occurring with version 1.87.16.1 and fixed by version 1.87.27.1. I could almost feel the blank stare that the tech must have assumed with that information. Anyway, can someone give me the proper entry codes to display the SARA version number that is currently in the box? Maybe I can call them back and hopefully talk to a senior level tech that at least knows that the box actually operates with operating system software. Thanks in advance...
Look at the first posts on this thread for information on getting your diagnostic info.
At Cox, have them escalate the issue to their IT specialists who test STB software and other configurations. The CSR and helpdesk people will only know how to re-send the current active software. Of which they may not know anything about revision numbers, etc., just a Push Download to STB type of button or something. Also ask them to push the issue up a level or two.

I've been thinking about getting a UPS, especially since I have the STB connected to a projector.

Speaking about drop outs caused me to start investigating again. I just found out that there is an audio drop out issue for Dolby sound when using a cable stb and Onkyo receivers. From Onkyo " TX-DS595[I], TX-DS696, TX-DS797 and the TX-DS898. If you own one of these units while using any form of Dolby Laboratories Digital broadcast and are experiencing the audio dropouts and would like to have the issue resolved, please check our website for your nearest authorized service location. Take the unit to them with your bill of sale, at that point please call us at 800-229-1687 and select option 2 for our product support team. We will assist having the unit repaired for you. " Looks like I'll give them a shot at fixing it.

DoubleDaz,
Can you supply me with the location of the thread referencing the copy flag issue with Cox?
Thanks

************************************************************ ************
FWIW, I noticed there is a new thread complaining about Cox messing with the copy flags and the recording resolution for 1394/Firewire, but I don't know if that is a temporary problem or if it's related to this issue.
************************************************************ ************That is the thread I was referring to. I think it's temporary, happened here last year sometime IIRC, but I think the day is coming.

I understand, It does automatically set the size, when I view a HD Channel it works fine, It's when I view SD content, I get the bars on both side, I was just worried about screen burn in. I have a 30 Toshiba Widescreen Tube TV. It Has HDMI and everything else to.

In Auto mode for me on the HD channel when the content is not in HD I get the bars, on the SD channel it is stretched for me with no bars on a Dell W3201C.

I have my SA8300HD on a APC UPS Smart-UPS 700V...

I do believe that a compressor motor on the same circuit could also create issues with the box that could create audio drops....


Though most decent UPSes (yours included) should protect/buffer against that by leveling off the output voltage (either by switching temporarily to battery or through the use of a voltage regulator).

Though most decent UPSes (yours included) should protect/buffer against that by leveling off the output voltage (either by switching temporarily to battery or through the use of a voltage regulator).


I agree completely. I guess I didn't write the post with enough clearification. Let me try once again:

With the UPS I get no issues and expect no issues. AND still I did had issues (same audio drops). Ended up as broadcast source issue (OTA had same issues, etc..).

Different sincerio - No UPS (original poster) and it can still be the source channel feed OR electrical issues due to compressor motors, etc....

I was stating that the original poster might consider it was the channel source while still acknowledging that the compressor wasn't a crazy idea / source of the issue. Just posting a FYI, heads up.

WITHDRAWN FROM THIS THREAD

[QUOTE=preiser]I have the following equipment and the following problems.

A one-week old SA 8300 HD STB from Time Warner NYC
A one week old KDL-V40XBR1 Bravia LCD HDTV from Sony
A several years old Tivo (I don’t know the model number)


PROBLEM 1
My coaxial cable goes into the STB and the signal goes out via the HDMI output into the TV’s HDMI input, but I get no video or audio. The TV does seem to detect the connection, though, because I do not get the message “no connection detected” which I do get when selecting other TV inputs. When I use the coaxial output from the STB to the antenna input on the TV, I get audio and video for all channels, including the HD channels. In short I can use the coaxial connection between the STB and the TV but not the HDMI connection. How do I get the HDMI to work? Is this a problem with my TV or my STB? (I have a subscription with TW for their HDTV service, so it should not be an issue of needing an upgrade of my level of service).

ok a couple of thoughts. first of all if you read this forum dispite what people say HDMI is not ready for prime time.

secondly i have time warner in NYC and cablevision at home on long island. I believe (and could be wrong) that time warner uses the other software (not sara) so you may have posted in the wrong forum. In new york and on long island I have no problem with the HDMI out as long as i dont pass it through another box (amplifier). make sure you have the latest firmware. restart everything (for time warner you press and hold the power button till you get boot). whenever i've had HDMI problems with TW that fixes it for me. good luck

Just confirming that SATA is enabled and working fine in Middletown, NJ. Setup, install, format, took less than 5 minutes.

Just confirming that SATA is enabled and working fine in Middletown, NJ. Setup, install, format, took less than 5 minutes.
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Great to hear. Are you with cablevision or comcast? I believe they both run the same SARA configuration but not positive, could be different district to district. I'm with cablevision in Marlboro, NJ, according to the manual SATA is for future use but does not mention if it is default disabled.

Kevin

Just confirming that SATA is enabled and working fine in Middletown, NJ. Setup, install, format, took less than 5 minutes.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Great to hear. Are you with cablevision or comcast? I believe they both run the same SARA configuration but not positive, could be different district to district. I'm with cablevision in Marlboro, NJ, according to the manual SATA is for future use but does not mention if it is default disabled.

Kevin

any recomendations for which drive to buy? a lot of them seem to come with a PCI card (which i dont need)

any recomendations for which drive to buy? a lot of them seem to come with a PCI card (which i dont need)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Only one I've seen specifically for the 8300.

http://discountechnology.com/s.nl;jsessionid=ac112b1f1f43731105ed3440424aa5c9bfd79a0d1dd6 .e3eTaxiNaN0Te34OaNeTbNmNaxn0n6jAmljGr5XDqQLvpAe?category=12&it=A&id=220





Kevin

any recomendations for which drive to buy? a lot of them seem to come with a PCI card (which i dont need)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Only one I've seen specifically for the 8300.

http://discountechnology.com/s.nl;jsessionid=ac112b1f1f43731105ed3440424aa5c9bfd79a0d1dd6 .e3eTaxiNaN0Te34OaNeTbNmNaxn0n6jAmljGr5XDqQLvpAe?category=12&it=A&id=220





Kevin

you have to use one of theirs?

BS Guys,

Go to the beginning of this Thread: You will see that most of us have assembled our own drives (it's easy). Only in the last 3 or 4 months have commercially packaged drives appeared for this application (and usually at higher prices than the do-it yourself approach. The original "intent" was to have cable companies test various drives and publish a list of "approved" or "recommended" drives. Most cable companies have ignored the capability and have ot published any such list. However, one commercially available drive is the Maxtor "Quickview". Check the ad at the top of this page for "Weaknees" - one outfit selling the "Quickview".

Dave, thanks for the tip. I just got my 8300 on Tuesday and was looking to see if the SATA output/input was active before I started any heavy research on an external drive. Besides the one you pointed out the only other I've seen was the one I linked to earliyer. I'll look into the BYO drive.....sounds like fun.

Kevin

Dave,

Don't you mean the SATA thread?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=516559

Dave,

Don't you mean the SATA thread?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=516559

:o Yes. I was on "autopilot" responding to Ext Drive issues.

Dave-

I found a small typo in the first post of this thread:


Diagnostic Mode. There are two ways to enter the Diagnostic Mode:
Press and hold the Select button on the front of the unit until the Mail light starts to flash, then press the INFO button.

Press and hold the Pause button on the remote until the Mail light starts to flash (around 10-15 seconds), then press the Page Up (-) button.


To get into diagnostic mode from the remote, you should hit Page + after the mail light starts flashing. My 8300HD was acting funny this afternoon (couldn't get out of pause), so I came here to look up the buttons to press to reboot it. Then I decided to look at the diagnostics, but when I followed the above directions, the LEDs showed E-00 and I couldn't change channels (but the transport buttons worked). Hitting DVR List displayed hdd1 on the LEDs. When I saw hdd1 I figured I was getting ready to format the hard drive, so I hit the power button, which returned everything to normal.

Sean

Well, I don't know about your remote, but mine (both my SA remote and my Harmony 688) works as indicated in the first post. I hit the Page + and nothing happens. I hit the Page - and get the diagnostics display. After that, I can use Page +/- to go forward or backward through the pages. What model is your remote?

Great to hear. Are you with cablevision or comcast? I believe they both run the same SARA configuration but not positive, could be different district to district. I'm with cablevision in Marlboro, NJ, according to the manual SATA is for future use but does not mention if it is default disabled.

Kevin

I have Comcast.

I called my local office in Eatontown; they told me SATA was NOT enabled. I figured I'd give it a shot anyway since the CSRs are usually clueless and luckily it worked.

Well, I don't know about your remote, but mine (both my SA remote and my Harmony 688) works as indicated in the first post. I hit the Page + and nothing happens. I hit the Page - and get the diagnostics display. After that, I can use Page +/- to go forward or backward through the pages. What model is your remote?
Dave-

I've got the remote that came with the 8300HD here in OKC on Cox- inside the battery compartment it says URC 7820B00-SA.

I just tried again, and definitely I have to hit Page + to get diagnostics page 1/34 to show up on the screen, then Page + goes to page 2/34, etc. I've got SARA 1.87.16.1.

I've also got a Harmony 520, but I can't get the mail light to flash while holding its pause button. I'm thinking that maybe it has a "stuck button" feature that stops sending the command after a while. If I use the SA remote to get the mail light to flash, I can do everything else with the Harmony. It also requires Page + to get the diagnostics to display.

On both remotes, if I hit Page - instead, the TV display doesn't change, but the LEDs on the box go to E-00.

Just to be clear, on the SA remote, Page + is above the "up" button, and Page - is below the "down" button.

Sean

Tried to search for a hint, but couldn't find anything.

Not sure if I'm missing something, but I can't quite figure out how to use my SA8300HD to record something that I'm watching on one of my Adelphia Cable's "On Demand" stations....

I see the channel # listed under Guide, but can't get "manual record" to recognize that staion #!!??

Any thoughts?

Tried to search for a hint, but couldn't find anything.

Not sure if I'm missing something, but I can't quite figure out how to use my SA8300HD to record something that I'm watching on one of my Adelphia Cable's "On Demand" stations....

I see the channel # listed under Guide, but can't get "manual record" to recognize that staion #!!??

Any thoughts?
Phil-

For whatever reason, that isn't allowed/possible. The manual (http://www.scientificatlanta.com/ExplorerClubGuides/getting_started/4003870.pdf) says "Can I record video-on-demand (VOD) programs? No."

You can record (authorized) pay-per-view programs, though.

Sean

I've got the remote that came with the 8300HD here in OKC on Cox- inside the battery compartment it says URC 7820B00-SA.Well, I suspect that's the problem. On your remote, the Up/Down functions appear to be reversed. SA ships or cableco's use a number of different remotes with the 8300 for some reason, but you're the first to mention a difference. I'll add a comment in the first post that you might have to use the opposite button on some model remotes.

Phil-

For whatever reason, that isn't allowed/possible. The manual (http://www.scientificatlanta.com/ExplorerClubGuides/getting_started/4003870.pdf) says "Can I record video-on-demand (VOD) programs? No."

You can record (authorized) pay-per-view programs, though.

Sean

Pretty strange. You pay for HBO, they throw in HBO On-Demand for free, but you're not allowed to record it!

I wonder if it's some technological problem or if they have some reason why they don't want you to do this?

Thanks for your help!!!!

We can't record video on demand here in Toronto either.

My theory is the DVR playback channel may be involved with VOD, but I can't prove it.

We can't record video on demand here in Toronto either.

My theory is the DVR playback channel may be involved with VOD, but I can't prove it.


Interesting that the 8300 manual says that you can record P-P-V movies, but not VOD.

If I remember, I'll have to try to record a P-P-V movie next time I buy one.

Has anyone discussed what Cisco buying SA could mean (or is this the wrong thread). There is also some thought in the industry Cisco has its eyes on Tivo.... That would be real interesting.

We can't record video on demand here in Toronto either.

My theory is the DVR playback channel may be involved with VOD, but I can't prove it.
I wonder if it is as simple as DVR and VOD both using the same transport buttons, so it would be confusing to the user.

Also, both features let you watch shows at your convenience, and overlap somewhat in functionality. If all VOD movies were always available, there'd be no reason to record them and waste drive space.

Sean

If all VOD movies were always available, there'd be no reason to record them and waste drive space.

Sean

Good comment!

Gets me directly to the reason I want to copy VOD to the 8300....I'm used to going from the 8300 to my VCR to share movies with my parents.

Is there a way to go right from VOD to the VCR without saving to the 8300 first?

thnx

I'm guessing you download off the drive to vcr via fire wire now? Since VOD wont go to the drive you should be able to copy to vcr with either composite or s-video out to capture VOD.
According to the manual both component and composite/s-video all output at the same time.


Kevin

I'm guessing you download off the drive to vcr via fire wire now? Since VOD wont go to the drive you should be able to copy to vcr with either composite or s-video out to capture VOD.
According to the manual both component and composite/s-video all output at the same time.


Kevin

I used to understand how to hook the basic stuff up until I bought an HDTV and it got so confusing. None of the wiring charts seemed to mimic my set-up since I have a combo VCR/DVD. :confused:

(I even have a SONY VCR/DVD and a SONY TV, but neither have a wiring diagram that included both those and a setup that shows something similar to the 8300!!??)

Anyway:

1) No firewire.....I connect the 8300 to the VCR/DVD with components.

2) I've gotten spoiled. I just record everything first and then set the 8300 to "copy to VCR."

3) Since that doesn't work for VOD, do I simply play the VOD and set the VCR to record simultaneously???

thnx

Pretty strange. You pay for HBO, they throw in HBO On-Demand for free, but you're not allowed to record it!

I wonder if it's some technological problem or if they have some reason why they don't want you to do this?



If it's Video on Demand, you don't need to record it on your dvr as you can get it "on demand" from the head end.

Thus, you cannot capture video on demand as there is no reason for it to be on your system.

Except that shows are constantly being added and/or deleted. If there is a movie that is available on demand today, but I won't have time to watch it until next week, I would want to save it now as it may be gone by next week.

Hask


If it's Video on Demand, you don't need to record it on your dvr as you can get it "on demand" from the head end.

Thus, you cannot capture video on demand as there is no reason for it to be on your system.

Interesting that the 8300 manual says that you can record P-P-V movies, but not VOD.

If I remember, I'll have to try to record a P-P-V movie next time I buy one.

I recorded a PPV movie several months ago (a "freebie" for buying the 8300HD). However, I had to wait for the movie to start before it would record. I wasn't able to schedule the recording ahead of time.

I wonder if it is as simple as DVR and VOD both using the same transport buttons, so it would be confusing to the user.

Also, both features let you watch shows at your convenience, and overlap somewhat in functionality. If all VOD movies were always available, there'd be no reason to record them and waste drive space.

Sean

Excellent point. I didn't think about that.

I apologize if this has been covered, but if it has, I couldn't find it --

8300HD, out to VCR, my quality is good, but I have bars above/below any program that is in HD -- anyway to avoid this?

Thanks

Eric

I used to understand how to hook the basic stuff up until I bought an HDTV and it got so confusing. None of the wiring charts seemed to mimic my set-up since I have a combo VCR/DVD. :confused:

(I even have a SONY VCR/DVD and a SONY TV, but neither have a wiring diagram that included both those and a setup that shows something similar to the 8300!!??)

Anyway:

1) No firewire.....I connect the 8300 to the VCR/DVD with components.

2) I've gotten spoiled. I just record everything first and then set the 8300 to "copy to VCR."

3) Since that doesn't work for VOD, do I simply play the VOD and set the VCR to record simultaneously???

thnx



According to the manual you can record live TV directly to VCR when not using "copy to VCR" function by just hitting record on the VCR. It does note however that any remote control activities, including info banners & on-screen displays will be recorded to the VCR tape!


Kevin

I apologize if this has been covered, but if it has, I couldn't find it --

8300HD, out to VCR, my quality is good, but I have bars above/below any program that is in HD -- anyway to avoid this?

Thanks

Eric

In short: NO.

Welcome to the shape of TV of the future.

According to the manual you can record live TV directly to VCR when not using "copy to VCR" function by just hitting record on the VCR. It does note however that any remote control activities, including info banners & on-screen displays will be recorded to the VCR tape!


Kevin


It's not quite as convenient as recording on the 8300 & then going to the VCR, but it's better than nothing.

Thanks for your help!!!!!!

According to the manual you can record live TV directly to VCR when not using "copy to VCR" function by just hitting record on the VCR. It does note however that any remote control activities, including info banners & on-screen displays will be recorded to the VCR tape! Kevin

Thanks Kevin. 2,000 posts and yours is one of about 3 I can actually use.

Except that shows are constantly being added and/or deleted. If there is a movie that is available on demand today, but I won't have time to watch it until next week, I would want to save it now as it may be gone by next week.

Hask

They are usually shown for weeks if not a month so the arguement about storing it on the last showing doesn't hold much weight with the powers that be.

PVRs are not made for long term archieving of data....they are meant for time shifting.

Well..the sound on my 8300HD just suddenly stopped working. I heard a slight click while watching a DVR program and sound cut out. Tried shutting it off and on and still no sound. Tried connecting through component and still no sound but the sound on the TV works trhough DVD so I know its not the TV.

Any suggestions?

Try a hard reboot (unplug power cord, then press and hold power button while plugging power cord back in until display says Boot or begins cycling).

Hmm, thats kind of hard to do because my power cord is plugged in on the opposite side of the wall in the closet..I will have to wait till tomorrow to get someone to help me out with that.

I tried unplugging it for a minute and that did not fix anything.

Just unplug it from the back of the 8300. It's easy enough to do a hard reboot with 2 hands.

Also, did you try any of the other audio connections; L-R, optical, coax?

The hard reboot with reset the 8300 internals, clear the cache, reload the software and IPG. Hopefully something is just stuck software-wise. If not, sounds (no pun intended) like you may need to replace the box.

Will a hard reboot erase all my recorded shows?

It shouldn't, never has mine. Some folks do a hard reboot once a month or so. Like a PC, the 8300 can be prone to similar ills and things need to be reset from time to time.

Nope. Did not work. thanks for you help..I will play around with it some more tomorrow and if I can't get it fixed I'll have to pick up a new box. What sucks is I still had a few shows that I recorded and didnt get to watch.

It shouldn't, never has mine. Some folks do a hard reboot once a month or so. Like a PC, the 8300 can be prone to similar ills and things need to be reset from time to time.

my box was not putting out sound last night and i rebooted and got sound back. speaking of that, i have to reboot once a week with my sara box (my passport about every 3 months) is this unusual? sometimes because of a blank screen sometimes i just get part of a blank screen and part of the on screen menu.

last night i tried to watch wednesday nights jon stewart and it said that the recording was their (in my dvr list) but when i pressed select it tuned to the dvr channel and i just got a message telling me to go back to the recorded show list. i tried playing tuesdays jon stewart and other recorded shows and they worked perfectly.

Rebooting once a week is unusual. Even HAVING to reboot every 3 months is unusual IMHO. I don't reboot at all unless something quits working right. The last time, about 6 months ago, I couldn't schedule a recording because it kept saying there was a conflict, even though the conflict only displayed 2 programs. There was obviously a 3rd one in the quethat simply wasn't being displayed and the reboot took care of the conflict.

Not sure what happened with the Jon Stewart recording. How is it that you have 2 boxes, one with SARA and one with Passport?

What sucks is I still had a few shows that I recorded and didnt get to watch.Yeah, that does suck. You could always do the Closed Caption thing, but if they are sitcoms, that kind of doesn't cut it, does it? :)

I take it you didn't get a chance to connect to the other audio ports to see if it's just the HDMI port. The only other things I can think of trying would be the General Settings/Audio: Digital Out, Range, or Volume Ctrl options to see if one of those got set wrong somehow, though I don't know that any of the options would drop audio altogether.

Rebooting once a week is unusual. Even HAVING to reboot every 3 months is unusual IMHO. I don't reboot at all unless something quits working right. The last time, about 6 months ago, I couldn't schedule a recording because it kept saying there was a conflict, even though the conflict only displayed 2 programs. There was obviously a 3rd one in the quethat simply wasn't being displayed and the reboot took care of the conflict.

Not sure what happened with the Jon Stewart recording. How is it that you have 2 boxes, one with SARA and one with Passport?

so i have some kind of problem with signal strenghth or my boxes.

in answer to your question have cablevision in east hampton:sara (sucks) and time warner in Manhatten which is passport (much, much better, in my opinion). i hear direct tv is going to a leasing model (no up front cost).

Once a week. Ouch. On the opposite end of the spectrum... I have NEVER had to reboot my SARA based 8300HD. I've had it since they first came out here. Not sure how long ago that was. Maybe 2 years now? Has it been that long?

Once a week. Ouch. On the opposite end of the spectrum... I have NEVER had to reboot my SARA based 8300HD. I've had it since they first came out here. Not sure how long ago that was. Maybe 2 years now? Has it been that long?

ok i'll call cablevision (that will be fun)

ok i'll call cablevision (that will be fun)


had a fascinating chat with cablevision about my reboot problems they claim that box must be off at night. if it isn't and they push upgrade i will have problems the next day. is this true? if yes it's the first time i'm hearing this

How do I fix this recording issue:

A few weeks ago ABC showed the first episode (and I believe the only episode shown so far) of Emily's Reasons Why Not. Prior to its airing I selected it in the IPG and set it to record all first-run episodes on that channel at any time.

Since then, for the last 2 weeks it has recorded another show that was on in the same time slot and put it in the recorded programs list labeled as Emily's Reasons Why Not when in fact another show was recorded. In both cases, prior to recording, the recorded show appeared red in the IPG. In fact, last week Lost appeared red AND when I tried to cancel Lost, it asked me if I wanted to cancel all recordings of Emily's Reasons Why Not!

had a fascinating chat with cablevision about my reboot problems they claim that box must be off at night. if it isn't and they push upgrade i will have problems the next day. is this true? if yes it's the first time i'm hearing this
The probability of having problems after update is raised when the STB is on during update. Turning off the STB allows for full use of the cleared memory for getting the update. Set up a timer in your STB to turn off each night, and then back on in the morning if you think it's a problem.

srothkin,
Delete your season pass for that show. It was cancelled immediately and there are no more shows scheduled for airing. The STB will try to reserve that space based on how you set to record, which was supposedly going to be weekly series, but is pre-empted each week for alternative programming.

vegggas

Rebooting once a week is unusual. Even HAVING to reboot every 3 months is unusual IMHO. I don't reboot at all unless something quits working right. The last time, about 6 months ago, I couldn't schedule a recording because it kept saying there was a conflict, even though the conflict only displayed 2 programs. There was obviously a 3rd one in the quethat simply wasn't being displayed and the reboot took care of the conflict.

Not sure what happened with the Jon Stewart recording. How is it that you have 2 boxes, one with SARA and one with Passport?

I've owned my 8300HD for more than 18 months and have never rebooted it.

Jim,

I consider myself one of the luckier 8300 users with few problems (which seems to aggravate some folks here :) ), but I see you are even luckier. I've only had to reboot the one time and it was probably more due to IPG problems than the 8300 itself. IMHO, many 8300-related problems are actually due to cableco/IPG problems. I did reboot a couple ofother times, but that was only to test something for someone.

Neil,

I should have thought of multiple locations, sorry for the question.

FWIW, I turn my 8300 off every time I turn the TV off. There used to be an auto-shutdown to minmize update problems, but I think many cableco's have turned that option off.

Jim,

Neil,

I should have thought of multiple locations, sorry for the question.

FWIW, I turn my 8300 off every time I turn the TV off. There used to be an auto-shutdown to minmize update problems, but I think many cableco's have turned that option off.

i was browsing Hi-def pay per view options and when i tried to return to the guide i could not change the channel and a few seconds later i would get the hi-def ppv menu again. tried it a bunch of times before i unplugged the darn thing.

ps you can set a timer to shut the thing down at 2 am and back on at 6 am (i have kids no shot at them turning it off themselves)

Anyone ever have problems with the audio and videoon HD channels sort of stuttering, like multiple, really fast audio drop outs? It has happened a few times the last few days on the HD channels, when I switch to SD channels it's fine though. Then I checked the same HD channels over my tuner in the TV and they were fine, so it had to be the box.

So the caption option does work so I will watch the two shows I need to with captions and no sound then go tomorrow to swap out the box for a new one..

I have also experienced the audio and video "cut-outs" that you are describing so hopefully a new box will stop this too.

Does anybody know the latest version of SARA. Im at 1.87.27.1 w/. Cox in the Cleveland, OH area.

Barney1,
You're chasing rainbows when you persue a SARA version. The version you have is the servion released for your cable system. There are a lot of variations from area to area. You are right to persue the best feature list you can learn about and legitimately hound your cableco for a feature like start from beggining on a program still recording instead of rewinding from the live point. But telling your cableco you want version x.xx.x.x is futile, it probably isn't even made available to them because it is designed for another locations specifications.

TerryB

Barney1,
You're chasing rainbows when you persue a SARA version. The version you have is the servion released for your cable system. There are a lot of variations from area to area. You are right to persue the best feature list you can learn about and legitimately hound your cableco for a feature like start from beggining on a program still recording instead of rewinding from the live point. But telling your cableco you want version x.xx.x.x is futile, it probably isn't even made available to them because it is designed for another locations specifications.

TerryB

that hounding cable co's for features works? because i've got a very long list, but the chance of cablevision listening to me are about as good as the NY Knicks winning a championship.

Well, if you don't hound them, it's all but guaranteed nothing will happen and they'll think you are perfectly satisfied with what you have (and everyone knows we are NEVER satisfied :) ). Of course, hounding them may not be the correct term, but certainly making your wishes known is worth an email. The actual hounding should begin in earnest once you hear that a new version, like OS 1.5, has been released. SA tends to only deal with issues that have been identified by cableco's. That may change as Tivo enters the cable market, but it appears SA actually wants cableco's to use more 3rd party stuff for IPGs, etc., and let SA concentrate on getting their hardware up to par. While I and several others have had relatively few problems with our boxes for 1-2 years now, there still seem to be enough quality control problems to cause them plenty of headaches just with the hardware, let alone the software changes users want.

SARA version?
Does anybody know the latest version of SARA. Im at 1.87.27.1 w/. Cox in the Cleveland, OH area.
Just picked up a unit at the Cox Parma office (West Cleveland) yesterday, Feb. 3,2006.
Version v1.87.27.1

Just had the cable guy out. He said I have plenty of signal and that they have tons of problems with the 8300hd much less with the non dvr HD box. He says rebooting is normal…. Oh well back to rebooting every few days

Just had the cable guy out. He said I have plenty of signal and that they have tons of problems with the 8300hd much less with the non dvr HD box. He says rebooting is normal…. Oh well back to rebooting every few days I think you need to tell him that you need to reboot him. ;)

Just had the cable guy out. He said I have plenty of signal and that they have tons of problems with the 8300hd much less with the non dvr HD box. He says rebooting is normal…. Oh well back to rebooting every few days

Could you put your location in your profile - that way we all can see where you are coming from and what cable system is so lousy.

I'm on Time Warner in Rochester NY and have had an 8300HD for something like 1 1/2 years (also have an external drive attached to it for almost 1 year). We have very little problems here - those comments on problems make me think that there is some incompatability in YOUR cable system and the 8300HD (or on the version of SW that they are using).

Could you put your location in your profile - that way we all can see where you are coming from and what cable system is so lousy.

I'm on Time Warner in Rochester NY and have had an 8300HD for something like 1 1/2 years (also have an external drive attached to it for almost 1 year). We have very little problems here - those comments on problems make me think that there is some incompatability in YOUR cable system and the 8300HD (or on the version of SW that they are using).

i have cablevision in east hampton and time warner in NY. i could be mistaken but doesnt your time warner box run passport (seems more stable).

No - It's SARA (1.87.16.109). Most cable systems were originally built with one or the other. As these systems were bought by the "biggies" they stayed (the really can't practically change) with the software they had. As a result TW has both SARA and Passport, I know that the same is true of Comcast.

I don't think that Passport is more stable - but it does have a different feature set (better user interface, no external drive capability).

The real bummer in this stuff is the Motorola HD DVR in use on some systems. Both of our daughters (one in Maryland, on in Atlanta) have them and what a piece of junk that one is.

the people in the yahoo cablevision format seemed poised to go directv when they go all lease and get their HD satellites running. there is some debate about whether sat hd is inferior to cable. the general feeling is cable is better at the moment but it will even out. the sat. dvr's seem more stable

Quick question. I have been using the 8300 with cablevison in NJ. I have on several occasions tried to record a program which prompted the appearance of the conflict screen stating that I cannot record 3 programs at once, but it only offers 2 programs choices to cancel from?

The recording schedule only shows 2 channels scheduled to record during this time period. Is there additional channels/time slots reserved based on various recording preferences that do not show up in the scheduled recording list and would not be offered as options on the conflict screen??

So I have my 8300HD S-video out hooked up to my Tivo, so I can record to it (so far only using 8300HD as DVR for hi-def channels only...I like Tivo better still). Also have L/R audio to Tivo.

So all this does is feed the SAME thing I am watching on either tuner of the 8300HD that I have going through HDMI. What I mean is, if the Tivo changes channels and records something from the S-video, I have to watch it as well through HDMI.

So we come to my question. Is there any way to feed/force the SECOND tuner of the 8300HD to output to the S-video/L/R audio, so I can record non-hidef channels on Tivo and watch something different through the HDMI output? I know if I use the 8300HD's DVR funtionaliy, I can do this, but I really want to use the Tivo. Is this possible?

-Brian

Hi

I recently received an 8300HD box and was curious if there was any sort of diagnostic menu that would show signal strength for the cable signal being received.

I live out in a rural area and we have always had poor cable signals. I am getting the digital signals but occasionally get some picture breakup - was thinking it might be because the signal level might be borderline.

Thanks

- Al

Quick question. I have been using the 8300 with cablevison in NJ. I have on several occasions tried to record a program which prompted the appearance of the conflict screen stating that I cannot record 3 programs at once, but it only offers 2 programs choices to cancel from?=

You need to do a hard reboot. Fixed the problem for me.

Brian,

Not that I know of. All output ports are tied to the "active" tuner, unless you are using the Copy To VCR function to record a recorded program to tape or DVD.

Hi

I recently received an 8300HD box and was curious if there was any sort of diagnostic menu that would show signal strength for the cable signal being received.

I live out in a rural area and we have always had poor cable signals. I am getting the digital signals but occasionally get some picture breakup - was thinking it might be because the signal level might be borderline.

Thanks

- Al

Instructions for this are in the first post.

I recently received an 8300HD box and was curious if there was any sort of diagnostic menu that would show signal strength for the cable signal being received.The first post contains instructions for SARA users to get to the diagnostic displays. Pages 1 shows signal strengths under RF Parameters. Page 5 shows it, along with S/N ratio, etc., under "level" for both analog and QAM (digital) channels. Page 10 also shows it. The number should be within the range of +10 to -10 dBmV.

Thanks guys, I tried searching the thread first and didn't see it, guess I should have started on page 1 :-)

Kind of off topic, but if you have an iPod or similar USB device, you can charge it using the 8300HD's front USB port.

This is handy if your computer is turned off and you need to recharge.

3 boxes later and I finally have a functioning 8300HD again . Last one they gave me did not boot up at all..all I got was the 4 dashes and no time and just a clicking sound when I hit the power button.

They also let me keep the extra cables from each new box they gave me even though I only kept taking back the settop itself so if anyone needs components cables, Im willing to sell them to you for a reasonable price!

IMHO, that is one of the biggest things cableco's do to give them and their equipment a bad name, recycle units that should be sent back for repair. There is simply no way it should take 4 units to get one that functions correctly. While my one and only 8300 has performed fine for over a year now, I have no dellusions that SA doesn't have the best QA program. But, if their success rate were only 25%, even they couldn't stay in business.

3 boxes later and I finally have a functioning 8300HD again . Last one they gave me did not boot up at all..all I got was the 4 dashes and no time and just a clicking sound when I hit the power button.

They also let me keep the extra cables from each new box they gave me even though I only kept taking back the settop itself so if anyone needs components cables, Im willing to sell them to you for a reasonable price!
It sounds like you are at the bottom of the minimum acceptable signal level for your data carriers. You could have many problems to come if the levels are too low. I give it about a 50-50 chance of failing soon.

vegggas

I second Vegggas's opinion, the box that worked is a quirk. Your line is hosed, possibly in the reuturn side.

TerryB

Funny line related thing this morning, the house is dead for analog and digital channels in all outlets, but the 8300 can talk to the head office and has time and playback ability.

How do I find out what the signal level is? And what do you mean by the line is hosed?

jmakVR6,
If you look at the front end of this thread, it will show instructions for the diagnostic screens, in fact there were some discussions about the screens a couple days ago. Look just slightly up the page to the post of 2-05 for diag. discussion on signal level.

By hosed I mean not properly functioning, as it appears to me the STB is not able to exchange data properly with the head end which loads software, authorizes operations, authorizes premium channels, etc. If the two computers can't correspond through the "hosed" cable circuit up and down wirection, then the box won't work correctly.

TerryB

I should have been more specific.
Your Forward Data Carrier (FDC) level is too low and/or your Return Data Carrier (RDC) level is way too high. FDC is the strength of the data download signal eventually getting to your STB from the headend. Too low and it's not strong enough to get the download and it could be corrupted.
The RDC is the strength of the signal needed from the STB to reach the headend. Too high, and the return amplifier in the STB is maxed out, running hot causing heat problems and is clipping the return signal so that it's not recognizeable at the headend.
That is the reason that you will get the four dashed lines when the STB is trying to download it's OS and information. This is typical of bad home coax lines from home amplifiers (no return amp), power surge "protectors" and conditioners that people put their RF cable through, bad connectors/cabless, barrel extensions, and splitters.

vegggas

Ok, I just went through a lot of the info on the front page and realized I should have read it before, sorry. I will check my diagnostic screens later on today when I am home and report back.

If something is wrong, then it most likely is from the cable/connecters or the splitter being used to split the line to the TV and cable modem because I am not running the coax line through a surge protector or line conditioner.

I know in this LONG thread that folks have mentioned pixelation/jitter/issues with the HD channels from the 8300HD.

Well, as anyone figured out how to fix this. I have noticed that a reboot of hte box addresses the issue in the short term, and in my case, its not every channel (aka, Fox HD seems fine, ABC HD has issues).

I am in New England areas with Charter Comm. cable, and the tech that came out (I was not home, so this is what my wife said he said :rolleyes: ) that I had a "spitter" issue, and addressed it. But we are still seeing intermit drop-outs.

Can anyone share there experiences with this, and if you somehow got fixed this issue how? This is annoying the hell out of me :mad:

-Brian

The 8300 HD has audio issues which are not related to signal levels. As far as I am aware, ALL picture issues are related to signal levels/ connecting hardware faults / or digital connectivity (HDMI) problems which usually provide an error message. Yours sounds like signal levels to me.

Try making a diary and keep track of channel, time of day, weather for a short period (couple days) and ask for a level 3 tech assistance to help you sort it out.


TerryB

i've been trying for weeks to get a level 3 dude to help me with HDMI no way i can get that high up. (cablevision)

I was trying to enable other picture formats besides 1080i and now I am stuck in the 480i mode with my TV displaying "Not Supported Mode". And when I try to get that screen back by pressing Info and Guide, its not working. How do I get out of 480i mode?

Ok, I just went through a lot of the info on the front page and realized I should have read it before, sorry. I will check my diagnostic screens later on today when I am home and report back.No need to apologize. This is one of the few threads where info in the first post if kept updated and most folks probably never consider that. IMHO, posts like the first one here should be able to be posted and maintained separately in a FAQ Forum. How many people would think to start with the first post in a thread containing this many posts?

If something is wrong, then it most likely is from the cable/connecters or the splitter being used to split the line to the TV and cable modem because I am not running the coax line through a surge protector or line conditioner.If you didn't upgrade your splitter to 1GHz or better, that could very well be part of the problem. You'll know as soon as you check your diagnosic displays. If the signal level is out of range, it will be highlighted in orange. I should mention though that I still had a picture with a signal as low as -19 on my old SA3270HD, though I did get breakups, etc., at the time. I rewired things when I got the SA8300HD.

JmakVR6, neilk2350,
Don't know if anyone else mentioned this yet, but HDMI is way overrated and not worth the hassle of the two way communication from the display. The HDMI/DVI display is forcing the STB into strange states for video resolution and audio compatibility - Remove the HDMI cable from the STB side, use component and everything should work correctly.
Check the HDMI link in my sig for more info.

If you didn't upgrade your splitter to 1GHz or better, that could very well be part of the problem. You'll know as soon as you check your diagnosic displays. If the signal level is out of range, it will be highlighted in orange. I should mention though that I still had a picture with a signal as low as -19 on my old SA3270HD, though I did get breakups, etc., at the time. I rewired things when I got the SA8300HD.
This signal level is not related to the FDC or RDC levels. The above mentioned level is for the currently tuned digital QAM channel you are watching. With the 8300 and it's internall splitter, you need a minimum of -10 for adequate signals, but that's on the hairy edge. Signal levels of -5 to + 5 are more ideal.
FWIW, two-way splitters have a minimum of -3.5 dbmv loss in both directions across all frequencies. If your splitter is limited to 550Mhz, then your upper HD channels will be significantly reduced and not tuneable.

vegggas

Ok nevermind my last post, I got the picture back. This may be a stupid question I know but if my TV is a 32" LCD, then the native resolution is 720p correct?

I def am considering just using component again. I saw no difference in PQ anyway.

Thanks again for the quick responses.

IMHO, that is one of the biggest things cableco's do to give them and their equipment a bad name, recycle units that should be sent back for repair. There is simply no way it should take 4 units to get one that functions correctly. While my one and only 8300 has performed fine for over a year now, I have no dellusions that SA doesn't have the best QA program. But, if their success rate were only 25%, even they couldn't stay in business.

Funny, mine too has been working fine for over a year without a bitch. On all the time inside a stuffy entertainment center.

This thing is as almost reliable as my microwave. I could not say the same about my PCs!

Ok nevermind my last post, I got the picture back. This may be a stupid question I know but if my TV is a 32" LCD, then the native resolution is 720p correct?

I def am considering just using component again. I saw no difference in PQ anyway.

Thanks again for the quick responses.
LCD native resolution, as well as any digital display can be any resolution. Some typical panels are 1366x768, 1024x768, 1024x1024, 1280x768, 1280x720, etc.

vegggas

On my plasma, 1024X768, 720p looks better, 1080i looks shaky and blurry.
On my lcd, 1366x768, can't tell the difference.

From my upconverting DVD player, 768p and 1:1 pixel mapping is best compared to 720p and 1080i on the plasma. Can't tell on the LCD.

Too bad the SA8300HD or its little brother won't do 768p.

I calibrated a Sony Bravia 40" LCD (768 x1366) last week. The customer can't stand the long time it takes for the set to respond to a channel change (from 720p to 1080i) when he uses the Auto setting. We checked HDNet test patterns with the box set at 720p and at 1080i. With this set the 1080i looked MUCH better.

It all depends......... :rolleyes:

I've been getting sound drop-outs lasting about a second or so in my recordings, about once or twice per recording. This is very annoying, especially when there's a key piece of dialog. Anyone else have this problem and/or a suggestion to fix?

I've had this in the past on both the SA8000HD and the SA8300HD boxes. If it's on a local network (NBC, ABC, CBS, FOX, etc...) then it really could be an audio dropout from the local network provider and have nothing to do with the cable company and/or STB.

Check your local OTA thread or local cable threads and see if anyone is reporting audio dop out issues. For my local area we had the channels phone number posted and we called asking to talk wiht the engineering department. Just kept them informed about how often there was audio dropouts.

A few weeks and a few AVS members (and maybe more) of phone calls and there are no more audio drops.

Hoping someone can confirm/clarify what I'm finding with my 8300HD box.

With an HDMI cable attached, my TV will only display channels which are output in 720p or 1080i. This means that I can only view STD/Analog channels if I set the 8300HD to only output in 720p or 1080i (ie. have the 8300hd upconvert all signals to 720p/1080i)

Unfortunately I don't think the 8300HD does a good job converting the 480i/480p signals up to 720p - I find a lot of digital artifacts around the edges of objects. So I guess I'll have to stick to the component cables.

Another thing, it appears that if I connect the cable out connector to the TV that the 8300HD does not pass through the cable signal - instead it just sends its output out on channel 3. I suppose the only way around this is to use a splitter before the cable box and use that to attach to the TV's cable in connection.

Thanks - Al

Al,

I think that what you are observing is a characteristic of your TV - not of the 8300HD. Many sets will not accept 480i (or even 480p) on the HDMI input. Check the specs on your TV (you didn't mention the brand/model by the way). Another thing that you might check: Have you enabled 480i on the SA8300?

You are right about the quality of the 8300 upconversion - usually the display will do a better job (partially because it's scaling process is specific to the characteristics of the display).

You are also correct about using a splitter to enable the TV to tune the SD cable channels directly. Make sure that any splitters are rated for 1GHz (1,000MHz). If you do this, make sure that the 8300 is getting a decent signal level.

Another potential approach for SD is to use the S-Video out of the box to your TV (and select that input when viewing SD). Also, many people do not observe an improvement in PQ when they do use HDMI instead of component. Going the component route with "Passthrough" may be the way to go - give it a try (but don't spend a fortune on cables).

Thanks for the info Dave - I think I'll stick with the component cables rather than switching the cable box to hdmi - I think having to switch inputs would confuse my wife and kids too much :-)

BTW, my TV is a Samsung 61" DLP HLR6167W. It could be the way the TV handles the inputs, but I couldn't find anything in the manual about it.

Yeh, I looked on-line at Samsung for the manual. It hardly has any specifications at all.

TY for a great post:..."An HDMI>HDMI or HDMI>DVI connection will automatically select 2 channel stereo if your TV does not support Dolby Digital (DD). In order to restore DD audio out to your receiver, you need to change the automatic setting. Press the Settings button twice and scroll to Audio: Digital Out. Change the setting from HDMI to Dolby Digital. This will force DD audio to the HDMI, as well as the digital/optical audio outs..."

Here is my problem: My MSO is COMCAST of Richmond/Chesterfield, VA. I run SARA v. 1.87.23.1 on the SA 8300HD. I run HDMI from the STB to my plasma, and an optical out from my STB to my receiver. I'm unable to force DD5.1 to the optical out because the AUDIO: Digital Out setting does not exist!!!. I complained and had a service call, with a new box...apparently that firmware option is not enabled. I lodged a complaint w/ their executive offices, and they responded really quickly. I know MSO's reserve the right to deselect licensed software options to their subscribers...any ideas WHY they don't offer this AUDIO option...COMCAST has a "ticket" out to SA...it's really stupid...to watch in DD5.1 my only option is to replace HDMI w/ Component out...anybody with any answers?
Frustrated in Midlothian, VA

Does anyone know if the 8300HD will delete programs off the box due to any broadcast flags, or something similar?

I had Boston Legal recorded for last week, and when I was checking the box this morning to make sure I had the Tuesday recordings all set, I noticed the Boston Legal was no longer in the 'recorded shows' listing. (I had watched about 5 minutes of the show on Sunday but didn't get a chance to finish it, had planned on watching it tonight.)

I don't think I deleted it manually; and I sure don't think i had enough programs recorded to force a 'delete for more space' - only had about 5 shows recorded. Thought you could have 20 hrs of HD recordings stored.

awdorrin,
Check your preferences for save time, that page will also show drive space. You may need to change the save / delete parameters.

TerryB

I am considering cancelling my Directv and going back to cablevision because my Directv HD receiver fried on SuperBowl Sunday.....and I am not about to drop more cash for a new receiver.

Anyways, I have been reading the thread and admit to having mixed feelings with the switch to a non tivo based DVR (I wont become a my TIVO was great flame thrower if make the move)

Heres my stupid Q..............

I have seen some of you refer to turning off your box. This is foreign to me. TIVOS are "always on" like an alarm clock....no off button. Do these boxes have off buttons? If they do, does the machine have some way of knowing when to turn on to record a show? Or do you have to manually turn it on to record? If so, that would suck.........I do not want abox that requires me to manually baby sit it at a recording time.

I am sure this is an easy one for you guys to answer. I may have more q's, but this is a good start for now.

Oohh...heres another little one. have read a ton on this box, but what about the SD box (I assume Cablevision uses the same model in an SD mode?) So hows the SD one....I would need that also....or direct me to where the thread is..havent found it yet

I have seen some of you refer to turning off your box. This is foreign to me. TIVOS are "always on" like an alarm clock....no off button. Do these boxes have off buttons? If they do, does the machine have some way of knowing when to turn on to record a show? Or do you have to manually turn it on to record?Cable DVRs (including the 8300HD) have 'off' buttons.

They act exactly like Tivo's 'standby' mode.

Yes, they still record as scheduled even when 'off'.

About the only thing 'off' turns off is the video output. And, depending on the exact DVR, potentially the live buffer. Although ... even that ... some of the cable DVRs buffer even when 'off'. The 8300HD with SARA does not buffer when 'off'.

Cablevision has the SA8300 in both SD and HD versions, the software and hard drives are the same they just have different outputs.

I am considering cancelling my Directv and going back to cablevision because my Directv HD receiver fried on SuperBowl Sunday.....and I am not about to drop more cash for a new receiver.

Anyways, I have been reading the thread and admit to having mixed feelings with the switch to a non tivo based DVR (I wont become a my TIVO was great flame thrower if make the move)

Heres my stupid Q..............

I have seen some of you refer to turning off your box. This is foreign to me. TIVOS are "always on" like an alarm clock....no off button. Do these boxes have off buttons? If they do, does the machine have some way of knowing when to turn on to record a show? Or do you have to manually turn it on to record? If so, that would suck.........I do not want abox that requires me to manually baby sit it at a recording time.

I am sure this is an easy one for you guys to answer. I may have more q's, but this is a good start for now.

Oohh...heres another little one. have read a ton on this box, but what about the SD box (I assume Cablevision uses the same model in an SD mode?) So hows the SD one....I would need that also....or direct me to where the thread is..havent found it yet

who is your cable provider... because if its cablevision (see the yahoo forum) you have as much chance of it not recording as you do of getting the recording.

according to the cable guys when you turn off the box it gets updates better. most people in the yahoo forum seem to be going back to directv (they are going all lease on march 1st )

if you are connecting with HDMI forget about the 8300hd its really glitchy

who is your cable provider... because if its cablevision (see the yahoo forum) you have as much chance of it not recording as you do of getting the recording.

according to the cable guys when you turn off the box it gets updates better. most people in the yahoo forum seem to be going back to directv (they are going all lease on march 1st )

if you are connecting with HDMI forget about the 8300hd its really glitchy

That's a load of crap. I've had a SA8300 from Cablevision since the first week they offered it. The only time it missed recordings that were not because of a guide issue, such as a name change in the show, was during July 2005 when there was a big software issue from an update, otherwise it has been flawless.

About 10-15 people said they were going to consider DirectTV if Cablevision doesn't sign a deal to carry SNY, the new RSN that will carry the NY Mets this season. It had nothing to due with the DVR.

The HDMI issue is TV related, always has been, my Sony CRT HDTV is hooked up via HDMI and works great.

unfortunatelt hte Directv concept of leasing is like a car dealership..pay us an upfront cost $299 for the HDDVR and then lease the box...........if they do that its not going to fly.

Cable may suck, but there is no commitment...if they really suck, maybe D will offer me a nice deal to come back.......no harm no foul right?

That's a load of crap. I've had a SA8300 from Cablevision since the first week they offered it. The only time it missed recordings that were not because of a guide issue, such as a name change in the show, was during July 2005 when there was a big software issue from an update, otherwise it has been flawless.

About 10-15 people said they were going to consider DirectTV if Cablevision doesn't sign a deal to carry SNY, the new RSN that will carry the NY Mets this season. It had nothing to due with the DVR.

The HDMI issue is TV related, always has been, my Sony CRT HDTV is hooked up via HDMI and works great.

here is a very typical quote from the cablevision forum that has nothing whatsoever to do with fsny or sports (this is from today, do some actual research and you will find hundreds of these):

"Wilt,

I think it's very unfortunate that cablevision keeps breaking things
when applying new software upgrades! When I first got my 8300hd HDMI
worked perfectly and recordings were smooth. Now I had to revert back
to component to avoid issues with HDMI. It wasn't worth the hassle
switching back and forth everytime HDMI crapped out -- 25$ for HDMI
cable down the drain. Add to that my recordings now have stutters.

I work in the software industry and it has been hammered into my brain
that regressions are the worst type of software issue. Cablevision
needs to get with the program! I would say that Tivo series 3 looks
pretty attractive at 500$ (when it comes out) because of these glitches.

So like I said in my first line, it's very unformtunate that cablevision
is doing all they can to keep the competition for set top boxes alive
and healthy. [:(] "

I've done plenty of research, I read every post there and participate under another name. There have been many people who have DirectTV getting information there about switching to CV. There are unhappy customers with every business.

I've done plenty of research, I read every post there and participate under another name. There have been many people who have DirectTV getting information there about switching to CV. There are unhappy customers with every business.

you are right about the fact that people who post are complainers. but!!!! to say it's a load of crap that cablevision 8300hd is not HDMI ready is misinformed and misleading. you are actually one of the few people who seems to be able to get it to work.

if the dude is getting Time Warner its a whole nother story as the passport software is more stable.

Most of the HDMI issues are TV related. I work with most of the TV manufacturers and have had many, many samples from all of them. It's funny when 1/3 of the sets they put out don't support the HDMI connection correctly. I have had to change out the displays several times to get a working display, and when I do, it's a crapshoot wether it's going to work or not. Often, they send me a 32", a 42" and a 50" and the 32" and 50" may work flawlessly, but the 42" will refuse to work at all. This is not just using the 8300, but various HDMI devices that use active encryption and two-way communication for resolution selection. DVD players are useless for testing DVI or HDMI connections, since they are not active connections.

vegggas

if the dude is getting Time Warner its a whole nother story as the passport software is more stable.
neilk2350, I wish you would get all your facts straight.
1) Passport is not more stable that SARA - it's just different problems that each have.
2) Time Warner IS NOT necessarily Passport. There are lots of TW systems in the country that have SARA. Conversely, I suspect that there are lots of Cablevision systems with Passport. :rolleyes:

(Sorry if I'm repeating someone, I didn't see this on here...)

There was a significant upgrade with Adelphia/Cleveland in the last week. Such things include 4x FF, and "Start from Beginning" when joining a recorded show in progress. Last night was my first time watching a show "time-shifted", when it ended in real time. Instead of kicking me out, it played normally to the end. Could this have been an anomaly? I know the box doesn't kick you out of a program 100% of the time, but I can't figure out exactly when it doesn't. For the record, I was recording a second program during the entire time.

Or has the problem been fixed?

Thanks.

neilk2350, I wish you would get all your facts straight.
1) Passport is not more stable that SARA - it's just different problems that each have.
2) Time Warner IS NOT necessarily Passport. There are lots of TW systems in the country that have SARA. Conversely, I suspect that there are lots of Cablevision systems with Passport. :rolleyes:

and i can tell you from first hand experience passport is significantly more stable then sara. yes time warner has both (but mine is passport) but all of cablevision is sara

Instead of kicking me out, it played normally to the end. Could this have been an anomaly?No ... no anomaly. The "Drop to Live" bug was/is fixed in the same releases as the 4x FF and "Start from Beginning" features were added.I know the box doesn't kick you out of a program 100% of the time, but I can't figure out exactly when it doesn't.For my version of SARA (1.87.16.1), any "scheduled" recordings have the "drop to live" bug. The only recordings that don't "drop to live" are ones that I manually start by hitting the record button.

No ... no anomaly. The "Drop to Live" bug was/is fixed in the same releases as the 4x FF and "Start from Beginning" features were added. For my version of SARA (1.87.16.1), any "scheduled" recordings have the "drop to live" bug. The only recordings that don't "drop to live" are ones that I manually start by hitting the record button.

Interesting...because the show I was watching yesterday was manually started. I'll have to try to see what happens with a scheduled program.

There was a significant upgrade with Adelphia/Cleveland in the last week. Such things include 4x FF, and "Start from Beginning" when joining a recorded show in progress. Last night was my first time watching a show "time-shifted", when it ended in real time. Instead of kicking me out, it played normally to the end. Could this have been an anomaly? I know the box doesn't kick you out of a program 100% of the time, but I can't figure out exactly when it doesn't. For the record, I was recording a second program during the entire time.

Or has the problem been fixed?

Thanks.

There is no kick out to live when you watch a recording in progress using the start from begining option. That option comes in the same software version that adds the 4th FF and REW speed. Obviously your Cable company has deployed a newer version of software. Go through the diagnostics screens to see what version you now have. It should be a 1.88.XX.X

I guess now that we're over (?) the My Tivo Is Better Than Your 8300 crap we have to begin the My Passport Is Better Than Your SARA crap. :)

Personally, I prefer SARA over my daughter's Passport, but that's more because none of us has a choice and I'm more familiar with SARA. AFAIK though, she hasn't had any problems with her Passport and I haven't had any with my SARA.

I'm really curious though just what specifically is more stable (not just different or preferred) in Passport than in SARA? And I'm not talking features that one has and the other doesn't. I just don't buy it.

Recording "Scrubs" Any time of day looks at the IPG to schedule a recording based on that name. If Scrubs comes on once in the following week, it will only try to reserve that timeslot called Scrubs next week and no more; thereby not having any conflicts throughout the week. Recording ESPN's "Sportscenter" this way, however may create problems if it plays every few hours everyday, causing a lot of reservations.
Recording by timeslot for scrubs, say 8:00 - 9:00 reserves only that time slot everyday and will potentially not allow you reserve any thing else that comes on at that time, inlcuding Scrubs because you don't see it highlighted and try ti record it again.

vegggas

This is bizzare enough that I have to double check. vegggas is saying that an "Any Time" recording is smart enough to use the show name, but a "Time Slot" recording is not and it reserves a time slot even if the show isn't on that day. Is this correct?!

So I'm trying to come up with rules of thumb to minimize conflicts.

Once a week shows: Any Time or First Run
One episode per day, repeated throughout the day: Time Slot
One episode per week, repeated at various times throughout the week: ??

For the last case, would First Run get several copies per week, or is only the first showing the First?

If First Run isn't appropriate, it seems like a toss up for the last case; both approaches have potential conflict problems.

Did I miss anything?
LazyBoy

This is bizzare enough that I have to double check. vegggas is saying that an "Any Time" recording is smart enough to use the show name, but a "Time Slot" recording is not and it reserves a time slot even if the show isn't on that day. Is this correct?!Yes, a Timeslot recording technically reserves the slot up until the time the recording is to begin and then it checks the IPG title. You cannot record that particular program without first cancelling the scheduled recording. However, you can schedule another recording on another channel, even if it's a "third" recording. There are times though when errors in the IPG preclude this. I ran into this the other night when CinC was supposed to be on. Even though it was preempted in the IPG, it still showed as a conflict and was titled CinC. This further convinces me that the fields in the IPG used for display are different than the fields used for recording, but that's another topic.
Once a week shows: Any Time or First RunFirst Run should be used unless you are trying to watch reruns, like during the summer. Any Tme would get you all reruns in addition to First Runs.
One episode per day, repeated throughout the day: Time SlotCorrect
One episode per week, repeated at various times throughout the week: ??

For the last case, would First Run get several copies per week, or is only the first showing the First?Technically it should only get the First showng, but it really depends on the IPG data and will get anything in the IPG that flagged as a First Run, in error or not.

Conflicts mainly occur if you use the Any Timeslot option on channels where the times change, like ESPN, INHD, HBO, etc. Since the times change often, chances are one of them will conflict with another weekly series recording schedule and they should be avoided or at least monitored frequently. If you end up with 3 or more recordings scheduled for the same timeslot, nothing will get recorded.

Programs like BG, STG, and STG:Atlantis on SciFi are a good example. If you set up several network primetime series recordings, the New Episodes on SciFi frequently conflict. The get around this, I set up a Timeslot recording for the second ScifFi showing later that same night. Unfortunately, unlike the First Run option, the Timeslot option also gets any reruns, like during the Christmas holidays, etc., but it's a small price to pay.

The bottomline is that you do need to do some management to make things work as smoothly as possible. This sounds a lot harder than it really is, but some folks really get frustrated by it all.

I called Cox-AZ today to see about getting the FW upgrade.
The tech knew nothing about it, and questioned how I knew about the sara upgrade, and how I found out I was on sara 1.87.16.1.
He put me on hold a long time, but all he could find was "they roll out updates several times a week, and we'll get it as soon as it's available". I WANT IT NOW :mad:

I

Oohh...heres another little one. have read a ton on this box, but what about the SD box (I assume Cablevision uses the same model in an SD mode?) So hows the SD one....I would need that also....or direct me to where the thread is..havent found it yet

You should consider getting a HD box even for your standard definition TVs if Cablevision will let you.

The HD box can be set up to operate in a standard definition mode, by using the Set Up Wizard.

The HD box has a 160 GB disc instead of a 80 GB disc, so you can record almost twice the number of programs.

I don't know what Cablevision does, but Time Warner Cable Houston:
1) charges the same for either box
2) has a basic group of HD channels that it does not charge extra for that can be viewed in 480i using the HD box

I guess now that we're over (?) the My Tivo Is Better Than Your 8300 crap we have to begin the My Passport Is Better Than Your SARA crap. :)

Personally, I prefer SARA over my daughter's Passport, but that's more because none of us has a choice and I'm more familiar with SARA. AFAIK though, she hasn't had any problems with her Passport and I haven't had any with my SARA.

I'm really curious though just what specifically is more stable (not just different or preferred) in Passport than in SARA? And I'm not talking features that one has and the other doesn't. I just don't buy it.

i can only compare time warner passport vs cablevision sara (i think every provider is on a different firmware version).

the two main differences in stabilty (this is not just me but other people also on the cablevison forum) are recording and HDMI passthrough.

almost (and i mean not everyone) everyone is experiencing dropouts,both audio and video when recording on sara. i recorded a week of jon stewart on both boxes (cablevision LI and Time Warner Manhatten) and found that 2 out of 4 shows on the cablevision box had drop outs. one of them was unwatchable. the passport box recorded all shows without a problem. This was a test i'd had many problems with dropouts before i just wanted to do a comparison. According to people on the cablevision forum they have gotten worse since the last firmware push. other people (not me) are losing shows they've recorded. about once a week a get a show that shows up in the dvr menu as recorded (not just jon stewart) and wont play, it just goes back to the dvr menu when i hit play.

the time warner box passes HDMI without a hitch

I called Cox-AZ today to see about getting the FW upgrade.AFAIK, this upgrade was specific to Cablevision and was not released to everyone. Other cableco's were waiting for the scheduled OS 1.5 upgrade, mostly due to other problems with 1.88.x.x, but since the status of that is questionable now, perhaps other cableco's will look at 1.88.x.x again.

You should consider getting a HD box even for your standard definition TVs if Cablevision will let you.

The HD box can be set up to operate in a standard definition mode, by using the Set Up Wizard.

The HD box has a 160 GB disc instead of a 80 GB disc, so you can record almost twice the number of programs.

I don't know what Cablevision does, but Time Warner Cable Houston:
1) charges the same for either box
2) has a basic group of HD channels that it does not charge extra for that can be viewed in 480i using the HD box

The 8300's Cablevision supplies have 160GB hard drives in both the SD and HD model.

Neil,

I had no doubt as to what you were referring to, but I wanted others reading this part of the thread to seewhere you are coming from. The problem with such comparisons though is that you blame the box or a version of software for what may very well be cableco problems, like signal levels, etc. The only FAIR comparison would be on the same connection/system w ith a single HDTV, which is obviously not possible. Here in Phoenix on Cox I can point you to any number of SARA folks not having any problems at all and some who are, both with dropouts and HDMI. In many cases, the problems are traced to signal levels caused by cheap splitters, etc. In other cases, the problems can't be traced because the individuals involved simply don't want to do the work or don't know how to trace such problems, even with forum help. :)

awdorrin,
Check your preferences for save time, that page will also show drive space. You may need to change the save / delete parameters.

TerryB

I think I figured out what I did - ther ewas a rerun of Boston Legal on another night, and it got recorded - I think when I deleted that episode I must have somehow deleted both of the episodes.

I did miss last night's episode of 'House' on Fox - I had setup the recording for that 'timeslot' and apparently American Idol ran 3 minutes longer - so instead of House starting at 9pm, it started at 9:03pm, so the box didn't record it. Thats a little frustrating... Seems like poor programming in the box that it can't detect a window of time around the recording time and just pick it up from there; seems like the only other option would be to tell the DVR to record 'any day, any time' - which could cause you to pick up a lot of reruns, depending on the show.

Guess I shouldn't stop using my VCR yet.

I have had my 8300HD for a year now and two days ago strange things happened. For the last two nights while the machine was powered off, the sound came on while it was recording a show. Both shows were in SD, Discovery channel, Mythbusters and Dirty Jobs. The sound comes out of my stereo via the digital out. Very freaky???? My box is from Adelphia. How can sound be sent out while the power is off, or I guess standby since it is never off since it was recording. Also, When I came out to look at the tv, I turned the box on and the last channel we were watching, ABCHD was on. The sound I was hearing while the box was off was from the recording show on Discovery. I powered off the box again and it happened again at 1AM at the start of the next show I was recording????? I had never turned off my stereo before, but now I may have to.

(Sorry if I'm repeating someone, I didn't see this on here...)

There was a significant upgrade with Adelphia/Cleveland in the last week. Such things include 4x FF, and "Start from Beginning" when joining a recorded show in progress. Last night was my first time watching a show "time-shifted", when it ended in real time. Instead of kicking me out, it played normally to the end. Could this have been an anomaly? I know the box doesn't kick you out of a program 100% of the time, but I can't figure out exactly when it doesn't. For the record, I was recording a second program during the entire time.

Or has the problem been fixed?

Thanks.

Could you check your SARA version?

Explorer for dummies: What is SARA, and how do I check the version?

Explorer for dummies: What is SARA, and how do I check the version?SARA = Scientific Atlanta Resident Application ... the main software (guide, DVR functionality, etc)

To find the version ... see the first post on this thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=4682052&&#post4682052
The "Finding SARA Software Version" section.

Neil,

I had no doubt as to what you were referring to, but I wanted others reading this part of the thread to seewhere you are coming from. The problem with such comparisons though is that you blame the box or a version of software for what may very well be cableco problems, like signal levels, etc. The only FAIR comparison would be on the same connection/system w ith a single HDTV, which is obviously not possible. Here in Phoenix on Cox I can point you to any number of SARA folks not having any problems at all and some who are, both with dropouts and HDMI. In many cases, the problems are traced to signal levels caused by cheap splitters, etc. In other cases, the problems can't be traced because the individuals involved simply don't want to do the work or don't know how to trace such problems, even with forum help. :)

i had the cablevision guy come to my house. he claimed i had a vast abundance of signal. i will do the test mentioned on the first page and let you know

SARA = Scientific Atlanta Resident Application ... the main software (guide, DVR functionality, etc)

To find the version ... see the first post on this thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=4682052&&#post4682052
The "Finding SARA Software Version" section.

Thanks!

The 8300's Cablevision supplies have 160GB hard drives in both the SD and HD model.

Thanks for the info.

Do all Cablevision divisions do this?

Do any other cable companies do this?

The 8300's Cablevision supplies have 160GB hard drives in both the SD and HD model.

Interesting, the SA8300 catalog sheet (spec sheet) does not show a SD 8300 with a 160GB drive. I checked both the Feb 2005 and Oct 2005 versions and the SD 8300 is only available with 80GB drive. (The 8300HD is available with a 80GB drive however). I know of some systems that now provide the 8300HD for anyone ordering a DVR. I also know of another system (Adelphia in Buffalo) that provides 8300HDs as the HD STB. They just do not enable the DVR functionality unless the customer orders it.

There is no kick out to live when you watch a recording in progress using the start from begining option. That option comes in the same software version that adds the 4th FF and REW speed. Obviously your Cable company has deployed a newer version of software. Go through the diagnostics screens to see what version you now have. It should be a 1.88.XX.X

Correct, RemyM, we were at 1.88.15.3. Unfortunately we were rolled back to 1.87.23.1 just today. Talk about a tease! I instantly appreciated the FFx4 and kick out fix, among others.

I searched this thread and could only find a few references to what is actually wrong with 1.88.xx.x. Does anybody have a list of bugs in 1.88.xx.x? I just can't figure out why Adelphia Cleveland would giveth then taketh away. We were having some problems last week with our local Fox-HD affiliate's splicing system. Recordings were being segmented or mangled due to some glitch injected into the bitstream when switching between local and national HD feeds (see http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7084085&&#post7084085). It's possible they pushed this out in a desperate attempt to fix the segmenting and then, when they realized it wouldn't, revoked it due to some huge bug I'm not aware of with 1.88.xx.x. Who can ever truly understand the weirding ways of Adelphia, though..

Interesting, the SA8300 catalog sheet (spec sheet) does not show a SD 8300 with a 160GB drive.From the spec sheet:8300 and 8300MR-DVR Specifications
Base SD Model Features
DVR with 80 GB Hard Drive

(Larger hard drives are available. Contact your North American marketing manager for more information.)

http://www.scientificatlanta.com/customers/Source/7004920.pdfAn 8300SD with 160GB drive does not have a standard part number. But they are available "upon request".

.....I had setup the recording for that 'timeslot' and apparently American Idol ran 3 minutes longer.....Timeslot means just that, a "specific" timeslot. FWIW, Idol didn't run 3 minutes long, it was scheduled that way and was reflected as such in the IPG, at least here. Lost and ER are other examples of programs that do this routinely.

I can understand the frustration caused by networks fiddling with start/end tmes, but it is a stretch to expect programmers to compensate for that. There are already other options available that will compensate. The New Episode option will adjust for different start/end times. If you do not have the New Episode option, you would be better off using Anytime, especially for network programming that generally is aired in the same "basic" timeslot, give or take a minute or 2. Be careful though using it where programs air at different times,likeESPN, HBO, etc., because if you inadvertently end up with 3 recordings scheduled at the same time, none will get recorded.

he claimed i had a vast abundance of signal.I don't know what he means by such a statement. He could simply mean that the run to the house is supplying enough signal for all the inside runs to various TVs, etc. The signal level to the cable box needs to be in the -10 to +10 range and the closer to 0 the better. Too much will cause just as many problems as too little. A splitter capable of less than 1Ghz will also cause problems and inconsistent operation. Many cable techs will often tell you what you want to hear and a lot of them simply don't know that HD DVRs are more prone to problems with marginal signal levels, even those that may technically be within range due to other factors such as heat.

I searched this thread and could only find a few references to what is actually wrong with 1.88.xx.x. Does anybody have a list of bugs in 1.88.xx.x? I just can't figure out why Adelphia Cleveland would giveth then taketh away.There is no definitive list, but RemyM will tell you how many recordings he missed, etc., until later corrections were released resulting in the current 1.88.x.x version. I think the main problem is that, as with several versions of SARA software, the initial 1.88.x.x was specific to Cablevision. There have been any number of releases that were specific to a given cableco and were not uploaded by every cableco. It's not like Windows XP where everyone gets SP1 and SP2. Each cableco tests whatever release SA gives them and makes a decision to load it or not. In this case, I don't think 1.88.x.x was even offered to all cableco's.

Do all Cablevision divisions do this?


The DVR is the same on all Cablevision's 15 or so systems which are all in the NY metro area.

There is no definitive list, but RemyM will tell you how many recordings he missed, etc., until later corrections were released resulting in the current 1.88.x.x version. I think the main problem is that, as with several versions of SARA software, the initial 1.88.x.x was specific to Cablevision.

The first 1.88.xx.x version was the worst, I don't remember the exact version number. I missed about 6 recordings in a 3 week span when we had it, but others missed more. Scheduled recordings would also mysteriously drop from your list. I think we are on our 4th version of it now and while it's not perfect (what software is?) the good certainly outweighs the bad. Cablevision's EVP of engineering participates on our Yahoo forum and that certainly helped to get the early issue resolved.

Timeslot means just that, a "specific" timeslot. FWIW, Idol didn't run 3 minutes long, it was scheduled that way and was reflected as such in the IPG, at least here. Lost and ER are other examples of programs that do this routinely.

Yeah, I did check the TV guide and realize it was a 63 minute episode.


I can understand the frustration caused by networks fiddling with start/end tmes, but it is a stretch to expect programmers to compensate for that.

Well, as a programmer myself, I don't think its that much of a stretch :-)

There are already other options available that will compensate. The New Episode option will adjust for different start/end times.

See this is a feature I would have expected - unfortunately I don't think my box has that feature, is it only certain versions that do?

If you do not have the New Episode option, you would be better off using Anytime, especially for network programming that generally is aired in the same "basic" timeslot, give or take a minute or 2. Be careful though using it where programs air at different times,likeESPN, HBO, etc., because if you inadvertently end up with 3 recordings scheduled at the same time, none will get recorded.

I did see the 'anytime' option and I'll try using that for these shows. I did have that option set for recording another show (Battlestar Gallactica) off of the SciFi network and wound up recording 3 episodes aired on UniversalHD over the weekend; so I do see why you have to be careful.

Thanks for the advice; i'll have to adjust the way I record and hope the 'new episode' feature you mentioned shows up sometime.

awdorrin,

The New Episode option is available on all SARA-based 8300's, but your IPG may not have the First Run flag, so you won't see the option until your IPG is upgraded.

By "stretch" I mean there are already options available that cover that situation, both the New and Anytime options. As a former programmer though, I can't believe you would code a "Timeslot" option to look for a variance and make some kind of decision to record something outside the timeslot. I'm not saying it can't be done, anything is possible, but why would you? Just how wide a variance would you code? 3 minutes? 5 minutes? 10 minutes? How about automatically adding 30-60 minutes to cover sporting events that run over? These and a lot of other things are possible and may even be desireable, but at some point, one has to draw a line and assume the operator has some control over things and knows what they what and how to get it. :)

Is there a fine tuning option on the 8300? When my 8300hd was installed by Adelphia, the guy had to fine tune it (and I watched him do it) the signal so that it would display correctly on my HD LCD.. However, I cannot find where he got to this setting. it was not on the TV, I am pretty sure he did it through the 8300 some how..

By "stretch" I mean there are already options available that cover that situation, both the New and Anytime options. As a former programmer though, I can't believe you would code a "Timeslot" option to look for a variance and make some kind of decision to record something outside the timeslot. ...at some point, one has to draw a line and assume the operator has some control over things and knows what they what and how to get it. :)
Considering that the whole point of a DVR is to add convenience and flexibility to the user's TV viewing experience, I would expect the DVR provider to try to deliver that to the greatest extent possible in order to be competitive.

As a user, why is it unreasonable to expect that the IPG includes explicit start and end times, and that when I highlight a program and click "record", it is those explicit start and end times that are used to determine when to actually start and end the program? That seems like a far more reasonable choice than hard-coding the system to only start/stop recordings on the :00 or :30 mark.

As a dumb user with no professional programming background, my *expectation* would be that if the program overlapped even by one minute into the original timeslot I set my program for, that the DVR would be "smart" enough to realize that "hey, this is probably what the user wants", and record the entire program from start to end. So if on Jan 1 I set the unit to record "The Simpsons" from 6:00 - 6:30 every Monday night, and on March 6 the IPG shows The Simpsons actually on from 6:15 - 6:45, I'd expect it to try to record the 6:15-6:45 program. (If that's not possible due to conflicts with other scheduled recordings, then sure--some manual intervention is required and/or the DVR needs to make an arbitrary choice about which one(s) to drop.)

For better or for worse, users set a program and expect it to just work. I don't start every week by scanning the IPG to make sure all my programmed recordings are still there.

A DVR supplier is free to put more burden on the viewer to finesse the programming to get the desired result. But the DVR that does the best job of "reading the users mind" will have a definite advantage in the market. (Or at least they would if we could all use whatever DVR we wanted with whatever video service we subscribe to!)

I've search the thread for occurrences, but haven't seen anything that directly relates to these bugs I've just encountered over the past day or two :

1) Audio dropouts : During analog station recorded shows (The Shield on FX last night, for example), the audio will drop out for 5 or so seconds and then resume.
Haven't seen this on an HDTV channel, only analog channels. Haven't seen this two frequently, since 90% of my recordings are in HDTV (the only reason I have this POS box).

2) Video freeze / severe lip sync : During analog station recorded shows (The Shield on FX last night, for example), the video will for a second or two, and then resume. The audio will then be off by those same two seconds, and slowly re-sync with the video over the course of 5-10 seconds of playback. Similar to what you see on playback of a poorly encoded Xvid file on a PC.

3) Orphan listings in the "scheduled recordings". I have a "record all shows, any time" entry for Scrubs on NBC-HD. After last week's epsides (they show two, back-to-back), the box pre-scheduled the recordings for this week's episodes. Sometime after that, the guide data changed such that the Olympics took over Scrubs' timeslots. After last night, one Scrubs scheduled recording remained, even though it's time slot had already passed. I've still got a 2/14/2006 entry for Scrubs in my "schedule recordings" listing even though that time has passed. This is the second time I've seen this happen.

Anyone else ?

As a user, why is it unreasonable to expect that the IPG includes explicit start and end times, and that when I highlight a program and click "record", it is those explicit start and end times that are used to determine when to actually start and end the program? It isn't, but networks vary their start/stop times to hook you into their next program, not the IPG. The 8300 does what you tell it to do. If you tell it to record a program ANYTIME, it will do that regardless of changes to the IPG.
That seems like a far more reasonable choice than hard-coding the system to only start/stop recordings on the :00 or :30 mark.It is not hard coded to start/stop on :00 and :30. The user ELECTED to setup a TIMESLOT recording and that's what the 8300 did. If the user had said to record a program (New or Anytime), then the 8300 would have done that regardless of the start/stop times. There is no doubt they could add an option to record a timeslot with leeway on the front and back, but if I want it to record from 7:00 - 8:00, then that is what it should do, not add a few minutes and potentilly conflict with subsequent scheduled recordings.
As a dumb user with no professional programming background, my *expectation* would be that if the program overlapped even by one minute into the original timeslot I set my program for, that the DVR would be "smart" enough to realize that "hey, this is probably what the user wants", and record the entire program from start to end. So if on Jan 1 I set the unit to record "The Simpsons" from 6:00 - 6:30 every Monday night, and on March 6 the IPG shows The Simpsons actually on from 6:15 - 6:45, I'd expect it to try to record the 6:15-6:45 program. (If that's not possible due to conflicts with other scheduled recordings, then sure--some manual intervention is required and/or the DVR needs to make an arbitrary choice about which one(s) to drop.)And it will do just that if you tell it to record a PROGRAM and not a TIMESLOT. Also, if there is a conflict and you aren't home, then what should it do? It can't do like Tivo does unless they decide to license the process from Tivo. As I've said any number of times, there are patents and copyrights involved in how much of this works on different DVRs.
But the DVR that does the best job of "reading the users mind" will have a definite advantage in the market. (Or at least they would if we could all use whatever DVR we wanted with whatever video service we subscribe to!)No one said otherwise. I'm just explaining how things work so you can get the programs you want recorded, I'm not defending it. If all you want to do is argue, we can do that, but that is not going to change what you have to do today to get your recordings. I would have programmed ALL this stuff differently, but that is not the point. We have to live with what we have until we get some changes and those are coming, either in a software upgrade or a new box/software combo at some point in the near future as OCAP gets implemented cable-wide.

I've search the thread for occurrences, but haven't seen anything that directly relates to these bugs I've just encountered over the past day or two :

3) Orphan listings in the "scheduled recordings". I have a "record all shows, any time" entry for Scrubs on NBC-HD. After last week's epsides (they show two, back-to-back), the box pre-scheduled the recordings for this week's episodes. Sometime after that, the guide data changed such that the Olympics took over Scrubs' timeslots. After last night, one Scrubs scheduled recording remained, even though it's time slot had already passed. I've still got a 2/14/2006 entry for Scrubs in my "schedule recordings" listing even though that time has passed. This is the second time I've seen this happen.

I've had this problem all along. In order to fix it, every 6 months or so I cancel all my scheduled recordings, do a hard reboot, then schedule everything. It sucks.

Considering that the whole point of a DVR is to add convenience and flexibility to the user's TV viewing experience, I would expect the DVR provider to try to deliver that to the greatest extent possible in order to be competitive.

Hah! Obviously, you're new around here. :)

This box is the bare minimum you can expect for a DVR, nothing more. The apologists around here will say "it's your cable provider's fault", or "SA has that coded up, but no one's gotten it yet", or "Wah, we can't have that cuz Tivo's got a patent on that" or some other excuse. The bottom line for you, however, is what you've got in front of you : a nice piece of hardware saddled with some god-awful software.


As a dumb user with no professional programming background, my *expectation* would be that if the program overlapped even by one minute into the original timeslot I set my program for, that the DVR would be "smart" enough to realize that "hey, this is probably what the user wants", and record the entire program from start to end. So if on Jan 1 I set the unit to record "The Simpsons" from 6:00 - 6:30 every Monday night, and on March 6 the IPG shows The Simpsons actually on from 6:15 - 6:45, I'd expect it to try to record the 6:15-6:45 program. (If that's not possible due to conflicts with other scheduled recordings, then sure--some manual intervention is required and/or the DVR needs to make an arbitrary choice about which one(s) to drop.)

I am a professional programmer, and the shortcomings this box are inexcusable, so don't feel so dumb. You're not dumb, the box is, plain and simple. It has various "features" (I'm being generous here) that simply make me scratch my head, if not scream out loud. Series recording options, poor guide data, poor conflict resolution, Fisher-Price level graphical menus, not being able to easily watch a program from the beginning while it's recording, getting kicked out to live TV while you're watching something, and so forth... This box has promise, but it's got a lot of problems right now.


A DVR supplier is free to put more burden on the viewer to finesse the programming to get the desired result. But the DVR that does the best job of "reading the users mind" will have a definite advantage in the market. (Or at least they would if we could all use whatever DVR we wanted with whatever video service we subscribe to!)

And that DVR is named TiVo. There are some around here who would paint me as a TiVo evangelist, which is incorrect. My situation dictates that I must use this POS box, as it's my only option for HD DVR services. TiVo isn't an option for me right now, since their HD DVR story isn't quite ready for prime time. However, when they do ship the Series3 HD DVR later this year, I'm on it like white on rice. It can't get here soon enough. It will support CableCard, and will therefore be usable on any cable service.

So, once again. Don't feel dumb. It's the box that's dumb. If you can live with it, fine. If not, don't feel intimidated, it's not your fault.

I just don't have the time these days to participate in that many forums (too much HD to watch :) ), but maybe I'll check back in with the San Diego forum. For the record, I didn't leave because of anyone and I do check in from time to time still, but I got involved with some other stuff and time is at a premium.

:)

Dave, can you direct me to the San Diego forum. I am in Chula Vista.

Thanks,
Devin

3) Orphan listings in the "scheduled recordings". I have a "record all shows, any time" entry for Scrubs on NBC-HD. After last week's epsides (they show two, back-to-back), the box pre-scheduled the recordings for this week's episodes. Sometime after that, the guide data changed such that the Olympics took over Scrubs' timeslots. After last night, one Scrubs scheduled recording remained, even though it's time slot had already passed. I've still got a 2/14/2006 entry for Scrubs in my "schedule recordings" listing even though that time has passed. This is the second time I've seen this happen.

Anyone else ?

That is totally normal for the 8300. What you are seeing is an all episode placeholder. Even if a show doesn't air for a week, or longer, it needs to stay in your list so it can schedule a new recording when it airs again. When another Scrubs episode appears in your guide this placeholder will match up with it and schedule a new recording. I've got at least 8 placeholders in my list with dates as old as August and they don't cause me any problems.

Thanks, Remy. It's a little confusing at first, but I guess it follows suit and is consistent with the rest of the way that the 8300 does business underneath the covers.

I only got worried because when I was with Comcast, the 6412 HD DVR had a somewhat similar bug which could lead to problems. If you say it's OK, I'll leave it be for now.

I know in this LONG thread that folks have mentioned pixelation/jitter/issues with the HD channels from the 8300HD...-Brian

Hey, I got this box recently and pixelation does happen on recordings, particularly at live shows. During the Grammies, Madonna's show almost became unwatchable, and other shows with flashing lights became affected too.

Anyway around this?

The pixellation from flashing lights is normal. I'll bet it looks they way at the camera side when it's encoded. Too much motion and light intensisty. Not enough bit rate.

Is there a way I can use my SA8300HD remote to power up my th-50pdh8uk? As it stands, I have to turn on the power of the monitor and then the cable. I can't seem to find how to program the dvr remote to also turn on the tv. thanks

Is there a way I can use my SA8300HD remote to power up my th-50pdh8uk? As it stands, I have to turn on the power of the monitor and then the cable. I can't seem to find how to program the dvr remote to also turn on the tv. thanks

interestingly for the exact same product the time warner remote (twny) has that feature. its a seperate button that is not on my cablevision remote (it runs a macro). of course when you hit guide on the time warner box it goes right to the guide instead of cablevisions io screen

interestingly for the exact same product the time warner remote (twny) has that feature. its a seperate button that is not on my cablevision remote (it runs a macro). of course when you hit guide on the time warner box it goes right to the guide instead of cablevisions io screen


huh? I'm not sure if you were responding to my post. Anyway, I'm just looking to turn on my panasonic plasma with my hd-dvr remote.

Is there a way I can use my SA8300HD remote to power up my th-50pdh8uk? As it stands, I have to turn on the power of the monitor and then the cable. I can't seem to find how to program the dvr remote to also turn on the tv. thanksThere's lots of different remotes cable companies deploy with these boxes. If you can figure out the actual remote you have ... you should be able to find a manual. Also, most cable companies have manuals for their remote controls on line.

Some of the more popular suppliers of remotes for the Explorers are:

Scientific Atlanta:
http://www.scientificatlanta.com/ExplorerClubGuides/getting_started.htm#Remote

Universal Remote Control, Inc:
http://universalremote.com/sb/digital/scientific.html

Universal Electronics:
http://www.urcsupport.com/

US Electronics:
http://www.uselectronics.com/

However, there's lots more. Figure out the remote you have ... you should be able to get more info. Each of the above websites also have manuals for each of their remotes.

Note: For Scientific Atlanta remotes the exact model number can be found on the back on the battery cover. Not sure about the other manufacturers.

huh? I'm not sure if you were responding to my post. Anyway, I'm just looking to turn on my panasonic plasma with my hd-dvr remote.

i was. it depends on the remote

thanks. I'll have to check under the battery cover since I didn't see the specific one on any of the links. I called Comcast and they told me may be model # 18075 or RC1384. Neither seems to be anywhere near any of the models listed above, so they probably just made something up or didn't know what to look for. I called again and was told URC1067AVG1 or GO51002

I believe it's a Comcast remote

this one, perhaps :

http://comcast.com/Media/1-2/CM/VanityURL/images/comcastdvr2device.bmp

Weird Problem with my SA 8300. Last night I was recording Lost. Twenty mins. into the show I started to watch it. Normally I rewind it to the beginning of the show while it was still recording. After the show was over...I went back to the recording and found out that it only record 20 minutes of it. Check the space used and I still had over 16% of free space left. Anyone else had this problem before? Never had this problem before. Did I do something wrong?

thanks

Dave, can you direct me to the San Diego forum. I am in Chula Vista.

Thanks,
DevinSan Diego Cox HDTV Forum (http://hdtv.forsandiego.com/messages/3/3.html?1089942273)

Edit: Actually, you might be better off going to the top level since I don't know if you have Cox, TWC, etc., or other interests:

San Diego HDTV Forum (http://hdtv.forsandiego.com)

Thanks Dave. BTW, I am on Cox HD in San Diego.

Hey, I got this box recently and pixelation does happen on recordings, particularly at live shows. During the Grammies, Madonna's show almost became unwatchable, and other shows with flashing lights became affected too.

Anyway around this?

I can't imagine Madonna being watchable on any equipment.

I did see the 'anytime' option and I'll try using that for these shows. I did have that option set for recording another show (Battlestar Gallactica) off of the SciFi network and wound up recording 3 episodes aired on UniversalHD over the weekend; so I do see why you have to be careful.Unfortunately, there is no one size fits all for these problems. Even Tivo can experience problems like this, but I believe it can record based on solely on Title and it handles conflicts a lot better. Even Title presents problems though as "The Rebel Billionaire" and "The Billionaire" proved a couple of years ago, it changed every other week.

The timeslot option would work better for Battlestar Gallactica since it's start/stop time doesn't change, that's the option I use to record it. Of course, the real solution is for networks to stay on the hour/half hour and quit fooling round. But, as some folks will tell you, even that sucks if they go by a different clock than the 8300, sometimes you lose the first minute or so.

The New Episode option is available on all SARA-based 8300's, but your IPG may not have the First Run flag, so you won't see the option until your IPG is upgraded.


Is "New Episode" the same as "First run only on this channel"?
Or do I have another variation to look forward to?

LB

Is "New Episode" the same as "First run only on this channel"?
Or do I have another variation to look forward to?

LB


Yes they refer to the same thing.

It should be the same option. FWIW, mine (1.87.16.1 on Cox) actually says "New first-run episodes on this channel".

awdorrin,

The New Episode option is available on all SARA-based 8300's, but your IPG may not have the First Run flag, so you won't see the option until your IPG is upgraded.

By "stretch" I mean there are already options available that cover that situation, both the New and Anytime options. As a former programmer though, I can't believe you would code a "Timeslot" option to look for a variance and make some kind of decision to record something outside the timeslot. I'm not saying it can't be done, anything is possible, but why would you? Just how wide a variance would you code? 3 minutes? 5 minutes? 10 minutes? How about automatically adding 30-60 minutes to cover sporting events that run over? These and a lot of other things are possible and may even be desireable, but at some point, one has to draw a line and assume the operator has some control over things and knows what they what and how to get it. :)
Dave-

Here's where it's better to build on work others have done, rather than reinventing the wheel. Most ReplayTV recordings I make are "timeslot" based, although I can choose which days of the week as well (the theme-based recordings are also powerful, and I wish they were available on the 8300). But it looks one "timeslot" before and after the one you put in to look for "out-of-place" shows. So if Lost is normally on at 8PM, but one week it's on at 8:03, or 8:42 or 9PM, it will still be recorded. Seems logical, not hard to program, and better than ignoring a show that airs 1 minute later than normal.

As to sporting events that run on, they partially implemented "soft padding". The idea being that the DVR will keep recording *if* there is no other show scheduled to record. Live shows are still pretty tough, and the network geniuses will always figure out ways to make people miss parts of shows they want to see.

There are many things that DVR programmers could do to help users get the shows they want to. Beyond ReplayTV and Tivo functions, what about the "v-chip" signals that Congress mandated have to be inserted before every show? Why not use those to determine when a show begins? And most HD TV channels broadcast information about the show that can be used as a hint by the DVR.

If you're going to say the operator should be smart enough to control everything, then why not just put in standard VCR time/date/channel options? The joke about people who don't know enough about their VCR to stop it from flashing 12:00 is grounded in reality. People will want DVRs that make it easier to record shows.

Unfortunately, there aren't many options right now. In order to timeshift HD shows, I have to use the 8300. I can live with that, but I do dream of the time when I get at least the functionality and user-friendliness of my 5-year-old ReplayTV on an HD-capable DVR.

Sean

I totally agree Sean, but I'll bet that those functions are patented and/or copyrighted and that is the crux of cable DVR weaknesses IMHO. Cableco's are reluctant to pay more and SA is reluctant to spend more to negotiate licenses. SA just recently negotiated a license with Tivo to use the Start From Beginning Option that appears in 1.88.x.x. and OS 1.5 versions of SARA.

You'll never get me to disagree that all these functions wouldn't be nice to have, but I live in the real world where patents and copyrights rule. Until OCAP is implemented cable-wide, we will continue to have to live with inferior products and I'm simply trying to make the best of it and get folks to quit slamming programmers, etc., for things that may be beyond their control. Sometimes I use the wrong words when explaining my POV and that leads folks like you to believe that I don't need or want the functions, but that is not the case.

FWIW, I went through my normal ritual this morning of double-checking my scheduled recordings for tonight and I noticed that none of the reruns on CBS were highlighted. I'll have to check again when I get home from work, but AFAIK this is different than it's been in the past and there was no new version of SARA loaded.

The pixellation from flashing lights is normal. I'll bet it looks they way at the camera side when it's encoded. Too much motion and light intensisty. Not enough bit rate.

Nope. I recorded the Grammy's on my replytv (because I reserve the limited space on my 8300 for the HD content, and I didn't expect the grammy's to be hd). Furthermore, I recorded it on replaytv's "standard" (lowest quality) setting. I did not see any pixellation whatsoever. The picture looked great on my 51 inch HDTV even despite the low quality recording setting and it being only SD.

Until OCAP is implemented cable-wide, we will continue to have to live with inferior productsOCAP (as currently spec'ed) will continue the status quo ... not change it. You'll still be limited to the software your cable company chooses to provide to you and unable to competitively select software from unaffiliated vendors.

Ok so I pulled out the hdmi and ran component. I have no picture.. is there a setting on the 8300hd box that changes outputs I see the way to change theaudio setting but nothing about video? It also might be my amp so I’m looking into that.

Nope. I recorded the Grammy's on my replytv (because I reserve the limited space on my 8300 for the HD content, and I didn't expect the grammy's to be hd). Furthermore, I recorded it on replaytv's "standard" (lowest quality) setting. I did not see any pixellation whatsoever. The picture looked great on my 51 inch HDTV even despite the low quality recording setting and it being only SD.

Grammys was not on HD, but the 8300 records on any format. I think your experience probably means that ReplayTV's machines have a better recorder. They certainly have been there for a long time, I hope SA catches up.

Grammys was not on HD, but the 8300 records on any format. I think your experience probably means that ReplayTV's machines have a better recorder. They certainly have been there for a long time, I hope SA catches up.

They weren't? I missed this year, but they've been incredible in years past, both HD and 5.1

Grammys was not on HD, but the 8300 records on any format. I think your experience probably means that ReplayTV's machines have a better recorder. They certainly have been there for a long time, I hope SA catches up.

The Grammy's were in HD and in DD5.1 as they have been for the past couple of years...

Donald :)

They were definitely in HD and that's where the problems were. They were also much worse here in Phoenix because our local station decided to test a lower bitrate (14.3) that night and the macro-blocking caused by the lights made that part unwatchable. The rest of it had a fuzziness to it that was a direct result of the lowered bitrate.

Yes.
There is a problem with SARA version 1.87.16.1 where the Copy to VCR has a problem with the output resolution. Since SA made this version in 2004, they have moved on with newer versions, most that cable co's are not using due to various issues. It was never known by SA there was a problem with the old 1.87.16.1 until recently. ;)
I'm also using 1.87.16.1 (boy, they beat even Apple at those version numbers!).

Checking the diagnostic "MPEG decoders" screen while outputting with Copy to VCR. Decoder 2 (Output 2) resolutions were... weird:

Source: original rez -> Copy To VCR output
SD 480i: 720 x 480 -> 720 x 480 (originally recorded from analog cable channel)
SD 480p: 704 x 480 -> 704 x 480 (digital cable channel)
HD 720p: 1280 x 720 -> 640 x 360 :eek:

The HD show has letterboxed output, so that'd explain the 360 vertical lines, but 640??? I was going to ask if there was a way to output a squeezed 4:3 version of the HD program, but someone's already said that's not possible. That would've been nice for dumping HD shows to SD 16:9 DVDs. 4:3 letterboxed DVDs are a drag...


Disappearing Diagnostic Window. Enter the Diagnostic Mode (see above item). While in this mode you can change the transparency of the screens by pressing the Select button on the front of the box. It goes from 100% opaque to about 50% opaque to about 5% opaque. You can then use the Page Up/Down button on the remote to cycle through screens. This is useful when changing channels, noting signal levels/PQ, or trying to see levels fluctuate as glitches occur.
You can also press the B (blue/square) button to toggle the opacity.

SA 8300 Nebie so please forgive if this is a stupid question...........

I just set up the WPT to tape all first run on this channel (or whatever the descriptio is). Nest weeks looks like a new one, but maybe its not......regardless its not showing in the upcoming recording schedule, so I thought "ok...lets change the settings to tape all in this time slot.........

Only problem is that since its not scheduled I dont seem to be able to pull it up to change the settings. With my TIVO I would go to the season pass manager and change it........how do I do it with this box? Do i simply go back to guid and set up a new recording? I was going to do that but then feared there would be multiple schedules for the same show.

Theres got to be a way to see what you have set up even if there are none scheduled.

Thanks in advance for the help.

antneye,
I'm afraid the only way to put that show on the schedule is to go to the guide and select it again. You could then choose any criteria except of course first run which it doesn't seem to be. I run in to this frequently when a rerun I missed first time fools me into thinking first run should work. The guide knows better.

TerryB

Another failure of the IPG to display needed data, the First Run (New) indicator. :(

BTW. I believe WPT starts Season 4 on March 8. Here's a link (http://www.worldpokertour.com/calendar/?x=main&m=03&y=2006#calendar) to a schedule that shows when new episodes Premiere.

You can also press the B (blue/square) button to toggle the opacity.Thanks, I've added that to the first post.

So should I assume that the 1st run selection i made already is not actually in the system? Or is it there but not visible since no new 1st runs are scheduled in the system?

I guess I can just wait until a week before the 8th and see id it shows up before making any changes.

SA just recently negotiated a license with Tivo to use the Start From Beginning Option
A few years ago the patent office was talking about invalidating many patents for technology, because they didn't realize how common it was at the time.

is there a setting on the 8300hd box that changes outputs I see the way to change theaudio setting but nothing about video?

Sounds like Tech Support lied to me. I asked how to enable the HDMI, and was told if I plugged in an HDMI cable (I haven't bought yet) then it would show HDMI as enabled.

Anybody have a tip/trick to move/remove the progress indicator while in FF mode?
When I FF thru the Olympics, I can't see the athlete info on the bottom of the screen.

Anybody have a tip/trick to move/remove the progress indicator while in FF mode?Press the Exit button.

I'm wondering if anyone else has this problem (and even better if anyone knows a fix). I have a SA 8300HD hooked via HDMI cable to an LG plasma. My provider is Comcast (Prince William County, VA). The digital (SD and HD) channels work great - good picture and sound. However, on the analog channels (< 100) I get a picture with no sound. I borrowed the component cables from my DVD and the sound works fine on all channels. It appears that the NTSC tuners (I tried both of them) do not output the sound to the HDMI output. I called Comcast and after a lenthy delay (I assume to call SA) they came back to say that since the HDMI is a digital output it does not work with the analog stations. I might believe this if the picture didn't work either. The picture and the sound are both analog so why should one work and the other not?

My kids watch a lot of Disney, which is only available in analog, and they're not too happy that it doesn't have sound. I can go with component cables but I paid $$ for the HDMI cable and would prefer to have only 1 cable instead of 5.

I've played with the sound option in the settings. It works as described for the HDMI setting, and not at all for the Dolby or Other setting.

I have searched to no avail ... I admit I am not the best with contructing searches. I hope someone can enlighten me.

I just got 3 of these STBs from Cablevision. 2 are hooked up to plasmas (one HDMI and one Component) and one to an old CRT that will be replaced soon. The CRT TV is connected with composite. I do not get any of the digital channels. I only get a grey screen. Is there a limitation? Will it not downconvert the HD channels and display them anyway? Is it potentially a problem with the STB? Is there a setting I need to look at? If this is normal I guess I will live with a small channel lineup temporarily.

Thanks for any replies.

As most of you know, I have long maintained that I could see no difference in the component vs. HDMI, and sometimes even felt that the component picture was better. Given the HDMI has had problems working consistently, it seemed that for now at least component was a good choice.

In the latest issue of TPV, they test a bunch of DVD players and find that in fact, component output on these players is superior to HDMI in almost all cases. Now, I know that the 8300HD is not a DVD player, but is there any reason to suspect that SA would provide a superior implementation of HDMI than many mid-level and top shelf DVD players?

Also, for me, these results have implications for the possibility that component connections may be turned off or downrezzed when the new hi def DVD players hit the market.

So should I assume that the 1st run selection i made already is not actually in the system? Or is it there but not visible since no new 1st runs are scheduled in the system?

I guess I can just wait until a week before the 8th and see if it shows up before making any changes.Another failure of SARA (and maybe Passport), not showing scheduled recordings that aren't linked to a program in the current IPG.

Chances are the scheduled recording is there, you just can't see it. If you schedule a New Episode recording and there is no New episode in the current IPG, the list of scheduled recordings will not display the one you just set up. Once a New episode shows up and gets recorded, the recording will thenshow up in the list. Even if several weeks are skipped with no New episodes, the list will display the last time a recording was made.

BTW. None of this is documented anywhere that I can find. That's why vegggas developed the original SA8000HD Tips thread and I updated it for the SA8300HD. If there were a User's Guide that defined all this stuff, I suspect not near as many folks would have the complaints they do or the negative attitude toward the 8300. We shouldn't have to find these features (or the lack thereof) through trial and error, and we shouldn't have to reply on a thread like this one or the internet to get the most out of our DVRs.

Also, for me, these results have implications for the possibility that component connections may be turned off or downrezzed when the new hi def DVD players hit the market.I think you've hit the nail on the head in a round about way. My take is that irrespective of the PQ one way or the other, the key ingredient is HDCP and I believe that is where most HDMI problems occur. HDMI uses HDCP whereas, unless I'm wrong, Component doesn't.

Hollywood wants everything to be based on HDCP to "protect" their (crappy?) content. I think it's as simple as that and I guess there could come a time when Hollywood could be successful in getting software changes to turn off Component, at least under certain conditions.

I don't pay much attention to all this HDMI/HDCP stuff, so I could be way offbase here. :)

... HDMI uses HDCP whereas, unless I'm wrong, Component doesn't. Hollywood wants everything to be based on HDCP to "protect" their (crappy?) content. I think it's as simple as that and I guess there could come a time when Hollywood could be successful in getting software changes to turn off Component, at least under certain conditions.Component output is one-directional and analog. There is no capability to implement a two-way digital protection mechanism such as HDCP with component video.

I agree with you. I think the ultimate fear of the whole video industry is that folks might figure out a way to rip high-def video content to a high-quality digital format and redistribute it, the way that CD audio and DVD video has been "compromised". As long as users can only get high-def video content through a distribution channel controlled by the video industry, then the industry will be happy, but any chink in the armor will get the industry's attention in a hurry.

Today, component video is relatively "safe" from ripping, because there are no low-cost devices on the market for capturing component video. The cheapest solutions out there are still a thousand dollars or more--not something that's going to be in Junior's PC anytime soon.

As long as that remains the case, the video industry won't fear uncontrolled component video output, and so probably won't take steps to limit it.

But if/when every tom, dick, and harry has a $100 PC card that can take component video in and create a high-def video file that's small enough to be easily distributed across the Internet, then I'd expect component video support to go the way of the dodo.

I also think that's why HD recording via 1394 is also such a hit-or-miss proposition right now. You won't see that become an easy and ubiquitous capability until the video nazis are confident they've got solid copy-protection / redistribution inhibits in place.

Just my $0.02.
Jim

Hi,

I'm not seeing any problems that I know of, but I want to check how bad my orange and red diagnostics are. Due to the way the house is wired and because I want to keep the Tivo around until I trust this thing, there are now three splitters before the 8300-HD.

From page 5, QAM level is -13 or -14dBmV and the EQ Gain is always Unavailable. I took the last (Tivo) splitter out temporarily and measured -9 and -10dBmV. (BTW, the level was -20dBmV when it was disconnected from the cable.)

Also the FDC Status is always Unlocked and it's Level is always Unavailable, while the RDC Power is always Unavailable. I read that the FDC and RDC values only apply to data channels, but I'm not sure what that means. I was unable to bring up the diagnostics while showing the Guide or Dashboard.

So do I need to do anything, or don't fix it if it's not broke?

Thanks,
LB

In the latest issue of TPV, they test a bunch of DVD players and find that in fact, component output on these players is superior to HDMI in almost all cases.

This caught my eye this morning - so I took a look at that issue of TPV. There are a few things that stuck me in that "comparison":
1) As the comparison starts out stating: "These reviews are not intended to be full-blown laboratory tests and should not be interpreted as such.", let's not put too much stock in them.
2) The ONLY display used in this comparison" was a Vizio P50. It has been pointed out again and again, that different sets will see different degrees of "improvement" by use of HDMI vs component. How can he make these sweeping statements by using just one display?
3) (This is an issue with many Plasma & LCDs). The Vizio display is NOT 720p x 1280 as the writer stated BUT is 768 x 1366. The problem here (and with all other displays designed for computer use) is that ALL HD scan rates need to be converted to the native display array (of 768 x 1366 pixels) - so there is always the issue of the quality of that conversion. I would hope that such a "comparison" would be done on set with REAL native resolutions of 720 lines and 1080 lines - not something that is neither nor fowl.

Frankly, it really shocks me that such an evaluation was made by a magazine named "The Perfect Vision" on a display principally sold at "Sams Club" and"Costco"> :rolleyes:

This caught my eye this morning - so I took a look at that issue of TPV. There are a few things that stuck me in that "comparison":
1) As the comparison starts out stating: "These reviews are not intended to be full-blown laboratory tests and should not be interpreted as such.", let's not put too much stock in them.
2) The ONLY display used in this comparison" was a Vizio P50. It has been pointed out again and again, that different sets will see different degrees of "improvement" by use of HDMI vs component. How can he make these sweeping statements by using just one display?
3) (This is an issue with many Plasma & LCDs). The Vizio display is NOT 720p x 1280 as the writer stated BUT is 768 x 1366. The problem here (and with all other displays designed for computer use) is that ALL HD scan rates need to be converted to the native display array (of 768 x 1366 pixels) - so there is always the issue of the quality of that conversion. I would hope that such a "comparison" would be done on set with REAL native resolutions of 720 lines and 1080 lines - not something that is neither nor fowl.

Frankly, it really shocks me that such an evaluation was made by a magazine named "The Perfect Vision" on a display principally sold at "Sams Club" and"Costco"> :rolleyes:

Dave,

I generally agree with what you say, however, in some instances the HDMI actually degraded PQ, ceteris paribus. That suggests to me that at the very least there may still be some PQ quality issues left unresolved in HDMI.

What we are left with is the suggestion that native rate conversion from HDMI data can be worse than from analog data. I would think it would be the opposite, if anything.

David

David,

As the signals (HD or DVD) we are dealing with come to us as digital signals the issue is how various scenarios handle them. If you use component then FOR SURE you are introducing a D to A and then (likely) a A to D cycle that you won't have with HDMI. I don't believe that HDMI itself degrades PQ - it is how a specific display handles that HDMI that may degrade PQ. In these cases it appears that the Vizio is not to hot - and that the majority of the DVD players "evaluated" did a better job converting digital to Analog than the Vizio did in handling digital alone.

BTW: Being a Marketing Type, could you enlighten this Engineering Type what "ceteris paribus" means :rolleyes:

i'm so glad i ran HDMI only in my bedroom thinking it was the future :rolleyes: . now i'm going to have to get someone in and run a pipe with wires in it (suggested somewhere here) so i can pull whatever i need. the HDMI hdcp is killing me. i lose sound virtually everytime i watch something and have to go restart the amp. should have spend more time reading here...

David,

As the signals (HD or DVD) we are dealing with come to us as digital signals the issue is how various scenarios handle them. If you use component then FOR SURE you are introducing a D to A and then (likely) a A to D cycle that you won't have with HDMI. I don't believe that HDMI itself degrades PQ - it is how a specific display handles that HDMI that may degrade PQ. In these cases it appears that the Vizio is not to hot - and that the majority of the DVD players "evaluated" did a better job converting digital to Analog than the Vizio did in handling digital alone.

BTW: Being a Marketing Type, could you enlighten this Engineering Type what "ceteris paribus" means :rolleyes:
A-HA! Got it. Makes sense. Thanks!

Ceteris paribus can be interpreted as "all else being equal" but literally is translated as "with other things [being] the same." It's a term used commonly in academic research.

And actually, I was an engineer long before I was in marketing. Oh how did I ever succumb to the dark side???? :D

Oh well - to tell the truth I spent a few (3) years in Market Research (actually we called it "Business Research") - I'm not sure which side is the "Dark Side".

:rolleyes:

Thanks for the answer on the unscheduled programs. I find it odd that they don't simply give you a list of your recorded shows which have nothing scheduled presently........I cannot imagine that that's a patent issue......but I should stop. I will not become one of the "This aint no TIVO" folks. I know it's not and I knew there'd be things I would miss.

On to the next question. I read this somewhere in this thread (before I switched) and for the life of me can't find the answer now, so forgive the repeat question. When watching a show from the hard drive..........if you stop the playback before its finished, go to live tv, or got to bed...whatever, and then come back at a later time to play off of the hard drive.........can you pick up where you left off? Or do you have to start at beginning again?

My old box (I wont say TIVO...oops, I said it) always remembered where i left off and brought me back to that spot. I thought someone said you can do it on this box, but I can't figure it out.

Thanks again.....I think this may actually be my last stupid Q. The box is not nearly as user friendly as "The other unnamed box", but it seems to do its job. My wife is a little depressed at the new one, but a free HDDVR is too good to pass up. She tried to look up a show my son wants to tape.....all she knew is it was on this week. Back in the old days we would type in the title and the box would bring it up......now we had to search through days and days of alphabetical listings....I may not get lucky tonight!

On a side note......I hate to give Cablevision credit, but the SD pictures on my HD TV look MUCH better woth them than they did with Directv. I may actually start watching SD on it. I typically watch only HD on it (Basement) and watch everything else in main family room.

Thanks for the answer on the unscheduled programs. I find it odd that they don't simply give you a list of your recorded shows which have nothing scheduled presently........I cannot imagine that that's a patent issue......I don't know why they programmed the List function the way they did and, truth be told, I don't know if it's SA or a third party that did it. I believe the IPG data itself comes from Gemstar/TVGuide. SARA is the interface that displays the data, such as it is, and does the scheduling, etc. Before I got into all this, I too would have doubted a lot of this stuff would be a patent issue, because it seems so obvious and that is usually not patentable, but so much of it is that it's now my first assumption.
When watching a show from the hard drive..........if you stop the playback before its finished, go to live tv, or got to bed...whatever, and then come back at a later time to play off of the hard drive.........can you pick up where you left off? Or do you have to start at beginning again?You can pick up from where you left off as long as you didn't start/stop another recording,simply tune to the DVR channel (800 here) and press Play. But, the 8300 does not assign bookmarks to all viewed recordings like Tivo does. I believe this is a patent issue similar to why we have the Start From Beginning fiasco. Without licensing from Tivo, SA cannot technically join a recording in progress, they actually join the buffer in progress. It may be technically possible to somehow provide a Start From Beginning option from the buffer, but that might be more difficult than it sounds and it is certainly more difficult that using the HDD recording. They have since licensed that feature and it is in the next complete release, though Cablevision users already have a version with that option. I assume bookmarks fall into the same category. While some other DVRs might also have bookmarks, I assume they license the feature or get around it somehow. And, it may not be a Tivo patent, it could be someone else's.
The box is not nearly as user friendly as "The other unnamed box", but it seems to do its job. My wife is a little depressed at the new one, but a free HDDVR is too good to pass up. She tried to look up a show my son wants to tape.....all she knew is it was on this week. Back in the old days we would type in the title and the box would bring it up......now we had to search through days and days of alphabetical listings....I may not get lucky tonight!There is now doubt about that. Tivo is certainly the standard by which all others are measured, but short of licensing agreements, there is little that can be done. Eventually user complaints will force such agreements or the government will step in and void some or all the patents, as someone else mentioned. In the meantime, you've found the reasons the majority of us learn to deal with the deficiencies, it's cheap and it records HD.
On a side note......I hate to give Cablevision credit, but the SD pictures on my HD TV look MUCH better with them than they did with Directv. I may actually start watching SD on it. I typically watch only HD on it (Basement) and watch everything else in main family room.This is a real surprise. Are you talking only about digital SD channels or the analog (2-99) channels too?

Oh well - to tell the truth I spent a few (3) years in Market Research (actually we called it "Business Research") - I'm not sure which side is the "Dark Side".

:rolleyes:
True Enough!

I have searched to no avail ... I admit I am not the best with contructing searches. I hope someone can enlighten me.

I just got 3 of these STBs from Cablevision. 2 are hooked up to plasmas (one HDMI and one Component) and one to an old CRT that will be replaced soon. The CRT TV is connected with composite. I do not get any of the digital channels. I only get a grey screen. Is there a limitation? Will it not downconvert the HD channels and display them anyway? Is it potentially a problem with the STB? Is there a setting I need to look at? If this is normal I guess I will live with a small channel lineup temporarily.

Thanks for any replies.

I think the 8300HD should default to 480i so I am not sure why it is not working unless that setting was changed.

Try using 'SD Mode'

To switch to 'SD Mode':
1. Turn on SDTV
2. Make sure SDTV is on the correct input (SVideo or Ch. 3 if using Coax)
3. Tun off STB
4. Press Guide and Info at the same time on the box.
5. Note - if you've got an HDTV hooked up via component, you'll see a message box with something to the effect of "Currently in HD Mode, press [A] to continue" ... don't press anything.
6. Wait ...
7. Wait ...
8. You'll eventually see a message (on the SDTV) "Currently in SD
Mode, press [A] to continue".
9. Press [A] to use 'SD Mode'
10. If you've got your HDTV on, the display will be black/white/fuzzy. This is normal because the top composite output will be active.
11. Turn box on ... you're good to go

To switch back to 'HD Mode':
1. Turn on HDTV
2. Make sure HDTV is on the correct input
3. Turn off STB
4. Press Guide and Info at the same time on the box.
5. Note - if you've got your SDTV turned on, you'll see a message box with something to the effect of "Currently in SD Mode, press [A] to continue" ... don't press anything.
6. The HDTV display will be a black/white/fuzzy message box saying you're in 'SD Mode'. This is normal because the top composite output will be active. Don't press anything yet
7. Wait ...
8. Wait ...
9. You'll eventually see a clear message (on the HDTV) "Currently in HD Mode, press [A] to continue".
10. Press [A] to use 'HD Mode'

You're now in the 'HDTV Setup Wizard' (which you can exit out of ... press exit or turn box on).

11. Turn box on ... you're good to go

Note:

1) There's also feedback on the front panel LED which would allow you to switch modes w/o looking at the screen. It is 'HD' and 'SD'.

2) By setting the 8300HD in SD mode, HD channels can be
zoomed to eliminate the top/bottom black bars. The HD
channels can also simply be viewed in normal mode
where it looks like watching a widescreen movie in
letterbox format. The ability to zoom and eliminate
black bars is a good option for wife approval factor.
The HD channels were closer to watching a DVD quality
show, as opposed to the grainier analog version.

3) After changing modes, you need to reboot the box
for it to remember the new setting.

4) If this doesn't work, you might try using SVideo or Coax.

In general yes ... if it aint broke ... don't fix it ... but ...From page 5, QAM level is -13 or -14dBmV and the EQ Gain is always Unavailable. I took the last (Tivo) splitter out temporarily and measured -9 and -10dBmV.I would prefer to see signal level within the -10db range. The closer to 0db the better. I useed to have problems with my 8000 boxes for channels with signal levels beyond -10db (finally got the cable guys to run a new cable from the street to the house which fixed my signal level problems). You might also want to look at some different channels as there are some natural signal level variances as you go from 50MHz up to 860MHz. In the diagnostic screens you can tune / change channels. However, you'll have to wait for a refresh (or up/down pages) to see new values. If it's generall in the -10db range and only gets to -14db on a few channels that's one thing. OTOH, if the best you get is -14db and other channels are worse than that ...I read that the FDC and RDC values only apply to data channels, but I'm not sure what that means.FDC is the forward data channel. Lots of things come down the FDC. Guide data, software updates, keys for the encrypted channels, etc. I wouldn't worry about the FDC too much unless you start having problems. Guide data unavailable ... channels you subscribe to that the box thinks you don't ... etc.

The RDC is the return data channel. When you order PPV or VOD that info goes to the cable plant via the RDC. Also, VOD commands like FF/RW/etc. Again, I wouldn't worry unless certain features don't work.

My 8300 was recently updated to version 1.88.17.1. It appears the harddrive now goes into suspend mode. You get a message telling you to press any key to continue. Unfortunately, this message takes up most of the screen (think the 4:3 part out of the 16:9 screen). It gets worse. 1 out of 3 times, pressing any key including power does not work, and the only recourse is pulling the plug. Any suggestions?
Thanks,
lo

I think the 8300HD should default to 480i so I am not sure why it is not working unless that setting was changed.

Try using 'SD Mode'



Thanks for the suggestions Russ. I went to SD mode and every channel displays 480i on the STB. I just still cannot get many of the channels. If I choose HBO or InHD for example I just get a grey screen even though my other 2 TVs get it fine. If I choose Showtime (I do not subscribe to it) I do get the message that I am not subscribed, so I wouldn't think it is an issue of it not knowing I get the channels.

Believe it or not, this old TV doesn't even have S-Video as an option. I guess I will wait until we replace the TV and see what it does with HDMI. I appreciate the reply.

Thanks for the suggestions Russ. I went to SD mode and every channel displays 480i on the STB. I just still cannot get many of the channels. If I choose HBO or InHD for example I just get a grey screen even though my other 2 TVs get it fine. If I choose Showtime (I do not subscribe to it) I do get the message that I am not subscribed, so I wouldn't think it is an issue of it not knowing I get the channels.

Believe it or not, this old TV doesn't even have S-Video as an option. I guess I will wait until we replace the TV and see what it does with HDMI. I appreciate the reply.

Could it be a signal issue? When I first got the 8300HD installed I couldn't get many of the HBO/Max and other digital channels to come in. Turns out the cable installer had put in an 8 way splitter to activate every outlet in the house. We switched to 2 two-way splitters and everything was fine. How many spliitters are you using?

Could it be a signal issue? When I first got the 8300HD installed I couldn't get many of the HBO/Max and other digital channels to come in. Turns out the cable installer had put in an 8 way splitter to activate every outlet in the house. We switched to 2 two-way splitters and everything was fine. How many spliitters are you using?

I have one 2 way that goes to the cable modem and the other half to all the TVs. After that there is a 3 way. The 'strongest' output is going to the TV with the problem. I will try switching outputs to see if there is any difference. Thank you.

Could it be a signal issue? When I first got the 8300HD installed I couldn't get many of the HBO/Max and other digital channels to come in. Turns out the cable installer had put in an 8 way splitter to activate every outlet in the house. We switched to 2 two-way splitters and everything was fine. How many spliitters are you using?

I think it may indeed be a signal issue. Switching outputs on the spitter did not help, but I did notice some more detail. 2-69 are no problem at all. Ch 70 is YES and it comes in for a few seconds sometimes and the picture kind of freezes. The only other channels I get are Cablevision channels and PPV channels over ch. 70. I also got ABC+ and the HD versions of the locals. Perhaps anything they are getting over satellite and then sending to me digitally are not strong enough? Is there a good cure for low signal strength if this is the issue? Would 2, 2 way splitters be better, worse or same as the current 3 way that is there? Thank you.

offandon,
They can install a signal amplifier to boost the signal. However, this problem may be an indication of problems further upstream.. You should have the Cableco service people evaluate the problem and fix it. Unless you installed the wiring and splitters, it's their baby.

TerryB

I think it may indeed be a signal issue. Switching outputs on the spitter did not help, but I did notice some more detail. 2-69 are no problem at all. Ch 70 is YES and it comes in for a few seconds sometimes and the picture kind of freezes. The only other channels I get are Cablevision channels and PPV channels over ch. 70. I also got ABC+ and the HD versions of the locals. Perhaps anything they are getting over satellite and then sending to me digitally are not strong enough? Is there a good cure for low signal strength if this is the issue? Would 2, 2 way splitters be better, worse or same as the current 3 way that is there? Thank you.

It sounds like a signal issue, but you may want to confirm it is not an issue with that 8300HD. Just swap boxes from one of your other TVs and change it to the proper mode. If you have the same problems then it is not an issue with the original 8300HD.

I think it may indeed be a signal issue. Switching outputs on the spitter did not help, but I did notice some more detail. 2-69 are no problem at all. Ch 70 is YES and it comes in for a few seconds sometimes and the picture kind of freezes. The only other channels I get are Cablevision channels and PPV channels over ch. 70. I also got ABC+ and the HD versions of the locals. Perhaps anything they are getting over satellite and then sending to me digitally are not strong enough? Is there a good cure for low signal strength if this is the issue? Would 2, 2 way splitters be better, worse or same as the current 3 way that is there? Thank you.

My solution was a two way splitter on the main line coming into the house, with one line going to the cable modem and the other going to a Motorola signal booster. The line out of the signal booster goes to a 2 way splitter to the 2 TV's. I haven't had any problems since going to this setup and now my signal levels in the diagnostic screen are usually between -5 and +5 dBmV vs. -15 to +15 dBmV before.

Thank you everyone. On the diags screen it said -9db ... ok from what I have read so I was going to do a swap. After unplugging it I wanted to see something else so I plugged it back in and voila ... now all the channels show up. Odd. Anyway thanks very much ... I guess I will treat these things like the computers they are ... when in doubt, reboot.

That is tip number 1, but usually it's not needed on a new box. :)

That is tip number 1, but usually it's not needed on a new box.
Unless your FDC and RDC levels are off and your channel package gets corrupted.
The poster is JUST looking at tuner levels, wheras -9 is the edge of threshold for digital (analog is good from about -2 ~ +5). The FDC has to be above -9 for non corrupted data and the RDC should not exceed about 45db max to avoid overheating and clipping of the return signal. [Each 3dB increase results in Twice the power output / or 3dB decrease is half the power.]

Attached is a screenshot of a diagnostic tool with parameters for a GOOD STB. You can get similar results using the diagnostic pages and reading your values and comparing.

vegggas

I totally agree Sean, but I'll bet that those functions are patented and/or copyrighted and that is the crux of cable DVR weaknesses IMHO. Cableco's are reluctant to pay more and SA is reluctant to spend more to negotiate licenses. SA just recently negotiated a license with Tivo to use the Start From Beginning Option that appears in 1.88.x.x. and OS 1.5 versions of SARA.

You'll never get me to disagree that all these functions wouldn't be nice to have, but I live in the real world where patents and copyrights rule. Until OCAP is implemented cable-wide, we will continue to have to live with inferior products and I'm simply trying to make the best of it and get folks to quit slamming programmers, etc., for things that may be beyond their control. Sometimes I use the wrong words when explaining my POV and that leads folks like you to believe that I don't need or want the functions, but that is not the case.
Dave-

I don't believe you don't need or want more functions, and I respect the work you've done in this thread helping 8300HD owners, including me. Your post asked how to implement a method of recording shows that don't start at exactly the right time. I knew the answer to that one, since ReplayTV has been doing it for years.

Any company that wants to compete but doesn't innovate can only license. Surely SA has some patents from their years of development that they can barter to other companies in exchange for some of these features. Or perhaps they should consider purchasing a company that has a better DVR feature set.

It sounds like we users should take every opportunity to let our cable providers know what features we want. If SA is willing to pay for Start From Beginning, maybe we can convince them that other features are also worth it.

Sean

It sounds like we users should take every opportunity to let our cable providers know what features we want. If SA is willing to pay for Start From Beginning, maybe we can convince them that other features are also worth it.I'll sign the "skip fwd 30 sec" petition. Who do we mail it to?? :)

Hi,

From page 5, QAM level is -13 or -14dBmV and the EQ Gain is always Unavailable. I took the last (Tivo) splitter out temporarily and measured -9 and -10dBmV. (BTW, the level was -20dBmV when it was disconnected from the cable.)



In general yes ... if it aint broke ... don't fix it ... but ...I would prefer to see signal level within the -10db range. The closer to 0db the better. I useed to have problems with my 8000 boxes for channels with signal levels beyond -10db (finally got the cable guys to run a new cable from the street to the house which fixed my signal level problems). You might also want to look at some different channels as there are some natural signal level variances as you go from 50MHz up to 860MHz. In the diagnostic screens you can tune / change channels. However, you'll have to wait for a refresh (or up/down pages) to see new values. If it's generall in the -10db range and only gets to -14db on a few channels that's one thing. OTOH, if the best you get is -14db and other channels are worse than that ...FDC is the forward data channel. Lots of things come down the FDC. Guide data, software updates, keys for the encrypted channels, etc. I wouldn't worry about the FDC too much unless you start having problems. Guide data unavailable ... channels you subscribe to that the box thinks you don't ... etc.


Totally disagree.

SA Boxes do not like anything above 0db and below -8db on the QAM channel.

There is a reason they go to a warning at -9db and change to red at 10db.

If you are at -10db, get it fixed.

Your line probably needs to be balanced if you find it all over the map on different frequencies.

If its just low overall, get them to run a new line or put in a different tap at the street.

PS - not that this is a cable card thread - but SA Cable Cards need much closer to 0db to work - at -8db where a SA3250HD or a SA8300HD will work, the cable card will be dropout city.

Could it be a signal issue? When I first got the 8300HD installed I couldn't get many of the HBO/Max and other digital channels to come in. Turns out the cable installer had put in an 8 way splitter to activate every outlet in the house. We switched to 2 two-way splitters and everything was fine. How many spliitters are you using?

A digital-ready signal booster is recommended, at least 10dB, and check that every splitter you use is digital-ready too, like in the gigahertz range.

Many of us had problems with picture quality and channel viewing with HDTVs and digital/HD channel reception and most of these issues were improved, if not resolved, with a quality signal booster and adequate splitters.

They were definitely in HD and that's where the problems were. They were also much worse here in Phoenix because our local station decided to test a lower bitrate (14.3) that night and the macro-blocking caused by the lights made that part unwatchable. The rest of it had a fuzziness to it that was a direct result of the lowered bitrate.

Hmmm...then that's what happened to me. OK guys, sorry, I didn't know because I don't have that channel with HD on my current cable service. We have OneLink, which came from Adelphia, and it's just this year starting to offer HD...only about 6 or 8 channels, most of them movie channels.

So, I got the Grammys on SD and probably suffered from what DoubleDAZ explains, at least makes sense to me since I haven't seen that much pixelation in any other recorded program.

Lots of good info here and on AVS in general.

I want to be able to use BOTH my HDMI and component video outs from my 8300 at the same time - sending the HDMI to my main HDTV and component to a secondary.

Is there a way to do this?

This is not a PIP situation to a single HDTV, but a stream to two differnet ones. I have to believe there is a way to tell the 8300 not to shut the composite out down when it switches to HDMI. Thanks.

I'll sign the "skip fwd 30 sec" petition. Who do we mail it to?? :)
Excellent question. I think it would be most useful to contact both your cable company and SA. Here's a link to a feedback form at SA (from the bottom of their FAQ page):

http://www.scientificatlanta.com/explorerclub/questions_answers_form.htm

You may have to sign up for the "Explorer Club" before you can access that link.

Edit: that link is really to ask a question not in their FAQ, but I can't find a general feedback form. I bet there used to be one, since they put this text on a couple of pages:

A Note About Technical Support
We respond to your questions and comments in the form of FAQs on the Explorer eClub Web site and improvements to information and products.


If I find a feedback form I'll post it.

Sean

easalpad,
As I understand it the HDMI DOES NOT allow a full resolution output to the component connections. The purpose of the digital connection is to allow only the compiant equipment to see the full resolution output. The component connection is not allowed to be "licensed" by tying something else to the HDMI.

TerryB

In the "Archive To VCR" mode, can I copy to a DVD recorder as well as the VCR? This is the HD8000....

I don't believe you don't need or want more functions.........It sounds like we users should take every opportunity to let our cable providers know what features we want. If SA is willing to pay for Start From Beginning, maybe we can convince them that other features are also worth it.Of course I want more functions, I just don't NEED them, and I don't chastize SA or their programmers on a personal level because I don't have them. I understand how all this works and I know features will eventually come, but at what price? I don't want my cable bill to rise another $10/mo for some nice-to-have features that I know I don't absolutely need in order to record HD, especially if I don't have a choice in the matter when it come to cost. Assuming the Tivo S3 gets released cable-wide and cableco's continue to offer the 8300, I'm not sure I'd pay more ($5 vs $12.95) for the S3 unless the unit itself is better.

Re licenses, it seems that just about everyone thinks that just because a given company is willing to negotiate for a license that the owner is likewise willing. Other than money, there is absolutely no incentive for Tivo to negotiate anything. And I believe past negotiations resulted in unreasonable demands. Only now that D* has severed it's relationship with Tivo is Tivo willing to negotiate in good faith to stay in business. I could be all wrong, but I don't like Tivo as a company because I perceived them to be unwilling to work with cable to bring their product to cable in the past. There is no doubt they have the better product, but I would rather do without than succumb to what I consider to be extortion. I'm old-fashioned that way I guess.

Re complaining to cableco's to get changes made. I also agree with that sentiment. Where I differ is in how it's done. IMHO, no one wins with comments like "SA sucks" or "The 8300 is a POS", et al. Constructive criticism and rational requests for given features goes a lot further in my book that telling a cableco or equipment supplier that they and their programmers are basically worthless. I'm sure you and I agree on that, but I can only imagine the kind of comments SA receives or would receive if they accepted comments from end-users. There are very few posts in this or other threads that rationally discuss 8300 short-comings and offer suggestions for change other than make it a Tivo at cable prices or license Tivo features regardless of cost.

I'll sign the "skip fwd 30 sec" petition. Who do we mail it to?? :)Mail it to the Hollywood types because they, not SA, not Tivo, not Moto, are the ones demanding it not be included in future DVRs. From what I've been told, it was in early SARA software and was removed because of pressure. It was also removed from Tivo, though one can hack it back in (on current models, I guess). AFAIK it will not be in the S3, though I don't know about the hack capability.

This may be a dumb newbee question but, where can I get info on what values are good/bad in the Diagnostic Mode ? I feel I get a poor signal and want to able to look at these numbers and say.... "ya thats good or thats not so good"...... I want to know if my cable signal is strong and if the box is giving me the best possible picture...... what other things should I be looking for in this mode ???

I have a DLP tv and really want my analog pics to look better, even my digital non-hd pics don't really look great......

thanks Tim

This may be a dumb newbee question but, where can I get info on what values are good/bad in the Diagnostic Mode ? I feel I get a poor signal and want to able to look at these numbers and say.... "ya thats good or thats not so good"...... I want to know if my cable signal is strong and if the box is giving me the best possible picture...... what other things should I be looking for in this mode ???

I have a DLP tv and really want my analog pics to look better, even my digital non-hd pics don't really look great......

thanks Tim
About a dozen posts back, I attached a pic - A graphical range of values for a GOOD base of signal levels. Green is good, Yellow is getting bad and Red WILL FAIL. Each channel will have different RF frequencies, so values will change for different channels.
As an aside, I can't get the same levels in one of my spare bedrooms due to what I believe, the builder put a nail through a cable. The high end is shot all to hell and I can't get signals stable over about 200 MHZ. Only solution is for me to pull a new cable, but since its for guests overstaying their welcome - screw em!

vegggas

Unless your FDC and RDC levels are off and your channel package gets corrupted.
The poster is JUST looking at tuner levels, wheras -9 is the edge of threshold for digital (analog is good from about -2 ~ +5). The FDC has to be above -9 for non corrupted data and the RDC should not exceed about 45db max to avoid overheating and clipping of the return signal. [Each 3dB increase results in Twice the power output / or 3dB decrease is half the power.]

Attached is a screenshot of a diagnostic tool with parameters for a GOOD STB. You can get similar results using the diagnostic pages and reading your values and comparing.

vegggas

I am the guy having trouble with my recordings stopping. My FDC Level is at 4, sometimes fluctuates to 5. My RDC is 36. Are these good numbers?
I appreciate your help/

Brian

I am the guy having trouble with my recordings stopping. My FDC Level is at 4, sometimes fluctuates to 5. My RDC is 36. Are these good numbers?
I appreciate your help/
Your levels, as listed here, are great.
The problem is still related the the IPG data somehow instructing the DVR to stop recording. Not sure exactly what is happening yet though. It can happen (and has with American Idol last season) on both the 8300 and the 8000 at the same time with good signal levels. It does seem to happen more often with lower FDC and higher RDC levels.

vegggas

Here are some of the levels I see on my box............

My current FDC -6 to -8 , s/n 27 75.5Mhz

Current RDC power 42 16.0 Mhz

Current QAM -6 dBmV s/n 35 567 Mhz

Not sure about these numbers....... ??? What do you guys think ....... how can I boost the (-) numbers or do they need it ?

Sorry if this is a newbee question, but I gotta learn

thanks Tim