Eric: Is this a consumer install or does it have to go to a dealer?


Yes, you CAN do this at home...

It even comes with the hex wrench to install it with.


Eric

I agree,, I mean a product that's both sold upon it's upgradeability AND beeing one the pre/processors with most connections (inputs/outputs..)...,,,

I mean, who wans't got the their RDC7.1 ( or 10/ 1000 ) completly filled with stuff going in and out ??,,, It's a days work getting it loose and another getting everything right again..

I haven't had that problem. And the dealer just uses the same hex wrench that comes in the box that you would.

Eric

thanks for the info eric i might have to have that card if not
for the rds alone i hope it will show the info on the plasma
like it does with the station no.

From the manual for the C-HDXM:

Receiving RDS Radio
RDS stands for Radio Data System and is a type of FM broadcasting.
RDS was developed within the National Radio Systems
Committee (NRSC) and is available in North America.

Many FM stations now transmit RDS signals which contain
additional information. RDS provides you with various services
so that you can choose a station broadcasting your favorite
categories of music or other information. The information
of Program Service Name, Radio Text and Program Type is
available for display on this tuner board.

Listening to the RDS Radio

For information on how to connect FM antenna and to tune,
refer to the Instruction Manual for your main unit.

The RDS indicator lights up when an RDS station is received.

Note:
• If radio signals are weak, RDS may not be received.

Displaying RDS Information

Press the [DISPLAY] / [Display] button repeatedly to cycle
through the available information.
1. Frequency and Listening mode (If available, Program Service Name will be displayed)
2. Radio Text (if Radio Text available)
3. Program Type



-Eric

Last time I tried XM, I wasn't able to revceive it. Maybe I should give it another shot.

thanks for the info eric i might have to have that card if not
for the rds alone i hope it will show the info on the plasma
like it does with the station no.

It should do, the RDS FM card that was released to Europe a few years back does.

i noticed that the pdf for the card is on the integra-research site
but not on the integra or onkyo site and when is it avaliable for purchase.

i noticed that the pdf for the card is on the integra-research site
but not on the integra or onkyo site and when is it avaliable for purchase.


It is orderable right now. The SKU was entered in the ordering system over a week ago. It's expected to ship this week.

Eric

thanks eric i assume it will also require a firmware upgrade.

A new firmware upgrade is available on http://www.onkyousa.com/download/software.cfm for TX-NR1000.
But "Please note: TX-NR1000 can ONLY be upgraded at a service center. You cannot download a firmware update online. Find your local service center by clicking here. "

What do you think ? Is it V2.x ?

Xavier

A new firmware upgrade is available on http://www.onkyousa.com/download/software.cfm for TX-NR1000.
But "Please note: TX-NR1000 can ONLY be upgraded at a service center. You cannot download a firmware update online. Find your local service center by clicking here. "

What do you think ? Is it V2.x ?

Xavier

No, that looks like a nettune upgrade. Since dealers will do the XM upgrade you can expect V2.X will be available soonish.

Looks like it is just a Net Tune fix... :confused:

Strange !
"NETTUNE Firmware upgrades are available for the following models :TX-NR1000, etc."
TX-NR1000 wasn't in the list the last week ! And also the note about TX-NR1000.
Do you imagine a firmware upgrade for NetTune and another firmware upgrade for support C-HDXM card ?

The actual firmware was 1.9. Only one version with all features.
Is it possible to upgrade only one feature like NetTune or support one specific card ?

Xavier

And, why to I have to disconnect my whole setup just to bring it in to a service center to do something that I was able to do myself in previous revisions of the firmware???!?!?

Sheesh...

:(

That's what I am thinking. Who wants to haul this tank to a UPS store? Then reset it back up again? Not me... :mad:

That's what I am thinking. Who wants to haul this tank to a UPS store? Then reset it back up again? Not me... :mad:

A few years ago I shipped my Integra Research RDC-7 to a service center for the THX Ultra2 upgrade. It came back with several scratches. No more service centers for me, thank you very much.

R

I don't know... Maybe if this code did something else for me besides the NetTune stuff... I would definitely bring it in once the HDMI code is updated.

Is there any reasoning behind Onkyo's madness as to why you have to take it in to update it?

You will need to update the firmware V2.XX which supports the new radio cards, I have had 2.00 on my RDC-7.1 since Onkyo UK installed the new DAB radio card.

Krobar, you said you have version 2.00 on your RDC-7.1.
What is the revision for the others features like :
a) master version (2.00 ?)
b) i.LINK (IEEE1394) version
c) Net-Tune version
d) HDMI version

Xavier

Hi Xavier,

a = 2.00
b = 1.02
Dont have C & D

I tend to post info the RDC-7.1 thread too:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=386266&page=64

Is there anyway to listen to XM, if I have a paid internet subscription, using the NR1000? Either using some kind of converter, or directly using an Ethernet cable?

"Is there any reasoning behind Onkyo's madness as to why you have to take it in to update it?"

Madness is the word for me at least,
Integra doesn't have any representation here in Sweden anymore,
Bought mine from Singapore,, so... That looks like a VERY expensive upgrade 4 me..!!

What Nettune version do you guys have? I have 1.00.01 update and it lists the following as improvements:

************************************************************ **********
Contents of the updates
************************************************************ **********

Ver.01.00.01
* Improvement to play WMA files created by Windows Media Player 10.
* The reception rate of the Internet radio has been improved.

Haven't tried it since I dont have the NetTune module.

this may be a question for egcarter but hd radio station wguc-fm 90.9
starting broadcasting in 5.1 using neural audio's 5.1 technology i was
wondering will the new card decode this.

this may be a question for egcarter but hd radio station wguc-fm 90.9
starting broadcasting in 5.1 using neural audio's 5.1 technology i was
wondering will the new card decode this.


I believe that Neural Audio can be decoded by standard Dolby decoders. So if your HD station also uses Neural, then the HD card will decode that station and you also put your AVR in one of the Dolby decoding modes (such as PLIIx) for the surround.

Eric

hello all...quick question for you Blu-ray & HD-DVD player owners...how exactly should I have the multichannel set up to hear the uncompressed PCM from Blu-ray & 5.1 TrueHD from HD-DVD? I don't think I have it set up correctly...thanks in advance

~Vince

Well nothing high end from Onkyo of interest @ IFA this year but a few new mid level recievers:
http://www.areadvd.de/news/2006/IFA_2006/cr/onkyo_ifa_1.shtml

I cant belive I just read all 43 pages and I have no intentions of buying this receiver....lol.

It must have been as compelling as a Richard Lamon book. :D

Labor day weekend....work decides to take the week off.....bored at work....

'nuff said :)

hello all...quick question for you Blu-ray & HD-DVD player owners...how exactly should I have the multichannel set up to hear the uncompressed PCM from Blu-ray & 5.1 TrueHD from HD-DVD? I don't think I have it set up correctly...thanks in advance

~Vince


Vince,

I do believe that you use the analog 5.1 out of the HD-DVD player into the MultiChannel in. The player decodes the audio to uncompressed PCM.

Eric

Vince,

I do believe that you use the analog 5.1 out of the HD-DVD player into the MultiChannel in. The player decodes the audio to uncompressed PCM.

Eric

Eric,
that part I was aware of, I should've explained better...on the Onkyo, I have the multichannel input set to multichannel...would that be the best setting for it, as opposed to say Direct? In the manual, it says that Direct is the best setting to to use to allow a component to decode sound & send to the reciever...also, should I set the Toshiba to PCM even though i'm not sending the audio over HDMI?

Eric,
that part I was aware of, I should've explained better...on the Onkyo, I have the multichannel input set to multichannel...would that be the best setting for it, as opposed to say Direct? In the manual, it says that Direct is the best setting to to use to allow a component to decode sound & send to the reciever...also, should I set the Toshiba to PCM even though i'm not sending the audio over HDMI?
brogan2424;I dont own the Toshiba but if you set it to LPCM you wont get the requisite analog output for the multichannel in on the amp.The d/a converters in the Toshiba need to be used unless Ive misread this whole thing :o

If you trust the bass management done by the Toshiba certainly Direct is better than multichannel ; but I would use pure audio - cuts video circuitry on top of tone controls etc and works on a 6-8 channel signal :)

brogan2424;I dont own the Toshiba but if you set it to LPCM you wont get the requisite analog output for the multichannel in on the amp.The d/a converters in the Toshiba need to be used unless Ive misread this whole thing :o

If you trust the bass management done by the Toshiba certainly Direct is better than multichannel ; but I would use pure audio - cuts video circuitry on top of tone controls etc and works on a 6-8
channel signal :)


So I should have the Tosh set to Bitstream instead of PCM if I want to use TrueHD or DD+ through analog & change multichannel to Direct or Pure Audio on the Onkyo? Is this correct?

So I should have the Tosh set to Bitstream instead of PCM if I want to use TrueHD or DD+ through analog & change multichannel to Direct or Pure Audio on the Onkyo? Is this correct?
Brogan ; The bitstream setting will be for HDMI version 1.3 which nobody has yet.The pcm setting is for HDMI ver 1.1 which the nr1000/dtr10.5 does not have.Our amps only have ver1.0.

The bitstream/pcm settings are for digital signals;The analog multichannel input cannot accept a digital signal- you must set the Toshiba to output an analog signal ie make it use its digital/analog converter and connect 6 analog rca;s to Slot E according to my australian manual.When we get the rumoured hdmi upgrade card we wont need to use the analog input we will decode the pcm to analog in the amp.If you use your amp to put the osd up Direct will cut any dsp;s and if you want to apply say pl 11x or dts neo 6 use the multichannel set up sub menu. :)On second thoughts applying pl 11x to dolby true hd is nonsensical.

Brogan ; The bitstream setting will be for HDMI version 1.3 which nobody has yet.The pcm setting is for HDMI ver 1.1 which the nr1000/dtr10.5 does not have.Our amps only have ver1.0.

The bitstream/pcm settings are for digital signals;The analog multichannel input cannot accept a digital signal- you must set the Toshiba to output an analog signal ie make it use its digital/analog converter and connect 6 analog rca;s to Slot E according to my australian manual.When we get the rumoured hdmi upgrade card we wont need to use the analog input we will decode the pcm to analog in the amp.If you use your amp to put the osd up Direct will cut any dsp;s and if you want to apply say pl 11x or dts neo 6 use the multichannel set up sub menu. :)On second thoughts applying pl 11x to dolby true hd is nonsensical.

What do I have to do to the Tosh to make it send the analog signal through multichannel? Are you saying that the PCM/Bitstream setting doesn't apply to the multichannel connections? Now i'm really confused :(

I don't think you have to do anything. I just have mine hooked up (using a Y adaptor for multi 6 channel) and it sounds great. If I am watching a regular SD movie I use the COAX cable and listen to it in either DD or DTS.

FYI, the new CHDXM card is now shipping.

Eric

Its good to see a new card is shipping. Now hopefully others will begin to follow shortly. :)

I don't think you have to do anything. I just have mine hooked up (using a Y adaptor for multi 6 channel) and it sounds great. If I am watching a regular SD movie I use the COAX cable and listen to it in either DD or DTS.

Joerod,
I have a couple questions for ya, if thats cool...which Y adaptors are you using? What do have the multichannel set to in the Onkyo? Also, what do have the Analog/PCM setting to? What audio settings are you using on the Tosh? When you're watching an HD-DVD w/TrueHD, what does it say on the receiver? (I know it won't say TrueHD, I just want to know what I should be seeing) Sorry to bombard you, this stuff is really killing me right now.

~Vince

I have Monster Y adaptors even though I know you really can use other brands. MultiChannel (not sure what you mean) is on 1. Analog?PCM is set to DD. The audio settings on my Toshiba XA1 are set to on for both Multichannel (analog) and digital (COAX). I have only had my receiver say MULTICHANNEL on its display. I have played around with the THX cinema option as well. So sometimes I guess it says THX CINEMA. If it sounds very good then I would say you have it set correctly. My sound is awesome and I as well as others are floored by it. The 6 Channel Matrix Sound is a good effect. You never notice that a sound is just meant for the surround L. You hear it in the surround L but also in the BACK speaker as well. And same goes for the R surround! It just does a good job of spreading the sound in a good way. I like the FULL surround effect. :)

I have Monster Y adaptors even though I know you really can use other brands. MultiChannel (not sure what you mean) is on 1. Analog?PCM is set to DD. The audio settings on my Toshiba XA1 are set to on for both Multichannel (analog) and digital (COAX). I have only had my receiver say MULTICHANNEL on its display. I have played around with the THX cinema option as well. So sometimes I guess it says THX CINEMA. If it sounds very good then I would say you have it set correctly. My sound is awesome and I as well as others are floored by it. The 6 Channel Matrix Sound is a good effect. You never notice that a sound is just meant for the surround L. You hear it in the surround L but also in the BACK speaker as well. And same goes for the R surround! It just does a good job of spreading the sound in a good way. I like the FULL surround effect. :)


OK, this is all starting to make a little sense to me now...when you say you have the XA1 set to on for both multichannel & coax, do you mean connected through multi & coax or actually set to that on the XA1? I don't see anywhere that can actually be selected...thanks for answering my previous questions, btw...

~Vince

What do I have to do to the Tosh to make it send the analog signal through multichannel? Are you saying that the PCM/Bitstream setting doesn't apply to the multichannel connections? Now i'm really confused :(
Brogan; Im glad joerod has the Tosh and can help with its sub menus.The pcm/bitstream absolutely does not apply to the multichannel connections.To put it another way these only concern a digital output not an analog one which feeds the multichannel input on your amp.

As I said these settings are for the hdmi output if used [bitstream for version 1.3 and pcm for ver1.1] I have a Pioneer 989 [your av79 ] and it switches to analog automatically when the 6 rca's are used .Good luck

Yes, I have both connected to my TX1000 (multichannel and COAX). Then I can decide on the fly on either of them depending on if I am watching SD titles or HD DVDs. It just makes it easier that way. Plus the sound is always good... :)

FYI, the new CHDXM card is now shipping.

Eric


wHAT IS THIS CARD ABOUT?

wHAT IS THIS CARD ABOUT?

AM/FM/HD Radio/XM Radio/RDS card. It replaces any existing AM/FM card ("K" slot, I believe).

Eric

The new Net-Tune firmware is now available for the card-based family.

It has the same improvements that the firmware for the other Onkyo/Integra receivers recently released... Windows Media 10 compatibility and far better connectivity to Internet Radio stations.

Eric

has anyone tried the new tuner card.

It looks like another season is about pass w/NO NEW INFO on the "phantom" HDMI card...this get's me sick to my stomach thinking about the fact that I can't get audio through HDMI w/this receiver...it's a $5K receiver that can't do what some do at 10% of the price...as great as the receiver is, the fact that it hasn't been PROPERLY supported is a disgrace...give me a friggin' HDMI 1.1 card & I would be ecstatic!! Hey Onkyo, support the God damn receiver!!

At this point you would expect a 1.3 card. It's the smart thing to make people wait until those cards are ready. I say it's another 8-10 months wait.

At this point you would expect a 1.3 card. It's the smart thing to make people wait until those cards are ready. I say it's another 8-10 months wait.


No Thomas, it's not the smart thing...they could put out a card now (1.2) & 12-18 months down the road put out a 1.3 card if they wanted...You're talking about people that have spent around/close to depending where how you got it $5,000 on a receiver, I think these people will pony up for a new card & maybe a newer card further down the line...I know I would...in 8-10 months I would expect to hear about Onkyo's next flagship receiver that has those cards already as stock...this company is a joke as far i'm concerned,
it's days like this I wish I bought the Denon :mad:

I understand, but if they were going to release a 1.1 card it should have been done long ago.
1.3 will hopefully be a standard that lasts (cross fingers.)
Good luck the 989 upgrade path/promises was hell for me at the time, b/c I thought the upgrades were ridiculously overpriced.

I understand, but if they were going to release a 1.1 card it should have been done long ago.
1.3 will hopefully be a standard that lasts (cross fingers.)
Good luck the 989 upgrade path/promises was hell for me at the time, b/c I thought the upgrades were ridiculously overpriced.


I would pay for ridiculously overpriced 1.1 HDMI card, I want the f-n option to use audio through HDMI, thats all...I would happily take 1.1 very late to the table than 1.3 way, way after the fact...it's nonsense, pure & simple...all they would have to do is release info on this...what are their plans? I honestly don't believe an HDMI card will EVER see the light of day for this receiver...it's been out for 2 years & this card is still a noshow to the party...last I heard, a leprechaun was gonna drop it off at my house riding a unicorn...

I thought the upgrades were ridiculously overpriced.

They had two upgrades, one for DPL2 - $50, great price - and the other for THX Ultra2 - $500, ridiculously overpriced indeed. I think that the new XM/HD/AM/FM tuner card is also overpriced at $300, I don't think that they'll sell many of those.

R

We'll find out at CEDIA what the HDMI card plans are...I know it's coming, but the question is if they'll release a 1.2 card soon (they already developed it) or wait for 1.3 chips to be available (not 'til 2007). Yes, you can't send your audio through the existing HDMI card (1.0)...that's what happens when you are the first to offer a technology that subsequently changes.

Onkyo is a member of both the Blu-Ray Association AND the HD-DVD camp. I understand that they are contemplating manufacturing a dual-format player, particularly since companies such as Ricoh are going to be making a dual-format drive. If they do so, they probably want to wait for 1.3. We probably don't want a 1.2 card, then a 1.3 card a few months down the road. Remember that these receivers were designed to be paired with their sibling DVD players featuring the iLink connection for the audio transport.

Eric

We'll find out at CEDIA what the HDMI card plans are...I know it's coming, but the question is if they'll release a 1.2 card soon (they already developed it) or wait for 1.3 chips to be available (not 'til 2007). Yes, you can't send your audio through the existing HDMI card (1.0)...that's what happens when you are the first to offer a technology that subsequently changes.

Eric
Egcarter; considering this 1.2 card has been in research and development for so long now; surely they must recoup the development costs by releasing it ? It would be an expensive write-off.

Even down here in Aus I have a hdmi hd pvr and dvd player soon to be joined by the xbox 360 hd dvd add on [which presumably will be hdmi].I can wait for the 1.3 card-dont get me wrong-as long as it has ports up the wazu :)

Cheers Colin

We probably don't want a 1.2 card, then a 1.3 card a few months down the road


Are you serious? OF COURSE WE WANT THAT CARD!!!! Anything is generally better than nothing, correct? HDMI v1.1 would be fine right now. If it truly has been developed (I personally don't believe that) they would sell it...they could always change the chipset down the road & offer another card w/1.3 when it becomes neccessary...until they release any info on these cards, they're vaporware as far i'm concerned :(

I hope someone can help me out here as i am confused!

I have a very old Nintendo Entertainment System (yes, the original NES from 1985) and I have always hooked it up to whatever HT system I have had and played my friends in Super Tecmo Bowl. Such a classic game!

The NES has the option for a regular composite video and mono composite audio. When I hook the auido up with a Y adapter to get 2 channel mono sound, it works fine, but when I hook the composite video into any of my composite video inputs and then use the up convert feature to hdmi, which goes to my hdmi projector, the picture will flash or only come on for a maximum of about three seconds and then the projector says no input detected.

When I hook the NES directly up to the projector's composite signal, it works fine so its not an output problem with the NES. Somewhere in the analog-composite to digital-hdmi up conversion, the signal gets jumbled and the projector thinks its not getting a good signal.

I have never had problems with upconverting component signals to hdmi with my satellite, game cube, xbox, or others. Just this composite NES.

Any ideas?

I was informed back around May that the 1.2 card was scheduled to debut around now...along with the new AM/FM/HD/XM card (which did just start shipping) and a third card, whose function now escapes my addled brain. And no, I don't want a 1.2 card (as a dealer AND consumer) and then have to deal with a 1.3 card down the road. Frankly, I don't need it and my clients don't need it at present. What we WILL really want is a 1.3 card! I use iLink for the multichannel audio (including SACD and DVD-Audio) and it works just wonderfully.

What will 1.2 give me that iLink doesn't? If I need the audio to travel via HDMI to a TV (why would I wanna do that?), that works now. I can understand some of you eager to get it, but I don't know the logistics of how they plan to handle the new card. Will all new AVR's of the Onkyo marque come with the 1.3 card pre-installed?? The Integra and IR product are "Built-to-order", so we specify what mix of cards we want. I don't have these answers.

As to the R&D, you might be surprised at how many products are developed and never come to market! As for developing the 1.2 card vs. 1.3, I don't think that development is wasted, they just need the 1.3 chipsets which aren't shipping until 2007...they can probably use the same design, otherwise.

Eric

What will 1.2 give me that iLink doesn't?

I don't know, but maybe the ability to use my HD-DVD player & Blu-ray player w/the receiver the way they should be used to get the BEST sound...having the audio through the HDMI so I can get TrueHD & uncompressed PCM sound is the way it should be for a receiver that has HDMI switching capability. I honestly wish it was DVI, then it woujldn't get as annoyed than basically having a crippled ver. of HDMI

This HDMI card is vaporware, pure & simple...by next year, there will refinements to 1.3 (either 1.3a, 1.4, etc) that will be what we REALLY want, right Eric? As a consumer, I want what was promised UPGRADEABILITY (In practice, not theory)
Then, they won't have to put out the 1.3 card & can start on the B.S. for the next card :rolleyes:

~Vince

What will 1.2 give me that iLink doesn't?

I don't know, but maybe the ability to use my HD-DVD player & Blu-ray player w/the receiver the way they should used...having the audio through the HDMI so I can get TrueHD & uncompressed PCM sound the way it should be

This HDMI card is vaporware, pure & simple...by next year, there will refinements to 1.3 (either 1.3a, 1.4, etc) that will be what we REALLY want, right Eric? As a consumer, I want what was promised UPGRADEABILITY (In practice, not theory)
Then, they won't have to put out the 1.3 card & can start on the B.S. for the next card :rolleyes:

~Vince



You're going to need a 1.3 card (along with a 1.3 capable HD player) to get all those nice audio formats the way you want them. And 1.3 has all of the capabilities you need for that!

Eric

You're going to need a 1.3 card (along with a 1.3 capable HD player) to get all those nice audio formats the way you want them.

Eric


Nope. Incorrect. Not right. Version 1.1 would be sufficient for me. As you you can see, I elaborated on my earlier post...

Man, hear I am giving my opinion to this question in a totally different way than i would have two months ago.

Brogan, I know exactly how you feel. I have been saying the same thing for the last 6 - 10 months. I do agree with EGCarter that this really comes down to the timing of the 1.3 chipsets. Personally though, if onkyo says 8 months until they can get their hands on the chips, then yes i do believe they should put a 1.2 card out. Whenever an electronics company estimates a timeframe, you can automatically factor in a multiple of 1.5 to the timeframe. Now if the could get the chipsets in 2-3 months than i would agree that they should wait. It really depends on realistically, how soon 1.3 will be available and actually in onkyo's manufacturing plants.

I do not agree though with the philosophy that if a technology is on the horizon, that we should wait. We didn't get a 1.1 card because 1.2 was coming out. We haven't got a 1.2 card because 1.3 is coming out. Unfortunately, Onkyo has fiddled around so long that we are actually near the release of 1.3 so we can't cry over spilled milk at this point. The fact of the matter is though, that if 1.3 comes out, they better have an upgrade card ready and released within a month of obtaining the earliest shipments of chipsets. Otherwise, they will mess around long enough that 1.4 will be a reality and we will never see an upgrade.

I also agree that 1.3 is probably more just a chipset upgrade and that they could probably use any current design for 1.2 and just add the new chipset in. Also though, i am not an engineer though so who knows.

The bottom line is that I would rather be in the situation of constant upgrade cards being released and me angry that they just outdated my card i just bought, rather than bitching about never seeing any cards.

can anyone help with my previous post about the NES?

...snip...


The bottom line is that I would rather be in the situation of constant upgrade cards being released and me angry that they just outdated my card i just bought, rather than bitching about never seeing any cards.


The logistics of having a constant upgrade of cards is rather untenable and a nightmare. That will never happen, thank goodness!

You guys are just speaking like Kids in Candy Stores! Not a way to run an enterprise. Onkyo reps told me last year that they decided to wait until this whole HDMI mess settled down, which I think it's doing. The Onkyo/Integra/IR products were the first on the market with HDMI and transcoding (other guys like Denon have just introduced HDMI transcoding)...they were originally about to ship in April 2004, but that was delayed for about 7 months due to major firmware issues. If you keep your collective Shirt on, I'll have more info at CEDIA Expo. Please don't talk about Vaporware...after all, they have never officially announced anything. Maybe I'll stop giving you guys inside info...

Eric

Egcarter, your inputs are appreciated, but
dealer threats don't mean anything.
Any info you have will most likely be presented to this forum by someone. I am not trying to make you feel unappreciated, but most dealers do not have anything in terms of info that the customers have not snooped out online. There's twice as many dealers willing to blab as there are those who will keep info to themselves. It's all part of that currying favor and good guy image thing.
It's a numbers thing and there are a lot of us looking for info.
It's just how it is.

Maybe it would be more constructive if we suggested some questions for which Eric might get answers at cedia. Here's mine...

1) Is the new HDMI card based on the 1.3 standard?
2) Time frame for availability?
3) Number of inputs?
4) With the release of the HDMI 1.3 card will there also be a corresponding processor firmware upgrade that will support native decoding of the new sound formats associated with HD DVD & BD (i.e., DD+, Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD, DTS-HD Master)?
5) Will the new HDMI 1.3 card and associated processor firmware upgrade also support the legacy high-resolution audio formats DVD-A & SACD transmitted natively and decoded in the processor?
6) Which models will get the firmware upgrade (e.g., RDC-7.1)?

Egcarter, your inputs are appreciated, but
dealer threats don't mean anything.
Any info you have will most likely be presented to this forum by someone. I am not trying to make you feel unappreciated, but most dealers do not have anything in terms of info that the customers have not snooped out online. There's twice as many dealers willing to blab as there are those who will keep info to themselves. It's all part of that currying favor and good guy image thing.
It's a numbers thing and there are a lot of us looking for info.
It's just how it is.

I've been around here for quite awhile and I have yet to see another dealer pipe up with info.

Eric

Maybe it would be more constructive if we suggested some questions for which Eric might get answers at cedia. Here's mine...

1) Is the new HDMI card based on the 1.3 standard?
2) Time frame for availability?
3) Number of inputs?
4) With the release of the HDMI 1.3 card will there also be a corresponding processor firmware upgrade that will support native decoding of the new sound formats associated with HD DVD & BD (i.e., DD+, Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD, DTS-HD Master)?
5) Will the new HDMI 1.3 card and associated processor firmware upgrade also support the legacy high-resolution audio formats DVD-A & SACD transmitted natively and decoded in the processor?
6) Which models will get the firmware upgrade (e.g., RDC-7.1)?


After CEDIA Expo I'll have more info, maybe not totally definitive... Please realize that I probably want these things MORE than you guys, after all I have the equipment, plus I have many clients' systems to consider... and I've been after them for quite a while about these things.

I'm sure DVD-A and SACD will continue to operate...HDMI 1.3 supports them, after all.

Their cards always work on all of the card-based product (TX-NR1000/5000/DTR-10.5/RDC7.1)


Eric

And no, I don't want a 1.2 card (as a dealer AND consumer) and then have to deal with a 1.3 card down the road. Frankly, I don't need it and my clients don't need it at present. What we WILL really want is a 1.3 card! I use iLink for the multichannel audio (including SACD and DVD-Audio) and it works just wonderfully.

Eric,

I'm with you 100%. I myself don't care at all about HDMI 1.2, I too don't have any use for it and if they were to release an HDMI 1.2 card I wouldn't buy it. HDMI 1.3, that's the one I really want.

R

Eric,
My post reads badly, but my point was that it's unfortunate, but I rarely see posters thank company reps or dealers, so I would not expect it.
I always think of DenonJeff and how he almost got run out of here.
I was trying to point out that it's a mostly thankless voluntary job/task.

I hope that reads better.
BTW, thanks.

I think waiting for 1.3 is the right thing to do, but they should tell somebody that.
It's a pretty elite group of people that have these receivers and they deserve better communication.

Egcarter, your inputs are appreciated, but
dealer threats don't mean anything.
Any info you have will most likely be presented to this forum by someone.

That's simply not true, Eric's the only reliable source of info we've got. I myself greatly appreciate what he's doing.

R

I just would like AUDIO with my HDMI inputs on the TX1000. At this point I really don't care which version it is. Any with sound would be a MIRACLE! :eek:

What will 1.2 give me that iLink doesn't?

A much bigger selection of DVD players to chose from. There are lot more DVD players made with HDMI to chose from, than there are with i-Link.

The logistics of having a constant upgrade of cards is rather untenable and a nightmare. That will never happen, thank goodness!


Constant? Constant!! Are you serious? I want 1!!!!! I can assure you that I want an upgrade to the HDMI card more than you do. I'll take anything at all more than I have now. It's the one weak link in a very strong chain. But what a weakness.
And Eric, if we're gonna have a dialogue, like adults, I would appreciate you don't "threaten" to stop giving people here updates that evidently they appreciate...i'll be happy to keep my opinions to myself, if it's a problem for you...

Johnla,
I was actually quoting Eric there, but thanks anyway...


~Vince

ANy HDMI card update would be appreciated. Atleast it would show Onkyo is doing something. I don't care about the other cards they are doing first. I am sure there are a select group of people that like the new cards but for the masses we want (need) a newer HDMI card. :confused:

Eric,

I'm with you 100%. I myself don't care at all about HDMI 1.2, I too don't have any use for it and if they were to release an HDMI 1.2 card I wouldn't buy it. HDMI 1.3, that's the one I really want.

R

A 1.3 card by itself won't give you anything that a 1.2 card can't give you. 1.3 supports the newer HD codecs, but there aren't any players that output those codecs and there may never be because the new HD formats pretty much require the player to do the decoding and even a 1.1 card could handle the multichannel PCM output.

Even if the player could output one of the new codecs the DSPs in the receiver would need an upgrade to support those codecs or the 1.3 card would be useless.

The other new features of 1.3 like increased color depth are only useful for video processors and displays. None of the HD formats use the extra color depth so the only way to make use of it is for a video processor to interpolate the extra color depth. Even then most displays couldn't display the extra color depth even if they had HDMI 1.3 inputs.

--
Steve

Which is why I would like ANY new HDMI card. Come on Onkyo, throw us a freakin bone... :D

Eric: Could you ask the Onkyo reps. if they plan on implementing Audessey technology into the software of the TX nr1000? I have concerns as to whether the current processor is up to the task of being able to handle some of the currently discussed upgradeability paths. I am actually surprised that Onkyo didn't make more of an effort at resolving heat disappacion issues in this receiver knowing that this can effect the chipsets in the processor.

As to the R&D, you might be surprised at how many products are developed and never come to market! As for developing the 1.2 card vs. 1.3, I don't think that development is wasted, they just need the 1.3 chipsets which aren't shipping until 2007...they can probably use the same design, otherwise.

Eric
Fair enough Eric ;If they can amortise the 1.2 development into the 1.3 all the better.I just like kanefskys logic about 1.1- Doesnt really matter where the lpcm is decoded ;Its all ones and zeros as far as Im concerned. :)

I guess I can live with that al long as they do not release a TX2000 and forget about the cards... :eek:

I guess I can live with that al long as they do not release a TX2000 and forget about the cards... :eek:


I could actually live w/that, if there was a decent trade in program :D

Eric: Could you ask the Onkyo reps. if they plan on implementing Audessey technology into the software of the TX nr1000? I have concerns as to whether the current processor is up to the task of being able to handle some of the currently discussed upgradeability paths. I am actually surprised that Onkyo didn't make more of an effort at resolving heat disappacion issues in this receiver knowing that this can effect the chipsets in the processor.

The required hardware is not present (Unless you consider dropping Zone 2 in which case it might be possible but why would they pay a license fee so you can get a free upgrade?). A new DSP board and firmware at $1000ish might be a possibility though.

I bought my TX-NR1000 new about 10 months ago and have had these problems since day 1. The first problem has to do with the volume control. It is extremely slow to respond, and when the volume is down low, only the left front or right front speaker will come on. This is in a 7.1 setup. As the volume is turned up, there is initially no response, but after a delay of 10 to 30 seconds, the other speakers turn on - the sound is usually too high now. Also, when I go to the level calibration sub-menu the speakers are also slow to turn on as I switch from one to the other. And, during this calibration, the left side speaker only comes on about 5 % of the time. Sometimes I can't get it to come on at all. Anyone have any idea? I have the latest firmware that was posted on this forum, so that shouldn't be the problem. I'm about to give up on Onkyo and switch to Denon.

Try a hard reset (Hold down standby and video 1 together), you will lose your settings. Otherwise, what firmware do you have?

Try a hard reset (Hold down standby and video 1 together), you will lose your settings. Otherwise, what firmware do you have?


Firmware version is 1.09. It did the same thing with the prior two firmware versions. Hard reset didn't help.

I would be extremely pissed after spending $3,000+ on the receiver 1 yr ago brand new only to have Onkyo turn around & release a new player that comes with all the new HD connectors & Codes & DSP!

The reason I made this big investment was for the fact that this receiver was the 1st Modular receiver with future proof. Yet this whole time & Onkyo has yet to release any significant upgrade cards for the TXNR1000!

I don't care if right now no HD DVD player isn't supporting the new HD Codes or HDMI 1.3, it's still no excuse for not wanting Onkyo to release the Cards that do!

I want to be able to have my receiver support the new HD DSP & Codes, as well as the new HDMI 1.3 standard. I hope Onkyo hasn't abandoned us already?

The logistics of having a constant upgrade of cards is rather untenable and a nightmare. That will never happen, thank goodness!

You guys are just speaking like Kids in Candy Stores! Not a way to run an enterprise. Onkyo reps told me last year that they decided to wait until this whole HDMI mess settled down, which I think it's doing. The Onkyo/Integra/IR products were the first on the market with HDMI and transcoding (other guys like Denon have just introduced HDMI transcoding)...they were originally about to ship in April 2004, but that was delayed for about 7 months due to major firmware issues. If you keep your collective Shirt on, I'll have more info at CEDIA Expo. Please don't talk about Vaporware...after all, they have never officially announced anything. Maybe I'll stop giving you guys inside info...

Eric

First of all, I wasn't talking about releasing an upgrade every five minutes. What i was talking about was the fact that no upgrades have been released and i would rather buy a 1.2 card and then find out five months later that the 1.3 card was just released. Reason being is that I understand that technology is constantly progressing and that any electronic piece you buy has the potentital to be upgraded / made obselete. I would much rather see the progression of technology take place than see it stand still. If onkyo released a 1.2 card for hdmi back when it debuted or as soon as onkyo would be able to design and manufacture, this board would only have about 50 posts vs the hundreds its has now.

I also think that everyone on this board understands that technology will better itself and would not be angry to see a 1.3 card be released a year later. This is what we paid for.

Further, i don't understand how upgrades would be "untenable and a nightmare." Everyone on this board owns a computer in which there are almost limitless options to upgrade sounds cards, video cards, etc. At one point the video card industry was releasing new technologies every six months. Any computer enthusiast knows they are not required to buy these new cards, but if they want the best at least it is available. With this receiver so far, we have been left out of two versions of hdmi upgrades. I can just see hdmi 1.3 becoming available but onkyo holds out for 1.4. As long as the technology works, release the card and let the consumers decide. Any person spending $5000 on a receiver should be well aware of how technology works and be prepared for change. Heck, I am just glad that i can upgrade the receiver rather than having to buy another $5000 receiver just to get the latest technology. Onkyo just needs to come through with their promise of a "future proof" receiver.

I think onkyo has built a great product and i have given up on a 1.2 hdmi release as it seems Onkyo would rather play it safe. I am just hoping that 1.3 does not also pass us by as well.

Onkyo will have to release an upgrade card, the recent rise off HD Players needing HDMI 1.1+ for Lossless audio means they wont sell many more without HDMI 1.1 or higher.

Firmware version is 1.09. It did the same thing with the prior two firmware versions. Hard reset didn't help.

Sounds Like a faulty reciever, I would return it.

Onkyo will have to release an upgrade card, the recent rise off HD Players needing HDMI 1.1+ for Lossless audio means they wont sell many more without HDMI 1.1 or higher.



I wish to God this was true...but they haven't supported it up until this point, which leaves me to believe that it won't be supported at all...if they had put out a 1.1 card months ago, I could totally understand waiting til 1.3 for a followup...but to expect everyone who has this receiver to to basically sit on their hands for another year waiting to see what they want to do is just really insulting...if they were really worried about what their customers thought, we would've had an updated card or at least some real info on the status of a new HDMI card...or as I like to call it, vaporware :)

Historically Onkyo have been pretty good with upgrades the old 989 never claimed to be upgadeable but they offered two upgrades anyway. What is important is they only tend to release updates when they release supporting hardware, I still think an HDMI 1.3 card, new DSP board with Audyssey and HD format decode and an Onkyo HD player with HDMI 1.3 out all in one go is the most likely. We have seen two new radio cards since release but this is likely because they are not reliant on any other compnent up stream of them.

Historically Onkyo have been pretty good with upgrades

That's totally false.

R

the old 989 never claimed to be upgadeable

Not true.

R

Ras beat me to it. That is completely false. It's in the manual in print. I was there when my brother purchased the Onkyo 989 after exchanging his HK unit. The Onkyo "Rep" told him about how it was upgradeable into the future and the firewire upgrade never happened. The DPLII upgrade ok. Everything since then was stupid priced and showed how Onkyo has no problem screwing their customers. They even gave us trouble with their faulty fan. They tried to charge us for getting it changed.
The same **** happened with my Parent's Mistubishi and their "promise."
They all lie and should be taken to court for it.

I am really curious to see if history repeats itself with the TXNR1000.

So far it has... :mad:

Further, i don't understand how upgrades would be "untenable and a nightmare." Everyone on this board owns a computer in which there are almost limitless options to upgrade sounds cards, video cards, etc. At one point the video card industry

..snip...

Yes, the video card INDUSTRY...not one company. And I do believe that the computer industry is a might higher volume one than specialty A/V.

Eric

Nobody install the new firmware 2.x ?
It's not vaporware, it's reality ! "The new Net-Tune firmware is now available for the card-based family." wrote Egcarter on 9/6/2006

Have you upgraded ?
Improvement to play WMA files created by Windows Media Player 10 => what's your feeling ?
The radio station reception rate of the Internet radio has improved => what's your feeling ?

Talking about future needs like HDMI is good. Live in the present is wonderful :cool:

Xavier

maybe someone will have some new info at cedia this week.

Sounds Like a faulty reciever, I would return it.

I took it into a Service Center. Let's see how it comes back.

did anyone get the XM card yet? if so, can you install it or do you HAVE to bring it in? I think if I update something on the receiver, it might make me feel better about it :(


~Vince

EGcarter,

I value your input on this board very much but i do disagree with you on this issue of upgradeability. Yes I said video card industry, but you can look at all the major manufacturers of those video cards (or sound cards, modems, etc...) and with every new generation of technology, almost every manufacturer produced one to three different versions of the new generation technology and marketted it in different fashions

Onkyo, as a single company, has not even produced one version of the latest hdmi technology since its original inclusion in the product. Much like the video card technology, the core is provided and they implement it into their own system.

We can argue all day about this, but the bottom line is onkyo promised upgradeability. I gaurantee that hdmi will continue to develop at this rate for some time and if onkyo continues to wait this out, then we will never see upgrade cards.

I go back to my statement i made a couple posts back. If Onkyo has a 1.2 card ready and 1.3 is not going to be available for anything close to a year or more, then they should release the card. We paid to upgrade as new technologies became available that would benefit the end user willing to pay for them. As many on here have enumerated, there are enhancements with the new hdmi technologies that add options to the receiver. Anyone willing to pay for them should be able to based on onkyo's "committment" to a future proof receiver.

I think this comes down more to onkyo as a company not having the right size and structure to deliver on their promises. It could be that they don't have enough staff, resources, or money to be producing these upgrades. None the less, it is not the consumers problem but onkyo's and excuses will not get anything done.

That's totally false.

R


For their market they have been good, competing products from Pioneer and Yamaha for example hardly ever saw any upgrades (Pioneer 1 and Yam 0) and I know from personal experience that Pioneer does not offer even firmware upgrades at all. It's not fair to compare the Onkyo to much more expensive brands like Merdian, and I dont know of any other reciever in the price band that recieved better upgrade support than the Onkyo.

Comparing to the computer industry which likely has 10000 times the installed base of computers with PCI-E/AGP slots compared to Onkyo recievers is Apples to Oranges.

Nobody install the new firmware 2.x ?
Have been running 2.0 for a while.

Pioneer and Yamaha for example hardly ever saw any upgrades (Pioneer 1 and Yam 0) and I know from personal experience that Pioneer does not offer even firmware upgrades at all.


That's funny, seeing as how I personally know that Pioneer and Yamaha has had some firmware upgrades for their DVD players, and I also think that Pioneer had some for a few of their AVR's. Now granted they were not ever provided as "user" install firmware upgrades, in that they were supposed to have been done only by a Pioneer or Yamaha service center, but they were still firmware upgrades. And as for the DVD player firmware upgrades, I even managed to get hold of the files and I did it myself on the Pioneer 636. And I did the same thing with my Yamaha S2500 DVD player, I obtained the file and did that myself also.

I had an Pioneer AX10I, RS232 Power signalling and compatiblity with other brands of I-Link player had severe problems, they knew of both issues only 6 months after release but refused to offer a firmware upgrade. Was referring only to receivers in my comment above.

Interesting... Integra have released a Tuner that uses the TX-NR1000 tuner modules:
http://www.gspr.com/integra/tun37.html

I had an Pioneer AX10I, RS232 Power signalling and compatiblity with other brands of I-Link player had severe problems, they knew of both issues only 6 months after release but refused to offer a firmware upgrade. Was referring only to receivers in my comment above.
I think the Pioneer 74TXi receiver, had some sort of issue when it first came out that was fixed with a firmware upgrade that could only be done by a service center.

"Comparing to the computer industry which likely has 10000 times the installed base of computers with PCI-E/AGP slots compared to Onkyo recievers is Apples to Oranges."



If by an apples to orange comparison, you mean that it would only be harder for the computer industry to accomplish this task vs. onkyo then i would accept that. This being due to the fact that there are many more configurations and set ups to accomodate for a computer parts manufacturer. Companies like Nvidia design graphics cards for two different standards of slots, AGP and PCI-Express, which you mentioned. They also have to design many of their components to interact with computers that are many years old and have differing operating systems. The computer industry is much more complex which makes any excuse onkyo offers even more rediculous since they are only designing this card for the TX-NR1000 of which they built.

Its Apples to Oranges because the market for the upgrade cards is far smaller for Onkyo, they may have control of it but there simply is not enough demand for 2 or 3 upgrades a year as is seen from ATI + NVIDIA. Onkyo are not a charity, they wont aim to release products unless they see likely profit. That is why I still think we will see an HDMI 1.3 and DSP board together as an upgrade and the upgraded products being called V2 or whatever.

Vid Card manufacturers work to some fairly well defined standards and compatibility is more an issue with games than other hardware nowadays (At least for Home Users). I work in computing and I get beta pre release products from Tyan at work so I know all about compatibility issues, PCI-E has been very stable for Vid cards, even the likes of Serverworks got it right first time.

Krobar,

I disagree with almost all those points but i don't want to take this thread any further away from its purpose. I think its great that we have such an active group here and I am glad we can all discuss these things.

Just to clarify, I do love the TX-NR1000. Right now I am still very happy with my purchase and the top notch quality of this machine. The thing is built like a rock and I have had no problems with it. I think this is the reason that this issue of upgradeability worries me so much. I have accepted Onkyo whole heartedly and I don't want to be disappointed.

To me though, this issue is as simple as the way Onkyo marketed this receiver. It is "future proof" and upgradeable. HDMI 1.2 was released 13 months ago and gives functionallity that many on this board have said they would like to have yet we have seen no upgrade cards from Onkyo.

My biggest "want" from Onkyo is to have more HDMI ports and the ability to send a full surround signal through the cable as well. Their track record so far with any sort of upgrades does worry me. These machines are "futureproof" but that won't last forever. Sooner or later technology will outgrow the basic functionallity of this machine and those technologies will not be able to be integrated into this unit. I just pray that Onkyo does not leave us out in the cold.


*** I guess I should not say I have not had any problems. My Nintendo from 1985 has troubles displaying a video signal to my projector when upconverted to HDMI. Does anyone have any idea why this problem occurs? It is a composite signal being upconverted. It displays perfectly when connected directly to the projector.

Remember all those ads? The receiver Nostradamus would get... Well, so far he would not have since there has not been any HDMI cards being offered. And in the ad it shows a HDMI card coming out... If they finally release a new HDMI card then maybe the ads aren't BS... Of course if they never do... :mad:

they actually reference an hdmi upgrade being available in the future in the ad?

No, they show a HDMI card coming out or going in. This ad has been in almost every magazine (WSR, HT, TPV)...

oh, alright. I have seen the picture of the hdmi card sitting on top of the unit. I about died in finding out that onkyo may be so close to releasing a card that they included it in their advertisements!

I am really hoping for the best here at Cedia. Please bring good news!

I am going to their booth real soon... Hopefully I will have some good news! :)

don't leave til you pry it out of them or steal one of their notebooks that has all the pertinent information :)

Hopefully Cedia won't be the unveiling of the new TX-NR1001! J/k

Krobar,

I disagree with almost all those points but i don't want to take this thread any further away from its purpose. I think its great that we have such an active group here and I am glad we can all discuss these things.

Just to clarify, I do love the TX-NR1000. Right now I am still very happy with my purchase and the top notch quality of this machine. The thing is built like a rock and I have had no problems with it. I think this is the reason that this issue of upgradeability worries me so much. I have accepted Onkyo whole heartedly and I don't want to be disappointed.

To me though, this issue is as simple as the way Onkyo marketed this receiver. It is "future proof" and upgradeable. HDMI 1.2 was released 13 months ago and gives functionallity that many on this board have said they would like to have yet we have seen no upgrade cards from Onkyo.

My biggest "want" from Onkyo is to have more HDMI ports and the ability to send a full surround signal through the cable as well. Their track record so far with any sort of upgrades does worry me. These machines are "futureproof" but that won't last forever. Sooner or later technology will outgrow the basic functionallity of this machine and those technologies will not be able to be integrated into this unit. I just pray that Onkyo does not leave us out in the cold.


*** I guess I should not say I have not had any problems. My Nintendo from 1985 has troubles displaying a video signal to my projector when upconverted to HDMI. Does anyone have any idea why this problem occurs? It is a composite signal being upconverted. It displays perfectly when connected directly to the projector.

I'm in an argumentative type state of mind, I think it has come from people having ridiculing me for taking part in both Bluray and HDDVD forums without taking too much of a side, feels like school. PC tech is a sidetrack which is why I never understood the initial comparison. I have faith that Onkyo will release a significant upgrade when the supporting components are ready. What I really want is a combo Blu/HDDVD player with I-Link from Onkyo so I dont have to bother upgrading my RDC-7.1 at all.

The word from the Integra product manager is that they did develop the HDMI 1.2 card but decided not to release it due to all of the HDMI hub-bub and other new developments. They will issue an HDMI 1.3 card next year. No details of how many ports in/out. The Aussie distribas were there with me chatting with him and they requested 4 in/2 out...but we have no idea what the configuration will ultimately be. It was said that going to 1.3 is not a difficult task from the 1.2-based card...they just need the darn silicon! As for a room-EQ card, apparently that's not possible because the Audyssey system needs to be integrated with the DSP, which isn't on the card.

The new TUN-3.7 tuner which was introduced at the show actually uses one of the tuner cards from the card-based receivers (either the C-AMFM card or the new C-HDXM card).

As for Blu-Ray and/or HD-DVD...the jury is still out. Onkyo will likely introduce one or the other (or both), but not a combo player. As for iLink? It's technically possible...it has more than sufficient bandwidth...but it was said that HDMI has become the industry data transport mechanism of choice.



Eric

What I really want is a combo Blu/HDDVD player with I-Link from Onkyo so I dont have to bother upgrading my RDC-7.1 at all.
When I suggested a HD/BLU player with i-link in a forum down here Krobar; I was told that as HDMI had hdcp i-link would be ignored.How robust is the A and M protocol that i-link has?

The pictures Ive seen of Samsung and Toshiba HD recorders have 2 i-link ports each -possibly in/out for daisy chaining???? :)

Ras beat me to it. That is completely false. It's in the manual in print. I was there when my brother purchased the Onkyo 989 after exchanging his HK unit. The Onkyo "Rep" told him about how it was upgradeable into the future and the firewire upgrade never happened. The DPLII upgrade ok. Everything since then was stupid priced and showed how Onkyo has no problem screwing their customers. They even gave us trouble with their faulty fan. They tried to charge us for getting it changed.
The same **** happened with my Parent's Mistubishi and their "promise."
They all lie and should be taken to court for it.

I am really curious to see if history repeats itself with the TXNR1000.

I'm not familiar with the "fan" issue. What was the problem, and what model(s) did it affect?

For their market they have been good, competing products from Pioneer and Yamaha for example hardly ever saw any upgrades (Pioneer 1 and Yam 0) and I know from personal experience that Pioneer does not offer even firmware upgrades at all. It's not fair to compare the Onkyo to much more expensive brands like Merdian, and I dont know of any other reciever in the price band that recieved better upgrade support than the Onkyo.

Comparing to the computer industry which likely has 10000 times the installed base of computers with PCI-E/AGP slots compared to Onkyo recievers is Apples to Oranges.

Nobody install the new firmware 2.x ?
Have been running 2.0 for a while.

Where can I get the firmware? It is not downloadable form the Onkyo site?

The word from the Integra product manager is that they did develop the HDMI 1.2 card but decided not to release it due to all of the HDMI hub-bub and other new developments. They will issue an HDMI 1.3 card next year. No details of how many ports in/out. The Aussie distribas were there with me chatting with him and they requested 4 in/2 out...but we have no idea what the configuration will ultimately be. It was said that going to 1.3 is not a difficult task from the 1.2-based card...they just need the darn silicon! As for a room-EQ card, apparently that's not possible because the Audyssey system needs to be integrated with the DSP, which isn't on the card.

The new TUN-3.7 tuner which was introduced at the show actually uses one of the tuner cards from the card-based receivers (either the C-AMFM card or the new C-HDXM card).

As for Blu-Ray and/or HD-DVD...the jury is still out. Onkyo will likely introduce one or the other (or both), but not a combo player. As for iLink? It's technically possible...it has more than sufficient bandwidth...but it was said that HDMI has become the industry data transport mechanism of choice.



Eric

The DSPs are on an internal removable card (Not for user upgrade). If you replaced the main DSP card, then I'm sire Audyssey support could be added.

Eric: Is there not a proprietary connector/terminal in the back of the receiver at the upper left section? Quote: "This terminal is provded for future service enhancement and is not used currently." Could not Onkyo create an outboard brain to deal with the extra processing needed for 1.3 hdmi and Audessey as well and, relieve the congestion of parts inside the receiver as well as making for a cooler respository for the processing chipsets. Could you please relay this idea to the Onko reps. It seems obvious and an inexpensive option. In fact, the idea of adding outboard modules may be a way for Onkyo to realize an enhanced revenue stream in that they keep those product purchasers in the upgrade path and helping absorb new development costs in technology. It increases maket share by increasing buyer commitment and loyalty to the product. It lowers advertising costs (happy customers say good things) and new products can continue to be created as new enhancements are enriched enough to warrent a new endproduct. Think of the module concept as what was envisioned with 1394 connectivity.

Where can I get the firmware? It is not downloadable form the Onkyo site?

Not anymore because some customers unplugged the machines during upgrade and damaged them :rolleyes:

Your dealer should be able to provide you with the upgrade, they all have access to a dealer secure area to download firmware upgrades as they become available.

When I suggested a HD/BLU player with i-link in a forum down here Krobar; I was told that as HDMI had hdcp i-link would be ignored.How robust is the A and M protocol that i-link has?

The pictures Ive seen of Samsung and Toshiba HD recorders have 2 i-link ports each -possibly in/out for daisy chaining???? :)

The ports on the recorders are for DV Video, not audio. Eric is completely right that there is no technical reason why I-Link cannot be use on Blu or HDDVD players. I-Link uses DTCP encryption which is approved by the AACS (As HDCP is) and has even more bandwith than HDMI.

The ports on the recorders are for DV Video, not audio. Eric is completely right that there is no technical reason why I-Link cannot be use on Blu or HDDVD players. I-Link uses DTCP encryption which is approved by the AACS (As HDCP is) and has even more bandwith than HDMI.
Thanks Krobar ;I certainly hope i-link continues.I remember a long time ago when Onkyo announced they were going to do a sdi conversion of their dvd player and werent phased by Hollywoods attitude.To bad nothing came of this :)

I'm not familiar with the "fan" issue. What was the problem, and what model(s) did it affect?

The fan on the 989 before the V2.0 models was on 24/7 and was very loud. We had our unit in a large enclosed cabinet and you could still hear it w/i 1 seconds of turning on. Airflow was not the issue, b/c it did it outside the cabinet. Many 989 users had their units fixed.

I wonder if you guys can take Onkyo to court if they have lesser upgrades than expected.
I think it's just a wait and see thing. The 1000 needs Auto EQ and HDMI 1.1-3 switching to be up to date w/ other flagship units. 4 in 1 out.

The word from the Integra product manager is that they did develop the HDMI 1.2 card but decided not to release it due to all of the HDMI hub-bub and other new developments. They will issue an HDMI 1.3 card next year. No details of how many ports in/out. The Aussie distribas were there with me chatting with him and they requested 4 in/2 out...but we have no idea what the configuration will ultimately be. It was said that going to 1.3 is not a difficult task from the 1.2-based card...they just need the darn silicon!


Eric

Well, I hope when they say next year they mean first or second quarter and not fourth quarter 2007. That is really good news that they can keep their current design which is what i was assuming. I just hope they can get their hands on the 1.3 chipsets and get these cards rolling as I will soon run out of hdmi ports as soon as the xbox releases its hd dvd player and goes to hdmi.

Thanks as always Eric.

There is an interesting interview/article on Onkyo in UK mag HCC this month. It talks about the dieing market of Hifi and their shift to networked home entertainment but there are more interesting things mentioned. Their Hifi PC the HDC-7 is very interesting and their is a pic of a Hifi Media PC preamp with huge matching poweramp.

Back to the relevant stuff though, they show the DAB upgrade for the modular recievers (TX-NR5000E in UK) and reiterate their comittment to more upgrades, the next one being a new HDMI module.

As for HD Disc spinners; Kengo Iwasaki freely admitted their was no rush to bring out new Integra Research products. He also said, "We are watching what's happening in the high definition market: Blu-ray, HD DVD and the HD audio formats from Dolby and DTS. We wont launch anything new for a couple of years..." Before people start saying that only applies to IR products, Onkyos flagship products are joined at the hip with the Integra Research ones.

Not anymore because some customers unplugged the machines during upgrade and damaged them :rolleyes:

Your dealer should be able to provide you with the upgrade, they all have access to a dealer secure area to download firmware upgrades as they become available.

I purchased from Crutchfield because there are no Onkyo dealers in my area that carry the higher end products. I paid top dollar as Crutchfield does not really discount their merchandise. Any suggestions as to where I can get software updates for my TX-NR1000 and my DV-SP1000?

I am also looking for legitimate files as opposed to just downloading from a server somewhere where I have no way of knowing if the software has been modified.

Why are the files available for some receiver on the Onkyo website, but not for others? They all carry the warning that if power is lost, the unit will have to be repaired :confused:

Thanks!

I can send you 1.09 for the TX-NR1000 if you wish. Does your SP1000 need the upgrade, what is its version?

Just thought I'd mention that the Aus distributors that Eric spoke with are Ambertech.com.au. I sent them an email a month ago asking for multiple hdmi ports - didnt get an answer but maybe emailing the American distributors could help possibly. ;)

I can send you 1.09 for the TX-NR1000 if you wish. Does your SP1000 need the upgrade, what is its version?

Thank you for the offer, but I actually received 1.09 from Onkyo a long time ago.

I think I may be a bit confused, which is not a surprise :p What is the latest firmware for the NR1000? The SP1000? I know that's another thread, but to simplify things, I'll ask here.

Is there a difference between the Net Tune upgrade currently available, and the main software ("The Firmware") for the NR1000?

Thanks for your help!

Yes, AFAIK the Nettune firmware is serperate.

The latest firmware I know of is 2.00 (Which was intalled when the UK service center upgraded mine), others may have newer but the last public release was 1.09. Its debatable if 2.00 would be of any use to you anyway since it only adds support for the new tuner cards (And possibly other future cards).

Yes, AFAIK the Nettune firmware is serperate.

The latest firmware I know of is 2.00 (Which was intalled when the UK service center upgraded mine), others may have newer but the last public release was 1.09. Its debatable if 2.00 would be of any use to you anyway since it only adds support for the new tuner cards (And possibly other future cards).

Can I purchase the tuner card, as a consumer in the US, and do a self-install? This is the only way I'd buy it. It would have to be brand new and factory sealed too.

I definitely won't buy it if I have to lug my unit to a service center, and there's no way I am shipping it again. I was lucky it arrived in great shape, but that was only because Onkyo had the foresight to pack the unit in two boxes. I don't have the outer box anymore, and it was pretty banged up from it's trip (only a couple of states away from me).

Do you know why I can't download the Net Tune upgrade available here (under Net Tune firmware upgrades). (http://www.us.onkyo.com/download/software.cfm) It gives the warning that all models will be rendered useless if you unplug it, or lose power, during upgrade, so I want to know what is different about the NR1000? I realize that you are not sure, and can't speak for Onkyo, so please don't take offense to my anger: It's not directed at you :) But, if you have an answer, I'd love to hear it ;)

Just thought I'd mention that the Aus distributors that Eric spoke with are Ambertech.com.au. I sent them an email a month ago asking for multiple hdmi ports - didnt get an answer but maybe emailing the American distributors could help possibly. ;)

I am going to go out out on a limb here, and make a prediction: The new HDMI 1.3 card will have more than two inputs, and use the new, smaller connector defined in the HDMI 1.3 specification.

We'll need conversion cables, but it will be worth it.

I am going to go out out on a limb here, and make a prediction: The new HDMI 1.3 card will have more than two inputs, and use the new, smaller connector defined in the HDMI 1.3 specification.

We'll need conversion cables, but it will be worth it.



Don't count on it.
The smaller connectors are intended for use with portable devices like video camera and still cameras, and are not really for things like DVD players, Tivo's, satellite or cable boxes.

http://hdmi.org/resourcecenter/index.asp

"New mini connector: With small portable devices such as HD camcorders and still cameras demanding seamless connectivity to HDTVs, HDMI 1.3 offers a new, smaller form factor connector option."

Bringing out the new mini connectors for hdmi is the same as when they introduced smaller usb connectors for cameras, etc. They were only introduced because these smaller, portable devices have less surface area to work with and need smaller connectors that don't take up as much space on the outside and the inside. I still believe that they would have no problem getting more then 2 in / 1 out on one of these cards.

What is even more interesting is that I read on the hdmi website that the HDMI folk do not prefer vertically aligned hdmi ports. They have had issues of the cables falling out and moving causing issues with the connection.

I have never had any problems with the vertical hdmi ports on the 1000. Maybe they will realign them in the new hdmi card.

What I am curious about is the type b HDMI 29 pin connector that Wikepedia says is for an expanded video channel.The type a we have now is 19 pins.I worry that 1.3 with its deep colour will need type b - I hope i'm just being paranoid :confused:

I saw references about "we'll find out at CEDIA" but havent read any results. Did anyone find out about HDMI upgrades or any other interesting items at this expo?

I was at the show, I live in Denver, but didn't see Onkyo on the list of exhibiters so I didnt pursue them.

Also, my "switched" electrical outlet is always on with my NR1000. Is there a setting I have missed to make it come on only with the receiver is on?

Thanks!

Scott

Don't count on it.
The smaller connectors are intended for use with portable devices like video camera and still cameras, and are not really for things like DVD players, Tivo's, satellite or cable boxes.

http://hdmi.org/resourcecenter/index.asp

"New mini connector: With small portable devices such as HD camcorders and still cameras demanding seamless connectivity to HDTVs, HDMI 1.3 offers a new, smaller form factor connector option."


Yes, but I don't think that the smaller connector excludes any functionality. It seems that it was introduced so that devices that need smaller connectors now have a standard to follow. The card for the NR1000 would certainly benefit from these smaller connectors.

Bringing out the new mini connectors for hdmi is the same as when they introduced smaller usb connectors for cameras, etc. They were only introduced because these smaller, portable devices have less surface area to work with and need smaller connectors that don't take up as much space on the outside and the inside. I still believe that they would have no problem getting more then 2 in / 1 out on one of these cards.

What is even more interesting is that I read on the hdmi website that the HDMI folk do not prefer vertically aligned hdmi ports. They have had issues of the cables falling out and moving causing issues with the connection.

I have never had any problems with the vertical hdmi ports on the 1000. Maybe they will realign them in the new hdmi card.

My personal opinion is that the HDMI connectors compare to SATA connections: Bad design. They should have a secure locking mechanism. They new "Quick Connect" SATA connectors have them, and are much better. They also have great tactile feedback when they seat properly :)

I agree that it would be a nice feature. Also though, if the back of your receiver is hard to get to, it is nice that the hdmi plugs pop in and out. I don't know how many times i fiddled with a dvi connector trying to unscrew the bolts. Its a little easier with computers since they do not weigh 85 pounds and can be easily moved.

I have never used an sata quick connect, or at least haven't since i built my last computer about 3 years ago for a friend. He did have an sata drive but i can't remember what the connector was like. I will have to check that out.

OT but Ive always liked hotswap sata, its hardly any extra and works great.

I purchased from Crutchfield because there are no Onkyo dealers in my area that carry the higher end products. I paid top dollar as Crutchfield does not really discount their merchandise. Any suggestions as to where I can get software updates for my TX-NR1000 and my DV-SP1000?

I am also looking for legitimate files as opposed to just downloading from a server somewhere where I have no way of knowing if the software has been modified.

Why are the files available for some receiver on the Onkyo website, but not for others? They all carry the warning that if power is lost, the unit will have to be repaired :confused:

Thanks!

The dealers just download the files from a server... why don't you ask Crutchfield? They have terrific support.

The issue with the card-based receivers and firmware upgrades has to do largely with people using computers that go into hiberation/sleep modes after long periods of keyboard inactivity. The update takes about 45 minutes or so and if the computer hibernates, it could very well turn the AVR into a doorstop.

You MUST turn off hibernation on a computer before updating firmware.

Eric

I saw references about "we'll find out at CEDIA" but havent read any results. Did anyone find out about HDMI upgrades or any other interesting items at this expo?

I was at the show, I live in Denver, but didn't see Onkyo on the list of exhibiters so I didnt pursue them.

Also, my "switched" electrical outlet is always on with my NR1000. Is there a setting I have missed to make it come on only with the receiver is on?

Thanks!

Scott

Scott,

Read the thread!

Eric

Can I purchase the tuner card, as a consumer in the US, and do a self-install? This is the only way I'd buy it. It would have to be brand new and factory sealed too.

I definitely won't buy it if I have to lug my unit to a service center, and there's no way I am shipping it again. I was lucky it arrived in great shape, but that was only because Onkyo had the foresight to pack the unit in two boxes. I don't have the outer box anymore, and it was pretty banged up from it's trip (only a couple of states away from me).


I don't see why not. The necessary firmware update is the real issue. But installing the card is a simple, quick operation.



Eric

I don't see why not. The necessary firmware update is the real issue. But installing the card is a simple, quick operation.



Eric

Do you know where I can purchase the card?

Thanks!

Toshibas new HD-DVD player has HDMI 1.3 and comes out in the first week of December. I think that Onkyo is really an old-mans-club like IBM! All 3 years they come out with something great and than they go back to sleep.

I thought it came out in the last week of December. Great if it is the first week! :)

For me that bought mine from the other side of the world from were I live,,
I'd be very very happy if someone..(.,,,??:::;;;,,,,) could pm the updated FW,

And,, no,, my PC won't hibernate,, only me (according to the girlfriend..))!

Can someone post the firmware (2.00) out here?

Also a computer professional and know when I do ANY firmware/BIOS update of ANYTHING I make sure there are no storms in the area or my 6 year old isn't playing with a circuit breaker...

<NOTE:That was just a joke, please don't report me to the Departmant of Child Welfare..>

:p

I dont have 2.00 in software form. Mine was installed by the UK service centre, I assume they made me ship my unit to them because they didnt want the firmware leaked.

Toshibas new HD-DVD player has HDMI 1.3 and comes out in the first week of December. I think that Onkyo is really an old-mans-club like IBM! All 3 years they come out with something great and than they go back to sleep.

The Toshiba HD-XA2 player is scheduled for the end of Dec/beginning of January (more likely the latter).

It uses the HDMI 1.3 TRANSMITTER chipset. AV Receivers require HDMI REPEATER chipset, which won't be shipping until around mid-2007. No receivers (or switchboxes) from anyone will support HDMI 1.3 until then.

Eric

The Toshiba HD-XA2 player is scheduled for the end of Dec/beginning of January (more likely the latter).

It uses the HDMI 1.3 TRANSMITTER chipset. AV Receivers require HDMI REPEATER chipset, which won't be shipping until around mid-2007. No receivers (or switchboxes) from anyone will support HDMI 1.3 until then.

Eric

Thank you for the update, did not know that there is a difference between HDMI chipset. But why would they delay for 1/2 year for the repeater chipset ???
Thought they have to test the transmitter chip against a receiver chip to make sure it works before the release any of them??

Thank you for the update, did not know that there is a difference between HDMI chipset. But why would they delay for 1/2 year for the repeater chipset ???
Thought they have to test the transmitter chip against a receiver chip to make sure it works before the release any of them??


They have probably already designed the chips...they're just not going into mass production until later.

Eric

Man I hate this long wait for upgradeable cards for my Onkyo AVR!

I am not sure Onkyo will ever be able to keep up with newer HDMI specs... :mad:

I am not sure Onkyo will ever be able to keep up with newer HDMI specs... :mad:

As time goes by & nothing new is announced or released by Onkyo, I'm afraid your statement will hold true. :( :mad: :confused: :rolleyes: :cool:

looks like i will have to invest in a switcher tired of waiting
anyone recomending one 4in 1 out.

No AVR manufacturer will have HDMI 1.3 support until around mid-2007. Don't blame the AVR companies...it's due to Silicon Image, the HDMI chipset guys...

Eric

All this time though Onkyo could have had atleast one HDMI upgraded card though. Screw 1.3, what about any newer spec? Nostradamus would have not purchased this unit! :confused:

Oztech, I like Key Digital switchers and also Monoprice's... You can't go wrong with either... ;)

looks like i will have to invest in a switcher tired of waiting
anyone recomending one 4in 1 out.


Gefen 4/1 or 4/2

I would AVOID gefen. They build their HDMI extenders and switchers based on DVI specs. The chances of having HDMI compatibility problems is a lot greater than other companies. I know this very well thru experience...

thanks joerod i will check that out.

I posted this earlier but maybe it was buried too deep.

My NR1000's switched electrical outlet on the back of the unit is always on now. Does anyone else have this problem and is there a fix?

Thanks

Scott

Just as an FYi and to maybe save people some frustration...I bought a Toshiba HD-DVD player, the HD-1A, last Friday night and am having a hell of a time getting it to work THROUGH my NR1000.

When I connect my Infocus 7210 projector directly to the Toshiba it works flawlessly but when I go through the NR1000 I get "HDMI Error 1". I thought it was a defective DVD player unit so I took it back and got another one...same result. I then used a buddies X1A and am getting the same thing. It looks like the NR1000 that is causing this issue.

Unless I can find an HDMI firmware upgrade for my NR1000 my next stop is to try an HDMI switch.

FYI and I am all ears if someone sees an error in my methodology.

Scott

Just as an FYi and to maybe save people some frustration...I bought a Toshiba HD-DVD player, the HD-1A, last Friday night and am having a hell of a time getting it to work THROUGH my NR1000.

When I connect my Infocus 7210 projector directly to the Toshiba it works flawlessly but when I go through the NR1000 I get "HDMI Error 1". I thought it was a defective DVD player unit so I took it back and got another one...same result. I then used a buddies X1A and am getting the same thing. It looks like the NR1000 that is causing this issue.

Unless I can find an HDMI firmware upgrade for my NR1000 my next stop is to try an HDMI switch.

FYI and I am all ears if someone sees an error in my methodology.

Scott



Scott,

Which HD-DVD firmware version are you on. Lots of people have had the same issue with various HDMI products. Have you updated to 2.0 yet?

I have an HD-DVD player lying around here that I have yet to hookup. I'll see what it does with my DTR-10.5.



Eric

I posted this earlier but maybe it was buried too deep.

My NR1000's switched electrical outlet on the back of the unit is always on now. Does anyone else have this problem and is there a fix?

Thanks

Scott


Scott,

Hmmm... I can give you the magic sequence that will reset your receiver.

Warning... you may lose some (or all) of your settings if you do this!

Press the VIDEO1 and OFF/Standby buttons simultaneously. The display should read: CLEAR.

Then turn it off and then back on.

Eric

Eric,

Thanks for the advice on reseting my NR1000. I'll give it a try later tonight.

I am on firmware version 2.0 for my Toshiba HD player.

Scott

Eric,

The reset did the trick for the electrical outlet. Thanks!

Now my Right rear surround channel has nothing but hiss and no sound at all. Not even in the white noise generator for output level calibration. It is configured in Speaker Configuration as 2 Channel Spkr A. I'll search the forum for this symptom but if you've heard of it I'd love to know the fix.

The reset didnt do anything for the Toshiba HD player and associated HDMI Error 1 issue.

Scott

Eric,

The reset did the trick for the electrical outlet. Thanks!

Now my Right rear surround channel has nothing but hiss and no sound at all. Not even in the white noise generator for output level calibration. It is configured in Speaker Configuration as 2 Channel Spkr A. I'll search the forum for this symptom but if you've heard of it I'd love to know the fix.

The reset didnt do anything for the Toshiba HD player and associated HDMI Error 1 issue.

Scott


Scott,

As for the hiss...I'd check the connections and also make sure that your setup info has been properly restored.

I'm in the midst of setting up an HD DVD player (haven't updated any firmware yet) with HDMI thru the DTR-10.5... had to hit the V.OUTPUT button a couple of times on the remote to get the HDMI video to show up on the projector.

Eric

Nobody install the new firmware 2.x ?
It's not vaporware, it's reality ! "The new Net-Tune firmware is now available for the card-based family." wrote Egcarter on 9/6/2006

Have you upgraded ?
Improvement to play WMA files created by Windows Media Player 10 => what's your feeling ?
The radio station reception rate of the Internet radio has improved => what's your feeling ?

Talking about future needs like HDMI is good. Live in the present is wonderful :cool:

Xavier

I asked to my local dealer to upgrade my amp.
Onkyo Germany or Benelux (I don't know) do it with a return to Onkyo technical services !
My dealer talk about a hardware upgrade not only a firmware upgrade as flashing or replace a EPROM. I asked to receive all the details about the upgrade. I'm waiting.
Perhaps an upgrade HDMI 1.1 to HDMI 1.2...

I'm talking about the Europeen version TX-NR 5000.
Egcarter, have you any input ?

Xavier

So the only way at this time to get newer HDMI chips is to upgrade our entire receiver?

So the only way at this time to get newer HDMI chips is to upgrade our entire receiver?

Wait for the release of the HDMI 1.3 card in '07.

Unless you have one of the lower-end models, which are newer. They are all HDMI 1.1.

Eric

Wait for the release of the HDMI 1.3 card in '07.

Unless you have one of the lower-end models, which are newer. They are all HDMI 1.1.

Eric

Egcarter,
Have you done only a software upgrade or an hardware upgrade ?
Why it's not clear for the customer ?

Thanks for your answer
Xavier

Egcarter,
Have you done only a software upgrade or an hardware upgrade ?
Why it's not clear for the customer ?

Thanks for your answer
Xavier


The only upgrades here in the U.S. at present are adding function cards or updating firmware. There is a NetTune firmware upgrade which really improves the operation of the product, and there is also a general firmware upgrade (2.0)...I have no idea what has been addressed in that upgrade.

Eric

Just as an FYi and to maybe save people some frustration...I bought a Toshiba HD-DVD player, the HD-1A, last Friday night and am having a hell of a time getting it to work THROUGH my NR1000.

When I connect my Infocus 7210 projector directly to the Toshiba it works flawlessly but when I go through the NR1000 I get "HDMI Error 1". I thought it was a defective DVD player unit so I took it back and got another one...same result. I then used a buddies X1A and am getting the same thing. It looks like the NR1000 that is causing this issue.

Unless I can find an HDMI firmware upgrade for my NR1000 my next stop is to try an HDMI switch.

FYI and I am all ears if someone sees an error in my methodology.

Scott

Scott,

I upgraded to FW 2.0 and started getting the dreaded HDMI Error 1 message when I try to play an HD DVD movie. Works fine directly into the projector. But thru the DTR-10.5 i get the same problem. It worked OK with 1.4.

I contacted the HDMI Licensing guys...they said it's the HD DVD player. Common problem...one that is exacerbated when you have an HDMI repeater (i.e. the receiver) in the chain. Toshiba has some more work to do on their firmware, it seems.

Eric

Hello Eric: Do you know what is the current processor in the receiver is? Is it an intel or an AMD? With all the heat the Onkyo puts out I can't see how it can't be too powerful. I believe to implement HDMI 1.3 that there is also involved increased computer processing . I have never heard the supposed fan that is in the receiver but I believe that Onkyo is going to have to create an outboard module to have the new upgrades. This should not be an issue since it can be placed in an other area as long as the connection "wire" is long enough (are you paying attention Onkyo engineers- free advice no charge for the consult) .This way space constraints is no longer an issue, heating problems are no longer an issue and firmware upgrades are simplified. Audessey technology is now possible and you can get an extra 350.00 usd to 650.00 usd from current client base.

Just as an FYi and to maybe save people some frustration...I bought a Toshiba HD-DVD player, the HD-1A, last Friday night and am having a hell of a time getting it to work THROUGH my NR1000.

When I connect my Infocus 7210 projector directly to the Toshiba it works flawlessly but when I go through the NR1000 I get "HDMI Error 1". I thought it was a defective DVD player unit so I took it back and got another one...same result. I then used a buddies X1A and am getting the same thing. It looks like the NR1000 that is causing this issue.

Unless I can find an HDMI firmware upgrade for my NR1000 my next stop is to try an HDMI switch.

FYI and I am all ears if someone sees an error in my methodology.

Scott

Scott,

I had the same problem with the XA1 with firmware 1.4 and 2.0.
The problem is the hand-shake after HDCP starts. You can check by putting the A1 or XA1 into setup mode and it will works without HDMI error until you go back to the movie and the encryption starts you are going to get the HDMI error 1.
I had some great guys from Toshiba on the phone and the problem is with our 1.0 HDMI to HDMI 1.1 hand-shake. Will not work and they do not know if they going to fix it on the X1. It might be fixed with the new A2 coming in November with HDMI 1.2a ($499) or with the XA2 HDMI 1.3 ($999) in December

Sky-

Scott,

I had the same problem with the XA1 with firmware 1.4 and 2.0.
The problem is the hand-shake after HDCP starts. You can check by putting the A1 or XA1 into setup mode and it will works without HDMI error until you go back to the movie and the encryption starts you are going to get the HDMI error 1.
I had some great guys from Toshiba on the phone and the problem is with our 1.0 HDMI to HDMI 1.1 hand-shake. Will not work and they do not know if they going to fix it on the X1. It might be fixed with the new A2 coming in November with HDMI 1.2a ($499) or with the XA2 HDMI 1.3 ($999) in December

Sky-

Eric and Sky,

I have "fixed" (more like steered around) this problem by putting in an HDMI switch in the equation. I bought a Monoprice 5 into 1 switch and connected the NR1000 into input 1 and the Toshiba xA1 into input 2. I then configured my Universal Remotes MX-3000 to switch to the correct input when I watch an HD DVD versus the satellite receiver or other HDMI input. This works like a champ. It's too bad the Toshiba wont work through the Onkyo...but oh well.

Now, I still have my right rear surround hiss issue and it looks like I'll be taking the NR-1000 into the service shop for a repair. I don't know if it’s covered under warranty but I’ll soon find out. I just hope it doesn’t have to be in the shop too long.

Scott

Any new word/ news on the Onkyo?

I just pre-ordered the Toshiba HDX2A 2nd-Gen HD-DVD player set for Dec release with HDMI1.3

Me to. Looks like the XA2 will be my first HDMI 1.3 product... :eek:

oh kool Joe!

My only concern is that since no HDTV currently has HDMI 1.3 how are our TVs going to handle the new HDMI 1.3 standard coming on the HD-XA2 HD-DVD players?

The Onkyo is rumored to be releasing a HDMI 1.3 card so Sound wise us ONKYO TXNR1000 owners are covered, but Display wise we're not, unless we have a NEW HDTV that comes with HDMI 1.3, b/c from I was told HDMI 1.3 is a Hardware upgrade & not a Software/Firmware one.

I hope they have learned their lessons with the past HDMI fiascos (handshaking issues). I would hope 1.3 would work with everything... If not I give up on HDMI... :eek:

oh kool Joe!

My only concern is that since no HDTV currently has HDMI 1.3 how are our TVs going to handle the new HDMI 1.3 standard coming on the HD-XA2 HD-DVD players?

The Onkyo is rumored to be releasing a HDMI 1.3 card so Sound wise us ONKYO TXNR1000 owners are covered, but Display wise we're not, unless we have a NEW HDTV that comes with HDMI 1.3, b/c from I was told HDMI 1.3 is a Hardware upgrade & not a Software/Firmware one.

I don't think that there will be any advantage or disadvantage when you use your HDMI 1.0 / 1.1 TV.

What’s new in the HDMI 1.3 Specification?

Higher speed:
Although all previous versions of HDMI have had more than enough bandwidth to support all current HDTV formats, HDMI 1.3 increases its single-link bandwidth to 340 MHz (10.2 Gbps) to support the demands of future HD display devices, such as higher resolutions, Deep Color and high frame rates. In addition, built into the HDMI 1.3 specification is the technical foundation that will let future versions of HDMI reach significantly higher speeds.

Deep Color:
HDMI 1.3 supports 30-bit, 36-bit and 48-bit (RGB or YCbCr) color depths, up from the 24-bit depths in previous versions of the HDMI specification, for stunning rendering of over one billion colors in unprecedented detail.

Broader color space:
HDMI 1.3 adds support for “xvYCC” color standard, which removes current color space limitations and enables the display of any color viewable by the human eye.
New mini connector: With small portable devices such as HD camcorders and still cameras demanding seamless connectivity to HDTVs, HDMI 1.3 offers a new, smaller form factor connector option.

Lip Sync:
Because consumer electronics devices are using increasingly complex digital signal processing to enhance the clarity and detail of the content, synchronization of video and audio in user devices has become a greater challenge and could potentially require complex end-user adjustments. HDMI 1.3 incorporates automatic audio synching capabilities that allows devices to perform this synchronization automatically with total accuracy.

New HD lossless audio formats:
In addition to HDMI’s current ability to support high-bandwidth uncompressed digital audio and all currently-available compressed formats (such as Dolby® Digital and DTS®), HDMI 1.3 adds additional support for new lossless compressed digital audio formats Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio™.

Eric and Sky,

I have "fixed" (more like steered around) this problem by putting in an HDMI switch in the equation. I bought a Monoprice 5 into 1 switch and connected the NR1000 into input 1 and the Toshiba xA1 into input 2. I then configured my Universal Remotes MX-3000 to switch to the correct input when I watch an HD DVD versus the satellite receiver or other HDMI input. This works like a champ. It's too bad the Toshiba wont work through the Onkyo...but oh well.

Now, I still have my right rear surround hiss issue and it looks like I'll be taking the NR-1000 into the service shop for a repair. I don't know if it’s covered under warranty but I’ll soon find out. I just hope it doesn’t have to be in the shop too long.

Scott

Scott,

Glad to hear you have a workaround. How long have you had your receiver? I think Onkyo's warranty on the 1000 is 2 years. (Integra is 3 years....)

Eric

Scott,

Glad to hear you have a workaround. How long have you had your receiver? I think Onkyo's warranty on the 1000 is 2 years. (Integra is 3 years....)

Eric

Eric,

I've had my NR1000 for about 18 months but I can't find my darn receipt. I'll be taking it in to the shop Friday. I am hoping they can find a way to evaluate and fix under warranty.

Scott

I took it into a Service Center. Let's see how it comes back.

Well, service center called to inform me that Onkyo would not authorise them to repair the unit because it was not bought from an Onkyo authorised daler. So it looks like this is the last Onkyo product that will ever see the inside of my house. I'll be switching to Denon.

Read your warranty and make sure that stipulation is in the verbage. If it is not, then fight this as it could be the dealer trying to get more money.

Read your warranty and make sure that stipulation is in the verbage. If it is not, then fight this as it could be the dealer trying to get more money.

The warranty does say that it must be bought from an authorised dealer, but unfortunately, you don't get to read the warranty until after you buy the product.

Well, service center called to inform me that Onkyo would not authorise them to repair the unit because it was not bought from an Onkyo authorised daler. So it looks like this is the last Onkyo product that will ever see the inside of my house. I'll be switching to Denon.

As much I like the TX-NR1000 in my system I have to agree with you. Almost 3 years and 60 AVS forum pages later with nothing really new from Onkyo even the HDMI is really bad ... I am going to sell mine ASAP.

Future proof system without future ....

Sky

Well, service center called to inform me that Onkyo would not authorise them to repair the unit because it was not bought from an Onkyo authorised daler. So it looks like this is the last Onkyo product that will ever see the inside of my house. I'll be switching to Denon.

Denon has the same warranty policy.

Eric

Well, service center called to inform me that Onkyo would not authorise them to repair the unit because it was not bought from an Onkyo authorised daler. So it looks like this is the last Onkyo product that will ever see the inside of my house. I'll be switching to Denon.

Changing brands won't do anything in that regard. Because under the same circumstances, of not buying it from a authorized dealer. Denon, Pioneer, H/K, Yamaha, all will tell you the same thing, no warranty.

Changing brands won't do anything in that regard. Because under the same circumstances, of not buying it from a authorized dealer. Denon, Pioneer, H/K, Yamaha, all will tell you the same thing, no warranty.

This is typical bad US law. Other countries let companies not get away like that.
It is not a counterfeit .. it is the same product and Onkyo, Denon did make there money on it by selling it to someone.

It's not so much that it's a bad US law, as much as it proves that the law that was enacted many years ago against price fixing. Pretty much has just ended up being more or less a law that was soon found to be loaded with a ton of loopholes to get around it.

Hi,

I am from Australia. Can anyone point me to the dealer in the US who will sell me just the IEEE 1394 card for DTR10.5?

Thanks


Patrick

Hi Patrick,

If the Aus setup is like the US then any of the official Integra dealers should sell you the module. If not then contact a dealer in the US and ask them to post it.

Law here in the UK is a little different to the US. If the units is sourced within the UK then they cannot deny you service, if it is a grey import then the distro must quote (Companies like Theta simply quote huge amounts) on repairing it or if bought within the EU then the original supplying country must repair. The warranty for goods purchased within the EU is supposed to be upheld in any EU country but the practice is often sidsetepped or made extremely akward. My own opinion is that a distro should be able to defend their brand and official dealers, I think the best method is to refuse to supply to inappropriate or sell through dealers, refusing warranty on legitimate products is just gonna p*ss customers off.

has anyone tried the hd tuner module
and did you like it.

Any firm dates on the HDMI 1.3 card yet? (or if its even coming for that matter) Also, why does Onkyo make it so difficult check out the cards available...i had to call/email tech support last time just to figure out what kinds of cards were available....terrible. Anybody have a web link or anything? Thanks.

Any firm dates on the HDMI 1.3 card yet? (or if its even coming for that matter) Also, why does Onkyo make it so difficult check out the cards available...i had to call/email tech support last time just to figure out what kinds of cards were available....terrible. Anybody have a web link or anything? Thanks.

Card upgrades and changes on the Onkyo product are not officially supported (At least the user upgrading them is not). Below I have included a complete list (AFAIK) of optional cards. Depending on if you buy an TX-NR1000E, TX-NR5000E, DTR-10.5 or RDC-7.1 you will get different modules as standard. The country you buy the Onkyo/Integra in also effects the standard modules you get. Hope this helps.

Full List of cards:

For Slot A:
C-I-LINK - 2 I-Link Inputs

For Slot B:
C-NET-A - Nettune MP3/WMA streaming

For Slot E:
C-AES - 1 AES/EBU & 1 7.1 Analogue Input
C-MULTI - 2 7.1 Analogue Inputs

For Slots H & I:
C-VIDEO - Analogue Video Module (Required for any video processing)

For Slot J:
C-CPNT-BNC - 1 Component BNC Input and 1 Output
C-CPNT-RCA - 1 Component RCA Input and 1 Output
C-D4 - 2 D4 Component Inputs and 1 Output (Japan Only)

For Slot K:
C-AMFM - AM/FM Radio Card
C-RDS - AM/FM RDS Radio Card (Europe Only)
C-HDXM - XM & AM/FM RDS Digital Radio Card (USA Only)
C-DAB - DAB & AM/FM RDS Digital Radio Card (UK Only)

For Slot L:
C-HDMI - 2 HDMI 1.0 Input and 1 Output

Any firm dates on the HDMI 1.3 card yet? (or if its even coming for that matter) Also, why does Onkyo make it so difficult check out the cards available...i had to call/email tech support last time just to figure out what kinds of cards were available....terrible. Anybody have a web link or anything? Thanks.

No manufacturers will have HDMI 1.3 capability for AV receivers until at least mid-2007. The HDMI 1.3 repeater chips won't be in production until that time period.

Eric

So does that mean Onkyo will have 1.3 cards someday? Hopefully they will give us any new HDMI card. But at this time, they might as well wait and just do th HDMI 1.3 cards. We have waited this long, whats 6 more months?

I think we will wait about a year actually. First recievers with HDMI 1.3 wont be out until about March and I very much doubt Onkyo will release on the cutting edge so end of next year would be about right. Maybe an announcement at CES?!?

What I find interesting is how these slots are designed. I installed a C-AES module recently, it seems the slot deals with Digital audio only and an ADC on the board converts the analogue to digital. I would make a guess that Audio only HDMI card could be designed for Slot E. Also, the C-D4 card shows the Onkyo can handle more Component inputs and it was just the amount of back panel space that limits it to 1 input on the card.

You are probably right about it being another year. Damn! So to get HDMI 1.3 we earlier we have to get a new receiver? I would like to think Onkyo is ahead of the curve on this one atleast... Of course it has been this long without any new HDMI cards so I am sure that is not the case... :confused:

From hdmi.org:

Q. When was the HDMI specification released?

The initial HDMI 1.0 specification was released in December 2002.
Version 1.1 was released in May 2004.
Version 1.2 was released in August of 2005.
Version 1.2a was released in December of 2005.
Version 1.3 was released in June of 2006.



There have been quite a few revisions to the spec, and it seems as if new specs are being released more and more frequently.

This worries me that by the time Onkyo can get the 1.3 repeater chips, a 1.4 spec could possibly be on its heels. Onkyo seems to be extremely conservative when it comes to these upgrades, which makes me afraid that an upgrade card will once again get bumped or held off.

From what EgCarter has said, the 1.2 card is almost ready or near ready, yet they are going to wait another 8 months or so to pop in the new 1.3 chip, if that is techincally possible. This is just me worrying again, but with the amount of money we all put into these machines, I think we have a good reason to worry. Not to mention that in another 8 months, there will be plenty of new machines out that will probably also support the latest specifications and audio formats.

I guess we can all just continue to keep our fingers crossed.

Is it really that bad?
I know someone considering the jump to separates and he is selling his TXNR1000 for $2700. Is this worth jumping on?

I am happy with my sound. I have a crystalio II that handles all of my video. I do use the TX1000 to switch between my HD TIVO and HR20 DVR. Then the out goes into my C2. So I won't be heart broken if we never see a new HDMI card. I just know many others who have been counting on getting a newer HDMI card whenever they come out. Also Onkyo claimed they would have them. They are still running their Nostradamus ads in the latest electronic magazines... I would be more than happy with a 1.2 card...

I don't think HDMI is about to release a 1.4 spec...after all, we knew the 1.3 spec was coming long before it was finalized. That was to support the new lossless audio codecs for the HD disc formats and the colorspace/depth improvements, auto lipsync, etc.

What more do they need now??

They know that the entire industry is WAITING patiently for the chips to support the 1.3 spec.

For the umpteenth time.... the Onkyo/Integra/IR product manager told me at CEDIA Expo that they already designed a 1.2 card, but decided to wait for the 1.3 chips, since that's a BIG upgrade to the spec and the one the marketplace REALLY wants due to HD disc formats, etc. He said it should be relatively straightforward to go from a 1.2 card to 1.3, BUT, there may be some issues involved there re: the interface between the card and the chassis being able to support all of the new functionality that they would like to offer with 1.3 spec. We'll see. I, for one, have no need or desire for a 1.2 card since I use iLink for the audio, which works like a champ.

I asked how about an iLink-enabled HD disc player, since Onkyo supports both HD DVD and Blu-Ray? He said that would be technically possible, but the marketplace has migrated from iLink to HDMI as the digital connection of choice.

Eric

I don't think HDMI is about to release a 1.4 spec...after all, we knew the 1.3 spec was coming long before it was finalized. That was to support the new lossless audio codecs for the HD disc formats and the colorspace/depth improvements, auto lipsync, etc.

What more do they need now??

They know that the entire industry is WAITING patiently for the chips to support the 1.3 spec.

For the umpteenth time.... the Onkyo/Integra/IR product manager told me at CEDIA Expo that they already designed a 1.2 card, but decided to wait for the 1.3 chips, since that's a BIG upgrade to the spec and the one the marketplace REALLY wants due to HD disc formats, etc. He said it should be relatively straightforward to go from a 1.2 card to 1.3, BUT, there may be some issues involved there re: the interface between the card and the chassis being able to support all of the new functionality that they would like to offer with 1.3 spec. We'll see. I, for one, have no need or desire for a 1.2 card since I use iLink for the audio, which works like a champ.

I asked how about an iLink-enabled HD disc player, since Onkyo supports both HD DVD and Blu-Ray? He said that would be technically possible, but the marketplace has migrated from iLink to HDMI as the digital connection of choice.

Eric
I'm still holding out hope for some kind of room correction or EQ card. I think I read a few pages back that that might not be technically feasable. If not, I wonder if an Onkyo branded external solution (digital) would be possible. An outboard digital Audessey box perhaps?

Should I start looking for pigs to fly? ;)

Best......Carlo.

There is always hope... ;)

There is always hope...

Yeah but the problem is, that sometimes it's followed by disappointment.

There is always hope... ;)

With Onkyo there is hope for years while others have receivers that are capable of audio over HDMI for over a year at the time they cough something up for the TX-NR1000, including their own product (TX-SR803).

I don't think HDMI is about to release a 1.4 spec...after all, we knew the 1.3 spec was coming long before it was finalized. That was to support the new lossless audio codecs for the HD disc formats and the colorspace/depth improvements, auto lipsync, etc.

What more do they need now??

They know that the entire industry is WAITING patiently for the chips to support the 1.3 spec.

For the umpteenth time.... the Onkyo/Integra/IR product manager told me at CEDIA Expo that they already designed a 1.2 card, but decided to wait for the 1.3 chips, since that's a BIG upgrade to the spec and the one the marketplace REALLY wants due to HD disc formats, etc. He said it should be relatively straightforward to go from a 1.2 card to 1.3, BUT, there may be some issues involved there re: the interface between the card and the chassis being able to support all of the new functionality that they would like to offer with 1.3 spec. We'll see. I, for one, have no need or desire for a 1.2 card since I use iLink for the audio, which works like a champ.

I asked how about an iLink-enabled HD disc player, since Onkyo supports both HD DVD and Blu-Ray? He said that would be technically possible, but the marketplace has migrated from iLink to HDMI as the digital connection of choice.

Eric

Thanks for the info Eric,

Its a shame to hear they wont offer I-Link on an HD Player. I-Link would be easiest, there would be no need to upgrade the Onkyo for alot of people with this. Oh well, maybe Pioneer will give us I-Link with HD.

I really enjoyed my iLINK with my Onkyo SP1000. To bad other manufacturers did not begin to adopt it because it worked out very well. The new Br and HD DVD players should have included it for as much as they are. And gys I am right there with you. If Onkyo does not release any new HDMI cards then I won't ever buy another Onkyo product again. I don't like being dooped either. And to me it has been nothing but false advertising up to this point. And now here we are on the heels of 2007 and we still don't have any new HDMI cards. I posted last year at this time about the same exact subject. They need to either put up or shut up (stop advertising this is the AVR that Nostradamus would buy).... :mad:

Hi Joerod,

Pioneer were the biggest supporter of I-Link and to be fair to them there would be no point including it on their first BR player since it does not decode any of the new audio formats internally anyway. Maybe Gen2 will see I-Link rise again (Or at least quietly reappear).

I really enjoyed my iLINK with my Onkyo SP1000. To bad other manufacturers did not begin to adopt it because it worked out very well. The new Br and HD DVD players should have included it for as much as they are. And gys I am right there with you. If Onkyo does not release any new HDMI cards then I won't ever buy another Onkyo product again. I don't like being dooped either. And to me it has been nothing but false advertising up to this point. And now here we are on the heels of 2007 and we still don't have any new HDMI cards. I posted last year at this time about the same exact subject. They need to either put up or shut up (stop advertising this is the AVR that Nostradamus would buy).... :mad:
Hey Joe, I have the same reciever and DVD combo you do also connected via iLINK. At the end of the day I have been very happy with my setup and, knock on wood, I've had no problems. For me, when I compare it to other offerings out there the Onkyo gets the big things right in spades, power ,sound quality, connection options and features. I really wouldn't want to trade it for anything else. Where it falls down has more to do with Onkyo's customer support and relations or their lack of them! If it wasn't for this forum and posters like you and Eric, I would know "jack" about what future upgrades or firmware or issues there are for this unit. Now that says something.
I would like Onkyo to communicate better to customers via their website and phone support about such things, both are severely lacking in my opinion. Denon seems to do a far better job in this regard.
Now I don't use HDMI since I still have an older RPTV so I'm not in the same boat as some others here are, but it still concerns me that people who do care about it find out more info here than they do from the company directly!
I hope when they do finally come out with the HDMI card it is a quality unit that takes full advantage of what the spec has to offer. It would be great if the video processing features ie: scaling and de-interlacing, etc. could be upgraded in the process. And room EQ would be a lovely addition also. It's available now in their cheaper units, what sense does it make not to offer it in their "flagship". You've given us the "kitchen" Onkyo, now toss in the "sink".

Best.........Carlo.

Great post Carlo. I appreciate your kind words. Hopefully they do improve on their customer relations. A big step in that direction would to bring back consumer participation with doing our own firmware downloads again... That is BIG deal to many and I will only buy products that I can do my own upgrades on via a disc or online. And since it is a receiver it needs to be done online... Sending in a 75 pound reciever is not fun.. So many companies do it so why not them?

EGCARTER

"What more do they need now??"

Isn't that always the questions with technology. Somebody probably said that when 1.2 came out, you just said it after 1.3 came out, and somebody will say it when 1.4 comes out.

The bottomline is there will be another spec, and i would bet good money on that if i had money to bet. Unfortunately, most of my money is sitting in a 75 lb audio/video receiver in which i took the bet that onkyo would make upgrade cards for. So far, i am losing that bet.

I know that sounds bad, and I hope i don't get labelled on the board as someone who is always negative, because i am satisfied with the quality of what onkyo initially built, now i want what the promised to build as far as upgrades. I want more hdmi inputs, as well as being able to use the latest features of hdmi. I still think they should have released their hdmi 1.2 card, as we have been talking about that for a couple months already. If they would have released it 2 months ago, then that would leave a 10 month window before the HDMI 1.3 card is PROJECTED to debut. One upgrade a year is reasonable sounding to me. Wouldn't it be to you guys as well?

I think HDMI 1.3 is it for awhile now. I wouldn't worry about 1.4 (they haven't even made any hints as to if and when that will ever happen), as it's going to take a couple of years until 1.3 is really adopted. After all, the repeater chips won't be in mass production until mid-2007. Onkyo was the VERY FIRST to implement HDMI in their AV products...and they did a great job. I haven't found one issue that was a problem with their product, it was always someone elses. I, for one, would rather wait for a 1.3 solution then get an interim 1.2 product (they do not want to have multiple HDMI-rev boards as active products...I'm sure a new board will replace the existing board in the product line). Does it make sense to introduce a board and have to replace it 9 months later?

I'm rather sick and tired of beating this issue to death...so I won't. I don't run Onkyo, I don't work for them...all I'm doing is reporting to you guys what I hear from people on the inside. So I'm zipping it...

Hasta La Vista.

Eric

egcarter,

My post was not directed to you except for the part about a new spec.

I agree that it is now too late to release a 1.2 card. They have waited too long and even if they decided to release the card today it would still be a couple months before we could get a hold of one which would only put us closer to the release of 1.3.

If we could turn back time, i wish onlyo would go back and release a 1.2 card as soon as they were able to get a hold of the chips. I would assume this would be many months back. Instead, they waited and waited and took forever to release the card. Now 1.3 is out and they will wait again.

I would bet that in another 8 months, there will be plenty of rumblings about 1.4. This is purely my opinion based off what i have gathered. I am not trying to prove you wrong as you have been a great resource and I appreciate your knowledge.

I have never disputed any of the information you have reported. I believe everything you say and appreciate it. Anything i have said is directed towards Onkyo and not towards you or anyone else on this board.

At this point, we must wait until 1.3 is ready and onkyo can release an upgrade card. I just think that the majority of us on this board will not hold our breath for the release of the 1.3 card as onkyo has been playing this very conservatively.

Again Mr. Carter, please do not take people's frustrations with Onkyo as any sort of attack on you. There are many of us that are just frustrated and I am sure that most of us, if not all of us, are mad at Onkyo and would not want you to think this has anything to do with your hard work and efforts in giving us information.

Thanks again for all your reports.

Well, there are vanishingly few HDMI 1.2 compliant AV receivers; I think you can count them on one hand. For example, all of the Denon models are 1.1.

The Onkyo/Integra/IR card-based triumvirate were designed as a system to mate with their world-class high-end DVD players, which have HDMI and iLink. There is no need for HDMI 1.1 or 1.2 when mated with these units, as the SACD and DVD-Audio are transmitted entirely in the digital domain over the iLink connection.

You want HDMI de-interlacing and scaling? The HDMI card does de-interlace...it converts all 480i into 480p. HD resolutions are passed through untouched. You want scaling? The Integra and IR versions of the DVD player will do this for their external inputs as well as scaling the DVDs. (something those of you that bought the Onkyo version may not have known). Why put it in the AV receiver?? It's still re-scaled by your video display anyway, no?

I think that all of those points are a big reason why they decided to wait for HDMI 1.3.

Eric

Eric,

you are not responsible for how they run things at Onkyo, but there is a saying: Throw them a friggin bone. People who buy a supposedly upgradable modular top-of-the-line receiver want to be able to upgrade a (non-radio-) card now and then.

So what Onkyo should have done in the first place would have been to release a 1.1 card to be able to accept PCM over HDMI for the new formats. Next stop 1.3 and just about everyone would have been happy. Now they have another half year of pissing and moaning (I am exaggerating a little here) from once loyal customers, who could have fed PCM to their HD-DVD players and DVD-players for over a year by then. Bad business I say.

That being said your contributions are the only thing that keeps up the hope that Onkyo will ever release a new HDMI card, so please stay and don't take the people's diappointment about Onkyo as a personal attack - it isn't.

Oliver

I guess we should all just call Onkyo and ask them the same question. Maybe then they will get the hint. Who's with me?

sounds good to me.
squeaky wheel always gets the grease.

Alright oztech! Let the games begin! Onkyo number 1 800 229 1687... :)

Alright oztech! Let the games begin! Onkyo number 1 800 229 1687... :)

So Joe what's the latest? Did you call?

Yes, I called twice last week. The first was a complete waste of time. The second I was elevated to higher support. They are saying that new cards (including HDMI) are on the way and to please have a little more patience. I told them patience is running out for many customers who bought the TX1000 thinking we would be able to change cards in the future. Anyway, I am supposed to get a call from some manager on Monday who is supposed to give me some better inside info. I guess we will wait and see.. But for as far as calling the 1-800 number, it is only good because thy log all complaints but other than that it is a waste of time...

Yes, I called twice last week. The first was a complete waste of time. The second I was elevated to higher support. They are saying that new cards (including HDMI) are on the way and to please have a little more patience. I told them patience is running out for many customers who bought the TX1000 thinking we would be able to change cards in the future. Anyway, I am supposed to get a call from some manager on Monday who is supposed to give me some better inside info. I guess we will wait and see.. But for as far as calling the 1-800 number, it is only good because thy log all complaints but other than that it is a waste of time...



at least you should get a little more info on this...PLEASE keep us posted, i'm dying to hear about the song & dance they give you...my experiences calling them have been fairly poor...

No problem. I will report back after my conversation with him...

joe had better luck than i did the tech told me he
was not at liberty to say.

Thanks Joe for your efforts!

No problem. I will report back after my conversation with him...

Very cool! Thanks :)

Joerod: You should tell the guy your in touch with dozens of fellow owners who would be more than happy to state their unhappiness personally, to him, if he dosent take you seriously.

I will definitely mention the forum. There is usually more strength in numbers. ;)

I think we will wait about a year actually. First recievers with HDMI 1.3 wont be out until about March and I very much doubt Onkyo will release on the cutting edge so end of next year would be about right. Maybe an announcement at CES?!?

What I find interesting is how these slots are designed. I installed a C-AES module recently, it seems the slot deals with Digital audio only and an ADC on the board converts the analogue to digital. I would make a guess that Audio only HDMI card could be designed for Slot E. Also, the C-D4 card shows the Onkyo can handle more Component inputs and it was just the amount of back panel space that limits it to 1 input on the card.
Krobar; your info about slot E having adc conversion helps a lot .We get the 2 # 7.1 input card as standard down here and the manual makes a poor job of describing how bass management works.I think the manual describes the x over;s ok very basically [ subwoofer a or b or none] but the multichannel input sub menu gives no clue as to speaker delay.

If this a/d converter gives access to full bass management [ as implemented by say Harmon Kardon] ; I will put my pioneer 989 universal dvd back to its default [0] bass management settings.Unless I've misread this whole thing :confused: Makes me reconsider an i-link card :)

It annoys me that this is the only receiver they put pre-outs on in their ENTIRE lineup.

It annoys me that this is the only receiver they put pre-outs on in their ENTIRE lineup.


The Onkyo TX-SR804 (just started shipping) has 7.1 pre-outs. In the Integra lineup, in addition to the top-of-the-line DTR-10.5, the DTR-7.7, DTR-6.6 and DTR-5.6 all have 7.1 pre-outs.

It annoys me that this is the only receiver they put pre-outs on in their ENTIRE lineup.
You don't know what you're talking about: I have 7.1 pre-outs even on my old TX-SR800. It may not be the only one. Look it up for yourself: Onkyo manual page (http://www.onkyousa.com/download/own_manuals.cfm?cat=Receiver).

Yeah, not only the 804, but the 703 has them as well. Not sure why you think only the 1000 has them.

Krobar; your info about slot E having adc conversion helps a lot .We get the 2 # 7.1 input card as standard down here and the manual makes a poor job of describing how bass management works.I think the manual describes the x over;s ok very basically [ subwoofer a or b or none] but the multichannel input sub menu gives no clue as to speaker delay.

If this a/d converter gives access to full bass management [ as implemented by say Harmon Kardon] ; I will put my pioneer 989 universal dvd back to its default [0] bass management settings.Unless I've misread this whole thing :confused: Makes me reconsider an i-link card :)

You should be able to get full bass management on the 7.1 inputs. You would probably be best disabling all bass management on the Pioneer player. The Integra/Onkyo will convert the analogue into 24/96 digital and apply all its normal preocessing unless you choose the Direct or Pure modes. The crossover setting used are set for the entire zone and not per input, in the case of the 7.1 inputs the same crossover settings used for coaxial or optical digital sources will be applied. I-Link should be an improvement since it skips the D/A - A/D - D/A steps and so should be a fair bit cleaner. I use the I-Link from my Pioneer DV-868AVI and it works great for DVD, DVD-Audio and SACD.

You should be able to get full bass management on the 7.1 inputs. You would probably be best disabling all bass management on the Pioneer player. The Integra/Onkyo will convert the analogue into 24/96 digital and apply all its normal preocessing unless you choose the Direct or Pure modes. The crossover setting used are set for the entire zone and not per input, in the case of the 7.1 inputs the same crossover settings used for coaxial or optical digital sources will be applied. I-Link should be an improvement since it skips the D/A - A/D - D/A steps and so should be a fair bit cleaner. I use the I-Link from my Pioneer DV-868AVI and it works great for DVD, DVD-Audio and SACD.
Will certainly disable the pio's bass management ; thanks Krobar. I certainly cant change individual speaker x over's with the pio. Good thing I listen to sacd's with pure mode to switch the video circuits off :) Not to mention only the amp got the proper spl meter treatment [ the pio has rougher gradations]

Yeah, not only the 804, but the 703 has them as well. Not sure why you think only the 1000 has them.


Well, the 703 is discontinued. It's still in-stock in Onkyo, but shows "Final Limited Quantity". So in the Onkyo-branded line, it's only the 1000 and 804 with surround pre-outs.


Eric

Greetings All,
I'm in need of a little help here. I've had my TX-NR1000 for about a year now, and have been running it with all video sources output via component to an older analog Sony Wega TV. That included a Sony DVP-CX995V 400 disc DVD changer that was outputing a 480i signal. I just upgraded the TV to a Sony 40" Bravia LCD TV, and my DirecTV receiver (was upscaling to component on the NR1000) to DirecTV HD. I'm still running component cables for everything, but had a few questions I'm hoping someone can help me with:

The DirecTV HD receiver and the Sony DVD Changer both have HDMI outputs. I know that the NR1000 can't do the audio on HDMI yet, so I'm not worried about that. What I'm wondering is if I will see any better picture quality from both of these sources if I switch them to HDMI signals? From what I understand, the DVD player is now sending out a 480p signal to the NR1000, which passes it to the LCD TV. It doesn't look too bad, but I can occasionally see some graininess in the darker colors on some discs. The DVD player manual indicates that it can send a 1080i signal out from the HDMI output, but I don't know if that will make normal DVD's look better or not. The driver here for my questions is cost - I don't want to go out and spend 200 - 300 dollars for HDMI cabling if I'm not going to get better picture quality then what I already have with the new LCD TV.

I'm experiencing a lesser picture quality from the DirecTV standard digital (non-HD) channels on the LCD TV than when I had it connected to the analog CRT TV (I don't have the HD sat dish installed yet). I somewhat expected this from reading many comments on the Net. However, the DirecTV rep stated that when I get the HD sat dish installed, I will have better picture quality for the standard channels on the LCD TV than what I did on the analog CRT TV. Can anyone confirm or refute this? I'm hoping that someone has done something similar to my upgrade situation, or knows someone who has to be able to answer this. I would very much like to know if I'm going to get the picture quality that I'm used to on the regular DirecTV channels.

Last question, I promise. I'm wondering if I'm misinterpreting or misunderstanding the manual for the NR1000. On page 43 of the manual that references HDMI connections, it states:

"When other input source than 1 or 2 is selected, analog/digital audio signals and analog video signals will be converted into HDMI format and output through the HDMI OUT terminal (In the initial settings, no audio is output. Appropriate setting should be made in the Audio Output Assign sub-menu)."

So my question is - I thought the receiver would only upscale via the component connection. Is it actually possible for the receiver to route a non-HDMI video signal through the HDMI if that particular input is configured as VIDEO in the HDMI portion of the Video Assign Sub-menu? If it can, is it going to produce a lesser picture quality than if I routed it out to the TV via it's native cabling? I have an XBOX that I'd like to upgrade to component cabling, and it would be very nice just to have 1 HDMI cable going to the TV for everything, instead of keeping the component connection for the non-HDMI sources.

Sorry for packing so many questions into one post, and thanks in advance for ANY help that you guys could provide.

Best Regards,

Todd Ridner

...snip...
So my question is - I thought the receiver would only upscale via the component connection. Is it actually possible for the receiver to route a non-HDMI video signal through the HDMI if that particular input is configured as VIDEO in the HDMI portion of the Video Assign Sub-menu? If it can, is it going to produce a lesser picture quality than if I routed it out to the TV via it's native cabling? I have an XBOX that I'd like to upgrade to component cabling, and it would be very nice just to have 1 HDMI cable going to the TV for everything, instead of keeping the component connection for the non-HDMI sources.

...snip...


Todd,

Absolutely! That's one of the many great features of the product. It was the very first component on the market to transcode all of the video inputs to HDMI. And (one of the reasons the HDMI module is so pricey)...it doesn't just pass through HDMI signals as a passive device, but re-generates them. So if you feed it a 480i signal, it will de-interlace it to 480p and send it through the HDMI. 720p or 1080i input will be sent through as is.

If your DVD device upscales to 1080i, I would certainly use that over 480i/p.

Eric

Tridner,

Carter is absolutely correct and it is one of the best features about this receiver. I have every input being converted to hdmi. (XBOX, XBOX 360, Gamecube, Dish Network HD receiver,etc) and they all look great on my system.

As for your picture quality, digital tv's and analog tv's cannot be compared by unplugging one cable and putting in the other and comparing. The signals are generally treated differently by each tv and require adjustment of picture settings to obtain the best results. I have never used a tv that gave me the same great PQ on one type of input cable as it did on another without adjusting the settings. Thats just my experience though.

As far as the SD channels, most digital sat providers no longer care about the quality of the SD channels. For a very long time, dish was actually broadcasting with the least amount of clarity on their SD channels in order to make more room for their HD channels. (They were low on badnwidth.) Not to mention that digital televisions like to deal with one quality of signal which is their native signal. CRT television are much more versatille in this aspect, but i still think that a well designed digital television broadcasting a signal that is native to it will look much better than any analog set.

Graininess can sometimes be a product of noise in the picture, which i have found to be much more common in analog cabling. When i switched from component to hdmi on my projector, the color got a little better, but the overall clarity was enhanced due to the almost complete removal of artifacts from the picture caused by noise in the line.

Right now, with the way that most broadcasters are still broadcasting, I think you will find it difficult to get your standard definition broadcast to look as good on your tv as they would on your older analog tv. Thank god that dish and others are offering digital locals. The majority of local programming i watch is now in HD so i really don't watch that much SD, except for the other channels like Bravo, comedy central, etc that aren't offered in HD yet. For those, you just have to realize that they are using older technology that makes it difficult to use on many digital sets.

Video scalers/processors are really the only other option, but generally don't benefit digital sat owners because the sat receivers don't off a native pass through of the video signal. If your dtv receiver does, then this could be a great option for you.

No problem. I will report back after my conversation with him...

I'm guessing you did not get a call?

i was in hopes he would get that call with some good news also.

I have had 2 conversations but unfortunately I have not had any concrete info given to me. The 2 calls mainly consisted of I will get back with you shortly. Now I am supposed to get another call from someone else supposably even higher up. Let's not hold our breath but you never know. Maybe the third will be the charm... Sorry I am just now reporting back. I just wanted to report back with some good news instead of this... :mad:

Thanks for the input, guys. I will be getting my HD dish installed on Dec. 1, so hopefully the quality will be a little better for the SD channels. I also ordered HDMI cables from Optimized Cable (online). Hopefully these will be decent enough cables to get the job done.

Thanks again,

Todd