No problem here, but I did want to clarify what I was speaking to. :)

I have been lurking on this thread for awhile. Many views on this Rape & Punishment.

First of all I believe it was rape. Who are we to say they the Cylons are not a race of beings with a soul/spirit. They are sentenent beings. They have their own thoughts and feelings. They are Hy-breds of humans. Yes they are programed to a sense. So can we be programed from birth. Look at religion/political views for that example. To watch that episode of the attempted rape scene made me squirm more then watching Al Swearengen receive the ice pick up his yahoo to relieve him of the kidney stones. Remember That? :D

As for the two Galatica crew members on their "crime" they will probably be reinstated and have their sentence commuted. I am sure Adama will punish them to some degree. He has realized they have been bending the rules too much.(The Fleet in General) This much he has learned from Cain. He also knows that he needs them.

Another thing...on the Kiss between the President and Adama. Well it is simple. They do love one another. This is plain to see. That kiss was not a peck on the cheek...it was drawn out some. Adama's face after she walked away was a strong clue as well. He is grieved by her condition and feels helpless.

Also, the Kiss between Laura and Bill was unscripted as per Ronald Moore on his podcast for this episode. Edward just felt like it was the thing to do at that moment and went with it. So they kept it.

That is an interesting tid-bit of info RLJ. I like it when they leave in that stuff. Still, most would agree there is a mutual attraction between the two characters. I look at it as they are falling in love and they are starting to actually realize just that. So they are cautious because the people of the fleet come first.

It is one of those shows that leaves allot to the viewers interpetation I suppose. It is still the best written Sci-Fi Drama (or simply Drama) since Babylon 5 in my opinion.

The Military has to act profesional in all maters with POW, otherwise we are no better then the bad guys.. Lt. Thorn and the rest of the members invoved should all be put on trial.

IMO, there's no question, no matter which side of the being/machine debate you fall on - allowing your troops to engage in rape at will is not healthy for your command.

They should be more interested in getting #6 and Boomer in the same cell and trying to get them to "network". :)

I have been lurking on this thread for awhile. Many views on this Rape & Punishment.

First of all I believe it was rape. Who are we to say they the Cylons are not a race of beings with a soul/spirit. They are sentenent beings. They have their own thoughts and feelings. They are Hy-breds of humans. Yes they are programed to a sense. So can we be programed from birth. Look at religion/political views for that example. To watch that episode of the attempted rape scene made me squirm more then watching Al Swearengen receive the ice pick up his yahoo to relieve him of the kidney stones. Remember That? :D

As for the two Galatica crew members on their "crime" they will probably be reinstated and have their sentence commuted. I am sure Adama will punish them to some degree. He has realized they have been bending the rules too much.(The Fleet in General) This much he has learned from Cain. He also knows that he needs them.

Another thing...on the Kiss between the President and Adama. Well it is simple. They do love one another. This is plain to see. That kiss was not a peck on the cheek...it was drawn out some. Adama's face after she walked away was a strong clue as well. He is grieved by her condition and feels helpless.



Thank you. I don't know about the Al Swearengen thing, but I felt the same way you did about the rapes. I was hoping I wasn't the only one, because I know that the Cylons are viewed as "toasters" who wiped out nearly all of humanity. Even so... Along the same line, I find it disgusting that a certain popular radio personality has made so much light out of our own similar actions he has made a line of shirts and hats with the name of that particular prison, calling it a "club" and selling them to his listeners.

About the two guys, I agree that Adama needs them. Especially the flight deck captain (?, forgot his name).

I also thought the kiss was more than a friendly kiss. 1) It was on the lips, not the cheeck or forehead, and 2) it was prolonged just long enough for viewers to say "hey" (if it was harmless, we wouldn't be talking about it here).

IMO, there's no question, no matter which side of the being/machine debate you fall on - allowing your troops to engage in rape at will is not healthy for your command.

They should be more interested in getting #6 and Boomer in the same cell and trying to get them to "network". :)

The problem was that many, including the guys who bragged about doing it, and the XO (?) under Cain(sp?), said that it wasn't rape because they are machines.

My stomach riled both as Sharon/Boomer was about to get raped, and when Baltar found the Pegasus' #6 on the floor after having been beaten and raped.

Actually raping a machine clone, or your typical barnyard animal, is not exactly officerly in most military commands.

Just wanted to chime in and say I watched both episodes together this weekend, and it's probably the best television I have seen (outside of ROME on HBO) in the past 5 years, since Band of Brothers. So, for anyone from BSG who lurks on this forum, there's another vote of confidence. Keep things going in this direction please! Less pointless soap opera, more charged drama that makes logical sense given the setting (civilization wiped out, struggle to survive).

I LOVE the idea of the expanded dramatic possibilities of adding a second battlestar. Just giving starbuck the chance for a whole new job, etc, on the other ship. Great stuff. Please do not revert to the Gilligan's island paradigm of TV writing (dangling ways to escape from the island on every show, then yanking them away by the end). Keep both ships in the fleet and let the crews benefit from their accomplishment of having found each other, as they would in real life. Don't repeat the lameness of the 70s original when they followed the Gilligan's island paradigm and trumped up an excuse to send the Pegasus away.

As to the rape issue, yeah, it was hard hitting, dramatic, and effective, but I can't say I'm totally square with the outcome. While normally I would agree the military should conduct itself above board on such matters, this situation is not really a normal military situation. Imagine the entire world destroyed, only a few thousand people left in a small corner of it, and then discovering that the way they destroyed you was by infiltrating you with programmed machines to undermine from within. It would simply not be possible, once these insiders were discovered, to treat them with humane respect. That is the one unfortunate element of the show I've never been able to buy into. "Oh, honey, you're not human ... you're a what??... and your people just did what to mine?...well, that's bad honey, you're bad for committing massive genocide, bad, but I can forgive you. Take a 5 min time out in that room there and then we're friends again and I'll go back to spending my days pining over you." I choke on that, sorry.

As to the rape issue, yeah, it was hard hitting, dramatic, and effective, but I can't say I'm totally square with the outcome. While normally I would agree the military should conduct itself above board on such matters, this situation is not really a normal military situation. Imagine the entire world destroyed, only a few thousand people left in a small corner of it, and then discovering that the way they destroyed you was by infiltrating you with programmed machines to undermine from within. It would simply not be possible, once these insiders were discovered, to treat them with humane respect. That is the one unfortunate element of the show I've never been able to buy into. "Oh, honey, you're not human ... you're a what??... and your people just did what to mine?...well, that's bad honey, you're bad for committing massive genocide, bad, but I can forgive you. Take a 5 min time out in that room there and then we're friends again and I'll go back to spending my days pining over you." I choke on that, sorry.

I think the issue Moore & Co. are exploring with this storyline is more the power of love than the power of rational thinking. Both Helo and Tyrol love Boomer and their emotions (a very human trait) simply overpowered their more rational side. To them she's not a machine and rape is rape. And if Caprica Boomer has managed to defeat her Cylon programming (and is pregnant), then what does that say about our humanity if we reject her and punish her for the sins of others?

That's the beauty of this show - it raises such interesting questions, makes you think. Always, it's exploring what it means to be human.

And if Caprica Boomer has managed to defeat her Cylon programming (and is pregnant), then what does that say about our humanity if we reject her and punish her for the sins of others?

She hasn't. Her programmed primary goal was to become pregnant at all costs.

She hasn't. Her programmed primary goal was to become pregnant at all costs.

But she has seemingly overcome her "programming", and even #6 has turned her back on her. In Season 1, the guy with #6 asked why #6 referred to her by the human name, and #6 replied that it was because "Sharon" had "turned", or something to that effect.

I think the issue Moore & Co. are exploring with this storyline is more the power of love than the power of rational thinking. Both Helo and Tyrol love Boomer and their emotions (a very human trait) simply overpowered their more rational side. To them she's not a machine and rape is rape. And if Caprica Boomer has managed to defeat her Cylon programming (and is pregnant), then what does that say about our humanity if we reject her and punish her for the sins of others?

That's the beauty of this show - it raises such interesting questions, makes you think. Always, it's exploring what it means to be human.


I think you hit the nail on the head, archiguy.
Love over rationality is a big part of the story, at least where these characters are concerned.

I think you hit the nail on the head, archiguy.
Love over rationality is a big part of the story, at least where these characters are concerned.

HeHe...true. Love is a many Splendored Thing....

Also If it Looks like a Duck and Walks like a Duck...blah,blah,blah... :rolleyes:

I think the issue Moore & Co. are exploring with this storyline is more the power of love than the power of rational thinking. Both Helo and Tyrol love Boomer and their emotions (a very human trait) simply overpowered their more rational side. To them she's not a machine and rape is rape. And if Caprica Boomer has managed to defeat her Cylon programming (and is pregnant), then what does that say about our humanity if we reject her and punish her for the sins of others?

That's the beauty of this show - it raises such interesting questions, makes you think. Always, it's exploring what it means to be human.

Helo may be blinded by love and "fatherhood" but the Chief is an out right traitor. Remember back to the Water episode when he kept covering up for Boomer's obvious guilt. He never reported that she was soaking wet after the water tanks blew. Never reported the explosives in the Raptor. Heck he lied and let one of his shipmates go to the brig in order to cover for Sharon when she left the bulkhead open. Never reported any of it even after she shot the old man and was revealed a Cylon. Never mind his covering up of the fragging. No, Chief is hardly any better than Baltar. He is one of the shows least sympathetic characters if you ask me.


And I have to agree with "Steve in LA" about the Pegasus. I am really glad that it is sticking around. Not only does it make for better writing but it seems to be the more logical thing as well. I remember as a kid being very disappointed that the Pegasus was gone almost as quickly as it appeared. When you double your strength, and then some, you don't toss it away like a pair of twos.

And I have to agree with "Steve in LA" about the Pegasus. I am really glad that it is sticking around. Not only does it make for better writing but it seems to be the more logical thing as well. I remember as a kid being very disappointed that the Pegasus was gone almost as quickly as it appeared. When you double your strength, and then some, you don't toss it away like a pair of twos.

Don't be so sure the Pegasus is sticking around.... that would drastically change the dynamic of the show. As to it leading to "better writing", I'm not sure it would. I'm perfectly happy to go where Moore & Co. lead us, and so far it's been Galactica Against the World. It's been a good ride so far using that approach. I figured the Pegasus would suffer fatal damage during the Resurrection assault; but it seems that damage to both ships was slight. We'll see what happens this Friday vis a vis the Pegasus story arc.

My guess is that the Pegasus will continue the fight against the Cylons and the Gallactica will head towards Earth.

Probably out of necessity. Holding off the Cylons in a suicide mission just to allow the Galactica to escort the rest of the fleet to safety.

Don't be so sure the Pegasus is sticking around.... that would drastically change the dynamic of the show. As to it leading to "better writing", I'm not sure it would. I'm perfectly happy to go where Moore & Co. lead us, and so far it's been Galactica Against the World. It's been a good ride so far using that approach. I figured the Pegasus would suffer fatal damage during the Resurrection assault; but it seems that damage to both ships was slight. We'll see what happens this Friday vis a vis the Pegasus story arc.


:eek: Yikes. "Better writing" was the wrong choice of words. That's not really what I meant. The writing is brilliant as it is. I think I was trying to make a point about the added complexity that the Pegasus and its crew brings to the plot. I should review before I post.

Don't be so sure the Pegasus is sticking around.... that would drastically change the dynamic of the show. As to it leading to "better writing", I'm not sure it would. I'm perfectly happy to go where Moore & Co. lead us, and so far it's been Galactica Against the World. It's been a good ride so far using that approach. I figured the Pegasus would suffer fatal damage during the Resurrection assault; but it seems that damage to both ships was slight. We'll see what happens this Friday vis a vis the Pegasus story arc.

Anybody else notice that the white board in Roslin's office hasn't had it's numbers changed since the Pegasus showed up? It's still at around 45,000. Or did I miss it?

Maybe it's foreshadowing the future without Pegasus...

Anybody else notice that the white board in Roslin's office hasn't had it's numbers changed since the Pegasus showed up? It's still at around 45,000. Or did I miss it?

Maybe it's foreshadowing the future without Pegasus...

I think I saw it last ep and it was back up to 49,000+, probably reflecting the crew members of the Pegasus. They also flash the number during the opening theme montage, and it changes from week to week.

Probably out of necessity. Holding off the Cylons in a suicide mission just to allow the Galactica to escort the rest of the fleet to safety.

In the original series, this is pretty much what happenned. The Pegasus Vipers and some crew transferred to the Galactica before Pegasus held off 2 battlestars to save the rest of the fleet.

It was never determined that Pegasus and Cain(Lloyd Bridges) were goners. They kinda left it openended I guess if they decided to bring them back.

In the original series, this is pretty much what happenned. The Pegasus Vipers and some crew transferred to the Galactica before Pegasus held off 2 battlestars to save the rest of the fleet.


It was also a plotline in one of the better Star Trek TNG episodes, but I can't remember the title of the ep now.

Sounds similar to my favorite TNG episode where the Enterprise "C" comes forward in time just before they died trying to defend a Klingon outpost (leading to the treaty with the Klingons) - but because they left (in time) the current Enterprise was in full battle mode in a long term war with the Klingons (with about 6 months before sure defeat).

They sent the old ship back to their time to die for the good of the current time line. Picard was a selfish bastard.

Helo may be blinded by love and "fatherhood" but the Chief is an out right traitor. Remember back to the Water episode when he kept covering up for Boomer's obvious guilt. He never reported that she was soaking wet after the water tanks blew. Never reported the explosives in the Raptor. Heck he lied and let one of his shipmates go to the brig in order to cover for Sharon when she left the bulkhead open. Never reported any of it even after she shot the old man and was revealed a Cylon. Never mind his covering up of the fragging. No, Chief is hardly any better than Baltar. He is one of the shows least sympathetic characters if you ask me.


Just 2 points.

1. He never saw Sharon soaking wet.

2. The Chief is also "blinded by love".

Sounds similar to my favorite TNG episode where the Enterprise "C" comes forward in time just before they died trying to defend a Klingon outpost (leading to the treaty with the Klingons) - but because they left (in time) the current Enterprise was in full battle mode in a long term war with the Klingons (with about 6 months before sure defeat).


Yes, that's the one. Loved that one.

Sounds similar to my favorite TNG episode where the Enterprise "C" comes forward in time just before they died trying to defend a Klingon outpost (leading to the treaty with the Klingons) - but because they left (in time) the current Enterprise was in full battle mode in a long term war with the Klingons (with about 6 months before sure defeat).

They sent the old ship back to their time to die for the good of the current time line. Picard was a selfish bastard.


"Yesterday's Enterprise"

Excellent Episode, Christopher McDonald plays LT. Castillo (Tasha's love interest)...

Anybody else notice that the white board in Roslin's office hasn't had it's numbers changed since the Pegasus showed up? It's still at around 45,000. Or did I miss it?



At the beginning of the season the count was 47875, beginning of "Flight of the Phoenix" the count was 47603, at the beginning of "Pegasus" after the ships connected the count jumped to 49605. At the beginning of "Resurrection Ship Part 2" it was listed at 49604.

Just 2 points.

1. He never saw Sharon soaking wet.

2. The Chief is also "blinded by love".

Quibbling. OK, he didn't SEE her wet. But she did confess the entire thing to Chief about her being all wet and having detonators or explosives or whatever just after the explosion and not remembering anything about it. And Chief still kept it quiet. I'll have to bust out some DVDs but I seem to remember her also saying something like "I think I'm a Cylon." and Chief just saying "Ah, baby don't say that." It was getting pretty hard to believe that Chief Tyrol didn't know she was a Cylon. Maybe its because..................................................... .........................



OMG, OMG! :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:



THE CHIEF IS A CYLON!!!!!!!!!!!!

:D

Sounds similar to my favorite TNG episode where the Enterprise "C" comes forward in time just before they died trying to defend a Klingon outpost (leading to the treaty with the Klingons) - but because they left (in time) the current Enterprise was in full battle mode in a long term war with the Klingons (with about 6 months before sure defeat).

They sent the old ship back to their time to die for the good of the current time line. Picard was a selfish bastard."Let History Never forget the name Enterprise" or something like :D also my favorite TNG... I too cannot see the Pegasus staying around for too long...

"Yesterday's Enterprise"

Excellent Episode, Christopher McDonald plays LT. Castillo (Tasha's love interest)...I hate to say it but... remembering that episode makes me "tingle!" What a twist when Tasha finds out she suffered a "meaningless" death, which compelled her to join Castillo's crew on their suicide mission. I remember a 13-year-old-yout who first saw Capt. Kirk battling some lizard creature and thinking this is the coolest program he ever saw. Enterprise TNG had many great episodes too... but it was all downhill after that.

I hate to say it but... remembering that episode makes me "tingle!" What a twist when Tasha finds out she suffered a "meaningless" death, which compelled her to join Castillo's crew on their suicide mission. I remember a 13-year-old-yout who first saw Capt. Kirk battling some lizard creature and thinking this is the coolest program he ever saw. Enterprise TNG had many great episodes too... but it was all downhill after that.

I remember that ep well too, it was a two parter, as I recall. The best part was when Picard confided in someone, can't recall who. He said very somberly, as some low dramatic music plays, that `the war does not go well for the Federation'. That's what made that story good, the Federation always prevailed, the technology always prevailed, and this arc went against that.

It's also what I like about BSG. Survival is in doubt, and all the tech is in a supporting role.

That, and the co-ed living quarters! :o)

I remember that ep well too, it was a two parter, as I recall. The best part was when Picard confided in someone, can't recall who. He said very somberly, as some low dramatic music plays, that `the war does not go well for the Federation'. That's what made that story good, the Federation always prevailed, the technology always prevailed, and this arc went against that.

It's also what I like about BSG. Survival is in doubt, and all the tech is in a supporting role.

That, and the co-ed living quarters! :o)

"Yesterday's Enterprise" was not a two-parter. But it was one of the best eps the show ever did.

You're probably thinking of the two-part Borg ep where Picard is captured and turned into Locutus. The season ended on the cliffhanger with Riker ordering the Enterprise to fire on the Borg cube. I almost **** when I realized I'd have to wait a couple of months to find out what happened next!

I remember that ep well too, it was a two parter, as I recall. The best part was when Picard confided in someone, can't recall who. He said very somberly, as some low dramatic music plays, that `the war does not go well for the Federation'. That's what made that story good, the Federation always prevailed, the technology always prevailed, and this arc went against that.

It's also what I like about BSG. Survival is in doubt, and all the tech is in a supporting role.

That, and the co-ed living quarters! :o)

He was explaining to the Captain of the Enterprise C why they should go back. One more ship in the here and now would make no difference, they were losing the war. But if they went back it was possible that there would be no war, and billions of lives could be saved.

I was surprised by that revelation as well. We all assumed that the Federation would clean up in a war with the Klingons.

Anyway, back to BSG. I can't see how they can keep the Pegasus around for too much longer, the core of the show is about being outnumbered and outgunned, Pegasus makes things a little too easy (relatively speaking of course. They are still outnumbered and outgunned, but you know what I mean).

24 Hours to Go! :)

"Yesterday's Enterprise" was not a two-parter. But it was one of the best eps the show ever did.

You're probably thinking of the two-part Borg ep where Picard is captured and turned into Locutus. The season ended on the cliffhanger with Riker ordering the Enterprise to fire on the Borg cube. I almost **** when I realized I'd have to wait a couple of months to find out what happened next!


The Best of both Worlds Part 1 & 2

24 Hours to Go! :)
I woke up today thinking it was Friday... :( :eek: :D

Interview with Katee Sackhoff,

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/tv/256140_tv19.html
Sackhoff on the flak she's gotten for her strong, sexy Starbuck: Frack it

She talks about science-fiction like it's a bad thing.

Katee didn't even mention that her and Dirk met together for coffee and cigars at, where else, Starbuck's. You can find it on the DVD of the mini series. I know it was only a stunt, but they did seem to be getting a long by the looks in their eyes.

She talks about science-fiction like it's a bad thing.
I didn't read it that way, I read it as she was saying what we have been saying here,

Do you think it's being overlooked because it's on Sci Fi, or because it's "Battlestar Galactica," and they still remember Lorne Green and Dirk Benedict?

It's probably a little bit of both. You know, they focus on the shows that are on the networks. And that's fine. I was on a network show. I wasn't happy. But I'm perfectly happy where I am. I think that's part of it; I think they remember the original show and they're kind of wondering, "How do you take that and turn it into something that isn't sci fi?" And that's exactly what they've done, they've turned it into a drama first and a science-fiction series second. So, it's really not like the original at all.

and the fact that it is on SciFi people get put off by it from the start,

P-I: "Battlestar" has been getting a lot of critical notice, and earned a slot on the American Film Institute's top 10 shows of 2005. Must be nice.

Sackhoff: That's the biggest accolade that we've gotten so far. That gives us a little more credibility, I think. We always had it. But I think as a science-fiction show you get looked over, so many times, just because we're on Sci Fi. I'll meet people who haven't watched the show purely because it's on Sci Fi. I'm like, you've gotta be kidding me. It's not really science fiction.

that doesn't sound negative at all...she's stating the truth...there's a sort of stigma that goes with science fiction...I have friends who won't watch BSG just because it's on sci fi...

I didn't read it that way, I read it as she was saying what we have been saying here.[/B][/I]
Agreed. If this was on one of the premium channels (HBO, SHO) in the same time slot, it would be recognized and lauded as a drama in a sci-fi setting (and we'd be getting a little more nudity, and frackin' would be dropped for some real 'Deadwood" type language ;) ). I don't think she was putting sci-fi down at all, but rather the preconceived notions associated with shows presented on the Sci-Fi channel.

______________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind

Agreed. If this was on one of the premium channels (HBO, SHO) in the same time slot, it would be recognized and lauded as a drama in a sci-fi setting (and we'd be getting a little more nudity, and frackin' would be dropped for some real 'Deadwood" type language ;) ). I don't think she was putting sci-fi down at all, but rather the preconceived notions associated with shows presented on the Sci-Fi channel.

______________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind

So, you mean if BSG were on HBO, we'd have seen Michelle Forbes get naked, then have seen her actually get her brains blown out?

I'm OK with the former!

that doesn't sound negative at all...she's stating the truth...there's a sort of stigma that goes with science fiction...I have friends who won't watch BSG just because it's on sci fi...

Have to agree with that.

My gf won't watch anything on Sci-Fi, but she loves Star Wars. Go figure.

I see no reason to replace Frak, that is one of my favorites.

I am OK with nudity, but unless it has something to do with the story, I would rather watch it on SciFi and surf for gratuitous pictures later if required.

Switching networks for picture quality or HD, now that is something I could stand behind.

v/r,
C-F

I see no reason to replace Frak, that is one of my favorites.

v/r,
C-F
I've actually started using "frak" occasionally in place of the more infamous "f" word. :D

BTW, It's Friday!!! :p :D

I've actually started using "frak" occasionally in place of the more infamous "f" word. :D

BTW, It's Friday!!! :p :D

I have been using the slang Frak and Felgercarb since 1979......

:rolleyes:

A little over 6.5 hours to go till Episode 2x13

I've actually started using "frak" occasionally in place of the more infamous "f" word. :D

it got used quite a bit last night here at work when we did a(n unsuccessful) failover test of a pair of weblogic servers.

apparently the guys who wrote mailmarshall and akonix haven't seen BSG... ;-)

it got used quite a bit last night here at work when we did a(n unsuccessful) failover test of a pair of weblogic servers.

apparently the guys who wrote mailmarshall and akonix haven't seen BSG... ;-)

LOL

I've actually started using "frak" occasionally in place of the more infamous "f" word. :D


The wife & I use it all the time now, including all its various derivatives. It's pretty much replaced its more infamous cousin in our little lexicon. My Mom would be so proud! :p

Why say "It's not really science fiction" why not say "this is better than most science fiction". The assumption (or stigma being perpetuated) is that if it is good drama or if there is a good story, it is no longer science fiction. That's what I didn't like about the statement.

Why say "It's not really science fiction" why not say "this is better than most science fiction". The assumption (or stigma being perpetuated) is that if it is good drama or if there is a good story, it is no longer science fiction. That's what I didn't like about the statement.

CP is correct, just making a blanket statement that this show is not Sci-Fi sure doesn't make it so.

I've actually started using "frak" occasionally in place of the more infamous "f" word. :D
In mixed company by itself, its alright. But it just doesn't flow well in phrases like 'Why don't you take a flying frackin' leap', or one of my personal favorites "Wonderfrackinful".

See what I mean. :)

_______________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind

Why say "It's not really science fiction" why not say "this is better than most science fiction". The assumption (or stigma being perpetuated) is that if it is good drama or if there is a good story, it is no longer science fiction. That's what I didn't like about the statement.
I see what you're saying, she contradicts herself to a degree, I think the point she was making was that BG is primarily a drama that just happens to be in a SciFi setting. The themes running through the show could be presented in a non-SciFi genre.

I would certainly agree that those that do not generally like SciFi may very well like BSG. I just don't like any comments that seem to write off or minimize the whole genre.

I don't think it could work in a non-SciFi setting.
They do use a lot of current issues, but the fact that the cylons are machines adds an entire dynamic that wouldn't be there if it wasn't SciFi.

I see what you're saying, she contradicts herself to a degree, I think the point she was making was that BG is primarily a drama that just happens to be in a SciFi setting. The themes running through the show could be presented in a non-SciFi genre.

Wow, warhead security on the Galactica really sucks!

And Gina with her ponytail and glasses looks a million times better than halluci-six.

Hmm.. no radiation detectors? Must have bad shuttle security. Our airport security is sure better than the Galactica

And Gina with her ponytail and glasses looks a million times better than halluci-six.

Agree - she's got that "Hot for Teacher" look. :)

And Gina with her ponytail and glasses looks a million times better than halluci-six.
Any way you slice it, Tricia is a very beautiful woman; but, I agree, she looks even better when she's not all dolled up...

~Dan

I don't think it could work in a non-SciFi setting.
They do use a lot of current issues, but the fact that the cylons are machines adds an entire dynamic that wouldn't be there if it wasn't SciFi.
True, but consider what we know so far, the Cylons are not all machines, not human, but certainly not all machine. The toasters are to human-like Cylons as the Vipers are to the humans, tools to an end.

Tonight's ep, (another great one which probably doesn't even need to be said anymore) goes along ways to that point. IMO, it is becoming apparent that the human-like Cylons are far more human-like than they are machines

I can't believe after next week's ep there is a week off and it returns on Feb 10, they're killing me.. :( :p

Agree - she's got that "Hot for Teacher" look. :)
Yup, that's definitely a look I hope we see more of. :)

Yup, that's definitely a look I hope we see more of. :)

Agreed. Ponytail and glasses are hot. :cool:

Wife was talking during the short teaser which showed the cylon/human fetus/baby. Anyone remember exactly what the voice-over said during that teaser?

_________________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind

Does anyone else think they took care of Roslin's cancer a little too quickly & easily? I mean, her disease was such a big part of the storyline in both seasons thus far and now, just like that <snaps fingers>, it's over. Her cancer influenced her to such a large degree, gave her visions and a sense of urgency that governed her actions at times. I'm glad she's all better 'n all, and I'm happy she'll be sticking around, but that whole thing just seemed a little too neat and convenient.

So now we know that Cylon fetal blood (can you successfully withdraw blood from a growing fetus? I guess so...) has antibodies that cure cancer. Will that now lead to a program to "grow/harvest" them so that all disease in the fleet can be wiped out (get busy, Helo!), or will Sharon's baby be used as a "blood factory"? Will that now lead to another moral quandary-type plotline?

Well, I guess I'm going to have to just get over it with Chief and Helo. Not only are they back on duty but the show didn't even make mention of their legal status, which I can only assume is completely exonerated. I bet the Pegasus people loved that. And Helo really needs to be relieved. I can only imagine what would have happened to me in the military if I blocked the old mans way with my hand resting on my sidearm. Oh, well. Rap my skull and say three times "its just a show."

Anyway, another great episode:
This Cylon surrender movement isn't going away for the rest of the season. Makes me sick.
I was surprised that Baltar had completely unrestricted and uncontrolled access to that warhead. I can only assume it was operational too.
Laura's visions/memories of Baltar with Six on Caprica are going to be very significant I have to think. Maybe not this season, but eventual Baltar is going to find that saving the President was his undoing.
Anybody else sense a conflict between the "caporal Six" and the "Baltar Six"?

Does anyone else think they took care of Roslin's cancer a little too quickly & easily? I mean, her disease was such a big part of the storyline in both seasons thus far and now, just like that <snaps fingers>, it's over. Her cancer influenced her to such a large degree, gave her visions and a sense of urgency that governed her actions at times. I'm glad she's all better 'n all, and I'm happy she'll be sticking around, but that whole thing just seemed a little too neat and convenient.


That bothered me too. I kind of thought that when they introduced a dying character it meant a commitment to a Sopranos like style where anybody could be killed off. And now with the snap of a finger, no more dying Rosalyn. Maybe next week the Cylon fetal blood will be used as an alternative fuel for the Vipers. It screams of a Star Trek plot where they use "a reverse tackion beam tied to the main deflector dish" to dig themselves out of an impossible situation. Kind of hokey.

The only consolation is that just as the Cylons have a plan, Ron Moore is supposed to have a long term plan for the show. So what seems hokey now may be very significant in season 5 or 6. We'll see.

The whole subversive peace-nik plot will probably eat up the whole season. I hope the Pegasus is used in more story lines. Now we will see Balter become more and more the traitor like the first Balter was. He will come to hate Rosalyn, HATE HATE HATE.

Has anythone though of Nuke + Pegagus = hole in space?

Also, Ronald does mention the cancer in his podcast, woth a listen to fill in some of the blanks.
Also, the nuke was the one Adam gave him for the creating and testing of his Cylon detector.

It's "convenient", but the rapid recovery leaves absolutely no doubt that the hybrid blood healed her. As interesting as her dying is/was - the further blurring of the lines between Cylon/Human will make for more interesting discussion and possibilities. Roslin is now a hybrid of a human and a hybrid. If the blood running through the veins does not determine your human status, what does - a person's thoughts?

interesting point panther - as far as the baby they showed in the "teaser" - I dont think anything was said

jim

Wow... Another great episode last night!
It's getting to be a habit, but the writers are setting the standard incredibly high.
You could cut the tension with a knife. My wife was looking at me from time to time during the show and said- you know.. you actually let out a big sigh at the commercial breaks. I think she's right, I can feel the tension building during the broadcast. Incredible...

Baltar is really out there! Cant believe he gave Gina a nuke. Damn... a frakin Cylon in the fleet with a nuke. He's lost it. It's just a matter of time before someone finally puts 2+2+2+2 together and he gets nailed. Although I don't know if Roslyn can put the pieces of the puzzle together from recollections during her semi-conscious state. I agree, Gina looked hot with glasses and a pony tail, even better than Number Six- but her arms looked weird.... kind of skinny? Maybe I have to watch that scene again..

I'm not happy with the magical cure for cancer either, but Roslyn is a major and interesting character. I think the show would suffer with her loss. I was wondering if they'd have the gnads to actually kill her off. Glad they didn't. Besides, could anyone actually see Baltar acting as president??
Now I can't wait till next weeks episode!! Oh Frack.......

Oh yeah... nice CG of the tylium refinery ship. Don't know where they're getting the space bucks for all these big $$ effects.... but I like it! :D

Oh yeah... nice CG of the tylium refinery ship. Don't know where they're getting the space bucks for all these big $$ effects.... but I like it! :D

Speaking of..... Did they say anything about what the end result of the sabotage was? Did that ship lose its FTL drive? If so, they might have to abandon it.

I have been using the slang Frak and Felgercarb since 1979......

I'm pretty sure it's "Feldercarb".... I remember it quite well from the original; when I was a teen we all said it.

On last night's episode: Rosylin's recovery was quick, but I figured they would pull something out - she is too central of a character. Also, does anyone see an analog of the cylon embryonic fluid and stem cell research? Or an analog between the Cylon sympathizers and any number of terrorist sympathizers in today's world?

I like that BSG puts in a lot of stuff that is topical in today's environment but yet they don't try to make a pat right/wrong answer for it... they just lay it out and leave both sides open to interpretation.

I was totally bugged that Baltar was able to smuggle the nuke off the station. In previous eps, they have shown that Gallactica has internal and external radiation detectors and the suitcase they used was obviously plastic.

Great show, can't wait for each successive ep!!

JP

No, it was "felgercarb."

Man, I must be going deaf. I really had a hard time understanding a lot of the dialog last night. So much of it was whispered and throaty. I had my HT cranked up, too, and still was struggling to decipher it all. Just me? Or should I turn on the CC in the future?

Funny you should mention that. I had to turn on the subtitles as well, and I try never to do that as it's distracting and kind of takes you out of the show to an extent. But this last ep made it a necessity.

On last night's episode: Rosylin's recovery was quick, but I figured they would pull something out - she is too central of a character. Also, does anyone see an analog of the cylon embryonic fluid and stem cell research? Or an analog between the Cylon sympathizers and any number of terrorist sympathizers in today's world?

I like that BSG puts in a lot of stuff that is topical in today's environment but yet they don't try to make a pat right/wrong answer for it... they just lay it out and leave both sides open to interpretation.Sure, she had a quick recovery, but we don't really know yet how the transfusion might affect her long-term. She could potentially cross over onto the dark side. Things may get very interesting.

Yeah, BSG tends to reflect contemporary issues, not unlike ST:TOS. When they confronted the terrorist sympathizer in the arsenal and she instantly started screaming, I almost lost all bladder control. That was great stuff!

It's "convenient", but the rapid recovery leaves absolutely no doubt that the hybrid blood healed her. As interesting as her dying is/was - the further blurring of the lines between Cylon/Human will make for more interesting discussion and possibilities. Roslin is now a hybrid of a human and a hybrid. If the blood running through the veins does not determine your human status, what does - a person's thoughts?
Exactly what I was getting at in earlier posts, the definition of human in the biological sense simply can't be used as the litmus test. If the organism has all the traits of the stereotypical human, emotions, physical, etc. and possibly has what would be considered improvements(i.e. evolution), who's to say what is human and what isn't?

I love the way this show approaches these subjects and issues. I'm already dreading the end of the season in March. :(

Does anyone else think they took care of Roslin's cancer a little too quickly & easily? I mean, her disease was such a big part of the storyline in both seasons thus far and now, just like that <snaps fingers>, it's over.
I thought that was just all a little convenient as well, but while they were injecting her with the blood I couldn't help but think there could possibly be more going on, as in maybe there is more to that blood than just being super-blood. Maybe Roslin's spine won't glow, but it's conceivable that the blood contains what could be the difference between humans and the Cylon-style humans. Such as Boomer-Sharon, she didn't know what she was until she starting doing things deeply "programmed" in her. The blood could possibly contain microscopic sized programming.

As part of a Cylon plot it would make a degree of sense when one considers a running theme put forth by the Cylons, that "this has all happened before". Knowing what has happened before gives one an incredible advantage.

I loved the Cylon Blood as Cancer Cure idea so much that when Baltar explained it I laughed with delight. This twist didn't just allow the show to retain President Roslin, the strongest and most interesting character on the show next to Adama. It also opened the possibility that Roslin might somehow be "infected" by that blood and raised the question as how it might be used in other ways. And on and on. BSG is the most inventive and creative show on TV these days -- by far.

No, it was "felgercarb."

Hey Dave, do you have anything to prove that? If you google "feldercarb" you will get over 1800 entries; if you google "felgercarb" you get 758. Hardly scientific, but significant. I've played the original series DVD's and I'm hearing "feldercarb". Doesn't mean I'm right, but that's my opinion :)

JP

I just checked the spelling in a BSG novel, it is Feldercarb.

Actually, it looks like both versions may have been used.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fictional_expletives

In the Richard Hatch written novel, Armageddon, it is spelled feldercarb. He use to see it spelled that way in original scripts nearly 30 years ago and I could dig out my 1970's copy of BSG written by Glen A Larson.

Exactly what I was getting at in earlier posts, the definition of human in the biological sense simply can't be used as the litmus test. If the organism has all the traits of the stereotypical human, emotions, physical, etc. and possibly has what would be considered improvements(i.e. evolution), who's to say what is human and what isn't?

I love the way this show approaches these subjects and issues. I'm already dreading the end of the season in March. :(

It is has been establshed that the Cylons are synthetic and not organic. If that's the case the baby is not a true hybrid.

Apparently Sharon was carrying a human egg harvested from the "Farm". She is a surrogate, but after Helo impregnated that egg, the Cylon blood had some effect and forced a mutation of a HUMAN fetus. This baby will have resemble Helo and whoever they took that egg from.(Sharon might give her the glowing spine though)What exactly those mutations are anyones guess but if the Cylons can replicate this, it doesn't matter, these children would be raised by Cylons parents and of course, they wouldn't know the difference between a Cylon and a human.

Actually, it looks like both versions may have been used.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fictional_expletives

I have all 18 of the Original Series Novels and all 6 of the 2nd. comming novels, and it has been spelled both ways. same on the TV show via Captions.

Oh Well...... :D

Funny you should mention that. I had to turn on the subtitles as well, and I try never to do that as it's distracting and kind of takes you out of the show to an extent. But this last ep made it a necessity.


I didn't have trouble, except for one thing the Chief(?) said when they found the fake ammo, right before he turned around and it cut to the next shot. I think I was listening at -20RL, on Sci-Fi analog on Comcast.

On last night's episode: Rosylin's recovery was quick, but I figured they would pull something out - she is too central of a character. Also, does anyone see an analog of the cylon embryonic fluid and stem cell research? Or an analog between the Cylon sympathizers and any number of terrorist sympathizers in today's world?

I like that BSG puts in a lot of stuff that is topical in today's environment but yet they don't try to make a pat right/wrong answer for it... they just lay it out and leave both sides open to interpretation.



I agree about the "topical" subject matter. I mentioned a similar one with the "treatment" of the cylon captives.

That is an interesting theory about the "Farm" and the eggs implanted in [Caprica]Boomer, I do not know if I agree that is what is going on. I had not put too much thought into it, but I thought the humans in the "Farm" were pregnant and being used as surrogate mothers or experiments. It would be easy to simply harvest the eggs, are they not all created at birth?

Also, what great value would [Caprica]Boomer have for the Cylons if she was simply carrying a surrogate human egg with some cylon blood in it. I thought that the basis for her worth and the attention paid to success by B'iers et al. was that this child is the (or one of) the first successful mating between a human and a cylon.

Upon reflection, it seems odd that this is the first successful event, there would have been plenty of 'donors' -- lots of [Baltars], fully functional teens, and 20-somethings that would fornicate with a knothole as long as the splinters do not get too bad.

v/r,
C-F

There are 6 novels from this version of the series already?

Didn't they say "love" was a vital part of conception? That would be a neat "trick" to make love a pre-requisite for parenthood. Imagine being a teenager and assuring some girl you don't love her. Or saying, "I don't need a condom, I really can't stand you." :D

It is has been establshed that the Cylons are synthetic and not organic. If that's the case the baby is not a true hybrid.

Apparently Sharon was carrying a human egg harvested from the "Farm". She is a surrogate, but after Helo impregnated that egg, the Cylon blood had some effect and forced a mutation of a HUMAN fetus. This baby will have resemble Helo and whoever they took that egg from.(Sharon might give her the glowing spine though)What exactly those mutations are anyones guess but if the Cylons can replicate this, it doesn't matter, these children would be raised by Cylons parents and of course, they wouldn't know the difference between a Cylon and a human.
I tend to go with C/F on this, where was it established that Sharon was carrying a "farm" implanted egg? And that sort of belies the importance attached to the child as being a product of a human and a Cylon.

As far as Cylons being synthetic, the Raider Starbuck piloted was certainly more than just metal and silicon.

Just a theory, but what may be happening is the Cylons have mastered the biology of humans and have created virtually identical models(even improved upon the human species) but need something from the humans that could not be created by them. Possibly the reproductive DNA map, or something similar. Maybe the distinctly human trait of empathy. Or as CP mentioned, the undefinable trait called love.

As part of a Cylon plot it would make a degree of sense when one considers a running theme put forth by the Cylons, that "this has all happened before". Knowing what has happened before gives one an incredible advantage.

I'm still not sure I understand what the Cylons mean by that. Are they suggesting that reality is in some gigantic time loop that endlessly repeats, or simply that in the past humans made as many poor choice then as they do now?

I think the Cylons are just speaking from scripture when they say "this has happened before". Previous episodes have established they all consider themselves to be experts in interpreting their "bible" and they have mentioned before the scriptures talk about history continually repeating.

JP

I think the Cylons are just speaking from scripture when they say "this has happened before". Previous episodes have established they all consider themselves to be experts in interpreting their "bible" and they have mentioned before the scriptures talk about history continually repeating.
Sorry JP, but I'm compelled to reject that plausible explanation on the grounds that its just not science fiction-ey enough. ;)

I'd rather see them chart some unexplored territory like the space-time continuum. Its been virtually ignored by every science fiction based television series, and I'm tired of seeing it overlooked. :mad: :D

____________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind

I get the impression that they are talking about distinct and actual events, not a "history repeats itself" type of thing.

That is an interesting theory about the "Farm" and the eggs implanted in [Caprica]Boomer, I do not know if I agree that is what is going on. I had not put too much thought into it, but I thought the humans in the "Farm" were pregnant and being used as surrogate mothers or experiments. It would be easy to simply harvest the eggs, are they not all created at birth?

Also, what great value would [Caprica]Boomer have for the Cylons if she was simply carrying a surrogate human egg with some cylon blood in it. I thought that the basis for her worth and the attention paid to success by B'iers et al. was that this child is the (or one of) the first successful mating between a human and a cylon.

Upon reflection, it seems odd that this is the first successful event, there would have been plenty of 'donors' -- lots of [Baltars], fully functional teens, and 20-somethings that would fornicate with a knothole as long as the splinters do not get too bad.

v/r,
C-F

There are 6 novels from this version of the series already?

Understand Cylons are "synthetic", chemical fascimiles of a human. I know this is sci-fi but it is impossible for a manufactured being to reproduce organically with the genetic variations that are introduced by human reproduction.

The females at the farm were also "surrogates" but were impregnated by eggs that were artificiallly inseminated and were hooked up to a machine that would introduce Cylon blood into their bodies to produce these mutated children.

Sharon was probably the first attempt to impregnate by natural methods but her egg was taken from a human female. It is their first attempt I suppose to do it the "old fashioned way."

The important thing here is "Why do the Cylons still care about 50k humans trying to get away." To wipe the rest of them out. Nah!!!

Palladin,

that is hilarious! Great satirical post! I can't count the number of times frakking Star Trek messed with the time line.... it's kind of like, "hey, what can we do this week? OH, I dunno, let's do a timline thing again" heh.

JP

Last night's episode wasn't entirely "hunkey dorey" with me. I was entertained, as I am every week with BSG - but it wasn't of the calibre of 33 or the 1st Pegasus episode.

First of all, to see Chief down in the hangar bay ordering Cally around - HELLO - did he not just commit manslaughter? Or is there a hidden time line that we missed where he has already served some kind of commuted sentence? Rape or not rape, they still assualted an officer who was operating under orders, and that assault resulted in an officer's death.

If the mere beating up of an officer has a 'severe penalty' on Pegasus, then surely, the killing, accidental or otherwise, of an officer carries something. Perhaps RDM has a plan and this will reveal itself - but I really didn't expect to see Helo and Chief wandering around as if nothing happened.

And then, the fetus blood? Roslin is now miraculously cured? Talk about jumping the shark. How convenient that someone in their last throws of life gets an injection of "magic elixir" and now they're up and about, lucid and fit.

And what's going on up in the CIC - with Apollo and Tigh getting snotty with each other. Boss's son or not, Tigh is a superior and Apollo owes him respect - especially when they are on duty.

I'm seeing a pattern where disobedience and lawlessness is rewarded:

Chief covers for Boomer time and time again - even gets one of his own guys sent to jail.
Chief is in on a conspiracy with several other crewman over the wrongful death of Crashdown.
Cally shoots a prisoner right in the mdidle of a crowded hallway.
Apollo commits outright treason and mutiny.
Starbuck disobeys orders to fly to Caprica
Chief and Helo assualt and kill an officer who was merely doing his job.

And, what's with the nuke getting off the Galactica - with nuke detectors everywhere?

And when, oh when, will people wise up and realize what a flake Baltar is? He talks to himself in the hallways, he pulls on his pud behind oil drums, and he aided a prisoner of war to not only kill a flag officer, but also secreted her off the ship - surely there are logs and surveillance to show that he did it.

It'll be interesting to see how this pans out for the remainder of the series, but this was not my favorite episode.

----------------
"You can't rape a machine." - Col Fisk.

...Sharon was probably the first attempt to impregnate by natural methods but her egg was taken from a human female. It is their first attempt I suppose to do it the "old fashioned way."I get the impression that this particular model of Sharon is the first to have (human-female) reproductive organs, or at least the first model to attempt to use them. Someone in last season's thread posted they could not believe she is the first to do so. Again, they have a plan; it has to start somewhere. The cylons seem to be able to synthesize blood of some sort, but who knows what/where it's devrived from. Some kinda nano-DNA fluid?

Chief and Helo assualt and kill an officer who was merely doing his job.
Merely doing his job? :eek:

Merely doing his job? :eek:

No real Military would allow that to hapen.

It sure was not tolerated in the US Navy.

I get the impression that this particular model of Sharon is the first to have (human-female) reproductive organs, or at least the first model to attempt to use them. Someone in last season's thread posted they could not believe she is the first to do so. Again, they have a plan; it has to start somewhere. The cylons seem to be able to synthesize blood of some sort, but who knows what/where it's devrived from. Some kinda nano-DNA fluid?


Listen Fake reproductive organs are just that fake. Synthetic and organic just don't mix, period. Again this is sci-fi, so I will allow the possibility that the writers can do as they wish but based on the episodes presented to this point I believe that they are trying to keep the science part of this as real as they can.

The Cylons need the humans to produce children. Up untill now, all they can do is make more of the current models that they have. I assume that these models do not age per se, but do break down. The Cylons want to be with God in heaven and in their current incarnation can not achieve this due to their built in immortality. If they can somehow become human ala Pinochio they can be with God upon death.

Understand Cylons are "synthetic", chemical fascimiles of a human. I know this is sci-fi but it is impossible for a manufactured being to reproduce organically with the genetic variations that are introduced by human reproduction.No one believes that we can do this now, but given that cylons exist with DNA and chromosomes close enough to fool most tests, what makes these 'manufactured' beings any different than a sheep-goat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid#Interspecific_hybrids) or a geep (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geep), a lab mouse (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimera_%28genetics%29#Research_chimerism), or even a human (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimera_%28genetics%29#Tetragametic_chimerism)? A chimera would be neat, and maybe the optical port and 'trick' spinal lights are how the cylon parts communicate with each other.

I have no doubt that any fake reproductive organs would be non-functional like styling elements on cars, but some of those hood scoops, ducts, nitrous buttons, and coffee can exhausts are functional. Evidently, Boomer's pipes work...

v/r,
C-F

In any event, the heart of the show is in the character interactions. The various deus ex machina and other architecture necessary to set the stage is fun to poke around at but ultimately irrelevant to me watching.

I am rather a newbie to BSG having first tuned in to watch the mini-series that was in HD on NBC last year. Since then I've been hooked. But I don't have the historical background that many of the posters here seem to present in their various arguments. I'm trying to pay attention and learn. It would seem there should be a means in the scripts from week to week for a new viewer to get up to speed on things. However, the complexity of the story line renders the "intro" each episode to be woefully inadequate. How do producers expect to draw a new faithful audience given such complexity? I realize this is the challenge for the genre of these kinds of programs, e.g. Lost, West Wing (to a degree), 24, etc. - how to draw new viewers.

ANYWAY, with my limited knowledge of what the frak is going on, I have a few observations:

Who made the Cylons? - Man. And man must have imbued the Cylons with someone's religious beliefs. (Why aren't they agnostic?) Within those beliefs, it seems they share the same concept of events happening time and again with their creators. Not a space/time continuum but a circle of certain and specific repetitiveness. IIRC, President Roslyn professed such beliefs too, when arguing for the mission to Caprica to retrieve the golden arrow.

I believe the "hidden time line" that Crule observed is in fact not so hidden, given the advance in Sharon's pregnancy state between the prior episode and when Baltar needled his way into her fetus. I suspect a number of weeks, if not months, have passed when all the military tribunals might have taken place. I agree the script advances without that being satifactorily resolved but I think there is time in there in which it could be concluded to have taken place.

I think Pres. Roslyn will turn out to be a sleeper Cylon as a result of her cure. As much as I agree that the organic and inorganic simply cannot mix scientifically, I think this is the fiction part of the sci-fi that the writers will expect us to swallow. She may turn out to be the last link between the "races" that ultimately resolves their differences so everyone can live happily ever after (or die and meet God). Now, I may be delusional in this not knowing if BSG is a resolveable struggle. I mean, the story arc is 35+ years in the telling? Is there a faction of followers who thinks there IS an ending?

If there is an ending I hope it doesn't come too soon; I'm loving the ride. Great show! Please be kind if I'm too far off base. :)

It's "convenient", but the rapid recovery leaves absolutely no doubt that the hybrid blood healed her. As interesting as her dying is/was - the further blurring of the lines between Cylon/Human will make for more interesting discussion and possibilities. Roslin is now a hybrid of a human and a hybrid. If the blood running through the veins does not determine your human status, what does - a person's thoughts?



Good Point CP. That is the big question....Do Cylons have a soul/spirit? Are they now a sentient life form? Can they break away from the "hive mind"....and have thier own thoughts? Or are they always influenced unknowingly by the "Hive". Is it just a hive? Or is there a #1? (My brain hurts now :D)

I do not think President Roslin is any more Cylon then if we would become Ape-Like if we got a transfusion of blood from an Ape. It always boils down: (to me anyways) "It is what is between the Ears that counts..."

The Colonials will have to eventualy (However reluctantly) to accept the Cylons as their equals. This is how I see it ending no matter how many seasons (Or theatrical movies) down the road this excellent series ends up.

No one believes that we can do this now, but given that cylons exist with DNA and chromosomes close enough to fool most tests, what makes these 'manufactured' beings any different than a sheep-goat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid#Interspecific_hybrids) or a geep (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geep), a lab mouse (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimera_%28genetics%29#Research_chimerism), or even a human (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimera_%28genetics%29#Tetragametic_chimerism)? A chimera would be neat, and maybe the optical port and 'trick' spinal lights are how the cylon parts communicate with each other.

I have no doubt that any fake reproductive organs would be non-functional like styling elements on cars, but some of those hood scoops, ducts, nitrous buttons, and coffee can exhausts are functional. Evidently, Boomer's pipes work...

v/r,
C-F

In any event, the heart of the show is in the character interactions. The various deus ex machina and other architecture necessary to set the stage is fun to poke around at but ultimately irrelevant to me watching.

This I do not disagree with.

Part of the teaser for the show is that the Cylons " have a plan". What exactly are the details are unclear but apparently they are attempting to produce a new human variant to repopulate the colonies and establish their own utopia. All I have tried to speculate at is what is the "plan" for those 50k humans fleeing the "Cylon tyranny."

I believe they need the humans to "love" Cylons in order for them to begin repopulate Caprica. They surely could have destroyed the fleet many times over but haven't done so. Why? Why waste resources chasing the fleet out into deep space? Either they are really pissed at Adama or they need these people for something.

This I do not disagree with.

Part of the teaser for the show is that the Cylons " have a plan". What exactly are the details are unclear but apparently they are attempting to produce a new human variant to repopulate the colonies and establish their own utopia. All I have tried to speculate at is what is the "plan" for those 50k humans fleeing the "Cylon tyranny."

I believe they need the humans to "love" Cylons in order for them to begin repopulate Caprica. They surely could have destroyed the fleet many times over but haven't done so. Why? Why waste resources chasing the fleet out into deep space? Either they are really pissed at Adama or they need these people for something.

The goal of the cylons is to exterminate the Human race, and advance the Cylon race.

The goal of the cylons is to exterminate the Human race, and advance the Cylon race.

... and for some reason, some people in the fleet are trying to demonize them. :)

I did like how the flashbacks revealed that Roslyn's toughness was in her all along (dealing with the teacher's strike, and refusing to resign when Adar asked her to), although it was all behind the scenes machinations, so no one (at least no one who survived the Cylon attack) was aware of it.

I did like how the flashbacks revealed that Roslyn's toughness was in her all along (dealing with the teacher's strike, and refusing to resign when Adar asked her to), although it was all behind the scenes machinations, so no one (at least no one who survived the Cylon attack) was aware of it.

I like the part were they showed Roslyn watching Baltar and Gina / #6 kissing in public....... Now we know what the President will hold against Baltar....... :D

The goal of the cylons is to exterminate the Human race, and advance the Cylon race.


There is no Cylon race and can never be, only Cylon machines and human replicants. Without humans they can not produce chilidren. Essentially they are trying to advance a mutated-modified human race.

This is an element that Ron Moore has introduced in his BSG, in order to keep the Cylons in the game so to speak whereas the old BSG kinda lost its way.

All of this HAS happened before!
Didn't anyone see the first series?

There is no Cylon race and can never be, only Cylon machines and human replicants. Without humans they can not produce chilidren. Essentially they are trying to advance a mutated-modified human race.

This is an element that Ron Moore has introduced in his BSG, in order to keep the Cylons in the game so to speak whereas the old BSG kinda lost its way.

The Advanced Cylons have now gained sentients (sp) level of reasoning, so yes, they are a race. a race of machines and a race of semi organic lifeforms.

The Advanced Cylons have now gained sentients (sp) level of reasoning, so yes, they are a race. a race of machines and a race of semi organic lifeforms.

The definition of a race includes the ability to breed among themselves, they cannot do this. They can make more machines and replicants but cannot breed as organic lifeforms.

The definition of a race includes the ability to breed among themselves, they cannot do this. They can make more machines and replicants but cannot breed as organic lifeforms.

includes but does not require it. If you want to argue this, please take it off the forum.

If you want to argue this, please take it off the forum.

:confused:

Why??

Really...why? I believe the Humans have to recognize the Cylons as a race of beings in order to understand them and deal with them. If they keep thinking of them as simply machines they will lose the war.

They already lost the war - the only question now is how best to survive.

They already lost the war - the only question now is how best to survive.
By using that home theater the Cylons have and inviting some of the boys and girls over to watch some blue movies. :) :D

What is in-organic about them? They appear to have carbon based molecules.

Does "Race" not imply a subset of a Genus and Species? Algae and other asexual reproducing organisms are considered as separate genus and species. So they probably are not technically a human 'race' but they certainly can be a species as long as they can reproduce at least clones that can act and learn independently.

Ignoring "Caprica Harbor" and abstracting out the current politics and maneuverings, at the basic level: what differentiates them from a Kodiak Bear? Both have individuals of varying temperament, both attempt to survive, both compete with us for resources, both routinely kill humans in encounters. What differentiated us from the Neanderthals?

The units seem to be capable of independent thought and temperament. It seems that it would be a big cognitive dissonance to be collectively looking for a way to die and meet their god, because they could simply turn off the radio and allow individuals to die without being sucked back up into the consciousness and reborn.

Now, just speculating wildly, that there could be another layer that promotes this belief system in the individuals, but really resides above them in the collective [network of interconnected units]. That need to guide and motivate the individual autonomous units into doing the work of an incorporeal 'upper management' which has different agendas would drive some big cognitive dissonances. Just not allowing Gina to disconnect from [Skynet] because that reduces the processing capacity of the distributed [Imperious Leaders] may be one example of one where the desires of any upper management clash with the individual units and their beliefs.

Anyway, it is all in fun and games, although I did agree with archiguy et al. about the quickness of the cancer cure. I thought it could have been drawn out more realistically and run parallel with the other sympathizer threads. But who knows, maybe it makes more sense when you have the big picture of their storyline into the future...

v/r,
C-F

They appear to have carbon based molecules.

So do pencils. :)

For those that believe procreation is necessary to be considered a race, are you conceding that if they develop a way to replicate a human egg (internally) and can concieve - are they now human - or at least no longer to be considered machines?

Take the fleet back to Caprica and make PEACE with the Cylons.

Yes, pencils, plants, and cylons all mostly made of organic material. :) However organic is also used to denote equipment or capabilities inherent to a creature/unit/group. Sometimes I am confused as to which definition of organic that folks are using, even in the same post.

v/r,
C-F

So do pencils. :)

For those that believe procreation is necessary to be considered a race, are you conceding that if they develop a way to replicate a human egg (internally) and can concieve - are they now human - or at least no longer to be considered machines?

If that were possible,yes, but I don't think they can, based on what info the show has given us.

I believe that one of the possible story lines that in their quest to go to God, they have to become more human and get everything that comes with that good and bad.

Take the fleet back to Caprica and make PEACE with the Cylons.

You wacky peaceniks are going to get us all killed. :)

If they wanted peace, they'd have sent some human Cylons as ambassadors instead of 150 nuclear warheads.

The Advanced Cylons have now gained sentients (sp) level of reasoning, so yes, they are a race. a race of machines and a race of semi organic lifeforms.

Don't mistake insanely great programing for your "sentients (sp) level of reasoning". Even if their actions seem genuine, you have to assume that it is just part of their programming or some sub routine.

So do pencils. :)

For those that believe procreation is necessary to be considered a race, are you conceding that if they develop a way to replicate a human egg (internally) and can concieve - are they now human - or at least no longer to be considered machines?
Maybe they are better than "human"...who's to say humans are the pinnacle of life forms..?

You wacky peaceniks are going to get us all killed. :)

If they wanted peace, they'd have sent some human Cylons as ambassadors instead of 150 nuclear warheads.


Couldn't agree more...all the hippies saying they should make peace are ignoring the fact that they WERE at peace before the Cylons attacked. Humans didn't start this round of the war.

What differentiated us from the Neanderthals?

v/r,
C-F

The Neanderthals had larger brains but a less developed intellect, not to mention bigger and srtonger. :)

"Don't mistake insanely great programing for your "sentients (sp) level of reasoning". Even if their actions seem genuine, you have to assume that it is just part of their programming or some sub routine."

I think this is the essential mystery of the show right now. Cylons like Sharon certainly seem convincing and sincere - is it for real, or all just a (really good) act? Can a species that started out as machines master biology enough to evolve into biological based life forms? It already takes a special blood test to tell the difference - at what point do we accept them as another lifeform?

Although Roslyn's illness was healed quickly, it brings up many new possibilities for the future. Can you ever really trust her now? It's impossible to predict the full effects of introducing alien blood into her.

This is such a great show.

Listen Fake reproductive organs are just that fake. Synthetic and organic just don't mix, period. Again this is sci-fi, so I will allow the possibility that the writers can do as they wish but based on the episodes presented to this point I believe that they are trying to keep the science part of this as real as they can.
I was only suggesting that perhaps Sharon's a synthetic carrier for organic life. Meaning, having a human womb, not synthetic. But if so, she would need to regularly intake organic (food) material to keep those organs running. And she'd likely have a monthly menstrual cycle, also.



I do not think President Roslin is any more Cylon then if we would become Ape-Like if we got a transfusion of blood from an Ape. It always boils down: (to me anyways) "It is what is between the Ears that counts..."Why? We don't yet know what makes up the cylon blood. Whatever it is, it's close to being human in content, but there's something a bit special about it. I wonder if Baltar really knows what that special something is.

Hey guys...

These writers aren't idiots.

They've hurried the plot line of the President's healing to get to the more juicy parts, don't you think? We haven't got all fracking year.

They wrote the story line, after all. You guys are just chicken-littles....trying to "out guess" them. :)

Lay back and enjoy it.

Love it!!!!

Ed

Ed, where da heck you been?
BTW, guessing is fun.

Hey Ed, welcome back. Great show isn't it? :) :)

I think some of the boys in the Time Machine thread would love this show. :D

If the Cylons can exercise free will - even only 90% of the time - assuming the other 10% is completely under control of their programming - is that enough?

If the Cylons can exercise free will - even only 90% of the time - assuming the other 10% is completely under control of their programming - is that enough?


Yes, Original Gina/#6 who decided to save Baltar showed independent Thought.

Wow!

Thanks, guys. I'm am truly honored.

If, indeed, they have a story line of about 2-4 years, they have to pace themselves, don't you think? Can't spill it all at once. No! They have something planned and it ain't frivolous. :)

Ed

Hey Ed, welcome back. Great show isn't it? :) :)

I think some of the boys in the Time Machine thread would love this show. :D

BSG is the best show that I've seen in many a moon.

Keenan: Don't know about that crowd in the Time Machine group, though. I'm sure they mean well, but they scare me. LMAO. :D :D :D

What fun!

Ed

Well I am looking forward to the episode #18 Downloaded. It is a look through the Cylon eyes. Should help a bit on how they tick.

Yes, Original Gina/#6 who decided to save Baltar showed independent Thought.

Indeed, Gina-No. 6 loves Baltar -- in a virtual sort of way.

On a biochemical level, there is no reason that a machine with the right molecules attached in the right places on a micro or nanoscopic level could not interprolate into human DNA in a fashion unrecognized by human DNA repair mechanisms or the human immune system.

It is not only theoretically possible, but it will be coming in our children's lifetimes.

It would seem there should be a means in the scripts from week to week for a new viewer to get up to speed on things. However, the complexity of the story line renders the "intro" each episode to be woefully inadequate. How do producers expect to draw a new faithful audience given such complexity? I realize this is the challenge for the genre of these kinds of programs, e.g. Lost, West Wing (to a degree), 24, etc. - how to draw new viewers.

IMO, they don't, and I seriously hope they never, ever change that. There is no way to give enough background in each and every episode to bring a new viewer up to speed that wouldn't drive the regular viewers absolutely crazy. Not to mention it would create horribly bad expositionary writing, where characters are constantly repeating information they already know to each other.

The only way to create a show that is truly accessible to anyone, anytime is to do only standalone episodes, and never really bother with much character development. There are plenty of shows like that -- most of what's on CBS prime time, and all of Law & Order and a zillion other procedural shows. I think it's fair enough for at least a few shows to be serialized and allowed to grow, change, and develop their stories over time.

I expect the producers think that if a viewer stumbles onto the show and is intrigued, they can go out and buy/borrow/rent the DVD sets. Everything but the most recent few episodes is already on DVD.

Who made the Cylons? - Man. And man must have imbued the Cylons with someone's religious beliefs.

I don't agree. The Cylons the humans made were simple robots -- the big, dumb toasters we saw in the museum. Why would a robot -- which the humans believed was not sentient -- be programmed with any religious beliefs? Would you program a PC with religious beliefs? A vacuum cleaner? I don't think the humans originally viewed the Cylons as any different.

I believe the "hidden time line" that Crule observed is in fact not so hidden, given the advance in Sharon's pregnancy state between the prior episode and when Baltar needled his way into her fetus. I suspect a number of weeks, if not months, have passed when all the military tribunals might have taken place. I agree the script advances without that being satifactorily resolved but I think there is time in there in which it could be concluded to have taken place.

It isn't hidden at all. Baltar says to Six, when he sees her in the hallway, that he hasn't seen her in "weeks."

I think Pres. Roslyn will turn out to be a sleeper Cylon as a result of her cure. As much as I agree that the organic and inorganic simply cannot mix scientifically, I think this is the fiction part of the sci-fi that the writers will expect us to swallow.

I would disagree again, though I suppose anything's possible. But it's not like the Cylons ever anticipated this contingency -- there's certainly no evidence that they did. I'm not going to get involved in the organic/inorganic debate, but I don't think the fact that she got a syringeful of Cylon blood is going to make her into a Cylon, or a Cylon agent. That seems like a result that's way too much technobabble of the kind Ron Moore has gone out of his way to avoid.

I don't agree. The Cylons the humans made were simple robots -- the big, dumb toasters we saw in the museum. Why would a robot -- which the humans believed was not sentient -- be programmed with any religious beliefs? Would you program a PC with religious beliefs? A vacuum cleaner? I don't think the humans originally viewed the Cylons as any different.In BSG:TOS, the cylons were created by an alien race. I hope they don't introduce them into this storyline....would seem too hokey, IMO.

Maybe they are better than "human"...who's to say humans are the pinnacle of life forms..?

I do. And I got a BFG for you if you don't believe me.

In BSG:TOS, the cylons were created by an alien race. I hope they don't introduce them into this storyline....would seem too hokey, IMO.

Yeah, but it's been pretty well established that isn't the case here, hasn't it? The Cylons being humanity's children come home and all? Besides, in the intro to the show, doesn't it say "The Cylons were created by man" ?

I do. And I got a BFG for you if you don't believe me.

BFG...? :confused:

I'm not going to get involved in the organic/inorganic debate, but I don't think the fact that she got a syringeful of Cylon blood is going to make her into a Cylon, or a Cylon agent. That seems like a result that's way too much technobabble of the kind Ron Moore has gone out of his way to avoid.

Not to suck you into the debate, but if the organs are identical - what else, other than the blood, distinguishes a Cylon from a human?

Normally BFG = Big Fracking Gun (from DOOM et al). I have no idea if that is what he meant though...

v/r,
C-F

Even the token girl on the board knows this one. :)

Big F**king Gun. Doom reference.

(Or should we say Fraking?)

Not to suck you into the debate, but if the organs are identical - what else, other than the blood, distinguishes a Cylon from a human?

The fact that they are created by non-biological means (e.g., not the union of egg and sperm, as its been established they can't reproduce that way)? Whatever makes their spine all glowy red during sex? I don't know! I barely passed cellular biology in high school. That's why I don't want to debate it. :)

But even if their blood is what makes them all Specially Cylon, that doesn't mean, to me, that if you get one syringe of blood you are converted into a Cylon, or made any less human. There's nothing demonstrating that syringe did anything other than kill the cancer cells, or whatever... I just don't see any evidence that it took over her body entirely and made her a Cylon.

They do make artificial blood products now, don't they? If you get some of those, do you become less human? I'm just not seeing -- at this point -- why this is any different.

I really don't believe President Roslin will become a Cylon. She might become more understanding of them as a race...but she will remain totally Human.

Has anyone here read the Blogs over at the Sci-fi channel forums? It is stated that the "toasters" are not sentient life forms.

Normally BFG = Big Fracking Gun (from DOOM et al). I have no idea if that is what he meant though...

v/r,
C-F
I'm sure he meant Big Friendly Grin, if it were the definition most commonly attached to BFG, as you note, it would actually prove my point. ;)

There's nothing demonstrating that syringe did anything other than kill the cancer cells, or whatever... I just don't see any evidence that it took over her body entirely and made her a Cylon.

Not yet. I didn't say it took her over entirely and made her a Cylon. I postulated that the measure of Cylon blood she was given could, perhaps in the future, make her just that bit more sympathetic (maybe not the right word I'm looking for) in her dealings with Cylons.

I think they could have come up with any other number of ways to cure or control her cancer that we would have subscribed to. But to get the cure from Cylon blood says to me we need to remember it is coursing through her veins.

The seed has been planted.

I really don't believe President Roslin will become a Cylon. She might become more understanding of them as a race...but she will remain totally Human.

Has anyone here read the Blogs over at the Sci-fi channel forums? It is stated that the "toasters" are not sentient life forms.
By toasters, if you mean the robot looking Cylons, yes that's pretty much a given, I think we're discussing the human replicant Cylons such as Gina and Sharon and how much of them is "human" and/or what differentiates them from humans. In my mind it is becoming more and more nebulous, and I think it adds tremendously to the overall story.

Whatever makes their spine all glowy red during sex? I don't know! I barely passed cellular biology in high school. That's why I don't want to debate it. :)

Don't feel bad, I remember most of my cellular/molecular biology, and I'm pretty sure they never even addressed the glowing spine issue. ;)

But even if their blood is what makes them all Specially Cylon, that doesn't mean, to me, that if you get one syringe of blood you are converted into a Cylon, or made any less human.

If the blood can heal human tissue or destroy cancer, it could easily grow to the extent that it overtakes (replaces/improves) the human blood cells. At the pace it healed Roslin, I'd say that by the next episode, she should have all Cylon blood. :eek:

Not yet. I didn't say it took her over entirely and made her a Cylon. I postulated that the measure of Cylon blood she was given could, perhaps in the future, make her just that bit more sympathetic (maybe not the right word I'm looking for) in her dealings with Cylons.

Uh, you said "sleeper Cylon." Which to me, means she's a Cylon. Just like a sleeper terrorist is a terrorist.

I think they could have come up with any other number of ways to cure or control her cancer that we would have subscribed to. But to get the cure from Cylon blood says to me we need to remember it is coursing through her veins.

Yes, but that would mean... curing cancer, wouldn't it? Which this society has never been able to do before, or it wouldn't even be a story point. But suddenly they manage to do so, with their limited personnel and resources, in the six months after a genocide that destroys all but 50,000 of them? That, to me, is way less plausible than a cure coming from a source that they never had access to before, like the Cylons.

The seed has been planted.

I guess time will tell, but the only thing I'm anticipating is that she isn't completely cured, but in remission, and the cancer could return.

Not yet. I didn't say it took her over entirely and made her a Cylon. I postulated that the measure of Cylon blood she was given could, perhaps in the future, make her just that bit more sympathetic (maybe not the right word I'm looking for) in her dealings with Cylons.

I think they could have come up with any other number of ways to cure or control her cancer that we would have subscribed to. But to get the cure from Cylon blood says to me we need to remember it is coursing through her veins.

The seed has been planted.
I believe so as well, they would not have gone through that whole scenario to cure her if there wasn't going to be "strings" attached, you would have to think that there would be a least a modicum of empathy for her savior.

If she starts doing shots of 3-in-1 oil, it's time for impeachment. :)

If she starts doing shots of 3-in-1 oil, it's time for impeachment. :)

Aw, that wouldn't get her impeached. Now, if she were to start fooling around with Billy... ;)

It would be cool if she got her own #6 hallucinations.

It would be cool if she got her own #6 hallucinations.
You took the thought right out of my head, hallucinations with #6 of course.. :eek: :D

A good read in the HOTP thread,

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6983479#post6983479
Hot Off The Press! The Latest Television News and Info - AVS Forum

Aw, that wouldn't get her impeached. Now, if she were to start fooling around with Billy... ;)

P.O.2.C. Deuella might have something to say about that. :p

A good read in the HOTP thread,

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6983479#post6983479
Hot Off The Press! The Latest Television News and Info - AVS Forum


Good Article.

^^ I agree

Not yet. I didn't say it took her over entirely and made her a Cylon. I postulated that the measure of Cylon blood she was given could, perhaps in the future, make her just that bit more sympathetic (maybe not the right word I'm looking for) in her dealings with Cylons.

I think they could have come up with any other number of ways to cure or control her cancer that we would have subscribed to. But to get the cure from Cylon blood says to me we need to remember it is coursing through her veins.

The seed has been planted.


empathetic? If so I agree with you and it may be either the link to mutual survival or the cause for our destruction.

Wife was talking during the short teaser which showed the cylon/human fetus/baby. Anyone remember exactly what the voice-over said during that teaser?
"Life; fragile, peaceful, innocent. What start's off microscopic, has the power to change everything."

Be sure to press the 'mute-spouse' button next time. j/k..... :p



Not yet. I didn't say it took her over entirely and made her a Cylon. I postulated that the measure of Cylon blood she was given could, perhaps in the future, make her just that bit more sympathetic (maybe not the right word I'm looking for) in her dealings with Cylons.
That's exactly what I meant, also. That only her thoughts and reasoning could lean toward the dark side; She won't be growing any fiber optics and that kinda thing.

Any way you slice it, Tricia is a very beautiful woman; but, I agree, she looks even better when she's not all dolled up...

~Dan

Oh yeah, definately intrigued by the "school teacher look"

Man, I must be going deaf. I really had a hard time understanding a lot of the dialog last night. So much of it was whispered and throaty. I had my HT cranked up, too, and still was struggling to decipher it all. Just me? Or should I turn on the CC in the future?



Speaking of that, did I hear the big "F" bomb word from someone in a viper???

I had to replay that myself...it was still "Frack"...but sounded REALLY close.

By toasters, if you mean the robot looking Cylons, yes that's pretty much a given, I think we're discussing the human replicant Cylons such as Gina and Sharon and how much of them is "human" and/or what differentiates them from humans. In my mind it is becoming more and more nebulous, and I think it adds tremendously to the overall story.

Oh I agree. I also understand what is being talked about...I was just making a point that Ron Moore has a blog that helps out on in show info. I am not sure if everyone knew that.

As for that spine glowing red thing...well mine doesn't glow...but, I have had my back go out on me during that kind of activity. :D Sure be nice to have some Cylon blood to heal our ache & pains.

Seriously though...isn't the blood from the fetus a hy-bred blood? Being that is is from a Human & Cylon parent. Not a pure Cylon blood sample. I do not think or believe President Roslin will become any way like a Cylon...she wil have to deal with her "Racism" about them though.

it wasn't the cylon blood that cured her...it was the hybrid fetus' blood...

I think this is a very important distinction...

It's kinda sad that Admiral Adama is on the much older Galactica instead of the newer, higher tech Pegasus.........Kinda like being on a WWII ship and the Pegasus a 1970's model.

it wasn't the cylon blood that cured her...it was the hybrid fetus' blood...

I think this is a very important distinction...

I thought I said just that...except I spelled it Hy-Bred blood.

I thought I said just that...except I spelled it Hy-Bred blood.

I was just re-directing...many people are just saying "cylon blood" and linking it to cylon detection and stuff...so I was just reminding people that cylon blood is different from the fetus'...that's all...

Speaking of that, did I hear the big "F" bomb word from someone in a viper???
Watching, or should I say listening live... I thought it was the "F" word too.
Upon many repeat playings on my ReplayTV- Kat said "20 Frackin minutes late". But boy, she really pushed the envelope on Frack this time!
Kat: just another reason to watch BSG!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v201/themanipulator/carro.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v201/themanipulator/125034916.jpg

By toasters, if you mean the robot looking Cylons, yes that's pretty much a given, I think we're discussing the human replicant Cylons such as Gina and Sharon and how much of them is "human" and/or what differentiates them from humans. In my mind it is becoming more and more nebulous, and I think it adds tremendously to the overall story.

If that's the case, how do the robot looking Cylons differentiate between the "Cylon" humans (like Gina, Sharon, Leoben, etc) and "real" humans (Adama, Tigh, Roslin, etc)?

Do they have something in them so they know the difference between them so that they know: "this human is actually a cylon, obey it" and "this human is not a cylon, destroy it"?

If they can scan the blood, might raise some interesting possibilities (Roslin get confronted by a centurion, it scans her blood, detects cylon elements, and determines this she a cylon - do not harm her). :cool:

If that's the case, how do the robot looking Cylons differentiate between the "Cylon" humans (like Gina, Sharon, Leoben, etc) and "real" humans (Adama, Tigh, Roslin, etc)?


Well...there are only 12 models...so maybe they have a picture of them! ;)

Facial recognition software, and "Three Laws Safe" programming. ;)

If that's the case, how do the robot looking Cylons differentiate between the "Cylon" humans (like Gina, Sharon, Leoben, etc) and "real" humans (Adama, Tigh, Roslin, etc)?

Do they have something in them so they know the difference between them so that they know: "this human is actually a cylon, obey it" and "this human is not a cylon, destroy it"?

If they can scan the blood, might raise some interesting possibilities (Roslin get confronted by a centurion, it scans her blood, detects cylon elements, and determines this she a cylon - do not harm her). :cool:

They most likely share the same 'net' connection that allow the cylons to communicate with one another and to 'phone home' when they die.

I'm wondering when/if we're going to see or hear about any repercussions about the Cylons losing the Resurrection ship, as I understand it now, when one of the 12 models "dies", it really dies and that could dramatically affect how they operate.

Oh I agree. I also understand what is being talked about...I was just making a point that Ron Moore has a blog that helps out on in show info. I am not sure if everyone knew that.


I knew about the blog and such, but I'm more a "purist"(read: geek :p ) about extraneous info about a program, I tend just to view just the program itself and make comments and speculate only from that info. :)

I'm wondering when/if we're going to see or hear about any repercussions about the Cylons losing the Resurrection ship, as I understand it now, when one of the 12 models "dies", it really dies and that could dramatically affect how they operate.

The good news for the rest of the fleet is that anyone falling in love with a Boomer model will get a woman without all the Chief/Helo baggage. :D

It's kinda sad that Admiral Adama is on the much older Galactica instead of the newer, higher tech Pegasus.........Kinda like being on a WWII ship and the Pegasus a 1970's model.
The Pegasus has all kinds of high-tech computer networks.

Adama hates computer networks.

Ergo, Galactica is the new flag ship...

~Dan

My thought is:

The Cylons keep saying: " this has all happened before".

Mankind ruled and created the Cylons.

Therefore.....the Cylons must cease to exist/destroyed until "recreated" by the next cycle of mankind. Yes?

Unless......?? What? :)

Ed

Unless the Cylons build their own toasters. :)

I don't understand what you mean, CP.

Ed

My thought is:

The Cylons keep saying: " this has all happened before".

Mankind ruled and created the Cylons.

Therefore.....the Cylons must cease to exist/destroyed until "recreated" by the next cycle of mankind. Yes?

Unless......?? What? :)

Ed
I can't continue to watch you guys agonize over interpreting this, so I'm going to revael the contents of a secret memo written by one of the producers which reveals that this is an 'in-joke' allusion to the fact that this same show ran with the same premise and characters 25 years ago.

When they resurrect this vehicle again in 2030, all the cylons will keep saying "this has all happened TWICE before" ......until somebody gets the joke. :D

_________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind

I can't continue to watch you guys agonize over interpreting this, so I'm going to revael the contents of a secret memo written by one of the producers which reveals that this is an 'in-joke' allusion to the fact that this same show ran with the same premise and characters 25 years ago.

When they resurrect this vehicle again in 2030, all the cylons will keep saying "this has all happened TWICE before" ......until somebody gets the joke. :D

_________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind

Could you be less cryptic and more to the point, please?

Thanks,
Ed

He's kidding Ed, he's referring to the fact that Battlestar Galactica has been on TV before, with the same premise and characters and that the Cylons in the latest version have transcended the void between fiction and reality and that is what they are talking about when they say "this has all happened before" i.e., the previous version of the show. :)

I can't continue to watch you guys agonize over interpreting this, so I'm going to revael the contents of a secret memo written by one of the producers which reveals that this is an 'in-joke' allusion to the fact that this same show ran with the same premise and characters 25 years ago.

When they resurrect this vehicle again in 2030, all the cylons will keep saying "this has all happened TWICE before" ......until somebody gets the joke. :D

_________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mindNot the "same premise". Could you, please, expound? I don't think they'd be that coy with this undertaking.

Ed

BG originally aired back in 1978, same characters and story line as today's version. Pallidan is making a joke that this is what the Cylons are referring to.

It's silly, but funny.. :D

Damn!

I feel like Data saying something like: "Humor. It escapes me!"

Ed

I don't understand what you mean, CP.

Ed

Man builds toasters > Toasters build beings > Beings kill man > Beings build new toasters > They build New Beings > New beings kill old Beings...... :)

But...

Is that all there is?? Just a passing joke for an old series?

Why derail a new series just to cash in on a cheap joke?

Ed

I don't understand what you mean, CP.

Ed
Somehow the Toasters created the human replicant Cylons, if those replicants are wiped out I asume they would still have the ability to make more eventually.

If every Cylon Toaster or otherwise was wiped out, then it would be the humans that would be responsible, or the cause of, for creating yet another robotic "creature" that went on to create another "race" that was bent on destroying the humans.

I think the underlying premise is that humans have been bent on destroying themselves throughout the history of mankind. IOW, we are our own worst enemy and until we get beyond that, if even possible, we will continue to repeat past "mistakes". Possibly the Cylons have found a way to prevent this from occurring, the Cylon/Human being carried by Sharon.

(how's that for some wild-ass speculation.. :p :D )

Keenan,

But....
It's not the same story line, etc....Very much different.

$hit, I gotta get a life. Anyone want to sell your's for cheap ????? :)

Ed

Edit: Didn't see your last response, above.

He's kidding Ed, he's referring to the fact that Battlestar Galactica has been on TV before, with the same premise and characters and that the Cylons in the latest version have transcended the void between fiction and reality and that is what they are talking about when they say "this has all happened before" i.e., the previous version of the show. :)
Thank you.

Sorry Ed, I thought I was making a fairly obvious joke here, and it wasn't intended toward you directly, just a matter of happenstance that you were the one who most recently quoted that line.

I like this show immensely to the extent of even watching the re-run of each episode to see if I missed something. We all have our own speculations because the writing has been both clever and veiled enough to suggest multiple interpretations; and as a result, I feel like we are trying to deconstruct it down to the molecular level at times, searching for its 'true meaning'. And sometimes that can enhance our enjoyment of it, and sometimes that can detract from the visceral 'entertainment' it provides.

Not the "same premise". Could you, please, expound? I don't think they'd be that coy with this undertaking.
Of course it is, at its core. Robot drones trying to destroy mankind, and the human remains racing toward the hopeful salvation that earth may provide. Now the character development and interaction is far more complex, and the story ideas are infinitely superior to the original, but....Anyway it was just a joke, but based on your reaction, I think we're gonna have to start opening local chapters of BG Anonymous.

"Hi! My name is Palladin and I'm a Galactiholic. I've brought a new member to our meeting. His name is Ed."

(Multiple voices) - "Hi, Ed." :)

______________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind

Somehow the Toasters created the human replicant Cylons, if those replicants are wiped out I asume they would still have the ability to make more eventually.

If every Cylon Toaster or otherwise was wiped out, then it would be the humans that would be responsible, or the cause of, for creating yet another robotic "creature" that went on to create another "race" that was bent on destroying the humans.

I think the underlying premise is that humans have been bent on destroying themselves throughout the history of mankind. IOW, we are our own worst enemy and until we get beyond that, if even possible, we will continue to repeat past "mistakes". Possibly the Cylons have found a way to prevent this from occurring, the Cylon/Human being carried by Sharon.

(how's that for some wild-ass speculation.. :p :D )

Pretty damned good. :D

But,as it says in the opening of the series...
"They evolved!"

I do, however, agree with your premise of humans bent on destroying themselves.

Ed

Thank you.

Sorry Ed, I thought I was making a fairly obvious joke here, and it wasn't intended toward you directly, just a matter of happenstance that you were the one who most recently quoted that line.

I like this show immensely to the extent of even watching the re-run of each episode to see if I missed something. We all have our own speculations because the writing has been both clever and veiled enough to suggest multiple interpretations; and as a result, I feel like we are trying to deconstruct it down to the molecular level at times, searching for its 'true meaning'. And sometimes that can enhance our enjoyment of it, and sometimes that can detract from the visceral 'entertainment' it provides.


Of course it is, at its core. Robot drones trying to destroy mankind, and the human remains racing toward the hopeful salvation that earth may provide. Now the character development and interaction is far more complex, and the story ideas are infinitely superior to the original, but....Anyway it was just a joke, but based on your reaction, I think we're gonna have to start opening local chapters of BG Anonymous.

"Hi! My name is Palladin and I'm a Galactiholic. I've brought a new member to our meeting. His name is Ed."

(Multiple voices) - "Hi, Ed." :)

______________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind

:D :D

I wasn't offended in the least, and don't know how you might have thought so.

Are we discussing the show, or not? Let's not make it "personal", shall we?

"Hi, All! I'm Ed and I'm a Galactiholic!! Thanks for the welcome. Palladin is my supplier." :D

Ed

Edit: Spelling

"Hi! My name is Palladin and I'm a Galactiholic. I've brought a new member to our meeting. His name is Ed."

(Multiple voices) - "Hi, Ed." :)

______________________________________________________

"Hi, my name is Jim"... :p :D

:D :D

I

"Hi, All! I'm Ed and I'm a Galactiholic!! Thanks for the welcome. Palladin is my supplier." :D

Ed
ROTFLMAO... :D :D :D :D

(still laughing out loud... :p )

That was too funny Ed.. :)

"Hi, my name is Jim"... :p :D
"Jim"???

Dammit Shatner, they killed off your character in 'Generations", and I've had it with these cameo appearances. Let it go. ;)

Okay guys, so far there are 3 of us. Now we've got to write up a 12-step program. What say we split it up, four each?? :D

BTW Keenan, liked your take on the 'real' meaning of that line.

___________________________________________________
Palladin (aka Superfly)

Chance favors the prepared mind

Sorry....

As soon as you insulted Capt. Kirk, I "hit the Galactica" again. Living room is now trashed and my dog, now, growls at me.

Thanks, a lot, Palladin.

Edit: BTW: It's "Call me Jim!" - Generations. :)

Ed

The Pegasus has all kinds of high-tech computer networks.

Adama hates computer networks.

Ergo, Galactica is the new flag ship...

~Dan

I have a different reason: Captains always think of their ship as a "she"...Galactica is Adama's ship...his girl...he won't leave her for the first cute thing that he comes across...

I have a different reason: Captains always think of their ship as a "she"...Galactica is Adama's ship...his girl...he won't leave her for the first cute thing that he comes across...

You are correct sir. He would never give up command of the Galatica. It is home. It is also where his family is.

I bet Pegasus gets nuked by Gina.....then we are back to one battlestar. The battlestar Galactica.

I bet Pegasus gets nuked by Gina.
I thought she was a member of the “Peace Movement”?
Blowing up the Peggy and her crew with a nuclear weapon doesn’t exactly conform to non-violent protest methodology. But she didn't seem to have any problem blowing Cain's head off at point blank range with her sidearm so I guess anything can happen when you give an artificial life form a nuke. Remember, now that the resurrection ship is gone, she can’t download to a new body. If she blows herself upalong with the Peggy- she’s gone for good…. take that you Frackin Cylon B***h!!
All this has certainly not happened before.

I thought she was a member of the “Peace Movement”?
Blowing up the Peggy and her crew with a nuclear weapon doesn’t exactly conform to non-violent protest methodology. But she didn't seem to have any problem blowing Cain's head off at point blank range with her sidearm so I guess anything can happen when you give an artificial life form a nuke. Remember, now that the resurrection ship is gone, she can’t download to a new body. If she blows herself upalong with the Peggy- she’s gone for good…. take that you Frackin Cylon B***h!!
All this has certainly not happened before.

she already bombed the trillium refinery ship...so the "peace" thing is out...

I thought she was a member of the “Peace Movement”?
Blowing up the Peggy and her crew with a nuclear weapon doesn’t exactly conform to non-violent protest methodology. But she didn't seem to have any problem blowing Cain's head off at point blank range with her sidearm so I guess anything can happen when you give an artificial life form a nuke. Remember, now that the resurrection ship is gone, she can’t download to a new body. If she blows herself upalong with the Peggy- she’s gone for good…. take that you Frackin Cylon B***h!!
All this has certainly not happened before.

Don't wanna see her go. Like the Naughty Librarian look too much.

I think Baltar feels the same way.

Gina is only using peace movement for her agenda as a cylon........

Gina is only using peace movement for her agenda as a cylon........
Agreed!
I wouldn't trust Sharon as far as I could throw her either. Can't wait to see what the baby looks like. I hope it's short and silver (anyone remember "Soap").
On another tangent.... I read on one site where supposedly one of the BSG writers said there was never a real (human) Sharon . Sometimes people ask "what happend to the real Sharon? The real Sharon was a Cylon.
Makes you think.....

I think everyone has assumed that there are no "real" versions of the Cylons. If they were simply cloned, why would they limit themselves to 12 models?

I think everyone has assumed that there are no "real" versions of the Cylons. If they were simply cloned, why would they limit themselves to 12 models?

Exactly! But who were they patterned after? Someone has already pointed out that there are 12 Gods, 12 Colonies, 12 Cylon models. Earth was the destination of the 13th tribe. Is there another "God."

Just a thought. In BSG:TOS, the religion centered around the appearance of Count Ilbli and the people in the "ship of lights". Of course the good Count was actually evil looking for souls......

It was mentioned in the new BSG that the catatrophe on Kobol took place when 1 God tried to elevate himself over the others. So maybe God referred to by Six is the 1 God who tried to elevate himself, was banished by the others, remade the Cylons in the image of the other 12(symbolic joke) gave them a plan to "bring them closer to God," and.......

So when someones asks Sharon or Six, why did they destroy the colonies and humanity, I guess their answer would be- THE DEVIL MADE ME DO IT."
:D

Maybe the one "true" God banished the other 12 Gods and the humans are backing the wrong horse. ;)

Maybe the one "true" God banished the other 12 Gods and the humans are backing the wrong horse. ;)
Don't laugh, I firmly believe there is a deep strain of that thought running through the writing in this show.

I just couldn't take having the 2.0 episodes doled out to me once a week when netflix had them sitting there waiting for me on DVD, so I watched 4 hours of it last night with great satisfaction. UHD is back on the list of directv HD choices I don't watch. I'll probably wind up watching 2.5 on DVD too, if it comes out on DVD first.

Maybe the one "true" God banished the other 12 Gods and the humans are backing the wrong horse. ;)
See Clifford Simak's A Choice of Gods (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/999740856X/qid=1138237416/sr=1-5/ref=sr_1_5/104-7377606-7851925?s=books&v=glance&n=283155) for an example of religious robots:
"One day on Earth, something strange happens-- the People vanish. The vast majority of humans are suddenly gone for the earth, leaving only an isolated pocket of remnants and all the robots. 5000 years passes and instead of developing new technology, the remaining humans find themselves expanding in unexpected ways and in the meantime the robots, deprived of people to serve, take up the abandoned task of serving God."

Maybe the one "true" God banished the other 12 Gods and the humans are backing the wrong horse. ;)

Maybe! Who knows, it can go either way!

A tidbit from BSG:TOS- Baltar recognizes Count Ilbli's voice and the voice of the imperious leader of the Cylons as one and the same. (Actually they were because Patrick McNee did both.) The imperious leader ordered the attack on the colonies.

I thought she was a member of the “Peace Movement”?
Blowing up the Peggy and her crew with a nuclear weapon doesn’t exactly conform to non-violent protest methodology. But she didn't seem to have any problem blowing Cain's head off at point blank range with her sidearm so I guess anything can happen when you give an artificial life form a nuke. Remember, now that the resurrection ship is gone, she can’t download to a new body. If she blows herself upalong with the Peggy- she’s gone for good…. take that you Frackin Cylon B***h!!
All this has certainly not happened before.

Remember, she was also mis treated and beaten by the crew of the Pegasus (not all, but same ship)

She only has to have it planted and set to go off.

BTW, I mentioned the nuke and the Pegasus back on post 822. :)

But won't be this week. Listened to Ronald Moore's podcast lastnight for tonights episode. He isn't thrilled with with this episode (download and listen to it to find out what I mean), so Pegagus will be with us for at least another week.

edited: for wording.

Even if tonight's episode was semi-filler, they pulled it off so well, I hardly noticed. Excellent episode. It not only showed us why Lee has been acting the way he is, but it also gave us another perspective from the point of view of the non-casted members of the Universe....the general public.

Next episode looks awesome too!

I liked last night's ep, but thought at the end it veered a little too much into cliche land with the space ho' saying, "I'm not her, I'm not every going to be her," blah blah.

I thought they would have named her Cassie (for Cassiopia) from the oroginal series, as a little in-joke.

Yes...It "looks" like they are building for another major arc in the story line. I would just like to know how they are "producing" anything anymore. Where are the factories? There has got to be a limit to the consumer goods. I would also be leary of the drugs that are being sold on the black market.

I really loved the last scene in Adama's cabin with Lee and Adama sitting on the couch having a drink together- trying to unwind and understand the long stressful day.... together.
Instead of son against father, they met on common ground and let their guard down for just a few precious minutes. Looks like Lee is growing up a bit and is starting to see the burden the old man carries on his shoulders.
Maybe he'll see how much he means to Adama... and how much he has in common with him.

I frakin' love Bill Duke. Filler, but still interesting.

I'm surprised they don't even mention the goal of "Earth". Nothing at all since the arrow showed them the fancy planetarium.

And why not jump-jump-jump-jump-jump to build a lead/ cover their tracks since they destroyed the resurrection ship and the Cylon armada tracking/chasing them?

I'm surprised they don't even mention the goal of "Earth". Nothing at all since the arrow showed them the fancy planetarium.

And why not jump-jump-jump-jump-jump to build a lead/ cover their tracks since they destroyed the resurrection ship and the Cylon armada tracking/chasing them?

yup...kind of suprising but then again all that other stuff happened so they probably haven't been able to focus on it...it looks like next episode is going to get back on track (with Starbuck wanting to go back to Capirca and the old man probably saying no which leads to the drinking)...I kind of liking how they're tearing each character apart and then rebuilding them....its still the best show on TV

Ok. The poll is now open:

Who will be named captain of the Pegasus?

Tigh's wife. She's got bigger balls than Tigh, and if he can be the XO of Galactica, she should be able to handle command of the Pegasus. :)

Ok. The poll is now open:

Who will be named captain of the Pegasus?

I'd say the Pegasus CAG only because he's somebody we wouldn't miss when the Pegasus gets nuked. I actually wished ol' Fisk could have stuck around a bit!

I'm surprised they don't even mention the goal of "Earth". Nothing at all since the arrow showed them the fancy planetarium.

And why not jump-jump-jump-jump-jump to build a lead/ cover their tracks since they destroyed the resurrection ship and the Cylon armada tracking/chasing them?

Hell, forget Earth. Just give me the next decent planet and let me off. Unless I just happened to have had a suite on Cloud Nine on warday then I'd have grabbed a tent and stayed on Kobel.

I'm surprised that more people in the fleet just don't decide to get off at the next planet instead of being stuck on these ships. I imagine a lot of people are not used to or prepared for living long term on the various vessels and that most of the ships lack proper quarters. Its no big deal for the Colonial crews and even the flight crews of the other ships, but I bet most of the people in the fleet have some pretty rough living conditions.

Anyway, I liked the episode. Nice to have one that focuses on the fleet a little. Another idea is for a ship to lose its FTL and the fleet has to redistribute 5000 people or something. Makes for a lot of tension.

I frakin' love Bill Duke. Filler, but still interesting.
Yeah, he does bad guys good...

Ok. The poll is now open:

Who will be named captain of the Pegasus?

That's going to be a tough call. But Ronald let something slip during his podcast. One of the major characters is going to "jump" services. And they could be next XO. Either on Galactica if Tigh is given command, with the Pegasus CAG becoming XP, and they become XO onc Galactica, or they will be the XO on the Pegasus to the CAG as commander.

Tough call no matter how you look at it. But who will they be willing to lose in the cast besides the entier crew of the Pegasus.

And looks like Lee has also messed up with Dualla as she seemed even closer with the Presidents assistant and working out with him (keep forgetting his name)

Billy (the fellow who should have maintained and recovered Laura's letter).

Not that I want to know about anything said in the podcasts, but since I have already read it: this Services thing is interesting. I guess institutional blindness left me with the feeling that they were all one service (I have not seen a Marine as a major character).

v/r,
C-F

That's going to be a tough call. But Ronald let something slip during his podcast. One of the major characters is going to "jump" services. And they could be next XO. Either on Galactica if Tigh is given command, with the Pegasus CAG becoming XP, and they become XO onc Galactica, or they will be the XO on the Pegasus to the CAG as commander.

Tough call no matter how you look at it. But who will they be willing to lose in the cast besides the entier crew of the Pegasus.

And looks like Lee has also messed up with Dualla as she seemed even closer with the Presidents assistant and working out with him (keep forgetting his name)

Flight Capt. Starbuck is still the CAG on Pegasus and will not be promoted to XO, she is not senior enough.


The New CO of Pegasus is a real mental case...... several stories deal with his breakdown...


Col. Tigh will never be promoted (rank or Position) Adama knows better.


Flight Capt. Apollo should be promoted Soon..... but will remain as BSG CAG and the Fleet SCAG!

I was meant the previous CAG before Starbuck. I haven't seen or heard anything about Starbuck still being the CAG on the Pegasus. She seemed to be back on board Galactica on last weeks episode.

Spoiler Alert! mouse over to read.
SPOILER (http://Cpt.Adama.is.going.to.become.a.Major.So.more.of.a.lateral.ra nk.change?)

Sorry, I don't have the SPOILER Alert Font in my list for a proper Spoiler Alert. Old fashion fake URL's will have to do. :)

Just use ..................... tags (except spell spoiler correctly).

I was meant the previous CAG before Starbuck. I haven't seen or heard anything about Starbuck still being the CAG on the Pegasus. She seemed to be back on board Galactica on last weeks episode.

Spoiler Alert! mouse over to read.
SPOILER (http://Cpt.Adama.is.going.to.become.a.Major.So.more.of.a.lateral.ra nk.change?)

Sorry, I don't have the SPOILER Alert Font in my list for a proper Spoiler Alert. Old fashion fake URL's will have to do. :)

The format is:

spoiler
/spoiler

but, but each in a bracket, like this [spoiler]

thanks guys. So that's how it works. couldn't find it.

Late in the game, but...Number 6 is a man... This should be hidden in the e-mail notification.Also a neat trick is to put them inside [ quote ] tags (again without spaces) which should prevent it from showing up in the plain text e-mail (like I just inadvertently read above).

v/r,
C-F

Cannon - Thanks.

Also explains why I have seen spoiler alerts in emails I have received.

I was meant the previous CAG before Starbuck. I haven't seen or heard anything about Starbuck still being the CAG on the Pegasus. She seemed to be back on board Galactica on last weeks episode.

Spoiler Alert! mouse over to read.
SPOILER (http://Cpt.Adama.is.going.to.become.a.Major.So.more.of.a.lateral.ra nk.change?)

Sorry, I don't have the SPOILER Alert Font in my list for a proper Spoiler Alert. Old fashion fake URL's will have to do. :)

Last we saw of Capt. Cole 'Stinger' Taylor (former Pegasus CAG) was when he was demoted to Lt. by Admiral Cain. I have not seen him back in the credits. and he was not in the next 2 episodes.

That doesn't mean too much. Starbuck wasn't in this last episode at all. So we will see and hopefully that giant chip on his shoulder (former CAG of the Pegasus) is gone as a result of his demotion. But couldn't think of someone more deserving of testing the Pegasus' commander quarters then him. So far I have not seen any security on Pegasus. 2 commanding officers killed in their quarters (the SAME quarters).
Hmmm, maybe we have found the new commander of the Pegasus. LOL

edit: for clarification, spelling

"Number 6 is a man..."

eww..!

Last we saw of Capt. Cole 'Stinger' Taylor (former Pegasus CAG) was when he was demoted to Lt. by Admiral Cain. I have not seen him back in the credits. and he was not in the next 2 episodes.

True. To bad they are not using him. He is still a good pilot. They need all the pilots they can get. Even if he was a "Richard Cranium" personality wise...so what...sometimes you need a tough leader. Not all the leaders can be Warm & Fuzzy. :D I am surprised he was not re-instated to a command post after Cain's death.

True. To bad they are not using him. He is still a good pilot. They need all the pilots they can get. Even if he was a "Richard Cranium" personality wise...so what...sometimes you need a tough leader. Not all the leaders can be Warm & Fuzzy. :D I am surprised he was not re-instated to a command post after Cain's death.

strange statement...we don't know anything of what happened on the Pegasus since Cain's death...he may have been promoted to God, for all we know! ;)

A god.

Unless... are you implying he's a cylon?

v/r,
C-F

OR...they only wanted to pay the Actor for a couple of Episodes.