I believe that COL Tigh found that he does not want command...

v/r,
C-F

....and since nobody in fleet wants him to command, it all works out. :D

What I don't understand is that 10 nukes were coming at them ( I think they said 10). You would think just one nuke would finish them off. They do not have shields like in Star Trek to deflect the impacts.

However, all in all...a great episode...next week...will be worth the wait.

I've always assumed that these nukes were low yield tactical weapons 10kt or less and that the battlestars were armoured enough to absorb some of the blast. Besides we don't have a clue about what allioys they may have developed that could be much tougher than anything we have here on Earth.

Hey I'm still waiting for Adama to say "Positive shield now", like in the old series! :)

I wonder if putting Lee in command is going to cause problems in the ranks. And I guess Pegasus will be around for a little while, unless Jaime Bamber wants out.

I've always assumed that these nukes were low yield tactical weapons 10kt or less and that the battlestars were armoured enough to absorb some of the blast. Besides we don't have a clue about what allioys they may have developed that could be much tougher than anything we have here on Earth.

Hey I'm still waiting for Adama to say "Positive shield now", like in the old series! :)



Maybe BSG is made out of unobtainium? :D

How long will it be before Dee gets pregnant by Apollo? They did mention populating mankind last night? :rolleyes:

Anybody else notice the silver Thompson SMG in the display case of the Pegasus Comanders quarters?

What I don't understand is that 10 nukes were coming at them ( I think they said 10). You would think just one nuke would finish them off. They do not have shields like in Star Trek to deflect the impacts.

Pfft who needs shields when they have ultra-strong lead armor? Shields are for writers who can't think of anything creative to come up with :)

I always wonder then why they freak out when a Cylon kamikaze heads towards them to ram if the ultra-strong lead armor is so strong and a nuke all they do is "brace for impact".

I think we need an astrophysicist to enlighten us as to the effects of a thermonuclear warhead detonated close in to a large space vessel. Much of the damage on earth is the result of blast, overpressure and the resulting wind. A warhead exploded in deep space would generate heat and radiation but I would think much of the blast would be mitigated by the vaccum unless it is a nuclear fragmentation warhead of some sort. Of course, I am not a physicist.

I always wonder then why they freak out when a Cylon kamikaze heads towards them to ram if the ultra-strong lead armor is so strong and a nuke all they do is "brace for impact".

That because a kamikaze is going to fly into a landing pod before triggering the bomb. Not much armour inside the landing pod, lots outside.
A nuke is going to hit the outside amour more often then not, so not as much of a concern.

I'm assuming you meant, "she probably" but remember, a month has gone by....its not like this happens the next day...she obviously did care for him by the way she acted when he got shot....but in this extreme life (as Baltar so eloquently put it), you have to live...and not be reminded by death everyday or else you won't surivive. She is merely going on with her life and continue the relationship with Lee unhindered by the guilt of lying to Billy.Sorry. I was actually referring to Billy's attempted heroics last week in the cantina--um, ten-forw---whatever it was.

Tigh doesn't want a command.

His wife wants him to have a command.

Therefore, Tigh is influenced to wonder why he didn't get the command of Pegasus.

Tigh drinks more and a showdown of resentment happens between him and Apollo.

Ed

Anyone notice that the President has, for the first time, left her long held beliefs and changed course on her moral ethics? Nano gizmos?

Ed

Sorry. I was actually referring to Billy's attempted heroics last week in the cantina--um, ten-forw---whatever it was.


LOL.

Cloud Nine.... From Outer Space. :)

Ed

Anyone notice that the President has, for the first time, left her long held beliefs and changed course on her moral ethics? Nano gizmos?

Ed

I thought she listened to reason....Adama that is. He brought her back to basics. She highly respects his view on everything even if she doesn't agree. She admitted her ideals didn't fit anymore. It still is against her beliefs, but the situation has changed. To me that showed character on her behalf.

I'd like to think so...but...

I thinks she will be whitled down...bit by bit, as the nano (thingies) invade her......Maybe??? Possibly??

:)

Ed

PS. Adama wasn't the one to say the fleet would cease to exist in 18 years.

... effects of a thermonuclear warhead detonated close in to a large space vessel...radiation... I think this calls for a quick suspension of belief pill, lest we get into the much more basic cosmic ray shielding concerns...

RE: the President. But I thought it was a rather light touch on the ramifications of the policies, statements, and public beliefs she held when she still had her cancer and [psychoactive drugs].

v/r,
C-F

Tigh doesn't want a command.

His wife wants him to have a command.

Therefore, Tigh is influenced to wonder why he didn't get the command of Pegasus.

Tigh drinks more and a showdown of resentment happens between him and Apollo.

Ed

Now that Lee Adama outranks Tigh, I can't wait till he puts him in his place.

I wonder who will become Lee's XO on Pegasus?

I am not sure the Lee does outrank Tigh, he just happens to be in command of a battlestar, and Tigh is XO of the flagship, which should have them on even ground unless I am way off on this.

Another thing to note, Starbuck is now the Galactica CAG and therefore the fleet CAG!

Now that Lee Adama outranks Tigh, I can't wait till he puts him in his place.

I wonder who will become Lee's XO on Pegasus?

How about the old Pegasus CAG!
That would be rich since he tried to humiliate Lee by taking him out of Vipers to be his chauffeur.

I am not sure the Lee does outrank Tigh, he just happens to be in command of a battlestar, and Tigh is XO of the flagship, which should have them on even ground unless I am way off on this.

Another thing to note, Starbuck is now the Galactica CAG and therefore the fleet CAG!


No it does not work that way.

The CAG that is most senior in Rank and Time in service will be the SCAG.

Tigh is only a Colonel and Lee Adama is now a Commander. In the Colonial Defense Force Commander outranks Colonel.

No it does not work that way.

The CAG that is most senior in Rank and Time in service will be the SCAG.

Tigh is only a Colonel and Lee Adama is now a Commander. In the Colonial Defense Force Commander outranks Colonel.

yup just about to say that....exactly...

the next conflict I predict is insurgency from having the Father-Son leading the military...I could see a few people seeing that as a problem ;)

I figured after the fun shown in the preview, they would return to the election politics, then probably some rumblings over perceived preferential treatment from Commander Adama's promotion (I can see that becoming confusing since the son now has the father's original rank) and/or some more growing for Commander Adama in his new position.

v/r,
C-F

No it does not work that way.

The CAG that is most senior in Rank and Time in service will be the SCAG.

Tigh is only a Colonel and Lee Adama is now a Commander. In the Colonial Defense Force Commander outranks Colonel.

Are we sure that Commander is a rank and not a position? There is a difference. For example, an Army First Sergeant is both a rank and a position that can be held by different ranks. And in Navel ranks, a Commodore is the position given to a Captain that is in command of more than one ship in a flotilla. I'm sure there are other examples of this, especially in navies with their more complicated rank and rate structures. The mixing of typical ground, air and naval ranks in BSG complicates the situation.

My point is that Adama Sr. and Tigh may have been in the same pay grade of Colonel with Adama having the title of Commander by benefit of his command. An Admiral though would keep that flag title. Adama Jr may still be in the grade of Major but now has the title of Commander by merit of his position on the Pegasus. And since you always address a Lt. Colonel as Colonel, Tigh may be of the lower rank and we wouldn't know short of looking at his personnel jacket.

Just speculation of course. Moore probably makes this stuff up as he goes.

O-14 Admiral of the Colonial Defense Force
O-13 Fleet Admiral
O-12 Admiral
O-11 Vice Admiral
O-10 Rear Admiral
O-9 Fleet Commander
O-8 Commander
O-7 Colonel
O-6 Lt. Colonel
O-5 Major
O-4 Captain
O-3 1st. Lt.
O-2 2nd. Lt.
O-1 Ensign.

This is what is listed in the Official Writers Bible for BSG 2003/2004.

Are we sure that Commander is a rank and not a position? There is a difference. For example, an Army First Sergeant is both a rank and a position that can be held by different ranks. And in Navel ranks, a Commodore is the position given to a Captain that is in command of more than one ship in a flotilla. I'm sure there are other examples of this, especially in navies with their more complicated rank and rate structures. The mixing of typical ground, air and naval ranks in BSG complicates the situation.

My point is that Adama Sr. and Tigh may have been in the same pay grade of Colonel with Adama having the title of Commander by benefit of his command. An Admiral though would keep that flag title. Adama Jr may still be in the grade of Major but now has the title of Commander by merit of his position on the Pegasus. And since you always address a Lt. Colonel as Colonel, Tigh may be of the lower rank and we wouldn't know short of looking at his personnel jacket.

Just speculation of course. Moore probably makes this stuff up as he goes.

If you figure they are combining Air Force and Naval ranks Thigh still out ranks Lee. Please see the link below:

http://www.defenselink.mil/specials/insignias/officers.html

The way I see it in the updated Colonial Defense Force Commander and Lt Colonel are the same.

If you figure they are combining Air Force and Naval ranks Thigh still out ranks Lee. Please see the link below:

http://www.defenselink.mil/specials/insignias/officers.html

The way I see it in the updated Colonial Defense Force Commander and Lt Colonel are the same.


Cmdr. in the CDF is not the same rank as Cmdr. in the Navel (US Navy).

IOW

Commander is one grade above Col. in the CDF....

They do not use US Navel Ranks in this show.

But do they use US Navel rings?

v/r,
C-F

Also, a Lt Col could still be put in charge of the Pegasus, and have the Title of Commander.
Just like the navy's of the world, a Lt Cmdr can be ranking officer of a navel ship and have the Title of Captain.

As for Starbuck, the fleet CAG is whoever Adm Adama makes it. And since the former CAG of the Pegasus seems to be gone and the previous Cmdr of the Pegasus said theat Captian <so and so> did thinks different. If they were still around, would they not have been in charge rather then Starbuck acting like she was the top pilot of the ship?

http://www.mostgraveconcern.com/snipes.jpg
(Mntmst, forgive me for resizing your photo...)

After spending four years in the engineering spaces aboard an aircraft carrier, a very noisy place, I can tell you that the guy indicated with the arrow is the only one who can still hear today!

I enjoyed this episode. Too often the "Black Gang" is overlooked in ship operations; but nothing happens if not for them!

~Dan
ET2 (3383), USS Carl Vinson (CVN-70), 1983-1986

Also, a Lt Col could still be put in charge of the Pegasus, and have the Title of Commander. Just like the navy's of the world, a Lt Cmdr can be ranking officer of a navel ship and have the Title of Captain.
Although "Captain" of a ship is officially "Commanding Officer," and not a title at all. "Captain" (and "Skipper" too) is just a familiar term used by the crew.

Your point is valid, however.

Also, remember that Major General George Armstrong Custer was really only a Lieutenant Colonel. And Colonel Sanders, of KFC fame, wasn't in the military at all. :)


As for Starbuck, the fleet CAG is whoever Adm Adama makes it.
There is no "Fleet CAG." Each ship would have it's own "Commander, Air Group." They would be a part of each ship's company, and have no tie between each other. You don't see Dr. Cottle and the Pegasus' doctor worring about who's "Senior Medical Officer"...there isn't one.

BTW, in the U.S. Navy, The CAG is in charge of the embarked air wing, and is not under the command of the ship's Commanding Officer. The air wing is a separate command from the ship, they just live on board.

Likewise, the Battle Group Commander (Admiral) is also not in charge of his flagship; he's simply a passenger. His job involves coordinating the activities of all the ships in his battle group. When he gives out orders, it's up to the flagship's CO to implement the tactical procedures required to complete the mission.

Technically, with Adama now an Admiral, in charge of an entire flotilla (spacetilla?) and coordinating the activities of two battlestars, the Galactica should have a separate Captain. In his supervisory role, Adama should not have to waste time dealing with the day-to-day housekeeping operations of a ship.

~Dan

(Mntmst, forgive me for resizing your photo...)

After spending four years in the engineering spaces aboard an aircraft carrier, a very noisy place, I can tell you that the guy indicated with the arrow is the only one who can still hear today!

I enjoyed this episode. Too often the "Black Gang" is overlooked in ship operations; but nothing happens if not for them!

~Dan
ET2 (3383), USS Carl Vinson (CVN-70), 1983-1986

I got a chuckle when the term "snipe" was used. That picture was from the USS Okinawa (LPH-3) 1979-1982. No nukes, just 600 psi steam from oil moved that bucket across the planet. :)

There is no "Fleet CAG." Each ship would have it's own "Commander, Air Group." They would be a part of each ship's company, and have no tie between each other. You don't see Dr. Cottle and the Pegasus' doctor worring about who's "Senior Medical Officer"...there isn't one.


Good point. :)


BTW, in the U.S. Navy, The CAG is in charge of the embarked air wing, and is not under the command of the ship's Commanding Officer. The air wing is a separate command from the ship, they just live on board.


True, but so we have seen that it looks like the commander of a battlestar seems to give out general or specific orders to their air group as they require. So they seem to exercise for direct control of the air groups, but only as needed.


Likewise, the Battle Group Commander (Admiral) is also not in charge of his flagship; he's simply a passenger. His job involves coordinating the activities of all the ships in his battle group. When he gives out orders, it's up to the flagship's CO to implement the tactical procedures required to complete the mission.

Technically, with Adama now an Admiral, in charge of an entire flotilla (spacetilla?) and coordinating the activities of two battlestars, the Galactica should have a separate Captain. In his supervisory role, Adama should not have to waste time dealing with the day-to-day housekeeping operations of a ship.
~Dan

From what we saw of Adm Cain, it is just one more hat to wear and delagate as needed. It also looks like Tigh is coming around more, and is actualling acting like an XO rather then as bridge lush. :)

And we can only see how things are being run now, not how they were run prior to the attack on the colonies. This could just be how things are done in the Colonial Fleet.
More warriors, less superivisors. :)

BTW, in the U.S. Navy, The CAG is in charge of the embarked air wing, and is not under the command of the ship's Commanding Officer. The air wing is a separate command from the ship, they just live on board.

Don't the Airedale (Flight) COs tend to be of a similar rank as the Captain of an aircraft carreir (i.e., both being full-bird, as it were)? Also, aren't most Admirals who are in charge of Battle Groups also out of the aviation service?

BTW, is anyone other than me interested in how they are going to make Lee's and Dee's relationship "okay", while Chief Tyrol's and Boomer's wasn't? (I might have missed this from the last two weeks amdist the "Dee is a Cylon" talk... :) ).

Later,
Bill

PS: Ellen Tigh still gets my vote as the next Cylon "outing". :)

PS: Ellen Tigh still gets my vote as the next Cylon "outing". :)

Never know...she could be their "B-4" Droid. :D

BTW, is anyone other than me interested in how they are going to make Lee's and Dee's relationship "okay", while Chief Tyrol's and Boomer's wasn't?I do not think they should (another growth opportunity for the CMDR), manning would eliminate the option for her to ETS/resign, but based on the President's edict - she just needs to get pregnant...

It sure seems like they would want at least a lead Air Group Commander. Not dramatic, but I believe I would start some type of training/mentoring program. If Admiral Adama's decision was based on more than the rosy tint of his glasses, they need to be more than one deep in effective leaders. I take that back, those training or learning-from-mistakes bits could be some exciting (if filler) programs...


v/r,
C-F

Don't the Airedale (Flight) COs tend to be of a similar rank as the Captain of an aircraft carreir (i.e., both being full-bird, as it were)?
On the ship I was on, the CO was a Captain, the XO was a Captain, the Medical Officer was a Captain, the Engineer was a Commander, the Reactor Officer was a Commander, and the CAG was a...drum roll, please...Captain.


Also, aren't most Admirals who are in charge of Battle Groups also out of the aviation service?
Yes. And they are all past-commanding officers of aircraft carriers (who are all pilots, also).

Since the only offensive weapon in a Carrier Battle Group (with the exception of cruise missiles) is the air wing, you need a Battle Group Commander who is intimately familiar with carrier tactics and the employment of air power.

Keep in mind that there are also Flag positions to be had for ex-cruiser/destroyer/submarine skippers...Destroyer Squadrons, Submarine Fleets (e.g., COMSUBPAC), etc.


BTW, is anyone other than me interested in how they are going to make Lee's and Dee's relationship "okay", while Chief Tyrol's and Boomer's wasn't?)
Well, Boomer was an officer, and the Chief is an enlisted dude, so that's "fraternization."

Lee and Dee is different: Lee is an officer, but Dee is...enlisted...er...oops... :D


PS: Ellen Tigh still gets my vote as the next Cylon "outing". :)
That's where my money is, too!

~Dan

BTW, in the U.S. Navy, The CAG is in charge of the embarked air wing, and is not under the command of the ship's Commanding Officer. The air wing is a separate command from the ship, they just live on board.

~Dan

Dan,

Well said, as someone who was in the US NAVY and spent his entire time on Aircraft Carriers, and Navel Air Stations, I can say the following.

The CAG is directly responsible for the operational readiness and tactical performance of the air wing. He is responsible for the coordination and supervision of all activities of the embarked squadrons and detachments, and for the material readiness, communications, and intelligence functions of the air wing. The CAG does not fall directly under the carrier’s commanding officer. Rather, he is a co-commanding officer. Both the carrier CO and CAG work together & report to the composite warfare commander.

The CAG does not fall directly under the carrier’s commanding officer. Rather, he is a co-commanding officer. Both the carrier CO and CAG work together & report to the composite warfare commander.

Who says that the Colonial service does things the way the US Navy does?

From what we have seen so far, the CAG certainly does report to the commander. And in the old series, it was the same.

Who says that the Colonial service does things the way the US Navy does?

From what we have seen so far, the CAG certainly does report to the commander. And in the old series, it was the same.


I have already stated as such in a previous post the same thing.

Well, Boomer was an officer, and the Chief is an enlisted dude, so that's "fraternization."

Lee and Dee is different: Lee is an officer, but Dee is...enlisted...er...oops... :D

~Dan

Someone correct me on this but I believe Dualla IS an officer, not enlisted personnel, so there is no "fraternization" issue.

Damn, I just watched "Final Cut" on Universal-HD and deleted the episode from my DVR. It had the names and ranks of the people D'anna was interviewing when she was doing the one-on-ones.

Also, her rank was mentioned in the episode where the Cylon centurions had invaded the Galactica (2nd episode of the 2.0 season). In it, Lee, Billy and Laura, on their way to the Sick Bay find Dee after the centurions had killed several other of her colleagues (she managed to not get killed) and she's standing there in a state of shock. She doesn't respond to anything anyone says, until Laura suggests she be addressed by her military rank, which I believe is Petty Officer...

Uh oh, isn't "petty officer" a rank given to ENLISTED personnel? :eek:

Maybe in the light of what's happened, the upper echelons of military command don't have time to deal with these issues now? (Roslin herself said it - they got to "get busy and start making babies").

Someone correct me on this but I believe Dualla IS an officer, not enlisted personnel, so there is no "fraternization" issue.

Damn, I just watched "Final Cut" on Universal-HD and deleted the episode from my DVR. It had the names and ranks of the people D'anna was interviewing when she was doing the one-on-ones.

Also, her rank was mentioned in the episode where the Cylon centurions had invaded the Galactica (2nd episode of the 2.0 season). In it, Lee, Billy and Laura, on their way to the Sick Bay find Dee after the centurions had killed several other of her colleagues (she managed to not get killed) and she's standing there in a state of shock. She doesn't respond to anything anyone says, until Laura suggests she be addressed by her military rank, which I believe is Petty Officer...

Uh oh, isn't "petty officer" a rank given to ENLISTED personnel? :eek:

Maybe in the light of what's happened, the upper echelons of military command don't have time to deal with these issues now? (Roslin herself said it - they got to "get busy and start making babies").

Petty Officer 2nd. Class is a Enlisted NONCOM Officer Rank.

I have already stated as such in a previous post the same thing.

Sorry, never noticed or misunderstood. :(

Someone I know at another (non-A/V) website is claiming that SciFi is going high definition starting this summer (2006). Unless I've really missed some big news, this is just another wild, unsubstantiated rumor, correct?

Correct.

I am a bit worried about the fact that Apollo now has a job where the life-span seems to rival that of Spinal Tap drummer.

I have a feeling that Apollo will get releived for some reason by season's end.

I have a feeling that Apollo will get releived for some reason by season's end.

I'm interested to see how he survives the destruction of the Pegasus.

I wouldn't bank on the Pegasus being destroyed. It has to be heavily damaged from the last battle including those nuke hits (I hope they acknowledge this in the eps to come), so maybe it may never be able to be repaired completely. Perhaps they find an "out of the way" place to "park" it and just use it for its Viper assembly line. Because, if the fleet doesn't start replacing its fighter losses, they're all toast.

PS: Ellen Tigh still gets my vote as the next Cylon "outing". :)I dunno about that.....if true, Adama risked his neck for nothing last season when he brought her to Galactica. Now if she does go darkside, she'd better go all the way.

Tigh's wife reminds me of Boltar's imaginary #6, the way the women coax and manipulate the men.

I dunno about that.....if true, Adama risked his neck for nothing last season when he brought her to Galactica. Now if she does go darkside, she'd better go all the way.
I believe, and correct me if I'm wrong, that this would be irony... ;)

Also recall she was one of the first ones tested by the "beta" Cylon detector and Baltar said at the end of the episode "he'll never tell" - presumably talking about Sharon, but also potentially covering Ellen.

As for how she manipulates men, she seemed awfully willing to jump Lee when he dragged her into the bathroom. And that is not even considering how she manipulated Saul during the first Adama shooting!

Alright, now that the case for Ellen Tigh is out of the way, back to Lee being relieved and the Pegasus destroyed. I'm thinking Season 3 for these, though. The rest of the season looks to be set-up for electoral malfeasance, IMHO.

As for how she manipulates men, she seemed awfully willing to jump Lee when he dragged her into the bathroom.Yeah, I noticed that. But Lee has backbone, something that Tigh has not (women love men with backbone).

Yeah, I noticed that. But Lee has backbone, something that Tigh has not (women love men with backbone).
The baby in the commercial has a backbone (it glows red!). I bet women will love it! ;)

What a screwed up thread. And the discussion of the last episode on UHD is where?

What a screwed up thread. And the discussion of the last episode on UHD is where?

This says Season 2.5 Discussion...You need to find the Season 2.0 discussion to discuss the current episodes that are airing on UHD...I suggest you read none of the above too

What a screwed up thread. And the discussion of the last episode on UHD is where?

Try here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=530633

What a screwed up thread. And the discussion of the last episode on UHD is where?
You don't need to see this information.
These aren't the threads you are looking for.
We can go about our business.
Move along. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=617850)

I think this is a more recent (but still dusty) thread on UHD Season 2.0 that started in January

v/r,
C-F

You don't need to see this information.
These aren't the threads you are looking for.
We can go about our business.
Wassa matter u? Wav'n yo haan aroun like sum jedi....dat won't werk---uhh!

I don need to see dis infomation....
Dis isn't da thread ahm lookin fo....
U can go 'bout yo bizness.......

*snorfle*

:: OMG I'm such a geek ::

Okay, this reminds me of my true geekitude -- when the episode "Pegasus" on ST: TNG was about to air, someone online wisecracked: "Yes, but is Lloyd Bridges the commander?" And of course I laughed because I got the -- at that time, rather obscure -- classic BSG reference.

Of course... the commander of the TNG Pegasus was not Lloyd Bridges... it was Terry O'Quinn, aka Locke from Lost! Proving that everything really is connected in one way or the other :)

Move along. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=617850)

I think this is a more recent (but still dusty) thread on UHD Season 2.0 that started in January

v/r,
C-F

Yep, that's the one I was looking for, but couldn't find.

What is the consensus of the UHD quality vs the DVD sets?

I struggle a bit on the SD showings but I can't wait. Will definitely watch it again on HD or DVD.

What is the consensus of the UHD quality vs the DVD sets?

I struggle a bit on the SD showings but I can't wait. Will definitely watch it again on HD or DVD.

HD >DVD

Its simply amazing quality....its not like they're scaling the Sci-Fi SD source to 1080i (which really wouldn't surprise me if they did do something like that)...its a true HD source and it looks fantastic

I thought that UHD on D* was more comparable to the DVD than it ought to have been. I have yet to watch an episode on TWC since they picked it up, though. IOW, I'm not sure we have a consensus.

Wow,

vurbano and all the other UHD viewers, stop reading now...

v/r,
C-F

The Cylon 5th Column has formed....

Good Episode.

Sure answered several questions posted here about Dr. Baltar, Starbucks Boyfriend that she had left behind on Caprica. ect.....

another great show... just wow

I can't even begin to analyze the whole Baltar and Six relationship after this episode. Its become unnervingly complicated.

Whew...going to have to give this at least one more viewing...getting into some pretty deep stuff in this episode...outstanding, even more than usual..


Getting back to the "Who's a Cylon?" game, how many think Maya is a Cylon...? Thought it was interesting that they showed her one more time than they really needed to, staring into space.

Wow,

vurbano and all the other UHD viewers, stop reading now...
<Keith Jackson voice> Whooooah, Nellie! </Jackson voice off>

FRAKKIN' good ep. Certainly put a spin on things. They should have done more eps like this months ago. Those who watch BSG on UHD exclusively shouldn't read here for a while. Someone made a prediction a while back that was on the money, but I wonder if that was just a guess. It pertains to one of the doctors and I'm not saying which one. *cough* Cottle *cough*

That parting shot of Maya is simply saying that we're not done with her yet, seeing as she has a precious package in her possession.

Also, (if Sharon and Six are any indication) the cylons seem to be much more human than they've previously led us to believe.

Excellent series, but you knew that. Had we seen Maya before? Some of you write as if we had. Talk about mind games. And just how did Balthar survive the blast? We're getting close to the end of the second season and the plot just keeps going deeper.

Also, (if Sharon and Six are any indication) the cylons seem to be much more human than they've previously led us to believe.
I've been saying this for quite some time, I think this whole thing is far more complex than just a them versus us situation. It goes back to those discussions about what makes a human "human".

When keenan mentioned Maya, it took me a minute to figure out who he was talking about. Can't really say I've seen her before.

Had we seen Maya before? Some of you write as if we had.
No we haven't seen her before, but there are a number of Cylon models yet to be identified. Maybe it's just a conspiracy theory, but wouldn't it be something if the person the Pres gave the baby to was actually a Cylon..? :eek:

And just how did Balthar survive the blast?
Good question, I'd always assumed that Six saved him from the blast, but that apparently was not the case.

I can't even begin to analyze the whole Baltar and Six relationship after this episode. Its become unnervingly complicated.

I agree. So are the Cylons playing mind games with both of them, or is there something else going on here?

BTW, did anybody else Tivo the episode last night? If so, go back and look again 27-28 minutes into the episode. There is a shot of the courtyard from above. A Six is walking with another individual who has his back to us. He appears to be an African American male, stout build, bald head and medium complexion. Who is this model? I don't believe that we have seen him before. I don't think he is the guy from thed organized crime episode. That guy (who I think was in Predator) is older and has a darker complexion. Am I forgeting a model, or is thisa teasor?

Just how did Baltar survive the blast?
"Caprica" Six shielded him from the nuke blast at his house and apparently died doing so. Baltar survived thanks to Six and made it to Sharon's Raptor. . the Six he's seen since the blast is not the "Caprica" six he knew.
I was going to do a "Spoiler alert" to reveal the Baltar/Six thing but decided against it, see below for details......

If you want some real incite into the Baltar/Six relationship.... you must watch the original pilot (2003 three hour movie) on disk one of the season one DVD set with the director's commentary on. The Director, Producer and Writer explain what's going on with Baltar (they explain and settle the- 'is she a chip in his head or is he just nutz' matter) and also which key figures are not Cylons. It put's a lot of questions to rest.
You'll be way ahead if you watch the pilot movie with the commentary on :D :D

... There is a shot of the courtyard from above. A Six is walking with another individual who has his back to us. He appears to be an African American male, stout build, bald head and medium complexion. Who is this model?...

I thought it was the model who was the doctor in the episode when Starbuck was captured on Caprica. Did you forget about him? I didn't go back and re-look, so my assumption may be off.

Great ep, but I about fell off the couch when they showed Baltar present for the re-awakening of 6--until I realized he wasn't really there. I guess we now have "proof" he's not a cylon since in the ep she refers to having been in love with a human.

Go back and look again 27-28 minutes into the episode. There is a shot of the courtyard from above. A Six is walking with another individual who has his back to us. He appears to be an African American male, stout build, bald head and medium complexion. Who is this model?
That's the "Simon" model.
He was the (Cylon) Doctor who treated Starbuck in "The Farm" episode back on Caprica.

So far we've seen six Cylon models... we haven't seen the other six yet.
Six
Dorral (Public relations guy in the pilot episode)
Sharon
Leoben
Simon
D'anna Biers (Lucy Lawless-she's been signed up for a recurring role in season three)

I'd forgotten Simon. Although I think this was a stand-n actor, hence his back being turned.

"Caprica" Six shielded him from the nuke blast at his house and apparently died doing so. Baltar survived thanks to Six and made it to Sharon's Raptor. . the Six he's seen since the blast is not the "Caprica" six he knew.
I was going to do a "Spoiler alert" to reveal the Baltar/Six thing but decided against it, see below for details......

If you want some real incite into the Baltar/Six relationship.... you must watch the original pilot (2003 three hour movie) on disk one of the season one DVD set with the director's commentary on. The Director, Producer and Writer explain what's going on with Baltar (they explain and settle the- 'is she a chip in his head or is he just nutz' matter) and also which key figures are not Cylons. It put's a lot of questions to rest.
You'll be way ahead if you watch the pilot movie with the commentary on :D :D


Well can you give a brief summary of what was said for those of us too cheap to buy the DVD set?

Great ep, but I about fell off the couch when they showed Baltar present for the re-awakening of 6--until I realized he wasn't really there. I guess we now have "proof" he's not a cylon since in the ep she refers to having been in love with a human......frak, now I'm confused.

I get the feeling Six gonna try to physically reach Baltar by leaving Caprica.I also have the feeling that the whole situation is gonna have a Neo-type resolve.....a deal/compromise with the machines.

Oh yeah, I thought all the resurrection ships were destroyed. How can Deanna (Xena) download to a new body?

My head is still spinning from this episode, but a few random thoughts:

In the process of rebirth, a conscience has become part of Sharon and "Caprica". They aren't "Model 8" and "Model 6", but have broken from the collective mentality. They have become indivduals in the midst of clones. I know the Cylons have said that each death is a learning experience, but I'll bet they didn't count on a concience emerging.

I'd like to hear more about what "being in a box" is like for a Cylon. Are they in a dreamless sleep, or self aware that they are trapped in the computer's hard drive (talk about a version of hell).

I also suspect we have not seen the last of Maya, and I'd put money on her being a Cylon.

.....frak, now I'm confused.

I get the feeling Six gonna try to physically reach Baltar by leaving Caprica.I also have the feeling that the whole situation is gonna have a Neo-type resolve.....a deal/compromise with the machines.

Oh yeah, I thought all the resurrection ships were destroyed. How can Deanna (Xena) download to a new body?

I think only the resurrection ship tailing Galactica and Pegaus was destroyed.

You know, I was about to ask about how the Podcasts were... Do they or the commentary reveal spoiler information, or take away from things yet to be revealed? I guess that is a fine line to walk: I was spoiled to last night's SG-Atlantis by the episode guide, not the end of the world - but I would have liked to have figured it out on my own.

v/r,
C-F

I've yet to see/hear the DVDs' commentary, so I'll just have to wait and see if Baltar returns after getting killed (if ever). BTW, there was a great fx shot last night. The one where numerous copies of certain models were standing at a railing's edge with their accompanying reflections on the glass building behind them. Terrific.

They have become indivduals in the midst of clones. I know the Cylons have said that each death is a learning experience, but I'll bet they didn't count on a concience emerging.I saw that most Cylons are individuals, they are just all of the same mold, raised in a monotheic, monoculturistic society almost like a cult or a [nK]. The Cylons that seem to start having 'individualistic' thoughts are the ones influenced by outside forces and human chaos. Maybe the D'Anna Biers('s) are the cultish version of [manipulators/sheepdogs]...

v/r,
C-F

(I don't listen to the podcast...)

.....frak, now I'm confused.

I get the feeling Six gonna try to physically reach Baltar by leaving Caprica.I also have the feeling that the whole situation is gonna have a Neo-type resolve.....a deal/compromise with the machines.

Oh yeah, I thought all the resurrection ships were destroyed. How can Deanna (Xena) download to a new body?
As far as we know, they only destroyed one ship, there may have been more elsewhere or on Caprica itself.

I understand the Cylons request, or need, to have Sharon cut loose from her false past, but what I don't get is why did they insist she move out...new surroundings I guess, so she won't be reminded of that false past?

The downloading of consciousness and re-loading into a new body is an interesting one and is very close to what Richard K Morgan has written about in a series of SciFi novels, Altered Carbon (http://www.richardkmorgan.com/) , Broken Angels and Woken Furies, in which when death occurs a "cortical stack" is removed from the body and replaced in a new body or "sleeve". This sleeve can be regular human sleeves or high tech ones manufactured with increased physical abilities. The contents of these stacks can be sent or "needlecast" to almost anywhere in the universe where a stack facility exists. Great reading, some of the best I've read since Gibson. Eight months after Morgan wrote Altered Carbon, his first novel, it was picked up by Hollywood, I hope they do it justice.

I don't listen to the podcasts either but I do think I will replay the mini-series with the commentary on, sounds like it will be interesting.

That parting shot of Maya is simply saying that we're not done with her yet, seeing as she has a precious package in her possession.

Humm ... I thought I (briefly) saw a new female cylon face in the background of the "cafe" scene ... I'm going to have to recheck that on the TiVo.

As I understood the concept, the Resurrection Ship was only necessary for those Spylons (and possibly Raiders) in Deep Space to regenerate since the Fleet is now so far away from the Colonies and I assume the original Cylon worlds that they can't download at death.

Maya -- wasn't one of the reasons they gave her the infant the fact that she had just lost her own infant? If so, why replace one apparent Cylon baby with the Sharon-Helo infant? From the rest of the fleets' eyes, the new infant would seem to have to be at least somewhat of a close match to keep the switch hidden.

I'm going to assume for now that the dead infant shown in the incubator was Maya's. If so it's a bit convenient to have 2 premie infants that look so similar that neither Helo or Sharon could distinguish it from Hera.

Still, this show's writing is just so amazingly complex. Everybody thought Six was the Queen Bitch, but it seems that there is a new Bee on the loose.

Maya -- wasn't one of the reasons they gave her the infant the fact that she had just lost her own infant? If so, why replace one apparent Cylon baby with the Sharon-Helo infant? From the rest of the fleets' eyes, the new infant would seem to have to be at least somewhat of a close match to keep the switch hidden.

I'm going to assume for now that the dead infant shown in the incubator was Maya's. If so it's a bit convenient to have 2 premie infants that look so similar that neither Helo or Sharon could distinguish it from Hera.


You lost me here, Maya is not the woman who had the abortion...and what other Cylon baby are you talking about...?

If Maya had a baby of her own, there's no way she can be a Cylon.

You know, I was about to ask about how the Podcasts were... Do they or the commentary reveal spoiler information, or take away from things yet to be revealed? I guess that is a fine line to walk: I was spoiled to last night's SG-Atlantis by the episode guide, not the end of the world - but I would have liked to have figured it out on my own.

v/r,
C-F

I listen to the podcasts all the time. There are spoilers, but also insite as to why some things were done the way they were.

So it is a double edged sword, but I accept that and listen. Good insite



As in the recent podcast, Ronald Moore said that the Pegasus is going to be with us with Lee Adama in command into next season (not many episodes left, but still...)

Do you have to own an IPod to listen to those podcasts?

Keenan, no, you can download them for free on iTunes (which itself is free).

It is obvious that Baltar died on Caprica.

She said "Get down!" They were both, obviously, destroyed.....at the same time.

Which Baltar....? I have no idea.

Ed

Keenan, no, you can download them for free on iTunes (which itself is free).
Thanks, I just figured it out(I never even owned a WalkMan.. :o ).

Well can you give a brief summary of what was said for those of us too cheap to buy the DVD set?
OK, but dont read it if you don't want to know........ :D

Well, “Caprica Six” did die in the nuke blast. Baltar survived. The Six that Baltar now sees is imaginary... all in his head. He's experiencing a psychotic break and his imaginary Six is the manifestation of the breakdown. The writer, Director and Producer told James Callis (the actor who plays Baltar) that “His” Six was a chip in his head- to help him with his acting. Only after the mini series (the three hour movie) did they tell him the truth about Baltar's mental breakdown.
They also said that Sharon being a Cylon was a last minute decision made after 99% of the principal shooting was done on the mini series.
They had also considered making Laura a Cylon but decided against it.
These are all facts form the Directors commentary on the three hour pilot episode.

You lost me here, Maya is not the woman who had the abortion...and what other Cylon baby are you talking about...?

No Maya is not the girl who had the abortion, but was there not a conversation where Maya when accepting "Hera" says to the President something to the extent of being 'when I lost my baby, I didn't think I could go on" and being so appreciative of having the chance to have an infant.

Therefore, if she had just lost a child of her own then there would be nearly zero chance of her being a Cylon otherwise there would have been a 2nd Cylon child. I was assuming she had lost her baby recently after the attack and probably recently, but those are certainly assumptions. If she shows up with an infant out of the middle of nowhere and wasn't know to be pregnant by her friends in the Fleet, would not this arouse all sort of suspicions among both Fleet Spylons as well as the Human Religious Leaders that the President warned Maya of.

I assumed she lost her baby (still-born) recently and that's the dead baby that was in the respirator/box.

But a cylon can get pregnant - Boomer's a cylon - so pregnancy shouldn't rule anyone out from suspicion.

But Boomer's pregnancy was a huge deal to the Cylons because they apparently cannot easily get pregnant. Boomer was the first, and Six back on Caprica was incredibly jealous of her because of it and didn't think such a "weak" model was worthy of such an honor.

In this case it should rule out Maya as a Cylon.

But Boomer's pregnancy was a huge deal to the Cylons because they apparently cannot easily get pregnant. Boomer was the first, and Six back on Caprica was incredibly jealous of her because of it and didn't think such a "weak" model was worthy of such an honor.

In this case it should rule out Maya as a Cylon.
Not entirely, who knows if Maya really did have a pregnancy, there's not enough background about her to know one way or the other. I'm not saying she is a Cylon but I've really seen nothing that says she can't be. Another thought is that she could be a Cylon sympathizer and that the baby could end up in Cylon control, maybe Gina's..

BRAV-FRACKING-O....best episode of the season...hell maybe the series...absolutely amazing story-telling and just adds a WHOLE nother dimension to the BSG verse...

My perspective is, the baby representes the Cylon's humanity...their evolution if you will towards peace. And the birth of the baby collimates (if thats a word) this...

Honestly, I've still got goose-bumps. Best show on TV. Amazing.

Do you have to own an IPod to listen to those podcasts?
Or you can just download them directly from SCI/FI's website.

http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/

BRAV-FRACKING-O....best episode of the season...hell maybe the series...absolutely amazing story-telling and just adds a WHOLE nother dimension to the BSG verse...

My perspective is, the baby representes the Cylon's humanity...their evolution if you will towards peace. And the birth of the baby collimates (if thats a word) this...

Honestly, I've still got goose-bumps. Best show on TV. Amazing.

This story arc is starting to take on Dune-like qualities. This baby may end up being the savior of humans and the liberator of the Cylons.

Or you can just download them directly from SCI/FI's website.

http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/
You can also download some deleted scenes and the end title animations for the previous seasons (if you hadn't spotted that section).
http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/episodes/

Not entirely, who knows if Maya really did have a pregnancy, there's not enough background about her to know one way or the other. I'm not saying she is a Cylon but I've really seen nothing that says she can't be. Another thought is that she could be a Cylon sympathizer and that the baby could end up in Cylon control, maybe Gina's..

Of course she had a pregnancy, it was her dead baby they showed to Helo and Sharon.

This story arc is starting to take on Dune-like qualities. This baby may end up being the savior of humans and the liberator of the Cylons.

I'd still space the baby. Like Adama said, if its good for the Cylons then it has to be bad for us.

BTW, those two filler episode were MORE than made up for in the past two episodes...now if Lost could only do the same thing with their season :confused:

Wonder what would happen if the two mentally unstables [Caprica]#6-Actual-v2 and Baltar ever met? Would their [voices] sync or conflict? If we put them and the hybrid child (or Cylon messiah) all into the same room? Is it like crossing the streams or replacing the Arrow?

Baltar seems to have dropped Gina, no? She must be too busy working out how to employ the device...

It does appear that the timeline was further clarified this week (unless it is already in the Podcasts).

v/r,
C-F

Of course she had a pregnancy, it was her dead baby they showed to Helo and Sharon.
I suppose you're right, but the way the sequence played out it doesn't really confirm that. If we had known Maya was pregnant prior to them giving her Sharon's baby it would have made more sense. Remember that they gave Cottle a list of suitable candidates, my assumption was they were going to pick one off that list who was not necessarily previously pregnant. If they were going to be so secretive about they would have to have found someone who had a failed pregnancy at that moment in time, IOW, would there actually have been that many women that fit that profile out of 49,000 people?

Could that dead baby have been the one from the woman who had the abortion awhile back..was she that far along?

I'm probably picking at nits but the way it played just doesn't seem right to me and I'm probably off-base, but I still think there is something "not right" about Maya. Who knows, it just something else that makes this such a good show. :)

Wow, finally watched it from DVR. Truly one of the best episodes ever and what a story arc that it is starting. the writing and ideas are excellent.

I suppose you're right, but the way the sequence played out it doesn't really confirm that. If we had known Maya was pregnant prior to them giving her Sharon's baby it would have made more sense. Remember that they gave Cottle a list of suitable candidates, my assumption was they were going to pick one off that list who was not necessarily previously pregnant. If they were going to be so secretive about they would have to have found someone who had a failed pregnancy at that moment in time, IOW, would there actually have been that many women that fit that profile out of 49,000 people?

Could that dead baby have been the one from the woman who had the abortion awhile back..was she that far along?

I'm probably picking at nits but the way it played just doesn't seem right to me and I'm probably off-base, but I still think there is something "not right" about Maya. Who knows, it just something else that makes this such a good show. :)

They kept it mysterious so that the audience would think they really had killed the baby, with the surprise reveal at the end. It was a way to increase the dramatic tension, not a clue about the nature of Maya's character.

Wonder what would happen if the two mentally unstables [Caprica]#6-Actual-v2 and Baltar ever met? Would their [voices] sync or conflict? If we put them and the hybrid child (or Cylon messiah) all into the same room? Is it like crossing the streams or replacing the Arrow?

Baltar seems to have dropped Gina, no? She must be too busy working out how to employ the device...

It does appear that the timeline was further clarified this week (unless it is already in the Podcasts).

v/r,
C-F

I was wondering that too...I'm also wondering how this cross-over happened....unless this ultimately proves than Baltar is a cylon, and when 6 and Baltar died on Caprica in the Nuke blast, their uploaded streams mixed and then when both of them woke up in the new bodies, they had two consciousness.

Its also worthy to note that the Resserecution ship obviously wasn't the only one. Since Lucy Lawless (#8 I think) didn't seem to worried about not being re-born again.

I love it. I loved the role-reversal for Baltar and 6 and I loved Grace Park as a broke Cylon. I can't wait to see how this new arc forms out.

Xena is #3; Sharon is #8, IIRC. (Viewing #2 should be tonight.)

I definitely dig the whacked head games that are also going on in Caprica 6's head, as well. The only question in my mind is how far into season three do they go before joining the resistance and/or hopping a ship and heading for wherever they think Galactica is.

Later,
Bill

I was wondering that too...I'm also wondering how this cross-over happened....unless this ultimately proves than Baltar is a cylon, and when 6 and Baltar died on Caprica in the Nuke blast, their uploaded streams mixed and then when both of them woke up in the new bodies, they had two consciousness.

Its also worthy to note that the Resserecution ship obviously wasn't the only one. Since Lucy Lawless (#8 I think) didn't seem to worried about not being re-born again.

I love it. I loved the role-reversal for Baltar and 6 and I loved Grace Park as a broke Cylon. I can't wait to see how this new arc forms out.

I'm not the only one to address this, but the resurrection ship should be thought of as a kind of backup or secondary system to the resurrection process. The cylons needed it for operations in deep space as the distance would prevent normal resurrection. Cylon Xena wasn't worried about it as she was tied in to either the main resurrection net or a local net on Caprica itself. But the destruction of the resurrection ship is important as now any cylon killed out beyond the core systems wouldn't be able to download. For example, the tactical experience of the "Scar" fighter has been lost or relegated to an earlier less capable backup.

I'm not the only one to address this, but the resurrection ship should be thought of as a kind of backup or secondary system to the resurrection process. The cylons needed it for operations in deep space as the distance would prevent normal resurrection. Cylon Xena wasn't worried about it as she was tied in to either the main resurrection net or a local net on Caprica itself. But the destruction of the resurrection ship is important as now any cylon killed out beyond the core systems wouldn't be able to download. For example, the tactical experience of the "Scar" fighter has been lost or relegated to an earlier less capable backup.

Good point...but in all honesty, I doubt that was the only Resurrection ship. Why build only one? Why not build a fleet of them in case anything happens?

However, I do think it gave us another look at the re-birth process as not just a continuation of life, but I process of evolution and change. I think this will become increasingly important as Cylons side with the Humans and Humans side with the Cylons...

...I'm also wondering how this cross-over happened....unless this ultimately proves than Baltar is a cylon, and when 6 and Baltar died on Caprica in the Nuke blast, their uploaded streams mixed and then when both of them woke up in the new bodies, they had two consciousness.Hmmm..........but then again, why have Gaius go through the hassle of being accused of collusion and sabotage if he really is a-- *gasp* cylon?

Hmmm..........but then again, why have Gaius go through the hassle of being accused of collusion and sabotage if he really is a-- *gasp* cylon?

I assume you mean the self-accusation by 6 (in Baltar's head) of the sabotage (or am I forgetting something from Season 1?)...well, then why are the cylons testing Caprica-6? Maybe its the synethic mind is unable to comprehend what it just did (slaughter of billions of people)...

I was referring to the time Six went physical in S1 and somehow assumed a body. She went by the name of Shelly-something, and had photoshopped some pix to appear that Baltar had hacked vital military information from central computers on Caprica. I think this was an attempt to blackmail Gaius to not defect back to the humans.

Do Cylon's age?

I know everything about them is kinda hazy but it's kind of weird to have only 12 models and for each model to all be the exact same age as all the other versions of the same model.


If they age, what happens in 80 years? Will their bodies expire despite downloading?

If they don't age, how they are going to explain the obvious physical changes of the actors that play cylons?

Sorry if this is a stupid question...

Amazing show.

Do Cylon's age?

I know everything about them is kinda hazy but it's kind of weird to have only 12 models and for each model to all be the exact same age as all the other versions of the same model.


If they age, what happens in 80 years? Will their bodies expire despite downloading?

If they don't age, how they are going to explain the obvious physical changes of the actors that play cylons?

Sorry if this is a stupid question...

Amazing show.

good question....all we know for sure is that they are all "born" full adult (well the 6 or so models we know of do)...

Shelly was on the Astral Queen(?), which got blown up in "33" (the best episode, IMHO). I'd expect that she was another Cylon mole who had gotten orders to try to sow dissent within the ranks (I wonder if that sub-plot will come up in the campaign in season 3...). As for aging, since the Cylons "disappeared" 40 years ago according to the pilot, it seems logical that the Cylons themselves might not have experience with aging, depending upon how recently developed the skin-jobs are (from a narrative standpoint).

I wonder if in a storyboard meeting someone has talked about a Blade Runner-esque Earth that Galactica finds...

Later,
Bill

speaking of season 3 - with season 2 ending in the next 2 weeks.. have they said if 3 will begin this summer? will there be a 3 and 3.5 like now?

Hmmm..........but then again, why have Gaius go through the hassle of being accused of collusion and sabotage if he really is a-- *gasp* cylon?

Baltar is not a cylon. He survived the nuking of Caprica when Six used her body to protect him from the concussion blast. She died as a result of that, but he survived and was one of the survivors picked up by Sharon's raptor in the mini-series. The director's commentary track to the mini-series on the DVD set states this explictly. Moreover, I seem to remember a comment in this episode from Caprica-6 about being in love with a human; no reason for this comment if Baltar was a cylon.

What we have been seeing (Baltar's "hallucination" of Six and now Six's hallucination of Baltar) is obviously the result of the subconscious mind being unable to cope with the person's role in the destruction of humanity. Both Baltar and Caprica-6 are somewhat psychotic, each seeing sort of idealized hallucinations of their lovers; each of them has become somewhat mentally unglued in trying to cope with their role in the Cylon invasion. This in turn suggests that the advanced Cylons are perhaps more human (or become more human as the result of their interactions with other humans and the rebirth process) than the Cylon culture might like or might have imagined. After all, if you try to clone a human, perhaps what happens is that you succeed so well that the resulting "machine" develops human-like traits and emotions: a conscience; love; etc. These emotions and traits might be controllable in a homogeneous environment, but once the advanced Cylons are outside that environment (Sharon, Caprica-6), they become difficult to control. It's a very interesting twist to the story - perhaps the Cylons were so good at creating a human-like machine that they created . . . a human. And that in turn means that like humans, these advanced Cylons will prove to be "erratic" in their behavior.

John C.

I think that a funny twist will be when the human like Cylons become too human, and the toasters decide to turn on them because they are treating them like disposable slaves.

I think that a funny twist will be when the human like Cylons become too human, and the toasters decide to turn on them because they are treating them like disposable slaves.

Well, we've already seen this to some extent in this episode, right - the Lucy Lawless Cylon essentially turning on the Sharon and Caprica-6 Cylons because of their "inability to cope" or whatever the line she used was.

Remember that the Cylons were originally created by humans; it's not much of a stretch to see them become more human as they evolve.

John C.

Shelly was on the Astral Queen(?), which got blown up in "33" (the best episode, IMHO). I'd expect that she was another Cylon mole who had gotten orders to try to sow dissent within the ranks (I wonder if that sub-plot will come up in the campaign in season 3...). As for aging, since the Cylons "disappeared" 40 years ago according to the pilot, it seems logical that the Cylons themselves might not have experience with aging, depending upon how recently developed the skin-jobs are (from a narrative standpoint).

I wonder if in a storyboard meeting someone has talked about a Blade Runner-esque Earth that Galactica finds...

Later,
Bill

Shelly was on the "Olympic Carrier", which disappeared in "33", but got blown up in the next episode "Water".

The Astral Queen is the prison barge from which Tom Zarek was freed.

(Baltar's "hallucination" of Six and now Six's hallucination of Baltar) is obviously the result of the subconscious mind being unable to cope with the person's role in the destruction of humanity. Both Baltar and Caprica-6 are somewhat psychotic, each seeing sort of idealized hallucinations of their lovers; each of them has become somewhat mentally unglued in trying to cope with their role in the Cylon invasion.
John C.

I am fine with most of your explanation. But this does not explain why most of what 6 tells Baltar comes true; IE. when she told baltar that one of his own will turn on the others (season 2.0..... I forget the lieutenant's name that was going to kill the chief's head engineer for not wanting to complete a mission), the birth of a female hybrid, the fact that Sharon was a cylon (season one) and the knowledge that Baltar would be suspected as a traitor and then vindicated (season one). I think it is more than a hallucination brought on by a psychotic event.

I am fine with most of your explanation. But this does not explain why most of what 6 tells Baltar comes true; IE. when she told baltar that one of his own will turn on the others (season 2.0..... I forget the lieutenant's name that was going to kill the chief's head engineer for not wanting to complete a mission), the birth of a female hybrid the fact that Sharon was a cylon (season one) and the knowledge that Baltar would be suspected as a traitor and then vindicated (season one). I think it is more than a hallucination brought on by a psychotic event.


Then maybe he really was chosen by God (the one the Cylons believe in, not the "Gods" the humans worship).

I am fine with most of your explanation. But this does not explain why most of what 6 tells Baltar comes true; IE. when she told baltar that one of his own will turn on the others (season 2.0..... I forget the lieutenant's name that was going to kill the chief's head engineer for not wanting to complete a mission), the birth of a female hybrid, the fact that Sharon was a cylon (season one) and the knowledge that Baltar would be suspected as a traitor and then vindicated (season one). I think it is more than a hallucination brought on by a psychotic event.

But wasn't Baltar's Sox actually wrong about the birth? IIRC, she said the child would be born in the cell. Sharon's daughter was actually born in Cottle's hospital.

I am fine with most of your explanation. But this does not explain why most of what 6 tells Baltar comes true; IE. when she told baltar that one of his own will turn on the others (season 2.0..... I forget the lieutenant's name that was going to kill the chief's head engineer for not wanting to complete a mission), the birth of a female hybrid, the fact that Sharon was a cylon (season one) and the knowledge that Baltar would be suspected as a traitor and then vindicated (season one). I think it is more than a hallucination brought on by a psychotic event.

Remember that Baltar is truly a genius-level intellect. A lot of what he hallucinates will come true because he subconsciously is processing the information he has and the resulting probabilities at a very high level. And of course if the predictions involve his own conduct, they are simply self-fulfilling prophecies. A psychotic such as Baltar could easily view himself as a suspected traitor, act accordingly, and then outwit everyone to save himself.

John C.

This does not explain why most of what 6 tells Baltar comes true. I think it is more than a hallucination brought on by a psychotic event.
Listen to the miniseries (original three hour movie) with the Directors commentary on...... you'll have the answer directly from the show's creator.

Listen to the miniseries (original three hour movie) with the Directors commentary on...... you'll have the answer directly from the show's creator.Thank's; I will do that.

replayrob and jdcolumbo's information about the Six/Baltar relationship is interesting, but I think they've gone a different way than what the writers initially intended... and it sounds like the writers do change their minds, again based on robs post about the DVD set director's commentary.

I think that, in the instant that the blast hit Six and Baltar, their consciousnesses were merged, or at least a ghost of each's conscious got into the other's head.

Six's body was destroyed shielding Baltar (who survived) and in that instance, as her soul was downloading from her mind to the resurrection facility, it became intertwined in Baltar's, leaving a print in his mind - at the same time, it became imprinted with Baltar's mind as it passed through him and made its way to the resurrection facility with a little bit of Baltar mixed in.

Now, this is just what my wife and I came up with as we were watching it Saturday morning (DVR'd it).

I typed this before reading the last couple pages of thread... Looks like lax01 thought something similair had happened ('cept he thinks they're both cylons with crossed streams).

I wonder if in a storyboard meeting someone has talked about a Blade Runner-esque Earth that Galactica finds...
Later,
BillI think, when galactica eventually finds earth, it's going to be a primitive earth of our past and they and/or the cylons are going to be our forefathers - unlike in TOS when the events occured in approximately the present time (Galactica intercepted a lunar landing transmission, and then in Galactica 1980, found Earth in, well, 1980).

Six's body was destroyed shielding Baltar (who survived) and in that instance, as her soul was downloading from her mind to the resurrection facility, it became intertwined in Baltar's, leaving a print in his mind - at the same time, it became imprinted with Baltar's mind as it passed through him and made its way to the resurrection facility with a little bit of Baltar mixed in.

That could be possible, even if Baltar is 100% human, assuming the science behind the resurrection process is more about their ability to "capture" consciousness as opposed to Cylons having some unique way to store that consciousness built into their systems. But I'd think Baltar would have had to die, or at least be near dead (and some of his consciousness "leaked out" ;) ) for that to be feasible. But it would offer interesting possibilities if the Cylons could capture a dead human's consciousness and place it in one of the 12 Cylon bodies.

But it would offer interesting possibilities if the Cylons could capture a dead human's consciousness and place it in one of the 12 Cylon bodies.

I will presume you meant to say "dying" human's consciousness. It would disappoint me to no end to learn there was a repository for all dead human consciousness from which the Cylons could draw from to give to one of the 12.

Just love this show, can't wait for the next ep, can't wait for the new season, whenever it comes.

I really enjoy the symmetry of the Cylon/human conflict --- humans create Cylons, who turn on them, now we have Cylons creating human-like beings, and they are now being turned on. The 6/Baltar shared psychosis. Beautiful.

Also, we're nine months from the attacks and a hybrid baby is born --- I know she was conceived after the attacks but it's a nice touch.

......

. But it would offer interesting possibilities if the Cylons could capture a dead human's consciousness and place it in one of the 12 Cylon bodies.

They better have a good A-D converter since we're analog and thery're digital. :p

I will presume you meant to say "dying" human's consciousness. It would disappoint me to no end to learn there was a repository for all dead human consciousness from which the Cylons could draw from to give to one of the 12.

My assumption would be "dead" since that is what's required of the Cylons.

Also, we're nine months from the attacks and a hybrid baby is born --- I know she was conceived after the attacks but it's a nice touch.
Hera was a preemie, so actually the timeline is perfect :cool:

That was one of Galactica's best episodes yet. The 90-minute season finale should be a real hoot if they keep amping up the ante like this!

It does not seem right for Cylon replicants to be completely cold door-knob dead and still upload, I figured death triggered a transmission (with battery back-up?, dying breath, etc.) to upload. Maybe they can get the information out if they have the body, but the Resurrection Ship play seemed to indicate they cannot do an [ETHER]-net transmission from a cold dead Cylon.

Seems that there should be capability to do uploads of the Raiders on a BaseStar. I think I would have built at least [black-box/flight recorder] storage into all of my capital warships though.

Of course, if you can upload a Cylon's grey matter and the Cylon's are close enough to human to require elaborate tests to discern, then it stands to reason that they are probably only a probe or two away from uploading humans...

v/r,
C-F

They better have a good A-D converter since we're analog and thery're digital. :p:)... But, since they are so close to human, seem to use similar biology/nervous systems, interbreed, and have fiber-optic ports in their wrists, would they not already have that interface/protocol down?

v/r,
C-F

A guess would be that there is a collective consciousness type of situation, where all the models have the ability to, not necessarily make use of, but somewhere in a lower level of data storage the ability to transmit, or become aware of one of them dying and needing to be "recovered". Sort of like Windows being notified by the machine language that a video card is dying, or something of that nature.

In the novels I referred to earlier, there was an actual physical device, a "cortical stack" that could be recovered and put into a new body. This "stack" would remain viable forever along as it itself was not destroyed.

This is not happening with the Cylons as there does not need to be any physical recovery done of the "consciousness", more likely it is a "network" type of transmission and recovery, and something that is not perceivable by human medicine/scanning detection procedures.

Setting aside transcendental explanations (and the argument Baltar/Caprica-6* make for it) for the moment...

I was only targeting the recovery of dead Cylons. There seems to be a ubiquitous [technological] [collective consciousness] which probably uploads the Cylons as they die. However, assuming Cylons use their brains/neurons (and they do not just light them up to pass as human) the upload/downlink has to either occur before cellular breakdown, or (as referenced) store it in whatever comprises their local non-biological components for later transmission or physical recovery.

Just idly wondering how a mesh or self-organizing network of nodes would act for that sort of challenge, vice a planet wide infrastructure of local access points (and mobile ships).

Manipulation-3 did not seem to have much idea what Caprica-6 and Sharon-8 were thinking, nor did the #5 who approached them in the courtyard. The network linking them does not seem to be very robust, or they have effective privacy over it...

Was the Resurrection Ship's value in the storage of dead Cylons & Raiders, or was it's value in the incubation and imprinting? Gina seemed to believe that if it were destroyed that she would not survive, leading me to think that the link (mesh or access point) has no real storage capability and depends on nodes or specialized units for that.

v/r,
C-F

* Like she's the only 6 on the planet...


(the crossing the streams stuff earlier was also supposed to be a funny...)

speaking of season 3 - with season 2 ending in the next 2 weeks.. have they said if 3 will begin this summer? will there be a 3 and 3.5 like now?

Shooting begins in April. Unsure about the 3-3.5 situation.

How about whether we are getting a full 26 episodes next season? With DVD sales probably being a huge revenue generator, it's hard to point to the economic question mark that was th first season...

According to Caprica Boomer (now Galactica Boomer), she's fully aware of the previous Boomer's feelings and memories including the relationship with the Chief. IIRC, she couldn't have resurrected with the cumulative Boomer info becasue she was alive before Galactica Boomer was shot. So does that mean that they all get updates via a stream as each similar model dies?

And either way - whether updates happen continuously or only at resurrection - doesn't that mean that all subsequent #6's and #8's would have the same conflicted feelings/loyalty?

There seems to be a conflict between Boomer's characterization of a combined consciousness (within each model) and the last episode where "Caprica 6" was viewed as a unique individual even after resurrection. The only explanation I can think of is that they are a series of individuals, that retain that individuality when resurrected - the additional info from other units that have died is downloaded more like a series of reports or memos rather than a true combination of their experiences and feelings. But pregnant Boomer seemed to have genuine feelings for the Chief, more than you'd have if you just read a report that your "twin sister" was in love with him.

:confused:

Shooting begins in April. Unsure about the 3-3.5 situation.

They will in all likelihood use the "split season" approach again with this season and the Stargate series' as it seems to work for them on multiple levels. Less "downtime" between seasons keeps the show fresh in viewers minds, and they've already discovered how to exploit the additional income stream resulting from a mid-season DVD release (I haven't contributed; will wait for the full Season 2 set this summer). Networks seldom relinquish an income stream or profit center once established.

How about whether we are getting a full 26 episodes next season? With DVD sales probably being a huge revenue generator, it's hard to point to the economic question mark that was th first season...

Aren't "full" television seasons only 22 episodes? At least that's the typical case with Big Four (or five or six) OTA networks. Perhaps Cable networks like SciFi do things differently, but it would probably be on the lesser episode side. Some shows only have 12 eps in a full season.

As to Sharon's conflicted loyalty, remember when one of the Sixes (probably not "Caprica Six" but who knows?) made disparaging comments about Sharon, i.e. "That model has always been weak." -or- "She thinks she's in love with him [Helo]". The thing that will catch the Cylon collective by surprise is that the Six model also apparently has such weaknesses, something they didn't count on. Perhaps others as well....? This opens up a whole new plotline and should be very interesting indeed.

According to Caprica Boomer (now Galactica Boomer), she's fully aware of the previous Boomer's feelings and memories including the relationship with the Chief. IIRC, she couldn't have resurrected with the cumulative Boomer info becasue she was alive before Galactica Boomer was shot. So does that mean that they all get updates via a stream as each similar model dies?

And either way - whether updates happen continuously or only at resurrection - doesn't that mean that all subsequent #6's and #8's would have the same conflicted feelings/loyalty?

There seems to be a conflict between Boomer's characterization of a combined consciousness (within each model) and the last episode where "Caprica 6" was viewed as a unique individual even after resurrection. The only explanation I can think of is that they are a series of individuals, that retain that individuality when resurrected - the additional info from other units that have died is downloaded more like a series of reports or memos rather than a true combination of their experiences and feelings. But pregnant Boomer seemed to have genuine feelings for the Chief, more than you'd have if you just read a report that your "twin sister" was in love with him.

:confused:

Very true, in the episode where they find the Tomb of Athena (Season 2.0), Boomer and the Terrell both meet each other for the first time, yet Boomer has distinct memories of the Chief. Also, iin Season 1 t seemed that they were playing up the point that #6 in Baltar's head was constantly receiving updates from the Cylons (unless she was just extremely inntuitive). This really does seem to contradict their current theme of independent personality and consciousness. Hopefully they'll find a good way to explain that...I don't doubt they have talent to do so...

I believe Boomer remembered Terrell from "before the attack", as mentioned on this week's UHD episode (Pegasus? where Sharon saves them from the virus/attack and Chief Terrell builds the stealth ship). I can't remember if when visiting the tomb, she said she "remembers" shooting Adama or anything after the attack...

I thought I was just being Big Brother with the Cylon Ether-net, but you are right, maybe those two were Firewalled in anticipation of being Boxed? Baby-Boomer felt a fair bit about the Chief, but she did not seem as connected to the shooting - maybe all undercovers have two firewalls: one to keep the Cylon out of the human, and one to keep the human from leaking into the [collective net]. Then [the infamous they] only cross over the edited or screened bits?

v/r,
C-F

I think I am going to revise what I had believed about the Borg, oops, sorry, the Cylons.

For a while I was thinking they were acting more as a hive mentalilty. I also thought that they had a shared consciousness. I don't think that is true.

When D'anna was talking to Sharon and Caprica, it was clear that she didn't know what the other two were thinking. Apparently each humlyon is an individual, even though there may be 12 models. I am agreeing with another observation that maybe they are more like twin/triplets/....up to whatever the final number of the Cylon population is.

(I started thinking about the Babylon 5 episode when Susan ran into Zathras, thinking that he was Zathras only to find out that he wasn't Zathras, but rather Zathras. )

I assume you mean the self-accusation by 6 (in Baltar's head) of the sabotage (or am I forgetting something from Season 1?)...well, then why are the cylons testing Caprica-6? Maybe its the synethic mind is unable to comprehend what it just did (slaughter of billions of people)...Of course, Baltar did betray the human race (a fact he wasn't truly aware of until the nukes started falling), but wasn't Shelly actually Six resurrected? Baltar immediately recognized her and accosted her in the stall of a co-ed restroom with countercharges of being a cylon (which she was). Shellys' accusations were made because Gaius was having second thoughts about helping the cylons and spurned their beliefs. If that was (and I think it is) the same episode where he couldn't find Six until he repented (while behind bars), that to me would make Shelly/Six one and the same. Six didn't return until after Shelly left................heck, maybe it was just coincidence.

I was trying to make a point, but forgot what it was....

Very true, in the episode where they find the Tomb of Athena (Season 2.0), Boomer and the Terrell both meet each other for the first time, yet Boomer has distinct memories of the Chief. Also, iin Season 1 t seemed that they were playing up the point that #6 in Baltar's head was constantly receiving updates from the Cylons (unless she was just extremely inntuitive). This really does seem to contradict their current theme of independent personality and consciousness. Hopefully they'll find a good way to explain that...I don't doubt they have talent to do so...

I had proposed that the cylon sleeper agents somehow transmitted everything they had seen or heard at periodic points. In essence they are walking video recorders, and in some fashion they download this info at periodic points for analysis.

Basically the perfect spy since they could not withhold info nor would they even know they were spying in the first place. For example the video that Deanna Biers shot that the Cylons got a hold of was not a transmission of the actual video but probabably what she saw through her own eyes as she cut it.

If this is the case, then Caprica Sharon was created from a download of Boomer after she had left Helo on Caprica. This is how the Cylons knew about Helo and Starbuck, etc.

How about whether we are getting a full 26 episodes next season? With DVD sales probably being a huge revenue generator, it's hard to point to the economic question mark that was th first season...

more episodes per season mean diluted quality according to Ron Moore so I'm fine with just 20 episodes a season.

I had proposed that the cylon sleeper agents somehow transmitted everything they had seen or heard at periodic points. In essence they are walking video recorders, and in some fashion they download this info at periodic points for analysis.

Basically the perfect spy since they could not withhold info nor would they even know they were spying in the first place. For example the video that Deanna Biers shot that the Cylons got a hold of was not a transmission of the actual video but probabably what she saw through her own eyes as she cut it.

If this is the case, then Caprica Sharon was created from a download of Boomer after she had left Helo on Caprica. This is how the Cylons knew about Helo and Starbuck, etc.


She was showing the footage she took, including the finished edited video. They "lost two Raiders transmitting it back."

She was showing the footage she took, including the finished edited video. They "lost two Raiders transmitting it back."

Deanna Biers did not show the footage she shot to the Cylons back on Caprica because she was with the fleet. The group of Cylons watching this at the theater happenned to include another #3 possibly the one that was killed by 6 and Sharon in this last episode.

Link to a review of BSG in a Philadelphia paper (http://www.philly.com/mld/philly/entertainment/13994601.htm?source=rss&channel=philly_entertainment)

Sounds like I am in the minority. After finally watching last week's episode, I must say that I am a little disappointed by the decision to pull back the curtain on the cylons a bit. Up to last week's episode, I was under the impression that the cylons actually had a unified "plan" that they were all working towards and we were seeing it unfold piece by piece. Kind of an unspoken, unknown sense of dread that the humans might be doing exactly what the cylons wanted them to do all along.

Now it appears that the cylons are just the ying to the human's yang; just as screwed up, mental, and disorganized. Kind of a bummer for me. Almost the same sense of "that's it?" when the producers were forced to start filling in the missing pieces at the end of the x-files. Like a good horror film, sometimes showing too much of the monster is not a good thing.

Just by way of one example, knowing that the shelly in baltar's head does not appear to be part of the cylon plan (I had assumed that she somehow survived the blast by going in baltar instead of reincarnating) seems to make her presence less of a threat.

I have some co-workers who are convinced that BSG is just Buck Rogers: The Next Generation. Obviously, they haven't seen a single minute of the actual show. So I decided to put together a little collection of critical acclaim to demonstrate that this show ain't your father's Battlestar Galactica. The list has worked so I decided to post an abreviated version here in case you know some skeptics too.


Time Magazine
#1 new show of 2005
Most of you probably think this entry has got to be a joke. The rest of you have actually watched the show. Adapted from a cheesy '70s Star Wars clone of the same name, Galactica (returning in January) is a ripping sci-fi allegory of the war on terror, complete with religious fundamentalists (here, genocidal robots called Cylons), sleeper cells, civil-liberties crackdowns and even a prisoner-torture scandal. The basic-cable budget sometimes shows in the production, but the writing and performances are first-class, especially Edward James Olmos as the noble but authoritarian commander in charge of saving the last remnants of humanity. Laugh if you want, but this story of enemies within is dead serious, and seriously good.
http://www.time.com/time/arts/article/0,8599,1141640,00.html

Newsday.com
#1 show of 2005
Wow. Who expected the year's best drama and most telling current-events allegory to come in a space-set actioner? This sly and sleek reimagining from "Star Trek" veteran Ronald D. Moore tackles nothing less than the meaning of civilization and the makeup of morality. As post-nuke humans battle for survival against a race of seemingly ruthless androids, Moore's writers neatly twist our expectations of who and what is "good" and "right" in a war of covert terrorism. You can look at this saga any way you want - as political drama, religious debate, psychological suspenser, sci-fi adventure, deep metaphor or just plain fun - and it's scintillating from every angle
http://www.newsday.com/entertainment/ny-fftv4561321dec25,0,795582.story

TV Guide
Best of 2005
The 2003 miniseries took me by surprise, reshaping a classic (if cheesy) sci-fi concept into a dark, scary, provocative adult adventure of genocide and survival. Still, nothing prepared me for the power of Sci Fi Channel's new Battlestar Galactica as a gripping weekly series, one of the best and most challenging dramas of any genre on TV today. Terse, tough, smart and unpredictable, the show pits a band of embattled humans against the cunning hybrid Cylons, who in their own spiritual explorations often seem more human than our militaristic, contentious heroes. The violent twists and turns are as grim and suspenseful as anything you'd find on 24. With shows like this, Sci Fi has shed that "for geeks only" label once and for all.
http://online.tvguide.com/special/bestofyear05/year-in-review.asp

American Film Institute
Top 10 show of 2005
Battlestar Galactica soars light years beyond the expectations of science fiction on television. Au courant and hard-hitting, it's one of the best series today about United States entanglements in the war on terror, addressing the moral quandary--when at war, when does a society become that which it opposes? It is this kind of deep thinking in space that makes the show both a cautionary tale and a rip-roaring, out-of-this-world adventure.
https://www.afi.com/tvevents/afiawards05/tvshows05.aspx

Chicago Tribune
Top 10 show of 2005
There’s no antiseptic, morally upright future on display here. Just a lot of confused, conflicted people, in a battle to the death with "others" who look exactly like humans — and who say they are representatives of the one true God. The real joke on those who think "Galactica" is just another sci-fi show is that this gripping drama is, in fact, television’s most topical, incisive commentary on current events in our very troubled world.
http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/entertainment_tv/2005/12/the_top_10_tv_s.html

Pittsburgh Post Gazette
#1 show of 2005
Go ahead, deride it as kiddie science fiction, but do so at the risk of displaying ignorance and ingrained bias. Filled with political and religious allegory, great character drama and exciting storytelling, this thoroughly human story is as good as TV drama gets.
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05363/629182.stm

USA Today
Runner up to Top 10 list
http://www.usatoday.com/life/television/reviews/2005-12-27-year-in-tv_x.htm

National Review
Science fiction has long been stereotyped as a hardware-obsessed, techno-jargon laden refuge for computer nerds and outcasts. Especially on television, which lacks the geek chic afforded by big-screen Hollywood budgets, the genre's reputation for hokey dialog and cardboard-and-wire effects have saturated it with a distinct odor of disrespectability. It is somewhat ironic, then, to see the Sci-Fi Channel, a network which often seems devoted to the pulpy and lowbrow, serve up Battlestar Galactica, a show about spaceships and killer robots that is also arguably the most potent, dramatically vibrant series on television. An unflinching examination of how the military, government, family, and religion interact in the fragile ecosystem of society, it as morally and intellectually serious as it is thrilling.
http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/suderman200601200838.asp

Very nice list. I hope your friends take the hint and check it out.

I noticed that a couple of the reviews mentioned the "cheesy" '70's series (which had an unprecedented 1 million dollar per episode budget at the time). I wonder how many fans of the old series (I still have fond memories of it), still haven't check out the new version.

I remember some of the flak about the casting of Starbuck as a woman, but honestly, does anyone still prefer Dirk Benedict to Katee Sackhoff?

I noticed that a couple of the reviews mentioned the "cheesy" '70's series.
They may consider the original BSG as cheesy on several different levels….
1) Extensive rip-off’s from Star wars including technology- base ships and raiders, casting- the Cylon’s Imperious Leader, Storm Troopers, and so on. Even the whole concept of BSG was a direct rip-off of Star Wars- the human race on the run from an evil empire.
2) The Cylon’s in the original series were guys with a chrome top, a silver plastic skirt over Spandex pants … who carried swords. Major Cheese!!
3) Later episodes contained more “recycled” footage than original footage. The network knew BSG was going to be canceled at the end of the season and killed the budget early. So, the writers were forced to write stories which fit the footage they already had. No new special effects or location shots…. Just more interior sets that had already been built. Very Very cheesy!
4) The whole “Centon” “Yarin” “Micron” thing- what was Glen A. Larson smoking when he came up with this convoluted system?.
5) Boxy and Muffit….. do we really even have to go into that cheese factory?
6) “The Council of the Twelve” was a bunch of geriatric yes-men who always agreed on whatever plan put Galactica and the fleet the most in harm’s way….please make them go away.
7) The opening for each episode was narrated by a guy with an unmistakable voice, who also played Satin incarnate in the series….???

So, there was some major cheese going on in the original BSG....... but we still love it anyway. It's the only BSG my kids can watch...... :D
BY.....YOUR.....COMMAND!!!

Thanks for the reviews list. I have a few friends I've been trying to convince to watch, but I think they have visions of Star Trek in their heads. I forwarded the list to them to try and convince them it's worthy of their time.
Seriously, how can anyone not think this is one of the best shows on tv right now?

Is it Friday already? :D

Thanks for the reviews list. I have a few friends I've been trying to convince to watch, but I think they have visions of Star Trek in their heads. I forwarded the list to them to try and convince them it's worthy of their time.
Seriously, how can anyone not think this is one of the best shows on tv right now?

They will repent evenutally.

I resisted Babylon 5 until its 5th season, and that was one series you didn't want to come in on the tail end of. I then had to go back to catch up from the beginning.

Those of us who have discovered what an incredible job of story telling the series is cannot imagine anyone NOT liking it.

For the life of me, I cannot get my buddies to watch BSG...they think its a total-nerd show and are shocked when I say its the best show on TV right now...its total ignorance on their part, and it pisses me off that they won't even give it a try before they totally condemn the series

Sounds like I'm not the only one having trouble with overcoming the stigma (to some) of sci-fi shows.
The opening to the show is so good, if we could just get them to go that far I think they would get drawn in.

For the life of me, I cannot get my buddies to watch BSG...they think its a total-nerd show and are shocked when I say its the best show on TV right now...its total ignorance on their part, and it pisses me off that they won't even give it a try before they totally condemn the series

I hear that from people all the time. They look at me like I am nuts.

Well...anyways, Mrs Dood loves the show with me. She enjoyed Babylon 5 with me as well. My best friend that enjoys this show is jealous of me because my wife will watch it and "get it" were his wife just rolls her eyes...

Say I have a question: When is the 90 minute episode? This week? Next week? Or both?

EDIT: For typ0s....*sigh*

They may consider the original BSG as cheesy on several different levels….


If you want cheesy, it's a bit off topic, but does anyone remember the film Space Mutiny (http://imdb.com/title/tt0096149/?fr=c2l0ZT1kZnx0dD0xfGZiPXV8cG49MHxrdz0xfHE9c3BhY2UgbXV0aW55 fGZ0PTF8bXg9MjB8bG09NTAwfGNvPTF8aHRtbD0xfG5tPTE_;fc=1;ft=20; fm=1) from 1988? They actually reused the battle footage from the original BSG. It was most excellently skewered during the 8th season of MST3K. :D

If you want cheesy, it's a bit off topic, but does anyone remember the film Space Mutiny (http://imdb.com/title/tt0096149/?fr=c2l0ZT1kZnx0dD0xfGZiPXV8cG49MHxrdz0xfHE9c3BhY2UgbXV0aW55 fGZ0PTF8bXg9MjB8bG09NTAwfGNvPTF8aHRtbD0xfG5tPTE_;fc=1;ft=20; fm=1) from 1988? They actually reused the battle footage from the original BSG. It was most excellently skewered during the 8th season of MST3K. :D

A film that borrowed scenes from a series that borrowed scenes from other movies?

All this has happened before.

So say we all.

So, there was some major cheese going on in the original BSG....... but we still love it anyway. It's the only BSG my kids can watch...... :DWell, there you have it. TOS was aimed at kids. I was a teen and certainly watched, though I couldn't stomach it now. Lorne Greene?....that was indeed my daddy's BSG.

Hey Hey Hey...does that make me yer Daddy? :D I always liked Lorne Greene. Except I always have his song "Ringo" stuck in my head....

My dad never missed an ep of his favorite (http://bonanza1.com/) series which starred LG. Maybe I'm not quite old-school enough, but episodic westerns (such as Bonanza, Gunsmoke, etc., were just OK to me.

My dad never missed an ep of his favorite (http://bonanza1.com/) series which starred LG. Maybe I'm not quite old-school enough, but episodic westerns (such as Bonanza, Gunsmoke, etc., were just OK to me.
they were great because there was nothing else all pre cable days

That opening sequence was intense, to put it mildly...almost a full range of emotions and an incredible soundtrack to boot, these people make some damn good TV.

Anybody catch when Baltar mentioned God, as in one God instead of "the gods" when he was talking to Zarek before the first debate..?

Yes! I did notice that. That was a good piece of dialog going there. Talk about a "threesome". ;)

BSG... This show just keeps getting better & better with each new episode... and it was great to begin with... episode 218 was simply amazing.

C'mon Sci Fi let's get with the HD programming.

That opening sequence was intense, to put it mildly...almost a full range of emotions and an incredible soundtrack to boot, these people make some damn good TV.I did notice an interesting change in last night's score. Didn't have that creepy bit that usually plays whenever Six shows up. OK ep,....I think last week's ep has been the pinnacle this season (just as '23rd Psalm' was the high point for Lost). I don't expect the season-ender to disappoint, though.

49,579

Just logging the population. Every week I forget what the previous week was, and last night was the first time I remembered - but there was no change :rolleyes:

Great episode. Was there anything that Starbuck's terrorist friend overheard in the parking garage between #6 and #8 that could bite someone in the ass if he makes it back to Galactica? Any Baltar references?

Another great episode. The fastest hour (Ok... only 42 min of content) on TV!
What's up with the Chief? Now he thinks he's a Cylon too? Frack me!!
Boomer has to take some happy pills and forget about the kid, I wouldn't trust her in her current condition/state of mind to take my SAR team ten jumps out. Isn't she looking for a little payback for the loss of the baby?
I loved Laura gettin tuff with Baltar before and after the debate.... great stuff.


Was there anything that Starbuck's terrorist friend overheard in the parking garage between #6 and #8 that could bite someone in the ass if he makes it back to Galactica? Any Baltar references?
I don't recall any Baltar references in the collapse scene, but in the trailer for next week's 90 min season 2 cliffhanger/grand finale .... we heard Laura saying "Baltar's working with the Cylons". In typical BSG fashion.... she may well have been talking to herself. Guess we'll have to wait till next Friday to find out!




OT: I thought the best thing about the original BSG were the space babes on the show:
Jane Seymour: (Serina) 28 year old beauty that stole every scene she was in! One of the most beautiful women ever on TV!
Maren Jensen: (Athena) 23 year old with some major curves. The original "bootylicious" Space babe!
Anne Lcockhart: (Sheba) 26 year old daughter of June Lockhart. Not in the same league as Seymour or Jensen... but she just had it going on!
Ok, I was 18 at the time, but damn.... these women were hot!!


OOT: If/when this series comes out on HD/BD DVD..... I will buy a HD DVD player!

I will lust for Jane Seymore until the day I die. :) She still has it going in her 50's.

Did everyone notice the look on Dee's face as Gaeta told her about the planet's potential concealment from the Cylons because of the nebula? That sly smile... already got the pic of Lee up in her locker...

The perfect little spylon. C'mon, you know she is.

He could out D'anna Biers, and should be able to provide sketches of most models, assuming that the Cylons put more than #3, #5, #6, #8, and the Doc on the planet.

v/r,
C-F

What's up with the Chief? Now he thinks he's a Cylon too? Frack me!!

OK, that bothered you too? I was trying to remember what happened that could have caused the Chief to suddenly go all psycho. In an otherwise great episode, that just didn't track.

....and why the heck of Al from the Quatum Leap project pretending to be a priest? And where was Sam Beckett? :)

....and why the heck of Al from the Quatum Leap project pretending to be a priest? And where was Sam Beckett? :)
Maybe Sam leaped into the Chief, which is why Al, er, the priest, is trying so hard to help the Chief get his head screwed on straight. :D

~Dan

OT: I thought the best thing about the original BSG were the space babes on the show:
Jane Seymour: (Serina) 28 year old beauty that stole every scene she was in! One of the most beautiful women ever on TV!
Maren Jensen: (Athena) 23 year old with some major curves. The original "bootylicious" Space babe!
Anne Lcockhart: (Sheba) 26 year old daughter of June Lockhart. Not in the same league as Seymour or Jensen... but she just had it going on!
Ok, I was 18 at the time, but damn.... these women were hot!!


I though Laurette Spang (Cassiopeia) was pretty hot, but I liked her more as a hooker--er, "Socialator"--than a med tech...

BTW, even though it was before my time, the honor of "Original Space Babe" has to go to Jane Fonda in Barberella.

~Dan

7) The opening for each episode was narrated by a guy with an unmistakable voice, who also played Satin incarnate in the series….???
Patrick Macnee, of The Avengers fame. He also did the voice of the Imperious Leader, as well as Count Iblis and the opening narration.

His is just one of those classic voices, like James Earl "This is CNN" Jones...

~Dan

Did everyone notice the look on Dee's face as Gaeta told her about the planet's potential concealment from the Cylons because of the nebula? That sly smile... already got the pic of Lee up in her locker...

The perfect little spylon. C'mon, you know she is.
I definitely noticed that, in fact, it just seemed a little too obvious not to be what we think.

OT: I thought the best thing about the original BSG were the space babes on the show:
Jane Seymour: (Serina) 28 year old beauty that stole every scene she was in! One of the most beautiful women ever on TV!
Maren Jensen: (Athena) 23 year old with some major curves. The original "bootylicious" Space babe!
Anne Lcockhart: (Sheba) 26 year old daughter of June Lockhart. Not in the same league as Seymour or Jensen... but she just had it going on!
Ok, I was 18 at the time, but damn.... these women were hot!!

OK, now there you got me. There was SOME redeeming quality to the old series. Actually of them all, Sheba was my favorite....probably why I like the current version of Starbuck. Both damn cute and can blast a raider to Kobol in the blink of an eye.

Just watched last night's episode...and well, I can't say it was the best episode of the season, but its definitely going to setup one hell of a season finale.

The opening scene: FRENTIC. 5 different storylines going round and round and it was just excellent with the score they used. This is why BSG is one of the best shows on TV.

The debates: Loved the dialouge between everyone...when Roslin goes "I'm going to wipe the floor with you Gauis" and Baltar replies, "You must be losing your mind again"...awesome.

Caprica rescue: Perfect setup...I didn't watch the preview, but I wonder if they're all going to get captured by the Cylons.

Sharon's mental status: I understand why she's so broken up...it makes sense
Chief Terrel's mental status: Totally confusing and un-needed. The one thing that really didn't fit in this episode (but I'm guessing it will resolve itself in the season finale or season 3)...I just dont get why he think he's a Cylon...

Can't wait for next weeks...I'm definitely going to try watching it at air-date instead of downloading the episode...so much more fun to watch it at 10pm than 2pm the next day ;)

Am I the only one who things the writers go way overboard with the word "frack"? I thought it was okay at first since they can't use the real word and in this fictional universe it's logical there would be slang we don't use... but they really don't know when to quit. I mean EVERY character uses it, and it's the only fictional cuss word that is used.

Don't get me wrong, I love the show and this is a minor quibble. But it's just about the only thing about the show that reminds me I'm watching a television show.

Am I the only one who things the writers go way overboard with the word "frack"? I thought it was okay at first since they can't use the real word and in this fictional universe it's logical there would be slang we don't use... but they really don't know when to quit. I mean EVERY character uses it, and it's the only fictional cuss word that is used.

Don't get me wrong, I love the show and this is a minor quibble. But it's just about the only thing about the show that reminds me I'm watching a television show.
lol im with you maybe they should say nit.

Maybe Sam leaped into the Chief, which is why Al, er, the priest, is trying so hard to help the Chief get his head screwed on straight. :D

~Dan

Duh!!!! Fracking Ziggy is a Cylon. :p

Am I the only one who things the writers go way overboard with the word "frack"? I thought it was okay at first since they can't use the real word and in this fictional universe it's logical there would be slang we don't use... but they really don't know when to quit. I mean EVERY character uses it, and it's the only fictional cuss word that is used.

Don't get me wrong, I love the show and this is a minor quibble. But it's just about the only thing about the show that reminds me I'm watching a television show.

Dude, you must really hate Deadwood then.

Just watched last night's episode...and well, I can't say it was the best episode of the season, but its definitely going to setup one hell of a season finale.

The opening scene: FRENTIC. 5 different storylines going round and round and it was just excellent with the score they used. This is why BSG is one of the best shows on TV.

The debates: Loved the dialouge between everyone...when Roslin goes "I'm going to wipe the floor with you Gauis" and Baltar replies, "You must be losing your mind again"...awesome.

Caprica rescue: Perfect setup...I didn't watch the preview, but I wonder if they're all going to get captured by the Cylons.

Sharon's mental status: I understand why she's so broken up...it makes sense
Chief Terrel's mental status: Totally confusing and un-needed. The one thing that really didn't fit in this episode (but I'm guessing it will resolve itself in the season finale or season 3)...I just dont get why he think he's a Cylon...

Can't wait for next weeks...I'm definitely going to try watching it at air-date instead of downloading the episode...so much more fun to watch it at 10pm than 2pm the next day ;)

I hate that I'm dropping three consecutive posts but I guess that's what happens when you watch the show on the next day with the DVR.

Anyway, I agree with you about the pace of the show. Kudos to last nights director as I was physically tense watching that episode. It might have been all the coffee I've drunk today but that episode really had me hooked and wired.

And Ditto to all the comments about the Chief. That storyline is a little abrupt isn't it? I bet that I read in Ron Moore's blog next month that they cut a scene from the last episode that would have explained the psychic breakdown better.

I bet that I read in Ron Moore's blog next month that they cut a
scene from the last episode that would have explained the psychic breakdown better.

here i'll break up your posts :)

its too bad they only have 42 minutes :(

Dude, you must really hate Deadwood then.

I'd have to watch the show to decide if the writers are overdoing it in Deadwood, and I haven't, but that's a different problem than "frack" in BSG. Frack is a fake word and they use it all the time. It reminds me that I'm watching a TV show in a show that otherwise does an excellent job immersing the audience in it's fictional universe. It's like flicking on the lights in the theater ever so often. If BSG was on HBO and they used the real F word, it would be a different story. But that's just me...

If BSG was on HBO and they used the real F word, it would be a different story. But that's just me...

THINK of the possiblities beyond just the use of the F word....in fact, I think every show would be better if it were on HBO...

wow, BSG on HBO wow

I agree about the energy, and the music in the first half(?) was great.

For the Chief, maybe he's just going crazy. But remember back when Sharon/Boomer started acting suicidal for no reason?

I agree about the energy, and the music in the first half(?) was great.

For the Chief, maybe he's just going crazy. But remember back when Sharon/Boomer started acting suicidal for no reason?

In "Water," she was acting suicidal because she was finally becoming aware of her Cylon-side...what she had done...and why she was doing it...perhaps, we just haven't seen this part of the Chief yet

Am I the only one who things the writers go way overboard with the word "frack"?
It's frakin' obvious that you have never frakin' been in the frakin' military, or you'd be frakin' using some frakin' f-word every other frakin' word.

It's almost a frakin' requirement. :D

~Dan

About Chief Tyrol, I thought they were just showing the other side of the coin with respect to the Cylon infiltrators (plus some guilt transference on his personal part).

If the Cylon infiltrators do not know, how are you to know if you are one or not? It stands to reason that one of the people who know how deep the programming went, would have some self-image [anxiety/fear/weakness] and need to work through the anxiety of wondering if they are one or not. Others more remote to the infiltrator most likely assume that [Galactica]Boomer was complicit. If so, then the [need] to use a central character close to her vice a disposable one could follow - as discussed about pilots leading ground troops (or a CSAR).

v/r,
C-F

Am I the only one who things the writers go way overboard with the word "frack"?Would you feel better if they replaced it with a real curse word on unrated DVD releases? Personally I think it's fine just the frakkin' way it is.

It's frakin' obvious that you have never frakin' been in the frakin' military, or you'd be frakin' using some frakin' f-word every other frakin' word.

It's almost a frakin' requirement. :D

~Dan

You're right. I've also never been a fracking president of no frackin country or colonies. Nor have I been a frackin robot or fought frackin robots. I don't know frack from frackola, I guess.

Would you feel better if they replaced it with a real curse word on unrated DVD releases? Personally I think it's fine just the frakkin' way it is.

No, just cut down on it. Look, I already said it was a minor quibble on an otherwise fine show. I knew criticizing it would frack you people off...

I had to talk my "sig other" to watch just one episode.

He said: " I guess frak means f*ck."

He then said: "It's becoming annoying!"

I agreed. Maybe they should be using "felgergarb"??????

Ed

PS. Felgergarb wouldn't last long. Where is the "S" word????

I'd have to watch the show to decide if the writers are overdoing it in Deadwood, and I haven't, but that's a different problem than "frack" in BSG. Frack is a fake word and they use it all the time. It reminds me that I'm watching a TV show in a show that otherwise does an excellent job immersing the audience in it's fictional universe.

See Penn & Teller's "BullFrack!" for a scathing report on the absurdity (and ultimate futility) of using "substitute" curse words. ;)

No, just cut down on it. Look, I already said it was a minor quibble on an otherwise fine show. I knew criticizing it would frack you people off...

No, I think it was a good point. It sounds so silly when used repetitively that it does remind you that you're watching a tv show. It's only because everything else about the show is so absorbing that this stands out.

I don't think I have ever heard the Admiral Adama ever say FRAK.

At the end of a particular episode in season 1, Ellen Tigh (I believe it was) relunctantly embraced Adama and quietly said "Don't frak with me, Adama." His grinning response? "Don't frak with me, either." And this after he risked his neck to reunite her with her husband.

No, just cut down on it. Look, I already said it was a minor quibble on an otherwise fine show. I knew criticizing it would frack you people off...
It didn't frak me off...I was just looking for an opportunity to use frak every other frakin' word! :D

BTW, I'm with you on this one...the last episode seemed to really be bad. Everything in moderation, is the key...

~Dan

I don't think I have ever heard the Admiral Adama ever say FRAK.


He's said it a few times.

I have some co-workers who are convinced that BSG is just Buck Rogers: The Next Generation. Obviously, they haven't seen a single minute of the actual show. So I decided to put together a little collection of critical acclaim to demonstrate that this show ain't your father's Battlestar Galactica. The list has worked so I decided to post an abreviated version here in case you know some skeptics too.

I have a couple of more for you -- and do you mind if we repost your list elsewhere?

The New Yorker
But what interests people who normally don’t care about science fiction is how timely and resonant the show is, bringing into play religion and religious fanaticism, global politics, terrorism, and questions about what it means to be human. (There are also a couple of funny jabs at the media, particularly at talk-show airheads who don’t, or can’t, distinguish between news and entertainment.) There’s no woozy space-aginess in the show, no theremin or symphonic music—the score consists mainly of taiko-inspired drumming, sometimes to the point of tedium, as if you were at a never-ending Iron John weekend. “Battlestar Galactica” is frank and graphic about sex and death.
http://www.newyorker.com/printables/critics/060123crte_television

Rolling Stone
Civilization is under attack by religious fanatics -- and the fanatics are winning. There are suicide bombers, a clueless president and prisoners who get tortured by the good guys. No, this isn't a particularly grim night on CNN: It's Battlestar Galactica, the smartest and toughest show on TV. In its second season, this remake of the 1978 camp classic has become -- no joke -- TV's most vivid depiction of the post-9/11 world and what happens to a society at war.
http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/9183391/intergalactic_terror

A couple of quick funnies. From the fine folks at Glarkware:
http://www.glarkware.com/securestore/c188252p16758170.2.html

And from LiveJournal (spoiler for Lay Down Your Burdens, pt. 1):
http://absolut3destiny.livejournal.com/162618.html#cutid1

I went to the BSG night at the Paley Festival last Friday, so here's my report. I took notes for you people :)

The night begins, as always, with some generic Paley/Museum stuff I won't go into, but finally the participants were introduced: producers Ron Moore and David Eick, and cast members Edward James Olmos, Mary McDonnell, Jamie Bamber, Katee Sackoff, James Callis and Grace Park. Callis looks *just* like Baltar. Down to the tweedy jacket and off-kilter tie. It was kinda weird. Grace looked very pretty and really like a tiny thing. Katee was very glam in a blue halter that really accented her OMG muscled arms and shoulders. Go her :)

Mary is very, very sweet, with nothing but big smiles for the audience. She and EJO got the biggest applause. Jamie is not as tall as I thought :) but looked very hot in a black shirt and trousers. He still sounds completely British, but give him another couple of years and I imagine he'll be sounding much more transatlantic.

RDM and David made a few funny comments -- mostly about the GINO-type fans who hated the remake before it ever aired -- by way of introducing the screening of Lay Down Your Burdens, Part 1, which was airing that same night.

At the Paley Fest, you never quite know what you're going to get in terms of what they show -- a lot of times the show is between seasons, or nothing new is ready to show, as was the case with Lost last year. So it was awesome to see a new episode on a huge screen with almost 600 fans in the room. It looked great (and reminded me how crappy Sci-Fi looks at my house, bleh) and the audience caught up from the first moments. Everyone loved the interaction between Roslin and Adama (omgtheyaresoshipped!) and other funny moments ("why don't you go frak yourself") got big laughs. An approving "oooh" went through the room when Dean Stockwell appeared. The episode just zoomed by and there was an audible groan when the fan's three least favorite words appeared at the end.

The panel was reintroduced by a not very good Museum curator who was moderating. (Which is a shame -- we had Elvis Mitchell for Entourage, and he was awesome. Too bad Matt Roush couldn't have done it.)

There was a brief taped hello message from Tricia, the only main-credits cast member who didn't appear, saying that she was sorry she couldn't be there, but was off filming. She asked us to be nice to her castmates, even pointing down where they happened to be sitting. It was very cute.

The notes from the panel follow -- I use mostly first names for the panelists just to make the typing easier. I try to be as faithful as possible to what was said, but I'm no stenographer. I won't use quotation marks unless I have something down as a quote; otherwise I'll try to give the sense of what was said.

-- The moderator's first question was for Ron & David about the 9/11 analogies, as he put it. David recalled that his first conversation about the show was with an executive at USA in December 2001. His first response was something like "why would anyone want to remake that?" He didn't see it was an opportunity until he and Ron started stalking about how it would resonate very differently -- he called them dark conversations, taking the story in a direction that wasn't fantastical or escapist.

-- Ron added that he wasn't sure if he wanted to do BSG after Star Trek. When he was first approached, he said he wanted to watch the original show's pilot. As he did, he was struck by how dark the premise was -- a whole civilization lost. The resonances couldn't be avoided after 9/11. He thought that people would bring their own experiences to the material and he saw it as a chance to do something relevant and meaningful. They've tried to continue what he calls subtle adaptation that he hopes strikes mostly on an unconscious level -- whether it's themes like security vs. liberty or things like the memorial wall.

-- Mary added that she went to ground zero after 9/11, long before she was involved in the BSG mini. She said it was a poingant experience, one that was dark but balanced with hope. The show is continually offering both those feelings of darkness and light.

-- The moderator asked Ron and David about casting, getting actors to look beyond the original. Did they have anyone in mind when they were writing? David: "Other than Edward James Olmos and Mary McDonnell? No." Heh.

-- Ron said he had Mary in mind because he had seen Donnie Darko for the first time around when he was writing. David said they had been influenced by Blade Runner and had EJO in mind because of that. David says it happens all the time, that you get dream actors in mind when developing a project, but you never, ever get them, and he still can't believe they did. (Awww!)

-- EJO said that for him it was the script and the story. He thought upon receiving it that it was completely "off the wall" -- he had no intention of ever being in a sci-fi anything -- it was the substance when he read it, and the script got him from the beginning. Ron had written a mission statement that was at the front of the script and EJ could tell from the way it described the world that it was something new. He thought the script was "breathtaking."

-- Ron piped in to say that it was an accident that any of the actors ever saw the mission statement. It was something meant for the network only that he'd written at the behest of (I can't read my notes -- either David or the studio, I think) that he'd written in one afternoon. But someone decided to send it out to the actors and it turned out to be instrumental in getting a lot of them interested. David added that the title "Battlestar Galactica" was both a blessing and a curse and that he was concerned about getting people just to start reading the script.

-- EJO continued by noting that he didn't know the story -- he knew nothing of the original, but the title, just like Miami Vice, made him want to run the other way, "and this one was worse." He liked the idea of putting a Latino in outer space, noting (somewhat incorrectly) that the only two others were Robert Beltran and Ricardo Montalban. He liked that "Guillermo Adama" as he thought of him was a leader. He mentioned his early discussions with Ron and David and how he wanted social relevance -- not a "statement" but how people would really feel in the situation -- put into every story.

-- Mary said she had a similar response. She giggled upon first receiving it -- why would anyone think of "Battlestar Galactica" and "Mary McDonnell" together? But reading it she felt it had nothing to do with her preconceptions. She didn't want to commit to a TV show unless she felt it was something that would connect her to people, and there is a sense of reality in the show that does that. She also loved the idea of a middle-aged woman who was discovering power.

-- Katee: she "needed a job and wanted to shoot a gun." She wanted the part immediately upon reading it. She knew nothing about the original, including the Starbuck gender change, and told a funny story about her dad informing her of it. She was drawn to the strong nature of the character, so driven and sure of who she is, outwardly strong yet flawed at the same time.

-- Jamie described how he was living quite a nice life as a stage and TV actor in the UK, but he was doing a TV show he wasn't happy on, and upon discovering his then-girlfriend now-wife was pregnant, he decided to go to LA for pilot season. When his manager first gave him the script he panicked with a moment of "butt-clenching" (his words!) anxiety -- he called it "remakeitis" -- as he was familiar with the original. He was blown away by the eloquence of the mission statement. The premise was riveting and the story engaging. He loves that everyone on the show is "really screwed up" -- you expect Apollo to be a hero but he's "chippy" and "not sorted."

-- James said the casting process was more rigorous than a US presidential election. He knew the original and didn't want to be "the creepy guy in a cape." After reading the script he liked the huge curve for his character. The audition scene for the mini was the scene when Six finds him in bed with another woman -- he thought it was hilarious, but director Michael Rymer first thought the humor he brought to it was dangerous for the project. But apparently the other decision-makers disagreed and thought he was funny. (I can't adequately describe how funny and Baltar-like James is.)

-- Grace first auditioned for Dualla, then for Starbuck, then she was offered Sharon, and she was pissed because she seemed like the nice girl :) She was pleasantly surprised by the end of the mini :) When she said "I wanted to play Starbuck!" Katee piped in with "I wanted to play Sharon!" and James replied: "I want to play with both of you."

-- An audience member asked if "frak" had become part of their vocabulary, and most of the panel nodded yes. Mary said she likes frak because as a mom she doesn't have to cop to saying the f-word.

-- An audience member asked Ron and David what they brought to the show from their prior experiences. Ron said that Star Trek was his formative experience -- writing and rewriting and sitting in the writers' room day after day, learning about story and character and exchanging ideas with many smart people over the years. He said he learned a lot from people like Michael Piller, not only about writing but about how to be a show runner. From Ira Behr he learned that flaws are what define human beings more than our virtues. He acknowledged BSG's writers, many of whom were there in the audience, which was very cool.

-- An audience member who identified herself as a combat veteran asked Katee what she draws on for Starbuck's inner conflict, which she thought was portrayed really well. Katee thanked her and said her dad was in the military, as was a friend who had spent time in Afghanistan and would call her and tell her she was holding the gun like a girl. :) She draws from their comments but mostly from moments when she can remember being scared or terrified.

-- An audience member asked Ron and David how they sell story ideas. (Ah, LA, where everyone has a screenplay in their back pocket.) David said to know your buyer. Sci-Fi wanted to do something different. If they hadn't walked in with something different, it wouldn't have gone anywhere. They've always agreed with Sci-Fi on a fundamental level of what the show is about, despite other disagreements that may have cropped up. But that fundamental sharing of the concept between the producers and the network is a big part of why the show has turned out so well.

-- Ron described the initial pitch to Sci-Fi, which was via videoconference. He knew he had Bonnie Hammer from her reaction when he said that in this version, Starbuck was a woman :)

That was it for questions because the evening closed with a trivia contest for some posters to be given away, which was kind of cute. Each panelist asked a question:

-- Grace: what number Cylon was Sharon (8, I think)
-- James: on whom did Baltar first use the Cylon detector, and did it work (he first used it on Sharon, but he lied about the results)
-- Jamie: what does CAG stand for (commander, air group)
-- Katee: who was Starbuck's finace and what happened to him (Zak Adama, whom she passed through basic flight though she shouldn't have, and he died in a viper accident)
-- Mary: what's Laura's preferred method of getting rid of cylons (and she made the entire audience repeat: "throw them out the airlock!")
-- EJO: what did Adama give Apollo before sending him on a dangerous mission, who's was it, and how did he get it back (a lighter, his father's, and Apollo returned it when he came back -- see Hand of God)
-- David ("oh, sure, I get the Hercules reference"): what's the name of Sharon and Helo's baby (Hera)
-- Ron: the name and the nickname of the stealth fighter (Laura and Blackbird)
-- The moderator's bonus question was about the actress who played the medic and what her relationship was to a member of the panel (she's Kerry Norton, Jamie Bamber's wife.)

Anyway, that was pretty much the end. I've been to a few of these now, and I really have to say that with the possible exception of Lost, this was my favorite.

frak = F-bomb lite.
i love it personally.

Whitearrow, thanks for those posts, good stuff. :)

It didn't frak me off...I was just looking for an opportunity to use frak every other frakin' word! :D


I know, I was just joining in on the fun.

I agree, thanks a lot Whitearrow. :)

Great write-up, thanks for taking the time to type all that out.

Certainly benefits to living in southern CA...

My pleasure, guys, and yes, there are, Keller! I'd have gone to a couple more this year (Weeds, House, Grey's Anatomy!) if I lived closer, but getting up there on weeknights is a pretty big hassle.

Well done, Whitearrow.

Thanks,

Ed

For those interested in the Paley Festival at the MT&R:

http://www.mtr.org/festivals/paleyfest2006/lineup.htm

I'd love to see the event with the Weeds cast on the 15th.

I went to the BSG night at the Paley Festival last Friday, so here's my report. I took notes for you people :)

-- An audience member asked Ron and David what they brought to the show from their prior experiences. Ron said that Star Trek was his formative experience -- writing and rewriting and sitting in the writers' room day after day, learning about story and character and exchanging ideas with many smart people over the years. He said he learned a lot from people like Michael Piller, not only about writing but about how to be a show runner. From Ira Behr he learned that flaws are what define human beings more than our virtues. He acknowledged BSG's writers, many of whom were there in the audience, which was very cool.



I also found it interesting how they commented that the writers spend a great deal of time BS'ing and throwing ideas around and off of each other. The panel had the writers stand up and I thought the whole audience, rightfully, clapped as enthusiastically for the writers as for each of the stars. That was nice.

I also got an impression from the cast and writers that they are earnestly enjoying their work. I hope they can keep the elements going that we like so much in this series.
EJO in particular made a comment to the effect of how making a great show was more important than pushing a means of "marketing this show" to capture a wider audience.

Lastly, I was struck by how much of a contrast there was between fans of the show and the people who were there who were trying to advance in the "biz". It was a fun night.

http://bitsofnews.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=3448

Rumor - NBC might move BSG from SciFi to NBC primetime next season.

http://bitsofnews.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=3448

Rumor - NBC might move BSG from SciFi to NBC primetime next season.

Won't happen. Although it would be nice to see first run eps in HD (or any eps for that matter for us UHD deprived TWC customers). NBC would probably insist on too much creative control and just muck it up. On the other hand, getting the budget ramped up to Big Four levels would be awesome.

Won't happen. Although it would be nice to see first run eps in HD (or any eps for that matter for us UHD deprived TWC customers). NBC would probably insist on too much creative control and just muck it up. On the other hand, getting the budget ramped up to Big Four levels would be awesome.

I don't agree. It's awfully good now. Adding more money might actually hurt.

Rumor - NBC might move BSG from SciFi to NBC primetime next season.
Followed by a complete makeover to increase ratings demographics, followed by cancellation shortly thereafter. Great. :mad:

Leave it on SciFi and show it in HD on UHD before each new mini-season starts, thank you very much.

~Dan

I don't agree. It's awfully good now. Adding more money might actually hurt.

Well, I do agree with you that it's awfully good now. As to increasing the budget, I'm pretty sure Ron Moore would not agree with you. More money makes his job a lot easier, not just in terms of increasing the vfx budget. That being said, they do an amazing job with what they have.

I finally picked up the soundtrack (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0009Q0F5U/sr=8-4/qid=1141925764/ref=pd_bbs_4/103-1649539-9127821?%5Fencoding=UTF8) for Season 1.

If anyone is thinking about getting this, it is great! There's a ton of music (nearly 80 minutes), and a ton of great songs. There's a lot of stuff I don't recognize, but some tracks that conjure up images from that episode. With the drumming and different instruments, it makes a great demo/test/critical listening disc. The bass from the drums on some of the tracks is truly great. I'll be taking this with me to a local subwoofer get-together this weekend.

http://bitsofnews.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=3448

Rumor - NBC might move BSG from SciFi to NBC primetime next season.

I'd take it. Since I'm Universal HD deprived, and since Adelphia provides a bad Sci Fi image, I'll take any HD I can get.

I'd love to see SciFi go HD by next season, and have all cable carriers offer it, but I know that's just not going to happen.

Won't happen. Although it would be nice to see first run eps in HD (or any eps for that matter for us UHD deprived TWC customers). NBC would probably insist on too much creative control and just muck it up. On the other hand, getting the budget ramped up to Big Four levels would be awesome.
The only way I could see this happening is due to the fact that NBC's schedule is a disaster area. I would hope that Moore and even Olmos would prevent too much NBC fiddling if it did happen.

Personally, I don't see it happening, SciFi has a good thing going on Fridays nights and it's hard to imagine NBC/Uni messing with that.

QE(FTSG), anyone (Bravo/NBC)?

QE(FTSG), anyone (Bravo/NBC)?


XP (GRP), unlikely (FX/UPN).

The one part of this rumor that seems to be true is the horrible news that season 3 won't premiere until October.

http://www.thefutoncritic.com/cgi/pr.cgi?id=20060308scifi01

That's a press release.

That really, really sucks. October. What the frak.

I wonder if this means they're going to bag the split-season concept and go back to a continuous run?

They've only signed Lucy for a 10 episode arc, it says. So, that Cylon character, Number 3, will essentially disappear after her limited gig is up? I thought she was going be a recurring character.

I'm all for them moving BSG to NBC for two reasons and two cavaets

Reasons:
1.HD = pure sex
2. MUCH larger audience will be exposed to this great show...and I won't have to tape/dvr/download it if I want to go out on Friday

Cavaets:
1. Moore remains in complete and utter control of the show and is not pressured by NBC to do stuff differently.
2. The Show remains great

That really, really sucks. October. What the frak.The only lady on the thread and you guys got her swearin' now.

From Sci-Fi: All 3 of Friday's shows will return with Season premiers on July 7th 2006

SG-1, SG-A, BSG-2006

I wonder if this means they're going to bag the split-season concept and go back to a continuous run?

They've only signed Lucy for a 10 episode arc, it says. So, that Cylon character, Number 3, will essentially disappear after her limited gig is up? I thought she was going be a recurring character.
People seem to think it means that, but who knows at this point. Re Lucy, I think she is still recurring, only she'll be appearing in a bunch of episodes at once. Given the nature of her character, unless something huge happens, they can still bring her back indefinitely.

From Sci-Fi: All 3 of Friday's shows will return with Season premiers on July 7th 2006
Yeah, except this latest press release changes that, unfortunately. It was dated today.

I'm all for them moving BSG to NBC for two reasons and two cavaets

Reasons:
1.HD = pure sex
2. MUCH larger audience will be exposed to this great show...and I won't have to tape/dvr/download it if I want to go out on Friday

Cavaets:
1. Moore remains in complete and utter control of the show and is not pressured by NBC to do stuff differently.
2. The Show remains great
Unfortunately, I think your caveat #1 is inherently incompatible with the idea of moving to NBC.

One of the most telling statements I heard at the Paley fest last week was David Eick saying that no matter what disagreements they had along the way, the producers and Sci-Fi had *always* had an maintained a shared vision for the show and what it should be. There's just no way to guarantee that NBC's interference wouldn't totally gut the show. And there's no way they give any producer carte blanche.

I'd rather the show stay at its current level of quality -- I'll suffer through SD a while longer in exchange for that and for no reruns during the time they air new episodes. What good is HD if it's no longer a show I want to watch?

The only lady on the thread and you guys got her swearin' now.
LOL, well, I swore long before this, and it wasn't because of them but because of those frakers at Sci-Fi, but thanks for watching out for my feminine honor! :) Hee.

hope it stays on sci fi NBC will find a way to screw it up like finding earth or something bad like that. Din't star gate start off on network i never watched then now i think it's great kinda like it better with McGyver

They'll add some stupid kid - just like the dork on Surface - then give him something idiotic like a robotic dog . ;)

They'll add some stupid kid - just like the dork on Surface - then give him something idiotic like a robotic dog . ;)Dam i forgot about the stupid daquet dog :eek:

Yep, that's exactly the kind of thing NBC would do.

We've already seen Boxy trailing after Starbuck. The question is whether Ron Moore will kill him off as a warning shot to NBC's executives... :D

I guess audience dilution would make airing on both networks a no-no...

But, I'm so fed up with the compression blurr of SciFi, that I wouldn't mind too terribly if they were to fill NBC's Saturday night void with an encore of SciFi's Friday night episode.

Even bandwidth starved HD is better than SciFi via DirecTV.

BSG under broadcast TV rules would be a pale shadow of what it is now ... Leave well enough alone.

Exactly. Look what happened to the original. In the interest of trying to draw in more vieweres, they changed most of the show. Only 2 original characters remained, Cmdr Adama and Boomer, in that show called Galatica 80.

Exactly. Look what happened to the original. In the interest of trying to draw in more vieweres, they changed most of the show. Only 2 original characters remained, Cmdr Adama and Boomer, in that show called Galatica 80.

About the only worthwhile episode in that version was The Return of Starbuck.