Can anyone comment on the durability of the glass base of the pedestal on the "Kirk" models? I'm interested in them, but I'm concerned about the glass breaking if I move to a new apartment or something. How thick is that glass?

Is it really glass??

Is it really glass??

Yes, according to CNET and the photos I've seen the base of the pedestal is glass. I'm assuming it's fairly sturdy stuff, but I'd like to hear people's first hand impression of this.

I'm also curious about what the packaging is like when you have this shipped to you. Since the pedestal isn't removable, I'm assuming the things just comes in a gigantic box. But that box must be huge.

It's pretty darn sturdy thick glass.

Do we have any release dates yet? I'm stuck between the HLR7178W and the Qualia 006, and I'm itching to see the Sammy so I can go ahead and make my decision.

Just want to add my "two cents"...comparing the Qualia 006 versus the new Samsungs.


Obviously we have yet to see the Samsungs, but I did go look at the Sony Qualia 006 (not sure of the spelling...sorry!)

I was not impressed by the image on the Sony. The picture seemed very "pixilated" to my eyes. Also, the brightness was not very impressive. This was at a fairly high end store in the Cincinnati, OH area. Lighting was not as bright as Best Buy or Circut City, but was brighter than most rooms I would view in.

The only thing I really have to compare to of the Samsung is the 50" or 56" pedestal models...which I have been impressed with since the first time I saw them...even in the bright lights of Best Buy and Circut City...matter of fact, even in the store that had the Sony Qualia 006, the Mitsubishi DLP picture seemed better than the Sony. (I am a big Sony fan and have had their XBR CRT televisions since they first came out with them, probably 20 years ago! I will never forget having to wait almost six months to recieve the first one I ordered, but never regretted it. Bought the current one about 5 years ago. Never seen a better picture on a conventional TV as the XBR!)

My experience with the Qualia was just the opposite. I saw HDNet playing on it and the Lord of the Rings DVD. This was the first HD set where it looked like I was looking through a window. The images pooped out at you and was like it was in 3d. The picture was amazing. Especially for the size and how close we were watching it on both the HD and dvd. If the Samsung looks half of what the Qualia looks, it will be an excellent picture. My coworker and I were totally amazed at the picture quality. But the price is extremely high. That is why I am going to get the 61"/67" samsung 1080P set.

the base is about 3/8" thick. Just measured it. Sturdy looking stuff.. at least on the R5087, though im assuming all use the same base. Running tests on video lag for games, confirmed so far that it has lag on 480i, now trying to find games with meters for 480p, ect

Samsung is a low-end Manufacturer of DLP's, not known for their quality or reliability.

bwahahahahahahaha!!!

It's pretty darn sturdy thick glass.


Might as well buy a load of windex and paper towels to keep it looking sharp though....

My experience with the Qualia was just the opposite. I saw HDNet playing on it and the Lord of the Rings DVD. This was the first HD set where it looked like I was looking through a window. The images pooped out at you and was like it was in 3d. The picture was amazing. Especially for the size and how close we were watching it on both the HD and dvd. If the Samsung looks half of what the Qualia looks, it will be an excellent picture. My coworker and I were totally amazed at the picture quality. But the price is extremely high. That is why I am going to get the 61"/67" samsung 1080P set.
I had a similar experience - the Qualia is the best TV I've seen and I can afford one. I want the best TV on the market, though, and I'd love to know if the Samsung is better. I guess only time will tell. :( Sigh...I want my HD now!!!

My experience with the Qualia was just the opposite ... The images pooped out at you and was like it was in 3d. ...

So it was actually like a 4 or 5D experience, with images pooping on you :D

I had a similar experience - the Qualia is the best TV I've seen and I can afford one. I want the best TV on the market, though, and I'd love to know if the Samsung is better. I guess only time will tell. :( Sigh...I want my HD now!!!

I saw the Qualia for the first time this weekend. Our local Tweeter had one. Selling it for 11,999.00 I had a chance to mess around with it for about 20 minutes. I didnt think the picture was as fantastic as everyone has been claiming. Now this could be my local tweeters source. They send out a Sencor? HD stream and used a Sony DVD player on the set. I mostly messed with contrast and couldnt get a really good Black.

Just my two cents.

So it was actually like a 4 or 5D experience, with images pooping on you

Lucas et. al. may want to hear about this. They thought they were doing good with 3D DLP! So, is this the secret of the new Sony theater projectors? :D :D

I had a similar experience - the Qualia is the best TV I've seen and I can afford one. I want the best TV on the market, though, and I'd love to know if the Samsung is better. I guess only time will tell. :( Sigh...I want my HD now!!!


LOL---Well...if you REALLY like it...buy it!

If you are like me...you can't wait. Purchased my first HDTV a few years ago. Wasn't going to keep waiting!

BUT...now I want bigger and better.

Go for it! You will probably be VERY happy with the Qualia. Since you CAN afford it, why wait. Buy it now! In a few years, you will want to upgrade to a "nicer" (better picture) HDTV with other new bells and whistles.

Does anyone know where the spec sheet for the 68 series is? I have the 88 and the 78 spec sheets from the first page of this review, but can't find the 68 series anywhere. Thanks

Does anyone know where the spec sheet for the 68 series is? I have the 88 and the 78 spec sheets from the first page of this review, but can't find the 68 series anywhere. Thanks

We haven't found one yet ... but, 78 series specs should be identical to the 68 series specs.

I have added Samsung's detailed TECHNICAL DRAWINGS for the 67, 68, 78, and 87 series models to POST #1. These are really great for installation planning! They show the TV's from several angles and give all major and minor dimensions.

Here is a HLR6168W sample: Technical Drawing (http://home.comcast.net/~ucsb/HL-R6168W.pdf)

Kirk@TVAuthority sent me the files ... thanks Kirk!!!

I have added Samsung's detailed TECHNICAL DRAWINGS for the 67, 68, 78, and 87 series models to POST #1. These are really great for installation planning! They show the TV's from several angles and give all major and minor dimensions.

Here is a HLR6168W sample: Technical Drawing (http://home.comcast.net/~ucsb/HL-R6168W.pdf)

Kirk@TVAuthority sent me the files ... thanks Kirk!!!

THANKS MUCH UCSB! Please give us a buzz when the 7178 technical drawing becomes available.

THANKS MUCH UCSB! Please give us a buzz when the 7178 technical drawing becomes available.

OK ... I knew you would be disappointed about that missing file.

From the new 6168 drawing, it looks like its stabalization foot is a bit more narrow in width compared to the foot dimensioned on the HL-P6163 technical drawing. Am I right?

Also, what are the opinions of using the stabaliztion foot on the 6168? Is it really more stable at about 30" in width? I understand its a bit deeper than the TV just sitting by itself - but 30" is a lot more narrow than the 57" width of the bottom of the TV.

My guess is that it will be perfectly stable without the 'foot'. I know that my hlp6163 is.

I am hoping to be able to remove the stabilizing foot. I don't have kids or pets or earthquakes or anything else that could tip this tv over.

No kids or pets or earthqaukes?! What fun is that?! ;)

I am hoping to be able to remove the stabilizing foot. I don't have kids or pets or earthquakes or anything else that could tip this tv over.
Unless you're using the Samsung stand, it's got to be *more* stable without the foot.

Someone has already posted instructions (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5699443&&#post5699443) for removing the foot on the 6167.

Yeah I'm not using the samsung stand. Those are the instructions I hope apply to the 6168 also.

The instructions to remove the stand are FAQ #19 in POST #1, if anyone is looking for them in the future.

Hi guys- i'm another one of those guys that have read all billion pages of the forum...blah blah blah... And now to the point :) -

I was at Best Buy today and I asked if they had the dates that they would be getting the 68 series in, and the employee went and asked the manager. The guy said that the manager said that the store was to be renevated in August and the entire TV section would be redone. (doesn't answer my question at all, but i was too lazy to push more questions at him). In other words, it sounds like they still aren't sure when they'll be getting them in.

I am confused about something, though. How is it that the 68 series is "supposed" to be available in two weeks, but they aren't on anybody's websites. Shouldn't Samsung have something posted by now? I'm worried.. i want my tv!!! i've been putting it off for a whole year now.

If anybody has any new info on the release dates please post it ASAP!!!!

-THANX

Has there been any indication from Samsung or otherwise that the new (1080p) models will be less sensitive to vertical viewing angle than other Samsung DLPs? (For instance I saw a 5674 in a store and was disappointed by the vertical angle aspect.)

arghiwannabigtv-

I would take whatever info you glean from a BB or CC employee with a grain of salt...

In NJ I went to an Eletronics Expo and asked abou the HLR5078W the salesman checked the computer and showed they would be carrying the HLR5678W and the HLR5678W. The selling price for the 56 was $3668 and the offered to oder one for me and said I would have it in three weeks. I saw there were a few orders taken as indicated by minus numbers on the inventory counts. Has anyone ordered one or have seen a xxxxx78 on a show room floor....?

Paul

Hi guys- i'm another one of those guys that have read all billion pages of the forum...blah blah blah... And now to the point :) -

I was at Best Buy today and I asked if they had the dates that they would be getting the 68 series in, and the employee went and asked the manager. The guy said that the manager said that the store was to be renevated in August and the entire TV section would be redone. (doesn't answer my question at all, but i was too lazy to push more questions at him). In other words, it sounds like they still aren't sure when they'll be getting them in.

I am confused about something, though. How is it that the 68 series is "supposed" to be available in two weeks, but they aren't on anybody's websites. Shouldn't Samsung have something posted by now? I'm worried.. i want my tv!!! i've been putting it off for a whole year now.

If anybody has any new info on the release dates please post it ASAP!!!!

-THANX

Over in the Samsung 1080p TV Authority Power Buy thread, it was indicated that the initial units will hit their Sacramento warehouse on the 14th. That's about a week from now.

Has there been any indication from Samsung or otherwise that the new (1080p) models will be less sensitive to vertical viewing angle than other Samsung DLPs?
That's not a Samsung characteristic. All DLP, LCD and CRT RPTV sets have narrow vertical viewing angles. Probably LCoS too. The current generation of screens cause the vertical viewing angle to be narrow in order to get a wider horizontal viewing angle. At least that's what I think I have read.

Plasma and LCD flat panels have wide viewing angles in both directions.

Re the Qualia vs. Samsung 1080p units:

While I personally have doubts that the Samsung units will be quite as good in terms of PQ and especially build quality of the Qualia, the real question is just how much difference in those areas will there be? Enough to justify the price difference? That is the question! :)

Glad to hear it's coming with the Pedestal Stand, I really want that with it.

Hi guys- i'm another one of those guys that have read all billion pages of the forum...blah blah blah... And now to the point :) -

I was at Best Buy today and I asked if they had the dates that they would be getting the 68 series in, and the employee went and asked the manager. The guy said that the manager said that the store was to be renevated in August and the entire TV section would be redone. (doesn't answer my question at all, but i was too lazy to push more questions at him). In other words, it sounds like they still aren't sure when they'll be getting them in.

I am confused about something, though. How is it that the 68 series is "supposed" to be available in two weeks, but they aren't on anybody's websites. Shouldn't Samsung have something posted by now? I'm worried.. i want my tv!!! i've been putting it off for a whole year now.

If anybody has any new info on the release dates please post it ASAP!!!!

-THANX

Re viewing angles, UCSB did some research into this on his post here:
Link (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5102953&#post5102953)

As for stores receiving the sets, I highly suggest you consider the PowerBuy. Aside from the fact that TVA is getting these sets very soon, they offer great service, have a very good return policy, and their prices will undoubtedly be lower than BB (particularly when you consider that delivery is included and no tax outisde CA and WA (I think). BB should stand for Buyer Beware if you ask me.

Re viewing angles, UCSB did some research into this on his post here:
Link (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5102953&#post5102953)



I just remembered that I have a discussion of viewing angle in FAQ #12 in POST #1 also. There is a photo in the link above and FAQ #12 that shows how viewing angle affects PQ. When looking at the photo, find the SAMSUNG logo under the screen. This will give you an idea of how brightness is diminshing with viewing angle.

Hi guys- i'm another one of those guys that have read all billion pages of the forum...blah blah blah... And now to the point :) -

I was at Best Buy today and I asked if they had the dates that they would be getting the 68 series in, and the employee went and asked the manager. The guy said that the manager said that the store was to be renevated in August and the entire TV section would be redone. (doesn't answer my question at all, but i was too lazy to push more questions at him). In other words, it sounds like they still aren't sure when they'll be getting them in.

I am confused about something, though. How is it that the 68 series is "supposed" to be available in two weeks, but they aren't on anybody's websites. Shouldn't Samsung have something posted by now? I'm worried.. i want my tv!!! i've been putting it off for a whole year now.

If anybody has any new info on the release dates please post it ASAP!!!!

-THANXThree days ago, on Fri Jun 3rd, I visited my San Ramon, CA Magnolia AV. They said they would be getting in BOTH the 6168 and 6178 on the 10th of this month - just 7 days away at that time, 4 days away now.

Thanks Ronnie ... I'll definitely be one of the first to go down and take a look! Let's hope that they get them on the floor soon.

While I personally have doubts that the Samsung units will be quite as good in terms of PQ and especially build quality of the Qualia,At 1/3 the price they will probably be better.

Placed my PB order yesterday. Hopefully using the Samsung HD DVD player will lessen the lip synch issue with HDMI. Anyway this will have to hold me until the best non projection technology with no speakers shows up (monitor only). It will probably take the industry 5 years to figure out that HT users have more speakers surrounding the TV then we need (at least for TV viewing). I would still like the tuners, but have the speakers be an add on (side would be OK as I would never put them on).

Has everyone gotten in on the pb???
Im so p1ssed im late by like 6 days. Amazing what u miss when yer gone from the site for a while.
At those prices you can get it, hate it and prob resell it locally for a profit or break even at least.
Alll the BM stores will sell close to msrp +tax. With such a huge discount and no tax for most ppl, this thing is a STEAL!! Im figuring about a $1400+ delta if i get it locally with a discount vs the pb. Thats sick!

Even if yer on the fence, should get in on this. TVA is awesome. I was in on the original HLM powerbuy. That thing was delayed like crazy, but they treated everybody very well.

Im in for my 5668.

Being that the Samsung 1080P's are being released this month...wouldn't you think Samsung would have them on their web site? I would also love to see the manual for the HLR6768...I sure hope I can get the 6768 before July 4th!

Thanks for that info, UCSB. IMHO Samsung and the others should give back a bit of vertical viewing angle, even if it means less horizontal viewing angle. Looking at the pics (and consistent with my experience looking at a 5674 in a store), there is a noticable difference even between 0 degrees and 5 degrees. I think this means (someone else do the math please) that sitting close (3x screen height) and dead center, there would be a noticable difference in brightness between something at the bottom of the screen and something in the middle.

I see this as a big drawback. Unfortunately plasma gets expensive at 60 inches, and has its own problem - screen reflections. I'm at a loss as to what to do.

Someone recently asked (on the PB thread, I think, but no need to keep cluttering it up) whether the 68/78 series sets will enable DNIe off. I think it is safe to assume that, at least until very recently, Samsung was planning on *not* having DNIe off as an option. This is gleaned from the 88 series manual which is essentially the same as the 67 series. That is, DNIe demo, and demo off are the only DNIe options.

That said, I would imagine that a simple firmware upgrade (which they may do *before* shipping the sets, but could certainly do after as well) could fix this "issue".

Anyone care to send email to Steve P. and ask/suggest this? (wasn't administrator the fellow with the good Steve P. contact?!)

... there would be a noticable difference in brightness between something at the bottom of the screen and something in the middle.

Even though the image is changing as your vertical viewing angle increases, you don't have to worry about brightness differences between the middle and top/bottom of the screen. There is no percieved difference until you get to pretty big angles.

so here's a silly little question:

just placed my pre-order for 61" on PB...now i'm concerned that it may be too much screen for the room...can i get some feedback on the following dimensions:
- room is roughly 12x15 (TV is on 15 ft wall)
- viewing distance is 10 feet

Viewing angle should be ok considering it ain't that wide a room...but at 10 feet away, will I see pixels (even if it is 1080)?...should i downgrade to the 56" screen or just suck it up? I've been on that site (forgot the name - the one that helps you calculate screen size for a given viewing distance)...it calculated that maximum viewing distance for HD TV should be around 8ft...i find that hard to believe...anyone have any thoughts around this? thanks in advance,
r

My viewing position is also 10 feet out. I went with 56 instead of 61 because I decided that was a more comfortable size for my eyes. But that's merely a personal thing. I tested a 61 inch 720p DLP set from 10 feet and could not see pixels. Of course I also don't see pixels with the 56 incher I ended up with.

so here's a silly little question:

just placed my pre-order for 61" on PB...now i'm concerned that it may be too much screen for the room...can i get some feedback on the following dimensions:
- room is roughly 12x15 (TV is on 15 ft wall)
- viewing distance is 10 feet

Viewing angle should be ok considering it ain't that wide a room...but at 10 feet away, will I see pixels (even if it is 1080)?...should i downgrade to the 56" screen or just suck it up? I've been on that site (forgot the name - the one that helps you calculate screen size for a given viewing distance)...it calculated that maximum viewing distance for HD TV should be around 8ft...i find that hard to believe...anyone have any thoughts around this? thanks in advance,
r

Definitely suck it up and get the 61". If there's one thing I've learned in deciding for myself on which size to get, it's to go bigger and that you won't regret it. After a few months, whichever set you get will start to look smaller and smaller.

so here's a silly little question:

just placed my pre-order for 61" on PB...now i'm concerned that it may be too much screen for the room...can i get some feedback on the following dimensions:
- room is roughly 12x15 (TV is on 15 ft wall)
- viewing distance is 10 feet

Viewing angle should be ok considering it ain't that wide a room...but at 10 feet away, will I see pixels (even if it is 1080)?...should i downgrade to the 56" screen or just suck it up? I've been on that site (forgot the name - the one that helps you calculate screen size for a given viewing distance)...it calculated that maximum viewing distance for HD TV should be around 8ft...i find that hard to believe...anyone have any thoughts around this? thanks in advance,
r

I have a hlp6163 and view it at ~ 10 ft; no problem with any of your worries. In fact, I'm a glutton and am going for a 7178 at this distance (can back up to 12 ft if even I am overwhelmed by the size, but I doubt it!) Go to some of the B&M's (maybe even take a folding chair to sit down in!), and try different sizes out at different distances. I would definitely not go any smaller than 61" at 10 ft (but that's me, and others prefer other situations).

I'm gonna be 9' and change at my usual seating position, but some seats are closer. The max distance I could sit would be around 12'. I'm going with the 61". The way I figure it, I'm not going to be in my house for 10 more years. Chances are I'll move in 2-3 years. The tv has got to last for 10 or more years. So I'm buying for now as well as the future.

Thanks for that info, UCSB. IMHO Samsung and the others should give back a bit of vertical viewing angle, even if it means less horizontal viewing angle. Looking at the pics (and consistent with my experience looking at a 5674 in a store), there is a noticable difference even between 0 degrees and 5 degrees. I think this means (someone else do the math please) that sitting close (3x screen height) and dead center, there would be a noticable difference in brightness between something at the bottom of the screen and something in the middle.

I see this as a big drawback. Unfortunately plasma gets expensive at 60 inches, and has its own problem - screen reflections. I'm at a loss as to what to do.

Just about all the stands are between 19 and 20 inches tall. Presumably that puts your eyeballs at mid-screen height when seated in a typical chair. In my own tests at stores, when watching a 46-inch and a 50 inch Sammy at a viewing distance of less than 10 feet, raising or lowering that lineup by just a few inches (say 5 or 6) made a very big difference in PQ. Totally unacceptable in my opinion. Beyond 10 feet and the degradation isn't so bad. My own conclusion is if you aren't more than 10 feet away from the screen, don't plan on lying on the floor to watch, and don't plan on standing up and watching (like we do when we get excited during a pass interception). Although I will be about 14 feet from the screen (when I finally get something) if it weren't for the reflectivity issue it would be plasma for me. Sometimes I wonder whether darkening the room would in the long run be a better choice than dealing with the vertical viewing angle problem. Why is nothing PERFECT?!?!?!

I wish someone could draw a very simple diagram illustrating vertical viewing angle and its path over distance from the screen (it would like the letter K where the vertical portion of the K is the screen). Even I could do that but I can't find the vertical viewing angle spec anywhere. If someone knows the spec, please pass it along.

Remember, one should be able to view these 1080p's as close as 1.5 x (screen diagonal) without any visual artifacts (screen door, picture noise, etc.), and this is the distance recommended for the 'full big screen HD experience'. Now not everybody wants to sit that close, but it can be done (and some people even like it that way). For a 10 ft viewing distance (120 ") this translates into a screen diagonal of 120 x (2/3) = 80"! (Talk about a WOW factor.) To get this '1.5' ratio with Samsung's 7178 set (71" ~ 6 ft) one would need to sit at ~ 9 ft away.

I wish someone could draw a very simple diagram illustrating vertical viewing angle and its path over distance from the screen (it would like the letter K where the vertical portion of the K is the screen). Even I could do that but I can't find the vertical viewing angle spec anywhere. If someone knows the spec, please pass it along.

Here is one of my prior posts with a link to a calculator that can be used to compute viewing angles for various distances.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5102953&&#post5102953

I wish someone could draw a very simple diagram illustrating vertical viewing angle and its path over distance from the screen (it would like the letter K where the vertical portion of the K is the screen). Even I could do that but I can't find the vertical viewing angle spec anywhere. If someone knows the spec, please pass it along.

If your viewing distance is D, and the eye level a distance d above or below the screen center, then the verticle angle (in degrees) is ~ (d/D)x57.3. E.g., if your viewing distance is 10 ft (=120") and the screen center is 6" above eye level, then the viewing angle is ~ (6/120)x57.3 = 2.9 deg, not at all a problem. You can go from here. UCSB's results suggest (I believe, can't remember precisely) that there is no problem so long as the verticle angle is ~ < 10 deg.

Thanks, UCSB. Looks like if one sits at 3 screen heights distance, dead center, then the top of the screen will be 9.5% above. Based on your pics in FAQ #12 in POST #1, the brightness difference between center and top/bottom is probably unacceptable to me.

Thanks, UCSB. Looks like if one sits at 3 screen heights distance, dead center, then the top of the screen will be 9.5% above. Based on your pics in FAQ #12 in POST #1, the brightness difference between center and top/bottom is probably unacceptable to me.

I'd go down and take a look and run some tests on the actual units. Brightness always seems consistent across the screen at normal viewing distances to me. Even in the photo in FAQ #12 there are some pretty extreme viewing angle differences between top to bottom in those shots (becuase I was shooting pretty close to the TV), and yet there is good brightness uniformity.

As screen size increases and viewing distances decrease to 1.5x screen diagonal, we are entering some new territory and we will have to wait and see what happens.

Agreed, we'll wait to see the new 1080p units. I'm going to cross my fingers that some change has been made to improve vertical view angle. I'm especially sensitive to this because, when I watch for an extended period (like a movie), I like to watch from a lower angle (feet propped on the coffee table and body slouched down, more prone), so I'll be more like -2 degrees at bottom, 8deg to center, 16deg to top.

[QUOTE=UCSB]Here is one of my prior posts with a link to a calculator that can be used to compute viewing angles for various distances.



Thanks USCB. But I don't get it. Why do we need a calculator? Isn't the vertical viewing angle a fixed number determined by the manufacturing process? For example, I believe that many mfg's tout their 160 degree horizontal viewing angle (no calculator needed). Isn't the same true for the vertical, only we don't know what that number is for Samsung models? I have read all kinds of estimates, but I have never seen the actual spec. I emailed the question to Samsung months ago (they must still be researching the answer).

By way of example, if we knew it was 20 degrees (10 degrees aiming up and 10 aiming down from center, then a protractor and some graph paper would answer all the questions I think. Obviously I am not technician/engineer, but I remember just enough of my high school geometry (from the early 60's) to confuse myself (and sometimes others).

Bueller55,

I would go with the 56". The 1080 will be shaper than the 720 at any size, but 61" at 10 feet you may have to move your head back and forth to see each side of the screen. It depends how immersive you like your HT experience to be.

I used to ask people where they would sit in a movie theater if they had their choice of any seat. If you would say anything other than the first 10 rows, go with the 56. If you say front row, go with the 61.

Keep in mind that your SD will look worse the bigger the screen size gets.

Thanks USCB. But I don't get it. Why do we need a calculator? Isn't the vertical viewing angle a fixed number determined by the manufacturing process? For example, I believe that many mfg's tout their 160 degree horizontal viewing angle (no calculator needed). Isn't the same true for the vertical, only we don't know what that number is for Samsung models? I have read all kinds of estimates, but I have never seen the actual spec. I emailed the question to Samsung months ago (they must still be researching the answer).

The number that I have often seen quoted (though I can't give you a reference off hand) is a verticle viewing angle of +/- 15 deg.

Has everyone gotten in on the pb???
Im so p1ssed im late by like 6 days. Amazing what u miss when yer gone from the site for a while.
At those prices you can get it, hate it and prob resell it locally for a profit or break even at least.
Alll the BM stores will sell close to msrp +tax. With such a huge discount and no tax for most ppl, this thing is a STEAL!! Im figuring about a $1400+ delta if i get it locally with a discount vs the pb. Thats sick!

Even if yer on the fence, should get in on this. TVA is awesome. I was in on the original HLM powerbuy. That thing was delayed like crazy, but they treated everybody very well.

Im in for my 5668.

Sup Kyung, :)

I just signed up for the TVA PB last night online. I went with the 5688 model, also picked up the 3 warranties & pedestal stand. Great deal, they give you free s/h & no tax, really helps a lot. I was going to pick up their surge protector, but I found the same model for less @ a couple other sites, so I'll get it later.

I called them up a few mins ago to speak with a customer rep, was told they expect my set sometime in mid June & that not many people have signed up for the 88 series so I am in very good position to receive mine quickly after it's released.

I'm siked, can't wait to finally enjoy some HDTV viewing & gaming & with the XBOX360 coming out by Nov, I'll be lounging like a PIMP!

What else do you guys suggest I pick up for my HT setup? I need suggestions on cables/connectors & surround sound speakers. I'm going to wait for the price on the Onkyo TXNR1000 to come down a bit before getting it. It's my choice for receiver since it has that modular (removable card slots on the back) circuitry for future proof tech down the road.

The number that I have often seen quoted (though I can't give you a reference off hand) is a verticle viewing angle of +/- 15 deg.


That would be consistent with my personal observation at tv stores:
Assuming that tv sits on a stand that itself is 20 inches high, once your viewing distance is 10 feet or more, you can lie on the floor or stand up (or otherwise get your eyeball height to six feet) and the picture is okay. Eyeball height at mid-screen-height is always best picture.

[QUOTE=UCSB]Here is one of my prior posts with a link to a calculator that can be used to compute viewing angles for various distances.



Thanks USCB. But I don't get it. Why do we need a calculator? Isn't the vertical viewing angle a fixed number determined by the manufacturing process? For example, I believe that many mfg's tout their 160 degree horizontal viewing angle (no calculator needed). Isn't the same true for the vertical, only we don't know what that number is for Samsung models? I have read all kinds of estimates, but I have never seen the actual spec. I emailed the question to Samsung months ago (they must still be researching the answer).

By way of example, if we knew it was 20 degrees (10 degrees aiming up and 10 aiming down from center, then a protractor and some graph paper would answer all the questions I think. Obviously I am not technician/engineer, but I remember just enough of my high school geometry (from the early 60's) to confuse myself (and sometimes others).

DLP HDTV's have a very wide horizontal viewing angle. Horizontal viewing angle isn't really an issue. But, brightness and PQ are optimized vertically when your eye is centered on the screen. The vertical viewing angle is much more sensitive than the horizontal. Even a small change in viewing angle, say 5% or 10% can be seen. The picture is still going to be OK with those small changes, but it is changing. If you are buying a new TV and stand and can optimize screen height, vertical viewing angle is not an issue. But, for some installations, people already own a stand, cabinet, or media niche. They would like understand what the TV will look like in their existing installation. For example, I have a built-in cabinet. I really like it and it cost $7,000. Unfortunately, it has a height of 31". How well will this work with say a new HLR5668W? Horizontally perfect. But, vertically I may be giving up some picture performance. If I compute my viewing angle from various locations in the room, I can get a feel for how well the TV will work in my setup. In my case, if I want to watch TV lying on my sofa I'm going to give up a little PQ. If I watch from a chair in the room, I am giving up relatively little. If I pull that chair forward four or five feet, I'm giving up nothing. Sometimes if I am doing a project, I like to watch from the floor ... this causes a big angle and a big trade-off, but I still do it. If you follow the link to the photo in FAQ #12, you can see the effect for various angles from 0 degrees to 23 degrees below level.

ADDITION: You need the calculator because the angle changes with distance from the TV. For example, if you are 18" below center line, this with give you a different angle at 8' than 12'.

The number that I have often seen quoted (though I can't give you a reference off hand) is a verticle viewing angle of +/- 15 deg.

I would agree with the 15 degree threshold. If you want a perfect picture stay level, but under 15 degrees you are OK. My impression is that there is a perfect spot at level. There is a quick change if you move off that, say 3 degrees. Then from there on out is a very gradual and consistent drop off. I adjusted my DLP to optimize performance at 5 to 10 degrees off level because that reflects my normal viewing angle.

any suggestions guys? Also need a good HDMI DVD player. @ the TVA PB site they had a samsung HDMI DVD player, but not sure how good this is or if a better model is coming out soon.

For example, I have a built-in cabinet. I really like it and it cost $7,000. Unfortunately, it has a height of 31". How well will this work with say a new HLR5668W?
My built in stand will be at 28" with the speaker just under the 28" level. My current config has the speaker at 40" above the floor.
http://members.sigecom.net/unloaded/cc.jpg

I am thinking about trying the 5668 at 12" above the floor with the speaker left at the top.

I would like to get your feedback at 31" with your 5668 to see if I should move my speaker down and my TV up. I will be at 7.5' to 8' viewing distance. I am also concerned with where the center of the screen will fall at these heights plus the 'strained neck syndrone".

[QUOTE=okbyme]

DLP HDTV's have a very wide horizontal viewing angle. Horizontal viewing angle isn't really an issue. But, brightness and PQ are optimized vertically when your eye is centered on the screen. The vertical viewing angle is much more sensitive than the horizontal. Even a small change in viewing angle, say 5% or 10% can be seen. The picture is still going to be OK with those small changes, but it is changing. If you are buying a new TV and stand and can optimize screen height, vertical viewing angle is not an issue. But, for some installations, people already own a stand, cabinet, or media niche. They would like understand what the TV will look like in their existing installation. For example, I have a built-in cabinet. I really like it and it cost $7,000. Unfortunately, it has a height of 31". How well will this work with say a new HLR5668W? Horizontally perfect. But, vertically I may be giving up some picture performance. If I compute my viewing angle from various locations in the room, I can get a feel for how well the TV will work in my setup. In my case, if I want to watch TV lying on my sofa I'm going to give up a little PQ. If I watch from a chair in the room, I am giving up relatively little. If I pull that chair forward four or five feet, I'm giving up nothing. Sometimes if I am doing a project, I like to watch from the floor ... this causes a big angle and a big trade-off, but I still do it. If you follow the link to the photo in FAQ #12, you can see the effect for various angles from 0 degrees to 23 degrees below level.

I believe I understand now. What you were telling me is how to calculate MY viewing angle based on distance and height at my point of observation. I was wondering what the manufacturer claims about the TV's acceptable vertical viewing angle (just like they claim the 160 horizontal viewing angle).

Wish I could create that optimum viewing scenario - - - I have a fixed niche in a wall and to accommodate the height of a 46" Samsung, I have to construct a shelf that's only 9 inches above the floor (versus the 20" of many stands). That's why I am so concerned.

any suggestions guys? Also need a good HDMI DVD player. @ the TVA PB site they had a samsung HDMI DVD player, but not sure how good this is or if a better model is coming out soon.

I currently own the Sony s7000 which cost $1000 when DVD players first came out. Its a solid product but you get 480i out only.

I just signed up for the Samsung DVD HD 950 which outputs all but 1080P :(

For $175 +SH/Tax its worth the trial. Hopefully it may also help the synch issues as well. This thing got an award at CES and its' black :cool:

okbyme ... In POST #1 you can use the HLR5668W technical drawings to get exact dimensions. This will allow you to compute both options and see which will perform best. But, I would expect speaker underneath the TV would be best.

Thanks all you guys for the answers!


Over in the Samsung 1080p TV Authority Power Buy thread, it was indicated that the initial units will hit their Sacramento warehouse on the 14th. That's about a week from now.

yay! nice and soon! But does anyone know how long it'll be in the warehouse's before it hits the stores? PLus.. i live in Virginia :D ... HOw long does TV AUthority take to ship after i order? (after it comes out) i will certainly look into getting it from them, but i have very bad experiences with stuff getting damaged during shipping so i'm still a little leery.

okbyme ... In POST #1 you can use the HLR5668W technical drawings to get exact dimensions. This will allow you to compute both options and see which will perform best. But, I would expect speaker underneath the TV would be best.

Thats what I think too but I will try it on blocks to determine. Changing my built in unit to set the TV's top to where the speakers top is now will require some new cabinetry below. That would put the center channel speaker at about 18" vertical center.

[QUOTE=okbyme]

Unfortunately, it has a height of 31". How well will this work with say a new HLR5668W? Horizontally perfect. But, vertically I may be giving up some picture performance.

UCSB: You should be able to tilt your set downward a bit (with a spacer below the back of the base) to compensate for the height. (But you obvously know this!) Is there any downside to doing this?

any suggestions guys? Also need a good HDMI DVD player. @ the TVA PB site they had a samsung HDMI DVD player, but not sure how good this is or if a better model is coming out soon.

I have the Denon 2910 and find it superb. It does, though, cost about twice as much as the ~ $200-300 players.

I currently own the Sony s7000 which cost $1000 when DVD players first came out. Its a solid product but you get 480i out only.

I just signed up for the Samsung DVD HD 950 which outputs all but 1080P :(

For $175 +SH/Tax its worth the trial. Hopefully it may also help the synch issues as well. This thing got an award at CES and its' black :cool:


Hey CCouper,

Thanks for responding & your suggestions. I'll look & keep an eye out for the Samsung DVD HD 950. Any other HD_DVD players? I also need help with picking out the cables to use & some excellent but under $1,0o0 standing floor surround sound speakers, in either 5, 6, or 7.1!

Thanks in advance.

IIRC, the samsung HD950 comes with an HDMI cable.

any suggestions guys? Also need a good HDMI DVD player. @ the TVA PB site they had a samsung HDMI DVD player, but not sure how good this is or if a better model is coming out soon.

Checkout the DVD Player (standard Def) forum ...

I have been browsing these extraordinary AVS forums almost every single day for close to two years now. The knowledge, advice and tips given here are simply the best anywhere. I myself learned back in February that Samsung would be replacing my defective 56" DLP with a new HLR5688W when they become available. Thanks to my many hours of reading here on AVS my anticipation has reached it's peak to say the least. I have read many posts indicating that this specific 1080p model along with the soon to follow 1080p models are expected as early as early to mid-June. I wanted to let others know that only this week did I receive an official phone call from Samsung explaining clearly that the HLR5688W would finally be available in their warehouses on Wednesday June 22nd. They said it would be delivered shortly thereafter. I will of course post a my full review and HT photos once this long awaited pedastal beauty arrives. Thanks again and kudos to the many gr8 contributors everyday here at AVS. You really make this forum an incredible place to learn from. :)

June 22 !? I am waiting for them to replace my defective HLP56 pedestal set with the HLR5688 also. I gotta check my messages. Wow. I am moving on July 1st. I hope it comes before then. Pushstar, what was the defect on your current HLP?

Re Vertical Viewing Angle:
I think I may be really screwing myself. I just framed a huge wall unit, with a 20" deep shelf above the fireplace in anticipation for the HLR to replace my 50" plasma (needed a bigger WOW factor). Unfortunately, the shelf is almost 60" high. Even though I can go huge (ie the 6768A), I'm thinking my brightness will be disasterously affected. I forgot thats the main weakness that plasma doesn't have. Any thoughts? The wall unit is really cool, and I know I can "shim" the back for a little better angle, but am I crazy to try to keep this config?
Thanx for any input,
Joel

wingnut,
Defective mirrors on the sets DMD is the reason for the warranty replacement. Several attempts to fix the problem failed. I must say that Samsung's customer service has been nothing less then stellar right from the start. I had originally purchased the set online through Crutchfield and sent the warranty card in on day one in order to receive Samsungs additional 3 months of coverage. We'll have to compare notes once we each receive our new 88s sometime around the end of the month.

Has anyone here seen 'smudges' on the new HLRs? I have a 5067 and see something that could be described as a 'smudge'.

Re Vertical Viewing Angle:
I think I may be really screwing myself. I just framed a huge wall unit, with a 20" deep shelf above the fireplace in anticipation for the HLR to replace my 50" plasma (needed a bigger WOW factor). Unfortunately, the shelf is almost 60" high. Even though I can go huge (ie the 6768A), I'm thinking my brightness will be disasterously affected. I forgot thats the main weakness that plasma doesn't have. Any thoughts? The wall unit is really cool, and I know I can "shim" the back for a little better angle, but am I crazy to try to keep this config?
Thanx for any input,
Joel


Yes, that's about 40" higher than optimum.

.

At 1/3 the price they will probably be better.

Based on what???

Hey CCouper,

Thanks for responding & your suggestions. I'll look & keep an eye out for the Samsung DVD HD 950. Any other HD_DVD players? I also need help with picking out the cables to use & some excellent but under $1,0o0 standing floor surround sound speakers, in either 5, 6, or 7.1!

Thanks in advance.

You might want to take a look at Neodigits' 2081 DVD player. It outputs at 1080p via the component cable (yes, I did say 1080p, but not quite sure why it only works @ 1080p via component). It also has HDMI, and built-in 5.1 and DTS decoders. Price around ~200, import from China. They also have DVD's for sale recorded at 720p (e.g., House of Flying Daggers, Hero, Winged Migration, etc.). [Note: It only works on their players--and yes, I own one. P.S. Also, region free--is this still posted??]. I asked them if they planned to have any pre-recorded DVD's at 1080i/p, since the player supports it, but received an e-mail back that there's not enough room on the media (disc space) to support any more than 720p on DVD. We'll have to wait for HD-DVD or Blu-Ray for that. Nonetheless, with the Samsung's upconverting/de-interlacing (??) to 1080p, I can't wait for my TVA PB to come in (HLR-5688w, which is supposed to be the first 1080p DLP released). I'm looking forward to some awesome looking DVD's. All in all, though, I don't know if the player will really improve PQ since the Samsung purportedly upconverts to 1080p anyway--maybe an AVS techie knows?? I apologize in advance for being a newbie--but I'm trying.....

Has anyone here seen 'smudges' on the new HLRs? I have a 5067 and see something that could be described as a 'smudge'.
i have hlr5067 and no smudges.
however, the center top of the screen has an internal defect about 1/2 inch wide and 5 inches long. I only see it on bright scenes, like the arctic scene in National Treasure or a light sky.
I don't call this a smudge because it does not go away when the set warms up.
I think it is just a ripple when the layers were adhered and i am trying to get it replaced.

[QUOTE=UCSB]

UCSB: You should be able to tilt your set downward a bit (with a spacer below the back of the base) to compensate for the height. (But you obvously know this!) Is there any downside to doing this?

I think I will be OK. I've given it a lot of thought and I'm not having any problems with my current Samsung DLP in the same location. But, I have to admit that I have given some thought to installing a simple electronic lift (remote controllable with my Pronto 3000) on the back of the base so that I can dial-in the perfect viewing angle. I could adjust the angle when I am viewing and then just return the TV to it's normal position.

You might want to take a look at Neodigits' 2081 DVD player. It outputs at 1080p via the component cable (yes, I did say 1080p, but not quite sure why it only works @ 1080p via component). It also has HDMI, and built-in 5.1 and DTS decoders. Price around ~200, import from China. They also have DVD's for sale recorded at 720p (e.g., House of Flying Daggers, Hero, Winged Migration, etc.). [Note: It only works on their players--and yes, I own one. P.S. Also, region free--is this still posted??]. ...

RJGin, thanks a bunch for the response & heads up info on this DVD player. My question to you is does it play regular DVD's as well like ones you would buy @ any retail store? Also can you play CD/DVD-R/RW, +R/RW , MP3, on it?

RJGin, thanks a bunch for the response & heads up info on this DVD player. My question to you is does it play regular DVD's as well like ones you would buy @ any retail store? Also can you play CD/DVD-R/RW, +R/RW , MP3, on it?

Yes on all counts. It also accepts PAL. Based on what I've seen out there, it specs out as good as anything I've seen until Blu-Ray or HD-DVD hits the market. I don't have it hooked up yet. I'm waiting for my Samsung 1080p HLR-5688w to test it out. I'll do a side by side comparison with a 480p DVD player and see if there are any noticeable differences. Listed below are the technical specs:

Support 1080P( 1080 Progressive Scan), 1080i, 720P, 576P and 480P output, VGA output support 640x480, 800x600, 1024x768 and 1280x1024.
Upscale DVD playback to high definition ( 1080P/1080i via component, 1280x1024 via VGA).
HDMI pure digital interface.
Supports 1080i/720P/480P/576P/640x480/800x600/1024x768/1280x1024.
Built-in high end level scaler delivers astonishing high definition image.
System contains one 32bit Risc CPU, one 24bit video processing CPU and one 24 bit RISC audio processing CPU. Total power equal to 1Ghz Pentium CPU.
Fast 16bit 149Mhz Video DAC and 192 kHz 24 Bit Audio DAC ( 32 bit/133Mhz Audio DSP).
HDCP is not required for playing copyright DVD title in high definition mode.
Brushed stainless steel front panel.
Fast forward / back forward (up to 40X) and ZOOM ( up to 8X)
Easy use full color navigation system.
Fully compatible with DVD/SVCD/VCD/CD/HDCD/MP3/WMA/Photo-CD/CD-R/CD-RW/DVD+R/DVD-R/DVD+RW/DVD-RW.
Built-in Dolby and DTS decoder.
Progressive scan, PAL/NTSC TV system compatible, support 4:3 & 16:9 TV mode.
Smart update function ( firmware upgradeable ).
Component, S-Video, VGA, HDMI and Composite video output.
Optical, Coaxial S/PDIF and RCA output. Support Dolby 5.1 and DTS digital output or 2 Channels analog stereo output. Built-in Dolby 5.1 / DTS decoder, 5.1 channel output.
Ultra slim and stylish design. Dimension: 17 x 10.5 x 1.7 inch (430 x 270 x 43 mm).
Package includes 1 DVD Player, 1 Remote Control, 1 pair analog Video /Audio Cable and User manual. Power 100 ~ 240 AC/50 ~ 60Hz.

Thanks Pushstar. I have had excellent experience with Samsung's customer service also. I got my set from Crutchfield too. Hopefully the new sets won't have any problems .

I noticed that Sony is supposed to be out with 50 and 60 inch 1080p SXRD units in the fall (60 inch in Oct at 4999 msrp). I think I am going to wait until I can see both that and the Samsung 6168 in a store to evaluate vertical viewing angle and other PQ before doing anything. For those who haven't noticed the new Sony thread it is http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=545987

There is always these for less (no status symbol);

http://www.dtvcity.com/jvc-projection/jvc-hd70fh96.html

Nonetheless, with the Samsung's upconverting/de-interlacing (??) to 1080p, I can't wait for my TVA PB to come in (HLR-5688w...).... All in all, though, I don't know if the player will really improve PQ since the Samsung [edit: does "Samsung" here refer to the TVs, e.g. HL-Rxx68/78/88W?] purportedly upconverts to 1080p anyway--maybe an AVS techie knows??

A fellow newbie, me, has basically the same question, i.e. is there any point to buying an upconverting/de-interlacing DVD player when, as I understand it, the TV does this anyway with its onboard hardware & firmware?

I researched this question this weekend and determined that unless one believes that the upconversion/de-interlacing perfomed by the DVD player is superior to the same functions performed by the HL-Rxx68/78/88W then there would be no benefit to using the upconverting/de-interlacing DVD player. However, I could be wrong. There must be members here who have a firm grasp on this issue.

I also came to the conclusion, again, possibly incorrect conclusion, that the upconverting/de-interlacing functions performed by a $200 DVD player were not likely superior to those performed by the 68/78/88. On a tangent, I'm not willing, at this point, to spend for a great DVD player when HD-DVD/Blu-Ray are around the corner. I'm planning to just stick with what I've got for now based on the above assumptions and lack of willingness to upgrade with a new format looming.

Wouldn't you have to send an unaltered 480i signal via digital connection from the DVD player to have the TV do 100% of the processing? That eliminates a good number of DVD players. Sending 480p already has the DVD player processing the signal. So I think I'm going to try having an upconverting DVD player send 1080i to my 6168 so all the TV has to do is deinterlace - which I think its supposed to do well since its meant to deinterlace 1080i HDTV.

Hey all,
I've been looking forward to the Samsung 1080p DLPs for awhile now, but I'm starting to wonder if maybe they aren't the best choice (particularly since 1080p inputs aren't supported). What do you all think? Are you looking at other TVs for this reason?

If so, which ones? I've been reading a little in this thread about Sony's SXRD TVs (that are expected to support 1080p inputs):
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=545987&page=1&pp=30
Of course, that's not expected to be out for quite awhile later, but I already have a Mitsu 55" Platinum Plus CRT RPTV to hold me over ;) There's also new JVC TVs that are supposed to accept 1080p inputs...

Any thoughts on this? By the way, I looked at Samsung's new 720p sets in BestBuy yesterday, and wow - they really stood out from th rest! Thanks,
--Kyle

Hey all,
I've been looking forward to the Samsung 1080p DLPs for awhile now, but I'm starting to wonder if maybe they aren't the best choice (particularly since 1080p inputs aren't supported). What do you all think? Are you looking at other TVs for this reason?

I'm leaning toward the hlr7178, but am still debating with myself about holding out to see the Mits 73727 before deciding. I find the dlp picture to be more impressive than the other digital displays I've seen, though I haven't seen the Qualia 06. I have ruled this out, however; even though I could afford it, it just seems obscene to pay this much for a TV.

I don't think any of these new 2005 TV's will accept a 1080P input...But I could be wrong.

I can live with replacing a bulb in these sets (I ordered the 6168 in the PB) but while I was calling service centers in my area (Albany, NY) to see if they will accept the repairmaster warranty, I got information as not to worry so much about the bulb but more about the color wheel making noises after 2 to 3 years of use and needing replacement...although a simple repair, it can add up with bulbs... so an extended warranty becomes very important...

A fellow newbie, me, has basically the same question, i.e. is there any point to buying an upconverting/de-interlacing DVD player when, as I understand it, the TV does this anyway with its onboard hardware & firmware?

I researched this question this weekend and determined that unless one believes that the upconversion/de-interlacing perfomed by the DVD player is superior to the same functions performed by the HL-Rxx68/78/88W then there would be no benefit to using the upconverting/de-interlacing DVD player. However, I could be wrong. There must be members here who have a firm grasp on this issue.


I agree with your logic. I actually felt the same way when I made the DVD player purchase. In all honesty, the feature that really grabbed me was it being region-free, as I'm a DVD nut and like that flexibility. I will also be among the first to get Blu-Ray/HD-DVD when (and if, but that's another thread altogether) it comes out.

...though I haven't seen the Qualia 06. I have ruled this out, however; even though I could afford it, it just seems obscene to pay this much for a TV.

See if you still feel that way after you do see it. If one can handle the action ($ and space), the Q6 image is very difficult to walk away from!

I also came to the conclusion, again, possibly incorrect conclusion, that the upconverting/de-interlacing functions performed by a $200 DVD player were not likely superior to those performed by the 68/78/88. On a tangent, I'm not willing, at this point, to spend for a great DVD player when HD-DVD/Blu-Ray are around the corner. I'm planning to just stick with what I've got for now based on the above assumptions and lack of willingness to upgrade with a new format looming.

One other possible reason to get an upconverting DVD player: There's a theory that some of the lip sync issues people have with the Samsungs are due to the amount of time it takes the TV to upconvert/deinterlace low-resolution signals (the audio gets processed by your receiver faster than the video gets processed by the TV, so there's a lag). If this is true, then an upconverting DVD player would be less likely to have lag.

We still don't seem to have a hard answer to whether this is really a general problem, or just specific to specific input sources.

nj

Wouldn't you have to send an unaltered 480i signal via digital connection from the DVD player to have the TV do 100% of the processing?

Dunno, but it's not my impression that it has to be digital for it to be upconverted/de-interlaced.

Of course, generally speaking most of us assume that keeping the signal all digital will minimize problems in the conversion process by eliminating D-A-D conversions. Without any other evidence, I will go out on a limb and say that I would like to keep mine all digital to the TV. But, some DVD players & some TVs look best through component....

So I think I'm going to try having an upconverting DVD player send 1080i to my 6168 so all the TV has to do is deinterlace - which I think its supposed to do well since its meant to deinterlace 1080i HDTV.

This could be the way to go. Your assumption, "I think its supposed to do well since its meant to deinterlace 1080i HDTV" goes directly to the question raised in my thread.

One other possible reason to get an upconverting DVD player: There's a theory that some of the lip sync issues people have with the Samsungs are due to the amount of time it takes the TV to upconvert/deinterlace low-resolution signals (the audio gets processed by your receiver faster than the video gets processed by the TV, so there's a lag). If this is true, then an upconverting DVD player would be less likely to have lag.

We still don't seem to have a hard answer to whether this is really a general problem, or just specific to specific input sources.

nj

Good point, and I agree that "if true" then and upconverting DVD would have an advantage over other designs w/the Samsungs so long as it didn't do a worse job at upconverting/de-interlacing the image by eliminating/reducing lip sync issues.

[QUOTE=videobruce]There is always these for less (no status symbol);

[QUOTE]


you might notice in the description given for that JVC that 1080p ISN'T a resolution input that is accepted by the tv. They have a pretty detailed description for a tv that isn't out yet and it isn't coming 1080p input enabled either.

I've use the TV Guide EPG in the past and I know it's transmitted via OTA analog and via cable analog. Anybody know if the built in TV Guide decoder in these new Samsung's can decode both analog & digital? So when the industry switches to digital and TVG EPG is transmitted in digital my future 6168 will still receive guide data? or will I need to upgrade?

I can live with replacing a bulb in these sets (I ordered the 6168 in the PB) but while I was calling service centers in my area (Albany, NY) to see if they will accept the repairmaster warranty, I got information as not to worry so much about the bulb but more about the color wheel making noises after 2 to 3 years of use and needing replacement...although a simple repair, it can add up with bulbs... so an extended warranty becomes very important...
I think most of these color wheel problems were with older designs. The new ones have air bearings so I am hopeful that will fix the problem. I went without a service agreement so far and used the AMEX card to get an additional year. Near the end of the first year I will evaluate the situation again to decide if I should get an extended warranty plan.

One other possible reason to get an upconverting DVD player: There's a theory that some of the lip sync issues people have with the Samsungs are due to the amount of time it takes the TV to upconvert/deinterlace low-resolution signals (the audio gets processed by your receiver faster than the video gets processed by the TV, so there's a lag). If this is true, then an upconverting DVD player would be less likely to have lag.

nj

This is what I hope to test with the DVDHD950 and the HLR5668. I will also send it my Sony S7000 via 480i Component to see the difference.

This is what I hope to test with the DVDHD950 and the HLR5668. I will also send it my Sony S7000 via 480i Component to see the difference.

Perfect! I can't wait to hear your results.

1080p is something that will be of greater benefit to those looking at larger screens. The drawback being that the only possible TRUE 1080p signal will be Blue-ray. But then again, none of the inputs on most of these 1080p sets accept a 1080p. Just a case of "biggest and best first" syndrome for a lot of people then?

I'd rather wait 1-2 years, see this technology perfected, possibly with a 3-chip DLP, and then buy 1080p.

Hey all,
I've been looking forward to the Samsung 1080p DLPs for awhile now, but I'm starting to wonder if maybe they aren't the best choice (particularly since 1080p inputs aren't supported). What do you all think? Are you looking at other TVs for this reason?

If so, which ones? I've been reading a little in this thread about Sony's SXRD TVs (that are expected to support 1080p inputs):
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=545987&page=1&pp=30
Of course, that's not expected to be out for quite awhile later, but I already have a Mitsu 55" Platinum Plus CRT RPTV to hold me over ;) There's also new JVC TVs that are supposed to accept 1080p inputs...

Any thoughts on this? By the way, I looked at Samsung's new 720p sets in BestBuy yesterday, and wow - they really stood out from th rest! Thanks,
--Kyle

Unless Sony or JVC is bringing their own input format to the table, no upcoming sets will support 1080p - as HDMI or anything else right now only accepts up to 1080i.

A quick question- Is the price on the 6768s and the 6168s cheaper on P.C. Richards or TVAuthority? HOw much is it at TVauthority?

Check the PowerBuy sticky thread at the top of the forum.

Unless Sony or JVC is bringing their own input format to the table, no upcoming sets will support 1080p - as HDMI or anything else right now only accepts up to 1080i.

Not true. HDMI is perfectly capable of supporting 1080P with today's technology.

Why manufacturers haven't included the circuitry is anyone's guess. Maybe some will later this year. I'm told the difference in cost is minimal.

We'll have to wait and see what other manufacturers sets accept as the 1080P rollout starts later this year.

I would think the new 1080p sets should be upgradeable later to full 1080p input over HDMI capability by simply swapping out the digital inputs board, yes?


Sure. It should be a relatively simple, inexpensive change assuming the designers
have prepared for this eventuality.

I would think the new 1080p sets should be upgradeable later to full 1080p input over HDMI capability by simply swapping out the digital inputs board, yes?

Possibly, but not sure how simple the swap out you've suggested is or how available those parts would be. If you're really familiar with this stuff then you may be able to find the part you need from an electronics retailer, i.e. Digikey. However, even if the right parts are in place, one still has to wonder about how those parts will interact with the "brains." IOW, it may not be as simple as replacing the physical jack.

Well, if the previous models are anything to go by the digital board and its firmware is progressively updated. But would a 1080p HDMI upgrade require changing chips or is it done in the firmware?


I believe it would require changing chips. Anyone feel differently?

Not true. HDMI is perfectly capable of supporting 1080P with today's technology.

Why manufacturers haven't included the circuitry is anyone's guess. Maybe some will later this year. I'm told the difference in cost is minimal.

That's my understanding too. ...just that it hasn't been implemented.

As for an "upgrade" (hardware or firmware), I'd be surprised to see it. Samsung would probably just prefer to push people to upgrade their TVs instead :(

Anyway, it does sound likely that those Sonys will be accepting 1080p inputs. With their own PlayStation 3 and computers able to output at 1080p, you would think they'd enable that. Otherwise, what's the point of 1080p on the PlayStation?
--Kyle

That's my understanding too. ...just that it hasn't been implemented.

As for an "upgrade" (hardware or firmware), I'd be surprised to see it. Samsung would probably just prefer to push people to upgrade their TVs instead :(

Anyway, it does sound likely that those Sonys will be accepting 1080p inputs. With their own PlayStation 3 and computers able to output at 1080p, you would think they'd enable that. Otherwise, what's the point of 1080p on the PlayStation?
--Kyle


I would be shocked if the Sony SXRD's don't accept 1080P input, as you say, from a purely selfish marketing viewpoint, it would make no sense with the convergence of SXRD with the 1080P capable PlayStation 3.

I have a feeling other manufacturers may surprise and will implement 1080P inputting this Fall/Winter also. It would not make any sense to eliminate the gaming segment who will be buying PS3 and are looking to purchase HDTVs from considering your product when this implementation costs so little.

I would be shocked if the Sony SXRD's don't accept 1080P input ...

The current 70" $13,000 Qualia 006 SXRD does not accept 1080p. Until Sony actually announces 1080p as a feature on the smaller cheaper versions, wouldn't the safe bet in 2005 be that they will NOT support 1080p?

I own several new current model Sony computers (desktop and notebook) that are their best highend models and they do not support 1080p. If you read the spec sheets on most Windows Media Center models (such as the RA line) they are only supporting 1280x1024. I downloaded the drivers directly from ATI and got some higher resolutions working. But, when I call Sony back they said they only support their drivers that don't support anything higher than 1280x1024. So saying that the SXRD HDTV's are going to support 1080p input because of the computers that Sony sells is not accurate.

The current 70" $13,000 Qualia 006 SXRD does not accept 1080p. Until Sony actually announces 1080p as a feature on the smaller cheaper versions, wouldn't the safe bet in 2005 be that they will NOT support 1080p?



We shall see. It certainly would make sense that they would. Quite a gaff on their part if they don't with the production cost being negligible to let JVC or some other manufacturer steal away their gamer's HDTV business with PS 3 coming. I really don't think Sony is that dense. Apparently you do?

I'm leaning toward the hlr7178, but am still debating with myself about holding out to see the Mits 73727 before deciding. I find the dlp picture to be more impressive than the other digital displays I've seen, though I haven't seen the Qualia 06. I have ruled this out, however; even though I could afford it, it just seems obscene to pay this much for a TV.
millerwill- For what's it's worth. I saw the Qualia 06 go up against the Sammy 6768 at the HE-2005 SHOW IN N.Y. Stick with the sammy. Your leaning the right way.

We shall see. It certainly would make sense that they would. Quite a gaff on their part if they don't with the production cost being negligible to let JVC or some other manufacturer steal away their gamer's HDTV business with PS 3 coming. I really don't think Sony is that dense. Apparently you do?

I like Sony. I have paid a premium to buy their products and I am a very loyal Sony customer. In addition to the computers that I have purchased, I recently purchased (45 days ago) a DCR-HC90 camcorder. Which is one of their better camcorders and I love it. I don't think they are dense. I have just as much respect for Samsung. I own fewer Samsung products than Sony products, but they have been reliable and I have enjoyed owning them. Especially, my DLP HDTV.

1080p will show up at some point in time (I haven't even totally given up on seeing it in the new Samsung 1080p units), but it is not a feature that I will assume is in a product until it is announced ... that is all I am saying.

Thanks Ronnie ... I'll definitely be one of the first to go down and take a look! Let's hope that they get them on the floor soon.Bill, be sure to call first. The salesman I spoke to said all units to arrive on that date had already been sold, so it doesn't sound like those will hit the floor.

Bill, be sure to call first. The salesman I spoke to said all units to arrive on that date had already been sold, so it doesn't sound like those will hit the floor.

I know what you mean, I've waited in the past for them to get a unit on the floor. Last year on the HLP5674W, I called and they said they had it and were setting it up, come down in two hours. I went down and they told me a customer came in and bought the unit after I called. I'm sure the first units will sell quickly.

Schaffer 970 ... Don't you think that the 68 series manuals should have shown up on FCC site by now? With units scheduled to arrive at TVAuthority next week, they must be out there somewhere.

I have looked every possible way. They aren't on the FCC site yet. Having watched the site for so long now, I've get the feeling that a manufacturer can ask not to have things posted until a given date. Trying to keep competitors at bay??? :D

Check the PowerBuy sticky thread at the top of the forum.

I did, but it says you have to call them for their price. Does anybody know the price? could you tell me please? :D

I did, but it says you have to call them for their price. Does anybody know the price? could you tell me please? :D

Click on this link:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=545162

It will take you to the powerbuy thread, then click on the link within the thread for the members only pricing. That will take you to a page on the TVA site. On that page, click the box on the bottom of the page indicating you are a AVS member.

Click on this link:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=545162

It will take you to the powerbuy thread, then click on the link within the thread for the members only pricing. That will take you to a page on the TVA site. On that page, click the box on the bottom of the page indicating you are a AVS member.

Plus, when you find the TV you are interested in, just put it in your shopping basket. The price will be shown in the shopping basket.

Has anyone seen a comparison of std def DVD's on a 720p vs a 1080p display at CES?

I was set to buy a Sony 60" XS (1386 x 788), but am intrigued by the Samsung 1080p resolution. But here is the dilemma for watching non-HD material. In my mind, if you are going to spring for a 1080p display, you should sit close enough so that your eyes can resolve the added detail. Why buy a 1080p if you sit so far away it's indistinguishable from a 720p display? Now, if you ARE sitting nice and close, how does a 480p DVD image look scaled to 1080p? Does the additional scaling needed to go to 1080p introduce more artifacts and noise? I suppose it would be a wash if you sat further back, but that defeats the purpose of getting a 1080p display in the first place! HD-DVD would of course solve this dilemma, or you could move your sofa back and forth depending on whether you happen to be watching SDTV, a DVD, or HDTV (just kidding).

Sorry for the anal convoluted logic. For watching non-HD DVD's, I wonder if the main advantage of the Samsung 1080p may not be the added resolution, but rather the touted better contrast ratio and deeper blacks, which may be a larger contribution to PQ than pure resolution.

I have the HL-R6768 on pre-order from TVA...I will be getting a new DVD player since my flawed Samsung HD941 is know longer with me...what are your thoughts on a decent player in the under $300 price point...Sorry for going off topic...just wondering what other soon to be owners of 68/78 series is doing for their DVD player.

I have the HL-R6768 on pre-order from TVA...I will be getting a new DVD player since my flawed Samsung HD941 is know longer with me...what are your thoughts on a decent player in the under $300 price point...Sorry for going off topic...just wondering what other soon to be owners of 68/78 series is doing for their DVD player.

I will be holding off on a DVD player, using my current progressive component player to see how it looks, compared with my PC via HDMI/DVI. I would like to wait until HD DVD/BluRay players are affordable (PS3?).

I have the HL-R6768 on pre-order from TVA...I will be getting a new DVD player since my flawed Samsung HD941 is know longer with me...what are your thoughts on a decent player in the under $300 price point...Sorry for going off topic...just wondering what other soon to be owners of 68/78 series is doing for their DVD player.

I am going to be looking at the Oppo OPDV971H and Samsung DVD-HD950. I currently have a Samsung DVD-HD931 and a Panasonic DVD-CP72 on my main HT system. I have to admit last years problems with DVD-HD850 and DVD-HD941 shook my faith in the Samsung players. My current DVD-HD931 has been absolutely solid and has done a good job (I am aware of the all of the issues discussed on this forum relative to this unit). So I am still interested in seeing what the DVD-HD950 can do. I guess you could put me squarely in the up-converting DVD player camp.

But, I am really waiting for HD-DVD's and I hope to step up to that format as soon as it is released.

Here is a link to some very interesting comments on the most popular DVD players: DVD Benchmarks (http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-bin/shootout.cgi?function=search&articles=122)

Congratulations to UCSB for making post # 4,000 in this thread. :eek:

:eek: Wow! :)

Has anyone seen a comparison of std def DVD's on a 720p vs a 1080p display at CES?

I was set to buy a Sony 60" XS (1386 x 788), but am intrigued by the Samsung 1080p resolution. But here is the dilemma for watching non-HD material. In my mind, if you are going to spring for a 1080p display, you should sit close enough so that your eyes can resolve the added detail. Why buy a 1080p if you sit so far away it's indistinguishable from a 720p display? Now, if you ARE sitting nice and close, how does a 480p DVD image look scaled to 1080p? Does the additional scaling needed to go to 1080p introduce more artifacts and noise? I suppose it would be a wash if you sat further back, but that defeats the purpose of getting a 1080p display in the first place! HD-DVD would of course solve this dilemma, or you could move your sofa back and forth depending on whether you happen to be watching SDTV, a DVD, or HDTV (just kidding).

Sorry for the anal convoluted logic. For watching non-HD DVD's, I wonder if the main advantage of the Samsung 1080p may not be the added resolution, but rather the touted better contrast ratio and deeper blacks, which may be a larger contribution to PQ than pure resolution.

We have photos in the high resolution gallery (see POST #1) of a HLR5078W playing the DVD iRobot at CES 2005. My understanding is that it looked good, but of course lacked the detail of the 1080i HD Demo material.

I don't think we (as a group here in this thread) have come to any final conclusions on the benefits of 1080p at various viewing distances. There are tables floating around that indicate that at 1.5x screen diagonal you can resolve each pixel with 20/20 eye sight. But, I don't know about you ... I have never gone down looking at TV's thinking at what distance can I resolve every pixel (usuallly when we could we labled it SDE :D ). What happens at 2x, 2.5x, 3x screen diagonals will become common knowledge once we get these sets and start experimenting. Someone over in the Qualia 006 thread must have figured this out by now (please enlighten us). But, my personal guess after viewing the Qualia 006 is that the benefits will be apparent well beyond the distances where you can resolve every pixel. Basically, from anywhere in the room (just my own opinion).

Plus, when you find the TV you are interested in, just put it in your shopping basket. The price will be shown in the shopping basket.

I had to call in. At work and at home after I placed an item in my shopping cart I would check the cart and the cart would be empty. I pointed this out to the TVA person I placed my order with. He did not respond. I think it may have something to do with browser settings and cookies, but it's just a WAG on my part. It's worth the phone call I guess is my point to anyone who wants to know about pricing if your shopping cart won't work.

Does anyone have an idea over what period of time the TVA Power Buy Prices will remain in effect? How long were previous Power Buy prices in effect? I am somewhat reluctant to buy a new HD TV, sight unseen.

I looked at the big Sony Qualia next to a Sammy 720P and the Qualia picture won, without a doubt. I really would like to see the Qualia next to a Sammy 1080P before I buy a Sammy.

Does anyone have an idea over what period of time the TVA Power Buy Prices will remain in effect? How long were previous Power Buy prices in effect? I am somewhat reluctant to buy a new HD TV, sight unseen.

I've seen that the last time would be 30 days after the units start to ship. I believe it starts when TVA starts to ship the TVs to those on the list. The "ship" in the first sentence is where any ambiguity could creep in.

I am going to be looking at the Oppo OPDV971H and Samsung DVD-HD950.

If you were to go with the Oppo, would you choose the DVI-DVI cable or the DVI-HDMI cable? Both are options with the Oppo purchase.

Does anyone have an idea over what period of time the TVA Power Buy Prices will remain in effect?

They will hold the PowerBuy open for at least 30 days after all the units being offered are shipping. So in the case of the HLRxx68W PowerBuy, the clock would start as soon as all three models (56", 61", and 67") have started shipping. In the past Samsung has not released every model in the same week, but that might change with only three models being released in this PowerBuy. You should have enough time to go down and see the unit in a store and still place an order on the PowerBuy.

If you were to go with the Oppo, would you choose the DVI-DVI cable or the DVI-HDMI cable? Both are options with the Oppo purchase.

I would be using it with a 68 series, so I would go the DVI-HDMI route. Here is a link to the Oppo info: LINK (http://www.oppodigital.com/)

I don't think we (as a group here in this thread) have come to any final conclusions on the benefits of 1080p at various viewing distances. There are tables floating around that indicate that at 1.5x screen diagonal you can resolve each pixel with 20/20 eye sight.

To see the individual pixels I think you would need to be about 1to 2 ft from the screen; at that's the case with my hlp 6163. The 1.5 x diagonal distance is the one for which HD was designed, the distance at which one achieves the 'full big experience'. There is no way one can see individual pixels on a HD3 or xHD4 dlp (though you may be able to with a 720p LCD RP or plasma, and probably with an EDTV plasma).

I own several new current model Sony computers (desktop and notebook) that are their best highend models and they do not support 1080p. If you read the spec sheets on most Windows Media Center models (such as the RA line) they are only supporting 1280x1024. I downloaded the drivers directly from ATI and got some higher resolutions working. But, when I call Sony back they said they only support their drivers that don't support anything higher than 1280x1024. So saying that the SXRD HDTV's are going to support 1080p input because of the computers that Sony sells is not accurate.

I was trying to say computers in general (not Sony's). There are plenty of video cards out that can do 1080p (you may have to use PowerStrip and setup a custom resolution, and use the latest drivers). I'm not sure why yours can't... Later,
--Kyle

I would be using it with a 68 series, so I would go the DVI-HDMI route. Here is a link to the Oppo info: LINK (http://www.oppodigital.com/)

I'll be using w/68 too. I forgot that 68 only comes with two HDMI inputs & no DVI inputs. I could have answered my own question if I'd have looked at the 68 specs again prior to posting. Oops.

To see the individual pixels I think you would need to be about 1to 2 ft from the screen; at that's the case with my hlp 6163. The 1.5 x diagonal distance is the one for which HD was designed, the distance at which one achieves the 'full big experience'. There is no way one can see individual pixels on a HD3 or xHD4 dlp (though you may be able to with a 720p LCD RP or plasma, and probably with an EDTV plasma).

Yes, I agree, because of the design of these sets we will not be able to see pixels on these new sets.

I just got off the phone with a bank rep asking for a credit line increase on my CC, I received it, now I'm ready for my 5688 Capt Kirk HDTV 1080p!!!!!!!!!!!!

I would be using it with a 68 series, so I would go the DVI-HDMI route. Here is a link to the Oppo info:


According to the Secrets review, this player is not HDCP compliant:

"The DVI output is not HDCP compliant, so consumers with older DVI monitors that don’t support HDCP are in luck!"


Wouldn't display on the Sammy's, would it?

Please excuse the slightly off topic post, but I've ordered my HLR-5667W and am expecting it shortly. I need to get a surge protector, and I have no idea which one is better than another. Is there a difference? Any recommendations?

According to the Secrets review, this player is not HDCP compliant:

"The DVI output is not HDCP compliant, so consumers with older DVI monitors that don’t support HDCP are in luck!"


Wouldn't display on the Sammy's, would it?

It will work. If you have a HDCP compliant DVD player and your HDTV is not then that won't work. But, in this case everything will work fine. There is a large Oppo thread over in the DVD player area.

1080p is something that will be of greater benefit to those looking at larger screens. The drawback being that the only possible TRUE 1080p signal will be Blue-ray. But then again, none of the inputs on most of these 1080p sets accept a 1080p. Just a case of "biggest and best first" syndrome for a lot of people then?

World of Warcraft on an X8x0 or GeForce 6-series will look AMAZING @ 1920x1080p. And it'll run at 60fps.

There seems to be a great deal of confusion regarding 1080P input to the sets. All of the 1080P sets do have 1920x1080 60Hz input through the VGA input. What we are not likely to be able to do is put a digital 1920x1080 60Hz signal through the HDMI input. How much picture quality difference there might be between the analog 1080p signal and a digital 1080p signal is open to debate (straight digital eliminates the D/A A/D conversion).

There seems to be a great deal of confusion regarding 1080P input to the sets. All of the 1080P sets do have 1920x1080 60Hz input through the VGA input. What we are not likely to be able to do is put a digital 1920x1080 60Hz signal through the HDMI input. How much picture quality difference there might be between the analog 1080p signal and a digital 1080p signal is open to debate (straight digital eliminates the D/A A/D conversion).

i didn't think it would accept 1080p through the component inputs either.

BenDover, (good to see you over slumming with us Sammys :D) looks like you are right. The component signal goes to a ADV7400 chip (Analog Devices) and a quick review of the chip indicates that it only accepts 1080i over component.

BJG: my choice is the Tripp Lite HTPOWERBAR10. I have two of them and will probably buy a third. Try this link

surge (http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=10377522&loc=101&sp=1)

A fellow newbie, me, has basically the same question, i.e. is there any point to buying an upconverting/de-interlacing DVD player when, as I understand it, the TV does this anyway with its onboard hardware & firmware?

I researched this question this weekend and determined that unless one believes that the upconversion/de-interlacing perfomed by the DVD player is superior to the same functions performed by the HL-Rxx68/78/88W then there would be no benefit to using the upconverting/de-interlacing DVD player. However, I could be wrong. There must be members here who have a firm grasp on this issue.

I also came to the conclusion, again, possibly incorrect conclusion, that the upconverting/de-interlacing functions performed by a $200 DVD player were not likely superior to those performed by the 68/78/88. On a tangent, I'm not willing, at this point, to spend for a great DVD player when HD-DVD/Blu-Ray are around the corner. I'm planning to just stick with what I've got for now based on the above assumptions and lack of willingness to upgrade with a new format looming.

I just bought an HLR5067W, and cound not get a sharp picture without
an upconverting DVD player. All of the 480 inputs produced ghosts on edges
such as DVD menus and movie credit text. Your problem will only be worse if you
expect the TV to scale 480 to 1080.

The benefit of the upconverting DVD is that the scaling is done on the digital data right from the disc. If you send it out to the TV on the component cables it goes throught D/A and then A/D. This introduces NOISE. Seriously.

My set displays a ghost next to any vertical edge when using the analog inputs.
Edges are sharp with the HDMI at 480p, 720p, or 1080i. Using a Tosh upconverting DVD.

Samsung did not do a great job on the analog inputs, IMHO. I've used other sets that upconverted and did not introduce ghosts.

In any case Samsung say my ghost problem is normal behavior. So get a
scaling DVD player and look for a 12 bit DAC.

Anyone find any Picture Settings that really capture the TV's purpose?

Please excuse the slightly off topic post, but I've ordered my HLR-5667W and am expecting it shortly. I need to get a surge protector, and I have no idea which one is better than another. Is there a difference? Any recommendations?

I have one of these on one of my smaller home theater setups, it does a nice job of filtering noise.

http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=90128449&loc=111&sp=1

They also make a larger HTS 2000 version.

BenDover, (good to see you over slumming with us Sammys :D) looks like you are right. The component signal goes to a ADV7400 chip (Analog Devices) and a quick review of the chip indicates that it only accepts 1080i over component.


no slumming, i am a proud owner of a sammy dlp and plan on adding a 1080p sammy whenever they finally start shipping. i recommend them to family and friends all the time without reservation.

Please excuse the slightly off topic post, but I've ordered my HLR-5667W and am expecting it shortly. I need to get a surge protector, and I have no idea which one is better than another. Is there a difference? Any recommendations?

I recommend American Power Conversion (APC) surge protectors. I'm using an APC NET7 on my Samsung HL-R5067.

APC makes a line of A/V-specific surge protectors that might be worth checking out too.

With over 4,000 posts to this thread (whew, great job UCSB)--and, I've read all of them, but forgive my memory, if this has been answered before, I have a nagging question: "Why the delay?" I mean, all of us are anxiously waiting with baited breath for the release of these HLR 1080p's, but the date seems to constantly move (and move....and move). I just got off the phone with Samsung customer support this morning, and they have no info. on the release date of the 1080p DLP's (that they're willing to say, anyway). The website isn't updated, and only one 1080p manual is listed with the FCC. I'm not getting any solid signals that these models are coming out anytime soon. The "rumoured" date, which is the best I could get out of the Samsung phone rep, is around the beginning of the July. TVA seems to think they're still in the mid-June to end of June time-frame, but rather than "when?", my question is beginning to turn to "why?" Model HLR-5688w was announced in January for a February release date. Heck, at that time it was only one month away. You would think a large manufacturer like Samsung, would have had those babies already boxed up in January for a February ship date [but in this case, I'm grateful for the delay--the chip changed, along with an improved contrast ratio]. But then it was pushed to April/May, then May/June, and now June/July. What's going on, folks? I can only assume there's some technical snaufu involved or compatability type issue--but what's the story? Anyone care to venture a guess? At this rate, every other manufacturer out there is going to beat Samsung to the punch, and Samsung was supposed to have a six-month lead on its competition. I know we're all hanging tough but what's the real story? Is it time to call up Steve P? P.S. Although this may appear a bit "maddening" or "frustrating" I'm really just curious. I'd much rather have the delay, and have Samsung get it right, then have them pre-release a lemon or models that are riddled with problems. This is a one-time (i.e., non-disposable) purchase for me, as I'm sure it is for a lot of you, and I'm sure we don't want to do this again, anytime soon.

"Why the delay?" I mean, all of us are anxiously waiting with baited breath for the release of these HLR 1080p's, but the date seems to constantly move (and move....and move).
I've read every message in this thread too. :eek:

I'm not waiting for the 1080p sets with great anxiety. That may be why my understanding of when to realistically expect them in stores has always been in a June/July time frame. ;)

Magnolia Video/HiFi expects the first 1080p models to arrive in their Northern California warehouse any day now. The first shipment seems to be sold already, so it might be a while longer before there are enough of them for display models.

With over 4,000 posts to this thread (whew, great job UCSB)--and, I've read all of them, but forgive my memory, if this has been answered before, I have a nagging question: "Why the delay?"

Having spent my career in a high tech manufacturing company, delays are not at all unusual. The reasons are many; building a few prototypes to test a concept is not the same as ramping up to build tens of thousands of final production units. During this ramp many issues arise: suppliers having problems ramping up to deliver parts, cosmetic issues with plastics due to molding problems or tolerance errors, electrical spec variations, tolerance buildup errors, production line tooling problems, etc. For those companies wishing to maintain their product quality (and minimizing warranty expense in the process), predicting actual shipment dates is difficult. There is a constant battle between manufacturing (quality oriented) and marketing (who also want quality but want to ship ASAP).

I've read every message in this thread too. :eek:

I'm not waiting for the 1080p sets with great anxiety. That may be why my understanding of when to realistically expect them in stores has always been in a June/July time frame. ;)

Magnolia Video/HiFi expects the first 1080p models to arrive in their Northern California warehouse any day now. The first shipment seems to be sold already, so it might be a while longer before there are enough of them for display models.

The June/July time frame is certainly a "realistic" time frame, especially in light of other manufacturers' release dates (but they didn't announce February or March release dates, either). I recollect, actually, that the model HLR-5688w was previously announced last year as the HLP-5697 which didn't come out at all. I think it's a bit of a marketing ploy, to raise interest levels and get people committed to a particular brand/model, but heck, it worked for me! I'm not really complaining, I'm hooked!

Like a few of us, I was at the Magnolia Hi-Fi in San Ramon two days ago (Wednesday), and saw the screen of HLR's on the way. Only one model (the 61") is expected in June, and that's supposed to arrive today, June 10th. I'm curious to know if it shows up. And even more curious to get feedback from those lucky customers on that first shipment.

I do applaud everyone for their patience, though. I know, whatever the wait, it's going to be very well worth it!

Typically, are the Samsung menu/setup options the same for each model? With the XX68/XX78 manuals not out yet, does anyone think the menu/setup will be similar to the 5688? We have a prelim manual for that.

I had to call in. At work and at home after I placed an item in my shopping cart I would check the cart and the cart would be empty. I pointed this out to the TVA person I placed my order with. He did not respond. I think it may have something to do with browser settings and cookies, but it's just a WAG on my part. It's worth the phone call I guess is my point to anyone who wants to know about pricing if your shopping cart won't work.

Yeah the same shopping cart thing is happening too. Can someone who knows already or is able to check from that website would you please just TELL me the prices of the 6168 and the 6768? thanx!

I have a new HLR 56. I was wondering if anyone knows the answers to the following:

1. Is there a way to get rid of the bars on the right and left of the picture when watching regular digital cable channels (e.g., non-HDTV channels)?

2. Is there a way to change the color of the bars on the right and left of the picture from gray to black? These bars are black when the tv is tuned to non-HDTV programming on an HDTV channel, but they seem to stay gray on the non-HDTV channels. They are certainly easier to live with if they are black rather than the stark gray.

Thanks.

Having spent my career in a high tech manufacturing company, delays are not at all unusual. The reasons are many; building a few prototypes to test a concept is not the same as ramping up to build tens of thousands of final production units. During this ramp many issues arise: suppliers having problems ramping up to deliver parts, cosmetic issues with plastics due to molding problems or tolerance errors, electrical spec variations, tolerance buildup errors, production line tooling problems, etc. For those companies wishing to maintain their product quality (and minimizing warranty expense in the process), predicting actual shipment dates is difficult. There is a constant battle between manufacturing (quality oriented) and marketing (who also want quality but want to ship ASAP).

This an UBER delay, Samsung has delayed the release of their 1080p line for so long they renamed the line...lol... I was expecting the previous model to have been released late last summer. :)

Yeah the same shopping cart thing is happening too. Can someone who knows already or is able to check from that website would you please just TELL me the prices of the 6168 and the 6768? thanx!
From my experience if you fail to check the member box before leaving the first TVA page their web site gets messed up. I was able to get it to work by shutting down my browser and trying again. As pure speculation, if you subtract 954 from the "5668" you might be very close.

We shall see. It certainly would make sense that they would. Quite a gaff on their part if they don't with the production cost being negligible to let JVC or some other manufacturer steal away their gamer's HDTV business with PS 3 coming. I really don't think Sony is that dense. Apparently you do?

"gamer's HDTV business with PS 3 coming"

Sorry, but the gaming community probably doesn't even show up on their radar as a factor to have it or not.

That arguement reminds me of a guy that commented on AMD and how much the techno/overclocking community had on it's locking or unlocking processors and how they would lose large sales as a result. The truth is they are a fractional % of the market, which is just the same case with 1080p input and the choice to do it or not because of consoles.

You can bet to add it or not will be 99% based on broadcast/recorded content in 1080p.

This an UBER delay, Samsung has delayed the release of their 1080p line for so long they renamed the line...lol... I was expecting the previous model to have been released late last summer. :)
Strange Expectations.

That would make a good movie title. ;)

A quizzical sort might want to know what Samsung source brought on those expectations. :rolleyes:

1. Is there a way to get rid of the bars on the right and left of the picture when watching regular digital cable channels (e.g., non-HDTV channels)?


try the "p size" button on the remote (it's on the left, under the slide-y thing). not sure about your other problem.

also, SD often looks better in 4:3 (w/ the black bars) than in 16:9 (w/out the bars)

Is there a problem with the HLR-5667w model? The online advisor from Samsung doesn't even suggest the model in the 50-61 inch size group, it totally overlooks it. Plus CC has a really good price on it 2799! Which is what other retailers are selling the 50" model for! I'm looking into purchasing this TV, I really like it. Hopefully next week or two I'll have it!

Is there a problem with the HLR-5667w model? The online advisor from Samsung doesn't even suggest the model in the 50-61 inch size group, it totally overlooks it. Plus CC has a really good price on it 2799! Which is what other retailers are selling the 50" model for! I'm looking into purchasing this TV, I really like it. Hopefully next week or two I'll have it!

There aren't any problems with the HLR5667W. You can read about it in the HLRxx67W owners thread here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=537675

"gamer's HDTV business with PS 3 coming"

Sorry, but the gaming community probably doesn't even show up on their radar as a factor to have it or not.

That arguement reminds me of a guy that commented on AMD and how much the techno/overclocking community had on it's locking or unlocking processors and how they would lose large sales as a result. The truth is they are a fractional % of the market, which is just the same case with 1080p input and the choice to do it or not because of consoles.

You can bet to add it or not will be 99% based on broadcast/recorded content in 1080p.

Actually if you'd bother to read some of this thread. Samsung has taken gaming very seriously with these modesl of TV's, especially since they've partenered with Microsoft on a project.

- D

Actually if you'd bother to read some of this thread. Samsung has taken gaming very seriously with these modesl of TV's, especially since they've partenered with Microsoft on a project.

- D

Daphoid,

you're definitely correct that manufacturers do take gaming into consideration with respect to some of the design for new models. I think that Samsung has taken gaming seriously with respect to the lag issue that has been experienced on some of the prior models.

However, I think that Ppowr was referring to whether or not manufacturers were considering gaming when deciding whether or not sets should accept 1080p through HDMI or component. I think that Ppowr is also right here. I highly doubt that gaming is much of a consideration (at least right now) in whether or not soon to be released sets should include 1080p through component or HDMI. That was the issue that Ppowr was bringing up with respect to gazelle's earlier comment.

I tend to agree with both statements. Lag was an issue for gamers, and samsung knew that hard-core gamers would shy away from sammy sets if they had lag. However, I'm not too sure the manufacturers currently (as I said before) care about gamers when it comes to the 1080p input issue.

However, I'm not too sure the manufacturers currently (as I said before) care about gamers when it comes to the 1080p input issue.
Neither am I. :)

I recall a study done quite some time ago that revealed that gaming performance (on the part of the gamer him/herself) decreased with larger screen sizes; i.e., the smaller the screen, the better the person's "score" but I guess that was well before The Sims, etc. where gaming really isn't about "scoring" but just being immersed.

Doom3 will probably scare the @#$% out of me on a 70" screen...I'll get my HTPC hooked up one of these days.

Anyway, I guess maybe what I am driving at is, do we really want to play games on huge TVs? ... we may all become psychotic :)

I was out at Magnolia HiFi in San Ramon today, mainly to look at the Qualia 06 to see if I can really handle a 70"-er (in anticipation of the hlr7178). I like the size, and the PQ, just fine, but was shocked at the horrible glary screen on the Qualia! The Mits dlp's have been crucified for their glary screen, but I thought that on the Qualia was as bad if not worse, and it is not removable, and yet I've heard very little discussion of this. ??? Also, I was very impressed with the hlr xx67's.

Also was interesting to get Mag HiFi's MSRP on the big Sammy's (I think it's OK to quote MSRP's right?): $6000 and $6500, respectively, for the 6768 and 7178. If one scales to the PB price that TVA has, that for the 7178 should be very nice.

I just bought an HLR5067W, and cound not get a sharp picture without
an upconverting DVD player. All of the 480 inputs produced ghosts on edges
such as DVD menus and movie credit text. Your problem will only be worse if you
expect the TV to scale 480 to 1080.

The benefit of the upconverting DVD is that the scaling is done on the digital data right from the disc. If you send it out to the TV on the component cables it goes throught D/A and then A/D. This introduces NOISE. Seriously.

My set displays a ghost next to any vertical edge when using the analog inputs.
Edges are sharp with the HDMI at 480p, 720p, or 1080i. Using a Tosh upconverting DVD.

Samsung did not do a great job on the analog inputs, IMHO. I've used other sets that upconverted and did not introduce ghosts.

In any case Samsung say my ghost problem is normal behavior. So get a
scaling DVD player and look for a 12 bit DAC.

Thanks for the input. After doing more reading in this forum I've decided to decide when I see my options on my set. In other words, I'm going to buy an upscaling player and compare it to my other option--my current player. I'll return the upscaler if I don't see improvement or don't think its a good value. However, from the things I'm reading, I doubt I'll be sending it back.

I'm leaning toward the Oppo at this point. I'd consider anything, though, and I'm also curious about the HD-950.

Is there a problem with the HLR-5667w model? The online advisor from Samsung doesn't even suggest the model in the 50-61 inch size group, it totally overlooks it. Plus CC has a really good price on it 2799! Which is what other retailers are selling the 50" model for! I'm looking into purchasing this TV, I really like it. Hopefully next week or two I'll have it!

From what I've seen the 5667 is a fine set. At 2799 plus tx & delivery (if you need delivery) I'm sure you could do much worse. However, have you checked into the PB for the 5668? No tax is collected by TVA, unless you live in CA or WA I believe, and shipping is free. YOu may be surprised at the price of the 5668 on the PB. The 5668 appears to have several significant improvements over the 5667. I say "appears" because I have not yet seen the 5668 picture in person. The specs make the 5668 a superior set.

Best of luck. I believe you'll be happy with either set.

Viewer grade decision tree; x67 (720p) vs. x68 (1080p)

So, while I appreciate the incredible work done by the group here (as a matter of fact, I was able to attend the Samsung press briefing at HES when I believe it was this group that went thru and was very impressed by the questions asked) I'm most interesting in raising some less technical, what I term to viewer issues.
So - pls dont flame if these were covered in the 136 pages (many of which I've read) I am torn between buying the 6167/68 - indeed cancelled an order for the 67 yesterday. As a techie/gadget type I would like to be on the leading edge - but not if it makes my current experience less rather than more.

1) Is there a concensus opinion of whether Std Def television (which will still be around for a while) will really look better on the 720p vs. 1080p sets? Even worse, will the 1080p experience be objectionable on std def?
In the end I will need to wait to look side by side if possible at the viewing experience to know this answer. But what do people think and have others done this comparision to date?


2) Will 1080p help me when viewing DVD's thru an appropriately high enough quality player? I have noted many of the great suggestion on this front and will be buying a new dvd player as I take delivery of my new DLP - my wife especially hopes any day now to finish our new den!

3) Since 1080p is not built into the hdmi interface, it would seem that these introductory 1080p sets are somewhat crippled for the future. Am I off-base here?

4) I expect to break down and enter the gaming/media access world thru an Xbox360 as soon as they come out. Especially when considering the Samsung PR, does anyone have any good feeling of whether the 1080p experience will blow away the 720p experience?

Thanks for the help.

Are we not allowed to say prices or something? Cuz no matter how many times i just ask for the prices, everyone always gives me a link or something (which doesn't work) I'm really not trying to be rude, i'm just wondering if there is a rule i'm missing. (cuz i don't want to get in trouble!)

And if you are allowed to say it.. TELL ME :D

Are we not allowed to say prices or something? Cuz no matter how many times i just ask for the prices, everyone always gives me a link or something (which doesn't work) I'm really not trying to be rude, i'm just wondering if there is a rule i'm missing. (cuz i don't want to get in trouble!)

And if you are allowed to say it.. TELL ME :D

Try reading the Special Posting Rules Announcement near the top of the thread list...

I don't see it.... but i'm guessing that means that we're not allowed to. Thank you!

I don't see it.... but i'm guessing that means that we're not allowed to. Thank you!

The forum rules only all posting of MSRP. TV Authority's prices are heavily discounted and therefore can not be listed. Just call TVA and they will give you all the info you need over the phone ... identify yourself as a AVSforum member to get the special PowerBuy prices.

I don't see it.... but i'm guessing that means that we're not allowed to. Thank you!
Posting the MSRP for the HLR5668 set is allowed. It's $4199. There is a number in my last post that you can subtract from the MSRP. Try that and see what you think.

To use this Rear Projection forum it helps if you start from this page.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=63

The third message from the top is the one you need for forum rules.

Sticky: >>> Special Posting Rules For This Area <<<

Someone from this thread should be able to answer RichNY's post. I have many of the same questions.

My main question is - how does SD look on 720p and/or 1080p?

I can't get any stores to show me SD on a HDTV. I live in the sticks of eastern Oklahoma. So I don't have many choices.

I currently have Directv and a 32" Sony CRT - which looks fine. But I am ready for the HD experience.

Given the current source material available, I still am debating between 720p (5667) or 1080i (5668). One thing I am curious about is the how important the contrast ratio is.

The 720p sets are 2500:1 where as the 1080i sets are "up to 10000:1". I know there's a huge difference between, say 400:1 and 2500:1 but how big is the difference between these two?

I'm sure that the true videophiles amongst us can tell but will the average Joe be able to see a difference?

As far as PQ, how good does 720p upscaled to 1080i look? Obviously it would look best at 1080i (1080p would be better but that's not here yet). But since most material is 720p and lower right now, on a 1080i I'll be looking at a lot of upscaled 720p. Can anyone point me to any commentary or reviews on this issue?

Thank in advance!

-Joe, aka PuterGeek

My main question is - how does SD look on 720p and/or 1080p?

I can't get any stores to show me SD on a HDTV. I live in the sticks of eastern Oklahoma. So I don't have many choices.

I currently have Directv and a 32" Sony CRT - which looks fine. But I am ready for the HD experience.

My local Best Buy has *one* of their HL-R5667 hooked up to a standard Directv feed. From 10 feet away, SD actually does not look bad. Not as good as my 40" Sony XBR crt, but not bad. I was actually rather impressed.

John

Thanks jpoet. That is what I was hoping to hear!

As far as PQ, how good does 720p upscaled to 1080i look? Obviously it would look best at 1080i (1080p would be better but that's not here yet). But since most material is 720p and lower right now, on a 1080i I'll be looking at a lot of upscaled 720p. Can anyone point me to any commentary or reviews on this issue?

Thank in advance!

-Joe, aka PuterGeek

Most TV content is not 720p, it is in fact 1080i. ABC and Fox use 720p and NBC and CBS (and almost all other channels other than ABC and Fox affiliates, e.g., HBO) use 1080i. In any event, the new HLRs have a native resolution of 1080p, not 1080i and most people strongly believe that 720p -> 1080p and 1080i -> 1080p, would look better than 720p -> 720p or 1080i -> 720p.

Rich could you edit your post to use -> or --> for arrows instead of just >, I thought you were saying 'greater than' for a second. :)

Hello, my name is Martin and I too have read every response in this thread. ;)

Viewer grade decision tree; x67 (720p) vs. x68 (1080p)

So, while I appreciate the incredible work done by the group here (as a matter of fact, I was able to attend the Samsung press briefing at HES when I believe it was this group that went thru and was very impressed by the questions asked) I'm most interesting in raising some less technical, what I term to viewer issues.
So - pls dont flame if these were covered in the 136 pages (many of which I've read) I am torn between buying the 6167/68 - indeed cancelled an order for the 67 yesterday. As a techie/gadget type I would like to be on the leading edge - but not if it makes my current experience less rather than more.

1) Is there a concensus opinion of whether Std Def television (which will still be around for a while) will really look better on the 720p vs. 1080p sets? Even worse, will the 1080p experience be objectionable on std def?
In the end I will need to wait to look side by side if possible at the viewing experience to know this answer. But what do people think and have others done this comparision to date?

Before I bought this or any HDTV, I would arrange for your local cable or satellite company to have HDTV programming installed on the day you are set to receive the set or soon after. These sets (and here I mean all of the upcoming 1080p sets, not just the Samsung DLPs) are meant to display high definition signals. More likely than not you will be underwhelmed at SD performance. I have not seen SD on the Samsung 1080p DLPs, but I have seen it on the Qualia--the pictures ranged from surprisingly good to poor depending on the channel. This is not the fault of the Qualia, BTW--it is an excellent display and is doing the best it can with what it is being fed. In other words, garbage in, garbage out.

2) Will 1080p help me when viewing DVD's thru an appropriately high enough quality player? I have noted many of the great suggestion on this front and will be buying a new dvd player as I take delivery of my new DLP - my wife especially hopes any day now to finish our new den!

There are those that believe that upscaling dvd players are the way to go, while others let the television do the upscaling. Without getting into a huge debate over which is better, you will definitely reap the rewards when Blu-Ray and/or HD-DVD hit either late this year or early next year (hopefully the format war will be avoided).

3) Since 1080p is not built into the hdmi interface, it would seem that these introductory 1080p sets are somewhat crippled for the future. Am I off-base here?

The million dollar question.
First things first. HDMI can handle 1080p60. The issue is whether or not the HDMI chipset being used on the television can accept it. From what I understand, Silicon Optics has a chipset available now that can--but we have no way of knowing if that particular chipset will be used in the Samsungs or any of the other 1080p RPTVs coming in the next few months. Sony offered an upgrade for the Qualia 004 front projector to receive 1080p60, but it was $3000, IIRC.

OTOH, here's why I'm not worried:

a. At the moment no one broadcasts in 1080p.
b. For that to change would require at the very least a sizable bandwidth increase not likely to happen in the immediate future.
c. Blu-Ray and/or HD-DVD will output 1080i as well as 1080p--so the differences between transmitted 1080p and deinterlaced 1080p should be minimal if the deinterlacing is done properly (i.e. not taken down to 540p first).
d. These sets can take 1080p60 over the analog VGA input, so when City of Villains comes out hopefully I'll be playing it at 1920x1080 with the help of a good video card. I'm not sure if my current Radeon 9800 will handle it.


4) I expect to break down and enter the gaming/media access world thru an Xbox360 as soon as they come out. Especially when considering the Samsung PR, does anyone have any good feeling of whether the 1080p experience will blow away the 720p experience?

I'd read that the Xbox360 would not display 1080p, but 1080i or 720p. Perhaps someone more familiar with the specs could confirm that. The Playstation 3 probably will output 1080p, but I'll bet the output can also be set to accept 1080i--and as stated earlier, I believe the deinterlaced 1080i content will rival transmitted 1080p. It is my personal opinion that the PQ on the 1080p Samsung DLPs is much better than the 720p models for the size I am considering (61" or 67").

Actually if you'd bother to read some of this thread. Samsung has taken gaming very seriously with these modesl of TV's, especially since they've partenered with Microsoft on a project.

- D


Maybe with respect to lag and compatability, but hardly to add 1080p or not. One reason manufacturers delayed the release of their 1080p sets was because of lack of content.

As, for your comment on reading the thread...some of us work for a living and don't have the free time to waste like you do to read it all. :rolleyes:

Daphoid,

you're definitely correct that manufacturers do take gaming into consideration with respect to some of the design for new models. I think that Samsung has taken gaming seriously with respect to the lag issue that has been experienced on some of the prior models.

However, I think that Ppowr was referring to whether or not manufacturers were considering gaming when deciding whether or not sets should accept 1080p through HDMI or component. I think that Ppowr is also right here. I highly doubt that gaming is much of a consideration (at least right now) in whether or not soon to be released sets should include 1080p through component or HDMI. That was the issue that Ppowr was bringing up with respect to gazelle's earlier comment.

I tend to agree with both statements. Lag was an issue for gamers, and samsung knew that hard-core gamers would shy away from sammy sets if they had lag. However, I'm not too sure the manufacturers currently (as I said before) care about gamers when it comes to the 1080p input issue.

Thanks, exactly what I meant... :)

Viewer grade decision tree; x67 (720p) vs. x68 (1080p)

So, while I appreciate the incredible work done by the group here (as a matter of fact, I was able to attend the Samsung press briefing at HES when I believe it was this group that went thru and was very impressed by the questions asked) I'm most interesting in raising some less technical, what I term to viewer issues.
So - pls dont flame if these were covered in the 136 pages (many of which I've read) I am torn between buying the 6167/68 - indeed cancelled an order for the 67 yesterday. As a techie/gadget type I would like to be on the leading edge - but not if it makes my current experience less rather than more.

1) Is there a concensus opinion of whether Std Def television (which will still be around for a while) will really look better on the 720p vs. 1080p sets? Even worse, will the 1080p experience be objectionable on std def?
In the end I will need to wait to look side by side if possible at the viewing experience to know this answer. But what do people think and have others done this comparision to date?


2) Will 1080p help me when viewing DVD's thru an appropriately high enough quality player? I have noted many of the great suggestion on this front and will be buying a new dvd player as I take delivery of my new DLP - my wife especially hopes any day now to finish our new den!

3) Since 1080p is not built into the hdmi interface, it would seem that these introductory 1080p sets are somewhat crippled for the future. Am I off-base here?

4) I expect to break down and enter the gaming/media access world thru an Xbox360 as soon as they come out. Especially when considering the Samsung PR, does anyone have any good feeling of whether the 1080p experience will blow away the 720p experience?

Thanks for the help.

If you are seriously considering both 67 and 68 series models, you will need to go down and look at both when the 68 series are available. Since you live in NYC that should not be a problem. Why am I recommending actually viewing the TV's? Well, just look at our experience with the 67 series. We have comments that range from very impressed (I'm in that camp) to others that were underwhelmed. Since the 68 series should be available shortly, there really is no reason not to wait and take a look.

ITEM #1: SD Viewing - At this point in time we do not have a single report on SD viewing on a Samsung 1080p DLP HDTV. The only safe bet is to wait and take a look yourself or rely on the comments of others once they start to ship. SD broadcasts on 720p is a well known quantity. It varies by the quality of input signal. For example, cable systems often have a number of analog SD channels and digital SD channels. Typically, the quality varies by channel! The best digital channels will look good. The worst analog channels will look bad, but be watchable. All of the other channels will fall in between. HD broadcasts will look awesome. To put this into perspective, SD on a $300 CRT direct view could easily look better. When I installed my Samsung DLP, my wife was watching a SD channel and asked me "what is wrong with the TV". :D Unfortunately, I had to answer "nothing, that is the way it looks.". In general, you will get used to it.

ITEM #2: Will 1080p help me when viewing standard DVD's vs. 720p. This is another question that has not been answered yet. Since standard DVD's are 480i, they will be upshifted for both 720p and 1080p. The upshifting players (or letting the TV upshift) can not add detail to the picture, but they might make it look smoother. We don't know, but I will bet that on the larger screen sizes 1080p will make DVD's look smoother. BUT, that is just a guess and we will need to really test this assumption. Remember, in general, the smaller the screen size the sharper the picture will look. We may find situations where a 50" 720p set will look sharper than a 61" 1080p for DVD's ... but, I expect we will be able to say the 1080p 61" will look better than a 61" 720p.

ITEM #3: If 1080p is not available on the HDMI input will this cripple these sets in the future? Current thinking is that the deinterlacing of 1080i material will be high enough quality to give you a solid picture. Several posts have pointed out that movies and broadcasts that use the 1080i 24fps standard will convert to 1080p after deinterlacing. 1080i will be offered on all HD products for the foreseeable future. But, the way I think about these issues is a little differently. We know there will be better HDTV's each year. When I bought my HDTV in 2003, if someone had said "why are you buying 720p, when 1080p is just two years away?". What if I was to tell you that something really, really great was going to be offered in 2007. Would you wait? I think 1080p HDMI inputs will be standard by next year (2006), if the feature is worth waiting a year ... then you should be able to get it next year. If the 1080i interlacing in as good as we expect, these sets should not be crippled in the future. [NOTE- I haven't completely given up hope of 1080p HDMI on this year's sets ... but, it is a long shot.]

ITEM #4: Gaming at 1080p? This is a unknown at this point in time. It will take weeks after the new units ship for gamers to fully investigate game performance. Of course, the new game consoles are not even available so they can not be tested. This means that questions like 1080p on the PS3 are complete unknowns at this point in time. The HLRxx67W owners thread has been in existence since May 7th and I still don't think we have a definitive answer on game performance (most people are reporting good performance, but a few have reported specific problems in certain games). So if gaming at 1080p is a deal breaker ... you should wait until late summer. I am not an avid gamer, but my son is ... so I will be able to report performance on both the XBox and PS2 since we have both.

With three of your four questions heavily dependent on user evaluations of the initial units, it would make sense for you to wait for the answers. Also, we might be able to get more information on the 1080i to 1080p performance. I'm going to give your questions more thought, I may add them to our section in POST #1 of tests we want to make on the new sets once they are released.

I've added RichNY's two new questions to the ... Items We Would Like To Test, But Need To Wait Until HDTV's Are Released ... area in POST #1. Here are all of the items we have in that section. The new items are number 5 and 6.

1. Do the remote control IR discrete codes work for ALL inputs?

2. Given the increased video processing demands of 1080p, what is the capability of the 68/78/88 series 1080p sets to handle computer/video gaming? Specifically, what is lag?

3. Given the increased video processing required in the 1080p units (68, 78, 88 Series), what steps has Samsung taken to insure that we don't see lip sync issues? Did anyone ask specifically about this concern?

4. Will 1080p be supported on the HDMI input on the 1080p models (68, 78, 88 series)? All of our information collected up to this point indicates that it won't, but it is an important item and many of us hope Samsung will find a way to include it in the final production sets. It should be checked when the sets are released.

5. How will SD broadcasts look on the 1080p sets? How will this compare to SD broadcasts on 720p sets?

6. How will standard DVD's look on the 1080p sets? How will standard DVD's look after being upshifted by the better upshifting DVD players in comparison to standard DVD on the 720p sets? Is there any advantage to the new 1080p sets when playing standard DVD's?

I've added RichNY's two new questions to the ... Items We Would Like To Test, But Need To Wait Until HDTV's Are Released ... area in POST #1.

UCSB--I want to tell you much I appreciate the detailed response you gave to RichNY, after his first post on this forum. Your feedback is always intelligent, polite, well thought-out, and extremely informative. You've done a wonderful job with this thread, and the amount of time you spend with it--which I'm sure can be very consuming all the way around. I'm just amazed at the commitment level and the passion that I see from everyone on this thread, and I just wanted to take a sec to say thanks to you for making it all happen! I think I check in about 3x a day for the latest post--it's becoming an obsession. I've lurked around a few other blogging sites, but the AVS forum, by far, is the ticket for accurate, informative, and interesting information to count on. I hope I can speak on behalf of quite a few members, by saying thanks for keeping up-to-date one of the best threads of any topic, anywhere.

UCSB--I want to tell you much I appreciate the detailed response you gave to RichNY, after his first post on this forum. Your feedback is always intelligent, polite, well thought-out, and extremely informative. You've done a wonderful job with this thread, and the amount of time you spend with it--which I'm sure can be very consuming all the way around. I'm just amazed at the commitment level and the passion that I see from everyone on this thread, and I just wanted to take a sec to say thanks to you for making it all happen! I think I check in about 3x a day for the latest post--it's becoming an obsession. I've lurked around a few other blogging sites, but the AVS forum, by far, is the ticket for accurate, informative, and interesting information to count on. I hope I can speak on behalf of quite a few members, by saying thanks for keeping up-to-date one of the best threads of any topic, anywhere.


I second your thoughts. UCSB - it must be like a part-time job to keep up!!

But you have done a awesome job and I have learned a alot from all your work...

:) ... thanks.

After reading some of these other Threads...such as...New 1080p sets - Straight Deinterlace or 540p upscale? and The point of 1080P...sounds kinda like these 1080P sets are not really future proof...my question is: does not having a 1080P input that bad of a thing...I am not a gamer and I won't be using a computer either...my only hook-ups at this time will be a Dish 811 and a DVD player such as the Samsung 950 which I hope is a decent player. I have a HLN 567 and had a HLP6163 and feel the PQ was great on both of these sets...I also have the HLR6768 on pre-order...do you think the 68 series will look a whole lot better than the 2 sets mentioned above. Starting to get cold feet reading all these threads...need some convincing here that this is the right thing to do...I hope to have this new set for 10 years...my wife told me this is the last TV for a long time...going to finally retire.

Well considering it will be able to show the full HD image 1920x1080 while those other sets can only show 1280x720. It should look much better. I looked at the Qualia 006 1080P set a few weeks ago. That picture was just amazing. If the Samsung 1080P sets look half as good as the Qualia did, it will be an excellent picture. I just with I could justify getting the 67" over the 61" but I just can't especially since I might replace the set in two or 3 years. That extended warranty will make it much easier to sell, and the smaller size will make it much easier to move.

...need some convincing here that this is the right thing to do...
The very best "convincing" available is for you to see for yourself. In three to four weeks, the '68s will be on display in local B&Ms. Go see for yourself. Take your favorite chair, favorite DVD and an appropriate beverage! Get to the point where the salesfolks hand you the remote and go the other way when they see you coming. Take your time. If you do not see a difference or anything worthwhile in the new sets, regardless of what anyone else sees or says, don't do it. As to the pre-order, IMHO, don't let the chance to save some money now be the source of anguish for the next 10 years. If you have pre-ordered with TVA, when you get the call, ask to be moved to the bottom of the list if you are not ready. If you ordered from some other company that will not let you move down the list, cancel the order. Buyer's remorse, whether 6 months or 10 years, is not worth it. Personally, I got into the market for a HDTV in Feb 2005. The wife agreed that I could have $15K out of our household account for a new system. Even though the money is burning a hole in my pocket, I've resolved to wait until I have a chance to first hand compare the PQ of the 1080p's from Samsung, Mitsubishi, Toshiba and JVC (D'ILA) before plunking down my hard earned cash. This means I'll probably not pull the trigger until October or November of this year. In the mean time, I've pulled the money out of the household account and placed it into a separate interest bearing account to ensure it's there when I make the decision. FWIW.

BTW, Happy Retirement.

$15K is a nice budget!

So per the answers to my questions; it seems that noone has seen SD on 1080p, at least noone that has posted. It seems like everything with 1080p is conjecture at this point.
Exactly what I am doing in my decision-making is holding off until I can see the 6168 (hopefully next to a x67) with SD playing on both.
If they are roughly equiv in PQ, I will go with thex68, because even though it seems that hdmi connections are somewhat crippled, it would probably be worth the upcharge to get a bit more of future proofing.
I also dont intend to be buying a set to replace this purchase anytime soon.
Also, I was originally going to buy a 6768, but last week decided to go with 61x and spend the addtl money on DefTech 7002's, possibly new DVD upconverteed player, and remote as this would be best value for these substantial amount of bucks rather than the extra 6 inches (even though as we all know size matters).

The very best "convincing" available is for you to see for yourself. In three to four weeks, the '68s will be on display in local B&Ms. Go see for yourself. Take your favorite chair, favorite DVD and an appropriate beverage! Get to the point where the salesfolks hand you the remote and go the other way when they see you coming. Take your time. If you do not see a difference or anything worthwhile in the new sets, regardless of what anyone else sees or says, don't do it. As to the pre-order, IMHO, don't let the chance to save some money now be the source of anguish for the next 10 years. If you have pre-ordered with TVA, when you get the call, ask to be moved to the bottom of the list if you are not ready. If you ordered from some other company that will not let you move down the list, cancel the order. Buyer's remorse, whether 6 months or 10 years, is not worth it. Personally, I got into the market for a HDTV in Feb 2005. The wife agreed that I could have $15K out of our household account for a new system. Even though the money is burning a hole in my pocket, I've resolved to wait until I have a chance to first hand compare the PQ of the 1080p's from Samsung, Mitsubishi, Toshiba and JVC (D'ILA) before plunking down my hard earned cash. This means I'll probably not pull the trigger until October or November of this year. In the mean time, I've pulled the money out of the household account and placed it into a separate interest bearing account to ensure it's there when I make the decision. FWIW.

BTW, Happy Retirement.


Great Post! Finally, a voice of reason. Why on earth anyone would buy a pig in a poke without eyeballing the massive amount of 1080P sets due this fall is astounding. JVC(which was the best, excluding Qualia, in PQ at the CES is bringing their 1080P D-ILA's out. Toshiba, which is said to be a great 1080P is coming Mitsubishi, LG(which won best in show for DLP's at the CES), not to mention the highly-anticipated Sony SXRD's! You may buy a Samsung 1080P now and be very happy with your decision, or you may realize six months down the road that every other line was better - the point is it's kind of insane to not inspect all these options for yourself before making a large - ticket purchase....

Great Post! Finally, a voice of reason. Why on earth anyone would buy a pig in a poke without eyeballing the massive amount of 1080P sets due this fall is astounding.

I have a very limited space issue to which buying another set would mean 52" sets wouldn't fit where the Sammy 56" does. So if I don't like the Sammy, if isn't worth the cost to me, I will send it back. Otherwise I will be happy with it, irregardless of the quality of other sets which won't fit my room anyways.

So generally I support your attitude but for me, I have been examining sets for over 2 years, eventually you just have to buy. There will always be better sets (cheaper too!!!) but time is money.

So per the answers to my questions; it seems that noone has seen SD on 1080p, at least noone that has posted. It seems like everything with 1080p is conjecture at this point.
Exactly what I am doing in my decision-making is holding off until I can see the 6168 (hopefully next to a x67) with SD playing on both.


Just a quick note concerning SD. A couple days ago the FCC moved up the date in which TV's must have digital receivers. They hope to mandate that all TV's 13" and larger have digital receivers built in by end of year 2006. Larger TV's have to be able to accept digital broadcasts even earlier than that.

"Breaking News
FCC Advances Tuner Mandate
Washington — The Federal Communications Commission voted unanimously to deny a Consumer Electronics Association (CEA) and Consumer Electronics Retailers Association (CERC)petition to remove a phase-in requirement that mandates television manufacturers to include DTV tuners in 50 percent of all televisions measuring 25 inches to 36 inches by July 1, 2005, and will consider proposed new rules that would push up the deadline requiring DTV tuners in all televisions 13-inches and larger to Dec. 31, 2006.
06/09/05 1:07PM"

My point is I don't think, in terms of the life-span of a TV, we have too much time left for SD. Granted, we're in this very awkward transition period between SD and HDTV, but SD's days are numbered. Before you know it, it will be a thing of the past, like the vinyl record album and the laserdisc.

After reading some of these other Threads...such as...New 1080p sets - Straight Deinterlace or 540p upscale? and The point of 1080P...sounds kinda like these 1080P sets are not really future proof...

Nothing is really future proof. The mfgs are developing new models at a rapid pace and it's going to continue for several more years. Two years from now the 2005 model year sets will be ancient history and people will be fretting over whether the 2007 models are really going to be future proof and if they should wait another year or two for prices to drop more.

Like other people said, if you've got cold feet, wait until you can see one in person. The picture is going to stay the same whether a better/newer/faster model comes out or not.

Jon

My point is I don't think, in terms of the life-span of a TV, we have too much time left for SD. Granted, we're in this very awkward transition period between SD and HDTV, but SD's days are numbered. Before you know it, it will be a thing of the past, like the vinyl record album and the laserdisc.

This new rule just requires digital tuners so that eventually the FCC can reallocate the analog UHF and VHF transmission bands. Long-term SD's days are numbered but it'll be around for a long time even if HDTV broadcasts take over. They'll just broadcast SD shows in HD like they are doing today. Where would they come up with HD content all of a sudden? What would they do with all the SD content that exists today? We're going to be stuck with Three's Company reruns for decades. It'll eventually be broadcast in HD, but it'll still be SD content.

This thread is going off topic. My HLR5067 makes even Three's Company in SD almost worth watching!

Jon

Just a quick note concerning SD. A couple days ago the FCC moved up the date in which TV's must have digital receivers. They hope to mandate that all TV's 13" and larger have digital receivers built in by end of year 2006. Larger TV's have to be able to accept digital broadcasts even earlier than that.

My point is I don't think, in terms of the life-span of a TV, we have too much time left for SD. Granted, we're in this very awkward transition period between SD and HDTV, but SD's days are numbered. Before you know it, it will be a thing of the past, like the vinyl record album and the laserdisc.

Isn't the dital receivers in these sets accepting an SD (480i, ATSC) digital signal as opposed to an SD (480i, NTSC) analog signal. So isn't the difference between the two not an SD / HD thing but a Analog / Digital thing that only effects the receivers in these sets?

Do current DLPs do a much better job at digital SD channels than analog SD channels? (When compared to a CRTs difference between digital and analog?)

By the way my Mom's Star Wars laserdiscs are still valuable because they aren't screwed up like the DVDs.

...eventually you just have to buy. There will always be better sets (cheaper too!!!) but time is money.
I whole heartedly agree! "Analysis paralysis" is just as bad, if not worst, than "buyer's remorse." If I were in my old job where time was money, the client is on the phone, my boss is saying "work smarter" for the 10,000th time and we never had all the data, I'd be the proud owner of an HL-P5674 and would not be reading this thread! In the current situation, I believe I have the luxury of a future window in which I will have "all of the data" that's important to me. The trick for me is that I think I've locked onto a set of buying criteria that will not change with every "next great thing" that's rumored. I'm 95% convinced that I'll have a new set before December because I believe current contrast levels are "good enough," 1080p@60Hz capable HDMI is not required to enjoy my investment, lip sync/lag issues are a crap shoot on any make/model, all the models I'm considering WILL have potential problems (smudges, fan noise, color wheels, lamps, slow channel changes, bright spots, not enough inputs, etc.), and available media is not going to change significantly (except for perhaps Blu-Ray & DVD-HD which will likely remain dueling formats and thus on my list of things to avoid) - so, waiting any longer than Fall will not make a difference. My one concern is that I have to delay for some reason until CES 2006. However, right now, I've decided that about the only thing that I could hear in the next CES that would change my decision regarding one of the mentioned 1080p HDTVs is that someone is producing a new set based on a new dlp DMD with mirrors that map 1:1 with a 1920 X 1080 pixel display. I doubt that's going to happen. So, I think I'll be content until late Fall reading and learning from the adventures and misadventures posted on this forum.

(Flame off. Future posts will be on topic. ;) )

I whole heartedly agree! "Analysis paralysis" is just as bad, if not worst, than "buyer's remorse." If I were in my old job where time was money, the client is on the phone, my boss is saying "work smarter" for the 10,000th time and we never had all the data, I'd be the proud owner of an HL-P5674 and would not be reading this thread! In the current situation, I believe I have the luxury of a future window in which I will have "all of the data" that's important to me. The trick for me is that I think I've locked onto a set of buying criteria that will not change with every "next great thing" that's rumored. I'm 95% convinced that I'll have a new set before December because I believe current contrast levels are "good enough," 1080p@60Hz capable HDMI is not required to enjoy my investment, lip sync/lag issues are a crap shoot on any make/model, all the models I'm considering WILL have potential problems (smudges, fan noise, color wheels, lamps, slow channel changes, bright spots, not enough inputs, etc.), and available media is not going to change significantly (except for perhaps Blu-Ray & DVD-HD which will likely remain dueling formats and thus on my list of things to avoid) - so, waiting any longer than Fall will not make a difference. My one concern is that I have to delay for some reason until CES 2006. However, right now, I've decided that about the only thing that I could hear in the next CES that would change my decision regarding one of the mentioned 1080p HDTVs is that someone is producing a new set based on a new dlp DMD with mirrors that map 1:1 with a 1920 X 1080 pixel display. I doubt that's going to happen. So, I think I'll be content until late Fall reading and learning from the adventures and misadventures posted on this forum.

(Flame off. Future posts will be on topic. ;) )



I'm with you baby, can't wait to see the new JVC 1080P D-ILA's, the new Sony 1080P SXRD's, the Award-Winning LG 1080P's, the highly anticipated Mitsubishi and Toshiba 1080P DLPs, the new Samsung 1080P's, and any others, maybe Sharp?, that i left out. I'm coming home with one or two of these babies this Fall or Winter, but not until i've checked them all out personally. I'll also get a bonus of paying less by waiting. Should be some nice buys coming with all this 1080P competition:)

Hi Folks,

Been using this Forum as a base for researching What DLP to buy!
I was really looking forward to the 50" HLR.
I just got back from BB and I am quite disappointed...
Not sure what the store setup is all about tho he had 2 feeds. The "store" cable and a Burnt DVD with "samples" of movies.

I didnt see where the TV was any brighter and actually looked a bit darker than the others.
Whats with the blurry fuzzy looing DVD? I was kinda shocked.
They have a HD feed that looked very nice. While the regular feed looked pretty awfull.

I tried another store to see if there setup was different but I cant seem to find another HLR here in Calgary.

One last thing, there appeared to be smudges/fingerprints on the inside of the screen. Of course u can only seem them a times but there were quite a few and of course once spotted it's hard to not see them!!

As it sits right now I am a bit confused and will hold off any purchase till I get more face time in!

Hi Folks,

Been using this Forum as a base for researching What DLP to buy!
I was really looking forward to the 50" HLR.
I just got back from BB and I am quite disappointed...
Not sure what the store setup is all about tho he had 2 feeds. The "store" cable and a Burnt DVD with "samples" of movies.

I didnt see where the TV was any brighter and actually looked a bit darker than the others.
Whats with the blurry fuzzy looing DVD? I was kinda shocked.
They have a HD feed that looked very nice. While the regular feed looked pretty awfull.

I tried another store to see if there setup was different but I cant seem to find another HLR here in Calgary.

One last thing, there appeared to be smudges/fingerprints on the inside of the screen. Of course u can only seem them a times but there were quite a few and of course once spotted it's hard to not see them!!

As it sits right now I am a bit confused and will hold off any purchase till I get more face time in!

The 720P HLR series has been disappointing, hopefully the 1080P series will be much better.

The 720P HLR series has been disappointing, hopefully the 1080P series will be much better.
Based on the postings in the HL-RXX67 Owners thread, my gut feel is that there are issues but the majority of posters are very happy with their purchase. Granted, the 720P HLR series might be disappointing to some for any number of far flung reasons (real and imaginary) but certainly not to all...

(Divination via entrails is notoriously unreliable. - Mark Twain)

The 720P HLR series has been disappointing, hopefully the 1080P series will be much better.
I'm not debating your statement but ....
based on what other than your personal impression?

I went to Best Buy today, once again in search of a release date. I asked one guy when the Samsung 68 series would be coming in, and he said, "What? What do you mean? Well we have the HLR series." -So I said nevermind, thank you, and found someone who would know what i was talking about.

I found a very kownledgable guy, and when i asked him when he would get them in he said- "definitely not for a while... probably not this YEAR"

I'll probably go to tweeters and Circuit city soon and see what they say.

*PANICKING, DESPERATE FOR A TV*

Isn't "knowledgable Best Buy sales person" an oxymoron? Delayed - maybe, next year - I don't think so.

I was in Magnolia HiFi (San Ramon, CA) over the weekend, and the person I talked to was extremely knowledgeable--at least he knew how to discuss any questions I could bring up! (I was asking lots of questions about the present Mits dlp's in comparison to the Sammy's. Came away leaning even more toward the hlr 7178!) He expects the xx68's to be in the store before the end of June, and the xx78's early in July. Hope he's correct.

FWIW: As I noted above, I was also really shocked at the glary screen of the Qualia 006; it looked to me to every bit as bad as that of the present Mits dlp's, and it's not removable! This feature would rule this set out for me (even if I was willing to pay this much for a tv!).

I'm with you baby, can't wait to see the new JVC 1080P D-ILA's, the new Sony 1080P SXRD's, the Award-Winning LG 1080P's, the highly anticipated Mitsubishi and Toshiba 1080P DLPs, the new Samsung 1080P's, and any others, maybe Sharp?, that i left out. I'm coming home with one or two of these babies this Fall or Winter, but not until i've checked them all out personally. I'll also get a bonus of paying less by waiting. Should be some nice buys coming with all this 1080P competition:)
Hey ho,

I understand what you're saying but at some point you have to commit to buying. I looked around for months at different sets and then decided on the 5685 when I noticed the buzz on the 1080p sets and decided to wait for the 5688 (which I've already got my name on the powerbuy list). I know that 2 weeks after I get my set some new tech will be showing sets at some obscene rate or will have some bell or whistle that I'll wish I had, but hey, that's life. But then I'll here rumors that the newest set will have smell-o-vision or something and then I should have waited another six months. And I'll be in the same boat, watching the same SD signal on the same relatively nice SONY Wega. And all my friends will be telling me how nice Smallville or the Superbowl or some documentary on the life of sea mollusks looked in HDTV and I'll respond "I'm just waiting for the Smell-o-vision sets to come out soon. They're gonna kick a**."

I've been patient now for over a decade, waiting for the technology to mature, content to be available, and the price to be less than my parent's mortgage. Other than HD-DVD/Blu-Ray, which is just around the bend, I think all my requirements have been satisfied.

I know this says this is my first post, but I've been lurking for almost a year looking at everyone's opinions, comments and rants. This site seems great for staying on topic and having real debates without trolling or flame wars. I thank you all for your advice and insight.

...Mike ( aka brazz)

Millerwill, I suspect a "quick edit" might be in order.... :confused:

Millerwill, I suspect a "quick edit" might be in order.... :confused:

Thanks much--have done! (I don't know whether to plead early Alzheimer's onset or just that second glass of wine!)

(I don't know whether to plead early Alzheimer's onset or just that second glass of wine!)

It all depends on if you remember where you put your glass down or not! :eek:


Howdy all, I'm new here.

Well, I got screwed again by my builder! First, they wouldn't run the wire for my surround system(but they WOULD put in plumbing for a sink in the laundry room! Tards) and now they made my media niche smaller than the one in the model. Model = 55" House = 53" I was planning on running a 6168 and just having the screen overlap sit flush over the wall while the rest of the TV sits in the niche cutout. Now that it's 53", its either have it stick out a bit further (around 3-3.5" as opposed to the 2" of just the screen) than before or step down to a 56", which measures 52.4", and have it sit nice and flush in the media niche. Is 5" THAT much of a difference in a TV. The price difference is only about $300 I think in the PB. So that's not an issue. Should I stay with the 61" and have it stick out a little bit of the niche or go nice and flush with the 56"? I'm stepping up from a Sony XBR 32" CRT by the way. Arrrggghhh! Kind of a vent post too! Sorry

I was in Magnolia HiFi (San Ramon, CA) over the weekend, and the person I talked to was extremely knowledgeable--at least he knew how to discuss any questions I could bring up! (I was asking lots of questions about the present Mits dlp's in comparison to the Sammy's. Came away leaning even more toward the hlr 7178!) He expects the xx68's to be in the store before the end of June, and the xx78's early in July. Hope he's correct.

FWIW: As I noted above, I was also really shocked at the glary screen of the Qualia 006; it looked to me to every bit as bad as that of the present Mits dlp's, and it's not removable! This feature would rule this set out for me (even if I was willing to pay this much for a tv!).


Miller - I'm up in Walnut Creek and plan on buying an HLR-6167 next month from the San Ramon Magnolia - I'm hoping that prices will drop dramatically on the 67 series when the new 68's come out - I don't need 1080p, I'm happy enough with a reduced-price 6167

drago88: Glad to meet a neighbor! I agree that the xx67's look awfully nice; I think you're making a sound choice. Though I have had very good experience with Mag HiFi (in Emeryville, but I'm San Ramon is the same), be sure to check out the TVA Power Buy; it's an extremely good deal, and TVA has an excellent reputation for their service even though it's not as convenient as a local B&M.

I see the Samsung Canada (Samsung.ca) is listing a 42, 46 and 50 inch HLRxx64 DLP.

I can't find any info on these sets in Post #1, and this HLRxx64 version seems to be 720p, and not 1080.

Does anyone have anything to offer in the way of info regarding these machines. Is there going to be a 56 inch or 61 inch version?

Will Samsung offer the 1080 version at all in Canada?

Any help appreciated.

Peter

I took the plunge with TV Authority's Power Buy for a Samsung HLR6168W. Can't wait! The STAND that the TV sits on in the photos from the January CES show in Vegas looks really nice. Like it was custom made for the set. Does anyone know where I could purchase the same stand?

Doesn't Magnolia have a 60(!) day price protection policy? One of the guys in there (the Roseville store, that is) told me they did, but I'm not sure I've seen it in writing. If this is policy, you might be making a good bet!

will there be 1080p DLPs in a size that is smaller than 50"?

will there be 1080p DLPs in a size that is smaller than 50"?
That's very unlikely. The difference between 720p and 1080p would be hard to detect in sets that small.

I was at Abt Electronics (Chicago suburbs) this weekend working with their custom install manager and he expects the 78 series in the next 1-2 weeks. They are taking pre-orders on their website. Off-topic, but I still can't figure out why I shouldn't just buy a 65" Mitsu CRT for $2k to get me by for the next couple years while the rest of the HDTV technology stabilizes. The picture looks awesome. But 1080P is certainly something I am leaning towards.

Doesn't Magnolia have a 60(!) day price protection policy? One of the guys in there (the Roseville store, that is) told me they did, but I'm not sure I've seen it in writing. If this is policy, you might be making a good bet!

Yes they do. I was in Mag today at lunch in Roseville and they do have a 60 day price protection. But their price is nowhere near the TVA PB price for the 56". And now I'm forced to go with the 56" instead of the 61" due to future house building issue. They are a good $850 more than the PB. Sooooo I guess I'll be hooking up the PB on the 56". And yes, I'm sure there might be something out later this year superior or better. But we can all play the "what if" game. Cuz when those come out, 6 months later something new will be out, etc. So for the price...I'm biting!

I was at Abt Electronics (Chicago suburbs) this weekend working with their custom install manager and he expects the 78 series in the next 1-2 weeks. They are taking pre-orders on their website. Off-topic, but I still can't figure out why I shouldn't just buy a 65" Mitsu CRT for $2k to get me by for the next couple years while the rest of the HDTV technology stabilizes. The picture looks awesome. But 1080P is certainly something I am leaning towards.Abt's is a awesome store...been there many times...drooling!

Yes they do. I was in Mag today at lunch in Roseville and they do have a 60 day price protection. But their price is nowhere near the TVA PB price for the 56". And now I'm forced to go with the 56" instead of the 61" due to future house building issue. They are a good $850 more than the PB. Sooooo I guess I'll be hooking up the PB on the 56". And yes, I'm sure there might be something out later this year superior or better. But we can all play the "what if" game. Cuz when those come out, 6 months later something new will be out, etc. So for the price...I'm biting!

Check out circuitcity.com. They have a terrific price on the HLR 5667 (as pointed out by someone on this thread). Something to think about if you prefer the convenience of a B&M store.

I see the Samsung Canada (Samsung.ca) is listing a 42, 46 and 50 inch HLRxx64 DLP.

I can't find any info on these sets in Post #1, and this HLRxx64 version seems to be 720p, and not 1080.

Does anyone have anything to offer in the way of info regarding these machines. Is there going to be a 56 inch or 61 inch version?

Will Samsung offer the 1080 version at all in Canada?

Any help appreciated.

Peter

Hey Pete here is a thread in Digital Home Canada with all the info you'll require.
Please read all.http://www.digitalhomecanada.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20576

I know this has been answered many times, but there are so many opinions. What would be a good compromise for my setup...I am getting ready to get all the cables I need for my new 5668.

I have an HK AVR 225, a Panny DVD with Component, and will have an E* DVR 942.

I will hook up the DVD with Component (and then be in the market for a new DVD to match the TV capabilities).

The receiver has optical, coax, RGA video and S video. Looking for advice here.

As well, the DVR looks like it will have HDMI, Component, optical outputs. With audio sync issues, what is the suggestion here.

I appreciate the help. I am not a whiz with connections (you don't even want to know how I have my current Proscan CRT wired!)

I took the plunge with TV Authority's Power Buy for a Samsung HLR6168W. Can't wait! The STAND that the TV sits on in the photos from the January CES show in Vegas looks really nice. Like it was custom made for the set. Does anyone know where I could purchase the same stand?

I'm in agreement. I checked with TVA and the stand they offer is not the same as the one in the CES pics. Anyone have an idea where to find it?

GOD DAMNIT I WANT MY TV ;_;

Someone hurry up and get a HLR6168 so I can bug my installer to go hunting :)

- D

Anybody thinking about getting the Oppo DV971H DVD player for their Samsung 68/78 series TV. I have the Samsung HD950 coming Thursday and I am thinking about returning it after looking at the Oppo DV971H thread in the DVD player area...it sounds like a great player.

Anybody thinking about getting the Oppo DV971H DVD player for their Samsung 68/78 series TV. I have the Samsung HD950 coming Thursday and I am thinking about returning it after looking at the Oppo DV971H thread in the DVD player area...it sounds like a great player.

I'm thinking about the OPPO and the Samsung DVD-HD950. It is a funny situation, there seems to be an unlimited amount of info on the OPPO and unfortunately little authoritative, reliable data on the 950 yet. I'm sure with units shipping more data will start to come together on the 950 soon. I was hoping that we would get some technical information on the processing and chips in the 950.

I see the Samsung Canada (Samsung.ca) is listing a 42, 46 and 50 inch HLRxx64 DLP.

I can't find any info on these sets in Post #1, and this HLRxx64 version seems to be 720p, and not 1080.

Does anyone have anything to offer in the way of info regarding these machines. Is there going to be a 56 inch or 61 inch version?

Will Samsung offer the 1080 version at all in Canada?

Any help appreciated.

Peter

Hi Peter ... schaffer970 noticed the manuals for the 64 series units on the FCC site a month or so ago. Perhaps if you search this thread you can find the links. I didn't added them to POST #1 because it was not clear where they were going to be sold. Perhaps I should add a little Canada only section to POST #1 with a few links.

ADDED: Here is schaffer970's original 64 series post:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5672113&&#post5672113

GOD DAMNIT I WANT MY TV :)

- D

Hi D ... hang in there!!! We are all excited. Isn't today the 14th ... I wonder if the PowerBuy TV's are on the way to TV Authority's Sacramento warehouse? :)

Hi D ... hang in there!!! We are all excited. Isn't today the 14th ... I wonder if the PowerBuy TV's are on the way to TV Authority's Sacramento warehouse?

I doubt it. Samsung and TVA when called state late june early july now.

I'm thinking about the OPPO and the Samsung DVD-HD950. It is a funny situation, there seems to be an unlimited amount of info on the OPPO and unfortunately little authoritative, reliable data on the 950 yet. I'm sure with units shipping more data will start to come together on the 950 soon. I was hoping that we would get some technical information on the processing and chips in the 950.I called Samsung and Vanns and they both said it had the DCDi chip, so I ordered it...coming Thursday...find out today it has the Zoran chip just like the HD850...a couple of owners on the DVD forum open up their boxes and seen it had the Zoran 778 not the DCDi...it's amazing that Samsung verified to me that it had it...Man you can not trust any of the CSR's from samsung. Also I received a email from Samsung engineering/tech and the 68/78 series will not have a 1080P input . Hope they are wrong again. Looks like the Samsung 950 is out...looks like the Oppo is in.

I just called Samsung and was informed that my HLR5688W along with the other 1080p models have now for whatever reason been pushed back once again to mid July. Too bad for anyone who had been looking forward to receiving their new 1080p DLP this month.

I just called Samsung and was informed that my HLR5688W along with the other 1080p models have now for whatever reason been pushed back once again to mid July. Too bad for anyone who had been looking forward to receiving their new 1080p DLP this month.Same thing with the 68/78 series...hopefully August :eek:

Yes. Too bad for me.This is taking forever and to complicate matters, I am moving to a new house at the end of this month.

In

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5757122#post5757122

info was posted about the delay. About a month delay so far.

At the bottom of the sell sheet for the 68 series it says:

Currently, HDMI, DVI and Component inputs can only accept up to 1080i signals.
All 1080i signals are converted to 1080p. Off-air 1080p signals are displayed in their
broadcast format.

Other specs and info are in the pdf file in the link above.