50" will be better. There has never been a Samsung upgrade program on DLP (except if your TV was unrepairable in warranty or had 3 serious repair visits and it was still broken).

In fact Samsung did offer an upgrade in 2003 for the owners of the original HLM models. The upgrade cost $200 and fixed some usability issues and introduced DNIe on those models. The digital board replacement effectively upgraded the HLM to an HLN.

In fact Samsung did offer an upgrade in 2003 for the owners of the original HLM models. The upgrade cost $200 and fixed some usability issues and introduced DNIe on those models. The digital board replacement effectively upgraded the HLM to an HLN.

Yes ... there was that board level upgrade and the lip sync fixs on the HLN models, but I think the original question was is there a program to exchange (upgrade) from last year's HLP to a new HLR.

Then maybe I should just wait and see the 1080p before I buy something. Its just hard with the NFL season coming and primetime tv shows.


I would highly recommend checking out the 1080p's just about anywhere but
Fry's...

You can also get one from TVA with a 30 day zero cost return privelage ( you only
pay the shipping and insurance back to them ).

I finally seen the HLR6178 at Tweeters today and have to say the glossy bezel looks pretty nice...and I did not see any reflections what so ever...PQ was really sweet...but I have to give Sony a good rating on their new 3 lcd a20 that was next to it...also they are discounting all Mits 2005 dlp's...I am getting real antsy for my 6768...when I talked to Steve P on Monday he said they are being shipped between 8-5 and 8-9 and B&M will get them first...they were delayed because of the light engine.

westa6969,

Can you post some pictures of your bello AVS-2663 stand? Also can you verify that there is 7 3/4 inches (200 mm) of usable space on the top shelf? I have a center channel that is 7 inches tall and want to verify that it will fit before I order the stand. I was looking at this stand on the Bello site and it looks very good.

Thanks,

Jeff

ok I am planning to buy a dlp nest weekend and I have confused on if I should get the toshiba 52hm84 or the samsung hlr5067w?
I am going to play alot of games. I heard a lag issue with Samsungs tvs is this true or is it will dlp sets?
I want to hook up my pc and game on it?
hook up hd cable and dvd player using component on both.
I plan on getting a hddvd player or blur ray when they come out.
In your honest opion which tv should I get and what should I beware about?

How will these tv's perform with the upcomming HD-DVD players. Will these tv's be able to display the 1080p signal these new DVD players will output at?

~Josh

HD-DVD will only be in 1080i according to Toshiba.

^But then they will have HD-DVDs that have progressive scan and all will be great :)

I dont know if anyone else has notice, but with the new 1080p sets coming in has made the 720p sets drop by ALOT! Check what kind of price you can get the 5067w on TVA or OneCall now. Very cheap! So tempting but I have to wait to see how the 5078 series looks

I dont know if anyone else has notice, but with the new 1080p sets coming in has made the 720p sets drop by ALOT! Check what kind of price you can get the 5067w on TVA or OneCall now. Very cheap! So tempting but I have to wait to see how the 5078 series looks
Yes I have. I even posted it before. $1000 less than the same size in the 1080p. So are the 1080p sets worth 1000 more than the 720p?

Yes I have. I even posted it before. $1000 less than the same size in the 1080p. So are the 1080p sets worth 1000 more than the 720p?

The HLR 6178W is on display at Eletronics Expo in Woodbridge NJ. Picture was bright clear and sharp. To my eye there was a significant difference to the 720P sets it was next to. It would be worth it for me. Viewing conditons were pretty good. Dimmed lighting in side room. They have the 61" in stock for thirtysix hundred that included ten percent off and they were offering no interest until january two thousand and seven. The 50" and 56" to follow in the next few weeks they also said they would have the Mitsubishi's 1080P sets in stock about the same time.

How will these tv's perform with the upcomming HD-DVD players. Will these tv's be able to display the 1080p signal these new DVD players will output at?

~Josh

Yes. Definitely.

HD-DVD will store and output video at 1080i ( from a 1080p24fps master ).

Blu-ray may store video at 1080p but will certainly output 1080i which
the 1080p sets will de-interlace and display at 1080p without artificating.

Has no one seen the HLR5656 at Costco? They are selling it with matching stand for an ok price.

I did a search of the first post and the whole thread and couldn't find mention of it.

It's also on the Costco website -- although there they call it the HLR5656C while the store model appeared to be the HLR5656 WX.

Has no one seen the HLR5656 at Costco? They are selling it with matching stand for an ok price.

I did a search of the first post and the whole thread and couldn't find mention of it.

It's also on the Costco website -- although there they call it the HLR5656C while the store model appeared to be the HLR5656 WX.

I'll add the 56 series to POST #1.

I'll add the 56 series to POST #1. Hmmm... Smells a bit Canadian... wonder if the donkey veered to far south?

Hmmm... Smells a bit Canadian... wonder if the donkey veered to far south.

It looks like the 56 series is a special version that is being sold through discounters, like Costco. In the past, Costco has often just sold discontinued models, but this looks like a repackage of last years 63 series.

Re the delay in the 6768 and 7178, I wonder if the brightness of the picture is something Samsung is having second thoughts about. They are spec'ed at present to have a 120 watt lamp, but that is only 20% more than the 100 watt lamp of the smaller sets. Question: do people with the 61" sets find them to be plenty bright? They are presumably not as bright as the 5078 that first came out and people reported as being so spectacularly bright. For comparison, the Mits 73" sets are supposed to have a 150 watt lamp. Anybody more knowledgeable than me have any thoughts on this?

Re the delay in the 6768 and 7178, I wonder if the brightness of the picture is something Samsung is having second thoughts about. They are spec'ed at present to have a 120 watt lamp, but that is only 20% more than the 100 watt lamp of the smaller sets. Question: do people with the 61" sets find them to be plenty bright? They are presumably not as bright as the 5078 that first came out and people reported as being so spectacularly bright. For comparison, the Mits 73" sets are supposed to have a 150 watt lamp. Anybody more knowledgeable than me have any thoughts on this?

The 6168 is a tad dark with Movie mode but very acceptable in a dark environment.

Dynamic mode is almost "too" bright...

The 6168 is a tad dark with Movie mode but very acceptable in a dark environment.

Dynamic mode is almost "too" bright...

I don't think I would ever want to use Dynamic mode. I use Cinema mode (Movie mode) on my 6163 essentially all the time. I think it is supposed to be closer to the ideal 'color temperature' (forget precisely what that is).

I don't think I would ever want to use Dynamic mode. I use Cinema mode (Movie mode) on my 6163 essentially all the time. I think it is supposed to be closer to the ideal 'color temperature' (forget precisely what that is).

Samsung appears to be doing something special with Movie mode because
I can't seem to duplicate the PQ with 'Custom' and duplicate settings.

Movie mode rocks especially with shadow detail, etc. but is a tad dark
to watch in a bright room during the day.

I primarily watch TV in the evenings so this not a problem. If I did watch a great
deal of TV during the day and could not control the lighting, I would probably
move to the 56 in. since it has the same watt bulb as the 61 in. and less screen area.

The 6168 is a tad dark with Movie mode but very acceptable in a dark environment.

Dynamic mode is almost "too" bright...

I have a 6168 and it is really quite acceptably bright. :cool: Movie mode is perfect for night-time viewing with the lights down low, and I actually like Dynamic mode during the daytime especially for good quality HD programming. For daytime viewing of SD or not-so-perfect HD programming, the Standard mode seems to hide the source PQ flaws a bit better. Note... I haven't done any tweaking to the settings at all yet.

I have a 6168 and it is really quite acceptably bright. :cool: Movie mode is perfect for night-time viewing with the lights down low, and I actually like Dynamic mode during the daytime especially for good quality HD programming. For daytime viewing of SD or not-so-perfect HD programming, the Standard mode seems to hide the source PQ flaws a bit better. Note... I haven't done any tweaking to the settings at all yet.

Thanks - I havn't checked out Standard mode for daytime SD vs. Dyamic mode for daytime HD yet..

Does anybody know any reputable dealer on East Coast carrying HLR 5678W ??

I have been waiting for Tweeter in Raleigh to get mine. I ordered 7/4 and it was due in the Atlanta warehouse on 7/22, then 7/29, then, 8/3, then 8/9, and I just called and now it is 8/17!!! :mad:

I have no faith they will get them on 8/17 and want one here by next week. Too bad item is to big for UPS/FedEx, I would have had one here by now.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,
George

Does anybody know any reputable dealer on East Coast carrying HLR 5678W ??

I have been waiting for Tweeter in Raleigh to get mine. I ordered 7/4 and it was due in the Atlanta warehouse on 7/22, then 7/29, then, 8/3, then 8/9, and I just called and now it is 8/17!!! :mad:

I have no faith they will get them on 8/17 and want one here by next week. Too bad item is to big for UPS/FedEx, I would have had one here by now.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,
George
I like many are waiting as well..As posted below I know the 61" are physically here on the east coast and the 50s and 56s will follow soon. I am also in contact with Stuarts audio in Westfield NJ. They will call when they have on on display. see below.. I know if you follow a link on the Samsung website they have authorized dealers who have up to the minute stock availibilty on the products. I was looking at crutchfield and vanns who had stock on one or two pieces in that size range but they wanted the same price as you can get a 61" for from local stores in NJ.

The HLR 6178W is on display at Eletronics Expo in Woodbridge NJ. Picture was bright clear and sharp. To my eye there was a significant difference to the 720P sets it was next to. It would be worth it for me. Viewing conditons were pretty good. Dimmed lighting in side room. They have the 61" in stock for thirtysix hundred that included ten percent off and they were offering no interest until january two thousand and seven. The 50" and 56" to follow in the next few weeks they also said they would have the Mitsubishi's 1080P sets in stock about the same time.

What do you think? Right or wrong decision?
I think you are in control until 30 days from the day you buy a TV. :D

It looks like the 56 series is a special version that is being sold through discounters, like Costco. In the past, Costco has often just sold discontinued models, but this looks like a repackage of last years 63 series.

I've got one of these (Costco hlr5656)and can answer questions. Is there a service mode or something where I can get more info?

HD-DVD will store and output video at 1080i ( from a 1080p24fps master ).



Not true. It has been confirmed by Amir that all 1080p sourced material is encoded as such in HD-DVD i.e. all film based HD-DVDs. See this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5662717&highlight=1080p#post5662717).

Not true. It has been confirmed by Amir that all 1080p sourced material is encoded as such in HD-DVD i.e. all film based HD-DVDs. See this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5662717&highlight=1080p#post5662717).

Not sure who Amir is but the source for film is 1080p24fps whether or not they
store as this on HD-DVD. Doesn't matter as long as HD-DVD provides the capability
to output 1080i ( which they are ) then the Samsung will recover the same quality PQ by de-interlacing.

Did Samsung discontinue the HL-R4677W ?
I just noticed that Samsung USA has moved it to the Archive section.

Not sure who Amir is but the source for film is 1080p24fps whether or not they
store as this on HD-DVD. Doesn't matter as long as HD-DVD provides the capability
to output 1080i ( which they are ) then the Samsung will recover the same quality PQ by de-interlacing.

Amir is the Microsoft Windows Media group VP. You should follow the "Latest Hi-Def DVD News" thread in the HiDef media forum ... has some 9,800 posts now, though ;)

Latest Hi-Def DVD News (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=411600).

There was some discussion about why interlacing + de-interlacing can never give you the same PQ here. I will post the links when I find them.

Lack of 1080p inputs over HDMI is the single reason why I decided not to buy this year's Samsung "1080p"s. I think it is ironic that 1080p sets can't take 1080p inputs over HDMI.

Hi all,

Started going thru all the posts in this thread, but burned out after a while ;)

Hooked up my new HR10-250 to my new Samsung DLP HLR5067W TV via the HDMI cable. The good news is that the picture is stunning, however, in the HR10 menu I set the Audio option to play & record in Dolby Digital when available. When I turn this option on, all video/audio on Standard non-HD channels is great. However, when I change to any HD channel the video still is great but there's no Audio whatsoever coming through the Samsung HLR5067W. I do also have the optical hooked up between the HR10 and my stereo receiver, and I do get audio that way via the receiver, BUT you can't tell me that the only way to get Audio on HD channels with the Dolby Digital option switched on is to listen through the receiver. I'm sure there's some option either on my DLP or HR10 that can accomodate this, but I'm stumped. Hoping someone out there has the same set-up as me and can offer some advice. Thanks in advance.

I do also have the optical hooked up between the HR10 and my stereo receiver, and I do get audio that way via the receiver, BUT you can't tell me that the only way to get Audio on HD channels with the Dolby Digital option switched on is to listen through the receiver. I'm sure there's some option either on my DLP or HR10 that can accomodate this, but I'm stumped. Hoping someone out there has the same set-up as me and can offer some advice. Thanks in advance. I have a similar setup with the HR10 and the Samsung HLR4677. I don't have your specific problem because I don't connect the digital audio from the HR10 to the TV (only to my receiver). One possible solution would be to connect the analog audio out from the HR10 to the TV. The analog outputs are always downmixed to stereo regardless of the Dolby Digital setting on the HR10. Personally I see no advantage or reason to using a digital audio connection to your TV since it only has 2 (low fidelity) speakers anyway. Good luck.

Jay

Can I ask a really low-tech, newbie question? What determines the color (black or gray) of the bars on the sides of the set when in 4:3 mode? Is it the Sammy or the source or the STB? I would prefer black over the current gray on my 6168, though I'm relatively certain I don't have any ability to change them.

Thanks!

I have a similar setup with the HR10 and the Samsung HLR4677. I don't have your specific problem because I don't connect the digital audio from the HR10 to the TV (only to my receiver). One possible solution would be to connect the analog audio out from the HR10 to the TV. The analog outputs are always downmixed to stereo regardless of the Dolby Digital setting on the HR10. Personally I see no advantage or reason to using a digital audio connection to your TV since it only has 2 (low fidelity) speakers anyway. Good luck.

Jay

Jay,

I do the same with my digital audio, ie straight from the HR10-250 to my audio receiver. However, where would I connect my analog audio to on my Samsung ? There's an input for the HDMI on the TV, but there looks to be no corresponding analog inputs associated. How were you able to connect these analog audio into the TV ?

Amir is the Microsoft Windows Media group VP. You should follow the "Latest Hi-Def DVD News" thread in the HiDef media forum ... has some 9,800 posts now, though ;)

Latest Hi-Def DVD News (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=411600).

There was some discussion about why interlacing + de-interlacing can never give you the same PQ here. I will post the links when I find them.

Lack of 1080p inputs over HDMI is the single reason why I decided not to buy this year's Samsung "1080p"s. I think it is ironic that 1080p sets can't take 1080p inputs over HDMI.

That is great that Amir has over 9000 posts :-)

If 1080p source is stored or transmitted at 1080i and the de-interlace is
done correctly there is absolutely *no* difference in PQ.

The problem is when a 1080i camera is used and then this is de-interlaced
to 1080p since a 1080i camera records the first 540 frame at t0 and
the second 540 frame at t0+1. Therefore de-interlacing this introduces temporal
artifacts.

The only people who should be concerned regarding a 1080p input
on any TV at this point is future PlayStation3 owners and those
with high-end scalers.

Film is mastered at 1080p24fps so the above issues is not a problem.

Did Samsung discontinue the HL-R4677W ?
I just noticed that Samsung USA has moved it to the Archive section.

I've updated POST #1 to indicate that the 4677 has been discontinued. This is a low volume product, so if anyone is interested in buying one ... you should pick it up now.

Hi all,

Started going thru all the posts in this thread, but burned out after a while ;)

Hooked up my new HR10-250 to my new Samsung DLP HLR5067W TV via the HDMI cable. The good news is that the picture is stunning, however, in the HR10 menu I set the Audio option to play & record in Dolby Digital when available. When I turn this option on, all video/audio on Standard non-HD channels is great. However, when I change to any HD channel the video still is great but there's no Audio whatsoever coming through the Samsung HLR5067W. I do also have the optical hooked up between the HR10 and my stereo receiver, and I do get audio that way via the receiver, BUT you can't tell me that the only way to get Audio on HD channels with the Dolby Digital option switched on is to listen through the receiver. I'm sure there's some option either on my DLP or HR10 that can accomodate this, but I'm stumped. Hoping someone out there has the same set-up as me and can offer some advice. Thanks in advance.

This is because the HDMI cable does not carry dolby digital 5.1 audio across the cable. It is only stereo. (This is not an HDMI cable limitation - just an implementation issue.)

If you go into your set up (Tivo) and change it to stereo, you will get sound from your TV on all channels - standard and HD.

If you want DD.... just use your AVR and output the sound via external speakers.

Jay,

I do the same with my digital audio, ie straight from the HR10-250 to my audio receiver. However, where would I connect my analog audio to on my Samsung ? There's an input for the HDMI on the TV, but there looks to be no corresponding analog inputs associated. How were you able to connect these analog audio into the TV ?I probably should have stated that I currently don't use HDMI. I am using component so I don't connect any audio to my TV. All the audio goes through my AV receiver. However there is a "DVI in" analog audio jack on your TV that should work. You might need to use an HDMI/DVI adapter. I have not tried this but it should work because that is how you do it with a DVI device.

I used to have my TVs setup so that sometimes I would use the TV's internal speakers and sometimes use the receiver/speakers. For one reason or another this always caused some problems so I made the decision to never use the TV speakers. It has made everthing so much simpler. Something you might want to consider. Good luck.

Jay

This is because the HDMI cable does not carry dolby digital 5.1 audio across the cable. It is only stereo. (This is not an HDMI cable limitation - just an implementation issue.)

If you go into your set up (Tivo) and change it to stereo, you will get sound from your TV on all channels - standard and HD.

If you want DD.... just use your AVR and output the sound via external speakers.

Agreed. The easiest way is to definitely set the Tivo option to output/record in Stereo (not Dolby digital) to be able to watch/listen to all shows via the TV without having the stereo receiver on. However, I wonder if that by setting that option off, will I never be outputting audio from the HR10-250 via the optical out ? I like to listen to the music channels off the satellite via the optical out to my receiver. Plus, if I record a show with the Dolby Digital option off, I'll never be able to hear that show in DD - it'll always be in regular stereo.

Okay, first post, here we go...
so the amount of information, in this thread and others, is staggering. Amazingly helpful. Just thought I'd seek out a couple pieces of advice:

1) With all the recent posts about screen size versus viewing distance, I feel the paranoia setting in that perhaps I am trying to go too large. I was looking forward to the new 50" Samsung DLP, but I'd be watching it at around 7 feet; considerably closer than what most of you are mentioning. I've done some basic measuring/watching of the older Samsung's in Best Buy, but am I asking for trouble/headaches in the long term?

2) I'm desperately trying to find a TV stand that isn't too wide (46-50"; just big enough for the 50" Sammy) but can also hold, among other equipment, my HK 635, which is pretty high and deep. Most every stand I find is either too wide or doesn't have appropriate shelf space.

and finally

3) I live in NYC, and when I go to the Samsung store, their DLP's look like heaven. Then I go to Best Buy, and they look, for the most part, kinda lame. Is it wrong to assume/hope that if I buy this tv, I'll be receiving the better of these two worlds, or is there all sorts of crazy mojo going on at the Samsung stores that make it look so much better?

Any input would be GREATLY appreciated. Again, you people rock.

Answer to question 3, Signal problem with Best Buy, that is why. These sets rock!!! The TV is only as good as the signal that you get. :)

Has anybody tried connecting their STB or DVD to their Samsung TV using the IEEE-1394 interface?

back from vacation and all caught up! i must admit i kinda cheated by skimming alot though :D

I saw the 6168 at the thousand oaks magnolia, and it was nice, but i was still dissapointed. It was very bright but, but the detail was somewhat lacking compared to the mitsubishi next to it.

Is there any new news on the 6768? i was thinking maybe since there's such a big delay to the east coast that it might be possible that they're just gonna release the entire 68 series all at once over here?

[QUOTE=arghiwannabigtv]
I saw the 6168 at the thousand oaks magnolia, and it was nice, but i was still dissapointed. It was very bright but, but the detail was somewhat lacking compared to the mitsubishi next to it.

Which Mitsubishi was this? One of the new 1080p's?

Is there any new news on the 6768?

Yes; they are delayed until sometime in Sept.

I saw the 6168 at the thousand oaks magnolia, and it was nice, but i was still dissapointed. It was very bright but, but the detail was somewhat lacking compared to the mitsubishi next to it.

Which Mitsubishi was this? One of the new 1080p's?

Is there any new news on the 6768?

Yes; they are delayed until sometime in Sept.


Is there any new news on the 6768?

Yes; they are delayed until sometime in Sept.

It was one of the 720p's :(

ahhh! wher'd that news come from??????

I've been waiting since the Japanese invented HighDef to buy a 1080p TV that didn't suffer burn-in (Panasonic's 20-year plasma statement is malarky) and didn't drive my pixel-sensitive retina crazy! The Samsung 6168/6178 absolutely does not fill that bill. I sat with the 6178 at Scottsdale's Ultimate Electronics store (near the 101 freeway) and almost cried everytime even small amonts of fast motion crept onto the screen. My God the pixelization problems!!! I had it up against a few Panasonic LCDs while watching the Mitsubishi HiDef production program material on all pieces and the Panasonic and Sharp Aquos pieces beat the Samsung piece handsdown for smoothness (minimization of pixelization) and for absence of fast-motion blur/smudge. I was ready to buy the Samsung 6168 today until I found out the following:

Samsung had the audacity to make us wait at least one more year for a set with a 1080p INPUT! What gives??? A few more pennies and 1080p input to output could have been had...but no. The Samsung tech in North Jersey said, "These units are almost perfect, so I guess they had to leave something undone so they could release something new next year! (Unbelievable....I am ready to hurl South Korean chunks!)

I don't know why the pixels smear/smudge/grow on fast motion, but this is unacceptable. No, the unit (6178) was not defective....the 6168 did the same thing last night at the desert Ridge outdoor mall in N. Phoenix. Electronically and topologically identical, the 68 and 78 differ by over a retail grand and by a little bit of fake black "lacquer." Now where can I find a good 61" diagonal LCD HDTV?

What gives with the seven segment color wheel? Could this be causing the noticablity of pixels on demanding fast motion? I'd like to better understand the correllation, if any.

For me, plasma is out (a defective technology IMHO...nothing like all those highly energetic strange and charmed quarks and a few vibrating strings to eat away at those short lived phosphor coatings. Can anyone think of a plasma less errosive than plasma?

Samsung has dedicated substantial attention to their DLP line....again, IMHO, more than any other manufacturer...so for this to be the result of all that work....I am shocked.

LCD may be my only hope, Obi Wan....in a few years when the larger liquid crystal matrices are "perfected" by companies like Samsung (in progress even as I speak).

So, does anyone out their have any consoling words for me...? Please, someone tell me why I am wrong here. Thank God Prozac is now generic!

I spoke with Mitsubishi today...the DLP 62" Diamondvision units will be out in November and allegedly will be 1080p from inputs to outputs (like the Samsung line should have been!). And word has it that they will blow the knickers off the Samsung phake 1080p R-series. And they have done away with the glare glass

I spoke with Mitsubishi today...the DLP 62" Diamondvision units will be out in November and allegedly will be 1080p from inputs to outputs (like the Samsung line should have been!). And word has it that they will blow the knickers off the Samsung phake 1080p R-series. And they have done away with the glare glass
No disrepect to you intended but I'll believe it when I see it. And, I am waiting to see it. (BTW, one dumb idea putting the DVR into the Diamond series!)

I spoke with Mitsubishi today...the DLP 62" Diamondvision units will be out in November and allegedly will be 1080p from inputs to outputs (like the Samsung line should have been!). And word has it that they will blow the knickers off the Samsung phake 1080p R-series. And they have done away with the glare glassYeah good luck...Just like they were going to release the first 1080P's...3 units and haven't heard about them since...Good job Mitsubishi!!!!!

I've been waiting since the Japanese invented HighDef to buy a 1080p TV that didn't suffer burn-in (Panasonic's 20-year plasma statement is malarky) and didn't drive my pixel-sensitive retina crazy! The Samsung 6168/6178 absolutely does not fill that bill. I sat with the 6178 at Scottsdale's Ultimate Electronics store (near the 101 freeway) and almost cried everytime even small amonts of fast motion crept onto the screen. My God the pixelization problems!!! I had it up against a few Panasonic LCDs while watching the Mitsubishi HiDef production program material on all pieces and the Panasonic and Sharp Aquos pieces beat the Samsung piece handsdown for smoothness (minimization of pixelization) and for absence of fast-motion blur/smudge. I was ready to buy the Samsung 6168 today until I found out the following:

Samsung had the audacity to make us wait at least one more year for a set with a 1080p INPUT! What gives??? A few more pennies and 1080p input to output could have been had...but no. The Samsung tech in North Jersey said, "These units are almost perfect, so I guess they had to leave something undone so they could release something new next year! (Unbelievable....I am ready to hurl South Korean chunks!)

I don't know why the pixels smear/smudge/grow on fast motion, but this is unacceptable. No, the unit (6178) was not defective....the 6168 did the same thing last night at the desert Ridge outdoor mall in N. Phoenix. Electronically and topologically identical, the 68 and 78 differ by over a retail grand and by a little bit of fake black "lacquer." Now where can I find a good 61" diagonal LCD HDTV?

What gives with the seven segment color wheel? Could this be causing the noticablity of pixels on demanding fast motion? I'd like to better understand the correllation, if any.

For me, plasma is out (a defective technology IMHO...nothing like all those highly energetic strange and charmed quarks and a few vibrating strings to eat away at those short lived phosphor coatings. Can anyone think of a plasma less errosive than plasma?

Samsung has dedicated substantial attention to their DLP line....again, IMHO, more than any other manufacturer...so for this to be the result of all that work....I am shocked.

LCD may be my only hope, Obi Wan....in a few years when the larger liquid crystal matrices are "perfected" by companies like Samsung (in progress even as I speak).

So, does anyone out their have any consoling words for me...? Please, someone tell me why I am wrong here. Thank God Prozac is now generic!

In store video distribution systems (or the original broadcst) often create small picture problems like those you are describing (or worst ... ie, Fry's system). Try to use a high quality DVD player and DVD to verify your observations when you encounter problems like the ones that you describe.

Okay, I will admit it. I am still a CRT guy. One 35" Hitachi Ultravision (1991 unit that just won't die) and a 36" Sony VVega about two years old.

I have been lurking for quite sometime. Afraid to pull the trigger on an HDTV. Now I am at a point where I can aquire one with Marriott Rewards points. A few years and heavy travel have me with enough points for a Samsung HL-R6167W. Free, gratus, including white glove delivery.

So, why am I still pondering?

My 13 / 14 year old boys and I (wife could care less) enjoy Xbox gaming as well as watching movies. All of this game lag and 720P vs 1080P as well as Samsung bashing has me all confused. The only other available option from Marriott rewards is the Shard 56DR650 and I have heard very little or bad feedback on that unit.

What would you do? Suck it up and get something for free that is pretty nice? Get it delivered, leave it in the box and sell it for $$ to apply to something else?

Viewing room is my finished basement. Low light and seating is approximately 10-11 feet from TV. I have an Integra 6.5 driving Paradigm 7 Towers, CC350 center, 12" sub and rear bookshelves behind the seating area. Ready for something big at the front of all this for viewing pleasure.

Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

Ted

Okay, I will admit it. I am still a CRT guy. One 35" Hitachi Ultravision (1991 unit that just won't die) and a 36" Sony VVega about two years old.

I have been lurking for quite sometime. Afraid to pull the trigger on an HDTV. Now I am at a point where I can aquire one with Marriott Rewards points. A few years and heavy travel have me with enough points for a Samsung HL-R6167W. Free, gratus, including white glove delivery.

So, why am I still pondering?

My 13 / 14 year old boys and I (wife could care less) enjoy Xbox gaming as well as watching movies. All of this game lag and 720P vs 1080P as well as Samsung bashing has me all confused. The only other available option from Marriott rewards is the Shard 56DR650 and I have heard very little or bad feedback on that unit.

What would you do? Suck it up and get something for free that is pretty nice? Get it delivered, leave it in the box and sell it for $$ to apply to something else?

Viewing room is my finished basement. Low light and seating is approximately 10-11 feet from TV. I have an Integra 6.5 driving Paradigm 7 Towers, CC350 center, 12" sub and rear bookshelves behind the seating area. Ready for something big at the front of all this for viewing pleasure.

Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

Ted

Get the Samsung ... set it up and enjoy it. If the gaming performance is not up to expectations, just use your 36" Sony to create a second gaming system. I have a number of HT's, allowing people to play games and others to watch TV, movies.

I spoke with Mitsubishi today...the DLP 62" Diamondvision units will be out in November and allegedly will be 1080p from inputs to outputs (like the Samsung line should have been!). And word has it that they will blow the knickers off the Samsung phake 1080p R-series. And they have done away with the glare glass

In the 73" size, my understanding is that the only difference between the 'diamond' units and the 'non-diamond' units is the internal DVR; all video features are the same. And the report I've seen say that only the non-diamond sets do not have the glare screen--the diamond units do.

Are these statements still true, or have Mits changed their plans in mid-stream?

In the 73" size, my understanding is that the only difference between the 'diamond' units and the 'non-diamond' units is the internal DVR; all video features are the same. And the report I've seen say that only the non-diamond sets do not have the glare screen--the diamond units do.

Are these statements still true, or have Mits changed their plans in mid-stream?

I believe the highest end Diamond series will accept 1080p60fps over vga like
the Samsungs do...

Yeah good luck...Just like they were going to release the first 1080P's...3 units and haven't heard about them since...Good job Mitsubishi!!!!!

That was the biggest frig'in joke I have ever seen in the business.

Big splash, first to market, ha! Where are they now?

I believe the highest end Diamond series will accept 1080p60fps over vga like
the Samsungs do...

Yes, you're right; forgot about that extra feature in the 'diamonds'.

thadius65Okay, I will admit it. I am still a CRT guy. One 35" Hitachi Ultravision (1991 unit that just won't die) and a 36" Sony VVega about two years old. Samsung HL-R6167W. Free, gratus, including white glove delivery

What are you waiting for - get yourself out of the Stone Age of TV Viewing and get the HD Experience. Pretty colors on a tube does not provide and immersive HT Feel that this Samsung will.

HDTV on that 16:9 large Screen will blow away those CRT Direct Views. We're talking 500% improvement in PQ with HD. I previously had a 2.5 yr old 36" Sony CRT with great picture and a monstrous TV at 237 lbs. but my new 32" Sharp LCD FP blows away that CRT. and cannot wait for my Samsung 6768.

Damn - and you have a chance to get it for free? Go for it even if it means you upgrade to the 1080P for a little more - but the 6167 is hardly slumming at 720P. Of course make sure you get rid of the SD viewing as it is garbage. HD and Digital channels will give you a Wow experience those CRT's cannot. I never had a TV give me that experience until I got the HDTV and 3 months later it still leaves that impression. You've got nothing to lose but your SOCKS! Go For it! :D

coyotesx5 -

Noticed you don't identify your technical background or AV experience to be a judge or to even know what your talking about as your a new member on this forum. What credentials do you bring to the table? Did you bother to check how the feeds were split or shared - the type of cable and the type of HD Loop?

Blindly going in and not knowing the conditions of the SOURCE fed how the hell could you be a judge of what you were witnessing. Your response goes totally contrary to the 15 frigging pages i have collected by experienced members on this forum. Do you even know the setup conditions of what you were witnessing or the local bozo's set the TV's up. Virtually everyone on this forum understands that most of the Sales Associates in those stores don't know Jack - most don't even know what 1080P truly is or what it does - are you by any chance related a member named Gazelle?

I don't need to defend the set it's testimonials speak for itself and yours is uniquely a flame without any objective review or fact since you failed to determine if the feeds were proper to actually know what the hell you were talking about. Sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder and you sure the hell have one against Koreans. As a new member your speaking to people that have studied these sets for the past year and with strong technical backgrounds and you come in here ranting with no basis of fact since you don't truly know the conditions of your viewing experience. Thanks for sharing your RANT. Steer the World by any means? Or shall I say your means. True reviewers on this forum and at the Trade Journals ensure the settings are proper before they stick their foot in their mouths. Pro's don't walk in a do a look see and ASSUME things are correctly setup the establish they are before they do an evaluation otherwise the evaluation is Worthless! In your case a worthless RANT. :mad:

I spoke with Mitsubishi today...the DLP 62" Diamondvision units will be out in November and allegedly will be 1080p from inputs to outputs (like the Samsung line should have been!). And word has it that they will blow the knickers off the Samsung phake 1080p R-series. And they have done away with the glare glass

What did you expect Mitsubishi to say? That Mits suck and Samsung rules?

By the way, Mits uses the same "phake" TI chip that Samsung does...

I just received my Samsung HL-R5667W yesterday and spent the afternoon setting it up. I currently am connected to Time Warner Cable running through a Monster Power HTS 1000 MKII to the Scientific Atlanta cable box (not HD, yet). My Sony Home Theater System is also connected using Monster M1000CV component cables.

When I powered on the Samsung, the first thing that came up on the screen was the TV Guide setup. It was crystal clear - sharp and crisp. Once it was complete, I found myself looking at our NBC affiliate. The picture was somewhat of a disappointment. It is not sharp and crisp (all of the other standard TV's in the house showed a sharp cable picture). I went to the Menu and tried different things - My Color - was interesting as it displays a beautiful picture of a woman with a picturesque golf course in the back ground. It identifies Standard and Custom as a split screen, but that picture is not representative of my channels.

I have ordered the CableCard and a technician will be out in 10 days and then I'll be able to watch the HD channels. My questions are:

1. Prior to my purchase, I read through the forums, and found that by and large most people indicated that the PQ on this set was excellent. Did they mean HD channels or all channels?

2. Any tips suggestions on improving the PQ? While watching several programs last night, the picture appeared "stretched," but checking the menu, it was set on 16x9. The clarity of the picture is not comparable to the 32" regular Magnavox that this Samsung replaced.

3. Should I remove the connection to the Monster Power and run the cable straight to the TV? Should I run the cable straight to the TV bypassing the cable box?

4. Will my picture quality improve once the CableCard is inserted?

Any help or reassurances would greatly be appreciated as I just purchased it the other day.

Thanks.

I spoke with Mitsubishi today...the DLP 62" Diamondvision units will be out in November and allegedly will be 1080p from inputs to outputs (like the Samsung line should have been!). And word has it that they will blow the knickers off the Samsung phake 1080p R-series. And they have done away with the glare glass

Hum, who does this sound like? Also note, only 2 posts (back to back). Could it be?

I've been waiting since the Japanese invented HighDef to buy a 1080p TV that didn't suffer burn-in (Panasonic's 20-year plasma statement is malarky) and didn't drive my pixel-sensitive retina crazy! The Samsung 6168/6178 absolutely does not fill that bill. I sat with the 6178 at Scottsdale's Ultimate Electronics store (near the 101 freeway) and almost cried everytime even small amonts of fast motion crept onto the screen. My God the pixelization problems!!! I had it up against a few Panasonic LCDs while watching the Mitsubishi HiDef production program material on all pieces and the Panasonic and Sharp Aquos pieces beat the Samsung piece handsdown for smoothness (minimization of pixelization) and for absence of fast-motion blur/smudge. I was ready to buy the Samsung 6168 today until I found out the following:

Samsung had the audacity to make us wait at least one more year for a set with a 1080p INPUT! What gives??? A few more pennies and 1080p input to output could have been had...but no. The Samsung tech in North Jersey said, "These units are almost perfect, so I guess they had to leave something undone so they could release something new next year! (Unbelievable....I am ready to hurl South Korean chunks!)

I don't know why the pixels smear/smudge/grow on fast motion, but this is unacceptable. No, the unit (6178) was not defective....the 6168 did the same thing last night at the desert Ridge outdoor mall in N. Phoenix. Electronically and topologically identical, the 68 and 78 differ by over a retail grand and by a little bit of fake black "lacquer." Now where can I find a good 61" diagonal LCD HDTV?

What gives with the seven segment color wheel? Could this be causing the noticablity of pixels on demanding fast motion? I'd like to better understand the correllation, if any.

For me, plasma is out (a defective technology IMHO...nothing like all those highly energetic strange and charmed quarks and a few vibrating strings to eat away at those short lived phosphor coatings. Can anyone think of a plasma less errosive than plasma?

Samsung has dedicated substantial attention to their DLP line....again, IMHO, more than any other manufacturer...so for this to be the result of all that work....I am shocked.

LCD may be my only hope, Obi Wan....in a few years when the larger liquid crystal matrices are "perfected" by companies like Samsung (in progress even as I speak).

So, does anyone out their have any consoling words for me...? Please, someone tell me why I am wrong here. Thank God Prozac is now generic!


Interesting. I've sat in Ultimate Electronics in N. Scottsdale off Raintree and also the one at Desert Ridge and examined the 6178 closely. I found it to rival the Qualia. Go to Ultimate Electronics at Desert Ridge again, where the 6178 sits next to the Qualia, and do a comparison.

For me, at least, I felt there wasn't much of a difference between the two sets and both were clearly better than the rest of the field. The additional detail provided by the 1080P picture was evident. I also noticed that the Mitsubishi feed had some real poor parts with lots of pixelation. In fact on the Qualia and Samsung it was evident -- maybe due to the added resolution.

Hum, who does this sound like? Also note, only 2 posts (back to back). Could it be?Looks like a hit and run :rolleyes:

I just received my Samsung HL-R5667W yesterday and spent the afternoon setting it up. I currently am connected to Time Warner Cable running through a Monster Power HTS 1000 MKII to the Scientific Atlanta cable box (not HD, yet). My Sony Home Theater System is also connected using Monster M1000CV component cables.

When I powered on the Samsung, the first thing that came up on the screen was the TV Guide setup. It was crystal clear - sharp and crisp. Once it was complete, I found myself looking at our NBC affiliate. The picture was somewhat of a disappointment. It is not sharp and crisp (all of the other standard TV's in the house showed a sharp cable picture). I went to the Menu and tried different things - My Color - was interesting as it displays a beautiful picture of a woman with a picturesque golf course in the back ground. It identifies Standard and Custom as a split screen, but that picture is not representative of my channels.

I have ordered the CableCard and a technician will be out in 10 days and then I'll be able to watch the HD channels. My questions are:

1. Prior to my purchase, I read through the forums, and found that by and large most people indicated that the PQ on this set was excellent. Did they mean HD channels or all channels?

2. Any tips suggestions on improving the PQ? While watching several programs last night, the picture appeared "stretched," but checking the menu, it was set on 16x9. The clarity of the picture is not comparable to the 32" regular Magnavox that this Samsung replaced.

3. Should I remove the connection to the Monster Power and run the cable straight to the TV? Should I run the cable straight to the TV bypassing the cable box?

4. Will my picture quality improve once the CableCard is inserted?

Any help or reassurances would greatly be appreciated as I just purchased it the other day.

Thanks.


can you provide the cable box model you are using from TW ? Is it the 8300hd silver box ? How are you connecting the cable box to the tv: hdmi, component, s-video, composite, RF ? What picture setting do you have the TV set to - try movie or standard

coyotesx5 -

Noticed you don't identify your technical background or AV experience to be a judge or to even know what your talking about as your a new member on this forum. What credentials do you bring to the table? Did you bother to check how the feeds were split or shared - the type of cable and the type of HD Loop?

Blindly going in and not knowing the conditions of the SOURCE fed how the hell could you be a judge of what you were witnessing. Your response goes totally contrary to the 15 frigging pages i have collected by experienced members on this forum. Do you even know the setup conditions of what you were witnessing or the local bozo's set the TV's up. Virtually everyone on this forum understands that most of the Sales Associates in those stores don't know Jack - most don't even know what 1080P truly is or what it does - are you by any chance related a member named Gazelle?

I don't need to defend the set it's testimonials speak for itself and yours is uniquely a flame without any objective review or fact since you failed to determine if the feeds were proper to actually know what the hell you were talking about. Sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder and you sure the hell have one against Koreans. As a new member your speaking to people that have studied these sets for the past year and with strong technical backgrounds and you come in here ranting with no basis of fact since you don't truly know the conditions of your viewing experience. Thanks for sharing your RANT. Steer the World by any means? Or shall I say your means. True reviewers on this forum and at the Trade Journals ensure the settings are proper before they stick their foot in their mouths. Pro's don't walk in a do a look see and ASSUME things are correctly setup the establish they are before they do an evaluation otherwise the evaluation is Worthless! In your case a worthless RANT. :mad:

I AGREE WITH YOU WESTA6969. YOU GO!! Especially new people who post stuff without the knowledge to back up their comments. I believe that coyotesx5 doesn't really know what he is talking about as you have stated above. I have studied these set's for years and I know the technical in's and out's with these. You cant Assume in electronics. It is better to say that you don't know something and want to learn, than to say that you know and to stick your foot in your mouth. I hate reading worthless forums.

Sorry if this turns out to be a repost. It does not show up when I revie the Samsung 2005 DLP thread:

Okay, I will admit it. I am still a CRT guy. One 35" Hitachi Ultravision (1991 unit that just won't die) and a 36" Sony VVega about two years old.

I have been lurking for quite sometime. Afraid to pull the trigger on an HDTV. Now I am at a point where I can aquire one with Marriott Rewards points. A few years and heavy travel have me with enough points for a Samsung HL-R6167W. Free, gratus, including white glove delivery.

So, why am I still pondering?

My 13 / 14 year old boys and I (wife could care less) enjoy Xbox gaming as well as watching movies. All of this game lag and 720P vs 1080P as well as Samsung bashing has me all confused. The only other available option from Marriott rewards is the Shard 56DR650 and I have heard very little or bad feedback on that unit.

What would you do? Suck it up and get something for free that is pretty nice? Get it delivered, leave it in the box and sell it for $$ to apply to something else?

Viewing room is my finished basement. Low light and seating is approximately 10-11 feet from TV. I have an Integra 6.5 driving Paradigm 7 Towers, CC350 center, 12" sub and rear bookshelves behind the seating area. Ready for something big at the front of all this for viewing pleasure.

Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

Ted

can you provide the cable box model you are using from TW ? Is it the 8300hd silver box ? How are you connecting the cable box to the tv: hdmi, component, s-video, composite, RF ? What picture setting do you have the TV set to - try movie or standard

I believe 'sheppardwk' states that he hasn't yet received HD (he is only viewing Standard Definition programming). Most - if not all - SD programming on this set (I have the 6168) will simply not look as good as on a smaller CRT. On the other hand, HD - as well as quality DVDs on an upconverting DVD player like the SS 950 - you will ("in 10 days") find to be STUNNING! And I mean CRAZY-BEAUTIFUL! :)

can you provide the cable box model you are using from TW ? Is it the 8300hd silver box ? How are you connecting the cable box to the tv: hdmi, component, s-video, composite, RF ? What picture setting do you have the TV set to - try movie or standard

I'm using the Explorer 2000 Digital Box connected to the Monster Power 1000 with an RF RG-6 cable, same coming out of Monster to Explorer 2000 and same entering TV. I also set up an S-Video out of the Explorer 2000 to the TV.

I do not have HD yet - the CableCard installation is about 10 days away.

I may just not be overreacting or not accustomed to the large size of the screen - 56" size - as I have been used to a 32" standard TV. However, I certainly notice a decline in the picture quality of the analog channels.

Picture setting is currently set at Standard.

Thanks.

A 56" picture is about 4x the size of a 32". When you spread the limited number of pixels out that wide, without any additional processing, then it just can't look as good. I've even noticed the same effect on the difference from small crt to larger ones. Another issue I don't see discussed much is the same chip pixel count is often used on the 42" thru 61" LCD or DLP sets...so the same pixel count is spread over a larger area.

A 56" picture is about 4x the size of a 32". When you spread the limited number of pixels out that wide, without any additional processing, then it just can't look as good. I've even noticed the same effect on the difference from small crt to larger ones. Another issue I don't see discussed much is the same chip pixel count is often used on the 42" thru 61" LCD or DLP sets...so the same pixel count is spread over a larger area.
I hope not, then the larger sets would not look as good as the smaller sets. I believe that the design in the chips are different from the samller sets to the larger ones.

If you click your own profile you can find your other posts. I answered you last night in the other thread - pasted below since you cannot locate it. Good Luck!

thadius65Okay, I will admit it. I am still a CRT guy. One 35" Hitachi Ultravision (1991 unit that just won't die) and a 36" Sony VVega about two years old. Samsung HL-R6167W. Free, gratus, including white glove delivery

What are you waiting for - get yourself out of the Stone Age of TV Viewing and get the HD Experience. Pretty colors on a tube does not provide and immersive HT Feel that this Samsung will.

HDTV on that 16:9 large Screen will blow away those CRT Direct Views. We're talking 500% improvement in PQ with HD expanded nearly 4 times larger. I previously had a 2.5 yr old 36" Sony CRT with great picture and a monstrous TV at 237 lbs. but my new 32" Sharp LCD FP blows away that CRT. and cannot wait for my Samsung 6768.

Damn - and you have a chance to get it for free? Go for it even if it means you upgrade to the 1080P for a little more - but the 6167 is hardly slumming at 720P. Of course make sure you get rid of the SD viewing as it is garbage. HD and Digital channels will give you a Wow experience those CRT's cannot. I never had a TV give me that experience until I got the HDTV and 3 months later it still leaves that impression. You've got nothing to lose but your SOCKS! Go For it!

PS: If you like Sports viewing you are in for a whole new experience - I'd stopped watching many and hadn't watched the Pistons until the Championships and I had this new HDTV and I was blown away by the experience - it's like you have the best seat in the house for every game and even things like the Kentucky Derby/Preakness - the details while they race are amazing that simply cannot be picked up on a CRT. The only sports viewing disappointment I have is many Golf Tournaments HD is letterboxed and cannot touch the quality that TNT displays their Golf in 1080i 16:9 and it's a huge difference. TNT does great wide screen events.

You'll see travel shows and almost as if your there anywhere on the planet. While DiscoveryHD has periodic lag issues when it's right it's perfect and the insane shows on that channel and the clarity is simply amazing at times - what I mean by insane is they are events I would never think of watching but it hooks you with the "You are There Experience". You'll be counting how many times a day you are saying WOW! Go for it and leave SD where it belongs in the dumpster - You are going to se an explosion of HD over the next 2 years. Go For it!:D

totally agree with the above.
I got my 5667 hooked up within the past few days, but until I got the cable card installed yesterday and tuned into HD Discovery channel - I had no idea how fantastic the picutre was! It was everything I wanted in a HD picture. Watched Spiderman 2 on HD-HBO last night as well and it was perfect. Crisp and clean throughout.
SD viewing was pretty good as well. My direcTV feed blows away my cable feed on those channels though. (can't wait for directv to get their HD-dvr act together later this year!)

Go for it!!!

totally agree with the above.
I got my 5667 hooked up within the past few days, but until I got the cable card installed yesterday and tuned into HD Discovery channel - I had no idea how fantastic the picutre was! It was everything I wanted in a HD picture. Watched Spiderman 2 on HD-HBO last night as well and it was perfect. Crisp and clean throughout.
SD viewing was pretty good as well. My direcTV feed blows away my cable feed on those channels though. (can't wait for directv to get their HD-dvr act together later this year!)

Go for it!!!
DISH Network too will be blown away. I bought all the HD package too, cant wait to watch ESPNHD Foothball. AWESOME!!

DISH Network too will be blown away. I bought all the HD package too, cant wait to watch ESPNHD Foothball. AWESOME!!

Philadelphia is at Pitsburgh on Monday on ESPN HD for a pre-game.

Go Steelers!

Oh yea, Dishnetwork is great. Get the 942 HD receiver / dvr

received this form TVA today...

Hello,



You are receiving this email because you have a Samsung 1080p pre-order in with TV Authority. This email does not necessarily mean we are ready to ship your order. If your pre-order is in line to be filled by this current shipment, you will be contacted by our customer service department.



We have the following ready to ship:

(7) HL-R5668W (35) scheduled to arrive to us by the end of the week

(6) HL-R5688W – We have 0 pre-orders for these now so if you know anyone who is interested in the pedestal model, it can ship immediately!

(15) HL-R6168W arriving this morning (20+) arriving early next week



Updates:

HL-R6768W – We expect to begin confirmation of these orders towards the end of NEXT WEEK!



HL-RXX78W series:

These continue to trickle in; numerous customers received confirmation calls yesterday.

HL-R7178W:

The latest rumor is this model will be released from Samsung in TWO weeks. We’ll let you know once they confirm that these are on the road to us.

question about this cable card, I have a HD receiver from Time Warner cable, I think it's a HD8300 or something like that. Will I still need the receiver after I recieve the 6768? Will the cable card act as the box?

I'm using the Explorer 2000 Digital Box connected to the Monster Power 1000 with an RF RG-6 cable, same coming out of Monster to Explorer 2000 and same entering TV. I also set up an S-Video out of the Explorer 2000 to the TV.

I do not have HD yet - the CableCard installation is about 10 days away.

I may just not be overreacting or not accustomed to the large size of the screen - 56" size - as I have been used to a 32" standard TV. However, I certainly notice a decline in the picture quality of the analog channels.

Picture setting is currently set at Standard.

Thanks.

reserve your judgement on the tv until you've gotten (1) cablecard installed and/or (2) an upconverting DVD player with HDMI output. RF connections are the worst, especially from the cable box. s-video is marginally better. I never used the 2000 series boxes, I assume they don't have component outputs (if they do use that). Remember that your smaller 32" tv was hiding the blemishes of analog/sd channels, a larger tv will really bring them out

Philadelphia is at Pitsburgh on Monday on ESPN HD for a pre-game.

Go Steelers!

Oh yea, Dishnetwork is great. Get the 942 HD receiver / dvr
I will be watching on Monday night with my new TV. GO EAGLES!!!
Sorry Steelers.

I haven't seen any 68's and 78's side-by-side, so I can't directly answer your question. But after spending an evening so far with my 5078, the black lacquer bezel doesn't bother me as much as I thought it would from a darkness standpoint.

The only time I notice a small negative effect is when there's a flood of black on the screen when watching in a lit room. In that case, it tends to call just a bit too much attention to itself. But darken the room a bit, or get to more typical content with a more broadly distributed value range? Then the set's higher contrast ratio just makes those blacks look truely deep and rich, pretty much matching the darkness of the bezel.

The nice thing is that we're not talking about a huge bezel here. In relation to a 50"+ screen, it's quite thin. Compare that to, say, a 16"x23" poster framed with 3" inches of matte board around it -- the color and value you choose for that matte has a much greater effect on your perception of the colors and values in the poster). So all in all, I think it works against the blacks in the image a small amount, and only then in certain situations where a direct comparison is obvious/evident.
I have seen them side by side, they look the same.

question about this cable card, I have a HD receiver from Time Warner cable, I think it's a HD8300 or something like that. Will I still need the receiver after I recieve the 6768? Will the cable card act as the box?
Not to change the subject, but I was just at Bestbuy and I saw the JVC and the Samsung 5677 model (720p) and beleive it or not, JVC looked better. Maybe it was me.

reserve your judgement on the tv until you've gotten (1) cablecard installed and/or (2) an upconverting DVD player with HDMI output. RF connections are the worst, especially from the cable box. s-video is marginally better. I never used the 2000 series boxes, I assume they don't have component outputs (if they do use that). Remember that your smaller 32" tv was hiding the blemishes of analog/sd channels, a larger tv will really bring them out


Thanks - I will. You are correct the 2000 is just for Digital Cable not HD - I would need the 8300HD if I wasn't going to use the CableCard. How would you recommend connecting the cable from the wall to the TV once the CableCard is installed? Is there an alternate method other than RF?

First, thanks to all the posters who spend time trying to educate and provide objective information. Despite Gazelle (and his alias') I pulled the trigger on the 5678 and they just called to say it will be delivered tomorrow afternoon (two weeks from the order to delivery).

Anyway, I was on vacation last week and I'm not going to read all the posts, but I did skim and search and did not see too much on xbox gaming reviews. I have been playing xbox since beta and a regular on our Friday night drunken fragfests (any xmg's out there?), and will be online this Friday night. Probably playing Top Spin (tennis) and Rainbow Six. I am concerned about the lag but as is my personality, took the risk and ordered.

If anyone cares and I don't get flamed, I'll post my thoughts on any lag or other issues with the xboxlive experience. I currently have been using a Sony 36" xbr400 for the last 4 years so I should notice any lag. I'll try and get some games in before I drink too much.

Try this...
Search out your local Harley-Davidson biker bar, go in say that you think that Yamahas are better than Harley-Davidsons. :eek:
IMHO, everything looks equally good (or bad) at BestBuy. They seem to be clueless about how to show HDTVs at their best, especially with their crappy "HD" feed and their poor placement of HDTVs. For example, in my local BB they have the 42" & 50" plasmas placed about 1-2' off the floor in an aisle that you can only step back about 5'. They also have several RPTVs placed about 8-10' above ground.
You are correct about that, no one at the retail stores know anything. They cant even answer the simple questions. I never talk to them anyway. There HD signal looked like crap. They have what 100 TV's on one feed. That is why. The TV was not setup right and I tried to fix it, when they snapped at me. BOO HOO to them!! :mad:

Try this...
Search out your local Harley-Davidson biker bar, go in say that you think that Yamahas are better than Harley-Davidsons. :eek:
IMHO, everything looks equally good (or bad) at BestBuy. They seem to be clueless about how to show HDTVs at their best, especially with their crappy "HD" feed and their poor placement of HDTVs. For example, in my local BB they have the 42" & 50" plasmas placed about 1-2' off the floor in an aisle that you can only step back about 5'. They also have several RPTVs placed about 8-10' above ground.
I am not defending JVC at all. I think SAMSUNG blows them away hands down, but I just wanted to see if any of you seen the same problem at Bestbuy. The TV was not 1080p. So this is a big difference.

Try this...
Search out your local Harley-Davidson biker bar, go in say that you think that Yamahas are better than Harley-Davidsons. :eek:
IMHO, everything looks equally good (or bad) at BestBuy. They seem to be clueless about how to show HDTVs at their best, especially with their crappy "HD" feed and their poor placement of HDTVs. For example, in my local BB they have the 42" & 50" plasmas placed about 1-2' off the floor in an aisle that you can only step back about 5'. They also have several RPTVs placed about 8-10' above ground.
We all know that HARLEY's RULE. :D I am about to buy one. :eek: :)

Try this...
Search out your local Harley-Davidson biker bar, go in say that you think that Yamahas are better than Harley-Davidsons. :eek:
IMHO, everything looks equally good (or bad) at BestBuy. They seem to be clueless about how to show HDTVs at their best, especially with their crappy "HD" feed and their poor placement of HDTVs. For example, in my local BB they have the 42" & 50" plasmas placed about 1-2' off the floor in an aisle that you can only step back about 5'. They also have several RPTVs placed about 8-10' above ground.

Unfortunately I feel like that's part of the reason I've always been turned off of plasma sets at BestBuy (besides the higher price/inch). They make you stand no further than 4-5 feet from the set, so the SDE is crazy. Then I've also seen Sammy DLPs hooked up to SD coax before at the one on 23rd st. here in NYC. Pathetic. I've seen also them set up a D-ILA set that clearly had a defect (a long band of blue across the set). It almost makes me feel like they are trying really hard to NOT sell sets there.

Unfortunately I feel like that's part of the reason I've always been turned off of plasma sets at BestBuy (besides the higher price/inch). They make you stand no further than 4-5 feet from the set, so the SDE is crazy. Then I've also seen Sammy DLPs hooked up to SD coax before at the one on 23rd st. here in NYC. Pathetic. I've seen also them set up a D-ILA set that clearly had a defect (a long band of blue across the set). It almost makes me feel like they are trying really hard to NOT sell sets there.
Your right and Plasma is the worst. Especially at Bestbuy. The cost Price/inch like you said is high. Plasma will not last long, not even a light bulb to replace and also they are hot. I mean hot. :mad: :eek:

I'm not saying you are defending the JVC, just try to joke about the fact that you said the JVC looked better than a Samsung in a Samsung thread. ;)
The JVCs are very captivating in the store. Late last year when we looking for a new HDTV, and I didn't know any better (I'm now in analysis paralysis ;-) my wife was seduced by the bright picture of the JVC in a store so we bought one. Got it home, didn't like the harshness of the picture, had some other problems (distorted picture, bad HDMI input, loud fan, etc) and couldn't wait to get rid of it.
Anyway, I don't want to get into JVC-bashing here so I'll say no more. I prefer the Samsung's picture.
Your post was awesome, thanks for that inside information about getting home the JVC and then not liking it. Strange too because at all the stores, JVC looks great, however you are right, They dont sell those much, HINT problems!!! You dont have to JVC bash, I WILL!!! HA HA JK. No seriously, this is to compare that. I had a simple question, that was all, I dont want to hurt JVC fans!!! It there are any. HEE-HEE :D :confused: :eek:

I'm not saying you are defending the JVC, just try to joke about the fact that you said the JVC looked better than a Samsung in a Samsung thread. ;)
The JVCs are very captivating in the store. Late last year when we looking for a new HDTV, and I didn't know any better (I'm now in analysis paralysis ;-) my wife was seduced by the bright picture of the JVC in a store so we bought one. Got it home, didn't like the harshness of the picture, had some other problems (distorted picture, bad HDMI input, loud fan, etc) and couldn't wait to get rid of it.
Anyway, I don't want to get into JVC-bashing here so I'll say no more. I prefer the Samsung's picture.
My jokes can be mean sometimes to the OTHER people who are against us. HA HA :confused: No hard feelings to the others.

I've got a PAL (UK) playstation 2 that I broke back from my time in England, and was trying to hook it up to play a game of Pro Evolution Soccer 4 using the crap composite connector to my 4667, and the picture isn't in color, the top half is cut off, and it overall looks ****. I'm guessing it's not liking the PAL signal it's outputting...

Is there anything I can do to make it work? Perhaps try component outputs or svideo or something? I don't want to invest in a new connector if it's a dead end.

Thanks in advance.

Phillip

Well...sorry if the sharing of my experience re: Samsung 6168/78 seemed like a flame. It was meant to share with the forum the insight into my disappointment with the state of where Samsung seems to be with DLP (and apparently every other manufacturer so far). In November, when Mitsu comes out with there Diamond version, the WD62927, I will try to be more careful and exert more control over how the inputs are connected at the locations I mentioned. If anyone has ever worked in audio/video sales, one knows that these sales people don't appreciate the customer "pain" that they "feel" when someone like me or you asks them to reconnect/rewire the inputs. I was dealing with managers in both locations, and the sources were 720p and 1080i program material being fed into both TVs simulatneously via what looked like identical connectors at the level of the sets. If this forum does not value my experiences because I did not use the scientific method or resort to using an oscilliscope or other instrument(s) to measure various parameters or have Drs. David Sarnoff, Mattie Otala or Van Alsteen over my right shoulder while evaluating these pieces, then I apologize. I am new to this forum but have been an audiophile of sorts since 1970. I do not know anyone else in this forum, have no motives, primary or alterior, of any sort. I enjoy audio far more than video, but am bothered by digital effects in audio AND video, especially if I am preparing to plunk a couple or more grand down for a tv.

I do not "have a chip" on my shoulder, as "StallionRe" put it, and have nothing against S. Koreans or any other Koreans for that matter. In fact, some background is in order. I am a retired anesthesiologist and former assistant clinical professor of anesthesiology. I am a risk management consultant for anesthesiologists and other critical care professionals. I have an MD degree and a BS in biochemistry. As a practicing full-time anesthesiologist, I worked also part-time having my own install company, Pro Audio/Video Consultants, formerly of Hightstown, NJ. I was a saleman in-the-field for 15 years from 1978 to 1993 for one of the Turchin brothers (anyone from the East Coast knows the Turchin white goods/brown goods dynasty...one brother started Tops, the other Regal Audio/Video & Appliance in Linden, NJ. (my boss) I did hi end audio and video installations back then in the NY-NJ-Conn tri-state area, primarily dealing with Mark Levinson, Krell, Rappaport, QMI, Hafler, New Acoustic Design (NAD), ADCOM, Staightwire, Stax, Magnepan, early Martin Logan, and many others. Mitsubishi Diamond Vision was the creme de la creme back then, except for projection video, whose roost was/is ruled by RUNCO et. al. I am not pretentious and apologize if I seemed so.

While I did not use the scientific method to compare the sets that I compared, I was pretty sure that the sets simultaneously shared the same signal (I did not examine the impedance of the cables used, or check to assure that the setup used cables made from oxygen-free copper, etc. Do members of this forum routinely do such tests?) If "high end A/V shops in other large cities allow their customers such control over the input signal, then maybe I should do my shopping there. I do think that the average A/V afficionado does not have such control...clearly the mass market for the most part, won't allow it.

Finally, I would ask any of you who are interested to focus on the Samsung 6168/78 during fast motion material...football tackles with arms and legs flying everywhere, ocean waves or bodies of water that shimmer, any rapid motion with darker attributes...if you don't see excessive "pixelization", then great...both sets might have been defective. In no way was I casting aspersions against your particular set or your purchase or your judgement. But I didn't see this excessive pixelization on adjacent comparison sets. Is it possible that my eyes are sensitive to some type of DLP artifact that other eyes don't see? (Similar to those of us who see DLP rainbows and others of us see only the pot 'o gold....only kidding!) I'll lurk for a while to see just how rigorous you engineer-types are...if you are out of my league, I won't post anymore...sorry I estranged so many people. And as far as the Korean remark goes...you misinterpreted my meaning. The assistant chairman of my department was Korean...and I must say, he made a very strong positive impression on my life and my approach to medical science in general. He was a Tai Kwan Do black belt and a Fellow of the American College of Anesthesiologists. He was the Korean equivalent of a Navy Seal of MENSA mentality...so you should understand that I am NOT prejudiced in any way...period. Most South Koreans(seems to me) strive for excellence...Samsung's success in cellphone manufacture is a good example. I have been told that they have revolutionized the field of LCD manufacture, which will soon reflect itself in a higher quality of LCD sets and cellphone displays. Let's wait and see.

we may have the 67's in time for football.....yeah baby!

hi

PC Richard is also showing stock in the warehouse on the HLR6178 but they are not in the retail stores yet.

coyotesx5 :)
I must be honest with you that some of the things you have reported I witnessed on many TV's by viewing and judging in-store demo's 9 months ago and I would see motion blur, artifacts and get headaches from fast movement panning sequences and I was anti Sharp for awhile because of what I witnessed in the stores. I later learned the flaws in what they feed and how they feed and the source splitting and poor cabling I simply learned over time viewing these threads the store setups were crap. This is what I believe you witnessed and I don't say this to rise to Samsungs defense.

I now own a Sharp Aquous LCD FP and I have never seen any of those factors I witnessed in the store - Never! I cannot imagine a TV with truer color tones and flesh and I'd buy one in a heart beat if I could afford the 65" but I cannot go beyond $5-$6K without going into debt and so based upon studying the CES results for the past 8 months and reviews from 1080P owners and the fact I always liked the 6163 very much I committed. The people reporting ere are giving real results that we cannot test in a store other than if it looks incredible in the store it will be in one's home as long as connections and source are proper. I've never seen a Sharp look as good in store as it looks in my home.

I like Plasma's, LCD's, and SXRD very much but for bang for the buck I chose the 6768 for HT immersiveness. I apologize if I overreacted and on reflection I truly feel you were seeing false views in the store otherwise you'd see some fuming customers that have bought it and returned it to TVA as we have a 30 day window to do so. I would hope you or anyone else does not trust what you see in the stores. People would not be raving about the PQ if it were not so.

An equivalent Plasma, LCD, SXRD will run any of us 2-3 times the money. I only suggest you understand what they are throwing at you and how pathetic these stores set the TV's up for viewing. I was at a new BB and they had no 1080P's yet but half the sets were artifacting from the loop they had going especially the Panasonic was horrendous but do you think a single person attempted to correct it - no - they stood around letting those feeds run poorly but I knew enough that Panasonic would not produce a PQ that poorly but i never came back here and blamed what I viewed as I knew it was the conditions the store had misconfigured not the TV's. I'm not trying to sell you on Samsung but rather make sure the source if presenting a true experience to report. Thanks and Happy Viewing! :D

While I did not use the scientific method to compare the sets that I compared, I was pretty sure that the sets simultaneously shared the same signal (I did not examine the impedance of the cables used, or check to assure that the setup used cables made from oxygen-free copper, etc.
I'm sorry you got such a "vigorous" reception. :o

I didn't follow it closely. I don't read as meany "detailed" reviews as I used to. I can tell you that some of the criticism came from the less informed among us. :rolleyes:

I hope this isn't covering old ground for you, but it's been my impression that almost all retail display setups are analog component loops because they are much cheaper than all digital sources. We have a retailer in our area who has had their Sony 70" XBR connected to a defective component source (no red) for over a year. :rolleyes:

I feel that the only way to tell how a Samsung DLP or any other digital display device will look is to see it connected to a digital HDMI source. In that case there is less video processing, and "oxygen-free copper" is irrelevant. :)

Enjoy.

coyotesx5

Part of the reason for the hostile reception wasn't just the fact that you stated the Samsung's were "big disappointments", it was the fact that you also did not take the time to determine the connections being used, as well as showing some ignorance such as :

I spoke with Mitsubishi today...the DLP 62" Diamondvision units will be out in November and allegedly will be 1080p from inputs to outputs (like the Samsung line should have been!). And word has it that they will blow the knickers off the Samsung phake 1080p R-series. And they have done away with the glare glass

The Mitsubishi's will be using the same "wobulated" chip from TI as the Samsungs. So, if the Samsung's are "phake 1080p", so are the Mitsubishi's.

And since they will use the same chip, it is very unlikely that they will "blow the knickers off the Samsungs". It is also surprising that someone with your level of education and experience with audio equipment would take a statement like this and place any value on it, especially coming from the (rival) manufacturer! :rolleyes:

I can tell you that some of the criticism came from the less informed among us.
In no way did this comment refer to Rob Tomlin.
:)

After reading Rob's message I find that I agree with it.

Re: My comments on Mitsubishi...they were NOT MY COMMENTS! I failed to properly use quotes, but it was the Mitsubishi tech that used the terminology re: "blow the knickers off the Samsung ,,,," blah blah blah...not me. I guess I'm guilty of not using quotes, but a re read of the sentance will show that I was paraphrasing the Mitsu tech...I was not trying to piss any one off.

In no way did this comment refer to Rob Tomlin.
:)

After reading Rob's message I find that I agree with it.

;) No worries.

Re: My comments on Mitsubishi...they were NOT MY COMMENTS! I failed to properly use quotes, but it was the Mitsubishi tech that used the terminology re: "blow the knickers off the Samsung ,,,," blah blah blah...not me. I guess I'm guilty of not using quotes, but a re read of the sentance will show that I was paraphrasing the Mitsu tech...I was not trying to piss any one off.

Re-read MY post.

I never said that those were your words. But if you don't place any credit on those comments, why post them here as though it were something you believed (i.e, that they would "blow the knickers off the Samsung"?

Re: My comments on Mitsubishi...they were NOT MY COMMENTS! I failed to properly use quotes, but it was the Mitsubishi tech that used the terminology re: "blow the knickers off the Samsung ,,,," blah blah blah...not me. I guess I'm guilty of not using quotes, but a re read of the sentance will show that I was paraphrasing the Mitsu tech...I was not trying to piss any one off.

I WANT TO APOLOGIZE TO YOU Coyotesx5, ;) I meant no harm to you at all. I think sometimes these threads can get out of hand especially when you read 10 pages a day and then you forget who wrote what when. I didnt put you down in anyway and wil not to. I think that your input is very good and I like what you post. I believe that store reps and tech's say the wrong things for no response. I beleive that all TV's are the same. They just tweek and peak them to make them better. It is all up to a person what they perfer that is all. Nothing more and nothing less, especially if you are married, then the wife rules. We all know that right? I am talking to the married people now. :D You didnt piss me off, and I hope that I didnt piss you off. :)

I am just happy that it seems the Mits 1080p sets are going to appear soon, so that we can have some side-by-side 'look sees' to judge their PQ relative to the Sammies with our own eyes. I'm guessing that they will be approximately equivalent, but that will be important to know. The only serious differences I've seen in the specs are that the Mits will have a 6-segment color wheel, while the Sammy has a 7-segment one, and the large (73") Mits sets will have a 150 watt lamp with the large (71") Sammy will have a 120 watt one. How this will manifest itself in relative PQ, I have no idea, but I'm REALLY looking forward to seeing.

I am just happy that it seems the Mits 1080p sets are going to appear soon, so that we can have some side-by-side 'look sees' to judge their PQ relative to the Sammies with our own eyes. I'm guessing that they will be approximately equivalent, but that will be important to know. The only serious differences I've seen in the specs are that the Mits will have a 6-segment color wheel, while the Sammy has a 7-segment one, and the large (73") Mits sets will have a 150 watt lamp with the large (71") Sammy will have a 120 watt one. How this will manifest itself in relative PQ, I have no idea, but I'm REALLY looking forward to seeing.
No matter what, I still feel Samsung is a better product over Mit. The lamp maybe be brighter, but the color wheel is key the the rainbow effect and the black levels. I feel that Mit is still a good product but I still still pixelation and problems with their sets. All sets have something, It depends on the buyer what they want. I am not a Mit hater, Just a Sammy lover. A brighter bulb does not mean a sharper, brighter, clearer, picture. I think in all DP TV's a 120 Watt bulb is bright enough. Would you agree? I heard that Sammy will produce next year or year in a half, you know them (always late), a brighter bulb for there set that is 71" and larger.

The 6168 is too bright as it is. At least for my eyes. I have to watch it in movie mode. I guess if I had direct sunlight in the room I would need the bright setting, but I never will have direct sunlight in that room.

today i stopped by Sound Advice in Tampa (Dale Mabary) to see this most talked about Samsung I had ordered sight unseen. Nothing prepared me for what I experienced in that store. Even going in expecting the worse.

I don't understand why a high end audio video store does not care to show these TVs the way they should be shown. Right by the entrance was the Q006. Looked horrible. My 5 year old Hitachi looked 100 times better. I knew it was the feed.

On to the Samsung. A 6178. Again, horrible picture. I checked all the HD channels and they looked like they were bad SD. I asked the manager if he could put in a dvd. What did this man go bring me? Stargate DVD. I may be wrong, but I don't think that is a reference dvd by a long shot. The Samung 850 player wasn't sending a signal. He checks and it isn't connected. He goes to look for cables comes back and connects it. The picture looks horrible. I ask him what he used HDMI? "No" Component? "No" Svideo? "No. It's composite." I asked him if he could at least find component cables. He goes off for 10 minutes. He comes back and says he can't find any. I point to the wall where there are brand new cables and he goes and grabs a pair of component cables. Hooks them up and the picture still looks bad. The picture is red out of focus. He fiddles and fiddles and can't get a good picture. I ask him to switch to the other set of component inputs on the tv and still gets a red out of focus picture.

At that point I give up, disgusted at the hour I wasted in the place.

Question. I noticed on the Samsung 6178 an effect on the screen that looked like a knit pattern behind the screen. Is this normal for DLP tvs? Is it their version of SDE? Kind of distracting, but the horrible feed wasn't helping.

Question. I noticed on the Samsung 6178 an effect on the screen that looked like a knit pattern behind the screen. Is this normal for DLP tvs? Is it their version of SDE? Kind of distracting, but the horrible feed wasn't helping.

You ordered a Samsung DLP sight unseen and you aren't at least familiar with DLP's (even the 720p models)?

Correct me if I am wrong, it just seems like that is what your question implies.

Slocko,

The Sound Advise in Clearwater is running a component feed on the 6178 and the 5078. They were the two best looking sets in the room. They also had the 850 hooked up to the 5078 over HDMI and they put in one one of the new Starwars Movies and it was probably the best looking DVD I had ever seen, although I am not a DVD expert. Hoping my 950 will look even better on my 6768.

today i stopped by Sound Advice in Tampa (Dale Mabary) to see this most talked about Samsung I had ordered sight unseen. Nothing prepared me for what I experienced in that store. Even going in expecting the worse.

I don't understand why a high end audio video store does not care to show these TVs the way they should be shown. Right by the entrance was the Q006. Looked horrible. My 5 year old Hitachi looked 100 times better. I knew it was the feed.

On to the Samsung. A 6178. Again, horrible picture. I checked all the HD channels and they looked like they were bad SD. I asked the manager if he could put in a dvd. What did this man go bring me? Stargate DVD. I may be wrong, but I don't think that is a reference dvd by a long shot. The Samung 850 player wasn't sending a signal. He checks and it isn't connected. He goes to look for cables comes back and connects it. The picture looks horrible. I ask him what he used HDMI? "No" Component? "No" Svideo? "No. It's composite." I asked him if he could at least find component cables. He goes off for 10 minutes. He comes back and says he can't find any. I point to the wall where there are brand new cables and he goes and grabs a pair of component cables. Hooks them up and the picture still looks bad. The picture is red out of focus. He fiddles and fiddles and can't get a good picture. I ask him to switch to the other set of component inputs on the tv and still gets a red out of focus picture.

At that point I give up, disgusted at the hour I wasted in the place.

Question. I noticed on the Samsung 6178 an effect on the screen that looked like a knit pattern behind the screen. Is this normal for DLP tvs? Is it their version of SDE? Kind of distracting, but the horrible feed wasn't helping.
:mad: OUCH!!! what a day for you. The signal feed was bad. The TV's dont have this on them at all. I never see these. Trust me, the TV's do no justice at the stores. As long as the signal is not good, then the TV's will be no good. He cant even hook up a DVD player right and you expect him to sell a TV. HA!! yeah right!!! I never go to the store to buy, only to look at the TV's and then I decide since I can bulid them. What sale's person would know what I am talking about anyway. :D

Slocko,

The Sound Advise in Clearwater is running a component feed on the 6178 and the 5078. They were the two best looking sets in the room. They also had the 850 hooked up to the 5078 over HDMI and they put in one one of the new Starwars Movies and it was probably the best looking DVD I had ever seen, although I am not a DVD expert. Hoping my 950 will look even better on my 6768.
Thanks for this post. Sounds like you got a winner here. HDMI feed will look even better. Do you have an HDMI dvd Player? I do, try that and you will be too amazed!! :)

Are you referring to a diamond-shaped criss-cross grid pattern that is barely visible in areas of light color during motion or camera movement when viewed from up real close to the screen?
Sounds like you are real close to the screen. I never noticed this. I will have to see.

The 6168 is too bright as it is. At least for my eyes. I have to watch it in movie mode. I guess if I had direct sunlight in the room I would need the bright setting, but I never will have direct sunlight in that room.
Just think if there was a 150 Watt bulb in there. Too bright I guess!!! I think that a 120w buld is just perfect. Since the mirrors reflect all of it to the screen.

That is correct. My main concerns are black levels and brightness. Something from what I have read has been addressed. I ordered from TVA knowing I had 30 days to try it out. Based on the comments here, and the reviews of the Qualia which the Samsung is reportedly almost equalling, the odds are good I will like the TV. There really isn't much choices if you want 1080p, which I do.

You ordered a Samsung DLP sight unseen and you aren't at least familiar with DLP's (even the 720p models)?

Correct me if I am wrong, it just seems like that is what your question implies.

I believe that is what I saw. I don't remember how close I was to the TV since it wasn't setup for ideal viewing conditions. I don't recall seeing it on the Qualia, but I know that is different technology. I'm sure that not having a good picture to look at made it noticeable.

What I referred to is only visible up close under the conditions described and is the Samsung DLP equivalent of SDE for the HD3, HD4 and xHD4 "wobbulated" chips. There is a TI article about it somewhere in one of the Samsung mega-threads. It is much less objectionable than SDE on RP-LCDs and is invisible from more than 1-3' away depending on screen size. On the HLR5078, even at just 1' away it is almost impossible to see. Its really nothing to be concerned about.

Would you be interested in joining the November calibration tour for our area? I really recommend calibration. NO matter how good you think it looks, it will shine with calibration. Especially with Avical who uses a very expensive top of the line analyzer. It's really not a gimmick. Even my wife who has no interest in video, was able to tell the difference. My old 5 year rear projection hitachi that i gave away to my friend, looked better than any tv I ever saw anywhere because it was calibrated yearly.

Slocko,

The Sound Advise in Clearwater is running a component feed on the 6178 and the 5078. They were the two best looking sets in the room. They also had the 850 hooked up to the 5078 over HDMI and they put in one one of the new Starwars Movies and it was probably the best looking DVD I had ever seen, although I am not a DVD expert. Hoping my 950 will look even better on my 6768.

What I referred to is only visible up close under the conditions described and is the Samsung DLP equivalent of SDE for the HD3, HD4 and xHD4 "wobbulated" chips. There is a TI article about it somewhere in one of the Samsung mega-threads. It is much less objectionable than SDE on RP-LCDs and is invisible from more than 1-3' away depending on screen size. On the HLR5078, even at just 1' away it is almost impossible to see. Its really nothing to be concerned about.
Thanks, you make me feel so much better, I was a bit worried that I might see it all the time. It depends on the signal and everything else. Thanks again.

That is correct. My main concerns are black levels and brightness. Something from what I have read has been addressed. I ordered from TVA knowing I had 30 days to try it out. Based on the comments here, and the reviews of the Qualia which the Samsung is reportedly almost equalling, the odds are good I will like the TV. There really isn't much choices if you want 1080p, which I do.

Good deal, I hope you like the set (despite what you saw at that sorry excuse for an audio/video store).

Would you be interested in joining the November calibration tour for our area? I really recommend calibration. NO matter how good you think it looks, it will shine with calibration. Especially with Avical who uses a very expensive top of the line analyzer. It's really not a gimmick. Even my wife who has no interest in video, was able to tell the difference. My old 5 year rear projection hitachi that i gave away to my friend, looked better than any tv I ever saw anywhere because it was calibrated yearly.


If I have me 6768 by then and I have had it long enough to break it in I may be interested.

Thanks-I love you Man! I was really getting some BS from a salesman and now I know why. He doesn't even know what the differences are!

No matter what, I still feel Samsung is a better product over Mit. The lamp maybe be brighter, but the color wheel is key the the rainbow effect and the black levels. I feel that Mit is still a good product but I still still pixelation and problems with their sets. All sets have something, It depends on the buyer what they want. I am not a Mit hater, Just a Sammy lover. A brighter bulb does not mean a sharper, brighter, clearer, picture. I think in all DP TV's a 120 Watt bulb is bright enough. Would you agree? I heard that Sammy will produce next year or year in a half, you know them (always late), a brighter bulb for there set that is 71" and larger.

You may very well turn out to be right; I admit that I am leaning toward a Sammy also, but I want to keep an open mind until I see the Mits in comparison. The present 720p Mits sets have pretty impressive PQ (and also some problems), in a number of cases that I've seen them at Magnolia they were as good as, or even better than the Sammies (both sets with the HD2+ chip). There are plenty of Mits people that swear by their sets, just as us Sammy folks do. I'm not wedded to either, just want to have an open-minded look.

Re the brightness, I was mainly responding to some comments a few days ago that the 61" Sammies were somewhat on the dim side (in Movie mode). I view my hlp6163 in Cinema mode (the old name, I guess, for Movie mode) and find the brightness just fine, day or night. I wouldn't expect the 1080p sets to be much different in this regard, but again, I would like to verify it.

The Bellevue, WA Magnolia had a 5668 right next to a HLN 56" and I was impressed.

I don't know about the settings but the feed was good. I watched some kids doing stunts on trials bicycles for about 20-30 min. The picture comparison was just like those split-screen photos shown above (I think it was this thread). The picture was crisper, brighter, blacker, clearer, and sharper. The colors also looked more natural (probably settings).

That being said I still can't decide if I should wait a while longer to see how the Mits, Tos, and Sony sets are. If it weren't for the video processing delay isssue (yes I may want to game on it) I would have already ordered mine!

P.S. The passion on this forum is almost scary, :eek:

Thanks - I will. You are correct the 2000 is just for Digital Cable not HD - I would need the 8300HD if I wasn't going to use the CableCard. How would you recommend connecting the cable from the wall to the TV once the CableCard is installed? Is there an alternate method other than RF?

when you have the CC installed, then the RF cable from the pole will go into the TV, since the TV takes the signal from the cable company and the cc has the info to decrypt and scrambled channels; in the meantime when you are using a "seperate" component box such as a cable box I was meant that you should always attempt to connect it to your tv using the best possible connection (HDMI/DVI>Component>s-video>composite>rf)

Well...sorry if the sharing of my experience re: Samsung 6168/78 seemed like a flame. It was meant to share with the forum the insight into my disappointment with the state of where Samsung seems to be with DLP (and apparently every other manufacturer so far). In November, when Mitsu comes out with there Diamond version, the WD62927, I will try to be more careful and exert more control over how the inputs are connected at the locations I mentioned. If anyone has ever worked in audio/video sales, one knows that these sales people don't appreciate the customer "pain" that they "feel" when someone like me or you asks them to reconnect/rewire the inputs. I was dealing with managers in both locations, and the sources were 720p and 1080i program material being fed into both TVs simulatneously via what looked like identical connectors at the level of the sets. If this forum does not value my experiences because I did not use the scientific method or resort to using an oscilliscope or other instrument(s) to measure various parameters or have Drs. David Sarnoff, Mattie Otala or Van Alsteen over my right shoulder while evaluating these pieces, then I apologize. I am new to this forum but have been an audiophile of sorts since 1970. I do not know anyone else in this forum, have no motives, primary or alterior, of any sort. I enjoy audio far more than video, but am bothered by digital effects in audio AND video, especially if I am preparing to plunk a couple or more grand down for a tv.



that's completely ok coyote. there's a small group of posters on this forum who decide they must bash everyone who does not have the same opinion as they do, especially those who have never even seen the tv in person, but rather base their opinions on what others post. I just skip their posts anyway. I always like to read varied opinions, especially from newbie's and others who go into stores and look at tv's with an open mind. don't be afraid to keep on posting, just ignore the flames, which I will do when those same guys respond to this post :p

today i stopped by Sound Advice in Tampa (Dale Mabary) to see this most talked about Samsung I had ordered sight unseen. Nothing prepared me for what I experienced in that store. Even going in expecting the worse.

I don't understand why a high end audio video store does not care to show these TVs the way they should be shown. Right by the entrance was the Q006. Looked horrible. My 5 year old Hitachi looked 100 times better. I knew it was the feed.

On to the Samsung. A 6178. Again, horrible picture. I checked all the HD channels and they looked like they were bad SD. I asked the manager if he could put in a dvd. What did this man go bring me? Stargate DVD. I may be wrong, but I don't think that is a reference dvd by a long shot. The Samung 850 player wasn't sending a signal. He checks and it isn't connected. He goes to look for cables comes back and connects it. The picture looks horrible. I ask him what he used HDMI? "No" Component? "No" Svideo? "No. It's composite." I asked him if he could at least find component cables. He goes off for 10 minutes. He comes back and says he can't find any. I point to the wall where there are brand new cables and he goes and grabs a pair of component cables. Hooks them up and the picture still looks bad. The picture is red out of focus. He fiddles and fiddles and can't get a good picture. I ask him to switch to the other set of component inputs on the tv and still gets a red out of focus picture.

At that point I give up, disgusted at the hour I wasted in the place.

Question. I noticed on the Samsung 6178 an effect on the screen that looked like a knit pattern behind the screen. Is this normal for DLP tvs? Is it their version of SDE? Kind of distracting, but the horrible feed wasn't helping.


sounds like the store idiot didn't connect the component cables correctly on either the dvd side and/or the tv side

Hi,

I recently purchased the HLR5067W and absolutely love it. However, in the next few days I'm going to be purchasing a up-converting DVD player (probably the Samsung 950) to replace my Harman/Kardon Progressive-Scan DVD Player. My question is this, should I continue using the HDMI input for the Directv HD-Tivo and run component for the new DVD Player, or should I switch and run the DVD into HDMI ? The reason I selected the Samsung 950 is that it allows the up-convert to be sent via component by a hack, but I'm not sure if this modified component signal will rival the HDMI.

One dumb question - my HD Tivo allows me to switch between 480, 720 and 1080 output - what has been everyone's best experience with setting this for (a) Hd-Tivo and (b) and up-converted DVD such as the Samsung.

You may very well turn out to be right; I admit that I am leaning toward a Sammy also, but I want to keep an open mind until I see the Mits in comparison. The present 720p Mits sets have pretty impressive PQ (and also some problems), in a number of cases that I've seen them at Magnolia they were as good as, or even better than the Sammies (both sets with the HD2+ chip). There are plenty of Mits people that swear by their sets, just as us Sammy folks do. I'm not wedded to either, just want to have an open-minded look.

Re the brightness, I was mainly responding to some comments a few days ago that the 61" Sammies were somewhat on the dim side (in Movie mode). I view my hlp6163 in Cinema mode (the old name, I guess, for Movie mode) and find the brightness just fine, day or night. I wouldn't expect the 1080p sets to be much different in this regard, but again, I would like to verify it.
:D I agree with you Millerwill. I had an open mind until I saw the new Sammy 1080p. They blow me away if it is hooked up with a good cable like Monster M series and the best of the best signal, which I all have. I like the Mit too, but they are noisey and they dont look that good in apperance wise. I was leaning towards the Sony Wega one, but too big. Look at the speakers, they are huge, located on the side of the TV. In this case I get a TV that is over 56" to fit in my cabinet. Therefore I chose Samsung because the speakers are not in the way and I could fit the 61"
and also the appearnce is a "Classical" look. I like that. With the stand it looks so awesome. :)

The Bellevue, WA Magnolia had a 5668 right next to a HLN 56" and I was impressed.

I don't know about the settings but the feed was good. I watched some kids doing stunts on trials bicycles for about 20-30 min. The picture comparison was just like those split-screen photos shown above (I think it was this thread). The picture was crisper, brighter, blacker, clearer, and sharper. The colors also looked more natural (probably settings).

That being said I still can't decide if I should wait a while longer to see how the Mits, Tos, and Sony sets are. If it weren't for the video processing delay isssue (yes I may want to game on it) I would have already ordered mine!

P.S. The passion on this forum is almost scary, :eek:

Sorry, those pics I saw were on p71 of the owners thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=559872&page=71&pp=30 :rolleyes:

Barely a difference between those two pictures.

I am pretty sure I will like it a lot. I know from experience that how the TV is setup determines how good it looks. I am a firm believer that you can take the worst reviewed TV in existence, calibrate it, and it will look better than 99 percent of the TVs in the stores.

Good deal, I hope you like the set (despite what you saw at that sorry excuse for an audio/video store).

The tour might be filled up by then, but you never know. In any case you are welcome to come see mine when it's calibrated to see if it's something you find worth spending on.

If I have me 6768 by then and I have had it long enough to break it in I may be interested.

Sorry, those pics I saw were on p71 of the owners thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=559872&page=71&pp=30 :rolleyes:
Here is another one that some one posted.
http://gallery.avsforum.com/showphoto.php/photo/15988/size/big

^not that much different. Background isn't as blocky

That is correct. My main concerns are black levels and brightness. Something from what I have read has been addressed. I ordered from TVA knowing I had 30 days to try it out. Based on the comments here, and the reviews of the Qualia which the Samsung is reportedly almost equalling, the odds are good I will like the TV. There really isn't much choices if you want 1080p, which I do.
I really think that the black levels are good in these new 1080p sets. I will have to see for myself.

The tour might be filled up by then, but you never know. In any case you are welcome to come see mine when it's calibrated to see if it's something you find worth spending on.

What exactly is a tour?

stumacdoUse HDMI for DVD or HD-DTV ???
Hope I'm not misunderstanding but if you buy the 950 it comes with it's own HDMI Cable and so why don't you test them both ways.

I presently have my 950 using HDMI with great results and it sort of does it's own thing automatically to 1080i and then it lets you select preferred viewing mode and if you want to remove letterbox effect.

I like it but it's PQ is better than my old Sony Progressive but just falls short of my Sharp AQuos FP of my HD 1080i channels which are pretty damn hard to beat as some are perfect and they are being fed via Component for now from the HDSTB to TV. I most likely will go Blu-ray next year but for now the 950 gives me HD quality and ability to remove letterbox and for a relatively low price as some of these upconversion s cost considerably more plus I feel if it's going to work great on anything it'll be that 6768.

Still waiting for my 6768 to test it out on though. I do not have any DVR's though. I would try both ways and see what's best but at least Samsung provides the HDMI for free with the 950 and a few other cables as well. Good luck! :D

about the brightnes of the bulbs...

At Magnolia i was told that samsung's bulbs are aimed straight at the picture, and Mitsubishi angles their bulb, which makes it a little bit duller (but also gives it more detail) So if Mitsubishi has a brighter bulb, it doesn't mean its going to be much (if at all) brighter.

A tour happens for two reasons. One, a qualified ISF tech is not available in your area. Let's say you live upstate New York or some remote section of the country. Rather than you shelling out a lot of money to pay for somebody to fly out and stay at a hotel, plus the calibration cost, you and others that share your passion for the ultimate picture, get together and organize a tour. Your little group then splits the costs of the travel for the ISF tech. This is why the good techs are able to make a living just by doing calibrations.

The second reason is that you are familiar with a particular tech and knows he does good work because you've used him before. I am new to the Tampa area so I 'm not sure if there are qualified ISF techs here. I spoke to my tech in New Jersey and he already knew some people in the area, of whom one is in Clearwater, who were interested in calibration. He will be free in November so that is when it was scheduled. I don't know right now if he managed to book the other spots since he will only be here a Friday through Monday. If you are interested in more information, you can contact him at Eliab@avical.com and also visit www.avical.com for more info. I have been using him in NJ for the last 3 years since he lived 20 mins away from me.

Here is a quote from our last conversation:

"Another thing that you should know concerning the Samsung displays is that my business partner literally wrote the calibration manual for them while consulting with Samsung at Joe Kane Productions (makers of Digital Video Essentials). Point is, I know how to really tweak these babies..:-) But, I also attended an invitation only seminar in LA back in March on how to approach these displays. They're extremely idiosyncratic and require and entirely new approach when calibrating them. In fact, they also require different instrumentation as the tristimulous analyzers that most ISF technicians own cannot be used. For that reason, I finally took the plunge and purchased the ferrari so to speak of color analyzers this past April...:-)

I'm now utilizing the legendary Photo Research PR-650 Spectroradiometer which is literally the reference tool by which all other analyzers are judged up against. The 650 is quite literally the most accurate analyzer under 40K. It'll ensure that the display in question will be adjusted at a level of precision rarely found in ISF calibrations. "

Eliab

Avical/Precision Theater Consultants
Video Calibration Specialists
Mobile - 908-531-7028
Email - info@avical.com
Website - www.Avical.com

What exactly is a tour?

about the brightnes of the bulbs...

At Magnolia i was told that samsung's bulbs are aimed straight at the picture, and Mitsubishi angles their bulb, which makes it a little bit duller (but also gives it more detail) So if Mitsubishi has a brighter bulb, it doesn't mean its going to be much (if at all) brighter.

Thanks, this is very interesting info; will be interesting to see if the 1080p Mits' are 'sharper' or not--hard to believe it would be possible from what one is hearing about the Sammies. Anyway, the proof will be when we see them side-by-side!

couple questions...
i've got the sammy 950 dvd player. i've got it plugged into my 5667 via hdmi, and then an optical cable from the tv to my stereo receiver. I can't get dolby digital sound out of my receiver with this set up. Did I read somewhere that HDMI can't carry DD? darn! oh well, optical from the 950 to the receiver is easy enough... just trying to save an optical input on my receiver.

2nd question - on the 950, there is a option of resolution output - 480, 720 , 1080. The 5667 is a 720 set, but I can selecte the 1080 output on the 950 and the picture looks fine. Is there a difference betwee the 720 and 1080 output in my situation? Any thing I should be considering when selecting the output resolution?

Thanks in advance!

set the 950 dvd player to output bitstream instead of pcm in the setup menu; run the optical cable from the dvd player directly to receiver

Sweet! I just got an email from Eliab for the DC tour schedule. I'm scheduled for September 8th so hopefully I won't have any problems with my replacement set. I should be able to get in at least 2 weeks of use on the replacement set so I guess that should be enough time for a full burn in.

A tour happens for two reasons. One, a qualified ISF tech is not available in your area. Let's say you live upstate New York or some remote section of the country. Rather than you shelling out a lot of money to pay for somebody to fly out and stay at a hotel, plus the calibration cost, you and others that share your passion for the ultimate picture, get together and organize a tour. Your little group then splits the costs of the travel for the ISF tech. This is why the good techs are able to make a living just by doing calibrations.

The second reason is that you are familiar with a particular tech and knows he does good work because you've used him before. I am new to the Tampa area so I 'm not sure if there are qualified ISF techs here. I spoke to my tech in New Jersey and he already knew some people in the area, of whom one is in Clearwater, who were interested in calibration. He will be free in November so that is when it was scheduled. I don't know right now if he managed to book the other spots since he will only be here a Friday through Monday. If you are interested in more information, you can contact him at Eliab@avical.com and also visit www.avical.com for more info. I have been using him in NJ for the last 3 years since he lived 20 mins away from me.

Here is a quote from our last conversation:

"Another thing that you should know concerning the Samsung displays is that my business partner literally wrote the calibration manual for them while consulting with Samsung at Joe Kane Productions (makers of Digital Video Essentials). Point is, I know how to really tweak these babies..:-) But, I also attended an invitation only seminar in LA back in March on how to approach these displays. They're extremely idiosyncratic and require and entirely new approach when calibrating them. In fact, they also require different instrumentation as the tristimulous analyzers that most ISF technicians own cannot be used. For that reason, I finally took the plunge and purchased the ferrari so to speak of color analyzers this past April...:-)

I'm now utilizing the legendary Photo Research PR-650 Spectroradiometer which is literally the reference tool by which all other analyzers are judged up against. The 650 is quite literally the most accurate analyzer under 40K. It'll ensure that the display in question will be adjusted at a level of precision rarely found in ISF calibrations. "

Eliab

Avical/Precision Theater Consultants
Video Calibration Specialists
Mobile - 908-531-7028
Email - info@avical.com
Website - www.Avical.com

I am new to the Tampa area so I 'm not sure if there are qualified ISF techs here.
slocko - Louis Carliner is in the Tampa area. He did my TV about 5 yrs ago when I lived there. Look him up.

Does anyone know why the Samsung 1080p manuals states that the HDMI input's will not accept a PC connection? Is there a technical limitation of the Samsung DLP's? The new Mits 1080p uses the HDMI for their PC connections (The Mits does not have a VGA input). Also would the PC HDMI port provide a better picture than the PC VGA port?

Does anyone know why the Samsung 1080p manuals states that the HDMI input's will not accept a PC connection?
As far as I know they will.

It would take a DVI/HDMI cable because there are no HDMI graphics cards that I know about. The HDMI sound capability wouldn't work for several reasons, but it seems to be limited anyway.

I use a HTPC for movies on our HLP5063 with a DVI connection. HDMI is backward compatible with video through DVI.

Is there a technical limitation of the DLP?
The fact that the TV uses a DLP chip to create the image isn't relevant. The fact that Samsung and other TV companies don't want to answers an infinite number of computer questions may have something to do with that disclaimer. :cool:

Also would the PC HDMI port provide a better picture than the PC VGA port? I think it does. VGA requires a digital to analog conversion before transmission and then a analog to digital conversion for display.

Does anyone know why the Samsung 1080p manuals states that the HDMI input's will not accept a PC connection?
I have a 6168. The HDMI will accept a PC connection (DVI->HDMI) but it's limited to 1080i.
Also would the PC HDMI port provide a better picture than the PC VGA port?
The VGA port allows 1920x1080@60Hz and image quality is very good. Also, I can get 1:1 pixel mapping over VGA but not over HDMI. I do not understand why this is so. So for me, the VGA port gives a better picture than the HDMI port.

The VGA port allows 1920x1080@60Hz and image quality is very good. Also, I can get 1:1 pixel mapping over VGA but not over HDMI. I do not understand why this is so. So for me, the VGA port gives a better picture than the HDMI port.
Since my set is native 720p any comment I made about PQ between VGA and HDMI should have been qualified. I am able to use my TV's native resolution for my PC output. :o

I have a 6168. The HDMI will accept a PC connection (DVI->HDMI) but it's limited to 1080i.

The VGA port allows 1920x1080@60Hz and image quality is very good. Also, I can get 1:1 pixel mapping over VGA but not over HDMI. I do not understand why this is so. So for me, the VGA port gives a better picture than the HDMI port.

Thanks for your reply. Can you explain what the 1:1 pixel mapping provides?

Barely a difference between those two pictures.

Sorry you can't see it, but I was impressed. 10-20% better IMO.

I took a ride to the local Samsung/Mitsubishi dealer and found out, much to my horror, that this particular Ultimate Electronics was using a "modified" composite conection, whatever they meant by that...and that they could not and would not connect the sets via the HDMI connection to some standardized 1080i or 720p source. My comments about the Samsung 6168/78 were clearly premature the other day, even though my "rant" was rife with disappointment and not pretentiousness, as some of you might have genuinely felt. I touched base with three other local dealers who, over the phone, told me that they also could not/would not arrange for what I considered to be the "proper" connections to be made for me to do a critical A/B of the Samsung and the "comparable" (notice the quotes, used for effect) Mitsubishi sets. They also said, as if with one collective voice...No, we don't have the resources and time to spend to do what you want. Seems like they still use the old trick they tried to force me to use years ago...wear the customer out, and he'll buy in desperation. (We used to call it, slapping the customer around). Since visual memory is many orders of magnitude better than auditory memory, I was satisfied with swapping tvs with the same input cable/source. The Samsung had significantly less pixelization than the Mitsu during that comparison. This was by no means a double blind study, but I did learn that by keeping one variable constant (the source), no matter how poor the source, you could tell when a poor source looked worse. In short, after spending time with the Sony Qualia, the JVC LCoS, and the Mitsubishis, IMHO, the Samsung took the lead. Mind you, this source was the standard Mitsubishi "infomercial" on what the salesman called a "hard drive." I'm done shopping....TVAuth. has my order for the 6168! When I get my set in 2 weeks (hopefully), I'll share my experiences with you guys. Thanks thus far for all of your constructive and destructive criticism...over the last few days. :D

The Samsung had significantly less pixelization than the Mitsu during that comparison. This was by no means a double blind study, but I did learn that by keeping one variable constant (the source), no matter how poor the source, you could tell when a poor source looked worse. In short, after spending time with the Sony Qualia, the JVC LCoS, and the Mitsubishis, IMHO, the Samsung took the lead. :D

Was the Mits you were comparing the Sammy to one of the new 1080p sets, or the 720p ones? Thanks for a helpful report!

I took a ride to the local Samsung/Mitsubishi dealer and found out, much to my horror, that this particular Ultimate Electronics was using a "modified" composite conection, whatever they meant by that...and that they could not and would not connect the sets via the HDMI connection to some standardized 1080i or 720p source. My comments about the Samsung 6168/78 were clearly premature the other day, even though my "rant" was rife with disappointment and not pretentiousness, as some of you might have genuinely felt. I touched base with three other local dealers who, over the phone, told me that they also could not/would not arrange for what I considered to be the "proper" connections to be made for me to do a critical A/B of the Samsung and the "comparable" (notice the quotes, used for effect) Mitsubishi sets. They also said, as if with one collective voice...No, we don't have the resources and time to spend to do what you want. Seems like they still use the old trick they tried to force me to use years ago...wear the customer out, and he'll buy in desperation. (We used to call it, slapping the customer around). Since visual memory is many orders of magnitude better than auditory memory, I was satisfied with swapping tvs with the same input cable/source. The Samsung had significantly less pixelization than the Mitsu during that comparison. This was by no means a double blind study, but I did learn that by keeping one variable constant (the source), no matter how poor the source, you could tell when a poor source looked worse. In short, after spending time with the Sony Qualia, the JVC LCoS, and the Mitsubishis, IMHO, the Samsung took the lead. Mind you, this source was the standard Mitsubishi "infomercial" on what the salesman called a "hard drive." I'm done shopping....TVAuth. has my order for the 6168! When I get my set in 2 weeks (hopefully), I'll share my experiences with you guys. Thanks thus far for all of your constructive and destructive criticism...over the last few days. :D
You are quite the man, to give us this good report. :) I sure have learned for it. That is what we were saying all along that the Samsung TV's are simply better than the rest. I believe this. I have compared everything for years now and the new Sammy's 1080p are awesome. More than words can describe. I had the same experience as you in the store. They simply dont care. I have never bought a TV from a store since 1997 and will not. I trust online more and I am having better luck with their help. I always window shop and then buy online. Either from TVA..... VANNS...... or ONECALL. These are the best companies that I have every dealt with. Thanks again for your report. It sure will help a lot of people on this forum who is looking for a good TV and which one to get. This is the foundation of them. :D

I will have my set tomorrow morning. WHEEEEEEEEE, Finally!!!

Is it possible to display a PC image on the new Samsung 1080p DLP's with a PIP source next to the PC image?

Interesting you should mention the Mitsubishi "infomercial" on a "hard drive." Where are you located? I've viewed a HLR5078 and a HLR6168 in two different SoundTracks in my area. One of them plays the Mitsubishi "infomercial" to the HDTVs but I'm not sure what input is through on the TV, it appears as channel 14-1. Whatever it is, it produces an excellent picture. In another SoundTrack they feed the HDTVs either HDNet or Discovery-HD via component and it looks very good also. In both cases the difference between the 68/78 and 67 is very evident. However, in BB+Magnolia they are feeding their loop to a HLR6168 and the HLR5067 and it looks awful.

I noticed up above that subwoofer mentioned not being able to see difference in PQ between a 720p 67 and a 1080p 68 or 78. He's not the only one to have said this. Then someone else remarked about being a 10-20% difference. Many others have felt the same (including me) that there is a noticeable difference between the 1080p 68/78 and the 720p 67. Maybe something that's missing here is some measure of how much better the 1080p sets look relative to the 720p sets. Is it night and day? No! Is the 1080p twice as good as the 720p? Probably not! Is the 1080p half as good again (i.e. 50% better) than the 720p? Maybe! Is the 1080p 10-20% or 25% better than the 720p? Yes, I would say so. This is a lot like the debates that regular go on over in the DVD players forum about whether a 720p/1080i upconvert DVD player is that much better than a regular 480i/p DVD player. Its not a huge improvement but more like 20-25% to me. In either case, I suppose what it all boils down to is how much better you expect it to be and how much better you think it is after viewing. That may be little or nothing to some people.
No matter what, 20-25% is still a lot. But I beleive that they have 30-40% is my take on it, I have seen them both at the store and it looks like 40% better. I think that it also depends on the setup and feed. Cables make a big difference on the quality. I am a firm believer of this: "A TV is only as good as the cables and source that it uses/receives." This is how I view it. I did an experiment one day. I hooked up the same TV to all my components with all different cables. It took me about 3 days to use all the different types of cables that are made on the market. ;)

I bought them all and tried them all out. I can see a big difference from composite, to DVI and HDMI. using the Monster M series cables, which is currently the higher cost of cables. IE Monster M series 4 meters, will be about $299.99 for them. The RCA were the worst in Composite video. The S-video was better. The off market brand cables were real bad. Like I have said in an earlier posts a week ago, that in fact cables do make the signal either Excellent, great, good or poor. Try this test yourself and you will see. But you have to look real close to see the difference on some of them. I also used my Oscilliscope to test the wave forms of the output and input of these cables too. On the Monster M series it was almost flat line, no noise or white noise with that set up. Since the Monster line is filled with gas, they are good. They have a lifetime warranty too. That is all that I use for my entire setup. Nothing beats HDMI or DVI cables, HDMI being the recent and the best bcause you can get video and signal through one cable, unlike the DVI cable. Only video for DVI ad much bigger connector too. What else should them make??? :) :D

Anyone have a clue when these sets will make it to the local BB's of the world. Well... at least to the Houston, TX part of the world?

AkstpWith a good source, good cables, and some suitable PQ adjusting at home the 1080p set may well end up looking 50% better than the 720p. Its hard to put a number on how much better something looks than something else, especially as much of it can be rather subjective. Hmmm, maybe we should start a poll.
I think we all could agree (except for Gazelle) that going back to CES and photo's comparing 720P vs. 1080P sets the level of detail and clarity was obvious present - and how we perceived it would be difficult to measure a percentage but to me it was significant enough that it gave the 1080P a quality of a Plasma look. (I do like plasma but in the 60+" sizes simply have a price margin 3x higher.)

Also, that all things being equal and set-up properly NONE of these sets could possibly look awful unless the sets were defective in their condition of or in their source - as they are digital then they are pretty much a clone of one another. Environmental conditions may have some impact but if they look awful as some have stated it should be obvious to the viewer if they understand digital technology that something is amiss otherwise I would not think Samsung would not be making more 10 Billion in profits last year and this year - they certainly couldn't turn profits like that if they looked awful. My statements don't mean to say Samsung is Better - there will be plenty of a great 1080P's but we can see they are the innovator bringing product changes to market much quicker than anyone else and they are king of DLP and hot enough that Sony has partnered with them sharing 24,000 patents - after all who else has about 5-6 1080P sets right now shipping to even consider? No one but Samsung.

I recall about 8 months ago I'd thought 1080P vs. 720 was a marketing scheme by the TV Industry but over time in reviewing those in the know on this forum and seeing a slideshow presentation by a pro photographer with them side-by-side the difference was obviously in favor of the 1080P and the overwhelming reviews that've poured in have provided testimonial that has supported that. I'm awaiting UCSB feedback as he more than anyone has been the guardian and gatekeeper of these Samsung threads since CES. The percentage of improvement? It's enough to make hundreds in this PB nearly salivate in anticipation. It makes enough difference that we'll pay significantly more. Come on UCSB bring on the feedback! We await your quality review and keen eye :D

Anyone have a clue when these sets will make it to the local BB's of the world. Well... at least to the Houston, TX part of the world?
They seem to trickle in - most BB don't even know what 1080P is in my area anyway. They seem to clear stock first as I followed the JVC 720P and Pio 5050 they were 6 weeks before receiving their stock while competitors had them and of course I've never seen them have prices close to PB and ours rarely carries anything larger than 61". Perhaps the ones with Magnolia will have them sooner.

With a good source, good cables, and some suitable PQ adjusting at home the 1080p set may well end up looking 50% better than the 720p. Its hard to put a number on how much better something looks than something else, especially as much of it can be rather subjective. Hmmm, maybe we should start a poll. ;)
I agree with you completely. It is up to the person whos buys the tv and the environment that it is in. No matter what all TVs look good in a house all by themselves, then you have nothing to compare them with, side-by-side. :D

Just for everyones info, the Best Buy over in Denver West has the 6168w on display with the upconverting 950 series samsung running a hdmi cable to it. Looks pretty sweet for DVD's. Okay bye.

Hi,

Just got a HL-R5067W and I have 3 quick questions?
1. With the Directv HR10-250, you can select the various outputs, i.e. 480, 720 and 1080. Knowing that the HL-R5067W is 720P native, am I best served by leaving the HR10-250 at that setting, i.e. does it make sense to even output at 1080 ?
2. Also, when using an upconvert DVD player such as the Oppo, should I just set outputs to 720P on the DVD Player.
3. Finally, when using a Home Theater set-up disk (such as Avia), what settings should I have on the Samsung for Video, i.e. Movie, Standard, Custom, Dynamic, etc.

Sorry if these seem a little dumb, first time with a DLP. Thanks in advance.

^I gotta see if my local Best Buy has the xx68 or xx78 series yet. I hate asking because most of the time the salesman has no idea what I'm talking about and thinks the xx67 and xx68 series are the same!

Audio Lag question:

Everyone now and then mentions that they are getting audio lag on some channels. It seems like they are getting this by having the setup of the audio cables going straight to the DLP tv and not to an AVR. I have the Yamaha 2400 AVR which has an audio delay feature built into it. Will this completely solve the problem? Doesn't seem that it would since the audio-lag issue doesn't happen every second, so how would the AVR know when it occurs. Or am I wrong and this receiver will eliminate all of these errors? I believe I heard from one user here saying that his AVR fixed his problems.

Hi,

Just got a HL-R5067W and I have 3 quick questions?
1. With the Directv HR10-250, you can select the various outputs, i.e. 480, 720 and 1080. Knowing that the HL-R5067W is 720P native, am I best served by leaving the HR10-250 at that setting, i.e. does it make sense to even output at 1080 ?
2. Also, when using an upconvert DVD player such as the Oppo, should I just set outputs to 720P on the DVD Player.
3. Finally, when using a Home Theater set-up disk (such as Avia), what settings should I have on the Samsung for Video, i.e. Movie, Standard, Custom, Dynamic, etc.

Sorry if these seem a little dumb, first time with a DLP. Thanks in advance.

The conventional wisdom is that you should feed your (720p) tv a 720p input for the best results. This addresses your questions 1. and 2. (Of course, it is easy to try the other inputs just to put the 'conventional wisdom' to a test!)

Re 3., I would calibrate with AVIA or DVE with which ever video setting you prefer to watch it with; most people find 'Movie' to have the better picture. ACtually, you can calibrate it for EACH setting (Movie, Standard, etc.) SEPARATELY, and your tv will remember these settings each time you change from one video mode to another.

The conventional wisdom is that you should feed your (720p) tv a 720p input for the best results. This addresses your questions 1. and 2. (Of course, it is easy to try the other inputs just to put the 'conventional wisdom' to a test!)

Re 3., I would calibrate with AVIA or DVE with which ever video setting you prefer to watch it with; most people find 'Movie' to have the better picture. ACtually, you can calibrate it for EACH setting (Movie, Standard, etc.) SEPARATELY, and your tv will remember these settings each time you change from one video mode to another.

Millerwill - thanks for the quick response. As far as always using the 720P input, is there any setting on the Sammy that I need to set to always default to 720P, or does it default to that ? I'm going to be running component from my Directv HR10-250 and DVI/HDMI from my Oppo DVD.

The conventional wisdom is that you should feed your (720p) tv a 720p input for the best results.

Many people believe that it is best to feed the TV the native resolution of the source, and let the TV perform the scaling/upconversion to 720p. Personally, I don't notice that much difference whether I set my Comcast/Motorola 6412 to output 1080i or 720p, but I usually leave it on the former (since most HD sources are 1080i - except ESPN and ABC). Some STB's allow you to just pass the native resolution; my 6412 does not.
This applies STB's, not upconverting DVD players, which typically have upconverters at least equal to those in the TV.

stumacdo - there is no action you need to take to get the Sammy to display 720p. That's all it does.

Hi,

Just got a HL-R5067W and I have 3 quick questions?
1. With the Directv HR10-250, you can select the various outputs, i.e. 480, 720 and 1080. Knowing that the HL-R5067W is 720P native, am I best served by leaving the HR10-250 at that setting, i.e. does it make sense to even output at 1080 ?
2. Also, when using an upconvert DVD player such as the Oppo, should I just set outputs to 720P on the DVD Player.
3. Finally, when using a Home Theater set-up disk (such as Avia), what settings should I have on the Samsung for Video, i.e. Movie, Standard, Custom, Dynamic, etc.

Sorry if these seem a little dumb, first time with a DLP. Thanks in advance.

I believe you will have to experiment to determine what is best because it all depends on which device has the better video processing circuitry. Certainly when the source is in the native format of the TV, pass it on through without processing, however, any other format, you will need to see which device does the conversion to the sets native format best. The Oppo more than likely is doing a better job and therefore that should be set at the set's native format; I don't know about the HR10-250...that you should experiment with.

Thanks for the info !! I will leave the Oppo to output at 720P and play around with the HR10-250. Honestly, I haven't seen any difference with the HR10-250 between 720P and 1080i.

Many people believe that it is best to feed the TV the native resolution of the source, and let the TV perform the scaling/upconversion to 720p. .

Is this really what you have seen? Almost all reports I've seen have said that the PQ is better by sending the tv ITS native resolution, i.e., to do the up-scaling in the source equipment before sending it to the tv. Please correct me if I've got it wrong.

There's no hard and fast rule for the upconversion location as far as between your source component or display. The myriad displays and source devices, coupled with their ability/inability to pass through the native rez of a given broadcast tends to complicate the matter. Some people tend to think that if their display contains a "quality scaler" (Faroudja and others, then you may as well use that). Some people think that Faroudja tends to be more hype than substance... I've seen good ones and bad ones use this tech, personally. Another monkeywrench gets thrown into the works with some of these displays since the more they have to process the video, the more out of sync the audio becomes due to delayed video.

So the answer to your question is, "Ummm.. well...uhhh... depends". :)

Regs,
Jeff

Is this really what you have seen? Almost all reports I've seen have said that the PQ is better by sending the tv ITS native resolution, i.e., to do the up-scaling in the source equipment before sending it to the tv. Please correct me if I've got it wrong.
Samsung has recommended native resolution input where possible. That's how our STB and HTPC is set up, and I have no plans to change it.

For the energetic it's easy to try both ways. :cool:

Thanks to all who provided input to my previous post. I ordered my HL-R6167W and should be here within two weeks. I also just ordered a Samsung DVD-HD950 and a TR61X2 stand. Should be enjoying this all by end of month.

Question in regards to extended warranties. As I stated before, this 67W cost me nothing, other than a boat load of Marriott Rewards points that took many years to accumulate. But, repairs cost money. I checked Repair Master (at vendor and TVA) and they were hesitating about the zero dollar invoice, which concerned me. I called Sears Warranties and they provided a 5 year master protection agreement, which includes everything (bulb also) and a yearly visit upon request. Cost for this with Sears is about (am I allowed to put this) -- $499.

Let me know your thoughts and recommendations and thanks again for the previous feedback/input.

Ted

Samsung has recommended native resolution input where possible. That's how our STB and HTPC is set up, and I have no plans to change it.

For the energetic it's easy to try both ways. :cool:


Do you recall where Samsung said that? Reference? Link?

thadius65 I checked Repair Master (at vendor and TVA) and they were hesitating about the zero dollar invoice, which concerned me. I called Sears Warranties and they provided a 5 year master protection agreement, which includes everything (bulb also) and a yearly visit upon request. Cost for this with Sears is about (am I allowed to put this) -- $499.

Congratulations - What a Perk! One of the reasons Repairmaster would be concerned is that your buying Insurance that is driven by a scale of price as it's not unusual for any serious issues to make a full replacement set available. You can figure that Samsung covers the first year and bulb and your insurance picks up after that. Even though the bulbs are rated at 6-8000 hours they can burn out sooner and I think they run about $200 each - but a new bulb = a new TV look each time. Whether the $499 is your best deal I can't say but you'll have a care free experience for 5 years with the insurance or should I say repair services. I'd go for it just to have the peace of mind. Wish you and your family a great viewing experience! :)

Ok I got my TV and played with it for 4 hours. I am ready to rule now and tell you what I think. Mixed reviews. I just dont understand somethings about the 6178, not me, but how Samsung built it. Strange.

Does the HLR5067W really suck for playing games on?

I wanted to hook up a Playstation 2 via component cables but now I am scared a little.

I am not a hardcore user like you guys, I just like to sit around and watch movies. In Best Buy it looks fine and I saw no lag with the DVD they were running, Monsters, Inc. Is the gaming aspect of this TV really that bad that it's not even possible to play games on it?

Do you recall where Samsung said that? Reference? Link?
I remember that I saw it in a Samsung User's Manual. Before that it was reported by other owners in threads related to the HLN sets.

It was just one sentence and there was no explanation.

Some people prefer component connections even though there are two analog/digital conversions involved. I think it's a perfect situation where you can make your choice based on what looks best to you.

According to SethS, my computer is doing a very good job of de-interlacing 480i and scaling 480p to 720p so that's a no brainer for me.

Since Samsung's HDMI and DVI will not accept 480i I chose to set the Comcast STB to output 720p. That means ABC, Fox, and ESPN HDTV are passed through without change. It also means that 1080i has to be de-interlaced and scaled by the STB. That's probably not great, but it works for our TV habits. Right now the Comcast digital channels have good SD PQ and very good HD PQ. The Analog channels are not great but they are very watchable.

Our priorities are DVD movies and sports. We have a calibrated 720p HLP5063. Maybe I would change some things if we were installing a new 1080p set. :rolleyes:

wbertramOriginally Posted by htwaits
Samsung has recommended native resolution input where possible. That's how our STB and HTPC is set up, and I have no plans to change it.

I've done a search and find on the entire manual for the 6768 (1080P) and all resolution references are within the TV - PC connections and in the current manual they don't use "Native" they use "Optimal" Resolution 1920x1080 @60Hz. It does make sense to me anyways that you'd use the Optimal. Not trying to contradict anyone just all my searches within the manual returned this only in the TV-PC area. :D

Does the HLR5067W really suck for playing games on?

I wanted to hook up a Playstation 2 via component cables but now I am scared a little.

I am not a hardcore user like you guys, I just like to sit around and watch movies. In Best Buy it looks fine and I saw no lag with the DVD they were running, Monsters, Inc. Is the gaming aspect of this TV really that bad that it's not even possible to play games on it?

I've got just that, a HLR5067W and a PS2 with component cables. So far I have not seen anything that I could say for sure wa a lag effect while playing any of my games, which are mostly driving games, both 480i and 480p. One 480i game has a shift indicator and I can't see any delay between when I hit the button and when the indicator changes. To me that suggests that the lag is short. There's really no way for me to tell for sure on the other games. I can still set high scores so again, it can't be too bad.

The 480i graphics don't look very good and I find myself playing less than I used to due to how bad looks rather than due to any lag issues.

You won't see any TV-induced lip sync problem on a DVD if the audio is coming from the TV's speakers. The problem happens when the audio is sent straight to an AVR. The video will lag the audio.

Jon

Ok I got my TV and played with it for 4 hours. I am ready to rule now and tell you what I think. Mixed reviews. I just dont understand somethings about the 6178, not me, but how Samsung built it. Strange.

OK, sit down, shut up and hold on, here is my review for the 6178W TV.

I am real impressed with the look of this tv, where the speakers and TV are in one unit. It gives it a cleaner look, a "Classical" look and feel.
1. No Glare, unlike the other makers.
2. Bright, Sharp, and warm picture, very clear too only on the 1080p format.
The other formats, even over the air signal is not great. But HD is AWESOME. I am very impressed. Satelite is awesome, shich I have. You need it for this TV.
3. Lip sync and lag big time, but I corrected that with my Onkyo THX ULTRA Reciever. I also mute the TV while listening through my speakers. No lag now.
4. Super quiet fan, no color purple on the wall. Cant see it anyway.
5. It fits real nicely on the Samsung TV stand that I got for it. The one we have be all taking about with deminsions.... The TRX61SB2.
6. The 1080p HDMI works great with the Sony 975V DVD player. better than I have even seen, I am serious about this. Better then my SONY LCD Upsatirs. WOW. When you set the DVD to Cinema 2, it is just like the Movies, but better.
7. It does have PIP, and with one touch of the button. Others claim that this is hard, You touch it once and get the PIP right up. It is the blue button on the far right bottom of the remote. See it. In the menu you have to enable this feature. If not, it wont work. That is the trick to this TV, you have to set everything up in the Menu before the remote can work right.
8. You have to play with the settings to get the color and picture just right. I am using the Dynamic settings in the day and Movie at night. WOW, the blacks are real black and the whites are real white. The contrast is more than Awesome, compared to the HLN sets. The 68 and 78 series are simply the very best of the best in my book.
9. The clock is a great feature to have. I like that.
10. The sound is awesome, you can change this at 4 different levels. I use the SRS TXT on. Which solves the problem of playing the 5.1 content over two speakers. Subwoffer I have on, and what a difference. It sounds like a stereo 5.1 channel. Set setero on in your TV menu.
11. Digitsl NR, make sure it is on, this reduces the static and ghosting that you have have over the air signal. The ghosting is gone, on mine.
12. Set LNA on for the recepion will be stronger on over the air signal.
13. I wish that this TV had three HDMI imputs, since they seem to work better that all the other imputs.
14. PS2 works great, no lag, or anything as others comment on.

OVERALL: This TV is one of the best that I have ever seen, besides plasma's, but we wont go there, not now and not ever. Anyway, This TV is awesome, mine works real well right out of the box. Plasma 61 inch is HOW MUCH, OUCH!!!

The shipping was great. My tv was package well. Foam all the way around and cardboard spindles to protect the screen. Unlike what other people had recieved their TV. I guess the new shippments are better than the old.

WHAT ELSE WOULD YOU LIKE TO KNOW. I WILL ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS.

Good job on the cable price. :D There are sure some bargins, out there, but I dont care, I have the money to buy Monster. I also get 60% off Monster cable anyway. So it is cheap for me, ifetime warranty too. Different strokes for different folks.

But everyone is right, when they talk about the price of Monster cables VS. other good brands that work the same. I dont disagree with that at all. :)

Please add:" Dont forget to set the TV to WARM1, in the menu, this is a great setting for everything. The cool setting is too blue and white looking. Warm 2 is too dark. The movie feature will handle that. WARM1, try it.

I love the one case design 78. It looks great!! My fianacee loves it, soon to be my wife. You know woman, everything has to look good in the house. They are more on looks rather than how it works, or the technical side of things.

It's funny you mention the cosmetics of the 78 because my wife felt that there was too much glare (probably due to the display lighting at the store) from the lacquer and that the 68 series had a "cleaner" look to it.

That leads me to my first question, is there any difference (besides cosmetic appearance) between the 68 and 78 series? I've been hearing conflicting stories.

My second question is, if there is no difference, how come the 68 series seems less expensive and yet harder to find in local retail stores as well as online?

It's funny you mention the cosmetics of the 78 because my wife felt that there was too much glare (probably due to the display lighting at the store) from the lacquer and that the 68 series had a "cleaner" look to it.

That leads me to my first question, is there any difference (besides cosmetic appearance) between the 68 and 78 series? I've been hearing conflicting stories.

My second question is, if there is no difference, how come the 68 series seems less expensive and yet harder to find in local retail stores as well as online?
Very good questions. I am not sure why the 68 is higher price, maybe the design look? Because they are both same. They have the same look, internally, hook ups and everything.

What do you mean cleaner look? I dont get it. I think that the one case design looks cleaner. I dont like the breakup of the speakers from the TV screen IE "Floating design" I like all one unit.

gunwratheOnly cosmetic differences
The 78 series are channelled through a higher end tier of the distribution channel however they are identical other than the Cosmetics, I like both but I could get my 6768 for $1400 less than the 7178 and it wasn't worth the extra money or the wait for 4 more inches since I'm pushing it already viewing a 67" at 9'.

Like I said I like both but not willing to pay that difference for 4" and black lacquer. I paid for both my new AVR and Bello stand with the difference. :D

gunwrathe
The 78 series are channelled through a higher end tier of the distribution channel however they are identical other than the Cosmetics, I like both but I could get my 6768 for $1400 less than the 7178 and it wasn't worth the extra money or the wait for 4 more inches since I'm pushing it already viewing a 67" at 9'.

Like I said I like both but not willing to pay that difference for 4" and black lacquer. I paid for both my new AVR and Bello stand with the difference. :D
This is a good observation. But I like the Bezel, but in my situation, the 78 and 68 were exactly the same price, so I got the 78. This makes much more sense to me.

That leads me to my first question, is there any difference (besides cosmetic appearance) between the 68 and 78 series? I've been hearing conflicting stories.
There is no difference between the two model lines. Where did you "hear" differently? You might get that kind of information from a sales person with only one version in stock. ;)

but I could get my 6768 for $1400 less than the 7178 and it wasn't worth the extra money or the wait for 4 more inches since I'm pushing it already viewing a 67" at 9'.

Of course this is about the same amount you are paying to go from 61" to 67"; where does it stop? If one wants to sit at a viewing distance of 1.5 X screen diagonal, and sits 10 ft from the screen, then this requires an 80" screen; what will the premium be to move up to that!

gunwrathe
The 78 series are channelled through a higher end tier of the distribution channel however they are identical other than the Cosmetics, I like both but I could get my 6768 for $1400 less than the 7178 and it wasn't worth the extra money or the wait for 4 more inches since I'm pushing it already viewing a 67" at 9'.

Like I said I like both but not willing to pay that difference for 4" and black lacquer. I paid for both my new AVR and Bello stand with the difference. :DI actually like the look of the 78 series a little better than the floating design 68 series...but could not justify the extra cost either...with the savings I bought a PUREAV PF60 Conditioner/Surge Protector...OPPO Dvd Player...some new cables...Now just need my new set. :D

Black laqueur bezel one-piece design of 78 series vs. floating screen design of 68 series....you have no choice if you are limited to the 50" model! :(

Or if you want the 71"-er.

I posted this in the xx67 thread, figure I would post it here too:

Went to Best Buy today and tried the 5067w with a PS2 game: Madden 2005. I thought the picture looked somewhat alright but could look better. Mind you that I was sitting about 4 feet from the tv. As for the question of lag, it was definitely there when I was doing kick off and punts due to the kick meter. However, I noticed that you can get your mind adjusted to it. When I came home on my CRT, there was zero lag. A big difference I would say. Although that was the only part of the game I felt you could really notice lag. When playing as the QB or RB, I felt the lag was minor to how you played.

Overall, I can't really decide if this is a reason or not to get a DLP tv. From what I've read and heard from others, is that Xbox games or games that are outputting a progressive scan signal do not show this. So perhaps you can get use to it or basically just wait for the PS3 and Xbox 360 to completely forget about console lag.

Has anyone here tried any PC games to see how perform?

No offense but I think reviews should be posted solely in the Samsung 1080p Owners thread. :)
I also posted that there too.

I also posted that there too.
That's the point. Once is enough no matter how excited you are. :)

Black laqueur bezel one-piece design of 78 series vs. floating screen design of 68 series....you have no choice if you are limited to the 50" model! :(
You are right for the 50" models. Maybe in the near future it will change.

Of course this is about the same amount you are paying to go from 61" to 67"; where does it stop? If one wants to sit at a viewing distance of 1.5 X screen diagonal, and sits 10 ft from the screen, then this requires an 80" screen; what will the premium be to move up to that!

I can tell you the premium for that...was just in Seoul this summer, wandered around in a large department store (Shinsegae) to look at the various DLP sets; nice variety of them, but the eye-catcher was an LG plasma display at 80", the posted price for which was a whopping 80 million won, which rounds out right at US$80,000!

-Greg Iverson in Milwaukee

That's the point. Once is enough no matter how excited you are. :)
They are different forums. I am on three of them and I dont see the same members. Therefore, I am posting on the forums that I am on. Which are currently three. Thanks for the info. I wont post the same for all.

I can tell you the premium for that...was just in Seoul this summer, wandered around in a large department store (Shinsegae) to look at the various DLP sets; nice variety of them, but the eye-catcher was an LG plasma display at 80", the posted price for which was a whopping 80 million won, which rounds out right at US$80,000!

-Greg Iverson in Milwaukee
WOW that is expensive, why would you buy this and then replace it after 5 years, when the gas runs out. Not worht it unless if you are totally rich.

No shortage of millionaires, especially in the DC area.

I can tell you the premium for that...was just in Seoul this summer, wandered around in a large department store (Shinsegae) to look at the various DLP sets; nice variety of them, but the eye-catcher was an LG plasma display at 80", the posted price for which was a whopping 80 million won, which rounds out right at US$80,000!

-Greg Iverson in Milwaukee

To achieve the 'HD design goal' of a viewing distance/screen size of 1.5, I think I will just stick with the 71" Sammy (or 73" Mits) and move my chair up to 9 ft away!

I actually like the look of the 78 series a little better than the floating design 68 series...but could not justify the extra cost either...with the savings I bought a PUREAV PF60 Conditioner/Surge Protector...OPPO Dvd Player...some new cables...Now just need my new set. :D
ME too, the look is cool.

I can tell you the premium for that...was just in Seoul this summer, wandered around in a large department store (Shinsegae) to look at the various DLP sets; nice variety of them, but the eye-catcher was an LG plasma display at 80", the posted price for which was a whopping 80 million won, which rounds out right at US$80,000!

-Greg Iverson in Milwaukee

I would hate to pay that electricity bill:)

To achieve the 'HD design goal' of a viewing distance/screen size of 1.5, I think I will just stick with the 71" Sammy (or 73" Mits) and move my chair up to 9 ft away!
WOW, :eek: you are killing me here, 71" or 73" at 9 feet, that is great. I think 71" is just to big for a small or medium size room like mine. But I would of got the 71" if it would of fit inside my entertainment center. The 61" is the largest that will fit. :D
Good luck to you. Let me know how this turns out.

I would hate to pay that electricity bill:)
Or a thief to take it!!! :eek:

Does the 80" Plasma look just as bad as the small 50" sets or is the pixel structure much smaller so it creates a watchable picture? On a 50" plasma all I see is the pixel structure and it is very annoying to look at.

Does the 80" Plasma look just as bad as the small 50" sets or is the pixel structure much smaller so it creates a watchable picture? On a 50" plasma all I see is the pixel structure and it is very annoying to look at.
I think the 80" looks just as bad as the 50". I think that the 80 is too large and it will look bad. I like the 50".

No shortage of millionaires, especially in the DC area.
You are sure right about that. I use to travel there and know what you mean. DC has a lot of money. That is where they print the money. Cool.

Hey folks,

Just wondering if anyone has the inside scoop as to whether Samsung may release a 42" and/or 46" version of these 1080p TVs.

Thanks!

FYI to all: I have played with my TV more and found it to work even better, when I play with the menu. I hate the simple fact then when you want to change, from Movie, Standard, Custom or Dynamic, you always have to go to the menu then picture and select what you want. My other TV had only one button to change between all these settings. Also you cant zoom, etc while using an 1080i format. This is fine. I got the picture looking real good now with DNIE on. This is much better. Hope this helps all you 68 and 78 owners.

why would you buy this and then replace it after 5 years, when the gas runs out.

Plasma lifetime is 20K to 30K hours per manufacturers' specs. Taking the lower value, you would have to run the plasma ~11 hours/day for it to die in 5 years. The national TV viewing average is about 4 hours/day, which equates to 13-14 years. Of course, anyone who can afford an $80K plasma probably doesn't care if it lasts 5 years or 13 years. :)

Plasma lifetime is 20K to 30K hours per manufacturers' specs. Taking the lower value, you would have to run the plasma ~11 hours/day for it to die in 5 years. The national TV viewing average is about 4 hours/day, which equates to 13-14 years. Of course, anyone who can afford an $80K plasma probably doesn't care if it lasts 5 years or 13 years. :)

These 'lifetimes' quoted for plasmas are for them to decay to about 50% of their original brightness. They will have lost 25% or their brightness much earlier, etc. I.e., they don't look like new until the time they die, but fade gradually. It depends on how much reduced PQ one is willing to live with.

I think somebody needs to stop me....

what is a good amp to go with the Denon 3805?

Which would have better stopping power a 45 ACP or 10 mm hollowpoint? Your choice!
As far as an amp goes.............since you are on the low side of your speakers rating you might want to check out a higher powered amp. Something around 400 to 500 watts output. The Sunfire line up of amps are very cost effective power but for more finesse look at an EAD Powermaster 1000 (200 watts x 5 channels) or 2000 (400 watts x 5 channels) or a CAL MCA 2500 (500 watts x 5 channels) and your journey will end. Fortunately or unfortunately, both of these companies are out of business but these amps can be bought for a good price used if you can find one.

Which would have better stopping power a 45 ACP or 10 mm hollowpoint? Your choice!
As far as an amp goes.............since you are on the low side of your speakers rating you might want to check out a higher powered amp. Something around 400 to 500 watts output. The Sunfire line up of amps are very cost effective power but for more finesse look at an EAD Powermaster 1000 (200 watts x 5 channels) or 2000 (400 watts x 5 channels) or a CAL MCA 2500 (500 watts x 5 channels) and your journey will end. Fortunately or unfortunately, both of these companies are out of business but these amps can be bought for a good price used if you can find one.
Now that is a monster of an Amp. I might upgrade to that one day. First things first, TV, oh got that cool. Speakers got that too. Now for a huge amp. I am still looking. 500 watts per channel. Cool.

I don't think I have enough room between my neighbors and myself for one of those powermasters. I think you would need at least 5 acres...lol. Those things are pretty pricey too! I'm thinking Rotel, anybody have any experience with them?

I don't think I have enough room between my neighbors and myself for one of those powermasters. I think you would need at least 5 acres...lol. Those things are pretty pricey too! I'm thinking Rotel, anybody have any experience with them?
And the weight, you would need a crane to lift it, lol. :eek:

Recently the subject of a HLR5656 model was brought up because Costco have been selling such a model. I stumbled across its manual on the Samsung web site here...
http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/200507/20050704183614234_BP68-00524A-00Eng_book.pdf
From this manual you'll see that there are actually four screen sizes: 46", 50", 56" and 61".
The rear panel shows a single HDMI input but there is no CableCard slot, no DVI input and no RGB/VGA input.

There is also an entry for it in the TVs section of the Samsung USA web site here...
http://product.samsung.com/cgi-bin/nabc/product/b2c_product_detail.jsp?eUser=&prod_id=HLR5656WX%2fXAA

and a brochure...
http://product.samsung.com/SamsungUSA/PRODUCT/20050726/HL-R5656W.pdfLooks like it may have the HD2+ chip.

Looks like it may have the HD2+ chip.
I really dont think that it has the HD2+ chip, because of the 720p. I would rethink this one. :D ;)

I wouldn't think so because according to the brochure it has the "Cinema Smooth" 720p Light Engine and a 2000:1 CR and "no visible pixel structure" which would give it the HD4 like in the 67 series. However you gotta wonder if someone goofed with the specs in the brochure as it mentions a 0.8" DMD and a 9,000rpm 7-segment color wheel. Samsung have shown themselves to be notoriously bad at producing error-free, accurate specs.
Correct, I think. It would have another chip than the HD2+ my guess is. Like you have stated above, the Brochure is wrong. I have seen two different brochures that Samsung has for the exact same product and they say two different things, therefore my guess is that Samsung is real bad about producing wrong material and write-ups.

I really dont think that it has the HD2+ chip, because of the 720p. I would rethink this one. :D ;)

HD2+ is 720p.

HD2+ is 720p.
Thnaks that is true. Then what would be the HD4+ 1080p?

I have a question for you, When they say Generation 6 in the brochure for the 68, 78 and 88 models, does this mean that Samsung is using the HD4+ chip?

What I've read:

In order of PQ:

xHD4: New 1080p's
HD4: New 720p's

HD2+: Old 720p's

HD3: Disappointing 720p

HD2: 2nd Generation 720p

Note: I've read about some xHD3 chips in newish sets but don't really know where they fit in perhaps 1080i or just wobulated 720p?!?

The xHD3 was the 1080p chip that was in the TI and Samsung prototypes shown first in Jan '04. But I don't think any products with these chips were ever brought to market; the xHD4 (present 1080p) replaced it.

What I've read:

In order of PQ:

xHD4: New 1080p's
HD4: New 720p's

HD2+: Old 720p's

HD3: Disappointing 720p

HD2: 2nd Generation 720p

Note: I've read about some xHD3 chips in newish sets but don't really know where they fit in perhaps 1080i or just wobulated 720p?!?
Your the best!!! That is what I was looking for. I wonder what the next generation chip will be. I really like the xHD4 chip.

HD3: Disappointing 720p
Shame on you. ;)


Note: I've read about some xHD3 chips in newish sets but don't really know where they fit in perhaps 1080i or just wobulated 720p?!?

TI's DLP chip family.

One mirror to control one pixel projected on the screen.
HD1 (720p) Never used by Samsung.
HD2 (720p)
HD2+ (720p)

Wobulated: One mirror controls two pixels projected on the screen.
HD3 (720p)
xHD3 (1080p) Never used by Samsung.

In this forum the chips used in the HLR sets are referred to as:
HD4 (720p)
xHD4 (1080p)
They are improved versions of the first wobulated chips (HD3 & xHD3).

For more information about the HLR sets read the first message in this thread.

Referring to HD4+ chips just adds confusion for people who are new to DLP TV.

Question for anyone who can answer this?
What is calibration? and does this need to be done on the 78 series when you buy it? Please explain. Thanks.

Question for anyone who can answer this?
What is calibration? and does this need to be done on the 78 series when you buy it? Please explain. Thanks.


Use the search function.

Calibration is a procedure to dial in your TV to a set of standardized metrics via specialized tools (could be ISF or SMPTE or what ever specs you are aiming to achieve.)

The new Mitsubishi 1080p DLP in 52" screen size apparently has an MSRP of about $3500 and the new Toshiba 1080p DLP in 56" screen size is supposedly going to have a MSRP of about $3200. The 50" Samsung currently has a MSRP of about $3800. The same kinds of price differentials will probably apply to the 60-62" screen sizes. Does it sound likely that Samsung will shortly need to cut their MSRPs by at least 10% to compete?

The price differential is even greater for the largest sets: that of the Mits 73727 is $5800 and that of the Sammy 7178 $6700. The 7178 does have a 1080p VGA input that the 73727 lacks, but I don't think that one feature makes that much difference. Street prices, however, may be closer, and we have yet to see how the PQ of the two sets compare.

The new Mitsubishi 1080p DLP in 52" screen size apparently has an MSRP of about $3500 and the new Toshiba 1080p DLP in 56" screen size is supposedly going to have a MSRP of about $3200. The 50" Samsung currently has a MSRP of about $3800. The same kinds of price differentials will probably apply to the 60-62" screen sizes. Does it sound likely that Samsung will shortly need to cut their MSRPs by at least 10% to compete?

I don't know... but I went to Fry's @ Campbell over the weekend and they seemed to have the new Mitsu 52" 1080P on display! The salesmen even claimed that the Mitsu had better PQ than the Sammy 6168. It should be possible for people to get to this store and evaluate the 2 sets side by side!

Note that they had some kind of hard-drive based device that was producing HD quality content that was being fed directly to the Sammy (no splitting). And they said that they could easily move this equipment to the Mitsu for comparison.

I thought the Sammy looked brilliant - didn't have time to look at the Mitsu...

FYI for SF Bay Area residents.

I don't know... but I went to Fry's @ Campbell over the weekend and they seemed to have the new Mitsu 52" 1080P on display! The salesmen even claimed that the Mitsu had better PQ than the Sammy 6168.
I have no idea who will have the best PQ when all the first year 1080p sets are available in stores.

I do have an idea about how much Fry's sales people are likely to know about PQ -- zip. :eek:

If Fry's has a Mitsubishi on display then Magnolia, GG, and Andersons will too very shortly. There should be many setups where they will be side by side. The source is always suspect, but that's even more true at Fry's.

I have no idea who will have the best PQ when all the first year 1080p sets are available in stores.

I do have an idea about how much Fry's sales people are likely to know about PQ -- zip. :eek:

If Fry's has a Mitsubishi on display then Magnolia, GG, and Andersons will too very shortly. There should be many setups where they will be side by side. The source is always suspect, but that's even more true at Fry's.

In fact at Campbell Fry's, the source was the BEST I have ever seen connected to any HDTV in any store including BB/Magnolia, Magnolia at Palo Alto and Good Guys.

If someone wants to compare these 2 TV sets with the same content (not sure it can be done simultaneously), now is the time - before they mess it up.

i went to a best buy here in VA and they had the 6168! it looked nice but sometimes when there was motion it looked "wiggly" as my sister put it.

They said they are getting the 67 inch on september 13th! :confused: i don't know if i'm glad that they have a date or sad that i'm gonna haveta wait till september. But now i've just become aware of the toshiba tv's and their price WHOOPS the sammy's. So now i'm in a pickle! gah.

do u guys know if the new 1080p mitsubishi t.v.s willhave a 1080P input? what about the toshiba's? thanks!

o and would it be bad to play the 1080p bluray discs through the 1080i input on the samsungs?

Was the motion problems from the feed? The only problem I see with motion on my 6168 is from the digital feed, the bitrate is too low most of the time. I will see the exact same effect on my HD LCD TV, it's just harder to see since it's only 26".

I posted this question in another forum as well, but................

Instead of using HDMI or DVI, can a Firewire connection yield the same HD picture as HDMI or DVI?

Was the motion problems from the feed? The only problem I see with motion on my 6168 is from the digital feed, the bitrate is too low most of the time. I will see the exact same effect on my HD LCD TV, it's just harder to see since it's only 26".

i think maybe a little bit of both? i couldn't really tell. There was a similar "wiggly-ness" on a few other t.v's, but not all of them. There was a plasma on the wall that didn't have the problem, but the dlp next to it (which was not a samsung) had the problem. the feed looked nice on still parts, so i can't tell!

what's a bitrate?

I went to the Best Buy at Pentagon City on saturday and I don't remember seeing the new Samsungs'.

I don't know... but I went to Fry's @ Campbell over the weekend and they seemed to have the new Mitsu 52" 1080P on display! The salesmen even claimed that the Mitsu had better PQ than the Sammy 6168. It should be possible for people to get to this store and evaluate the 2 sets side by side!

Note that they had some kind of hard-drive based device that was producing HD quality content that was being fed directly to the Sammy (no splitting). And they said that they could easily move this equipment to the Mitsu for comparison.

I thought the Sammy looked brilliant - didn't have time to look at the Mitsu...

FYI for SF Bay Area residents.
I saw both units side by side, and I am very sure that the Samsung looks so much brigther and better. I was just at Fry's this morning and spent a great deal of time looking at all the TV's. I feel that Samsung is the winner. :)

What's this "wiggly-ness" you refer to? How can motion look "wiggly"? Are you perhaps referring to the blocking or pixelation that can occur during motion when the feed is of poor quality?

i really wish i could describe it better, but i can't. the whole picture just .... um.... wiggled! Its possible it might have been pixelation to such a small extent that it gave this effect, but i don't know for sure what it was.

Could someone please tell me what PQ is?

Could someone please tell me what PQ is?
It's short for picture quality.

I've got a 4266 which I love. I have cable (digital, cablevision) going into the antenna input, no STB. When I direct tune to a channel (e.g. press the number 5 on the remote, I get a message about a weak signal and no picture. If I use the channel up/down buttons, e.g. go from 4 then channel up to 5, I get a picture.

Any thoughts? Thanks for the help.

p.s. long time lurker, first time poster!

i really wish i could describe it better, but i can't. the whole picture just .... um.... wiggled! Its possible it might have been pixelation to such a small extent that it gave this effect, but i don't know for sure what it was.

Could someone please tell me what PQ is?

maybe you are seeing "judder" ...

I've got a 4266 which I love. I have cable (digital, cablevision) going into the antenna input, no STB. When I direct tune to a channel (e.g. press the number 5 on the remote, I get a message about a weak signal and no picture. If I use the channel up/down buttons, e.g. go from 4 then channel up to 5, I get a picture.

Any thoughts? Thanks for the help.

p.s. long time lurker, first time poster!
Welcome aboard ginigma,

How is the 66 series treating you? Thought about upgrading to a 68 or 78 series?

To answer your question, I think that the signal for the channel is very weak from your service provider.
Now that is strange why your remote up/down will work but not the number keys (shows weak Signal) this I cant fiqure out.
Did you do an auto channel scan on your system?

Welcome aboard ginigma,

How is the 66 series treating you? Thought about upgrading to a 68 or 78 series?

To answer your question, I think that the signal for the channel is very weak from your service provider.
Now that is strange why your remote up/down will work but not the number keys (shows weak Signal) this I cant fiqure out.
Did you do an auto channel scan on your system?

Hi. I just got the '66. I really wanted the 4668, but it was 1/3 inch too wide. It had to fit in an armoire. Oh well. I'm happy with the 66 for a bedroom TV. Once I do the whole home theater next year, I'll be able to get something bigger and better for the same $$$.

I did an auto channel scan and it put both the analog and digital version of the channel in memory (mainly on the lower channels), so I'd have to press the channel up button twice . I removed the analog version from memory. I guess I can run the auto scan again and this time delete the digital version, but hey, digital is supposed to be better than analog, right?

Thanks.

maybe you are seeing "judder" ...

Maybe-what's that?... Wait a sec is that a joke?

Good Evening-

Brand new member here...my cousin just received his Samsung 61" 1080p DLP and I took a peek at it tonight and it is a very nice television. My question is, can someone really sell me on why I *need* the 1080p instead of the 720p?

I currently own, and have happily owned for the last 5 years, an RCA rear projection set, the *old*, tired technology (don't laugh) and have been hesitant to upgrade since it seems like right about the time I seriously contemplate it somehting "New & Improved" is out, literally every month it seems. I have been tempted by LCos, then Phillips dipped out, leaving me dubious of that technology. Then I start thinking plasma and all I hear is "burin-in, burn-in" and I shrink back. I am not afraid to be an *early-adopter* on most technology fronts, and I think DLP seems to be shaking out to be as near a *standard* as we can expect. So I really just need to know if the 1080p is truly worth the cost over the 720p sets just arriving in stores now. I am not as fanatical as others here (duh) but I do watch a lot of sports and action movies and the *ghosting* or *pixels-catching-up* that I see on a lot of the older DLPs is unacceptable. If I buy a newest generation Samsung 720p DLP will it meet my needs or will I just be sorely disappointed when everything goes 1080p?

I apologize for the length of this post, but it is my first and I can tell by reading around here that I will certainly receive *expert* advice.

Thank you in advance for the help.

-Jhintonh

Good Evening-

Brand new member here...my cousin just received his Samsung 61" 1080p DLP and I took a peek at it tonight and it is a very nice television. My question is, can someone really sell me on why I *need* the 1080p instead of the 780p?

I currently own, and have happily owned for the last 5 years, an RCA rear projection set, the *old*, tired technology (don't laugh) and have been hesitant to upgrade since it seems like right about the time I seriously contemplate it somehting "New & Improved" is out, literally every month it seems. I have been tempted by LCos, then Phillips dipped out, leaving me dubious of that technology. Then I start thinking plasma and all I hear is "burin-in, burn-in" and I shrink back. I am not afraid to be an *early-adopter* on most technology fronts, and I think DLP seems to be shaking out to be as near a *standard* as we can expect. So I really just need to know if the 1080p is truly worth the cost over the 780p sets just arriving in stores now. I am not as fanatical as others here (duh) but I do watch a lot of sports and action movies and the *ghosting* or *pixels-catching-up* that I see on a lot of the older DLPs is unacceptable. If I buy a newest generation Samsung 780p DLP will it meet my needs or will I just be sorely disappointed when everything goes 1080p?

I apologize for the length of this post, but it is my first and I can tell by reading around here that I will certainly receive *expert* advice.

Thank you in advance for the help.

-Jhintonh

Dood! What a question! I don't think you're gonna find many 720p fans around here. We're trying to convice ourselves of our own wisdom. One thing I know for certain is that next years TVs will offer some new feature that some people won't be able to live without.

Ignorance is bliss! If you never encounter a 1080 TV then you'll never know what you missed. If, however, you have your cousins TV staring you in the face, on a regular basis, you'll get TV envy. If you're happy, then stick with what you have. If not, investigate, be patient then work your best deal. Just like the rest of us...yeah right.

Good Evening-

Brand new member here...my cousin just received his Samsung 61" 1080p DLP and I took a peek at it tonight and it is a very nice television. My question is, can someone really sell me on why I *need* the 1080p instead of the 720p?

I currently own, and have happily owned for the last 5 years, an RCA rear projection set, the *old*, tired technology (don't laugh) and have been hesitant to upgrade since it seems like right about the time I seriously contemplate it somehting "New & Improved" is out, literally every month it seems. I have been tempted by LCos, then Phillips dipped out, leaving me dubious of that technology. Then I start thinking plasma and all I hear is "burin-in, burn-in" and I shrink back. I am not afraid to be an *early-adopter* on most technology fronts, and I think DLP seems to be shaking out to be as near a *standard* as we can expect. So I really just need to know if the 1080p is truly worth the cost over the 720p sets just arriving in stores now. I am not as fanatical as others here (duh) but I do watch a lot of sports and action movies and the *ghosting* or *pixels-catching-up* that I see on a lot of the older DLPs is unacceptable. If I buy a newest generation Samsung 720p DLP will it meet my needs or will I just be sorely disappointed when everything goes 1080p?

I apologize for the length of this post, but it is my first and I can tell by reading around here that I will certainly receive *expert* advice.

Thank you in advance for the help.

-Jhintonh

POST #1 in this thread goes into detail about the differences between the 1080p and 720p models. But, to answer you question ... 1080p is a better TV. If you can afford it, go with 1080p.

POST #1 in this thread goes into detail about the differences between the 1080p and 720p models. But, to answer you question ... 1080p is a better TV. If you can afford it, go with 1080p.

Good Evening-

Thanks and I will go back and read Post #1.

-Jhintonh

have the handfull of 67's shipped yet?

OT: & wrong thread....but there are knowledgable people here

Rotel or Parasound?

I'm lov'n these Axiom's, but I can tell they want some more juice to really perform.....