Originally posted by htwaits
As expected it's specs look like the HLPxx74 with HDTV Tuner and CableCard added, but without DVI and VGA inputs.

However, according to Post #1, the chipset could be HD4. Whereas the 4674/5674 are HD2+ based. So, this could be a significant difference as well.

Originally posted by mastahkaz
funny, since the first post says this regarding the 74 series:

"We will transition this series to a new design mid year that will include the integrated design. So, no 77 series will come.. it'll be called something a little different but it will be a "70" series."

Unless they mean no 77 series will come in the HLP line, then i suppose its true.
That e-mail was from September 2004... Things change. (As we know.)

Originally posted by mastahkaz
funny, since the first post says this regarding the 74 series:

"We will transition this series to a new design mid year that will include the integrated design. So, no 77 series will come.. it'll be called something a little different but it will be a "70" series."

Unless they mean no 77 series will come in the HLP line, then i suppose its true.

The HLPxx74W information in the FAQ's section in POST #1 is obviously not correct. I will be updating it with links to the new products or possibly adding these new HLR models to POST #1. As we all know, product spec's and now even model changes can occur during development.

This HLRxx77W announcement also casts doubts on our other back channel information from Steve P. Over the next day, I am going to review all of the key info from Steve P. and either delete it or modify the text to reflect the fact that there may be problems with it. I have to admit that I was starting to have doubts after the last round of updates from Steve P. indicating that the new HLRxx67W's were going to have a HD3 chip. This really seemed like misinformation to me.

Actually, keeping the HLRxx77W alive makes sense to me. The HLPxx74W have been an extremely popular cabinet design. I really hope that this HLRxx77W announcement is not indicative of a big delay in the HLRxxx8W 1080p models.

Originally posted by wish_i_had_hdtv
However, according to Post #1, the chipset could be HD4. Whereas the 4674/5674 are HD2+ based. So, this could be a significant difference as well.
The HLRxx77W is the same as the HLPxx74W, only it has the built-in tuner/cable card, and it doesn't have the DVI and VGA.

Steve Panosian confirmed this for me in late February 2005.

Administrator, you might want to let Steve know that there is at least one problem with the specifications for the HLRxx77s:

Single 0.08" Digital Micro-Mirror Device

I know TI is getting good at miniaturization but I think they mean .8".
Also, 9,000 RPM - never seen that number before but maybe it's correct

Originally posted by schaffer970
Administrator, you might want to let Steve know that there is at least one problem with the specifications for the HLRxx77s:

Single 0.08" Digital Micro-Mirror Device

I know TI is getting good at miniaturization but I think they mean .8".
Also, 9,000 RPM - never seen that number before but maybe it's correct
Thanks, I'll let him know.

Originally posted by AkaStp
...so why is it a HLR rather than a HLPxx77?

It seems that Samsung intends that the ATSC tuner and CC will be the differentiating features of the HL-R series, rather than the things *we* really care about ie: chip, resolution, contrast ratio, inputs, etc.

I've updated FAQ #9 in POST #1 to indicate that the HLRxx77W will be produced and included the links to the Samsung web site for futher information.

On the bright side, we now know what the HLRxx77W manuals on the FCC site that Schaffer 970 found were going to be used for.

While on the Samsung site I noticed that the updated the picture of the HiDef DVD-HD950 DVD player and it is now BLACK instead of silver.

It looks like there are several things wrong about the 4677 and 5677 info on the "Specifications" webpage:

1.) Single 0.08" Digital Micro-Mirror Device
2.) 7 Segment Color Wheel
3.) They have the Order Code wrong for the Optional Stand for the 46"
4.) They have the Net Dimensions wrong for the Optional Stand for the 56"

Steve said: "thanks, the team will fix the incorrect models"

I have gone back an reviewed / updated POST #1 to reflect all of our new information. POST #1 now reflects our best information. I have reviewed all of the other information that we have from Steve P. to insure that it is still current and correct. It all appears OK.

Little did Samsung know that within 5 minutes of posting new information, it would be proof read, cross-referenced with everything they have ever said in the last 5 years and suggestions made as to how to correct things. I hope they appreciate all this free help :D

Like I said, that info from Steve about the 77 Series not coming was from September 2004. The 74 Series was discontinued in March/April like he said it would be - It was just replaced with the 77 Series.

We can't hold him to everything he says, because he doesn't control everything... I'm just thankful for the info he does feed us, even if it does sometimes change down the road... At least he helps feed our curiosity! :D

Originally posted by Administrator
Like I said, that info from Steve about the 77 Series not coming was from September 2004. The 74 Series was discontinued in March/April like he said it would be - It was just replaced with the 77 Series.

We can't hold him to everything he says, because he doesn't control everything... I'm just thankful for the info he does feed us, even if it does sometimes change down the road... At least he helps feed our curiosity! :D

True ... and I am still wondering if the HLRxx77W release is a stop gap release to bridge a possible delay in the HLRxxx8 releases. Without the HLRxx77W, Samsung could have been left without a higher-end chip in a tabletop model.

Originally posted by UCSB
True ... and I am still wondering if the HLRxx77W release is a stop gap release to bridge a possible delay in the HLRxxx8 releases. Without the HLRxx77W, Samsung could have been left without a higher-end chip in a tabletop model.
This is a very possible reason for the HLPxx67W Series and this HLRxx77W Series...

Back in February, Steve told me:

"Regarding the HLP4677W, a very limited quantity will be built, under a 1,000."

I just asked him again today if they were still making under 1,000...

He said:

"About a 1,000 of each. depends now on the new models."

So I'd say you're correct in assuming a possible delay in the planned 2005 line up. With the 67 & 77 Series, Samsung still has a product to sell after July 1st with integrated tuners if their new line is delayed...

Originally posted by Administrator
We can't hold him to everything he says, because he doesn't control everything... I'm just thankful for the info he does feed us, even if it does sometimes change down the road... At least he helps feed our curiosity! :D

Here! Here! (And, keep it coming.)

For easier reading, I started a new thread for HL-R info:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=5349458#post5349458

Kirk

Originally posted by Administrator
It looks like there are several things wrong about the 4677 and 5677 info on the "Specifications" webpage:

1.) Single 0.08" Digital Micro-Mirror Device
2.) 7 Segment Color Wheel
3.) They have the Order Code wrong for the Optional Stand for the 46"
4.) They have the Net Dimensions wrong for the Optional Stand for the 56"

Steve said: "thanks, the team will fix the incorrect models"
-It looks like they have fixed the DMD size to 0.8" for both sets...

-They fixed the 56" set to reflect the 6 Segment Color Wheel, but not the 46" yet - Steve told me it was 6 so don't think that they left the 46" saying 7 on purpose...

-They still have # 3 wrong.

-They fixed the Net Dimensions for the Optional Stand for the 56" but now it looks like those dimensions are wrong for the 46" :rolleyes:

Maybe that webmaster just fixed a couple things for now, then went on break?! :rolleyes:

Fantastic news. That means that when the new thin bezel, below-screen speaker Sony LCD set comes out in the summer there will be a Samsung thin bezel DLP to compare and decide between.

Originally posted by AkaStp
...so why is it a HLR rather than a HLPxx77?
I asked Steve about this...

He said:

"intro'd in 2005."

Then I said:

"True, but what about the HLPxx67W?"

Then he said:

"launched in November."

Originally posted by RickMTB
Fantastic news. That means that when the new thin bezel, below-screen speaker Sony LCD set comes out in the summer there will be a Samsung thin bezel DLP to compare and decide between.
No. Not necessarily. Steve said they will only be making around 1,000 of each size in the 77 Series.

Unless the new models get delayed, the HLRxx77W sets will not be on the market for very long.

Just posted the following on Kirt's new thread:

Thanks for the info Kirk. I have mixed feelings about starting a new thread. UCSB's thread has so much information in it (especially post #1) that it will be hard for most of us to pull away from it. I think we all need to think about whether it is a good idea to start a new thread.

Any thoughts on starting a new thread? :confused:

Originally posted by schaffer970
Any thoughts on starting a new thread? :confused:
I like this one. :p

By the way, Steve said the HLRxx77W will be "without a TV Guide EPG".

I will be adding Kirk's information to POST #1 in this thread. Because of the new MODEL, the HLR4266W, and large amount of data I am going to have to work on it this evening. But, after I update POST #1, I'll let everyone know.

Originally posted by Administrator
By the way, Steve said the HLRxx77W will be "without a TV Guide EPG".

I'll add this spec and the lower quantity production run comments to POST #1 this evening.

Thanks UCSB. Sorry everyone, my intent wasn't to take the focus away from this thread. There's an unbelievable amount of info here to filter through and just wanted to start fresh with information confirmed directly by Samsung. If everyone really thinks it best, i happy to delete my thread!

Originally posted by Administrator
-They still have # 3 wrong.

-They fixed the Net Dimensions for the Optional Stand for the 56" but now it looks like those dimensions are wrong for the 46" :rolleyes:
It looks like it's all fixed now!

Kirk, your idea was good. At this point I think we should keep the bulk of the information here. When people start getting the HLR sets an owners thread should be started (much like what happened with the 006). We'll have to see which sets group together (720s, 1080s, other ways to break them apart?). Finally, thanks for the dimension information, I needed it so I can plan for the stand I am designing!

I am watching this forum from past 9 months and noting the advancements in
the new Samsung DLP models. I am now fully convinced that DLP is the
way to go and I waiting for the HLR series DLP sets to hit the market
to buy a 46" DLP set.

A. What are the differences between HLR4667 and HLR4667:
1)Chipset HD2+, HD4
2) Contrast, PQ
3)Dimensions
4)MSRP price
5)When is each model releasing by samsung
6)Both of them seems to have the CC, HD tuner, HDMI, does anyone come
with DVI, IEEE1394?
7)What the pros and cons of each?
8)color wheels, CR,
9)Which is more reliable?

B. What are the major differences between HLP and HLR?
like chipset, color wheels

Ideally I am looking for a better quality picture with good contrast(>2000)
and having DVI, HDMI, HD tuner capabilities. Hopefully after both of these
models are released I will choose one of it for my family room in the next
few months. Already its beena long wait for me, but i don;t want to
compromise on the PQ of the TV I am planning to buy.

Thanks for posting that information, Kirk.

I have been lurking for over a year. This forum (and thread) already consumes too much of my time. I very much would prefer, with all due respect, that Neal/Kirk include their info in this thread. I just don't have enough time to monitor another thread compulsively, as I do this one. By all means, start a new owners' thread when the new models come out, but until then, let's keep all speculation on 2005 models (informed or otherwise) in this thread.

P.S. I very much appreciate the input from Steve P, but weren't we a little misinformed on thin bezel models? I am one of those with tight space tolerances, and it makes a diference to me. It occurs to me that the AVSForum support for thin bezel may have kept them alive. Any chance of a 1080p thin bezel? If we can resurrect the xxx77, maybe a thin bezel 1080p is not out of the question?

I would like to second dgdallas' sentiments regarding the crew that has set in my mind motion the advancment of my video pleasure.

My current concerns surround the integration of my HTPC which I plan on building with the new ATI All-In-Wonder X800 XT graphics card with on board TV/FM tuner. It uses DVI-I out and from what I gather, the unit that will quench my video-lust a.k.a. HL-R5078W is only using HDMI. So here is the $65K question. Will A 8meter DVI-HDMI cable i found on sale for a mere $209.95 + S&H at xxxcables.com, do what I want. Surf and Play with my new 50" computer monitor that also doubles as a TV when I have the need?

Well my target is the 56" 1080p (prob HLR5668W) but I only have 54" W and 56" H to play with. The Samsung stand + TV is 56.9" High, almost an inch too tall. I hope I will be able to find a slightly shorter stand that will fit the stupid hole in my wall :)

Even the slim bezel winds up with 56.2" H because the stand is aparently taller (could probably use the other stand though) but no 1080 kills that option.

Hey All.

Ive been reading up on these forums for about 7 months now. I am about to move into my new apartment in a few weeks, and i have been doing tons and tons of research on HDTV's and Especially DLP's.

These new 1080p samsung sets seem like the right choice. Im still not 100 percent sure though. It will either be this or the new JVC D-ILA , but i think thats going to take a bit to hit stores so this would be the best bet.

My question is , will there be a Power Buy for these sets. How would we find out if there is going to be one , or try and start one ? I am very interested in the DLR-5678 table top. I believe this one is xHD4 chip if im not mistaken ?

I noticed the backsliding on the lamp specifications - for the 100watt bulb originally it was 8000 hours, on the HLP sets it was 5000 to 8000 hours, now on the HLR sets it is ~5000 hours.

Also the specs fail to mention the digital sound output (which is needed since the set has a built in tuner). It is shown on the back of the set but not mentioned in the specifications.

Hey,

I was about to pull the trigger on a 5674, but now I'm thinking of waiting for the 1080ps. One kinda dumb question...I plan to watch SD DVDs a lot on whatever new TV I buy. Would a 1080p be better or worse for watching SD DVDs than a 720p? It seems obvious that more resolution is always better, but since it's upconverting from a lower-res source, I could imagine that upconverting "farther" might result in more artifacts, etc...

Hey rictus, have you found any documentation on the 5674? I found the owners manual for the 5667 and 5677 on the samsung site, but nothing on the 5674. The xx67 documentation shows a back panel with only one HDMI input along with a D-15 PC input. I hear the the new 5678 will have two HDMI inputs (which is what I want). I was curious if you have confirmation on the inputs for the 5674?

I'm pretty sure the 5674 has one HDMI and one DVI input. Here's the TV Authority page on it:

http://www.tvauthority.com/DLP-TV-HDTV/Samsung-HLP5674W.asp

(input specs are all the way at the bottom)

FYI I have a 5674, it does have one DVI and one HDMI inputs, and they both work fine :)

Originally posted by rictus
I'm pretty sure the 5674 has one HDMI and one DVI input. Here's the TV Authority page on it:

http://www.tvauthority.com/DLP-TV-HDTV/Samsung-HLP5674W.asp

(input specs are all the way at the bottom)

Ah Ha! I see where I got confused. I did not get that you were talking about the HLP series. I was refering to the much anticipated HL-R series that should be here any day now - (OK it's not for a couple months, but a boy can dream, can't he?).

I have a secret but I have to post a couple more time to show you

It has been discussed, but either I have not seen it or I overlooke it.

Wanna know what it is?

HL-R5667W Owners Manual (http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/200503/20050315094921953_BP68-00469A-00Eng.pdf)

and,

HL-R5677W Owners Manual (http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/200501/20050131152218265_BP68-00460A-01Eng.pdf)

Are the dimensions for the new 50" models the same as the 5063W ?

Looks like there are two new versions - straight box & floating screen.
Doesn't seem like the floating version could be the same height as the straight version ?

Originally posted by vinski
Are the dimensions for the new 50" models the same as the 5063W ?
According to the spec sheet they are the same.

htwaits: what will be the price for the lowest priced Samsung 1080p set? Will that be the lowest priced 1080p set regardles of technology(DLP, Flat Panel LCD, D'ILA, SXRD)?

Sorry. I have no idea. :(

Originally posted by JONNY_P
HL-R5667W Owners Manual (http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/200503/20050315094921953_BP68-00469A-00Eng.pdf)

and,

HL-R5677W Owners Manual (http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/200501/20050131152218265_BP68-00460A-01Eng.pdf)

Thanks for the links ... I'll add them to POST #1 when I do the next updates later today.

Originally posted by Artwood
htwaits: what will be the price for the lowest priced Samsung 1080p set? Will that be the lowest priced 1080p set regardles of technology(DLP, Flat Panel LCD, D'ILA, SXRD)?

LGs 1080p dlp set is supposed to be priced lower than Samsungs.

Originally posted by AkaStp
Could you ask if the new HLR5677 has a speaker shelf built into the top of the cabinet like the HLP5674 does?
I'm guessing it probably does as a result of re-using the same cabinet but would like to be sure.
Yes, the HLRxx77W has the shelf built into the top of the cabinet.

Originally posted by baba160
I am watching this forum from past 9 months and noting the advancements in
the new Samsung DLP models. I am now fully convinced that DLP is the
way to go and I waiting for the HLR series DLP sets to hit the market
to buy a 46" DLP set.

A. What are the differences between HLR4667 and HLR4667:
1)Chipset HD2+, HD4
2) Contrast, PQ
3)Dimensions
4)MSRP price
5)When is each model releasing by samsung
6)Both of them seems to have the CC, HD tuner, HDMI, does anyone come with DVI, IEEE1394?
7)What the pros and cons of each?
8)color wheels, CR,
9)Which is more reliable?

B. What are the major differences between HLP and HLR?
like chipset, color wheels

Ideally I am looking for a better quality picture with good contrast(>2000)
and having DVI, HDMI, HD tuner capabilities. Hopefully after both of these
models are released I will choose one of it for my family room in the next
few months. Already its beena long wait for me, but i don;t want to
compromise on the PQ of the TV I am planning to buy.
FYI there is an HLPxx67W available now. The HLRxx67W is scheduled to be released May/June 2005.

First, the main differences between the HLPxx67W and HLRxx67W:
The HLP has a 1500:1 Contrast Ratio, HLR = 2000:1
The HLR has the new "Floating Screen Design" cabinet
The HLR will have a Gemstar TV Electronic Program Guide, IEEE 1394 DTV Link, and ANYNET
Current info on the HLP4667W can be found on Samsung.com here (http://product.samsung.com/cgi-bin/nabc/product/b2c_product_detail.jsp?prod_id=HLP4667WX%252fXAA).

Differences between HLR4667W and HLR4677W:
1) The HLRxx67W will probably use the HD3 chip, 77 Series uses the HD2+ chip.
2) They both have a 2000:1 Contrast Ratio. 67 = Softer Film-Like Picture, 77 = Sharper Picture.
3) HLR4667W = 42.89(W) x 13.4(D) x 32.0(H)
HLR4677W = 40.6(W) x 16.1(D) x 30.0(H) <--This set has the built-in speaker shelf on top and the "Ultra Thin" bezel.
4) HLR4667W MSRP Guess = $2,699
HLR4677W MSRP = $2,899
5) HLR67 Series available May/June 2005, 77 Series available now click here (http://product.samsung.com/cgi-bin/nabc/product/b2c_product_detail.jsp?prod_id=HLR4677WX%252fXAA).
6) Neither have DVI input, HLR67 Series has 2 IEEE 1394 DTV Link.
7) Off the top of my head: The HLR67 Series has the Gemstar TV Electronic Program Guide, and IEEE 1394 DTV Link. The 77 Series has the speaker shelf and thinner bezel.
8) 67 Series has a 7 Segment Color Wheel, 77 Series has a 6 Segment Color Wheel.
9) N/A

FYI - The HLRxx77W is being released in very limited quantity... Around 1,000 of each size... So it probably won't be on the market for very long. (They may make more if the new 2005 sets are delayed.)

Originally posted by htwaits
According to the spec sheet they are the same.

I'm referring to the new HLR models about to be released.
Could you direct me to the spec sheets ?

Here is the spec sheet for the HLR5677 (http://product.samsung.com/SamsungUSA/PRODUCT/20050318/hlr5677.pdf) :)

Reread what you were looking for. TVA put up the dimensions for all the HLR sets in this thread New Samsung HL-R info courtesy of TV Authority (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=521619)

UCSB will be updating post #1 in this thread as soon as he has time, which will include the information from TVA.

I just wanted to let everyone know that I have made the following updates / additions to POST #1 in this thread:

1. Added the measurements for all units. Thanks Kirk@TVauthority!
2. Added a link in the HLRxx67W section to the final owners manual. Thanks Jonny_P!
3. Added FAQ #16 to the FAQ section listing all of the available Samsung stands and their dimensions. Thanks Kirk@TVauthority!

Also, when I added the new measurements for all units to POST #1, I left the current HLPxx63W measurements there for comparison.

Originally posted by vinski
I'm referring to the new HLR models about to be released.
Could you direct me to the spec sheets ?

I have updated POST #1 at the top of this thread to included the dimensions for all models, including the 50" models.

I was looking at the HLRxx67W manual and noticed a few interesting things on the back panel.

1. G-Link input - this looks like an IR input on the back of the set. I really hope it is and that it is compatible with my multiroom Xantech system.
2. There is a service port on the back. The description of the ports says it is for SOFTWARE upgrades. It is a little hard to tell just what it is, but it looks like it may be a USB port. WOW wouldn't that be great ... just down load a firmware upgrade to our computers and then apply it to our HDTVs. I would be impressed ... very impressed if that was possible.
3. Digital audio output. I haven't added this to the specs, but I will add it tomorrow to all units.

Because TV Authority is showing the sizes of the 78 series as including the 50 and 70 inch versions...does that mean that these sizes are no longer tentative (as presently id'd in post #1)? And, does that also mean that the 78 series is a go?

I see the release date of these keeps getting changed to farther and farther away The same thing as last year!:mad: That means that when the new thin bezel, below-screen speaker Sony LCD set comes out in the summer there will be a Samsung thin bezel DLP to compare and decide between.Samsung would still win out. Phony; all baloney. I noticed the backsliding on the lamp specifications - for the 100watt bulb originally it was 8000 hours, on the HLP sets it was 5000 to 8000 hours, now on the HLR sets it is ~5000 hours.Sounds as they are being more accurate from experience with previous bulbs considering these are the 4th generation Sammies.

Originally posted by Ed Weinman
Because TV Authority is showing the sizes of the 78 series as including the 50 and 70 inch versions...does that mean that these sizes are no longer tentative (as presently id'd in post #1)? And, does that also mean that the 78 series is a go?

I was wondering the same thing. I am going to ask Kirk at TVauthority the same question over in the TVauthority thread.

The dimensions of the 70" set given on pg 1 don't seem consistent with those of the 61" and 67" ones; they seem too large. E.g, 61 to 67 is a 6" increase in diagonal screen size, and 67 to 70 is only half that increment (i.e., 3"), so if the black border/bezel on all three sets were the same (maybe this is a bad assumption?), the increase in width from 61 to 67 should be 6"x16/sqrt(337) = 5.2", and the increase in width in going from 67 to 70 should be 3"x16/sqrt(337) = 2.6". The increments that are listed on pg 1 are 5.5" for 61 to 67--which agrees pretty well with the prediction--but the increment that is listed for 67 to 70 is 4.5", a lot more than one would expect. The increase in the depths of the sets also don't seem to scale appropriately, again with that for the 70" seeming to be too large. Anybody have any thoughts?

Originally posted by millerwill
The dimensions of the 70" set given on pg 1 don't seem consistent with those of the 61" and 67" ones; they seem too large. E.g, 61 to 67 is a 6" increase in diagonal screen size, and 67 to 70 is only half that increment (i.e., 3"), so if the black border/bezel on all three sets were the same (maybe this is a bad assumption?), the increase in width from 61 to 67 should be 6"x16/sqrt(337) = 5.2", and the increase in width in going from 67 to 70 should be 3"x16/sqrt(337) = 2.6". The increments that are listed on pg 1 are 5.5" for 61 to 67--which agrees pretty well with the prediction--but the increment that is listed for 67 to 70 is 4.5", a lot more than one would expect. The increase in the depths of the sets also don't seem to scale appropriately, again with that for the 70" seeming to be too large. Anybody have any thoughts?

If you go to the hi res gallery and carefully compare the 61" and the 70" photos (they are right next to each other), it looks to me like the 70" bezel is wider. Perhaps they beefed up the case or decided that people that were going with the 70" wanted size and made it a little larger for impact. It is also possible the the smaller bezel just didn't look right on the 70".

Originally posted by UCSB
If you go to the hi res gallery and carefully compare the 61" and the 70" photos (they are right next to each other), it looks to me like the 70" bezel is wider. Perhaps they beefed up the case or decided that people that were going with the 70" wanted size and made it a little larger for impact. It is also possible the the smaller bezel just didn't look right on the 70".

Thanks for the reply; sounds like this must be the correct resolution of my question. I will thus need to re-do some space calculations!

One further similar question, re the heights of the stands: I see that the height of the stand for the 67" set is the same as that forthe 61" ones, namely 17". Any info on what the stand height is for the 70" set?

So I have now wasted (at least that is what my wife and daughter think) half of my Sunday reading this thread. It has been very helpful, but I am now looking for a little help. I am in the market for a 61 inch DLP, thought I wanted the Mitsubishi Diamond, but am now back in the Samsung camp. I am probably going to get 2, one for the family room and one for a game room.

What are the main differences between the HL-R6167W and the HL-R6168W???

The thought was getting the 67 for now in the family room and then the 68 when it comes out. I have nothing now and am having cabinets built in both rooms. Should I wait the extra 2+ months? Thanks in advance for the advise.

Ktomkins,

re: the "should I wait" part: I've been waiting since 10/94 (when my prior set died after enjoying it for 2 1/2 years) and decided to look forward to the new ...68 sets.

To keep track of the model differences I updated this table of essentials:

DLP CC HDMI DVI VGA/PC DA IEEE1394

HL-Pxx63W HD3 720p N 1 1 1 N 0
HL-Pxx67W HD3 720p Y 1 0 0 Y 0

HL-Pxx74W HD2+ 720p N 1 1 1 N 0 thin bezel / speaker shelf
HL-Rxx77W HD2+ 720p Y 1 0 0 Y 0 thin bezel / speaker shelf

HL-Rxx67W HD4 720p Y 1 0 1 Y 2 floating screen

HL-Rxx68W xHD4 1080p Y 2 0 1 Y 2 floating screen

HL-Rxx78W xHD4 1080p Y 2 0 1 Y 2

CC = CableCard
DA = digital optical out

Originally posted by Ed Weinman
...I've been waiting since 10/94...
wow - that is a long time! :D

I'm pretty disappointed in the HL-Rxx77 release - I read this to mean that I shouldn't hope to see the HL-Rxx67 before summer.... Hope I'm wrong though.

The new Samsungs make my decision on type of RP to buy even more difficult.

Although off topic, is there any advantage to the JVC LYCOS format using 3 chips as compared to one chip Sammy?

Thanks for any opinions !

jensph,

...partially my finances...partially my calm Bronx upbringing...NOT!

Do we know of an aprox. date when we can begin to see Samsung promos on these new sets?

Originally posted by EJKrew
The new Samsungs make my decision on type of RP to buy even more difficult.

Although off topic, is there any advantage to the JVC LYCOS format using 3 chips as compared to one chip Sammy?

Thanks for any opinions !

LCOS doesn't suffer from the DLP rainbow phenomenon.

Originally posted by ktomkins
What are the main differences between the HL-R6167W and the HL-R6168W???

At this point I think I would want the 1080p set if it was a 61" screen.

For that kind of money I would definitely want to see both of them before I made a choice. Most people think the HLR6168 will have a more impressive image with HDTV, HD-DVD, and SD-DVD. SD-DVD and SD-TV might not look as good.

I like the fact that the "68" models are supposed to have two HDMI inputs.

It's hard to predict how long the wait will be between the arrival of the 720p HLR6167 and the arrival of the 1080p HLR6168.

Information about xHD4 (in "68" models) and HD4(in "67" models) chips is just guesswork at this point. We don't know if they will be used or what the differences will be between them and the HD3 and xHD3 chips that we do know something about.

Your wife and daughter are right. You should have read the first message and then skipped to the end of the thread. ;)

Originally posted by falsedawn
LCOS doesn't suffer from the DLP rainbow phenomenon.
There is no "DLP" rainbow phenomenon. What there is, though, is a color wheel rainbow phenomenon.

Rainbows are seen by some people on DLP RPTV sets because they have been designed to produce a color image from a single DLP chip using a color wheel.

Three chip DLP front projectors are used in some movie houses which eliminates the rainbow phenomenon. Unfortunately three chip DLP front projectors are very expensive, and three chip DLP RPTV sets are not practical at this time.

Originally posted by htwaits
Most people think the HLR6168 will have a more impressive image with HDTV, HD-DVD, and SD-DVD. SD-DVD and SD-TV might not look as good.

I've been wondering about this--given that a significant portion of what I'm going to be watching for the near future is SD-DVDs, are they likely to look better or worse on 1080p than on 720p?

Originally posted by rictus
I've been wondering about this--given that a significant portion of what I'm going to be watching for the near future is SD-DVDs, are they likely to look better or worse on 1080p than on 720p?
I don't know, and if I was buying one that's the first thing I would check since I already have a 720p set.

I'm intrigued by the HL-R4677W, but can't find it anywhere on the web. Where can I buy it?

I'm also looking to put it into an armoire that is 42" high, is that too high for this tv for my living room. It will be 10 feet between the TV and my couch.

Originally posted by htwaits
Three chip DLP front projectors are used in some movie houses which eliminates the rainbow phenomenon. Unfortunately three chip DLP front projectors are very expensive, and three chip DLP RPTV sets are not practical at this time.

htwaits - although I agree that a three chip would eliminate the rainbow phenomenon, would you ever see a rainbow with a front projector when looking at the screen? With a front projector, you're not actually looking at the source (as you are with an RPTV). So there's no rainbow to be seen, whether it's a one chip or three chip DLP. We have DLP front projectors at work (one-chip, I think) - looking at the lens (not straight on, of course) I can see rainbows, looking on to the screen I don't.

In the FAQ there is mentionof the "67" series, but NO mention of the "77" series which is on Sammies web site. I see the 77 appears to be a stripped down 67 at least for the inputs.

Comments?

Originally posted by skinsfan
I'm intrigued by the HL-R4677W, but can't find it anywhere on the web. Where can I buy it?

I'm also looking to put it into an armoire that is 42" high, is that too high for this tv for my living room. It will be 10 feet between the TV and my couch.

The HLR4677W just appeared this week ... check with dealers selling the HLP4674W and they should be able to get a HLR4677W for you.

Earlier in this thread (around pages 15 - 25), I did an extensive analysis of viewing angles. If you can find those posts, there is a high resolution photo of how viewing angle affects picture quality of a HLN467W, plus instructions and a calculator for computing your viewing angles.

Originally posted by gakon
htwaits - although I agree that a three chip would eliminate the rainbow phenomenon, would you ever see a rainbow with a front projector when looking at the screen?
I've never seen a rainbow. :)

People do report seeing them with single chip front projectors. I had a salesman try to show me rainbows when I first got interested in DLP. He used a single chip DLP projector with a three element color wheel. He thought everyone should be able to see them if they just tried hard enough. I failed miserably. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by videobruce
In the FAQ there is mentionof the "67" series, but NO mention of the "77" series which is on Sammies web site. I see the 77 appears to be a stripped down 67 at least for the inputs.

Comments?

Up until this week, we were under the impression that the 77 series would not be produced. So, I had not included it in POST #1. Now that it is out, I am debating if I should add it to POST #1. I probably should add at least a short description to POST #1 and a link to the Samsung site.

Originally posted by gakon
would you ever see a rainbow with a front projector when looking at the screen?
Yes, you can still see rainbows on the surface that the image is projected onto with DLP projectors. Unless you don't see rainbows in the first place, then you probably won't.

Originally posted by htwaits


three chip DLP RPTV sets are not practical at this time.

Now I'm really confused....

I thought that JVC's LCOS RPTVs were 3 chip systems.

No?

Originally posted by EJKrew
Now I'm really confused....

I thought that JVC's LCOS RPTVs were 3 chip systems.

No?
Yes they are. DLP is much much harder ($$$) to do with three chips. According to Rogo the lens assembly is very complex. Evidently LCoS and LCD are relatively (much cheaper) easy to do. In fact I've never read about a single chip LCoS or LCD RPTV.

I'm not an engineer so I can't explain why getting three DLP chips to work together is prohibitive at the current time.

I don't follow the > $20k forum but that's where I expect you would find three chip DLP front projectors. I've never read about a three chip DLP RPTV.

Originally posted by mastahkaz
Yes, you can still see rainbows on the surface that the image is projected onto with DLP projectors. Unless you don't see rainbows in the first place, then you probably won't.

I usually see the rainbows on rear projection sets, but I have never seen them from the image of a front projector.

Originally posted by htwaits
In fact I've never read about a single chip LCoS or LCD RPTV.



Philips sold single chip LCOS sets, but they stopped production in October of last year.

Up until this week, we were under the impression that the 77 series would not be produced.UCSB; the 77 is just a stripped down 67?

In the post by AnthonyP in this thread SO WHAT'S NEXT FOR DLP (& when) ? (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=521805&perpage=20&pagenumber=1) there is a good explanation of why 3-chip DLP is harder than the others.

Placed my order for a Samsung HLP4663W on 03-13-05 and was told 2 to 4 for days for it to arrive at the store. Received call that product is ready for Pu. When I arrived Sunday I was told the Samsung TV was discontinued and they really did not have any other set comparable to mine for substitution. I’m very upset because I sold off my Mitsu (wt-46809) in anticipation for the new set. They have the display model available. However, I don’t know if I should try a work out a deal with the display or not.

What? They're BSin you buddy. That set hasn't been discontinued yet.

videobruce- The 77 series is a slim bezel design so more of a spruced up 74 series than a stripped down 67 series.

They have placed me in a bad spot because like I mentioned earlier I sold my set already. Do they have to honor the price they gave me for the Samsung? <1600
with tax inc.

I am very interested in using my nice tax return this year to get an amazing 50" DLP tv from Samsung. I love their products and DLP seems like the way of the future for television. I am looking at both the 67and 78 models. Only true difference being that one is good for 1080i with a much higher contrast ratio. I got two questions about these:

1) Is the 78 series worth the extra money for 1080i and higher contrast?

2) These are suppose to arrive sometime this summer. Where can one get these tvs and see them? I doubt BB or CC will carry these new tvs.

The 78/68 models will be 1080p not 1080i. You are right about the higer contrast ratio, but also keep in mind that the 78/68 models will have two HDMI inputs. Double check the first post for other major differences. The way things are proceeding it seems as though we will not see the 78/68 models until late this year as opposed to summer.

I went to Tweeter yesterday to snoop. I spoke with the sales manager who said to expect the new 1080p HLR's in June. He went to check their computer and it showed the 78 series but without a SKU number. He told me they wouldn't be able to get any spec or shipping info until the model number was assigned a SKU. Over his shoulder I was able to see the HLR5678W and the HLR6178W listed on his screen.

Yea I have lots of reading to do on this thread.

Thats good that it will be 1080p but it seems the two models are very close to each other. I'm surprised that they even will produce both, seems like Samsung is making too many different DLP models that the general public can't dicipher between.

I was hoping to get a new tv this summer, but from what it sounds like, these are going to be amazing DLPs and I should save my money and wait. Think so? I am planning on getting a 50" tv (I would go as low as 46" though since I will be 7-8 feet away) and I have placed in the $3000-$4000 price range for a new DLP tv.

Originally posted by aaronwt
Philips sold single chip LCOS sets, but they stopped production in October of last year.
I forgot the Philips! :rolleyes:

Some people did see plenty of rainbows with that set, but I think it failed for other reasons.

Originally posted by farscape7
Placed my order for a Samsung HLP4663W on 03-13-05 and was told 2 to 4 for days for it to arrive at the store. Received call that product is ready for Pu. When I arrived Sunday I was told the Samsung TV was discontinued and they really did not have any other set comparable to mine for substitution. I’m very upset because I sold off my Mitsu (wt-46809) in anticipation for the new set. They have the display model available. However, I don’t know if I should try a work out a deal with the display or not.
You might be able to find a HLP4663W at another store, but they are being replaced by the HLPxx67 Series.

Originally posted by videobruce
In the FAQ there is mentionof the "67" series, but NO mention of the "77" series which is on Sammies web site. I see the 77 appears to be a stripped down 67 at least for the inputs.

Comments?
The HLPxx67W on Samsung.com is the replacement for the 2004 63 Series. Basically this HLP67 Series includes the tuner/cablecard, but drops the DVI input.

The HLRxx77W on Samsung.com is the replacement for the 2004 74 Series. Basically the 77 Series includes the tuner/cablecard, but drops the DVI input. This is the set with the "Ultra Thin" bezel.

The set listed in POST #1 is the HLRxx67W which should be released in May/June 2005. You can see the differences between HLPxx67W and HLRxx67W and HLRxx77W in this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=5354585#post5354585).

Originally posted by mastahkaz
Yes, you can still see rainbows on the surface that the image is projected onto with DLP projectors. Unless you don't see rainbows in the first place, then you probably won't.
I can see rainbows (although they don't bother me), but have never seen them on the display from a front projector. However, looking at PowerPoint presentations at work is not the same as watching movies at home (at least for me), and the conditions may not be right for me to see rainbows.

Originally posted by videobruce
UCSB; the 77 is just a stripped down 67?

No the 77 is not a stripped down 67. The HLRxx77W models are based on the current HLPxx74W introduced last November. They contain a HD2+ DLP chip and a six segment color wheel. The 77 is a 74 with integrated CableCard and ATSC digital tuners. When they added the tuners to the 77 they deleted the DVI and PC/VGA inputs of the 74.

It is a little dangerous to use just 67 because there are actually two 67 series. First, the currently available HLPxx67W, which is an upgraded HLPxx63W with the integrated tuner (minus DVI and PC/VGA). It uses the HD3 wobulated DLP chip. Second, the new HLRxx67W which will use the wobulated HD4 (we think), which is not out yet. Both of these models have seven segment color wheel. So you have to be a little careful just using the term 67. In either case the new HLRxx77W is an entirely different model which will have a different picture.

I am going to try and add a 77 Series area to POST #1 over the next day or so ... hopefully that will reduce the confusion.

Originally posted by subwoofer
Yea I have lots of reading to do on this thread.

You can read and study POST #1 in this thread. It is updated and maintained and contains all of the most current information.

Originally posted by htwaits
There is no "DLP" rainbow phenomenon. What there is, though, is a color wheel rainbow phenomenon.



Sorry, htwaits, you are, of course, correct. Since EJKrew was comparing LCOS to the "one chip sammy", I was answering in that vein.

Originally posted by falsedawn
Sorry, htwaits, you are, of course, correct. Since EJKrew was comparing LCOS to the "one chip sammy", I was answering in that vein.
Sure. I was just thinking of newcomers to this confusing world of microchip displays. :)

So would it be correct to say the 5688w pedestal 1080p will be the first model released since their release date was Feb/05 which probably means May/05 just like their June/05 will mean October/05

Ugh, the longer I wait for these dang TV's the farther and farther the release date becomes.

As I said in an earlier post I NEED a tv for my new place im moving into this Sat. Most people said just to wait but I cannot go that long without my big screen/high def goodness. It seems that instead of waiting a month or so i'll now be waiting up to 3 or more months.

Do any stores offer any kind of "upgrade" programs? Like say if I were to go buy an older model Panasonic or Samsung DLP this week, then in a few months when the newer models come out take it back get the full amount towards a newer version?

If not I was thinking about just buying a Plasma at Costco for now and take advantage of their excellent return policy when I want my "real" tv. I just figured i'd go Plasma because it would be easier to get in and out of the store when buying/returning.

Originally posted by sbro
So would it be correct to say the 5688w pedestal 1080p will be the first model released since their release date was Feb/05 which probably means May/05 just like their June/05 will mean October/05
Probably not. ;)

Originally posted by mastahkaz
If not I was thinking about just buying a Plasma at Costco for now and take advantage of their excellent return policy when I want my "real" tv. I just figured i'd go Plasma because it would be easier to get in and out of the store when buying/returning.

I don't know about this idea ... as a fellow Costco member, won't this kind of thinking eventually ruin our excellent return policy?

In an earlier post, you said that you wanted to keep the purchase under $3k (set, tax, delivery, stand?). That would tend to be in the HLRxx67W territory. With Samsung loading the HLRxx67W manuals on their web site, I think we are only four - six weeks from seeing these models for sale (maybe less). I think you can count on that schedule.

Anyone know where most of these new Sammy tvs will be sold at? I doubt Best Buy or CC will carry them until they have been out for a while. I've been setting my eye on the 5078 and the 5067. Just don't know if the 1080p is even worth it at this point in time. Seems kinda like overkill to me and wasting money. Why buy something that supports a format that is for two days from now when tv companies don't even have what should be here tomorrow. know what I mean?

Why buy something that supports a format that is for two days from now when tv companies don't even have what should be here tomorrow. know what I mean?

I guess it depends on whether you use your set for anything other than tv and how soon you believe that HD DVD/Blu-ray will arrive. I believe that we will see HD DVD/Blu-ray at the end of the year and that by the middle of next year (at the latest 06 holiday season) they will be affordable.

My TV purchases last me a number of years (we won't talk about when I bought the last one).

Do tell....haha. I have a 32" CRT that does just fine and I got it about 3.5 years ago. But I feel its getting close to when the time where I want HD, even though not many channels offer that much programming for it.

My 2 cents about HD DVD/Blu Ray is that its years and years away. They can't decide on which format to go with and most consumers wouldn't even know the dfference between HDDVD and DVD, so there's a very small market for it. Reminds me of the days of mini-discs and how they would take over CD-ROMs. I just don't see people wanting to rebuy all of their favorite movies AGAIN on a new format when it doesn't offer that much more, especially since very few people use HDTVs. I for one would have to throw out all of my movies and get the new formats, even if I only had to buy a few with better quality. But with HDDVDs, aren't they made for 720p and not 1080p? Or does everyone just want the 1080p because its better? Like I was saying earlier, this time next year everyone here will be saying that 1080 is old and not the best.

subwoofer, it is my understanding that both HD DVD and Blu-ray will be 1080i which the sets easily converts to 1080p (in fact there is no set out yet that will accept a 1080p signal).

UCSB, I am not sure which manuals you are aware of for the HLR sets, but on the Samsung Global download site they now have manuals for:

HLR4266
HLR5067
HLR4677
HLR5677

1080p is worth it RIGHT NOW: all the reports of people that have seen it note that the enhanced PQ is a striking step beyond 720p (if one likes to view it close enough to get the 'full big screen experience'). And there is also sound theoretical reasoning that 1080p will easily deal with the present 1080i (remember how much 'progressive scanning' meant in changing SD (480i) into 480p) and also 720p. Why is this so hard to get across?

The FCC site just listed the approval for the HLRxx64 series of sets from Samsung. A very quick perusal of the manual shows no cable card and a chip resolution of 1024x768 (possibly the new .55 XGA chip?). Here is the manual HLRxx64 (https://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/oet/forms/blobs/retrieve.cgi?attachment_id=525609&native_or_pdf=pdf)

The models the manual is for is:

HLR4664
HLR5064
HLR5664
HLR6164

Is Samsung trying to pick up a big piece of the low-end market???

Looks like it lacks a built in ATSC tuner as well which makes me think it might be meant for the Canadian market

Originally posted by millerwill
1080p is worth it RIGHT NOW: all the reports of people that have seen it note that the enhanced PQ is a striking step beyond 720p (if one likes to view it close enough to get the 'full big screen experience'). And there is also sound theoretical reasoning that 1080p will easily deal with the present 1080i (remember how much 'progressive scanning' meant in changing SD (480i) into 480p) and also 720p. Why is this so hard to get across?

It isn't, no need to get uptight about it. Its just the fact that 90% of people's tvs out there (rich or poor) don't have HD. So how is 1080p gonna pick up if 720p is barely recognized today. There needs to be more of a push for it. I'm all for it and I am planning on dropping 3-4k for a new HDTV but when I say these numbers to the general public, they look at me as if I'm crazy.

Its just hard to see if 1080 is the next step or maybe its too soon to tell.

Originally posted by subwoofer
Its just the fact that 90% of people's tvs out there (rich or poor) don't have HD. So how is 1080p gonna pick up if 720p is barely recognized today.

I agree that if you're not interested in HD then 1080p (or 1080i or 720p) makes no sense. But I don't that applies to anyone reading this forum.

Defininely not for those reading here, thats for sure. If I said there was something better than 1080p out there (which I'm sure they are working on), then everyone here would bite on that and want it. I'm just stating that the group of people here and others like us don't make up that large of a percentage of consumers who want these HDTVs. Therefore, there isn't a huge market for it causing these companies to level off for a while, which I believe is going to be 720p

Originally posted by schaffer970
UCSB, I am not sure which manuals you are aware of for the HLR sets, but on the Samsung Global download site they now have manuals for:

HLR4266
HLR5067
HLR4677
HLR5677

Thanks.

Originally posted by subwoofer
Defininely not for those reading here, thats for sure. If I said there was something better than 1080p out there (which I'm sure they are working on), then everyone here would bite on that and want it. I'm just stating that the group of people here and others like us don't make up that large of a percentage of consumers who want these HDTVs. Therefore, there isn't a huge market for it causing these companies to level off for a while, which I believe is going to be 720p

I don't disagree with the point you make here.

Originally posted by subwoofer
But with HDDVDs, aren't they made for 720p and not 1080p?
HD DVD's will be 1080i which deinterlaces to a near perfect 1080p for display on the new sets. That's also true of all HDTV now being produced using 1080i. That would be everyone except Fox, ABC, and ESPN.

I don't think we have any reports about how the 1080p sets perform with 480i, 480p, or 720p input. AT least, I don't remember reading any. ;)

Originally posted by schaffer970
UCSB, I am not sure which manuals you are aware of for the HLR sets, but on the Samsung Global download site they now have manuals for:

HLR4266
HLR5067
HLR4677
HLR5677

The HLR5067 manual is for the 4667, 5067, 5667, and 6167. So we have all of the HLRxx67W's covered. It is the link that I have for Owners Manual in POST #1. But, I will be adding the xx66 and xx77 info soon.

Why buy something that supports a format that is for two days from now when tv companies don't even have what should be here tomorrow. know what I mean?

If I'm going to be spending 4k+ on a tv I'm going to be keeping it for 5+ years. Blue-ray/hd dvd may not be out now, but in 5-10 years we'll see it and I'll be ready for it. This isn't a purchase that I make every year or 2. This is a purchase that will be used for a long time so I might as well get as good as I can when I'm ready to buy.

Originally posted by subwoofer
So how is 1080p gonna pick up if 720p is barely recognized today. There needs to be more of a push for it. I'm all for it and I am planning on dropping 3-4k for a new HDTV but when I say these numbers to the general public, they look at me as if I'm crazy. Most new products/features start at the bleeding edge. LaserDiscs sold decently well for a long time to a dedicated niche. Porsches too. ABS, airbags, stability/traction control all were luxury features for a long time, but now are standard even down to cheap family sedans.

Being ahead of the curve means getting better picture quality at a higher price than it will later cost. I went through this same exercise with my PDA; I bought a fancy unit about 18 months ago that I knew would drop by $100 in two months, and it did, but each incremental day I had it was worth more than $10 for that day for me. So I look at it not as paying $100 too much, but as having gotten a great deal on functionality.

haha, oh right Laserdiscs, those are still popular.....haha. You make a good point with the math you did for $10 a day is worth it. All depends on the person and what you want. I for one like to shop around for the best deal and get the best bang for my buck. This is the reason why I never buy the fastest CPU on the market when building a new PC, its not worth it. Just my side of the story though, others think different.

Think the 5078 might be overkill for me so I might be leaning towards the HLR5067w. Did I read somewhere that this will be out real soon? That true?

Also with the xx67 series, is it a good thing or bad thing that they ditched the DVI port? I thought that is the best way to connect a PC to your DLP TV.

If its true that the HLR5067w will be coming out within a month then i'll probably wait for that and get it. My only concern about that is its been said to use the HD4 chip. I do not like the image the current HD3 chips give compared to the HD2+. So, as far as I know i'm going 720p no matter what. I just don't want to wait too long for the new sets only to find out the HD4 gives that "soft" look that I dont like, then end up getting a HD2+ set that I could have bought today.

My reason for going 720p instead of 1080p is that unlike alot of people posting here, i get the "upgrade bug" quite frequently. I tend to upgrade all my major electronics (computer, tv, etc.) every two years. I usually sell off the current item and use that money plus whatever i've saved up to upgrade. I think in two years we'll be closer to seeing more 1080p stuff out there and it'll then be worth buying to me. The price will also have come down a great deal.

I've also actually been considering a 480p display, probably a Plasma. Reason being is the only High Def source I have now is the very few channels I get though comcast, and even then I only watch about 5 HD shows a week (which still look amazing on my current ED display). HD-DVD/Bluray probably wont be affordable before I end up getting my next (as in next after this) display anyways. But, one of the big reasons i'm wanting to step it up to 720p is since the announcement that all Xbox 2 games would be 720p. And i'm a big gamer. Plus a 50" RPTV is bigger than a 42" plasma, and bigger is always better.

Originally posted by subwoofer
haha, oh right Laserdiscs, those are still popular.....haha. You make a good point with the math you did for $10 a day is worth it. All depends on the person and what you want. I for one like to shop around for the best deal and get the best bang for my buck. This is the reason why I never buy the fastest CPU on the market when building a new PC, its not worth it. Just my side of the story though, others think different.

Think the 5078 might be overkill for me so I might be leaning towards the HLR5067w. Did I read somewhere that this will be out real soon? That true?

Also with the xx67 series, is it a good thing or bad thing that they ditched the DVI port? I thought that is the best way to connect a PC to your DLP TV.

Subwoofer - if you are looking for the best bang for the buck rather than the newest and greatest, you will be hardpressed to find a better deal than the current 4674 and 5674. Why do you want to wait for the xx67 series?

As I see it, if you want a 720P set, the xx74/xx77 series is the best bet because:

1) They have the HD2+ chipset which makes sharper images. (Admittedly, I don't know that much about the HD3 chips on xx67 series.)

2) xx74 series has 2 digital ports (HDMI and DVI).

3) They are probably getting cheaper and cheaper right now to buy and probably will vanish altogether from the market pretty soon.

On the flip side, the xx74 doesn't have built-in ATSC tuners etc. If this is important, you could consider the xx77 series but I don't know about the deals available on those.

Cheers.

^Thanks for the info and post!

I would get one of these but I want a 50" set and something newer with less bugs in it. Plus, I heard that the xx74s have PS2 lagging on them. I really still have to do more homework on these DLP tvs again, I havent looked into them hard enough since the fall

Has anyone heard anything about the WEIGHT of the new 1080p sets, specifically the 67" and 70" ones? The present 6163 weights only 99 lbs; it would be very useful to know how much heavier these larger sets will be.

The following is from Samsung manuals for the HLR models (in pounds):

4667 5067 5667 6167
66.8 72.5 80.91 94.58

4664 5064 5664 6164
69.44 77.16 91.49 103.62

4677 5677
71.65 93.7


I wouldn't expect much difference for the 1080p sets, the only real difference is the light engine and there can't be a major gain in weight.

So the 61" sets are ~ 100 +/- 5 lbs. I still wonder how much heavier the 67" (HLR6768) and 70" (HLR7078 or HLR7068) sets will be.

Morning all --

Some updated AVS pricing for these new models will be posted no later than this evening PST. See ya soon!

Seems that these tvs have come down in price. According to the first page in this thread, the 5067w is set to $2999. That seems very cheap because you can probably get it for about $500 cheaper at a store whenever it comes out. Thats pretty decent for a 50" 720p HDTV.

My plan is to get a 50" HDTV this summer, a decent 55" or 58" wide stand, a new DVD player that upconverts to 720p, DVI and HDMI cables and a power strip. I would have to say that my price range for all of this (including the warrenty) $3000-$4000. I figured I could get all of this and Comcast HD package to watch primetime tv in HD, movies on the movie channels in HD, digital cable to look great, standard cable to look decent, play PS2 and PS3 (next year) on this tv and also every now and then hook my PC up to it. I could use some help for some good tips with DLP issue I am having. I could get an HDTV now or I can wait another 9-12 months. I'm open for suggestions.

THanks

Where will the TVA pricing be posted? In this thread, in this forum, or in the PowerBuy forum?

Thanks.

Originally posted by T. Perinne
Where will the TVA pricing be posted? In this thread, in this forum, or in the PowerBuy forum?
How about the TVA web site on the AVS member pages. :)

That's where all the other "AVS specials" have been.

The new posted prices Neil referred too may not be "special" this early. For sure they should be based on actual MSRP prices from Samsung and not on estimates.

Originally posted by htwaits
How about the TVA web site on the AVS member pages. :)

That's where all the other "AVS specials" have been.

The new posted prices Neil referred too may not be "special" this early. For sure they should be based on actual MSRP prices from Samsung and not on estimates.

Lol, give me a link please? I'm not finding...

Originally posted by T. Perinne
Lol, give me a link please? I'm not finding...
http://www.tvauthority.com/avs-forum-members-only/avs-forum-members-only.asp

Hi,

I've been following this thread for a while now. I'm wondering if there are any reasons to wait for the HLRxx67 sets to be released or should I just buy the HLPxx74 model now before they are gone and hopefully at a good price? What are the differences between the two model series that are really worthwhile? Should I expect a better picture quality out of the new chips compared with the HD2+ chips?

Thanks!

Originally posted by subwoofer
^Thanks for the info and post!

I would get one of these but I want a 50" set and something newer with less bugs in it.

An oxymoron if ever there was one. :D

Can't really comment on the lag with PS2 etc.... I am not a gamer.

Originally posted by jandrade
I've been following this thread for a while now. I'm wondering if there are any reasons to wait for the HLRxx67 sets to be released or should I just buy the HLPxx74 model now before they are gone and hopefully at a good price? What are the differences between the two model series that are really worthwhile? Should I expect a better picture quality out of the new chips compared with the HD2+ chips?

Thanks!
You seem to be using some information that is a "little" mixed up. :)

The 720p HLRxx67 is the 2005 version of the HLRxx63 sets which use the HD3 chip. The HD3 chip has half the mirrors of the HD2 chip and uses a "wobblation" mirror to project two pixels on the screen for each mirror on the chip. The HLRxx67 additionally has a built in HD tuner and CableCard.

The 720p HD2+ chip (an improved HD2 chip) was also new to the market at about the same time the HD3 chip came out. It's the more expensive option because it has a mirror on the chip for every pixel on the screen. It is also used in the HLPxx85 sets.

Again the HLPxx74 models were released in 2004 (late) and the HLRxx77 are on their way to the market now. The "R" indicates 2005 release and the last digit (7) indicates that the sets will also have a HD tuner and CableCard built in.

The HD3 chip is cheaper and produces a softer image. The HD2+ chip is more expensive and produces a sharper image. Which one pleases you will depend on how you use it, and how you react to the picture quality that is produced.

If the new models have better picture quality it may be due to refinements in the light engine more than which chip is used.

At the same time there are the HLR sets coming that use the "xHD?" chip which is 1080p. They will have higher resolution and contrast ratio and will also use "wobblation" to produce two pixels on the screen for each mirror on the chip. They will probably be the most expensive Samsung DLP sets. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by htwaits
The 720p HLRxx67 is the 2005 version of the HLRxx63 sets which use the HD3 chip.
Now my big question of the day is... is the HLRxx67 going to use the HD3 chip or a new chip called HD4? Half the people here keep saying HD3, then the other half, including the person who updates the main page of this thread says HD4.

I'd just like to know because if its HD3 then im definatly going to pass on these new models and something with an HD2+ in it (probably the Panasonic). If it's HD4 then I might wait and see how those look before buying something.

Very useful information, htwait! It does help to clarify a few things. However I'm still confused on the HLRxx67 because POST#1 in this thread indicates they would use the new chip HD4, and not the HD3 as you say. So will these be very simlar chips, or do we just not know yet which one will be used?

It sounds like the "wobblation" mechanism may decrease production costs but also picture quality, right? In what situations would I not want the sharper picture?

I am also wondering about the HD tuner. I always use a cable box as my tuner. Why would I want an integrated tuner as well?

Thanks!

I may be in the minority, but I think the wobulated chips are getting a bad rap here and I don't think it's warranted. Real life doesn't have lines between the pixels unless you're looking through a screen door:D. I believe the wobulated chip is an ingenious way to solve a problem and IMHO produces a better picture.

Originally posted by mastahkaz
Now my big question of the day is... is the HLRxx67 going to use the HD3 chip or a new chip called HD4? Half the people here keep saying HD3, then the other half, including the person who updates the main page of this thread says HD4.
Based on the info I got from Steve Panosian (the Director of Marketing for Digital HDTV & DLP TV Products at Samsung Electronics America), I think the HLRxx67W Series will be using the HD3 chip...

Originally posted by jandrade
I've been following this thread for a while now. I'm wondering if there are any reasons to wait for the HLRxx67 sets to be released or should I just buy the HLPxx74 model now before they are gone and hopefully at a good price? What are the differences between the two model series that are really worthwhile? Should I expect a better picture quality out of the new chips compared with the HD2+ chips?
In this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=5354585#post5354585) you'll find a comparison of these models...

The 77 Series mentioned in the link above is the same as the 74 Series. The only real difference is it has the built-in tuner/cablecard and it drops the DVI and VGA inputs. (Same "thin bezel" cabinet, etc as the 74 Series.)

Originally posted by smahon
I believe the wobulated chip is an ingenious way to solve a problem
What is the problem that wobulation tries to solve?

Originally posted by smahon
and IMHO produces a better picture.
I suppose that a better picture is based on each person's opinion. Do you mean to say that wobulation used with the HD3 chips produces a sharper image, or do you prefer the softer image?

Originally posted by smahon
Real life doesn't have lines between the pixels unless you're looking through a screen door:D.
Real life isnt all fuzzy/blurry either (unless you're drunk). :)

Out of the two i'll take the sharper image and deal with a little more SDE than the fuzzier image with a lower CR.

Time to divide this thread into two; one for 720p product line and the other for 1080p.

Originally posted by jandrade
Very useful information, htwait! It does help to clarify a few things. However I'm still confused on the HLRxx67 because POST#1 in this thread indicates they would use the new chip HD4, and not the HD3 as you say. So will these be very simlar chips, or do we just not know yet which one will be used?

If they do use an HD4 chip, it will be a "wobulation" chip like the HD3. My guess is they will still be using the HD3 chip.

It sounds like the "wobblation" mechanism may decrease production costs but also picture quality, right? In what situations would I not want the sharper picture?

Some people prefer the smoother film-like image that the wobble chip produces. Some people may think the sharper image from the HD2+ chip is not natural. It's personal preference.

I am also wondering about the HD tuner. I always use a cable box as my tuner. Why would I want an integrated tuner as well?

You wouldn't use both. One or the other. Integrated could be nice because you won't need another component sitting in your HT rack and you would have one more free input on the back of your TV where your cable box would have been connected...

Originally posted by Administrator
Integrated could be nice because you won't need another component sitting in your HT rack and you would have one more free input on the back of your TV where your cable box would have been connected...
Except that as you pointed out the "67" sets give up the DVI input. :)

Originally posted by mastahkaz
Now my big question of the day is... is the HLRxx67 going to use the HD3 chip or a new chip called HD4? Half the people here keep saying HD3, then the other half, including the person who updates the main page of this thread says HD4.
The first page "qualified" the possibility of a HD4 chip the last time I read it. :)

Some folks hope so hard that they miss the qualifiers. ;)

All i know is the first page reads something like this:

"DLP Chip: per Samsung, Latest 720p (HD4 --- neither Samsung nor TI are discussing chips, this is our best guess given available information)"

It looks like somebody got some kind of "available information" that would lead them to believe the chip used will be HD4.

As for getting my hopes up, I could care less what it ends up using. I just know for a fact I dont like the look the HD3 chips give (compared to HD2+), therefore if this is using something else i'm willing to wait and give it a try before I pass on it as an option. If it ends up using an HD3 then oh well, i'll get an HD2+ model that'll treat me just fine.

Originally posted by jandrade
However I'm still confused on the HLRxx67 because POST#1 in this thread indicates they would use the new chip HD4, and not the HD3 as you say.

I don't think Post#1 actually says that a HD4 chip will be used.

So will these be very similar chips

Probably but again, we know nothing about the HD4 chip except that two manufacturers refereed to "HD4" when all the other's did not discuss chips at all.

or do we just not know yet which one will be used?

See above. :)

It sounds like the "wobblation" mechanism may decrease production costs but also picture quality, right?

Costs are reduced for sure. Picture quality is in the eye of the beholder. My number one use of a DLP TV is to watch DVD movies from film stock.

For me, extra sharpness can be distracting. It's nice for "good quality" HD TV, but that's hard to find.

In what situations would I not want the sharper picture?

DVD movies and digital SD TV are two that I like better with the HD3 chip.

The price difference, at the time I made my final choice, was ~$800 (HLP5063 vs HLP5674, and my wife didn't want a bigger screen. :rolleyes: Both factors were part of my choice. :)

I am also wondering about the HD tuner. I always use a cable box as my tuner. Why would I want an integrated tuner as well?

It's no use for satellite subscribers but, as Administrator pointed out, it lets you get rid of one box for Cable or OTA sources.

Originally posted by Administrator

If they do use an HD4 chip, it will be a "wobulation" chip like the HD3. My guess is they will still be using the HD3 chip.

.....

Some people prefer the smoother film-like image that the wobble chip produces. Some people may think the sharper image from the HD2+ chip is not natural. It's personal preference.



OK. I am confused, again. I have compared the xx63w and the xx85w and I have no doubt that the HD2+ sets looks better than the HD2 sets. But is there any HD3 sets out yet to compare? What about the Rxx77W when it shows up on the show room floor (soon)?

I think I am in the same boat with a few people here. I am waiting to see if the HD3 or HD4 set looks any better than the HD2+ (contrast and smoothness wise) before pulling the trigger on a HD2+ sets before they are discontinued.

The 1080p don't excite me but smoothness is a bit of a concern. On DLP screens, I see some "un-natural" movement with close up on fast action
sports like the under basket shoots in basketball. Thats why I have been thinking of going with the Sony GW IV before.

Eric

Originally posted by mastahkaz
All i know is the first page reads something like this:

"DLP Chip: per Samsung, Latest 720p (HD4 --- neither Samsung nor TI are discussing chips, this is our best guess given available information)"

It looks like somebody got some kind of "available information" that would lead them to believe the chip used will be HD4.

I think it led them to a "best guess". That's pretty clear.

One source of "available information" was two manufacturer's at CES listed HD4 on the signs in front of the sets they were showing or in some printed material. The counter "available information" is Administrator's quote from Steve Panosian.

Post#1 has been a mammoth task to create and keep up to date while indicating what might happen along with what probably will happen.

Your choice sounds fine to me. It should because I almost made the same one.

Chanman - Did you ever live in Reno, NV? Graduate from Reno High?

Originally posted by chanman
I have compared the xx63w and the xx85w and I have no doubt that the HD2+ sets looks better than the HD2 sets.

The HLPxx63 sets use HD3 chips. You would have to compare the HLPxx85 sets to the HLN or even older HLM sets to compare HD2 and HD2+ chips. I agree that the HD2+ chip looks better in the HLPxx85 sets than the HD2 based sets. Higher contrast ratio and a seven element color wheel seem to make a big difference. The HLPxx74 & new HLRxx77 sets still use the six element color wheel.

But is there any HD3 sets out yet to compare?

All HLPxx63 sets use the HD3 chip and they went into production one year ago.

What about the Rxx77W when it shows up on the show room floor (soon)?

It will look and perform just like the HLPxx74 sets with a HD tuner and CableCard added.

htwaits - why are the 74 & 77's with the HD2+ rated at 2000:1 CR while the 85 "Pedastool" models are rated at 2500:1?

The Pedastool models look better on paper as they have a faster color wheel and higher CR, but i've never seen a 74/77 in real life to compare. The Pedastool models just wont work for me though because I need to be able to put the TV on a stand. This is why i'm thinkin about the Panasonic if I end up going with a HD2+ set, it states a 2500:1 CR plus an 8-segment color wheel. I've actually seen this set in person and the picture was great, plus it can be had at a great price. However, the styling of the Panny is ugly. I'd rather have something with speakers on the bottom like the Samsungs.

I guess im getting a little off topic here. But, theres not much new info as far as these new sets are concerned to talk about.

Originally posted by mastahkaz
htwaits - why are the 74 & 77's with the HD2+ rated at 2000:1 CR while the 85 "Pedastool" models are rated at 2500:1?

The difference that I know about is the color wheel. It has seven elements in the HLPxx85 sets and six elements in the HLPxx74-77 sets.

Also the light engine in the HLPxx85 sets is a complete new design to work from the pedestal. The light engine in the HLPxx74-77 sets is a "tweaked" HLN light engine from the HLN567 and HLN467 sets. It's probably just like the light engine used in all the HLM and HLN sets with minor improvements. The HLM/HLN sets has a contrast ration of 1,000:1.

The Pedastool models look better on paper as they have a faster color wheel and higher CR, but i've never seen a 74/77 in real life to compare.

Most people think the HLPxx85 is slightly better. You may not ever see one as, according to Steve Panosian, Samsung will only build 1,000 of them.

This is why i'm thinkin about the Panasonic if I end up going with a HD2+ set, it states a 2500:1 CR plus an 8-segment color wheel.

I like the Panasonic PQ but not the side mounted speakers. Because of the speakers I've never tried to view one critically.

I've actually seen this set in person and the picture was great, plus it can be had at a great price. However, the styling of the Panny is ugly. I'd rather have something with speakers on the bottom like the Samsungs.

Now you are in my dilemma. It's one I couldn't get passed my wife either.

Never fear. The discussion will go on until there are tidbits about next years models. Also, a lot of the competition hasn't been heard from yet.

Originally posted by AkaStp
Better still would have been to replace the DVI input with another HDMI input.
... which they are doing in the 1080p models. :rolleyes:

My guess is that the DVI input that is removed from the back panel is actually being used by the internal tuner, allowing insertion of the tuner without redesigning the actual inputs. The 1080p's are a redesign anyhow, so they are able to add another digital input to the mix.

Originally posted by smahon
My guess is that the DVI input that is removed from the back panel is actually being used by the internal tuner, allowing insertion of the tuner without redesigning the actual inputs. The 1080p's are a redesign anyhow, so they are able to add another digital input to the mix.
They've all been doing it in like circumstances so I think your "guess" just might be on the money -- pun intended. ;)

Originally posted by mastahkaz
Real life isnt all fuzzy/blurry either (unless you're drunk). :)

Out of the two i'll take the sharper image and deal with a little more SDE than the fuzzier image with a lower CR.

Many videophiles prefer the film-quality picture produced by an HD3 chip to the digital picture produced by an HD2+ chip. My wife and I both do, which is why I won't buy a TV based on HD2+.

And with the new 1080p sets, the CR is significantly higher, not lower!

I will try to give you a bit of history as to where the information in post #1 came from and where I think we are going now.

First remember that all the information in post #1 started from CES 2005 back in January. There was a thread Samsung CES news (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=491508 ) that many of us were following, but once we had an actual announcement of models from Samsung, UCSB started this thread with the information found in post #1. In trying to put together post #1 UCSB made, and continues to make, a Herculean effort to gather and correlate all information available. One of the things we were all interested in was what chips were going to be put in the sets. TI, Samsung and the other manufactures were closed-mouthed and gave out no information of what chips were going in the various sets.

One piece of information of interest, came from Optoma who said in a CES press release that they were using a HD4 chip with a CR of 2500:1 (interesting note, the current press release on the Optoma site has no mention of HD4 now). In addition there is a document on the Zeiss site that many of us knew about, that mentions the HD3/HD4 and the xHD3/xHD4. Thus, with Samsung announcing new sets with greatly improved CR ratios, UCSB with input from many of us, decided to list the HD4 and xHD4 chips as the chips that would be used with disclaimer wording. Most of the decision making was based on CR as that seemed to be the differentiating characteristic of the various sets.

I have spent countless hours scouring the internet trying to figure out what the chip scheme is that TI is/will be using. Just lately things have fallen in place for me and I think I have it figured out (of course all of this may be BS too). The most recent developments in chip technologies made by TI are something called Fast Track Pixel (FTP) and DarkChip3. FTP actually changes the chip architecture (there is one less layer and the chip is easier to manufacture, see attachment) while DarkChip3, as I understand it, adds a coating to minimize light scattering from within the chip (I am not completely sure where FTP stops and DarkChip3 starts but it really doesn’t matter). What this all results in, is that the HD4 chip is a HD3 chip with FTP/DarkChip3 and the xHD4 is xHD3 with FTP/DarkChip3. I believe that for at least this year, the only new chips we will see will be the wobbulated HD4/xHD4. It would not surprise me to see a non-wobbulated chip in 2006.

I believe the naming scheme that TI seems to have settled on is the chip diagonal size followed by 720p, 1080p or some other designation such as XGA. So far we have .55 XGA, .8 720p (in the SIM2 HT300E), and rumors of .85 1080p.

In the mean time, the sets that Samsung is putting out seem to continue to have the existing HD2+ or HD3 chips in them with the inputs updated. Hopefully things will become clear as to when we will see the new chips over the next couple of months (look for the inclusion of DarkChip3 in info from Samsung).

Sorry for being so long winded, but hopefully this will help some of you.
:D :D :D

Originally posted by duffin
Time to divide this thread into two; one for 720p product line and the other for 1080p.

I agree. This thread is an incredible source of information, but for someone who's only interested in the 1080p models, there's an awful lot of 720p discussion to wade through.

You can always go to the first post to get up-to-date and when at all possible accurate info. Once you are aware of what is on the first post just keep checking the last few pages of the thread daily. It is not really that much to "wade" through especially considering there are only 1-2 pages added to the thread daily and most of the posts are relatively small in size.

I believe there was some degree of agreement that "Owners" threads that would be based on resolution or series, should be started as people actually acquired the new sets. Until that time we would keep this thread together.

Originally posted by thommy
I agree. This thread is an incredible source of information, but for someone who's only interested in the 1080p models, there's an awful lot of 720p discussion to wade through.

I agree with Schaffer970, owners threads (67 Series 720p, 68 / 78 Series 1080p) threads will be created once these units are released. With the 67 Series expected in the next four to six weeks, a lot of the 720p discussion will switch to the owners thread.

I feel there is value in having all of the 2005 models together. As we have seen, there are enough models in the 2005 line-up that it can get confusing.

If you have limited time and don't want to sort through all of the discussion, I maintain a change log at the end of POST #1 showing the date and what change I made to POST #1. You can just look at the end of the change log to see if there have been any changes to POST #1.

I'm going to be making the following changes to POST #1:

1. Add digital audio out to all units.
2. Add 77 Series to 720p area.
3. Clarify HLR4266W in 67 series area and add link to manual.
4. Add weight spec for 67 series units to specs area.

Have I missed any other required changes?

What about adding the new HLRxx64 models that are expected soon as well as perhaps adding a more clear disclaimer to any mention of possible chips being used as that seems to be creating confusion for some

TVAuthority has negotiated some group pricing with Samsung for an official AVS /TVA PowerBuy. The PowerBuy will initially only be for the HLR4266W, HLRxx67, HLR5087W, and HLRxx77 series. We've learned from past PowerBuys not to take pre-orders for models that won't be shipping for 2 months. Dates get pushed back, and prices change in that time frame. We have every intention of adding the various 1080P models to the PowerBuy down the road.

Details, pricing, and pre-orders will be available on Thursday 3/24 @ 9:00am PST / 12:00pm EST. Keep an eye on the main Rear Projection section for a sticky thread on the top of the section. We've put together a real good program for AVSers which will allow you to save more money as more of your fellow members purchase. Stay tuned!

Also, here's some updated info. I'm sure it's been posted somewhere on this monsterous thread, but just in case:

HLR4266W - MAP $2499 - Shipping Mid May
HLR4667W - MAP $2699 - Shipping Mid April - Preliminary Spec Sheet (http://www.tvauthority.com/dlp/hl-r4667w.pdf)

HLR5067W - MAP $2999 - Shipping Mid April - Preliminary Spec Sheet (http://www.tvauthority.com/dlp/hl-r5067w.pdf)

HLR5667W - MAP $3499 - Shipping Mid April - Preliminary Spec Sheet (http://www.tvauthority.com/dlp/hl-r5667w.pdf)

HLR6167W - MAP $3799 - Shipping Mid April - Preliminary Spec Sheet (http://www.tvauthority.com/dlp/hl-r6167w.pdf)

HLR5087W - MAP $3999 - Shipping Mid April - Preliminary Spec Sheet (http://www.tvauthority.com/dlp/hl-r5087w.pdf)


HLR4677W - MAP $2499 - Preliminary Spec Sheet (http://www.tvauthority.com/dlp/hl-r4677w.pdf)

HLR5677W - MAP $3499 - Preliminary Spec Sheet (http://www.tvauthority.com/dlp/hl-r5677w.pdf)

Both 77 Models Shipping Now! We've got units arriving on Friday!

Originally posted by UCSB
I'm going to be making the following changes to POST #1:

1. Add digital audio out to all units.
2. Add 77 Series to 720p area.
3. Clarify HLR4266W in 67 series area and add link to manual.
4. Add weight spec for 67 series units to specs area.


I have made all of these changes to POST #1, except adding a link for the HLR4266W manual. I could not find it on the downloads site. If anyone has a link to it please post the link.

Originally posted by neiltvauthority
HLR5087W - MAP $3999 - Shipping Mid April - Preliminary Spec Sheet (http://www.tvauthority.com/dlp/hl-r5087w.pdf)

Please note that this price is $200 higher than the number in POST #1, I will revise POST #1 upward unless someone can determine that this $3,999 price is in error.

Originally posted by Jon_W
What about adding the new HLRxx64 models that are expected soon as well as perhaps adding a more clear disclaimer to any mention of possible chips being used as that seems to be creating confusion for some

Even though Schaffer970 found the 64 series manuals, we have not heard about this potentially new series from any other source than the FCC site. Therefore, it is too early to add these units to POST #1. Once we can confirm that Samsung will be selling the 64 series, I will add it to POST #1.

Originally posted by neiltvauthority
TVAuthority has negotiated some group pricing with Samsung for an official AVS /TVA PowerBuy. The PowerBuy will initially only be for the HLR4266W, HLRxx67, HLR5087W, and HLRxx77 series. We've learned from past PowerBuys not to take pre-orders for models that won't be shipping for 2 months. Dates get pushed back, and prices change in that time frame. We have every intention of adding the various 1080P models to the PowerBuy down the road.

Details, pricing, and pre-orders will be available on Thursday 3/24 @ 9:00am PST / 12:00pm EST. Keep an eye on the main Rear Projection section for a sticky thread on the top of the section. We've put together a real good program for AVSers which will allow you to save more money as more of your fellow members purchase. Stay tuned!

Thanks Neil, the information that you are providing is very useful. Especially, the MID APRIL arrival for the 67 series. Thanks!

I'm sure we are going to have some interesting discussions if the price of the HLR4677W is $2,499 and the price of the HLR4266W is $2,499. Samsung seems to be discounting the 77 series, even though the case is nicer.

UCSB --

Woops. That was an error. The correct MAP price on the HLR4677 is $2899 not $2499. Thanks for staying on top of this!

Good night!

Has there been any new information on the 78 series? Such as updated pricing and availability?

I've waited a long time for the right big screen DLP to come along and the 7078 looks like the winner. I have a very large family room that virtually swallows up my current HDTV (Zenith c32v37). So at a viewing distance of about 18-20 feet I feel that a 70 inch Sammy will fit in nicely. Also I have a growing collection of HD movies and TV programs that I've been saving to watch on a large screen. To say I'm excited about the 78 series is an understatement, I'm practically renovating my entire family room around the future purchase of that TV. Also the 1080p aspect will prove to be very exciting as well. I would imagine before the year is out we should start to see a few movies/programs in the 1080p format.

Shawn - a very excited consumer

Is there any confirmation that the HLRXX67W models will have those 2 Firewire inputs?

Originally posted by UCSB
I have made all of these changes to POST #1, except adding a link for the HLR4266W manual. I could not find it on the downloads site. If anyone has a link to it please post the link.

Here you go: http://www.samsung.com/download/FileView.aspx?cttfileid=263998&type=TV&typecode=1&subtype=Projection&subtypecode=103&model=HL-R4266W&filetype=UM&language=

Originally posted by Jon_W
Is there any confirmation that the HLRXX67W models will have those 2 Firewire inputs?

Well based on Neil's link ( http://www.tvauthority.com/dlp/hl-r6167w.pdf ) there will be a PC input which I'm assuming would be firewire.

EDIT: After searching the pdf manual there is no mention of firewire so perhaps it's not there afterall.

Originally posted by Jon_W
Is there any confirmation that the HLRXX67W models will have those 2 Firewire inputs?

There are two firewire inputs shown in the manual for the HLRXX67W. However, there aren't any shown on the HLR4266W.

The users manual for the HLRxx67 model (http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/200503/20050315094921953_BP68-00469A-00Eng.pdf) show two firewire ports (see page 14).

Originally posted by mastahkaz
htwaits - why are the 74 & 77's with the HD2+ rated at 2000:1 CR while the 85 "Pedastool" models are rated at 2500:1?

The Pedastool models look better on paper as they have a faster color wheel and higher CR, but i've never seen a 74/77 in real life to compare. The Pedastool models just wont work for me though because I need to be able to put the TV on a stand. This is why i'm thinkin about the Panasonic if I end up going with a HD2+ set, it states a 2500:1 CR plus an 8-segment color wheel. I've actually seen this set in person and the picture was great, plus it can be had at a great price. However, the styling of the Panny is ugly. I'd rather have something with speakers on the bottom like the Samsungs.

This is something I have been curious about as well. I am kinda split between the xx78 and the xx67. Besides the fact that one is 720p and the other is 1080p, does the difference between contrast ratio matter for these two sets? I mean, the one is 2000:1 and the other is 10,000:1. Thats a huge difference and I was wondering if it will be worth the extra bucks.

Also, where is everyone going to view/buy these tvs at? I think my only option is Tweeter (if I wanna see it).

Thanks guys sorry for the confusion. I previous thought I had looked at the manual for the HLRXX67W model but now I realize it had been the HLRXX77W. The firewire ports make the set more appealing given lack of more than one HDMI/DVi input.

Does anyone know if the HLRxx77 models are certified to work well with game consoles? (That was one of the reasons I decided not to pick up the HLPxx74.) I remember someone mentioning that almost all the existing models were *not* certified to work well with game consoles, but that new Samsungs coming out were supposed to be.

Originally posted by Arkitech
Has there been any new information on the 78 series? Such as updated pricing and availability?

I've waited a long time for the right big screen DLP to come along and the 7078 looks like the winner. I have a very large family room that virtually swallows up my current HDTV (Zenith c32v37). So at a viewing distance of about 18-20 feet I feel that a 70 inch Sammy will fit in nicely. Also I have a growing collection of HD movies and TV programs that I've been saving to watch on a large screen. To say I'm excited about the 78 series is an understatement, I'm practically renovating my entire family room around the future purchase of that TV. Also the 1080p aspect will prove to be very exciting as well. I would imagine before the year is out we should start to see a few movies/programs in the 1080p format.

Shawn - a very excited consumer

Shawn -- according to Samsung, the HLR7078 is due to ship in June/July with the rest of the 78 series. As we hear more updated information, we will make sure to pass it on!

Thanks!

Originally posted by drewba
Here you go: http://www.samsung.com/download/FileView.aspx?cttfileid=263998&type=TV&typecode=1&subtype=Projection&subtypecode=103&model=HL-R4266W&filetype=UM&language=

Thanks! The HLR426W manual is now a link in POST #1.

Originally posted by rictus
Does anyone know if the HLRxx77 models are certified to work well with game consoles? (That was one of the reasons I decided not to pick up the HLPxx74.) I remember someone mentioning that almost all the existing models were *not* certified to work well with game consoles, but that new Samsungs coming out were supposed to be.

I would expect the HLRxx77W to work like a HLPxx74W for gaming. There is an extensive HLPxx74 owners thread. You should be able to get a good idea of gaming performance there.

As far as I know, none of the new Samsungs will be *certified* to work with video gaming. This one area that Samsung does not address in their specs, manuals, or advertising. After they are released, we will start to get feedback on their gaming performance. I would wait for these early reports if gaming performance is important to your purchasing decision.

I have included links to the Preliminary Spec sheets for the 67 / 87 series POST #1. Since we have the manual for the 67, it would be a better source of information for detailed questions.

Hey Bill,

Here was my source for the "HLR series should not have synch issues with video games" theory:

http://www.highdefforum.com/showthread.php?t=5807&highlight=HLP5067+video+games

I know, it's not avsforum, so it's probably not accurate :) But it's supposedly from someone at Samsung--that said, it's a "should not" rather than "is guaranteed not to".

nj

UCSB/Neil,

So, again, is the 7078 still tentative or is it a go?

Originally posted by Ed Weinman
UCSB/Neil,

So, again, is the 7078 still tentative or is it a go?

Our best data indicates that the 70" will be built. But, we still do not have confirmation from Samsung.

I have created an new FAQ ... #17 it contains Schaffer970's chip information. I think this information is very valuable because if you think about it, it could lead to performance differences between the HD3 generation and HD4 generation. The new FAQ is below:

---------

17. Is there any information about the differences between the HD3 / xHD3 generation chips and HD4 / xHD4 generation chips? Comments by Schaffer970 (AVSforum Member)
I have spent countless hours scouring the internet trying to figure out what the chip scheme is that TI is/will be using. Just lately things have fallen in place for me and I think I have it figured out (of course all of this may be BS too). The most recent developments in chip technologies made by TI are something called Fast Track Pixel (FTP) and DarkChip3. FTP actually changes the chip architecture (there is one less layer and the chip is easier to manufacture, see attachment) while DarkChip3, as I understand it, adds a coating to minimize light scattering from within the chip (I am not completely sure where FTP stops and DarkChip3 starts but it really doesn’t matter). What this all results in, is that the HD4 chip is a HD3 chip with FTP/DarkChip3 and the xHD4 is xHD3 with FTP/DarkChip3. I believe that for at least this year, the only new chips we will see will be the wobbulated HD4/xHD4. It would not surprise me to see a non-wobbulated chip in 2006.

I believe the naming scheme that TI seems to have settled on is the chip diagonal size followed by 720p, 1080p or some other designation such as XGA. So far we have .55 XGA, .8 720p (in the SIM2 HT300E), and rumors of .85 1080p.

In the mean time, the sets that Samsung is putting out seem to continue to have the existing HD2+ or HD3 chips in them with the inputs updated. Hopefully things will become clear as to when we will see the new chips over the next couple of months (look for the inclusion of DarkChip3 in info from Samsung).

Chip Diagram: Fast Track Pixel - FTP (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?s=&postid=5376289&fullpage=1)

Originally posted by Ed Weinman
UCSB/Neil,

So, again, is the 7078 still tentative or is it a go?

Ed --

According to my resources, the HLR7078 is scheduled to ship late summer with the rest of the 78 series. I certainly wouldn't bet my life on it coming out, but if it helps, I know a UPC code has already been generated for it, and estimated weight and dimensions already exist for it. Also, it will be released in the speciality channel: (Tweeter, Magnolia, TVAuthority, Etc..)

As I get more info, I'll make sure to pass it on!

Originally posted by rictus
Hey Bill,

Here was my source for the "HLR series should not have synch issues with video games" theory:

http://www.highdefforum.com/showthread.php?t=5807&highlight=HLP5067+video+games

I know, it's not avsforum, so it's probably not accurate :) But it's supposedly from someone at Samsung--that said, it's a "should not" rather than "is guaranteed not to".

nj

We will just have to test actual units as they are released. There really is no way to know aboout gaming performance beforehand. I would expect the HLRxx67W's to perform well. The HLRxxx8's are another matter ... only time will tell.

I am willing to release the tentative status off of the HLR5078W and HLR7078W. As a group, what does everyone think?

[Remember, there seems to be some question still whether they are going to build the entire 78 line or just expand the 68 series]

Originally posted by neiltvauthority
Ed --

According to my resources, the HLR7078 is scheduled to ship late summer with the rest of the 78 series. I certainly wouldn't bet my life on it coming out, but if it helps, I know a UPC code has already been generated for it, and estimated weight and dimensions already exist for it. Also, it will be released in the speciality channel: (Tweeter, Magnolia, TVAuthority, Etc..)

Weight and size dimensions for the 7078? Please share these with us as soon as you can!

Originally posted by millerwill
Weight and size dimensions for the 7078? Please share these with us as soon as you can!

Dimensions are in POST #1.

Originally posted by UCSB
Dimensions are in POST #1.

Yes, thanks; I did remember that (and was puzzled about the rather larger increment in size increase for the 7078 compared to that for the 6768).

What is "wobulated" or "wobulizer" chip mean when referred to the HD3 and XHD3 chips used in the new Samsung DLPs and is the HD2+ chip considered to be "wobulated" sorry for my ignorance but I do not understand what this means .Is the HD2+ considered to be the "superior chip"compared to the others that Samsung uses in their DLPs.
Thanks

Originally posted by UCSB
I am willing to release the tentative status off of the HLR5078W and HLR7078W. As a group, what does everyone think?

[Remember, there seems to be some question still whether they are going to build the entire 78 line or just expand the 68 series]

do tell, my man.

I have created an new FAQ ... #17 it contains Schaffer970's chip information. I think this information is very valuable because if you think about it, it could lead to performance differences between the HD3 generation and HD4 generation. The new FAQ is below:

UCSB, I am honored. I have just spent so much time trying to figure this all out, that I had to do something with it. Now let's hope I get lucky and am correct :D

Wobbulation is a method that HP and TI worked out so that one mirror is used to create two pixels on the screen. There are a number of threads about the HD3 chip and it merits and problems. The only wobbulated chip that is in shipping in current sets is the HD3.

Originally posted by UCSB
I would expect the HLRxx77W to work like a HLPxx74W for gaming. There is an extensive HLPxx74 owners thread. You should be able to get a good idea of gaming performance there.

As far as I know, none of the new Samsungs will be *certified* to work with video gaming. This one area that Samsung does not address in their specs, manuals, or advertising. After they are released, we will start to get feedback on their gaming performance. I would wait for these early reports if gaming performance is important to your purchasing decision.

I know what some of you are thinking that these new systems are gonna show massive lag for PS2 and some Xbox games. I have a PS2 and a high end PC which I would kill to hook up to an HDTV. I'm fine with the PC but I worry about my PS2 on a xx77 or whatever. Now that the PS3 should be out by the end of this year or early next year, I don't think this is an issue anymore. The newer gaming consoles are ready to handle high end tvs and will most likely output 720p on all games.

On HL-Rxx77W dimensions:

Samsung web-page HL-R4677W 40.6 W x 30.0 H x 16.1 D 73.9lbs
Instruction Manual (1-31-05) HL-R4677W 43.07W x 32.05H x 13.35D 71.65lbs

Samsung web-page HL-R5677W 49.9 W x 36.3 H x 18.2 D 94.8lbs
Instruction Manual (1-31-05) HL-R5677W 49.9 W x 36.4 H x 18.1 D 93.7lbs

The HL-R4677W seems to have two sizes.

Originally posted by Kevin Graf
On HL-Rxx77W dimensions:

Samsung web-page HL-R4677W 40.6 W x 30.0 H x 16.1 D 73.9lbs
Instruction Manual (1-31-05) HL-R4677W 43.07W x 32.05H x 13.35D 71.65lbs

Samsung web-page HL-R5677W 49.9 W x 36.3 H x 18.2 D 94.8lbs
Instruction Manual (1-31-05) HL-R5677W 49.9 W x 36.4 H x 18.1 D 93.7lbs

The HL-R4677W seems to have two sizes.
I mentioned this to Steve Panosian a couple of weeks ago. He said:

"there's a mistake in someone's understanding. The HLRxx74W and the HLRxx77W are exactly the same size."

The dimensions on the Samsung.com website are correct. The Instruction Manuals are wrong.

Is there any feel for what stores are going to be carrying what new Samsung. I know the HLRXX78 models are meant for higher end speciallty stores, but what about the HLRXX68? Where we find the HLPXX63 can we expect to find the new HLRXX67 and the HLRXX68? Also is there any way to find out what models are going to be released in Canada? Currently, to my understanding the HLPXX63 and the HLPXX85 are the only lines avaliable in Canada, where as the U.S. has a much greater selection of Sammies exists

Originally posted by Jon_W
Where we find the HLPXX63 can we expect to find the new HLRXX67 and the HLRXX68?
Yes, that is correct.

Pardon my ignorance, but how would the built-in tuner on the HLRxx77 models interface with a D* STB. I was hoping to use the HDMI for a DVD player but I wasn't sure if the built in tuner would accept some kind of digital connection from a D* box.

Two separate things. The built-in tuner will accept nothing from any of the satellite systems it will only work with cable.

and OTA.

Originally posted by Jon_W
Is there any feel for what stores are going to be carrying what new Samsung. I know the HLRXX78 models are meant for higher end speciallty stores, but what about the HLRXX68? Where we find the HLPXX63 can we expect to find the new HLRXX67 and the HLRXX68? Also is there any way to find out what models are going to be released in Canada? Currently, to my understanding the HLPXX63 and the HLPXX85 are the only lines avaliable in Canada, where as the U.S. has a much greater selection of Sammies exists

Us Canadians will get SCREWED again with release dates and models that we are not able to have released up here .We cannot even get the bloody TR85 stand for the"CAPTAIN KIRK" pedestal.Samsung offers us the TV pedestal and does not make the stand available in Canada.I have to drive to Buffalo to get it:confused: :mad:
I do not know what it is about Canada we are not a third world country we should have everything that is offered to the states and at the same time not 3-6 monthes after they get released in the America,its B.S.:mad:

I was just reading in another thread that one of us Canadians was having a problem with his or her Sammy DLP and the company offered him a new one but he would have to wait until new models came out because Samsung Canada had no more HLRXX63W sets in their warehouse, which most likely means we will get the new models at about the same time as in the U.S. I am more concerned with the avaliability of the HLRXX68 sets.

What they probably meant is when they come out in Canada which is usually a few months after the States gets them.I am holding out for the new 1080p DLPs but now i keep reading that they are gonna be around June for USA which means Sept minimum for Canada,Im at the point of just getting the HLP5085W pedestal rather than wait another 6 months.its frustrating.What ticks me off is we(Burlington,Ontario) are farther south than some USA states but they will get them first..ARRRRRRRRGH.

Originally posted by Kevin Graf
The HL-R4677W seems to have two sizes.
Samsung is using the HLN467 and HLN567 case which they also used for the HLPxx74 sets.

Here are the HLPxx74 measurements thanks to our friend Arun Gupta.

Size/Weight:

46” - 40.6”(W) x 30.0”(H) x 16.1”(D), 73.9 lbs.

56” - 49.9”(W) x 36.3”(H) x 18.2”(D), 94.8 lbs.

sbro

It is not a matter of physical location but rather other factors that often delay products in Canada. Safety and technical requirements may be different sourh of the border meaning that Samsung Canada might have to change certain aspects to meet stronger or simply different Canadian standards. Could the government do this quicker? One would think so. But it might also be the fault of Samsung in taking to long to submit a product. The border maybe open and undefended but it is not invisible and different countries have different rules and regulations.

Originally posted by sbro
What ticks me off is we(Burlington,Ontario) are farther south than some USA states but they will get them first..ARRRRRRRRGH.
See it works like this in the marketing departments of Japan and Korea. They take the area of a country in square kilometers and divide it into the population. The resulting value makes Korea, Japan, Belgium, USA, and a lot of other places look like better markets than that vast and empty land to the North.

Get busy and increase your people per square kilometer numbers and you will be flooded with TV's and other valuable disposables. ;)

yo... whats up with the HLR 4266w ? Its starting to look like a HLP ..just in a new size. it doesn't have the same contrast ratio as the other HLR 720p series (2000:1)...its 1500:1 just like the hlp. looks like the same casing and everything...

looks like they are trying to pass a hlp as a HLR if you ask me.

A question to consider? Is the lipsync issue that plagues the the HLN, HLM and HLP series permanently fixed on the newer models?

Sharper pictures are nice and minimizing rainbows are great but the lip sync issue is a complete turn off!

Originally posted by Fedreams
A question to consider? Is the lipsync issue that plagues the the HLN, HLM and HLP series permanently fixed on the newer models?

Sharper pictures are nice and minimizing rainbows are great but the lip sync issue is a complete turn off!

I havent encountered one lipsync problem ever. I have a 5685 though. I have watched all kinds of movies and tv without a problem. I have an xbox and PS2 and never had a problem. Not sure why people who have never owned a Samsung DLP have to state: "Samsung's have terrible lipsync issues."

Originally posted by Hellraiser
yo... whats up with the HLR 4266w ? Its starting to look like a HLP ..just in a new size. it doesn't have the same contrast ratio as the other HLR 720p series (2000:1)...its 1500:1 just like the hlp. looks like the same casing and everything...

looks like they are trying to pass a hlp as a HLR if you ask me.

I would like to follow-up on your comments and possibly create a separate area for the HLR4266W in POST #1. Where are you getting your information?

Thanks UCSB for all the info.
Awesome thread and forum.

Here are some specs I came across and don't know if they're outdated or if this is a repost. Hope it helps.

wwwdotdlpdotcom/home_entertainment/images/DLP_TV_Guidedotpdf

regards,

Originally posted by UCSB
I am willing to release the tentative status off of the HLR5078W and HLR7078W. As a group, what does everyone think?

[Remember, there seems to be some question still whether they are going to build the entire 78 line or just expand the 68 series]

UCSB, any info regarding the 5078? Did I miss you releasing status?

UCSB, I thinks the odds at this point are about 75/25 that there will be a 78 series, based on Neil's earlier post. I guess now that the odds are past 50/50, in my mind you might as well go ahead and remove the tentative status. After all, everything is subject to change up to the minute they ship. :)

Originally posted by jayselle
I havent encountered one lipsync problem ever. I have a 5685 though. I have watched all kinds of movies and tv without a problem. I have an xbox and PS2 and never had a problem. Not sure why people who have never owned a Samsung DLP have to state: "Samsung's have terrible lipsync issues."

Do you have components or a receiver playing your audio or the TV speakers?
The TV speakers do not display the lip sync issue. It seem to be prevalent only when processing the audio with components or a receiver.

Can someone answer this for me:

It appears that most people are mad at most of the HLR because they got rid of 2 digital inputs (removing the DVI) yet installing an HD-tuner. Does this only benefit people with Comcast cable or are there other reasons this is not good? For me, I will be using Comcasts HD so I guess they will be able to use the HD-tuner available in the Sammy DLP and the HDMI will go to my DVD player. But this also seems to cause problems only having the HDMI because not many dvd players use that output (unless you wanna drop 1000 bucks for a simple dvd system)

The 1080p models coming out this summer will have two HDMI inputs, so I wouldn't say that most will only have one digital input. Even if I could get cable via the new cablecard and hd tuner in the HL-R5674W I wouldn't want to use it, as I want DVR capabilites which limits me to using a cablebox. Otherwise I wouldn't mind not having both digital inputs (DVI and HDMI). You also don't have to drop $1000 for a "simple dvd system", the Panny S97 has HDMI out, that is the unit I play to buy very shortly. It can be found for under $300 online and it even comes with an HDMI cable :).

Greg

Shame on Samsung, shame on them. What was the point in dropping the DVI port? Basically so they didn't have to remodel the architecture of the boards and use that slot for HD-tuner. So now it seems that you have to purchase a more expensive DVD player that has HDMI rather than one that has DVI, which there are way more of on the market. Sure $300 isn't that much but still, its the principle of it.

There is a simple DVI to HDMI adapter. You don't have to buy a new player. See one of the AVS Member above (such as RAM)

Hi,

I am on order with TVA for HLP5674 and have received a email saying I will neeed to get a HL(5677 (or something to that effect), and am waiting for a call today from them.

I am particular that my PC is able to connect. Should be able to go DVI (on my PC) to HDMI on the TV ? . Also I see HDMI switchers with remote (for < 200 froogle) . This will be an extra inconvenience to control, but I can then throw in a DVD player or Digital DVR in there, with it.

Since the price (MSRP) has dropped and the cabel card + ota cards have been added, Is this a viable option..

Looking for views from the AVS gurus..

Cheers

Wow... So much for my plan to wait to look at the HL-R5668's and drop back to an HL-P5674 if I did not like what I saw.

I'm not a guru, but.... The HL-R5677 is basically the HL-P5674 with the integrated HD tuner and cable card capability added and the dvi input removed. Cabinet styling, size, etc. should be the same. So, for me, on the basis of functionality, asthetics and economics, it would be a viable option relative to the HL-P5674. The basic question of economics is whether you think the differencce between the expected lower price of last year's model (HL-P5674) and the increased price of this year's model (HL-R5677) is worth the added tuner, cable card slot and lost of the dvi port.

(edit 10:35) Hmmm... Just reread your post and noticed key issue is the DVI/HDMI connection. As noted above, since the HL-R5677 has an HDMI port there is no problem using a dvi/hdmi adapter if your device has only dvi ports. As to HDMI switchers, I've not used one and you will have to depend on the gurus for a response.

Whats the difference with hd-tuner and cable card? Or are they opposite since one is for hd and the other is for those who don't want hd yet?

This seems completely stupid to get a converter when they SHOULD have enough ports. Poor planning.

For those like myself who want a to have HD from a cable company, a DVD player that outputs 720p, a PC thru DVI (isn't dvi better than vga?) and a PS2 or PS3 or Xbox will have trouble finding enough ports. When the next generation of consoles come out, I would put money on it that they will use DVI connections.

HD tuner can pull in signals over-the-air (OTA) using an attenna. The cable card is an option that will allow you to get the HD signal from your cable provider using a card instead of a set top box (STB) from the provider.

By act of Congress, all TV sets above a certain size will be required to contain an HD tuner. Also, by law, cable providers will be required to offer a cable card option instead of the STB. However, the current cable cards only have one-way communications (provider to user), so the providers are not over joyed to offer the cards because they lose out on such money making ventures as movies-on-demand that require two-way communication.

The OTA tuner for HD from the antenna. The cable card will allow for HD channels supplied by the cable company (like HBO) to be received...

Thanks for the info. Seems like a decent idea, but I'm not sure why Congress cares so much about it. And I'm sure they will fix the two way communication problem.

Anyone know if it costs extra money to get a cable card from Comcast or someone?

I'm just curious how I will be able to get HD channels from Comcast, a DVD player, a PC and a video game console all on a Sammy DLP. Any ideas? I have a Yamaha 2400 receiver that outputs Component video but I much rather have DVI or HDMI

Originally posted by donb1948
HD tuner can pull in signals over-the-air (OTA) using an attenna. The cable card is an option that will allow you to get the HD signal from your cable provider using a card instead of a set top box (STB) from the provider.

By act of Congress, all TV sets above a certain size will be required to contain an HD tuner. Also, by law, cable providers will be required to offer a cable card option instead of the STB. However, the current cable cards only have one-way communications (provider to user), so the providers are not over joyed to offer the cards because they lose out on such money making ventures as movies-on-demand that require two-way communication.

The tuner in the Samsung DLPs will allow you to watch both OTA and unscrambled Cable (QAM) signals in both SD and HD.

The Cable Card will allow you to watch cable Premium/Scrambled channels to which you subscribe. If you do not subscribe to Premium channels, there is no need for the Cable Card, you will still be able to watch unscrambled SD and HD cable channels.

Originally posted by subwoofer
Anyone know if it costs extra money to get a cable card from Comcast or someone?

Yes it does in most areas.

I'm just curious how I will be able to get HD channels from Comcast, a DVD player, a PC and a video game console all on a Sammy DLP.

There is no TV available that will allow you to do that without using an external switch.

What needs to happen is AVR's with several HDMI inputs and one HDMI output. Then you would connect the DVD player, the PC, future game consoles, and recording devices to the AVR.

Actually your list of needed inputs can be reduced. With the right graphics card and a 3Gig+ processor using TheaterTek's latest software DVD player, you can outperform most high priced dedicated DVD players. With a HDTV tuner card you can use the PC to record HD TV. You can even use it to play games. :)

Excuse my most likely stupid question, but it sounds like people such as me that have a satellite connection will still have to buy the satellite HD tuner correct? The onboard HD tuner won't work for Satellite hookups?

Originally posted by mwilli
Excuse my most likely stupid question, but it sounds like people such as me that have a satellite connection will still have to buy the satellite HD tuner correct? The onboard HD tuner won't work for Satellite hookups?
Right. You can blame the Satellite companies for using different conventions in their STB's. You can't use one Satellite STB to receive the other companies signals. They don't want to make it easy to switch providers since they don't have exclusive territories.

Well I was planning on gettin it anyway so i guess that it doesn't change my plans much. Now if Samsung would just release these badboys I could get on with my life's work of irratating my wife by buying every toy that comes to market :)

htwaits, don't forget the component inputs. You are correct if everything is digital. There are no game consoles that have digital video (DVI/HDMI) outputs yet, so far they only have component outputs.

Originally posted by htwaits
There is no TV available that will allow you to do that without using an external switch.

What needs to happen is AVR's with several HDMI inputs and one HDMI output. Then you would connect the DVD player, the PC, future game consoles, and recording devices to the AVR.

Actually your list of needed inputs can be reduced. With the right graphics card and a 3Gig+ processor using TheaterTek's latest software DVD player, you can outperform most high priced dedicated DVD players. With a HDTV tuner card you can use the PC to record HD TV. You can even use it to play games.


Hmmm, interesting. Sounds like DLP tvs need more inputs. But if I get a 5078w DLP that has two HDMI, I could probably connect all of these. Right?

So you are saying to connect my PC to the hd-tuner and not thru a DVI or VGA port? Because this could change somethings. If I can use the hd-tuner for my PC, the HDMI for the PS3 (just hope it has that option, if not get a converter from dvi to hdmi) and use the cable card for HD from Comcast.....this could work but pretty much makes my AVR useless. Right now I have everything connected to my receiver with only a component cable going to the tv. grrrrrrr.....and the waiting continues

Originally posted by schaffer970
htwaits, don't forget the component inputs. You are correct if everything is digital. There are no game consoles that have digital video (DVI/HDMI) outputs yet, so far they only have component outputs.

I haven't looked at the specs yet but I bet PS3 and the next Xbox will have DVI outputs. I would put money on it.

Now that I think about it, I won't need a new DVD player because I would use the PS3 as a dvd player since that will be high end next year and output 720p anyway.

So now I just have to figure out how to get my PC to the DLP. I have yet to see anything from a PC connected to a DLP but is the DVI that much better than VGA? Worse case is that I just get an HDMI to DVI converter

I apologize for being dense, but the dimensions of the HLR7078 given on pg 1 (est) just don't seem consistent to me: thus the dimensions of the 6168 and 6178 are identical, suggesting that there is no structural difference between the xx68 and xx78 series. Now the 6768, which is 9.8% larger (in diagonal dimension) than the 61" sets, has WxHxD dimensions that are 9.7%, 8.4%, and 7.6% larger, respectively--which DOES seem consistent--but the 7078, which is 14.8% larger (in diagonal measure) than the 61" sets has WxHxD dimensions that are 17.6%, 16.6%, and 27.2% larger, respectively.

Thus the dimensions given for the 7078 set seem to be a larger than one would expect. E.g., if they were larger in the same proportional as the 6768 set is larger, then the 7078's dimensions would be 65.2x46.9x20.5, rather than 66.9x48.5x23.4.

Originally posted by subwoofer
But if I get a 5078w DLP that has two HDMI, I could probably connect all of these.

Yes if you use your PC for multiple purposes.

So you are saying to connect my PC to the hd-tuner and not thru a DVI or VGA port?

No. That's not possible.

With a single HDMI input I would use a HDMI cable with a DVI connector on one end to connect the HTPC to the TV. They sell in ~10' lengths for less than $40 on-line and cost no more than HDMI cables with HDMI connectors on both ends.

I would use either a coax or optic cable to connect the audio to the AVR and let it decode the audio stream for surround sound. In fact that's what I already do using DVI -- for Video DVI and HDMI are identical. The "Home Theater Computer" forum is full of people doing similar things.

Many of them are also recording HDTV with their HTPC setups.

Originally posted by millerwill
I apologize for being dense ...
Others have made the same observation. Either the very preliminary nature of the information explains it as an error, or for appearance sake, Samsung has come to the conclusion that the set needs a wider bezel. Clarification will come -- eventually. :)