anybody having problems with too little lfe/bass output? i have mine set up with the sub +10 and the sub at +7 and still need to have the sub volume turned up quite a bit to get decent bass out of sacd's/dvd-a's. any ideas?

hi guys,have a Anthem D2 and was thinking of a universal source,i have a 128 now and a cheap Panasonic DVD(w/hdmi).I was wondering if anyone compared these and if there was still alot of glitches with the 5910 and the D2?
thanks John

I have not experienced any glitches using the 5910 with the D2. The D2 is a superb video processor, so using the costly 5910 simply to feed it with a 480i signal is a complete waste of good $. A DVD player like the Oppo 983H is a lot more cost effective. Unfortunately for me, I was not aware of the D2 when I bought my 5910.
Ben

I have got my Denon 5910ci hooked up to my Denon 5805 Receiver using Denon Link.

I read up that both pieces are DL3 so they should be able to pass thorugh SACD 2 channel and multi channel.

I have no problems connecting the 5910ci to the 5805 with the Denon link playing CD, DVD (DTS, DD and DTS24/96) but there is no sound when I pop in a SACD into the 5910ci.

My 5910ci lights up the SACD logo on the front panel when it plays the SACD, I can only assume that the 5910 works. It worked all along using the analog outs.

Are there any settings that I need to enable on the 5910 to pass SACD through denonlink when any other source have worked so far.

Please help!

Go into the denon dvd menu under denon link you might only be on denon link 2 instead of 3 that is why sacd is not playing.

I went into to the Deon LInk menu..

It has 2 channel, iee1394 and auto..

I selected auto and everything passes through save for SACD.. I don't think I own any DVD-A disc so I can't test/don't care..

My 5805 and 5910ci are both advertised as Denon Link 3, I am guessing it should pass SACD by default??

I think I figured out the problem.. For MY 5910ci.. there is only option of DenonLink Off, DenonLink 2nd Auto, Denonlink 2nd (Iee1394) and Denonlink 2nd (analog)

I think the firmware have been screwed up some how on my machine..

I gone to www.denon.com and noticed that the 3930ci menu has denonlink 2 or 3 selectable on the setup menu..

Could somebody with a 5910ci look under set-up menu and confirm what you see under denonlink??

Denonlink2nd doesn't do SACD, Denonlink 3rd does.. Now the bigger question is how to get somebody to install the latest firmware to include DL3...

something is very wrong--dneonlink 3 should be there--if you have a ci model then dl 3 was in the firmeare years ago ( I have a non-ci model from 05 that had dl3--first factory batch with it) is the dl cable plugged in? btw the firmware update is very easy--instructions on denons website--basically download it and burn it.

I think I figured out the problem.. For MY 5910ci.. there is only option of DenonLink Off, DenonLink 2nd Auto, Denonlink 2nd (Iee1394) and Denonlink 2nd (analog)

I think the firmware have been screwed up some how on my machine..

I gone to www.denon.com and noticed that the 3930ci menu has denonlink 2 or 3 selectable on the setup menu..

Could somebody with a 5910ci look under set-up menu and confirm what you see under denonlink??

Denonlink2nd doesn't do SACD, Denonlink 3rd does.. Now the bigger question is how to get somebody to install the latest firmware to include DL3...

Are you sure you got a "ci"? All ci's should only have ever been denonlink 3. The early non-ci models were DenonLink 2; partway through they became DenonLink 3 during manufacturing process (a "3rd" sticker was placed above the connector). (You should check out the early part of this thread, as most likely there were several posts from early owners. Similarly, the Denon website used to have info regarding this change and/or firmware update.)

What date was your 5910(ci) manufactured (on the back (towards the bottom))? At least those manufactured Jun 2005 and later were denonlink 3, possibly earlier than that (again see beginning of this thread). Where does it say it's a ci?

Does your "ci" provide 1080p output (through HDMI)? If not, it's not a ci...

I think I figured out the problem.. For MY 5910ci.. there is only option of DenonLink Off, DenonLink 2nd Auto, Denonlink 2nd (Iee1394) and Denonlink 2nd (analog)

I think the firmware have been screwed up some how on my machine..

I gone to www.denon.com and noticed that the 3930ci menu has denonlink 2 or 3 selectable on the setup menu..

Could somebody with a 5910ci look under set-up menu and confirm what you see under denonlink??

Denonlink2nd doesn't do SACD, Denonlink 3rd does.. Now the bigger question is how to get somebody to install the latest firmware to include DL3...
Weird, CI should have DL3. You can check on the denon web site by entering the serial # if yours needs the DL3 update.
Take care,

Thankx guys.. I got it figured out..

I punched in my serial number on my unit and it came out as a plain 5910. The manufacture date is Dec 31, 05. It's not a 5910ci unit.

There is one free firmware but I need to get the Ci update for $299.. that will get me the 1080p plus the DL3 activated if it's not done yet as stated on the Denon website, this explains why I can't get DL3 and 1080p to work...

My sales guy indicated that my unit is a 5910ci and that is what is printed on the receipt as well..

I will definitely calling the shop and see what they will do to fix me up..

I have been mistakenly scammed here...

Thankx guys for helping out...

Hi everybody,

Is there any place to download DVD-5910 firmware?

Thanks a lot.

Thankx guys.. I got it figured out..

I punched in my serial number on my unit and it came out as a plain 5910. The manufacture date is Dec 31, 05. It's not a 5910ci unit.

There is one free firmware but I need to get the Ci update for $299.. that will get me the 1080p plus the DL3 activated if it's not done yet as stated on the Denon website, this explains why I can't get DL3 and 1080p to work...

My sales guy indicated that my unit is a 5910ci and that is what is printed on the receipt as well..

I will definitely calling the shop and see what they will do to fix me up..

I have been mistakenly scammed here...

Thankx guys for helping out...

There's a better solution. Just use the IEEE1394 from the 5910 to the 5805. IEEE1394 from the 5910 should support DSD SACD along with DVD-A just fine. No need for DL3 if your receiver has IEEE1394.

Is there any reason to keep my 5910 (non ci) on the rack?

I have some SACDs and DVD-A's and many standard DVD's -- all which I enjoyed for years!

I am starting blu ray collection, and have PS3 and panasonic bmp35, awaiting OPPO 83.

Will the new OPPO 83 beat the 5910?

Will the new OPPO 83 beat the 5910?

Nobody knows yet-

Why don't you be our beta tester and report back? :)

Is there any reason to keep my 5910 (non ci) on the rack?

I have some SACDs and DVD-A's and many standard DVD's -- all which I enjoyed for years!

I am starting blu ray collection, and have PS3 and panasonic bmp35, awaiting OPPO 83.

Will the new OPPO 83 beat the 5910?

It won't beat the new Denon Universal player if you have the Denon AVP as well, unless Oppo is putting a Denon Link on their unit....

Probably won't beat the new Denon with the analog outs either, if you want to go that way.

That's my plan, as I don't have HDMI audio on my Arcam pre/pro.

I do have Denon 4806, what is denon AVP?

I finally have a receiver which can use the Denon-link(3808CI). My 5910 was never updated for the CI version. What will the Denon-link actually handle? I know it will work for DVD-Audio and regular CD's. Will it also work for SACD's or will I have to use the 5-channel audio outs for those? Since I will be using HMDI for playing regular DVD's, does the Denon-link come into play for them or not?

I finally have a receiver which can use the Denon-link(3808CI). My 5910 was never updated for the CI version. What will the Denon-link actually handle? I know it will work for DVD-Audio and regular CD's. Will it also work for SACD's or will I have to use the 5-channel audio outs for those? Since I will be using HMDI for playing regular DVD's, does the Denon-link come into play for them or not?
The CI update on the 5910 is for 1080p, it does not affect SACD. Your 5910 should be able to send SACD through Denon link (assuming your unit supports DLIII, if it does not it is a free upgrade from Denon, a firmware). You can use HDMI for video (not for audio because the 5910 HDMI is v1.1 so it only supports DVD-V/DVD-A) and DLIII for the audio together.

Is there any reason to keep my 5910 (non ci) on the rack?

I have some SACDs and DVD-A's and many standard DVD's -- all which I enjoyed for years!

I am starting blu ray collection, and have PS3 and panasonic bmp35, awaiting OPPO 83.

Will the new OPPO 83 beat the 5910?
Well Denon is going to release the upcoming DVD-A1UDCI and that can and should be compared to the 5910 and OPPO 83.
It all depends on how you leverage the 5910. Audio wise if you are using analog outs the 5910 is probably better and the DVD-A1UDCI even more. On the video side we have to wait till both are available on the market.

More than likely you will be limited to version 2 functionality of the Denon Link

Hey,
I just wanted other 5910ci owners to know how state of the art this dvd player really is with the 1080p output capability! It is definitely one of those pieces that only shows its true capability with other equal state of the art components (eg powercords, hdmi cables, hd monitors, high quality power conditioner) Back when the CI upgrade became available for the 5910, I decided to buy mine- knowing that although I was unable to take advantage of 1080p output, eventually it should come in handy! Well, I recently upgraded my hdtv from Qualia 006 with 1080i input to Signature Elite Kuro 141fd with 1080p input and omg I am blown away. I also have the Denon 3800bdci which I use for BR and have compared it with the 5910ci's dvd playback and the 5910ci wins hands down with both pq and most drastically in aq. I put on the dvd "Mexico" and my jaw dropped to the floor! I kept having to remind myself that I was watching a dvd and not a really highquality Blue Ray Disc. When comparing the 1080p video processing for dvd upscaling between the two players, the difference is not night and day, but the 5910ci is definitely smoother and just as detailed as the 3800bdci. I watch alot of full screen anime dvds with my 5910 and the pic and audio again are untouchable. The playback of dvd-audio and sacd are like icing on the cake for me- through the years I have collected quite a few high resolution music discs and will always be able to go back and listen to them in glorious multichannel high resolution! Anyway, when I saw this forum, I just had to chime in! The 5910ci is one of my favorite pleasure pieces!
Cheers

Hey,
I just wanted other 5910ci owners to know how state of the art this dvd player really is with the 1080p output capability! It is definitely one of those pieces that only shows its true capability with other equal state of the art components (eg powercords, hdmi cables, hd monitors, high quality power conditioner) Back when the CI upgrade became available for the 5910, I decided to buy mine- knowing that although I was unable to take advantage of 1080p output, eventually it should come in handy! Well, I recently upgraded my hdtv from Qualia 006 with 1080i input to Signature Elite Kuro 141fd with 1080p input and omg I am blown away. I also have the Denon 3800bdci which I use for BR and have compared it with the 5910ci's dvd playback and the 5910ci wins hands down with both pq and most drastically in aq. I put on the dvd "Once Upon a time in Mexico" and my jaw dropped to the floor! I kept having to remind myself that I was watching a dvd and not a really highquality Blue Ray Disc. When comparing the 1080p video processing for dvd upscaling between the two players, the difference is not night and day, but the 5910ci is definitely smoother and just as detailed as the 3800bdci. I watch alot of full screen anime dvds with my 5910 and the pic and audio again are untouchable. The playback of dvd-audio and sacd are like icing on the cake for me- through the years I have collected quite a few high resolution music discs and will always be able to go back and listen to them in glorious multichannel high resolution! Anyway, when I saw this forum, I just had to chime in! The 5910ci is one of my favorite pleasure pieces!
Cheers
once upon a time in mexico

I'm still having trouble setting up my 5910 with my 3808ci. So far I have used the following video settings:

TV Aspect = Wide(16 X 9) for my Sony 60A2000
TV Type = NTSC
TV System = HDMI/DVI
Compoment Video Output = Progressive
Squeeze Mode = Off
Progressive Mode = Auto

and I have used the following digital settings:

HDMI/DVI Picture Adjust = Normal
HDMI Audio Setup = Multi(Normal)
HDMI Auto Format = Panel Res
Denon Link = 2nd(Analogue)

and the following Audio settings:

Compression = Off
SACD Filter = 50Khz
For some unknown reason I am unable to access the settings for Audio Channel, Digital Output, LPCM, Source Direct, and Bass Enhancer since they are faded and I don't know why...

I want to be able to play CD's, DVD/Audio's, SACD's in addition to std DVD's. I assume the Scaling, Interlacing, etc. should be done by the 5910 rather than the 3808ci but don't know how to accomplish this. My 5910 is apparently too old(Ser. #4108400012) to have the D-Link III already installed at the factory. I asked Denon's "support group" how to get the free firmware update for D-Link III and was shown how to access a download from their website. I haven't tried it yet because the free download only mentioned that it "fixed" playback of 2 DVD's(A-Team and Star Wars Episope 2) and 1 CD(Rick Springfield). It does not state that that download will also upgrade my D-Link from II to III. Does anyone know if it actually will do that or do I have to ship my player to Denon to get the free upgrade to D-Link III. In the meanwhile, is there any way for me to play SACD's while still using HDMI and D-Link II for everything else? I have tried hooking up the 5-channel analogue audio outs from the 5910 to the 3808ci leaving HDMI and D-Link II intact but had no volume for my SACD's.

I'm still having trouble setting up my 5910 with my 3808ci. So far I have used the following video settings:

TV Aspect = Wide(16 X 9) for my Sony 60A2000
TV Type = NTSC
TV System = HDMI/DVI
Compoment Video Output = Progressive
Squeeze Mode = Off
Progressive Mode = Auto

and I have used the following digital settings:

HDMI/DVI Picture Adjust = Normal
HDMI Audio Setup = Multi(Normal)
HDMI Auto Format = Panel Res
Denon Link = 2nd(Analogue)

and the following Audio settings:

Compression = Off
SACD Filter = 50Khz
For some unknown reason I am unable to access the settings for Audio Channel, Digital Output, LPCM, Source Direct, and Bass Enhancer since they are faded and I don't know why...

I want to be able to play CD's, DVD/Audio's, SACD's in addition to std DVD's. I assume the Scaling, Interlacing, etc. should be done by the 5910 rather than the 3808ci but don't know how to accomplish this. My 5910 is apparently too old(Ser. #4108400012) to have the D-Link III already installed at the factory. I asked Denon's "support group" how to get the free firmware update for D-Link III and was shown how to access a download from their website. I haven't tried it yet because the free download only mentioned that it "fixed" playback of 2 DVD's(A-Team and Star Wars Episope 2) and 1 CD(Rick Springfield). It does not state that that download will also upgrade my D-Link from II to III. Does anyone know if it actually will do that or do I have to ship my player to Denon to get the free upgrade to D-Link III. In the meanwhile, is there any way for me to play SACD's while still using HDMI and D-Link II for everything else? I have tried hooking up the 5-channel analogue audio outs from the 5910 to the 3808ci leaving HDMI and D-Link II intact but had no volume for my SACD's.

You cannot play SACD through HDMI since the HDMI in the 5910 is at v1.1. So you must use the analog outs. In essence, the 5910 will decode DD,DTS,DVD-A and SACD through the analog out. You are going to use HDMI for video only. You can still use the DLII for DD,DTS and DVD-A but I don't know if the 3808ci will automatically detect when you play SACD the signal is coming from analog, I've never had to deal with it because my 5910 had DLIII.

Denon 5910 Manual references:
Setup 5.1 analog - page 15
Denon Link - page 17
HMDI Audio must be 2CH - page 20

I think the DLIII upgrade is via firmware and is free, you will need to enter your product serial # for eligibiligy here (http://www.usa.denon.com/ProductUpdatesUpgrades.asp).

Take care,

I went to the page at Denon you referenced and it's the same one I've mentioned in my previous note. There is absolutely no mention that D-Link III is included as a part of the free firmware offered to me. It is merely the three fixes for DVD's and CD's. Please use my Serial No(4108400012) and see for yourself. I am leery of doing the free download and installing it unless I am absolutely certain that it also includes D-Link III.

The simple connection of one IEEE 1394 cable permits high quality digital transfer of the following between devices having IEEE 1394
connectors: the audio of DVD video, DVD audio that up until now could only be connected by 5-conductor audio cable in an analog
connection, or Super Audio CD and other multi-channel audio. (unless DENON LINK connections)
(IEEE 1394 is an international standard established by the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers, Inc. of the U.S.)

I've never done it (I also have DenonLink 3), but seemingly this (see page 18 of manual) is also an option for SACD playback... (??)

I went to the page at Denon you referenced and it's the same one I've mentioned in my previous note. There is absolutely no mention that D-Link III is included as a part of the free firmware offered to me. It is merely the three fixes for DVD's and CD's. Please use my Serial No(4108400012) and see for yourself. I am leery of doing the free download and installing it unless I am absolutely certain that it also includes D-Link III.

Funny how your serial number reveals the ci upgrade, while mine gives diddly. Doubtful that that other firmware mentioned would give you DenonLink 3 if you don't already have it... Try the IEEE link.


(I do not have the ci, but every once in a while (e.g., after reading Parrish's post) I get the urge to upgrade; my 1080i playback seems to be somewhat weak in comparison to the 1080p DVD playback that my blu-ray player is providing me, or any other 1080p DVD playback that I have for that matter.

With my 1080i players I get a much more significant amount of false contouring that seems to all but disappear on the 1080p players. It got so irritating that I finally just play all my DVDs on them rather than the 5910. Just can't get the false contouring to go away, no matter what the settings. Thinking it's basically the difference between 1080i and 1080p, but I'm not certain enough to want to throw away another 300 bucks to find out that it's not after all.)

I went to the page at Denon you referenced and it's the same one I've mentioned in my previous note. There is absolutely no mention that D-Link III is included as a part of the free firmware offered to me. It is merely the three fixes for DVD's and CD's. Please use my Serial No(4108400012) and see for yourself. I am leery of doing the free download and installing it unless I am absolutely certain that it also includes D-Link III.

Ok I used your serial # and got to the page. It is not free, they want $299 for it, you will get the upgrade to 1080p and DLIII! You have to pay for the shipping to Denon yourself! I thought it was free but apparently it is not.:(

Funny how your serial number reveals the ci upgrade, while mine gives diddly. Doubtful that that other firmware mentioned would give you DenonLink 3 if you don't already have it... Try the IEEE link.


(I do not have the ci, but every once in a while (e.g., after reading Parrish's post) I get the urge to upgrade; my 1080i playback seems to be somewhat weak in comparison to the 1080p DVD playback that my blu-ray player is providing me, or any other 1080p DVD playback that I have for that matter.

With my 1080i players I get a much more significant amount of false contouring that seems to all but disappear on the 1080p players. It got so irritating that I finally just play all my DVDs on them rather than the 5910. Just can't get the false contouring to go away, no matter what the settings. Thinking it's basically the difference between 1080i and 1080p, but I'm not certain enough to want to throw away another 300 bucks to find out that it's not after all.)

Hey there- I just wanted to reiterate that the 5910ci was better than the 3800bdci with upscaling dvd's to 1080p since the terranex processor in the 5910ci is better than the processor in the 3800bdci. I don't think there is any video player on the market that has the same caliber of Silicon Optix processor that the 5910ci has! I would think that the upgrade would be worthwhile since you still have your 5910 non ci with Terranex Processor. I even asked my ISF Calibrator to compare between these two players and he noticed a smoother more filmlike picture with the 5910ci! Hope this helps!

Hey there- I just wanted to reiterate that the 5910ci was better than the 3800bdci with upscaling dvd's to 1080p since the terranex processor in the 5910ci is better than the processor in the 3800bdci. I don't think there is any video player on the market that has the same caliber of Silicon Optix processor that the 5910ci has! I would think that the upgrade would be worthwhile since you still have your 5910 non ci with Terranex Processor. I even asked my ISF Calibrator to compare between these two players and he noticed a smoother more filmlike picture with the 5910ci! Hope this helps!

May have to make that my summer project...

Hey there- I just wanted to reiterate that the 5910ci was better than the 3800bdci with upscaling dvd's to 1080p since the terranex processor in the 5910ci is better than the processor in the 3800bdci. I don't think there is any video player on the market that has the same caliber of Silicon Optix processor that the 5910ci has! I would think that the upgrade would be worthwhile since you still have your 5910 non ci with Terranex Processor. I even asked my ISF Calibrator to compare between these two players and he noticed a smoother more filmlike picture with the 5910ci! Hope this helps!


FWIW, due to the attractive closeout pricing on Denon universal (including SACD) players, I very recently bought a 1940ci and a 2930ci and a 5910ci.

The 5910ci has the same Realta video chip as the 3930ci, but the 5910ci is massive and does not have a fan of any kind. :)

Nonetheless, I plopped (taped actually, using blue 3M masking/paint tape) a 120x120x25mm 12v fan (Scythe S-FLEX SFF21F) on the hot rear top corner of my 5910ci, using a small variable AC/DC transformer with settings for 12v, 9v, 7.5v, 6v, 4.5v and 3v. Runs OK with the 3v setting and is inaudible.

So I'm hoping that maybe that will give my Denon 5910ci unit some longer legs?

Cheers

FWIW, due to the attractive closeout pricing on Denon universal (including SACD) players, I very recently bought a 1940ci and a 2930ci and a 5910ci.

The 5910ci has the same Realta video chip as the 3930ci, but the 5910ci is massive and does not have a fan of any kind. :)

Nonetheless, I plopped (taped actually, using blue 3M masking/paint tape) a 120x120x25mm 12v fan (Scythe S-FLEX SFF21F) on the hot rear top corner of my 5910ci, using a small variable AC/DC transformer with settings for 12v, 9v, 7.5v, 6v, 4.5v and 3v. Runs OK with the 3v setting and is inaudible.

So I'm hoping that maybe that will give my Denon 5910ci unit some longer legs?

Cheers

Hey- I have never had any problems with my 5910ci overheating or anything! I did have give it more than just an inch of clearance on top though! I tried putting in a tight space with only an inch on top and it did get very hot up there- but giving 3 or more inches on top really does a world of difference! I'm sure adding a fan keeps it alot cooler as long as the noise isn't an issue! Perhaps since this unit has a larger power supply than other players this allowed them to make it without a fan? For what it is worth, I use DH Labs Cones and Pads under my 5910ci and it really enhances the already stellar audio performance!

As someone who considers themselves reasonably knowledgeable (although by no means a pro) about audiovisual stuff... Denon Japan chief technician personally gave me a 5910 for my help in troubleshooting the previous flagship, the A1 ...I can appreciate fabulous design when I see it.

And boy, was the 5910 a demonstration of fabulous design. Although superseded by the still nascent BluRay / HD download brigade, audiowise, this player is still in a class of its own, worthy of being partner to amps and speakers many times its own price and holding itself up proudly against even some of the more rarified audio gear on the market today.

Thus, with this disclaimer out of the way, I don't want to suddenly sound ignorant.

<<takes a deep breath>>

Considering that the 5910 had been designed like a Sherman Tank, used practically the finest components known to mankind and then tweaked to eek the very last drops of detail from the disks (or so readers of this forum will gladly tell us) could you explain how a few little cones help to the extent that they cause a humanly audible difference? And if they do, why Denon didn't incorporate a similar feature into its design, considering the 5910 was long the flagship, no holds barred player of choice for the discerning video-AND-audiophile.

I'm extremely curious as to how a little vibration management can "really enhance the already stellar performance" of a $4000 player that is to all intents and purposes, considering its construction, unlikely to suffer unduly from day to day vibrations of any kind besides those caused by a warped or damaged disc or a disc with a label stuck to one edge or a small earthquake.

Of course, if one lives by a motorway, vibrations might be enough to affect one's player... in which case the sound of the cars would all but drown out anything below 24 db or so in any case, making such an investment all but pointless.

I'm really sorry to sound sceptical, but I had friends who used to spray antistatic wax on their cables and made similar "really enhances XYZ" or the classic "tightens the bass/focus/pants" line.

One day, fed up with their constant "tweking", when they were out, I cleaned the wax off the cables with some rubbing alcohol, but of course they continued to boast about the improvements when their mates came round. Not only that, but I had reversed the polarity of one of the back corner surround speakers, just for a laugh. And until the day I left, it stayed wired that way, unnoticed.

Of course, in the days of valves, when the filaments could be excited by external vibrations, any isolation was bound to help, even more so with a turntable (which I demonstrated once by placing the needle on the receiver of a phone during a conversation and having a muffled version of the conversation relayed through speakers.

But come on, seriously, modern electronics being affected by vibrations to the point where the vibrations affect the device audibly more than the vibrations raise the sound floor of the room itself?

Now don't get me wrong, I am a man who understands the value of floor to ceiling curtains, a thick carpet and a rather uncool, but audiophile tiled ceiling.

I also understand the importance of solid speaker stands, relative speaker distance and especially of course sub woofer placement.

I can also vouch for the efficacy of the auto calibration of a number of highish end amps.

But I don't ever want to see a monster TOSLINK cable, or for that matter a 25% silver digital interconnect costing $1000 connected to a modern digital buffer with full ECC. I don't want the smell of cable-antistatic spray in my room... And I do not ever, ever want to see another green rimmed CD in my freezer ever, ever again, Paul, do you hear me ;-) !

sorry... I'll... erm... I guess I'll be going then...

<<grabs his coat and shuffles out of the building quietly by the back door>>

For what it is worth, I use DH Labs Cones and Pads under my 5910ci and it really enhances the already stellar audio performance!

... or maybe its just that the cones give it more airflow and its not overheating! :rolleyes:

Hey- I have never had any problems with my 5910ci overheating or anything!


But you contradict that just just two sentences below. :)

I did have give it more than just an inch of clearance on top though! I tried putting in a tight space with only an inch on top and it did get very hot up there- but giving 3 or more inches on top really does a world of difference! I'm sure adding a fan keeps it alot cooler as long as the noise isn't an issue!


You might try putting your hand at the bottom side of the hot rear corner as it is warmest there. FWIW, mine is on top shelf of an open air rack.

The fan that I use (12v fan, running at 3v) is inaudible and moves just enough air to make a decent improvement. :)

I thought it worth a post, given that the worst of summer will arrive this next 90 days. :(

Perhaps since this unit has a larger power supply than other players this allowed them to make it without a fan?


It's an interesting question. e.g. when I ran it for anything more than two hours, without the fan, the unit got warmer across the entire top including the disc and laser assembly.

AFAIK the Denon 3930ci player uses the same main Realta chip for video and has an internal fan. Probably runs even hotter, and not inaudible.

Cheers

I appreciate your concern about the DH Cones and Pads being a waste of time and money, but in my opinion and with my personal experience, they do actually make a positive difference in certain situations. I think the reason they work for me is that they help elevate the 5910ci thus adding more space underneath for cooling. Also, they do actually help to eliminate the effects of vibration in my system because my source components are in close proximity to my full range speakers and sub woofers- I notice that most notably the sound is more dynamic with the cones in place in my system! I use the Jumbo cones by the way since the 5910ci is so heavy! I also use these cones underneath my EAD PM2000 power amp for elevation/cooling and for vibration suppression. Other than that, I'm not really a big tweaker except with regard to power cords and cabling! This is an area where I have become a huge believer in the positive attributes of aftermarket cabling! My Elrod Power Cords and Nordost Cabling have made as big a difference in sound quality improvement as any other source component, amp or preamp I have purchased!

I appreciate your concern about the DH Cones and Pads being a waste of time and money, but in my opinion and with my personal experience, they do actually make a positive difference in certain situations. I think the reason they work for me is that they help elevate the 5910ci thus adding more space underneath for cooling. Also, they do actually help to eliminate the effects of vibration in my system because my source components are in close proximity to my full range speakers and sub woofers- I notice that most notably the sound is more dynamic with the cones in place in my system! I use the Jumbo cones by the way since the 5910ci is so heavy! I also use these cones underneath my EAD PM2000 power amp for elevation/cooling and for vibration suppression. Other than that, I'm not really a big tweaker except with regard to power cords and cabling! This is an area where I have become a huge believer in the positive attributes of aftermarket cabling! My Elrod Power Cords and Nordost Cabling have made as big a difference in sound quality improvement as any other source component, amp or preamp I have purchased!

Can't find any cones or discs on DHLabs website :confused:

Can't find any cones or discs on DHLabs website :confused:

I guess I should have mentioned that Golden Sound makes the DH Labs Cones and Pads- here is a review I found for the cones!

http://www.positive-feedback.com/ambackissues/DHcones.htm

I guess I should have mentioned that Golden Sound makes the DH Labs Cones and Pads- here is a review I found for the cones!

http://www.positive-feedback.com/ambackissues/DHcones.htm

Hey- also you can check out Daruma Ball Bearing Audio Insulators- I have a small set of these on a pre amp and it does a wonderful job as well!

Can't find any cones or discs on DHLabs website :confused:

Hey- for what it is worth moonhawk- you will just have to be your own judge as to whether tweaks really do work or not! My Dad is an electrical engineer and also into hometheater and he criticizes me for being into tweaky stuff, but my system sounds as good as it does because of such applications! Please also note that before ever applying the cones and such under components, I did invest in a decent audio component rack with spikes and pillars filled with sand- this is where one must start in suppressing vibration is a good dampened audio rack which may or may not be enough- then you can try some of the other tweaks! Once people know you are a tweaker, then you will be prone to naysaying, but your ears will not lie to you!

Once people know you are a tweaker, then you will be prone to naysaying, but your ears will not lie to you! Your ears won't, but your brain may. :)

larry

If anyone is looking for new 5910CI, Crutchfield just lowered the price to $999.

[QUOTE=mserrano;16698992]If anyone is looking for new 5910CI, Crutchfield just lowered the price to $999.[/QUOTE

Boy- for a guy in the right situation, he could have the 5910ci plus the 3800bdci for around $2500 or less! Both of these components are "Stereophile (Class-A) Recommended Components" and in my opinion state of the art! Especially the 5910ci at under $1000 is a steal! Unfortunately for me, having bought both of these units at their inception, I spent at least $4-5k for the pair! Although it hurts to wait, it also pays to wait!

I decided to buy the Jeff Beck Live at Ronnie Scott's dvd instead of the bluray so as to be able to play it on my 5910ci and I must say I wasn't disappointed! I will probably buy the BD version to playback on the 3800 just to compare, but I'm not sure if it could look or sound any better! There is something magical about the combination of the 5910ci and the Kuro- like they were made for each other!

I decided to buy the Jeff Beck Live at Ronnie Scott's dvd instead of the bluray so as to be able to play it on my 5910ci and I must say I wasn't disappointed! I will probably buy the BD version to playback on the 3800 just to compare, but I'm not sure if it could look or sound any better! There is something magical about the combination of the 5910ci and the Kuro- like they were made for each other!

Couldn't agree more!

I'm sure the SD-DVD looks nice, but the BD has to look better or there's something wrong with you panel calibration or you sit too far from the panel. I have 60" Kuro and I'm at about 8 ft or so away. Audio will depend on what is used for playback. So far, the 3 EagleVision HD produced BDs I've seen all have excellent PQ and AQ (Jeff at Ronnie Scott's is one).

larry

Hey- for what it is worth moonhawk- you will just have to be your own judge as to whether tweaks really do work or not! My Dad is an electrical engineer and also into hometheater and he criticizes me for being into tweaky stuff, but my system sounds as good as it does because of such applications! Please also note that before ever applying the cones and such under components, I did invest in a decent audio component rack with spikes and pillars filled with sand- this is where one must start in suppressing vibration is a good dampened audio rack which may or may not be enough- then you can try some of the other tweaks! Once people know you are a tweaker, then you will be prone to naysaying, but your ears will not lie to you!

Keep in mind, the tweaks may be doing absolutely nothing, but your expectation that they are doing something may influence you into believing something is changing (i.e., you may experience bias...).

I would spend your money on things that have a clear and provable effect, such as better speakers, excellent EQ, and acoustic room treatments (also, optimal speaker layout within the room).

How did I get dragged into this? :D

I'm sure the SD-DVD looks nice, but the BD has to look better or there's something wrong with you panel calibration or you sit too far from the panel. I have 60" Kuro and I'm at about 8 ft or so away. Audio will depend on what is used for playback. So far, the 3 EagleVision HD produced BDs I've seen all have excellent PQ and AQ (Jeff at Ronnie Scott's is one).

larry

I think if these bd concert discs were 1080p24 then I would be more inclined to buy them instead of the dvds, but their mostly all 1080i. I know that technically the bd at 1080i ultimately looks better than the sddvd, but I get real satisfaction out of watching a dvd and being thoroughly satisfied. I am also getting a kick out of seeing 1080p come out of the 5910ci. I'm sure you all are sick of reading my 5910ci posts, but I feel compelled to tell someone how I feel and this thread should be the best place for it! If I ever get my fill of video with this player, I fully intend to revisit the sacd/dvd-a playback! It's been well over a year since I last spun any hi-res audio discs!

When reading the 2930/3930 thread, it seems that the faulty laser is an inherent problem, is this the same with the 5910?

When reading the 2930/3930 thread, it seems that the faulty laser is an inherent problem, is this the same with the 5910?

Depends on what "the faulty laser" symptoms are. Possibly...

Can any 5910ci owners verify that is normal for the d.mix indicator to be lit up? Since I don't want d.mix is there a setting that I have missed for turning it off?

Depends on what "the faulty laser" symptoms are. Possibly...

Well, apparently the 2930/3930 would stop reading discs. It doesn't take much to see that the player(s) are flawed jumping around that thread, wondering if there are alot of reports about laser problems on the 5910. Seems like a basic question.....

I think if these bd concert discs were 1080p24 then I would be more inclined to buy them instead of the dvds, but their mostly all 1080i. I know that technically the bd at 1080i ultimately looks better than the sddvd, but I get real satisfaction out of watching a dvd and being thoroughly satisfied. I am also getting a kick out of seeing 1080p come out of the 5910ci. I'm sure you all are sick of reading my 5910ci posts, but I feel compelled to tell someone how I feel and this thread should be the best place for it! If I ever get my fill of video with this player, I fully intend to revisit the sacd/dvd-a playback! It's been well over a year since I last spun any hi-res audio discs!

the fact that this was one of the best if not the best at sddvd's--still competetive and arguably better (esp layer change) than the newer blu ray upconverters says something about the original design. I have neve had a hiccup with my player and I still love using it all the time--this is a fantastic unit--if it only had balanced inputs--is there someone who mods these with xlr outs or can balance the whole player? This is one of the only purchases I have made with this degree of satisfaction every time I use it--that definitely adds a LOT of value to the purchase--I imagine the owners of the new a1 must will be feeling this way too...

speaking of which, anyone done an analog comparison with the new a1--I'd love to hear what you found~i'd love to see a level matched blind test between he two--not that im into that crowd but it could make either a lot fo 5910 owners or a1 owners very happy but i don't think either side would be all that surprised if no one could tell a difference...

speaking of accolades--listening to patricia barber modern cool right now--if you want to hear sound in 3d with pinpoint imaging and an incredible ambiance and soundstage--please get this sacd--it will be a great demo for your player...(not to mention you'll KNOW when your setup sounds like it SHOULD,

Can any 5910ci owners verify that is normal for the d.mix indicator to be lit up? Since I don't want d.mix is there a setting that I have missed for turning it off?


What is d.mix??? Perhaps you mean DL? (DenonLink; DENON LINK and Advanced AL24 are the two top center lights (buttons))

Anyhow if you don't mean DL, I couldn't find "d.mix" in my 5910ci setup menu.

You might try going through your setup menu and changing stuff till it turns off.

Better still, call Denon tech support. :)

Cheers

Hi,

I've read through many pages but not able to find answer or at least easily find.

DLIII Question? I just ordered a 5910CI, my receiver supports DLIII; will the 5910CI support it out of the box? I see reference to firmware upgrades in this thread but they are older postings and mainly seem to reference the non-CI unit.

Many thanks in advance for helping out a Denon "newbie"

I'm pretty sure you're OK with a current unit, but I have an older non CI unit and can't say for sure.

A ci will have DL3.

Cool SACD's w/o converting to Analog or PCM first!

Thank You all for the responses.


P.S. How is the 5910CI upgraded anyhow? I do not see an ethernet port on the diagram of the rear panel.

P.S. How is the 5910CI upgraded anyhow? I do not see an ethernet port on the diagram of the rear panel.

Via downloaded firmware burned to CD-R.

Question on the "Advanced AL24" - Should the light go on up when a standard CD or 2 or 5.1 channel DVD is playing? Mine does not. I've tried everything I can think of and it does not light. After some research was not able to find any info on how to get the light to appear (or disappear). Is this unit "broken"? I am setup via Denon Link and HDMI, I also tried CD through Optical and light still remained off.

Question on the "Advanced AL24" - Should the light go on up when a standard CD or 2 or 5.1 channel DVD is playing? Mine does not. I've tried everything I can think of and it does not light. After some research was not able to find any info on how to get the light to appear (or disappear). Is this unit "broken"? I am setup via Denon Link and HDMI, I also tried CD through Optical and light still remained off.

Found this in a 3910 owners thread:

You raise a good question about the AL24 Plus indicator light, though. Not sure, but my guess is that this light is always off when Denon Link is enabled, and is always on when it's not.

Unless it is a programming error, if the 3910's AL24 light is not on the AL24 processor is not active. So, you do have to deactivate the 3910's Denon Link to activate the AL24 processing for the 3910's analog outs.

It makes sense that the analog signal is being processed through the 3910's DACs, but I would love to know why that AL24 light isn't on when the Denon Link is enabled, and if I'm not hearing everything I could. Obviously, you can't A/B as it requires a trip into the setup menu to turn D-Link on/off.

When D-Link was turned off the AL24 light was lit, turned on the Denon-link light was lit. What is the Al24 used for then?

Nothing further on the subject last post was from 2005.

I will try with Denon Link turned off. If it works, then does that mean AL24 is not available using D-link or is that processing offloaded to the Denon receiver?

Question on the "Advanced AL24" - Should the light go on up when a standard CD or 2 or 5.1 channel DVD is playing? Mine does not. I've tried everything I can think of and it does not light. After some research was not able to find any info on how to get the light to appear (or disappear). Is this unit "broken"? I am setup via Denon Link and HDMI, I also tried CD through Optical and light still remained off.


I have a Denon 5910ci player (build date of Dec.'06) that I bought this past 2 months at a closeout price of $999 (vs the orig. $3,800 price).

I run mine with HDMI out (HDMI strictly for video) and with 5.1 RCA out for audio. When playing audio discs of any kind (CD/SACD/DVD-Audio) the AL24 light always seems to be lit.

Try setting up with 5.1 RCA out for audio (connections), and make appropriate menu changes for that in the menu, and see if that makes a difference with regard to the front panel AL24 light.

Cheers

I have a Denon 5910ci player (build date of Dec.'06) that I bought this past 2 months at a closeout price of $999 (vs the orig. $3,800 price).

I run mine with HDMI out (HDMI strictly for video) and with 5.1 RCA out for audio. When playing audio discs of any kind (CD/SACD/DVD-Audio) the AL24 light always seems to be lit.

Try setting up with 5.1 RCA out for audio (connections), and make appropriate menu changes for that in the menu, and see if that makes a difference with regard to the front panel AL24 light.

Cheers


The AL24 light goes on when I turn Denon Link off. Not sure what this means in the end, guess it's just the way it is. Anyhow mystery solved.

Very little complaints. The remote's UI is a little strange, especially near the middle top quadrant. Otherwise, just wish i would've waited for the price drop.

Very little complaints. The remote's UI is a little strange, especially near the middle top quadrant. Otherwise, just wish i would've waited for the price drop.


In my experience with Denon 5910ci players (2 at this point), they are very picky about the disc being on spec. The 1st one clearly had a problem ($2k from Crutchfield via Amazon), so I bought a 2nd one ($999 from ListenUp via Amazon a week later) and that confirmed the problem with the 1st unit, which I returned for a full refund.

Another thing about the 5910ci is that you MUST center the disc in the disc tray!

Cheers

Can any 5910ci owners verify that is normal for the d.mix indicator to be lit up? Since I don't want d.mix is there a setting that I have missed for turning it off?

d.mix (down mixed 5.1 to 2 channel) would light up if you chose 2-channel instead of 5.1 I believe

I am the proud new owner of said 5910ci.
As per Kris, I set…
HDMI/DVI: normal
YCbCr
Detail Enhance: 1
Contrast: -2
IRE: 7.5 I tried it at 0 but could not get it to display the THX shadow on my 50” Elite PRO-1140HD
I did the THX setup as found on the Finding Nemo disk.
The 1140HD is 1360x768 so I set it to output at 720p. I think the logical path would be to let the 5910ci do what it does best, de-interlace. The 1140HD does a fine job of scaling. I have the HDMI cable going straight to my 1140HD. I do not own an A/V Processor.

PICTURE
Last night I watched U-571 and today I watched Finding Nemo. PQ is very clear, sharp, smooth and with lots of shadow detail. Colour (Canadian spelling) is wonderful, absolutely gorgeous. This is indeed a very special SD player. It is better than I had expected. Picture quality is perhaps on par and or better than the HD cable feed I get from my Cable (Rogers) provider. I feel Denon engineers really need to be praised for their efforts.

SOUNDTRACK
For movie watching, I set the audio to 2CH (SRS ON). I use the analog outputs. SRS produces more LFE in my B&W 802s3. Though, better than without SRS, not as good as the Elite DV-85AVI performed. Some distortion during quiet passages. I did have a complete 5.1 set-up but always found the 2CH quality to be more convincing. IMO, the center channel speaker never could replace the perfect phantom image of properly set up 2CH speakers. I got rid of all the 5.1 speakers and amps (I had 5 dedicated amps.)

AUDIO
I set the audio to 2CH. Pure Direct. I have played a dozen Red Book, a couple DVD-A’s and some SACD’s. The best digital I have heard to date. BUT still digital. It has that edge that announces it is not real, just 0’s and 1’s. Not even close to analog. I was really hoping on getting something close to reality audio wise. I have tried a half dozen players in the last few years and just can’t seem to find a player that does not leave me fatigued. LP’s simply do not do that. The Shanling SACD was the most analog sounding but at the expense of detail and bass control. The 5910ci may need time to break-in, I do not know, I hope so, it would be nice if the harshness would subside somewhat. Please do not misunderstand me, this may very well be a class ‘A’ digital audio source component. It certainly is not lacking anything in it’s design and in the implantation of such design. Top shelf components, DAC’s, power supply, relays, isolation, dampening, etc. If I only listened to digital, I would believe this to be the best I have heard.

Just my 2-cents. I am VERY happy with my 5910ci and do not expect I will upgrade for a long time. Well worth the price of admission.

I want to thank all of you fellow AV members for your 2-cents. I have read every page of this thread and feel I owe my buying decision to you fellows.

AUDIO
I set the audio to 2CH. Pure Direct. I have played a dozen Red Book, a couple DVD-A’s and some SACD’s. The best digital I have heard to date. BUT still digital. It has that edge that announces it is not real, just 0’s and 1’s. Not even close to analog. I was really hoping on getting something close to reality audio wise. I have tried a half dozen players in the last few years and just can’t seem to find a player that does not leave me fatigued. LP’s simply do not do that. The Shanling SACD was the most analog sounding but at the expense of detail and bass control. The 5910ci may need time to break-in, I do not know, I hope so, it would be nice if the harshness would subside somewhat. Please do not misunderstand me, this may very well be a class ‘A’ digital audio source component. It certainly is not lacking anything in it’s design and in the implantation of such design. Top shelf components, DAC’s, power supply, relays, isolation, dampening, etc. If I only listened to digital, I would believe this to be the best I have heard.

Just my 2-cents. I am VERY happy with my 5910ci and do not expect I will upgrade for a long time. Well worth the price of admission.




Try original 1980's non remastered CD's or DCC and MFSL. Many of the Sony single layer SACD's from 1999-2001 are also excellent. Most CD's from 1993 onward, and SACD's from 2002 forward suffer from heavy Dynamic Compression*. In general remastered CD's do not sound natural. Bunch of marketing crap for the most part. The 5910CI makes CD's sound amazing and natural but there is nothing it can do with modern LOUD remastered CD's as the source. Basically crap in crap out.

*=that is what causes the fatigue. Natural sound is highly dynamic. The old CD's like the old LP's were not manipulated digitally with pro-tools and the like during the mastering process just so they would sound loud all the time.

Try original 1980's non remastered CD's or DCC and MFSL. Many of the Sony single layer SACD's from 1999-2001 are also excellent. Most CD's from 1993 onward, and SACD's from 2002 forward suffer from heavy Dynamic Compression*. In general remastered CD's do not sound natural. Bunch of marketing crap for the most part. The 5910CI sounds makes CD's sound amazing and natural but there is nothing it can do with modern LOUD remastered CD's as the source. Basically crap in crap out.

*=that is what causes the fatigue. Natural sound is highly dynamic. The old CD's like the old LP's were not manipulated digitally with pro-tools and the like during the mastering process just so they would sound loud all the time.

You very well might be right. I do not give much attention to what the engineer did to produce the CD. I just put on the CD to listen to the music. We spend so much of our resources endeavoring to assemble an accurate playback system, only to be laughed at by the guys behind the mixing board. My brother-in-law wanted to hear my system with Pink Floyd’s ‘Wish You Were Here’. After a couple of cuts, I had to put on a couple of other disks to demonstrate what a bad recording ‘Wish You Were Here’ was. Rick Rubin kept his hands off with his 5 Johnny Cash releases. That is immediately apparent when the disk is played. I wish all my disks were like that. We all have our reference material, but I always allow my guests to choose their music. My brother-in-law should have picked ‘Dark Side’ SACD. I do know that the 5910ci is a wonderful audio player but I can tell immediately that it is not an LP that is playing.

Watched ‘Batman Begins’ yesterday, very impressed with the shadow detail and soundtrack. A dark movie but now I can see much of the detail I had not seen before. I am thinking now that the SRS may be as good or better than the Elite DV-85AVI.

Unit sure gets hot. I think I am going to have to rig up some sort of air circulation system.

We ordered the 5910ci from Listen Up on Sunday and it should be here next week. Thanks to everyone who posted here for helping make our purchasing decision easier!

From the posts and reviews I have read, $999 seems like a great price even if we only used the 5910 for CD's. Really looking forward to viewing concert DVD's and movies with the 5910ci. We have a PS3 for Blu-Ray, but we have quite a few DVD's and a ton of CD's, so the 5910 seems like a good deal for us.

I do have a couple questions...

I'm still not sure how Denon Link works. We have a Denon 4308ci so I know we can use Denon link (both version 3) for audio, but if we use Denon Link which dacs are used, the receivers or the 5910's dacs? Since the 5910's dac's are better, is it better to use the analog outputs?

Try original 1980's non remastered CD's or DCC and MFSL. Many of the Sony single layer SACD's from 1999-2001 are also excellent. Most CD's from 1993 onward, and SACD's from 2002 forward suffer from heavy Dynamic Compression*. In general remastered CD's do not sound natural. Bunch of marketing crap for the most part. The 5910CI sounds makes CD's sound amazing and natural but there is nothing it can do with modern LOUD remastered CD's as the source. Basically crap in crap out.

*=that is what causes the fatigue. Natural sound is highly dynamic. The old CD's like the old LP's were not manipulated digitally with pro-tools and the like during the mastering process just so they would sound loud all the time.

I agree about remastered CD's not sounding natural. What has surprised me is that some of the MFSL CD's aren't that good when compared to the original (not-remastered) CD's. I have had 4 versions of Supertramp's "Crime of the Century" - the LP was best, followed by the original CD, then the MFSL, and bringing up the rear was the remastered CD. There are some well recorded older CD's out there such as Patricia Barber's "Cafe Blue".

We ordered the 5910ci from Listen Up on Sunday and it should be here next week. Thanks to everyone who posted here for helping make our purchasing decision easier!

From the posts and reviews I have read, $999 seems like a great price even if we only used the 5910 for CD's. Really looking forward to viewing concert DVD's and movies with the 5910ci. We have a PS3 for Blu-Ray, but we have quite a few DVD's and a ton of CD's, so the 5910 seems like a good deal for us.

I do have a couple questions...

I'm still not sure how Denon Link works. We have a Denon 4308ci so I know we can use Denon link (both version 3) for audio, but if we use Denon Link which dacs are used, the receivers or the 5910's dacs? Since the 5910's dac's are better, is it better to use the analog outputs?

Got mine from ListenUp also.
DenonLink will send digital signal to your 4308ci and use the 4308ci Digital Aanalog Converter to convert to analog. I do not know what DAC's the 4308ci uses, but I would think not near as good as what is in the 5910ci. I bought the 5910ci for it's DAC's.

Got mine from ListenUp also.
DenonLink will send digital signal to your 4308ci and use the 4308ci Digital Aanalog Converter to convert to analog. I do not know what DAC's the 4308ci uses, but I would think not near as good as what is in the 5910ci. I bought the 5910ci for it's DAC's.

It sounds like you are pretty happy with the 5910ci. About the heat issue... I read somewhere that the 5910 needs space around it or it gets pretty hot. Is yours in an enclosed cabinet?

I bought the 5910ci for it's DAC's also. I'm pretty sure the Denon 4308ci's DAC's are not as good as the ones in the 5910ci so I guess I should use the analog outputs from the 5910ci to make sure it's DACs are used. I think I would have had to get the 5308ci (for $5499 vs the $1600 we paid for the 4308ci) to have comparable DAC's to the 5910ci. I'm not positive about that since the numbering used for the Burr-Brown DAC's is confusing as heck (to me at least).

We are replacing a Sony NS999ES (SACD/DVD player) with the 5910ci, and I hope that my wife and I can see/hear a big enough improvement to justify keeping the Denon.

Unit sure gets hot. I think I am going to have to rig up some sort of air circulation system.

I use this:
http://www.buyextras.com/evavcoblfanf.html

They seem to have gone up almost $10 since I got mine last year. I replaced the transformer/adapter with a variable speed one. This way I get decent cooling without the extra noise.

We have a Denon 4308ci so I know we can use Denon link (both version 3) for audio, but if we use Denon Link which dacs are used, the receivers or the 5910's dacs? Since the 5910's dac's are better, is it better to use the analog outputs?


I would like to know about this as well. Also which DAC's are used via firewire. Currently I'm using Denon link but not sure if it's optimal. As in your case the 5910 DACs are superior to my Denon receivers'

Seems like most of the pro's dropped from this thread around a year ago.

I would like to know about this as well. Also which DAC's are used via firewire. Currently I'm using Denon link but not sure if it's optimal. As in your case the 5910 DACs are superior to my Denon receivers'

Seems like most of the pro's dropped from this thread around a year ago.

I'm no pro but if dnlyko's correct about Denon Link using the receiver's DAC's (it does make sense now that I think about it) you would be much better off using the analog outputs on your 5910. I may be wrong about this but I believe that if you use a digital output from the 5910 (Denon Link, HDMI, Firewire, etc.) your audio does not take advantage of the 5910's DAC's. It would be nice if an expert weighed in on this, but the pro's have probably have moved on to the Denon DVD-A1UDCI.

I would like to know about this as well. Also which DAC's are used via firewire. Currently I'm using Denon link but not sure if it's optimal. As in your case the 5910 DACs are superior to my Denon receivers'

Seems like most of the pro's dropped from this thread around a year ago.

I'm no pro but if dnlyko's correct about Denon Link using the receiver's DAC's (it does make sense now that I think about it) you would be much better off using the analog outputs on your 5910. I may be wrong about this but I believe that if you use a digital output from the 5910 (Denon Link, HDMI, Firewire, etc.) your audio does not take advantage of the 5910's DAC's. It would be nice if an expert weighed in on this, but the pro's have probably have moved on to the Denon DVD-A1UDCI.

The 4308ci has PCM-1791 DAC's and the 5910ci uses PCM-1792's. The 72's are better but I do not think you will hear the difference unless you have a very revealing system.

Yes, you are correct IOgOgilby. It does not matter which digital output of the 5910ci you use, they all output a digital stream with out using the 5910ci DAC's. In order for us to hear that digital stream, it needs to be converted to analog. We hear in analog.

The 4308ci has PCM-1791 DAC's and the 5910ci uses PCM-1792's. The 72's are better but I do not think you will hear the difference unless you have a very revealing system.

Yes, you are correct OgOgilby. It does not matter which digital output of the 5910ci you use, they all output a digital stream with out using the 5910ci DAC's. In order for us to hear that digital stream, it needs to be converted to analog. We hear in analog.

Thanks dnlyko.

We are using Salk HT2-TL's, which are very revealing. We have a Sony NS999ES that I compared to a NAD M5 we were thinking about purchasing (using Onix Rocket 750's) last year using the analog outputs. The NAD M5 was a bit better than the Sony when played through the Rockets but at the time it wasn't a big enough difference to buy the NAD. Since the Denon 5910ci is supposedly better than the NAD M5, I hope we will hear the difference with the Salks or I will return the 5910ci.

UPDATE:

We are extremely happy with the 5910ci. It is an absolute steal for $999 and I can fully understand why others spent a lot more for the 5910 a couple years ago. My wife commented that things looked and sounded better now (she is NOT into home audio or video, but she has a degree in Photography and Cinema and has a good eye for color, etc.) - the best part was that I didn't even ask for her opinion.

Audio - there is more fine detail, increased separation, and improved imaging (we are using the 5910ci analog outputs into our Denon 4308ci) compared to the Sony NS999ES / Denon 4308ci (either analog or digital connections). One small example with the 5910ci... on Nils Lofgren's "Keith Don't Go" from his "Acoustic Live" CD I can now hear the individual strings clearly when he strums.

Video - (using Kris Deering's settings) my wife and I thought there was an improvement over our Oppo DV-983H (which is a darn good DVD player). I wasn't expecting the video to be better since the Oppo is so good, but we both thought there was a bit more detail and less noise with the 5910ci. It could be a matter of the 5910 having the same amount of detail as the Oppo, but with less noise, but it is hard to say without A/B testing of the 2 players - that's not going to happen.

Downsides to the 5910ci - it is big and heavy, the same width but deeper than the 4308ci. The 5910 remote shows it's age but we are using a Harmony One anyway.

Needless to say, we won't be returning the 5910ci - it will replace the Sony NS999ES and the Oppo DV-983H (which will make a nice bedroom DVD player) in our system!

Sweet! Congratulations on your new toy! It is really cool that your wife approves of it too! Everyone who has ever seen the output of this player while visiting my house assumed we were watching bluray until I told them it was a dvd! In a review of the newest Oppo they said that it upscales/outputs dvds at 1080p24- If this is really the case, I wonder how much difference in pq there would be and if this is something that Denon could add to further update the 5910ci?!? I didn't know it was possible to upconvert dvds to 1080p24!

Haven't heard about converting to 1080p 24.

It is hard to imagine any product doing a better job than the 5910ci does with DVD's.

UPDATE:

We are extremely happy with the 5910ci. It is an absolute steal for $999 and I can fully understand why others spent a lot more for the 5910 a couple years ago. My wife commented that things looked and sounded better now (she is NOT into home audio or video, but she has a degree in Photography and Cinema and has a good eye for color, etc.) - the best part was that I didn't even ask for her opinion.



I'd like to second Og's take on the 5910ci. I also just got one about three weeks ago from ListenUp, and I'm mighty impressed.

I already own a 3930ci, and I've been very pleased with it (except for the flaky laser). I bought the 5910ci to grab a little piece of history: the last no-holds barred pre-HD universal player. I was also curious to see what improvement, if any, there was over the 3930.

I'm surprised to say there are noticeable improvements, both in audio and video. The 5910 does a slightly better job of producing low level audio information with clarity. Impulse sounds like castanets, snapping fingers, and guitar plucks are reproduced more convincingly than the 3930, which itself does a great job; same with long decays like brushes on cymbals.

The video performance is even more surprising. The DVDO scaling in the 5910 produces a smoother image than the HQV scaler in the 3930 without sacrificing any detail. The 5910's image is also a little quieter than the 3930's. What is very noticeable is the difference in gamma between the two. Both come in with nearly the same black and white level settings as determined by my Avia disc, but viewing various gray patterns at lower IRE shows that the 5910 has a higher gamma. The 5910's color balance also looks better. All this amounts to the 5910 giving a contrasty and nicely saturated picture at lower grays to midtones, whereas the 3930 looks a little washed out by comparison. This gives the image from the 5910 what I can only describe as "depth". That's something I've never seen on my plasma.

I've only got a few minor gripes. I wish that for the ci version of the 5910 that Denon had adopted the slicker on-screen interface of the 3930ci, instead of using the same primitive looking interface that all the xx10 players had. I was a little disappointed at first by the loud clicking sounds that the 5910 makes when first starting a CD or when switching menus on a DVD, but I think I figured it out: it's electromechanical switching of the analog audio outputs. This is probably done because good electromechanical relays will generally add less noise to the output signal than solid-state switches (whether or not you can hear that is another matter).

Overall, this is a damned impressive player, and I really do see it as a piece of history. It's a keeper - definitely worth the close-out price.

I've only got a few minor gripes. I wish that for the ci version of the 5910 that Denon had adopted the slicker on-screen interface of the 3930ci, instead of using the same primitive looking interface that all the xx10 players had. I was a little disappointed at first by the loud clicking sounds that the 5910 makes when first starting a CD or when switching menus on a DVD, but I think I figured it out: it's electromechanical switching of the analog audio outputs. This is probably done because good electromechanical relays will generally add less noise to the output signal than solid-state switches (whether or not you can hear that is another matter).

Overall, this is a damned impressive player, and I really do see it as a piece of history. It's a keeper - definitely worth the close-out price.

Dead on review Spoliator. I agree about the interface - it is quite dated and rather ugly, but does the job. The relay clicking doesn't bother us (it might be annoying to some) - we've have had other equipment that did that and I don't notice it anymore. And yes, the player is a keeper :)

Dead on review Spoliator. I agree about the interface - it is quite dated and rather ugly, but does the job. The relay clicking doesn't bother us (it might be annoying to some) - we've have had other equipment that did that and I don't notice it anymore. And yes, the player is a keeper :)

Agreed about the relays. They aren't really bothersome now, but I wasn't expecting it at first, so it was a little jarring. My two-channel preamp switches inputs this way. Electromechanical switching really is a good design choice for minimizing output noise. In my experience building electronics for data collection, solid-state relays always add some noise to the signal when closed. Of course, it would have been great if they had used some nice, quiet-switching reed relays, but good ones can be costly.

I also agree with your earlier comment about how big this thing is, but now, my rack just wouldn't look complete without all that "presence"!

In the current (Sept 2009) "the absolute sound" they list the 2009 editors choice awards. The Denon DVD-5910ci is one of six products mentioned in the $3000-$5000 digital source category. TAS calls the 5910ci "a flat-out bargain for its capabilities with all formats". Not bad for an "old" product.

In the current (Sept 2009) "the absolute sound" they list the 2009 editors choice awards. The Denon DVD-5910ci is one of six products mentioned in the $3000-$5000 digital source category. TAS calls the 5910ci "a flat-out bargain for its capabilities with all formats". Not bad for an "old" product.


"Universal" disc players (DVD/CD/SACD/DVD-A) are a mature product.

Solid state amps are another mature product.

FWIW, I recently got a Denon DVD-5910ci universal player on closeout (from authorized ListenUp) at $999 ($3800 list) and consider it to be my best deal as a disc player.

IMO Blu-ray players are overpriced and overrated, not to mention the high price of the movie discs.

Cheers

"Universal" disc players (DVD/CD/SACD/DVD-A) are a mature product.

Solid state amps are another mature product.

FWIW, I recently got a Denon DVD-5910ci universal player on closeout (from authorized ListenUp) at $999 ($3800 list) and consider it to be my best deal as a disc player.

IMO Blu-ray players are overpriced and overrated, not to mention the high price of the movie discs.

Cheers

You were doing well until that last sentence (the overpriced and overrated players part). Would guess you don't have one.

Anyone notice that even these end of life players still have the occasional hiccup feature? Every once in a while, e.g., every few discs, there appears a very brief (less than a second) video splatter of largish "dots" (biggish squares sometimes) at some random place, replay of the section hiccuping plays fine thereafter. Only player I have that does this. [Think it may be some kind of static buildup that discharges.] Happens maybe every other time I use the player.

FWIW, I recently got a Denon DVD-5910ci universal player on closeout (from authorized ListenUp) at $999 ($3800 list) and consider it to be my best deal as a disc player.

IMO Blu-ray players are overpriced and overrated, not to mention the high price of the movie discs.


You were doing well until that last sentence (the overpriced and overrated players part). Would guess you don't have one.


I do have a 3rd generation Toshiba HD A35 player (which I wound up paying about $170 for after Amazon provided a $50 rebate for those like me who'd purchased new through them) and quite a few of the inexpensive HD-DVD discs.

So I have a clue.

I feel like I got a learning experience almost for free. :)

Better deal all around is my Denon universal 5910ci player ($999 closeout vs 3,800 list), and I'm not holding my breath on Blu-ray, let alone spending any extra money on it. DVD is more than adequate.

Looks like Beta (Blu-ray) vs VHS (DVD) replayed to me.

Last time that happened, VHS won.

I *hate* the whole higher priced, and copy protection oriented, Blu-ray thing.

I'm betting on DVD, and see no good reason to be moving into Blu-ray until the price is the same as DVD.

Cheers

Anyone notice that even these end of life players still have the occasional hiccup feature? Every once in a while, e.g., every few discs, there appears a very brief (less than a second) video splatter of largish "dots" (biggish squares sometimes) at some random place, replay of the section hiccuping plays fine thereafter. Only player I have that does this. [Think it may be some kind of static buildup that discharges.] Happens maybe every other time I use the player.


"every other time" you use your Denon 5910ci player???

It does sometimes happen, but not all that often for me with my Denon 5910ci player.

The unit is somewhat picky with regard to the quality of the disc being played.

Cheers

"every other time" you use your Denon 5910ci player???

It does sometimes happen, but not all that often for me with my Denon 5910ci player.

The unit is somewhat picky with regard to the quality of the disc being played.

Cheers

Been using it a bit more lately than usual, so "every other time" here does not mean every other disc, but rather every other time it gets used. (Seemed to be more likely to happen during certain times of the year, can't recall which, though now seems to be one of them.)

I do have a 3rd generation Toshiba HD A35 player (which I wound up paying about $170 for after Amazon provided a $50 rebate for those like me who'd purchased new through them) and quite a few of the inexpensive HD-DVD discs.

So I have a clue.

I feel like I got a learning experience almost for free. :)

Better deal all around is my Denon universal 5910ci player ($999 closeout vs 3,800 list), and I'm not holding my breath on Blu-ray, let alone spending any extra money on it. DVD is more than adequate.

Looks like Beta (Blu-ray) vs VHS (DVD) replayed to me.

Last time that happened, VHS won.

I *hate* the whole higher priced, and copy protection oriented, Blu-ray thing.

I'm betting on DVD, and see no good reason to be moving into Blu-ray until the price is the same as DVD.

Cheers

Quite decent BD players are available for similar prices as you paid for your Tosh. And disc prices are mostly coming down, selection is expanding (good and bad titles), people are buying. Presume that blurry/noisy DVDs are sufficient for you, I prefer the extra detail, clarity, and stunning sound that the blu-ray disc format offers. (Beta vs VHS was Blu-Ray vs HD-DVD, this time Beta won...)

You were doing well until that last sentence (the overpriced and overrated players part). Would guess you don't have one.

I feel I must chime in here and second that. I have both the 5910, analog output stages highly moded by Hot Rod Audio Mods, a Toshiba HD-A35 that (on my system) thoroughly trounces the 5910 for DVD upconversion, (and on which I play my 15 or so HD DVDs), And a Sony PS3 (60GB that has SACD playback capability) for BD.

Video formats aside, I have yet to see a DVD released to include the latest and, IHMO, greatest audio codecs. For those who have highly resolving systems, it is my belief that the latest audio tracks will be enough of a motivational factor to induce someone to find a good used PS3, even if the only BDs they buy are those with the best audio tracks. Having done that, they will find that there really is a difference in the video quality, (if their system resolves the higher resolutions) as well, and, there won't be any going back. :D

So why have the 5910? The high res SACD playback capabilities on my moded analog stages is glorious....and no I am not concerned about the SACD format going away. Disks are still being made and my music apetite is sufficiently satisfied.

Seriously, all my purchases now are on BD; the difference for us in our home theater is that compelling.:)

In the current (Sept 2009) "the absolute sound" they list the 2009 editors choice awards. The Denon DVD-5910ci is one of six products mentioned in the $3000-$5000 digital source category. TAS calls the 5910ci "a flat-out bargain for its capabilities with all formats". Not bad for an "old" product.

There's no doubt about the 5910ci being "the" universal player to have and especially to be had for its current price- but you really need to invest in a BD player! Having both the 5910ci and a bd player- even if just purchasing the Playstation 3 for BDs is where its really at! What a luxury to have the "best" dvd player and a bluray player as well! When you have both players you begin to realize that some content will be fine in dvd but some will be better with blue ray! Like for example "Coraline" - if you have the choice between watching the dvd or the bluray- the bluray smokes the dvd! I did a comparison so I know! But, now on something like Jeff Beck- Live at Ronnie Scott's concert venue- the dvd spun on the 5910ci looks good enough to not warrant paying an additional $15.00 for the BD! My first BD player was the PS3 and the picture quality and the sound exceeded my expectations- then I got a higher end bd player- the Denon 3800bdci and the pq and sound quality went up yet another notch! So- you need to do yourself a favor and jump into the BD scene to start enjoying what it has to offer!

There's no doubt about the 5910ci being "the" universal player to have and especially to be had for its current price- but you really need to invest in a BD player! Having both the 5910ci and a bd player- even if just purchasing the Playstation 3 for BDs is where its really at! What a luxury to have the "best" dvd player and a bluray player as well! When you have both players you begin to realize that some content will be fine in dvd but some will be better with blue ray! Like for example "Coraline" - if you have the choice between watching the dvd or the bluray- the bluray smokes the dvd! I did a comparison so I know! But, now on something like Jeff Beck- Live at Ronnie Scott's concert venue- the dvd spun on the 5910ci looks good enough to not warrant paying an additional $15.00 for the BD! My first BD player was the PS3 and the picture quality and the sound exceeded my expectations- then I got a higher end bd player- the Denon and the pq and sound quality went up yet another notch! So- you need to do yourself a favor and jump into the BD scene to start enjoying what it has to offer!

Thanks Parrish - I mentioned in an earlier post that we use a PS3 for Blu-Ray (we have 2 of them). Sound and image quality with Blu-Ray is great. We use the 5910ci for DVD, CD, and SACD. I would love to get a better Blu-Ray player down the road, but the PS3's are OK for the time being. We have a lot of DVD's and CD's, some SACD's, and around 15 Blu-Ray disks, so we end up using the 5910ci more often. When we have more Blu-Ray disks it will be worth it to upgrade to a better BR player.

I feel I must chime in here and second that. I have both the 5910, analog output stages highly moded by Hot Rod Audio Mods, a Toshiba HD-A35 that (on my system) thoroughly trounces the 5910 for DVD upconversion, (and on which I play my 15 or so HD DVDs), And a Sony PS3 (60GB that has SACD playback capability) for BD.

That is interesting since the UltimateAV review I read on the Toshiba HD-A35 mentioned that "video deinterlacing and scaling could be better". Not that everything reviews state shouldn't be taken with a grain of salt...

Video formats aside, I have yet to see a DVD released to include the latest and, IHMO, greatest audio codecs. For those who have highly resolving systems, it is my belief that the latest audio tracks will be enough of a motivational factor to induce someone to find a good used PS3, even if the only BDs they buy are those with the best audio tracks. Having done that, they will find that there really is a difference in the video quality, (if their system resolves the higher resolutions) as well, and, there won't be any going back. :D

So why have the 5910? The high res SACD playback capabilities on my moded analog stages is glorious....and no I am not concerned about the SACD format going away. Disks are still being made and my music apetite is sufficiently satisfied.

Seriously, all my purchases now are on BD; the difference for us in our home theater is that compelling.:)

The 5910ci is pretty good as is with SACD's, how much did the mods help? Did the mods you had done improve 2 channel audio also?

Some things we watch are not available on BD (and may never be). For example we have first season of the TV show "LIFE" on DVD and have pre-ordered the second (and last) season on DVD since there are no BD's available. I doubt that they will produce BD's and we loved the show.

Speaking of the PS3- Check this out!

http://www.destructoid.com/here-you-go-your-ps3-slim-images-and-details-144786.phtml

The NAD M5 was a bit better than the Sony when played through the Rockets but at the time it wasn't a big enough difference to buy the NAD. Since the Denon 5910ci is supposedly better than the NAD M5, I hope we will hear the difference with the Salks or I will return the 5910ci.

UPDATE:

We are extremely happy with the 5910ci. It is an absolute steal for $999 and I can fully understand why others spent a lot more for the 5910 a couple years ago. My wife commented that things looked and sounded better now (she is NOT into home audio or video, but she has a degree in Photography and Cinema and has a good eye for color, etc.) - the best part was that I didn't even ask for her opinion.

Audio - there is more fine detail, increased separation, and improved imaging (we are using the 5910ci analog outputs into our Denon 4308ci) compared to the Sony NS999ES / Denon 4308ci (either analog or digital connections). One small example with the 5910ci... on Nils Lofgren's "Keith Don't Go" from his "Acoustic Live" CD I can now hear the individual strings clearly when he strums.

Needless to say, we won't be returning the 5910ci - it will replace the Sony NS999ES and the Oppo DV-983H (which will make a nice bedroom DVD player) in our system!

I'm looking at pyrchasing an NAD M5 or the 5910 for CD/SACD play primaily (own a Denon 3800 Blu-Ray Player)

Has anyone here done the side by side comparison for some advice, and is there another $1k-$1500 player that i should be looking to audition also?

Thanks

That is interesting since the UltimateAV review I read on the Toshiba HD-A35 mentioned that "video deinterlacing and scaling could be better". Not that everything reviews state shouldn't be taken with a grain of salt...


Well, the poster did compare the 5910 (no "ci") with his Toshiba HD-A35. And I would concur that several (most? all?) of the HD/BD players that do a decent job of upconverting DVDs to 1080p likely do a much better job of it than that 1080i 5910 did (trust me I know). The 1080p 5910ci, though, another story. Likely as good, if not better, than pretty much anything out there. (Except for that occaisional video hiccup.)

I'm looking at pyrchasing an NAD M5 or the 5910 for CD/SACD play primaily (own a Denon 3800 Blu-Ray Player)

Has anyone here done the side by side comparison for some advice, and is there another $1k-$1500 player that i should be looking to audition also?

Thanks

I did side by side comparisons of the NAD M5, Rega Apollo, and a Rotel (forgot the model). The NAD was clearly better but it was using balanced outputs and the others weren't - I don't know how much of an advantage that would give it, if any. I brought the NAD home to try against my Sony NS999ES. I set them up as close as possible - RCA outputs, same amp (Denon 4308ci), same speakers (Rocket 750's, Rocket Bigfoot), volume, etc. The NAD M5 was a little bit better than the Sony for CD's and SACD's but my wife and I didn't think it was worth spending the money, just not a big enough improvement over the Sony.

I have the Denon 5910ci now and we are very happy with it, it was a nice improvement over the Sony. It is hard to compare the Denon to the NAD since the speakers we have now (Salk HT2 TL's and a matched Salk Center) are much better than the Rockets.

I would say that the Denon is a better choice at the current $999 Listen Up price (assuming they still have them) or even the same price as the NAD. The current issue of The Absolute Sound still rates the 5910ci as a bargain at $3800! One thing - if you are going to be using balanced connections get the NAD since the Denon doesn't have balanced outputs.

Hope this helps.

I did side by side comparisons of the NAD M5, Rega Apollo, and a Rotel (forgot the model). The NAD was clearly better but it was using balanced outputs and the others weren't - I don't know how much of an advantage that would give it, if any. I brought the NAD home to try against my Sony NS999ES. I set them up as close as possible - RCA outputs, same amp (Denon 4308ci), same speakers (Rocket 750's, Rocket Bigfoot), volume, etc. The NAD M5 was a little bit better than the Sony for CD's and SACD's but my wife and I didn't think it was worth spending the money, just not a big enough improvement over the Sony.

I have the Denon 5910ci now and we are very happy with it, it was a nice improvement over the Sony. It is hard to compare the Denon to the NAD since the speakers we have now (Salk HT2 TL's and a matched Salk Center) are much better than the Rockets.

I would say that the Denon is a better choice at the current $999 Listen Up price (assuming they still have them) or even the same price as the NAD. The current issue of The Absolute Sound still rates the 5910ci as a bargain at $3800! One thing - if you are going to be using balanced connections get the NAD since the Denon doesn't have balanced outputs.

Hope this helps.

I could probably get either one for about $1k, that's why its hard for me to make a decision. Thanks for the advice, am trying to audition each one.

If you like watching dvds upscaled to 1080p then get the 5910ci and have the sacd/dvdaudio to boot! Just make sure to get the "ci" unit and be done with it! If you find it to not be good enough out of the box, then you can pay extra to mod it! It can be modified to no end!

If you like watching dvds upscaled to 1080p then get the 5910ci and have the sacd/dvdaudio to boot! Just make sure to get the "ci" unit and be done with it! If you find it to not be good enough out of the box, then you can pay extra to mod it! It can be modified to no end!

I have a 3800 BDCI that can do the upscaling, and and Anthem D2v, so i should be fine there. I just hate how the 3800 can't do SACD it really should have been included

Vengazor,

Just to let you know- after comparing the dvd upscaling to 1080p of both the 5910ci and the 3800bdci, the 5910ci did a better job! Not by alot, but it was a noticeable improvement!

I could probably get either one for about $1k, that's why its hard for me to make a decision. Thanks for the advice, am trying to audition each one.

I'd be interested in your opinion if you get a chance to hear both players. I haven't seen a new NAD that cheap, but I have seen refurbished NAD's that low - have the NAD prices dropped?

I'd be interested in your opinion if you get a chance to hear both players. I haven't seen a new NAD that cheap, but I have seen refurbished NAD's that low - have the NAD prices dropped?

I don't have a big problem buying a refurbished from an authorized retailer with the warranty included. Some people do, but what's the difference between buying one brand new that could have problems versus buying one that has been sent back and had everything already fixed for a lot less? IMO you are buying the same player and warranty for less.

Vengazor,

Just to let you know- after comparing the dvd upscaling to 1080p of both the 5910ci and the 3800bdci, the 5910ci did a better job! Not by alot, but it was a noticeable improvement!

That is very very interesting, thanks for the info

I don't have a big problem buying a refurbished from an authorized retailer with the warranty included. Some people do, but what's the difference between buying one brand new that could have problems versus buying one that has been sent back and had everything already fixed for a lot less? IMO you are buying the same player and warranty for less.

I have purchased a number of electronics that were refurbished with mixed results. Some seemed as good as new and had no issues, some never seemed quite right.

The audio dealer's sales person who let me audition the NAD at home and who I had a great relationship with due to the amount of time I spent in the shop told me to be careful if I buy a reconditioned NAD and make sure I received a full warranty if I went that route. They are an official NAD dealer and could sell me a reconditioned model if that is what I wanted. He told me it would be better to get the NAD at a discount ($1499 at that time) than buy a refurbished one. He wasn't trying to sell me the most expensive player in the store (they had some very high end gear) but seemed worried that I would have problems with a reconditioned NAD. I don't know if there is anything to this, but you might want to look into it if you are considering one.

I have purchased a number of electronics that were refurbished with mixed results. Some seemed as good as new and had no issues, some never seemed quite right.

The audio dealer's sales person who let me audition the NAD at home and who I had a great relationship with due to the amount of time I spent in the shop told me to be careful if I buy a reconditioned NAD and make sure I received a full warranty if I went that route. They are an official NAD dealer and could sell me a reconditioned model if that is what I wanted. He told me it would be better to get the NAD at a discount ($1499 at that time) than buy a refurbished one. He wasn't trying to sell me the most expensive player in the store (they had some very high end gear) but seemed worried that I would have problems with a reconditioned NAD. I don't know if there is anything to this, but you might want to look into it if you are considering one.

Thanks for the heads up, my local NAD dealer has been very good to me and their customer service is excellent (if at times very slow). MY biggest problem is finding the 5910ci to audition in my home, I may just have to compare them in different rooms with different systems unfortunately.

Thanks for the heads up, my local NAD dealer has been very good to me and their customer service is excellent (if at times very slow). MY biggest problem is finding the 5910ci to audition in my home, I may just have to compare them in different rooms with different systems unfortunately.

I think the Denon 5910ci's are being phased out in favor of their Blu-Ray players so they might be hard to find. Listen Up seems to have some kind of a deal with Denon - they even have an interview with Denon's Director of Product Development on their site (can't say I have seen that before). Here is the link: www.listenup.com (http://www.listenup.com/Denon+DVD-5910CI-p-DVD5910CI-p-.html). Since they have a 30 day return policy you could "audition" one and send it back if you don't like it.

Good luck Rich - let us know what you end up with. I do hope you get a chance to do an A/B test with the 2 players.

I think the Denon 5910ci's are being phased out in favor of their Blu-Ray players so they might be hard to find. Listen Up seems to have some kind of a deal with Denon - they even have an interview with Denon's Director of Product Development on their site (can't say I have seen that before). Here is the link: www.listenup.com (http://www.listenup.com/Denon+DVD-5910CI-p-DVD5910CI-p-.html). Since they have a 30 day return policy you could "audition" one and send it back if you don't like it.

Good luck Rich - let us know what you end up with. I do hope you get a chance to do an A/B test with the 2 players.

Listenup and Amazon have the players on sale for 999, my local connection sold their NAD M5 yesterday for 999, so I may just buy a new 5910ci for $999 instead, since the best i can get for an M5 now is about 50% more at $1,500

Listenup and Amazon have the players on sale for 999, my local connection sold their NAD M5 yesterday for 999, so I may just buy a new 5910ci for $999 instead, since the best i can get for an M5 now is about 50% more at $1,500


This is NOT a "hurry hurry hurry" response (by me), but there is some urgency here.

I've gotten 2 Denon DVD-5910ci players. 1st had minor problems (which I wasn't sure about); took having the guts to get/buy a 2nd one to understand that the 1st one had "read" problems with DVD movies. I then returned the 1st one for a full refund. :)

The on-line closeout price of the 5910ci keeps bouncing from $999 to $2k.

Once that dries up, you're not ever again going to see a $999 price for a new/unused 5910ci unit.

In my recent experience with my 2nd 5910ci player, it is simply the best player I have for 1) CD playback and 2) MC audio disc playback (SACD/DVD-A) and 3) DVD movie playback.

All of this done using only the 5.1 RCA sound outs; so I have no clue on how decent it's other audio outs are.

FWIW I myself am very unlikely to ever buy a used disc player of any kind, unless it is a local buy from someone that I know and with the understanding that I can return it within a month with no questions asked.

With regard to the above mentioned NAD M5, I've no experience or knowledge of that unit.

Cheers

This is NOT a "hurry hurry hurry" response (by me), but there is some urgency here.

I've gotten 2 Denon DVD-5910ci players. 1st had minor problems (which I wasn't sure about); took having the guts to get/buy a 2nd one to understand that the 1st one had "read" problems with DVD movies. I then returned the 1st one for a full refund. :)

...

In my recent experience with my 2nd 5910ci player, it is simply the best player I have for 1) CD playback and 2) MC audio disc playback (SACD/DVD-A) and 3) DVD movie playback.


OtherSongs, what were the "minor problems"? (Was it the video "hiccup" that you replied to my earlier post about? If so, does your second one not have this problem?)

Think mine also has "minor problems", but wanted to compare notes to see if they are the same kinds or of some other sort... if you ended up with one without video "hiccup" I may go ahead and try for a unit that works better.

(I have about one more week before my 30 days runs out... still not certain I am going to keep it as none of my other players have ever done this...)

OtherSongs, what were the "minor problems"? (Was it the video "hiccup" that you replied to my earlier post about? If so, does your second one not have this problem?)


By "minor problems" I meant that my 1st unit did not read DVD-R and DVD+R movies that I had ripped and burned myself. The manual clearly says that it should. The 1st unit also failed to read a moderate number of *commercial* DVD movies.

The video "hiccup" is a separate issue with both the 1st and 2nd units, noting that I've kept the 2nd unit. As far as I can tell the "hiccup" is a defect of the disc itself, or it needs cleaning, or is an inferior disc that I've burnt myself.

The one thing that I've recently learned about disc quality (i.e. DVD-R and DVD+R recordable discs) is that it is worth searching out what the top/best discs are and only using those for discs that you burn yourself, as opposed to taking your chances with whatever you find at Wal-Mart.

Now, when I get a "hiccup" I reburn the disc on my personal computer using a good quality disc.

If the poor disc is one that I've burnt myself, once I've re-burnt to a better quality disc, I throw the poor quality one away.

If the poor disc is an official movie that I've paid money for, I 1st try cleaning it with distilled water, and if that doesn't work I try my ripping program on it in order to burn it to one of my own good discs.


Think mine also has "minor problems", but wanted to compare notes to see if they are the same kinds or of some other sort... if you ended up with one without video "hiccup" I may go ahead and try for a unit that works better.

(I have about one more week before my 30 days runs out... still not certain I am going to keep it as none of my other players have ever done this...)


I wouldn't get worried about the hiccup issue.

Also, for whatever reason the 5910ci (2nd unit, the good one) is more picky about disc quality than any other player I've owned. But it is also hands down the best universal player I've ever owned. Quite a deal even with the disc pickiness; i.e. closeout of $999 vs list of $3.8k

FWIW, while I also recently got a 1940ci and a 2930ci at closeout prices, but I've only used them each for about a week and temporarily set them aside. I did just put the 2930ci back into my equipment rack yesterday, but need to make 6 RCA interconnect cables to connect it (proper length interconnect cables with the excellent Canare RCA connectors (crimp)) which I plan to do today.

It will be interesting to use the 2930ci and find out if it is as picky about disc quality as my good 5910ci, but that is pretty certain to take a couple of weeks of using it as my primary player.

Cheers

By "minor problems" I meant that my 1st unit did not read DVD-R and DVD+R movies that I had ripped and burned myself. The manual clearly says that it should. The 1st unit also failed to read a moderate number of *commercial* DVD movies.
...

The one thing that I've recently learned about disc quality (i.e. DVD-R and DVD+R recordable discs) is that it is worth searching out what the top/best discs are and only using those for discs that you burn yourself, as opposed to taking your chances with whatever you find at Wal-Mart.

...

Also, for whatever reason the 5910ci (2nd unit, the good one) is more picky about disc quality than any other player I've owned. But it is also hands down the best universal player I've ever owned. Quite a deal even with the disc pickiness; i.e. closeout of $999 vs list of $3.8k
Cheers

I'm very near getting the 5910CI at the $999 closeout price. The manual says that
it does not play DVD+R DL discs. I'm really interested in knowing if that has been your
experience with this model (note: I burn DVD+R DL only on very high-quality discs).

Reason I ask is because the manual for the DVD-3910 (which I currently own) never
even mentioned that it could play DVD+R (DL or SL) discs: it just included DVD-R
in its list of playable discs. However, it did play DVD+R (DL or SL) discs just fine.

[BTW, I found at least one post here --- from milt99 in 2006, message #937 --- that
said: "I use Verbatim single and dual layers on both my former 5900 and 5910 with no
problems ever". I also use Verbatim discs with my 3910, and wanted some more points
of reference re. this issue with the 5910.]

TIA for your opinions in this regard.

Cheerio!

I'm very near getting the 5910CI at the $999 closeout price. The manual says that it does not play DVD+R DL discs. I'm really interested in knowing if that has been your experience with this model (note: I burn DVD+R DL only on very high-quality discs).


My 5910ci player reads high quality burnt *single* *layer* DVD+R discs just fine, as well as high quality burnt single layer DVD-R discs just fine.

While I do have dual layer recordable discs, I don't normally do that and am not willing to make any comment on it.

Cheers

My 5910ci player reads high quality burnt *single* *layer* DVD+R discs just fine, as well as high quality burnt single layer DVD-R discs just fine.

While I do have dual layer recordable discs, I don't normally do that and am not willing to make any comment on it.

Cheers

Thanks for the info. I just ordered the 5910CI, and it appears that Listen Up has already
shipped it! Look forward to receiving it ... now to ponder what to do with my
immaculate 3910.

Cheerio!

Thanks for the info. I just ordered the 5910CI, and it appears that Listen Up has already shipped it! Look forward to receiving it ... now to ponder what to do with my immaculate 3910.

Cheerio!


Hope you get one that doesn't have any issues. Be aware that it will likely have a build date of Dec. '06, as mine does.

Since you don't do many posts, kindly do us all a favor and do one more after roughly a week of having used it, as to what you think of it. Thanks in advance!

With regard to your old/still good 3910, I'd never try to sell a unit like that on Audiogon.

Either set up your main system to have more than one player, or use it elsewhere in your home, or sell it to a *local* person, or even give it away to a good friend.

Cheers

Be aware that it will likely have a build date of Dec. '06, as mine does.



Mine has the same build date... must have been a big month for building 5910ci's ;) It is a bit odd that Denon never updated the name on the player's faceplate to include "ci". Denon might have overproduced the 5910's and just updated them to the "ci" version then didn't sell many because of the price and people waiting for Blu-Ray. Denon could be sitting on a bunch of Dec. 2006 5910ci's. I also find it funny that Listen Up has a video interview with a Denon "Director of Product Development" about a 3 year old product that is really an unofficial close out item and still on Denon's web site as their top of the line DVD player...

None of this really matters to us at least, the 5910ci is a great player, a very good deal at $999, and we are quite happy with it :)

Mine has the same build date... must have been a big month for building 5910ci's ;) It is a bit odd that Denon never updated the name on the player's faceplate to include "ci". Denon might have overproduced the 5910's and just updated them to the "ci" version then didn't sell many because of the price and people waiting for Blu-Ray. Denon could be sitting on a bunch of Dec. 2006 5910ci's. I also find it funny that Listen Up has a video interview with a Denon "Director of Product Development" about a 3 year old product that is really an unofficial close out item and still on Denon's web site as their top of the line DVD player...

None of this really matters to us at least, the 5910ci is a great player, a very good deal at $999, and we are quite happy with it :)

I bought a 5910ci from listen up. Although my Anthem D2v can accept the balanced lines I just felt that I would like this denon product. It should arrive monday and i will give you guys a full review of my opinion.

Thanks for your input

at 1k price point it is a no brainer. ive had my non ci version for several years and continue to enjoy it regularly! the 1k price point is a little alarming though--im guessing denon isnt losing money on it which means there is a lot of markup at regular pricing on heir gear i would imagine...

I bought a 5910ci from listen up. Although my Anthem D2v can accept the balanced lines I just felt that I would like this denon product. It should arrive monday and i will give you guys a full review of my opinion.

Thanks for your input

Looking forward to reading your review on it. One heads up - it is rather large for a DVD player :)

Looking forward to reading your review on it. One heads up - it is rather large for a DVD player :)

My rack is 7 feet tall, will it fit?:)

My rack is 7 feet tall, will it fit?:)

Well the height will ;)

Dudes,

I watched Fargo dvd over the weekend with the 5910ci/Kuro and omg the blacks were freaking fabulous! For a low budget movie on dvd the picture quality was more than enjoyable! I wonder if the BD version could look any better?

Hope you get one that doesn't have any issues. Be aware that it will likely have a build date of Dec. '06, as mine does.

Since you don't do many posts, kindly do us all a favor and do one more after roughly a week of having used it, as to what you think of it. Thanks in advance!

With regard to your old/still good 3910, I'd never try to sell a unit like that on Audiogon.

Either set up your main system to have more than one player, or use it elsewhere in your home, or sell it to a *local* person, or even give it away to a good friend.

Cheers

Will let you know after I've used it (after it arrives!). However, I must tell you that
my principal use for it is the multi-channel playback of surround music DVD-Audios and
SACDs (of which I have a growing collection of 200+ discs), and the purportedly
great video playback is a bonus as far as I am concerned. I won't be able to comment
much, for example, about the 1080p up-conversion, since I don't even have a 1080p
TV (mine's a 1080i plasma).

However, I am raring to have its SACD audio capabilities compared against my reference
Sony XA9000ES SACD player (which doesn't do DVD-Audio, though). I have been
very happy with my 3910's DVD-Audio playback, but the Sony decidedly has an edge
over the 3910 for SACD playback, both stereo and multi-channel.

As for the fate of my 3910, I never intended to put it up on Audiogon. I'll probably
keep it for my secondary system (which has a nine year old basic Sony DVD player
that still works, and could do with the upgrade).

Cheerio!

at 1k price point it is a no brainer. ive had my non ci version for several years and continue to enjoy it regularly! the 1k price point is a little alarming though--im guessing denon isnt losing money on it which means there is a lot of markup at regular pricing on heir gear i would imagine...

A friend of mine in the "business" once told me that the retail price typically reflected ~100% markup. Obviously, there is some markup between the manufacturer and the dealer, but I don't know what that is.

On a separate topic, wasn't there a laser reliability problem with some 5910 units? Also, do you happen to know, if your 5910 was built in Japan? I always thought that the TOTL models were built in Japan, but the CI version isn't. Just curious as to how much outsourcing is going on.

Will let you know after I've used it (after it arrives!). However, I must tell you that my principal use for it is the multi-channel playback of surround music DVD-Audios and SACDs (of which I have a growing collection of 200+ discs), and the purportedly great video playback is a bonus as far as I am concerned. I won't be able to comment much, for example, about the 1080p up-conversion, since I don't even have a 1080p TV (mine's a 1080i plasma).


I'll look forward to your comments on your "new/unused/Dec.'06" Denon DVD-5910ci player.

I can add that it's MC audio output is excellent both for SACD discs (music only) and also for DVD-Audio discs (music only even through it is often necessary to have video to make sense of the DVD-Audio menu). Also note that my 5910ci experience is strictly via the 5.1 RCA outputs, which is the only way I've used it so far.

However, I am raring to have its SACD audio capabilities compared against my reference Sony XA9000ES SACD player (which doesn't do DVD-Audio, though). I have been very happy with my 3910's DVD-Audio playback, but the Sony decidedly has an edge over the 3910 for SACD playback, both stereo and multi-channel.


I'll also be interested in your comments comparing the musicality of the Denon 5910ci player to that of the Sony XA9000ES player.

Just be sure to preview your subjective comparison post *several* times before you actually send it; as subjective posting/comments frequently leads to combative type posting by a number of the AVS people who don't seem to have anything better to do with their lives than post about the merits/demerits of double blind listening comparisons, as well as the importance of measurements. :)

Cheers

Also, do you happen to know, if your 5910 was built in Japan? I always thought that the TOTL models were built in Japan, but the CI version isn't. Just curious as to how much outsourcing is going on.

Our 5910ci says Japan on the back...

Our 5910ci says Japan on the back...

Thanks for the info.

I've just hooked up my Pioneer Elite 151fd that was bought in March. The basement construction had some delays that were unexpected, so the the Plasma was in a box for 5 months. I downloaded the slideshow and am running it 24/7 for the next few days on the Sports settings that were recommended, and I have a pro calibrator coming in november after the panel gets some hours on it.

My questions are: after the break-in slides run, should i just use d-nice's settings and wait for the ISF calibrator to come, or should I be using something else in that time duration instead?

Are there any known settings that I should be making in my Denon 5910ci that will make the video sharper in the meantime, or just wait for the calibrator to take care of that?

Thanks

Leave the player on default settings and use D-nice's plasma settings. No need for break-in slides unless you won't have 100-200 hours on the plasma before the calibrator comes.

larry

Leave the player on default settings and use D-nice's plasma settings. No need for break-in slides unless you won't have 100-200 hours on the plasma before the calibrator comes.

larry

Thanks for the info, the slides will be the only way to get 100+ hours on there, no seats yet for 2 more weeks :(

How close is the 5910 to the 3930ci?

Not even.

I've been wanting to get the complete series for both Deadwood and Sopranos for a long time now- do any of you have either of these dvd collections? Are they worth the price they are going for right now? Should I get these collections on dvd and use the 5910ci or wait indefinitely for the bd versions to use with a bd player? They would seem to be good material for enjoying the 5910ci with.

I guess I'll go ahead and answer my own post now! I acquired both complete series sets and while Sopranos is mediorcre and I'm only in the first season, I am totally blown away by the pq of Deadwood! Deadwood + 5910ci + Kuro = Bad Ass Shadow Detail and film like quality! I have heard that as you progress through the Sopranos collection it gets better and this I hope to be true! I am glad I waited to watch these and now can do so on my own time frame and I get a chance to utilize the astounding Denon 5910ci player with upgraded 1080p upscaling output! Bad Ass Blacks!

I guess I'll go ahead and answer my own post now! I acquired both complete series sets and while Sopranos is mediorcre and I'm only in the first season, I am totally blown away by the pq of Deadwood! Deadwood + 5910ci + Kuro = Bad Ass Shadow Detail and film like quality! I have heard that as you progress through the Sopranos collection it gets better and this I hope to be true! I am glad I waited to watch these and now can do so on my own time frame and I get a chance to utilize the astounding Denon 5910ci player with upgraded 1080p upscaling output! Bad Ass Blacks!

Those kind of questions are tough to answer since it is ultimately your decision.

If the question was: "Does the 5910ci offer one of the best in DVD upscaling to 1080P?" Then, most definitely.

By the way, Soparanos S1 is supposedly due for release on blu-ray this winter

http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=2668

I can certainly say that the 5910ci playing deadwood on the kuro looks so good that I won't be tempted to even compare with bd if ever it is available, however, the first season of Sopranos will surely look much better on BD. Man I can't get over how good the blacks and shadow deatail are in Deadwood! Awesome show!

is it Denon has something to do with the brand Eonon? i just see a promotion on twitter about eonon, but i dont know much about the company, does it has anything to do with Deono?

How close is the 5910 to the 3930ci?

100% worse on some burned DVD-Rs and DVD+Rs.

Despite the fact it claims to be "compatible" I have some DVD-Rs that made every 5910 I put them in get "stuck" at a certain point on the disc.

Literally every other brand of DVD player (the issue also occurred with 3910s) played the DVD-Rs perfectly, as does the 3930CI.

I can certainly say that the 5910ci playing deadwood on the kuro looks so good that I won't be tempted to even compare with bd if ever it is available, however, the first season of Sopranos will surely look much better on BD. Man I can't get over how good the blacks and shadow deatail are in Deadwood! Awesome show!

Hmmm. 5910ci/151FD Kuro combo does not compare to Blu by a long shot. Definitely not taking advantage of the Kuro resolution by using dvd upscaling. Go Blu.

Hmmm. 5910ci/151FD Kuro combo does not compare to Blu by a long shot. Definitely not taking advantage of the Kuro resolution by using dvd upscaling. Go Blu.


I've a Denon 5910ci player (that I got on closeout at $1k) and a decent flat-screen 1080p TV, as well as a Toshiba A35 HD-DVD player.

Given that DVD movies played on the 5910ci player look almost as good as my HD-DVD movies, *and* still cost less than one half that of Blu-Ray movies, I see (and hear) no good reason to move to the still more expensive Blu-Ray discs.

My venture with HD-DVD taught me a very inexpensive lesson.

Namely that the whole HD movie thing is an expensive sham, including still expensive Blu-Ray.

I'll consider Blu-Ray if and when it costs the same as DVD. But I'm not holding my breath.


Cheers

OtherSongs, reads to me like your TV isn't really as decent as you think it is.

Sure some DVDs look great via the 5910ci, some of them can look close to hi-def quality, but a lot of them look just like what they are: lower resolution (also known as blurry) and/or noisy. Lipstick on a pig, you still have the pig.

And yes I watch DVDs all of the time. As well as HD-DVDs from time to time, and Blu-Rays probably as much as DVDs.

And then there's the lossless audio. If you're not hearing much difference there, reads to me like your audio rig isn't really all that decent either.

Oh and by the way, while you weren't paying attention, the cost of Blu-Ray has dropped substantially too. Might not do you much good, but it's been quite a ride for most that have made the transition.

Different strokes for different folks.

The 5910ci is a statement piece that unless you have it in your system, then you really can't appreciate it- it is great for the videophile that has no bd player but it is even greater for the videophile that also has a bd player. It gives the closest comparison between dvd and bd that one could get given that the user has a state of the art video monitor. It does allow me the choice between shelling out a premium for the bluray version or getting a great discount on the used dvd version. Many HBO series shows, some concerts etc don't really look a whole lot better or sound better for that matter when comparing the bd to the dvd- so in this case the 5910ci is a gem. I will admit though that in my opinion, you cannot be a videophile and not have access to viewing bluray. It just doesn't make sense at this stage in the game! Even my little bro who is the furthest thing from a videophile has purchased a ps3 for $299 and is enjoying bd, not to mention hd gaming! Bluray won the battle so for goodness sake partake in the fruits- life is too short- even if you have a stellar dvd player like the 5910ci! By the way my dad and I were on board with BD from very early on and did not support hddvd, but if hddvd would have won out then I can assure you that I would have purchased a hddvd player because I want the highest quality video available for my viewing pleasure! Thank you God for this hobby.

I've a Denon 5910ci player (that I got on closeout at $1k) and a decent flat-screen 1080p TV, as well as a Toshiba A35 HD-DVD player.

Given that DVD movies played on the 5910ci player look almost as good as my HD-DVD movies, *and* still cost less than one half that of Blu-Ray movies, I see (and hear) no good reason to move to the still more expensive Blu-Ray discs.

My venture with HD-DVD taught me a very inexpensive lesson.

Namely that the whole HD movie thing is an expensive sham, including still expensive Blu-Ray.

I'll consider Blu-Ray if and when it costs the same as DVD. But I'm not holding my breath.


Cheers

If dvd upconverted using Realta looks almost as good as hd-dvd, then I can only conclude that either hd-dvd wasn't that good, there is a problem with your television, or the source material was poor. Never owned hd-dvd, since I was waiting for format war to end. One lesson to take away is that when there are competing formats such as hd-dvd and blu, its better to wait things out for emerging winner.

I have the 5910ci and Oppo bdp-83, and it just doesn't compare when viewing realta upconverted dvd vs. blu using the same movie title (Transformers, Live Free or Die Hard, etc.). Listen, I understand the reluctance to go blu. I mean, most people (including myself) cannot continually spend money on the next best thing, when we know very well that something better is right around the corner.

I'm not sure that blu will ever catch up to dvd prices, since dvd is yesterday's technology. The price of blu has already come down significantly, however. Check new release prices of dvd vs. blu at Amazon and Wal-Mart.

The 5910ci is a statement piece that unless you have it in your system, then you really can't appreciate it- it is great for the videophile that has no bd player but it is even greater for the videophile that also has a bd player. It gives the closest comparison between dvd and bd that one could get given that the user has a state of the art video monitor. It does allow me the choice between shelling out a premium for the bluray version or getting a great discount on the used dvd version. Many HBO series shows, some concerts etc don't really look a whole lot better or sound better for that matter when comparing the bd to the dvd- so in this case the 5910ci is a gem. I will admit though that in my opinion, you cannot be a videophile and not have access to viewing bluray. It just doesn't make sense at this stage in the game! Even my little bro who is the furthest thing from a videophile has purchased a ps3 for $299 and is enjoying bd, not to mention hd gaming! Bluray won the battle so for goodness sake partake in the fruits- life is too short- even if you have a stellar dvd player like the 5910ci! By the way my dad and I were on board with BD from very early on and did not support hddvd, but if hddvd would have won out then I can assure you that I would have purchased a hddvd player because I want the highest quality video available for my viewing pleasure! Thank you God for this hobby.

I can appreciate the 5910ci construction quality. However, it is somewhat of a quirky machine and load speed is at a snail's pace. Just the other day I couldn't get it to play Schindler's List. Took a long time for the DVD logo to light up, then it couldn't load the DVD menu and I finally ejected it after losing patience. I took the dvd out and loaded it in the Oppo, no problems.
Tried playing a DTS DVD Audio (The Police) using Dlink or hdmi, but had problems getting the AVP to recognize the proper encoding. Put the same disc into the Oppo and my AVP recognized it properly. Checked the denon website for patches, but nothing is available. Denon seems to have poor implementation of hardware/software synergy. I hear that their $4,500 Universal has some quirks as well. Somewhat disappointed as a 5910ci owner.

<snip>

I'm not sure that blu will ever catch up to dvd prices, since dvd is yesterday's technology. The price of blu has already come down significantly, however. Check new release prices of dvd vs. blu at Amazon and Wal-Mart.


Agreed that "the price of blu" has come down.

But I usually buy *used* DVD movie discs, as well as HD-DVD discs when they show up at a good price.

I also rent current new movie releases from local Red Box units at $1 per night.

e.g. I recently got a new Transformers-1 HD-DVD through an Amazon dealer, at something like $1.99 + $2.99 shipping, for a total price of $4.98. :)

Used DVD discs typically cost well under half that of used Blu-Ray discs.

If I want to be blown away by a movie, I go out to a good local movie theater.

Meaning that I'm over the whole HD thing. Granted that both the video and audio are better than DVD movies, but not by enough to make me spend anymore extra money on HD gear or discs.


Cheers

I can appreciate the 5910ci construction quality. However, it is somewhat of a quirky machine and load speed is at a snail's pace. Just the other day I couldn't get it to play Schindler's List. Took a long time for the DVD logo to light up, then it couldn't load the DVD menu and I finally ejected it after losing patience. I took the dvd out and loaded it in the Oppo, no problems.
Tried playing a DTS DVD Audio (The Police) using Dlink or hdmi, but had problems getting the AVP to recognize the proper encoding. Put the same disc into the Oppo and my AVP recognized it properly. Checked the denon website for patches, but nothing is available. Denon seems to have poor implementation of hardware/software synergy. I hear that their $4,500 Universal has some quirks as well. Somewhat disappointed as a 5910ci owner.
I heard you, I had one and sold it. Build construction is excellent but frankly I preferred the Oppo 980 image wise. Granted on the audio side it could not compete but since I had the receiver do the decoding it made no difference. But on the video side I preferred the Oppo;)

I can appreciate the 5910ci construction quality. However, it is somewhat of a quirky machine and load speed is at a snail's pace. Just the other day I couldn't get it to play Schindler's List. Took a long time for the DVD logo to light up, then it couldn't load the DVD menu and I finally ejected it after losing patience. I took the dvd out and loaded it in the Oppo, no problems.


I found another disc that wouldn't play. Tried play the latest version of Dune on DVD. Same thing. 5910ci tried to read it, but it gave up in the end.

So I called Denon about this and the Customer Rep. told me that it may be due to the laser/pick up mechanism being "too accurate". Other less expensive players by other manufacturers are less accurate and can handle problem discs. To put it plainly, my disc is the problem and my 5910ci is too good to read it.:confused:

Apparently Denon has some firmware updates that aren't posted online and only a qualified Service Technician can do the update, but there are not guarantees that it will do the trick.:( I don't want to ship it, but the nearest place is ~100miles away. Man, I love my Oppo.

If dvd upconverted using Realta looks almost as good as hd-dvd, then I can only conclude that either hd-dvd wasn't that good, there is a problem with your television, or the source material was poor. Never owned hd-dvd, since I was waiting for format war to end. One lesson to take away is that when there are competing formats such as hd-dvd and blu, its better to wait things out for emerging winner.

I have the 5910ci and Oppo bdp-83, and it just doesn't compare when viewing realta upconverted dvd vs. blu using the same movie title (Transformers, Live Free or Die Hard, etc.). Listen, I understand the reluctance to go blu. I mean, most people (including myself) cannot continually spend money on the next best thing, when we know very well that something better is right around the corner.

I'm not sure that blu will ever catch up to dvd prices, since dvd is yesterday's technology. The price of blu has already come down significantly, however. Check new release prices of dvd vs. blu at Amazon and Wal-Mart.

I found another disc that wouldn't play. Tried play the latest version of Dune on DVD. Same thing. 5910ci tried to read it, but it gave up in the end.

So I called Denon about this and the Customer Rep. told me that it may be due to the laser/pick up mechanism being "too accurate". Other less expensive players by other manufacturers are less accurate and can handle problem discs. To put it plainly, my disc is the problem and my 5910ci is too good to read it.:confused:

Apparently Denon has some firmware updates that aren't posted online and only a qualified Service Technician can do the update, but there are not guarantees that it will do the trick.:( I don't want to ship it, but the nearest place is ~100miles away. Man, I love my Oppo.

Frahengeo,

Mmmm, so you have Oppo BD-83 and a Denon 5910Ci? :cool: You find that the ABT of Oppo is superior PQ on SD-DVD to the purpose built Denon DVD. Any thing else you can compare the Denon 5910 PQ to?

The reason I am asking for more detail on this is I am looking for a big improvement in SD-DVD PQ to a 65" Mitsu DLP 1080p instead of the old Denon 2910 that I've had for @6years. I just got a Pioneer Blu-Ray, BD-51FD (sub $100 with warranty) and am quite pleased with it, slow Blu-ray, but stunningly good SD-DVD using Pio's implementation of HQV Realta or Reon (sp?) I think. Really, really good viewing. My only problem is that I don't want to put too many hours on the Pioneer for SD-DVD, rather save it for Blu-ray and some really excellent audio discs. Which brings me to looking for a purpose built SD-DVD player of good quality and killer PQ. Yes, I do prefer Japan built. Multi-region is strongly preferred. I know that my old Denon was hackable for multi-region, and I have a couple of sources for 5910's at well under the new Oppo BD-83 price. I just don't know.

Yep, Oppo 983h (except for that Japan thing). But finding one that I could trust enough to buy is a bit of an issue. Oppo' customer service has to be experienced to be believed (in a good way), but I'd be pretty much flapping in the breeze with an E-bay purchase at something north of $300.

So, any other observations of the Denon vs Oppo vs (insert here) for SD-DVD? For Blu-ray PQ it seems "parts is parts", for DVD-- not so much.

Thanks,
MKard

Frahengeo,

Mmmm, so you have Oppo BD-83 and a Denon 5910Ci? :cool: You find that the ABT of Oppo is superior PQ on SD-DVD to the purpose built Denon DVD. Any thing else you can compare the Denon 5910 PQ to?

The reason I am asking for more detail on this is I am looking for a big improvement in SD-DVD PQ to a 65" Mitsu DLP 1080p instead of the old Denon 2910 that I've had for @6years. I just got a Pioneer Blu-Ray, BD-51FD (sub $100 with warranty) and am quite pleased with it, slow Blu-ray, but stunningly good SD-DVD using Pio's implementation of HQV Realta or Reon (sp?) I think. Really, really good viewing. My only problem is that I don't want to put too many hours on the Pioneer for SD-DVD, rather save it for Blu-ray and some really excellent audio discs. Which brings me to looking for a purpose built SD-DVD player of good quality and killer PQ. Yes, I do prefer Japan built. Multi-region is strongly preferred. I know that my old Denon was hackable for multi-region, and I have a couple of sources for 5910's at well under the new Oppo BD-83 price. I just don't know.

Yep, Oppo 983h (except for that Japan thing). But finding one that I could trust enough to buy is a bit of an issue. Oppo' customer service has to be experienced to be believed (in a good way), but I'd be pretty much flapping in the breeze with an E-bay purchase at something north of $300.

So, any other observations of the Denon vs Oppo vs (insert here) for SD-DVD? For Blu-ray PQ it seems "parts is parts", for DVD-- not so much.

Thanks,
MKard

Hi MKard,

In case there was some misunderstanding, my comments were directed at someone comparing Realta upconverted DVD to blu-ray. Given a decent monitor/TV, its not even in the same ballpark.

Regards to Oppo vs. 5910ci for DVD, I cannot see a difference. Test results at Audioholics report Realta being better. Again, I don't see it.

Personally, I would get the Oppo since you mentioned slow loading times on the Pio. Also, the Oppo is a current model and will continue to be supported.

The 5910ci has better build quality and perhaps better performance of redbook cds, but that's about it.

Go for the Oppo.

Go for the 5910 if you want to listen to music on it. World class audio, especially if you get a great price. Don't have a BluRay yet, but the picture quality for DVD is superb. I'm sure the audio will best the Oppo hands down, unless you have the new SE version, and then it wouldn't be hands down.

I had the 5910 running multi-region at one point. The couple of PAL DVDs I tried on the 5910 were easily bested by the region-free Malata I was also using at the time, which did rather well with them all in all, though not perfect. (Could make adjustments on the Malata that the 5910 did not have available is my guess as to why.) Wouldn't expect the 5910ci to do much better, but haven't tried it. NTSC DVDs, no contest, the 5910 was better.

Ditto moonhawk on the sound. The 5910ci is significantly better than the 983h, at least what's provided via the 983h's HDMI. (DenonLink!) PQ-wise, the ci and the 983h are similar, though I think the 5910ci picture is a bit more stable ('cept for those hiccups that still plague me once in a while). Not sure how the 'ci stacks up as a region-free player compared to Oppo.

Have my dealers 5910CI for a 5 day home demo. Using component video at 480i and digital co ax for dvd's, the multi channel output for SACD/DVD Audio and the 2 channel output for CD's.

Dvd's look and sound fine through my Anthem AVM 50v. SACD and DVD Audio sound great. But the problem is I can't listen to any CD's. I put a CD in and nothing happens. The display reads all 00000000 for the time. I don't even hear the disc spinning up. Could the laser be shot?

I've gone through the set up menu so many times I'm going crazy. Is there a setting I need to turn on to get CD playback? Need help from you fellow 5910CI owners.

I currently own a 3930CI which sounds great but want to see how much better the 5910CI is.

Have my dealers 5910CI for a 5 day home demo. Using component video at 480i and digital co ax for dvd's, the multi channel output for SACD/DVD Audio and the 2 channel output for CD's.

Dvd's look and sound fine through my Anthem AVM 50v. SACD and DVD Audio sound great. But the problem is I can't listen to any CD's. I put a CD in and nothing happens. The display reads all 00000000 for the time. I don't even hear the disc spinning up. Could the laser be shot?

I've gone through the set up menu so many times I'm going crazy. Is there a setting I need to turn on to get CD playback? Need help from you fellow 5910CI owners.

I currently own a 3930CI which sounds great but want to see how much better the 5910CI is.


I have both a Denon 5910CI player and a Denon 2930CI player.

AFAIK, all 3 of the now discontinued Denon universal players (5910CI ( ~ $3.8k new), 3930CI that you have, and 2930CI ( ~ $850 new)) had/have problematic units that read the discs.

I've noticed that my own 5910CI player is *very* finicky with regard to any disc that is even the smallest bit off.

FWIW I got mine mail order (new at closeout of $1k) roughly 9 months ago, and the 1st one had problems with the disc unit and I returned it for a full refund (including the shipping!).

Even the 2nd one, that I now have, is finicky but likely OK. So when I get an "off" CD disc, I simply make a full backup copy on my personal computer and that solves the problem.

The fact that the dealer's unit won't read *any* commercial CD disc that you have, says to me that you should not buy that unit. Unless of course he sells it for something like $100, in which case you'll still have to get it fixed and that will take time and money.

Just some comments and ideas.

If any of it is wrong, I'm sure someone else will jump in. :)

And FWIW my 5910CI player is hands down a *great* universal player. And it is noticeably the best upscaling player of standard DVD movies.

Who needs Blu-ray when you've got a 5910CI player? :)

And BTW, the 5910CI gets pretty warm near one of the rear corners. I run mine with a 5"x5"x1" low speed fan (12v fan that can be run down to as low as 3v; I use mine at 4.5v), that I've taped (3M blue masking tape) to the top of that rear corner of the unit. But then you've got a 3930CI, which I've read also runs warm?


Good luck

I play all formats on my 5910 through the MC outputs--analog-- whether music or movies, 2ch or mch, so I can't say whether settings will help.

But If you're trying to listen to 2ch CDs through separate 2ch outputs, you may have to select that somewhere in the menus, though I think your Anthem would determine which input is getting the signal.

Thanks for all your help guys. I've been through the set up menu so many times trying different combinations of settings and nothing works trying to listen to a CD through the 2 ch analogue output. My guess is the laser is faulty.

Othersongs, I'm familiar with the finiky lasers. My 3930CI went in for service when some CD's would not play or not go to the next track. Unit plays fine now. I have no heat issues with my 3930CI.

I am impressed with the dvd quality of the 5910CI. 480i into my AVM 50v looks really really good. I don't want to say close to Blu Ray but it sure does look great. I use my 3930CI the same way (480i output) and it doesn't look as sharp compared to the 5910CI.

Oh well a few more days of trying.

Thanks for all your help guys. I've been through the set up menu so many times trying different combinations of settings and nothing works trying to listen to a CD through the 2 ch analogue output. My guess is the laser is faulty.

Othersongs, I'm familiar with the finiky lasers. My 3930CI went in for service when some CD's would not play or not go to the next track. Unit plays fine now. I have no heat issues with my 3930CI.


Since you currently have both 5910CI and 3930CI on hand, how do they compare with regard to heat issues?

That I don't have to run a fan on my 2930CI is one thing that I like about it. I went with it, over the 3930CI (that you have), due to concern about possible heat issues as well as that it was the better closeout deal at the time I got it.


I am impressed with the dvd quality of the 5910CI. 480i into my AVM 50v looks really really good. I don't want to say close to Blu Ray but it sure does look great. I use my 3930CI the same way (480i output) and it doesn't look as sharp compared to the 5910CI


Interesting comment.

I meant to ask that, but forgot to. So thanks for that. :)

I've recently seen similar comments in the comments on OPPO's Blu-ray player versions: BDP83 vs the SE version (and Nuforce version also) and also in the Blu-ray thread on the upcoming "Ayre DX-5 bluray player" (which also uses the 83's innards as it's starting point).

I also wonder where current high end players are at with regard to their upscaling of DVD movies vs a unit like the Denon 5910CI player. I haven't seen anyone comment on that in the Blu-ray player threads that I mentioned above.

But like you, I got the 5910CI for it's audio ability. The truly excellent upscaling of DVD movies was an unexpected benefit, and surprisingly close to that of current high def movies. I've a HD-DVD player so I do have a clue, but have yet to buy into the Blu-ray thing.


Oh well a few more days of trying.


Ask/tell the dealer to get the laser unit fixed?

I wouldn't want to do that for a just purchased unit. Even though the last of the 5910CI are already old (mine has a date on the back of December 2006) the electronics are less likely to have problems than the laser unit.

Unless he'll sell it, as is, at a giveaway price. :)


Cheers

I play all formats on my 5910 through the MC outputs--analog-- whether music or movies, 2ch or mch, so I can't say whether settings will help.

But If you're trying to listen to 2ch CDs through separate 2ch outputs, you may have to select that somewhere in the menus, though I think your Anthem would determine which input is getting the signal.


I've got my 5910CI hooked up with 6 RCA cables for 5.1 output (DVD movies and SACD surround), and 2 separate RCA cables for the stereo output.

When I play a CD, the signal goes out on *both* the 5.1 RCA outs as well as the stereo RCA outs. So it's easy to do a comparison, provided that you do an SPL level match with a decent SPL meter.

Out of curiosity, I just did this in order to confirm; but I didn't bother to match sound level as I have my noisy PC running.

Won't surprise me if Denon uses better components for the stereo outs.

It's something I've been meaning to give a serious listen to with my Denon 5910CI player, given that I'm already set up for it; but at the moment I'm more busy with other stuff.

e.g. OPPO's recent BDP83 player uses different DAC chips for analog outputs: i.e. stereo-RCA out vs 5.1-RCA out. I think only on the upgraded SE version of the 83?


Cheers

Well I've confirmed its the laser. Damn Denon laser units. Tried a CD this morning and it loaded up with no problems. Played a few tunes and all was working. Ejected the CD and put in a second CD and guess what, it didn't load up. Put the first CD back in and it too would not load up.

I can't believe that such a high priced unit has such a finiky laser. Didn't listen long enough to compare the 5910CI to my 3930CI. My 3930CI has played every CD/DVD/SACD that I've put in it.

So far not impressed with the 5910CI.

Othersongs, I have had no issues whatsoever regarding heat issues with my 3930CI. I know it has a fan but I have never heard it running during any type of playback.

This experience with the 5910CI has shown me just how good/reliable my 3930CI is. At the time of purchase in 2006 I was trying to decide between the 2930CI and the 3939CI. I'm so glad I went with the 3930CI. It will remain my universal player for the foreseable future.

strange--I don;t remember the pre-ci units having so many laser problems--my non-ci version from 05 still works like a charm and i never once had any sort of disk issue.

My non-CI 5910 ls quite finicky with some disks, mostly SACD. I have one or two no longer produced Alison Krauss SACDs that won't play at all.

Some rental movies hang up or pixellate. There are a couple of disc treatment liquids I have used that have rescued a movie or two that wouldn't play. Sorry, I'm not at home. but if you remind me in a week, I'll post a link. they are really surprising products. Made movies that wouldn't play at all not only play, but look and sound better.

Seriously. :D

My non-CI 5910 ls quite finicky with some disks, mostly SACD. I have one or two no longer produced Alison Krauss SACDs that won't play at all.


My one guess is your laser alignment is slightly off.

That's also my one guess with my two Denon 5910CI players that I've had at home; the worst was the 1st which was returned.


Some rental movies hang up or pixellate. There are a couple of disc treatment liquids I have used that have rescued a movie or two that wouldn't play. Sorry, I'm not at home. but if you remind me in a week, I'll post a link. they are really surprising products. Made movies that wouldn't play at all not only play, but look and sound better.

Seriously. :D


I'm interested.

But did you try distilled water?


Cheers

Won't surprise me if Denon uses better components for the stereo outs.
Yes, it does. On the 5910 you have dedicated DAC's for each channel working on "mono" mode on the stereo outs, but you have the same DAC working on "stereo" mode on the 5.1 outs - that gives an advantage to the stereo outs.
Also, the OpAmps on the stereo outs are slighty better quality that the ones on 5.1.
That's the same on all models (3910, 2930...).

I have swaped the OpAmps in all my players/receivers with better ones and it does make a difference.

Yes, it does. On the 5910 you have dedicated DAC's for each channel working on "mono" mode on the stereo outs, but you have the same DAC working on "stereo" mode on the 5.1 outs - that gives an advantage to the stereo outs.
Also, the OpAmps on the stereo outs are slighty better quality that the ones on 5.1.
That's the same on all models (3910, 2930...).

I have swaped the OpAmps in all my players/receivers with better ones and it does make a difference.

to me hands down the stereo outs sound better than the 5.1 outs--just my HO. Good to know there is a reason why this should be the case.:D

Othersongs, I have had no issues whatsoever regarding heat issues with my 3930CI. I know it has a fan but I have never heard it running during any type of playback.


Thank you for your feedback.

1st sorry to beat this thing to death, but in my humble opinion this is one of the better ways to learn...

2nd I know that *you* recently added into this thread, looking for feedback, and I think that I provided some of that...

Anyhow, since you have a 3930CI player, I now (finally) have some (real?) confidence that at least the last (?) of these players have an internal fan in them.

Meaning that I asked this same question of a 3930 owner roughly a year ago (in the 3930/2930 thread?), and was given the answer that their 3930 (CI?) player had *no* fan inside.

Go figure!

Or maybe *early* 3930 player units did not have an internal fan, whereas the ending 3930CI player units did have an internal fan???

What I do know is that my own end of production run Denon 5910CI disc player (mfg: Dec.'06) does not have an internal fan and runs warmer than I want it to, but only after it has been on for at least 3+ hours.

Hence my putting a low speed (and therefore low noise) fan on top of it.

My hunch is that you at most played one movie (at a time) on the loaner Denon 5910CI player that your dealer leant you, and therefore never got a true assessment of how warm it runs when it used for 3+ hours?


This experience with the 5910CI has shown me just how good/reliable my 3930CI is. At the time of purchase in 2006 I was trying to decide between the 2930CI and the 3939CI. I'm so glad I went with the 3930CI. It will remain my universal player for the foreseable future.


My one hunch is that your dealer's 5910CI player has a laser that is out of adjustment, and therefore not worth buying, short of a giveaway price.

Now that you've given it back to him, wait a couple of days and then call him up and state that you could still be interested, but only if he sends it back to Denon and gets it fixed.

This assumes that he's still a Denon dealer, and that he'll send it back and actually get them to fix it, and that if you buy it from him that you'll get a full warranty on it.

As well as an attractive price.

My own recent Denon 2930CI universal player purchase, like your own 3930CI repaired unit, has a laser that is adjusted perfectly. So I'm an especially happy camper there given the closeout deal on it. :)

My 2nd 5910CI seems to have it's laser adjustment ever so slightly off.

But I kept it nonetheless. That may come back to haunt me.

But the unit (5910CI at closeout of $1k) seemed good enough to keep, given the closeout deal price that I got it at.


Cheers

Othersongs, I can't remember which website it was, but they had a picture of the internals of the 3930CI and you could clearly see the fan. They also mentioned the vents on the back panel where the fan exhausts the heat.

Took the 5910CI back to my dealer this morning and told them of the laser problem. No worries. They would send it out for repair and I'm welcome to take it back for another demo if I desire. My dealer is awesome.

It was so nice to hook up my 3930CI up and play every disc I put in it. I would seriously look at getting a second 3930CI at a great deal. Fantastic machine in my opinion.

My non-CI 5910 ls quite finicky with some disks, mostly SACD. I have one or two no longer produced Alison Krauss SACDs that won't play at all.

Some rental movies hang up or pixellate. There are a couple of disc treatment liquids I have used that have rescued a movie or two that wouldn't play. Sorry, I'm not at home. but if you remind me in a week, I'll post a link. they are really surprising products. Made movies that wouldn't play at all not only play, but look and sound better.

Seriously. :D

My one guess is your laser alignment is slightly off.

That's also my one guess with my two Denon 5910CI players that I've had at home; the worst was the 1st which was returned.

I'm interested.

But did you try distilled water?

Cheers

Other Songs-- The product is called "Ultra Bit Platinum"

http://www.ultrabitplatinum.com/

Stuff works for me, but, no, have not tried distilled water--never thought of that. Some day I will when I think of it, and if it doesn't work and ultrabit does, we have a winner. Couple folks I AB's ultrabit for said they noticed a difference, too.

Thanks for the thought on lazer alignment. My local dealer's repair guy worked on it, and it is slightly bettter, but I suspect it needs a factory tune-up. The cost may be prohibitive though, if I were to upgrade to CI also, and pay for shipping two ways, compared to the $1000.00 dollar close-out deal. Also, I'd rather just get an A1UD.

Will try the stereo outs compared to mch and report back--again when I can find some time.

Later.

Othersongs, I can't remember which website it was, but they had a picture of the internals of the 3930CI and you could clearly see the fan. They also mentioned the vents on the back panel where the fan exhausts the heat.

Took the 5910CI back to my dealer this morning and told them of the laser problem. No worries. They would send it out for repair and I'm welcome to take it back for another demo if I desire. My dealer is awesome.

It was so nice to hook up my 3930CI up and play every disc I put in it. I would seriously look at getting a second 3930CI at a great deal. Fantastic machine in my opinion.


Once the laser is fixed, I'd take your dealer up on the offer to "take it back for another demo"

All depends on the price vs the price of other more current players. Since your interest seems to be like mine (sound first), give the dealer's 5910CI another try, as it is hands down my best universal disc player, short of maybe a few of the current universal Blu-ray players which I've no experience with.


Cheers

Other Songs-- The product is called "Ultra Bit Platinum"

http://www.ultrabitplatinum.com/

Stuff works for me, but, no, have not tried distilled water--never thought of that. Some day I will when I think of it, and if it doesn't work and ultrabit does, we have a winner. Couple folks I AB's ultrabit for said they noticed a difference, too.

Thanks for the thought on lazer alignment. My local dealer's repair guy worked on it, and it is slightly bettter, but I suspect it needs a factory tune-up. The cost may be prohibitive though, if I were to upgrade to CI also, and pay for shipping two ways, compared to the $1000.00 dollar close-out deal. Also, I'd rather just get an A1UD.

Will try the stereo outs compared to mch and report back--again when I can find some time.


Thanks for the thank you.

I took a look at the link, and for fluid it's moderately expensive stuff.

Meaning that I'll not try it.


Cheers

Yes, it is, but it goes a very long way. :)

Hi to all.

Few weeks ago I got my DVD A1XVA to regionfree and apparently all was OK.

But now I have a problem that I don't know if is related to that.

I have my DVD connected to a DVDO Edge and I sometimes have a problem of 'black frames': I mean that during a DVD vision I have random (usually once per DVD) some black screens and after that all is normal (apparently).

I thought it was the Edge but I'm sure is not so it should be the Denon and the only difference is that now is regionfree; so 2 questions:

1. Has someone the same problem?
2. It is possible to come back 'before' the regionfree conversion to try if the black screens conyinue?

Thanks to all.

To go back to region locked, just key in the same number on your remote as you did to make it region free.

No Edge in my system, but my random, possibly once per DVD, issue (I call it a hiccup), appears as a bit of digital blocking (various very random in size (very small, barely noticeable to perhaps a quarter of the screen) and number random-sized color squares) appearing about once per disc. Go back and replay where it happens, and nothing the next time around. Perhaps this is how your Edge deals with this same activity.

I think it has to do with a static discharge. What seems to lessen its occurrance is to power down the player all the way when it's not going to be used for a while.

Dunno if it's different blanks being used recently or something in my player has "aged", but I've run a few different batches of Warner Archive burn on demand titles thru my 5910ci. The older ones seemed to play fine (there was only one that I exchanged from a late last year order that I recall not working in another player too).

However, the last batch, every one of them had some type of problem playing. Not quite "the hiccup" (see previous post) in nature, as going back and playing that problem area again resulted in the same or a similar failure. Finally I just gave up and played the rest on another (non-Denon) player. Oh, and this last batch, instead of being just a disc and case, they did shrinkwrap as well (hmmm.....)

Haven't gone back to the earlier ones to see if they still play fine or not, but it's so frustrating with the last set that I don't feel particularly inclined to stick another one in again.

Anyone else have similar issues with Warner Archive titles on their 5910?

I had a CD that would not play in my 5910ci. I knew the CD was fine because it played fine in my Shanling SCD-T200C, Pioneer 47Ai, Pioneer 578A, Pioneer 58Av, my clock radio/cd and in my car. I took the covers off to determine why this was the case. Well, was I in for a shock!
No wonder there are so many complaints of discs not being able to play. The drive clamping device system is simply awful. The top is a plastic spindle snapped into a thin stamped sheet metal housing cover that is screwed to a plastic housing with self-tapping screws. Real precision pieces. NOT. Cost about $1.50 to build. Utter crap. I thought this was Denon’s ‘State of the Art’ player. The bottom is a tapered brass spindle with a piece of rubber stuck to it. The laser travels along steel rails that are secured into a PLASTIC housing. Again, real precision pieces. LOL.
So when the disc drawer closes, the bottom tapered spindle moves up into the center hole of the disc and continues to move up and make contact with the top plastic spindle in the cover. Problem is, the plastic spindle is not stationary so the bottom spindle may not come into proper contact, hence the infamous ‘Denon Shake Rattle & 00.00.00’.
Secondly, the force that the bottom spindle presses up against the top spindle is not sufficient. If the center hole in the disc is tight, the spindle does not have enough force driving it to press into the disc hole, hence ‘00.00.00’. IMO, this is a Denon DEFECT! All of my other players, all at a fraction of the cost of the 5910, can at least clamp the disc properly. This was the case with my disk. I took a sharp knife and scraped the inside edge of the CD centre hole and reinserted it into the player. Viola, no ’00.00.00’, just music.
As you may well know, the 5910 is a VERY warm (temperature) player. With all the plastic and thin sheet metal on the drive, no wonder all the problems. Plastic and thin metal may change slightly because of the heat inside the player. This may change the alignment of the laser which may then not be able to read the inserted disc, hence the ’00.00.00’. The laser is mounted on the two steel rails. At the back of the rails, where they fit into the PLASTIC housing, there are adjusting allen keys to align the laser. If you want to DIY (very easy), may I suggest that you FIRST turn in (clockwise) the allen key all the way and COUNT the number of turns, in case you want to set them back to factory settings. I will post this in a few forums for those of you that want to address their 5910’s read problems.

Is it trial and error to find the right alignment setting?

I have a 5-year-old 5910 (non-CI), which has become more finicky in playing discs. In particular, many SACDs have now become either unplayable or the 5910 will stop playing them (or skip on them) mid-disc. I was wondering what sort of results people have gotten in having Denon repair these units. How long, did it take, how much did it cost, and and did they work properly (and continue to work properly) after getting it back?

At this point, I'm considering replacing it with something else, but would contemplate repair if I thought the fix would really work.

I have a 5-year-old 5910 (non-CI), which has become more finicky in playing discs. In particular, many SACDs have now become either unplayable or the 5910 will stop playing them (or skip on them) mid-disc. I was wondering what sort of results people have gotten in having Denon repair these units. How long, did it take, how much did it cost, and and did they work properly (and continue to work properly) after getting it back?

At this point, I'm considering replacing it with something else, but would contemplate repair if I thought the fix would really work.

Mine does all the same things, so ditto your questions. I have replaced it with the Marantz UD9004, which is now out for repair--under warranty, thankfully--for similar issues, though it got to the point where it refused to read any discs.

The Denon, like yours, had more problems with SACDs. I would like to sell it, but I'm worried the repair would cost more than I could sell it for.

My 5910 non-CI did this years ago. It steadily worsened until it would not play play anything but DVDs. I can't even remember whether I paid for the repair or whether it was under warranty at the time. The one thing I can tell you that will help is that the repair stuck. I have not had Any difficulty playing any format since.

But here's the thing. I am convinced that as technology progresses, new units sound progressively better, and for less $. I have not had the chance to preview the Oppo BDP-83SE or the BDP-95 (which isn't out until Feb 11), but these universal players are getting rave reviews! And what does an 83 SE cost? Something close to $500? Unfotunately, neither the 83 or the 83SE models are available any longer but at $1000 the new 95 still costs a lot less than what we paid for a new 5910.

A couple of years back when I began having problems with the 5910 I had been considering the same questions, repair/replace. I can assure you the next time something goes wrong with the 5910, it's on the market for parts.

Thanks for the heads up guys. I now have something to look forward to. The much quicker than expected eventual failure of my 5910CI:(

Thanks for the heads up guys. I now have something to look forward to. The much quicker than expected eventual failure of my 5910CI:(

The main pc board in my 5910CI failed last year. Cost $630 for repair at a local Denon authorized repair shop. I still think it is one of the best, if not THE best, DVD-A/SACD/CD players out there especially when the Denon Link is used.

The main pc board in my 5910CI failed last year. Cost $630 for repair at a local Denon authorized repair shop. I still think it is one of the best, if not THE best, DVD-A/SACD/CD players out there especially when the Denon Link is used.

The build seems nice, yet it seems to have quirks that a flagship unit should not have. In the past, I've had some DVDs that it could not read, but most recently, I started experiencing some CDs that the 5910CI would not recognize. I know that this issue has been posted before with recommended fixes, but its very disappointing. It may be the "Best", but only when its running properly.
For your example, I wouldn't think that the board should go so quickly. The CI unit is a 2005 release, so its relatively new.
This could be the case of having just too many "Bells and Whistles" leading to more things/chances for failure.

Out of curiosity, does anyone know whether a backup laser can be purchased?

Mine has become a very expensive door stop--If it costs 650 dollars to fix, plus shipping, I'd lose money selling it for what I could get.

My non-CI 5910 ls quite finicky with some disks, mostly SACD. I have one or two no longer produced Alison Krauss SACDs that won't play at all.

Some rental movies hang up or pixellate. There are a couple of disc treatment liquids I have used that have rescued a movie or two that wouldn't play. Sorry, I'm not at home. but if you remind me in a week, I'll post a link. they are really surprising products. Made movies that wouldn't play at all not only play, but look and sound better.

Seriously. :D

The build seems nice, yet it seems to have quirks that a flagship unit should not have. In the past, I've had some DVDs that it could not read, but most recently, I started experiencing some CDs that the 5910CI would not recognize. I know that this issue has been posted before with recommended fixes, but its very disappointing. It may be the "Best", but only when its running properly.
For your example, I wouldn't think that the board should go so quickly. The CI unit is a 2005 release, so its relatively new.
This could be the case of having just too many "Bells and Whistles" leading to more things/chances for failure.

Out of curiosity, does anyone know whether a backup laser can be purchased?

I have discovered one SACD disc (Patricia Barber - Nightclub, MOFI) that skips on Track 10. I can play this disc in my Denon 2900 fine.

Have had no other issues with any DVD-A, CD or SACD. Even the DVD-A's that I have ripped from FLAC play fine.

I had a nice car a few years ago that had a CD player that had an issue with a Paul Simon disc - Skipping. I could play the disc in any other player and it played fine. The car played all my other CD's fine.

One would think these hi-end players may not like Michael Jackson or Madonna but Patti Barber and Paul Simon? :D

Wrt DVD-Audios not playing, think I had an issue with a dualdisc, AC/DC's Back In Black. Recall some audio dropouts when playing that. Otherwise, although have many more unplayed than played, have had no issues.

On the other hand, the Warner Archive burn on demand DVD-Rs have been pretty much no-gos recently. I had an early batch or two that for the most part played ok (I think one of them was bad), whereas the last batch was mostly not playable without some hiccup or other happening during playback. They played fine on my Oppo DVD player, which now is always used to play such discs. For the most part, however, pretty much done with burn on demand DVD-Rs: just such a bad idea, if nothing else from a longevity perspective (that and their failures on the 5910ci has soured me quite a lot on them).

Speaking of Oppo, only option for SACD and DVD-Audio between it and my Denon receiver is HDMI with PCM. The 5910ci via DenonLink was for the most part like day (it) vs night (Oppo) with the few titles I tried out. Less muddy, more spacious. Haven't found either SACD or DVD-A to approach lossless audio a la blu-ray (could be a set-up issue I suppose), however.

Speaking of Oppo, only option for SACD and DVD-Audio between it and my Denon receiver is HDMI with PCM. The 5910ci via DenonLink was for the most part like day (it) vs night (Oppo) with the few titles I tried out. Less muddy, more spacious. Haven't found either SACD or DVD-A to approach lossless audio a la blu-ray (could be a set-up issue I suppose), however.


Agree with you on both counts: Denon Link = + big difference over HDMI and Blu-ray DTS HD MA track over PCM and DSD. Could be the mixing though - The bits and rate are supposed to be about the same for all. Tom Petty's MOJO and Damn The Torpedos are sublime in DTS HD MA.

Now if I can just figure out how to get the DTS HD MA tracks into my DLNA server..............:cool:

Anyone know where I can get the latest firmware for the Denon DVD-5910?

Anyone know where I can get the latest firmware for the Denon DVD-5910?

Have you tried the DENON website? Just input your serial number and it will tell you the latest version which you can compare to your unit's version. Then you can download and save/burn to CDR for updating in the player.

I don't think there has been a firmware available for some years now........When Blu-Ray came out, it pretty much put the kabosh on any further firmware for this player. Most firmware nowadays deals with blu-ray disc compatibility issues (java, bdlive, etc.).

Have you tried the DENON website? Just input your serial number and it will tell you the latest version which you can compare to your unit's version. Then you can download and save/burn to CDR for updating in the player.

I don't think there has been a firmware available for some years now........When Blu-Ray came out, it pretty much put the kabosh on any further firmware for this player. Most firmware nowadays deals with blu-ray disc compatibility issues (java, bdlive, etc.).

Firmware updates for this product, back in the day, were usually done by a service center. Don't recall anything being available online for download. (And at one point there was a firmware update (possibly along with a hardware mod depending on when you 5910 was made), that cost $300, and had to be done at a service center; it got you from 5910 to 5910ci. Last I checked the $300 option was no longer available.)

Just tried to log in to denon, but apparently it's been so long that my password has apparently expired... with no apparent way to reset it. Would be curious to know if there is firmware online and any particular details.

Firmware updates for this product, back in the day, were usually done by a service center. Don't recall anything being available online for download. (And at one point there was a firmware update (possibly along with a hardware mod depending on when you 5910 was made), that cost $300, and had to be done at a service center; it got you from 5910 to 5910ci. Last I checked the $300 option was no longer available.)

Just tried to log in to denon, but apparently it's been so long that my password has apparently expired... with no apparent way to reset it. Would be curious to know if there is firmware online and any particular details.

Not sure what part of the Denon website you are referring to that requires a password - This should not be necessary for a firmware check and may not be necessary to download either.

Here is the link:

http://stagingna.dev-denon.com/US/Downloads/Pages/Product-Updates.aspx

It requires the serial number of the player.

It requires the serial number of the player.

Yes it does........As I so noted in my very first response to this issue. It requires a serial number but it should not require a PASSWORD. Perhaps you mis-read the previous posts?

Regardless, that page doesn't take 5910 serial numbers. Doubtful there is or ever was any firmware for it you can just grab off the internet, at least not legitimately.

(I was referrring to the Owners Club page, which may/not be some reworking of whatever it was I registered for years ago when I got the 5805 and the 5910.)

How do I set up the 5910 so that it does all of the "heavy lifting(scaling, interlacing, etc.) rather than letting my Denon 3808 receiver or Sony A2000 tv do so?

Regardless, that page doesn't take 5910 serial numbers. Doubtful there is or ever was any firmware for it you can just grab off the internet, at least not legitimately.

(I was referrring to the Owners Club page, which may/not be some reworking of whatever it was I registered for years ago when I got the 5805 and the 5910.)

Well, it accepts my serial number fine.

Well, it accepts my serial number fine.

So what does it say?

I need some advice.

I am upgrading my home theater system and I plan on getting the new Denon 4311CI for the receiver.

I want to get an SACD player that I can connect via DL3, and I would like opinions as to whether it is worth getting the higher lever 5910ci over the 3930ci if the connection will be using the receiver's DAC's anyway.

Is the 5910 still available?

It's a great unit, but outdated tech in a lot of ways. (won't play blurays.)

Mine stopped playing many discs--especialy sacd, and it would cost more to fix than I could sell it for.

(I'll sell it cheap if anyone likes messing with that sort of thing.)

I need some advice.

I am upgrading my home theater system and I plan on getting the new Denon 4311CI for the receiver.

I want to get an SACD player that I can connect via DL3, and I would like opinions as to whether it is worth getting the higher lever 5910ci over the 3930ci if the connection will be using the receiver's DAC's anyway.

This is a tough one to answer. I have the 5910CI and it was a significant upgrade to the 2900 that I had before. Some people claim not to notice any difference in sound quality via Denon Link compared to HDMI but I do so I am going to be keeping my 5910CI for a few more years. It was the reference player for many years but bear in mind that the unit dates back 5 or 6 years so there are a few significant advances since then and there are alternatives out there now such as the offerings from Oppo. The DAC's built into the 5910CI are still really good and rival most anything today but you only use these if you output via analog. If you use Denon Link, then of course you will be using the Denon receiver or Denon pre/pros DAC's anyway. I have an Oppo BDP93 that I use exclusively for BluRay and streaming and I use the 5910CI for CD, SACD and DVD-A shiny discs. If it were me buying something new today, I would probably go for the Oppo BDP 95. The only shortcoming over the 5910CI would be the lack of the Denon Link which may or may not make much difference to you anyway. As I noted above, some people cannot tell any difference between DL and HDMI anyway so the point would be moot; If you go with the Oppo, you would be free to buy any receiver or pre/pro too - not stuck with Denon. I see these on eBay for $500-1500 depending on version and condition so they still bring a decent price. Originally sold for $3500 or so, back in the day.

Well, it accepts my serial number fine.

So what does it say?

Have a heavily modified 5910 done by Hot Rod Audio Mods http://hotrodaudiomods.com/ on which the center anolog channel is dying, (or dead for all intents and purposes).

digital side should still be good for music and video but haven't used it for this in so long that I don't know.

Mods included on analog side include:

new op amps on stereo R/L channels
new op amps on all 5 ss channels
internal case mods:
rfi/emi sheilding
vibration control

Here it comes.....

:) See classified listing in DVD Players, this site. Includes remote and manual (heavily marked up).

Replaced with stock Oppo BDP-95 :D

Mine's a doorstop, too.

How does the OPPO compare for audio?

The Oppo has a greater depth and width to its' soundstage, placement of performers is more precise. The Oppo is quicker, more exhilarating in presentation. Response is great too, I believe the mid and upper ranges are clearer and less fatiguing. Downside, 'They say' that the bass could have more extension but I am hard pressed prove it. Mind you, I am looking for it and cannot substantiate that comment.

Please keep in mind that I am comparing a stock BDP-95 to a heavily modded 5910.

**Please note** the Oppo must have At Least 48 hrs burn-in time. Out of the box it Stinks!

There is no comparison in video quality and consider that the 5910 is dvd only.

I believe the Oppo is a no brainer. Music Direct is offering free money for 12 months. Couldn't pass it up.

Actually spent a bit of time listening to the Pet Sounds DVD-Audio yesterday. It's a dual sided disc, DVD-Audio on one side, DVD-Video on the other.

First on the 5910ci, where there were a good number of dropouts over the course of playback, between one and three on most of the tracks. And then on the Oppo 93, where it played without any problems. (5910ci via DenonLink, 93 via HDMI.)

Decided that the 93 actually sounded pretty good, at least once the volume was cranked up a bit. So may not be so bad after all in comparison with the Denon.

Next up, somewhere along the line, will be to check out a few more SACDs. (DenonLink will give my receiver DSD directly, but the 93 has to convert it to PCM and then send it via HDMI.) And then finally some CDs (HDCD encoded and just plain ones). And a few more DVD-Audios as well.

My 5910 and 5910ci have both been a bit finicky from the start, kind of hoping that the 93 will work out to be a reasonable sonic facsimile so I can free up some space on my rack. Only thing that's bugged me about the two Oppos I've had is that for some reason the first bit of sound is just about always cut off, at least when first played, kind of annoying to have to go back in order to hear the whole track. Otherwise, if the AQ and PQ hold up pretty well in comparison to each other, may be time to just unplug the 5910ci once and for all.