Well a week in and have not noticed any problems with the Hitachi 500 GB drive with some heavy usage. As I had already reached 99% capacity on the internal HDD every new program was going on to the external drive. So far, I haven't had the pixelation problems that some have mentioned. I can only imagine that there may be some other factors involved.

I did notice that the Hitachi 500 drive was sold out quite a bit and finally was able to get one from mwave for a good price with 2 day shipping.

I've gone from 22% to 43% by recording many movies, shows and sports. It's all been great. It's really terrific to just record stuff in advance and not worry about space limitations. Thanks to everyone here for sharing on this.

I leave the drive powered up and in the newegg case, I don't hear anything in the way of the drive. It's working just fine and not too hot.

Well a week in and have not noticed any problems with the Hitachi 500 GB drive with some heavy usage. As I had already reached 99% capacity on the internal HDD every new program was going on to the external drive. So far, I haven't had the pixelation problems that some have mentioned. I can only imagine that there may be some other factors involved.

I did notice that the Hitachi 500 drive was sold out quite a bit and finally was able to get one from mwave for a good price with 2 day shipping.

I've gone from 22% to 43% by recording many movies, shows and sports. It's all been great. It's really terrific to just record stuff in advance and not worry about space limitations. Thanks to everyone here for sharing on this.

I leave the drive powered up and in the newegg case, I don't hear anything in the way of the drive. It's working just fine and not too hot.
Thanks for the update, romanesq. I think 500GB drives are being looked at closely by many here as well as some drive/case "solution" vendors. There is some thinking that "housekeeping" issues will kick in and toss a spanner in the works on larger drives. And we're all a bit anxious to see if, and at what capacity, that happens.

I just hooked up a 250GB drive to my 8300HD and it installed flawlessly as per the Scientific Atlantic instructions with the proper messages displayed but any new recorded content (I assume it is on the external drive as it has more space) plays back and freezes and/or has audio drop outs. For some of the recordings it is very bad where you do not want to watch it (freezes 10 or more seconds).

I have done a hard boot but still had the same problem, I even watched all the content on my 8300 and reformatted it, got the message that an external drive was connected but it did not reformat it and I still have the same problem.

I spent an hour searching this thread, is there anyway to reformat the external drive? Could there be any other issue that is causing the playback to freeze?

Should I try a smaller drive size?

This is Cablevision of NYC in Brooklyn.

Thanks for any help.
Lou

I just hooked up a 250GB drive to my 8300HD and it installed flawlessly as per the Scientific Atlantic instructions with the proper messages displayed but any new recorded content (I assume it is on the external drive as it has more space) plays back and freezes and/or has audio drop outs. For some of the recordings it is very bad where you do not want to watch it (freezes 10 or more seconds).

I have done a hard boot but still had the same problem, I even watched all the content on my 8300 and reformatted it, got the message that an external drive was connected but it did not reformat it and I still have the same problem.

I spent an hour searching this thread, is there anyway to reformat the external drive? Could there be any other issue that is causing the playback to freeze?

Should I try a smaller drive size?

This is Cablevision of NYC in Brooklyn.

Thanks for any help.
Lou
You could try formatting the drive with Windoze. Upon re-attching it to the 8300HD it would look unformatted - the formats are not compatible - and would offer to format it. However, it's unlikely that that would fix the problem. Nor would a smaller capacity as some have reported success with 300GB, 400GB and now 500GB.

What is the rotational speed of the drive? The cache size?

I'm also experiencing the 'freezing' or skipping / unsync'd audio problems with playback of recorded programs on my external Maxtor 300GB SATA drive.

Here's my equipment:

Scientific Atlanta 8300
Maxtor 300GB MaxLine III SATA HD Model 7L300S0
(SATA-150, 16MB Cache, 7200RPM)
eSATA to SATA I cable (has 2 different ends)

I'm using a Metal Gear Box enclosure (I've bypassed the SATA thru cable as it would not work, so the drive is using this boxes power supply only; I have the SATA cable directly hooked up from the PVR to the HD)

After connecting it and powering on, I received the message asking me to format the drive, which I did. After turning off the units and turning them back on, I get the PVR message:

ATTENTION: The external storage device connected works with this DVR.

So there doesn't appear to be anything wrong with the equipment, however during playback, the video will freeze, the audio drops off during this, and when it continues the video and audio are no longer synced.

PVR OS Information:

ROM Image: 1.87.16.11 05/19/05
OS 6.14.11.1 02/24/05
SARA 1.87.16.11 05/19/05
PowerKEY LIB: 3.7.5.2 11/11/04
HAL Driver: 1.0.39.109221 05/19/05
PHAL3 Driver: 3.5.11.1021 02/18/05

Anybody have any ideas what could be wrong?

Thanks...
Mike

I'm also experiencing the 'freezing' or skipping / unsync'd audio problems with playback of recorded programs on my external Maxtor 300GB SATA drive.

Anybody have any ideas what could be wrong?
vegggas? davehancock? C-F?

It wasn't me. I swear. :p

v/r,
C-F

i'm starting to get annoyed and and becoming somewhat suspicious of recent updates to the 8300 being pushed on us.

I have not had any issues since install until very recently. just the other day I was watching a movie I recorded a week or so ago and I noticed some dreadful lip sync issues.

upon reading the previous poster's issue I thought, could it be my drive is starting to become fragmented, but then I quickly dismissed this notion since the poster is talking about a freshly formatted drive.

I'm starting to think up some conspiracy theories in my head...

I have not had any issues since install until very recently. just the other day I was watching a movie I recorded a week or so ago and I noticed some dreadful lip sync issues.

I would like to add to this comment; the video is recorded OK. If you rewind prior to the 'freezing / skipping' portion and play it again, it will play fine. Also, after such an occurance while watching, simply hitting pause and unpause will re-sync the audio.

At first I thought maybe this drive just isn't compatible with such uses, especially after finding out Maxtor has a "QuickView" drive specifically for this purpose. But now reading BenDover's comment above, where everything has been ok until recently, obviously there's more at work here.

Mike

Those with freezing, skipping issues - Are you using the Maxtor Quickview Expander Kit, or your own enclosure and drive combo?
The Maxtor Quickview Expander Kit does NOT use error correction for data and buffer issues. Drives are designed to try to correct the data as it it being written and read, however this action will cause skipping and freezing issues with streaming video as it tries to reread the data, so the Maxtor Quickview Expander Kit was designed to not do this, and go on with the read process if an error exists.

vegggas

I've also had the lip-sync issue - but have not noticed it happening more with programs recorded on the external drive than the internal one.

Mike's comment regarding hitting pause agrees with my experience. I've usually observed the problem after I have fast forwarded through commercials and suspect that what happens is that there were greater video than audio drop outs during the portion I jumped by - resulting in an out of sync situation. Again, just hitting pause and then play fixes the problem.

Mike, are you sure that you are seeing more problems with programs recorded on the external driv, than the internal one? Something else may be going on here. My observation has been that I have slightly FEWER drop outs with stuff recorded on the external drive (similar Maxtor, but 250GB) than the internal - but drop outs do happen - particularly when I am recording 2 HD programs while watching a 3rd (previously recorded) program.

Those with freezing, skipping issues - Are you using the Maxtor Quickview Expander Kit, or your own enclosure and drive combo?
The Maxtor Quickview Expander Kit does NOT use error correction for data and buffer issues. Drives are designed to try to correct the data as it it being written and read, however this action will cause skipping and freezing issues with streaming video as it tries to reread the data, so the Maxtor Quickview Expander Kit was designed to not do this, and go on with the read process if an error exists.

vegggas
Is there a way through jumpering or firmware to adjust - or disable - error-correction on hard drives?

For those that have purchased the Vantec enclosure are you aware whether an EIDE drive will work with it?

If not can someone point me to a SATA II enclosure that accepts EIDE? I have an unopened EIDE 250GB drive sitting here that I'd like to put to some use if I can.

Thanks,
Frank

For those that have purchased the Vantec enclosure are you aware whether an EIDE drive will work with it?

If not can someone point me to a SATA II enclosure that accepts EIDE? I have an unopened EIDE 250GB drive sitting here that I'd like to put to some use if I can.

Thanks,
Frank

I just received and installed this one Vantec NEXSTAR 3 NST-360SU-BK eSATA and USB Interface Enclosure with a SATA drive and it works as advertised.

I am sure I saw one with a ATA (EIDE) interface at Newegg where I purchased the SATA version.

VideoRoy- Thanks for the reply. I was too impatient and ordered a new SATA II drive as well.

I am sure I saw one with a ATA (EIDE) interface at Newegg where I purchased the SATA version.

I just looked again at Newegg and do not see one with an EIDE to eSATA now. Sorry it must have been some other site.

I do not have the maxtor drive but nor do I think that error correction is the culprit here given my experience.

if you look at the fact that the sync is fixed by pausing, rewinding then playing, I think this points to the decoder falling behind. if they have been monkeying around with the bitstream, eg for content protection, etc, they may well have started taxing the horsepower of the decoder.

the other factor I consider is that I have been experiencing all sorts of other issues/problems since the last few updates, like black or gray snow screens when starting up, changing channels and even starting recordings from the dvr.

I hope they straighten it out, whatever the cause but I really don't think it has to do with the drive since I *had* been using it without issue for about a year now.

Those with freezing, skipping issues - Are you using the Maxtor Quickview Expander Kit, or your own enclosure and drive combo?

Hi vegggas; No, I'm using a standard Maxtor SATA drive... I didn't know about the 'QuickView' drives until after. Thankfully this one was only $188CDN (300GB)... I may still try the QuickView 300.

But before I go spend some more... I'd also like to know if its possible to somehow disable error correction in the drive?

Thanks!
Mike

Mike, are you sure that you are seeing more problems with programs recorded on the external driv, than the internal one?

Hi DaveHancock; Actually until now I've never experienced any dropouts at all. The internal drive plays things back perfectly. Only recordings on the external drive are playing with these anomolies.

I'm watching a 1 hour recording now; the first dropout occurred exactly 30 minutes into the program causing the lipsync issue. I paused, resumed and sync was corrected. Then again 3 minutes later it occurred again.

Does this 'random timing' of the event sway the jury to error correction being the culprit?

Mike

Hi DaveHancock; Actually until now I've never experienced any dropouts at all. The internal drive plays things back perfectly. Only recordings on the external drive are playing with these anomolies.

I'm watching a 1 hour recording now; the first dropout occurred exactly 30 minutes into the program causing the lipsync issue. I paused, resumed and sync was corrected. Then again 3 minutes later it occurred again.

Does this 'random timing' of the event sway the jury to error correction being the culprit?

Mike
Is the content you are playing back HD or SD? I have seen this behavior in HD but not from recording just realtime broadcast.

Is the content you are playing back HD or SD? I have seen this behavior in HD but not from recording just realtime broadcast.

The content is SD (SA 8300). Only when playing back on the external drive, the internal drive plays back flawlessly.

Mike

The content is SD (SA 8300). Only when playing back on the external drive, the internal drive plays back flawlessly.

Mike
I am also using a Maxtor drive. It is one of the older 250gb models, Maxline Plus II 1.5gb interface SATA 1. The drive was in heavy use before I used it for this. I am using the Vantec Case.

I installed it about a week ago and have watched 4 or 5 HD recordings and copied a few shows to my DVD recorder (HD and SD source) and have not experienced this behavior.

Have you checked all the usual suspects.

* Cable to drive not routed over other equipment
* Connections all tight
* Etc.

Have you checked all the usual suspects.

* Cable to drive not routed over other equipment
* Connections all tight
* Etc.

I thought about that - took the assembly apart, unplugged everything, rehooked... PVR again claims the unit is compatible, etc. But then the freezing etc during playback continues.

The box I'm using (Metal Gear Box) is just supplying power to the drive; I had to bypass the rear port / internal connector because the PVR would not recognize the drive as compatible with that hooked up. So the cable, which I believe is 18" long goes from the back of the PVR directly into the Maxtor drive, which is on the shelf below the PVR (sits there alone).

I have all this equipment beside my right front surround speaker (shielded). I thought maybe this was the culprit, but imagined if it were a problem, I would have had problems with the PVR by itself as well.

Since the only problems occur during playback (the recording is 100% fine), does this suggest anything? The 'error correction' suggestion is still on the table. Another question about that would be: Does error correctly only occur during playback? If not, why is the recording OK?

Mike

Since the only problems occur during playback (the recording is 100% fine)?
How do you know this?

The box I'm using (Metal Gear Box) is just supplying power to the drive; I had to bypass the rear port / internal connector because the PVR would not recognize the drive as compatible with that hooked up. So the cable, which I believe is 18" long goes from the back of the PVR directly into the Maxtor drive, which is on the shelf below the PVR (sits there alone).

I have all this equipment beside my right front surround speaker (shielded). I thought maybe this was the culprit, but imagined if it were a problem, I would have had problems with the PVR by itself as well.
Mike
Do you have the drive mounted well in the enclosure or is it exposed? If you get rotational vibration the drive servo motor has to compensate more. I have actually run into this one before and could watch the error rates increase on an analyzer. Is the 18" a true external cable with shielding?

And you are sure that recordings play fine from the internal drive? I was thinking you might want to look over the rest of your setup? How do you have your sound hooked up to the TV or Surround Sound system? I had something strange going on not too long ago while I was setting up and the sound was slightly out of sync if I used analog sound verus the optical or coaxial.

How do you know this?

Well, I guess I'm not absolutely certain on this point, however whenever the freezing / skipping occurs, if I rewind and replay that part it works fine. So I just assumed the recording is ok; if it skipped while replaying the same part then I'd know the recording was shot too.

Mike

Do you have the drive mounted well in the enclosure or is it exposed? If you get rotational vibration the drive servo motor has to compensate more. I have actually run into this one before and could watch the error rates increase on an analyzer. Is the 18" a true external cable with shielding?

Ah! That is interesting. The drive is not mounted inside the enclosure; in fact, there is room for it to move. The reason being is that the Metal Gear Box had front/side walls with blue lights on them. The drive just barely fit with these installed, however the SATA cable would have been bent at such an awkward angle I didn't want to risk damaging it, so I removed the fancy (useful!) lights. I'm going to secure the drive and give that a shot.

And you are sure that recordings play fine from the internal drive? I was thinking you might want to look over the rest of your setup? How do you have your sound hooked up to the TV or Surround Sound system? I had something strange going on not too long ago while I was setting up and the sound was slightly out of sync if I used analog sound verus the optical or coaxial.

The PVR has been running perfectly since I bought it about 6 months ago. My recording space (prior to adding the external drive) was about 94%. After I added the external drive and recorded several programs, that's when I started to notice the problem. When playing some of the older material I had recorded (which would have been on the internal drive) there are no problems.

I'm keeping the current volume of stuff on the unit so I know for sure it is being recorded on the new drive. I'm going to go secure that drive now and record something. Will post results!

Thanks,
Mike

Is the 18" a true external cable with shielding?

Oops, forgot to reply to this; actually my mistake, the cable is 3' long. This is the cable (and where I bought it):

3' SATA 1 to eSATA Cable (http://discountechnology.com/s.nl/sc.2/category.52/it.A/id.195/.f)

I hope this is the correct cable to use...?

Mike

Well the results are in.... <drum roll>.... nope! Still freezes and skips etc. The harddrive is now fastened to the enclosure; no chance of movement.

Aargh... stomp stomp stomp

:D Mike

So: No apparent problems with the hardware cable, drive, power circuitry / grounding issues, heat issues, works fine for 30 minutes at times...

No correlation with recording simultaneously - SD/HD - 1/2 tuners, SD/HD on other buffers, tuners on lower /upper tiers, passthrough vs single resolution, DD vs PCM, other variables such as that?

Is there a way on SARA to look for errors and memory utilization against the times of the dropouts?

v/r,
C-F

So: No apparent problems with the hardware cable, drive, power circuitry / grounding issues, heat issues, works fine for 30 minutes at times...

No correlation with recording simultaneously - SD/HD - 1/2 tuners, SD/HD on other buffers, tuners on lower /upper tiers, passthrough vs single resolution, DD vs PCM, other variables such as that?

Is there a way on SARA to look for errors and memory utilization against the times of the dropouts?

v/r,
C-F

So far I cannot find any consistency. Recording 1 or 2 programs, DD or PCM, nada... just seems to hiccup or choke on the stream.

You lost me with the lower/upper tiers & passthrough vs single resolution... what is that?

Regarding SARA... there is a screen in the service menu titled "SOFTWARE ANOMALIES" - which has a load of "warnings" there. I can post them here, but does anyone know what they mean? I will check and see if the times of the warnings match the hiccups.

Mike

SOFTWARE ANOMALIES entries:

WARNING! 060128.23.14 [SARA Main] @ CWatchTV.cpp:1372 (Exception - 0x2801 in WatchTV Suspend())
WARNING! 060128.21.17 [SARA Main] @ wmgr.c:1009 (NewWindow: specified high-res screen for Floating window, ignoring)
WARNING! 060128.20:41 [CONFIG] @ config.c:1206 (Exception - 0x10700 cfg owner 3, parameter 33)

etc etc... the movie I was just watching just skipped, but no corresponding time entry was posted here.

However, over to the MPEG DECODER STATUS screen:

Decoder 1
State: Started
Pid: 0
Stream Type: SD
Mpeg Stream Type: MPEG2
Progressive: 1
Decoder Skips: 2
Change Count: 1
Bit Buffer Level: 24576
Frames Per Second: 29.97
Video Sync Error: 4238
Rff Count: 1383
Frame Count: 2844

Anything there spark any interest? Video Sync Error? Decoder Skips? I have no idea what this stuff means... anybody here build/program SA equipment?!

Mike

I have no special insight, just tossing out variations on the unit's load to see if that makes any difference. Usually, some channels are analog (2-78?), some are likely digital in the higher numbers (digital tier), then there are the encrypted channels, and the HD tier. Since both tuners are usually always [saving] something into the buffer, it could have been a factor. I usually set the other tuners on an free On-Demand channel since my Passport box does not buffer those to the HHD. I have noticed that the unused tuner 'times out' now and to switch to it causes a pause to set up the buffer as it defaults to the TWC-KC AD channel (it could have always and I never noticed before the later Passport versions).

Pass-through vs. single resolution was to see if converting everything to one resolution vice sending native signals could have reduced the load if that is a factor.

RE: error correction. Somewhere on here is the math for a back of the envelope estimate of ~7 soft read errors on a HHD (using someone else's error per bytes statistic). I have not seen an easy way to get at that for a particular drive, the SMART statistics do not seem to log that particular statistic. There are some folks who have modified the firmware for CD/DVD burners, so it may be possible for those folks -- if that truly is the cause (but well out of my league).

v/r,
C-F

Edit: Not saying this dance will help, but you might get a sense of if those have any meaning by rebooting, watching an hour show off the internal with no skips, noting the numbers (order of magnitude) and then rebooting and watching a known skipper for about the same time to see if anything is majorly different.

Oops, forgot to reply to this; actually my mistake, the cable is 3' long. This is the cable (and where I bought it):

3' SATA 1 to eSATA Cable (http://discountechnology.com/s.nl/sc.2/category.52/it.A/id.195/.f)

I hope this is the correct cable to use...?

Mike
Looks like the right cable. Mine is shorter but 1m is within the spec.

the first dropout occurred exactly 30 minutes into the program causing the lipsync issue. I paused, resumed and sync was corrected. Then again 3 minutes later it occurred again.


I just added a 400GB western digital wd4000kd, and I saw similar problems. Mostly the dropouts (and a lot more frequent than that), but hitting the replay button resolved the dropouts every time which seems to indicate the problem is with the playback and not the recording.

I looked up the jumper settings on this drive and it doesn't seem that I can change the error correction. The only thing I can do is lock the transfer rate to 150MB/sec. So I'm thinking of sending it back.

Any recommendations for a drive that will work reliably in the 400 to 500GB range? I see others in this thread have had success with and recommend the maxtor drives that are specifically made for expanding DVRs, but I haven't seen them in capacities over 300GB.

Any recommendations for a drive that will work reliably in the 400 to 500GB range? I see others in this thread have had success with and recommend the maxtor drives that are specifically made for expanding DVRs, but I haven't seen them in capacities over 300GB.


I've been using the 500GB hitachi drive for quite awhile now with zero problems. But seeing as how your box is having probs with 400GB I kind of doubt any brand drive will be flawless.

I've been using the 500GB hitachi drive for quite awhile now with zero problems. But seeing as how your box is having probs with 400GB I kind of doubt any brand drive will be flawless.

What's the model #?

Is it specifically for DVRs or does it allow you to disable error correction?

WD Caviar® SE16 500 GB Hard Drives Maximize Performance with 300 MB/s Transfer Rate and NCQ, Strengthen Position in High-Capacity Market

LAKE FOREST, Calif. - Jan. 26, 2006 - Western Digital Corp. (NYSE: WDC) today announced it is shipping its new high-capacity 500 GB Serial ATA (SATA) WD Caviar® SE16 desktop-class hard drives. Providing a half terabyte of capacity for data-intensive applications such as graphic design, digital video editing, personal video recorders and advanced business computing, WD Caviar SE16 500 GB drives also deliver high 7,200 RPM performance with 300 MB/s transfer rate, 16 MB cache and Native Command Queuing (NCQ).

"The WD Caviar family of hard drives delivers the reliability and performance that customers expect from WD," said Don Bennett, WD vice president and general manager of desktop storage. "The extreme capacity and high performance of this drive address a variety of demanding applications and expand WD's portfolio of storage products. From 6 to 500 GB, WD offers a diverse range of hard drives to meet our customers' wide-ranging storage needs."

WD Caviar SE16 500 GB Pricing and Availability
WD Caviar SE16 500 GB (model WD5000KS) hard drives may be ordered on the company's online store (www.westerndigital.com) for $349.99 USD.

The drive I'm having problems with is from the caviar series, so I wonder if the new one would be any better (though it is another 100gb)

No problems after almost of month using the Hitachi 16MG cache 500GB drive in the G-Tech Quad enclosure. Quiet as a mouse, 24/7 cool operation (heat sink, no fan), very happy with it. It was pricey ($549) but worth every penny for ease of use, looks, build quality, noiseless/fanless operation, and direct eSATA II to eSATA II connectivity to my SA8300HD.

-gil

What's the model #?

Is it specifically for DVRs or does it allow you to disable error correction?

Hitachi Deskstar 7K500 500GB Serial ATA II 7200RPM Hard Drive w/16MB Buffer

Been using it since september. It's just a normal desktop drive.

Does anybody know what type of screw bit will open the cover to the SA 8300 HD DVR, it looks to be a non standard screw

I haven't seen this one mentioned here; if it's old news, I apologize.

Thermaltake Muse eSATA enclosure (http://www.thermaltakeusa.com/2005/enclosures/a2319/a2319.htm)

pepar,

I'm shocked :eek: that you posted a link for an enclosure WITHOUT A FAN! You have been such a proponent of using forced cooling (at least you convinced me) :)

I have experienced freezes and skips with my external SATA since day 1.

I tried all the suggestions on this thread, even replaced the hard drive with a completely different model.

I am convinced the freezes and skips have nothing to do with the drive itself, but is a limitation of the SARA software that for some reason is exposed for some users and not others.

My latest guess is that there is fragmentation or some other issue on the internal drive that leads to the freezes and skips. I plan to reformat the internal drive to attempt to solve this problem, but have a lot of content there I really do not want to lose.

Has anybody reformatted the internal hard drive of the 8300HD in an attempt to resolve the freezes and skips? If so, did it work?

pepar,

I'm shocked :eek: that you posted a link for an enclosure WITHOUT A FAN! You have been such a proponent of using forced cooling (at least you convinced me) :)
'Twas for informational purposes only. Or . . the Big Blue Meter seduced me. Take your pick. :)

I would LOVE to see a shootout of a dozen or so external enclosures, with and without fans. My membership in the Fan Fan Club is so far based only on theory, supported by passive's lagging performance against active CPU cooler solutions. As much fun as it it to cast negative aspersions on one scheme or another, real numbers would allow people to make informed decisions.

Now, who can we persuade to run well-designed and executed performance tests of eSATA enclosures? One of the online technology sites like Extremetech or Tom's Hardware? Preferably it would be an entity already experienced in benchmarking.

MEMBERS, WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS?

I haven't read all 44 pages of this thread and really can't find a good way to do a search on this issue so hopefully someone can advise me. I have a Maxtor 300gb External Hard Drive on my SA 8300. I also have a problem with recordings being dropped.

I've done everything from formating the hard drive to replacement of the SA 8300 to having a tech come out and rewire and install an amplifier on the cable on Wednesday. After he did this Wednesday evening I had all kinds of problems from dropped recordings to the 8300 switching from my watching a recorded progam to what it was recording as my "live" station. It also went through a series of dropped recordings and then picking up. It chopped "Bones" into about 8 pieces.

So yesterday I cleared my to be recorded list, rebooted and everything went fine last night.

I've noticed on the Info screen that there are several "Warning: Software Abnomally" that occur during the day yesterday. None of them affected my recordings and the only time I could relate to any of them was the one that said "reconfigure" when I rebooted about 10:00 am. I've noticed these since the day I discovered how to get to the info screen and never gave them much thought.

I know this is rather long but I wanted to lay out everything I've experienced before I get to this final question: Is the Maxtor External HD possibly causing the dropped programs? I can't seem to find anything else.

I've been using an 8300 with an external 250GB Maxtor Sata drive for 8 months with no problems.

Last week my optical audio port went out and I had to exchange the box. Now I am having problems with freezing and melting screens.

Can anyone shed light on why this external worked perfectly with my last unit for 8 months. Not a single flaw.

On a side note, the person that I bought the drive from said they were not using anything greater then 250 GB drives because of problems with larger drives. Again this was told to me 8 months ago.

Brian

Has anybody reformatted the internal hard drive of the 8300HD in an attempt to resolve the freezes and skips? If so, did it work?I have had similar problems to yours. My Maxtor 250GB drive works quite well (say 95%), but my Seagate 250 GB makes the system just about unusable. Both drives were successfully formatted and error scanned on a PC. This would imply that the external drive is part of the problem.

At some point I reformatted my internal drive but that did not help.

As some people run error free and other have problems seems to suggest that the problem is 8300 hardware related, possibly different build or version levels.

Last week my optical audio port went out and I had to exchange the box. Now I am having problems with freezing and melting screens.

Can anyone shed light on why this external worked perfectly with my last unit for 8 months. Not a single flaw.

This bolsters my theory that freezing and skipping problems are not due to problems with the external drive but with the 8300HD itself.

Have you tried reformatting the internal drive? Now would be a good time since your recorded list is probably close to empty:

Press and hold PAUSE until Mail led is lit. Press PAGE down or (-), and then press LIST three times. Turn box off. When turned back on, formatting will begin.

If you do this please report back and let us know if it solved the problem.

I reformatted the 8300 and after reboot I got the message my external drive was attached and ready for use, the 8300 did NOT reformat the external drive and I still had problems with audio drop and picture freezing for over 10 seconds.
I sent back the HD for another one which Fedex reported arrived today, I will see tonight if I still have problems. I might just eat the restocking fee and $30 in postage now and buy that one from Weakknees.

Dropped shows,
Dropped shows, IMO are related to IPG corruption. I'm still working on it though. I have had shows get dropped, but it's always been on CBS, and always while the tuner was on that channel. Immediately after knowing that a program did not record, checking the sheduled recording screen showed alphanumeric garbage as the description. The screen cleared soon after.

External drive & video errors,
Looking at the last few posts, some have experienced problems with different drives (Seagate vs Maxtor), while others have experienced problems with different STB's and a known working drive. It looks like the problems exist when mating drives to STB's. Sometimes they mate correctly, and other times they don't quite sync correctly. Those with problems have had a bad matchup, while those with working units have had a good matchup.
How do you get a good matchup? Who knows. Maybe it's taking a fresh drive, with a freshly hard booted (but completely downloaded data [1/2 hour later]) and then bringing everything down and connecting the external drive. Power up the external drive, and 1 minute later, repower the STB. The screen should ask to accept and format the drive, then go to normal within a few seconds and NOT be rebooted. This would indicate a good matchup. Having to wait a long time, or having to reboot during the install would seem to indicate a bad matchup and be prone to failures - IMO. Those having to reboot many times would seem to indicate a problem with communication, as the process should only take a few seconds.
I have connected several Maxtor Quickview Expander kits now, and only 1 has ever had problems (long time to initialize during hookup) while following the advice above. Re-doing the installation form the start (all remove power, disconnect, Hard boot STB, wait 1/2 hour, power down, power up drive, wait, power up STB) ,seemed to fix the timeout, and the drive has worked ever since.

vegggas

I've noticed on the Info screen that there are several "Warning: Software Abnomally"

I see something similar on my box. I don't know for sure what you're seeing, but what I'm seeing (and what I've seen several others post) look to me like software compilation errors from when either SA or CableVision compiled the SARA code. Its also possible that they are boot-runtime errors indicating that the software is trying to initialize something the box doesn't have or beyond the limits of the box. Regardless, IMHO, to me (as a computer software developer) these warnings indicate sloppy software quality control.

I see something similar on my box. I don't know for sure what you're seeing, but what I'm seeing (and what I've seen several others post) look to me like software compilation errors from when either SA or CableVision compiled the SARA code. Its also possible that they are boot-runtime errors indicating that the software is trying to initialize something the box doesn't have or beyond the limits of the box. Regardless, IMHO, to me (as a computer software developer) these warnings indicate sloppy software quality control.

An opinion I whole heartedly support. :)

I have connected several Maxtor Quickview Expander kits now, and only 1 has ever had problems (long time to initialize during hookup) while following the advice above. Re-doing the installation form the start (all remove power, disconnect, Hard boot STB, wait 1/2 hour, power down, power up drive, wait, power up STB) ,seemed to fix the timeout, and the drive has worked ever since.
Are you leaning toward Error Correction is a culprit? How about this: Some nVidia RAID-chipped motherboards had problems with certain hard drives because of firmware; perhaps the 8300HD's SATA host controller is having issues with certain hard drives' firmware?

Software errors on diagnostic screen.
SA had mentioned that they are all but useless for diagnosing end user problems. They pop up for every abnormality that exists, such as OSD graphics hiccups, updates, etc. You can create abnormalities yourself by trying to use PIP and then the IPG back and forth, or having a recorded show end, while in PIP or IPG mode. It's closer to a windows eventlog or similar file that marks all events.

Pepar,
I think error correction is part of a small problem. I think a larger problem is initial compatibility between the external components and the STB. Doing a proper install and getting perfect results is probably the biggest factor. Any deviation could result in problems down the road.

vegggas

...perhaps the 8300HD's SATA host controller is having issues with certain hard drives' firmware?
This is unlikely because some users are reporting 100% trouble-free operation with the same exact hard drive model that causes problems with other users.

Dropped shows,
External drive & video errors,
looks like the problems exist when mating drives to STB's. Sometimes they mate correctly, and other times they don't quite sync correctly. Those with problems have had a bad matchup, while those with working units have had a good matchup.vegggas

I think you hit my particular problem, the inital plug in on the first drive I got the message that the drive was there and hit <A> to format it but then the message went away the total available size of recordings never changed.
I let it sit for four hours and then hard booted the STB and the percentage changed but I thought it didn't change "that much" for the 250gig drive and the number of recordings.

I'll see what happens tonight when I plug in a new external drive.

This is unlikely because some users are reporting 100% trouble-free operation with the same exact hard drive model that causes problems with other users.
Nobody's been mentioning firmware versions of the drives. I'd like to have that info before coming to a conclusion.

I think you hit my particular problem, the inital plug in on the first drive I got the message that the drive was there and hit <A> to format it but then the message went away the total available size of recordings never changed.
I let it sit for four hours and then hard booted the STB and the percentage changed but I thought it didn't change "that much" for the 250gig drive and the number of recordings.

I'll see what happens tonight when I plug in a new external drive.

Do the procedure I metioned above and start with a clear slate. Here is a detailed process:
Unplug everything from power first!
Hard boot the STB (hold power button while applying power) and allow ample time for a complete download of IPG and OS data (~1/2 hour). Can be done earlier in the day prior to drive installation.
Turn off STB, then unplug from wall.
Everything should be unplugged at this time.
Everything should be unplugged at this time. This bears repeating.
Plug in ONLY the eSATA cable between the two devices.
Plug in the POWER to the External drive. Wait ~ 2 min for complete initialization
Plug in power (Don't hold power button) to the STB. Wait ~3 min for complete initialization. Sit back and relax, this may take a few minutes more if you try to hurry it along. Eventually a Powerkey screen may come up and then go dark.
Press power button on STB (after the 3 minutes) to see the STB screen
A message should say "The drive connected ...blah blah blah" Press A to continue.
Pressing A will complete the process. If it reformatted, it should take a few seconds, if it's already formatted, it will be instant.
Normal use is now available.


vegggas
edited to add numbers instead of bullet points

Veggas,

Possibly a stupid question but does step 2 of your instructions result in loss of previously recorded programming as well as recording schedule?

Thanks,

Drivie

This bolsters my theory that freezing and skipping problems are not due to problems with the external drive but with the 8300HD itself.

Have you tried reformatting the internal drive? Now would be a good time since your recorded list is probably close to empty:

Press and hold PAUSE until Mail led is lit. Press PAGE down or (-), and then press LIST three times. Turn box off. When turned back on, formatting will begin.

If you do this please report back and let us know if it solved the problem.
OK, I did this and will let you know how it tiurned out once I record some data.

Thanks

BRian

Veggas,

Possibly a stupid question but does step 2 of your instructions result in loss of previously recorded programming as well as recording schedule?

Thanks,

Drivie
Hard booting is non-destructive to recorded data, but clears the memory and reloads the OS and IPG data.

vegggas

Hard booting is non-destructive to recorded data, but clears the memory and reloads the OS and IPG data.

vegggas

Thanks for the info...

Drivie

Well whatever, I got to back up my recordings and disconnect the Maxtor. Once again on the recordind of Ghost Whisper it stopped 5 minutes into the recording.

That's it . Tomorrow I' m disconnecticng that drive.

OK, I did this and will let you know how it tiurned out once I record some data.

Thanks

BRian

Nope, formatting didnt fix. In Ghost Whisperer two split seconnd freezes and 2 screen melts. So far I only seem to notice this on CBS. Is that a coincidence? I know that CBD broadcasts in 1080 and I believe others 720?

I still don't understand how the drive worked fine for 8 months on my original box. I guess I can keep returning the box until I get one that mates up ok.

Weird.

Brian

Ghost Whisperer recorded for exactly 7 minutes for me and stopped. I'm pretty certain at this point that my external hard drive is causing this, though how I'm not sure. All I know is that I never had this problem until I hooked up the external hd and now I have problems recording every other day. I already turned in my old 8300.

Fortunately I only have a few recorded shows so I'm just going to reformat the hard drive on my 8300 and leave the Maxtor HD disconnected and see what happens.

I spend more time downloading bit torrent to watch these shows then should be necessary! I'll give it a week without the external hd and see how it does. If it's successful I will hook the Maxtor HD back up (It will format at that point) and see how it does, but quite honestly I don't think it's workable for whatever reason on my SA8300.

Just purchased a Western Digtial 200 gb SATA Drive with a Vantec NexStar 3 ESATA/USB external enclosure. The enclosure came with a SATA to ESATA converter bracket that I was able to unscrew from the bracket and use to connect to my Explorer 8300 (not a HD DVR).

After numerous attempts, boots shut downs and restarts it still wont recognize this drive. The diagnostics say that the second hard drive is "unavailable" I have WOW Cable in Clinton Township, Mi.

Has anyone gotten the expanded capacity to work with a non hd DVR? I suspect either I have a connection issue - maybe the wrong connection to the STB or this function has been disabled by the cable company

Just purchased a Western Digtial 200 gb SATA Drive with a Vantec NexStar 3 ESATA/USB external enclosure. The enclosure came with a SATA to ESATA converter bracket that I was able to unscrew from the bracket and use to connect to my Explorer 8300 (not a HD DVR).

After numerous attempts, boots shut downs and restarts it still wont recognize this drive. The diagnostics say that the second hard drive is "unavailable" I have WOW Cable in Clinton Township, Mi.

Has anyone gotten the expanded capacity to work with a non hd DVR? I suspect either I have a connection issue - maybe the wrong connection to the STB or this function has been disabled by the cable company

I'm a bit confused by what you mean by an Explorer 8300 not being a HD DVR. Perhaps you just don't have HD?

Anyway in order for the SATA to work you need to have a firmware that is capable of using it from your cable company. More then likely they do not have a firmware that has enabled this function. My SATA was not available until my cable companies last upgrade.

I'm a bit confused by what you mean by an Explorer 8300 not being a HD DVR. Perhaps you just don't have HD?The 8300 comes as a non-HD DVR also for those who want to record, but don't have HD service or an HDTV. The SD version generally has a smaller HDD along with the SATA option.

Did anyone else have trouble recording the Super Bowl tonight? I had to stop and restart the recording a couple of times because the 8300HD would indicate that it was recording but if I tried to rewind, it would jump back to near the beginning of the recording and had stopped actually recording after about 10 mins. This has happened to me in the past but not usually on ABC, usually CBS. I finally gave up on trying to get it to record more than 10 mins because it kept happening. It really pissed me off because I wanted to rewind to see a couple of commercials. Sometimes I hate this DVR.

Not sure if I should replace it with another one or if this is normal behavior. Also, I don't have an external drive attached to it...yet.

Drivie

I'm a bit confused by what you mean by an Explorer 8300 not being a HD DVR. Perhaps you just don't have HD?

Anyway in order for the SATA to work you need to have a firmware that is capable of using it from your cable company. More then likely they do not have a firmware that has enabled this function. My SATA was not available until my cable companies last upgrade.

Firmware is 1.87.16.1 which is better than or equal to what others have had success with. SA makes the 8300 in a HD and a non HD model per their website and states the hard drive expansion option should be available for both

wcm2001,
SD and HD 8300's with DVR recognize a valid drive. I've upgraded one for a user that only records analog SD on a SD unit, which takes roughly just as much space per hour as HD does.
The eSATA expansion is part of the core OS of SARA, like USB with Windows. A cable company has to manually go in and suppress the access of the eSATA port for it not to work, which is unlikely - Either that, or someone had it before you, broke the eSATA connection attempting to do something to it and then returned it as "Broken".

drivie,
Your memory was full/fragmented and could not buffer the video. Do a simple or hard reboot and the memory is cleared.

FWIW, A good tip!
Watching a recording in progress, delayed, and then deleting it before finishing the recording often attempts to buffer two different memory allocations of the same stream at the same time of the same file. First imagine all the simultaneous read/write cycles and movement of the HD Heads :eek: . The additional deletion of the content will cause a buffer underrun condition and invalid video crash as the delayed viewing suddenly has the file erased while still being accessed. This will FUBAR your memory and need a reboot.
If you must delete a currently recording file, at least go to LIVE first, then stop and erase. Better yet, wait for it to finish first, then delete it.

vegggas

Do the procedure I metioned above and start with a clear slate. Here is a detailed process: [list=1]vegggas
edited to add numbers instead of bullet points

Okay, follwed everything you listed, pressed the <A> but my percentage of used space never changed. Rebooted (soft) the STB and the percentage changed.
Then recorded an HD program, and watched a DVD, came back and played the recording and had the same problem as before, video froze for up to 10 seconds making the recording unwatchable.
I will return this drive and take the hit of 15% restocking and will try Maxtor QuickView QVX Expander once I get the refund.

Veggas, thanks for your help, I saved your directions and may even go a step further of wiping the 8300 hard drive when I get the new external and start completely from scratch.

I noticed for some time now a problem with stabalization of power from my UPS device. It's real noticealbe when my power goes off and my generator kicks in.

Yesterday I purchased an APC RS/XS 1500. It has a voltage regulator in it and when I tested it working with my generator (by shutting off house current) it did indeed send stable power to the 8300. Previously my old UPS was causing lights to flicker in the house until I turned it off.

All this lead to some interesting speculating from my wife. She's thinking that any power instability would have an affect on how the 8300 was recording. She feels now that we know we have a stable power unit the the Maxtor External Hard Drive will work successfully.

So I hooked it back up this morning (carefully following all directions). I hope she's correct, I really need that recording space.

I have to admit I am skeptical of the "hard reboot" of the SA8300HD.

I have never had a problem solved by doing a hard reboot, and in fact I can see no evidence that holding the power button does anything. The boot sequence and time it takes for the box to become active are exactly the same whether or not I hold the power button while booting.

There is also no mention of the hard reboot in the SA8300HD manual.

Is there evidence that hard reboot really works? How long must you hold the POWER button while booting? I've tried holding it until the "boot" message disappears.

Tonight I tried to record Vegas and 24 at the same time and I was watching Vegas and the 8300 kept kicking out and going to 24. I would return to Vegas which was still recording. This happened all through the second half of the show. When all was done I had one, one-hour recording of Vegas and seven recordings of various lengths of 24! I don't really mind, I'll watch all seven in order and then trash them but it seems I had maxed out the buffer feature as described in the recent post from Vegggas. My question is what, if anything should I do? I have a 250gb drive on the system which works very well only occasionally do I get dropouts. I don't want to reformat drives unless I really need to if it means losing all my recordings. I would liike to know what happened and why and how I can keep from having it happen again. Any advice is greatly appreciated.

Tonight I tried to record Vegas and 24 at the same time and I was watching Vegas and the 8300 kept kicking out and going to 24. I would return to Vegas which was still recording. This happened all through the second half of the show. When all was done I had one, one-hour recording of Vegas and seven recordings of various lengths of 24! I don't really mind, I'll watch all seven in order and then trash them but it seems I had maxed out the buffer feature as described in the recent post from Vegggas. My question is what, if anything should I do? I have a 250gb drive on the system which works very well only occasionally do I get dropouts. I don't want to reformat drives unless I really need to if it means losing all my recordings. I would liike to know what happened and why and how I can keep from having it happen again. Any advice is greatly appreciated.

I had the same thing happen to me twice last week, both Fox shows. Bones and Cops. Cops was divided into 2 minutes segments, it was crazy. And it was kicking me out of watching a recorded show to the shows that were segmented.

I forgot to record 24 last night! Thanks for the reminder, I'm going bit torrent hunting now.

If I knew how to bit torrent I would provide 24 for you but I don't. So, Hookbill, being a sophisticated and knowledgeable HD expert what do you think is the dang deal with this "segmenting" problem? If you have a theory, solution or palliative I'd be very grateful for your sage advice.

I thought that people here knew, but downloading of content via ********** or any other file sharing service is not permitted to be discussed for the obvious reasons.

hookbill, you really shouldn't be advertising ... friendly advice ;)

I thought that people here knew, but downloading of content via ********** or any other file sharing service is not permitted to be discussed for the obvious reasons.

hookbill, you really shouldn't be advertising ... friendly advice ;)


I'm not advertising. Didn't say anything about how it was done, either. You want to deny it exists, that's up to you. :)

And if I broke a forum rule, I sure wasn't aware of it. So I'll apologize if that's the case.

If I knew how to bit torrent I would provide 24 for you but I don't. So, Hookbill, being a sophisticated and knowledgeable HD expert what do you think is the dang deal with this "segmenting" problem? If you have a theory, solution or palliative I'd be very grateful for your sage advice.

Sorry. I really don't have a definitive idea "why" this happens. I only have some vague theorys that have no basis of proof, so I'd rather not get into it. :)

I'm not advertising. Didn't say anything about how it was done, either. You want to deny it exists, that's up to you. :)

And if I broke a forum rule, I sure wasn't aware of it. So I'll apologize if that's the case.

hook, i think you misconstrued my statement, the advertising i was speaking of was of your own use, as in identifying yourself, etc. :eek:

it exists, certainly, and i don't necessarily disagree with the premises, but i'm not the final word ... as my wife reminds me daily :)

hook, i think you misconstrued my statement, the advertising i was speaking of was of your own use, as in identifying yourself, etc. :eek:

it exists, certainly, and i don't necessarily disagree with the premises, but i'm not the final word ... as my wife reminds me daily :)

Oh...I gotcha...well, it wasn't for me. It was for a friend of mine. Yeah, that's it. I would NEVER do anything that was illegal. ;) Even after the MANY times my 8300 failed me for whatever reason, there is no excuse for that. :)

Tonight I tried to record Vegas and 24 at the same time and I was watching Vegas and the 8300 kept kicking out and going to 24. I would return to Vegas which was still recording. This happened all through the second half of the show. When all was done I had one, one-hour recording of Vegas and seven recordings of various lengths of 24! I don't really mind, I'll watch all seven in order and then trash them but it seems I had maxed out the buffer feature as described in the recent post from Vegggas. My question is what, if anything should I do? I have a 250gb drive on the system which works very well only occasionally do I get dropouts. I don't want to reformat drives unless I really need to if it means losing all my recordings. I would liike to know what happened and why and how I can keep from having it happen again. Any advice is greatly appreciated.

I've heard scattered reports of this and similar things happening (and had similar things happen myself). A little birdy told me that there is a known bug in SARA software that periodically has this problem - but only on a SPECIFIC QAM channel. Thus people may have this problem on the ABC HD channel in Pittsburgh and those in Rochester have it on the WB HD channel. The problem has also got to be related to a flaw in the IPG data. I heard this about half a year ago and have no idea when it is supposed to be fixed.

I've only heard of this happening on the FOX channel, and it was widespread last year among many cable co's. I thought it was also attributed to corrupted IPG data from the originating provider.
There may be other issues too, but I'm not sure what they are either.

vegggas

I've only heard of this happening on the FOX channel, and it was widespread last year among many cable co's. I thought it was also attributed to corrupted IPG data from the originating provider.
There may be other issues too, but I'm not sure what they are either.

vegggas

As a matter of fact it was on FOX right during the Super Bowl time. Supposedly FOX was fooling around with something during their transmissions so DVR's could not record the Super Bowl. Corrupted IPG data makes more sense.

Thanks for your response on this, vegggas. I'm starting to get a clearer picture now on why I'm having some issues on a regular basis.

Here is a current collection of links to building a box (Since this is
my first post the system will not let me post URLs or even mention
prefix or suffix to the website's name)...

Enclosure: E-POWER EP-301SA, $33.85 +s/h...
Website: newegg search for N82E16817155903


Drive: Seagate 300 MB, 8 MB Cache, $99.99 After Rebate +s/h...
Website: outpost search for 4303165


Cable: SIIG eSATA to SATA I Cable (1m), $16.63 +s/h...
Website: provantage search for CB-SA0311-S1

Then recorded an HD program, and watched a DVD, came back and played the recording and had the same problem as before, video froze for up to 10 seconds making the recording unwatchable.

I will return this drive and take the hit of 15% restocking and will try Maxtor QuickView QVX Expander once I get the refund.
There is a good chance that the new drive will either work right from the start, or can be made to work.

My results have been a roller coaster ride. See post #1109 for last update. Since that time the Seagate drive has been sitting unused, and the Maxtor running reasonably well.

Well I just tried another test. Did the cold reboot trick (button hold & 30 minute wait) yesterday morning, cleared all recordings from the PVR, shut it down and connected the Seagate. Powered up and the drive was recognized, no format required. It worked without a problem, simultaneous recording of two HD programs while playing back a third. The hard disk going crazy during this test, but no issues with stuttering, pause and rewind worked fine both for playback and live viewing.

Just to confirm that the external drive was really being used, the PVR was shut down and the external drive disconnected. After reboot the recorded list was still there but none of the recordings could be accessed.

The memory full/fragmented seems to best explain the problem, but it does not account for one drive not working properly and being replace by another which works.

Well I just tried another test. Did the cold reboot trick (button hold & 30 minute wait) yesterday morning, cleared all recordings from the PVR, shut it down and connected the Seagate.

Technically, doing the Hard Reboot AFTER clearing the content would be better :) .

The memory full/fragmented seems to best explain the problem, but it does not account for one drive not working properly and being replace by another which works.

I'm still holding to the error correction issues being involved between drives, but it could be anything, including physical drive errors causing the memory to exponentially get used up.
Keep us informed and updated.

vegggas

This works on Rogers Canada with an Explorer 8300 and SARA FW

Just get a Vantec NexStar 3 NST-360SU-BK case. It comes with the right eSATA cable, PSU, case, USB cable and eSATA adapter for your PC.

You need a SATAII drive eg. Western Digital 250GB Hard Drive KS

You must power off the explorer completely by removing the mains cord. Power up the drive - then power on the explorer - it then discovers the drive and asks you if you want to format it. A 250G drive gives you 4 times the total capacity for a total outlay of ~$200CAN.

I see this discussion is still continuing... I've been away on vacation for a week, just caught up on the thread. While away, I've recorded about a dozen different programs, different channels. The playback seems to be much worse now as the drive is 'filling up'. The freezes during playback only occurred occasionally initially, but now they are almost constant. Very irritating...

I'm thinking a hammer... or a tub of water... may solve it! :eek:

Mike

Ok - I'm considering getting rid of my Maxtor 300GB drive + assembly and purchasing a Maxtor 300GB QuickView drive instead (as it claims to be designed for use specifically for the SA 8300 series of PVRs).

So now I have this useless SATA drive as my computer does not have a SATA connection. Has anyone tried using SATA to USB connectors / adapters? Would be nice to use this drive as a backup unit.

Is anybody here using the 300GB Maxtor QuickView? Any comments? The unit seems pricey to me (~$350 CDN) - I'd be very disappointed to find the same issues that I have now.

Mike

Ok - I'm considering getting rid of my Maxtor 300GB drive + assembly and purchasing a Maxtor 300GB QuickView drive instead (as it claims to be designed for use specifically for the SA 8300 series of PVRs).

So now I have this useless SATA drive as my computer does not have a SATA connection. Has anyone tried using SATA to USB connectors / adapters? Would be nice to use this drive as a backup unit.
There are many external enclosures that house SATA drives and offer other outputs including Firewire and USB.

My external drive has been working fine for several months. I had to move my ext. drive in my rack last night. I unplugged my 8300 HD first and then my Ext. drive. Moved it and then plugged the SATA cable back in the 8300. Powered up the drive for a few minutes and then powered up the 8300. 8300 booted up for awhile until 8300 screen was blank. Pushed the power button on 8300 and it turned on to channel. No messages. Went to DVR and all my shows were there. However, when you go to play some of the shows you get a cablevision screen that says Digital Video Recorder Playback channel. Then a box that says Press the lIST button to see your recordings. Only way out is to press DVR button. Some shows playback but they are probably on the 8300. Any suggestions as to what happened and how to fix? How can I tell if drive is being recognized?

I am now testing a 500GB Glyph GT 050Q with a Seagate 7200 RPM drive installed. It is tweaked by Glyph for AV recording, and is aimed primarily at the Digital Audio Workstation market for audio recording and production. Details can be found here http://www.glyphtech.com/site/products_gt050q.html

The cabinet is nicely constructed, with vents and an LED on the front and a very quiet fan in the rear. In fact, I tested this drive side-by-side with my G-Tech G-Drive Q which uses a heat sink, and the Glyph drive is actually quieter! Turns out that the G-Tech's chassis design allows for the actual drive noise to come through. The Hitachi 500GB hard drive in the G-Tech makes more physical noise than the fan in the Glyph model. Glyph employs noise reducing technology they call tri-laminate sound-damping (explained here http://www.glyphtech.com/site/technology_quietmetal.html). Since these drives are designed for use in recording studios, noise reduction is a mission-critical design criteria - and the folks at Glyph do not disappoint.

The Glyph was recognized by the SA8300HD and formatted flawlessly. Playback has been smooth with no hiccups, jitter, or other anomalies.

I am VERY impressed with the Glyph GT 050Q. I own several Glyph drives for my Digidesign Pro Tools hard disc recording system, and they have always performed flawlessly, so I am not surprised that the GT 050Q works as well as it does.

This is a Professional piece of gear, and looks right at home with my 8300HD and Pioneer Elite Receiver. It is not the cheapest solution out there (the 500GB sells for $775) but it is definitely one of the best.

The GT 050Q is available in capacities of 80GB, 120GB, 160GB, 200GB, 250GB, 300GB, 400GB, and 500GB, and can be purchased through Glyph's authorized dealer channel, online and Brick & Mortar:

http://www.glyphtech.com/site/sales_dealers.html

-gil

Mike Grell,
I have used the Maxrtor QVE Kit, and installed it for others. No issues linked to the drive or cabling. I get A/V stutter once in a while, but not very often and it happend before I installed the drives.

BarryDGordon,
I would repeat the connection process. Power down, connect, power up, etc again. It sounds like a bad connection.

GilWave,
Cool. Hammer it and let us know how it works out. What were you using (if anything) before and what kind of problems did you have? Comparisons?

vegggas

Mike Grell,

You may also find this card useful in updating an older PC to use the new SATA drives. This is a mid to low level card. I think they also had a lower 2 port version, for about $25 to $35. I use 4 internal SATA drives in my HTPC (1TB) and they work great.

http://www.cwol.com/serial-ata/sata-raid-2-internal-2-external.htm

Steve

Ok - I'm considering getting rid of my Maxtor 300GB drive + assembly and purchasing a Maxtor 300GB QuickView drive instead (as it claims to be designed for use specifically for the SA 8300 series of PVRs).

So now I have this useless SATA drive as my computer does not have a SATA connection. Has anyone tried using SATA to USB connectors / adapters? Would be nice to use this drive as a backup unit.

Is anybody here using the 300GB Maxtor QuickView? Any comments? The unit seems pricey to me (~$350 CDN) - I'd be very disappointed to find the same issues that I have now.

Mike

There are some external boxes that have Firewire, USB, and SATA connections and use a SATA drive such as this (http://macgurus.com/productpages/firewire/triplecombo.php) one, although I am sure there are others and that they are available from other sources. This just happens to be the one I have seen.

I suppose that you could get a PCI/SATA controller to use in your computer that would probably be about the price of the external case I mentioned and then you could control multiple SATA drives if your computer has the space to install them.

I do not know why the drive you have does not work with your DVR. I have a TWC/SA 8300HD which I have been using with a Maxtor Maxline III SATA drive in an external enclosure. So far as I am aware I have not had problems with it though I have had the usual assortment of problems with the SA 8300HD.

GilWave,
Cool. Hammer it and let us know how it works out. What were you using (if anything) before and what kind of problems did you have? Comparisons?Hi Vegggas...

I have been using the G-Tech G-Drive Q )http://www.g-technology.com/Products/G-DRIVEQ.cfm) fitted with the new Hitachi 16MB cache 500GB 7200 RPM hard drive. I chose it originally because of its stylish chassis (designed to complement an Apple G5 Tower computer) and the fact that it was fan-less (it employs a heat sink cleverly mounted below the drive).

Also, at the time I was considering the Maxtor QuickView but was disappointed that it only went up to 300GB. I record a lot of HD content for myself and my family, and 300GB wasn't going to be enough. I searched around for off-the-shelf eSATA cases to put my own Hitachi drive into to save money, but they all looked cheesy or plastic or goofy or all three. I wanted something well-built, nice-looking, and quiet.

When I heard that Glyph was coming out with an eSATA drive I called them immediately and asked them to send me one. I got a second SA8300HD for the bedroom, so I could put both drives to the test long-term. I set the Glyph unit up next to the G-Tech for an afternoon to do side-by-side noise comparisons (comparing playback, recording, and idle modes).

In all three modes, the Glyph is clearly quieter. You have to actually go put your ear to the fan in the rear of the unit to hear anything. The G-Tech model, having holes front and rear, allows the drive noise to escape. The drive in the G-Tech needs to be semi-exposed in order for the heat sink to work effectively. The Glyph chassis is larger (55% wider and about 10% deeper) but it incorporate the sound-damping technology I mentioned in the previous post, so the drive noise is not audible. The fan noise is barely audible.

Both units employ front-mounted LEDs. The G-Tech's is built into their logo plate, and glows a mellow white. The Glyph's is a yellow LED on the right side of the chassis, and blinks as the drive is being accessed.

The G-Tech stutters occasionally on playback (+/- 70% full), the Glyph as yet does not (10% full). This may be attributable to the amount of drive space used, I don't know yet but will continue to check the Glyph as I fill it up with more content.

I will take some photos and post them when I have some more hours on both units.

-gil

My external drive has been working fine for several months. I had to move my ext. drive in my rack last night. I unplugged my 8300 HD first and then my Ext. drive. Moved it and then plugged the SATA cable back in the 8300. Powered up the drive for a few minutes and then powered up the 8300. 8300 booted up for awhile until 8300 screen was blank. Pushed the power button on 8300 and it turned on to channel. No messages. Went to DVR and all my shows were there. However, when you go to play some of the shows you get a cablevision screen that says Digital Video Recorder Playback channel. Then a box that says Press the lIST button to see your recordings. Only way out is to press DVR button. Some shows playback but they are probably on the 8300. Any suggestions as to what happened and how to fix? How can I tell if drive is being recognized?

I am not clear on whether you followed this procedure or not. The 8300 needs to be unplugged, not just turned off, when you reattach the external drive. Then power up the external drive and then plug in the 8300 and turn it on. It has worked OK for me this way when I have had to move something.

The G-Tech stutters occasionally on playback (+/- 70% full), the Glyph as yet does not (10% full). This may be attributable to the amount of drive space used, I don't know yet but will continue to check the Glyph as I fill it up with more content.

I will take some photos and post them when I have some more hours on both units.

-gil
Thanks, gil. This is all very interesting! Obviously, the true test will be when the Glyth is 70% full.

But this from your previous post "It is tweaked by Glyph for AV recording, and is aimed primarily at the Digital Audio Workstation market for audio recording and production." is what interests me the most.

I am new to all this and have a question. I found a Western Digiatal Hard drive that is SATA. It's a 160 gb drive, 7200 RPM, 8mp data buffer. Should this work with the enclosure and cable for the SA 8300? Also, and suggestions as to the best place to purchase the enclosure and cable? Thanks.

I am new to all this and have a question. I found a Western Digiatal Hard drive that is SATA. It's a 160 gb drive, 7200 RPM, 8mp data buffer. Should this work with the enclosure and cable for the SA 8300? Also, and suggestions as to the best place to purchase the enclosure and cable? Thanks.
Yes, it will work, but you're not moving the ball forward much by adding only 160GB more storage.

Yes, it will work, but you're not moving the ball forward much by adding only 160GB more storage.Right - you'll go from a meager 24 hours of HD to a whopping 48 hours!!

I've got over 600GB between the 8300HD and my 500GB Hitachi SATA, and I'm already 70% full.

Since you can't add additional SATA drives to the 8300, best to buy the biggest SATA drive you can afford - I would suggest 300GB at a minimum, 400GB as a decent compromise and 500GB if you can swing it.

-g

Right - you'll go from a meager 24 hours of HD to a whopping 48 hours!!

I've got over 600GB between the 8300HD and my 500GB Hicatchi SATA, and I'm already 70% full.

Since you can't add additional SATA drives to the 8300, best to buy the biggest SATA drive you can afford - I would suggest 300GB at a minimum, 400GB as a decent compromise and 500GB if you can swing it.
That's the logic I'd use, unless I already owned a 160GB drive from some other usage.

I am looking to expand the storage capacity just like most of you are. I've read a ton of posts and still don't have a clear idea what is the best most economical and reliable solution. If someone could summarize what items need to be bought and where - that would be great. Better yet, is there a kit out there that has everything needed or Maxtor's QuickView is the only one? Your help is greatly appreciated.

I am looking to expand the storage capacity just like most of you are. I've read a ton of posts and still don't have a clear idea what is the best most economical and reliable solution. If someone could summarize what items need to be bought and where - that would be great. Better yet, is there a kit out there that has everything needed or Maxtor's QuickView is the only one? Your help is greatly appreciated.
I thought this one was the easiest:

Vantec NEXSTAR 3 NST-360SU-BK eSATA and USB Interface Enclosure from Newegg. Has everything you need except drive.

I added a Maxtor 250gb SATA drive I already had. Put together in a couple of minuts and up a running for 3 weeks.

When looking for an external drive for the SA8300, are there any minimum requirements to look for? I don't know that any of them say they support being connected to a HD-DVR - they list PC/Mac.

I thought this one was the easiest:

Vantec NEXSTAR 3 NST-360SU-BK eSATA and USB Interface Enclosure from Newegg. Has everything you need except drive.

I added a Maxtor 250gb SATA drive I already had. Put together in a couple of minuts and up a running for 3 weeks.


Has anyone succesfully upgraded an SA 8300HHD to 660GB, with a Maxtor *500GB* 7200 RPM SATA drive (not a QuickView) and a Vantec NEXSTAR 3 NST-360SU-BK eSATA and USB Interface Enclosure?

Thanks in advance!

I'm still unclear on the Passport software. Has anyone in the Central Florida Brighthouse area successfully expanded the capacity of an SA8300HD DVR yet?

If so can you list your components and installation procedure. I'm about to have a new 8300 brought out, old one is having odd sound issues, warbling, low volume, no sound, etc.

Thanks,

Ryan Reid
Cocoa, FL

I'm still unclear on the Passport software. Has anyone in the Central Florida Brighthouse area successfully expanded the capacity of an SA8300HD DVR yet?

If so can you list your components and installation procedure. I'm about to have a new 8300 brought out, old one is having odd sound issues, warbling, low volume, no sound, etc.

Thanks,

Ryan Reid
Cocoa, FL
Try the search function on this thread, Ryan. Passport does not support external drives - yet.

I am aiming to add a 500GB External HDD to a SA 8300HD on Cox Cable in Santa Barbara CA.

Has anyone has successfully added an external eSATA hard drive to their Cox Cable - Santa Barbara SA 8300HD.

Also, I want to know if anyone can tell me if Cox Cable - Santa Barbara is running Passport software or not on their 8300HD's.

I am aiming to add a 500GB External HDD to a SA 8300HD on Cox Cable in Santa Barbara CA.

Has anyone has successfully added an external eSATA hard drive to their Cox Cable - Santa Barbara SA 8300HD.

Also, I want to know if anyone can tell me if Cox Cable - Santa Barbara is running Passport software or not on their 8300HD's.
If you have the box you can unplug and re-power it. On boot, it will display the software.

I was speaking with Rogers tech support and he confirmed that they are now supporting an external sata drive on the 8300 and have the new notes for getting working.

Dont think they are supplying the drives though.

And he was quick to point out that hooking it up to a pc would be useless, just in case I was wondering.

I was speaking with Rogers tech support and he confirmed that they are now supporting an external sata drive on the 8300 and have the new notes for getting working.
SARA software, right?

Yes, Rogers uses SARA.

Well I am now 3 boxes in the past 10 days and I'm still having problems. I don't even have the external drive connected anymore and I',m still having recordings cut short. Just stops anywhere it feels like it. As I mentioned, my previous box was perfection for 8 months. Had to replace because of a bad optical port. Since then every one of the 3 boxes has done the same thing. One thing I noticed, my original box had a Maxtor drive and the new boxes have Western Digital.

My old box worked fine with my external 250 gb Maxtor for 8 monthsl. I haven't even attempted to hook up the SATA drive since I can't get the bare bones unit to work right.

Any suggestions?

Brian

Has anyone succesfully upgraded an SA 8300HHD to 660GB, with a Maxtor *500GB* 7200 RPM SATA drive (not a QuickView) and a Vantec NEXSTAR 3 NST-360SU-BK eSATA and USB Interface Enclosure?No reason why this wouldn't work if it worked with a 250GB in the same enclosure.

I have both a Hitachi 500GB 7200 RPM SATA Drive and a Seagate 500GB 7200RPM SATA Drive connected to 2 SA8300HD units. As long as the SATA cable makes the connection, and you have the SARA (not Passport) OS in your 8300, it sees the drive and formats it when you boot up with the drive powered up.

Thanks to the Olympics in HD I was able to crank-up the recorded content to >70% on my new 500GB Seagate 7200RPM SATA-based Glyph drive.

It exhibits the same anomolies as my Hitachi 7200RPM SATA-based G-Tech drive, which is to say that it will occassionaly spit and sputter on playback.

I have seen DVDs do something similar, and even Star Wars II in Digital Projection at the theater (Texas Instruments DLP techology, movie stored to multiple Seagate SCSI 18GB drives and projected through mirrors to the screen), as well as some "On Demand" movies and HBO series from Digital Cable (Cablevision of NJ).

I think it is an artifact of the digital compression algorithm used in the MPEG compression scheme combined with the way a hard drive's read/write head accesses and then spools out data. I do not believe it is a function of any particular brand of hard drive, or formatting of same.

I could be wrong. Any AVS members using the Scientific Atlanta-approved Maxtor QuickView 300GB drive with greater than 70% recorded content NOT having these issues on playback? If so, then perhaps the previous posts saying that the problem is with 400GB and 500GB drives only might have some merit.

-gil

Thanks to the Olympics in HD I was able to crank-up the recorded content to >70% on my new 500GB Seagate 7200RPM SATA-based Glyph drive.

It exhibits the same anomolies as my Hitachi 7200RPM SATA-based G-Tech drive, which is to say that it will occassionaly spit and sputter on playback.

I have seen DVDs do something similar, and even Star Wars II in Digital Projection at the theater (Texas Instruments DLP techology, movie stored to multiple Seagate SCSI 18GB drives and projected through mirrors to the screen), as well as some "On Demand" movies and HBO series from Digital Cable (Cablevision of NJ).

I think it is an artifact of the digital compression algorithm used in the MPEG compression scheme combined with the way a hard drive's read/write head accesses and then spools out data. I do not believe it is a function of any particular brand of hard drive, or formatting of same.

I could be wrong. Any AVS members using the Scientific Atlanta-approved Maxtor QuickView 300GB drive with greater than 70% recorded content NOT having these issues on playback? If so, then perhaps the previous posts saying that the problem is with 400GB and 500GB drives only might have some merit.

-gil
Yes, but Glyph presents itself as specialists in streaming video storage. And the price seems to reflect specialization. If we cobble something together, we're responsible. If we pay multiples of the DIY price, we should expect - and demand - reliable operation.

If we pay multiples of the DIY price, we should expect - and demand - reliable operation.Agreed. But I wonder then why Maxtor hasn't gone to 400 and 500GB drives in their QuickView series. When I was first researching this issue last November, one of the QuickView dealers told me that the reason there were not yet a 400 or 500GB solution was that they were having problems with the way those larger drives handled the I/O and Read/Write calls from the 8300/SARA system.

Since both my A/V optimized Hitachi and Seagate drives are exhibiting the same anomoly, and since I have seen it on other large-file digital playback systems (HBO On Demand, Star Wars II DLP) I am assuming that that Glyph and G-Tech are not at fault.

Maxtor makes a 500GB 16MB cache 7200RPM drive for DVR use inside the DVR, aimed at the manufacturer (see http://www.maxtor.com/_files/maxtor/en_us/documentation/data_sheets/quickview_500_datasheet_en.pdf) yet even they haven't put it in a QuickView Expander for 8300 eSATA use yet - why not?

There must be an explanation somewhere.

-gil

Hi Gang,

We have the Scientific Atlanta 8300 box with the SATA port. I bought a Seagate 300 SATA drive and a Addonics Combo II enclosure. The Addonics kit gives you a drive harness that fits into a 5 1/4 inch drive bay on your computer for use as a removeable internal drive. It also lets you use the drive as an external through a SATA I/0 card. My question is this: Has anyone partitioned one of these prior to letting the 8300 get it? My thought is that if you partitioned and formatted part of the disk for Windows then the 8300 box would probably look for unpartitioned space (or else just pick a partition) and format that for itself leaving you with two partitions: 1 for use on your computer and 1 for use with your cable box. This sounds a little hairy to me but it would be nice if it worked. Anyone tried it? Thanks.

Steve

Agreed. But I wonder then why Maxtor hasn't gone to 400 and 500GB drives in their QuickView series.
Maxtor has announced the QuickView 500 with 400GB and 500GB capacities.

All this stuff about optimization for video streaming is meaningless if the SA8300HD does not support the required instructions.

Has anyone partitioned one of these prior to letting the 8300 get it? My thought is that if you partitioned and formatted part of the disk for Windows then the 8300 box would probably look for unpartitioned space...
No, it does not work this way. The 8300 has no knowledge of PC partitions. It accesses the drive in its own way regardless of whether you format it or partition it.

Hi Gang,

We have the Scientific Atlanta 8300 box with the SATA port. I bought a Seagate 300 SATA drive and a Addonics Combo II enclosure. The Addonics kit gives you a drive harness that fits into a 5 1/4 inch drive bay on your computer for use as a removeable internal drive. It also lets you use the drive as an external through a SATA I/0 card. My question is this: Has anyone partitioned one of these prior to letting the 8300 get it? My thought is that if you partitioned and formatted part of the disk for Windows then the 8300 box would probably look for unpartitioned space (or else just pick a partition) and format that for itself leaving you with two partitions: 1 for use on your computer and 1 for use with your cable box. This sounds a little hairy to me but it would be nice if it worked. Anyone tried it? Thanks.

Steve
Why would you want to use a drive for both PC and DVR?

Used Vantec Nextar 3 NST-360SU-BK Enclosure with a Maxtor diamond Max 10 6v33FO 300 Gb Sata hard drive with 16 mb buffer. 5 minutes to put hard drive together 5 minutes to connect and reboot everything. Went from 80% used to 29%. Thanks for everyones help. Was nervous about putting hard drive together but it is simple. Connect 1 cable and screw together.

Maxtor has announced the QuickView 500 with 400GB and 500GB capacities.for INTERNAL use - they have not yet announced (to my knowledge) a eSATA 500GB QuickView Expander. The QucikView Expander external models still top out at 300GB.

All this stuff about optimization for video streaming is meaningless if the SA8300HD does not support the required instructions.Agreed. So why the trouble with digital stuttering/skipping with >300GB external SATA drives?

for INTERNAL use - they have not yet announced (to my knowledge) a eSATA 500GB QuickView Expander. The QucikView Expander external models still top out at 300GB.

Agreed. So why the trouble with digital stuttering/skipping with >300GB external SATA drives?

Hmm. I wonder if I could install one of these in my 8300. I seem to remember someone else going to a larger internal hard drive a while back.

Yes, I do own the box. :D

RaveD: Thanks. That answers my question.

Pepar: I suppose to maximize the utility of the equipment. But I don't think I would have used it much on the PC anyway.

Will this work with the 8300HD?

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1820418

Exactly what else would I need in addition to this? Just a cable? Where's a good source for the cable?

Anything else?

Thanks!

Will this work with the 8300HD?

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1820418

Exactly what else would I need in addition to this? Just a cable? Where's a good source for the cable?

Anything else?

Thanks!

i just ordered this earlier today. will report back once i have everything hooked up. (not sure yet if i need to buy a SATA cable)

i just ordered this earlier today. will report back once i have everything hooked up. (not sure yet if i need to buy a SATA cable)
Pretty sure it doesn't come with the cable.

I just wondered if you can use any plain SATA cable or if something in particular was needed.

So if I order the combo from Tiger and this cable
http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10226&cs_id=1022601&p_id=2215&seq=1&format=2&style=

That's all I should need?

NO!!! You need an eSATA (aka SATA-II or Type "I") on the 8300 end (and a SATA [SATA-I or Type "L"] on the other). The Mono price cable in the link is a straight SATA-I cable. Go back to the beginning of this thread for a link to CRUZ systems, which sells the correct cable.

Agreed. So why the trouble with digital stuttering/skipping with >300GB external SATA drives?
Who knows, and that's why it's so maddening.

And it's not necessarily related to the size of the drive. There have been reports of stuttering/skipping with 250GB drives. Conversely there have been reports of 100% trouble-free operation with 500GB Hitachi drives.

Some have reported 100% trouble free operation with the exact drives that I have tried: Maxtor DiamondMax 6 and MaxLine III, 300GB. For me both have resulted in the exact same poor performance, regardless of how much pre-formatting I do in a PC.

One user has reported 100% trouble-free operation in one SA8300, then stuttering/skipping with the exact same drive in a different SA8300.

It seems to me that the SA8300 hardware is temperamental. Stuttering/skipping seems more due to the cable box than to the drive or enclosure. I have tried every suggestion I could find to eliminate the problem but nothing works.

Purchased the following two items from NEWEGG:

VANTEC NST360-SU eSATA and USB 2.0 Enclosure

Samsung Spinpoint SP2504C 7200 RPM 3.0 GB/sec drive

Came complete with all necessary cables for about $155 delivered. Powered off 8300 and external drive. Powered up drive and power light flashed on for about a second. Plugged in 8300 and drive powered up. After booting, got a station and nothing else. Powered off 8300 from front paned, and powered on again. Receiver downloaded program guide, then found the drive. Allowed format, and extra space was immediately useable.

Went from probably 90+ percent full (forgot to look) to 20%.

The outside of the drive enclosure runs about 99 degrees according to laser non-contact thermometer.

Real pleased, thank you guys for this information.

Neal

Yes the blue light in the enclosure is BRIGHT (and it acts as the activity indicator). Nice if you need a night light, otherwise, don't connect it when installing the drive.

Drive in the enclosure is also a little noisy when put on a hard surface, Drive seeks can be heard when room is silent. A small piece of foam under the drive stand takes care of it. Too bad there was no foam in the drive enclosure box.

The following worked for me:

1) 300GB Seagate (ST3300831AS (http://www.seagate.com/cda/products/discsales/marketing/detail/0,1081,631,00.html)) SATA 1.5GB/s drive from Fry's ($108 incl. tax and rebate)
2) Kingwin aluminum SATA drive enclosure from Newegg (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817146318) ($30 shipped)
3) 6' SATA (Type A connector) to eSATA (Type B connector) cable from MacGurus (http://www.macgurus.com/cgi-bin/ccp51/cp-app.cgi?pg=prod&ref=MC78EX-AB) ($24 shipped)

Notes on this Kingwin enclosure:
Some folks have reported issues with the internal connectors in the enclosure being flaky. My personal experience was that I had to use a pocketknife to whittle the plastic around the eSATA connector on the cable (just a little) so it'd fit into the recepticle on the enclosure, but it worked fine. The enclosure's built-in fan is a little noisy, and I'm thinking of disconnecting it (but monitoring temperature!). There are also a couple of very bright lights on the top of the enclosure. These can be masked with neatly-cut electrical tape. I didn't notice an obviously easy connector that could be unplugged to turn off the lights.

Notes on installation/setup:
I installed the drive in the enclosure, connected the drive to the 8300HD with the cable, and powered on. After the drive spun up, the 8300HD asked if I wanted to format. Less than 2 minutes after I clicked "Yes", the 8300HD reported that I had a new drive added, and my storage space increased accordingly. Couldn't have been easier.

Note to others considering this:
YMMV.

Jim
TWC customer, Houston, TX

I've been reading through this thread, but 47 pages is a lot, so please forgive me if this has been clarified somewhere in here. I did a search on "Comcast" but didn't come up with anything....

I just got an HDTV and traded in my 8000DVR for the 8300HD from Comcast in Monmouth, NJ. The Comcast customer service rep (hah!) stated that the SATA port is disabled on Comcast boxes, and that they have no intention of activating it any time soon. But if I'm understanding some of these comments correctly, it would seem that if my 8300HD is using the SARA software, then the SATA port will work on the unit? I checked the unit, and it is using SARA. Can someone confirm that the SATA port should work, before I lay out $150 on a 250Gb SATA II drive?

Also, it looks like that, while the HDMI port is active, the HDMI audio channel is turned off. Does anyone know of any way to activate the HDMI audio directly?

Again, apologies if this has been answered clearly elsewhere in this thread.

Cheers!

Hey don't think about a 250GB drive. Go for double.
As for HDMI audio, it doesn't seem to be an option for folks from what I know.
Do a search on Comcast it may come up but I think your odds are good.

I'm not too worried about the size of the drive right now, I'm just not sure if the drive will work with Comcast, since their reps say it won't. I don't see anywhere in the box setup where the port is inactive.

Blackpool9,

You can get a Seagate 300 SATA for $99 at Outpost.

It seems to me that the SA8300 hardware is temperamental. Stuttering/skipping seems more due to the cable box than to the drive or enclosure. I have tried every suggestion I could find to eliminate the problem but nothing works.I agree that the box is quirky and suspect that memory fragmentation has a big influence on the stuttering/skipping. Here is why:

I have an external 250GB drive that on two occasions when it was installed caused a total lockup and reboot when playing and pausing a live HD program. On the other two times when installed (months apart between non usage) it was flawless.

If possible, I recommend that the 8300HD be completely cleared (no recordings), followed by a hard reboot (30+ minute wait for software download refresh), and then install the external HD. This seems to produce best results.

If possible, I recommend that the 8300HD be completely cleared (no recordings), followed by a hard reboot (30+ minute wait for software download refresh), and then install the external HD. This seems to produce best results.I don't see how this approach would make any difference at all. Unless you happen to pick the exact time that your cable provider pushes a new software release (not a common occurrence at all!), rebooting the STB will not affect its software load. The only thing you buy by having the STB clear of all recordings is that the new drive might not be used for new recordings immediately, but that's only *IF* you're installing a relatively small drive. If you're installing a drive larger than 160GB, the new drive will be used immediately regardless of whether the STB is completely empty or completely full.

For what it's worth, my STB was ~60% full (~40 programs) and had been running all day long when I plugged in my 300GB drive for the first time. The STB immediately recognized the drive and formatted it. Per the documentation, the STB chooses the drive with the most free space when starting a new recording, which for me has almost certainly been exclusively the new drive for the two weeks I've been using it. I've had no problems whatsoever.

I'm at a loss to explain the stutter / lockup problems some folks are experiencing, but I'd suggest that any positive results from this approach are likely only a coincidence.

I don't see how this approach would make any difference at all. Unless you happen to pick the exact time that your cable provider pushes a new software release (not a common occurrence at all!), rebooting the STB will not affect its software load.A hard reboot forces a reload of the software from your service provider. Waiting for about 30 minutes allows it to complete.

The important part of the step is to eliminate the memory fragmentation.

I'm at a loss to explain the stutter / lockup problems some folks are experiencing, but I'd suggest that any positive results from this approach are likely only a coincidence.If a coincidence fixes it for 1 person, then it is worth it. Until a better explanation comes along this seems to a process worth trying. Nothing tried, nothing gained.

I seemed to have solved some of my non finishing of recordings problems. I filed the drive. I just recorded until I got to 99%. I have replay units and I know there were many problems with them with new drives. The solutions were doing low level formats which wrote 0's to the drive..So I'm thinking maybe it's the fresh drive.

We will see.

Brian

If possible, I recommend that the 8300HD be completely cleared (no recordings), followed by a hard reboot (30+ minute wait for software download refresh), and then install the external HD. This seems to produce best results.
Another user on this thread cleared all recordings and did a reformat of the internal hard drive and did a hard reboot and still has problems.

I'm convinced it's a SARA bug influenced by hardware issues. For all we know it could be related to the firmware in the SATA controller inside the box.

Nevertheless I'm trying to get my wife to sit down and watch all the stuff we have saved on the internal drive so I can give this a try. I just don't look forward to the feeling I will get when I experience my first freeze after going through it all.

But at that point if I still have problems I'll just keep getting a new box from the cable company until I find one that works.

Is there a way I can check to see if Comcast has activated this option on my machine? How does one know if will even work? I assume that I'll probably set mine up wrong, so if there's a way to know if it's a "go" from the beginning, that'd help. Thanks

Also, do only online stores carry a eSATA to SATA cable or is it something I could find at, say, CompUSA?

Anyone? Also, what is offered as far as enclosures that don't have eSATA ports (so I could just use SATA to SATA--instead of having to special order that htf cable)?

The Comcast customer service rep I contacted stated that Comcast has the SATA port deactivated. I'm not sure if that is entirely correct or not. When i get into the diagnostic/informational screens of the 8300, it says the second drive is "unavailable", but that might just mean that there isn't one there. There have been some suggestions that if your box is running SARA (as my Comcast box does), the port is active regardless of what Comcast says. However, I'm still waiting for someone with Comcast using this box to confirm. I might just order the VANTEC enclosure from newegg (it's got the eSATA-SATA cable included, along with a USB 2.0 cable) and a 400 or 500GB drive, and use it as an external backup drive for my primary PC if it doesn't work with the 8300.

If Comcast is using SARA software it is likely the SATA port will work.

They have a clear business motivation for telling customers that the port is disabled (for example maybe they have plans to offer an external drive as an additional service, or to roll out an alternative server-based DVR).

If Comcast is using SARA software it is likely the SATA port will work.

They have a clear business motivation for telling customers that the port is disabled (for example maybe they have plans to offer an external drive as an additional service, or to roll out an alternative server-based DVR).
I can't believe that ANY cableco will offer their own external drive. Imagine multiplying the problems AVS members are having by 100,000 to get an idea of the service calls they'd be fielding. In fact, it is my thinking that that is exactly why they are saying it's not activated; they are going to get increased service calls whether they offer their own drives or not. In fact, I'm surprised that SA was able to sell 'em on boxes with eSATA ports at all.

I think if they got their firmware up to par everything would be ok but that won't happen because they don't officially support external drives. Will they soon?

Anyone? Also, what is offered as far as enclosures that don't have eSATA ports (so I could just use SATA to SATA--instead of having to special order that htf cable)?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817145167


This is the one I ordered today. I think it has everything. If it doesn't work for the 8300HD box it will make a nice external for the pc...but I hope it works. I also picked up the 200 gig Maxtor SATA drive on sale last week at Staples for 75 bucks no rebates. So hopefully for a buck twenty five I can more than double my capicity!

Could anybody tell me if the SATA port is active for Northeast Ohio Time Warner Cable? I have the 8300HD PVR. I'd hate to get all of the goodies and it not work. Their customer support is clueless! They didn't even know about the SATA port!

Thanks,
Brian

Well I spoke too soon. My machine stopped recording the Olympics 3 hours and 23 minutes into the 4 hours. Is anyone else having the issue of recordings stopping in the middle of a show. I don't even have my external drive attached. Of course Comcast claims they've never heard of the problem yet this is my 3rd unit in 3 weeks.

Brian

Well I spoke too soon. My machine stopped recording the Olympics 3 hours and 23 minutes into the 4 hours. Is anyone else having the issue of recordings stopping in the middle of a show. I don't even have my external drive attached. Of course Comcast claims they've never heard of the problem yet this is my 3rd unit in 3 weeks.

Brian
Nothing to do with your drive or your STB... AFAIK, It ONLY happens on local channels (usually FOX). If anyone knows differently, speakup. I think it has to do with corrupted IPG data (possible low FDC levels too [where IPG comes from]). Clearing the drive and forcing new IPG Data just delayed the problem.

vegggas

dak0ta11, don't you have Passport? I have only seen one report of a Passport SATA port that worked, and it had some significant problems. Theoretically, one of the 2.5 or 3.something firm/soft/jello-ware versions will have SATA support.

v/r,
C-F

I am in the process of putting together a viable external sollution to add storage space to my 8300 box. I am considering the following external enclosure:
-ww.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1495717&sku=T13-1048
This is the "CoolMax 3.5" SATA / IDE, USB 2.0 and Firewire Aluminum Hard Drive Enclosure." Does anyone have any experience with this enclosure. I want to know if I use the internal IDE connection to connect a standard IDE hard drive will the SATA output on the back work (or do I need to use a SATA hard drive via the internal SATA connection)?
Also, does anyone know any Candian retailers for the SATA to SATA2 cable?
Thanks
Aaron

I don't suppose the 1349 slots are working, if the SATAs are on some...... I wish there was a way to plug in something (ipod, computer, any firewire) to that connection. what is SA waiting for?

I don't suppose the 1349 slots are working, if the SATAs are on some...... I wish there was a way to plug in something (ipod, computer, any firewire) to that connection. what is SA waiting for?
It does work wherever encryption is turned on. Just plug in any 5c compliant device and see for yourself.
BTW, computers, Ipods, etc are not 5c compliant devices...

vegggas

The Comcast customer service rep I contacted stated that Comcast has the SATA port deactivated. I'm not sure if that is entirely correct or not.

I doubt you will find a CSR that "really" knows. I'm on Comcast in Howard County, MD and my eSATA port is enabled. Comcast runs SARA as their standard from what I can tell.


I might just order the VANTEC enclosure from newegg (it's got the eSATA-SATA cable included, along with a USB 2.0 cable) and a 400 or 500GB drive, and use it as an external backup drive for my primary PC if it doesn't work with the 8300.

I have this VANTEC enclosure connected to my 8300. Looks nice, doesn't get too hot despite not having a fan and comes with the cable you need. :)

Yes, I do have Passport. The diag screen shows the following versions:

Passport Echo 1.8.111
OS:6.14.43.3sp

I'm not sure if this helps or not.

Thanks,
Brian

Yes, I do have Passport.
Passport? No SATA for you. :p

Nothing to do with your drive or your STB... AFAIK, It ONLY happens on local channels (usually FOX). If anyone knows differently, speakup. I think it has to do with corrupted IPG data (possible low FDC levels too [where IPG comes from]). Clearing the drive and forcing new IPG Data just delayed the problem.

vegggas

I've seen the problems on locals. Latest with the olympics is NBC. Problem is 98% of the HD content I record is from local network television so this is a problem.

Is there a fix for this?

Again, the unit I had from May until Feb worked flawlessly alone and with my external drive. Problems didn't start until I had to get a new unit for an optical problem.

Brian

The problem, as mentioned earlier, may be your data carrier levels. Check the sig for the 8300 thread for detailed instructions, etc. When you changed out STB's, you moved the RF cabling, and probably affected levels due to poor shield conductors, bad barrel connector, splitters, etc, etc.
As you said, it worked until you touched it...

vegggas

I don't know if you guys are still wanting to hear success stories, but I just had success here in Vegas with Cox. SARA 1.87.xx.xx. I used the Vantec enclosure everyone here has been using (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817145167) and a brand new 300 GB Seagate SATA (8MB cache, uh, can't remember anything else about it, but fairly standard SATA drive). Space used went from 34% to 11%.

Recording right now to the new drive while watching live HD and no jumps. I will test more intensively as time goes on.

BTW, the enclosure is very nice. I will look to Vantec for my future enclosure needs, I'm that impressed. Thanks everyone for the information. :D

It does work wherever encryption is turned on. Just plug in any 5c compliant device and see for yourself.
BTW, computers, Ipods, etc are not 5c compliant devices...

vegggas


Not true.

There are many markets where it doesn't work and the Cable Companies are at a loss why.

Thus far I have seen it said that Oceanic in Honolulu and TWC in Memphis has active IEEE1394 ports on a SA8300. All other posts that I recall from other markets have stated they are having the same difficulties as I am.

I would love if anyone who has a SA8300HD with a working IEEE1394 port would post in the 8300HD/Recording via IEEE1394 thread if you do not want this thread cluttered and hijacked :D

If we could get a good list of yes and no, I think that would allow some head honchos to call between systems, check settings and get it working for everyone. This is exactly what we had to do in the beginning with the SA3250HD box in many markets.

I was a bit premature. Guess I was excited.

Last night, I recorded the 2 hour American Idol (HD) and a Simpsons (SD). So that's 2.5 hours of straight recording, and while it was going, I tested it and there was no jumping, not for playback or for watching live while recording. This was all going to the new drive, because it was new and empty. After Idol was done recording, the box switched off and wasn't used until two hours later.

That was when I decided to test it before I went to bed, just so I could sleep easy :rolleyes: . Turned it on, and the picture was frozen and the box wouldn't respond to any remote commands or buttons pushed right from the box itself. Pulled the power (only left it out for 30 seconds, I'll try 30+min. when I get home from work), let it reboot, it came back on, gave me the "this disc will work with your DVR..." and everything was fine. I tried recordings on the disc and they played fine, live tv was fine, etc. So I turned it all off, then back on, and it was fine. Did it once more, BAM, frozen again. This time, I had sound, but the picture was frozen and it wouldn't respond to remote commands. This time I pushed a bunch of buttons on the remote, seeing if it would queue them up, then waited. Four minutes later, it performed some of the button functions, then froze up again. So it's like it's just getting its ass kicked, either the disc or maybe the RAM in the box.

So then, I rebooted, everything came back up, rebooted, came back up, rebooted, BAM, frozen.

Any ideas? I don't recall this specific issue being mentioned in this thread yet, so I'm kind of bummed. :(

Well, I believe I may have resolved my issue (see previous post) and I'm surprised at the culprit. The entire time, I've been using my Harmony 520 to control everything. Even before the external drive, I'd been using the Harmony and everything was fine. Last night, when encountering the lockups with my cable box, I was again using the Harmony. Today, I decided to not use that to eliminate that as an issue. First, I tried a Hard Reboot, which didn't work. Then, I put the remote down. Turning the cable box on and off using its power button on the front failed to produce the error a single time. I power cycled about 15 times, and after power cycling I would enter the IPG and switch to another channel, just to ensure smooth operation. It worked just fine, so I powered everything down. Then, I picked up my Harmony, pressed my Watch TV button, and the cable box froze.

Long story short, the Harmony's software isn't as flexible as it should be, so my present workaround is to just leave the cable box on all the time (fortunately, the Harmony's software is flexible enough to allow me to do this while still using my Watch TV macro). So I'm wondering: Is it detrimental in any significant way to leave the box on 24/7? It seems as if even when it's off, it's still receiving a signal from Cox, still booted up and starting and stopping recordings to the HDD, etc, so is there a huge difference anyways? Plus, there's always the ongoing debate in the PC world about whether or not to leave workstations on 24/7 or shut them down when not being used. There's a large camp of people who claim there's less stress put on the components (HDD particularly) when leaving them on 24/7. I personally don't lean either way, it just depends on the situation.

So I'd appreciate it if someone would advise me if my workaround will somehow damage my box. Thanks again for all the info...

Is it detrimental in any significant way to leave the box on 24/7?Just like the endless PC debate, you'll probably get multiple, contradicting opinions about that...except that they may be rendered moot by your box's behavior: Have you actually tried this yet? You may find that you can't do it.

If I leave it on, my 8300HD turns itself off around 1am. This is a feature that SA put in the box presumably to prevent the box from being left on 24/7 inadvertently, and is mentioned in the 8300HD manual available from SA's website (after you join the "Explorer Club").

I believe that's a cableco-selectable feature, though, so 8300HDs on different cable systems may operate differently.

That aside, back to your original question. My answer: What's the worst that could happen? Say leaving it on 24/7 limits the life of the box, and one day (sooner rather than later) there's a HDD failure. It'd be a bummer to lose your recorded shows, but in the grand scheme of things, they're just TV shows, not critical data, and you can unplug the box, take it to your cableco, and swap it for another.

So leave it on if you want to.

Jim

So I'm wondering: Is it detrimental in any significant way to leave the box on 24/7?
It's "on" anyway 24/7. The hard drive and every circuit (except the outputs) is on even when the STB is turned "off."

It's "on" anyway 24/7. The hard drive and every circuit (except the outputs) is on even when the STB is turned "off."What does "every circuit is on" mean?

My HDD does not spin and my box cools down significantly when power is off ("standby"). There is a definite difference between "on" and "standby", power-usage wise...at least when a scheduled recording is not in progress.

Is it detrimental in any significant way to leave the box on 24/7?If it is left on and tuned to a broadcast channel it will be recording so the hard drive will not just be spinning but actually writing data. Leaving it on the recorded playback channel would eliminate this activity.

What does "every circuit is on" mean?

My HDD does not spin and my box cools down significantly when power is off ("standby"). There is a definite difference between "on" and "standby", power-usage wise...at least when a scheduled recording is not in progress.
Really? Not mine. And, I've read posts here by others whose drives spin all the time. Sometimes, I can even hear a lot of read/write chatter with mine off. (Not recording at the time.) Powering down turns off the outputs, of which I think the component outs are heat generators; that could be why you've noticed a temperature differential.

Long story short, the Harmony's software isn't as flexible as it should be...You should be able to program the remote to do what you want. I have my Universal programmed to do the following:

1. Watch TV: discrete on to A/V, fudge commands to turn on TV, "0" key to turn on PVR
2. Turn off system: discrete off to A/V, discrete off to TV, power off to PVR

The keyboard setting need to be enabled to get the "0" key to work on the PVR. If the PVR is already on the "0" key is a do nothing command. My PVR is always powered off when not in use.

Really? Not mine. And, I've read posts here by others whose drives spin all the time. Sometimes, I can even hear a lot of read/write chatter with mine off. (Not recording at the time.) Powering down turns off the outputs, of which I think the component outs are heat generators; that could be why you've noticed a temperature differential.Well, you got me curious, so I checked. When I powered up the first time this morning, the HDD clearly spun up from a stop. However, when I powered down, the HDD kept spinning.

Obviously, at some point, the HDD stops when the unit is off, but I now realize I don't know when that happens. (after some fixed time? at the 1am shutdown? dunno.)

At any rate, I stand (partially) corrected!

Well, you got me curious, so I checked. When I powered up the first time this morning, the HDD clearly spun up from a stop. However, when I powered down, the HDD kept spinning.

Obviously, at some point, the HDD stops when the unit is off, but I now realize I don't know when that happens. (after some fixed time? at the 1am shutdown? dunno.)

At any rate, I stand (partially) corrected!
I might as well. I thought, as others do, the drives were always spinning. This has come up for the external drives as well where the generally accepted wisdom is that they need to be kept cool because they are always running. Well, I can see how the box may be smart enough to turn off the internal drive, but not the external.

We need more data points!!

you may need to adjust the delay between commands on your harmony remote; sometimes devices are programmed to receive commands one at a time requiring a fixed amount of time before accepting the next command. try adjusting the delay for your cable box in increments of 50 or 100 ms...it is virtually unnoticeable, the extra delay. I have found the harmony remotes to be extremely flexible and simple to program/use; a little less flexible since logitech took over, but still very flexible.

This has come up for the external drives as well where the generally accepted wisdom is that they need to be kept cool because they are always running. Well, I can see how the box may be smart enough to turn off the internal drive, but not the external.I should have mentioned, just for completeness, that of course my external drive does run continuously, regardless of the power state of the STB or the spin state of the internal HDD...

I should have mentioned, just for completeness, that of course my external drive does run continuously, regardless of the power state of the STB or the spin state of the internal HDD...
Roger that. That adds another item to the wish list for future improvements - a next gen SATA host controller that not only can spin the external drive down, but support the ATA-7 AV Streaming Feature Set.

Yes, the point that was made about the drive still maintaining the Live TV buffer is exactly what I discovered after getting up this morning. Everything was on as I had left it (so I'm presuming Cox-LV has disabled the Auto Turn-Off feature), but the External Drive was still indicating constant activity. So does this mean that the Live TV buffer is maintained:

1) Always on the external drive?
or
2) On the drive with more free space, as the recording feature does?

Hmm, that's interesting. Well anyways, my problem with leaving it on all night is data is constantly being written to it. This differs from a computer in that a computer is not writing such a large amount of data so often. So this would bring us to a point similar to the one jruhnke brought up: What's the worst that could happen? Drive may die sooner, but when it does, you lose some recordings, but not the end of the world. But here's where the difference lies. You can't just take the drive back to Cableco and have them replace it. So, I would have a vested interest in ensuring that, once again, I power off my DVR when not using it.

It's good that I have a reliable workaround right now, but I do want to fix this issue with the remote. Someone mentioned fiddling with delays, which I had to do the day I got the remote because, with factory settings, there was a huge delay between when I would press buttons on the remote and when they would register on the box. That was resolved by messing with the delays. Plus, I don't think it's a delay issue, because the box does register the power command from the remote and power on. It just freezes once it's on.

What I consider my best, most promising theory is that the Harmony is set up to send an On/Off toggle command to the DVR when turning it on and off. I'm thinking that for some strange reason, since adding the external drive, the DVR isn't happy with this On/Off toggle command and would instead prefer a discreet on when powering on and a discreet off when powering off. This, however, is where the inflexibility of the Harmony software lies. When I attempt to edit my "Watch TV" macro, since it is a "canned" macro that was pretty much autoconfigured by the software, I am limited in my options in editting its properties. Specifically, it says "DVR, TV, A/V Receiver powered on, then perform the following commands......". So I can't edit the dvr/tv/av powering on part. It's static. The only way I can possibly edit this is to create my own "utility" macro, where I specify every command manually. This is a PITA, though, because now, I need to map EVERY SINGLE BUTTON command for this macro. Volume, guide, exit, list, A, B, C, numbers, etc etc. This sucks. But I'll do it tonight.

So in short, my own observations this morning plus the input of forum members have convinced me to find a way to use the Harmony 520 to turn off the DVR when not using it. I don't like my external drive getting thrashed so much while maintaining the Live TV buffer 24/7.

I think you should go back to the default delays and see what happens; the point isn't that it isn't getting the first command but that you are possibly overwhelming it with subsequent commands coming at it too fast and possibly being repeated (depending on how you might have "tailored" the activity).

I don't think what you are saying about being able to send a discreet on/off code vs. a power toggle command is entirely accurate. Without going through it again myself, I do recall at some point (not sure if it was on initial set up of the activity or subsequent modifications, either to the activity or to the device itself) being able to specify exactly which command should be used to turn the unit on or off, not just *after* the "canned" portion.

Take your time to explore all the options available on the Harmony set up page(s). They aren't always intuitive (I could swear they were before Logitech took over), but if you explore all the available options to modify the activity and/or the individual device, I know there is an area where you can specify either power toggle or discreet on/off...I've definitely done this but can't recall offhand exactly which configuration screen I used.

Also, re the live buffer constantly being recorded to the external drive, i don't think that is correct...it may just be that you woke up after the specified time in which drive activity is resumed.

The live buffer can be on either drive, based on space availability.
There is no buffer when on music channels - i.e. no recording or buffering allowed.
You can program the STB to turn off and/or on everyday, and power up to a certain unbuffered channel.
On a macro, you can send a number (like 0) to the STB to turn it on if you don't want to send a power command. There is a setting to say power on with power button only or power and numeric inputs.
I have mine programmed to turn off every night for rest and updates. It then turns on in the early morning set to a music channel (power on to channel). I also set the second tuner to a music channel, so that there is NO buffering happening at all, until I change to a regular channel. Any preset recording still works correctly.

vegggas

I turned "off" my 8300HD at 10:30A and when I returned home at 5:30P I put my ear to the unit. I heard the drive spinning as well as what I'd describe as read/write operations, i.e. the read/write arm was clicking away fairly actively. There were no recordings scheduled for today. I'm not so sure about the internal drive spinning down. I am using Passport 2.2.020.

vegggas - When you're talking about the macros, are those in the STB or in conjunction with a universal remote? Hmm, I'll have to check it out when I get home. I'd assume it be in the Settings>More Settings Area.

pepar - Yes, there's activity even when it's "off", but listen to that activity, then turn it on to a video channel (i.e. not a music or DVR playback channel) and listen. There's a huge difference. I agree in that I don't think it spins down either. Rather, there's just a lot less activity going on when the box is "off" because it's not buffering the Live TV.

I turned "off" my 8300HD at 10:30A and when I returned home at 5:30P I put my ear to the unit. I heard the drive spinning as well as what I'd describe as read/write operations, i.e. the read/write arm was clicking away fairly actively. There were no recordings scheduled for today. I'm not so sure about the internal drive spinning down. I am using Passport 2.2.020.

So is Passport different in this regard (for internal drives)?

Maybe.
--TWC-KC / Passport 1.8.112 / OS 6.14.43sp
--This box will keep the HHD ticking along buffering until it is put on an On-Demand channel or the tuner times out. The [inactive] tuner times out for sure with the box off, maybe with the box on. I think the STB was actually 'turned' off long enough for the [active] tuner to time out on one occasion... I have not tested the Music channels for a while. I vaguely remember recording a bunch of [Subscribe ...] on one of the subscription channels as an earlier test of some of this.

rbienstock sees some slightly different behavior, as his evidently switches tuners when he changes channels. Mine does not act that way consistently, and as far as I can remember (and I will not have the con until my 3 hours of SciFi Friday...) it times out the [inactive] tuner on an inactivity timer. If the [inactive] tuner is timed out, I can switch channels all day watching TV without invoking it from sleep (unless PIP or recordings intervene).

YMMV, since my aspect ratios worked correctly for 1 month in '03, and have been wonky over three boxes (Pioneer, 8000HD, 8300HD) since then so I think there is some customization here...

v/r,
C-F

What I consider my best, most promising theory is that the Harmony is set up to send an On/Off toggle command to the DVR when turning it on and off. I'm thinking that for some strange reason, since adding the external drive, the DVR isn't happy with this On/Off toggle command and would instead prefer a discreet on when powering on and a discreet off when powering off.
The SA boxes only have a power toggle. They do not have discrete on/off codes. So your DVR cannot "prefer" the latter. Some people program macros into their remotes to simulate discrete behavior because that makes their larger macros work better, but the end result is the same to the DVR.

If you want to simulate discrete on/off, I suggest "0, exit" for "on", and "0, power" for "off" (and changing the settings on the DVR to power-on for number keys). This was straightforward with the Harmony, but I don't recall the exact steps.

LB

So is Passport different in this regard (for internal drives)?
Umm gosh, I almost forgot where I am. Everybody else has SARA here. That's probably it; Passport operates differently than SARA.

vegggas - When you're talking about the macros, are those in the STB or in conjunction with a universal remote? Hmm, I'll have to check it out when I get home. I'd assume it be in the Settings>More Settings Area.

pepar - Yes, there's activity even when it's "off", but listen to that activity, then turn it on to a video channel (i.e. not a music or DVR playback channel) and listen. There's a huge difference. I agree in that I don't think it spins down either. Rather, there's just a lot less activity going on when the box is "off" because it's not buffering the Live TV.
Phil, Don't forget to subscribe to the Las Vegas thread in my sig...

I'm talking about the STB, independent of the macros or remotes.
Settings x2:
Timer: Turn Off ~ Choose a time after you go to sleep
Timer: Wake up ~ set to a non recordable channel, such as music before you wake
Viewer: Power On ~ set to a non recordable channel, such as music (covers 2nd tuner to completley stop buffering)
Set: Power-On Keys ~ Power and Numeric - Pressing a channel number will also turn on the STB, if needed for a remote macro, and you don't use the timer wake up features, etc.

For hard drive buffering to completely stop, direct both tuners to the appropriate music channel, using the PIP feature.

vegggas

HDTVfanatic,
The previous post about 1394 usage was for D-VHS recording on 5c devices. The thread where I saw problems was specifically for PC recording issues. I have seen many D-VHS players working with the 8300 on live recordings. If this is a concern specific to D-VHS ONLY compatibility, there should be a thread for D-VHS and the 8300, and NOT connected to the PC recording thread.
I also would not want to hijack this thread for that topic, so I will not post anymore comments in this thread concerning 1394 and 5c compliance.

vegggas

Another sucsess story, if you read my pervious posts I couldn't get the external drive to work without it freezing in play back on Cablevision of NYC in Brooklyn SARA 1.88.15.3.

I followed Veggas' directions to the letter on a second drive same problem.

So I spent the extra bucks and ordered from Weaknees the Maxtor, this is the drive approved by SA right?

So I once more follow to the letter the directions and POW, the STB stops working. When it reboots with the external harddrive I get the "advanced services not available message" and nothing works.

I unplugged everything, left the external drive unpluged, ensured cable in connection had not come loose and did a hard reboot but still got the same message.

Decided to spend the time on HOLD with CV even knowing they are going to say "service call or go to the service center for a new box". They walked me through the same thing I had just did (after 20 min on hold) said "we need to replace the box, we can schedule a service call or you can go to the nearest walk in center".

Knowing that my closet Cablevision Store was open late on Thursdays I said I'll swap the box.

So I get the new box (only 30 minutes on line this time compared to when I swapped the SD box for an HD at over an hour), set it up saw that it got the same version of SARA. I recorded some HD programing so I had a percentage recorded and then once more followed Veggas directions.

Shocking the thing WORKED, I even deleted all the recordings on the STB and tried the record two programs and play back a third and that worked flawlessly as well.

So my long journey, expensive (for using Weaknees and restock fees on the other drive) and losing recordings TWICE (returned box and reformatted box) I now have the extra recording space I have been looking for.

I should have swapped the STB the first time I had trouble, I assume that was the issue from the start. Why would I even think CV would give me working equipment? Learned my lesson and thanks to everyone for the help. Kudos to you Veggas.

forcing consumers to swap boxes is a brute force way of clearing everyone's content I guess :eek:

also a good marketing plan ahead of their rollout of their new dvr model, the one where you don't actually store any content locally but instead store it in their server farm on your own drive/partition.

I hope they don't force that model on everyone, I don't see it as advantageous and think it will likely be problematic.

[EDIT: I should have specified, I was referring to my cable provider, Cablevision of NY]

forcing consumers to swap boxes is a brute force way of clearing everyone's content I guess :eek:
OH god, you *are* cynical; even I wouldn't have thought of that. :)

Thanks vegggas, I have (for now, at least) fixed my problem by telling my Harmony to send 3 commands to the box to power it on: 7, 3, 1. That powers it on and changes it to channel 731 (PBSHD). Then, for powering it off, I just issue it the toggle power command. It seems to be ok with this. The reason I couldn't find how to change the power commands for the STB in the Harmony software was because I was looking to do it under the Activity settings. The whole time, I could have done it in the Device settings. So, my bad. I will finally have time to actually watch TV tonight and this weekend, so that will be the ultimate test. I have tentative high hopes. Oh, and I've subscribed to the Vegas thread. That should be interesting.

ben, you referenced a DVR that stores shows on the cableco's servers instead of our own HDD. Was that sarcasm, is that in the works? That'd be an interesting way to go, but I bet that'll ixnay the external storage solution we're using. Maybe they'll let you pay more to get more storage. Seems like that'd be easy to implement on their end.

ben, you referenced a DVR that stores shows on the cableco's servers instead of our own HDD. Was that sarcasm, is that in the works? That'd be an interesting way to go, but I bet that'll ixnay the external storage solution we're using. Maybe they'll let you pay more to get more storage. Seems like that'd be easy to implement on their end.
There've been all kinds of schemes that have been floated. At first I thought it would be a good idea for cablecos to "lease" subscribers storage space, but that would in essense be conflicting with their - lucrative - VOD service. I mean, like how much could they charge for storage?

...

ben, you referenced a DVR that stores shows on the cableco's servers instead of our own HDD. Was that sarcasm, is that in the works? That'd be an interesting way to go, but I bet that'll ixnay the external storage solution we're using. Maybe they'll let you pay more to get more storage. Seems like that'd be easy to implement on their end.

Yes, sorry, I was referring to plans that my cable company has been cooking up, Cabelvision of NY.

pepar, I don't see how it would be different than their VOD and in fact, do you really think they would actually give you storage space where your show was recorded as opposed to simply putting "bookmarks/pointer" in your file pointing to a single storage area...sounds like VOD :)


Cablevision is supposedly not going to use the multi-room DVRs and instead adopt this alternative model, which I am obviously not a fan of...oh, yes, I am *very* cynical...comes with age I guess.

pepar, I don't see how it would be different than their VOD and in fact, do you really think they would actually give you storage space where your show was recorded as opposed to simply putting "bookmarks/pointer" in your file pointing to a single storage area...sounds like VOD :)
Roger that. It would not be different, and therefore, IMO, will not happen.

Cablevision is supposedly not going to use the multi-room DVRs and instead adopt this alternative model, which I am obviously not a fan of...oh, yes, I am *very* cynical...comes with age I guess.
What model - remote storage?

What model - remote storage?

Yes, store the customer's recorded shows on their storage located at some remote site as opposed to in your own home on a hard drive physically present in your house.

Yes, store the customer's recorded shows on their storage located at some remote site as opposed to in your own home on a hard drive physically present in your house.
I can't see why they'd offer this if they have VOD.

Remote storage is coming as a DVR service for all digital cable users. Any STB, including 3rd party OCAP devices, like next generation TV's, will have DVR capability by using shared storage. You will still have VOD, but can record anything else that you want, and then play it back on any of the devices in your home.

vegggas

Remote storage is coming as a DVR service for all digital cable users. Any STB, including 3rd party OCAP devices, like next generation TV's, will have DVR capability by using shared storage. You will still have VOD, but can record anything else that you want, and then play it back on any of the devices in your home.

vegggas
As this is functionally no different than VOD, why would the cablecos offer it? Surely it would cannibalize VOD sales. As informed as you are on all things cable, I'm from Missouri on this one; I need to be shown.

I live in Oxford, Ma and I also have the SA 8300 HDDVR box and I bought a Maxtor One Touch II 300 gig external HD right around x-mas time and I hooked it up and of course it did nothing :-( so I called Charter Cable and they said that the SATA port was not active as of yet which I have heard clearly is active in my area so they were no help at all. So I read some of the posts here and I got all excited and ordered my Sata cable yesterday and I quickly realized that the Maxtor drive doesn't have a SATA interface it only has USB and Firewire. Does anyone know what my options are? and is there a cable that I can buy to link up the 8300 box and the drive? Thanks a bunch everyone and I have learned everything that I know about the SA8300 ( set up and tweaking) on here because the cable co. is absolutely useless and knows pretty much nothing about their own equipment! Mike D

Thanks vegggas, I have (for now, at least) fixed my problem by telling my Harmony to send 3 commands to the box to power it on: 7, 3, 1. That powers it on and changes it to channel 731 (PBSHD). . .
The SA8300HD has a setting for power-on channel. You can just set it to turn on to 731 and eliminate that command in your Harmony.

I live in Oxford, Ma and I also have the SA 8300 HDDVR box and I bought a Maxtor One Touch II 300 gig external HD right around x-mas time and I hooked it up and of course it did nothing :-( so I called Charter Cable and they said that the SATA port was not active as of yet which I have heard clearly is active in my area so they were no help at all. So I read some of the posts here and I got all excited and ordered my Sata cable yesterday and I quickly realized that the Maxtor drive doesn't have a SATA interface it only has USB and Firewire. Does anyone know what my options are? and is there a cable that I can buy to link up the 8300 box and the drive? Thanks a bunch everyone and I have learned everything that I know about the SA8300 ( set up and tweaking) on here because the cable co. is absolutely useless and knows pretty much nothing about their own equipment! Mike D
Your options, unfortunately, do not include a way to use your One Touch with the 8300HD. :(

Don't say that I paid $275 the drive and I certainly don't need a 300 gig back up HD. I can't take it out of it case and put it in the new case or something?? argh!!

Don't say that I paid $275 the drive and I certainly don't need a 300 gig back up HD. I can't take it out of it case and put it in the new case or something?? argh!!
You might have just hit on something there; if the internal drive is SATA, and there's an excellent chance it is, you could cannibalize it and go the DIY route with a case, power supply and cable to connect it to your 8300HD. Sorry I didn't think of that before. Your warranty, of course, goes out the window when you open the case. Another consideration is that of rotational speed; DVRs like 7200RPM drives with big caches. Check your specs. The follow-up to this is that, if it's only 5400RPM, you may be able to ebay the One Touch and buy the appropriate drive.

Sooo, you do have options, but they are not simple.

As this is functionally no different than VOD, why would the cablecos offer it? Surely it would cannibalize VOD sales. As informed as you are on all things cable, I'm from Missouri on this one; I need to be shown.
DVR recording to remote storage service would be just like the current DVR model, EXCEPT that ANY customer can have the feature with any digital service, and there is no extra hardware needed. This is an added value service that any digital customer can add to their account.
Remote storage will not affect VOD sales, as they are different services. Paid VOD is for PPV and value content, whereas DVR content would be for timeshifted free/ your subscription content. Cableco's can also lease different levels of storage to power customers vs. casual users, like internet service plans. A casual user may get 100GB for $10/ month, and may a power user may get 500GB for $20/ month, or it could be a pay as you need the space. Maybe 1 price up to 100GB, then another as you use more than that. Keep your reserved/used space down, and have lower fees?

vegggas

But vegggas,
1) Would it let the viewer FF past commercials?
2) Would it limit how long you could retain a program?
3) Would it limit how many times you could view a program?

Or has it been defined well-enough to answer these questions?

Also, do different copyright issues come into play when it is the cable company that is recording the program (as the HD is on their premises) vs leased equipment on the customer's premises?

DVR recording to remote storage service would be just like the current DVR model, EXCEPT that ANY customer can have the feature with any digital service, and there is no extra hardware needed. This is an added value service that any digital customer can add to their account.
Remote storage will not affect VOD sales, as they are different services. Paid VOD is for PPV and value content, whereas DVR content would be for timeshifted free/ your subscription content. Cableco's can also lease different levels of storage to power customers vs. casual users, like internet service plans. A casual user may get 100GB for $10/ month, and may a power user may get 500GB for $20/ month, or it could be a pay as you need the space. Maybe 1 price up to 100GB, then another as you use more than that. Keep your reserved/used space down, and have lower fees?

vegggas
Thank you, I'm beginning to see the viability of remote DVR. There is currently a, for want of a better word, tiered release schedule. Movie theatres, VOD/PPV, DVD, premium movie channels and then network TV. There are exceptions; some movies go straight to video while others take forever to be released on DVD. With your scenario, VOD/PPV would still occur before premium movie channels got it and it became available for DVR storage. I'm sure the remote DVR, like our in-house units, would NOT store VOD/PPV content. Pricing, though, will be interesting. For another $7 per month I can rent another 8300HD with 160GB drive. That means they'd have to charge less than $7 per month for 160GB of remote storage.

pepar,
I made up the pricing as an example of what could be used. I have no idea what the pricing would really be. The cool thing could be that you could get "X" amount of storage, but can access it with any digital device/STB in the home, so you wouldn't need a second or third physical DVR.
As for VOD vs. DVR there is no difference to what you do today, except that the external storage is located outside the customers premises. You still hit the list button, or go to the DVR channel to playback recorded shows, and you still use the IPG to record a program. When you want VOD or PPV, that still is done the same way as it is now.

Davehancock,
I know of no defined parameters for remote DVR storage for cable. It makes sense that all parmeters that apply now, should apply to remote storage. No reason not to be able to FF or REW at any time. For the second and third options, those could be revoked at any time on the current DVR's, as well as for remote storage. I would compare the space available for remote storage like the personal storage available with your internet account for webpages, etc.
As for copyright issues, having the storage at the cable company would grant better rights management and greater services available, since it's not open to tampering, etc.

vegggas

question about the VANTEC NST-360SU-BK 3.5" eSATA + USB2.0 Aluminum External Enclosure:

can the hard drive I put in it be SATA 2? or does it have to be SATA 1?

I have a 8300HD with TWC. I just hooked up a Maxtor 300GB SATA HDD to the 8300 and working perfectly. My external HDD case has a fan but is it necessasry for me to leave the hard drive on 24/7? Will this cause wear and tear on the HDD? Is the HDD always running or only when you are recording or watching a recorded program?

Thank you in advance for your response.

I would love to know how to power up the SA8300HD with the channel of my choice. I currently do this with my remote but the "default" from my Adlelphia cable system is for the system to turn on with their public access channel which is the positively the worst show on TV. I did not find any setting in the settings menu for the power on channel. Is there another hidden menu to allow this?

is it necessasry for me to leave the hard drive on 24/7? Will this cause wear and tear on the HDD? Is the HDD always running or only when you are recording or watching a recorded program?These questions have been asked/answered many times in this thread. Yes the HDD must be left on. Wear and tear is minimal. It is always running whatever the usage.

tried mine out this weekend. worked like a charm! thanks for all the tips!


EDIT: by the way, I'm in northern VA

hmmm, it seems i may have been wrong about my cableco, cablevision of ny, moving to remote storage, unless what was said on a recent investor's conference call could be misconstrued...they indicated that they are on the verge of deploying the network dvr...hope this means the multi-room dvr.

i'd prefer that over remote storage.

hmmm, it seems i may have been wrong about my cableco, cablevision of ny, moving to remote storage, unless what was said on a recent investor's conference call could be misconstrued...they indicated that they are on the verge of deploying the network dvr...hope this means the multi-room dvr.

i'd prefer that over remote storage.
I think that is referring to what we know as multi-room DVR.

I bought an external SATA for my SA 8300HD (SARA) last week. The Vantec enclosure with a Maxstor 300GB SATA drive. Installation went fine.

However, 75% of the recordings on the new drive end early. Some after 3 min, some after 17, or other odd numbers. No indication in the entries why (unlike the cancelled by user comments).

Any idea what's going wrong? and what to do to fix it?

Before I put the drive on the SA, I attached it to the PC and formatted it, as well as writing a lot of data to it, to exercise the drive and see if there were any problems. There weren't any.

The SA formatted it when it was attached.

Jim Burks
Collierville, TN
Time Warner Cable
SA 8300 HD

I've been looking at the sale prices and I may get a SATA 2 drive. Will it work in the Vantec enclosure or does that only accept SATA 1? What is the best enclosure for a SATA 2 drive?

"SATA support is currently in QA testing. We can make the code available for head-end testing in a few weeks." - Aptiv Digital to my provider's technical director

I don't know how they would be able to implement this 'remote storage' thing, at least for high def users (such as us).

Basically the system would have to have enough bandwidth to accomodate as many customers as had this service all at the same time, say conservatively 5000 households on a single headend or server. So you would need the bandwidth for 5000 high def channels, not taking into consideration what it would do to my cable modem bandwidth when you factor in the two way communications necessary for such an operation.

I think I would rather have another plethora of high def channels, and I can keep the hard drive(s) at my house, thanks.

Appreciate a quick summary...been away from this thread for a while....I'm on TWC with Passport on SA8300HD...have we had any additional external SATA successes beyond the one initial one reported, and did that one hold up?

OK, I brought my SA 8300 back because it was doing partial recordings on shows. HD shows, and only on the networks during primetime. I got another SA 8300 hooked it back up to my Maxtor and the same thing happened.

I called Maxtor, got an RMA and got a new external hard drive sent to me. I hooked it up Friday evening. Everything recorded fine, until tonight. Cold Case only retained 40 minutes even though I observed the recording light on for a full hour.

10 days prior to getting a new Maxtor Quickview disconnected the SATA drive and had absolutely no missed or partial recordings.

I don't get it. I don't see others having this problem. Why me?

Frankly, I've seen a few others (in various forums) mentioning this problem. Not clear if it is related to ext Drives though. I've had the problem (I've got a 250GB ext drive) too. It seems to me that the problem is reduced after I do a hard boot. Also, I believe I've noted the problem occurs when I am watchng a previously recorded program. I suspect that somehow my erasing the program I just watched is related to the premature stopping of another program being recorded. Fortunately, it does not happen enough to really be able to pin it down.

This problem has flared up from time to time. I had one person tell me that it was related to a certain QAM (a digital cable carrier), but I have seen other statements that it was related to certain networks (Fox, I believe). It also could well be related to some corruption of IPG data.

Some speculation, no answers. Sorry

Frankly, I've seen a few others (in various forums) mentioning this problem. Not clear if it is related to ext Drives though. I've had the problem (I've got a 250GB ext drive) too. It seems to me that the problem is reduced after I do a hard boot. Also, I believe I've noted the problem occurs when I am watchng a previously recorded program. I suspect that somehow my erasing the program I just watched is related to the premature stopping of another program being recorded. Fortunately, it does not happen enough to really be able to pin it down.

This problem has flared up from time to time. I had one person tell me that it was related to a certain QAM (a digital cable carrier), but I have seen other statements that it was related to certain networks (Fox, I believe). It also could well be related to some corruption of IPG data.

Some speculation, no answers. Sorry

In this case I feel I have narrowed it down to some type of problem with the ext drive and my cable system. Note that I actually see the whole program being recorded (recording light is on for entire show) but when I look at the list immediately after the recording it shows only XX amount of time recorded. So it's not that it "stops recording" but that it doesn't retain the entire show.

I do believe this happens when I am watching a recorded show. I can't think of anytime that I am recording in primetime when this doesn't happen.

Another thing that makes me think it's more of a local issue is that it only happens on HD local stations. I've never seen it mess up on HBO or any other HD stations or non HD stations.

It causing my wife to say "why don't we just record SD?" :rolleyes:

She doesn't see the difference anyway.

In this case I feel I have narrowed it down to some type of problem with the ext drive and my cable system. Note that I actually see the whole program being recorded (recording light is on for entire show) but when I look at the list immediately after the recording it shows only XX amount of time recorded. So it's not that it "stops recording" but that it doesn't retain the entire show.


I see similar behavior on TWC Memphis. 8300HD works fine all of the time w/o the external drive. With the external drive connected, 90% of the shows end recording earlier than scheduled.

I have a new Maxstor 300GB SATA drive and the Vantec enclosure others have mentioned as working fine. I also put the drive on the PC, formatted it and wrote a lot of data to it to burn it in with no errors.

I don't get any kind of on-screen error message.

SARA 1.87.*
TWC Mid-South (Memphis Area).

I see similar behavior on TWC Memphis. 8300HD works fine all of the time w/o the external drive. With the external drive connected, 90% of the shows end recording earlier than scheduled.SARA 1.87.*
TWC Mid-South (Memphis Area).

90%? Well, mine is not that bad. Question. Does it actually stop recording or record and only partial data returned. That's the problem with mine, it does a full recording but only partial retention of the recorded show. I also have SARA 1.87.*

Hookbill, are you using the vaunted quickview or a different Maxtor? That'd be pretty disheartening that the one drive that has had 100% success thus far is now failing someone (and you RMA'd it, and it's still happening). Perhaps if you're not using the Quickview, the drive you are using has inadequate specs?? Really, I have no clue, because you already swapped out the box AND the drive, and everything was fine when you disconnected the drive. That's actually similar to my problem that I continue to have...

At seemingly random times, my box will freeze. It stops responding to remote commands or commands issued right at the box. Sometimes, if I wait, it will respond again, but with one key difference: it can't see the external drive. So I always have to reboot it. If this happens when nothing is recording, no harm, no foul, other than I have to get off my ass to reboot the thing. But if something is recording, the recording stops when the box freezes (because it loses connection with the ext. HDD, which it is recording to) and for the ~2 minutes it takes to completely reboot, I am missing my show. So, a lot of my shows have two separate recordings, with a 2 minute gap.

I followed vegggas's detailed instructions on how to "re-pair" the drive and the box, which seems to have curtailed the freezing. It's now happened twice over the past week. Anyone have any ideas?

I'm using the Quickview, have since last July. I've had problems with missed recordings prior to the installation of the Quickview, but they had increased to two or three times a week. Always HD shows, primetime, on the local network feeds.

And since I have seen the whole show record, it doesn't seem to be a recording problem but a distribution problem as only X amount of the show is actually retained for viewing.

Based on emperical user evidence I firmly believe problems with external drive configurations are due to problems with the SARA software and/or 8300HD hardware/firmware.

A SATA drive is a reliable device. Unless the drive is defective it is unlikely to be the source of the problem. It seems to me the external drive "overpowers" the 8300HD and/or SARA software in some way. For example, maybe the SATA delivers data too fast and overflows certain buffers. The SATA interface was designed quite awhile ago; it was probably never tested with the new crop of SATA drives.

Our only hope is that now that more and more people are using the external interface, Scientific Atlanta (Cisco) will address these bugs in a future release. In the mean time, I think you need to get lucky in order to have a working configuration.

I'm using the Quickview, have since last July. I've had problems with missed recordings prior to the installation of the Quickview, but they had increased to two or three times a week. Always HD shows, primetime, on the local network feeds.

And since I have seen the whole show record, it doesn't seem to be a recording problem but a distribution problem as only X amount of the show is actually retained for viewing.
Or, more likely, "available" for viewing. "Retained" implies some was deleted and I can't think of a way that would happen. File corruption - of file access table corruption seems more likely. Regardless, knowing why isn't really moving the ball forward on solving the problem.

Based on emperical user evidence I firmly believe problems with external drive configurations are due to problems with the SARA software and/or 8300HD hardware/firmware.

A SATA drive is a reliable device. Unless the drive is defective it is unlikely to be the source of the problem. It seems to me the external drive "overpowers" the 8300HD and/or SARA software in some way. For example, maybe the SATA delivers data too fast and overflows certain buffers. The SATA interface was designed quite awhile ago; it was probably never tested with the new crop of SATA drives.

Our only hope is that now that more and more people are using the external interface, Scientific Atlanta (Cisco) will address these bugs in a future release. In the mean time, I think you need to get lucky in order to have a working configuration.
You might be on to something with the firmware issues, but I doubt if the drive delivers data too fast. The 8300 SATA host controller controls data I/O and the drive only "gives" data to it as it is "asked for" and is - supposedly - backward compatible.

I use Passport, which is currently without SATA support. That seems about to change, though, and we will may soon be able to single out hardware (8300HD) or firmware/software (SARA/Passport) as the problem.

Or, more likely, "available" for viewing. "Retained" implies some was deleted and I can't think of a way that would happen. File corruption - of file access table corruption seems more likely. Regardless, knowing why isn't really moving the ball forward on solving the problem.

Whether "available, retained" you get what I'm saying. I see a full recording occure, yet the data simply isn't there when I try and view it. Knowing why may help to understand what is causing this issue. But I'm at the point now of understanding it's really not in my control. This is something SA will have to address. Somehow, someway.

Well, I have some additional info (or gas to throw on the flames). After I made my post last I realized that I had experienced this problem just a few minutes earlier:

I was recording the Academy Awards and started to watch it about 10 minutes after the Awards started. I rewound to the beginning and watched from there. I eventually "caught up" (in the first hour) and was watching "live" (or so I thought). Suddenly the picture froze, I hit "Live" and tried to back up a minute or two - it jumped to where the picture Froze and rewound from there. I did not think much about it, but later discovered that the recording had stopped at that point. I was recording nothing else, and the RECORD light was on for the entire program. I had scheduled two other programs to record that night: Crossing Jordan at 10PM, and Roper & Ebert at 11:35. Both recorded fine. My "Freeze" episode occured around 8:30PM. I was not doing anything when the "freeze" occured.

My drive is a 250GB Maxtor SATA w/16MB buffer (not a Quickview) that I have had since April. It usually has been reliable. Our SARA here is 1.87.16.a109. I've only seen this problem since we had this version. I experience it less than 10% of the time. The only other channel that I recall that this has happened on is the "WB HD" (which is on a different QAM than the local ABC HD).

If we put together enough "facts" perhaps we can figure this thing out.

One question: Has there been evidence of this happening with people without external drives. I think I heard about the problem in other forums (ones not dedicated to External Drives), but that does not mean that those people don't have ext drives too.

I was just on the phone with a TWC guy here in Kansas City and he said that I could connect an external SATA drive to increase my overall DVR space. I am about 90% sure I am running the Passport version of the SA 8300. From what I can gather from this thread, the Passport version of the 8300 is NOT compatible with an external SATA drive. Is that correct? I just started looking into this and need some help.

Thanks

I was just on the phone with a TWC guy here in Kansas City and he said that I could connect an external SATA drive to increase my overall DVR space. I am about 90% sure I am running the Passport version of the SA 8300. From what I can gather from this thread, the Passport version of the 8300 is NOT compatible with an external SATA drive. Is that correct? I just started looking into this and need some help.

Thanks
The generally accepted wisdom here is that Passport does not - yet - support the SATA port. I have no idea why your TWC guy said it did; perhaps he has a small amount of knowledge (hmmm, I see an SATA port.) and is dangerous. :)

One question: Has there been evidence of this happening with people without external drives. I think I heard about the problem in other forums (ones not dedicated to External Drives), but that does not mean that those people don't have ext drives too.

I ran my SA 8300 (SARA v 1.87.23.1) for two weeks without having an external hard drive and I had no partial recordings. I wanted to test it before I did an RMA.

I find what you have to say about the freeze up very interesting and a good catch. That could explain why my recording light is still on yet it is not really recording.

Something else to think about: for a few days my cable company upgraded to SARA 1.88.15.3 but do to other problems they were having they went back to 1.87.23.1. During that time I still had the partial recording problem. This was about a month ago.

I had the same thing happen to me last night recording the Acadamy Awards. I've got a seagate 500Gig drive connected through the Vantec eclosure. Anyhow, at some point the image freezed so I tried hitting live, which it did switch to eventually. The pvr said it was still recording but this morning when I checked it had not recorded after that freeze. This was at about 10:00pm.

I'm also very frustrated with the sound and video stutter that happens every once in a while. It seems to occur only on quick cuts from dark to white. This only started after installing the new Ext Drive.

I'm sure going to be annoyed to hell watching a stutter 24 tonight. And it would hurt the geek pride if I had to disconnect the drive.

K.

I'm sure going to be annoyed to hell watching a stutter 24 tonight. And it would hurt the geek pride if I had to disconnect the drive.

K.

Boy, do I relate to that statement! :) I have thought about going to D* but I'm not sure I can get a signal (trees) and I would loose my locals in hd at least for a while. And I understand pq by satellite isn't that great.

So I could just record the network programs on local digital which is available through my cable system. That would insure a recording - but no HD. That would put me in the same position I would be in if I switched to D*.

I was recording the Academy Awards and started to watch it about 10 minutes after the Awards started. I rewound to the beginning and watched from there. I eventually "caught up" (in the first hour) and was watching "live" (or so I thought). Suddenly the picture froze, I hit "Live" and tried to back up a minute or two - it jumped to where the picture Froze and rewound from there. I did not think much about it, but later discovered that the recording had stopped at that point. I was recording nothing else, and the RECORD light was on for the entire program. I had scheduled two other programs to record that night: Crossing Jordan at 10PM, and Roper & Ebert at 11:35. Both recorded fine. My "Freeze" episode occured around 8:30PM. I was not doing anything when the "freeze" occured.



I have experienced this exact issue many times and I have never had an external drive attached to my 8300HD. I'm a customer of Cox in AZ with SARA software (not sure what version). This is the most frustrating experience because if you are behind what you are recording, you can miss out on quite a bit of programming. This has happened to me on several HD feeds (not just FOX or NBC, etc).

Kinda sucks because these issues are keeping me from getting an external drive setup for my DVR.

Drivie

I have experienced this exact issue many times and I have never had an external drive attached to my 8300HD. I'm a customer of Cox in AZ with SARA software (not sure what version). This is the most frustrating experience because if you are behind what you are recording, you can miss out on quite a bit of programming. This has happened to me on several HD feeds (not just FOX or NBC, etc).

Kinda sucks because these issues are keeping me from getting an external drive setup for my DVR.

Drivie

I have found that if you want to watch a program already in progress and being recorded that you should go to the DVR menu, select the recording currently in progress (indicated in red) and then choose play from beginning.

I think I have run into the same issue being described when I simply tuned to the channel/program being recorded and hit the rewind button until it reached the beginning.

Is there any chance someone who's having the external drive recording problem lives close to someone who uses an external drive and is not having the problem? If both parties would be willing to lose the recordings they have on their drives, it would be a very valuable experiment to have the two folks swap external drives for a while to answer the following questions:

1) Did the problem recur after swapping drives?
2) Did the problem follow the hard drive, or stay with the original SA box?

(I live in SE Houston, TX, and have not had problems. It'd be painful to lose my recordings, but I'd be willing to swap with someone in the Houston area who's having trouble, to run this test.)

Is there any chance someone who's having the external drive recording problem lives close to someone who uses an external drive and is not having the problem? If both parties would be willing to lose the recordings they have on their drives, it would be a very valuable experiment to have the two folks swap external drives for a while to answer the following questions:

1) Did the problem recur after swapping drives?
2) Did the problem follow the hard drive, or stay with the original SA box?

(I live in SE Houston, TX, and have not had problems. It'd be painful to lose my recordings, but I'd be willing to swap with someone in the Houston area who's having trouble, to run this test.)

Well, I've already done that in a sense. I pulled my external hd off, tested for 10 days without it being on then received another Maxtor Quickview brand new out of the box as my RMA. So I am seeing this problem on two different External Hard Drives.

Now tonight, just to make things a bit more interesting my SA 8300 decided to do a reboot for God knows what reason at 9:50 pm while I was recording 24 and The Apprentice. I had just turned the unit off about 2 minutes prior to this, so now I have 2 recordings each of 24 and the Apprentice, one 50 minutes long one 8 minutes long.

I'm not blaming the external hard drive for that, that to me is a typical SA type error.

Next up is CSI Miami, and I'm going to bed. Hope that records with no problem.

It (partial recording) has happend on both my 8300 (with Ext HDD) and my 8000 (w/o Ext HDD). It is most llikely to happen if I am watching a delayed program and catch up to the live feed by pressing FF.
I have confirmed that as Hookbill describes, the recording indicator remains lit and says it is recording, but the program (remaining) is not there. I can almost make this happen if I want it to with the above method if the STB has not been rebooted recently.
The problem has ONLY happend on local stations during primetime. In each case, my best educated guess has been a memory problem that disrupted the mpeg stream and failed to continue recording. Those with external drives are MORE likely to see the issue due to the increased memory issues with extended catalog files and header information being stored in ram with the external drive.

vegggas

I have found that if you want to watch a program already in progress and being recorded that you should go to the DVR menu, select the recording currently in progress (indicated in red) and then choose play from beginning.

I think I have run into the same issue being described when I simply tuned to the channel/program being recorded and hit the rewind button until it reached the beginning.Huh? On my box, there's no difference between tuning to the channel being recorded vs. selecting the recording in progress from the DVR menu. Both methods dump you into the program "live", forcing you to manually rewind back to the beginning. (I use SARA v1.87.16.1)

Huh? On my box, there's no difference between tuning to the channel being recorded vs. selecting the recording in progress from the DVR menu. Both methods dump you into the program "live", forcing you to manually rewind back to the beginning. (I use SARA v1.87.16.1)

Same behavior on my 8300HD. Not sure how that makes any difference at all.

Drivie

For various reasons I am currently convinced that this problem (recordings ending prematurely) is related to SW and to IPG data. I believe that having an external drive may relate to the problem, but the problem is not a defective drive.

Ben said: I have found that if you want to watch a program already in progress and being recorded that you should go to the DVR menu, select the recording currently in progress (indicated in red) and then choose play from beginning. In my Academy Awards experience I went to the program from the list as you suggested - and had the problem. Also, other occurances of this problem have happened when I did not look at all at the program being recorded till the program was over.

I probably record 30-40 hrs of programs (mostly in HD) per week, and only have had the problem on network stations (no HBO, or Showtime problems) and also only during prime time hours. I only seem to have the problem once a week or less (usually less).

Hi all; back after some experimentation... for those that replied to my posts previously, my equipment:

Scientific Atlanta 8300
Maxtor 300GB MaxLine III SATA HD Model 7L300S0
(SATA-150, 16MB Cache, 7200RPM)
eSATA to SATA I cable (has 2 different ends)

...I was experiencing freezing / unsynced audio on playbacks. Anyways, I gave up on the enclosure/Maxtor drive and purchased a Maxtor 300GB QuickView.

After extensive testing and massive recording, NO freezing, NO audio sync issues, NO problems at all. Absolutely perfect playback!

The drive removed is now a portable backup unit :D

Mike

I have found that if you want to watch a program already in progress and being recorded that you should go to the DVR menu, select the recording currently in progress (indicated in red) and then choose play from beginning.That would work if everyone were running the same version (likey 1.88.x.x) as you are and had that option. Unfortunately, many are still using 1.87.x.x software and it doesn't have a "Start From Beginnng" option when joining a recording in progress. :)