There's only one problem though, it's for adjusting vertical lines only, for horizontal lines you will have to live with what you have since they can only be adjusted with magnets.

Not sure if anyones tried these convergence tweaks, but i say be my guest and tell me how you do.I have a 34XBR960 and I've worked with both magnets and the service menu.

When I first bought my set, it was in relatively poor shape and I had a Sony factory tech come out to adjust the convergence problems. He used some magnets, and some service menu tweaks, but I wasn't really satisfied when he decided it was "close enough" and "met factory specs".

I called Sony again, and this time got the name of some local authorized service guys, and authorization to have one of them come over for a "second opinion". I was quite lucky to pick someone who was very attentive to perfection and was willing to spend 2 hours on his first visit (before he ran out of magnets) and another hour on his self-initiated second visit (with a fresh supply of magnets) to complete the job. Of course after his magnet work we (and then me alone) worked on the service menu convergence adjustments to optimize things, based on his new magnet placements.

So there really is no way to share the convergence tweaks from one set to another... they are each unique by set, because magnet placement on each set is totally unique. They all come from the factory with assorted magnets already placed by factory techs (during final checkout, I would imagine, to get "close enough" and so that it "meets factory specs"), which will be different for each and every set.

Since the then-needed vertical line convergence tweaks in the service menu (D-CONV group) are really a function of how your set finally turned out based on its magnet placement (yes, magnets must be used to "cure" horizontal line convergence issues but will obviously also affect vertical lines as well), about the only thing that can be said is "to each his own", and "YMMV".

However there's no question the D-CONV group can have significant results improving things, in the vertical line convergence arena. My own tweaks concentrated on D-CONV 0-11, with some minor and some major changes.

All in all I feel the magnet work and D-CONV tweaks to have given me stellar results.

I have a 34XBR960 and I've worked with both magnets and the service menu.

All in all I feel the magnet work and D-CONV tweaks to have given me stellar results.

DSperber - Three questions:

- Did you get the magnet work done under the sony warranty?
- Were your problems only convergence, or did you also have geometry issues?
- I'm also in Marina Del Rey...if you want to share the name of the magnet guy, please PM contact information.

No matter how fast I hit the buttons, it will not let me in. What is your secret to getting in there?

Remember the TV has to OFF before you hit the combination: display, 5, +vol, power on...!

Nice to know i'm not the only one that has made improvements just by using the D-CONVERGANCE settings:)

For me it was the very top and bottom of the picture that needed convergance tweaking a bit since there were obvious color fringes there.After using some of the D-Convergance tweaks the color fringing is gone and it's more sharper now.

Point taken...Use D-Convergance to fix some minor convergance problems, i know they helped me out very well, not perfect but it much more better overall.

- Did you get the magnet work done under the sony warranty?Yes.

The initial factory tech visit (perhaps 1 week after the set was delivered to me) was arranged by Sony. I don't actually know where he came from. Free visit to me.

The second visit, from a local authorized service place, was also free to me. His follow-up visit (because he'd run out of magnets on the first trip) was also free to me, but he simply might not have told Sony and done it on his own because of the incomplete first trip. Very sincere.


- Were your problems only convergence, or did you also have geometry issues?As would be expected, I had both. And of course this makes geometry placement quite an art. A magnet affects not only convergence but the entire electron beam, which means even geometry can be affected (adversely or beneficially) while trying to cure convergence problems.

As it turns out, we were able to use magnets to reduce some of the more gross bow/curvature artifacts along with pincusion and trapezoid problems (especially obvious in the corners of course) and even some S-curves more in the middle of straight lines, working very carefully to not disturb the convergence corrections we had also implemented. As would be expected, the results were not absolutely 100% perfect, and some compromises (from me, really) were necessary. But outside of the test patterns where you can really see the problems and effects of the magnets, most actual live HDTV content looks perfect.

So once the magnet work was complete and we didn't want to fool with it anymore for fear of tampering with "success", I proceeded to work (on my own) with the full set of 2170D-1 and 2170D-2 groups, moving little-by-little all around the screen and trying to get "rectangularity" and "linearity" where previously I might have seen distortions. I am extremely pleased with my final results.

Just recently, in response to the Oct.1 premiere of "Saturday Night Live" in HD and the misplacement of the upconverted SD bug, I became aware that I also had misadjusted my overscan. I think I must have done this using a DVD-provided test image at 480p (from Digital Video Essentials) and INPUT5 on the set. Whatever the explanation, it was clearly off as the misplaced NBC bug was 50% cut off, partially because of their misplacement and partially because of my wrong overscan adjustment.

So last week I worked on re-sizing and re-centering, and reducing horizontal and vertical overscan. This time I connected my XBR960 to my PC (DVI output of ATI Radeon 9800 Pro to component video INPUT6 of the TV via ATI adapter, running at 1080i resolution using ATI 5.8 Catalyst drivers) and used a 1920x1080 convergence/overscan test pattern from DisplayMate for Windows Video Edition (attached to this post). Preliminary adjustments were entirely in the 2170D-1 (0-1, for vertical position and size of the raster) and 2170D-2 (1-2, for horizontal position and size of the raster) groups, followed by overscan adjustments within the now adjusted raster using MID3 (0-3, for horizontal and vertical position and size). I'm quite surprised at how much better things now look, and how much broadcast content I was previously losing before this recent tuning effort.

Much to my surprise, some previous residual geometry and linearity distortions around the extreme perimiter of the screen (which I never could quite tweak out) now seem to have been greatly reduced. To my eye, permiter lines and corners seem much more linear and rectangular than before. Perhaps I was previously "stretching" things unnaturally and now, with proper re-sizing and re-centering and much reduced overscan, things are being displayed with proper proportions and H/V dimension ratios, and thus appear much more linear.

Whatever the explanation, adjusting size/center and overscan using 2170D-1 (0-1), 2170D-2 (1-2), and finally MID3 (0-3) has seemingly had a positive effect on geometry and lineary as well, but that may be partially optical illusion since everything is just a tiny bit smaller now (with reduced overscan, more picture is now being displayed in the same 16x9 34" screen area).

NOTE: I think a real test of your adjustments is on ESPN-HD, when they're showing 4x3 content and have those gray vertical areas on the left and right to fill out the 16x9. The gray areas are striped, with thin black stripes against the gray background. And they're supposed to be truly vertical stripes, and black. Depending on your convergence settings and other geometry/linearity settings, anything not perfect will be quite visible in these two gray areas. On my set, the black stripes left side were initially way out (and almost rainbow-like) while the stripes on the right side were virtually pure black. Now, they're both very very similar (although the left side black stripes are not quite pure black as the right side stripes still are, but they're very very close and at least they're not chromatic and rainbow any longer). I think this content is the real proof of your overall convergence tuning and geometry tuning, whether by magnets or service menu tweaks. I know I always fall back to it as my "real world" test.


- I'm also in Marina Del Rey...if you want to share the name of the magnet guy, please PM contact information.No need for secrecy or privacy. The guy deserves some promotion.

Ask for Andy, at Audio Video Shoppe (on Teale St. in Culver City). 310-306-4600. They're authorized service providers for lots of brands, including Sony.

Ask for Andy, at Audio Video Shoppe (on Teale St. in Culver City). 310-306-4600. They're authorized service providers for lots of brands, including Sony.

Thanks for the info, good people should always be shared and promoted...!

You are not the only one falling back to the ESPN side bars. I recieve my HD signal through Comcasts Motorola 6412 DVR. So I also use the Saturday morning test signal from INHD and I always test my 480i signal against the NBC Weather Plus channel.

But since i discovered the Sony QM menu I mostly use these test patterns for my geometry adventures.

Is there a black level adjustment for both s-video and composite? It seems UBOF is the same for video1-4, and i would like to tweak the black level for both composite and s-video since they both have different black levels.

Is there any items other than UBOF,SBRT ?

The reason being is because if i tweak composite perfectly, then s-video is to dark..so when i brighten up s-video to get it perfect then composite video get's messed up and smokey.

Is there an adjsutment to adjust these two items seperately? or do i just have to make a compromise?

Remember the TV has to OFF before you hit the combination: display, 5, +vol, power on...!



Right! Tv is off, I am hitting these buttons...nothing. I am not 80 and have shaking hands either, I am 34 and can still score 750,000 points in a game of Robotron. I think you guys are all just crazy :)

This button combination does not work on my 30xs955. Are you hitting them all at once or sequentially?

Right! Tv is off, I am hitting these buttons...nothing. I am not 80 and have shaking hands either, I am 34 and can still score 750,000 points in a game of Robotron. I think you guys are all just crazy :)

This button combination does not work on my 30xs955. Are you hitting them all at once or sequentially?

This is a hard one to explain, but...!

On my remote, I do the following:

- Power Off
In a "flowing" succession I push
- Display (round button, buttom right)
- 5 (the number 5 buttom)
- +Vol (the upper part of the volume button)
- Power On

When the TV comes on you will see 3-4 lines of codes and numbers on top of the normal TV picture.

Hi DSperber,

Can you please explain in more detail how to adjust horiz and vert size/pos with the 2170D-1, 2170D-2, and MID3 settings for overscan. I have always used only the 2170D ones (left MID3 as is) - no wonder why I can't get things exactly right! I don't have a PC attached to the TV but I can use a Denon DVD player playing VE/AVIA that outputs 480p/720p/1080i via DVI or HDMI.

BTW I have the 30XBR910

thanks!

Joe




So last week I worked on re-sizing and re-centering, and reducing horizontal and vertical overscan. This time I connected my XBR960 to my PC (DVI output of ATI Radeon 9800 Pro to component video INPUT6 of the TV via ATI adapter, running at 1080i resolution using ATI 5.8 Catalyst drivers) and used a 1920x1080 convergence/overscan test pattern from DisplayMate for Windows Video Edition (attached to this post). Preliminary adjustments were entirely in the 2170D-1 (0-1, for vertical position and size of the raster) and 2170D-2 (1-2, for horizontal position and size of the raster) groups, followed by overscan adjustments within the now adjusted raster using MID3 (0-3, for horizontal and vertical position and size). I'm quite surprised at how much better things now look, and how much broadcast content I was previously losing before this recent tuning effort.

Much to my surprise, some previous residual geometry and linearity distortions around the extreme perimiter of the screen (which I never could quite tweak out) now seem to have been greatly reduced. To my eye, permiter lines and corners seem much more linear and rectangular than before. Perhaps I was previously "stretching" things unnaturally and now, with proper re-sizing and re-centering and much reduced overscan, things are being displayed with proper proportions and H/V dimension ratios, and thus appear much more linear.

Whatever the explanation, adjusting size/center and overscan using 2170D-1 (0-1), 2170D-2 (1-2), and finally MID3 (0-3) has seemingly had a positive effect on geometry and lineary as well, but that may be partially optical illusion since everything is just a tiny bit smaller now (with reduced overscan, more picture is now being displayed in the same 16x9 34" screen area).

Can you please explain in more detail how to adjust horiz and vert size/pos with the 2170D-1, 2170D-2, and MID3 settings for overscan.Well, first I believe there are separate memories for 480p/720p/1080i (I may be wrong here), or else there are just separate memories for INPUT5 and INPUT6. One way or the other, I show different service menu values when I adjust with a test pattern from DVE (480p on INPUT5) vs. when I adjust with a test pattern from my PC (DMWVE overscan test image, 1080i on INPUT6). However whatever the actual settings are, the general tweaking approach is the same.

(1) Using DVE, I went to Title 12 (Display Setup Patterns) and then Chapter 17 (1:33 overscan pattern). On my 34XBR960 the test pattern will display automatically in FULL mode (i.e. 16x9), although I can use the MODE button to get it back to 4:3 if I wanted to (but I don't). So now I'm looking at that pattern in 16x9. It has extreme edges, as well as interior rectangles and gradation markings reflecting the various percentages of overscan.

The following recipe will probably require several iterations, going back through 2170D-1, 2170D-2 and MID3 until you're totally satisfied. So don't just stop with your first try. Also, you will want to verify that you have proper alignment on all of your inputs... since it appears there are separate memories for each.

Don't forget to write down your current settings for each input before you start.

(2) Power the TV off, and then enter service mode (Display, 5, Volume +, Power). Then press 2 repeatedly until you get to the 2170D-1 group for vertical alignment. Use 5 to go back if you "overshoot" the group.

Once in 2170D-1 I used only 0 (VPOS vertical position) and 1 (VSIZ vertical size) to adjust vertically, using 1/4 buttons to go back and forth between 0 and 1, and using 3/6 buttons to adjust that item up or down.

To sense the effect of each 3/6 tweak, push the key just one unit at a time and watch what happens on the screen. It will be obvious what you're changing, and when you've reached (or exceeded) where you should probably be.

When you're satisfied that you have centered and sized vertically (using the gradations and overscan percentage rectangles as your general guide), move on.

(3) Press 2 to move into 2170D-2, where I used only 1 (HPOS horizontal position) and 2 (HSIZ horizontal size), again using 1/4 buttons to go back and forth between 1 and 2, and using 3/6 buttons to adjust that item up or down.

Again, try your best to get the best (or expected) amount of size and centering in the horizontal direction. You may want to go back to 2170D-1 and fool around some more with vertical arrangement.

Again, use 3/6 one unit at a time and watch what happens on the screen. Even though you haven't gotten to MID3 yet, you can still sense when what you currently have is optimal or not.

(4) When satisfied that you have the vertical and horizontal size and centering done acceptably (for now, anyway), press 2 repeatedly until you get to MID3.

The adjustments with 2170D-1 and 2170D-2 are conceptually the "raster" (i.e. the "canvas"), which is sort of the background upon which the actual image will then be displayed... located on your physical screen according to your VPOS, VSIZ, HPOS and HSIZ settings.

Then, the "image" dimensions and position (on top of the "canvas") is what is controlled by MID3. So in a sense, you can have a larger background than an actual image on top of that background, and the image can be moved around and resized on top of the background using the MID3 controls.

That's why you try to maximize/optimize the "background raster" with 2170D-1 and 2170D-2, in anticipation of properly sizing and placing the "image" on top of it using MID3. Obviously you want to end up with the image size and canvas size the same, which would make the image extend out to the edges of the screen just like the conceptual raster background underneath it. This maximizes the amount of image you see, wasting nothing of your 16x9 screen real estate.

I don't know why Sony decided to implement this whole thing as "layers" (a la Photoshop) but they did. So you just have to go through this 2-step process of first spreading out the canvas to fill your screen, and then spreading out the image on top of the canvas to also fill the screen. What's up to you to control is just how much overscan you impute through your settings, meaning how much of the perimiter image you are willing to lose.

Once at MID3, you use 0 (VDHP horizontal position), 1 (VDHS horizontal size), 2 (VDVE vertical position) and 3 (VDVS vertical size) to manipulate the "image" on top of the "background" (i.e. within the "background raster"). Again, use 3/6 buttons to adjust one unit at a time up or down and watch what happens on the screen. It will be obvious what you're doing and what effect you're having.

Try to adjust things so that you have maximum amount of screen real estate covered, with symmetrical alignment of the 5% overscan rectangle a bit inside the extreme perimiter of the screen... depending on your likes. I suppose you can align things so that you have essentially 0% overscan (where the extreme outside of the test pattern rectangle is uniformly visible around the edges of the screen) but that may let in some video noise depending on what you're watching. It's more likely to see that video noise when a channel broadcasts 4x3 content inside their 16x9 digital presentation (e.g. "Curb Your Enthusiasm" on HBOHD).

In other words, shooting for approximately 1-3% overscan is probably a good idea, and will keep you from screaming at the set when you see video noise. Better not to deal with that.

(5) Once you get used to what you're doing with MID3 and the image stretching, sliding, etc., you can go back to 2170D-1 and 2170D-2 to see if you can perfect things a bit more. And then of course you'll come back to MID3 and tweak again.

This is a delicate process, but you will clearly see what you're accomplishing as you use 3/6 one unit at a time in either direction. It will be very obvious that you're either helping things or hurting things.

(6) Again, I recommend doing this for each of your inputs (INPUT5 and INPUT6 in my case, as I use INPUT5 for DVD/480p and INPUT6 for HD/720p/1080i), at least to determine where the separate memories are... are they by input, or by resolution? Based on my experience there definitely are separate memories for my 1080i (PC, INPUT6) and 480p (DVD, INPUT5) efforts.

(7) Finally, although you can tweak your heart out with a test pattern, you still want to double-check what you've done with realworld content that you're familiar with. For example, the Leno show is excellent as a test because it's wonderful picture quality and essentially a stationary image very night. Also, you might want to look at other film-based high quality shows (e.g. CSI, original, Lost, Rome) to be sure that the HxW proportions of your adusted image looks correct. Images that have the wrong H or W proportions will look squashed or stretched in the horizontal or vertical directions, and people's faces are good tests of that. Going to 0% overscan on a small screen might make the images look too small, whereas going up to 3% might be just enough "enlargement" to make things look more appealing. Of course if you've used your test patterns properly the realworld test should be just fine.

Hope this helps.

(6) Again, I recommend doing this for each of your inputs (INPUT5 and INPUT6 in my case, as I use INPUT5 for DVD/480p and INPUT6 for HD/720p/1080i), at least to determine where the separate memories are... are they by input, or by resolution? Based on my experience there definitely are separate memories for my 1080i (PC, INPUT6) and 480p (DVD, INPUT5) efforts.

Excellent explanation. Since you are not mentioning 480i, I just want to add that 480i viewed through the tuner has to be corrected using MID2, 0-3

There are so many different size settings to use in the service menu that I'm convinced that they are a sign of "patching" and adding to older versions, rather than planning for a specific model.

I still have no idea how and when to use the global size settings in MID1, 0-3 and the half global settings of MID1, 8-11.

Hi DSperber,

Thanks for a wonderful explanation of this process! I will try this on my set ASAP. I have to order DVE (I just have VE and AVIA). As for separate memories for MID3, there are but I have to check the service manual. I think that most of the 2170D-1 and 2170D-2 settings are global - but I will check to make sure.


thanks,

Joe

Hi DSperber,

Just thought of this - since KenTech posted so many great tutorials (15 I believe) in this thread, it would be a great idea to add a few more -

(1) Geometry/overscan witht he 2170D-1 and 2170D-2 groups and
(2) adjusting vertical convergence with the D-CONV group.

I know that geometry adjustments are very tricky and I am sure there is a preferred method for this. The hardest for me is where should I start since they all interact with each other. A recommended procedure for this would be a great benefit!

Same with D-conv group for vertical convergence, but obviously horizontal convergence would be outside of the scope of this forum because you need to use the permalloy magnets.

It would be wonderful if you can explain these 2 processes.

thanks,

Joe

When viewing widescreen movies that have top and bottom borders, the left top curves downward, and the bottom left curves upward.

However my right side is straight. Is there a setting to help adjust this? I could not find anything.

Thanks.

Believe it or not them D-Convergance tweaks helped my set a lot, i never used them untill now.Now in 4:3 mode there is'nt color fringing near the black borders nice:)

When viewing widescreen movies that have top and bottom borders, the left top curves downward, and the bottom left curves upward.

However my right side is straight. Is there a setting to help adjust this? I could not find anything.

Thanks.


2170D-1, 9 HTPZ (H-Trapezoid)

If you cannot get rid of all af the curve, you need need to check your centering of the raster.

I have a 30xs955 and after lots of playing and reading, I've come up with very similar procedures for sizing/centering as recently described. I have a few comments and questions.

1) I have found that setting equal overscan on all sides does not necessarily give the right proportions and one must use a test pattern such as on DVE with a perfect circle and make sure it's vertical and horizontal size is identical. This does not seem to give equal vertical and horizontal overscan on my set. Any thoughts on this one?

2) I have also found that centering based on a center point on the screen does not necessarily perfected center the edges of the screen. What have others been using to center?

3) I have found that HSIZE is a global setting and hence must be used to correctly size the raster for a correct 4:3 width on a 16x9 set. I just did the math based on the height of the screen. How have others been doing this?

Hello all,

I have read this entire thread and feel like I am ready to dive into some image tweaking! My set is a Sony KV32HS500 that has a memory stick slot. I downloaded KenTech's images and put them on a memory stick that I have and the TV does not see the images at all. They have been placed into a folder named DCIM at the root level of the MS. I also put a photo from a digital sony camera in there as well and I can see the small image, but I can not display the full screen image on the TV. What am I doing wrong? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.


Cloner

I have a 30xs955 and after lots of playing and reading, I've come up with very similar procedures for sizing/centering as recently described. I have a few comments and questions.

1) I have found that setting equal overscan on all sides does not necessarily give the right proportions and one must use a test pattern such as on DVE with a perfect circle and make sure it's vertical and horizontal size is identical. This does not seem to give equal vertical and horizontal overscan on my set. Any thoughts on this one?

2) I have also found that centering based on a center point on the screen does not necessarily perfected center the edges of the screen. What have others been using to center?

3) I have found that HSIZE is a global setting and hence must be used to correctly size the raster for a correct 4:3 width on a 16x9 set. I just did the math based on the height of the screen. How have others been doing this?

- I start by setting all MID1, MID2 and MID3 size menues to their default settings.
- Then I do the raster centering like described in service manual 2-8.
- Then the 2170D-1 and 2 settings.
- Ending with the MID2 and MID3 fine tuning.

If the MID settings are not set to default you might not be able to get correct proportions in the 2170D menues. I suspect that this is be because the size settings in 2170D1 and 2 works from the center out, whereas the MID settings works from the top and side.

Hello all,

I have read this entire thread and feel like I am ready to dive into some image tweaking! My set is a Sony KV32HS500 that has a memory stick slot. I downloaded KenTech's images and put them on a memory stick that I have and the TV does not see the images at all. They have been placed into a folder named DCIM at the root level of the MS. I also put a photo from a digital sony camera in there as well and I can see the small image, but I can not display the full screen image on the TV. What am I doing wrong? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.


Cloner

You must create a subfolder within the root DCIM folder called 100MSDCF. Place all your images inside this subfolder. This should solve your problem.

You must create a subfolder within the root DCIM folder called 100MSDCF. Place all your images inside this subfolder. This should solve your problem.


Thanks for the reply. I did that when I got home. I am only able to display a photo taken with the camera. None of the jpg images will display. I get an file error on the TV screen. I am trying a few things using photoshop and see what happens. If you think of anything else, please let me know!!!


cloner

geometry code for kv-29x2b.

So has anybody tried adjusting the yoke or magnets at all yet? I have an issue with my 36HS20 where horizontal lines slope slightly downwards on the left side of the screen which I've tried and failed to fix in service mode. If it's reasonable to make some manual adjustments though, I'd be up for it.

Jonathan

XS955:XBR960 Service Data.pdf is broken....

can some one please fix it or let me know where I can find it?

Been trying to cal the greyscale on my HS420 set (see the whole story on the AVS cal forum).

Basically, what I'm finding is there is a lot of cross color contamination from both the RF & CV/YC inputs !!
The color slider is just a gain control but all the other offsets + leakage cause both the greyscale & general color palette to move around quite a bit.

From the measurement I took with Sencore colorimeter (older CP288), as you turn up the color slider there is about an 8-10% reduction in red & 10-15% reduction in blue. the componet input also has this issue (about5% red/10% blue).
The component is probably better since it does not have any of the leakage issues with the tuner or Cv/YC inputs ??

There are some posts on similar issues a few months back on this forum between KenTech and GlenC (ISF guy) but no one ever resolved the issues.

Is there a better way to cal the D65 greyscale and then color decoder or is it just best to get it close and do the rest by eye ??

Todd

03 - COLOR CALIBRATION AND BLACK LEVEL

(snip)

Go to code-group 2170P-1. Leave red settings alone. Look out the window at those clouds. Look back at the TV, and set #7-GDRV (green) and #8-BDRV (blue) until the whites are *white* to your eyes. Go between the outdoor view and the TV (big brightness difference, unfortunately) until you get it right. Cycle among your TV channels for different material to verify you're getting it right. Unless you have a color-perception problem, your eyes don't lie: if it looks white, it is white. The clouds “calibrate” your eyes for a short time.

Now sit in front of the TV, and adjust #10-GCUT (green) and #11-BCUT (blue) until the darkest areas *match* the color of those whites. There is some interaction here, so twiddle until you think you've got it: a really good B/W picture with very few off-color areas. Note that too-bright white areas may develop pinkish or greenish casts from heating of the CRTs aperture-grille wires - a drawback to the big tubes. Lower the Picture setting if that's the case. You should be able to get a B/W display that maintains consistent color from shadows thru highlights.

Howdy folks. Bit late to the party here! I bought my humble 30hs420 in February, before this wonderful thread, when info was a bit more hazy. An enormous thanks to Ken for his power-to-the-people Sony hacking, and Glen for his pro perspective.

Anyway, I've been tweaking since I bought the set, here and there. I understand how important accurate grayscale is before getting into color, and that's why the above section of Ken's 3rd article (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5497452&&#post5497452) is something I want to do right. I tried this method out today and already have a much more appealing picture, but I'll be honest, I really had to ballpark it, and I'd like to do better. I'm talking about the second paragraph, where you try to tune your grays to be neutral in color. Using GCUT and BCUT, I can only clearly tell I've gone too far in one direction when it becomes quite pronounced (kind of sepia with BCUT too low, for example, or magenta on GCUT). There's a large area within each parameter where I am simply unsure if my grays are being tinted or not.

Given that I've seen today what even a rough calibration in this area can do to pop life into the picture, I would very much appreciate some help in getting these GCUT and BCUT settings as good as they can be. How do you all judge your grays with this tweak?

I'm mostly using a pattern from DVE with two sets of gray swatches that run in opposite directions across the screen. I forget the title/chapter number. I have the color set to zero as suggested by Ken.

(I did have great success today with the focus adjustments listed near the beginning of the thread. It was nice to finally have those SM settings explained.)

I have a small problem with the 720p and 1080i modes on a 32hs420 (on the HDMI interface). The 16:9 Enhanced mode (v-compression) automatically kicks in when using these, and I can't disable it using the normal menu (it only has Auto and On).

I'm using an Oppo upconverting DVD player, and this becomes an issue on 4:3 DVD's. Is there any way to disabling this automatic v-compression from the service menu?

Thanks!
Costi

Here's a newbie question for everyone: what is "landing?" I'm having the magnetic discoloration problem that at least one other person has mentioned in this thread. It's a small patch in the upper right hand corner. I've tried different positions of the TV and the surrounding components, but the current splotch is the best I've been able to get. However, pumping up the landing gets rid of it. The problem is I don't know what that does, and I don't want to hurt my set unintentionally.

So what is it? The default settings in the service menu are:
LT - 197
LB - 197
RT - 91
RB - 92

When I increase the RT landing to 168-ish, the splotch disappears. Please tell me what I'm doing.

Landing? Anyone?

Much like Cloner's post above, I can't get the calibration JPEGs to display on my screen because the TV just spits out "File Error."

Oddly, when plugged into my Sony PSP, they display perfectly. Perhaps some models are itchy about pictures not taken by a camera? I have a non-Sony camera but got pictures I took to appear on the screen by following the naming convention. Didn't have any similar success here.

Model is KV-34HS510, for the record.

EDITED: According to a Google search, running the graphics through this program (http://www.david-taylor.myby.co.uk/software/imaging.html#TVwriter ) should make them more compatable with the TV's memory stick reader. They just have to follow the Sony camera settings.

Landing? Anyone?
I only note that this guy (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5016136&&#post5016136) had similar success with the LANDING settings.

I checked some of my service menu docs. The Sony service manuals I have do not explain what LANDING is, but one of the many circulated user-written tables lists your four LANDING numbers as "LCC Controls" for each corner (RT=right top, LB=left bottom etc). I don't know what LCC means, but it might put you one step farther along the path, Justin.

Thanks for the link. I had seen that post, but his "Try at your own risk" warnings scared me off, which is why I was looking for clarification on what landing actually does. I was also curious as to whether the settings needed to be balanced for each side of the screen (i.e. should I set the bottom right to the same number as the top right?).

Still, he didn't write back in to say "Holy God, my TV exploded!" so if no one can provide any additional info, I may just cross my fingers and give it a shot.

Indeed, 4:3 DVD's are a problem. You can set the Oppo in Wide/SQZ mode and then use the TV's zoom, but the proportions are still not accurate and image quality takes a large hit.

One solution here would be to forget upscaling and use 480p, where v-compression is not automatically enabled. But the 480p doesn't work - the image keeps jumping up and down. Component out is useless too, unless you can live with interlaced 480. I've also seen a post by another Sony owner that had the same problem. Oppo + Sony HS TV doesn't seem to work so well, unfortunately ... Oppo tech support was very friendly and willing to help, but they did not know how to fix it. They sent a note to their engineering department. No news since then.

I was hoping I could find some setting in the service menu to turn off the v-comp, but no luck so far.

I'll probably return the Oppo. Although it has better image quality than my old DVD player, the Sony 480p issue and the extensive macroblocking I get from the Faroudja processor make it hard to live with.

I ordered a Sony DVPNS70H from CircuitCity to see how it compares (it arrives tomorrow). Maybe it will do better...

Hopefully you won't have the same issue :) (I really don't know if it is a problem for all HS Sony TV's).

Jim,

The links still work for me. I just clicked the "service data chart" attachment and it came right up. Have you got something that can read .pdf files?

A quick note: I got the Sony DVPNS70H and hooked it to the 32HS420. I don't have a HDMI-HDMI cable yet, so I used the 480p component output (no upscaling). The image quality is significantly better than the Oppo at 720p over HDMI! It has a significant ... wow factor. I'm curious to see if 70H's 720p will actually improve on that. It would be quite a feat.

From what I see, there's almost no macroblocking, and the image is visibly sharper. I will miss the Divx and the slightly more natural Faroudja colors of the Oppo, but the Sony 70H is a keeper.

It would still be nice to know how to disable that HS420 auto v-comp though. Calling Sony's tech support was a big waste of time ...

A quick note: I got the Sony DVPNS70H and hooked it to the 32HS420. The image quality is significantly better than the Oppo at 720p over HDMI! I'm curious to see if 70H's 720p will actually improve on that.
CRTs are incapapable of 720p. I believe they'd "upscale" 720p to 1080i.

CRTs are incapapable of 720p. I believe they'd "upscale" 720p to 1080i.

That is news to me...!
What are you basing your conclusions on? I have different settings for 480i, 480p, 720p and 1080i in the service menu for my CRT-34XBR960.

As far as I know you cannot disable the 16:9 vertical compression on the 4:3 sets for 720p and 1080i sources. The assumption is if it's 720p or 1080i, it is a 16:9 image. You will have to set your player to output no more than 480p for 4:3 sources.

That is news to me...!
What are you basing your conclusions on? I have different settings for 480i, 480p, 720p and 1080i in the service menu for my CRT-34XBR960.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=489948&highlight=720p

Does anyone know if there are internal test pattens in the HS series or are they only in the XBR series?

First off, great guide - used it to tweak my system to the point that when I had a pro come and correct my color, that was the only thing that was off (and not by much...the clouds do work).

Anyway, need some help on a question I couldn't find an answer to. On my set, when I'm running my PS2 through component input 5 I'm getting color distortion only the edges of the screen, similar to what I'd see if I had speakers next to the set. However, the only speakers are the ones in the TV itself (external speakers are wall mounted several feet away) and I only notice it when using that input. When the ps2 is in 16:9, 480p it's very noticeable, when in 4:3 the only thing I notice are the edges of the screen are slightly lighter than the center. On all my other inputs I don't have this distortion, except on 1080I the extreme upper right corner has a small amount of pink tint when on an all white background.

So, I guess my question is, how do I go about correcting this? As it's only in one mode I'm assuming it's not the internal speakers, but I don't want to change anything that will throw off my color/greyscale now that I've paid to have it set. I'm assuming the are SM codes, but I'm not sure which ones. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Hello, I'm new here. Well, to an extent. I am what people refer to as a "lurker."

Question: on my 30xs955, my colors are off. Faces appear to have a purplish tint, especially in the lips. Do any people here have similar experiences, and if so, were they remedied by tinkering in the service menu? I am guessing that this is likely a problem associated with the red or green levels, but am just wondering, before I start adjusting things, if this is what people more technically inclined than myself would do. I'm grateful for any replies.

Question: on my 30xs955, my colors are off. Faces appear to have a purplish tint, especially in the lips. Do any people here have similar experiences, and if so, were they remedied by tinkering in the service menu? I am guessing that this is likely a problem associated with the red or green levels, but am just wondering, before I start adjusting things, if this is what people more technically inclined than myself would do. I'm grateful for any replies.

Have you tried simply tweaking the Hue slider?

Also, make sure it's happening on every input before you go altering the service settings; I have a cheapo secondary DVD player that puts out dreadful colors in prog scan mode. Calibration was very confusing until I realized this was the case! I now use my better quality Tosh DVD player to calibrate only.

After both of those points, if you still think the color on your TV is just plain wrong, I'd suggest tweaking the color decoder in the service menu. These are items RYR, RYB, GYR and GYB under the 2170p-4 heading in your service menu. Search these forums and elsewhere for "RYR" and you'll get better info than I can give. I've done this calibration in conjunction with DVE dozens of times and it's nothing to be scared of. Also look up RGBS, a service menu item for selectively disabling the color guns that makes this process much easier.

I am very much an amateur tweaker. Apologies to the pros if I've made the wrong assumption here. :)

Thanks for the suggestions, Ayton.

FYI, it's happening with over the air HDTV, and I have tried sliding the hue around.

I'll give your suggestions a try.

[B]I own a Sony KF-50XBR800. I also have a service manual for it. I notice there are several service code settings above the printed codes in the manual. I have corrected a problem I had by changing the value of POS CTL to recenter the main menu Image Revision setting. That works great now. However, I some how or another turned off the picture frame in twin view. While I can still switch between pics, I have no (blue) frame. Does anyone know which code I need to turn it bac k on?

I have a 30xs955 and i have noticed a slight shift to the right on most things that are displayed. (horizontal alignment) Its very obvious with the THX test patterns on some of the DVDs i own, and also during sports when they have a scoreline up. Also After using the memory stick and Patterns posted here (namely the 16x9 dot pattern) it looks like the convergence is off in the lower right. What are the service menu options to fix these things.. I DO NOT want to mess with stuff just for the heck of it.. i want to fix only what i notice and leave the rest alone. I cant afford to screw this tv up. Also, does anyone know if sony's warrenty will cover In home, professional calibration? Thanks!

Dr.

I have a 30xs955 and i have noticed a slight shift to the right on most things that are displayed. (horizontal alignment) Its very obvious with the THX test patterns on some of the DVDs i own, and also during sports when they have a scoreline up. Also After using the Patterns posted here (namwly the 16x9 dot pattern it looks like the convergence is off in the lower right. What are the service menu options to fix these things.. I DO NOT want to mess with stuff just for the heck of it.. i want to fix only what i notice and leave the rest alone. I cant afford to screw this tv up. Also, does anyone know if sony's warrenty will cover In home, professional calibration? Thanks!

Dr.

First you need to determine if it is all inputs that are shifted to the right...

As always - write down existing settings before changing.

1) If all - The global centering entry for all inputs is 2170D-2, 0, HCNT. This controls the "default" raster, or frame. that your TV is displaying the picture on. If by adjusting to the left you run out of sync, in the right hand side, adjust back to the original setting, and use the global 2170D-2, 1, HPOS setting instead.
2) If 480i - The entry is MID2, 0, DRHP.
3) If all others - The entry is MID33, 0, VDHP. You have to adjust this setting for all the inputs, different than 480i.

The convergence setting for the lower right is D-CONV, 4, RUBW.

No, Sony will not pay for a professional calibration.

First you need to determine if it is all inputs that are shifted to the right...

As always - write down existing settings before changing.

1) If all - The global centering entry for all inputs is 2170D-2, 0, HCNT. This controls the "default" raster, or frame. that your TV is displaying the picture on. If by adjusting to the left you run out of sync, in the right hand side, adjust back to the original setting, and use the global 2170D-2, 1, HPOS setting instead.
2) If 480i - The entry is MID2, 0, DRHP.
3) If all others - The entry is MID33, 0, VDHP. You have to adjust this setting for all the inputs, different than 480i.

The convergence setting for the lower right is D-CONV, 4, RUBW.

No, Sony will not pay for a professional calibration.
Thanks, i got the H-Centering Perfect now, it was off quite a bit. I had to shrink the H-Size a bit, and then shift it left. Now its great. I tried the D-CONV #4 and it didnt seem to make any difference at all 0-63 seemed to look exactly the same (default 22) so i just left it at the stock setting. the amount its off probably isnt enough to even make a difference during normal viewing, the Dots really point out the flaws.. Thanks for the help though, i did atleast get one issue (the worst one) fixed.

Dr.

Calibratred my 34HS420 using Avia, Spyder and the spreadsheet from the Calibration forum. After getting comfortable with the Spyders data I dived into service menu. Overall I am happy with the end results, I can now see shadow detail, but the new settings are far from the defaults. All of the xCUTs are set higher, especially the red which is now at 61. This tells me that G2 is set too high since it takes more voltage to temper the guns. I could lower G2 buy would have to open up my set which would then let me lower xCUTs. I guess what I would like to know from the more experienced folks out there is does it really matter?

So does anybody know if it's possible to disable the v-compression on Sony HS420 sets? It's automatically engaged over the HDMI connection, which means a 4:3 DVD cannot be upconverted to 1080i over the HDMI input (it squeezes it to 16:9).

How do you receive your TV signal...?

DVD player via the HDMI input. I've got a new Oppo player and a DVD at 1080i over the HDMI connection is automatically squeezed to 16:9. This is fine for widescreen, anamorphic DVDs but non-anamorphic letterboxed or 4:3 DVDs are squeezed as well (which ain't fine...!).

I can watch 4:3 material via the Oppo's component connections and let the TV do the upscaling, of course. But sure would be nice to be able to turn off the HS420's v-compression so I can watch 4:3 discs over the digital connection.

Not sure if this helps, but there is a new firmware upgrade that claims to fix the problem: http://www.oppodigital.com/opdv971h_support.html

DVD player via the HDMI input. I've got a new Oppo player and a DVD at 1080i over the HDMI connection is automatically squeezed to 16:9. This is fine for widescreen, anamorphic DVDs but non-anamorphic letterboxed or 4:3 DVDs are squeezed as well (which ain't fine...!).

I can watch 4:3 material via the Oppo's component connections and let the TV do the upscaling, of course. But sure would be nice to be able to turn off the HS420's v-compression so I can watch 4:3 discs over the digital connection.


or...

Q: My 4:3 content is being stetched. Why is that and how to fix it?
A: The OPDV971H automatically stretches 4:3 content to fit a widescreen display if the TV Display in the General Setup menu is set to Wide. For the best possible playback of 4:3 content, set the TV Display to Wide/SQZ.

Calibratred my 34HS420 using Avia, Spyder and the spreadsheet from the Calibration forum. After getting comfortable with the Spyders data I dived into service menu. Overall I am happy with the end results, I can now see shadow detail, but the new settings are far from the defaults. All of the xCUTs are set higher, especially the red which is now at 61. This tells me that G2 is set too high since it takes more voltage to temper the guns. I could lower G2 buy would have to open up my set which would then let me lower xCUTs. I guess what I would like to know from the more experienced folks out there is does it really matter?

Wow, 61 is really high, mine are around mid section all three of them. I own the 30HS420 wich it is basically the same set. Can you tell me your settings for the GCUT & BCUT aswell? I'd like to test it on my set.

My set is automatically assuming a 1080i signal via the HDMI input is 16:9, and is enabling the v-compression. My display isn't widescreen.

The v-compression on Sony HS420 sets has only two settings: on and automatic. No off. Some of us have been hoping we could turn the v-compression off in the service menu somewhere.

Others have asked about this. Thought I'd try one more time and see if anybody knew anything.

EDIT: Just found out if I put the Oppo in "wide/squeeze" mode, over the HDMI connect it will come out window-boxed on my screen. Then I can use the zoom feature on the Sony to fill the screen with the image.

See my thread, "Sony HS420s: i, p, and 'CineMotion'...?" if interested.

Wow, 61 is really high, mine are around mid section all three of them. I own the 30HS420 wich it is basically the same set. Can you tell me your settings for the GCUT & BCUT aswell? I'd like to test it on my set.


Didn't like RCUT to so high, I lowered the settings for the xDRVs and xCUTs proportianally form their original settings. After calibrating with the Spyder and the colorimeter spreadsheet the values I settled on, at least for now are:

SBRT - 21
RCUT, RDRV - 51, 36
GCUT, GDRV - 28, 27
BCUT, BDRV - 38, 23
GAMR, GAMG, GAMB - 2, 2, 1

All CRTs are different to some degree so my settings may be completely useless for your set.

Thanks, I'l check it out to see how it looks on mine.

Can someone maybe help me out? I have Bronchitis this week and just don't feel like scanning through 20 pages.

Is there a fix for the following?

When watching a standard/digital program with bars on the sides....the bottom of my left side seems to bow outwards slightly. It's far from a straight line from top to bottom. My pc moniter has adjustments to tweak these types of problems. Is this found in the service mode for my tv?

Also, can the purple splotch in the upper right corner also be fixed in service mode?

Thanks for any help.

When watching a standard/digital program with bars on the sides....the bottom of my left side seems to bow outwards slightly. It's far from a straight line from top to bottom. Is this found in the service mode for my tv? Very likely yes. Geometry problems can be tweaked in the SM. You probably won't be able to get perfect geometry, however. That's kind of the nature of the beast with CRTs.

For an HS420, check out menu options VPOS through ZOOM, and HCNT through LBOW. These are all the main geometry settings. there may be more (?), but likely these will be enough to fix the problem.

Also, can the purple splotch in the upper right corner also be fixed in service mode?
This I'm less sure about. I have a slight blue tint in the upper right corner. I've not tried to fix it in the SM yet, but frankly it's very slight so I've not really made the effort. Seems I've heard some of these "blob" problems being unfixable short of having a calibrationist out to install special magnets in your set :eek: . I'm far from an expert, though.

Hope you feel better. :)

This I'm less sure about. I have a slight blue tint in the upper right corner. I've not tried to fix it in the SM yet, but frankly it's very slight so I've not really made the effort. Seems I've heard some of these "blob" problems being unfixable short of having a calibrationist out to install special magnets in your set :eek: . I'm far from an expert, though.
Try tweaking the landing setting for that corner of the screen in the SM. I don't know what it does, and judging from when I asked about it a few pages back, no one else does either. However, it made the splotch in my upper right corner go away.

Sorry if this was already covered. The search results for the thread were inconclusive.

I've been operating under the assumption that there are separate setting memories for 480, 720, and 1080 on my XBR960. However, I have an underscanned 720 source on input 6 and a cable 1080 source on input 7 and there positions seem to be linked. If I center the screen horizontally on the 720 feed, the 1080 feed is off. If I fix the 1080, the 720 is off. I've currently centered the 720 feed, because the 1080 feed still has overscan to cover the screen. However, all the titles on programs aren't centered which annoys by obsessive soul.

Is there any way to address this or do all widescreen feeds share the same settings?

Try tweaking the landing setting for that corner of the screen in the SM. ...it made the splotch in my upper right corner go away.
Hmmmmm, will give that a try. Does it have a funky abbreviation in the SM?

I think it's just "Landing" or "Land" or something obvious like that. RT stands for Right Top, RB stands for Right Bottom, and I'm betting you can figure out the other two.

I have a question about my set KV30hs420, It's being a while like that and I checked the geometry with the avia disk; 480i for the GC, 480p for the DVD and 1080i for GT4 on PS2 are all centered and almost 100% right but when I play my PS2 games in 480p, the screen is off center, more on the right. If I tweak the MID3 menu and center it for the PS2 in 480p, then the DVD is off center. I decided to leave the 480p centered for the DVD since the 480i on my PS2 look just as good. But if there is a way to fix it, I'd really appreciate it.

anyone know how to fix this problem?
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=599482

anyone know how to fix this problem?
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=599482
I agree with biznus97: sounds like phosphor trailing to me. Proper calibration is all you can do about phosphor trailing. As far as I know, it's something of the nature of CRTs.

Maybe you could post a pic.?

no cam to take a pic. so you think it can be fixed with proper calibration? if so what settings do i tune in the SM?

I have a question about my set KV30hs420, It's being a while like that and I checked the geometry with the avia disk; 480i for the GC, 480p for the DVD and 1080i for GT4 on PS2 are all centered and almost 100% right but when I play my PS2 games in 480p, the screen is off center, more on the right. If I tweak the MID3 menu and center it for the PS2 in 480p, then the DVD is off center. I decided to leave the 480p centered for the DVD since the 480i on my PS2 look just as good. But if there is a way to fix it, I'd really appreciate it.

480i signals must be corrected in MID2.

no cam to take a pic. so you think it can be fixed with proper calibration? if so what settings do i tune in the SM?
The extent to which I understand it, you can calibrate your set as well as possible and it will diminish phosphor trailing, but your probably still gonna' notice it sometimes. It's just the nature of CRT technology.

Read and study the SM calibration tutorials toward the beginning of this thread. That's what I'm trying to do. :)

oh man there is alot to learn here. ill be here forever :(

I'm experiencing a lot of ghosting / trailing on my xbr960. This is giving me a lot of eye strain and head aches. Is there anything in the service menu to fix this issue? Or is this permanent because it is in 1080i @ 30 fps and my eye can notice such things? Maybe my xbr 960 have a DLP chip some where in it? :(

I'm experiencing a lot of ghosting / trailing on my xbr960. This is giving me a lot of eye strain and head aches. Is there anything in the service menu to fix this issue? Or is this permanent because it is in 1080i @ 30 fps and my eye can notice such things? Maybe my xbr 960 have a DLP chip some where in it? :(What picture mode, contrast, brightness and sharpness settings are you using? Does it still happen in the Pro or Movie mode?

Pro, Picture 42, Brightness 28, color 31, sharpness 31, Color Warm, Clearedge VM off, Monitor. I also used most of the service tweaks so I believe sharpness and clearedge are off in the service menu.

The phosphor speed is usually pretty good on CRTs, my guess would be the ghosting would have something to do with the game digital graphics and an analog display. The XBR960 will show everything in the signal.

sharpness 31Have you experimented with sharpness=MIN for your HD inputs?

This does not inject any "softening" or "blurring" (i.e. going into negative sharpness as some other sets do). For the XBR960 it simply completely eliminates all artificially added edge enhancement (and associated video noise) to the right of the zero point. In other words, sharpness=MIN turns edge enhancement completely off. You see the true picture that is being broadcast.

The result is quite different from your sharpness=31 and will take a bit of getting used to if you're accustomed to the artificial edge-enhancement associated with having any positive sharpness value. But within just a few minutes it will hopefully look like "true reality" to you and you'll hopefully marvel at what the XBR960 looks like when displaying exactly the image that is being broadcast... with zero extra edging. You'll wonder why you never tried this before.

You'll be amazed at what the US Open tennis court and Augusta National grass at the Masters looks like with sharpness=MIN. It's like you're looking through a window, except that there's no glass! You're actually looking through just a window frame!

Same with "live on tape" shows like Leno, SNL, Conan, Letterman, etc. You really should try sharpness=MIN.

Have you experimented with sharpness=MIN for your HD inputs?

This does not inject any "softening" or "blurring" (i.e. going into negative sharpness as some other sets do). For the XBR960 it simply completely eliminates all artificially added edge enhancement (and associated video noise) to the right of the zero point. In other words, sharpness=MIN turns edge enhancement completely off. You see the true picture that is being broadcast.

The result is quite different from your sharpness=31 and will take a bit of getting used to if you're accustomed to the artificial edge-enhancement associated with having any positive sharpness value. But within just a few minutes it will hopefully look like "true reality" to you and you'll hopefully marvel at what the XBR960 looks like when displaying exactly the image that is being broadcast... with zero extra edging. You'll wonder why you never tried this before.

You'll be amazed at what the US Open tennis court and Augusta National grass at the Masters looks like with sharpness=MIN. It's like you're looking through a window, except that there's no glass! You're actually looking through just a window frame!

Same with "live on tape" shows like Leno, SNL, Conan, Letterman, etc. You really should try sharpness=MIN.

I put the sharpness to min. It's some times hard to spot out trailings / ghostings. This thread right here :http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6470733&&#post6470733 is a good example of what happens.
I put the sharpness to min and still did some of the service menu tweaks on the dvd players input (input 6). Its a progressive scan sony player threw component. I have the same issues has listed with the link with ghosting.

Pro, Picture 42...
Does 42 for "picture"/white level not seem awfully high to you guys (I assume that's 42 ticks up from the bottom on the scale)? I've got a 36HS420 and I've got my white level 13 ticks up, and it's plenty bright.

I realize it's a different set and display settings are pretty relative anyway, but still...

Does 42 for "picture"/white level not seem awfully high to you guys It probably depends on brightness and other tweak factors and the particular input and source device, but I would agree that this seems pretty high.

My D* SD input picture/brightness is set at (39,33) and OTA SD is set at (40,34). But my HD inputs are much lower: DVD=(34,36), 720p/1080i=(35,32), HDMI=(35,32), and iLink=(34,31).

But to each his own I guess. Depends on what looks good to you in your viewing conditions.

Well this is my second set. The first set of the xbr960 the brightness and contrast levels were way different to get the image to look bright enough on the screen. I believe I had the contrast / brightness about 10 clicks down on the first xbr960. On this tv the brightness is different and I have about 10 clicks up for the contrast / brightness. I guess this is why no tv is the same.

Could I get some help?
I did a major NO NO and made some adjustments with out writing down factory numbers. :(
At first I lost some of my menu items, I lost my PIP. I did some tweaking in the ID area and some of the menus came back.
I was wondering if anyone might share their settings in regards to this part of the service menu?

thanks

SONY KD-34XBR960

Hi Guys,

So I have had some great success with adjusting overscan on my 32" 4:3 Sony HDTV.

I now noticed a couple of other problems I would like to fix.

I am not sure what this is called, but at the top of the screen lines start slanting to the right some, and then to a greater extent on the bottom of the screen they slant to the left.

My other problem is that it seems like whites are bleeding through the sides of the screen (almost like it looks like a backlit LCD), and also on the tops and bottoms. It is noticable only when bright colors are near the tops and bottoms (white being the worst).

Could I get some help?
I did a major NO NO and made some adjustments with out writing down factory numbers. :(
At first I lost some of my menu items, I lost my PIP. I did some tweaking in the ID area and some of the menus came back.
I was wondering if anyone might share their settings in regards to this part of the service menu?

thanks


Info about model would be good...?

I am not sure what this is called, but at the top of the screen lines start slanting to the right some, and then to a greater extent on the bottom of the screen they slant to the left.

My other problem is that it seems like whites are bleeding through the sides of the screen (almost like it looks like a backlit LCD), and also on the tops and bottoms. It is noticable only when bright colors are near the tops and bottoms (white being the worst).

Is it the whole top and bottom of the screen that's slanting right and left...?

The bleeding can be fixed with the blanking function. Search on blanking in this forum, there are several good suggestions.

Is it the whole top and bottom of the screen that's slanting right and left...?

The bleeding can be fixed with the blanking function. Search on blanking in this forum, there are several good suggestions.

Yes, it is the whole top and bottom...it looks something like this (but not quite as drastic)...

top
//////////////
||||||||||||||
||||||||||||||
||||||||||||||
//////////////

bottom


I read post 265 about blanking, and messed with the setting some, but nothing appeared to help it.

Yes, it is the whole top and bottom...it looks something like this (but not quite as drastic)...

top
//////////////
||||||||||||||
||||||||||||||
||||||||||||||
//////////////

bottom


I read post 265 about blanking, and messed with the setting some, but nothing appeared to help it.

- Check the attachment on #409.

- Blanking was my best bet.

Sorry if this was already covered. The search results for the thread were inconclusive.

I've been operating under the assumption that there are separate setting memories for 480, 720, and 1080 on my XBR960. However, I have an underscanned 720 source on input 6 and a cable 1080 source on input 7 and there positions seem to be linked. If I center the screen horizontally on the 720 feed, the 1080 feed is off. If I fix the 1080, the 720 is off. I've currently centered the 720 feed, because the 1080 feed still has overscan to cover the screen. However, all the titles on programs aren't centered which annoys by obsessive soul.

Is there any way to address this or do all widescreen feeds share the same settings?
OK, so it appears not to be the resolution that's the issue but the input. My cable box DVR with the 1080 feed was going into the HDMI input. Having bought a new DVD player, I switched the DVR to component; the problem was immediately solved. I attached the DVD player through HDMI; you guessed it, the problem is still there. So apparently the HDMI input horizontal position is out of whack with the component and antenna positions. Is there a service menu setting other than 2170D-2 that will adjust the horizontal position of *just* the HDMI input?

OK, so it appears not to be the resolution that's the issue but the input. My cable box DVR with the 1080 feed was going into the HDMI input. Having bought a new DVD player, I switched the DVR to component; the problem was immediately solved. I attached the DVD player through HDMI; you guessed it, the problem is still there. So apparently the HDMI input horizontal position is out of whack with the component and antenna positions. Is there a service menu setting other than 2170D-2 that will adjust the horizontal position of *just* the HDMI input?

MID3, 0-3 controls, vertical and horisontal size and position. All scan sizes except 480i, which is done in MID2, 0-3.

Remember you can only do this if the "default" raster/frame has been set correctly using 2170D-1 and -2. Read back in this forum for more info.

Crap. I didn't read the most recent posts closely enough. This was on the last page, for chrissakes!

Thanks so much! It did the trick and fixed something that's been driving me nuts for weeks.

OOOPS
Its a SONY KD-34XBR960

:)

It seems my 40XBR800 doesn't have the LANDING option on it (to help rid discoloration). I've searched everywhere but no luck. It must have been added for even later models. Anyhow, is there anything I can do to get rid of a slight discoloration on the top left (no magnets for me)? I suspect I might have to bear with it.

Nam.

OOOPS
Its a SONY KD-34XBR960

:)

0 - 89
1 - 255
2 - 255
3 - 111
4 - 203
5 - 207
6 - 62
7 - 25

Some of the service manuals have 7 - 19, but that is wrong...!

In your opinion, might they be the same setting for most xbr960's?

In your opinion, might they be the same setting for most xbr960's?

Those are the factory settings for 34XBR960. Do you still have problems?

Regarding the Landing settings. I finally tried those out tonight on my mild color purity issues, and it actually seems to have solved about 80 or 90% of the problem.

It wasn't too bad to start off with, small blue areas in top right and left side in bright white scenes, and medium sized slightly red area on right/right-lower in white/yellow scenes.

The Landing 0 through 3 definitely helped, thanks for the tip.

Snif... no landing settings for 40xbr800 it seems...

Nope, but I started out in 2002 with them in all 4 corners. By some act of what, today I only have the top left corner. Maybe someone is looking out for me, dunno no.

Another question on my 30xs955:

Lately I've noticed I've developed what seems to be a convergence problem. On any vertical line I get a slight transparent distortion next to it on the right. Almost like a "ghost" image of the line but only a milimeter or two from the other. This is occurring on all inputs and I've tried literally everything and I can't get rid of it. If it was only on my cable feed I'd chalk it up to a bad feed, but even on my DVD input and my 360 I get the same problem. I've played around with convergence and I can't get it to correct. I've also tried moving wires, speakers, etc...to make sure it was something electrical or magnetic effecting the beam, but no improvement. Of course, it didn't show up until after my 30 return window has past. I don't notice it unless I'm close to the set, such as when I sit and play the 360, but it's driving me insane. Anyone have any tips, or is this something that will need to be fix internally? I'll try to post a picture later that shows the problem. Thanks.

Can someone please post the Service Menu PDF/DOC for the XBR960? Every link I have tried through the search have been dead.

THANKS!

My 34XBR910 may be haunted!

About a month ago I put in a DVD and the the picture looked very bright and lots of enhancement. I have pro mode optomized for my DVD player. I push the XBR menue button and find the contrast turned up and SVM on high! I have spent much time with AVIA and DVE for optimum adjustment and the user settings are not where I left them? My kids are grown and gone, had no recent visitors and my wife uses the Satellite receiver romote so has no access to the menue function (only on/off volume) and swears she didn't change anything. Ok, maybe I forgot doing something....You guessed it, it happened again! We come home from a 4 day trip to visit my daughter and now the user settings have changer in standard picture mode! No one home, security system on, all electronics powered down...
Only standard mode user settings changed. SM settings as I set them. Reset user settings again and everything works fine.

Now a new, possibly unrelated, symptom. Last night my wife asks "what's that red light on the front of the TV." It's the memory stick indicator light. I push the memory stick button on the remote, no response. Manual says light indicates reading data on memory stick. I don't own a memory stick! TV working fine and I don't need memory stick so my first thought is put tape over red light and ignore it. But first I try a few obvious things; unplug TV for a few hours, no change; hold reset button and cycle power to reset to factory settings, no change except now had to put all user settings back to my preferences and redo the annoying initial set up process.

Sooo, is my XBR haunted? Am I losing my memory (and memory stick)? Anyone experienced anything similar? I am concerned these are early symptoms of impending computer failure.

Thanks for any suggestions

Rick

I seem to recall long ago that the 960s had a bug where they could lose some user settings. There was a firmware upgrade you could do by getting a service tech to come out and load a special memory stick into your set.

Maybe you should ask them if there's an upgrade available for your set. Otherwise it sounds like it may be developing some other problem.

Hey guys,

What other things besides SBRT and YOF can i use to tweak black levels?

BTW -- WHAT IS YOF ANYWAY? It was originally at 12 and I turned it up all the way to 15, which seems to lighten up shadows (which is what Im trying to do).

I tried raising RCUT, BCUT & GCUT to no avail. Didnt seem to make much a difference.

What else can I try to crush the black crush?

My 34XBR910 may be haunted!



Sooo, is my XBR haunted? Am I losing my memory (and memory stick)? Anyone experienced anything similar? I am concerned these are early symptoms of impending computer failure.

Thanks for any suggestions

Rick

I had a similar experience with my 34XBR910. I called sony Service and arranged for a sony authorized service tech to come. The solution was to replace the memory stick module board. Has worked fine since.

Hey guys,

What other things besides SBRT and YOF can i use to tweak black levels?

BTW -- WHAT IS YOF ANYWAY? It was originally at 12 and I turned it up all the way to 15, which seems to lighten up shadows (which is what Im trying to do).

I tried raising RCUT, BCUT & GCUT to no avail. Didnt seem to make much a difference.

What else can I try to crush the black crush?

what about GAMMA correction?
talks about it on page 1.

You're welcome very, very much!
If your darkest grays are satisfactory in color, meaning they're a neutral gray, not reddish or bluish or something, then I would leave them alone. Make the major adjustment with SBRT, no matter what value it ends up with. That guarantees you won't screw up the color. (I'm only guessing that changing RCUT-BCUT by the same amount leaves the color untouched. Maybe they actually don't track perfectly.)
Yes. Smoky-gray blacks indicate a *high* black level for that source (coming into the TV), and you should consider lowering UBOF for that input or leaving it at zero and lowering SBRT.
That really does seem like a good strategy, as I certainly can't say how black behaves on your DVD player's component outputs. But if you know that DVD/component black is higher than DVD/S-video (i.e. its blacks are smoky), then you can set the component DVD connection to UBOF = 0 (and ignore DVD/S-video), and the other inputs and broadcast will likely be set to a higher UBOF. You might have to go through this process twice to get it right.

this may also be helpful....

mr2828 / jjmilo,

Thanks for the information. Although it sounds like the memory stick and user settings loss are not related, the memory stick function is needed to fix the user setting problem. As my 2 year warranty expires in the next 2 weeks I guess I should forget covering and ignoring the memory stick light and call for a warranty service visit.

Any other experiences would still be appreciated.

Regards, Rick

Those are the factory settings for 34XBR960. Do you still have problems?

You factory settings worked great! Thanks!!! \
I have the service manual and the settings in there are umm how should I say..."not right" LOL

Anyone else use the service menu to calibrate their KV30HS420?

I've resolved to calibrate my system using it, but I was hoping to get in touch with someone that's been through it before.

If you like, you can send me a PM and we can discuss it. I'm trying to wrap my head around all these different service codes. Not very easy.

I have a problem with my KD34XBR960. There seems to be a bluish/purplish color in the bottom left corner that bleeds into the rest of the image. I was told that this could be caused by electrical interference, so I moved everything electrical away from the TV and unplugged it for about 4 hours. Didn't help any. So then I hear two other things i've yet to check out: one person who had this exact problem with this exact model said they got a Sony rep to look at it, and he needed to adjust something with the calibration. Another person suggested messing with some kind of option that deals with how the earth's magnetic field can affect the TV, but I found no such option.

Basically what i'm getting at, is is there any option in the service menu that could help a problem like this? I'm very new to this kind of thing, and would rather not just go in and start messing with stuff. My last resort will have to be shelling out money to have someone come out and fix it, but i'd rather avoid that.

Anyone else use the service menu to calibrate their KV30HS420?

I've resolved to calibrate my system using it, but I was hoping to get in touch with someone that's been through it before.

If you like, you can send me a PM and we can discuss it. I'm trying to wrap my head around all these different service codes. Not very easy.
I have use the SM to make some adjustments to my 34HS420. And access to the SM is required to perform some of the trickier elements of calibration (e.g. overscan, sharpness, etc).

My efforts have been those of a newbie following the directions of others. Go ahead and PM me and I can at least point you to some helpful posts.

I have a problem with my KD34XBR960. There seems to be a bluish/purplish color in the bottom left corner that bleeds into the rest of the image. I was told that this could be caused by electrical interference, so I moved everything electrical away from the TV and unplugged it for about 4 hours. Didn't help any. So then I hear two other things i've yet to check out: one person who had this exact problem with this exact model said they got a Sony rep to look at it, and he needed to adjust something with the calibration. Another person suggested messing with some kind of option that deals with how the earth's magnetic field can affect the TV, but I found no such option.

Basically what i'm getting at, is is there any option in the service menu that could help a problem like this? I'm very new to this kind of thing, and would rather not just go in and start messing with stuff. My last resort will have to be shelling out money to have someone come out and fix it, but i'd rather avoid that.


I had some success recently fixing some color purity blotches on my 960 using the LANDING settings in service mode.

i just noticed that the edges on my 30HS420 are slightly blurry(not as focused as the center). has anyone tried the focus codes?

i just noticed that the edges on my 30HS420 are slightly blurry(not as focused as the center). has anyone tried the focus codes?

I actually just did a calibration of my 30HS420 last night. I went a slew of codes, although not even close to as many as KenTech.

I basically went through and fiddled with: HPOS,HSIZ,VPOS,and VSIZ for size and position. GYR, GYB, RYR and RYB for color, UBOF and SBRT for black levels, and QPAM thru QPDP, DF, and DQP for focus and clarity.

I would've done more with color, but KenTech's post outlines using clouds as a white reference. I was calibrating at night, and I wanted a more reliable method. So I used DVE with the filters, and the color codes mentioned above. I have actually gotten VERY good color results now.

The focus codes also did a wonderful job on my picture especially with SMTPE 133 res. pattern.

I was watching some HD and SD content yesterday, and I am very pleased with the results. My only gripe is that the whites seem too white and the blacks seem too black. So I'll continue to do a little more adjusting, but Brightness and Picture in the Video Options should suit me just fine.

If you'd like to know the group codes for the items mentioned above, feel free to PM me. Anything I know, I learned from Justc, Crockhunter, and KenTech of course.

I had some success recently fixing some color purity blotches on my 960 using the LANDING settings in service mode.

Do you know the code for this setting? I can't find anything like it.

I actually just did a calibration of my 30HS420 last night. I went a slew of codes, although not even close to as many as KenTech.

I basically went through and fiddled with: HPOS,HSIZ,VPOS,and VSIZ for size and position. GYR, GYB, RYR and RYB for color, UBOF and SBRT for black levels, and QPAM thru QPDP, DF, and DQP for focus and clarity.

I would've done more with color, but KenTech's post outlines using clouds as a white reference. I was calibrating at night, and I wanted a more reliable method. So I used DVE with the filters, and the color codes mentioned above. I have actually gotten VERY good color results now.

The focus codes also did a wonderful job on my picture especially with SMTPE 133 res. pattern.

I was watching some HD and SD content yesterday, and I am very pleased with the results. My only gripe is that the whites seem too white and the blacks seem too black. So I'll continue to do a little more adjusting, but Brightness and Picture in the Video Options should suit me just fine.

If you'd like to know the group codes for the items mentioned above, feel free to PM me. Anything I know, I learned from Justc, Crockhunter, and KenTech of course.
This is very good news. Congratulations are in order.

I also have times when whites are a bit too white - like when watching football in bright sunlight, the players white pants or jerseys can seem very "overexposed."

Isn't it wild how much better your PQ can be with relatively few adjustments?

Do you know the code for this setting? I can't find anything like it.

LAND 0 through 9

on my 960. If you don't have a 960, you may not have these?

LAND 0 through 9

on my 960. If you don't have a 960, you may not have these?

You are a little angel, you know that? Haha.

I thought I was gonna have to spend several hundred dollars getting this fixed, but that did it. Had to change one of the settings (think it was 7) from 0 to 1.

I've searched the thread and found a number of you that have adjusted for overscan, but not a lot of details on the specifics. Can someone do a quick walkthrough of a "surgical strike" of getting in, reducing overscan (on HDMI input), and getting out? I've got a 34HS420.

Thanks.

I've searched the thread and found a number of you that have adjusted for overscan, but not a lot of details on the specifics. Can someone do a quick walkthrough of a "surgical strike" of getting in, reducing overscan (on HDMI input), and getting out? I've got a 34HS420.

Thanks.
You need to be able to put up a test pattern to correct for overscan. That can be difficult to do directly on your HDMI input unless you have an upconverting dvd player connected there. Most of us use either the Avia or DVE calibration discs since they include all the test patterns you need. The only other way to do this on the HDMI input is to somehow get a test pattern broadcast to you - with Comcast Digital Cable, INHD broadcasts test patterns every Saturday morning at 4am EST. And they do put up such a pattern.

Once you have a test pattern you can use VPOS & VSIZ (in the Service Menu) to adjust for overscan vertically and HPOS & HSIZ for the horizontal.

I've searched the thread and found a number of you that have adjusted for overscan, but not a lot of details on the specifics.This is meant to be humorous, right? I'm not trying to be facetious, but this subject has honestly been discussed in great detail in several threads... especially in a number of recent threads posted by new XBOX owners seeking to tweak their Sony sets (e.g. XBR960) to eliminate overscan.

Assuming you're into the service menu (and are familiar with how it is entered, used, saved, and exited), the primary recipe approach is fundamentally twofold: (1) use the VPOS and VSIZ items in the 2170D-1 group, and the HPOS and HSIZ items in the 2170D-2 service menu group, to adjust the "background raster" (aka "canvas") in both horizontal and vertical directions. Then (2) in the MID3 group you use 0 (VDHP horizontal position), 1 (VDHS horizontal size), 2 (VDVE vertical position) and 3 (VDVS vertical size) to manipulate the 1080i/720p "image" on top of the "background" (i.e. within the "background raster").

2170D-1 and 2170D-2 are used to adjust the "canvas" to reach to the physical edges of the screen, so that the image then placed on top of it can utilize all available screen real estate. MID3 is used for the 1080i and 720p image size and placement adjustments, within the background raster area set by 2170D-1 and 2170D-2. You position and size the image over the background so that it is fully visible and reaches to the extreme edges of the background for 0% overscan. Then you enlarge it just a bit more in all four directions (using the test pattern on your screen as the guide) to "crop" out the video noise which you may see at 0% overscan, losing perhaps 1-2% of the image in this final "overscan" adjustment.

As you get into each part of the adjustments, clicking up or down one unit at a time so that you see the precise results of your tweak, you focus on getting the extreme outer edge of the test pattern rectangle visible on your screen. When you're done (at 0% overscan), the complete rectangle should be totally visible on all four sides. No wasted screen, and nothing eliminated (at 0% overscan).

There is an assumption that you have a proper 16:9 test pattern on your screen, the best of which can be found attached to this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6723557&&#post6723557) which if you can connect your PC to your HDTV is ideal. If you have a video card like ATI Radeon 9800 Pro, it has a second DVI head and you can connect it to your Sony with a DVI-to-HDMI cable setup. Or, you can get the ATI DVI-to-component adapter and connect the second head to your Sony with component video cables.

Otherwise, you can use Avia or DVE DVD's to display geometry and overscan test patterns, though at 480p. Using DVE, you can go to Title 12 (Display Setup Patterns) and then Chapter 17 (1:33 overscan pattern), with the latter "spread" to 16:9 by the MODE button on your remote.

"Blow-by-blow" as well as instructions for service menu entry, exit and use, can be found in this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6346890&&#post6346890) .

A bit more editorializing can be found in this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6346890&&#post6346890)

Hope this helps.

Perfect, thanks.

Hello everyone well first off before I ask any questions I would like to thank everyone who posts here for the wonderful information that I've gotten from this thread and board so far, its really made me happy with my purchase of my kv30hs420. Now for my question, when I watch dvd's and other things like games words sometimes appear to be blurred to the right. For instance when watching pulp fiction the orange lettering in the opening credits seems to blur to the right almost to the end of the screen, now it's a very light blur but its there and I was wondering if anyone had any idea at all about what exactly I would have to do to fix it or at least what could be causing it. Thank everyone again in advance for the help

Hello everyone well first off before I ask any questions I would like to thank everyone who posts here for the wonderful information that I've gotten from this thread and board so far, its really made me happy with my purchase of my kv30hs420. Now for my question, when I watch dvd's and other things like games words sometimes appear to be blurred to the right. For instance when watching pulp fiction the orange lettering in the opening credits seems to blur to the right almost to the end of the screen, now it's a very light blur but its there and I was wondering if anyone had any idea at all about what exactly I would have to do to fix it or at least what could be causing it. Thank everyone again in advance for the help

Use the function "Search this Thread" and search for "focus".

Hello everyone well first off before I ask any questions I would like to thank everyone who posts here for the wonderful information that I've gotten from this thread and board so far, its really made me happy with my purchase of my kv30hs420. Now for my question, when I watch dvd's and other things like games words sometimes appear to be blurred to the right. For instance when watching pulp fiction the orange lettering in the opening credits seems to blur to the right almost to the end of the screen, now it's a very light blur but its there and I was wondering if anyone had any idea at all about what exactly I would have to do to fix it or at least what could be causing it. Thank everyone again in advance for the help
I find this to be "normal" for an interlaced signal. Try setting the set to progressive (480p) and see what happens to the text. I realize 480p may not be optimal for viewing, but it can cut down on the "blur."

Happy Holiday.

I have a few questions about my XBR960.
Any one have any idea why the CCD menu does not show up in my service menu?
Any idea why items 7 through 12 in 2170P-4 are listen on the Service manual but do not show
up on the TV service menu?

When adjusting the zoom, wide zoom, etc, does one bring that up on the screen, adjust, and then write?....will that affect the normal view?

Any suggestion as to what I could do to input a pattern to the Cable input?

FYI. I am using ATI 9600 all in wonder. I bought a VGA to YPbPr adapter. Using the software and dip switches, my TV tells me it can get a 720p signal.

Thanks...

Happy Holiday.

I have a few questions about my XBR960.
Any one have any idea why the CCD menu does not show up in my service menu?
Any idea why items 7 through 12 in 2170P-4 are listen on the Service manual but do not show
up on the TV service menu?

When adjusting the zoom, wide zoom, etc, does one bring that up on the screen, adjust, and then write?....will that affect the normal view?

Any suggestion as to what I could do to input a pattern to the Cable input?

FYI. I am using ATI 9600 all in wonder. I bought a VGA to YPbPr adapter. Using the software and dip switches, my TV tells me it can get a 720p signal.

Thanks...


The Sony Service Manuals are not easy to understand, and they are not always correct. The two examples that you mention are the best known. But there are also menues in the TV that is not in the Service Manual, ex the QM menu. I have two versions of the 34XBR960 service manuals and they are different in several areas.

Correct, it will not effect the normal view if the service menu has a specific entry for the particular zoom. If there are no specific entry in the service manual for the zoom or for the input, the change might be global, so you always have to check the service manual.

Read - #416, #429 and #433

The Sony Service Manuals are not easy to understand, and they are not always correct. The two examples that you mention are the best known. But there are also menues in the TV that is not in the Service Manual, ex the QM menu. I have two versions of the 34XBR960 service manuals and they are different in several areas.

Correct, it will not effect the normal view if the service menu has a specific entry for the particular zoom. If there are no specific entry in the service manual for the zoom or for the input, the change might be global, so you always have to check the service manual.

Read - #416, #429 and #433


I don't know what you mean by "Read - #416, #429 and #433

I don't know what you mean by "Read - #416, #429 and #433

Numbers of the posts in this forum.

Hi There!
A help on a description of service codes in a Sony KV-J29MF8 Chassis SCCK57Q-A is well come
Many thanks to all of you.
Baule

Ok..Thanks.

Does anyone else beside me, have a time of it trying to make the geometry perfect?
I have the overscan just right, and the pic is all centered.
The edges are clean, etc.
The real concern is when I watch a broadcast, if the camera pans quick, I can see the distortion.
Any easy fix, or is this all by eye with a cross hatch pattern?

I am really in need for some help. After reading ken's guides and other overscan guides i have read on here, i have completely screwed up my tv even though i "thought" i had it. The only excel sheets i can find are for an xbr and a 30hs420 in which things are not getting better. Can anyone find or post an excel sheet for the kv-34hs420. please... :(

I am really in need for some help. After reading ken's guides and other overscan guides i have read on here, i have completely screwed up my tv even though i "thought" i had it. The only excel sheets i can find are for an xbr and a 30hs420 in which things are not getting better. Can anyone find or post an excel sheet for the kv-34hs420. please... :(

The absolute first post in this forum contains the original sony service manual grid for your TV. You cannot expect a perfect result just by putting in the numbers from the grid, and you cannot expect the different excel spredsheets out there to give you a better result. All tube TV's are "temperamental", and if you want to fiddle, you better be careful.

I suggest you write about what you did, which menues you changed and what went wrong.

I'd like some more help with my television. Anyone have expierence doing focus on Sony HDTV's. Anyway to push the focus further on the Sony? I had Qpam at 0 and DQP at 42, and it had improved considerably, but still wasn't as focused as the center of the television. Any suggestions? I would be willing to open up the back of my television to access pots if necessary. Please, advice would be much appreciated!

I have two floor speakers to the left and right of the Sony. Could these be hurting the television? I've tried removing them, and they don't seem to have any effect on the T.V. I know they are unshielded.

The middle bottom, or the bottom of a widescreen, is bowing upward. Which setting in the service menu addresses that? Please, I would appreciate it.

I'd like some more help with my television. Anyone have expierence doing focus on Sony HDTV's. Anyway to push the focus further on the Sony? I had Qpam at 0 and DQP at 42, and it had improved considerably, but still wasn't as focused as the center of the television. Any suggestions? I would be willing to open up the back of my television to access pots if necessary. Please, advice would be much appreciated!

I have two floor speakers to the left and right of the Sony. Could these be hurting the television? I've tried removing them, and they don't seem to have any effect on the T.V. I know they are unshielded.

The middle bottom, or the bottom of a widescreen, is bowing upward. Which setting in the service menu addresses that? Please, I would appreciate it.

First I need to "bitch" a little...!
You are willing to to remove the back of your TV and rummage around, voiding your warranty, but you are not willing to use the search tools to find relevant articles???....."bitching" over...!

1) Read Article #8 and #133
2) Unshielded speakers should not be anywhere near a CRT TV
3) Read Article #409

Thankyou very much for the reply. Those articles are very helpful.I'm going to read them shortly. I've printed them off.

The two speakers I use for front left and right are Cerwin Vega E-712's. They don't have video shielding. When I bought them I didn't have a clue. Anyways. It seems that they don't have any effect on the Sony TV. I take them away, and there is no difference in focus or geometry. They are each about 1.5 feet straight line away from the TV. There is no discoloration. I've seen them cause that before when they were placed RIGHT next to the television. At this range however, there is none of that. I just don't want them to destroy my TV. What do you say now? Sorry this is really really off topic.

Thankyou very much for the reply. Those articles are very helpful.I'm going to read them shortly. I've printed them off.

The two speakers I use for front left and right are Cerwin Vega E-712's. They don't have video shielding. When I bought them I didn't have a clue. Anyways. It seems that they don't have any effect on the Sony TV. I take them away, and there is no difference in focus or geometry. They are each about 1.5 feet straight line away from the TV. There is no discoloration. I've seen them cause that before when they were placed RIGHT next to the television. At this range however, there is none of that. I just don't want them to destroy my TV. What do you say now?

I do not know enough about your speakers, but the logic is: Very weak magnets are used on the tube to correct the direction and landing of the beam, unshielded speakers contain rather strong magnets, so...!

I've read article # 133 dealing with the focus pot inside the television. However, If my center focus is just fine, should I even do anything with the pot. Is there any hope in fixing more left and right edge focus by using the focus pot. Qpam is the SM register that is helping me the most.If I set it to 0 the left and right focus become their best, but still not nearly as good as the center. The right seems to be the worst. The DQP register can bring the left into focus all by itself when lowered. However, it seems the reverse is not true for the right. If I go the other way there is a point where the right refuses to get any better with the DQP balance register. I'm just throwing out what I have. I still haven't written any settings yet.Guess I need to diddle some more with the DQP. I think that's the register that's hanging me up.

#8 :::LEFT-RIGHT BALANCE is #8 DQP.
#133:::(6) Look at the focus patterns at the middle of the left and right edges of the screen, and adjust #0 QPAM for best focus and #2 QPAP for best balance between left and right.

In article #133 it suggests that QPap is the left right balance register, and in #8 it says that DQP is the left right balance setting. Is there something I'm not getting. Does DQP interact with Qpap? Maybe this would affect my DQP register having a significant affect on the right side?



By using the pot, could I obtain more left and right edge focus?

If I raised the focus of the entire screen, then maybe Qpam could focus the edges farther? The article said I could never obtain focus at the edges like I could at the center, and this discourages me from even trying to obtain better focus.

Any thoughts? My problem is focus correct? Text is blurry at the right and left middle edges of the screen.


Also, putting test patterns on a GumStick and trying to view them with the Picture Viewer on the KV36HS500 does not work. No matter what I have done, the patterns just exhibit viewing error's, yet pictures taken with a sony camera work just fine. David Taylor's TVWriter program fixes the problem, but it also messes with the size and res of the input test patterns which isn't wanted.I've tried correct naming and folder convention, but that doesn't work.

My TV requires some sort of header on the JPEG file for it to work in the Viewer. I searched the post, and others have this problem too, but I don't think it got fixed. Anyone with other fixes? Simply throwing them on a gumstick doesn't work. I think I might try a flash drive with my Xbox. I did that and the patterns seem good. I'll just use that.

Well, I thought I had everything pretty much done as far as overscan goes on my KV-32HS510. I have about 3% overscan now on dvd's and HD Cable, which is about what I wanted.

Today, I turned on my Gamecube, and to my horror, it looks like a really bad case of UNDERscan. At least 3-5% underscan around all of the edges. This happens in 480i/p on my Gamecube and PS2. The problem does not however happen on my Xbox360 at 480p or 720p/1080i.

I went into the diagnostic page, and it seems like my tv shares all of the diagnostic settings across all inputs and resolutions. So I don't know how I can eliminate the underscan without having a ton of overscan with my dvd player and cable.

Does anyone have any insight on this? I am pretty confused on what I can do to fix this.

Yes, it is the whole top and bottom...it looks something like this (but not quite as drastic)...

top
//////////////
||||||||||||||
||||||||||||||
||||||||||||||
//////////////

bottom



Also, I still have not been able to fix this problem with the very top of my screen curving right and the very bottom curving left. Someone mentioned to check the attachment on post 409, but there was nothing in it about this problem.

Well, I thought I had everything pretty much done as far as overscan goes on my KV-32HS510. I have about 3% overscan now on dvd's and HD Cable, which is about what I wanted.

Today, I turned on my Gamecube, and to my horror, it looks like a really bad case of UNDERscan. At least 3-5% underscan around all of the edges. This happens in 480i/p on my Gamecube and PS2. The problem does not however happen on my Xbox360 at 480p or 720p/1080i.

I went into the diagnostic page, and it seems like my tv shares all of the diagnostic settings across all inputs and resolutions. So I don't know how I can eliminate the underscan without having a ton of overscan with my dvd player and cable.

Does anyone have any insight on this? I am pretty confused on what I can do to fix this.


Read the thread or use the "Search this Thread" tool. There are several post on that exact problem. You have got to invest a little time...we did...!!

Also, I still have not been able to fix this problem with the very top of my screen curving right and the very bottom curving left. Someone mentioned to check the attachment on post 409, but there was nothing in it about this problem.

There are about 10-12 settings that can impact the vertical lines and they all impact each other. It's impossible to tell you which, that's why I attached the very informative drawings. If you cannot fix it to your satisfaction, hide it using overscan. If the overscan doesn't exceed 5%, you are fine.

Any thoughts? My problem is focus correct? Text is blurry at the right and left middle edges of the screen.

I only mentioned a couple of post that deals with focus. There are many many more to read. Search and read on...there might not be an exact answer to your exact problem, but this forum has touched on almost all existing settings.

Read, get inspired, fix your problem - then you tell all of us exactly what you did.

This thread seems to be about bigger and more expensive models than my little kv-20fs120, but I'm interested in tinkering in the service menu to get the best out of my tv, for practice so I'll be less likely to make mistakes on a larger tv in the future and just for the fun of it. BUT, info on this model is pretty hard to come by, probably because it's so low end that no one ever bothered..

Most of the problems with it are minor and I'll probably be able to fix with DVE once it gets here (except for a slight convergence problem, which I don't think this model has adjustments for), the problem is I don't know what all of the abbreviations in the service menu are. I've managed to get some of the basics from a combination of the things posted early in this thread, and "SONY Service Mode NTSC Version Compiled by Anthony W. Haukap" and a little bit of guessing, but the meaning of the majority of the three hundred settings remain a mystery to me.

I copied down all the names of the settings and their default values in a text document, to which I added the few definitions I could find. I'd get the service manual, but I read that they rarely reveal the meanings of the settings (how the heck do people learn them, then?).

If no one knows where I can find the meaning of all the individual settings, maybe someone could help me understand at least what the categories mean..

They are:

DEF ntsc - I found descriptions for most things in this category, it mostly has to do with geometry stuff.

16:9 ntsc - I'm pretty sure this is for the 16:9 enhanced mode

VP1 ntsc - has controls for the guns and a lot of stuff I have no idea about

vp2 ntsc - no idea

NR ntsc - no idea

Pallet pro - I think they're picture, brightness, etc controls, with a lot of other settings I don't know the meaning of

y ntsc - no idea

C ntsc - no idea

RGB ntsc - no idea

Defd ntsc - no idea

other ntsc - no idea

h/w akb ntsc - still no idea..

audio ntsc - FINALLY, I word I understand.. too bad I don't know what more than half the settings are for

ap2 ntsc - no idea

micro ntsc - no idea

feature ntsc - no idea what the features are or what their settings control

d'oh

I spent hours searching, and right after I decided to give up and ask for help, I found what I was looking for.


I can't post the url, so if anyone needs it, pm me

It's for a slightly different model, but the settings I've checked so far have the same names as mine.

Now I have a new question.. Where is the best glossary of terms for tv calibration terms? I have no idea what things like "eht mode" and "matrix ratio select" are..

By using the pot, could I obtain more left and right edge focus?

If I raised the focus of the entire screen, then maybe Qpam could focus the edges farther? The article said I could never obtain focus at the edges like I could at the center, and this discourages me from even trying to obtain better focus.


Does the pot even affect the edges of the screen?

The article says this because that is the nature of any flat-screen CRT. You might even have to sacrifice center focus to get the edge focus decent. On my Pioneer RPTV, the ISF tech defocused the center ever so slightly to get the extremities focused a bit better. The overall effect is quite nice, as too much center focus (a common mistake) is distracting and causes you to obsess. Not sure if the Sony direct-view CRT works the same though.

That definately helps. I'm getting the courage up to drill the hole and do a full focus readjustment. I will have to remember that. Maybe my center focus is too focused, that could be too. Thx.

Could someone please repost the service manual for the Sony 30HS420, I can't seem to get the links to work.

Could someone please repost the service manual for the Sony 30HS420, I can't seem to get the links to work.


I was having problems and here's what I did - Right click on the document hyperlink and then "open in a new window." Maybe this will work for you.

Bumping focus info previously posted in this thread:


Overall focus is a compromise between focusing bright objects and focusing dark objects, as the scanning dot "blooms" as it gets bright. I will be writing an improved article #07 soon about how to do this more precisely, including the internal focus control on the HV transformer. QPDC *adjusts* the overall dynamic focus of the screen, and its effect is mostly visible in the center. But other adjustments in the 2170P-4 "QP--" series affect the sides, top & bottom, and corners. Using anything but a 2-dinensional high-contrast pattern will mislead you into focusing wrongly -- don't use the raster lines as a criterion! One could argue that an HD broadcast of a sporting event and its long shots of the crowd might be the best pattern. If you diddle, write down the settings before changing them.

DF and DQF are left-right spot-shape balance controls and should maybe be left alone for now. My article will describe how to adjust them using Sony's official methods.

I was having problems and here's what I did - Right click on the document hyperlink and then "open in a new window." Maybe this will work for you.

Thanks, that worked for me as well. Can't believe I didn't think about trying that.

On my 30-XS955 I use the internal QAM tuner to watch Cable; 480i DVD through component to Video 5; and D* HDTivo through HDMI (Video 7).

If I mess around with the geometry in the Service Menu, which I would do while on Video 5, will my changes affect the tuner and Video 7? Also, are geometry changes effective for all picture modes (vivid, pro, std) (I'm guessing yes).

I have the geometry pages from the 34XBR service manual that are posted in the early portion of this thread and they describe tweaking geometry for Full mode, then normal, zoom, widezoom, (twinview which I don't have) and finally HD1080i. If I do all of this while on Video 5, am I all set?

Thanks.

On my 30-XS955 I use the internal QAM tuner to watch Cable; 480i DVD through component to Video 5; and D* HDTivo through HDMI (Video 7).

If I mess around with the geometry in the Service Menu, which I would do while on Video 5, will my changes affect the tuner and Video 7? Also, are geometry changes effective for all picture modes (vivid, pro, std) (I'm guessing yes).

I have the geometry pages from the 34XBR service manual that are posted in the early portion of this thread and they describe tweaking geometry for Full mode, then normal, zoom, widezoom, (twinview which I don't have) and finally HD1080i. If I do all of this while on Video 5, am I all set?

Thanks.

Read post #513 and #514 in this forum

Read post #513 and #514 in this forum


I did and am not sure what the answer to my question is. Are you saying that the geometry settings for one video input will not be effective for other inputs, or just won't be effective for the tuner? If its only the tuner that the changes are not effective for, then what source material should I use for adjusting geometry for the tuner?

I did and am not sure what the answer to my question is. Are you saying that the geometry settings for one video input will not be effective for other inputs, or just won't be effective for the tuner? If its only the tuner that the changes are not effective for, then what source material should I use for adjusting geometry for the tuner?

When you read the grid in the service manual, some entries are universial like 2170D-1, 0, VPOS. Others like MID3, 0, VDHP have settings for both input and input format. Others again have settings for input format and picture mode(vivid, pro..). If there is a specific setting for your input or input format, changes will not impact other inputs and formats.

On 4:3 TV's I would start with the Tuner 480i input in the 2170D-1 and 2 menues. Then the others using the MID2 and 3 settings.

Read the mentioned post, again or search the forum using "Search This Thread".

Is there a way to fix the problem I have where there is a yellow tint to the far left side of the screen like below. It's easy to see on a white screen.

||||

Thanks.

Is there a way to fix the problem I have where there is a yellow tint to the far left side of the screen like below. It's easy to see on a white screen.

||||

Thanks.

Use the "Search this Thread" tool and search for Landing.

Use the "Search this Thread" tool and search for Landing.

I've heard about the Landing aswell but unforttunatly for me the "landing" is not on my KV30HS420.

So only the XBR960 and XS955 models have the LAND parameters?

Just my luck... I have a KV30HS420. Is there anything similar to "landing" for it?

Just my luck... I have a KV30HS420. Is there anything similar to "landing" for it?

Yeah, unfortunatly. When I read about the landing that could corrected the corners of the screen I quickly enterd the SM, and nothing. :(
I'd like to know aswell if there is anything similar to "landing" for the HS420 models.

This is meant to be humorous, right? I'm not trying to be facetious, but this subject has honestly been discussed in great detail in several threads... especially in a number of recent threads posted by new XBOX owners seeking to tweak their Sony sets (e.g. XBR960) to eliminate overscan.

Assuming you're into the service menu (and are familiar with how it is entered, used, saved, and exited), the primary recipe approach is fundamentally twofold: (1) use the VPOS and VSIZ items in the 2170D-1 group, and the HPOS and HSIZ items in the 2170D-2 service menu group, to adjust the "background raster" (aka "canvas") in both horizontal and vertical directions. Then (2) in the MID3 group you use 0 (VDHP horizontal position), 1 (VDHS horizontal size), 2 (VDVE vertical position) and 3 (VDVS vertical size) to manipulate the 1080i/720p "image" on top of the "background" (i.e. within the "background raster").

2170D-1 and 2170D-2 are used to adjust the "canvas" to reach to the physical edges of the screen, so that the image then placed on top of it can utilize all available screen real estate. MID3 is used for the 1080i and 720p image size and placement adjustments, within the background raster area set by 2170D-1 and 2170D-2. You position and size the image over the background so that it is fully visible and reaches to the extreme edges of the background for 0% overscan. Then you enlarge it just a bit more in all four directions (using the test pattern on your screen as the guide) to "crop" out the video noise which you may see at 0% overscan, losing perhaps 1-2% of the image in this final "overscan" adjustment.

As you get into each part of the adjustments, clicking up or down one unit at a time so that you see the precise results of your tweak, you focus on getting the extreme outer edge of the test pattern rectangle visible on your screen. When you're done (at 0% overscan), the complete rectangle should be totally visible on all four sides. No wasted screen, and nothing eliminated (at 0% overscan).

There is an assumption that you have a proper 16:9 test pattern on your screen, the best of which can be found attached to this post which if you can connect your PC to your HDTV is ideal. If you have a video card like ATI Radeon 9800 Pro, it has a second DVI head and you can connect it to your Sony with a DVI-to-HDMI cable setup. Or, you can get the ATI DVI-to-component adapter and connect the second head to your Sony with component video cables.

Otherwise, you can use Avia or DVE DVD's to display geometry and overscan test patterns, though at 480p. Using DVE, you can go to Title 12 (Display Setup Patterns) and then Chapter 17 (1:33 overscan pattern), with the latter "spread" to 16:9 by the MODE button on your remote.

Hope this helps.

I have the Sony KV-30HS420 and even though the service manual has it listed, my service menu does not have the: VDHP, VDHS, VDVE, or the VDVS settings. I'm looking under MID-3 but I do not see it anywhere here or under any of the other categories. Any help or info would be greatly appreciated.

Only I have a 34xs955 which is supposed to be (on the whole) the same set. Some of my other menus are a little off as well, but MID3 has none of the settings listed in the service manual and a complete search of ALL the menus found none of those adjustment parameters. My set has a build date of July 2005. Has there been a revamping of the SM to keep us twiddlers at bay?!?

What gives?

Only I have a 34xs955 which is supposed to be (on the whole) the same set. Some of my other menus are a little off as well, but MID3 has none of the settings listed in the service manual and a complete search of ALL the menus found none of those adjustment parameters. My set has a build date of July 2005. Has there been a revamping of the SM to keep us twiddlers at bay?!?

What gives?

I do not know the 420 but the 955 should be the same as my XBR960, so this is a surprise. Question 1: When you go to the MID3 menu in the service menu or your TV, which entries are there? Question 2: What does your ID, ID7 say?

I do not know the 420 but the 955 should be the same as my XBR960, so this is a surprise. Question 1: When you go to the MID3 menu in the service menu or your TV, which entries are there? Question 2: What does your ID, ID7 say?

On mine (30HS420) it's the following:

ID7 = 17

MID-3
0 YCPO
1 CCPO
2 PRPB
3 DOSA
4 YCWD
5 MYCD
6 PSTP
7 PSTT
8 VHSC
9 VHSL
10 PLHC
11 PLHL
12 MDTC
13 MFRV

I'm not in front of my set (I'm at work. :( ), but I do remember that the listing that Bolo gave is exactly the set that I have. I didn't check the ID/ID7. I most certainly DID NOT change that setting, is it possible it left the factory with the wrong ID group? I would never have thought to check that!!
BTW, did anyone ever figure out if a 955 could mimick a 960 by changing the ID?
Thanks for the advice, PT!
Bolo, what is the buid date on your set? (just for reference.)

I have a 30XS955 built in August 2005. Try going to MID2 and use DHHP, DHHS, DHVP, and DHVS after you've switched to an HD source. The 720p and 1080i are independent of one another if I remember correctly.

That was the other change I noticed! MID2 labels were changed in regards to the second letter of the code (ie. DH HP instead of DR HP and so on...)
Now, you're suggesting that these MID2 settings have the same effect as VDHP, VDHS, VDVE, and VDVS? Curious!
What's the experienced Sony tweakers take on all this?

On mine (30HS420) it's the following:

ID7 = 17

MID-3
0 YCPO
1 CCPO
2 PRPB
3 DOSA
4 YCWD
5 MYCD
6 PSTP
7 PSTT
8 VHSC
9 VHSL
10 PLHC
11 PLHL
12 MDTC
13 MFRV

That is really strange...!

I have 2 versions of the 960/955 service manual and many of the menues are different. One of the most influential is the ID7 setting. I'm not saying that it will change anything but the newest revision of the service manual has the setting to 11 instead of 17. Give it a try. Make the change, save, turn TV off and on again.

....they'e on to us!! :p

That was the other change I noticed! MID2 labels were changed in regards to the second letter of the code (ie. DH HP instead of DR HP and so on...)
Now, you're suggesting that these MID2 settings have the same effect as VDHP, VDHS, VDVE, and VDVS? Curious!
What's the experienced Sony tweakers take on all this?

In my XBR960 the MID2, 0 to 3 settings are for 480i only, MID3, 0 to 3 are for 1080i and 720p in all the different inputs.

I was making my adjustments in 1080i and my MID3 labels were exactly like the ones Bolo's 420 has. :confused:

Did you give the MID2 adjustments a shot? I can only vouch for the Video 5 input, but I don't see why that would make a difference.

Manufactured Date November 2005

JTF,
Sorry, I'm at work and cannot try the settings. :( I will see how it works when I get home! I was setting the Input 5 as well.

Bolo,
That is one fresh tube you got there! :D

About that ID7 line of reasoning, any more thoughts?

That is really strange...!

I have 2 versions of the 960/955 service manual and many of the menues are different. One of the most influential is the ID7 setting. I'm not saying that it will change anything but the newest revision of the service manual has the setting to 11 instead of 17. Give it a try. Make the change, save, turn TV off and on again.

What will that do? By changing that it won't affect any of the hard coded settings will it?

JTF,
Sorry, I'm at work and cannot try the settings. :( I will see how it works when I get home!

Bolo,
That is one fresh tube you got there! :D

About that ID7 line of reasoning, any more thoughts?

Yeah I got it so I could play HD Xbox 360 :D .

From my limited knowledge base, it seems the ID settings let the set know -1)What functions it can utilize and 2) What the base settings will be.
It seems to be an evolving instruction set that is a lot of layers and patches that has grown over the life of these models. Easier than "reinventing the wheel" every time a new model comes along. Add a new component....patch the instruction set to the SM.

p.s. I'm rockin' the 360 as well! (Yummy!!!)

What will that do? By changing that it won't affect any of the hard coded settings will it?

It didn't for me. I lost ALL my settings by using a bad 7-9 combination. I then read in all the default settings from the service manual, to get a starting point. Now 3 months later I have a TV that is better than it was. One problem was that the newest service manual said that ID7 should be 19. With 19 picture in picture didn't work and I couldn't get my harmony remote to work either. Two weeks later I found an older revision of the service manual that had the ID7 at 25. I changed it and everything was perfect.

I honestly cannot remember if any existing settings were changed. I think not, but as with all these setings - write down everything before tinkering.

JTF,

I tried the MID2 settings as you suggested. They seemed to have the same effect as the 2170D-1 & 2170D-2 (vpos/vsiz & hpos/hsiz). The issue I'm having is that I can't expand the image to 0% overscan and center it, it's just unbalanced as to how much you can see of the right/left and top/bottom edges. Also, to get anywhere near good geometry, I have to resort to 5%+ overscan because the bottom edge curves SEVERELY to the left at the last 3/4" of the raster.

This is the 5th 955 I've been through and the best of the buch, so far. It would be nice to send it to an Authorized repair shop and see if Sony will help me work these issues out. Am I delusional in expecting anything along these lines?

Bryan

JTF,

I tried the MID2 settings as you suggested. They seemed to have the same effect as the 2170D-1 & 2170D-2 (vpos/vsiz & hpos/hsiz). The issue I'm having is that I can't expand the image to 0% overscan and center it, it's just unbalanced as to how much you can see of the right/left and top/bottom edges. Also, to get anywhere near good geometry, I have to resort to 5%+ overscan because the bottom edge curves SEVERELY to the left at the last 3/4" of the raster.

This is the 5th 955 I've been through and the best of the buch, so far. It would be nice to send it to an Authorized repair shop and see if Sony will help me work these issues out. Am I delusional in expecting anything along these lines?

Bryan

I do not know where you live, but in this thread there are several suggestions to how you find the "right" sony support people. There are also specific addresses to guys that actually know how to work the magnets.

If you go the "normal" route to the sony service groups, 5% overscan will be considered "within specs".

You have to remember that you should only set the raser and thereby overscan using the 2170-D, 1 and 2 settings. The MID settings should only be used to center the different "other" inputs and formats.

Well, I live in Omaha Nebraska, if anyone knows of someone in my vicinity.
My issue is that I thow the first crosshatch pattern (from the QM menu) for the 1080i. Let's say I shrink the raster so I can see it's edges. The pattern is not centered within the raster and I thought the MID3 settings move the "picture" around on the "canvas"/raster. Am I completely wrong? Ifso, how do I move the pattern in respect to the raster? I have no doubt that the ammount of overscan/stetching has quite an impact on the PQ and, in particular, artifacts like edge ringing.
BTW, thanks for your continued interest in helping me. I forgot to mention that I tried different values in the ID7. Mine was set at 17. Tried 11 and 25. No difference to picture or menu structure. Boo!

Well, I live in Omaha Nebraska, if anyone knows of someone in my vicinity.
My issue is that I thow the first crosshatch pattern (from the QM menu) for the 1080i. Let's say I shrink the raster so I can see it's edges. The pattern is not centered within the raster and I thought the MID3 settings move the "picture" around on the "canvas"/raster. Am I completely wrong? Ifso, how do I move the pattern in respect to the raster? I have no doubt that the ammount of overscan/stetching has quite an impact on the PQ and, in particular, artifacts like edge ringing.
BTW, thanks for your continued interest in helping me. I forgot to mention that I tried different values in the ID7. Mine was set at 17. Tried 11 and 25. No difference to picture or menu structure. Boo!

Since I have a 16:9 TV I always start by setting the full 16:9 raster in 1080i, by using the "overscan" pattern. This will set and center the raster and control the overscan. Then I change to all the other inputs one by one and center them using MID2 for 480i and MID3 for the rest.

In your case I would start with a 480i signal for your 4:3 TV, find the correct overscan pattern in the QM menu. Then of cause this signal and input should not be further corrected in MID2 and MID3, just the rest of the signals ond inputs.

I hope I didn't give the wrong impression. I have the 34xs955 (widescreen). I am doing the same proceedure you describe above only with the crosshatch. It has a dashed rectangle which, I believe marks the 5% range. Would you suggest using the "overscan" pattern from a DVD or from the QM menu? I would think the TV generated one would be best to use (this may be my first misconception!) If you look at the QM "overscan" pattern, how many hash marks outside the rectangle do you want to see?
Question, did you think I had a 30" or 36" by the ID7 number I provided? Just curious...

I was just reading in the 34xbr manual that they suggest using the 2150D-1 #12 SCRL(vpos) and #11 ASPT(vsiz) and 2150D-2 #1 HPOS for adjustments in 1080i mode. they also suggest doing this only after centering the raster in "FULL" mode using Input 1 (480i?). Then work out all your geometry problems and then go on to 1080i...confused? I am....
And has anyone else discovered that their MID3 menu does not match the general service manual?

I was just reading in the 34xbr manual that they suggest using the 2150D-1 #12 SCRL(vpos) and #11 ASPT(vsiz) and 2150D-2 #1 HPOS for adjustments in 1080i mode. they also suggest doing this only after centering the raster in "FULL" mode using Input 1 (480i?). Then work out all your geometry problems and then go on to 1080i...confused? I am....
And has anyone else discovered that their MID3 menu does not match the general service manual?

I'm pretty confused as well, has anyone with the Sony 30HS420 figured out how to do this. Which settings are for which input/video mode (480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i)? Any help any one can offer will be greatly appreciated.

I had to first set my geometry in 480p, and 1080i fell into place. If I tried doing it in 1080i, then it would be off in 480. It's confusing, but that's the way it works. I think the manual says it has to be done that way.

I also tried to adjust 1080i overscan with HSIZ, and also got curved edges. I had to end up losing a few lines on each side, but not quite as many as before.

Yeah, unfortunatly. When I read about the landing that could corrected the corners of the screen I quickly enterd the SM, and nothing. :(
I'd like to know aswell if there is anything similar to "landing" for the HS420 models.

I have a 34HS420 and yes there are landing settings. They are in D-CONV in the service menu. There is RUMP, which is right upper, LUMP which is left upper, etc. Use a 50IRE cross hatch and fiddle with the adjustments in this menu to line things up.

Hello
I have the Australian version of the XBR 910/ 960 and I've been in service mode before.

Can anyone walk me through how to adjust horizontal pincushion, this horizontal bowing at the edges is starting to give me the shits.

I have a 34HS420 and yes there are landing settings. They are in D-CONV in the service menu. There is RUMP, which is right upper, LUMP which is left upper, etc. Use a 50IRE cross hatch and fiddle with the adjustments in this menu to line things up.

Thank you! Is the geometry generally better on the HS420 than the XS955? All the demos I've seen in town would lead me to believe this, and Sony has disco'd the XS but not the HS. Hmmm...

Has anyone had the problem where on the left side of a 4:3 picture there is a small fuzzy virtical line where the 4:3 picture meets the black bars? I have heard of this many times, my tv has this slightly and i would like to know how to fix it. I am getting frustrated now as i have asked this question numerous times in about 2 weeks with no answers, please help me and also how much does DVE cost? Will fixing the overscan in video 5 fix it for viewing digital cable or what? Thank you.

Thank you! Is the geometry generally better on the HS420 than the XS955? All the demos I've seen in town would lead me to believe this, and Sony has disco'd the XS but not the HS. Hmmm...

I couldn't say but I beleive they use the same magnetics so in that respect they wouldn't be any different, However, the XS series uses the fine pitch tube meaning more resolution so I think it might have a little better convergence. But really the HS is quite good and I was able to get really great convergence on my set, certainly better than the factory settings.

I drilled a hole and diddled with my focus pot. The pot adjusts the ENTIRE screen. It makes a huge huge difference. I followed Kentec's article on precision focusing exactly. It's still not where I want it. The bottom right and right is constantly blurry, and I have attempted a refocus twice now. I follow the article exactly. The blurry on the right and not the left is even worse than just blurry. The uneveness is even more noticable.

Right now, I am back at my original settings with the focus nob adjusted for best overall focus while I research more. The focus nob has a point where all the extremeties come into their best focus, and this is where I have it at now, without any Service Menu adjustments. The side and corner focus is still nowhere near the center focus however.

#1 : Following Kentec exactly: Top middle blurry, right middle and right bottom corner blurry.

#2 Freeform attempt after following Kentec step on adjusting DQP. Right middle and bottom corner blurry.

I just don't know. If I called an ISF tech, could I hope to get focus at the corners and left, right.bottom,top-middle, like I get focus in the center? Is this possible?I'm just getting frustrated. If I kept trying to fix it, do you think I could ever get a uniform focus close to that of the center?

Television is a Sony KV36HS500

I drilled a hole and diddled with my focus pot. The pot adjusts the ENTIRE screen. It makes a huge huge difference. I followed Kentec's article on precision focusing exactly. It's still not where I want it. The bottom right and right is constantly blurry, and I have attempted a refocus twice now. I follow the article exactly. The blurry on the right and not the left is even worse than just blurry. The uneveness is even more noticable.

Right now, I am back at my original settings with the focus nob adjusted for best overall focus while I research more. The focus nob has a point where all the extremeties come into their best focus, and this is where I have it at now, without any Service Menu adjustments. The side and corner focus is still nowhere near the center focus however.

Don't use the pot for fine adjustment especially for the corners, it is for coarse adjustment in the center of the screen. There are magnetic rings around the neck of the tube for corner adjsutment but don't mess with them, your'e gonna end up chasing your tail. Get the pot back to where it was and stick with the service menu adjustments in which there are many. You really need to get the service manual.

You can finely adjust the center in D-CONV as well as the corners. Here are some of the defintions but I don't remember all of them. Start with the center and work your way out. Make sure they are back to the factor settings before you readjust the pot

D-CONV
(CXA8070)
0 YBWU 0-63
1 YBWL 0-63
2 RSAP 0-63
3 RUMB 0-63[ right upper
4 RUBW 0-63; right upper
5 RLMB 0-63; right lower
6 RLBW 0-63; right lower
7 LSAP 0-63
8 LUMB 0-63; left upper
9 LUBW 0-63; left upper
10 LLMB 0-63; left lower
11 LLBW 0-63; left lower
12 CADJ 0-63; center adjust
13 HVCA 0-63

Don't use the pot for fine adjustment especially for the corners, it is for coarse adjustment in the center of the screen. There are magnetic rings around the neck of the tube for corner adjsutment but don't mess with them, your'e gonna end up chasing your tail. Get the pot back to where it was and stick with the service menu adjustments in which there are many. You really need to get the service manual.

You can finely adjust the center in D-CONV as well as the corners. Here are some of the defintions but I don't remember all of them. Start with the center and work your way out. Make sure they are back to the factor settings before you readjust the pot

So my problem is convergence as well? I need this answered. People are using "convergence" and "focus" in the same sentences, and I don't understand. Is my fuzzy text in certain areas of the screen a focus problem or a convergance problem?

When you said. "Get the pot back to where it was and stick with the service menu adjustments in which there are many." Which pot position do you want? The one where I focus it for best center focus via Kentec's Guide, or the setting I have now, which seems to make the outsides of the screen the clearest with my original Service Menu settings?

Thankyou for informing me of this. I will remember that the pot is only for coarse center adjustments. This means that Kentec's guide about adjusting the the pot for best center focus is the definate guide? So let me reiterate.

What you want me to do is. " Make sure they(the 2170D-4 settings) are back to the factor settings before you readjust the pot." Then readjust the pot for best possible center focus? I guess I'm still a little foggy.

I have a service manual for my KV36HS500


Next, I really need your confirmation on this. You mentioned convergence settings in your reply. Convergence can have an affect on focus? I was thinking that focus pot + Focus Service Menu settings were my problem. Is convergence my problem as well? Which do you do first? Convergence or Focus? If you could just tell me, I can research convergence. I am in desperate need of help. Just send me in the right direction once again.

So my problem is convergence as well? I need this answered. People are using "convergence" and "focus" in the same sentences, and I don't understand. Is my fuzzy text in certain areas of the screen a focus problem or a convergence problem?

First I need to now if you can display a cross hatch or a dot pattern. Do you have the Avia disk?

Focus and convergence are really two different things but most people use it to mean the same thing. Partly becasue of the nomenclature of the Service Menu options I think. What you are really doing is converging three focused electron beams to land on the red, green and blue phosphors to make a white pixel.

First, reset all of the Service Menu items you changed back to their original settings. Display the Avia pattern with the plusses (+), I think you can select one that is 50 IRE. Now look at the + in the very center, is it a straight up and down or do you see a small blue edge or green edge? You really have a red plus, a green plus and a blue plus in the center and you want them all to line up or "converge. Now adjust the pot on the back of the set so the lines are as thin or sharp as they can get and the RGB +'s look lined up. Remeber this is for coarse adjustment, you will improve on it in the service menu.

What you want me to do is. " Make sure they(the 2170D-4 settings) are back to the factor settings before you readjust the pot." Then readjust the pot for best possible center focus? I guess I'm still a little foggy.

Yes, just try to undo what you did the best you can. After that we'll take the next step

Good luck

mdtiberi, I greatly appreciate your help. You must know how maddening it can be.I appreciate everyone's help.

Ok, I just did this tonight.I tried following your suggestions as close as possible. I went into service menu and returned all 2170D-4(Focus) settings to their original values. I then brought up Kentec's 4:3 Focus Matrix, and turned on only the green gun. I tweaked the center focus pattern for absolute best focus. My face was very close to the screen, and the center focus is at it's very best.

I then turned back on all the guns, and looked at a white 4:3 Crosshatch pattern. I'm using Video Essentials by the way, but used a crosshatch pattern on stick. I looked closely at the right side of the screen. At about 1.5-1.0 ft from the screen, I noticed large amounts of convergence issue on the right side of the screen. When looking at the right vertical lines, I could detect a red line, a green line, and a blue line quite distinctly. I then looked at the center. The convergence was much better compared to the right side of the screen. Only a slight trace of red and blue could be seen. The left had a little problem as well, however not like the right.

Could this be what's causing my blurry text at the extremeties of the screen? The areas of the screen that suffer from blurry text are also suffering from convergence issues. Are they tied together? What's the next step. (I don't think Kentec wrote a convergence guide.)

Yes, I think the misconvergence is causing you to see blurry text. I do not know the SM items for your set but do you have D-CONV? First play with the CADJ or center adjust and get that where you like it then move out to the edges. The settings LUMB, LLMB, are for left lower and left upper found in D-CONV. Try fiddling with these settings so you can see how they work. You might also have to go back to QPAM and some of the geometry settings for pin cushion etc. All of these settings interact with one another so it can get a little tricky. Just take your time and make notes. Eventually it will all come together.

Thx mdtiberi

I am working on convergence settings in D-Conv, as well as geometry settings in 2170D-1. What is the order that you should do adjustments? Geomerty>Convergence>Focus. The convergence is helping quite a bit. I guess convergence can make white text look fuzzy/blurry. I know a cross hatch vertical line that isn't converged looks fuzzy.

I've just been looking at a white crosshatch to do focus on.

I have a question however. In the top middle of my screen the middle section of a "Horizontal Line" is not converged. I have heard that convergence on horizontal lines, or "vertical convergence" can't be done. Are there any settings that could possibly fix that area?

Wow, QPAM made a huge difference! I'd tried D-CONV and 2170D-1 with few results. The crosshatch lines were still fuzzy until I changed QPAM, and then they got very sharp. The geometry is still a bit off, but the convergence is better than ever!

Hello,

Could someone tell me how to get the files in this thread to download.
Error message says it can't find the files

Thanks

Hello,

Could someone tell me how to get the files in this thread to download.
Error message says it can't find the files

Thanks

Right click, open in new window.

To anyone who has had discoloration in corners of their set and fixed it by changing the Landing settings:

I just tried to do this with no luck. I thought I had the same problem as you all do, but now I wonder. My new xbr960 has discoloration in three of the corners, the top left the worst by far, but it doesn't stay there. It comes and goes, maybe once or twice a minute a color distortion will bleed out of the corner a ways, maybe pulse a little, and then move back in. Did you all have something like that or just steady discoloration?

It makes it tough to watch the tv right now. My eyes keep moving to the color distortions when they occur. Thanks for any help.

To anyone who has had discoloration in corners of their set and fixed it by changing the Landing settings:

I just tried to do this with no luck. I thought I had the same problem as you all do, but now I wonder. My new xbr960 has discoloration in three of the corners, the top left the worst by far, but it doesn't stay there. It comes and goes, maybe once or twice a minute a color distortion will bleed out of the corner a ways, maybe pulse a little, and then move back in. Did you all have something like that or just steady discoloration?

It makes it tough to watch the tv right now. My eyes keep moving to the color distortions when they occur. Thanks for any help.

Move your speakers away from the TV

Well, not only are they shielded and pretty far away at is it, except the center speaker on top, but I of course did that the second I saw something like this, didn't affect it. Thanks though. I've done it in the past and learned my lesson.

Deckels
No my colour purity problems were constant , never pulsating.

I'm a bit concerned about your's though

Where's Dakotatech when u need him?

Is it still under warranty?

In a 9-30-05 post, Kentech wrote:

"Further, no matter what I have said before, there are two places where sharpness is very significantly controlled *in addition* to 2170P-3 and the MID5 table. I'll write that up soon. I have some substantially improved image settings to recommend for different sources, based on these (for me) recent discoveries. Surprising improvements for SD broadcast and SD over S-video, and for DVD on component inputs, less so for HD broadcast."

Since that time, he has been silent. Does anyone have a clue what he was talking about?

Since that time, he has been silent. Does anyone have a clue what he was talking about?
Sorry to have been absent from ths forum for so long. There is that need to shoot the engineer and publish the results, no?

What I have been doing is watching tons of movies from my newish Panasonic S97 DVD player, which is nearly perfect over its component outputs at 480i, letting the TV perform 3:2 pulldown when I care about it (not always). As a result I have been revising my settings for image processing and shaping — that is, the equalization and/or enhancement of real-world video so it looks like a million dollars. Then I’ve been adapting what I have learned there to the other video inputs and sources.

In particular, I have been trying to track down *every* source of edge enhancement and ringing in the entire signal chain, starting with the DVD disk. Fortunately there are some DVDs that simply have no significant edge enhancement or artifacts of their own. How does one know? By playing them on a computer screen digitally and displaying the picture pixel-for-pixel. A good example is The Incredibles, an example of great computer-to-DVD perfection, followed closely by Monsters, Inc. This test can be done with the open-source software “VLC” from videolan.com, with the display-ratio settings at 720:480 (Mac or PC).

Without getting into many gory details quite yet, I will say the following:

(1) I mentioned sharpness/EQ settings “hiding” in a couple of places. Right. Here they are:

(a) First, in plain sight: 2170P-3. I have decided that #9-F1LV introduces too much after-edge outlining for me, and I have generally set it to zero. Further, after having lived with SYSM=3 for some time, I now realize that the least harmful equalization can be found in SYSM=2. Set properly, it acts like true unsharp-masking (a term digital-camera fans will understand).

(b) Also, I use the MID5 enhancements *very* conservatively. POP=63 is always set to all-zeroes for nos. 1-18, which pretty much makes MID5 pass-through if I set MIDE=63 in 2170P-3. Then small amounts of very-fine-detail enhancement can be added in other columns by setting MHYL=3 and varying MHYE from 0 (no effect) to 7 (max effect). We’re talking skin and cloth texture, here, not big edge-sharpness. Settings of MHYE=2 or 3 are helpful for all fine sources, such as DVDs and HDTV. A “heavier” setting for SD sources can be had by setting MHYO to 1 (makes it coarser), MHYL=3, and then MHYE to 1 to 3.

(c) The “hidden” enhancements are real troublemakers! The worst is in 2103-1, nos. 6-8, SHAP-SHF0-PREO. SHAP is yet another sharpness enhancer, but this one is in mid-detail, and it rings, adding coarseness and a “video look” to fine sources. 2103-1 does NOT affect certain digital inputs (e.g. HDMI, HDTV from tuner) and always affects V5/V6 component 480i, S-video 480i, and RF-tuner and digital-tuner 480i. Recommended: set SHAP to zero, SHF0 to 3, and PREO (less critical) to 0 or 3 (haven’t decided yet).

(d) For all S-video, composite-video, and RF-tuner 480i sources, the 3D comb filter separate color from luminance, and the 3D-COMB section has significant sharpness tweaks, nos. 14 and 15: VAPG and VAPI for vertical anhancement (generally not used, which means zeros); and nos. 17 and 18: YPFT and YPFG. In this case, YPFG can act as either a detail-reducer or enhancer, with no effect at YPFG=8. (Possibly 7; still experimenting.) Note that the 3D-COMB settings have no effect on all high-quality sources, such as HDTV, HDMI, and component inputs. Recommended: Set VAPG and VAPI to zero, YPFT to 3 and YPFG to 8.

***************

SO . . . Imagine a chart so we can track this stuff. (Attached is a PDF of a useful chart for keeping track of these settings. Print on legal-size paper.)

The settings can be grouped in a table. Reading down the far-left column . . .

3D-COMB: 14-15-17-18 (4 rows) X 4 columns, 1 for each picture mode (Pro, Standard, Movie, Vivid).

2103-1: 6-7-8 (3 rows), only one column for all picture modes.

2170P-3: 0 thru 16, SYSM-VMLV-VMCR- ... - MIDE (17 rows grouped 1-1-4-4-3-3-1, according to function) X 4 columns, 1 for each picture mode.

MID5: 0 thru 18, POP-MHLY-MHLC- ... -MVCE (19 rows grouped 1-4-4-4-3-3, according to finction) and sample columns showing the POP values for possible MIDE values in 2170P-3, above.

The row-orders are the same as in the parameter charts from the Sony service manuals that have been published.

Example: My latest thinking for DVD-480i thru component inputs in Pro mode is:

3D-COMB: 14-15-17-18 = not applicable.
2103-1: 6-7-8 = 0-3-3
2170P-3: 0 thru 16 = 2 — n — 0-3-2-8 — 0-1-3-0 — 0-1-0 — 5-0-0 — 60, where n depends on the velocity-modulation setting. UBOF = 5 balances the black level against my other inputs. There, YMMV.

MIDE: 0 thru 18 = 60 — 0-0-0-0 — 0-3-3-0 — 0-0-0-0 — 0-0-0 — 0-0-0

This requires the user Sharpness slider to be set at 25-35, depending on taste. Mine is usually near 30.

************

Cryptic and confusing? I guess those were some of the gory details, indeed! I have been through these numbers so many times that I think of them as a series. When I am writing down what I am doing, for example, in the 2170P-3 settings, I just scribble the 17 numbers in a column with lines between the groups. That way I can see patterns developing or changing as I experiment. If the chart is used as a template, then one can publish settings as a number-series, as I have done above. Note that a chart as described above may cover all picture modes, but there has to be a separate chart for each video-input class and scan type.

Final thoughts for now:

(1) I believe that very conservative velocity modulation settings (ClearEdge) are a benefit for non-HD sources, maybe even for HD. I have set it according to what I have previously written: For all picture modes, 2170P-3-VM, VMH, VMM, VML are set to 0-9-6-3, respectively. I typicaly have the user VM control set to Medium, maybe Low or Off for HDTV. Set conservatively, it does NOT suppress fine detail as rumors would have it. (But some of the ringy enhancement filters can do that, as implied earlier.)

I have been experimenting extensively with the settings in 2170P-3, nos. 2-5, the codes that entirely determine the "look" of VM. The current settings of 0-3-2-8 replace earlier settings of 0-3-1-0 and seem to cause less distortion of high-contrast vertical edges while reducing the mush from the scanning spot. The differences are subtle and matter only if there is any VM turned on at all.

(2) I can’t fathom Sony’s claim of “minimum enhancements” for the Pro mode, as it clearly invokes certain digital filters that significantly modiofy the image, in some cases to its detriment. I’ve tried to ferret out these effects and control them. I am making judgements based on a near-photographic reproduction of DVD material from source to screen, and some enhancement and sharpening *is* necessary — but it doesn’t have to be ugly! The same settings applied to HDTV prove the result — almost shocking photo-like detail, when the broadcast is good.

(3) Summary: The most valuable lesson I have learned here is setting 2170P-3/SYSM to 2, reserving all fine-detail adjustments for the MID5 group of codes, and turning OFF all other sharpening filters for fine sources. The the Sharpness slider is used to adjust overall sharpness to taste. (Exception: for SD cable-broadcast, I turn 2170P-3: F1LV up to 3. Ordinary broadcast can be pretty awful, but even that benefitted from getting the nasty sharpness eliminated from 2103-1. It also made my VHS tapes look gawd-awful and grainy; much better now.)

UPDATE: Attached chart is now revised to include SSMD and PPHA parameters. See post #1040 here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7162837&&#post7162837).

Sorry to have been absent from ths forum for so long. There is that need to shoot the engineer and publish the results, no?

Good to see you back...!

The bottom right and right is constantly blurry, and I have attempted a refocus twice now. I follow the article exactly. The blurry on the right and not the left is even worse than just blurry. The uneveness is even more noticable.
The focus pot is an *overall-focus* adjustment, as is 2170P-4 #3 QPDC. They sort of duplicate each other -- but not quite. You can isolate them only by adding an electrical jumper onto one of the circuit boards, and that's not possible without taking the back off the set. That's why I suggested setting QPDC to either the default or (maybe for you) the middle of its range.

Yes, the whole screen is affected by the adjustment pot, but you should pay attention only to the center and get that to be the best compromise between the pot setting and QPDC. In addition, you are trying to balance any asymmetry in the deflection yoke or its mounting on the tube by doing this step: "Adjust 2170D-4 #8, DQP until vertical line widths at equal distances from center are balanced." I.e. you want the left and right sides to be *equally* out-of-focus during this step. This is how Sony suggests to do it, and it worked fine for me on my 36XS955.

Having now set up the center focus, all you can do is the best you can with the dynamic-focus controls described in steps 5-7. The corners will *always* be crappier than the center -- fact of life for CRTs. Just do the best you can; it's going to be a compromise no matter what. The detailed dynamic-focus settings are designed to minimize the *differences* between the screen's outer reaches and the center.

Focus and convergence are completely different matters. Focus is the attempt to make the scanning dot (of whatever color) as small as possible over as much of the screen as possible. Convergence is the attempt to make the three color dots (red, green, blue) line up perfectly over as much of the screen as possible, no matter the focus.

If the green pattern is well-focused, the other colors are as well, as the three electron guns are designed to track that way. But if you see color fringing on horizital or vertical edges or lines, that means the three (well-focused) colors aren't lining up properly, and that is what convergence is all about. It's usually set up with a fine-dot pattern over all the screen. You can adjust for nearly perfect horizontal convergence (no fringing on vertical lines), but fringing on horizontal lines is tough to cure, as it means fooling with permanent magnets inside the set -- not a pleasant job, and sometimes the best you can achieve, again, is a compromise.

If you have the center 3/4 of the area of your picture well-focused and converged, you likely will not pay much attention to outer aberrations when watching actual video material, especially in the corners -- well, excepting maybe for games and other computer graphics. . . . And I hope this method works well for your HS500, a set with which I have no personal experience.

It comes and goes, maybe once or twice a minute a color distortion will bleed out of the corner a ways, maybe pulse a little, and then move back in. Did you all have something like that or just steady discoloration?
I'm really suspicious of this "pulsing." If it were an adjustment-fixable problem, it wouldn't be pulsing. The way you describe it, the pulsing sounds like the difference between the scan rate of NTSC-standard TV (59.94Hz or something like that) and the exact 60Hz of the power mains. This means that it could be caused by a low-level interference from a 60Hz outside magnetic field caused by a big motor, transformer, overhead power lines, roof air conditioner, apartment-building wiring, whatever. If you change the orientation of the set in the room, by turning it or relocating it, and the pulsing changes in pattern or degree, I really would suspect this.

(This problem plagues computer-monitor users, too. How about major power lines just outside a third-floor office of a client? Caused an maddening 15Hz wobble of the 75Hz-scan display.)

Oh, Hell, I just thought of something else less pleasant. It could be that there is some kind of leakage in the device that is supposed to turn of *completely* the degaussing current that causes the big "bzzt" when you first turn on your set. If it's a relay, small chance of that; but if the device is what is called a PTC resistor, then it may be defective. Can you have it checked out under warranty? A definitive test would be to open the back of the set and temporarily disconnect (unplug) the degaussing coil from the curcuit board where it normally connects. If the pulsing stops, that's the problem.

Thankyou KenTech. I greatly appreciate the help and response. I'm still trying to get my geomerty/convergence/focus down. All of which are not so hot. I have never really noticed the convergence/focus problems until I started using HDTV content heavily. 480i and 480p do not allow one to notice the focus/convergence problems, so it is just recently that I have noticed these problems. I'm going to try again tonight with a geometry>convergence>focus extravaganza. Sometimes I wish I would have waited until now to buy my HDTV. I would have bought a widescreen DLP. Candy and Nuts though. Thanks again.

TV: KV36HS500

Do any of you know why on my KV-30HS420 the HDMI input port won't work after doin a mid reset data? ALl of my ID are set properly and everything... I just can't see why....

I know that the service codes list and data sheets are posted here as adobe pdf files, but I cannot find them posted as excel spreadsheets, which makes them easire to use. If anyone knows which post the spreadsheets are found in, or if you have the spreadsheets for the XS955 line, could you please let me know. I'd like to be able to keep an electronic table, rather than paper only. Thanks.

I know that the service codes list and data sheets are posted here as adobe pdf files, but I cannot find them posted as excel spreadsheets, which makes them easire to use. If anyone knows which post the spreadsheets are found in, or if you have the spreadsheets for the XS955 line, could you please let me know. I'd like to be able to keep an electronic table, rather than paper only. Thanks.

I personally find the adobe pdf files that contain the actual service manual listings to be more useful than the spreadsheets. The service manual listings very clearly indicate how the parameters are distributed across inputs, picture modes, DRC modes, etc. The spreadsheets don't make these issues clear. Without this information, navigating and modifying parameters can be confusing and risky. I simply print the pdf listing and pencil in my differences/modifications. The spreadsheets do provide useful information in that the authors have provided explanations of many of the parameters. YMMV.

Raoul

I assumed the pdf files were just "snapshots" of the excel sheets. I just want to be able to manipulate the data in the sheet, as well as be able to manipulate the print area. I know this is petty, but if the files exist . . .

I know that the service codes list and data sheets are posted here as adobe pdf files, but I cannot find them posted as excel spreadsheets, which makes them easire to use.
Here is the only one I'm aware of, for the 34XBR910, which has only a few differences with the later sets. There are a couple of vatiations of this, but this seems the most informed. Note that some of the "descriptions" are, at best, wild guesses.

But note that this is not as useful as you would believe. The spreadsheets give you *no* clue as to how the code-settings are memorized for different combinations of picture mode, video mode, and input type. Except for an occasional quick look, I have found the spreadsheets essentially useless! They helped at the beginning of my experimentation, but only the charts can make plain what is stored when you WRITE the settings.

Example: The MID5 code-group alone starts with a table of 64 columns X 19 rows, all visible in the charts. The spreadsheets give no clue! Same with the complex 2170P groups. The simple vertical listing in the spreadsheet is useless!

Both are attached>

FAIR WARNING: CHANGES DURING WARMUP

It will not come as any surprise to anyone reading my posts that, for me, no tweaking of these XS955/XBR960 sets brings as much benefit as optimizing the image-processing path. My post #707 is an example. (Of course, that presumes you have satisfactory focus and geometry — but geometry is a separate issue.)

But I have some shocking news in case some of you have found yourselves chasing your tail at times: Something substantial changes within the set during warmup. Well, it’s more complicated than that. Let me explain.

It is known that solid-state devices (all of the chips, transistors, and processors) change electrical characteristics with warmup. Amplifiers improve in gain and ability to handle high frequencies. Memory and switching chips actually slow down slightly. The whole chain of processing in these sets is really crappy when cold, improving substantially in the first ten minutes of operation after a really cold start, say in the morning in a cool house. The tube doesn’t look its best, either.

All you have to do to prove the point is to put up one of AVIA’s Resolution test patterns. The second pattern in the Resolution group, “200 TVL,” is good. Turn on a cold TV, and put up this pattern in Pro mode as soon as you can from your DVD player. Then watch the vertical wedges and the lower-right circle change over half an hour! But that’s only the half of it.

Example of what got me wondering: I once put up a test pattern 5 minutes after startup, reviewed my charts and planned what I was going to do, then looked at the TV and realized I had forgotten to put it into Service mode. 15 minutes had gone by or more. Fine. So I restarted the TV and went through the button sequence on the remote to put it into Service mode. But wait! Now the pattern looked much improved! What was going on here? Only 20 seconds had elapsed.

After getting somewhat confused by this and undergoing some hair-replacement, I have come to this solid conclusion: This TV performs some sort of self-optimizing calibration at startup, likely to compensate for temperature and set-to-set variations in components. It happens during that first 10 seconds or so while the screen is dark. It has nothing to do with Service mode. Important: It performs this calibration at EVERY RESTART.

I’ll state it a different way: If you turn on your set from cold, it performs this calibration as best it can, and presents a picture. But it is not at its best yet — that takes 15 minutes or more of warmup. If you display high-quality video, say through the component inputs (a 480i test pattern proves the point), then restart the set after 15 minutes or more, the image/pattern improves, and very substantially for the best video (a great DVD, say). And by “restart” I mean power-off/on for 0.5 - 1 second, that’s all. Fine detail seems most affected.

I don’t think at present it affects straight-digital inputs, such as HDMI or HD broadcast from the tuner; but it definitely affects any 480i analog video from any input. Which leads me to believe the culprit is the 2130 chip, but I can’t prove it, and it doesn’t really matter. I can’t say whether mine is the only set that does this, either, but I doubt it.

Bottom line: If you are going to experiment with image-processing tweaks, restart the set after 15-30 minutes before working on it. And if you are going to watch any 480i material, warm up the TV first, then restart after 15-30 minutes. It will then be at its best. I now routinely restart the set after warmup, no matter what I am watching, to force recalibration. It may not matter for the evening news or CNN, but it does if the analog broadcast is high-quality and you’re awake enough to care.

Has anyone besides Bolo the Romeo and I noticed that their MID3 menu looks nothing like the service manual layout? He has a 420 and I have a 955. Both of our ID7 settings are 17. If you care to catch up, our quandary starts at post # 661.
Please help some brothers out!

Bryan

Okay - I finally printed out the 22 page PDF chart for the XS series (I have the 30XS955) and recorded all of my initial settings for V5/V6 (using my HDTivo connected to V6, which allowed me to toggle output between 480i and 1080i - I don't use 480p or 720p).

I noticed that on several settings, what the chart had for 480i and 1080i was reversed. For example: 3DNR #43 - YEL (Vivid) is listed as 6 (480i) and 4 (1080i) on the chart, but my actuals were the opposite - 4 (480i) and 6 (1080i).

Another example is 3DNR #41 - YMG (Vivid) - The chart has 3 (480i) and 1 (1080i), but my actuals were the opposite - 1 (480i) and 3 (1080i).

Any ideas about this?

Finally, I'm one of those people who made a few changes before printing the charts. The only changes I made prior to printing the charts were to the geometry settings and I wrote down my changes at the time I made them, but I was not perfect in doing so. I think I may have changed a couple of settings without recording the original value. If anyone has their originals for these two groups (only 2170-D1 and D2), I'd very much appreciate a PM. I think I have most of the original values recorded, but I'm not 100% positive. My geometry is fine but I'd like to be certain about the original settings if I can be. Thanks.

I'm really suspicious of this "pulsing." If it were an adjustment-fixable problem, it wouldn't be pulsing. The way you describe it, the pulsing sounds like the difference between the scan rate of NTSC-standard TV (59.94Hz or something like that) and the exact 60Hz of the power mains. This means that it could be caused by a low-level interference from a 60Hz outside magnetic field caused by a big motor, transformer, overhead power lines, roof air conditioner, apartment-building wiring, whatever. If you change the orientation of the set in the room, by turning it or relocating it, and the pulsing changes in pattern or degree, I really would suspect this.

(This problem plagues computer-monitor users, too. How about major power lines just outside a third-floor office of a client? Caused an maddening 15Hz wobble of the 75Hz-scan display.)

Oh, Hell, I just thought of something else less pleasant. It could be that there is some kind of leakage in the device that is supposed to turn of *completely* the degaussing current that causes the big "bzzt" when you first turn on your set. If it's a relay, small chance of that; but if the device is what is called a PTC resistor, then it may be defective. Can you have it checked out under warranty? A definitive test would be to open the back of the set and temporarily disconnect (unplug) the degaussing coil from the curcuit board where it normally connects. If the pulsing stops, that's the problem.

Thanks for the help. I hate the idea of someone form sony coming out and opening it up, but it sounds like that might be the final solution. I think I'll see if it goes away in a couple days first. I'll call Sony today and let them know about it, so it's clear this was happening from the get go.

I'll try moving the tv around a bit, but I don't have real options as to where it can go. I don't know where a large magnetic force could be coming from. I'm on the top floor and it's just a pizza restaurant below me.

Finally, I'm one of those people who made a few changes before printing the charts. The only changes I made prior to printing the charts were to the geometry settings and I wrote down my changes at the time I made them, but I was not perfect in doing so. I think I may have changed a couple of settings without recording the original value. If anyone has their originals for these two groups (only 2170-D1 and D2), I'd very much appreciate a PM. I think I have most of the original values recorded, but I'm not 100% positive. My geometry is fine but I'd like to be certain about the original settings if I can be. Thanks.

Two things you need to know:

1) Service Manuals are not updated as often as the TV's, so you might find missing or added entries, and as you saw entries in a different order.

2) I'm sure you already know, but... The values in the Service Manual are the default settings for your TV. The actual values on your TV are often changed in the final factory check. On my XBR960 over 20% of the values were different than the default, from the Service Manual.

Two things you need to know:

1) Service Manuals are not updated as often as the TV's, so you might find missing or added entries, and as you saw entries in a different order.

2) I'm sure you already know, but... The values in the Service Manual are the default settings for your TV. The actual values on your TV are often changed in the final factory check. On my XBR960 over 20% of the values were different than the default, from the Service Manual.


Thanks for the reply. I figured the service manual entries are the defaults, and that my set would have been adjusted prior to shipment. Nevertheless, if a couple of people with this set sent me thiey original values for 2170D1 & 2 and they turn out to be essentially identical to each other (and virtually the same as the original values I'm certain of, then I could feel comfortable with the few values I'm not sure of. Hopefully I'm making sense.

Again - thatnks!

I noticed that on several settings, what the chart had for 480i and 1080i was reversed. For example: 3DNR #43 - YEL (Vivid) is listed as 6 (480i) and 4 (1080i) on the chart, but my actuals were the opposite - 4 (480i) and 6 (1080i).

Another example is 3DNR #41 - YMG (Vivid) - The chart has 3 (480i) and 1 (1080i), but my actuals were the opposite - 1 (480i) and 3 (1080i).

Any ideas about this?
Here is my experience with these. I have tried hard to understand what the 3DNR (3-D Noise Reduction, also in many DVD players) parameters do and what happens if they're changed. I have put up a 480i picture with critical detail, hard edges and some grainy noise. Then I have gone thru many of the 3DNR settings (if not all!), changing the values up and down to see if anything changed on-screen. In every case where the picture didn't simply disappear, turn to gibberish, or radically reverse color, I couldn't notice anything useful. E.g. I could never find one parameter that might mean "degree of noise reduction" or "detail preservation" with 0 = off, and 1-3 having increasing effect. Nothing.

Maybe I was not using the right test conditions or a suitable picture. Maybe this stuff kicks in only with horrible fringe-reception conditions or bad VHS tapes, I don't know. But I felt it was a waste of time, and I was pleased with the video reproduction as it was. There were so many *other* settings that were critical, I let 3DNR settings alone. I have recently on a rainy Sayurday tried again to identify useful tweaks in 3DNR. No-go; nothing new.

Having said that, and having little use for the horribly unsophisticated "enhancements" of the Vivid mode, I have taken over Vivid for my own purposes and made sure *all* of the mode-dependent settings were initially identical to Pro, a conservative picture mode. Parameters nos. 43 and 41 didn't respond to tweaking, and now I don't care, my initial reasoning being "if the only change in the chart is for Vivid, I don't need it!"

Bottom line: So many other parameters are more important, I wouldn't sweat a single drop over this. My chart shows exceptions in the Vivid-Others column for #62, too, but I have long ago made these parameters all the same for all modes (same as Pro). And that's where they have stayed, including the more radically changing #45-CLV.

The Image-Processing Chart posted above in message #707 has been significantly updated. I recommend anyone who has downloaded it discard that and download the new one.

I believe the comments and descriptions are now much more reflective of what these parameters really do, and a few minor errors have been fixed. To a great extent we are reading tea leaves here, as Sony is no help, and the descriptions may be further revised as I learn more. But many of the descriptions seem really solid in hindsight after several months of experience.

Reminder of its purpose: We can now easily share these important image-processing settings by simply listing them as a number-series in a message. Filling those numbers into an appropriate column of the chart, top-down, then ties them to the actual parameters and the descriptions, saving much time and trouble.

Example: Excellent settings for 1080i HDTV reception from built-in cable or antenna ATSC (digital) tuner, now my "standard" for everyday viewing. I set Sharpness at 25-35, to taste. ClearEdge is usually set to Low or OFF, but sometimes to Medium. These settings assume Pro-like settings for everything else.

3D-COMB and 2103-1 = not applicable

2170P-3 = 2 - <n> - 0.3.2.8 - 0.1.3.0 - 0.1.0 - 5.0.0 - 61
(For the 5.0.0 group, VMMV depending on how you balance your inputs.)

MID5 = 61 - 0.0.0.0 - 0.3.2.0 - 0.3.2.0 - 0.0.0 - 0.0.0

For 720p, change MIDE to 60 and:

MID5 = 60 - 0.0.0.0 - 0.3.3.0 - 0.3.3.0 - 0.0.0 - 0.0.0

Howdy Ken,

Glad to see you're still keeping tabs on things.

Re greyscales... based on some more recent experiments using various 6500K references, it looks like my earlier best-guess/color-differentation eyeballing method may not have worked quite as well as hoped, and that I was probably leaning a bit too much toward orange on my yellows, overdriving red and underdriving green on the display.

Re sharpness... if you're still using the memory stick I'd be curious to hear your or Glen's take (or anyone else's for that matter) on the patterns in Post #10 here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6841463&&#post6841463), and why, for example, they seem to work with 2170P-3/SYSM set to 2 or 3, but not 0 or 1.

The Image-Processing Chart posted above in message #707 has been significantly updated. I recommend anyone who has downloaded it discard that and download the new one.

A little ambiguity in your statement has me a little confused. I assume the chart in post #707 is the newest one since there is no other subsequent to it. Please advise

A little ambiguity in your statement has me a little confused. I assume the chart in post #707 is the newest one since there is no other subsequent to it. Please advise
Yes, it's the one in post #707 that has been updated. I didn't want to leave the old one hanging around.

Here is the only one I'm aware of, for the 34XBR910, which has only a few differences with the later sets. There are a couple of vatiations of this, but this seems the most informed. Note that some of the "descriptions" are, at best, wild guesses.

But note that this is not as useful as you would believe. The spreadsheets give you *no* clue as to how the code-settings are memorized for different combinations of picture mode, video mode, and input type. Except for an occasional quick look, I have found the spreadsheets essentially useless! They helped at the beginning of my experimentation, but only the charts can make plain what is stored when you WRITE the settings.

Example: The MID5 code-group alone starts with a table of 64 columns X 19 rows, all visible in the charts. The spreadsheets give no clue! Same with the complex 2170P groups. The simple vertical listing in the spreadsheet is useless!

Both are attached>


I completely understand that that chart is the more important document. The chart which is in Adobe PDF "looks" like it was originally an excel file. Is the CHART available in excel? I ask because I'd like to be able to Hide rows that aren't applicable to me ("Twin View, "Freeze," etc.), as well as be able to record original settings and new settings side by side with the defaults.

If there's not one, then I might set out to create one based on the pdf file, which will obviously take some time. If I do, I'll post it when its done.

The chart which is in Adobe PDF "looks" like it was originally an excel file. Is the CHART available in excel?
Ah! Your dream is our dream! I'm sure it started as an Excel file somewhere deep in the bowels of Sony Engineering, but what comes out is either a printed service manual or a PDF document of the same, both available from Sony. The definitive Sony chart (and I use "definitive" loosely) is certainly edited down from an original PDF of the manual, as it is identical. But I have never seen an Excel file of it. One look at the MID5 charts should dissuade you from converting it! Maybe a couple of important pages . . .

For my part, I have simply printed Sony's charts in color and stapled them all together, and I annotate it in fine pencil. Most of the charts I need have room to scribble small. I now pretty much ignore the MID5 monster and the 2170P-3 charts, as I have distilled their essence into a new chart I can manage. (See post #707.)

Sony won't even give up concise descriptions of the codes. Getting the original chart (and there must be dozens of variations) would be impossible without a "friend" deep inside Sony.

Ah! Your dream is our dream! I'm sure it started as an Excel file somewhere deep in the bowels of Sony Engineering, but what comes out is either a printed service manual or a PDF document of the same, both available from Sony. The definitive Sony chart (and I use "definitive" loosely) is certainly edited down from an original PDF of the manual, as it is identical. But I have never seen an Excel file of it. One look at the MID5 charts should dissuade you from converting it! Maybe a couple of important pages . . .

For my part, I have simply printed Sony's charts in color and stapled them all together, and I annotate it in fine pencil. Most of the charts I need have room to scribble small. I now pretty much ignore the MID5 monster and the 2170P-3 charts, as I have distilled their essence into a new chart I can manage. (See post #707.)

Sony won't even give up concise descriptions of the codes. Getting the original chart (and there must be dozens of variations) would be impossible without a "friend" deep inside Sony.


Creating the spreadsheet itself wouldn't be that much work - entering the data, on the other hand would be very cumbersome, but eventually doable, with liberal cutting and pasting where values are the same. I certainly recognize that there are better ways to spend my time.

Because I only use a few of the inputs and don't have the Twin View function, I'd just like to be able to hide them if I don't need them.

Do we know the date of the Service Manual from which the "current" chart is taken?

Re greyscales... based on some more recent experiments using various 6500K references, it looks like my earlier best-guess/color-differentation eyeballing method may not have worked quite as well as hoped, and that I was probably leaning a bit too much toward orange on my yellows, overdriving red and underdriving green on the display.

Before I was ISF calibrated, I was WAY too blue. I am an experienced tweaker and I do know the theory. I don't know about staring at the clouds in the sky, but I used a 6500K light shining on a Kodak Grey Card, in a dark room. It was really difficult to dial in by eye but I thought I had achieved a greyscale that looked pretty good (better than stock). I found out months later it was actually way cool, something like 8000 - 10000 K. My ISF stepped in and measured it properly with the proper test equipment, and my blue was 50-60% too high across the board, and my red was about 10-15% too low in some areas. He said this was a common error using a light on a card. I don't know what method you used.

Interesting. Erring toward the blue, or the red the way I did on my yellows does seem to be a common mistake when eyeballing greyscale. And as one of the guys (Ken or Glen, can't remember which) mentioned a number of pages ago, there does seem to be some noticeable variation in color among different brands of 6500K fluorescent bulbs. So I've been reluctant to use those as my sole reference so far w/o knowing their chromaticity and CRI. Someone posted chromaticity for the Philips Daylight Deluxe here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=596152) but the B&Ms only have those in 4-foot size which is too big for my purposes. And I haven't had much luck locating similar info on smaller bulbs. All I've been able to find out about the Walmart LOA 6500K bulbs is they have an 84 CRI and use tri-phosphor, which isn't much help.

The last adjustment I did was using an LCD monitor which seemed to have reasonably decent color-decoding and greyscale as my guide. And I'm fairly pleased with the results so far (although I'm sure there's quite a bit of variation in LCDs too). The bulb approach still interests me however, and I'll probably be re-visiting these adjustments a couple more times as I can lay my hands on other potential 6500K sources to test. My eyes may not be very good at guessing what 6500K is w/o a reference, but the more sources I have for comparison, the better I think I'm starting to get at distinguishing the subtler differences between them.

Another prospect I've considered is simply adjusting the greyscale (or one of the other temperature modes) to precisely match my 6500K bias lighting, regardless of how accurate it is... just to keep everything tidy. As nutty as that probably sounds, maybe it would work ok from a purely aesthetic standpoint.

The bulb I originally used was an inexpensive 18" one from Home Depot. I forget what brand it is (mabye Philips) but I took it to work and had it measured by a wise old man in our spectroradiometer test lab. It didn't do too badly, maybe 150K too warm, and chromaticity was close enough for the money and my gross purposes. I used it for bias lighting too.

But now that I'm ISF calibrated, I've got a bulb from Ideal-lume which is more accurate, but I haven't measured it:

http://www.cinemaquestinc.com/ideal_lume.htm

I have two monitors side-by side at work, a new Dell LCD and an older CRT. The CRT has a "6500K" setting which looks really nice. The LCD never looks very good, color wise. It has 3 preset settings: Blue, Red, Normal. It looks best on "Red". The other settings are way too cool. To be honest I wouldn't trust either monitor as is. It is possible for the user to make custom settings.


Another prospect I've considered is simply adjusting the greyscale (or one of the other temperature modes) to precisely match my 6500K bias lighting, regardless of how accurate it is... just to keep everything tidy. As nutty as that probably sounds, maybe it would work ok from a purely aesthetic standpoint.

Sounds reasonable, good luck.

Tks.The bulb I originally used was an inexpensive 18" one from Home Depot. I forget what brand it is (mabye Philips) but I took it to work and had it measured by a wise old man in our spectroradiometer test lab. It didn't do too badly, maybe 150K too warm, and chromaticity was close enough for the money and my gross purposes. I used it for bias lighting too.Probably a GE or Sylvania, which I've heard may be less close than the Philips. umr posted some chromaticity measurements on the Ideal-Lume here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6424230&&#post6424230). Not sure which model that applies to though. (I think they use different bulbs depending on the price/model.)

To get really decent results with the bulb/grey card approach, I'm beginning to believe that you'd need a bulb that's close to the CIE D65 chromaticity spec and also very high in color rendering index (CRI), which might rule out most of the over-the-counter bulbs. Despite what's suggested in the link above, those Kodak "grey" cards appear to be a color composite that's probably designed to look neutral in full-spectrum lighting. So the color they reflect back might be somewhat skewed by spikes in a fluorescent bulb's spectral response... another reason I'm leaning a bit more towards the monitor approach at this point, and hoping maybe to find a newer computer LCD monitor with a really decent 6500K setting. Or maybe I can rent a little B&W 6500K SMPTE reference CRT somewhere for a reasonable price.

If you're using a cheaper over-the counter 6500K bulb with a lower CRI but decent chromaticity, perhaps a neutral white card might be less effected by spectral spikes in the bulb.

Ah! Your dream is our dream! I have never seen an Excel file of it. One look at the MID5 charts should dissuade you from converting it! Maybe a couple of important pages . . .

Getting the original chart (and there must be dozens of variations) would be impossible without a "friend" deep inside Sony.


OK, I've started the project to convert the pdf chart to a spreadsheet - 3 pages down - 18 to go. If I don't kill myself and only do a few pages each day, I should have it done in a little over a week.

In case anyone cares, I'm using OpenOffice, as I don't have the MS Office Suite and prefer open source programs when and where I can use them for free. I can open Excel files in OpenOffice, but am not sure about the reverse compatibility.

I was resetting the System NVM Data and I pressed 7, 9, then enter twice and now my picture is screwed up and I don't know what I did. HD channels sometimes won't even show up. How can I get the TV back to the way it was before?

Edit: Just thought I'd point out two more things. I have the KD-30XS955. And I can view 480i HD channels but can't view 720p or 1080i HD channels. They just appear dark, but I can hear the sound. What should I be looking to alter in the service menu to bring back these HD channels? Please help :)

I was resetting the System NVM Data and I pressed 7, 9, then enter twice and now my picture is screwed up and I don't know what I did. HD channels sometimes won't even show up. How can I get the TV back to the way it was before?

Edit: Just thought I'd point out two more things. I have the KD-30XS955. And I can view 480i HD channels but can't view 720p or 1080i HD channels. They just appear dark, but I can hear the sound. What should I be looking to alter in the service menu to bring back these HD channels? Please help :)


Man, that really sucks. Have you tried re-entering all of your original values? I have no idea what resetting the NVM data does, so I stay clear of the 7 and 9 buttons.

Once, I hit 7 by mistake and the screen changed from "Service" to "Initi-" or something like that. I almost had a heart attack - it changed back to "Service" after a couple of seconds thankfully.

Here is my experience with these. I have tried hard to understand what the 3DNR (3-D Noise Reduction, also in many DVD players) parameters do and what happens if they're changed. I have put up a 480i picture with critical detail, hard edges and some grainy noise. Then I have gone thru many of the 3DNR settings (if not all!), changing the values up and down to see if anything changed on-screen. In every case where the picture didn't simply disappear, turn to gibberish, or radically reverse color, I couldn't notice anything useful. E.g. I could never find one parameter that might mean "degree of noise reduction" or "detail preservation" with 0 = off, and 1-3 having increasing effect. Nothing.

Maybe I was not using the right test conditions or a suitable picture. Maybe this stuff kicks in only with horrible fringe-reception conditions or bad VHS tapes, I don't know. But I felt it was a waste of time, and I was pleased with the video reproduction as it was. There were so many *other* settings that were critical, I let 3DNR settings alone. I have recently on a rainy Sayurday tried again to identify useful tweaks in 3DNR. No-go; nothing new.

Having said that, and having little use for the horribly unsophisticated "enhancements" of the Vivid mode, I have taken over Vivid for my own purposes and made sure *all* of the mode-dependent settings were initially identical to Pro, a conservative picture mode. Parameters nos. 43 and 41 didn't respond to tweaking, and now I don't care, my initial reasoning being "if the only change in the chart is for Vivid, I don't need it!"

Bottom line: So many other parameters are more important, I wouldn't sweat a single drop over this. My chart shows exceptions in the Vivid-Others column for #62, too, but I have long ago made these parameters all the same for all modes (same as Pro). And that's where they have stayed, including the more radically changing #45-CLV.]

Ken, Any recommended settings for GYR and GYB?

It seems i've been fiddling around with these settings a lot lately and can't seem to get the greens right so i just left them at default values of GYR-9 and GYB-6 for now but i think there is room for improvemnt to make them better, any recommended settings you would use?I tried the color filters from DVE and tried using RGBS to turn just the green gun on but it seems i have to adjust GYR-GYB very low to match the back ground color in essence creating a green push which i don't think is right.

Any recommended settings to fix this issue?

Matt~

Well...I was able to bring back the dark HD stations by changing the value of FIXS in the CA2171 category. It looks like I only need to change some geometry and everything will be back to normal...I hope. But any help is still greatly appreciated.

Ken, Any recommended settings for GYR and GYB?
Yes. This is an easy one.

These settings do not adjust the individual colors. Thay set up a complex decoding martix for extracting color, and it really can't be eyeballed. For any one input, there really is only one correct setting. If you use the DVE or AVIA DVDs for setting up your DVD player's input, you have done it right. Period. If you still aren't happy with the greens, you can't blame the player/TV combination!

The good news is that most inputs share the same color-matrix settings just fine, and using DVE to set these parameters will also set it for all other similar inputs. If you wish to go through the process on your own set (DVE works well), I recommend you use 2170P-2/RGBS to turn on only the individual color guns instead of using the color filters.

More good news: Many folks have reported roughtly the same settings after they go through this process. For me it was 14-14-5-3 for RYR thru GYB, respectively. There is a little sloppiness in the proces, and at other times I have set it to 13-15-5-3, and so have others. Not a big deal, since you have gotten away from the huge red push that comes from the factory. I assigned these settings to the "Standard (Normal?)" choice in the user menus.

Viewing those color bars with the green-only gun really explicitly identifies green push; so it does with red, too. Get that right, and your TV is now okay. Or you can just punch in the above numbers (14-14-5-3), and you will be *very* close. For you, the 5-3 pair is all-inportant.

You might be seeing a green push in the original video material for some reason. Food commercials use a red or red-orange "push" all the time. The demo videos on DVE are fairly neutral, and you might start there to see what you've accomplished.

[QUOTE=KenTech] I recommend you use 2170P-2/RGBS to turn on only the individual color guns instead of using the color filters.

Viewing those color bars with the green-only gun really explicitly identifies green push; so it does with red, too. Get that right, and your TV is now okay. Or you can just punch in the above numbers (14-14-5-3), and you will be *very* close. For you, the 5-3 pair is all-important. QUOTE]

Yes, use 2170-2/RGBS instead of the DVE filters. They are much more accurate !!
I have my matrix/decoder settings at 14-13-6-3 with a an average gray scale color temp of around 6600 kelvin (measured with DVE & SpyderTV).
I have found that the levels of RGB as decoded change as a function of the color slider with blue the most sensitive and green the least. That is to say that when you back down the color slider (I always have to do this after this adj in DVE) blue de-saturates more than red and red more than green. This can be seen easily when viewing the color decoder check in AVIA (it gives +/- 20% squares).
I don't know if this is a color axis change (tint) or if Sony designed it that way to de-saturate blue Vs the way too blue gray scale these sets come with.
I also fought a similar problem in calibrating the grey scale (color temp changes Vs color slider)

For this reason it may be best to "touch up" the color matrix/decoder settings a notch here and there to compensate for some non-linearities in Sony's design.
Example:If skintones look too green or red or tint of primary/secondary colors looks off. I think initially I had my GYR-GYB at 7-4 but changed it to compensate when I run the color slider back down to a more reasonable level (especially for analog cable) !!!

Todd

I have found that the levels of RGB as decoded change as a function of the color slider with blue the most sensitive and green the least. That is to say that when you back down the color slider (I always have to do this after this adj in DVE) blue de-saturates more than red and red more than green. This can be seen easily when viewing the color decoder check in AVIA (it gives +/- 20% squares).
Well, isn't *that* interesting! I wonder if that is a correct interpretation of those results. I will experiment in the next few days and see if I come to the same conclusion.

What I fond odd -- and this would be with the settings for color matrix, color amount (Color), and color phase (Hue) set just right with the DVE patterns -- is that the AVIA color-decoder check routinely shows a bit of blue push on my TV. Not a lot. But it does make those blue-nylon parkas people wear in outdoor shots seem, well, *electric.* It's not a push that irritates me, as red does.

I have pulled the color charts off of the DVE disk and measured them on a computer, and they're dead-on, so we can't blame the disk.

Well, isn't *that* interesting! I wonder if that is a correct interpretation of those results. I will experiment in the next few days and see if I come to the same conclusion.

I have pulled the color charts off of the DVE disk and measured them on a computer, and they're dead-on, so we can't blame the disk.

With AVIA, once you get the 3 colors & tints (all boxes equal) you can run the color slider down until green is at -5% and measure blue and red.
Red will be about -10% and blue at -15%.
As i said before, I think this was designed in to offset the >10k color temp out of the box.

I don't blame DVE (I get similar results with AVIA) but do think the Sony sets have some weird offsets or color leakage in both the matrix decoder and the gray scale RGB cuts (at least the HS420 does).

If you have a problem with blue push (never measued that) it may be from CXA2171-3/4 ?
My HS420 series had the blue one notch higher than red by default.
This will not change cuts & drives (grayscale) but will increase red or blue saturation (only for V5/6 and HDMI) so before the final (sure final) round of calibration I set both to 5 or 6.

neo505,

If you need other help than can be found here I believe there's a "900" number that can be contacted for "non-authorized service tech support" from Sony for a fee (somethin like $3/minute with a minimum of $20/call). Sony Parts (http://servicesales.sel.sony.com/web/contact_us.jsp) (800-488-SONY) should have more info. How much help they'd be in your situation, I don't know. Never had the stones to try an NVM reset for fear of removing factory SM adjustments. Getting the TV serviced (or perhaps worked on by a professional calibrator) might be another option, though that could run more $$ if it's out of warranty.

todd95008,

The behavior you're seeing with the Color control may be normal. While it's tempting to think of that as simply your "saturation" adjustment, it's unfortunately a bit more complicated than that, and more of a crucial link in the TV's color decoding system. To maintain the most accurate color on the display, the Color and Hue controls really shouldn't be changed once the decoders have been properly adjusted.

*The CXA2171/CBGN, CRGN, YGN controls you're referring to are I believe 1080i color decoding offsets, possibly designed to compensate for minor differences in color-decoding between 1080i and other signals. I think most or all of the parameters in that circuit should be 1080i/33.75kHz-related.

*CXA2171/MTRX is I believe possibly designed to change the color space on the TV. If all you're running is basic OTA or cable/sat 1080i, I don't think their should be a reason to change this. However, in case you're tempted... be advised that the MTRX parameter seems to work differently with respect to reading and writing from memory than most other parameters.

[*Edit: Some of the above speculations were not exactly correct. Please see the following pages for more current and IMO correct info on how the MTRX and other CXA2171 parameters really work and should be used.]

todd95008,

The behavior you're seeing with the Color control may be normal. While it's tempting to think of that as simply your "saturation" adjustment, it's unfortunately a bit more complicated than that, and more of a crucial link in the TV's color decoding system. To maintain the most accurate color on the display, the Color and Hue controls really shouldn't be changed once the decoders have been properly adjusted.

The CXA2171/CBGN, CRGN, YGN controls you're referring to are I believe 1080i color decoding offsets, designed to compensate for minor differences in color-decoding between 31.5KHz 480p signals and 33.75khz 1080i signals. I think most or all of the parameters in that circuit should be 1080i/33.75kHz-related.

CXA2171/MTRX is I believe designed to change the color space for input devices that don't conform to the usual ATSC color space. If all you're running is basic OTA or cable/sat 1080i, I don't think their should be a reason to change this. However, in case you're tempted... http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/images/icons/icon4.gif BE ADVISED that the MTRX value is automatically stored without being saved to memory. So be sure to make note of the original value before changing it. This control is "global" (ie effects 1080i on all inputs) as opposed to input-sensitive on my 34XBR800 btw... though it's quite possible that may have been changed on newer Sony models.

In theory yes, the color control should not need to be adjusted once the chroma/color decoder is adjusted. When I do this with my calibrated PC monitor everything is fine but with the sony I have to run the color level back down to keep all colors from looking like cartoons. Even the video samples on DVE look oversaturated and these tend to be very accurate compared with most DVD's.
I won't even talk about the way oversaturated cable tv !!!

Yes the MTRX value is for HD but the CXA2171/CBGN, CRGN controls are for component inputs (480i to 1080i). When you have a proper greyscale (one that is not too blue) they should be the same number. I set mine to match measured test signals on RF & composite/s-video inputs. If I left them at the factory default blue was too strong !! I don't have my charts here but I think I set both to 6 ??

Todd

In theory yes, the color control should not need to be adjusted once the chroma/color decoder is adjusted. When I do this with my calibrated PC monitor everything is fine but with the sony I have to run the color level back down to keep all colors from looking like cartoons. Even the video samples on DVE look oversaturated and these tend to be very accurate compared with most DVD's.
Interesting, because this is not my experience with my 36XS955. When the set is calibrated for Color, Hue, and the color matrix (14-14-5-3), the observed colors are quite natural on DVDs in general, DVE in particular. The restaurant scene in Title 17 is perfect!

Analog-cable broadcast, on the other hand, is all over the place. I typically run the COlor down from 31 to 22-26 for MTV, FoodTV, sometimes HGTV. (Sometimes program-dependent.) Black level shows similar anarchy! But DVDs and most HDTV? Glorious.

Wonder how your TV differs . . .

Hi,
I am new here and i just got my hs420 set yesturday, but have one problem.
There is a slight upwards bow on the picture on the left and right sides of the screen. It is most noticable when a ticker is crossing the screen and when playing a fps on my 360 (moving horizontally). I have tried to fix it in the service menu, but have had no luck. I have tried RSAP, LBOW, RBOW,VBOW,PIN, and a few other things. Is this adjustable??? If it isnt i will live with it because its not that big of a deal (right at the moment). I also dont want to have to EVER lug this tv downstairs, as it was a nightmare bringing it up. PLEASE, Any help will be appreciated. THANKS.....

Hi,
I am new here and i just got my hs420 set yesturday, but have one problem.
There is a slight upwards bow on the picture on the left and right sides of the screen. It is most noticable when a ticker is crossing the screen and when playing a fps on my 360 (moving horizontally). I have tried to fix it in the service menu, but have had no luck. I have tried RSAP, LBOW, RBOW,VBOW,PIN, and a few other things. Is this adjustable??? If it isnt i will live with it because its not that big of a deal (right at the moment). I also dont want to have to EVER lug this tv downstairs, as it was a nightmare bringing it up. PLEASE, Any help will be appreciated. THANKS.....

You might try VCEN, VPIN and HTPZ. A crosshatch pattern should be used to accurately set these parameters. VCEN is used to equalize the vertical bow at the top and bottom of screen. VPIN is used to make the vertical lines as straight as possible. HTPZ is used to make the horizontal lines as parallel as possible.

Raoul

You might try VCEN, VPIN and HTPZ. A crosshatch pattern should be used to accurately set these parameters. VCEN is used to equalize the vertical bow at the top and bottom of screen. VPIN is used to make the vertical lines as straight as possible. HTPZ is used to make the horizontal lines as parallel as possible.

Raoul
I can confirm that these are the settings I used to correct a similar "bow" on my 34HS420.

Thank you, i will try those settings and i will reply back on how it goes.

Thanks ken i appreciate the help!

I just left my GYr-GYB serttings at default since i did'nt see much improvement setting them lower,since all it did was actually cause a green push and colors to bleed.So instead i'm quite happy at them being in their factory defaults of GYR-9 and GYB-6.

I got rid of red push though by adjusting RYR-15 and RYB-15 though by using DVE.

Thanks for your help:)

Matt~